h2-builds-and-combat

[rare flax]

Sorry was driving my kids to school.

So staff of Circe, what stays effects are best? The guide I was looking at made no mention of hitch at all.

As for familiars, raki is flying all over the place I’d rather utilize overlap

[silver flax]

If you wanna double-stack the Casts, go with Gale. She follows you relentlessly. Hitch can work if you want to spread the damage from the beam.

[tough torrent]

Hitch is better for it when you aren't stacking the circles cause the hitch cast only deals damage when its applying hitch

Which it doesnt do if the thing already has hitch

[odd bolt]

yeah its the easiest vow

[silver flax]

Oh right this is for Cast boons specifically, yeah no you'd want things that actually stack from you having two of them overlapping, things like Hestia's or Zeus' come to mind.

[odd bolt]

i was able to get a good build with mel coat just now

#h2-victory-boasting message if you wanna take a look

[silver flax]

Wave Strike, Extra Dose, Grevious Blow and Exhaust Rider, holy blender

[odd bolt]

grievous blow showed up on the last shop

i wanted arterial spray

[silver flax]

😔

[rare flax]

stracking casts hestia + zeus for circe?

i also saw people mentioning apollo and heph but those aren't really DOT right?

[odd bolt]

hestia and zeus are the best for Circe yeah

Demeter also works

[odd bolt]

Apollo, Heph and maybe even Poseidon are good too if you get winners circle from hermes

[rare flax]

got it, for the blast at the end but not really for DOT

[odd bolt]

Heph because even if your cast expires the hammer still keeps doing damage

It doesn't go away

[odd bolt]

Yeah

[rare flax]

i'm gonna do a run with gale and circe

[odd bolt]

If you wanna meme even ares can work with winners circle

[rare flax]

now one thing i'm unsure about is, the magic restoration arcana card vs. burning a booin for magic recovery

what's everyo0ne's thoughts on that?

[surreal hazel]

The unseen is a total waste of grasp

[rare flax]

hmmmm

[odd bolt]

#h2-victory-boasting message I love stupid ares builds

[surreal hazel]

you will always want to have a Gain boon, not just for the actual gain properties

[odd bolt]

If you're using Circe you dont even need omegas

And the unseen arcana sucks yeah

[surreal hazel]

but also that they so far outstrip the weaksauce regen on the Unseen with basically anything

[rare flax]

you're talking about regen boons?

[surreal hazel]

If you don't take a gain boon, you will keep being offered one because it's a core boon and gods always offer them if you have an empty slot

[surreal hazel]

All boons with "gain" in the name, yes, the mana restoring boons

[rare flax]

ok i'm gonna mess with this

i have a brand new unrelated line of questioning now

[viral yew]

Unseen is sooooo buns

[surreal hazel]

they also virtually always are an acceptable pre-requisite for duo boons

[rare flax]

i am getting SMOKED by promotheus regularly

i have only beaten him like three times and i'm not sure what to change.

my guess is that i'm too focused on rushdown tactics vs waiting and playing a longer battle

[surreal hazel]

What's killing you? The game of Simon Says or Simon Kicks You In The Head?

[viral yew]

[rare flax]

the simon says is learnable i've gotten better even if i gotta pause it

[surreal hazel]

don't memorise where the flames go

memorise just one location that is clear

even if there's two

[rare flax]

yeah i just rmemeber where to stand not where the flames are

but it's the damage deadling and defense

[surreal hazel]

and Prom actually does have an attack pattern, and it changes each phase

[rare flax]

i can abvoid that part but i'm blowing through three defiance even if i do beat him

whereas i can reach chronos pretty easily, but i'm convinced the surface is the more difficult path

[tough torrent]

The main attack from prom himself that messes me up is the rocket punches. Like yeesh

[surreal hazel]

Have you noticed that prom has Charged and Uncharged versions of his moves?

[rare flax]

no

[surreal hazel]

like the punch flurry sometimes launches projectiles, others it doesn't

as an example

[rare flax]

i'm thinking it's a battle that requires more patience and poking than i'm giving it currently

[tough torrent]

But when its in bromance mode sometimes the Simon says is rough cause I get distracted by, uh, other things

[surreal hazel]

So in phase one, he only uses charged attacks, then pauses for a while

phase two he uses irrc, two quick uncharged moves, then a charged one before pausing

[rare flax]

right when he's aiming for a few seconds before letting loose

[surreal hazel]

in phase 3 it's charged, uncharged x2, charged

[rare flax]

irrc?

[surreal hazel]

That's not a move with an uncharged version, but he does that occasinoally too

but yeah, with that move, you can't really dodge it if you're too close

try to make him aim it somewhere workable, you really don't want it going down the middle of the arena

[rare flax]

what is irrc?

[surreal hazel]

if I recall correctly

[rare flax]

oh duh

thought it was a game term

[tough torrent]

The big swath that he aims at you, you can dodge by dashing through him. The timing is tight though

[rare flax]

Let's talk hexes, if I HAVE to take one, I was watching a YouTube video where they were like, just take the healing.

[surreal hazel]

the big detonation move is the easiest to deal with

[surreal hazel]

Pfft, cowards

I mean yeah, Panacea is busted as an upgrade, but you gotta experience the power of Trinity Lunar ray with apollo godsent

[rare flax]

i mean i just don't find it that useful otherwise esp against guardians, although i had impervious maxed out which set me up for my first and only win against typhon.

[tough torrent]

Twilight Curse is imo the best hex by so much that it ain't even close

[surreal hazel]

ehhhh, sometimes Night Bloom can pop off like crazy

[tough torrent]

Its very good even with no upgrades

[rare flax]

godsent?

[surreal hazel]

ah, you've not unlocked godsent hexes yet, right

[rare flax]

the purple upgrades?

[tough torrent]

Duo hexes

[surreal hazel]

basically an upgrade on each of them that only appears if you have a boon from the paired god

[rare flax]

never seen those

[surreal hazel]

so Moon Water's godsent only appears if you have posideon with you

[surreal hazel]

Have you used all nine hexes at least once?

[rare flax]

i don't think so

[tough torrent]

Zooz twilight curse is nutters

[surreal hazel]

Including the hex that's innate to the black coat's second aspect

[rare flax]

i htink the only one i haven't used is heals

i'll do it next run

[surreal hazel]

have you used skyfall?

heck have you even unlocked the aspect of selene?

[rare flax]

the one with shine on the coat? yes

[tough torrent]

Skyfall having a duo is kind of insane

[surreal hazel]

okay

then yeah, use moon water at least once, then the next run after Selene will unlock godsent hexes for you

[tough torrent]

Like you can only get this boon on this exact weapon if you have this god

[rare flax]

got it

[surreal hazel]

Skyfall being aspect specific is a neat idea but uuuuuugh

it's a hex I'd want on virtually any other weapon

literally every other weapon is more omega-damage dependent than the coat

and if you want big omega attack damage on the coat, Shiva is right there

[tough torrent]

ngl I completely forget to use hexes whenever they're not curse

[rare flax]

so to summarize:

circe works well with gale if you want stacked casts, focusingh on hestia, zeus, demeter, or heph.

magic restoration card, not worth it...take a magic regen boon

test heals Hex

promotheus: be more patient and idneitfy patterns charged vs. uncharged

[surreal hazel]

so other arcana question

do you have Origination enabled?

[rare flax]

soemtimes, depends on the run, but i love DOT so i've been priotizing it more

[surreal hazel]

well, not just enabled, but basically, nailed down, superglued and welded to your arcana board

[tough torrent]

Shrimply get a chaos boom to restore 17 mana a second

Its that ez honest

[surreal hazel]

getting two curses is possible on basically every build ever

[rare flax]

not like thgat but it sounds i'm about to change that

[surreal hazel]

and it's one of the reasons why people love boons like blinding rush so much

[rare flax]

where you apply daze with sprinting? why?

[tough torrent]

Its easy to apply and lasts a long time

[opal pecan]

But also just because sprint fast is gud

[surreal hazel]

because origination demands two curses, and blinding rush spreads it like the plague

[tough torrent]

Effectively lasts forever on mobs cause they are gonna die before 9 seconds

Also yeah the aoe is surprisingly huge for the daze

[surreal hazel]

you can easily get the second from the other core boons

[rare flax]

where are we on daze vs. weak?

[tough torrent]

Also the affect of daze is just very good?

