suggestion-discussion

[real trellis]

.shortinfo 1607297

Speaking of blocking, I don't like that the bosses basically either need to be cheesed or you need to have a shield or be really good at blocking with weapons that have a block option in order to not take damage. There need to be other ways to avoid getting hit by a skeleton champ if you're using a weapon without a block function and not staircheesing him

[mortal carbon]

for me we dont need action house, but what we need is filter by rarity and specific stats, example "%health" or "maxHealth" and it show items with those stats.

[frozen locust]

Fasten up the basic axe od barbarian and two handed weapons are too slow or increase damage of 2 two handed weapons and fasten up a barbarian it does not have any sense that fighter is faster in full plate armour than barbarian in medium armour since you have based this game on Dungeons and dragons video games obviously barbarians rage should last longer and barbarian should have plus 33 percent of passive movement speed also reduce noise and movement penalties od heavy armour I mean what is the point of extra protection when you can't catch them anyway it would be also useful to remove friendly fire and that they can only loot something from your inventory and not anything your character wears after death - that gear on your character should stay even after death @everyone and slow down rogue or fasten up basic starting barbarian's axe you need few hits to kill someone and you cannot even hit them once due to a terrible slow attack speed or boost damage of that starting axe

[noble dust]

This and also pots not being used, should be a bit darker.
With low light, in-match you can see people far away only because they have a red / white spot on their hips

[civic isle]

small loot , like bracelets, need a bigger hint box

[mint stone]

You can actually dodge all 3 of the skeleton champions attacks, without blocking. They all involve crouching and ducking in a certain direction

[dull dagger]

I think its left-to-right swipe can be dodged simply by moving to its left.

[frozen locust]

It would be great that we see friend list in-game so I don't have to spam players to add my steam account this could be useful @everyone and randomly generated dungeon levels could be also useful

[waxen needle]

@plucky blade @glacial sphinx an auction system will benefit everyone everyone. People will be able to spend more time in dungeon to find gear and stuff to sell the merchants. And the way you stop people from playing the auction house is buy only allowing to post items found in raid. For those saying an auction would not benefit this game is beyond me. If they increased the amount of gold from the crap items you get in raid it would help with being able to by a good item on the auction house. There is no reason to have to spend hours to buy a gear set that you can potentially lose in the next raid. I’m telling you, once you get good enough at the game and start to only push high roller this is the biggest complaint. If not a auction system then add a slow mode to posting to make it so people have to stand behind their original sale price. So many people spam the auction house and deny trades because they are trying to price their items. Something needs to be done in order to speed up trading times and gold making. People waste so much time trying to trade their gear versus actually dubgeoning.

[dull dagger]

Yeah, the current trade system is garbage. Takes far too much vigilance and time to find what you want.

[plucky blade]

slow mode is good idea

[real trellis]

🤔 interesting. Can you do the same with the wraith?

[mint stone]

Yes the wraith's attack can be dodge by simply side strafing to either it's left or right, then getting about one-three hits in (depending on ur wep), then repeating the process. But if u try and swing while he is drawing back his attack, you will be to slow to dodge it.

[glacial sphinx]

It wasnt good for D3. The more you streamline trading the less self found loot from dungeons you'll wear. To me that is degrading the experience.

[plucky blade]

but again, auction house will kill the trading post literally, and only the best items will be sold, and its gonna be too easy to get a perfect set

[mint stone]

I just think allowing players to get into the dungeons with "the perfect gear set" just because u died is going against what the game is all about. You should be punished for dying. The grind to the ideal gear set should be rewarding, not something u just pay for cause you searched up a specific item set via an Auction house system.

[dull dagger]

The current trade system encourages the same behavior, just to a lesser degree. Not sure what the solution is. D3's system was, indeed, bad; I was buying items for virtually no gold that were better than anything I'd ever find.

[pseudo forge]

I can't currently post this in the #1048762118255673428 channel so I will post here for now until I can.

.suggest People suggest gear/stat-based matchmaking. I HEAVILY disagree with that idea. However, those who initially make the suggestion have an interesting point. Lobbies full of geared or un-geared players who have experience could potentially drive away new players who don't understand what's going on.

So here's my idea:
What about **skill-based **matchmaking? Something similar to that of Rocket League. Where certain actions contribute points towards your MMR. To elaborate I will share some example ideas:

Ranks:

• Explorer
• Dungeoneer
• Adept
• Master
• Grandmaster
• Elder
  These are probably sub-par titles but you get the idea. Each rank, like Rocket League, could also have divisions.

Ideas for actions per match that contribute to MMR:

• total value of loot (if you successfully extract)
• total player kills
• total mob kills
• damage taken (more dmg = less MMR and this would obviously have to be balanced for each class as some classes can take more or less dmg)
• extraction time (the longer you stay, the more MMR)
• successful extractions
• etc

All of these would of course contribute a miniscule amount toward your total MMR for that match.

What would be the benefits of this system?

In my opinion, it would satisfy players' competitive nature and give them something more to work towards. It would encourage people to learn how to play and "git gud". It would allow players to match with other players similar to their skill level while still keeping the core principle of looting intact. Players could still decide whether or not they want to come in naked - geared to the brim.

It would eliminate skilled players coming in geared and absolutely dominating lobbies. Dominating a lobby in your skill level would be even more rewarding because you will have known you were equally matched.

[frozen locust]

also since is a dungeon crawler subgenre of role playing game and it has heavy inspiration from Dungeons and dragons every 4 levels you should get a stat to appoint to your character so level should matter in addition to the extra feats (or perks as you call it in this game) you should have 5 extra stats to put on str will agi and so on @everyone thanks for that

[keen knot]

[let us rotate items in the inventory by 90 degrees, it would make looting and inventory management slightly faster. Speaking of inventory, It would be awesome to have more specific boxes for inventory space saving, like gold chest, potion boxes, etc. and the said boxes should have affinities (like the money puch allready has an affinity where if you fast transfer money it goes in to the pouch). Also I would like to be able to send all the money from my inventory to the stash in one click. Item spliting - let us use the num pad and the enter button for it, or if its splitting from a pouch, make it 10 gold split default as the split number] Thoughts? also upvote this if you like it

[plucky blade]

completly disagree, when noob finally kill advanced player and find super gear is what make the game exciting

[waxen needle]

@plucky blade @mint stone @glacial sphinx I totally hear what you guys are saying but this can be done. Wether it’s an auction system or tweaks to the trading forums. Things need to be done because in the current state, the trade system is chaotic. Also if I go into the dungeon with a gear set and lose, that’s my punishment within its self - I would have to spend time grinding gear to make gold to buy those items. They should add a slow mode to the trade forums or charge one silver coin to even create a post on the trade forums, this will give silver coins a purpose and make people accountable to committing to their original sale price instead of deny trades and then increasing their prices. I truly understand where you guys are coming from but there is too much foolery and chaos that happens in the current trade system that makes it so hard to buy gear, that you would have to agree with. Also if someone does not have the 15gold to make the trade they should even be allowed to post or even enter the trade forum.

[frozen solstice]

6 hour wait for new suggestion

[pseudo forge]

mine never submitted when i tried posting it :/

[pseudo forge]

I think you may have missed one of the crucial points to my suggestion. You would still be able to come in a lobby kitted out to the brim. A naked player could still come in and kill that kitted player, but it would be in a lobby where both players are matched according to skill, not stats.

[glacial sphinx]

@pseudo forge I don't agree with skill based matchmaking honestly. I think it slows down queues and makes it more competitive at all times than it needs to be. I think the underlying problem that causes people to suggest gear based lobbies is actually an issue with gearing.

Imo there is too much power from certain attribute rolls. That means that when wearing that type of gear the player effectively becomes completely free from risk when engaging lesser geared players, and this is emphasized by the fact that people wearing their bis gear tend to roll out with two teammates doing the same for added security. I'd nerf some of the strongest attribute rolls. For example +all stats probably shouldn't go higher than 2, and flat added damage modifiers should probably be halved or not exist on some pieces.

[keen knot]

I dont think most people want this game to become sweatty, most games I know that implemented skill based matchmaking started loosing players because the game becomes unfun once you reach a certain rank

[astral root]

god the suggestions are so ful of noobs

[frozen solstice]

SBMM is a mistake, and will feel more stress than fun.

[plucky blade]

same as the game it self, its for everybody

[pseudo forge]

This is one of my concerns with my suggestion as well

[pseudo tendon]

Keep normal dungeons casual, and high roll competitive.

[dull dagger]

Don't these guys understand that I just want to kill newbs without effort? Why on earth would I want to face other players who are on my level? It's hard!

[echo hawk]

yeah it sucks running into a full ruby three stack in normal dungeons

[waxen needle]

Also they need to add a kernel anti-cheat. The state of tarkov is horrible right with cheaters and radar cheats because they don’t have a kernel anti-cheat. So people don’t get banned for months. Can you imagine there being radar cheats for this game? I bring up radar because it is the most use cheat in tarkov.

[mint stone]

i mean... smurfing on fresh accounts just to run through lower MMR brackets exist... so i don't see how an MMR system will stop beginners from losing their sets.

[keen knot]

no one wants kernel anti cheat, and tarkov anti cheat sucks because of the engine they are using

[pseudo tendon]

Normal Dungeons could try being naked runs only, with high roller is going in with the crew.

[glacial sphinx]

don't be so easy to suggest people grant access at kernel level to play a game. It's a terrible practice

[echo hawk]

yeah ironmace should get started on a really good anti cheat before it gets really bad, i can already see aimbot rangers and flying wizards.

[pseudo forge]

This is also a viable option! I like your idea! A concern of mine with my idea as well is that SBMM would inevitably change the current core gameplay. The developers may or may not want it to go that direction.

[muted locust]

Not only that but in the future we'll get to a point where gear is not a priority and people will rush to spawn rooms to get easy kills for the ladder. Have you seen the last tourney? There were a group of 3 with a barb destroying doors, ignoring mobs/chests until they found players

[waxen needle]

I understand that kernel anti-cheats push on the border of security and privacy but most games are turning to some kind of kernel access because that’s how these hacks are being created to work and in games like this we’re killing players for loot, I can assure you kernal hacks are going to be developed especially subtle ones like radar on a second pc. I love this game and I just don’t want to see it go to shit from cheaters. Once again this is just my opinion and I understand that people don’t like kernal anti cheats but one of the most popular games in the world uses one and most other games are leaning to some kind of kernal access to help with such cheaters.

[dull dagger]

A solution doesn't need to be perfect to be better. A fluid MMR system like Hunt: Showdown's can help prevent this, as well.

[pseudo tendon]

Would a tournament where all participants start off with default gear be better? The meta would stay the same, but the potential for upsets would be higher.

[muted locust]

I gave the tourney as an example for the behaviour of players who don't have to worry about gear. That is exactly what will happen in the future for the general playerbase

[scenic veldt]

There should be more crowd control spells for wizard, stuff like *color spray

[pseudo tendon]

I agree, the item economy doesn't pass from top to bottom as well upsets rarely happen in dungeons.

Long Term Stability begins with foundation, the game needs to have the normal dungeon be the go to for all players. Default runs would be the standard and high roll dungeon be the competitive format with a lower entry fee.

[dull glen]

#d-and-d-suggestions message
solo dungeon didn't have leaderboard so I don't know what this dude is talking about

[stable sentinel]

he is talking about teaming in solos, and teaming in highroller to cheese the leaderbord

[muted drum]

People team in highroller? Where are those games, I been getting stomped as a solo 😂

[dull glen]

teaming in solos doesn't have a leaderboard and that's why they added VOIP; I haven't seen anyone team (as in more than 3) in high roller but maybe it's region specific

[stable sentinel]

no the person is talking about people just teaming in solos. and then that people are teaming in highroller to cheese the leaderbord,

[dull glen]

you just posted the same message twice

[pseudo tendon]

It's called win trading, stat padding, exploiting.. There's no fix for it and doubtful there ever will be.

Leaderboards should never be seen as "The best of the best". I've always seen it as "Spent X more hours than me, or found an exploit."

[magic flume]

If u team up with players you're playing the game right

[stable sentinel]

no. you dont understand what im saying. the person is saying, that you should be able to report people that team up in the solos, and that u should be able to report people that team up in highroller to cheese the leaderbords. They is not saying that there is a leaderbord in solos or that they are cheesing the "solo leaderboard" They are talking about to different cases that shuld be reportable according to them

[white cliff]

Hello, kill race tournament winner here. From my perspective gear doesn’t really matter till purple and upwards we where running through teams in white/gray gear.

[static hazel]

Scratch that, it's a 6 hour cooldown, wow.
I'll just post it here for now and then repost it as a proper suggestion for the devs to see when the CD is up.
I've also posted it on Reddit.

This suggestion relies on two assumptions for changes that are supposedly planned:

• The current level 1 is going to be level 2, with an easier level 1 added
• Going deeper will match you with a new set of players, instead of only the people that also went deeper in your current instance

My suggestion:

• Remove the current High Roller queue
• Add another 1-2 levels to the map(s, solo Goblin Cave and Castle)
• Give the option to pay money to skip to a certain floor directly, getting progressively more expensive

This essentially rolls the High Roller concept into the normal queues. It has a few purposes:

• As people get more geared, they will prefer to not spend time on the higher, low-reward levels, and instead want to speed up their runs by starting on a lower, more challenging and rewarding tier
• This will indirectly protect lower-geared players, as they can remain on the higher floors and gear up that way
• This can act as an additional money sink, equal to the current High Roller queue

And an example:
Say you have floors 1-5 for the Group map.
Floor 1 is free to enter and the starting level, I heard it's supposed to be an overworld map of some sorts.
Floor 2 is the current Castle map and costs 50g to skip to (or you start on lvl 1 and descend).
Floor 3 is the current highroller map / difficulty and costs 100g to skip to (or descend from 2).
Floor 4 is an additional map /difficulty and costs 200g to skip to (or descend from 3).
Floor 5 is (larger) Hell and costs 300g (or descend from 4).
Of course the numbers and levels are pulled out of thin air and depend on the economy etc.

[pseudo tendon]

The amount of coding to get all this to work, I'd do a hard no for a total rework of so many systems already in place that already work at the fundamental level.

[stable sentinel]

i agree with u @white cliff, we ran 3 naked rogues and nuked purple geared team with no issues. One just need to "git gud" or play differently when they playing "naked/basic" runs

[pseudo tendon]

How long were your rogue sessions for with your 3 man team?

[white cliff]

Don’t get me wrong gear disparity exists, it’s a core aspect of the game. But I don’t think it matters till late game gameplay.

[static hazel]

I don't know about total rework. Functionally, each level is a separate instance. 'going down' just puts you in first a temp room hidden somewhere on the map, and later in a new instance. This suggestion really does nothing else, and the hard part, which is matching between each floor with players that also went down, is supposedly planned.

[stable sentinel]

10-12 hours i think, over the last 2 days

[eager creek]

that has to be a troll right?

[pseudo tendon]

I understand what you're saying. But the coding itself would be an incredible undertaking, to a already decent system.

I'd wager another year of development for the current team to get that up and going. Foregoing any other content releases.

[static hazel]

What else do you have to rework? Pay to enter an instance is already present in the high roller queue. More floors being entered successively is planned. Floors having different droprates is in.

[white cliff]

I’m not sure if you understand how game development works…

[brittle cosmos]

I think a great idea would be an arena mode, possibly allow in game betting on matches, with in game currency obviously, make it best of 3 or 5 and allow equipment changes in between marches

[pseudo tendon]

I'd wager near the end, your squad was battle hardy and experienced to do this with ease on the 2nd day (I love naked runs, anything extracted is a win lol)

[static hazel]

I really feel like people are misunderstanding my suggestion here, so please tell me what you don't get. This is very similar to what we already have. The major difference is that 'high roller' difficulty is just another floor, and the other floors can also be accessed the same way.

[white cliff]

Removing high roller is a bad idea. I don’t think you’ve seen named uniques.

[muted locust]

wait someone asked to remove highroller? 💀

[pseudo tendon]

I feel like we do understand, although you're thinking shortsighted to the long-term work needed to get this going.

Network/Multiplayer is incredibly finicky. Adding in "layers" of entry, creates a nightmare of if statement checks.

As well coding specific floor rarity drops, to match with mob difficulty balance..

[stable sentinel]

it is removing highroller. i agree that more levels should be added but i dont think it should all be rolled in to one queue.

[eager creek]

make the suggestion digestible in a few sentences then, if it isnt that much. Seeing long suggestions is a turn off.

[atomic heath]

Sorry in advance if my suggestion is basic and is probably already suggested but I mained Ranger for this Alpha and it's kind of a pain to be somehow forced to buy something at the start even if it's not that much i feel like the Ranger have it too hard if he doenst buy one so..giving him some kind of short sword or a dagger would be nice

Every single decent ranger already have a short sword or a spear so it wouldnt change that much of the game beside giving a little bit easier start to new players

[pseudo tendon]

Give the ranger a rat dagger, that's fine by me.

But also lower the Str by 1 or 2

[eager creek]

Ranger already has the best starting kit in the game by a mile. You dont need a dagger. I brought basic gear into the goblin cave and made 3k in 2 days.. No other class is geared anywhere near the ranger with basic stuff.

[static hazel]

Sorry but no way. Same to Jkidd. This is not technically challenging at all judging by the systems already in place and the plans they have. This does not require any great revamps. You already have a system for going down, and it's a primary concept of the dungeon crawler called 'Dark and Darker'. There is already a system to pay to be put in a certain map or queue. These are the major elements needed.

Adding in "layers" of entry
This already exists, it's high roller or transisting zones. The loading screen you see is you getting put into a fresh map instance.
As well coding specific floor rarity drops, to match with mob difficulty balance.
This already exists, it's different floors and high roller. It's also an incredibly basic concept, I don't know why you think this is difficult. Many games have lootpools for all kinds of situations, be it general map rarities, different containers, etc.
@eager creek
make the suggestion digestible in a few sentences then
Come on, that is not a long suggestion at all

[atomic heath]

I dont know it's just that as a ranger we all buy a 2nd hand weapon and he is the only class who can't hit a Melee (Even Wizard staff does "some" damage). With a bow you need such a big area to moove in to dance around monsters and this is kind of rare in the map

[ashen warren]

Yo okay, I'm personally not into @static hazel's suggestion here, I don't think that much depth really works because now the deeper lvls would have more competition which isn't as rewarding imo

but anyone arguing against the points he made due to technical complexity has no idea wtf they're talking about. The stuff he describes would not be very difficult to implement

[novel sedge]

i just hope at the next test we will have some content further than basics some side quest and things to do beyond killing and looting

[static hazel]

Anyways, the technical suggestion is for the devs to look at.

[static hazel]

Ish? High roller is in effect 'higher risk (100g and stronger enemies), higher reward). Lower floors would in effect be the same thing.

I don't think that much depth really works because now the deeper lvls would have more competition which isn't as rewarding imo
As far as I know, this is planned anyways. 🤷‍♂️

[eager creek]

nah, just learn how to kite enemies. Walk up to them, back up, let them swing, shoot. walk up, back up, swing, reload, walk up etc --. Once you get an enemies atk pattern down they wont hit you, even the nightmare skeletons in hell dungeon. You dont need much space, just practice it, watch how streamers fight mobs like Thespudhunter (ranegr). -- As for gear, I think the other classes need some starting love, ranger getting traps, campfire and biscuits lv 1 is so op (at least 100 gold value) compared to wizard getting a single protection potion or barb getting a couple of throwing axes.

[pseudo tendon]

If we are talking about the "waiting room", technically it's a space in the first map teams go to to wait till the match is at its end via match timer.

Also, to go to said waiting area you need to be in the first dungeon. Which in that case, would lower the "active" player count in the first dungeon. Since some teams paid to skip content due to inconvenience.

I understand the technical ability is there, but the costs of implementation is the problem. Removing full dungeon matches is the big issue. If we are using the same back end functionalities.

[stable sentinel]

rangers doesnt "need" a melee weapon in the start kit when u 4 hit mods with the base bow and how a rapid fire with a 20sec cooldown. not to talk about the potential for 3 free heals, and camp fire and traps to stop people from pushing u, this is all lvl 1.

[atomic heath]

Well if i "could" play the game i would test your idea but i will trust you on that point. But i keep my idea cuz idk it feels weird to always buy a melee weapon at every death but i think i need more experience on the game

[sterile sage]

Hi, you mentioned classes that are confirmed. Can I have the sauce?

[pseudo tendon]

Wouldn't all dnd classes technically be confirmed?

