ai-feedback-discussion

[manic portal]

that's really just it.

[silver raven]

AI overview I assume ?

[manic portal]

depends on what it is. I'm happy to be proven wrong

[manic portal]

yeah cause that's a tool. I can go write a paper for you if you want and cite encyclopedic references

Point is that deinos and ceras are scavangers. Scavengers have a different biology that allows them to gain nutrients from rotted corpses that most other species cannot do. It's just how it works man..

I think your point is that they should all be the same?

[silver raven]

not at all

[silver raven]

Then why do they have a diet list ?

if they can just ignore it

[manic portal]

Diet list is preferred food

[trim wolf]

hello lads i am new to the isle and iam having truble getting past juvenile stage because i cant find ai(especially with Deinosuchus) so can anyone help me understand how ai spawns work any specific place to look any way i can trigger ai to spawn? right now i barely ever see it and just starve to death

[woven patrol]

I don't know how AI spawns exactly work. My observation (or better feeling) so far: There seem to be a certain number of possible total AI spawns which tend to concentrate where players are. So for example, if I log in early in the morning and there are only a few player, I get quite a log of fish spawns for my dinosuchus. With more players, the spaws seems to get distributed over the map. So normally I log in at a time with only a few player and then I just wait. And yes, the location need to have spawn zones. Not all water areas can have fish spawns.

[keen merlin]

That's because fish spawns have been broken for months on end and deino is currently unplayable due to this issue. Devs have not mentioned or addressed this whatsoever in any updates or notes.

[desert ravine]

Facts it’s very unprofessional

[keen merlin]

Not wrong tbh. I love deino. It was the only playable apex predator on the isle on evirma and now it's entirely unplayable. I barely touch the game anymore because of it.

[desert ravine]

Couldn’t have said it better man 😔💯

And you know the amount of times it’s been complained abt for literal months now there’s no way they haven’t seen our complaints I see at least 10 plus different people complain abt it daily in ai feedback or in here

I just want the devs to acknowledge the issue so we can eventually get a fix ( hopefully sooner rather than later ) and they can’t even do that

[keen merlin]

the fact that there has been absolutely zero acknowledgment that there even is a problem bothers me. screw the elder skins, the extra human structures, heck, even the rex and allo for the moment. At least make what you already have ,work please. What's the point of Evirma if all the same mistakes are being made over again? Ignoring broken parts of the game and just building upon a shattered foundation...

[thorny dragon]

Have either of you played the HT?

Fish spawns are more than fine

[sullen igloo]

its... been fixed in HT. for months.

[keen merlin]

Hordetest is not the official release. Not everyone is on hordetest, in fact, it's in the very name, TEST. That's a beta branch, not the actual game. Hordetest is a test bed for random stuff. The game itself, The Isle Evirma, is not fixed. The problem has not been acknowledged at any point either. Hordetest is not the official release. We are asking for a the official release of the game that we paid for to actually work. I dont think that's too much of an ask. And yes, I have played hordetest recently.

[sullen igloo]

"random stuff" LITERALLY the next update for the game, containing countless bug fixes (including the one youre complaining about), new mechanics, etc

alongside an engine update

"its not fixed, give us an update!"
and then they give us hordetest
"NO! NOT LIKE THAT!!"

[keen merlin]

Hordetest is not an update lol

[sullen igloo]

so when it goes to evrima, whats that called?

because everything in HT goes to evrima

[keen merlin]

THAT is an update. nothing on hordetest is official

nothing on hordetest should be taken as being guaranteed to be on the official release either

[sullen igloo]

so the problem isnt the fact it hasnt been fixed, the problem is it just isnt fast enough lol

because it has been fixed in HT, which is the upcoming update

[keen merlin]

now you're moving the goal posts

[sullen igloo]

no the goalpost is fish being fixed

its been fixed

[keen merlin]

a beta test version of the game is not a fix unless you're saying everyone should just play HT?

i didnt pay for the beta vers of the game

[charred dew]

if you count 3 schooling fish and 1 elite fish in a whole lake or a swamp.... yeah, totally fixed

[keen merlin]

I paid for the actual game which is Evirma, heck it wasnt even that. It was V3 back when i started

I've had the game for absolutely ages

[sullen igloo]

what does that have to do with fish actively being fixed in the update thats on the way to evrima

[keen merlin]

when

[sullen igloo]

when its ready

[keen merlin]

Right

[sullen igloo]

play evrima and deal with the fish or play HT

[keen merlin]

That's the point. I PAID for a game that is not working as advertised and your "solution" is shut up or play the beta version of the game where they're actively testing concepts that may or may not actually be put in the game?

really?

is it too much to ask for the actual game to just...work?

to have the fish work like it was previously even?

this wasn't an issue before

it has been for months on end with no official word from any dev about it or when it may be resolved on the mainline version

we just want accountability and open communication

not "here's a new skin we worked on" when one of the stars of the game is now uplayable for no good reason

or "we changed the sound design for this unreleased dino"

just say "hey, we see this broke. We will make it a priority fix so you can have fun playing as an apex carnivore again. We will do our best to get that bug fix out in X amount of time" and just let us know if that gets delayed or whatever

that's not a big ask

so stop making it out to be one

I love this game

I love the graphics, the apexes, the thrill of the hunt

I got a lot of friends into the game

All we ask is accountability and honest/open communication. Not defending poor decisions or flat out moving ahead with blinders on without even acknowledging the player bases complaints

[oak talon]

You new to the isle?

[keen merlin]

nope

not in the least

it's just this kind of stuff is super repetitive

and i find it hilarious that people defend the behavior

[oak talon]

So you should know that complaints don't do much really

Search the feedback channels I'm sure you'd find 20000k about fixing fish

[keen merlin]

i know

i check every month or so to see if it's still an issue and it remains to be

[trim wolf]

Thank you my friend

[oak talon]

Devs gonna do what they wanna do, it's their passion project they've never really pandered to people's asks

[trim wolf]

Not sure is it unplayable since i saw others that are fully grown deino how they do it than?

[oak talon]

I know some people will play on an alt grow a maia then make their way to where their croc is, log in on croc kill maia and repeat

[keen merlin]

that or the just cannibalize all the other crocs in the area as there is no other food sources but even then, that's become limited as no one is really playing deino anymore

[trim wolf]

Than i just hope devs fix it

[keen merlin]

thats all we can do

[oak talon]

I been having fun playing beipi baiting stuff for the deinos that don't insta eat me, I know fish are better on HT I exclusively play that so I would recommend you play that instead

Once they push next update ai should be better cause as I said it is in HT

Why it hasn't been pushed when it's been fixed in HT for a long time you ask?

Not sure but it will happen when it's ready

[modest nymph]

In my experience with this game, there is kind of no such thing as "hotfix". Stuff gets added/changed in a "batch" (current hordetest) and then shipped to live all at once -- with most issues persisting until the next live push even if it's already fixed in HT

[trim wolf]

And also overall ai for carnivorse do they also have some problem sometimes i find lot of them other times none and just starve

[oak talon]

What version of the game?

They are definitely around if you're in HT alot of people miss them because they're just sprinting in a direction to a patrol and not actually investigating and listening for any around them before running away

[trim wolf]

Evrima i play on unoffical servers

[oak talon]

Ahhh yeah they're deffs a bit more sparse over there, but just try do the same thing just try keep an ear out before taking off from an area

[trim wolf]

For sure thank you

[keen merlin]

So did the new update fix the fish spawns in evirma?

[hushed basin]

hord test is overe

[keen merlin]

Right but did this update/patch to Evirma put fish back at normal spawn rates? It wasn't noted in the changelogs and I'm not able to go in and check for myself right this second so I'm just asking if that was fixed w this patch or not

[sullen igloo]

today

[keen merlin]

Thanks. That's very unhelpful.

[ashen field]

Anyone know if dibble AI made it past hordetest? Allo and Rex just came out of hordetest.

[quiet dagger]

some ai are spawning inside the rocks/inclines... or are frog noises apart of the ambience?

[muted lodge]

is water AI spawning fixxed? so i know if i should reinstall the isle

[keen merlin]

No one is answering me this so idk. It wasn't in patch notes and no one will confirm if they fixed it in the update based on actual gameplay experience

[limber spoke]

Did this update drop AI DINOS?

[shy crystal]

played 3 hours as Deino. Saw 2 schools of fish and 0 Elite fish. I traveled all over the place too. RIP Deino

[steel python]

ok, I have to ask...why are people so hellbent on playing Deino as a pure piscivore?

[shy crystal]

because you cant kill anything as a baby and drinkable water without worry about a Deino is sooooo easy that you rarely see other dinos.

[steel python]

you...have literally everything on your diet tho? As soon as its rotten everything gives you nutrients...

[shy crystal]

doesnt matter if nothing dies near the water

[steel python]

maybe we just have different definitions of "near", that may be a thing

[shy crystal]

Im not trying to dehydrate to go get a bite out of a baby raptor

water drops very fast

also stam, so you are a sitting duck

[steel python]

yeah, I know, I am currently playing Deino

[muted lodge]

theres 0 fish and theres so many little pools that you either sit on a hotspot (which theres not really any anymore near accessable water) or you just die. theres not enough action spread out so theres no accesable corpses

[muted lodge]

its joever

[steel python]

maybe I'm just a masochist, but I kinda enjoy having to actually figure out a way to get food. Tho yes, I will admit that having the action more spread out would be preferable. Obviously. Not denying that.

[quick laurel]

did they remove night vision?

[steel python]

no

[quick laurel]

ok because my N key dosent work and i dont have the binding anymore so i was wondering

[steel python]

I think the default key is x if I'm not mistaken

[quick laurel]

Oh ok thanks for letting me know

[keen merlin]

Thank you so much for actually answering this question

[charred dew]

Can’t wait to see Bary and Spino added to the game, only to be forced into cannibalizing each other like Deino—because the devs still refuse to add fish where they’re actually supposed to be

the bigger and deeper the lake or water is , the less food in it

[keen merlin]

I love all the people who tried to clown on me saying its fixed in HT oh it'll be fixed with next patch just be patient devs know about it and will have it sorted by next patch

Okay

Now what do people have to say. It's next patch.. HT is closed or whatever. So where's the fish?

[charred dew]

its funny that deino gamplay strat is "tryin to squeeze itself itno a pond out of nowhere"

[sullen igloo]

everywhere from what i've seen. i've seen atleast a dozen schooling fish in delta as pteranodon, alongside several other AI

i also found fish in pretty much every other water source i went to, except for some of the smaller lakes and such

[keen merlin]

I just played on 3 different servers where zero fish spawned lol, a rabbit corpse flew away, and my deino got stuck to a log

[fierce schooner]

dibbles went where n why

[oak talon]

Try go delta

[desert ravine]

It seems to be fixed now with the recent update schools everywhere however now you can’t see in water 😂

[keen merlin]

I saw three schools just below the big hexagon thing in the middle and that's it, but that was as a rex. As for under water vision, you're right, it's absolutely crap now xD.

Not to mention bodies kinda helicopter in my dinos mouth now? Idk what that's about lmao

[faint quail]

Are dibble able to be added as spawnable ai?

[tribal turtle]

#ai-feedback message
it is on ur diet, just gotta let it rot :/

[pearl tapir]

what are you yapping about, they broke fish. Literally no food, elite fish are unicorns, school fish are rare. At this pooint, remove Deino it's so much effort to grow and you will eventually starve anyway unless you have a donor maia every hour or so.

[pearl tapir]

this is only the case after fresh server restart, and not always ensured. More people are saying fish are not spawning, as a bird you can literally fly across the map and find plenty of fish because you only need schoolfish anyway. PLus you can get infinite free food so your opinion as a pterandon is invalid.

[sullen igloo]

having access to free infinite food doesnt make my eyes stop working, not sure what that has to do with physically seeing schools of fish in pretty much every water body ive been to lol

[pearl tapir]

deino cannot survive off school fish bro

[sullen igloo]

its not supposed to

[pearl tapir]

there is no food in the water, except for other deinos, and the rare chance that some idiot swims across...

[sullen igloo]

apexes in general arent supposed to be held up entirely by ai

[pearl tapir]

???

their is no food what part of your brain is not comprehending?

there*

how you supposed to grow?

[sullen igloo]

and the solution is, instead of giving deino a kit adjustment and addressing the things that lead to there being no food... you just want to make it artificially easier by flooding the rivers with fish?

talk about a bandaid fix

[pearl tapir]

no just make fish spawn like they used to what are you yapping about deino kit adjustment.

Literally no food, while herbivores never starve....

[sullen igloo]

so you agree with what i just said

"no, dont address the root problem, just make fish plentiful"

you actively agreed with what i just said, and then said no lol

[pearl tapir]

They either broke fish spawns, or minimized it to the point where deino growth is suffering... I am siding more with the latter at this point, you literally can be that incompetent when it comes to AI spawning....

[sullen igloo]

we've seen what happens when ai can sustain apexes MULTIPLE times. spiro had rivers flooded with deinos, recent HT was jampacked with megapacks of rexes because of diablo ai

and instead of fixing the ROOT problems with the playable, we'd rather just have THAT again?

[pearl tapir]

ya dibbie AI that just sat there and died... And of course they decided to make em spawn in one area what do you expect. The maount of dibbies was fine if they spread them...

So you want to artifically control dino population by limiting food....

[sullen igloo]

you mean like spreading out the fish?

[pearl tapir]

Lol okay make herbivores like Trike starve

[sullen igloo]

THATS HOW ECOSYSTEMS WORK????

if there is not enough calories in the ecosystem to sustain a predator it DIES

[pearl tapir]

Ya their ecosystem is not an actual ecosystem bud.

Nor will it ever reach that point because they empower herbivores artificially to make them more favorable to play

[sullen igloo]

the game having an innate ecosystem is like... half of the game

[pearl tapir]

Make giant herbivores starve...

[sullen igloo]

theyre already talking about removing grazing, which ive been asking for since like 2022

yah large herbivores should also starve

[pearl tapir]

Talk is talk

[sullen igloo]

well this talk just happened like a week before break lol

[pearl tapir]

But fish should spawn, why are they so scarce? The game feels dead in the water bro

This is not an ecosystem.

[sullen igloo]

now imagine a rex player saying this about diablo ai

"but diablo should spawn! why they so scarce?"

[pearl tapir]

You know how much life is in rivers compared to this shite game?

[pearl tapir]

They are reduced to almost not spawning or barely from witnesses.

[sullen igloo]

you just advocated for spread out ai, and now you have spread out fish ai but no no! not that ai! that ai has to be PLENTIFUL so deinos can overpopulate the rivers once again. ignore the 2 semi aquatics coming to the game in a few months

[pearl tapir]

Those 2 semi aquatics have no issue on land so I could care less they will not have issues like Deino does.

Literally more people agree that fish spawns are broken or too low. The only other option for food is other deinos which are rare since food is rare. AI is an option for early growth, but once you are 8+ tons you are screwed. They destroyed SP, nobody really goes there anymore except for the nostalgic few, North lake is dead, Highlands has no fish and you will sit there for hours before a catch, the only viable option at this point is river delta which is usually gatekeeped by big crocs.

Meanwhile I can grow any herbivore np, never need to worry about food even with grazing removed. I can find plenty of plants.

I get instant perfect diet as a herbi from sanct, which you can't get as a carnivore another bias.

