#dnd-lore

1 messages · Page 80 of 1

calm crest
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They are still by and large malignant fascists. They just also hate one particular other evil group.

obsidian gate
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individual yanki can be chill

glossy summit
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I like the githyanki. I kinda want to know a bit more of the lore

jagged apex
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the norm is just that a norm, not a universal law

obsidian gate
jagged apex
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but it for sure has not helped them from having a better relationship with the other races who may argue they are just as bad to learn of being in the area as the illithid

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yeah as we see even in specific continuities like bg3, some simply keep their disagreement quite and secretive, so they don't draw the eye of the queen, else their soul is definitely gunna be on the menu

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which, can't blame them, but the level of power she have does make her claim at being a god, at least a bit more convincing than it otherwise would be

calm crest
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The original Vlaakith I (as well as Gith) was also Lawful Evil. She drew power from allying with devils early into the gith empire—hence the continued relationship with red dragons.

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The githyanki have been predominantly evil for 10,000-odd years worth of empresses.

jagged apex
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yeah but given the length of her rein and the things she has done and had her people do despite if it is good for them or not, i'd argue carries more wait than the others, far as i know Gith themself was not evil and the vlaakiths before the one we have now i'd imagine was more lawful than they were evil

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though i'd still blame their evil norms on vlaakith as given how the original came to power, they definitely were not above underhanded means of gaining power, though given far as i know only did the CLVII one actually go as far as to also undergo lichdom on top of being a tyrant

calm crest
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As far as I know, the Warrior-Queen Gith has only ever been given a statblock in 4e, where she is depicted as Evil.

jagged apex
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given 4e's tendency to have it's lore to be so far removed from other editions, i'd be skeptical about that one to be honest as they could have simply modeled them off the existing githyanki or just making it up

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but i know the whole reason they split as a people was cuz they disagreed on how to spend their new found freedom when they had nearly wiped out the illithid, unless i am mistaken

calm crest
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1e’s Fiend Folio, the first ever appearance of the gith, indicates that the proto-gith were predominantly evil even prior to being enthralled by mind flayers.

calm crest
jagged apex
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eh, still seems that viewing the evil lich tyrant that has ruled them like a living, or i guess in this case unliving, god is reasonable to put the bulk of the blame on, especially with depending on the continuity there are examples of far more reasonable members of their species

jagged apex
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and they have just kind of both been attacking the remains when and where they could ever since

calm crest
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That and working from memory for some of it.

jagged apex
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ah, fair, though i am seemingly refferencing the forgotten realms one, far as i know the rule of vlaakith is technically setting agnostic, at least in the sense of it being bound to one setting since they live in the astral plane, so at least if a setting uses that part of the cosmos it presumably is likely to apply

calm crest
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The githyanki are essentially Melnibonéans in space.

jagged apex
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cuz i still feel when the 5e stuff says it does not pass in the astral plane, given the wiki cites it as technically having a form of time dilation to the astral plane, i feel they could be meaning that for practical purposes time does not pass in regards to the current cosmology, cuz even now seems it truely being timeless seems specific to the world tree cosmology https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Astral_Plane

calm crest
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For each 1,000 years that pass on the Prime, one subjective day occurs on the Astral.

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So the entirety of gith history has felt like less than two weeks on the Astral.

jagged apex
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yeah which i honestly find interesting and how someone like laezel can simply be 22 and how some beings from the oldest days in their history can still be alive in some continuities at least

jagged apex
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the astral plane is weird, but in a cool and interesting way

calm crest
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The only estimate I could find is that the 157 Vlaakiths have ruled for approximately 10,000 years total.

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So around a subjective tenday.

jagged apex
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which i imagine given what happened to get the first one in power, i imagine some of their reins were relatively very short

calm crest
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For sure.

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But it’s very possible that a githyanki from the rule of Gith is not only still alive, but has only slept nine times since her rule.

jagged apex
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she may be evil and a soul eating tyrannt, but she clearly has learned from those who came before her given how long she has managed to keep the role to help progress her plot for godhood

calm crest
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Which making a bid for godhood amongst a historically irreverent species that lives on the corpses of failed gods is definitely a strategy.

jagged apex
calm crest
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A githyanki could conceivably have fasted for the entire species’ history.

jagged apex
calm crest
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Literally (anti-)paladinlike, depending on edition.

jagged apex
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well in so far as their devotion is very zealous, least is the implication how that description of their society is used on the wiki

calm crest
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Oh, I understood.

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The githyanki knights have just been mechanically evil paladin-types in some editions.

jagged apex
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the description of their society seems to come from their old tsr days along with why is so hard for any organized religion to thrive in their culture "A Guide to the Astral Plane." being the name of the sourcebook

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like apparently Vlaakith, does not specify which, apparently would kill any githyanki that openly began to follow or venerate another deity openly

calm crest
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(Somewhat ironic given the longstanding pact with a dragon-goddess.)

jagged apex
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like if there are any githyanki clerics apparently they would be both rare and have to live in hiding

calm crest
jagged apex
calm crest
jagged apex
jagged apex
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wonder if she knows about Ao's changes during the time of troubles and she may be needing to get his approval even if she does get enough followers, not entirely sure how that sort of thing would work with them mainly living in the astral plane and really only going to the prime under special conditions such as to fight illithid, raid, or have their young and raise them

calm crest
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Astral plane makes it tricky, as it doesn’t really follow the rules of a specific setting.

jagged apex
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good point, i know at least in past editions or other obscure lore you don't actually need a deity to use some of the lower level clerical spells, but you do to access the stronger onces

calm crest
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The number of deities that actually operate on the Astral plane is typically small.

calm crest
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In AD&D at least, spells of levels 1 and 2 are the result of conviction. Midlevel spells are from a divine servant, and only the highest actually need a full deity.

jagged apex
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eberron i know does cuz of it's selfcontained nature and how the norm for such things is just different, athas, was not suspecting since the gods abandoned it and i recall people telling me that magic was basically hated on that world

calm crest
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On Athas, it’s unclear if there ever were gods. The cleric-types there either use elemental power or worship the Vlaakith-esque Sorcerer-Kings.

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Eberron has been expressly linked to the core D&D multiverse, albeit in continuity-confusing ways.

jagged apex
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yeah but given the view of magic i just out right did not expect magic, divine or otherwise, and i know it was from a time where psionics were not a form of magic

calm crest
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Only arcane magic results in defiling. Clerics, templars, and druids don’t defile.

jagged apex
calm crest
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And preservers have made a workaround. It’s just harder and less powerful than the temping lure of defiling.

calm crest
jagged apex
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honestly when i saw that sort of theory confirmed in the published lore a while back, i had the biggest smile XD

calm crest
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Psionics have existed since the dawn of Athas, magic was a later development caused by Rajaat in the Green Age.

jagged apex
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huh, too bad magic users ruined, it, bet the illithid would have felt comfortable there given their typical view of non psionic magic

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but i imagine with the state it has been left in for some time, they'd take the underdark colonies any day of the tenday XD

calm crest
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Had the illithids been there, I imagine that destroying them would’ve been a priority of Rajaat.

jagged apex
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lol, would be kind of funny to see a setting where the illithid are not the bad guys at least compared to how they tend to wind up being just do to their alien nature and world views

calm crest
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Given that Rajaat was the engineer of all arcane magic and that he personally mentored the Sorcerer-Kings down the path of the dragon, I do like the theory that he also included the avangion transformation in the nature of magic itself deliberately as a long term bid to restore the world to his ideal Blue Age after the dragons destroy humanity. Didn’t exactly work out, and the ends don’t justify the means, but it’s an interesting scheme.

jagged apex
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lol, sounds like a tharzidunian plan, you know the insane god that wants to destroy everything, including himself, and remake it all in his own image

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makes me imagine this Rajaat person was a few pages short of a spellbook so to speak

calm crest
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Ultimately his goal was to reset Athas to its original oceanic paradise. His plan to do this, however, was to kill every species that didn’t exist at the dawn of time—pretty much every sapient creature other than halflings and thri-kreen.

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Humans just happened to make the perfect living weapon due to their unlimited psionic and arcane potential.

jagged apex
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i imagine one species safe from his scheme was his own people, since from looking it up, Rajaat was a pyreen, ironic given what they apparently are otherwise known as

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else if he was willing to kill himself and his people for this scheme, he truly was mad

calm crest
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Well, the pyreen are sorta a subspecies of halflings.

jagged apex
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ah

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since they resembled basically all the humanoid races

calm crest
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The halflings (and pyreen) had life shaping abilities that they used to make new species. The pyreen were halflings that used this on themselves.

jagged apex
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huh, the darksun wiki also seems to suggest they are their own thing, so not sure where you are getting this from, but i am not gunna claim i know any better https://darksun.fandom.com/wiki/Pyreen

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still, seems ironic given what you said earlier about Rajaat

midnight notch
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Would this be a good place to discuss a possible scenario involving bargaining the soul of an ancient black dragon?

jagged apex
thorny hound
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can dragons take on any humanoid form? or any form actually?

jagged apex
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it says in the statblock for their shape change ability, least those who have it, but lore wise it depends on the kind of dragon

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also in that case, seems more like a mechanical question so maybe better asked in #dnd-rules

feral lintel
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Chromatic Dragons iirc are capable, they just chose not to

serene crater
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question of curiosity about the marilith, is it's lower half always of a serpent or is there a chance it could be something else?

calm crest
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Demons are highly erratic. They’ve got a lot of variation in appearance.

unkempt merlin
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Yea. The concept applies similarly to both demons and devils. Even within a single layer they are liable to have variance. But between layers of hell/the abyss "the same" fiend is almost certainly going to look different compared to one from a different layer

crude blaze
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Same goes for demons who are specifically aligned with certain demon lords. DiA had concept art for all the different types of demons who are aligned with Yeenoghu and most, if not all, of them look very different from the “base” look.

calm crest
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Devils are a little more uniform, because lawful, but still have a lot of variation. Some of the variation is actually built in—one third of devils are female, one third are male, and one third are intersex, as per the decree of their higher-ups.

jagged apex
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also i feel is more accurate to call the "base" just an average example, sort of cuz that is just what it is, than any sort of real baseline in the traditional sense

magic bridge
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That sound better when you put it that way ngl

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I care a lot about the afterlife which is why I am asking that question haha

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Sorry it took me 2 days to respond, legitimately forgot because I wasn't pinged lol

candid shard
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Vecna

thorny hound
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so what are Centaurs? are they fey? are they monstrosities?

feral lintel
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In 2024, theyre Fey

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guardians and stewards of nature

outer locust
versed hare
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Monstrosity in the 2014 mm

unkempt merlin
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What creature type a centaur is has continually been dependent on setting lore. (This applies to a lot of things in fact, see: Eberron with humanoid changelings while they are fey elsewhere)

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In Theros, centaur are both fey and monstrosity, as there are multiple groups of centaur

sharp owl
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Another example is Ravnica; centaurs aligned with the Selesnya Conclave are fey in nature, whilist those aligned with the Gruul Clans are typically monstrous in disposition. There are centaurs outside those guilds who fall anywhere between the two natures, but they're much less common than their guild-aligned kin

feral lintel
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Selesnya and Gruul is Ravnica

sharp owl
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Clarified

snow laurel
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I understand that the basic building blocks of matter in d&d are the four classical elements. Are substances made up of molecules and atoms of pure elemental matter, or is there another system?