[surreal hazel]

Both, both is good, but weakness has a default duration of 1 second

so good luck using passion rush to keep a target weak

[tough torrent]

Weak being 1 second default is crazy

[surreal hazel]

rapture ring is better, glamour gain is easily the best

[opal pecan]

Rapture comes with the bonus double CC so I'm all in favor

[rare flax]

so daze has big AOE, longer duration and pairs wtih originations

[surreal hazel]

Glamour Gain with Island getaway makes everyone weak, anywhere, all the time

[tough torrent]

Unfortunate thing about glamor gain is its in the gain slot so some weapons basically cannot use it

[rare flax]

combine with casts boons, voila

[surreal hazel]

the actual rate of gain on glamour is poor, and it doesn't play nicely with the Huntress

but if you don't need that but want a free curse, go nuts

[tough torrent]

Glamor island sounds funny but good luck getting me to take aphro attack or spec

[surreal hazel]

a juicy +300% bonus on an epic Flutter Flourish might convince you otherwise

[wild drift]

Island Getaway Flutter Flourish Dual Moonshot on Mel Staff (not actually sure if Dual Moonshot counts as "nearby" enough so as to not need Island Getaway)

[bronze flax]

Glamour Island is fun, except when you get Nervous Wreck. That anti-synergy

[surreal hazel]

mostly

"nearby" is basically cast radius

but measured to their centrepoint

[wild drift]

Really wish vanilla Hades could have boons and hammers next to Skelly

[white sun]

i need a aspect if circe build and how do you even use that aspect

im a aspect of charon abuser and wanted to try new weapons

[surreal hazel]

get Storm ring, press cast, win

run the other side of enemies from your familiar

[tough torrent]

@leaden heron #h2-victory-boasting message
getting screwed with no attack boon is lowkey one of my biggest reasons for loving morrigan so much

no boons no problem, take 800 damage

[leaden heron]

If you don't have Glamour/Flood gain and Hera Attack, its over on 67

With Nergal

[tough torrent]

im not at 67 yet

i'm still trying to get the statues

[tough torrent]

Does Weed Killer after every burst of Dawnbreaker on Eos torches?

got epic snow queen vs epic weed killer and i'm just like bruh

[flint widget]

uh yeah

[tough torrent]

huh i just went through thessaly without getting the god for my keepsake

here i thought i had a good run and then eris just kills me 100->0

[spiral wadi]

yea god keepsakes r giga inconsistent on thessaly

[tough torrent]

rip

man i know heracles is a free room but even then he's kind of just annoying

[serene wagon]

I was at over half heath on the last phase against Chronos

[spiral wadi]

heracles is weird ye, he's good in olympus and ephyra but he loses time on thessaly

[serene wagon]

And accidentally dashed into his explosion area

You know when you stand on the circle waiting for it to end?

[spiral wadi]

dw we lock in next run

[serene wagon]

I hit dash by accident

[spiral wadi]

67 is also like absurdly difficult, most ppl run 62 which is no vow of void cuz game's heavily balanced around arcana

[tough torrent]

just do all but the last rank of Void and do Judgement gaming

[flint widget]

only real arcana is swift runner and lovers rest are fake cards

[rare flax]

Thanks for the tips this morning gang. Getting better at promotes and took down tython with Circe staff

[tough torrent]

lived a boss on 1 hp for the first time this game 💀

you can polymorph Carybdis's tenctacles????????

wtf 😭

[silent crow]

not in the rivals fight funnily enough which is really nice

[tough torrent]

thats why i was confused

why is that nice though. I'd super rather be able to morph them there

[silent crow]

its not i lied

[tough torrent]

the classic kill prom before hera even phases and then lose 2 dds to hera doing his best Asterion impression

the very end of rivals typhon just seems so impossible to me man

[viral yew]

Babality?

[tough torrent]

yeah

...is that not the end?

[viral yew]

No

[tough torrent]

how is there more omfg

[viral yew]

You don't have to stay in the circle you can leave it to dodge

[tough torrent]

huh

oh but return to it you mean yeah

[viral yew]

Yep

[tough torrent]

the fight is already so bullet hellish in some parts. This seems harder than super dad from the first game yeesh

[opal pecan]

Super dad's super dad and also his super dadfriend

[viral yew]

Rivals typhon is still easier than rivals chronos

[tough torrent]

that's just not true

I've beaten rivals chronos a couple times

apparently i havent even seen the final phase of rivals typhon

[viral yew]

Alot of people agree with me

[opal pecan]

Do you want spoilers?

[viral yew]

Chronos has a lot more jank he can hit you with, typhon is hella predictable

[tough torrent]

i dont see how super grandpa is harder

[viral yew]

Noooo don't do it

[opal pecan]

This is an all spoilers zone but just outta courtesy I'll respect whatever you want lol

Er, Appa, that is

You don't got nothin left to spoil, Luthien, lmao

[viral yew]

Typhon just has less bs he can hit you with really

I've done hitless typhon but have yet to do hitless chronos

[tough torrent]

idk man. This is like the third time i've rolled uo on rivals typhon with 300-400 hp and 3 DDs and died

[viral yew]

I mean the chronos parts are super telegraphed, his moves are the same, just with bigger aoes that you can consistently dodge every time, babality is probably the biggest adjustment but I never had problems with it

Last phase is the last phase

Just have enough dps for the eggs and learn the deadzones

[tough torrent]

baby is where i've died every single time i got there with decent hp

sometimes i roll up with like 100 hp and one skele tooth and just kind of die to attrition but other than that

[opal pecan]

It's a pure survival phase

Just gotta focus in and be on top of reacting to all the moves

[viral yew]

Rivals scylla but easier

[tough torrent]

wait can you mini-crit enemies standing inside the circle from Anubis attack???

im getting red numbers that are suspiciously twice as much as other numbers while fighitng inside my anubis circle

[viral yew]

Do you have ares at all

[tough torrent]

not when i first noticed it in erebus, though i do now

which believe it or not makes it harder to try and figure out how i'm getting them

[viral yew]

Red crits are from ares

[tough torrent]

im not sure what to tell you. I didnt even have a wounds boon let alone the ares crit boon

is still dont even have the crit boon

[broken spoke]

Mutual destruction don't need wound

[viral yew]

Yep

[tough torrent]

hm

[viral yew]

Anubis doesn't have built in crits of any kind

[tough torrent]

yeah thats it

i keep forgetting thats crit chance for missing hp, in my head its minus strike

[umbral horizon]

Typhon does not move, that makes him a lot of easier than Chronos in my opinion

Even easier than Promecles

[tough torrent]

timer'd to chronos rip

[prisma gust]

When you time out before even getting Chronos to phase 2 and still clutch up

Anyways Hel is the worst aspect

[tough torrent]

i made it to p3 but had 8 seconds left sooooo

[umbral horizon]

Time out in 62 fears?

[tough torrent]

i did however end the run with 80% last gasp

[prisma gust]

Nah. 40

I'm only doing rivals 3

I'm working on 40 fear all aspects

[umbral horizon]

I love Hel. Zues and Poseidon are so broken with this aspect

[tough torrent]

i wish that O cast wasn't the easiest thing to channel on Hel by a billion miles

💀

[umbral horizon]

Ospecial is really strong, long channel but good enough

[viral yew]

Real

[viral yew]

Crazy cause most 62 runners play hel without it

[tough torrent]

at like 20 fear it feels like if i can even channel a special on hel, i also could have just killed the enemies by throwing a normal spec and shooting them a bunch in the same time

[umbral horizon]

Same issue with any magic spending aspect in 62 fear

[viral yew]

It's got nothing to do with the magic it's just not a great omega move

50 magic, longish charge time, good room clear but bad for bossing

[tough torrent]

i havent done a whole lot of omega-ing on skull in general to be honest

outside of winner circle memes

[prisma gust]

I use skull omega attack

Especially when P. Array

P. Array is literally the best hammer in the game

[odd bolt]

yeah it's up there

parray, psychic whirlwind and trick knives are probably top 3 hammers

[prisma gust]

I'm an axe hater so I don't really use psychic whirlwind very often

Same for twin blades and trick knives

[odd bolt]

Dual moonshot can arguably go on that list too but I still think those are the 3 best ones

[silver flax]

Air Quality is swiftly becoming my favorite boon in Hades 2

[umbral horizon]

And mirrored thrasher too. Staff have so many good hammer

[spark crown]

https://tenor.com/view/funny-cat-the-yearning-the-yearning-gif-11190376703342778094

[white sun]

need a aspect of pan build

[surreal hazel]

Shimmering rockets is the coat's best. Probably

[spark crown]

Anything but wound(ares)

[umbral horizon]

Arterial spray

[spark crown]

Low key forget that existed

[tough torrent]

P array you dont gotta channel it though is the the thing

[tall notch]

Trick knives

[tough torrent]

Can morrigan do trick knives and is it worth

[digital juniper]

it doesn’t have trick knives no

and morrigan’s special is horrible, if it did have TK it would only be for easier triads

[viral yew]

No

[median anvil]

honestly I'd take it

[tough torrent]

My thought would be you dont have to press special manually when going for triads but yeah idk

[median anvil]

just dash attack into oattack for back to back triads

[tough torrent]

Yeah thays what I was thinking

[digital juniper]

well yeah that’s exactly what i said

[tough torrent]

Though tbh I try to triad perhaps a bit too much

[digital juniper]

there is no too much trading on morrigan

[tough torrent]

Oh oops I thought i read wouldn't

[flint widget]

didn't know you could trade stocks with morrigan

i should let my dad know about this

[digital juniper]

https://tenor.com/view/minor-spelling-mistake-gif-21179057

[flint widget]

https://tenor.com/view/ishowspeed-meme-trying-not-to-laugh-laugh-homeless-gif-9458928528704746136

[tough torrent]

Oh I took it to mean trading hits

[digital juniper]

on the topic of triads

do yall say tree-ad or try-ad?