[silver raven]

They actually do that in the hopes that it will turn the isle in an actual ecosystem, instead of one where there's 3x more carnivores than herbivores

[silver raven]

The reason people complain is because they only play deino and never touched any other playable

[silver raven]

So people can grow deinos
Just not an infinite amount of them

[charred dew]

the amount of food you can find as a baby rex vs as a deino hatchling tells the difference

might took them another 6 month or a year to fix the fish spawn

[silver raven]

Maybe fish spawns aren't broken and their intention just isn't to let deino live off fish...

[charred dew]

yeah from 30kg all the way to prime elder

and meanwhile a allo or rex can run for 5 to 10min to get their first meal
30kg deino have to swim for over 30mins only to starve or dehydrated

if deino below 1 ton weight are suffering from lack of food, how is bary or spino suppose to get anything to eat?

deer and boars? then what the point making them semiauatic when their whole life cycle can just live in the forest?

[pearl tapir]

sure, people will still grow them they will just log off instead of starving to death...

such insane gameplay, having to log off cause environment is dead of life

[pearl tapir]

this is my thought at this point, but just remove deino cause most people will agree it is suffering not even possible without some cheesing....

to grow to prime and sustain that is....

rexes comparatively much easier to grow and sustain...

[silver raven]

Deino doesn't need more fish, it needs a rework so fish isn't its only source of food

[pearl tapir]

i can agree, different aquatic ai can help

ones that can fight back

[charred dew]

The problem is right now is you can be a semi aquatic and swim around for over an hour and nothing spawns
im not talking about elite fish, schooling fish

[silver raven]

That's still not what it needs

[charred dew]

they should make boars and deer spawn rate same to elite fish

cause duh dont need ai

do you know why there’s so much AI on land animals that it can rot to the point where everyone can smell it, while there’s nothing in and around the water?
Because AI in the water basically almost never spawn

[silver raven]

Probably because fish and land AI share the same spawn limit

And most of the map is land, not water

[charred dew]

I’m glad we have at least a little bit of common ground

at this point they should change Spino's name into "Hunchback rex'

[silver raven]

why

[charred dew]

because their life cycle is basically the same, they spend most of their time on land due to rivers and swamps, and because the water is so clean that it doesn’t even contain a single bacterium

[silver raven]

Did you play spino yet ?

[charred dew]

what can they do in water? if it is only waste of time navigating around there

[silver raven]

Eat deinos
Maybe they'll add bigger fish once spino is in

[charred dew]

I thought you are against ai

apex shouldnt rely on ai

[silver raven]

Not entirely

[charred dew]

no deinos can save spno if the crocs themselves are struggling to get over 100 kg

thats what happening right now

[silver raven]

that's why deino needs a rework

[pearl tapir]

currently there aint that many deinos to eat

[silver raven]

If deinos can "gatekeep certain areas" then I don't think their population is that low

[pearl tapir]

nah they starving before they get the chance to 'gatekeep'

hordetest crocs were able to live cause dibbies would get chased into the water, that is not the case no more and no longer is river delta a hotspot as it was.

[silver raven]

That's not what the other guy said

[pearl tapir]

wdym im the one who said crocs gatekeep delta

but that isnt the case as much as it use to be cause of starvation

[silver raven]

Oh yeah my mistake

It felt weird because you're contradicting yourself

[pearl tapir]

it comes down to crocs not having food, while other apexes have no issues that is all

[silver raven]

Well I think other apexes should have some issues as well

[pearl tapir]

not really

i can literally live off pigs as prime rex

[silver raven]

So they should have issues
As in: AI spawns need to be fixed so it's harder to grow a rex than living off pigs

Or rather, AI needs to be made smarter so it's not as much free food

[pearl tapir]

its not at all easy to live off pigs lol

ya good luck they tend to break AI then make it better...

[silver raven]

Dying of starvation because you're too bad doesn't feel as bad as dying of starvation because the island is empty

[pearl tapir]

literally the latter for crocs. Meanwhile as apex herbi i can never starve even if they remove grazing... Why? Cause there is plants everywhere and they respawn.

The island feels empty as a croc. The fact that I have to grow a maia to keep my croc fed is crazy.

[silver raven]

Yeah, deino needs a rework

[charred dew]

like what, do a backflip? wouldn't help if no food spawn and all you can do is to smell them and cant reach

[charred dew]

like a year ago, I can live off elite fishes as a adult ,each one only provide me with 2-5%
but if I try real hard and swim from delta to the bridge area (which is not a hot spot back then, every other deino is camping in SP and HL for a ez meal)
I can still maintain my hunger or getting full if im lucky
in the process I controll that area , and punish those player who think outside the hotspot is safe

[silver raven]

-Make juvie deinos faster than adults again so they can escape
-Rework lunge to make it harder to land on a watchful opponent, so players don't feel as pressured to avoid deino waters as much, providing deinos more opportunities to grab someone
-Reduce thirst drain so deinos can migrate on land to any body of water
-Reduce adult deino's speed on land to compensate for increased land presence
-Maybe do something with hunger drain, allow deino to wait in ambush for extended periods of time if deemed necessary

I'm not sure these changes would suffice to make deino an actual playable, but at least that'd be a start

[steep hill]

I liked my idea that wallowing in mud allows a deino to stave off dehydration so that it could travel across land

[silver raven]

You like your own ideas
Cringe

I'll like it for you instead

[steep hill]

[charred dew]

the food issue is across species, they already make schooling fish only valuable in its early life cycle
unless bary gonna feed on boar and deer for most of the time
or getting spear fishing like ptera and can just "spawn" food out of nowwhere

without spear fishing even ptera are starving right now

[silver raven]

More food won't solve deino being horrible to play as and against

I mean if you want to play deino just to sit in a puddle of water for 20 hours eating AI fish I won't judge you

But I expect a giant croc's gameplay to be at least a little bit more engaging than that

[charred dew]

you didnt read did you

[steep hill]

give it Ptera’s fishing mechanic but it has to be in a shallow section and it holds its mouth open in the water to catch an elite fish

[charred dew]

the amout of distance I traveled to only keep the hunger is more than any rex running around back then
and I not only sitting in one spot

[silver raven]

So players have a choice between ptera and fat ptera who can't fly

[steep hill]

so true

[silver raven]

But more fish would just allow you to sit in one spot and never travel
In fact it doesn't matter how much distance you have to travel to find fish

If it's all you do it's still boring

[charred dew]

every trip of active searching has a risk for me being jump on by other deino
or do you want them to literally sit there like those in the highland or south plain back then?

[silver raven]

I want deino to play the game along with other players
Not just among themselves

[charred dew]

no you just like them to fill inside the twisted hotspot or some weird pond out of nowhere instead evenly spread out
and ppl can just carelessly swim in the swamp or across the river

[silver raven]

I'm pretty sure I know what I think better than you do, thanks for not misinterptreting what I want

[pearl tapir]

Deino is literally ambush, it's entire life is based on sitting in one area waiting for prey. Well guess what, there is no need for players to come to the water and AI is nonexistent for a Deino in most cases.

Their hunger drain is crazy considering the food supply, meanwhile real life crocs and gators can live up to year with no food easily. Im not saying make hunger drain that slow but at least give a FG deino 3-4 hours imo.

[silver raven]

Yeah
Read the above messages

[pearl tapir]

I've seen those, but unfortunately the way they have it designed this has to be done to avoid starvation. Also worth mentioning that they keep adding safe spots to drink, this in itself along with bridges to cross has diminished croc gameplay.

You want the deinos to play the game, but the game design has turned the gameplay into hunger simulator.

[charred dew]

deino gameplay is to deal with other deino
you cant see the fight becasue it usually end within 30 sec

[pearl tapir]

Literally they are playing among themselves because the Devs have decided to make their only consistent food source their own kind....

[charred dew]

you just dont spam 1 call and running around like rex or ceras do

[silver raven]

That needs to change

Right now deino is an ambusher who never ambushes anyone

[charred dew]

yeah, cause everyone knows there is always a tiny shallow pool somewhere duh

[silver raven]

Yes, because as it is now, safespots are the only counterplay against deino
And nobody wants the Spiro deino plague all over again

[pearl tapir]

I wonder why, can't be cause of all the safe spots and bridges they added... or the fact they almost removed fish spawns to nill.

[pearl tapir]

Bro this is the only time Deino can get food, and even then it's a game of chance because deino has to be in the right spot at the right time.

[silver raven]

Now imagine
Just imagine
If players didn't NEED to know where that tiny shallow pool is

Imagine a world where a player can think "there is probably a deino in the water here, but if I'm careful enough I might be able to avoid it instead of having to spend 10 minutes walking to the other side of the map to drink"

That would already do wonders for deino interaction

[pearl tapir]

We are literally rolling the dice when it comes to catching prey, and sure it's similar to rreal life in that sense but at least IRL we have actual life populating the streams.

[silver raven]

and it's bad

[charred dew]

now ppl just know there just impossiabe to grow deino in place like east lake and north east and can just swim in there

no food can support them to grow to a stage when they can snatch other player

same with most of the swamp area

[silver raven]

Deino doesn't need to be fully grown to catch other players
Not everyone is 4 tons

[charred dew]

you know how long for them to even grow to a ton?

[pearl tapir]

lol I know how bad it is for big crocs so I know the chances of a prime deino in North Lake, Dam Lake, Highland is like 0.1%

[charred dew]

and its NV are abysmal meaning like 1/2 to 1/4 of the time you cant see anything or hunt

[pearl tapir]

I've been drinking at those spots with no worries

[charred dew]

unless you are asking them to log off every night

and only play during daytime

[pearl tapir]

if players ever come to the water which they dont

[silver raven]

Because they don't have a choice

[charred dew]

and it might being ppl buying 2 copies of the game and feed them with sub account

[pearl tapir]

ya but they log off cause no food after an hour or two of waiting for nothing.

They will have alt feeder accounts and scount accounts to spot.

But the fact that you need 3 accounts to sustain a deino is stupid. Stupid game design

[sullen igloo]

i like how hours later, its circled back to "instead of fixing the playable, just artificially sustain it with fish"

we can admit deino is in a bad place, we can admit it has "stupid game design" and instead of actually fixing said design... we just apply band-aid fix 2000

[silver raven]

At least I tried

[charred dew]

I am simply trying to point out that the biomass provided by terrestrial and aquatic systems is very unequal
our biggest land playable now trex got boar in its diet and have no problem finding them
where as deino got frogs and elite fish but they barely exist

even schooling fish are hard to find

[sullen igloo]

tbf i also have issue with rex/trike/etc having such an easy time in their early life as well

[charred dew]

then make boars and deer spawn rate equal to elite fish, Im sure everyone will love this

you know the game has problem when even ptera have problem looking for fish
the spear fishing mechanic is more like a band-aid fix according to your opinion

[sullen igloo]

ive been doing fine without spearfishing as PT lol, especially with spearfishing being bugged

pteranodon is also not an apex aquatic predator and is one of the smallest tiers in the game

of course one of the smallest animals in the game relies more heavily on AI than the apex.

duh

apples and oranges

"this 8 ton crocodile should be able to live off fish because the 100 pound seagull can!" you genuinely HAVE to be ragebaiting

not to mention that pteranodon spearfishing is a) risky depending on location due to you being grounded for over a minute, and b) only works during the day

but yes, flooding the rivers with fish so we can artificially balloon deino population to spiro-esque level is the EXACT same as spearfishing

[oak talon]

Imagine they make deino stand outside the water for a minite to spearfish 😭

[charred dew]

im not askng them to flood the river with ai, plus schooling fish already only give fg denio 0.1% food
im saying there is nothing spawns in water and you have to rely on land ai being "STUCK" in the middle of the river to get any food

waste of my time trying to speak to a brick wall and only sees "oh no more ai bad"

[charred dew]

"this 8 ton crocodile should be able to live off fish because the 100 pound seagull can!"
how are creature in upper food chain gonna survive , when the "seagull" are struggling to find any fish on the map too?(if you took away spearfishing , it allows them to never engage with other player)

[steel python]

you see...the point we are trying to make is: a creature in the upper part of the food chain is supposed to survive off of players. Not fish. So the fix isn't more fish, it's find a way to get players into the range of a Deino.

[pearl tapir]

They have pushed players away from the rivers and waters that Deino patrols, so yes unless they remove the safe spots we need more aquatic AI. They won't remove safe spots cause people cry when they let their guard down and get grabbed.

Why even bring up this fact "ive been doing fine without spearfishing as PT" when the discussion is about a feeding a much bigger animal. PT can fly halfway through the map in less than 5 minutes so ya of course you don't have issues finding the 10 batches of school fish throughout the map.

[pearl tapir]

you know I'm sure majority of community would want more fish if they realized the lack of them, unlike the select vocal few that insist on starving Apex carnivores whilst Apex herbivores don't have to worry about hunger simulator. At this point, the devs just need to stop their 'balancing' of the AI ecosystem and let community servers manage these spawning parameters. I could care less what happens to officials with the cheater issue not being solved.

Once again, I can easily feed a 8ton+ rex on land, and I'm sure with the new semi-aquatics that have no issue travesing land will not have food issues cause alas there is such an abundant amount of pigs.

[sullen igloo]

"why bring up this fact" it wasnt a response to you, it was a response to the person who brought up spearfishing

if you're not going to actual read the convo then this is pointless lol

[charred dew]

🤡

[sullen igloo]

so true! asking me why i brought it up when it was in response to YOU bringing it up is clown behavior! glad we could agree

[atomic haven]

This would also make deino more fun to play

As it stands it’s very rare you actually get to hunt a player that’s not another deino lol

[charred dew]

There’s simply no motivation for players to go anywhere near rivers or swamps.
You can drink from any random puddle, and the forest is flooded with food—so much of it ends up rotting untouched.
Adding Bary at this point wouldn’t fix anything; it would suffer the exact same issues as deinos (below 1 ton)and be pushed inland just to survive

they could make the plants around delta or swamp provide more food value to encourage herbi to visit

[steel python]

exactly...and more fish wouldn't help with that at all, it would only let you survive...alone...by yourself...in the exile you've been put in

[steel python]

the way I see it, they now have all the tools needed to make Deinos and the rest of the roster interact. With the right combination of migrations, patrols, elder requirements and maybe nesting zones (I think they at least in theory still exist) it would be possible to get people into the right spots.

Now all that's needed is to make Deino less of a playable map hazard (yaknow...like a boulder trap or something where the only counterplay is "don't go near it") and I think that'd already help a lot.

[charred dew]

since teleporting Deinos to active waterways or making them faster on land isn’t an option—and major changes to the map’s river system are also unlikely—we should be focusing on the most practical solutions instead.

for example, most other playables can stop during long trips, rest, and find food along the way. For Deinos, though, it’s like crossing a radioactive wasteland.

If you try to crawl from the east lake (pond) to the central water system and then all the way to Delta, you’re looking at around 30 minutes on land, during which you’ll also take dehydration damage.
and if you try to swim from Delta to the western side of the map, you have to go through the swamp and the ocean—areas that also lack food and players (maybe one or two baby Deinos that already starved to death). That’s easily another 30-plus-minute trip

and if you are a fresh spawn that happen to spawn at north east or east lake?
better respawn by meeting gravity cause it is impossiable to grow to a size you can travel on land efficiently

[steel python]

well...that's why I said...get people where the Deinos are. I don't think Deinos need to be everywhere. But I honestly don't know why east is still a spawn for them. Northeast is fine tho, you can just swim down the river (yes, you can actually get down the waterfalls without getting hurt, done it plenty of times).

[charred dew]

then adding schooling fish is a good way to kickstart it
they dont feed deino that is over 1 ton

and right now deino eting deino 99% of the time is because it is the only playable big enough that rely on water

you wouldn't want to see bary and spino living on plain 24/7 right?

