vrchat-general-2

[nova horizon]

mabye one my PVM?

(joke: due to a misconfiguration of EAC, PVM was banned from VRC because "Virtual Machines Cannot Run VrChat")

[topaz dew]

Does anyone know where my dad is?

[opaque leaf]

moved to south carolina

[topaz dew]

Damn alright

[shadow ermine]

EAC doesn't ban anyone though?

[open crescent]

[reef lark]

shush im really desperate

[open crescent]

You need a gaming computer (since this is a game, and a very heavy one at that because of all the shit avatars)
If you don't want VR, the requirements are more lenient but you still need a gaming computer.

I e. You need a decent CPU, a decent GPU, and a decent amount of RAM 16GB at least I'd say

[reef lark]

is there anything like preferably $700-$900 that can run vrchat? like something with the bare minimum requirements

[open crescent]

A" cheap" desktop gaming pc will be cheaper than a "cheap" gaming laptop

[sharp saddle]

For some reason, I read that as "shush im really a degenerate"

[reef lark]

i mean that could work too

[open crescent]

Check their profile tho

[sharp saddle]

Wooooooow.

[reef lark]

[deft tulip]

my computer can run vr it has a decade old cpu

[reef lark]

hm

[reef lark]

Noone answerd my questiofne

stap calloing me a degenerate and answor my questoin

[open crescent]

I gave you the info you need

[reef lark]

oh

[nova gulch]

e

[leaden trellis]

#vrchat-general-1 is crazy af rn 💀

[open crescent]

Has been for a whole week

[hasty elk]

yuh

[hybrid bone]

anyone actually watch LS media i just watched a movie from there

[jade solstice]

kinda funny how they remove mods and yet avatar ripping is still a thing...guess what mod i was using...yeah my avatar is not getting ripped

funny how mods that helped the deaf and other accessibility mods got removed i guess just screw those people.

[full ruin]

You’ll get more responses talking about it in #vrchat-general-1

[jade solstice]

why do i care hell why do i even care the devs sure as hell don't they are just in it for the money

[full ruin]

K

[jade solstice]

sorry for going off just sad that i spent nearly 2k hours on a game and watching it fall apart infront of my own eyes

[open crescent]

Read the blog posts #announcements and the game is quite fine thanks

But yes general 1 seems to be the channel for the endless discussion over the same points over and over again, along with the tantrum gang screeching constantly

They address most of the legit issues

[misty onyx]

Day 5 of waiting for general 1 to talk about something else and not being a broken record of the same points.

[meager solstice]

what would u like to talk about

[exotic flicker]

they switched from eac to nsfw idk what u want

[shell spindle]

Holy crap general 1 is mostly people hating on the developers

[misty onyx]

Well besides the community chaos in general 1 maybe talking about developers trying to make avatars based on video games and shows.

[open crescent]

Screeching and spamming kids, meet the tantrum gang

[shell spindle]

Yeah it’s been like six or seven days since this all started

[misty onyx]

Oof

[dapper merlin]

Hmmm i kinda want to find alt vrc, between chillout vr and neos, what do yall think will be better for immigration ?

[final isle]

Ay can I say this vrchat team i got banned last monday I was supposed to get unbanned August 2 can u ask y it was increase to August 4 and also can yall at least give everybody time before the updates because they people that are banned dont have access to there accounts so it would be hard to undo things so before u start completely banning people this week give everybody till Saturday even the people that are banned time to get ready for it.

[cerulean cobalt]

Mods should just quarantine general-1

[open crescent]

#vrchat-support

[exotic kiln]

Hey, guys! How are we doing, today?

[cerulean cobalt]

Going great Ninjacat, gonna dive into VRC to watch some youtube with friends in a bit

[exotic kiln]

Sounds fun!

[cerulean cobalt]

How are you doing? Got anything fun planned for the rest of the day?

[exotic kiln]

Thanks for asking, I honestly appreciate it! I'm actually going to do some drawing, today. I'm going to try finish off my fursona. Actually, due to may lack of knowledge in 3D modelling, I'm considering requesting some talented person to create a low poly avatar model with textures provided by me. I'm not sure how commissioning works with the VR-chat community, though.

[cerulean cobalt]

I'm not sure about commissioning, but booth.pm and gumroad.com have avatars. Wouldn't be surprised if you could find some in a style you like then contact the author for a commission.

[blissful pewter]

@exotic kiln you can also find 3D Bases at both places and provide edits and textures yourself 🙂

[exotic kiln]

Alright. Thanks, guys!

[warped nebula]

Hello

I actually haven't downloaded other yet I went in here to see if it is a good game

[open crescent]

Vket also sells avatars

[exotic kiln]

Vket?

[open crescent]

Correct

https://www.store.vket.com/

But for commissions I suggest the vrctraders discord, check #community-servers-old

[exotic kiln]

Thanks!

[marble gale]

I guess, I'll ask here, since there's too much traffic going on in G1... I wonder, what's consider NSFW and what's not? Because people I know on here think it's only limited to nudity, and not like revealing clothing as well.

[wheat trail]

Gen 2 is so quiet compared to gen 1 😭

[marble gale]

Which is great because it's easier for someone to answer questions, without being spammed.

[open crescent]

P*rn and nudity, read the community guidelines

[graceful pewter]

yup

[unkempt fulcrum]

In reality NSFW is the games player base if u think of it

[barren fractal]

Really is believable, especially with the amount of, interesting avatars people wear these days

[marble gale]

Yep

[unkempt fulcrum]

Their just turning a beautiful game into a democracy

[lusty flicker]

There adding salt into the wounds they made with there loyal community

[unkempt fulcrum]

Tbh the anticheat don't hurt me but like leave it at that no sense in going in deeper yes the people numbers dropped and came back but if they limit more they r gonna look real stupid when they don't come back I like vrc tbh chillout and neos isn't as advanced as vrc they feel weird and not at home

Wow I tries saying something with t. I. T. S in it and they dismissed my comment

[barren fractal]

not sure if beautiful is the right word for vrchat, but i get what you mean lmao

[exotic flicker]

why should vrchat be safe for work if only the devs actually work here

[unkempt fulcrum]

All ik I know it sounds bad but who will argue over seeing virtual b o o b s

Just slap a NSFW filter on the game where it's ur choice if u wanna see it

[barren fractal]

no one tbh but it might scar some kids, who cares tho! 😈

well damn we might get banned now

[unkempt fulcrum]

This is what we need

It would make them happy and keep people nothing will change

[barren fractal]

true, that way no one can really complain if they enable a filter like that

[unkempt fulcrum]

Yep

[bright turret]

...Theres also such things as safety settings, or just hiding a model.

[barren fractal]

tru dat

[unkempt fulcrum]

Ik they don't look at that tho they look at the fact that a kid can unhide a model and see a nude female body or a guy

[bright turret]

Easy fix, raise the minimum age to play the game ._.

[unkempt fulcrum]

Or the NSFW filter where they gotta turn it on first

[lusty flicker]

They can also add a parental setting that can be set based on age

[barren fractal]

would be great

[unkempt fulcrum]

See all these normal fixes and they wanna go Over and beyond

[lusty flicker]

Like make a age thing part of haveing a account

[barren fractal]

then again kids could just lie about their age, pretty sure everyone has done it online at least once

[lusty flicker]

Kinda like tictok it as a age thing that if your born such and such year your account restricted tell you account becomes of age

[unkempt fulcrum]

Yea but that's their call if they wanna get grounded by their parents

[bright turret]

I just think the NSFW thing is stupid. Now it sounds like someone is spying on me.

[barren fractal]

if they get caught heh

[lusty flicker]

The problem lies in the fact there’s only so much that can be done

[barren fractal]

yeah, theres no 100%

[vocal shard]

I farded

[lusty flicker]

Before it baseicly becomes a inconvenience for everyone for the sake of stupid children and bad Parenting

[unkempt fulcrum]

Yea all they will probably due is take the ability to make nude characters away they can't go through and pick one by one out so the nudity will be the same with the millions of avatars out there

[barren fractal]

reminds me of when i met a parent who let their kid on vrc, saying he needed to "grow up fast" like the parent did, kinda sad 😦

[bright turret]

Also its sort of the communities fault that everything has to be so NSFW on the game. The communities of lap dancers, "vrc families", etc.

[lusty flicker]

Vrc is a social platform it is not Ment for kids as far as I know it wasint intended for kids from the start

[barren fractal]

vrc families.. 💀 💀

[unkempt fulcrum]

Not gonna be a community left if they restrict one more thing

[lusty flicker]

To be honest vrc shold have like a separate version of it like vrc kids or just make a adult only one

[barren fractal]

thats the most google+, animo app, role-playing thing i've ever witnessed on the game 💀

[unkempt fulcrum]

Yea like little tikes vrchat

[lusty flicker]

Yeah

[bright turret]

Ill be completly honest, Its a parents fault and the kids fault if they are let on this kind of game.

[vocal shard]

Gonna throw my two cents and say it kinda sounds like what happened to Youtube if they do end up doing a thing like that

[unkempt fulcrum]

I mean it don't help our case when there's 2 wolves having intercourse in the open around people

[barren fractal]

tru

[barren fractal]

Lmaoo 💀 💀

[vocal shard]

Well y’know minus the legality that caused it

[bright turret]

I just honestly feel like VRC is just wanting to watch its community more, like its a social experiment. I didn't care about the EAC update but like.... jeezus can I get some privacy?

[lusty flicker]

Kinda yeah

[unkempt fulcrum]

I totally agree but u see YouTube has a kid section vrchat don't

[barren fractal]

theres always that one fbt user with half of their parts hanging, shaking in-front of a mirror

[bright turret]

What if VRC is just a big social experiment, based upon the state of nature principles. Where no one is ruled by another?

[barren fractal]

lets be real, vrc wont profit from kids

[bright turret]

Just realizing, VRC is a state of nature.

[lusty flicker]

My piont like what is it there after cos nsfw isint a problem like the amount of people that have nsfw avatars is mind boggling not to mention the time and money people have put into the stuff

Lol

[bright turret]

Were going to look like the Money For Nothing - Dire Straits Official Video.

[barren fractal]

im shocked people spend up to hundreds on avatars

[unkempt fulcrum]

Had to delete that before their stupid selves had a idea

[lusty flicker]

Not to mention most the adults I know aka my self included don’t want to be around kids for many many reasons

[bright turret]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wTP2RUD_cL0 This is vrc in the next week.

[lusty flicker]

Lol

[unkempt fulcrum]

Its what they want

Like have any of u tried neos or chillout yet

[lusty flicker]

Yes I love them so far

[bright turret]

Im sorry but like can Eric Johnson be not forgotten, what an absolute artist.

[unkempt fulcrum]

I do to but they don't feel right not to mention there isn't alot of people on it and vrc is more advanced in graphics

[bright turret]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VnqpOFcBiMM

[bright turret]

Shits art.

[unkempt fulcrum]

Ik they took a big hit with the waves of people coming in but like they feel a bit old school vr

[barren fractal]

i tried chillout but my pc cant handle shit like it used to

[unkempt fulcrum]

Will say I like neos better then chillout I like the idea of saving props and being able to hop out of ur body to look at it

Me and my boyfriend played it not to long ago

[idle wharf]

well damn...

C&Ds goin out now apparently...hope the community management dont get too much heat

[unkempt fulcrum]

C&d?

[idle wharf]

cease and desist

[unkempt fulcrum]

Explain?

[idle wharf]

"Earlier today, VRChat submitted a cease and desist to the creator of the VRC Private Server project. We estimate that this letter was written by a high-tier law firm, and probably cost about $10k+."

this is from the one pink haired VRC 'addon'

[unkempt fulcrum]

Yea ik about it

[idle wharf]

smh my head

its sad, updating my review

[unkempt fulcrum]

U think they will go after all the mod communities or just emmc

[urban wolf]

Sucks that they're pulling multiple moves similar to how Uber banned drunk people from using the app. Guess a community driven social vr game is too much to ask for.

[umbral reef]

You realize there is literally no way they could have let this project finish right? Any company sends letters for this but its apparently something we in this special ed community have to be angry about?

[urban wolf]

Dead By Daylight has a fair sized private server modding community and I'm pretty sure Behaviour hasn't pushed back too hard against it. Could be wrong though.

