ai-feedback-discussion

[lethal fog]

isn't that what they're trying to prevent?

[dawn plume]

Well, I could. i think grazing should give huge debuffs so you are forced to actually look for diets.

[lethal fog]

So you'd punish players for keeping themselves alive?

after almost a year carnis can finally nest again

wait more than a year actually

[dawn plume]

I've nested with no issue.
Sorry but maybe you're just very bad at the game?

No offense.

But I've had no issue nesting with troo, carno and so on

[lethal fog]

I don't know man but I don't like nesting with 10 ceras 6 dilos and 2 stegos around

[dawn plume]

Apparently you gotta nest where you can find food, not in the middle of nowhere, but so what?

[dawn plume]

I've never had anyone around, done like 8 nests with carnivores in the past 12 days (that's how long I've been playing)

80 hours.

Raised a bunch of babies

[lethal fog]

maybe you just hate fun

[dawn plume]

And I'm not some cyber athlete

[dawn plume]

No, it's just that I like my fun hard earned, and you like it shoved down your throat free of charge and struggle.

[lethal fog]

I don't think I am bad at the game when I just don't feel like fighting a giant mixpack of 4 ceras a dibble and 2 stegos just to keep myself alive for the next 30 minutes

[lethal fog]

if you think so

#ai-feedback message

[lethal smelt]

Nah you are just straight up wrong and inconsiderate on so many levels based on everything you've said here.

There's more to survival than just food.
The lack of ai was terrible to the point where that was the sole thing you would think of 24/7. And it was predominantly based on luck, not skill.
Couldn't travel comfortably, nest or chill for even a minute without scurrying around for the next possible meal. It also worsened the hotspot crisis. Nobody would care about organizing hunts and tracking prey - it was just kos because everyone's desperately starving.

If you didn't notice any of this, then you are the one who hasn't played enough of this game.
And lol you've played 12 days so I know for a fact you haven't played enough.
I have 300+ hours, I know what I'm talking about. Ive seen how patterns have been these past many months as ai has evolved. And trust me when I say it is extremely unhealthy to have scarce AI. It becomes a desperate lifeless kos-fest.
As I mentioned earlier, there's many other aspects of survival which weren't even at play cause without AI, food was 99% of your purpose at any given time.

.
However I will say that this luxury of surviving easily with AI should only be available to small tiers. Cause their hunting success rates are overall low.
Apexes or even mid tiers should have to struggle far more to survive and actually hunt players.

[lethal fog]

^

[lethal fog]

I doubt that a fully grown allo or rex will be able to survive on AI

[lyric lava]

Tbh i think you're just lying too.

And if you arent people dont always have 4 whole days out of 2 weeks to play the game.

And the experience of running around looking for another player or literally anything at all for 20 minutes only to find your own corpse is not fun.

If i have 2 hours to play the game I dont want it to be a walking simulator

[lethal smelt]

Yup whoever has played deino will know that eating a boar gives you like one small tick on your hunger bar only.
So allo would have to eat like 4-5 boars and rex around 12-15 boars to go from 0 to 100 which will not be enough to sustain them for long, given how many allos and rexes there will be.

[placid nimbus]

no one thinks you're cool because you want a hard game

[lyric lava]

But has he beaten all the DKC games? Only then can he call himself a gamer

[dawn plume]

Git gud I guess...

[lethal smelt]

Don't fall for the bait

[dawn plume]

Ah yes, what a horrible bait it is - to tell people that if they actually get good at the game, they will be able to accomplish things they can't now

[lyric lava]

Lmao EXACTLY what i thought he would say tbh

[final skiff]

Whatever it was, it’s definitely fixed now. Raised a Ptero to adult and only got swarmed once on an all fish diet, and even that was after flying for a while with the fish in my mouth.
Now all we need if for them to make the little bastards edible again! 😋

Plus, you could be on a server with basically no players near you, or a server full of mix pack gank squads who think they’re playing Fortnite. The more options the better, especially if that includes ai critters that can bury you if you’re too cocky or attack the wrong end. And why WOULDN’T you want to join in on a Diplodocus hunt or something similar!?

[gusty helm]

ahhh how mutch i love playing dino family and how nice it is that there is no need to kill anymore...

[final skiff]

Luck plays an integral part in PVP as well. I lost a juvenile Stego to a pack of 4-5 Omnis yesterday. Losing to them was all about skill, and I like to think I put up a good fight, given the odds (bloodied at least three of em, but they still got me), but then finding me? Pure luck. I way well hidden and not moving in dense jungle, cause I heard them barking far off, but in the direction I was heading, so I hid to consider if I could go any other way. But, they stumbled right onto me, actually went past me, then noticed me and pounced. Horrible luck for me, but a very lucky find for them!!

[lethal smelt]

Playing a small part is fine
Dependence on luck is a problem

[final skiff]

One of the most entertains things I’ve seen was an adult Cera trying to catch a baby Troodon that was really giving him the run around. He got him eventually, but it’s nice to know that tiny tiers can actually outmaneuver big fellas, not just on paper but in practice. I wanna see that again when Trex comes along.

I still almost starved as a Stego in the woods, cause none of that ground cover is grazable apparently, and the next biome over was the swamp. Omni pack solved my problem for me.

What I think a lot of people are missing is that the game is not balanced, and that’s not a bug; it’s a feature. Ptero will NEVER be able to take on any of the other carnivores face to face, no matter how much tweaking is done, but nobody plays Ptero to get a kill count. You play Ptero to fly around the whole map, spy on other peoples’ drama, and go fishing. No one plays Deino to test their skills. You play Deino to make players with hours on a creature they’ve been growing absolutely soul themselves when the biggest set of teeth in the game (currently) materializes out of thin air to send them to the creature select screen. Choosing a creature in the game is both a choosing your play-style and your difficulty at once, and that’s on purpose. The only “fair” experiences/fights are going to between con specifics and creatures designed to match eachother’s gusto, like I imagine Rex and Trike will be.

[gusty helm]

W dc admin here, another one that like the chalenge and i will asume, like to fight and strugle, becasue like that u will have a bit of pride for ur work done :))

[final skiff]

And in game. You can only graze on certain terrain types, and I learned the hard way that does NOT include jungle cover. If the player doesn’t know that or plans poorly, it’s apparently as easy to starve to death as a Stego in the Jungle as a Deino drying out in the grasslands.

Yes. Finally got a Ptero to adulthood for the first time.

It kinda works that way already. Even my sub-adult Cera can’t fill her stomach halfway off of a deer. It drops off faster than I expected at least.

[gusty helm]

man

[final skiff]

If they had just gone left instead of right, they would have never seen me. The fight would’ve never happened. I’d call that more than a small part.

[final skiff]

But now there’s enough ai that I have the option to TRY and survive. To try and find another deer that I haven’t scared off completely, and to catch a second prey item without being spotted by a bigger predator. More options is ALWAYS better than landing my 9th Ptera in a row on rock and watching it starve to death again cause there are no Tacos, no crabs, and no fish. More options means more ways to engage with the game and more things to explore! And maybe instead of catching a second deer, I’ll get my first real fight on a new Cera cause somebody heard me eating and wanted to end me.

[final skiff]

Luck creates scenarios, skill and/or wisdom resolves them.

[lethal smelt]

Yeah but overall it's a small part cause it's an extremely rare occurrence for something like this to happen

[final skiff]

But unless you’re brazenly using roads like a human, lying in ambush at a busy game trail, or standing out in the open daring people to challenge you, that’s how fights happen.

[lethal smelt]

I think you can't generalize all carnivores that way. You say it is fair but that is not fair.

Troodons even when fg have v poor hunting success when herbis get to be 3-6 tons easily for free
Meanwhile deinos get a one click kill when they are fg and have a near 100% hunting success rate

So ai should absolutely be there to sustain small tiers regardless of juvie or adult. But as soon as you go above a certain size range AI has diminishing results and you should have to rely on killing players (mid tiers, apexes, etc)

[gusty helm]

the "problem" there is not 1 or 2 deer's or boars, everyone would enjoy a free snack. the problem is that there is so mutch ai now that there is no need to kill anymore and there are ant it will be people that will exploit that. For example "i'm hungry but i will not take that fight with that raptor because i will find ai and everything will be good" or "i'm not hungry because there is just a loot of boars that i killed and i will just run from the raptor chasing me because there is no point for me to fight with all that food that i will find" and on and on. on top of that we have the megamicpack thing that is so frequent right now, there are even more players that will decide not to take the fight because they are not hungry and there is no reason. there should be reasons. there should be that reason when u are starving and u need to get that kill because if u don't u will die.

[lethal smelt]

But once mid tiers and apexes are here, which will be very soon, this problem won't exist. Most players will switch to allo and rex and this 'abundant ai' will not sustain them.
It will continue to sustain small tiers tho.

[gusty helm]

yea, i totaly agree with that, but i still think there is no reason that u will not need to fight or kill for ur food. me personaly from the ai fix update, i don't need to kill players anymore, because there is plenty ai and i can't even kill every ai i see because i'm just to full. i fight just for fun now, or at least try to fight because there are again, the megamixpack's that aswell, don't fight eachothers because they are not hungry... and good luck killing 1 dino from a 17ppl group that they will attack u after u attack 1 of them because they are a group so they will help eachothers

[cosmic jewel]

This is why I don't think AI should give diets
That way you're incentivized to hunt other players to get your diet bonuses, but you can still rely on AI to not starve if things are rough

[gusty helm]

this is a ok ideea but on the other side, how would u expect a baby to grow without the ai diets? or a troodon? a pt? or a fg raptor to win in a fight against a cera or carno, it's a hard fight. i get the point, but u can't do that.
the ai was bad because it's spawn rate was messed up, we only had ai after restart and that's it. the thing that needed to be fixed was the spawn rate, not the number to be increased. and overall, it is a god damn dinosaur game in the end, do u think the dinosaurs were cute and flufy? nuh ahh they are literaly monsters. there need to be death, there need to be starving people to die so the smaller ones will get the chance to fiind the big corpse and have an amazing meal. there need to be chalange and dificulties

[cosmic jewel]

If you want to grow fast, you need to hunt other babies. But you still have the option of growing (more slowly) with ai if there aren't any viable targets nearby.

[gusty helm]

and how do u think the masive 1.3T animal will be able to move in the dense foliage, brances, bushes, trees without making noise so he can get close to the ai?

[gusty helm]

trodon baby vs cera baby for example is not a winnable fight for the trood, never

[cosmic jewel]

Well that's just troodon being weak unfortunately. I think troodon should be an omnivore but that's a seperate issue
Troodon is a pack animal though. Troo baby pack vs cera baby is winnable

[gusty helm]

same as other babyies, u can't just force peoples in to baby deathmatches everytime they want to play and grow something...

[cosmic jewel]

exactly, that's why you have plentiful AI to provide a cushion. But if you play a carnivore, you have to hunt other players throughout your lifetime. that's how the game loop works

[gusty helm]

throu ur life time, not everytime u are a baby

yea, anyway, ur ideea, ok

[final skiff]

Diet and Diet buffs can help that to a degree, though what you’re describing is also just how real predators hunt. All apex predators will target the weak, the old, and the king dead long before they ever risk engaging a riskier meal. Lions eat Cape buffalo, but never if they can just steal a zebra that some hyenas already killed. It’s why I die so fast when I’m a juvenile with some bigger family members and suddenly two Ceras bolt out of cover. I’m slower and do less damage, so they get me first to be sure they get something at all. I’ve seen the desperation force riskier fights too. Playing Ptera yesterday, I saw a big mix pack at THE waterfall with a good 3-5 mangled Cera, and their Ptera killed me for daring to catch fish. By the time I got back with a fresh Ptera, their numbers were thinner and their Ptera was gone to, with some recognizable corpses near the rotting Ceras. I didn’t see the next bit, but I heard plenty. Half an hour later, the mix pack was completely gone and there weren’t any bodies left at all, just one Gali yelling at me. Somebody got them to move or log out, and the corpse of players and ai were all cleaned up except a few bones. The mix pack tried to monopolize a popular crossing and all the meat inside it, and they were gone in under an hour. Violently. Probably. Alternatively, they got bored, and still left plenty of food for those brave enough to risk a Maia ambush. BTW, are we supposed to report that kind of behavior somewhere?

[final skiff]

Troodon baby vs Cera baby is also winnable if the Cera panics. I’ve lost that fight.

[cosmic jewel]

I get where you're coming from but I'm just not a fan of allowing carnivores to quickly grow themselves to sub or adult without any challenge of other players. The more that happens, the more difficult it is to play herbivores in a game where herbivores are already outnumbered. That problem is also going to become more significant when apexes and mid tiers come out

[final skiff]

Can we all agree that the diet system is genuinely brilliant and brilliantly simple? Three little icons force SO much more movement and engagement than I’ve seen in honestly any other game!

[cosmic jewel]

Absolutely, the diet system is great
It also makes herbivore gameplay a lot more interesting, as a teno main

[final skiff]

Exactly! One system for every creature and play style, determining your every goal and destination in subtle or direct ways!

[static moon]

Well, many people don't want to play a simulator of death from hunger. What should developers do? Honestly, it's hard for me to understand your argument, because it seemed to me that survival here is the correct interaction with players, and not with AI.

[blissful oar]

It is quite a good idea to make gameplay predictable yet not boring

[blissful oar]

There will always be a proper middle ground, the middle ground is just different for everyone

[wide veldt]

i personally love the new sense of big carnis taking territory and we have to sneak around them/chase them out to get our feed. just saw two huge players guarding west rail and while i found it really cool, i got out and moved locations as a fs herrera lol

....and then proceeded to be killed by a boar but thats a skill issue on my part

[static moon]

Everyone has different desires, so you can't please everyone at once. You talk about the middle, but you rightly note that even it can differ in people's understanding. One side wants less AI as before, the other complained that there wasn't enough AI before. It would seem to make an average spawn? But it was like that before and people still complained. I'm starting to feel sorry for the developers

[gusty helm]

i don't think u get "where i'm coming from"... my personal problem with the ai is that it will reduce the number of fights, the number of " we need to fiind someone to kill because otherwise we will starve" situations will be so small close to none if everyboddy has food. u want combat, but u want the ai to be like just a filler, not a need... i want combat, but i want the ai to not be able to simply sustain people so they will no need to fight anymore if they don't want too...

[blissful oar]

If it exists, people will complain about it in way or form.

[blissful oar]

It doesn’t really. Most (!) carnivores play carnivores to hunt other people.

I don’t play deino to hunt ai. I play deino for the ambushing. AI giving a bit more time to find prey, which can be hard, is just a nice tool

[gusty helm]

YESSSSSSSSSSSSSS

this is why i play carnivoreeee

[static moon]

Why should people stop fighting because carni have food? By this logic, herbivores should not want to fight at all because they do not need a corpse to eat, but as practice shows, this is not so. The essence of online games is interaction with other players, of course, there will be those who just like to sit in one place and chat, but what's wrong with that? Moreover, these are far from all players.