[steel python]

you get nutrients from schooling fish when they're rotten...just like from everything else

[charred dew]

but like what? each fish give 0.1 hunger?

for adult deino eating 1 fish cost more energy to catch it and swallow it

[steel python]

if you're fully grown, yeah...for a juvi it's a lot more than that. I just mean they don't necessarily need to be on your diet

[charred dew]

sure it gives you like what 0.25 deconds more time

[charred dew]

how about bary?

[steel python]

what about bary? I don't know what Bary's going to do...I don't know how Bary's going to play, I...only know what it looks like so far

[charred dew]

it is a semi aquatic and you expect it to live in dense forest or plains?

[steel python]

why would I?

I'd expect it to live around lakes

but that's just me, I have no idea what plans they have for it

[charred dew]

why go to rivers and lakes when you know there might be deino trap in there, besides boars and deers provide much more food than schooling fish

and Elite fish basically don’t exist in the current state of the game.

[steel python]

and if Bary ends up having neither boar nor deer on its diet?

[charred dew]

whats it going to have? if a deino can be in the game swimming around over an hour and find 0 fish

[steel python]

also, I thought Deino was the topic...not Bary

[charred dew]

and im talking about schoooling fish

[charred dew]

you are against the idea deino feeding on deinos and grow right?
cause it is the only playable dumb enough to show up in rivers

[steel python]

I am...what? Deinos can feed on Deinos all day, I don't mind that.

I am against the idea that Deinos need to be able to sustain themselves on fish alone.

They are way too big for that.

[charred dew]

small deino eat fish, big deino eat smalldeino until they are big enough to grab somthing else, i dont see any problem here

they are players

but right now fresh spawn just swim around over 45 mins and starve to death

[steel python]

because...the only thing it's looking for is fish?

[charred dew]

or crawl on land and get onesoht by rex and allos running around
I dont see rex and allo have issue with food shortages

[charred dew]

what else they are looking for? bullfrogs?

or elite fish?

[steel python]

literally anything?

it's a Deino...anything that's rotten will give it diets

you just need to find...anything

[charred dew]

and all the rotten stuff on inland you need to burn youur stam to get to it?

and ai can just sense you in water and run away?

or begging the system to make boar getting stuck in the middle of river so you can have something to eat and rotting it took over 20 mins because you can't tear meat checks out of it?

[steel python]

I'll be honest with you...I haven't starved on a Deino in...months? Unless I went afk for like 30 minutes or something.

[charred dew]

ah yes "skil issue" end of conversation

[steel python]

But the thing is, I don't think anyone denies that Deino is in a terrible spot right now. For...a myriad of reasons. None of which is too few fish spawns.

[charred dew]

look for the word fish in general chat, it show up almost every hour ppl asking where it is fixed or not

[steel python]

yes, because that's the bandaid they want on their open fracture

[sullen igloo]

https://tenor.com/view/that-part-jada-pinkett-smith-point-rtt-red-table-talk-gif-16259099

[steel python]

it wouldn't solve the issue with the creature itself. It would just let them be miserable alone in their pond of choice for longer.

I mean, if people pick Deino to basically play a pve only creature....okay, fair. But I doubt that's what people actually want.

[charred dew]

or a crystal-clear, completely sanitized river system is normal right now?
An elite fish only provides around 80–100 kg of food value—judging by the size of the players it can actually attack
I believe any boar or deer can easily weight heavier than it , and it is easy to spot one

[steel python]

am I tripping or are people seeing Deino as a pve only creature?

[charred dew]

wut?

[steel python]

all I get from you is....AI....all your arguments are focused around some type of AI

[charred dew]

you need to be big enough to be able to snatch anything on land

and from a 50kg to 1 ton can easily took hours

you wont go pvp as a newly spawned rex right?

[steel python]

of course you will, if you see a small raptor

[charred dew]

good luck when you play as deino cause there is nothing there

[steel python]

THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT THO!

THAT is the point that needs to be fixed

[charred dew]

whats 50kg deino gonna do

pvp some brick head swimming and fighting it?

[steel python]

a 50kg Deino can try to kill some other juvi thing...or steal the remains of....literally anything that died to literally anything

[charred dew]

sure, find something only half or 3/4 (if its swimming) of its weight

still no motive for them to go to these places

[steel python]

which....is....exactly...the thing...that needs....fixing....

...they need to have a reason to go to those places

is what I've been saying for....almost an hour now

[charred dew]

same here, and I present a way form them to not messing with the terrain all the time and can focus on working future playables

[steel python]

what's...what?

what does the messing with terrain or future playables have to do with anything?

[charred dew]

in short , fix the ai make it everly spread and the player will natraully show up in these places
bigger croc will have territory and will actiely control the population for hunting ground search for player and ai

and other futre semi aquatic will have reason to stay close to water

cause they also need ai in their certain stage

and they will bring other land playables to interact

or like I suggest before, make the plants in certain area provide more food and the herbivore will show up

[steel python]

uh...I don't...see that working out the way you think it would...if you "fix the ai" the way you want it to be fixed, with plenty of fish everywhere, there's gonna be way more Deinos and even less reason to go near water that can have them.

[charred dew]

just tune it back to a year ago

[steel python]

That would move people even more towards the safe drinking spots...including the other semi-aquatics (bar spino)

[charred dew]

im not asking them to fill the river

but in preivous patch it worked fine

elite fish spawn like boars you will encounter on land and baby deino can have no issue grow to the size they can catch elite fish

[steel python]

did it? I think that's the first time I've heard it was fine before this patch...I've been seeing complaints about fish and safe drinking spots forever now

[charred dew]

to clearify , every time you see ppl arguing about fish, is because iy used to work fine and somehow balence
and the dev broke it for almost an year right now

schooling fish gives 0.05 to 0.1 food and the elite fish gives 2-5% of food
it is like rex right now

[steel python]

point still stands tho. Fish only get a Deino so far. with enough fish you'll be able to grow past 50% but if the only way to survive a Deino is to be over 9 tons or just not be anywhere near one...it's still going to be incredibly unfun for everyone involved.

And people are STILL going to avoid all water that could have one

so you will not actually solve the problem

[charred dew]

yes but being an ambush predetor the amount of time you have to wait is easily over the 1hr30mins of its hunger capacity

[steel python]

what does that have to do with anything?

[charred dew]

"Fish only get a Deino so far"
but right now you cant even start a deino

[steel python]

ok, so you'd rather starve at 80% than at 30%?

[charred dew]

you can actually hunt player at 80% thats the difference

[steel python]

only if there are players near the water

which...you keep saying they're not

because they have no reason to be

[charred dew]

80% you can made the travel to the hotspot , which is small deino can't do
most of them just die soon after they spawn

and by constant logging off the game to prserve energy which is a twsited way to play it

I dont see rex having this kind of issue

[steel python]

if Rex is too easy to grow, that's a rex issue tho, not a deino issue

[charred dew]

then I will happily suggest to tune the boar/ deer spawn rate equal to elite fish we have right now

[steel python]

I'd be fine with that

[charred dew]

Surely this will just be dismissed as a “skill issue.”

Glad we’ve at least found some common ground: boars should either spawn as only one per migration area, or not spawn there at all.

[steel python]

You're barking up the wrong tree here, I'm someone who actually enjoys playing on No AI servers xD

[charred dew]

and they are empty most of the time for a reason

[steel python]

yes, the reason being that people want an easy life

if they're not empty tho, they are way better for everyone (yes, even Deinos, believe it or not)

[pearl tapir]

I smell bs, unless you are just logging off as soon as you see the area is dead. Which is braindead gameplay, actually it's no gameplay you just log off instead of starving.

Literally fresh spawn Deino cannot kill anything except for a troodon that's swimming. It's only source of food is fishes in the beginning, I have no idea why people insist that Deino should not be able to survive in isolation in PVE when all the Apex land creatures can literally survive off AI and plants....

As for making people going to the rivers, they kind of did it during hordetest by making Dibbies spawn in central delta but that has reverted back to the original state since Dibbies are rare sight now. Though, don't have your faith in this because almost every update/patch they have pushed people away from major water sources via bridges, safe spots.

Why would they add safe spots if they want people to run into Deino? Clearly they dont, they should remove Deino imo give people less headache since they could care less to fix it's design issues.

[steel python]

I don't log off. Not during the night, not when the area is dead. I don't need to kill anything. What I do is sniff. If I smell something rotten, I go for it. If that means running across land, so be it.

I don't want any carnivore over 2 tons to be able to survive without other players (at least not as long as other players are the only threat to your survival). Herbivores are a different thing, because they are actually necessary as food for the carnivores. They need to be easier, because they need to be more plentiful. How long can a Rex survive off a Trike? 2 hours? How long does a Trike need to grow? 8 hours? Then how many Trikes do you need to sustain the Rex? But even still, the "whataboutism" is frankly annoying. One thing being easy doesn't mean everything else should.

The Dibbles in Delta were a different kind of disaster. Yes, people went to the river...but then you made another carnivorous apex extremely easy and braindead. That's not a solution to anything.

I honestly always said that adding Deino was a mistake. That thing, while undoubtedly well done for what it is, doesn't fit into the ecosystem whatsoever and I doubt it ever will, even with Spino, Bary, Austro and Sucho. But we have it now and we somehow have to find a way to have it somewhat interact instead of being a standalone pve-experience completely detached from everything else.

[pearl tapir]

13.5 ton deino can't live exclusively fish even when they use to spawn at a decent rate. The fact that the water ecosystem is dead other than the occasional bugged land ai is stupid. At least have enough fish to support multiple 2-4 ton sized crocs. Kind of crazy you have to walk on land to get food, because a land croc is most likely a dead one.

It's like they added Deino, and instead of enhancing the gameplay they made it godawful compared to the other Apexes. IT's like they regret adding it and just want to sour the playerbase who want to ever grow a croc.

With no fish, Deino can't even participate in the ecosystem. And it's not like Deino doesn't have a place in the ecosystem, it's more so they took Deino out of it completely with map changes and fish spawns.

I don't see how some insist on the current fish population being okay, even if I agree with the fact that fish shouldn't feed a prime deino which it never did, there is no good reason to have almost no fish other than to kill off Deino completely.

[steel python]

You know, one of the issues is that the only threat to an adult or elder Deino is another adult or elder Deino. You have to literally WANT to die to anything else. So the moment Deinos life gets too easy, the Deino numbers are going to explode again. And the map is going to feel extremely empty if 50 of the 100 people on it are Deinos. Again, I don't hate Deino. It's just the link between the terrestrial and the aquatic ecosystem that's completely unnecessary because there is no aquatic ecosystem, so it has basically a complete safezone away from everything else.

[charred dew]

if 50 players choose to play deino , why stop them for playing the thing they want? you feel like the map is empty its because the engagement will occur in the swamps and river instead
and with spino is coming to the game they will meet their challenge, and that is a great thing, because it can put to an end to pond deino playstyle, deino got nowhere to run if a spino or even a group of bary deicde to occupy a shallow pond

As I mentioned before, if increasing server capacity while maintaining connection quality, and revamping the map to make it smaller—thereby reducing “dead zones” and making travel easier—is not possible, then we need to look for solutions that are actually feasible in practice

considering they are working on the mangrove, they might introduce it as a sanctuary for semi-aquatic creatures(they already show that beipi can hide inside of it)

[nocturne surge]

I cant log in to game

did all could with anticheat

can any one help?

[oak talon]

Fish might be hard to find but delta rivers are full of boar and deer

[charred dew]

yeah, and they spotted deino under water like 100m away

[south vessel]

goats hard to find for anyone else?

[oak talon]

Try killing a player organs give all 3 diets

Goats are notoriously hard to find organs are normally easiest bet

[south vessel]

i know but goats should be like a 1% chacne to spawn when boars and deer literally spawn almost every 20 feet it feels like

[oak talon]

They have set areas of spawn so not really

Best spot to look is between highlands lake and water access

[south vessel]

ingame says all land biomes i guess im just not looking i the correct ones

[south vessel]

thanks oh well i get primal some other day thanks

[oak talon]

Yeah it's honestly super easy to prime even the smaller dinos, deino is probably hardest with no water sanctuarys

[south vessel]

currently trying for allo\

[south vessel]

so is there like a specified time for goats to spawn? or am i just SOL?

[burnt ibex]

Im repeatedly running into bugged ai that dont react and dont take any damage. Hard to start a run if a part of the early game doesnt work...:(

[hoary shore]

The devs need to dedicate near 100% effort to fixing the damn AI. It sounds like this has been a problem for MONTHS. Really makes new players like me consider refunding the game.

[coarse flint]

people are growing rexes off of AI only... seems like the ai is fine.

[tardy star]

please fix the invisible wall bug

[light garden]

@arctic ridge Gotta read the rules Bud.

[wintry comet]

I finally did it, I caught my first rabbit while flying! (I'm so bad) lol

[bold marsh]

I agree with this slightly. BRING THE ELITE FISH BACK, but they definetly shouldn't be able to support any big deinos, at that point your done living off of fish and need to hunt properly.

[charred dew]

they only give 2-5% food to a 8 ton fg deino (and schooling fish like 0.05 to 0.1) like 8 months ago back when they haven't butcher the system
I think is pretty fair back then, enough to slow down your hunger drain while you are making a long travel, or cover the whole central river/ delta in search of players
by actively searching for elite fish deino player will bump into each other lead to a short time truce or full out war

and elite fish never spawn like deer or boars where there is bunch of them

[warm yacht]

with how incredibly hard it is to find an elite fish 2-5% makes no sense considering how big the elite fish is

[charred dew]

roughly equal to a boar

[brittle thistle]

I stand for this lol, I think generally it also made more sense that the AI food was other dinosaurs and not a random chicken for instance 😅that’s just a personal preference though for immersion 🤷‍♀️

[soft nymph]

We have tacos in the game though. I do miss the Ava and oros though

[brittle thistle]

Yes I know we have tacos, although they’re like impossible to find I noticed, 90% of the dens I come across have nothing in them 😭

Oreo’s and Ava’s I liked though instead of the board, deers, etc we have now. Just felt more immersive personally, but in the end it is what it is 🤷‍♀️

[warped lake]

A bit late to the party but have you tried digging the burrows multiple times? Usually if digging the 1st time doesn't work I do it 2 more times and it usually spawns them/forces them out

[sonic sundial]

I actually feel like making the AIs be regular animals and the playables be dinosaurs is more immersive, personally. It differentiates the playable creatures into a more "special" class of creature. In so far as the game's lore goes, it seems we're playing in prehistory, but actually modern times(?) so it make sense regular animals are seeded all throughout the areas to feed the more special creatures, which, I assume, were procured in some JP-ish way..? IDK 🤷 . I also think AI appearance isn't something the devs should put that much effort into, so if they can just purchase a premade asset, there will be more dev time for the playable animals.

[brittle thistle]

I dig until they disappear! Unfortunately 90% of the time for me nothing spawns, just a million burrows with nothing inside ^^’

[brittle thistle]

In Legacy I found it to be more immersive for the AI to be ava, oro and taco, it made it feel like you were actually playing a dinosaur world. I find a deer, boar, etc to be offset in that sorta setting although you are right it’s more of an island that people are running experiments on. So they would be around during that time, it’s just a personal preference for the AI imo. Also, they already have all the assets for the AI to be dinosaurs, there’s AI versions of all the playable for the most part as well (it’s server specific to be turned on/off). so it’s not really crazy tbh

[rough crown]

since im on a high ai server im a bit in a confusion, what type of ai is currently activated by default, so far i only know for sure that the galli ai is active...