[tough torrent]

Try

Idk which is correct but I've always heard it as try for triad

[viral yew]

The latter

[tough torrent]

Like Agni Kai Triad in lok, Triple Triad from final fantasy(???)

[median anvil]

try-ad

[wild drift]

Lmao this reminds me of Haelian's video first using Morrigan

Chat was on his ass

Triad like triangle for sure

[odd bolt]

I say tree-ad...

Maybe because it's closer to how I would say on my native language but it makes sense to be try-ad

[prisma gust]

Thermal dynamics on literally any cost aspect is really fun

[tall notch]

you should tell your dad to throw his life savings into crypto trust

[leaden heron]

I keep getting to Hecate at like, 1 minute remaining on 67. Almost got her when I had Gigaros Dash but no attack boon or Magick regain but did have Psychic Whirlwind. Any tips on Nergal?

Did get a godly seed earlier that got me to sirens but got rocked

Best 67 run in the past with Nerg got me to gramps but that Erebus had Arachne, Charon, Fountain, and Nemesis back to back

[frank siren]

You might be better off asking in the speedrunning discord... I think all dozen of the 67 clear players hang out there

[final sedge]

What is aspect of moros blast damage based on, the attack or special?

[opal pecan]

Attack

[spark crown]

Tri-ad :P

[digital juniper]

good morning metal

[spark crown]

Morning

How's your runs going

[digital juniper]

currently savestating sirens at 62

[leaden heron]

Timed out on a 67 on Promecles

So ehhh

[spark crown]

Rough

[tough torrent]

hmmm

savestating one the rivals 4 fights to get some experience on them would be neat

[tough torrent]

i sure love getting NO gain offers and having to take Ionic Gain in the end shop of thessaly

[tough torrent]

bro playing hel hurts my wrists so muich for some reason. Other skulls dont do this to me 😭

[slender apex]

Are any daedelus hammer upgrades not offered on specific weapon aspects, similar to Hades 1?

[tough torrent]

yes

[opal pecan]

Have you unlocked the codex yet? It should tell you in the prereqs for each hammer if it has certain exclusions

[viral yew]

Yep

[tough torrent]

ok yeah. I might play Hel like once more to get the prohecy to take it to Chronos but after that never again. Idk what about it makes my wrist hurt so bad

[slender apex]

Got it, thanks!

[spark crown]

You on roller or m&k

[vernal quiver]

crazy when its a 1 button weapon

[alpine raft]

just dont hold the buttons so hard

[manic shuttle]

I like hel because no button mashing, we're not the same

[umbral horizon]

Really? How do u play with other skulls? All you need to do with Hel is just stand still.

[tough torrent]

might be this idk

[tough torrent]

wdym just stand still 😭
with hel i always felt like enemies were an inch out of my range and i always had to stop and dash again

[austere trail]

valkyrie form

[tall notch]

Positioning can help with that to a degree

[tough torrent]

I mean yeah? I just have to reposition a lot more it feels like

[tough torrent]

I throw the spec a decent amount, at least in the run where I complained about my wrist, cause I had hera spec

[tall notch]

If you're in the right place to begin with you won't have to reposition as much 🔥

[tough torrent]

Torches + Arch Flash + Zooz Special is sure a thing of all time

[surreal hazel]

Sometimes the torches do damage

[tough torrent]

that was probably my lowest damge taken on eris ever lol

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/268784286985879553/1472288821952647249/image.png?ex=69920750&is=6990b5d0&hm=7ccf9a5073a5504d20f864f38f3d171174a1a7f5258baededa3c4437f62528b5

yo why is it so tiny wtf

oh no i just got thermal dynamics

supay is so weird i'm almost timing out on Poly, and then i'm reaching Prometheus probably the fastest i've ever done so

[alpine raft]

yea easily the worst start

[tough torrent]

prometheus dead with 3:57 on the timer still yeah man wth

[median anvil]

it has the slowest start by far but then snowballs into an absolute monstrosity

[tough torrent]

i just cleared summit without taking damage up to the end shop wtf 😭
i used some blocks like snow queen so not true hitless but man

[tough torrent]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/268784286985879553/1472298873077895340/image.png?ex=699210ad&is=6990bf2d&hm=183ac4978573ded4c90ef9a6899cb9ad3fae5b335ee3594af84eedd8c09c7be7

how's this for thanatos?

[median anvil]

debt??

[tough torrent]

whats wrong with debt

[median anvil]

take fangs1 instead of crap smh

[tough torrent]

i thought debt was one of the easy ones

[tall notch]

debt is free fear just chrolex 🔥

[median anvil]

less boons

[rain grove]

Hi everyone, there is any reason to take the black scroll after the Second time? I took the last item (calling card).
The fight is really hard and it gives nothing. if possible I would rather avoid it

[opal pecan]

Just for funsies really

[rain grove]

Also there is any way o have more than 30 grasp of arcana?

[opal pecan]

With Judgment or Circe's keepsake only

[tough torrent]

circe herself can pull an extra arcana too

but in each case you dont get to choose the extra cards

[rain grove]

Thanks

Do you have any suggestions for the best card combination?

[opal pecan]

Best card combination depends on what you're playing and how you want to play it

Have you completed the game (reached the end credits) yet?

[rain grove]

I need to find the sisters

[tough torrent]

i mean they said they beat zag so

[opal pecan]

Oh wait, yes, of course, you mentioned Calling Card

[rain grove]

Playing at 10/20 fear. I usually prefer non magic build

[opal pecan]

In that case, being able to use FW keepsakes is very strong, so unless you prefer rerolls personally, I'd recommend something that uses that

[rain grove]

Thanks

[tough torrent]

o cast, more like no cast sheeesh

[opal pecan]

This is my usual arcana setup for "general purpose": https://h2crossroads.pages.dev/ArcanaDeck/?deck=WyJjMSIsImMyIiwiYzMiLCJjNiIsImM3IiwiYzgiLCJjMTEiLCJjMTMiLCJjMTQiLCJjMTUiLCJjMTciLCJjMTgiLCJjMjMiLCJjMjQiXQ==

However, if you want to auto-activate your hexes, you might consider switching Artificer out for Eternity, which would activate Moon while maintaining Divinity

[tough torrent]

what does non magic build mean exactly? like not using mana, or what

[rain grove]

Yeah, I usually not use charged moves

[tough torrent]

Rip

[opal pecan]

(I stopped using Eternity because it slows things down without slowing down the timer, but there's no reason to avoid it if you don't care about that)

[rain grove]

I only like some of them 🙁

I would go with this https://h2crossroads.pages.dev/ArcanaDeck/?deck=WyJjMSIsImMyIiwiYzMiLCJjNCIsImM1IiwiYzciLCJjMTIiLCJjMTMiLCJjMTciLCJjMTgiLCJjMTkiLCJjMjAiLCJjMjMiLCJjMjQiXQ==

[opal pecan]

Death AND Strength!?

I mean, feel free to do what you like

It's errr not optimal

But hey whatever floats yer boat

[rain grove]

You got a point 🤔

[opal pecan]

Origination is also extremely strongly recommended, as it's a huge global damage bonus; Lovers is also vastly helpful defensively. If your primary concern is wanting to run DDs, then you could consider something like this: https://h2crossroads.pages.dev/ArcanaDeck/?deck=WyJjMSIsImMyIiwiYzMiLCJjNCIsImM1IiwiYzYiLCJjNyIsImM4IiwiYzExIiwiYzEyIiwiYzEzIiwiYzE0IiwiYzE1IiwiYzE3IiwiYzIwIiwiYzI0Il0=

But either way, up to you!

(Or, honestly, if you don't care about hexes, https://h2crossroads.pages.dev/ArcanaDeck/?deck=WyJjMSIsImMyIiwiYzMiLCJjNiIsImM3IiwiYzgiLCJjMTEiLCJjMTIiLCJjMTMiLCJjMTQiLCJjMTUiLCJjMTciLCJjMTgiLCJjMjAiLCJjMjQiXQ== would be even juicier, since Death gives you middle row for Divinity already so you don't need top row)

[tough torrent]

I'm kind of growing to resent how strong Origination is tbh

[opal pecan]

--Oh, I left Queen in there. Anyway, Queen/Excellence are basically like, "these are nice to have, but not necessarily as impactful as some of the cheaper/easier-to-get cards"

But anyway, experiment around and see what you like :)

[rain grove]

Which 2 curse do you easily apply at the same time?

[opal pecan]

Any two, it's very flexible

It's just a mindset to get into -- checking to see if you have two easy ways to apply curses, and picking boons based on that

For most weapons, any combination of two curse-applying attack/special/cast boons will be the easiest

[tough torrent]

Anything but Weak™

[opal pecan]

For melee weapons, Glamour Gain becomes viable; for weapons that mostly use only Attacks or only Specials, then it becomes that + cast; for Supay, rush is obviously easier to use as a curse source compared to how easy it is on other aspects

[autumn gyro]

Does the oath that reduces the amount of arcana at your disposal affect Judgement?

[tough torrent]

...for some reason i didnt expect gorgon amulet to disable fates whim

[vernal quiver]

No, hence why void3 becomes a judgment run

[autumn gyro]

noted

[vernal quiver]

But also you should never be touching void until 65f

[grim current]

How inefficient is it to perform attack & special with Circe?

