questions-2

[whole portal]

Mh you can't use it for all meanings of approach like that

Ansatz/Herangehensweise

But Annäherung is a word, yes

[fervent kernel]

Danke

[whole portal]

Annäherungsverbot = restraining order for example

[manic stream]

Hi. I have my B2 Goethe examination on 27th. Do you guys have any tips 👀🥲

[long whale]

der Annäherungsversuch = a guy trying to pick up a girl

[whole portal]

I was about to say that

Also why not the other way

[fervent kernel]

Approaching attempts 😄

[whole portal]

Not that any girl has approached me so far 😔

[fervent kernel]

That might be the why 😄

[fervent kernel]

The message order mixed up. I meant, this might be the reason, that wasn't the response to your message 😅

[rugged hazel]

No translation exists

[hidden tinsel]

What's the difference between zb2 and b2/j in osd???

[long whale]

Please don't post the same question in more than 1 channel - just re-post in the same if it doesn't get answered. ;) Also, perhaps you could post a link to where you found this, or at least provide some context?

Ah - it's ÖSD - "z" = Zertifikat/certificate; b2/j = Jugendliche (14 - 17 years old)

@hidden tinsel

[junior flame]

I read a german text where a man was saying this sentence: "Ich kann Euch nicht verstehen.".
Although he was addressing only one person he used 'Euch' and that too with capital 'E'. Why this?

[long whale]

It's either a very old text, or it's fantasy/a fairy tale, right? It's an obsolete, very respectful form of address, used to be used for social superiors, even the king/queen.

[stable pawn]

Can someone help me understand this sentence? “Daß das der” is really tripping me up

[long whale]

You know about "dass" (that), right? "das" = this/that; "der [nächste Schritt] = def. article (the)

Does that help?

[stable pawn]

So what is “das” referring to?

[whole portal]

Something from before

It's a relative pronoun if I got the terminology right

[stable pawn]

So in the independent clause starting with “daß”, “der nächste Schritt” would be the subject, right? What would “das” be acting as?

Achhh ich sehe jetzt

Vielen Dank @long whale & @whole portal

[proven sphinx]

By the way, "daß" is no longer correct after 1996. It's been superseded by "dass".

[flint nimbus]

is this a good translation of "can you please repeat the first thing you said?"

Kannst du bitte wiederholen das erste Sache du gesagt hast?

wait! let me make a change

ok, now

[whole portal]

Kannst du bitte das Erste/die erste Sache, die du gesagt hast wiederholen?

[flint nimbus]

i see

[sleek pulsar]

How does one say „Tell me about X” in German, ie "tell me about where you're from"?

[pastel shore]

You will probably want to check the verbs "Erzahlen" & "Sagen". Also: "where you're from?" = "woher kommst du"

[sleek pulsar]

Ok, danke sehr!

[timid vector]

erzählen*

also in this context it would be "woher du kommst"

Sag mir bitte nochmal, woher du kommst?

or with the other
Erzähl mir, woher du kommst

first being more like tell the information and 2nd being more about describing it I would say but maybe my intuition isn't the best for that

[nimble viper]

Wann sagt man wirklich “Anzeige ist raus”

[rugged hazel]

Maybe you could say it instead of "Ich habe XY angezeigt", but it's more of a joke saying by young people
(i.e. nobody ever says it)
If you mean when to use it in a joking way: Three parties exist, one is abiding by every single rule and overly strict in the eyes of the second party, which has no problem with breaking smaller rules not taken seriously even by the third party which is neutral. In a general sense, the first party notices the second breaking such a rule / moral code or similar and overreacts (according to party two) by threatening to sue (anzeigen) party two. Party two is making fun of party one by using their own slang/colloquial speech ("Anzeige ist raus") to represent party one between each other, without party one ever actually interacting with party two for the specific rule-breaking

[nimble viper]

Wow what a niche use! Saw someone type it in a comments section to a reel with hundreds of likes and I had no idea why the comment was so popular

So Party two is making fun of party one with this statement because it supposedly fools party one into thinking they have achieved something?

[rugged hazel]

They make fun of the perceived overcorrectness of 1

2.a Walks across the street when no cars are present but the light is red.
2.b. "Anzeige ist raus!"
1 is not present

it's not as complex as you think with fooling 1 or something. it's really dumb

[long whale]

Side note if anyone's interested: jdn anzeigen; Anzeige gegen jdn erstatten = to report somebody to the authorities/police

[fervent kernel]

Good morning 🙂 I would like to ask 2 questions about justice and laws.

• I am looking for a translation of "defence", but this is not like "defending an area". It is more like: someone accuses another person and the other person "defences" themselves. In English, it is also possible to say "come back" (more casual). So, I'm just wondering if these sentences are correct.

"Er hat sich gegen Anklagen verteidigt" (defence)
"Was ist dein Zurückkommen?" (come back)

• I also wanna ask if these translations are correct because "accusing" someone or "charge" someone might change depending on the situation, casual or formal.

"anschuldigen" - "accuse" (die Anschuldigung)
"beschuldigen" - "blame" (die Beschuldigung)
"anklagen" - "charge" (die Anklage)

And I believe, "anklagen" is the most formal one?

[long whale]

1. jdn/etwas verteidigen works for all: defending a country/place, oneself (sich) against any kind of attack (verbal or physical) and also for lawyers. The other one (come back) doesn't.

2. jdn [einer Sache (Genitiv)] anschuldigen/beschuldigen mean the same (to accuse). I believe jdn [einer Sache (Genitiv)] anklagen is really only used in the context of court proceedings.

@fervent kernel

[fervent kernel]

Danke schön 🙂

anklagen is the more formal one then if it's used in courts

[long whale]

Also, there is a very long list of more or less colloquial synonyms for jdn/sich verteidigen.

[long whale]

Nothing to do with formal/informal (in English and in German, at least to my knowledge). I can accuse you basically of anything (if I'm crazy enough). It depends on whether the DA/der Staatsanwalt decides there is reason to charge you whether you actually get charged (Anklage erheben).

[fervent kernel]

Danke 🙂

[slate salmon]

Hello!:) Did I write this correctly? This sounds a bit off. "Um ein Kind zu erziehen, braucht es zwei Personen."

[verbal girder]

i was thinking about benötigt but whado iknow 🤷‍♂️

[wise pendant]

Yes you did

[slate salmon]

Thank you!

[slate salmon]

What about this sentence? " Ich hoffe nur, dass nichts Schlimmes daraus manifestiert"

[long whale]

No. "sich manifestieren" is the wrong verb. "aus etwas resultieren" would work, so would "bei etwas herauskommen" (for example)

[slate salmon]

Thanks!

[rugged hazel]

Is there a difference between using benötigen and brauchen that matters though?

[slate salmon]

"Ich hoffe nur, dass dabei nichts Schlimmes herauskommt." would work?

[long whale]

Yes. :)

[long whale]

IMO, "benötigen" would not really work in OP's sentence. "nötig sein" would work, though.

I don't know whether other native speakers would feel differently, but to me, it would sound quite... strange if you said "Man benötigt zwei Personen, um ein Kind zu erziehen". As if raising a child were like making soup: you need X ingredients, you know?

[rugged hazel]

I thought "Es braucht 2 Personen" sounds fine too

Haha yes like a recipe

[long whale]

Yes, of course it's fine. :) (I was just thinking about your question/possible alternatives.)

[dreamy fern]

Hello, I have a little question about deutsch pronouns: I don't understand when I ought to use "mein, dein", I mean possessive pronouns without alterations.
Muss man "meinen Löffel" oder "mein Löffel" sagen ? für mascl. Dativ ?
Because I have a german list of pronouns where they never mention usage of mein, dein, indeed all the possibilities (all cases with all pronouns) are, I believe, matched with mein+alteration or dein+alteration etc.. : as I mentioned, for mascl. Datif there is "mein+en"
However on other sources I can see
"Das ist mein Löffel."

[opal narwhal]

"mein Löffel" is Nominativ

"meinen Löffel" is Akkusativ

"meinem Löffel" is Dativ

[dreamy fern]

On both my book and websites it is written meiner for Nominative

[tardy shadow]

Meiner cannot be nominative

[dreamy fern]

Ok maybe it is an error from my book and the random website

Thank you very much !

[tardy shadow]

Here are the declensions of Löffel: https://www.verbformen.com/?w=Löffel

You use dein and mein etc. either for nominative masculine/neuter or accusative neuter

[dreamy fern]

Ok thanks, don't worry it was just my book saying to me to use meiner for Nominativ masculine

I 'll dump it x)

[tardy shadow]

I think masculine and neuter conjugate the same way for dative and genitive but I'm not sure

[dreamy fern]

Oh, I have another question I you don't mind

[tardy shadow]

Is it in a sentence

[dreamy fern]

no it's a list

[tardy shadow]

Go ahead and ask

[opal narwhal]

"meiner" can be Nominativ, but only as a pronoun

[tardy shadow]

Oh, you mean at the start of a clause?

[dreamy fern]

oh, so it can be a pronoun or an article

[opal narwhal]

No, I mean when there is no noun after it

[dreamy fern]

Ok I'm confuse now

[tardy shadow]

Isn't that for feminine nouns though

[opal narwhal]

Mein Löffel ist grösser als dein Löffel. / Meiner ist grösser als deiner.

[tardy shadow]

Oh no if it's nominative right

If it's dative it would be meiner for a feminine noun

But since it's nominative it's nominative for a masculine noun

[opal narwhal]

?

[tardy shadow]

Nominative* lol I disclosed it in the same sentence

Here let me edit

[opal narwhal]

Oh, OK, then yes 😉

[dreamy fern]

So it's as the difference between my and mine ?

[opal narwhal]

Exactly!

[tardy shadow]

Ye

[dreamy fern]

You made my day thanks

I'm so stupid

[opal narwhal]

You are not stupid, you are learning. It is normal to make mistake and be confused

[tardy shadow]

My bad for saying it cannot be nominative

I forgot it exists in the sense of "mine"

[dreamy fern]

I understand why we use accusativ for "Ich freue mich"
so why do we use dativ for "Es geht mir" ?

[tardy shadow]

It's a nuance

It (my day or whatever) goes to me

It tells you to whom of importance is the verb

[dreamy fern]

But if I say "Es freut mich" (the day please me), isn't it the same nuance as "Es geht mir" ?

[tardy shadow]

No because the verb freuen apparently takes an actual, accusative object

You could say "es geht" and continue the sentence without using "mir" to refer to how the day went for you

It's just a nuance in this case I believe

[dreamy fern]

But gehen doesn't always takes an dativ object right?

[tardy shadow]

It doesn't take any object at all as far as I am aware

You can always use dative pronouns to add this nuance of importance to somebody

Unless the verb actually uses it for something

[dreamy fern]

Can you share an exemple please ?

[tardy shadow]

"Es tut mir leid" I think is a good example

It does me sorrow

[dreamy fern]

Oh and tut is for tun I guess ?

[tardy shadow]

Yes

[dreamy fern]

Thanks I think I understand better know, is the "nuance" tantamount of increasing the importance of the "action" of the sentence ?

[tardy shadow]

With gehen you might have also learned "Wie geht's?" ("How's it going?") or the full sentence "Wie geht es dir?" ("How is it going for you?")

[tardy shadow]

Or relevance/reference. It's of some importance to the referred, of course

[dreamy fern]

And when you say "You can always use dative pronouns to add this nuance of importance to somebody" you mean I can always use it ?

