general-feedback-discussion

[barren zephyr]

A dinosaur that's prey and slow should have a means of escape from predators, whether it's swim speed advantage, jumping on a rock, or turn radius.

[limber hull]

troo gains really good speed really fast, it's only the first few moments that really hurt

maia can't outrun CERATO until it's basically a fresh adult

troo also has the advantage of being near impossible to spot, and basically any scrap of food providing a complete meal

[barren zephyr]

Yeah, and that's why barely anyone plays it. I would love to see stats on troo deaths from starvation. lol

Then to make it worse it's a one shot as an adult (as it should be) and allo's and ceras and young rex's can alt bite faster than you can jump off.

It's annoying for most people to play and not worth it.

[pliant elm]

It's not so bad for Maia because it can graze and do AFK growth, while Troodon starves to death at 36%, where it's no faster than 30km/h

I never understood Dondi decision to do that.

[limber hull]

nah, i genuinely hate that argument, troo absolutely has it easier imho

grazing doesn't make up for just how bad maia has it, at least troodon can literally grow to sub off literally a single crab

[barren zephyr]

Good luck finding one. lol

But yeah, they need to do something for maia.

[limber hull]

my fave animal in the entire game is troodon, and i've not really had much trouble growing it

find a compy, find a crab, find a chicken, we good

compies are really easy to find now too, just... go to a corpse

[barren zephyr]

Your experience doesn't define everyone else's though.

[limber hull]

sure

but i do have a lot of experience in troodon

[barren zephyr]

Same.

[delicate wadi]

I will say, baby maia is horrendous. I don't know when its swim speed got nerfed, but it should be un-nerfed imo -- aren't hadrosaurs supposed to be good swimmers?

[barren zephyr]

But my point isn't that it's impossible to grow, people can and have obviously, it's that it SUCKS to grow.

[limber hull]

yea, i found it such a shame that they nerfed it

[barren zephyr]

I agree. They should un-nerf it.

[delicate wadi]

Maia just feels like a walking burger at this point, especially with all cerato buffs. Skill issue on my part for not being great at its combat, but c'mon.

[barren zephyr]

I can't even remember a single post from anyone complaining about maia, but maybe I missed it.

[limber hull]

oh there were

[barren zephyr]

I think when it first came out, yeah.

[limber hull]

on initial release, there were so many complaints, maia got turbonerfed

[barren zephyr]

Like the kicks were too fast or something.

But nothing about swim speed.

[limber hull]

namely "oh maia beats dibble in a 1v1 facetank"

headshot hitboxes were bugged at the time. if they weren't, dibble would've had its defence

[barren zephyr]

But I expect nerfs for almost any dinosaur being released since they always seem to let them go into live too powerful in some manner.

[delicate wadi]

Yeah that's true

[barren zephyr]

Oh wow. I never saw that post. The idea of it beating dibble in a headon is crazy.

Was it just beating it to death with its feet? xD

Slaps of doom.

[delicate wadi]

That stomp's no joke xD

[barren zephyr]

Reminds me of how the deers attack.

[limber hull]

initial maia had issues, namely the fact that quad was effectively useless and biped did everything, but i still think it got overnerfed

[barren zephyr]

Yeah.

I wish the devs would take some of their cera love and share it with other dinousaurs.

[delicate wadi]

Same. The cera stability buff means teno tail slams no longer work while a cera is charge biting. Combined with the upcoming teno weight nerf is... a big oof for teno enjoyers.

I guess it would be less bad if the weight decrease is balanced by a speed increase; it'll be a big L if not though

[barren zephyr]

Just another dinosaur that we'll barely ever see again if they go through with that nerf.

I'm super sad about the tail slam, and just the fact that the developers seem to be going away from dynamic fights in general.

They seem to be introducing a lot of quick kill mechanics. Puke (which can end you quickly most times, especially if there's more than one cera), pins, body break moves (making players incapable of combat), the infinite headbutts from carno (think they might have changed that though but the fact that it was allowed is still my point).

I like combat that last a few minutes and depends on skill and making the right moves at the right times. I've had so many epic battles where I didn't know if I'd survive or not. It was good times.

And taking away tail slam, where it actually knocks someone down, means that predators don't have to be as careful and can just bum rush.

Although I will say most stuns are too long, imo.

[muted burrow]

I can say the cracks in this map are really showing., If my food is restricted to certain zones, and I spend half my play time travelling to that zone, only to find no food at that zone, it feels like I was cheated and starved to death of no fault of my own.

just spend the past hour and a half starving to death as a Dilo in a patrol zone

[limber hull]

patrol zones aren't really for spawning carni food

[muted burrow]

I think it would help to make tracking deer/bboar etc somewhat easier

like.... im a predator with really advanced sense of smell and I cant even pick up a scent? Only very scarce audio ques unhearable during rain and interrupted by blasting music?

[normal shuttle]

Also, since you’re just here, I will ask you whether you mean V3 or Spiro as the “old map”

Both were much worse, although V3 infinitely worse in terms of traversal

Gateway is by far one of the more comfortable ones to move around

And spiro sucks for not having anything to accomodate many playables today and being nearly a deathmatch

[delicate wadi]

I definitely think carnis should be able to smell AI at short range / within patrol zones -- you can turn off music, but if it's raining/thundering out then you're kind of screwed

[potent glade]

The busier the servers are ,the less fish spawn, not sure how that works. I was playing when the server was at 15 players and fish were spawning constantly right on top of me. When I was playing later on with 100 players, I struggled to find any fish even though I did not see any deinos around me to be eating them.

[opal widget]

@delicate wadi this is such a lie. V3 was not even close as claustrophobic as gateway. Mountains only on the edges, mostly plain, hills and open pine forest. You could see whole map from not very high hill and tell where you are and where you need to go right away. No stupid roads, no walls, no gates, no domes and other BS. Legacy maps allowed you truly to go ANY direction freely and end up somewhere, on gateway you go the wrong way you either cut off by buildings, rocks or cliffs. Gateway is not even big if you consider the space actually available to players.

[normal shuttle]

Not necessarily claustrophobic. There were many points in that post and maybe I should have specified, but cliffs that make traversal a slog sure were infinitely more egregious in V3 than in Gateway.

Gateway has denser jungles but at least new bushes make chases more viable, as well as the new scent.

[limber hull]

there is quite literally a claustrophobic canyon that makes up an insanely large portion of V3

additionally, yes, there were ABSOLUTELY walls, giant cliffs/slippery slopes where one wrong step could mean a devestating legbreak, or worse, instant death

[normal shuttle]

Look at this middle finger bro

[normal shuttle]

LITERALLY

The whole pseudo swamp river jungle place that also cuts the entire map into multiple pizza slices with those cracks that have a few chokepoints where you can go

And if you try sliding down a smooth cliff, you might as well die or break a leg

[limber hull]

the amount of times legacy wasted my time with legbreak after legbreak after legbreak for not walking on anything that wasn't flat ground was ABSURD

and if it wasn't legbreaks, it was a horrible, instant death

i like having roads, I like having walls and gates, because it promotes traffic to go down certain routes, which aides ambush predators in achieving their primary goal, aides new players in finding a safe path between A and B (especially vital with migrations) and it creates unique environmental interaction, where certain animals can climb over or jump on these walls, or make it over, cutting time or escaping a scarier creature that cannot follow

players need spaces to organically interact with their animals goals

a gate, for instance, is an excellent place for an ambush predator to set up its base of operations. It knows creatures will likely be drawn to walk through it, and that the wall protects it from sight, allowing a more consistent ambush

[normal shuttle]

“Gateway has so many cliffs limiting your way so that you waste your time traveling!!”

Meanwhile gateway:

(Forgot one route dammit)

And also V3 canyon when you wanna go to twin lakes where all the action is:

And if you spawn in the south it is a thousand times worse to traverse

Half of the path is just devoid of anything, just an empty void of conifers

[delicate wadi]

Why was I pinged I wasn't even in this conversation lmao

[normal shuttle]

Now you’re in

[delicate wadi]

https://tenor.com/view/yippee-creature-yippee-gif-yippee-autism-creature-autism-gif-2188294398318319643

[limber hull]

welcome

[junior nymph]

soo you havent played legacy

[obtuse wing]

If you're sad about the loss of graphical quality, chances are you haven't seen the skins we lost (for customization).

[opal widget]

I played on all maps pretty much, and own the game since 2016. Just go and check screenshots from v3 it's no where close to being as closed off and cramped as gateway

[junior nymph]

ive played v3 recently, its not great.

theres some spots that are open, but theres alot of other spots that are worse than gateway

[opal widget]

I mean no jokes, legacy in 2025 is kinda not very hot, I do prefer the general layout of V3 though, not to mention gateway now is so weirdly shaped after they nuked most of its left side 💀

Savannah past South planes is great though on gateway. It's even and open

[junior nymph]

so should gateway just be a flat map?

[opal widget]

The only one I can think of is canyon area? It only has two in and outs on the way , but it's a great route from rapids to trike hill that both are close to hotspots and we're used a lot

[opal widget]

No, but maybe less swamps, walls and huge ahh mountains you can't climb at least in smaller scale

[junior nymph]

there were some annoying moutains in v3

[opal widget]

Also sick of tropical vacation ngl

[junior nymph]

swamps is very out of the way

[opal widget]

Yeah thats a huge area though. Not very popular too, but that's mostly on migration zones being wacky

[junior nymph]

it used to be really popular

[limber hull]

v3 has the mountains way worse wdym

swamp also probably needs animals to actually interact with them (austro and bary)

[glass oak]

im guessing getting prime elder is still a no???

i did everything i did before to get prime on allo but still nothing....

[icy lion]

@safe hearth What?

[safe hearth]

oh hello superlunary 😄
nice to hear from you.

Well, on our community server we can just activate the massmigration (footprint-zone). But with that zone, the patrolzone (eye-zone) can't showing up at the same time.
that massmigration is the zone for all players on the server.
I am looking for the migration zone that gives each dinosaur (Pachyzoo, Tenomaro, etc.) its own zone.
like it was as gateway was released: "the pachy meets teno at his zone, but never stegosaurus"

• on HT like my picture is showing, this migrationzone does exist.

But you can't find anything online about how to activate it. The necessary game.ini file is missing online.

so thats why i was posting it here, cause it was frustrating to find no answer anywhere

[icy lion]

Oh you're asking for documentation on how the mass migrations can be enabled, I was confused lol

[safe hearth]

well the mass-migration is working.
i asking about the migrationzone which allows the patrolzone at the same time; well just about its game.ini sentence which activate that migration zone.
I've been looking for this for so long, I'd be happy if someone just sent me a DM with this game.ini file, where it is included.
so if 🙏 you have any information about it, i would kiss your feet to know it, lol. or it would help to know: which of the devteam may i ask for this.

that situation i'm looking for.
(the mass-migration deactivate this eye-zone)

Sorry, I misread your answer.🤗

[glass oak]

does anyone know if its possible to get prime now on HT? pls reply if you know and i greatly appreciate it... thanks so much 🙏 🙏

[latent olive]

@limber hull the generic theropod curse strikes again

#general-feedback message

[limber hull]

me when my generic therapod is woefully generic

[wind mesa]

@dreamy berry #general-feedback message prime was bugged until today, where nobody could get it. they fixed it today, is that why you couldnt get prime?

[dreamy berry]

wow, didnt know

I grew up to 75% today, and I should have gotten a prime

[wind mesa]

yeah they didnt make any announcements on it lol. we all just found out by everyone going "why no prime???"

[dreamy berry]

omg

crazy shi

[wind mesa]

normal isle dev shenanigans

[dreamy berry]

https://tenor.com/view/venom-twerk-marvel-rivals-venom-venom-twerking-marvel-rivals-venom-kao-gif-8612916396515986082

[normal shuttle]

Saving this, but…this is quite offtopic, unrelated to anything

And kinda inappropriate

<@&933486433342222376>

[fast terrace]

#general-feedback message

looking at this ragebaits me
i hate allos pounce rn

[wind mesa]

@quick ice #general-feedback message reminds me of the huge megapacks we'd end up in legacy, supported by people doing essentially this. you'd think they would've patched that by now, somehow

[dreamy berry]

can u hit the prime after get 75%?

[wind mesa]

nope, not now

[quartz meteor]

@quick ice I suggested the same thing and everyone was down voting it lol I guess everyone is feeling it now.