[blissful oar]

https://tenor.com/view/beasts-of-bermuda-kaperoo-the-isle-path-of-titans-gif-23526654

[gusty helm]

but how am i suposed to fight people that mixpack and stay in gropus of 20 just because there is no need for them to fight because everone is full food

[static moon]

And this is another problem, independent of food. Mixpacks and megapacks have always been there and this is not prohibited.

[lyric lava]

All of the most aggresive animals are herbivores irl. Water buffalos are called Widow Makers for a reason

[cosmic jewel]

The problem is that with the size of the map and the hotspot situation there are often places where carnivores just can't find other players to fight (or the only players to fight are mixpacking)
so in those situations, AI should act as a cushion for carnivores. But it should give you poor diet to incentivize fighting other players

[blissful oar]

Hippos being one of the most dangerous animals among carnivores

[cosmic jewel]

I think the game would be in a good state if the AI abundance was the same as it is now (maybe a bit less) but they gave no diet bonuses

[lyric lava]

Yepper

[blissful oar]

Oh hey swamp

o/

[lyric lava]

A moose will mess you up for no reason at all tbh

[blissful oar]

I’ve been close to that, ye🥲

[lyric lava]

Thats gunna be a no from me dawg

I would not mess with a moose

[gusty helm]

nah, enough for me, i'm out

[blissful oar]

A bit less would be better, but ai also spawns on places that are death traps. They probably need a despawn command

[blissful oar]

Aw bye tho 👋🏻

[cosmic jewel]

I do think the distribution could be better, yeah
Some areas of the map have zero AI

[static moon]

In general, the idea of the absence of dietary bonuses from Ai is often heard now and it seems to me that this is a really good idea with the caveat that this should only apply to fg

[lyric lava]

I think we should get another growth level above what we have right now thats only available if you hunt enough player characters

[static moon]

Aren't these the elders?

[lyric lava]

Idk i havent played enough haha

[static moon]

If I'm not mistaken, this is exactly what they are planning?

[thorny dragon]

We don't know the requirements to become an elder yet

[blissful oar]

It’s not in yet so

[thorny dragon]

Personally I doubt it'll be based on kill count

[blissful oar]

That wouldn’t make sense for herbivores at least

[lyric lava]

So why do people complain about being able to reach fully grown when NO ONE can be fully grown yet? We dont even have fuly grown in the game rn

[thorny dragon]

You can be fully grown in game right now because there is such thing as a fullgrown

[static moon]

I apologize if I don't want to misinform you. The guy just said about a new age level and the elders will really be one.

[blissful oar]

^this is why

[thorny dragon]

The existence of a future stage doesn't mean fg doesn't exist currently lol

[cosmic jewel]

It's an interesting idea
But IMO that makes it too easy to get to FG as a carni. It should be difficult to do because the more FG predators (and especially apexes when they come out) are on the map the more unbalanced the ecosytem becomes and the more painful it is for herbivores and smaller carnivores

[lyric lava]

But when it comes into being it will cease to be "fully grown" if you can get bigger

[thorny dragon]

Probably, but I doubt the community term for a full adult will shift

[lyric lava]

Who knows when that will be though

[thorny dragon]

Elders are something earned, not everyone will become stronger

[lyric lava]

And that seems to be what people are asking for

[static moon]

Well, we already have Legacy as an example and it all works there. The balance is achieved by the fact that the growth time of large and small dinosaurs is different, of course here we have a 300% bonus, but the apexes will still grow an order of magnitude longer.

[lyric lava]

Something contingent on your interactions with the other players

[old garden]

I like how the ai spawned in before it only spawned on restart, even with the restart spawn amount it wouldn’t have been too bad if it respawned again in an hour. I played yesterday never went below 80 hunger never “had” to take a fight, I didn’t have to worry about anything but players. I go south plains and everyone is hugging and cuddling up in mixpacks or just not fighting. Also all the ai allows for mega packs, I saw a pack of 6+carnos running around with no fear of starvation. It should take a big hunt or numerous hunts to sustain that size of a pack not free grows off ai, each hunt is a risk and could kill you if you pick for a larger meal. Right now we are playing easy mode with optional fights and free grows for death match, I’ll say again the only thing good about this much ai is it helps nesting but I think nests should just make more ai in an area.

[blissful oar]

Cool. Still doesn’t stop the fact that you starving due to random thing beyond your control isn’t fun or fair. If I go to migration or patrol zone, I expect to see players (or at least herbivores) following intended gamedesign, yet I barely do.

[cosmic jewel]

Hmm, I haven't played Legacy, maybe you're right. But I don't like the idea of balancing based off of time, because then it encourages people to sit in a quiet area of the map and just farm AI for diet bonuses until they are FG
If players don't have to take risks to grow at the fastest speed, why even have a growing mechanic in the first place? It just becomes a "Waiting" requirement to have a strong dinosaur

[blissful oar]

And you never replied to my realism rebuttal, when are we continuing that

[lyric lava]

Mixpacking for herbivores is realistic af too if we go that route

They wouldn't be competing for the same foods because they were specialized to eat different things

Even now you see scavengers and carnivores work together like wolves and ravens

[blissful oar]

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, there is a point where the “but it’s realistic” card stops working

[lyric lava]

Yep

Real life isnt fun

You want realism? Eaten by your parents

[blissful oar]

Exactly

[lyric lava]

You want realism? Dying from a heat stroke or diarrhea

You got tapeworm sorry better luck next run

[static moon]

Makes you think actually🤔 But at the same time when you die several times in a row from adult dinosaurs you want to either close the game or go grow up in the bushes, honestly. In general, I understand what you are talking about, all I can add from myself: for me, anything is better than ai once an hour

[cosmic jewel]

Agreed. Too much ai is better than too little ai

[blissful oar]

Real realism as an animal would be not being able to tell what your disease is, only knowing the symptoms

They are smart enough to treat the symptoms, but finding out it was a virus is a bit too far

(Tho if it’s a skin crawling thing, treating the symptom DOES make them better)

[static moon]

I don't agree with you at all, but nesting is one of the reasons. I find it annoying that when I make a nest, food can suddenly disappear (at least it used to) and you can't move around to find food because you're tied to a place, it completely demotivates players to make nests, although for me, nesting is a good way to find a group, but I don't want me and my little carnos to starve to death. So maybe spawning food near the nests would help with that.

[blissful oar]

I’ve wanted to make deino nests but you know… food issues

[static moon]

that's exactly what i'm talking about

[blissful oar]

Also I played herra with a friend of mine who tried out the game. We spawned highlands, pretty popular area, yet the only thing we found was a deino. Bro died of starvation before he even could climb a tree, we were constantly on the move

Like, trial and error is a thing but it really sucks when a new player can’t even play the game without dying a few times before getting LUCKY.

[static moon]

Yes, I agree with you. You and I may know the best places for ai to spawn, but a new player may not. Starving to death several times in a row is unlikely to motivate him to continue playing.

[thorny dragon]

It's possible that both the pre-patch and post-patch ai levels are bad for the game imo

Not to mention we're yet to get the tiny tiny ai specifically made for juvies (rats, lizards, bugs)

[blissful oar]

Don’t get me wrong, seeing plains full of ai isn’t fun for me either, but carnivores don’t have 1 set place to go for that at least spawned child safety. Herbivores at least get sanctuaries (yes I know carnis get it in a later update)

[blissful oar]

Then we should probably keep it at these kinds of levels (maybe a bit lower if they would stop. Spawning. On. Cliffs)

[thorny dragon]

The current levels are far too high in my opinion, but the ai before the patch was also awful

[old garden]

You don’t agree with its very easy now? Or that all the ai won’t allow for big packs of large carnis to be formed? I’ve nested almost every time I hit fg on my carnis during the ai drought, was only possible after a hunt as you had to be quick about it. The looming thought and stress of getting them their first hunt was fun and frustrating, the feeling of getting a kill when you’re not sure if or when you will feels good. Felt like I was way more on my toes and hunting, stalking, and making a play for my next meal picking out better options.

[static moon]

tbh it scares me a bit. For example on Petis there was a problem with ai because when there were a lot of players on the server 80% of the ai was small (toads), and considering their food value..

[lavish scarab]

Starvation isn't even a threat to Carnis anymore

[blissful oar]

Yeah somehow, I don’t find that likely with how little I saw nests pop up. But you know, it’s possible

[thorny dragon]

...large carnivores had to kill other players to not starve? That's the kind of game I want

Imo, AI should be for juvies and small carnivores (sub 1 ton or so)

[gusty helm]

finaly, thx

[old garden]

Yeah that’s how I feel when I want an egg, so I make them so others might think hey I’ll pop some out too

[thorny dragon]

Anything above that should barely scrape by or not scrape by at all if they can't/don't kill players

[gusty helm]

yesssssssss an even better argument

[blissful oar]

Implying that food is the only reason people hunt?

[old garden]

It should be the main impulse to make you attack another player, I kill players for their organs to sustain my diet

[blissful oar]

Congrats, you might have been the one pair of people to consistently do that.

[static moon]

I don't agree that the absence of AI an hour after restart is the norm. I don't want to make a nest like "well I gave you an egg, now go get your own food", I want to grow them in more or less conditions at least to the state of sab before they are forced to enter the battle, forgive me for considering myself responsible for my nest

[blissful oar]

Then I have bad news for you. If that’s how it worked, herbivores wouldn’t KOS a carnivore on the other side of the river

[lavish scarab]

It's literally impossible to starve now..

Like what's the point of getting a fg if it's so easy too?

[old garden]

Herbis are just bored 😂☠️

[blissful oar]

Oh dont worry, deinos will find a way

[static moon]

People want eggs to get extra mutations and find a group to play with, obviously they don't want to die right after birth.

[blissful oar]

But that’s not hunting for food, which was your argument. So my point still stands

If people want to hunt, they WILL hunt

[old garden]

As a carnivore who lives off a meat, meat which other players have. Yes that would be your main reason to attack another player

[blissful oar]

I’ve had plenty of times where my omni pack was fed off of corpses we made and still we went for stegos

[old garden]

At the end of the day we are ppl playing a game so people will act like people

[blissful oar]

And yet it isn’t for most people. Because hunting is fun

If im full food on deino (honestly, report at that point cuse that’s RARE), I still hunt. Do I do it for the food then? No.

[cosmic jewel]

I mean, for herbivores it's completely different
Carnivores hunt for food, so carni players' chief reason to fight players is to eat
Herbivores' chief reason to fight players is to defend themselves from being eaten
If a herbivore sees you as a potential threat, they might defend themselves

[blissful oar]

I wouldn’t call 1 omni vs 4 dibbles a threat, yet there I was

[static moon]

Look at it from another angle. We have a hypothetical group (4 people) of cerato. They won the fight and got their prey, now they need time to heal, and then to find new food, what if their next prey runs away or they simply don't find it? (there can be many situations, for example bodyguard, but that's not the point) they need a chance to make a mistake, they shouldn't die of hunger because of one mistake

[thorny dragon]

They should

[cosmic jewel]

that's why omni is faster than dibble

[blissful oar]

My only saving grace 🙏🏻

[lyric lava]

I think with small AI for smaller animals it'll fix a lot of the issues we currently have, along with the elder growth levels (whatever they are)

[cosmic jewel]

I agree with the idea that there should be more courtesy between carnis/herbis in situations like that, but players are gonna be players

[blissful oar]

Listen swamp, I’m not gonna say that 24/7 stockpiling on ai only is good. I have never said this and I never will. But AI on its own is flawed. It gets stuck, reaches unreachable places and is sometimes so fast that juvis (who need it the most) can’t get it. In the end, ai being a bit too much is better than barely any, causing every carnivore to starve when they don’t find anything (regardless of growth).

[old garden]

I feel you, ai shouldn’t just vanish after an hour. Also I wouldn’t just abandon them or make them go on their own, I raise them to fg if i can help it. Most the time they die making a bad decision. To get them food I need to get me food, so I kill and they can eat what is there. Sometimes they go and kill their own small things. Once they are big enough to stop feeding from puke it’s time to hunt.

[static moon]

Imo this is too much complexity. That's why I say that the lack of nutrients (and therefore buffs) from ai food for fg sounds good, since it would motivate (if you think that people need motivation to fight) predators to fight other players for diets, but at the same time would not force them to die of hunger in case of an unsuccessful hunt. If we are talking about realism, then irl no one dies from a day or two without food by the way.

[blissful oar]

And when they finally add more in and fix more and manage to get servers to a higher cap without sacrificing performance, we can go back to less ai. But for now with what we have, (still in a beta) getting people to play is to make them not suffer from starvation most of the time they spawn.

[thorny dragon]

I'm not talking about realism, I'm talking about gameplay

[blissful oar]

Aight enough said, I’m gonna go do something.

See you later

[lyric lava]

thank you for coming

have a nice day

[cosmic jewel]

On a seperate note, boars really shouldn't be so agro against herbivores
lmao
https://steamusercontent-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/44572507894852328/2B479FE79F6276B48AAB648951B90163EA97AFAD/

I hope my teno is feeding some growing baby carnis out there

[lyric lava]

Boars irl have a charging instinct, they charge everything

[static moon]

Well, if we talk about gameplay, I already said that it's too much of a challenge. The above-mentioned group will be less likely to suffer defeat in a hunt, but what about loners? Why should they have to make do with scraps? Hunting groups as a loner may not be an unrealistic task, but it's definitely not the easiest one, and finding a group for Cerato under the conditions you mentioned... well, you'll probably be eaten by your own species.

[thorny dragon]

And the ones who are doing the eating survive, yea

I'm not sure why death from starvation is seen as so appalling in a survival game

[static moon]

Well, I also have a couple of questions in this case. Why do you need AI in the game at all if starvation is not a problem? Why did people not like no AI servers if starvation is not a problem? Why should the main problem for my survival in an online game not be other players, but hunger? And I will also add that serious problems with hunger increase the population of herbivores, and the larger the groups they gather in, the harder it is to hunt them.

