general-feedback-discussion

[rustic gale]

A pack of good Omniraptors would probably be able to take it down but too early to say when we don’t know what iteration of the Rex they will go with

[icy urchin]

Or maybe make a point system u build up overtime so people can play rex on officials, then it would be more (rare) to encounter such a beast.

[barren crater]

They haven't even population controlled any of the other carnivores, so I'd hope they wouldn't put it on officials until they find a good fix

[barren crater]

Assuming the rex is solo and is in an ideal place for them to hunt, but maybe

[crisp topaz]

I think population control on the roster is too early. It's been ongoing since the beginning and doesn't accomplish anything but indecision. They were trying to population control 3 carnivores and it never works until you add more playables. Once the new and shiny toy isn't new and shiny anymore, people move on. When you have little to no options, obviously everyone and their brother is going to be a carno or Omni.

The same will be said for rex. It's going to be massively popular and then eventually it'll die out as people gain more options. Seeing 50 Rex's is no different than seeing 50 omnis or 50 carnos running around center lol.

But that all changed when they added more playables.

[urban flax]

That's not a good example
Am I the only person on earth with a weak spot ?
Are you the only person on earth who can kick ?

[icy urchin]

All heavy weights should be able to hurt Rex's leg, if u don't have speed u gonna have power, that is law of nature.

[barren crater]

If Rex is completely superior and able to actually pack up / cannibalise then it's over. Much better to see how it works on unofficials and tweak it. If it works, then good. Add it to officials.

[icy urchin]

👍

[barren crater]

But even then, I'd wait for more mid tiers *

[urban flax]

Never argued against that
What I was talking about was mechanics or interactions specially for one playable against one set playable

If you want to make stego able to fracture rex's leg, then give stego's tail jab fracture damage, and deal with the consequences on the other playables.

[icy urchin]

@urban flax In my opinion this doesnt have to be Stego only by design, it can be any slow dinosaur who has a tail swipe attack.

if its heavy enough

[crisp topaz]

Kissen has not once said that if rex balance is good they'll bring it to official straight away. Just going off of the comments she's made, they're developing rex for community servers to do with what they please and then MAYBE, if a game mode allows it in the future, will they allow rex. It even goes in tandem with them preaching that not every dino would be on official.

[icy urchin]

@crisp topaz It's a good start

[robust dome]

Pretty sure rex's early stages will be really hard (should be at least).
Sub and juvie rex should be really vulnerable especially to mid tiers. Then, when you have achieved full adult you should be allowed to be an absolute monster. With other monsters to fight you like giga or Shant.

[crisp topaz]

In legacy I've gotten 1 rex to full grown and died to 2 spinos. If they're worried about rex wreaking havoc, they should just wait and release it alongside another apex.

[robust dome]

The community is worried. Some at least. The devs dont seem to be

[barren crater]

Fair, but the current largest land carnivore is 1.8t, which would probably be a small sub if it was a rex. (Probably not talking about now?)

[crisp topaz]

I've never seen the community address these devs in a manner that they're CONCERNED for the state of rex when it releases. Unless I'm missing something?

[barren crater]

Rex is likely speedy when growing and if it has the stuns, grabs & fractures of the full adult then yeah. Nothing in their size range while growing will compete

[robust dome]

Allo will be 2ts ~

[barren crater]

Allo is 2.8 - 3.2t. Hopefully by that stage Rex loses a lot of speed and is towards the end of sub

Hopefully with its own unique growth scaling

[icy urchin]

Rex is like 5-7 ts in real life

[limber hull]

likely will be 8 tons or greater ingame

[robust dome]

Most likely rex wont be that speedy tho. Not as much as carno or allo or a pack of utahs

[barren crater]

Full grown yeah

[urban flax]

More

[barren crater]

juvis / subs?

[limber hull]

its already speedy in its adult, and its sub/juvis will likely be speed demons

[barren crater]

Might be nightmares

[icy urchin]

[urban flax]

Irl adult rex ranges from ~7 to 10+ tons

[icy urchin]

thats like 5 cars in weight Poggers

[barren crater]

Large juvi rex being a better small game hunter than Carno

[limber hull]

IT PROBABLY WILL BE HAHAHAHAHA

[crisp topaz]

Until it's not lol

[limber hull]

god damn carno never gonna catch a break

[crisp topaz]

Good. Carno's deserve all the pain.

[limber hull]

ah, a revenge balancer, glad to know

[urban flax]

Revenge balancing is the best kind of balancing

[icy urchin]

lmao

[limber hull]

i love balance opinions being derived 95% from personal bias

carno deserves better than what it got

it's basically been a flawed and confused design from the day it dropped into EVRIMA

what with its botched ambusher playstyle

[icy urchin]

Only problem i have with Carno is that it starves so quickly

[limber hull]

oh yea, that needs resolving

either make it require less food to fill its stomach or just let it not die for existing for 30 minutes

[icy urchin]

Yeah

[limber hull]

idk man, i just want cool plains-dominant pursuit carno

with gateway and stuff like allos to humble it, it'll actually do a decent job

also with a charge that isn't built to be the only element of its kit worth using

[true haven]

they really need to fleshed out pounce synchronization

they're like pouncing on the air...

[amber cosmos]

@opal wagon i agree with you about it being able to out stam everything but i also think thats the trade off for it being slow af its post to be an endurance hunter/ scavenger

[limber hull]

it's barely a tradeoff, since cera isn't that slow and doesn't need to scavene

it can just endurance hunt, it's arguably a better hunter than carno atm

[opal wagon]

If you agree with that then u should also agree the shouldnt be roaming and conquering the flats... They do, Carno has no place.

[amber cosmos]

it goes 40 something its pretty slow

[amber cosmos]

yeah 100%

[limber hull]

its not that slow, they move the same speed as teno, the fastest quadruped planned for the game

[amber cosmos]

i just think carno needs a buff not so much nerfing cerato

[limber hull]

i honestly dislike the endurance hunter playstyle role for cera, since it already is an excellent corpse bully

[limber hull]

cera def needs a nerf as long as vomitlocking exists

the fact that cera can stunlock is complete bull

[opal wagon]

The Comiting affects the stamina on top of this, Legit can bully anything.

Vomititng

[amber cosmos]

hard disagree simple fact a lone cerato if fighting anything that knows what its doing wont get the kill lol

unless its like a hypsy or troodon

[limber hull]

vomitlocking literally makes it that ceras can kill stegos and tenos without them being able to remotely fight back

[opal wagon]

Ceras can 1 v 1 everything pretty much in its weight class and below. Thats a scavenger?

[amber cosmos]

i dont know what stegos you been fighting but i killed 7 ceratos in one go yesterday and was still at 50%

[limber hull]

how bad are those ceras lmao

7 ceratos is an easy win if they just bumrush you to vomitlock

[opal wagon]

Stegos are a apex you cant compare

[limber hull]

you can

[amber cosmos]

how bad were the stegos? it takes one headshot on a cera to kill it with a stego

[limber hull]

because ceratos can stunlock them to death

[limber hull]

if the stego can't attack, that doesn't matter

vomitlock disables the stego's ability to attack

[amber cosmos]

they have to get a bite off to attack thus already bad stego

[opal wagon]

The simple fact is that a Carno should be able to bully a cera without a body in the flats. Cant argue that

[robust dome]

Vomitlock ?

[icy urchin]

@limber hull Damn sounds crazy OP, didnt know Cera could do that 😮

[amber cosmos]

agree carno needs buff

[limber hull]

ceras can stack vomit on top of vomit. Vomit animation cancels any attack and prevents you from using any attack. Essentially, the creature CANNOT use any fighting technique to defend itself, and if it tries, the animation will be cancelled via the vomit animation, leaving the creature entirely open with no room to counterattack

[opal wagon]

I would not say that ethier... Think about ceras TURN/Alt bite. A raptor dont even stand a chance against a scavenger.

[amber cosmos]

i actually think with the body mechanic they should find a way to make it so it only works against creatures smaller then the cerato anyway, doesnt make sense for a cerato to be buffed against larger creatures

[robust dome]

How do u even make a stego vomit without dying first

[barren crater]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/778350416831709314/1124558049160474695/GIF_2023-6-29_8-25-35.gif

[limber hull]

this

[icy urchin]

😂

[opal wagon]

That stego sat there and puked its guts legit out

[icy urchin]

Thats what i get every weekend

[limber hull]

charged bites apply 40% bacteria. Normal bites apply 20%. With 3 or more ceras, it's easy enough to apply the bacteria so fast, the stego cannot counterattack, and if the stego isn't 100% stomach, that becomes even faster

[robust dome]

Seems fair tho. Literally 4v1

[barren crater]

Yeah 3 charged bites to puke a stego

On full hunger

[limber hull]

its not fair to not be allowed to fight

you literally CAN'T PLAY, you just are forced to watch your animal die

[robust dome]

Yeah well you can one shot them

[urban flax]

How is it fair to have the larger animal have to sit down and die just because 4 smaller ones decided it had to die ?

[amber cosmos]

the simple solution is headshot the first one that runs in

[limber hull]

you can't, because you can't attack

[robust dome]

Its a 50/50. Either u kill them and live or they bite you enough for you to vomit and die

[barren crater]

That window is enough for the others to jump in

[limber hull]

which, if the cera is smart, will bait you and then you've got attacks on you, and you're screwed

[limber hull]

Which is a horrible matchup, entirely unfun and should not be a thing

[wispy fable]

😻

[urban flax]

And once the stego kills a cera the rest get a 50% damage resistance so it cannot kill them before it gets vomitlocked

[limber hull]

Stunlocks were REMOVED for a reason in U6.5, except cera got the worst stunlock ever

[limber hull]

LMAO true

[opal wagon]

Bottom line, nerf Ceras stam and its all good. Leave run speed the same and I think everyone can be happy with that

[amber cosmos]

anyone stego player knows people bait, i wait for them to run for my head then sprint forward so they get stuck on me and smack them

[robust dome]

Well the ceras are at risk too since they risk their life to get that bite. Although 40% is def too much

[urban flax]

It's not all good while a stunlock mechanic exists

[amber cosmos]

that doesnt solve what they are complaining about with the bile lol

[limber hull]

The fact that cera got a stunlock that's worse than every stunlock before it in the update that removed pachy stun, carno stun, deino stun, omniraptor pounce stun, and more, is absolutely comedic gold

[robust dome]

I dont think its stam is the issue

[opal wagon]

Ok so make it more bits to trigger the bile

[robust dome]

Deino can vomit to cera ?