[static hazel]

Also, to go to said waiting area you need to be in the first dungeon.
Not really. What you want is to be spawned into the fresh instance on the next floor. So, you'd be sitting in the menu screen while queueing for the match, and then put into the closed off room, like what happens after the loading screen is done, either after loading into floor 1 or descending into hell.
If the devs didn't plan to have new matchmaking after you descend, then the suggestion is obviously pointless, hence the disclaimer at the beginning.

[eager creek]

just watch thespudhunter, he rarely pulls out a sword. He has done quite a few zero to hero runs, where he starts base gear solo norms too. youll get the hang of it, was hard during my first playtest. I never knew the value in actually walking up to the mob - when you do that, they dont chase you, meaning you arent squeezed into tight spots as often.

[atomic heath]

Alright my bad on the point then !

[sterile sage]

It seems to be mostly based on AD&D so far, but -without sources behind my argument- I'd wager that they'd rather make a balanced game than add more classes for the sake of reproducing D&D

[runic axle]

Theres really push back on barbs being nerfed? defeinitely just from barb mains. as someone who got barb to level 20 the past to play tests it desperately needs a nerf. You can run around just as fast as anyone else, 1.5-2x hp of everyone else, you can two hit everyone and add two rarity tiers to any axe weapon with a skill. Also ranger definitely does not have the best starting kit by any measure of distance. you get a terrible dmg bow that takes forever for the damage to draw and you have no melee option.

[muted locust]

I completely disagree with the removal of highroller. There MUST be a distinction between normal queue and highroller due to the large percent of casual players. You want casual players to not feel frustrated by going against fully geared enemies all the time. Highroller allows highly skilled players to go against people of the same level with the incentive of getting juicy rewards. Normal queue is a safe system for casuals.

[pseudo tendon]

Ranger default DPS vs barb default DPS. Who wins?...

[stable sentinel]

lvl 1 base kit , ranger

[runic axle]

lol no

[static hazel]

Highroller isn't removed, the equivalent to highroller is just lower floors in the same dungeon.
You know how you descend from Castle into Hell? Pretend you descend to High Roller instead. Now pretend you can still pay 100g to jump straight to that descended level. That is in effect what my suggestion is, just applied to other levels, such as Hell, as well.

[shrewd wasp]

Barb defenders are really something else

[pseudo tendon]

Why? I'm seriously curious

[eager creek]

Rangers starting kit is the best in a vacuum compared to the other starting kits. Its not even comparable tbh, what can any other class do vs traps, campfire, 3 biscuits lv 1? I played enough goblin caves as every class, and ranger was by far the easiest. I have an over 90% extraction rate with base gear, any other class it was less than 50% @pseudo tendon essentially ranger has 2 healthbars w all the heals they recieve lv 1, while being ranged.

[weak karma]

We need a dungeon that requires 100 heart candies to enter.

[muted locust]

You're not taking into perspective how people think when there is a ranking system. Highroller is played not only for the loot but also for the ladder. People WON'T pay to rush floors because they can get easy kills on previous floors. It's already a common thing to rush spawn rooms and get rid of gearless players just because it adds points to their position in the ranking.

[unkempt oasis]

guh

[runic axle]

if you take into account it is very difficult to hit arrows on the run especially during the quick 3 shot sequence there is no shot at all that base ranger out dps base barb. also if you're not braindead and you know that someone placed a trap which you do in 99% of scenarios you can just jump over it. im not saying ranger isnt best for pve of course ranger with unlimited range will always be the best for pve.

[static hazel]

The ranking system is actually a decent point. There would have to be an equivalent solution for that.

[stable sentinel]

DPS wise they might be the same but time to kill the ranger wins simply bc of rapit fire

[eager creek]

how does a barb catch you? This might be a skill diff because a good ranger can run without weops, heal w biscuits, turn around flick arrows, slow you down and then keep running. I rarely get caught in goblin caves, even by rouges. --- Barb > Mage > then either fighter or Ranger > Rouge @pseudo tendon

[pseudo tendon]

If we talking power scaling, from Default --> Blues ---> Purple. What would be your tier list (or anyone else's)

[cobalt obsidian]

a barb has to hit throwing axes to slow a high mobility class down when kiting.

Which is why I suggested that throwables become non consumable.

Fking mods hit this channel with the slow mode. Motherfkers.

[runic axle]

yea this works if you're running down a straight enemy-less hallway with no traps or turns or anything. which we're not doing. its a dungeon. also throwing axes like martin said

[muted locust]

I'll give you a brief answer: Throwing hatchets

[weak karma]

Okay, I get it, you don't like spending gold to get better loot, we've all been there and stopped being so pathetic, but let me suggest this idea...

... What if instead of a fee-gated dungeon, it just costs gold to skip floors? The more gold you put up, the more floors you skip. This way, all the loserbabies crying about fee-gates can luck their way there, while all the normal people can skip the trash and get to the main point of the game. Good idea?

[muted locust]

Add that to the numerous strength and speed buffs that barb has, and you get yourself a class who won't let you escape by any means. A barb only needs 2 braincells to secure kills, no matter the class he's against.

[runic axle]

^^^^. I played a ton of barb so its not like im coming from a place that I dont know how it is. barb gets so boring to play bc you just walk forward and hold left click and kill people in 1-3 hits

[cobalt obsidian]

A barb literally cant kill me unless they hit the best throwing axes of their life.

Assuming they aren't supported of course.

[eager creek]

Well a good ranger has multiple escape options. and goodluck hitting your starting 3 axes, miss 1 or 2 and you arent winning the encounter. Things have to go perfectly for the barb to win, the ranger wins by default. Idk why this is an argument, if you played the goblin caves im sure youve been kited by rangers, its such a common class there. -- Im def not gifted or anything at the goblin caves but when you shoot a barb they get so slow they cant move. @muted locust we are talking base kits, you get 3 axes.

[pseudo tendon]

I don't want to run from a barb for XX seconds because my options are now gone. And going melee is what the barb wants to do.

From a Rock Paper Scissors perspective, Ranger/Wizards should win. The other two lose outright.

[stable sentinel]

ranger - ranger - ranger. the barb might one hit a ranger but that requires that they get to the ranger before the die to rapid fire or a one shot from winlass crossbow to the head. (i have gotten one shot full health of 140 25%dmg reduction by a ranger)

[quasi copper]

Why some people are against solo maps, and better looting for solo players? Isn't it just a matter to adjust these maps to balance these maps to make it difficulty to loot?

Not everybody wants to play with friends all the time to be able to have a good loot.

And I think it's terrible to find random players to be able to play maps with a party.

[muted locust]

It should be of common sense that a ranger wins against a barb if they are in long-range distance. Throwing axes get rid of all that. That's why it is super annoying.

[runic axle]

doesn't this hitting your axes issue come down to a skill issue like you said earlier? I never had problems tracking down rangers and slowing them with throwing axes b/c if you have any situational awareness you can get close enough to people to hit them. eventually they're going to run into mobs or another player or anything to slow them down especially in goblin caves

[weak karma]

I'm not against solo maps, but they should be harder than party maps since loot and hiding tactics trivialize the game too much.

[eager creek]

probably does, ive kited and dodged several hundred barbs w axes and im sure youve crushed some rangers. I just dont see how the encounter is fair from my pov, you the same i suppose.

[pseudo tendon]

From a outright, non variable fight. Rangers win it, easily.

Barbs feel overwhelming from the Solo dungeon spacing, as well from the current meta that's very prevalent.

[runic axle]

okay? but 0 fights ever in the game have been a headshotting a target dummy dps contest

[stable sentinel]

yes. where rangers lose is if they panic or their positioning is shit.

[weak karma]

Rangers might seem powerful, but they are basically fragile little princesses. Remember, you can crouch, lean, and sidestep and projects file slow as poo. Practice some dancing and they will waste all their arrows. Rush with 2H and watch them squirm. It's pathetic how many Rangers think they're good up until they lose their only advantage.

[eager creek]

anyways besides straight up 1v1 rangers kit allows for attrition which is the op aspect of their starting gear. They essentially have 2 hp bars and can cheese any mob type.

[pseudo tendon]

I'll say it.. Barbs are the staple balance point to what a class definition is.

Fighter has identity crisis.

Rogues lack big bang damage from their underwhelming default dagger.

Rangers are good but not new friendly.

Wizards need invis taken away.

[muted locust]

Now let's bring to the table the REAL problem. We already talked about Ranger vs Barb. Ranger wins long distance, Barb wins short distance.

But what about Rogue - Barb? I'm a Rogue main and I've only been playing Rogue for the entire duration of the playtest. I can ASSURE you that Rogue has NO chance to win against a barb who knows just a tiny bit what he's doing. Try to explain a scenario where a Rogue beats a Barb with the same combat experience.

You can't kite him down and avoid his axe swings because he'll throw hatchets at you to slow you down and secure his hits. It's a completely different situation from the ranger one because barb has a low chance of missing those throwing axes.

[mint scarab]

So i'm playing at a really high resolution across 3 screens; One thing i'd like to see if possible, is a scalable map, i find it's quite tiny and hard to tell where youa re....while we are at it, maybe an arrow on the map that stands out, instead of the player location icon that we already have that I sometimes struggle to pick out

[mighty willow]

a rouge is not supposed to win against a barb in a fair 1 v 1

[blazing mesa]

When rouge dosnt face tank damage and just back peddles

[runic axle]

rogue goes invis, optionally using backstab to get behind the guy, 1-3 hits before barb can figure out what happen and hit back, unequip weapon, run and throw throwing knives until barb is weak then go in for kill

[rigid bramble]

invisibility should be a rogue thing, wizards having better invis makes no sense

[eager creek]

Wizard needs haste taken away and that will balance barb. Barb is only op because of that spell. It steals the sprint identity from fighter too, who is faster than barb, but doesnt have as much dps. @muted locust if youre in melee distance of a barb, youre already dead lol. Thats supposed to be a onesided mu by design. @shrewd wasp Still steals identity away from fighter. Id like to see it gone, its dominated every playtest.

[muted locust]

You could say a rogue is not supposed to win against a - in a fair 1 v 1 and you would still be right. Unfortunately, Rogue's win condition against any other class is to ambush them. You literally have 0 chance against all classes in a 1 v 1

[shrewd wasp]

Just nerf duration on targets other than self. Simple as

[pseudo tendon]

Or, I don't know. make wizard a DPS role, not a support role. Give those options to the bard/cleric.

[sterile sage]

Rogue is supposed to not win in a 1v1 scenario versus fighting classes. They fill the niche of rogue: you attack while unseen and, if they're not dead, get out of danger. But a good ambush will end up with them dead

[fleet harbor]

@shrewd wasp I think i will not change anything it will be anyway enough to come on oneshoot distance

[eager creek]

YUUP thats exactly what I was thinking. Idk why wizard has such great support tools while being insane dps machine.

[weak karma]

Going by last playtest, Barbarian is the ONLY real damage class. Fighter is useless because armor does almost nothing and the shield frequently fails to work (even when aiming in the right direction). Rogues are better alone by themselves, or with other rogues, which has always been the case. Rangers are played by COD losers who think ranged beats everything, when it really only beats amateurs. Wizards are utility -- and should be -- but lack vital utility spells like detect magic, or levitation, or sleep. The slow spell is a joke.

[stable sentinel]

yes u are a rogue, sneaky sneaky stabby stabby is what they do, their greatest weapon is their speed and their abilty to hide. they should never take a "fair" fight

[muted locust]

There should be a perk that extends the duration of Rogue's stealth. If you want to balance it then make it unequipable while having the 10 steps perk. As of now, Rogue's invisibility has way too many restrictions that put him in an awkward situation. Wizard's invisibility is a good example of a hide skill that can be used in combat.

[eager creek]

Damn someone is salty at rangers haha, you get two pieced by my purple longbows ;)?

[pseudo tendon]

@weak karma Speed is meta, more armor more problems.

I agree! Too many wasted points for a specific rogue play style.

[weak karma]

Hahaha! Overconfident like every ranger I've killed. I love watching you kids empty your quivers right before you empty your bowels when you're completely helpless and out of ammo. LMFAO!

[lilac wren]

Solo barb as a low-gear is very painful with the easily readable starting poleaxe side and topswing, in a speed regard. Unlike (medieval fighting games, take your pick) you can't feint to counter their speed advantage when you visibly over-commit to attack.

[quaint ivy]

@lilac wren that's why we saw tons of parbs with mages backing them up. Haste. invis. Fire axe.

[boreal sun]

The big ranger thing is when there's more than one of them and they have smart positioning
If you approach one, you're necessarily leaving the other alone and that other one can shoot you
It's a rough spot to be in

[weak karma]

Pro tip for dealing with easy Rangers like this @eager creek guy: You can lean backwards and forwards in the game. The collider actually moves with you, so while these braggers are sniping noobs, they'll rage hard when they can't land a single shot. Dance and dash, over and over, they crumble so easily. Find yourself a fancy purple (albeit useless) bow, then move onto the next loser ranger and do the same thing. The game's slow projectile movement makes it ez pz.

[pseudo tendon]

Sorry my ADHD kicked in and the arrow hit my face as it always does...

[obsidian plume]

Yes, but sometimes you kind of have to, and you are literally dead. If they have any braincells functioning, you cannot kill them. You have to pray to God you can escape. Whilst any other class can at least try.

[boreal sun]

"hope they miss" isn't exactly good counterplay

[runic axle]

^ said by someone who hasnt played ranger and tried to hit headshots on a moving, dodging target with the expected variable netcode in a playtest

[pseudo tendon]

"But I'm melee, how else do I run at rangers?"

[strong shale]

you could just shoot them in the body, around the abdominal

[eager creek]

See me in high roller bub, you cant even pay the entry to the lobbies i play in xD

[boreal sun]

I have played ranger and I know it's safer to aim for center of mass and get more guaranteed damage

It's the sniper problem, where it's a onesided interaction where, if you want to approach in their sightline, you have to hope they miss

You dodging is the same thing as them missing, it's not really counterplay, it's just a failure on their part

[weak karma]

High roller is where I roll the most rangers, but keep bragging, kid. It definitely makes you look intimidating.

[dawn raptor]

Whoa there's a badass in chat

[neon sparrow]

Lower barb axe range it’s too long you’re giving barb a long weapon range and Mutiple damage boost passives make zero sense

[boreal sun]

Main ranger counterplay is using obstacles and line of sight blockers to close distance, and to use shields well

But a good ranger will know how to keep their distance, or will have teammates to prevent your approach

[pseudo tendon]

I'm usually looting gear for someone else.

[eager creek]

Pff ik, you should see my KDA, id smoke you without looking at my monitor. Luckily I have a wirless headset so when you step in my trap while im taking a piss just know I let you live on purpose, kid.

[obsidian plume]

Also it doesn't make any sense why the wizards can run whilst invisible and the router has to take a perk, crawl, and can only move for 10 steps.

[queen lynx]

@unkempt oasis - added your suggestion, not sure why yours crashed

[sterile sage]

Ah yes, the act of paying 100 gold before playing a match when most green pieces of gear are sold for that amount. Truly makes a person worthy of the highest praise

[jaunty scaffold]

Try not to cut yourself on that edge buddy

[unkempt oasis]

thx

[lilac wren]

The range defines the class, as its made for peeking over the shields, just short of heater-shields which are getting close to tower-shield territory

[pseudo tendon]

Warriors are perfectly good 🥸

[eager creek]

Orlanthi def makes fighter look like a fine class. Saw him take out narikk the other day.

[pseudo tendon]

Anyone would be fine if they had a two pocket supports

[eager creek]

well Narikk the #1 killer outlaw also had double pocket support so, it evend out.

[jaunty scaffold]

I’m curious about how Bard is going to work. A roguish support sounds fun

[lilac wren]

#d-and-d-suggestions message

I agree with this sugg, crafting felt a bit lacking, with some suprising choices of who gets crafts and who doesn't. At most the most valuable generic monsters to farm are mummies, which continously drop gemstones and valuable rings.

Mummy spider jars for instance yielding 3 silk patches for the clothier would have been fine.

[eager creek]

#d-and-d-suggestions message You guys like the current state of haste meta?

[lilac wren]

I always thought fighter was more of a prize-fighter kind of role, than a all around merc. I expected a prettyboy with a dainty sword.

[tawdry isle]

It is the result of very low TTK, where usually the person to get the first hit off in melee combat wins. There is not a whole lot of options to "outplay" your opponent outside of dodging a hit matrix style.

[white cliff]

Real and true.

[wintry wind]

I am more interested in a Dispel option being added than removing an ability

[lilac wren]

#d-and-d-suggestions message

Easy sugg to address, just have your item weight deal damage when you jump on enemies so you can stomp the spiders in plate.

Also me, on a overhang beneath a party.
https://media.tenor.com/JEXAiQdogw4AAAAd/kratos-falling.gif

[pseudo tendon]

I prefer lower TTK than Minecraft slug fests

[white cliff]

Engagement time depends on gear though, some uniques do true damage or special effects that one to two shot people.

[eager creek]

dispel would still require a wizard on team though, I think a good balance to removing haste would be to remove some slow from ranged attacks, because if you get hit twice w a bow you just are stuck in place.

[wintry wind]

Only if that option is put on Wizard instead of another class. There's already loading screen art of both a Druid and a Bard

So I'm hopeful that the niche will.be filled outside of the current class dynamics

I also wouldn't be opposed to items that have similar function to some spells. Explosive Bottle to Fireball for example.

So a dispel rune or something similar would be interesting.

[pseudo tendon]

Chef class please, carries camp kits and frying pans

[lilac wren]

You say that, but i wouldn't know how you expect people to put out the zoning fires as well as any other source of fire in the first place. (without like a bucket of bottomless water)

Skeleton mage fireballs have a short lived area of denial but flamebottles last a lot longer.

[wintry wind]

Create Water is a classic D&D spell, but honestly I don't see it as a huge concern to address.

[granite plinth]

omg the latest suggestion is so good

[weary spear]

Nerf throwing axes. Also allow rangers to use any throwable as such.

[harsh belfry]

did you just hype your own suggestion?

[granite plinth]

yes

[boreal forge]

So I have to wait 5 Hours to be able to post a suggestion again when my suggestion I tried to post never even got through because I apparently the limit is 1900 characters. BUT THAT WAS NEVER SPECIFIED Like Wtf, I am being punished for something that was never even a written rule and I followed the prompt to a tea

[manic gorge]

Can rogues get a perk that allows them to do a running slide, and or wall jumps. Some nod to the acrobat prestige class.

[loud cargo]

100% ttk needs to be lower at high gear. Rn it's whoever gets the first hit in cuz it one shots / does 80% anyway xD

[boreal forge]

that'd be disgusting

[ornate hound]

I saw an interview and they stated they wanted to add a bard. it would be cool if the bard had a campfire like ability where he could sit and play music and people in its range get a "inspired" buff or something for 2-3mins where they run a bit faster and regen a little bit of health

[manic gorge]

Disgustingly fun!

[astral ether]

hey who is the suggestor in the suggestions

is it a bot or like an actual moderator

[lilac wren]

Read the reactions, says its a bot.

[wispy hemlock]

It also says ✅bot next to its name

[wintry wind]

Reading? Literate elitists trying to push their way of life on me 😠

[white cliff]

Trolls ruined the suggestions channel in between play tests, and the the 200k the in the discord warrant the timer as well. Also, usually anything above 1900 characters has too many points so it gets downvoted or is just generally too wordy.

[stuck leaf]

How do you make an edit to a suggestion with the 6hr cooldown on the chat?

[white cliff]

That’s the neat part, you don’t.

[keen grove]

when gonna be #5 playtest guys?

[void canyon]

not announced afaik

[white cliff]

@tender saffron Lich is already an enemy type.

[tender saffron]

Oh that must be the robed figure that sent me to hell lol

[boreal forge]

I wrote a well detailed Duelist class suggestion that I got pretty good feedback on from several people.

[boreal forge]

and that doesn't justify them NOT writing that rule down. cause now I got to wait for Hours on end to send the edited version that has less characters in it. Well then the Limitation should have been stated.

[white cliff]

It’s a limitation not really a rule.

[boreal forge]

that kind of stuff should be stated so people don't have to wait 6 hours to send the same suggestion again but edited.

[white cliff]

@frank herald a reward for 2 million play testers is kinda redundant.

[grave oriole]

Will there be loot crates for me to gamble for skins?