[tardy shadow]

No I think it's more colloquial with some verbs over others

Also doesn't really work when a verb uses the dative case for something but honestly I think the idea is the same when it's a proper, grammatical case for a verb's object

[dreamy fern]

ok so for instance "er hat mich getocht" cannot be turned into "er hat mir getocht" ?

It's more an error than an attempt to get a nuance out of it ?

[tardy shadow]

For example with geben: "Ich gebe dir das Bild" ("I'm giving you the painting"), it wouldn't matter to you or refer to you at all being the one who got the painting which I gave

[dreamy fern]

So in your case (with geben) it works ? That's what you mean right ?

[tardy shadow]

I'm not familiar with the verb

[dreamy fern]

I wanted to use töten

[tardy shadow]

The verb geben properly needs a dative object if I want to express to whom the accusative object is given

[dreamy fern]

but I used another verb by mistake

[dreamy fern]

Cool to know, thanks

[dreamy fern]

wanted to say "er hat mich getötet" , can it be turned into "er hat mir getötet"

[tardy shadow]

I think the nuance works in the verb nehmen, for example, which means "to take", in which case I'm expressing to whom or for whose sake the accusative object is taken

Ich nehme mir Eis - I'm taking ice for me

[tardy shadow]

I think with the dative it's like "he died on me"

[dreamy fern]

But didn't you say that with Dativ, the action is emphasised but not the one who receive ?

[dreamy fern]

Oh x)

[tardy shadow]

The one to whom the verb is of importance is how I like to describe the nuance

[tardy shadow]

Well, no, sorry, "he's killed for me"

Not really "for my sake", maybe like a soldier killing without being commanded to do so

Kind of passively for someone, you know?

Like "oops I did it and you care about it"

[dreamy fern]

I think I understand your examples with "mir", but the one with the painting seems a little hard to me: because you said no matter who is the one receiving the painting (it would be all the same coz here it emphasis the one who give it), but isn't it the dativ objective to emphasis whom receive the painting ? because the one marked with the dativ ist dich->dir

[tardy shadow]

Ye, the dative object of geben is the recipient

This is who I like to call the one for whom the action is relevant after it's done

I'm giving it. You're of relevance to it, because I'm giving it to you

[dreamy fern]

And you mean it's the same one who is being more important with dativ ? ( the one for whom the action is relevant after it's done)

[tardy shadow]

Yeah that's how I take it

It's a lot more direct with geben because it always refers to the recipient of the action of giving

It's like the meaning of the dative object for this verb

[dreamy fern]

So it end up I just did'nt understood your explanation with the painting 🙂

Thank you for your explanations !

[tardy shadow]

Das Bild - the painting

It's a noun

With geben I like to think the meaning of the indirect object, which is expressed with the dative case, has been fixed

To mean the recipient

[dreamy fern]

Oh I see, with have the same in French

But there is no Dativ fortunately x)

[tardy shadow]

With the verbs sagen/erzählen, the dative object is also the recipient of what is said

[dreamy fern]

Nice, when there is an object and a recipient, and both are persons the dativ is to add importance for who ? the recipient I would have said.

But I saw the sentence : "Sie Schicken dir ein Agent."

And maybe I'm wrong but isn't the Agent the important one here ? even though the recipient dir is marked with the dativ

[pliant widget]

Reading this makes me feel like I'm in German class 😨

[delicate tiger]

"Sie schicken dir einen Agenten."

[dreamy fern]

How did you know it was einen Agenten ?

[opal narwhal]

@dreamy fern To make it simple (if you know well you French Grammar): Akkusativ = COD / Dativ = COI. It doesn't always work, but most of the time 😉

[dreamy fern]

Yep

[pliant widget]

I actually never think about why I use that haha

Bauchgefühl

[dreamy fern]

Okkkk

I'm so confused

I understand now, it's just a normal sentence

[opal narwhal]

Yes

[dreamy fern]

And I understand too that it is akkusativ mascl therefore we need to use einen

but how did the +en happened on Agent

[opal narwhal]

It's a special declension (n-Deklination)

[dreamy fern]

But isn't it einen Vater ? (akk mscl)

and neither einen Vatern nor einen Vateren

[opal narwhal]

It is. But some nouns are declined differently (n-Deklination), there are only few (Agent, Student, Nachbar, etc.)

[dreamy fern]

My day is ruined x)

Thank you all !

[tardy shadow]

Name too?

[long whale]

Yes.

[plain umbra]

faq weak nouns

[stoic mauve]

Weak Nouns

Weak nouns are called this way because they receive the same endings as adjectives inflected with weak endings. They take an additional ending -n in every case except nominative singular. This is also known as N-Declension and affects almost exclusively masculine nouns.

Nominativ: der Junge, die Junge__n__
Genitiv: des Junge__n__, der Junge__n__
Dativ: dem Junge__n__, den Junge__n__
Akkusativ: den Junge__n__, die Junge__n__

Some nouns end with a suffix -en to make the pronunciation easier:
der Mensch, den Mensch__en__

‼ Das Herz is the only non-masculine (neuter) noun with N-Declension❣

So how do we recognize these nouns? We can divide them into 3 big groups:

1. nouns of Greek and Latin origin,
2. nouns ending with -e (most of these refer to people or animals),
3. other random German nouns (Mensch, Herr, Student, Nachbar, Prinz etc.)

Another way to divide the groups could be:

1. nouns denoting male beings in general (der Bauer, der Knabe, der Herr, der Junge, der Kunde etc.)
2. nouns indicating nationality or religious affiliation (der Chinese, der Russe, der Türke, der Jude, der Katholik, der Protestant)
3. nouns designating male beings and ending in the foreign suffixes (-ant, -arch, -ast, -ege, -ent, -ist, -oge, -om, -oph, -ot: der Kollege, der Student, der Psychologe, der Polizist, der Philosoph)

‼ der Käse and words ending with -ee aren’t weak nouns.

Genitive of Weak Nouns
You might have noticed from the examples above that weak nouns don’t have the additional -s in genitive like other masculine nouns.
Some exceptions are das Herz and nouns of group 3 that don’t refer to people nor animals (Name, Wille, Glaube, Buchstabe etc.), which take both the -n and -s endings.
Example: der Name, des Name__ns__.

[plain umbra]

This may be helpful.

[plain umbra]

Dative has nothing to do with adding importance to anything, btw. It simply shows what part of the sentence the noun is being used for. So in "es geht mir gut" for example, dative just shows the person whose wellbeing you're describing. You don't have to really know why it's dative - in this case it's pretty much just idiomatic and you can memorise it. Later you will learn some grammar concepts where the case follows a rule, but in this one, you don't really have to think about it too much as long as you can remember it.

[dreamy fern]

Thanks a lot

"Du musst mir helfen, es rechzeitig zur Party zu schaffen" apparently means "You need to help me to arrive on time at the party"

But when I search for schaffen meaning

There is all but the "arrive" meaning, am I understanding something wrong ?

maybe if I turn it like "make it on time to the party"

Because schaffen also means create, so maybe make ?

[plain umbra]

Yes, it's similar to "make" in the sense of reaching/achieving something.

And it can be used like this to expressing "making it on time" to something.

Rechtzeitig is part of that.

[dreamy fern]

Awesome, thank you again

[plain umbra]

Basically:
rechtzeitig schaffen = make it on time

No problem.

[flint nimbus]

Um wen kümmerst du dich, Harry?
Ich kümmere um den Pinguin.

why isn't kümmern reflexive in the answer?

also should kümmern sich um be generically translated to take care of?

[opal narwhal]

Normally, it should be: Ich kümmere mich um den Pinguin.

[flint nimbus]

maybe just a mistake from the course makers then

[opal narwhal]

It's possible

[near folio]

also should kümmern sich um be generically translated to take care of?
Ja genau, oder to look after sth.

[bleak leaf]

hallo

[flint nimbus]

how flexible is the word schmecken? On wiktionary it seems only to be of the form "Das schmeckt.. (gut)", that is, noun tastes adjective. But I think i've seen the reverse as well: Ich schmecke den Reis gut? "i taste the rise good"?

[long whale]

I don't think you can have seen it, because it doesn't work. What you may have seen is "Ich schmecke den Reis ab" - "abschmecken" = to correct the seasoning, i.e. you try a little bit of a dish and then add more salt/sugar/spices/lemon - whatever. Does that help?

[flint nimbus]

it does help insofar as i'll just ignore the thing that didn't make sense 🙂

[undone verge]

perhaps you were thinking of 'mir schmeckt der Reis gut' ?

[long whale]

Ah - there is one other thing: Ich schmecke X [heraus] - I can taste X (my taste buds recognize X; X being some ingredient )

[long whale]

Typo: der

[undone verge]

I'll raise you 20 'typos' and an aneurism 😎

[flint nimbus]

maybe... so in "Peter schmecken die Tomaten gut", that's what's going on? Peter is dative?

[undone verge]

yes 🙂 and I believe it's die Tomaten

[flint nimbus]

wait

yes

my bad

ok let's see then, what are we doing then

so normally the one tasting, would be in nominative, right?

or not mentioned at all?

[undone verge]

hmmm...in this case though it is not the 'person' tasting, but rather the thing being eaten that 'has a taste'

[flint nimbus]

usually only the thing tasted is mentioned, like in "das Bier schmeckt sehr gut", there is no mention of to whom it tastes good

[undone verge]

but yes, that is right how you've described it

[flint nimbus]

so in "Peter schmeckt das Bier sehr gut", we're basically saying the same thing, except we're adding Peter as the one tasting

[undone verge]

no, Peter is not tasting

the beer has taste

das Bier schmeckt

[long whale]

Well - depends on what you're trying to say. Does it generally taste good? Can you recommend it? Or do you like it (mir)?

[flint nimbus]

oh right! but he's the receiver of the taste i suppose then

[undone verge]

yeah exactly

[long whale]

And again, Bier is singular -> verb form!

[flint nimbus]

oh right

there

this will only take nominative and dative then right

i've noticed it's quite common for dative verbs to also take an adjective

or be able to anyway

like in this case, it's possible to add "sehr gut", connecting it directly to the verb

[long whale]

-> adverbial use of adjective ;)

[flint nimbus]

so when there's dative and nominative like this, we always write the dative before the verb? or could we have written Das Bier schmeckt Peter gut?

[long whale]

Yup, fine.

[flint nimbus]

no general rule of thumb there, just the wild west?

oh no i know what you're gonna say!

put the thing first that you want to emphasize the most

[long whale]

The rule is the same as always: [conjugated part of the] verb in 2nd position in a main clause.

[flint nimbus]

well sure, the v2 is of course there, but sometimes there are guidelines or rules for which case comes before which

[long whale]

Yes, but almost anything can be in Pos. 1 (except for unstressed particles, and "es" in Akkusativ)

(At least, those are the exceptions I'm aware of)

[flint nimbus]

ok thanks ya'll!

[sullen sphinx]

Wir gehen tanzen. and Deine Freunde surfen gern.
Why are both of these valid sentences. I cant figure out the verb order

[long whale]

Where's the problem?

[sullen sphinx]

I don't understand which verb goes where

[long whale]

And it's in Pos. 2, as per usual.

[sullen sphinx]

How is gehen not a verb?

[long whale]

Oh, oops. 😄 Yes. You can use "gehen" in the sense of "... going to + verb". But only if you're actually going somewhere.

