suggestion-discussion

[pliant sorrel]

I just would really like to see the addition of more human like people, not dvergr but someone that scaled up to our size

[rose swan]

Doubt we’ll see other Vikings in-game 🤔 but perhaps another neutral mob like Dvergr

[arctic wharf]

elves perhaps... they are as big in the mythos as dverger hehe

[pliant sorrel]

Idk how to bring the conversation i had a couple days ago up, but there were some nice reasons

Plus doesn’t need to be specifically human, something that rather resembleds them

Also if there was an addition of these more human like people, I’d also like to see their buildings built differently/more advanced

[lofty wave]

A human-ish, hostile enemy that isn't undead would be perfect

[pliant sorrel]

I was thinking of making them like dvergrs, but hostile would make more sense

[lofty wave]

If they're neutral I'd prefer to just see more dvergr

[pliant sorrel]

They have the same tech & intelligence as us.

[languid ibex]

I recall a lot of the lore pointing to the world of Valheim actually being a trick by Loki, and he has been posing as Odin the whole time, a twisted version of Vikings mind-controlled by Loki when passing by too many challenges set out by him would be interesting.. of course based in a theory, but I do enjoy the idea that you aren't meant to survive the trials of Valheim, and do so anyways.

[pliant sorrel]

They live in a village that’s not too big, some have towers, log cabins or a mix, & at the center it can introduce a new fireplace that’s big and melts snow in the surrounding area

[pliant sorrel]

Now that I think of it, humans would not be a great addition, rather something human like that wants more rescources & stuff and have bad intentions

Let me write out my entire idea of this:

[stiff stag]

Taking a very lazy and invalid approach of "just ignore it" is far different from not being able to form your thoughts very well. There are glaring balancing issues that would need to be addressed that can't be ignored that you're trying to downplay and sweep under the rug. Although it's ultimately a moot point anyway, since magic is not meant/intended to be available to the player any sooner in any form, that's the whole point of it being new content in the mistlands and why eitr as well as eitr foods/etc. only become available then and no sooner. If it were added very early on then a major chunk of mistlands content would no longer be anything new once you get there, it would just be more of the same old stuff, detracting from the theme and design of the biome being a very mystical place.

[pliant sorrel]

In the DN there are villages spread out across the land by “human-like” creatures. They are intelligent, & have either the same tech or even more advanced then us. They use different weapons, some hold swords, bows, axes, bows, crossbows, some mages, all different. They have some watch out towers, log cabins, & many forges & crafting tables to be able to survive & build in this land. This houses & chests they have in the houses contain many valuable resources, & they have a massive fire in the middle making walking around their village no problem. Their designs, armor can slightly vary from each other still showing big resemblance, just to make it more unique. Some of these people can be found in (dungeons if it’s added) trying to get more resources, & wood in forest like areas (obviously they won’t be able to get any of these, but they’d be there to give it the illusion of “mining resources” etc.

& they’re not messy like the fulings, they can keep order, their items are not messy & all over the place & would have an interactive ai with eachother, when there’s no player near them, it’d seem as if some are talking or doing work, when aggroed or not they’d have texts above their head like dvergrs

When they’re attacking you, they will obviously have different texts rather then when they’re walking around/working

& there could be a rng for their heights to be from 1.8-2 meters

All of this I believe would make it all immersive, & show actual communication between the people rather than going rogue or being messy. & I think it’d be cool for some to have a sheild or tower sheild that can occasionally block with making new combat

The end, until something else comes to mine

[arctic wharf]

I could take or leave such an addition, which might not bode well for something that would take tons of effort and be easy to end up underwhelming just as fortresses. 🤔
Just not sure how worth it, it might be. but I still wouldn't be against such an addition ofc either.

[pliant sorrel]

Also I don’t think it’d be as difficult since it’s similar to dvergrs & fulings, obviously would be hard in some ways but doesn’t have to come up with some completely unique stuff except for a different ai system.

[arctic wharf]

How much inspiration terms of loot is the main thing + it's sounding like a lot of content for their structures.

[pliant sorrel]

True, their structures will be very different and would have different of content, but after the designer would have the houses & towers designed, lots of it is somewhat completed

[hexed jewel]

#suggestions message this option could utilize bone or some other mats to add more use value to mats similar to how stone is consumed paving road status quo

[pliant sorrel]

Should I make the suggestion for my idea? I can even try making a design too

And tbh, something I’d like to see in the dn is possibly 3 side quests for weapons

Anddd maybe, the DN can generate more like an island, & make it slightly bigger than the ashlands

[late vortex]

yo y’all cool w backflips right

[long glacier]

Not sure how much it adds gameplay-wise, but it would be cool

[lofty wave]

It could just be one of the emotes that can be used with commands

[granite geyser]

And?

Does that mean they should make all other playstyles irrelevant to use because magic is M A G I C? Then what's the point of having multiple playstyles in the first place?

It doesn't make any sense

[fleet lintel]

Not making a change because it would be overpowered isn’t wrong at all. It would be wrong not to block such a change. The entire game is built around accruing power, ability, and capability to circumvent growing challenges and dangers. If you make all the challenges trivial with something overpowered you may as well just enable godmode for the vanilla game. Defeats the whole point

[wet drift]

Valheim does have some early content that does feel like the player is doing something magical.

Forsaken powers and wishbone is the first thing that comes to mind.

It wouldn't feel too crazy if we got some other magical abilities.

However, I would still prefere if eitr remained mistlands...probably. Idk know, it would be cool with berries in mountains that only spawn really high, but then I don't want anything in plains so....

One thing that I feel could help against the odd feeling of sudenly using level 0 skills in the lategame, would be to have certain items count towards magic when crafting them.

Frost arrows is the first that came to my mind, but it could probably apply to other things.

Those who have weaponized the elements are likely to grasp magic more quickly.

Yeah, let crafting/using elemental damage things contribute to elemental magic skill, and maybe forsaken power usage could level blood magic

[stiff stag]

If magic is already very powerful, having skill level on top of that long before you have access to them would be overkill.

[proper sage]

if you had 50 skill by mistlands, but they nerfed the magic to balance it, does it really matter? it's balanced for when it's introduced, so your skill doesn't matter really

[analog moss]

the other side of that is the grind, especially for elemental magic.

it takes sooo long to level.

[proper sage]

would i like magic earlier in the game? yes, but i can just go play mods to do that, rather then them spend a ton of time rebalancing the game to introduce that stuff while they're focued on other, more engaging content and the deep north

[hexed jewel]

if anythign i feel like blood is way harder to level

[analog moss]

I'll admit to cheesing blood at a farm.

[wet drift]

If that would actually be problematic, which I don't really believe because early levels are so much quicker than later levels anyway, and nobody is using that many elemental items, then tweaking the numbers slightly shouldn't be too much effort.

[hexed jewel]

elemental basically any attack spam levels it, blood you're stuck with either each summon or the bubble (and THINK it's only levelled when specifically popped by damage not when just wears off, and pretty sure not on any cast either)

untill you get trollstaff of course, which I don't have experience with so dunno how much easier that makes it

[fleet lintel]

More so than balancing, I think the reason to keep magic as a late game addition is simple engagement.

Valheim does a pretty good job of introducing things slowly and developing them as you. But even then if you’re just advancing the same mechanics you still get comfortable enough with them that it’s easy to get a little disengaged if not bored. So adding an entirely new mechanic, even if it is a little overpowered, is a great late game reward after you had time to get really comfortable with melee combat and bows

[hexed jewel]

that's a persuasive argument

[fleet lintel]

Adding magic to early game just saturates it with more things on the front end that distracts from learning the basics and makes the mid-end game less interesting because there’s nothing “new”

[hexed jewel]

i certainly was excited af the moment I learned it existed and eagerly worked towards it, and was not disappointed and was quite satisfied on acheiving it

[fleet lintel]

Yeah, me too

[wet drift]

That is why I want eitr to remain late. On the other hand, having no allusions to magic at all does hurt immersion a bit, because the 'new zone = new update = new mechanics' becomes a bit too transparent.

I believe the experience of using some frost arrows and gaining a magic level wouldn't really hurt the excitement of proper magic later. (And at least not any more than opening the menu and seeing those skills at 0, you're spoiled either way)

On the other hand, if you are in to that mystical stuff, seeing your magic level go up after trying to roleplay an enchanter would be really good. And I think it would acctually increase the effect of finally unlocking your potential in the Mistlands.

[fleet lintel]

Eh… having a way to level magic before mistlands would only be practical if magic wasn’t perfectly capable of killing mistlands mobs at level 0. But it is. So it’s kind of pointless.

Shooting frost arrows and getting magic skill just seems… weird

[wet drift]

Then make big number smaller

[fleet lintel]

You’re already getting bow skill for frost arrows

[fleet lintel]

Or just leave it as it is? I’m going to opt for the path of least resistance on this one.

[wet drift]

The path of least resistance is to not make the game

[fleet lintel]

It wouldn’t break the game to make weird things give you magic skill. Wouldn’t add anything either. Would just be changing it to change it

[fleet lintel]

Well no, the “path” is making/developing the game. Not doing that is halting on the path, for this analogy anyway.

[proper sage]

the point of skills is to gain experience from using the weapons/tools, etc. not crafting arrows to satisfy your need to see higher number in your skill tree

[fleet lintel]

And to be clear I don’t think the path of least resistance is always the right answer. I just want a compelling answer of some sort as to why something should be changed

[stiff stag]

Yes, it vey much would be problematic. People would start leveling early once they realize they can (so they can jump right in with high skill levels vs having to work up to it once they get to mistlands). And nerfing magic to fit in a needless change is bad either way (it's either going to be too little to counteract the skill gain, or for it to be enough to counteract it, it would be nerfed too much, making magic very weak). Also, can't really call the different arrow types magic anyway, considering actual magic isn't involved with them in any way (just because they are elemental doesn't make them magic, it's simply the properties of the materials used to craft them).

[analog moss]

it doesn't really make sense anyway. It's like saying blobs and drakes are magic users.

[fleet lintel]

How else does a blob jump without magic?!? (Just kidding)

[analog moss]

my daughter's jello jumps off the table all the time 😆

[wet drift]

Still. I believe the path in this case is a scenic hike. The goal is easy enough to reach, but the easiest path is one that barely has any beauty to offer. Taking it would make the trip pointless.

The devs have already decided to climb. A quick walking detour for some better scenery is only worth dismissing if they're tired and just want to get home.

[fleet lintel]

Obviously it just throws its pseudopod at you with enough force to carry the rest of it 40 feet through the air.

But seriously why can blobs jump so far

[fleet lintel]

Yeah but this detour of using frost arrows to get magic skill adds nothing interesting to your scenic hike

What is gained from the ability to level up magic skill earlier? How does it add to the gameplay experience?

It’s just going to make people who haven’t played the game wonder what magic skill is for when they can use it for 5 biomes

Starting magic with 0 skill isn’t a problem to solve, because it’s already perfectly functional at 0 skill.

Making it not functional at 0 skill just for the sake of making it level-able earlier is just punishing people for not developing a skill they can’t use

[wet drift]

I don't even think it needs to be proper magic, although some of it does seem magical to me. I think weaponizing elements would/could give applicable experience.
You don't have to find my arguments significant but I have definitely provided plenty.
Leveling early also doesn't really sound like a big exploit if the levels don't do anything yet, and leveling later is faster.
In general, I think people are a bit impatient to get to the next area. I've said it before, but I would honestly give up multiple biomes for a bit more polish.

[fleet lintel]

Currently, every skill is just developed organically through useage after you acquire it. I don’t see any reason magic should be any different. And several why it should stay the same.

[wet drift]

-Because said skills remain unavailable so much later (obvious idea, but less directly important to me personally)
-Because some of what you do clearly seem magical.
-See my previous user experience arguments.

[fleet lintel]

What skills become unavailable later?

[wet drift]

not become. are

[fleet lintel]

What skills are unavailable later?

[wet drift]

bad wording on my part tbf

fixed it

[stiff stag]

The arrow types are more akin to a freezer, a flamethrower, poison darts, etc. irl, all things not based in magic in any sense that do relate to different elements/effects. Same can be said for materials used in game for the different types of arrows, they have practical/mechanical means of creating those elements/effects, not magic by any means. And just "seeming magical" doesn't make it so.

[fleet lintel]

I don’t know what your user experience argument is. If you link I’ll read it, but I’m just going to scroll up and hope I find what you’re talking about.

[wet drift]

this mostly

[fleet lintel]

I still have no idea what you mean. Unless you just saying the magic skill is unavailable until later in the game? But we all know this. It’s also not problematic. Crossbow is also unavailable early in the game, so people need to be able to level crossbow in meadows?

Do people need to be able to level farming before they can farm?

Or riding before they tame a rideable animal?

[wet drift]

Tbh, I think it could be bundled with bows. That's not really important though.

As I said yes, the late availability is less important to me personally, or would be if it wasn't a significant shift that really incentives the use of those lvl0s. It's just a common complaint which my idea just so happens to solve.

Farming and riding seem okay to me, because as a player, I can't see any reason I should know how to farm or ride well. And it also isn't a spoiler that the skill exists in my menu. I mean, I guess it is, but it seems less significant.

Seeing the magic skill as a new player, I just know that eventually, this viking simulator is going to turn into a magic game, but I haven't gotten that far because devs only came up with it later in the game to add variety; and then, crafting elemental weapons that seem magical and not leveling elemental magic only confirms that idea while also disappointing me.

I expect this from a continually updating MMO, and that is the reason I don't play that genre. Seeing it in a game with predetermined and limited scope is quite jarring, even though this is relatively minor example.
(It would also be a proportionally minor issue to solve)

[fleet lintel]

Seeing what? Skills in the skill menu you can’t use yet?

I think the best solution for that would be to keep the skills from populating in the menu until you gain at least 1 level in it

[wet drift]

That would cover some of the points. I would want them to do this if they don't do anything more.

