general-feedback-discussion

[dusk meteor]

It's not right but you're dealing with a cesspit of different people, who have different perspectives, backgrounds and issues. In that situation they should be acting evenif it's just for show to paint a positive image of themselves

that's not good but that would help them

But I guess the reality is that no one on the team is really good at carrying the social side of the development or no one has been designated it as a task. It's an art in itself because it's not easy. They'd need someone good with words and good with people, and I don't know if they have that person

[cyan quarry]

Do they have enough money to recruit someone like this ?

[dusk meteor]

I don't think Dondi would want to even if they did. On a small team liketheirs it's better to have it be like, the side-task of someone doing something else for the development

I'm pretty sure if he wantd someone capable in PR he would've gotten someone ages ago

it would'vesaved a lot of headache lmao

[neon zephyr]

Yeah; I agree they need to sit down and just work on that sort of thing too.
I personally don't want to see anymore content added until they fix up what they already have.

The more you add new stuff to an already buggy, broken mess; the worse it's going to get???
And a lot of bugs or flat out broken code built on each other makes updating it more of a hassle?
(TS4, for example)

||I'm not a game designer LOL, so just speaking from what I have/can see with games I follow ; A ; I could be wrong I guess LOL||

But; they certainly need to at least reverse the update and remove nv for now due to the health concerns, I think.

And before people jump my case; I'm not saying "scrap the system"

I'm saying remove for now, until you work on it more, so you don't risk your player's health anymore.

But; I'm not sure I see that happening, esp given the players who are still playing the game and/or have decided they like the nv as is.

But that's also why I've just uninstalled the game for now. 😅
No point in me having it when I can't even play it anymore for the time being.

[dusk meteor]

I also think rolling back the update would be the most competent decision while adjustments are worked on. God forbid they take a responsible decision ig

it might still happen, but I don't really have high hopes on them doing anything in a timely manner

[obsidian jetty]

see? that's what I mean 😛 constant attacks ^^

[dusk meteor]

It's not an attack, it's the reality. They're a business, which means they are subject to being looked at like one

[neon zephyr]

It's really not meant as an attack.

It's just my truth.

[dusk meteor]

and imo it's a poor business practice not to act somewhat speedily.

[neon zephyr]

If they surprise me and do it? AWESOME

That's be great.

[gritty terrace]

I have no idea hoe epilepsy works but tell me if this helps; my thought is making the lines thicker but also giving them softer edges and letting people choose the outline color

[obsidian jetty]

I wasn't talking about what you said @neon zephyr

[neon zephyr]

Ahhh okk ~ Sorry Ellyldan ^^

[dusk meteor]

You need to separate what is reality versus an attack. If a food product didn't label allergens, that would also be an irresponsible decision

with potential legal ramifications

slash also separate humour

[cyan quarry]

I don't see any business in what they are doing. In their case it's more a project

[gritty terrace]

To be fair even what frost said wasn't really an attack personally, just saying rolling back the update is a good idea in a joking manner

Because of the devs past of taking a while

[dusk meteor]

businesses have projects too. It is a project. And they are a business.

It is irresponsible to leave it and I'mbasically taking a crack at that. There's people on the team that have no say in whether something happens or not

[cyan quarry]

I wonder how much they got pay

[dusk meteor]

not to do with us

[gritty terrace]

You can probably just look that up

[obsidian jetty]

I am aware of the fact that was cynical...and thus not nearly as bad as much of the other stuff they're getting. And I do agree, as it is a health issue we are talking about, we need a solution for it...any...and even if it's just a temporary one.

[dusk meteor]

i doubt any of them have spoken about pay. they don't have to and they're under no need to talk about it

[dusk meteor]

It's not bad at all. Humour is the best way to make light of a serious situation with serious points. I can articulate it without being cynical but that's not half as interesting.

[cyan quarry]

@dusk meteor just curiosity, I won't push on this idea. I just wish the "business" feel more serious than now.

[neon zephyr]

N it can kinda be different for everyone @gritty terrace ; esp given there's multiple types of epilepsy, and everyone has different triggers.
Drs recommend creating a sort of "trigger journal" for you to track supposed triggers and more or less try to confirm by that.

I think I'd have to just see some of these changes for myself, in action, to really give good feedback on how well the change has or hasn't worked. I don't want to say YES THIS WOULD WORK, when truthfully I'm just not sure. ; A ;

I think trying stuff like thicker lines, making the color of the lines more opaque or maybe more of a grey over white, and possibly even the motion blur thing mentioned might be good places to start??

I know I struggle greatly with black backgrounds and white text; same for straight-white bg with straight-black text.

I more or less tend to use shades of grey to help soften things up.

I.e. I use dark mode on Discord; so it's all varying levels of grey with the white text... n really this white text doesn't even seem to be a.. "bright" white, if that makes sense???

[dusk meteor]

They're a small team, it'll probably never feel that serious to us. It's gradually become more so as the devs have realised interacting with a cesspit is hard and have gradually pulled back, which makes them more faceless and more business-like already to me

[neon zephyr]

Certain text fonts and certain sizes mess with me really bad too 😂

And don't get me started on the pretty c o l o u r s people like to add (i.e. to website profiles)

[dusk meteor]

which iswhy I went out on a limb to praise filipe. I kinda just feel bad for him but he did more than anyone else in the fallout

at least, more publically

[neon zephyr]

Here's the image for Lost Ark's photosensitive mode again
It darkens/greys things up a bit (an immediate difference you see when you turn it on/off)

N then it also completely gets rid of (more or less) a bunch of crazy effects there'd otherwise be.

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/423939730544132096/1011763896148828200/photosensitivity_mode.PNG
https://preview.redd.it/n4i6jxmh2sh81.jpg?auto=webp&s=5e739b2096bc66fe6940fe3140bf31cc5e812b2f

[gritty terrace]

Ah I see what you mean, so more transitions of color helps

[neon zephyr]

I hope my discussions help LOL

All I can really do is talk about things that I know bother/help; bc I don't really know all the terms of technical things people have been talking about. Like I said - I'm not too savvy with that sort of thing. 😂 But imma try my best to help

[neon zephyr]

Yes I believe so; and less jarring shifts.

[ripe thistle]

The difference is that there isn't any actually bright visuals with the current nv. No light glare or obscenely bright outlines as presented. But I'm curious how it would look if they were to.. "soften it up"?

[limber hull]

general feedback is being utterly ridiculous rn lmao

"guys a single dev said that the community is inconsistent with what they want with balance so it's hard to trust what they say! Quickly, twist his words to make it seem like the devs HATE feedback and want NOTHING to do with the community, despite the fact he was quite literally doing a Q&A during the stream!"

[thorny crag]

those were his words tho in the chat and on stream aswell, it disheartening to hear that

it's not good what is happening rn, pr wise anyway

[limber hull]

these takes are absurd and prove WHY the devs wouldn't want to talk with us in the first place. He said something, it got COMPLETELY taken out of context and now the community is once again painting the dev team as a whole as horrible awful people

[thorny crag]

why say this publicly

[limber hull]

Filipe ISN'T EVEN PR, so expecting him to act as such is ridiculous

[thorny crag]

it's ridiculous to say "everything the community says is bs"

[limber hull]

he didn't say that

once again, you're being utterly ridiculous

[thorny crag]

if u think so ok

[limber hull]

were you even paying attention to the context?

he was talking SPECIFICALLY about balance

[thorny crag]

i watched it yea and i follow this game many years, never have i heard this before

[limber hull]

specifically, he was pointing out his frustrations in the fact that the community is never satisfied, they want 2 complete opposites and it's impossible to please the community

He "can't trust us" because one feedback he hears might be the complete opposite of what another large group of the community wants

[thorny crag]

i don't think it's right to say that they can only trust qa and some friends when theres plenty of feedback channels and devblog asks us to share out opinion

[limber hull]

You cherry picking his words to make him seem like the villain proves exactly why the devs are so hesitant to talk with us about anything

you are purposely leaving out vital pieces of information to push a narrative

[thorny crag]

what i saw is a very sad and frustrated dev, this is sad to see you know, why share this exact thing that will ultimately get back to them

best to be careful with what you present

[limber hull]

damn, I'm sure making him seem like someone who HATES community feedback and the community will REALLY cheer him up from his sad and frustrated state

[thorny crag]

idk whyt u try to project on me

[limber hull]

He'll cheer right up after he's seen how you've twisted his words

Because you're doing something unfair

I'm not projecting, I'm calling you out for doing something that's just unfair and mean, and only serves to alienate the devs from us more

[thorny crag]

this is not my company, they are hurting themselves, i don't try to do anything but i share how i feel

[limber hull]

Pay attention to the WHOLE clip with all of its context

Stop cherrypicking what you need to spin your narrative

[thorny crag]

ok it's fine

[limber hull]

So many people have fallen for this narrative too because people like you are making it seem like that was the intent

It's causing a greater divide, it's completely unhealthy for dev relations

[thorny crag]

i was honestly shocked to see him that way, was that stream planned or anything?

[crisp topaz]

Let's be real the amount of time these devs spend giving us details, answering questions, and giving feedback to the community, when none of us are owed even an ounce of it.

It's kinda silly to see the community throw fits the way they do

So many entitled players

[limber hull]

It was a stream he decided to do in order to give the community a nice little insight into upcoming content to help keep us out of the dark and up to date with progress

I'm sure the positive feedback will make this a frequent thing

[thorny crag]

yea lets hope it goes that way

can't count the amounts of annoyed sighs during the 10 minute compilation i saw, i hope that work goes better than the communication here

i'm worried but i let this topic be for now

[low canopy]

that moment when certain member of X got removed from Y over having opinion/criticising

Also, community is your friend, not your enemy, this is baffling to me

[crisp topaz]

Imagine sifting through 30k people worth of feedback across various channels and platforms just to be told how to make THEIR game.

[low canopy]

Those are just opinions, you don't and should not take things directed at game as a whole personally

[crisp topaz]

But when players do such, there's no discrepancy allowed?

[low canopy]

Freedom of opinion and discussion should be encouraged, not shut down.
That only leads to Whats its called.... "Echochamber", you can see it every day in ID for example where "wrong" opinions get shut down and dog piled

[crisp topaz]

Are they wrong opinions or attacked opinions? Cuz there's a distinct difference.

Filipe made it very clear what was good and concise feedback that was warranted and what was not.

When players choose to push their own agenda because they don't agree with something, that puts devs in a position to silence because it's not the players game or decision to make.

[low canopy]

So what? They don't have to give in if they feel like it

[thorny crag]

But they ask for feedback in several channels, if a player get headaches from playing then it's their right to say so

[crisp topaz]

Yes it's a right to say so, but there are people attempting to strong arm the devs cuz they can't play. How is that just?

[low canopy]

also regarding night as a whole, I reckon your average joe just wants to be able to play the game, thats it.
Everything else is secondary to them, now i dont think those views intertwine with the vision devs have which results in conflict

[thorny crag]

No I don't feel this is true honestly. I read through feedback and most people just share their opinions there, some for many years now. It's OK to say some of it are trolls and fake but by no means all.

Critical thinking doesn't have to mean there's an agenda to destroy the game

[crisp topaz]

The feedback regarding NV is just sad. There are a lot of really good suggestions and feedback in there but there are also a lot of people who feel they're entitled to a specific change and lash at the devs as if it's owed. I can think of tons of games that don't cater to photosensitive players and the ones that do are generally published by AAA studios with millions to put into the game and 100+ team members.

Personally my opinion means very little regarding a game I'm not making, despite how long I've allegedly supported or backed their ideas.

[low canopy]

I don't trust my takes regarding the game to be good, (which is why i don't make feedback)
But this whole deal with "us vs them" regardless of parties involved needs to disappear, its destructive and sad to see

[surreal sedge]

those games are published feature complete usually and dont add anything afterwards that make people with photosensitivity physically ill, i think people are entitled to being able to keep playing the game they payed for and were fine with before this update, hopefully this stuff is considered in the night terrors update adding more diverse nightvision for creatures, i do think there is merit to my suggestion to add just a bit of brightness even if it washes out the color to this version of nightvision so the contrast isnt too high.

besides i dont think this dev team wants to be compared to EA

[thorny crag]

yea very sad

[midnight stirrup]

@thorny crag I can further back this up, I do not think they listen much. I even think that support/assistance roles are also somewhat ignored unfortunately, I had a critical issue that still isn’t fixed and has rendered me unable to play the game as a whole. Throughout the 4 days that this issue happened, I pinged tech support and admins multiple times, and I got almost nothing in response outside of server members.

[thorny crag]

if you are lucky then a qa member gets to the same issue or you maybe catch a dev in discussion channel to ask about this one day

[low canopy]

i'd just try to reach out to Krow when they are around, they are super nice and know about tech stuff

[lapis mauve]

Hello, I have a problem with The Isle, so evrima works perfectly for me but when I enter legacy it doesn't work well, does anyone have an idea why?

[low canopy]

you should check https://discord.com/channels/401464048610312193/401485101046693888 pins if there is fix to your problem

[crystal trail]

You know you're able to DM me for troubleshooting

[midnight stirrup]

I am?

[crystal trail]

Yeah, in the #rules-and-info there's one that I made which exempts me from the tag/dm rule.

[midnight stirrup]

I’m in school right now, but I’ll send the problem and a few examples in dms if that’s okay?

[crystal trail]

Yup, whenever is convenient for you

[crystal trail]

^

[lapis mauve]

@crystal trail can you help i join game and keeps freezing and having framerates and fps drops i reinstalled the game but still dont work

[crystal trail]

As I mentioned to Weaver, DM me

That way we aren't clogging up this channel with various solutions

[icy fiber]

@brittle ermine that clip is obviously a skill gap issue, they pressed pounce button, if you wanted to make sure they couldnt pounce on you in the middle of your attack animations then you shouldve gone over to their house and beat them over the head with their keyboard, obviously.