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mostly I ask because I'm thinking of making a bbeg of entropy and chaos who's capable of splitting atoms and nuking cities with radiant damage

unkempt merlin
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I'm not even sure if your initial claim is correct

But generally dnd settings do not follow irl physics

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Or science in general

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Ex: gunpowder just. Doesn't explode. In the FR

snow laurel
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I guess this does raise a question that if you just cast reduce on someone infinitismally will they eventually be unable to breathe?

sharp owl
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No, because it's magic, not physics

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D&D is fantasy and follows an internal consistency in line with that

calm crest
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(Furthermore, Reduce has minimum size/non-stackability rules in every edition.)

trail gyro
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Hello peoples, I has question

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Are there standardized wizard robes in dnd, or standardized for whatever school you are from? Or is it just whatever works?

sharp owl
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That's like asking if there's a standardised school uniform or medical scrubs or police uniform across the whole world

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It varies between settings, between planes, between worlds, between continents down to varying within the same institutes in some places

trail gyro
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Are there any examples? If I do art I may just do baldurs gate 3 robes, but I'm asking just so I know

feral lintel
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The only place where it really matters is Strixhaven or Dragonlance. Is there any setting in particular

trail gyro
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Not really

storm dagger
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Thay Wizards wear red

storm dagger
magic violet
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Forgotten Realms:
Are silver dragons not universally lawful good? I'm a little confused what reason Miirym would have for breaking into Candlekeep, "intent on adding its riches to her hoard. She devoured scholars and destroyed a score of irreplaceable books before she was confronted by an archmage and bound into service to protect Candlekeep as penance for her misdeeds."

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However, even as her flesh sloughed away and her bones turned to dust, Torth's powerful magic kept her bound still, animated and sentient, but now undead and somewhat less than sane. What remained was a malevolent but diligent, invisible guardian force. Afraid of their own guardian, the monks hired mages to destroy her, but they were also unable to undo Torth's magic; however, they did manage to bind her within closer proximity to Torth's casket. It was only by the sacrifice of a group of monks that the casket was moved down into the labyrinthine complex of caverns and passages beneath Candlekeep, where Miirym remained, guarding the keep from below against would-be intruders.

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This all seems at odds with how silver dragons are described

feral lintel
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Their description in the MM is an average

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As with any individualistic creatures, especially when it comes to stuff like dragons, there will always be exceptions

magic violet
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fair, thanks 🙏

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i wasnt sure how strict the chromatic evil metallic good thing was

feral lintel
magic violet
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Thank you :)

jagged apex
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this applies to most if not all creatures in dnd unless their lore in a specific setting states it as a universal fact rather than just a norm

crude sparrow
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Would it make sense for Tiamat to curse a character with a Hysterical Rage ala Kratos or Heracles while they are fighting a Dragon Cult?

One of my PCs wants to do the Kratos Backstory feel and I wanna tie it into an ongoing plot about Dragons and Elemental stuff

reef cape
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Just because that dragon decided to commit theft does not make the dragon not lawful good. One slip-up does not change your alignment

reef cape
jagged apex
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so i doubt you would even need to know if tiamat could do such a thing as it would more so be a character matter than any sort of lore or anything to do with tiamat, that said, last i checked the way curses in dnd work are vague and varied so easily a being as powerful as the goddess of evil dragons could more likely bestow such a curse if they wished than not

reef cape
jagged apex
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well from what i am aware other gods can counter or block their efforts

reef cape
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And that goes to the limits part

calm crest
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I mean, Tiamat isn’t a greater deity in most settings. If she starts slinging curses immoderately, it’s simply not an arms race she can win.

jagged apex
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plus many curses tend to be bound to items as i recall in published lore especially in association with the gods

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but far as i know is not like that is technically even a factor given what the player was wanting to go for, but far as i know there is nothing that prevents tiamat from cursing mortals or anyone for that matter if she wants, obviously it can be countered, but that would require her being able to do so in the first place

reef cape
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Thing is, we know that they do not do that. Whether it is because they do not have the ability to just curse people and require something specific, or because it would immediately be undone by another divinity...

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Or perhaps they simply know that in a world where a spell like remove curse exists, cursing people is often a waste of time and energy

jagged apex
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or that wasting such time and energy on a single mortal where there are other gods acting against you

tropic nova
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Hey, do any of you know what might cause someone to be excommunicated from the Church of The Red Knight?

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Please ping on reply, cause I'm about to start cooking and I'll forget

jagged apex
# tropic nova Hey, do any of you know what might cause someone to be excommunicated from the C...

i am not sure it is that simple as at least in the forgotten realms which the red knight is worshiped in, there is not one singular united church https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Church_of_the_Red_Knight
this could prove helpful still else may depend on which of the churches that person belongs to, plus i am not even sure if excommunication is a thing as some gods and their faithful may not have such mercy, though more common among evil gods, it is not something strictly only evil gods or even just their faithful may do

tropic nova
drifting junco
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am i tripping or is there an item of sorts that gives items their charges back?

feral lintel
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not really a lore thing

drifting junco
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i thought i saw something in planescape lore about it a while ago.

jagged apex
versed hare
jagged apex
glacial turret
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Hey! Was checking out Greyhawk in the new DMG, and wanted to delve more into the lore, are there any popular actual-play games to check out that take place in the setting? Or any other digestible things to check out to get more of a feeling for the setting without getting hit with a kitchen sink?

muted marsh
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What is the Nobility system like in fearun? just the general British nobility, royalty/dukes, marquesses, earls, viscounts, and barons? Does it depends on the specific culture of whatever location/race? (specifically looking into tymantherian in this case)

jagged apex
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i know the setting's creator, ed greenwood, has covered nobles in various parts of the realms and or houses on his person youtube channel, as that could be helpful

jagged apex
muted marsh
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yeah I've read that entire wiki page about a dozen times, though if that's all there is then that's all there is

jagged apex
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i am honestly not sure they even have nobles beyond the vanquisher, least none seem to be mentioned

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you could always ask ed greenwood, as creator of the forgotten realms he would know better than anyone

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but nobility in the realms if i have learned anything is varied and is not uniform as there are many different cultures, kingdoms, territories, ect... in faerun, none of them united under a singular banner or anything we in our world may call a nation

jagged apex
muted marsh
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okay TBF what I've set up is more "respected rich family" and not so much political power holders, or at the barest of minimum I could easily rework my ideas

jagged apex
jagged apex
jagged apex
jagged apex
muted marsh
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well it does also say this:

"The power of the Vanquisher was not absolute, however, as he or she served most of the time as a arbiter for the conclave of elders, made up by all the patriarchs and matriarchs of the Tymantheran clans."

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I feel like that's a good equivalent

jagged apex
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well it more so leans into the culture of the dragonborn population as it is heavily rooted there so looking at that may provide clarity, wealth tends to mean far less than honor and the deeds of one's actions for them https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Thymari

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and you can check the cited sources for the extra details that they may have excluded or could not copy word for word

muted marsh
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I should clarify what I have for my own thing does fit into the honor and deeds aspect.

jagged apex
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far as i can tell the sort of equivalent would be a clan that is known for both their skill and honorable deeds in serivce to their people

muted marsh
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which is what I already got, so.... seems all's good

jagged apex
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well as i said earlier, for matters more specific to your own game and NOT published lore, #dm-discussion would be a better place to talk about such a thing

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this channel is for talk and sharing what is recording in official published materials

muted marsh
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and that was what I was here for, research for a PC

jagged apex
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well best i can do is tell/point you in the direction of where you can read up on their goverment, lore, and culture in published materials, which i have via the wiki, for extra context and or detail, that is why is important the sources sited at the bottom of the pages

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if the wiki page itself is not enough, those sources are your next step, unless you simply don't have any sort of access to them

muted marsh
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I'll also look into those when I get the time

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danke

timid tendon
muted marsh
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I really regret saying that

timid tendon
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Why so

muted marsh
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because it was the wrong thing to say, apparently

timid tendon
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Dragonborn lore is fun to pick at

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Dont apologize

muted marsh
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I ain't

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but given the backstory, which ties into the platinum brigade quite heavily, it works

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justifies the family/clan name

timid tendon
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Nice nice

jade canyon
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Is there any art, or what I find more likely any description given to Relentless Slasher beyond their entry in VRGR?

calm crest
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It is a one-off monster from VRGR that doesn’t exist in any other source.

jagged apex
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yeah VRGR is it's first appearance to date unless i am mistaken, it's only one but saddly was not given official artwork

calm crest
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It’s essentially any slasher horror villain with the serial numbers filed off, so the appearance could vary drastically from Domain to Domain to suit the theme of horror prevalent there.

sand solstice
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Is the new 2024 wizard able to copy spells into their spellbook? I cant find anything that says they do

versed hare
dusky pond
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I have a question about Hagspawn. From what I have read, it only states that Hagspawn are human-hag hybrids and nothing else states that another Humanoid race could fill that genetic template of the Hagspawn. Is it possible (specifically within the Forgotten Realms) for a Hag to trick an Orc or a Half Orc into making a Hagspawn?

feral lintel
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Hexblood fill that role

dusky pond
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That's not as clear cut tho according to the lore. Nothing states that Hexbloods are born from Hag reproduction like Hagspawn, which are different.

feral lintel
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theres a whole sidebar about hexbloods turning into hags

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One way hags create more of their kind is through the creation of hexbloods. Every hexblood exhibits features suggestive of the hag whose magic inspires their powers. This includes an unusual crown, often called a eldercross or witch’s turn. This living, garland-like part of a hexblood’s body extends from their temples and wraps behind the head, serving as a visible mark of the bargain between hag and hexblood, a debt owed, or a change to come.

dusky pond
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Hagspawn don't get turned into Hags. They're all boys and are typically outcasted from the Coven.

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I just wanna know if it's possible for one to be half Orc instead of human.

feral lintel
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Thats something you ask your DM about, or if youre a DM, up to you

jagged apex
slender tundra
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I'm looking at adapting 5e 2024 to Forgotten Realms but in the era shortly after the Time of Troubles rather than the regular time (1490s). I'm wondering - when I look up the Planetouched, apparently they became more prolific after the Spellplague which happened around 1385 (a few decades after Time of Troubles), so I'm wondering if it would make more sense to not necessarily ban planetouched (aasimar and tiefling - plus the possible adaptation of genesi from 3e as a new species choice) but to probably avoid it unless a player is really interested in playing one? It doesn't seem like I've ready anywhere that they were completely not present prior to Spellplague, but just would have been way more unusual?

jagged apex
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more prolific just means they would be more common, no real reason far as i can tell

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besides what happens at your table is specific to your table and not bound by any continuity

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effectively even if in an established setting, your game is it's own timeline

slender tundra
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True... I'm just looking to be guided by the 2nd edition lore and some 3rd edition, but trimming away the bits that deal with events after the time we're planning to be set.

jagged apex
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in an effectively infinite multiverse, who is to say in one version of a timeline someone is born plane touched instead of a normal human?

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if they are not as abundant, you can easily reflect that by the way characters react to and treat them and what species those characters are, all the npcs are controlled by the dm

slender tundra
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The whole Multiverse thing kind of does my head in a bit... But one thing I am wanting to adapt the old lore to is the presence of Feywild and Shadowfell as parallel dimensions of the Material Plane, and the whole goblins being fey thing, which I actually think is kind of cool.

slender tundra
jagged apex
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your players being of those species does not really inflate the overall population unless you specifially make the world reflect that

jagged apex
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in dnd, again unless i am mistaken, depending on context and or intention it can have more than one definition but most often is reffering to simply the cosmos of dnd

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like historically time travel and time manipulation magic and even a demiplane of time are things in the forgotten realms, so is not like is new territory, just not as focused on as all the other stuff

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in fact i do believe unless i am mistaken, the era you are planning on exploring uses the cosmology and such of when it was last mentioned around 3.5e and editions prior in published material

west oriole
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I’m trying to design a 1-shot that’s set in a seaside town where creatures a coming out of the ocean. said creatures are meant to appear like the creatures in FO:FarHarbour or Davy Jones’ crew in POTC, also the cadavers of dead sailors. Lore-wise, what would be able to create/animate/control these creatures

sharp owl
west oriole
vital cloudBOT
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No pings, please :pray:

If you see someone with “No Pings” in their name, please don’t @ that user. If you Reply to them, please turn the alert @OFF, and if you forget, a simple apology is appreciated. Thank you!

shut nacelle
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Forgotten Realms peoples! I'm going off artwork here, but can someone confirm for me:

Going off artwork, do goliath have pure white eyes? None of the artwork I can find seems to show them with irises or pupils, but maybe I'm just missing the obvious counter-examples.

