suggestion-discussion

[scenic kettle]

people been working the whole week

[real cloud]

Would be good if it also disabled fires from an explosion

[toxic mortar]

The amount of players that are on that tiny goblin map is redic, revert it

[real cloud]

i.e. fireball, lantern, explo

[real cloud]

It’s not that bad lol

Just play slower

Focus on looting

[toxic mortar]

The map is tiny

[real cloud]

Not for 11p

[toxic mortar]

9 was enough

[real cloud]

It’s fine

You’re Ranger, the only risk you have is if you don’t position properly

You can punish people hard on goblin with a bow

[stuck perch]

Can't agree enough. If they want more people, they need to make larger maps to accommodate them AND give us more pve time in the map by slowing the shrinking of the zone. 20mins matches wouldn't be a bad thing.

[toxic mortar]

Literally spawn next to 2 peolpe everytime

[real cloud]

idk I had no issue with the change as barb, got out like 6-7 times in a row until I got unlucky with a champion into a cross team fight

[toxic mortar]

And im solo so even going on the other map isnt really an option seeming they have also up'd that too

[real cloud]

The only risk on the original map as solo is teams

[toxic mortar]

Dog piss bro i think im done with this wipe

[real cloud]

So just play on goblin until you find someone in gather hall

Most people on gather hall are actually decent too

I’ve had a few bad parties but meh

[toxic mortar]

I should have to play with someone to play the game bro

shoukldnt

[real cloud]

Then do goblin 👍

[versed goblet]

i m also a much bigger fan of old spawns, i still havent played much hours with this new ones but they dont feel good on many levels

[real cloud]

I mean as of now goblin feels more balanced with pvp/pve while before it was almost all pve

[stuck perch]

Even as a full trio, castle map isn't as fun. There used to be this growing tension that you'd be forced into as you got deeper in. Now it's just chaos. Even the concept of "deeper in" doesn't apply anymore as most rooms are already looted by those spawning further in.

[real cloud]

since most people died and there were enough portals for everyone to peacefully leave

now you actually need to fight

[versed goblet]

well putted, it losses like the narrative of each game

[real cloud]

My complaint with deeper is that you’re forced into boss room most of the time

[stuck perch]

As people get better this would have resolved itself.

[real cloud]

that’s it

[real cloud]

If playtests lasted longer the issue would be solved

But meh

[stuck perch]

If the maps were bigger it wouldn't be impossible to bypass. Do we even have time to kill the boss now?

[real cloud]

It’s a close call

[deft monolith]

The increase of players is not good at all....please revert that. It's making it way too PVPish....it had a great balance before

[real cloud]

My take is still the same

it’s fine now

[stuck perch]

It did, especially the last playtest. If anything slow down the darkness so we can do more exploring. No matter what, keeping the same number of extraction portals will force pvp in the end.

[real cloud]

Think the only thing I’d want balance wise is to get a way to limit stat rolls for certain items

like I don’t want magic power on a barb weapon

or any barb armor in that matter

[stuck perch]

That's not crazy but it also makes those good items where the rolls line up pretty spectacular.

[deft monolith]

The darkness was fine. So was the amount of people. What they did effed it up. We don't need more people on the map, that's an exponential increase and I'm not sure why they did it

[stuck perch]

They're testing things out.

[real cloud]

exponential

what

+2

not that bad

[deft monolith]

I get that. This is my feedback. I'm trying to send it to them but those feedback channels won't let people type

[last walrus]

This seems to be the only channel without an insane slow mode attached.

[real cloud]

class discussion channels have none either

[stuck perch]

You have to make a suggestion, keep it simple and then link it here so people can upvote it.

[real cloud]

good to talk about strategies

helps learn about the game

last night's barb chat was amazing

[deft monolith]

+2 is a lot considering it was 16.....played for about 8 hours today and def noticed running into constant pvp more than before

[real cloud]

it was 9 on goblin

11 now

[last walrus]

General Chat

5 minute timer...

I'd like to suggest that goes away but I can only make one suggestion every 6 hours so I gotta make sure it's the one I want.

[stuck perch]

The darkness often puts undue pressure, on us to abandon rooms before we're done looting it. Sometimes we barely have time to kill all the monsters in it before the darkness comes.

[real cloud]

should be 1m imo

much slower now

[deft monolith]

It also might be they changed the spawns....