[fallow spoke]

Ai by default refers to quantity not type. I think at base its 400 and they may have bumped it anywhere from 401-whatever amount. Doesnt really mean it works. Just means they set the server to have more than normal.

Theres ptero, compy, boar, goat, chicken, frog, rabbit, deer, taco, turtles, crabs, galli, dibble, and maybe elite fish. Regular fish dont count as ai from what i can see as those still spawn on no-ai servers. (In the sky at least...)

[rough crown]

well thats some useful information thank you, so it mightve been an admin that spawned some beipies in the swamp?

[pearl tapir]

thing is, even back then you needed lots of players around to sustain a 8 ton deino. That was when fish was spawning like crazy after restart btw, so you would have a lot of Deino players loggin in after restarts. It's important to note that fish spawns died down, along with other AI spawns near end of restart cycle.

There is no way you can sustain 13.5 ton deinos(almost 2x the weight) with elite fish, they gave a 8 ton croc 3-5%. You will 100% deplete all the fish and still have hunger issues as prime Deino.

[bold marsh]

I am not saying to sustain full grown deinos with fish, I’m saying there should be enough to stave off hunger for like a 3-4 ton Deino, but there isn’t, if your swamps as Deino your basically screwed because there’s no food

[devout echo]

So it's not me hallucinating, it's really no small fish anywhere at the map lmao?

not saying about other AIs, such as crabs and etc... (I haven't ever seen turtle AI's since Gateway release)

[fallow spoke]

Beipi doesnt exist as an official ai so those were either players or an admin figured something out

[rough crown]

mustve been ai, there were multiple at the same spot all idle and the default beipi skin

[coarse flint]

i see small fish as ptera all the time. and turtles are usually along the south coast of swamp, and the sandbar by west rail.

[fallow spoke]

Would be very interesting if they were ai dang lol

[devout echo]

I tried pt few times after recent updates and for all the times found... 0 fishes, 0 crabs and frogs and not even psytaccos. I saw only chickens, rabbits and other common land AIs... guess my luck then 🤷‍♀️ Yesterday and today I was on different servers, so it made me feel wrong

[final skiff]

#ai-feedback message
I noticed that the new Crab is DEFINITELY slower than they used to be, and that is massive for tiny predators and fresh spawns. They are worth chasing for a tiny animal, and while it does make them easier to kill as an Adult Allo, for example, said Allo gets so little food from a crab that it doesn’t even register visually on their food bar. Crabs are officially the best behaving Ai for their intended role, and if they just did that and nothing else to frogs, I think it’d be enough.
But I also think that putting frogs in mud, ESPECIALLY in the huge mud flats in the swamp, would make a lot of sense. Mud has a lot of potential as a biome itself, if there was just more food there than clams and clams alone, for Ptera and Ptera alone.

Let Austro and Beipi get clams and put frogs in mud, and suddenly the swamp has players in it don’t want to die and spawn somewhere else. Let Troo and Herera also benefit from clams and mud frogs, and suddenly it’s an ecosystem. At that point all it needs is a dedicated herbivore to round out the prey population, and I think any existing herbivore could fit that niche if it could just move in mud more freely.

[pearl tapir]

#ai-feedback message

This should be the case when food for Apex carnivores is limited, so should plants. The same reasoning they use to limit Rex/Croc population via limited food is the same reason why plants should be limited in resources too. Unfortunately, you can literally just move to another part of the map and never starve as Apex herbi. There are plants everywhere, if you are starving it's cause too many herbis in one area which means relocate or fight for your food like carnivores would.

I personally don't think food should be used as a balance mechanic to limit population of Apex creatures, because I believe their execution is horrible.

The current standards of AI and size of map make Evirma feel like a barren wasteland instead of a densely populated ecosystem.

[wanton herald]

Per-server populations have doubled or tripled since Gateway released and it still feels like a ghost town most of the time.

[silver raven]

That's because Spiro's murderpit, where all players were packed constantly, no longer exists

[wanton herald]

I dont recall mentioning Spiro (just checked to make sure and surprisingly it appears that I didn't), but if Gateway was designed around Official server population limits (and those servers have far less population than the Unofficials, which themselves are vastly empty), then Gateway is a failure.

If AI ever reaches a decent state, it will still only be a bandaid.

[silver raven]

You said "since Gateway released" guess what changed when Gateway released ?

[wanton herald]

Starting at the point Gateway released, guess what isn't in the game after that?

Oh right, Spiro

How could I forget how a timeline works, my mistake

[silver raven]

🤨

[wanton herald]

If Gateway is an empty wasteland at release, and continues to be a wasteland after population triples, then guess what the problem is? Could it be the map size?

[silver raven]

Gateway isn't a wasteland

[wanton herald]

Ok

[vapid gull]

does the ai bleed out

[grave nebula]

wow

[charred dew]

no

[final skiff]

#ai-feedback message
well that’s the thing, with Dactyls at least, they’ve fixed them several times, and then they just break again. Hopefully it sticks this time!

[soft nymph]

@candid otter you want to put that in #🐞-evrima-bug-reports-🐞

[soft nymph]

@sour tusk you want #🐞-evrima-bug-reports-🐞 for that

[stray edge]

at least say its only in highlands 😭 its lying to me

[sullen igloo]

it does lie sometimes

i agree though, either make goat appear in all biomes or say that its in highlands only

[knotty smelt]

Whenever i try to host my server to play for fun it just stays on a black screen. Anyone know how to fix this?

[dense violet]

are fish ai fixed??

[soft nymph]

No

[calm canopy]

dibles on?

oficial evrima?

[thorny dragon]

Nope

[calm canopy]

Will there be no more ia dibble?

[thorny dragon]

Not for now at least

[calm canopy]

okey thanks:)

[wanton garden]

wait, so there are no AI potatos?

[soft nymph]

@dapper frost best place for that video is in #videos-and-streams
#ai-feedback is for stuff about the AI

[pliant turtle]

Just out of curiosity, I heard couple of times that fish AI is now broken or rather not existing, how long is this occuring and how fishes mechanic looked like i nthe past?

[charred dew]

they broke the system for almost an year now

[humble charm]

Swayn

[pliant turtle]

Lol that's so bad, as it's probably just a rollback of the changes which broke it

[ebon cape]

So are there any actual plans to fix this? It’s pretty lame for 1 not letting deino get nutrients from other ai, and 2 having no other option than to canni if you can even find another player killable, or try to wait for players to get close enough to the water.

[sullen igloo]

deino can get nutrients from anything if they let it rot

[charred dew]

relying on other players to kill AI creatures out of boredom and leave the bodies close enough for you to grab.
Or you kill a boar or a deer if it gets stuck, then leave the corpse in the water for over 20 minutes just to gain some nutrients.
meanwhile, everyone in the area can smell the body in the water and immediately knows there’s a growing Deino there.
You repeat this process over and over, carefully avoiding being stomped on land or cannibalized by larger crocodiles, until you finally reach 50% growth.
congrats now you weight 500kg and surely bee able to hunt some player.....funny thing is you can mate with a prime elder at the stage and lay eggs

[final skiff]

I have a theory that part of the “problem” is that fish spawns are tied somehow to certain herbivores being in the water. I only have anecdotal evidence for Dryo, Pachy, and Stego, and these two clips to back it up, but I feel like I’ve had this exact thing happen on many occasions. The two clips were from me actually trying to replicate it, and two out of my five dives in various bodies of water had fish spawn right next to me.

If any of y’all have the time, please try testing this out with different animals. Find a spot of river or lake with no water, jump in and swim around, and see if any show up near you. Record it if you can, cause I think I might be onto something.

If I’m right about this, I’m guessing it’s a reference to how hippopotamus work IRL. They go up on land and eat grass all night, then hang out in the water all day, digesting and pooping, bringing LOADS of nutrients off of the land and into the water, where plants, diatoms, and fish THRIVE.

If that’s what the devs did, I’d say it’s really cool, but suffers from the massive problem that a total of ZERO herbivores in the game are sub aquatic and ALL of them have a huge, gator shaped reason to stay the heck out of the water at all costs. So there’s a non-zero chance that just adding Minmi and Anky to the game could just “fix” fish, but we can’t prove anything without more than anecdotal evidence.

I did my small Pachy tests on a dead server, to avoid any interference, so I am certain (especially in the first clip) that there were not any other players anywhere near me to influence that school of fish just spawning there, almost exactly where I landed in the water. SUS.

[tribal vortex]

this is true

just happen to me on trike as soon as I got close to the pond fish spawned

[final skiff]

So I’m at least not fully imagining things. Do you have a recording?

Also, more people, try this! Anecdotal evidence rocks, and I want more, but we also need data, which means we need more tests!

[tribal vortex]

I dont but this is confirmed

ai is spawning for herbis

the server NERF has fixed fish and ai

how did the devs miss something like this

[paper ether]

in what way? playing on any server feels so lonely and ai not really good at spawning when you need them too. if you meant literally, then the person you were talking to was speaking figuratively. It's not a wasteland like the fallout games but it is one with how lifeless it feels. :/ seeing the ai feedback channel (the other one) reaffirms this

[silver raven]

Players are spread out on Gateway, so obviously you won't meet a player in every corner like you used to in spiro's center.

But it still has hostpots and high-traffick areas where you'll consistently meet players. I've never felt alone when I was playing gateway, excepted when I was purposefully avoiding highly populated areas (or after spawning in a remote corner of the map where nobody goes)

It's better than what happened on spiro, where everyone was congregating in one spot, and the rest of the map was actually a wasteland, with no players and no AI whatsoever in remote areas (except some AI stuck on cliffs)

[paper ether]

Not sure what servers your playing on but the hotspots constantly change when i play to the point it's getting frustrating. I'll be in the west rail access one day with like 3 other players of the same dino as myself, then later no one is at west rail access at all. Then south plains will have some people but they're gone next time i play. Swamps and water access are always empty for me, jungle sectors are the worst because sometimes you think you hear other players but then it turns out it's just you when you're moving so that becomes frustrating really quick, I mostly avoid jungle sectors when i can now. I've spawned at north lake, east swamp and northwest ridge and just died due to lack of ai, I remember turtles spawning on the beaches but haven't seen that happen since my last binge week of the game (on my recent binge i put 15 or so more hours in and no turtles in all that). I didn't get to experience spiro and the way you described it makes it sound way more appealing than gateway, i go on entire treks in this game and find no one at times, even on servers like dinopolis or islander yet the chat is constantly active. Seems like the chat box is the main multiplayer feature at this point yet you cant even location drop on a map as big as gateway unless the admin is kind enough to let you do so, which most of the time I've observed is a big fat no (though i did see one person get permission on dinopolis like 2 days ago but it was their only freebie the admin said).

Also sniffing sucks for carnivores, I get not being able to track players for grief reasons but not being able to track the scent of ai prey is just a huge L. There are rarely any corpses that show up on the compass when sniffing (yes i know to hold it down), at least it works for water or I definitely would've died of thirst multiple times now, it's mainly just starvation I die from half the time. The other half being I underestimated that drop or slope or just dinocide to get a better spawn.

[silver raven]

I play officials

[paper ether]

i tried that, not having global chat makes the game itself worst imo, at least in unofficials i can socialize even if im not with the other people at their location

[silver raven]

Welp, seems like I can find players in officials without global chat, while you can't find players in unofficials with global chat

I don't think it's a game issue

[paper ether]

i mean, the officials was my first introduction to the game and its the same experience just w/o global chat which is why mentioned global chat as the reason for me playing unofficials otherwise i would be playing officials

[final skiff]

I think it’s deliberate. Hippos are a massive boon to fish populations in the Nile, specifically because their constant crap brings a ton of plant nutrients off of land and into the water.
The Devs definitely like to do fun, nature accurate things like that (Ptera’s fishing pose), so it makes a lot of biological sense.

Like I said in the main post tho, there aren’t any sub aquatic herbivores in the game, and all of the existing herbivores have a MASSIVE gator shaped reason to stay away from water at all costs. When Trike first dropped into Horde Test, it was a FAST swimmer, so I thought it might be a pseudo Hippo for the game, but they changed that pretty quick.

Unless the devs want to patch out that bit of realism for the game’s sake, what we need in game is Anky, Minmi, or even Duck-Deino to be fish spawn era that regular Deino won’t eat because of their weight, cuteness, or claws, respectively.
With Barry being teased a lot lately, I really REALLY hope they’ll sneak in Minmi as a fish generator, or even rework something like Dryo to be more aquatic.

I’m gonna keep testing so we have lots of video evidence.

I want to know EXACTLY which animals dodo and don’t spawn fish.

[rugged helm]

seen the same thing on diablo

[opal glacier]

where are the goats thought they were ing highlands?

[final skiff]

Saw two in highlands yesterday. I think Ai is just too perceptive to even spot tho, when you’re something they’re scared of.

I did a BUNCH of testing yesterday and can confirm it works on everything aside from Teno, Diablo, and Dryo. Couldn’t get Teno or Diablo to spawn any fish, and I just haven’t tried it with Dryo in a sec.
Hypsi was the fastest, and I even spawned two on either bank once.

[final skiff]

This gives Deino, Herera, and Ptera a pretty good reason to be peaceful to Hypsi in particular.

[rugged helm]

definitely interesting. there must have been another species hiding around then, cause i only saw myself (juvie diablo) and my two parents in the highlands lake. fish started jumping out of the water in front of us an a ptera showed up after a bit, but i didn’t see any other herbis.

unfortunately my storage is far too full for me to record, but i’ll try to as soon as i get my new hard drive

[final skiff]

Diablo and Teno probably can do it, I just didn’t have any luck. I need to test Gali too.

[final skiff]

#ai-feedback message
It isn’t just a Deino thing either. I flubbed a swoop as Ptera the other day and landed in the water, but since there wasn’t anyone anywhere near South Plains, I just swam around to get the fish (bless the devs for Ptera’s better swim speed), and yeah, each peck respawned a fish until the school just vanished, no food caught. I tried to do the same thing again later and record it for proof, BUT it was the other, small fish that looks like a Pale Chub or some sort of Blue Gill, and that time I caught one first try. The school that I respawned before were the long, green trout adjacent fellers, and I usually only see catfish flying, I think…

I only have my own experience for this one, but I think that maaaaaaaybe the three types of fish school in game actually function differently and might experience separate bugs? I don’t know.

[fallow spoke]

That does seem like the bug only affects specific fish types. Maybe the devs could disable the bugged ones until they are fixed so the non bugged ones can spawn more

[molten sable]

Please make AI spawns more consistent

[pearl tapir]

Those flying fish are bugged, even ptera cannot grab them.

They don't start out in space, they start out in the river then the magical fish start flying

You will never have this issue as a herbivore

Plants are everywhere

and don'

[modest nymph]

This is tangential to your point @queen ibex, but you can get diet from schooling fish as croc if you put it down and let it rot, it becomes alpha diet. Unless they changed that
#ai-feedback message

But 100% agree that fish & small AI need urgent looking at. Small things like frogs, crabs, and potentially even freshwater turtles aren't just the backbone of the semiaquatic food chain, but also provide interactions for small land carnivores to seek prey near water, and thereby create hunting opportunities for semiaquatics as well

[queen ibex]

last i checked it dont work on small fish.

[pearl tapir]

it works on everything

7 mins to rot fish and slabs of meat.