[idle wharf]

just that they're really doubling down on this, more confirmation that they truly don't want anyone doing any modding, no matter how much its needed cuz the base game hasnt supported a feature for years, no matter how much it helps something that's broken or needs improvement in their game, no matter how much work it did FOR the devs....they're sticking to it....it's depressing, i cant enjoy it anymore cuz FBT is borked, mainly, but a few other things are also just more downers...

gonna wait a while, see what avatars get made for COVR, how the modding goes there (lots of mods already popping up) and hop over there eventually

for now, il do other stuff ig...hunt: showdown i been grinding the event...some other VR games to try again...shrug

[umbral reef]

Bit different then a live service though-
DbD is match making, heaps of competitve games allow for private servers so people can practice and improve. Live services are highly against it though

[unkempt fulcrum]

My whole point is u already killed the mods like u wanted right why keep going on a restriction spree

[idle wharf]

you're telling me a game that has a new killer/survivor every 3 months with big fanfare and updates isnt live service?

[umbral reef]

Do you play matches/instances each time or are you constantly in the lobby/service
Maybe saying live service wasnt the right word but you should grasp what i mean

[lusty flicker]

I feel like vrc had a change in management and now there on a big power trip

[unkempt fulcrum]

Anyway I gotta go to sleep yall seem pretty chill yall can pm me if yall wanna play sometime I need more friends anyway

[idle wharf]

no i dont know what you mean....

per "trusted reviews" (the first thing on google):

"A live service game is a game that sees a constant stream of new content added post launch, and is purposefully designed to keep you playing years after launch. This is unlike traditional single-player games, which can be completed in a set number of hours."

[rain isle]

Hallo

[umbral reef]

The difference between a game like a Moba where your always playing in a server for every second of your game in 'one server' Vs jumping between matches/servers constantly.

[urban wolf]

I'm confused about the comparison because it seems like functionally both dbd and vrchat create temporary server instances for players to connect to and interact within.

[umbral reef]

Your always online in Vrchat in an instance.
If dbd you can menu sit all you want without being constantly interacting with there game server

[urban wolf]

I think you connect to live servers the moment you log into dbd, for the sake of having access to profile information

[idle wharf]

idk how servers work in different mobas, i'd imagine they're not all equal....but you still hav more than one server...like NAE, NAW, oceana, UK, etc....its not one server...and mobas are still seperate matches...

whether or not a game is p2p connection or something else doesnt matter as to whether or not its a live service game...it's what MOST live service games do, have a central server for keeping track of player stats and whatnot, dbd does this too...also an easy way for them to say 'yeah yknow that game you bought? we're only making tons of money, not ludicrus ammounts of money so we're shutting it down sorry bye' and then if anyone tries to revive it themselves, years later, after the original devs/publishers completely abandoned it and are making NO money off it...they send cease and desist letters (EA, battlefield 2142)

that kinda bs is why im upset...companies getting rid of good things, using a minority (malicious mods) as the scapegote, their 'fix' not doing anything, and this whole thing just getting rid of mods probably cuz it just makes them look bad cuz it did their job better than them...

@urban wolf youre right you log in the moment you 'press space to continue' in dbd...you cant play without connecting, cant even get to the menu

[urban wolf]

You're just connecting to a different server when you get into a match. I get how the game sections aren't really comparable though.

Having played on dbd private servers I can't see how VRC private servers would damage the game's income/reputation any more than the devs are actively doing right now.

[open crescent]

And that's why you're not in charge of those decisions

[urban wolf]

The only reasonable ideas I can see being behind their actions are grounded in legal issues. I know vrc has had some unsavory things happening on its' platform, but people are going to do dumb stuff regardless of access to modding.

[topaz dagger]

ive got new user and it wont let me build and test i need help

[open crescent]

?upload

[shy spoke]

You must obtain at least "New User" Trust Rank in our Trust and Safety system in order to upload content. You can get this by just spending a few hours in VRChat, hop some worlds, and make some friends. Give it some time and you'll be able to upload content in no time.

As an aside, you must have a VRChat account to upload content. That means you can't use a Steam account, Oculus account, or Viveport account to upload content like worlds or avatars.

Source: https://docs.vrchat.com/docs/frequently-asked-questions

[topaz dagger]

fo avatar creation

[open crescent]

Yes read the bot message

[topaz dagger]

ive got new user

[urban wolf]

They said that they're ealready new user rank. Maybe you should read the message, bot.

[open crescent]

Read the rest of the message

[topaz dagger]

ive got an vrc acc

[open crescent]

What error are you getting then

[topaz dagger]

it says im new to the sdk

no errors

[hollow pond]

interesting Seems there's a lovely little blacklist being implemented.

[clever nexus]

?

[hollow pond]

I'm testing out terms and some things are just outright denied now. How curious

[umbral reef]

Has been a thing for years- There are lists of all blacklisted words and what they result into

[hollow pond]

Newer than previously.

[bitter talon]

Everyone has read the blogposts man. That why so many people are having issues with what they did as EAC didn't accomplish what they set out to do and made the situation far worse for VRC by removing everyones higher levels of protection and giving us only the basic level protection that EAC provides. And they pretty much did a big screw you to the community with no Beta test, and not working with the community. Me and the majority aren't mad about losing MODS. People are mad about the big screw you by the VRC community. Kicking tens of thousands of players overnight isn't appreciated or liked. WE want VRC to be succesful and grow. BUT THIS KIND OF BEHAVIOR BY THE VRC TEAM IS UNACCEPTABLE.

[hollow pond]

^

[umbral reef]

You really think this community would have not actively gone around causing problems in publics every day of that beta if it lasted for a week?
Also they are now able to do a lot more towards bad clients then just using EAC, all the server side protections first could not be employed because of the good mods getting in the cross fire. Its always been super clear you could never get rid of the bad without removing the good.

[storm musk]

Being part of the community that benefitted from the helpful QoL, Yea, I Do.

[umbral reef]

Complain about them not adding these QoL things earlier, thats valid as fuck and i fully agree with that. Been complaining the particle limiter isnt in the UI since day one of its release.
Saying EAC wont do anything is just ignorant as its already clear it had a big impact in lowering client numbers

[hollow pond]

I have friends that used QoL mods for performance, anti-crash, quest issues, etc etc. It's a shame just how many people are getting the shaft for something that was never discussed with community leaders before hand...You know, like any sane company would do when making a huge change that may just isolate and affect hundreds of thousands/millions.

[umbral reef]

Community leaders
No one is that, your small social circle is a extremely minor part of this game.

[jagged leaf]

they could have simply done nothing and let the community weed out the bad apples... ohwait thats what was already happening, except due to mods being not allowed most people were scared off using protection mods

[storm musk]

Dead by Daylight, that uses EAC, it's absolutely pathetic

[umbral reef]

Its using a way older version then Vrchat and hasnt updated it in ages so cant really be compared 👀
Thats like saying a modern day ferarri is slow because there cars from 5 years ago are slow for supercars now.

[storm musk]

Lets be fair here, VRC doesn't have some cutting edge EAC version that's never been heard of, even if it's newer, it'll take people less than a week, it's bare bones protection, why do you think pretty much everyone universally dislikes it.

[jagged leaf]

And yet Vrchat's implementation is pathetic

[umbral reef]

Lets not warp things, even the good mods caused a lot of development problems for the team and content creators.
Together with the fact that normalizing mods also normalized unsafe clients more and more with the lies that go around in this community.
Sure, 100 devs working on hyper specific things can produce content faster, but only a minority of users can play with it.

Locking out like 70% of the platform from these fixes is whack, if mod people really cared they would help VRchat instead of get in there way most of the time. Treathen to expose vunrabilities instead of report them and ect.

[hollow pond]

EAC is craptastic no matter what game utilizes it, no matter what version it is, and you turning a blind eye to that fact does nothing to help your point. Ferrari? EAC? That'd be funny if it wasn't so darn sad.

[umbral reef]

Its the latest up to date version only fortnite has been using.
Also they indeed dont go as deep as some other platforms because they dont need to really

[jagged leaf]

The modding team offered help.

[storm musk]

^

[umbral reef]

What modding team as plenty claimed they would but did proper jack shit

[hollow pond]

Hacking in Fortnite is super common. That does nothing for your point.

[jagged leaf]

because most of them were scared to get banned?

[umbral reef]

They wanted to help while keeping there special not following the rules priveledge?
Ofcours that is not realistic, thats proper clown behavior to think so

[hollow pond]

F for that message. <3

[storm musk]

Especially considering a vague and draconian TOS.

[jagged leaf]

the what are you talking about

[storm musk]

waa, Playstation users wouldn't get to use it

[jagged leaf]

Modding was banned and everyone using or developing it where scared of getting banned, you wouldnt just go up to the team and casually offer them your mods, you will most likely get banned (like many stupid companies do)

[umbral reef]

ToS be some law stuff- There is a community guidline for this exact reason that is made for a normal human to understand what the ToS wants to say.
https://hello.vrchat.com/community-guidelines

[bitter talon]

They did, they tried so hard to help the VRC team. Thats why they are so upset. Earlier today, VRChat submitted a cease and desist to the creator of the VRC Private Server project. VRChat is on the war path against modders, and that’s not something I want to mess with. Its this stabbing the back that has people so upset. Its messed up.

This is EXTREMELY DANGEROUS behaviour by VRChat, and means that not only is VRC modding dead, but other communities could be next. This is why the modders are also strongly urging you to check out the alternatives. Most of the moders are heading to ChillOutVR, but NeosVR is also a great option. Both of these projects are made by people that actually care for their users, and are constantly growing and getting better (and in a lot of cases, already ARE better than VRChat). -qoute from emmylove

[umbral reef]

Thats not how it worked at all but go at it my dude-
The team has never banned anyone for reporting clearly better stuff with clear examples of how to do so.
Same for exploits and all others, you get a nice thank you even from them.

[jagged leaf]

only after they already attacked the modding community did they have an open chance to talk with them without fearing to get banned (since they already were banned infact)

[hollow pond]

My brother in Christ, how many hours you got running?

[jagged leaf]

BS.

[open crescent]

Chilloutvr: please work with us we're not going to pay you

NeosVR: please buy our cryptocoins also we hate each other

[umbral reef]

Imagine thinking you can ignore all IP rights by running a private server to play on a older version of the game 🙃

[umbral reef]

Been playing since 2017 so pick a number you seem fitting

[bitter talon]

Rofls indeed

[storm musk]

imagine wanting to run on an older sandboxed version that would run separate from the live build.

[umbral reef]

Almost something heaps of games dont like you doing as it breaks multiple IP rights 🙂

[open crescent]

Imagine thinking running a pirated version of the game isn't going to get you in legal trouble

[jagged leaf]

just as much BS. Neos has been actively trying to get rid of the pro crypto CEO

[hollow pond]

Yo, pog, same. So you know how much this hurts then. So why the hardcore d-riding scene when you know, for a fact, this is a terrible move?

[open crescent]

The drama isn't even about the crypto that's just another bad thing they have

[umbral reef]

I like EAC, i think its plain stupid they didnt fix shit before hand with it.
Im not a client monkey so its only pure good for me 🤷

[jagged leaf]

what drama?

[storm musk]

"Client Monkey" considering the disabled community that used it?

[umbral reef]

Throw me a mod that the disabled community used that cant be done with OSC or on an OS level that VRC aint adding 🙃
Also you damn well know what i mean when i say that therm

[bitter talon]

Renamon does have a point, they are trying to get rid of NEOS VRs CEO and find a replacement. Real scumbag Crypto Bro and a thief. Very similar to the scumbag CEO of VRC. Never heard anything bad about ChilloutVR although until everyone swapped over to the platform last week It really had no devlopment on it.

[storm musk]

TTS, we had it already.

[umbral reef]

You really cant use TTS on the OS level 🙂 ?
Really? Because i got something to tell you then my friend!

[jagged leaf]

Do you call anyone who plays with mods in other games to infinitely extend the joy from a game also Client Monkeys? are they all degenerates to you because they see that there is much more to be had beyond the simple limits devs give them?

[storm musk]

My man, it's clear you have the argumentative demeanor of someone fresh out of middle school, continue paying your VRC+ subscription and have a nice day.

