💬┃general

[livid prairie]

Maybe from the quater million CONCURRENT players it had on release and cosmetic packs they were selling perhaps

[viral marsh]

They didn't make enough money from the cosmetics.

[livid prairie]

I don't believe that

[short vessel]

The cosmetics weren't good

Ngl

I don't think there'd be many people hard whaling every cosmetic pack

[night marten]

You are never going to convince someone if they think EHG is lying.

[ornate vine]

game looks ugly, cosmetics were bad and ugly, game didnt get updates good enough for people to want to invest

[viral marsh]

I didn't buy anything, they looked too bad for my taste. Or well just not for me.

I would rather buy functionality for my stash

[lilac temple]

are you talking about last epoch ?

[ornate vine]

obviously. game looks dreadful.

[short vessel]

I disagree on that front, tho the mtx isn't good

Moreso due to just being too dissimilar stylistically to LE's general design

[lilac temple]

The game is in the top 5 for 99% of YouTubers, testers, and serious players. Sure, the cosmetics aren’t perfect, but acting like it’s a dealbreaker just because they don’t suit your taste is like spitting out a gourmet meal because you don’t like the garnish.

[opaque perch]

I agree with this. I've gone looking for new mtx sometimes because I want to buy something cool. Only to find nothing really that great.

[ornate vine]

whatever helps you sleep

[ornate vine]

clearly is a deal breaker because the model relying on them failed

[willow canopy]

That or the people who enjoy arpgs are just not the type to care about cosmetics. Like I want cool loot that does big numbers not a cape that looks like leaves.

[lilac temple]

this

[ornate vine]

yet other arpgs sell many cosmetics. so thats clearly false

[short vessel]

Yeah nah

Demonstrably not true from other arpgs

[lilac temple]

I don't know. I enjoy a lot grim dawn, and I don't care about it. Same for other arpgs

depends on the guy I suppose

[short vessel]

I mean, the real deep in the weeds guys tend not to (at least, not enough to whale)

You and me

But the vast majority of an arpgs playerbase aren't us

[lilac temple]

hmmm... there are cool cosmetics tbh. It's just a... special style

you like or you hate I think

[short vessel]

I'd like a lot of them... if they didn't clash with the rest of my gear

Wait

I just realised why

Non-mtx model design is too focused around up close

[willow canopy]

I mean your probably right hence why diablo 4 has so many cosmetics on its battle pass, but yeah not something I'm looking for in my ARPG

[short vessel]

A lot of the non-mtx models are clearly designed for how they look when looking at the model in some kinda viewer

But the mtx is actually designed around how it looks from the actual gameplay view

Zoomed out

And those fundamentally just look really odd when placed next to each other

[zinc blaze]

thats a good point

[quartz moat]

are a lot fewer people playing this season compared to last season? the discussion forums for the game also seems much quieter

[willow canopy]

I'd actually like more cosmetic pets. That's something I enjoyed with diablo 3 especially when they would zoom around and grab the gold for me

[west grove]

I think most people have completed things for this season so it is pretty quiet

[fluid pebble]

The start of the season saw a near 50% drop off for the season day 1 (150k vs 80k)

tbh, season 3 felt super light on content compared to season 2 anyway

[ornate vine]

the foundations of the game are just bad. for long term success they need LE 2

the technical debt is massive

[lilac temple]

I wonder if it's a troll ... lol

[night marten]

The tech debt is massive so you want them to make a game from scratch? Lol

[ornate vine]

yes, because this game will never feel good to play compared to others in the genre

that clunk will always be there

it has a ceiling

[short vessel]

I'ma put that down to unity engine. And i believe that was a necessary financial choice at the time

[inner finch]

@ornate vine how far does your Unity 6 knowledge go?

[night marten]

Unity wasnt specifically a financial thing. It was what everyone knew when le started on reddit

[ornate vine]

don't need knowledge of an engine to know the feel of a game is garbage lmao. These devs have got a track record of bug ridden slow development. Ori and hollow knight are unity games and have very fluid movement and are unity games. EHG just don't know what they're doing unfortunately

[inner finch]

If they work hard and have the talent, they can patch things up

[royal sapphire]

If only hard work and talent was all it took

[inner finch]

I know armchair bulshittery is a great and common skill for ARPG criticizers

but i trust the process for what its worth

[night marten]

Comparing 2d games and 2d games is a choice

[royal sapphire]

whose process tho?

nah, nothing to do with remote

most of the work did remote for like 2 years

*most of the world

Sure, but clearly they thought it was worth it, by whatever metrics they choose to use

[night marten]

....yes. this is their first game as a company. They are amateurs. They have no experience doing this

Lol

[quartz moat]

i think they spent too much money on server resources tbh.

might have worked better as a single player game

[royal sapphire]

is it first multiplayer game ever?

no1 did action rpg as gaas?

[brittle aurora]

jesus christ just read the news

season 4 in march? is this a joke

season 5 in 2027?

[royal sapphire]

its not like there were examples of plethora games which did similar stuff before them?

[brittle aurora]

what the heck did i even pay for

just sell the company

[lilac temple]

what do you think they would do with 40 bucks ? tons of content each 3 months ?

during years ? lol

[brittle aurora]

yeah like a normal arpg would do

[royal sapphire]

damn its almost no1 managed to do it before

with only box price

let alone ingame store

[quartz moat]

how many copies of LE did they sell so far?

[royal sapphire]

2-3m afaik

[brittle aurora]

you think that adding "echo chains" and "rune of corruption" is a lot of content?

you really do?

[lilac temple]

what gameS managed to do it ?

[night marten]

Who said s5 in 2027? Lmao

[brittle aurora]

prediction

[royal sapphire]

they didnt say it was in 2026 tho, did they?

[brittle aurora]

what a meme

[royal sapphire]

also, many studios that did action rpgs with box prices that are still around, notably thq nordic and crate entertainment

also van helsing 1 and 2

just on top of my head

[viral marsh]

3m copies which they posted on 20th of august

[inner finch]

I paid 20 dollars to fund this game and all i got was a thousand hours of gameplay

I feel ripped off

😠

[lilac temple]

lol

this

[royal sapphire]

i didnt know we had a timer, so if we pass a certain point, devs can shit on us

[dusty peak]

Yeah, that's nearly a penny an hour!!

[broken yarrow]

well it could be more hours

[inner finch]

😡

even

[stable forum]

The reason Crate exists is because the previous studio died lmao

[royal sapphire]

Glad you got so many hours outta game, I only managed 380 to finish everything and play with all masteries

[royal sapphire]

not everything can be a hit, or make money

[inner finch]

I also threw 30 dollars towards Umbra

We all know how that ended lol

[viral marsh]

Oh n

[quartz moat]

i wonder if 3m copies sold would have been enough to fund a single player game + a few expansions

[inner finch]

This purely depends on the scope, level of skill

[royal sapphire]

ofc it would

but not with a team of over 100 ppl

[lilac temple]

It’s just my take, I could be wrong. But these days people are outrageously demanding while giving as little as possible and making questionable comparisons.

[royal sapphire]

because there are options on every corner

no reason to settle for anything less than good

[stable forum]

I understand, it’s just using crate as an example of studios that survive is ironic. Not to mention THQ Nordic. You should look up their history!

[royal sapphire]

well afaik crate is still alive and kicking

even new xp soon

[inner finch]

Very few studios crack the code of sustainable updating game with a small team on a stable salary

[royal sapphire]

thq nordic, is... well thq

yes, and that is why throwing money does not really work since its not forcing to make adjustments at the core

[inner finch]

Hello Games cracked the code. They have a multiplayer supported game, with updates that arrive when they are ready, and a small team with exceedingly high technical capability working with their homegrown game engine

[stable forum]

They aren’t though. The original THQ closed and sold off all their properties. Nordic went around and bought it all up and then changed their name to THQ Nordic 😂

[royal sapphire]

yea i didn't meant laterally that they are THQ

damn autocorrect on this stupid discord

literally

[stable forum]

point is, making games is HARD

and the industry is unforgiving

[royal sapphire]

yes, thats why product must be best, or at least as good as your competition

if you want to survive

[stable forum]

and I hope they get the ship back on track next year and really make progress towards the game we all want to play

[royal sapphire]

me too, but unfortunately I do not see it

since they still are not adressing core issues they have

and when will they? who knows

[inner finch]

The best thing we can do is just to let this thing cook

[turbid silo]

We love cookin'

[royal sapphire]

Acta, non verba

[inner finch]

I... did not imagine that it would take 9 years for the game to get to the point it would with Orobyss, but LE looked like a much simpler game with a lower feature scope back then anyway

[zinc blaze]

Got any good recipes to share?