[barren crater]

Cerato needs 5 bites to puke a Carno at full hunger. 5 for Omni and 5 for stego. There is no scaling for it

[limber hull]

Deino can't vomit

[opal wagon]

Stam is still a huge issue. It out stams a Carno anyday

[urban flax]

Why are you so intent on keeping the vomitlock ?

[urban flax]

(which is absurd)

[limber hull]

Scaling should be a thing, 100%

[rare kelp]

can anybody tell me what stunock the cera has and how it works ?

[urban flax]

4 ceras could stunlock and kill a brachi
Or a hyper rex
With no effort

[opal wagon]

Im not, I dont like ceras tbh but Im saying things I think would help balance

[barren crater]

1 bite should puke an Omni. 5~ for Carno 10 + for stego

[amber cosmos]

its post to out stam it its an endurance hunter where as the carno is a ambush/ speed hunter its like a lion vs a cheetah

[robust dome]

Good because carno is a 100times faster and if you cant catch a cera before running out of stam, you deserve to die to the cera honestly

[amber cosmos]

facts

[opal wagon]

Its not even that....

[robust dome]

2 for omni imo.

[urban flax]

Once it applies enough bacteria to a target, the target vomits, blocking all attacks for the duration of the animation.
If enough ceras are biting it at the same time, the target chains vomits without being able to launch a single attack until it's dead

[limber hull]

Cerato is nothing like a lion. Carno is nothing like a cheetah. What the hell is this argument lol

[barren crater]

Omni has speed & stamina to avoid it

[opal wagon]

If a Caro rams one time and gets bit the carno is forced to retreat

[barren crater]

If you get hit, then you deserve it

[amber cosmos]

im comparing the way they hunt try to keep up

[urban flax]

Cerato shouldn't even be a proficient hunter

[barren crater]

Agile creature.

[limber hull]

Carno... doesn't even hunt like a cheetah, and cerato doesn't hunt like a lion

[urban flax]

It would be more fair to compare cera to a vulture

[robust dome]

Knwoing there are lags and such that make eligible to get bit by the target you are pouncing, it sounds fair.

[urban flax]

And carno to a bull that eats meat

[barren crater]

You don't balance around lag

[urban flax]

(Like its name implies )

[robust dome]

No because you bite back and win ?

[opal wagon]

Hear me out.... If they removed the stun lock and ceras bite that affects stam would still have it in a great spot

[robust dome]

You can to that temporarly

[amber cosmos]

the carno absolutly hunts like a cheetah short bursts of a high top speed to run down and catch its target where as a lion trys to tire out the target using hit and run and pack tactics on larger prey

[opal wagon]

A carno vs cera bit is unmatched. Ceras win

[robust dome]

I totally disagree and tahts from experience

[urban flax]

And just like a cheetah, carno uses its superior strength to overpower prey and knock them down

[barren crater]

Or maybe Omni should have creatures that it outright avoids via being too large or too much of a hassle to hunt

[amber cosmos]

3 carnos should be able to kill 4 ceras no problem

[opal wagon]

Bro I have legit spent hours playing carno?

[urban flax]

Just like a cheetah, a carno can hide in the grass and use its excellent acceleration to ambush its prey

[robust dome]

So did I for cera and carno.

[opal wagon]

I have been in that spot multi times. IT dont

All the ceras have to do is bite 1 to 2 times and chase them down. GG

[limber hull]

Just like a cheetah haha

[robust dome]

It already is quite risky and much of a hassle but it could be slightly more while still remaining fair to the omni and cera. 2 bites sound enough and not too much

[amber cosmos]

yeah same which is why i agree carno need buff, i simply dont think cerato needs a stam nerf as it wont be able to hunt tenos

[limber hull]

Much like how a cheetah is much larger than a lion and is very good at predating upon them

[robust dome]

@barren crater or maybe 1 bite in the head is enough but 2 for the body

[slim elbow]

as cera i am not scared at all of carnos, i go into their packs and start the bloodbath lol

[robust dome]

yeah, you being the blood from the bath

[opal wagon]

Ok give Carno more stam, I could see that working but! There is also the other issue of stun lock

[slim elbow]

not at all

[icy urchin]

Shots fired 😮

[slim elbow]

charges are so easy to avoid

[robust dome]

Then yo uare playing against 5 years olds

[opal wagon]

???? Igeere what are u talking about

[icy urchin]

[opal wagon]

Cera vs Carno=Cera on top

[robust dome]

Bummerpure, im talking about him being the one that dies to carno (should I say carnoS)

[opal wagon]

It out Bites and Out stams and out bleeds.

[amber cosmos]

yall are conveniently ignoring the facts here that a cerato in game is a bully and pushes stuff off corpses being intentionally ignorant just makes your arguements mute, the carno like a cheetah takes advantage of its high speed to catch prey thats literally what i was conveying and yall are pretending like it doesnt grow up

[robust dome]

And you have what we call speed and health and stun over it

[limber hull]

Speed is literally the only thing carno and cheetah have in common. Past that, they couldn't be more different

[amber cosmos]

i do think carno needs more stam it should be able to run from tenos if it fails the hunt lol

[opal wagon]

Pasternak what you dont get it dont need a body down to kill

[opal wagon]

Speed is only good for legit 2 headbutts...

[urban flax]

The fact they're both fast is literally the only point carno and cheetah have in common
You could also compare it to a peregrine falcon, a shark or even a dragonfly if that's all you care about

[robust dome]

Wich is a decent amount of damage to allow you to then jsut bite and win

[opal wagon]

NO, Still no... thats the problem

[amber cosmos]

the fact neither of them are endurance hunters as a cheetah can run max speed for only a few mins or less is another comparison

[opal wagon]

SO lets say a Cera bits a carno and the carno rams the cera right... 1 for 1. The carno will lose everytime due to stun lock and cant run away

[limber hull]

Except, unlike cheetah, that can change (and should since the cheetah hunting style does not work on an animal like carno)

[amber cosmos]

also yeah generally i dont bother biting ceras i just ram them over and over till they die

[opal wagon]

Until what? U lose all stam after 2 headbutts?

[amber cosmos]

since when

[opal wagon]

Bro play a carno and try what ur saying

[urban flax]

Of course they aren't endurance hunters
The only endurance hunters in our world are humans and wolves (and maybe some fishes)

[opal wagon]

I have been trying over and over to kill ceras due to the simple fact there broken

[amber cosmos]

i been playing carno on the zoo

[robust dome]

I dont know how much damage exactly a Ram is but cera has only 1300 hp compared to 1800. If you charge it twice it goes to 1000hp ~ maybne a bit less. From then on you have 800 heatlh more than him.

Either way, that you can or can't beat a cera as carno, you can just not engage in a fight with it and run away. Which also makes you the winner because this is a survival game. it's like stego, you can run away so techincally stego isn't op

[opal wagon]

Then u Should know your out of stam after 2 times

[icy urchin]

Just don't fight Cera around a corpse, it's not that hard

[amber cosmos]

nah i get atleast 4 rams in unless your sprinting from across the map for the ram

[opal wagon]

U forget to mention if he bits the carno 1 time not only does he not reg stam but he also has a bleed

[opal wagon]

No, I get 2 rams 1 v 1 a cera. If the cera is smart u ram him and he chase you. By time u get enough distance to turn around you got 1 more ram before your forced to run

[robust dome]

then, dont. get. bit. (dont engage)

[amber cosmos]

carno cant run from cera cera has more stam

[opal wagon]

Thats what Im getting at........

[limber hull]

ram does like, 350 damage, it's absolutely insane, and it can be up to around 425 damage with a headshot

thats not even counting for bite combos

[amber cosmos]

its pretty much a situation where as a carno if a cera decides to fight you either kill it or die

[opal wagon]

Its a carno hes all legs and ur telling me a fat potato can out stam?

[icy urchin]

Give Carno a camouflage spell then lol

[robust dome]

Carno has way more speed and has then the possibility to hide. I can't count my encoutners that went this way.

I see Carno, I run at it, it runs away, I ru nafter it, it gets in a forest, you loose it.

[opal wagon]

Then ur a bad cera player lol... Not hard to hunt a Carno when they are on the Flats

[limber hull]

the fact that carno, the plains predator, has to run and hide in a forest from cera, the scavenger, should be raising red flags

[robust dome]

@opal wagon ^

[cyan flame]

I think the issue there is more so, why does a carno, the plains dweller, run into a forest from a smaller predator that should by all rights not be hunting it, and be the one to run into the forest instead, unless it has a decent sized body to defend

[amber cosmos]

yeah that wouldnt work on me as i know how to follow your foot prints lol\

[limber hull]

with the body buff, it DOES NOT need its current stam on top of that

[amber cosmos]

and i agree i just think the answer is different from nerfing ceratos stam

[urban flax]

Hasn't it been said before that cera "would have the advantage over carno if it's in a forest, but run from it if it's in plains" ?

[limber hull]

i think nerfing cera's stam means animals like pachy and teno get some room to breathe

plus, cera still has, y'know, up to 50% damage res near a corpse

and passive fracture/bleed resist

[amber cosmos]

well anyone fighting a cerato near a body is dumb anyway

[limber hull]

fighting cera at all is dumb atm

[amber cosmos]

true enough lol

[limber hull]

because it will proceed to stam you down to oblivion if you mess up

[urban flax]

Speaking of that
Wouldn't a 20% damage resistance be more than enough ?

[limber hull]

i dont want cera to be carno's level of stam

i dont want any animal to experience that level of exhaustion

but like, even 15 seconds less stam would be enough

[amber cosmos]

carno needs a stam buff not the other way around

[limber hull]

sure, but i'd rather it be really good at corpse defending and lose out on the insane endurnace hunting

[limber hull]

by that logic, teno, pachy and basically the entire roster needs stam buffs to compensate for cera

[urban flax]

I mean, cera could use more than one nerf... (as long as it isn't nerfed into oblivion)

[limber hull]

bile and stam is all i want

vomitlocking and endurance hunting need a hit, i could care less about the rest

[opal wagon]

👍

[limber hull]

keep it strong at corpse guarding, that's what it should be

[robust dome]

I honestly don't expect them to balance things out properly since what happened to omni as it went from decent but not good enough to just unskilled op

[amber cosmos]

yeah i have the opposite opinion and think it should keep the stam but nerf the body down buff to max out at 20% and the bile

[limber hull]

i mean, part of that is from the omni playerbase themselves making a huge scene and begging for power boosts

[limber hull]

so then, make it worse at corpse bullying and just an endurance hunter? Doesn't that just obliterate the cool identity it had?

Another generic hunter therapod rather than the unique scav niche

[amber cosmos]

its a 20% buff how is that making it bad at corpse bullying?

