td2-build-advice

[novel ember]

do i need to play the brooklyn again or not

[onyx sage]

no, just using the boost won't force you into brooklyn

[novel ember]

i just created a new one with using the booster now they dropped me in brooklyn but i cant go to w-dc

i will solve the 2nd character too

so thats mean i have 3 char now

why i feel like i did something wrong here lol

[onyx sage]

you have to create a lv1 character and then boost in store page if you don't want to be forced to brooklyn

[stark flicker]

which would be better overall for an ongoing directive build ridgeway's pride with a sadist lmg or bluescreen/iron lung with og chest and catalyst

[novel ember]

ohh nice you mean if i do it with this way no need to play the brooklyn mission

[onyx sage]

yes

[novel ember]

now i can see on my new char i can use the full points on my watch again to max them out ! any benefit from this ?

[onyx sage]

no, unless you plan to use it, in which case the benefit is obvious

[novel ember]

if i want to play with char any mission in the future i have to max this watch i mean using the points on it

[onyx sage]

if you mean the 800 points you always get then you're not "spending" them, you have them by default

those are for the watch bonuses, they don't take from the scavenging points

[novel ember]

so i will use them then

and i can see my watch without that much of resorces ! so how players can share these resorces with other charactars

[onyx sage]

check out inaya

[hoary valve]

is there a build for xp farm in kenly college ?

[loud pine]

the second one, the od chest is pretty good

[stark flicker]

for blue screen now that I have the blueprint from the manhunt I can get it from any exotic drops right?

[loud pine]

im not sure to be honest

[novel ember]

whos this

[onyx sage]

the lady next to the crafting bench in white house

[solar sable]

Bluescreen isn't tied to anything, idk why you did all that

[hallow pike]

what should i roll onto my 4 piece striker backfire build?

[stark flicker]

I saw bluescreen as a manhunt reward and thought it'd give me the gun itself

[solar sable]

what exactly is your build?
Either way both crits

[hallow pike]

striker mask, backpack, gloves and holster,, grupo kneepads and ridgeways pride

[subtle bluff]

Exotics/named’s weapon/gear aren’t always the best or is needed the for every build.

[hallow pike]

so give me suggestions then

[lament reef]

check pins

[subtle bluff]

Context? I am just giving a fact out.

[solar sable]

I would sincerely run striker's w/memento if I want to use Backfire

[hallow pike]

well give me suggestions of what to use instead of a snarky comment about my current setup

[hallow pike]

thank u, ill swap it out

[subtle bluff]

Again I need context of what you want if you want advice. I was again just stating a fact.

[solar sable]

just don't use any hazpro or bleed res mods lol

[subtle bluff]

Nothing about that statement was snarky. It's a fact, a lot of players focus on needing to use a exotic or a named gear/weapon all the time.

This is all HE gear.

[candid talon]

What's the best red build in the game right now?

[subtle bluff]

Strikers

[candid talon]

No, red. Instant damage.

Something you'd use for a speedrun

[subtle bluff]

Did that clip not show you fast?

[patent fossil]

For a speedrun, some kind of regulus build probably

[subtle bluff]

Yes and no. It depends on a few things.

[patent fossil]

Dunno if anyone has established yet if 3pc imminence is better than hhf

[subtle bluff]

Depends on the level of content. We already have enough dmg with HHF in solo.

[subtle bluff]

There is no "best" red build in the game.

[patent fossil]

Yeah would definitely depend on the content and scaling

[candid talon]

Fine, I'll spell it out. Without having to get a bunch of stacks, which build can get over 1M damage per AR shot from the get go? I'm thinking GC / Fox / Contractor's etc.

[subtle bluff]

Standard HE DPS. It's in the pinned messages

And by no means it's "The Best" this is why context helps when asking.

Also counting your dmg by bullet dmg isn't the best way to go when we have RPM. DPS is what you want to do.

[onyx sage]

if you let HF stack up, it will beat imminence, but if kills are few and far between imminence is better

[late dew]

Any improvements to this build?

[subtle bluff]

Switch NBB (Ninja Bike Backpack) for Striker BP. Then any mix of all of the follow 1 pc Ceska and obliterate talent for the Chest.

[tired falcon]

snarky comments is part of the meta; part of the unofficial endgame content, along with the hidden named hunter delta-03 😛
I pinky swear it

[tired falcon]

no such ar build exists as far as I know; if you want 1mil dmg per shot without any setup work then you might as well use a rifle crit build

[loud pine]

you can get 1 mil crits with a he build

my red he hits 1 mil crit body 1.4m headshots with 10m coyote buff active

[tired falcon]

my test was using all red, hollow man, contractors, foxes, perfect glass canon, perfect vigilance, and a fenris.
I forgot about the Closer vest but likely wouldn't change much. I tested in shooting range on a named enemy, no modifiers, no global directive.
Also the St.Elmo was used, I have max expertise on it

[loud pine]

i used coyotes, 3pc providence, pgc and foxes with strained lexington expertise level 22

[solemn totem]

Anyone have a build that specifically deals with rogue agents. Thinking about hunting them in dark zones

[cerulean smelt]

think a bighorn with armor regen and catharsis build of some sort is/was popular for pvp

[lost wren]

isn't it the most popular now?

[lone wadi]

Yes but that’s not a rogue hunter build

just go put on umbra or something if you wanna police

[subtle bluff]

Yay bots! @pure marsh

[hexed steppe]

what bots 😎

[late dew]

Like have the chest be Ceska n everything else be striker?

[hazy steeple]

@late dew You don't get a benefit for having more than 4 pieces of a Gearset on at the same time.
What you want is Ceska Chest (with Obliterate as the Talent), strikersx4 (including backpack), and Coyotes as the Mask, or swap out the backpack for Memento and use Striker with the Mask slot.

The Coyotes version of that is pretty much the meta damage build in div2.

[late dew]

Okay thank you

[slate wedge]

this or another variation with 3 gila & 2 golan/3 gila & matador & 1 belstone is probably the most versatile pvp build atm

[late dew]

Wait can you not change talents on certain pieces of armor?

[solar sable]

If it's a Perfect Talent or Exotic, it cannot be extracted nor recalibrated.

[late dew]

Damn 😭

I’ve been playing for a little over 100 hrs n just now making my first build so

[distant atlas]

slow servers again

[lost wren]

looking to get back into some kind of pvp, how's this?

it's not bighorn headshot regen, but i do like striker's so

[subtle bluff]

There's a #td2-pvp-discussions they'll answer you faster than most of us would.

[lost wren]

ah ok

[thorny kernel]

Tested this in heroic, it melted enemies like a hot knife in butter

[subtle bluff]

Yup. People that need hazpro are missing out.

[thorny kernel]

Is there a way to get rid of the red screen tint from the bleed tho? It's getting slightly annoying lol

[subtle bluff]

You can run 2 Ceska to get some some hazpro it'll go away faster or reload quicker and it'll go away at 3 bleeds

[full dew]

What AR would you guys recommend to go with a striker set? And which would you consider the best exotic AR?

[thorny kernel]

St. Elmo's Engine and St. Elmo's Engine

If you don't want to go with an exotic though, I'd recommend a Police M4 with the talent Strained

A little twist i like to do is using technician instead of gunner, and use a Police M4 with Flatline and the linked laser pointer attachment

[novel ember]

how about the bleed effect

guys how can i use my smart cover like this ?? he used it while taking a cover !

[thorny kernel]

It's so minimal that it's almost not noticable.

Plus if you look at my skills, i have the fixer drone equipped incase i do have to counter it

Hell, i could put armor regen on one of my gear pieces to just nullify the bleed completely

[novel ember]

hmm nice move fixer drone

[thorny kernel]

If you just tap the skill button your character will just smack it into the wall youre sitting at with their bare hands lol

[novel ember]

but bro try to level up and dont care about builds now and just put elmos assult insted of backfire same result but more comfy

[novel ember]

the problem is ive tried this and nothing happened xD i will try again

[thorny kernel]

Nah i like Backfire

Like i said, the bleed doesn't bother me, only the red screen tint does lmfao

[patent fossil]

double-tap skill button for instant use

[thorny kernel]

Also 'try to level up'. I'd understand if you told me that if i didn't even have my SHD watch yet, but not when I'm almost SHD 500 lol

Okay its only a single tap for me. Might be because I'm on console?

[novel ember]

was confusing me when i tried it i will rebuild it maybe today

[novel ember]

thanks mate i will try this

[novel ember]

i think so memo

sorry momp

omg momo

im tired sorry xd

[novel ember]

yaya your goal is leveling up with easy build if you want help add me im rushing cps today on heroic

[thorny kernel]

Haha it's fine

[thorny kernel]

I think I'll be fine, but thanks for the offer

[subtle bluff]

I'll keep saying this:
Exotics / Named gear/weapons aren't always the best and always aren't needed.

[thorny kernel]

The best example here is Kingbreaker imo.

The fact that the TKB is just not a good base weapon makes the perfect Flatline it has absolutely not worth using over almost any other AR with normal Flatline

[raw ridge]

Guys I'm thinking of running a LMG focused build. Should I go for 4 piece Stryker or 4 piece negotiator ? I have a Centurion's Scabbard holster as well

As of now I have a Quiet Roar LMG, fully proficient

[subtle bluff]

Too many IE. Kingbreaker is it's RPM.

[thorny kernel]

IE?

[subtle bluff]

For example

[thorny kernel]

Ah

[thorny kernel]

I still don't entirely understand what you mean with this statement though haha

[subtle bluff]

There's too many examples.