[stable forum]

I didn't get in at the start, but I first played when the passive tree was vertical lol

[royal sapphire]

G2g, but let me leave you with a brain teaser: what happens when dlc class does not sell well enough? What is the next step?

[honest belfry]

I tossed a Spiced mixed nuts recipe in #📚┃off-topic message a few days ago

[royal sapphire]

To me it seems we will be right here at this point, in 2 years or so, whenever they release it/them

[inner finch]

I would like to imagine that by the time its offered, LE is in a very different place.

[zinc blaze]

Oooo

[quartz moat]

i think the game has gotten a bit bloated with feature creep. a lot of stuff in the game is obsolete because they were added in beta and the game has changed. dungeons for example.

its all about empowered monos these days

[turbid silo]

We'll be sharing them in future EMs!

[viral halo]

Thats why everything will get its repolishing over the time.

[zinc blaze]

Can’t wait for the cooking with sentinel part of etera monthly now

[cobalt fable]

any true gigachads in the chat?

[chrome basalt]

I haven't played this game in ages, but I think after the disappointment of D4 and PoE2 I find this game makes me want to play it more than either of those. This game has some really cool stuff. Although, is there any way to rebind my potion key?

[willow sentinel]

That should be pretty easy yeah

Let mefind you the menu

[chrome basalt]

God damn, I knew I remembered it somewhere like that and I STILL couldn't see it, LOL! Thank you!

[willow sentinel]

Happy to help

[stoic pivot]

guys i've missed a bunch. how's this s3 doing? cool stuff added or just those dinosaurs thing

[inner finch]

There are quite a few videos talking about all the season 3 features

A quick text post over discord wont do it justice

[stoic pivot]

thanks! are you enjoying it so far? or does it feel like it lacks

[inner finch]

Its a relatively short development cycle season, so not as dramatic as season 2 with the amount of additional content

I have enjoyed Season 3 mostly for leveling and speccing several toons

did an aberroth run with a few

[grim remnant]

is there any use in building a character that would buff the stats of other players? from what i have seen the game is pretty single player correct?

[zinc blaze]

yeah LE doesn't have something akin to an aura bot in path of exile

paladin can buff his friends with his holy aura but thats more just a slight bonus and things are balanced mainly for single player

[grim remnant]

Aww. That's my only complaint about these games is the lack of party content. Though maybe it turns into a balance nightmare or something

[zinc blaze]

You can still do co-op party playing, there’s just nothing that’s a pure support

[stoic pivot]

runemaster has some auras in the passive tree (3 or 4) that can be extended to allies. Nothing big but it's nice

[grim remnant]

I need the "Sacrifice ally for x% dmg" mod 😛

[short vessel]

The problem is that when ally bonuses have been significant it completely breaks things

Becomes completely unbalanced

[tropic crown]

ok

[weak crag]

Is Last Epoch selling classes now?

[tropic crown]

I sell functions

ok

[flint night]

probably will, we wont have more information until 3-4 months from now

[strange umbra]

new emoji drop

lol

[main frigate]

What your favourite food is? 🤔

[scenic fog]

Long live the muffin king!

[ionic vale]

7 months for a season kinda insane

[frank bramble]

100M gold to everyone on MG so we can get a chance of buying those 60d+ listed rare items

[opal vapor]

i dno why everybody is freaking out about the monetizaion

ive put what, 1000 hours in to this game

and paid like 40$?

thats about as much as a movie and some popcorn

lol

also the complaints about the campaign

campaign is way less important than end game for ARPGS

i understand the "polish" argument but I would much rather resources be used to expand and improve end game

than on the campaign

one issue I do have is all the bugs

also, stop comparing LE to POE

unless you played POE in bea

beta*

it took them years to get to the point they are now

and the game was arguably worse than LE for at least 5 years

people are forgetting why they even play this game

a ton of it is good and innovative

[short vessel]

Afaik i did play PoE in beta but not enough to actually compare it to anything. Plus i'm generally on the side pointing out PoE beta went on for ages antway

[opal vapor]

poe in beta was terrible

and it was honestly terrible for tons of leagues

[tropic nebula]

ENDLESS DOMINUS RUNS!

[opal vapor]

like, in all of the early leagues in POE

less than 1% of the playerbase had everything

and 99% of the playerbase were running <10C builds

most people just played the campaign

a lot of GGG's success is just timing

is a great game now, back then not so much

[short vessel]

Farming dried lake :L

[opal vapor]

lmao

merciless dried lake

[short vessel]

People forget that PoE only had 4 campaign acts in beta

[opal vapor]

yup

mirrored gear was T1 life, T1 tri -res

every piece

except for weapon

[short vessel]

I really like LE, and think it's a great game, but EHG have definitely overpromised/underdelivered

[opal vapor]

yep, it happens

[short vessel]

I mean consistently

[opal vapor]

the world is extremely chaotic right now

people aren't spending money on luxuries

[short vessel]

It's been a running trend

People making out ehg to have actively lied or done malicious stuff are just really stupid tho

[opal vapor]

you should see the subreddit

its actually what led me here

[short vessel]

Oh i do

[frank bramble]

subcesspool you mean @opal vapor

[tropic nebula]

where I'm from its called mouths writing checks that hands cant cash. (clean version)

[short vessel]

Absolutely fair, and people are right to criticise them for that

[opal vapor]

another thing about gaming

is that people used to consider like

a few hours a night of gaming hardcore gaming

nowadays people spend 40+ hours a weekend

[tropic nebula]

thats generational specific

[opal vapor]

its impossible to keep up with their appetites

[short vessel]

Dudes in their 30s aren't gaming 40 hours a weekend i can tell you that

[tropic nebula]

i know many of dad/moms (mostly dads) that slam in 2-3 hours where they can after the kids go to bed.

[opal vapor]

they definitely are

[tropic nebula]

thats if theyre lucky

[opal vapor]

lol

since co vid people go out less and less

and zoomers dont party as much as older generations did

[tropic nebula]

bro... idk about you, but as a full time dad/husband... we couldnt go out anyway

[opal vapor]

they grew up on screens

[tropic nebula]

we're lucky if we see applebees

[opal vapor]

im not saying people should be going out

i couldnt care less what people do

im just saying its hard for a live action game to satiate people

when a ton of them are playing so much

and want new content all the time

GGG deals with the same shit

a league drops, within a few weeks people are crying for more

or they drop the league and play something else

[tropic nebula]

is this anecdotal info your giving?

[opal vapor]

go on the subreddit

the league is around a month old

[tropic nebula]

i dont do reddit

[opal vapor]

see all the negative posts about it

[tropic nebula]

mostly cause im old

[opal vapor]

its not anecdotal

ive been playing POE since beta

[frank bramble]

i'm thankfully banned from poe subreddit KEKW

[south moat]

actually wasn't it 3

[opal vapor]

i personally think one of LE's issues is its too easy

[tropic nebula]

if its based soley on personal accounts vs research... its anecdotal

[opal vapor]

if it were much harder and the gear progression was more linear

[frank bramble]

dominus farming was the shit

[opal vapor]

it would tkae long to get to end game

your getting like double exalted items in the first few acts of the campaign now

which is crazy to me

it trivializes the entire game

[frank bramble]

wait what? maybe in CoF, in MG i waited 300 hours for the first 77 item to drop naturally for me

[opal vapor]

wdym wat

[south moat]

Never seen double exalts in the campaign
Sure, nemesis can give you t6 or t7 if you're lucky
but double? yeah no haven't seen that happen ever

[opal vapor]

ok maybe not doubles

but your getting very powerful items

from nemesis, very early

it makes the game a breeze

[frank bramble]

since they are supposed to help your leveling

[opal vapor]

its far too easy imo

[south moat]

Exaggerating will not help your point

[opal vapor]

wasnt exaggerating

do you honestly thin kthe difficulty of the gmae is in a good place

[frank bramble]

too easy? then why do i see multiple people asking for help with story / monos Lagon or harbis on low corruption

[south moat]

I don't think the campaign needs to be especially hard. Sure it could get some difficulty adjustment but eh

[frank bramble]

campaign is supposed to give you passive points / idol slots and let you farm monos

[opal vapor]

the game is way too easy in its current state

like im doing the second dungeon at level what

under 20

[frank bramble]

okay Scott then tell me what corruption are you doing atm on your highest character

[opal vapor]

around 1000

[frank bramble]

and how many ubers you've killed

[opal vapor]

quite a few

[frank bramble]

and you still think it's too easy? what the

[opal vapor]

i get the game has infinite scaling but its such a breeze to get to empowered monos

yes

i think its far far too easy

and ive seen many people say the same

[frank bramble]

it is the point of that road, it's only supposed to prepare you for empowered monos

[opal vapor]

thats what im saying, maybe it should be more linear

[frank bramble]

and then i see people on global asking for regular abby kills, harbi kills, low orobyss kills because they can't progress

[eternal lake]

Seasons always launching with PoE2 literally killed the game.

