#dnd-lore

1 messages · Page 37 of 1

modest badger
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Things are like Ceremony which has atonement which changes it back:

Atonement. You touch one willing creature whose alignment has changed, and you make a DC 20 Wisdom (Insight) check. On a successful check, you restore the target to its original alignment.

This might be in response to very powerful effects such as those that come with staying too long in the Abyss, a plane of chaotic evil:

If a corrupted creature doesn't leave the plane within 1d4+2 days, its alignment changes to chaotic evil. Casting the dispel evil and good spell on the creature restores its original alignment.

But possibly other factors. Might be better to work with your DM on that one.

stable gulch
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Aasaimon, do you know if there is a race for them, or might I be able to find a Homebrew equivalent that isn't to much

modest badger
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Not a playable race in 5e no. Closest you'll get is Aasimar who are the descendents of them.

Much like how you can't play an actual demon or devil, but could play a tiefling.

stable gulch
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That makes sense

iron saffron
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4E had playable devas but they were essentially wingless aasimar (4E didn't have the typical D&D angels like planetars and solars but rather generic angels that looked like the 5E elemental myridons)

stable gulch
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i see

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can someone name a god for me that is all about helping those in need, helping in general

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goodie two shoes

iron saffron
stable gulch
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ah

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ty sorre

iron saffron
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This channel is to discuss about official D&D lore, not your homebrew lore.

stable gulch
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is there not gods of spesific things in dnd?

iron saffron
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Which setting?

stable gulch
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ah i need to be spesific

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ill find the book soon

iron saffron
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Taps channel's sign:

Discuss WotC-published game settings, and the events and characters that shaped them. Wherever possible, please indicate which setting you're discussing: [Forgotten Realms]/[FR], [Eberron], [Dragonlance], etc.

stable gulch
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yes my apologies

iron saffron
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There are many official campaign settings.

stable gulch
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if that works as a title

modest badger
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Hidden Shrine technically takes place in Greyhawk setting, but can take place in any setting.

stable gulch
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oh

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the map we used is forgotten realms

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otherwise thats all i got

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for setting

modest badger
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Angels serve most good aligned gods in FR. You might want Torm or Lathander or so on.

stable gulch
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ty

iron saffron
stable gulch
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ty

shy cape
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Hey guys I gotta question about BG3 im hoping i can get a answer i cant seem to get one in the Larian Server. So I just read Decent into Avernus and all and i watched a YouTube video where they said in the beginning of BG3 you start in Elturel. Now is that the very beginning? Like where the ship crashes?

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Wouldnt Elturel be all corupted from being in hell and stuff?

modest badger
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I think they mean in hell. Elturel was a city dragged down into hell.

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So you start BG3 in hell.
beyond that though might be spoilers for both BG3 and Descent into Avernus

iron saffron
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BG3 lore isn't official D&D lore.

modest badger
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Although I think their information is wrong and you do not start in Elturel, in hell or otherwise.

shy cape
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ok ill ask there ive been getting all different kinds of answers so i am supeer conufused

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ive ben playing elder scrolls my whoel life idk why ive pushed forgotten realms off for so long and ive just started getting into it last week so im super overwhelmed with studying the lore and all theres so much over 35,000+ years worth of lore its insane. Blows the elder scrolls outta the water IMO lol

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thanks

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i didnt know Mind Flayers are another name for Illithids so i was doing quests protecting them not knowing who they were so my campaign for bg3 is pretty much screwed right now😭

iron saffron
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The Forgotten Realms campaign setting is older than D&D itself.

modest badger
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I'd say it's official lore, but it's canon unto itself really. As each branch of D&D media is.

iron saffron
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Sorry I meant official canon in regards to the overall D&D multiverse. WotC had no hand in BG3. It was all Larian who just licensed the product. It's as official as the D&D movie (which is self contained canon in its own lore)

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(I'm not disputing you, Elgate)

modest badger
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But yeah BG3 discussion should happen in those channels to avoid spoilers dndLol

shy cape
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Im new to Forgotten Realms. The only books I have is The Legend of Drizzt 1,2 & 3. Im looking for actual RAW Lore. What are some lore books to get me started learning about the history of Forgotten REalms? I Know the Wiki is good but I want a good solid hardback book to collect and read that isnt digital media.

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I have so many questions but i dont want to seem like im spamming chat so i wont be annoying like that 😦

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I know im in for a huge ride being completely GREEN to Forgotten Realms but you gotta start somewhere. It took me almost 9 years to learn everythign about Elder Scrolls starting with Skryim in 2012. But now with BG3 idk why ive put Forgotten Realms off for so long

iron saffron
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Which part of the planet Toril do you want to know about? The continent of Faerun? Which part of Faerun? The Sword Coast? Which part of the Sword Coast? etc.

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There's the 3E Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting book. It's my go to book for Faerun lore and other information.

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For things related to FR gods I use the 3E Faiths and Pantheons.

shy cape
iron saffron
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2E had the Volo's series that goes into detail, such as Volo's Guide to Waterdeep.

modest badger
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The wiki is also good because you can check the sources at the bottom of the page. Wikia's might have their own quirks on what they consider official or not, or what data to prioritise, but they often are a good source for finding more sources.

shy cape
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the wiki is the best but i prefer hardback books 😄

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being new to all this is very overwhelming.

modest badger
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Right, but my point is that the wiki can point you to those books. On the subject you were looking at.

iron saffron
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Pre-5E books are harder to find since they're out of print. You can get most of them in PDF format on DMs Guild (some may have print-on-demand option)

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You can try to find older edition physical books on eBay.

modest badger
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Want to learn more about lizardfolk, but not sure where to look? Take a peek at the sources cited on the wiki, and see which of those books might be worth looking into further. The more they're cited, the more likely they are to have more information on the thing you want.

dusty kettle
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Is there anything known about specific rituals worshippers of Loviatar would perform? I'm designing a dungeon that is a temple dedicated to her

quartz lagoon
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although i know that it wasnt ever official, is there any magic in the forgotten realms that have a similar widespread amnestic as the false hydra?

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like a magic item that makes the world forget you exist?

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that would make for quite the elusive antagonist

little trellis
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modify memory on a large scale

spark haven
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Nystul's Magic Aura is...an approximation. Perfect amnestics/antimemes are, as you've intuited, not that common because they're extremely hard to work around without unpleasant contrivances

rough fractal
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Hey guys! I'm introducing a new player to my Forgotten Realms games. I've run a number of games in the Realms and there's a lot that's happened, including the modules. I'm thinking of using the following as an explanation of where the world is at as we begin play:

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The year is 1494 by the Dalereckoning, in a time period that will eventually be known as the Time of Terrors. In the last few years, many ills have befallen the Realms, and especially the Sword Coast. The Cult of The Dragon attempted a summoning of Tiamat out of her chains in Avernus. Giants rampaged across the Heartlands. Masked Lords were outed and slain in the streets of Waterdeep. Dragons stir and are slain in the lands south of Neverwinter. Elder Elementals have turned the primordial forces of nature itself against The North. Amnians seek refuge in Baldur's Gate from debt-induced slavery. Most recently, however, the entire city of Elturel was swallowed by The Hells, and the small nation of Elturgard has become infested with devils. In many of these epic and horrendous events, adventurers were mustered with pomises of gold and glory. Many of these adventurers perished. However, all was not lost. Great heroes rose up and conquered the evils for the goodly folk of the Sword Coast. The Cult of the Dragon was neutered by the famed Harpers. The giants were pacified with the daring rescue of King Hekaton, and a peace between them and man has been brokered. Waterdeep has rooted out its criminals and begun appointing new Masked Lords, due to the help of a single Candlekeep scholar. This is the state of Faerun as you choose to adventure. A Time of Terrors, and an Age of Adventure.

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Do you feel this accurately displays the last decade of the 15th century? Does it give an appropriate view of the Realms?

raven marsh
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Is anyone aware of there ever being anything official about how long slaad live?

jagged apex
raven marsh
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Thanks!

jagged apex
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but seems is long enough to most either evolve into higher forms of slaad or die prematurely from fatal wounds before they risk dying of old age, but seems likely more than a century based on this info about death slaads from 3.5e's epic level handbook https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Death_slaad#Ecology

cinder folio
dense pendant
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Hey guys. I'm running the Phandelver and Below campaign and come across the ancient elven nation Illefarn. However, I can't really find a clear answer what parts of the current (5e) map of Faerûn were part of this nation. Does anyone have a clear answer/source?

supple nest
dense pendant
supple nest
dense pendant
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Yeah if I'm correct it spanned from south of the River Mirar to River Delimbiyr (Luskan to Daggerford), West of the Dessarin River and River Surbrin?

supple nest
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Note that the forests were much larger at the time.

dense pendant
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https://i.imgur.com/nyokSNJ.jpeg
Ah I see, it edges towards the corner near Nesmé, the southern point of The Spine of the World.
I like to think the border was indeed geographical because of the mountain ranges and rivers.

supple nest
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I tend to agree. Aryvandaar was the one that was pushing to annex a lot of nations (and change the borders), specifically Miyeritar. The Illythiir didn't like that...and thus the Crown Wars

jagged apex
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which one? XD

supple nest
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All of them are Arycandaar's fault. Elven Court said so, which led to the 5th war, finally ending it 😉

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(a vast snarky oversimplification)

jagged apex
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drow get a lot of flack, but low key, the sun elves are the real worst of the elves

supple nest
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Well the Sun Elves did start it...but the proto Drow in Illythiir pulled out all the stops and used dragons and other means to burn down their foes forests...and summon demons etc.

dense pendant
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The drow were also wrong in annexing from the other side tho. However the drow curse is due to the ritual by the sun elves.

jagged apex
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drow are second worst at best/worst depending how you look at it in my opinion, and that is largely only do to the majority of the known ones for the longest time being the evil followers of lolth

jagged apex
supple nest
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Well...the Miyeritar were innocent dark elves, that were forced to decend with that same ritual.

jagged apex
supple nest
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Comes down to the elves are actually their own worst enemy.

jagged apex
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lol, talk about fighting fire with fire, nobody fights elves better than other elves

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except, maybe orcs

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😛

supple nest
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Which is why they now all have learned from it, and NEVER discuss the Crown War shame with non-elves. Ever.

jagged apex
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like seems big elf daddy drop the ball there that led to lolth eventually twisting a chunk of them into her own image

supple nest
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Not just the high magic...but the Seldarine's active involvement and Corelleon's blessing is strongly implied.

dense pendant
supple nest
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Well...there are more than one set of Drow; the largest group follow Lolth.

jagged apex
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well, the most well known

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from what i have heard more recent lore hints that she might not have as iron tight of a hold on the drow people as once thought, though i could be wrong

supple nest
jagged apex
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udadrow mostly making up the ones that follow lolth last i checked

supple nest
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Yep

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The other two are VERY rare...decendents of Miyeritar and other places I imagine.

jagged apex
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well less so rare to my understanding and more so just ones that managed to resist her influence and taint, living largely unknown until more recent years

dense pendant
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Yeah i meant the Aevendrow and Lorendrow, but also Drizzt.

jagged apex
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well drizzt is an udadrow, who is one of the few in a lolth dominated city that was able to escape the rather, let's face it, horrible life he was born into

supple nest
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Or were never exposed to her...I haven't read the source material so I don't know.

jagged apex
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most either fall to the nature of lolth's twisted system of a society or wind up murdered

dense pendant
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Hmm, so any of the drow (dark elves) are still in dispute with the sun elves, no matter if they are still Lollthtouched.