[twin wadi]

even if you write a detailed suggestion, if devs were to add it, they'd have to rework it here and there to fit with their vision
usually a top-level overview is enough, if you can't describe your idea in few sentences, you either overcomplicated it or focused on unimportant details

[river mauve]

I dont want to repeat a suggestion but was there one made to make the pickup on a small item easier? Rings or bracelets for example - make the item pickup have a larger pickup "area" instead of having to perfectly hover over the item to collect. Maybe make the vacant space in the middle of some of the objects still count as a collectable surface?

[tired forum]

i have a feeling a portion of the 2million play testers were banned for cheating, and made new accounts to get back into the free playtest

[boreal forge]

dude that's a given. ofcourse they should rework and optomize it to fit their vision. I got zero problems with whatever happens with the suggestion, I just don't want to wait 6 hours because of something that I had no idea wasn't possible. They. Should. Have. Wrote. It DOWN. that you can't post over 1900 character posts.

[tired forum]

more of an issue with the bot theyre using rather than their fault

[boreal forge]

Sure if you want to go by making them configure the bot. But this could easily be fixed, BY THEM WRITING IT DOWN.

[tacit fossil]

Guys, would make the game spoiled if they add itens for players "roll" the item stats?

[stuck leaf]

What kind of cheats are even viable in a game like this? Walls and aimbot for the zap hitscan? 😛 I suppose seeing the loot tables would be strong but could be mitigated by rolling the loot when you open a container.

[nimble socket]

Maybe if they tie the rr to a rare item that can be found. But it should be really difficult to get.

[boreal forge]

Simple just put in. "Keep posts under 1900 characters" Is that so hard? I wouldn't have minded the wait if my post went through which it would have done if I'd have seen in the channel that it said to keep it under 1900, but my post never made it through so it's just a bs reason for me to wait.

[tacit fossil]

Probally a boss drop?-

[boreal forge]

So far every response has failed to see what I have a problem with. instead the response was a jab at my suggestion being possibly "overcomplicated" without knowing a single digit of what I wrote (purely demotivating speculation) or that somehow because "It's a limitation not really a rule" makes up for my argument that they should have it written down there for people to see.

I rest my case

[lusty wren]

The crash hack is pretty useful in this game id imagine lol

Also seeing through walls is HUGE you can always make sure to ambush when they are looting or off guard

[gilded wyvern]

@river mauve Believe me! I understand the frustration in your suggestion but I think the difficulty in picking them up is supposed to be the point, it slows you down. I'm pretty mixed on it.

[nimble socket]

Yea, probably small chance for it to drop. But then people will hold on to legendaries and uniques and farm rr items. No legendary items will appear in the player markets because they will be hoarded. Basicly "bad rolls" on weapons would not be a problem, but idk if that is a good thing.

[twin wadi]

I mean come on dude, I assume your duelist suggestion focused on explaining what passives and active skills it should have, rather than giving a short description of what role it fits and what tools it uses
I could probably spend 1900 characters writing down how rogue should work in D&D, or I could just say "guy with stealth, poisons and ability to mess with mechanical contraptions"

[boreal forge]

Yeah I wrote perks and skill suggestions and weapons that could be added with it, so?

[muted locust]

Dude this isn't Titanfall. NPCs can barely move forward without bugging and you're asking for slides and wall jumps?

[tacit fossil]

If it's so hard to get, i think it is fair, look's like an unique utilitarie item from now on haha

[boreal forge]

it even had descriptions throughout the whole thing of how it'd be for pve, pvp, teamplay, and what it's main playstyle could be like. So what? If I had ideas for every other instances of it's kit to have it be able to have a balanced amount of options to spec into, what's so wrong with that? really IF they saw it and considered it I would have made it a lot easier for them in the first place by it being a template to work off of.

[lime marsh]

holy shit 6 hour cooldown

[grand obsidian]

RELEASE THE GAME ILL BUY IT. WHO AGREES 10,000 COPY AND PASTES THEYLL DO IT

[muted locust]

Oh yeah there was one time where I accidentally suggested in this channel and got reprimended by the bot. I went to suggest in the right channel but the bot didn't let me send the message because I had to wait 4 more seconds. I tried to send it after the 4 seconds and the bot counted it as message sent so I had to wait 6 hours

[daring gazelle]

I'd like to see Arena Teams gladiator style. 2v2 or 3v3.

[mighty willow]

The cd is from discord not from the bot, therefore you message counts even tho the bot wasnt "ready" for it.

[boreal forge]

would be better with a less dungeon like map. a dark forest maybe or a mountainside

[twin wadi]

and while cool and all, all that fluff rarely adds actual value to the suggestion, I personally enjoy reading a short description than delving about a "what-if" scenario of a class that might never make it to production
basically you can type 10% as much to convey 90% of the idea

[stuck leaf]

@gilded wyvern I actually really like the idea of nabbing something off the belt. It’s useful, irritating to the victim, and quite a bit more practical.

[lilac wren]

Obviously a racial perk for elves.

So i can have my cross-class orc with the savage perk on something like fighter, or cleric

[boreal forge]

That's not always true or the case. and as said, there was a short description to it.
With even the wackiest suggestion of a class you could make it could be even more challanging to come up with ways to implement it effectively. Hence giving suggestions.

[finite nebula]

Jesus christ dude you're bitching about something rudimentary. wait your 6 hours then post it instead of sitting here complaining

[past elk]

ADD BASHING TO ALL BOWS

[lunar spruce]

A cool thing would be if spiders gave loot so it made it worth killing the elite+ spiders instead of just an annoying mob. A way this could work is if only the first 3 spiders gave loot (maybe similar to flying skulls or mummies). The limit of 3 would stop players from abusing the spiders respawning.

[loud cargo]

fuck elite spiders. Especially in goblin cave

[boreal forge]

And still, you seem to ignore the actual problem I had in the first place. I really could care less to talk about the contents of my suggestion, but you still keep going onto it. I made it clear what my problem was and you really shouldn't care how I wrote it when you never were the one I was appealing towards. So? ok you like short descriptions, good for you I hope you find more short light novels to read. I never cared to know or ever possibly wondered what you specifically would be after in a suggestion, I made my piece about what my complaint was and what you wanted to point out something irrelevant to that. But great now I know you like short descriptors, thanks.

[finite nebula]

Cope

[boreal forge]

I don't care.

[finite nebula]

obviously you do if you've spent like the last hour complaining about a rudimentary "rule" that wasn't clarified, hop off it mate lmao

[lusty wren]

Jesus this is still going?

[boreal forge]

I can clarify for you: I don't care in the slightest of what you say or what they said, I made a complaint over 1 thing. then they jabbed at me over irrelevant things I could care little to nothing about.

[finite nebula]

"I don't care" - proceeds to respond

[boreal forge]

So by me responding I am displaying emotional investment and "interest"? pop off I guess.

[frozen scaffold]

Would it be cool if Rogues could disarm/arm traps throughout the dungeon?

[finite nebula]

if something truly doesn't bother you, you display that by simply ignoring it. Yes, you are displaying investment and interest by responding to the people who are "jabbing" you.

[nimble socket]

@flat heath they should halve the time fart cloud stay but increase it's damage to still make it a threat. Most annoying thing about it was how long it lingered, but it should remain a threat so no one can run through with the little damage it does.

[lilac wren]

Environmental traps work off easy to read triggers, a simple spike trap can be entirely disarmed by just throwing a torch at it, then walking over it before it re-arms.

If you're really talking about traps, do you mean littering the maps with the consumable/re-armable traps already laid down? I can imagine those being pretty spammy.

[brittle cosmos]

Maybe earn tickets by surviving maps or something

[lilac wren]

#d-and-d-suggestions message

This is already planned anyway in some capacity, if you look in the "Coming Soon" category under service and quests, and other placeholder icons. I assume more quests, grabbing stuff and killing monsters with a successful escape might up your relationship with that character.

I was going to make a sugg similar to this but at a tangent.

[frozen scaffold]

Maybe it’s not a big deal, but I just thought the idea of a rogue being able to disarm stuff like floor spikes, swinging axes, and wall spikes would be a cool bonus to playing a rogue. Obviously you wouldn’t always want to keep them disarm invade people following you but maybe if you were running with group it might benefit the group as a whole.

[brittle cosmos]

I think an easy QOL change would have the collector buy all items, having to sell to specific vendors adds almost nothing to the game, buying stuff from different vendors makes sense

[nimble sinew]

Can i edit my suggestion without 6 hour chat delay?

[mighty willow]

they already have a perk to see and disarm the "pve" traps

[robust lark]

All of these suggestions! while some seem they slightly may be plausible, we are in danger of trying to make this game like every other game we have played. I say let the devs complete there vision and everybody slow down a wee bit.

[brittle cosmos]

I suggested arena and one vendor to sell to..

[astral ether]

where tf do u find a lich

[quaint herald]

Le boss

[robust lark]

If you have time watch a dev interview, they have mentioned an arena in the back of the tavern. They have lots of plans and ideas:)

[sacred quest]

I just think they should a practice room with dummies to test damage and stuff

[rough mural]

If they did add a practice room, if they could, maybe add a small moving target to practice attacks on as well?

[white cliff]

It’s a boss on B3.

[fleet wing]

Anyone like the idea of there being a physical guild vault people could enter if there were to be guilds in the game? One that could look like a bigger version of the golden room? Please tell me your thoughts, and mb see what i wrote in the dnd suggestion chat:
#d-and-d-suggestions message

[sacred quest]

like where they can get items from their guild? that might ruin the grind though. if anything id think they'd first allow you to share your stash among your other classes but even then that might hurt the hardcore feeling or the game that people like

[fleet wing]

I wrote in the chat, but you would need a special guild key that could be traded to you by a player who has access to it, plus it's not necessary. It's not like you can get the key and just steal everything. Plus it's most likely gonna be a max of like 15 ish players per guild so it's a small community that doesn't benefit greatly from the items. And again, you can still die with the items, so u don't really have an infinite supply of items, since others might need some too.

[sacred quest]

frankly id just be happy with my own room where i can have my stash and test dummies. Maybe have decorations that they can make some more money off of purchases that dont impact the game.

[verbal marsh]

.shortinfo 1607854 I think it would be cool if you could freelook over left of shoulder and it'd change your character weapon stance to a more of a martial position.

[eager sable]

Suggestion from ReKaimelar#4794

Free Look - mmb, click to reset position. This way people can run around with different stances. I would also like to see different weapon neutral stances for running, walking, and carrying various weapons.

Suggestions Feed Post

Suggestions Feed Post

Suggestion ID: 1607854 | Submitted at · Feb 16, 2023, 6:48 PM

[fleet wing]

ooh, a housing system, thats something i'll suggest next

[rugged pilot]

Yeah agreed, dunno about the martial position thing, but freelook would be lovely

[verbal marsh]

imagine if you freelook over left shoulder it'd give you a left dominate weapon quarterstaff attack, and freelook over right it'd switch it to right, kinda like cornering with a gun.

[rugged pilot]

Yeah, thats what I thought you were getting at. I am against directional attacks

[sacred quest]

yea like have Skellington props with a loadout on them and maybe boss trophies to help push boss fights and let your friends visit. there might be more important things they need to focus on but stuff like this to do that isnt stressful would be cool to me at least

[verbal marsh]

wouldn't be directional it would just change up your combo to give you 3 different variants as well as allow freelook quiet movement when staying still. FE: with sword and shield it would give you a shield dominate position opposed to a strike closing position

[earnest swift]

Brewing your own potions or crafting bandage?

[rugged pilot]

I think the key to this game is the locked animations and combos, so I don't like that idea

[lusty wren]

Look left get left attack, look right get right attack. Sounds like directional combat to me

[fleet wing]

Exactly, perhaps like a sort of dungeon that could be refurnished into a sort of mansion like map, with silk curtains and red carpets, vintage paintings, and most importantly EXPENSIVE collectibles gathered from your journey. Maybe they could add a legendary rarity to treasure which makes it 10x more valuable but gives you an option to instead showcase it in your home?

[verbal marsh]

nah the combo's are stronger in game if you were always one tapping you wernt doing combat effeiciently.

[sacred quest]

maybe? my only worry there would be them going into a different direction with the game. like that would add crafting supplies to the game and maybe lower the difficulty which i dont think is what they are trying to do

[lusty wren]

How does this change the fact that look left get left attack is directional combat? 😄 lol its clearly directional combat as you described. Which imo does not fit this game.

[earnest swift]

Fair point, maybe best to not make it more similar to tarkov hehe

[verbal marsh]

it is directional combat what is your point? I cant hit people behind me.

[lusty wren]

"wouldn't be directional it would just change up your combo to give you 3 different variants" LOL contradict yourself much? Ill move on.

Devs have talked about doing some form of instanced housing sounds pretty cool

[verbal marsh]

no it would change how your animation initiates the attack, so you could control your body more the overall combo would remain the same it would just be visually improved.

[sacred quest]

that would rock in my opinion. its not going to benefit you other than just having bling. being able to but expansions would be cool and i think if they had rare decoration drops to extract with it would be a sweet trading avenue i think.

[fleet wing]

yeah, like having legendary/unique treasure having wildly more interesting designs, like a goblet having jewels on it, or a jewel having glowing runes on it, and they could be stored in glass cases.

[velvet berry]

I like the glass case idea so it’s a sound cue as well

[white cliff]

It’s not an mmo I don’t think it really needs a housing system, that’s an incredible amount of development resources.

[sacred quest]

idk about looking different directions to change attacks but that does make me think that it would be cool to have a stance changing class to improve range, damage, or speed of your attacks. or just give it to fighter to feel more unique

[verbal marsh]

if you pan your camera left with freelook you still attack center screen, your animation would essentially reflect where you're looking and give off a different vibe to your enemy, change the gate in your footsteps and give you a better feel toward pacing and space.

[sacred quest]

yea thats why i thought it would have to be a down the road idea do that they can focus on more important issues. its just the direction id personally like to see it get to eventually that would make it more enjoyable for some and make them money in the process.

[white cliff]

I’m interested in what will make the game the most enjoyable for the most people. I really have low interest in making the game like the sims, or like “insert you’re favorite game here”. I like dark and darker because it’s like nothing I’ve ever played.

[rugged pilot]

The point is people do not want directional combat. Why pretend it isn't when we both know it is?

[verbal marsh]

your definition of directional combat seems very narrow, you are using directional combat so I don't see your point in any regard.

[fleet wing]

wouldve been a bigger problem if they really have no time to work on it. knowing they must add maps and enemies, it certainly would be out of the question for at least a year after its release. however, it will only go into early access this april, with them basically already knowing what to do with the game before it's fully out, so they have time to flesh out a lot of the mechanics/ideas they want to implement in the following months, and just creating a small cellar for a start is nothing difficult, since there are many cellar like structures not only in the forgotten castle, but literally in the waiting room/tavern, afterwards they need only either find some preexisting models of prettier structures and slightly modify them to make them fit in with the idea of a housing system. i agree that if they didn't already have so many assets that could fit in with the idea of a housing system it would be miles more difficult, but i doubt it would take more than 3 months to create good housing with their engine

[rugged pilot]

Directional combat is you choosing what direction you swing your weapon, like in Mordhau or Chivalry.

As opposed to what we have in the game currently: Very set animations and combos that swing in set patterns, which is how weapons are countered in D & D

[verbal marsh]

and I stated my concept would not change the direction swing of your weapon O.o, it would change your animation to reflect your freelook position. I fail to see your assessment of my suggestion.

[white cliff]

Realize what you’re asking for, a full fledged housing system with assets customization and display cases, that’s multiplayer accessible and includes trading, and items. This takes modelers, textures, and coders all time to do when they could be doing something else. Sure modularity helps with what they’ve already made but nothing poofs into existence. Think about the changes that have been made since last PT and now.

[rapid iris]

For the thief skill that allows you to steal. Would it be possible to use it on other players in the pre lobby? Since the rogues are so weak it would help balance the matches if they can steal a potion or armor from a player before the matches begin

[sacred quest]

thats understandable from your perspective but i think it wouldnt effect how you go about it at all. its just a slice of life add to the game that i think many players would enjoy while benefiting the devs and adding more depth to the game and market system

[real owl]

Noooo girl, there's no way of resisting that through combat etc

[rugged pilot]

That still changes the direction the attack comes from my guy.

[verbal marsh]

no, if i have freelook left, my position would still start with a top down attack, followed by a right swing, and a left swing, The difference would be my character is looking left while initiating the combo, and his foot work would change to reflect where he is looking. Nothing else changes. - Now if I do that with freelookg right, it would look differently because its right hand dominate but it would still be an overhead with a right and a left.

[lusty laurel]

id like do have an ui reference for currently equiped rarity of consumable: pot, bandage etc is hard to remember in combat wich slot a determined consumable have

sry my english is terrible isnt my native language

[fleet wing]

Again, i understand, however if they can already have a pre match lobby, i greatly doubt that porting that exact system to the housing without a timer would be difficult. I understand your worry for the team, but they already have everything they need in the game, I'm not asking them to rewrite the code of the game, it's literally copy pasting existing mechanics with some alterations that are not hard to pull off at all. I know how this works

[rugged pilot]

Why does your head looking left change footwork or swinging animations? If I do 3 strikes with an arming sword in real life, and then do the same 3 swings with my head looking to my left, I don't have to change anything about how I do the strikes.

[wet condor]

I agree I want dungeon levels and spells and stuff more than housing, but housing would be sick, more stash space, place to train without losing your stuff, another way to make money for dark and darker if they wanna sell more cosmetic stuff, more things to do in the game and doesn't get rid of the enjoyment people have without it

[amber token]

we need 4 player parties

[sacred quest]

i think you might be over complicating it. most of what they need already exists and anything they add can contribute. for example lets say they add a new map and a new boss. to make a trophy for that they would just need the bosses head, that already exists, and put it on the mount. like messa said they already have most of the code also from just the lobby.

[verbal marsh]

if you do 3 strikes with arming sword with head left, you shoulder would be facing your enemy and your swing would be short. if you were to be right sided you'd have a little more range but the footwork would give you more drag due to center of gravity pushing beyond your body.

[north sandal]

Nerf healing if you have to but please for the love of god make the character hitboxes for healing and buff spells a bit bigger. missing a heal spell or a protection spell because you're 1 pixel off their character model is the most annoying thing on the planet, especially when its wasted on a tile floor or wall

[rugged pilot]

I'm not turning my entire body, just my head. I can repeat a trio of strikes with no difference in those strikes.

No offense, It sounds like you've never actually held and made use of a real sword

[sacred quest]

although i will give you that they would have to do some work on being able to customize your space but might be mostly resolved by using the code that lets you place traps

[verbal marsh]

I can't argue with a mute point. Please learn how gravity and motion works and get back to me.

[lusty laurel]

about healing i think we need some sorta of Grevious wound/Mortal strike that reduces incoming healing or reduce the healing amount of Holy Light with some equipement it heals way too much imho

[rugged pilot]

Please learn that no matter what mode of transport you try to use, I and others do not want Mordhau/Chiv directional combat. It will kill the game.

[sacred quest]

would adding more traps to ranger make it to degenerate?

[north sandal]

@lusty laurel Its all fun and games till you hit one of your own teammates with that

[frigid flint]

pls back this game, is my life pls

[verbal marsh]

I sorry but your opinion doesnt matter to me please feel free to move to discuss other suggestions.

[lusty laurel]

? if u hit a teammates with that u will almost refull him i dont get what ur saying

[rugged pilot]

Thats fine, mine doesn't have to matter. I've seen every single "directional combat, choose your own swinging angle, mordhau/chiv swings please, let me move my mouse the way I want to swing" suggestions, and not one of them got upvoted over downvoted.

[verbal marsh]

you have a narrow imagination and cannot fathom my idea in the context of my limited vocabulary. I'm sorry that you've had a poor experience with other games let DaD fix that for you.

[north sandal]

If they did add something like that it wouldn't be on a weapon, it would be a spell. the only person you're usually healing is the melee, if they added a weapon that reduced healing it would undoubtedly become the most used weapon in the game (At some point) Not to mention you could just keep one in your inventory at all times as you would probably use it at least once a game. what you're talking about would completely nullify Cleric @lusty laurel

[rugged pilot]

I have a limited imagination when you try to stealth a mechanic through under peoples noses and then when that fails, try to tell people that its realistic, when its not. You clearly have no idea how actual swordplay works and have played Chivalry and Mordhau, and think that those dead games should be replicated here.

[lusty laurel]

oh i get it now, ye u might be right but i think the healing is a bit too much in term of 1 target healing i dont want it to be nerfed to the ground but reducing a little bit on spell or healing debuff could be right

[verbal marsh]

I'm sorry you've had a poor expierence with Chivalry and Mordhau players. Let me reassure you by letting you know I neither like nore continue to play those games. Please reframe from stereotyping others based on the context of their ideas.