[bitter talon]

Sounds like Oclac gets upset when someone has a custom client in Minecraft as well based on his previous argument

[open crescent]

Oof bruh you're in for a ride.

They have so much internal drama, with the fight between the two founders, the employees wanting a big salary but the CEO offering a cheaper cone and then they making it public, stopping game updates for a year, the two founders continuously publishing drama long texts about each other etc

[jagged leaf]

So what? that sounds like part of the ongoing attempt to get rid of that scumbag CEO, of course hes not going down without a fight

[umbral reef]

Not far off but could not be further from being right at the same time
Its just that most people here really want there mods when they literally do not need them in most cases.
Dragging disabled people into this while all the actual speach or vision impaired people i know dont care as they didnt use mods (funfact, they kinda wanna use other software on there PC too and got tools that help everywhere 🙃 )

There is heaps of shit this game needs to fix first IMO, EAC was not even on my wish list. But im not some insane person thinking mods where the be all end all of VRchat and that mods are the only reason the game got big or survived.

[open crescent]

In the case of chillout the "work for us but without pay" I consider a pretty shit move.
But they also got a lot of flak for promising a ton of features and years later not delivering any of that.

[umbral reef]

The game allows and advocates for modding so no-
Same how VRchat gives tools to play around within a specific limit. Lots can be done with OSC and SDK3 tools.

[open crescent]

And renamon says "so what" well they aren't the "everything Vrchat doesn't have" heavens the tantrum gang thinks. (Just allow mods)
And those reasons make me not want to support them tbh

[bitter talon]

Really this would all end if the VRC Team would apologize as oppose to doubling down on their screw up. Even if they didn't change a single thing, if they would just apologize of their horrific treatment of the community this would just all end. The fact that tens of thousands of players STILL CANT CONNECT is just a garbage treatment of their userbase. Just because you aren't having issues doesn't mean everyone else isn't. The fact they knew this would be unpopular so as oppose to informing the community they snuck it in essentially overnight is BS and a garbage treatment. We want a apology.

[umbral reef]

Honest question and its fine if you didnt as who really does.
Did you read all there blogposts in full?

[tame echo]

Exactly

[storm musk]

They gave it a grand total of a day, and it flopped.

[hollow pond]

There are always going to be bad apples no matter how people choose to play a game. With mods, without, etc etc. EAC isn't going to stop hackers/crashers/etc. I can, have, and frequently do bypass EAC in Eldin Ring, which was/is consider a newer/newest version to play modded continuous coop games with friends. It's fun. I'm doing nothing to harm the game or the community and only play that way because I wanted to run it as a coop game from start to finish...

But that's the thing....It's sleep easy as all get out to bypass. It does 💩 4️⃣ 🍆 to stop anyone with any kind of scripting experience from doing whatever they want. Just as I only do that to have fun, there are people who don't even use mods to purposefully ruin others fun.

The same thing happens in VRC. Yeah, you can block them, report them, etc. But how often does that actually result in anything? It takes a vote to kick and they still come back. And if they rock up with a crash? When before people had anticrash? Welp, that whole room is gone now because one a-hole decided to ruin the fun.

Heck, coming in with a HIGH POLY avatar can do the same. No mods required.

[storm musk]

^

[open crescent]

Problem is the tantrum gang refuses to listen to reason, it's all or nothing. Doesn't matter vrchat is implementing the accesibility and qol stuff because tantrum

[bitter talon]

All of them, I have been desperate for any info on a timeline on when me and my friends can play VRC again. That doubling down on their error on their post on the 29th was not ok. Whats worse is they still aren't pushing out updates on when they intend to reslove their issues with the official Japanese Twitter. Its unbelievable!

[tame echo]

THIS

[open crescent]

Good thing is tantrum gang is just a few players and the rest are still enjoying the game

[storm musk]

You are about as tone deaf and uninformed as Genki-Dev

[umbral reef]

As i stated earlier- Do you really think this community would have gone less ape shit about it?
In the past people went on for weeks crashing every lobby, Ddosing and more because they talked/ran betas of updates people didnt like.
The only way this shitstorm would have been smaller for the average user (aka non mod persons) was this way.

Its shitty but with the past of this community really not unrealsitic.

[hollow pond]

OH DARN!

[open crescent]

What issues with Japanese twitter lmao, are you talking about the nsfw stuff that was never allowed

[storm musk]

My question will remain, what did it stop, other than a massive drop in VRC+ subs.

[open crescent]

The stuff vrchat explained in the first blogpost

[umbral reef]

The 'adressing the' post was uther shit yea and top tier bad communication as they always do (and what i hate too, by far the top tier cringe post they made so far)
If you check there first blog they added a proper 'yea we understand people are angry and will change things around to make it less bad'.
Thats fairly simple 'ok we messed up, lets fix it as you guys told us to asap'.

[storm musk]

Mhm, and I will also ask, have you personally encountered them before the EAC implementation?

[bitter talon]

No, For a hot minutes after the update we couldn't connect to VRC as EAC would not verify. Eventually got on via a VPN to a US IP, I have no idea why as they never released any updates. Extremely frustrating as we reported it via all official bug reporting channels with no fix ever pushed out. However it seems to be getting better now.

[umbral reef]

Easier to take overall action against clients even if they bypass EAC.
A lot less pressure on the development team and creators to solve problems that are 100% mod related.
Reduce the spread and acceptance of bad clients that steal avatars, passwords.
Make is to they can start fighting against userbots/protonbots.

[open crescent]

Every single update discord was full of mod users screaming "vrchat broke fbt! Fix your fucking game" for example

[umbral reef]

I have encountered and helped with these reasons before in this chat.
The second one a shit ton even.

[hollow pond]

Smh at this entire situation all the way around.

[open crescent]

I live in Japan tho, it was not everyone. Might have been issues with a specific ISP

[umbral reef]

JP server has been struggeling before the update even though 👀

[hollow pond]

^

[storm musk]

While that is a fair argument, you've also got to take into perspective the people that got the shaft and have to wait the possible months that it'll take for them to even implement the features they're promising.

and lets be fair, a movable Menu and a personal mirror? really?

[open crescent]

Some features like TTS can be done with external software without mods

Others with avatars, others are already in beta, and others will have to wait unfortunately, but it's not like all is lost

[storm musk]

anything hooked externally will get hit and won't let VRC Launch

[open crescent]

You don't need to "hook" for TTS

[umbral reef]

Yes and that is also why i dont like the update.
But yelling angry about it, ruining the games future growth and all will not reverse that.

We have heaps of tools people refused to use as 'X mod did that' (while often using the exact tool VRC provided...).
The open beta is really just them pushing the release of side projects up- But its showing they want to fix things

[storm musk]

That I can agree with, as you said prior the team also needs to work on their pisspoor communication skills as well

[hollow pond]

External modifications/software that would supplement or augment the baseline service would, by ToS, be violations. If it ain't base VRC, that's a mod by ToS. Would they not?

[umbral reef]

Ey i been roasting them for that for 2018 so preach that

[open crescent]

Too much people wanted it, so they decided to add it. Moveable menu is part of accesibility and can help disabled people tho

[bitter talon]

Yeah, been a lot of garbage posted on the discord. By both sides. Don't necessarily condone some of the more extreme actions. I do think it is a net positive though if people continue to let the VRC team know that this behaviors is unacceptable if they want community support. Its that people are continuing to give them grief until they start getting better with working with the community. I count it fortunate that I've always had the pleasure of working with good Dev teams (I know this can be rare and I am a outlier) but the VRC Team is absolutely trash with working with the community. They still don't have a timeline posted of when they will roll out the updates so we can play VRC again. Which I don't understand. YOU would think a timeframe like this would be a critical thing that they would want to release (As oppose to working on it over the next 2-weeks post that they gave).

[umbral reef]

Since when does any normal TTS that everyone used up to this point need to touch anything VRchat related that your current microphone doesnt?

[open crescent]

No you don't need mods for a lot of stuff

[umbral reef]

They stopped giving a timeframe because they didnt want to push there devs to overwork hard and not lie to there community.
Its IMO better then before where they did give rough estimates and went way past it.

[open crescent]

On this we can agree, remember avatar dynamics in summer 2021

[storm musk]

Honestly this update could have hit far less harder than it did, and I do believe it fair to blame it on the dev teams communication, and I will also say that their actions on the outside of their reach, like the C&D/suit threat is pretty uncalled for.

[umbral reef]

That suit is for something against the law and could risk the company as a whole though
You should really think about how a company works, no developer will have any say over legal matters. Thats all up to the legal person.
If he says a letter gets send, it gets send for damn clear reasons.
This applies for any company

[open crescent]

Any individual expecting to run a pirated version of a game server and clients without getting in legal trouble is... Not very smart

[storm musk]

Yeah, blocked that term I see. pink haired extention.

Idc about the "pirated" clients fuck them, but those of us using the pink client are what I was intending for the suit.

Last I checked that wasn't pirated, considering you needed both an active VRC account, and VRC+

[open crescent]

The cease and desist was for the pirated server and clients so you should not complain about that if you don't care

And yes it was pirated

[storm musk]

My entire point went over your head, so I'm going to ignore you.

[open crescent]

Throwing reason out the window are we

[umbral reef]

Mind Dming me what you actually mean as i think we are mixing up two things now.

[hollow pond]

[I feel bad for the community managers who don't have anything to do with the legal/announcements communications team having to put up with all of our BS.] shrug

[hollow grove]

they have support of the benjamins now, I don't think they care what the community thinks - they are going to bend to the questies at this point - wouldn't it be ironic if they started to cowtow to facebook

[hollow pond]

Imagine the f-ing headaches caused by all this. shudders in former S-L community manager.

[hollow grove]

Oh thats an excellent example of handling a situation poorly is second life

[hollow pond]

You're darn right it is, though I meant Secret Labs.

The SCP community is...vicious.

Close knit, wholesome at times, and ravenously bloodthirsty.

[storm musk]

honestly do feel bad for tupper, man got more flak then he deserves

[hollow pond]

oof F for yet another message.

[hollow grove]

I wasn't spamming tho :\

[hollow pond]

^This. My dude got shredded for no good reason.

[hollow grove]

I just want them to be clear about their direction moving forward tbh - like their stance on things - so I know that they won't one day just be like "yeah all these communities will now be persecuted like this one points to modder community"

[hollow pond]

It's a reasonable request.

[open crescent]

What do you mean, the official stance always was "mods are banned"

[hollow grove]

Dude... miss me with that tos bull. Its weak when you don't enforce it at all, like twitch and their inability to ban blatant breaches of their tos

[hollow pond]

Shots fired.

[open crescent]

They banned mostly based on reports, but an official stance doesn't get more official than the TOS of a company what else do you want

[umbral reef]

VRC's moderation style has always been 'we only take action if reported unless its getting too big of a problem'

[hollow pond]

And let's be real, very little of this ever happened. There were people that went on for months doing all kinds of things until it got big enough for them to notice.

[umbral reef]

Yea as no one reports shit lmao

[hollow pond]

Mostly, because the community self polices itself with blocks and vote kicks.

[storm musk]

reporting barely ever works lmao

[hollow grove]

Br0 listen, at the end of the day the way it looked is they wanted the numbers on their platform, while tolerating the things they did, and now that their numbers are high they are jettisoning them like they never mattered, that is what happened. They allowed it until they didn't need the numbers

[umbral reef]

Reporting worked insanely well if you did it right. What is hard to do.
Getting video proof, logs ect send into #moderation-reports isnt easy.

[open crescent]

Official stance never changed, and it was repeated multiple times over the years by the Devs every chance they could. So this shouldn't be a surprise

Everyday angry kids came to complain about their ban

Break the rules
Banned for breaking the rules
Pikachu face

Now they aren't even banning people they let you play when you delete your mods

[hollow pond]

Wanting that Fat Papa Sony 💸, amirite?