(Never mind! Found the obvious artwork with eyes; and more lore. I figured I had to be wrong here.)

mighty yarrow
#

Faerûn question: did the Turning wheel (temple of gond in ravens bluff) exist at the same time as the Reading Room (temple of Deneir in the earthfast moutains)? I looked at their pages in the forgotten realms fandom website, but i didnt see any matching/overlapping dates. I was wondering this because there are multiple other temples in the area for both gods, almost all of which exist at the same time.

jagged apex
#

and both had sources during the tsr days

mighty yarrow
#

Thats what I thought too, but at the same time, the Reading Room page doesnt mention when it was built either

jagged apex
#

one can make a rough estimation based on the in universe year the source mentioning it covers

#

so checking the cited info from 2e's "Faiths & Avatars" might shed some light

#

but seems to imply it was at least in existance by the time of 1360s DR given the cited info about it's organization

#

and raven's bluff's in universe realms year is cited as 1370 DR

#

so seems a safe bet that both would have existed at earliest 1370 DR onward, least best i can deduce

#

@mighty yarrow hopefully that helps

feral lintel
#

Are there any creatures, besides the obvious Sun Dragons, who are associated with the Sun?

calm crest
#

Mystara had the Sollux, also known as the Brotherhood of the Sun, a species of fire-associated humanoids that opposed the efreet.

jagged apex
feral lintel
jagged apex
#

like the mourning lord's predacesor, Amunator had Dragons (emerald, sapphire, and steel), golems, and takos, interestingly enough

#

plus there is animals, like Appolo has crows and falcons

feral lintel
#

Apollo im a bit more familiar with aye. THeres also his Red cows and his horses too

jagged apex
jagged apex
feral lintel
#

I mean, both his cows and horses are still mentioned (the latter more indirectly with his chariot being mentioned)

versed hare
jagged apex
feral lintel
#

ill go give them a look MGuraEyes

serene crater
#

a question of curiosity, though is it known if any of the faerun gods have dragon followers outside of the draconic pantheon?

crude blaze
serene crater
#

all good, though hmm

jagged apex
#

i know some of the faerunian gods are known to have dragons implemented in their service, not sure if that necessarily means they follow that god, but gods on faerun last i checked are not something most dragons worship at least openly, and if they do they often lean towards bahamut or tiamat, as most of the other draconic gods lost most of their influence do to not doing much of anything when the draco-rage plagued their people, bahamut and tiamat do to their activities and history outside of dragon kind such as with the human nation of Untheric and later the Faerunian one, bahamut constantly apposing tiamat's schemes

jagged apex
#

seems torm is known to favor gold and silver dragons

#

and selune having the same for song and weredragons

#

oghma seems to favor metallic dragons in general

#

same with mystra but she also has pseudodragons among her favored monsters

tough karma
#

hi! wondering where I should look to start with lore

#

I only know some stuff about different realm layouts, and know almost nothing about the shadowfell

jagged apex
#

if not having a specific setting in mind, i'd suggest starting with setting agnostic sources such as the new 2024 books

eager bay
#

Are all the DnD books and supplements and whatnot canon?

reef cape
#

Define "canon"

jagged apex
#

not all of them really even are lore based, some are more mechanical, but it depends on the edition, if it is 3rd party or not, and more recently if it is legacy content or not

#

plus what happens at your table is not bound by the published lore, so lot of factors at play to where in dnd it is not simply "canon" vs "non-canon" there are multiple continuities especially across different forms of media and the like

sharp owl
# eager bay Are all the DnD books and supplements and whatnot canon?

The official stance on canon is as follows; there are four canons that WotC entertains

  1. Internal consistency - they have guidelines and their own internal canon so that new books are as consistent with old books as they need to be so that familiarity that comes with D&D persists
  2. Cross-rulebook canon - events, characters, and lore that spans multiple rulebooks. To date there has only been three instances of this; the 2014 core rulebooks (DMG, PHB, MM), Dragon of Icespire Peak and it's three digital only follow up adventures (Divine Contention, Sleeping Dragons Wake, and Storm Lords Wrath), and Tyranny of Dragons before the reprint (Hoard of the Dragon Queen and Rise of Tiamat)
  3. Per-media canon - Each different media expression of D&D is it's own canon. The movie plus the tie in books and comics is one. The RA books are another. The comics a third and the various video games are each their own. There are sometimes references, easter eggs, or parallel events between media expressions
  4. What happens at your table - The events of your games in official settings using official adventures are no more or less canon than anything else

So, for example, the events of Icewind Dale: Rime of the Frostmaiden are not canon with Waterdeep: Dragon Heist per the books. The movie Honour Among Theives is not canon to Baldur's Gate: Descent into Avernus, etc etc

eager bay
jagged apex
#

sometimes adventures have outcomes that are referenced in others, but this tends to be rather rare and vague these days, but that sort of thing would be what they described as Internal Consistency

#

it is something that is not gunna have a simple cut and dry answer

eager bay
#

So basically everything has its own “canon” for the most part but a lot of the stuff is for all intents and purposes separated?

jagged apex
#

there are basically multiple continuities, is the simpliest way to sum it up/view it

feral lintel
#

Whats "canon" is entirely up to table. Again, see Davyd's comment

eager bay
#

Alr

wanton kettle
#

was there never much exploration of Shar and her followers / dark justiciars until BG3?

jagged apex
#

so seems much of the details about the dark justicars may be thx to bg3, though i could be wrong and the wiki might not have all the details

frigid compass
#

Does anyone know the political state of the moonshae isles in the forgotten realms setting? I am thinking of doing a pirate adventure there

jagged apex
#

seems after the spellplague it is far as we know in published mateiral all over the place, but one of the sourcebooks we are suppose to be getting down the line is gunna focus on the moonshae isles, so more modern/relevant lore for how it is in present day, or least as close as preset day as we get, will be in there

gentle scaffold
#

Is Durnan a masked lord in Waterdeep?

jagged apex
#

at least back in 3.5e

feral lintel
coral pawn
#

Thanks gang

gentle scaffold
celest folio
#

Say
How does magic resistance/absorption work lore wise?
Spells create force or elements or other physical aspects
When we cast a fireball
We use magic and give it the properties of a fireball then shoot it
So having magic resist or absorb is irrelevant
You need to be able to resist the force and the heat
Same is true for all spells

Only spells i can see smth like magic resist effecting are spells that take effect in or directly near your body, because your not allowing the magic there to transform

So whats happening exactly?

sharp owl
#

It depends entirely on the creature and how/why they're resistant

#

Resistance is a mechanic, not a lore thing

#

An ancient red dragon might be immune to fire damage simply because they live in volcanos and swim in lava, it's their natural environment so why would it harm them? On the other hand, an archfey of the winter court might be resistant to cold because they control the very elements

celest folio
vital cloudBOT
#
No pings, please :pray:

If you see someone with “No Pings” in their name, please don’t @ that user. If you Reply to them, please turn the alert @OFF, and if you forget, a simple apology is appreciated. Thank you!

celest folio
#

Ah
Sry
Didnt see it

sharp owl
#

And again, it depends on the creature
Some are immune to magic
Some have control over it
You're asking "How does this generic mechanic map into lore" and the answer is "it doesn't" or at the most forgiving "it depends"

#

That generic mechanic covers countless possible different expressions of power and resilience and abilities as they appear in lore

#

And also not every mechanic relates to the lore of a creature, sometimes it's just game balance

celest folio
#

Its just that
This is an issue with a lot of other settings too
Im trying to scientifically explain it
Like enchantment spells work on hormones
Or illusion is creating sound, vidual, smell, touch, etc without the thing happening

But magic resist is too wild a term for this

Unless i consider everything that is magically created as still made of magic and no longer the element it turns into
And also the forces behind them as straight up ceasing to exist
It doesn't make sense
And if i take this scenario as the real one
Well, now we have a whole other can of worms

sharp owl
#

Sounds like something for #dm-discussion, but also something that fantasy is not suited to (scientific explanation of phenomena that is)

celest folio
#

Thx davyd

mighty yarrow
#

What time and place in dnd is closest to classical Athens?

prisma siren
#

The first places that come to mind are Sigil, Seventon, and Meletis, but none of those are perfectly analogous

calm crest
#

Athas’ Balic is also Athens-inspired. I believe Mystara also has an analogue, but I cannot recall offhand.

crude blaze
#

Akros, Meletis, and Setessa were based on mythological Sparta, Athens, and Themyscira respectively

jagged apex
#

plus with the mtg stuff is important to remember even if adapted to dnd in offical materials, they are not considered part of the dnd multiverse

unkempt merlin
#

not quite

#

the versions of the mtg settings that have been published (at minimum) are a part of the dnd multiverse. How exactly they fit in has not been explored.

But the concept of Planeswalkers (and thus, related settings that term comes from) is something that has been brought up outside of the MTG books

jagged apex
#

also in regards to the a sort of athens esc dnd setting, you may be able to find such a world in what historically is called "Greatspace" which have their main pantheon being the olympian pantheon, all be it the good aligned ones https://spelljammer.fandom.com/wiki/Greatspace

jagged apex
unkempt merlin
jagged apex
#

honestly far as i know very few published settings are intentionally modeled after real world civilizations or cultures, only ones that come to mind were some of the ones introduced and largely used within the anthologies of "Journeys through the radiant citadel", to my knowledge other cases were the cases of additional writers in existing settings implementing such themes like is the case with several in the forgotten realms as an example, so i'd maybe suggest looking into greatspace as that may be the closest thing if not counting the mtg settings

crude blaze
#

I do believe the new DMG also has at least a handful of the MTG settings listed as campaign settings that are a part of the D&D multiverse now, but I could be wrong

#

But yeah, as Swampellow, we have had examples of MTG officially crossing into the D&D settings

serene crater
#

Tarkir was acknowledged in fizbans and kaldheim was in bigby's

versed hare
#

There's planeswalkers from mtg in a non mtg dnd 5e campaign book allright

feral lintel
#

theres one in 5e too

#

and not in a mtg book

serene crater
#

Ellywick I think her name is

feral lintel
#

mhmm SGuraNod
actually, whats the timeline between her in [Redacted] and in the Forgotten Realms set?

unkempt merlin
feral lintel
#

yeah, hard to mention the world tree without mentioning kaldheim's world tree

eager bay
#

whats this channel about

unkempt merlin
#

Discuss WotC-published game settings, and the events and characters that shaped them. Wherever possible, please indicate which setting you're discussing: [Forgotten Realms]/[FR], [Eberron], [Dragonlance], etc.

eager bay
#

ok

smoky plume
#

Is there any non undead creatures assosicated with undeath?

versed hare
#

Necromancers certainly

smoky plume
#

Haha I know that silly

calm crest
#

Groaning spirits/banshees, depending on edition.

#

Thouls.

smoky plume
#

Aren’t those undead tho?

jagged apex
#

depending on the edition, some editions have different creature types and spirits use to be a subtype or tag in older editions if memory serves

calm crest
#

No, banshees in AD&D are disembodied elven spirits, which are not the same thing as undead.