[brittle ermine]

Lol ok firstly when I saw the notification was like, of ffs here we go. Then I read further into your tactic and can't find anything to disagree upon, the best course of action truly is to ambush them and use their own keyboard against them. Obviously

[icy fiber]

right? its the best counter really. but in all honesty I feel like attacks should take priority over pounce. "missing pounce" isnt really all that punishing outside of 1v1 scenarios and for that reason it shouldnt be made anymore punishing, but utahs hunt in massive packs so punishing them when they miss isnt a reliable way to fight them, because you likely have 3-5 other utahs to worry about so at the very least their pounce should have a lower priority than things like bite / tail slam.

[brittle ermine]

I'm compliling all the clips I have of utah just ignoring spacing or literal attacks on it's pounce path to display it better but it's just not a fun fight to be honest.

[faint folio]

Attacks do prioritize over pounce-- been countered by both teno and pachy stuns in the middle of pouncing (after starting the jump animation but before connecting/latching).

Though really it's normally not missing pounce that is punishing, but rather the brief stun when dismounting-- which is imo how it should be. Gives dinos a chance to kill on the mount and dismount in exchange for high bleed

I think this may be a case of lag though... I've been clobbered despite being nowhere near a stego after dismounting, and the same in reverse

[lapis swallow]

@quasi vault I think its because of the fact that utah uses its bite while being in a highly agile state. It cant put as much force behind its bites if it does crazy turns n stuff

[ripe thistle]

Utah arent powerful, they're agile shredders. In most cases, the animation shows them clawing as well. But I can see how it feels underwhelming, not much snap. More guttural sounds than anything else.

[quasi vault]

the biggest problem is, if you're opening your mouth that wide for a bite, realistically the most it would do is scrape the target with the front teeth. The mouth isnt opening up wide enough to get around anything

[ripe thistle]

Could be the point? Maybe. Just slash/tear at the hind muscles during a chase without getting caught up in the power.

Would definitely like to see some kind bite mechanic around holding left click or something, which i think was suggested for deino power bites

Like raptor in pounce position, rather than just outright leaping, would open their maw and go for a big hit

[peak granite]

@bronze notch you can get out of it! I got trapped there as a utah and I managed to get out it just took some pretty exact maneuvering. I doubt you’d be able to get out with anything other than ptera, utah, and hypsi though

[faint folio]

@mossy horizon I like the idea, but I want to raise it with -- what about smell?

The scent system is currently downright underpowered compared to hearing and sight for tracking. Think about it-- if you're an herbi you can smell plant food nodes, pack scent, dead things, blood and water. If you're a carni, you can smell packs, dead things, blood, and water, and also footprints (but only if something passed by extremely recently, and animals don't always leave footprints along their entire path.

It would be awesome if dinos used smell to help compensate when vision is poor-- maybe sniffing helps lighten nearby area or modifies squiggles to indicate you can smell something nearby

Then night vision is really more like an overlay combining sensory information, rather than "literally what you can see at night"

[mossy horizon]

Yeah I've thought about scent as well but couldn't reference how it could work in game, the idea you have for scent though definitely could work.
Since it's an ecosystem every inhabitant needs their way to navigate and scent would add more to the table, an enjoyable take.

[faint folio]

Also plenty of animals have good enough smell that they can track down food for miles

[mossy horizon]

Yeah something like Rex which is known for its good sense of smell would really benefit from using it during night too

[faint folio]

You could go with an overlay at night (with things closer or staying still showing up more boldly, and things moving quickly or further away showing more faintly, representing how strong of a smell you get -- also affected by how long you stand sniffing).

Or you could do a static compass icon (I smell prey/predators to the SW) for medium to long distance, and in short range (sight range during the day) simply a message "a teno passed by recently". So that you can't use scent to track down creatures hidden in a bush

[mossy horizon]

The first idea I like since it has to deal with distance, keeping the mystery of something in the dark is needed for something to make The Isle more like a horror game

[faint folio]

Absolutely. And you realistically should be able to smell something more easily if the source is closer to you

Similarly, the longer something is in the same place, the more time you have to smell it, and determine direction and source. You may catch a whiff on the wind, but may be unable to identify what it is or where it's coming from if it's brief enough. This would also allow nocturnals like troodon to hide by staying in motion

Idk, I just think it's weird that these animals basically can't smell anything other than carrion and water

[mossy horizon]

That sounds sick, it would make sense for how that would work.
And yeah I agree it is strange how you can only smell tracks and food/water sources but not the animals themselves. Speaking of which mud could be even more useful when tackling animals that rely on scent more (if mud is able to hide scent).

To have sight, sound, and scent all vary and be complex in the game would make night interesting nonetheless..

[faint folio]

Yeah exactly! Wallowing would prevent your dino from leaving scent that others can pick up, preventing tracking and making you near invisible in night vision mode

[barren zephyr]

Social movement to convince confused fans to move on from the isle

[faint folio]

I just feel like so many make the mistake of forgetting about how important scent is to animals because humans really have absolutely terrible sense of smell compared to sight and hearing. Obviously with the medium, smell can't literally be shown directly to the player so the alternative is a visual overlay that represents smell to us strongly visual primates lol

[mossy horizon]

Yeah lol plus it just adds more to the animal's playstyle at the end of the day (literally).

and it opens up even more of a gateway to perks probably

[bronze notch]

oh goddamn. unlucky then i guess. still such a death hole!!!

[vestal rune]

bruh what is this clown ass "delete the feedback channel" 💀

[topaz pendant]

Why is everyone taking about not being trusted ?

Did I miss something?

[scarlet ocean]

Yeah o-o Majorly, There was alot of quite disgusting stuff being said about the community in the latest stream from the devs. So now the community is in disbelief, thats why theres so many feedbacks about it rn

[topaz pendant]

The devs where saying it about the community ?

[scarlet ocean]

Im sure you can watch the stream through twitch if it was saved by anyone, or themselves

[scarlet ocean]

Yeah, but dont look at me to explain it 😅 Sorry, its more worth for you to listen to all of it

[topaz pendant]

Ok thx

[scarlet ocean]

Obviously it wasn't all bad, but from the communities response to it, and suddenly so many people coming and defending themselves out of literally nowhere, i think you can imagine that its bad 🥲 ✌️

[topaz pendant]

Kk

[scarlet ocean]

You should catch up on isle news then if you dont get it xD

[vestal rune]

what isle news?

[scarlet ocean]

The many youtube channels, feedback channels rallying out of literally nowhere, and watching the isle dev streams

[vestal rune]

that filipe said that most of the community can't be trusted because they complain about everything? do you think that's new? this has been the opinion of the devs for years and frankly I agree with them

[scarlet ocean]

No no not only that, there is much much more

[vestal rune]

like what?

[scarlet ocean]

Im not going to be the one to explain it to you, were not really friends nor am i here to explain stuff, just guide people to the right direction 😅 Sorry, But you can look into it yourself and youll find stuff for sure

Good luck =D

[vestal rune]

what is this lmao, I literally have been playing this game for 6 years and have 2000 hours, I know almost everything about it

if you're suggesting I go into r/theisle then you're insane

[scarlet ocean]

Yeah hell no, since when is reddit a valueable source of information. But clearly you havent heard everything

[vestal rune]

btw, the devs have a long history of responding to player feedback

[scarlet ocean]

Are you really gonna argue in here? and try to overpower me just cause you have many hours? Thats quite childish. You cant say ''you know everything'' when theres also people who know stuff you clearly dont. So please just do some more research and have a good day =)

[vestal rune]

bro what are you even on about lmao, you are acting like the devs are some tyrants

[scarlet ocean]

Theyre not, but everyone has a bad side to them as well as a good one, theyre not saints either

[vestal rune]

I've done my research, I know all about the bad things the devs have done, I've watched the stream

it honestly seems like you are just hating on the game to hate on it, as you won't even criticise anything in paticular and are just calling the devs bad

if there's something you don't like, call it out instead of going "do your own research =)"

[scarlet ocean]

Im very much not, i have incredibly passion for this game, im not going into full detail cause there simply already is enough and a time comes where people are so hurt that they dont even explain, cause the entire situation and feedback channels speak for themselves. So all we can actually do now is just rally and hope something gets better

[vestal rune]

ok but what made you hurt? that a dev called the community whiners?

[scarlet ocean]

Dont say just me, its more than 50% of the community right now, atleast in this week.

And its everything, the game going bad as a whole. Evrima was made to make a better game, and it is slowly following the same failed example of legacy

and if you disagree, thats fine, but theres not just ''me'' thats hurt

[vestal rune]

legacy's failed example is a broken code base and a focus on more dinos rather than improving the game

neither of which apply to evrima

[scarlet ocean]

Yeah, they created it to add those things, cause they physically couldnt with legacy

so they had to crap it

[vestal rune]

to crap it?

[scarlet ocean]

**scrap

oops xD typo

[vestal rune]

ye that's pretty much it

[scarlet ocean]

Yeah, I agree. So im not 100% sure whats your argument here. Were kinda just talking

[vestal rune]

btw are you one of those people with the idea that the devs will ban you for making a slight criticism on the game? your feedback makes it seem that way

I've chronically made fun of the isle with mods right in the discussion channel, never got banned lol

[scarlet ocean]

Very much so, cause they have done it before. And in the past it happened extremely often. if it doesnt happen as much anymore, thats great. But the past matters and it impacts people (again, not just me)

[scarlet ocean]

i feel like your lucky, but if its legit, thats nice then 😅

[peak granite]

Very much, it’s deceiving too you have no idea till you’re walking in

[vestal rune]

you are definitely making things up, I have literally seen the devs prevent someone who was breaking the rules from getting banned so they could talk to them

if you're not disrespectful you can criticise the game as much as you want, maybe the community will get mad at you but you won't get banned

[uneven mist]

||its mostly the mods that ban or mute for some dumb reason||

[vestal rune]

I mean tbh the mods and admins sometimes punish people for stupid reasons, but it's never just because you criticise the game lol

[scarlet ocean]

I swear that im not, I've seen it happen, to others and even to my friends who made a critisicm post just like me or something similar, theyre no longer here.

[vestal rune]

I'm sure they did something else to get banned, you can look in the feedback channel and see many posts similar to yours lol

[scarlet ocean]

Its a double edged sword, the devs egos and emotional stability is sadly very poor.. so they get offended and get defensive over almost everything..

[scarlet ocean]

Will do then

[vestal rune]

by "devs" you mean literally one dev, dondi, none of the other devs are that bad lol

[scarlet ocean]

I won't call names in here, thats risky business

[bronze notch]

i know right?!

i stumbled there at night too

[vestal rune]

omg guys dondi is really mean and insults people a lot, this is really unprofessional behaviour and he should stop interacting with the community

look, I'm fine, the mods probably agree with me lmao

[scarlet ocean]

Cause you did it on purpose, aka not from the heart. But ok, yeah he is awful, but i still wont call names cuz it isnt just dondi like you say it is

[vestal rune]

what do you mean not from the heart? this has always been my opinion of him, he is infamous for his behavior lmao

[scarlet ocean]

I think you said that text up above just to prove to me that your fine 😅 thats all

[vestal rune]

if you start hate brigades on the devs the mods will obviously ban you, but if you're just criticising them you'll be fine

[scarlet ocean]

I dont wanna test that though, cause eventually it will suddenly be a problem

[vestal rune]

hell they even have moderation complaint forms

[spring holly]

Probably a lot of devs out there have a bad attitude 🤷‍♀️ i mean, who cares as long as what they release is decent work

[vestal rune]

honestly can't blame them for having a bad attitude with this community lol

[scarlet ocean]

Idk man, i disagree. It isnt just about creating a game and releasing updates, connections and contact with the community that plays theyre game imo is almost more important than actually doing updates and work on the game

No community = no game/work technically

[vestal rune]

I'd say punch does a decent job of that, remember he is the actual community manager lol

[scarlet ocean]

Ok, i can agree with decent, but not good.. He is known to blatantly ignore people too..

[vestal rune]

you know whenever he talks a bunch of people flock to the channel right? he isn't able to respond to everyone lmao

[scarlet ocean]

There arent that many ppl even asking questions, whenever they or he pops into the discord chats, theres only a max of 3-4 ppl properly trying to talk to him

[spring holly]

if i did that, i wouldnt listen/read/play 90% of the stuff I like. you gotta seperate the artist from the art.

[scarlet ocean]

Imo thats very easy to keep track of everything and multitask like crazy

[scarlet ocean]

True that

[vestal rune]

from what I've seen it's not that easy lol, I don't think he's exactly an exceptionally fast typer

[scarlet ocean]

Too bad ig If thats the case that sucks

[spring holly]

and most devs out there dont interact much with their community and with good reason. maybe the isle should start doing the same

were legit spoiled here

[vestal rune]

the isle is doing the same lol, punch is the only one who constantly interacts with the community

[scarlet ocean]

Not everyone is awful though, as we are called. And wdym by spoiled?

[faint folio]

I think the main problem is questions get buried under other conversations in the general chat. When he's actively answering questions, I doubt he's intentionally skipping things. But the main chat easily gets 10-15 texts a second most of the time

[scenic sapphire]

Yeah, I think if they supposedly despise us as much as they do, then maybe they should better focus on transparency instead of reaching out to the community otherwise.

[spring holly]

the devs talk to their community and stream. a lot of games im waiting for just do posts and never reply to any of the comments

[faint folio]

Heck, sometimes I miss parts of a conversation I'm having in that channel

[scarlet ocean]

Thats fair

[scenic sapphire]

I would much prefer actual transparency and proper reaction to feedback than them popping into general chat.

[scarlet ocean]

Alright, in the case it seems like were spoiled, But maybe the games your waiting for actually have nothing wrong and theyre cruising just fine, maybe

[scarlet ocean]

Very much so, yup

[peak granite]

Oh yikes, that’s the worst

[scenic sapphire]

and the fact that this isn't the first time we've had slips like this is just like... So then stop affording us this much communication. Go. Do what every other game is doing, I don't want to hear about how we're all "spoiled" because we want to see a game in a very niche genre do well.