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Despite the no longer talking about the Crown Wars.

supple nest
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Well the Udadrow certainly as a general culture, hates the Sun/Moon/Wood elves. (ignoring individuals here)

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Lolth keeps it that way.

dense pendant
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Yeah, the other 2 are splinters probably the other elves don’t even know they exist. If they are seen, they would just be referred to as those pesky dark elves

jagged apex
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drow literally have a derogitory term for other elves, at least on toril

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they call the surface dwelling elves "fairy elves"

supple nest
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I assume not (again, haven't read the sourc Drizzt novels) But I certainly could imagine some bitterness. They could follow eilistraee, but I somehow see them rejecting both Seldarine and Dark Seldarine.

jagged apex
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at least from what i recall, there is a chance i could be misremembering things, though i am fairly sure i am remembering that correctly in saying they call surface dwelling elves "fairy elves"

jagged apex
supple nest
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Most "Fairy Elves" do hate the drow. They do come to the surface, and raid, take slaves and sacrifice folk. But in the current times, we are seeing lots of Underdark refugees...so is it changing the larger populace of elves? Sun and Wood I would say no probably. Moon elves might. All personal speculation.

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And isofar as the game is concerned; the DM's call.

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I suppose I could ask Ed in his Discord...or look for it there.

jagged apex
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and with the recent revelation that some dark elves/drow have avoided the evils of lolth and her pantheon as a whole, i could see people reasonably becoming more open minded to the idea of "not all drow are bad" as word of such discoveries spread

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on top of the growth of eilistraee's faith and the acknowledgement and support of it by the surface races over the years

supple nest
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The wiki stuff we linked, really dates to 1372. Its now 1492 ish. So I would argue that amoung elves in Silverymoon or in human locales like Waterdeep would be more open.

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But they aren't SO open that Jarlaxl can act openly;.

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Drizz is a notable exception...a nice one. Viconia de Diir...well, not so much.

dense pendant
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There is indeed a really big time gap about how refugee Drow are incorporated in above ground society. For me it would feel natural there is still a big group anti-drow, even if this isn't fair at all.

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I like 'fairy elves' tho, will use it in my campaign.

supple nest
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Well...its fair as broad strokes go. Lolth is still Lolth.

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Most Drow are members of that culture. So its based on "All drow are bad...except drizzt. He's cool."

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But we do have a lot of players wanting to play the underdark escapee/refugee. I have one I play with on Sundays. Helped him get his lore together.

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Well "Fairy Elves" in elvish is a slur. I always use Ar, Teu, or Sy when talking about other elves, when I play one of mine...or dhaerrow for drow.

jagged apex
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honestly, it would be less of a slur and more accurate in theory if used to describe an eladrin, but they may have another slang term for those extra fey elves, but if they do idk what it is

dense pendant
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Treehugger works for Wood Elves tho

supple nest
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the word "iblith" is likely used a lot with it.

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Ah..."darthiir"

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that's the correct word...probably used with iblith a lot still.

dense pendant
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“Colnbluth” for non-drow

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Although ‘darthiir’ would be more fitting against other elves

inner ibex
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Do elves have any hobbies?

crude blaze
grim siren
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And it would depend on the setting as well. Elves of Eberron and elves of Toril do different stuff

spark haven
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I'd be extremely alarmed if they didn't. Imagine living for centuries just sitting in a room staring at the wall.

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A cursed existence

inner ibex
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Truly

pine reef
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Is Abyss part of Ao's authority or is it outside of it

iron saffron
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Ao is only in charge of Realmspace, which is just one system in the Material Plane.
The Abyss is an Outer (Lower) Plane, waaay beyond his influence.

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Noone has control over the Abyss.

umbral vigil
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hey, how do goliaths compare to orcs?

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in terms of strength, intellect, etc

sharp owl
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They're two different speciies

pine reef
sharp owl
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Depending on setting, those settings will be more or less apparent due to how those peoples interact and mingle

modest badger
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Can entirely depend on the individual, but golaiths typically are 'stronger' in build, in that they're usually larger. This is reflected n their large build trait that allows them extra carry capacity in 5e

sharp owl
iron saffron
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Deities' divine influence span the multiverse, not limited to their home plane (domain).

iron saffron
umbral vigil
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oh, i meant in the lore

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i've never actually played DND before and don't knows its mechanics, so

modest badger
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In this case the mechanics are the lore.

iron saffron
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Perhaps you should read about the game mechanics first rather than about the lore. Lore doesn't give the numbers, game mechanics does.

umbral vigil
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i'm a bit confused

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there are general ballparks for races, right?

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elves are generally faster and live longer, dwarves are shorter and stronger, that kind of thing?

pine reef
modest badger
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5e is moving away from bioessentialism.
Most races now will not come with generalised stats, and many species printed earlier can now use the floating +2/+1 stat mechanics.

obsidian gate
modest badger
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It's more about an individual, their upbringing and so on. having different traits like different vision, or longevity, or so on are reflected in racial traits. For example Golaith have 'Powerful Build' which allows them a greater carry capacity for their size.

iron saffron
obsidian gate
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we still have powerful build as mentioned, on both orcs and goliaths

umbral vigil
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hmmmmm

modest badger
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Oh my bad, missed orcs had that too.

pine reef
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I read on it since then. 🙂

iron saffron
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When was this?

pine reef
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The Demonweb Pits, also known as Lolth's Web,[1][8] was originally the 66th layer of the Abyss.[9] By the end of the Silence of Lolth, Lolth had moved her domain in the Demonweb Pits to its own planar space.[10]

Philip Athans (August 2005). Annihilation. (Wizards of the Coast), p. 311. ISBN 0-7869-3752-1.

obsidian gate
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the demonweb pits are back in the abyss as of 5e

umbral vigil
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i'm still a bit confused

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so you can have a dwarf that's faster than an elf, and it wouldn't be shocking to anyone?

iron saffron
pine reef
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Oooh.

iron saffron
pine reef
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My bad.

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Odd that they'd include the fact that it was moved out of the Abyss in the top paragraph.

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When it was moved back again. 😄

iron saffron
# pine reef My bad.

4E changed a lot of lore 180 and 5E reverted most of it as if the 4E changes never happened.

obsidian gate
pine reef
umbral vigil
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hmmm

obsidian gate
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and since adventurer's are pretty exceptional people, its hard to tell what of their capabilities are schocking and why to commoners

iron saffron
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If you want to know the differences between the playable races ask in #dnd-newcomers since you never played D&D before.

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Taps channel's sign:

Discuss WotC-published game settings, and the events and characters that shaped them. Wherever possible, please indicate which setting you're discussing: [Forgotten Realms]/[FR], [Eberron], [Dragonlance], etc.

pine reef
iron saffron
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There are pantheons that have a general alignment leaning, such as the elves' Seldarine is CG-leaning so the elven gods reside on Arborea even though some of the elven gods aren't CG.

pine reef
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Understood, thanks.

jagged apex
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to my knowledge most gods hate the demon princes and vice versa, even those who were known to have their divine realms in the abyss in the past

iron saffron
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Demon princes are wannabe deities. Deites pay them no mind and their Blood War.

storm dagger
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Some gods also just make domains in Outer Planes that don’t match their alignment

iron saffron
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Yes, that's why i used the phrase "tend to"

Gods tend to have their divine domain in an Outer Plane that matches their alignment.

storm dagger
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Like Gruumsh and the Orc Pantheon in Acheron a law leaning plane, or the evil gods Ilsensine and Gzemnid who are in the neutral Outlands

crude blaze
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Annam is apparently in the Outlands as well

iron saffron
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Well, that goes back to the 1E when the orcs were LE but changed to CE in 3E.

storm dagger
near pine
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Hey, I need help with this for an upcoming campaign. Can Darklords leave their Domain of Dread?

iron saffron
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Yes.

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Lord Soth and Vecna has both escaped.

modest badger
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They're not meant to be able to, but they can forcibly escape. There tends to be consequences to this.

calm crest
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Generally speaking, however, they are imprisoned barring extremely unusual circumstances.

modest badger
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5e lore:

Beings of the Shadowfell called the Dark Powers created these domains as prisons for these "darklords," and through cruelty or carelessness trapped innocent mortals in these domains as well.
DMG p.51
And
These Darklords wield incredible power within their isolated domains, yet they're held captive in eternal torment as victims of malign forces known as the Dark Powers.
VRGtR p.4

Darklords Are Prisoners. Darklords cannot leave their domains. If a Darklord enters the Mists or uses another method to attempt an escape, the Dark Powers return them to their domain. Even death rarely allows a Darklord to escape their prison for long.
VRGtR p.9

They're definitely not meant to be able to leave.

jagged apex
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so at least historically there are only 2 proven methods to work, there are hints to a third one even in the 5e ravenloft books but that one is left up in the air deliberately

obsidian gate
crude blaze
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Yeah, they’re not supposed to be able to though. It’s why (at least in 5E) we don’t really know how they did it.

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In 5E, there’s actually even a garbage disposal domain designed to destroy “lost and failed domains” called Klorr

storm dagger
jagged apex
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unless you count potential non-existance as escaping

mystic sail
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What’s the lore with deathpact angels?

supple nest
iron saffron
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Ravnica is MtG

orchid ocean
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I can't remember where I heard this but are the demon lords God like creatures?

I feel like the awnser is no but they have portfolios like gods, but they can be killed so?

I'm trying to hand craft my own world

feral lintel
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They can be killed

iron saffron
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Demon lords are not deities.

feral lintel
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^

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They are just really powerful demons

orchid ocean
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Thanks. I figured but it never hurts to ask

supple nest
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in other editions some had deity status. But not currently.

iron saffron
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Some of the demon lords were briefly lesser gods in 2E Monsters of Mythology

orchid ocean
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Yeah I heard orcus was almost a God

supple nest
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And once Asmodeus was "only" an archdevil.

iron saffron
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Demon lords like Orcus and Demogorgon want to achieve godhood.

orchid ocean
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Gotcha.

iron saffron
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Well, Lolth was once a demon lord in 1E but was elevated to godhood as her lore expanded in 2E

orchid ocean
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I thought she was always a member of the elven pantheon then "fell" making the drow pantheon

iron saffron
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Each edition's lore add (or removes) stuff (I'm looking at you 4E!)

orchid ocean
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Lol
Thanks tho

feral lintel
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How did she end up as a demon lord anyway? did she just go to the Abyss and took over a layer?

iron saffron
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It was just in 1E she was a demon lord. It was only later her lore expanded with her backstory that she was once Correlon's wife.

feral lintel
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Ah ic, so she achieved godhood later on

supple nest
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She was banished there along with the other Dark Selderine by Corellon. per MoTF ("Parted ways")

iron saffron
supple nest
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Specifically as a "Demon Lord" So you can argue she ascended post that.

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"Lolth and Corellon parted ways, Lolth to become a demon lord in the Abyss and Corellon to become the de facto leader of a pantheon that could no longer be trusted."

iron saffron
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She was alway a goddes. The later edition lore jsut retconned that she was a goddes who was banished.

feral lintel
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Ah ic ic

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But she was already established to be in the Abyss is what you're saying?

supple nest
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until 4e, when the demonweb was moved out, and 5e it moved back in.

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Part of the problem here is the retconning makes this all confusing.