[mortal prism]

Idk if its already known or not, but I have seen crabs spawning on the South Eastern beach near the sanctuary. They are absurdly small and nearly impossible to spot from afar, but if you walk up on them they'll scatter around like an ant, and their speed doesnt seem lightning atm

[queen ibex]

i just tryed it and the fish just vanish and never had the rotted meat sign.. so yea i dunno it dont work on the little fish

at least not for croc

anyways regardless we need more fish, its not fair land dinos get everything they need on land wither its a herbi or carni and crocs dont get anything.
the odd frog when you dont need it... might see one elite fish a day if youre lucky.... it needs work and its not even on the announcements as issues they know about.
like why did they even bring croc out if its in this state and it sees like no one is doing anything about it or cares.
the game wasent ready for croc either improve or remove it.

[modest nymph]

It worked as of last hordetest (before it went live), but for all I know it's gotten bugged 💀

[flint sierra]

It still works! The schooling fish just never show the rotted meat sign, and there's no visual indicator that they're rotten (that i could see anyways). You have to time it yourself, which is kind of annoying :/ But it does still work and it does still give you nutrients! That is, if you can find any schooling fish that aren't in the sky, anyways.

[queen ibex]

yeah I set an 8 minute timer, it does work but the fish have like a 50% chance of just vanishing as well. so I suppose I was getting unlucky trying to cook one at a time, so now I just cook 5 an hope for the best

[glossy sky]

do same things with 7min timer works every time for me

[pearl tapir]

7 mins, they disappear after 9

you can cook any slab of fresh meat, 7 mins

bodies take 30 mins

[rough siren]

This isn't a bad point.. audio seems broken. AI calls from more distant prey also tend to sound closer than they should be.

I would point out to OP though that using good BT headphones and no other noise/music/distraction you can usually get a good direction on ai when close. I'm usually unable to hunt ai in the woods/bushes without them. Unless it's raining... in which then all bets are off 🪦

[neon dove]

I understand where you're coming from but ultimately the best part of the isle is having the pvp interactions, Life as rex is meant to be really difficult so that the server pop isn't all rexes (still kinda is tho), while i do think its a decent idea, I believe the player base should grow before they added bigger tier ai imo.

[left aspen]

I also think they should add some bigger AI for larger Dino’s but not a lot to still keep it difficult and to keep pvp up.

[rich basalt]

I personally disagree,
This game has become a grow simulator instead of a survival simulator. It’s so easy to find food. That’s almost funny to me.

[humble iris]

I see a fundamental problem here that there are two different expectations for the game. PVP and PVE. Personally, I prefer PVE, I would rather play the game as Dino Life Simulator than Counterstrike with Dinos. You just have to put way too much time into the game to even be able to fight, then the huge map, and that's just for a fight that's over in seconds and just ruins hours of progress? You could also just make a server on a small map where you spawn as an adult and it's all about fighting. In my opinion, the game offers so much potential and should not be broken down into a pure pvp game. I think it's a shame that such unique games always have to be pvp games, when there can be so much more. There are also far too many differences between the dinosaurs in terms of how easily they get food. As a carnivore on land, it may be too easy with AI animals, but as a deino, you still starve far too quickly if you are not eaten first. There are hardly any significant water spawns and eventually even pigs and deer no longer feed. spawns for coastal AI are virtually nonexistent. I had played a Deino with saltwater mutation, but in the sea you would starve, IN THE SEA! There isn't as much life on the entire planet as there is in the ocean. Adding more AI animals there would offer entirely new alternatives, such for saltwater Deinos or Ptaros. If there were more food for everyone and hunger and thirst lasted at least twice as long, then there would be many more opportunities to play the game without being constantly stressed. PVP players could still hunt down players, but PVE players would have the opportunity to spread out on the map and search for hiding places. They could finally use the entire map. Carnivores could also lie in wait and wait for a good opportunity instead of starving, like the Herrera. It would give each player more options on how to play the game.

[humble iris]

I think PVP would be a lot better if

-map size reduction a lot
-max player per server raise a lot
-disable ai completely

It would lead to

• more food available
  -more small/juvenile dinos to hunt
  -more action/ less starving wandering
  -more pvp
  -less full grown vs. Juvenile fights

For pve i would suggest

-pve server with the following changes

• map size as it is
  -even more ai, especial at the coast and in water
  -lesser player per server

[rich basalt]

All of this can be customized in a unofficial server
It’s hard to balance for PVP and PVE and make everybody happy on the officials.
Personally, there is no real distinction between the 2 in survival.
PVE is just surviving, getting food so you can grow until PvP becomes necessary to stay alive.
The transition is hard to do ofc, but fewer boar and deer ai, medium ai in general, and more small ai like frogs, chickens, fish, etc would be better for both.
Carnivores are more popular to play, so starvation is a heavy risk without ai, but a healthier herbivore population would balance it out.
Rn carnivores are forced to kill each other whether on diet or not because of the lack of herbivores.
If people want more tailored experiences then they need to look at unofficial servers.
This game isn’t just PvP or pve, it’s a full experience of both depending on your playable.

[wanton herald]

My view is that eating AI as a carnivore should be like grazing as a herbivore, useful as filler but not giving diet. You should have to kill a player to get diet.

[vast grove]

Strongly disagree! Scarse AI are fine to support juvenile and smaller carnivores, the main gameplay loop however should demand player interaction. This doesn't mean forced PvP but creating a healthy ecosystem on every server. Countless rexes being able to sustain themselves on AI alone is just bananas.

AI not giving any nutrients is fine though. There just shouldn't be a safe lifeline for carnivores.

[wanton herald]

I wasnt meaning they should be a safe lifeline, only that they shouldnt give diet 🙂

[edgy pier]

I think ai giving diets for smaller carnivores is fine, and I think there is no carnivore larger than dilo that has all three diets as Ai

[vast grove]

Rex

[edgy pier]

Rex has all three?

I wouldn't know, I don't play Rex as it's existence disgusts me

[vast grove]

Yes, Rex has the most insane diet list of them all. It's actually the easiest carnivore to grow to prime. You can sustain yourself with AI only (because there are that many) and get all your nutrients at the same time. Imagine this... the #1 apex in the game doesn't even need to hunt other players.

Rex nutrients:
Boars - alpha
Deer - beta
Turtles and goats - gamma

I know rabbits and chicken are also on the list (for whatever reason) but what really matters are those larger AIs that Rex can just gobble up nonstop. So yeah, rex has it all.
This is the main reason why there are so many on every server. AI are just busted right now.

[humble iris]

But other dinos still struggle. As i played Herrera a while ago, i wasn't able to catch something until i was close to starving, after having a full belly. In that time i didn't saw an single player and only some ai far away. I had to run after them, draining stamina as hell, cause you never can't jump from tree to tree fast enough to catch them. Also i constantly had a problem with stamina, forcing me to rest much longer than i was able to hunt. Even with the mutation, where you have to jump 50 times for.

Strangely some times there are spots, where you can stay like forever, spawning ai, one after another, but the moment you leave to get to another place, there is not a single ai around.

Yesterday i played as a Trodon and had an other strange ai behavior. It wasn't the slightest problem to hunt deers as a baby, cause multiple times the stood still, literally inside each other, even with me attacking them.
Felt like cheating.

[vast grove]

Herrera's and Troodon's juvies are by far the worst growth stages in the game. Also the elder system clearly wasn't designed with them in mind.

However they don't struggle because of the amount of AI but because there are too many "large" AI creatures. You simply can't hunt boar or deer as Herrera or Troodon when you spawn.
The amount of AI overall needs to be decreased and some boar and deer need to be swapped in favour of frogs and chicken. But I think more small AI are planned anyway with rats, bugs and larvae. What I don't understand is why they don't also use random compys and pterodactylus spawns as AI since they already exist in the game.

[humble iris]

This👆

[worthy elk]

I agree, as a herrera main, the elder system makes it painful. I've noticed that larger AI don't run from you as much if you swap trees but when you're a juvi you need either a fresh corpse or a chicken or your hopes of getting prime or surviving diminish quickly, especially on official servers. I like the idea of having more tiny AI creatures for juvis and a bit less medium AI to promote hunting.

Also I feel that hunger diminishes in percentage as if you're an adult and not as your current size. If your hunger, stamina, hp, etc, are all your weight number then why does your hunger take such a hit? Why do smaller dinos nearly starve just running to a sanctuary?

[vast grove]

Starvation isn't really the issue. Hunger does drop faster, however not as fast as it looks like. What really happens is that your stomach size increases. Compare it to for example Stego or Rex. They have phases throughout their growth where they gain a lot of weight really quickly and become very hungry. Their food treshold increases, the overall amount of food you already have remains more or less the same because your base hunger depletion doesn't increase at such a rate. What this means is that you can actually last quite a bit longer without food than it looks like.

The real problem is your starting nutrient! It depletes faster than your hunger = infertility. This means not only do you have to find a random corpse to scavenge but one that also gives you nutrients. For Herrera or Troodon this means they have to find the "right" corspe or a chicken FAST!

[worthy elk]

Hunger thing makes sense especially if you get a growth tick and a hunger tick at the same time, it would look greater than it is. If you get a corpse that is not your own species and organs are left then you can get a little nutrient but it's nothing like consuming a schooling fish. One of those will nearly fill that nutrient and a ton of hunger. The rest of the AI require consuming more for the same effect.

[outer prism]

SE beach. i have noticed turtles only spawn when 2 or more dinos are present in the area. i will be there for an hour and as soon as another dino shows up....poof! a turtle shows up on the beach. not sure if intended

[worthy elk]

They spawn in the grasses near beaches and can be missed due to your own footstep sounds being louder than them crawling

[long loom]

I know the fish & AI spawn issues have been mentioned a million times, but I hope its on top priority to get fixed because it's genuinely making small carnivore species near impossible to play right now

[quaint dock]

yeah, unless your lucky you find food nearby as a deino its nearly impossible to survive as it since there is almost nothing that it can eat. It can mostly only eat (From AI) Elite fishes and frogs which basically almost never spawn.

[obtuse meadow]

I 100% agree that fish are screwy, there's no obvious reason why vast wetland areas, like swamp, are so devoid of swimming prey.

However, anyone complaining about Ptera needs to remember that shore fishing exists, and timing your meals with sunset can ensure survival without great difficulty.

[rich basalt]

Rn ai spawn rates are increased based on players in an area.
So it’ll cause them to spawn sooner the more people that are in the area.
Staying in a location solo long enough will also trigger spawns but at a slower rate

[rich basalt]

<@&933486433342222376>

They are relentless man

[long loom]

I have a hunch whoever made the fish system isn't around anymore which is why it's taking so long to fix

[sturdy raptor]

So has anyone else experienced fish just ceasing to spawn entirely???

[soft nymph]

Yep. They’re broken

[sturdy raptor]

Just starved to death on my Deino because not a single fish spawned in north lake or the river all the way to dead end 😑

How is the game MORE broken than when I quit almost a year ago 😑

[soft nymph]

Fish have been broken for months

[orchid shoal]

Hey guys, I wanted to ask a question. Me and two friends were playing on the US 4 server and we suddenly died with 3 trikes +50%.

[weary abyss]

welp, answers why I joined the discord for, haha

[long loom]

Hackers probably, would recommend unofficial servers to avoid them

[eager hornet]

yall know where did the official EU servers go?

[tired seal]

@final skiff
#ai-feedback message
These are the best kind of feedback I've ever seen. I demand more.

[final skiff]

Danke! I did these too, just the Hadro idea at different scales, and using Sanctuary and/or Mud Flats to gatekeep large carnivores.

The Hypsi-like and Mud-Dracos are my favorites, after Hadro nests.

[vital notch]

Whats the status on elite fish / AI for deinos?

[fathom hemlock]

Any timeline? elite fish are really important for deino to get perfect diet.

[steady ingot]

add more ai close to water in north lake

[soft nymph]

@pliant steeple it does and it’s /unstuck but #ai-feedback isn’t a channel to post that in. Next time try the command. If that doesn’t work go to your server’s chat room and follow the pinned messages to request a possible unstuck.

[pliant steeple]

ty

[limber vortex]

Guy I have come back to playing the isle and I haven't seen a single dibble ai. Have they been removed or moved from where they used to be?

[silver raven]

removed

[limber vortex]

why tho?

[silver raven]

Because they were awful

They provided free infinite food for rex megapacks and did nothing else

[limber vortex]

oh alr

[inland hemlock]

@wicked umbra Looking at the Lore behind The Isle (which Im also not really deep into) these animals make total sense since its in modern times. Same goes for the human buildings.

[silver raven]

Which "dinosaur times" ? Half the roster we have wasn't even around at the same time as the other half of the dinos in-game.

[graceful aspen]

ok so how often are you guys seeing fish as a deino ? curious what others think

[keen sparrow]

What are fish

[rigid minnow]

I was about to say the same thing.

[graceful aspen]

make deino fly or make the fish swim, one or the other

[keen sparrow]

Deino gonna need to burrow to since I been seeing schools of fish poking up outta the ground sometimes lmao

[inland hemlock]

@silent oracle The chickens do exist, I actually just killed one. BUT they make NO SOUND at all or the cooldown between their calls are super high because I usually only hear their footsteps.
I found mine in West Rail

[soft nymph]

@surreal wharf if it was small it was probably a goat or you saw a deer. They don’t have pronghorn AI

[surreal wharf]

yeah it wasn't a deer must of been a goat was just moving around without actually moving. Looked really wierd lol

[formal lava]

We need more aquatic Ai. And boar/deer added to croc diet.

[keen sparrow]

They could add the piranhacanda and have it patrol swamps like the Fel reaver

[fallow spoke]

@astral goblet you can right click at the edge of the water during the day and your pt will fish. Just left click when the fish gets into the center of your wings and youll grab it. Might help with getting food while they fix the ai spawns

[astral goblet]

yah that did not work at all.

[fallow spoke]

Yikes

[soft nymph]

@opal scaffold they were taken out due to bugs for a bit

[opal scaffold]

Ah I see thx :) is it public knowledge if/when they’ll return or is it best guess for now?

[soft nymph]

Nope. Falls under rule 10

[opal scaffold]

Gotcha🫡 thx for the info

[final skiff]

#ai-feedback message

I really think Ai needs to have its Perception and Behavior completely reworked, so that carnivores can actual ambush and/or track them. Then they need to have their Bleed and Stamina completely reworked, so that they can be killed using the same mechanics that work on other players, not just brute force.

Until that is done, Ai will always feel like they’ve been transplanted from a totally different, lesser game. The experience of hunting them is just THAT inconsistent with the experience of hunting a player, to such a degree that it’s actually harder for small tiers to kill Ai than players.

[grand badge]

I chilled high up on one these large gates as a Herrera, and a chicken walked into my proximity and freaked out because it "saw" me. How am I supposed to ambush them? AI also seems to have infinite stam at the moment. And they get stuck between rocks and trees very often.

[regal palm]

spawn more food for the flying dino

[knotty steeple]

You can spawn in food for yourself at will during the day

Do you know what spearfishing is?

[wraith ore]

Make the petry able to carry prey like the croc (cause i cant seem to catch any Rabbits as Peteranodon, and they spawn a lot, in contrast to chicken which seem to spawn less frequent)

Could make it the same system as crocs, hes able to skim anything half his weight.
Makes him more of a predator for smaller Players and for Ai

[regal palm]

i do now thanks.

[silver raven]

What's the point
It would only allow it to grab hypsi, which it can oneshot anyway

[radiant junco]

my buddy is fulyy stuck and command wotn work. ANy idea

[fallow spoke]

<@&933486433342222376>

[woeful sun]

FIX FISH

[tribal karma]

have the devs said aything about fixing the fish?