[robust dome]

They really have 0 obligation on listening to the community that luch and should seek what is good and healthy for the game rather than what pleases part of the player base

[limber hull]

When part of your commuity is literally relentlessly crying about omni, you'd be inclined to think it needs buffs

[robust dome]

Yes. But not making it op

[amber cosmos]

i havent played omni since before it was omni cause bad lol

[opal wagon]

Omni is only bad due to the Ping that players have and some other game breaking bugs with pounce.

[barren crater]

I don't mind Omni's state if they only brought other creatures up to standard

[amber cosmos]

i mean lets be honest even without all that its just really bad compared to other dinos and it cant solo anything unless really lucky lol

and yes i know its not post to solo stuff but lets be real here a single carno can take a whole group of omnis

[barren crater]

It's very good rn. The other creatures are just much larger so not much there

[amber cosmos]

did they buff it with 6.5?

[opal wagon]

Um I had some decent luck with it... If the game dont break. It just becomes a really long fight as u want for it to bleed while it runs through multi forest

[limber hull]

pachy and teno specifically need some help

[barren crater]

Yes. Very much so

[amber cosmos]

cause i been merking them its basically free food

[barren crater]

• Better agility
• No missed pounce recovery
• Bucking isn't as rough as update 6

Feel like I'm forgetting something

[amber cosmos]

i might have to try it out then

[limber hull]

it was already good in U6, besides the "carno obliterates you" thing

[amber cosmos]

doesnt help the ones i keep fighting are in wide open fields with nowhere to hide

[barren crater]

It's unironically very easy to dodge Carno as Omni

[limber hull]

just today, my omni pack was able to destroy some random cerato

and cerato is supposed to be good against omni

[barren crater]

Like genuinely I don't think you should be getting hit by a Carno you spot

[opal wagon]

Hard to imagine.... One bite and a raptor is gone

[amber cosmos]

i dont even ram omnis i just sit there and alt bite when they try to latch lol

[opal wagon]

Thats all the ceras do and need to do.

[limber hull]

isnt alt-bite, like, insanely broken this update

[amber cosmos]

im talking carno

[limber hull]

like it quite literally hits every direction around you

[opal wagon]

Yea vs a Omni thats about it

[barren crater]

lmao yeah. The only way to catch an Omni outside of an ambush

Although a lot of Omni's still run in straight lines

[amber cosmos]

yeah i think alot of people play them thinking they are faster then they really are lol

[opal wagon]

I had the best Packy vs Cera the other day... It involved me breaking his leg and running as far and deep in the woods as I could.. Fun time

[barren crater]

Wish the game had character infos on playables. For Omni it would be "AVOID CARNO, AS IT'S MUCH FASTER..." unless in a decent group.

[amber cosmos]

they should disable sprint when you break legs like in legacy i dont get sprinting with broken legs makes no sense

[barren crater]

Like details like that apart of a creatures profile in game

[opal wagon]

I would rather fight a Carno then a cera as a Omni

[barren crater]

Oh yeah, which is stupid lol

[amber cosmos]

i actually havent even seen any omnis when playing my cera, they might be avoiding me lol

[barren crater]

The 1.8t small game hunter that's meant to be the "nightmare of all small tiers" does worse than Cera

Like not just worse. Much worse.

[amber cosmos]

they should make it so multiple omnis can latch at a time

[limber hull]

they can

that's always been a thing

[amber cosmos]

it bugs out and bleeds the omnis

[barren crater]

Yeah it's a bit iffy at times

[limber hull]

just today i got 2 omnis on a cera

[barren crater]

Sometimes you're on the other side and someone pounces the other side and falls off. Or other times where you're both visually on the same side together

[amber cosmos]

hell one time i latched and then my buddy tried to latch and it just outright killed me lol

[barren crater]

And it's not client side either. All the parties see it that way

I think they added that feature in update 5 iirc? In update 4 you could pounce whenever and you couldn't hit eachother off at all

I feel like it's another jank pounce moment though, but the way Omni is right now. IDK. They need to work on pounce. Feels very RNG and group play feels bad.

[amber cosmos]

yup, maybe even give them a pack mechanic where they get a speed buff or something when working together

[limber hull]

@sly lotus we are getting exactly that

[limber hull]

ehhh, i'd rather not have stuff like that

[barren crater]

I'd much rather they work on group play when pouncing creatures

[amber cosmos]

you say that but its already here with cerato and the body down buff

[barren crater]

Feels way too punishing

Also tap pouncing being the best strat is cringe

[amber cosmos]

how many pounces does it even take to bleed a cerato anyway?

like to the point it matters lol

[barren crater]

Ah. Cerato is a bit odd. You need to use bites when you start off.

Well, it's the quickest way to kill it

Once it's like half health, bleed seems to be worse for it.

So pouncing after biting it a few times seems to be the best bet.

[amber cosmos]

interesting

[amber cosmos]

so completly different topic but what about letting deinosuchus grab and drag larger creatures like stego instead of just outright picking them up?

[limber hull]

it really doesn't need any buffs, especially against stego

[opal wagon]

Think stego and deino are in a soild spot. Maybe, MAYBE nerd the hitbox on stego

Nerf

[limber hull]

stego's hitbox is extremely tight tho, it's one of the most accurate hitboxes to the actual tail

most of its "weird hits" are latency issues

[opal wagon]

I would prolly agree to this but I feel both are in good spots

[amber cosmos]

its post to be able to kill things much larger then it, crocs in real life kill things by draggin them by the hind quarter into the water then drowning it if its bigger then them. the fact it cant do anything to a full grown stego has created a situation where stegos can just camp the water at 100% grown and take out 3 deinos solo if played right

[limber hull]

tons of people have discovered that steg's attack hitbox essentially aligns perfectly with the animation

[limber hull]

if you are
A: Dying to a stego "camping the water"
B: Losing 3 deinos to one stego

You aren't a superb deino, ngl

Deino has tons of ways to avoid ever dying to a stego

[opal wagon]

Yea but a Stego and deno are not suppoused to go head to head. Only reason your thinking this way is due to the small list of dinos

[amber cosmos]

i didnt say myself but it shouldnt be even possible lol

[amber cosmos]

yes and it should be able to hunt them as well

[limber hull]

It really shouldn't

[amber cosmos]

it really should

[limber hull]

It already hunts 11/13 members of the roster without contest

It NEEDS stego to keep it from being literally just undefeatable god

[opal wagon]

11/13? What others lol only thing i can think of is its self or stego

[amber cosmos]

the fact it dies of thirst and has bad stam makes it anything but undefeatable lol

[urban flax]

Clearly, you didn't play update 3

[limber hull]

What kills deino, besides deino and stego

[amber cosmos]

im not talking about update 3 im talking about now and the future of the game lol

[limber hull]

Like, what creature

[amber cosmos]

rex, trike, bronto, anything as large if not larger then a stego?

[urban flax]

It is
Update 3 was the one update during which deino could beat stego in a 1v1 easily
It had the exact same stats as right now, except for the alt-bite
And it completely dominated the land

[limber hull]

what creature, right now, kills deino?

[amber cosmos]

stego

[limber hull]

and if we take that away, deino has no threats and is now a god

[amber cosmos]

didnt realise we were doing a balance patch every update to slow down game development sorry

[limber hull]

(it already doesn't really have any meaningful threats if it just plays the way its meant to but that's a different topic entirely)

[limber hull]

fun game design tidbit from an educated and employed game designer

yea, you balance for what's in now, not what'll be later

[amber cosmos]

or just get water in shallow spots where they cant get you and just laugh as they run out of stam on land chasing you? also i said drag not grab and pick up as in stego can still attack but is slowly dragged into water

[limber hull]

what shallow spots are there on Spiro, really

[amber cosmos]

must be why the game is still in beta after almost a decade lol

[limber hull]

besides that single puddle on the beach]

[amber cosmos]

there are a ton

[limber hull]

???? what

how the hell does "ensuring the game is balanced for the existing roster" = BAD SLOW GAME DEV

that's not at all related

[amber cosmos]

simple if they did balance passes after they released the dinos they could focus on getting them out as well as mechanics then do one final pass for balancing before launch, games been on steam since 2015 its 2023

[limber hull]

that is not at all how game development works

[amber cosmos]

maybe thats why the industry is failing hardcore to impress the players they all think like you

[limber hull]

a dinosaur isn't just a collection of numbers, it's art, animations, niche design, sound design, environmental interactions, unique mechanics

[limber hull]

the industry fails to do the impossible, hence it's failure

the only way to impress nowadays is to quite literally forgo reality

[amber cosmos]

its not impossible to make good games

[limber hull]

it is impossible to just... generate dinosaurs out of thin air because you made less balance changes

[amber cosmos]

reason they fail nowadays is cause they just resell the same crap they have been making since 2001 with a graphics update

[limber hull]

they still need to be modelled, rigged, animated, have their sounds designed, programmed, have unique mechanics developed to support them, balanced, QA tested and more

[urban flax]

I lost it
Are you talking about afterthought, AAA game companies, or videogame developers in general ?
Because none of what you said makes sense for all of them

[amber cosmos]

your ridiculous and lack critical thinking skills if you think taking attention off balancing for a beta to actually work on finishing the game wouldnt save time

[amber cosmos]

AAA

[limber hull]

im quite literally experienced in the field idk what you're on about

[urban flax]

Then which AAA studios is reselling the same game since 2001 with a graphic update ?

[limber hull]

i have game development experience, i am aware of the limitations of game development

[amber cosmos]

i dont think you are your ability to comprehend what im conveying or lack there of makes me think your not

[amber cosmos]

activision, bungie, ubisoft,EA, literally all of them.

[limber hull]

i see that my legitimate experience as a developer has been deflected by "nah i dont think so"

[amber cosmos]

you havent done anything but claim your a dev to prove your a dev

[limber hull]

what do you want me to do to prove it

[amber cosmos]

your the dev tell me something to prove it besides saying your a dev lol

[limber hull]

how about this. Have you heard of SCP:SL? Lead Game Designer for several years. It's on steam, it's free, lots of people have played it.

Or how about this, I'm currently on my final year of my degree at university with a Bachelor of Information Technology with a major in Game Design and Development

[urban flax]

Then what you're saying is wrong ?
Activision is known among game companies to be lazy and greedy, they're not the norm
I don't know who Bungie are
Ubisoft is making new games regularly, even though the assassin's creed series are getting repetitive, they're still quite innovative

[amber cosmos]

its a simple fact games like this that release early access or beta spend years longer in devolopment because they decide to focus on balancing rather then finishing the game. we have one freaking map and 13 dinos

[urban flax]

You really do look like you don't understand how game development works

[limber hull]

he does not

[amber cosmos]

what new IPs have any of them come out with that they didnt by from a small dev studio?