[thorny kernel]

Ah

[subtle bluff]

Like the guy above with Quiet Roar

[thorny kernel]

Tbh, almost every single piece of named gear is a good example

Cloak being one of the best.

-50% threat on a brandset that's supposed to bump your threat?

[subtle bluff]

Eh just the piece by itself would "lower" your threat.

[autumn yacht]

if you’re gonna use everyday carrier needs to be hsd so carth/everyday carrier but if you want crit i’d use ceska/coyote or ceska memento (assuming you really want to use eb)

[lament reef]

maybe you and your buddy could main tank and offtank with it

[candid talon]

What's "DCH" ?

[onyx sage]

dodge city (gunslinger's) holster

[candid talon]

Ofc, thanks.

Does Achilles trigger "pulse"? Are enemies hit by achilles considered pulsed?

Or in a DCH Flatline Achilles build you're counting on your allies to pulse?

[onyx sage]

yes and yes

[onyx sage]

both, depends on the situation. an overcharged teammate can pulse for you and it would highlight 6 zones instead of max 3 at tier 6

[candid talon]

Best way to OC an entire team is still BTSU right?

[onyx sage]

yeah

[charred eagle]

Can I get the blueprint for the Empress Guard Knees from descent ? I know I can from dz and named item caches but I don’t do the dz lol

[hoary sail]

yes u can i have it just need some luck with ur caches 🤣

[pastel ledge]

I read online there's a new item that opens up passives on both weapons. Is that true?

[eager viper]

New exotic mask I believe.

Not out yet

[pastel ledge]

Ah gotcha

[hoary sail]

u lost so much dmg with this if it's what u r currently using

[young notch]

is it worth using a backfire on a hunters fury build? i feel like you have to spec alot into haz pro to make it worthwhile no?

[slate wedge]

i think cloak was actually bugged iirc

[thorny kernel]

Backfire needs zero hazpro, it's bleed damage is so minimal that you won't even notice it most of the time

[small igloo]

Deconstruct

[young notch]

isnt it like up 50% arm dmg, thats quite a bit no?

[thorny kernel]

Yes, but you can just counter that with something like the fixer drone, one or two armor regen attributes and idk how many other things.

Backfire doesn't need HazPro. Period.

[vestal ibex]

Are you really putting this here? Basically witch hunting or trying to bandwagon this guy.

[thorny kernel]

This is my Backfire build that's getting me through Heroic without issues. Not a single HazPro attribute.

[young notch]

ill play with it a bit switching off my vector, but i run 4r/2b memento setup

[hearty owl]

He posted in GC too 😭

[real quarry]

It's not mine its a guy on tiktok who made it and said it's good

https://vm.tiktok.com/ZNdaBUcEf/

That's his tiktok, apparently he's a streamer

[hearty owl]

ok so what’s the point lol

[real quarry]

Bc I can?

And I was making sure I was losing my mind after what he said

Is it a crime to ask and show, I thought the point of showing builds was to see if it was decent or not

[hearty owl]

?? you didn’t ask anything. You said “imma let yall cook” which very obviously means you wanted us to join you in shtting on him lol

some very weird attention seeking

[vestal ibex]

Rule 12 bro

[real quarry]

Imma let y'all cook can me food or bad

Because I had an opinion but I wanted more opinions about also for myself

[vestal ibex]

Cook aka roast this SHD 300 guy.

[real quarry]

Lol

Sorry that I showed a build, and it hurt your feelings?

Sensitive bunch

[hearty owl]

😭

[vestal ibex]

You named and shamed a guy.

A ignorant new player who put up a bad build.

[hearty owl]

Frick that guy smh how dare someone run a suboptimal build on challenging

[real quarry]

Damn bro , really big group of haters over a post acting like I hunt down div 2 players to call them trash. I only posted the texted because of the reason he said it was used for. Personally SHD level don't mean anything and honestly y'all really offended over a build picture and stating I'm the bad. Nah this ain't for builds for people who wanna be judged for building. Lmao

[vestal ibex]

No one is offended here. Just crazy you are posting this to discords for validation I guess. Just read rule 12 and that's why I called you out.

[real quarry]

I don't know what you are even on about I found it yesterday, if I really gave a shit I would posted it yesterday and said way more than let y'all cook

[vestal ibex]

You've read rule 12 right?

[real quarry]

Like y'all don't understand how stupid you sound some people commented about the build bc I've seen some people build with gearset but I wanted an outside opinion due to him saying he killed a hunter in 30 seconds on challenging. So posted it here to make I wasn't the only one looking at it like it's wrong or just weird

Like you all assumed so early didn't even just look at the build or the message he sent. Like lmao

[vestal ibex]

So you were seeking validation.

[hoary sail]

Well 300 shd for me he is beginner in the game. So i assume he has not that much knonwledge of the game nd how it's works to make a good build

[hearty owl]

His build is fine for challenging tho?

[real quarry]

Idk never heard of a build like that killing something fast like a hunter

[vestal ibex]

30 seconds isn't fast..

[hoary sail]

Oneshoot is more faster 🤣

[real quarry]

So excuse me for being confused and honestly wanted clarification due seeing others that are like it but are built around to sets with the backpack

In div 2 type of game it is

[hearty owl]

holy victim goddamn

[loud pine]

its okay bullying shd 300s is my favourite pastime too

[autumn yacht]

this channel acting like they don’t make fun of builds is funny ngl

[hoary sail]

Full set builds are not that good if it's what u try to ask

[vestal ibex]

Yeah dude even in the private discords it's frowned upon to bully sub 1k.

[real quarry]

I mean like 3 piece striker w 2 piece hunter and ninja backpack

I've seen a couple but they aren't strong so I don't use them

[vestal ibex]

Oh we do, a ton. But giving names and links to social accounts is against the rules. Good thing the mods are sleeping.

[real quarry]

Wouldn't know I can't read rules

[hearty owl]

Can tell

[urban latch]

No one is saying it's a good build. Everyone, including yourself, are aware it's not.

Your just dunking on a new player, and that's just a lame thing to do

[real quarry]

And what name did I give out?

[vestal ibex]

You are joking right?

[hearty owl]

The name you can’t read apparently

[hoary sail]

link to social nd on screen u post here

[hearty owl]

Deadazz illiterate bruh 😭

[real quarry]

If you mean Justin fish? My personally owned name from birth?

[loud pine]

you dropped his tiktok name you
illiterate muppet

[vestal ibex]

The link to their tik Tok? The name on all your screen shots??

[real quarry]

Oh no I committed a crime against myself I hope he doesn't sue me for slander

[loud pine]

average division 2 player that cant read

[vestal ibex]

Rivens might actually be welcome right now...

[hearty owl]

You must have been in a lot of relationships

[real quarry]

His streamer name and the screenshot had my name and his and the pictures were saved which his his streamer name

I'm confused what crime I've committed to y'all sit on sticks

[hearty owl]

I’m just bored tbh mb

[real quarry]

Figured sounded like it, but it's okay I'll delete it because it's promoting. Lol

[loud pine]

you need to speedrun art museum

[hearty owl]

So true

[onyx sage]

or zoo

[hearty owl]

@onyx sage is doing that

[onyx sage]

no bro f art museum

[hearty owl]

Omg hi dien im such a big fan

[loud pine]

i audibly sigh when in forced to do manning

[vestal ibex]

enny% in the house.

[hearty owl]

OMG

That’s so much aura.. enny%

[hearty owl]

whats PB

[onyx sage]

i forgor

[hearty owl]

remembr

[onyx sage]

let me be washed ty

i come back when climax 👍

[hearty owl]

we need to get you back in inc bootcamp

nah nah get back here

you can climax later

[fair dragon]

💀

[charred eagle]

I’m not familiar with the descent caches, are they easily obtainable or would it be a hassle? Cause if so ima just try my luck with named caches

[autumn yacht]

try your luck with named, you’re gonna spend 40 mins on a run for a chance to get the descent cache just to roll a 1/100+ chance for the bp

[hoary sail]

u can drop it if u kill the nemesis with 50% chance or buy it in descent vendor with the NSA money. The name it's reconstitued caches for named blueprints

[autumn yacht]

maybe i’m mistaken, i was thinking of reconstructed caches

[vestal ibex]

It is reconstructed caches.

Current list of blueprints in that pool #td2-descent message

[young notch]

in solo play do you think itd be better to run intimidate or obliterate even if i lose 15% dmg in favour of reliability?

[stark flicker]

def run ob

I'm curious why so many people run striker's over ongoing striker's is really inconsistent bc it needs a lot of stacks to really get going and you have to redo the setup every encounter but with the chestpiece ongoing gives a flat x1.5 damage multi while only requiring you kill an enemy within a magazine

you don't need the backpack for it to function so you can run wtv as a backpack slot and have complete freedom over what exotic if any you use

if you run the flamethrower spec you don't even need to run any status effect giving talents just let them break your armor then melt them

[vestal ibex]

Cause if you run strikers in a 100 stack version it'll do more damage than OD and most people move quickly enough thru content for stacks to be enough.

[stark flicker]

honestly I think the biggest thing that puts me off striker's is the fact you basically have to run the backpack

[vestal ibex]

You dont have to. You could PGC and ceska vigi.

[stark flicker]

I dislike the squishiness striker's gives og allows you to run some bulk

[vestal ibex]

Well you should just make a list of your opinions and preferences before all this tho.

Cause there really isn't much to say if someone doesn't like something. They just don't so yeah.

