general-feedback-discussion

[junior nymph]

im not saying that either

[halcyon pike]

tell me, how would you ever be able to say that someone is using ESP then? like the story i wrote, it cant get more blatant almost, just looks like u are giving people way too much benefit of the doubt, but honestly, i dont really care enough to discuss this further xd

[junior nymph]

I am not wanting to discuss this further either so this is the last thing ima write unless you respond, I give people the benifit of the doubt a bit too much yes, but I did say its highly likely that that person was using ESP, I just am also saying that theres a chance that they werent. The way I see if someone is esping is if they dont follow tracks and they go straight towards you, not even knowing you are there, almost locking their camara and their head towards you and just B-lining it towards you, theres a difference between dumb luck and ESP though. So alot of players claim ESP even if its just dumb luck that someone randomly found you.

im just someone who thinks of different scenarios before jumping to conclusions

[halcyon pike]

ok, he "lost" me and didnt chase me for lets say a minute, i ran further for lets say 30sec+ and hid in a bush u cant see through, he then came back with the deer in his mouth and "B-lined" towards my baby rex sitting in that bush, putting the deer there, there was no looking around for footsteps, no hesitation, it felt like he wanted to let me know "hey dude i can see u no matter what u do"

maybe it was esp, or MAYBE he was just really good at the game xd

you are probably just a new player and got tracked down bro

(joke)

[olive hearth]

😉

[indigo notch]

What did he adjust the shaders to?

[junior nymph]

dunno, I just know that they mixed around with some stuff, probs contrast and vibrance

[indigo notch]

Hm

Might have to play with it myself it looks good

[junior nymph]

just remember, that lighting is a different version from like a year ago, so you might not be able to fully get it to look 1-1

[normal shuttle]

I want cama to be good!!!

[dreamy berry]

btw, you just compared a drawing and a finished model, and they didn't even show you the cama, so how do you know that it can only whip its tail?

[normal shuttle]

Even a neck swing doesn’t feel like it would do much to an apex

[dreamy berry]

First of all, it will be released for beta testing, and you will be able to see the subsequent fixes

[urban flax]

Behold the 5k damage tail flick

[normal shuttle]

Would look maybe a little dumb, but if they do they I will be happy too

[urban flax]

Can't look more dumb than dryo's tail attack

[normal shuttle]

True

Also wasn’t that like dryo’s second strongest attack?

[junior nymph]

I hope it does stun, I wanna whip a rex and for it to be like man.... I shouldn't fight this, and proceed to walk away

[urban flax]

Second to what ?

[junior nymph]

foward alt

[normal shuttle]

Front alt

[urban flax]

ah

[normal shuttle]

Kick kick bite that used to apply bleed.

I used it a lot back then to apply bleed and win trades vs juvies

Sucks they nerfed it and now I’m restricted to galli and beipi when I want to grief babies

[normal shuttle]

At the very least it should stun, but I feel like some knockdown could work better

[proven river]

I absolutely agree those are all good ideas and points I was just poking at a nitpick lol

Yippee!

[velvet lake]

thank you

[olive hearth]

youre welcome

[limber hull]

this might be inaccurate or entirely changed in future btw so uh

don't rely on it

hell, it might not be accurate RIGHT NOW

[olive hearth]

you dont need all of them tho, its enought to never get infertile and get spasm and you need to visit a sanctuary, a migrationszone and 4 patrol zones

[olive hearth]

yeah it just works like 80% of the time :P

[velvet lake]

you dont need to hatch from egg thats nice

[olive hearth]

neither do you need to raise a friend to juvi

perfect diet is a must have tho

same with the migration and patrol zones

[velvet lake]

Okeey thanks for help iam new to this and this works with any dino?

all req are same

[olive hearth]

so far it does work with every dino, never tried it with deino tho

[mild pulsar]

what abour sanc i heard that you need to visit once when your small no ?

[olive hearth]

if you got the first six checked you should get prime :)

[olive hearth]

you can visit them as adult as well, let the bees sting you a few times and you should get that checked as well

[mild pulsar]

nice almost 75% rex i should start to head to one asap

[velvet lake]

🐊 🎉

[olive hearth]

oh nice, good luck!

[mild pulsar]

thanks its ALO slaughter house everywhere its going to be tricky

[olive hearth]

yeah its anarchy out there right now xD

[mild pulsar]

xDD

[velvet lake]

And sorry for bothering again but how do you achieve perfect diet as an carnivore you need to have all symbols full?

[olive hearth]

not full but at least 1% of all 3 of em at the same time

no need to say sorry, we all started at one piont

[velvet lake]

Okeey thank you so much 😄

[olive hearth]

You're welcome and good luck with becoming prime elder!

[mild pulsar]

If i am not mistaken you need the perfect diet to show up once for prime but its good to have it at all times for growth speed but not needed at all time for prime

[jaunty locust]

Whats wrong with the servers on hordetesting ?

[mild pulsar]

all down

since 5 hours ago and counting

they are fixing something

[olive hearth]

i've heard it's a cloudflare problem, some community server have the same problem

[mild pulsar]

hmmmm

[tall vine]

@ionic raven i wish they fixed desync for both prey and predator

[queen reef]

wipe coming, one more time, as always making fools of the players.

[junior nymph]

wipe shouldnt be happening

[obtuse wing]

Do not expect any honesty from that member.
I literally said, "a remake of V3 with old aspects that worked would be interesting for Evrima."
The first thing he said was, "V3 had several useless areas," as if that could not be easily fixed with resource distribution and as if Gateway did not have about 20% of its area deleted for being useless.

What I mentioned that he liked to distort was "cold climate, a quieter forest, cold colors that contribute to horror aspects that evoke feelings of vulnerability and loneliness."
He came and said, "Australia has no horror, guys, because it’s not cold," as if I had said that cold is the only relevant element for the horror theme, instead of saying that it contributes to making this aspect more tangible.

For some reason, they want to convince people that Gateway, a map with three biomes (with extremely noticeable differences in flora and climate, which are the island’s standard biome, the Highlands, and the Swamp, the latter being easily avoidable and currently completely useless), would be better than a map based on V3, with temperate forests, Redwoods, colder swamps, warmer swamps, rivers, enormous lakes, very interesting canyons for migration routes, open fields, and better placed human structures, bringing together what worked in several features of a classic game map.

To justify his opinion he used a screenshot of a much superior older version of Gateway from before that map was completely ruined and utterly failed.
Even if they put a redwood inside that dome and improve it a lot, Gateway would still be inferior in aesthetics and functionality to a proper remake of the V3 map.

[drowsy cedar]

I have to agree, if we call our selves a realistic game we should have a realistic biteforce for deino

it wouldn't affect gameplay all too much either

as the things it would really hurt it can grab and drown anyway

[cyan flame]

But it's not a realistic game

[cyan flame]

And that would be the case against increasing the biteforce, since now the deino can just bite instead of using its lunge

[drowsy cedar]

its called a realistic horror sim right?

and didn't we increase dinosaur weights to be more realistic to their morphs?

[icy lion]

For better gameplay by being able to tell about how powerful something is based on its size, which is especially important when so many mechanics are weight based

[cyan flame]

No, no it is not. It is immersive, and based in realism, but it's not realistic, or meant to be accurate. As you can see from multiple critters not exactly working like they did for real, if they even existed in the first place (omni)

[icy lion]

Realism is very different from accuracy

[cyan flame]

No, or well, realistic in so far as visual size matches weight, but thats not the same as the critter having a realistic weight/size in the first place either

[drowsy cedar]

I mean if we were to be realistic about it

it would have a bite force near that of a rex

not that much different than the 500 newtons it has now

you'd be looking at 100 increase

I doubt deino would bite instead of using its lunge in that case

[cyan flame]

I don't think so, those estimates ended up not being all that accurate I think

But it does not mean anything, since again, game is not meant to be realistic

Don't rex and trike do like 800+ or so on their basic attacks in the game

[drowsy cedar]

then why call it a simulator then

[cyan flame]

I'm not entirely sure it is, or is meant to be, to be honest.

[icy lion]

It's a sci-fi horror game

[cyan flame]

Unless the devs have called it a sim, but I don't know on that one

[cyan flame]

Sure, if you just added another 100 damage, it might not do much, but then why add it in the first place?

[drowsy cedar]

because it will slightly improve player experience?

I mean if that was the argument against anything then why have most of the map

or why have the smaller playables

they don't change much in the grand aspect of things

[cyan flame]

In what way? I'm not neccesarily opposed to it, but what exactly would it do? If it's not enough to be useful and you'd still use the lunge, then why add it? I guess it'd make deino mirror match slightly faster, for good and ill, but outside of that, I don't know. You won't be contesting rex or trike anyway, or even stego probably.

[cyan flame]

Because smaller playables play in their own way and are fun to play as, at least to some people

[drowsy cedar]

well I have not heard that about Dryo but sure

[drowsy cedar]

well if you are in a fight against a rex with a group of deinos it may add up

plus if you buff that the lower bite forces may go up abit

which would help smaller deinos against barrys whenever that comes

but not too much

[cyan flame]

Fair, though they could also make bary not too powerful, so it could go either way there

[cyan flame]

Maybe, but you're not really going to be fighting a rex as a group of deinos, unless there's some very specific circumstances, but yes, that would add up a bit, so I guess for some exceptions, it could be useful.

[drowsy cedar]

you don't want to nerf barry like that you want it there to be a rivalry

[cyan flame]

You could still have a rivalry, my point was just that you could either make bary fit smaller deinos in the matchup, or if neccesary, let smaller deinos gain biteforce faster, or something. There are multiple ways you can figure that matchup out, without giving deino higher biteforce as adult

[normal shuttle]

@ripe fractal “Justice for deino” should be a rework rather than turning it into aqua rex

The playable itself is too abysmal and not necessarily because of its stat pool

It just sucks design wise and even then it shouldn’t be hunting adult trikes and rexes normally unless it is an elder capable of grabbing them

[ripe fractal]

they will do a rework as dondi said, but for now its just a water puppy that u can make fun of by playing rex or trike

[ripe fractal]

elder cant grab em...

[normal shuttle]

Honestly, it is healthier for the game if it stays that way

[ripe fractal]

ur opinion

[normal shuttle]

If they’re swimming yes, and it’s a life cycle game, meaning you can grab large subs

[normal shuttle]

A pretty well founded one considering that Deinosuchus as it is now is just problematic for everyone

The mildly positive thing it has is, besides the appearance, the dopamine burst you get after a good catch

But everything else about the gameplay is utterly miserable from beginning to end, such as precisely how it has zero agency to catch its own prey unlike all other ambushers, and if it had agency to catch them, it would be unfair for the prey

[ripe fractal]

why would it be unfair for the pray?

u go for a swim, u choose to risk and not just go around

its ur fault

the dopamine ur talking about is overshadowed by hours of suffering

[normal shuttle]

Because you cannot see or hear it coming due to how water works in this game, meaning that drinking out of a safe spot means gambling with your life

And if you drink at a safe spot? Then you are safe, but a whole apex carnivore has been countered by a simple non effort ritual that it can’t do anything about.

Do you see the problem there? Compare it for instance with how rex as a large apex ambusher has both agency to hunt and isn’t unfair because you can see it coming. Oh, and rex also has matchups, whereas the matchups for deino are either drink in safe spot or simply stare at a deino as you bite each other to death without any maneuvers or anything possible

[normal shuttle]

Because deino sucks and I want it to be better

But better design wise, not being the same but with better stats

[ripe fractal]

ur saying it from a perspective of a guy that played deino only a couple times it seems

try actually playing it now, and u'll all the problems it has atm.

[normal shuttle]

I’ve played it multiple times, but I frankly get to joy out of it, since right now deino is a coinflip and has been for years

I know what the problems are very well, and it isn’t that you cannot chomp a trike to death

[ripe fractal]

yep

that's pretty much the problem

trike do stupid move, it should be punished

for the balance of universe

[cyan flame]

You can grab them while swimming, if you're prime and they're not, right?

[normal shuttle]

If I want to play an ambusher, I could play Herrera and have way more fun, as it ticks all the boxes that deino doesn’t for a well designed ambusher:

Agency over what it can eat, meaning that it can do something if people simply won’t walk into a trap ✅
Fair in its ambushes, as they are avoidable by aware players ✅
Has surprisingly more than just one matchup ✅

[cyan flame]

And what happens when you get shant, camara, and other even larger critters, or spino?

[ripe fractal]

when was the last time u saw non prime trike ?xD

[ripe fractal]

then we get another balance changes accordingly to the roster

[cyan flame]

No idea, I've not been able to play, I was merely commenting on the actual stats that I know of. Also I'm not sure on how the elder is intended to work in the end, if prime is meant to be common, or rare, for example.