[faint folio]

I've been seen Punch answer questions with "I don't know" or "I need to ask the other devs first before I can share"-- he doesn't seem to be ignoring questions he doesn't feel comfortable answering

[spring holly]

oh they have plenty wrong, especially the big companies

[scenic sapphire]

I think the "ignoring of questions" thing is a bit of a moot point, isn't it? There are like 10,000 people in this discord and they all swarm as soon as a dev pops in.

[scarlet ocean]

ok, definietly not, not 10k people. I'd be generous if i said 5-6 people o-o, the others just chill with theyre own conversation

[faint folio]

I agree with this. But it's also nice that they pop by randomly too. Wish devs in general were a little more transparent -- there's a few games I follow where the devs keep things very hush hush

[scenic sapphire]

Idk I'm tired of the weird complaining about the whole of the community. If it weren't for your community, your game would go nowhere as an indie dev, so. Y'know whatever

[vestal rune]

fairly sure most of the "complaining" is them explaining how they don't necessarily listen to what people say because it's not always useful

[scenic sapphire]

yeah no I've been around here for a few years and it gets INSANE when devs pop into chat sometimes

[vestal rune]

a lot of people will just complain when change is implemented

[scenic sapphire]

that's true, people will bitch just to bitch but ignoring the fact that there has been an energy of "this whole community is spoiled babies" in the past, is irresponsible, as well

[vestal rune]

I mean from what I remember that energy mostly comes from dondi

[scenic sapphire]

without your community you don't get sales. you don't get feedback, you don't get player count, etc etc. and YEAH yeah, but not entirely from him

[vestal rune]

I've never seen punch or anything act like that, although I guess filipe sort of had a similar sentiment but I don't think he meant it as that

[faint folio]

I didn't watch the stream so idk about filipe

[scenic sapphire]

I'm not going to continue to support a game where I feel like there's this begrudging relationship between us and the devs to the point where there have been active general insults like... I know I'm not the only one. I understand and empathize with the fact that there is very much a risk to one's mental health when exposing themselves to as big a crowd as this, especially when you put love into what you're doing, but the place to express frustration and in the way that it is being and has been in the past is not where it has been.

needs to be* imo and there's the issue of "if the feedback channel is useless, are you just putting it there to placate us" and then like how much else has been there just to placate us.

there's already a lack of transparency in many places where it feels crucial, but to place dummy channels ontop of that lack is like. Lol.

I hope that's not true

[vestal rune]

fairly sure punch checks the feedback channels lol

[spring holly]

I dont think so either. I watched the stream and I had the feeling he was trying to say they cant blindly follow what their community wants. they know what they want for the game and sometimes it doesnt align with the community.

[scenic sapphire]

I like punch yeah

but the problem is what's been said, really

[compact forum]

Ugh... the skin colors are making this game alot less realistic and more like BOB

[scenic sapphire]

because with everything else that goes on and then to hear that they don't pay attention to the feedback channels bc "most of them are liars" is like. lmao

[spring holly]

the color palet should be more natural... a blueberry stego... ugh. yah.. has a BOB feel to it

[scenic sapphire]

I know theyre not lizards, but aren't like

other scaly animals irl very colorful

a lot of them are very very vibrant

[compact forum]

@spring holly i just saw the new color pallete for the new dinos from phillips stream and am sobbing...

[minor laurel]

Everybody is so tense.

I am sure Filipe was just saying that it is hard to make a decision everybody will approve and a lot of feedbacks are opinion-based so biased anyway.

It wasn't mean to denigrate the whole community but to maybe pointing out issues they have to face.

He looked tired and maybe words have slipped in a bad way.

At least i hope.

[vestal rune]

uh I don't think that's meant to be the actual colour palette?

[spring holly]

oh no.. i missed that part

[compact forum]

Ya im not saying they cant have fun colors, but like most of the pretty colors on reptiles and birds are accents not the whole body 😦

@vestal rune oh okay thats good, I hope your right

[spring holly]

I feel like that too. i work in the industry too and sometimes its hard choices

[vestal rune]

ye I think he was just showing off the how they work with the skin system, the colours are likely subject to change so I wouldn't trust that those exact colours are going ingame lol

[scenic sapphire]

I hope, too, honestly. I really do... I've sunk 3 years into this game with feedback and playtesting and interaction and I want to see it do well, so I'm just going to hope this was a poor choice of words but the problem is that this sort of thing like... Keeps happening?

[spring holly]

yes exactly!! like the blueberry stego shouldnt be able to have the main color blue, just like some secondary traits

all main colors should be green, brown and gray imo

unless its feathers

[scenic sapphire]

there are many reptiles that have whole body colors tho

idr the name of them but I can think of a specific species that is all bright yellow and blue

[spring holly]

yah but that doesnt fit the dark grounded horror theme the game is clearly trying to achieve

[scenic sapphire]

ehh, let me provide my experience

here's the brightest raptor I could make that I liked

I could still blend into the environment and hide

I agree that I don't wanna see like neon pink and purple all over but I think, at least, our current palette is just fine? like even in legacy I played white dinos and if you know what you're doing, you can evade and hide properly

[spring holly]

thats not too bad, looks fairly natural and grounded

[scenic sapphire]

I based it off those lizards :>

[spring holly]

i meant more like albino, blueberry stego for example

but we need dark underbelly

[scenic sapphire]

I think it's fun for certain creatures bc like... what even challenges stego rn? and I grew an albinistic deino and didn't have much issue. Plus, albinism and melanism are naturally occuring

[scenic sapphire]

PLEASE. YES

[uneven mist]

Here’s my Utah

[scenic sapphire]

I like it :)

really good palette

[spring holly]

i like it ❤️

[uneven mist]

Yeah I like making skins that can blend with the biome or environments

[scenic sapphire]

I think they did a good job with giving us that option while still maintaining a natural colorful look

because most of the colors are very muted or kind of like... idk how to describe. "dirty looking"? they look like skin idk

[spring holly]

makes sense. a blueberry stego doesnt blend anywhere and thats kinda the issue

[scenic sapphire]

tbh I think as the ecosystem balances out, peoples color choices will, too

I like having the option but as we get more and more predators and competitors there will be less people choosing to be bright

[uneven mist]

Here’s some other skins that I like to blend (swamp teno and jungle pachy)

[minor laurel]

It is frustrating for people involving themselves at their level into the developement of the game, that is sure.

I don't think that they "know" how to speak properly to the huge community they have. I mean it is a whole time job to deal with that and they may just not have time or communication skills to do so.

It's only been a week since 5.5 has been released and they may be thinking of something to do with all the heat that NV has generated.

At least, i'll wait for things to come up in some other week. I mean they can't deal with all that in a hurry or they could get things worse.

[uneven mist]

Yeah whenever I see a skin I don’t like in a Dino I kill then nonetheless, especially blue stegos

[spring holly]

same xD

[minor laurel]

Into the sky like a shooting star

[spring holly]

nioce!!

[scenic sapphire]

That's true. I want to be sympathic to a point because they are, very much, human and not just content generators (I've seen people regard many devs that way, as I'm sure you have) but the communication in that way has continued to be a problem over the years? That's why I'm kind of losing my patience with it, honestly.

[spring holly]

😂

[minor laurel]

Understandable for sure. Hope they'll do something about it. You are not alone into that.

[faint folio]

That's what I think, too.

Honestly I think on most dev teams they have 1 staff member who goes through general feedback and compiles good ideas occasionally (1ce a week, 2x a month, etc etc) to share with the team. The rest of the staff never regularly reads the feedback directly. That's probably what Filipe meant as well.

That and... A lot of the feedback can be misleading. I read a small handful of feedback posts where people were directly saying that NV was triggering migraine or epilepsy. Don't get me wrong--medical issues are a major concern and need addressing-- but MOST of the posts about NV that mentioned epilepsy or migraine were referring in 3rd person to the small handful of posts from people who were directly affected, which makes it seem like a much, much larger section of the player base is affected than probably actually is. Usually the community advocating for people with medical issues is really good because it amplifies their voices, but in this case it makes it hard for the devs to get an accurate reading of who is actually directly affected, and how severely they are affected... Which is why QA has been reaching out directly to people who reported having 1st person experienced issues so they can get an idea of the actual problem

[scenic sapphire]

I mean, accessibility IS an issue with this game.

[faint folio]

That and it takes time to change code, but a lot of times the community thinks if they complain harshly enough a fix will be implemented within a few hours/days. And that's honestly unreasonable. Even large companies with dozens of programmers on a team usually take a week or two to patch major security holes-- and that's usually with said team pulling serious overtime because it's a data security threat

[scenic sapphire]

I'm very photosensitive due to a mutation and have issues playing with my keyboard so I have to use controller, I am a disabled player.

I haven't personally played with NV yet but I know people who also have issues with vision who were complaining of migraines who aren't epileptic, so if that's happening, then I'm inclined to believe it's capable of causing seizures as someone who can get photosensitive seizures.

Focal seizures, to be exact.

[spring holly]

it's the devs to decide what to prioritize but im sure they will support players with disabilities at some point.

just gotta be patient. unfortunately, they only have so many resources

[scenic sapphire]

"At some point" does suck, though. We're already an afterthought with so many games as is.

[somber parrot]

Don't forget, there is a lot of feedback posts every day, and it does take some time to read everything, and to sort them. So yes, there is probably some devs that aren't reading the feedback channel actively, but that doesn't mean they do not care about it.

[spring holly]

yah and sometimes its preferable to do things in a certain order so some stuff that affect specific people are implemented later

building a game is pretty complex. could be a number of reasons

[scenic sapphire]

I suppose I'm frustrated, honestly, as someone who struggles to see accessibility in this game AT ALL and any feedback that generates doesn't seem to amount to... Literally anything. So the idea of the devs not taking feedback seriously isn't far of a stretch in my mind.

[minor laurel]

That's a good point they are active on that.

I agree that a lot of fever has taken the feedback channel about NV, mostly because the system doesn't fit people tastes or just isn't practical to just, y'a know, play at night and agrumenting about people having health issues about it.

I think the lots of feedbacks anyway should be put at attention because of all the other things that don't suit a large (i think ?) Part of the players.

Fixes and patches can take days and decisions to take too, then appliying them, testing them and all is an all new developement process, etc.

[faint folio]

Absolutely. But honestly they need to hear directly from people who are having issues to best understand how to improve accessability. I'm not saying they need players to intentionally trigger seizures, but often times the people who have the disability are the best voices for what kinds of accessibility they actually need, you know? And there's a wide variety of visual effects that can trigger photosensitivity, so knowing what kinds specifically are causing issues will help them resolve this issue and prevent future issues

[scenic sapphire]

We already have to deal with a lack of accessibility and being afterthoughts in other aspects of life, I don't want to deal with that in my downtime, too lmao

[scenic sapphire]

Oh, I've seen people give that feedback, though. People who are affected directly, myself included.

It's not NOT happening

[spring holly]

yah and i get that, but the isle is also early access so its very possible they address certain things very later in the dev stage

[vestal rune]

a lot of people without epilipsy or migraines still have problems

[scenic sapphire]

exactly

[vestal rune]

also nv has very minimal code associated with it, most of the work on it is artistic

[scenic sapphire]

people who aren't even epileptic are experiencing eye strain and headaches

[vestal rune]

ofc if they're working on fixing the problem it will still take time to come up with and implement a solution, but filipe did suggest there will be a nv hotfix

[scenic sapphire]

I think with that alone you can easily infer it'll affect those of us with more sensitivity worse

[faint folio]

And art doesn't take time to create?

[spring holly]

Art takes a long time. Sometimes I have nothing to code because I need to wait on art

[minor laurel]

It does but that was mean to say that the code part isn't a big of a deal.

And that's probably why Filipe didn't know that much about what was going on with NV.

[spring holly]

yah make sense

[fleet quartz]

Did anyone really have any complaints with update 4 lighting

Everyone liked it if I remember

[faint folio]

Ive seen someone say in this channel they were directly contacted by the dev team for more information about the medical effects of the night vision after posting feedback about it. So they are showing an interest in it, and there probably will be a hotfix related to it.

I don't think it's fair to jump to conclusions and say that they are not looking into it when Filipe said he thought a hotfix was likely AND people have said the devs are following up with some people about eye strain, epilepsy, migraine, etc

[dusk meteor]

I think they are looking into it, they're just being quiet as usual
and frankly it's not really the ideal way to handle this situation. They'll handle it, they'll just handle it in their usual way

[scenic sapphire]

Oh thank god lol thank you for that information

[minor laurel]

To add about that, Punch did come to this channel for a bug related thing but, i mean if he didn't look at it he wouldn't have noticed that too.

[scenic sapphire]

and I wouldn't say it's entirely unfair. As, again, we are often afterthoughts or altogether ignored within the gaming industry.

like FFXIV has straight up given me seizures on multiple occassions and it's a AAA company so my expectations are in the floor.

[minor laurel]

I did like it too.
The ambiance was way more smooth and lighting too.
I especially liked the DOF fog adding so much to the life of the light, particularly at night. They were blue and foggy and mysterious.

[minor laurel]

I understand

[scenic sapphire]

I wish it wasn't like that, but it's not simply bad faith, it's experience.

[minor laurel]

Unfortunately the only thing we can do for now is waiting and see.

I can't play at night because of eyes issues since the 5.5 so i just stopped playing at all, letting them time to deal with the issues they have.

[scenic sapphire]

That's very true

I'm willing to wait though since they seem to want to fix it

[storm barn]

I am a bit confused, why are people saying things like the devs do not care in general feedback?

[orchid moon]

typing the damn bible

[faint folio]

Absolutely, and you deserve to have your voice heard.

I simply say it's unfair because they're getting accused of ignoring health/medical issues when they are not (although, would it really kill them to release an official statement about looking into it, instead of having the community piece together bits and pieces based on what little devs imply)

[minor laurel]

A pile of things. A misunderstood explication from a dev on a stream and silence in the channels have frustrated lots of people. To keep the core of the thing.