I known it's very inefficient for Melinoe's.

[digital juniper]

i usually only use one to get huntress on

sometimes the enemies line up nicely with the double casts so i might throw an oattack

[grim current]

Hum. I figure whenever anyone wants to trigger Huntress, they'd perform cast when it's extremely easy to do so.

Not any of the attacks or specials in any weapon.

[digital juniper]

yeah that’s probably the better play but i just ospecial at the beginning of the room so i don’t have any think of it

but nah on other weapons you’d usually oattack or ospecial

[flint widget]

for me i just use omega special to activate huntress

omega attack too damn slow

[grim current]

At any rate, we digress. I know that Decura's most damaging combo is dash-attack -> special -> attack 1. Only by equipping % boons do Descura's attack & special outpace regular attack & special.

[flint widget]

yeah dash strike special is cracked

[spiral wadi]

omega atk is solid on staff in general

omega spec is uhhh eh

[grim current]

So it's only Melinoe's Descura is it grossly suboptimal to build around & perform attack & special?

[silver flax]

Mostly because you want to make the most use of the extra power on the Special, at least iirc. Omega Attacks are still good on Melinoe's tho given the big Magick boost

[viral yew]

Ospecial i'd say is still better

Oattack isn't great but you can get some really nice ospecial builds

[silver flax]

Oh wait you can probably get extra benefit from the power shot hammer and the double charge hammer, can't you

[spiral wadi]

i think oatk is just generally solid to have in ur subconscious

like not smth to build around but can still do a thing

[silver flax]

yeah it's kinda hard to skip out on a very solid AoE

[tough torrent]

when you roll up to a pair of doors thats Hammer vs Family dispute, which one do you normally take?

[grim current]

Family dispute. It's not like Hades 1 where the game tries its best to give the player 2 Daedalus hammers, but there's usually enough time for the game to provide the option again. Artificer can even provide the player their first Daedalus Hammer of the run.

[opal pecan]

Hades 2 does in fact try its best to give the player two hammers

[tough torrent]

i think they meant to say its not like hades 1 in that it doe a better job of shoving two hammers down your throat

[opal pecan]

It will continue to offer hammers as location rewards or shop items as long as the player has fewer than two (excluding Experimental Hammer, whose temporary hammer is not counted toward the limit, although it does exclude the temp hammer as an option from the offered "permanent" hammers)

[tough torrent]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/742094289361961061/1472411663247478959/image.png?ex=699279b8&is=69912838&hm=1224e77242ab88c51419cdaa782747ece9100329eba1e135403c86358955d52a

gaming

heck. Iron Core vs Furious Whirlwind

whirl i think, but not sure. the extra recovery on core is nice

[viral yew]

Safety vs damage really

[tough torrent]

the faster speed during beserk helps channel too i think, but its not always on obv

[grim current]

At max Mortality, is attack + Night's +15 CR (totalling to 35 CR) worth it...?

[grim current]

Even then, the +100% movement speed whilst performing allows the player to more safely continue the move then they can more easily avoid attacks.

Pretty funny to finish Nergal's attack animation whilst running way from the boulder attack from Eye of Typhon.

[spark crown]

Boons > hammer

[grim current]

I'd rather say Family Dispute is 300 g worth of loot, while a single Daedalus is 200.

[digital juniper]

ehh i wouldn’t use gold as a metric

[grim current]

That's just it.

[digital juniper]

it depends a lot on what boons you already have, what gods are on the trial, what aspect you’re using and how important hammers are to it

[grim current]

It's more complicated to say boons are greater than Daedalus Hammers.

[digital juniper]

it’s very situational on what would be better

[grim current]

But if we're making a simple, ereneous opinion such as that, might as well add the superficial reason that 2 burlap sack boons are more valuable than 1 Daedalus Hammer.

But at this point, I digress.

Family Disputes are generally better than Daedalus rooms when the game attempts to provide 2 Hammers per run.

[digital juniper]

what’s a burlap sack

[tough torrent]

mystery boon

[digital juniper]

ah

[opal pecan]

665 nights in (why couldn't it have been on night 666 ;-;) I have finally, finally seen the sheepball Fangs perk

Or rather, I didn't see the sheepball, because I was busy being stunned by a mini-spawn while the tail of Typhon popped in for a random visit and also a bunch of burrowing dudes were spitting at me

Also it turned me into a pig, not a sheep

But like, it's the principle of the thing

[digital juniper]

yeah it’s one of the rarer ones

so is seeker

[opal pecan]

What's Seeker do?

I technically completed the Fangs perk prophecy ages ago, but obviously did not actually see every power in action

[digital juniper]

foes with projectiles now have autoseeking

similiar to how hippo projectiles seek

[opal pecan]

Or those eyeball-sun dudes on the Summit, I suppose, or to a lesser extent the burrowing dudes

[digital juniper]

yeah i haven’t played surface in a hot minute so i don’t recall much of them

[opal pecan]

They are all Rude Boys 🫡

[tough torrent]

previously i thought the super speed punchy dudes in mourning were the worst regular mob in the game.
i was wrong. Its the burrowing dracon things good golly gee

they really do just

teleport across the room simply to waste time

as soon as you're close enough to swing

[digital juniper]

apparently they burrow out as soon as you change directions or something?

i vaguely remember hearing that in a youtube video

[wild drift]

Yeah probably top 3 worst for me are the sniper satyrs, land dracons, and anchors

Also the Typhon spermy eye things that do a figure 8 and somehow do like 20 damage

[tough torrent]

man i just like, always forget to equip pin before oceanus

never gonna get this quest lmao

man i really gotta start taking blood spree more highly this is really sweet

[digital juniper]

you could just do it in the chaos trial

[tough torrent]

o

is the one with Pin in oceanus?

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/268784286985879553/1472435725416005714/image.png?ex=69929021&is=69913ea1&hm=a9a1e4c05b337acce17fe823e3dd38bf6bc17b18540ccaf360885e66d67af45b

charon stock more things

[grim current]

I wish Wells of Charon stocked more Centaur Souls & other permanent upgrades.

[tough torrent]

me when charon adds "empty tonic bottle" to his wares

[grim current]

I wish Sacrificial Hymn provided 3 sacrifice boons.

[tough torrent]

Like one or two times I've managed to spike a Hymn while having one core boon at the start of the run

Starting to be able to clear underworld up to Chronos without losing a DD... though I still have yet to beat Chronos without losing a DD... or even beat phase 2 without losing one

And forget it for surface. If Eris doesnt take a DD, Prometheus does.

[digital kettle]

What are the most fun aspects in hades 2 for you?

[median anvil]

all fun except pan and selene

[umbral horizon]

What is your "top 5 best boons" or "top 5 boons you must take"? Here is my list:

1. Heaven Strike/Heaven Flourish
2. Exceptional Talent
3. Success Rate
4. Slow Cooker
5. Rallying Cry

[tall notch]

Apollo sprint, trusty shield, snow queen, blitz attack/special (I'm considering these two as one pretty much) and artic ring in no particular order

[umbral horizon]

Oh I forgot some defense boons, but if you must take one boon, which one?

[manic shuttle]

Blinding Rush, Trusty Shield & Static Shock are my top 3

[tall notch]

Omg right how could I forget about static 😭 that thing's crazy good if it doesn't prime you out on a magick aspect

Must be because I keep myself at the fates' whim and they didn't feel like giving me static for a while

[umbral horizon]

Static Shock and Blitz maybe the best combo in the game

[wild drift]

Not including Duo/Legendary

1. Heaven Strike/Heaven Flourish
2. Trusty Shield/Heavy Metal
3. Double Strike
4. Pyro Technique
5. Nitro Boost/Hasty Retreat

42/56 of my clears have had Blitz on either attack or special lol, only been on Fate's Whim like 8 times

[umbral horizon]

And What is the top 5 hammers? Me first:

1. Trick knives
2. Possessed Array
3. Dual Moonshot
4. Sudden Burst
5. Exhaust Riser

[tall notch]

1. Trick knives
2. Trick knives
3. Trick knives
4. Trick knives
5. Trick knives

Can we nuke this hammer from existence and make non-morrigan blades work without it tyvm

[manic shuttle]

1. Trick Knives
2. Possessed Array
3. Psychic Whirlwind
4. Mirrored Trasher / Dual Moonshot
5. Shimmering Rockets

[umbral horizon]

Reaper Knives, Blitz+Static Shock. Spamming Special I guess.

[tall notch]

Reaper and trick knives work together so reaper is more extra synergy for trick slop rather than an alternative

[digital juniper]

saying this when parray exists is crazy

[tall notch]

Idk i think parray is a little bit overrated, it's too easy to just not have the magick in a high fear setting

Like yeah it's really really good if u can build around it but it's a level under the actually busted hammers that elevate your run the moment you get them

Try #h2-tech-support

They're more likely to be able to help you there

[digital juniper]

it’s the highest damage output in the game, it can’t be overrated

and if parrayslop can work in 67, you can make it work in any other setting really

[tough torrent]

I've hard Array and nowhere near enough mana to support it before yeah.
Generally whenever i get Parray as my second hammer its like that

[wild drift]

Yeah if I get it late enough sometimes I might as well take something else over it

Especially if I'm all hubris'd down

[tough torrent]

i mean i still take it, but its basically Hydraulic Might as a hammer at that point

[jovial schooner]

Been a stan for Hestia attack since my first day of playing H2. hasn't changed. That thing with the Mel torches was my first Surface clear.

to be clear, it's not great if your build is focused on single large strikes

But if your build aims to hit a lot of strikes quickly (Daggers, Torches, sometimes cloak or staff) you will build up that Scorch meter very fast.