[arctic wharf]

This has made little to no sense to me... played my fair share of MMO's and fail to see how anything you have said is comparable. Doubly so when IG is super duper concerned about pointing valheim out as NOT being an MMO all the time

[wet drift]

I have come to use "the MMO effect" to describe anything that is added for mechanical variety in new parts of the game, such as new quests or areas, without sufficiently tying into earlier parts.

If only used once for that area, it could be described as a gimmic.

[fleet lintel]

How is an MMO effect for a game to get more complex as you progress?

[wet drift]

It's all in the tie in

[fleet lintel]

Games would be so boring if they didnt get more complex as you played

[wet drift]

New mechanics = good
New mechanics that feel disconected or like they should have been there from the start = bad

[fleet lintel]

Good thing magic is tied in well and doesn’t feel disconnected or like it should be there from the start

[wet drift]

Agree with the later, disagree with the former.

It just sorta pops up.

[fleet lintel]

You get an ability to harvest and refine a new resource and it lets you build new items and make new food. That’s as tied in as anything gets with valheim

That’s like saying forging a sword when you can mine bronze seems random and just pops up

[wet drift]

It's the 'new zone = new update = new mechanics' thing I mentioned earlier. I really do think that hurts immersion. This is exaggerated by all the (better) ways that mistlands already feels different.

Tool progression doesn't really give that. I didn't craft a stone axe and expect it to be my only weapon.

[fleet lintel]

You are out of your mind if you think adding new elements to new biomes breaks immersion.

[wet drift]

It doesn't. But those elements could and should be connected to something previously established. Magic is a very large shift, and as such could benefit from a lot of hints.

That is ingame hints, not menu hints.

Anyway, I think I will be doing something else with my night/morning now.

[fleet lintel]

Lore stones alluding to magic would be fine

[wet drift]

Yes. I agree. Although I do like the gradual drop in stones.
That in combination with the ravens reaction to the refinery implies we are likely the first to reach mistlands.
Which I think is fitting

I guess one of the traders could have a line.

[arctic wharf]

splitting hairs...

[open dagger]

#suggestions message i would add to this that it levels the skill in secret, so it doesnt show you the effect and if you open the skill menu. it shouldnt spoil magic for people who dont know about it yet

[hollow elm]

#suggestions message I agree, but I suspect that if spirit damage becomes useful, Fader will just end up with more hit points.

[hearty finch]

#suggestions message yes pls, carapace helm = iron helm. feels so bad to unequip padded for that shit (tbh my complaint is mostly just the helm)

[granite geyser]

Why? It's not like the current spirit weapons would make any difference

Thunder axes would probably still outdamage anything.

[grand sable]

It is disappointing, but i do like the more open helmet design plus its more armour dran drake or iron

[hearty finch]

yea m8 im strictly talking about the cosmetics of it. imo they should make the helmet looking like seeker soldier head

the armor is made from carapace but looking at it right now, it doesnt scream "this was made with bug parts"

[hollow elm]

Full transmog functionality! 😛

[hollow elm]

If you say so. I was just suggesting that, generally, boss battles are at least somewhat balanced around the damaging capacity of the players fighting them. I don't theory-craft Valheim anywhere near enough to advise on specific weapons; my implication was that increasing the damage one can inflict upon a boss (even for lore purposes) would likely result in some balancing of the boss's survivability that goes against the initial suggestion's intent.

[grand sable]

(i really dont like the bug aesthetic)

also why do people not want flametal chests

like i understand not changing certain things of the game for logistical reasons....but how on earth do you explain not wanting more cool-ass things.

[arctic wharf]

I want flametal chests... only reason I could think not is instead we get a final tier in deep north

Our last tier is black metal from plain right?

[grand sable]

mhm

theres one for every tier except for mountains, mistlands & ashlands.

take my word for it i've only been awake for a decade and it is now 6am

i am currently in the process of blacking tf out

[hollow elm]

What kind of survival game would Valheim be if the max. level gear/crafting at official release wasn't made available considerably after when it was useful?

[arctic wharf]

???? Not sure what you mean, DN is going to have a final tier of gear and progression just like every biome before it.

That, or they break expectations by breaking the cycle lol

[hollow elm]

Don't feel bad. I don't know what I mean half the time, either.

[hearty finch]

well there are cool ways to do it imo, for example chitin armor in skyrim

https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/elderscrolls/images/4/46/Heavy_Chitin_Armor_-_Both.png/revision/latest?cb=20130213030747

[short wing]

He's not chitin you, that armor in skyrim looks cool.

[hearty finch]

lmao

[obtuse wolf]

@lofty mountain 💡 👍

[hexed jewel]

haters of the sailing skill make me sad

[hearty finch]

maybe too unrealistic. like how is ur knowledge of boating gonna affect the wind. either u have it or not

[hexed jewel]

i don't think it's that unrealistic at all to suppose a more skilled hand at the tiller knows how to tack to the wind better to get more speed out of given wind

it's almost if not actually arguably LITERALLY a skill in REAL LIFE that works almost EXACTLY that way lol

and also BOAT MOVE FASTER BECAUSE LINE GO UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 🤩😍 🚀

[hearty finch]

currently the "tack to the wind" is made by the player. not sure what a player skill would do, would it automatically steer for you? like if you wanna go in a direction and the wind is not in that direction, idk what you can do..

[hexed jewel]

i'm just giving what I think is a plausible 'realism' explanation for how one could "head canon" it working, were it added--i.e. an answer to the "maybe (un)realism" as a reason to dislike it

it would mechanically just be one or more scaling improvements to aspects of sailing based upon skill like all skills

i.e., a percentage buff to base speed scaling with skill, maybe also like op suggested scaling "narrowing" of the size of the "against the wind" arc

just in general things that would overall improve the experience/efficiency/effectiveness of sailing, as sailing skill increases

[hearty finch]

alright ya i think i understand what u mean

stuff can def be done to improve boating, like more row seats for more speed

[hexed jewel]

i think if you mean allowing extra players to add rowing speed we're even less likely to ever get that than a sailing skill just because of how consistently and forcefully devs (or maybe should say just Smiffe but think he speaking for a 'dev consensus' here) have said no, and on the basis of a principle that SEEMS to me pretty good and reasonable "nothign that benefits multiplayer over singlerplayer"

so while they HAVE done things later they said no to before, I'm skeptical additional rowing/rowing partners will be one

now boat UPGRADES that allow building a boat with, or adding to existing boat, "oars" or something that add speed (working same in single and MP) I could see

[hearty finch]

rip

[hexed jewel]

RIP indeed

[arctic wharf]

yeah, rowing in multiplayer to contribute to some aspect of boat maneuverability is pretty much one of the hard no's mentioned by the devs hehe

Would be skeptical as well, but we never know for sure I guess

[lofty wave]

#suggestions message
The piece that generates shields shouldn't be a shield generator?

[boreal iris]

@pliant sorrel they should make the dn enemy svaltrbrigands

Elves

[grand sable]

i think the sailing skill should only affect mobility not speed

[hexed jewel]

i'm not really TOO wedded to any particular conception of the skill, just in general sailing skill a neat idea I like because sailing such a significant part of game (or feels like it should be and could be with not too many inconceivable changes like upgradeable/customizable boats maybe, and a fishing improvement pass) and it would reward doing it/be a fun thing to level, and get benefits from levelling

speed increase a naturally obvious function of the skill, but so too is mobility, and I'd be 100% content with a mobility only buff

[crimson dock]

Where would the sling be in terms of progression? @pale ocean

Gives me meadows and Black Forest vibes as an alternative to the bow and spear for range

[hexed jewel]

with stones you pick up everywhere as ammo--love it #suggestions message

[crimson dock]

I think it would work best if there’s only one type of sling with 4 upgrades and you upgrade its damage via ammo too

Stone -> bronze or iron pellets -> silver or crystal pellets -> black metal pellets

Probably bronze over iron as iron already has so many uses, or just make them copper like the knife

[tawdry turret]

has the team considered using a discord forum instead of just a channel for #suggestions ? w/ the forum setup there's a more coherent record of a suggestions & the relevant discussions directly nested within each post, & better idea of the relevance/popularity of topics since the forum feature surfaces the most active topics. i ask b/c it's very hard to gauge the actual community sentiment & discussion history around a suggestion in the current format

[crimson dock]

Ideas that are frequently reposted are shown with the repost icon and ideas that are favourable are thumbs up? I’m sure the team has some notes somewhere on frequently requested features and features they’d actually consider implementing that are suggested

[tawdry turret]

yeah i get the point of the emoji, imo from looking at other dev discs the forum implementation is so much better suited for organizing and presenting that information in a meaningful way

[pale ocean]

Early game

[pale ocean]

Actually basically what i had in mind

[kindred pier]

hallo guten tag

[wet drift]

How about narrowing headwind?

[long glacier]

The physics of sails and wind won’t change based on skill at sailing. But being better at turning makes enough sense

[wet drift]

It was a while since I sailed, but it does seem quite reasonable that a more skilled sailor could align their sail better.

Can't narrow it down infinitely ofcourse.

[arctic wharf]

Revealing a larger area of the map while sailing was something one of the mod version of a sailing skill added thatI quite liked a lot. Just made it easier to not leave gaps in the map as I charted it out.

Ofc, I wouldgo for just about anything to increase the radius hahaha... it's so small

[hearty finch]

#suggestions message this would be awesome, imagine for example summoning a support dragon for 5min or a huge aoe explosion from ur position

a lot of the current boss powers feel so underused and could be replaced with this

[lofty wave]

I think some kind of instant effect with a shorter cooldown instead of a 5 min effect with a long cooldown could work for something

[hearty finch]

for example replace moder sailing power with summoning 3-5x drakes to help you

or replace elder power with a bunch of vines being summoned around you, like staff of the wild

stuff like that would come in so clutch in situations in ashlands where u get swarmed

fader power could also for sure be redesigned like this

[lofty wave]

It could spawn his meteors?

[crimson dock]

I think the way the powers should work is have an active power that will help in combat/mobility and then a passive ability that is always active

Like the moder power could always give you wind in your sails but have an active that gives support drakes that are allied only to you

Elder always give you better wood chopping and as an active power give axes a new attack combo or spawn vines around you or something

Eikthyr should stay as it is and as a passive give you say double resources from meadows creatures or something

Fader as a passive should give you say a green fire trail or something

Bonemass as passive give you alliance with blobs and oozes?

[lofty wave]

Support drakes would be too strong as most enemies can't reach them

[cinder needle]

has someone suggested 1 or 2 more map symbols ? like a resource bag, or something else
it just feels a little bit missing 1 or 2, and helps not specifying so much text on dots 🙂

[hearty finch]

ya i like this idea too

[pure vine]

Hey, would it be out of place if the Moder power also forced clear weather and made wind speed strong for its duration?

Blow away fog to sail clearer. Better wind to sail faster. Makes sense to me. Because right now it's so niche, but not that great for its one use. Some powers just have so few use cases

[lofty wave]

Sailing in a storm is fun though

[pure vine]

True, true. Maybe it only stops fog.

[hollow elm]

#suggestions message There's no wall coal-fuelled option either. It's not the first time I've said that it boggles my mind that there wasn't a standard build set that was applicable to each advancement level. Then, each level might have some flavour.

[crimson dock]

Have them be on a timer before they fly away or turn against you lol

[pliant sorrel]

I don’t like the idea of having any animal be your helper for a specific amount of time, doesn’t sit right with me

[hollow elm]

I've implemented a liveable minimum wage, personal and annual leave, plus a pension plan for all the animals I use as helpers.

[pliant sorrel]

Well it wouldn’t be so bad for the animals it seems 😂

[obtuse wolf]

#suggestions message good idea for just the wolf charm the thing it gives not so much

smth it could give instead or just also it buffs ur tamed wolves

[arctic wharf]

I was thinking the same. Like the idea of the charm, but not so much the actual bonuses

@quaint gust try to keep suggestions to one suggestion per post. Can edit the message to fix that... otherwise it gets automatic 👎

Quick slots are pretty unlikely based on the expressed devs desires and opinions, so don't bank on that one ever seeing implementation.

As far as extended tool tips / more information given to the player. 🤔👍 always fine with that myself.

[quaint gust]

I have edited😊👍🏻 info is the big one

[lofty wave]

#suggestions message
Nothing is balanced around having bonemass power

[bleak pebble]

Taking half damage for 5 minutes is huge, two players taking half damage for 10 out of every 20 minutes is going to focus their whole exploration strategy around use of that power and never use anything else

[pale ocean]

@bleak pebble instead of nerfing bonemass into oblivion why not buff the other abilities

[long glacier]

The game isn’t balanced around bonemass buff’s strength, bonemass is really strong but the enemies aren’t unfair without it

[pale ocean]

25% upkeep time is balanced its good enough to be nice but not op buff the elder for one

[long glacier]

In multiplayer where you can chain it for 100% uptime it’s really good, but Eikthyr and queen (for mages) are still good options

[pale ocean]

Yagluth for one needs a buff to not be outdone by potions and lightning resistance is too niche

[grand sable]

hey now nothing else gives you a resistance to eikthyrs attacks 🤯

[pale ocean]

Well armor does actually

[long glacier]

Eikthyr, yagluth, and obliterator are the only sources of lighting damage dealt to players in the game
I think

[vivid schooner]

I keep bonemass on me solely for moments where I'm terribly outnumbered. If you're relying solely on bonemass then that seems more like a skill issue than a balance issue.

[pale ocean]

And fire and frost get beat by potions so i say give yagluth not resistance but immunity to fire frost and poison

[long glacier]

Oh, refined eitr sparks also deal lightning

[crimson dock]

@mellow crater the swamps further from centre tend to be bigger and have more crypts

I have several small swamps on my world on the islands next over from spawn with few or no crypts

But there’s a huge swamp to the bottom left of my world with like 13+ crypts

[vivid schooner]

As he's a sorcerer king what about buffing element damage instead of giving resistance?