[sleek tinsel]

https://tenor.com/view/brawl-stars-jacky-jacky-toxic-cry-bs-gif-10879641267581525603

[woven bane]

@waxen moon @boreal swift how are you supposed to fight that? easy, use the same technique smaller dinos use against omni’s pressing RMB

[waxen moon]

Haha yeah I’m Talking more about that Hitbox but whatever if you think Thats fair than keep thinking that

[woven bane]

seems like desync, you’re playing on unstable HT servers after all

not justifying the hitbox itself but it ain’t that big lmao

[waxen moon]

True but allo rn is still to Op, or lets just say Omni is to weak ig and this desync makes it almost impossible

[woven bane]

ye i agree allo is busted

omni however, far from weak

[waxen moon]

Trust me I have a lot of hours on Omni and rn it’s in it’s weakest state against all those op dinos and also in the Most unfun

[cyan flame]

How is it weak? Is there something it can't survive? Does it struggle staying alive overall?

[woven bane]

why do you keep playing it if you find it unfun, regardless i think it performs just fine, what are the issues?

[waxen moon]

It struggles fighting pretty much everything on the ht rn if your not a big grp

[waxen moon]

Dont ask me… nostalgia

[woven bane]

it received a massive stamina buff this HT, it can pin 3 galli’s back to back and still have enough stamina to run all over gateway

[boreal swift]

What are you on about? 🤣 a 3,8ton dino being able to not even stand up before instapinning you is fully fair to you?

[cyan flame]

Okay, but can you survive?

[woven bane]

maybe don’t run straight into its mouth expecting a good outcome

no different from omni insta pinning stuff

but that’s beside the point

[cyan flame]

Cause at the end, the game is survival, not fighting. So the question is, is omni lacking in surviving and doing fine overall. Or are you complaining that you can't fight things? Cause those are not the same things.

[boreal swift]

what is omni instapinning? u knew to the game or sum?

[cyan flame]

Omni normally pins things under a certain weight?

[boreal swift]

alr man, keep sitting mid fight and survive everything

[woven bane]

omni can pin things anything its size and below lmao

[boreal swift]

yeah? what exacly is that? a troodon? XD

[woven bane]

again, i ain’t a fan of allo’s state

[waxen moon]

Saying Omni is Not weak rn is crazy honestly

[cyan flame]

I mean, in the clip, you kind of ran right next to the allo, it did look a little delayed/odd, but it didn't seem unreasonable that the allo could catch you there

[waxen moon]

Haha yeah Thats Bad desnyc Alr but Thats Not the only thing Bad about fighting allos

[cyan flame]

Pretty sure omni is a little larger than troodon, but you are one of the playables that can hunt troodon effectively, so that's maybe a thing to do, though they seem a little small for food to be honest

[woven bane]

Hypsi
Troodon
Homalo
Dryo
Beipi
Austro
Herra
Rugops
Mono
Proto
Galli
Minmi
Ovi
Ptera
Ava
omni.

not to mention subs and juvis who weigh around half a ton of other species

[cyan flame]

No doubt, allo is probably a little overtuned, then it'll be undertuned, and around we go, cause that tends to be how the Isle does it xD

[boreal swift]

what the?

what are you on lmao

[cyan flame]

But maybe allos aren't great to fight, what with their grapple, they do seem like something you don't want to mess with if you can get taken down in one go

[woven bane]

nobody is complaining about losing a troodon to an omni, it becomes an issue when equally sized opponents are deleted with 1 click

[woven bane]

reading is not this difficult man

[pliant elm]

Omni is buggy, not weak

[woven bane]

i gave you a list of the animals that get pinned by it, it’s more than a mere troodon

[boreal swift]

dinos that arent even in the game my guy

[cyan flame]

As it has pretty much always been, omni has overall been very powerful, but pounce does whatever it wants xD

[boreal swift]

im not doing this, speaking to you is like speaking to an ai

[woven bane]

yeah, take those away and you still got a decent portion of the roster being unable to exist in the vicinity of an omni

[waxen moon]

Same thing

[cyan flame]

Biggest issue with omni is that they want it to do one thing, but making that work out and be fun, is quite difficult. Somewhat similar to dilo perhaps

[waxen moon]

Honestly I dont even want to Argue about this

[pliant elm]

No. Pounce is bugged, and this ends up making Omni and Troodon much weaker than they should be. This should be a priority to fix, Especially now with Allo

[waxen moon]

Yeah 2 dinos that are Instant adult, a flying Bird, a Swimmer a climber and troodon lmao

[desert arch]

Dont forget galli

[cyan flame]

How good/bad is troodon currently?

[woven bane]

mechanical issues=/= balance issues

[pliant elm]

More or less good. Troo is in a good place, despite having an unnecessarily difficult juv phase

[desert arch]

But if were justifying omni pinning things, allo is no issue as well.
Things smaller than omni cant interact with it at all in any meaningful way, even if they wanted to. So yeah

Same thing, scaled up

[pliant elm]

The recent buffs and additions to it have really been very good

[waxen moon]

Yeah true

[woven bane]

allo has a 65% threshold so technically to a lesser degree if we’re talking proportionally

[waxen moon]

Honestly killing Omni with troodon is pretty easy

[desert arch]

Fun wise same thing.
Am I smaller than it? If the answer is yes, I cant exist anywhere near it or have any chance at fighting it.

Pin just sucks, it gotta go

[pliant elm]

Although whenever they do good things, they also do two bad things. Troodon had a change in diet and a reduction in Pounce cost, but suffered a completely unnecessary decrease in juv speed from 39km to 12km

[desert arch]

If the omni lets you, sure
All it has to do is face you and press rmb when the troodon gets close, since pin hits the attack for you

[pliant elm]

One step forward and five steps back xd

[woven bane]

omni mains finally get a taste of their own medicine and conclude that the pin mechanic isn’t actually broken, it’s just unfair on anything else besides omni

[waxen moon]

I hate Pin on Omni too dont get me wrong

[desert arch]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1344002521462738954/1354919316692402408/DDD1071.MP4?ex=69237272&is=692220f2&hm=407b8b29226b2d596b7978df3cceb7655e073aa9c3322ec63595b30d3a6b481c&
💔

[waxen moon]

yeah also bs but still hitbox not as bad atleast he pressed pounce when you where infront of him that allo was mid standup but i feel your pain none the less

[fast terrace]

#general-feedback message

i like this
reminds me of dayz cannibalism

[terse portal]

#general-feedback message @agile fable
I personally believe grapple itself as a whole is much more fair and balanced as it requires teamwork and coordinating and only really works in a good enviornment. Vs individual pinning is in its entirety lol (that goes for raptor, allo and rex(specifically for its pin)) just right pin and slaughter helplessly...

If that trike was in a more defensive position (Against the water, a cliff, rock, etc) the allos wouldnt be able to achieve that in any of those scenarios without the risk of being scrapped off/lodged between an object and the trike then 1 shot lol. Catching them in the open like that IS the reward. Also for servers that enforce it... the group limit is only supposed to be 3 but ofc official servers are always full of completely unnatural and unfair scenarios. :v

A normal group of even fully grown prime elder allos wouldnt have the weight to achieve that on a fg prime elder trike- its not fair to balance off of peoples mobs of dinos on the unlawful servers lol.

[normal shuttle]

Hey dude, remember when I said that people would suddenly begin complaining and caring about pin when allo was released?

Suddenly, when these issues began to affect their favorite dinosaurs and become their problem, they realized how bad it is even though they would just say “just avoid the pin bro” to all tiny tier players

But otherwise they would have never seen it

Crazy empathy 🥀

[agile fable]

I agree, he was obviously in a bad spot. but he also could never have made it to the water or any other defensive position as trike is simply too slow.

trike stego etc cant always be by a tree rock water or cliff but the game also needs fear factors as well i guess.

was just insane to see 5 dibble strength dinos pin and kill a trike within 10seconds or so

[hollow vine]

wat a balanced way of dying

press pounce on the most immobile creature in the game press pounce and win the fight delete 10 or more hours of growing with pin yep sounds very very balanced to me, remove pin on allo entirely. no matter if its 3.9 tons or not allo should NOT be easily killing trikes like this or rexes.

[icy lion]

@pulsar inlet Check the pinned messages in the official server channels to see how to report hackers

[next flint]

@urban bear to your feedback
hordetest is a TEST branch. Its only one zone locked at delta so ppl go there, test, fight, its not a play like live branch

[pulsar inlet]

I know how (but thank you!)- I guess my point was that not all people have discord and are able to report that way, and most even with discord would benefit for a more streamlined in-game option to do so. I think it would be a common sense option to help increase reporting and decrease hackers! If anything I would hope it would deter people just by seeing that there’s an in-game report option. Food for thought 🙂

[urban bear]

Thats great but how are we suppose to test how the new dinosaurs would function in a proper eco system when its just delta deathmatch

[next flint]

bc theres not enough people that actually play this life cycle, they just test and run into everything no one rlly tries to play there. Also unlikely is that there is every species. Most species are on live servers while atm mostly rex, allo and ptera is being played on HT servers. There is no proper eco system its just stat and balance testing

[delicate wadi]

@tiny gorge The water bug is already fixed in current hordetest

[limber hull]

@barren zephyr #general-feedback message

imagine you lag and the server detects you moving at an unusual speed because of it so it just explodes you and you lose your hours thanks to latency

It’d be pretty funny but probably not for the guy who got exploded over their wifi router conking out lmao

[barren zephyr]

I'm sure they could work around that.

[barren zephyr]

Lag doesn't make your dinosaur move at a higher speed. If you're worried about when you rubberband and it looks like you're moving faster, what you're actually seeing is when the game makes it catch up to where it should have been in the first place. Lag doesn't make dinos go faster. It causes movement delays, stuttering and rubberbanding. None of that would register as someone using a speed hack. I don't know why you think that it would.

[native dune]

Has there been another wipe? Im 100% sure i logged off as a prime allo on eu2 yesterday

[junior nymph]

no wipes I dont think, but rollbacks yea

[native dune]

Ah. Well its gone. Guess I'll grow another then

[barren zephyr]

I was going to say that but thought there wouldn't be a point since I'm pretty sure he disliked my suggestion simply because we didn't agree yesterday. lol

[urban flax]

They're moving faster and there's already a system causing players to get disconnected when they're moving too fast
This system also causes random disconnects on players with connection issues because they're "moving too fast" when their dino is catching up

[faint folio]

@ionic estuary One problem with making logs so you can step over or through them is that, right now, I heard multiple players say they use logs when playing small animals (dryo, teno, galli, etc) to gain distance on attackers. They just jump the log, but larger enemies are forced to go around. That wouldn't work if larger dinos can just go through the obstacle.

Instead of making the logs so that everyone can ignore them, why not make logs and objects that block hit boxes easier to see by either changing the surrounding ground clutter a bit, or by scaling them up some so they're bigger?

[ionic estuary]

I like that idea too. My main issue with the logs is the fact that you just can't see them until you run into them, that's all.

[faint folio]

Yeah I hate when I get stopped randomly by some hitbox that I can't see

[normal shuttle]

I rejoice

[delicate wadi]

This, or make them more like the hollow driftwood logs on beaches and near lakes, where smaller animals / those who can jump are able to maneuver underneath but larger animals would have to go around.

[barren zephyr]

The system you're talking about isn't intended, I'm sure. No one wants their game to crash or for random disconnects to happen. What I was suggesting would be intended, and I would hope that they could make it detect when someone is lagging or not. But this wasn't just about speed either. It's about doing more damage then the dinosaur should, such as a baby cera or hypsi one shotting prime dinosaurs. Sure speed hackers are annoying but one shot killers are the bane of existence and there has to be a way to detect when someone is doing more damage then they should be capable of.

On top of that, I don't think they're actually moving faster when they lag. Lags a delay between input and action. It just looks like the dinosaur is moving faster as things try to correct themselves.

[urban flax]

Desync makes dinos move faster
Because on the user's end the dino is moving in a certain direction/a certain distance while on the server it's not
When resync happens the dino has to be moved very fast for both positions to match
For the server itself it's almost undiscernable from speed hacks

[barren zephyr]

They're not actually moving faster though. And if they made it so they could detect prolonged/sustained movement then it would be able to tell the difference if that was somehow the case.

It's not a genuine speed increase when there's lag or desync.

[urban flax]

But it's how the game perceives it, and that's what matters
The issue is hackers always find ways to get around these things
There used to be a different damage hack back then, that allowed cheaters to oneshot anyone not by increasing their bite damage (because believe it or not, there's already a measure against that) but by allowing themselves to bite 1000 times in one single click
Technically they weren't dealing extra damage, just biting a lot of times

Then devs hard-coded bite cooldowns so that couldn't happen anymore, but hackers have found a way around it again

Think of it like this : is the solution is simple enough that you can think of it, it's most likely already been attempted

[barren zephyr]

That's not how the game perceives it. That's how the players perceive it. That's why a raptor pins a galli four feet away from itself. They were in different spots to each other but no one's speed actually changed.