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In the end...she's a goddess now, and currently in the Abyss this week.

iron saffron
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Shh... we don't talk about 4E lore around here... 😉

supple nest
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I try not to...but...wiki pages...(sigh)

iron saffron
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Most of the 4E lore changes was retconned in 5E

supple nest
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trying to reconcile the holes so there appears to be a reasonable cohesive story is important to me...but its nearly a hopeless cause if you care to align with published stuff.

iron saffron
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Well, each edition wants to put its own stamp on D&D lore over the past 50 years. It's no different then trying to comprehend what has happened over the decades with DC Comics' canon, with each of their reboots making a bigger mess than fixing it.

supple nest
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lets not bring up the comic universes....that makes D&D lore simple.

feral lintel
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Ofc it does lol

supple nest
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But the overall goal of WoTC was that you didn't HAVE to go back into the lore for every edition. You just use the lore as written and go forward. But that doesn't help nuts like me who like continuity, and like going back to old lore (like Crown Wars).

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Besides...if I want accurate lore opinions I'd ask Ed Greenwood in his discord for FR, and Keith Baker in his for Eberron. Otherwise, I'll fix it for my players as I go.

iron saffron
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With 5E WotC has moved away from establishing much lore.

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Because of that I go back to my older edition books for reference.

supple nest
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Same...because a lot of it was really really good reference material.

iron saffron
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Except for my 4E FR book...

supple nest
#

It is what you make of it. A lot of 4e had bad ideas that you just have to ignore. Like driders suddenly becoming Blessed of Lolth.

jagged apex
#

honestly, i could see it kind of making some sense, given how we saw some giants in bigby's "blessed" by demon lords, and lolth is still technically a demon lord in addition to a goddess, though to my knowledge the only thing that makes that strange is to my knowledge in most editions it is a form of punishment or curse from lolth, but i guess that is what happens when 4e does it's thing of not really checking the lore of past editions, surprised they remember as many of the deties and characters from the past that they did

sharp owl
# mystic sail What’s the lore with deathpact angels?

They're boros angels that have been corrupted or otherwise influenced by the Orzhov Syndicate. Sometimes it's because they become disenfranchised with the Boros Legion, other times it's because they'll end up in debt to the Syndicate somehow, or sometimes it's just because they end up leaning more on the authoritarian aspect of their white mana

mystic sail
sharp owl
#

One way to help understand Ravnica lore is understanding the foundation in mana. In the MtG card game that the setting is based on, all Ravnican guilds are aligned with two of the five colours of magic; White, Blue, Black, Red, Green. For example Boros Legion is White/Red.
Each colour represents a mix of positive, neutral, and negative traits. Some of these traits are:

  • White: Law, loyalty, discipline, tyranny, oppression, authoritarianism
  • Blue: Knowledge, discovery, secrets, subterfuge, control, manipulation
  • Black: Determination, autonomy, drive, selfishness, cruelty
  • Red: Passion, love, freedom, destruction, anarchy, chaos
  • Green: Growth, rebirth, life, death, decay
    The colours are arranged in a wheel: White > Blue > Black > Red > Green > back to White. This wheel expresses two core concepts of each colour; it's allies (the two colours adjacent to it) and it's enemies (the two colours opposite it)
    For example, Red is allied with green and black, but enemies with white and blue

This applies to Ravnica because it lets you understand how the guilds relate; Boros Legion is a military organisation aligned with white and red mana. This gives you not only an idea of their disposition (passionate yet disciplined, orderly yet aggressive), but also how they interact with the other guilds. For example, they share white mana alignment with the Orhzov Syndicate (white/black), the Azorius Senate (white/blue), and the Selesnya Conclave (white/green). They share their red mana alignment with the Cult of Rakdos (black/red), Izzet League (blue/red), and Gruul Clans (red/green). This allows you to understand that a Boros Legion individual would likely have some relation or in-road with one of those guilds in some capacity

However, the Boros Legion shares no colour alignment with the Simic Combine (blue/green), Golgari Swarm (black/green), or House Dimir (blue/black)

manic moat
#

Are there any cursed musical instruments in the forgotten realms lore?

jagged apex
#

otherwise, none that i could find or am otherwise aware of

manic moat
#

Thanks for the help

clear pine
#

Do the purple dragon knights follow a complete different hierarchy than the Purple Dragons?

#

are they imediately above all purple dragons by being a PDK?

feral lintel
#

Uh no

jagged apex
clear pine
#

i mean both don't say exactly which ranks do you need to be to be eligible to be a pdk, it just say they are the most distinctive but that's super vague. Where exactly do the pdks find themselves in the hierarchy?

feral lintel
#

I think that depends on the story

#

they can be a PDK and also not one too (which in that case, they are usually called Bannerets)

clear pine
#

i'm not talking about the subclass but the title, it's not for a player but for an NPC

feral lintel
#

Ok, perhaps clarify for me a bit

jagged apex
#

given the description on the wiki, it saying they are among the most premier of the organization likely means one of these 2 definitions when it says that
"first in importance, order, or position; leading" or "of earliest creation"

#

so it could mean that they are the sort of faces of the orginization or were the foundation that the rest of it was later built apon

clear pine
#

for sure it doesn't mean being the first

jagged apex
#

only thing that would be safe to say about them is that in relation to one another and especially the people of Cormyr, they are VERY important

#

but important does not = rank or status necessarily

#

like assaulting a purple dragon knight in cormyr would be akin to in our world assaulting someone that people consider to be a national treasure, and you'd be getting your ass beat

#

by the people likely, not the knight

clear pine
#

well going by a comparison between the US army and the ranks of the purple dragons

#

it is stated that they are officers

#

so it is safe to assume that they are Swordcaptains/lieutenants at least

#

or at the very least a first sword/sergeant major

#

i am not well aquinted with the US military

#

so does that sounds correct?

jagged apex
#

sounds about right, the bulk of their importance i feel is likely as part of the kingdom's culture, given how they got that name associating them with "purple dragons" which funnily did involve a dragon, but not one that we would otherwise note as a purple or deep dragon, but rather a very elderly black dragon who's coloration had taken on a more purple esc coloration

#

which is just funny to me, that the place known as the land of purple dragons and has an orginization named after them, had no involvement of actual purple dragons XD

clear pine
#

it is indeed funny

#

the title of knight sounds one more related to nobility rather than of military

#

so probably a pdk can be someone with a low rank

#

but probably as soon as they became a pdk they might be promoted to a leadership rank or become an errant knight

#

it is probably in the best interests of the crown that their most loyal knights to be away from unecessary danger in military operations

grave blade
supple nest
#

The latter. It's a blessing only in 4e.

#

The drizzt novels only call it a curse..I don't think they retconned it. So...fans get confused

jagged apex
#

again, probably cuz the writers of 4e did not check past editions or it's lore, like with how they introduced far realm infected stars

modest badger
#

No, they checked the lore, they just intentionally changed parts of it in cases like this.

jagged apex
#

well that just makes it all the more baffeling

modest badger
#

I'm trying to track down some of the behind the scenes notes, but if I recall it was basically 'But lolth is like a big drider and she likes spiders, so why would being a drider be a curse to drow?'

jagged apex
#

you don't gotta like spiders to have power over it, and she got that power from another being and was not originally drider like, so seems like they misunderstood her character regardless

modest badger
#

Well the weird thing with lore there is 'which edition are you staying more true to?'
1e Lolth absolutely was just a demon queen of spiders. Nothing to do with corellon or elves.
2e core she was still a spider demon, but 2e Forgotten Realms made her into a fallen elven goddess.
Then 3e mostly stuck with the FR version.

supple nest
#

1e lolth started in Greyhawk. But 2e monster mythology (1992) she's upgraded there to a deity probably to match FR introduced officially in 1987

modern bolt
#

(Reposting this because I originally put it in the wrong chat) but when it comes to curses in general DND lore,

I had the idea for an interesting character concept but I’m not going to continue with it unless I know if the concept is aplicable to most fantasy dnd

The concept was (insert race/class here) with a curse similar to lycanthropy as punishment for a heinous act. Are curses that change one’s appearance something that’s been touched down on before?

supple nest
jagged apex
#

the 5e ravenloft book has a section on curses

modest badger
#

It also appears that in 4 FR lore, driders are still generally percieved as a curse:

House Melarn makes use of driders to an extent unmatched by any other house in Menzoberranzan. The Melarni believe that the d rider form is not a curse but a blessing that reflects the new shape of the Spider Queen. After all, the Lady Penitent had the form of an immensely powerful demonic d rider. In the past, the priestesses sent the driders to the pits below the city, using tales of the creatures to terrify the drow into obedience. Now, the d riders can be seen openly, climbing over the crystalline webs that support the Melarn compound. The sight disturbs many of the more traditional houses of Menzoberranzan, giving them one more reason to hate House Melarn.
Mezoberranzan- City of Intrigue, 4e, 2012, p.50

modern bolt
jagged apex
#

ah, so was a specific house's view that was a blessing

modest badger
#

At least in FR 4e.

supple nest
#

Ugh....the continuity headache.

modest badger
#

In generic MM lore, those who pass the test of Lolth become driders (in all other editions, those who fail become driders)

jagged apex
jagged apex
pine reef
#

Where can I find detailed info on the Far Realm lore?

supple nest
supple nest
iron saffron
#

Yes Lolth was a lesser goddess in 1E Deities & Demigods with a whopping 66 hp!

pine reef
iron saffron
#

That's the appeal of it is that it's a mysteries place with little information on it

supple nest
jagged apex
#

literally is so chaotic by our reality's standards, even gods that so much as glance at it can go mad

#

supposidly is what happened with tharzidun

supple nest
#

Literally, review early copies of Dr. Strange and you are good to make it up as you for the Far Realm. It doesn't need to make sense, have a purpose or anything of the sort. HP Lovecraft maddess at its finest.

jagged apex
#

yeah, the closest thing you will get to canon information is that certain beings from there existing there, somewhere, the vast majority is constantly changing literally

#

is kind of why if you wind up in the far realm you basically get transformed into some horrific monstrosity, one stray thought, and bam!, your hand isn't a hand anymore and what ever the hell it is it is freaking you the heck out

pine reef
#

they said they consumed their reality.

jagged apex
#

sort of

supple nest
jagged apex
#

they traveled through it as basically psionic energy with the crystal of pure evil or what ever it was called, but they are freaky and alien enough to where one could mistake them as being from there

#

like presumably they looked different from what we know of them, since they had basically disembodied themselves via the way they traveled from their reality

pine reef
#

shard of pure evil, yeah. they sent it into our reality, corrupting the mad god, created the abyss, etc.