[grand sable]

the queen already has the mage power

[long glacier]

He could buff magic, although that would spoil mistlands content
Unless it doesn’t say what it does until the player unlocks magic

[vivid schooner]

Eitr regen yeah, but it doesn't have to be solely .magic

I'm talking all element damage, including that on weapons

[mellow crater]

Yes but is that fair forcing players to go very far on very long journeys with just a Karv ? I go over mountains and plains, to a range I wouldn’t be surprised seeing mistlands in the distance… I don’t think it is intended

[long glacier]

The queen could get her mage power reworked because bugs aren’t known for their sorcerous abilities

[grand sable]

don't need the queen being even more disappointing

[crimson dock]

Well the swamps closest to world centre should be enough for the longship, it’s 10 iron, realistically it should be one of the first things you prioritise when you have iron

[mellow crater]

About forsaken powers :

A previous suggestion was made about forsaken powers : giving them two facets, one for utility and one for fighting. I really liked this idea. I’ll try to find it and quote it here

[long glacier]

Needing to explore is intended

[mellow crater]

The fact is that I have no iron at all

[long glacier]

It could give increased melee damage, health, or stamina regen. Rework, not removal

[crimson dock]

Show a screenshot of your map with crypts visible

[mellow crater]

Of course, and I like it btw. Just sailing half a map in Karv is not really fun

[mellow crater]

No discovered crypt on my map, you want the seed ?

[crimson dock]

I had to sail 20+ minutes to reach my Bonemass swamp from where I planted my base down south but I ended up getting some nice serpent meat so it was worth it and yes send seed

[long glacier]

I usually find a good swamp just a bit out from the elder spawn

[mellow crater]

Okay I’ll send it in 10min

[crimson dock]

My main point is it’s random, you might get lucky with a lot of swamps or you might find none at all, but part of the fun is being rewarded and it is most certainly rewarding to find a huge swamp plentiful in iron after many with no or very little iron

I’m going bed in 10 mins but I’ll check it out in morning, also if you have access to the seed and are growing tired of searching for a swamp with crypts why not use it to find the closest crypts to your base

Also iron nails and longship mats can be transported through portals, smelters are easy to set up in swamps so you could go on a long voyage in a karve and be coming back in a longship once you do finally find the iron

if you are growing tired of spending a lot of time boating there’s always the option to break it up with portalling back to base and doing other things like raiding burial chambers and farming or building or literally anything else even take a break from the game for a bit

[mellow crater]

I am launching the game

I’ll tell you sound, eager to know your opinion on this map. Good night for now

[crimson dock]

You may be right, it might genuinely be terrible for bf -> swamp progression but then you may have lucked out on mountain-> plains

[mellow crater]

Oh I am a ||[censured]|| the two maps post-Hidir are not mine but hosted by friends

Sorry, well I will send it tomorrow then

[mellow crater]

Yeah we found great mountains while sailing. We are just not skilled enough to go inside with troll hide armor 😅

[crimson dock]

No worries, I hope you find the swamps soon and find a good one with plentiful crypts, best of luck to ya

[mellow crater]

Thanks 🙏

He sended it to me!
Seed is PRJzZ4akvj
Oh, and I believe it was created post-Ashlands pre-Bogwitch

Now I go sleeping too.

[pale ocean]

No i like the concept of it its just not good enough and increased damage no matter what would be insanely busted or insanely bad immunity to elemental damage is better

[mellow crater]

Found it :

💡 Split Forsaken Powers into Combat and Utility
Core Concept:

• Each Forsaken Power has a Combat and Utility Power
• You can choose one Combat Power and one Utility Power from any Unlocked Forsaken Boss
• The Cooldowns for Combat and Utility Powers are Separate
• Activating the power would either use a new key binding or a shortcut of the existing binding (Tap "F" for Combat Power, Hold "F" for Utility, as an example)
  Benefits:
• Less frequency with adjusting Forsaken Powers between various activities
• More diversity in power options
• New build options for specific utility combinations
  Power Breakdowns:
  Bellow is the table with the proposed power breakdowns:
  #screenshots message
• Eikthyr's Combat Power would give you a small bonus to stagger, rewarding aggressive attacks to fit the theme of a deer charging head first into combat
• Elder's Combat Power would be like the player could root themselves to the ground; stopping them from being thrown so far back when attacked, keeping them from falling off cliffs and allowing them to more easily counter attack
• Bonemass's Utility Power would work well in all biomes, but specifically the Swamp which is always raining
• Moder's Combat Power would boost non-magic ranged combat, a fitting bonus for a dragon which spends a lot of the time in the air
• Yagluth's Utility Power I struggled with something thematic; Riding is introduced in the plains so it felt appropriate
• Queen and Fader already have powers that split nicely into Combat and Utility
  Drawbacks:
• I acknowledge some Utility Powers still have combat synergy such as Eikthyr giving a bonus to running/jumping. However, I feel the bonuses aren't so great that it would upset the balance
• Adjustments will probably need to be made to existing powers for balance

[arctic wharf]

Immunity to elemental damage is obscenely busted....
Surely I am not the only one to think that 😂
I mean we are talking about immunity, 0 damage taken! No way hahaha

[rose swan]

Oh 100%, immunity is far too strong haha

[vivid schooner]

A small boost to element dmg certainly seems better to me than any form of dmg immunity

[amber wind]

I like the idea of stacking resistances, so you don't get full immunity from using a power or using a potion or piece of equipment, but rather you need to use both or all to stack your resistance. And maybe limiting it to something like 75% max seems reasonable to me.

[arctic wharf]

Not really a big fan of the passive effects added to boss powers btw, or the concept shared with one for active and one for passive at a time. I know I talked about it before, but it doesn't really solve much. It's mostly just some power creep.

Had discussed better options at that time, if you remember 🫡

[mellow crater]

Don’t remember a suggestion of you, what was it ?

[amber wind]

Anything can be balanced to mitigate power creep, it just depends on how it is implemented. I think the idea of giving two different optional powers is more variety.

Or how about if you can either pick the combat power or the utility power...but not both.

[grand sable]

i wish eikthyrs power gave you 100% damage immunity

[lofty wave]

Only 100%? We need MORE

[amber wind]

Heh heh..they have a cheat command for that...

[grand sable]

damage heals you

[arctic wharf]

Aside from each biomes feast givinf major effects (buffs) that compliment it's forsaken power.

I also think we need to shelf the limitation of returning to the stones to change your forsaken powers, and just allow us to change them at any time.
I did make a suggestion for this as well ❤️

[arctic wharf]

Saw this too, and still think it's really not neccessary.

[lofty wave]

We shouldn't be able to change them anywhere. Maybe when we sleep?

[arctic wharf]

I will preface, elder power (and maybe one or two others) could use a bit of tweaking or buffing to be in line with the rest.

[amber wind]

I was kind of against this when I started, but now I'm leaning towards it. Limiting it only once every 30 minutes seems like a good enough restriction that having to trek all the way back to the start just seems like a chore rather than a challenge.

[arctic wharf]

Anywhere... we can already pocket portal back to the stones at any time, so such a change just makes it less of a pain and incentavises swapping as you need or want a power.

There was some limitation ofc, as mentioned in the suggestion

[finite vapor]

I would like a medium sized runestone we can place in our base to change powers at more conveniently rather than watch 40 sec of portals screen everytime i want to change power

[amber wind]

Yeah, same with being able to equip all the utility items simultaneously. (Belt, wishbone, wisplight).

[arctic wharf]

Still too much effort.
Once again, pocket portal is one step off from that (or just a portal in your base).

Truly, best option would be able to just swap right from a UI you can open at any time.

Have to make it convenient to use in the wild, rather than cumbersome.

[amber wind]

Plus it'll create a lot of LOLs when you accidentally swap to Moder's power instead of Bonemass mid fight...OOOPS!

[finite vapor]

Its true and its still balanced since it retains 20m cd when swapped

[arctic wharf]

That would require a few steps I imagine... and a confirmation box if a power is active hahaha

[amber wind]

Nah, that's easy. When the power is activated, it stays activated with a shared CD on all the different boss powers. You can swap, but the currently activated power stays and runs it's duration and then the CD before you activate the new power.

[arctic wharf]

See... if you couldn't already get around that by portal to stones I might agree hahaha.

I think it is better to make it fun to use the system. Not tedious.

If you swap while a power is active, end it's effect immediately. And have each power have their own independent cooldowns, so you can't just swap back and reactivate the power you swapped from.

This leaves no options for abuse. Just the choice to quickly and easily swap powers at any time.

I might toss in having to be out of combat as well, maybe... Just maybe.

[amber wind]

Amusing story time. My friend constantly fat fingered his boss power because it's usually the F key to activate, so he changed it to some other key, but whenever we need him to activate his power, he can never remember what they key he needs to press to activate it. It's kind of amusing how he always uses his power when we need it least, and can never find the right button when we need it the most.

[arctic wharf]

Fun times

[amber wind]

So...swap willy nilly...but you only get 5 minutes of ULTIMATE POWER every 30 minutes (or whatever the CD is)? So you could be fighting a boss that does physical damage and elemental damage, and just swap between Bonemass and Yagluth whenever they wind up for each type of attack? For five minutes at least?

[arctic wharf]

Main thing this change brings is then there really isn't any need to make each power neccessarily equal in terms of potential, as we can easily and more naturally use all of them when their intended scenario for use arises.

(Once again, prefacing that some need a bit of a buff still)

[arctic wharf]

Considering you end the effect when you swap, in theory you could only swap once and lose the first effect. Swapping back would result in the first ability used being on cooldown still and buff gone from both.

[amber wind]

Ah, so separate CDs for each power...

[arctic wharf]

Yep, make it convenient to swap not tedious

But not too abusable, since the CD is kept track of. Still need to wait the 30 mins

[amber wind]

So then you could activate all of them at once, and in a multiparty, everyone would have every ability all the time.

[arctic wharf]

No... if you swap, anyone benefitting from your last power would also lose it.

And if someone wants to troll by going through them all to clear buffs 😂 well, that is someone you just might not want to play with hahaha

[amber wind]

So the active ability overwrites the old active ability, but has a separate cooldown...I see, it is kind of complicated.

[arctic wharf]

Ah... I kinda get what you might mean if a group cycles on up times though. But that is technically already possible with a portal trip.

[arctic wharf]

I wouldn't say overwrite, you just lose it since it's not the ability you have active. Would have to then activate the new one you swapped to fresh if you want it (ofc putting it then on its own CD).

Could alternately just put the requirement that you can't have any ability on cooldown to swap if you want less shenanigans, but I am pretty sure you can already get around that when visiting the stones. 🤔
(A question I need answering haha)

[amber wind]

Yeah, the newly activated power clobbers the old one....overwrites it...and you lose it's effects with the new one. Question: When you activate the new power, does it share the same active up time as the old? Or is it reset to 5 minutes...so you could continuously roll through every power every 5 minutes and always have a power in use (assuming you have enough to outlast the CD.)

[arctic wharf]

No... it does not automatically activate the new one. When you swap you only lose the old one. Poof, gone.

Then, you can choose to activate the new one if you want, fresh, it's own 5 minutes duration and 15 minute cooldown

[amber wind]

So...you swap at 4:59....same thing.

The only thing that changes is the order of operations...activate power...wait 5 minutes, swap power, activate new power...rinse and repeat.

[arctic wharf]

Yes... you lost 1 second of buff time and the ability you swapped from is still on CD for 10 minutes even if you swap back.

[amber wind]

The rules are: 1. you can only have 1 active power at a time. 2. once activated the power has a CD before it can be used again....But how do you handle multiplayer? If I actiavte one power, and my friend activates a 2nd power...does his power overwrite my power? (How does this work in the game currently)?

[arctic wharf]

Can someone for science tell me what happens when you change your power at stones if you have an active one already?
I would most likely mirror that in all seriousness (for the most part).

Yeah, it might be a bit messy but I am sure such occurrences have an existing solution in multiplayer. (For groups running around with duplicate powers)

[amber wind]

I think the powers have a shared CD...so you can activate your "Ultimate" once every 20-30 minutes...and can't activate another one until the CD is in effect...you can swap them, but swapping and activating are 2 separate functions.

I don't recall if you share multiple Ultimates if more than one person activates...I'll have to test this out (or maybe someone can report back). We mostly take the appropriate powers needed for whatever function we are doing, and when one runs out, someone else pops theirs to prolong the duration of it.

[arctic wharf]

Alright, if that is the case the best option might be to just mirror that.
Main goal of the suggestion is to remove the need to portal back to stones really, thus making it feel more convenient to swap powers.

I believe the coolodwn is only 15 minutes btw, so a 33% uptime in solo play 🫡

And thus only needing 3 players for near 100% uptime.

I might be wrong, will check wiki

[amber wind]

Yeah, that's how I was thinking...same system as before except you can swap to whatever power you want whenever you want...but once activated, the power stays and the CD is shared. Also, I believe the CD is 20 minutes which starts as soon as you activate the power so once the 5 minute activation period is done, there is 15 minutes left of the CD before you can use it again.

[arctic wharf]

Ah. Is 20 mins

[amber wind]

For some reason I do think you can have overlapping powers activated if someone activates a different one nearby...but I could be wrong.

[arctic wharf]

You can, that I am 100% certain of.

It is one of a few reasons multiplayer becomes so much easier over solo play

[amber wind]

So, when you have a power activated and swap powers at the stones, the activated power stays activated (for 5 minutes) and the ability is swapped in your interface and they keep the 20 minute CD.

[arctic wharf]

So yeah, I went off on a bit of a tangent haha. In the end, just copying what happens when we would swap at stones already. 🫡

Yep

[amber wind]

So really everyone has the ability to activate 1 power every 20 minutes...and I think this is fine. Letting us swap which power it is without having to run back to the start seems like it would eliminate the chore and not really break the gameplay.

[arctic wharf]

So many just don't realize the power of a pocket portal
Can technically go back to anywhere you have put a portal within less than a minute.

So is not even a trip in existance right now, assuming you know to abuse portals haha

Or
Playing a no portal run, then nvm I guess for those folks

[amber wind]

Choose your power carefully...because you're stuck with it forever! Trust me, I know...

Gets to Boss fight, realizes has Moder ability...3 hours later, returns to boss site.

[arctic wharf]

So many don't realize the pocket portal power, that so many think this is just always the case even with portals in the game. Is a bit silly.