[thorny dragon]

People didn't like the no AI servers because people don't like starving in a survival game. That doesn't mean starvation shouldn't exist

[lyric lava]

It's a problem when it happens 90% of the time you start a new character and you don't get to engage with the actual gameplay loop at all

[thorny dragon]

And a high population of herbivores is my dream for this game lmao

[cosmic jewel]

The possibility of death by starvation should be a motivator to find food, but not unavoidable

[thorny dragon]

That's why I want small ai in abundance for juvies

My problem is adult dinos not just surviving but thriving off of ai

[lyric lava]

I agree with you

[static moon]

And I'm not saying that it shouldn't be there, I just stick to the idea that hunger shouldn't be the main problem when we have a whole pvp arena with different beautiful lizards here

[thorny dragon]

Hunger should be the main problem because this is a survival game, not a pvp arena. In fact, you can fix starvation by pvping so we get the best of both worlds

[lyric lava]

I would say a player cap on the amount of carnivore/herbivores to keep it consistent would work, but I don't think that it would because people might just go to another server or play a different game instead

[thorny dragon]

Yea species caps usually sound fine on paper but imo they're just anti-player

[lyric lava]

I'll be frank, I haven't really tried any herbivores because... I just don't want to be an herbivore? I want to hunt for food, not look for bushes

I think to most people the idea of being an herbivore dinosaur is just not as compelling as playing as something like a raptor or a T Rex

[cosmic jewel]

Yeah the carni/herbi imbalance is one of the big problems with gameplay atm in my opinion
I main teno and play herbi most of the time, but when I barely ever see any other herbivores it can get boring
Teno is a lot of fun to fight with though
Ultimately people want to be the hunter and not the hunted

[static moon]

I'm not saying that the full Cerato group should easily feed itself with the help of ai, I agree with you that they should hunt, I'm just saying that they should have a chance for error, a transit snack between meals. Maybe other guys' ideas about how ai wouldn't completely fill the stomach for fg would be a solution?

[static moon]

I think in this matter we can only talk about ourselves. For example, I play all types from time to time 50/50 carni/herbi

[cosmic jewel]

To be fair I think his mindset is shared by most of the community, based on how many carnivores vs. herbivores I see

It's funny because as a herbivore, even Teno which isn't as OP as stego or diablo, carnivores mostly don't want to hunt me. They would rather hunt other carnivores instead, which in turn makes herbi gameplay less exciting

[static moon]

In terms of population, I've never noticed that there was a direct predominance of something on the server, but if we talk about player feedback, it's noticeable how many demand large predators and yet I can't take such players seriously, since they want this simply because "I want to kill a stego with one bite."

Don't think that I mean everyone, of course not, but many are really motivated by something like this and we all understand perfectly well that easy prey is also not something to hope for in a survival game

[lyric sphinx]

I think its not about kill stego in one bite, but if stego hit cera for example with tail. It can easily take half of the health..but if cera bite stego its not even close to that damage whyt stego cause cera..

[static moon]

Oh, well I don't know, of course being Carno I wouldn't want to break into Stego or Diablo's group, but trying one Diablo or maia/teno always sounds interesting

[lyric sphinx]

Herbi stronger than carni 😅 not worth to hunt if you are alone. And ofc it depends how much you are skilled and the other player

[cosmic jewel]

I'm going to be curious to see how the bigger carnivores are balanced. I think being able to compete with stegos/dibbles in terms of damage and health but being slow and outran by smaller dinos would make sense. They become specialized for hunting the bigger dinos that everyone else gets outcompeted by

[cosmic jewel]

I think part of that comes from the lack of top tier carnis atm, like I said above

[lyric sphinx]

Yeah. We need something bigger to hunt big herbis 😄 So it will be balanced and stegos will not be that confident

[static moon]

Maybe if stego was in kentro's place people would be more satisfied? But who am I to talk about it, all I want to say is that it's logical because stego is bigger than cera, but sooner or later the roster will expand a lot and stego will have more serious enemies. And then with them the larger herbivores.

[lyric sphinx]

Yeah

[static moon]

In fact, I think the developers do a great job of balancing realism and gameplay.

[lethal fog]

you want realism? dies to an infection because a cera bit you

[lethal fog]

I think it could be better but...there is worse

[dawn plume]

The issue with this game is that somehow half the playerbase want to play a pvp arena, so they like the new ai changes cause that lets them grow in a bush for 2 hours then go pvp, and the other half barely knows how to press buttons on a computer, plays like ass, always dies of hunger, and obviously they also like the changes.

It's just a bit weird that a survival game has very little players who actually want challenging survival gameplay.

[dawn plume]

Also herbivore gameplay gets a bit stale.
You get to a spot with all 3 diets and uuuhh..just sit there for 30 minutes munching. If no carnivores come around to bother you, 5 minutes in you're bored out of your mind.
And now carnies don't have a reason to come bother you cause they're sitting in a bush growing off the 50 deer spawning around them.

It does seem that the ai change is not working as intended and they didn't mean to make it this bad, but it is really disheartening how many players loved it. Really shows the quality of the community.

People are so shortsighted they don't realize that current ai spawn rates break the game for everyone in many ways and take away a bunch of interesting and thrilling gameplay situations

[floral rivet]

Had something similar the last few Hypsis I tried to grow, I would run away even across water and boars would chase me down and murder me xD

[cosmic jewel]

Yeah it's funny as a full grown teno to oneshot them, but it got very annoying when I was playing galli earlier

[dawn plume]

I imagine the imbalance can be fixed by both removing carnies from carnivore diets AND limiting the number of carnivores on the server.
People are gonna cry, but they cry all the time anyways.

[dawn plume]

Hell, even making it so that if a carnivore eats too much carnivore meat, it catches some kind of parasite and gets weaker.
Servers queues will disappear also, because the south plains pvp crowd will just make their own servers for pvping and stay there.

But all these three changes must be implemented at the same time to yield a result

[cosmic jewel]

I don't really like artificially limiting the number of carnivores, but I do like removing other carnis from more diets. I still think making AI non-diet for all carnivores is the better solution. That would strongly encourage carnis to hunt down herbivore players to avoid long grow times, and lead to more fighting for herbivores, making people more likely to pick a herbivore.
I think artificially capping it is more of a bandage on the problem.

[dawn plume]

I play herbie maybe 40% of the time and I'd definitely play them more if I had more action in the places i usually grow my herbies - north lake, east, all along the river.

There are carnivores there for sure, just not as many as could be, cause all of them are in south plains

[wide veldt]

i think i'd be happy with ai not giving diet. im still a learning carni player so i'd personally be fine with waiting longer to grow

[steel thunder]

someone told me you could bait pterodactylus with food but I tried it and nothing happens is there still a way to kill pterodactylus because i havent been able to hunt them at all

[silent patrol]

grab a chunk of meat and start walking or flying away. they have lowered the chance and the distance they spawned from when they would chase you

[silent patrol]

only creatures on your diet gives you your nutrients. tbh i would rather there be more of the smaller AI like rabbits and chickens around that dont fill up alot but enough to keep you alive to find other food would be nice. sort of like how they made it so the schooling fish was limited so older deinos could not just eat them to survive

[last bobcat]

Do the fish now give more food to the crocs again? I dont dare logging on my Croc cuz its on the edge of starving

[silent patrol]

you mean the elite fish right?

[last bobcat]

Both

[silent patrol]

well.. one is on its diet, and the other isnt

[last bobcat]

Even elite fiah gave only 3 %

Didnt help either

Schooling fish never were on diet but they gave something

[silent patrol]

i got to fg only on elite fish and they were fine

[last bobcat]

Ok. Then i hope they spawn more now

[silent patrol]

well some of the schooling fish after i let them rot as well

[last bobcat]

Because there were like none before update

[silent patrol]

i was playing before the update in the northern east lake and basicly got to delta

[last bobcat]

I went from swamp to southpond to southplains to highlands.

There was like none

Really not seeing forward loosing my 2 gen croc

[silent patrol]

i can see why... you went to small areas of water, as in. oh i dont see anything let me go up ri... oh yeah there is no more water to travel

i do think swamp is not the best area due to the layout itself and it being like a maze.

[final skiff]

I keep thinking about the idea of a playable whose whole purpose is to act as ai cleanup. Like a flyer that’s fast on foot but slow to take off. I feel like some people want Hatz as an apex, but for those of you who hate how the ai is working right now, how would you feel if Tropeognathus or Santanadactylus was a playable in the server, clearing away ai like a low flying Cera (so it can overeat and not leave bodies around), fragile enough to take down as any sub-adult or a juvenile group, but still bitey enough and fleet footed enough to not feel like a free meal? A garbage truck flyer for keeping the server healthy and making ai hunting more interesting when it shows up. A player in this role could be encouraged to fight back by having a slow takeoff and fast growth, so running is riskier than biting back, and dying doesn’t feel like a waste.

Like, Deino’s “role” in the ecosystem is to make sure there is turnover in the full grown population, and this guy could do that for ai. 🤷‍♀️

Part of me wants Ptera to fill in a scavenger niche, if only so herbivores would not kill me so often, even though Ptera poses zero threat to them. Ptera can’t take down Maia, so why trample me, when all I wanna do is eat the Carno you just bodied?

[indigo anchor]

So wait, i must ask
The number of ai that we now see around the server
Is that how many was there the entire time but had just gotten lost/stuck?

[outer siren]

This is literally me every time I go to scavenge after a fight where hervis won

Genuinely 0 chill

[dawn plume]

Are you really going to complain about literally ANYTHING in a dinosaur game?
Yes, dinosaurs kill dinosaurs. You're not entitled to eating in peace regardless of whether you are harmless or not.
Jesus, everyone's such a crybaby nowadays

[lyric lava]

He says while tears stream from his eyes

[indigo anchor]

There are three reasons a maia will take down a ptera

1. pteras can be. Really annoying. Really, really annoying
2. pteras sometimes scout for other players
3. the maias kos everything for fun

[final skiff]

1. I’ve only met one annoying Ptera, who killed me (another Ptera) for no obvious reason. Every other Ptera I’ve met in game has been very very chill, just catching fish and hanging out in trees. Or dying to literally everything 😅
2. Just because a Ptera can scout doesn’t mean they are scouting. Please assume that some of us want to play the intended way and just have fun. I don’t harass Galis on sight just because I’ve been killed by several, and I wouldn’t assume every Maia is mix packing, just because half the ones I’ve seen seemed like they were. That would be very rude of me.
3. The scariest thing on the Isle is players who think they’re actually playing Fortnite. The zone won’t move and killing me wont help you unless you need to eat me or I’m planning to eat you.

Incidentally, has anyone else noticed that the Isle is in fact hemmed in by a Fortnite-esque blue lightning wall?

[indigo anchor]

Ive met a few annoying pteras
But i usually try to bribe them into being nice by feeding them

Sometimes theyre a bit dumb and dont realise im feeding them though

[wide veldt]

as a ptera i normally try to help herbies by getting nips on the carnis to show im chill n just want food (or peck at the herbis if the herbi is obviously outnumbered and has no hope). or try to scout carnis to ai we both benefit from like turtles or tacos as a "plz help we can share"

[celest flare]

I just went from the most southern point of swamp to the first pools of Delta, (log pond I call it) No fish. I met one Deino who quickly hid from me, but when I asked him if he had seen fish, he said no.
Sounds like you and I have the same issue. I ended up logging out in the hopes fish will spawn while my 80% Deino sleeps.
Which, seems like bad game play design to me, I have been encouraged to log out OR watch my dinosaur die simply because the game says it's time to die now.

[last bobcat]

the fish is a real problem. it gives nothing. due to this i had to kill other crocs and i feel bad cuz i hate being canni

[thorny dragon]

Then why play the thing that's fully intended to cannibalize?

[celest flare]

Regardless of being a cannibal or not, I only saw 1 other croc. and zero other land animals.

[last bobcat]

well i saw a cheating dilo that tried to kill me

thats it

[last bobcat]

cuz i wanna play an aquatic carnivore with out needing to be an ass. besides this theres almost no crocs

[celest flare]

At the moment, the strategy to stay alive is to log out and not play... which seems like not great game design... cos this is supposed to be a game right? Yes it's a semi realistic sim, but by realism standards, a full stomach should last me weeks not days (I just googled it, crocodiles can last a year between meals)

So then what is it? are we promoting game play mechanics that drive player engagement and fun. Or are we pushing realism into the system, which reduces player agency.

Yes it is realistic for animals to starve to death... but I don't want to play a "starve to death" simulator.
Again, I was actively hunting and seeking food. I had 50% (or more) stomach contents when I logged in. I spent an hour or more just looking for food...

[lament sapphire]

when's the last time you played they've fixed a lot of ai issues with the most recent patches?

[celest flare]

The other problems with food scarcity (feast and famine) are also: When I find an area with lots of AI fish, I have no reason to leave that river or pond... I call it "watching paint dry" Why would I leave my food security behind when there's no reassurance i'll be able to find food elsewhere.

For example: I have my salt water mut and I am trying to go from swamp, down the coast, to south plains river... an easy enough journey when you have a full stomach. But by the time I go from Delta to swamp i'm lower on food. So I hunt the swamp for food... I find no food, so I swim back up the delta... I have repeated this cycle twice now. Except this time when I travel back up north, there was no fish and I am currently starving to death. (Am logged out atm)

The other problem with food scarcity is; I could be hunting all the time non-stop, even when my stomach is full... In the event i kill something big, my stomach is already 100% full. The food rots and eventually de-spawns. So it's a waste of time then isn't it. But if I don't kill it, who knows when I will eat again. So I encouraged to hunt players even when I don't need to, which feels not very nice.

I think increasing the time it takes to get hungry could help this a lot. It's why I always want to get the efficient digestion mutation

[celest flare]

I was playing today, literally just an hour ago ^-^

[lament sapphire]

huh weird not a lot of people haven't been having issue with ai with the most recent patches although I haven't had time myself to try it yet

[celest flare]

My friend is saying if you stay in one place that increases AI spawns... but I don't know where he's getting that info from. But also, sitting around and waiting for AI to spawn is like watching paint dry, and still doesn't solve the problem of whether or not there will actually be food to eat.

My strategy is to get swim speed first, so I can cover more area, my thought process is, the more area I cna cover, the more AI I will see. I also hunt players when the opportunity arrises, but I avoid Deinos since fighting is risky.

[celest flare]

This is just my experience, maybe I am very unlucky. Maybe I will ask a friend to scout the pond for me before I log back in so I know there will be fish there. I don't wanna lose my 6 hour Deino because of bad luck... my 11th spawn, 6 hour Deino

I get it though, it's really hard to balance. Carnivores being hungry is what drives them to hunt players. Carnivores hunting players is a core gameplay aspect. If we have too much AI, carnivores never need to hunt players and you lose that drive. People would still hunt players for fun, but it would increase animosity since people would know you are hunting because you want to, not because you have to...

When I saw that path of titans has quests to complete, I thought that was odd... but I get it now, it gives the players something to do other than eat... or starve.

[dawn plume]

Smh fml, people are having problems on deino even now, when the shores are literally besieged by deer and pigs.

Saw 3 pigs and 1 deer swinning together across the river in Delta yesterday

[celest flare]

So why couldn't I find that today in swamp? I would have happily eaten them and not be here right now.

If we could all sniff for AI, that would mean that carnivores wouldn't need to be over fed, but would also reduce the risk of starving to death just because you get unlucky and can't find AI or players

[dawn plume]

Should've swam up the river, where animals glitch into riverbanks and become easy food.