[normal shuttle]

That’s not really what I was talking about. Sure, maybe if the trike really messes up in the wrong place at the wrong time, that is what will happen

But deino shouldn’t be buffed to punish apexes regularly. It just isn’t meant to be doing that at all

[cyan flame]

You do realize at some point there'll be things you can't attack?

[ripe fractal]

because deinos damage atm is balanced for an old roster

where the biggest dino was carno

[cyan flame]

Spino is meant to hunt deino, and I doubt you'd get changes so you can go after a shant, much less a cama or brachi or such

[ripe fractal]

spino is meant to hunt small deino

[cyan flame]

Shant is massive, cama even larger, spino is huge as well

[normal shuttle]

I’m calling it now as I said on the other discussion chat

There will be people that will complain deino can’t hunt camara

[ripe fractal]

prime deino is not a prey for 5-6 ton spino xD

[cyan flame]

No, no it's meant to hunt full adults, bary casn hunt small ones

[cyan flame]

You realize our spino is huge, right?

Spino is larger than rex, most likely, and that's not a prime spino, a prime spino might be an actual kaiju in this game

[normal shuttle]

Nope, adult spino is going to be utterly dunking on any deino it comes across

Sure deinos are gonna make life hell for smaller spinos, but once they grow they’re simply not going to be beaten

[ripe fractal]

so is the croc pretty much

[normal shuttle]

Not as much as the spino we have

[cyan flame]

Our deino is not that large, well, the prime is, but then you look at prime trike and prime rex

[ripe fractal]

well by that means, deino is a middle

not apex

[normal shuttle]

Spino is prob gonna be +11t

Not official but it absolutely looks that way

[cyan flame]

Deino is "apex" in the same way stego is, that is to say not really, but it still can do some damage to them

[ripe fractal]

talking about damage lol

[cyan flame]

Both deino and stego were apexes, until trike and rex came along, and now they're not

[normal shuttle]

Nah it’s still an apex by so many standards. It just doesn’t focus on hunting other apexes, but instead excels terrorizing everything below it

[cyan flame]

It's just that deino can still get away with a lot, because spino isn't in, and trike and rex can't really go after deino, not like they can go after stego at least

[ripe fractal]

which is not an apex then

[cyan flame]

When spino is in, deino will probably be a lot more worried about being hunted

[ripe fractal]

just above smaller tiers

[cyan flame]

Can still be an apex, just not one designed to 1v1 other apexes

[normal shuttle]

My point is, deino shouldn’t get a stronger bite force because the real one did (even though the math you are mentioning was quite faulty if I remember correctly, that has been brought up many times here before that suggestion), nor should it to fight other apexes

[ripe fractal]

im saying it should be able to fight em in water atleast

[normal shuttle]

Not really. Something can be an apex predator while not being capable of fighting others

Deino is nearly the size of rex and one shots fg Maias. In fact, it has the highest effective damage attack in the entire game.

[normal shuttle]

Eh…It would do better with a rework, but as the devs said: a rex in the water is still a rex

[ripe fractal]

wdym, it has 450-575 bite force

[normal shuttle]

Fractures on deino are completely unnecessary

[ripe fractal]

same as cera's charged bite

[normal shuttle]

Not like it needs more when it kills by grabbing and drowning things

Cera’s charged bite is 350 iirc on a full grown

Headshot however does more than a deino body shot true

But that’s more of a cerato issue as it is free to use that as a primary attack

[limpid bear]

KELP FORESTS give me KELPFORESTS

[normal shuttle]

And I also completely disagree with the notion of giving AI in apex diets

They should be complicated and not just farming AI in their early game

The fact very small deinos can “cook” ai is already stupid enough

[ripe fractal]

bruh, ur completely wrong about ai

do u even know how much foor grown croc needs?

and how u can just never meet any players for hours

not to mention smaller crocs

[normal shuttle]

Deino design issue if anything

There could be ways to make it a fair hunter with agency

[ripe fractal]

that CANNOT hunt anything but ai

[normal shuttle]

But nothing above 2-3 tons should be eating any ai whatsoever

[ripe fractal]

and that ai doesnt give any diets

[normal shuttle]

They have enough with elite fish

[ripe fractal]

well thats the problem with deino and its constant starving

[ripe fractal]

agahhaha

elite fish?

[normal shuttle]

And how it cannot properly hunt due to how it is designed

[ripe fractal]

i havent seen any for the whole day

the ai for crocs barely works

[normal shuttle]

So back to my main point, deino needs a rework badly

I would rather have it slowly rotting in the shadows than to simply buff it so it can cheese its way to adulthood to still be an annoyance to everyone involved

[ripe fractal]

i see more swimming boars then fish

[normal shuttle]

I simply do not want deino right now

[ripe fractal]

my point is: it wont get a rework u think it needs, and the bare minimum devs can do to help it, its to buff it

[normal shuttle]

Why won’t it get a rework to make it actually work?

Devs know well what the issues with deino are

[ripe fractal]

because devs are lazy, and its gonna take years to make it

but fixing bite force gonna take 5 mins

they will add a couple more attacks for it, but its not the rework ur talking about

[cyan flame]

But fixing the biteforce isn't going to do much, you're not going to be biting rexes and trikes to death in the water, they'll just do the same thing everyone else does, avoid you entirely

[normal shuttle]

That was so uncalled for. They put so much work into the game, and a deino rework could probably come on like…Spino hordetest maybe?

Also there’s no “fixing” to the bite force. The only thing deinos would do with it would be killing each other faster and try rushing large creatures at the shore like they do with stego in the live branch

[ripe fractal]

oh i will trust me xD

[normal shuttle]

Exactly^^^^

If you give bs to deino (like giving it the ability to consistently bite apexes to death in the water) then they will all simply decide you’re not worth the trouble and go on drinking in their safe spots. Nothing would change, and deino gameplay would remain miserable as it further reinforces how the only interaction it has with other playables is drinking behind a rock

[ripe fractal]

so, next couple years xD

[indigo notch]

I disagree

[ripe fractal]

and for that time, its gonna be a pain to play

[indigo notch]

Most servers are dead without ai and if there’s nobody playing what are you supposed to eat?

[ripe fractal]

...

[indigo notch]

?

[ripe fractal]

thats why ai prey choice for crocs should be enhanced

[normal shuttle]

People? The average official is always full bro

[ripe fractal]

all u can do atm is chill in delta

[indigo notch]

The devs have tested this. They put out na2 no ai for a couple of weeks and even at peak hours max players only reached up to 20 players

Devs noticed that the server was completely dead due to no ai so they decided to add ai to it

Without ai it’s literally unplayable

[normal shuttle]

For many carnivores yes

Because your early game relies pretty hard on finding that first meal

However I don’t know how does that mean that +2 ton creatures perfectly capable of hunting should be eating any AI at all

[indigo notch]

I mean there’s a good solution to this tbh. If the server is full/almost full then only small ai spawns (for juvies) if it’s below half players then big ai starts to spawn like dibbles etc etc

[ripe fractal]

thats the problem, 2 ton deino cant hunt because of other bigger crocs taking all hunting spots )

and u cant just go and pick another spot

because everyone is just playing around delta

and u cant hide from those bigger crocs because half the server use esp

there are a lot more undercovered problems than u may think, u just gotta play croc for a few hundreds of hours to understand

[normal shuttle]

Which is something that could be fixed with a rework too

I appreciate how you’re helping me showing how deino needs more than buffs.

It is by far the most luck based, mind numbing playable in the entire game and it’s not even close

[ripe fractal]

im just being realistic and not expecting any big changes

anyways, im off for now, good talk

[normal shuttle]

buffing the dysfunctional playable won’t do much better. It would probably be more harmful if anything

[ripe fractal]

yea yea, i've seen it xD

[normal shuttle]

Honestly I would just object to one thing

Deino has always had a rough go

Even in spiro, one of the main things that discouraged me from playing was that even then subadults got effortlessly walked down by larger gators, and then the whole body of water was a narrow hallway which meant you were quite literally at the mercy of the deino groups or simply larger individuals

Barring U6, deino has always felt like a D- playable

F even

[ripe fractal]

i got one more thing to say. In my vision of croc. It should stay as a king of the water, the spino and deino fights should not be based on another pinning mechanic, but purely on biting each other, so that skill can define the winner

[normal shuttle]

Deino is losing anyways 💔

I think a spino would really have to mess up to somehow lose that, as deino’s kit just isn’t built to be fighting things multiple tons heavier than itself that can also kill other apexes

Like come on

Lemme pull the picture

[cyan flame]

On the one hand, I do agree more pin and similar isn't neccesarily good, but I doubt spino would just bite deino. Most likely it'd grapple with the arms, maybe not a full pin but perhaps more like allo is intended to do. But spino is meant to be the danger to deino, when a spino shows up, you swim away as deino, or so it was put.

[normal shuttle]

Pulled out the most recent model show

This thing is about the size of a prime elder rex when simply non prime adult 🥀

No way deino is beating up that thing in the water unless it’s a 2 or 3 versus 1

Hoping it is minimum 11 tons, will be happier if more

Tank carni for once (besides cera)

[ripe fractal]

cera gonna be buffed to 15 tons minimum

[normal shuttle]

Cera is getting right the nerf that I wanted

I am excited to see how it turns out

Do you guys think cama really isn’t going to get bodied? It’s like, what, 15 tons at most?

[icy lion]

I wouldn't be surprised if it were 20 by default tbh

We get there when we get there

[normal shuttle]

True I may be looking too far into the future but like…

Is it just gonna kick a rex or spino in the shin? Sure it’s better than legacy one, but it’s kinda hard to imagine what is it gonna do unless it is more mobile than I imagine

[mild isle]

They’ll probably bring some form of trample back

[old idol]

I believe in one of the more recent devblogs where dondi was talking about camara he mentioned the trample system would be coming back with it

[lean escarp]

hell yeah

[icy lion]

@maiden drift Remove any command lines from your launch properties

[honest helm]

why is this a normal game thing that you cant even see the ground your walking on? who made this and thought its a good idea, even a small fish could kill me now if i cant see anything?"!="="

[limber hull]

It’s dishonest to dismiss old screenshots from Gateway while literally using screenshots of an old, dead map from a discarded branch of the game’s history.

Don’t talk of dishonesty while practicing it yourself and twisting my words in every available way

[velvet lake]

Guys what is best location to find goat spawns?

[limber hull]

never spawn dibble AI is a better solution

[wild crescent]

@pale river

#general-feedback message

herbivores that are faster than carnivores can easily abuse this, like a hypsi following a rex to drain its hunger

[pale river]

True thanks for the response I’ll think of a solution or smth

[devout pendant]

#general-feedback message

Why people reacting negatively to this? As it stands it will just create a much bigger breach in the power level between solos and premade teams. Resetting to 0 after 20 hours of grind is horrid when the only real way to safeguard it is by having a megapack

If I'm totally honest I think you should just keep a % of the buffs forever so it's a one time grind. Say you entomb with bleed resist once, now every single one of the same species dinosaur is just 1% more resistance to bleed until the end of time while still being able to pick it for any playthrough

[limber hull]

that literally only helps megapacks and clans even more

and goddamn it screws over the new player

trying to get ahead when others have permanent, superior stats

[devout pendant]

Not really anyone can entomb once, the megapacks wouldn't get any larger advantage than normal folks after the first week

Or month if you want to get more than the core ones

[limber hull]

to me, i like the idea of it being permadeath

i want it to feel meaningful to hold onto the highest level of entombment

the only change I'd make is make entombment levels not lost if you die, say, 10 minutes after spawning in

[devout pendant]

I think it's cool in principle too but fear that it will just benefit big packs, they get to hunt solo guys forcing them to reset to 0 while they rarely die

[devout pendant]

That could be a big improvement, perhaps up to sub so it's a lil easier

[limber hull]

nah, not sub

juvi shouldn't be immune to it

id give the same grace period to everyone

[devout pendant]

I mean 10 minutes is 50% of a hypsi and 1% if an apex, at least it should be growth% bases

[limber hull]

i dont think so honestly

apexes SHOULD have it rough

[devout pendant]

I think apexes shouldn't be so hard to grow but instead limited in time by resource consumption

[limber hull]

im not entirely sure what that means

like how do you limit their time via resource consumption lol

[devout pendant]

The same concept as hypers really

It's rather silly that a Rex is so hard to get past childhood but then is currently untouchable as adult as long as they aren't idiots. Instead of limiting the amount of babies, we should limit the amount of adults

Same for any other apex really

[limber hull]

i mean... idk man, that feels to defeat the point

like, yea, i think rex hunger is WAY too slow, but the growth is absolutely meant to be a trial to undertake

[devout pendant]

Then we have created deino 2.0, growing is hard but then you are immortal

[earnest perch]

@limpid bear
Well thats intended.
Frail Elder is not a reward, it is a punishment for players that does not play the game as intended.