Its why I think having a UI for it would just be leaps and bounds better, and make people feel less locked in and thus upset at the powers that don't really provide much.

[amber wind]

I agree. Keeping the shared CD still limits it's use in gameplay, but removing the need to run back to the stones to swap powers makes using the other powers that have more of a niche use less of a chore.

[granite geyser]

#suggestions message

Why would we go to other worlds? The game is literally named VALHEIM, not "the 10 worlds of Norse mythology", that means the game should be completely set in VALHEIM

Furthermore, the game is already infinitely replayable as it currently is (not being finished), so "infinite potential" as in "more reasons to replay it" doesn't make sense, it literally already is

[fleet lintel]

For once I agree with your suggestion and the logic behind it.

[short hemlock]

why cant i post a suggestion

[stiff stag]

Add a 💡 at the start of the post, and read the pinned message in #suggestions for more information.

[short hemlock]

i have that at the start

[rose swan]

10 worlds, 9 biomes each. 90 biomes. One fist weapon.

[stark furnace]

erm actually it's two 🤓

[grand sable]

dude 10 worlds with 9 biomes would be fucking diabolical

....it sounds kinda awesome

how would the progression go

valheim > midgard > vanaheim > alfheim > jotunheim > niflheim > muspelheim > helheim > asgard

@short hemlock what is the word 'chiral'

i feel like upvoting your own suggestion is a little bit iffy 😭

[short hemlock]

if people look at the vote totals, not upvoting myself just undercuts my suggestion

[short hemlock]

chiral means an item that cannot be superimposed on its mirror image. like your hands are chiral, the left hand and the right hand cannot be superimposed over eachother due to their mirror symmetry

[arctic wharf]

I always vote on my own suggestions 😂 because I vote on eeeeeeevery suggestion hahaha

[granite geyser]

And impossible

[short hemlock]

I agree with more worlds, but not 10, and not 9 biomes each

no midgard or asgard, although a portal to asgard being an endgame credit sequence trigger would work well

[stiff stag]

More worlds do not belong period. That is not what this game is nor is it ever what it will be.

Yeah, an end credits sequence featuring valhalla (the final destination of the character) is the only way the concept fits in any way.

[arctic wharf]

I disagree with more worlds... because valheim has taken a very long time and still isn't done yet (geting there). How many more years do you expect them to keep working on this game? The answer is, far more than the devs ever would want to... as they seem to be eager to reach 1.0 and move onto their next project.

[stiff stag]

More worlds would be a project for modders (since it doesn't belong as part of the base game regardless of how much time and effort it would take), assuming that's a feat that can even be done.

[short hemlock]

it wouldnt be as hard or long. they could recycle the world generation code, just replace textures, models, and adjust the drop tables. the best thing would be entering a new world would destroy the old one, no going back

[grand sable]

technically....says who

what timeframe given, what system requirements, i'm sure it is entirely possible

[grand sable]

same thing could be said for minecraft or world of warcraft which are ongoing ongoing ongoing and even more ongoing and it works totally fine and everyone is happy

and the chances i give more than 20% of a shit about the next project is low because valheim specifically is in my top games and the only reason i might buy another game would be to support iron gate, not because i have any interest

[rose swan]

Well, Minecraft is a complete game, and world of Warcraft is a live service game- it’s a good deal different I think

[arctic wharf]

They are pretty incomparable.

One is a game perpetuated by company greed...
And the other is, well technically the same but also an MMO and the valheim devs always love to point out that valheim is NOT and MMO

They just want to bring valheim to a nice conclusive end, and then start their next project. 🤷‍♂️ nothing wrong with that imo.

[rose swan]

Agreed!

Now that Minecraft has micro transactions, it definitely puts it in a different league.

[stark furnace]

minecraft has mtx now ???

no shot

[rose swan]

It’s like skins and some other content I think? Only in the bedrock edition as far as I know.

[grand sable]

minecraft also have a conclusive end, the end dragon, in the end.

but it doesn't mean that content is constantly added...although i guess it is mostly building and random animals and cosmetics

[grand sable]

noone plays bedrock

[wet drift]

A lot of people do. Most of them just don't have a valid reason to.

[graceful osprey]

good thing i play vintage story

[wet drift]

Regarding the above discussion. Minecraft has arguably reached content bloat. Personally I think 1.16 was the last entirely positive update.
Obviously it would be possible for Valheim to get there, but I find it way more likely that it will end up undercooked. The game would likely benefit from a couple more years than it's likely going to get, in terms of polish and cohesion once it's vertically complete.

[arctic wharf]

Minecraft does not really have a super conclusive end if you ask me... and most of the content coming out now is like scraps.
The real meat and potatoes is mods... lots and lots of mods.

[arctic wharf]

Hyped for this next update 🥳

[graceful osprey]

it already happened tho

[arctic wharf]

Oop, it's out? Moving living situation right now, so I guess it slipped by me.

Yippee

[graceful osprey]

yeah The Journey, has a trailer out already showcasing everything

[stiff stag]

It's impossible for the next update to have already happened because it would no longer be the next update.

[arctic wharf]

I did see that, just didn't see what the actual live date was.
(Sips juice)

[graceful osprey]

coincidentally the long dark also had a recent major update too

may my survival craft game addiction never cure itself

[arctic wharf]

Good time for indi games. So many good ones that there is always another update for one of them right around the corner.

[grand sable]

the end is the end where you fight the end thing, it doesn't mean gameplay stops

[arctic wharf]

I mean... I guess, but is the end even really the end for minecrafts intended gameplay? Could rush it in less than a day, and then spend months just occupying yourself with other random faff.

Also not the end once you use as many mods as I have

[wet drift]

It doesn't have an end to it's story, because the story is something you make in your mind.
What it does have is a furthest place to go.

[arctic wharf]

I am assuming valheims "end" will feel far more like a proper conclusion to this long long chain of progression and rather simple yet challanging quest. 🫡

[wet drift]

I am curious what they will do with it. I have to imagine we will be able to keep playing, and the game doesn't really have a lot of story elements to conclude. I honestly wouldn't even be surprised if it was just handled like any other boss death.

It would be cool if we got dialogue with the Odin shadow or something. Then get something to unlock literal god gear. Not as a boss drop, but as a gift. Then back to playing the game.

[fleet lintel]

They have already said you still be able to keep building and running around your world after the last boss, haven’t they?

[pale ocean]

@olive yacht fader is not weak you probably just play the game too seriously

[grand sable]

hi loafy

[olive yacht]

he isn't weak, his spells are really strong, its just that his mele hits are weak, taking 20 dmg from a mele hit just because you have harnesk is feeling like a cheat code

[arctic wharf]

I believe so, but it seems like the way they worded it that you either stay and continue in the world, or end that play through for whatever final ending. 🤔

Makes me want to see whatever the final end is, but than still continue

Nothing is certain off, that's just how it sounded.

[stark furnace]

50% of all copies sold are bedrock edition so ??

[languid ibex]

Yeah but they try it and then purchase java 👈 👈

[grand sable]

i dont believe u

[stark furnace]

you forget that mobile is bedrock edition, mobile gaming is huge

[graceful osprey]

bedrock autosaves get me killed so much

[grand sable]

mobile gamers dont exist, they're not real gamers 🙂‍↔️

[arctic wharf]

Mobile games... scoff

[pale ocean]

Hi obi

[grand sable]

idr how to refer to u, lad or lass. 🧐

[crimson dock]

Good morning! So I had a look at the seed and there is atleast one crypt on spawn island surprisingly and an absolutely stacked swamp ||south|| of spawn and taking a look at the generation there is a meadows biome surrounded completely by mountains which in theory sounds like an amazing base spot depending on the generation also in the world somewhere

[grand sable]

@pale ocean alivenate

[pale ocean]

OH either is fine

Whatever makes you comfortable sorry i was busy

[grand sable]

iiii 🧐 .....don't know what to do with something like that

[pale ocean]

What do you think i am

[grand sable]

I lean towards male because everyone online is and everyone who says otherwise is a trap 😌

[pale ocean]

A smart assumption

If its important ig i have balls I'm not really attached to titles though whatever you wanna call me i dont mind

[grand sable]

i will call you bean

that was the question i wondered essentially i just don't do english good and the only way to pose that question that came to mind was "what are you" and that sounded like i was inquiring to an alien what they were.

i am generally autistic 🧡

[pale ocean]

Same i also have autism i just let people see me the way they want.

[grand sable]

awesome sauce

i'll just imagine you as the girl in your pfp then 🐦

[amber wind]

You don't even need a mod for this...just make a world build called Asgard, Valhala, etc. and join it. Problem solved.

[granite geyser]

@lofty mountain

1. There are only 2m beams, that would be redundant

2. Hold shift

3. not possible

4. #suggestions message

[mellow crater]

Really? On the spawn island ? I am surprised, we went all around, having a single small swamp west (empty). We’ll double check then. Also, happy to hear there is a big swamp somewhere, thanks you 👍

[hollow elm]

#suggestions message Well thought out, I like it. 🙂

[crimson dock]

Unless world seed viewer is outdated I did see a crypt on the south swamp

[lofty wave]

https://valheim.fandom.com/wiki/Treasure_chest
@eternal jolt

[granite geyser]

@noble parcel

#suggestions message

[noble parcel]

made a list, my bad XD was just vibing after watching the stream talking about deep north

got excited

[hollow elm]

#suggestions message @still vapor I feel you, but this is a fail-safe. Accidentally destroying your ship in the middle of the ocean is catastophic.

[vivid schooner]

Yep. Why i hate that I can accidentally smoke it with my sword

[still vapor]

But destroyable onyl w workbencj

[vivid schooner]

Or arrows, or w/e

[still vapor]

You wont be able to delete it without workbecnh nearby

[hollow elm]

Fair. I dunno then. Carts are the same.

[obtuse wolf]

having some way to break objects like that would be nice over having to just hit it a bunch with ur weapon

and the requirement of workbench would make it harder to accidently destroy it

[eternal jolt]

It says those chests are purely decorative, they would need to be functional. And I would wish for larger chests to be buildable

[lofty wave]

We have black metal chests with an inventory the size of a player’s. Do we need anything bigger?

[boreal iris]

Holy cringe

[granite geyser]

And are made of one of the easiest materials to gather

[languid ibex]

The inventory size is perfect, I wouldn't mind an "advancement" in the size of the chest though, perhaps a slightly larger barrel

[vivid schooner]

Fr, only reason to use anything besides chests is for decoration. Would be nice if it was also functional.

[granite geyser]

@halcyon cypress @eager jungle

Did any of you think of going to settings and check for the language options to see if the game made by a SWEDISH company had the Swedish language?

[halcyon cypress]

i’m well aware that the company is Swedish BUT on Xbox it is not added so idk add it lol because it’s on PC, i have been without this feature since i started playing on xbox and it would be nice to see it be added atleast on xbox one

[granite geyser]

Hmmm...

If that's the case, my bad. It's... Very strange that one of the official/main languages is not on console, I assume it must be because the port was done by another company

[halcyon cypress]

I thought so aswell when i first learned that my friends have it ( PC) while i don’t (XBOX)

[stiff stag]

#suggestions message You can already hide map pins by right clicking the ones in the legend. Only thing missing is a toggle for non-player placed pins. I don't see any need for a toggle all button though when the option to hide each individual one already exists.

[grand sable]

flametal chests 😎

with one whole extra awkwardly placed slot

[lofty wave]

An equipment slot?

[grand sable]

i seriously just want to make everything out of ashwood & flametal

[grand sable]

yeah you can put a hat on it

[lofty wave]

Then people can stop asking

[grand sable]

bro are discord slow mode seconds like mississipi seconds or what??? i'm going to go feral

[lofty wave]

They seem like normal seconds to me

But I’m very tired so idk

[grand sable]

Big ree

[simple hound]

Teacher time

2 minutes left before end of exam. 30 seconds later - pencils down

[grand sable]

i am so so used to sending like two messages back to back in my normal texting, this server hurts me mr moderator 🙁

[simple hound]

RIP

Hospital taxi?

[grand sable]

yes

[lofty wave]

Just send one message then edit it for the second
Like this - two messages

All within the slow mode timer

[granite geyser]

@finite moss

And the last one is not a suggestion. You could've asked here

[finite moss]

On xbox?

[pale ocean]

Yes

[lofty field]

Yes, there is a legend at the bottom if the screen. I think its D-Right.
The only things you can't toggle off are the trader icons

[tawdry ibex]

#suggestions message
If you have to go against the wind (say, you're carrying a bunch of ores back home on a boat pre-Ashlands) having the option would be quite handy, and saves a lot of time.

[crimson dock]

Actually goated suggestion

[finite moss]

Elder power is shit anyway just take it as it is

[arctic wharf]

Have it also give a small chance for extra wood to drop when breaking a log, and boom we all good.

By small I mean like... 25% btw.
Not looking for some slot machine level RNG

[lofty wave]

Why can't it be 25% extra wood instead?

Like what the world modifier does

[arctic wharf]

🤔 just depends how strong people (mostly the devs) think that is. Wouldn't see me complaining

Oh, and 0.001% chance of Lord of the Trees axe dropping

[granite geyser]

What would be the point of getting loot from destroying/killing things?

More RNG and especially encouraging engaging in RNG is the opposite of fun

And what would you do if you had more of the same item if every player already has it? A waste of space?

[arctic wharf]

Is that... directed at my more meme messages above?

Its also not exactly loot from killing things, it's wood from trees - added to the elder forsaken power which makes chopping trees a little bit easier (and that's all currently).

Flat buff all good too when I am realistically thinking about it and not joking about haha

[granite geyser]

You have discussed about getting loot from killing enemies. Having thought about something similar out of nowhere sounds like something you would say unironically

[arctic wharf]

Idk, what you are even referring to

[granite geyser]

#suggestion-discussion message

[arctic wharf]

I would hope that axe bit at the end is also extremely obviously a joke.