[lusty wren]

Id stop feeding him. Soon he wont be capable of feeding himself in the wild

[rugged pilot]

#d-and-d-suggestions message

You mean like rebindable keys? @neat flint Let me rephrase that, it was a poor question on my part.

You mean you would like to bind Mousewheel to scroll through toolbelt 3 & 4 slots?

[north sandal]

That's what I mean, like nerf the healing a little and make it a little easier to hit the intended target. I don't want it to be baby easy but hitting a hasted barb when he's enraged and flailing around to evade hits is almost impossible @lusty laurel

[lusty laurel]

we have seen enough buffed barbarian rampaging all over the place with stacked pot, haste, ignite ,invis, bless, shield healing spam in this playtest and it isnt really "balanced"

[short turret]

make the game early access right now!!!!! best game on the market...

[verbal marsh]

I'm hungry, and he doesn't really have any food he's beating himself up.

[rugged pilot]

Please standby and let the devs develop their game.

[lusty wren]

It should be. If you guys chose to make the barb run at mach 2 and he doesn't understand to make himself a easier healing target when low then it deserves to be tough

[lime marsh]

communicate and tell him to stop or back up for 1 second so you can heal him?

[verbal marsh]

plenty of bad players out there that walk right into a mouse trap. nothing you can do about it.

[rugged pilot]

I agree with this but I am also a cleric that is incapable of healing people that are unhasted / invis'd dude. It hurts to fail to support people. Mentally and physically when the Barb dies and you are the next enemy to face their frontline lmao

[inner thorn]

yes barbarians can hit you basically from any position, but short weapons need precise shooting

[short turret]

oh i will, i loved this game and i don't mind to wait (or maybe a lil bit lol), but the thing is with early acces i think this game will blow up on player base, this game have so much to offer, is a good game and thats not normal in the market nowdays

[lusty laurel]

i think buff stacking is a bit out of control that barb/fighter, wizard, cleric meta is outrageous, some teamfight looks like rooster fights

[ancient briar]

I know a lot of you wizards would hate this change but ask yourself what you hate more.. nerfing the charges, meditation, damage or whatever comes next.

#d-and-d-suggestions message

In my opinion invisibility makes this class to versatile. It would suck to see this spell go but at the same time.. it sucks to be nerfed in every other possible way. Once the invisibility is gone, the class will still have it edge and maybe finally people will stop complaining about how busted the class is.

[rugged pilot]

Yes but blowing up is the last thing it needs to do right now. They reached astronomical numbers for a playtest and have alot of data to digest and work to do, people are getting a bit outrageous with the demands for another playtest and paid access NOW, SOON, ASAP.

Let 'em cook. 🧑‍🍳 👩‍🍳

[inner thorn]

well in rock-scissors-paper you cant make rockskissorspaper and say its balanced

[verbal marsh]

I found it amazing whenever players try to run behind me as cleric when I keep them topped off lol, it really comes down to fight or flight being chosen incorrectly that costs clerics their lives.

[short turret]

this remind me of the toy story meme, hollup... let him cook

[lime marsh]

I appreciate that each class can be incredibly deadly if the player is exceptionally skilled, even if a barb CAN 1-shot doesn't mean he WILL

[sacred quest]

Its ok to not want to wait too long. a game can become very stale and make its players move on if the devs dont maintain interest. Im fine with waiting for release but they released the demo so the hype is in effect and its their job to keep it rolling

[ancient briar]

I never said anything about balancing it. I am playing wizard and I see that invisibility makes this class a nuker and an assassin. @rugged pilot they can play around and see what works best.

@median owl it's not about being op.. it's about being two in one class. You are basically a rouge with spells.

[rugged pilot]

Haste is what needs to be removed, not invisibility. Haste genuinely makes OTHER classes need nerfs because it exists.

[inner thorn]

yeah better assassin then rogue which is extra sad

[median owl]

Every class can be op, barb can one shot, wizz can deal huge aoe, archer has high per target dps and range, rouge can backline one shot squishy, priest can heal up teammates to full, fighter can be almost immortal all depends how u play every class

[rugged pilot]

Except Wizard can actively give superpowers to his teamates at the moment

[robust lark]

agreed, all classes are deadly in the right situations.

[ancient briar]

I dont think wizard should be allowed to cast the haste and invis 10 meters behind cover and gap close and go behind the enemy line. I think it's busted.

@median owl i personally don't like the dagger build but I know how powerful it is. my preference is crystal sword due to its range

[short turret]

yea thats also true, i feel like the wait for the next play test (or realease) shouldn't be that long, bc a lot players will lose interest and that could be bad for them, but we will see, i trust the devs

[hazy rock]

Where was this confirmed? If there is a post?

[median owl]

@rugged pilot Here we go...
@ancient briar i mean if you use the dagger build u can but still your invisibility is much less

[twin delta]

I've found it again #the-tavern message

someone pointed out that the list is
fighter
barbarian
rogue
ranger
cleric
wizard

bard

artificer/alchemist
druid
paladin
sorcerer
warlock

[inner thorn]

you can run with this inv

[lusty laurel]

i like a wizard that throw fireball etc not a buffer with a flaming dagger in his hand stabbing you like a rogue i think the buff itselfs (haste, ignite) on himself or teammates are what bring this class to nerfs, invis is the least of the problems, at least to my experience

[rugged pilot]

I have no more to say on that subject lmao. If you look into the cause of alot of balance problems, its either damage stacking or Wizard

[sacred quest]

i do too. its kind of unfortunate that they put this pressure on themselves though. they've allowed people to play the core of the game and while its fantastic so for they are going to to be sprinting for success now. i agree with you and think they should make the game buyable now so they can afford development power

[astral ether]

@toxic basin the barbarian is already pretty slow and ranger does a good amount of damage

[ancient briar]

although I agree, removing haste would nerf the wizard more than removing the stealth

[median owl]

@inner thorn true but its like 3 seconds so it will usually be expected unlike rogue
@rugged pilot lets not start it it would last xD

[toxic basin]

@astral ether The barbarian has a crapton of health and damage. As it stands he can walk up to you and one shot you even if you put 4 arrows into him. The bow is very weak. I literally shot a guy in the back 3 times while he stood still channeling a blue portal. He finished and got out. That shouldn't be a thing.

[median owl]

that a big no no, haste has to be in the game as long as others have speed boosts if not then it would be ok

[jovial sail]

Shoulda aimed for his head ;)

[inner thorn]

huh dont you want 6 headhot stabs and 50% hp left?

[ancient briar]

I'd rather have my stealth removed than haste. What I don't like for wizards is to get to the backline so easily. Of course.. you may get hit by someone and it will reveal you but most often you don't get hit.

[toxic basin]

@jovial sailSure, that would've killed him. But hitting the head shouldn't be the requirement for killing someone. 3-4 arrows to the chest or back sounds balanced. If you are worried about the triple shot by the ranger, nerf the damage on that.

[rugged pilot]

@median owl I simply don't have much more to say on that subject, so it wouldn't last for me.

#d-and-d-suggestions message

I love the very suggestion of a musketeer or gunpowder rifleman class, but not all the extra details and fluff in the suggestion.

Just give me a shitty blackpowder rifle class or weapon option, god please.

[astral ether]

then nerf the damage and health bc barb has a tough time keeping up with people when trying to hit them. As for the arrows body shots do very little for the smaller ones and even the longbow so just hit them in the head

[next vault]

I just got some top behind a Taco Bell dumpster for $3.67 and a steak chalupa

[median owl]

Same love haste more, it would be best if we switched invisibility with some kind of blink for escape instead of stealth for engage if you agree

[sacred quest]

think haste is fine. i play ranger a lot and nobody would catch me without it

[weary lotus]

he will lol

[lusty laurel]

every single buff alone is ok the problem is when u put 6 buff on a single player, he will run mach3 oneshotting everything he touch, there is no counterplay u can just run and hope he misses or play the rooster fight with one of your teammates with the same buffs XD

[ancient briar]

I'd be afraid that blink with many charges would make the class busted again. If that was one charge only with medium to bad recovery I'd be okay with it.

Anyway that's also it for me. I spoke my mind and its up to people and devs decide.

I will say this though, If they don't remove invis.. I will keep annihilating backlines as if I was an assassin which is rouges job to be an assassin.

[verbal marsh]

Base gear felt fairly balanced. Cleric < Ranger < Doubles . Felt like geared gameplay was fairly balanced as well although I didn't encounter many evan fights.

[astral ether]

yeah 3-4 body shot kill does not sound balanced. If you want higher damage then try going for crossbow or just try meleeing

[inner thorn]

Dont you have occurances of full geared teams when you are level 1 all of the time? lucky

[median owl]

@rugged pilot The problem with musks avoiding the theme wise part would be it would either deal lower or higher damage then other ranged classes depending how they make it so it would b op or garbage
@ancient briar Agreed, but like 1 blink , with 1 recovered per full meditate and its a faster cast of course otherwise no point not to haste

[rough mural]

If the Dev's want to add blackpowder weapons, that's fine, I personally enjoy the style of fighting and outfits they're depicted as having, I mean, if you're gonna charge into hell, you may as well look fabulous while doing it.

[verbal marsh]

I hit lv 5 after one delve, I didn't find exiting or leveling particularly difficult, and the solo dungeon was ez mode.

[inner thorn]

i need to enter same servers) full plated fighters x3 make me sad all of the time

[rugged pilot]

I hope so. I really do.

I loved the Pirate idea, having a flintlock pistol or blunderbuss on a skill, an array of 1 handed weaponary and access to bombs and the firebottle. MAN that sounded fun.

Dude could start shirtless with some seafarers boots and bandana, cutlass and a crappy pistol to dualwield... Oh man I'd be hyped.

[quaint ivy]

I would LOVE to see a pirate class.

[ancient briar]

They could also make haste cancel if you use invisibility, it would be much harder to get on the enemy backline. For now it is too easy to get to the poor cleric or ranger or any other backline class. For example, rouges needs to be smart how they use their stealth while wizard.. just pops it and gets to the enemy in no time.

[toxic basin]

@astral ether Yes. That's how it should be. The barbarian is a rampaging tank warrior that deals out a lot of damage up close and has a lot of health. I don't think that should be changed. Instead I think it'll balance him out more if he was even slower. That's the price you pay for playing him. If you want more speed, haste him with wizard (which they already do anyway because he's so broken). For arrows, "justHEETheemEENDAHED" isn't a solution. It shouldn't be the requirement for killing someone, it should be a massive pay off for someone that manages to do it. And it's not a 1 shot 1 kill to the head anyway. You still need to shoot them 2-4 times in the head depending on the bow and who it is. You know how difficult that is to do while they are rushing you? There aren't that many long lines of sight in the game, there are a lot of corners. 3-4 Body shot kill absolutely sounds balanced (Unless it's a survival bow). Crossbow isn't meant for a solo. It's meant for a group that can cover your reload times. Because if you shoot once and miss, you're dead. Unless you mean the small crossbow which is fine and dandy except it's WAY too expensive for the base model.

[verbal marsh]

full plat is easy to kite around entire dungeon unless you're a cleric to where you've just to kill entire group... Like I said Cleric < Ranger < Doubles / cleric

[sacred quest]

when's mimic class?

[inner thorn]

rogue with extra steps?
you can close chests if you want pressing shift-f

[median owl]

How about a necromancer class, but like he can control only 1 sceleton for a duration not red ones though or reanimated player corpses only he or his team killed max 1 controlled or he lifesteals with spells idk what do u guys think

[sacred quest]

nah just would be funny to chase people around as a mimic chest lol

[toxic basin]

@astral ether And when you add blue pots and shields into the mix, good luck even doing 20% damage before they get to you. And then you're at massive disadvantage because you do 10% less damage with a melee weapon.

[inner thorn]

1 skeleton is super weak for players, you will be shredded pretty fast

[lusty laurel]

as rogue i would love to have consumable traps for boxes that explode when box is opened dealing damage, hiding in a room with a trapped box waiting for someone to loot it, solo player life in this game is hard XD

[verbal marsh]

they nerfed my chugalug potion stacking early into playtest xD - No witchers alloud.

[median owl]

maybe you will maybe u can use him as a blocker idk xD just a concept @inner thorn

[sacred quest]

while that sounds cool i dont think rogues need to be more annoying lol

[quaint ivy]

My class List:
Pirate - slow reload heavy hitting pistols / blunderbus / scimitar
Druid - Heals over time - shape shifting - slows and roots
Monk - fist combat / self healing / damage denial chanting
Warlock - Minor npc summonings that aid you - eldrith magic
Alchemist - concoctions - alchemy bombs - sling shot with debuffs

I wanna see some COOL shit implemented (obviously these are all just random takes, dont judge it too hard)
The point is, i wanna see either new takes or old DND takes of classes.

[astral ether]

yeah i meant the regular crossbow and making the barb slower just makes it too easy to avoid him as he wouldnt have enough speed to keep up with the lighter classes much less hit them when swinging. As for 3-4 body shots would be broken as heck as the three arrow would do almost ur entire health bar. The smaller bow arent supposed to do that much damage as a trade off for how fast they shoot and movement while shooting.

[rugged pilot]

Dunno about the concept and tbh I don't really mind.

I just want me a gunpowder weapon or multiple of em, and to use them with a onehanded weapon

[inner thorn]

well at least make him killable from behind and not just turning to you and oneshot

[toxic basin]

@astral ether He isn't mean to keep up with the lighter classes. They are mean to avoid him or get wrecked. For the arrow thing we'll have to agree to disagree, I already made my case lol

[median owl]

Tony just sitting here disliking what everyone says while just watching hahaha

[verbal marsh]

crossbows were great, land a crossbow, swap to windlas with true strike to the head, swap back and reload he's either dead or about to be on final shot.

[sacred quest]

minion classes are usually really bad or really op. would probably cause salt eather way

[lusty laurel]

i think a nice fix for this buff meta could be a dispell castable to remove all/part of the buff of a target

[lime marsh]

haha ya it's entertaining, some people are tossing out awesome suggestions, but then there are other ones who are like trying to be game designers on the dev team

[quaint ivy]

I believe we can all agree, Tony smells of Cheese and Elderberries.

[median owl]

its just a concept , if many agree who knows it may go in

[lime marsh]

just voting the same way the suggestion channel does, is that not correct? how else are you supposed to know if people agree or not

[astral ether]

I play a lot of barb and while killing people is easy, ive had almost all my health drained in that three arrow ability with a long bow and at least half with the recurve. Ranger just has a high skill requirement if u wanna face barbs or fighters. And yeah the barb is supposed to be able to keep up with the lighter classes at least when not holding a weapon otherwise the only thing he'd be able to kill is ceric or fighter

[astral ether]

if ur talking about rogue then yeah i can totally understand ur viewpoint

[hardy dawn]

they need to add slide canceling and an AR-15

[quaint ivy]

the crystal ball + dagger combo on mage felt wayyy too strong. i was 1-2 shotting people no matter the class when i used my good gear set, in normals or High roller.
shit was poking for like 90+ dps a stab when enchanted on the training dummy + burn damage
as a mage, even i wanted that nerfed cause it seemed not fitting for a mage.

[lusty laurel]

what you guts think about adding a cleric ability Dispel that remove all/part of the target buff?

[verbal marsh]

getting one shot by fresc is a fair trade off toward wizard being lethal. -I did stack str on a wizard once, it was fun until I failed to block with my quarterstaff twice. the trade off toward having health as wizard not really worth however. Glass cannon all the way.

[lime marsh]

that training dummy doesn't stand a chance

[agile meadow]

maybe weakens the buffs

[quaint ivy]

I guess that's a fair take @verbal marsh just with some str stacking / blue pots, wizards become somewhat tanky

[toxic basin]

@astral ether Yeah, I agree the three shot ability is too strong. It does too much damage and is off cooldown too quickly. It should keep the headshot damage but the bodyshot damage should be halfed per arrow imo. And the ability cd extended by at least 10-15 more seconds. That being said, I'm talking about the base damage by the bow. The example you gave is by the broken q ability, which I agree is broken right now. The barb keeping up with lighter classes is too absurd to respond to, I already made my stand on that. If you disagree, that's on you.

[quaint ivy]

@verbal marsh i never used the quarter staff, but the orb + dagger with how fast and accurate the strikes were, people couldnt react.

Bluepot/ignite/haste/invis, you just hear the cheek clapping feetsies running at you, and then you're dead. lol

[lusty laurel]

you forgot that quickshot will replenish all the arrow loaded instantly by just pressing it, u can press quickshot and cancel to reload instantly and keep running, funny thing is that i already reported suggested to change it and got downvoted to hell

[lime marsh]

that's so much setup to close the distance on someone not paying attention, you earned it

[toxic basin]

@lusty laurel Yeah, that too lol. That ability is too strong to pass up.

[verbal marsh]

a lot more rangers were running tracking when I played wizard, so I didnt really run any stealth plays.

[wintry wind]

What if arrows had a ramp up? They need to fly for a certain distance/duration before reaching 100% damage.

Would help with the issue of triple shots burst damage as you're trying to get close to exploit Rangers perceived weakness.

[inner thorn]

"but most places on the map are small corridors"

[astral ether]

when solo you can easily poke down a barb before he gets to you and finish with a melee. With how fast the smaller bows shoot they do a decent amount of damage. And the barb keeping up is no where near as absurd as u make it to be

[lusty laurel]

all ranger ability, multishot too will replenish all his arrow by just pressing and cancel it

[verbal marsh]

Rangers are weak to barbarian fists, especially when you give them divine strike. - I think I punched more people dead then anything else :3

[wintry wind]

Everything is weak to Barbarian fists

[verbal marsh]

its because field rations + ability are still better then the tradeoff. Rangers have a robust kit when it comes down to it.

[inner thorn]

also how much additional 11 str from ale is on the damage scale?

[lusty laurel]

@verbal marsh
ye ofc but that bypass a basic game mechanics that is reload, when u reload ur slow and are locked in animation for about 2-3 second, the way i was farming the troll was running and shooting arrow non stop by using this mechanic to never have to stop running, and dunno felt quite "unreal" that ability should only give you 3 arrow that u will fire with the ability itself, for example with longbow u can shot 5 arrow, quickshot -> 3 quick arrow and still have 2 extra arrow for free, 10 arrow without a single reload

[verbal marsh]

I didn't check for any changes but previously every str point is 1 phy power and few hp.

[inner thorn]

so +11dmg?

basic short sword for example

[bright ore]

cleric W beer and full buffs fists harder my boi

[frozen solstice]

@sacred quest Did you and I both suggest the same idea?

[minor yew]

Howdy yall, I have a mockup of a GUID suggestion, is there a way to suggest with a picture attached?

[sacred quest]

i didnt even see your suggestion at first lol but yea.

[verbal marsh]

trade off for quick reload is not activating the ability, and losing field rations to chain them together. I still find it fair to bypass reload with it rather then use it. It still has an activation gap of 1 second even though you're not greatly losing movement speed. I often used field rations at full hitpoints just to skip equipment swap penalty to maintain distances.

[frozen solstice]

I had to wait 6 hours to post that suggestion lmao

[wintry wind]

You promise?

[lusty laurel]

@verbal marsh edited my statement to clarify that interaction: for example with longbow u can shoot 5 arrow, quickshot -> 3 quick arrow and still have 2 extra arrow for free, 10 arrow without a single reload, if u have multishot too u can shot another 5 for free basically, ofc the tradeoff is loosing the field ration, but if u have quickshot and multishot u can almost forgot the reload button

[bright ore]

maybe in #dnd-content

[final charm]

Enable Voice Chat by default

[bright ore]

check this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=giwjTsc93z8

[frozen solstice]

@naive stag @sacred quest I think we all I had this Idea, to be fair. I'm sure many people would like their own space while waiting for other party members, or to test gear

[verbal marsh]

I am aware; Essentially a barrage that keeps enemies at bay if you're accurate with your shots. Easily overcome by a full plated fighter backed by a cleric, but otherwise a way to suppress a passage.

[short steppe]

I would like advanced information for all the numbers, math, and calculations behind every stat and ability on items and what they effect. Not many games do this anymore, and it allows for advanced build configuration and planning...

[low violet]

holy hell i was about to post another suggestion and then i noticed the 6 HOUR TIMER (edit: bruh there is even a timer here....)