[storm musk]

exactly, it's super hard when some people can't or just don't think to record to begin with

[umbral reef]

But if you get the proof people do get punished, aint always obvious as public world bans are a thing after all

[open crescent]

Now it's angry kids:
"How dare you enforce the rules you've had for years"

[bitter talon]

Unfortunately I feel you are right. I believe (This is not verified and have only heard rumors) is the only reason they forced the EAC update was VRChat INC had already signed for the license for EAC and the actual higher ups at VRChat Inc pretty much force the team to push out the update as they needed A Anti-cheat prior to monitization. What's a real shame is this is something so many content creators have called for, yet instead of working to get a good update, since they had to release it and knew a few people would be upset they didn't even offer a community beta test and essentially released it overnight. They may be at the bequest of Benjamins, but I do think if people to continue to write negative reviews, file complaints on discord, and reach out to media orgs about VRChats severe issues it will either force the VRC team to work with the community to make VRChat the best VR social platform out there. Or the platform will stay as is and stop all growth and progress forward until sometime in the far future were they go the way of the dinosaur.

[umbral reef]

They have stated no 'higher power' or investor forced them too. Also they got EAC for free... So no money lost.

[storm musk]

At least it wasn't BattleEye

[bitter talon]

Copy why I stated was a rumor, thanks for clarifying.

[hollow pond]

Good Christ, Judge! Do Not Speak Its Name Lest It Infect Us All! ✝️

:P

[bitter talon]

Either way if they aren't willing to work with the community I do feel it is in everyone's best interest to continue to report these issues and reach outside of the community for the more severe issues with VRC and go to public discussions and the media. VRC has always struggled with this and with so many of the mods that tried to stop the most egregious things to occur on VRC I feel really the only thing people can do is to report VRC to the media.

[hollow pond]

They're getting slammed online atm.

[bitter talon]

This whole situation is just horrific and sad.

[umbral reef]

They do want to work with people who can talk civil and know there stuff-
Its indeed that they have no need for a 'fix it' talk with people 👀

[storm musk]

Overwhelmingly Negative reviews on steam

[open crescent]

This

[hollow pond]

But also, heck Kotaku.

[open crescent]

You work with people who can talk reasonably not with a bunch of screeching kids throwing a tantrum

[minor rune]

I honestly see that as the best course of action. Unfortunately people will probably focus on some guy that told the devs to commit unalive

[hollow pond]

Yeesh.

[dreamy crane]

Mega BASED thank you very informative

[umbral reef]

That info is wrong though --

[open crescent]

Someone posted screenshots from the mod discord of the announcements like "boycott vrc! Unsubscribe from vrc+! Leave negative reviews!" Yes very willing to work with vrchat of course

Meanwhile actual reasonable communities like the Helping Hands discord actually did

[umbral reef]

Dont forget the mod group that treathend to expose exploits

[frosty berry]

What is left to discuss in a civil way after VRC gave them a bloody nose?

[minor rune]

Well, if they aren't going to listen to the community, what choice do they have if they want to have their voices heard?

[bitter talon]

Yeah, I know, but more talking about their complete negligence of prevent child predation on the platform. Some of the mods were the leaders in the community in providing reporting tools to expose some of these horrific excuses of human beings. With them gone really our best bet is to go to every news organization we can to report on what goes on. If the VRC team won't give us a timeline, won't work with us to stop this kind of behavior we need to let the public in general know what has happened to individuals. We can't wait on a update on this. They need to put a stop to this now. This has been the number one request of the VRC team prior to EAC and now is like 2 or 3. They need to resolve this now. It's sad, and I understand it could be the death of the platform, but if they are unwiling to work with the community to resolve these issues the best and only right thing we can do is start writing journalist to report this. It would be a sad day when the story breaks CNN, NBS, or Fox, but I don't know what we can do if the VRC team doesn't listen to us.

I am just trully devestated.

[umbral reef]

They dont blindly do 100% what someone in the community tells them, they damn well listen

[open crescent]

They listened to the reasonable communities not the screeching tantrums

[storm musk]

are you physically able to stop parroting the same thing over and over again?

[bitter talon]

I need a hug, this whole EAC thing is soul crushing. No more hanging out with so many friends and family in VRC until they release a fix/update.

[storm musk]

you've provided nothing to the conversation and you've just filled the room with hot air.

[bitter talon]

😢

[hollow pond]

Review Bombing in and of itself is just one way to have your opinion/voice be heard when other avenues are less effective or outright denied to people.

However, purposefully shitting on the game for xyz because angry rather than trying to leave constructive criticism or even attempt discourse? That helps no one.

[minor rune]

I guess testdostres is choosing to focus on the bad apples... Voting with your wallet is a form of protest, you know?

[hollow pond]

^

[open crescent]

You are just insulting me instead of being reasonable, I am being as polite as possible with arguments.

@minor rune sure that is valid.

[storm musk]

Honestly I can understand the perspective of wanting EAC, but doesn't mean I agree with it.

[frosty berry]

VRChat has shown it's true colors. It never wanted to be associated with mods and now it took care of it. As of NSFW it is the same as it doesn't want to be associated with it. The TOS 9.4.c and 12.d make it clear. If you upload or behave in certain manner you can get banned. I won't put it past to bring down the ban hammer soon. Currently they decided that 10%-15% dip in their user base it's a price they are willing to pay to get rid of the some unwanted communities.

[storm musk]

it seems like a heavy handed fix for something that could have been worked & worded better

[minor rune]

I feel for you bro

[hollow pond]

Wanting an Anticheat is fine. Hell, there should have been one since day one. However, EAC is and has been proven grossly ineffective at stopping the majority of 'bad actors' in plenty of other games, no matter the version.

[umbral reef]

The rules for NSFW have always been the exact same though and always get/got enforced the exact same way.
If you get reported- You get punished.

Doing anything past that is highly unrealistic for VRchat to do unless they plan to hire some poor soul to look at millions of avatars in high detail 💀

[minor rune]

All the devs team had to do is go to modders that have solve some of VRC problems and go "hey, can we copy this? We'll credit you"

[storm musk]

and this is the reason I've put you to block and refuse to acknowledge you any further, good day.

[umbral reef]

Law does not work like that

[frosty berry]

Funny thing is that you could have said exactly the same about mods up to a week ago.

[minor rune]

I'm not looking from a law angle, I'm looking from a community one

[storm musk]

Honestly, Hire the modders, get yourself more hands on the team that understand the SDK and know how to streamline the features

[umbral reef]

Beside that mods had an way to make it a lot harder

[umbral reef]

They have done so over the past year. A large part of the new devs are people who worked on community tools and still actively work on them

[storm musk]

and that's a good thing, a wise step to take

[hollow pond]

ToS ain't a law, it's a contract. One set up by their moderation and legal teams, sure. But is a contract that you agree to. The most they can do is file a civil suit/cease and desist, which doesn't actually make it to say, a federal court, but a civil one. It's not breaking the law, it's breaking a contract.

[umbral reef]

Its also why udon, IK2, Avatar dynamics and OSC are a thing
All really big things for VRchat and its community in large, allowing bigger events, more useability and ect

[open crescent]

It depends on what you do, take a look at Nintendo suing (and winning) people over selling mods for the switch

[umbral reef]

Thats for breaching IP rights wasnt it though?

[hollow pond]

That's still a civil suit. That's not a criminal suit.

[open crescent]

They won millions of dollars tho

[umbral reef]

Companies cant file criminal suits anyway so

[open crescent]

Oof wait, Google "Nintendo Hacker Gary Bowser sentenced to 40 months in Jail" it was not just the money

He got that for "creating and selling devices that host pirated games"

[hollow pond]

So there is a difference between a civil suit and criminal court case. Those charges were over hacking and theft, as well as violation of IP Rights. All crimes and not just something someone is issuing a civil suit over. Those are criminal violations and subject to criminal court. obviously, as he was given 40 months in prison.

But violating a ToS, in and of itself, is not a criminal offense (assumedly, in most countries, I'm not an international lawyer) and could/would be suspect to a possible civil suit.

In the US, you can sue anyone for anything at anytime. God Bless 'Murica. But that doesn't mean you're bringing criminal charges against them. That's a completely different process altogether.

[open crescent]

Well yeah indeed, but that's why I said it depends on what you do.
Some mods were paid, for example

And the pirated server guy well that's the riskiest by far

[umbral reef]

Also people really think VRchat well send a big lawyer firm after someone without making sure they are in the right 💀

[hollow pond]

Violations of ToS are usually pretty cut and dry. It's why they typically have verbiage about when you download as of acknowledgement per this agreement upon agreement etc etc. Unless they somehow didn't violate the ToS by hosting a private server...?

But also, just the threat of a C&D is enough to get most people to back the hell off. Fighting that in court? Scary af.

No one wants to be sued so hard they can't pay back their legal fees (even if they were to somehow win). Because they'd potentially have to countersue to recoop most of the damages, even if the court finds favor with them instead of the company. Paying for that kind of battle can bankrupt a person.

[next saddle]

does anybody know how to fix avatars not being able to use expression or move hands around in vr unless turning safe mode on?

[hollow pond]

Sounds like an issue with dynamic bones...and boy have I got some bad news for you.

[next saddle]

are you talking to me? and if you are is there a way to fix it?

[storm musk]

either dynamic or Physbones

[hollow pond]

^
Well...there was an easy fix for that but that no longer is possible.

The harder fix is going into Unity or whatever modeling program you used to set up your bones and reactions and seeing what's tied to where and seeing if you can properly set them correctly. Same thing with expressions being tied to your individual button combos. There used to be a much easier fix but now you're going to have to do it manually.

[next saddle]

what....... I play on quest not pc

[hollow pond]

Then you're SoL, my dude. I've no clue.

[open crescent]

Make sure you didn't disable expressions, it happens often

[storm musk]

do you have emoting disabled from your ingame menu?

[hollow pond]

^These guys know their quest stuff. I just make models badly and do funny voices for fun.

[vocal shard]

annnd people talk about the NSFW stuff again in gen-1

[next saddle]

ill have to check both of those

[storm musk]

eugh

[next saddle]

its just weird, i cant use expressions and im out of the avatars body. and when i turn safe mode on it goes back to normal but then i cant talk to anyone

[storm musk]

That

[hollow pond]

Huh...

[storm musk]

hmm, I'm not 100% certain on that one chief

[short wasp]

so i read something concerning that i’m not sure is a rumor or not. while crashing is still an issue avatar ripping is said to still be a very real problem, mainly because in a lot of cases supposedly don’t even use mods to do this. i’m not asking for a dev/mod opinion on this because they’ll be biased towards the platform they serve but is this true?

[hollow pond]

https://tenor.com/view/elmo-sesame-street-shrug-idk-i-have-no-idea-gif-17243185

[storm musk]

I know there are websites hosted that display ripped content, but most of them are sketch af, and I've seen some people buy an avatar from gumroad then make it public
I by no means support rippers.

[hollow pond]

Ripping without a program? You'd have to find a way to, first, download the entire avatar file, including all the code for bones, the meshes, all the polygons, etc etc etc. Then you'd have to also have a way to convert that raw data into something usable...And that's before basically having to reconstruct the avatar from the ground up anyway...So no?

You'd be better off trying to make it from memory.

[short wasp]

okay, i’m glad to hear that.

[storm musk]

so, improbable but not 100% impossible??

[hollow pond]

Pretty much. If I liked an avatar that much, I'd just recreate something similar, ask to buy it, or ask for a clone.

[short wasp]

i’m only a part of a discord for a known ripping website so that i could get my avatars blacklisted from that site but unfortunately, in spite of what mods and admins have said, ripping is still very much a problem. i wish those sites could get taken down.

[hollow pond]

The above is way too much damn effort when a simple ask can usually net you an avatar easier.

[short wasp]

i agree. asking is the better option.

[ocean elm]

Bro my VRChat don't work, anyone else's too?

[meager solstice]

whats wrong with it?

[hollow grove]

You never needed a program to rip avis besides a unity script

[thorny nacelle]

Help, it's 40°c outside i'm dying 💀

[umbral reef]

I recommend crawling inside the freezer and surviving there

[open crescent]

I just got my electricity bill

I will die from the shock of electricity prices in the summer

[viscid crown]

How do I install the easy anti cheat

[thorny nacelle]

You don't have too, it's automatic

[visual lintel]

bro i was supposed to get unbanned at 3 this morning and now it's been moved to the 4th? would someone care to explain?