[urban flax]

Balancing is like bugfixing
It's not something you do once and then forget

[amber cosmos]

maybe if you want to stay in beta and compete with star citizen on how long it takes to come out

[urban flax]

I think For Honor was a pretty original game and, despite some questionable recent balance and game design decisions, still is a good game
If an indie game studio made this one before them I'd like to know what it was
All I could think of is Skara: The Blade Remains, but that game was pretty bad and not that similar anyways
Or chivalry:deadliest warrior, which doesn't have much in common either

[urban flax]

It's unrelated
That's just how it is

[amber cosmos]

for honor came out in 2017 kinda dated and i have no idea what skara is never heard of it

[urban flax]

Balancing a videogame is something you fine-tune over time
And for some game, there is no sweet spot, it has to be changed constantly as new additions are made

[urban flax]

Not many people heard of Skara since, as I said, it was pretty bad

[amber cosmos]

so yeah anyway what assasins creed and tom clancy ghost recon we on now?

[urban flax]

what ?

[amber cosmos]

how many assasins creeds are there and ghost recon games?

[amber cosmos]

AAA are failing cause they dont make new IPs

[urban flax]

how does that matter ?
I'm not even sure anymore if you're trying to prove a point or just rambling about random things

[urban flax]

Look, you can criticize game studios without knowing what it's all about all you want, a lot of people do it anyway, but if you want to be listened to, you should at least try to understand what you're talking about

[amber cosmos]

im making the point that devoplers as a whole in the industry need to rethink how they make games as they dont understand what makes the players happy they get one success and stick with it for decades thinking that would work, also we seem to be having like two convos lol

[urban flax]

Oh ok then you're wrong in your way of thinking
Developers generally don't choose what they do, especially in big studios
Producers do
And when you're a producer in a company that needs to pay thousands of people, you don't like taking risks
Don't put indie game devs in the same bucket as AAA game devs and game producers

[amber cosmos]

i didnt put indie game devs in i literally said AAA a few replys up LOL

[amber cosmos]

only reason devs got brought up in the first place is cause the other guy claimed to be one

[urban flax]

"developers as a whole"

[urban flax]

(He actually is)

[amber cosmos]

still waiting for proof

[urban flax]

I don't have his portfolio to send you

[amber cosmos]

im also a purple dragon that eats pineapples

[urban flax]

It's easy to call people liars when you're not trying to prove anything yourself

[amber cosmos]

facts its also easy to claim your something your not online then disapeer when asked to show proof

which is why i dont claim to be things im not

wait you mean for compys and stuff?

ah yeah i dont think playables should also have AI either

[cyan flame]

@amber cosmosDeino is not meant to hunt large things. It has a lunge that can one shot things up to 4T, that's going to be most of the roster. It does, by no means, need to hunt anything larger than that. And it certainly should not be hunting anything stego sized, much less larger.

[amber cosmos]

would make since if it wasnt for the fact some of its real life pray aka the duck billed family can get to be as big as stego

[cyan flame]

Yes well, this is a game and thus, balance takes precedence. Otherwise stego and deino would both oneshot each other, omnis would shred everything, and rex would be all around invincible, and so on. Not neccesarily what makes things fun.

[amber cosmos]

also why doesnt it use its death roll in combat lol

[urban flax]

For the exact same reason as what Erik Eden just said
Also deino irl most likely couldn't deathroll

[amber cosmos]

according to the American museum of natural history it probably could

[urban flax]

Well it's time to show proof then

[amber cosmos]

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/ancient-crocodilians-used-death-rolls-to-kill-dinosaurs/#:~:text=The researchers suggest that Deinosuchus,respectively%2C dinosaurs and large mammals.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2622664/Crocodile-death-roll-used-reptiles-fearsome-ancestors-80-million-years-ago-hunted-dinosaurs.html

[urban flax]

This one only takes into account the skull's resistance, not the animal's mass

Ah no they mention the weight problem
And they say adults couldn't do it

[amber cosmos]

its literally a conclusion from paleontologists from the american institute of natural history i think they probably know what they are talking about

where does it say adults couldnt do it as i didnt see that

[urban flax]

I guess that's why they say it's only conjecture, that it's not proven, and that possibly only juveniles could do it

[amber cosmos]

go back and reread thats in aspects to the sarchosuches

[urban flax]

Nope, not all of it

They say "sarcosuchus most likely couldn't deathroll because it's skull wasn't hard enough"
And "deinosuchus and purrusaurus possibly could because their skull was hard enough"

[amber cosmos]

However, the death roll can generate substantial forces in the skull. To see if ancient crocs had skulls that were strong enough to withstand these stresses, investigators modeled the skulls of 16 living crocodilian species and three extinct crocodilian groups.

The researchers suggest that Deinosuchus and Purussaurus could execute death rolls on, respectively, dinosaurs and large mammals. However, narrow-snouted Sarcosuchus probably could not, as the forces to its skull may have been too great.

The scientists found that death rolls were easier for smaller predators, because they were lighter, making it easier for them to spin. This means it was probably easier for juveniles than adults, said lead study author Ernesto Blanco, a paleobiomechanicist at the Institute of Physics in Montevideo, Uruguay.

"It is possible that very large specimens use other approaches for taking chunks of meat from large vertebrates," Blanco said -- for example, with sideways movements of the head. They may have also simply swallowed small prey whole.

The researchers did note their model had several uncertainties, as "we are studying much larger crocs than any living species," Blanco told Live Science. This means "we cannot completely exclude 'death roll' in Sarcosuchus."

literal copy and paste read the last sentence

[urban flax]

You don't need to repost it all here

[amber cosmos]

well if you didnt want to admit it i will simply show the whole context

[urban flax]

You can show it, but can you understand it ?

[cyan flame]

In any case, it does not matter for the game. It probably does not have a death roll in fighting because it'd be hard to make it work, or simply because they want deino to drag things into the water to drown it.

[urban flax]

Nothing is even a proof in that article, they only speak by "may" and "could"

(As should all paleontologists by the way)

[amber cosmos]

everything we think about dinosaurs is a maybe and could lol

[urban flax]

Glad that you finally understood that

[amber cosmos]

so i guess the rex doesnt have the strongest bite of any land creature in history cause its not alive today to test it?

[urban flax]

I don't even need to answer that

[amber cosmos]

i guess that also means we dont know if a stego could one shot a raptor either as we never witnessed it

so why make a game if you dont know anything about what any of these things do

[urban flax]

I take back what I said, you didn't understand

[amber cosmos]

my point is this, its the only croc in the game it should have the deathroll as an attack its literally a signature of thier entire families hunting style

[urban flax]

That's too much work for something that isn't worth it

besides, deino already has a deathroll, it's its eating animation

[amber cosmos]

which is dumb af

[urban flax]

And as a matter of fact, crocs mostly deathroll when eating

The thing is, they mostly don't care if their prey is still alive when they start eating it

[amber cosmos]

crocs mostly swipe their heads side to side when eating they death roll underwater to drain the stamina of what they are hunting

that or swallow stuff whole

[urban flax]

Since when is deathrolling for draining stam ?

Well if you consider losing a limb drains your stam it kinda does

[amber cosmos]

you ever play fight with someone in a pool? it can be exhausting now imagine something that outweighs you starts spinning you and you cant see while you try to fight for your life, probably pretty exhausting.

https://animals.mom.com/crocodiles-roll-3131.html

[urban flax]

My friends don't deathroll me
As I already mentioned, deathrolling is for tearing off chunks of flesh

[amber cosmos]

it doesnt have just one use why do you do this pick one thing and stick with it its so silly and one minded lol

[urban flax]

Because that's its main use

[amber cosmos]

Death rolling behavior may have nothing to do with feeding strategy at all,” Drumheller and colleagues write. Crocodylians of all sorts fight with each other by biting, often along the head, legs, and the base of the tail. There are even fossils that show similar injuries. Biting and twisting is part of the combat repertoire, either to injure and opponent or escape. The “death roll” may actually be a “combat roll,” evolved as part of croc confrontation and then later co-opted by the chompier species to rip chunks off their dinners. And given how long crocs of all sorts have persisted through evolutionary time, they’ll keep rolling on.

https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/laelaps/the-secret-of-the-crocodile-death-roll/

[urban flax]

I don't see "exhausting prey" written here
But I see "ripping chunks of flesh"

[amber cosmos]

guess you skipped the combat part by choice as well

i wish i could pick and choose what parts to read and skip like you do

[urban flax]

Show me the exact line where it's written "deathrolling is used to exhaust prey"

Guess I'm just bad at reading

[amber cosmos]

so you lost the combat part and now you move on to "show me where it is used to exhaust prey" dude go spin in the water that fast by yourself and tell me how you feel

its common sense

not being to curse keeps making me have to rewrite my sentences lol

[urban flax]

What's common sense is seeing that when a croc deathrolls something, a chunk gets ripped off
And that they do it even out of water

[amber cosmos]

give me but a moment ill find another article for you to read

[urban flax]

Too late I'm going to eat now

[amber cosmos]

dont worry itll be here when you get back

https://www.newzealandrabbitclub.net/do-alligators-drown-their-prey/#:~:text=This twisting and rolling motion,to breakbones and dismember prey.

Do crocs and alligators both death roll?
Yes, both crocodiles and alligators are capable of performing the death roll. The death roll is a defensive strategy or defensive behavior that crocodiles and alligators use when hunting or defending themselves against perceived threats.

This type of behavior involves a twisting of the body to produce strong torques and torque-like forces on the prey animal. This twisting and rolling motion helps to cause internal injuries to the prey and can help exhaust the prey’s energy.

Typically, the death roll is performed while the crocodile or alligator is submerged in water, and the bite force used during this attack is strong enough to breakbones and dismember prey.