They were just seeing different things.

And if it's biting a thousand times then they could counter it the same way, by preventing the dinosaur from doing anything its not supposed to or else it dies.

[barren zephyr]

Dude, it was just a suggestion. lol

[urban flax]

Here lies the issue
Define "anything it's not supposed to"

[barren zephyr]

Are people not supposed to make suggestions because it might have been said or thought of already?

Anything = whatever it was not programmed to do.

[urban flax]

That's not something you can tell to a machine

[barren zephyr]

It literally is.

If so and so goes over x amount of damage, speed, whatever then you shut it down.

[urban flax]

And hackers have found a way around this rule

[barren zephyr]

And programmers can find a way around the way they found a way around.

I mean, you proved it yourself with the bite cool downs.

[urban flax]

Yes, all I'm saying is it's not as simple as you think it is

[barren zephyr]

You're something. lol

Where did I ever say I thought it was simple?

I literally said in my post "I don't know if this is possible or not".

[urban flax]

Well now you know it's not
Or rather, already been done

[barren zephyr]

No, I don't know anything. You're not one of the developers that have tried it.

Or are you? Your name's not red.

Do they give you updates on what they do?

[urban flax]

I was around when they rolled out fixes to the different cheats that happened

[barren zephyr]

Okay, dude. lmao

You need to be right. I can see it. We'll just agree to disagree.

And yes, I still think it's possible despite you trying to assure me for whatever reason its not.

It's a hill you clearly want to die on.

[urban flax]

It's not, but I have enough experience in game development to know that if there seems to be a simple fix to an issue, either it doesn't work or it's already been done

[barren zephyr]

Whatever you say, champ.

But I don't agree. Let's leave it at that.

[atomic tangle]

#general-feedback message
arent they gonna make the rex sparring?

[limber hull]

It already has sparring

[normal shuttle]

I hope they keep allo pin and grapple like this for a while

Divine justice

It is actually infuriating every time I think about it

no one cared until it affected them

[urban flax]

You can apply that to every problem in the world

[atomic tangle]

yeah but its kinda broken

[normal shuttle]

I know, still I’m mad because I can see issues with playables I hardly ever use

[pale river]

I have a start to a solution to the mix packing problem. We a carni is near a herbi for a long period of time and is close the carni gets hungry faster. I believe that this wouldn’t hurt hunting/normal game play that much and would make an incentive for carnivores to eat there herbi friend if it was smaller or run away to look for food if it was bigger. (This would only work for herbis over a ton or so) Please tell me in general feedback discussion for issues on this

What’s is the issue with this solution

[wind mesa]

#general-feedback message @cold abyss i understand where you're coming from for this, as logging out while in a fight to avoid death is hugely annoying. I'd like to share my experience though so you know why i x'd:

Last night i'm growing a sub trike with a friend. Got ambushed by a prime allo and two juvies, which we handled but i was left very low as i am not a good trike player lol.
However, we were then chased by one of the juvie allos for 10 minutes, as he's 1 calling and copying his coords for his friends. We eventually manage to catch him and kill him, only for a juvie raptor - one of his friends - to jump down off a cliff and harass us to make us not log out.

Took 5 minutes to log out, and that was only because i had leaned up against a cliff so he couldn't pounce on me (which would cancel my logging out).
We eventually logged out without issue, no idea who he was 1 calling for but i wasnt going to find out!

If they are willing to go to this much effort already, biting to cancel logging out would only make this worse. I think the 60 second timer is already enough time for someone to kill you, especially if you're running from a fight.

Otherwise, i would suggest that only a medium-high amount of damage would wake you up, and being hit/pounced on by something insignificant wouldn't. I would be ok with that.

having a juvie raptor descend from the heavens just to mess with me was certainly an experience lel

[normal shuttle]

<@&933486433342222376>

[pliant elm]

The only appropriate solution for mix packs is rules. Solutions that inflict debuffs will always have loopholes that trolls can exploit

[pale river]

I heard there were rules on legacy how did that work

What I find the issue with rules is that they have to be in forced and with the hacker issue being like the same thing and isn’t really being in forced I just don’t see how that would work rn.

[wind mesa]

rules on legacy were enforced by unofficial servers, official servers had no rules and were a free-for-all like evrima's servers.

[pale river]

Ah alright

[pliant elm]

Only unofficial servers have rules, and that's also true for Evrima. If you want to have fun and avoid dealing with hackers and mix packs, I recommend playing only on unofficial servers

[pale river]

Ye I just can’t find “the one” I want one that is like official with just no mixpacking and maybe a lil bit for people (I’ve looked at mettas den and petit peids)

[pale river]

Do you have any in mind

[pliant elm]

Petit pieds

Or simply filter by "most players" above, and the servers with the most players will appear; join them to test

[pale river]

It’s just to many rules (I know I’m picky) I just want to carni/herbi packers and there’s to many people

[pale river]

I will test them more

Thank you

[pliant elm]

Petit is Low Rule, But there's also no AI on the map due to the high number of players

It's a very difficult server, but good

[olive hearth]

i can recommend the Triassic Survival Server
low rules, storage system, regular events and a nice community

[pale river]

I’ll try it

[inland vigil]

@wraith robin the reason you crashed is because you did hit the allo. all the other pecks were far too high and didn't land- the one time you did hit it, you weren't holding z brake. they adjusted ptera so that biting large targets when flying too quickly makes you crash. it's some weird balancing addition idk

[wraith robin]

ok thats stupit change thx for telling me

[inland vigil]

yeah i think it's because pteras bother big dinos who cant fight back cause they cant jump, but like- if you're being harassed by a ptera the forest is RIGHT there 💀 i don't get it at all. ptera has one thing it can have fun with and they take it away

[wraith robin]

so no point to play it anymore...only to explore the isle sad

[inland vigil]

i like a lot of the new ptera changes with the flight (other than the slow down) but yeah the inability to interact with other players is so sad :/

[wraith robin]

the flying thinks are realy nice ( beeing super slow not xd ) yeah only ai hunting makes no fun and babys fare to fast and agil. Pt cant hunt anythink because of the slow flying a chicken runs faster then i fly

[inland vigil]

pt really doesn't have the health or stamina to even fight juvies on the ground which is what the devs said they wanted it to do

i would love to be able to run around on the ground like a little bird menace but my stamina is DESTROYED in doing so 😭

[wraith robin]

no chance how to fight a baby omni or baby allo there pin you over.
all other 2 hit you too so why fight on the ground?

[inland vigil]

exactly. ptera needs some major changes to actually fill that niche

plus the peck attack doesnt even seem very menacing from an animation perspective. i would much prefer to fly down and pick up a juvie and drop it from a great height to its death 😂

[wraith robin]

yes that would be fun XD

[inland vigil]

(to keep from this being abused they could make it drop naturally after a few seconds)

[wraith robin]

fly baby and DIE XD

[inland vigil]

that would make ptera genuinely so fun hahah

[faint folio]

I've had friends who ran into the forest, hid in bushes, etc and were unable to get rid of the ptera attacking them until they died. Ptera simply should not be able to kill things massively out of their league

But I do hope they make pteta capable of hunting juvis and such. It would require a rework of their ground movement too

[tight dove]

No need, flying while holding a small dino would cost a lot of stamina, if you don't fly high enough and drop it quickly you will just fall on the ground with him ahahah

[cyan flame]

@tight dove They might be able to use the sparring system in some manner for a tug-of-war style hunting for deino. But I'm not sure that'd neccesarily make it better for deino, there'll probably still be some limits to what you can drag down or even grab on to. Bucking, currently being RNG would probably not be a good idea to use though. Deathroll could be useful as an attack, but not sure how much damage it would do. The biteforce is already in the game, it's the lunge weight limit. You can grab 4-6T (and more as prime), that's your "force" right there. Might not be as obvious, but none the less. So not sure how much an attack would do, probably not too much, if you're still meant to drag things rather than outright kill them.

[inland vigil]

oh yea true

[tight dove]

The deinosuchus' bite force isn't particularly strong in the game; theoretically, it should be greater than that of a T-Rex, but obviously it would make it too OP even on land. This is why I think it makes sense to include a death roll once you've already grabbed the prey. Give the deinosuchus the strength it deserves, but only for that attack, not for the alt bite, etc. Since it only works in this limited context, I don't think it's a big problem if it allows you to directly kill prey that isn't particularly large (just as the T-Rex's crush bite one shot half the roaster). Dragging it into the water would still be the best option for medium-sized prey that would survive the death roll and escape. But at the same time, the chance to escape the deinosuchus's grip would give them a chance of survival if they're not too close to the water. The death roll would also mean that dinosaurs like the Stegosaurus couldn't just face-tank multiple crocodiles. On land, they'd still have a huge advantage, but at least there'd be minimal skill use, as you have to avoid getting right in the face where it can grab a leg (or that small head) and perform the death roll.

[cyan flame]

The basic biteforce, no, but you have that biteforce represented in the lunge. And no, I don't think the biteforce was greater than the rex, it's based on estimates that turned out to not be accurate. Otherwise, the idea isn't bad, adding a more proper tug of war thing would be nice. Not sure on the deathroll, if the point is to drown things. And there's no real issue with stego or anything larger "facetanking" a deino, they're too large to hunt anyway, so just avoid them. But it would be more interesting for midtiers with a better way than the current lunge at least.

[tight dove]

Even if it were smaller than that of a T-Rex, the difference wouldn't be as extreme as it is in the game. I understand that this force is built into the ability to drag prey through water, but this way you're making the deinos absolutely op against prey up to a certain weight x and completely useless against dinosaurs that weigh 100 kg more. Doesn't make much sense

[cyan flame]

Yeah, and therein lies the issue with current lunge. It would be a lot better if they had something like spar but for tug-of-war for deino, that way you could apply that to anything but the smallest things, and make it increasingly difficult for the deino to succeed, up until targets that are simply too large to pull in the first place. Deathroll should perhaps be a "finisher" when you've dragged things sufficiently far into the water, rather than then holding them under the water for x seconds until they drown.

[tight dove]

And honestly, I think it's quite a problem that a stegosaurus can easily face-tank a multitude of deinos... With that tiny head it should pay adequate attention ahahah

[tight dove]

Oh yeah, there are definitely several possible solutions and the devs will obviously have to make everything balanced, but the current lunge definitely needs tweaking

[cyan flame]

Well, last time there was talk about tug of war, stego was intended to pull the deino, so I'm not sure it's meant to be a target for deinos, unless the stego is swimming.

[pliant elm]

Deino was unfortunately brutally nerfed in real life. Now weighing less than 5 tons and obviously not having a bite force stronger than Rex

[tight dove]

I agree, that's why I specified in the suggestion that the dinosaurs that the deino can't grab at the moment should be able to drag the croc along as well, but the deino could use the death roll to do adequate damage

Obviously a fg stego should have an advantage over deinos on land, it just shouldn't be that extreme

[cyan flame]

Not sure on the deathroll on land, I'd rather see that as a finisher if you drag things into the water. Instead of grabbing them and then sitting on the bottom of the lake until they drown, while they just wait for that too. Would be more engaging and a quicker kill if you, after having successfully dragged the target into swimming anim, then just deathroll and kill them like that.

[obtuse wing]

yeah

[cyan flame]

So we have an oversized deino and undersized stego in the game. And maybe changing diablo and teno and possibly others.

[obtuse wing]

a creature that should have been oversized didn't get it

[tight dove]

I understand your point but honestly seeing stegosauruses half-dipping into the water and facing groups of deinos who physically can't do anything is a punch in the eyes

[obtuse wing]

The idea of ​​the pteranodon being designed to be similar to the pteranodon from Jurassic Park III would make more sense and be more useful.

[cyan flame]

No worse than seeing trikes or rexes doing it from what I can tell really

And for some reason rex has an alt bite in the water at that, I think

[cyan flame]

Eh, we're going to get quetz that'll do for big bird. Ptera should probably remain the size it is, it doesn't need size, it needs a bunch of other things. Similar to deino and some others, the issue is rarely purely stats, but more so abilities or mechanics. Even stego suffered from that until it got powerswing, despite having pretty good stats.