[sullen sphinx]

what about gern I dont understand why gern surfen is wrong

[verbal girder]

because the verb has to be in the 2nd position in a normal clause

[long whale]

"gern" is an adverb. If you put it before the verb, the verb won't be in Pos. 2 anymore.

[sullen sphinx]

hmm thought to like would be a verb

[long whale]

It will sound odd/awkward, but it's better if you think of "gern" as "gladly"...

[verbal girder]

with pleasure describes the circumstances on which something happens

[steel patrol]

I just heard a native speaker say in a podcast episode "...und btw, in 4 Jahren habt ihr zwei Kinder und sind glücklicher dann je."

Why "dann", not "als"? 😱

[long whale]

denn, not dann

[steel patrol]

Ohh, ok. But still, why that rather than "als"? 😄

[long whale]

Doesn't matter. 🤷 glücklicher als je zuvor = denn je zuvor

[steel patrol]

So with "zuvor" we need to use "als", and without it it's "denn"? Just checking I got it.

[long whale]

(I see DWDS has an example with "als je" (without "zuvor") which sounds/looks a little odd to me, but, oh, well...)

Last examples under 1. https://www.dwds.de/wb/je

@steel patrol

[steel patrol]

This one here? I may be a little lost, sorry.

[long whale]

It's right at the bottom now.

No, directly under 1 - you need to click on ... 7 weitere Beispiele

[steel patrol]

Alright, I see it now, thank you. Could you please though confirm if my summary/understanding of your previous message was right? (The one I've linked to here) - just to be super sure.
@long whale

[long whale]

No, apparently, I was mistaken: both work for both: als je [zuvor] = denn je [zuvor]

Duden says: es ging besser denn/als je [zuvor]

Note to self: must ALWAYS double check. sigh

@steel patrol

[steel patrol]

Nono, but if it sounds better/more natural to you with "zuvor" then that's what I'm really after (and I'll just keep what Duden says at the back of my mind as a possibility). @long whale

I know that this was more questions than normal, my apologies. Thank you very much though for the help as always!

[terse junco]

Hallo! This is not a language question - I'm a musician from Australia looking to move to Germany for a time, what cities should I check out for a strong local music scene?

Any help would be greatly appreciated but no dramas if I'm in the wrong place

[steel patrol]

It might be best for you to ask in #1033125270217048246 :)

[terse junco]

Thanks very much I'll copy it there

[flint nimbus]

what word form would you use on like a self-directed todo-list? Like "learn 100 german words, finish 4 Nicos Weg lessons"

i think in english i might just be using a kind of generalized imperative? So maybe 3rd person singular imperative for german?

[undone verge]

'100 deutsche Wörter lernen'

[long whale]

3rd person sg does not have an imperative. ;) Just use the infinitive - yes, see above.

[undone verge]

this is the german 'generalised imperative'

[flint nimbus]

oh i meant 2nd person, my bad, but yes, i'll use the "generalized imperative"!

cool!

just some common todo entries then:

start lesson 10
Unterricht 10 anfangen.
finish lesson 10
Unterricht 10 beenden
Do chapter 5
Kapitel 5 machen/tun
do these work?

[long whale]

🤔 "der Unterricht" = a lesson in class/with a teacher

beende is missing its ending

[flint nimbus]

thanks

[undone verge]

Lektion instead of Unterricht, beenden
Kapitel 5 machen, not tun

[flint nimbus]

what would like a Nicos Weg lesson be called then?

[long whale]

"do chapter X" - I'd use durcharbeiten, I think.

[long whale]

See the post by hallö above yours. ;)

[flint nimbus]

ah!

i missed it because Lektion is exactly the swedish word i think, so it just blended into the text as "word i already know"

this is great thanks ya'll! I'm sure i'll come back with some more similar questions, it's satisfying to let german take over a small part of one's life and actually used as it's practiced, rather than just practiced in a lesson

[odd dawn]

"Er ist mit der Antwort nicht ganz zufrieden, doch wenigstens wurde ihm geholfen und dafür zeigte er ihnen keinen Dank."

Hab ich das richtig geschrieben?

[autumn marsh]

it's hard to say if it's correct not knowing what you actually want to say, but it works grammatically yes

it's likely that "wenigstens" is not the word you want to use there, it's more likely that what you want to use is "immerhin" or "zumindest", but without knowing what you want to say it's hard to tell

[odd dawn]

"He is not satisfied with the answer, but at least he was helped and he didn't even thank them for that."

[autumn marsh]

it's the "doch" thats feels weird with "wenigstens", imo that works better with: "immerhin", while "wenigstens" would work using "aber" instead

[autumn marsh]

yea in that case use "aber" instead of "doch" imo

i can't say your version doesn't work but it sounds bad :>

(for me)

[odd dawn]

So aber + wenigstens, but doch + immerhin/zumindest. So it has to do with the way it sounds, not with the meaning itself. Is it something like formal versus informal?

[autumn marsh]

it seems to me that it's only a matter of my own preference here, nothing else

problem is, natives can use language intuitively but sometimes if you think to hard, too long, you confuse yourself :>

i'd say you can just leave it as it is

but i'd have written it with "immerhin2

[odd dawn]

Oh, got it! Thank you, @autumn marsh!

[long whale]

I feel everything works with everything else in this context: aber/doch wenigstens/immerhin/zumindest 🤷

[autumn marsh]

see, susana sees it differently, so just go with your version 👍

[odd dawn]

So it's preference. I see. I thank you two! 🙂

My question was actually about whether Dank zeigen works or not. German is interesting, but unpredictable. 🙂

[flint nimbus]

gonna re-ask the questions here instead for visibility and remove the original buried ones:
First, is Brei the most straight forward translation to porridge? I get Grütze as another option
Second, the verb googeln has 3 alternatives for the ich-form in wiktionary: google, googele, googel. Which one do you think is most common/will win out over time?

[gusty silo]

Brei is probably the best translation of porridge, it's atleast completely adequate (i don't know when the last time i've said Grütze even is)
i don't really get the thing with googeln, words can just have multiple variants in parallel?

the thing with -ele~el~le is that in native verbs with the iterative -eln, those alternate as well (due to the way phonology and grammar intersect there). i might wager a guess that retaining the first e in googeln could be more common then it is in some native verbs in -eln, because the -el there is part of the root of the word (the thing is not called Goog after all and in english -le is pronounced -el anyway), and not merely an ending

but that guess is based on precisely nothing 🤷

[brazen steppe]

Hallo, ich suche nach einem Sprachpartner B2+ C1, C2 oder Muttersprachler, um Gespräche zu führen.

[fervent kernel]

Viel vs viele is masculine and feminine right?

[charred harbor]

No

It's about countability

Uncountable nouns use "viel" and countable nouns use "viele" (that's the gist, anyway)

[fervent kernel]

danke!!

[charred harbor]

You can think of it like "much" vs "many" in English

[fervent kernel]

Do you know an example of how es gibt is used?

[charred harbor]

I can give you one, sure

"Es gibt einen Mann, der Deutsch spricht"

[flint nimbus]

more than good enough for me! I'll go with Brei and googele then

googele also fits the pattern of all of the other conjugations, so it really does make the most sense to me

[brazen steppe]

Hallo, ich suche nach einem Gesprächspartner

[long whale]

-> #1065443550004781067 ;)

[sleek pulsar]

Ich habe eine Frage über ein Songtext: warum ist der Lyric „Und deine Freundin die hat niemals für dich Zeit.” und nicht „sie hat niemals für dich Zeit”? Danke in Voraus

Das Lied ist „Schrei nach Liebe” von Die Ärzte

[verbal girder]

theres a comma after freundin and die here means "that"
actually idk thats supposed to be a relativsatz -> nebensatz which yours isnt

[whole portal]

Comma is missing, yes.

[verbal girder]

well then shouldnt the verb also be at the end?

[whole portal]

word order is unusual, yes, not sure if it's "wrong" tho tbh

[long whale]

There is definitely a comma missing, just like yoshi said. However, I'm not sure it is in fact a relative clause - because yes, the verb ought to be at the end...

[long whale]

No, feels right to me, but doesn't "feel" like a relative clause to me - or if it is, it must be a kind of special subset... 🤔

[whole portal]

Yeah

"Deine Freundin hat niemals für dich Zeit." looks fine to me tho so why not relative

[long whale]

rushing back from reading the wikipedia entry Because there is not a single example under Relativsatz which looks in the least like the above sentence...

[whole portal]

Idk it's a specification of the subject and then a sentence using it with a relative die, maybe there's a special name for it

[long whale]

@rugged hazel Please, could you have a look at the above conversation, from #questions-2 message - ?

[rugged hazel]

ok

Ah I think I know

Let's cut off the conjunction:

Deine Freundin, die hat niemals für dich Zeit.
What is "die"? It's a demonstrative pronoun ( Korrelat )
Deine Freundin hat niemals für dich Zeit.
This is a form of movement called Topicalization
It is not relative since the verb position is wrong. Relative would be:
Deine Freundin, die niemals Zeit für dich hat
@long whale @sleek pulsar

More specific; Linksversetzung
https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Topikalisierung?useskin=vector

[long whale]

Ah, thanks a lot!

[dreamy fern]

Since the verb position is wrong, is the sentence wrong ?

Or is wrong for a relative one

[rugged hazel]

The latter

[dreamy fern]

So it makes it not a relative proposition.

But what else ?

[long whale]

Please read up a little. ;)

[dreamy fern]

Oh maybe it's the thing you call topikalisierung

[rugged hazel]

👍

[dreamy fern]

I thought this one was for describing relatives

my bad

Thanks

[rugged hazel]

It's not a secondary clause or anything

[verbal girder]

so its written like this for purpose of rhythm?

[rugged hazel]

Most likely

But it also sounds nice

[rugged hazel]

In that context, a popular song that uses topicalization: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gLxtIGWd7A

[long whale]

... or https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sljXszZCcFs

[sleek pulsar]

Ok, thank you so much! So it's using topikalsierung for the rhythm of the song? That's really cool lol

[jade crane]

Laut Wörterbücher bedeutet zurückgeben "to give back", aber ist es nur wörtlich wie "to return" oder "to donate, to contribute" auch?

[proven sphinx]

"to donate" is usually "etwas spenden" and "to contribute" is "zu etwas beitragen".

[jade crane]

I see, so zurückgeben doesn't have the idiomatic meaning it has in English

I was asking because some phrasal verbs have similar meanings in english in german

Danke

[flint nimbus]

Ich bringe den Müll runter - i don't quite get why it's runter. Is the implication in this sentence that they live in an appartment so the person speaking is taking the trash down rather than out?

[proven sphinx]

That's pretty much it, yes.

Otherwise, it would be "Ich bringe den Müll raus".

[dreamy fern]

"Eines Tages werde ich Deutsch beherrschen." ist Genitiv immer verpflichtend hier ? Oder kann man vielleicht "Ein Tag werde ich Deutsch beherrschen" sagen ? bitte

[proven sphinx]

Nope, "eines Tages" is the only option since it's a set phrase.

[dreamy fern]

Aber: "Heute, werde ich Deutsch beherrschen" hat kein genitiv ?

Oder ist es ?

Danke

[proven sphinx]

Dieser Satz ergibt einfach nicht wirklich viel Sinn, aber in diesem Satz gibt es jedenfalls keinen Genitiv.

"Heute kann ich Deutsch" würde man eher sagen.

[fair violet]

"Morgen/In drei Tagen/Nächstes Jahr werde ich Deutsch beherrschen" would all be correct too

[teal heron]

hello can someone explain me how do you change the endings of adjectives with nouns?