[opal vapor]

maybe gear progression should happen less swifly

[eternal lake]

It never got a chance

[opal vapor]

i dont even think ive even worn a rare item since season 2

i ust block all magic/normal/rare items

[frank bramble]

they apparently are in communication with ggg and will try not to interfere with each other so people dont have to choose

[tropic nebula]

https://www.statista.com/forecasts/202839/time-spent-playing-games-by-social-gamers-in-the-us

highest bracker is 30-39 and thats not even 10 hours a week. So it appears that reddit is full of basement dwelling no lifers.

[frank bramble]

and what, do you think it's bad? rares are supposed to start being obsolete at 60-70s when exalts come

[opal vapor]

yes, that is exactly what it is full of lol

[opal vapor]

you get exalted items in the campaign now

[tropic nebula]

ya, this is why, you cant take their word as anything but anecdotal.

cause adults are not doing 40+

[frank bramble]

but nemesis encounters are quite rare during the story so you get only a few

[opal vapor]

i dont find them rare at all

not after season 2

i really think the game would improve if it got harder

[south moat]

Nah apparently you just get all slots full of double t7 by act3

[frank bramble]

i know right? like are we playing a different game or what

[chrome basalt]

I hate being forced to use social media to view game news.

[frank bramble]

also nemesis gives you RANDOM items which sometimes can't even help you

warpath isn't gonna use a damn wand neither falconer is gonna use a 2h sword

[tropic nebula]

so since most adults dont play more than 8 hours a week, they have a hard time getting through content. because theyre not slamming their heads into the game. They just changed diapers, or clocked outta work, now they wanna slay monsters.

[south moat]

I got lucky with nemesis giving me a t7 once during the campaign
one that was actually usable for me, that is

[south moat]

Also got to cook and clean

[frank bramble]

i didn't even get one as far as i remember

[tropic nebula]

this is why diablo leads the way in arpgs. not because its some crazy wicked content, its cause they can pick it up, hit buttons, and things happen

they gear their game for a specific group... the working adult group with money

and, its working. has been for years

[tropic nebula]

lol... i have my robot vacuum

[south moat]

It was a 2h axe with t7 increased melee dmg when I was playing forge weapon build
It was low lvl base so the base dmg wasn't impressive
but with all the buffs to the weapons it did do a good job

[frank bramble]

glad that someone actually got something useful

[tropic nebula]

theres 3 groups youll typically find in ARPGs and some other types of games. People with money (jobs), people w/o money (no jobs) and people who get paid to play the game (streamers ccs). The 2 later player groups tend to be much better at the game, but don't contribute much to the games ecosystem monetarily. However the first has money, and need to be satiated for a game to really have success. Sure 100 CCs can full nut on a game, but that pennies in the bucket. This is why the D4 model wins, and most hard core ARPGrs feel isolated from that game. Because its not geared for the hard core player, its geared for the casual with money.

Sell to the masses, and skip the small groups. Any game that starts to deviate from that kind of model either A) doesn't last long B) Must sell to a bigger company or C) stops existing

That's just how it goes.

We could be starting to see a shift in their structure. They know they need to chase the whales. (Smart) By doing so, some HC arpgrs are gonna be turned off (sad, but necessary). Can't please everyone, so please the ones that pay you.

[tropic nebula]

plenty of game sites offer news... just depends on what that game site covers.

I also can't stand social media.

[kind harbor]

Damn, I just saw LE sits on overwhelmingly negative reviews (17%). That's rough, but deserved at the same time.

[tropic nebula]

It is what it is. Alot of people have been "emotionally" invested in the game. They are probably feeling like a social contract was broken

[calm jay]

I don't like it but I guess I understand it if nothing else.

[tropic nebula]

That's the mature stance. I had to write an entire article about it to explain it.

[kind harbor]

I think people are just disappointed. LE had it all, they gathered an audience hoping it will fill the void between D4 and PoE and that's what it was supposed to be. Devs decided however they wanted LE to just be worse version of PoE.

[tropic nebula]

I think, truly... they just wanted their own ARPG. Not trying to measure up to anything. Just right now, they are trying to come together after a massive shake

And the community is making a clear statement "This aint it chief"

[calm jay]

I think the burning question is monetization and how it happens now that their seasonal design has kinda crumbled and denied repeatedly drawing in for purchases, while their ingame shop has also floundered.

[tropic nebula]

Again, thats the social contract thing I was talking about.

[kind harbor]

You have to aim at something. D4 is for casuals. PoE is for hardcores. TQ and GD are for build fetisists. D2:R is for oldschoolers. LE could fill the void of being harder than D4 but without sweating and 20 external guides like PoE. They simply failed in that and LE is worse in every aspect from the alternatives.

[tropic nebula]

I have no valid argument

[calm jay]

They're basically forced to pivot at this point and I wouldn't be surprised to get an announcement basically stating they have to take this back to the drawing board basically on your guys' points as discussion, plus a monetization scheme.

A review bomb while they double tapped what the community parsed as bad news is not nice

[kind harbor]

Monetization is just awful, average sking for very high price

[calm jay]

Yeah they needed something but I dunno what

[tropic nebula]

The only saving move would be to walk back anything other than cosmetics.... that's the only move. However, I do not think they can

[kind harbor]

for 10$ I can get tons of stuff in Marvel Rivals from battlepass and they give me 5$ back if I complete it

that's a good value

[calm jay]

Oh damn

[kind harbor]

skins in LE are just not worth the price

[calm jay]

So does that technically mean every third one is 'free' if you complete two?

[tropic nebula]

d3 and d4 got ridiculed for their pay to be the best in the ladder classes.

[kind harbor]

yes

[tropic nebula]

they could afford the ridicule however.

[kind harbor]

my next one will be free

[calm jay]

See these are monetization models I point out as successful

[tropic nebula]

Skins are only worth the price if you emotionally invest in the RP part of ARPG

[calm jay]

But this game is very wham bam

[tropic nebula]

If you dont wanna play longer than 4 hours... you aint gonna invest

[kind harbor]

RP in arpg? I think it's the worst genre to "RP"

[calm jay]

You're not like spending a long time in any one place. You kind of plow through everything super fast

[tropic nebula]

well... arpg literally means action roll playing game

[calm jay]

Or maybe that was just my takeaway but

[kind harbor]

yes, that's why nobody was calling it arpg back in the day but hack n' slash

because you know, you basically go and... slash

and watch numbers get bigger

[calm jay]

Yeah it feels more like Gauntlet. Which I like mind you

But it doesn't feel deliberate outside boss fights

[tropic nebula]

well, theres a subtle difference in the two that came with technology

h&s we more just melee heavy linear progression

with tech, came ARPGs usually fully customizable feature where you could make "Your own version" of a character. Technically, very possible to be unique, albeit some combinations are clearly advantageous.

[kind harbor]

let's be honest, vast majority of people playing LE don't care about "RP" aspect, they just want to kill stuff and level up

[tropic nebula]

ya, that we can agree on

[kind harbor]

and you can do that without 60$ armor skin

[tropic nebula]

but the genre is different

[calm jay]

Diablo 2 was kind of two steps of evolution that way

It first brought the skill trees, then the passive synergies skills gave to others in the skill tree

[tropic nebula]

d2 was the first step in that way. good example. that was the intermediary.

that was before complex interactive mechanics (both offensive and defensive)

[kind harbor]

anyway I need to go so I will just finish with I had very had hopes for LE in beta. I truly believed them introducing faction system to appeal to both market enthusiasts and loot enthusiasts was revolutionary. Still, years passed and story is not finished and endgame is weak.

[tropic nebula]

But I would argue, to really sell cosmetics... they REALLY need people to feel connected to their character enough to want to make it "their own".

[tropic nebula]

respectable take

[scenic fog]

Character customization would be pretty awesome.

It'd be cool to have an opt-in "encounter other players in the world" option too.

[fervent lintel]

Sure would be interesting if an ARPG was designed to be hard enough that you could play solo, but it would be really inefficient, so you would want to group up with other players to run content. Further incentivize it with group-size bonuses to exp/magic find/drop quantity etc. Then to make it even more obvious that grouping is ideal, have class features that are okay on their own, but powerful force multipliers in a party (auras, buffs, debuffs, crowd control, etc).

In a sense, it would be kind of how old school MMOs were, but not quite as punishing to solo play. You want the design to discourage--but not disallow--solo play.