[full sail]

Good morning all~

[cold shore]

46 for me :)

[thorny nacelle]

Oh damn, where are you from?

[full sail]

Roughly 40.5 here. Yesterday was the first time it dropped below 40 in a month

[lyric eagle]

is this why people are up in arms again?

[verbal ocean]

add eac to ban mods
send c&d to private servers
(false) rumors that they'll target nsfw content next as it's in the exact same situation as mods were prior to eac being introduced

people got a couple reasons

[umbral reef]

^ and the msgs for the c&d made some people think they got the letter for not the private server stuff but all mods what just ain't true

[ruby needle]

^
#vrchat-general-1 message

[lyric eagle]

@verbal ocean @umbral reef I know about all the EAC shit but... Yeah ofc someone dumb enough to make a carbon copy of VRChat is gonna get a C&D for intellectual property theft. Fuckin morons...

@ruby needle ty for the link!

[verbal ocean]

The issue people have is that it's not a carbon copy, it's backend emulation that older versions of the vrc client can connect to

Understandable the action they took based on tupper's response, but still not a fan personally

[lyric eagle]

regardless, the name of it is the "VRC Private server project." That's using VRChat's own copyrighted intellectual property against VRChat.

[umbral reef]

So you really saying Tupper is straight up lying?

[lyric eagle]

id be willing to bet you a good amount of money that if the project were named something else, action wouldn't have been taken

[umbral reef]

Copying vrchats for 99% and having that 1 be new is still an carbon copy pmuch

[lyric eagle]

so they're emulating VRChat's software? sounds like intellectual property theft to me...

[umbral reef]

Protecting all IP stuff is important, not just the name

[lyric eagle]

wasnt aware that it emulated software until the message was edited

[verbal ocean]

Not at all what I said. Tupper is 100% correct in what he said, the IP is used in the name, but the backend is physically impossible to create a carbon copy of. It's not open source.
You can look at similar things in the case of FFXI and GTAV private servers. They don't get taken down for a number of reasons, most importantly that they don't actively use the game's name (FiveM, EdenXI, etc for other games)

[ruby needle]

They don't get taken down cus they do not represent the actual GTAV multiplayer part

[umbral reef]

Fairly sure both platforms also allow there front end stuff to be used in these cases while vrchat also doesn't..

[ruby needle]

The moment they do they'll be sued into oblivion.

[verbal ocean]

Except that they do.
FiveM actively allows for a customized multiplayer server, that's exactly what it does.
It's used for things like GTA 5 RP, but it's not just for that.

At the end of the day, as Disko had said, had they not used the name "VRChat Private Server Project" and called it something like, idk, "PrivateVR"
They'd have been fine

[ruby needle]

It still works different from the normal GTA V Multiplayer, they also are not permitted to use the up to date patches. (afaik always 1 behind)

[tender trench]

I heard the main character of the new gta is going to be Vin Deisel and the main Enemy is going to be Dominic Toretto.

[lyric eagle]

Im not familiar with GTA V private RP lobbies, but do they get permission from Rockstar/GTA Devs to go private before doing so?

I feel like having permission versus doing so without permission could also warrant legal action

[verbal ocean]

@ruby needle
VRCPSP also was not permitted to use up to date patches. The whole idea was to allow mods by running out of date versions of the game
Just like FiveM, it'd function differently than official VRC servers
They are identical to one another, but for different games

@lyric eagle
Not afaik, in fact a C&D went out to the FiveM team a few years ago iirc, which they rescinded after, funnily enough, less backlash than the VRC community has shown

[ruby needle]

There is a major difference with the platform making a framework to go by for making things then a creator saying "i won't do x then it should be fine"

[lyric eagle]

im sure the FiveM team and their content is responsible for a lot of GTA V content on streaming and content platforms tbf. On the other hand, this update has caused more recognition to VRChat if anything. any recognition is better than none.

[ruby needle]

It's the same for clients that gave VRC+ extra features.
It's a good intend and nice thought, but is in absolutely zero way a permission from VRChat's end and remains just as punishable.

[reef bluff]

Why do people need more than 10

I just use like a cycle of 5 zhongli avatars and that’s it lol

[honest valley]

just call it the zhondong

[reef bluff]

Hey! Not a single one has one

[verbal ocean]

Ehhh I wouldn't say 13% overwhelmingly negative is good recognition to get, especially when VRC was already getting plenty of natural attention from streamers and the like

Also while true @ruby needle, I point back to again, FFXI private servers, a subscription based game that private servers avoid all together
I should again mention before saying, as much as I'm against VRC's decision, I firmly acknowledge they are 100% in the right.
SE could easily throw a C&D to any FFXI private server, and would win in a heartbeat. This can be seen with WoW private servers which Bliz has a bigger incentive to dropkick off the earth given it's still going
but FFXI private server's do SE's job of preserving the game, they don't have to turn it single player.
Similarly, at least imo, VRCPSP does VRC's job of separating modders and vanilla players without harming the other in any real way, especially when the modding community actively went out of their way to try and keep things as tame as possible outside a number of bad actors
I just don't see what good sending the C&D does for VRC, I guess it's lost potential profits from VRC+, but at that point users of those private servers will just go elsewhere, rather than inflating the VRC player count on steam
For that matter, I don't see what good any of VRC's recent decisions do for the platform

[ruby needle]

As for teh C&D, please do not forget the additional factors.
#vrchat-general-1 message

[hollow grove]

So another example of allowing people to make, stress test, and bug fix things that people want, with zero effort on vrchats part so they can do other things, then when something changes, axe them all - then reverse engineer the mod. Loud and clear. Such an excellent company.

In a sort of diabolical way I kind of respect it.

[verbal ocean]

Bypassing security was, at least afaik, using an older version of the client to avoid EAC
The two main points of "copyright" which I can only assume is the use of the VRChat name, and what seems to be describing blackmail, are all I can really gather that were provoking the move
Which
Yeah, that sucks, but unless it was a 1 person team which I'm doubtful that it was, shooting the whole project just seems like taking a cannon to an ant

edit: Could argue running the any version of the client on unofficial servers bypasses security measures anyways but I feel like that's not really the point of the move

[wet tulip]

It would be better for vrc if they removed the entire update and risked being taken down on quest. Quest users are leaving because of the recent avatar reduction, and PC users are leaving because of EAC and Poor performance due to EAC. It be better to loose the quest vrc+ people than to get rid of almost everyone who has tried to make their mods help support vrc and the people in it. they are loosing more money than they would if they didn't add EAC.
*I posted this here because the cooldown is broken for me in general 1 *

[full sail]

Oh dear, the chill is warming

[earnest chasm]

Any recognition - including the type that make new users looking for an ADULT friendly platform do a complete 360 away from it.

[wet tulip]

the only recognition is getting more people to not play it

the slow mode is broken in general 1

[earnest chasm]

They're not going to change anything, kids dominate the platform more than anything else at this point, and thats gonna be what keeps them afloat.

[bold sable]

avatar reduction?

[wet tulip]

why would they survive off people who aren't old enough to be playing the game? the minimum age is 13 and half the kids on vrc are below that.

[bold sable]

a lot of thing floats on the grey line

and they survive off things on the grey line

there’s a lot of underage people in rec room as well, but they’re the people keeping rr alive

[wet tulip]

they brought down the recent avatars from 99 to 25. kind of fucked up that they would add something that they knew would drive away people, then add something that makes people more likely to give them money for vrc+.

[wet tulip]

Vrc was a behemoth compared to rec room until they did what they are doing now

[bold sable]

false

vrc and rec room are just both social games but with different communities
rr obviously has more children and vrc has more teens & adults

the size is honestly pretty similar

[wet tulip]

and vrc is driving away the teens and adults and turning into rec room

[bold sable]

rec room has more developed game creating… system or whatever i call it
while vrc survives off it’s avatars

[earnest chasm]

because they all use mommys and daddys money, and mommy and daddy wont care if nsfw is gone and theres nothing to touch their "pure" game

[bold sable]

rec room just has a shit bunch of clones
you’d see 3 people with identical avatars walking around

[bold sable]

i’m not good at comprehending things but how is this related

[earnest chasm]

thats how vrc stays afloat. thats the income, kids using their parent money who dont facilitate games for them .

[bold sable]

the nsfw stuff?

[wet tulip]

and they have reduced the recent avatars, and put in an anti cheat that isn't necessary in a game like vrc. rec room has it because it has mostly games. vrc has no use for it.

[polar latch]

Who ever made the word "Agender" is a fucking idiot. If it means the absence of gender, then why are you making it a gender in it of itself???

[earnest chasm]

Adults are leaving because this use to be a nice ADULT escape, but now its catering to children. so ofc the people who dont want to be involved with minors, or who are losing a major asset in the game they played, are bouncing.

[bold sable]

they’ll come back knowing there’s simply no alternatives

[earnest chasm]

did you forget the actually modder we all left for literally works for chill vr now? Dont even mentioned the fact they have resources now.

[bold sable]

they’ll still come back knowing that chill vr is no match to vrchat

[earnest chasm]

i mean i personally blocked every minor and child.

Also ive bene on chill vr. its literally the same things. but you can have boobies.

[bold sable]

just look at the player count
quest players aren’t even included

[earnest chasm]

im on quest and play, i cable link.

[bold sable]

no offense but that’s fucking disgusting
why are people disrespecting minors so much for no apparent reason

[bold sable]

pcvr quest users are counted into steam users are you ok

[earnest chasm]

bc i have nothing to do with a minor? its gross people romanticize friendships with children. There is nothing i need from a child. i play games to get away from mine. so no, i dont want to "relax" with more children.

[zinc gorge]

Is it not possible to open 2 vrchat clients at the same time any more? When I try to launch a second client it fails because it tries load eac again.

[wet tulip]

those kids are annoying. it makes sense when you are trying to talk to someone and some 9yro starts trying to do annoying shit

[bold sable]

that doesn’t make up for anyone to instant mute minors
that’s just being disrespectful

[earnest chasm]

i mean yall enjoy your minor friends. its weird you can't make friends your age to the point you have to defend having children as friends so desperately.

[bold sable]

one big issues of vrc is that some people are pretty much elitists and refuses to communicate with minors

[earnest chasm]

I dont gaf about a child being on my lewd anime game. you damn right.

[wet tulip]

anyone under 13 I mute and/or block.

[earnest chasm]

anyone under 18 i mute/block.

[full ruin]

Lmao no it’s not. It’s called not wanting to deal with annoying little shits

[bold sable]

or it’s simply being fucking disrespectful and mute people on sight

[earnest chasm]

thats why i dont speak to them at all. imagine adults actually wanting to associate with children. same argument.

[wet tulip]

I do it for people under 13 because thats the minimum age for vrc. if they are younger, I dont want to interact with them.

[full ruin]

“Oh no my feefees some adult muted me, a child :(((“ idc

[bold sable]

you’re understandable but he’s being straight up disrespectful

[earnest chasm]

but if you're over 18 and wanna be friends with a minor. glws.

lol people actually defending wanting to associate with kids anyway they can . oof

[shell spindle]

What is going on here

[full ruin]

Exactly. Seems sus to me

[bold sable]

“fuck off with the toxicity”

[earnest chasm]

like right? lmao the adult that are so pressed over other adults not wanting to associate with minors. why are you trying to normalize it so much?

[wet tulip]

I dont, I just want to deal with people that are 5 and that are always annoying.

[bold sable]

“sus”
socialising with a person doesn’t directly mean that you have sexual thoughts to them

[earnest chasm]

MOOD. @bold sable nah but the way you defending wanting to be friendly to kids is.

[full ruin]

I’m not a babysitter so I don’t interact with children on a game I go on to chill bc children give me a headache.

[bold sable]

he’s still consisting that he’s not an elitist… how strange

[shell spindle]

Uh

[wet tulip]

"Oh shit! I said hello to a minor! I can't believe im a pedophile"

[earnest chasm]

this, im a mom, so im not going on a stupid game to play with kids lmao .

[bold sable]

what makes you block kids on sight if they didn’t do shit

[earnest chasm]

yes, because i dont care to listen or associate with them imagine.

[bold sable]

then you’re straight up being disrespectful

[full ruin]

Probably their high pitched voices, weird ass thoughts and opinions, and general tomfoolery

[earnest chasm]

id rather be disrespectful than a predator .