[dreamy fern]

faq adjektiv declension

[stoic mauve]

FAQ not found. I found the following similar entries: N-Declension (1), Adjective Declension (2)
Select one of the values in the brackets to directly open the suggested FAQ.

Adjective Declension

A Brief Guide to Memorizing German Noun and Adjective Declension by Basementality
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1jWl5-kkqF3FQLDzrz8XLBJj7hvPFQK7MT5SYEDGK65E/edit

[dreamy fern]

Danke

[iron hound]

I thought it was "Der Professor(in)"

[whole portal]

Der Professor, die Professorin, I think the image to the left was part of the information

[iron hound]

Ohh. Weird, they don't always stick to the image for context in these questions. Thanks :)

[whole portal]

but tbh she looks more like a granny with a milk carton to me

[charred harbor]

I think it's supposed to be a book

[flint nimbus]

Schweizer Firmen produzieren...
is this genetive?

[whole portal]

No, Nominativ

Schweizer is an Adjektiv

[flint nimbus]

i don't understand how. Firmen is plural, right? How would it give -er to Schweizer if it's nominativ

[whole portal]

what would be the base form lol

[flint nimbus]

base form of what? Firma?

[whole portal]

Schweizer

Der Schweizer Mann gibt der Schweizer Frau den Schweizer Käse der Schweizer Firma.

[long whale]

Adjectives for place names ending in -er do not change/inflect - now, isn't that nice?

[flint nimbus]

i thought Schweizer would be translated to "swiss", was that mistaken then?

[long whale]

No, no, that's correct. Why not?

[flint nimbus]

i think i'm thinking of "schweizerisch"

Schweizer is a noun?

[long whale]

No, they're both adjectives, except der/die/das Schweizer can be used as a nominalized adjective. Adjectives for places ending in -isch decline as per usual, it's just those adjectives for place names ending in -er which remain the same.

[flint nimbus]

when would one use one or the other?

[long whale]

Best look them up in a dictionary, I'd say. 🤔

The -er ones don't usually work with places ending in -land, or -reich, or -ien (der Italiener = an Italian (man), otherwise it's -isch: italienischer Wein). I think the likelihood of having an -er adjective is higher with 1- or 2-syllable places (Tiroler Speck; Frankfurter Würstchen; Berliner Pfannkuchen), but that's by no means a rule (japaner Reiswein).

[sullen sphinx]

When out in a new area, do you ask for the toilet or bathroom? Every question i'm seeing is asking for toilet, just want to know whats more common

[long whale]

Mildly amusing anecdote: a woman from the US, being a guest in a private German home, asked "Where is the bathroom?", was shown to the bathroom by the slightly surprised host, then came out again horrified, saying "There is no bathroom in your bathroom!" ;) - Does that answer your question?

[rugged hazel]

The derivation with -er which is an adjective in nominativ and is used when nominalized as the term for people from that location (not always), like Susana said, is used mostly in names: Schweizer Käse, Schweizer Taschenmesser - That is why it is capitalized - It's part of a name. The derivation with -isch, "schweizerisch", does the same but I have never seen it as part of a name. If it were, it would be written capitalized too, of course. If you want to add the property of "being swiss" to a noun, you could always add "schweizerisch" to it.
One could argue that the second form emphasizes the cultural properties of the word in an especially highlighted way: "kielersche Woche" sounds like the values from the people of Kiel, their history and whatnot contribute to the "kielersche Woche". "Kieler Woche" can be taken as just happening in Kiel geographically. But they could also mean the exact same.

Kieler Woche, Kieler Innenstadt, Kieler Jahrmarkt
kielersche Woche, kielersche Innenstadt, kielerscher Jahrmarkt
I know an example where it's a bit misleading:
Steinbrücker Teich
and not
?steinbrückerischer Teich
Since the name is derived from a stone bridge in the area and "Steinbrücken" is a couple hours away, and, secondly, a lake is not something that has properties of your culture, it is nature. So it works best for things made by humans, like events and products.

[flint nimbus]

so overlapping use, but rough guidelines -er = literally from that place, like a greek person or company or something, -isch = in the style of that place, like a greek salad in a swedish restaurant?

[rugged hazel]

You put it into words well 👍

[long whale]

Right idea, wrong example:

der Grieche, die Griechen, die Griechin, die Griechinnen (people only), vs. ein griechisches Gericht; Griechischer Salat. ;)

[flint nimbus]

right you're saying because in this particular case the corresponding nominalized greek word wouldn't end in -er, and since Salat is masculine, Griechisch will take -er ending if declined strongly

[long whale]

Correct, because g/Griecher isn't a word. ;)

[rugged hazel]

Yes sorry

[long whale]

(As I said above - a dictionary is usually best. 🤷)

[flint nimbus]

i would never ever ask here before having looked at a dictionary and not getting it

if i did i would maybe ask like 50 questions per day lol

[rugged hazel]

Die Ableitungen sind aber so unregelmäßig, dass es am besten ist, diese Formen nachzuschlagen oder auswendig zu lernen.
Ah well

[long whale]

No, no, I just meant: in general, as far as those -er/-isch adjectives for places are concerned. :)

[flint nimbus]

now that i know there is a difference and have a rough idea of what that is and the implications grammar-wise, it will be much easier to continue to study it. I don't need to have learned it perfectly 🙂

[fervent kernel]

Leute, was ist der Unterschied zwischen "sich erholen" und "sich ausruhen" ?

Und "faulenzen"

[wide crater]

Sich ausruhen = to relax
Sich erholen = to recover

@fervent kernel

[fervent kernel]

Danke 🙏

[karmic remnant]

Zu faulenzen..to be lazy..lol

[sullen sphinx]

Why is noch here

[whole portal]

also/on top/lastly

[rugged hazel]

Their interaction was probably close to ending, and she adds, before leaving, one more thing: "Lastly, let me give you my phone number".
The following sentence can be interpreted in two ways:

Wir sollten noch einen Termin vereinbaren.

1. Is "We should make another appointment"
2. Is "We should make an appointment" in the sense of above - "Ah, we have done everything - Let us lastly quickly make an appointment, before we forget it, okay?"
   According to Wiktionary, 1) boils down to "einen Weiteren" (an additional) and 2) boils down to "zukünftig" (in the future), but that's a bit misleading because it can only really be used in that context, in my opinion at least, so I gave the example
   @whole portal What do you think?

[whole portal]

uh

I mean in the example above I definitely think she meant it as lastly

[rugged hazel]

Yes I know, just wanted to know if you disagree with my stuff

[whole portal]

yeah no that's all right

[rugged hazel]

Ok good

[long whale]

zukünftig = lastly - ? 🤔 (Or did I misunderstand sth?)

[rugged hazel]

Yep, no meaning on wiktionary came closer in my view

That's why I added the examples etc

[wide crater]

wat?

zuletzt = lastly ?

[long whale]

That's why I was wondering. :)

[fervent kernel]

Are these correct translations of the English phrases?
"all over the place" - "in alle Richtingen"
"all over again" - "noch einmal ganz von vorne"

[long whale]

2nd one is fine. 1st one... I'd need some context.

[fervent kernel]

For the first one, there's no general translation then. For example: "The toys are all over the place"

"Das Spielzeug ist überall" should work, but what if I wanna make it more drastic 😄

[long whale]

Überall liegt Spielzeug herum is what you're looking for, I think. ;)

"in alle Richtungen" is 100% wrong because it would need a directional movement verb (since it's Akkusativ), and that's in fact the way we'd use it. ;)

[fervent kernel]

May I also ask when I can use these phrases? 🤔 I just wonder

DeepL gave me 4 different phrases

I thought, maybe the 3rd one would fit for my toy example

"in allen Ecken und Enden"

[long whale]

IMO, it ought to be "an allen Ecken und Enden" 🤔 Please also see the msg I posted above your screenshot.

[worthy lily]

Hello! When referring to inanimate objects with pronouns, does the gender "transfer" between clauses such that you would still use 'er' or 'sie' even if the object is not named within that particular clause?

[long whale]

Yes.

[worthy lily]

ex: "He has the computer. It is his." -> "Den Computer hat er. Er ist sein"?

alright, thanks!

[long whale]

Right idea, wrong example: Er gehört ihm (jdm gehören = to belong to so, to be so's possession)

[worthy lily]

mm, gotcha. would "Er ist sein Computer" work to show possession?

[long whale]

Unfortunately not. You'd use "es" in this case, "Es ist sein Computer" - don't overthink it, it's rather like the "it" in "It's funny. When you..."

There are demonstrative possessives, like "mine, yours, etc.", but they decline differently: Es ist seiner. (It's his.)

If you refer to the computer directly, as in "Tom hat einen neuen Computer gekauft. Er war sehr teuer." (Tom's bought a new computer. It was very expensive), you do need to use the correct pronoun.

(Maybe a better example for the it/es in "Es ist seiner", resp. "Es ist sein Computer" would be sth like "Who's at the door?" - "It's (She's) my aunt"?)

[worthy lily]

interesting, I think I've got the general idea. thanks again!

[fervent kernel]

How can someone say "don't mind me" in a situation where someone means "ignore them"?

[long whale]

I don't quite get it, I'm afraid.

[fervent kernel]

"don't mind me" means like "ignore me" or "don't think about what I've said/what I've done" etc.

the verb "mind" is the key actually

There's also a phrase like "do you mind if I sit here" for example

[long whale]

Mm. They wouldn't be translated the same way. For the 2nd, you'd probably just say "Darf ich [mich hier hinsetzen]?" (= May I [sit here]?) For other things like "Do you mind if I open/close the window?" for example, you could say "Stört es Sie/dich, wenn ich...?" or "Macht es Ihnen/dir [et]was aus, wenn ich...?"

[fervent kernel]

Then for the first example, I probably need to use "ignorieren"

[long whale]

The 1st... I'd probably say sth like "Entschuldige, vergiss es [bitte]" or "Bitte vergiss, was ich gesagt habe"

[fervent kernel]

I actually wrote the verb "vergessen" also as "nevermind". does it work like that also?

nevermind = vergiss es

[long whale]

Depending on context, yes.

[fervent kernel]

Vielen Dank

Someone gotta give you a special role on this server 😄

You're really helping people here

[fervent kernel]

How can you say "I am just browsing" in a store as an answer to a worker asking if you need help?

[plain umbra]

With the verb sich umschauen.

Ich möchte mich umschauen. And similar sentences.

[fervent kernel]

Danke

[plain umbra]

No problem. Actually I'm not sure if umsehen is more common so feel free to double check with a native speaker.

[fervent kernel]

I was gonna ask that

because "umschauen" sounds like "watch around"

[plain umbra]

It has the same meaning. It's just that verbs based on schauen tend to be viewed more regionally compared to verbs based on sehen, which are typically considered the most standard variation.

But I feel like I've seen umschauen used more in this context so it's good to get some insight in case there's a regional difference.

[void grove]

im a native speaker i would say it the same way "ich gucke mich nur um" -> "im just looking around"

[rugged hazel]

I would prefer umschauen

[plain umbra]

Umgucken is definitely regional/colloquial. Although of course it's still useful to know about it.

[void grove]

hmm tru sry mb

[plain umbra]

All good, still a useful comment.

[sleek pulsar]

was ist die Unterschied zwischen "wir sind kalt" und "uns ist kalt"?