It would be imperative for the devs to clearly communicate this intention during development and marketing, though. Make sure people have the right expectations going in.

[copper sorrel]

That's not the case for LE?

[brittle aurora]

true

[inner finch]

Dont make me feel like im wasting time not grouping with others, thanks

[willow sentinel]

I like that EHG does not favor/cater to group play

[fervent lintel]

Not even a little, but not sure if /s or not

[autumn briar]

it does though, it's advantageous to play in group. it's just not to the point that if you play solo, you're hurting yourself (d3, d4)

[fervent lintel]

LE isn't that game. I would like for there to be one, though.

Almost everyone I've ever known who played D3 was either couch coop or PC solo, lol

[autumn briar]

d3 gameplay was 4 man premades most of the time, endless exp grind because no paragon cap

d4 forced grouping for boss rotations was one of the worst experiences i've ever had

[fervent lintel]

Forced grouping is taking it farther than what I have in mind

[inner finch]

well, the examples mentioned are a bit extreme, tbh

D3 took it the furthest ive seen ARPGs do, with extrmely powerful and mandatory support specs

[autumn briar]

yeah it's from a sweaty tryhard point of view, the only way i know

but that's the way that it is if you are going for rank1

[inner finch]

I can't blame the players too much, they were given quite a versatile toolset to build this supports from

in an awkward messed up way, its a decent design

if we forget how advantageous it is

[fervent lintel]

Yeah, that's just not what I saw from most people in D3, at all. I saw it from some streamers and ladder climbers, that was about it.

[inner finch]

It was quite a bit more sweaty in the earlier days, granted

I call it the ban era lol

Because many leaderboard pushers were cheaters

you know something is sweaty when people risk their accounts, even during streaming, to get leaderboard positions

[fervent lintel]

The game I want would have grouping normalized--not just the sweats

It should be weird (but allowed) to play solo

[inner finch]

well, you know what big difference D3 and LE has in that aspect

the social system, guilds, communities and grouping was very easy and very seamless

it was completely effortless

[fervent lintel]

D3 is multiplayer?

[inner finch]

in the same way LE is, you can form up to 4 player lobbies

[fervent lintel]

I'm being a bit tongue-in-cheek there

[inner finch]

#💬┃general message this is one of the craziest hills to die on, but im absolutely willing

[fervent lintel]

Seems valid to me

The biggest lesson, imo, is Adventure Mode. If I still had to play the campaign in D3, I wouldn't play the game.

It's easily the worst part of most of the current ARPGs

[inner finch]

Many many things were solved during the development of this game, and somehow the industry keep forgetting those lessons lol

the UI UX lessons, the moment to moment combat mechanics

like, forget itemization and endgame design, the critique there is absolutely fair

[fervent lintel]

Yeah, I'm not a D3 hater, but I have played A LOT of it, and new seasons provide very little reason to come back

[inner finch]

Its mostly to kill dead time if your time is really really dead

[willow sentinel]

I wish it had some kind of offline and the ability to mod it

Game felt real good to play

[inner finch]

I wished for that too, Vlad, and have participated in less than a fair way to make it happen too

but the project has just shut its doors and we look forward

[willow sentinel]

And with community support and mod, we could have had seasons and all

[inner finch]

Yes, we could have

One day they will have to shut the servers down

and ill try to voice my none-existant opinion as loud as i can, but i dont think they will give us an offline client

[willow sentinel]

Yeah

Sadly

[inner finch]

A rebalanced client would have been absolutely tremendous

[willow sentinel]

Rebalanced?

[inner finch]

in terms of numbers, item effects

like, even to that minimal degree

[willow sentinel]

Ah ok

You know what, I have not played it in a long while

Might dwl it and play a bit today

[inner finch]

new season has just started lol

[copper sorrel]

Tat's sad! We teorycrafted quite a bit about multiplayer, always was under te assumption, it would've been te most optimal way to play te ame wit a full roup. We ten just never ad te time to play past lvl 6 or so lol

[willow sentinel]

Press H

[acoustic palm]

You know what D3 did better than LE? They didn't go bankrupt

[fervent lintel]

You know what they did worse? RMAH

[acoustic palm]

Well, they could evne sell drugs, just the fact that they were able to make profit makes them superior.

[inner finch]

They do 101 things better, but yeah, being owned by a giant gigacorporation helps

[copper sorrel]

wat d2 did better was 8 player mode.

[acoustic palm]

well, EHG also had accesss to 100m euro from sales, other games like Warframe, Path of exile, League of legends and what not didn't had. Sure these all got bought later, but they were at a profit the whole time.

So, at least, hopefully the person that is in charge with money is wiser/ has some help.

That's the first thing, we can't have more seasons if our money somehow dissapear

And that's a nice way to say, money 'magically' dissapears either due corruption, bad management or poor choices.

[fervent lintel]

Among many other things.

[autumn briar]

can you believe that some of the d3 early season were double goblins. that's it. that's your season mechanic

[acoustic palm]

and our 1.3 was one mob and 10 items :kek

and some ugly mtx sets

So hopefully the money that EHG will earn now will be better spent.

Ubisoft also has that problem, with 20k employees, they had to get a 1.5 B loan from Tencent, so its not just 'small companies'.

Mostly because in late 2024 and earny 2025 their 4 released games sold poorly. IN EHG case: All the people that now own LE, they bring zero extra cash, so extra monetisation is needed.

I understand that. We are not bringing cash to LE now, we are actually costing them cash by playing on their server.

[fervent lintel]

It's honestly surprising how many technical issues LE still has--bugs, crashes, performance issues, etc

[willow sentinel]

I am worried about your H key

[fervent lintel]

Does LE ban for that?

[willow sentinel]

Shiit
I had to reset my phone a while back and didnt recover the bnet autenticator

I am locked out of my bnet account

[willow sentinel]

Yes

[fervent lintel]

I thought so. Been awhile tho.

Not that I have to worry about it anyway. Am on Linux.

[shut quiver]

I've seen this point brought up many times but why do ppl talk about how much money EHG has or has made from the game or from krafton deal? We don't know anything about these deals and the conditions that were placed while making these deals(in ref to krafton/subnautica). And even if we do know about the specifics what does it matter. Why are we talking finances instead of the game 😂

[fervent lintel]

Because we are concerned about the future of the game

[shut quiver]

Then talk about the game

The devs aren't gonna make financial decisions based on players' concerns about their finances planning. Krafton deal made it abundantly clear

Call out the game for lack of content or quality and all that, it makes sense but why divert the topic to a point where we have no control or relevancy even

[fervent lintel]

Because we are concerned about the future of the game

If they won't listen on finances, why do you suppose they would listen on anything else? 🤔

It's all related anyhow

Foolish to suggest otherwise

[shut quiver]

Why would they listen to players opinions on their finance management? Im sorry but if u are running a business, will u ask ur customers how to run ur business?

[fervent lintel]

If you're smart, you would. Your company is in danger of going under, maybe you ask them, "What can we do differently that you would want to buy from us more?"

[shut quiver]

I...idk what to say

[fervent lintel]

When they say "No gameplay MTX," that's a pretty clear signal

Several people have said they'd be okay with battlepasses

I suggested they maybe do the Warframe thing and outsource some of the MTX work for commission

They want to sell classes instead, then wonder why things aren't working out.

When your customers tell you not to sell fish at your burger joint, don't sell fkn fish.

[shut quiver]

Let me try and put it this way.
Things we know about and can criticise - the game. And the devs would care to listen on that part
Things we dnt know abt and cant criticise - their finances. Because of all these are assumptions you guys are making that they're in financial trouble thats why they're doing this

[fervent lintel]

It's not just assumption. They have said as much.

But we can still criticize it

Because they broke a foundational promise

Their whole pitch was "No gameplay MTX"

[shut quiver]

I really cant make this any more clear that by talking abt things that we have no control over we are only diverting from the main issue but idk man! Gl i guess

[fervent lintel]

The problem isn't that you aren't clear. It's that you're wrong.

[shut quiver]

Sure sure

[fervent lintel]

Well, you have yet to make a half-decent argument about any of it, so I'm quite confident in saying as much.

[shut quiver]

Maybe we should band together and have everyone sign a petition for EHG to release their financial records so that WE can solve their issues for them. U know, "Because we are concerned about the future of the game"

Hows that for decent?

[fervent lintel]

Awful

It's a straw man

[shut quiver]

Come on. Im at least asking we get details while u are making random assumptions and giving random solutions for those assumptions

[fervent lintel]

Even if we did that, it still doesn't have anything to do with the issue people are upset about

[shut quiver]

OMG u actually considered that, didnt u

[fervent lintel]

Their financial statement isn't the core problem. Their business model is.