[real cloud]

since all the crybabies that died once or twice are mostly gone now

[real cloud]

this is probably the reason

not the player increase

[stuck perch]

The general chat time is due to the number of people in that room, it's a discord limitation not a dev selected one.

[deft monolith]

why did the change the spawns

[real cloud]

prob just testing

[stuck perch]

I think they changed the spawns because people were complaining too much about being spawn rushed. But you could easily counter it if you either skipped it or hid.

[real cloud]

I mean during my runs I just rushed the stair exit and camped there

[toxic mortar]

Literally turned goblin map in to a deathmatch map

[real cloud]

got good loot every time

[stuck perch]

Previously with everyone starting on the sides, you knew that if you went deeper towards the center you were unlikely to find an already looted room.

[real cloud]

and was safe because there was a heal shrine nearby

good strats

good pve

good pvp

[deft monolith]

they need to go back to original spawns....if it's a problem, space spawns out

[real cloud]

just buy a good green wep off trade for like 50-100

and run that

[stuck perch]

Space spawns out, maybe add another level above and below if you really want more people per match. That way spawn rushing is very unlikely to give fruit but it's still a possibility.

[cobalt root]

I think goblin caves needs a bit more time for each layer of the circle - currently, at 4 minutes in, more than half the map is swarm

[stuck perch]

Increase the overall darkness zone timer by 5 minutes and see how that works out.

[real cloud]

it'd be too slow then

it does need an increase

not that much tho

3min max

[stuck perch]

I'm saying 5 minutes overall divided equally amongst all layers of the circle.

[real cloud]

in the end I've had a blast as barb

no real complaints

actually

the only one I have is cave troll changes

makes it impossible to kill as barb lmao

[lament willow]

having easier bosses for normals and harder ones for high roller/super high roller or w/e sounds like a good suggestion

[stuck perch]

I thought the troll was made to be impossible to solo.

[lament willow]

some groups are annihilating bosses, but the vast majority of players I think have never killed any boss ever

[lament willow]

no
he was made a bit harder because he was too easy to solo

you can still solo him

[summer wraith]

Should be able to give negative karma for people teaming in solo duneon

[lament willow]

that's gameplay as intended

dungeon diplomacy has long been a part of the kind of d&d multicrawls this is based on

[stuck perch]

Yeah teaming up in solo dungeon was the intent.

If you want a no teaming dungeon it needs to be an arena with a single extraction portal.

Even then, if there's more than 2 players, they will make quick alliances and betray each other later on.

[lament willow]

@gray rover that already mostly exists

you voice and go 'anyone need anything' and someone's like 'I need chest and pots and a weapon' and you go 'I got you brah'

and you just shove it on the floor

at the start of the run

[gray rover]

I'm talking about if you want to give your friend rare, epic or legendary items and not want risk going into a game

[stuck perch]

They have that already, it's through the trade channel

You have to be member of the trader's guild and there's a fee for both of you per trade.

[gray rover]

You're missing the point

[autumn beacon]

death skulls are so fakking annoying

[stuck perch]

If you're trying to safely trade something to your friend, why is the trade mechanic not good enough?

@autumn beacon What class are you having trouble with them?

[autumn beacon]

wizzy

[stuck perch]

I think it's something like 2 smacks on the head. Or you could try zapping them.

[autumn beacon]

yeah. they're just annoyoing af

[unkempt vault]

We should be able to see portals on minimal

Minimap

Is my hot take

[fervent plover]

the current version is having a terrible hit feel i suppose. melee classes like rogue, or rangers definitely needs a better hit feeling since both classes requires a strict attack distance to hit something.
and the damaging spells need some hit feelings as well (like the magic missiles)

[severe scroll]

An item attribute that gave this wouldn't be too bad. Or a consumable.

[stuck perch]

No, hearing them and looking for them is part of the experience. Although the directional sounds need to be well done.

[fervent plover]

sometimes i just cast chain lighting and have no idea if I've hit, unless the log shows I've just killed someone

[stuck perch]

Yeah spells are bad for that, same with zap. Make an on hit animation of some sorts.

Why do most of the wizard perk suck?