[plain umbra]

So basically, in German, they express "I feel cold" (and some similar feelings) in a different way than in English. When you say something is cold in German, you're saying the temperature of that thing is low. So like, you would say "Eis ist kalt" (ice is cold). But you don't say that for a person if a person feels cold because that's a different meaning. You instead say "[dative pronoun] ist kalt". Like "mir ist kalt" or "uns ist kalt". And that means "It feels cold to me/us".

[sleek pulsar]

ahh ok

thats really interesting

[charred harbor]

“Wir sind kalt” generally sounds like you’re calling the group cold-hearted imo

[sleek pulsar]

danke sehr

oh ok

kinda like saying „ich bin gut” means you're a good person?

[plain umbra]

Ja.

[sleek pulsar]

ach so

[plain umbra]

Another good example is langweilig. Langweilig means "boring", so:

Ich bin langweilig. = I am boring.
Mir ist langweilig. = It's boring to me. (or better translation: I'm bored.)

[west pond]

why is "als du" at the end of the sentence not "sind", isn't that a Nebensatz?

DeepL

[plain umbra]

It's a special word order rule, that als/wie comparisons can go at the end even after the verbs.

[west pond]

"can" go at the end? so it's correct to say "die schlimmer als du sind" or is it only the other way

[plain umbra]

I think both are correct, yeah.

[charred harbor]

Mir ist immer heiß -> I live in a desert
Ich bin immer heiß -> I’m a narcissist

[void grove]

xDDD good one

[void grove]

but | ich bin immer heiß -> im always horny

in a lewd way

[charred harbor]

Generally, ye

[fervent kernel]

I've just realised that you used a reflexive pronoun there. I was wondering if it is necessary?

[plain umbra]

As far as I know, yes.

[frigid aurora]

Hallo Leute kannt ihr mir erklären die Grammatik von die Satz ' Das weiß ich eben nicht. Und deshalb auch der Auftrag an Sie'

Und vielleicht ein Beispiel zu geben ?

[long whale]

What exactly would you like to know? Why there is no verb in the 2nd sentence?

[frigid aurora]

Ummm maybe...

But i wanna know the meaning the usage there

[fervent kernel]

Ein Buch kann genauso spannend wie ein Videospiel sein, aber für das Lesen ist ein bisschen Mühe erforderlich. Zu diesem winzigen Unterschied gehört meines Erachtens die Verarmung dessen, was wir täglich konsumieren.
Sounds it weird or should I leave it as it is? (sorry my English isn't good enough)

[long whale]

I don't have the slightest idea what you're trying to say, I'm afraid. 🤷

(Grammar-wise, the sentence is fine. The problem is: it doesn't really mean anything.)

[fervent kernel]

I have already edited it

"To this tiny difference belongs the impoverishment of what we consume daily."

[rugged hazel]

als -> wie

[long whale]

🤔 Don't you mean sth like "this tiny difference is the cause of...?"

[rugged hazel]

Maybe "Verschlechterung" instead of "Verarmung"?

[fervent kernel]

"die Ursache für die Qualitätsverschlechterung unseres Konsums-Verhalten ist die Vermeidung von Anstrengung." works better hier, doesn't it?

[rugged hazel]

I would suggest Konsum-Verhalten instead of Konsum

[long whale]

I'd have chosen "etwas (Akk) auf etwas (Akk) zurückführen", i.e. Auf diesen winzigen Unterschied ist ... zurückzuführen

[long whale]

Why the hyphen? ;)

[rugged hazel]

More readable

[fervent kernel]

funny, I wanted to use exactly that verb but I couldn't remember the exact letters and the Präposition

So I tried to re-formulate it

Thank you @rugged hazel @long whale

[winter fulcrum]

i cant find any model test for b1 in the goethe exam onlz telc, where can i find for goethe_

[thorn pelican]

on the goethe website

[winter fulcrum]

There is only one modeltest

And i keep hearing there is 7 model tests

And I cant find them

[fervent kernel]

Könten sie ein Sätze mit "Bahnsteigen "bilden.

[delicate tiger]

Ich muss schnell in die Bahn steigen, die fährt gleich los.

[fervent kernel]

Bahn und steigen

[fervent kernel]

Bahnsteigen

[delicate tiger]

"Die Schienen sind zwischen den Bahnsteigen"

[fervent kernel]

Danke Schön

Könten sie ein Sätze mit "darüben" bilden.

[proven sphinx]

"darüben" gibt es leider nicht...

Meintest du "darüber" oder "drüben"?

[delicate tiger]

Da Rüben so lecker sind, esse ich sie jeden Tag

[proven sphinx]

Es ist also "drüben".

"Siehst du das Haus dort drüben?" = Do you see the house over there?

That's how it's used.

Almost always in conjunction with "dort" or "da".

"da/dort drüben" simply means "over there".

[fervent kernel]

Ok

Danke schön

[fervent kernel]

Könten sie bitte ein Sätze mit "Ausfallen" bilden ?

[fervent kernel]

Is there any difference between these sentences?
"dieses Geld sollte alle Kosten decken"
"dieses Geld sollte alle Kosten abdecken"

[rugged hazel]

I've read a couple of forum posts and Duden entries on this and I conclude that there can't be any notable difference. "Decken" and "Abdecken" both have use in finanicial context and basically boil down to almost the same thing. "Decken" is however used for all usage that is concerned with expenses and revenue, or debt that has to be paid back, while "abdecken" is more fitting for context of "having enough money at hand for the trip to Germany".

[fervent kernel]

Vielen Dank

[delicate tiger]

"Der nächste Zug fällt aus"

[flint nimbus]

is there some "rule" for guessing whether a verb with end with -t or -en (or else) in it's past participle form (perfect)?

[proven sphinx]

I think almost all verbs that have a past participle that ends in -en are already irregular, like "sehen", "lesen", "essen" etc.

[flint nimbus]

oh really, i actually thought that was the regular form

so the regular form is ge + third person singular?

[proven sphinx]

Nah, -t is the regular form, like in "gemacht" for "machen", which is as regular as you're going to get.

Like, I can't think of a single verb where the past participle ends in -en, but everything else is regular.

[flint nimbus]

schlafen

oh it has the ä

[proven sphinx]

Nope, it's irregular. "Ich schlief" instead of "ich schlafte".

Yep, and also "er schläft" in the present tense, as you mentioned.

[rugged hazel]

Bei schwachen Verben hat das Partizip II die Endung -(e)t
Bei starken Verben hat das Partizip II die Endung -en.
Dudenband 4 page 440

[proven sphinx]

Ohhhh, there's "backen", which is mostly regular these days, but it used to be more irregular. The past participle is still "gebacken", though.

[rugged hazel]

As in "Bug"?

[flint nimbus]

the last piece of irregularity still holding out 🫡

[proven sphinx]

Alter, man schreibt das als "buk". 😂

[rugged hazel]

Ah, ok

[proven sphinx]

Ein Bug ist ein Computerbug.

[delicate tiger]

(ein Teil vom Schiff)

[proven sphinx]

Even then, I'd say "er bäckt" is far more common than "er backt", so it's still irregular in some ways.

[proven sphinx]

Ja, das auch.

[rugged hazel]

I would say the opposite, "er backt" sounds more natural. Maybe someone made a statistic for that, I will look

[proven sphinx]

I wouldn't be surprised if there are regional differences here as well.

Seems like you're right.

It's something very recent, though.

[rugged hazel]

There is a website that has a Germany-map

I can't find it

[proven sphinx]

It may indeed be regional, though. I checked what the NZZ (a prestigious Swiss newspaper) wrote, and "er bäckt" occurs 166 times compared to "er backt" occurring only once.

[rugged hazel]

That's why I'm interested in the Germany map

(and other German-speaking countries of course)

[proven sphinx]

Wait, Google is trolling me again...

It's just the same sentence over and over again. LOL.

Yeah, I'd have to check an actual corpus for that, probably.

[delicate tiger]

nächste Runde bei Alas Alltagssprache? ^^

[rugged hazel]

Thank you!

That was the website I searched

I forgot the name.

They haven't ever asked about it sadly :/

[proven sphinx]

Well, I tried to search on all Swiss websites, and "backt" is indeed more common than "bäckt" even there, though only by a factor of 3-to-1.

With sites with a .de domain, the difference is even more pronounced, though. It's more of a factor of 6-to-1 there for "backt".

In any case, "bäckt" is not wrong, but "backt" is indeed more common overall.

This seems to line up with the results from Google Ngram as well.

[charred harbor]

I doubt anyone’d care either way tbh

Whether you said backt or bäckt

[fervent kernel]

Can I use the word "Werkzeug" as tools on computer programs? So, basically, this is like an abstract thing, not something you can hold

For example: "There is a tool on this computer program to do this"

[errant ivy]

so a virtual tool in a program? i think u could use "Werkzeug" yes but i think "Funktion" would fit better in this case for example that would be "Es gibt eine Funktion dafür" -> "There is a feature/tool for that"

or in ur case "Es gibt eine Funktion in diesem Programm dafür" -> "There is a tool on this computer program to do this"

[fervent kernel]

"Funktion" kind of works, but tools also can be downloaded. They can be added later. So, you wouldn't say "There is a feature you can download" but "There is a tool you can download"

and I was wondering if there's a special word for that in German. Normally, yes, "Werkzeug" means "tool"

and I guess, there isn't

[errant ivy]

i dont think so no

we just use tool aswell sometimes

so i guess it works

[rugged hazel]

You might also be interested that German interfaces often use "Extras" for "Tools" - For example VisualStudio.

[fervent kernel]

Interesting 🤔 I've been using VS in English for years. Doesn't it create conflicts with the other real "Extras" menu?

Or are they called differently?

[rugged hazel]

Maybe I am confusing it then. I was pretty sure multiple software I used in the past called tools extras. It could be that I remembered it wrong, nevermind.

No, I was right. They call it that.

Maybe they shuffled it - Could it be that "Extras" is a submenu of "Tools" in the English version? Then they just switched it.

[fervent kernel]

I can't remember now actually. I've been busy with German. I stopped coding for months 😄

I also have a question. I was looking for the translation of "in the first place", which means like "initially". For example:
"Why didn't you tell me in the first place?", which means a person didn't tell something before something happens. DeepL gives me the translation of "gleich" for that, but I'm not quite sure. It sounds weird to me

I put another example sentence and now it gives me "von vornherein".
"I could've done it in the first place"

[long whale]

Yes, "gleich" would have been my 1st choice. "von vornherein" works, too, but is probably far less common.

(certainly in speaking)

[fervent kernel]

Does it even work for the 2nd sentence?
"Du konntest das gleich tun"

[long whale]

du konntest = you were able to vs. du hättest das (gleich) tun können = you could have done that (but didn't!)

-> yes, it works.

[fervent kernel]

I was confused between using "konntest" or "könntest", but do I really need "hättest" there? Only "könntest" gives the same meaning, right?

[long whale]

Oh yes, you need it! du könntest das tun = you could do that (now/in the future)

[fervent kernel]

Danke

[flint nimbus]

Das ist die Frau. Sie hat Harry angerufen. Das ist die Frau, die Harry angerufen hat.
In the examples they give they consistently give sie in the first coupling, and die in the second. Why? I thought they were supposed to be equal in these kinds of uses

or is this a special use of das/die/der for connecting the two clauses?

this is the most confused i've been at a german grammar point in a long time lol

[long whale]

In written German, using "sie" for a woman/feminine noun is still very much prevalent. In the 2nd sentence, the 1st is exactly like in English (This is the woman), while in the 2nd instance, it must be "die", since only "der, die das" (and their declined forms) work as relative pronouns for specific nouns. Does that help?

