suggestion-discussion

[sonic musk]

#suggestions message
if you think the frost dvergers are bad wait till you hear about the fire dvergers 😃 if you just so happen to wear the feather cape, which is an extremely likely scenario, and you get hit by a 1* fire blast with lvl 3 carapace armor you would take about 171 damage instantly and 101 burn damage over time 😆 very friendly. If you ate the 3 highest health foods for mistlands, you could only survive if you regenerated HP at least once before the fire took you out, otherwise it's guaranteed death hehe.

[wintry bobcat]

Yea gotta bring barley wine or take a dip in water before engaging with fire, if you wear feather cape

[novel crescent]

Why not tho? Check nearby chunks and spawn pieces of the fortress accordingly.

[prime needle]

is it possible to make multiple chunks blend together? similar to the board game Carcassonne. I know you said they cant place things directly on the edge but maybe it could fit with a “broken” bridge or lava pool

[wintry bobcat]

Sounds like rather tall tasks to me

[prime needle]

yeah id agree.. the idea about dungeons being in the center seems the easiest to implement and most fun tbh

[proper sequoia]

It would take too long for the Valheim devs

[arctic wharf]

Given some effort, I am sure eventually you could have solved for multi-chunk generation.

No idea how much effort that would take ofc.

[red musk]

The animal lead and trough suggestion is really good! Is there any reason leads haven’t been added yet?

[arctic wharf]

🤷‍♂️

[barren oasis]

A trough to stop my berries from despawning would be very cool

[stiff stag]

A work station already does that

[barren oasis]

A lead would be nice too. You can use an abyssal harpoon though

[barren oasis]

Pretty unintuitive as a new player

A trough would just be generally nice qol

Also stops you from picking up the berries

[broken belfry]

Surprised this did so well

[rigid juniper]

I carry harpoons to make fuling/wolf pits.

[sonic musk]

Both have been suggested many times. The devs are aware of it. Could come in a future update or not at all. But they certainly know about those 2 ideas.

[red musk]

Praying they come with or post DN then!

[half maple]

Yeah I find it becomes a bonemass moshpit LOL

Maybe if catapults were better you could really bomb out a lot of the defences before attacking?

Right now the catapult is just a transportation device for me and I don't even bother trying to use it while sieging

[wanton atlas]

chunks are randomized. and any changes to such things impacts the performance of the game

[wanton atlas]

to much and performance ^

[arctic wharf]

If games like minecraft and other random gen games using chunks can...
I know it's feasible and could be plenty performant.
Just not fully aware of what kind of effort it entails

[wintry bobcat]

Though personally I don’t wear heavy armor much (outside of helmets), and feel it could use a buff, there’s also a lot of people who love heavy armor as is and think light armor is trash

Though I do think you’re forgetting the perk of flametal armor. Heat resistance is often scoffed at for only giving you such momentary protection, but when you’re in lava a moment of protection is the difference between life and death

I actually think the disparity is bigger early game. Like troll armor is only 2 armor below bronze, and bear armor 1 below

[coral rivet]

@proper sequoia Have you taken into account how armor effects other things? Getting staggered, blocking, parrying, taking frost/fire/lightning damage, and how it heavily synergizes with health food, stagger resistance (fader), and general mob swarms? While I agree it should have a better set bonus.

[proper sequoia]

Lightning and frost damage have very few creatures who use them and none after the Plains. Fire is more common but you also have barley wine so most fire doesn’t deal damage. Same with frost and how every cape is resistance against it

Stagger Resistance of Fader is unlocked like after finishing the game so that ain’t really worth considering if we look at heavy armor in general

I think general mob swarms is the biggest concern of what you mentioned but again you shouldn’t get in those kind of situations in the first place and if you do running away will be much easier with light armor.

[proper sequoia]

Yeah precisely nobody uses heavy armor in the early game just for how useless it is and expensively.

Also the flame tap set is only effective if someone made a very, very bad decision and somehow ended up in lava so it’s extremely situational

[languid ibex]

High armor rating is a bonus in itself, the perks of weaker armor are meant to be the draw for those sets/pieces.

[wintry bobcat]

I hear a lot of complaints from people that they get knocked into lava by mobs or lava outshoots. I think heat resistance is pretty good for the average player

Also being able to take a hop to cross a lava stream instead of bringing basalt bombs is kinda nice

[languid ibex]

Bronze armor is beneficial to those who may not be able to take on a troll/bear without decent armor.