[fervent plover]

yeah, some are useless, i just want to max out spell casting speed and then go for survival

[stuck perch]

You have 2 perks that increase spellcasting speed by 10% and then a bunch of +5% damage perks

[strong shale]

they don't suck

the casting speed is great for arcane missiles, because it also effects the channel / how fast they're released.

The +5% fire damage one also increases burn time which is huge damage, the arcane one makes invis basically instant cast.

that said though, starting gear on wizard is basically unplayable, you can't cast jack shit if an npc is close, and they walk fast enough that you can barely get half a spell off if you run away to get some distance.

Once they get some gear, they're broken as fuck

[fervent plover]

starting gear is enough for killing mobs though, i really love npc wizards, loot their crystal balls or spell books and yay

[strong shale]

i do 14 damage with a 2h staff, arcane missiles is basically uncastable once they've closed the gap, can't cast fireball or lightning spells or i'll kill myself with my own spell.

just gotta work 200-300 health down with 14 damage slow swings.

Totally fine

i just wish it did something like 30 magic damage on hit, that way my stats would help it and i could kill a zombie in 10 hits or so instead of running out of time and just having to run through a room rather than fight things once they're aggro'd

[fervent plover]

you dont need to run too far, just wait for the zombie to attack and run opposite

[stuck perch]

the casting speed ones are the only ones that don't suck, casting speed is always good no matter what.

For the fire spell, 5% of nothing is not much more.

[strong shale]

fireball can and will one shot another wizard

5% more makes it nice enough to two shot a barb sometimes with the ignite

[cobalt root]

The rogue's starting weapon is absolutely abysmal - I'd rather start with the wizard's starting staff for melee than that starting dagger.
With a weapon that bad it makes getting the first extraction with it absolutely awful. Every other class has better starting damage that it, even the ranger with its bad bow.

I think the rogue's starting dagger should be slightly better, or maybe even start with a rapier for at least a bit better range

was playing a ton of fighter and barb and wanted to try out rogue again, but yeesh

[stuck perch]

In this playtest after it was nerfed twice?

[strong shale]

The rogue's starting weapon is absolutely abysmal - I'd rather start with the wizard's starting staff for melee than that starting dagger.
That is delusional, because you do poison damage which stacks for great dps. Your purpose is not to do physical damage, it's to do poison stack like the rogue you are. It does great damage.

Wizards do NOTHING to mobs once they're stuck in close range.

[stuck perch]

Also fireball is useless in close range, you're more likely to kill yourself and not much more.

[vale pivot]

Revert 18 players to 16

[stuck perch]

I totally agree with you, but what was your thinking behind wanting less players?

[vale pivot]

Just buy a better one from weaponsmith for like 12 gold

[autumn beacon]

he said that first extraction. so assuming that's not an option yet

[vale pivot]

It's pretty trash yeah

[strong shale]

the splash damage nerf is fine, direct damage and ignite is the bread and butter of the damage of fireball

[autumn beacon]

it is pretty trash but i got lucky and extracted my very first game after making a rogue lol

oh wait nvm! that was ranger i did that on

[stuck perch]

Ignite as in the spell? That got nerfed too!

[vale pivot]

Map size fits 16 better imo. 16 just feels more balanced for the spawns and amount of encounters per round

[strong shale]

no, ignite as in the debuff that is applied

[stuck perch]

How much damage is that? Because it feels like nothing to me.

It's already near impossible to hit something with it due to it's projectile speed. The splash was were you got most of your reliable damge

I liked it as a slow moving but powerful Aoe, now it's just a cheap spell that isn't good for long or close range.

[scenic kettle]

im suprised people dont talk in this cha

since there is no timer

meanwhile the other chats have a 5 min timer

[stuck perch]

If people came here to talk we'd have the same timer

[scenic kettle]

thats true

[short ingot]

Hey guys new player here(been playing for 1 day) i have a problem where my character stutters while moving(nothing else stutters just my character) its similar to like running into a wall. Makes combat impossible tbh. any tips? (Drivers are up to date. Using a 3060TI, every other game runs fine etc) ❤️ pls halp

[scenic kettle]

i think your just lagging

usually only happens when u lag

assuming your fps doesnt drop

[short ingot]

But only lagging in dark and darker? Always? That seems weird. also nothing else seems to lag just my character

[scenic kettle]

is it like when u move around

or look around?