[flint nimbus]

i'll finish the lesson and see if it's explained more there first and then return

[charred harbor]

It’s like how we use who/that in English

The girl who likes me
The computer that is broken

[flint nimbus]

oh ok

[long whale]

(And those are called "relative pronouns" in English, Relativpronomen in German - with the added joy of declination in German, of course. ;) )

[charred harbor]

German is less lax than English is in that where we should be saying “whom”, we often say “who”- you can’t do that in German

[flint nimbus]

you say that as a joke but declinations are cool af

[charred harbor]

Der Mann, den ich liebe
Der Mann, der mich liebt
Basically whom & who

[flint nimbus]

right the declinations part is not the difficulty, but i'll continue on a bit now, i think what's already been said has been helpful

the many uses of das/der/die is unexpected difficulty that no one talks about though 😄 i like it, it's like how zu keeps popping up everywhere

just quickly, obviously these can be in dative as well, right? the lesson only mentions nominative and accusative, but i assume that is to make things easier

[long whale]

Yup.

[charred harbor]

This is such a good comparison

[flint nimbus]

i also dearly appreciate that a lot of the most odd and idiomatic vocabulary constructions are idiomatic in exactly the same way in swedish so that it's just a literal translation, but that's another topic 😄

[rotund gate]

What is difference in usage between

in Nahe von
in der Umgebung von

[long whale]

in Nahe von doesn't exist. "in der Nähe von X" = not far from X vs. "in der Umgebung von X" = in the surroundings/in the area around X

[rotund gate]

ist it interchangable?

[long whale]

Not always, no. Very similar to English, I feel: "in der Umgebung" is mostly used when talking about geographical places. Your friend lives close by (in der Nähe), not in your "surroundings" (Umgebung), right?

@rotund gate

[rotund gate]

isn't it the same?

in that context

i feel like umgebung is higher level german than nahe

[ripe dust]

Ich rede über den Menschen damit ( mit dir ). Did I use Präpositionalpronomen correctly in this sentence?

[undone verge]

doesn't seem right, what would you like to say?

maybe: ich rede darüber mit dir (?)

[long whale]

No, you can't use Präpositionalpronomen for people. Ich spreche mit meinem Bruder -> Ich spreche mit ihm. ;)

[flint nimbus]

Ich komme erst um...
is this like "i'm not coming until..."?

[long whale]

That's how you'd translate it, yes. Literally, it's more like "I'll only be arriving/coming at..."

[flint nimbus]

are ab and von interchangeable when it comes to time?

[long whale]

No - at least not always.

[fervent kernel]

is hier pronounced the same as in english?

[proven sphinx]

Pretty much, especially if you say it with a British accent.

[plain umbra]

Definitely not American. 😄

[charred harbor]

Probably closer to Australian than British I think 🤔

I might be wrong

[proven sphinx]

Yeah, I think you're on to something there.

[urban oxide]

Die Filmpremiere ist ein großes Fest, zu ___ viele prominente Leute kommen

Welches passt hier?
"dem" (für Fest) oder "der" (für Filmpremiere)

[undone verge]

that is a good question 😄 I would personally go with 'dem' since Fest is closer to the relative clause

[urban oxide]

I see

but "der" isn't completely wrong either, is it?

[undone verge]

I don't know if there is a technical rule on this or not. My gut tells me both are possible but 'dem' is more normal

[plain umbra]

Typically the relative clause will be as close to the noun it refers to as possible, so even in a sentence without the verb being sein, if you make a relative clause referring to the subject and then put it at the end like this, it will sound weird.

@undone verge in case you want to comment on that as well.

Like you would say "Der Mann, den ich kenne, isst Pizza." rather than "Der Mann isst Pizza, den ich kenne."

So in this case you could have "Die Filmpremiere, zu der viele prominente Leute kommen, ist ein großes Fest."

It would have a slightly different meaning, but hopefully you get what I'm saying.

[urban oxide]

ohhh

that makes sense

thank you!

[fervent kernel]

I'm about to complete my flashcard set (finally 😄 ) and there's a few things left that I wanna ask. I'd be appreciated if you guys could help me

1. Is it possible to give short answers in German like in English? For example:
   "Do you like chocolate?" - "(Yes) I do"
   "Magst du Schokolade?" - "Ja mag ich / Ich mag"

"Did you finish the task?" - "(Yes) I did"
"Hast du die Aufgabe erledigt?" - "(Ja) habe ich / Ich habe"

2. I'm looking for the translations of "to supervise" and "supervisor", but couldn't find any result that satisfies me 😄 This words can be used for both work places or parenting. "Supervising the workers / The supervisor (boss maybe)" and "Supervising the kids (parenting) / The supervisors (mother and father)"

3. How can you say "life happens/happened" in German, meaning something that is not in your control happened. What's the corresponding idiom in German?

4. How can you translate this sentence? "You can call me John". Calling something is translated as "nennen" in German, but in this case, it makes no sense. The translation would be like "You can name as John"

5. Translation of "ban someone from a server". The best I could find was "ausschließen", which means "lock out", but I'm not sure.

6. I'm looking for the translation of "though" for months, but couldn't find any. This word's meaning changes depending on the context. So, here's the example:
   "This machine looks good. Though I have to test it."

7. This one confused me a bit. How can you say "swipe finger (on screen)" and "swipe card" in German?

8. This is one of the "I can't tell which one is which" scenario. I'm looking for the translation of "distribute" and "distribution" and I ended up with the word "vertreiben", which means both "distribute" and "drive away"?

9. Can the word "Grundstein" be used "milestones", which means like steps to achieve something?

10. This is a difficult one. What's the translation of "framing someone", which means making a person guilty with false info

[ripe dust]

i realised my mistake. For example, I want to say this sentence:

[charred pumice]

6. you could use 'aber' here I believe, not sure if there's a word for 'though'

[ripe dust]

Ich glaube, dass am Sonntag mit meiner Familie ins Kino gehen. Ich habe darüber mit meiner Frau gesprochen.

[snow relic]

Here are the ones I can answer:

1. Yes
2. I don't know, but you can plug it into deepL to get an accurate translation
3. "Es ist halt so."
4. "Du darfst mich John nennen." (I'd use may instead of can here)
5. Jemand von einem Server bannen (not sure if this is 100% accurate but it should work)
6. For your example you'd use although, which is obwohl. This creates a Nebensatz so be careful
7. DeepL says distribute is "verteilen," idk where you're getting your definition from
8. Use Meilenstein

[fervent kernel]

for 6, obwohl doesn't work becuase it means like "even though", which sounds a bit weird
for 8, I don't just use DeepL, I also check the meanings on verbformen and pons because sometimes DeepL starts to give different results or outdated results

[snow relic]

You could use aber in that case

[rugged hazel]

1 is interesting, because

Magst du Schokolade? - Mag ich.
Sounds unnatural. You would at least keep the answer particle.

Ich mag.
Would however never be used, but
Ja, ich mag Schokolade.
would.

[fervent kernel]

@rugged hazel could you help me on 2, 7, 8 and 10?

[rugged hazel]

For 10, the DeepL translation seems fine: Jemandem etwas anhängen.

Framing as a technical term is just loaned(?) by German.

For 7, you use "wischen" for your phone, and "durchziehen" or "stecken" (depending on the device) for your card.
The device you swipe your card through is called Durchzugleser: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Durchzugleser?useskin=vector

Most of the time, you would use (ein)stecken.

[fervent kernel]

Danke 👍

[rugged hazel]

Wait for Raven's correction, I might have messed something up.

[proven sphinx]

Another thing that should be mentioned about "swiping a card" is that credit/debit cards aren't really swiped in Europe. You either plug it in as seen in the picture above, or these days you can just pay contactlessly by just putting the card relatively close to the card reader.

More of a cultural thing than a language thing, but still.

[rugged hazel]

They have been replaced.

[fervent kernel]

Which verb is used for this then?

[proven sphinx]

You just say "mit Karte bezahlen".

[proven sphinx]

Gab es früher auch in Europa "Durchzugleser"? Ich bin wohl nicht alt genug, um mich daran erinnern zu können. 😅

[rugged hazel]

Die gibt es immer noch an Zigarettenautomaten, beispielsweise.

[proven sphinx]

For 8) as well, "to distribute" is usually translated as "verteilen". "distribution" in the case of distribution of goods is "Warenverkehr".

[proven sphinx]

Ich bin kein Raucher, also würde ich das wohl eh nicht wissen.

[rugged hazel]

Für die Identifikation genutzt.

[proven sphinx]

Hmm, interessant. Keine Ahnung, ob das in der Schweiz auch der Fall ist, da ich wie gesagt nicht rauche. 😅

Gibt es hier überhaupt Zigarettenautomaten? Wahrscheinlich schon...

[rugged hazel]

Muss man kein Raucher für sein

[proven sphinx]

Wenn es diese Automaten überhaupt in der Schweiz gibt, dann sind sie wohl sicher viel seltener als in Deutschland.

Vielleicht ist es hier nicht einmal legal, Zigaretten in einem Automaten zu verkaufen. Müsste ich mal nachschauen.

https://www.aargauerzeitung.ch/schweiz/kanton-pruft-ob-zigaretten-automaten-die-gesetzlichen-vorgaben-erfullen-ld.1989538

Okay, die gibt es offenbar tatsächlich...

[rugged hazel]

@fervent kernel Yes, a Vertrieb is something like a distributor. See meaning 2 on Wiktionary https://de.wiktionary.org/wiki/vertreiben?useskin=vector

[proven sphinx]

Hier habe ich etwas dazu gefunden, wenn es dich überhaupt interessiert. 😅

[rugged hazel]

Interessant. Könnte man in Deutschland auch mal abschrauben die Teile.

[fervent kernel]

Maybe, verteilen means like distrubition of numbers/colors etc. while vertreiben is more like distrubition of a product?

[proven sphinx]

Pretty much.

[long whale]

vertreiben has the "selling/for money" component which "verteilen" lacks.

-> typically, there will be no money involved with "verteilen"

[fervent kernel]

But then it can still mean "distribute" for companies?

I was just checking my old notes and about modal verbs I have a few things to ask. I'm not sure if these sentences are correct.

1. müssen
   "You must have seen the reports" - "Du hättest die Berichte sehen müssen"
   "It must have been someone else" - "Es muss jemand anderes gewesen sein"

2. können
   "You could have seen the reports" - "Du hättest die Berichte sehen können"
   "It could have been someone else" "Es könnte jemand anderes gewesen sein"

3. sollen
   "You should have seen the reports" - "Du hättest die Berichte sehen sollen"
   "It should have been someone else" - "Es sollte jemand anderes gewesen sein"

[proven sphinx]

"You must have seen the reports" does not actually translate to "Du hättest die Berichte sehen müssen". 😅

It would rather be "Du hast die Berichte wohl gesehen".

[fervent kernel]

I was just checking DeepL and "haben" and "müssen" is the other way around 😄 Is that correct? If so, what's the meaning of the original?

[proven sphinx]

"wohl" being a modal particle, which I talked about in #questions just now.

[proven sphinx]

"Du hättest die Berichte sehen müssen" means "You should have seen the reports", which is not the same as "must have seen" here.

[fervent kernel]

DeepL also says "du musst die Berichte sehen haben". What does that mean?

[long whale]

Free samples, copies, brochures - sure. Tasks.