[stark flicker]

honestly while I've seen the results of striker's og feels a lot more like a midway point between the bulk of hf and the offense of striker

[vestal ibex]

It is more of a mid way point. idk maybe I'm missing context here or something.

[onyx sage]

it's quite a bit bigger than that. intimidate is actually 42% at max stacks so it's 20 vs 42

[stark flicker]

also for the hollow-point and sadist bonuses is it basex1.5x1.3 or is it basex1.8

[onyx sage]

they're separate so 1.5 × 1.3

[stark flicker]

wow

oh also running a classic m60 with sadist as talent which backpack is better overall memento, liquid engineer, or a petrov backpack with bloodsucker

I'll get a paste for the build rq

[young notch]

isnt like 36%? 3x9?

[onyx sage]

no, each stack is multiplicative with each other, so it's 1.04^9

[stark flicker]

3x9 is 27

[vestal ibex]

It multiplies with it self.

[young notch]

i meant 4 but yea

[onyx sage]

exponential is another way you could put it

[stark flicker]

does the new formula give it more or less damage than old intim?

[onyx sage]

more

og intimidate is just 1.35

[stark flicker]

damn

[stark flicker]

this is the build https://mxswat.github.io/mx-division-builds/#/GwdgtMYIwEzfURwAxletmPoFzawfkVjjJCgmCMTSeBVIU7cqXA850W2By12hwBWAMzwY4eqiEVu-GngELW8wauRA

what I figure is running a gold bp gives me more chd but running memento gives me more damage overall and passive armor regen for when I can't take a kill

[pale solar]

Does the capacitor give more skill damage than the test subject might be a dumb question sorry if it is

[onyx sage]

it does but requires stacking

[pale solar]

Ah thanks!

[hoary sail]

yes full stack it's 60%

[junior zealot]

Hello, can someone please help me with that blueprint, how can I get it, I have done so many control points but just keep getting different things. someone who can explain things to me well.

[onyx sage]

keep doing them, you'll get this one eventually

you need to do 200+ for all of them

[junior zealot]

Does it matter which one you do or do you really have to choose and do certain ones?

[onyx sage]

it doesn't, as long as it's level 3 or 4

everyone has to do it, just grind and get them done

[junior zealot]

What do you mean 200+, you mean all need to be done more than 200x?

[onyx sage]

there are more than 200+ blueprints to unlock via control points

which means you need to clear control points 200 or more times

[junior zealot]

Yes, I did that, I'm almost level 800 and I still only got 3 pieces brother.

[onyx sage]

which control point doesn't matter, you can clear the same one 200 times

[solar sable]

1 CP3-4 = 1 blueprint

[onyx sage]

you sure you're on level 3+?

[vestal ibex]

You can check how many CPs you've completed via the leaderboards too.

[hearty owl]

CP LEADERBOARD

[junior zealot]

there are more than 200+ blueprints to unlock via control points
which means you need to clear control points 200 or more times

[solar sable]

uh huh

[junior zealot]

oke, thankyou mate

[junior zealot]

do you understand what I mean exactly?

[onyx sage]

we all understand

[solar sable]

yup, it's that I just woke up

[junior zealot]

But on the leaderboard I can't really see how much I've done, only see the score xD

[onyx sage]

there's a "Jump to me" button

[junior zealot]

Yes, I do that, but I only see a score of 208, but I don't see how many times I have done it. xD

[vestal ibex]

208

[onyx sage]

yeah that's how many times

I'm pretty sure you didn't do them on challenging or heroic if you don't have all of them then

[junior zealot]

Lol sorry guys, it good than, thankyou all xD

[junior zealot]

Yes, I just set the map to challenging and then it automatically becomes heroic when it goes to lvl 4.

[raw ridge]

Guys I just got the bluescreen. Should I use it with 4 piece striker, 4 piece negotiator, or 4 piece ongoing directive ?

I got a ninja bike messenger knee pads as well

[vestal ibex]

Yes.

[onyx sage]

try clearing one, and then look at the rewards when you finish the defense phase, if you still see a blueprint reward then you need to do more.

you're done when you stop seeing blueprint reward

[vestal ibex]

Pretty sure that "randome blueprint" shows up as a reward when looking at any control point tho.

For non captured ones ya know.

[onyx sage]

yeah i never thought of looking at the hover screen

[junior zealot]

Yes, it drops really random things, but I will do (a) checkpoint once and then reset it and then do it again and then try a few times to see what it will give.

But I have done exactly this before, unfortunately I get other types of blueprints.

[onyx sage]

yes... that means you need to do more

you cannot choose which blueprint, but you will never get duplicates. just keep doing them

[junior zealot]

Thanyou mate

[raw ridge]

Anyone ?

[vestal ibex]

Any will do.

[raw ridge]

Alright thanks mate

[solar sable]

all those builds work great, you choose

[raw ridge]

Yeah cuz I saw a yt video that the hollow point round you get from ongoing directive is great for CC

[solar sable]

eh, I don't recommend using YT as your source of info for division builds

[vestal ibex]

I'd just try them all tbh, you have 16 loadouts so put em to work.

[stark flicker]

the hollow-points are a good bit of damage bonus esp paired with a sadist weapon there's a lot better cc methods though because bleed doesn't give many penalties to enemies

[buoyant magnet]

how good is the eagle bearer in pvp?

[tulip charm]

probably better to ask in #td2-pvp-discussions

Utility wise is good. Damage wise, theres better options imo.

[buoyant magnet]

Didn’t know this existed. Thank you!

[candid talon]

I dunno who said Kingbreaker was nerfed but that person must have been high. Still hittinh 1.5M per shot regular with Obliterate Strikers

Down from 900~1M with any other rifle

[onyx sage]

it's more about rpm

you should care about dps more than the bullet damage number

[vestal ibex]

Yeah people look at numbers but forget that some weapons might shoot like 40% faster.

[candid talon]

And often you look at DPS and forget some enemies need to be bursted down

Sometimes you don't have a whole minute to put up high numbers

[vestal ibex]

People trying to stack BF and are doing so much damage per bullet they can't even maintain 100 striker stacks cause they kill too fast....

[candid talon]

But that has always been true to everything except very specific content

[tulip charm]

isnt that what dps is?

[candid talon]

No

[vestal ibex]

I need an explaination on that now.

[candid talon]

DPS is literally just damage per second over the course of X seconds. It's a way to read damage but no method is flawless. Let's say you check two weapons, and you see how much damage you do in 1 minute. I use a sniper. I take 12 shots, each do 30M, totals 360M, maybe less, add 1 or 2 reloads in there. Now you're using a rifle. You do 1M damage per shot, but you can put 850 shots in there, this is quite literal since "RPM = rounds per minute", minus reloads, etc. but let's say you do 700M damage. Awesome, you do close to twice my DPS in the span OF A MINUTE.

Except enemy has 50M hp.

I killed him in two shots. Took me two seconds. You need 50 shots.

What you can sometimes measure it in, which accounts for HP, bonuses etc. is TTK which is Time to Kill

And generally, lowest time to kill an enemy is the most efficient. But what if there's a bunch of enemies?

Then you have to add all the variables, how sustained is your DPS? Do you have AoE effects? Etc. etc. etc.

[tulip charm]

I see.

[candid talon]

So all I'm saying is that SOMETIMES, this is not absolute, this is not "this damage is better than that damage, but sometimes, burst damage, is better

[tulip charm]

I'll let the guys with a phd in div handle this.

[candid talon]

xD

This is rather rudimental math, it's not, it doesn't need rocket science

You asked a simply question, isn't that DPS? Well, vaguely, but not really

[urban latch]

Ok. But simply looking at the per bullet damage, like saying "wow the King breaker is good because it hits 1.5m crits" is going to mislead yourself. Simply the per bullet damage is meaningless without the context of the rate of damage your averaging.

[candid talon]

I mean, fair enough, but IMHO, builds right now are hot depending on the event

[onyx sage]

a lot of what you said above isn't relevant to the topic at hand

[candid talon]

The modifiers are literally shitfiting meta

[urban latch]

The "M" in rpm doesn't really have anything to do with an actual minute if damage, it's simply a unit of measurement for how fast the bullets come out

[candid talon]

Yeah it does, 850 RPM equals 850 rounds in a minute of sustained fire (minus, reloads)

[urban latch]

Your really trying to shift the goalposts from the original point that was being made to you lol

[candid talon]

It gives you a general idea

Okay, so let me put it like this. The difference in RPM doesn't account for the difference in 40% in damage per bullet.

When you have about... 23...% less RPM

From the meta ARs ofc

[urban latch]

Pick an example

[candid talon]

Of course when you add the sustain damage of Elmo and it's huge magazine pool, it's a different conversation, but that leads to my point. Sustain =/= Burst

[vestal ibex]

This is the first time I've seen you mention burst vs sustain tho.

[candid talon]

Literally one of the first things I said, though.

[urban latch]

Burst vs sustain is a completely different conversation than judging a build/gun off per bullet damage vs DPS

[onyx sage]

TKB base is 63508, M4 base is 46917, TKB is around 35% more

TKB RPM is 600, M4 RPM is 850, M4 is about 41% more

[vestal ibex]

Maybe I can't read?

[candid talon]

See, that's where you're misjudging a bunch of factors

More bonuses apply to flat damage than to RPM

[vestal ibex]

Can someone with a red circle help me out?

[hearty forge]

Getting back into the game. I'm a yellow main, is the remodeled gear set worth anything?

[urban latch]

Your literally just moving the goalposts...