[lusty laurel]

dynamic spell tooltip with damage/healing calculated could be a good start, there are wizard spell that are not even telling u the base damage of the spell

[frozen solstice]

@scarlet token in regards to battle pass, it is a way to monetize a game without PTW. and its supportive of the devs. I dont think its unideal to monetize their product by more than selling the game at base price, and it helps funds further updates, progression, and new projects. Not inherently a bad thing.

[final charm]

I don't understand why you guys dont seem to like this. Its way more fun to play in character, mute interaction is boring. Also I agree with @short steppe game needs better tooltips.

[inner thorn]

poison damage not calculated on mannequins

[weak vine]

Battlepasses are always dogshit, and take time away from improving the game, just focus on making a good game battlepass is just not needed

[verbal marsh]

smite and judgement as well as healing were all effected by spell power as well, but no obvious values to indicate by how much : <

[clever talon]

I personally would like to see CHESTS. They will be 6 slots, but only take up 4 inside your stash. You can buy them from merchants. That way you can have more room for your gold, or any items you want to store like rings, amulets, ect. Idk how much the chests would cost but i'd say roughly 200-300G basing that off of the amount it is to buy a coin purse. You could always lower, or raise it. I personally think chests inside this game to hold gold or other items, would be amazing. It would give you more inventory space.

[lusty laurel]

i had to try spells on mannequin to see the basic damage i think we all did this at least once ahha

[frozen solstice]

many games have a designer team not directly associated with actual game development. this idea that it takes away from the game isnt exactly accurate

[inner thorn]

ah yes bags from tarkov

[bright ore]

i allready sugested that few says back after having 5K gold in stash 😄

[final charm]

Didnt even realize manaquins worked like that, so I was just blind the whole time.

[weak vine]

@frozen solstice still have to hire a whole new team for that sounds like a waste of time/money

[scarlet token]

i agree they just have to make it a good one and not like other games

[clever talon]

Same, I thought of it (probably others too) a few days ago with having barely any space. xD

[frozen solstice]

not if 100,000 people are playing your game at any given moment. We cant disregard how Fortnite ran over an entire genre as FTP, selling some cosmetics

[inner thorn]

they dont calculate all types of damage properly

[lusty laurel]

no please not item case there too but i would love to have a gold chest in my stash im sick of those 50 gold pockets.. even trading need a revamp imho you cant put all those bags in the trade window

[bright ore]

well i had to move golds to my another charr wia trading it w my friend

[weak vine]

@frozen solstice As long as there is literally 0 benefit to buying the battlepass like some other games will give you exp boost to make you level up faster, if there is no benefit besides cool skins then i doubt anyone would care including myself just dont want this game to sellout like so many others

[quiet plank]

Honestly the downvotes on removing the market suggestion only prove how much of a crutch it is for people lol. Exactly the reason tarkov dies in a month every wipe

[inner thorn]

there are ways to cheat it, but for normal player market works perfectly fine

[verbal marsh]

They have item identification planned it seems like, so I think they will eventually have a tarkov styled inspect system on loot. I hope they normalize chest interaction speeds and change it into more of a tarkov styled identification toward looting trash.

[quiet plank]

I never said it didnt work? I said it facilitates RMT making it easier and also contributes to gear waterfall and saturation. You need to do online shopping to stay competitive in a dungeon crawler. just think about that

[final charm]

Just like actual dungeon crawling

[weak vine]

@quiet plank 99% of people dont use rmt and trading is fun

[lusty laurel]

there are ppl that play only to do trades and are not focused on top10 leaderboard you cant remove a good portion of the game for those ppl

[quiet plank]

Why would anyone ever want to Escape From Tarkov when the Instacart works so amazingly and instantly there? i imagine the PMC's just laying there on their bed scrolling on their phone. Trade market is lame AF and detracts from the experience

[verbal marsh]

With the amount of players being greedy and acting as loot globins I do hope they switch loot speeds toward being identification speeds instead.

[inner thorn]

i woud rather get killed myself by player with blue item in next battle then sell it to npc

[lime marsh]

how are the devs supposed to make money so they can keep supporting the game?

[weak vine]

You just sound like a super fun person who enjoys videogames id love to play with you sometime

[lusty laurel]

early access 20€ one time pay and they will have all the money they need to do everything

[fleet wing]

btw when the border around a suggestion is green, it means the devs have acknowledged it?

[quiet plank]

Sorry you can't think of a response

[scarlet token]

one feature i think would be nice is that a battle pass with lets say 100 tiers is not time limited you can buy every season pass even if you didnt play at that time this way everyone can play when they want and are not pressured to play the battle pass to get their moneys worth and new players can buy each battle pass when they want this way new players could buy 2 from 5 accessible battle passes when they have the money or like the (cosmetics) in only those 2 then you select in which battle pass you wanna play that way i would really like a battle pass if there will be one

[weak vine]

my response is trading is one of the most fun parts of the game for me and many others, hense literally 1000's of people in the trading posts 24/7

[inner thorn]

more like automatic system count likes ratio and its good

[lusty laurel]

id rather pay one time early acces then having battlepass\microtransaction all over the place, how do you think rust is become what it is nowdays? the early access looked horrible but the base was solid and d&d is on the same boat at my eyes

[quiet plank]

I mean you literally need to do that to stay competitive so of course everyone's in there, but there's nothing fun about it for me or anyone i've spoken to since my first PT in October. Its an annoying slog. Why are you so against earning your gear in-game? Also it's spelled hence.

[weak vine]

Its fun to sell items you dont need for lots of money makes me happy 🙂

[short steppe]

@quiet plank Some people find trading fun, uptrading for good gear can be quite rewarding.

[bright ore]

hell yeah my fellow gold goblin!

[quiet plank]

Yes, skipping the gameplay loop and having a ton of money so you don't have to actually play the game does feel good for people like you, that is the point i'm trying to make. Artificially inflated pendants going for 3-400+ dropping from a skullbat is going to blow the economy open and ruin the progression of the wipes. It already became totally saturated a week in, although drops are def boosted rn

[finite nebula]

thoughts on a necromancer class? And please, if you're going to downvote the suggestion, provide legitimate reasons as to why you think it wouldn't work lmao

[weak vine]

I get your point, but what am i supposed to do with extra really good gear for characters I dont use as a solo player? just fuck those guys right?

[verbal marsh]

I feel like player downed gear should have blood on it and be untradable in the gathering hall. Use it or lose it. - Sell it to the Goblin Merchant, and he'll randomly fence it back to player population clean.

[bright ore]

would be hard to config mobs to work by your order but actually interesting idea

[quiet plank]

Its not a solo game to begin with. Take the shitty vendor price or make friends? Idk but it feels like the system is already baked in to encourage you to trade organically to friends/teammates, not scalp items for 100s of gold when vendors would give 10-20 lol.

[weak vine]

wanna buy 3 health potions? 55 gold, Wanna sell a Golden item with stats that make you god, 40 gold!!!!!

[finite nebula]

it doesn't need to apply to only the undead. I can foresee the broken mechanics which is why I suggested Undead. Honestly it can be sorted out by having an extremely short res time, and not allowing you to res the same enemy more than once

[twin delta]

the organic trade is mid-dungeon which is actually a huge risk. if you and your friends are merchants then you can safely trade stuff with one another for only 15g (each) though

[quiet plank]

Yeah, but that pricing is balanced by the devs and represents their vision for the game. trade market lets players override these decisions. In a marketless version of the game, potions could be much cheaper or there could be questlines to work towards crafting your own. and @twin delta I am pro-risk when it comes to these games, its why you feel that adrenaline

[weak vine]

I just dont see them fully removing the market, if they do they would replace it with something similar

[bright ore]

man i just think that youre mad cuz you coudnt get some easy 50G purple items bcz youre slow on clicking trade request

[twin delta]

the market currently exists as the only means to buy lanterns, lockpicks, heart candies, amulets, and rings. also the only place to buy your basic weapons like spears reliably as well, since weaponsmaster doesn't commonly stock spears and even when he does he'll stock one white or three grey spears at a time

[quiet plank]

Yeah, I can't see it being removed either, 90% of the playerbase is already entirely dependent on it. Just trying to get the conversation about its downsides going. I fear it is gonna be a repeat of one of Tarkov's mistakes. Also, i never reply to creepy chomo pfps so don't even bother lmfao

[modest hinge]

Do the devs respond to dm’s?

[frozen solstice]

Im sure they have members that pay attention here, and thats why they have a suggestion box!

[modest hinge]

I can easily suggest dozens of ideas, but I don’t want to put them here and get buried by the chat flow or snagged by someone else and not getting credit, As much as I love the game.

[wet condor]

You're so delusional, go buy epics and die your first run in like everyone else

[lusty laurel]

then use make-suggestion channel we are here to discuss ideas

[inner thorn]

post every 6 hours, you now have an irl repeating quest

[frozen solstice]

They intentionally limit 1 suggestion per 6 hours for a reason! Id imagine many of us have more than 1 suggestion, but we are Many, they are few.

[rancid whale]

curious what your guy's thoughts are on the mining system

[wintry wind]

Doesn't seem worth the time and investment

[modest hinge]

Is suggesting a bulk of ideas considered one suggestion? Because I had a similar vein of thought with one suggestion like with what @rancid whale said

[verbal marsh]

I would like to see bloodstained equipment non-tradable in gathering-hub, sold to goblin merchant - who acts like a fence and resells to players randomly from the pool of bloodstained equipment sold to it. Could also serve to differentiate pve from pvp item quests, and if players really want they could bypass hub by trading like rats in the dungeon.

[inner thorn]

1000 times buy pick and die simulator

[frozen solstice]

Id imagine you just answered your own question.

[weak vine]

Them making stuff found in raid only like in tarkov killed tarkov in my eyes so hopefully i hope they keep trading gear no matter what happens to it

[lusty laurel]

the only time i mined was with someone else mining pick looted in the same run XD

[vestal spruce]

#d-and-d-suggestions message (1608096)
Also, an addition. It would also make it easier to manipulate treasure in the inventory. When you have lots of vases and stuff like that if we have some way of seeing what quality items are without hovering over them it will make it a lot easier to know which ones to replace/drop/etc.

[rancid whale]

yea this is exactly what i felt. i would regularly buy a pickaxe, which is not cheap, just to go in and find no ore, or if i did, by the time i cleared out the guys around it, i wouldn't have time either to players or because of the zone closing in. the best i got was two ore mined in the several hours of trying to get ore lol

[lusty laurel]

the ore are so big in the inventory plus the set crafted isnt anything special.. u can easly get puple item on the same level just opening chests or buy on the market, i dont like mining as it is rn neither i think is worth it doing, the investment in pickaxe time and inventory space is so hudge

[verbal marsh]

How so? Maybe they can referb the karma system to allow bloodstain blck market, but give better overall vendor prices for good align players.

[wintry wind]

Maybe if you could find the pick, it'd be a different story.

It definitely needs a rework. Killing Mini bosses is actually somehow faster, safer and more consistent for gear

[weak vine]

i enjoy selling stuff 🙂

[inner thorn]

well maybe with less loot in newer versions it would be more viable

[rancid whale]

yep, i feel the main value it has is as a collectors item, since the only way to get rubysilver and cobalt gear is to craft it yourself. but you can get equivalent or better gear by trading, like a purple decent-roll cuirass would be about 200-250 gold, which isnt that hard to work up to in a couple good runs

[fast vortex]

Instead of wipes like in tarkov there should be some type of seasonal characters like in diablo

[onyx lotus]

@blissful crane the best gear is absolutely not made from crafting with the ore. The best gear drops from the bosses.

[lusty laurel]

the sets should be purple and orange rarity not blue/purple then could be worth doing so or mb give the set a unique bonus set with n* piece equipped, is the only real set in the game and should have more value i think

[verbal marsh]

ok what if I were to propose that it becomes bloodstained, so you cant sell on gathering hub if you just murdered someone, but if you've no quams about having 0 good karma you can sell in the black market to other players who have no quams about good karma.

[modest hinge]

Just suggested that there be a way to craft potions via ingredients from a forest dungeon. Maybe paving the way for an Alchemist class or stat-affected potion quality. Instead of just the potions from the merchant, maybe we can brew speed potions, protection potions, throwable acid/spell jars, etc. Bad idea?

[inner thorn]

crafting exp? so ore is more valuable as a learning material, as in warcraft

[weak vine]

its not up to me lmao i just dont like that direction it had on tarkov so i dont think it would be good here

[rare agate]

i suggested that we needed 150 dollar game package like tarkov , so i can have MORE storage last play test i had way to much gold and i need MORE ROOM

[rancid whale]

i feel it'd be really cool to have an ecosystem that allowed mining to be viable - go out of your way to mine the ore, and craft to gear to sell or use. just allows another avenue for getting rich, which is the goal of every player

i also agree with other people for sure, i mean hell you can get purple gear sometimes from wraiths which arent too bad if you know what youre doing. for the cost of 4 pickaxes you could ante up and go high roller, and while its obviously not guaranteed i think thats a better gamble for high quality loot than socking it all into pickaxes

[hasty jasper]

I think they already have all the planned classes - adapting the classes from Dungeons and Dragons 5e

[wintry wind]

I think the main issue is just the time and gold you spend. If you replace the pick once, you are 50g down the hole.

You have to either address the ore yield or the cost of mining.

Currently it's 3-4 random rolls. The amount of investment just isn't worth pulling the level.

[modest hinge]

Doesn’t necessarily have to be a different class, could just be a skill leveled outside the dungeon with crafting. It opens the avenue for more player trades through the ingredients list or crafted potions. I’m imagining the Elder Scrolls: Oblivion-style potion crafting, but with the effects already uncovered and not as many ingredients.

[silver fulcrum]

What if for the last circle a higher level baddy appears that will smash doors and chase until slain. This would still add a little jeopardy in the final round even if most had already escaped or gotten killed off.

[verbal marsh]

yeah I get what you're saying I'm just looking toward a work around so it doesnt diminish the amount of trading you can potentially do but does add a moral decision toward trading bloodstained items, and diminish the worth of used equipment.

[weak vine]

They gotta add a legendary item where the more kills you personally rack up on it the more damage it does that would be op af but interesting i bet

[lusty laurel]

yep but the whole point is give more value to mining, they could even add a chance to mine rare gems to have more value of a single mine, there are soo many way to fix it, like u get randomly rare/epic gems that sell for extra cash at collector

[wintry wind]

You just described the Eyelander and it's busted.

[hasty jasper]

Don't pay wall this.

Yes, mining needs changing. Adjustments to both cost and reward. Set bonus is a pretty good idea, admittedly.

@modest hinge I'd love separate "profession" style level up systems. But A LOT would need to be added to the game to support that.

[verbal marsh]

I was thinking it would be cool if weapons had bane on it like the cleric perk. It would balance pve dmg vs pvp while allowing you to scale your equipment.

[weak vine]

Yeah but so are all the legendary items, strike lightning on someone for 20 magical damage, freeze people, burn them, bows with 0 arrow drop all those items are busted af

[inner thorn]

well just a tab. delete x item add x item done

[wintry wind]

You don't need more stuff tied to Mining or crafting. No one is going to engage with it unless you're forcing them to, which is unfun, or it's worthwhile for the effort.

Set Bonus would be great.

I don't think a crafting skill would fit here.

[rancid whale]

ooo a set bonus is a great idea. again goes after that collector mindset, if you get the whole set its better etc

mining can be a very good niche in the game, i just think it needs some work

[lusty laurel]

i think a good change to mining is when u mine u get n* ore and maybe on chance random gem (white, green, blue rarity) will be totally worth to mine in that way

[weak vine]

just make mining faster by like 50% and its fine tbh

[quiet plank]

Nobody really engaged with my idea lol just said no I like it like this. You can directly pinpoint tarkov's playerbase decline each wipe to players reaching "endgame" gear and this is entirely caused by the flea. The fact is most people get bored when everyone running juicer kits with no consequence because the economy is just a suggestion.

[misty hollow]

#d-and-d-suggestions message
But... asking to put the game on early access and also develop new features right away ... doesnt work like that.
If people want new features devs need time to develop it and test out.
The game is great the way they are working if they try to push everything in a rush it will start to crumble due bugs, hacks, new content coming out, require testing for all new features on top of new bugs and DDos attacks ,etc ,etc ,etc

[modest hinge]

If a crafting skill provides an actual combat advantage or allows you to last longer in the dungeon, say with a potion to resist the ring for 5s or a random teleport potion and even a potion of attack speed/haste, would cause crafting to be a viable player activity. We can also work as player merchants to sell items we craft, with our stats affecting the quality of the item.

[verbal marsh]

yeah thats why I was thinking toward bloodstained equipment to add moral decision on how you receive your loot gear. Some players would black market, and be evil. Others would goblin fence bloodstained and maintain better merchant prices.

[rancid whale]

kinda taking from skyrim - i like that. would also be sick to offset the price of the pickaxe, too. i think getting multiple ore from one mining thing would be a good solution too.

[split ginkgo]

@lunar spruce the only reasons spiders don't give loot is cause they can respawn and if you add loot then you have to git rid of the respawn or add a limit which just defeats the purpose they supposed to be annoying and never stop till you break it. It's basically a troll by the dungeon.

[quiet plank]

Is this a mechanic from another game or something? never heard of it but anything to slow down the gear waterfall will be good for longevity tbh

[verbal marsh]

I can't think of any exact titles that had bloodstained equipment but I'm fairly certain the concept has been used before.

[wintry wind]

That's where it enters 'forcing them to engage' territory.

I think if you absolutely must have a crafting skill, it would be a sort of tech tree. You pay manipulate your random rolls for the item to be favorable.

That said, I think you need to look at the actions to craft rather than potential rewards.

[modest hinge]

The ‘endgame gear’ issue can be mitigated by forcing players to repair their gear or to make some gear only usable in the dungeon that match

[quiet plank]

Yeah or just make it as rare as it actually spawns, which they already have complete control over.

[noble hearth]

I really hope they get rid of the current reading system. And replace it with a auction house

[wintry wind]

I hate reading

[modest hinge]

Enlighten me as to How it’s forcing players to craft? If the potions spawn naturally, then crafting is just an added way of being able to get it other than buying from the merchants/players. Not to mention that merchants might have cycling inventories that dont always have certain potions and players can charge expensive prices. Being able to farm ingredients and craft them back in the tavern would help

[verbal marsh]

It would be cool if there were Class E quests like in isekai anime that players could repeatidly do for money, like trading trash jewelry, that is required to keep ai vendors stocked on certain items by the general community lol instead of selling gems, you need to gather herbs in the dg to give to the alchemist so he stays stocked on potions.

[noble hearth]

That’s a terrible idea

[lime marsh]

you know what you can repeatedly do for money? play the game

[wintry wind]

If it has an actual combat advantage, you will have to engage with it in order to compete.

Whereas crafted gear can be traded or bought, which can be done by gold, which is just playing the game.

[verbal marsh]

how so, instead of just jewelry you'd be selling alchemy items gold and silver.

[noble hearth]

Selling gold?

[verbal marsh]

Another thing I feel is lacking that wizards don't need components to cast spells. I would like to see spells limited based on material cost as well. No wizard just casted a powerful spell willy nilly good spells cost you money.

[lime marsh]

so it doesn't actually add any value or depth to the game is what you're saying, just like some random alternative thing to pick up and sell?

[noble hearth]

What is bro on lmao. “Yeah sorry team I couldn’t fireball them cause I didn’t bring enough gold into the dungeon where I can lose it”

[verbal marsh]

It would be between being a used item and a crafting use item, and a quest use item so it would have multiple uses.

[white cliff]

And what would that solve or add? Sounds needlessly complicated.

[karmic fossil]

People also forget that server costs are a thing.

Pumping data 24/7 to 100K players isn’t free.

[verbal marsh]

you simply wouldn't equip fireball if you couldn't afford the ruby to cast it, you'd instead bring lightning strike or a different variant that has a lower component cost like salt because your broke ass ain cool enough to cast a fireball.

[noble hearth]

So what your saying is a wizard couldn’t cast fireball because he hasn’t looted in the dungeon and found a random ass ruby yet. Or anything for that matter.

[lime marsh]

so you could end up never being able to cast anything because you've died so many times...? spell reagents in all games is really outdated and not fun

[verbal marsh]

you would start off with some basic components enough to cast a general loadout that has a general cost, but flashier cool spells would be equiv to someone comining in equipped. - maybe even just have it so you can cast it with ashe, but casting it with a ruby is the real way to cast it.

[noble hearth]

And you see nothing wrong with this. Like at all.

[verbal marsh]

nope, not if you can buy find and trade for components.