[long whale]

It is meaningless. 🤷

[fervent kernel]

I meant "vertreiben". For example: "Das Unternehmen hat die neuen Produkten vertrieben"

[fervent kernel]

DeepL being DeepL again 🙂

[long whale]

die neuen Produkte - yes. But not "verteilt", unless they were handing them out for free - or shared them out among different branches, for example.

[fervent kernel]

Oh okay, now I understand it clearly

Danke 🙂

[proven sphinx]

That's not correct...

[fervent kernel]

Sorry, it says "Sie müssen die Berichte gesehen haben"

[proven sphinx]

Yeah, that makes more sense.

[fervent kernel]

which means the same? "must have"

[proven sphinx]

That does basically mean "You must have seen the reports", yes.

[fervent kernel]

So, I should swap modal verbs and "haben" in the 1st sentences

Then all are correct?

[proven sphinx]

Yep.

[fervent kernel]

Danke

@proven sphinx oh and they should be in Konjunktiv II versions right?

"You could have seen" - "Du könntest ... gesehen haben"

[eternal elk]

Question to the native people. If somebody is speaking in German with you and his speech is really easily understandable, but he has a little bit of an accent, do you consider this as a problem? Him having an accent

[verbal girder]

culture-study-----

visa!

[fervent kernel]

It varies from verb to verb according to DeepL 🤔
"Must have been" with Präsens form "du musst"
"Could have been" with Konjunktiv II form "du könntest"
"Should have been" with Konjunktiv II form "du solltest"

[proven sphinx]

We are used to hearing people speak German with a non-native accent due to the large number of immigrants in German-speaking countries. So no, it should be no problem at all.

[fervent kernel]

@proven sphinx sorry for tagging, but this really got me. Is there a specific reason why "müssen" is used with its present form while the others with Konjunktiv II forms?

Also, there's another modal verb that English has but German doesn't, "might". However, I guess, translation of it is "können" in Konjunktiv II. So, I was just wondering if this logic is correct.

"It could have been" - "Es kann ... gewesen sein"
"It might have been" - "Es könnte ... gewesen sein"

Or maybe it doesn't ever matter because could've and might've mean the same

[proven sphinx]

"müssen" also has a Konjunktiv II form, which would be "müsste".

"Er muss das gewusst haben." = He had to have known that.
"Er müsste das gewusst haben" = Almost the same, but you're less certain.

[fervent kernel]

Oh okay. DeepL of course couldn't understand the difference from the sentence because English language lacks of it

Vielen Dank

[proven sphinx]

Actually, DeepL translates these sentences differently.

It translates the former as "He must have known that" and the latter as "He should have known that".

[fervent kernel]

The only example that I can think of and fits for "müsste" is that "I must have missed something", which means you're not quite sure, but something is wrong. So, you're guessing that there must be something missing

[proven sphinx]

To be fair, "müsste" is almost always just used when referring to something in the future, meaning you should do something.

"Ich müsste das mal nachschauen" = I would need to look that up.

[fervent kernel]

I understand it better now

Danke

[proven sphinx]

Or "Er müsste das schon mal gemacht haben" for "He must have already done it".

[fervent kernel]

how to say ‘i love this very much’

[proven sphinx]

"Ich liebe das sehr" or "Ich habe das sehr gern".

The former is a bit stronger than the latter.

"lieben" in general is stronger than "to love" in English

[eternal elk]

DeepL is really inaccurate if you ask me. I think Google Translate does better job

[charred harbor]

Probably most people would disagree with this

[delicate tiger]

all the stuff you use in English + ß ä ö ü

[proven sphinx]

DeepL is definitely far more accurate than Google Translate. It's just that no machine translation is perfect, at least not yet.

[opal narwhal]

I hope this can help you: https://learn-german-easily.com/alphabet

[opal narwhal]

Eine Frage zu den substantivierten Adjektiven: Schreibt man "den anderen" oder "den Anderen", wenn man z.B. "lass den anderen/Anderen ausreden!" sagt?

[proven sphinx]

I wondered that myself just a few days ago. The answer is even though "den Anderen" is correct, it's much more common and also correct to write "den anderen".

[opal narwhal]

Thank you very much!

[high topaz]

Hallo Zusammen.
In a TV show i'm watching in German, everytime someone has to adress a single person they use "ihr" (example: "Gewohnt euch daran"). Does this make any sense?

I've been learning German for years and never heard of this.

(Everytime they address this single person directly, not in a 3rd person way)

[delicate tiger]

short version: outdated, no longer used form of address; used in fictional medieval (and pseudo-medieval/fantasy) settings

[high topaz]

Hm, interesting! The show is from the Star Wars universe

Wonder why they speak like that

[rugged hazel]

Since you're asking every German here personally; for me, some accents, I am bothered by, yes. Others, not so much.

[proven sphinx]

It was a conscious choice by the German translators. I suppose since Star Wars is more fantasy than sci-fi most of the time, they thought the antiquated polite "Ihr" form would be appropriate.

Or rather, it was the form used for the very first Star Wars movie (A New Hope), so it stuck.

[high topaz]

It's one of those things that must be natural for natives, but intriguing for those who aren't.

Thanks for the answers.

[proven sphinx]

It's strange, really. It just sounds very odd to hear someone say "Sie" in a fantasy/medieval setting in German.

[high topaz]

Well, TIL.

ty

[rugged hazel]

It's just an obsolete honorific, really. German has a very simple system of honorifics. It was most likely used because the person addressed is an emperor, king, and similar of some kind.

[tame beacon]

I think it really depends on the type of sentece/text you want to translate. But mostly DeepL is more accurate than Google Translate, at least in my opinion. Though Google Translate offers more languages than DeepL.

And yeah, both aren't perfect.

[fervent kernel]

do some people take the genders out of words in german these days?

like dein vs deine

would it be assuming gender

if u say dein or deine

how do that work

[plain umbra]

Sorry, I'm not sure what you mean.

Can you explain more?

[fervent kernel]

if you ask a question with deine

would people think you assumed their gender

[plain umbra]

No, because the ending of dein is based on the noun, not the person you're talking to.

Like if you talk about someone's pet cat, you say "deine Katze" because it's "die Katze".

The owner's gender isn't relevant.

The gender of the person is relevant though if you say his or her.

seine Katze = his cat
ihre Katze = her cat

sein Hund = his dog
ihr Hund = her dog

[west pond]

Herr John, (ist-seid-sind-hat) Ihr Sohn ins Kino gegangen? - Ja

it's gonna be "ist" right? because "Ihr Sohn" could be replaced with "er" it would be "Ist er ins Kino gegangen" so it takes the conjugation of "er"

[tribal aspen]

yes that's right

[primal spire]

Wie spricht man "Stil" eigentlich aus? Mein einer Deutschlehrer hat das "Schtiel" ausgesprochen (Und ich dachte das ist komisch, deswegen weiß ich das auch noch) und eigentlich kenne ich es als naja "Stil" halt (?) [Falls beides geht, was wäre "normal"?]

[tribal aspen]

Stil wird Stil ausgesprochen mit "sch" wäre es dann ein Stiel

[primal spire]

cool danke >:(

[rugged hazel]

Moment

Standardsprachlich ist Schtiel und Stil beides korrekt..

Dudenband 9:

Das Fremdwort Stil wird meist
ebenfalls (schtiel) gesprochen, doch kommt
auch die Aussprache (stiel) vor.

[tribal aspen]

[sand bronze]

I have a quick question for my german homework

Is this sentence that I've made grammatically correct?

Katharina ist kein Minimalist, weil sie ihren Krempel mag.

[versed wasp]

Das tue ich mir nicht mehr an.

Kann jemand mir zeigen, wie kann man diesen Satz aussprechen? 🤔 🤔

[grave laurel]

Like this?

(I'm not a native and my pronunciation may be off - please correct me!)

[grave laurel]

Lol I was debating whether to say it that way or not.

Thank you, I'll keep that in mind. I'm sorry for putting the e on.

I see now that it's important to say it the way it's actually said.

I know it's not incorrect, I just don't want him to learn it that way and then realize it sounds better without it many years later.

Teaching is hard. xD

I'm curious why he wanted to know how you can pronounce it, though.

[thorn zodiac]

"Die Suche nach dessen Verbleib führt den Protagonisten durch weitläufige unterirdische Höhlen, die von Mutanten bevölkert sind."

Is it possible that the "die von" can be switched around to make:

", von die Mutanten bevölkert sind"

Ive been looking into the relative pronoun with prepositions and wasnt sure if it had to be a fixed verb and prep combo

[delicate tiger]

"..., welche von Mutanten..." works

[plain umbra]

faq keyboard

[stoic mauve]

German letters

Being able to type German letters is quite important!

• Schon = already. Schön = beautiful.
• Mutter = mother. Mütter = mothers.

How to? There are several options.
🔸 Use a program like AutoHotkey. Download the program from https://www.autohotkey.com/ and read the pinned message in #resources for instructions on how to set it up. It can be used with any keyboard layout and the hotkeys can be customised.
🔸 US International layout: this is basically just a US keyboard layout with extra characters, so if you're using a US-style keyboard or something similar, the transition is very easy! Everything stays as you know it, except that some of the symbol keys can be used to create the special characters. For example " + a = ä. You can also do RightAlt + s = ß.
To use US International on Windows, look for the Region & Language options and switch your selected keyboard layout to US International.
🔸 If you're on Mac, on most systems you can press and hold a letter to show several variants including umlauts. You can type ß by pressing Option + B.

See the next page for more alternatives.

Page 1/2

[plain umbra]

@midnight aspen

Feel free to check out this.

[midnight aspen]

thanks beast! this is a duo language keyboard, with both languages on the keys, but i was hoping there would be a kez or something to swap between the languages -- i have to do some research on it

[plain umbra]

What do you mean? Is it a normal Windows keyboard layout?

[midnight aspen]

iäll take a picture one sec

[plain umbra]

Oh okay, so what you mean is you need to find out what button changes the lighting?

[midnight aspen]

not the lighting but the kezs between german and english lazout

there should be a kez trigger but itäs not in the instructions

[plain umbra]

Okay, so on your computer (not the physical keyboard) you're using Windows and it's the standard English and German keyboard layout settings, right?

[midnight aspen]

yes thatäs how i have to swap it currentlz, through windows

[plain umbra]

You should be able to press Windows Key + Space to swap layouts.

[midnight aspen]

oh wow beast, that is actuallz working, thanks a bunch!

that makes things much easier for when i just need the other layout for a single word or letter

[plain umbra]

But as I mentioned, you don't actually have to learn the German keyboard layout. You can if you want to, or if you will have a benefit from it (e.g. working in Germany and needing to use someone else's keyboard), but there are several ways to add umlauts and eszett to any other layout.

[midnight aspen]

yeah that's why i got it, to learn to type better for work

[plain umbra]

Okay, got it.

[midnight aspen]

but typing english on my german keyboard is weird and typing german on my english keyboard is weird. i know that if i type one language the keys are in other locations, but typing in german is much slower for me - so now i have a keyboard that does both so i can get more used to it

[flint nimbus]

is Panne like a motorstop? Or more generally any machinery breaking down?

[long whale]

It's most commonly understood as a car/vehicle breaking down, but in principle might be used for any machinery.

[flint nimbus]

i see, thank you!