#

so if those things were so bad whatevers in the far realm is far worse

jagged apex
#

basically they were pure psionic energy, until they infected tharzidun's mind and they eventually manipulated him to give themselves new bodies, only the strongest of them survived, the rest basically just became that left over energy that kind of if i remember correctly went on to infused the abyss

pine reef
#

would magic even work in far realm? divine or arcane?

jagged apex
#

they likely could endure the far realm to a degree before falling victim to it be it mentally or physically, given that the abyss especially in those deeper levels or older editions it is sort of discount far realm or pseudo far realm

pine reef
#

or unless ur psionic ur out of luck

jagged apex
#

basically the abyss is the closest to the far realm outside of the far realm itself

jagged apex
#

like concentration spells would definitely be off the table cuz you already would have to be constantly concentrating to keep both your body and mind from being twisted by the far realm, one stray thought, no matter how minor or for how brief, you more or less wind up something like this https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/forgottenrealms/images/f/fc/Kaorti_3e.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20200305234051 or this https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/forgottenrealms/images/1/1f/Uvuudaum-3e.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20190129235915

#

or literally any possible number of equally if not more horrific otherworldly twisted forms

#

and technically according to the wiki at least the far realm has wild magic as a magical trait, so that would imply magic does work, but definitely not the way the caster is probably intending it to

supple nest
pine reef
#

Thank you, that's really helpful.

jagged apex
#

lol, far realm is more like if limbo went insane

#

cuz it makes limbo seem normal, the literal plane of chaos seems normal by comparison

supple nest
#

Well in Limbo, an intelligent mind can form it to be "normal" like the Githzerai do. I'm pretty sure you can't do that in Far Realm...just not smart enough to undo that mess.

jagged apex
#

but basically all magic in the far realm in 5e likely would be psionic since your mind, subconcious and concious are so dominate that is why your stray thoughts can basically mess you up

jagged apex
#

probably why the obriyth basically turned themselves into energy and sent it in the shard of evil through the far realm, something about the crystal at least keep their energies some what protected

#

assuming i am even remembering that process correctly, they may not have actually put themselves in the crystal, but i am pretty sure they at least still had turned themselves into pure psionic energy in the process

jagged apex
#

is like unhinged chaos if we are gunna compare it to limbo

#

like limbo is pure chaos, no taint of any sort, the far realm is basically chaos + madness

#

other lore youtubers have also done videos on it and AJ and others have done videos covering various creatures from the far realm which obviously talks at least a little bit about the far realm itself

jagged apex
#

at least not without naming every possible variation of cosmic horror possible in detail

#

like realistically, if a god or god like being can go mad just by looking at it, yeah, you ain't gunna be able to process it, like at all, just next second you suddenly in sane and or in horrific pain or a form that looks horrific and probably painful to any mortal

#

like honestly, comparing it to limbo at all is basically short hand and not even that accurate when you get down to it

#

like just imagine the most horrific, otherworldly, and alien thing you can, and it is much worse than that, infinitely

supple nest
#

A dalkyr's fanfic of Twilight?

jagged apex
#

do i have to repeat myself?

#

we are talking about a literal realm of madness more or less

supple nest
#

Yeah...Xoriat will give the far realm a run for your money. The dalkyr actively are interested in us where the Far Realm reads like a horrible accident caused by idiots on the prime. Actively malevolent vs passive.

jagged apex
#

to the far realm and it's natives, our reality is the horrible accident

supple nest
#

I agree. The dalkyr want to 'fix' us. Far Realm hasn't yet cared to do so.

jagged apex
#

literally part of why some great old one warlocks can just take power from a patron is cuz we are so small in scale to them that we are less than insignificant

#

our reality is like just a dust bunny that is largely not noticed

supple nest
#

Yep. The premise of the Dalkyr is "but what if they did?" Both have interesting narratives for players. 🙂

spice sorrel
#

I have a player with the Outlander background. She's a human rogue. The way she described it was a nomadic tribe that would steal from cities (sneaking in to steal what they need, not violent pillaging) and move on. It's Ravenloft, so I'm playing with the idea that she has Vistani blood but doesn't realize it (since that seems like the kind of thing they might do). The origin world is technically Forgotten Realms, which I've been using as a resource to help flesh out backstories, but is otherwise irrelevant. I'd like to develop more about her tribe, but I'm having trouble finding stuff. (There is no simple list of "outlander tribes" that I could find and the list of Forgotten Realms tribes at https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Category:Tribes is a little overwhelming and mostly irrelevant.) Any help would be appreciated.

sharp owl
#

Mainly because rather than just asking about the lore, you're asking how to ground a specific character/background in the lore

solid mica
#

how are bags of holding created?

#

kind of a broad question, but i thought id ask out of curiosity for world building

sharp owl
jagged apex
# solid mica how are bags of holding created?

from what i could find, at least in the forgotten realms on the wiki it has not details on how they are created, just that they have been known to the realms for a long time since they were first brought over by the kender of krynn, presumably it is something similar to how an artificer makes one with it's infusions since in 5e at least you can make one if you are an artificer of sufficient level and known the infusion, so to my knowledge that is one of those elements of dnd that is left intentionally vague and unexplained

#

but would suggest asking and talking about it in #dm-world-building if you wanna theroize and what not for any world building you are looking to do

buoyant sage
#

in lore does anything happen if a vampire spawn bites someone and kills them

#

does it make an undead of some kind or no

iron saffron
#

No.

jagged apex
#

only thing that happens is they die, nothing else, this is even reflected in the mechanics, at least in 5e

#

as they don't have the line of text the vampire lord has about how they can rise as a vampire spawn

tardy wasp
#

What kinds of elves and half-elves might be most drawn to the service of Sehanine Moonbow, whether in terms of subraces or social/vocational backgrounds?

jagged apex
#

if any specific, moon elves would be top of the list, since historically they are her people, having "moon elves" in her portfolio

tardy wasp
#

Also, does Eilistraee have presence outside of Toril’s cosmos, like the other dark elf deities, or is she a one-world-wonder? She’s listed in both On Hallowed Ground and in Tome of Foes, which are multiversal in approach, but I haven’t found a straight answer.

jagged apex
#

to my knowledge she is really only involved in one setting, but where ever the other elven gods are she likely is also able to be as she is the daughter of corellon and lolth

iron saffron
#

She's not limited to the FR pantheon.

jagged apex
#

yeah she is at least implied to exist on other worlds potentially, just not really aware of any we know for sure by name

#

but to my knowledge all her significant story lines and events happen to be if on any given world, be on toril or otherwise in the outer planes

iron saffron
#

Ed Greenwood did create her though to balance out her mother Lolth.

#

By the end of 2E and with 3E FR because the "default" official campaign setting so we didn't get much updated to Greyhawk (I was never into Greyhawk so I didn't follow the Living Greyhawk stuff).

jagged apex
#

but yeah, far as i am aware ther is nothing imply or limiting her to being specific to any one setting, as she was there when lolth was banishes and exiled, being that they were in the outer planes which are shared in published material across settings outside of selfcontained cosmologies

#

so at least from that edition where that origin story for lolth and her relationship with the elven gods was established onwards Eilistraee at the very least would be plausible to be a multispherical power

iron saffron
#

Greyhawk does have an Underdark (kinda...) but not in detail as FR's

jagged apex
#

multispherical being the term used for such deities and god like entities in older editions since until 5e most were still going off 2e spelljammer for the details on the way the wider parts of the material plane and settings were structured

#

and with the way they are still sort of softly still there potentially, no reason to bother making up a new term as it still serves the purpose well enough

eternal quarry
#

What would happen if a demilich phylactery remains intact but the soul gems were scattered/destroyed?
Would it lose power?

jagged apex
#

to my knowledge would more so just be unable to replenish itself, ie basically not able to feed itself more souls to maintain it's sanity

#

at the very least would prevent it from being able to kill someone and capture their soul to feed to their phylactry until they could be replaced/gathered

#

like probably could still kill them, but the soul would i imagine likely pass on to the afterlife as normal

iron saffron
#

Lore is history.

jagged apex
#

eh, to my knowledge the mechanics don't really address the gems much

iron saffron
#

Gameplay mechanic:

As long as its phylactery is intact, the demilich can’t be permanently destroyed. Its skull reforms after 1d10 days, restoring the creature to its wretched state. If it has the presence of mind to do so, a demilich can reclaim its former power by feeding just one soul to its phylactery. Doing so restores the demilich to lich form, reconstituting its undead body.

If the demilich drops to 0 hit points, it is destroyed and turns to powder, leaving behind its gems. Crushing a gem releases any soul trapped within, at which point the target’s body re-forms in an unoccupied space nearest to the gem and in the same state as when it was trapped.

jagged apex
#

it is addressed in the lore, not the mechanics nessissarrily and seems to be ment for the variant but lore wise mentions this "Liches who follow Acererak’s path believe that by becoming free of their bodies, they can continue their quest for power beyond the mortal world. As their patron did, they secure their remains within well-guarded vaults, using soul gems to maintain their phylacteries and destroy the adventurers who disturb their lairs." from the 5e monster manual in the box thing along it's statblock that is titled "ACERERAK AND HIS DISCIPLES"

iron saffron
#

Has nothing to do with lore.

jagged apex
#

so seems not even all demiliches have them

#

at least in the 5e continuity

iron saffron
#

I believe that Acererak was the first demi-lich introduced in D&D with ToH.

jagged apex
#

but if you had been meaning you wanted to know mechanically, that otherwise would indeed be more a #dnd-discussion or #dm-discussion thing, cuz mechanically is a variant, lore wise just would mean no auto maintenance/defense system of sorts, if anything

#

is still just as deadly more or less

eternal quarry
#

Yeah, I asked not bc I'm in a game, but bc I'm trying to do a character backstory

#

Sorry if I accidentally broke a rule

iron saffron
#

There's no rule broken. We're just trying to guide you to the proper channel.

eternal quarry
#

Thanks

#

I appreciate the help

eager bay
#

How do cold-blooded species evolve to survive cold climates

pine reef
eager bay
#

Like irl polar dinosaurs

pine reef
#

u should ask in world building.

iron saffron
#

Which setting?

eager bay
eager bay
#

I'm just seeing if it's been done officially before

iron saffron
#

No, you have to be specific. Besides, evolution isn't really a thing in D&D where gods create species with their will.

#

If you want feathered dinosaurs in your setting then you can add feathered dinosaurs in your setting. That would be #dm-world-building

eager bay
iron saffron
#

Remember that D&D has been around before the real world scientific evidence that dinosaurs had feathers (pre-Jurassic Park movie)

#

There is no "evidence" in D&D lore. There's just lore. Again, D&D has been around before real world evidence of feathered dinosaurs. If you wanted illustrated depictions of dinosaurs then look at the 5E Monster Manual, which AFAIK depicts them as non-feathered.

eager bay
iron saffron
#

That's the name of the T-Rex. I don't see an illustration of it having feathers or its statblock mentioning feathers. That said, there's nothing stopping you from having feathered dinosaurs living in arctic climate.

mortal panther
#

art of the King of Feathers does have feathers

iron saffron
#

King of Feathers is also a Monstrousity and not a Beast, so not the typical T-Rex.

iron saffron
jagged apex
eager bay
jagged apex
eager bay
#

Mordenkanen

iron saffron
#

Regardless, my comment still stands. As the DM you can make dinosaurs feathered and warm-blooded with the ability to live in colder climates.

eager bay
#

Are there canon limitations on hybridization?

iron saffron
#

Hybridization as in half-illithid / half-minotaur? That's up to the Monster Manuals of the various editions to make up new creatures.