[lime marsh]

you're directly conflicting with the spell knowledge system they have in place to limit the number of spells you can bring in, you're basically saying you know how to design wizards better than the devs, this isn't a suggestion it's disrespect towards the designers imo
you want to add another layer of overhead to the casting system, I'm sorry but I don't think you're going to convince anyone of this "suggestion"

[noble hearth]

So players are just supposed to know how much components to bring into a match? And if they die it’s their fault. “Awww damn I didn’t bring 20 rubies with me this run and I can’t cast anymore fireballs boys. I’m basically useless for the rest of the run.

[lime marsh]

you floated your idea, it was not received well, just let it go, not all ideas are good ones and that's okay 🏆

[wanton lintel]

Making Wizardry an aristocracy sounds tedious and unfun

[noble hearth]

What you could’ve said is “adding components to spells too give them a extra small effect would be cool” and that would’ve been a cool suggestion.

[verbal marsh]

Amusing that you think that way, however, incorrect. You are aware there are many similarities drawn to dungeons and dragons with this game, and that spell components are a key featured of a wizard, and you shouldn't try to interpret anyone's suggestions as disrespectful, your usage of that word astounds me and I have no retort for such a stupid blanket accusation.

[rugged pilot]

He won't let go of it untill its dead. Kinji doesn't understand beating a dead horse.

[white cliff]

If you would have said, hey proper magic resist needs to exist so that they can actually balance wizards without that shit being useless or broken I would have been like, nice.

[strange void]

Can anyone explain the actual point of the pubg circle closing?

[wanton lintel]

Seems like it. He's just trying to make DaD = DnD despite the unfun component system. Even in DnD nearly nobody uses the component system except for late-game spells.

If wizards had a spell-enhancement system that adds a unique twist to their spells, I would consider this fun and relatively easy to implement. But overhauling the magic system is a no-go as a "suggestion". It's far too labor intensive to do.

[noble hearth]

Wizards are currently the weakest class. Making it even harder for them is going to drive them into the ground.

[agile meadow]

people would just chill at the edge of the map otherwise

[lime marsh]

just a forcing factor to end the game in a certain amount of time, otherwise players might agree to just not engage and let the match stay open forever

[halcyon crescent]

What does dual wielding do besides reduce your movement speed?

[rugged pilot]

directly preventing camping, forcing players to engage eachother that otherwise wouldn't, reducing extraction with incredible quality collector items to make maximum gold from every run, allowing the server to close at the same time each round, there are many more but these are a few to paste instantly

[white cliff]

Forces engagements, prevents people from slow and campy. Allows for queue times to stay consistently low. Fast addicting rounds.

[verbal marsh]

I dont beat dead horses, I gut them and crawl inside.

[strange void]

Make the exit portals only appear in the middle. It's a looter at heart, why not give time to loot?

[steady raven]

Dual wielding gives you the second weapon's moveset. You can have a fast dagger main hand but a long-reaching rapier for offhand if they create distance. Not all weapons hit the same area so it gives you options.

[wanton lintel]

Get to have two weapon attribute buffs at the same time. Also gives you two ways to attack an enemy, and this is good if you're trying to play both reach and dps with different weapons.

[noble hearth]

Grants a 5 hit combo if you are clicking both left and right at the same time. Faster attack speed and you get both weapon bonus at the same time. At the cost of movement.

[halcyon crescent]

MS is the most OP stat in the game, on my Rogue i just run 1 really strong weapon and i can still 2 shot players... i don't see the big advantage

[ebon idol]

Also, the closing circle shows where portals spawn, which does prevent exit camping while also giving you a general direction on where to go to exit.

[lime marsh]

and you look badass while dual wielding, style points +9999999

[rugged pilot]

Yes, you gut conversations untill nobody wants to have one with you

[white cliff]

I hate horses.

[strange void]

The circle is a unoriginal concept that doesn't translate well. I can think of many ways to drive pvp without an arbitrary and random no-no zone.

[verbal marsh]

I never suggested overhauling the spellcasting system, you let some ninny cloud your assessment of what I was suggesting.

[noble hearth]

Then don’t use dual weilding. It’s that simple. It’s a different kind of playstyle.

[wanton lintel]

A good weapon alone deals around 30 damage per hit. A good set of gear will make you do 60 damage per hit. Add some damage perks and an ability and you'll do 80 damage per hit, then you'll 2-shot enemies. But it's heavily limited by gear. Without good gear, rogues are useless.

@verbal marsh Rephrase your argument/suggestion instead of replying to replies to replies to replies.

[quiet plank]

The fact we're even talking about giving magic MORE resources to monitor when rangers are still infinite ammo john wick reload-skipping machines with more damage and faster projectiles is an absolute dark and darker moment

[noble hearth]

We aren’t. Just his dumb suggestion that literally everyone says is a bad idea.

[strange void]

Make meditate limited and increase options for mage melee

[nimble moss]

Can you make a dot in the center of the screen a little more visible?

[verbal marsh]

I'm not making any concrete suggestions right now, I'm just entertaining ideas and concepts that could potentially be good. A few individuals just like to play devils advocate and immediately attack any suggestion that falls into a certain criteria. It is entertaining to some degree, annoying in others.

[wanton lintel]

You replied to another reply. Make a suggestion instead of talking about other people.

[dire iron]

guys what about a necromancer or warlock class? I mean , imagine a class that you cold do some poison spells like the zombie cloud or curses and debuffs to enemy team like the lich from the hell floor , of course balanced to be a player not a boss summonig 5 skely archers , and also a staff rework they are horrible

[quiet plank]

I didn't even like the meditate buff because i feel like it moves the game closer to ranged spam dominance. I'd prefer both of the ranged DPS classes having more punishment for missing. being far away is its own privilege but Rangers definitely are up next if we're nerfing lol

[ebon idol]

I mean, if we limit wizards, we have to limit rangers in some way as well. Meditate is basically a wizards reload. Magic is not support like with the cleric, magic is their way to fight.

[strange void]

rangers limited arrows, not that crazy of a concept

[hollow radish]

If a heavy two handed weapon, say an axe or hammer hits a shield it should put a cooldown on blocking with the shield. Say even just .5 to a full second

[verbal marsh]

This is a discussion thread, please take your cancel culture to the restroom. - seems like you're replying to a reply to troll... you can either block me or be blocked if you want to continue to attempt ot harass me : |

[wanton lintel]

Seems like a reply thread to me. You're obsessed with people and not with suggestions.

[quiet plank]

Yep, I always put it like this: imagine if Ranger had to take one skill slot to be able to reload, and another skill slot to shoot arrows. Thats where we are at with Wiz right now lol. We don't have skills.

[dire iron]

noo if we limit wizard is over for them, have you ever tried to kill a mob with their staff?

[vital solstice]

I think giving the wizard a spell similar to Turn Undead and make one of the skeleton mobs fight for him could be an interesting concept along the lines of Necromancy however It would likely take a lot of effort to do so Id think

[ebon idol]

I agree, but a bow doesn't have 5 modes. The spells ARE the skills. Wizard is basically reverse ranger.

[strange void]

@dire iron like any rogue?

[halcyon crescent]

if they added special combos/double attacks/parries to offhand it would make sense

[harsh belfry]

I think it would be cool if you could sync the animations. Like let players try to attack with both but if you time it wrong the clank into each other and slow/stall you out a bit. Like when hitting a wall. So you would have to know both weapon patterns and which portion of the attack sequence you can sync with other weapons

[quiet plank]

I mean, Do you really need anything else when one of your "spells" is a rapid projectile that hits as hard as a zweihander of the same tier? Longbow is just extremely boring and good. At least spells are hard to hit with and make audible warning sounds when charged. Nevermind infinite ammo lol.

[noble hearth]

It has a special combo already. It’s a 5 hit one?

[vital solstice]

I mean historically (And I guess if you also wanted to go with the DnD Theme that seems to run alongside this game) a big part of dual wielding is the ability to either parry an attack or disarm an opponent, a high Tier off hand weapon similar to a sword breaker that can disarm melee combatants could be an interesting one, plus not something wizards would necessarily have to worry about so would also indirectly buff their utility

[lime marsh]

I love how everyone has their own views on which class is OP and needs nerfing, it kinda demonstrates how well designed they all are, consider how many factors determine who wins an engagement, movement/dungeon location/mobs in the area/consumables/gear/player skill

[verbal marsh]

wouldn't have any attack gaps would be a bit overpowering. would imagine the ms penalty to double but you'd essentially be a whirling dervish with a cleric behind you. Don't see that ever happening.

[ebon idol]

That is what I mean. The wizard doen't have any skills because their spells already act like skills. Haste as a speed up, quick fire by magic missle, and AOE explosion, etc. Wizard doesn't need any more skills. Makes sense the skills are "cast spell" and "recharge spell"

[dire iron]

no man , rogues hides in the shadows and aply poison to a dagger(melee) its way different , a necro throw from its staff or hand (ranged) and puts curses , if I have to tell you the diferences between a rogue and a necromancer you should go and just search for a image in google

[halcyon crescent]

an offhand that does a parry similar to fighters longsword would be interesting, and worth the movement speed reduction

[quiet plank]

Wiz to Ranger is a fair comparison because they're the two ranged DPS in the game right now. One has to give up both skill slots to merely use the base function of their class. One doesn't, and instead gets an free-kill skill that skips their reload, the only lose condition the class really has. I dont really think magic is gonna take a skill slot in the final game though

[teal crow]

About the latest suggestion, I think they will do something like that, heard from players but I could be wrong
Auction house would really be nice

[vital solstice]

Plus, if they did decide to implement a disarm function to something like an off hand weapon disarming an opponent really is just a next level way to farm salt

[ebon idol]

Quick fire instantly reloading will never be a think I understand.

[verbal marsh]

parry dagger would be cool. maybe just allow player to flip a dagger upside down to use as offhand parry instead of offhand duel wield O.o

[grand sundial]

The game will be subscription based starting at 14.99 - 39.99. The Next Playtest will be available in 10 days - See you then!

[noble hearth]

God I hope they do just that. The current system is garbage

[vital solstice]

For example if it was class limited to something like a rogue, equipping an off hand weapon replaces one of their skills to be able to brace for an opponents attack and then I'm sure there'd need to be a system involved based on your off hand weapons stats vs their weapons stats but a successful skill results in a disarm? therefore resulting in the fighter being temporarily out of combat whilst they pick up their weapon

[halcyon crescent]

parry dagger does sound interesting, you can't directly attack with it but if you get the parry it does a riposte

[harsh belfry]

Do I think it will be in the final game? No, but I’d love to play around with it in one of these demos.

[verbal marsh]

yeah it would just have to be restricted to fighter, i think parry on rogue would be a bit op rn.

[grand sundial]

The game will be subscription based starting at 14.99 - 39.99. The Next Playtest will be available in 10 days - See you then!

[vital solstice]

Hmm when I think of the ability of doing something like a parry/disarm especially when doing something like dual wielding I tend to think it fits a rogue better , especially if having the ability to do so would limit/remove one of their other skills whilst having the offhand weapon equipped

[bright ore]

10days really? where did u find out?

[stray acorn]

what do you guys think about shield hitbox

[shrewd wasp]

It's fine, but needs to be a reward for blocking

[lime marsh]

I didn't really successfully block anything intentionally, seems difficult to master, not my cup of tea

[verbal marsh]

its because you're use to parrying in most games that involve countering after the animation already starts, with the desync that is not available. You need to have shield block started immediately at the bgeginning of the attack animation.

[lime marsh]

nah I tried to just constantly block on my fighter, I'm just bad at it I think lol, hard to match the attack angle since I can't see (because the shield is in my view) or I just don't understand how blocking is supposed to work, does it block 100% of the damage or just some of it?

[bright sierra]

i wish that the shield visual matched up with the actual shield hitbox. its so hard to master because you can be holding your shield straight up in the air while blocking and still get hit by an overhead, which is what makes it so difficult

[vital solstice]

We need different Shields, from a Buckler to a Tower Shield that match up with the hitboxes, I wanna be able to 3 Fighter Tower shield Phalanx and become immortal

[verbal marsh]

Basically, it is to intercept the path. At the beginning of the attack the available factors are already started, so say a battle axe starts its going to be overhead, at the beginning of the animation you need to have shield already positioned before the axe starts to decent down and have that angel protected.

[grand sundial]

The game will be subscription based starting at 14.99 - 39.99. The Next Playtest will be available in 10 days - See you then!

[bright ore]

again where did you find out???????????????

[stray acorn]

i dont like how the shield hitbox dosent exist until u finish the block animation

[burnt ledge]

they're trolling

[lime marsh]

even if that were true, I'd happily pay monthly, I spend more on DoorDash for my fat ass

[prisma lynx]

I would rather it be pay to play then free with microtransactions

[vital solstice]

low tier bait tbh

[verbal marsh]

subscription method is a dead horse, the f2p cheapo's already destroyed all soft subscription versions and basically battlepass is just a soft sub model.

[grand sundial]

The game will be subscription based starting at 14.99 - 39.99. The Next Playtest will be available in 10 days - See you then!

[burnt ledge]

Right? All people have to do is read #📢announcements lol. I reported that guy for spam and blocked him.

[lime marsh]

okay spam much? get this guy outta here

[dusk verge]

Has the Idea for a PvE map been discussed? Maybe only give low tier loot and small amounts of gold for newer players to get used to the game and build up some basic gear and money.

[weak vine]

Sounds like a bad idea tbh people would just farm up there until they can afford good kits, every match should include enemy players i feel like

[vital solstice]

Expecting people in a discord server to actually read the channels that have the info will be your downfall i'm afraid lmao, also because I will be msg locked due to a timer im gonna address the latest comment about the PvE Map, the idea of this unfortunately removes 90% of the threat in game, people only really die to the mobs when they're being chased by players and forget that they're there, it just kind of becomes Farming Simulator Medieval Version

[stray acorn]

i'd say max white loot and cracked trikets

[dusk verge]

Yeah, I could definitely see that. Hopefully there would be a way to balance it where it wouldn't be worth it to farm, but I'm probably underestimating peoples time commitment to farming.

[burnt ledge]

i like the punishing nature of the game - but even though you start with 0 gold, you do actually get some basic starting gear every raid (also worth 0 gold). This is far better than, for example, Tarkov. 😛

[weak vine]

@dusk verge I have friends that I know for a fact would farm that because theyre not really good at video games and would like to take advantage to farm up and get a huge advantage on people when they get good gear lmao

[vital solstice]

If you never played any kind of Old MMORPGs then I can forgive this mentality, but unfortunately when there is any ability to gain monetary value to be used in a 3rd party market like this game has there will /always/ be those who farm endlessly

[ebon idol]

As a friend of farming simulator, I still want this game to be what it is now.

[verbal marsh]

agreed; would just lead to an increaes of bots and cheaters cause you wouldn't there would be less community moderation toward those type of players.

[dusk verge]

Ah true, I didn't even think of bots.

[stray acorn]

man i really dont get cheaters

[lime marsh]

any word of when they are going to implement talents for a playtest?

[verbal marsh]

I mean if you want an example of good pve pvp it did work for star conflict, but I'm unaware how much cheating occured in that game at all. Shame that game became plagued with ui screens I did enjoy it.

[bright ore]

they love to break someones fun or just want to get attention

[ebon idol]

The fact that there was gold sellers IN A PLAYTEST tells us that there are just so many people out there willing to pay bucks for an edge in a game that means nothing. It is no wonder the gaming scene is what it is today.

[rose sandal]

Having attainable items that give an in game advantage will always create a market for people to get those items in a cost effective way.

[lime marsh]

and what's even more funny is that whatever gold someone buys with real cash, they're GOING to eventually lose it because no one is going to be 100% undefeated

[trim maple]

The worst part is ppl actually spend money on it

[stray acorn]

what bugs do you guys want to get fixed

[bright ore]

i dont think thats big problem bcz the RNG of this game can kill even best geared player actually seen that alot fullgeared ppl geting killed by base-geared solo players etc and i think that this is gonna make ppl think twice before buying golds for real monney just to lose it all to random rouge siting in dark corner

[verbal marsh]

which bugs did you notice?

[grand sundial]

Can we make this game subscription based like world of world craft? @admins

[rose sandal]

It's not a bug, but I'd like to see more flexibility in activating skills and specifically bow draws.

[warped wharf]

@fierce quarry just so you know, quick move is in the game...double clicking of shift/control clicking objects moves them to the other windows instantly. Your suggestion already exists

[karmic violet]

if this game will get a "harder" coop/solo pve dungeon crawler mode would be so cool

but it must have lower tier loot. but it would be easier to get.

or what about a dungeon crawler "race to live" mode
where there are 3 parallel dungeon paths that all travel in one direction and periodically cross making you fight another player to progress or temporarily team up

but because of only one escape portal players will have to fight each other

[stray acorn]

i really hate the quickbar delay

[grand sundial]

Can we make this game subscription based like world of world craft? @spark trench

[ebon idol]

I don't think it will be a big problem, I just think it shows how and why the gaming industry has fallen into this p2w hole it is in today.

[rose sandal]

Speaking of quickbar, have the 3 slot toggle, fine, but allow the extra slots to be bound directly as well.

[remote latch]

Why do you want this so much tf

[verbal marsh]

I would like a stamina indication for dropped movement during swings, I don't think this needs to be a learning curve for new players and movement decreases should be clearly outlined.

[grand sundial]

I would pay top dollar to see this game subscription based like World Of World Craft - can we do this? @spark trench

[remote latch]

Boo this man

[bright ore]

i would pay 5 dollar just to make you banned

[verbal marsh]

which part of the delay, can you elaborate?

[native spoke]

Kind of want the ability to earn extra spells even if they're useless
Is why I make suggestion even though I know that the wizard is currently a monster and the cleric is currently pretty good

[grand sundial]

I would pay top dollar to see this game subscription based like World Of World Craft - can we do this? @spark trench

[vital solstice]

Stop feeding the trolls please, the easiest way to remove them is to starve them of attention

[verbal marsh]

I was thinking it would be cool if you could consume components before casting a spell to increase the spell strength and visuals. Maybe make it so you can use a ruby to empower your fireball fire a larger radius otherwise it looks like the tier 3 ice shot.

[rose sandal]

I would like to see a universal block (except for some items) and the ability to cancel really early attack animations both by the person making the attack, and by the attacker taking damage. You could set the forced attack cancel with damage to health ratios and stats, so barbs would be more resistant, for example.

[smoky brook]

thats funky ngl, bro clearly was a solo barb trying to 1v3 and got railed from behind by a wizard ngl

[grand sundial]

I would pay top dollar to see this game subscription based like World Of World Craft - can we do this? @spark trench

[noble hearth]

Wizard is literally the weakest class. He gets out dps by every class, zero armor,not fast enough to run without consuming two spells. Only decent at range and unless you have a front line you’re getting ran down.

[simple helm]

I like that a lot, bring in some of that classic reagent stuff and make magic a bit more dependent on found items

[lime marsh]

yet somehow I've seen squads of 3 get wiped by a Wizard, it's a mystery

[light drum]

Make slowmode in chats 30sec?

[verbal marsh]

I've wiped squads in orange gear with green as clerics, its all about timing.

[noble hearth]

Catching people off guard is not 1v3ing. It’s getting lucky. I assure you a wizard with blue gear gets bodied by fresh spawns if they have a inkling of a idea of what they are doing.

[lime marsh]

I guess my group was just bad, we were literally trying to hunt this Wizard down and he kept kiting us and eventually got all 3 of us rofl

[verbal marsh]

you can bury teams with rogue/barb combo and one shot fully geared players with base equip. being well prepared doesn't mean entirely prepared.

[clear wind]

A necromancer class would go hard, if it’s not broken

[native spoke]

Sounds like someone who hasn't seen any wizard with gear just stomp out whole parties with fireball/ChainLightning combo's

[noble hearth]

I’ve seen plenty of geared wizards. And I’ve also seen them get over whelmed extremely quickly.

[verbal marsh]

people really under appreciated rogues this playtest, a single hiding rogue with a throwing dagger and weak point can burry any player with a ranger who shoots after rogue lands that hit.

[grand sundial]

I would pay top dollar to see this game subscription based like World Of World Craft - can we do this? @spark trench

[simple helm]

Put that reagent stuff in a suggestion and I will upvote it

[native spoke]

I've seen wizards that just solo full parties because of spell casting speed and the ridiculous damage that fireball and chain lightning can deal base. Like spell casting speed can get wizards through most issues besides stealth rogues bursting them down. Cus Haste and Invis give them the distance to get things done

[simple helm]

Necromancer would be sweet, they would need to have a limit on amount of mobs they can rez and some means of controling them (go this way, attack etc), also would be nicely thematic if they could consume a dead players soul heart for regenerating spells. Also some curse debuffs like weakness, slow etc. Diablo2 is rich with ideas to lift.