[obtuse wing]

I believe the problem here would be the lack of a proper drag mechanism
like this

stego x deino ^

[tight dove]

The mechanism would also make these fights less unequal. Obviously, they're even bigger and more dangerous, so the Deinos' disadvantage would be even greater compared to a stego, but the point is that it shouldn't be so extremly one sided

[tight dove]

It would essentially be a revisitation and improvement of sparring

[obtuse wing]

Ptero is useless today, and that wouldn't change with a few abilities in my opinion.
But it's okay, it works as it is now..
But honestly, it could be much cooler if it were bigger

[tight dove]

Give Ptera the ability to grab and carry small juvi and some AI and I have no doubt that many would start using it

[cyan flame]

Maybe, but since we're getting quetz, I suspect they intend for that one to do all the potentially cool ptera things. Which does make some sense, instead of just making quetz a bigger ptera.

[cyan flame]

I don't know. I think things that size isn't meant for deino to engage with, even in water at times. A rex is a rex, even while swimming after all.

[tight dove]

And a deino is a deino, even on land ahahah

[cinder anchor]

i feel like a lot of people barely reads suggestions and just down vote just to down vote

which isnt okey

[limber hull]

I read “buff the damage of the animal that can consistently 1v1 trike already” and knew what I needed to know

And no, I read the entire thing, I just think it’s an absurd take

[cinder anchor]

trike 1 taps it tho

[obtuse wing]

One does not exclude the other; we would have two flying creatures capable of competing for resources.
While the Quetzalcoatl can capture a Gallimimus, the Ptero will be much more agile and capable of efficiently handling creatures such as herreras, beipe, hypsi, juveniles, etc.

[cinder anchor]

while rex needs like 10 bites to kill trike

[limber hull]

it does not

[cinder anchor]

yes it does

[limber hull]

how?

what attack does it have that possibly magically one-taps rex

[cinder anchor]

push the rex down to the ground and then use the 6000 damage ability and ggs ez

[limber hull]

it can't knock down rex

at least, not if both are fg

[cinder anchor]

yes it can

[limber hull]

i think maybe prime elder can knock down an adult rex but that's prime elder

[cinder anchor]

6000 damage ability is still not what i call fair and balanced when the roster is this small

[limber hull]

i dont think there should be any complaints about prime elder being stronger than non prime elder

[limber hull]

it's only 6000 if it gets that knockdown in the first place, which it can't do on a similarly sized rex

[cinder anchor]

im not even talking prime elder

balance after adults not elders

[limber hull]

i know, im just saying, the only thing that can knockdown an adult rex is a prime elder trike

[cinder anchor]

dude, you dont get it, rex has 5 seconds to get out of pin and then u have so much stam drain while using it

it needs more damage to make up for that

[limber hull]

you don't get it, rex can fracture, damage and pin trike, trike can't knockdown rex

rex has so many advantages yet we apparently need more

the ONLY thing trike does to do exceptional damage is thrash, which is insanely punishable if not used on a knocked down target or dodged in general

in a fight between two competent players, the damage output is very similar

except rex can pin and fracture, leaning it more to its side

[cinder anchor]

you just said it cant knock down tho what are u even talking about is this even about rex anymore?

[limber hull]

dude.

come on

[cinder anchor]

u cant knockdown rex ig

[limber hull]

yes

you can't knock down rex

[cinder anchor]

then wdym

[limber hull]

i dont understand the point of confusion??

[pliant elm]

Rex needs to fly

[limber hull]

• trike's thrash is extremely easy to punish and difficult to land against a creature that isn't knocked down
• trike's thrash is the only thing in its kit that does insanely high damage, everything else is around rex level
• trike cannot knock down rex

i cannot make it clearer

[cinder anchor]

arent they gonan buff the apexes sooner or later anyway?

because shant, cama, giga, spino,

[cyan flame]

Yes but deino in the game isn't designed to be an apex hunter, but rather a midtier hunter, and slightly above if the target is swimming.

[cinder anchor]

fr?

where was this said

[limber hull]

why would they buff the apexes?

the apexes are plenty strong as is

[cyan flame]

True, you could make them distinct enough, like trike and dibble. Still, I don't think they want ptera doing that, at least not until they've tried the whole more grounded approach (which does make sense too, and we've seen how iffy it is when ptera can peck things that can't really fight back)

[pliant elm]

It seems that This guy wants to play Rex and kill everyone without even knowing how to play

[cinder anchor]

nah

more so that why does trike do 6k but rex only 1k?

[pliant elm]

Rex can fracture and Pin

That's why

[cyan flame]

To be fair, even normal thrash does a lot of damage, does it not? Like 4K or so?

[limber hull]

because trike's 6k is extremely circumstantial and rex has fracture/pin/murdersprint/generally higher speed/better trot/better agility

[cyan flame]

Why would they?

[limber hull]

true, yes, but good luck landing that on any competent rex

[cyan flame]

Well, more or less, if you look at the lunge weights, and the other stats, plus that whole if there were a tug of war, stego would win over deino. I don't think deino is really designed to fight other apexes (and its not an apex itself, it's like stego, kind of sort of, but not really an apex)

[cinder anchor]

why did they buff deino as of currently then?

if its a midtier hunter

[cyan flame]

Oh yeah, it's still an iffy attack, but if you do land it, that is decent damage, even on a rex. Of course, landing two of them on a rex + whatever else to finish it off, is not very likely to happen.

[cyan flame]

Buff how so? Deino did get a buff to what it can lunge that is swimming, but aside from that?

@cinder anchorConsidering how much people complained about stego being powerful, and now trike, do we really need rex to be even more powerful too?

[cinder anchor]

more so the elder

[limber hull]

exactly

you're far more likely to land enough crushes to fracture a trike, which immediately removes its ability to spar and sprint, heavily shifting the matchup in your favour

to me, I feel it's dishonest to just focus on nothing but raw damage output, given how much rex can do in these fights

[cyan flame]

Cause most critters get a powerful elder? I wouldn't consider that a buff when the others also have very powerful elders

[cyan flame]

It is, it's the same with how people only looked at stego dps and ignored everything else

The thrash is powerful, but it's a rather locked attack

[cinder anchor]

it used to be 11+ tons tho

now its 13.5

[pliant elm]

But Deino Elder is powerful. Frail weighs 9 tons and Prime 13.5 tons. I don't understand the complaint

[cyan flame]

So they upped elder from 11 to 13? Maybe they wanted to hit a certain threshold then. But I'm pretty sure elder deino does not grab elder rex or elder trike, or even elder stego from land (but it can now grab elder stego when swimming)

[cinder anchor]

im not complaining its more confusing

[cyan flame]

There's not complaint, the question was if the added weight from 11 to 13 was a buff. I wouldn't really say so, it seems more like they buffed stego, then went "but elder deino should grab elder stego, up the weight a bit"

[cinder anchor]

exactly

ngl i feel like the elder should be like 10 tons

if its a midtier hunter

[limber hull]

the point is the elder never stops growing

deino in general is supposed to never stop growing till it hits 100%

it's the only animal in the game with this unique trait

the frail prime is actually bigger than the peak prime

no other animal is like this

[cinder anchor]

how heavy?

[limber hull]

its also one of the only animal that keeps growing even if it doesn't get prime, albeit less so

[cinder anchor]

wasnt taht changed tho since midtier hunter apparently

[limber hull]

you're hyperfixating on random terms and labels

[cyan flame]

One does not neccesarily exlude the other. And you're yes, focusing overly much on that

My entire point there was that deino isn't designed to "fight" another apex, or even really hunt it

[limber hull]

deino's hunting range is "whatever is small enough to grab", and that scales with whatever weight it ends up being

[cyan flame]

Pretty much, which tends to mean things smaller than you, since the weight is 50%-75% of your own

Hence the "mid tier" hunter, in the sense that you can't grab your own size critters, and so you're not really meant to mess with them

[limber hull]

yes, a 100% prime deino can now grab an adult stego off the land, but it still has to wait for a prime stego, adult rex or adult trike to swim before it can grab them

and it stll can't grab prime elder trikes and rexes

[cinder anchor]

can a prime elder deino facetank a rex?

[limber hull]

ehhhh probably not

[cyan flame]

Maybe a normal adult, but not a prime one I don't think

[limber hull]

it does much less damage all things considered

[cyan flame]

What does prime deino do in damage?

[limber hull]

also if you're playing a rex and the only way you can think of fighting a 13 ton gator is by standing in front of it and tapping LMB idk what to tell you

[cyan flame]

Yeah, that, I imagine you can apply crush as well on a deino? Or does that not work?

[limber hull]

550 when at 100%

It does more at its peak, but has less weight

[cyan flame]

I think you can win, but it'd be a close fight, and it'd be if rex only uses normal bite, and doesn't ... well, do anything else

As in, just stands there, instead of trying to move around or otherwise actually win the fight

[limber hull]

rex is also typically not exactly designed to punch up in weightclass

that's more giga's forte

[tight dove]

Right now it's a small mid tiers one shotter and a big mid tiers victim. Doesn't make sense

[limber hull]

its a gator, it makes perfect sense lmao, that's how gators hunt

[tight dove]

Rex and trike are a thing, but stego is not even considerable an apex in this game

It was an apex in his time, but compared to rexes is not that big of a monster

[cinder anchor]

stego is frail tho 🤓

[cyan flame]

Nor is deino, really. They're more or less the same, kind of apex, but not really. Powerful, but still yield to the actual apexes

[tight dove]

In what universe? Gators don't magically pass from being able to move around at full speed with a prey in their mounth to being unable to do anything because of a 1kg of difference ahahah

[cyan flame]

Well, it's how they want deino to work, at least for now

Spino would be the more proper apex around water

[normal shuttle]

Imagine giga getting percentage based bleed damage maybe on an ability or botrk in some way (doing that on purpose because you don’t know what that item is)

[limber hull]

i do not know what the hell you are talking about this is true

[tight dove]

And in fact I never said it should be able to compete with an adult T-Rex. You said it's similar to a Stegosaurus, an apex not a proper apex, but while the Stegosaurus is able to assert itself, the Deinos are purely victims.

[cinder anchor]

thats acro btw

acro is shown choking a cama

while giga relies on bleed

[cyan flame]

How are deinos victims?

I would argue if we're looking at the roster, deino is safer overall than stego. Granted, deino suffers from other issue and have a rougher life in general, but victim?

[tight dove]

In an apex confrontation

[cyan flame]

And stegos aren't? Stego folds to trike, and more often than not to rex as well, just as easily. And it has a harder time avoiding them than deino at that

[cinder anchor]

and numbers

[normal shuttle]

Basically, in league there is an object that you can buy for physical damages oriented champions, which makes it so that your attacks deal a bonus damage based on the current health of a target, meaning that you deal your highest damage to not highly armored, high hp, non terribly wounded characters

[cinder anchor]

giga is meant for packs

[limber hull]

im not at all a fan of how acro seems to be designed in this game, i think its design is going to be exceptionally unhealthy unless it has insane pre-requisites

nothing should rely on solo killing animals well above its weight class as a consistent hunting strategy

[cinder anchor]

while rex and acro are meant for tackleing big game alone

[cyan flame]

I don't think it'll even come in packs, pairs, maybe a trio at most

[tight dove]

They are weaker as it's supposed to be, but it's not one sided, a group of stegos can kill a rex or a trike

[cyan flame]

As for acro, we don't really know how that'll work, but maybe it'll be more of a big game hunter than rex

[tight dove]

while 2 fg deinos will get smashed by 1 stego even if he just facetank

[cyan flame]

Because they have less of a reliable way of just... not engaging

[limber hull]

rex has always been depicted as a punch-down, bully creature that crushes and kills any smaller creature unfortunate enough to end up in its jaws

it likely won't be tussling with sauropods or shants

[normal shuttle]

Herrera is the outlier I believe

And maybe troodon to an extent

But yes I totally agree with you

Acro seems like it’s gonna be hell to program and/or very unfun to go against if it can just go and start choking things 50% heavier than itself

[cinder anchor]

it should tho

[normal shuttle]

It better have some other abilities and leave that as a punch up execute imo

[normal shuttle]

Why?

[cinder anchor]

because why shouldnt it?

[normal shuttle]

Shant is like twice the size of Rex

[limber hull]

herrera is firstly, 175kg, meaning it cannot do much against anything above like, cera size

secondly, it requires a good ambush to make that happen, being spotted = death or failed hunt

acro is a heavy brawler type creature shown to be somehow capable of outbrawling a creature literally twice its own size

also troodon's punchup requires significant work and skill to not get one-tapped nuked, it doesn't just grab the neck and kill whatever it wants dead

[cyan flame]

What if it was dependent on acro vs target stamina or something, to engage in the choke?