Swamp is too big.

I've no idea if fish spawns are also increased or not since last patch that broke ai, but tbh mostly I haven't issues finding fish even before patch.

[celest flare]

ah ok, so "Don't play in swamp" is your answer. Also, for your information, I started in south swamp and swam north to river delta. but you see, i'm starving to death before I can get any decent way up the delta

[dawn plume]

Tho particularly swamp fish spawns could probably be increased to be honest

[dawn plume]

I dunno, i have never starved on juvi deino. Always found enough fish, even if it took a while.

But if you can't find food after the devs broke the ai then maybe you're just bad at the game? Both swamp and delta are now LITTERED with ai corpses

Both living ai and corpses

Literally every 100 meters.

[celest flare]

yeah it's a bit easier not to starve as juvinile. I'm 80% now... but like, I would have eaten schooling fish or elite fish, or maybe even another Deino. Find those things i did not, even after an hour of actively searching

[dawn plume]

I always play on full servers. Could be worse on an empty server, i dunno.

[celest flare]

I wonder if AUS 2 has been updated with the changes. Hopefully when I log back in I see all the food you are talking about

[dawn plume]

Maybe I've just been lucky, always finding a bunch of fish and Crocs to eat.

Now the lake south of the south plains river? There i starved to death since fish didn't fill me at 80%

[celest flare]

Aus1 and aus2 are normally full, would be nice to get an aus 3

[dawn plume]

And big fish didnt spawn

And people didn't come to drink much

That was before ai broke tho.

[celest flare]

yeah on my previous full grown I starved in south plains river. I dunno why my friends like that river so much... I wanna stay in delta, but I got salt water mut... I should have gotten efficient digestion... next time i think i'll avoid salt water all together and just try to dominate the river delta

[dawn plume]

I guess south river can be hit or miss. And also you have to come out on shore sometimes to get nearby corpses.

Also, survival is not guaranteed in this game normally

It's a survival game, you're supposed to struggle, but struggling shouldn't guarantee success.

Otherwise we get a dumb easy game for kiddies like path of whatever the schoolboys are playing

Well, arguably we did get exactly that after last patch though

[celest flare]

Yeah I get it's hard to balance. But there has to be some reassurance for players that when I grow toward the end game goal of being a large dinosaur, that i will be able to sustain myself. Again, I am trying to find food, I'm not just wasting time.

If the game kills me too often for getting unlucky then that would be a pretty good reason to stop playing, a good reason the player base of the game will decrease.

The issue is, it's a video game. There needs to be a balance between survival sim and video game.

[last bobcat]

Nor every damn croc is at delta where the ai runs in the water. There is legit never ai in the water at highlands

[tawdry stone]

an example of what im talking about.. we dont need like 6+ turtles on the beach of the isle in like 5 places and then vast tracks of empty beachs with just NOTHING! it's the same across most of the Bioms AI is plentiful on and off, if you know were to look and thats it...feels a little like logging into an MMO and seeing a bunch of Kobolds standing ina feild just...wandering around...and they dont leave the feild.

[dawn plume]

#ai-feedback message

I really hope devs don't listen to feedback like this

[stoic river]

Saw a rabbit for the first time after a few months of playing. Immediately stomped it as a Dibble. That’ll teach them!

[latent ore]

yeah me 2 xD

[stoic river]

They’re much faster than I expected. Little guy was a lag wizard lmao. Good thing he got stuck on a tree!

[latent ore]

all A.I. is lagging and rubberbanding

[final skiff]

Except Tacos, oddly. Their movement is definitely smoother than it was pre-fix. They don’t catch frogs anymore tho 😔

[grizzled ether]

I want chickens. As dibble I get assaulted all day, as troodon, never seen one.

Though I did find a crab as pterra, that was nice. They should be on the list with turtle (still havn't found that one at all)

@molten mulch ref #ai-feedback message

It would be awesome to see salmon migrating up river and jumping at the falls.

[final skiff]

I drop fish for people as a Ptera, but their probably not dumb, they’ve just been ambushed by herbivores too many time. Even adult Pter is VERY fragile.

[final skiff]

Same, tho the only group who has shown me any friendliness at all is beach Dilos. Everybody else tries to kill me on sight 😅

[dawn plume]

#ai-feedback message

I can, by the waterfall in south plains.

Before the ai broke down I could camp pretty much anywhere

So yeah, maybe think before posting

[grizzled ether]

@ocean glade ref #ai-feedback message

I wish I had this issue. As Troodon I'm barely finding food amd need south west spawn just to get to spots where others are killing (solo) boars destroy troo in one hit, goats take an ungodly amount of time.

I usually only see deer and boars when looking, but playing dibble I get kamikaze chickens galore lol.

To me it looks like the spawn rates have other mechanics involved and I think thats what needs to be fixed to fix the spawn rates so they fit, this should also fix @dawn plume issue as well.

[dawn plume]

Also you posted it in the wrong section.

[grizzled ether]

Ai spawn needs a fix. Some have nothing while others get, it's not just the rates thats the issue but migration zones. If your not in the right zone at the right time (with the right amount of competition) you end up starving. Bigger dino's smaller dino's its the same issue.

Scent needs some fixes to detect ai meat sources better (or at all) this will give players the visability on their prey for where it is needed and not just up the rates which can negatively effect gameplay (fps)

[abstract hemlock]

#ai-feedback message @dawn plume how does ai being increased affect herrera gameplay lol

[dawn plume]

I mean, it was literally explained in the post and you still didn't get it 🤡
Is there a way I can block a person on here so I don't have to read their posts?

Found it, blocking hides posts

[knotty steeple]

Blocking someone because they disagreed with you is insane

[lyric lava]

He exclusively complains and nothing else. And then tells you to get good when you disagree

[abstract hemlock]

no because your problem dosent make sense. herrera isn’t designed to be camping food sources as a method to hunt lol

[lyric lava]

Funny too cuz he was complaining about camping AI bodies before too

Now he's upset he cant camp bodies

[somber perch]

boohoo i can't camp on one site anymore

[abstract hemlock]

herrera mains the moment they can’t just afk in one spot and press RMB to get food:

[safe root]

This guy clearly has to much time on his hands and needs to get another hobby lol

[fiery lodge]

zero ai wtf

[fading roost]

It literally doesn't, I liked playing Herra before the fix BUT it had the same issue as other carnis if not worse because as a Herra you're extremely limited to what you can actually kill especially while not fully grown. Now you can actually grow and kill/ambush more prey and IF you can't find anything and you know you aren't playing the starving simulator anymore so it's much more enjoyable to play. The only thing the Devs can do now is have the spawns more spread out around the map as I've noticed tonnes of AI spawn in West Access, West Rail and Plains but you don't really encounter many anywhere else

[floral rivet]

Found invisible AI, a sea turtle that vanished as I approached it. But I could still attack and eat it.

[gusty helm]

Make this guy the dino designer

https://tenor.com/view/take-my-money-heres-my-card-here’s-my-card-card-take-my-card-gif-5650338825958178904

[fierce wraith]

We just had that problem 3 times on NA4, you either find them stuck just barely sticking out or once you approach them they pop under haha.

[final skiff]

Naw, they’ve got amazing artists! I just hope they see it ☺️

The way varsity’s playables do, don’t, and could fit ecological niches IN the gameplay just gets me theory crafting.

[compact python]

AI BROKEN

[trail wharf]

yesterday ai was invisible or i couldnt find any

[unreal cypress]

still invisible today

[lyric lava]

@final skiff love the work you put into your concept. The drawings look really great too

[thorny dragon]

@final skiff Hey! Your posts don't exactly fit in te #ai-feedback channel, could you move them over to #general-feedback? Didn't want to delete them before you could copy your ideas

[vital notch]

AI still invisible? just heared boars and goats walk beside me and dont see nothing

[final skiff]

Thanks!

[final skiff]

It started as AI Feedback, just cause of the idea of playable with fully AI diets. Can do tho.

[grizzled bolt]

I had this problem too, I had to log out because all the ai in West access was under the map

Did it get fixed yet? Very close to starvation so I don't want to log on and starve more for no reason

On na4 official

[silent patrol]

have you tried to fight a juvy deino as a adult ptera.. the results might suprise you

[grizzled ether]

Apart from just finding them by sound, I suggest a mutation instead of just populating ai creatures on the scent map take the mutation and bam, see your prey on scent (ai spawn only) as players are much easier to track comparitively.

[lusty cairn]

#ai-feedback message
Shouldn't have to waste a slot for this, it should be base game

[grizzled ether]

I do agree, but I'm also not adverse to it being a mutaion,

I also think there should be species specific mutations (ie making 4 mutations) but am inclined that a species mutation like this would be a 1st mutation option.

[final skiff]

As many hours as I’ve put into Ptera, I’ve only grown like three to full adult. Given how hard it is to stay alive, I don’t take chances like that 😅

[silent patrol]

my only complaint is that the juvys are so heavy

[knotty pawn]

Wow, really? I've definitely grown 20+ pteras at this point, definitely more fg than died before fg. I find it to be the easiest dino to grow in the game

(Of course there's also hypsi with its 30 min grow time, but that doesn't count lmao)

[final skiff]

They grow fast, but I started playing during the recent AI drought, which made things harder. Heck, finding consistent fish is still a little tough, but Tacos are catchable now!

[knotty pawn]

The ai being invisible is certainly very annoying :( Fish are very reliable in places like sp and NL though, if I can't find ai then I always go right there :)

[bleak sail]

Why do devs fix the AI problems then break them again?

Not enjoyable until the invis ai fix is released now

Seems like a simple thing to fix it’s not monster hunter it’s a game where you role play as dinosaurs

Like get a grip

[grizzled ether]

I've added the following to AI feedback -
Current AI issue - Spawning inside rocks, invisable, frozen on the spot.

In addition Boars that are 'frozen' will kill smaller dino's mounting or attacking from any angle.

If you have any of these issue make sure you report them using - https://discord.com/channels/401464048610312193/783214088456896513

[final skiff]

It’s funny, most water sources seem reliable for fish, but will spontaneously “dry up” sometimes, forcing me to fly toward Salt Lake River.

[bleak sail]

Hey dude @rare crane said we’re not having this issue so let’s just drop it. We need to update our steam client instead

[rare crane]

i literally didnt say that 😭

[bleak sail]

4K

[rare crane]

that doesnt mean you're not experiencing the issue "use your head"

[bleak sail]

Yea but it makes the report pointless

Because it’s on our end

[rare crane]

still a different thing and you're still spreading misinfo regardless

[bleak sail]

Wish you were as correct as you are adamant

😩

[grizzled ether]

It is up to date.

[grizzled ether]

This is an issue and it's not user side.

Dlss issues yes, that is user side and there currently is no permenant fix for users having this. On / off works as a temp solution.

[bleak sail]

Thank you

@rare crane told you.

shrug

[rare crane]

it was just a theory bro

[bleak sail]

Opinions on flat earth in that case?

[grizzled ether]

Some of the issue is related to the game engine, which is outdated. But it has a less conventional conflict causing it.

We can discuss how different dependancies on different machines can cause specific errors for those machines that are different but caused by the same error. That is really moot.

Regardless, if you are not a programmer or technician then you should not spread gossip about issues you have not dealt with first hand.

If you experience issues you need to report them. This gives the dev's a better picture of the issue and possible solutions.

As for feedback, there is a template for giving feedback as well.

I put the issue in feedback for transparency as it is an operation 'not as intended' and is not a localized issue.

This helps others who have dealt with similar issues or are not sure (i keep hearing goats...), understand there is an issue, what is happening and they are not just 'hearing things.'

At this time I have killed a chicken in a rock, an invisible rabbit, frozen baby deer, died to a frozen piglet, chased a rabbit that when invisible, chased a boar in a rock, got bucked off by a herra who was on a rock and pushed into the rock becoming stuck. Unable to pounce frogs (no damage) and fought invulnerable goats (multiple issue here part fps lag with dlss and part server lag)

[cosmic wolf]

Virtually ALL AI in the game is currently spawning invisible and frozen..

[stoic glade]

is there any talk to fix ai invis?

[woven spear]

EU3 AI was pretty good earlier today. Now it's invisible, gg

[lethal smelt]

@dreamy river large / apex carnivores are not meant to have an easy life surviving with just ai
Starvation is a very real threat if you aren't hunting players

[dreamy river]

As a Deinosuchus, it's not so easy when no other players come to the lake/river where I am. I totally agree with you that, in principle, one should hunt other species. But when nothing shows up for hours, even if I swim from the dam lake all the way down to the swamp and find nothing except AI, and then I simply starve to death, that's not a well-thought-out strategy. I don't need 100% from a single fish, but at least the ability to survive phases where no players are nearby. Currently, I only play until I reach 100%, and then I start dying from hunger because I only rarely find something, with extreme luck, that fills my stomach more than 0.1-4%.

[grizzled ether]

@quaint mist I'd love to see ai animals following behavioral patterns. following game trails, drinking and grazing. It'd also be great to see proper herd critters being in a herd.

I get that goats are haha in jurassic park but they are not so believable though I get that buildings kinda bring us to a more "clone the dino" period.

Still, the mammals we do have should be in herds.

[quaint mist]

They kind of used to have little families but i think that bugged out, sometimes you would find a couple of deer with baby deer and same with boars....

made it easier for juveniles because you could just pick off a boar piglet as a solo troodon instead of the adult boar that 1-hits you from it's backside lol

[grizzled ether]

oh it's back but with the ai freezing issue it's dangerous to grab a piglet when your a small carno (new troodon will die to their attak)

[quaint mist]

yeah, i'm really hoping the new AI could avoid some of those issues

[tiny bobcat]

@dapper frostA Dev is streaming rn and the Dinosaur AI alr have stam.

[dapper frost]

im talking about the current ai. deer,boar,goat,etc

[lime sleet]

#ai-feedback message I don't, the boar is massive compared to the carno, and the carno can easily run away

[severe cedar]

I don't talk about the big boar. That would make perfectly sense. I talk about the baby that kills a carno with only one hit while it has no strength or tusks at all and the carno exists to kill. As far as I'm concerned, a baby wild boar can kill a fresh spawn carno if it does well but not with one hit. Even if the carno is only slightly bigger at spawn, that still doesn't make sense after all the slightly bigger carno can't kill the baby wild boar with one hit either so why can the baby?

[crimson anchor]

I’m a new player to this game. But I’ve been a game dev, server manager. Etc

Lemme start off by saying the games amazing and fun!.

1. Add effects for people eating their own kind on the official servers,

Less visuals, gives way less nutrients, thirst goes up, overall speed goes down, all (effects) that can be applied not all but some / randomly the more you eat.