[tough torrent]

Artic Gale is pretty high up there for me

"free" curse on your cast that doesnt take up your cast slot

so you can set up your cast to activate origination all on its own

[opal pecan]

I'm a huge Nexus Rush fan for UW but for some reason it feels worse on the Surface

But uhh https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/280788714790322176/1472643483037864169/image.png?ex=6993519e&is=6992001e&hm=f847b1725d5c323dcb63510a318d6c9b6235206cf81bdefda6d3343a9ae181fd&

(TBF as far as boons go, "Times Used" includes a certain element of "how easy is it to get this boon" and "how easy is it to fit this boon into any random build")

[tough torrent]

Nimble Limbs is the #2 boon in the game, you heard it here first folks

[grim current]

I too really enjoy Nimble Limbs.

[tough torrent]

I prefer racing thoughts usually but eh

I think quick buck or the dodge % per boon are my most picked hermes

[opal pecan]

Faster! faster! cried the nightmare goddess

[grim current]

Hyper Sprint was my favorite Hermes boon in Hades 1.

[opal pecan]

Remind me what that did?

[tough torrent]

Fond memories of chasing heroic on the additional sprint charges boon in H1, to get the mythical 8 dash gilgamesh

[tough torrent]

Looks like move speed and short immunity after a dash

[grim current]

After dashing, +100% movement speed & +30% DMG resist for 0.5s.

[tough torrent]

O

I forgor what sturdy was

[grim current]

I think it's quite cool how Supergiant translated Hyper Sprint & Side Hustle (+10 gold per room) into Nimble Limbs, Gold Dress, & Riches from the Dead.

[tough torrent]

Wouldn't hyper sprint be more like Stutter Step
Or I guess blinding dash

[digital juniper]

stutter step is greatest reflex

[tough torrent]

o

trying to remember boon names in this game vs a very similar game i havent played in several years has got me like

[opal pecan]

Maybe I should try fishing for boons once in a while 🤔

[tall notch]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/925113924855140417/1472666783306481760/image.png?ex=69936751&is=699215d1&hm=eca5739f8a37357a63e99a93b0d8965c72bba91e93fd7bfa0052b64e7d261885&oh by times used these seem to be my most often taken boons, but that's definitely a leftover from pre-jpom days where I'd Hera keepsake start a lot

[opal pecan]

Just cos Hera works with everything, or cos you were runnin something specific?

[tall notch]

it's because assuming you're using your attack, Hera was never bad and I'd click her if I had no idea for something more aspect-specific

especially in hordes 3 levels of fear where Hitch will very quickly become your best friend for room clear

[opal pecan]

Shoulda taken it three times fewer

[tough torrent]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/268784286985879553/1472668681300348938/image.png?ex=69936916&is=69921796&hm=fc5425a4427c2d4eb2ff48935dbeffccc23d61c9053f7db0787a5c634aaebd7a

[flint widget]

just had the most cursed 62f run ever

artemis 62f without an attack or special boon until midway through tartarus

[tough torrent]

what do you mean rivals chornos unpauses the game

[sand crow]

K, for Morrigan should I take common racing thoughts, epic nimble limbs or common travel deal? Running 32 fear (also this is my first boon)

[flint widget]

racing probably

[tough torrent]

i'd do racing because i like using triad, but if you're a hater then limbs seems ok

if you're picking Time Piece later on and confident in your erebus, travel deal could be good value later

[sand crow]

OOOOOOOH good point

I did take Boatman as well

[flint widget]

tho lowk sorceress channeling already good enough for morrigan

so lowk i think id take travel deal

[sand crow]

I'm probably gonna do a travel deal then, sorceress will hopefully hard-carry

Man I love triad

I'm doing a max grit loadout lol

[sand crow]

Does Fourth Degree work on enemies who already have Wounds?

[spiral wadi]

nope

fourth degree is only really worth it if u don't have another wounds core

[opal pecan]

For accountability purposes: no more than five more resets (||||) or one more death/abandoned run and then I'm putting this damn 32F surface speed attempt down for reals

[opal pecan]

Bro I got Charyb'd no fewer than five times in a single session who put a jinx on me... alr I guess that's the end of that

[winged acorn]

can someone recommend me good black coat aspect of nyx build please, with arcana cards

[opal pecan]

Check the pins

[winged acorn]

im not reading allat sorry bradar 😭

that's why im asking ppl that know some builds and can help me

[opal pecan]

Did you actually check the pins

[winged acorn]

yea i did, there is a website

[digital juniper]

and the website has an index that takes you to each aspect’s guide

[split igloo]

just started playing recently, and most weapons outside of the staff and torches seem weak/hard to use?? like the daggers are just lower DPS/range, the axe is too slow so you can't chain stunlock mobs, the skulls need to be picked up, haven't unlocked the final weapon yet though

the staff is very reliable, you can spam regular attacks with hammer boons for good damage, then omega at range, the specials are meh but ok for sniping, the torches you just hold down attack and deal good DPS while still being able to move and dodge, the special is again eh though, not sure how to play the other weapons

[mystic mango]

Sister blades benefit a lot from their mobility but they are overall one of the weaker aspects. Charon axe and the hidden aspect, ||Nergal||, are among some of the best in the game. skull has the strongest overall spread of aspects with Medea being a decently high skill ceiling but the hands down best aspect in the game, and mel and persephone aspects both being quite strong in their own right. Coat has aspect of nyx which is really strong with the nightspawn rockets making for very strong room clear, and mel coat being just a solid and consistent option.

I will definitely concede though that staff and flames are absolutely the easiest to just pick up and do well with

[split igloo]

haven't unlocked the aspects yet, just got the final bronze piece, will unlock them once I finish this run

[mystic mango]

Skull takes some muscle memory to use special to recover skulls, coat is almost all just spamming dash attack and base rockets and not using omegas, sister blades requires some effort to get around and chase people down, and axe can be very unweildy until you learn how to manuever it

[mystic mango]

They'll become WAY stronger after you get the aspects

[split igloo]

just talking the basic movesets, unless the aspects change them considerably?

[mystic mango]

Base blades is dumpster garbage

The base 3 aspects for each keep the same moveset and the hidden aspects change the moveset entirely

[rare flax]

So what is the key to the staff of Anubis?

[mystic mango]

Dash in to drop the AOE and spam omega special AFAIK

It's a weird one

[split igloo]

honestly, if the staff's special was faster it'd be the perfect weapon, I'm happy with everything else

[mystic mango]

Melinoe aspect staff has a really strong special since it gains base power but does take some effort to get use to the time delay. With the right daedalus hammers it's one of the absolute most consistent weapons in the game

Melinoe staff and circe staff are probably #2 and #3 aspects in the game

[rare flax]

I meant more any boon suggestions for it?

Hitch?

[mystic mango]

Stuff like blitz from zeus is really good, hitch is another solid option, scorch

Anything that either gives a flat buff to damage or benefits from groups

Blitz with thermo dynamics duo is quite strong if you get a good roll on pyro technique from hestia

[split igloo]

I picked up that double attack hammer boon + some mana regen boon and almost killed the final boss that run lol, with the staff. got him halfway through phase 2

[mystic mango]

Mirrored thrasher is a very good daedalus upgrade especially with stuff like poseidon attack due to the flat damage buff and added AOE

[rare flax]

Was wondering about Apollo, double attack sounds crazy on Anubis

[split igloo]

I think I had tranquil gain + the base mana regen from that arcana

[mystic mango]

There's certain aspects where it actually doesn't affect both omega attack and omega special

Like I think it doesn't affect flames o-special

And I don't think affects anubis o-attack

[split igloo]

so when I do the weapon aspect incantation, do I just unlock all base aspects for all weapons, or is there more work to do?

[mystic mango]

You unlock all the aspects using materials you collected from runs and then afterwards all aspects besides melinoe's aspects use nightmare to upgrade, which is a resource you get from completing bounties

Melinoe's aspects will continue to cost silver and fate fabric

[split igloo]

basically, do I unlock any aspects when I chant the incantation that unlocks the aspect feature?

or do I need to gather more resources still

[mystic mango]

You have to unlock them individually after but the first 3 aspects are available to unlock when you do the incantation

You have to discover the hidden aspect for each weapon while playing

[split igloo]

ok ok, so I get 3 aspects, that's good

[mystic mango]

The aspects all actively make the base weapon stronger in some regard

Or add new effects

[split igloo]

oh yeah also wanted to ask, is Hermes' keepsake completely pointless? it says it only lasts 200 sec, is that a joke?