[cinder anchor]

and that makes you think giga is gonan stand a chance? while it got wrecked in the concept art

[normal shuttle]

Because herbivores are allowed to be competent, especially when they are (probably going to be) +15h growth long titans that are only surpassed in magnitude by strains and brachi

[tight dove]

Yes, because right now there are no Apex creatures capable of going underwater, but in the future, the deinos will have to deal with spinosaurs. If the idea remains "you can one-shot any creature below this threshold but you can't do anything above it," they won't be very satisfying fights.

[cyan flame]

Because it uses bleed, so it can get a hit or two in and then let the shant grow weaker, whereas rex is more direct confrontation, and might struggle more

[normal shuttle]

Where did it get wrecked?

[cyan flame]

Yep, and vs spino deino is meant to just swim away

[limber hull]

deino isn't a fighter, idk if you noticed this, it thrives on the "one hit, death" playstyle

[cyan flame]

Otherwise, I quite agree with you. Current deino isn't that fun, and I do like your idea overall

[cinder anchor]

in rex's concept art and then gets stomped by shant lmao

[limber hull]

well, giga obviously isn't going to be a better brawler than rex and likely will have a disadvantage in that confrontation, but it also will likely be better against shant

also i dont think shant ever fought giga in its concept art

just checked, shant literally never fights giga

oh wait, yes it does

a solo one, tho

which obviously wouldn't end well for any apex

[tight dove]

Yes, and what I'm saying is that it shouldn't be that extreme. Crocodiles drag their prey into the water; even small prey has a chance of escaping (quite a high one), and they don't go from having zero chance of survival to being completely immune from it from one kilogram to another. And in reality, grabbing a limb or a head and starting to spin is one of the most characteristic characteristics of crocodiles. In the current model, spinosaurs would go from being grabbed and killed without difficulty to slaughtering deinos in the space of a 1 kg step.

[cinder anchor]

also ngl rex should be able to pin things with an ambush and potentially 1 shot it

[limber hull]

it can lol

[cinder anchor]

only if not seen tho

[limber hull]

thats its prime hunting style

[cyan flame]

Yes, thats what ambush generally means, attacking before your target can see and react

[limber hull]

rex pins and can instantly kill unaware creatures, basically does this to the entire roster besides maybe trike and stego, but stego is screwed regardless if it gets ambushed

[normal shuttle]

rex and herrera being peak design ambushers when grown while most of the carni roster is a dumpster fire of either underwhelming or unfun playables is kinda funny to me

luckily they are my favs

[limber hull]

id like rex more if the murdersprint wasn't so obnoxious as an ability but yea

murdersprint, at least to me, undermines the ambush a lot

[normal shuttle]

that's an alberto bro

[limber hull]

especially since you can screw up an ambush on a dibble, go "nah" and then start moving faster than it

and sub rex just obliterates allos due to the speed and weight advantage

[normal shuttle]

alberto defo is getting stomped into the dirt

however rex shouldnt have it easy either

[limber hull]

giga gets tackled, which goes to show that in a direct 1v1 brawl, rex likely won't be taking it

giga would be able to get in and out and let the bleed do most of the work

especially in duos

which will likely be giga's preferred hunting style

[normal shuttle]

yeah I agree giga could maybe manage to take on those if it does get a good kit to simply tear through large healthbars or blood pools

(like percentages, I see it coming)

or maybe just world shattering bleed idk lol

[normal shuttle]

tbf what is even an elder deino trying to do against an adult spino under most conditions

[tight dove]

There are not only fg, deinos and spinos will have to coexist in all %, and it would be quite ridiculous to have clashes that go from being one-sided to being one-sided on the other side within 1% of growth

[cyan flame]

Well, obviously small spinos would be a meal for larger deinos, just like how small deinos are

[cinder anchor]

still gets pinned by shant then

[normal shuttle]

sounds very fitting

[tight dove]

Yeah, there aren't only fg in this game

[normal shuttle]

neither rex nor giga should be trying to trade with an adult or elder shant for free

[cinder anchor]

rex being the brawler it is kinda should

giga can go for cama

[tight dove]

Yes but it makes no sense if the clashes are one-sided in one way or another and the transition is 1% growth

[cinder anchor]

but it is a hadrosaur afterall ngl and what did T. rex eat? yeah hadrosaurs not just triceratops was on the menu

[normal shuttle]

nah bro

[limber hull]

Giga is going after shant and cama

Rex goes after the smaller guys because it’s an ambush bully

[normal shuttle]

16-18t shant is not something that rex should be brawling, period

[cinder anchor]

u wnat shant to be untoucable?

nothing should be able to hunt shant ig

[limber hull]

Dude. Giga is still right there lmao

[cinder anchor]

it got pinned tho

dead meat

[normal shuttle]

edmontosaurus wasn't +15 tons, and also players are handling the dinosaurs, meaning that they won't be running away and refusing to fight some rawry beast

[limber hull]

No? It got knocked down, and Rex would too

[cinder anchor]

me when acro is just better than giga

[limber hull]

Me when acro is just awfully designed in its concept art lmao

[cinder anchor]

nah not really

[limber hull]

Yes really lmao

[normal shuttle]

in a 1v1, shant, spino, cama, (likely) trike and anky pretty much should have the upper hand with basically any other playable

Doesn't mean untouchable, just like 2-3 carnos can mess with a maia but 1 is having a hard time

And as said, giga has a better kit. Doesn't mean it should use it freely to trade and disengage, but it must be better at this than rex

[limber hull]

It looks like the most anti fun creature, taking inspiration from everything people don’t like to go against

[cyan flame]

I kind of agree, but that's how it works with pin/pounce as well. If you're above the weight, it's pounce, not pin, even if it's just a tiny kg. At least I think so, unless things have been changed?

[tight dove]

Both rex and giga will just ignore the herbivores and kill each other

[normal shuttle]

So engaging and fun to be grabbed and die from one move

[cinder anchor]

spino once it gets crushed

[limber hull]

Good for them lol

[normal shuttle]

(unless of course acro turns out to be te goat and actually has huge prerequisites and other abilities for the rest of the combat)

[limber hull]

Unlikely, spino is both bigger than Rex and a better brawler

[cyan flame]

Stamina requirement, maybe. Need higher stam than the target, and has to bait the target to waste enough stamina, otherwise choke won't work?

[cyan flame]

Unless they don't get each other as diet

[compact sequoia]

https://tenor.com/view/spinosaurus-killing-t-rex-jurassic-park-3-gif-12356895238206207825

[tight dove]

Is the isle spino going to be jurassic park spino?

[normal shuttle]

spino is 100% larger than trike. You're gonna need more than one crush

In fact, I'm just an internet idiot with no real inner knowledge, but comparing the most recent spino model shown, that thing is already about as big if not bigger than prime elder rex

Easily +11t if they really want to go tank with it

[limber hull]

Effectively

[cyan flame]

Yep

[tight dove]

That never stopped fight

[normal shuttle]

yes, more aquatic but yes

[cyan flame]

True, but it's less food and diets, so maybe not as good of an option then

[compact sequoia]

i wonder how am i going to hide the huge sail ..... so easily spotable

[limber hull]

You won’t. Spino is not going to be ambush focused like Rex or deino are

[normal shuttle]

maybe just keep it as an execute imo

Like give it other abilities to wear things down and then get this as a grapple you can do alone to finish the job

Or maybe, taking inspiration from your idea, maybe acro could be about dealing stamina damage besides health and bleed to punish people who waste their stam very harshly with this solo grapple?

[compact sequoia]

So how's it going to hunt ?

[normal shuttle]

(and fish)

[limber hull]

Likely? It won’t be a good hunter. But an insanely powerful bully that can take food from basically anyone it wants

And it can eat fish

[normal shuttle]

and the best part: kicking deinos out of south river

[compact sequoia]

hmm interesting, what about rex vs spino

[normal shuttle]

spino sided 100%

[limber hull]

I genuinely think, based on dev comments, spino takes the win

[tight dove]

Yeah but if a creature becomes too big to be pinned by an omni it doesn't automatically become unbeatable for him and at the moment deinos work like that. And btw that is also dumb, they really need to change the pin mechanic a bit. For omni it was acceptable because it's a small dino, with allo is just dumb

[limber hull]

Lots of people seem to have problem with it but it seems to be the outcome the devs want

[tight dove]

Isn't spino supposed to be better in water and rex better on land?

Doesn't make much sense if spino is just better in both scenario

[compact sequoia]

i am happy, but i fear it doesn't get treated like deino.....once a good in spiro now a fish eater in general

[cyan flame]

I was thinking it would be interesting if acro had to somehow "overcome" something, like stamina vs the opponent for the choke to work. So you'd have to utilize baits/other things to wear the target out in a sense, and then finish it off. Which would make you good vs triggerhappy targets, but also more limited if the opponent is very careful. But yeah, haven't really thought it through a lot, so you're more than welcome to improve upon it. I just figured it would be better than deino/rex outright attack where it's just "do the attack and you're good to go", with little work put in before.

[compact sequoia]

it would mean really op, so they have to compensate by low speed if this happens

[tight dove]

Realistically it should get brutalized by a rex, but to make the game decently balanced it seems like the best solution to me

[normal shuttle]

regardless of whether they're swimming or not, spino is a spino, and rex is a rex

If rex doesn't want to quietly get sliced up by something in a swamp, it shouldn't go for a swim or mess with the sail backed kaiju larger than itself and capable of flipping ankys

If spino doesn't want to be hopelessly chipped away at its health by other animals like allo, giga or rex; and also wants to eat, it should not be taking long walks away from deep bodies of water

[cyan flame]

I'm kind of hoping they go for a, spino can defend itself really well, but not neccesarily great at going on the offense. So it's like, you can grab a rex by the jaws, but it's still a rex you're now holding on to, so you do need some more to it.

[normal shuttle]

20kph spino would go hard

[limber hull]

I agree, I think spino should have one of the worst speeds of any carnivore, in both land and water

[compact sequoia]

i am excited for what the deva cook and when it comes to ht ....damnn the joy

[normal shuttle]

long time no see

[cinder anchor]

fr

[normal shuttle]

spino simply cannot hunt or thrive in land

it will be okay

maybe even give some terrible land alt attack speed and turn speed to spino so it really needs water to fight other apexes comfortably

[tight dove]

What's the probable weight the spino will have in the game? And the bite force?

[cyan flame]

You know, you could maybe give spino the teno kangaroo niche I think you've wanted? Terrible on land and in attack, but god help you if you try to take it on where the water is deep enough for it to pull that on you

[hollow vine]

someone is suggesting stego is useless against rex lmao all those rexes that die to stegos would say otherwise

[limber hull]

(All the Rexes that die to stegos are not that great tbh)

You have basically every possible advantage as the Rex

[cyan flame]

I'm pretty sure rex has the clear advantage over stego in the matchup currently, so maybe those rexes aren't that good, or it's prime stego vs normal rex perhaps, in which case the stego does do well

[pliant elm]

Well, Stego is. Stego can't run away and can't fight a Rex

[hollow vine]

if we gonna compare primes then id argue trike is much worse of compared to stego

[cyan flame]

Prime trike is worse tha prime stego?

[pliant elm]

Any Rex that manages to die to a Stego is terrible at the game

[hollow vine]

trike is the slowest plaayable atm and its high damage output trash is only really viable if the target is knocked down .. spoiler alert u aint knocking down a prime rex as prime trike

[hollow vine]

that powerswing aint for display a headshot will stun the rex and lets u follow up with at least 2 more wich will be more then enough to either kill the rex or nearly kill it

the stegos i see that die to rexes die cause of 1 reason, they let the rex bait their first powerswing the rex dodges this of course and then hits the stego making it fall to the ground \

[normal shuttle]

Weight I’m guessing 11-13 tons for the adult

Based on the scale, lemme find the conparison meter by meter

With prime elder rex (which is 12 tons)

[hollow vine]

11-13 ? hell no thank you.

[tight dove]

I can't wait to use them on a PvP server so I can get a more objective idea. I've slaughtered stegosauruses without any difficulty, but 90% of stego players sucks. I can't say what a good player is capable of.

[normal shuttle]

Fg spino and prime elder rex

[pliant elm]

Stego cant stun Rex

[hollow vine]

headshot doesnt stun ?

[normal shuttle]

They’re pretty much the same size with spino being larger

[pliant elm]

Adult vs adult

[pliant elm]

No

[cyan flame]

Do you stun an adult rex as adult stego on headshot with the powerswing? Only on headshot?

