💬┃general

[main frigate]

Vintage Story... Googled it, lol emmm... it's a game based on minecraft?

[pure dawn]

Calling Skyrim and Red Dead Redemption 2 "mediocre" is so out of touch.

[main frigate]

lol I have tried don't starve together, I have no idea how to enjoy survival games

[short vessel]

I'd somewhat agree on skyrim being mediocre... in some aspects

But rdr2?

Nah

[muted cape]

That was way too much writing that was not last epoch, for lengthy discussions not related to last epoch use #📚┃off-topic to post instead, thanks.

[stoic frigate]

Open chat and see a multi-paragraph schizo rant shitting on what is frankly one of the best narrative games we have ever had in history

Remember why I don't visit this channel anymore

Please, don't funnel that to off-topic, us weirdos who hang out there don't wanna deal with it

[little lagoon]

Skyrim has a shit story but I think the fact that Bethesda was able to create a framework of a game that is still played over ten years later is proof that it’s definitely not a mediocre game.

Red Dead Redemption 2 has objectively good acting, writing and overall mechanics.

Last Epoch is there

[glass pendant]

I look at general. I see a lot of epochs that aren't last enough

[little lagoon]

And Last Epoch should be here

So go away basically

[stoic frigate]

😔 I'm just pushed further away with each update. 0.9 was peak, that was the best epoch

[glass pendant]

1.4 epoch will be the best epoch yet

[stoic frigate]

I think as long as we are in the era of "put 2LP legendary items in every slot" I will be disappointed, really

[south moat]

1.4 will truly be the last epoch of all time

[glass pendant]

I'm fine with player power. I just want content that justifies it

And more exciting loot

[stoic frigate]

It isn't a player power thing to me

It's just a "this is really boring gearing" to me

[glass pendant]

Imo what's boring about it isn't the itemization itself but the farming process. Maps don't need to be 20 times worse than other maps

But gg drops are definitely absent from the game

Where's my gmod shield

[stoic frigate]

It's kinda both on my end. There's nothing interesting about shoving in Unique Item With High Generic Stats And Two Or More Affixes Slammed On #8 to me

[glass pendant]

I wonder if another rarity would help the game. the gg finds. the magebloods, the t.might, the dwebs, the mang songs lessons

[stoic frigate]

Like, this season brought in the Flay boots. That every melee user on the planet is using because EHG threw melee attack speed on them.

[glass pendant]

mirror tier crafting mats, something

[stoic frigate]

Red Ring was fine imo, when it was a chase item, I have no issue with generically strong but very rare items. Now people can deadass farm them on day 2, if not day 1.

[glass pendant]

maybe primordials should've been an entire separate rarity

and the itemization should've been separated from the cache

[stoic frigate]

I am also of the (controversial) opinion that guaranteed slams was a bad addition

[glass pendant]

Any change to that part would imo have to come with restructuring of the itemisation structure itself. For example in d2 when you hit a rare rune word, the gamba comes from roll ranges. A bad rolled enigma is still a gg item

What I don't like about slamming is how punishing it is for something that is 100% a dice roll

I would settle for the gamba being limited to roll ranges

But I think the problem is indeed with how op legendaries are more than anything

it's sad skill sigils aren't coming sooner, would've been a much needed fresh air

And I hope they're actually droppable equippable farmable items, not just "here's 5 things with fixed stats, add them to your skill and be done"

That's way too d3

[pastel path]

Best Epoch is when skill sigil is in and the greatest Future Strike is brought back

[stoic frigate]

Mm. Like, D3 is fine as a game, but it's also a completely different approach of a game compared to others in the genre, I would honestly say it's a different genre really

Nah. Don't wanna. Don't like you.

[glass pendant]

it's ok for what it is, I'm not hating on d3, if anything I didn't walk into it at the time expecting the deepest rpg ever

But LE could use a different item type to chase

And I think that's a good candidate

[stoic frigate]

Lootable skills/skill mutators would be interesting for sure yeah. It's rather rare too, I think there's like... Diablo 1? And... another one I'm blanking on rn that I've played (unfort, it is kinda P2W and appeals to mobile gamers despite some very cool systems). Oh and I guess Crystalfall whenever that comes out (I am wary of it though, they talk about some blockchain stuff and I need to see what they mean with that before I decide on if it's worth trying)

[stoic frigate]

[little lagoon]

She’s right

[glass pendant]

There's PoE with those things you put on the passive tree with the radius I guess (don't remember the name sorry)

Not the same thing but still cool

[stoic frigate]

Uh... cluster jewels? Or tattoos?

Or uh, the timeless jewels maybe?

[glass pendant]

Honestly probably either. I've seen ones that have a radius that boost slotted passives and another one that lets you put points in things detached far away in the tree

I'd love to see similar stuff in LE

The latter is a thing in slormancer too

And it's very enjoyable

[stoic frigate]

Mm. Radius is timeless jewel I think, if I'm understanding you right. The detached ones are specific unique jewels that do that (ICR names atm, I'll remember in like two hours probably on accident).
Cluster jewels have specific slots in the tree you put them in and they basically expand the tree.

[glass pendant]

I'm positive LE could benefit from any combination of those, or even something with similar vibes. I don't know, some ultra rare "jewel" that gives a skill a conversion it doesn't normally have or something silly like that

Although that doesn't align with their thematic vision so rip

[stoic frigate]

I have so many feelings about their "thematic visions" and none of them are good

[glass pendant]

I agree with some, disagree with other ones. My biggest gripe is how against they are with players accessing information. we'll see how that changes when they finally rework that excuse for a character sheet

[pure dawn]

https://tenor.com/view/benjammins-aint-reading-all-that-im-happy-for-u-tho-or-sorry-that-happened-im-happy-for-you-thought-or-sorry-that-happened-gif-16532884834168127420

It’s not that serious friend

[grand bobcat]

so me and my friend decided to play coop but when he joins my world or i join his we can't see eachother: only the one who joined can see the other

also he plays acolyte and even when he's solo he can't see the skeletons

and enemies he kills get into default pose upon death instead of ragdolling

is there a way to fix that?

also he said he doesn't have skill cooldown and his hp and mana don't get depleted upon taking damage and using skills

[simple bison]

Does it keep happening even if you guys swap instance or relog?

[grand bobcat]

yes

[simple bison]

if so I'd verify the integrity of both your guys files

[grand bobcat]

we restarted the game several times

[grand bobcat]

all files (1793) have successfully passed the test

does that mean the problem wasn't in them

[simple bison]

Yeah It'll say that and still fix something like 90% of the time for some reason

not necessarily

[tropic cove]

But does he die?

[grand bobcat]

he didn't test that

[tropic cove]

That would be 2 different issues if he dies or not, just ruling in that it's simply visual

[grand bobcat]

seems like it's fixed

he said he was using vpn too, maybe it caused disruptions in client-server connections

[grand bobcat]

is there a way to see the level of your teammate?

[stoic frigate]

Hit H and check the party tab

[grand bobcat]

thanks

[mellow robin]

redid build. dmg went way up. gotta work with the squishiness

aaaaand game crash

this game really loves to take a shit when you alt tab out

[simple bison]

Even on borderless? I have no issues personally with alt tabbing

You can confine the cursor even in borderless mode

[mellow robin]

yes, even on borderless

maybe i should change it

i only got the game yesterday and im 10 hours in right now. im not expecting perfection or anything. it was just something i noticed. it also doesn't happen every time i'm alt tabbed out though

i respecc'd a BUNCH of shit and now i'm so underpowered for level 40 content.

[simple bison]

Your skills will go back to the level they were at an accelerated rate but yeah it can be rough for a little bit

Respeccing everything at once is faster but also more rough than doing one or two skills at a time

[regal finch]

this not-respeccing is so not fun 😩 and that's not a common alt-tabbing issue

[simple bison]

And I'm surprised it's still acting up in borderless, since that should be the same as windowed. I'd report it with the in game tool (F8) for sure

Yeah I've never had issues with alt tabbing in borderless, never played with fullscreen so I wouldn't know how it acts there

[mellow robin]

yeah i figured. i did too much at once and i have to live with it. but it's no big deal

im trying to follow a poison bladedancer build

[simple bison]

Yep, at worst you might wanna re-run a lower level zone or something to get a level or two on the skills but that's about it

Usually you can get away with not doing that though

[mellow robin]

i have no issue doing that. just gonna be a PITA cuz the skills are min 6 (well the 4 worked on a respec right now are 7)

im also drunk so im f*cking up alot of my rotations

[mellow skiff]

hi all i build a (Forge Guard Javelin) , and i having a problem for searching this 2 - Handed Spear ( Marauder's Sierpin's Fractal Tree ) ,According to the Unique Requirement it only drop from ( Exiled Mages )spawn in Echoes run , but need to get Rune Prison Complex to Trigger it work , so where can it get this RUNE PRISON COMPLEX Woven Echo? thanks for reply

[south moat]

Rune Prison only drops from exiled mages
And the spear can drop from exiled mages in normal echoes too, no need for rune prison for it

Oh right
rune prison only drops in areas that are lvl 90 or higher and only from the exiled mages

[mellow skiff]

o.......thanks bro hope can get it by to day run

[south moat]

Good luck

[clear oar]

Yo this is dumb but i dont know how to read these loot filters from maxroll leveling build? If i see the items on the ground, is there a good way to figure out which ones i want to wear without painstakingly going through each stat? there's just a bunch of colors and dots

is a 4 dot red better than a 5 dot tan? idk!

[simple bison]

You can basically ignore (and tbh even turn off) the dots. The colours are the important bit

What color means what I wouldn't know without looking at the filter myself

They usually name the rules though iirc, so you should be able to see what colour means what by looking at the filter

[clear oar]

oh neat and if i open the filter it lists the rule next to the item! perfect ty

[grand bobcat]

where exactly do i put bug reports?