[minor laurel]

nodding

[scenic sapphire]

Well, thank you for your information ❤️ because I hadn't been seeing it and it does change my opinion somewhat. Enough that I'm not fuming lol

[faint folio]

I can find at least what Filipe said. Don't remember which user said that the dev team contacted them, and it's probably drowned in this channel now

[faint folio]

#isle-discussion message

The link to Filipe's comment saying that a hotfix for NV was likely

[faint folio]

#general-feedback-discussion message

And the link to the user comment saying they had been talking to QA

If the devs really do pay more attention to QA than the general public I still consider it a win, because it means QA is going to elevate the issue

O.O the human, the myth, the legend is typing...

[neon zephyr]

I can say they aren't just down-right ignoring the medical issues;

A member of the QA team reached out to me to get more info about some of the things I was talking about in my posts/discussions.

(I had reported an epileptic episode the morning after release 😅 )

It's not an official statement or any real confirmation they are working on something specific; but it is a bit unfair to just say they are ignoring I think... so trying to kinda let people know I guess??

[ripe thistle]

I would like to upvote that, but cannot. This is really the biggest issue: People just jumping the gun and being downright noxious because something hasn't been immediately or publicly done.

[neon zephyr]

Yeah; try and say it here and there so it's a bit more known.

[faint folio]

Honestly from what you said previously it sounds like they're trying to gather information so they can make an informed decision on how to proceed-- you said you were talking with them about photosensitivity modes that could be implemented to help

[neon zephyr]

I can understand and kinda agree why the communication is important.
Esp being someone who had to report such an issue.

But; idk.

At least they contacted me about it?

Instead of just literally nothing at all.

Yes; Iceandi. ^^

Was more them just getting more info; but it still shows they are paying attention, and saw my/our/the many posts in regards to the photosensitive/epilepsy concerns.

That's all I'm saying e.e

[left storm]

@modern prism exactly what I was thinking

[faint folio]

That's the first step. They still have to do something about it, but good information gathering is the foundation to fixing the problem.

[neon zephyr]

Ye ^^

[ripe thistle]

Case in point? This TheGreat and Rawdawg pair. This is why the devs make jokes about, mock or just overall don't care to listen/consider feedback in the slog of it all. The community is, in fact, flooded with useless and venomous nonsense that's just there to make the whiner feel better.

The loudest voices are often the least useful, and bandwagons are easy to jump on. Which is not to say folks aren't having issues. But it absolutely adds credence to the statement "We can't trust feedback from the general public".

[left storm]

@ripe thistle sorry to have ruffled your jammies

[ripe thistle]

You'd have to matter to do that. I was just making an oberservation.

[left storm]

Ok? Are you that offended to be insulting people over their opinions?

[ripe thistle]

Again, you'd have to matter to have an effect on me.

PS: That was a tantrum, not an opinion.

And since you have no desire to play anymore, kindly move on.

[left storm]

https://tenor.com/view/no-i-dont-think-i-will-gif-23864982

[minor laurel]

Spitting on each other will not help things being solved or being better neither.

[left storm]

Anyways I have an expo I’m going to. Have fun insulting others, my dude.

[ripe thistle]

Enjoy your hypocrisy!

[scarlet ocean]

Oh lawd 0-0 the toxicity, someone’s feelings got hurt, daamn 0-0 Imma stay far far away

[ripe thistle]

Apparently not. Thanks for adding nothing though.

[violet magnet]

@mossy fulcrum and if people don't want Global chat enabled on their servers they can just turn it off
like...I still don't get why they removed it tbh. It was in Evrima upon initial release and community servers use it, why not just make it toggleable?

[icy lion]

Global chat will be a toggle for community servers in the future

[violet magnet]

[left storm]

Bro…chill. Do your homework.

[ripe thistle]

See? Proved me right with just one more comment. Enjoy your high horse. I'll be down with the rest of us lowly mortals, coexisting.

[limber hull]

i LOVE how people are still going over this "DEVS HATE FEEDBACK" hate train ran entirely by taking a statement of one non-PR dev out of context and running with it so they can push an agenda

i dont think a single person has bothered to look at the WHOLE context of the situation where he says that

[ripe thistle]

Of course not.

[limber hull]

A: It was directly referring to balance and his frustrations that if the community is always constantly split on how things should be balanced (he "couldn't trust us" since every time he makes a change to satisfying the community, a large group is disappointed and says it was the worst possible change to make)
B: He literally responded to feedback IN THAT STREAM. What kind of lunatic says he doesn't take feedback before IMMEDIATELY taking feedback?

The only reason people are pushing this narrative is to push the agenda that the devs hate us and don't want to hear a word from us, which ironically, is a self fulfilling prophecy, since I doubt Filipe is too happy with us twisting his words to make him seem like an dickhead who hates feedback

[ripe thistle]

Words taken out of context is what those kinds of people do.

It's exactly why the Devs don't remark. Because a few words spoken in context can be twisted to mean the exact opposite thanks to cult following.

[limber hull]

That feels about right

I'm sure glad that this rare insight into devwork after so long of nothing has been spoiled by a single 10 second clip taken without context

[ripe thistle]

Right?

[limber hull]

I'm certain the devs will be jumping at the opportunity to do another

[ripe thistle]

"Devs don't listen! OMG did you hear Filipe complain about always having people dissatisfied with him trying to implement their suggestions? Devs don't listen."

It's textbook insanity and honestly just bully tactics.

[limber hull]

It's honestly quite disgusting, and the COMPLETE over-exaggeration of a response doesn't help

[ripe thistle]

And frankly, the fact that the devs still love what they do and haven't just said "Screw it" is a miracle.

[limber hull]

"Just delete feedback channels, they're USELESS anyways!"

Boy, for someone who thinks the devs are assholes who hate our ideas, you sure are giving them a great idea for how to deal with that

If the feedback channels are going to be nothing but this

[ripe thistle]

Temper tantrums and ego trips, pretty much.

[marsh leaf]

why not? let's get everything out and the open and keep it honest. if they are not taking feedback, there's no reason for feedback channels.

[limber hull]

they are taking feedback lmao

the statement made by a single dev taken out of its original context does not prove me wrong

[marsh leaf]

what more context or statement do we need beyond (my paraphrasing here,) "this is why we dont listen to feedback"?

[scarlet ocean]

But how come there’s still tons of issues then =\ ? Speaks for itself in my opinion.
(Not talking about the out of context thing)

[limber hull]

maybe the fact that only a few hours ago, PunchPacket came in to RESPOND TO FEEDBACK

into THIS channel

[limber hull]

Because issues don't get resolved in an instant, that's not how gamedev works

[scarlet ocean]

It hasn’t been instant, it’s been uuuuuummm, about 8 months or more. And stuff keeps building up

[limber hull]

what issues are you referring to?

[scarlet ocean]

Everything, optimization, the graphics, Dino balance, Now nv, General community vs dev drama from about 5 months ago and some more I don’t remember at the top of my head.

People wouldn’t be spamming the feedback channel for years and months if there wasn’t any issues

(Wether they be dumb or smart ppl)

And if you would read Atleast up till the start of 2021 on all the feedback channels, All the feedback eventually repeats itself. With the occasional new stuff

Idk, seems concerning to me

[limber hull]

NV hasn't even been out for a week

[scarlet ocean]

Yeah it’s the least of the problems currently. Imo Atleast

[limber hull]

Optimisation and graphics are constant ongoing processes, more or less feedback does not enhance the speed at which they do it

Dino balance is actually the point of contention with the whole "doesn't read feedback" thing since, according to Filipe, they can't make a single change to balance that the community wants without at least some portion of the community hating it and calling it garbage

[scarlet ocean]

I think they should, cause it’s been in optimized ever since evrima launched.. it’s never been at peak 100% optimization greatness
People normally compare games to other games. And with how slow isle is, is concerning to some. (Coming from a indie game dev too)

[scarlet ocean]

Yeah I’ve heard, and I agree. But that doesn’t make the feedbacks invalid, they’re very much valid cause sometimes the devs just focus on the wrong stuff. (Like the next update or new mechanics/new playables)

[scarlet ocean]

Also wouldn’t you be concerned? One update the graphics and optimization seemed fine, and when another update launched, it went worse.

No one knows why or how cause they didn’t even tweak with optimization or graphics, for example in this update 5.5. Its confusing to an extent

So clearly they’re doing something wrong they don’t even know.

[limber hull]

why would i be concerned? They're changing around lighting and adding new features, of course the graphics/optimisation will seem better and worse at times

thats how game dev is

[scarlet ocean]

I understand, but that stuff also messes with fps, and fps low for not much reason when ppl have insane rigs = less playerbase and if it continues, no community

But I’ve overstayed my own welcome. Time for sleep 😅

[marsh leaf]

you'll excuse me if i do not care. punch has been nonstop been responding to suggestions in the time before filepe said his thing.

[limber hull]

And you still believe devs don't listen to feedback?

You also clearly weren't paying attention to the whole context because the entire topic was on dino balance and the fact the community can't decide what the hell they want

[marsh leaf]

i'm actually fairly sure they do not, at all, at this point

there's not a great deal of professionalism in this outfit, i've found

[limber hull]

So... You KNOW Punch responds to feedback and still think don't think they don't listen to feedback

You are a special kind of baffling

[marsh leaf]

because "responding" is not the same as "listening"

as you are so graciously demonstrating =]

[limber hull]

You have to listen to respond

This is a ridiculous sentiment

[marsh leaf]

no, you really do not

[limber hull]

You have to know what the other person is talking about to respond to them lmao. The only way to respond without listening is to just randomly throw out a statement and hope it's loosely related to the point being made

[faint folio]

Really what you're saying is they're "listening" and "responding", but not "taking people's feedback and implementing". Which... Yeah. Sometimes they're not going to implement popular suggestions. Sometimes implementing suggestions takes time

[marsh leaf]

no you do not

see? i just did it there.

[tardy talon]

@mystic lion the ripples have been replaced with jumping fish, so look out for those instead next time 🙂

[mystic lion]

you've gotta be kidding me...

[limber hull]

So Punchpacket has just been guessing at people's feedback. What a good guesser he is!

[tardy talon]

It’s actually a lot easier to see then the old ripples lol

[mystic lion]

even at night? bc we were looking. i didn't see any jumping fish...

[marsh leaf]

furthermore, even if punch is listening, there's no evidence anything that has been "listened to" is brought back to the rest of the team

[tardy talon]

Could be a bug with the spawning, I haven’t been able to play for a week or so, so idk

[marsh leaf]

especially when you have a member of "the rest of the team" saying "this is why we dont listen to feedback"

[tardy talon]

If you experience it again you can put in #🐞-evrima-bug-reports-🐞

[faint folio]

Yeah even at night, although it's easier if you fly close to the water so the fish stand out from the dark water more with night vision on

@mystic lion try the river near NW (below the waterfall right by stego rock/pride rock), the center river near where it branches to SE/NE, and the south river by the waterfalls. Usually there are some fish spawns in those places since the change.

Sometimes it can be tough to find them though

[mystic lion]

thanks!

[faint folio]

You're welcome. Wish there was a way to smell AI. A lot fewer dinos would starve

[left storm]

So you’re all content with the devs lashing out at players for their opinions and destroying the frame rates and even graphics quality with every update?

I will not support a team that treats their community like garbage and some of you need to see this game has been going on a downhill trend for years. I’m not saying abandon the game, but acknowledge why so many of us are fed up.

Stop making fun of people for being critical when it’s well deserved.

[limber hull]

Yes, the villains at Afterthought love destroying their framerates and graphics to harm and inconvenience their players, the conspiracy unveiled.

As for lashing out, I've honestly seen very little of that which isn't
A: Outright deserved due to a person's initial hostility in their "opinion", which is generally a thinly veiled hate rant
B: Isn't a statement taken out of context

I'm also not making fun of anyone, I'm pointing out the fact that you are using a statement purposely taken out of context to once again demonise the development team from a single, non-PR developer, in the context of the complicated nature of trying to balance around community demands.

Game development is not a cut and dry process, it's tough work that requires skill, effort and sacrifice. The game is in Early Access, sometimes the graphical fidelity must be sacrificed until you can find ways to improve it without damaging the optimisation even further

There has never been an active malicious intent to worsen the experience for people

[alpine prairie]

@wild maple Kinda like this?

[sullen prism]

where the memes

[wild maple]

no. the current NV would just be on the perimeter of that nightlight

[alpine prairie]

i gotchu

i know what u mean now

[modern prism]

completely right i was out of line.

[fleet wasp]

Definitely agree with this and the comment after about the average player not minding. I think lowering the amount of headshots needed to kill a stego ain't a bad idea in terms of making gameplay for stego and deino more interesting.

[silver sierra]

Okay, it should be clear enough from the censoring of the word R E F U N D, where this dev team is going. And from what a certain someone said on stream about the purpose of feedback channels. These devs give us no respect.

I just got a content blocked message for trying to post something with the word refund in it in general feedback

[urban flax]

Why were you trying to mention refunding in general feedback ?

[proud coral]

Ya sure there wasn't just a swear in the message? Bot censors that for some reason.

[icy lion]

No, you didn't. You swore. Bot doesn't like that

[proud coral]

Smelly bot 👈

[ripe thistle]

I love when people use refund as like, an ultimatum, idea or demand. "Game doesn't give me what I want anymore. It did for a while, but not anymore. Give me back my money. Or start offering others refunds too." It's like buying a movie and watching it a few dozen times, then saying you're bored of it and want to take it back to the store to get your money back.

Why the remark? Because that's the only reason anyone ever brings up refunds.

[urban flax]

Yeah feedback is rarely constructive when it implies a refund

[marsh leaf]

this is a complex topic, being sold something "in development" is a new-ish thing, and there is an argument for refunding the game if it's direction goes too far from what you were led to believe at purchase.

i mean the steam early access thing says to only buy early access if you're ok with what the game is now, not what it might be. but what about if you WERE ok with where the game was, but are no longer?