[woeful sun]

No

I wish

[grand badge]

I guess the overall number of fish is fine, but most of them live in the sky now. Flying fish have been an issue for years. At least we used to have enough in the water, too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3X388rMCyk

[earnest knot]

I agree makes early deino a nightmare and almost unplayable you really just have to rely on lucky food to get any kind of start. I struggle to find any fish and when I do they are always flying. It seems worse than it used to be. You would get some but not every single school of fish you encounter being 300 feet up

[keen sparrow]

They also spawn underground aswell, I’ve seen it south of delta where the top of the school will be coming in and out of the ground

[grand badge]

Currently you only have a chance to grow a deino if you cannibalize every fresh spawn deino and every other deino smaller than you.

Re: fish spawns, I don’t know if I'm hallucinating, but I think I sometimes also hear deer and boar under ground or inside rocks.

[sullen igloo]

what if its both? what if they spawn in rocks/under ground & and you're also hallucinating? scary stuff...

no but seriously, it can be v annoying to chase down a boar call only to realize its coming from the depths of hell within a mountain

[rustic lodge]

I have searched for a long time and have not seen a single elite fish I only know it spawns cause someone I played with killed 1 and that's it

And I've never ever seen a single frog

[cerulean bramble]

Yeah you have like 3 minutes after the fish spawn to kill them or they path out if the water even a little and become unkillable

[woeful sun]

fix FISH

[subtle wharf]

FIX THE FISH

[soft nymph]

^^^
<@&933486433342222376> spamming in all feedback channels…

[cyan burrow]

maybe they want them to fix the fish. people have been saying it for a long long time gotta try soemthing new to let them know they need to fix the fish

[coarse flint]

ah. yes. and spamming that will certainly help.

[cyan burrow]

nothing works as is they aren't doing anything about it when they dont spam maybe causing a scene will get there attention so they fix the issue

would love a perfect world were we dont need to bring things like this up at all but fish have been broken for almost a year and theres not talk about fixing them AT ALL

[cyan burrow]

lol what misinformation did i spread

what a joke

[cyan burrow]

LOL

they read it thats true but do they actually listen?

[coarse flint]

it's a feedback channel, not a command channel.

[cyan burrow]

lol yall are funny asf

[final skiff]

I wish I could remember exactly when the fish got so bad, because they used to be at least a little consistent. Sure, the Elite Fish sometimes took to the skies like gods and ate Deinos whole, but it got WAY worse at some point, I think at some point during the Rex Horde Test.

And then there are the Dactyls. Feels like every other update they fix them, then the very next update they’re invisible and intangible. They’ve been stuck that way for months now, just fully broken even though they’ve worked perfectly in multiple updates. It’s like the devs fix it, and then a new update comes along and overwrites the fix, which makes me sad. They’re fun to eat!

[blissful oar]

*for now. It breaks often and over

[cerulean bramble]

Since the "fix" I've seen none, I had 5 the day before ToT

[pearl tapir]

when do the devs plan on doing somethin about fish?

it will be a crime to add in spino with fish in this current state

[midnight dragon]

spino is not close to being done, they have plenty of time

[edgy gazelle]

How do we feel chat?

[sullen igloo]

the idea of legacy style AI spawns makes me cringe

i dont like the idea of the game just throwing food at you if you get under a certain % of hunger

feels like it directly contridicts the concept of proper resource management in the survival game

mid tier dinosaur ai is also

[edgy gazelle]

Dynamic legacy-style spawning isn't "throwing food", it creates responsive, living ecosystems where hungry carnivores slightly boost mid-tier prey probability nearby, rewarding adaptation and map awareness over static hotspot camping, while fixing broken food chains with balanced mid-tier AI that gives meaningful hunts without easy handouts.

[thorny dragon]

Legacy style spawning is the definition of easy handouts that promote hotspot camping

[edgy gazelle]

Static hotspots do reward map knowledge over actual gameplay skill.

[edgy gazelle]

But it replaces static, predictable clusters with dynamic, demand-driven spawns that respond to hungry carnivores and player activity, forcing real tracking, adaptation, and movement across the map instead of camping the same 5 rocks forever, which to me seems very boring.

[sullen igloo]

sorry, no. the avaceraptops spawning behind my rex thats been sitting down for 30 minutes because my hunger dropped below 70% is not a responsive, living ecosystem. its directly rewarding me for just sitting there and doing nothing.

[thorny dragon]

You're using a lot of buzzwords but it doesn't make that true

How does an ai spawning near you make you move? It does the opposite

[edgy gazelle]

70% more than likely wouldn't be the set hunger percentage for AI to spawn.

[sullen igloo]

instead of static predictable clusters, now every carnivore had a predictable cluster of ai around them!

incredible

[sullen igloo]

but thats what it was in legacy lol

and frankly if its lower thats... almost worse?

[edgy gazelle]

So then what's your point?

[sullen igloo]

"oh, you failed to properly keep your hunger up? you're now at 20-40%? here, have a free treat."

just completely negates the aspect that starvation is and should be a very serious threat in this game

[thorny dragon]

AI should spawn where players aren't and only become rendered when someone gets within range

As opposed to actually just spawning infinitely on players

[edgy gazelle]

Okay, see I can see that, but it should also be around players as well. Be honest, if you were a carnivore who was starving and couldn't find anything to eat wouldn't you want food to spawn near you?

[thorny dragon]

If I were starving and couldn't secure a meal then I should starve

[sullen igloo]

what i want is different from what i deserve based off my gameplay

[thorny dragon]

That's why there's a hunger bar in the game

(and why I want grazing removed before that gets mentioned)

[sullen igloo]

if starvation becomes basically a non issue, you might as well remove the hunger meter. it doesnt serve as a resource, it simply serves as a timer for PVP.

or, just a timer in general.

theres no risk if you know that, even if you fail to find food and support your animal, the game will forgo proper punishment for your failure and instead will just keep you propped up

[edgy gazelle]

Okay, I'm just gonna say this then: dynamic legacy spawning isn't "throwing food" or rewarding AFK sitting, it's a lightly tuned, probabilistic boost to mid-tier prey in zones with genuinely hungry, active carnivores (not exact hunger % triggers), paired with moving patrol zones and anti-clustering to prevent predictable clusters, forcing real movement, tracking, and adaptation while keeping starvation a real threat and fixing dead static hotspots.

[sullen igloo]

the "predictable cluster" doesnt disappear though

it just becomes every hungry carnivore player

we have unofficials that show us what happens when food is casually tossed to players that have relatively low hunger, even without it being a sure-fire thing.

[edgy gazelle]

Dynamic legacy-style spawning doesn't turn every hungry carnivore into a predictable cluster or casually toss food like some unofficials. It uses carefully tuned, low-probability boosts only in zones with genuinely low-food active players, paired with moving migration zones and strict anti-clustering caps to spread AI across the map, forcing actual movement, tracking, and skill while keeping starvation a real threat and eliminating static hotspot camping.

I understand both your point and reasoning, and I've seen what AI can do, especially on Unofficial servers and Official servers alike, but this would still be something cool to implement.

[keen sparrow]

This entire conversation is stupid, AI needs to be 100% built alongside the map and its biomes to give the world proper life, we don’t need paratrooper goats coming to your rescue.

[frigid sigil]

Guys I think you're arguing with a chat bot😅

[silver raven]

I think so too

[pearl tapir]

they had plenty of time this past year to fix fish, that's the point is they haven't done so. It's safe to assume spino will be added before fish fixes

There is a record lmao, go look at AI feedback. We got timestamps for fish lol

Just take a second and scroll up through ai feedback

my buddy wants to play deino, and he is new to the game and I am trying to convince him to not play hunger simulator but he thinks the fish spawns we have right now are normal lol

[wary terrace]

any US server i join there is no AI why is that and is it just happening to me?

i cant choose my mutations either its weird

[edgy gazelle]

I'm not a chat bot, I just know how to properly use grammar and if I was I'm sure it'd be like that one guy's suggestion in #general-feedback.

If you simply dislike the idea then just say that. 😭

[silver raven]

That's what a chatbot would say

[edgy gazelle]

Well, you’re entitled to your opinion, but I'm definitely not a chatbot. I have the ACT to thank for my grammar.

[edgy prism]

i just started today, no fish died 6 times as a croc because i could not find anything to eat other than a pig that wooped my A##

[next pilot]

Same, I think it's bugged a bit

And I was playing on EU and AU servers

[tall belfry]

The official servers are total garbage. My minecraft server in 2010 ran better than these ones. Find a good unofficial

[wraith seal]

@final skiff @grand badge Can either of you state which AI you are having issues with bleed/vemom/stamina with? Far as I know, AI is impacted by them

[grand badge]

I never saw any AI run out of stam or die to bleed or venom. If it's in the game, it's not noticable or helpful. In Legacy it was obvious. As a fresh spawn Utah you could kill an Ava by stacking bleed and chasing it until it ran of stam. It was difficult but possible.

[final skiff]

Everything that I’ve tried. Deer, hogs, Galli, basically anything that doesn’t die in one hit can run away far longer than a player can run after it, and doesn’t seem to mind bleed even a little.

I haven’t tested venom myself, but my issues are more with fresh spawns and ambush predators not being able to eat Ai at all unless the bug out or get stuck on terrain.
Turtles would be good to test on, since they can’t run away, otherwise, hogs just run into the sunset and you never see em again.

[olive yoke]

could somoene help idk what to do, i know he is not there we ask for help if somoene can

[spring tusk]

go in general 10

[neat night]

I would love if the boar noises didn't hurt my ears so much, holy mother of god they're like nails on a chalkboard.

[shy crystal]

Are elite fish fixed yet?

[soft mesa]

Not really? They spawn under schooling fish, chill until caught and if they're hit and don't die they almost instantly swimm away into oblivion.

[shadow surge]

Fish should be everywhere in water so that it’s feasible to grow in any river or lake. I guess time will tell

[modern berry]

these would be great for a.i. more food and realism fun

[silver raven]

Just HOW would that bring more realism

[pearl tapir]

Ai don’t bleed out, don’t die from fall damage, don’t drown either.

At one point when dibbie ai was around, I stashed 4 dibbies under logs to deny the Rexes from food.

They stayed there until I needed the food lol.

[modern berry]

realism as in,itll be fun hunting human species without guns. i shouldve used the word roleplay instead of realism lol

[mystic raft]

<@&933486433342222376>

[soft mesa]

Oh this is a new one, this elite fish is stuck in a log

[charred dew]

nah they did this since day1

[soft mesa]

Well, new one for me. I tried biting it from every angle and no dice it's just permastuck there

[misty jackal]

Yall are seeing elite fish still???

[soft mesa]

I do. not all the time but they're there at the bottom of fish school spawns usually

[misty jackal]

That’s how the always used to spawn, I haven’t played much deino in awhile because I always just get killed by another. Though the fish spawns that I have been seeing haven’t had any elite fish around them that I’ve seen

[modern berry]

true deino was my main at first but the constant starving and cannibalism is toooooo much so now im a rex player

[neat night]

Considering rivers and freshwater sources are supposed to be arteries of nutrients and life, they're sadly barren, so I like the ideas like catfish holes for Dryos and anything that lets a dino try to pull food out of the water.

[soft mesa]

Yeah never pick up food twice you must eat it from the ground

[misty moss]

Yeah, that’s the one thing I really want to see, is more life in the water. You don’t see that in any of the Big Three games, though BoB and PoT have more aquatic playable creatures.

[lofty ginkgo]

Not sure if this is a thing yet, but possibly make it so AI runs out of stam eventually?? I was running as a baby rex trying to catch a chicken in the forest and this thing had so much stam. Granted, totally L on me for missing my hits on a chicken 🥹 but a baby rex has so much stam, i feel like an ai should have lost stam at some point

[misty moss]

Would totally be okay with that

[neat night]

If the reason AI don't have more complex stats like stamina and blood is that it costs more processing, maybe use simplified systems to emulate them.

Like, for chasing them down, if we can't wear down their stamina, we still need them to be more responsive to our hunting tactics. They eventually need to slow down or they're just escaping machines.

At their spawn point they should be prone to slower more casual ambulation. Every once in a while they get a nudge to explore their territory at a trotting pace.

First instance of aggro should initiate a burst of erratic running away (like they do now) followed by a cooldown during which they default to a more trotting constant attempt to return to their spawn point or sprinting away from an active threat. But the cooldown on their sprinting mode would give predators a chance to reward themselves for keeping up with the opportunity to strike at that point.

I dunno if this is more complicated or less complicated than how it's handled already, but the AI can't strategize how to use stamina, so this at least gives them instructions on how to move like prey being chased instead of like the maniacal monsters they are now.

The bleeding, I have no idea why they can't use the same system we all do for bleeding.

[modern berry]

ai losing stamina and reducing speed value ,will be 1 of the best updates ever

[lofty ginkgo]

Right ???

[steep yoke]

So true

[eager quarry]

I’ve noticed a lot of schooling fish spawns still flying in the air like some killer bug hoard

[keen sparrow]

Maybe it’s a sharknado reference

[midnight star]

Is the deino ai better, i heard the fish ai isnt working and i havent played for a few months

[soft nymph]

It’s poop

[soft mesa]

It's pretty bad unless you hit right after a reset

[modern berry]

add bigger ai like 2 group of edmont or para and sinoceratops since they are big and slow..

ofc theyll have only 1 basic attack, to keep it balanced and easy for players to hunt

[autumn pivot]

Nice

[exotic sierra]

Anyone know how to fix ?

[thorny dragon]

What GPU do you have?

[modern berry]

wrong channel guys

[exotic sierra]

T-T o

[silver raven]

You know it's supposed to be a survival game, right ?

[modern berry]

theres ai in game already so whats your point . and a edmont is strong as heck bro. if only having to hunt players was an only option then ai wouldnt be in game,right?

[lament sapphire]

doesn't that make growing something like apexs too easy? the game is supposed to at least try to be challenging. with the current ai it already makes it way easier let alone adding something as big as Edmontosaurus?

[silver raven]

You're right about something, if there was too much AI you'd never have to hunt players
Which is why there is no AI larger than a boar, and hopefully never will be

[modern berry]

you both have good points that i already thought of but the edmont ai and para ai would be tough as heck

id like some big ai roaming around to live out my dino fantasy

[silver raven]

You literally said "they'd have only 1 attack so that they're easy to hunt"

[modern berry]

tough not hard. as in they wont die easy as also hunt easy as in if your starved itll be a bit of luck to come across ed or para to eat if your big enough or in group ect

[silver raven]

Yeah
No

There shouldn't be any AI to sustain apexes

[blissful oar]

Massive ai that is harmless? That’s going to feed hordes of rexes without effort

[flint fox]

I dont know, when I cant even get my Deino past 35% before it dies of starvation, it seems like the AI system is broken.

[lament sapphire]

for fish yeah

[flint fox]

Its not just Deinos and fish, Troodon juvies have a hard time with just about every AI except chickens. Rabbits too fast and boar/dear 1 shot them. And good luck trying to catch a non-white feathered chicken in the thick jungle.

Hell I even had a chicken fight back and made my screen slighlty bloodied. Didnt think a chicken would actually fight back.

And ive only ever seen 1 bull frog on a whole river, which is odd.