[short ingot]

move around

[nimble ruin]

What are people's thoughts on my suggestion now that its been in for a day? Would more environment affects be fun or deter pvp? #d-and-d-suggestions message

[scenic kettle]

yeah usually that problem occurs when your lagging

if you could try to shoot a bow

if the shot is delayed

than that would confirm it

[short ingot]

Nah nothing is delayed. Only problem is movement. spells fine/other characters fine/ arrows fine etfc

[scenic kettle]

your suggestion is good

but im not sure about being able to break rubble or stuff to kill pursuers

maybe to block off the path is nice

[nimble ruin]

that's why i said hurt/kill cause i think it could be abused

[scenic kettle]

feel like it would be cheesy to just run away

the nboom break off a path u followed me ur dead

yeah hurt works

but everything else is good

i do think there should be more puzzles

and possibly breaking whiles

walls*

[scenic kettle]

this is weird

are u playing on full screen

and have the right resoulution

[short ingot]

Tried fullscreen and other option. i believe resolution is correct im using whatever was default tbh

[scenic kettle]

umm

when u play with people

can they see you kinda lag

like move in place

[cobalt root]

I've been having jank/laggy movement all day today - happened yesterday too, but wasn't as bad

like moving forward, but getting sent back to the same spot 10 times a second until I either back away, or jump over the invisible lag demon

[stuck perch]

Make a holy symbol off-hand for the cleric. Kinda like how wizard can do orb and dagger

[weary storm]

Is there anything being put in place to combat against unreachable hunting traps put inside bodies?

I see, Thanks for the response.

[dry vessel]

fighter with a longbow is dumb, pls nerf

[stuck perch]

Why? He's just worse than a ranger in every aspect.

Why? just look where you put your feet

[shy pilot]

honestly the barb needs to be nerf hard man good god the amount of times I keep getting two tapped with in 10 seconds is stupid they swing two handed weapons way to fast and are ready to swing again with in a second it would be nice to see a longer wind up time after a swing

[stuck locust]

Lol samsons suggestion is funny

#report-a-bug

[shy pilot]

thanks

[spring veldt]

how can i post suggestions guys?

when i write .suggest it doesnt work

[stuck locust]

Wait a minute it takes a while

[spring veldt]

wdy im trying since 10mins

the words just shake for a sec and thats it

[stuck locust]

What are you trying to suggest

[spring veldt]

balance changes

[stuck locust]

Paste it here I’ll try

[spring veldt]

rework ideas

etc

[stuck locust]

There’s a 5 hour cooldown

I didn’t realize lol

[spring veldt]

people are posting right now

idk why i cant

i even tried to suggest only the monster stuff and it doesnt work

[real trellis]

Is there a timer counting down below the chat bar when you look in that channel?

Because suggestions are once per 6 hours

[spring veldt]

no i havent posted anything yet

ill try to post a picture instead

1sec

[lofty totem]

anyone else having voip turn off every time they open game?

[sand gale]

CLAN/GUILD would be a nice touch to keep in touch with players that you enjoy playing with. You could also incorporate donating gold to level it up to give bonuses such as additional players in it, increased EXP gain, or overall passive skills such as higher health, strength, ETC.

[lofty totem]

i dont feel as if there is a point due to discord here and because steam exists with friend lists

[stuck locust]

What about the people who never use discord or steam and only play game

[lofty totem]

you have to use steam to play the game unless i'm mistaken

[sand gale]

anyone else having a problem making suggestions

[lofty totem]

also who doesnt use discord at this point

[empty trail]

I don't like that they added more people to matches but didn't compensate with more portals. Nothing feels worse in this game than dying in the end because you never even saw a blue portal the entire match.

[sand gale]

ya i agree

[lofty totem]

more people dying equals it out

[stuck locust]

Me I only use it when The dark and darker playtest are online lol

[sand gale]

and the next level is to difficult for low level teams

[stuck locust]

Wait wrong reply

[stuck locust]

Yeah 9 seemed perfect for solo no idea why then added 2 more

[lofty totem]

i get which one the reply is for

i think solo count is fine

my last run i died but the one before that there were 3 left, two teamed on one and the guy who let me escape got out due to the others killing each other. it evens out and works with 11 just fine

@arctic hound saw your suggestion, they said the game is on hard mode rn and that it will have normal mode later on

[tough oar]

gotta be agro in the late circles and stake out your escape portals or hard challenge the people in the circle for theirs. just kill them all 4head

[empty trail]

I've been running a lot of goblin cave and in matches where you have 5 people instantly die to AI, yeah things are fine. But if you have competent people in your lobby there just aren't enough portals to go around. I understand contesting them is good but with the way goblin cave is set up to be multi tiered you are likely to have someone taking a portal right above you with nothing you can do about it. It feels like a worse problem than the old normal map was just because of how the map is set up.