[hallow smelt]

@ripe thistle curious as to why you’re against the original backers of the game having access to the original version of the game.

[ripe thistle]

Because of the berating tone and attitude of your remark. Neither helpful or serious. Just your mark in the sludge of fits being thrown.

[limber hull]

Also why would you WANT the original version

It's massively lacking in features, buggy as hell, unbalanced to the nines and so on

Like people make fun of EVRIMA but that's so much worse

[ripe thistle]

It's not a complex topic. You knowingly purchased an in-development game. Knowing it was going to change. Knowing it might change in ways you don't like. Knowing it might be amazing from start to finish.

I could go on, but what's the point?

Just like if you used to like childish movies and bought them, but no longer do. Can't just take it back, you werent deceived.

[faint folio]

i'd say just like clothes you wore for a bit and outgrew, or a season pass to an amusement park that you only used once or twice, the fact that you used the service you paid for, for any period of time, means that you are not entitled to a refund, even if said service no longer aligns with your interests or needs.

I have a game on steam that i've played literally thousands of hours on, which i dont really play anymore because it badly needs some balance changes. i would never ask for a refund, because imo $20 divided by a thousand hours... I got my money's worth from the game, even if it ends up being something i never play again

[ripe thistle]

Well said

[pastel cove]

My message was deleted in feedback because I said “I know the devs don’t really check in feedback and to please optimize the game”. Said it was for misinformation????

Feel you on that one ig

[haughty warren]

i feel like that night vision needs to be revised because that is really. unplayable and hurts the eyes 😓

[pastel cove]

I have no clue why they haven’t made an announcement or something on this either addressing it

[pulsar pike]

afaik im not photosensitive and the new night vision started making me nauseous

[faint folio]

honestly, even at only 100 hours of gameplay... $20 is enough to pay for 2 movies at the cinema (6 hours) or 6 movies rented and streamed (18 hours).... so 100 hours of entertainment for only $20 is well worth the price

[haughty warren]

i didnt even play it, i saw it from a video and it made me want to pass out

[pastel cove]

I’ve heard people have had pretty bad headaches etc from it

Tbh, they should rework it, and just disable night time for the meantime

[haughty warren]

thats really bad in general

[marsh leaf]

your movie thing is a terrible analogy, you cant really buy a movie before it's out of development. and that's why it's a complex topic, any comparison you make is going to be to a finished product.

[limber hull]

you can buy tickets to a theme park if some of their rides still aren't done

[marsh leaf]

not when they selling point of the ticket are the rides in development

[pastel cove]

It’s a horrible thing and people saying it already it should’ve been removed and reworked

[marsh leaf]

also bad analogies, as these are finished products. money per time spent is also a terrible metric

[limber hull]

My brother in Christ you could have not purchased the game if you were going in with the knowledge that it is a WIP early access

[marsh leaf]

and i should have researched it more before i did, yes, i know, caveat emptor.

[pastel cove]

Wish I knew this as well 💀

[marsh leaf]

however, if i am not supposed to buy early access because of what it might develop into, but for what it is now, why shouldent there be a remedy for me if the game goes off the rails i expected?

[pastel cove]

i do believe there is a certain amount of hours you need to be below to refund it

Trust me I tried it already

[marsh leaf]

yes, 2

[faint folio]

money per time spent is not a terrible metric... you buy games because you want to get entertained. that is the point. so, the service you pay for is being entertained for X hours.

Also, steam's own refund policy is based on play time (2 hours). Buying an early access game is considered a risk-- one that steam labels heavily in giant text on the store page-- and by doing so you accept the risk that it may not end up being a game you want to play. They literally tell you this on the steam store page for a reason

[haughty warren]

everyones tryna refund the game?

[marsh leaf]

2 hours, which is not even enough to grow some dinos

[faint folio]

and that is steam's fault or problem... how?

[marsh leaf]

consider this, not enough time spent, you do not know what you are talking about. to much, "you got your money's worth." where is the sweet spot where i know what i am talking about but did not get my money's worth?

[haughty warren]

id refund it but ive had it since drop so that aint gonna fly

[pastel cove]

Was it two hours? I thought it was more

[marsh leaf]

nope, 2 hours or 2 weeks of ownership (not playtime)

[faint folio]

honestly i'd say below 20 hours or so. thing is you cant use something for months, decide you dislike it, and demand a refund for it. literally no company would accept a refund under those conditions

[pastel cove]

20 hours would’ve be a sweet spot for getting a refund

you get enough time to grow out all Dino’s if you wanted to

[marsh leaf]

nope, at 20 hours, you do not know what you are talking about

[faint folio]

20 hours lets you grow dinos to adult several times, try out all the mechanics

[jade brook]

Do you know how many games are only played that many hours? Most AAA games have under a hundred of hours of content

[marsh leaf]

trust me, i've been hit with "you do not have enough time to know what you're talking about" at 200 hours

[jade brook]

Steam would cease to exist and so would all of your licenses on it

[faint folio]

but again, no sane company would issue refunds for a product that was sold months ago and/or had hundreds of hours of use

[pastel cove]

Unfortunately, yeah

The only way I can see that the devs might start listening is if there’s a very steep drop in players

[limber hull]

I don’t see how that’s unfortunate. How can you expect to turn a profit if someone can take their money back after doing everything possible in a game

[faint folio]

well, that is exactly why that is not steam's policy lol. so many games would be played through to completion and then returned/refunded

[pastel cove]

I meant more for the 2 hours of gameplay only

Replied to the wrong message

[marsh leaf]

i dont know, by delivering a quality product that people dont want to refund, maybe? by showing your customer base that you hear them and are doing something to remedy their issues?

[faint folio]

yeah... survival genre is kind of a special case because of how the gameplay works. would be nice to have an exception for the genre

[limber hull]

You can’t fix these issues in a snap, that’s simply not how it works.

[marsh leaf]

perhaps by not saying "we dont listen to feedback" when you are in a program that is supposed to be for providing feedback?

[pastel cove]

And also warning people who state this, as I did and I was warned.

i was warned for “misinformation”

[faint folio]

people refund things whenever possible. seriously, people buy clothes, wear it once with tags on, and return it for the refund. people would absolutely do the exact same thing with video games if given the chance

[jade brook]

(i admit that i have once spent 2 hours trying to troubleshoot a game in the settings and have been refused a refund because of that, that was annoying)

[limber hull]

Have they made that statement officially or is it an out of context statement from a non-PR developer not responsible for the games overall direction? Because you really like doubling down on this, despite the fact that you consistently leave out context

[pastel cove]

Problem is they never state these issue officially

Like ever

[jagged oar]

ive been lurkin and these were my thoughts exactly lol

[pastel cove]

I don’t know how they haven’t addressed the whole people getting serious problems from the NV officially yet

[jade brook]

Problem is people expecting them to have to

[limber hull]

They have, they’ve stated hotfixes are in the work as we speak

[marsh leaf]

you cannot just ignore what is said by devs that are not community managers say when they are acting in any capcity related to their job, they represent the company as much as any employee

[pastel cove]

Where? I haven’t seen any announcements on steam or here

[limber hull]

And you can’t ignore context to push a narrative

[marsh leaf]

hell if i flipped burgers at mcdonalds and told a customer "we dont listen to customer feedback," i'd get fired

[pastel cove]

Then they should hire people to address the community, devs shouldn’t be the ones to do it regardless

[marsh leaf]

they have at least two

[pastel cove]

Haven’t seen it yet

[limber hull]

They have one dedicated PR guy.

[marsh leaf]

and his manager

[limber hull]

It’s just Punch

There’s no PR manager above him

[marsh leaf]

punch isnt the one who posts the devblogs to steam announcements

[jade brook]

no you don't get it. They don't have to hire or say anything. No matter how much you want it. And despite that, they do keep people informed, but there always will be people that will ask more, more early, more frequently

[marsh leaf]

that's a good way to ruin all customer goodwill and run a company into the ground

[jade brook]

that's a naive way of thinking

[marsh leaf]

perhaps if you've never been in business for yourself

[pastel cove]

They don’t keep people informed, though. I still haven’t seen any addressing of the NV giving people headaches

[marsh leaf]

also, just want to point out, that "non-pr dev" is the lead programmer

[limber hull]

Yes. He’s not responsible for feedback, is he?

[jade brook]

"asking more, more early more frequently" relax it has been less than a week.

[marsh leaf]

it's very telling if the lead programmer says "we do not listen to feedback."

[pastel cove]

dude. People are having serious issues with NV. Like so many people

[jagged oar]

for someone who supposedly doesnt take feedback this server has quite a lot of feedback channels

[marsh leaf]

"lead programmer" doesent mean he's the boss

[pastel cove]

It’s probably a good idea to address it ASAP if people are photosensitive and can have a possibility of causing seizures

[jagged oar]

ok when did i claim he was?

[pastel cove]

As people who aren’t (like me) get headaches from playing with said NV as well

[marsh leaf]

he doesent have ANY feedback channels here

[jagged oar]

i said this server, youre in a feedback channel right now no?

[marsh leaf]

this isnt his personal server

[jagged oar]

ok?

[marsh leaf]

punch comes around, but if the lead programmer is saying they dont listen to feedback, that means punch isnt taking anything back to the devs

[jagged oar]

devs are just as capable of reading feedback as he is

[marsh leaf]

(not as a direlection of duty, mind you)

[pastel cove]

Be careful with saying that, I was warned earlier today for misinformation for stating that they probably don’t

Warned in my DMs by bot

[marsh leaf]

i'm beyond caring, i was banned from the steam forums for much, much less

[pastel cove]

Completely absurd

#general-feedback message

This is probably the best suggestion for fixing NV so far

I hope they do look at it and expand on it

[faint folio]

@pastel cove idk why they havent made a formal statement, but they arent ignoring the issue either

oop sorry murro meant to turn off ping but i forgor. 1 am brain doing a brrr

[pastel cove]

Ur good, but yeah it should be made into a formal statement so people know they’re actively working on it

I would say a majority of people wouldn’t know they are working on it if they didn’t see that message

[faint folio]

and filipe said yesterday in gen chat that there will probably be hotfixes for night vision (but he isnt the dev that works on nv so he isn't completely in the loop there)

[pastel cove]

Wouldn’t have known of this if you didn’t tell me rn either

[jade brook]

it is to be expected though?

[pastel cove]

Them addressing something publicly that’s an issue? No. Does it need to be? Yes

[faint folio]

yeah it needs to be an announcement. but you can search his messages and read for yourself

[pastel cove]

Nah I believe you, I just don’t know why it isn’t an announcement

[jade brook]

no it is to be expected that work is being done. a public announcement isn't necessary at all aside appeasing people who can't figure that out

[pastel cove]

Literally here it says an epileptic episode was reported

Yknow, I think it’s pretty important to announce they’re working on it if people are having medical problems with it, no?????

[gritty terrace]

Reassurance helps a lot there is no reason not to especially since there have been issues

[faint folio]

idk either. honestly this the the second dev team i've watched get an absolute dumpsterfire of feedback that couldve been avoided by making a pr announcement saying they're looking into options to address feedback related to night vision

[pastel cove]

I’d imagine server announced polls would help a lot

[marsh leaf]

especially as i dont recall there being any photosensitivity warnings in the game or supporting materials

[pastel cove]

^

[jade brook]

well like i said, for the people who can't figure that out. But yes a trigger warning should be a thing

[marsh leaf]

you do not want to discover you have photosensitivity by having a siezure

[gritty terrace]

Yeah what

[jade brook]

well if you didn't know you were photosensitive before, then the warning would be moot anyway no?

[gritty terrace]

I also just think doing a photosensitivity mode or overall making the night vision more pleasant is the best way to go, this game having accessibility issues when it comes to optimization already but then making the accessibility even worse than it already is because of something that effects people physically is an issue

[gritty terrace]

There are people who have said they never thought they were photosensitive till playing this, getting headaches and eye strain

#general-feedback message

Even this is very recent

[pastel cove]

I did get a very brief headache watching gameplay of it but haven’t gotten any so far playing it

[marsh leaf]

i could be on the lookout for it. even i, having played games with flashing and strobing light patterns for some 37 years or so, recently found a game that affected me

[faint folio]

i think that was one of the things murrocity brought up to QA

[gritty terrace]

QA talked to them already yes

Im aware

But that is nowhere close to being official

[faint folio]

no i mean i think they brought up potentially adding a photosensitivity mode as a suggestion

that doesnt mean devs will add it of course

[gritty terrace]

I know and I think that is really good for starters

-.-

And yet we are all pushing to even hear a single thing about something that is effecting everyone physically

That is fun

[obsidian jetty]

And what...other than "we are trying to find out what causes the issues and will see how to fix it" would there be to say? Which, call me naive, I am kinda inclined to believe is what they are doing currently.

[marsh leaf]

perhaps a warning?

[jade brook]

I think that before leaving feedback that it causes you headache, that you should actually try it. So many things can cause a headache. Not to discredit people who actually have headache truly beacuse of it, but i think a lot of people get on the bandwagon of health issues because it is convenient for a change they just don't like or because of confirmation bias and coincidence.
Again i'm not saying the issue is false or shouldnt be fix but before reporting headache because of a footage you watched, maybe try it for real. It could have been a headache for other reason, could be beacuse of the settings (anti-aliasing has done weird thing for me with NV), and are you sure you saw the most recent iteration of NV? it has changed before getting out of QA

[marsh leaf]

personally, i'd want a warning public ASAP, as i would not want to test culpability laws in every country the game is sold in

[gritty terrace]

Literally any dev saying at any point that they will be working on it in Amy way

[obsidian jetty]

That would go into the start screen of the game if you want everyone to see it anyway...and someone would need to make that, implement it and update the game o.o

[marsh leaf]

isnt this what felipe was getting at when he said that feedback was full of lies?