Not to mention the AI seem to have x-ray vision and can spot you 100 miles away

[lament sapphire]

my bad haven't seriously played the game in a while didn't know it was that bad hopefully it gets fixed soon i guess

[flint fox]

Well, I dont think AI should be able to sustain you, and just like with grazing, I dont think it should give you more than like 25% hunger. It should only be there to prevent death from starvation and should scale with the AI and predator. Like a bull frog isnt going to give an adult much of anything. Espeacially when its a large predator like a rex, allo, or something like that

But you have to give the player something, espeacially when server pops are low, and there just isnt enough players on to hunt.

I wouldnt want to lose my 6 hour grown Rex just because the server only has like 30-ish people on it, and almost 1/3rd of them are sitting at the bottom of a lake, or flying in the sky.

[lament sapphire]

thats fair yeah just gotta strike a balance somewhere like most of the things in the game i suppose

[flint fox]

Well I was playing a Cera on a server that only has AI corpses, and I spawned in at East Lake. I hit the sanctuary and made my way to North Lake, and I didnt see a single person the whole time, and there were like 80-ish people on. When I finally got to North Lake I was taking starvation damage and when I finally found a Pachy accross the river, I died before I could even think about trying to hunt it.

If there was atleast 1 or 2 AI i could have eaten along the way, I could have lived long enough to actually have an encounter with another player, but that just didnt happen.

[modern berry]

wrong, and 90%player base starves to death these days since Lack of a.i. and including all ai running from you when your 40feet away makes a starved,slow or low stam dino die. all facts

rumtin has a brain an knows what im talking about. i dont want Big A.i. added to make survival super eazy but a little ai variety wouldnt hurt anyone.im a week old player and im not the only new or old player dying to starvation when food,players and tiny ai are no where to be found

[blissful oar]

Right. We had dibble ai like that on the horde servers because they needed rexes to stay alive for testing. So there were tons of rexes who just lived of ai. The running away point is valid, cuse every ai has that issue right now but making such a big dino ai barely any challenge to hunt is going to end up overfeeding the population. You’ve got to at least make them difficult to kill.

Also, if you’ve played for a week, maybe you need more experience first? Dying of starvation is part of the game. There is ai, the spawnrate just needs to get adjusted a bit.

[modern berry]

i knew about the isle since it released. watched famil n friends play for years im not an idiot an 2! ok if they make edmont or watever big ai a challenge i wouldnt mind at all. this is more like a starve and survive mixpack game at best..until shyt is fixed

[blissful oar]

I just said you're inexperienced. Not an idiot. I don't think you're an idiot at all. The reason there isn't bigger ai than boar is so people cant just grab ai and afk grow. That already happens a lot. Again, the spawnrate might need fixing, but I don't think an entirely new ai to feed the apexes is a good idea. But that's just my honest and blunt opinion.

[modern berry]

sorry i meant no offensive. i feel you forreal.ill jus add that how about community servers get a option to config an add their own ai then

[blissful oar]

that sounds good, since a lot of servers also work with dino limits

so you can limit populations with that while having AI high

[modern berry]

that way the official servers wont be easy for good players like you,trying to survive

[blissful oar]

that's all good mate, it's just that things can get heated sometimes and the point gets lost in the heat of the moment 🙂

[modern berry]

imo i would be ok in a server with big ai and no mixpacking or megapacking hehe

[blissful oar]

I'm sure there are some servers out there that would fit that description, you'd just have to ask around a bit

[modern berry]

https://klipy.com/gifs/im-not-listening-eric-cartman

cartmen-it was the heat..of the moment..

[median skiff]

if a rex in everma can eat organs for deceased rex if you r not cannlbe and not get muscle spams

[hot urchin]

Admin only know how to remove the truth of the comment/experience about the game.

not bothering the user experience. Good job

That's why Unofficial server > Official server

[thorny dragon]

Read rule 11. #ai-feedback is only for suggestions and feedback about the game's AI

[hot urchin]

Maybe can we debate about spreading misinformation?

AI spawns for fish was relative low? or I am wrong about this fact?

[thorny dragon]

That wasn't remotely what your post said

You can provide something constructive and on topic when your posting cooldown has finished

[hot urchin]

Doesn't matter. Because the feedback might not take into consideration.
Otherwise, we won't had that topics until now.

Deep down, we know why.

[silver raven]

lol

[raw oar]

@misty jackal the fish are fixed on ht

[modern berry]

para and sinoceratops as ai,what you guys think? or what ai you have in mind,thatll improve game

[misty jackal]

I like the sound of that, might play a deino tomorrow then 👀

[raw oar]

do it , ive already seen a prime deino pair in hll lake on a server , theres obviously elite fish then , plus the schooling fish is really consistant

[misty jackal]

Pray it doesn’t get messed up when brought to the live server, crocs moving all over isn’t even how real crocs live lmao. They pick a section of stream typically close by to where they were born and they’ll live there until either resources force them to move or they lose a fight

[misty jackal]

So far I’ve yet to see an elite fish after a few hours, however I’m seeing schooling fish regularly so perhaps the elite fish are spawning under them out of bounds cause if I remember correctly under the school is where the elite fish used to spawn

[soft mesa]

This would work if crocs didn't have to travel for prime and also people couldn't easily avoid the water and let the croc starve really easy. All it takes is one "big croc in water access us7" in some unofficial community for nobody to go there ever again if they become non migratory.

As it stands you can be in a "prime" watering spot like west rail and see nobody on a 115 server for hours.

[sullen igloo]

<@&933486433342222376>

[unique loom]

Another one got hacked RIP

[misty moss]

Dafuq is a Parasaurosaurus?! 😂

[charred dew]

Does the goat still do that weird drifting animation when it moves in the game?

[final mica]

Yes, at least for me the past days.

[misty moss]

"I'm stiff af boi!"

[charred dew]

https://tenor.com/view/hachi-palitinho-gif-24192001

[hot urchin]

how does AI spawn work?
I will the whole East coast during low pops, less than 20 player, still can't find any sea turtle

[modern berry]

hope devs are working to fix entire ai spawn system

[hot urchin]

Dont get me wrong. Dont think they will fix that. Otherwise, we might this improvement long time ago.

Just accept it with the cost of the money not costing alot like others game.

Just give and take.

[modern berry]

no you accept it i wont lol. and they are fixing it

[unique loom]

I've been very patient and I'm starting to lose it. I was a Deinosuchus, I jumped out of the water to get a goat when all of a sudden, it shoots up into the air, and starts walking in the air. Don't even get me started on the fish

[azure raft]

The ai is fine ish, it just should be easier to locate

[hot urchin]

seaturtle as well. i can't find 1 in east costal area. maybe sea turtle had extinct in that area. Or I need maphack as well just to find these AIs

[slate musk]

if you could add a icon for ai so you can smell it or you can hide and do a special call like theres and lure the ai to you and then kill it

[silver raven]

Lame af
Elon Musk was more generous

[weak shore]

ai sucks it honestly goes from to much to nothing and their really buggy

[unique loom]

That's so real I starved my croc because there was no food and I was at 64% and about to get prime

[misty jackal]

Welp, do not attack boar when you’re growing, they will one shot you

[fallow spoke]

A canon event all must learn at some point lol

[modern berry]

nno they do not unfortunately

[tiny ridge]

Interesting

[jaunty dock]

Idk i think they do they just have a massive blood pool cuz i bleed out a boar once as an allo

[modern berry]

im sure they dont bleed out

[jaunty dock]

Really did you test it?

[modern berry]

😅 yes

[jaunty dock]

Alr im not sure but you said you tested it

[soft mesa]

Just watched a ptera pick up a whole school of fish and carry it into the sky lol

[silver raven]

Gluttony

[modern berry]

decrease all A.i speed

[sullen igloo]

#ai-feedback message #announcements

[rich basalt]

Depends on area, players nearby, and time in the area.
(Using turtles since you brought them up)
Turtles spawn on all beaches from west rail to east lake (south side of the map) except for some areas of swamp beach.
The more players nearby, the more ai that spawns.
The longer you’re in an area, the more likely they will spawn.
It takes time, not instant usually. But hanging out in an area will also increase the chance they spawn

But it applies to all ai rn

[sweet creek]

Well it doesn’t rly work for the fish cuz they are hella buggy and dont spawn at all more often then not

[rich basalt]

The fish do spawn, schooling fish are pretty much everywhere besides the little ponds.
But we know that there are issues with fish spawning all over the place
The Ht has them most mostly fixed as far as I’m aware

[sweet creek]

Then we need those fixes like rn on normal servers cuz it’s horrible to just have a starving deino 99% of the time

[rich basalt]

I personally don’t think a big croc should survive on schools of fish personally. It would help if frogs spawned in the water more often tho.
But they still do spawn a decent amount.

[sweet creek]

I’m not talking about schools of fish I’m talking about elite fish. Both are nearly impossible to come by most of the time

[rich basalt]

Elite fish spawn here and there. Mostly in the deeper water. I haven’t really seen many in the area between falls for example.
But delta has em, as does water access.

It’s just annoying to get actual players cause most people just grow around the ponds etc.
I hate how many safe spots there are to drink. Not to mention the chore and risk of moving to different water sources.
Everyone pretty much plays the big stuff. Not really any smaller tiers

Reabsorption and reticulated kidneys need to go for most Dino’s imo

[hot urchin]

Thanks mate. Good to know about the ai spawn mechanism. So it is not rng nor the fixed respawn time in that area.

From the west rail, there are few spots where you can always find a seaturtle, about 4-5 spots. It just depend where did the seaturtle move to jungle and hard to spot by.

Much appreciated for the information.

[rich basalt]

Np.
Ai is a lot easier to find than people think, but because it no longer “exists” on a map but is now spawned in people tend to just run around before the spawn is triggered.

[hushed forum]

Im about 68% Deino and have yet to see an elite fish. The only option seems to be to hang out in the most active part of the map. Which would be fine if every other croc didnt have to do the same thing. And who can blame someone if their croc is about to starve to attack another one. I started in the swamp, moved all the way up the river as far as it goes for the last 6 hours over the last few days and have see a total of 1 schooling fish (doesnt do anything for large croc) and have seen 0 elite fish.

One of two things needs to happen.

1. When deer or boar rot, the amount of food you get should not be less than if you eat it normal, so crocs can maintain nutrients a bit better.
2. Fix croc AI spawns

Elite fish used to have the problem of flying through the air. now it seems schooling fish do the same thing. What happened? Please fix.

what happened to when the waters looked like this picture?

[soft mesa]

<@&933486433342222376>

Bro indeed

[uneven night]

I understand your problems, had the same thing a few days ago. I think Elite fish and schooling fish are not the problem bc in the time that i grew a Deino in east lake I had times where i've found 10 elite fish and around 15 schooling fishes but there were other times where there were no ai at all in a lake. The Ai Spawns in lakes and rivers are just really bad and not consistent. In my Opinion there should be way more AI's for crocs bc at some point i think at around 65% Ai is just no sutainable for a deino that size. Another thing is that the map at it self is not suitable for a deino just an example from my side: I've spawned in East Lake and grew there until 68%. In my whole Lifetime i've never witnessed another dino drinking there. In my Opinion there should be waterways that connect every lake with rivers.

[hot urchin]

there will be pro and cons if waterways connect every lake with rivers.
more safe drinking spot for dino. harder for deino to punish when they need to drink.

Unless official server can host more than 115 players for such a big map

[soft nymph]

@faint loom they don’t bleed out

[faint loom]

Then let them bleed out

[soft nymph]

They’re not programmed to do that

[faint loom]

Which is why I suggested that be changed my good stranger on the internet

[soft nymph]

Nah

[faint loom]

Well the secret to happiness is to never argue with fools Ive been told, so you are right 🙂

[rich badge]

I think to add, (for east lake) there should be smaller ai rather than the Deer/Boar. like I don’t see any bullfrogs or rabbits/chickens nearby. Adding more variety feels like a step in the right direction to help the early life and make lakes more lively

[lean grotto]

Its kind of silly they dont when it pretty much screws over omni and troodon if you dont abuse a bug to lock them in place to kill (which should also be fixed at the same time imo). Without doing that, you could end up depleting your entire stamina/diet chasing depending on what the ai deer or boar does. Not to mention they can just kill a juvi omni, troodon, in a single hit.

[soft nymph]

That’s why it’s best to scavenge or go after smaller prey

[sullen igloo]

ai bleeding out is already planned anyway

[rich basalt]

You could just hunt other things besides deer and boar.
Chickens, rabbits, tacos, etc

[lofty acorn]

They fixed the AI for deino?

[soft nymph]

Not yet

[shell bone]

People wanting all AI to be free food lmao

[pine fractal]

Anyone else having issues with HT Elite fish not giving nutrients?

[modest nymph]

It's a known issue #announcements message

[obtuse meadow]

Don't attack pigs as Troo, high risk, low reward. you can fill your belly on a chicken, and go back to that same chicken for more, why bother with a pig? It's not on diet, doesn't flip out like a player you might troll, and it's corpse, if you kill it, will surely draw larger preds to the area.

[charred dew]

I don't think boars are capable of performing back kicks; it really goes against their anatomy

[sullen igloo]

#ai-feedback message @tame junco while i do agree boar shouldnt have a 360 bite radius... why did you dismount looking directly down at the floor :stare: thats what made you dismount inside of it

[empty sandal]

honestly pretty realistic that a lone troodon can't hunt a wild boar too

boar are just far bigger and scarier animals irl than the species of troodon which isle's one is based on.

[modern berry]

been saying this since i started playing. atleast add cape buffalo or para,edmont or something to eat that isnt faster than superman lol

[rich basalt]

I disagree.
Too much ai leads to growth and survival being easier than it already is.
Playing a large carnivore should come with the fact that you need to hunt other players.
Otherwise everyone will just play like in legacy, nothing but apex’s really

Rex can already get prime just by getting ai early on then living on turtles, boars, deer etc.
there’s no need to add more ai to further boost the allo and Rex populations

If you’re playing a mid tier+ carnivore, then you need to hunt players. But no one is even playing mid tiers and below for the most part because of the misbalance of Dino’s being played

[obtuse meadow]

There will always be some who get a thrill playing small, dancing with danger. Maybe there's more of my kind out there, I'll never know, they're probably hiding in the bushes right next to me.

Plenty of AI food, once you're big enough to hunt.

[sullen igloo]

yes they should totally add something larger than the diablo AI that sustained 10+ rex groups

[modest nymph]

If more AI, it should be more small AI, like tiny AI -- rats and bugs and stuff -- to prop up the small tier and baby dinosaurs, not big stuff that will inflate the prime elder mid/large/apex carni population beyond how absurd it already is proportionally

[soft mesa]

Yeah my problem with ai right now (other than fish and frogs) is basically your options are chickens. If you're not a big Dino, that's it. That's the option. Rabbits are too fast and everything else tok big.
Big apexes SHOULD struggle on AI. Like if ai counts are server wide and spawn around players (which they do), then if 2 fg rexes are on a server, alone, together, they should have enough AI to squeak by. The second there's more than about 10 people that should fall off to impossible to sustain them both because the other scattered players are also spawning some of the AI limit and eating them and taking away from the rexes forcing them to seek out players or split up. And if there's enough players they shouldn't find almost any unless they are seeking out players.

Meanwhile playing juvies sucks cause nothing can eat a boar on spawn and a small deer is a lucky catch if you live thru it and that's all you can get. Rabbits are too fast, frogs and crabs are a joke and chickens never spawn. You're lucky if you find a taco (and are big enough to dig) or by some miracle a sea turtle. Dont even think about finding a galli or dryo. This all assuming you even have these on your diet list. We need more small or medium ai 100%.