#

Hence they can’t be turned.

jagged apex
#

and stuff like 4e sometimes their origin of creatures is far removed from any other edition

#

as much as things are universal in dnd, there are even more things that change from one source to another

calm crest
#

Fetches, ghedens, ghules, katanes are all half-undead.

unkempt merlin
#

Corpse collectors

#

Sorry, cadaver collectors

calm crest
#

Pseudo-undead resemble but avoid actual undead.

jagged apex
#

that makes me wonder, would they even go after undead? like i could buy it if far as the construct is concerned a corpse, undead or not, is still a corpse

calm crest
#

They can summon undead.

smoky plume
#

I mean the way I’ve played them is working with the undead because at the end of the day if the undead dies it goes back to corpse

jagged apex
calm crest
#

True.

jagged apex
#

plus there is arguably the reborn

smoky plume
#

So Psuedo undead are the hated of both worlds?

jagged apex
#

like sure they are technically player use, but i'd say they count as we have non player characters that are of those lineages

jagged apex
smoky plume
#

Yeah reborn would be like half undead imo

calm crest
smoky plume
calm crest
#

Nagpa are a Mystaran species with the innate power to create undead.

jagged apex
calm crest
smoky plume
#

It was listed along with spirits which aren’t “undead”

calm crest
#

Pseudozombies, pseudoghouls, pseudowraiths, etc. are pseudo-undead.

jagged apex
#

plus even prior to that they were classified, at least in 5e as humanoid

calm crest
#

Groaning spirits/banshees are just an undead-like spirit, rather than the specific type of humanoid called pseudo-undead.

smoky plume
#

What’s the difference between undead or spirits?

jagged apex
#

one is unnatural, the other, isn't

#

least that is the simpliest way i can put it

smoky plume
#

Isn’t there undead that are made by “natural” causes?

calm crest
#

Elves don’t have souls in AD&D, and only ensouled beings can be resurrected or become undead. The essence of an elf is a spirit, and if one of these spirits is intensely evil, it can persist beyond death as a banshee.

jagged apex
#

there is also many a fey that are considered spirits, plus spirit is a lot more vauge a term in dnd than undead, so there is also that

calm crest
#

In later editions, anyone can be resurrected, so the distinction is no longer made.

jagged apex
#

undead is often a twisted mockary of life, those powered by necrotic energy basically the anti-souls, like normal souls are implied historically to be a nature more in line with the positive energy plane

smoky plume
#

I mostly mean 3.5 onwards

calm crest
#

Then banshees are plain undead, in that case.

smoky plume
calm crest
#

Correct.

jagged apex
#

i said often, not always

calm crest
#

Eberron’s undying are positive energy undead.

jagged apex
#

there is another example

smoky plume
#

Right but what makes the distinction between evil or not evil undead? Is it just protection from the effects?

calm crest
#

Old school mummies were also positive energy undead.

jagged apex
#

is more the same as other intelligent beings if they are intelligent undead, otherwise is more so do to the nature of them if they are of a mindless undead, most mindless undead tend to have an innate hatred for conventional life, like zombies as an example, where unless controlled in some way, if left to it's own devices it will snuff out life if given the chance, at least in most settings

calm crest
#

Mystara also had the bhuts which are beings with traits in common with both undead and lycanthropes but are neither.

severe basin
calm crest
#

The zombies of a yellow musk creeper or a myconid aren’t actual undead, despite being reanimated corpses.

smoky plume
calm crest
#

Skeletons were neutral in multiple editions.

severe basin
calm crest
#

Maurezhi are demons heavily associated with ghouls, just as shadow demons are with shadows, and Orcus with undead generally.

severe basin
calm crest
#

Dybbukim are demons that possess and defile corpses, behaving similarly to undead.

unkempt merlin
#

There seem to be two separate conversations

"Things that aren't undead and have associations with undead"
And
"Good vs evil undead"

#

It's also going to get muddy if you try and separate "undead the creature type" from "undead that is the creature type that isn't undead" without clarification

smoky plume
calm crest
#

Given that this is the lore channel, the creature type would seem to matter somewhat less than in-universe differentiation, no?

smoky plume
severe basin
#

I don't know if the lore channel is the place to discuss the moral implications of using someone's body after they die without asking them for permission while they're alive tbh

unkempt merlin
severe basin
smoky plume
severe basin
calm crest
#

Well, the spore servants of myconids or yellow must creeper hosts aren’t undead in either capacity. They’re corpses controlled by fungi/plants rather than necromantic forces.

calm crest
smoky plume
#

No one wants to be killed or their bodies changed or altered when they die

unkempt merlin
severe basin
#

Isn't that an undead creature type that isn't really undead in the traditional sense

unkempt merlin
#

Yep

severe basin
#

An example of the type of undead you said didn't exist

calm crest
#

Nightwalkers, nightcrawlers, nightwings, and nighthaunts are all effectively negative energy elementals and all the pure form of undeath.

unkempt merlin
#

Not quite

smoky plume
#

They are still undead though.

#

It’s just a different type

#

It’s like.. skeletons vs shadows

unkempt merlin
#

It's because "undeath" is often shorthand for "negative energy"

smoky plume
#

Those are both undead. Wildly different

severe basin
#

In a lot of cases

#

In most cases

calm crest
#

Correct. Not all undead are necessarily former living things.

smoky plume
#

Undead doesn’t mean they have to be alive and then not.

severe basin
#

I think

smoky plume
#

Some undead are made just of negative energy.

calm crest
#

Just as not all ex-living entities are undead—flesh golems, petitioners, etc.

unkempt merlin
#

This is what I was getting at with "different types of undead" because there are frankly, plenty of examples of "undead" (whether they have the creature type or not) that are not powered by negative energy.

This is why I said it gets muddy without clarification

smoky plume
#

There’s also undead that aren’t made of bodies or anything

severe basin
#

Nightwalker is the sole kind of undead I can think of that has never been something alive

smoky plume
#

You can make a shadow without killing someone

#

By animating a shadow using negative energy

unkempt merlin
#

Yea a shadow is well. A shadow

#

Infused with that negative energy yea

severe basin
#

Shadows create more of themselves by killing

smoky plume
#

Yeah that’s a way to make it

calm crest
#

All the nightshades are never-living undead.

unkempt merlin
#

They can certainly

smoky plume
#

Think of it like this

calm crest
#

Phantoms in some settings are undead manifestations of mass death or trauma, rather than a specific dead individual.

smoky plume
#

You can create a shadow, it is now powered and harnesses negative energy. It kills something else. It’s power as a shadow is then to subject the person it killed to the SAME fate as it

#

(It puts some of its negative energy into the creatures shadow, making another shadow.”

severe basin
#

Here's how I think of it.
5e description of undead
Undead are once-living creatures brought to a horrifying state of undeath through the practice of necromantic magic or some unholy curse. Undead include walking corpses, such as vampires and zombies, as well as bodiless spirits, such as ghosts and specters.
🤨

smoky plume
#

Yeah that’s the general not the rule

unkempt merlin
#

That's the very basic description yes

smoky plume
#

Like how most golems are made using inorganic things

#

But you can also make bone, blood or flesh golems.

unkempt merlin
#

Very general. Even on release of 5e there were creatures of a given type that didn't fall under the basic definition accurately

calm crest
#

Many of the unusual examples I’m citing are AD&D era or Mystaran monsters, which don’t play by modern classification rules as nicely.

smoky plume
#

Well to be fair there is undead and then things which draw from or have some power from undead

#

Like how one can do with an angel

severe basin
#

I wonder if 5e is missing a couple of creature types

#

No i don't need to wonder about that it's definitely missing some

smoky plume
#

Not really? What do you think wouldn’t fall under normal creature types

calm crest
#

Off the top of my head, anyway.

unkempt merlin
#

The only real "historic" type missing is outsider yea

#

But that was more of a grouping of other types than anything

smoky plume
#

Which means (not from the material plane)

severe basin
#

A type we needed

unkempt merlin
#

(Or by some definitions, a subtype. Depending on how you looked at it)

calm crest
#

Well, from the outer planes, to be slightly more specific.

unkempt merlin
#

I don't think it's very needed though

severe basin
#

It would be nice to have

unkempt merlin
#

At least not as a primary type

#

It's very functionally more of a subtype

smoky plume
unkempt merlin
#

Since it makes the whole "native X" thing. Weird.

#

(Native X thing referring to stuff like ex: Eberron. Where Couatl are Native celestials. Ie from the material plane and not elsewhere)

severe basin
#

In the new 2024 monster manual they're using celestials for a lot more Beings

#

Like the sphinx

smoky plume
#

Yeah celestial is now sort of the catch all for “holy beings.” And Unholy is “Fiend”

severe basin
#

Now it's the catch all for

#

Almost all non evil outsiders

smoky plume
#

Yeah

severe basin
#

They could have made modrons celestials

#

They did not but they could have

feral lintel
#

Mechanus is in the midle of both sides

#

its not upper, its not lower

calm crest
#

Checking my Rules Cyclopedia, in addition to the never-living nightshades, it’s ambiguous if Mystaran druj, odics, or revenants were ever alive.

smoky plume
#

Revenants normally are

calm crest
#

Also, much like OD&D shadows, Mystaran shadows are expressly not undead.

calm crest
#

It’s about as different or more as Athas from, say, Oerth or Toril.

#

Or Cerilia.

jagged apex
#

such is the ways of many old settings that have yet to get more modern revamps, if i am not mistaken, and that is kind of cool debatably

calm crest
#

One small tidbit is that while undead traditionally have had alien minds that were not subject to psionics, Athasian undead that weren’t mindless pretty much universally have psionic powers and can be fought psychically.

jagged apex
#

plus unless i am mistaken, which i could be, given i am sure it is before i got into dnd or was even born, wasn't mystara in those early days before creature type was a proper thing? cuz to my knowledge it was not really a thing as core to it until 3e onward

calm crest
#

Mystara first existed as the Known World, which began with the Isle of Dread in the B/X era. It only be cane officially called Mystara late into its product lifespan in the BECMI or RC era. It was concurrent with both 1e and 2e, and hasn’t really made much of an appearance since, other than the borrowing of monsters like nightshades, nagpa, and neh-thalggu.

#

So it was constructed from B/X’s generic setting modules and only later fleshed out.

jagged apex
#

far as i know any mention is of the setting is just the name and usually in sourcebooks and not in like lore, like one character talking about it to another

calm crest
#

It also exists in an extremely different cosmology.

jagged apex
#

kind of like athas, if nothing else we can at least say it exists in some capacity, probably

calm crest
#

It’s a setting expressly without gods, and has a very different planar structure. Also traits it has in common with Athas that makes it not play nice with the core multiverse.

#

It also leaned really far into the cultural analogue direction as it went on, and several parts of that were extremely insensitive and poorly conceived. Some were at least more mindful than others, but it’s a real mixed bag.

#

The more humorous and gonzo setting can be fun, but when meshed with what are parodies of real-world cultures mapped onto monsters, it can also be offensive in places.

#

Has a lot of other interesting stuff for it, though, if one doesn’t use all the Gazetteers as written.

#

It’s also one of the places Blackmoor has been set in, in addition to Oerth.

#

Since apparently they were contractually obligated to include Blackmoor, it exists in the Known World’s distant past as a realm of high technology in an age now lost (barring relatively abundant time travel).

jagged apex
#

honestly, pretty easy to lose an age when you have a lot of time travel, in fiction space and time don't tack well to being messed with on the regular, pretty sure is part of why historically there is a type of inevitable ment for dealing with such forces

calm crest
#

Their civilization was wiped out in the Great Rain of Fire, the result of mages tampering with the crashed remnants of a space ship.

#

The engine of that ship, the Beagle, is now fundamentally tied to the nature of magic in Mystara and is buried under Glantri.

feral lintel
#

is there any info on wyvern/dragon incubation and such?

jagged apex
#

i recall such a thing was covered at the very least for true dragons back in the old draconomicons if you want detailed numbers

#

not sure if it covers lesser dragons such as wyverns with the same degree of info

jagged apex
# feral lintel is there any info on wyvern/dragon incubation and such?

saddly i can't seem to find any such info if you are wanting that for a wyvern specifically, at least not that i am aware of, even tried seeing if it might have been mentioned in it's ecology article form way back when, but did not see any mention of their eggs, at most just babies or hatchlings

feral lintel
#

gotcha, all good

frigid bear
#

Hey does anyone know any lore about the eleven baneful gates, all I could find is that it's a piece of text that has a way to become a lich somewhere in it and nothing else

modest badger
modest badger
# feral lintel is there any info on wyvern/dragon incubation and such?

I know the 3.5 Draconomicon went into detail on this, including on rules for PCs trying to incubate eggs themselves. Golds took the longest to incubate at around 720 days and whites the shortest at 420 days, and had rules like:

Black: The egg must be immersed in [acid], or sunk in a swamp, bog, or marsh.
(Removed some mechanics there).

However some of these nuances and complexities were removed in later editions (Such as the wyrmlings all being different sizes so whites hatched the size of cats (Tiny) and reds hatched the size of ponies (Medium). In 5e all wyrmlings are the same size category).