#

[magic.gif]

eager bay
spark haven
#

The problem is that this question effectively boils down to "How are babies made?" which is a topic that Wizards isn't super interested in spending money on

crude blaze
#

Depends on the setting. Like I know Forgotten Realms says elves and orcs can’t reproduce with one another

spark haven
#

Especially not lately

crude blaze
#

Yeah, it’s definitely an “ask your DM” situation

spark haven
#

It's not a question that's categorically irrelevant or inappropriate, but it's niche enough that it's not really worth putting in any handbooks.

iron saffron
#

Not a lore question/answer but use Custom Lineage.

eager bay
#

Question. Do tabaxi get to not be affected by extreme cold if they're like a mountain lion or snow leopard?

iron saffron
#

There are no mountain lion/snow leopard sub-races of tabaxi. Use their game statistics.

eager bay
iron saffron
#

FR tabaxis were originally from Maztica and immigrated to Chult.

iron saffron
#

Ask your DM if they want to change the game mechanics if there are mountain tabaxi. That's not a lore question.

unkempt merlin
iron saffron
#

And just because you live in a cold climate doesn't mean you naturally have cold resistance. Many creatures, including humans, who live cold climate don't have cold resistance in their statblock.

jagged apex
#

icewind dale is a perfect example, plenty of humans just as cold as anyone else would be, despite living there

eager bay
static nebula
#

da snow dwella

eager bay
#

And apparently I lack functional eyes

#

As I just re-read the goddamn rules for extreme cold

#

And a barbarian failing a DC 10 con check is not super likely

static nebula
#

now sorry for like, jumping in and interrupting shad, but how exactly does a philactery work in lore? like is it just a container for souls or something? always confused me a little.

eager bay
static nebula
#

like mechanically its a respawn for the thing you gank that is bound to it, but I mean as ina lore perspective

eager bay
#

Like horcruxes from harry potter

#

Except the philactery needs to be of a bit more complex design then any old object

#

but even then, those rules have been broken

eager bay
ionic rivet
#

Okay folks - this channel is about D&D lore, not about how to change your character mechanics.

static nebula
#

oh im not doing that

eager bay
#

I thought that was kind of evident from the messages

static nebula
#

eh, it could have not been

eager bay
ionic rivet
#

I came in on the tabaxi bit - and thus my comment now

eager bay
#

anyways, alhoons have a different version

ionic rivet
#

But carry on with phylactery lore

eager bay
#

Which rather then bringing them back, stores their souls when they die

static nebula
#

Always thought it was Philactery

eager bay
#

and if it ever gets broken, all the souls trapped inside it die forever

#

Including the ones the alhoons sacrificed

#

but it also gives any creature holding it the ability to talk to the souls inside

static nebula
#

Huh

#

so the alhoon thing is moreso just a storage container for the soul

eager bay
static nebula
#

nice

eager bay
#

also, this is my first time answering a lore question rather then asking. feels good to be helpful.

static nebula
#

so a lich would have to go out and get more souls is my guess

eager bay
static nebula
#

nice

eager bay
# static nebula nice

with alhoons specifically, they gain the remaining lifespan of what they sacrifice

#

whereas with liches it appears there's like a rate of deterioration rather then a transfering of years

#

personally, I find eldritch liches to be more meaningful, as they're insane and accepted a parasite from the far realm for immortality

iron saffron
#

Why wouldn't it be free?

#

https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Djinni#Personality

While no genie liked being enslaved, djinn were the most tolerant of temporary servitude to mortals. They were forgiving of a mortal master's flaws or even amused by them. They viewed short-term servitude as determined by Fate, and knew that no one could defy one's fate. However, long-term service upset them, and being imprisoned was considered anathema. They would not forgive betrayal. Those who wished to gain the brief service of a djinn should gift them with fine meals, gemstones, magical items, flattery, and other forms of bribery

#

And my question wasn't asking for a specific reason but as to why wouldn't it they be free. They're not an enslaved as a whole.

jagged apex
#

depends what kind

iron saffron
#

Read the links above. Most genies live in their respective elemental planes. They're not enslaved as a whole (hence my question of "Why would they not be free?")

jagged apex
#

some but not all things from a their mythological source material is and otherwise is not part of the dnd version

iron saffron
#

Yes, some of the D&D magic items have bounded genies but that doesn't represent all genies.

jagged apex
#

this is partially why they are associated with the elemental energies of the elemental planes and various types

#

heck if you were to treat one genie the same as you would another, you'd be offending them massively

#

especially if that genie happens to be of the opposing element

#

well not all genies are the kind one would be after, only nobel genies are the kind that can grant wishes

iron saffron
jagged apex
#

and again, read the lore, their personalities are basically them as they are bound or not

#

especially not bound

#

i'd honestly read what is in the game already, as that in it of itself can present some ideas to tie into

iron saffron
jagged apex
#

depends, if he is like the ones that took over part of toril, forget which country, they may try to conquer the world or as much as they can

#

remember, while creatures do have personality norms, invididuals can deviate just like any other intelligent being such as you or eye

iron saffron
#

You as the DM can make the NPC be whatever you want them to be.

jagged apex
#

ones of the near universal things as i recall is that they all claim themselves to be nobility, so likely they will more often than not view themselves as superior to any humanoid mortal

iron saffron
#

As elementals they see themselves above Material Plane mortals.

jagged apex
#

granted i could be wrong with that, but i know is definitely the case with the myrid aka the water genies

#

and view things in relation to their elements usually as elemental life is fundimentally different than mortal life

iron saffron
#

#dm-discussion is to help you flesh out your adventure. This isn't the channel for it. We can point you to the lore but not help you about your adventure in this channel.

#

I'm both a D&D lore nerd and a forever DM but I'm also very OCD so I don't like crossing the streams. 😛

jagged apex
#

yeah, whole setting even

#

is where their activities on the prime are mostly detailed

iron saffron
jagged apex
#

based off the middle east at the time, cultural sensitivity being reasons that it and other older such settings they are hesistant to revisit as they largely were somewhat rooted in stereotypes, cuz cultural sensitivity and that was not what it is today

#

so when reading those, do brace yourself for stuff like that which you likely would not see in a modern adaptation

iron saffron
#

I never played Al-Qadim but knew of it. I do like that there were non-European-centric regions of Toril outside of Faerun.

jagged apex
#

same

#

is just neat to see worlds fleshed out and diverse as much as our own roughly

iron saffron
#

Right now my players are around the Chultan peninsula. First in Tashluta and now in Halruaa. They'll later go sail around Chult, stopping in Port Nyanzaru.

I just wanted to be away from the European-centric Sword Coast that's been dominate in 5E.

jagged apex
#

well easiest one to find in the underdark would be a dao

#

aka earth genies

iron saffron
#

D&D is full of magic and creatures from the multiverse. "Something something magic" is pretty much the only explanation you need to explain why a genie is there.

jagged apex
#

as where similarties are strongest, elemental planes can overlap with portals to them back and forth and and the underdark is already very similar to the elemental plane of earth https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Dao

#

they also kind of touch on similar things called nodes in the 5e adventure "PRINCES OF THE APOCALYPSE"

#

so if you have that adventure, that could prove useful too as reference material

gilded lava
#

what blue curtain does the spell Dream of the Blue Veil reference? is there some canon lore about the separation between settings and how it's different from travelling by Astral Sea or Gate or Plane Shift?

iron saffron
iron saffron
jagged apex
#

the spell is likely going with the turquoise color that is associated with the prime material plane with the ethereal curtain

gilded lava
#

thanks!

jagged apex
#

as turqoise is kind of blue

iron saffron
#

Think of lore is about history.

We talk about the history and not about game mechanics. If you want help with the game mechanics or how to create your homebrew world then you ask in #dm-discussion and #dm-world-building , respectively.

If you have a lore question then ask here.

#

Realm?

jagged apex
#

a plane is like a dimension, all part of the same cosmos

iron saffron
#

Toril (the Forgotten Realms) is a planet in the Material Plane.
Oearth (Greyhawk) is a planet in the same Material Plane.
Krynn (Dragonlance) is a planet in the same Material Plane.

jagged apex
#

eh, not entirely

#

as the outerplanes are very methaphyiscal

#

each setting can have any number of planets really

iron saffron
#

Think of the Outer Planes as the "afterlife" where Material Plane mortals' souls go after they die.

#

Realmspace has nine planets I believe...

#

This is where we move into the Spelljammer campaign setting, which can span other campaign settings via spelljamming ships.

#

Spelljammer is the name of a city-sized manta ray-shaped spelljammer ship.

jagged apex
iron saffron
#

Spelljammer is the name of the type of ship that travels through space (I refuse to say Astral Sea).

jagged apex
#

and spelljammers are named after it as they function similarly

iron saffron
#

I refuse to accept the crappy 5E Spelljammer changes. I'm sticking to my 2E Spelljammer boxed set.

jagged apex
#

canonically in 5e astral plane and astral sea are largely just interchangable terms

#

nobody is asking you to deviate from an edition dude, relax

iron saffron
#

Don't get me started on spelljammers using the Astral Sea to travel...

jagged apex
#

it is what is in published materials for the current edition, unless a dm changes it for their games, is not gunna hurt you for alter your games outside of your control

#

spelljammer is not a setting

iron saffron
#

Canon is what you make of it at your table.

jagged apex
#

at least not in a traditional sense

#

well that has nothing to do with the lore, like at all

iron saffron
#

Is your campaign a homebrew setting or an official one like Forgotten Realms?

#

If it's the former then you're not bound by lore. Hell, even with the official one you're not bound by it.

jagged apex
#

from what i saw him say it is homebrew

iron saffron
#

Then don't worry about official lore.

jagged apex
#

but my guess is much like me he likes rooting his stuff within the confines of the lore to at least make it slide in as seemlessly into the dnd multiverse

iron saffron
#

You write the lore of your campaign setting.

#

Even official settings like Eberron and Dark Sun ignored the "prime" D&D lore stuff...

jagged apex
#

only worry about what it says in published materials if that is what you are wanting to stick to

#

eberron, easily cuz, self contained cosmology

iron saffron
#

The crystal sphere of Athasspace (Dark Sun) was cut off from the rest of the Material Plane, so no deities or spelljammers.

jagged apex
#

well to my knowledge is just cut off from the ethereal plane

#

that other stuff you mentioned about it, never heard anyone mention such a thing

iron saffron
#

I never got into Eberron so I don't know much about its lore.

jagged apex
#

especially since the gods left do to actions on that world's main planet to my knowledge

#

well in dnd Djinn is a specific kind of genie, just a reminder, would be worth considering if you are gunna leave that be or change it for your setting

iron saffron
#

Genie is a grouping of elemental beings. It's like humans, gorillas, and chimps are great apes.

jagged apex
#

though will say, being beings of elemental air, being trapped in a cave, especially in the underdark, would be pretty scary for a djinn

iron saffron
#

Djinni are genies from the plane of air.
Dao are genies from the plane of earth.
Efreeti are genies from the plane of fire.
Marid are genies from the plane of water.

foggy seal
#

There's demon lords and archdevils. Is there a yugoloth equivalent to those?

supple nest
# foggy seal There's demon lords and archdevils. Is there a yugoloth equivalent to those?

Lorewise from https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Yugoloth

Yugoloth Lords
Altraloth: Made from yugoloths of any type, altraloths were fiends who, either for their needs or those of the witches, entered a deal with night hags that would enhance them, some using their newfound powers to master over other yugoloths and others doing as they pleased independent of their kin.[15]
Baernoloth: Sometimes classified as greater yugoloths,[12] baernoloths were supposedly the primal champions of evil who created the yugoloths, although in recent times they scoffed at their schemes and had little to do with their society besides allegedly giving advice to certain ultroloths.[9][23]
Oinoloth: Despite being the ruler of Khin-Oin and nominal leader of the yugoloth race, responsible for uniting the fractured cultural elements of their society, the Oinoloth spent most of their time simply playing factions off each other trying to prevent them from turning on him

#

BUT in 5e, the oinoloth is now a type of Yugoloth, and I don't then we have any unique named ones (still poking the database to be sure)

serene goblet
#

Probably super dumb question but is Elminster trans or did they just change his gender with one of the editions? On the forgotten realms wiki it says Male (Formerly: Female) so I just thought it was a funny thought

unkempt merlin
supple nest
unkempt merlin
supple nest
#

But...". The General of Gehenna. Somewhere in the brimstone wastes of Gehenna, there roams an ultroloth so strong that none contests his power" Its a Ultraloth varient

serene goblet
supple nest
#

But Shemeshka has a different block than Arcanaloths

foggy seal
#

Lorewise, are devils the most powerful fiends individually, then Yugoloths? I assume demons would be at the bottom of individual power seeing as there's an infinite number of them, but why would devils bother hiring Yugoloths if they were weak?

unkempt merlin
#

they aren't weak, and devils aren't inherently the most powerful on an individual level. there are many weak devils

#

devils hire yugoloths because devils are finite (technically) while (as you said) demons are infinite, so devils want more numbers

supple nest
#

The first Yugoloth is a Malaxxix at CR 18

#

But there are more Yugoloths than Baatorian (devils)...but they are hired by both sides.