[wet tulip]

I say hello to people that I meet. does that mean I'm a pedophile?

[bold sable]

“if they didn’t do shit”
minors can be completely mature and not do dumb shit

[full ruin]

Mmmmm no. I’ve never met a “mature” minor

[earnest chasm]

i mean idc what you do, but dont get offended adults like to block kids. im think you're weird if you keep minors on your FL as an adult unless you're like 18.

[bold sable]

or perhaps you’ve never realised the person you’re talking to is a minor?

[earnest chasm]

nah. we are smart, we ask ages dummy. to avoid weird conversation or to influence anyone.

at that part if they lie

[wet tulip]

that makes sense, i block people under 13 because its 1, against the community guidlines, and 2, once they become about 14, they stop being annoying little shits. (That doesnt mean i like minors dont you twist my words

[bold sable]

so what you’re saying is
you ask age before socialising
then how come you guys have never met a mature minor if you refuse to socialise with any

[full ruin]

No I can definitely tell. The prepubescent voices/voice cracking, talking about school/teachers/other things I can no longer relate to, reading their bios. If they lie to me and I say something “inappropriate” aka ab an adult topic that’s on them

[bold sable]

minor is ones below 18, not below 13
deep voice isn’t a privilege to adults

[earnest chasm]

bc i dont care to be friends with a "mature" minor. Yknow the 23 year old dude that use to diddle me at 13 use to call me a mature minor. lmao . anyone that uses that term is sick .

[full ruin]

Excuse me for not wanting to associate with children/high schoolers when I’m in college and can no longer relate to them.

[bold sable]

it’s fucking stupid you guys directly relate high pitched voice to minors

[umbral reef]

Behavior stuff over a longer time often does give it away too. Not fool proof but they ain't banning peoplez just blocking peeps they don't like

[earnest chasm]

like right? adults are so pressed we dont like children xD

[bold sable]

we don’t like children
i’m a mom

[floral spoke]

being friends with a minor isnt inherently sus unless youre trying to have weird convos with em

[full ruin]

What’s actually stupid is you trying to force people to interact with children when they don’t want to bc it’s “disrespectful”

[earnest chasm]

i dont have to like OTHER children to liek my own.

[bold sable]

no ones forcing you, i’m just disgusted how you guys block them on sight because they’re a minor

[wet tulip]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/732088880303702086/1002275296134836274/Made_BY_CoastSilly_The_Betrayed_Trim.mp4 Im tired of this conversation so take this and goodbye.

[earnest chasm]

even then, im not a very motherly person. my spouse who is a female wanted children.

[full ruin]

Lmao if you aren’t trying to force people then what tf are u arguing

[bold sable]

openly expressing my opinion and convincing you guys to not fucking do that.

[earnest chasm]

im disgusted you're disgusted bc you like to call minors mature to validate your friendships with them. My groomer did too.

[earnest chasm]

tyring to convince me to interact with minors? im good, is this some weird pedo conversion ?

[bold sable]

interacting equal grooming
your logic of thinking is weirder than my 12 yo brother

what you’re saying is any mother interacting with their children is essentially grooming them

even if you don’t mean it, that’s exactly the logic you’re using right now

[full ruin]

The bottom line is that I’m not a babysitter or sister or mother

[earnest chasm]

nah what im saying is a grown adult on the internet with no relation to the minor they're trying to befriend is freaking weird.

[bold sable]

what is weird about interacting with children online as an adult.

[hollow grove]

..uh

[earnest chasm]

repeat your statement. but slower.

[bold sable]

neither of you actually elaborated what’s wrong with it

[merry pivot]

@bold sable I see what you’re saying, but execution is poor. You should stop where you are before you scuff yourself up further.

[bronze bough]

Damn I came at a weird time lmao

[floral spoke]

if youre seeking out minors thats weird, but if youre having a convo with one and then they tell you their underage then its whatever

[earnest chasm]

lmao im just letting him bury himself at this point. I enjoy him elaborating .

[merry pivot]

Yeah the self-burial hole is pretty fucking deep right now

[vocal shard]

if ur purposely trying to talk with children when you like 25 you’re fucking weird 😭😭

[bold sable]

it’s really funny seeing one having extreme bane towards minors and still thinks she’s in the right

[floral spoke]

lmaoo

[hollow grove]

🍿

[full ruin]

Exactly. @bold sable thinks otherwise

[bold sable]

if not purposely?

[vocal shard]

talking with a minor isn’t weird, it’s purposely seeking a child out

[bronze bough]

Is this a conversation to have in a general chat? Just wondering lmao

[earnest chasm]

Yes, i am in the right. bc its my game. my pc and my experience. so im allowed to block whoever i wnat. including the minors and as you called it the "mature minors" out of my experience.

[hollow grove]

They mean if you are specifically seeking out kids, its kinda shady

[bold sable]

the entire convo has went to the other side
purposely interacting with children and interacting with minors are a whole different world

[merry pivot]

No one is obligated to talk to people they don’t want to associate with. Interaction with minors isn’t bad but justifying the concept of it has its own negative connotation (see; pedophilia).

[full ruin]

Imagine trying to police who people interact with on their own game

[earnest chasm]

literally. lmao

[vocal shard]

Talking with someone underage isnt weird, its seeking underage people out that is

[hollow grove]

Wait... children and minors are different to you? How?

[bold sable]

they’re saying the first one is weird

[full ruin]

You literally said it was “disgusting and “disrespectful” that people block minors

[earnest chasm]

yeah lmao , that

[merry pivot]

[bold sable]

children more likely refers to those whos around 13 or younger

[bronze bough]

I personally can’t handle children well if they really annoying exhibit A is I have really annoying little cousins

[earnest chasm]

minors and children to me are anyone under the age of 18.

[bold sable]

block minors on sight, that’s an important point

[hollow grove]

I don't want to talk to screeching children quest users who want to touch my avatar or take pictures of while giggling into their open mic - sorry if that....disgusts...anyone?

[earnest chasm]

its weird if you dont think a 13 year old is a child. and yes, on sight. theres no reason for me to associate with them. period.

[bronze bough]

Kid is anyone 5 plus years younger than me 😂

[vocal shard]

thats kinda a weird stand point ig? 😭 idk

[bold sable]

if you block them after interacting with them and think they’re annoying, yeah that’s fine
but if you decide to block them before they did anything, that’s straight up disrespectful

[full ruin]

I’ll leave all minors unblocked and talk about adult topics around them unfiltered even though it may be damaging to them instead of blocking them out right and not letting them hear me.

[earnest chasm]

big freaking mood. like lmao, an adult so pressed that we dont want that experience.

[bronze bough]

And I’m 20 about to be 21

[earnest chasm]

B I N G O lmao like is that what we should do ? ???

[full sail]

I remember doing something kinda-afk in my vr settings and a kid coming into the world being the absolute stereotypical meme of quoting anime fights and hovering until I politely excused myself x.x

[bold sable]

i’m pretty sure you’re blocking them for the sake of yourself and not protecting them

[hollow grove]

I think the children should stick to the playground - thats just me, if they want to annoy eachother fine, its their peers, let me play with my peers..

[earnest chasm]

yes, bc freak them kids.

[full ruin]

It can be both. The two are not mutually exclusive

[bronze bough]

Nah I feel you on that bro I hate kids that just screech into their mics or just people that blast music into their mics in general

[earnest chasm]

@bold sable Sako, why are you so adamant on trying to keep adults interacting with children?

[bronze bough]

Yeah

[earnest chasm]

wrong tag paps

[merry pivot]

@bold sable you tool, there are adult topics that adults discuss which minors shouldn’t be exposed to. Perhaps I should talk about spicy RP or my recent drinking night around a group of minors, cuz that’s fine to you? Don’t block them cuz I shouldn’t?

[bold sable]

because there’s nothing wrong with it?
it’s understandable if you block them because they’re annoying again, but why would you block them before they did anything harmful

[vocal shard]

Why not? 🤔

[earnest chasm]

okay so i should just let them listen to the conversation im having with my friends about drugs and raves?

[hollow grove]

Because what do I hope to actually get out of a conversation with an 8 year old? Absolutely nothing

[bold sable]

@merry pivot i said this before

[merry pivot]

This

[vocal shard]

I block people who seem annoying even though ive never talked to them before

[bronze bough]

Big facts like- hold that thought I don’t wanna get banned lmao

[earnest chasm]

if you're the type who wants them exposed to that then you're the weird one, again.

[floral spoke]

im almost 19 so if i talk to a 16 year old, does that make me a pedo?

[hollow grove]

Listen... I'm not a bigot but... Everytime I see a brush avatar, I just assume it is going to say something stupid.

[white bobcat]

Based blocker of minors

[earnest chasm]

i mean if its intimate yeah.

[bold sable]

what they’re saying is yes

[short plinth]

Or just go to private adult only events held by clubs...

[floral spoke]

no intimacy, just hangin out

[bronze bough]

But clubs are noisy with music no?

[full ruin]

Genuine question: why would you want to hang out with a child

[earnest chasm]

you're not even 18 yet? then you should be fine

[short plinth]

Some are i guess, the ones im in are nice and calm

[bold sable]

why wouldn’t you

[vocal shard]

bro 💀

[earnest chasm]

THERE it is, he loves to hang with children. ew. after all the resons we gave WHY NOT

[bold sable]

children are often funnier than adults in vr
that’s already a good reason

[full ruin]

??????? what. As an adult you shouldn’t want to hang out with kids wtf

[bronze bough]

Idk tbh I’ve met some kids on vr around 15 years of age and they’re just like my vr sons lol

[earnest chasm]

THERE IT IS. lmaooo. the grooming has always been rampant on this game though.

[floral spoke]

because theyre a cool and chill person. i try not to discriminate but its not like im trying to get with em 🤷🏻‍♀️

[vocal shard]

😧 idek what to say anymore

[earnest chasm]

i tried to tell yall, but nah im the weird one self projecting apparently. nahhhh @bold sable thats you bud.

[cyan falcon]

Because some of us need to protect the younger ones from gross people.

[bronze bough]

I literally have like a whole vr family group

[earnest chasm]

i do too but theyre all over the age of 18

[full ruin]

Personally I’m not anybodys mommy, babysitter, or even sister. Like I can interact with a minor cordially but I don’t want to be FRIENDS with one.

[cyan falcon]

Because we also need to protect them from gross fs-

[royal sable]

SAme.

[bronze bough]

Mine is all ages ranging from like 23 to 15 I think

[earnest chasm]

THIS .

[floral spoke]

frfr

[full ruin]

Look protecting minors in vrchat is the staff’s responsibility.

[short plinth]

I go out of my way to avoid kids and thats led to me really only playing the game at private 18+ clubs or events. Im tired of dealing with children and having to watch my wording and what im talking about

[bronze bough]

We don’t do nothing bad we just play games and watch movies and shows and stuff

[earnest chasm]

lol @bold sable whered you go bud? i cant seem to hear you from that hole you dug.

[floral spoke]

staff aint doin shit

[bold sable]

i turned out it’d be better to let it rest knowing that i’m at the disadvantage

[earnest chasm]

Staff only doing what gives them big investors money.

[merry pivot]

Got some closeted pedos here

[bronze bough]

Idk if I should say this so I’m not

[full ruin]

They should be. It shouldn’t be up to the userbase/on random people to protect kids

[earnest chasm]

bc you admitted you LIKED talking to kids and having them as friends, and enjoy it more so than adults.

[drowsy terrace]

Honestly, it should just be an option. Maybe some people under 18 are OK, but there is a huge amount of them that are just running around shrieking and dropping n bombs in public lobbies. If I could press a button and block everyone under 18, I'd do it just so I could hang out in a public again without it being a test of how fast I get annoyed with somebody's shrieking ill behaved child using a quest as a babysitter.

[bronze bough]

Who me?

[floral spoke]

exactly, but thats just how it is i suppose

[full ruin]

Amen

[earnest chasm]

there was this 23 year old dating this 16 year old, and I blkokced her dude got so pressed and simpy he blocked me for blokcing a minor.

[bold sable]

you’re still thinking interacting with minors equal having sexual thoughts to them
that’s simply weird

[earnest chasm]

Nah i think the things you stated about them in this convo is weird actually. everything you said yourself, has been weird.