However looking into 5e we have some lore in 'A Practical Guide to Dragon Riding' which is repeated in 'A practically complete guide to dragons', and... it actually repeats the 3.5 Draconomicon, just with more diegetic language:

The best place for this egg to incubate is deep within a swamp, bog or marsh. Or, if you happen to have strong acid lying around, you might also place the egg within a jar. Waiting time, 480 days.

#

Fizban's has some very strange options for egg generation, and vague lore on incubation, saying it can last anywhere between months to decades and should be appropriate to each dragon.

I'm not sure where to look for Gem dragon egg lore. That might be in even older AD&D texts.

polar sparrow
#

Lore question. How are soul coins generated? I know they are minted in Minaros but if a mortal travels to hell do they get a soul coin of their own soul?

severe basin
polar sparrow
severe basin
#

There is no one kind of devil claimed mortal soul that can become a soul coin

polar sparrow
#

Ok, so it's not a specific process. It's just a however the soul can be obtained and in doing so it becomes a coin

severe basin
polar sparrow
#

Ok, that makes sense. Thank you

severe basin
#

Because each soul coin has a unique soul trapped within it, each has a story. A creature might have been imprisoned as a result of defaulting on a deal, while another might be the victim of a night hag's curse.

#

The "as a result of defaulting on a deal" part might imply that soul coins aren't made from people who keep their deals with a devil but instead those who try to break them

#

Perhaps either can be a soul coin
There really isn't too much lore on exactly how they're made

eager bay
#

What god or gods would a forge cleric worship

pallid flower
eager bay
#

Okay ty

crude blaze
jagged apex
eager bay
#

Kinda in general, but are there any specific good or bad relations that goliaths have with other species?

feral lintel
#

Which setting in particular? IIRC, in FR, they dont really, due to their secluded lifestyle

eager bay
#

Hi there,
is Shar associated with any particular number ?
I'm running a Reverse Shadowheart, Twilight Cleric of Selune, and everytime he roles a certain number, the next time he uses radiant dmg spells, they will be tinged with dark shadows just for the lore. so I was wondering what that number should be

jagged apex
jagged apex
eager bay
#

ahhh thanks

jagged apex
#

where as shar's is "Black disk with a purple border" so no real number connection there

eager bay
#

so i guess my number is 8

#

damn

#

thanks dude

#

mind blown

jagged apex
#

eh, there is no real canon connection, but what ever you do in your games is fair game, especially stuff like that which is more so rooted in one's interpretation

severe basin
#

Mystra's least favorite number is 12

eager bay
#

ill take it. but still i don't think its thaaaat far fetched when you look at the concept art

jagged apex
#

personally given her goals and views, i'd say shar if anything would be a fan of the number 0

severe basin
#

Mystra hated 12 so much that she banned magic of that level

jagged apex
#

she is an embodiment of the void so to speak, nothingness

#

or as the wiki describes it "A force of destruction and darkness, the very existence of Shar was paradoxical; the Nightbringer was brought into existence by the creation of Realmspace, but was the living embodiment of the void, the perfect nothing that existed before she was born."

#

she more or less, to my understanding longs for things to eventually return to that state of nothingness, is why she is so opposed to her sister, she took the lighting of toril's sun more or less as a personal attack on her

eager bay
#

but i think it lends itself to the dark moon heresy. where both fullness and nothingness can sometimes be the same goal through different paths.

the phases of the moon go from 1 to 8. if one is full and 8 is new. 8 sort of becomes the symbol of null.

Again i understand this part is infered from canon and not canon. But i think it's reasonable as far as interpretations go

calm crest
#

There are definitely some gods that care about numbers. 2e even had a Numbers sphere for priests. Most don’t have specific sacred numbers, however.

eager bay
jagged apex
severe basin
jagged apex
# eager bay why she not like 12 ?

i believe they are making a joke, as to my knowledge it had nothing to do with numbers of any sort and such info is not even given if they have any fondness of any number or not

severe basin
#

Mystra doesn't care one way or another for any numbers except that she does not let anyone cast 10th 11th or 12th level spells anymore

eager bay
jagged apex
#

that is because of the level of harm the mages of toril caused with such massive levels of power

severe basin
#

Crazy shit

jagged apex
eager bay
#

oh is that where the crown of karsus in bg 3 comes from ?

severe basin
#

Probably a reference of sorts yes

jagged apex
#

presumably had he picked any other god, it would have been fine, but he picked the only objectively wrong choice

severe basin
#

You cant just replace the god of magic and expect to get away with it

jagged apex
calm crest
#

The only caster to successfully use a 12th level spell in Realmspace was chaotic neutral, not evil. The same alignment as Mystryl, the original goddess of magic, in fact.

jagged apex
severe basin
#

This is why 12th level spells are not good for the environment

jagged apex
#

and technically if you look into it, is not so much as they can't cast such spells anymore, but there are a lot of divine safety measures and hurdles you have to over come, largely most detrimental to humans and other similarly short lived races

calm crest
#

Well, it’s more of a data point of one. A 12th level spell could be literally anything else of the same power, and 10th and 11th level spells had pretty much nothing to do with it other than being the foundation of Netheril, Karsus’ civilization.

jagged apex
severe basin
#

Indeed, twelfth level spells tend to be not very good for the environment

jagged apex
calm crest
#

Other settings still have non-epic spells of level 10+, such as Athas. Cerilia has Realm Magic, which are major rituals that act on the scale of kingdoms by tapping the caster’s innate divinity.

jagged apex
#

even details those limitations and hurdles i mentioned earlier, basically the reason people believe such spells are not possible is because it is actively kept near impossible and secretive by these rules that were imposed after karsus' folly

calm crest
#

Post-Folly Epic Magic is more akin to an esoteric rite than a traditional spell.

jagged apex
calm crest
#

I was just about to mention that!

severe basin
#

Some epic magic is good for the environment

jagged apex
#

these things, to my knowledge at least can result in spells, though often at the price of at least one of the caster's lives or more, that can basically kick out a god from the setting

calm crest
#

The most powerful Athasian magic relies on a combination of preserving or defiling mixed with psionics.

severe basin
#

Some epic magic can turn an entire city into a place where everybody inside the city can fly

jagged apex
severe basin
jagged apex
severe basin
#

It could be bad for the environment

#

However, epic magic specifically designed to help the environment can often but not always prove helpful to the environment

#

Some epic magic specifically designed to help the environment can have unforeseen side effect that may harm the environment

calm crest
#

Unless it’s Athas, where all arcane magic is demonstrably good or bad for the environment, magic is typically environmentally neutral as a whole.

severe basin
#

In athas, an important part of the setting is that Arcane magic is a lot of the time bad for the environment

#

And that using it is often considered evil

calm crest
#

Defiling magic specifically, yes.

#

Or at least, non-good.

severe basin
#

Let me re read it

#

Interesting

eager bay
#

why is the Year 1492 DR called The Year of Three Ships Sailing ?

calm crest
#

Most of the names are pretty arbitrary, as far as I know.

severe basin
#

Indeed

#

No event during 1492 seems to tie into ships sailing

severe basin
#

Mephits are small sized elemental type creatures native to the transitory elemental planes. Mephits come in 6 varieties, each one from a different transitory plane; Dust (air and earth), Ice (air and water), Magma (earth and fire), Mud (earth and water), Smoke (air and fire), and Steam (fire and water)
Mephits are most frequently neutral evil in alignment and often mischeivous pests. Their challenge ratings range from 1/4 to 1/2. All of them are capable of flight, explode in a burst of elemental energy upon death, and possess a breath weapon ability.

olive zodiac
#

How do great wyrms work? I think most sources say they absorb echoes of themself from other dimensions, but they also say “or absorb their energies in other ways” and some sources flat up say there’s no ritual for it. Is there variance across editions?

#

Also how big can an ancient dragon grow? Is there a hard limit?

jagged apex
severe basin
#

Demons are chaotic evil

olive zodiac
river garnet
#

I had a question somewhat I don’t know anything about the forgotten realms. I was looking into a god for a character of mine. Lathonder the god of renewal and dawn. Is there anything else I should know about him?

obsidian gate
river garnet
#

That helped a lot thanks

hazy grail
#

Heyo what do we do here??

ionic rivet
#

As the channel description says, "Discuss WotC-published game settings, and the events and characters that shaped them. Wherever possible, please indicate which setting you're discussing: [Forgotten Realms]/[FR], [Eberron], [Dragonlance], etc."

#

Basically discuss official D&D lore from official D&D settings and adventures

uncut umbra
#

ik time doesnt pass in the astral see... but how would say and astral elf state thier age? ik they live to 750+ but if asked their age what would they say? for example lets say an astral elf is 300, if asked his age would he say 300 or say like 1500yrs bc hes spent 800yrs in the astral sea and 700 out? i guess im just asking what the protocol is for this kind of thing?

versed hare
#

Time passes but things don't suffer aging

pallid flower
sharp owl
last marlin
#

character lore question: I built a level 5 Fey Wanderer Ranger a few months ago and chose Primordial as one of my Deft Explorer languages. It's recently become relevant and I've been saying I learned Primordial in the Feywild but I don't see really any lore about elementals there. Anyone know of some that I can reference to justify a thing I made up on the spot?

sharp owl
#

That would depend on what setting you're playing in

last marlin
#

Sorry, was just wondering if I should add that. Forgotten Realms/Faerun

sharp owl
#

Because the Feywild and the Planes of Elemental Chaos (or their equivilents) vary from setting to setting

tawdry frost
#

If nothing else, by conjuration spells.

sharp owl
#

Also, the Feywild tends to be broken up into Domains of Delight, each ruled by an Archfey who has some degree of control, or at least knowledge, over who is passing into and out of their realm. This means that elementals just stumbling into the Feywild is probably a lot less likely than in the material plane

tawdry frost
#

OH, CHWINGA! Chwinga are basically nature spirit elementals!

sharp owl
#

Chwinga aren't native to the Feywild

tawdry frost
sharp owl
#

They're native to the material plane IIRC

#

It's not impossible or even unlikely that an Archfey would have elementals under their employ though, either through pacts and deals made with elemental lords such as Djinni or Dao, or even through direct magical summonings

last marlin
last marlin
tawdry frost
# sharp owl Chwinga aren't native to the Feywild

RotFM set the precedent that Chwinga can travel with migrants via the objects they carry and adapt to their new environment so it's not impossible. In fact, the lore states they are guardians of the natural world and prefer places far from civilization. The feywild fits the bill perfectly.

vital cloudBOT
#
No pings, please :pray:

If you see someone with “No Pings” in their name, please don’t @ that user. If you Reply to them, please turn the alert @OFF, and if you forget, a simple apology is appreciated. Thank you!

tawdry frost
#

I literally turned it off! Why did it go back on?

sharp owl
#

Don't know, nor do I care, I just ask you don't ping me

tawdry frost
#

Discord being funny I see.

sharp owl
#

Also, the Feywild isn't nature/natural
It's an hyperactive, hypercolored, turned up to 11 borderline parody of nature

tawdry frost
#

Normally it's one and done but I'll be sure to keep an eye out. Not trying to ignore what you've said.

sharp owl
#

Chwinga would likely loathe the Feywild

tawdry frost
#

"The Feywild was a place of awe-inspiring natural beauty."
"the natural landscape was markedly more dramatic and beautiful in the Feywild,"
"While most Prime locations and landmarks had analogues in the Feywild, sites of civilization in the Prime could be so unimportant in the Feywild as to be easily missed, while natural landmarks might be significantly more majestic or extreme"

#

Sure is a lot of nature in the description for that not nature

sharp owl
#

I never said there wasn't, but it's not nature as mortals know it

#

Like I said, nature turned up to 11

#

the natural landscape was markedly more dramatic and beautiful in the Feywild

#

But that's beside the point of nora's question

#

It's not impossible there'd be elementals in the Feywild, but from what I know/can recal/can find, there's no elemental civilisations so I'm not sure you could justify knowing Primordial as a language directly from elementals

last marlin
sharp owl
#

That being said, there are places of learning and study within the various fey locales, although usually not in the traditional academic sense but more learning directly from wise figures and storytellers

sharp owl
last marlin
#

I mean like, is there an archfey that has ties to the shadowfell?