#

Whooops...THAT's an individual.

#

Baernaloths at CR17...as a group of loths

soft silo
#

I've got a question that is equal parts niche, pedantic, absurd and a little bit dweebish;

In forgotten realms' elvish language, is -ei pronounced "ay" as in day or "eye" as in sky

#

In english it can go either way but english is somewhat unique in its lack of phonetic consistency

jagged apex
#

best way i can guess is to look at the way Eilistraee's name is pronounced

#

in which cases seems to be as "eye"

#

otherwise since is realms specific, could always ask ed greenwood

supple nest
#

Per https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eilistraee her name is pronounced: "Eilistraee's name is pronounced as EEL-iss-TRAY-yee",[1] "eel-ISS-tray-ee",[2] "eel-iss-tray-yee"[3] or "eil-iss-tray-yee".[4]" so pick

pine reef
#

How large is an Abyssal layer city? What sort of population would it have?

iron saffron
#

Which city/layer?

#

It's like asking, "How big is an American city?"

pine reef
iron saffron
#

Nope.

#

Lots of demons is safe to say.

pine reef
#

Hundreds, thousands, millions?

iron saffron
#

There's Orcus' city of Orcusgate.

#

Probably tens of thousands.

pine reef
#

So, Graz'zt one of the strongest Demon Princes with 3 layers would have a population of 100k demons at most. So most demons are not city-dwellers? Do we have an inside into the workings of demon society when its not about the blood war?

iron saffron
#

Remember that demons are CE creatures so they don't live in a very organized place like a city. They're only kept in line by stronger demons.

#

I have my 3E Fiendish Codex 1: Hordes of the Abyss book in front of me. It doesn't go into much detail on demon soceity or cities because there isn't much of any... Demons are destruction manifested in physical form.

pine reef
#

So do they mostly roam the infinite Abyss? Fight each other?

iron saffron
#

Sure, kept in line by stronger demons who work for the demon lords.

pine reef
#

What's the difference between a Demon Lord and a Demon Prince? The term seems to be interchangeable.

jagged apex
#

demon lords may not have complete sovereignty over a layer of the Abyss, whereas all demon princes rule one or more layers

#

is what i found

iron saffron
#

Not all demon lords control a layer.

pine reef
#

Also, the city of Zelatar from the wiki you provided seems to be immense, spanning three layers. So, as chaotic evil beings in a city held in-line solely by the power of demonic lord/prince, what exactly do they do in a city?

jagged apex
#

basically, princes rule their entire layer of the abyss, no exceptions, lords just have a majority of a layer it seems

pine reef
#

Aha, gotcha.

#

You can't smash stuff because the overlord Prince will rip you to shreds.

iron saffron
#

My players just encountered Kerzit, a minor demon lord who isn't strong enough to have a layer.

jagged apex
#

that is cuz they are part of the 3 layers ruled by one prince, who consolidated them into what is otherwise known as the little hells

pine reef
#

Yes, but my question is why demons stay in these cities? They can't break stuff or they get tortured to death. What do they actually do in them?

iron saffron
jagged apex
#

if i recall correctly confiding and connecting them all into one reduced them to not be infinite in scale like other layers of the abyss, granted is still massive

iron saffron
#

There are some mortals (mostly cultists) in those demonic cities.

jagged apex
#

at least compared to the rest of the abyss is a safer than living else where in the abyss

iron saffron
#

Graz'zt rules with an iron fist so that keeps the demons in line.

pine reef
#

So, that suggests to me that demons gravitate towards the order of heirarchy just to keep themselves safe. Graz'zt rulee is absolute, you stir shit up, u get killed. The safety of that appeals to demons.

jagged apex
#

plus living in said city comes with the perks of civilization, even if it is a demonic kind

iron saffron
#

I DMed the 3E campaign, Expedition to the Demonweb Pits, ages ago and the PCs go to Azzagrat and the city of Zelatar. It's relatively "safe" for mortals compared to the rest of the Abyss.

jagged apex
#

might makes right, you obey so you don't die and potentially stop existing

iron saffron
#

There is no order of hierarchy among demons, it's just power and strength.

jagged apex
#

Graz'zt is an outlier for his seemingly more lawful behavior

pine reef
#

isn't that a hierarchy in itself?

iron saffron
jagged apex
#

not really, as it is not static

#

might makes right basically means it can change at any time if someone bashes the other's head in first

#

like look at the definition "a system or organization in which people or groups are ranked one above the other according to status or authority."

#

unless you are counting alive and not existing as statuses

#

it is basically just too broad and changing to really be counted as a hierarchy

#

closest thing you have is the types which is technically mortal made to my knowledge, there is really just demon lords, which also includes obryth lords which are all competing against one another rather than being ranked with one being on top of another

iron saffron
#

Iggwilv (aka Tasha) and Ahm are/were two of the prominent demonologists. Iggwilv wrote the Demonomicon while Ahm had several Black Scrolls of Ahm.

pine reef
iron saffron
#

What about him?

#

He's a demon prince.

pine reef
#

Does he rule supreme, does he have authority over all other demon princes, or he's just the strongest and nobody cares about his title?

#

Kinda like a demon Asmodeus?

iron saffron
#

No, he's just the self proclaimed "prince of demons"

#

He has no sway over other demons other than the ones who reside in his two layers.

#

Orcus and Graz'zt has fought him over the centuries for the title.

pine reef
#

OK, so if he's not a figure of authority over others, who is the one that sends the infinite demons of the Abyss against the Devils in the blood war? Why does anyone do anything since we've established they fear non-existence?

#

My assumption was the Prince of Demons was basically forcing other Princes to commit troops so the Hells don't roll over them.

iron saffron
#

The obryrith lord Dagon was once the "prince of demons" but with the tanar'ri being the dominant species of demons Dagon works as an "advisor" to Demogorgon

#

Demogorgon has no sway over the other demo lords/princes.

pine reef
#

So how the demons fight the war?

iron saffron
#

Demon lord/princes send their forces to Avernus as part of the Blood War. It keeps the demons occupied. Dying in Hell is a temporary set back to the demons since their essences will go back to Abyss and they'll reform.

pine reef
#

Since any devil slain in Avernus/Hells dies permanently have the Hells made attempts to push the war into the Abyss instead? Like opening a great gateway between Abyss and Hells and just pour in Devils through. If devil gets slain in Abyss, its temporary, if Demon gets slain there its permanent.

iron saffron
#

In any war the defenders have the advantage of fighting on home territory. Devils are more organized so they have better strategy and tactics. They also hire out yugoloth mercenaries to fight for them.

#

Demons have the advantage of sheer numbers since they lack discipline, training, and strategy/tactics.

pine reef
#

But in this case, home territory isn't advantage, it is literal death sentence. They can get slain in Abyss and just reform, but in Hells they die for good.

iron saffron
#

The Blood War has been stalemate for centuries (which is very good for the rest of the multiverse).

iron saffron
#

1:3 is the typical ratio of defenders to attackers casualties (probably very much higher for demonic attackers).

pine reef
#

Lore-wise is it possible to open a permanent, stable gateway between planes? Hells gain a foothold in Abyss, they link it to Avernus, fight offensive because every demon killed dies permanently while every devil slain just reforms albeit of lesser rank, through attrition alone they'll win sooner or later.

obsidian gate
#

The devils are currently not doing incredibly well. That’s one of the reasons Zariel pulled an entire city into the hells

mystic sail
#

Have their been any recorded cases of dragon dhampirs?

cinder folio
mystic sail
#

Thanks mate

hollow tartan
obsidian gate
jagged apex
jagged apex
graceful jolt
#

Is there are a set lore for what happens to a soul once they are turned into an undead(specifically incorporated ones like shadows and specters), and then killed? Does it destroy the soul?

#

Same would apply to other corporeal Undead too, such as vampires and Wights?

jagged apex
#

at least to my knowledge

unkempt merlin
#

Not super duper a lore question but likely knowledge, arcana, trickery or more

modest badger
#

Funnily there is an Ambition Domian for 5e, but unofficial- from the Planeshift Amonkhet homebrew.

But Yeah this is more picking out domains in 5e that make sense. Domains change from edition to edition.

graceful jolt
wispy ice
#

yeppers

kind dagger
#

Is there some kind of lore reason why thaumaturgy is only for clerics and tieflings

cinder folio
#

Theatrics of the celestial and infernal?

kind dagger
#

I guess that makes sense but in my mind I feel like paladins and warlocks would suit it as well

iron saffron
kind dagger
#

Ah ok

shadow haven
#

So from a lore perspective a common NPC is more or less classless. Does that mean Lvl 1 characters are exceptional people in relation to those around them?

magic jackal
#

Not necessarily it all depends on setting

#

But NPCs generally as of 5e don't have true "Class Levels" so to speak.

#

No matter how powerful they are.

pine reef
#

Is there a lore reason why toril is at the same tech level for thousands of years?

magic jackal
#

Probably Gond's fault.

jagged apex
#

not really

#

is more so the fear and those actively hindering it do to fear of what happened with karsus' folly

#

like there are groups that actively prevent advancements in magical tech/item development feeling thata second age like the empire the netherese had would bring only more trouble

#

though these groups are mainly in the desert that once was not a desert and had the netherese empire floating over it

fast wing
spark haven
#

It's an important consideration. Humans, for example, had (very inefficient) steam engines for at least a thousand years, maybe two. But at the time, nobody was shipping or digging or lifting such quantity of goods across such distances that the needs couldn't be met by muscle-power. Steam engines came into their own at a very precise time and place: deep shaft coal mining.

Mine owners needed some sort of continuous power source to keep the mines drained. You could do it with human or animal labor but that's expensive. Steam engines had been improved a bit, but they were very very fuel hungry, a complete dealbreaker in every single scenario except one: where you're close to your fuel source.

jagged apex
spark haven
#

Then the mining industry began rapidly iterating on their design, which began to spread out into other applications as its efficiency improved

fast wing
jagged apex
#

not really how that works

#

tech in a world with magic is fundimentally different than one without it, that was a major thing hit apon back when some people from earth were kidnapped by one of those ancient empires on toril

#

is also why the likes of eberron rather than a steam engine use elementals bound to the engines of such vehciles like the lightning rails

#

plus not everyone can even use magic

pine reef
jagged apex
#

it is a lot harder than it is for say a player character for any random common person to, and those people make much less than player characters, most not even making a enough to equal a single gold piece within a year of work

jagged apex
#

like the 2 are not opposites and very much can work in unison, Gond and his followers such as the island nation of lantan are massive examples of this

#

again, i definitely would give the earlier linked video a watch as this would massively help you work away from misconceptions of tech and magic not mixing and other silly nonsense like guns or artificers not fitting into dnd

#

especially at about the 7 minute mark is where he goes into detail about the technology of faerun in it's history in relation to our own world

fast wing
#

I'm not saying tech doesn't exist, or is inert. I'm was more so saying that the need for the technology we know and have developed would not be nearly as much an issue in the fantasy world, due to magic and super natural powers.
I think you nailed the description in this one

fast wing
jagged apex
#

just cuz magic exists, does not mean everyone can use it or even many people

#

honestly our technology is impressive more so because how different it goes about achieving a prupose and function compared to the majority of things worlds with magic would invent

#

like even something like a pully system would have gotten a fair bit of respect for the person who built it

#

hell, an earth space ship, despite not being able to travel as far, would be a big deal among the spelljammers of other worlds

#

not to mention cuz just how different the designs of such ships are compared to spelljammers

jagged apex
fast wing
#

I'm about to start a campaign as a Hill Dwarf life cleric, and wanted to use an official Dwarven life domain God. I was thinking about doing Berronar Truesilver, but I wasnt sure if there was a better fit for me.
*Campaign is Descent into Avernus

jagged apex
#

otherwise, there is not really a "better" between the 2 as they are both intermediate deities, berronar truesilver is just more prominent cuz she is also the consort to the head of the pantheon, moradin

fast wing
#

Okay cool 😎 thanks

eager bay
#

Hello. Do I understand well that 3rd ed Plane of Shadow now in 5ed is called Shadowfell? Or those are two different planes? But i remember that we could use shadow plane to make a shortcuts during travels and it seems Shadowfell works similar?

modest badger
#

Plane of Shadow is now Shadowfell yeah.