[merry pivot]

If you thought you were mentioned… you may be one…

[bronze bough]

Also some people under the age of 18 can be like so much mature than their age group

[short plinth]

Wait, people get upset at you simply blocking others?

[full ruin]

Like I’ll be nice to the minor that approaches me but I’m not going to hold a conversation with them bc I don’t want to. @bold sable is saying that I’m “disgusting” and “disrespectful” for being that way

[bronze bough]

True me kid, I ain’t

[short plinth]

Dude the block feature is the shit, especially in public worlds

[bronze bough]

Real talk, if I was I’d probably be in prison a long time ago

[bold sable]

yeah i’ll let it rest
i’ll just let these “mature adults” keep on blasting me for no apparent reason but probably that slight ego boost

[earnest chasm]

yeah yeah go play with your "mature minors"

[bold sable]

again, unfortunate to tell you they do exist

[bronze bough]

Lol the internet is so toxic

[earnest chasm]

you hvae mature minor friends you like to mess with?

[full ruin]

LMAOOO no good reason when u admitted to enjoying being friends with literal children over being friends with adults and called people disgusting and disrespectful for playing a GAME how they want to

[earnest chasm]

he just wants to diddle children without looking weird shhhh

[bold sable]

what’s wrong with being friends with children and how does interacting with children directly relate to pedophilia

[floral spoke]

💀

one of the worst takes ive read today

[earnest chasm]

It doesnt, but the way you're acting, fighting for it, and the things you've said, are so much more than basic friendship. including calling them "mature minors" only ever heard that term from a groomer.

[bold sable]

no one has answered me how does interacting with children directly relate to pedophilia just yet

the fact that i protect the minor community equals that i’m a pedophile, that’s a nice logic

[bronze bough]

Hey you wanna know why I personally don’t like kids? I was playing echo vr the other day and these kids put their crotch in peoples faces even mine 🤮and proceeded to do a thrusting motions

[full ruin]

As an adult you can’t “be friends” with a child like you can with an adult without it being weird. Like if ur talking about sex, drugs, alcohol around minors purposefully ur mad weird for it.

[full sail]

Gen2 lookin gen1 sus today.

[earnest chasm]

No, you're upset with people who block minors to protect them from the darker side of the community. so can't say that.

[bronze bough]

That why I don’t like kids one bad apple ruins the batch

[bold sable]

again, you’re blocking them for the sake of your own self and not protecting them
i can tell that you’re a pretty self centred person by this convo

[pure sun]

[earnest chasm]

Lol i rather be self-centered than a groomer like you.

[floral spoke]

mk this convo is just a dumpster fire at this point lmao, im done trying to back either side

[bold sable]

again, how am i a groomer, any proof you have?

[honest ridge]

Earlier today, VRChat submitted a cease and desist to the creator of the VRC Private Server project. We estimate that this letter was written by a high-tier law firm, and probably cost about $10k+. VRChat is on the war path against modders, and that’s not something wanted to be mess with.

[earnest chasm]

go back and read everything you typed. admitted it yourself.

[bold sable]

and no, the way i protect the minor community isn’t a hard proof i’m a groomer

[earnest chasm]

nah you advocate enough for yourself xD

[honest ridge]

Ripp

[bold sable]

are you going to say that and not elaborate how i backstabbed myself

[earnest chasm]

He said earlier he prefers children to adults on vrc. "why wouldnt you WANT to interact with children"

[pure sun]

adults who intentionally hang out with minors in the VR space for the sake of protecc? what did i just read lol

[earnest chasm]

Like this lmao .

Hes literally saying hes a martyr for hanging our with kiddos to protect them when in reality he just enjoys it and hes trying to defend it

[bold sable]

that’s a bad expression, not a direct proof

[earnest chasm]

ok

[pure sun]

closet pedos and groomers, I can't believe how casual they came out with it lol

[earnest chasm]

right?

[full sail]

Hot take: banana pudding without nilla wafers isn't as good

[bold sable]

by any chance am i not an adult myself lol

[brazen ruin]

I heard there were war crimes in this sever where they at

[earnest chasm]

so are you a child who thinks this is okay bc you have an adult friend grooming you ?

[bold sable]

what other chances can it be if i’m trying so hard to protect minors yet not a pedophile

[bronze bough]

Well on vr chat especially, you can run into some innocent smol beans so and there are not so innocent parts of vrchat and some of its “people” dare I name them trolls and rude people just to get laughs

[bold sable]

how does that relate lmao

[earnest chasm]

you said what if you arent an adult? are you an adult or not?

[bold sable]

yeah i give up just figure it out yourself

[floral spoke]

this this this

[earnest chasm]

are you the child talking to the adult, or are you the adult talking to the child. lmao. but ima go with you're the adult messing with kids.

[full ruin]

Lmao he won’t admit he’s an adult bc it makes him look weird

[bronze bough]

Damn y’all still going back and forth lmao why don’t you just kiss and make up

[cyan falcon]

facts

[bold sable]

or am i literally neither and i’m being framed as one of them?

[pure sun]

oh im aware of certain spaces on VRC and the creepy factor of the internet, as i've been on it since dial up modems, im just pointing out what this dude said to casually defend his stance on being a closet groomer is all XD

[cyan falcon]

Sir/Mam you know you are a duck.

[full ruin]

There is no neither. You’re either a minor or not (an adult)

[floral spoke]

dipping vanilla wafers in banana pudding just hits different

[earnest chasm]

You admitted yourself you were so, can't back track now when everyone saw it.

[full sail]

Mood~

[bronze bough]

Oh my fault I didn’t understand the closeted groomer part lmao

[cyan falcon]

I want vanilla pudding...or ice cream now...fing thanks lmao

[bold sable]

i’m pretty bad at expressing you can tell
they’ll just keep saying i’m a pedophile but that’s what they think anyways

[earnest chasm]

lmaooo i dont care about winning, i hate adults who try and say interacting with kids is okay and then end up like this. this is exactly why i block children.

[floral spoke]

i want some cherry pie ffs

[bold sable]

the truth is there, believe it or keep thinking what you’re thinking

[tame echo]

Yo what happened

[pure sun]

did you not just say you hang out with children to "protect" them and prefer hanging out with children then adults? lol

[earnest chasm]

^

[floral spoke]

people arguing

[full ruin]

@bold sable said that people who block kids are “disgusting” and “disrespectful”

[bronze bough]

Some peeps just beefing 🥩

[cyan falcon]

I have tried cherries...and a pie crust...but no crust to put ontop >:

[bold sable]

i didn’t say that actually
at least i didn’t intentionally say that

[bold sable]

rewording that,
people who block kids on sight without them doing anything wrong is horrible

[earnest chasm]

you definitely typed itall out.

[floral spoke]

dont need top crust

[pure sun]

i block kids, because im an adult, and only hang out with adults. having kids on my friends list and my age, would look really really bad lol

[tame echo]

Bro what 💀💀💀. That is the stupidest thing I’ve heard today lmao. Some of us just don’t want to deal with kids what’s so bad abt that

[full ruin]

Lmao keep trying to make it out that people playing a game how they want are the villains here

[cyan falcon]

But I dooo....>:

[earnest chasm]

lol thats exactly what you said earlier. sorry if blocking kids to keep them from hearing my adult conversations is disgusting. The fact you want them even exposed to that. so they can become the "mature minors" you keep talking about?

[full ruin]

Apparently we’re just supposed to tolerate the screeching and yelling bc it will hurt their feefees

[floral spoke]

its not horrible, people can block who they want. is it a little unfair? sure, but ultimately its their game and they can play it how they want

[drowsy terrace]

no it isn't horrible, it is people tending to their own experiences, and many people don't want to hang out with children. You don't need a reason to block a person at all, every user is allowed to use the block button to make sure their experience isn't ruined by what they don't like

[bold sable]

first, i never said that kids should be exposed to inappropriate topics
as i said, you’re pretty much clear that you’re self centred enough to not think for the kids, you’re blocking them for the sake of yourself

[full ruin]

And what’s wrong with blocking bc you don’t want your experience to be sullied by kids being kids

[pure sun]

you want to create "mature minors" ? wtf, big yikes sako lol

[bronze bough]

True you did never say that

[earnest chasm]

You think its disgusting for adults to block minors immediately though? so why do you continue to contradict yourself?

[tame echo]

Yiiikesss

[bold sable]

blocking anyone on sight is just being socially disrespectful lmao

[honest bane]

Nah, fuck them kids

[full ruin]

This man loves that one song by oingo boingo unironically

[earnest chasm]

nah blocking children on site is respectful to THEIR PARENTS because you're not exposing them to things that are sick .

[bold sable]

i’m not saying it the third time?

[tribal topaz]

what's going on in here??

[tame echo]

FR. I’ve seen kids under 13 on vrc. Like what parent would even let their kid do that oml

[earnest chasm]

nah keep saying how much you love kids, its entertaining.

[full ruin]

@bold sable likes kids in a weird way

[bronze bough]

Me personally I just ignore children I resort to blocking when they be in my face or too noisy

[bold sable]

also if you treat vrchat more important than your life
why the fuck are you talking about nsfw stuff in public

[pure sun]

we block kids for a number of reasons, usually its an age gap thing, maturity, and the adult nature of adult oriented conversations. id rather block them, its easier, and it separates my experience from their world and mine. sometimes im drinking with friends and talking about mature stuff. why would you want to expose children to that? lol

[earnest chasm]

parents who dont care. so that why adults in the community like me block them, so expose them less .and also for our own sanity and experience.

[cyan falcon]

What about pudding in general?

[bold sable]

there we go, he’s framing me again
do what makes you happy

[honest bane]

Because I'm an adult talking to other adults

[floral spoke]

parents who want to let technology raise their kids instead of doing their job as a parent

[tribal topaz]

where does he say that

[full ruin]

Don’t get him started on maturity he’ll mention the “mature minors”

Also @bold sable refer to me by proper pronouns or not at all thanks

[earnest chasm]

You stated it yourself, its in this chat, you've stated it over and over and over. YOU did it to yourself.

[tame echo]

Same here! I’m 18 so I’m barely an adult but I do the same thing, especially when it’s VERY young kids

[bold sable]

if you know there’s kids present in the place?
you wouldn’t talk about that stuff in a playground just because there’s an adult you’re talking to

[bronze bough]

I hate to say it y’all but I’m switching team y’all kinda raining bullets on sako and now this ain’t right

[honest bane]

Yeah, so I block them lmao

[drowsy terrace]

I don't need to be talking about NSFW stuff to want to block children. I don't come to VR to hang out with shrieking goblins dropping n bombs who need a proper babysitter. Nothing to do with NSFW, just don't need a squeaking racist brush head ruining my social time.

[pure sun]

creating "mature minors" threw up some serious red flags with this dude lol

[tame echo]

Parents who do that disgust me tbh

[full ruin]

It’s just his vibe from everything he’s said. It’s weird that he prefers being friends with kids over adults as he stated himself

[bronze bough]

It went from a more civil dispute to this…

[bold sable]

i’m bad at expressing, some other guy said so, but i never mentioned that because i know it’s not gonna change shit at this point

[cyan falcon]

Do you like strawberries?

[earnest chasm]

the difference between a vr game and rl, is you can block kids on one. trust if i could block kids irl i would.

[pure sun]

i dont go to playgrounds, because you know, im an adult, and that is where kids play. i do believe they have a term for grown men who go to playground and talk to kids lol

[earnest chasm]

on a vr game you're CHOOSING to interact with those kids. let that sink in.

[bronze bough]

Waht yes

[full sail]

Strawberries are super good for smoothies. sans the straining seeds after blending x.x

[earnest chasm]

thank you this.

[void hazel]

W, I hate kids, and don't care about how they feel ||(nice troll btw)||

[bold sable]

as i said, i’m not an adult myself so i don’t know how am i even framed as a pedophile

@shy spoke who the fuck named it this thing lmao

[earnest chasm]

then if you're not an adult are you being groomed by one and thats why you think its okay?

[cyan falcon]

I forgot I just got milk and need to make a smoothie.
@vast basin Yes.
@bronze bough good, they are great.