It for sure sucks when you become frail Elder, but then you have not played the way you are supossed to do. Those players are rewarded with Prime Elder status

[toxic wren]

Oh boy, I sure love being "punished" for surviving to adulthood. It's a shame I didn't hit a long list of checkmarks the game doesn't tell you about.

[ripe fractal]

yea, ofc. The elder system doesnt work as its intended. I visited 18 patrol zones and 4 migrations, visited sanct as croc and still didnt get the prime, i had above 200% growth rate the whole time and now dondi does this.

talk about not active gameplay

[ripe fractal]

if i didnt play how im i supposed to, then how do i even gotta play?

[limpid bear]

my biggest gripe is not being able to be an adult for more than 5 mins and frail prime elder being ridiculously slow as i said is ridiuclous just because i didnt do a checklist , it seems intended to punish players for playing small tiers

[limpid bear]

but i think that was just about fixed

[normal shuttle]

Well no

At least rex can play the game unlike deino, and also can die to more than cannibals

[limpid bear]

deino is borderline unplayable yeah

[obtuse wing]

Obviously it is dishonest on your part to use old images of Gateway to justify yourself.
I used old images of V3 because it is the ideal example to aim for. I never said V3 is perfect or that it ever was perfect, especially because I used images from different versions of that map precisely to show that it is possible to use and draw inspiration from environmental aspects of different eras of that map.

Obviously, when I said “show me an image of Gateway with better atmosphere than this,” it could not be more obvious that I am referring to the current Gateway, not the old one. And by the way, the old Gateway had much greater potential than the current one. Gateway is a map that started well, improvements were made, but today, and in the hordetest, it is a mediocre map if placed next to a solid remake of V3.

Better points of V3:

While Gateway is completely surrounded by coastline, V3 has two exits to the sea and the rest is surrounded by mountains and a more compact shoreline. This greatly improves the quality of the map. If we measure it in square meters, an immense portion of Gateway is just beach, which only serves as an easy traversal route.

V3 is more promising in terms of biome quantity. V3 could support a Redwood, more open forests, dense forests, a large river similar to the Delta River, deeper and shallower swamps, huge lakes like that dam. That dam in V3 would be an explosion of life (of course, nothing I am saying here refers to copy-pasting Legacy, but to a proper remake). But that dam lake would be an explosion of life: beipes, austros, spinos, bary, sucho, pterosaurs, minmis. Literally that lake has space for all those creatures to live even together, not tolerating each other, but the environment itself is interesting.

The wide natural corridor that exist in Gateway are even better in V3 (in earlier versions), because they are wide, with wide rivers running through them. They are solid migration routes, with predators being able to use them very well.
There is no way to argue that the current Gateway, considering the direction it is taking, would be better than a remake of V3 using aspects that worked across its versions over the years. There is simply no way.

But let's trust that Gateway has greater potential than taking inspiration from this 👍🏻

[normal shuttle]

This looks more like a fantasy world than a real place where someone would put dinosaurs, as well an alligator and a giant monitor lizard

[limber hull]

"an immense portion of Gateway is just beach, which only serves as an easy traversal route."

first time "easy to traverse" has been a critique of a map

[normal shuttle]

In fact why are we getting moded V3 images mixed with thenyaw

[limber hull]

"V3 is more promising in terms of biome quantity"

than a TROPICAL ISLAND??? lmao you're kidding

[normal shuttle]

I guess he prefers to get around a massive cliff and waste an extra 30 minutes moving to twin lakes from the wash or hot springs

[obtuse wing]

It's not about simply copying and pasting any existing map, but rather a map that combines aspects that worked well in both V3 and Thenyaw.

[obtuse wing]

Funny, you guys love to say the game isn't realistic (paleo).
In the game we have mutant animals, nothing would prevent them from creating a crocodile tolerant to colder waters and climates.

[normal shuttle]

That’s how you get gateway tbh

[junior nymph]

we are never getting thenyaw back

[obtuse wing]

absolutely not

[obtuse wing]

And I don't even want that; that map is cool, but small. An honest V3 remake would be our best option.

[junior nymph]

spero!

[normal shuttle]

So…the devs learnt nothing about making maps then?

[obtuse wing]

Gateway once had potential, but that day is gone

V3 is a map that could support many more biomes with significant differences, and besides being a classic map present in the game since the beginning, it deserves a remake in Evrima

[limber hull]

thenyaw is literally just better than V3 tho

V3 is one of the game's worst maps and not enough people talk about it

[obtuse wing]

V3 is bad in legacy mode today because the devs improve the map a lot, and instead of adjusting features and adding more mechanics, they end up making it worse, just like what's happening with Gateway today

[limber hull]

if you genuinely believe that, then why do you want it back

[obtuse wing]

Places like this would reach their peak in Evrima, a wide open passage with a broad river in the center, a solid route for herbivores to migrate, viable for semi-aquatics to ambush them, and with spots for predators to hide

[urban flax]

That looks like spiro

[junior nymph]

the issue is somewhere like that would just be a hotspot, like a mega hotspot, but I would kinda like it

[obtuse wing]

Thenyaw Island is better than V3 because Legacy always lacked good resource distribution, and it also requires fewer players...
In the future, we'll have servers with 400, maybe 500 slots in Evrima, a map the size of V3 with migration routes like those locations, and migration and diet systems, and an intelligent resource distribution would make it an excellent map with many more biomes than Gateway could have

[wooden agate]

i dont know the current argument but i can say id really love a map with the sense of scale V3 had

a map inspired by V3 that has been reworked a large amount to be functional for niche cases like Herrerasaurus and Deino would be nice

[obtuse wing]

I disagree; staying in that location would be bad for raptors because they would be easy prey for Carnotaurus, Herrerasaurus would be monstrous in that area, it would be a shortcut for migrating herbivore groups, and an interesting place for predators to ambush.
It wouldn't be a bigger hotspot than the Southplains or Highlands

[limber hull]

it really does

in fact it carries a lot of the main problems spiro presented

[junior nymph]

it would be a bigger hotspot, for the reason of hey its massive open plains

[limber hull]

a single central river where every deino would lurk, large flat plains for nothing but constant PvP combat, little actual areas for animals that aren't said plains creatures to do much of anything

[indigo gulch]

Yeaaaaaah this is the worst thing about the system by far

[indigo gulch]

This sounds like hell ngl

And I say that as a deino player.

[junior nymph]

center river 2.0

[obtuse wing]

If what you said were true, the river delta would be the busiest location in the game, but the locations are the highlands and southplains.

[limber hull]

river delta is not nearly the same as that river

it is far more similar to spiro's central river

[obtuse wing]

I think I need to reiterate that my idea is not a copy-and-paste copy of the current map

Adjustments to the river shown can be made for better functionality

[junior nymph]

its a river, what adjustments do you want

[limber hull]

^

[junior nymph]

nothing would change the fact that is a big river in the middle of plains, unless you want to change the area completely which goes against what you are wanting

[obtuse wing]

First, a large river cutting through a plain isn't a bad concept.

It's an interesting location for semi-aquatic creatures and strategic locations for predators and prey. V3 is a large map with various biomes; it wouldn't just be one huge central river like Spiro was

[limber hull]

it was done once before, it absolutely was a bad concept

[obtuse wing]

why?

[limber hull]

it absolutely destroyed any other desire to go anywhere but that one spot

[obtuse wing]

?

[limber hull]

basically, no one migrated, no one explored, no one hunted, they just fought in the main central area near the big river in the plains

[indigo gulch]

The reason delta river isnt the busiest location (for deino) is because people barely go there. People usually go to south plains and highlands BECAUSE it has safe spots to drink and it’s more populated. And then the deinos go there too

[limber hull]

it was like that for literal months

it got so bad that the game tanked in FPS because of how many corpses were in this one location

[obtuse wing]

No, and it's funny you say that considering Gateway's PVP areas are Highlands and Southplais, not Delta

[obtuse wing]

exactly

[indigo gulch]

Because it’s flat, has easy food access in the form of pz and mz and has safe drinking spots

[obtuse wing]

When I played on V3, this area wasn't a hotspot

[indigo gulch]

People dont want to risk crossing a river when its all but guaranteed a deino will be in there

Same thing with spiro. Some spots were Just guaranteed death when crossing

[indigo gulch]

I cant talk about that sadly, I started on spiro

[obtuse wing]

I remember that day; after I took that picture, I chased after about five gallimimus that ran away from me. I tried to catch a herrerasaurus, but I ended up being spotted by a carnotarus when I was out of stamina

It was more of a route than a hotspot

[obtuse wing]

Imagine a map with the dimensions and main layout of V3

with wide rivers, wide passages with a river running through the center, and more developed human structures (similar to what Gateway is becoming in this aspect)
Redwood, pine forests, subtropical forests (like in the image below)
swamps placed more toward the center of the map, so players would have a greater need to cross or circle them, creating an area with a varied and interesting flow of species while still offering longer alternative routes
(Migration events on V3, managed by regulated servers, really are the peak. There are extremely interesting routes passing through these areas)
We would have places like the one in the image above, a flooded plain ideal for herbivores, Suchomimus, Baryonyx, and predators in general. We would have the largest lake in the game, the dam lake (Titan Lake), which would be abundant in semi-aquatic life

As I said, an honest remake of V3 has far more potential than what Gateway can become from now on

[limber hull]

Gateway could have literally all of these things, or already has this

genuinely I don't see why you think Gateway has less potential than this

[cyan flame]

You guys still on this whole map thing. Might as well put this in then. V4 was one of the better maps, even though it never got finished. R2 Redwoods was also very cool, even if it was the most unoptimized map ever I'm pretty sure.

[obtuse wing]

The gateway doesn't even have half of that, and what it does have is done in a very simplistic way

[limber hull]

and who says it cant do those things?

[normal shuttle]

I wonder what’s the point of this with animals like Herrera in game

You just…want them to die I guess?

[cyan flame]

How do you come to that conclusion?

[obtuse wing]

I literally said that it's not a literal copy of the images shown, but rather creating something similar. Trees can be added to the area, and this wouldn't be the only area on the island; there are also good spots for Herrera/Beipe/Hypsi etc. at the gateway

[normal shuttle]

There’s no place for Herrera or hypsi there to thrive at all

They’re built for a jungle

[cyan flame]

Okay, so another part of the map can be adjusted for that

[normal shuttle]

Conifers just suck for that since they would get in the way

And we’re getting redwoods in gateway regardless

[cyan flame]

Or you could adjust the density of some forests, or variants of trees

[normal shuttle]

So you will probably have your fill there

[obtuse wing]

herrersa places

[cyan flame]

Not like you can't adjust how the trees look, and are planted, and such, or introduce cliffs (since herrera can use those too), and so on. Honestly not sure why there's this idea that only this or that map can work, as if map design is only a thing when it suits someone.

[obtuse wing]

Where will we have Redwood's at the gateway?
Inside a dome? That would simply be mediocre

[normal shuttle]

Why mediocre? You’re getting right what you want without screwing over the whole map

[normal shuttle]

1. Lol cliff where everyone can see it

2. So redwoods, we’re getting that

[obtuse wing]

For example, the Highlands is one of the places with the most Herrerasaurus, and there too the trees are terrible for it to climb and rest on; however, pine trees could also be varied with trees where the Herrera can rest

[limber hull]

why is it mediocre besides you said so lol

[cyan flame]

I wish we could get the region2 redwoods back

[limber hull]

easy to find, cool as hell, fits a fan-favourite biome onto a tropical map

[normal shuttle]

^^ there’s no other intelligent way to blend it with places like highlands

[cyan flame]

Would rather have a full, proper redwoods style map

[obtuse wing]

No lake in the gateway can support more than 2 deinosuchus and a few beipes
In V3 we have a lake almost the size of the highlands

[cyan flame]

You can have multiple biomes on the same map in better ways than a dedicated biodome, see v4

[normal shuttle]

You know what I would like at least as a mod?

Literal urban map

[normal shuttle]

Mind remininding me which one was that?

[cyan flame]

Oh that was back in progression, were you even around at that time?

[normal shuttle]

It’s been so long since I ever touched legacy, let alone any map besides v3 or region2

I was around basically when progression started

A few months after game released

[obtuse wing]

region 2

[normal shuttle]

Map was quite ugly ngl

Still better than the huge plain they made once

Lemme find it

ISLE MESA

LMAOOOOO that one was the one I meant

That was genuine psychological horror of a map

[obtuse wing]

To say that a map with redwoods, subtropical forests, swamps, human structures, etc., is not viable for Herrera/hypsi
because there are more open areas is simply madness. Herreras in the Delta, a very open area, are extremely successful

[limber hull]

they look exceptionally out of place in a temperate environment tho

[cyan flame]

Oh now thats very old

[limber hull]

the animal built like an iguana and the other one like a tropical bird

[cyan flame]

You do realize we got lizards and snakes up here in scandinavia, right? And birds, with some colors too, for that matter. It's not all black and white and grey and cows or something

[normal shuttle]

The open area in question:

(this is as open as it gets)

(Most of it is surrounded by dense jungle save for the place where it connects with the ocean)

Also never said a thing about subtropical forests. Just conifers and open plains

[obtuse wing]

This iguana lives in places where the water temperature is between 9°C and 15°C or 48°F to 59°F

[normal shuttle]

Doesn’t look like a tropical bird at all

[obtuse wing]

The tropical bird in question lives in forests where the temperature can range from 9°C to 19°C or 48°F to 66°F

[normal shuttle]

Source?