[amber cosmos]

do me a favor and read paragraph 2

[cyan flame]

Why are you arguing this when it does not matter for the game? :p

[amber cosmos]

simple i want the grab to have a death roll for larger creatures that will get added later like the duck bills that instead of ripping limbs off does a debuff like pachys bone break

currently when you try to grab a creature you cant grab you just sit there like a dummy in a stunned state

i think it should do the death roll instead

[halcyon sigil]

I don't have a horse in this race, but a lot of those articles are just blogs.

https://scholar.google.com/scholar?hl=en&as_sdt=0%2C24&q=death+roll&btnG=

[amber cosmos]

in the blogs they sight national geographic, musuems and other such things

[halcyon sigil]

Meh, just watching the back and forth and it started looking a bit silly

Especially when the last blog was from the new zealand rabbit club haha

[amber cosmos]

i agree it wouldnt have been so bad if he admitted he was wrong earlier

[amber cosmos]

lol

[halcyon sigil]

I prefer at least articles that are peer reviewed, even though they can be meh also

https://journals.biologists.com/jeb/article/210/16/2811/17002/Death-roll-of-the-alligator-mechanics-of-twist

[amber cosmos]

also that link you posted shows the same convo with drumheller that was cited in one of my other articles i posted so

[halcyon sigil]

Yeah, that link was just me google scholar searching death roll

Didn't read past it after that XD

Like I said, no horse in this race

[amber cosmos]

all the math make head hurt lol

[halcyon sigil]

But S c i e n c e

[amber cosmos]

true enough, from what im reading though they are more focused on how the crocs pull it off rather then the purpose lol

https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/03949370.2019.1592231

[cyan flame]

Duck bills? Anyway, deino should not have that, it should not be hunting larger creatures. No matter how it does it. It's already one of the most op playables, it does not need to hunt everything on the roster, by any means. Though maybe if you made the death roll way weaker and more able to fight back in, it could work, but then it'd only really help smaller (relatively speaking) critters to fight back, you're not taking on a rex or trike or something.

[amber cosmos]

but you are probably ok with rex hunting everything it should hunt right?

[cyan flame]

Yes, because you're not meant to hunt those things you can not grab. It's that simple.

[cyan flame]

Considering it'd most likely be slow and not really good at catching most things that aren't also big and slow (and thus capable of fighting back properly), I'm not too worried there (aside from how stego will fare, but that's more on stego needing buffs).

[amber cosmos]

this man says stego needs buffs

😭

[cyan flame]

Yes. Current stego would most likely just die to rex and trike.

[desert arch]

Hes right tho

[amber cosmos]

yeah so it should die to a rex its a stego

[cyan flame]

So it does indeed need buffs in order to survive against those. Whereas deino, can as usual, just swim away. As it's been said to do vs spino.

[amber cosmos]

this isnt path of titans its the isle its a dino sim

[cyan flame]

So you want deino to hunt things way above it's size, and stego to just die?

[urban flax]

I'm back
Oh this is still going

[amber cosmos]

the heck you talking about the deino its bigger then stego

[cyan flame]

I don't know, but it seems a bit... hypocritical sort of? If you want to buff deino this badly, then we sure as can be should buff stego as well.

[desert arch]

But the thing is, its unable to run away from a rex
Rex is confirmed to trot almost as fast as stego can run.

[cyan flame]

What part of, lunge works on things half your size, are you unaware of. You do not hunt things larger than that, you certainly do not need to. The roster consists mostly of things that size or smaller. As well as growing apexes, that you can also hunt. So, stego is "above deino size" when it comes to what it should hunt.

[amber cosmos]

yes but it also has hella dmg

[cyan flame]

Just like how some critters punch up, some punch down, and so on.

[amber cosmos]

i simply disagree with that idea

[cyan flame]

Deino currently at least is designed to punch down very well, and do amazingly as a solo hunter at that. One of the few where you do not need another deino to hunt successfully.

[amber cosmos]

as a whole

[desert arch]

And rex will most likely be 2 tons bigger, have stuns and considerable damage as well

[cyan flame]

Well, that's ... on you then. But that's how it works, all there is to that.

[amber cosmos]

and will probably take longer to grow too

[cyan flame]

Deino is fine as it is, it's far too fine as it were, despite it's "nerfs".

And letting it oneshot even more of the final roster is a terrible idea.

[desert arch]

Growth times dont change the fact that stego will be fodder to rex

[amber cosmos]

im not suggesting one shotting anything pls read what im actually suggesting

[cyan flame]

There are better ideas and ways if you want to make deino better at defending right at the shoreline without letting it hunt above it's range.

[cyan flame]

You know how the lunge works, right? So, you suggesting we change the lunge for a death roll, that will do what then?

You grab the stego, and then what, you're not moving it, it's far too large. You're not pulling it into the water, where you could possibly roll it.

[amber cosmos]

do a leg break or something similiar and seeing as stego wins in a fight on land anyway solo it shouldnt matter

why do i need to repeat myself simply because you refuse to read

[cyan flame]

So you'd only really change the lunge for something that would admittedly look better, dragging the target backwards and then rolling it. But it would still have to be limited to what you can actually grab and drag.

Why would you need to do a legbreak?

[amber cosmos]

simple to slow it down so you can actually fight it instead of it running off and draining all your stam

[cyan flame]

You're not meant to fight it, that's the thing.

Why do you struggle with understanding that you're not meant to fight larger things.

[robust dome]

Wouldnt augmenting the dmage rex getd when getting Headshot to 2x and stego swing to the head to 1.75x - 2x be enough ?

It would mean taking 4x 1600 ( i think)

[amber cosmos]

and thats what i disagree with, how is deino going to hunt its real food source if it cant do anything to it lol

[urban flax]

Its real food source is things under 4 tons, which already represent 80% of the roster

[cyan flame]

... You have plenty of prey options. Targets your own size is not your food source. Allo, alberto, maia, pachyrhino, and so on, are targets.

Mid tiers that are large, but not too large. As well as anything else you can grab while you're just sitting there that is smaller but still worth it, like carno, teno, cera and so on.

[amber cosmos]

the duck billed dino weighed 5 tons and was the deino suchus real diet

[cyan flame]

We have quite the large roster, plenty of targets at or under 4T to kill. This also includes growing stegos and rexes and trikes and so on. It just means if they are too big to grab/lunge, you do not attack them.

This is a game.

[urban flax]

We're talking in-game here

And a game needs balance

[cyan flame]

You're not getting "real food source"

[amber cosmos]

you think duck bill isnt coming to game?

[urban flax]

not what I said

[cyan flame]

We're getting a para, and maia, if that counts?

Not sure which particular critter you're referring to, so can't say if that one comes to the game

But our maia would be prey, while the para, not sure how large it'll end up being. But a growing para would also be prey.

And well, 5T, could work. We could up deino to 10T to let it take on that if needed. But that would still rule out any of the larger critters, including stego.

So you're not getting apex hunter deino even if we go by that real food source thing.

[amber cosmos]

i dont want it to hunt apex i want it to hunt duck bill dino like its post to lol

stego isnt a apex

[cyan flame]

That'd be a maia then, which you will be able to hunt as it stands. And maybe para, depending on size of it, but probably not. And no, stego isn't, at least not currently, but it could and might be. Deino is also not apex, so there's that too.

Generally, deino does not hunt things it's own size, due to how the lunge works, and any similar mechanic would be no more fun. So unless you plan for the death roll to allow for fighting back much better, there's no reason it'd do better. And if you can fight back better, you're still not winning those fights vs stego or larger things anyway, so it wouldn't matter then.

[amber cosmos]

para is 3.5 tons and iguanadon is 5.5 tons

also have the corythasaurus which is a little smaller then a edmontasaurus but not sure on actual weight

[cyan flame]

Okay, how about we consider ingame values, those that do matter. Our para I'm pretty sure is way bigger than that at the very least, unless they intend to make it tiny, but then we already have maia. Also we don't have an iguanadon, do we? Not sure right now honestly, roster too big xD

And we have a shant, which I sincerely doubt deino would hunt :p

[urban flax]

"the problem with Iguanodon is that it would invalidate para" I don't remember who said this, it was probably Filipe or Kissen
But Iguanodon isn't planned as of now

[amber cosmos]

yeah deino didnt hunt shant

[cyan flame]

If allo comes in at about 3T, para is probably 4-5T, if it's above 4, you're not drowning a grown one as it stands, which would be fine.

[cyan flame]

Thank you.

[cyan flame]

So. You have maia to hunt, it's a "duck bill" I think. And maybe younger paras, assuming we get big para above 4T. So you kind of have the prey you want?

[amber cosmos]

see not being able to hunt a para i have a problem with specially since knowing the devs they will put it on the diet lol

[cyan flame]

Plenty of things have dietary things, that does not mean they can and should hunt those things at full size.

Or hunt them if they come in pairs or more.

But well, para in game is not para irl, same with deino. So you might have to just deal with that as it were.

[amber cosmos]

real question who yall think will win deino or spino?

[urban flax]

According to what Dondi said before spino will merk deino
imo it should be somewhat spino-favored

But not to the point where deino doesn't stand a chance

[amber cosmos]

i think in water deino should be able to merk spino but thats just me

mostly cause i think it will swim faster

[urban flax]

If it swims faster it makes no sense for it to also win in a fight and that's precisely why I say spino should have the advantage

If spino is both slower and weaker than deino in the water, why would it even go to the water ?

[amber cosmos]

well im saying it can use its speed to come in get a bite and leave, spino bite force will not be anywhere near as big

there for trading bite for bite deino should win

[urban flax]

I don't think deino should have the agility to do "hit and run" tactics either

[urban flax]

And that's the reason spino has claws

[amber cosmos]

yeah but that will most likely cause bleed which deino doesnt care about

[urban flax]

That's why it will most likely not just cause bleed

[amber cosmos]

doubt

probably to smaller stuff it will do more

[urban flax]

As I said, if spino ends up being weaker and slower than deino it has no point in existing

Or it is a land-only animal

[amber cosmos]

thats not true it can just bring the fight onto land thus negating the deinos advantage

and i think its a given the spino will have a weaker bite force

[urban flax]

That's what I said
Why would a spino ever go into the water if it needs to be on land to stand a chance against deino ?

[amber cosmos]

but probably attack faster

[amber cosmos]

to eat smaller deinos bleipis and fish

[urban flax]

What a great fate for an apex

[amber cosmos]

its not a shark why does it need to fight in the water when it can do both

[urban flax]

Because as opposed to deino, it's an apex

[amber cosmos]

so because the word apex you think its the king of water?

[urban flax]

I didn't say it should be the king of the water
I said it should have somewhat of an advantage

But funnily enough, apex quite literally means something is the king of its environment

[amber cosmos]

yeah its advantage is it can go on land and not lose all its stam in 5 secs

[urban flax]

No I meant somewhat of an advantage in the water

On land deino would be as good as dead

[amber cosmos]

so then i ask this, why play deino if spino beats you in water and on land?

[urban flax]

Because it has a different gameplay and is not as much made for fighting

Deino is an ambusher that targets land animals, not an apex slayer

[amber cosmos]

why would anyone waste 5 hrs growing a deino just to get merked by a spino

[urban flax]

Why would anyone waste 5 hrs growing a deino just to sit in a river and kill people
It's the same question
Also deino has the option to swim away

[amber cosmos]

unless they give spino more stam

in water anyway

[urban flax]

Depends on how much more stam
Omni has more stam than galli, yet it cannot catch it if the galli decides to run away

Also I think deino already has pretty absurd stam in water, I don't think spino would have more

[amber cosmos]

we wont really know till its in game but i imagine it will be slower but have more stam in water or vice versa

[cyan flame]

From what's been said, spino will make deino swim away. I'd imagine spino would win as long as it's standing. Maybe if it's swimming, or well, walking in deep water, deino might have a chance.