[onyx sage]

but getting more rpm gets you stacks faster

[candid talon]

That's absolutely not what I'm doing :\

[urban latch]

By yellow do you mean skill builds or high end builds?

[onyx sage]

these are quite literally relevant to the topic at hand

[hearty forge]

Skill

[candid talon]

I build stacks with Rock n Roll though xD

[vestal ibex]

Sustain/burst/mag damage/alpha damage are all different metrics that paint different pictures.

[candid talon]

I also said that...

[urban latch]

Check the pinned spreadsheet, bunch of guides in there. Not sure how long it's been since you played, but skill builds haven't changed a ton in awhile. Refractor is the newest set which is an alright support build

[vestal ibex]

You've said a lot of random stuff that wasn't put well together tbf

[candid talon]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[vestal ibex]

Reading all of this is like watching someone try to figure out what they are saying.

[urban latch]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motte-and-bailey_fallacy

[loud pine]

lol

[hearty forge]

Currently running 3 empress, 2 Hana, and 1 wyvern wear

[urban latch]

thats still a solid enough skill build

[lament reef]

that’s pretty much what the pins say lmao

maybe throw a waveform in there

[candid talon]

Not what this is at all, I mean, if you're gonna try and appeal to fallacies I could point out the dunning-kruger in saying the M in RPM doesn't mean minute, I could point out the moving the goalpost when my main goal was stating that "DPS" was a flawed metric

[hearty forge]

Kind of sad we haven't gotten a strong gear set yet

[hearty owl]

????

[candid talon]

That's because it's strong enough

[hearty owl]

Are you aware of Striker sir

[candid talon]

He probably means skill wise.

[hearty owl]

Rigger is OP

[loud pine]

yellow striker 🔥🔥🔥

hard grand washington hotel wont know what hit it

[vestal ibex]

Yellow strikers with smart cover gonna take over the world.

[hearty owl]

NO TROLL REACTS IM BEING HONEST

[onyx sage]

you also realize you can't use rock and roll in every situation right?

if we're playing the generalizing game

[candid talon]

I mean, if you're going there, you can carry many different builds and weapons and adjust per enemy

In fact, the top players in this game that can solo every piece of content do exactly that

[loud pine]

🤓👆🏻

[vestal ibex]

Bro is gonna hot swap a full build in combat.

[onyx sage]

...which is quite countering your cherry-picked example of how kingbreaker is better in one aspect

[urban latch]

Reread what I said, because your really not understanding the point I'm making and it's key to understanding what your misunderstanding

[violet juniper]

is this another debate about Kingbreaker?

[vestal ibex]

I wonder who here might have experience soloing some of the hardest content.

[candid talon]

But that was my point. Kingbreaker is better in one aspect. lol

[onyx sage]

wouldn't be me, surely

[vestal ibex]

enny% the world!

[violet juniper]

Kingbreaker is ass dude

[onyx sage]

which, our whole point was that this point doesn't matter as much as you think it does

[urban latch]

Which aspect

[candid talon]

Burst damage.

[vestal ibex]

Epeen numbers.

[vestal ibex]

wat

[urban latch]

Compared to what

[candid talon]

Other AR's, what could I possibly be comparing it to ?

[urban latch]

It literally has the lowest burst damage of all ARs

[candid talon]

Okay, this is going circular now

[urban latch]

No, it's really not lol

[violet juniper]

It's the slowest AR, it has the worst burst damage

[candid talon]

Sure, you're right.

[violet juniper]

How can a slow RPM weapon do more burst (low time, high damage) damage than a high RPM weapon?

it doesn't, is the answer.

[candid talon]

Not requiring an entire clip to kill

[onyx sage]

it can if the base is high enough, but even with 35% higher base, it doesn't

[urban latch]

Ok, how are you defining "burst damage"? Is it the same way literally everyone else defines it or a new way?

[vestal ibex]

If it DID happen to have numbers to support that it could. It just doesn't.

[vestal ibex]

"Lets just move this post again."

[violet juniper]

that's not burst.

[onyx sage]

mag damage is it

[tulip charm]

Last season had the aks high up in burst.

Was fun until everything else was buffed

[violet juniper]

funny that some of the top burst weapons are single shot weapons lmao

[vestal ibex]

Are we on Motte or bailey right now?

[tulip charm]

Yes

[candid talon]

If I have to explain how less shots can mean more pew pew again I'm gonna have a freaking aneurism at this point so you win. DPS and Sustain damage graph apparently explain burst damage. It's like having a conversation in a different language.

[vestal ibex]

When talking about one shots that's a different thing entirely.

[vestal ibex]

I'm not even sure you know your point anymore.

[violet juniper]

I must admit, my definition of it is "how much can it inflict in a short amount of time". Not really sure what the official definition is

[urban latch]

How are you defining "burst damage"? Is it the same way literally everyone else defines it or a new way?

[violet juniper]

you'd have a point if you had used any other example than Kingbreaker.

[candid talon]

That's EXACTLY what it is. What it ISN'T is DPS or "SUSTAIN DAMAGE" as the graph Souless showed. And EVEN AT THAT GRAPH, look at "modded sustained DPS", see where Kingbreaker falls.

[urban latch]

That's not a graph....

[candid talon]

Any visual representation of data is a graph

[urban latch]

Omfg

[violet juniper]

that's a spreadsheet, it's talking about sustain damage with seasonal modifiers, and it's still at the bottom of the list btw

[candid talon]

It has ONE weapon above it. ONE. St. Elmo's, because of the ridiculously high mags. That's it.

It's at the bottom of the list because the list is ordered by DPS...

[violet juniper]

There's your answer

[candid talon]

...

[vestal ibex]

That's not an order list anyway.

[candid talon]

Dude, seriously, I'm done. I just want to say, Raucey, you were right, I was thinking data viz, not graph.

[violet juniper]

Kingbreaker was nerfed. Unfortunately high damage doesn't mean much when it's firing at a mighty 600 rpm. For striker, that's useless because it's not fast enough to build stacks. For Nego, there's far better options. For Heartbreaker (it's best synergy), it's too slow to build stacks, can't support techie laser as far as I remember, and way too inaccurate to reliably deal damage over time.

[marsh dome]

What’s the best guns right now?

[violet juniper]

Had to scroll pretty far up lmao

[urban latch]

If you want to judge things by sustain DPS, fine. That's not remotely what started this whole thing though. The point is that you don't want to simply look at a per bullet damage and take anything away from that without other context.

[violet juniper]

Backfire is pretty much the king rn

[candid talon]

Homie, I said that, right at the start.

[marsh dome]

Alr, is the Strego or St Elmo still good or no

[violet juniper]

St Elmo's is still great, Strega is good but less mag

Lexington beats St Elmo's, in my opinion

[solar sable]

just no hazpro

[candid talon]

There is not one true way to look at damage and claim something is better than everything else, because, the game is way too complex for that.

[marsh dome]

Alr, should I still be running strikers for them both ?

[violet juniper]

honestly, either hazpro or Regen/AoK

[violet juniper]

run whatever you like

[honest junco]

anyone wanna hop in a vc n chill

[solar sable]

no VCs here

[honest junco]

private then

[hearty owl]

So true we need to account for survivability because how do you stay alive on all red cores with glass cannon like how can I OUTPUT THE DPS WITHOUT BEING ALIVE. 🤬

😈 imma start a yt channel now

[onyx sage]

Solo Legendary Full Red Glass Cannon No Reviver Hive?? Sure! What a joke!!

[hearty owl]

We need more modifiers 😡

[candid talon]

That too is a point. Let's say you can do 10M damage in 10 seconds, but you will stay alive for 20s. Meanwhile, I take 1 minute to do 10M damage, but I'm virtually unkillable. All those variables should be accounted for. DPS is usually THE go to measure because dead enemies don't fight back.

Also, faster runs.

Hence why sets like Umbra aren't picked as much. Free health sustain? No thanks, DPS or bust.

[marsh dome]

Can I get a build for the St Elmo’s Engine?

[candid talon]

Literally anything. Go strikers.

[marsh dome]

Full red or?

[hearty owl]

NO

[candid talon]

It's probably the most versatile rifle in the whole game. Okay damage per round. Great RPM. Insane mags. Built-In CC.

[hoary valve]

i have the bighorn and i want to do some pvp (conflict)

[sleek crypt]

So, hoping to get some recs on what I should run for a full Blue, or at least mostly blue build. More or so, what can give me even more armor on top of the 1.8 mil I already have.

[subtle bluff]

Do more in a sec

[subtle bluff]

We don't "recs" going full blue.

[sleek crypt]

I'm more or so meaning all of my gear's core attributes are just + however much armor. I'm not full, full blue, I have the gear mods and the sub-attributes as red/yellow. I'm just mainly like "What gear could I get that would be the most effective while still giving me a bunch of armor"

[subtle bluff]

pinned messages there's a gdoc with a bunch of builds in it

[sleek crypt]

Okay, great, thanks

[violet juniper]

Umbra has this weird thing of having very impressive numbers but does almost zero damage

it might just be me, but it just never does what I want it to do

[violet juniper]

Blue Striker ngl

best balance between armour and damage output. I personally run a 2 blue core build with HF and Memento, still craps out damage but has ridiculous survivability

[candid talon]

Umbra increases your RPM and it gives you unlimited armor back

[hoary valve]

Do you guys know the perfect build for protect protection from elite enemies in the game?

[candid talon]

No such thing as perfect anything. I use two for that. Still trying to decide which is best...