[hollow vine]

ive seen plenty of stegs powerswing headshots on rex and stunning the rex

[tight dove]

I thought he was going to do a mix between real spino and jurassic park, but apparently they want to go for sci-fi lol

[cyan flame]

It would be nice with some official deathmatch sandbox server to test things

[normal shuttle]

Cant wait for the dopamine burst that is gonna give me to see spino elder weight

[pliant elm]

Prime Stego can stun up to 11.5 tons, but Adult Stego can only stun up to 6 tons

[cyan flame]

Might be prime stego vs normal rex, at that point you stun, due to stego being almost as large as an adult rex is at that point

[normal shuttle]

Please make it +15 or 16

[cyan flame]

So you stun normal adult but not prime rex then

[tight dove]

Yeah that's the best way to test fight, i don't understand why they don't make one

[cyan flame]

Probably because they don't want us testing things all that much

[hollow vine]

if thats the case then they would need to change it, its the same with trike full grown ( not prime ) triker can flip a full grown rex but a full prime trike cant flip a full prime rex

[limber hull]

There’s no unique stun modifier for headshots on any animal, never has been

[tight dove]

Did they enhance the bleeding that omnis do?

[cinder anchor]

great comparison, anyway how heavy is omni?

adult

[normal shuttle]

Like about 400? Haven’t played it in HT but I know it for a weight reduction

[cyan flame]

So noted

[cinder anchor]

really?

[limber hull]

I think adult stego can stun up to 9 tons, just short of actually stunning Rex

[normal shuttle]

Im not too sure

I am mostly hanging around the live branch

[cyan flame]

I think I've seen 395 kg, could be wrong though

[normal shuttle]

Cuz HT servers are always full

[tight dove]

450

[limber hull]

Pretty sure that’s it, yea

[limber hull]

Not in HT, it got reduced

[tight dove]

Noooo my boy

What about prime?

[desert arch]

660kg, it got buffed

[limber hull]

Increased to like over 600kg

[tight dove]

nicee

[normal shuttle]

Crazy

Pinning pachy?

[tight dove]

speed and bleed are also higher right?

[normal shuttle]

Btw how fat is elder pachy

[tight dove]

speed for the 100% prime

[limber hull]

Adult pachy is now 700kg

Elder Pachy is over 900kg

[normal shuttle]

https://tenor.com/view/pogchamp-pog-pogey-poggers-twitch-gif-14340727

Das crazy

They actually buffed pachy

It can knock over (almost?) adult carnos and ceras now. Absolute cinema

[tight dove]

And obv the headbutt is still bugged af

[limber hull]

It can. It’s hysterical

[normal shuttle]

But yeah buff pachy anyway

I must try it now

I need to bully them

Welcome back U4 pachy

[limber hull]

Pachy actually has one of the best growths in the game now, since sub pachy now has the weight of old adult pachy plus the speed of sub pachy

You are both bigger and faster than an adult omni. Their reaper, if you will

[tight dove]

I can accept that, but i can't accept how i get hit when i go to bite their head even if they landed 2 hours before

[normal shuttle]

Sounds like a good buff since 85% pachy being pinned by adult omnis was terrible

[normal shuttle]

Pachy is using projections, afterimages of its kinetic force

[tight dove]

Even faster? damn

[limber hull]

Juvi pachy survives safely and capably in sanctuaries
Sub pachy has insane speed, stam and a high enough weight to tussle with raptors without instapin
Adult pachy is both beefy and quick enough to survive most threats
Prime elder pachy is a legitimate menace that revels in the joy of toppling unaware carnos and ceras

It has one of the most fun grows in the game now, and probably the best of any herbivore tbh

At no point is it just terrible and hyper vulnerable for no reason

[normal shuttle]

I must try it because, alongside maia (which got totally butchered in the early game), pachy is my most played herbivore, mainly for trolling potential

[tight dove]

And they even reduced the time it need to get up after an headbutt

[normal shuttle]

That sounds pretty good on paper since pachy early game was already goated but fell off so hard after you had to get out of sanctuaries

[limber hull]

Oh really? Goddamn this really is its patch, they even got rid of the speed mutations that were making its life hell

[tight dove]

It's goated even in the main branch, headbutting stuff is just too much fun

[normal shuttle]

We just need type H pachy now

With a giant bladed horn on the dome to apply bleed

[limber hull]

nah, mainbranch pachy is one of the worst animals in the game

Fun? Yea. Not good tho

[normal shuttle]

Only early game

Because sure, you can ambush lone omnis, dilos or sub carnos, but you are terrible at defending yourself as a pachy.

It is very bad compared to other herbivores in terms of keeping oneself alive

Only playables I consider worse than pachy are deino (impossible to surpass) and ptera

Dilo is worthless to an extent too

Dilo is the Schrödinger’s Piece of Trash of the isle

Sometimes it destroys everyone with minimal effort

Sometimes rng makes you the worst carnivore ever that can even be effortlessly soloed by troodons

(Troodon’s best matchup is easily that one besides ptera and hypsi)

[tight dove]

Before hitting fg quite painfull, but as a fg... omnis are not too much of a problem (if you are not fighting a pack alone), you can run away from ceras and with carnos i always loved the "try to break the leg before you die"

[limber hull]

yea but you can't run from ceras if they take the speed mutation and you don't, which only adds to how bad the animal is

[normal shuttle]

One pounce and you’re done because no sprint and barely trotting

[tight dove]

And it's op in a mixherd, one hit and any carni is done for

[normal shuttle]

And cannot effectively deal with carnos

Also one body break to a dilo and if gets to bite you, you’re dead

[tight dove]

Always take speed mutation on officials, and you know... the best choice is always to just not play on officials ahahah

[normal shuttle]

Nah officials are good

[limber hull]

i always play on officials because i like good ping lmao (and i think most server owners are pretentious as hell)

[normal shuttle]

Great ping

And also no dumb rules like most populated unofficials

[tight dove]

Yeah and one hit on them and they are done for because of the bone break... While you can just use trees or water to knock them off

[tight dove]

But you can knock them down

[normal shuttle]

If you get the body break instead of leg and get bitten once, you’re cooked on a coinflip

[tight dove]

And dilos have a quite terrible agility, is not easy to miss

[normal shuttle]

Trees only if you’re right next to them already, otherwise you’re dying to damage pounce because haha fun speed reduction

I don’t like how much of a coinflip pachy is at times in the live branch

[tight dove]

Yeah if they ambush you in the open that's quite right

I don't think it was weak at all, in a 1vs1 i would prefer to be the pachy then the omni or dilo

[normal shuttle]

It’s also cringe imo how you can’t hold the charge forever like how cerato can

[normal shuttle]

Only because the other two are more buggy

[tight dove]

Running around in the charge pose would be quite fun

[tight dove]

Pachy is even buggier, but it's the only one with bugs that are good for him ahahahah

Bro's head has thorns 5 enchantment, if you bite it you'll get magically knocked over

[limber hull]

#general-feedback message

headshot dependent stuns aren’t a thing in this game and honestly shouldn’t be, just let power swing stun Rex in general

Also adult trike cannot flip adult Rex atm

Also also you cannot heal leg fractures at all while standing, that’s just a little gimmick it has

[tight dove]

Am I the only one who thinks the T-Rex pin attack should only work during an ambush?

[limber hull]

How would that work?

[tight dove]

Just make it an ambush speed dependent attack

And stop the t-rex's extra speed if the attack misses

[limber hull]

I mean, it can just activate that speed mid fight

Although I do like the idea of using an attack stopping the murder sprint

[tight dove]

Sure, but it's still going to be able to use it only once

[tight dove]

You could also change that, maybe include a cooldown from the last bite to use sprint

So you can't use it if you bit more than 20 seconds ago

I would do the same for the Allosaurus honestly, having a 3.9 ton beast able to pin stuff is not fun at all

[limber hull]

I’d make it that you can only activate murdersprint if you’re at full stamina, encouraging you to use it only from a position of ambush

[tight dove]

Yeah that's a great idea

[limber hull]

Then I’d remove the cooldown on it, since it had a different pre-requisite of needing full stamina, removing the need for an artificial cooldown

Easier for the Rex to use and track, same as the prey

[tight dove]

Yeah, rn the t-rex has so many cool attacks but they are completely useless because the pin is just too op

Same for allo

[south cedar]

yeah frik pinslop!!

[tight dove]

Idk how fight with trikes would go without the pin spam, they wold probably have to balance some stuff, but it's definitely better then what we have now

[tight dove]

Post a feedback about it, i can't since i posted one an hour ago

[limber hull]

I did a while ago

[mental mountain]

Doesn't it like not take more stamina than the regular sprint? What's the point of the regular then?

[limber hull]

In my experience it doesn’t take any more stam

It literally is just faster move speed on a set duration and cooldown

The only point of regular sprinting is that you’re on cooldown for murdersprint

[mental mountain]

Maybe they could slightly increase regular sprints length and then slightly decrease murder sprint length and then have you only use it at 100% stam?

Like a 5 second increase on the regular and a 5 second decrease on the ambush

Difference of 10 seconds is pretty big

[limber hull]

idk anymore

if it were me i'd remove the arbitrary speed boost ability and do something else lol, rather than consider the balance nightmare of alternating speeds

#general-feedback message

@sudden tapir wasn't update 3 utah significantly worse when it came to pins, since it could pin up to 200% of its own weight? I recall it pinning 1000 kilo carnos

[sudden tapir]

iirc it was only 1.5x and I was more referring to latching and missed pounce punishment. I hated it back in the day but the penalty added a lot to the pounce dynamics, and pounce itself wasn't so overwhelmingly powerful that biting and alt attacks were made irrelevant.

[limber hull]

True, I do think the lack of miss animations on most animals really does lead them to just overusing these moves (allo is especially bad with its free speed boost)

[hollow vine]

not agreed on the stego part since tbf a stego shouldnt have any issues hitting a rex anywhere on the body so rexes wont be able to win anymore just let them stun from headshots. didnt know trike cant flip rex anymore thats ... dumb lets make it fair and disable the fracturing from crush in rex vs trike then. you cant heal leg fractures while standing ? thats ridiculuos i dont see the point in that except ruin trike gameplay. go back to legacy fracture system.

[limber hull]

Yea but still, headshot dependent stuns aren’t really a thing

That’s not a mechanic the game has

[hollow vine]

then it should be added. cant be harder then having locational damage can it

[limber hull]

Would really mess with certain matchups tbh

Personally I’d rather stego power swing not cost insane amount of stam

It’s an absurd overbalance that doesn’t need to exist

[hollow vine]

powerswing does insane damage and can be spammed so fast not having a big stam drain will make stego broken

[hollow vine]

wat matchups would be messed up ?

[limber hull]

Trike does more than three times the damage of a power swing for no stamina. Rex does fracture, pin and high damage for 4% stamina

I’ll be real, nothing in this game should cost that much stamina

10% is insane enough, but 15% is absolutely absurd

[hollow vine]

the only attack from trike that does more damage then powerswing is its trash wich comes at equal downsides, stationary for far longer then stego with powerswing very very slow attack speed by the time trike trashes once stego powerswings 3 times so the damage difference is easily nullified

[limber hull]

Yes and stego melts through a colossal amount of its own stam to not even deal the same damage as the thrash, so I fail to see your point

I don’t think anything deserves to have stamina as bad as stego. The only real reason people accept it is tactile endurance exists and carries stego. If tact didn’t exist, stego would be completely outclassed by everything else

[hollow vine]

it does do the same damage as trash at least 3 powerswings do

[hollow vine]

stego actually has more stam then u think, also powerswing isnt necesary against anything except rex and maybe allo the rest of the roster you can alt attack wich costs way less

[old idol]

@quartz meteor This isnt a bad suggestion but whats stopping mix packers from just haveing a male and female maia friend to pump out eggs

[hollow vine]

ure expecting a 6ton dino to be as good/ strong as a 9.5 ton dino.