[south moat]

You can press F8 in game to do it

[autumn socket]

So, i am at the character selection screen right now, and I tried all of the classes and played a paladin the most got him to level 86 but deleted him got bored of him. I tried the mage and got to level 30 and then deleted him. I just don't know what class is fun and easy to play and doesn't require mana shit and is fast leveling.. I like fast paced characters but I feel like there isn't much options in this game.

Nobody ever wants to be friends and chat and discuss about the game so idk what to do in the game

[simple bison]

Going to level 30 won't really let you explore a class properly honestly. A lot of builds mana issues get solved after a while through uniques and incremental improvements. There are of course some that never have mana issues as well (mana strike spark charge for mage as an example) but yeah. If you want to zoom around rogue is likely your best bet, especially falconer currently

[warm yoke]

Actually mana issued never get solved on 70% of all classes...

[simple bison]

That's not true? That's only the case if you're trying to spam nuke skills like meteor or something

Or if you're using something with a non trivial cost without any generation sources

Honestly you can even somewhat sustain meteor now with the new primordials depending on your setup

(not saying it's good, but you can sustain it)

[dull topaz]

hammer throw is easy mana and super fast levelling, end game you're looking at 6-8 min kills on ubersloot though, rogue with chakrams (can do life build or low life build for more dps / dmg reduction with the OP armor from primodial bro) - 0 mana, also insanely fast levelling and you can gear up and do uber in 2-3 mins, maybe less if you're really good dunno, personal skill I guess. I'd say rogue and flasks but the mana on that is shit house, was shit before and worse with this patch the devs really don't appreciate it lol

[broken siren]

Just got to 2500 corruption on my shadow cascade bladedancer! Now the road to 3000 🙂

[sly coyote]

Hi guys! I am wondering how is the issue with Stash memory leak in legacy/non seasonal mode? When i played and still after the patch that would fix it i still had issues with Stash, has something changed?

[frank bramble]

@glass pendant you won't believe what my pal Doom did recently, he found a way to fix that desynced character issue which was hurting us so bad, you won't believe it when you hear the solution like I'm 100% sure

[paper ibex]

anyone here in Asia server right now? come let's play

[jagged coral]

hello guys , i m new to the game. What build sould i go with ?

[willow sentinel]

The one you find cool /'fun

[paper ibex]

why is my Runic Invocation skill dark in color? does it mean I cannot use it?

if anyone's free can somone come to VC please?

[mellow robin]

gotta farm today

yeah im not doing that right now im not in the mood

[grave idol]

I just submitted a bug report via f8. I cant see my chat window and dont get any messages

hitting enter doesnt do anything

clicking the chat symbol on the right of the screen doesnt do anything

I checked files with steam and restarted game

also my friends are not shown anywhere. I know I had one friend lol

[grave idol]

Im down

[paper ibex]

hi

just doing echoes

[grave idol]

Im only lvl 84

whats ur ingame name

[paper ibex]

I'm only level 83 T_T

ManongKepweng

[grave idol]

did you get my friend inv?

my name is RedEyz

[paper ibex]

I'm on Legacy haha

[mellow robin]

im just trying to farm myself

[buoyant turret]

the jokes write themselves on that one

[paper ibex]

T_T

[buoyant turret]

farmer mtx when though. straw hat, overalls, a pitchfork is already a 2h spear i mean cmon

[paper ibex]

anyone here in legacy? I need help farming stability to open boss fight with the deer god haha

[mellow robin]

i'll be in legacy. after the current season ends XD

[simple bison]

What corruption

[paper ibex]

none atm

[simple bison]

sure give me a min

[paper ibex]

still trying to complete echoes

[simple bison]

what's your in game name

Press H and look in the top left of the window

[paper ibex]

ManongKepweng

[mellow robin]

created a mage, this should be fun

[paper ibex]

I'm too afraid to enter cemetery haha

[buoyant turret]

too many goodies in there not to

clearly not enough coffee yet sheesh

[simple bison]

You sure? It's not coming back

[paper ibex]

@simple bison what's your ign?

[simple bison]

Same as here, Cyborgwars

Your ign is menudolover

that's why ^^

[buoyant turret]

today the search for nice lp wordslpitter continue

[paper ibex]

where do I farm mad alchemist ?

[willow sentinel]

Kill mages

[paper ibex]

gotcha

RNG jesus be kind to us

[simple bison]

Yep, good luck!

[paper ibex]

tysm! true end-game begins

[main frigate]

@primal abyss good morning, remember to eat breakfast, why Halloween is your favorite festival?

[primal abyss]

Good morning!

Because it's simply fun! Filled with spooky things, food, costumes. I enjoy it a great deal.

Hope all of our travelers are doing well this spooky week of October

[main frigate]

Which food will you eat to celebrate that?

[paper ibex]

since I'm dying on level 100 bosses, should I stick to base level maps, will harbingers still spawn?

[main frigate]

Let's begin a new food talk

[primal abyss]

Honestly, I don't know. Around this time people like to make Pumpkin Pie or Sweet Potato pie and I'm a fan of most pies soooo sign me up

[main frigate]

Today's food talk is over. I need to learn something about different pies...

You remind me of crime scene kitchen, a tv show which let me know various pies in this world for the first time

[south moat]

No
Harbingers don't spawn in normal monoliths once you've access to empowered

[dark holly]

Did I see someone say there was a way to get the Weaver Tree to get dungeon drops to drop elsewhere?

Or did I hallucinate that?

[south moat]

There is yes
Node that gives the tomb & cemetery monsters 0.1% chance (per point, for total of 0.3%) to drop them
Think there's another node too somewhere

[dark holly]

that says timeline bosses doesn't it

[willow sentinel]

No thats for timeline boss

There is a node for dungeon drops

Bottom part

Thats makes dungeon mobs spawn in the echo

[south moat]

ah right, yea
I mix those 2 often tbh

[dark holly]

Warden's Echo, I see it now, thank you

[south moat]

Never had pumpkin pie or sweet potato pie

[main frigate]

You're good. Zero pie I have ate.

[south moat]

Smh
We got to fix that

[main frigate]

:)

So much life experience I need... Sigh

[south moat]

Well
It's not like someone has tried every food out there

[primal abyss]

Never had Pumpkin or Sweet Potato Pie?!

Outrageous, but understandable... I want everyone to eat pie atleast once this month!

[south moat]

Well
I've never had pumpkin in general

[buoyant turret]

pie and spiced latte flavoring are its biggest roles other than jack o lanterns 😉

[primal abyss]

It being seasonal and something not everyone has had, I get it. There is a fun running joke of Pumpkin Pie vs Sweet Potato Pie due to their similarities

But yes,

Its not used year round like many other things xD

[mellow robin]

mage is fun 🙂

[mellow robin]

i bought 2 sweet potato pies at the grocery store when i was like 17 thinking they were pumpkin pies.... nope. still ate em though XD

[main frigate]

I tried sweet potato, I tried pumpkin, but I never eat pies which filling with them

[south moat]

Also pies over here are different than the typical american ones

[primal abyss]

Been there...

[mellow robin]

in my defense i wasn't the smartest 17 year old 😂

[primal abyss]

I was 17 once.... 😆

I get it

[main frigate]

No "pies" in China. Pies in Europe at least

[simple bison]

sweet potato pie sounds good

[south moat]

Last time I baked a pie it was applepie
posted a pic of it to offtopic

[simple bison]

same, I baked an apple pie a couple weeks ago with a friend

[main frigate]

Snowflake Crisps is what I ate instead 🤔

I hope frozen puff pastry is as common as NA and EU here

[south moat]

Frozen pastry is common, yes

[main frigate]

The most common frozen food here is steamed food

[primal abyss]

Most common food here...is fried...usually 😆

[main frigate]

Fried food = poisoned food for most 70s Chinese parents

Oil-consuming in process and not healthy at all

It cause me desired fried food so much

Van must have tried all food he want to eat and it's last a long time before he decided to keep a healthy deal. Sorry, I don't on this period yet

[primal abyss]

I am very seldom able to enjoy fried food, but I still do time to time.and yes there are very bad ways of cooking things but easier and bit more healthier..I feel like I just have to try to keep a hold of decent moderation

[south moat]

Moderation in most things

[primal abyss]

But food just tastes so good

[south moat]

Yeah
Got to eat
And speaking of that, my food is almost ready

[regal finch]

my stomach is very quick to react to not-okay food, so i got conditioned early to eat healthy 😊

[primal abyss]

That too! That happens either sooner or later for some hahah

[turbid silo]

Good morning Travelers! We're looking for your insights on cosmetics in Last Epoch and want to hear from you. Please visit the forum post below to provide your thoughts on shaping the future of our cosmetic offerings.

https://forum.lastepoch.com/t/your-cosmetic-feedback-could-shape-what-s-next-in-last-epoch/79970

[south moat]

Would probably be noticed by more people if posted in #news instead of here

[main frigate]

1. I'm confused why you don't post it on #news + ping everyone
2. Words always limited on describe art style. Pictures are needed but forum don't support to post pictures so I think you get it on a wrong platform

[turbid silo]

News incoming 😉

[south moat]

Tbh my feedback for that would be worthless
Don't got a job currently so no money to spend on cosmetic stuff

[main frigate]

#❔┃ask-the-community message
yes, don't support pictures

[digital oriole]

Drerick sorry no money to spend, = Do not care about MTX.

[crystal vale]

"We're excited to hear from you all about cosmetics in Last Epoch." Don't be like Diablo 4 and hide all the cool cosmetics on the store!!

[wooden aurora]

market research for cosmetic MTX... I get that they need to make money but they sure are firing on all the monitization cilinders without showing much for it...

[karmic wharf]

The recent mtx asks about items. Why? We need SKILL MTX.

[jade oak]

I mean we've been looking on your insight into expansion. It's been couple weeks already, and you still havent clarified if its going to be free or are you going to scam all the early supporters by doing a paid "expansion"

[north heath]

More shield mtx plz!