[marsh leaf]

you mean like the early access warning already on the start screen? yea you can do that in unreal in a few minutes

[gritty terrace]

I can understand if everyone was getting on the bandwagon to just get rid of it and go back to legacy night vision but 90% of the people saying they have headaches or anything say how they could fix it, just mention that it is cool but needs tweaks or that it is just causing them headaches

Like yes, I would understand if there is frustration because everyone is saying scrap it but most people saying this is saying just tweak it

Even the person who had an epilepsy attack said do not scrap it just temporarily take it out and bring it in after it is tweaked

[obsidian jetty]

Yes like that.

[gritty terrace]

A seizure warning would help too

[obsidian jetty]

That'd be the easiest "fix" for now.

[gritty terrace]

Oh yeah and it is quick to do as well, that would be the best first step

[jade brook]

that i agree, even if the cause and effect isn't concluded 100%, they should warn the possibility of it in the meantime

[obsidian jetty]

I mean, I was kinda surprised this game doesn't have one. Every game does nowadays. XD

[gritty terrace]

Yeah I was gonna say that is kinda the regular nowadays

[marsh leaf]

it's kind of been the standard since the NES days, if you opened the manuals

[jade brook]

it is weird for me, because, although i did like it, legacy's NV was the one straining my eyes. I'm actually surprised i don't have an issue myself given the recent feedbacks, even more so since i just got lazik, have allergies, smoke too much weed, and stay up late too much...
but maybe it's because i up the gamma to widen the outlines, and Flux is helping my eyes too warming the colors

[obsidian jetty]

I meant the flash screen thing at startup. But that game devs want to make sure that people don't sue them isn't new, true. ^^

[jade brook]

yes the flashing screen at startup is at least annoying to me indeed

[obsidian jetty]

People are different and everyone reacts to different things. I have no issues with the current nv but I can see why people might. There really is a lot going on on the screen, especially in a forest, so it can be hard to focus on something with all those white lines "screaming at you".

[jade brook]

speaking of which, if anything is hurting my eyes with the recent changes, it would be the water. Not that i dislike the appearence, but it's the reflections with the waves i find are "screaming at me" and make it hard to focus for me

[random flame]

@rocky aspen I understand your point of view and I would love the devs to move forward but "not awful" is still a problem, we want good lol

I kinda start to feel bad for the devs tho, as they are getting pretty much ill-treated when they are trying things. The real persons we should get mad at are the majority of incapable stress testers

[limber hull]

Seems to me that most stress testers are there for either content or “early access”, yea. From what I’ve heard, they barely make an effort to populate the server and instead spend their time only joining for a new patch and not providing any bug reports or feedback

[random flame]

^

pretty much agreed

[limber hull]

But when the patch goes live, and they actually choose to play it in a legitimately populated environment, they then start to see the cracks they could’ve called out from the beginning

[random flame]

I don't know how they could say NV is at least decent, it's not very memorable at all and I expected way more from the Isle

it works... but that's about it

[limber hull]

I actually personally really like the NV

[random flame]

that's understandable, I personally think it looks like a visual glitch

[nocturne holly]

Guys i cant use my night vision how i can bind my night vision and what is the name of that in settings cuz i cant find it

[rare fractal]

For me it looks like a botched reshade preset

[random flame]

go into your game files and delete the "saved" folder

that's something recurring for me and it annoys me to the highest point lol, I'm done losing all my skins everytime

I don't know yet if it also deletes saved dinos because I haven't played since I had to do this

but I often lost them for no reason so it may be correlated after all

[minor laurel]

It is quite a shame. That makes me so angry to read that and i hope it is just an impression and not the truth lol

[barren zephyr]

I think theres a difference between the devs not believing what the people in feedback channels say and actually being aware of it. Even Filipe said he‘s not a fan of current NV which is just asylum detective mode right now, and that its gonna have to be improved. The fact that the devs are not answering to anyone right now or addressing the fact that they acknowledge and see our feedback shows me that they prefer to hide in the shadows, not say anything but read the stuff we say in the feedback channels.

[jagged jewel]

when are the next applications starting again?

i imagine in a devlog of U6

[barren zephyr]

Maybe its sometimes better to not say anything. I definitely know better community managers who interact with their community in a much more advantageous way than the one for the isle

We saw in the past how this is the devs reaction to strong feedback. Radio silence and work on a hotfix or patch while adding stuff or balance changes that go beyond any logical understanding if they would‘ve just listened to the right people.

[flat crypt]

I get being wary of feedback and trying to make things a surprise but all of this negativity about NV could have been avoided if they just showcased it earlier on, when they still could have made significant changes without throwing a bunch of work in the bin 😩

I think it's understandable to be cautious when its something like a gameplay mechanic that needs to be played with to be properly understood, but visual stuff like this really values from community feedback early on

you dont need to play with NV to watch some clips and see it gives you a headache or makes your eyes hurt

[barren zephyr]

I‘m sure they‘ll do a hotfix to come up with a better version of NV, cuz right I don‘t think a lotta people are playing the current iteration of NV.

[limber hull]

They gotta improve NV, not replace it

[barren zephyr]

This could have been avoided if the ST would be public too. I have a strong feeling the ST weren‘t enough numbers compared to the feedback of the public when NV released

[lapis swallow]

Public st would have worsened the problem, too chaotic, I think

[barren zephyr]

At this point I can‘t believe in any value the ST can contribute apart from a few bug reports when theyre testing a new build

How would it be too chaotic lol, you would avoid releasing stuff to the public while getting feedback on possible changes before you release it

[lapis swallow]

Too much feedback and the same thing every time

[barren zephyr]

So what if its the same thing every time ?

[lapis swallow]

The stresstesters should have said that its not nice to look at

[barren zephyr]

Its better than releasing it to the public and making the same mistake again of not giving the people a chance to voice their opinions on it.

[uneven mist]

The problem with public ST is that mostly everyone didn’t give any feedback and just wanted to play the update or they didn’t report any bugs, that’s why the public stress test lasted sooo long but if people gave feedback it was usually “this is not good” without giving proper feedback and what could be changed

[barren zephyr]

You can‘t really blame the stress testers IMO. Its moreso the fault of the devs and their way of handling their builds

[limber hull]

@near cairn I’m not misunderstanding

[near cairn]

wow ping surprised me

how would you like to see night vision - i think legacys was good so this design is such that it just feels like a heartless experiment offered as a feature

[limber hull]

Legacy’s NV was infinitely worse designed

[near cairn]

It was simple and easy to see without the grass cutting the image into grains

[limber hull]

It also isn’t as well designed for a plethora of reason and doesn’t fit EVRIMA’s design plans

[uneven mist]

It was not easy to see, if you weren’t a dilo then you were not able to see and could just log off

[near cairn]

I'm aware of it needing to be redesigned and evrimas militarized aesthetic. I care about if the screen is recordable/stream is not just blurry dinosaur outline, or screenshots would give an image that's sensible or even worth looking at besdes to detect a little pixel chicken on the round for ten more minutes of playtime. You can go outside at night and see better than in this. It should be better.

Re the feedbacks just posted; Agree
I play this game with other artists/designers that use screens all day with sensitive eyes and they all complain it gives them headache or is genuinely too straining to play visually, especially at night. While I'm still sitting in here annoyed at this paste-grey film over the ground, new NV was not enough of an improvement for people who are not diehard fans.

[neon zephyr]

I literally game all day every day and have never, ever had any issues; or when I do I obviously stop for the day and rest (doesn't happen often, and it's genuinely bc I've just been on the screen too much and am tired or have had too much caffeine or something)

I've had issues with Evrima graphics before, but somewhere before/with the nesting update, whatever it was that was bothering me was fixed, hence I started playing.
No issues up until now. 😭

Not even 1 minute in to watching a stream of their NV, and I developed eye strain and a headache (some "floaters" in the eyes, but that is more specific to my epilepsy according to my neuro); and ofc early morning after that, is when I had my epileptic episode. 😭

I don't want any of my fellow epileptics to have the same experience I did.
I feel bad for everyone else experiencing the photosensitivity too ofc; but.. yeah 😅

[pastel cove]

Sorry you had to go through that. The devs should’ve probably made a warning prior or an announcement saying the new NV may be photosensitive

It’s not fair to you nor other people with photosensitivity issues.

[swift root]

I give you right @neon zephyr I hate the NV too and it hurts also my eyes

I hope they change it.
Kinda want it like in legacy again just different

[neon zephyr]

Well; idk, apparently no one in their test-team had any issues with it???
Which... I think is crazy... e.e but would explain why they gave no sort of notice.
(Y'all need to find some photosensitive/epileptic people to put on your teams or something man)

But; I'm lucky enough that my condition is controlled, and with my epilepsy being abdominal outside of just focal, the "seizures" I still have despite my medication are hours worth of puking my guts out with abdominal tingling and pens and needles sometimes.

I appreciate everyone's concern over this 🧡 tysm

N yeah, I enjoyed Legacy just fine, but I can understand the not wanting to go back too I think

[swift root]

Yea my eyes are kinda sensitive with to bright or dark lighting, and this in evrima specifically the weird night vision they came up with just hurts. Would rlly like if they change that...liked the legacy NV more

I mean they don't need it to make it exactly like it just from Grey to greenish and maybe a bit better and done

[neon zephyr]

Ye ^^ uh, I'd have to go back and find the posts again; but there's 2 posts that were pretty awesome ideas for NV that had gotten a lot of attention

[limber hull]

Legacy NV should not return

[neon zephyr]

Anky, let's please not go through this circle of an argument again.

[limber hull]

I just dislike the sentiment

[neon zephyr]

Everyone is entitled to have their own opinion.

You don't need to argue over it every single time someone says it.

[swift root]

Oh i need to see them, you can send me them per DM if ya want

[neon zephyr]

Ye let me see if I can get links to their posts

[swift root]

That's right, everyone has there own opinions and wants, so it's important to accept them instead of arguing

[swift root]

Take your time no need of rush

[limber hull]

"Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but some more than others"

I'm not allowed to share my opinion on legacy NV, but they're allowed to share theirs. Very epic

[swift root]

Please leave it like that, everyone has there right to speak there opinions and what they think, if no one likes it, they have to ignore it and leave it. Arguing is wrong and useless, so please stop. I won't answer any further on this.

[neon zephyr]

I'm not saying that, Anky.

But I've seen you argue this point almost daily.

Sure at this point everyone knows your stance on it.

[pastel cove]

#general-feedback message here’s one of em!

Loved the NV design of this one

[limber hull]

im gonna guess its kojih

[pastel cove]

Yeah, I really liked their design for NV

Definitely one of my favs

[neon zephyr]

Yee; n this was the other one I saw get a bit of traction?
#general-feedback message

There may have been more popular that I missed, but I like how this person accounts for color blindness as well; and a gradual tone-shift in color as you go further and further out rather than just flat out black or something.

Given I myself have issues with, for example, solid white text on a solid black background and vise versa, Bukka0 had mentioned such a gradual shift like that might be beneficial as well.

N ofc the motion blur being removed was recommended I believe.

There's so many good suggestions and ideas on how to help. It's been amazing to see.

[limber hull]

That one's all well and good until you realise it's got a fatal flaw

NV right now only introduces lines

It doesn't change any colours, at all

[neon zephyr]

And that solid black bg, with white lines, is part of the problem.

[pastel cove]

I don’t really like it, it feels low effort tbh.

[neon zephyr]

Not to mention, to my understanding, they had promised coloration to some degree in the ight vision?

[limber hull]

I don't think they ever did, no

The only thing they promised was that it'd work just as well in day as it did in night without any jarring differences

Which it does indeed live up to

[neon zephyr]

AH, idk Banana lol; I jsut figure they were doing a sort of "brain storm" / concept art

N fair enough Anky.

[limber hull]

They wanted it so you could keep it running through day and night and never really feel like it changed much at all

[pastel cove]

I’m just surprised it made it past stress testers lol

[neon zephyr]

OH I meant the second linked NV suggestion

Not the NV released 😂

[pastel cove]

Oh mb lol

[neon zephyr]

Yeah idk how that got passed them either

all good, nw ~

[pastel cove]

Here I was referring to the actual NV, not the 2nd concept 😅 I like the 2nd concept as well

Just the one that got more attention feels more horrifying and scary

[limber hull]

I actually think it takes away a lot of the horror personally

It looks a lot tamer and easier to spot threats

[neon zephyr]

I gotcha, I gotcha. ^^

N yes, I agree the 1st has more edge over the 2nd

[limber hull]

Outside of glowy eyes, it really doesn't have much in the way of horror tbh. It lets me see threats well before they ambush me from the darkness

[pastel cove]

It’s more of the lighting that makes it more unsettling as well, and the outside edges being blurry/unrecognizable shapes

Which means you don’t really know what’s lurking

[neon zephyr]

Yeye

[limber hull]

Eh, I find the matter of NOT knowing if something is near more unsettling than not knowing what's coming towards me, because I already know I should probably run and hide, whereas with current NV, I would not get that chance to react

[pastel cove]

There’s also the dark area in contrast with the white blurry DOF area as well in the first NV suggestion

I mean, it gives you advantage and disadvantage depending on what you’re playing, but I feel as it balances it out

[ripe thistle]

It's actually not terrible. Your tastes change with time, just like games in development. So whether or not it's out of development is irrelevant. You chose to purchase a product you knew wasnt finished and would be changing. You are not owed a refund in any way just because you changed your mind.

All that is, is selfishness and entitlement. And frankly, it's outright shameful to think it's acceptable to demand a refund because you chose to support something you knew was unfinished.

People buy video games they get maybe 10 good hours out of every once in a great while for 60$. When they're "done" should they get a refund? I mean they clearly got bored for a while with it after a first clear.

Answer: no. And this is no different. So kindly try to adjust your view out of self-service.