The Shadowfell, also called the Plane of Shadow, is a dimension of black, gray, and white where most other color has been leached from everything.
DMG p.51

#

As for shortcuts, not really sure.
Shadowfell works like the Feywild in 5e. it's a parallel plane that overlaps the material plane, and while there are crossings into both, the distance on either side to a location is going to be similar.

crisp trout
#

“Heroes of the Feywild” is a really great book if you’re looking to flesh out a character with Fey connections. Lots of interesting lore.

modest badger
#

That's a great 4e book for sure. Love that one.

eager bay
# modest badger As for shortcuts, not really sure. Shadowfell works like the Feywild in 5e. it'...

Well i just try to push 3rd ed Race of gloamings into the 5ed. And still have some small confusions. So thanks.
About shortcuts... well there was a rule (3rd ed) that if a Mage know how the specific location looks and where it can be found on any mirroring plane (like Shadowfell in this case) he/she can travel through such plane to spend less time on traveling. But ofcourse getting themselfes in dangerous environment.
Because some paths were shorter and some paths turned out to be longer than Material Plane.

modest badger
#

That sounds more like a clever use of planeshift / Gate.

serene goblet
#

Which place in Faerun is the most common for wizards to be from?

#

Or like, forgotten realms in general

iron saffron
#

Thay has a lot of wizards.

supple nest
pine reef
supple nest
# pine reef For a normal society what percentage of the pop would be able to wield magic? 1%...

I'm not even sure its that high, but this question is closer to World-Building. Thay does have a lot of high power wizards...but they have far more slaves (live and undead).
Its also a seperate topci on how common is magic; Eberron has a lot of very common low level magic...but high power casters are rarer than FR, which tends to have archmages hidden in every shrub. (or so it feels)

shadow haven
#

So in forgotten realms how common place is magic from a person by person basis?

obsidian gate
#

The vast majority of people don’t have any magic

modest badger
#

For the Realms I think the closest we'll get to a 'RAI' answer are these tweets from Ed Greenwood https://www.sageadvice.eu/what-is-the-approximate-ratio-of-spellcasters-to-nonspellcasters-in-the-forgotten-realms-1-out-of-10000-1-out-of-100000/
And it's Long tweet. But the numbers he gives (which should probably be taken more as an intention of rarity than face value) are:

General:

  • 1 in 9,000 are born with the gift of magic. (whether they actually learn to use it as clerics, sorcerers, or such is another matter)

Sorcerers

  • 1 in 12,000 may manifest a 'wild talent' that lets them work magic without casting (Innate casting? Wild sorcs?)
  • 1 in 26,000 actually manage to manifest this gift to cast spells (Sorcerers)

Warlocks:

  • 1 in 130,000 grow desperate enough to reach out to a patron
  • perhaps 1 in 300,000 succeeds

Clerics (And paladins? Maybe Druids and Rangers? I dunno)

  • 1 in 4000 want to dedicate to a faith
  • 1 in 8,000 are actually accepted
  • Of those 1 in 6,000 actually can wield divine power (and not just be a simple conduit or get burnt out channeling a god)
  • And apparently they rarely get above 3rd level

Trained Arcane casters:

  • 1 in 40,000 can cast a cantrip
  • 1in 70,000 can cast 1sts
  • 1 in 90,000 can cast 2nds
#

I'm far to tired to even try and math out what 1 in 40,000 of 1 in 9,000 and such even is. But apparently true spellcasting is meant to be very rare in the Realms, but seems somewhat common thanks to priests doing minor spellcasting and miracles and bards spreading legends, and high profile wizards being well known in cities and so on.

#

And Warlocks are meant to be very, very rare.

#

But then there are outliers. Some cultures have higher amounts of spellcasters, such as Halruaa, and high elven PCs start off with cantrips learnt, and so on.

#

Also these thoughts seem a bit 'off the top of my head' from Greenwood. So pinch of salt.

#

For an official source we do have this, actually:
D&D 3.0 Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting, p. 92, "Magic in Society":

Wielders of arcane magic—also known as the Art—are rare in most Heartlands societies. No more than one person in a hundred or so is likely to have any ability as a wizard or sorcerer.
1 in 100 is wwaaaaay more than what Ed was tweeting above.

#

Might have been a shift with spellplague or such who knows

#

(Most of those tweet numbers do not actually make sense, considering that the population of Faerun isn't much more than 100 million based on people trying to add up all the demographics listed in the 3.0 FRCs- Which should also be taken with a pinch of salt.)

#

But from the official source and the tweet t seems like the intention is that less than 1% of the population can claim to be an Arcane spellcaster, warlocks are super rare, and divine casters are more common, but still rare.

meager trout
#

whats the lore for warforged

lapis stag
#

robots innit

meager trout
#

yah there like robots

modest badger
#

Robots would actually be pretty reductive and the writer of them tries to avoid that comparison.

unkempt merlin
#

Very much not robots

#

at best cyborg, but moreso just constructed people. Its why they are humanoid

modest badger
#

Warforged are often dismissed as “magical robots,” but it’s a flawed analogy. Warforged are formed from wood and metal, but they are living creatures. Their musculature is formed from a rootlike substances, and they have a circulatory system of alchemical fluids. A warforged can be healed, and they can even be poisoned, though it’s not easy.

#

Keith Bakers blog can add a lot of insight from the writer, but what we have in the 5e Eberron Rising from the Last War is what we have for 5e lore.
Warforged are sentient living constructs forged for war as their name says:

The warforged were built to fight in the Last War. The first warforged were mindless automatons, but House Cannith devoted vast resources to improving these steel soldiers. An unexpected breakthrough produced fully sentient soldiers, blending organic and inorganic materials. Warforged are made from wood and metal, but they can feel pain and emotion. Built as weapons, they must now find a purpose beyond the war. A warforged can be a steadfast ally, a cold-hearted killing machine, or a visionary in search of purpose and meaning.

jagged apex
# meager trout yah there like robots

if you want a player race that is more so a robot, autognomes are what you want, warforged are not robots, that is why their creature type is humanoid and not construct

#

basically calling them robots would not only be an oversimplification, but would also basically be a slur towards a warforged

jagged apex
modest badger
#

It's a bit weird because Warforged are constructs, but 5e gave them the humanoid creature type for ease.
In 3.X they were special 'Living Constructs', which is also what they are in 4e.
With 5e now being more loose on PC creature type (we have Autognome and Fairy now as some non humanoid options) if they redid warforged I wouldn't be surprised if they'd be constructs too.
But then creature type and it's meaning shifts with each edition. 'Living construct' is too niche a creature type for 5e, and maybe they felt just construct wasn't the right nuance.

unkempt merlin
#

Living construct was a creature type to replicate being humanoid-like, if warforged were remade they would likely still be humanoid, due to it being the closest to living construct

eager bay
#

So, why do autognomes have a lifespan limit and warforged don't?

unkempt merlin
#

because the warforged lifespan is unknown

#

the oldest warforged is only 30

meager trout
#

They can theoretically live forever properly maintained

pine reef
#

How can demons or devils raid Kelemvor's City of the Dead to steal souls either false or faithless when Kelemvor ought to have absolute power there as a Greater Deity? Can't he simply smite any demon or devil that emerges?

sharp owl
iron saffron
pine reef
sharp owl
#

Nope, that's been removed from the lore

#

The most recent errata to SCAG removed that

pine reef
#

What is the fate of the faithless now?

sharp owl
#

They pass to the Fuge Plane and wander the City of Judgement, unaware that they're dead

#

They'll typically linger there until either a servant of the god they worshipped comes to collect them, or are sent back to be reborn and finish unfinished work.

#

Those that aren't collected or sent back are judged by Kelemvor who decides each ones fate

random lintel
#

Nice

formal sable
#

Finding information on Neverwinter seems to be a challenge w/o referring to some of the previous editions. I want to have a better grasp of the city since my party will begin Phandelver this next week.

sharp owl
#

Why can't/won't you refer to previous editions? Unless explicitly contradicted, that lore is still valid

formal sable
#

This is true and I didnt say I wouldn't use it. In fact, I am. I was just wondering if there was a more recent resource.

sharp owl
#

Not really, SCAG would be your best bet. There's no adventure set in Neverwinter. Tomb of Annihilation opens there, but with little exposition on the area

formal sable
#

Actually, you know what I could really use? A filled out city. I remember when I was much younger, a campaign setting in a city, detailed to a granular level,...Greyhawk, I think it was.

#

I may see if I can get my hands on that...there's no reason some of that exposition cant be transferred to Neverwinter.

sharp owl
modest badger
#

There are some very detailed books on Neverwinter from 3.5 and.. 2e?

#

4e too.
4e has Neverwinter Campaign Setting
3.5 Had the generic Forgotten Realms Campaign setting
2e had The Savage Frontier, The North: Guide to the Savage Frontier, Waterdeep and the North and so on. So not fully focused on Neverwinter but had sections on it.

#

But you're right that Neverwinter is a lot more neglected than I remember. I played the NwN video game so part of me is surprised there isn't more in the books for it, aside from 4e.

formal sable
#

Yah. It needs some WotC love. I just found a good copy of the campaing setting on ebay for $45. A lot lower than most places ...it should do.

#

Thanks!

merry roost
#

From what I understand of the lore, the in setting reason for calling it The Material Plane was because they found out it was one continuous Material Plane.
But, as of the spelljammer book this is false, I feel this is implying to me that it now multiple Material Planes.
Is this correct?

sharp owl
#

it being called the Material Plane doesn't have anything to do with it being continuous

#

It's to do with it's relation to the other planes; there's the elemental planes, the astral plane, the energy planes etc
The material plane, sometimes called the mortal plane, is a plane of material existence

#

It has nothing to do with Spelljammer

#

If you think of material as being synonymous with physical, it makes sense as the other planes are metaphysical planes; planes of alignment or elements or energies given form

jagged apex
#

yeah and that is why most if not all mortal life lives on the prime material plane, is basically the mortal realm, at least that is one way i like to think of it and often will refer to it as when rping a character that has a more extra planar background

cinder folio
#

@long olive regarding advancement in a religious organisation, I would imagine much like a promotion in the workplace.