[fervent lintel]

You're basically admitting that you're arguing in bad faith, lol

[zealous mesa]

🍿

[fervent lintel]

Kindly get lost then

[willow canopy]

Better off just playing the game @shut quiver Your not going to convince the haters otherwise

[quartz ivy]

March 26th is diabolical

[fervent lintel]

I'm not even a hater. I'm just calling balls and strikes. I want them to succeed, but what they are choosing is extremely risky, because it angers so much of their player base.

However, some weirdo trying to say what we can and can't talk about on it is absurd.

[shut quiver]

Not cant. Shouldn't. It looks petty and is irrelevant but sure man. U do u

[copper sorrel]

Haha, me too. The other keys teamed up and murdered G and H in cold plastic.
(Wrote that on phone.)

[fervent lintel]

It's so wild

[willow canopy]

At some point It just become beating a dead horse though. Frankly I'm tired of hearing it. Speculate all you want, but untill time passes we won't know anything untill it happens. So if you want to speculate the games demise, by all means, but im going to keep playing and hoping they deliver. They aren't the first game company to be acquired to prevent going under and they won't be the last.

[fervent lintel]

Totally fair

Though I'm not necessarily saying it's "dead" or going to be any time soon. Just concerned that it may be on that path.

[copper sorrel]

LE bans for what exactly?

[fervent lintel]

Use of Auto Hotkey ("Hkey")

[quartz ivy]

d4 is playable for around 12hours of content, poe2 has no endgame, sucks. poe1 3.27 is basically over.... we are in trouble haha

[copper sorrel]

lol, i thought he might mean le bans for repeated misstyping

[fervent lintel]

If you're looking for something to get you by while you wait for other games to do stuff:

• Chronicon
• Grim Dawn (or Titan Quest)
• Slormancer
• Sacred 2
• Torchlight 2 or Infinite

Assuming you haven't played them before, ofc

There's also D2R 🙂

[quartz ivy]

grim dawn is like skyrim for me, ive played it way too much and will never go back. infinite is ok, waiting on new season. titan quest is a good shout though

[copper sorrel]

Warcraft 3. One of the games of all time.
It's basically similar to an aarpg. You move a hero with up to 4 spells most of the time, who needs to kill mobs, loot and collect exp.

[fervent lintel]

Yeah, I'm 800+ in GD lol

I'm about "half way" through it 😄

[quartz ivy]

i wish i wasnt old and slow so i could play arc raiders lmao

[fervent lintel]

You're not. It's all in your head.

[quartz ivy]

slomancer wasnt it, wasnt feeling it

[fervent lintel]

It takes a bit to wind up, but doesn't do a lot to keep alts fun

[quartz ivy]

the arpg market is kinda small huh

[fervent lintel]

Depends on if you're a purist or okay with ARPG-ish games

[quartz ivy]

yeah, true

[fervent lintel]

Like Borderlands 2 is ARPG-like

[quartz ivy]

another game ive beat to death with hours lol. 3 and 4.. no thanks

[willow sentinel]

It was a joke

[fervent lintel]

2 is the good one lol

1 is actually good too, but 2 is better

[quartz ivy]

2 is the best by far. tiny tina is a very good game too

[fervent lintel]

The Division is looter-shooter like that too, but a little dated at this point

[quartz ivy]

i never did try that game, its n my steam library too

[fervent lintel]

It's kind of like BL2 in the sense that you'll play most of the builds and then have a hard time finding stuff to do lol

Kind of like D3

Fun for awhile tho

Dungeons of Sundaria is a tiny indie game that runs off ARPG-like design

[quartz ivy]

i almost jumped in to this new season of d3. around 5k hours in d3 over the years. brain dead GR running was a therapy

titan quest is what im going to do i think, no1, 2 doesnt have endgame yet, right ?

[fervent lintel]

Haven't played 2 yet

But that's what I hear

[quartz ivy]

i think its just story for now

[fervent lintel]

Or if you like CRPGs at all, Pillars 2 is amazing

[quartz ivy]

pillars of eternity ?

[fervent lintel]

The first game did okay, so most people didn't give 2 the shot it deserved

Ya

2 is substantially better

[quartz ivy]

im just a bit salty. would have loved to have a new LE season for over the xmas break

[fervent lintel]

You like the dual class system in Grim Dawn? You can do something like that in Pillars 2

[quartz ivy]

ill check pillars out for sure

[fervent lintel]

I have a hard time getting into that genre usually--too slow

[willow canopy]

Isn't pillard of eternity a CRPG?

[fervent lintel]

But it has real time w/ pause, which is the perfect middle ground for me

Makes it play like KOTOR

It also has a turn-based mode if you prefer it

[acoustic palm]

I remember the purple named person was trying to tell me that 80k peak is enough players, when I was calling it early that the game is probably struggling financially, one month later krafton was announced

[willow canopy]

Ah okay yeah ive played a bit of pillars one. I also got titan quest 2 it's been interesting they have some cool ideas and the game looks beautiful, bit so far I belive it's only got 2 chapters.

[acoustic palm]

There is some bias here, but everyone is biased towards something

[quartz ivy]

its literally 4 months away..

[fervent lintel]

I absolutely love games that let you multi-class though, especially if it's not the ultra lame way D&D does it

[acoustic palm]

Rift was a good concept for multi class

[fervent lintel]

It was

[willow canopy]

Not a fan of BG 3 eh?

[fervent lintel]

p2w destroyed that game tho

[acoustic palm]

Or archeage, I sold my account in that game to buy a PC when I was small

[fervent lintel]

Haven't played yet

[quartz ivy]

i never got in to turn based

[acoustic palm]

Got like 1k euro which was a lot like 10 years ago

That game was ultra pay to win

[fervent lintel]

So I've heard

[willow canopy]

It's basically dnd 5th edition but video game form so if you don't like the way dnd does things you might not like it.

[fervent lintel]

I don't like how it handles multi-classing

Taking turns by level is so lame

In Pillars 2, you just are both classes. You just choose where to invest within those classes.

[quartz ivy]

you guys ever play Neverwinter back in the day? i wonder if theres still a player base there

[fervent lintel]

Much like Grim Dawn

[acoustic palm]

I am excited for the new GD expansion

[fervent lintel]

Siralim Ultimate doesn't use "classes" per se, but you capture creatures and you can combine them for interesting team compositions.

Feels like part dungeon crawler, part Pokemon, part MTG (but in the good ways)

[acoustic palm]

GD always delivered quality, they have nice story too

[fervent lintel]

Siralim has immense depth

Not very ARPG-like tho

Ghostlore is a decent indie ARPG, but I'd wait for a sale. Don't think it's worth $20. Maybe more like $10.

[spring quest]

the link for the road map isn't working for me

[fervent lintel]

Did you check #news ?

[spring quest]

yep that's where i clicked the link at

[fervent lintel]

Odd. It works for me.

Maybe restart your browser and/or Discord?

[spring quest]

i restarted my phone let's see if that did something 😂

[fervent lintel]

If tapping the link doesn't work, try copy/pasting it manually

[quartz moat]

wasnt there a community manager here on the discord?

[fervent lintel]

Sometimes there is, but they gotta sleep too

[south moat]

Probably hopping on in an hour or so

[fervent lintel]

Oof, the faces on the Youtube thumbnails are beginning to animate sans mouse interaction... That's my queue for bed time.

[south moat]

Yeah, go get some rest

[quartz moat]

oh i was just wondering if they were still around

[spring quest]

I had to use a different web browser for some reason chrome is acting up

[fervent lintel]

(Use Brave)

Anyway, g'night folks ❤️

[spring quest]

that's what I used for it and night thx

[acoustic palm]

I advise people to use Firefox, while brave has many things installed, it's still chromium and it exists just because chromium V2 manifest is not blocked.

Sure, it's better than using chrome which has V3, but it's part of the problem since it supports chromium.

[copper sorrel]

Why is it problematic to support chromium?

[acoustic palm]

Because it enables practices like making ad blocks unable to work, collects more data

[inner finch]

Firefox has terrible performance and compatibility

But i still chose to use it lol

Because google can @$%% my whole @$%@

[acoustic palm]

Edge runs better than chrome nowadays

[inner finch]

involve Microsoft too? @$@$ that @$@%#, they sure can @#$ my entire #@$#%

[acoustic palm]

Haha, not saying that I use it, but it uses less resources

I use waterfox. I have no issue with it on windows/ Linux/ mobile, it satisfies me.

Waterfox is a branch of Firefox. I can use it at work too, which makes me happier than the default chrome.