2. Fix the ai disappearing.

It’s annoying as a player to hear sheep, frogs, boar, etc for it to be invisible just screaming. Specially when you been looking and looking for food and nothing, ( I play as croc 🐊 )

Also happen as a carno, I was running around in circles to find out AI can straight up be invisible.

3. Increase the sever count from 100 > 250 and add priority for people who wanna spend $5 a month or whatever they can get into servers without a que. I’m tired of the Que waits 😭

[blissful oar]

They have already stated that this paid queue thing isn’t going to happen

Source:

[tiny bobcat]

Everytime i hunt Elite fishes they get slower the longer they i chase them maybe they have stam idk.

[true herald]

is AI prey still invisible?

any ideas when/if it might get fixed? This is pretty absurd, considering how old this game is, doing an update and breaking it then just never fixing it...

welp, finally did my steam review of this game 👎

maybe in another ten years we'll actually get something we can play HAHA

[knotty steeple]

Pretty sure its fixed next patch

[true herald]

which is when?

[knotty steeple]

Idk ask them🤷‍♂️

[true herald]

fffff... uninstalling

maybe I'll come back in another six months to see a few visual assets got polished and everything still BROKEN

[molten dust]

only some not all, unsure if it's random or not, ive only encountered it once. Rest I could see just fine.

[tepid cradle]

If you hear them walk around a little bit using the sound queues, you will eventually bump into it, you can bite it then and get the food. Not ideal but it works.

[true herald]

I like how only players and none of the devs respond 🥷

[lethal fog]

They read it but rarely reply

I think they've their reasons

[true herald]

cool. nice to know the game is completely borked, but not know when it might be fixed.

[soft nymph]

We don’t get ETAs on stuff. It’s fixed when it gets fixed. Along with the other laundry list of items the devs have to do. They don’t need to respond to every single person’s comment. Otherwise they’d never work on the game at all.

[true herald]

a laundry list TEN YEARS LONG. Like.. bruh. Don't act like they ain't have time

regardless, it's obvious we're all screaming into a void here. They done got their money, so who cares right? Ta-ta

[soft nymph]

They have IRL stuff other than this work to deal. If you think you can make a better game then go for it

[knotty steeple]

https://tenor.com/view/bait-used-to-be-believable-baited-jebaited-bait-i-got-jebaited-gif-1296286127798996733

[grizzled ether]

yeah they are deadly.

[celest locust]

to the na5 mixpack of dibl, cera, and dilo, yall are cruel
-teno

[woven flower]

...How do I make fish appear? I have been cruising around the lower part of the swamp for 45 mins and not a single fish. Yet another wasted hour with the inability to survive due to ZERO ai in water.

[knotty steeple]

Ai has set spawn points, swamp just isnt supposed to have a lot of fish apparently.
Theres a bridge at delta that always has plenty of fish, along with delta in general.

So try going there next time

[woven flower]

Swamp is pretty important for crocs heading to the south plains. Probably going to check back in on this game in a few years. I don't mind being killed by others players after playing for hours, but the number of times a croc can't find fish is too high in this game.

[knotty steeple]

If you get saltwater mutation you can skip the swamp and get to south plains through the ocean

[woven flower]

...by still going through the swamp lol

[knotty steeple]

And its pretty much 100% safe, unless you start the journey on less than half food

[knotty steeple]

You dont have to

[woven flower]

which happens most of the time because therew isnt fish

lol so your solution is travel all the way along the north shore and scavenge for crabs?

[knotty steeple]

Ive managed to get nearly 300% growth on my croc so it certainly isnt impossible, even as a fg

[knotty steeple]

No? Thats not what I said lol

[woven flower]

either that or all the way around south? lol

[knotty steeple]

You said you wanted to get to south plains, so I told you that you can go through the dam at delta and follow to coastline to get there easily using the saltwater mutation

[woven flower]

which is around the north coast.. lol

[knotty steeple]

Its like a 20 min journey at most

And you only have to risk going onto land once for a short time

[woven flower]

okay... still the north coast like I said? lol

[knotty steeple]

Yeah and why is that bad?

[woven flower]

...it ain't ideal.

[knotty steeple]

Far safer and reliable though🤷‍♂️

[woven flower]

...I mean fair enough? Thanks for sharing the known safer alternative to get to south plains as a croc I guess? I'm wondering about AI mechanics for fish, specifically in the swamp? I like my current FG croc in the south plains without using up a mutation for saltwater and asking for fish doesn't seem like too big of an ask for one of the four bodies of water that the game spawns deinos in....

[knotty steeple]

Ai is also based on nearby player populations and, well, swamp is NOT populated 99% of the time, especially on officials. That, plus the area fish can spawn in is relatively small.

*In the swamp

[woven flower]

...what does "based on nearby player pop" mean? Everyone says that. Is there an actual write up of how AI works?

...and what does the area that fish can spawn in being relatively small mean? As compared to what?

[knotty steeple]

So basically the server has a list of players in order, it goes down the list periodically and spawns ai nearby that player. So if youre alone in an area, chances are you have to wait a while for not a whole lot of ai to spawn, as opposed to being in a populated area like west rail where players are constantly spawning ai.

[knotty steeple]

Swamp has a ton of shallow spots where they just cant spawn, compared to highlands lake or delta at least.

[woven flower]

I understand the concept... Is there an actual write up, because the mechanic doesn;t seem to actually work that way

[knotty steeple]

I know a spot at swamp right at the edge of delta though that has a TON of fish spawns if you can get them rolling.

[woven flower]

Ya def has its hot spots, just seems very inconsistent with fish. There will big pigs and frogs etc but no fish with plenty of water for them to spwan in.

Where as the pond on the way to south plains will be desolate, but as soon as the croc arrives BAM fish

100% of the time no matter the time of day. That's been true of every small pond I've managed to travel to.

Just strange how inconsistent the swamp is. Everywhere else on the maps seems fine

[novel gust]

What about fish in the ocean?

[knotty steeple]

#announcements message now 🙂

[lethal fog]

They left

[knotty steeple]

LMAO 😭

[grizzled ether]

Unless your playing the deino. 🤣 🤣

[final skiff]

Has anyone managed to snag a Dactyl out of the air?

They’re edible on the ground, but I wanna snag one of the ones circling a tree.

[civic seal]

Im so tired of this stuff... camping out in a lake on a Herrera and after about 5 min fish spawn everwhere in the lake. Jump on a croc - wait 30 minutes... now dying of starvation and NOT ONE FISH HAS SPAWNED
I literally dont get this game fml

[civic seal]

there are ZERO fish in the ocean they dont spawn there

[silent yoke]

Would be nice if fish spawed in the ocean

[prime tundra]

I had one strafing me last night and after the fourth pass used the Deino charge and grabbed it right out of the air.

[agile star]

it does near delta

[final skiff]

Yeah, fish work ODDLY

[final skiff]

A Dactyl or a Ptera tho? Cause I’m talking about the little ai bastards that are on Pteranodon’s diet and can be found swarming select trees. They’d be a great food source, but the tree Dactyls specifically seem to be unkillable (they also spawn on caught fish sometimes, and THOSE can be killed and eaten).

[final skiff]

I’ve seen Elite Fish in the ocean, only at that spot tho, and never schooling fish.

[blissful oar]

Can confirm, that’s the one spot I’ve seen them in the ocean

[prime tundra]

I meant the playable. Sorry still fairly new to the game so not familiar with everything's name.

[quick jungle]

Do you have plans to fix the respawn of bots and fish? In the past you could find them more easily, today it is rarer to find them on the map

[final skiff]

I’m not sure if anyone calls them Dactyl other than me, but if the two, it’s the only one with Dactyl in its name. Pteranodon and Pteradactylus. People call Pteranodon Ptera, so Dactyl makes the most sense to me 🤷‍♀️

[limber flume]

Ey, have they fixed AI yet or is this still a dead solo game ><

[pastel brook]

@naive basin they have shown AI insects and rats

[pastel brook]

too much ai now

makes the game too easy

[naive basin]

oh i did not know, thank you!!

[pastel brook]

its in devblog 53 🙂

[naive basin]

@charred dew LITERALLY happened to me last night. Was playing ptera, flew along the coast from the bottom of the swamp all the way to the western shore. Not a SINGLE seaturtle and died from starvation :\

[charred dew]

now the best wat to grow deino is to camp in the same space
wait for the server to restart and log in to get all the ai

[burnt yew]

a

[blissful oar]

b

[lime sleet]

Better luck next time

[final skiff]

Yeah, the best way to stay fed I’ve found is along rivers and close to lakes that are likely to have more players. I fill up along the salt-lake river, then fly west to the beaches near that baby-zone, since Tacos and Turtles seem to spawn there a little more reliably.

Going back and forth between those two areas seems to increase the odds of something being spawned into at least one. Still, I wish we could eat the Dactyls that swarm around trees or have more fish in unpopulated areas like the human settlement in the north-east, with all the cranes 🏗️

Also, Ptera doesn’t get attacked by bees, so you can rest on the rocks there and theoretically be safe from all but baby Herrera, which you can eat.

[civic seal]

If I'm on my Bipi I'll feed my Herrera, Croc, and Ptera buddies fish!

[final skiff]

I drop fish as Ptera just in the hope that the carnivores I drop them near will have mercy if I screw up near them.

[indigo anchor]

https://discordapp.com/channels/401464048610312193/778350554304479240/1333993697708347513
Fish do spawn here (both shoaling and elite) and ai do spawn. I have seen goats, mainly, and possibly boar

[quick karma]

I’ve spawned at water access on two different servers and no fish…

[atomic haven]

My deino survived more on boars and deer that ran into the river than actually finding fish before it starved lol

[blissful oar]

yeah it's kinda stupid

[charred dew]

specially when you waited and patrol a river for 20mins and the only thing you see is 5-10 deer spawn along the river

[frank elbow]

Running through the whole map and not finding any AI is ridiculous. Legacy AI spawns were much better.

And night time + rain is a signal to just safe log and come back later. Impossible to find something. Way to hard.

Im talking about evrima btw.

Yea you can cross it but its the truth and im not alone with this opinion 😉

Over 1500hours in the game 🙂

[steep hawk]

For me, this was a reason to stop playing the game until the AI works properly

[fresh rover]

Dude how are lakes and rivers void of fish? Why are they not filled with fish all the time? I play deino and when theres multiple deinos in a zone we get faster respawns yes, but it's still like 3-4 fishes for 6 deinos which is kind of insane, if you're solo and there's nobody around? Well good luck cause you gonna have maybe a fish every 15-20 minutes, and only if you don't move from an area and you stay stationed. It's insane, I could understand maybe land AI takes a toll on the engine, but fishes? really? lakes and river should be filled at all times, especially considering the nature of deino's gameplay, that's already insanely punishing, and many times you won't find many other players cause you're FORCED to be near water, shit's unbalanced, not only it's the hardest carnivore to survive with but also the one it needs more time to grow, you wanna make it somewhat balanced? Increase fishes spawns by a TON. If body of waters are empty of any players for hours on end AT LEAST give me the means to survive, especially when you're >70%growth, the risk of starvation is insanely high, and if you don't see players you need SO MUCH elite fish to fill your stomach, which again, WOULD be fine if there was multiple spawns all the time, i'm not talking 2-3, im talking 7-8. Shit's not fun atm and it's a constant struggle, this minor thing could at least make deino's gameplay not pure hell.

(oh a little sidenote, as far as i understand the devs basically work on one dino at a time, so im assuming when they fix something they fix stuff around that dino they're working on at that moment, might be wrong idk, but if thats the case, i doubt theres gonna be any significant change around deinos anytime soon, damn im not even sure they read these channels at all, but also im kinda new, so who knows)

[dull epoch]

Bro facts

Amarok needs to wake up

Tracking system needs a rework also

[charred dew]

soft shell turtle can get pretty big
it would be nice if they added them to the river system and maybe redesign deino's diet
cannibalism for S diet is fine, but I think we need some other option for dots and // for deino that is in 1-4 ton growing stage, since schooling fish can only help you to get around a ton

[quartz axle]

I didn't play legacy much, but the ai did seem a lot better back then compared to evrima currently. Didn't they spawn near you if you couldn't find food or players for a while. It always kind of felt like that, just giving enough food to allow you to continue searching for players.

[quartz axle]

@thorny dragon My prophet, is any part of thee suggestion good. I require your scripture and seek knowledge and enlightenment.

[thorny dragon]

I definitely like the second part about the wandering behavior, but not the first part

[quartz axle]

Let me just modify it a bit.

Heresy expunged

@thorny dragon
https://tenor.com/view/f-inger-guns-skeleton-gif-10885432

[lethal smelt]

@quartz axle @frank elbow @dull epoch
Are we even playing the same evrima?
There is so much AI on the map, you have to make an effort to avoid it if you want to starve
Also, ai despawns v quickly when it has run far away from players and respawns around you in a few minutes

This is the most perfect and ideal iteration of ai that has ever existed in the game

Anything more and they might as well remove the hunger bar because it looks like you all want starvation to never be a possibility even

[quartz axle]

Did i say anything in my feedback about ai not being available

I didn't know they despawned though, but I still think a wandering spawn zone is cool

[lethal smelt]

The second half of my message was for you, the despawning thing
I addressed the others in the first sentence
Sorry

[quartz axle]

ah gotcha

[dull epoch]

The Ai respawns , Respawns under the map

[vivid moth]

It really does feel like feast or famine with the ai right now, like either you can't find anything or there's half a dozen deer and goats in one spot waiting for someone to eat them. This probably has to do with their spawn zones, but that's one more thing that's completely opaque to newer players and makes the game unnecessarily difficult.

[woven flower]

...the spawn points are inconsistent too though and it's a problem, especially for deinos.

[lyric heath]

#ai-feedback message
feels like the majority of fish / frog / crab ai issues are that i'll see MANY appear in once spot, and won't see any for miles
i.e. in Delta river, if you sit at a location for 30 minutes, 6 groups of fish will spawn nearby - i'm guessing that this takes fish away from other locations
A possible fix could be making it so that the fish spawns don't last very long. Maybe they last 2 minutes total before disappearing and reappearing somewhere else?

[uneven helm]

river supreme fish swim into walls too often

[quartz axle]

https://tenor.com/view/adventure-time-deer-evil-plotting-gif-3475489

#ai-feedback message

[grizzled ether]

@sacred axle

The core programming, location tracking and map irregularities hold the bulk issues. Fix those and we'll know what the actual issues are, apart from what we think they could be lol.

[hexed matrix]

When will river delta have fish again? This will be my 2nd time starving cause no one is there + no fish

Ridiculous

[woven flower]

....Same in swamp. The Fish AI is terribly inconsistent. Makes playing this game not fun at all sometimes.

[scenic ocean]

The recent devlog mentioned they're working on fixing the inconsistent/absent water AI spawns for some water biomes.