[limber hull]

Yes. Because it’s not faster, so it needs to be able to defend itself

Just because something is heavier doesn’t mean the smaller thing should roll over and die

I play troodon yet I have the tools to not get instantly killed without counterplay by most of the roster

It’s also rather annoying that the stego has such poor stam on the move meant to defend it from Rex and allo, two creatures that can pin you easily if you have low stam

Feels counterintuitive

[hollow vine]

stego while having a high stam consumption on its powerswing ( its able to powerswing about 8 times or so with a full stam bar u only really need 2 to kill an allo. the total amount of stam on stego is much higher then the total amount of stam on trike wich also shows how bad it would be if trike actually consumed stam on its attacks

trike flip attack - stationary ( it did get improved as now it isnt stationary nearly as long as before) trash attack also stationary very easily dodgable by rexes similar to your weight since trike is not able to flip rexes near its own weight anymore

[hollow vine]

i see plenty of stegos demolishing rexes

[limber hull]

I genuinely don’t think those Rexes are any good at all at using their kit

They assume basic crush spam will win the game, it won’t

[hollow vine]

i do see rexes demolishing stegos as well but there are plenty of bad stego players out there to

[hollow vine]

bait the powerswing run in either crush and then knock it over and crush again or knock it over first and then crush etcx

problem with stego players is they are easily baited into using powerswing

[limber hull]

Yea, and they get nuked because unless you’re a hyper competent stego with meta mutations, you’re dead

[hollow vine]

i mean meta mutations everyone uses those lol stego is not the strongest in the roster true but it sure is capable of beating rexes.

both stego and trike are also fairly reliant on its surroundings

stego is able to run for twice as long as a trike + its alot faster then trike as well

[cyan flame]

Couldn't you up the stun threshold on the running swing, let that one stun adult/prime, and so a good, and brave, stego can do the whole run at the rex, or possibly even trike, stun and either retreat immediately, or try for a few extra hits, if it's positioned good (since you turn with the attack and all). Rex and similar could be fought off, and while you could smack a trike, it's not really going to do much due to the frill (and even less if the trike "parries" with a block, which could also negate the stun maybe).

[hollow vine]

powerswing on a trikes head should not be stunning it regardless if its blocking or not

[cyan flame]

I would honestly like it if they upped stego to 8T, gave it full trike/rex growth time, and there we go.

[hollow vine]

id like some more speed on trike but yea :p

if you are stego and u play with ure environment properly eg putting your face on a cliff you should be winning against rex most of the times Just dont get instant baited

[cyan flame]

Maybe not, I just think it's fine if stego can fight back, since it still is at a massive disadvantage vs trike, and rex as well overall. Or at least so people say. You're one of the few saying stegos can just handle rexes fine as it is honestly.

[limber hull]

I’d prefer just reducing the stam rather than encouraging stegos to make kamikaze charges at their foe, only to waste the stam they could’ve used for smarter combat or escape

[cyan flame]

But at the very least stegos running swing could stun rexes, and that'd make it a bit more interesting

[limber hull]

To me, making current running power swing stun encourages the exact opposite playstyle of what stego should be doing

[cyan flame]

Oh sure, I'd be fine with removing the running swing, I do not like it at all, but we're stuck with it for now, so I guess making it be slightly more useful and encouraged for the risky fight vs rex would be fine

[cyan flame]

It does, but you kind of need to run at the target to use the running swing, and what else to run at and actually hit, if not large targets

[hollow vine]

stego should not be fighting trikes period trike is this strong because at the same time its also this slow unable to catch anything in the game u see a stego well that stego is walking away without a care in the world and nothing a trike can do. suggesting stego should be able to fight with a trike makes no sense since trike is not a danger to you why should you be a danger to a trike, trike wont be able to outrun you so you being able to put up a fight is bad balancing

( stego can actually fight trike atm since even if trike knocks you down stego apparently can instant get up before trike has a chance to press the trash button 😛

[cyan flame]

Sure, stego can run, I just think it'd be more fun if they could fight somewhat. Nothing more to it, I don't think it's unreasonable that a full power stego could fight a trike, or at least put up something of a fight before walking away. But even if a trike can't run, trike can defend itself so well that it's pretty much impossible to win the fight anyway. Though if you were to power up stego, it should probably be about the same speed as trike, or just the tiniest bit faster, so trike can punish if the stego first tries to fight and then run.

[limber hull]

If anything, I’d reduce its ability to stun, reduce its stamcost and heavily increase its bleed output

As we’ve seen, bleed can be significantly scary to animals like Rex and allo, and with the poor stam of Rex, would leave it very vulnerable

[cyan flame]

Internal bleeding mechanic maybe, could be interesting

[limber hull]

They’re thagomizers. They hit deep, and should cause crazy bleed

[cyan flame]

Problem is that bleed is rarely good for defense

[hollow vine]

even if you buff the stego stego wont be beating trikes anyway 2 totally different dinosaurs 1 attacks with its tail the other with its head so if you are playing stego and im trike and im to lazy to fight you i just need to not go to you since you need to face me with ure tail in order to attack me

[cyan flame]

But sure, remove stun, add internal bleeding mechanic instead, where bleed has a worse effect than currently. Could apply something similar to wounded perhaps.

[cyan flame]

Which is why I'm not concerned with buffing stego, trike would still have a very clear advantage and it'd always be better for the stego to just leave the trike be.

[hollow vine]

then im gonna ask for the same for trike lol

[hollow vine]

even then buffing stego could very possibly ruin the whole balance even more allo would need alot more to even possibly kill a stego

and just increasing its weight propably wont be enough for many so you would also like a damage increase so instead of allo dying in 2 powerswings it will die in 1 just like anything else on the roster except rex

meaning stegos natural predator allo is useless against stego

[cyan flame]

It wouldn't really make it much worse than going after a rex or trike I don't think, at least not if you also adjust damage values to be lower and such. It shouldn't really be just a buff, more so putting stego in line with trike and rex as apex proper really.

[hollow vine]

stego could however use a reduction in its fallen state ( rex knocking you over) currently i think it takes to long for stego to recover from it

[hollow vine]

but if you nerf the damage now all of a sudden cera is able to survive a powerswing so would become harder to kil even tho you have more hp

i do think there is alot of things going into balancing each playable

[cyan flame]

Are we going for allo being a match for stego 1v1? Do you know how the devs see that?

[hollow vine]

nope allo should not 1v1 steg

that should be a group effort

[cyan flame]

How large is normal cera these days, I know the prime got buffed

[hollow vine]

normal i think 1.6 ?

[cyan flame]

Though considering how much people have complained that stego can oneshot cera, I think people would be happy if it couldn't anymore xD

[cyan flame]

Hm, well then there's still some room to nerf, but good to know

[hollow vine]

all the cera players will and stego players wont cause that would mean needing twice the amount of succesfull hits to kil them so they have more time to kill you

[cyan flame]

Fair enough, you never can be sure. I've seen all kinds of various opinions on how allo vs stego should go xD

[hollow vine]

anyone that says allo should be able to fight 1v1 just doesnt think about balance at all and just wants their favorite dino to obliterate everything else

pack animals should hunt bigger things in packs period

you wont see a single omni going to fight a cera now do you

if you do my bad then lol but it would make no sense

[cyan flame]

You've clearly never met omni/utah mains, have you ^^ They believe they should solo apexes if they're "skilled" enough

[hollow vine]

and while evrima is reliant on individual player skill certain stat differences shouldnt be able to be nullified just cause of skill

[hollow vine]

oh i know those are prolly the ones that played tailriding legacy

a low tier dino should never no matter how skilled the player be able to kill an apex

dont even think omni is able to outdamage trikes healing lol

[cyan flame]

Yeah, playing without the official mechanics to show how good they are disabling alt turn). But I think it does show that I'm not entirely without reason to wonder if allo should 1v1 stego. There are all kinds of opinions on how fights should go out there

And I can't be sure what the devs are planning, or how most players see things, so might as well ask when talking about these things

[hollow vine]

thing is how can u let a dino that grows lets say 3 hours 1v1 somethign that takes 6 hours

[hollow vine]

im sure devs have no intention of having allo 1v1 stegs or trikes etc

[hollow vine]

exactly cause when alt turn is enabled omni cant do a thing 😛

i am however glad with the anti tailriding approach of evrima

and the fact that herbivores aint no longer the walking meatbags they were on legacy

[cyan flame]

Much to the displeasure of carni players, it would seem

[hollow vine]

o0h for sure

carni players want to be able to easily hunt any and all herbivores

" herbi bias" xD thats the excuse i hear

cause they aint walking meatbags and can actually kill you if u dont play correctly

stego in legacy = dead to any and all apexes, trike in legacy = facetanked by spino just demolished by rex double bite and bonebreak however it is more then capable of killing giga

Shant = tailridden by spino, able to kill rexes if they dont bonebreak u fast enough able to kill giga to

[limber hull]

Sure, I don’t really care lol. I just think thagomizers would be better at it

[hollow vine]

oh agreed thagomizers would propably do more overall damage then the horns but even then those horns would be able to end a fight with a single thrust

meanwhile rex would not really be able to kill a trike in 1 bite since it would be very very hard to hit the neck of the trike due to the frill

also Anky in legacy ........ absolutely worthless ( with bonebreak its able to kill giga but thats it ) spino and rex destroy anky

[cyan flame]

To be fair, stego, shant and spino weren't adjusted for survival, but trike does apply.

[cyan flame]

What if trike was better at knockdown, because it has attacks to apply there, while stego did more knockback of some kind, plus internal bleed. So trike wants to get in close, and finish you off, while stego wants to apply the bleed plus create distance to start running now that you're going to not want to run after it due to said bleed.

[hollow vine]

true but even then .... spino stats were way to broken, and rex was adjusted for survival it was just to strong lol

[hollow vine]

would be great for both those playables since trike with thrash does rely alot on being able to knock its opponent down. and stego could use something that would allow it to either create distance or have its opponent back off for a bit if it took to much damage.

[cyan flame]

I'd say giga was more of a problem overall in survival legacy than rex to be honest.

[cyan flame]

I figured it could also help emphasis that trike wants to fight you, stego wants you to go away

[hollow vine]

gotta make it so herbivores are fun to play since we need way more herbivores 80% or so of ther playerbase is carnivore

[hollow vine]

oh no out of all 3 apexes giga is the weakest for sure, just because it was also the slowest runner

compared to that the rex usually only needed 1 bite to break your legs and pretty much end it in his victory

[cyan flame]

True, but giga could trot down pretty much most others, it was the better hunter, if not the better fighter

[hollow vine]

true since trike is also more liek a bull lol bulls also run towards you i guess

[hollow vine]

wat use is being able to trot something down when u cant win from it, apexes most often fought mostly other apexes either carnivorous apexes or herbivorous apexes, it doesnt matter if a giga is able to trot down a rex when all the rex needs is to bite u once maybe twice and you can kiss your trotspeed goodbye. spino is also able to do alot of bleed and has better bleed regen and resistance then giga

and the herbivores were to strong as well shant being able to keep up with giga and tailride it to death, trike outdamaging giga as well

i also think the biggest reason that trike was underpowered in legacy is because they gave it so much bleed and overcompensated it by taking away to much of its raw damage

Heck even Pue in legacy is bad af with its left back leg being extremely useless unable to do anything but let its enemies bite its leg, at least it could safelog long before dying

giga relied to heavily on getting the first bite and hopefully not trading, only then could it have a chance of winning

[limber hull]

Nah, giga was absolutely the most powerful apex in the game. It struggled in 1v1s against its own weight class but by god it obliterated the midtier with terrifying efficiency

[cyan flame]

You could win pretty much any other matchup? It was only really rex, and trike depending on situation that you might worry about. And spino does not apply, it wasn't in survival.

[hollow vine]

there is the thing an apex only able to fight below its own weight so no apexes is exactly wat makes it the worst apex

[hollow vine]

again if u dont look at sandbox then out of the available apexes giga was by far the weakest

u cant be called the strongest apex if u cant win from the other apexes in a 1v1

u can call it a mid tier demolisher not the strongest apex

in legacy the title strongest apex would go to rex

and with or without sandbox dinos giga is the weakest out of all the apexes

the only thing giga was best at was its trot speed 🤣

[limber hull]

No, in terms of actual ability to terrorise the majority of the roster, giga was the best

[hollow vine]

to terorise midtiers acro is far better

[limber hull]

I don’t think just because Rex was good at 1v1s made it better than giga’s tyrannical rule

[cyan flame]

I don't agree, it was the best overall, not the "strongest", but the better choice overall. Sure rex, and trike to a lesser degree were stronger, but the game isn't, and wasn't about fighting as much as survival so

[hollow vine]

and just because you can trot down the majority of the playables doesnt mean its the best apex again if you cant beat other apexes in a 1v1 you cant be called strongest apex

[cyan flame]

Another, not adjusted for survival playable

To be fair, I only count the actual survival playables, because the rest of the sandbox ones, were either too good, or too bad, because they were never made for survival in the first place

[hollow vine]

at this point idk wich ones from survival and wich from sandbox exactly

[cyan flame]

So while you could refer to them, they were not part of official roster so

[cyan flame]

Fair enough, it's been a while, hasn't it. But if it didn't have proper juvie/subadult stages, it wasn't for survival

[hollow vine]

im talking about actual combat power ( weakest) its undeniably weaker in terms of combat power compared to any other apex

[hollow vine]

yea been a long while xD

in a 1v1 giga will lose to any other apex.