Either way, I am more interested in knowing any actual criticism you may have towards gateway

Last time saying that hot climates are boring wasn’t…really the most convincing thing

[cyan flame]

It wasn't that they were boring. But that a hot climate itself isn't very "scary" or "fear inducing" in the same way that a cooler climate is. That the warmer lighting of Gateway isn't as "unnerving" as the colder lighting Legacy had.

[normal shuttle]

Yep, that’s more accurate

Not like I consider it a good enough reason to make a new map anyway

[cyan flame]

I kind of wish they'd not just make new maps, but rather adjust an older one, but for some reason we kept getting new map after new map xD

[obtuse wing]

Alright, here are my criticisms of Gateway, and I believe these wouldn’t change with simple adjustments to the map.

1 - Very little natural variation of different biomes:
While a temperate-climate map can have Redwoods, pine forests, mixed with Mediterranean and subtropical vegetation and variations
In Gateway, at most, besides the main biome and its variations (plains, jungles), we have a swamp (which is isolated in a corner and easily avoided) and the highlands, which are currently ruined.
Introducing Redwoods inside the Domes will not satisfy me, it will be a small area with a closed sky and surrounded on all sides.

2 - Tropical climate is not the most suitable for the game’s survival-horror theme:
Yes, we can feel fear in a tropical or even desert environment, but psychologically, cooler colors and colder weather more easily induce a sense of vulnerability. This kind of climate also enhances shadows, making them darker. Screenshots of that version really give a sense of cold temperature, and the “cold and dark” style appeals to me a lot.

3 - More beautiful:
Honestly, V3, combining its strengths across different versions, was much more beautiful. We had flowered fields with red, white, and yellow flowers, which made the scenery stunning...
I don’t see Gateway surpassing that beauty.

So in summary:
We won’t have enough environmental variation, we won’t have enough beauty, and that’s basically it

[obtuse wing]

At the same time that the map was dark, it had more colors, like the flowers I mentioned, so returning to that essence would be the peak

[normal shuttle]

So

Without flooding the chat with more images because I already have my fair share of legacy playtime, what would you say V3 conveys? What does it tell you about the game?

@sullen pawn

[normal shuttle]

https://tenor.com/view/boar-ai-gif-10029750210535585520

https://tenor.com/view/omega-omega-planetes-boar-ai-monster-hunter-wilds-gif-9027075388981730636

[faint folio]

Idk, I feel like it sort of depends on how the game uses it. For example, Green Hell uses bright, vibrant, warm tropical forest well. It's still a horror/survival game, but I think the atmosphere wouldn't land nearly as well with more "bleak" landscape. The game does a good job of using atmospheric juxtaposition to unnerve the player by hiding danger in plain sight.

Granted, the isle's attempt at a similar atmosphere isn't landing, but that is an execution problem, not a problem with the tropical environment itself

[cyan flame]

It can of course still be horror, even set in the tropics. But that's kind of, yes, the game is horror because there's danger hidden in plain sight. Now remove the danger, and keep just the atmosphere.

[faint folio]

Exactly, it's an execution problem

[cyan flame]

That too, but you're missing the point.

The entire argument stems from the atmosphere itself, the environment, nothing extra added.

If you had to walk through the two maps, for 15 minutes as a human player. There's no danger, there's nothing else there, no other life. You know there's not, you know you're perfectly safe, and that your only mission is to walk around for 15 minutes, looking at the environment. Now, set this in a tropical, beach vacation environment, and a tundra/"frozen" wasteland. Those two are not going to, most likely, elicit the same emotions from you as you're wandering around.

And that's the entire argument and point, not that you can't have horror set in the tropics, or that you can't feel fear because it's warm outside. But that cold/cold lighting itself elicits a different emotional reaction than warmth/warm lighting does.

[faint folio]

Sure. But if you can add danger, the tropical environment can be imo more unsettling than the tundra. There's a creep factor to something that looks like it should be safe, but you know it's not a reliable feeling

[cyan flame]

Right, but adding things wasn't part of the argument, hence why it's not relevant. Fear can come from many things of course. But that was never the point of the discussion.

The entire argument was just "cold lighting/temperate environment itself is more unnerving than warm lighting/tropical environment itself is"

And that's why he favours the old map and/or style, because it gives a different atmosphere in and of itself, no matter if there's dinosaurs on the island or not

[faint folio]

It may not have been the point, but I think it's still relevant to the devs choice of environment. If they want a bleak, lonely feeling, then yes, a tundra/taiga environment would work better. But I think they're going for an environment more like Green Hell's, and they're missing the mark because they're missing the extra factors that make it work

Arguably a big part of that is assorted mechanics not functioning well or missing

[cyan flame]

Oh sure, but I don't think there was ever a question of the devs choice, or if it was bad for their vision, or anything like that. I don't think there was ever an argument made that the devs can't make it work in a Jurassic Park style island (and let's be honest, that's probably exactly why it is set the way it is)

[faint folio]

But the end result is that the map never makes it past the threshold to creepy

[cyan flame]

I honestly don't know how it managed to become such a massive "argument", since it should be rather obvious that lighting and colors themselves can affect mood and thus the environment itself will make a difference. No matter the other factors added or not.

[faint folio]

One thing I thought about is maybe something like Valheim's atmospheric system would work. There's zones that feel warmer and safer, and others that feel bleak. There's also a massive tone and lighting change when the sun goes down - nights are a lot spookier with almost haunted style lighting

[cyan flame]

That's probably something they intend to try, what with the biodomes, and at least something they've tried before with various biomes on a map

[faint folio]

Granted, you need the animals to have functional night vision to make something like that work, but I could see a tone shift where the game is noticeably darker/bleaker at night working, potentially

[cyan flame]

Wouldn't say much about night time, considering NV for my game = complete void most of the time xD

But yeah, with a different NV, that would probably work out quite well

[faint folio]

Tbh same, but I think that's fundamentally bad game design when the medium is called video games

The images on the screen are pretty fundamental to the medium - if you can't see it becomes frustrating (not scary) incredibly quickly

[cyan flame]

Yeah, it's not scary when I can't see at all, it's just a "whatever I guess", and hope for the best

[faint folio]

Exactly. It's possible to obscure information and make the player uncertain without blinding them... and imo blinding only works well in media where there's other sensory information, like smell or touch

[limpid bear]

@queen mortar i cant upvote ur suggestion 😭

i do it but then it imediately removes it

[woven bane]

hate to be the bearer of bad news but you’re blocked

[limpid bear]

the helly

what did i do to smeasel

[woven bane]

who knows, i’ve been blocked simply for hitting ❌ on feedbacks lmao

[proven river]

My God is this still going on?

[proven river]

There was a V4?

[cyan flame]

Yes

[proven river]

:O

[cyan flame]

Look in DM

[violet pasture]

https://tenor.com/view/hysterical-laughter-laughing-gif-25735842

[inland vigil]

@crystal jolt prime is broken atm, hence why the servers are down to fix it. why they didnt put that in announcements and instead offhandedly mentioned it in the isle discussion is beyond me

[crystal jolt]

truuly one of the choices ever

[inland vigil]

isle moment

[normal shuttle]

@young yacht dunno how is that supposed to help make the game better in any way

And now I feel curious about what killer you so you felt the need say that to the developers

[limber hull]

It’s always someone with a Petit Petid’s discord tag too lmao

[normal shuttle]

Lol, I didn’t bother to click it so I didn’t know

Petits sure has a wild community

Still waiting for the guy to defend that take and justify how saying “your game is trash” with nothing else will suddenly make the game better according to him

[icy lion]

Notify us about that sort of content please!

[normal shuttle]

Yeah that makes sense, noted

I don’t think that’s really the first thing a developer wants to see after spending 8 hours working on something and they just decided to hop on the discord

@proper mantle the point of removing those was due to how insane of an advantage that was and how it altered the balance of the game. In order to not screw up matchups of a playable vs itself, or some interaction it may have, not even those playables should be allowed to have them

[proper mantle]

thats why i mainly suggested ptera and galli who are mostly observers. for example, photosynthetic wouldnt be broken for galli because it already is faster than almost any other dino (other than carno) so what supposed advantage does it really get by being 5% faster. its a quality of life mutation. same goes with ptera, i dont see how a bird being 5% faster will break the game for the other players, and ptera isnt a threat to begin with

[delicate wadi]

I think what ptera needs most right now is to get its crazy slowdown/momentum decay fixed on HT, then we can readdress its proper speed. Right now on live branch it can easily cross the entire map if you use thermals smartly, but on HT its stamina changes are negated by the fact that it loses speed and altitude almost immediately

[limber hull]

to me it just sets a bad precedent

people will look at it and go "why do they get a speed boost and not me?", and it just creates a meta for said animals where they select those two mutations to get the best experience and forgo diversity

[proper mantle]

there are going to be metas with or without the changes to photosynthetic, the rationale of "its gonna cause a meta so we shouldn't change or add something" makes no sense as there are always going to be metas

[delicate wadi]

This is also why hydrodynamic should be nuked (and replaced with a minor base speed buff for all semiaquatics). Because if you spawn in as beipi, it's no longer your mandatory first mut

[proper mantle]

thats the thing though they confirmed that the speed decay on ptera is permanent and its gonna ruin ptera

[limber hull]

i do actually like the idea of hydrodynamic not being availible on aquatics tbf, because the ability to become more aquatic is really fun on land creatures

swamp cera is a personal fave build

[delicate wadi]

For real? 💀 Flight is gutted. Where was this confirmed?

[proper mantle]

in one of the most recent dev blogs lemme get the quote

[limber hull]

flight on ptera is a lot more dynamic, i genuinely don't think ptera is ruined at all, new patch ptera is insanely fun

takes off automatically from ledges, controllable dive, insanely high top speed (higher than it's ever been), a brand new air-drift ability that allows it to make tight turns in the air, so on, so forth

passive flight is slow, sure, but active flight gets REALLY fast

[proper mantle]

most people glide a lot with ptera so not being able to fly more than 20 ft before losing all your speed is kind of a deal breaker to alot of people

cant wait to miss every fight because i wont get there until 20 minutes after (it was 100 feet away)

[delicate wadi]

I haven't played the newest-newest patch, but as of the one immediately before this: It's currently impossible to travel anywhere. Even with thermals I feel slow and unwieldy. I expanded on exactly the reasons for this here: #balance-feedback message

[proper mantle]

@delicate wadi "There’s one more turn functionality for its flight to keep it nimble, but otherwise flight is done and it's time to give it some terrestrial enhancements." otherwords they are done with ptera flight

[limber hull]

god im excited for the terrestrial changes

[proper mantle]

its terrible. i loaded in excited to try it and i logged off after 20 minutes because it took me ages to even fly across water access

[proper mantle]

all those tacos and hypsis are quavering in their boots

[delicate wadi]

Ah. I was under the impression that the momentum decay might be a bug, since they claim momentum has been dramatically improved and yet it's actually much worse in practice than current live branch

[proper mantle]

what exactly are we even supposed to fight on the ground, literally everything weighs more than this

[icy lion]

Flight is done mechanically, not necessarily balance wise

The change to dive to be a keybind instead of automatic came long after that blog

[proper mantle]

so are you saying that momentum could or could not change

[icy lion]

Balance could always change

[proper mantle]

ok thanks, because ptera is dead to me atm

unplayable

[limber hull]

imma be real guys, not adapting to the new flight systems then blaming the new flight for being bad is wild lol

genuinely, ptera is in one of its best states it's ever been in with a dynamic, engaging flight system that rewards you for utilising all your controls to get the most out of your movement and actual momentum to its flight

the most it lost was the ability to peck random things on the ground

ive been enjoying ptera a lot more as of late

[delicate wadi]

Yes and I'm very glad they did that! I've been having trouble triggering it consistently, but the restoration of controlled descent makes fishing much easier than before

[icy lion]

Doesn't holding W keep you at a faster speed than not pressing anything? I haven't had the chance to play in a hot minute

[delicate wadi]

Yes, but it consumes stamina

[limber hull]

yep, and pressing shift or diving gets you some insane top speed

[proper mantle]

it lost its ability to travel the map? it will take a lot longer to go anywhere. sure they added a lot of good stuff, but the momentum change ruins flight. i want to be able to glide, not drag thru the air.