[shell bone]

AI is plentiful and I've never had an issue finding the big ones like deer and boar. Most people complaining about it are, honestly, having a skill issue

We'll have rats, lizards, and snails as AI eventually for the smaller guys

[sullen igloo]

what is up with everyone wanting large animals to be sustained solely off AI even moreso than they are now? is that not the exact opposite you would want from a survival game where players are an inherent resource?

"big ai like edmonto" no, we do not need MORE rex megapack filling AI.

[modern berry]

some people like a bit of realism.hunting big would be fun an a relief from fighting mega packs 24/7 and the big ai doesnt have to be ez to hunt,also if they let people add their own ai dinos/modded ai to private servers i dont see the harm in that. hell you can walk for hours an not see a player or ai sometimes.

[sullen igloo]

okay but you do realize it would just make... MORE megapacks, right?

sure, maybe you dont need to fight them, you just need to avoid 20 more that are roaming around the map fully sustained with just AI

it is just inherently against the very core of the game lmao

and frankly if you can currently walk for hours and not see an AI, you are horrible at finding AI. this is one of the most AI heavy times in the game, to the point where even now, solo rexes are able to get themselves to adult via just boar/turtle/deer.

[soft mesa]

#ai-feedback message @final skiff I suppose you'd have to program them to be aggressive to only things big enough to be a threat tho, and how? Troos and omni make it so it can't just be a size thing. You couldn't leave out things like trikes either cause mix packing is gonna be meta until they find a way to punish it enough to make it worse than the benefits.
If you just let them aggro everything you just have an herbi/noob unplayable kill corpse zone where all the corpses are useless and inaccessible and hypsi that can't see just gets instant stomped and nobody can play there.

I think brachi AI has the potential to do this better.

A single, very big, very loud ai. It wanders so you're never locked out of one area. It may even strip plants as it walks thru a place. It aggros everything cerato and bigger on sight, and anything that deals it damage. It's too big to be meaningfully hindered by omnis or troos even in huge packs. It hits like a truck so you regret attacking it. Both herbis and carnivores have a REASON to attack it and vice versa (carnivores for food, herbis cause they're food competition). After it goes down another can't spawn for x amount of time.

[modern berry]

i think the branchi could get in defensive mode once it sees a big carnivore an as you get close it kinda bluff runs at you. ect. ofc ai needs stam and bleed stats so they wont continue to have infinite blood and stamina

[soft mesa]

Im really hoping brachi will be very boss like in its implementation as AI

[fading snow]

anyone else noticed a lack of goat spawns?

[soft nymph]

All in highlands

[fading snow]

im talking about highlands

[slim thunder]

I’m trying to prime a PT regularly but I’m struggling to consistently complete 5 prime requirements. Usually I hit sanctuary, perfect diet, no spasms, and no infertile. I suspect the issue to be a failure to register zones as a PT. Does anyone know specifics here, for example if you have to land in a zone for 20 seconds or if flying in the zone for 20 seconds is okay?

[sleek mantle]

hm, i've seen plenty of them in ht and evrima

[robust smelt]

you have to kill and eat other spawns like taco, chicken and rabbit if there are no goats - takes around a minute and a goat will most likely spawn

[crimson carbon]

Why is it foggy most of the time? It ruins the gaming experience.

Keep the rain & fog in check.

[final skiff]

First off, there already is weight gated reactions in the temp Ai, it’s just super inconsistent. Chickens used to attack Pteranodon and Troodon, but run from bigger threats, like a full grown Pteranodon. They have done it before and can do it again. Letting small predators hang around in the zone would be fine too, since the SECOND they attack something, they are surrounded by hostile adults, so don’t do that. The only “free” food in the circles would be from scavenging other carnivores who died, or hunting things like Compies and Oviraptor.

As for mix packing, I feel like the last few times people have responded to this proposal I drew up, they didn’t bother to read it, cause I address that in the text.
Yes, technically a Trike would be safe hiding inside this nesting ground, but diet food would NEVER spawn in either circle, and there isn’t even grass to graze on in the inner circle. So yes, it is a shelter, but it’s basically a less safe version of a building or cave, because you still HAVE to leave to eat and drink, or else go infertile.

On top of that, stepping in a nest at ALL would trigger an attack. Not a full to-the-death agro, but enough to knock you off of their nest. So big herbivores would risk constant chip damage if the don’t watch their steps super carefully, and if a trigger happy Steg or Trike fights back after getting knocked off a nest? They are vulnerable to the exact same kind of snowballing that the carnivores are. Friendly fire is turned on for all herbivores already, so rowdy player will be stomped to death by the herd.

Also, I drew Lambeosaurs specifically because it’s not a proposed member of the roster. They would never rush to the defense of a player herbivore, not even a different type of Hadrosaur. They only defend themselves, as the devs intended players to do. So you can co-habitate if you are a herbivore or are tiny, but they will NEVER have your back.

Even if your wait until two Ai Hadros leave for water and follow them to water, they will only defend eachother if attacked, and Isle preserve you if you accidentally hit one of them while trying to third party and protect them, cause now you’re on their hit list too. Your only slightly safer due to numbers, but most Carnivores will probably hard focus a player species following Ai Hadros anyhow, out of spite and for diet.

[final skiff]

Big agree!! I love the idea of a BIG BOSS Ai.

A lot of people act like Ai in The Isle cannot be fun and fulfilling to play against ever, no matter why, but o don’t understand that attitude at all. TONS of third person action games are built entirely around JUST hunting or fighting monsters, and all of them are fun.

Like, literally every Monster Hunter game ever made?? The have big animals with diverse move pools, telegraphed attacks, aggressive Ai damage thresholds with visible scars and points where the Ai decides to retreat. And those games work perfectly, arguably better, in multiplayer.

I don’t get why some Isle players think that the devs are incapable of doing that? Just because hog and deer Ai is clearly unfinished? Have some faith in your devs, gamers!!

Just because the skill ceiling is high doesn’t mean that its impossible to make a bot that feels smart, is fun to fight, and is still designed to be fought and conquered. Tons of games have done it and some of them are even multiplayer.

[final skiff]

And once a good framework for an Ai Nesting Ground is built, it could be iterated on to make small Ai nests in Sanctuaries, burrowing and climbing Ai that runs out of reach of big predators while fighting small ones, and Ai in out of the way zones like islands and mud flats, where Big carnivores like Rex and Allo would waste a TON of time and stam trying to get to the Ai, only for the Ai to just swim away or leave with superior mobility. Make small Ai too fast or well hidden for Apex Theropods, but still aggressive toward predators in their weight class.

[feral stag]

#ai-feedback message its following u bc it wants to kill u

#ai-feedback message i’ve seen lotsss of rabbits and tacos

[modest nymph]

Also I love the tiny pouncer backpacks. Makes me want hypsi to be able to latch on big animals tbh and it would probably be less work than playable teenies

[final skiff]

I’d love to land on bigger animals as even Pteranodon, but I feel like people would inevitably abuse that for mix-packing 🤷‍♀️
I just wanna watch the drama, so a tiny enough playable that it can’t be food, scout, or artillery (Hypsi turrets) would work. But maybe even if they just didn’t let Hypsi while on another animal? I would personally argue that these playables should stick to only animal that human being could comfortably carry around. Hypsilophodont is actually pretty big, by that measure. Bigger than most dogs I’ve had, and none of them were easy to carry around.

Mostly I think that any and all games that people tend to spend hours and hours in at a time benefit from side content that lets the play rest their brain in between tense gameplay. Like if Elden Ring had a fishing minigame, having the option of a tiny, no stress playable to hop onto in between actual runs, especially on LONG growth animal, like losing a Prime Trike, would help sooth player frustration.

It would need some weird help for server counts though. Wouldn’t want have the server to be useless as food.

[final skiff]

I wish I knew what set them off, cause I’ve had blood thirsty deer come after me on a fresh spawn that hadn’t killed or attacked anything yet, or even grouped up with others who might’ve.

I do miss when Chickens and Compies were hyper aggressive though. I basically never see them anymore cause even when they spawn in, they just bolt, never to be seen again. Compies can pounce and latch! They used to actually do that, which would be a great way to teach new players about bucking while they’re still small.

[modest nymph]

Yeah, I think the simplest solution would be to just not let hypsi spit while being a backpack xP Hypsi is only 20kg so most animals should have no trouble I think, except perhaps other tiny tiers. I'm biased as I love hypsi to begin with though xP

I also like the idea of playable compies and pteros (and return of playable taco from ye olde ancient legacy) but I think it's a potentially difficult ask of dev resources since they would need a whole suite of new animations/sounds for the interactions that players would do that AI don't, like drinking, resting, etc., so I raise it mostly as a path of least resistance

[feral stag]

u existing is threatening enough lol. i think when ure within it’s radius it just goes into defense mode (i’ve only ever had this behavior happen as baby tho)

[crimson carbon]

We need bigger AI & AI herbivores in the game.

So large carnivores can practice their attack & not be hungry all the time.

[silver raven]

No we don't

If you're playing a big carnivore, you're supposed to have practiced already
During your juvie phase for example

[crimson carbon]

With what exactly?

Juvi trex is vulnerable to every other dino who do you want them to practice with?

[silver raven]

Juvie rex can feed off the existing AI perfectly fine until it's big enough to kill most prey in the game

Sea turtles come to mind

[crimson carbon]

You do understand that you cannot practice your attacks as a juvi rex & only a prime rex can kill most carnivores on a 1v1 but then they all can outrun it.

Most Rex players survive over AI boars & deer that's why they are inexperienced in fights & usually get killed in their first fight with an equal opponent.

[silver raven]

More AI won't fix people's skill issues
It's the opposite

Less AI would force them to actually engage with other players and learn to use their different attacks rather than just bite on a target that never fights back until it dies

[crimson carbon]

It will if AI is gonna be herbivores like grown trikes & stegos

[silver raven]

You have players for that

[crimson carbon]

Who roam in mix packs & over packs.

[silver raven]

Just like rexes

[crimson carbon]

What choice do rexes have? Spend hours growing it & die in their first fight?

[silver raven]

How awful do you have to be to die in your first fight as a FG rex
Unless you got attacked by a bigger rex

[crimson carbon]

Try attacking a trike & stego of the same weight.

I would love to see your skills. Make sure you share the link of the video for us all to see.

[silver raven]

Just so you know, if a fight isn't going your way you can run away

[crimson carbon]

Rex can't run from 💩 🤣🤣🤣 that's the biggest problem of em all.

[silver raven]

What really ? Did you unbind your sprint button in order to not be able to run from anything ?

[crimson carbon]

Base rex speed : 33.5 km/h
Base stego : 32 km/h
Base trike : 32 km/h

Rex stamina : 1 min
Stego : 1 min 45 secs
Trike : 1 min 15 secs

Rex gets locked out after losing stamina but trikes & stegos can still defend themselves.

[silver raven]

I'm 99% sure these speeds are wrong
But even if they were you forgot to mention rex's murdersprint and the fact it has better stamina regen than everyone else

Also how are stego an dtrike able to fight without stamina, but rex isn't ? Is it because you can only fight if you can spam crush ?

[crimson carbon]

If you think they are wrong you're welcome to present the real ones.

[halcyon elk]

question, why does deer fight back more than boar? well that is at least my experiance(how you spell that damn word?...)

[silver raven]

I've been looking up some speed charts other people made
I found one for hypernova which is outdated, the other one is from evrima quick guide, which gets updated very frequently
Neither of them put stego and trike as fast as you do

I know other trustable people in here made more recent ones, but I have other things to do thna look for them

[crimson carbon]

Also trikes & stegos can regan stamina standing up but rex have to lay down after emptying the stack.

[silver raven]

Unless you can show evidence of that I'll consider it false as well

[crimson carbon]

Well since you work at white house you shouldn't be discussing a game anyways.

[crimson carbon]

Boar fights back too but after receiving considerable damage

[knotty steeple]

Rex at 88% is 33.7km/h
Stego at 88% is 30.6km/h
Trike at 88% is 25.2km/h

They are not running you down, especially because rex regens stamina twice as fast while trotting than any other creature in the game. Only scenario you can get ran down by a stego is if youre not full on stamina, or ate a few swings beforehand.

[knotty steeple]

Nothing can regen stamina without sitting once theyre below 20%, unless youre a deino/beipi floating in the water.

[crimson carbon]

Why did you specifically choose 88% growth?

[knotty steeple]

Because thats their peak power, and you also chose 33.5km/h for rex in your example, which is very close to that

[final skiff]

I guess, but usually they run. I don’t get what makes them choose one or the other, cause it sure doesn’t seem to be weight. They’ll run from a Ptera, but charge a Dilo at the same stage, even though it’s heavier 🤷‍♀️

[final skiff]

I think the other argument against playable Ai is just that they wouldn’t necessarily have complete or interesting lifestyles. Especially since burrowing is still not in the game, even poor Dryo can be challenging to be invested in. I love playing Dryo, but every time I nest in players, 1 out of 3 ALWAYS gets bored and either throws themselves off a ledge of starts attacking their siblings. Herbivores in general need a little more to do, or they get murder crazy out of boredom.

But that might get worked out automatically as they get Ava to the point that it is both playable and Ai. Some existing Ai might get new features in parallel. Honestly, I don’t think Compies or Dactyls necessarily need to be able to rest. I don’t think any other animal in the game needs more than one hit to kill them, so it’s highly unlikely they’ll need to regen HP ever. Just make them super agile, with stam that regens fine while standing, and the ability to eat rotting meat, and they’d almost feel feature complete.

Y’also, my rule of thumb for clarity is that:
Pteranodon = Ptera
Pterodactylus = Dactyl

That way there’s no overlap.

[final skiff]

I think they changed it because deer has a much more obvious attack animation, where boar kinda feel like they kill you by touching you. Longer limbs means more obvious kick. No idea is that’s true tho, just my guess.

[halcyon elk]

Aaah i see, well it does make sense when you say it like that, thanks

[modest nymph]

Yeah 100%. We absolutely need more non-combat activities for animals to do -- nesting used to be The Thing, but elder system has made that prohibitive for casual nesters. Smalls like dryo, beipi, etc. can still do it, but like you said that's rough when those animals can be difficult to invest in otherwise

[feral stag]

yesh idk i’ve wondered too

[tepid coral]

<@&401466542140817419>

[thorny dragon]

?

[tepid coral]

how does one get on bosch servers?

[thorny dragon]

Search for unofficials on the evrima beta branch

[tepid coral]

how do you search for unofficials?

[thorny dragon]

On the right side, click the Official filter and change it to Unofficial

[tepid coral]

THANK YOUUUUUUU

almost refunded

[brazen juniper]

It is unacceptable that a swamp of such large size, with rivers flowing in various directions, has no fish available. When playing as a dinosaur, fish are visible and even jump out of the water. However, when playing as a crocodile, no fish appear. This discrepancy has already resulted in the loss of two crocodiles due to starvation, and the others are left without hunting alternatives. Following the river means either dying of hunger or being eliminated by another adult.

The map shows animals in abundance, yet the rivers remain without fish. This situation compromises gameplay and makes survival as a crocodile unfeasible. In the past, this was not the case. It is inconsistent that a lake of such size has not a single fish, especially considering that during the age of dinosaurs there were far more marine animals than terrestrial ones.

The game can and should be challenging, but not to the point of making survival impossible due to the absence of basic resources. Veteran players are already frustrated, and newcomers are likely to give up when faced with such disproportionate difficulty.

I request immediate attention from the administrators to correct this balancing issue. Without proper measures, the player community feels neglected and demotivated. <@&401466542140817419>

[normal fable]

I hope you know we do not work on the game.