[verbal marsh]

its all situational you cant chase run and clear at same time most cases.

[simple helm]

Moving Haste from Wizard to the upcoming Bard class would make wizards a lot less able to kite folks

[oblique mist]

fun playing wiz without haste zzZzzz

when u start to move spells and introduce more classes,u can easily fall in the world of warcraft/league trap, lots of classes that all just feels the same, right now its all so unique as it should

[karmic violet]

rapier dagger
parry riposte

parry with dagger
trust once with rapier

should only parry light and thrust attacks

axes and zwihanders will blow though

[verbal marsh]

if they added the raise dead spell I would imagine it being a simple way of detecting whether players enter an area you've already cleared. Just a friendly animated skeleton that is easily one shot, or only attacks other nearby ai aggro.

[vital solstice]

Move Haste from Wizard to Bard, give Wizard the ability to Turn Undead meaning it attacks all players you are not allied with would likely be easiest option

[glacial sphinx]

Why would you do that? It'd make wizards terrible and unfun

[fierce quarry]

what? i know for a fact that shift clicking does not work for me.

[normal wharf]

Anyone think that basic spellcasting (i.e. the 5 spells the spellcasting ability currently gives) should not take up an ability spot? It just seems like most classes with spell casting will always take spellcasting and so forcing them to sacrifice an ability slot for it just leads to less build variety (i.e. most wizards I ran into or played with would always take meditate so the other abilities went to waste).

[simple helm]

Clerics already turn undead, if Wizards need replacement for Haste it should be something like a dimensional door or invisibility

[warped wharf]

I can't remember exactly what the keybind for it was, but you could also double left click things to transfer inventories. I'd press my rapid click mouse button and just clear peoples bodies quickly for it. It was 100% a thing

[grand sundial]

I would pay top dollar to see this game subscription based like World Of World Craft - can we do this? @spark trench

[fierce quarry]

dang, I wish i'd known that, tbh it was the thing I found most annoying about the game.

[karmic violet]

Maybe add a new type of dagger

Parry dagger
cannot cut or thrust - can only parry

[bold radish]

Is individual keybindings for spells something you’ve been thinking about, having the option to bind E-Z-X-C-V to your spells for example @spark trench

[short steppe]

@fierce quarry Shift rightclick ingame, stash is rightclick, it's quick.

[vital solstice]

Not sure how they would work Dimensional door into the game unless it dropped you in a random location (likely not advisable with a map that gets smaller and smaller) , unless They give wizard a spell to perhaps summon the red gates that let you go deeper into the dungeon and therefore dont have to go scouting for them? would increase a wizard's pick rate in party play I suppose?

[simple helm]

Simple just make it a line of site teleport to where your cursor is pointing, alternativly a 'return' to where you were where when the spell first started

[verbal marsh]

I dont feel like wizards needed haste, it was primarily good for teamates, invis was actually preferable to mid combat, haste was more of a chase support spell. I do feel that the duration should further be shortened to be a burst of speed rather then longer duration. What was the duration of haste at the end of playtest?

[grand sundial]

I would pay top dollar to see this game subscription based like World Of World Craft - can we do this? @spark trench

[vital solstice]

Haste should absolutely 110% be a spell they put on the bard class, Bards entire thing is about buffing their team, and I feel like as Dimensional Door that effect would just be underwhelming considering what all DnD players know Dimension door to be able to do, however a warp option would be an interesting thing for wizards to help them stay out of melee range, would just need to make sure that it cant be exploited I guess

[waxen sable]

Imagine if they will add some sort of stress or fear, like in darkest dungeon{Like debuff }. And bard will save from it, with his sweat melodies.

[vital solstice]

In one mind, I really really hope you meant sweet melodies, in the other mind I understand that this is discord so cant be too sure

[civic agate]

Shield and blocking need a better hitbox

[boreal forge]

they probably got some pve and pvp debuff stuff to go with aswell

[verbal marsh]

blocking isn't terrible it is the desync that is terrible. Attackers advantage in response to avoiding shield hitbox is a bit annoying. - Someones thumb was too close to my rear whew.

Honestly if you understand that there is an absolute attackers adv. blocking is easy, you just have to use 60% skill 30% luck 10% handsome and it all works out.

[boreal forge]

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/WhirlwindZestyLeafcutterant-max-1mb.gif Hoping for a Duelist class in the future, to come a long with new armor and dueling weapons specialising in parries and having quick footwork: weapons like the Spadone, Montante, Epee, Estoc and Rapier with a buckler or Rapier with a Sword breaker side dagger

[waxen sable]

DUEList but his perk is on TEAM fight xd

[boreal forge]

Well his whole thing would be to make it a fair fight so a perk to make him get increased armor rating and wpn dmg when 3 people are within his vacinity wouldn't be half bad

[verbal marsh]

duelist is a prestige class in dnd / nwn, could imagine some perks they could opt toward to make it available. We're all still curious as to the talent windows.

[waxen sable]

meant sweet... xD missclicked

[boreal forge]

could have skills about challanging opponents where they get a debuff from running away or a skill to reveal any hidden enemies around you in the shape of a taunting laugh. Basically being light to medium armored and all about movement speed and parrying or dodging attacks.

[dim osprey]

Why do people want the game not to be free?

[civic agate]

So what you told me is the hitbox is broken and we need some better networking to prevent desync and only works 60% of the time. So it still needs fixing?

[waxen sable]

It will encourage DEVs to make content. It will have a lot microtransactions if it will be free

[ebon idol]

No game is free. Free game would mean a different type of monetisation.

[wanton lintel]

Developers are paid around $100k on average. Ironmace devs claim to be veteran devs. If you assume a team of 10 people, you’re looking at at least $1m/year labor costs.

[candid hazel]

Skins are a type of monetisation
But like Tarkov, it would be better if it was a pay game

[verbal marsh]

basically if your shield isnt already up and ready at the beginning of the enemy attack animation you're not blocking anything. You also want to be maintaining a range that can control what range that attack might actually hit you at so he has no option around your shield. So it works in that instance, any instance that he has adv to where he can work around your shield its screwed.

[dim osprey]

I understand but I just thought it was gonna be a free to play game with a lot of like cosmetics or currency since that is usually what works super well recently, already tons of ppl playing too and it'd be weird to go from early access to a paid game. I was just curious cuz I thought it was a bit weird, whatever helps the dev get more money to improve the game and keep the players coming in tho 🤷‍♂️

[cyan agate]

How about 2 seperate PvP arenas, one practice room where you respawn with your kit and just fight endlessly - And another Arena where you buy in ( like high roller ) and if you die, your armor / weapons / inventory and your ante are the rewards for your opponent

[mighty willow]

This wanst an early access this was a play test

[candid hazel]

I think shielding is pretty ok in general, unless your side-to-side with the attacker, then you hear the block but it still does damage
But maybe a small shield for parrys would be cool, with perfect or semi-perfect blocks giving you a big window to attack

[waxen sable]

adv: Lets buy pet dragon for 100$))) but there are some new things coming....Blue dragon pet!!!!

[verbal marsh]

when you hear the block and still take damage that means he worked aroudn your shield even though you successfully blocked he has attackers adv.

[rancid whale]

question; has anyone stated the obvious as a suggestion? fighter being too versatile and strong. i feel wizard, and to an extent ranger and cleric are pretty underplayed, and i dont blame them - hardly any gear for them, resulting in lackluster damage, among being really hard to heal yourself. fighter has second wind and the 5% hp back abilities, and barbarian naturally has a ton of health, but it leaves other classes needing more. what do yall think? this is coming from mostly a solo player so i may be biased

[ebon idol]

I mean, PoE has a monetisation system like that. Free Game, seasons, updates, resets, everything you dream of. Only real monetisation is cosmetics. Problem: You look like shit. Seriously, even if you are full legendary, with no bought cosmetics you look like a city guard that scrambled together some chains and leathers and called it a day. If you sell something, you have to create a need for it. If you sell cosmetics, you will make the default stuff look like crap. And since you have to create and sell more, you need to go further and further over the top with cosmetics.

[verbal marsh]

naked is balanced. Finding gear to preform one shots in a different story.

[candid hazel]

wait what's that?

[rancid whale]

yea i think they scale too well with gear. base fighter is pretty good, fair against a starter barbarian or rogue, maybe even a little weak. but when fighter gets gear, man they are strong
and, they can wear and use basically any gear, so it happens fast most times

[ebon idol]

"If they got gear, fighters are soo good" proceeds to get two shotted by barb with gray weapon

[candid hazel]

maybe cosmetics more like rust would make sense, you can give your sword a unique skin, but if you die that weapon has that skin, so if you kill someone with skins their yours until you lose the item

[verbal marsh]

like I said there is a desync between initiating the shield block and receiving damage. so unless you have your guard up pre-emptively there is no quick block between attacks, it is based on distance negotiation between the start and finish of attacks raising your shield is essentially a raised response both of your hands need to be played at the same time and correctly to win that game of rock paper siccors.

[rancid whale]

yea i was gonna say barbs are pretty dang strong too. i think the other classes just need buffs, less so that they need to be nerfed

[lime marsh]

the game hasn't been played enough to call for nerfs/buffs... all y'all have different experiences of each class, there are too many variables for any human to just flat out come to a conclusion that something needs a nerf/buff at this point in time, unless someone has a spreadsheet all of you are going off of your "feelings"

[dim osprey]

Do you think having it a paid game will have increased players?

[candid hazel]

So you have to predict the hit or just be blocking, that's quite real? I guess
Not like you could block an attack by raising your shield at the last momento
But maybe parrying could be introduced

[ebon idol]

No, I don't. Free to play will have more players. I also never made that argument.

[wanton lintel]

It’s about how they can make a sustainable revenue flow. If they were draining us of our money, they’d make it P2W and destroy the game. FIFA games made more money in one year than Elden ring ever did. Yet, Elden ring is a better game.

Ironmace said they do not want to participate in exploitative business practices, so according to this, they are going to make it a paid game with possible cosmetics.

[rancid whale]

i mean.. i played about 15 hours of the playtest, and its pretty clear that fighter is stronger than wizard without a doubt
particularly in solo

[lime marsh]

then prove it to me with data

[dim osprey]

I guess it's more about having players stay, so if it costed it might have a higher chance of ppl staying and playing longer? I'm not sure how that works but the game is already dope so even if it's free to play I'm sure the community will stay like tf2 or sum, the idea is good and they're actually working devs so either way but Idk which would be better to keep players staying

[verbal marsh]

you have to know the attack speed of the weapon striking you, use the counter attack bonus to position yourself and strike back, and maintain a guard distance so you can block or swing inside their next attempt against faster weapons maintain your guard against multiple attacks is pointless after the first unless you've the guard movement bonus on fighter. - the key component I'm stating is block works fine if you control the attack distance, but otherwise if you're trying to parry someone who can strike at any part of your body you're playing a guessing game with an extremely low chance of winning. and if you're raising your guard last second well he probably doesn't even register you doing that.

[harsh belfry]

I like the idea of the game being an upfront cost and then having a dual purchase path for cosmetics that uses the adventure currency or cash payment. I always liked that format like how league of legends has for its champions.

[rancid whale]

tell how you genuinely expect me to come back with data? everything is player experience. i think the vast lack of gear for wizard is where it starts though, finding a better staff is very rare, i think i found like 2 or 3 tops through all of my play. spellbooks and crystal balls are rare too. their damage is good, i think they just get bit by the lack of gear compared to the overwhelming versatility of fighter

[lime marsh]

after an impressive 15 hours playing, surely you can tell me the exact DPS throughput of Fighter compared to Wizard at various ranges/armor values for head/chest/legs while factoring in cast times? charts comparing weapons/spells and consumable buffs
I can't even imagine dumping a whole 15 hours into the playtest wow

[candid hazel]

Playing solo gives the perspective that 3 classes are completely useless, while playing with friends and coordinating gives great viability to the same classes
In my opinion the Cleric needs more capacity to know spells, 12 is just low
In a party of 3, having the Cleric as the tank can be awkward, as the dps lackluster, and as the middle man the best outcome but still worst than a full on other tank like barb or fighter or another dps as rogue, or wiz

[ebon idol]

They will eventually have to find a secondary way of monetisation. Just pay 2 play won't feed the server bills forever. However, pay 2 play also punishes cheaters and money bots more, since you have to pay again every time you get caught, at least.

[eager flint]

Has anyone suggested adding stamina as a addition to the game to combat the power of some weapons and classes? That way people can't spam attacks as adding stamina to attacks only would be the viable way to implement it. Parrying is a thing, but could be implemented better if once you block someone, it resets their attack combo, much like how it works when you hit some mobs? 77 hours this playtest btw so I have some experience

[rancid whale]

i dont understand why youre being so disrespectful? I simply raised a question and asked for thoughts, as i know my perspective is skewed since i played mostly solo. i was asking for other perspectives, and other's experiences

[verbal marsh]

only thing I want to see from stamina is movement speed indication during attack speeds. I want to see how much I'm slowed by and for how long. - basically is visible if you open your character panel while attacking (-38%) extra. I would like a gold bar for normal movement speed, the bar to become chunked when swinging my great axe to indicate the drag, and then a (-50%) for the backswing and the indication I'm back to 80% while my axe is out and 100% when unarmed.

[lime marsh]

idk I'm irrationally upset about discussions on nerfs/buffs from "experts"

[candid hazel]

Stamina just for attacking you mean? I guess that could be tested and figured a way to work
But the shear time to attack and health kind of balances it out on its own
Like a rogue can hit like 5 times, when a barb hits only 2, but the life of a rogue and a barb are astronomically different

[rancid whale]

i still think stamina is a close one but not quite a solution. i think maybe shields or parrying need to interrupt more? something does need to be done though, because attacks certainly can be spammed into a shielded opponent and they cant do much

also to tony, i never claimed to be an expert at all - i came here to make discussion on the dynamic between fighter and other classes, theres clearly a reason why theyre the most played and i have to be honest they're for sure the strongest class to the point its impacting the game

[rugged pilot]

I mentioned stamina when people mention limited ranger arrows, for consistency

Force melee users to rest like wizard if Rangse has to pick up arrows

[fluid mortar]

That is a cool mechanic but I would personally rather not see it put in.

[candid hazel]

A buff and debuff indication with descriptions while in the inventory would be quite usefull
Complete agree on that one

[eager flint]

Most attacks are overhead swings, so blocking those is simply looking up. Weapons that swing horizontally are just having the appropriate positions since any attack that goes through your guard will hit you. You can also check steam to see how long you've played. I have 77.6 in the demo, and 83.1 through playtests 2 and 3.

[lime marsh]

limiting ranger arrows doesn't solve anything imo, you won't feel anything when you play against them, rangers will just have a poorer gameplay experience because they run out of arrows

[granite plinth]

ranger just shouldn't do that much dmg

[rugged pilot]

I agree, I compared it to barb getting tired and needing to sleep after 6 swings. Just nonsense that makes a class unfun

[ebon idol]

Running into an empty ranger will have the same experience as running into a guy who is looting his friend. It will be a "he didn't have a chance to begin with, and I didn't win because of my skill" situation. Which can be fine, but still empty experience.

[lime marsh]

rangers just shouldn't aim so well, I hate when they hit me while I'm standing still looting or in a trap, so rude, absolutely overpowered

[candid hazel]

They don't?
Only if they hit headshots and use their skills
Which is a skilled player, and punishing skilled players is just dumb

[fluid mortar]

Buff my class and nerf the rest.

[dim osprey]

Yeah that's true, I haven't ran into cheaters at all but I've heard of them, tho i do only have like 40 hours so but it's always good to get rid of them, idek why they cheat, maybe making the game a lowerish price with like free to play extra stuff

[pseudo juniper]

so if a fighter shoots u in the head with a longbow what happens then nerf fighter? wizards can literally use crossbows too

[granite plinth]

its like a barb from range thats fast and has heals / @candid hazel bro everyone is so slow in this game that not being good at ranger makes u a npc ranger is an unethical class u cant punish it the only way to counter it is if ur also a ranger

[verbal marsh]

doesn't matter if you need to look up you need to be prepared to block any angel he could conceive hitting you at the beginning of his attack animation else you're not blocking. Once the enemy starts their attack they can still move their character to hit you at any angle or just not even swing at you. Like I've been saying it is attackers advantage. If you can block their overhead yes you need to be block it correctly yes your are correct.

[ebon idol]

What I also like about the game is after you lose, you have this "what could I have done" or "what did I do wrong" experience. "Shouldn't have run out of arrows when I fought that first group" doesn't feel like it was my fault.

[eager flint]

Unless they spawn in with a sword it makes no sense to limit arrows carried. @candid hazel Mainly just for attacks being spammed and rewarding players that can accurately block an enemy attack. Thrusting attacks are hard to block but still do a lot of damage purely because you can change where you aim the entire attack and doesn't lock you into an attack you commit to when you swing the weapon. @rancid whale Rewarding blocks is the mechanic I want to see implemented the most because it encourages more methodical gameplay vs just playing barb and having pocket heals. @fluid mortar Why would you not want this implemented?

[pseudo juniper]

could do something like meditation and call it fletching but still seems over kill. ^^ or they need to spawn with a melee wep too

[granite plinth]

nerf bows and crossbows but still ranger has more dmg on this cuz of the skills

[candid hazel]

The way to counter a ranger is having a shield, or going other way so he doesn't have the long range advantage
But that's like every ranged vs melee in every possible situation, in melee combat you should always win as the can headshot them with a big ass sword

[fluid mortar]

My "Buff my class nerf the rest" just makes sense. I have stats to prove it. (Trust)

[verbal marsh]

I would like to see QoL for item slots added, (hold)3/4 key to immediately consume items upon equipment swap. -oops- Yes, that is my favorite part of game also I often curse myself for choosing fight or flight incorrectly.

[pseudo juniper]

so u dont think ranger should have skills ? i dont understand. should they just remove ranger in general ?

[rancid whale]

maybe a shield bash? or something to stun them while theyre in the middle of an attack, to throw them off and allow the defender an opportunity to attack again

[blissful lodge]

buff ranger make arrows auto lock on to players and one shot them

[granite plinth]

u dont have a shield as rogue or barb also running the other way doesnt mean u beat them lil bro / @pseudo juniper i think they should nerf the dmg on bows and crossbow + the dmg on most ranger skills it literally 1 taps everyone

[civic agate]

Have you played the ranger?

[pseudo juniper]

sounds like u dont know how to strafe big man, thats a skill issue and nothing else. as a rogue i simply kill the ranger

[blissful lodge]

skill issue ranger needs a buff . make the arrows rain on the entire map whenever ranger takes a step so he can one shot everything

[fluid mortar]

I believe ranger should keep infinite arrows. They have to reload anyway. Besides, it is not like they have 10 arrows. Unless I haven't seen a bow with more, the max arrow count I've seen is 6. That's 1 triple shot and three staggered arrows before reload. As a Fighter class I am completely fine giving the Ranger their arrows.

[candid hazel]

Any other class other than ranger using a bow or crossbow have a subpar experience with them
As they lack the ability to have a faster animation, which helps a lot, at least in my case
And they lack the skills to make full use of them, as triple shot or so
/ @granite plinth you beat them by not interacting, because your not supposed to defeat a long ranged opponent with a sword or a pair of daggers

[eager flint]

Well the fighter has a skill that increases attack speed and movement by 10% which I think is comically underrated. That gives you time to retaliate on a successful block, most people just don't immediately attack or even use the skill. A shield bash would be cool, but require you to trade a skill for it.

[verbal marsh]

I would like to see skeleton champions bash ability turned into a counter attack knock back for shields and varying impact levels on shield quality would imagine the damage being low but ideal for the role of a fighter / tank.

[pseudo juniper]

this dude wants both ranged classes nerfed. yeah thats a skill issue big man

[rancid whale]

i think giving fighter an attack interrupt would be pretty sweet, imo. have to time it to when theyre attacking, but rewarded with them failing an attack and a basically guaranteed attack back

[candid hazel]

The Survival Bow has 7, which isn't much more but helps
/ @eager flint a shield bash would be so cool as a skill, and would make for a perfect counter to being harassed by other players

[pseudo juniper]

@rancid whale if they add cc into this game i will quit instantly and i think everyone else will soon after lol. u already move slow and attacking at the wrong time with a 2h means your death. turn your character 180 and move 2 feet then turn back to block or attack the next swing. slow is not real cc

[verbal marsh]

did you quit? cause wizard and cleric have cc already.