[lofty totem]

eh, sometimes it is a bit more complicated

[stuck locust]

I do have that happen to me

[tough oar]

idk there arent meant to be portals for everyone, to force more pvp, if solos group up they often get left with not enough portals, makes it spicier

[stuck locust]

The problem with that is there are so many more mobs in solo compared to normal that most of the time solos team up just because they’re that many

[tough oar]

like ive cleared heaps of enemies with another person, then it got near the end and we said farewell and went opposite ways, both got out feelsgoodman

[empty trail]

Before any patches there were 4 portals for 9 players, leaving 5 people out of luck. They deemed that to be too few so they added a 5th portal for 9 players, leaving 4. Now we have the same 5 portals for 11 players, leaving out 6 which is worse than the starting situation! It just makes no sense.

[tough oar]

you have to kill someone to be "guaranteed" an extract. makes sense

it should maybe be more, but idk, playtests should try out things more to the extremes imo

[empty trail]

Killing someone does not "guarantee" an extract, if it did we would be in a much better place.

[tough oar]

thats why i gave it the ""

most BRs are flat out only 1 remains, this allows lots of people to get out at least

[gritty verge]

Troll is now impossible to kill, the swing change makes it so you dont even know when to dodge or block it

[stuck locust]

BRO YES TRAINING AREA NEED

[rare knot]

Full nudity client side only option to be enabled in options menu, upvote, letsgo

[raw belfry]

It would be even cooler to see a class thats focused on status effects etc. Damage over time, slows, curses and what not. Like an offense support, as cleric is focused on buffing allies

Would become a must-have class for team comps going for bosses

[stuck perch]

For #d-and-d-suggestions message
I'd be willing to take 15 to 20% with the same cooldown , it's mostly a pve skill and you should be able to count your hits while using it. But seriously 5% is way too low. For the Barb skill I'd be willing to tolerate the same as it can't be farmed in pve and heals more due to a larger health pool.

[opal flicker]

i dont believe my further nerfing/reworking wizards suggestion will be very popular, but touching on it even further, i have a few ideas in mind of fair nerfs in my opinion

Haste: stays mostly the same but after its duration ends it comes with a significant slow debuff for a time equivalent to or slightly longer than the haste effect, similiar to the spells effect in dungeons and dragons. also gives a reason to run equipment which reduces debuff duration or clerics cleanse and acts as an engagement tool that must be acted upon swiftly or very emergency exit tool rather than a get out of jail free card

Invis: Simply cannot be cast on self OR does not give a movement speed buff

Ignite: this one im actually a little stumped on and maybe does not need any change, giving lower geared players a better chance with ignite is not awful, maybe it just stays with its reduced spell capacity

alternatively, with bards entering the game soon and likely being a support caster, maybe just completely remove buffing spells from wizard and give them more offensive spells, making them THE offensive caster, but idk how i feel about this. i do know that wizard is in a ridiculous state right now though and i dont belive reducing their spell capacity and forcing them to take meditation is the answer

[hard agate]

Personally I dont think that the swarm at the end should kill you oncce it finishes. It should just let the dot effect do its job and players get the chance to get out and loot

[opal flicker]

i agree with that you should add that as a suggestion. if i got the meds let me use them till i cant you know

[nimble basalt]

WTF how come After I successfully left, everything in my bag disappeared

[inland pelican]

Cosigned

[inland pelican]

The thing is more spell options is better for wizard, lower spell quantity also fits, the best nerf for wizard would actually be to continue with balancing the number of casts while adding new spells in the game to diversify their kits, keeps in theme and keeps them as the Swiss army knife they are intended to be

[stuck perch]

An easy way to balance haste on the wizard is reducing the wizard's agility. Agility 20 is overkill for a wizard. Sure haste and invisibility can still be used to get away, but buffing a lower stat doesn't provide as much speed and the spell still works nicely on everyone else. Besides wizards using haste or invisibility to get away is fine. There are ways to corner him if need be and barb/fighter sprints should last longer anyways. If a wizard burns all his haste/invisibility spells he's going to get caught pretty quickly. This would also nerf the dagger wizard that people are complaining are better rogues, then you can return ignite to +10 damage per hit. On the other hand, let people walk and do non-aggressive non-spell casting actions with the invisibility from potions.