[simple bison]

The post is asking about mtx in general

a skill mtx is still an "item" in the store

[pulsar pollen]

Speaking of cosmetics, the cosmic hammer throw is one of the coolest mtx I ever bought

[lone plaza]

with the announcment of PS5 release, has there been any news about xbox release, and specifically if it would be cross platform with PC? Would like to talk my friend who has an xbox into getting LE if so

[simple bison]

Nothing announced regarding that yet. It's likely gonna be a while yet until the port comes out

[karmic wharf]

thats not how it reads tho

[pulsar pollen]

Xbox has the series S issue

Probably slowing things down

[simple bison]

It is to me. And I'm 90% sure that's what they meant. Skill mtx aren't any different from equipment mtx

[crystal vale]

Xbox has the Xbox issue lol

[pulsar pollen]

Right but more specifically I would bet the series S is why LE hasn't announced anything

[stable forum]

at this point it's probably better to port to Switch 2 than it is xbox lol

[lone plaza]

hey man youre preaching to the choir im pc

unfortunately gotta meet the homeboy where he is lol

[pulsar pollen]

The series X plays the Sims really well my wife tells me so there's that

[sudden palm]

anyone know what the paid dlc will have content wise ?

[simple bison]

Not announced yet

[south moat]

If we knew there would've been an announcement about it

And the people who do have an idea without announcement can't talk about it

[fallow sleet]

For me I just distilled the whole deal into two possible scenarios.

1: The expac is not worth its money and not enough people will buy it.

2: The expac is worth its money and enough people will buy it.

I know there's plenty of other permutations one can think of, but I just decided to keep it simple.

[karmic prairie]

another SURVEY 🥹

bruh

[main frigate]

This problem may be solved by giving players more ranks like poe 2. I still remember how expensive the highest rank is (the level includes artbook)

[south moat]

Go fill it
Maybe you'll get a cookie as a reward (you won't)

[main frigate]

I'm not the people EHG find, sorry

But it's interesting to check out more ideas from EHG

I want to grab a free plate under the username from EHG's event instead

[south moat]

Not sure whar you mean

[fresh warren]

Pretty specific questions on that cosmetics feedback questionnaire. I'll just say I would've bought some if any were worth buying, but for now nothing seems worth the price. Saying this as a dude with thousands spent in that other games cosmetics over 14 or so years.

[rancid pulsar]

so where's the google form to give my feedback in an overseeable manner? Forum threads are so annoying to navigate lmao

might have to give feedback about feedback

[fickle birch]

Personally, and amongst all my friends who play, the collective is that the worst part of LE are the cosmetics. They're very random and mostly bland or ugly. The game is addictive, which is the most important part, but yes the cosmetics need an upgrade.

[main frigate]

I think that puppeteer skill mtx and honey mentor mtx are impressive. But I will not buy them because If I bought one of them, I will want a set of skill mtx for mage/acolyte. But my balance don't support me to do that 🤷‍♀️

I must train myself not interested in mtx. It's not the problem EHG care.

[fickle birch]

I should also note that the only reason I bought the supporter packs was to support the game because I like it so much. The cosmetics themselves are negligible, as previously stated.

[granite kindle]

Cosmetic ping 💀

[kind harbor]

EHG never learns. They don't understand people play the game on Steam, not on LE forums. They post news on discord for fraction of users and I bet fraction of this fraction doesn't have the server muted, and then fraction of that will actually participate on the forum.

There were multiple threads on Steam discussions about this topic and conclusion is simple - cosmetics in LE are just bad. If devs took a bit of their time and actually read through some of the discussions they would know it, but they want our help and they expect us to come to their place, not them coming to place players actually use.

Normal, smart developer would post it as a "news" on Steam and get a response

[fickle birch]

This was my initial thought as well. They've either failed in the sense to acknowledge the Steam forums, or completely ignored them; both of which are terrible practices for a company that wants positive feedback from a player base that is already annoyed by the buyout.

[errant verge]

lol collect cosmetic feedback but no content

Plz fix bugs

And finish the game

[fickle birch]

They can do both things at the same time. Take a deep breath.

[errant verge]

lol they have demonstrated the bandwidth before to do neither

[kind harbor]

it's simple - cosmetics are the only revenue they have not counting the game sale, and they said they weren't profitable since 1.0. They had a lot of time to fix the problem, but they decided to ask the playerbase only after they sold themselves and p*ssed everyone with new expansion

[fickle birch]

And being completely off topic and badgering them about it won't help.

They asked for cosmetic feedback, not echo the issues they're already aware of.

[grave idol]

can someone try to interact with me in game. it doesnt seem to work at all

Im on SE Asia

name is RedEyz

[mellow robin]

hopefully they don't go the Bethesda route (which is fix 10 bugs, intro 150 more)

[kind harbor]

they already do

[severe socket]

99 little bugs in the code,
99 little bugs in the code.
Take one down, patch it around...
117 little bugs in the code.

[nimble topaz]

the game stucks and we're here to talk about cosmetics?

[mellow robin]

i hate how hard this made me laugh

[severe socket]

What else is there to talk about?

Rhetorical, really.

[regal finch]

let's instead make artists fix code bugs, that will go well 😏

[glass pendant]

Great first step in the spirit of back and forth constructive conversation ❤️ would be amazing for this to happen for more topics looking forward

[severe socket]

Good thing I'm not a programmer, or else I'd have been SUFFERING from this. xD

[nimble topaz]

Honestly, I would have preferred a conversation about the game dynamics, gameplay and improvements, not cosmetics.

[regal finch]

i really hate how after like 20 re-re-re-rereleases Skyrim is still full of bugs. now Oblivion alongside it as well.

[severe socket]

It's their trade secret at this point. 😄

[kind harbor]

game dynamics, gameplay and improvements do not bring in money

[severe socket]

They really should commemorate it.

[nimble topaz]

but they lead to the future of the game

[regal finch]

can't have future if there's no money to pay the devs

[glass pendant]

I suggested that the team ask us for feedback on topics moving forward so that the suggestions channel isn't a one way street

[kind harbor]

there is no future, LE has new owners and promises are already being broken, now it will be all about how much Le can be milked before it dies

[glass pendant]

I'm all for criticizing the shortcomings of the game, but let's not shoot down good decisions

I'm sure Derrick will do this for more things in the future if this is successful and not toxic

[nimble topaz]

Last Epoch currently has the same number of users as TQ2, which is in Early Access with only 2 acts. Is there a reason why after a week no one was playing?

[kind harbor]

TQ2 is very good

[regal finch]

TQ2 wasn't available for like 6 years before this point 🧐

it's still new and intriguing

[nimble topaz]

What I'm saying isn't about TQ2, but how LE is doing even worse than Diablo 4. Instead of doing better, it's always doing worse. The game has been stalled since it came out. They had to add a new act that wasn't needed and needed more fresh dynamics. And now we're here talking about cosmetics. But if the game is dying, are we talking about cosmetics?

[kind harbor]

for the reason I said above

[nimble topaz]

Krafton didn't buy LE for glory and to kill it, but to exploit it as best as possible and make a profit. I think it will be much better when they actually intervene, because one of their games has been in the top 3 on SteamDB for a long time.

[severe socket]

Only time will tell.

[nimble topaz]

I hope we don't have to wait at least a year

[kind harbor]

because the game has a good dev, Krafton just cares about profit

[glass pendant]

Personally I'm retiring any drive for criticism I have, for season 4, which I feel will be pivotal for the future of the game

[severe socket]

At least LE is faring better than Superfuse.

Which has literally $0 for its value as an IP overall.

[nimble topaz]

Profit or not, PUBG has been in the top 3 for a long time now with at least 300,000 players. This means their system for entertaining people is working and I believe in what they will do with LE.

[kind harbor]

PUBG... just is, nothing much needs to be done with it

[glass pendant]

it's sadly not a 1-1 comparison. Battle arenas are fast food content, arpgs are niche in the gaming world with only poe2 being currently in the top 50 concurrent

[fickle birch]

Took the reply I was about to make right out of my mouth. Lol

Comparing apples to oranges is not healthy.

[glass pendant]

Yup, if it was that easy, Subnautica 2 would be out and scoring millions

[outer void]

I've never bought cosmetics on any arpg game. I honestly don't know why. Because I've purchased A LOT of skins on League of Legends, and spent time grinding certain currencies to try and sell UNWANTED skins to purchase ones I did want.

[kind harbor]

for me it's because they are often unappealing and overpriced

[outer void]

But, hopefully everyone here in the LE community can give EHG some constructive criticism on positive cosmetic improvements.

[kind harbor]

in Marvel Rivals I can but battlepass for 10$ and they give me 5$ back, 10 skins and a lot of other stuff completing it

what do LE skin bundles give you?

I mean, look what 10$ can give you in LE

a bird, ugly sloth backpack and 2 situational weapon skins

[outer void]

Do LE skins apply to every class, or are they individualized? Like can a brand new season 3 skin be applied to all 5 classes?

[kind harbor]

I am looking at these packs on Steam and... I don't know

that's another major issue

nobody will risk 70$ just to learn about it

[fringe lotus]

What is TQ2

[kind harbor]

Titan Quest II

[severe socket]

Worth noting that it's the season's lull period.

[outer void]

Do you think that could be somewhat alleviated with a log-in type of system that rewards you with currency towards buying cosmetics or in-game items?

[simple bison]

All classes

[severe socket]

As someone who doesn't give half a f--k about MTX in general, let alone cosmetics, I have no idea.

That, plus I don't think adding a daily "carrot on a stick" would be a good move.

I'll take gachas as an example, namely genshin which I've HEAVILY burned out quite a while ago.

[outer void]

Yeah, maybe if there was PVP or some other reason to log-in outside of pushing endgame... then log-in rewards would make more sense.

[severe socket]

The only two things that still keep me tethered to that crap are daily grind and remnants of curiosity about when and how this whole chapter ends, if ever.