[proper sequoia]

The higher armor rating isn’t useful enough tho that’s the whole point I made there😭

[proper sequoia]

Most people use a bow early game to kill trolls without making armor but I do see your point tho👍🏻

[languid ibex]

To me, your example highlights the good aspect of having better armor, I will take 7 less damage per hit all day long if I'm having a hard time.

[crimson ermine]

sounds to me like its a cost/no set bonus problem rather than it being bad

[proper sequoia]

It’s more so the other option is just so much better overall that the the other option isn’t worth in comparison

Most people die because of one silly mistake where a heavy hitter hits them hard and they take too much damage regardless of armour they would have, the little hits rarely make a big difference in most cases

[languid ibex]

Better is subjective though, if you don't naturally utilize the light/medium armor bonuses in your playstyle, they could just as easily appear useless to someone else.

[proper sequoia]

Oh yes I can’t use my run and attack stamina reduction usefully

The bonuses are simple you don’t need rocket science to use them effectively just run and you already are using them

[languid ibex]

Don't mock it, some players truly will brute force and rely on other means.

I'm not saying it's difficult to be clear, I am pointing to playstyles.

[proper sequoia]

I am one of those who brute forces and it works out fine if you know what you are doing

At the end of the day it’s how good the players ability is

[languid ibex]

Disagree

[proper sequoia]

How so?

You can beat Valheim with anything if you are good enough although it will be harder in some cases

[languid ibex]

I might be extremely versed in bows and don't miss a shot, but opt into tanking hits and push that as far as I can.

[proper sequoia]

Well yeah melee is more efficient

Doesn’t mean you can’t use a bow nonetheless

Everything is viable if you are good enough

[languid ibex]

I am not talking about efficiency, I am speaking of playstyles.

[crimson ermine]

counterpoint: killing bonemass with a fishing rod like @royal lily

[proper sequoia]

And? A good player can use just about do any playstyle

[languid ibex]

Okay I am talking about chosen playstyles then.

What's useless can differ

[lofty wave]

we need a better one, it gets too weak in later biomes

[proper sequoia]

Well a tower shield is useless to 95% of players and only useful for like 1-2 playstyles

So if I call it useless than I won’t be wrong since it technically is useless to majority of players

[languid ibex]

That doesn't invalidate or make how anyone feels objectively correct though.

[proper sequoia]

Well yeah you can feel that tower shields for example are useful for you but that doesn’t change the fact that for majority it is pretty useless

[coral rivet]

#suggestion-discussion message

[languid ibex]

I don't understand, are you taking this discussion as someone getting worked up?

[coral rivet]

#suggestion-discussion message

Take your own advice.

[crimson ermine]

🍿

[proper sequoia]

@lunar finch make a tameable Abomination frrr, imagine riding that boy through the swamps

[languid ibex]

Are you alright sir? I have insulted no one here.

[proper sequoia]

Enjoying the show sir?

[crimson ermine]

insert michael jackson eating popcorn gif here

[lunar finch]

Not exactly what I had in mind but damn it would be cool

[proper sequoia]

If we could only tame bears with honey😔

[languid ibex]

I truly don't understand how euphoria666 gets my context wrong so often.
Anyways, @proper sequoia I am glad you are willing to say there's players that do have use for such things, it's nice to hear your reasoning on this.

[proper sequoia]

Well yeah I used heavy armor pretty often, so I know it’s not useless, it’s just that light armor set feels too much better and makes me feel sad that the heavy armor ain’t getting the same love

[languid ibex]

However rare, there is value in that, I would be quicker to agree that armor totals could be tweaked, and leave bonuses to the lighter sets.

[lunar finch]

I mean for me, I choose heavy armor over light. I like melee fights and with light armor I cant just fight and dodge every attack at the same time. So heavy is helping me stay alive

Only difference is ashlands. Asksvin armor there is truly very op

[proper sequoia]

Ask set truly op, and provides a solid amount of armor

[crimson ermine]

yeah ok so if the askvin armor is "truely op" then wouldnt bear armor be cheating? bear armor is way better in its biome compared to askvin in its biome because ashlands is much harder in comparison to the gear

[proper sequoia]

Bear armor you take 25% more physical damage from everything, it basically having close to no armor with certain enemies

Also the bonuses are fundamentally different so idk what kind of comparison you made there

[lunar finch]

That would be nice. Fixes the issue I pointed out.