#

Just gave some character background to make the lore question make sense

sharp owl
#

Not as far as I know, the two planes are antiethical to each other

last marlin
#

I thought so but I was just kinda making stuff up when I wrote it lol I figured I could find some lore to loosely match later. Thanks a ton though!

tawdry frost
# last marlin This brought up another question that's been on my mind. Part of my backstory is...

There's actually something that I read in the text earlier that could help here!
"Visitors to the plane found that all sensations, both sensory and emotional, were heightened. Smells were stronger, colors were more vivid, and sounds were clearer, but at the same time shadows were darker and impulses were harder to control.

Combine this with what we know about how natural portals open up in places where planes align in "vibe," we just need to check the Shadowfell page for the requirements: "Naturally occurring intermittent portals called vortices appeared in seemingly random areas of heavy shade or darkness. "

Alternatively, I found this while grabbing the quotes, it's under a passage explaining the types of portals in dnd:

"Variable: These portals send travelers to a variety of different locations, either within a single plane or among several planes."

sleek mesa
#

I spent an unholy amount of time reseaching about dragons in dnd and goddamn how could you possibly use a steel dragon in a campain

sharp owl
tawdry frost
vital cloudBOT
#
No pings, please :pray:

If you see someone with “No Pings” in their name, please don’t @ that user. If you Reply to them, please turn the alert @OFF, and if you forget, a simple apology is appreciated. Thank you!

last marlin
teal rock
#

I know one of the mods directed you here but I thought I should inform you that this channel is more to discuss the official lore of DnD.

dense trellis
feral lintel
#

The channel is for official lore

tawdry frost
tawdry frost
#

They've been asking is there any lore to support this concept.

ionic rivet
#

Uh no this channel is very much for official D&D lore as written, discussed, shared in official D&D media.

#

Folks may be directed here if their question(s) relate to official lore.

tawdry frost
#

You mean like

Manual of the Planes 1st edition by TSR

Manual of the Planes, Third Edition, by Wizards of the Coast

Player's Guide to Faerûn, by Wizards of the Coast

Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting 3rd edition, Wizards of the Coast

Manual of the Planes 4th edition, by Wizards of the Coast

Etc?

Because they're right there, being sourced.

ionic rivet
#

Apologies If I misunderstood what you were trying to communicate. But as a moderator I need to emphasize this channel's purpose is to discuss official D&D lore. It's not for folks to discuss their character/game lore. What happens at your table is that table's lore and not considered official D&D lore and thus not a topic for this channel.

clever river
#

Who is the elven god of trances? I would guess it’s either Sehanine Moonbow (being the god of dreams), or Labelas Enoreth (god of history)

glossy summit
#

Drizz't is official dnd lore?

clever path
#

The most recognizable dnd lore

glossy summit
#

Drizz't's a ranger right?

clever path
#

Partially. He’s mostly a fighter

glossy summit
#

fighter?

clever path
#

Yes. Fighter.

glossy summit
#

The one class i specifically dislike? was Drizzt fighter or ranger first?

clever path
#

Fighter. It’s his largest class level

#

He was renown for his swordsmanship, top of his class in drow school

calm crest
#

He's varied between editions, but Drizzt is iconically associated with dual scimitars and an animal companion.

#

He was a ranger in AD&D. His class got more complicated later, although that's more mechanics than lore, strictly speaking.

grim siren
#

Drizzt learns to become a ranger only after he leaves the under dark. He was trained to be a swordsman first.

gentle scaffold
#

Is there any campign setting during the Time of trouble?

sharp owl
jagged apex
#

if any god i'd say their patron god Corellon would the one associated with it, as he is known as the Creator of the Elves, Father of Elvenkind, First of the Seldarine, ect...

#

plus the faithful of Sehanine Moonbow, given they are a god of dreams, are one of the few elves who would choose to sleep and thus dream to recieve messages from their goddess last i checked, as you do not dream during reverie

grim siren
spare smelt
#

What connection is there to dwarves and barbarians in dnd lore?

jagged apex
#

what setting?

spare smelt
#

Far Realms

jagged apex
#

not a setting

spare smelt
#

Forgotten my bad

jagged apex
#

did you mean forgotten realms?

#

cuz there is no real specific connection between the two compared to any other race, though historically there is a specific kind of barbarian path for them that mechanically was not very good and was largely left behind in early 5e, but is a form of combat specific to the dwarves of the forgotten realms https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Battlerager

#

so presumably this might be what you were looking for, but is more so a specific style they invented for themselves, plus classes are largely non diagetic when it comes to lore

spare smelt
#

I saw an off comment about it and I remembered in dragon age the barbarian was said to be inspired by dwarves, which is usually means its stolen from probably dnd.

That’s probably it thanks, I figured dwarves usually preferred a lot of armour over light armour, and even those pictures kinda say the same thing

jagged apex
#

no, that is not what it ment likely

#

plus one does not simply steal from dnd, many of the things in dnd are it's own takes on existing concepts

smoky plume
#

What exactly animates constructs?

versed hare
#

The manual of golems is one thing

smoky plume
#

No I mean like energy wise, undead have negative energy, and living have positive

sharp owl
#

It depends greatly on the construct. Many golems are animated by an elemental drawn from the Planes of Elemental Chaos. Some contructs, such as Nimblewrights, are more akin to clockwork driven by magic. For animated armor, it's armor directly manipulated and driven by magic

smoky plume
sharp owl
#

No, it can be necromancy if you're drawing on some kind of undead spirit, or conjuration if you're pulling energy from one of the planes, or even evocation if you're just binding energy as a motive force

smoky plume
sharp owl
#

One is a corpse, the other isn't

smoky plume
sharp owl
#

That's a mechanical distinction, not a narrative one

#

If you animate a corpse with necrotic energy, you get an undead (narratively) because it's something that was once alive, then dead, and now neither
If you animate an object with necrotic energy, you still get a construct (narratively) because it's something that was never alive given the semblance of life

#

Remember that the game mechanics and the narrative do not exist in parity and should not be treated as such

smoky plume
sharp owl
#

You could use parts of corpses and get a flesh golem which is still considered a construct and not an undead

#

Because it's not something that was ever alive

#

The whole "corpse is an object" thing is a mechanical conceit, not a narrative one

#

narratively, in the lore, a corpse is a corpse. It's the remains of something that was once alive
The lore doesn't care about the whole corpse/object/effect distinction thing present in the rules

#

If at any point you find yourself going "but in the rules...." that's your point to stop and contemplate if the rules are trying to say anything about the lore, which often they're not

smoky plume
drowsy wraith
#

How do duergar view spellcasters? Particularly duergar spellcasters. Would they accept a duergar sorcerer as being a useful tool?

thorny hound
#

Do Archfey have a 'normalized' look or do they just look however they want to?

versed hare
#

Archfey are all unique supremely powerful fey

feral lintel
#

Much like the demons, theyre wildly varied, being beings of chaos

calm crest
#

Many of them resemble other fey creatures, but there’s no standardized appearance, and most of them can shapechange.

simple ingot
#

Aasimar are born and live where?

calm crest
#

Aasimar are humanoids with an Upper Planar influence. They can be born into families of other aasimar, or occasionally the trait may be recessive and not appear for generations. They can live pretty much wherever.

#

In prior editions, they were expressly descendants of aasimon (angels) and humans, but it’s a lot more open lately.

jagged apex
jagged apex
calm crest
#

Yes, setting can be a relevant distinction.

jagged apex
#

and often is, which is why some of the species like the dragonborn for example can seem like they lost much of what lore they had in the new books, is cuz those new sources are ment to be setting agnostic

#

especially since some settings, like eberron drastically differ do to having a self contained cosmology

calm crest
#

The fey of Mystara are different from those of Oerth, just as the aasimar of Toril are different from their Sigilian brethren.

reef cape
calm crest
#

-# Sigilite?

jagged apex
#

though certain broad strokes are often shared, such as aasimar and their celestial influence and tieflings with their fiendish ones

reef cape
#

But it is true that aasimars, genasis and tieflings are more common in Sigil than anywhere else

calm crest
#

And more likely that the planar-types (aasimar, tiefling, etc.) of Sigil had an outsider ancestor rather than just being influenced by a plane.

jagged apex
#

makes sense, they would logically feel more at home in the multiversal capital than on their native plane of existance where like in the case of tieflings historically they are often viewed negatively just because of their heritage as if they were irredeemably evil, which is not at all true, though is not like the people of worlds like toril necessarily know that

#

plane touched tend to be rare compared to native races on prime material worlds, so rarely are there enough to form unique cultures or communities, though some do exist on toril to my knowledge but they are still very small and are not exactly the norm

pallid flower
#

There’s a demesne for fiendtouched and an orphanage for planetouched in Eberron

jagged apex
#

again, that is another case where setting is a heavy factor in the specifics

calm crest
#

Unusual settings, like Athas and Mystara wholly lack aasimar because celestials don’t exist there. Cerilia has a huge (effectively) aasimar population, as every regent has a bloodline imbued with divine power.

glossy summit
#

does drizzt have any siblings?

calm crest
jagged apex
#

though seems most of them just happened to have died in some unknown way during the fall of their house, ie the noble family of Do'Urden as a whole, not a literal house

uneven raft
#

what is a planetouched person?

sharp owl
#

Someone who has some connection to one of the planes beyond the material

#

The most common planetouched are those whose physical nature is influenced, such as:

  • Genasi - Planes of Elemental Chaos [Inner planes] - Elementals
  • Tieflings - Nine Hells, The Abyss, Gehenna etc [Lower planes] - Fiends
  • Aasimar - Mount Celestia, Elysium, Bitopia etc [Upper planes] - Celestials
  • Clockwork Soul Sorcerers - Mechanus - Constructs
chrome moon
#

Err, the Savage North in Faerun extends in the west to the Spine Of The World and the east to the Nether Mountains. And in the southwest the border with Storm Coast North is the Ardeep Forest and the Lizard Marsh? Just checking if my geography is correct?

jagged apex
chrome moon
pallid flower
ornate jetty
#

is the word coat and neverwinter actually part of the universe?

#

swoard coast*

calm crest
#

It’s part of the setting called the Forgotten Realms in the region of Toril called Faerûn.

ornate jetty
#

so neverwinter nights is canon?