[soft nymph]

That’ll be nice to have more spawns in the water. Lost my FG Deino cause of no food

[scenic ocean]

Yeah me too and it would cut down on the cannibalism if they'd buff hunger from big fish for FG, too.

and add schooling to the diet 😐

[soft nymph]

Mhmm

Schooling used to be there for juvies but they took it away

[scenic ocean]

I did also suggest that they open up some of those unfinished tunnels between areas (north river to delta for example)

[soft nymph]

I think those are for later on in development. Would be nice to have one going to SP from delta for deinos though

Or just some more water ways for them in general

[scenic ocean]

#ai-feedback message All AI (and plants) should have some set spawns and increase in number when it becomes a Migration zone. Stupid that Herbis can survive on non-diet plants and grass outside of the zones but carnivores have to starve because they can't find any non-player food sources. I went over an hour without seeing a single AI yesterday on my herrera.

Also there were no PZs and migrations were taking forever to pop up.

[next drift]

There should be some ai dinos not counted towards player count and increase player pop from 100 to 120

@silver raven why not?

[silver raven]

Dino Ai is terrible

It detracts from the player experience

[next drift]

The worst parts of this game is the staving bc lack of ai and lack of players

[silver raven]

I don't see how people still manage to die of starvation with the new AI rates

[next drift]

I guess its up to luck, i think ai herbi and carni, low level threats would increase the player experince

being a stepping stone for players to learn how to hunt

[silver raven]

If the game starts to spoonfeed dino AI to carnivores, there would be absolutely no reason to play herbivore anymore

Not only you'd only be playing as glorified food, but on top of that, everytime you meet another herbi "player" there's a 90% chance it's just gonna be some dumb AI

[next drift]

The thrill of being hunted is why people play herb

[silver raven]

And by implementing dino AI that is completely removed

Carnivores won't ever hunt herbi players if there is much more abundant, and much more dumb dino AI lying around to make sure they never starve

[next drift]

The ai could be same level as pig or boar, just tiny dinos that eat and drink

[idle umbra]

I dont know if I would say the dino AI is dumb, of what I saw on amarok's stream of him testing, it looked more competent then most players I fight

[silver raven]

How is that an argument ?

If you just want tiny AI that serves no purpose but emergency food, we already have it

[silver raven]

And it looked smart on his streams from more than 1 year ago
The thing is, it becomes much more stupid when there is more than 1 player around

Even if the AI is insanely smart, it doesn't remove the issue of it suppressing player interaction

[idle umbra]

his recent showing of it were way better then what we saw a year ago, and it likely gonna improve a good bit more before it gets added since last time he showed it was a month or 2 ago

[silver raven]

I'll believe it when I see it working in-game

[next drift]

Im new to the game so might be wrong but 100 players is still too little to be efficient for hunting when ur fully grown

gtg but thanks for chatting ill check back later

[idle umbra]

I dont really see it doing that, the AI showed that it runs away when it gets hurt, I believe it was 65% health it ran, so maybe stuff that can keep up with the AI will be able to sustain off it. I highly doubt that tho since the AI pathfinding seemed really good so it'll probably escape in most situations easily

[silver raven]

That's not my issue with it
It suppresses player interaction because it turns the game from players interacting with each other to carnivores hunting AI and herbivores players being bored to death, surrounded only by AI
No more socializing

[idle umbra]

I don't think the AI would be able to cause that, even if the AI is decently common, it will likely just be a more in depth interaction between player interactions, because rn thats what most carnivores are doing, but instead of just killing like 10 boars/deer/goats. Now you will get a actually decently challenging hunt that's more fun.

[silver raven]

And herbivores get nothing

[idle umbra]

people would still interact with each other the same amount most likely, just instead of killing boar ai for 30 mins before you see a player, you now get a decent fun hunt

[silver raven]

Again, why keep playing herbivore if, not only every other "player" you meet has a non-negligible chance of just being some AI you can't interact with, and carnivores don't even have an incentive to hunt you because of the AI ?

[idle umbra]

it wouldn't really affect how much herbivores get? it would probably be the same thing as it is rn, where people just live off AI in-between hunts of players

[silver raven]

And I won't believe AI will actually be as challenging to hunt as a player until I see it happen

[silver raven]

It would affect them because instead of playing as actual characters they play the human-controlled version of glorified food for carnis

[idle umbra]

I mean, the AI can interact with herbivores as well, the carno AI that has been show will likely go after pachy/galli/teno, sure teno will delete its health and make it run instantly, but once bigger AI's are added, it will add interaction for both

[silver raven]

Interaction isn't just about killing
Players also like to form herds or packs and chat with each other

which they can't do with AI

[idle umbra]

I highly doubt it will be "glorified food for carnis", like ive said, the AI seems very good, the dryo AI when amarok was testing it was extremely good at dodging, so it will be pretty hard to catch

[idle umbra]

How would the AI affect that? there will still be the same amount of players to group and hang out with, its just now you have AI as well which you can interact with

[silver raven]

And the teno AI in his old streams could defend itself and run away when needed
And the carno AI would actually try to locate and track players, and lose sight of them in the bushes

[silver raven]

I can guarantee you there would be less players, because 1. "why even play that if there's already plenty of AI of it ?" and 2.After meeting AI several times when you're looking for other players to socialize with, most players would just switch to another playable which is actually a full-on playable and not playable AI

[idle umbra]

the old teno AI was really bad, now idk if the teno AI there going to add will be better, since teno is such a complex AI I doubt a AI will play it correctly(I dont think they should have teno AI since it liekly wont be good) but the carno, dryo, and even omni AI shown recently seems pretty solid, and its still getting work

[silver raven]

There is no game in which AI can properly replace players.
AI works when the game is designed about a specific creature being AI-controlled, and that's it.

[idle umbra]

I mean obv, but the AI seems good and I doubt it will affect player numbers

[silver raven]

Players will gravitate towards the playables that don't have AI enabled

[idle umbra]

Just because theres a lot of an AI for lets say teno, doesnt mean people are not gonna want to play teno, its still teno and will be fun to play and get hunted by, it doesnt change that experience at all

[silver raven]

When there was dryo AI, the dryo population plummetted
Same happened to teno players when the teno AI released, and with carno when there was carno AI

Somehow people don't like being treated the same way as bots

[silver raven]

It absolutely does

[idle umbra]

when teno AI was a thing in start of gateway, there were just as many teno players, I didnt see any drop at all

[silver raven]

I don't know where server or when you were playing, but there was absolutely a drop
Teno players almost went extinct

[idle umbra]

officials, and unofficial, both still had a lot of teno players

[silver raven]

It's just annoying.
Meeting AI of your own species feels bad. So players switch to something with which they will NOT meet fake players

[idle umbra]

I played teno a lot when teno AI was thing, almost everyday had a herd of 10 tenos, all players, not AI

[idle umbra]

Not really, finding the teno AI as a teno was kinda cool, it was fun to lure carnivores to them as distractions or to have them help in a fight

[silver raven]

You're the very first person I see with that opinion

[idle umbra]

everyone I've talked to has had that opinion for me, everyone I know loved the AI and hanging out with it as teno

[silver raven]

I just don't believe you

[idle umbra]

its also possible they bring back AI following you, when u spawned as a teno in start of gateway there was a chance for AI herd to spawn and follow you, I dont think they should do that, but amarok was working on having the AI recognize a 2 call. so maybe they could have it work in a way where you could 2 call them and they "join your group"

[idle umbra]

idk then, legit probably 30 or 40 people Ive interacted with early gateway all loved to herd around and with the AI

[silver raven]

yikes

[idle umbra]

?

[silver raven]

AI is NOT players
It's useless trying to make them behave like players because they won't
Animal AI is perfectly fine (although it has a lot of room for improvement) because it's not meant to replace players, nor replicate their behavior. It's there as its own thing.

The issue with dino AI that looks like players, behaves like players and mimicks being a player is that it tries to replace players

[idle umbra]

The dino AI also isnt trying to replace players, its just more to add the the map for more interactions, its also its own thing just like animal AI

[silver raven]

If AI is undiscernable from a player, then it effectively replaces them

[idle umbra]

the only way it looks like a plyers is the fact that its the same creature a player can play, otherwise its is very different

[silver raven]

If there is Teno AI and player AI, and they look the same, then the AI is trying to replace the players

[silver raven]

And that is a BIG issue

[idle umbra]

The teno AI acted completely different from players, it was very obv which was players and which was AI

[silver raven]

Compy, ptero and compy AI is fine because they're not playable
They're dedicated AI.

[idle umbra]

not really

[silver raven]

But if something is both playable with AI, it's playable AI. Which is a very important distinction and an active detriment to its enjoyment.

[silver raven]

If you can't see the issue by yourself, I can't make you understand

[idle umbra]

I've never seen it like that, and your the first person I've talked to to think that, the AI doesn't take away from the fun of that playable, its the exact same experience except you can now find AI of yourself which sure, maybe some may not like that, but I don't see that being a large amount of players based on what I saw when teno AI was in game

[silver raven]

Then we apparently live in two different worlds because my experience of it is the exact opposite

[idle umbra]

I have no idea then, I have a lot of hours on this game, and played probably a good 200-300 hours while teno AI was in game, almost every player I found thought the AI was neat

what servers do you play on? because maybe its a region thing since I play US servers

[silver raven]

EU officials

But I've also seen complaints from people from the US saying that the AI was terrible

[idle umbra]

idk, maybe its the difference between US and EU, but on the US officials during that time, most I ran into liked the AI and thought it was cool

[idle umbra]

idk then

[scenic ocean]

the only dino AI that needs to exist is small tiers up to the wight of boars, to give smaller dinos things to hunt.

[winter laurel]

The main issues with playable AI were:

1. If you're a player looking for group, you follow 1-calls of your species. Unfortunately, this led to encountering mostly AI, which can't group and follow you, and kinda just wander blindly around until attacked/killed.
2. If they spawn with you, they'll follow you around, but they call with the same frequency as normal AI so now you have a screaming beacon that attracts large carnivores to your location. Not ideal if you are a juvi. They also just simply got in the way of attacks/etc a lot.
3. Both of these flaws would be forgivable, except the AI is generally much easier to fight than real players. So they don't actually help in combat much or play strategically, and they actively get in the way.

Potentially this could get better if they improved the AI, but this seems to be difficult

[rain igloo]

if they could nest and or shut up when they group this wouldn't be too bad.

[plush sapphire]

i cant load into the 'evrima' version of the isle

[silent yoke]

Did you get an error message?

[plush sapphire]

no nothin

[thorny dragon]

Check out #🔧-evrima-troubleshooting-🔧

[bronze marlin]

Great AI's i just found some deer's on land and when i finally got to them i died of hunger fix pls.. I got some pic's if u dont believe me 🙂

[plush sapphire]

it doesnt work unfortunately ive tried already

[sullen igloo]

wait what is there to fix

you didnt get to the food in time

thats not the games fault

[errant tendon]

Boss ai? 🤔 Rewards for killing said boss? buff? talent or some sort of unlock?

[prisma burrow]

While solo swam around North Lake waiting for any action to occur. After a hour logged off my croc due to fear of starvation; feels like AI doesn't spawn for solo players.

[scenic ocean]

just go eat another croc, works for everyone else.

(sarcasm)

[ornate vessel]

god it would be cool if a couple AI dino’s were implemented/re implemented this year

[bronze marlin]

I been on the game for 45min+ in highlands lake as a croc and there only spawned 1 frog soo? and i was FG so that's not gonna feed me..? How can u say its not the games fault?

@sullen igloo Ask next time before u say anything 😄

[spare gorge]

Still not games fault

[bronze marlin]

@spare gorge So what would u do in that situation if there is no food at all? explain? u must have some good ideas i can use then?

[spare gorge]

I would leave and go look for food elsewhere. I actually did that the other day on my 3 month old deino

[bronze marlin]

@spare gorge Great idea u got.. so good nr 1. player.. mine was around 5-6 months old but ur right its my fault not game 🙂 there should be fish in the water no matter what

But forget i died and the game sucks sometimes, when it's not functunally workin 🙂

[spare gorge]

You’re an 8 ton predator that can one shot nearly everything, you should be at significant risk of starving if you don’t put in the effort to find food

[bronze marlin]

Dude i dont think u understand what was my point to write this.. My point was to tell them so they maybe could fix it cause in the 5-6 month i been playing on the deino and have never experinced that.. but u just wanna talk like good and if u dont read my message then dont apply to it cause if u did u would have seen that i worte that i went on land to get something but i starved before i even could get to something but ofc no effort 🙂 Good night to u kiddo 😉

[sullen igloo]

if you weren't experiencing starvation for 5-6 months while staying at highlands lake because of fish (which is why you imply), then frankly i think the change to fish couldnt have come soon enough lol.

if the situation changes and YOU fail to adapt (such as leaving highlands lake), that is on YOU. stop expecting the game to hand feed your semi aquatic 8 ton apex predator that can 1 shot 75% of the roster

[bronze marlin]

@sullen igloo I dont want to discuss it anymore cause u clearly dont read so good😉 i clearly wrote that i went on land to find food but by the time i find some food i died of starvation right before i could get it and it took long before it even spawned some AI 's and the other player ran away when they saw me🤣 but okay kiddo's 😉

[sullen igloo]

https://tenor.com/view/sure-jennifer-lawrence-the-mocking-jay-the-hunger-games-katniss-gif-10886330088181860026

[lethal smelt]

@sturdy halo I have no idea why you instantly jump to blaming the game when you haven't spent the time nor effort to learn proper hunting and how to find AI?
Like, if I die to someone in a shooter game should I ask for bullets to do less damage?

There is a ton of ai everywhere, more than you would need, you just have to know how to hear and track it

[sturdy halo]

@lethal smelt I jump to "blaming the game" cause it seems to be "the game".
I follow migration zones, listen and look for my dinos
proper diet only to find, most of the time, im left
running around watching my food drain while finding
nothing or food thats not in my dinos diet.
Leading to slower growth. I sunk 147 hours into this game and know a decent amount (no expert) about it to say that sometimes theres an over abundance of ai food
or not enough, no trend, but tonight and last night i could barely find any ai food.
I play with gaming earbuds with dolby atmos on, I can
hear things very well a little to well sometimes.