[coral rivet]

25% more physical damage does not mean "close to no armor", that is pure exaggeration
I just tested this with Greydwarf Brute.
maxed Bear Armor: I take 7 - 8 damage per strike on average
maxed Troll Armor: I take 5 - 6 damage per strike on average
No armor: I take 25 - 26 damage per strike on average

[rigid juniper]

Technically, Achilles isn't wrong. Bears/Trolls can 1 shot you if you're rocking the bear kit at H/VH difficulty settings, hits you would survive if you were wearing a troll outfit instead. So in those situations against 'certain enemies', bear armor is like wearing no armor.

It's enough of a concern that a lot of folks will intentionally break the set bonus by switching out one piece since it's only 1 armor less than the bronze armor and you keep more of your movement speed.

[shut finch]

@proper sequoia in regards to your suggestion. It's great, and I love it personally, however I don't know if it would work in Valheim. Combat pretty much requires constant movement, and staying in one place is like begging for being outflanked one way or the other. Coolest idea tho.

[wanton atlas]

it would work if valheim was a co-op game only. 🤔

but mega-tank isn't really possible without breaking the combat gameplay 😄

[gleaming valley]

i feel like i said a hundred times already during cta beta, but towers are completely viable through the whole game even fun if you embrace the tank vibe, and as i recently found actually better against insane amounts of enemies. the reason they feel underpowered is the new free parry cost, basically parrying shields got a massive massive buff, so i dont know the answer is also buff tower shields making them also op.

for the ashlands armor part of the convo, two words: heat resistance.

[prime needle]

i think it would be neat if tower shields applied some kind of status effect like frost, poison, or spirit to enemies if they melee attack. it would give tower shields a greater use

[alpine saddle]

There’s also the pretty aggressive knock back values on most shields

I just want to parry the enemy for an attack, I don’t want to parry the enemy into another universe

Tower shields should (IMO) come with varying levels of block force. Gimme a shield with 0 block force and one with 100. Let me pick more of a playstyle!

[gleaming valley]

i recently found it annoying how far back carapace buckler knocked enemies i parry such that i have to run at them to hit them

i like it on tower because imo tower is for hordes and knockback slows the waves crashing against you, but buckler parry should be next to no knockback

[alpine saddle]

This is exactly the issue why I don’t use those on modded servers (just overleveled items).

Bronze and iron buckler are the absolute best because 30 block force

[gleaming valley]

actually ima add other weapons into that too, parrying things with battleaxe means i have to also run or jump at them to counter attack. i dont understand the benefit of knockback from parry, high block force should be tower shields only

[merry hollow]

@shut finch Yesss I want glass roof options, let me make a greenhouse 😂

[rigid juniper]

Roofs block plants from growing, you'll need the planteverything mod to make greenhouses a reality, you could also install gizmo to make your dreams come true rn.

[merry hollow]

True still though glass roof would be nice just because pretty. And another way to allow light into a base.

[spiral ice]

Unless the devs made the roof check ignore glass. Not sure the implications on that though.

[rose swan]

It might a similar thing to why iron cages won’t allow smoke/rain pass. Maybe the current system in place doesn’t allow for such complexity? 🤔

[gleaming valley]

i would love me some iron cage smoke passage. could make some awesome multi story chimney things

[karmic flax]

Smoke needs 1x1 meter space minimum to escape

[gleaming valley]

ya, but would be cool if metal grates were “space” somehow

[karmic flax]

then youd fall through 👀

[gleaming valley]

hehe, SMOKE space not PEOPLE space

[long anvil]

@sudden flint #suggestions message while im not against contextual perks in theory, i think the base game (unmodded, i mean) is best served with its current simplicity

[runic plover]

I am rather amused that the example options for the bow skill are both things that naturally increase as your bow skill rises.

[long anvil]

and i think im largely on the same page with achilles on the heavy armor, too, once youre comfortable with combat, heavier armor feels like it becomes largely a cosmetic decision at the cost of movement and other perks even at lower levels, and thats where the gaps are larger

[runic plover]

Indeed, I find myself going with troll armor these days when I used to make bronze back in the day. Just don't need that extra little bit of armor in exchange for the move speed modifier alone.

[safe dove]

Honestly in the Black Forest using the berserker armor and troll skin hood to avoid getting the damage taken increase trumps bronze armor every time. It’s easy to upgrade the armor to be stronger than bronze quite quickly as well.

[rose swan]

Agreed, would love to see heavy armor get some bonuses. Even if it does contribute to the overall power creep

[safe dove]

The only biome it costs more to get light armor than heavy armor is the mountains. Usually the light armor materials will be gathered just by exploring, while heavy armor requires more processing to create. That, combined with an inherent debuff I think makes it reasonable for heavy armor sets to get some sort of buff, though I think the defense scores do the pieces shouldn’t be altered, or at least not too much. With a buff to heavy armor though I think it would be fair to hold off adding such a thing to the game until light armors are available in every biome (missing in plains/mistlands), if they would ever be added.