Ah, that was more spitting random ideas around as far as what might make sense with earlier magic sources.
Don't personally care about that one either. 🫡

I remember toomuchdog also having some nice ideas tossed into the convo, just for funsies 🌟

[fleet lintel]

He has a generational predisposition to pay-as-you. It’s not his fault. He can’t help it

Subscriptions and addictive grindy mechanics are part of his identity

[arctic wharf]

Had not heard of the term pay-as-you(-go?) Until now

Am quite anti addictive content for the sake of it. Too many abusive and scummy practices devised for corporate greed...

Rather, I am a believer that anything added to games should be in service of providing the most fun experience possible. Given that a game is really fun, the money and success will naturally follow.
No exceptions.

[sterile swan]

Is it normal that from the bog witch we see the damage numbers extremely far? I have a pvp server and it doesn't like for stealth

Same (for the healt tip, etc...)

[pale ocean]

Yea i guess i didnt think it would be hated so much 😭

[mellow crater]

Loafy, please and in your suggestion « cheese made with greydwarf eyes as an ingredient » xD

[pale ocean]

We already have eyescream which is basically frozen thin butter so

Ok

[mellow crater]

Thank you !

[rose swan]

🥛 🧀

[pale ocean]

Bro doesnt want cheese

[lofty wave]

We don't need more food in black forest

[vivid schooner]

@stiff cave wisp torches exist, it wouldn't be as free floating ofc, but still give it that magical look

[stiff cave]

yeah the wisplights are good, they just don't give the look I want

and I mean I could use the fountains for a dancing wisp look but I would rather use it in tandem with wisplight armor stands for peak wisping

[onyx chasm]

is there any works on a Arachnophobia mode? i love valheim and i have a friend who loves viking but he hates spiders

[lofty wave]

There aren’t any spiders in valheim.

[onyx chasm]

i saw some gameplay in the mistlands

[lofty wave]

There are no spiders in mistlands

[onyx chasm]

was it a mod?

[lofty wave]

Probably

[onyx chasm]

ah nice, thanks!

[arctic wharf]

You have bugs... which are far closer to cockrouches.
There are no spiders in valheim, but I know of a mod that used to add spiders waaaaaaaasay back before the mistlands was ever officially added

[onyx chasm]

it's this video i saw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PByHbE1eWYU&t=42s

[arctic wharf]

Arachnophobos are some of the loudest scaredy-cats...

That's the mod yeah. 🫡

[onyx chasm]

o nuts, some cool mods

[rose swan]

I don’t want cheese made from greydwarf eyes 😅

[vivid schooner]

What kind of eyes should we make it from then?

[lofty wave]

Cheese from greydwarf eyes would be like harder, warmer eyescream. It can’t be that bad

[vivid schooner]

Seeing as lox are livebirth missed opportunity for Lox Milk.

[hexed jewel]

lox cannot decide if they're reptilian or mammalian

if the former, missed opportunity to make the mount infinitely more usable as a mount by having it lay eggs

if the latter, missed opportunity for lox milk

[rose swan]

I think the deep north provides a really good opportunity for milk and cheese 🤔

[boreal iris]

Molk🥛🤍

[rose swan]

Mulk?

[arctic wharf]

Funny enough, animal milk is not great for you and does not help you get strong bones

[rose swan]

I’ve been a milk drinker my whole life, my bones seem pretty solid to me 👀

[arctic wharf]

I still drink milk too though not fond of it alone, hot chocolate is the king!

[eternal wyvern]

Sure, milk for calcium might work - but have you tried crunching through eggshells?

[fleet lintel]

wtf are you talking about?

[arctic wharf]

The concept of milk helping grow strong bones is age old advertising propagated by time... because it makes milk sell

At best you will likely see it as (debated) because ofc it would be...

Not to claim all milk is so terrible you shouldn't eat it, but many of the chemicals in the U.S. don't help for most foods.

[vivid schooner]

Nope, but you can add em to your favorite sauces pretty easily.

Toast em in the oven to remove the linings and grind em into a fine powder, also nice for your plants.

[crimson dock]

Wonder if deep north will have tameable or be more like mistlands with no tames

[stiff cave]

technically we do have tames in the form of skeletts

I love my skelett friends :)

(they die every 2 seconds)

[rose swan]

If we do, I hope it’s not a big one

[granite geyser]

@odd pasture

https://store.steampowered.com/app/2059530/Dawn_of_Defiance/

[arctic wharf]

TAmeable goats please 🐐

[olive yacht]

i think all goats can be timed, that's more a matter of whether you have a stopwatch around

[lofty wave]

Stopwatches please?

Not sure why we’d need to time goats

[olive yacht]

well to figure out which one's the fastest...at something

[lofty wave]

https://tenor.com/view/animal-animals-sliding-goat-ice-gif-4474197

[rose swan]

Goat Olympics

[olive yacht]

that's gonna be the real 1.0 update

[boreal iris]

I love mölk

[arctic wharf]

Hahaha, woopsie

Dang autocorrect

Canoe has a fast rowing speed, but only a rowing speed 😎

• make it have a tighter turn radius and boom, perfect boat for very short trips and river travel.

Bonus points if we can pick it up and carry it above our heads at a small deficit to move speed...

[quartz oriole]

YES!

[barren oasis]

If they add milk it should come from lox since they're literally half ox and as such should have milk and it would give a good reason to actually take the time to tame them

[lofty wave]

@ember mesa What mass?

[arctic wharf]

By mass you mean carry weight as a mechanic?

@ember mesa

[pliant sorrel]

@ember mesa #suggestions message
what mass?

[barren oasis]

Bonemass?

[pliant sorrel]

I was thinking bonemass too but idk

[arctic wharf]

Totally want over my head... if they are referring to bonemass, which is fine

Though technically all bosses could use a bit of TLC

[pliant sorrel]

What does TLC mean..? 😅

[arctic wharf]

Tender loving care

AKA, give time to better something with good intentions

[rose swan]

The M A S S

Also, don’t really see the need for adding new food items in the plains- or really any biome at this point. Would much rather see milk in the Deep North 🤔 on a side note… so much talk about milk recently lol

[wet drift]

Not sure just how deep the north will be, but I'm not really sure how it would fit.

If they wanted to have it exist as a DN tier ingredient, I'd much rather have the animal in an earlier zone, but only make it tameable by feeding it some DN resource.

My main reason I wouldn't want it in general is that recipes already exist that probably would use milk, but would be too annoying if it was needed.

[fleet lintel]

Calcium and vitamin D both aid bone density. None of this research is disputed. Milk is usually fortified with both of these in the US, in addition to being naturally high in calcium. I think you need to learn how to parse research

But if you want to link a study or literature review you believe to be reputable which finds that milk causes “bone erosion” I’m happy to read it

[arctic wharf]

https://med.stanford.edu/news/all-news/2018/08/christopher-gardner-busts-myths-about-milk.html

[fleet lintel]

From the article you just linked “Studies have shown that drinking milk can improve your bone density”

That doesn’t say anything controversial. Just that people don’t “need dairy milk” which no one really contends that they do?

[versed sonnet]

But Arnold said in a very funny accent "milk is for babies!" 😤

it must be just AWFUL!

but yeah that article just says you don't need milk for healthy bones and that physical activity is a contender for bone health.

[arctic wharf]

I am busy atm...

[wet drift]

I mean...milk has the materials. But it's a bit like saying meat helps growing strong muscles.

(Although to be fair, calcium deficiency might be more common than protein deficiency.)

Just play some volleyball while you're young!

[arctic wharf]

The main place I would like to cite is a documentary actually, but too busy atm. Will later 🫡

Nothing is all bad or good ofc... but why do you think they artificial add the vitamins and such.

Is pretty off topic for valheim as well, sooo not wanting to get into such a debate too much ye.

Not in this chat at least.

[wet drift]

I mean, added vitamins are still vitamins. As for why they add it to milk in particular, I have no idea.

Perhaps since people consider it healthy, adding more health-stuff appeals to the market.

Alternatively it could be that milk and those vitamins should be consumed proportionally. Similarly to Iodized salt.

[grand sable]

omg this is still being talked about

[arctic wharf]

Yeeee, fret not, won't drag this on in this chat further.

[grand sable]

blah blah blah....idk what anyone concluded, but milk is tasty shut up. 😾

[grand sable]

beecause i think that too much calcium alone without vitamin D is bad for you and can lead to calcification in the body itself and vitamin D breaks down those molecules i believe so the body can actually absorb and benefit from it.

[arctic wharf]

Because it's tasty is why America has a severe obesity problem. So many just don't care whats in the food 😂

Surely no one would deny that.

[grand sable]

yeah but thats not milk specifically, theres things that milk gets added to that is unhealthy, we eat eye scream in valheim already.

[arctic wharf]

👁️😱 = yummy!

On a different more relevant note, still don't know what the Mass is that one suggestion wants removed.

[finite vapor]

Bonemass?

[arctic wharf]

.
Also I would think a healing weapon (as long as it cam self heal too) would be fine and fun in some ways. Just needs some way to balance it out more.

Don't let it be too spammable.
Needs a somewhat hefty cost. (Evem if it's just a decent chunk of your magic bar)
Perhaps something to make it more interesting than just a click = heal.

[arctic wharf]

One of the things we were speculating, but that's just an assumption.

[grand sable]

the staff of protection is already kinda slow....its exciting enough to try and bubble your buds

[finite vapor]

Healing wep would make the meads useless and magic is already overpowered enough

[grand sable]

no not really...theres a cooldown on meads, and the healing would not affect you so it would be useless if you didn't have an ally

cuz i mean....obviously a healing weapon would be blood magic

[finite vapor]

Why would they implement a purely support weapon when they balance the game around single player. Theres a reason we cant row the boat faster with 2 ppl

[grand sable]

i think if it was a slow focused effect rather than a burst of healing too it wouldn't be all that op....

[grand sable]

skeletts, tamed animals.

[finite vapor]

You can already bubble them, healing tames can be done by feeding iirc

[stark furnace]

idk there's really no place for a healing staff in valheim

and it doesn't really classify under blood magic either because all blood magic skills actively take away and sap your health idk

[fleet lintel]

Yeah, so here’s the thing, when you spout nonsense like “milk causes bone erosion” and someone with osteoporosis reads it and believes you and stops consuming an important calcium source, then what you have done has caused harm so you don’t get just get to say “oh now I don’t want to talk about it anymore” because your idiocy is being debunked.

[grand sable]

yeah....and give it to someone else.

[grand sable]

bubbling constantly is expensive, it would make the idea of a support class more eitr efficient if you could also slowly heal from behind the lines.

and additionally i am 90% certain that in the deep north, seeing as the dead raiser is not max level, there will be another kind of summon weapon...and/or more tamed animals, this could be a viable thing.

[stark furnace]

bubbling constantly is expensive because you shouldn't be bubbling constantly, it's the punishment for your bubble getting popped what is this

[stark furnace]

wdym the dead raiser isn't maxed level you can upgrade it to quality 4?

[grand sable]

in the ashlands no?

what, why did i put that not there, ignore that.

[stark furnace]

yea

[grand sable]

because the dead raiser is max level i think there could be another summon weapon, that isn't big fucking rage murder demon.

[stark furnace]

I'd rather not we get more bloat

Make a unique and interesting twist on the summon mechanic again like the summoned troll and i'm cool with it but a deadraiser2.0 is uninteresting

[grand sable]

there's literally only one real loyal minion summon, if two is considered bloat then jesus...

I come from modded terraria...you don't know bloat 😅

[stark furnace]

Oh i've played mmo after mmo I know exactly what bloat is

[grand sable]

then the scale we're talking about isn't bloat....i think sometimes ideas for games are not safe enough....should we not get another sword in the deep north because we've already gotten swords for most other biomes? no, that would make me incredibly sad, i do want more.

i liked the trolstav but when i saw that was pretty much it for blood magic i was like....wut....why wasn't there another blood magic weapon, elemental magic got three weapons...

[stark furnace]

Thing is, deadraiser doesn't really need a 2.0 option, it can summon 4 skeletons, all of which can be bubbled,which provide major distraction AND dps

Which imo if they were to add a deadraiser2.0 in the deep north, it'd be equivalent to an iron sword, and an iron sword that does the exact same thing

[grand sable]

something that summons only one thing, and that creature gets upgraded per each level, that deals more damage but is squishier, hows that...i noticed that skeletts against warriors did fuck all.

[stark furnace]

That just tells me you don't have a great understanding of how to use the weapon to it's best abilities idk

you don't just summon them and let them go off and kill things you work together as a team, for warriors what you wanna do is charge in with himmin, stagger the warrior, then let the skeletts get damage in while the warrior is staggered

[grand sable]

oh PFFFT

I don't do hybrids 🥴

[stark furnace]

using himmin on mage is literally not even close to being a hybrid

[grand sable]

It is entirely so, It doesn't use eitr, Not for me baby.

[stark furnace]

mages have both stamina and eitr should use both options if you want to be the best you can what is this

"I actively limit my own options and then complain about when something isn't good (in the playstyle where I nerf it's abilities) and want a new version of it"

[grand sable]

in the ashlands i use 3 eitr, mistlands is 2 eitr one stamina.

i mean....melee weapons, ranged weapons, and other magic weapons don't need to be supplemented with other random bullshit for them to be remotely good.....

[stark furnace]

3eitr foods gives you like 100 stamina which is more than enough for one himmin swing

[grand sable]

i see people running nothing but the staff of the wild.

[stark furnace]

because staff of wild is absurdly broken op

[stark furnace]

valheim is all about using the tools and preparation you have to be successful

[grand sable]

If the dead raiser is not viable without another weapon then i think its a bad weapon and more like a tool to keep enemies distracted 🫠

[arctic wharf]

A weapon that doesn't have any positive effect for you is already a no go since it lacks use in singleplayer.

Healing tames... maybe? But only as useful as the tames might be ans also that they don't die too quickly.

[stark furnace]

It's more than viable without himmin

You can nuke the queen in 60 seconds with proper use of the deadraiser (where you don't even use himmin 😱 )

[grand sable]

Now that sounds like cheese if i ever heard it

[stark furnace]

nope, just staff of embers and proper set up with deadraiser

[arctic wharf]

Um, bruh. Too busy with other stuff RN. Also am mostly referring to cows milk and your common mass produced variety. 🫡
Can get into this later in some PMs if you like (friendly discussion), but not for this chat room haha.