[icy lion]

Even if you keep it at the same angle as a listless descent?

[limber hull]

it absolutely did not with its stam buffs

[icy lion]

Since imo the change to "hands off" speed is a direct result of people talking about problems/annoyances they had while skimming

[proper mantle]

im talking about the momentum. you move at the pace of a grandma after 20 feet.

[delicate wadi]

Didn't skimming slow you down anyway?

[icy lion]

People would slow to minimum flight speed, skim, then the moment they tapped W to adjust they'd shoot up to the cruising speed

[proper mantle]

they can give me stam and a machine gun but if i am flying at 5 mph im not having fun

[icy lion]

It's a feedback I've seen multiple times in the past

[delicate wadi]

I'll just repost this here for my thoughts:

Momentum improvements don't seem to have manifested. Stamina consumption on hordetest is improved per action (and this is good), but you need to be constantly sprinting or climbing because glide loses speed and altitude almost immediately.

On live, momentum from sprinting or diving decays quickly, but the base speed of gliding is strong enough to leverage, with stamina usage revolving around altitude gain. On horde, momentum still decays rapidly, but your base speed is massively nerfed, so you need to spend on both forward momentum and altitude gain. Therefore, even with buffs, stamina usage on horde is considerably worse in practice than it is on live branch, especially once you grow out of the juvi stam buff.

[icy lion]

Now what would be nice is if you could tap Z to fly at minimum speed, and hold Z to use the actual airbreak, unless it's intended to require players to hold W (and therefore consume stam) to get to a "cruising" speed

[proper mantle]

especially if fish arent fixed, pteras will prolly starve a lot more often. i already sometimes have problems circling the map because no fish are spawning and now i am expected to do the same thing at the fraction of the speed?

they ruin ptera's flight and say well at least now you can fight a hypsi!!

[icy lion]

Ptera is way faster than it's basically ever been and got some pretty decent stamina buffs to boot. All it requires is using the keyboard

Which, annoying sure, but saying you have to do things at a fraction of the old speed is a choice

[proper mantle]

not from what ive seen. i tried flying across water access and it was like watching grass grow it makes everything boring

gotta fly across water access might as well open up clash royale and play a game

[delicate wadi]

I think the glide speed on live is extraordinarily fast, and it would be perfectly healthy to nerf it in conjunction with stamina improvements on HT -- but making it this slow feels awful to play

[proper mantle]

at the end of the day it was an unnecessary change that nobody wanted

[proper mantle]

it doesnt feel like youre a pterasaur it makes you feel like a turkey trying to glide

[delicate wadi]

Everything else about the new flight, I generally like, except for the giga-nerfed base speed of the animal

[proper mantle]

every other change is great

i love the fishing and new flight system, the flight feels a lot more natural until you hit the invisible wall and all of a sudden cant fly faster than 5 mph

[delicate wadi]

I feel like it's not too bad when descending or flying straight, but adjusting to even minor inclines/hills is like hitting a brick wall regardless of your momentum

You could have just sprinted to top speed but if you hit spacebar, your momentum is gone -- could I adjust to this change? Sure! But that doesn't stop it from feeling bad

[junior nymph]

@sterile geyser we already know that there will be a patch today that fixes both nesting and prime

[icy lion]

@leaden relic Check the pinned messages in the official server channels to see how to report hackers

[tawdry pine]

Hi, I’m on an official server and my dinosaur got stuck between two hills.
Is there someone I can contact to move my dinosaur — support or an admin?
Thank you!

[junior nymph]

try /unstuck

[tawdry pine]

How ?

[faint folio]

open up the chat like you want to talk in game to other players, then type /unstuck

Hit enter to send

The chatbox will interpret it as a command

[normal shuttle]

HE DMed ME INSULTING ME IN A WHOLE PARAGRAPH OVER THIS MESSAGE

LMAOOOOOOOOOOOO

Also my mother for some reason got included in his message when I only asked “why do you think the game is bad?”

Also blocked me so I could never respond lol

He took it so personally

[limber hull]

oh that guy? you shoulda seen what he sent me

multiple threats were made

[normal shuttle]

HAHAHAHAHAHA YOU TOO?

That’s crazy

[limber hull]

yea he includes mothers a lot

i tried to unpack what his fixation on mothers is and if it were linked to a past trauma, but he seemed awfully clammy about it

i thought we were getting close to a breakthrough, personally

[normal shuttle]

In my base he just said something and blocked me which I find absolutely hysterical when I only asked one question about the feedback. And then he just went ahead with the insults and already declared that I would never see the issues with the game even if I saw them myself

[junior nymph]

@glass oak

[glass oak]

thanks so much..... how long ago was 8.59am? im in a diff time zone and its 5.15pm now for me 😛

[junior nymph]

its also 5:15pm for me so

[glass oak]

oh wow....... where you at?

[junior nymph]

WA

[glass oak]

ohhh.... i was thinking that.... KALGOORLIE eh? lol

[junior nymph]

been there, like once, but nah im at perth.

[glass oak]

Im not in WA but i do miss em fremantle fish n chips...

anyways, cant wait for elder system fix to kick in...

[junior nymph]

same, nesting is also being fixed so thats also a win!

[glass oak]

ive been on au 2 or au 3 servers.... mostly au3

[normal shuttle]

#general-feedback message what a nice little package. So much to unravel

Also self vote

[limber hull]

im telling you man, it's always someone with a Petit Petid's discord tag

you see what I mean now right

[normal shuttle]

I didn’t see it again

Lol yes the pattern

It’s actually insane bro

And I am shocked considering how Petits barely has any rules. The people that complain the most and are new often are “semi realism” players

Gonna give the guy a chance to defend himself

@novel ore I have a few questions about your post:

• why is elders not getting a free speed boost a bad thing?

• which playables are the only playable ones while the others are unviable?

• which mechanics would be controversial in your opinion?

[novel ore]

1.096 / 5.000
Because it makes the game unbalanced, there are no species that can survive attacks from elders, for example. That's not a realistic action, for instance. However, it benefits the favored species.

The game is limited to large dinosaurs. You can't perform well with any other medium-sized dinosaur, except for the Cerato, which was recently buffed again with another advantage, while other species don't receive any of the attention given to PvP.

Regarding mechanics, another example is the PT. While the Cerato gains more advantages, others are nerfed and reduced. PT doesn't have any change of direction, just like Dilo, and its bite speed has been reduced for some time, but on the other hand, we have a Mega Sacrificial, another dinosaur with T-Rex that has an advantage at each growth stage. Now I ask you, would you spend hours growing a dinosaur knowing that it won't have a chance of a confrontation, not even a Juvi Allo or a buffed Cerato? There's no balancing, and that makes the game completely unplayable for someone coming home from work and wanting to spend money on it. It seems like a waste of time.

I don't play on Petit Man. I play on different servers for better immersion.

[junior nymph]

in regards to cerato, its getting nerfed

[normal shuttle]

Considering I can kill ceratos or simply deny their engagement infinitely as a maia or galli, I would disagree with that feeling. This game is a survival game, so brawling isn’t all I need. In fact, game sense carries way harder than mechanics in this game. I have zero issues surviving with my mains and hitting prime elder because, while some could receive more love, I can only really consider 3 playables truly abysmal for survival.

And well, you were complaining about elder speeds being reduced, but now I’m getting the impression you think that’s a good thing because they could catch up to anyone? I don’t get to your point there if you are gonna shift it, but I would like elders to NOT be faster so weaker members of that species can survive and to not mess with balance like it happened with elder cera outrunning tenos.

Which mind you, cera has been nerfed now, and there are so many playables you can use to effectively survive because, as I said, this is not a brawling game. Cera is very strong and an extremely good generalist that should be toned down and likely will over time, but you have a myriad playable that either fight well or can escape well that aren’t apexes: beipi, galli, maia, teno, herrera, troodon, hypsi, ptera, dryo, omni, carno…I don’t know what led you to think that non large creatures cannot perform well.

This game is NOT PvP oriented. There’s more ways to deathmatch than just killing. And you should probably know what asymmetrical balancing is and how it applies to this game, because this isn’t rainbow six or marvel rivals where all characters should be able to beat others in some reliable way. There’s times where it’s going to be better to avoid a confrontation and go on living

All of it just kinda sounds like you are new and have a lot to learn about how the game works, or you’re more interested in hunting and brawling than the other aspects of survival (which is fine, but not all playables will cater to that)

[novel ore]

Please don't take this as a personal offense. That wasn't my intention. But your grandmother, for example, does she get faster over time? I don't think so. And if the game isn't just about PvP, larger species tend to need more food, and consequently you'll have to compete for food with those players or starve. So the game boils down to, at some point, engaging in combat with those species.

And yes, I need to learn more, because The Isle is a game in development that undergoes constant changes with each HT. It's impossible to know everything, but if you're an extremely skilled player who can survive even against players using hacks, that's something I can't perform.

[normal shuttle]

Don’t worry, I’m not offended lol. It’s fine to ask that to me

Sure, my grandmother got slower and so do basically all old people as their joints and musculature are not what used to be. While that is what would happen with elders and I don’t mind it to a greater extent, I do think the penalties as they get frail are excessive, and I would like larger and stronger prime elders to not be faster

And sure, when you are larger you need more PvP, but as far as I have seen that is not quite an issue since the larger carnivores can hunt just fine and also can pick their own fights like most carnivores do in nature, always going for the easiest kills

And I don’t think anyone can survive consistently against hacks. I have only come across three hackers in my whole life that I can recall and two killed me in an official a long time ago, but those are issues that aren’t tied to balancing. Mods also do huge amounts of effort banning them, but due to how Steam game bans work, there isn’t much better that can be done right now. However, I am confident that we will quit having these issues eventually

The hacker community is actually very small but they’re people who just want people to quit playing. They want people to do exactly that because they hate the game

But that tangent aside, I am not that skilled

In fact, mechanical skill barely matters

It is awareness and thinking about the implications of some choices what helps you the most in this game. Anyone with a job can hone that without being a god gamer

@half copper deino has other competitors planned, and honestly just more sea life is something I wouldn’t add because it sounds a lot more like giant ai to eat

[half copper]

oh i didnt know that

I was just thinking since they wont fix ai any time soon adding other sea creatures maybe would be better

[normal shuttle]

Many people would disagree with what I am going to say, but I think it’s good to keep deino bad and borderline unplayable right now until it gets the rework.

But yeah next HT you’re getting bary, and not too late into the future to will also be getting spino

Deino is way too harmful for the experience as it is now, better to keep their population as low as possible

[half copper]

oh okay

[novel ore]

So you agree that the game will have PvP at some point in your journey to create a dinosaur. There's no way around it. And that's the problem: there's no balancing against allo-type dinosaurs, ceratosaurs, or T-Rexes. Even Carnotaurus, which are similarly sized and have the highest speed in the game, can't handle it because certain species have too many buffs. In nature, the hunter often becomes the hunted, I think you've heard that expression before, I don't know... but in the current savanna, for example, a pride of lions, which is at the top of the food chain, can't hunt a giraffe unless it's a huge group and many are killed in the process. And avoiding confrontation isn't always an option. But, after all these observations, to make myself clearer, I'll summarize what I'm saying.

In my opinion, I believe that the balancing between the sizes of the dinosaurs should be better analyzed by the development team, aiming for the quality of the player experience. Nowadays, a Cerato, an Allo, or even a young T-Rex can defeat any other species with considerable advantages, whether in a group or not. The current buffs should be taken into consideration for other players who will need to deal with these newly implemented mechanics. A group can't hunt a Trodon because the group's mobility has been reduced. At some point, in terms of survival, you'll need to hunt someone; it's inevitable.

But, man, that's just my opinion, and I thought it was important to express it because I realized the community isn't paying attention to this, and other species have become vulnerable and impractical.

[normal shuttle]

By PvP I also include much weaker prey. Frail elders, juveniles and things that are notoriously weaker are also in the menu. Me being a carnivore that has to hunt doesn’t mean I have to fight against rexes or allos.

I feel like all of this just boils down to asymmetrical balance. Not everything is meant to be fighting everything, and also allo, cera and rex can still be killed by many other things. I am yet to see adult or elder ceras today actually ever trying to take on an adult or elder trike, or even being able to catch an adult Maia. Herbivores and most other playables simply have options to fend off opponents that are stronger

[novel ore]

Dude, if a Cerato's companion dies in combat, the Cerato gets even stronger. All this while hunting any herb, a Maia, for example.

Now, how long did it take you to cultivate an Ancient Triceratops, for example? A day's work? That's what I'm talking about.