[severe socket]

Pushing endgame doesn't make sense either because the curve is too steep at various places.

[simple bison]

Imo challenges with cosmetic (or otherwise) rewards would help retention a decent amount

Basically same as Poe

[severe socket]

Besides, the closer you're to level cap, the more unnecessarily quadratic the XP curve gets.

Which has been profoundly p---ing me off if I'm being honest.

[kind harbor]

This

[severe socket]

I HATE XP GATING WITH NO PAYOFFS

[kind harbor]

I was shitting on it so much in S2 dev in it'sr grace banned me from here for 24h

[pastel summit]

Wasn't that an intentional change a while back? Make it easier to get to 80 but harder to get past that?

[severe socket]

I would understand if all there was beyond that point was skill level scaling.

But gating passives behind a parabolic curve?

WTF is even that.

[simple bison]

How long does it take people to get to 100? I feel like my view on it is skewed or something since this doesn't register for me as an issue at all anymore. What would be a reasonable amount of time in your opinion? Or is the time not an issue, but just the fact that it slows down so much?

[severe socket]

I know we're beating a decayed horse skeleton at this point, but still.

[kind harbor]

after lvl 95 it slows down too much

[severe socket]

Personally, I don't believe I'm ever gonna hit Lv100 in LE.

EVER.

[kind harbor]

hitting last few levels is basically a second job

[simple bison]

That's honestly wild to me. How long do you usually play a character for?

[severe socket]

Not as wild if you recall that I'm all of the below at once:

• A parent
• Someone with fluctuating job load
• A RAGING altoholic

[pearl orbit]

100 is super quick to hit in LE

[simple bison]

That's how I feel too tbh. But maybe I'm just a fast leveler / play a lot, so I wanna know about others experience

[severe socket]

Which leaves me little to no free time to actually invest into LE beyond the point where it stops being something relaxing.

[worldly valve]

only if u have apples

[kind harbor]

obviously if you play some of the meta buils like most of the defenders of this game do you play at cor 1000 and level fast

[simple bison]

I feel like you can still very much hit 100 with the first two, and that's its the third point stopping you

[kind harbor]

but people who play their own builds and fight cor 300-500 are f*cked

[outer void]

I think I've put about 25 hours into my paladin this season. He's level 91 currently.

[simple bison]

That's reasonable

[kind harbor]

my last char pushed it to 600 and leveling was barely bearable

[worldly valve]

paladin is very bad

[simple bison]

No it's not xd

[worldly valve]

whatu need is abirdman

[outer void]

I should specify, Judgement Paladin.

[kind harbor]

take judgement and forget about any mechanic in the game

[simple bison]

I mean yeah falconer is the fastest leveling mastery

Is 50 hours or less for level 100 reasonable? I'm not saying that's how long it takes, but if it were to be how long it takes is that too long or is it fine

(if you hurry you can get level 100 on any mastery in less than 35 hours currently, some less than 24 hours)

[kind harbor]

in LE, no

there is no content to spend 50h on

[simple bison]

What would a reasonable timeframe be?

[kind harbor]

hard to say, 30?

[simple bison]

And are we talking casual play or trying to rush level 100

[kind harbor]

casual

I could accept 50h in GD, but not in LE

[simple bison]

I wouldn't be super against it tbh. It sounds a good amount faster than it is now, but I don't really care personally either way

[severe socket]

It's not about "can I hit Lv100", it's about "how long is it gonna take". And with all the factors combined plus the fact that I've been catching increasingly severe bouts of burnout lately, the latter is leaning too dangerously into the "probably never" territory.

[kind harbor]

the problem is the terrible balance this game has

for everyone the leveling seems different depending on the build

people who sit on maxroll for 24h and play judgement or frogs game seems easy

[severe socket]

I've already mentioned Grim Dawn apparently allowing to hit the cap reasonably fast even on Normal with one of the recent patches.

[kind harbor]

for me who wanted to play black arrows (which are useless no matter how you play it) it's painful

[kind harbor]

GD is the GOAT

[severe socket]

And the fact that the game intends the player to actually finalize their builds, as in have all the intended skill/attribute/devotion points at their disposal.

[kind harbor]

I am buying FoA even if they charge AAA price for it

[severe socket]

ikr? 3.7k hours under my belt.

[kind harbor]

I have 312 but I enjoyed every second of it

and the only reason I am not playing it now is because I don't want to play before FoA

[simple bison]

I mean nowadays shatterstrike is reasonably meta but it used to be seen as really bad (and It was) and I've always played it and never really felt the hindrance of levelling personally. I guess I also just don't really care about hitting 100 generally, it just happens eventually

Even when I play super wonky builds like lightning harbinger of stars meteor I hit 100

and that build capped out at 200 or 300 corruption

[kind harbor]

in S1 I was going mad at lvl 70, at S2 and 3 I was going mad after lvl 85 so... it's all about content

[simple bison]

I've even reached 100 with old tempest strike

[severe socket]

Said eventuality is an approximate not every player is able to reach at all, let alone within reasonable timeframe.

[kind harbor]

LE has no content tbh

playing just to push a bigger corruption is boring

[simple bison]

Idk Personally I feel 50 hours is reasonable for 3 months. Now you can say the content dries up before that point but to me that's no reason to really make it faster, but a reason to make more content if anything

and like yeah I guess they can make it faster until the wider community agrees there is enough content to raise it but people will get mad no matter what if they raise it

[kind harbor]

yes, but people do not want to play a game for 3 months just for new season to drop and play it again

[simple bison]

they can't just make it way faster now and keep raising it every season little by little until we get to where we are now again when we have the content

[kind harbor]

except very few individuals who play mainly one game

[simple bison]

they'd get backlash for it every season

[simple bison]

I totally agree with that, and trust me I don't play LE for 3 months lol

My seasons last a month max if even

same goes for poe and other arpg's btw

But like 2 hours a day will get you to 100 in 25 days (less than a month) if it took 50 hours (it can take substantially less if you know how to level quickly)

To me that's not unreasonably slow. Especially considering you can get 100 in 30 or so hours in reality

and that's without 1000 corruption. I'm talking about 300 corruption

because that's what we ran when we raced

[silk wolf]

Seasons are very popular and have been so since diablo 2. In diablo 2, there was not even anything new, just a reset.

[simple bison]

I've added a decent chunk of time on top of it since I know I'm an experienced player and all that

[kind harbor]

I have 527h in LE. I played in beta till lvl 60 and then 3 times during S1, S2 and S3 hitting level 100. That doesn't look like 50h to hit level 100 for me

I wonder how long did I play this season because I quit right after hitting 100

and we could see how long it takes hitting level 100 for average non-meta player

[simple bison]

If it takes more than 50 hours (almost double the time it takes if you use some basic strategies and focus on leveling) I'm not sure what's going on honestly, which is why I've been trying to ask questions and come to an understanding

I'm a non meta player but I also understand I'm not an average player, so I can't use myself to gauge the norm

[kind harbor]

I clear all optional maps, I don't rush campaign, I read most of the dialogues

[simple bison]

How long does the campaign take total would you say?

like until you go into echoes and never touch it again

[kind harbor]

hard to say at this point, between 10 and 15?

what is this plague of hacked accounts

every server for past couple of days

[simple bison]

Okay there's a decent chunk of extra time for sure, not enough to take it above 50 hours though I don't feel

I guess if you take everything nice and slow and are methodical about everything it can take more than 50 for sure though

[kind harbor]

I feel like levels 90-100 are half of my playtime

[simple bison]

Since I personally just skip everything that can be skipped and rush through

[simple bison]

Yeah that's about right

[kind harbor]

that's a massive jump in requirements

[simple bison]

98-100 takes around as much xp as 1-98. Obviously you're gaining a ton more xp at that point though

[kind harbor]

not if you don't play at very high corruption, some builds are just not ready for it

[simple bison]

would you say 300 is very high?

since even just getting to empowered doubles your xp gain

[kind harbor]

I think 300 is possible with any build

[simple bison]

that's what I use when I rush 100

I stay at around 300

sometimes I'll go higher but generally not really since I won't have the gear on my kinda mid build

Meta builds like razorfall falconer absolutely can push higher faster

but you don't need to do it to level quickly is my point

Like at most I'll go to maybe 500

but usually I'll be around 300

[kind harbor]

multiple people stated in game that farming higher corruption for exp is not good, it's better do lower corruption for lower exp but with how fast you can clear it you are still way ahead

maybe higher corruption should also give exponentially more exp

[simple bison]

yep. the xp gain drops off after 300 and then again at higher thresholds

[kind harbor]

because I always level on the highest corruption I can hit

[kind harbor]

but why?

[simple bison]

It used to have a linear relationship but it caused toxic gameplay patterns since it gave too much incentive for people to only play meta high corruoption pushing builds

[kind harbor]

what's the point of it?

[simple bison]

since xp = favor for your factions

[kind harbor]

and that's where youa re wrong, normal players don't do that, discord screechers do

[simple bison]

Normal players don't get to 1000 corruption anyway so it doesn't really matter for them

[kind harbor]

this game is in the state it is because it got influenced by top meta one percenters

[simple bison]

Making it so 1000 corruption gives more xp won't affect normal players at all

But it makes the game worse for people who do get there because of the reasons stated

[kind harbor]

yes, but normal people will hit 300, and if there is punishment for playing higher then 300 it's an issue

[simple bison]

There's no punishment

you still get more xp and better loot

[kind harbor]

it is, difficulty goes up more than exp

[simple bison]

farming at higher corruption is pure upside

yes, which is why you park where your build is comfy

[severe socket]

Except once you hit 300C, diminishing returns start kicking in.

[simple bison]

if it's anything higher than 300 you're good basically

[severe socket]

And it gets worse the deeper you're in.

[kind harbor]

exactly

you yourself farm at 300

[simple bison]

Yes? so people don't feel preassured to only play builds that can do 5000 corruption

I think that's a good thing no?