It also has chromium ESR support if you need an extension from chrome

[stable shoal]

Opera works fine for me

[quartz moat]

opera is chrome based iirc

[balmy arrow]

[obtuse bay]

[calm jay]

All my browsers gotta do is block ads, hawh

[thick lotus]

[brittle aurora]

2000 negative reviews on steam?

damn

almost like actions have consequences

[brittle hollow]

What happened ?

[south moat]

Nah he didn't

[willow sentinel]

Oo

[brittle hollow]

Yeah it wasn’t picking up

I was waiting for the spiel

So I could join in the heckling

[willow sentinel]

Ngl, I almost fell for it

[brittle hollow]

It feels nice having the same conversation daily.. like time is standing still

And people have nothing better to do

[brittle aurora]

get used to it

[primal abyss]

Howdy Travelers

[south moat]

jello 👋

[willow canopy]

Howdy

[primal abyss]

Hope everyone is well today

[south moat]

It's another day that ends in y
What could be better

[brittle hollow]

2001 negative reviews

That would be better maybe 🤔

[verbal ore]

I havnt been following much, is this game still moving towards AI gen? Kinda got a hankering to play again but don't wanna support AI content

[stable forum]

never was moving that direction

[main frigate]

#📚┃off-topic message
Do you think an artist who own this level of skills wiling to be polluted by AI art? 👀
He's an art director in EHG.

[brittle hollow]

Specifically mentioned and replied in a Reddit post that there is no generative AI content in the game as well… and never was moving either

[verbal ore]

Oh good to know, I read that krafton was making their company AI first and then they fired a bunch of people so figured it already started

[primal abyss]

What MonEll said. I was rudely interrupted by said kitten who demanded the utmost attention. hairballs

[verbal ore]

I see the post in news but can't open it at work due to blockers but I assume that probably covers it?

[primal abyss]

The latest post provides a much needed expanded look of info regarding S4, S5 and the expansion

The info isn't going anywhere but would suggest checking it out whenever you get the chance. 🙂

[main frigate]

#❔┃ask-the-community message
I want to ask for you help

[verbal ore]

I'm heading home in 30 I'll check it out, just wanted to start the download again remotely so it's done when I get home haha

I love the game, just can't support Ai content as an artist myself. I'm sure that's understandable

So if that's not an issue I'm full support

[primal abyss]

Ah okay. Could you try restating the question again for me here?

[main frigate]

What's your answer for "The team have to delay something because of unavoidable reasons. But this team have been told something trust us a few times before. How will you explain that with angry/upset/disappointing players and protect the trust"? Plus nothing exciting in spoilers of S4.

I believe it's a good and interesting question on the interview for a CM. EHG gave a good context.
It's tricky to be hyped because the final strike is in the expansion due to roadmap, like 2 monolith of fate update, corruption tiers and etched timestones.

[south moat]

Kirra it's hard to understand what do you mean "protect the trust"
They've already lost the trust of a lot of the players
I suppose you should be asking what can they do to earn it back
And for some players they can't.

[obtuse bay]

difficult to earn trust, easy to lose it

[shell wadi]

The question is what should you pay next if the money through affordable classes is not enough?

[primal abyss]

There honestly isn't short or easy response. With the updated roadmap and details, it was a way of showing a commitment of providing an experience worth the time and patience. We missed the mark with the initial roadmap post and needed to own up to it. So we provided the updated info. Like nub mentioned, folks may feel a certain kind of way. I won't dismiss that, rather report it and share it with the team as a whole. This will ensure that it won't occur again.

Currently, you'll notice some things changing, more suggestions, feedback and other communications with the community, etc. This is part of what we aim to ensure that you feel heard. (Also why I suggest providing any sort of feedback/suggestion, regardless of how outlandish it may sound)

I want to also thank folks for their candor and respectful dialogue. It is truly appreciated.

[shut quiver]

Currently, you'll notice some things changing, more suggestions, feedback and other communications with the community, etc
About this, can I ask where are these suggestions and feedback being taken from generally?

[primal abyss]

If you are here in discord, #feedback and #suggestions. I will share the caveat is that: There are a lot of different type of players, feedback and suggestions. It would be extremely difficult to implement each and every thing. However, everything is shared with the team. Regardless, if something is already under way, internally.

A little less recently, we've asked community to share information regarding bugs they experience or have continued to do so on our forums. It just isn't limited there as our team pretty much scans everywhere the community is.

[south moat]

I kinda wish you would also take feedback and suggestions from other places than just those channels

[primal abyss]

We do. Maybe not in the exact same manner, but we do

[shut quiver]

Fair enough. I only ask because just a very small percentage of players seem to speak up on any forum regarding situations like this

[primal abyss]

Anywhere our eyes find members, we absolutely do. The thing is...just because it isn't in Discord, doesn't mean we dont see it, share it or take it to heart.

[zinc blaze]

discord just lets the devs have an easier time of keeping track of the suggestions

[primal abyss]

The threads here do that, yes

[shut quiver]

And thats the tragedy of it. Discord is way easier means to communicate with devs directly and yet most players don't use it

[primal abyss]

Discord isn't for everyone. We get that

And some folks on other platforms might feel the same way about a different platform Like twitch, youtube, reddit, forums, etc

So we do our best to cover as many platforms as possible

You made a reddit post? WE SEES IT. Made a Youtube video? WE probably seen that too! Stream on twitch? Someone has probably lurked in the stream at some point

and so on

[zinc blaze]

I'd personally still like a classic forum post but so many of my job and field specific communities use discord so i use discord too

[acoustic palm]

I wish the communication was also done on steam for the important things, 90% of people don't dig in discord/ reddit, just no lifers like us, but for rest of the players they will hear nothing aside from the streamers covering an uproar

I forgot about the game myself until I heard dr3ad quitting LE, so theres that.

[primal abyss]

Throw that in #suggestions. I know we do post most of our news on steam as well. We shared the Decembe 8 roadmap on steam but please, drop all the things and what you'd like to see

[balmy arrow]

I wish I could notice the seasons every 4 months

[zinc blaze]

[shut quiver]

90% is still too generous if u ask me. Lets say this server has 50k players, any controversial or big news and IF mostly 500 users show up to react to that news thats only 1% of the users. Meanwhile in the last 10 days u got close to 1000 negative reviews on steam

[acoustic palm]

Yeah, and these people that came to yap here only came since they saw the info somewhere else, yapped and left the discord, I am in 30 discords too and all of them are muted, so unless I'm active in one I will not notice the post in news

[shut quiver]

Precisely. So the majority of the players are either silent or unheard on most of the matters

[calm jay]

On the other hand, like 90% of opinions are 'you broke the promise' at this point, which... let's be frank, helps nobody and doesn't need any more saying, really

[acoustic palm]

Also, I don't follow the game reddit as 90% of posts are "the game sucks" 😄

[calm jay]

Most of Reddit is bots anyway

You're missing very little by not being there except AI-generated posts, people who defend them, and teenagers

[acoustic palm]

Nah, I know these are genuine players as they have broken english.

[calm jay]

Ahhhhh, can't be the LLM with classic typos. That's how teamwork do!

[shut quiver]

While I do agree with this, lets be honest that these opinions are voiced by maybe the 0.1-0.5% of the population

[acoustic palm]

That too, most of people do not care enough to voice their opinion, hell most people do not care enough to check a 'dead game' social media

How often do you find yourself checking mass effect 4 reddit?

[calm jay]

I mean it's more for me that I really don't have that strong of an opinion, lol

Lots of people are absolutely shattered by this, apparently, but even before I knew they somewhere, sometime promised they wouldn't pursue additional monetization that that simply wouldn't be true anyway. Money is pretty useful stuff, it turns out.

[acoustic palm]

People just play other games, they don't follow one game social media unless they are really invested into it.

[calm jay]

So even if I were pressed for an opinion it'd be like, "I understand businesses need to make money"

Will I buy any of it? Depends entirely on the content, if it's good, if it's what I want, etc

[shut quiver]

People usually blame the devs/companies for the lack of communication while the majority cant be bothered to voice their opinions to begin with. I wish there was a way to circumvent this issue

[acoustic palm]

Agree on that yeah. To me is not the 5-10 euro cost of paid DLC that bothers me, I feel like I paid enough and the quality of the game is under my expectations, so I will only pay more if the game meets my expectations.

[calm jay]

There is, the unfortunate thing is that it requires people to stop, slow down, and actually communicate instead of just jumping to sensationalist replies.

I can dig that Madliv, I personally don't know how I feel about an xpac narratively when the campaign's story delivery is kind of... messy and bad, haha

[acoustic palm]

Look at the other arpg, I paid 90 euro for a support package cuz I feel like it meets my expectations

[main frigate]

Judd will not allow me to shout at you 🤷‍♀️

I prefer to ask hard and tricky questions, yes.

[calm jay]

Someone has to, and they always exist regardless of an asker.