[stuck perch]

If there's a support caster right now it's the cleric. Every class needs multiple ways to play them so I think Wizard should not only keep his buffs but also receive more buff and more damage spells. Let War Wizards be a thing but also let support wizards also be a thing. Even if the bard ends up with support magic, they can give him different buffs just like wizard and cleric buffs are different. They don't need to take away something from the wizard to make the bard a viable class. I wouldn't even care if bards shared spells with wizards, provided wizards are still the masters of arcane magic.

[opal flicker]

i would agree that more spell options is better, which is why my primary suggestion is nerfing the ones they have and not removing them, that is an extreme secondary option and i would love to see more spells for the wizard as i have spent a significant amount of time this playtest playing as wizard, the problem is as the buffing spells stand right now, they are practically mandatory takes, even as a solo they are just so good as to not be able to pass up in any comp, and thats a problem, especially when those choices tend to roll people that havent also made those choices in a party composition

[errant dawn]

do the races actually apply the buffs under their desription?

[spiral comet]

Thoughts on adding an entire other class like monk with light healing ability's to add variety to the only cleric comps. With a rework to cleric to limit his heals and help his dmg more

[stuck perch]

I'd rather see less spell casts than having the spells nerfed themselves. Give us the option to itemize for more spell casts with knowledge and make the spells themselves scale off of will. Then you can build for maximum effectiveness or maximum uses or somewhere in between.
But more spell options are important for every caster.

[real trellis]

Monk is either going to be amazing because they don't need weapons or they're going to suck horribly because they can't use weapons

[stuck perch]

I'm hoping that Paladin, Druid, and Bard come with some light spell casting.

[fickle marten]

Its pretty annoying how skeletons are able to hit me through bars

[real trellis]

quarterstaff is really good though

[spiral comet]

thatd be nice

[stuck perch]

Well Druid should be a major caster but with it's own spell list that includes light heals.

[spiral comet]

Also possible rework to the penetration to armor with ranger arrows. The class is broken against green and below but almost become absolute when it comes to rarer gear

[inland pelican]

You are making the case for nerfing the spells you feel you HAVE to take

[opal flicker]

the lowered agility is also an excellent idea though i worry that it doesnt effect a composition at all and only the solo. the amount of outfootworking that can be done with fighter V fighter or any melee class V any melee class with a haste spell on is ridiculous to the point of being stale, you see that they are hasted? might as well back up and disengage, but also goodluck with that. i think the slow after the effect is a good trade off, really makes one think about when to use haste and how instead of just throwing it down whenever which is the core problem, there is really no downside or thought to the spell. fireball has weaker splash damage requiring a direct hit and large friendly fire, chain lightning has dangerous friendly fire, lightning strikes line of sight can be blocked and do friendly fire. magic missile is slow. all these spells require thought behind their use invis haste and ignite are just really really good and i think thats why we see them all the time in almost every build.it should still be an option, but it shouldnt be THE option

[stuck perch]

On that subject I'd like all weapons to deal a % of their damage as true damage. And switch armor into a flat reduction system possibly hit location based or a combination of flat and % with percentage applying first.

[inland pelican]

Pally is likely going to be under cleric imo and monk under barb maybe

[opal flicker]

yes, i think when there is a very good option that puts you at a significant disadvantage if you dont take because others do in almost or all situations that is an issue that needs to be resolved

[inland pelican]

Spellblade under fighter or wizard

[inland pelican]

Agreed, feels like an internal balance issue

[opal flicker]

im glad you agree, this is the core of my suggestion and i felt remiss if i had just said "nerf these" without providing any suggestion about how or why

[stuck perch]

The slow would only work if the haste lasted much much longer. Otherwise you'd get yelled at for using it. Sure there's plenty of footwork to be done with it, but that's a good thing. You can always move to a choke point and focus on blocking. Likewise it can give melee team mates the chance to get to the enemy backline for interesting tactics. If you're worried that it needs counter-play, there are other ways of handling that than just slapping on such a disadvantage.