[peak bronze]

Maybe each heavy armor set could have one slight resistance modifier to blunt/pierce/slash. Like full bronze armor could have slight resistant to blunt, then full iron armor same but for slash etc.

[fast void]

Bronze armor set bonus: 10% chance to blind attacking enemies. Because SHINY 😏

[fast void]

I would support this more if we could continually upgrade things.

[peak bronze]

You mean upgrading them further than quality 4?

[fast void]

Only for pre-DN things.
Like if DN caps at 4:
Ash should cap at 5.
Mist cap at 6.
And so on, and so forth.

[runic plover]

Those upgrades would become obscenely expensive if their costs kept scaling at the same rate.

[fast void]

So if you like the look of something, you can keep using it without stat loss for the price of having to grind the increasing material cost.

[fast void]

Yes. Not a problem.

[karmic flax]

expensive isnt the problem, that'd just be poor design imo

[fast void]

?

Forcing people to abandon stuff they identify with is "poor design" imo.

Reason Zelda's new "all weapons break, screw you if you find one you like" system got the amount of backlash it did.

[rose swan]

Could make the cost rarer materials that are dependent on the tier they’re upgrading to? Just spitballing ideas.

[karmic flax]

i think transmog would be a better solution

[rose swan]

Ultimately, I think I agree 🤔

[fast void]

Transmog fixes "this lower level armor has a set bonus I like but I can't use it anymore" --how?

[karmic flax]

oh that, i assumed you were talking about looks

[fast void]

Core issue, no.
But my idea solves both simultaneously.

[karmic flax]

it messes with progression though

[fast void]

No?

You're given a choice between switch to new, cheaper armor with better stats or grind out ridiculous amounts of materials to keep your same armor for equal stats.

[karmic flax]

And are you grinding thrm in the new area or the area where you created the original?

[fast void]

Bronze grind for rank 2 vs iron grind for rank 1 is not as much of a question as bronze grind for rank 5 vs. iron grind for rank 4.

[runic plover]

Should we apply this same upgrade logic for weapons? Should I just wander around harvesting flint instead of ever mining for metal weapons?

[karmic flax]

Black forest grind vs ashlands grind

[fast void]

Let me use my wooden club in the Ashlands if I want to!!!

After spending 1k bone frags upgrading it 😁

[runic plover]

Exactly. With no upgrade cap, that club will eventually match flametal.

[fast void]

It has a cap though.

Which would be when it matches flametal. 😁

[runic plover]

Ah, right. I misremembered. Apologies.

[coral rivet]

i mean that isn't very realistic, but I see the vision

[karmic flax]

Oh so it doesnt match deep north?

[runic plover]

Still, kinda silly that you could upgrade what is essentially a stick to match anything made of metal.

[fast void]

The point is making set bonuses carry up through biomes.

The side effect is "transmog but it costs a lot."

[karmic flax]

I have thousands of bone fragments chilling in my base tho

[fast void]

Guarantee you my idea has more traction if Pierce Resist was a SET BONUS of Root (as it 🤬ing should be) instead of just a 1-piece buff.

[rose swan]

Eh, there’s plenty of example of materials being oddly mismatched in terms of durability/strength 😁

[runic plover]

Vs. silver, sure, but frostner (as long as we're comparing maces) is most certainly a magical weapon.

[fast void]

You're saying my magical wooden stick isn't magical?

[peak bronze]

Pierce resistant in Harnesk could be included in set bonus, yeah.

[karmic flax]

I think the better solution is for weapons or armor with special effects to be upgradable further, but needing to use later biomes mats for upgrades

[fast void]

SHOULD

Not "could" 😭

[long anvil]

Many ways to skin a cat, and all that. They could make the light / special armors more of a process to make, but I do think that would frustrate some players.

[long anvil]

Like I do enjoy this.

[safe dove]

That would be really cool

[karmic flax]

if you just use same biome upgrade items, you will make it tedious and easy

someone will probably make or have made a mod like that

[proper sequoia]

This is just gonna make some already more op items even more op and less diversity in Valheim weapon

Frostner glazers for example will never leave that item from their hotbar if this happens

Same with fenris armor + root harnesk

[rigid juniper]

I would be okay with this if the item has an increasing chance to break as you upgrade it. You want to upgrade that Frostner from lvl 4 to 5? Fine. It'll cost you 90 silver and it'll have a 15% chance to break on attempt.