[acoustic palm]

I see dlcs as tips, are you going to tip if the food was trash? Nope (I'm from Europe)

[calm jay]

Yeah basically

[acoustic palm]

But if the game/ food meets your expectations and the server gives you a outstanding welcome and the resturant is super cozy, yeah, you add more tips because the place made you feel nice.

Yet when the food is smaller than you imagined, it lacks salt, the restaurant is cold...you don't feel like tipping. That's how I see it with gaming too.

[calm jay]

Yeah I agree with that, I kinda do the same with achievements honestly

If I 100% cheevo your game, you dun summin' right

[acoustic palm]

I'm sorry if I was/ am toxic sometimes, but imo this is the best way I can voice my view towards DLC

[calm jay]

I've seen nothing but above-table behaviour in this discord for the most part, it's one of the most civilized I've been in, which is impressive at 200k members

I do think the seasonal cycles won't pan out for LE. They could do something similar or adopt a system like it, but as it is in its current construct I think it'll just cause more issues; I also think the campaign needs different deliveries, either they need to make the quest system just bake into the progress so you get your points/idols as you conquer out zones-- or they need to make it so the quests are far more involving, give better rewards, and are more than just an NPC saying "sssoooo hhheeeyyy know you got that whole 'correcting the timeline' biz but you mind knocking off this jerk over here for me? thaaaaaaaaaaaaanx"

I should really do a write up in suggestions, hhehe

[acoustic palm]

And since we are keeping the comparation using food, their biggest competition is GGG, which offers two dishes at the 'price of one'.

Realistically, you only see MTX when you play, right? So a 7-8 months between league means you don't see your MTX that much.

Well, at GGG when I go to dine at them, they give me two dishes at the price of one. With 6 leagues per year I get a lot of food that I can eat / opportunities for me to see my MTX.

Sure, maybe some people don't enjoy one dish, or they enjoy one more than the other, but the food/ content is there.

at LE?, 1.3 was dissapointing and I only played for 2 days, so seeing my mtx 2 days per year isn't going to make me that happy 😄

I already played my 1.2 char a lot and got to 3k corruption, and starting a new one felt boring

EHG team getting depression each time I post

[inner finch]

I want to believe HR simply forbids them from ever touching this server

I know i wouldnt come near, or to reddit

[stable forum]

I think it totally can. Once the campaign is finished with the exp pack, seems to me like they can focus those resources towards steady content updates. I don't know anything about their process, so this is a big assumption obviously, but it makes sense in my head lol

[strange umbra]

Good morning Eterrans! ☕

[tough sierra]

Hello, Mr Muffin

[exotic solar]

Its nothing compared to the depression i am gonna get if i see elemental arrow passives on marksman at season 4

[primal abyss]

Hallo Muffin Man

[zinc blaze]

hello John Bloodborne

[inner finch]

blood muffins

[turbid silo]

Good day folks

[primal abyss]

Hello Derrick~

[turbid silo]

How's everyone?

[exotic solar]

Curious, how about you?

[turbid silo]

I'm doing pretty good, neck is a little uncomfortable cause I clearly slept wrong on it hhe

but otherwise really good 🙂

[tough sierra]

Soo many yellow names. Love it.

[exotic solar]

Happy you are goos. You can use a hot towel to softed your neck and do few small exercises, it works for me.

[honest belfry]

Morning all!

[slender bramble]

A hot tower... the nemesis woven echo?

[tough sierra]

and another one!

[exotic solar]

ohh yeah, long day at works sorry

[primal abyss]

EHG Woven Echo

[turbid silo]

Hah, nemesis woven echo lol

[strange umbra]

lmao

[strange umbra]

Ill be better once my brain comes online ☕

[honest belfry]

Ditto.

[tough sierra]

There it is. 5 in a row. Echo chain. ><

[turbid silo]

Facts, coffee is doing its work

[fresh tiger]

still missing some caffeine tbh yeah

[honest belfry]

I grabbed a bottle of eggnog from the store and replaced my coffee creamer with it. Good stuff

[main frigate]

I have been made a friend with the same pfp 3 years ago

Full of nostalgia

[calm jay]

Egg nog in coffee? O: I love both of these things...

[honest belfry]

That or make the Nordic spice from the Elder scrolls cookbook and add it to the coffee grounds before you brew (chef's kiss)

[turbid silo]

Egg nog lattes are delicious

Egg nog chai is my fav tho

[simple bison]

I've never had or even seen eggnog

[calm jay]

An egg nog chai sounds rad. Chai happens to be my jam for teas, too. Ima have to check this spice out now...

[inner finch]

eggnog is awesome

[calm jay]

I mean, I consider the stuff ambrosia

[inner finch]

quite an acquired taste.

[calm jay]

Definitely

[honest belfry]

It's pretty easy to make. It's mostly just eggs, dairy and spices

[calm jay]

It's very, very rich and creamy, which isn't for everyone

[simple bison]

It's just not a thing here I guess

[inner finch]

if anyone find it a little rich, you can always dilute a bit with milk

but it loses its magic

[simple bison]

Here you drink spiced wine and a special soda that's only available in winter during the winter holidays

[honest belfry]

Sofa?

[simple bison]

Autocorrect

[calm jay]

Ooooh, a good mulled wine is absolutely peak though

Heheh

Spice-flavoured things in general pop up lots around christmas here in Canada.

[honest belfry]

Ah! ok. I had a weird dejavu moment where I swore we had this conversation before haha

[calm jay]

Although egg nog makes guest appearances at Easter now

[simple bison]

I think I've mentioned the soda before

[strange umbra]

@honest belfry did you see my new emoji lmao

[simple bison]

It's literally called Christmas must

[honest belfry]

That Wassail recipe in the Eterra Monthly, go add a splash of mulled wine to it. That's how we do it at my house

[strange umbra]

[honest belfry]

I did!

[tough sierra]

EHG, I hope you all sprinkle more upcomming information along the way to make the journey to March 26th less grueling. 🙂

[exotic solar]

Since there is a group of devs here i will make a suggestion. Can we have a unique that changes bear form to cat form? Preferably based on my cat but anything works.

[honest belfry]

Were-cat would be cool. Toss it in the #suggestions I don't think we've pulled this week's list for review yet

[viral halo]

Make it even more wild. Let us fight as a squirrel. 🐿️

[exotic solar]

Its a cool idea but tbh i want my cat in game.

At least one of them, for now.

[viral halo]

Imagine being the alpha squirrel with a group of smaller minion squirrels following you.

[tropic crown]

why is this game gender locked? I want all my chars to be female

[copper sorrel]

Are you malephobic?

[inner finch]

[calm jay]

I would appreciate each gender for each class, but I also don't think your character spends much time being a visual key point, usually gets hidden under armor pretty quick.

[willow sentinel]

But then we could be using "female armor"
You know

[calm jay]

The only female armor I'm interested in is full-body full-plate. Full plate, and packing steel!

None of this 'command the king's armies at 5, and then king the army commander at 7' WoW-style work. Nuh-uh.

[tough sierra]

It would be a 'nice to have' feature for me. Way down on the priority list.

[south moat]

Bikini plate is all you'll get
but only on male acolyte

[honest belfry]

You guys are starting to scare me...

[broken yarrow]

why do people still defend p2w or pay for convenience aspects in 2025?

[steep river]

Embrace the armored budgie smuggler

[tough sierra]

Here we go....

[steep river]

Is anyone defending that?

[broken yarrow]

In ingame chat, yes

[tough sierra]

Ask them, then

[broken yarrow]

why not both

[brittle hollow]

What’s convenient and what are they winning ?

[acoustic palm]

I just had a pancake

[broken yarrow]

stash tabs in poe are convenience e.g.

[brittle hollow]

MAKE GAMES FREE AGAIN

MGFA

Or make free games again? MFGA? No thats close to something else

[copper sorrel]

With a topping?

[acoustic palm]

Chocolate

[tough sierra]

I like cereal

[brittle hollow]

I put bananas in mine. It’s amazing

[acoustic palm]

Oh banana is good yeah

[broken yarrow]

i like eating shit

thats why im paying lost ark

playing*

[brittle hollow]

Pro tip too, if you have strawberry jam, put some in a cup, a dash of water , stir it and pop it in the microwave for 30 seconds. Homemade pancake syrup

[brittle hollow]

Good stuff!

[main frigate]

I never understand why people enjoy food includes syrup

[strange umbra]

ARE WE DISCUSSING BREAKFAST FOODS

[brittle hollow]

Because people like sweet things ?