[kind harbor]

now it's clear, I play cor 600, game is 2 times harder but only 1.25x more rewarding

it's just stupid

[severe socket]

5000C is pure insanity.

[simple bison]

You guys may not feel that incentive but a lot of people do

and by a lot it's still obviously a minority

but it's a good amount of the people who get to empowered

(which is also a small minority)

[kind harbor]

and where is that "lot of people"? Every new season brings back half of the players

[simple bison]

That's not the case, the drop off isn't that drastic

[simple bison]

I meant it as a proportion of the active playerbase

even if it's 3 people out of 10 total

that's a "lot" proportionally

[severe socket]

Someone in the community said a while ago that the game poses itself to be a middle ground between D4 and PoE, but still somehow caters to the cream of the crop of its playerbase instead of the bulk average.

[kind harbor]

yeah, but maybe making 3 out of 10 people slightly more happy will make another 3 out of 10 people stop playing the game entirely

[simple bison]

I personally dislike the "middle of poe and d4" thing

[severe socket]

Wrong wording as usual on my part, but the point is still the same.

[simple bison]

I don't think its ever been accurate

[kind harbor]

no, wtaht was what LE was supposed to be for a lot of people, something between D4 and PoE

[simple bison]

I mean a lot of people say that. I just don't agree with it

[kind harbor]

but it went PoE direction and surprise, PoE is just better at being PoE

[simple bison]

It didn't really go in the poe direction, It's always been in that direction since like 0.9

or at least as long as I've been playing (0.8. something)

[kind harbor]

no, it went like it since 1.1

[simple bison]

Not really? Even during 0.9 they were adding more and more systems that made the game more complex

like dungeons

legendaries

exiled mages and experimental crafting

they've just continued that

[kind harbor]

but it still felt... normal

[simple bison]

Yes because there wasn't much to it yet

just like poe in the early days

[kind harbor]

only after 1.1 I started feeling like normal builds struggle

[simple bison]

Because of aberroth?

[severe socket]

There's one thing that gets me all the time: who the hell at EHG thought that flagging a content-incomplete game as release-ready was a good idea?

[kind harbor]

yes

Abberoth jump was insane

[simple bison]

Would you say it's wrong to introduce content not meant for everyone? as in aspirational content

[kind harbor]

especially when fighting him is expensive

[inner finch]

I'd say money

[kind harbor]

I am still afraid to go into him solo

[inner finch]

It was clearly running out

[kind harbor]

because of how punishing losing to him is

[simple bison]

What's the punishment?

you just lose the eye

[kind harbor]

losing an eye

[simple bison]

which you can get from any harbinger

[severe socket]

I can say that I know one case of a successful turnaround: Wuthering Waves. They did ONE HELL of a bounce over there.

[simple bison]

You can very consistently get eyes, Idk I don't see eye to eye with you there

[severe socket]

That said, again, "releasing" a game with its main storyline lacking at least 3 chapters is wild.

[kind harbor]

but playing echoes just for opportunity to fight harbinger and then hoping it drops is not really fun

[simple bison]

even at low corruption as long as you always summon a harbinger in your timeline boss fights you'll have a decently steady supply

[kind harbor]

it's too much time for one attempt

[simple bison]

But their only use is fighting him

It's not like you can either fight him or use them on something else

[severe socket]

I'm not even talking about backend literally crumbling away on them on release day.

[kind harbor]

but when I start with 10 eyes, I die 5 times because I don't fully know mechanics because he has a lot of phases I say "fck it, I am losing my drops"

abberoth should be free until first kill ot it should have practice mod or something

[simple bison]

It took poe 4 years after launch to have all its campaign acts

[kind harbor]

I am not wasting eyes to learn how the fight works

[simple bison]

I think they were just taking a page out of their playbook

[severe socket]

And which business model did GGG pick for PoE?

[kind harbor]

and I don't want to watch yt videos on it

[severe socket]

How sustainable was PoE during its first year?

[simple bison]

That's a different topic no?

[kind harbor]

tbh it is

[severe socket]

Different, but still relevant to where we're currently.

[simple bison]

You're saying it's not okay to release 1.0 without a finished campaign, but other games have done it and it's totally fine

[severe socket]

Yes, I'm saying that having a content-incomplete game flagged as release-ready is not okay.

[simple bison]

Sure but we can't talk about the entirety of reality at once

We have to pick a topic

[kind harbor]

I agree

LE has so many problems we can't talk about all of them at once

[severe socket]

I'd say money
it was clearly running out
↑ #💬┃general message, #💬┃general message
Let's say this distracted me somewhat.

[simple bison]

To me, the state of the campaign is completely inconsequential personally. I know it's not for others and that's totally fine. But because I couldn't care less about the campaign it results in me not really seeing eye to eye with the argument that they should've waited on 1.0 specifically because the campaign wasn't finished. To ehg it seems that the threshold for 1.1 was having 3 masteries for each class and to me that's as good a threshold as any tbh

[kind harbor]

My friends always ask me "is the campaign finished" when I tell them new season starts

casuals do care about it

[simple bison]

And I don't doubt that for a second

But at the same time does it really matter what version number the game is on

they would be asking the same thing if 0.9.9 came out

[kind harbor]

I thing for many people it does

when people see 1.0 they expect game to have an ending

[simple bison]

Idk because my friends asked me about the campaign before 1.0 too

[kind harbor]

I know it's not always the case but that's how many view it

[simple bison]

They played the game early on when 0.9 had just come out and would occasionally ask about the campaign whenever a big update came out

same as now whenever a new season comes out

they'd ask, I'd say no. And then we'd still play

[severe socket]

Aside from the story not being remotely complete, the deliberate lack of P2P multiplayer capability is a deal-breaker for me personally. This one is, too, a long-decayed corpse of a horse to keep beating, sadly.

[kind harbor]

well because some games finish the campaign before 1.0 and just add stuff till 1.0

[simple bison]

Like lan?

[kind harbor]

the point is campaign should be finished not later than 1.0

[simple bison]

or self hosting

[wispy notch]

There tends to be "hype", or promotional events tied to major versions. Which in turn gets new eyes on the game.
In that case I completetly see why a good, engaging and complete campaign matters. It's the first experience new players will have, and if they aren't veterans of the genre they don't have the option of racing through it if doesn't engage them.
With the game also being buy-to-play, it's even more important to make people feel they got their moneys worth.

[severe socket]

Both.

GD can host and join both LAN games and WAN-broadcasted games (achievable via UPnP).

[simple bison]

Fair but also not always true. I feel like the campaign is just one of many things you can consider for when a game should reach 1.0. And for the arpg category I'd say it's at its weakest compared to other genres

[severe socket]

But GD is a singleplayer game first, coop second.

[simple bison]

You can't compare LE to GD like that

[severe socket]

LE is a weird case. It can work as a singleplayer game, but I can't utilize my own LAN to play with my kid, for instance, when he grows up enough.

[simple bison]

LE is server authoritative, and GD have mentioned that if they could they likely would have made it server authoritative as well. And if they did you likely wouldn't have had the same LAN and hosting capabilties

[severe socket]

So both of us have to suffer both WAN latencies and backend whateverthefreakery.

[simple bison]

But they used the TQ engine and just didn't have the resources to make that happen

I do think LE having LAN for offline mode would be dope personally

[severe socket]

Ok, let's get back a bit and recall Diablo 2.

[simple bison]

And maybe self hosting offline characters would be dope too

[kind harbor]

I agree that when it comes to arpgs campaign doesn't play as big of a role but it still does, and many players are not typical arpg players. My friends bought LE, played it with me even if they do not have love for arpgs but abandoned it after they realized only farming echoes left

but they all loved GD

[severe socket]

It can be singleplayer, it can be local multiplayer, it can be WAN multiplayer.

[simple bison]

Totally fair

[severe socket]

All in one package.

[simple bison]

I know a decent chunk of people who play arpg's only really play the campaign

[kind harbor]

I think the problem is LE is barely for anyone

[simple bison]

Also not server authoritative

[kind harbor]

who is attracted to LE because I don't really know

what does it have to build their own community?

that's an important question

[simple bison]

I am. But maybe not a lot of the arpg community are like me (I don't think that's the case. I actually think a lot of people want to like LE). I also enjoy poe and other arpg's and genres though

I think the main isusue LE has currently is not enough content and not fast enough

Poe basically had the equivalent of 1.2 every 3 months for years

while for LE 1.2 took 9 months

[kind harbor]

Diablo has nostalgia, marketing and is fully casual. PoE is hardcore and market related. TQ goes hard on mythology, has nice campaign and mixes classes. GD is full SP experience that also mixes classes and you can do any build you want. What does LE have? I think the original direction it was heading, live service game that is harder and more advanced than Diablo but more welcoming than PoE is where this game could shine. At some point LE abandoned this idea and right now it is not for any particular group

[simple bison]

If you think about it GGG is an absolute content engine

[severe socket]

Even Battle.Net mode?

[simple bison]

To be fair I'd say LE is still substantially easier to get into than poe

[wispy notch]

I originally bought Last Epoch due to its promise of being focused on polishing the fundamentals of the genre, and with less burden of knowledge in order to make builds (I love PoE, but some of the obscure ways unique item effects interact is a big turnoff). Though I feel that the game has drifted away from that.

[kind harbor]

It is, but it becomes harder and harder. Abby was one big jump, adding tombs and ubby leaped into hardcore category

[simple bison]

Battle net realms are weird. I think by now they likely are authoritative but back then not really no

The server would believe what your computer told them way too easily at first

[severe socket]

Back then nobody really gave cheaters that much thought until it became too rampant to ignore.

[simple bison]

yep

My point is if LE were to make LAN and P2P a thing they'd need to make brand new netcode, you can't copy paste server authoritative netcode for those

[severe socket]

Then again, as long as ladders are out of the picture, why not let players just coop up in their own network to take some steam off the backend?