[pure sun]

[full ruin]

You came into this conversation masquerading as an adult for no reason then

[earnest chasm]

This as well.

[bold sable]

what makes you think it directly relates that i’m either grooming or i’m being groomed

[bronze bough]

Oooo nice enjoy your smoothie

[tame echo]

If you’re not an adult then you have no say on it 💀

[full ruin]

You right. He would get the block in vrchat

[bold sable]

i never said i’m an adult, you guys just think i’m one

[earnest chasm]

bc you're so passionate about it so far. really like adults interacting with kids so much you're pushing for it and calling people names.

[pure sun]

i block kids, i block lolis, i block groomers, and i block simps, and i block overly try hard edgy people. case closed on my end, im going back to working on 3d stuff lol

[cyan falcon]

XD I need to go make one so I can have a banana, strawberry and blue berry smoothie.

[earnest chasm]

xD lmaooooo

[full sail]

Make some extra for me too! I'm stuck working on a vehicle wrap for the next... two hours. The cravings are real

[bronze bough]

Ooo sounds yummy

[bold sable]

i never said that adults interacting with kids is better
i’m just saying adults can interact with kids

[spice bane]

Lmao u probably block 95% of vrc publics then

[cyan falcon]

ouch...is it at LEAST a nice car?

@bronze bough Mhm it be, add a bit of ice cream in there

[pure sun]

yes, yes i do, and you know what is left? usually good folks to talk to

[tame echo]

Exactly. It’s mad weird

[spice bane]

I do the same thing but mentally.

[bold sable]

i’m pretty much shit at expression but i’m pretty sure saying it now isn’t gonna change anything

[tame echo]

Yeah exactly

[earnest chasm]

Thats your fault tbh

[drowsy terrace]

You kinda dug that hole yourself

[honest bane]

lol

[bold sable]

you got that point and exaggerated it a thousand times to the chat

[drowsy terrace]

don't blame other people for your own words

[bronze bough]

Big facts

[bold sable]

i’m not blaming anyone lmao

[cyan falcon]

@tardy bladeKramit have you ate porkchops recently?

[earnest chasm]

but you stated it over and over, and i asked many different ways, and you stated it over and over.

[drowsy terrace]

oh you're not blaming anyone eh?

[tame echo]

Not even 💀💀💀. Just stay mad that you got exposed

[zenith karma]

tf going on here, pedo got exposed

[tame echo]

Oooo that sounds good

[bold sable]

and you’re being affected of that exaggeration

[cyan falcon]

That sounds so good

[earnest chasm]

like sorry you talked about children in a weird way and im trying to shine a light on the rampant grooming on this game.

[tame echo]

How so?

[bold sable]

again saying anything isn’t gonna change shit now, like wise kermit said, people are just going to forget this in a day or two

[cyan falcon]

Lets talk about food.

[pure sun]

the real question is, do you actually have free candy in your van tho

[bronze bough]

If this stuff goes on for another 5 minutes I’m finna get a chat mods attention

[earnest chasm]

💀

[bold sable]

you weren’t here in the beginning, you don’t know what even happened and decided to believe rosie’s words

[drowsy terrace]

Fuck yeah, I just ate a grilled ham and gouda cheese. Good ham, like sliced off a big ham roast.

[spice bane]

Eh its a hard topic cuz ur stuck in A platform where you WILL run into children, a normal adult will leave them be and let them hang with other children, you can block them if they're annoying, what sucks is you're gunna make that kid feel neglected, but he shouldnt be on vrchat in the first place so i dont see blocking them a problem

[pure sun]

i know, bad humor, off to texturing i go XD

[earnest chasm]

yep, and just go tag his name and read everything lol

[tame echo]

I haven’t eaten yet >_< My eggs are cooking rn

[bold sable]

more like an aftermatch

[cyan falcon]

Where is this van and can I climb in it for free candy? @vast basin wanna join me?

[zenith karma]

you could also get banned that sounds like a good thing to happen

[bronze bough]

Bruh I literally see children in the 18+ clubs

[bold sable]

and you still decided to frame that i’m a pedophile despite me admitting that i’m not an adult

[drowsy terrace]

I have a nice grill press. It's awesome for sandwiches.

[spice bane]

Thats a problem, theres adults letting them in there

[cyan falcon]

Gimmie the damn sandwich now and no one gets hurt.

[tame echo]

Exactly 😭

[bronze bough]

Hush up bot

[spice bane]

A was so mad when drinking night turned quest, made no sense

[drowsy terrace]

and when they get found they usually get blacklisted

[zenith karma]

how tf did you know i'm a robot

[bronze bough]

The world or the kids lol?

[drowsy terrace]

🥪

[bold sable]

you could also read the chat again

[spice bane]

Well publics u cant do aything sadly

[pure sun]

bruh, you are trying to expose kids to adult things so you can shape kids into "mature minors" and you choose to hang out with minors because you prefer them over adults. no one is framing you, people are questioning your weird flex to hang out with kids and justify actively seeking them out to hang out with them lol

[cyan falcon]

Good Bear Icon person.

[earnest chasm]

ok you did that urself

[spice bane]

If ur gunna do adult stuff like get drunk, do it in a friends +

[drowsy terrace]

The instance owners running events that are 18+ actively kick out children.

[bold sable]

where did you come with the conclusion that i’m exposing them to inappropriate topics

[cyan falcon]

duck meat is greasy

[pure sun]

scroll up, you said it, not me lol

[bronze bough]

It was a public world last I checked

[earnest chasm]

THISSSSS lmaooo @bold sable you did!

[bold sable]

i directly pointed that’s not right

[spice bane]

Thats just how u have to treat this game, publics are a lost cause sadly

[zenith karma]

that does infact
sound sus as hell

[cyan falcon]

But you ate your wife miss piggy.

[bold sable]

this

[earnest chasm]

u not wrong

[bold sable]

@tardy blade frog meat

[full sail]

Generic Ford f150 wanting realtree camo

[cyan falcon]

Though Roasted duck is pretty good.

[drowsy terrace]

if it is a public world, then it isn't really 18+, it's just a suggestion at that point. If nothing in it is NSFW, the world won't get banned even if reported.

[bold sable]

frog meat and mayo

[earnest chasm]

You literally said people are gross for immediately blocking children and keep advocating that adults talk to children on the game. also said its gross even if we are blocking them to block them from our convos and our experience.

[spice bane]

Dont talk to the kids, if u have to talk to them tell them to talk to someone their age and block them or leave. Its as simple as that

[cyan falcon]

YOu know I'm not wrong,
@full sail ffs, sounds like hell

[bold sable]

let me reword that, people are gross for immediately blocking children for the sake of themselves
bad expression, just saying

[pure sun]

oh i missed that first half of the conversation, yikes lol

[earnest chasm]

there it is . lol\

[full ruin]

You’re gross for trying to make it out like a bad thing that people block kids and don’t want to interact with them

[zenith karma]

^^^

[bronze bough]

Everyone is entitled to their own Opinions my friends
@earnest chasm
@bold sable

[bold sable]

oh yeah i still think that’s a bad thing
it’s not a sin to interact with minors why are people so against it

[spice bane]

How is that gross, those children shouldnt be trying to talk to adult strangers, so i block them or leave

[cyan falcon]

Does your hair smell like bubblegum or strawberries?

[floral spoke]

are we still talkin bout this

[earnest chasm]

why is it gross to NOT want to ?

[full ruin]

Neither. Coconut

[pure sun]

VRC should be an 18+ space, not even a hot take. why are minors wandering around virtual reality? lol

[bronze bough]

Sadly yes, they are

[bold sable]

simply socially disrespectful

[cyan falcon]

Roast coconut?

[spice bane]

Game worlds :D

[bold sable]

i forgot because the last time i played vrchat was probably 2 fucking years ago

[drowsy terrace]

when you reword things they sound just as bad you know, maybe you should stop digging yourself a hole. People don't want to hang out with children, and don't have to if they don't want to. Nobody owes you their time, even if you think of yourself as a "mature child" as you seem to be claiming you are

[full ruin]

I use Shea moisture. So yea probably

[pure sun]

what birb said lol

[earnest chasm]

THIS this this. @bold sable go play with your "mature minors"

[zenith karma]

so why are you here

[cyan falcon]

XD I was asking because of your icon, she looks like her hair would be stawberry, or something else pink

[bold sable]

it’s kind of sarcastic when i tried to end the convo, you dug it up again
you’re mature aren’t you

[bronze bough]

Shush bot don’t add fuel

[full sail]

I've just accepted that the time between fun jobs is slathered with generic and boring / tedious af, lol.

If anything it just makes looking forward to vr chill better

[bold sable]

hypocrites gotta be hypocrites

[cyan falcon]

Wanna hang tonight?

[full ruin]

Lmao she smells like strawberry

[bold sable]

now i’m gonna dip chat, have fun

[zenith karma]

eeeh ok

[spice bane]

Vrchat can be a place for under 18, theres cool worlds avatars and game worlds. but we need some kind of divide for the adults who want to socialize, not game.

[bronze bough]

Take care friend

[cyan falcon]

I knew it

[earnest chasm]

you've literally kept it going but ok.

[cyan falcon]

Lets just shut the f- up about dumb things and TALK about food.

[pure sun]

uh huh, at least i dont go to virtual equivalents to parks to look for kids to "mature" them up like you do. ill take my label of being mature, at least im not a risk to the youth lol

[bold sable]

, i went silence trying to end it and you decided to ask why am i silent

[earnest chasm]

you're still going

[bold sable]

again you should read the convo again, i said that was wrong already
now i’m actually dipping bye

[cyan falcon]

Ignore them, lets talk about food.

[zenith karma]

oh no here we go again

[drowsy terrace]

LUL bruh is on a list now

[spice bane]

If your mature you'd know how to distance yourself from underage

[earnest chasm]

@cyan falcon but they love me 👁️ 👄 👁️ 🥺

[cyan falcon]

I like your icon because its a duck

[pure sun]

bye!

[earnest chasm]

well i am Kami Desu, also known as Duck God in vrc

[honest valley]

chicken sandwich

[spice bane]

Do you use the duck knuckles avi

[cyan falcon]

Is it a squishy duck?
@honest valley Me want.

[earnest chasm]

full body fluffy duck uwu

[drowsy terrace]

well, at least that was a break from people going nuts over EAC, albeit a very creepy break LOL

[cyan falcon]

Screams I want to pet!!

[spice bane]

How does one full body. A duck with no arms

[honest valley]

same

[earnest chasm]

it was the American Perkin avatar. I use to run it often and give people really cool visual and music experiences in game. but i quit now. had a churrch and everything v.v

[cyan falcon]

Puts hand over mouth SHUSH, ENOUGH of that. Food Now

[bronze bough]

@bold sable
@earnest chasm
Y’all done now? Good we don’t need more rowdy rascal fuel adders lol

[earnest chasm]

we've been done but you brought it up again so i might bring it up again

[spice bane]

Church of duck

[cyan falcon]

give me.

[bold sable]

yeah i’m pretty much done i’m sleepy

[earnest chasm]

oh so hes still here "im done bye chat"

[cyan falcon]

duck restaurant, but we don't hurt @earnest chasm just other ducks

[bronze bough]

Just making sure sorry

[earnest chasm]

oh no please. eat me. end me.

[cyan falcon]

NO

[full sail]

Sounds like a solid gameplan~ may be a rough... 3ish hours? To get home and settled in

[bronze bough]

Cuz I’m sure people like bot boy slice over there had no clue what it was about

[honest valley]

[cyan falcon]

Go catch pokemon. NOW.

[drowsy terrace]

no joke though my friend raises ducks LOL

[bronze bough]

Huh?

[honest valley]

ok hear me out, a duck restaurant where you can PET the ducks

[pure sun]

i usually lurk this discord, that is the most i spoke in here ever. as soon as i seen the conversation, i was like, "what.....is....happening.." lol

[cyan falcon]

Sure just message when you get on.

[full sail]

o7

[floral spoke]

can i join yall?

[drowsy terrace]

I have a bunch of duck eggs in my fridge

[earnest chasm]

yall be safe and have fun

[cyan falcon]

FUCK yes.

[earnest chasm]

my babies, please let them nourish u well