[gritty terrace]

this is 100% taste, it is hard to explain why I do not get scared from the new night vision as much. for the old one knowing what will come after you is almost scarier in my opinion, one time lets say I am playing diablos, if a utah jumps me I wouldn't be as scared but just from the glowing eyes and jumpscare value I might be but if a Dilo for example comes, the time where it is coming from just outside my vision then coming to bite me I would realize what it is and be TERRIFIED, where with this my thought when I die is "oh I just died to an outline." the thing that is scary to me is actually seeing the datils of what is about to kill you right before you get hit or right before you die, even if it is very little. another issue is that it shows almost too much detail because nothing can really hide in a bush anymore and it gives you enough info to do combat just fine as if daytime, only thing is that there is no 3D space or depth so unless I am comparing to how far away they are from me on the ground I miss my hits but thats the only difference really. I want to almost disagree to when murrocity is saying where you don't know what is lurking from outside the radius being a scary part of old night vision, I almost get more scared from stuff outside of the radius on the new one because I may be able to see small glimpses of something just outside my NV that would get me more scared than if it was in my radius. With the old night vision for me it is almost like you forget everything that is outside that radius unless you hear a call or footsteps, but then something runs into the radius it is more jumpscary, so I do see the downsides and upsides of both but I think first thing to do is make the radius smaller for most dinos after they tweak the headache issue

[hallow smelt]

So you disagree with me because of my "text tone"., not because of the suggestion itself. Got it.

[neon zephyr]

Huh?? I was scared by just about everything in Legacy when it was dark. e.e

Esp bc I spent a lot of time as a Theri in my early days of playing; night was always so stressful (in a good way) trying to move around and also stay out of danger. I couldn't hardly see crap. I can't really say I'd "forget" about anything outside of my radius. I'm paranoid at night, listening closely to the things around me, esp bc often times the ambient noise would make me think I heard an AI or a player. 😂

I also can't compare legacy NV to this NV to begin with, given I literally can't play to even test it out in such a nature.

All I can say about it; is that legacy night vision didn't cause me eye strain, let alone a seizure.
That as of right now, even if the general opinion is that legacy NV is crap; it's still better than Evrima's current NV iteration, simply bc of the photosensitive/epileptic response to it.

If I absolutely had to choose between the two; with the only other option being to take NV away for now - I'd pick Legacy NV, given at the very least I can actually still play the game 😂 😭

[limber hull]

idk, the ability to see a rex or dilo approaching
A: Defeats the purpose of being a nocturnal if you can't even exploit that fact for your success
B: Weakens the impact as you can easily escape or prepare in advance. Your lack of preperation is what makes nights frightening imho

[neon zephyr]

(I'm obv not saying this is what they should do, at all. I'd actually rather them just take NV away for now like others have said; just until they can work on it more - but ye)

[gritty terrace]

idk, with my experience legacy has that jumpscare factor and has the lurking factor while in combat which I like and with the new one it has that lurking feeling before you are in combat, but when you are in combat it is not really significant spooky wise at all

[ripe thistle]

I never implied that at all. If the old version were good, evrima never would've gotten enough support to continue. People were practically begging for something better. And while evrima has its flaws, it is still an absolute improvement over V3 or earlier.

[uneven mist]

Well that may also be because of the lack of Dino’s, the reason NV was scary in legacy was because of dilo’s and without a nocturnal Dino and bigger Dino’s it does not feel scary

[gritty terrace]

that is fair

idk I just do not think outlines are really scary

the dino's in the game are scary until they come into outline radius

[pastel cove]

@broken canopy Heavily agree with your suggestion. Without it, you literally have to wait for an official server admin to get on (when they might not be on at all) or log to prevent you from starving/dehydrating to death/being killed

[dusk meteor]

I don't think this is fair. More dinos doesn't inherently = more scary. The fear of the unknown is what the old nv preyed on, dilo being a night-time specific dino with spooky sounds helped but was not inherently required. I did find legacy's nv more intimidating than the new one even if I'm not a fan of it overall. The new one doesn't give me any spooks.

[limber hull]

@dusk meteor there's no ambient hypsi sounds wdym

[limber hull]

also the fact that you had huge apexes like rexes and nocturnal demons like dilo 100% helped with the horror. Carno is the biggest we have and it doesn't even instant kill you like how a rex would, nor is it near impossible to lose like a dilo

[dusk meteor]

It's notscary but I can't say I care about the ambient rex noises, they aren'tin the game

[limber hull]

legacy NV without these animals would def feel less scary and more shallow

[dusk meteor]

🤔 But it seems generally poor to include noises which are vital for player interaction in a largely pvp game as a background noise.
thats not to say other spooky sounds couldn't be put in their place but player-specific noises should not be used

which there are plenty of other noises filling it out

[limber hull]

i seriously dont know what ambient player noises you're talking about

i havent heard any of those

[dusk meteor]

have you never heard them?

[limber hull]

nope

i dont think there is ambient player noises at all

on an empty server, I never hear other player calls, it's just ambience and nothing else

all the ambient sounds are very distinct from player calls too

[dusk meteor]

there has been a change to the audio this/last update to be honest there's new sounds it it I haven't heard before
so
I'll tryand listen out and pick it out. There certainly was a hypsi at one point that didn't dsound like other players

it was the hypsi soun but not normal

[faint folio]

I hear hypsis occasionally but with my particular setup I can't make heads or tails of sound directions when I'm playing with other people. I figure they're actual player hypsis somewhere-- they're small and fast so could see one being nearby and never seeing it

[dusk meteor]

maybe it's not in 🤷 but I know for sure i've talked with people who have agreed, I haven't heard it in a while but it was just an example

that said, the basic point doesn't really change

such sounds shouldn't be used unless they're related to ai becuase of the importance of audio

[latent olive]

Playables will have different calls depending on how much stamina they have

[dusk meteor]

No, if anything caused the misunderstannding it would be the echo distortion

Playable calls have an echo effect at further distances which can blend them into the background somewhat. There's a certain radius where this disappears in a snap tho

[ripe thistle]

Imagine saying "no" to helping devs figure out why you're having trouble with a content update. Tell us you're just out to cause problems without telling us you're just out to cause problems. How pathetic.

So, what do you call that little temper tantrum in response to calling petulant behavior pathetic...? A positive suggestion aimed at informing people that just saying "it hurts" doesnt help is rotten?

I realize you have a severe ego complex and need for significance, but every single one of my attempts at having conversation with people like you is met with snark, actual attitude and insults or berating comments. You want to talk about my "rotten attitude" for wanting to fix things, when you're out here just attacking me for it.

I'll say it again: enjoy your hypocrisy

There was absolutely nothing about my post you refuted that was not constructive or helpful. But no, you'd rather show your backside while consistently pretending you're better. People like you are the problem, and the devs know it.

[vestal rune]

I like this suggestion a lot, actually tries to tackle the problem of nv causing eye strain rather than just "NEW NV BAD!!"

[faint folio]

Yeah I do too. And I get a bright purple/orange gradient isn't exactly scary/horror genre, but that's the nice thing about having a setting-- you can adjust the appearance to suit your preferences and needs

Also it looks like it's just a lot easier on the eyes... I'm partial to the green tone example

[molten flame]

Cera bacteria could add as if a diet as carrion. It eats a rotten corpse the diet fills up, and when it bites the diet goes down slightly. Juvis could fill up on a normal corpse or something.

[snow meadow]

@broken canopy I agree with a unstuck button but for the future sometimes I've been able to safe log stuck Inna tree then when I'm logging back in I can wiggle myself out. But only sometimes. It's worth a shot next time.

[faint folio]

I honestly would prefer a separate meter for things like venom and septic bites -- makes no sense that using the ability reduces your diet, especially bacteria that don't even use the dino's resources to maintain

[snow meadow]

What if it made you vomit

[molten flame]

I didnt mean all the diets i ment a separate bar that looks like a diet so it matches

[faint folio]

Ooh, I gotcha. Yeah that would make sense

[faint folio]

I think we're talking about the cost to the ceratosaurus when it uses the ability, not the effect on its prey

[snow meadow]

Oh sorry I read that wrong.

Vomiting from a Cera bite would be pretty fun though (as the cera)

[faint folio]

But that would be an interesting mechanic for it's prey B)

Especially if vomit can be smelled... Half digested lunch tends to smell pretty ripe

[snow meadow]

Imagine if the more sick you got the more bloody your vomit became in the Gore update. And maybe visual changes. Thatd be scary.

[faint folio]

Could be used in replacement of bleed for cera to track prey it bites

[snow meadow]

I wonder if they'd add more salt. I rarely see that stuff

[faint folio]

It's a good point. Would give more reason for salt to be a resource players want to track

Or even if vomit sickness, instead of suddenly dropping your hunger and diet to 20%, gradually did it over time-- playing the vomit animation once every 10-20 seconds and draining 5-10% each time until it hits 20%

Would give a reason to seek salt (which cures vomit sickness), preserving your hunger and diet

@snow meadow

[agile lark]

@barren zephyr I like that idea! With the sort of glowy look to Dino’s eyes. And the foreground either being so blurry that you can’t have infinite vision, or have it become quite a bit dark.

I am not sure the technicalities, but I feel gamma could definitely be abused in a sense with that - because they are trying to prevent that so that nocturnal hunters have their own strong suit - but still. I can’t shake the eye strain I have right now.

[snow meadow]

Yeah that'd be pretty cool

[faint folio]

Yeah I think blur would be the better option because gamma doesn't work on blur. The only issue is you need to be careful because there's a middle ground of blur where people's eyes try to focus on objects and they can't (because the actual image they're looking at is blurred--theres nothing to focus on) and that can cause eyestrain. But with enough blur of course then it stops being interpreted as shapes that you can focus on and the issue goes away

[agile lark]

Very true

[night oxide]

its way too long dark in my opinion

[vestal rune]

@kindred kiln wait I'm confused, can't you just save over a previous skin?

[sand oar]

there is a reset button

[kindred kiln]

yes you can but otherwise until you save the skin is there and loads automatically

lets say i randomly generate a cool skin that i want to replace some of my old one with - i cant because if i switch my generated skin is lost

its just a small little quality of life thing thats not necessary but would be nice to have

[vestal rune]

ohhhh I see

[kindred kiln]

reset button does not delete your saved skin from the slot it only sets the colours to default

im usually trying to replace skins in different slots like that using export/import options but results are mixed... i find that usually when i import skin from code it does not come exactly as ive exported it

[idle cradle]

Anyone try to get Evrima to run on the Steam Deck? The anti cheat doesn't want to work, which is frustrating when other games using the EAC work just fine (like VRchat)

[barren zephyr]

@scarlet ocean well said, I completely agree with you 100%.

[surreal sedge]

imo this suggestion that keeps getting upvoted is way too bright kinda negating the point of night to where it is more difficult to see even with night vision

[urban flax]

Wait I just realized that's from Skyrim

[surreal sedge]

maybe i could see troodon having this quality of nightvision but basically everything else is a hard no from me

[urban flax]

People are upset about night being SO dark they would like anything that's not pitch black

[surreal sedge]

aye and it should be brighter with night vision, even with something that has puny eyes like a stego or pachy but yeah this would be a bit much for night vision, except probably pachy and maybe ptera

[urban flax]

I honestly am one of those people
I don't like it when games make nights so unrealistically dark
Like, just go outside somewhere without urban lights, with clear weather, you'll be able to actually see a lot

[surreal sedge]

and dilo

yeah you will but still this game wants to have dark nights where its difficult to see and well skyrim isnt difficult to see at night like at all

[neon zephyr]

Couldn't that just be used a cocept, and it can be made darker, and where you can't see as far, based on what dino you are?

[urban flax]

Nights in skyrim are always full-moon levels of brightness
But that screenshot used a weather mod or an ENB, maybe both

[surreal sedge]

its definitely an enb skyrim isnt that pretty lol

but yeah i still like my suggestion of for some dinos with bad night vision keeping the current night vision but upping the gamma in an area around the player just enough to barely distinguish colors

current night vision is what a stego with a poor diet should see

[urban flax]

I'm worried at how night will look for humans if they keep it this way
Using a flashlight during the night shouldn't be mandatory if you're trying to hide

[surreal sedge]

ideally unless humans get night vision goggles from a lucky find they should be terrified of even a determined subadult utah, well unless someone has a gun but then what are you going to draw in with that.

besides theres gonna be bases at night unless youve made a mistake you should be hunkering down in a defensive position in some structure or hell even a well defended cave

night for humans should be very unpleasant unless geared up or with someone that is

head on a swivel type stuff

but yeah some basic night vision for them

[faint folio]

Yeah I imagine night vision goggles will be tech available (on top of torches, flashlights, fires, etc). Then they have guns, spears, machetes, bows, etc for if they do attract something

[surreal sedge]

maybe have them have to stay still and concentrate for their night vision to really boost up to where they can see stuff kinda decently, but have it decay with movement or looking at anything bright

[urban flax]

Unpleasant yes
But not "flashlight or go blind"

[modern prism]

@sick halo that's would be an awesome feature to have. I keep a hunt log of every dino I play. Would be superb if there was an in-game feature that kept track of your dinos Kill count. I'm all for it

[surreal sedge]

aye, can make out shapes but good luck figuring out if that blob is a sitting utah or a rock

[sick halo]

Thanks! I gotta keep a hunt log myself then, cuz i'm always so curious how many I knockdown myself! Especially with the deinos, has to be 10+ with my full adult

[faint folio]

Humans really do have terrible night vision. If you go way out in the country on a night with the moon half full or less, you really can't make out more than vague gray shapes and movement. Especially not what a moving animal is

With a full moon, you can see really well. But not with a crescent moon

[urban flax]

I know how it looks at night I literally live way out in the country

[surreal sedge]

But yeah I do think humans should very much favor finding somewhere to hunker down at during the night, encourages humans to use bases because they don't have the same ability to navigate at night as dinosaurs except the exceptionally poor visioned ones like stego and anky and even those would probably have slightly better night vision at a perfect diet than a human, at least better ability to distinguish colors

[calm granite]

@barren zephyr hard to trust this community tbh

[proven river]

Yes but when you have all the server saying that the night vision causes epileptic seizures i feel like you would listen to them, shit's dangerous

[proud coral]

I imagine they're trying to get a fix working. Hopefully at least. 😋 Prolly takes time

[faint folio]

Okay... Then it makes sense to say that during new moon and crescent moon, humans need flashlights (or they go blind, like real night). During gibbous and full moon, they can see fine without help.