  • do the job to a high standard
  • have the support of your superiors
  • use opportunities to take on additional tasks and responsibilities
  • have a vacancy or position open
long olive
#

So do God's ever request highly valuable items (whether in need of retrieval or if it'll help power wise)

#

Not help with the god/leaders power, but maybe make a high priestess stronger or in order to assist high ranking followers or whatnot

cinder folio
jagged apex
#

yeah, in one storyline in bg3 they even make use of this

long olive
#

Is lolth in BG3?

jagged apex
#

more so the getting powerful magical items recovered

long olive
#

Oh

#

Ty

iron saffron
long olive
#

Idk what setting is, I know she rules the underdark (or part of it at least)

#

Question about lolth tho:

So when I was reading up on lolth it said something about land raids or something? I know I can just look it up, but typically websites that have info on it tend to be super lengthy, and im just not up for that kind of read

iron saffron
#

What are you specifically want to know about her?

cinder folio
#

"ASCENSION TO POWER IN DROW SOCIETY IS A SIMPLE PROCESS OF ASSASSINATION."

"Her clergy sacrificed the living and treasure for her glory."

"She not only enjoyed, but thrived upon torture, destruction, and death, whether personally performing it or causing it. Every interaction was ultimately done with malice..."

cinder folio
long olive
cinder folio
#

I know why you're on a sacred mission. They want you dead but can't be bothered to do it themselves. You should get powerful so when you come back, you can show them who's boss.

iron saffron
#

If you want help with your quest design then #dm-discussion is a better place than here.

long olive
#

That's what people on reddit said, but thats where the determination and desperation comes from. I feel like she'd be in denial at first and then come to terms with her newfound freedom (I havent read the drizzt books, but I heard this is similar)

long olive
long olive
jagged apex
#

either of those should prove helpful, heck maybe even both

cinder folio
#

Guile, ruthlessness and ambition. Shadow, poison and blade. Wield them well or be forgotten forever.

jagged apex
#

and stuff like no witnesses, in her societies, laws exist to punish those who get caught

#

basically as long as you don't get caught or leave any loose ends or encrimidating evidence, you are innocent in the eyes of her socity's laws

#

like these are drow who regularly plan and attempt assassinations of others to get higher positions in society, am largely describing this from memory so there is a chance i am over simplifying things in some places

long olive
#

Sounds like a great place for rogues

jagged apex
#

honestly any killer or corrupt person that understands subtlty, and is a drow

#

cuz any other race you probably are gunna wind up dead or a slave

long olive
#

But what about her priestesses and clerics? What is their purpose other then to be clerics and priestesses

jagged apex
long olive
#

And like... how do they get into the position they're in? Nobility?

jagged apex
#

i'd suggest reading the details here and other pages that may be linked to see if the answers are already there for you to read

long olive
#

I read the worshipers part and the orders part

cinder folio
jagged apex
long olive
#

So basically luck, money and killing people

#

And the better thief you are, the better. And... do they learn cleric abilities from other worshipers?

jagged apex
#

plus it will likely included additional info you will find useful in some way

long olive
#

Nvm I just looked it up and found a shortened version. There's a grand temple that's used for training clerics

haughty olive
#

Arach Tinilith

long olive
#

Idk

jagged apex
long olive
#

Ty for always coming here with the links (I know they're easy to get, but that site always has so many words and you make it to where I go to specific paragraphs)

#

Ah, so she'd be a novice, then be sent out on this "impossible" mission... I shall report to my dm of my findings

hollow panther
#

The Olympian pantheon (aka Greek pantheon) exists in the Forgotten Realms and are basically greek mithology gods. I was wondering how those gods interact with other pantheons. They are mostly just an afterthought but it seems strange how almost all gods in the olympian pantheon have overlapping portfolios with other gods, like Hades and Jergal that both ruled death. Isn't that prohibited by the overgods? What happens when 2 gods rule death?

iron saffron
#

Not the entire pantheon

#

Where does it say the Greek gods have presence on Toril?

cinder folio
#

But of those that do co-exist and overlap, how does that go? Do they focus on their own followers or do the gods in question do rock-paper-scissors to assert temporary dominance?

iron saffron
#

As far as I know only the Egyptian pantheon has a presence on Toril

unkempt merlin
#

Plenty of Faerunian gods overlap in domain and portfolios

unkempt merlin
iron saffron
#

That's not the entire pantheon, just Tyr

crude blaze
iron saffron
#

Pantheon is the entire group of related gods

unkempt merlin
iron saffron
#

It's like saying there is a pack of dogs when there's just one

cinder folio
#

Yes, but to the point: what happens when there's overlap?

iron saffron
#

Anyway back to Cabra, where did it say there are Greek godson Toril?

jagged apex
#

though most of those are from past editions and the only one i know to have slightly more relevance is pan, cuz saytrs

jagged apex
iron saffron
#

Remember that the FR wiki includes information on stuff not exclusive to FR and Realmspace

jagged apex
#

so seems they barely have an influence on toril

#

mainly via Tymora and Beshaba who was otherwise composed as the goddess Tyche

iron saffron
#

Yeah that's why I wanted a citation from Cabra

jagged apex
#

and seems Hermes and Pan investigated her demise, so seems something is going on with them, but like only 3 of the greek gods it seems ever set foot or set up shop on toril

#

with hermes and pan's investigation being cited as from "On Hallowed Ground"

#

else seems after that we got no new notable history regarding them and toril, or if we have nobody has added it to the forgotten realms wiki yet

jagged apex
#

else they both probably would just be serving kelemvor

#

cuz most of their divine status from other worlds where they are prominently worshiped, would not carry over, so they would be massively lower ranked and likely weaker than the existing realms specific gods

#

but to my knowledge, the pantheon as a whole is not worshiped, at least not widely, on toril, at best probably just have a few individuals that worship gods from that pantheon

iron saffron
#

Ao has the final say which gods can have influence in Realmspace.

Even between pantheons gods' portfolios can overlap.

cinder folio
unkempt merlin
#

Most of the time overlap in portfolio isn't a big deal in the grand cosmic sense

#

A lot of the time it results in gods with overlapping portfolios either A) being allies/friendly in some capacity or B) them being rivals in some capacity

#

Like how a lot of the gods of nature are in category A

jagged apex
#

is really only an issue if they are a god in the same setting and both are of a certain status, greater deity i believe being the lowest, where they have to have enough differences or else have to become one or risk loosing that thing in their portfolio or just not being allowed to operate in that setting anymore, though i could be wrong

unkempt merlin
#

I was specifically referring to the FR in my comment. A lot of other settings simply don't have gods with the same type of overlapping portfolios

jagged apex
#

from what i recall my bit was also about the forgotten realms, at least from what i recall of how gods work in relation to the topic there and that presumably far as i know is largely the default of things for other settings unless specified otherwise

tranquil heron
#

What position do males take in typical drow society?

grim siren
#

Which setting?

iron saffron
#

Depends if the drow society is under sway of Lolth or not.

jagged apex
oblique blade
#

was bg1 and 2's story canon to lore?

tranquil heron
#

Lolth's drow, in the Forgotten Realms.

oblique blade
#

If so, will they make the good endings of bg3 canon in FR because there are some REVELATIONS

tranquil heron
jagged apex
#

we will not know until it happens basically by those writing forgotten realms content set after the events of that game's events

oblique blade
#

is the new edition a new time period in the lore?

#

or will it just be the same timeline

unkempt merlin
#

there is no new edition

jagged apex
#

they are basically just consolidating changes made to 5e's core and taking advantage of that by adding some new core stuff into it, it is still dnd 5e effectively hence why it is backwards compatible with previous 5e content

oblique blade
#

dang really wanted to see who'd kill mystra this time

jagged apex
#

it is not something that happens easily or lightly

#

it just happened to be used in a storyline to explain in universe the changes between editions

#

like there is no guarantee if they did do a new edition she would at all just cuz it was used as part of that transition a few times before, if anything they'd probably try to think of something else to avoid being called lazy in their writing, but lore wise, she exist in such a way to where she is much harder to kill as a lot of her power and thus herself is in the weave itself

#

at least as far as i am aware that is the case

jagged apex
grim siren
jagged apex
#

honestly that would be the stupidest way for her to die

tranquil heron
jagged apex
#

that would be even worse probably, cuz it is not something she would do

#

if you are gunna make more joke comments like that, there is likely a better suited channel

iron saffron
jagged apex
#

there is some connections barely, but that would be more so for #baldurs-gate-3-spoilers talk, but to the wider dnd lore, i reffer to my earlier statements

honest loom
#

they may have been created and licensed by bioware yeah but the stories (some endings) and characters joined canon through some novels and cameos in other adventures

jagged apex
#

or at least some versions of those events and characters

#

given what wizards of the coast said regarding canon a while back

honest loom
#

yeah canon's loosey goosey through the years, but I'm excited to see if wotsy decides to ever... immortalise... some elements of the patch 5 epilogues in the future

jagged apex
#

or more accurately, much like other IPs in multiple mediums, there is more than 1

#

honestly i feel that kind of works into the idea and thus in the favor arguably of dnd canonically having it's own multiverse, at least in my opinion, as weather it is good or bad to have multiple continuities is probably inherently subjective

jagged apex
honest loom
#

Earth-3 Abdel Adrian's a sapient squirrel /joking

meager urchin
#

Who did the chromatic dragon god (idk the name) have eggs with

iron saffron
#

Tiamat?

jagged apex
#

which have varied over the years in some cases, but a few are known by name largely for their roles and impact in certain events in dnd lore, such as her red dragon consort, Ephelomon

#

at least assuming you do mean tiamat, as while she is their queen, technically there are other dragon gods that those on other worlds may otherwise devote themselves to

#

but especially in the likes of the forgotten realms she is basically the main if not only one as all the other dragon gods save for bahamut has drastically lost followers to where they effectively have no presence or influence on worlds like toril and the setting it is part of

polar oracle
#

What classes in lore have the most freedom to do what they want?

unkempt merlin
#

Any? Classes are in large part non diagetic

polar oracle
#

Yeah

unkempt merlin
#

I'm saying any class has the most freedom because class is non diagetic largely

iron saffron
polar oracle
iron saffron
#

Classes is a gameplay mechanic.
Lore essentially deals with history.

unkempt merlin
jagged apex
#

at least not these days

#

older editions they were a lot more strict from what i hear

#

but yeah that is more mechanics than anything

iron saffron
#

Yes, there are more restrictions on older edtion classes but again, that's gameplay mechanics which doesn't belong in this channel.

jagged apex
#

at best what you are thinking of are archetypes, which is neither mechanics nor lore

polar oracle
iron saffron
#

Classes are gameplay mechanics.

polar oracle
#

So rangers don’t exist in lore

jagged apex
#

they are, but it is not like they are viewed that way in universe, they are more so for game play mechanics than for the worlds we play in

polar oracle
#

Or am I paraphrasing wrong

jagged apex
#

you are basically misunderstanding what people are trying to tell you

iron saffron
#

Not all classes existed in older editions. Wizards could call themselves "sorcerer" or "warlock" (in AD&D, magic-users had different titles per level, which included "sorcerer" and "warlock" (neither of those were classes back then)).

jagged apex
#

plus many are not strictly terms that relate to a class, not all rangers of are rangers necessarily as an example

iron saffron
# polar oracle So rangers don’t exist in lore

I'm politely telling you that classes are not diagetic in lore.

Drizzt referred himself as a ranger even though his statblocks he was 10th level fighter/1st level barbarian/5th level ranger in 3E.

unkempt merlin
#

yea, the class mechanical definitions are not diagetic

jagged apex
#

perhaps they don't know what diagetic means?

sinful pasture
#

is there a blood god in dnd?