[grand sable]

if you were doing a build with skeletts it would certainly have use.

[arctic wharf]

Until skelets get torn to shreds too fast to get healed.

Admittedly I have not extensively used the dead raiser, so not super familiar with how tanky they may or may not be.

[grand sable]

don't let them do that 👽

Lets say, Hypothetically, They get hurt, then bubble bubble broken, You bubble them and then use mana to heal them while bubbled, then they're more useful if their bubble is broken again.

[arctic wharf]

If they are anything like tames though, I can see them being outscaled decently quickly...

[grand sable]

outscaled by what....i see people using two star askvin to fight fader

[arctic wharf]

Hmmm, well it just depends really if they can survive at least one hit that dwalt damage to thwir health theoretically.

Bubble is so much stronger because the damage it absorbs can scale with skill level above the actual health total of your skelets

[stark furnace]

yea and like 100 of them

[arctic wharf]

I was talking about the skelets... btw.
Askvin have the best chance of not being outscaled because DN is not a thing yet

[tawdry ibex]

#suggestions message
Time to guess what Smiffe's gonna say about this one ...

Also, quick insertion about the protection bubble spell: that thing is incredibly busted.

[grand sable]

mostly

[tawdry ibex]

It's honestly better than tank gear, which doesn't seem fair.

[arctic wharf]

Damage prevention is better than damage recovery (healing) 9 times out of 10.... and it prevents a loooot of damage if you sink some time to get grindy with the blood magic skill.

[tawdry ibex]

If you're hit by a powerful shot, the shield just breaks.
Attempting to parry something like that can get you either stunned or killed even with 2 health food and insane armor.

[stark furnace]

Yes reminder staff of protection can block 28trillion damage at once

[grand sable]

oh its amazing, until you run out of mana as a mage and have a cooldown on eitr potions.

[tawdry ibex]

actual satire (I don't think you can, to be honest)

[stark furnace]

Remember how you learn proper stamina management? Same applies to proper eitr management

[grand sable]

i know i know i know

It happens to me, because mana regen is not instantaneous and i have a limited supply, and without that bubble i feel fucking terrified as a mage in the ashlands.

[arctic wharf]

That should be the ideal situation... making it not a forever abusable thing. Actual implementation though not so ideal.

[stark furnace]

Mage actually has crazy armor, don't lean into it but it's actually not half bad

[grand sable]

This was especially horrible during a fortress attack where my friend broke the front gate and well he's new he died right away....and i found that somehow i couldn't get away from the ballistas line of sight, or the twitchers rocks, or the marksmans arrows....and i saw my bubble break again and again and i saw my health getting lower and lower...

[tawdry ibex]

The problem here is there really isn't a playstyle that's equivalent to mage bubble for tanks. Kinda makes getting the armor for it worthless.

[arctic wharf]

Bubble staff brings back nightmares of discipline priests in world of warcraft arena pvp.

[stark furnace]

trueeee

[grand sable]

I just like to take a middle ground in most arguments, The bubble staff does not ensure victory, Its really good but i feel it sounds like some people are overconfident.

"Just don't use your mana up" 🗿

[arctic wharf]

That's true of almost everything
If bubble staff truly made you 100% immortal, it would see nerfs.

[grand sable]

just because i know how to manage stamina more than 1200 hours ago doesn't mean i don't sometimes almost fucking die because i run out of it.

[tawdry ibex]

The problem with this though: Bubble staff is really fun and you have to time when to start it again once you lost it. I don't see nerfing the thing would make things more fun for anyone.
You still die if you time it wrong (say, you call it too close to enemy archers, not looking around for people stabbing ya before calling it ...)

It's just that you don't see those dynamics being executed well enough for tanks.

[grand sable]

charred projectiles seem to whittle away at it surprisingly fast, and without flametal armour...that shit kinda hurts.

[arctic wharf]

Not a complete replacement of armor, never. Still need to survive the one (maybe two) hits that might get through the shield.

Nothing matters if you get 1 shot.

[grand sable]

like just a starred twitcher or marksman really hurts with embla armour

[stark furnace]

It's still ridiculous that you can block lord reto with the bubble but can't block him through parrying, the parrying power of the bubble needs to be addressed, and the fact that it can take a infinite amount of damage

[tawdry ibex]

Parry is the closest thing tanks have to the bubble, but it's not really executed right.

[arctic wharf]

Just need excess damage when shield pops to seep through to your health.
And yeah, parrying in valheim is a little bit scuffed.

[grand sable]

i don't think it should be changed that it can take infinite damage, a shield breaking i feel like would repel an attack...like i assume logically you're meaning if something is so strong it cleaves through the bubble and you like butter?...

skeletron surprise in the mistlands....whats the threshold for raids? i literally have a workbench and a chest and some wisplights lmao...

[tawdry ibex]

I'd change Parries so that you can survive insane damage being dealt to you, but the staggered meter should go to like ... 99% (depends on the damage you take, but up to 99%) to let you at least get out of the situation.
And it acts as a cooldown similar to the bubble's casting time, since trying to parry when you have the stagger bar visible would always get you killed. Similar to getting hit while trying to cast the bubble.

You'd need to experiment further and tweak this as you go, but it's a good start off point.

[tawdry ibex]

Armor helps you out here by lowering the damage you take, thus lowering the resulting stagger meter received on perfect parry if the damage dealt to you is too big, so you can parry again quicker if you need to.
Tanks often play the game in a more simpler way than other classes, so adding any more tactical depth to it than that would not be great I think.

[fleet lintel]

Um, bruh, if you were actually busy you wouldn’t be on discord.

You’re welcome to PM me, but if your source is some documentary and you don’t have any scholarly research, it’s probably because the documentary is a bunch of bs. @arctic wharf

[tawdry ibex]

I was about to say: No idea who you were responding to here, cause I'm honestly confused.

[fleet lintel]

It was a reply but I’m also trying to get my toddler ti go to sleep so I guess the reply tag timed out

[grand sable]

there are alot of things processes and chemicals nowadays i don't trust, but i feel like a valheim context would have unpasteurised raw milk....which would have its own risks and its own merits.

[fleet lintel]

I don’t think fallen Vikings have to worry about brucellosis

[grand sable]

Well its not purely infections, I hear things about like blood and pus in some raw milk, It seems fine for some people but it sounds kinda yucky.

[fleet lintel]

If the cows utters or milk glands were infected but that would be pretty obvious to whomever was milking the cow I’d imagine though

#suggestions message the dvergr mages already have a healing spell they use on themselves quite effectively. Could just be a less broken version of that

[arctic wharf]

Some amounts of blood in milk is pretty common... and most the time fine. Even for humans.

[grand sable]

yeahh but it makes me feel weird about milk 🥴

[grand sable]

its a very divisive subject it seems

[fleet lintel]

Well no, again, it’s never “normal” to have blood in milk without trauma or infection in whatever is lactating.

[arctic wharf]

It was a pretty lengthy documentary, citing sources. But if that wouldn't be enough to pose decent credibility, then 🤷‍♂️
Wouldn't expect my word alone online to be taken at face value ofc. Smart not to take anyone's word without the proof.

[arctic wharf]

Didn't say normal, just common. And it usually won't pose any harm for nursing infants, even if it looks off. (Pink)
Coming from trauma ofc, as you also mentioned.

[grand sable]

i believe everything every one of you is saying including myself 😎

[fleet lintel]

I can dig through the documentaries sources, I’ve vetted plenty of research before. But people doing legitimate medical research don’t have to make sensationalized documentaries

[arctic wharf]

Infection though, idk as much about that but would imagine it is obviously possibly harmful

[fleet lintel]

If an infant bites a nipple and ingests blood, no, it likely won’t cause additional harm to the infant, assuming there is nothing harmful in the mother’s blood that isn’t already being vertically transmitted to her milk. But to say blood won’t cause any harm to infants, when mixed with anything is a pretty irresponsible claim.

[arctic wharf]

Can dig it up tomorrow and send it your way (if you like). Promise I am not pulling it from nothing though to senselessly win an argument / debate

Is 1 AM here (almost), legit. Was also just busy with some work IRL but tryna hop back into convo as I could.

[arctic wharf]

I said usually.
A little bit mixed in usually is not harmful. But there can be other factors at play, just as you pointed out.

[fleet lintel]

I don’t really feel like you can meaningfully compare the utility of the bubble shield to parrying.

[grand sable]

i use both as a mage, its fun.

[fleet lintel]

The bubble shield you can cast ahead of time to absorb a few blows. If you’re trying to rebubble mid fight you’re probably going to die

While parrying a utility is only while in combat.

And your bubble takes so much eitr that if you are recasting it, you’re severely limiting the amount of damage you can do with your spells

Meanwhile you can parry without crippling your ability to also kill whatever you’re fighting

[arctic wharf]

Inclined to agree with you. They are not very comparable

[grand sable]

parrying with a bubble shield and then ice staffing is diabolical

[arctic wharf]

At most, they are both damage mitigation. How they achieve it is entirely different - for all the reasons you are listing haha.

[fleet lintel]

So saying the bubble is better at tanking than armor and parrying wouldn’t only be meaningful at all if you were in a situation where all you are doing is tanking damage, which implies other people are killing for you in multi player. And the game ultimately has to be balanced around single player

[fleet lintel]

Yeah, the party/block on the bubble staff is pretty high if I recall.

Thank fucking god my kid finally went to sleep. I swear my wife must be giving him meth before I get home just to spite me

He’s a little maniac

[stark furnace]

What lol

I guess bubble jumping just like doesn’t exist

[stark furnace]

Literally 60 eitr

Which is like 2 fireballs

Not even close to “severely” lowering your damage

I swear people tried mage for like 2 seconds, never learned how to properly use the tools and adjust to the new play style, and call it dogshit

When in reality it’s by far the strongest play style in valheim

[grand sable]

it is, and it has moments of weakness.

bubble jumping is great and all but still...going up against enough marksmen and the bubble is not staying around that long.

[round lotus]

You can dodge any number of marksmen attacks by the awesome power of sidestrafing as long as you keep some distance. Which is hardly an issue as a mage.
The bubble isn't supposed to make you a tank, it just covers your fuckups. And the ability to take any one hit no matter what makes it very good at that. It also means hp is basically a non-issue for mage builds.

Also there still trollstav and skellies as meatshields on top of that, the skellies potentially with their own bubbles.

[fleet lintel]

No one is saying is mages are dogshit, except for you, here.

I am saying a mage recasting shield interferes with your damage output far more than a parry while wearing heavy armor.

I agree, magic is overpowered. But not principally because the bubble shield is better than blocking.

[fleet lintel]

This entire discussion was based around the claim someone made earlier that the bubble shield was better tanking damage than armor and shields/parrying.

Anyone can side strafe so it doesn’t really play into the difference between the mage bubble vs parrying as defensive mechanics.

And again, never said the bubble wasn’t good.

[grand sable]

well better at taking damage yes but its not a tank because it breaks and then you're vulnerable, its not consistent damage reduction, literally a glass cannon because sometimes one hit from something shatters it, like glass.

[fleet lintel]

You can bubble a single hit better than you can parry a single hit, sure. But if you are talking about taking multiple hits to the face and weathering damage as part of a strategy, I am claiming that comparing recasting bubble vs parrying with high armor and block is not a meaningful comparison.

And yeah, at 60 eitr a cast with 260~ eitr you can rebubble 4 times and lose 2 fireballs a cast, which would be 25-30% your ability to deal damage before you have to let your eitr recharge?

Furthermore I’d say if you’re a mage you generally avoid getting hit, whether you have your bubble up or not, so again, the utility of parrying vs the bubble is not really a meaningful comparison

[granite geyser]

Funny considering it's affected by pickaxe/chop dmg which the strongest enemies also deal and is a very stupid decision that was never readdressed

[grand sable]

why does that matter so much, the bubble by consensus is kinda overpowered.

[granite geyser]

Because it makes it completely irrelevant to the one enemies you are encouraged to use the shield more frequently against

[grand sable]

i mean ideally in most scenarios i don't think that i want to be in close range of enemies as a mage

which enemies are you referring to as the strongest, the morgen and asksvin?

i find the asksvin to be destructive in terms of fighting them

[hearty finch]

why thumbs down this #suggestions message it would make those materials have some use after boss fight

[grand sable]

i know i'd like uses for boss drops but the food idea is kinda weird

[hearty finch]

ya maybe pots instead?

im thinking it would be helpful for the next boss, for ppl that need it

[grand sable]

well....literally way back in my day 👴 before hearth and home when yagluth was the last boss i saw fanart of a padded armor viking wielding a storming eikthyr antler bow and it stuck with my heart ever since

[hearty finch]

can be cool

or imagine like a shrine in your base built by boss mats, that give u a buff after some time. like rested

[grand sable]

shrines...that sounds fun, i liked astrology and divine stuff in games, devotion systems and crap like that.

[granite geyser]

That's just two of them and only from one biome.

Seeker soldiers, fuling berserkers, golems, even trolls.

All of them one shot the shield, and three of them are lower than the tier the staff is from.

A troll, an enemy from FOUR biomes below mistlands... Completely destroys a shield meant to protect you... in ONE hit.

I would've used a mod to remove that a long time ago if it existed

[grand sable]

Ahhh...i never experimented with them i guess.

[round lotus]

As a mage why are you even facetanking easily kitable melee only enemies?
The ability to take any one hit no matter what is already borderline op, bubble does not need buffs.

[grand sable]

parrying warriors with a bubble

[granite geyser]

You are assuming everyone that uses the shield is mage.

That's not true

[grand sable]

(ew hybrids)

[lofty field]

And on the other hand, with a high skill level it's really strong. I have one character with a blood magic skill close to 100 and the bubble lasts forever. I'd say starting durability should be increased, gain per skill level decreased and xp gain increased

[granite geyser]

You are assuming that 1) The average player has high BLOOD MAGIC skill level and 2) The skill is easy to level up in the first place

Arguing that X skill is useful once you have lvl 99 of said skill should never be used as the metric to argue that the skill is useful

Elemental magic is op even if your skill is lvl 0

That is an example of something being useful regardless of skill level

[arctic wharf]

Same topic still alive and well... someone must have been using the staff of protection on it

[stiff stag]

#suggestions message I object, for comedic purposes it should be the most calm and relaxing theme of all.