[mystic mango]

For example melinoe staff adds base damage to specials and gives you extra magick while circe's staff makes your cast duplicate on your familiar companion and creates a damaging laser between you and your familiar

[mystic mango]

It levels up to I think 300 seconds

You're just playing too slow for it to be that viable tbh

We all start slow

But 5 minutes for an area is literally a requirement when you add difficult on the game

[split igloo]

won't this make the game too easy, I almost beat the final boss on like my 12th run without the aspects

[mystic mango]

Due to the timer you can activate giving you 5 minutes max per area

[mystic mango]

Ahahahahaha yeah have fun

You haven't ||gone to the surface|| or discovered ||the testament of night||

[split igloo]

I mean, I guess there's a ||heat|| mechanic like in the first game, probably

[mystic mango]

If you think the game is too easy go max vow of rivals and have fun

Rivals chronos is HUMBLING

And rivals Scylla is like second hardest boss in the game

[split igloo]

anyway, keepsakes wise, knuckle bone + strength arcana seems like a very strong combo, any reason to change to something else?

[mystic mango]

God keepsakes are very strong for engineering a specific build, and you'll discover a lot of other keepsakes that make knucklebones look like a joke tbh

Knucklebones is mediocre at best since it only makes bosses slightly easier

If you are doing enough damage and just aren't getting hit it's pretty pointless

Strength arcana is great though if you're confident enough to not go Death

[split igloo]

it's good training wheels though, with that arcana + knuckle bone I get 40% damage reduction, almost half

[mystic mango]

Yeah but like you already get 40% damage reduction from maxed level strength arcana

[split igloo]

I don't like revives, if you proc 1 you feel like your run is wasted, it's a trap mechanic IMO

[mystic mango]

Oh yeah you can upgrade arcana if you haven't found that yet

[mystic mango]

wait until you have a really good run and then choke a dash on chronos and get instakilled

Rivals chronos throws out multiple instakills in a row

I'm not saying the early game isn't kinda easy, I'm just saying it gets WAY harder

[split igloo]

his only insta-kill attack is the one where you need to quickly dash to the small circle? the regular Chronos I mean

it's hard to mess up IMO

[mystic mango]

If you're playing safe, sure

If you get greedy and try to squeeze in damage it can screw you

[split igloo]

oh btw, I also tried vampirism last run, you can literally heal off adds in boss fights, it's kinda busted, +5 hp for an omega attack kill, and with mana regen you can just spam with impunity

they might patch this out idk, seems too strong

[mystic mango]

You think this game is getting patches?

Nah this game is finalized until maybe a tiny balance patch when it goes to Xbox and PlayStation

[split igloo]

no more big updates? sad if true

[mystic mango]

It’s not really that crazy strong since you have to play around it to get any major effect out of it

It’s a decent safety net but it’s hard to guarantee it’s what you kill with sometimes

When you’re playing time you’ll find it a lot less viable

[split igloo]

you mean speedrunning? I suppose

but so far it seems like one of the strongest sources of healing, you can finish each room at top health, as long as you have some mana regen to spam omegas

[tough torrent]

Thats not the only one

There's also one where he raises up to slam in the center of the second phase arena, and the only safe spot is a thing ring around him

And on rivals there's also a sweeping beam going clockwise as well that, while not instant kill, hurts a lot

[mystic mango]

I mean like my average run time now on 40 fear underworld and 32 fear surface is maybe 12-15 minutes

[split igloo]

oh btw, can you explain Cerberus' insta-kill? the arena started getting orange, so I sprinted the other way, then I took 63 dmg and died, what was that, did I need to be near him

[mystic mango]

Not at all a speedrun

[mystic mango]

You have to run close to him yeah

You need to listen for where he comes up and get close to him ASAP

[tough torrent]

Thats an instant kill?

[mystic mango]

It’s 100 damage so no but really hurts

[tough torrent]

Ah ok

[mystic mango]

When I say instakill I mean Chronos literally does 999 damage

[split igloo]

what's the telegraph? this was during phase 2

[mystic mango]

When he burrows

During second phase if he ever burrows he’ll show up somewhere far away and have a chance to do that attack

[tough torrent]

Its harder to react to in regular than rivals funnily enough

[split igloo]

he burrows all the time in phase 2, then just re-appears and does his usual attacks? this was the first time I saw this one

[mystic mango]

Larger arena yeah

[tough torrent]

In regular cerb, he can pop up literally off screen

[mystic mango]

Yeah it’s only a chance to do the super attack

[tough torrent]

In rivals you can always see at least some of him from the center of the arena

[split igloo]

oh yeah, some bosses started doing new attacks after the first 10 or 12 runs or so, like Hecate does the 3 laser thing now, what did I do lol

[mystic mango]

Yep that’s normal

[tough torrent]

Hec lunar ray is so annoying

[mystic mango]

Yeah a lot of hecate’s moves are skill check especially on rivals

Hard to avoid if you aren’t very familiar with dodging

[split igloo]

also how do you dodge the curse? I don't super mind it, you can still dodge as a sheep, but it's a waste of time lol

[mystic mango]

You have to dodge through it back and forth

It will rubber band back and forth so you have to keep dodging straight at it

[split igloo]

like, literally dash through it back and forth?

[mystic mango]

Yep

[tough torrent]

Im still only 20% dodge rate on the poly morph in rivals hec

No u

It's nasty tho. I still am not 100% sure what im doing different when I manage to dodge the rivals polymorph

[mystic mango]

It’s a lot of luck due to the fact it splits. I’ve dodged it perfectly then hit by some random one flying in at Mach-F from off screen

But you can skill it I’m just not quite that good

[split igloo]

tips for Charybdis projectile spam? it looks like there's nowhere to hide, I had to tank the boss then died to Eris because I only had 45 hp

[mystic mango]

Run all the way to one side before it starts

Then all the way to the other. The projectiles are too slow to catch you

[split igloo]

the red balls keep splitting and there's just too many to dodge

[mystic mango]

Yep so do the thing I said

It’s incredibly hard to dodge straight-up

[split igloo]

hmm, what's the telegraph again?

[mystic mango]

The moment he hits half health

It’s a half-way thing he does every time

[split igloo]

he does it again later I think?

[mystic mango]

It always retracts his tentacles and does the projectile attack

He’ll shoot them out occasionally during second phase

Just gotta keep your eyes open for them

[tough torrent]

Dont sprint as fast as you can to the other side btw. If you dash into sprint to the otherside the attack will still being going when you reach the other side

You wanna stay like just ahead of the projectiles

[mystic mango]

Yeah and then you still gotta dodge through them

I make that mistake sometimes and eat 40 damage for it

[split igloo]

hmmmm, so like keep moving outside the projectile "cloud" towards one of the sides of the arena?

[mystic mango]

Yep literally just run from one end to the other as the projectiles start to chase you

[split igloo]

okay, I'll try it, thanks

[opal pecan]

Charybdis is a lady excuse u

[split igloo]

it is a lady in my native language, but Kol said "he" so I just went along with it lol

[mystic mango]

Charybdis is a difficult mini boss compared to most others. Also really annoying cause SHE takes as long or longer than some actual bosses

[opal pecan]

The worst miniboss tbqh

[mystic mango]

I forgor

[split igloo]

Scylla and Charybdis, they were together in the legend IIRC

[mystic mango]

Charybdis is literally a potential reset case for speedruns

[mystic mango]

Chat, does he know?

[opal pecan]

I got her so many times today despite the fact she's supposed to be a rare spawn

Bruh why can't I have this kinda luck when rolling for, like, boons I want

[mystic mango]

Charybdis takes so long it’s basically just a “yep I got Charybdis instead of yargonaught reset”

Least I imagine that the case

But for normal runs she’s just annoying

[opal pecan]

Maybe it's not as bad if you're really good at the game but as someone who is not

Undo Night

[mystic mango]

Twilight curse is nice of Charybdis since the tentacles can’t burrow while morphed

Can squeeze out some extra damage cause of that before the mid-phase

[split igloo]

I kinda feel like the bosses are all pretty spongy compared to other roguelikes, and the ones like charybdis just outstay their welcome, as it's only 2 attacks

[mystic mango]

Wonder if it’s possible to one-phase Charybdis with that

If it hasn’t been done

[split igloo]

though, I suppose they'll be faster when I get better at the game

[mystic mango]

When you get a good build they aren’t

[opal pecan]

Um excuse u she has THREE attacks (pointy projectile, tentacle slam, and tracking blobs ;D)

[mystic mango]

#h2-victory-boasting message

Not the greatest example but a good build RIPS

Was a decent 40 fear run 13:XX

I’m nowhere near a speed runner but it feels nice consistently being under 15 minutes

[opal pecan]

Yah my personal experience is that knowing how to build gets you a long way even if you're not lightning fingers mcgee

[mystic mango]

Denial is fun

Makes tailoring builds without rerolls easier

IMHO

[split igloo]

so how do you make a good build? infusions? it kinda feels like each strike boon is equally valid, and that's going to be the core of your build

obviously I take hammers and chaos gates whenever I see any, as those are huge too

[mystic mango]

Knowing what works best with each weapon

[opal pecan]

Not all strike boons are equally strong for every aspect

[mystic mango]

Also FYI Daedalus hammers are basically a guaranteed drop so don’t hesitate to pass them up

You’re basically guaranteed to GET 2 every run

So if you pass one up it’ll appear again

[opal pecan]

Not 100%, but the game does try its best, bless its boots

[mystic mango]

It’s very likely you’ll see it again shortly after if you don’t pick it

Unlike boons

[split igloo]

should I skip special boons if I don't really use my specials? this way I can spend the poms on other stuff

[opal pecan]

Why don't you really use your specials?