[simple bison]

and they've deemed it not worth the resources, and honestly I totally agree

for the people that would use it it'd be awesome

but 99% of people won't use it

[severe socket]

...sigh.

[simple bison]

Look. If we had a magic wand that could make everyones dreams come true I'm sure EHG would wave it around. I cannot imagine it's worth the investment money or resource wise

[severe socket]

What is worth investment money in the first place?

[simple bison]

we're talking about basically having several 1.3 patches for the sake of this functionality (if you took away chapter 10 from 1.3)

[simple bison]

Something that makes a profit

[severe socket]

I have no bloody idea where the game even wants to go direction-wise.

[simple bison]

or at least breaks even

[wispy notch]

It would be nice, but there's probably a lot more work involved in adding "offline multiplayer" support than we could even start to guess at. And I'd personally like to have them focus their efforts elsewhere for now.

[simple bison]

Exactly this

[kind harbor]

both things are true, it would be nice but it's not worth it and 99% of people wouldn't use it

[severe socket]

They wasted WAY TOO MUCH time and effort juggling two codebases at once pre-0.9.

[simple bison]

They still are

[severe socket]

...oh ffs...

[simple bison]

online and offline are not the same

[viral kelp]

indeed it is. but PoE, once it hooks you, it never lets go. I've been playing LE since 2021 and always hoping to get a similar feeling, even if it doesn't last as long. but the endgame just doesn't do it for me. it's not just about the quantity of content but the kind of content. there aren't enough "surprise" moments inside echos, making many feel very samey. and just chasing after corruption is a bit boring, at least for me

[kind harbor]

that's true

[simple bison]

Not sure about that. I and a lot of my friends used to play every poe league, and then every other. And now I haven't played since crucible

[severe socket]

PoE, once it hooks you, it never lets go
My gaping crater of a burnout at 234.3h would like to argue.

[simple bison]

But I do agree LE just needs more meat

[severe socket]

I tried getting into it. I really did. It never clicked in the end.

[kind harbor]

but we can look at the numbers and we can see PoE keeps their fanbase while LE is bleeding

we should ask ourselves the question why

and my opinion is LE doesn't have a designated group to target

[viral kelp]

I had a similar experience I think. I was introduced to PoE by a friend, back in 2016. I played even a little longer than that, with my friend's help but it just didn't click. Then I tried the game again, late 2019 and with the help of a different friend (who just explained the concepts of the game differently), I finally understood the game on a base level and it hooked me. I have 6000 hours played now and I absolutely love it. but I can see how it doesn't click for some, I was the same

[severe socket]

LE is its own Forge Guard. Tries to be everything at once but keeps failing at it. imio anyway.

[simple bison]

LE has a good chunk of older content that's basically just not used anymore (arena, lightless arbour, soulfire bastion especially but even temporal sanctum, nobody runs it anymore you just skip to the boss) that are in desperate need of a refresh or rework. The monolith system is also kindoff antiquated imo and corruption as a whole could use an overhaul and then on top of that it just needs more content. Either sidecontent that you can do instead of echoes or in addition to them

[wispy notch]

One is a f2p game that anyone can pick up and try, the other is a paid game. I do not believe that LE will have an "endless" lifespan unless it pulls of something like No Mans Sky or Final Fantasy Online; where the core game is solid enough that each content cycle encourages some people that don't own the game to go "why not? Worth a try".

[viral kelp]

PoE has so much content and so little tutorialization that it is very aggravating for a new player coming in. specially if the game is not introduced to you by a friend

[simple bison]

I'd say it's because there's nothing to do after a certain point in LE, which you yourself agreed with when we were talking about leveling. While in poe there's always like 5 things you can think of that you haven't touched yet or can do to get something for your character

[kind harbor]

yes, that is also big part of the problem

[simple bison]

Yep, which is why imo the biggest issue is that LE hasn't pumped out enough content fast enough to keep the playerbases attention

[severe socket]

First of all, its utterly bizarre economy is a major turnoff for people like me. Second, it's way too punishing to experiment with builds, the cost of error makes homebrew not worth the hassle. Third, for altoholics like me, it's just unsustainable.

[viral kelp]

all fair points mate! though I don't understand what you really mean about the third one. is the the character slot limit or something different?

[kind harbor]

I can agree with that, but I also think the big problem is LE doesn't fill any void, especially the biggest one that is live service game that is easier than PoE but harder than Diablo IV

[severe socket]

I mean that if I branch out to make an alt, then it means that I'm literally starting over with a blank slate with all the same risks and costs attached as my main.

[simple bison]

Imo LE isn't "easier" than poe, it's just more approachable

[elfin vortex]

Is it me or the loot in LE is just downright pathetic ?

[simple bison]

Once you have accumilated enough knowledge in poe you realize most if not all its systems are pretty straight forward

it just has a ton of them

[kind harbor]

I think it is way easier than PoE, I tried couple of times but I never hit level 100 in PoE or got far into maps, in LE I could clear any content until S2

[elfin vortex]

Here I am doing level 90 mono's, myself at level 91 and constantly getting loot that is dozens of levels below me ( with low stats )

[viral kelp]

that is not entirely true. when you start with a new character other than your main, you are able to get twink gear much more easily. also you don't have to repeat the trials that are required to ascend (poe's version of specialization). there are less steps required on your second (or more) character

[simple bison]

I'd say that just goes to show it's more approachable, it's easier to learn as you go in LE while in POE you kinda hit a brick wall right away since if you make a mistake you're cooked

[severe socket]

Guess it's been made to be this way long after I was gone from the scene entirely.

[simple bison]

But if you knew everything about both games I don't think you do anything in poe that's a lot more complex or mechanically harder than you need to do in LE

[viral kelp]

when did you last try the game? it might be worth trying again, the game has change quite a lot in the past 6 years

[kind harbor]

true, that's one of the reasons. Another reason is I hate having to use markets in games. The idea LE came up with (factions) is the best thing this dev ever made.

[severe socket]

Bestiary.

And like I said, I've burned out so hard it left a gaping crater in me.

[simple bison]

Yeah I agree I almost always go CoF personally. playing SSF in poe makes it very obvious the game isn't designed for it

even though it can also be fun

[kind harbor]

I 100% agree that's why I accepted PoE isn't really for me and that's fine

[wispy notch]

You want to hit empowered mono's and then start pushing mechanics that improve your odds of dropping exalted gear. Then either use uniques with Legendary Potential or multi-exalt items.
Level 90 mono's are still very "early" to the endgame.

[viral kelp]

well, if you ever decide to give it another try, let me tell you the game is so different than it was back in bestiary that you may hardly even recognize much of it. and about the economy, the game now has an "auction house" like trading system for currency and soon a similar system is gonna be added for all gear and items (it already exists in poe 2 and it's great)

[severe socket]

...I'll pass, but thanks for the offer.

[elfin vortex]

Already got those mechanism... but if empowered mono is what you want, what is the point of the regular ones ? To waste your time ? I mean mindlessly pressing the same buttons to get garbage loot non stop gets boring extremely fast.
I cleared hundreds of the same boring maps, only to use the same gear for a long time, because nothing usefull ever drops

The loot drops are just very poorly designed, simple as that.

What is the point of an ARPG if the loot is garbage ?

[severe socket]

MTX 😏

[elfin vortex]

Seriously now, I get the same stuff I was getting on a level 70 monolith when I am clearing a level 90 monolith

[simple bison]

They're the same thing, just higher level

Empowered doesn't unlock anything crazy

[thorn bane]

It's a stepping stone. But most people enter empowered in the early 70s. So you are just not being efficient in your routing to empowered

[simple bison]

So you weren't wasting your time in normal ones

[elfin vortex]

No, they are not even different level at least in the normal monos

[simple bison]

It's like saying you waste your time farming at 200 corruption when you wanna be at 1000 corruption

[thorn bane]

Level 70 and level 90 are still 0 corruption

[elfin vortex]

Nah, the loot is just trash

[elfin vortex]

So why even bother giving them different levels then ? What is the point ?

[thorn bane]

Smh learn how loot drops I guess

[elfin vortex]

I know how the loot drops.

Like shit

[thorn bane]

Stepping stone....

[elfin vortex]

Waste of time

[severe socket]

Certain bases only start dropping past certain level threshold.

[wispy notch]

Leveling, if you rushed into monos with campaign skips and the like.
I never spend any time in normal monos except what I have to in order to unlock empowered.

[elfin vortex]

I get it, but that stepping stone is just too big and boring

[thorn bane]

Some people take their time to empowered, others rush it. If you want good loot, rush it and push corruption

[thorn bane]

It doesn't even take a day to get from lvl 1 to empowerd

[elfin vortex]

I did not rush, if anything its so easy its boring

[elfin vortex]

That was not my point. The point is loot is trash

[thorn bane]

Talking in circles at this point

[kind harbor]

I think you are just accustomed to older loot systems. In LE level of the item is often fixed, it's not a level that dictates how powerful an item is but it's affixes, rolls, FP and LP

[elfin vortex]

Fair, so is level 90 good enough to go empowered ?

[severe socket]

Yes.

[elfin vortex]

But that is the thing, regardless of the level itself its just trash

[severe socket]

You're actually set up to hit empowered earlier than charLv90.

And empowered timelines start off as zoneLv100+C.

[elfin vortex]

Oh really ? THanks man, I though, to take my time, you know, hoped the loot gets good, but I have only 3 left to do the quests, guess I will rush them and go empowered

[kind harbor]

You drop 1000 items and one is good, you just need to know your character and to know what to look for

[severe socket]

You only have to beat one Lv90 normal timeline before you gain access to empowered ones.

[elfin vortex]

I know EXACTLY what I am looking for, its just that even rares and exalted ( and I see them non stop ) are rubbish

[severe socket]

Even on your main.

[elfin vortex]

Oh good

[thorn bane]

Lvl 70 for me

[near bobcat]

Ive been playing le on and off since release, casually. I've never seen abberoth, let alone beaten him. As someone who doesn't have hours a day to grind, end game feels like a chore. But, that first little while with a new character or new season is fun.