[rustic gale]

Why would anyone waste probably up towards 6-8 hours growing a Spino just to be merced in the water by a Deino

Spino is a fisher Dino so it has every right to have a place in the water ecosystem like the Deino without constantly getting chased out of it

[amber cosmos]

spino can get on land and escape deino doesnt have same option also your late to the party

[rustic gale]

Thats why they should both have their strenghts

I know Im late but reading all this

[amber cosmos]

better late then never i guess lol

[rustic gale]

But to end it all on, I think the new map probably is big enough for both the Deinos and the Spinos to have their own territories without it being a major issue. And if it does become an issue I do believe the spino will be the strongest fighter and Deino the strongest swimmer which seems fair to me

[amber cosmos]

i thought gateway was smaller then spiro? or do you mean spiro is big enough?

[rustic gale]

Gateway has more lakes and rivers I believe so more areas for players to split up withouth being forced into a single river system

[amber cosmos]

im actually excited to see how the lakes turn out when they add more water predators

i imagine on realism servers spinos and such will have to kick stuff out of their lake or something lol

[rustic gale]

One can hope, with a good map layout theres lots of potential for a thriving ecosystem

[amber cosmos]

either way i think spiro has alot of water too people just need spread out more and raise the server cap to like 150 or something and increase AI spawns

swamp is almost dead player pop wise

and the beach

[rustic gale]

Yes it has a lot of water, but the issue is mostly that carnivores go where herbivores go. And herbivores likes to be in open areas where they can see the carnivores coming. And Spiro is filled with dense and thick forests where Herbivores dont want to hang.

[amber cosmos]

yeah but all the shallow water safe drinking spots are in the woods lol

[rustic gale]

Yep, but that just goes to show how much herbivores value their open space over anything else

[amber cosmos]

i literally just jumped a cliff with a stego ive had since patch day cause it wont die

i hangout in NW toward the end of the river then go into the woods past the drain spot cause another river leads to a water fall there and its super shallow so i drink there and just eat pumpkin

[stone hatch]

I think the issue with spiro is that people only really go along one route. Along the western river that goes from south to nw, across the southern plains to se, and ocassionally people will visit the top right or bottom left for diet.

[amber cosmos]

yeah i think the map needs more wild life as well to get players to feel like they can leave that central area without dying of hunger

[thorny lynx]

@compact bobcat Perhaps it would be best if we started off with +25 on each official server to see if they can take the load, then continue in increments of 25 until the server can no longer handle a certain population. Some people want 200 on officials, but and such a drastic jump could jeopardize performance, especially when body parts, bones, organs, and chunks from 50+ dinos are lying around in center and with another 100 players around...

[small crescent]

This, if your a ptera, deino or the other one the um bleiposaurus or whatever the other water dino is you're perfectly fine, any other carnivore is forced to attack anything and everything they see due to not having any ai to help. ooooo deers give like 7% for cera's. Theres more fish in a small stretch of river than half the land map.

[slim elbow]

surviving as cera is even viable because it can eat everything including rotten meat and bones

try the carno, is a starving simulator

[small crescent]

Ya i have no doubt, never played the carno before. But it would make sense, even my raptor has a hard time, specially from fresh spawn till about 80% when he can actually take something down. Ive found 1 boar since i became a raptor. Its stupid.

[compact bobcat]

I can definitely get behind that! As small as they need to be works for me and I'm sure most of us. They just need to try something. I am still in queue since I posted that feedback lmao. Took me 37 minutes to get into the server.

[stone hatch]

when storms come to the game add lightning that seems random but actually only strikes you if you kill a dryo as an herbivore, in random times after you kill it so nobody suspects anything

[eager parrot]

I agree whole heartedly

[barren zephyr]

@empty epoch

[empty epoch]

https://tenor.com/view/dennis-nedry-jurassic-park-wayne-knight-gif-24822846

[barren zephyr]

LOL

[true haven]

the more i play the isle the more i hate the physics of it 😔

[midnight stirrup]

@cinder fossil @empty epoch This might help a tad bit, but earlier whilst I was playing, this particular patch of forest stuck out to me and was perfect in NV. The rest around it was pitch black and useless. This kind of NV and lighting is reminiscent of one of Bilbos and Magpies suggestions for better NV.

Bilbo - #general-feedback message

Magpie - #general-feedback message

When the Moon shined just right, the forest looked awesome at night. Wish it was always like this.

[true haven]

i hope they have a plan to renew the physics system, it is so buggy and so clunky

[cinder fossil]

I do wish that, instead of just a radius of nv, the brightness of everything around you differed by species,
And it wouldn’t be in just black and white like it is now, it would be color, maybe not super vibrant, but not like a movie from the 1950’s
I know this isn’t a realistic game, but I do wish it would take a more realistic approach to night vision.

@midnight stirrup

Forgot to reply 💀

[toxic vortex]

are they every going to get rid of the locked screen while eating and drinking?

it feel awful and at least for me it centered wierdly where i can view one side more than the other

[eager parrot]

How did they break deino again bruh

Just noticed an issue, not sure if its growth related but commonly when I drop a small to medium sized body on the ground it freaks out then teleports away, leaving nothing behind and me starving

[eager parrot]

Holy shite please someone help me

I've just gotten this deino all the way to 50% I literally cant get any food, every single body flys away from me

Does anyone know how to fix thiss??

[normal lotus]

@bitter summit not a bad idea. Plus Kenneth is the best VA for any dino doc. Better than even david

[celest mural]

is there any news about the new patch guys?

[limber hull]

@thorny lynx turn on manual alt bite in game settings, that should fix it

@rose burrow yes, it would

[thorny lynx]

I'll try it tomorrow. It's just SO ANNOYING when I'm trying to bite something in place and I keep moving forward.

[limber hull]

Def auto alt bite

[thorny lynx]

Ohh... so all this time I've been using the wrong bite when I normal bite? FUUUUUUU

[rare fractal]

I read the @ and got so confused why I wasn't pinged till I noticed...

[thorny lynx]

Twins!

[rare fractal]

lmao

[thorny lynx]

Where is that option so I know how to turn it off when I play, tomorrow?

[rare fractal]

It's at the bottom of gameplay settings

[fiery haven]

@sinful creek Saw your suggestion about the ghosting effect etc in the feedback chat. That's not the games fault it's due to your settings and how your PC handles the graphical options, especially when concerning post-fx, DLSS, FXAA etc.

Depending on your PC there will be an option that looks very nice. Personally for me I have a nvidia graphics card so I have it set to NVIDIA DLSS or something like that and now all the foliage is sharp, no ghosting or blurring.

It's the same on other games like war thunder.

Also you can turn off motion blur 😊

[eager parrot]

Anyone know how to stop the flickering without restarting my game?

Changed my Anti AlaisingTo DLSS for 1 second and then changed it back

If I have to log I get stuck in Q

Cant believe changing my quality to a lower setting has just broken my game lol

[sinful creek]

@fiery haven Unless they patched the game recently motion blur can only be set to low and cant be turned off. I have amd 6750xt so no DLSS for me. Which AA & Resolution setting are you using ?

[eager parrot]

Yeah^^

I was just using TAA, switched to DLSS to see if my game would run smoother now the whole world is flickering and changing it back to TAA wont fix it like what??

[fiery haven]

Maybe I'm high but I swear I have Motion blur off. If not then you may be right and it's on low. Can't remember my exact settings but I have everything on high, NVIDIA DLSS, turned 1920 x 1080p.

Can't remember exactly. On holiday atm so not near my pc

I know it's an issue because i accidentally reset my settings and it was so bad like you described

So had to change a lot before I got it looking nice again without the ghosting

[sinful creek]

I have the settings on high aswell but dont remember what I use in the AA & Resolution setting. I am certain motion blur cant be turned off tho. I will test that setting more when I go back to my pc.

[fiery haven]

I remember having the same issue with war Thunder for ages till I found the right settings

[rain hollow]

i like how 40% of general feedback is just ai feedback or balance feedback

[agile roost]

@ocean coral They renamed it because they're adding an actual utah raptor later

[lapis swallow]

@hallow portal why?

[hallow portal]

what?

[lapis swallow]

your suggestion. what are the benefits?

[hallow portal]

poop meter adds realism and fun game play mechanics like managing the poop meter

[lapis swallow]

bro, i am talking about your stamina suggestion

[hallow portal]

oh, because hitting 0 stamina already limits movement and attacks but you can literally stand still for 5 seconds and go back to spamming alts.

[lapis swallow]

so your suggestion is to make combat more sluggish and even more stamina dependent?

[hallow portal]

yep and I think pounces and charges should cost way more stamina

[lapis swallow]

like carno charges? the attack that drains your whole stam in mere seconds?

[hallow portal]

theres no point in it draining stam tho if u can instantly recover and use charge again tho

hitting 0 stamina only has negative effects for like 5 seconds

[lapis swallow]

No??? you have to regain your stam, which takes literal minutes without being in combat.

[hallow portal]

im on official server and not experiencing that

[lapis swallow]

its not like you instantly regain your stam after it gets to zero

[hallow portal]

i can literally charge with cera, hit 0 stam, stand still 5 seconds regen 10% and zoom away holding charge attack

[lapis swallow]

no you cant or you are talking about a cera that forgot that shift exists

[hallow portal]

the only dino that gets negative effects is ptero it takes like 2-3minutes just to fly again (not talking about glide takeoffs)

[lapis swallow]

with low stam you cant fight effectively, cant run away and you just die a lot easier. everything has disadvantages

[hallow portal]

idk what game you're playing tbh or you arent playing offical server

[lapis swallow]

stamina cant be temperered with. lets take a look at teno. it needs its stam to deal damage. you cant just make it that it just cant fight for 30 seconds when its stam is gone

[hallow portal]

im not an expert on the game but the deino, carno, and cera charges shouldn't be as spammable.

[lapis swallow]

carnos charge is not spammable

you can do it a total of four times if you are lucky

or five times

[desert arch]

Deinos lunge isnt spammable either, once you grab someone it melts through your stam

[urban flax]

cera's charge bite doesn't cost stam at all, making dinos unable to regain stam after being empty would change nothing

[hallow portal]

once you grab someone they're dead anyways so it doesn't matter 😛

[desert arch]

No? you still need stam to drown them

lunge doesnt do that much damage

[hallow portal]

idk i think the playerbase just likes spamming alt attacks with no consequence for easy combat

[desert arch]

alt attacks are a bit busted this update, thats true

[hallow portal]

charges should be 100% commitment kind of thing and messing it up should be punished

[desert arch]

but the thing is, alt attacks dont cost stam

[desert arch]

And all playables are already punished for that

except cera

[hallow portal]

how is carno punished if they can charge 5+ times ?