[normal shuttle]

Maia can disengage whenever it likes tbh

And sure, body buff is a thing, but also you can defuse it super easily or just walk away from it

You can turn off body buff as a carnivore

It’s a very obscure trick

I might double check to see if it still works

[foggy field]

Just drag the corpse

And the buff on cera stops working

[normal shuttle]

Does grabbing a chunk also work? I remember it used to

And so luring a cera a few meters away while a buddy grabbed a piece immediately cut its health pool in half

[foggy field]

Only the whole corpse o reckon

[normal shuttle]

Oh

[foggy field]

Yup

But tbh since the speed nerf cerato is fine now

[normal shuttle]

Cera body buff is strong only in solo

[normal shuttle]

Is the 1.4t adult also slower for sure?

[foggy field]

Still 40

[normal shuttle]

Oh dang

[foggy field]

But it does not get to 45 anymore on prime elder

[normal shuttle]

Yeah that’s way better

[foggy field]

Frail elder gets omega slow at 30

[normal shuttle]

45kph 2t cera was super unfair for tenos

[foggy field]

Unplayable

[normal shuttle]

And dibbles too

[foggy field]

Teno speed was also nerfed, the elder one

[normal shuttle]

Crazy

[cyan tusk]

Sorry if this is the wrong room. I tried to boot up the Isle today and it told me the anti-cheat isn't installed. Do I just need to reinstall the game or do I have to get the anti cheat somewhere else?

[tawdry pine]

merci beaucoup

[cyan tusk]

Figured it out. You have to go into your game files and manually install the anti cheat. I didn't have to do that in the OG install but ok.

[glass oak]

Hey hey, elder system fix out already by any chance ?

[eternal crag]

BUFF ALLO THEY SHOULD BE 2ND APEX PREDATOR HERBIVORE PLAYERS SHOULD NOT BE AS OP AS THEY ARE

[wooden agate]

lol

[normal shuttle]

Poe’s Law is hitting hard with this one

It’s genuinely a struggle to tell whether this is a mind numbingly stupid (yet honest) take or simply a deliberate caricature

[eternal crag]

It’s the take everyone is thinking but nobody will say

I’m doing everyone a favor. Herbivores are the most zero skill braindead easy strat in the game and are boring

[normal shuttle]

https://tenor.com/view/laugh-out-loud-laugh-ridiculous-hilarious-lolz-gif-17376550074772904877

That’s so good bro

What killed this time? What was the straw that broke the camel’s back? A fg trike killing your sub allo but dying to the megapack anyway?

[eternal crag]

Full grown allo 1 shotted by trike

[delicate wadi]

I bet bro tried to pounce on its face

[normal shuttle]

Have you considered that maybe it is a skill issue?

I know it’s not the most constructive thing, but seeing how so many herbivores have a negative pick rate and some are way harder than basically any carnivore will ever be both in terms of skill floor and skill cap…Maybe it’s just that the anger is not truly rational or founded on anything real

[normal shuttle]

Bro, what did you expect?!

It’s a creature 6 tons heavier than you and probably just knocked you over and you of course lost the trade catastrophically. Allos shouldn’t be thinking trikes are an easy target

[eternal crag]

Jesus see this is why the game will never blow up…. Absolutely zero thought process just straight to skill issue

[delicate wadi]

A solo allo vs. a solo trike is not an easy kill, if you went in thinking you'd have an easy time then yeah... it is kind of a skill issue. You had a bad sense of the matchup and bit off more than you could chew, or at least that's what it sounds like

[normal shuttle]

Why are you blaming the community as if we didn’t care about balance? Many regulars (including myself) like to offer accurate feedback to improve the state of the game and there are many changes that have been added thanks to that. I just disagree with your statement, because the reasoning is faulty

You are literally here complaining that an adult (if not on the way to elder) trike killed your allo as if you were any meant to be trading with apexes at all. You know…Rex, deino, acro, spino, giga, stego, anky, cama, trike and shant are all creatures that either already can or most likely will be able to one tap a full grown or even elder allo, because they simply are not in the same league. You’re at an overwhelming disadvantage, and so you should not be making mistakes or considering them your first option to kill. Is the trike really op for growing throughout 12 hours and killing something that is a rat in comparison after it made a mistake, or is it that maybe allosaurus is not meant to be an apex carnivore tanking hits from the largest creatures in the roster?

[eternal crag]

but 1 shotting??????????????

[normal shuttle]

I’m sorry you had to learn the lesson that way and lose those hours in an unsatisfactory way, but this feedback is going nowhere if it does not present anything other than (and I mean this without offense) rage posting and also accusing all herbivores of being op because an apex killed something far smaller than itself

[eternal crag]

it wasnt smaller im not too sure what % the trike was but it was smaller than me

[normal shuttle]

By what you are telling me, you got hit by the highest commitment, slowest attack trike has that has to be done while stationary, and either got hit in the head or you were first knocked over

[pliant elm]

That's a lie, Cerato is still in the game

[normal shuttle]

Cera, dilo, deino

The three horsemen of low skill floor, low skill cap playables

We will get a fourth eventually

[delicate wadi]

Dilo only if its clones are working xD

[normal shuttle]

I know, but dilo’s kit pretty much forces you to rely on that or else you’re barely hunting anything

[eternal crag]

so even a trike smaller than me can 1 shot a full grown allo and thats balanced is what ur saying

[normal shuttle]

It sure wasn’t smaller because the numbers don’t add up

And also, were you knocked over first?

[pliant elm]

Dilo should have received a rework a long time ago...

[eternal crag]

it 100% without question was

[normal shuttle]

Maybe in terms of height or length, but certainly not weight

[icy lion]

Smaller doesn't mean lighter

Trike's dense

[normal shuttle]

Yep

[eternal crag]

dude i swear to you it was not bigger in any way not size not weight if i had to guess thing was MAYBE like 30%

[delicate wadi]

If you're saying a freshspawn trike nuked your allo then there's a nonzero chance it was a cheater, but that still has nothing to do with the actual balance of herbis in the game

[normal shuttle]

Can you tell me what happened so we can infer it? Were you knocked over first and then thrashed or not?

[delicate wadi]

But when you open your complaint with "a trike oneshot my allo" and no additional context, it makes you sound like you have no idea what you're talking about

[normal shuttle]

I feel like even a 4-5 ton trike with knockdown+thrash to the head could kill a fg allo

That’s probably like 3k damage right there easily

[eternal crag]

no not knocked over, baited an attack then ran behind and bit, then trike left clicked while i was behind, and 1 shot killed me somehow. no knockdown, no thrash, nothing, just dead

[normal shuttle]

No thrash?

[eternal crag]

im newish but not a complete dunce

[normal shuttle]

Didn’t it hit the ground with its horns?

If it did, then I know what happened

[delicate wadi]

Could be desync, but if it happened as he describes then it kinda sounds like cheats. Which would be bad if true, but doesn't represent a balance problem re: how herbis are designed overall

[normal shuttle]

Desync but also something else

Trike’s thrash (downward attack) hitbox also seems to be a little larger from behind, in a way that it extends behind the forelimbs

So he probably ate the whole thing right in the head because of the extended hitbox plus latency and died

@eternal crag if anything that would be a good reason to ask for a hitbox tweak, but not make allo an apex and accuse all herbivores of being op and no skill

[eternal crag]

hitbox maybe either way herbis are op respectfully

[normal shuttle]

So even with your reason out of the way, herbis are op regardless?

I mean, have you played hypsi, pachy, dryo, maia or dibble at all in the HT?

[eternal crag]

ridiculous, hours down the drain instantly from someone pressing left click

[normal shuttle]

Teno is valid too

Also stego lol, and frankly trike as well is tricky

[eternal crag]

ive played every dino herbivore is so easy its actually unbelievable

[normal shuttle]

The same could be said if a rex had crushed you or you were grabbed by a deino. Does that make all carnivores op and no skill?

[eternal crag]

no, it makes rex and deino op!! buff allo!!!!!!!!

[normal shuttle]

You’ve fought with them? Like with Maia for example (keep bringing it up because it’s my main)

[normal shuttle]

Insane logic

Trike kills allo in one thrash = all herbis op and buff allo

Deino/Rex kill allo with their abilities = only them are op and buff allo

if this is ragebait, say it already

And this begs the question: why do you think allo should be taking the strongest hits from some of the largest apexes in the whole planned roster in the first place?

[eternal crag]

it shouldnt be 1 tap is what im saying that is not fun or engaging and it just wastes hours

[delicate wadi]

Then it shouldn't be 1tap for deino to kill anything either. But it is.

[normal shuttle]

You know you could also simply not fight them if you are alone or not confident in your skill, right?

[eternal crag]

this is ragebait but everything else im serious

[normal shuttle]

I am still yet to see anyone upset that carno one shots troodon

“Buff troodon, carno op, it wasted my time with one click”

[eternal crag]

pt should get a 1 tap ability then too where he divebombs ur head and you die no matter how big you are

[delicate wadi]

This. Also, when I play in carni packs, 70% of deaths are packmates rushing in to burst damage and eating attacks to the face instead of baiting & punishing, maintaining pressure, and keeping a safe distance until a hit is guaranteed. Allo's bleed nerf means you can no longer nuke everything you sneeze at, so having to actually use one's brain cells seems like a great injustice.

Also, if skilled troos can duo or trio a trike, a half-decent allo can certainly do so as well. 🤷‍♂️

[eternal crag]

did you not read

i was outplaying the trike with "skill" and then got 1 shot by a 30% trike to stupid hitboxes or lag or desync or whatever tf

[limber hull]

how would you even buff allo? it already has insane bleed, great DPS, a grapple/pin option, a decent weight/healthpool, good standing agility, good alt attacks

like it is a pretty all-round great animal on top of its excellent bleed, it's one of the best things to run if you want something dead

[normal shuttle]

For real

Asking to buff the best carnivore in the game right now is madness

All because uh oh, 5t trike one tapped me

[limber hull]

i genuinely can't imagine a 30% trike somehow instantly killing your adult allo by fluke

there seems to be a lot more at play here that you're either not saying, or you're exaggerating to make your point seem more valid

[normal shuttle]

He just made a conjecture of growth, ignoring the growth curve trike suffers

[delicate wadi]

And I said it before: lag or desync has nothing to do with herbi balance. Now you know where the hitbox actually lands, and will keep a wider berth in the future. I have learned this many times over with troo and carno's hitbox; I have learned that it is bigger than it looks, and adjusted accordingly 🤷‍♂️ You live and learn, that's the game

[eternal crag]

i swear to you bro thats why im so ticked off about it. thats the entire story i swear on everything

[normal shuttle]

Also you missed the best part, wave.

Agrees it was a hitbox issue, still thinks that herbis are op while ignoring things like maia or dibble pvp #general-feedback-discussion message

[limber hull]

triceratops only reaches a state where it's notably lethal to an allo at around sub adult, where it'd be around 3-4 tons and have an actually meaningful thrash

[eternal crag]

cheats maybe???? he did no special attack. just left click like i said

he was like 30%

[normal shuttle]

He didn’t do the horns to the ground thing?

[limber hull]

i haven't seen those cheats at all as of late so if they've returned, it's weird to think the cheaters went to trike first

[eternal crag]

no bruh he did not

[normal shuttle]

That’s really weird

Maybe could be a bizarre cheater but I would be surprised you didn’t die in the first attack if there were range hacks

Which makes it really hard to judge this whole thing because it could either be a stranger trying to twist the situation to make something look more valid, some mistake describing this whole thing, or a very peculiar cheater

Either way, can you provide us with what would be your ideal buffs to allo and how are herbivores op and no skill with precise examples and cases barring this one?

[eternal crag]

😭 dude i swear im not twisting anything holy

[normal shuttle]

I can’t know that, but if it helps, I don’t think you’re arguing in bad faith

I personally am not inclined to believe the earlier

[delicate wadi]

You're allowed to be frustrated, but I think it's also important to recognize that your in-the-moment frustration doesn't necessarily translate to remotely good game design suggestions

[eternal crag]

yeah sure more health for allo like 10%, increase sprint speed like 10%, and then nerf stamina usage while pouncing/pin

last parts confusing... i mean make allos use more stamina while pouncing, so nerf

[wooden agate]

it really does not need any of that lol

[delicate wadi]

That's not too bad, though it has very little to do with your situation, and also allo is still the best carnivore in the game by a long shot (maybe cera is better now post-bleed nerf? I haven't tried it yet), so I don't know why it would need those stat buffs

A trot speed buff would be nice tho, and I endorse the increased stamina cost for pinning/pouncing

[wooden agate]

it mostly needs thresh holds for grapple to be changed from cringe omni values

[eternal crag]

i think allos biggest thing is it should feel a bit more nimble and quick than it does right now

[limber hull]

it genuinely does not need that at all, that would make it pretty insane

both higher weight and speed are nuts

[eternal crag]

is health tied directly to weight?