[severe socket]

Literally same word by word.

[elfin vortex]

See what you mean, but I feel really strong at level 90 paladin, I think level 70 I would be too weak

[kind harbor]

maybe your expectations are too big too early

[elfin vortex]

Oh yeah, sure, how dare I expect anything even close to decent loot once in dozens of maps cleared, I should get used seeing stuff I was getting 50 levels earlier, no ?
You for real ?

And level 90 is early now ?

Then when ? Will I stop seeing loot literally 40 levels below mine with useless stats ( Yeah I know loot level does not tell the whole story.... )

[thorn bane]

Depends on your experience, I've been playing for a couple years so I just rush it and skip from ch5 in the story to monos

[wispy notch]

The thing with empowered monos is that you unlock nemesis improvements from defeating harbingers. That in turn lets you generate base exalteds for a slot/type with something like 2-3 exalted and 50-60 forging potential. You then combine that with the weaver "same type" system to start dropping copies of that, along with runes to start changing which exalted stats you get.
Higher corruption speeds all of this up too.

[severe socket]

Heavily depends on your affixes and their tiers. I'd say past a certain point when you're looking for gear, if you know that a given slot has a unique that can benefit your build greatly, you first look for that unique and as much LP on it as physically possible, then you look for an exalted item with affixes+tiers you'd want said unique to have.

[wispy notch]

So even if an item has the "wrong stats", simply from being "of good quality", you can use it to reroll into something good.

[strange elm]

Dude use loot filter thats it 🫩

[wispy notch]

And empowered monos not only speed that up, but is required to unlock/progress the Forgotten Knights endgame faction.

[kind harbor]

I don't know what to tell you, I just don't agree, in my experience drops at level 40 and level 90 are way different

[dense spindle]

is online mode broken ? Stuck at loading char...

[severe socket]

Any VPN engaged?

LE hates that.

[dense spindle]

no VPN

[kind harbor]

probably VPN

[elfin vortex]

We must be playing different games, because the I am level 90 and did not even see a level 90 drop, allmost always 40-70 ( at most )

[elfin vortex]

Why would I waste the resources when its just terrible loot ? Especially when I am doing more than fine

[simple bison]

Level requirement has little to do with the quality of the item in this game

[severe socket]

Level requirement rises alongside total affix tiers on a given piece.

If an item has a total of T20+, naturally its level requirement is one of the highest.

[simple bison]

Even at level 100 it's normal to have items that only require level 70 or even less if they're unique

[severe socket]

Even if the base itself is low-level (IIRC anyway).

[wispy notch]

I was refering to what you can expect to see when doing higher corruption monoliths (2-3 exalt items with 50+ forging potential), as well as having mechanics to re-craft those items into what you need.

[magic moth]

Elon Musk in LE????

[severe socket]

?

[magic moth]

Cant believe you guys missed poe2 meme with Elon

[tardy bison]

exactly what I thought lmao

[wispy notch]

Musk was "playing" PoE2, and complaining about "bad low level items he wanted to replace" that had amazing stats, indicating he's not the one who geared up his character.

[inner finch]

we didnt, its just not funny or interesting

[elfin vortex]

So its normal that loot is garabe.
Got it

[simple bison]

No. You'll pretty much never have an item with a level requirement of 100

or even near it

[elfin vortex]

If recrafting is your answer, what is the point in the loot or clearing monos ?

[simple bison]

Level requirement has little to do with the power of the item

For example this ring is one of the rarest and strongest items in the game, and its level requirement is only 80

There are other examples where the level requirement is even lower

you can't equate the two

[thorn bane]

Well first you need a good base and affixes to craft off... hence the drop

[elfin vortex]

I have it and its kind of pointless for my build, compared to what I have

[simple bison]

That's fine. I was just showing it as an example

[elfin vortex]

Kind of pathetic if such a rare ring that people consider good turns out useless ( by rings I found 20 levels or more sooner )

[simple bison]

You have not found 20 red rings

I can guarantee you that lol

[elfin vortex]

Then again, what is the point of an ARPG, looting and clearing maps if you just " Craft it " ??!

[simple bison]

Or did I misunderstand

[elfin vortex]

Why would I need them even, they are worthless for my build.

I have rings better than that

[simple bison]

You have to first drop an item that's crafABLE, and then craft it

you can't just craft a white item to be good in this game

[simple bison]

That might very well be true for your build. But it was just an example, that ring is really good for a solid chunk of builds

[young night]

hey Cyborg, what do you mean by red ring?

[thorn bane]

Bruh I just explained it. Read again

[young night]

oh

its name

[simple bison]

yep

it's literally called the red ring of atlaria :P

[young night]

i was thinking rarity or something lol

[elfin vortex]

Funny to me how you all keep jumping hoops to justify this bad loot system

[young night]

derp

[simple bison]

If they just raised the level requirement would it be better? I don't understand the complaint

[thorn bane]

Look in the mirror, you just sound like a doomer. People are explaining it to you... its pretty standard for arpgs. Find loot with a solid base and a good exalted affix then craft it further or slam it on to a unique. Check the in game guides or YouTube for better explanations

[young night]

i think i use phantom grips

[astral vortex]

buddy acts like it a diablo 4 "crafting" system....

[simple bison]

Those are solid for some builds

[young night]

still trying to find one with good stats so i can slam it

diablo 4 has a crafting system?

or is that the joke?

[astral vortex]

exactly

tempering and masterworking... a half ass system

that is getting reworked tho

[young night]

diablo 4 is already meh'd me too much

[wispy notch]

At this point I'm just going to call "troll" and be done with it.
"Good loot" comes in many forms, and item level has nothing to do with its potential (especially in the case of Legendary items, which are defined by their potential... heh)
But mindlessly grinding easy normal monoliths without fully unlocking all game mechanics is naturally not going to be a fast and efficient way to obtain it, and even then you need the game knowledge to identify what is good or else you'll leave it behind.

[simple bison]

I haven't played D4 since the first preseason when it first came out xd, I'll play a season eventually I think to see how much it has changed since

[young night]

oh its not even the same game since preseason

[wispy notch]

Now excuse me as my lvl 100 rancid behind gets back to grinding lvl 20 items that are Best in Slot for me, while upping my corruption to a comfortable 700'ish to improve my odds of getting a starting point for crafting.

[young night]

less talky more grindy

[fickle birch]

It's crazy how true this statement is, and how boring D4 still is.

[young night]

yep

its better than it was, but the bar was never above kneel level

[fickle birch]

Yeah, they had (shit, still have) a very LONG way to go.

Even after 2 years. lol

And people are complaining about LE content? Lmao

[young night]

tbh id bail on d4 and devote resources to producing a better d5?

[simple bison]

Honestly my main issue with it was that none of the release classes really spoke to me. I really wish we could have a monk, crusader or paladin type class

[young night]

isnt that what a judgement sent is?

[fickle birch]

And then they added Spiritborn, which is just the most boring shit ever.

[young night]

spiritborn was fun for a week or two

[simple bison]

The gameplay was honestly fine, albeit a little boring and tedious maybe. But playing a class you don't really vibe with ruins it for me

[young night]

oh you meant in d4

[fickle birch]

Spamming evade to be the best class in the game is just not something any ARPG should aspire for, imo.

[astral vortex]

evade has never been best class in d4

[simple bison]

Ya

[astral vortex]

strong sure but its never been the strongest

[fickle birch]

I mean, pedantic much? lol

[young night]

i wonder if diablo games will ever let us play the demon side

[simple bison]

And tbh looking at gameplay now makes it seem like TLI or something which I'm not a fan of either. Dealing gajillions of damage while moving at mach 10 isn't something I love. Which is ironic considering one of my all time favourite poe builds is flicker strike

[young night]

try to kill the normal human players or something

[fickle birch]

They have that PvP area in D4, buuuuuut it's always just.... empty.

"Um actually, there are at least 2 or 3 people there at all times"
I beat you to it Kevin.

[astral vortex]

i mean you did say "Best class in the game"

just stating

its never been the best

[fickle birch]

Hyperbole and pedantic are just not in your vocabulary, and that's fine.

[astral vortex]

and this comment is unnecessary

[astral vortex]

same with this one

we can disagree no need to be rude lmao

[fickle birch]

I noticed you only said this after removing the "clown" reaction.

[simple bison]

Guys

move on please

Getting heated over pretty much nothing does no good for anyone

[fickle birch]

It's fine, I know how to block people. And I'm not getting heated. Lol

[astral vortex]

def not

[fickle birch]

Deleting messages so everything is out of context is a weird move, though. lol

[astral vortex]

that is the mod dude

lmao

same with the clown emote

the mod

[broken siren]

is me not losing gaze of orobyss when I die in confluence of oblivion a bug?

[simple bison]

I deleted the clown emote and the messages after my request to stop. Now lets please just move on with our day lol

[simple bison]

Don't think so? Unsure though tbh

if you think there's any chance of it being a bug just report it using F8

Worst case it's good feedback that they should clarify something that's so unclear it can be viewed as maybe being a bug

[broken siren]

because i lose gaze of orobyss in regular echo of world

[simple bison]

yep

[autumn briar]

doesnt seem like a bug

but it seems like a bug that you can use it to climb corruption (maybe?)

[broken siren]

is there anywhere I can ask the devs?

[simple bison]

#👨┃ask-the-devs-not-support-no-bugs

[elfin vortex]

What is to doom there about a game ? Don't be ridiculos.

[main frigate]

#🎥┃video-shoutout message
lol interesting. I like this confident title

[outer void]

If you're referring to my video, then thank you! 🙏

[main frigate]

This type of videos deserved to be encouraged 🔥

I'm confused why 1 like only... It's not matched with the scale of your channel

[outer void]

Are there any particular classes/masteries you'd like to see added into the game? I just feel like LE has such a breadth of characters to choose from since they have time travel and alternate timelines to choose from.