[granite geyser]

If they do follow the idea of DN being mysterious, barren, and fear-inducing then something more ominous and sinister might be possible

[lofty field]

Thats not what I was arguing. I'm with you on this. Im saying its too weak with low skill and too strong with high skill.
But blood magic takes forever to level up. Dont know what you meant with easy, but it takes ages.

[round lotus]

So the shield isn't supposed to make your heavy armor build even tankier. That's clearly not its purpose going by the design.
But it functions just as well for melee glass-cannon as it does for mages since they also dodge attacks instead of trying to tank them.

As for the difficulty of leveling blood magic once you have dead raiser 30-40 skill can be reached in a couple nights of walking through a swamp, so it's not hard to level either. The only reason to grind it further than that is reaching the treshold of being able to use DR with only 1 eitr food, and with Ashlands foods now in the game that isn't much of an issue anymore.

[fleet lintel]

The strongest enemies having a way of 1 shorting your shield doesn’t seem inappropriate to me. But it is another way in which parrying/tanking and the mage shield are categorically different in their utility

[lofty field]

Blood magic is not hard to grind in lower biomes, but leveling it naturally is very slow, because it's too weak for the biome it's obtained in at lvl 0. I think there is no other weapon which requires you to grind lvls in lower biomes to reach a threshold where it becomes viable in the biome it's obtained in.
And the bubble durability alone is reason enough to level it beyond 30-40.

[granite geyser]

"You can just grind it and that's it" isn't really a good metric either...

If the shield can be destroyed so very easily while also hurting you in the process then I see a questionable decision there.

[granite geyser]

Fair on the first part. But those enemies are also the ones with the highest amount of damage, the shield being affected by pickaxe/chop dmg could be removed and those enemies would still have an easy time to break it, but it would at least make sense as it'd be based on their normal damage types

@errant pewter the table doesn't have levels, that would mean you would be able to cook one of the best stamina foods in the entire game if you manage to get the ingredients, which only one of them is much more difficult to get than the others

[errant pewter]

Ah yes, I did not think of that. Salad bowl extension for the food prep table then! 😄

[rose swan]

I was actually curious why I was the only one who liked the idea, but I didn’t see it before the edit lol. Yeah, I think there could a little tweaking of the food prep table to have some upgrades like the cauldron. Don’t think we’ll see it though.

[stark furnace]

Guess you didn’t read the full discussion but that’s okay hun 👍

[fleet lintel]

I read the part of the discussion I was responding to. If you want to read things into people’s comments that are clearly not there, that’s on you.

[stark furnace]

So maybe don’t make comments without the full context idk

Just a lil bit of advice

[fleet lintel]

The context I was operating in was the shield being arguably better than parrying. That’s all I addressed and all I said anything in relation to.

Maybe don’t give unsolicited advice, especially if it just betrays your deficiency in reading comprehension. Just a lil bit of advice

[proper sage]

https://tenor.com/view/keep-goin-gif-6704079567258296337

[stark furnace]

Except I never claimed that the shield is arguably better than parrying. I claimed that it is ridiculous that the bubble can parry lord reto when a shield cannot. Maybe increase your efficiency in reading comprehension. 👍

[fleet lintel]

Great, so you’re stating you were bringing baggage into a facet of the conversation where it is both entirely irrelevant and you weren’t discussing in the first place

[crimson dock]

A healing staff would be great tbh, assuming it’s a blood magic weapon and you use your own health to heal teammates

[pliant sorrel]

It is really op though..

[crimson dock]

Or have it work where the secondary of the healing staff feeds it blood magic that you can then discharge when needed

[fleet lintel]

I wouldn’t be opposed to a healing item, but a little more single player relevance would be nice. Maybe also make a blood magic item that “charms” enemies, even if it only works on potentially tame-able animals

Would be useful for taming and give you something to heal that wasn’t yourself

[stark furnace]

yes lets give mage more utility and options because it certainly needs it

[fleet lintel]

You must be responding to rianu, because I’m clearly not saying that

[stark furnace]

I'm responding to the idea of mage getting a healing wand 🙂

Which iGod stated, glad I could help.

[fleet lintel]

It is actually helpful to know who and what you’re responding to. Thanks

[fleet lintel]

Talking about “mages” in valheim I also sort of misleading. It’s not an rpg, it’s a survival game. There are no classes. Just tools to use. If magic DPS it’s so powerful it makes other tools negligible then make magic healing a solution to that rather than making the equation more lopsided.

I.e. make healing a low eitr cost spell that becomes more effective the larger the health pool you have/the more health food you eat, so melee builds with a little magic get a lot more survivable.

Whereas eitr heavy foods/big eitr pools don’t benefit as much

So if you like slinging spells around instead of hitting things in the face you’re less inclined to bother with healing because it doesn’t help you as much.

Either make it heal based on a % of your total health or give you a regeneration velocity based off your total health pool.

[stark furnace]

Devs themselves refer to eitr usage as being a mage, I will also refer to eitr usage being a mage

Source: https://youtu.be/Thhqp8OgJ3U?si=U9RjfPZXs7sgH7Fx&t=249

[fleet lintel]

Refer to whatever you want, however you want. The game doesn’t lock you into “class” distinctions. Eitr usage can synergize with melee or archery or anything else however the devs build it in.

[stark furnace]

Yes I'm aware it doesn't lock you into class distinctions, but the devs themselves use those typical arpg classes, and the ashlands supports the idea of using certain armor to match your playstyle/class

[fleet lintel]

I think you yourself were complaining earlier about players not using tools at their disposal to be effective

[stark furnace]

And you're also talkin to the guy that goes the most hybrid and doesn't really ever follow typical class distinctions

[fleet lintel]

If healing magic is more useful for melee combat than ranged spells is it a melee tool or a magic tool?

Then you’d be the perfect person to know that magic could be a solution to making melee less underpowered than magic DPS

[stark furnace]

Thing is melee shouldn't be buffed to mage power level, mage power level should be nerfed to melee power level

[fleet lintel]

As long as it’s balanced in the end I don’t see it matters how it’s achieved.

Usually once something has been added to a game (or anything) people are more amenable to adding things to balance rather than taking away.

But I’m the last person to care about appeasing people. So if the devs want to nerf magic that works too.

But I do think healing could be an elegant solution to the melee/magic damage discrepancy.

Better than just adding more armor to gear and more damage to melee weapons and bows

[round lotus]

it matters because builds aren't just balanced against each other but also against the mobs. I think that should be obvious.
And melee hardly needs another buff after berserkir mead. If anything both options need a nerf or two, we've been having a lot of power creep since Ashlands.

[arctic wharf]

Still going huh

[fleet lintel]

Adjusting the difficulty of the mobs with hp and damage resistance and output I would think is much easier and more linear than adjustments to the classes at all if you just want to make everyone less survivable all around.

[round lotus]

The advantage of on-demand healing for melee far outweighs a few % more damage or hp

[fleet lintel]

That would all depend on how powerful the healing was I would think.

[round lotus]

we already have healing in the game and it's sharply limited by cooldown for a reason

[fleet lintel]

I’m not married to the idea of adding healing spells. I do think they have potential for interesting implementation though

[granite geyser]

@brittle dust

https://valheim.fandom.com/wiki/Root_Set

[lofty wave]

#suggestions message
Why does archery need more buffs?

[finite vapor]

Level bows skill up if you feel archer isnt strong enough

[mellow crater]

At level 20 with bow I can oneshot/twoshot greydwarfs with prairie bow and wooden arrows. I think archers don’t need more power.
Plus they can upgrade both weapon and munitions to deal more damage while other warriors can upgrade only the weapon.

[fleet lintel]

The big advantage of bows is that skill gives benefit to damage and draw time, which in turn increases attack speed and decreases sta usage

[hollow elm]

I could be wrong, but it feels like the experience increase for skills is triggered on use, and it's pretty static standard. So, slower skills like bows, crossbows(!), cooking, take a lot longer to level than something like running or jumping. There is seriously no balance for leveling skills in Valheim.

[fleet lintel]

Yeah, I hate the current skill system. But if you want a weapon that gets more powerful with skill usage, bows give you more bang per point

[mellow crater]

It’s triggered on success. For run or jump it is the same as on use, but for weapon it means you have to hit a living entity (vehicles and builds don’t increase skills)

[arctic wharf]

Another thing we can agree on.
Skills = 🤮
So I just ignore the system exists and play... otherwise it just brings up flaws flaws flaws

[mellow crater]

Don’t totally ignore it
I fought Queen with 15 in sword…
Guess the issue of this fight. I had to train and level it up to 30 before coming back to finally kill this big bug

But yeah, skills need a rework, it is just so difficult to say how the rework should be

[arctic wharf]

Well, even ignoring it, skills tend to hover between 15 and 50 (depending on death frequency). I just never care to keep track of any skill or specifically grind any out (which is many hours of boredom).

I find you can get by just fine without caring...
Otherwise I would be in the boat of always being upset with skills and its flaws.

Get me on the tangent, and I will be right there with the others saying all the parts of their design I think are bad

[round lotus]

Bow is actually one of the faster leveling weapon skills if you main it. The only thing that levels notably faster is spears.
I'd suggest rushing the root armor set for that sweet +15 bow skill to get over the initial hump when bows are crap - the lower draw time and dps increase makes the beginning a lot more comfortable and increases your leveling speed quite a bit.

[hexed jewel]

i dunno how i feel about snap points--instances which do add some tax to the system resources--but for sure more axes of rotation would open up huge numbers greater possibilities of construction without even varying up the existing assets; we have a hint of what possible already in mods and/or console commands

[languid ibex]

I can see the logic behind rewarding a playstyle that requires inventory slots/food slot(s) and making said food. It's a bigger trade off than gathering supplies for arrows to use with a bow.

[quartz totem]

#suggestions message
Even if they were fixed angles. Not freely like Gizmo do. Also this way we would not "need" a pole AND a beam (as they are technically the same thing, like many "repeated" pieces). Choose the 2 meter wood "stick" and press Shift +Q to rotate until it is a pole or a straight beam, or a 26, they set the angle and done. (I use Gizmo to find some better angles for some ideas, and sometimes is way more convenient...)

[lofty field]

26/45 degree variants are longer and not simply rotations of their 2m pole variant, if I'm not mistaken.

[lofty wave]

They need to be longer to fit with walls properly

[grand sable]

why do you say it like that, more options doesn't equal bad, i don't think a healing tool needs to be added i think that i want it to be added.

i think that it could work if it was added.

and ya know what mage for actual utility is lacking i think, blood magic has the most utility, trolstavs are sometimes not in that category when they cause so much destruction, skeletts aren't always reliable

[finite vapor]

Trollstav is broken and can be abused to clear fortresses 100% safely or smash ores and rocks instantly

[grand sable]

the mining part is a fun use, but then theres the fact that you have giant rage murder machine that you have to deal with.

[stark furnace]

actual wut moment

I'm not engaging with that lol

[finite vapor]

Its a fantastic way to balance it

[grand sable]

i'm going to turkey sandwich you

[finite vapor]

Christ

[grand sable]

more chill utilities, like any way to heal either allies yourself or a bunch of eitr used for both,

there's healing things in other games that also have healing potions and you certainly don't feel immortal in them becauseeee of potion cooldowns.

[lofty wave]

A secondary attack on the dead raiser to heal skeletons could work, but players are responsible for their own health

[finite vapor]

Ty christmas pup
Yes we dont need a new wep, rather just add secondaries to existing ones

[grand sable]

well that i never thought about...

[stark furnace]

this has got to be the funniest response i've ever had

ty obi ron

[crimson dock]

Mage shouldn’t be nerfed, it’s an endgame set of weapons and armor that rewards good positioning and avoiding damage with dealing a lot of damage

You sacrifice health and stamina points for more damage

[lofty wave]

You’re sacrificing health for a shield that allows you to survive an infinitely strong hit and sacrificing stamina for weapons that don’t cost stamina

[crimson dock]

And it also has a fairly long deploy time and lowers your health upon use too, jumping and running rolling etc still costs stamina

it’s high skill high reward, it’s not like you give a new player a mage staff and they’re gonna be op with it, you see someone playing well with it it’s because they’ve practised it a lot

You have 2 enemies hit you slightly apart from each other and you lose you shield, get staggered or die, then die because you got staggered

And once again, it’s locked to the endgame so why shouldn’t it be as strong as it is?

[stark furnace]

Level of cognitive dissonance is crazy ngl

[wet drift]

The game doesn't really gain anything from combat being difficult. This unfortunately isn't a game where you slowly learn attack patterns and get good at individual fights. It's a game where you either beat the thing from the start, or you repeat the runback until the enemy is whittled to 0.

Or well, it does gain from some fights being hard, but only in scenarios where such fights are avoided for those reasons. Prep is fun. Running scared is fun. Fighting mostly isn't.

[stark furnace]

Games gains everything from combat being difficult wdym

games not fun when you steamroll and obliterate content

[wet drift]

Look, I can like difficulty. I'm currently in the middle of a no-bonfire all bosses run of dark souls.
This game just doesn't have a system where difficult battle = fun battle.

[stark furnace]

Valheim is advertised as a brutal survival game and if the combats not brutal well then

[wet drift]

Again, I like prepping for battles in Valheim, and I like when enemies make exploration or resource gathering more difficult. That certainly matches the idea of brutal survival.

The game is not, however, despite progression being tied to bosses, built to make combat interesting when it is the only / primary thing going on.

I would require quite steep payment to play a game that was Valheim combat without any of the other elements.

[lofty wave]

Combat is my favourite part of valheim, I’d happily play a game like that

[wet drift]

I very much cannot understand you, but I also don't know how to have a discussion about it without insulting you, or even try to rationalize the existence of your opinion to myself without making inherently insulting assumptions.