[hoary valve]

i was about to edit it to leave the perfect out

[candid talon]

Attributes are intuitive.

[hoary valve]

do i have to run the shoty

[candid talon]

Which? Lullaby/Sweet Dreams is to one shot annoying purple. In the other build the Scorpio is ... well, self-explanatory

You're rarely forced to use anything, hardly ever a single piece will make or break a build.

Keyword: Rarely

[subtle bluff]

PFE builds aren't set in stone it's probably one of the... Idk confused builds. I call them support tanks but tank should be the word just something it kind of does.

[candid talon]

^

TBF, you probably could, get away with a Foundry Bulwark PFE build

It's huh... versatile, you can change pieces here and there. Mileage may vary. Try and see what you like the most or what works for you.

[subtle bluff]

If you have ask if you have to run the shottie you won't get the gameplay for this build.

[candid talon]

Yeah, probably don't run the top build, it involves counter-intuitive mechanics like running into enemies and getting shot xD
Might be better in team. I'd say go for the bottom one, it's pretty nice even as solo.

[subtle bluff]

Yeah but then they just stand there and does nothing imo

[candid talon]

Yeah, fair... I mean, I would say it's more of a team oriented build

[subtle bluff]

Even then. Then I call it a selfish tank just staying upright it's only thing.

It can't do any dmg to keep any of the agro

[candid talon]

I mean, you can sponge just about anything like crazy, giving team wide unbreakable, with setup you're boosting damage, there's some merits there. I'd say it's a good build to run if you're an unexperienced tank.

You won't be as effective or useful as you COULD be, but you'll be relatively safe doing it. It's sub-optimal but it's, like everything, a trade off.

[subtle bluff]

My view on this is for leggo 4 man

Which 99% when I see them there in my way of shooting things.

[violet juniper]

i know what the gear set does. I'm saying it feels incredibly underwhelming given how much of a crit increase you get

[subtle bluff]

So I normally leave them with the heavy they do tank and kill everything else and come back. But I would have killed the heavy with in 3 to 4 seconds anywhere if he wasn't in the way.

[violet juniper]

Tank builds in general are a complete waste of time.

[subtle bluff]

Support PFE build can be useful but the playstyle for them isn't easy to learn.

[candid talon]

Trade-off. I mean, you're giving away damage to... be a self-medic

I run it sometimes in huh... heroic full directives summit runs

It's amazing sustain by giving away damage, makes you super bursty, it just requires you to be very disciplined

But then again, I run just about everything when I'm bored

[urban latch]

What a sentence

[hoary valve]

idk what you guys going on about what gear mods are you running

[grizzled garnet]

so i got a ND bluescreen build together but im ngl idek how to properly use it. do i procc bluescreen myself (drop a skill) or wait for enemies to die? do i paint every target i can and procc bluescreen on them or focus on one at a time?

[hearty owl]

Me trying to figure out the synergy between ND and Bluescreen

[grizzled garnet]

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1uC1ZYSegDfj5s9hrkZJUo7Z4FeMTjgKgZ1L6MqVj_Kg/edit?tab=t.0#heading=h.5ewxrd8m6swu

[candid talon]

I'll break it down.
Umbra makes you empty your clip fast, sure you aren't hitting as hard as many other red builds, but you do it "fast" and go back into cover.
And, it requires discipline because you have to play safe, and constantly trigger into shadows from the shadows to constantly be full.
The only major downside is enemies that heal too much. If you're bad, you will run out of ammo often.

Umbra with Chatterbox is straight hilarious

I'm almost sure the game doesn't register some of the shots 😂

[hearty owl]

The whole point in ND is that you damage multiple things at once, the idea is to kill them. If you are wasting your time using skills to proc 2s status effects while using a crap LMG then you are better off on Striker*

[candid talon]

Again, intuitive, the cores are just.. you know, look at the color xD
Reds are CHC and CHD, blues are PFE

[hearty owl]

To answer your question you want to tag multiple things then drop your skill

[candid talon]

Well, a lot of what you said is just wrong. You're not wasting time procing skills, you do it passively. You just crit an enemy to trigger ND and move on to the next, suddenly you're killing entire spawns in seconds and safe. Also, crap LMG? RPM is good, accuracy is great, damage is pretty decent, you don't have to reload while clearing full spawns, you're constantly applying CC, I dunno what you see that is bad with it.

[hearty owl]

My bad I’m new to the game and definitely haven’t used it myself

[fair dragon]

So true

[hearty owl]

I’ve probably clocked more hours on ND than you have on the game

[candid talon]

Possibly. I only have like 1100 hours.

[candid talon]

You can use Nightwatcher to proc pulse a lot and constantly dizzy the enemies

Or you can do it like me and use it as panic button xD

[hearty owl]

“Constantly dizzy” you realize enemies get an immunity to status effects for each consecutive application?

Your second disorient is almost half of the 2s the first one was

[candid talon]

Constantly over the course of the mission, not constantly the same guy

You're supposed to actually kill them

[hearty owl]

Oh right and with nightwatcher and a “REALLY SUBOPTIMAL” LMG you are doing that how

[candid talon]

Do you want me to stream it or something..?

[hearty owl]

On solo?

Yes please stream on Twitch

I will def watch

I care a lot about this

[candid talon]

I will def not create a twitch account. I'll stream it in Discord

[hearty owl]

I’m at work so really cba

[candid talon]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[violet juniper]

Bluescreen is not a bad LMG I'm sorry

[fair dragon]

Its not a good LMG either

[candid talon]

Telling you it works, you can either go red nego catalyst catharsis bluescreen, or nightwatcher HB bluescreen

[hearty owl]

I corrected myself to call it suboptimal later don’t worry guys

[grizzled garnet]

woah woah woah... i only just got bluescreen and now you want me to get catty?

[violet juniper]

Catalyst?

[grizzled garnet]

;-;

[violet juniper]

no. definitely no.

[candid talon]

Meant Catharsis, not Catalyst

[hearty owl]

THE SYNERGY THOUGH THINK OF IT

[grizzled garnet]

why catharsis?

[hearty owl]

Why not Catalyst????

[candid talon]

This is my brain still traumatized by how disgusting it was to farm that mask

[hearty owl]

Cmon it procs off disorient surely this synergy is insane with the god blue scween

Catharsis is omega useless on this build you def meant Catalyst…

I’m gonna run that in my IH tonight

Wish my LFG luck

[candid talon]

You need luck to clear IH..?

[hearty owl]

Yes I am new

[onyx sage]

he's carrying me with that build

[hearty owl]

And I need more luck for DH cause boss dmg check and I’m on bluescreen ND

[onyx sage]

just use it on boomer ez

[hearty owl]

And Bluescreen is SOOOOO good

[candid talon]

Yeah, because judging a fish for its ability to climb trees is how you judge a build on this game

[gentle lichen]

@magic pilot not sure if you looked into this yet but would this be the best iteration of a crit build with new set? no coyote cause i don't like variable damage and mask is normal D&H

[hearty owl]

I’m sorry Starke I think the content we play is just completely different, that’s all

Maybe if I played more open world or matchmaked missions I would understand the appeal to yout build crafting

[candid talon]

Yeah, you're judging a nego bluescreen build for its ability to perform on a IH role, that's ... you know, I got nothing positive to say about it

[subtle bluff]

ND hit more targets. Bluescreen more targets and keep up the stacks. Pretty simple. Idk I've carry some trash teams in leggo with it. The build is only good in a team from my experience so far with it.

[hearty owl]

We will discuss this later Mr Chow along with your shotgun choices

[candid talon]

I guess if we're going by raids, bullet king is meta, why aren't you running it with Strikers? It's so absolute top

[hearty owl]

Who tf said BK was meta

[violet juniper]

It synergises with bluescreen. As in, every target hit counts towards disruptor

[subtle bluff]

Why some players still run bluescreen on incursion just confuses me.

[candid talon]

I mean, you use it in one niche fight, but it's great there so it must be top LMG, right?!

[hearty owl]

WHICH FIGHT

[candid talon]

Dogs

[hearty owl]

OH NOOO

[subtle bluff]

Wait what? My BLB says otherwise.

[hearty owl]

It’s 2025 brother we don’t need the BK anymore put it away 😭

[candid talon]

The logic stands by what you said

[hearty owl]

BK is not meta on dogs I am so sorry

[subtle bluff]

They both work. It hasn't changed my gameplay due to power creep anyways.

[candid talon]

Sorry if I haven't run raids in over a year, I got the exotics a long long time ago

[hearty owl]

I don’t know what delusional you live in to think that

Ok that answers it

[candid talon]

Not surprised new strats appeared

[subtle bluff]

I just did 4 BK striker incursion challenge. That was rough. The old BK did that much easier.

[candid talon]

Why would I run content that I ran extensively until myself and all my clan got the damn weapons, that I was tired of after running it on about every role, with about any strat

[hearty owl]

So you replay story missions isntead

[candid talon]

You're the one obsessed with results with "top tier content me and my friends run"

[violet juniper]

wtf

[candid talon]

No, for instance, I quit for like a year, I missed like 6 exotics, I spent some time farming them, had to run incursions on 4 chars, was doing summit, was doing PVP, you know

Not LET ME GO SWEAT AT RAID SO I CAN DO WEEKLY RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAWR

Got any piece I could possibly want in this game, I actually have fun playing at this point, and when I don't, I'll probably quit for a nice long period again

[subtle bluff]

DH raid is easy tho...

[candid talon]

So is doing a handstand, do you know how often I do them?