[flint nimbus]

Ich glaube, die Deutschen sind genauso pünktlich oder unpünktlich wie die anderen Europäer auch.
why is the auch there?

is it like "i think the germans are such and such as well"?

my intutions would've placed the auch earlier in the sentence then

[hexed nova]

no thats alright most would say it like that

[tired igloo]

Unpünktlich wie auch die anderen Europäer and unpünktlich wie die anderen europäer auch is basically the same not sure if theres any rule for that

[flint nimbus]

would you say that the auch is more emphasized in one or the other?

[tired igloo]

If you put it first it does feel more emphasized yea

But in terms of meaning its the same

[flint nimbus]

it's weird to me that when i think about the "neutral" word order i pretty much just think about what is most important and put it last, but for emphasis it moves forward??

[tired igloo]

Suppose thats normal, if somethings more important id generally move it forward aswell

[flint nimbus]

yes but the weird part is that the important stuff is usually at the end, save for the v2 rule

[tired igloo]

Alright thats out of my league i just speak german and look cute sorry

[whole portal]

I need proof of that

[whole portal]

also the whole sentence looks wonky in general

I'd argue the auch is wrong there.

[flint nimbus]

Ich trinke Bier, obwohl ich lieber Wein mag.
this looks odd to me, like i'm saying "i prefer to like wine", i would've expected something more like ... obwohl ich lieber Wein trinkt. or ... obwohl ich noch Wein mag. or something

[whole portal]

The usage of auch there implies that something is done in the same way

The english equivalent in such a sentence is probably just

Then again you could see a connection with the genau so

[long whale]

Ich mag Wein. Ich mag Wein lieber als Bier. (= I prefer wine to beer; you could see this as: I like wine more than beer). You could say ... obwohl ich Wein noch lieber mag (... although I like wine even more), but just with "noch", it doesn't work. ;)

... obwohl ich lieber Wein trinke would also work, of course.

[flint nimbus]

what about the original sample sentence then?

[rugged hazel]

That's a really good question!
I think this is redundant, but it comes from

So unpünktlich, wie die anderen Europäer [es auch sind].

[flint nimbus]

ok, seems like it's a bit complicated

[long whale]

X lieber mögen [als Y] = to prefer X [to Y]

[flint nimbus]

i'm reading the link you deleted! Interesting, but yeah, complicated 😄

[rugged hazel]

👍 .

[rugged hazel]

It's like.. A reduction from "wie" as a subjunction to "wie" as a conjunction, by throwing away the stuff we need to make the relative clause.

If you wonder about the es: It's nothing complicated here, just a way to avoid "unpünktlich":

So unpünktlich, wie die anderen Europäer auch unpünktlich sind.
See
Ich bin unpünktlich. ( unpünktlich is an adjective )
Ich bin es. ( es is a noun )
So the position of "auch" changes (according to rules I don't know), if you noticed that, but it doesn't matter anyways if we reduce the sentence.
👍

@flint nimbus

[opal narwhal]

Kleine Korrektur: es is a pronoun

[rugged hazel]

Noun is fine.

Ok ok - Nomen. :)

[opal narwhal]

Wie meinst du das? "Es" ist ein Pronomen, kein Nomen... Ich verstehe nicht, warum du von Nomen sprichst.

[rugged hazel]

Ich glaube, du denkst gerade an Substantive.

[opal narwhal]

Nein, aber vielleicht sprechen wir nicht über dasselbe.

Du hast geschrieben: "Ich bin es. ( es is a noun )"

Und ich sage: "es is a pronoun"

[rugged hazel]

I wanted to highlight that "es" and "unpünktlich" are different parts of speech so "auch" changes in its position.

Unbewusst Englisch, sorry.

[opal narwhal]

Das ist klar, aber "es" bleibt trotzdem ein Pronomen, oder begreife ich etwas nicht?

[rugged hazel]

Oh, I should have said "part of sentence", not "part of speech". I mix these up all the time.

[zinc dock]

Ist der Satz richtig?
"Aus der Grafik geht hervor, dass Zahl der Menschen, die abnehmen wollen, in 2014 Jahre fast verdoppelt."

[opal narwhal]

Ich glaube, dass ich es endlich verstanden habe. Ich habe eben dies gelesen: https://languagetool.org/insights/de/beitrag/grammatik-nomen-substantiv/
Anscheinend hast du das Wort "Nomen" in seiner alten Bedeutung benutzt (und diese Bedeutung kannte ich nicht). Jetzt gehe ich ins Bett. Gute Nacht!

[potent copper]

eines Tages kommt die Stunde der Vergeltung!
-Goebbels
Kann jemand mir die Verwendung des Genitivs und Präsens erklären?

Is this normal, or did he do it to sound old-timey/poetic?

[whole portal]

It's all normal

The eines Tages sets the scene as in the future so you only need to use Präsens

Idk what there is to explain about the Genitiv

[plain umbra]

Maybe they wonder about the genitive used in "eines Tages". Is that right, @potent copper ?

If so, it's because genitive is used for time adverbs if there's no preposition and it's describing some indefinite time.

[long whale]

No, there are multiple issues. "Zahl" needs the def. article. It's "sich (Akk) verdoppeln". For years, you either just use the number: in 2014 Jahre OR you say: im Jahr[e] 2014. And since 2014 is in the past, the auxiliary for Perfekt is missing at the end of the sentence. ;)

[rare jetty]

Interesting choice of example sentences

[potent copper]

Thank you, that's exactly what I was wondering about

[icy flax]

Bc of that there're still weird ones like "eines Nachts". Once we stumbled upon it in a reading group here in GLaD. Hard to swallow given the feminine genus of Nacht.

[opal narwhal]

Wieder etwas gelernt, danke.

[rugged hazel]

Search for "Adverbialer Genitiv" to find more.

Used in more than time adverbials:

Ich trat festen Schrittes aus dem Haus.

[opal narwhal]

Das ist auch interessant, danke.

[terse skiff]

How often do the variations on 'wer' get used as pronouns versus using "der/die/das" as pronouns. Like saying "Die Leute, wem dies gehört" vs "Die Leute, denen dies gehört" (im not sure these are good example sentences, but I hope they get across what I mean)

[long whale]

Die Leute, wem dies gehört doesn't work. You must use the correct form of the relative pronoun, depending on the construction required by the verb in the relative clause: jdm (Dativ) gehören -> relative pronoun in Dativ

[terse skiff]

What would the relative pronoun be in this case then? Wem is the dativ of wer, isn't it? Or am I talking about the completely wrong thing

[gusty silo]

wer just sounds ungrammatical to me there

[long whale]

You can't use wer/wem here. It only works in very exceptional cases as a pronoun.

Der Mann, dem das Auto gehört...

[gusty silo]

the interrogative that can head that relative clause is welch- (and very non-standardly also wo in some regions, but i wouldn't recommend this to a learner of standard german)

(though actually no, i guess wo can't do that since it has to be dative here. idk what speakers who do that do in this case even)

actually actually, give me a reality check: does "Der Mann, welchem das Auto gehört" even work?

[terse skiff]

Just to be sure I understand: "Die Leute welchem dies gehört" could work?

[gusty silo]

welchen

but no actually i think something else is weird there

[calm kernel]

hello i searched this up but unfortunately couldn't find any resource on youtube. do you know any video or resource for it?

[long whale]

It does, I just find it thoroughly objectionable, stylistically. ;) Reason: why not just use "dem" instead? ;)

[calm kernel]

i was gonna ping this actually

[terse skiff]

The Wiki entry is suprisingly helpful

Danke @gusty silo und @long whale, ich habe etwas Neues gelernt

[gusty silo]

what sort of information about it are you looking for, by the way?

[calm kernel]

adverbliar Genitiv (ich könnte es falsch buchstabieren haben)

[gusty silo]

ja schon, aber was willst du über den adverbialen Genitiv wissen?

[rugged hazel]

Ok.

[calm kernel]

ich habe darüber keine Information tatsächlich

the basics are enough for now hehe

[rugged hazel]

Could also search for "Genitivus Absolutus".

[gusty silo]

fundamentally it's just a thing that Germanic languages (atleast german and english) do/did. adding -s to adverbs, or adding -s to things to show they're adverbs

[calm kernel]

english does that?

[gusty silo]

alway**s, amids**t

english doesn't do this productively, german has this a lot more

[gusty silo]

it's originally the genitive ending, but the function has become a bit opaque and some of the words so common that the association is lost, and some that the ending is applied to weren't really nominals to begin with (like german öfters, where öfter is used as an adverb to begin with)

[calm kernel]

interesting, but since i am not a english native i didn't even know about its existence

[gusty silo]

nobody talks about this in english as a genitive, i think. and understandably so

[long whale]

I suspect few English native speakers would know about this... :D

[charred harbor]

Nah, totally knew about it. 100%.
(Did they buy it….?)

[final marlin]

In this example, cannot we simply say, Der Mann, wem das Auto gehört. statt Der Mann, welchem das Auto gehört.
Hört mich irgendwie besser an.

[whole portal]

@final marlin Hört sich überhaupt nicht besser an ^^"

dem oder welchem geht

(Und dein letzter Satz müsste "hört sich für mich ..." heißen.)

[fervent kernel]

Könnte jemand bitte mir erklären wenn diese Typ der Wörter am Ende "s" nimmt? z.B. die Unterschiede zwischen:
"besonder" vs "besonders" (specificly)
"meisten" vs "meistens" (mostly)

[long whale]

Please read from here: #questions-2 message ;)

[fervent kernel]

Extra Info: In AmE, people prefer using "toward" without "s" at the end

[fervent kernel]

Kann man diesen Satz auf Deutsch sagen? "Ich werde sehen was ich tun kann"
(I'll see what I can do)

Ich bin mir nicht sicher besonders über den Teil "sehen"

[autumn marsh]

yes

[long whale]

Yes (comma after "sehen") ;)

[fervent kernel]

I am a bit scared of saying "danke" from now on because I was once muted by the bot. It thought that I was spamming the message "danke" 🙂 but just you know that whenever I react a message with thumbsup emoji, it means "danke" 😄

[fervent kernel]

Kann man die Wörter "vertreten" und "Vertretung" so benutzen?
"Diese Dateien vertreten wie die Benutzer die Webseite benutzen"
"Das ist die Vertretung, wie die Benutzer die Webseite benutzen"

Grundsätzlich suche ich nach der Übersetzung von "represent"

[opal narwhal]

In diesem Kontext würde ich "darstellen" benutzen.

[fervent kernel]

Was ist den Unterschied denn? 🤔

[long whale]

"darstellen" is a nice option (but a bit complicated, bec. separable). "zeigen" would work as well. "vertreten" is used for "standing in [for so]", for example (it has other meanings as well, but doesn't work in this case.

[opal narwhal]

Yes, "vertreten" is "represent" for example a lawyer who is representing you (er vertritt dich).

[fervent kernel]

Gilt diese Regel auch auf Deutsch? Wenn man ein Dativ Objekt benutzt, braucht man nicht auf Englisch Konjunktiv I. z.B.
"He said, he will be here in 15 minutes"
"He said to me, "***I ***will be here in 15 minutes" "

Ist das gleich auf Deutsch?
"Er hat gesagt, er ist da in 15 Minuten" - "Er hat mir gesagt, "Ich bin da in 15 Minuten" "

[tired igloo]

seems about right

only

"Er hat gesagt, er ist in 15 Minuten da"

"Er hat zu mir gesagt, "Ich bin in 15 Minuten da"

[dense obsidian]

"Er hat gesagt, er sei in 5 Minuten da."

[tired igloo]

"Er hat sich dazu erdreistet zu behaupten in 15 Minuten da zu sein"