#

an bg 1 and 2

calm crest
#

They each are their own continuities with some degree of crossover to the core TTRPG.

ornate jetty
#

are they canon or not?

unkempt merlin
#

canon is not a simple yes/no status

#

its like marvel canon, where the answer is "sometimes"

ornate jetty
#

bg3 is not as canon as the older games

#

imo

unkempt merlin
#

it 100% is just as canon

ornate jetty
#

i liked to connect neverwinter with bg2

#

and bg1

#

does icewind dale still exist?

calm crest
#

Yes, Icewind Dale exists.

ornate jetty
#

thats old school shit

#

booting up my windows 98

feral lintel
jagged apex
versed hare
#

Yeah it's been 50 years of dnd there's a lot of contiuities

jagged apex
#

mostly between different forms of media, but even then like with the video games, there are multiple continuities within that specific branch of everything, like how bg3 is not entirely canon to the prior entries in the series but has some broad references to it, but nothing direct

chrome moon
#

Are the immediate surroundings of Baldur´s Gate described anywhere?

grim siren
#

If you mean immediate as in a few miles then also yes in the supplement Murder in Baldur's Gate.

coarse hull
#

Hey Guys, who was Vecna before he became powerful?

feral lintel
#

A wizard

chrome moon
coarse hull
#

Before that? What was his job? Background, etc

chrome moon
#

Well, he is from Chult

feral lintel
#

king

grim siren
#

If your character is from Chult. That is far from the Gate, and you would be best looking at Tomb of Annihilation. Or 2e's Jungles of Chult.

chrome moon
#

Ah, sorry that Chult comment was for the Vecna question up above. Forgot to link reply on mobile

grim siren
#

Vecna is not from Chult. Vecna is from the Planet Oreth. Chult is on the planet Toril. The lich from Tomb of Annihilation is another Orethian Lich named Acererak who was once a pupil of Vecna.

chrome moon
#

Ah. So the Information I read about 20 years ago has been proven to be false. Imma look that Ace chap up later

chrome moon
#

@grim siren And I cant find anything on him. Do you perchance got a link? FR wiki has nothing and whatever other dnd wiki I found was shit

grim siren
chrome moon
#

How? When I typed it in, correctly, it did not show anything

glossy summit
#

whats your favorite dnd lore?

grim siren
#

Some claim that foxes aren't native to forgotten realms at all, but were introduced from Earth—specifically France—by a halfling trader named Altho Minstrelwish around 12 DR. Hoping to profit from their fur, especially the tails or "brushes," he was disappointed when few halflings found the scent appealing. Attempts to sell fox meat fared even worse. Ultimately, Altho released the animals into the wild, where they spread quickly and eventually outcompeted the native lynx. The halfling word for fox, rennard, is said to come from the French word renard. However, other sources note that foxes were present in the realms as far back as the days of ancient Netheril, well before Altho's time.

reef cape
feral lintel
#

not really a lore thing

small matrix
#

Who makes up the bulk of yuan ti armies; Brood guards or Malisons?

serene crater
#

most of the time it's malisons, as brood guards are typically prisoners/slaves who have been captured and transformed into guards

#

their main purpose (at least by FR) is as their name implies, as brood guards aren't often competent

small matrix
serene crater
#

np

chrome moon
#

How much information do we have on the world of Abeir itself?

grim siren
#

From Ed Greenwood himself

chrome moon
#

No written down setting books? Imma bookmark te video for later

grim siren
#

Nope. The 4e setting guide features Returned Abeir. A continent called Laerakond, it's the deepest published Abier lore

chrome moon
#

A mention of that one was what made me curious

exotic python
#

So in my campaign I am using a story telling technique where my character is narrating the campaign thru letters and lore that he wrote, it is about my characters Friend getting possessed by vecnas hold of darkness and I am having trouble starting the lore, any suggestions.

pallid flower
dusky pond
#

Is there anything adjacent to a Ghost Rider in the Forgotten Realms? I'm looking to build a character themed around GR.

wintry marlin
pallid flower
#

Sounds like more of a question for #character-discussion
There are plenty of features that involve mounts and undead (Find Steed+Reborn)

dusky pond
#

That's a good idea. Vengeance Paladin/Fiend Warlock multiclass should work, right?

feral lintel
#

not really a lore thing

exotic python
dusky pond
#

What good aligned Gods are cool with Archliches? (People who sought out lichdom for a noble cause and to fight against the enemies of good.)

calm crest
#

Setting?

dusky pond
#

Forgotten Realms

thick sentinel
#

The first adventure in the original 1987 FR gray box is about an archlich, so really all of them. Every good Forgotten Realms deity is a go

I would say that Ilmater, Tyr, Torm, and Helm are not great choices, as are not Waukeen, Amaunator, or Red Knight. Any other that those will really shine in a setting that includes the archlich as a core concept. If they have a tie to the region, city, or ruins -- then it elevates it just a bit more

azure barn
#

is there much direct reference to some of the old wizards in 5e, like Nystul, Tenser, Melf etc... outside of the odd spell here and there

thick sentinel
#

Yes, 1 of those is in the TSR Rogues' Gallery booklet. It was a product released in 1980 that really was the NPC guide (from the TSR & Gygax family and friends PCs) for the World of Greyhawk. Tenser was played by Ernie Gygax, and a rustler from the Wild Coast like Mordenkainen; friends. Melf was a noble Gray Elf from Celene and related to Celene's Queen Yolande played by Luke Gygax

Both were magic users, but Tenser would love to bare-hand fight and mix it up, thus how some of his spells were cast (cast is a double-entendre pun in this sentence and context)

Nystul was added much later, as a prominent magic user in the Duchy of Tenh. The Tenh itself represents the Flan peoples in modern 576CY times, but Nystul is an anagram of Sultan. In some versions of the story, Nystul is joined by Janina which is an anagram of our real-world Anjani (Anjana of Hindu mythology, possibly showing the geopolitics between the Delhi Sultanate and the Ottoman Timur's campaigns aka the Timurid conquests. Nystul is also a magic user

Nystul, like many of the quasi-deity and heroes of Greyhawk, was named after a game associate of the TSR staff, Mike Nystul -- but never played as the family&friends PCs were

#

I always included Bigby (another Gygax PC), Terik, played by Terry Kuntz, the brother of Rob Kuntz (Robliar) along with Mordenkainen and Tenser as a small band from the Wild Coast, which was also the portal to Rob Kuntz' world setting, Kalibruhn

Drawmij (Jim Ward's PC, also mentioned in Rogues' Gallery) lived off the coast of Keoland as some impossibly-only Captain Nemo figure as a Greyhawk magic user

I could talk about these at length, is any of this on the right track?

azure barn
#

this is great! i only knew a few bits and pieces so i will read however much you care to share

thick sentinel
#

are you interested in spells or also magical items from the names of the Greyhawk treasures?

azure barn
#

sure!

#

i am just a student taking in knowledge right now, i know all these names from the odd reference here or there (see nystuls magic aura) but without physical copies of a lot of books its harder to go looking

#

so to the great patron of discord i go, and i thank you for your time and energy sharing

thick sentinel
#

cool. I really like the deity Ehlonna, and she is linked to the Quiver of Ehlonna. She's not just a standard nature deity, and I think she might be related to Elise, Gygax's oldest daughter? This is why I wanted to stop beacuse the facts aren't always right. There's also an area in Greyhawk named Ahlissa and an artifact named after a Queen Ehlissa

#

There is a bard named Heward, who is a quasi-deity -- and he has a few magical items but Heward's Handy Sack comes to mind first. He hung out with Bucknard and Maralee, who were brother-and sister

Some of who these people are related to is correct here, but I can't account for the entire accuracy of this page -- https://www.greyhawkonline.com/grodog/gh_anagrams.html

#

There's a Flannic Ranger Knight named Quaal, with the feather tokens

#

There's a paladin named Daern, and she invented or created Daern's fortress

#

Keoghtom's Ointment is named after Tom Keogh, a close frined of Gygax

#

Vecna = Vance = Jack Vance

#

Zagyg = Gygax backward

#

Tasha's Hideous Laughter, Tasha being Iggwilv, either/or being named by a little girl who wrote to Gary Gygax and/or a combo with Gygax's youngest Cindy Lee, and the connection of Iggwilv to the Finnish epic Kalevala -- specifically the witch queen Louhi (who is detailed in Deities & Demigods) are all speculation. I have never confirmed or denied any of these unknown treasures of D&D lore

#

Leomund was Lakofka’s PC, and we likely would not have had any of the above without Len's interactions with Gary. Len made heavy use of the "Hey GM -- Can I invent spells?" principles, and was really one of the first homebrewers that really fit the description of the bill today

That's why so many spells etc are named after Leomund, because Len Lakofka was on a mission to keep inventing them

thick sentinel
#

Who am I missing? Jallarzi? Rary? Otiluke? They're all in the Vecna Lives appendix V along with a few of the others already mentioned

calm crest
#

Good ol’ Medium Rary, who couldn’t cast the spells later attributed him.

jagged apex
#

at least any more, if i am not mistaken spells are often reclassified over time and thus vary from edition to edition or version to version in the case of some more modern ones that got reclassified in the 2024 books

#

in universe this is basically various scholars debating and agreeing upon certain things regarding such spells usually as part of some sort of order or system to mages wishing to learn more about magic and how to wield it, though i could be mistaken

#

plus since those early days, depending on the setting, much has happened to require magic and the nature of it for mortals to have to change such as in the forgotten realms when karsus' folly happened once the weave was restored and a new mystra was born

calm crest
#

The whole thing is that original character of Rary was only played to medium level for the sake of a joke. Once he got reworked as an Oerthic NPC, he was made much higher level and had spells named after him.

#

Eventually becoming called Rary the Traitor.

dusky pond
thick sentinel
#

I think on a case-by case basis. Generally, it would be an abomination, but Kelemvor and his followers are very intelligent and if it's helping them or other allies in any way, would be instantly open to hearing more

Ed Greenwood even addressed this once, saying the Kelemvor folk are happy to help the archlich, as long as he or she considers a path towards a true or final death after the situation is resolved. A smart archlich who doesn't want the same has many options, though, so I could see several reversals here. Would be fun for a campaign, that's for sure!

dusky pond
#

You're a saint, thank you.

thick sentinel
#

You have the good and fun questions!

dark comet
#

In Eberron, I understand that there are Khoravar, which are like half-elves in that they came about from being mixed human and elf ancestry.

But I’m seeing some “drama” around them? Like do people have a problem with them not being called half-elves? Or something else? I read their Wiki page just to get more context but nothing is jumping out at me.

https://eberron.fandom.com/wiki/Half-elf

twilit creek
#

So what happened to vecna did he die is he still around can he be revived

sharp owl
#

Vecna ascended to godhood at some point, becoming the god of secrets and hidden knowledge

jagged apex
jagged apex
# twilit creek So what happened to vecna did he die is he still around can he be revived

he is effectively immortal as one of if not the only lich to successfully ascend to godhood, in 5e at least this is even reflected mechanically, as for what happened to him, depends on the edition and setting, as despite being originally from the world of greyhawk he has a notable presence in the forgotten realms https://greyhawkonline.com/greyhawkwiki/Vecna#History https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Vecna#History his most recent plot in published materials is the center of an entire adventure module that was also a celebration of 50 years of dnd

dark comet
modest badger
#

Not sure if really a lore aspect so much as how folk online are reacting to changes. Quite possibly this is simply a delayed reaction to 2024 not including half-elves as a PHB species, but Khoravar will be available to play, and ensuing debates around that. Likely started by headlines like this one: https://www.wargamer.com/dnd/eberron-half-elf

However opinions on lore aren't really the appropriate topic for this channel. This would be a great place to chat about how Eberron and Keith Baker approach the concept of mixed-species and identity, and where Khoravar fall on that (while of mixed human-elven heritage, Khoravar do not consider themselves 'half-elves'), but discussions around how people feel about that is better suited to #dnd-discussion or if wanting to change and build upon lore #dm-world-building

unkempt merlin
#

Yea as Elgate touched on, the Khoravar in Eberron are generally unique in their presentation compared to half elves in other settings because they are considered just. Themselves.

They of course have relationships with elves and humans, but the framing both outside of and (especially) inside setting are mostly just different than half elves get

thick summit
#

they call themselves Khoravar because unlike humans and elves that originated in other continents, half-elves are "native" to Khorvaire

round umbra
#

I am slightly confused about Ao's degree after the Times of Trouble. I thought gods were forbidden from interfering with mortals directly, and if they do, they become mortals. The dead-three are quasi-deities as a result, so no true gods.

How did Lolth get banished by Gromph Baenre from the city if Ao would smite down any gods from interfering directly? She had a presence in the city, and was doing whatever she wanted, same as always.

clever path
#

If you mean during OoTA she never entered the city

round umbra
clever path
#

Avatars are specifically the exception to the rule because they arent the god themselves being in the material plane.

#

That’s why there are two hardcover adventures featuring god avatars as bosses

#

It’s more a puppet that channels a minor fragment of their true power

round umbra
#

That minor power is still far above most mortals though, no? And it is a direct involvement.

clever path
#

Still not their real form which remains in their home realm. And being above most mortal isn’t a high bar. An old enough dragon fits that already too

round umbra
#

Understood, gotcha. So it's a sort of loophole.

clever path
#

Yea more or less. Most gods only have one unless they merc another deity

jagged apex
#

in short, much later in the timeline

eager bay
#

Are there "sand elves"? As in elves that live in a desert?

calm crest
#

Setting?