[hearty owl]

He thinks raids are hard it’s ok let him be. He’s used to the 1h DH runs

[grizzled garnet]

i quit for a while and missed the lexington ;-;

[candid talon]

Same boat.

[hearty owl]

I feel like you’re kinda losing it Starke you were way more composed earier..

[candid talon]

Losing what, son? Do you think there's a prize? 😂

[violet juniper]

I mean, I find it a bit difficult on some bosses. team knowledge goes a long way

[hearty owl]

Oh

[candid talon]

God forbid this guy sees you playing a hardwire skill reset build, he's gonna have an aneurism

[hearty owl]

Oh he called me son ermm

Losing your mind is what I meant Uncle Starke

[fair dragon]

Ironically a HW reset build is more niche than BK on dogs

[hearty owl]

^^^^^^

[candid talon]

I know. That's why I said it.

[hearty owl]

Like I think the 2 raids alone have enough builds between them to touch every aspect of the game 😭 dps, skills, tank, etc.

[candid talon]

Won't stop me or many other people to use them for fun, specially in events like Hollywood. Was pretty useful there. Cleared it in like 5 minutes 😂

Also, it was actually meta for a while before WONY.

[hearty owl]

Oh remind me when GE’s were active in raids I forgor

[candid talon]

Remind me when did anyone ever mention raids besides you.

[hearty owl]

Sooo what are we talking about

[candid talon]

I don't think you realize you've been pretty much swinging at windmills for the past ... I dunno, wasn't counting

[fair dragon]

Oh you meant random main mission?

[hearty owl]

Like what did you clear in 5 mins you kinda just brought that up out of nowhere

[candid talon]

The event...

[hearty owl]

We just last discussed raids so any normal human would assume that’s what you were talking about

[candid talon]

No, you moved the topic to "raids", I addressed it briefly.

[hearty owl]

You cleared the event in 5 mins gotcha that makes sense

(guys what is he talking about?)

[grizzled garnet]

i'll come back another day 👍

[candid talon]

What am I talking about? We were discussing a build, you arrived and went "BUT IT'S SUBOPTIMAL FOR RAIDS"

So is anything in the game besides 5 builds.

[lament reef]

is this same builds creature ragebaiting 7 hours later

[hearty owl]

LMFAO

[candid talon]

Must be fun constantly playing the same content with the same optimal builds ever

[hearty owl]

I don’t think it’s rage bait atp

[grizzled garnet]

who are you referring to?

[hearty owl]

🥀

[candid talon]

It's kay guys, maybe one day i'll be super 1337 when I put together the #1 meta build and I memorize a mission and do it over and over and over and over without making mistakes so my friends won't laugh at me T_T

[hearty owl]

gulp

[violet juniper]

It's just a game dude

[candid talon]

Exactly

[odd ginkgo]

I ignored them sometime back. They tend to be rude and argumentative with every conversation they have here.

[hearty owl]

Good call

[violet juniper]

You're the only one making a big deal out of it lol

[candid talon]

No, I am not. I was being facetious because someone was throwing a tantrum because some weapon isn't "raid meta". Probably the same type of person who rages on the mic when people don't play perfectly and rage quits on the regular. I was just, well, admittedly, being a big of a troll.

[hoary valve]

sorry don’t understand trying to do stuff rn

[thorny kernel]

CHC is Critical Hit Chance. CHD is Critical Hit Damage. PFE is Protection From Elites (which reduces the damage you take from enemies with yellow HP bars)

[vernal bison]

would this build be better with st elmos or can back fire work just as good?

[candid talon]

You're 'gonna be constantly getting hit with the bleed effect but it shouldn't be the end of the world. I'd take Saint's (mostly because you don't even have the 50 hazpro from clock at SHD 130)

[versed summit]

You don’t get 50 hazpro from the watch

[candid talon]

50 points = 10%

Sorry I wasn't explicit

[versed summit]

Lol

[candid talon]

It would be completely broken if it was 50% 😂

[hexed steppe]

let me know when you get there, ill help you put together a super dope mortar setup
-# Mortar Supremacy

[cerulean smelt]

@candid talon take up Localdecks offer (> <)

[hexed steppe]

you too

everyone needs boom booms in their life

[cerulean smelt]

oh trust me i have a good boom boom for my playstyle (> <)

slightly different from your build, but for me it works perfectly (> <)

[hexed steppe]

👀

[cerulean smelt]

i know, know how many times i've sent Seeker, place mortar. kill with mortar and hey skilled proc!!!! throw seekers again

[hexed steppe]

who taught you this blasphemy

[cerulean smelt]

it's almost infinite seekers too XD

[hexed steppe]

youll need all them seekers with the damage youll be missing 😎

but fair enough

😂

[cerulean smelt]

it's humorous. mortar something. they die to the bleed, skilled procs XD

fun watching npcs rolling left and right almost infinitely

[violet juniper]

What brand set should I go for?

[cerulean smelt]

NPCs can't shoot if they're busy rolling left and right dodging seekers and mortars (> <)

[violet juniper]

This is my casual content build

[hexed steppe]

also cant shoot when they are... you know... dead

but if you are getting seekers back enough to span then you are getting something done... ill allow it

there is still a mortar there

[desert roost]

Yo how do you get chatterbox 😭

[cerulean smelt]

if you're maining the Chatterbox, i'd say Sokolova or just put in a Ceska or Grupo maybe? depending on your chc as is

unless that 1 gila is saving your butt with extra armor i think 1pc does?

[autumn yacht]

(> <)

[violet juniper]

tank oriented

I've farmed a bit of Palisade now lmao

I tried Belstone and it only really starts holding up at full memento stacks

[cerulean smelt]

palisade could work for the 1 pc armor on kill bit

[violet juniper]

it's a hidden project

[violet juniper]

It'll be nice to replace the lost AoK from Gunner

[violet juniper]

It's like 5% total armour

[cerulean smelt]

yeah, looked at the sheet just now. was going to suggest maybe deathgrips and oh 511 brand nm (> <)

[tulip charm]

Palisade or Ceska. You’re very limited due to how bad hf chest and bag are.

[lost wren]

what the hell are the umbra builds i keep running into in conflict that just shred me bro

[tulip charm]

umbra nbb setup.

[lost wren]

nbb?

[tulip charm]

#td2-pvp-discussions probably has images of it.

Ninjabike backpack

[violet juniper]

don't need ceska in any way

[lost wren]

what about the other pieces?

and what cores, mods, and attributes?

[tulip charm]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

I haven’t open the game for a few months

[violet juniper]

I'd say 3 blue, 2 red, NBB

crit chance and hazpro most likely, Umbra takes care of the CHD

[cerulean smelt]

notice the name Alphabridge abuser. they're waiting to get tinkerer mask

[tulip charm]

Literally that build has like multiple different versions.

Some go 3/3 rb some go 6 yellow + cap

[violet juniper]

the only PvP umbra builds I see are usually Iron Lung or Pesti focused

[hexed steppe]

chatterbox parts locations are listed in this pin, with a few other project exos. its pretty easy to get, and will be added to the loot pool after that. #ask-td2-community message

[tulip charm]

: )

[onyx sage]

yeah he should be banned for abusing game mechanics

[tulip charm]

Ok average player

[lost wren]

what brand sets do people use for the last two pieces

[tulip charm]

This what separate the average players and the gooder player 😀

[onyx sage]

sir, if you're so good why isn't your shd higher than mine

clearly higher shd = higher skill

[tulip charm]

Obviously you’re hacking

[onyx sage]

of course sir how can i be good otherwise

[tulip charm]

I appreciate people having to use cheats to get to my skill level 😎

[violet juniper]

4PC Umbra, NBB... not a clue.

[lost wren]

wish i had nbb, rip

[violet juniper]

probably whatever gear piece you need to shore up any deficiencies

Ceska, Belstone, whatever lol

[cerulean smelt]

more like 3 umbra, NBB, then 2 pieces

[lost wren]

and if no nbb?

[lone wadi]

nobody runs haz with umbra

[lone wadi]

4 umbra, contractors gloves,ceska vigilance bag

[lost wren]

i do have a ceska vigi bag, all red for crit
what about the rest of the cores, attributes, and whatnot?

[lone wadi]

crit dmg on all pieces

mods can be dmg or chance , whatever you need to reach 55+ crit chance

cores you pick as well but id run at least 2 blues and not more than 4

[violet juniper]

I forgot how NBB works lmao

[violet juniper]

I don't play PvP so I've not got much knowledge in niche PvP builds

[lost wren]

only 2 blues? wow

[lone wadi]

yeah cause its a damage based build in the end

[lost wren]

true

[violet juniper]

Umbra in PvP is just hosing rogues down before they realize what's happening

[lost wren]

fair

does this setup only work for pesti and iron lung? or does it work for others like ars

[violet juniper]

works best with pesti and Iron Lung

[lone wadi]

also nice if you are rogue

[lone wadi]

those work as well but i would run an ar as a primary

[violet juniper]

AR's make you reload before you can hit your stride really

[lone wadi]

something like lexington or m4 with measured

[lost wren]

lexington with optimist?

[violet juniper]

measured

[lone wadi]

i like using measured

[violet juniper]

Optimist is a meh talent

[lone wadi]

you can usually one mag most people

[lost wren]

gotcha

what specialization?