[cyan flame]

Okay, sure, though I do think trikes could be handled, but yes, rex was the better fighter. Though multiple times I tried to find a glorious end on my giga and threw myself at rexes, I ended up winning (because of course, when you're looking for a way out, you'll not find it)

[hollow vine]

thats wat im saying with the weakest apex

[cyan flame]

So while rex may have had the better stats, the players were not always as competent as one could ask for

[hollow vine]

rex was just struggling with its turn radius if you manage to not get bonebroken u can tailride it fairly easy but most of the times bonebreak rng was on rexes side

ill have to disagree trike will almost always destroy giga 1v1

[hollow vine]

oh true as rex against trike or spino if you dont use double bite u lose when i first played i didnt know this of course and died to spino and trike xD

if giga runs at trike and bites it the trike will be able to trade an equal if not superior amount of hits and while the giga did do more base bleed and more base damage it had slower attack speed and worse bleed resistance

and then the giga would have to run away from the trike to let the bleed work and giga running speed was only slightly faster then trike and u would have already wasted more going into/ out of the fight then the trike would have wasted

[limber hull]

Giga could regen stam while trotting, on top of having crazy high trot speed, making its endurance terrifying

[hollow vine]

thats true

im glad evrima trike can regen stam while walking xD

same with rex

[limber hull]

In the case of Rex, it tends to not be able to do that due to how fast it drains its own stam lol

[hollow vine]

thats true but trike stam drains pretty fast as well

u can run for like 5-10 seconds before u need to start walking to be able to regen

[peak jetty]

game is tariffic as is

[icy lion]

@peak jetty Read rule 5

[calm flare]

Is tariffs considered NSFW....?

[limber hull]

Pretty sure he just misspelled terrific lol

[peak jetty]

https://tenor.com/view/tariff-don't-hug-me-i'm-scared-duck-tariffs-damn-it-gif-13796742927252001287

i think it was because it had trump in it

[icy lion]

There are 2 paragraphs to it

[peak jetty]

this should just be about economics now its safe for work

[calm flare]

Okay, so, I get that, but...are tarrifs really able to be considered as politics? Tariffs are a global phenomena not specific to any one country. The fact that it had the American president on it perhaps made it seem more political than need be, but the discussion of tariffs itself isn't technically a political standpoint.

[icy lion]

It devolves into politics, and has nothing to do with #general-feedback #general-feedback-discussion or the Isle at all

[peak jetty]

generally hate tariffs myself

but i love the game the isle is sick

[calm flare]

So if we moved it into general discussion it would be okay to talk about

[calm flare]

100% agree

[icy lion]

No

[icy lion]

@vocal totem Keep this channel on topic, please

[vocal totem]

https://tenor.com/view/hehehe-gif-8803924313447176056

can i get some general feedback on this lizard gif?

[peak jetty]

https://tenor.com/view/wash-your-hands-gecko-lizard-funny-gif-16662744

seems clean

[vocal totem]

or is this the general isle feedback discussion thread?

[cyan flame]

@pliant elm Isn't ptera supposed to get some groundbased PvP or hunting capabilities?

[calm flare]

Seems clean to me

[peak jetty]

like the spearfishing ability?

[limber hull]

No, like actual player vs player combat mechanics

The spearfishing is PvE (it’s a nice feature tho regardless)

[peak jetty]

cant you just peck them

[limber hull]

You can, but it’s less effective than it was

[peak jetty]

seems fair enough

[limber hull]

You have to airbreak to attack something higher than your weight

[peak jetty]

no you dont

everything weighs more than that flimsy bird XD you just fly by and bite them

i kill babbies on the beach all the time with the ptera

[limber hull]

Yea, but you get knocked out of the air if you peck something larger than yourself now

[barren crater]

On the HT*

[peak jetty]

they should atleast let you side latch like the raptor

[limber hull]

I genuinely despise the ideology that “can’t kill something else therefore worthless”. Completely dismisses everything about the animal because for some people, killing power is the only metric of enjoyment

Ptera has like, so many new features, yet people are fixated on its attack power and refuse to engage with it, despite it having the most unique ways to interact with the world

[limber hull]

What would that even do for you lol

[peak jetty]

regen stamina

while interacting with the world in a cool way

[limber hull]

i mean, you can just do that to a tree for the same effect, although i guess there's not much harm in a ptera doing it

if its just like "imma hitch a ride cuz i wanna" lol

[peak jetty]

the ptera should be able to poop on them like a pigeon does might not do damage but at least you can mark out your territory to assert dominance

[pliant elm]

Ptera in the ground is useless, I don't understand this Dondi idea xd

Unless he makes the Ptera weigh over 300kg and run more than 40km, then I'd see something coming out of this idea

[icy lion]

To make it not useless

[limber hull]

Pretty easy to understand. He wants an animal that’s more than a glorified spectator cam that actually interacts with the ecosystem as opposed to either hovering above it or harassing it with no counterplay

[pliant elm]

Yes, he wants to. But there's no good way to do that with Ptera without giving him a huge buff

[limber hull]

Like currently all I hear from you is the complaint that ptera isn’t quetz. Yea, it isn’t, and it never will be

It has a lot more of a focus on PvE and world interaction than needing to be a one-note nuisance that only kills by abusing the fact that a majority of the roster lacks verticality

[pliant elm]

No, I just don't want Ptera to join the club of the forgotten, along with Dryo and Hypsi, who are only played occasionally.

That's why I don't see any problem with Ptera being able to fight while flying.

[limber hull]

It won’t. You creating your own idea of forgotten dinosaurs then lumping ptera in there is on you

I personally really enjoy both hypsi and dryo

[icy lion]

The forgotten dino, currently undergoing a rework

[pliant elm]

When Quetz arrives, what will be the point of playing Ptera, which has practically become an AI that literally does nothing but fly and catch fish? Xd

Yes, the animation is very good. But good animation doesn't make it fun

Pick a Playable to watch others playing, so fun! Lol

[limber hull]

More mobility, more unique ways to play, a more laid back playstyle? I don’t know, I don’t base everything on purely killing power

[limber hull]

Ptera is playing, it has unique mini game interactions exclusive to it, an engaging momentum-based flight system, interesting travel routes and an upcoming revamped combat system.

But I guess it can’t harass carno so worthless

[thick ivy]

@queen locust mate so why did u dislike my message

[pliant elm]

A good example is the Troodon: It has the ability to hunt, play, and have a lot of fun even though it is small.

Ptera was like that too

Ptera will only be used by Mix packers and nothing else

[limber hull]

Yes but see troodon actually had risk and counterplay to its hunts

A ptera with good movement was just basically a drawn out, boring, annoying death

[pliant elm]

Yes, these new additions are really cool. But what happens after you already know all this? Trying it for the first time is really cool and fun, but what about afterwards? Flying, catching fish, flying, flying and catching fish...

[faint folio]

Aren't they also working on a ptera ground overhaul?

[pliant elm]

You won't have any interaction with other players like any other good playable; you'll just watch others having fun.

[limber hull]

Before it was flying and pecking things, flying and pecking things

It has less to do

The only reason people care is because everything needs to kill everything otherwise it’s a worthless creature

[pliant elm]

Ptera didn't peck at things before, but at players. Unlike always doing the same thing, against players everything is practically always different

[icy lion]

https://tenor.com/view/monster-versus-vs-alien-monster-vs-alien-gif-16037253809360562033

[faint folio]

I suspect Ptera will end up having more interactions with hatchlings and juvis after it's done. I don't think it being able to kill creatures many times its own weight and grow time with no real counterplay was a good thing to have in game

[queen locust]

cause I like not knowing what to expect if I end up getting prime elder on a dino I haven't before

[thick ivy]

valid i guess

[faint folio]

Troodon, while it does many of the same things regarding punching up, is actually counterable because it is forced to spend time where it's prey can theoretically hit it (and it's one shot, so one good play by the prey wins)

[pliant elm]

That's why playables that interact with other players are much more playable than those that don't, like Dryo and Hypsi, who basically just run around the map

[faint folio]

If the Ptera flies high enough, there's literally nothing most of the larger playables can do because they don't have upwards attacks

[icy lion]

And... making it have survivability on the ground is.... bad for making it interact with other players? The ones that are by and large all on the ground?

[pliant elm]

Although Ptera's case is worse than those two, since now it can't attack anything heavier than itself xd

[faint folio]

I'd argue if a dryo or hypsi ran up and started attacking a full grown carno, that should end with a dead dryo/hypsi

[pliant elm]

To be honest, these three can be deleted from the game and won't be missed. Some will complain and feel nostalgic for a while, but it will soon pass, as these creature aren't much different from not playing at all

Spending time growing them and ending up not being able to do anything besides Walk/Run/Fly. Wow...

[faint folio]

Full stop. Both have tools to survive an encounter with carno (at least theoretically... If we take into account burrowing), but they shouldn't be killing the carno that weighs a lot more than them and takes significantly longer to grow unless the carno is already severely injured from a different fight or completely afk

That's really the fundamental problem with Ptera. Before the rework started, a ptera could solo kill a full grown carno with very little counterplay, especially if the ptera was good at avoiding trees

[pliant elm]

What they could have done to solve this is to give Carno and others like him the ability to bite upwards, thus still leaving Ptera as it was before but also giving the others more chances to kill the Ptera

[limber hull]

They will be missed, just not by you. Stop projecting

[pliant elm]

Doing this would also ultimately make them better against other Playable characters, improving the overall gameplay.

[limber hull]

I personally always turn to hypsi and dryo when I can’t think of something to play

[limber hull]

This is infinitely more work to deal with 2 playable creatures, as opposed to just limiting the 2 creatures

[faint folio]

Dryo and hypsi are both herbis and part of their gameplay as a result does involve getting out of surprise combat with carnis, to start. And ptera is in the middle of a rework that we know isn't done. Of course it is performing poorly right now. And all 3 are really not designed to fight things bigger than 5x their own weight - they're designed to run or hide from larger creatures and fight only against things in their weight class - hatchlings, juvis, troodon, etc

[limber hull]

A completely new attack with completely new controls and animations and hitboxes

VS

Simply limiting the problem child bird

[pliant elm]

It's more work, but it ends up being better for everyone. Ptera would still be fun to play, and those who unfortunately can't kill a Ptera will have more chances with this

[faint folio]

It's like playing carno and being upset that you can't solo kill an adult rex. It's bad balance, and carno was never designed to fight that weight class effectively

[pliant elm]

But instead, it seems better to kill Ptera and turn him into that thing in Hordtest xd

[limber hull]

Plus, “upwards attacks” doesn’t even solve the issue, because you’d need to make them have a hitbox that realistically solves the issue

How is a Maia doing an upward attack? How will juvis be able to outdo ptera’s instantly long beak hitbox

[pliant elm]

No, it's extremely different. Carno isn't useless for not being able to do that, as it's still capable of attacking many creatures

[limber hull]

It’s not dead. Genuinely, stop. Cope with the fact that you are not going to enjoy everything, rather than claiming everyone else hates it as much as you do. I like the new ptera more than I ever liked ptera before. I am the counter to your entire point

[faint folio]

Again, Ptera is only poorly balanced right now (and I agree with you, it IS poorly balanced) because they've removed its old toolkit but they haven't fully implemented the new one. It's not dead... More like a Phoenix

[barren crater]

I love the new aerial stuff. Can't wait for the ground stuff as well.

https://tenor.com/view/kaperoo-evrima-pteranodon-the-isle-gif-10702103593393764545

[pliant elm]

I highly doubt Ptera will get any better, very highly

[limber hull]

Yea same, gonna be so fun

[pliant elm]

Seeing as some people liked the 2.1t cerato, it makes sense that they would also like this Ptera. I'm not surprised

[barren crater]

I don't like 2.1t cera, but I do like new ptera

😼

[faint folio]

Stranger things have happened. Say what you want, it's obvious they'll keep tinkering with it until they're happy. As evidenced by however many iterations of night vision and grass we're on at this point 😅 lol

[limber hull]

Yea this is what I’m talking about

Doomer posting and then assuming everyone is as doomer about stuff as you is genuinely frustrating.

“Ptera won’t be fun for anyone and will be a dead animal”

“Cerato will never see nerfs and the game will be forever dominated by it”

Like goddamn dude lighten up for once

Cerato’s getting nerfs. Ptera’s getting buffs. Chill.

Nothing is forever

[pliant elm]

My main complaint is regarding the issue of unnecessary changes, I don't know if that was explicit

[limber hull]

They aren’t unnecessary