#

On Athas, that’s the default, for example.

jagged apex
pallid flower
#

There are elves who live in desert regions. For an example from another setting, the elves of Valenar from Eberron

thorny hollow
#

Any books or series that read like Arthurian?

jagged apex
#

what setting

thorny hollow
#

Any

jagged apex
#

as you can see in the appearance section, it appears and is otherwise mentioned in several novels

#

but to my knowledge there is no setting with an entire series in that sort of theme

thorny hollow
#

Gotcha. Thanks for the info

calm crest
#

Birthright is fairly Arthurian.

eager bay
round umbra
#

So, returning to the earlier question I had. 1490-ish, Lolth banished by Gromph Baenre for 100 years. Does that mean she cannot bestow divine magic on her clerics anymore? What does banishment entail?

sharp owl
#

Banishment usually means a restriction or limitation of their ability to manifest and act in the plane where they're banished from, rather than a full cutting off

clever path
#

I’m not familiar with this event specifically but no mortal has the power to restrict a divinity in such a manner. You mentioned she had avatars running about so it’s likely more that he banished those off the material plane no?

round umbra
clever path
#

Yea her avatar presumably because real Lloth can’t be there

round umbra
#

I dunno, I haven't read the book. It is from Lolth's Warrior book.

#

Just read the summary.

#

OK, so Lolth would still be able to grant divine power to her clerics even as banished?

clever path
#

Well yea? She does it from the abyss normally anyways

#

Mortals cannot block divine connections to followers generally

round umbra
#

Davyd mentioned a restriction or limitation. Would it mean she cannot power-up as many clerics as before, or it is not at all impacted?

You're saying mortals cannot block divine connection at all, Davyd suggests it may be diminished (I think).

clever path
#

He said what banishment means in general terms not what it meant right then for Lloth. Nothing Grompf could have done single-handedly would have been able to weaken Lloth as a literal goddess

sharp owl
#

Her power isn't deminished, but certain aspects of it can be restricted from manifesting in certain places
Off the top of my head, I believe Tiamat is limited in how she can manifest her power within Waterdeep due to the Dragonward

round umbra
#

Understood, all clear; thanks both.

unkempt merlin
#

Tiamat is limited in particular just from being trapped in Avernus the way she is

In general it would make sense for the Dragonward to affect her though

round umbra
#

Is there any technological progress in the Forgotten Realms/Toril? Like is there a difference between 1400's DR, and 100DR?

sharp owl
#

There are individual innovations such as the development of certain types of constructs (such as nimblewrights) but no, overall Toril has been pretty stagnant technologically

#

That's not to say it's primitive, just that there's little motivating factor to advance technology given the impact of magic

jagged apex
# round umbra Is there any technological progress in the Forgotten Realms/Toril? Like is there...

plenty, but like most worlds with access to magic unlike earth, their technology is rooted in magic more so than the principles we would here on earth, magical items are effectively a form of technology arguably in the context of dnd, so it sort of depends what you mean specifically by "technology" but there have been improvements since those time periods, all be it fewer than we would see in a similar span of time on worlds like earth, and these sort of factors can also very from one part of toril to another

pearl hinge
#

Out of all the enemies Drizzt and his friends faced. Was Ygorl the strongest out of all of them?

jagged apex
#

eh, is tricky, assuming you mean Ygorl the slaad lord, given his unique nature, plus i have never heard of driz'zt and his friends facing Ygorl

split tapir
#

It is in the latest trilogy and yes, it is the strongest one.

grim siren
# round umbra Is there any technological progress in the Forgotten Realms/Toril? Like is there...

Absolutely, the most important one was the development of smoke powder by the Lantanna.

The artificers of Lantan developed a new method of wager war for Faerûn the Bombard with actual gunpowder around the 1240s. Very quickly this tech miniaturized and was found all throughout the world. Much to the disdain and grumblement of many petty Lords and kingdoms who now had to deal with an armed populace.

The god of craft Gond entered into an agreement with the goddess of magic Mystra. To render the substance inert so is to not lose many worshipers very quickly.

About 100 years later Gond was found to be made Mortal and struck a deal with the Lantanna making giving them the secrets of Smoke powder. A magical substance similar to gunpowder but far more explosive.

By the Next 20 years, the firearm industry exploded all throughout faerun. While still only manufactured on the island of Lantan. Resellers began spreading them throughout the world. Any reasonably well stocked shop or blacksmithing area would have at least one or two weapons for sale though at a very premium price. It would not be uncommon to see generals and captains carrying a pistol.

In the late-15th century DR, following the Second Sundering returning it from the parallel-world of Abeir, the island nation of Lantan became more secretive. From the occasional glimpses that outsiders got of the Lantanna, they got the impression that their technology had become more advanced in the time since their absence. This in turn lead some to speculate about what developments the Lantanna may have made in regards to smokepowder weapons.

jagged apex
#

even got/had some drow working for Jarlaxle who are armed with such firearms in waterdeep, around the 1490s DR

#

and depending on which continuity you are talking about, there are potentially things produced by others of gond's faith, all be it against their will, like the steel watchers

#

and while constructs that can act as potent warriors and guardians are not anything new, to my knowledge that is one example of any of the continuities were such a thing was effectively mass produced, ignoring the uniqueness of some of it's materials

grim siren
#

the point is Technology is improving and changing but people need to understand that for the vast vast majority of the Realms playable and written timeline was from 1e to 3e.

that is 1351-1372. 21 years ago tech was much different than it is today. But we are also at the awful end of exponential tech explosion. The tech between 887 AD - 907 AD wasn't that big of a leap.

That brings up "Well what about the 100 year timeskip? Yes 4e brought forth the spellplague and a 105 year timeskip to 1479 DR. It was explicitly stated this was a sort of apocalyptic event. Where everyone went fall of rome. They went from creating to surviving. Its only in the last 20+ Years in the 5e time that tech is moving again.

jagged apex
#

and that in worlds with access to magic, unless i am mistaken, their tech is different than ours, being rooted in magic more often than what tech in our world is

#

so depends if you are meaning tech as we understand it or not

round umbra
#

Thank you very much Kas for the detailed answer. That answered my question and then some.

#

I have another related to Drow society. Do Drow noblemen hold authority over drow women commoners, or all women hold authority over all men?

jagged apex
#

men are in those that follow loth and her ways, are more or less second class citizens, being barely above the slaves the drow are known to hold of the lesser races as they see them

#

there are some who kind of defy these trends such as the famous jarlaxel via his mercenary company, who despite being male, actually has notablely significant power in a lolth worshiping society which is to my understanding not the norm and what makes it so impressive for him to have achieved https://forgottenrealms.fandom.com/wiki/Jarlaxle

#

and the way it describes that fact on the wiki at least suggests that males like him are a minority as most males in drow societies that worship lolth presumably don't have much if any power, being little more that valuable property of the noble ladies of the house, though i could be wrong

round umbra
jagged apex
#

idk, but you could maybe read the driz'zt books, he is as i recall technically one such male

#

granted he escaped and went rogue, but he did grow up in a lolth worshiping society and spent years there before he made his escape, so could provide some incite via context

#

but in general lolth views women as more valuable than men, deeming men worthless, so by that logic even the most common drow woman would be seen as more valuable than a noble man in lolth's eyes, weather or not this is reflected by the whole of a lolth worshiping society and to what degree, idk

split tapir
#

It is reflected somewhat. But obviously high status gives drow males authority over lowborn females in practice. It is a situation where practical things overrul tenets. Still even among noble most male drow has degree of engraved revery towards females from the upbringing. For example someone extremely powerful like Archmage Gromph can easily kill any insignificant female without second thought. But the lower is your status the more caution you will exhibit. Also males of all statues generally fell spite towards any females because of the oppression.

mild wind
# jagged apex and that in worlds with access to magic, unless i am mistaken, their tech is dif...

Not necessarily. There are plenty of examples of societies that had technology that wasn’t magic-based, even though the society itself possessed magic or even magic-based technology. For instance, the gnomes of the Lantan civilization developed non-magical engineering and devices that utilized basic principles such as gears, levers, and pulleys which ranged from elevators and cranes to printing presses. They also created clockwork devices and non-magical clockwork constructs. It should be noted that while they did use non-magic-based technology, magical technology still existed and had its place.

jagged apex
#

yes but that is different from the norm, is why when they took some people from earth as slaves, they were amazed at the stuff they made to aid in their tasks, such as some rather simple pully systems

#

though to my understanding the norm for most worlds with magic is more often than not their tech is more rooted in magic than the things we in our world would, as magic is a fundimental part of the dnd multiverse, just like gravity for example

mild wind
#

Most settings with magic-based technology also have non-magic-based technology as well.

#

Non-magical technology is a fundamental part of the multiverse.

jagged apex
#

i never said settings had either one or the other

mild wind
#

You said if they had magic, then their tech was rooted in magic.

#

I was saying that statement isn't necessarily true. 🙂

jagged apex
#

yeah, as the norm, apologies if i did not make that clearer

mild wind
#

Most settings have technology that isn't rooted in magic.

#

And then technology eventually is adapted to with magic.

jagged apex
#

not sure where you are getting that from, to my understanding those with magic are the majority

mild wind
#

I'm saying your statment is incorrect.

jagged apex
#

based on what source or evidence? else this just seems like a pointless back and forth, i never said settings had one or the other full stop nor did i claim i was 100% objectively correct

#

i am not saying you are wrong or that i am nessissarily correct, but i am genuinely curious of the source

mild wind
#

You're turning this into a debate. No need to.

#

This isn't you versus me.

#

No need to take offense.

jagged apex
#

i am not taking offense, as i said i am curious of the source you are getting your info from

#

cuz it is not what i am familiar with clearly, and i wish to know

unkempt merlin
#

Marek is generally correct. Most settings have a plethora of non magical technology (both fictional and otherwise)

#

of official settings, Eberron is the biggest outlier for having the low ratio of nonmagical:magical tech things, since even for more simple thing magical stuff replaces nonmagical

jagged apex
#

k, but is there a source or is this something one must extrapulate from viewing various published materials?

unkempt merlin
#

its something you can just observe from what is present in the settings

jagged apex
#

k

unkempt merlin
#

it isn't magical tech for people to have stuff like blacksmithing and shovels and all that

pallid flower
#

Eberron’s the only d&d setting to reinvent the umbrella to my knowledge

fiery vortex
#

What are the patrons of hexblades

pallid flower
#

Which setting?

fiery vortex
true saffron
#

Raven Queen as well as sentient magic weapons, on top of my head.

unkempt merlin
#

Raven queen yes, sentient magic weapons no

#

The long and short answer is "entities from the shadowfell who create magic weapons"

true saffron
#

Oh, right!

thorny hound
#

Could a human be changed into a changeling under some circustamnces lorewise?

versed hare
#

Yes, a curse, a wish, a reincarnation.

prisma siren
versed hare
#

The weapon is the patron is what it says now

unkempt merlin
#

"now" doesn't really count, since UA isn't a thing in the lore until its published

#

in current lore and everything about the hexblade, the patron is not a weapon

silver sphinx
unkempt merlin
#

it doesn't, they are referring to UA

spare smelt
#

Do drow player characters or enemies still suffer from sunlight sensitivity?

feral lintel
#

Not a lore thing

spare smelt
#

It is

#

I know they don’t in game but I was wondering if it’s still seen in literature

feral lintel
#

Game mechanics arent lore for the purposes of this channel

spare smelt
#

It's literally part of their lore? Was that changed when the game mechanics changed?

feral lintel
#

**Discuss WotC-published game settings, and the events and characters that shaped them. **Wherever possible, please indicate which setting you're discussing: [Forgotten Realms]/[FR], [Eberron], [Dragonlance], etc.

  • To discuss your own game world, see ⁠dm-world-building.
  • To discuss specific adventures, see ⁠adventures-spoilers.
  • To share what happened in your own games, see ⁠tales-from-the-table.
versed hare
#

Sunlight sensitivity does indeed go back years, you see it on drow stat blocks in monsters of the multiverse still as well as in the 2014 players handbook but not in the 2024 phb for drow players

spare smelt
#

That’s why I worded the question a bit weird. If it’s for the enemy statblocks I’m assuming it’s still there in the lore, and I don’t think there’s been a new book on it