[lethal smelt]

I'm guessing you're playing carnivore
Migration zones don't spawn any additional ai, they're mainly for herbi food and therefore an indicator that you'll find herbivores there to possibly hunt
So I recommend keeping track of where you have found ai in the past on Vulnona map (Google it and select Gateway), remember them, and find regular growing spots for yourself
After enough time and experience, it should be pretty easy to grow

I can give you a few of my favorites: forks plains, west access, west rail

[viscid marten]

@high thicket Hey some misunderstanding here

We already have frogs for baby crocs. Now, these frogs spawn so slowly that you can easily starve to death anyways despite em, but we're going to pretend like that's not an issue. However, you should be able to farm AI as a baby before you starve to death. You get to around 8% before you would be near death, and although it might be risky to eat an elite fish, you can eat normal schooling fish. In my opinion, having more types of fish isn't needed, but the fact that fish don't respawn in certain places like highlands or south plains is probably the issue your experiencing. It's not that there aren't fish to eat, it's just that for some god forbidden reason they only appear at the restart of a server. Hope this helps

[high thicket]

all the big fish keep going into the airrrrrr

when i chasing them

[high thicket]

pluss big fish cant doesnt even feed full grown

[viscid marten]

They can

Elite fish can sustain a fg croc esp if they have efficient

Each one gives like 15%

[high thicket]

im full grown rn and my friend rn are about to die rn because big fish only gives us like 5 percent and there is no more fish so my friend starved to death and i had to eat off his body

btw we looked for hours

[viscid marten]

I know the feeling but your suggestion was for deinos between 0 and 15 percent, which there is already a bunch of stuff for, and fixing flying fish should already be a known bug since I see them everywhere

[high thicket]

yea mb i didnt know how hard it was being full grown lol

no fish in site

[normal citrus]

devs want to spawn fish in swamps anytime soon?

[lethal smelt]

@prisma burrow @grand spear

Land ai is extremely abundant everywhere at all times. Like 10x more than what it has always been months ago.

For fish, you won't find it everywhere, some places are more common than others. And I've noticed spawn rate is much lower during night or rainy weather.

[dim marlin]

Are fish spawns based on players being nearby? Like if i hang out in one spot will some spawn eventually, Or is it more random?

[pastel brook]

shut up

[lethal smelt]

@merry locust carnivores are already difficult to play
There's a lot of competition between them
They get wrecked by their herbi counterparts
And ai only sustains our current small carnivores
As these bigger dinos get released, ai will not sustain them
So as an incentive, i think it's perfectly okay to let ai be a luxury for small carnivores cause their hunting success rates will drop a lot as players pick big stuff which tiny carnivores can't even hope to attack

[lime sleet]

#ai-feedback message finally a good #ai-feedback

[lime sleet]

Not with the ai right now they're not

They're literally everywhere

Far too much

Carnis need to be an actual challenge again

[lethal smelt]

Yes that's what I said, currently it's all small carnis so they benefit from the current amount of ai
Rex and allo will not

[silver raven]

The issue isn't the amount of AI, it's how easy they are to kill

Let players starve because they're bad, not because they're too unlucky to have a free meal handed to them

[final skiff]

They’re only everywhere if you’re near hotspots or literally solo in a server. Spawn far away from any other players on a populated server, and you’ll starve three Dilos before you see another player. That’s not challenging, it’s just boring gameplay.

Consistent AI matters, so players can actually live long enough to find other players, who are the FUN challenge.

[final skiff]

This is why I keep arguing Clams. Add a tiny AI that can keep you alive, but is a hassle to forage for playables that aren’t Beipi or Austro, and are too small to fill the belly of anything bigger either.

Just enough to keep alive until you can find actual players to hunt.

[grizzled ether]

@dull crest the issue for me is that much of the ai can run 30-40 kmh doesn't leave tracks. Frogs should not be fast at all on land, rabbits a hair slower. But all animals should have a stamina rating where they get tired and begin to slow down.

[dull crest]

Uh what Dino do you play? I have no issue with getting AI as Omni or Cera, I may lose track of it sometimes but that’s part of the hunt

[grizzled ether]

Lol troodon mostly

[dull crest]

Isn’t troos speed around 35-40kmh?

[grizzled ether]

42kmh to 46kmh

Ish

[dull crest]

Troos super small so may just be losing sight of them ngl- if I lose sight of them they do get pretty far 😭 but I tend to find them again if I keep running straight + there’s usually multiple if hunting deer, goats, or hogs

Also idk if it was a glitch or an intended feature but I was just vibing behind a hog’s butt as Cera and it didn’t notice I was there until I bit it

[grizzled ether]

it takes about two full stamina for a solo troo to killna goat, boars are untouchable due to bugs (insta kill anything smaller then sub adult) if your unlucky when dismounting and then chase you. Attacking a boars face is just death.

Rabbits just ninja with their erratic movements and frogs move fast enough on land and have a tiny hit box.

Troodon's pounce often fails due to a bug, you can even be frozen mid jump.

If your sneaking unless you can see the ai you'll not find it without a lot of luck. Normal movement spooks all ai in about a hundred foot radius. Leaving goats....

I'd love to see ai that have nests and eggs, that would solve a lot of food issues for small dino's.

[fallow trellis]

Obviously u dont have any problem if u plsy the fastests carnis T-T

[fallow trellis]

It happened at me too, i was a ptera, regaining stam afk, and noticed a little chicken in front of me, sniffing, like meaning "uh what is this? Is it alive??" XD
I went up and killed it, felt so bad after be eating him T-T

[silver raven]

I'd prefer the current AI being reworked so it's not free meals, rather than havinh free meal AI+ not-so-easy-to-get AI that is simply a downgrade from the easier to get, and much more filling AI.

[fallow trellis]

It is actuall not so easy to get AI, or didnt u see what were we talking about?

[silver raven]

I wans't answering to you specifically, but yes, it is too easy

The only AIs that are remotely hard to catch are boars when you're very small, because they fight back, rabbits, because they burrow, and deer (if you're slow and they don't forget to run, which they usually do)
The rest is absolute free food

[lime sleet]

#ai-feedback message for the love of god someone upvote this person please

[silver raven]

I can't

[fallow trellis]

No rlly it isnt

[fallow trellis]

Uh? Ther is no Ai practically

It has 14 negative votes for a reason

[silver raven]

Chickens cannot run away nor fight back
Same goes with goats, crabs and turtles
Boar are also too slow to run away so as soon as you're big enough they're free food
Deer are also quite slow, and completely unable to fight back so if you're fast enough, you can be the weakest thing alive and still kill them
So yes, ghey're too easy to get

Oh, also schooling fish don't react to getting eaten either, so there's that too

[fallow trellis]

Some dinos arent fast enough to get these Ai

[silver raven]

Which ones ?

[fallow trellis]

And all dinos are semi acuatic to cacth a fish right? ☠️

[silver raven]

Even cera, the slowest carni, can run down any of them except deer

[fallow trellis]

Yes, but rabbits and frogs are too small to hit them easy

[silver raven]

Depends what you're playing as
If you're a cera or carno, why are you even running after those

[fallow trellis]

Bcs u need to grow when u,re baby? Use the brain bro

[silver raven]

When you're a baby you're not too big to hit them

[fallow trellis]

THEN HOW U SURVIVE BRO?

[silver raven]

By killing small AI when you're small and killing players once you're big

[fallow trellis]

Then why u said that when u,re baby, u,re too big to kill Ai 💀

[silver raven]

"not"

[fallow trellis]

Then what the point of what u said? ☠️ ☠️ ☠️

[silver raven]

what

I'm trying to give some sort of logic here
large AI is free food for medium/big carnis
Small AI is free food for small carnis

Because AI is extremely dumb and with poor stats, so it's very easy to kill, even as something that is not supposed to be primarily hunting AI

[fallow trellis]

And i,m saying u that Ai isnt free food, is difficult to cacth

[silver raven]

Which one is ??

[fallow trellis]

Maybe dumb and weak, but fast

[silver raven]

They're slow af
The only AI that is faster than a cera (slowest land carnivore) is deer
Which is the fastest of them

Not to mention they also forget to keep running after a while so they become even more free food

[grizzled ether]

difficulty to catch, easiest at the top.
Chicken - they attack you first (if they spawn)
schooling fish (for pterra this is below goat.)
psiti...
boar
frog (swimming)
goat
deer
elite fish

frog, on land
bunny, master of dekes.

[fallow trellis]

#ai-feedback message

[fallow trellis]

Elite fishes are bigger than beipi, so i find it logic if they can kill them

[scenic ocean]

AI being able to detect players is fine, but AI can see you without line of sight, which makes it impossible to stealthily hunt them and also gives you away to other players when all the AI go mental (because they don't have an alert to danger state, it's either chill, or fleeing for their life at a twig snapping)

I want to be able to sneak up on AI whtout them running from 2km away while I'm behind a bush.

it's fun.

[last nexus]

what would be nice on top of that, is that if your crouched and walking at them the detection radius was even smaller. that way you can properly stalk them and get close enough to try and dash at them.

[molten nova]

i cant pick any ai, i always die by starvation

[soft nymph]

What are you playing as?

[molten nova]

as a raptor

[molten nova]

raptor

[soft nymph]

Are you on HT or Evrima?

[molten nova]

evrima

[soft nymph]

Best bet is to go after goats, deer or tacos. Tacos usually hide in their burrows before you get close so you have to dig them out. Goat and deer you can pounce on a couple times and hold left click to do damage. Don’t stay attached to long cause you want some stam to chase them down and keep biting at them till they die. That’s usually how I have to do it if I can’t find anything to scavenge. Avoid boar till you’re bigger and they start running away from you. Chickens will peck at you too but if you can pounce them first they die fast

[molten nova]

but i cant see any

when im playing with my spego i see plenty of them

[soft nymph]

Most AI spawns I’ve seen are around east pond, south plains, north lake and highlands or west access. Other areas seem to spawn nothing

[fallow trellis]

#ai-feedback message there are everytine fishes in water, and i think is unlimited, so i see no problem with any semi or acuatic dino, even herrera can est fishes, and land ai wasnt as much 2 days ago, so it was, and is, easier for acuatic dinos get food

[fallow trellis]

Highlands is one of the best places if it isnt the best place where i have been, there are a lot of ia everywhere, and an human campaign rlly near the water, so u can hide easily with small creatures

[soft nymph]

I usually avoid that place unless I really can’t find anything

[scenic ocean]

Play a deinosuchus outside of hotspots and tell us how it goes for you.

[fallow trellis]

I dont play deinosuchus bcs of cannibals, but i used to play as it, and isnt as difficult survive outside of hotspots

[fallow trellis]

Why? I litterally try to go there everytime

[soft nymph]

Most times I’ve gone there an herbi gets me.

[fallow trellis]

But herbi are such slower than most of carni dinos, they shouldnt be a problem, i meet them everytime, u can scape easily in chase they try to kill u

[soft nymph]

Okay but I personally do not like that area. So i don’t go there because I don’t want to loose anything to mixpackers and hacker central

[fallow trellis]

Instead of if u play as deino, then u cant scape, but still they cant catch u if u,re in the water, so u can just wait for them needing food

[scenic ocean]

If you haven't played it recently, it's actually awful trying to grow unless you're somewhere like North Lake.

[fallow trellis]

Oh i necer saw any hacker, but if u did, i,ll be more carefull now

[blissful oar]

Fishes aren't unlimited. There is 5 fish in a school and it has the habit of not respawning until there is a server reset.

[fallow trellis]

Oh then u,re right

#ai-feedback message u just need to go out of jungle, in highlands, there are lots of food and they are easily visible

[sturdy halo]

thank you

[scenic ocean]

AI only spawns reliably in a few spots on the map, but usually it doesn't spawn unless there are a certain number of players.

[scenic ocean]

#ai-feedback message also live frog is invincible when it goes on the ground, croaks forever but sshows as S on the compass so it baits people into thinking' it's something useful.

[sonic rose]

last "fish" spotted was a frog in the swamp on a 110 players server with 109 online

[scenic ocean]

Yes, they know things aren't spawning. Read the devlog.

[worn stirrup]

Did they talk about that? I didn't see it

I will read it again, it would be a great thing to slap in the face of players blaming our server not spawning fish.

Oh I got it

[merry lynx]

Maybe i just dont know how the game works but are frogs similar to crabs? Do i have to sniff them out and dig for them?

[fluid path]

Agreed

[jagged summit]

<@&933486433342222376> ?

[tidal lantern]

@timid crane please keep the chat on topic

[lethal smelt]

@lyric elk report in #🐞-evrima-bug-reports-🐞

[olive wasp]

I think wanting more AI in general is a valid compliant and idk why it seems so controversial to discuss it

[lime sleet]

Because there's far too much already

[vital hazel]

mia

Can a plant-eater hit us first?

[merry lynx]

spawn wise yeah, diversity wise not so much

You get your full diet for the whole game just by finding a field with a spawn. It would be fun if every biome had some kind of specific spawn similar to how beaches spawn turtles. Like Deer spawn in forests, goats spawn in high lands and boars should probably spawn in swampier places, Rabbits should spawn in fields.

[olive wasp]

yeah, crowded around hotspots

meanwhile you can walk through entire portions of the map and not see a single thing move

[inland hemlock]

Thats basically the old AI system on spiro with dedicated spawn areas. I miss this system it made u travel around more

[jagged summit]

https://tenor.com/view/beasts-of-bermuda-kaperoo-the-isle-path-of-titans-gif-23526654

[scenic ocean]

#ai-feedback message @jade bridge yeah it's the game not the servers. devs are working on it.

[scenic ocean]

far too much - in 3 spots on the map when players exist.

[molten nova]

can a small croc kill a big fish ai???

[jagged summit]

you can kill anything with anything, it'll just take a while

[tepid wedge]

why does NO AI spawn in the forest. died twice as a croc and not a single fish

[jagged summit]

fish in the forest?

[tepid wedge]

Sorry.... i mean swamp 🙂

starved to death even with 20% digestion mutation and not a single fish in the swamp

[jagged summit]

yeah swamp is really lacking of any aquatic or amphibious ai

[tepid wedge]

not lacking ..l it is not existent

there are no fish in the swamp at all

[jagged summit]

some schooling fish in some spots

[tepid wedge]

nope... there are no fish in the swamp at all

its got to be a glitch but that is what is happening

[scenic ocean]

It's an issue with the game - read devblog for February.

Fish AI are having issues not spawning in many sources of water at all/reliably.

#ai-feedback message Make the tracking system be more reliable and allow them to use scent that way on AI.

[astral marsh]

ive had this happen to me on a lot of dinos. not enough ai food, and then when you do hear one, you lose track of it pretty fast

[scenic ocean]

#ai-feedback message They're working on it. @reef swallow

[high thunder]

hey can we remove the ability of catfish to swallow 10% crocs whole? thanks

[scenic ocean]

They can't catfish only eat up to an 8% and the others have a lower limit. Just dont be bad.