[lapis swallow]

if it fails, it gets run down and killed

[desert arch]

It has no stam, thus it can be run down and easily killed

And its even worse for teno and stego

[hallow portal]

i mean if you have no stam you should be run down and easily killed

thats why hitting 0 stamina should be punished more heavily and all of these "special attacks" like charging and pouncing should use more stam

[desert arch]

but rendering a playable completely useless is fair?

[hallow portal]

which dinos would be useless if you had to manage stamina more carefully during combat?

[amber cosmos]

i think charging and pouncing use enough stam for how much dmg they do

[desert arch]

Teno and stego already suffer heavily due to the lack of stam in long term fights

even carno suffers

miss 1 charge, then proceed to be run down by the whole roster

[hallow portal]

i mean if you commit to an attack and miss it should be punished

[amber cosmos]

it is punished already

[hallow portal]

for one dinosaur that has only enough stamina for one charge?

you said its okay that carno can charge 5+times :\

[amber cosmos]

carno doesnt have enough stam as is why you complaining are you a stego main?

[hallow portal]

no i main character creation cause i'm always dead 🙂

[amber cosmos]

ah so your just bad

[desert arch]

a carno can only charge for 9 seconds before hitting 0 stamina (assuming it only activated charge once)

[ebon coyote]

From what I have Seen people already complain about how hard it is to survive as Carno, and you want to punish them even more? O_o Its super rare I get killed by one and I Play all kinds of Dinos

[north quiver]

#general-feedback message adult beipi definitely needs a higher jump. no doubt about it

[stone hatch]

bro when teno runs out of stam it has the effective damage of a wet napkin

[hallow portal]

whats wrong with that?

[stone hatch]

teno already takes significantly more stamina to attack when compared to anything else, and its damage/hitbox isnt even worth it when u do use your stamina anymore

if teno is out of stamina it gets outbrawled by one raptor blud

[hallow portal]

okay? maybe the teno should have managed stamina better.

also why is a herbi even fighting a raptor to begin with?

[urban flax]

Hmmm good question
Why would a herbi ever be trying to fight off a predator ?

[hallow portal]

i mean if herbi goes aggressive blowing all stamina trying to fight a carni it deserves death

[urban flax]

It doesn't necessarily need to go agressive

Getting out of stam against pretty much anything against a raptor pretty much always means death, I don't think it has to be made even more hopeless

[hallow portal]

every teno I see instantly charges carnis trying to kill them 🙂

[urban flax]

That is not the point

[hallow portal]

it is if you're saying teno can't kill carnis because they blow through stamina too fast

teno isn't a predator xD

[cyan flame]

I don't think that was the point either

[hallow portal]

i'm not saying herbis shouldn't be able to kill carnis either in self-dense but idk about herbis chasing down carnis to kill them

[urban flax]

I can confirm, that was not the point either

[hallow portal]

alsooo irl most herbis never fight back against carnis but you can't replicate that in game with player controlled dinos

[urban flax]

The point is, a teno can run out of stam in self-defence
And it has a very high likeliness of doing so because all of its attacks cost stam, and a rather large amount of it

[urban flax]

eat grass and die

[hallow portal]

lol

[cyan flame]

@hallow portalMost playables are more or less helpless and at least very vunerable without stam, especially if you're up against a bleeder. As such, the change you suggest, would only make it far worse for any fights, and make some playables like teno, carno, stego, pretty much "lie down and die" the moment they no longer have enough stamina to do anything. A minute or getting no stam at all, means you can just rush them and kill them before they can do much about it. Not exactly fun, as we can see with cera vomit lock. And when bucking was more powerful, and pounce was harsher to use, people complained aplenty. You have to keep in mind people enjoy fighting, and as much as this is a survival game and should be focused on that and not pvp, the pvp should still be fun when it does happen.

[hallow portal]

idk how you can say pvp is fun when 90% of it is one shot kills

and most one shot kills are spammable because of stamina not being used

[tall hearth]

Dont fight stuff that 1 shots you

[cyan flame]

Such as? Sure, size and power difference can result in that, but you also have more same sized fights that's not neccesarily like that? And I don't think there's many one shot kills that can be spammed, which attacks are you thinking of?

[stone hatch]

path of titans pvp is unfun because you beat the shi out of something for 5 minutes

[hallow portal]

PoT combat is dumb you just spin in circles biting

[stone hatch]

same with ark, the isle is intended to be slightly more realistic and horror based, and a more risky pvp helps this vision in all aspects

[hallow portal]

idk it would be nice if there was mechanic to escape one shot kills unless you're below certain bleed threshold

[tall hearth]

No

[cyan flame]

Depends on the thing attacking you. It makes little sense you "escape" from a deino lunge or rex grab, or even a stego swing, if you're not more or less as powerful as they are.

[stone hatch]

I could maybe see like changing it to where a stego cant one shot a full grown carno or a galli one shotting a full grown beipi, things like that, as long as things still die quickly and combat is risky

i personally disagree but i could see reason in those two examples

[hallow portal]

i think if dino is in sub-adult stage and the weight class isn't insane there should be QTE or something to escape

i think a sub adult raptor could claw at t-rex eye or something and manage to escape

[stone hatch]

minigames are awful and gimmicky bruh

[cyan flame]

Escape from what? Most attacks are just normal attacks?

[hallow portal]

but it should still one shot kill if u had like 20% health left

[stone hatch]

why would it literally ever do that tho

[cyan flame]

What...

[stone hatch]

blud off the meds

[urban flax]

That kind of situation can already happen in-game
It just takes skill

Players don't deserve to have a "free escape card" in a PvP environment if they're going for situations they should absolutely not go for

[hallow portal]

yeah, but if the dino escapes it won't be in perfect health and get a head,body, or leg fracture.

[urban flax]

It's also weird how you say "people should always have a chance to survive a one-shot" but on the other hand your last suggestion is like "people should always die when their stamina hits 0%"

[urban flax]

It will be in perfect health
Just don't get hit

[tall hearth]

Flip flop city

[hallow portal]

theres a big gap between dying at 0% stamina and getting one shot

[urban flax]

One makes sense in certain situations, the other one is needless extra punishment

[hallow portal]

if herbi dies at 0% stamina its either spamming attacks or trying to escape a carni both acceptable deaths 🙂

[limber hull]

"shouldn't have tried to survive idiot herbi"

[hallow portal]

herbi could have stopped to rest instead of not managing stamina

[limber hull]

remember, herbis are PLAYABLE FOOD they are NOT meant to be fun

[tall hearth]

Remove all attacks from herbivores

[limber hull]

herbi players play to feed (superior) carnivores

[urban flax]

You know, there's a thing in-game called healthbars
They're designed to decide when a player should die
Healthbars empty when a player takes damage
Once it's empty, the player dies
It's a very ocnvenient and intuitive system

[hallow portal]

herbi vs carni, carni should always win unless carni is super out classed like a raptor trying to kill an adult trike or stego

combat should be more skill based and not rely on these dumb one shot attacks though

[urban flax]

This is where you're wrong

[outer yacht]

Just like real life! Wait…

[hallow portal]

yeah just like real life exactly

[cyan flame]

Ah yes, stop to rest in the middle of the fight, makes sense. That's something the faster playable can do, not the slower. Which is often the carni, not the herbi.

[outer yacht]

…it’s not like real life at all

[cyan flame]

What one shot attacks?

[urban flax]

One shot attacks only happens when there is a massive size gap tho
And when omni pounces something its size or smaller

[tall hearth]

Carni should always win

But it should also always be skill based

Do you read what you type

[hallow portal]

cera charging bite, carno charge, deino grab

[urban flax]

You should play real life more often

[cyan flame]

Most things similar sized do not one shot, aside from omni pin but that is it's own issue :p

[hallow portal]

idk about legacy version i only play evaria

[limber hull]

this is absolutely hysterical i refuse to believe this isn't bait

[cyan flame]

Carno charge does not oneshot, cera charge bite does not oneshot, unless you get headshots. Which is fine, you ... kind of have yourself to blame there.

And even so, that only applies to something noticably smaller than them

[hallow portal]

theres youtube videos of carno charge one shotting >_>

[tall hearth]

Headshots go brrr

[cyan flame]

If you somehow take a carno charge to the face, then well, you kind of deserve it. Same if you let a cera charge up an obvious bite and then you shove your face right there for it to bite down.

Also again, this applies to smaller things

[urban flax]

it depends on the target
Would you expect a dryo surviving a charge from a 1.8 ton missile on legs ?

[sinful creek]

whats getting one shot ?

[cyan flame]

A cera does not oneshot a teno or carno or other cera on headshot, nor does a carno charge from what I know.

[hallow portal]

i was sub adult raptor vs sub adult cera and it grabbed me with its charge attack instant dead

[urban flax]

skill issue

[cyan flame]

And a subadult raptor is much smaller than subadult cera?

A cera is quite a bit larger than an omni

[hallow portal]

eh idk sub adult raptor vs cera size difference isn't that big

[urban flax]

Adult raptor is 450 kg
Adult cera is 1300 kg

[hallow portal]

the adult raptor in my group was almost as big and still got one shot

[urban flax]

More than twice as big

[hallow portal]

sub adult not adult

[sinful creek]

big gap in weight and dmg were you afk while it charged its bite ? I mean you are complaning about one shots 20-400kg creatures getting one shot by 1k-1.8k kg dinos is natural

[urban flax]

A subadult cera is still much larger than an adult raptor

Also charge bite only oneshots omni on headshots so you could have avoided that

[sinful creek]

Like I would be okey if they added trample dmg against critter dinos honestly

[hallow portal]

yeah, but if you're a healthy dino and the size diff isn't that big why can't you try fighting back being grabbed?

it could be like raptor/troo pounce but reverse you bite/claw to get released

[sinful creek]

I belive only dino that can grab alive creatures is deino

[hallow portal]

because the game code is written like that 🙂

[sinful creek]

ye

[urban flax]

Because once you're grabbed by anything but a deino it means you're already dead

[hallow portal]

idk i think if sub adult cera/carno grabs a sub adult+ raptor then it should be releaseable

also why can't pack mates rescue you

its in the movies 🙂

[desert arch]

But whats the point when youre already dead?

[cyan flame]

But a cera does not grab something else, not like deino or omni does?