[limber hull]

yes

[wooden agate]

yes

[eternal crag]

ah ok

[limber hull]

weight = heath across the board

[delicate wadi]

It's one of the larger mid-tier carnivores in the game right now, if you want to be more nimble, play a smaller animal

[covert fiber]

what unofficial server is most like official but w actual admin/mod support for cheaters?

[normal shuttle]

Okay those buffs would essentially lead then to a 2.75 ton allo with a 38.5kph speed if memory serves me well with allo adult stats, which, even if they weren’t problematic for the rest of the roster, solve NONE of your complaints

Rex, deino, trike and many to come would still one tap it

[limber hull]

lmao true

it takes a lot to beat trike's breakpoint in health

[normal shuttle]

If this guy really wants allo to not get effortlessly gored to death, we would need to go full paleo meme and resurrect saurophaganax

And honestly

I don’t think an adult allo (let alone elder) with 5k health would be any healthy for the game

[limber hull]

You reckon? Lmao

Even a 5k allo would still get knocked down and thrashed to death too tho lmao

[normal shuttle]

We already have a surprising shortage of mid tiers in the 2-4 ton range, no need to take allo away

[normal shuttle]

Crazy

And well yes, I was mostly accounting for maybe like a body thrash

7-8 ton allo would be mental illness beyond any hope

Call me crazy, but maybe allo shouldn’t be solo brawling adult trikes or rexes and treat them like their usual meal instead of like

You know…maia, cera, teno, carno…

All much less risky and some getting one tapped by an allo that ambushes them

[glad arrow]

why is us 3 broken????

[foggy field]

Current allo elder size is more them enought

4tons is plenty to go by

[fast terrace]

#general-feedback message

this is the feedback of all time

imagine 100%ing the isle

[cinder anchor]

i really cant be the only one who wants better performance

please tell me im not the only one

people spend like 4k dollars on nasa pcs so no wonder why people get 200 fps

[delicate wadi]

@frozen heron #general-feedback message
I agree with all except I think "normal" adult should still be a thing. Most dinosaurs ought to keep their adult stats, while specific actions result in frail or prime to punish or reward certain types of play. But having guaranteed automatic frail feels like punishment for survival, especially on smaller/faster growing species that struggle to achieve current prime criteria

[frozen heron]

They've acknowledged small creatures having a hard time with the elder system, i guess it's a wait and see thing for what they'll do about it

If we had the ability to keep normal adults, going into frail would probably need a high reward. Just getting to entomb isn't enough

[cunning crown]

@frozen heron the problem is:
Frail Elders suck, they really do.
I think there's no sane person who would be ok with it over prime.
Prime should be as frequent as good players on the servers, right now you get the bad elder just because you miss stupid pointless stuff like 1 PZ or you get infertile once for 10 seconds.
Frail are so bad, imo, only afkers or static players that never leaves the good classic spot should get, no point in punishing a player for missing 1 PZ or stuff like this.
Give Prime just to people which actually play the game "for good".
If you travel a lot, if you get perfect diet multiple times of for x minutes, if you kill other players, if you nest, if you kill organs.
That stuff should all matter, not just a stupid checklist with "visit X patrol zones or get the bad dinosaur and die".

[limber hull]

i just think you should be locked at 75% grown for a good amount of time, then become elder

[delicate wadi]

100%; make frail punishment for being AFK or something like that, not the default outcome

[tired quest]

well deino wait in an area for most of its life.
means once you reach adult every second we spend means you are wasting your stat, resulting only to log in and check if there is any player in that area then quick log out.
or even worse, forming mixpack relying alt account or your friend to tell you where ppl at then log on to your big boi to get them

moving to populated area just doesn't fit with deino's gameplay
when you have to risk crawling on land for 10-20 mins to other waterbodies and find out they are not there

[delicate wadi]

I played deino the other day and had a grand time traveling down from north lake to riverdelta to swamps; it's doable. But even if you don't make a big trek like that, remaining in one area =/= being AFK.

Re: this #general-feedback message

I agree that the new water shader, while beautiful, looks a bit odd, especially in rivers and swamps. It looks better for bigger lakes, etc. but some kind of middle ground between the mud brown and neon blue would be ideal imo.

Also, please fix the underwater shader so beipi and deino can see.

[tired quest]

yeah north to south are ez but going to the west or east is a gamble
deino gameplay are just starving simulator from hatchling to prime elder, guess we will have to wait until next year since they are now focusing on other stuff and cheater running around deleting ppl's progress in the game

[glass oak]

Hi guys, has the elder system been fixed already ? Pls reply if you know. Thanks 🙏👍

[tired quest]

depend on what kind of fix you are asking

[glass oak]

Is it possible to get to prime now ? @tired quest

[tired quest]

no

[glass oak]

Damn… why’s the fix taking so long.

[limber hull]

@white plover #general-feedback message

Humans won't be encouraged to hunt, nor designed around the idea of hunting dinosaurs

Generation 1 tribal humans, maybe, but I doubt they really understand how tanning works given that they're horrible freakish orc men, they'd probably just eat the dinos

[white plover]

Unless they're naked horrible freakish orc men I don't see why they'd be uneducated on how to tan leathers like most tribal humans do!

[limber hull]

they're making naked horrible freakish orc men

see examples provided

[white plover]

wow i can't believe naked horrible freakish orc men are gonna be roaming my dinosaur game
man
i was like 25% hopeful that it might be a semi-respectful representation of native humanity but I see now that having any expectations on the internet is a fool's arrand LMFAO

[limber hull]

there's a pretty good reason they aren't making a respectful representation of native humanity

[white plover]

imagine me resting my chin on my hands I'm not actually disappointed I'm genuinely extremely interested in the lore reason

[limber hull]

because said representation would get absolutely obliterated within a few days of existing on the island

they USED to be ye old pocahantas style native looking stereotype, but thankfully they did away with that

[white plover]

ARE THEY MUTANTS

[limber hull]

also yes, the lore reason is they messed up BIGTIME trying to make humans the first batch

these are generation 1, and they were meant to be human, but clearly didn't come out right

generation 2, the modern guys, are the successful version

they're technically not mutants, they were always like this, just a failed copy of humanity

[white plover]

I see...!
It's giving The Forest honestly. I still think skinning for color would be super sick but ngl that sounds like a nightmare to code and just imagine running into this thing in the dead of night omg.

[limber hull]

it is very much like the forest, and i really like the concept of having to deal with both horrible dinosaur monsters on top of forest cannibals as a hapless, regular guy

[white plover]

Imagining one of these freaks crashing through a field with like three raptors on him brings me a lot of glee yeah

[limber hull]

i doubt he'd be standing after the first raptor, but yea lol

he's still a human, he's bigger and taller than your standard human, but not like, giant

also he can climb trees, that's confirmed

[white plover]

freak2herra communication

this has been super enlightening thank you for taking the time to tag me here holy heck

[limber hull]

all good lol

[latent olive]

another person on the generation 1 hype train

[glacial kestrel]

I’m not stupid for thinking this eh?

Seems more than reasonable

[frank notch]

I would say at the bare minimum schooling fish should be added onto it.

Deinosuchus should be difficult to grow. And it is, if you get it to elder it's gonna be a monster. Might dwindle the over population of larger carnivores. (Allo and reds overpopulate the lands. Mz's can't be reset as frequently because herbivores are killed too quickly, meaning plants remain).

Even if all ai was given to deino. It likely would only slow the gradual starvation of deinos.

Unless the deino has incredible luck and the ai swims into their maw.

(It's a skill issue on my side for not being able to grow a deino. Or rex and Allo. I'm a herbi main regardless, some deinos increase my enjoyment due to the jumpscare factor or letting my baby hypsi live out of pity.)

Deino takes skill to land the lunge, therefore If they grab and drown me- yeah I'm sad about my Dino dying. But I could of done more to avoid it.
On the other hand pinning from rexes and allos take no skill... It's just... unfun? Due to no counterplay...

[delicate wadi]

I haven't gotten to 100% this hordetest, but I grew one to 70% purely on schooling fish, elite fish, deer, and boar :O Some AIs will become diets if you allow them to rot, for example schooling fish becomes carbs when rotten. Sea turtles are lipids I think? Not sure if any are protein off the top of my head though

[limber hull]

i'll be real, i'd rather add all playables than all AI to deino's diet

deino is inherently opportunistic and relies on waiting for things to come drink

[frank notch]

Ngl that would make more sense.

All dinos should be on its diet, but not all ai.

[latent olive]

god if only i could sustain myself long enough to catch the stray juvenile rex as a 6 ton deino

[delicate wadi]

Yeah unless they program AIs to "drink" and not spidey sense you when you're fully hidden underwater -- opportunistic deino makes sense in theory but it can be hard to keep one alive in low-pop servers. I got lucky with fish spawns and dumb AI stuck on rocks to feed my big boy, but it's not reliable

[latent olive]

actually the AI dont notice you underwater

i remember sitting on the edge of the bank as a deino when a boar wandered infront of me, i grabbed it with RMB

[frank notch]

That's the issue. In Ht you can't predict things will work in your favor.

[latent olive]

theyre really good at hearing though so maybe movement is easy for them to detect

[delicate wadi]

Boars seem less skittish, but deer are gone gone from a long distance away it seems

[limber hull]

the fact that rex has slower hunger drain than deino is sad

[delicate wadi]

Yuhh it's a little ridiculous imo

[frank notch]

I think it should be swapped.

Crocadilians and some camens can go for near a year without eating If they preserve their energy.

It doesn't make sense for such a short hunger timer.

[limber hull]

deino has a long hunger time, i just think it should have the LONGEST hunger time

[frank notch]

That's what I mean.

[delicate wadi]

It definitely ought to be longer than rex, who's moving around constantly and roaming instead of ambushing from water. If deino is chilling and waiting for his chance, then he should use less food energy

[frank notch]

Mhm

Dryo still needs a buff man, and additional dash charge or increase the distance it moves with its dash. It hasn't got anything done to it in a long while.

[normal shuttle]

I also think deino should have way longer hunger time than rex both now and after a rework

But honestly as I have many times, I’d rather keep it terrible for now

I don’t like deino in the ecosystem

[tired quest]

The core problem lies in how the fish AI functions in this game.
The larger or deeper the body of water is, the less food you’re able to find. You end up swimming through shallow rivers just to cover more area and hope something appears, or camping beside a tiny pond because it’s the only place that reliably triggers fish spawns and players will visit

[normal shuttle]

No, the core problem is Deinosuchus

Almost all of it

It is coinflip: the playable

Young ones cannot hunt players most of the time and rely on luck through AI

They can’t escape or fight larger crocs in any way so they rely on luck as they grow or to avoid canni pairs

It has zero agency over what it can snatch due to safe spots, and thus it relies on luck to have an overly confident player who wants to gamble for their life

Due to the swallow water animation and and how water textures and transparency work in this game, if you are not cheesing the crocs then you are gambling and rely on luck to not die instantly

When you’re large and can’t eat just elite fish, you gotta move to hotspots that need large amounts of walking and traveling, just to maybe end up in a death trap with more deinos there that decide to gang up on you, thus relying on luck there too

You have so little agency over your own life as a deino, and it sucks

But you also can’t buff it without a rework because it is unfair and uninteresting for everyone else

[tired quest]

before the elder patch hits and fish spawn normally, I raised countless adult deino on different servers.
each elite fish gives 2-5% of food , with mutation slower the drain and actively patrolling along the central river, I was able to keep my deino fed (or atleast maintain around 50 %) and looking for careless player or tenoto herds.
the ai is rewarding if a solo deino willing to go back and forth between delta to the fork plain river, while most of the other deino were at south plains or west rail pond.

Then it all turned into a dumpster fire, broken ai for over 6 months , disconnect if you press right click to lundge, cheater roaming acroess server...

[normal shuttle]

AI is not the problem with deino

[tired quest]

well you can't ask them to alter the map

and with all the safe spot they keep adding I think asking for reason amount ai is the way to go

and future playable bary /spino will def need it

[normal shuttle]

I don’t need to ask them to rework deino, because they already plan on doing it

That’s all it needs to maybe be a decent, bearable playable with matchup variety

#general-feedback message literally everything about deino besides appearance is wrong 🥀

You can rework deino in a way it doesn’t suffer as hard with the map

Instead of making the map more friendly to the current deino so people end up concentrating in the place with more face spots because gambling for your dinosaur’s life is ass

As unfair as it remains for the prey, you can’t simply encourage players to die to an undetectable threat

[dusky swift]

How is Deino supposed to survive with Rex, Trike and Allo on the map?

He needs the water

[normal shuttle]

I don’t want this to sound mean

You see, there’s this really cool molecule named water, H2O, which is featured in the game and in large amounts is a medium much denser than air, where land creatures tend to be far slower, whereas deino can thrive there by being quicker and also diving

It has enough water, but, while some minor changes could be added, you absolutely cannot just make spiro 2.0 in the sense that the map caters to a deino that mechanically is just gambling for your opponents

[dusky swift]

Honestly, don't be afraid of Deino in water.