[outer void]

I just started making LE content, so I don't think YT knows who to show my videos to yet lol. I just have to be patient.

[gleaming jasper]

Just make a hot sorceress girl.. its not hard 🫣

[main frigate]

Like witch/lich in poe 2? Sign me in!

The dress/robe animation is quite impressive

A old sorcerer man is a bit boring indeed

What the cool thing I find is the concept of faerie can move to solve marksman's issue I met directly

[outer void]

what's your issue with marksman?

[main frigate]

Elusive defence you mentioned is quite cool because that's the most defense I use when I play marksman... Dash, which as equal as shift in le. Consume stacks of xxx debuff to deal xxx damage. So shift will more powerful. Mental debuff is quite cool, like confusion, it let enemies have a chance to miss their attack.

Damn just 100% what I want

[outer void]

I see your point now. I think constant dashes, movement, and 'confusion' type debuffs with low HP or defenses as a trade off would be pretty slick.

[main frigate]

Shift just a tool of recovering mana/ health and cleanse debuff so far, it can bring with shurikens but this skill help too less on more damage

Oh... maybe shurikens need to rework too then

[ionic vale]

IS THE THEME FOR SEASON 4

mage?

as in is that hte class that is being reworked / focused on

[tidal heart]

😂 well we know the problem. The forum posts are all players saying they don’t buy mtx

[inner finch]

So far most forum posts are talking about what they wanna see, by people who have already bought plenty of MTX packs

[tidal heart]

They certainly are not

Some say they might buy skill mtx

[inner finch]

Would anyone commit to buying something before even seeing it?

[tidal heart]

It’s feedback

If the feedback is “I don’t buy mtx for armour”

That’s useless

Also the forums gonna be just die hard supporters not a single casual gonna be on it

[inner finch]

So far, scrolling to the 100-something posts, i see plenty of well formatted feedback

[tidal heart]

I don’t but I’m glad you think that feedback will get them to be able to sell mtx

[inner finch]

Would the better path be to not to give any?

They aren't asking because its a slow office day

[muted cape]

Feedback is the most important thing our community can do.

Thats how mg and cof even exist

[tidal heart]

The better path is to not ask for feedback on the forums like the only people who are on the forums are die hard supporters. They need to target the casual audience. People who are on the forums have probably be following the game for a long time, if they are not selling mtx they should probably get feedback from different areas not just the og supporters

[inner finch]

And yet, dozens of posts that explain the weaknesses and possible improvements of the MTX system and what they wanna see

How about that

There is no weakness in asking the community about things that "should be obvious to a medium sized developer"

[tidal heart]

I will never use the forums and I’m an mtx whale the only reason I’m even saying anything is because I like the game but there is nothing me or my community will buy and all of us just spent a ton of money on torchlight infinite this weekend and Poe 2 last season

[inner finch]

Discord feedback was never no an option to express opinions

[tidal heart]

And yet the first 10 comments all saying they dont buy mtx

[inner finch]

Forums was never the only way to give EHG feedback

[tidal heart]

Yes its limited and the people are giving back feedback on the forums they are saying the mtx is fine

[outer lily]

Stacking 20 gamba systems on top of each other and calling it a content is not gonna be it, better MTX monetisation or not.

They're looking for fixes in the wrong place

[inner finch]

7 out of the 10 first posts have profile signatures with all the MTX packs they bought, some of them are worth over 100 dollars

[tidal heart]

And yet I bought a ton of Poe 2 cosmetics yet I only bought the $10 pack this season for LE and the spirit blossom rogue shroud

[outer lily]

How is that a "yet", that's what I said

[tidal heart]

That’s a lie

[inner finch]

So the automated supporter pack linked-account system that gives you a flair when you buy packs is made up

Did i get that right?

[tidal heart]

They buy for support not for actual mtx like I don’t understand how you don’t understand

Like read the comments

[muted cape]

I can think of atleast a few ideas. Mtx for events, like 🎃 👻 mtx for lore hunts, mtx for races 🏁

[outer lily]

You could have 100 times the mtx - if the gameplay sucks, the gameplay sucks.

D4 => opinion discarded

[inner finch]

First comment tells the devs they want more thematic MTXs with elements. Second comment tells the devs they are happy with supporter cosmetics and would like to see more ability MTX. Third comment asks LE to not add PoE goblin. Fourth comment asks for more focus portals and pets. Fifth comment prefers ability cosmetic and say they will prefer buying those. Sixth comment haven't used them for not being able to use them offline (you can, that was patched). Seventh comment asks to upgrade existing MTX supporter packs and that they are in a good place. 8th comment would love UI organization. Ninth comment would prefer quality over quantity in detail and visuals of MTX. Tenth one asks for different sounds to escort different ability MTX

[tidal heart]

I’ve been happy with the supporter pack cosmetics and the new additions lately, would love to see more ability MTX

All I know is that if you add the LE version of the PoE goblin troupe, I’m quitting the game

My favorite cosmetics are ability cosmetics. I’m more likely to purchase those.
I’m not really keen on armor or weapon cosmetics because I don’t really see them while I’m out there grinding.

My biggest feedback is to let me upgrade my existing packs. So if I get the $10 supporter pack, let me get that price off the next tier up.

Otherwise I think the MTX are in a good place.

[inner finch]

Here, i read them to make sure you are wrong down to the letter

[tidal heart]

Here is a few of the first ones

[muted cape]

Le got new skill reworks, new class reworks, and new crafting items so thats not nothing

[outer lily]

LE literally has the most skippable campaign of all ARPG

[inner finch]

Because its quite generic and lacks character and storytelling

[outer lily]

I'm sure they'll add a dungeon to skip ch9+10 at some point as well

[inner finch]

We are not geting Expedition 33 level of storytelling in ARPGs, its simply the consensus

[outer lily]

how much attention did you pay to it?

[inner finch]

My first 5-6 playthroughs very little, then ive read all text carefully, and still didnt care too much

The story is very genetic and forgettable, which is a shame, because the locations are interesting

The characters are also quite one-dimentional, they seem to exist just to move the story forward

[outer lily]

I found several characters quite entertaining

Lagon is one of my favs

[inner finch]

Lagon has a hint of character, yes

Maybe most of it because he is the least dramatic of the gods

[outer lily]

wdym least

he is sass incarnate

[inner finch]

Lagon is very chill

[outer lily]

no lol

[inner finch]

The little care Lagon initially shows for the conflict tells us how much he cared until we came to his place

[coral stump]

is the game still alive ?

[outer lily]

Lagon is literally nicknamed "the capricious one" by Eterra

[inner finch]

That's what oceanic gods do

But besides testing us and giving us a blessing and a half, he is very Swiss

As long as stuff doesnt get into his realm, you have to apply strong convincing power for him to care

[outer lily]

If I had to choose one of the 4 as "Swiss", it's Majasa

I don't believe it's the most groundbreaking story or anything, but it's fine and has some nice highs 🤷‍♀️

I do enjoy the worldbuilding

[inner finch]

Not having particularly serious expectations for a good story makes me not disappointed by it

From the very start EHG has also prepared us for this to be a very post-game mechanical game, so the expectations werent there

[outer lily]

The postgame is running Trove and occasionally pulling the one-armed bandit

[inner finch]

The standards for rich endgame we have today wasn't quite a thing in 2018

[outer lily]

Stacking 20 gamba systems and calling it content wasn't considered rich endgame in 2018 either

[inner finch]

it is what it is

[outer lily]

There are some really cool systems in the game, and I think the way classes are designed is very creative

[inner finch]

If its any point of optimism, i can recall at least 2 times pre 1.0 where i was sure LE would absolutely shut the project down or halt development

And they came in clutch with very meaningful content updates so there's that

[outer lily]

I'll be happy to see whee this is going

[inner finch]

The project has grew to dimensions larger and more serious than other, similar projects did

[outer lily]

For some reason they are really clinging to gamba elements though

Even when they do "give a finger" (like with Julra tier 2), it's quite obvious how reluctant they are to part with even a bit of the gamba

[torn shore]

Barely lol

[coral stump]

figured i guess ill just give up on this game since poe and diablo seem to have taken over maybe in a few years

[outer lily]

That post about MTX when there are so many glaring gameplay issues (and the Discord server is barren thanks to low player retention) seems so stubborn and tone deaf to me lol

It's like they're living on another planet

[tardy bison]

wasn't this kind of expected with krafton?

[cobalt fable]

for sure

[outer lily]

Krafton didn't make that post, EHG did

[tardy bison]

name adds up

[outer lily]

"So guys, I know you've been begging us to improve gameplay, but we'd really like t improve MTX" 🤡

[torn shore]

Tbf they need to improve the mtx to make more money but they should've done this before announcing a damn DLC

But yeah rn they have to fix their game

Ffs

[outer lily]

They could add 1000 more MTX and nobody is gonna care because the game has 0 player retention

[torn shore]

True

Me when my player base goes down 76% in 10 days

[outer lily]

People buy fugly-ass MTX in PoE2 to support the game

[torn shore]

Tbf tho

Poe2 does genuinely have some fire mtx

Same with poe1

[outer lily]

no

the MTX in PoE2 are really all fugly

[torn shore]

Ehh imo no

The dreamers set + monarch sets are really nice looking

[short vessel]

Ngl, i think LE would be a much worse game without the gamba elements

[torn shore]

Same with the valkyrie skill effects

[torn shore]

I disagree

[outer lily]

I highly disagree

[torn shore]

Gambling elements in arpgs have always just led to frustration

[short vessel]

I think there's ways they could "cap" the gamba

[outer lily]

Slot machine isn't content

[torn shore]

It's one of the reasons why harvest in poe was so popular

[outer lily]

the dose makes the poison

[short vessel]

I should clarify

[torn shore]

Having a way to guarantee things or at least introduce surefire ways of reducing rng redundancy always made things better for the player

So when people say gamble rng for meaningful stuff is good they're talking out of their ass