Also increases the importance of bases and shelter, otherwise players would never use them. Plus, it may not be just afk sim if humans get enough tasks to do around base at night-- crafting defenses, repairing tools, preparing food, creating ammo or armor or storage, etc

[jagged jewel]

yes that's pretty much the plan

except for some reason the day and night cycle part of 5.5 didn't make it in

[faint folio]

That's weird

[barren zephyr]

Ig, but votes should at least be tried out.

[mystic lion]

#general-feedback message
@barren zephyr
i can't get behind the foggy blue night idea, similar to how it was before the new NV update. i'm not a big fan of the new night vision, but the fogginess from before absolutely killed my eyes. in a way that induced headaches and nausea. because you're always scanning the distance, which is all foggy, and your eyes are trying to define things and focus and you can't. it's terrible.

[jade brook]

^

[neon zephyr]

I can say @proven river - reducing the amount of NV "line clutter" would prolly be yet another thing they could try. ^^

There's been a lot of pretty good collective suggestions - like getting rid of motion blur, making the lines darker, and so on. (not to mention the lovely concept ideas)

@proven geyser
A QA member did actually contact me for a little more info about a photosensitive mode and another game's edits they will be making to reduce the strain.

Just trying to get them to release a statement about it and a warning :/
No one should go through what I did, esp when they've contacted me - so very well know about it.

Though I guess if they aren't taking it seriously, then

[proven river]

[neon zephyr]

(Sorry for pings )

[proven river]

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[neon zephyr]

😂

[proven geyser]

Thanks for letting me know.
Im glad thats getting sorted.

But sadly its strill true that the feedback channel is mainly ignored.

[neon zephyr]

Yeah, I've seen it mentioned a lot ; A ;

Big

[vestal rune]

I mean iirc punch said he looks through it quite frequently

HUH

[limber hull]

LMAO

WHO DOESN'T READ FEEDBACK NOW

[proud coral]

[tiny compass]

@barren zephyr I agree with everything you say except the eyes glow in the dark is pretty weak for us to see unless the animal is looking at a direct light source so it’s eyes can reflect it.

[jagged sleet]

@fleet surge
Try this

If you are experiencing issues with your controls since the latest update (can't move camera, unable to court, etc) then please try wiping your config files in localappdata.

1. If running The Isle, exit the game.
2. Open File Explorer.
3. Click the address bar at the top.
4. Type %localappdata% then press Enter.
5. Find "TheIsle" folder. Open it.
6. Open the "Saved" folder.
7. Delete the "Config" folder. Note: This will reset any of your custom settings to their defaults.
8. Restart the game. The issues should be fixed.

[fleet surge]

i just cant see anything the screens so dark and the x button does not activate any night vision.

but i wil;l try those steps

[jagged sleet]

it should fix the X button not working or showing up in keybinds, fixed it for me

[fleet surge]

ok thanks

[fleet surge]

yer did it but i cant not customisee any of the buttons to fit to my hand size, finger crossed they fix this hot mess soon

[summer forge]

@gloomy reef not to be mean but if you're out of stam then it's your fault for getting eaten when you spawn

[gloomy reef]

I had no stam when i logged in lol.

and he merked me for just logging in

they are ment to be in water

not land, they shouldnt be able to merk a stego on land.

[summer forge]

modern crocs and gator also live on land though, and some can run pretty fast

[gloomy reef]

Small crocs can run fast a 5Ton i think croc can not run fast.

[summer forge]

true

[gloomy reef]

They bask on land.

They dont rlly live on land.

[summer forge]

yeah

true

[gloomy reef]

rip my stego lol

[uneven mist]

I mean…you had no stam ofc you were going to die also stego is mutch faster than deino so idk how it catched up to you

[gloomy reef]

he walked faster then me my z walk wasnt on and i was normal speed

and he magicly catched up to me

he also killed me with tail bites

[uneven mist]

Hmmm, interesting. Want to test it out on scope?

[uneven mist]

Kinda sounds like speed hack but I’m not sure

[gloomy reef]

whats scope?

[uneven mist]

Server that lets you get admin to test and fight

[gloomy reef]

Yea sure

do u wanna 1v1 after we test it? Cas i am bored.

[uneven mist]

Sure

[gloomy reef]

can u vc?

[uneven mist]

I can yes

[gloomy reef]

ight join the vc in dms.

[reef sorrel]

when ur suggestion gets blocked by the bots 😅

[neon zephyr]

Oof ; A ;

[reef sorrel]

trying to figure out what words in it triggered it

[neon zephyr]

Hope you're able to figure out. : o

[uneven mist]

Did you say either s hit or f uck?

[rocky aspen]

The baby skins are a little confusing to me.. they're meant to cover the body of a small dinosaur. There just blotches of colors with no spots. I think that isn't very productive to add.

[limber hull]

@neon zephyr okay, so i've given NV a good hard look after doing my assignments and getting some free time. On one hand, I love what they've done, on the other, I can FULLY see and sympathise with what you're going through

That flickering is really notable

[neon zephyr]

It's not just the flickering.

For the brief moment I watched the stream I was watching, I actually didn't even see much flickering.

The entire design hurts.

But I do appreciate it, Anky.

Flickering is a really big issue regardless

[limber hull]

as far as i can tell, the flickering is based on anti-aliasing

Which is kinda bad

It means that depending on your settings, you can be assaulted with flickering grass

I personally prefer high to epic

And that's where the flickering is quite notable

[severe idol]

There are no mentions of you or your account for recent activity.

[neon zephyr]

Oh hey Saoul!

Y'all should release a statement about the photosensitive and epilepsy concerns : ' }

[limber hull]

I've been doing some testing of my own

[severe idol]

Literally not a Developer.

Not an employee, not paid, no control over it’s actions or choices.

[neon zephyr]

Fair enough 🤷

Wasn't directly saying you should do it as is.

But, it's a very important matter, so Imma keep saying it.

I didn't even @ or reply; so no ping received by you.

[severe idol]

I don’t do work for Afterthought, I just do Discord. There is no “y’all”I am a part of to make any semblance of an official statement and it would probably be extremely detrimental to me if I did or pretended to. DM Punchpacket.

[neon zephyr]

Ok

[pastel cove]

Isn’t DMing a Dev a mutable offense? I’ve seen other discords work like that

[severe idol]

Word of the rule is that Punchpacket is the one you CAN message.

[pastel cove]

I see; thank you for the clarification.

[severe idol]

As it’s also literally the first one… please take a minute to familiarize yourself with the rules.

[pastel cove]

I’ve read through them before, just have trouble remembering, I’ll give it another look through though.

[severe idol]

Most of them are pretty straight forward and can sum up as “Try not to be a dick”.

[pastel cove]

Yeah pretty much. It was just the first one I didn’t remember but pretty much the others are standard and common sense.

[severe idol]

A facet of the Discord important to me is that users are free to discuss basically anything as long as it's done in a civil and orderly manner. That's how we've maintained through various troubles over my time here and will continue to do as long as I'm here (likely after). There's a few topics that shouldn't be brought up in polite company and are self-evident by their content.

If you guys suspect you're being unduly suppressed or think there's some foulplay, do not hesitate to DM me. They're always open. I have full access to logs of the Discord and what happens (deleted messages, altered messages, bot snipes, etc) This is particularly in towards Moderator trouble, we've got a form for it available at the bottom of the rules page and I'll add a link to the bottom of this. They are only visible to Senior Administration and are kept confidential.

[And to the select group that think I'm the main problem; who knows. Give it a try. You might be surprised]
https://dyno.gg/form/a81c40a8 <- Mod complaint form.

While this isn't relevant to any conversation at hand in particular, it's good to remind people every so often.

[pastel cove]

I’ll actually take you up on this in DMs cause I am curious about something I was warned for a day or two ago.

[proven river]

@gloomy reef , stego walks and runs faster than deino, it may have been a sub adult but adult deino isn't faster than adult stego

[pastel cove]

Yeah adult deino is practically useless on land if it tries to get away

I’ve killed an adult deino since it ran out of stam far out of water with a couple of tail hits as a steg

I do believe the stego population is going down though since stegs are canning a LOT lately

Saw one massacre two adult stegs on NA5, was crazy

[pastel cove]

@fleet surge The devs are looking into it, I had a short discussion with Punch about it earlier

[queen mortar]

in my experience people who claim to have been unjustly muted were actually muted or banned justifiably and were given multiple chances. i've had multiple people reach out to me about an unjust ban and i've pretty easily been able to verify that they were pushing the limits (i've been there too as @severe idol can probably recall). it's pretty easy to get back in after an allotted "time-out" has passed and you can display that you're sincerely sorry for misusing this forum, which is ultimately a privileged experience and i remind others that who are banned. i think people are entitled to a lot of basic needs, but being apart of a community discord is not one of them. to be a public discord doesn't make it a truly public forum.

but i'll also be the first to say i've seen the staff here mishandle things. they're imperfect for sure, but i've always had positive outcomes when bringing up issues. i think the staff do really give a sh*t

bad staff have also been dealt with in the past

shout out to @topaz epoch for being an OG boss hog

[pastel cove]

I do feel you on that one. I was warned for putting a suggestion and adding “ik the devs don’t really look at feedback”. Literally a day or two ago I was constantly angry and upset at the Devs, I get it they take long for updates, but they’re people too. I’d imagine it’s difficult when your own fan base wants to see you fail and constantly berate you.

That’s the only thing I was really confused about, but other than that, I had a civil conversation with SaoulZodd about the rules etc. i haven’t seen bad adminship at all in the server

[severe idol]

It's rare we have to scrape a Moderator or Admin from our roster, but it does happen.

[queen mortar]

it has happened, but it doesn't go un-dealt with

[pastel cove]

I was a bit frustrated about it but I just let it go, not really worth the complaining etc etc

Rather be more productive and do something and discuss lore ideas and how to make the game better

[cedar quartz]

@fluid lake if you don’t want to annoy Kojih you can just disable ping on reply

[proud coral]

That pack leader suggestion was basically already talked about by the devs, having to fight for your status and also maintain it n' such. Not sure if it's 100% confirmed thoough.

[marsh leaf]

not in my personal experience. if you say something that hurts their feelings, you get banned, regardless of how neutral in tone you try to be. i got a permanent steam forum ban because i called any manager without the technical skills to know when someone they are in charge of is bamboozling them "incompetent." i mean, what else am i supposed to call it, especially when said bamboozling necessitates the entire project being redone from scratch?

[minor laurel]

It actually doesn't bother me, don't worry. I'll even say that it is always pleasant to have people trusting this idea. I surely am grateful for all people who found it worth. Thank you !

[zealous stone]

@clever thorn I don't think all carnivores should have better night vision than herbivores, as that reduces the ways they have of differentiating carnivores from other carnivores and herbivores from other herbivores. Some herbivores should fear the night, but others should fear the day.

[jagged jewel]

@clever thorn stuff like dryo should have better NV than the average carnivore

[zealous stone]

So I was playing Deino and hunting herbivores along that common migration route between the Central Grasslands and the Swamp, and I actually find it quite fun so I had an idea. What if the Isle did more to encourage carnivores to actively stalk migrating groups of herbivores, rather than just sticking to one general area and hunting what shows up.

Perhaps herbivore herds could sort of serve as mobile hotspots, with carnivores lurking just out of sight.

[queen mortar]

you and others like you who make assumptions and speak on topics you weren't and aren't privy to are arrogant. if someone behaved like a childish asshole in my discord or steam page i'd ban them too. they're justified and within their right to do so. in my opinion, its refreshing to have developers who stand up for themselves and their work instead of folding to frivolous whining.

these devs take criticism. i offer my own criticism all the time, the difference is that i offer that criticism in a constructive and respectful manner, because i understand that any disrespect given can result in me being removed from this forum. if i "hurt the devs feelings" after i just got done slandering them, i wouldn't blame them for kicking me. play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

[vestal rune]

are you talking about the deathly situation?

[marsh leaf]

the thing about slander: it's not true. if the statement is true, it's not slander. challenge: give me an adjective that isnt "incompetent" that describes the lack of competence. how can i inform the team that when they give the situation described as the reason they had to start from scratch, it does not inspire confidence?

[vestal rune]

because if you are then I 100% understand why you were banned that heavily comes off as one of those reddit hate babies

[marsh leaf]

i dont know the names, but maybe?

[vestal rune]

oh as in the programmer who's work was so bad that they had to redo all of it

[marsh leaf]

that's it. my offence was questioning why that person's manager was not a competent enough programmer to know the team was being hoodwinked.

[vestal rune]

you're talking about dondi I'm presuming. The reason for that is because the isle initially started off as a passion project with barely any devs, there was one programmer who's manager was someone with 0 coding experience. As much as I dislike a lot of what dondi does I cannot blame him for not realising what deathly was doing in the early days. It was only once they got more devs and more importantly more programmers where it was made clear the effect deathly had on the game, which is why he was fired and the recode took place

I guess you could technically call that incompetent sure, but going on the forums and making those accusations on a situation you weren't a part in immediatly puts red flags on your intentions of criticism

[marsh leaf]

it's not exactly an accusation when i'm just rephrasing what punch told me into a single sentence.

and i didnt just "go to the forums" and do that. i had been a regular for some time by that point

[vestal rune]

from what it sounds like punch explained the situation to you and you decide to go "the manager is incompetant"? idk it still seems accusatory

from my personal experience, I regularly critcise the game in this discord and even straight up make fun of it, but the only punishments I've been given were stupid things like being sniped by the bot

[marsh leaf]

stop for a moment and think: this is a product being sold for money, and because of "managerial missteps" the entire product had to be remade from scratch. as a customer, wouldent you want to know there was no way for something like that to happen again?

[vestal rune]

recodes like that aren't uncommon while designing software. I see no reason for anything like that to happen again as they started evrima with a wider programming team which drastically reduces the chance of anything close to this happening again