There are so many safe drinking water sources and crossings.

[normal shuttle]

And it also solves nothing about deino early game being luck based in terms of food either AI (as their abysmal speed and grab ratio disallows them from hunting pretty much anything) and also depending on the compassion of larger deinos

[normal shuttle]

And that’s another problem

I am not afraid of deinos because I can cheese them in a way that they can’t do anything about it. And then, even if there weren’t safe spots that completely counter them without effort, it isn’t scary to simply gamble with your dinosaur that took you a while to grow. There’s no tension, just luck involved.

And it is lame because every other ambusher both isn’t effortlessly exploited by one simple maneuver, nor are they undetectable, one tap menace for others (and therefore are fair despite not being as easy to counter)

Rex and Herrera get this perfectly, so why can’t deino abide by the same basic rules of game design?

[dusky swift]

In what way are Allo's and Rex's Pin and Hera's jump better?

Pin is also just a matter of pressing a button to win, while Hera can attack you and climb away from where you can't reach.
It's no different than a dinosaur going back into the water, if not worse, since it can actively walk onto land and attack again while you can't do anything.
His size is the only thing that makes it less difficult in comparison.

[normal shuttle]

I am fine with some one shots. I’m not gonna complain about deino one tapping an allo

However, the thing with allo, herra and rex (which is the point that was missed) is that you can see them before they get to use their abilities. You can actually make use of your awareness and senses to do something before they’re in range to annihilate you.

Deino on the other hand? You can’t see nor hear it as the guy just sprints in your direction and right clicks before you can do anything in many water textures, whereas in some you might be able to narrowly escape if you can jump as soon as it approaches. And the counterplay to this is something that is not engaging for any party involved: it’s just exploring design flaws Deino has to leave it without any options unless the player is clueless and doesn’t account for deinos in the water

[limber hull]

@sonic jolt it already is on troo diet tho?

unless they removed it and i didnt notice lol

[junior nymph]

@blissful oasis nah no need to work on grass when we getting this

[blissful oasis]

oh wow thats like exsacly what i said. i feel so cool now and a bit dumb

[junior nymph]

theres some tall bits

[blissful oasis]

whats the render distance on that tho? cuz it looks really REALLY good so itll prolly cause some performace problems no?

[junior nymph]

but it looks like the best grass we have got, (hopefully no performance impacts happen)

[blissful oasis]

by FAR looks like a blender anim

[blissful oasis]

the render distance is really low still ;(

[junior nymph]

i mean they cant get it too far, and thats always been the render distance for every grass in the game, infact I think thats really a super long distanc

[blissful oasis]

when it cuts off like that i makes it look so cheap tho, is there a way to solve it? like ever?

[junior nymph]

its just more noticable due to the actual colour of the ground

[blissful oasis]

good point, do you think they will change the ground rexture to?

[junior nymph]

they have been changing it, best wayh I see it blending is if they just sue the grass colour and slap it to the ground texture, but that also looks off

[blissful oasis]

take a photo of the grass from above with no variables like light, then plaster that on if the grass is out of render distance?

[junior nymph]

yea

[blissful oasis]

i love you man

[junior nymph]

everyone loves me

[stoic vault]

its not confirmed I think

[junior nymph]

i think it is

we will get it between now and then

[stoic vault]

I think Dondi had said it was just a test for him, nothing more

[junior nymph]

he actually said grass isnt something we should be worried about

[stoic vault]

I feel that grass would be fine, but with a combination of tall grass; I quite like the grass we currently have

[junior nymph]

I used to like the grass we had

back when it was more dense

now its spindily and feels off

[stoic vault]

I feel it's not as realistic as the one we have

[stoic vault]

I would like a combination of the long grass with this new grass, because otherwise it will be difficult to camouflage myself in the new grass.

[junior nymph]

i liked when the grass used to look like this

but alas, that had performance issues, giving us what we have

[urban flax]

It looks very bad tho

[junior nymph]

eh

[stoic vault]

that look so good

[stoic vault]

I hope they combine the long grass with this new lawn

[urban flax]

There's too many stark shadows, which makes it look plastic

[cunning crown]

@tame jetty This feels right

[icy lion]

@sinful zenith It's planned

[sinful zenith]

pl

[normal shuttle]

This is all official

There’s more obviously

That last screenshot makes me wonder what will Ovi get 🤔

Out of that whole list, it’s probably the playable that we all saw closer in the early days of evrima, but at the same time we got no clue

[vagrant trench]

does anyone know if you need to get all conditions for prime elder in a single run without logging off?
like, does the game remember all the milestones I already achieved when I come back?

[blissful oasis]

#general-feedback message thats excacly what i meant, where u get this photo?

[tame jetty]

Right? It makes zo much more sense...
Why are devs even punishing normal playing players with frail..

[cunning crown]

They are still testing things, I think it’s all still heavily wip once they figure out it doesn’t feel good to be a 39kmh raptor while being an active player they are gonna smooth out things

[tame jetty]

Hopefully ye

[harsh sun]

Does anyone know why the ground textures look so awful now? What happened to the ground textures that we had before trike released?

[pliant elm]

One step forward and five steps back. That's how every update is, Unfortunately

[harsh sun]

💔

The game used to look like this

[delicate wadi]

The current bloom from the sun makes me feel like I need to clean my glasses ngl. The game can definitely be gorgeous even now, but I feel like it's so dark that you need NV on even during the day, which washes out the colors and removes contrast

[delicate wadi]

That said, when you actually can see, the game is still beautiful -- but I think it definitely shines at sunrise/sunset

[wooden agate]

@muted burrow pretty much all the old main maps are available to play

one of them, spiro, has quite literally 0 players

V3/Thenyaw are the maps on Legacy and afaik, barely any servers use Thenyaw. V3 just... has more of the same things you have issue with

speaking of spiro i always find it funny how many people scream and holler about wanting it back, wanting the old stam system, wanting deino to be 'back in its prime', want 1800kg carno back, etc and then just... dont

youd think eventually someone would throw up an unofficial on spiro

[limber hull]

yea because reminiscing/looking at Spiro is not the same as playing on it

playing on it makes you quick to realise how garbage it is

@muted burrow also i can tell you now, i've been playing with new players as of late and Gateway being an actual map with actual mechanics and environments to engage with is much better than Spiro's bloodbowl

if you think spiro is better, that's probably because you've never played on it. Trust older players when they tell you they do NOT want that map back

[junior nymph]

@inland vigil press g to let go of the corpse

[indigo notch]

@inland vigil

#general-feedback message

if you press G the dibble will let go of the body if it’s stuck in its horns

[inland vigil]

that's not an intuitive solution

[junior nymph]

I mean it makes sense

its like dropping a corpse

[inland vigil]

no thanks. need a click to dislodge it

[limber hull]

you're right, but it is a solution nonetheless

[inland vigil]

if i'm fighting i'm not going to want to hit g

edited my feedback tho thanks

[junior nymph]

it would be better if it was just a lmb to let go

[wooden agate]

g is universally grab/drop in this game

it could use a pop up like eating/drinking though

[fast terrace]

a lot more things in this game needs prompts icl

[wind mesa]

do agree that an attack should dislodge the body. I dont want to have to worry about pressing g when im watching allos around me. it's a small thing but it makes a difference

[delicate wadi]

Also: re the map feeling claustrophobic/like a maze etc. I wonder if this warrants the implementation of even a rudimentary ingame navigation system. Obviously we have the compass, and experienced players know landmarks and spawn points; I've memorized where to go from each spawn of my favorite playables -- but new players might have "quit moments" if they don't know where to go and are unaware of third-party map tools.

I'm assuming that a full map of the entire island is out of the question, but it could be useful to include landmarks on the compass ("magnetic disruptions?") or allow players to put down scent-mark waypoints to help orient themselves.

[queen reef]

Please change the developers.

[hexed copper]

agree

[harsh bison]

.

[glass oak]

Hi guys , is it now possible to reach prime again yet ? Anyone knows? Thanks yea

[junior nymph]

It is fixed I think now

[glass oak]

Thanks mate

[barren zephyr]

#general-feedback message Troo is basically a compy, just no one plays it because they're slow as hell and starve in like 6 minutes after spawn unless they're lucky enough to find another players kill.

Edit: So, what I'm saying is they need to buff troo and it could fill the compy role by scavanging and being eaten, etc.

[delicate wadi]

Also don't forget that they're sickened by rotten meat, so they suck at scavenging too

[limber hull]

i know a good few people who play troo, including myself, and honestly im kinda sick of people treating it like it's "just a glorified compy" because it really isn't

best stam of any carnivore, best agility of any carnivore, best trot of any carnivore, extremely cheap cost for pounce, incredible damage potential, good swim speed, extremely stealthy, has literally every AI besides boar on its diet, etc

yet people only focus on the fact that it spawns small, as if a single small AI won't entirely sustain it until it reaches a far greater growth

[delicate wadi]

It's a PITA because it's so slow and weak as a fresh spawn that most AI can either curbstomp it or simply run away from it. I love troo -- it's my favorite carni contigent on being able to move more than 12 km/h

[barren zephyr]

I love troo. It's one of my favorites to play. What I was getting at is it's silly they have to add small dinos like compy when troo exists and should be able to play the role in the ecosystem.

What legally said.

I was maining troo until they nerfed it.

[limber hull]

i'll be real, troodon has gotten way more buffs than nerfs

[barren zephyr]

Yeah, but its current nerf is horrible.

[limber hull]

namely its buffs to venom, stam, diet variety, etc

[barren zephyr]

It makes absolutely no sense why it's so slow when it does insanely low damage.

[delicate wadi]

If you can survive the juvi starvation bottleneck you're golden -- which I suppose is true of all carnivores, but troo gets hit particularly hard

[barren zephyr]

And it starves so fast. Meanwhile apex babies like allo and rex can last for what feels like forever as a fresh spawn before they starve AND they can still kill almost anything around their size.

I can't see the logic.

[limber hull]

there is actually a reason for it

it's BECAUSE they remain at that starting weight for so long

Troodon starts gaining a lot of weight IMMEDIATELY on spawn

[barren zephyr]

Make it make sense though.

[limber hull]

It does make sense tho

[barren zephyr]

It doesn't.

[limber hull]

Like, it makes sense given the rules of the game

[barren zephyr]

Give me one good reason why troo must be slow.

[limber hull]

As you gain weight, your stomach grows with you, not the amount of food in it

[barren zephyr]

So what?

[limber hull]

So as you grow, you hunger faster

[icy lion]

Putting on weight increases the max stomach size which makes it look like your hunger is rapidly draining

[delicate wadi]

It makes sense on a systems level, yes, but it still sucks because baby troo spawns in a state where it's incapable of running down an AI chicken

[barren zephyr]

It's a game though.

[limber hull]

I don't see what that has to do with anything

[barren zephyr]

They could adjust it for each dinosaur.

[pliant elm]

The biggest problem isn't being small, but rather being one of the slowest juvs and, consequently, having one of the most difficult juv phases

[limber hull]

They can adjust growth curves I guess, but this rule would remain the same

You can't adjust the fact that stomachs grow with weight, that's just a thing that is

[barren zephyr]

Just like they need to adjust the elder system for small dinosaurs too.

One thing doesn't fit all.

[delicate wadi]

This. If troo is going to starve fast, at least let it be fast. Nobody is complaining about how weight gain correlates to hunger drain, we're complaining about how troo is uniquely ill-equipped as a juvi to meet its hunger needs

[limber hull]

In this case, I genuinely don't know how you would make it work any other way

[barren zephyr]

Make it faster so it can find food.

[pliant elm]

They just need to make the Troodon Juv run at 25-39 km/h. That would solve it

[limber hull]

Elder, sure, I can see having different elder pre-requisites for smaller creatures

[pliant elm]

Maia has this problem too, but not so much because it's a herb

[barren zephyr]

I would rather be faster and wait longer for venom again then be slow and die 10 times trying to make it to a location where there's food not being guarded.

[pliant elm]

Maia, being a creature that relies on speed to survive, is now slower than a Cerato until it reaches 60% growth. It's ridiculous xd

Dondi and his wonderful decisions

[barren zephyr]

Things that are weak should be fast, things that are strong should be slow.

[delicate wadi]

My hot take is that troo should get a unique "foraging" or tracking mechanic where it can dig up a compy AI just like galli does. More effort than galli to correspond to increased food value for a smaller animal, with diminishing returns as it reaches adulthood that make it more worthwhile to hunt larger prey (also for varied diets).

[barren zephyr]

I think that idea makes sense.

If they're keeping the speed slow.

[delicate wadi]

Yes nodnod

[barren zephyr]

Cera is just op in general.

[limber hull]

maia has it worse imho

i played both, maia's is REALLY bad