[lone wadi]

you pick but prolly firewall

[lost wren]

makes sense

[desert roost]

Tysm

[lone wadi]

dy have ninjabike bag? theres some 'fun' builds you can make with that and umbra

[lost wren]

no nbb

only recently got back into the game
not even shd 1000+ yet

[lone wadi]

ah too bad

np, take the game at ur own pace

[violet juniper]

4pc Umbra, Catalyst, Ceska bag with Wicked and Iron Lung

[lost wren]

i've gotten the ravenous and bighorn both from the dz
but no nbb yet

[violet juniper]

that's what I used in PvP lmao

[lone wadi]

catalyst is not good for pvp

[lone wadi]

wow nice

[violet juniper]

surprisingly good at countering the 1% of people who use fire sticky

[lost wren]

doesn't everyone just use foam and stinger hive now

[lone wadi]

a lot of people use fire sticky tbh

[violet juniper]

it's my personal preference to use catalyst just for the damage boost with Iron Lung

[lone wadi]

nah nobody uses stinger

[violet juniper]

you can slot in Catharsis and it's probably better

[lone wadi]

nice, i use njb, 2 lengmo rest umbra for mine

[lone wadi]

nah it wont be, umbra isnt meant to tank

[violet juniper]

I run 3/3 on mine lmao

[lone wadi]

3/3 what

[violet juniper]

Red and blue

[lone wadi]

ohh ok me too

[violet juniper]

then I camp on a supply drop and wait for rogues

[lone wadi]

tbh with iron lung is when you might want to consider running 6 blues

because you dont want to die before the fire kicks in

[violet juniper]

I'm too far away to get hit too much usually

I hose lone agents then run away

[lost wren]

this is what my usual build is currently

still looking for a blue core matador with chc and chd

or at least one to roll for blue core

[cerulean smelt]

could go live in Descent for a blueprint maybe?

[lost wren]

maybe

i did recently get this
but at most it's for bighorn hazpro headshot regen and even then it's not great

[lone wadi]

i mean thats great, i would suggest use foxes prayers insntead of second walker

[lone wadi]

yea a golan belstone or gila bag with the substats you need is better than the 6% extra total bonus armour

[lost wren]

ye
i use 3 piece gila with yaahl holster

the extra hazpro is nice

[lost wren]

actually no i lied, this is what i run

is 4 blues fine? or should i really go for 5 or 6?

[lone wadi]

yeah i would use maybe 5 to take more advantage of the efficient kit and catharsis and ad rush

all three of those are better when you have more armour

[lost wren]

i'll try and find fenris with chc and chd to roll for blue while i hunt for chc chd matador to also rroll for blue

6 blue is yummy

[lone wadi]

tbh

maybe replace matador with fenris and get foxes prayers

[lost wren]

really?

[lone wadi]

but see how rng treats you

[lost wren]

in the meantime i'll just nuke people with umbra pesti

something like this

[lone wadi]

that looks great

[lost wren]

super balanced
trust

[lone wadi]

small suggestion

pistol use deagle, harvest, or orbit with finisher on it

so you can maybe pop an npc, a drone, or a decoy for some extra dmg

[lost wren]

orbit is good

i'll take orbit

[lone wadi]

and something i do is that after my pistol kill i count in my heaad for 10 second if im currently not in a fight so i start the talent as late as possible

[candid talon]

I tried, I didn't love it.

[hexed steppe]

probably one of the most challenging skills to use, ngl

[lone wadi]

mortar?

[hexed steppe]

yes

the travel time makes path prediction key to success with mortar

[lone wadi]

i found it A LOT easier to use if you can set it up high

[hexed steppe]

once you know an area you can get pretty funky with it. like some spots in dua. capital inside the chamber

learn how to bounce them and thread narrow spots

[lone wadi]

it was so much fun using it during hollywood

whats ur second skill normally? drone?

[hexed steppe]

yeah. mortar is 😍 anytime for me. mortar main with no shame 😎

stinger hive/btsu glove trigger

[cerulean smelt]

i got a different mortar build where i'm using seekers with Skilled and tend to get lucky getting skilled procced so it's technically nearly infinite seeker mines (> <)

[lone wadi]

nice build, how does combined arms compare with the named chinalight bag?

[hexed steppe]

extra 10% total skill damage. low uptime, but it can be procced while mortar is mid flight

[cerulean smelt]

i'd say probably a lot more damage considering Capacitor stacks and the backpack talent increase as well

[lone wadi]

youll just have to peek out more then ig

[hexed steppe]

its good synergy with the high burst. i think with seekers it may be better with s&a because they all hit at different times and favor the uptime

stinger is easy to proc tho since its also a lot of cc and easy to mag dump cap to keep pca procced

this setup is about the only time i use pca. its probably good with oxi as well but that a lot more limited use and i just tech support oxi

[onyx sage]

yeah oxi tech support is more consistent

[hexed steppe]

another bonus i like with mortar... you can still aim and fire mortar while reviving teamates 😅

[thorn quartz]

Hello, recently started playing on division2, I was playing when there was 30lvl max! looks like lot of things changed, is there any userfriendly build to followup? mostly for solo content. Thanks

[subtle bluff]

There all in the Pinned Messages GDoc

Get to 40 first

[thorn quartz]

Yeah I'm already 40 did some raids already and i feel like items are getting throwed on me so im lost in them 😄 and need to figure out what I need to look for, Thank you, saw the Gdoc

[candid talon]

My issue is that its clunky, I never "enjoy" the gameplay and honestly it doesn't feel rewarding. If I try a build it has to fit on the fun category or the great category and that one felt like an hassle for no reason. Needs more damage / better scaling.

[autumn yacht]

you should try mortar in pvp players love dealing with it

[hexed steppe]

how its built makes a big difference on performance. being familiar with npc spawn patterns/behavior also increases how well its going to clear the map. top end with the setup i posted when fully stacked capacitor/talent proced is around 10mil per mortar, fully stacked with oc from btsu gloves is around 13mil per strike.

[vital apex]

What is a good tanks armor regen chameleon build for countdown?

[grizzled garnet]

for hive is there a floor for how fast its charges can regen?

[patent fossil]

Practically, there isn't one.
Tanks aren't really useful in most of the game (including countdown) as enemies will simply ignore you and focus on the players doing the most damage.
Chameleon is also very unsuited to countdown as it's short range and only strong when the stacks are up, and you'll have to spend a significant amount of time rebuilding the stacks since most encounters last longer than 45s.

[candid talon]

I understand that, but you realize how much effort you have to put into it for the return you get? I dunno. I personally feel that it should be more gratifying but that's my personal subjective opinion.

[violet juniper]

I have to agree with him here. getting that yellow sacrifice is horrible

[hexed steppe]

Yeah, that's why I said it was a challenging skill to use.
Personal preference goes a long way, and liking a build is another factor in success with it.

[violet juniper]

A good mortar guy on legendary is a godsend

[hexed steppe]

Now get those unicorns x4 😎

I got all alts setup.
Me and mortar run deep, so highly biased

[violet juniper]

I'm pretty much the same with hunters fury

I'm at the point of using Ridgeways with it now

[hexed steppe]

No doubts. This channel thrives because of the diversity we all have in build preference. More than a few times I had my eyes opened by someone utilizing some unique build synergy

[violet juniper]

The weird stuff often works

[feral quest]

Am I missing something with builds? I see people making builds that kill elites in a second and when I replicate it I can barely stand against a single elite. Is it that big of a difference if my armor/weapon attributes aren't maxed out? Ive been optimizing as much as I can but good lord this kills my motivation with this game

[patent fossil]

Are you looking at YouTube builds? Those often use misleading footage showing optimal cases or unmentioned team/countdown buffs

[feral quest]

Im going off of info I find on reddit or discussions, what gear set and attributes I should equip

[urban latch]

Can you post a screenshot of what you've currently got?

Generally speaking, having the right rolls, talents, etc make most of the difference. Obviously optimizing everything, watch levels, experience levels play into things a bit, but a build with the right but non-maxed rolls should be able to complete anything.

[feral quest]

SMG, crit hit/dmg

The attributes and mods arent max

[patent fossil]

Yeah you're missing a chunk of damage by running that chest, you want a high end one with obliterate or intimidate

Gearsets are mostly only worth running if you use all 4 pieces like you are with hunters fury

[urban latch]

Also reroll damage to targets out of cover on your SMG.

[feral quest]

I did that today actually. I will try the vest recommendation. Making it now

[candid talon]

Most stuff you see on Youtube is clickbait with people being buffed from a trillion different sources... big orange number gets click bro!

[urban latch]

Just something to keep in mind, high ends (yellow gear) are essentially the same "tier" as gearsets and exotics. This isn't a game where you always will have an exotic in every build, and basically every build will have 1-2 high end pieces, if not all high end.

[feral quest]

But they seem so genuine!

Does this gooder?

[urban latch]

Very good

[violet juniper]

Um.

[violet juniper]

that's much better lol

[late dew]

I’m having trouble building stacks with strikers, is there any way I can build it quicker?

[bright raptor]

ACS-12 is the fastest

[bright raptor]

depending on when it was posted, information on the subreddit can be rendered incorrect by updates and balance changes since

[violet juniper]

Use a faster weapon

[candid talon]

Yeah, Rock and Roll or ACS-12

Rock and Roll being able to shoot for longer due to huge magazine

ACS-12 slightly better damage, slightly worse stack build

[feral quest]

Thanks for the advice folks 🙏

[merry nest]

What's a badass build for DZ pvp?