[mystic mango]

Depending on the weapon maybe

But like some weapons live and die by their special

[split igloo]

I use the staff's attacks + omega attacks + base casts, that's my playstyle

[opal pecan]

Have you unlocked aspects yet?

[split igloo]

I only use a special when I need to snipe something halfway across the arena, but that's rare

[mystic mango]

Staff special is awkward at first but especially Mel staff is very strong

[split igloo]

not yet, missing one bronze piece lol

[opal pecan]

Alr, that might shake things up in future for ya

[grim current]

Ah. You're playing under the pretense attack/special always deal greater DPS than regular attack/special.

[opal pecan]

Have fun in the meantime :)

[mystic mango]

No aspects yet they just beat Chronos for the first time after I think they said 12 runs

The game is apparently too easy

[split igloo]

almost beat him, then I started playing surface to unlock the aspects and such, got to Eris

[mystic mango]

And I said they’re ready to get humbled soon enough

[split igloo]

so I'm like 14 runs in right now, still learning, hence me asking about basics

[mystic mango]

Yeah took a bit for me to break that idea

[grim current]

Likewise.

[split igloo]

my almost winning run had that double attack hammer boon (mirrored something), so I was spamming basic attacks that time, it was pretty strong, but you need equally strong mana regen, I had the mana regen arcana + tranquil gain I believe

[opal pecan]

Mirrored Thrasher is very strong indeed! Cardio Gain is the ideal gain to get with that.

[grim current]

Oof. Unseen is one helluva noob trap, unfortunately.

[split igloo]

it's probably a crutch card but I like it, it means I can spam omegas right in room 1

[mystic mango]

Mirrored thrasher power surge cardio gain is really funny

Especially with incandescent aura

[opal pecan]

Bro my dream is -- yeah, IA.

[grim current]

Not so much a crutch of an Arcana is it ingloriously expensive.

[opal pecan]

Shimmering Moonshot with Hera special, hitch the entire room, then attack spam? IDK how optimal it is but it sounds hella fun

[mystic mango]

Unseen is definitely something I clung to for a while cause I thought “I need this for early game if I don’t get a gain” then learned to not just rely on omegas

[opal pecan]

I mean, some things you really can't avoid that -- Moros f'rex, or Mel torches if you're trying to play them normal-like, or to a lesser extent stuff like Anubis

[split igloo]

it's 5 grasp and I have 20 total, so it's fine, besides I don't have all cards unlocked yet

[opal pecan]

And yeah, not having all the better options yet is a good point too

[split igloo]

and since it's 5 grasp it also auto-activates that arcana in the center, which is cool

[mystic mango]

You could get messenger, furies, and wayward son for that cost

[grim current]

Even then, the hardcore RPG gamer inside me knew games never usually allow "passive regeneration" Arcana like Unseen to be that powerful. I knew all I needed was a Gain boon at all.

[mystic mango]

Or artificer and furies

[grim current]

Then again, Wayward Sun is powerful.

[split igloo]

what if you get bad gains or none at all, then you're screwed

[grim current]

Well, don't tell them to equip Artificer when it's obviously an endgame Arcana.

[mystic mango]

Yeahhhh it’s only good once you don’t need resources

I finally got the last thing that needed psyche and ashes

||icarus’s final gift||

Now I can finally sell them

Well I was already selling psyche

But now I know I don’t need them for anything else

[split igloo]

once you meet Hera on the surface, does she spawn in the underworld as well?

[grim current]

Yes.

[opal pecan]

All of the core-boon-giving gods will be available everywhere after you properly meet 'em

[mystic mango]

Yes the only differences from surface and underworld mechanically are the Charon shops in underworld and the Hermes shops on surface

[opal pecan]

Wellll

[mystic mango]

And underworld has pools of purging

I actually didn’t know I hadn’t unlocked the incantation to have them be in every mid-room until like 150 runs in since I basically never used the one in Tartarus

[grim current]

You've now unlocked 8 of the 9 primary boon givers.

[opal pecan]

The random encounter NPCs you can get are also different, as well as the types of environmental "assistance" you can unlock incantations for and the "special gimmicks" in particular regions

[mystic mango]

I didn’t know you needed to use it a few times

[split igloo]

the restore health on leaving a room mechanic works oddly on the surface, because sometimes you go to the previous room, or just stay in the current one

[mystic mango]

Well yeah I guess you don’t see Heracles or Icarus in underworld or nem on surface but you get the point

I mean that mechanically for the same things you’ll see EVERY run the shops are the only difference

Obviously everything else is “different” but I mean that the Charon wells and Hermes shops fundamentally work differently

And offer very different things

[mystic mango]

“Locations” only counts when going to and from the city center or leaving a ship in Thessaly

Going into the rooms in ephyra doesn’t count as a “location”

[split igloo]

what are the bat cages? is that worth unlocking?

[mystic mango]

Lets you see the whole map and freezes the timer

So you don’t have to run around

[split igloo]

so like the trees in the fields?

[mystic mango]

In a way yeah but you don’t have to find the bat cages

They’re always in the same places

(Now nobody get technical with me and say “so are the trees since the maps are the same”)

But that running into ephyra there’s always the one right by the entrance

[split igloo]

that room is not that big, not sure if I need a navigator lol

[opal pecan]

There's also this bizarre and mildly annoying behavior where if you enter the city square after beating the "outskirts" encounter normally, the IGT will start ticking down before you regain full control of Mel's movement

BUT if you took a Chaos portal from the first room and skipped the "outskirts" encounter, you spawn into the actual city square and have control of Mel's movement immediately

[mystic mango]

When you start caring about time you’ll want to not spend a minute running around finding what you want

[split igloo]

is there any content hidden behind speedruns? or are you guys just doing it for fun?

[opal pecan]

Fun

[split igloo]

fair enough

[mystic mango]

It’s free fear for the testament if you’re able to do sub-5 per region consistently

[opal pecan]

One of the difficulty modifiers also does give you varying levels of time limit, which is what Kol is alluding to

[mystic mango]

9, 7 or 5 minutes per region

Same as it worked in the first game

[opal pecan]

But the most demanding of the "locked content" is behind 32F and it's very possible to do that without Time if you really hate going fast

[mystic mango]

My first 32F surface was like 12 minutes

[opal pecan]

(I guess you could argue that the random Chaos trials are more demanding, since they screw with your whole starting build)

[proper cloak]

Ah yes, "content"

[mystic mango]

Though that’s extra since you only need 24 fear surface

[opal pecan]

Extremely beautiful and perfect and flawless content

[mystic mango]

And 32 fear underworld

[mystic mango]

Don’t you ever speak ill about my ||buff Melinoes||

But yeah technically the highest difficulty locked content is 24 fear surface and 32 fear underworld

If you’re on PC technically the hardest challenge is great chaos below

[opal pecan]

Wait wdym on PC

[mystic mango]

If you want true 100%

[proper cloak]

I appreciate that they lowered it to 24. I might never have pushed my skill if I didn't have that jumping on point

[opal pecan]

Is it not a thing on Switch

[mystic mango]

Steam achievements

There’s one for GCB

[opal pecan]

But Switch hasn't got 'em?

[mystic mango]

Rarest achievement in the game above doing two chaos trials in a row

Yeah switch doesn’t have achievements

[opal pecan]

Huh, TIL!

[mystic mango]

My only two achievements I need is two trials in a row and a GCB clear then I’m done

But I’ve been putting it off

And then only remaining prophecy is getting fates’ trimming from narcissus

[split igloo]

was Hera's born gain overnerfed? some reddit threads say it's the best one and I just got the base version to spawn and it primes 20 magic each time you run out which seems horrible unless you have like 200 magic

[opal pecan]

Base version isn't great, but it's fairly easy to get max magick upgrades throughout a run, and the leveled up or rarer versions prime less

[proper cloak]

Born gain is solid. It may have been nerfed I forget. It's mostly good if you aren't churning through crazy amounts of magick

It's great for regular encounters. Less good for bosses

[split igloo]

and you guys say Unseen is a noob trap lol, it's at least reliable

[mystic mango]

I mean consider that it effectively multiplies any magick you get

[proper cloak]

Nah unseen is way worse than born gain

[opal pecan]

The thing about Unseen which is sneaky and actually bad (not just expensive) is that it doesn't actually activate if you are channeling

[mystic mango]

On some weapons like flames it’s basically worthless

Since you can’t recover magick while attacking

It’s SOMETHING but there’s way better options

[split igloo]

with Unseen I can have like 75 magic and still spam without looking at the bar, but with Born Gain 20 I will run out of magic and not be able to omega at all

[proper cloak]

Unseen is a noob trap since it falls off on high fear due to speed requirements and taking a ton of grasp

[opal pecan]

Have you unlocked and maxed out Centaur yet, just curious

[mystic mango]

If it takes you that long to kill stuff and you only use omegas I guess

[proper cloak]

Born gain falls off a little due to hubris

But it's easier to play around

[opal pecan]

Oh, time for my PSA

Flood Gain is better than it seems, because whenever it's off cooldown, it can let you do omega moves and regain magick even if you start at zero magick

[mystic mango]

Yep

[opal pecan]

You effectively get infinite magick whenever it's off cooldown

[mystic mango]

Since they refund magick, not just work for free

[proper cloak]

I'm happy to use Born gain for middle-intensity magick weapons like torches

[split igloo]

I have it activated, but I'm not able to upgrade the cards yet

it's the 1+2+3+4+5 one, right?

in the center of the board

[mystic mango]

Centaur is extra health and magick every 5 encounters

Or is it locations?