[analog moss]

sounds to me like you each enjoy different types of gaming.

[proper sage]

that's not true, plenty of games have destroyed their playerbase by increasing all enemy difficulty. the division is a prime example of this: they increased the difficulty of the game and everyone quit because of how tiring/frustrating it was just to do anything. they fixed it and created a resurgence by mixing tough difficulty, with easy trash mobs that were fun to blow through while chilling out and looting, which you could then use that loot to prepare for harder content.

[stark furnace]

hello this is my opinion i'm allowed to have it 👍

[proper sage]

you absolutely can, but i can absolutely give you examples of how your opinion differentiates from reality

[stark furnace]

my opinion is also supported by games that are specialized towards players like me idk

something something souls likes genre, hardcore raiding etc

and there's a huge audience for gamers that like to be mechanically challenged how is this debatable

[languid ibex]

I have to disagree, and funnily enough it's because of elements similar to Dark Souls that I enjoy. I'll make an attempt at bosses with mid-range gear to learn their patterns, and it always feels incredible to get a hang of their patterns and win while being extremely unprepared. On the flipside, it's enthralling to learn that no matter how well I understand the boss, there's going to need to be compensation on the prep side of unavoidable damage taken. Both are quite fun for me, and it probably isn't a universal truth that it isn't a fun system.

[proper sage]

souls-like games still have easier trash mobs to blow through to get to harder content, and "hardcore raids" also lead up to that with easier content and trash mobs to blow through

[stark furnace]

and those parts are the unfun parts of souls likes and mythic+

they're just wasting time that's all they are

[amber wind]

I feel like Valheim has a lot more to go before I would consider the combat "souls-like". The Dark Souls game have a very precision based hit box/defense/stam system that I feel is very intricate in comparison to Valheim. For example, for many Valheim mobs, simply stepping backwards completely negates their attacks. While I don't expect Valheim to reach the level of combat as the Dark Souls games, I think adding more difficulty or variety to the fighting gameplay would be great. In most cases, I feel like combat is pretty much just the mobs constantly chasing and attacking you, there isn't much more strategy than that.

[stark furnace]

Ye I agree valheim is ways a way from being a soulslike, was just using it as an example of a type of game i enjoy

[amber wind]

If they could achieve a level of sophisticated combat like Dark Souls, would I enjoy it? Hells yeah! Do I think others will enjoy it? Maybe helf of them. Do I expect this to happen? Not really.

[languid ibex]

There's an element of balancing to consider as well, as gathering resources in a biome begins combat with nearby mobs, and mobs themselves are utilized for resources. It's difficult to agree they should be more difficult when it's possible to be surrounded, or fighting them could eat away at more resources than you would gather.

[lofty wave]

It’s definitely best not to change the combat mechanics people have been practicing for years

[proper sage]

there's an argument both ways for combat changes - especially with their terrain choices

but i also heard there was a mod that lets you aim up/down slightly

[amber wind]

Another thing to consider is that the Dark Souls trilogy's level design is completely hand-crafted, and the combat and enemy choices are also hand crafted to create a challenging experience. With Valheim's open world RNG mob spawns and strange vertical artifacts with the combat, it's (probably) really difficult to get more sophisticated.

[lofty wave]

Strange vertical artifacts?

[amber wind]

You know, not hitting the mob right in front of you because it is up half a meter in front of you...or vice versa.

[lofty wave]

If it’s half a meter up it’s not right in front of you. Why is it strange that you need to consider your 3D position in a 3D game?

[proper sage]

plenty of games let you aim up and down during combat lol

[lofty wave]

So it’s broken because other games do it differently?

[stark furnace]

It's just bad design that's all

[amber wind]

heh heh...when I'm pushing the mob and I swing my weapon, I expect it to hit...not miss because the weapon I have only swings downward or upward like an idiot.

[proper sage]

when games have demonstrated better controls for over a decade, yes, it's not a good system.

[amber wind]

You learn your way around the system, but when it happens and you feel like "WTF just happened, why did I miss?" then I feel like it's more a flaw than a feature.

[proper sage]

i mean, as soon as you go into the mistlands, the problem just jumps in your face constantly, it's hard to ignore

obviously there's issues in the previous biomes, but they're less frustrating

[stark furnace]

it's doable to play around and you're basically forced to, doesn't make it fun or well designed

also makes ranged weapons in some degree better than melee weapons, because they can actually aim up and down

which also inadvertently buffs mage...

[amber wind]

They "sorta" aim up and down...though aiming directly down takes a little practice.

[wet drift]

Whether or not the people have managed to find enjoyment in it, I think it is simply true that the game isn't really designed around making difficult battles feel rewarding.

The game doesn't intend for you to be unprepared, and consequently, combat isn't made in a way where getting hit always feels like you have made a misstake.

I also just think many of the features feel bad to use.
Roll: ew, multi repurposed inputs.
Block: if it's really dangerous it won't help.

Even just looking around while in combat makes it very clear that the camera was meant for other things. I can't really put it to words, but there's all of these small litle sciences that devs have slowly developed. I don't understand them, but I sure feel it when it's off.

That by itself is not a critisism, it works fine for building and exploration. I just don't think a game can be good at that many things, not just because of limited dev time, but because different types of experiences demand mutually exclusive systems.

[grand sable]

it isn't brutal.

tbh...

[arctic wharf]

When it was, people complained, devs caved, valheim is now moderately hard at best.

There is settings though... if you want to inflate numbers and make it brutal
Good addition.
Doesn't do too much in terms of making it more mechanically harder though, just more unforgiving of mistakes.

[stark furnace]

Problem is very hard is a shell of what a real difficulty setting is

e.g. V Rising difficulty sliders

[round lotus]

Inflating numbers isn't difficulty, it's just a copout. The slider won't bring back OG Ashland spawns. Or Mistlands spawns. Or remove the ridiculous "running in circles instead of attacking" a lot of mobs do because players complained about being overwhelmed when they actually focused on attacking.

[stark furnace]

probably the coolest thing they could do with very hard is lower the damage output slightly, but give mobs and bosses feint attacks, similar to the charred warriors, to add an extra layer of difficulty or just straight up new attacks and patterns. I recognize that's a lot of work and essentially involves doing 100s of animations, but It'd be insane. V Rising did it and they got huge amounts of praise and $$ for it

Just my hopes and dreams 😢

[arctic wharf]

I would love two main supported difficulties myaelf.
The settings were a huge step forward in the right direction, but number tweaks just won't offer the proper changes to give the difficult we want yeah.

I wouldn't call it a cop out or bad, it was just a fast adjustment to give us some options. Could always have had no options at all like before

Anywho, if they had 2 primary difficulties... then they could tailor a more forgiving and a more challanging experience more finely, and make changes like those we are thinking about.
Mechanical changes, and some more challanging additions.

Besically... yeah, V Rising is the example I have in mind as well.

Bring true brutal back!

Without just making all attacks one hit kills lol

[molten bloom]

Honestly it would be nice to just have a ton more options in terms of world settings with a greater degree of freedom for those settings. In project zomboid you can adjust world settings to the decimal and there are all sorts of little tweaks you can do to make the game harder, easier, or just different. Valheim could really use this instead of the stiff sliders than go from "a bit harder" to "everything one shots you". Having things like mob spawn rate sliders to unique location generation to continent size etc.

I would agree with the more involved "hard mode" being implemented a la v rising like you said or even like terraria expert mode with additional drops, but this would take a monumental effort that I just don't think they are likely to do

[arctic wharf]

Never say never

[molten bloom]

For sure it would be nice, I'm just saying that expanding the world settings would be much easier and would accomplish nearly the same thing, just less cool

[arctic wharf]

Well, yeah. It's just splitting up all the individual changes into their own settings. Can still have a preset for the difficulties too like we already have.

I was questioning why some of the settings were bundled like they did before the settings ever hit the live version... but suggestions go unheard and stuff still gets pushed hehe

Some still are weirdly bundled even.

I don't expect they will ever do too much in terms of expanding or adjusting the settings available to us, but I do believe the possibility of some in the vain of harder difficulty settings that do more than just number changes is actually somewhat plausible.

[stark furnace]

Hopefully post 1.0 things 🙏

[crimson dock]

Like looking at videos against fader of mages vs melee, melee absolutely obliterates fader while mage comes close to death multiple times, and from my own experience too melee is a lot easier than mage so I’m not sure how our experience differs to make you think mage is so much more op other than on paper having an infinite damage shield

[hearty finch]

idk what the discussion is here but playing mage is several magnitudes (not exaggerating) easier than melee. idk what vids u have seen but mage vs fader goes like this: keep spawning trolls while at a distance and shoot some vines now and again to stun the boss (if u want, only spawning trolls is enough). you barely even deal with meteors because they go to ur vines/trolls and the spawned mobs attack trolls. on melee u have to deal with everything and tank all mechanics. mage vs fader on very hard is easier than melee vs fader on normal and maybe even casual idk

[crimson dock]

https://youtu.be/i0PRIAqqDaw

“Mage absolutely obliterates fader” or something like that is the title

And then another video of melee vs fader no potions or magic

the melee guy killed in ~6 mins and never went below 120 health, the mage dude didn’t even have 120 health max and dropped as low as like 20 a few times, and took ~10 mins to kill

[hearty finch]

ya hes a noob

[crimson dock]

So making it more difficult will only serve to gatekeep the experience, of course mage should be strong if you’ve mastered them and know the right tool for the job

[hearty finch]

bro i said on mage u just need trollstav to beat it

[crimson dock]

You can also bypass the meteors with shield generators

[hearty finch]

and u can basically afk at range

on any difficulty

[crimson dock]

AFK how when you have enemies coming in to kill you

[hearty finch]

raise walls if u want

[grand sable]

i'm goign to turn u guys into cupboards

[crimson dock]

I guess random generation plays a role too, some people will have easier fights simply based on how all the structures generated

[hearty finch]

but both melee and mage would have to deal with mobs coming in and trying to kil you.. so its an even point

just the arena is enough, random doesnt rly come into account afaik

anyway just try it out and see for urself

[crimson dock]

Yeah, I’m planning on taking a better stab at mage this play through I’m currently mid plains so I’m almost there, but from previous playthroughs and seeing clips and content shared online I don’t really see a power divide, melee is also insanely strong in the endgame especially in the hands of the right player, and the same argument goes for mage

[hearty finch]

ya again idk what u've been watching but from me doing several normal/hard/very hard playthroughs.. mage is S tier and melee is maybe C tier

because you're never really in danger as a mage and when u unlock vine staff.. wtf u just do insane dmg literally for free

[crimson dock]

as the difficulty increases I agree mage will be way stronger, but I’m talking about the vanilla intended ‘normal’ experience

Like people act like these people don’t know how to balance the game but they’re gamers making their own game, I’m sure they know what they’re doing

People will always find ways to cheese the mechanics

[hearty finch]

welp ya try it urself xD sry

[crimson dock]

I’ve tried mage and I found it hard to play but I didn’t play my mistlands character enough or have fun as mage so I stopped playing that character but maybe I just didn’t put enough time into

Low level skills also probably plays a part in my personal perception of mage

[hearty finch]

why hard to play

[crimson dock]

Managing low stamina with slow eitr regen and trying to use bubble shield too much, taking too many unnecessary hits

I mean you can summarise it with inexperience but I found mistlands miserable my first time round

[hearty finch]

hmm... maybe you're just not used to kiting and more used to facetank kinda playstyle

[crimson dock]

With melee I usually go for parries and trying to find ways to stunlock

[hearty finch]

eitr is gonna be a problem if you're taking hits all the time and have to redo bubble

but if you're kiting and avoiding projectiles and just using it for fireballs, its gonna be fine

[crimson dock]

yeah I probably just needed to back off more but I was always jump casting bubble so I was low on eitr stamina and health and then the rough terrain it just didn’t go well lol

[short wing]

2 eitr, 1 stamina food is the way I play mage most of the time.
You can use all that stamina to put distance between you and the baddies, drop a skeleton or more for distraction, bubble yourself and possibly the skeletons and go ham with the staff of embers.
Climb a rock, some of the seekers might follow but they only get 1 flight to you and then they stay there for a while so let them land and move again.

[hearty finch]

ya i was just gonna say. what foods were u using?

1 stamina food should be enough. ur stamina is used for survival only so it shouldnt drain that fast

[crimson dock]

oh god I don’t really remember this was not long after mistlands released, seeker aspic and best health stamina foods available to me

[hearty finch]

fire staff does insane dmg + knockback too

[lofty wave]

You don’t need any health with a staff of protection

[hearty finch]

aight ya just use stuffer mushroom + seeker aspic + salad

[crimson dock]

2 eitr 1 stamina gotcha

[hearty finch]

i think salad.. maybe theres some higher stam dont remember

[crimson dock]

Feasts worth it? The ones with also eitr?

[short wing]

Don't run too much before you meet any baddies so you have most of your stamina bar to move to a more advantageous position.

[hearty finch]

idk i just use normal food. i think it gives higher specific values and feast is more like balanced health/stam/eitr. not sure tho

[short wing]

There is but it takes more work than the salad, you need to go catch anglerfish for bread and fish.

[hearty finch]

aight

[lofty wave]

mushroom omelette also has more stamina

[short wing]

feasts are good for their duration but give a little less stats, if I'm not mistaken.

[crimson dock]

From what I seen stats wise the eitr feasts are slot better than the other feasts

Maybe eitr feast, eitr, stamina?

[lofty wave]

Using an eitr feast as a mage will get you more eitr but less stamina, and some health you don’t need
2 eitr 1 stamina only gives stats you actually use

[short wing]

Also true but takes more work than the salad, salad is the easiest to make and for mage play the extra stamina isn't that important, if you can be bothered to go catch fish or make the omelette certainly go for that.

[hearty finch]

not sure. just aim for eitr/eitr/stam. btw some melee is good when u're starting as mage. i recommend using himmini + mistwalker/frostner

[crimson dock]

Oh yeah himmin afl and frostner is what I’m planning to run

[hearty finch]

aight

ya himmini is stupid OP and pretty mandatory for any playthrough