Some people at least. And that was essentially strawberry jam lol

[honest belfry]

Make a brown sugar glaze and add roasted Pecans

[turbid silo]

I like breakfast foods 😄

Just had a breakfast burrito

[brittle hollow]

Oh now I know what I’m making next time my wife and I are both at home for breakfast 😄

[steep river]

You need to make some homemade pancakes or waffles from scratch and drizzle a small amount of good quality maple syrup on them sometime. If you still don't like it, that's fine, different people like different things.

[south moat]

I could draw crude fanart of it for you (not really)

[calm jay]

It's more just defending that they need money and paid classes is less restriction on the box price than paid expacs. I'd much rather live in a world where like PoE, they could be free and run off a cash shop only

Also maple syrup is beast mode, of course I enjoy it >:U

[steep river]

Roast pecans, rough chop, and mix into the waffle batter. Fall/winter favorite for my wife. Made some last weekend

[main frigate]

(Chewing Salami as my snack and be confused)

I want garlic salt on my nuts only

[steep river]

Probably good on popcorn too

[main frigate]

what your favourite food?

[main frigate]

I just know dinner foods sorry

[turbid silo]

Sushi

[strange umbra]

mmmm so good - I am in the land of amazing breakfast burritos here lol

[turbid silo]

Right? They are fantastic

[honest belfry]

I have a recipe for one we used to call the Hangover Burrito. It served 1 purpose and it never failed

[inner finch]

idk how yall consume all of this heartattack food this early

[honest belfry]

We don't. not in 1 day. Sometimes not even in the same week

[south moat]

I'd like to get that recipe

[turbid silo]

Maybe we'll include it with EM!

[south moat]

Should be delivered now

[honest belfry]

haha I will warn, it has a long ingredient list. It started as a "I have left overs and it's 8am" kinda thing, and we just changed it up until we found what worked best.

[main frigate]

#📚┃off-topic message

This biscuit helped me to learn the flavor of cinnamon & brown sugar. Not bad, not my first choice though.

Spent me some time to adapt the sweetness because it's too much at the beginning

[main frigate]

🤔 Interesting. You like textures from raw food?

[turbid silo]

Nah, just the flavor

And of course the rice

[main frigate]

😅 .......

Rice lover. I see

[inner finch]

Biscoff isnt just ordinary brown sugar

it is a caramelized one

You notice those slightly deeper notes

[brittle hollow]

Biscoff needs some moderation true. I do prefer the cookies compared to the spread/butter. Although the butter is killer on a crepe

[main frigate]

You have a rice cooker at home? Will you cook rice daily?

[foggy vale]

yay more good news today love the teasers and direction, cant wait for march

[turbid silo]

Naw, not daily, but quite often

[inner finch]

wait what good news today

[main frigate]

Oh. Better than my dad. My dad is a rice man.

[scenic fog]

I believe I've worked out a pretty powerful ele nova build, lots of moving parts but... so far so good...

I believe the final form will have nova at level 40

[south moat]

So far so good
So far so good

OH NO

[scenic fog]

My build uses 3 different sets

I'm nowhere near done yet but my nova tooltip already is sitting at nearly 50,000

[inner finch]

Is that a frost claw nova build?

[scenic fog]

No, its tri-ele

if everything works as planned.. my elemental nova will reach level 41

And deal a lot of damage, and cover the entire screen

and cast avalanche

[inner finch]

yeah, just for the record, frost claw can proc any nova, of any kind

Just beware, there's a serious performance degredation with high cast speed of novas

[scenic fog]

When its done and I make it to serious content, I'll try to get a video of gameplay. I'm pretty proud of this one.

[south moat]

Good, good

[ornate urchin]

when is season 4 coming?

[inner finch]

I would highly suggest reading the announcement

but the short answer is March 26th

[pulsar geyser]

march 26, 2026

[viral halo]

@willow sentinel
Are you sure about that ailment scaling?
Delete your post... I did the same 😁

[willow sentinel]

Yup

Ailments inherit the Attribute related Inc Dmg from the skill that apply them

[viral halo]

Oh, thats interesting

I killed aberroth with hit and had just base intelligence, 0 on gear or on skill tree

But the damage was there, thats why i am wondering..

[willow sentinel]

It's clearly not the best scaler in most case

4% Inc Dmg per Attribute when you can get more than 200% on ring with t7 Ele Dot

Is not a lot

But it's there

[viral halo]

So, if a dexterity skill proccs poison, the poison ailment will be boosted by dexterity?

With the common 4% or so?!

[willow sentinel]

4%

Per dex

[viral halo]

Yep

Gotcha

[willow sentinel]

Everything the skill does get 4% per Dex

You know about more dmg applying to ailments too

Well applicable More Dmg

[zinc blaze]

shout out to void spells getting flat void dmg from vitality

[chilly ember]

shatter strike getting flat and increased from dex is pretty wild too

[fervent lintel]

Yeah, the main benefit is that it's available in affix slots that the stronger scaling affixes may not be--and base stats do a little extra besides

Non-dmg effects

[scenic fog]

I'm really excited about this new ele nova build I am working in, it's doing so well, the avalanche procs are popping bosses really fast

[cobalt fable]

i mean last epoch dont have a future as long krafton is here

[brittle hollow]

You said it!

[heady night]

96 days until hype week

[sharp heron]

Guys, who are the best korean/chinese build creators?

[sharp heron]

Feel free to leave, I guess

[short vessel]

I very much doubt anyone here will know lol

[main frigate]

You need to go to bilibili if you want to find Chinese youtubers

I never see a Korean YouTuber here xd

Only single Chinese famous YouTuber available so I guess you can find him easily

[stable shoal]

Mistia I think is her name I think she is Chinese , she is one of the best build creators there is because whatever she cooks its good

[muted cape]

Misha

[autumn briar]

Misha and mistia are different people

Both are good and worth following though

[main frigate]

search Mistia on which platform?

🤔 letools don't support to search user names

企鹅毛？oh

[autumn briar]

The Asian content creators that are on YouTube that i know of are mistia42 and comfy3k

On bili there would be loads more probably really good but we dont get to see

[main frigate]

#❔┃ask-the-community message
Yes I found his bilibili page. Views aren't good because le isn't quite popular

Asian community is waiting to be developed yet

[fathom carbon]

👋

[balmy arrow]

[willow sentinel]

Top of the morning, travelers

[acoustic palm]

I doubt it, but will LE show something at the TGA?

[severe socket]

...LE's gonna be present on TGA?

🤨

[gritty helm]

I don't think so ?
I can see EHG showcasing the free expansion, but that's more like a gamescom time possibility

[severe socket]

Thought so.

Besides, there's too early to really show anything, imo.

WAY too early.

[gritty helm]

We are likely on a slow burn until the end of the march

[candid linden]

Is you guys excited about Druid class i

[acoustic palm]

Werebear? I played it in 1.3 but it was a bit clunky

[gritty helm]

Kind of excited, but GGG with 1.1 taught me to temper my expectations

For all the LE problems I have/had at least I never had a crashout as bad as Lake/1.1

[main frigate]

Synthesis is what I hyped

Druid? Not interested in that so much before I'm rich

[gritty helm]

Hilarious that Lake was the league when I've wanted to commit into PoE, and when I've wanted to commit into PoE2 1.1 happened

So I don't get excited for that game anymore 😐

My excitement is cursed

[inner finch]

good, do not consume

[gritty helm]

Hilariously enough slow burn with LE announcements does not affect me badly. Magic the Gathering has perpetual spoiler hype season. Expansion relases, already next two are teased and hyped

It tires me so much I kind of welcome media with periods of nothing going on lol

[balmy arrow]

[obtuse bay]

[golden lodge]

i think so

[inner finch]

Also waking up to this #👨┃ask-the-devs-not-support-no-bugs message is amazing

its exactly what i was hoping to hear

aspire

[gritty helm]

tbf neither it has without any publisher

I get scepticism, but let's not pretend it had any to begin with

[golden lodge]

i didnt say publisher is bad

i say krafton is bad

tbf we are right

paid classes proof of this

[gritty helm]

Good publishers are dime in a dozen though

I still think it could have went way worse

[golden lodge]

It's very sad that you're the kind of person who can settle for the lesser of two evils and not be bothered by it.

[inner finch]

@gritty helm You just got labeled, high five

[gritty helm]

Well I don't see any alternative solution. And I definitely prefer and appreciate devs trying to keep the project afloat, rather than giving up.

[main frigate]

I discovered more interesting things I can do after I burnt out so it's not a bad thing

Just found another new thing... Wax seals, thinking which pattern should I diy...

[inner finch]

yeah these are also used for car headlights

[main frigate]

I decided colours for wax pellets in 20s but patterns is a tricky thing to decide

I just know I want a 35mm seal

[gritty helm]

Yep. It's not all that bad