@high thunder

[jagged summit]

Omg this guy

[scenic ocean]

#ai-feedback message they're changing it so Tacos attack small dinos so uhhhhh no.

add rabbits/chickens/frogs/crabs

[lime sleet]

If any AI should be spawning in sancs, it should be the upcoming rat/grasshopper ai

[hallow marlin]

Tbf frogs would make sense for the swamp sanctuary. Honestly the only one from both of your lists I think would be weird is crab, followed by frog for the non swamp sanctuaries

[lime sleet]

We need sanctuary rat ai

[charred ravine]

Famn

Damn

[lunar yacht]

No one click that

its a scam

[steel shore]

I was in the swamps in 40 minutes only one elite fish appears my deino is logged out barely alive because of hunger I think the AI ​​in the swamps should be increased especially since hardly anyone goes there

[olive wasp]

I hope its not like rabbit and chicken AI where they are so rare that seeing one is almost a unicorn

I've said it before but smaller critters should spawn more often, especially in jungles and swamps (which feel very dead at the moment)

[hallow marlin]

I’ve legit seen two something chicken AIs.

And both were like within the same hour on the same dilo. They both attacked me (and died). Never seen them before or since

[charred ravine]

Need more elite fish in swamp

Eating scraps as deino is hell

[hallow marlin]

We need less elite fish they inconvenience my beipi

[charred ravine]

LOL

[frozen elm]

I have roughly around 600 hours in game. Before two days ago, I had seen a total of 2 rabbits. One dead already, the other sitting on an island of sand near the south plains slough area. That rabbit took of running and I had zero chance of catching it as a ptera. Lol

Then day before yesterday, sitting in a bush at NE, poof, rabbit spawns in front of me. Few minutes later, in a different area, boom! Rabbit spawn 5 ft in front of me. Lol I bought a lottery ticket that night! 😅

[quartz axle]

I’ve been seeing chickens. I cant eat them since i was a teno, but they spawned right in front of me and i saw it be murdered by the tacos. It happened right after a reset and i smelled bodies all around me, it was the tacos killing all the chickens.

[jagged summit]

#ai-feedback message ok but why are your anims at 5fps

[hallow marlin]

#ai-feedback message

As a general rule ai fish only spawn in ways that are wack/inconvenience you

[hallow marlin]

The fish applied their jank to the player

[frozen elm]

That is hilarious!! Lol

[lethal smelt]

@light mountain the rubber banding is because of dev monitoring tools running in the background of that particular server

[spark flume]

#ai-feedback message Now deino players doesnt have anything to complain about 😂

[charred ravine]

Hear me out

Dodo ai

[lime sleet]

#ai-feedback message rat ai

[hearty sapphire]

#ai-feedback more ai spawning, i know the idea is to estimulate engage, but if u play when server low pop with carnivore most of time u dead cause no AI spawning... i like to play croc and how im limited to water places sometimes no players come and ai no spawn so ez died, and more u grow more broken that shows... how i make half island in river and dont find any fish...

[silver raven]

We have chicken AI already

[charred ravine]

dodo

[smoky cloak]

The appearance of any food depends of surrounding dinousaurs - flesh eater, herbivore and croc. Depending on the range of them and time period(ticks every minute) - You might not see Your desired food. (it also depends on Your previous ticks of Your status before)
It also depends, if You navigate through, around and away from location to make food appear on Your sight.
And yes, there are also dead zones, where no food has ever been seen.

P.s. these are my impressions of 3 week gameplay with various dinos as a new player, without reading much of code sharing on how things exactly work.

[hearty sapphire]

yeah but it need to be reworked put more spawns or something like that, i got a bug where fish were flying... multiple times, and other not much often but the AI was like ghost "mirage" i see them but could not hurt/kill

[smoky cloak]

I disagree with rework, but fixes of dead zones, flying fish and ghost animals are bound to happen.
Dead zone fix will satisfy Your croc desires, or do Yourself a favor and hang around zones You seen food, when You need food.

[lunar flint]

I saw a fish going on land and he just walked off on land lol

[jagged summit]

chickens

[charred ravine]

no

dodo is superior

[jagged summit]

X

[naive acorn]

truly immersive gameplay

[jagged summit]

#ai-feedback message @queen thicket Pterodactylus* 🤓

[queen thicket]

ah man , the fact is that they are laggy thats all

[glad tangle]

was with whole pack of omnis with another pack on the other side of the places we were in, only deer and goats were spawning, the deer would make boar sounds and tricked us, no boar was spawning but im always passing by and chilling there and always hear and see them, its like if you want it the game knows(i know it doesnt know or does it? lol) but whenever i want something it doesnt appear anyways if anyone has the same problem with deer make boar sounds?

[radiant pike]

Only pond AI is spawning in hordetest. Frogs & fish only.

[candid spruce]

Yep still the same 🙃

[tiny bobcat]

Amarok said that some of the AI spawners don't work, the only AI spawners that work in the current HT are turtles, Fish, frogs and crabs.

[edgy storm]

Is ai spawning on the hordetest, other than fish? I have only found fish

[radiant pike]

Rog, thank you. Just saw that on saphir haha. I don't believe it's fixed yet either Gallus.

[glass crater]

its not fixed lol, have the devs said anything about it yet? i would assume this would be a pretty big issue on their radar

[sullen igloo]

id imagine a fix will be thrown out with the next patch (which is very likely sometime this week, it's rare for HT to go a week without an update if one is active)

[radiant pike]

AI is still busted. Can't be interacted with on the ground and only seems to spawn in Highlands.

[sick jetty]

Could barely find ai today even when in big groups

[olive wasp]

Spreading out the AI across the map and in different types of terrain is the lowest hanging fruit the devs can do if they want to players to be less dependent on hotspots. At the moment you will never hear a player say "Im hungry, lets find food int he Swamps/Beach/Jungle!". The food is all located in hotspots, so players will stay in the hotspots. Simple as.

[digital stag]

Lmao <@&933486433342222376> ^

Poor guy can’t even hack people right, smh smh
Must not have been able to afford the whole link

[ashen fable]

add a hippo ai creature to feed growing barys, and spinos in swamps and east plains that will be able to fight back and be a compentent fighter if not taken seriously (maybe make them like around 1 ton to 1.5 tons as real ones can reach up to 3 tons which i don't think a bary will be able to kill esscially if growing). I believe this will bring new ai creature for different habbits and not always the same in every location.

[hallow marlin]

Yeah, I was gonna say it would need to be a little smaller or else it might just be munching on the barys xd

A sea cow could be funny, though probably not enough of a challenge

[fallen ore]

Uuhhhhhhhh idk if this is international but are the chickens supposed to always attack the maias?

[soft nymph]

Chickens attack anyone

[ebon island]

Are sea turtles spawning?

[lyric heath]

seems they're having issues in HT

regular evrima they're spawning fine

[vocal birch]

eu 12 not fish spawning at west acess

[hallow marlin]

Mice spawn?

[ashen fable]

they added mice already?

[lofty marten]

Its wild that evrima still struggles so much on AI across the board on multiple levels

We need so much more, more spread out and more quantities. Also swamps have basically no fish in them at all

We also need more bigger AI as we get more bigger playable dinos

Rex won't survive at all we with how current game is

[sullen igloo]

good

rex should NOT be surviving off AI at all

you want an apex animal, you work for apex animal. that means starving to death if you can not find people

[lofty marten]

Or other apexes

[sullen igloo]

larger animals in general shouldnt find use in AI outside of using it to kickstart their diet as freshspawns

or maybe sustaining them for a bit longer than they would have had without it, allowing them to have a better chance at finding someone

but AI should not prevent starvation for animals that are 4+ tons imo

(obviously the closer you are to that 4 ton mark, the longer you can subsist off AI as you grow into the adolescent stage and sub adult stage)

but i do agree AI spawns need to be worked on :nod:

[lofty marten]

I mean no "big" AI as like you said, be too easy but something kinda substantial

[sullen igloo]

yeah i get that

a big problem we have in game right now is that survival is trivial for a game advertising itself as a survival game

so im really hoping these larger animals bring in the challenge ive been wanting from the isle. i can only play deino so many times

[lofty marten]

Saaaame, and I'm a Deino main myself

But fish ai is in horrible state rn

Gotta go to south plains if want to survive and get any action

And forced to live in one spot is boring

[hallow marlin]

My personal opinion is the smaller the Dino the more threats should be it’s concern and the bigger the more food should be (not that either should lack the other concern, but I think beipi and deino are decent example, ignoring that deino has the same fear due to cannibalism xd)

[blissful oar]

<@&933486433342222376> dont think this is legal🤣

[jagged ravine]

Me and my mates just hang around south Plains and west Raul access, tons of food and water with no crocs (WRA)

[blissful oar]

No croc in sp? damn

[lethal smelt]

@lofty marten actually there's more than enough ai
Swamp is an exception, that place is just horrible, but everywhere else is perfectly fine.
It just needs to give slightly morel

With that said, apexes should not be allowed to sustain on ai alone

[lofty marten]

We already talked about the Apex thing

dont need to rehash same thing

[lofty marten]

I would still argue there should be more and spread it out more so people can make use of more of the map and do nesting

[lethal smelt]

Sorry it's hard to read everything on discord with so much text

I'm hoping the upcoming deino rework changes the way it's played somewhat and makes it a less frustrating experience

[lofty marten]

Amen

Honestly the AI part of the game is my biggest gripe with game currently, the balance isnt the greatest but not the worst and the roster additions will just come in time

[gusty helm]

are we having more tipes of deer now? hear me out, we have baby deer, big dear withouth horns, bucks-big dear with horns and i'm 100% sure i'm seeing smaller bucks with big horns but not as big, can anyone else confirm?

[random mesa]

@silver raven

[silver raven]

https://tenor.com/view/skeletor-excellent-excellent-gif-26134922

[muted mango]

i found this dinosaur with a fluffy tail carrying around a chicken on the beach. I thought it was a player but it just kept spinning in circles and running back and forth

[soft nymph]

It’s a taco AI

[muted mango]

oo whats that

[soft nymph]

The thing you killed with the fluffy tail

[muted mango]

sorry i meant like whats its name. Or is it just called a taco?

[thorny dragon]

Psittacosaurus

[soft nymph]

Thank you Lunar

[muted mango]

ohhhh tyty

[soft nymph]

That thing but we all call it taco

[muted mango]

gotcha

[thorny dragon]

It's a long name lol

[soft nymph]

Especially tasty on tuesdays

[thorny dragon]

And taco is fitting for a good snack

[olive wasp]

You are essentially punished for not making a beeline to a hotspot as soon as you spawn with the way AI works now as a carni

[lofty marten]

exactly

[foggy ermine]

Hello,
New player here, is it normal that I can't find any seaturtle or crabs on offical servers?

[olive wasp]

Their spawns are very inconsistent, try the coasts west of west rail access

Generally most AI spawns on open plains

[hallow marlin]

If you don’t play beipi don’t expect to see a crab

[flat glacier]

I've dug up lots of borrows no ai in em

[foggy ermine]

Why a Beipi specifically?

[hallow marlin]

Beipi can sniff bubbles underwater, and when it reaches the bubbling spot can dig up crab. Once you become an adult crabs are likely the majority of your diet, and if you go oceanic it’s all you eat

[distant hull]

Is there any AI in HT rn?

[radiant field]

Sometimes they just don't show up

[flat glacier]

Hmm

Ok..

[wind saffron]

#ai-feedback message
are you speaking into a glass bottle? lol

[inner cloak]

@wheat kindle All bots are bugged in the hordtest, Every now and then you find some, but it is really very rare for them to spawn

[mild badge]

its not just HT, AI spawns in general are abyssmal. when you do find them, they're usually dead already and its just other players no-lifing that one spawn until the server resets.

[naive yoke]

im new this game looks great ive died of starvation twice tho how do you find food? how does ai spawn? max pop servers in the recommend locations next to other players why is the game deisghned so that i have to hunt through discord and reddit to learn how to find food? im using q all the time also* and very confused

[knotty steeple]

What are you trying to play?

[lethal smelt]

Twice really isn't that much.
I think expectations need to be managed.
Its meant to be a brutal survival game and it doesn't handhold you with anything and does not serve food to you with any ease ever.
It's perfectly okay to die until you develop certain skill sets.
There's plenty of ai in the game that you'll learn over time where to find and how to find (most of it is audio cues - wearing headphones helps a lot).
Tracking and remembering common spawn locations is a huge help as well.
After several hours of teaching yourself and learning survival naturally, you'll almost never be in a situation where you can't find AI.

[naive yoke]

Yh except I’ve died a lot more than twice

I can’t find a lick of AI

[naive yoke]

Any carnivore

[knotty steeple]

Try playing a herbivore or omnivore first so you can have a chance to learn the basic mechanics without starving to death

[naive yoke]

I can play those I know the basic mechanics I’m pretty successful on the pvp servers just on others I starve young

[knotty steeple]

But if you still insist on growing carnivores, try something like cerato, omni, dilo etc

[naive yoke]

Yh I do

All body’s are guarded

[knotty steeple]

Oh I see

[naive yoke]

I just wanna know if there’s a way to find ai consistently I should know?

[knotty steeple]

Ai spawns more frequently the more players are around

[naive yoke]

Yh I hang in high pop areas the odd occasion I get a pig but I mostly starve

[knotty steeple]

And all ai have specific spawn points as well

[naive yoke]

Oh really?

[knotty steeple]

Yep

[naive yoke]

Is there any way to find out?

[knotty steeple]

West rail and west access are ai hotspots

[knotty steeple]

Gotta learn it the hard way, or ask some veterans :/

[naive yoke]

What I’m trying to do

Rn

[naive yoke]

Thanks tho

[lethal smelt]

Yeah I guess asking us is a trick 👍 🤣
Mudflats is good too
These areas will keep you fed until you learn the map more and discover the rest in your own

[mild badge]

how come goats are listed as a source for lipids in the cera diet but dont pop up when sniffing for food???

[naive yoke]

??

Thanks man idk what trick means tho

Pretty poor game design tbh just in general not only beacuse of lack of AI this game would be goated if it was headed by someone competent

[mild badge]

facts, ive only got about 20hrs in rn and apparently the only way to have any fun so far is if you give yourself brainrot playing the unofficial servers overran with basement dwellers. i work 40hrs a week, and gameplay liek this isnt gonna convince any of my friends to play, nvm for $13usd...

Q isnt even working for me now, im having to rely ENTIRELY on sound/eyes on to do any hunting.

[lethal smelt]

Pathetic take but whatever
Clearly not the easy experience you're looking for

You're not even a couple days into playing the game and making sweeping judgemental statements as if you know anything about it

Theres a massive difference between "this is a great game with a lot of depth, but a bit too much for me to handle cause I prefer a more casual experience" and "this game + devs both suck cause it doesn't tell me how to win easily and I don't have the time nor effort to figure it out myself"
So disappointing

[naive yoke]

There’s no need to get emotional mate I never said any of this this is a great game with a lot of depth never said the devs suck never said I was looking for a casual experience or to win easily

But it’s still got major flaws in general game design compared to other games that are obvious probably because it’s a smaller game studio with less recourse and I have heard the guy in charge isn’t great