[split igloo]

yeah that's the one, it's +3 each I believe

[mystic mango]

Encounters and locations are different things so that part matters

Max level it’s +5

But yeah born gain is one of the best gains in the game in some cases and other cases it’s just fine

Unseen is basically just an even worse aphro gain

[split igloo]

idk, so far tranquil seems the best, because you will stop doing things when dodging an attack or something, and you just restore all of your magic

and then aphrodite's one is great for melee/close range builds

[opal pecan]

There are some Tranquil Gain lovers in the server

[mystic mango]

Tranquil is meh imho

[opal pecan]

I am not among them, but go forth and enjoy what ye enjoy

[mystic mango]

Tranquil gain with jpom is pretty good since it’s near instantaneous even if common

But they’re a long way off from getting jpom

But I’ll just say hold up on calling the game easy until you beat surface

Won’t spoil why but it’s definitely tough until you learn it

[dry jay]

I 100% agree lol
even getting deeper into post-game I still struggle sometimes

[split igloo]

apparently the surface final boss is tricky, and overall this path is harder than the underworld, but I'm about to unlock the aspects + other things, so it will be fair game

[mystic mango]

Surface is overall a lot harder than underworld and that’s why it naturally makes you apply less fear to get completion of the game

[dry jay]

that's what you would think
I was cocky and got clapped for it

[split igloo]

not a fan of the ship biome though, too little space to dodge, plus you stay in the same room sometimes so no bonus health

[mystic mango]

Thessaly is worst area hands down

That’s a pretty common sentiment you’re not alone

Very few rewards and you don’t get resets from leaving locations

[dry jay]

ye
prob my least favorite area

[split igloo]

plus those explosive barrels + spilled oil make the space even smaller still

[mystic mango]

Thessaly is mechanically the worst on top of being a bit annoying

[opal pecan]

The goddamn anchor dudes

[dry jay]

what is yall's favorite tho?

[mystic mango]

Probably Oceanus or Tartarus

[opal pecan]

Ephyra buffet

[mystic mango]

Oceanus is hectic but not overwhelming

Ephyra is really nice

[split igloo]

btw, is the fields the final boss area from Hades 1? where you fight daddy, or it just looks similar

[opal pecan]

Just looks similar

[mystic mango]

Nah fields is in the underworld

[dry jay]

I love tartarus ngl
always look forward to that area, even if I don't struggle with it anymore

[opal pecan]

I do think that the Fields' region gimmick is the one of the more interesting ones, and Oceanus is the most aesthetically fun

[mystic mango]

Fields was really cool the first time I got there

[dry jay]

btw was it a good idea to play Hades 2 (and get deep into the post game) before playing hades 1?

I've seen so many references to the first game

[opal pecan]

Only you can make that judgment call

Most people in this server would probably say it was not optimal

But hey, it's whatever

[dry jay]

Hades 2 has genuinely been one of my favorite games tho
i love roguelikes

[mystic mango]

Ehhh you might be a little disappointed by the build diversity of H1. I didn’t quite enjoy it as much as H2

H2 added a ton of unique concepts from the first game while most of the first game is just “this does a bit more damage” imho

[split igloo]

oceanus was overwhelming at first, those spammy fishes, lots of environmental hazards, I didn't use casts at all at first, thought they did nothing unless you charge lol, so the enemies would ovewhelm me

[mystic mango]

I will say there is some unique builds in H1 and it is still really fun but just understand that H2 built on the systems a LOT

[mystic mango]

Yeah casts are a necessity in Oceanus with all the enemies that can fly at you

[split igloo]

now I spam casts to zone out enemies, though I'm still not sure what's the point of charging them, too much risk for little to no gain

[mystic mango]

150 base damage

[opal pecan]

There are certain boons that reward the charged cast

[dry jay]

btw do we have any idea if there are plans on releasing Hades 2 on console?

[mystic mango]

Omega cast has some VERY strong builds

[opal pecan]

Also, something I only learned today: after you begin channeling the omega cast, you can actually still dash without interrupting the channel

[mystic mango]

I’d send an example I posted earlier but it would be a spoiler

[split igloo]

you can just omega charge attacks/specials for the same damage if not more? unless?

[mystic mango]

Yup

[dry jay]

I basically never used cast

[mystic mango]

Even if you get hit and stuff or I think if you let go of the button you can start it again

[mystic mango]

Play Circe staff then come back to me

Circe staff is nutty

Even just on their own casts can be very strong

[dry jay]

I think it'd be good if there were some non-dummy enemies in the training grounds tho
some of the "unique" mechanics on some weapons are hard to understand when you're fighting against a non-hostile and non-moving enemy

[split igloo]

I think the cast mechanic would be more intuitive if you couldn't charge them, because I thought the base casts were failed charges and did nothing lol, was like this for a few hours till I realized base casts did things lol

[mystic mango]

They hold enemies in place is their base function and on some builds you won’t want to spend time charging it but because you can still dodge while charging you remain maneuverable

Especially if you have Eternity arcana

Since you can dash around while time is slowed

[split igloo]

you also deal +20% damage to the enemies inside with that one card

[mystic mango]

Yep, 30% at max level

It’s a very solid damage buff

[split igloo]

so always worth putting one down on a boss

[mystic mango]

Some cast boons are very strong when you build into them

There’s entire builds made around Zeus’ infusion, air quality

[split igloo]

the scorch one seemed strong, I think it was Hestia

[mystic mango]

Yeah

Hestia is overall the best cast for multiple enemies and raw damage since it also applies a curse

Technically less damage than some other options like ares or Hephaestus but those don’t apply a curse

Which you really want curses for origination arcana

Hands down one of the best arcana’s since the 50% damage buff is massive

Some gods are really held back by their viability to work with origination alone

[split igloo]

oh yeah, I had a run with Hephaestus +400 damage attack boon, got it down to 4 sec between procs, was OP, this was the first run where I got to Cerberus I believe, and promptly died lol

[mystic mango]

Hephaestus is really fun if you get a strong build going with him

Can feel underwhelming at first but the duos are stupidly strong

[split igloo]

the cling clang sound effect is satisfying

[mystic mango]

Had a run earlier with just grand caldera and the Apollo duo and was doing 4773 damage on crit with just smithy rush

A DASH doing that much damage

300 extra power from rude awakening and 200 extra power from grand caldera

[split igloo]

the crit boons I'm getting from Artemis are all too low chance and barely matter

[mystic mango]

Something to consider is that crit is a 3x damage effect that happens after all other damage calculation

[split igloo]

there's the base 3% one + a better one if you prime magic, maybe 8%? I forget

[mystic mango]

That’s a 9% damage buff after ALL other calculation

% bonuses are just additive but crit is multiplicative

[split igloo]

dodge can be stacked to like 20% via infusions, so it's OP, I think it was from Aphrodite

[mystic mango]

A 15% crit is a 45% damage buff to all damage

[alpine raft]

hows that math

[mystic mango]

A 15% chance to do 3x damage is effectively a 45% buff

Errr… brain one second

[split igloo]

hmm, pretty sure it's +30%

[alpine raft]

yea

[mystic mango]

Well either way it’s still a lot

[alpine raft]

oh for sure, her crit stuff is great even the small 3%

[mystic mango]

I’m just slightly dumb but crit is huge in this game and it was in the first game which is why they had to remove Artemis as a main god

She’s a random encounter now since crit is that strong

[split igloo]

say you hit 100 times for 1 point of damage, 15 of your hits deal triple damage, you overall dealt 130 points of damage

[mystic mango]

Raki is a goated familiar

Yes yes I got the math

It doesn’t matter it’s still good

[alpine raft]

and antler is busted

[split igloo]

is that arcana where you deal +30% damage when your magic is not at max always worth taking?

or is there a catch

[alpine raft]

thats huntress, its only attack and special that get +50%

very good but rarely those 2 moves do 0 damage anyway so you dont want it

[split igloo]

I guess it can be pointless with good magic regen

[alpine raft]

nah its an always take besides 1 aspect that doesnt care for it

[mystic mango]

It’s very good on certain builds and very cheap to have

2 grasp is basically a no brainer for how strong it is on certain builds

Black coat is one that basically always benefits from huntress since you almost never use omegas

Honestly black coat, in my opinion, is sometimes worth not even taking a gain on just so you can keep huntress active

[dry jay]

black coat my beloved

|| the hidden aspect is my go-to curently ||