But seeing as you can just spawn in whatever, eeeh.

Every time I see anyone rocking a frostner in ashlands I'd just assume they're cheating.

[peak bronze]

Why?

[rigid juniper]

Cause 80% of the games I've tried to join playing with random folks had either an admin or one of their friends either be an outright cheater or be willing to 'tilt' things in their favor.

Right now, a frostner doesn't go over lvl 4. So if I see one being carried around in the Ashlands I'd assume they just really like it.

If it can go to lvl 12? With a 0.0001% chance of getting there without breaking while upgrading it to that point with over a thousand silver?

I'd assume it's a spawned lvl 12 frostner and I'd probably be right more than half the time.

Especially if it's a vanilla game with no anti-cheat mods.

[peak bronze]

I've rocked with Frostner in Ashlands, it is actually viable weapon there.

[rigid juniper]

Oh it is.

[peak bronze]

Not the best, but solid.

[rigid juniper]

Don't get me wrong. I do no boss runs and it's my go to in Mistlands/Ashlands.

But I'm saying the percentage chance thing I suggested would never work.

Too many people would immediately cheat the system and make themselves lvl 12 frostners.

Especially since it wouldn't immediately be visible to anyone else that they're rocking lvl 12 frostners. It's not like other people can see your item levels or damage numbers.

[peak bronze]

Ah, missed the context earlier.

Still about the upgrading over quality 4 thing.

Dunno, I don't think we need to get gear upgraded over that cap. Otherwise there would be quality 12 Early axes demolishing the whole game.

-# New pair of axes instead please.

[gleaming valley]

i was thinking about this, what would you use them against though? once battleaxe is online it’s so good against everything, and what it isnt good against i’d rather use a spear or pickaxe anyway.

[proper sequoia]

dual axes too op

[rose swan]

(Just playing devils advocate!)
Sometimes it’s about more than just the viability of a weapon, the fun factor might be a big one 🤔

[peak bronze]

Axes in middle of Early axes and Berserkir axes would be nice. As I have made suggestion about such: #suggestions message

[rigid juniper]

#suggestions message
I figured they unloaded the crossbow because if they remembered the load state after unequipping, people would just carry multiple crossbows and shoot something 4 times before they have a chance to react.

[karmic flax]

dual axes for flying

[proper sequoia]

The deer looking at me as I am in the air with 2 lighning axes grinning like a maniac

[gleaming valley]

i can get behind fun factor. im just thinking of all the things that i just sweep up with the battleaxe though, idk what id use the dual axes for except moder maybe yagluth.

[rigid juniper]

I want to try a dual wield only run.

What would be my options, lets see... fists until I get bear claws or dual axes, then I guess those until I get to mountains?

No idea what I'd do about drakes though.

[coral rivet]

I'm doing a fist weap + knife only run, and it's pretty easy actually:
hide behind structure/rock/tree, the drake will try to get closeby, then just jump and slash it. Can also utilize the stucture to get a higher jump at it

sometimes it will even come down to ground level and a jump isn't necessary if it does

[stiff stag]

I try to do that whenever I can. Always fun to bait them into melee range.

[proper sequoia]

Yo there is a 2 star morgen in front of my portal, do I fight it or abondon the portal?

[rigid juniper]

Definitely going to try that. I started the run figuring I'd throw ooze bombs or something if it came down to it. Still haven't found my first weapon yet, did kill one bear but it only dropped one paw, or at least it was the only one I could find.

[rigid juniper]

How did you do Gjalls?

[coral rivet]

I'm still in the Mountains xD

streaming it right now actually D:

with a bunch of other constraints too

[crimson ermine]

put it in #suggestions and we can talk about it

[proper sequoia]

nvm I just decided to kill it with the goold old sword and shield

[crimson ermine]

based

[rigid juniper]

Hmm.. I don't mind just running from em if it comes down to it. And I can always just pull them towards Dvergrs if I want a trophy or something.

[half maple]

As much as I love the weapon visually I dont think brutal slayer is worth it. you have to be down 100 health for a 20% damage bonus which raises the weapons damage to 204. But you don't ever want to be down 100 health and the lightning weapons chain hits are so much better in the context of the ashlands, especially for a sluggish sword. I suppose you could try a blood magic shield and purposefully lowering your hp to very critical but I think the juice just isn't worth the squeeze so to speak lol.

The model is so much better than the scourging slayer one though (I'm biased cuz it reminds me of Berserk LOL)

We need this so badly

I get some damage types being less effecient on some enemies but this is just torture