[slate wedge]

this

all headshot damage and hazprot

need good aim tho

[merry nest]

I literally never headshot🤣🤣 controller aint controlling

[slate wedge]

well, then go for 4 pieces umbra, ceska backpack with vigilance or wicked and contractor gloves

use iron lung with crit chance as third attribute and get to 60% crit chance

try out how many blue cores you feel comfortable with and go nuts

[buoyant perch]

what buff is this?
edit: found it, sharpshooter buff - extra armor in cover

[cerulean smelt]

fist bump?

[violet juniper]

What spec are you running?

[buoyant perch]

it's from a video who's running Gunner

[violet juniper]

I'm fairly certain it's a specialisation buff

[tired falcon]

full auto shotgun, so yeah the acs12; or a really high rpm non-shotgun weapon
ie Pestilence with striker has over 1000 rpm (I forget the exact number)

[subtle bluff]

Should be obliterate

Idk since it's cropped too big for me.

[solar sable]

oblit is different

[subtle bluff]

Yeah obli normally has stacks in it..

[buoyant perch]

not obli

[solar sable]

no stacks bar + no shockwave ring + it isn't a fist facing forward

[subtle bluff]

Bleh

[solar sable]

wait, is it Tactical Link from Survivalist?

[vestal cargo]

Thoughts on how I can improve my build?
I’ve heard Memento is pretty decent

[cerulean smelt]

a couple things honestly
ninja bag is intersting in what it does but the lack of a backpack talent really hurts your damage
the usual striker build suggested is striker backpack, gloves, knees and holster with Ceska chest with obliterate talent on it and coyote's mask
if you want to opt for Memento, then mask, gloves, knees and holster, ceska chest with obliterate

ceska is important since strikers 2-4 pieces doesn't give any crit chance and ceska fills that gap

[vestal cargo]

Dually noted - I found the chest plate helps with the perfect spotter perk. Really accentuates that “Scout” Brand lmao

[vestal cargo]

I’ll run your suggestions here in a second, pretty sure I have most of what you mentioned in the stash already

[shy willow]

Get all your stuff rolled to crit too

[cerulean smelt]

you'll want to reach 55-60% crit chance then dump everything into damage

[glad moat]

whats your main weapon?

[nocturne edge]

question: for the talents that amp and cause bleed, blind, or fire status effects (Sadist, Eyeless and Ignited talents) after a certain amount of kills, are you able to reproc it from 3rd party kill sources (status effect kills, kills from drones, turrets, explosion, Vile exotic, kill assists) or is it ONLY from the weapon itself to be able to reproc the status effect?

[cerulean smelt]

i personally feel its more of the weapon doing the kills to proc those talents, but i could be wrong as i rarely use those telents in general anyways

[onyx sage]

i'm confused on what you're asking about here. when the talent says "after 3 kills, apply bleed" or similar, it just means that. after 3 kills, it will apply bleed on the next hit.

now are you asking what counts as kills? because if so if the target dies from any sort of damage coming from you (so doesn't have to be your gun damage, can come from a skill that you own or status effect you caused) it counts as your kill and it counts as 1 kill for the talent

if you're asking about whether the first part of the talent (the amp) works on targets that don't have the status applied from the talent itself, then yes, it works no matter where the bleed/blind/fire came from

[nocturne edge]

let me try to rephrase:

shoot gun, blind, gun kill, gun kill, gun kill, shoot gun, blind
OR
shoot gun, blind, emp w/ vile, 3+ die from plague, shoot gun, blind

[cerulean smelt]

i didn't think skills could count as the kill part, but it does make sense

[onyx sage]

2nd situation

[onyx sage]

read the 2nd part of this reply

wait nvm, it wouldn't work.

keep in mind you have to hold the gun while this entire thing is active for the kill counter to track

if you swap off the gun with the talent, the kill counter resets

which, your 2nd situation won't work with because you mentioned plague, which means you'd be swapping off the gun with the status talent towards pestilence, which resets the kill counter

the 1st situation will work

[flint spire]

Any other way to improve this load out
Or is it good as it is?

[onyx sage]

just to deepen your understanding, a 3rd situation like this will work:

shoot gun, blind, fire sticky and cause 3 dudes to die from eclipse fire spread, shoot gun, blind

this works because fire sticky doesn't make you swap off the gun with eyeless

[nocturne edge]

now yall understanding my dilemma, and im not using pestilence (exotic lmg), im using the vile perk (exotic MASK) that states that any status effect applied cause damage over time and pestilence is NOT status effect, its just weapon damage over time, so i emp WHILE the talent weapon is out which is what im trying to find out what can count towards the kill counter unless its ONLY from the weapon itself

[stark flicker]

what should I slot in for a backpack? https://mxswat.github.io/mx-division-builds/#/GwdgtMYIwEzfURwAxletmPoFzawfkVjjJCgmCMTSeBVIU7cqXAMyaMvMkwddePXAFZOjGOFhgYqERSJ4hQpcMJ5S3ZayhrkQA

preferably not named

[cerulean smelt]

what's wrong with named backpack?

[stark flicker]

just don't wanna grind named caches

[inland warren]

Thoughts on a Catalyst Striker Backfire w Bloodsucker on BP?

[cerulean smelt]

i wouldn't run it, but that's just me.
i'd say try it out and see how it feels to you then come back with your findings and ask if there can be some improvements?

[nocturne edge]

hmm i might try that, but im still testing things so ill figure it out eventually and thanks

[nocturne edge]

st elmo or iron lunge might good be alternates as you don't need to use skills and try to kill tanky elites to proc, just shoot set things on fire/electrify, and keep shooting with only reloading being the only automatic motion unless you spam the reload button

[onyx sage]

it's just an example just to demonstrate it, i wouldn't recommend actually using it

i would want to know what you're actually trying to accomplish too

[steel fractal]

Am I stupid or smt but since when do the signature weapons count towards the exotic weapon limit?

Or is it a catalyst only thing

[slate wedge]

hey guys recommend me some builds to farm for in CD

can be PvP aswell

[nocturne edge]

running an eclipse protocol status effect build with vile, perfect trauma named chest and the scorpio but was always curious about the status effect talents on weapons and how they proc (if at all)

[inland warren]

i'm lost when using it, sometimes i feel like it needs more dmg, sometimes more hazpro, sometimes more armor so idk what to do

[vestal cargo]

St. Elmos Engine

[onyx sage]

you don't want to use these with eclipse because they don't really help the status damage. common picks are scorpio, capacitor or any shotgun with in sync just because of the native dta on the weapon helping with the status damage

[steel fractal]

Is it a catalyst only thing? first time I saw that the signature weapon count towards the limit

[onyx sage]

perfect trauma isn't really a good choice also because it doesn't help with status damage or spread. people commonly use eclipse chest (or in some cases glass cannon talent chest)

[hoary valve]

what is the best conflict build

[flint spire]

I don't think fire does much against tanks
But I'll put these two to the test
Ty!

[onyx sage]

this is how people run eclipse for damage commonly

stinger hive is interchangeable with fire sticky

[nocturne edge]

yeah i know, i just like to inflict nearly all the colors of the rainbow of status effects on one dude before my dps teammates finish him off lol
just stun-locking the guy with poison, disorient, shock, blind, bleed, disrupt and ensnare
very fun for normal play and just clearing rooms with a single emp blast
the ONLY drawback is when im facing immune bosses/enemies, THEN you're screwed
but yeah its what im comfortable with 🙂

[onyx sage]

i wouldn't run vile then, could run an electrique piece

[grizzled garnet]

is there any interesting new builds? looking to shake up my gameplay. preferably red build but can be skill or blues. i got most of the standard ones (strikers, hotshot, regulus, hazpro tank, skill build, fi healer, oxy, ep status and ND)

[cerulean smelt]

only person i saw a document of builds so far is Localdeck, AmeragePlayer might have one as well?

[grizzled garnet]

recently got ninjabike backpack so maybe smn with that

[cerulean smelt]

best i can give you for meme is that with 2 strikers and 3 umbra to make your guns go br. especially if you go the famas/vector route

[grizzled garnet]

looking for a more practical approach

[cerulean smelt]

beyond what i've given you? not many here are fans of it and would tell you to use something else
so you'll have to play around with it yourself and find your middle ground that you find acceptable using it

[grizzled garnet]

oki ty 🙏

[cerulean smelt]

like i've attempted a ninja backpack, picaro's, 2 palisades for 3 skill tiers, 4th with technician then i fall flat what other pieces to use, even more falling as the damage isn't there in general skill wise or weapon wise and i dismantle the whole build

[onyx sage]

what content do you want to do?

[grizzled garnet]

countdown and other group schtuff

(not raids or legendary)

[onyx sage]

have you tried blue OD?

[grizzled garnet]

i tried A blue of that used scorpio but wasnt my jam. if you got a spin on it though i'll try it since i still got the gear

[onyx sage]

eh i don't play it but i'd use scorpio with vanguard oppo

it suits countdown more than anything

[grizzled garnet]

oppo?

[onyx sage]

opportunistic

[grizzled garnet]

gimme a sec an i'll show you what i had

[grizzled garnet]

its not perfect but its functional

if i was to farm a new pointman should i focus the brand or the slot 🤔

[onyx sage]

the brand

[grizzled garnet]

🙏

[violet juniper]

No Creeping death bag?

[violet juniper]

if you're farming named gear, always the brand it's from

[cerulean smelt]

what if i prefer snow machine knees? O_O

[onyx sage]

for damage you use EP backpack, for control you use creeping death

i recommended the damage approach since they said they use vile

but even then they're going for an "all-status" fireworks build so vile doesn't even fit either