[spiral comet]

Yeah that would definitely help. No reason purple longbows should take 5 headshots to kill a Barb\

[inland pelican]

Druid is totally its own class, actives to choose two form changes or one form change and casting for the other, carry a regen spell and control spells ( vine walls and fog clouds )

[spiral comet]

When at that level Barbs 1 shot

[inland pelican]

Atm it feels barbs have a low skill floor and ceiling, as a fighter with lower gear... any barb is a worry, one missed block is nearly a death

[stuck perch]

For example buffs need to be decent AND most of all fun to use and receive, but because they're powerful you need some skill to use them and some counter-play. They could add a Dispel Magic spell for removing enemy buffs/friendly debuffs. But that requires the buffs to last long enough that a player would want to use a spell or ability for removing it.

[atomic plover]

I think it would have to be tested, but you may do more damage to chest since most plate helmets that barbs wear have headshot protection of some sort.

Esp if it's the bare chested barb variety

[stuck perch]

Choosing to not wear chest armor would require some weighing of the pros and cons.

[autumn vale]

No more extention?

[spiral comet]

this is definitely a rough test but its still about 4-5 shots to the chest with purple longbow. Ive only got 50 hours tho so thats no concrete

[spiral comet]

^

[winged venture]

i mean barb starts with like 140 health any gear and he becomes an absolute tank

[stuck perch]

Barbs are supposed to be tough to kill, but all that damage they take also draws on team resources so you might not encounter full health barbs all the time. That said your best defense against a barb charging in is your bear trap.

[spiral comet]

With their door bust ability tho its almost impossibe after they rage to get enough time to place

[stuck perch]

Also play a barb for a bit, you'll note that they're not that hard to dodge.

[opal flicker]

i dont believe you would be yelled at for using it, i think it would just become more situational. closing gaps, getting to cover. perhaps the slow would not last as long as i said it would, but regardless the debuff would utilize other systems that are meant to negate debuffs. i would also push back against the point that you can always fall back and block, i infact believe often by the time something hasted is rushing at you you dont really have the time to get anywhere, not to mention that being forced to block already puts you in a losing state. if one person is attempting to do damage (of which its pretty easy to get past shields and blocks) and the other is not, the aggressor will win more often then not and thats dumb for just a single spell, which in the case of haste i think is pretty boring honestly, so then you also need to be hasted to stand a chance, and we arrive back at the original stand off that it becomes a required spell. even clerics healing have the counterplay of standing between the cleric and the enemy, however dangerous that is. i just dont think there is real counterplay to haste

[winged venture]

yeah bait his swings he hits for like 84 to the head base gear

[inland pelican]

Basically code a cleanse that works for all buffs and give it an aoe and you have a good dispel magic

[atomic plover]

I mean that's slow tactile play, of course bear trap helps, but if you don't have the luxury of the seconds it takes to put one down...

[opal flicker]

dispel magic could be a very good option in this case that i like the idea of

[manic fulcrum]

The suggestion to only let us spectate our party when we die and not others later sounds super salty. Idk how you can cheat because you only see from other party perspectives after your whole team is dead/extracted? Also I always enjoy spectating the people I screw over/die to to know how it ends for them

[opal flicker]

generally people are stacking buffs on buffs so even for their short durations it could be very good

[whole juniper]

No chance for extend playtest?

[stuck perch]

Make Dispel magic an AoE that removes allied magical debuff and enemy buffs. Could even work against prot potions. Give the cleric a player based aoe version and the wizard a targeted aoe version.

[winged venture]

probably not they would have announced by now

[stuck perch]

It's always bad to get surprised, if any class surprises you, you're in for a tough fight.

[spiral comet]

Whats your opionion on every one-hand weapon having a block option with the abilty to parry

feel like itd make combat more fluid

but the lighter the weapon the less defense the block has letting in dmg

[inland pelican]

Easier, it's dispel magic, removes all magic buffs, period

[manic fulcrum]

depends on the details imo. does literally every 1h wep get to parry? it'd feel really bad for a dagger to parry a felling axe swing. If you parry, do you get a timing advantage on your swing compared to them? if not, what advantage does parrying have?