[fluid mortar]

Noted/Piggy back. A shield bash could be nice, and assist with the lack of health on a Fighter. I just hope it wouldn't be a stun, but an attack interrupt. I can see cooldown being an issue for this, considering you would not want someone spamming this. Not too long, not too short.

[granite plinth]

i think ur dumb any ranger that has a brain literally makes rogue unplayable unless the ranger is bad and just runs into u while ur invis / @candid hazel s exactly my point theres literally no way of beating a ranger the only way is running and they are fast , surely not unethical and broken.

[simple helm]

obviously any limit to ranger arrows will need to be substantial, a quiver can hold like 20 arrows and you would have them on mobs all over the place, the Ranger is not going to run out of arrows through the course of the dungeon, but over the course of a fight where he can't machine gun them with abandon

[zinc nacelle]

shield bash would be cool if it was a skill and had a 45 second cooldown or something like that

[rancid whale]

the shield bash doesnt have to have cc or attack interrupt, just a suggestion - i just think something needs to get done about getting just attacked over and over and hoping for an opening

[pseudo juniper]

i think a lot of people are coming from tarkov and not mordhau

[harsh belfry]

I personally hope rangers never get a quiver. They already have infinite arrows

[candid hazel]

For what I've read here, some say Fighter is OP, which I don't think grasps correctly the big picture
Because when you chose the class it says that it's loot dependent, and that shows
Lvl 1 fighter only wins against other noobs or looting players, so not actually winning the 'fight'
Then at lvl 20 with good equipment, it's hard to say the fighter isn't as least strong

[fluid mortar]

I think this falls under "assistance from Party". You may not be able to beat one solo, but if you have a shield, and someone ranged in the rear. It should turn out ok.

[eager flint]

I haven't had any issue trading with a ranger as a fighter since I can tank more damage than they can at the cost of a lower damage. It's give and take even with giving a wizard a crossy and using ignite to one tap someone in the head. @rancid whale The parry on the longsword should throw the attacker off balance, but the damage you put out with a riposte can two shot a barb in the head before they recover. @candid hazel @fluid mortar If you make the shield bash deal no damage and have a cooldown between 10-15 seconds it would be a viable alternative to the awkward crouch and jump ways to avoid attacks.

[verbal marsh]

would imagine using it would give you a temp movement speed penalty from the exertion - so somewhat stamina until it could be used again, and if you used it multiple times the ms penalty would be so extreme you wouldnt be able to bash anyone with the reach of your speed.

[granite plinth]

exactly what im saying the only way to beat them is with a ranger on ur team surely not unethical and broken op. make ranger reload be stuck in the same place and long also give her a cooldown on reload

[ebon idol]

"Unethical." People need to chill when talking about nerfs in a game.

[pseudo juniper]

the way i see an attack interrupt= you get a free hit, and that basically means u can walk up to someone bash the first swing they do and one deag them in the head with a purple horsemans axe. how is this not true ?

[fluid mortar]

Not necessarily. If I block arrows, sure I may take some hits, but another Fighter and or Barb could flank.

[candid hazel]

A stun would be kinda broken, so maybe a disrupt, not being able to attack for a couple of seconds maybe
/ @granite plinth yeah that's the concept of range vs melee, if your close enough you win, if your not, you lose

[ebon idol]

The real thing we all need to be addressing when talking about rangers is how it feels like they and cleric are the most important classes when it comes to boss kills. While possible, killing lich and the paper towel gets incredibly harder without the two in team. Speaking from the perspective of a mediocre skilled person at the game.

[zinc nacelle]

i think fighter really doesnt need any shield bash, you can just play safe with spear and accomplish the same thing, but maybe someone like cleric could use it if they're caught away from their team to maybe fall back 🤷‍♂️ or maybe im just smoking

[granite plinth]

theres no way u flank anyone in this game they are going to hear u

[rancid whale]

blocking takes time - it would be very hard to pull out your shield, block and shield bash all before they attack. it has to interrupt the attack, otherwise it'd do basically nothing

[eager flint]

If you only tie it to using a shield bash or blocking with a difficult weapon it theoretically be balanced. With the longsword you can do the same thing you mention with a riposte.

[fluid mortar]

Flanks don't need to be stealth based. What I mean is you can use a shield and someone can advance on them.

[pseudo juniper]

so having a horsemans axe and a shield out.....what is stopping me from holding up my shield until u attack and then instantly bashing the attack and insta killing you while u try to jump around my shield or stab my toes. stop adding reactions its cringe

[granite plinth]

the only way to actually beat a ranger is to wait in a room without moving and they run past u /this is a 1v3 then? ...

[harsh belfry]

If they implement some kind of stagger or bash the person using it shouldn’t be able to capitalize on it. It should be a space maker for both parties and a way to set up attacks for teammates.

[verbal marsh]

I only reason I want a shield bash is an optional punish for someone trying to re position in your bubble after failing to avoid hitting the shield in the first place. The problem is that daggers and horsemen axes are so fast it doesnt matter if they hit your shield they will still get 3 attacks before you can swing your first so why block anyways.

[candid hazel]

Being the main dps, and the healer, it makes sense for everything to be harder without them

[civic agate]

The ranger is in an okay place. It's good when he can lockdown room. but is dog shit when he has to fight and move in close range like in a maze. I do think some things can be fixed for him like oneshot from the multi shot can be busted

[pseudo juniper]

yeah this is true but how can u make that ..... its impossible

[ebon idol]

While it makes sense, I don't think it makes it less frustrating for people who want to play their favourite class just for it being "unsuited for boss kills"

[eager flint]

You can do that right now without the shield bash. Attacking with the horseman axe and switching to a block is incredibly fast

[fluid mortar]

The reason I am adding reactions is so that you know there is a response coming, or at least its been acknowledged. Message cooldown and all.

[quaint bay]

rogue has to be dogshit in combat because on-demand long term stealth is gamebreaking in far too many ways. you can't buff rogue stealth without nerfing their combat capabilities, and you cant buff rogue fighting without nerfing how toxic stealth is to deal with. they suck right now because everyone else would prefer not to have to play the game inching through hallways in tight formations or sweeping every room before looting. if rogues are strong, it ruins gameplay for everyone else even if a rogue isn't in the lobby because you always have to play as if there is one

[harsh belfry]

Maybe perfectly timed blocks could increase the recoil time on attackers weapons? This would make blocking a skill.

[pseudo juniper]

right so lets make it even more broken, is that the mind set ? sunder i really like that idea

[harsh belfry]

You make the skill for staggering or bashing cause over exertion on the users part or make it knock them back a bit as well.

[verbal marsh]

nah because blocking is based on positioning already and the desync doesn't make for good on that. They just need a parry like longswords for shield to bash if they dont back off after hitting your shield. if they hit your shield they should be like oh no, back up, not oh no let me work further into the shield so I can chunk 4 attacks before he can swing. After enemy hits your shield you should be able to right click like longsword and preform skeleton champions bash for a small chunk of dmg and staggering your enemy if they dont dodge backwards.

[candid hazel]

I get that, but having a melee boss be less obnoxious while having only melee players in your party just seems impossible
Maybe have rogue poison do more damage to bosses, or something like that, additional damage to bosses for some classes
/ @quaint bay rogue should have a camouflage approach for stealth, like being a couple meters close would make the rogue 'visible', being able to see the silhouette

[pseudo juniper]

could be like. Successfully blocking an attack causes -10% attack speed to the attacker for 2 seconds. with a 10 second cool down. that would make blocking high skill cap. being able to capitalize on the longer swing by hitting the opponent and being able to move out before the slower swing lands

[harsh belfry]

.shortinfo 1607596

[eager sable]

Suggestion from Sunder#4876

Next map should have a roaming boss.

Opinion:

+47

Suggestions Feed Post

[Suggestions Feed Post](#d-and-d-suggestions message)

Suggestion ID: 1607596 | Submitted at · Feb 16, 2023, 4:17 PM

[candid hazel]

Maybe be weapon based, as a 10% debuff for a rogue and their daggers just doesn't do anything

[ember yoke]

they should make +all attributes only found on rubysilver pieces or legendarys imo

[pseudo juniper]

right but rogues already lose to shield classes in that scenario

[verbal marsh]

you already receive a 10% movement and damage bonus with counter attack, that is obvious ineffective against a 45 agi rogue who wants to run circles around you.

[ebon idol]

The question is how would you even do that? Would the boss be able to open doors? Would the map not have doors to begin with? When would it stop following you?

[pseudo juniper]

literally just move your mouse faster and more accurately and you will be all good man trust me. same skill vs same skill rogue doesnt beat a shield class. unless they get the drop

[quaint bay]

agreed. if rogue stealth was imperfect (like they became more visible as you approached them, or had a permanent shimmer, or some sort of sound cue, or other types of hints) you could make them much more viable in combat. most people crying about rogues being weak have no idea how horrendous it is to play against them if they're strong. do folks really want people to be forced to afk sweep every room they enter to make sure a rogue isn't there? they can already oneshot wizards clerics and rangers pretty easily out of stealth with enough surprise. the counterplay against most classes usually comes in to play when you hear them coming and you are able to prepare a strategy to beat those classes. the counterplay for rogues is lame, boring, and repetitive - and you always have to be performing rogue counterplay at all moments during a match even if they are nowhere near you.

[candid hazel]

maybe roam between 4 rooms placed in a kind of circle
But that'd make more of a gimmick of luck when finding him then any other thing

[ember yoke]

next map should be a crystal cave with slimes and elementals change my mind

[opaque shore]

Whites should have +All attributes

[ebon idol]

The rogue of the Lindstrom party just oneshots a high roll equipped ranger with no problem what so ever. They come out of nowhere and you die. That is also kinda what they are supposed to do.

[opaque shore]

🙏

[pseudo juniper]

that is ALL they can do....rogue is really good at having 3 second duration damage modifier and being able to turn invisible and move about 5 yards

[candid hazel]

A permanent shimmer is to much I think, but being able to see them kind of clearer as you enter an area around them would be nice enough
What I don't know is about inv potions

[verbal marsh]

equally geared fighter vs rat rogue, rat rogue wins regardless of whether you immediately block after first attack. your swing rate is too slow to stop the next 3 and your shield means nothing. - ranger doesn't one tap fighter without a rogues assistance, and even then its 3-4.

[granite plinth]

ranger 1 taps both anyways so it doesnt matter

[pseudo juniper]

yeah man if i come out of stealth and stab u in the back of the head 2 times with weakpoint and ambush u are probably gunna lose the fight but thats the only scenario u should die to a rogue

[opaque shore]

Please refrain from sending nerd reactions.

[quaint bay]

if this is what they are "supposed to do", then they should not be in the game at all. you can easily make a rogue that satisfies a sneaky, ambush-ey, thievery class fantasy without allowing them to oneshot people out of perfect stealth. rock paper scissors is a game that already exists and while characters should have niches and weaknesses and strengths, 'you lose if this class is in your lobb y' is just bad gameplay all around.

[candid hazel]

You have either played against the best players of the server, or are just so tilted about ranged classes being good and ranged combat
/ @pseudo juniper exactly, it's annoying as hell to die to an ambush from a rogue, but that's their entire purpose

[cursive kayak]

I have been jumped by a Rouge and I have been able to get out of it thanks to my shield

[verbal marsh]

if you perfectly strike me thrice I have no quams about dying, if you strike me once, i turn block the next 3 and cant do anything about just dying. Yes I'm annoyed.

[granite plinth]

not really u kinda just kill any barb also as rogue they are way 2 slow to even hit u @candid hazel i had so much gear on basically all characters that i only played high roller

[pseudo juniper]

what u dont understand is that u can two or three hit a rogue with starter gear if u land headshots. which they cannot block. i do okay because i can abuse movement. but if i am not skilled enough to dodge i die. if u guys think dodging giant weapons and hitting people thru shields is easy then im done arguing

[opaque shore]

@cursive kayak I told you to refrain. Next time will be a longer timeout.

[candid hazel]

Being a ranger, and having the footprints passive, should tell you if the footprints are recent or not
That would help with rangers being ganked every time they think there's a rogue

[opaque shore]

If you're an educated adult, you can discuss about anything without resorting to such chit chat.

[granite plinth]

unethical class players needs more than he already has on ranger wild

[pseudo juniper]

also before u say rogue can run away barb has aoe slow and fighter has sprint

[candid hazel]

Now that's a moderator
/ @granite plinth so you are tilted because ranged classes are better at ranged combat
Incredible species you are, analyzed you should be, yes, yes

[quaint bay]

one thing i'd love to see in the game is for the different classes to have a lot of their interesting mechanic perks baseline and instead have perks that heavily enhance them. fighters could wear every weapon baseline but at a much steeper penalty unless they have a trait. rangers can see footsteps but only for the last 10 seconds without the trait. there's a lot of really interesting mechanical functionality that is locked away behind trait options and i dont think it makes sense for perks to work that way

[safe orbit]

I feel like the game could use a dmg modifier applied only to players to make fights more interesting and reduce the one-shot galore that seems to be the "meta". Shields need to cover more area, and be destructible to avoid abuse.

[verbal marsh]

what I'm saying is that hatchet, horsemans, and daggers all turn shields into a false security - and I think a bash would be a cool option toward punishing someone who directly approaches a fighter with those weapons, but yeah you're right it isn't necessary.

[granite plinth]

rogue can 100% run away if u have any trouble against any melee class as rogue u are simply horrible at rogue , the only classes that u cant really do anything ab is wiz and ranger

[plucky hinge]

fighter can also have a bow ?

[civic agate]

Yes with a perk

[granite plinth]

yea and fighter with bow too

[candid hazel]

Maybe with the masteries they'll implement that
But that does sound quite nice, being able to have different playstyles while playing the same class
/ @safe orbit shields breaking is like rangers having finite arrows, just annoying and tedious

[dawn raptor]

Hey guys. What do you think of having a training room where you can test out your gear? /s

[pseudo juniper]

barb has an aoe slow with like a 20 yard range and u cant out run a fighter with sprint u just cant its not possible so idk what ur even saying . if u dont insta kill your enemy or severely out play them with movement u are just dead bro. there is no arguing that ur just wrong

[verbal marsh]

my rogue hard 315 ms with his weapon out... thats faster then most players running with gloves.

[granite plinth]

im not wrong its a massive skill issue on ur part on even getting hit by any barb or fighter lol

[candid hazel]

A test ground would help so much, a test ground as a private match which can be entered with friends would be quite the feat to

[dawn raptor]

I know its just been suggested like 800 times already

[pseudo juniper]

right so what do u do when u are 10 yards away from a barb and get slowed? or what happens when u try to one shot a fighter but he has more gear than u and he lives and pops sprint and chases after u? please tell me what u do in those scenarios. im guessing those scenarios simply do not exsist for u. homie really said throwing knife like it doesnt do 7 damage

[verbal marsh]

switch to your throwing dagger and hit him before he hatchets you and gtfo or stab him in the face.

[granite plinth]

literally dodge and get free hits , u are horrible at rogue if u cant beat melee classes (SKILL ISSUE) also throwing knife with q ability 1 shots rangers/wiz also does a lot of dmg lol

[dawn raptor]

What does the barb do when you're 10 yards away and running away? Throw an axe. Skill check.

[candid hazel]

Discussion about different level gear is just for the sake of having it
Comparing an endgame gear anything against a lvl 1, just dumped to the gutter anyother thing just doesn't make a lot of sense

[pseudo juniper]

finally a real player has entered the chat room

[limpid moon]

why do so many people think that their opinion matters when they very clearly emotionally type, don't have enough experience playing the game with all the classes(like they think they do) or want to downplay their own class to see it buffed to make up for the fact that they suck at the game. So many people make a mistake or die and think it's the game's fault or the game needs to change for them. Lol. Professional tip for fighter/barb players who complain about ranged classes, use throwing axes to SLOW THEM or get kited because your primate brain compels you to walk in a straight line for the ranger or wizard.

With that said I have a suggestion. Don't listen to immature, poorly thought out ideas, and don't power creep the game. Unique weapons with effects should get their effect base damage significantly reduced to incentivize creating a "gear build" around the weapon as these weapons are too strong on their own.

Great game, played every playtest, and excited to see the future of it. (:

[safe orbit]

@candid hazel Finite arrows actually dont sound too bad either, as planning around resources, at least for me, makes the gameplay more exciting and adds another layer of complexity and planning. In the shield's case, if it (and it probably will) gets better hit detection, you will have players that just cant be downed, or take too long to do so. Durability is a hard counter for that.

[quaint bay]

why are you, a rogue, within ten yards of a barbarian? you have already made several mistakes to get to that point lol

[granite plinth]

no he has not lol rogue shits on barb badly its literally their counter

[civic agate]

I play a ton of this game and I've never seen a barbarian throw axes it stupid that they don't do that more often

[pseudo juniper]

ur so delusional if u think thats never gunna happen becasue ur just so good at the game u will never even exsist near a barbarian. these people think that rogues are op and they just arent lol

[dawn raptor]

The decent ones do. I assume you were playing a lot of goblin caves. I was still seeing 90% freshies in there even on the last day.

[harsh belfry]

You will eventually lose that unique weapon, I’m ok with them being OP. Let’s you take a power trip for a few games and then lose it when you overextend from your team or get out maneuvered.

[ebon idol]

You see it a lot in solo dungeon. Where Barbs have to get the kills all on their own.

[quaint bay]

i completely agree, played a ton of barbarian and you literally are never hitting a rogue who is spacing properly. but if this guy thinks that he auto-loses to barbarians if they are able to shout slow him then why does he keep letting barbarians get in range to shout slow him? its annoying that people complain about melee characters being strong in melee range when they have plenty of tools and the capability to stay out of melee range as long as they want. the only class that you cannot feasibly stay out of melee range with is the rogue because of stealth.

[cursive kayak]

I honestly think that Rouges are in a really good spot and I'm a fighter

[granite plinth]

rogue is 100% op ur able to 3 tap a fully geared barb with a green dagger u are just bad and probably lvl 10 (i main rogue)

[candid hazel]

In a battle against other players, having to reload is a big enough burden
Having finite arrows against a fighter means he can just wait you out while walking in a straight line towards you

[lusty wren]

typical rogue main takes 😄

[dawn raptor]

Mostly true but I wonder how a dual wield barb does against rogues. Probably chews them right up any time they try to stab.

[pseudo juniper]

ur literally mad becasue i disagreed with u earlier and its so easy to see ur trolling. become more aware irl if u want my advice

[boreal forge]

Feel like rogue should be able to use buckler and a weak hand crossbow or smthn.

[verbal marsh]

I too hope to see less power creep. Perhaps push weapon bonus's toward bane damage rather then magic weapons increasing overall damage. That would balance full sets to being more completive against players while powerful weapons would improve pve creep. Thoughts?

[granite plinth]

he is bad and probably new lol ignore his comments he is prob hardstuck normal games casual player @pseudo juniper no im not mad at u lol u clearly said rogue is a "weak class" when its the only class in the game that literally 3 taps barbs in melee range with green weapons ........

[cursive kayak]

Rouges are good the way they are. They don't need a bow just get some throwing knives

[harsh belfry]

I want to see every class have a monster Hunter perk like clerics with skeletons.

[boreal forge]

And hey what if Archery was more like Kingdom come Deliverance minus the slow drawspeed but the way that aiming works and holding in your arrow? Cause people be doing all phys dmg builds to 1shot in pvp as rangers.

[pseudo juniper]

ur right because other barbs just one tap other barbs if they land a head shot, same with rangers and fighters with good weapons. u are the one who hasnt played the game enough

[verbal marsh]

actually surprised that rangers don't have a drop down option toward their favored enemy.

[ebon idol]

Rangers would make sense to have an anti-beast skill, but who would get the demon-slayer perk?

[glass ore]

this guy gets it, I made my suggestion with arrow ammo because I think fighters shouldn't be able to just pick one up and use it over swords for the whole game (you'd be surprised how often fighters fight me and kill me with a bow because they have better armor even though I am hitting them more)

[candid hazel]

Power creep is best not existing, but as that isn't possible in a ongoing game
The later it comes into the game the better
And personally I don't think neither class is OP in comparison to the rest
At least in 3v3s
In solo it's much more skill oriented with the right classes as they have a rock, paper, scissors relationship

[granite plinth]

yea if they land a headshot with a purple axe ur not 1 tapping any other barb thats geared with a green axe lil bro