[sinful creek]

you have around 200 hp as sub utah

[hallow portal]

if the code was changed so they could grab alive dinos it you wouldn't be dead

[cyan flame]

It's just normal damage

There's no "grabbing", just a bite attack

[hallow portal]

for example cera, carno, deino grab dino they have to keep pressing attack to chomp you to death

[sinful creek]

imagine the trolling that will ensue if we could grab alive players

[urban flax]

So you would rather add it so bites can grab living dinos but they have a chance to break free ? What's the point ?

[hallow portal]

during that time u can attack back or get rescued by your pack

yeah it could be chomps till death based on weight difference

[urban flax]

That's just a buff to all big animals against smaller ones

They don't need that

[hallow portal]

adult carno biting juvi raptor=one chomp, sub adult = 2 chomps , adult = 3 chomps for example

[desert arch]

Also makes group fights even more clunkier

[hallow portal]

then they could swallow em like normal or release their carcass

thats would be a disadvantage to grab dinos during group combat then

[desert arch]

But then whats the point?

[hallow portal]

to make combat more fun?

[desert arch]

You dont wantto grab dinos either since they can break free

[hallow portal]

a carno vs pack of raptors could still grab one and chomp the n relase if you get chomped there would be chance of body,head,leg fracture

so u could grab raptor break leg, relese, grab next one if thats what you wanted

[desert arch]

This "grab" mechanic is just like deinos lunge
And deinos lunge is not fun at all

[hallow portal]

i would rather get deino grabbed and be able to get released by fighting back then one shot

[urban flax]

You realize that'd still be a one shot, right ?

[desert arch]

But by using your rxamples you get leg fractured and die to the deino anyway since you cant run away

[hallow portal]

but i still didnt get one shot 🙂

[desert arch]

Isnt much more fair either

[hallow portal]

also some dinos with leg fractures still have decent speed

[urban flax]

In no world would a raptor survive a bite from a deino, unless it's on the tail

[desert arch]

Deino can lunge more than once

So theorechically deino can stack all fractures on something smaller

(Not like deino needs any buffs)

[hallow portal]

i mean deino can't actually bite its just a grab>drown>swallow whole or death roll to tear meat off

[urban flax]

Deino also has a regular bite

[desert arch]

Also body fracture would be nuts on deino
Deino grabs you -> takes you to the middle of the river -> gives you body fracture -> releases you -> victim drowns anyway since it cannot swim to shore with body fracture all while the deino consumed minimal amounts of stamina

[hallow portal]

lol deino players would do that just for fun

[desert arch]

Fair and balanced 🙂

[hallow portal]

because deino is fair and balanced now? 🙂

[desert arch]

Current lunge is still more surviveable than whatever this would be

[hallow portal]

uh, how you can't escape grab currently?

[desert arch]

Also carno could just grab its prey, give it some sort of fracture and insta win

[hallow portal]

id rather get grabbed released with fracture then killed over one shot though

[desert arch]

If the deino runs out of stamina it releases you, and it cannot swim without stamina for a few seconds

Thats the time window for escape

[hallow portal]

i mean thats pretty low chance of happening unless the deino player is new

[desert arch]

Even if youre released you die since you cannot swim to shore
Also deino can just spam fracture you

[desert arch]

Deino cant drown stuff like teno or cera even on full stam

[hallow portal]

any dino with grab could spam fracture you unless stamina was changed or it had cooldown

[desert arch]

Again, basically no counterplay and makes the target a free meal.
Its not fun at all.

[hallow portal]

raptor pounce is good example of cooldown tbh idk why cera, carno, and deimos can spam grab

how is there no counterplay to not getting one shot?

[desert arch]

Pounce doesnt have a cooldown?

[hallow portal]

your friend can easily kill or give you enough time to escape

its like 1-2 seconds between pounce wdym?

[desert arch]

If something can 1 shot you theres a good chance you can very easily run away from it

[desert arch]

That goes for basically all attacks tho

[hallow portal]

when humans get added and start one shotting dinos with guns im sure people will cry about it

[desert arch]

Makes solo play even harder

And survival group reliant

[hallow portal]

why would it be such a big mechanic change to require dinos grabbing dinos regardless of size to keep attacking (chomping) grabbed dino to kill it?

[desert arch]

Or the devs can just balance it properly :p

Because it would just be an unnecesary buff to big dinos and would also make combat less fair for smaller ones

Also no counterplay

Besides "not get hit"

[hallow portal]

??? combat is already less fair for small dinos because ceras and carnos one shot with their grabs

[desert arch]

Even current deino lunge is busted
And people complain about it. Now imagine that on all playables with added fracture

[hallow portal]

they would still be alive if they got fracture though

[desert arch]

Easy counter
Press W+shift

[hallow portal]

and they only would get fracture if 1. they escaped or 2. the carni let go

that might be because other dino came to fight or pack mates are trying to save you

or u escaped mashing buttons

[desert arch]

Leg fracture=cant run away
Body fracture=3x stamina consumed on everything
Head fracture=lower damage,cant see

[hallow portal]

surviving grab is priceless 🙂

[obsidian jetty]

just to make sure I understood this right...what you want is to die after the grab instead of during the grab?

[hallow portal]

yes i want the chance of survival

instead of 100% you died screen

[desert arch]

Whats stopping the cerni from grabbing you, then letting you go immediately?
With a fracture you are just dead anyway, why hold onto something when its free food already?

[obsidian jetty]

well that's the misconception...it would be 100% death screen either way most of the time...it would just take longer with the grab

[desert arch]

Which is what ive been saying for the past 15 minutes

Also would make any big carnivore overpowered

[hallow portal]

i mean that would be their option to go around fracturing tbh

also right now if a cera or carno is fighting a raptor pack it can just go for insta one shot kills with grab

[obsidian jetty]

unless the act of breaking free staggers whatever grabbed you, it will just bite instantly and kill you anyway

[hallow portal]

if the cera/carno was required to ACTUALLY continue biting with you in its mouth it would make fighting packs more dangerous

it could drop a raptor with leg fracture but that raptor isnt out of the fight

also like i said it would be weight class based so a cera/carno could still kill hatchling/juvi raptors with one bite after grabbing but larger dinos like sub adult/adult raptors would be two or three bites

[desert arch]

Carno can only 1shot omni if it lands a headshot with charge, which is... unlikely to say the least with current carno

Cerato can only 1 shot an omni if it lands a fully charged bite (which takes about 2-3 seconds to be fully charged) on an omnis head
Again, unlikely since omni is way faster

[hallow portal]

idk i think the current you died screen is dumb with no survival chance as decent size dino

[desert arch]

You should have tried to survive before the death screen :p

[urban flax]

You need to understand that it's normal to have no survival chance when your health reaches zero

[sinful creek]

Utah is not a decent size dino its a small tier dino

[urban flax]

What you're asking for is basically reducing averyone's damage accross the board, but with extra steps

[desert arch]

This reminds me when someone requested omni to be able to survive a 1 shot on 1% hp, fun times

[hallow portal]

i'm asking that cera,deino, and carno have more steps before they one shot kill you 😉

[urban flax]

Also there was that one person who asked for herbis to be unable to deal damage to carnivores until attacked

[urban flax]

So you're asking for reduced damage

[obsidian jetty]

guess you're gonna love the rex

[hallow portal]

once again whats the big deal if they grab you to require them to continue biting before you reach zero health?

[cyan flame]

First off, please stop calling normal attacks grabs, because they're not. It's just normal bites, and so on. Second, no, they should one shot certain targets, that's fine, especially since those one shots only happen on headshots in some cases.

[desert arch]

But they can only 1 shot you under extremely specific circumstances

[hallow portal]

i'm talking about the deinos and cera bite grab

idk if carno can bite grab you tbh

[obsidian jetty]

the cera does not grab

[hallow portal]

which dino charges with its mouth open and bites you and can carry you around then

[desert arch]

Only deino can grab alive targets

[obsidian jetty]

it can only carry you when you die from the bite

[sinful creek]

This is pointless. Your dead body gets grabbed because other dinos dmg was higher than your health

[hallow portal]

im saying they should change the code to allow that tho

[obsidian jetty]

the cerato can not grab a living dino

[hallow portal]

no more one shot kills ony alive dino grabs

[urban flax]

No we don't need to have even more dinos be able to grab

[urban flax]

Completely removing oneshot kills would be ridiculous

[hallow portal]

why not that would make combat more immersive

[desert arch]

So make small tiers magically survive things they should have died to?

[obsidian jetty]

grab is the lamest mechanic in the game tbh...

[cyan flame]

That seems... strange. Those one shot kills are fine, you're complaining about something that isn't an issue. The one shots so far in the game, are more or less reasonable.

[hallow portal]

grab with chance to escape would make combat way more dynamic as well

[sinful creek]

You get grabbed because code knows you died and considers your body food

[desert arch]

Because a juvi troodon surviving a bite from a carno is immersive

[sinful creek]

Because you tried to fight a 2 ton creature as a utah

[hallow portal]

idk if carno bite is a grab or not

i'm stirctly talking about the deinos and cera grab

[sinful creek]

İts not a grab

[urban flax]

It would make it more sluggish
Instead of simply surviving a bite and continuing the fight you'd need to escape it first

[urban flax]

cera has no grab

[sinful creek]

Cera does not have a grab

[hallow portal]

because cera is coded as instant kill

[desert arch]

Also would make the grabbed creature free food afterwards

[urban flax]

[hallow portal]

i think you guys are cera enjoyers tbh

[urban flax]

Cera is coded to deal a set amount of damage
If that damage exceeds your health, you die. Simple as that.

[desert arch]

Dang

[urban flax]

I think you're trolling

[hallow portal]

you just want instant kills to dab on people

[sinful creek]

No, you are simply suppose to die when you get bitten by a fully charged bite from a cera

[desert arch]

But ypu can easily escape instant kills

[hallow portal]

thats dumb though

[sinful creek]

İf you are playing small dinos

[hallow portal]

cera can grab THEN decide to keep munching to kill it shouldn't be game over screen thats dumb

[desert arch]

If an omni lets a cera get a headshot on it with a charged bite thats MASSIVE skill issue

[sinful creek]

Its the same thing as stepping on an ant

[sinful creek]

Cera doesnt have grab

[hallow portal]

cera bite grab then w/e u want to call it

[desert arch]

Also, what would stegos "grab" look like?

[hallow portal]

it's the cera charging attack were you end up in the mouth with game over screen

[obsidian jetty]

try...not putting your head between the ceratos jaws when it bites o.o

[sinful creek]

Impale

[hallow portal]

stegos has impale tbh that shouldnt be one shot either unless its headshot