[inland pelican]

This is what I have to say to that #d-and-d-suggestions message

[stuck perch]

Backing and blocking shouldn't put you on the losing stance, if a barb is hasted it's not a 1v1 fight. Which means that while you're blocking your allies can help resolve the situation. Providing counter play mechanics is more important than punishing players who like those spells by providing downsides.

[spiral comet]

A parry would block whatever set Percentage stat it has but responds with a faster counter attack

daggers probably not

[inland pelican]

Aside from my suggested shield buff I personally believe if you hit a weapon with your weapon it should cause a blocked recoil for both of you, maybe based on the opposing weapons weight

[inland pelican]

So yes even a dagger, but with very little recoil if much at all

[winged venture]

weapon collision would be dope

[inland pelican]

I trust they will work on it, but im sure it would be faster if one of you guys encapsulated my idea into a cohesive suggestion

[opal flicker]

without teammates it is definitely a losing stance, a death timer of when will the barb hit, but in a 2v1 situation maybe thats how it should be, however in something like a 2v2 situation, you still have to remember that the wizard is not sitting idly by sucking his thumbs, he is going to try to kill the friend that is helping you, this continues on as the numbers increase and still results in the team with the haste being in a far more advantaged state then the team without which is the baseline problem. it is TOO good. im not saying it shouldnt be pretty good, however it is nerfed should make it still viable, but it shouldnt be the BEST thing ever. i agree that counterplay mechanics are good, but trying not to die while someone else saves you is not counterplay. thats why i think haste is too strong, the counter play trends towards also having haste or just being significantly better than them. the one good consistent counterplay i can think of is a clerics protection or a protection potion so you can continue being aggressive in this instance. however that isnt really counterplay, its just extra health, and they have the same options + the haste. maybe you play with better melee frontlines then i do, but usually i hear "hasted barb" followed by a smacking noise, maybe two if im lucky, and then a death for my team. i dont want to be forced into a playstyle because its just the best, its not fun

[inland pelican]

To be fair, even D&D added exhaustion after haste, maybe a move speed and attack speed penalty for a quarter of the time the barb was hasted, but thats the biggest nerf I would make other then lowering spell count

[opal flicker]

that may be difficult to work around but is incredibly interesting.

either way, i think we can all agree one of the best stats in this game is speed, and haste is just free speed. its incredibly good in dungeons and dragons too, but it comes with that downside. speed now but slow later. maybe haste should last longer and then we get hit with the slowness, that way there is a reason to be outlasting the fury of blows instead of waiting for rescue, you are instead waiting for your turn with the advantaged state. a wild frenzy of attacks and block. but as it stands right now, its just a no duh take

[opal flicker]

that was the reasoning behind my first idea, like i said it should still be good, just not flawless

also an interesting idea

i think there is alot of play and potential here for how to get it in a good space inline with the other spells

my idea is likely not perfect in its conception, i aknowledge that, but i think its heading in the right direction

which im glad there is an attempt to explore at least

i think a quarter time is definitely much more fair that the entire duration like i said in my first suggestion

[spiral comet]

Adding a stat Calculation system that adds up all your buffs and additional equipment stats to tell you what your current stats are rather than base

[stuck perch]

Maybe the enemy wizard isn't wasting his time, but so is your team mate. They could be killing the barb, or going after the wizard. If the barb can't kill you because you're blocking his blows, then he's going to face a 2v1 after your friend kills the Wizard. Or maybe he switches targets to go after your friend and you can go back on the offense. If the barb is attacking you and failing for any reason, that's good for you and your team. Successfully blocking needs to provide more incentives for people to try especially vs players.

[barren orchid]

what if wizard and cleric had a flask 1 time use that restores 50% spells and was just merely quicker than meditating 🤔

[stuck perch]

Or we could leave haste as it is, and give other classes cool abilities or ways to counter cool abilities/spells like haste?

[opal flicker]

i would concede that if other classes had cooler abilities so that it did not feel like wizard was a requirement when fighting against another wizard that that would be a fine solution, though i believe incredibly difficult to achieve currently

[barren orchid]

how is wizard hard to deal with?

[opal flicker]

mana potions when 🤔 would definetly solve the whole meditation is also sudo required problem

[brisk oxide]

@pliant sleet In regards to #d-and-d-suggestions message, you understand that as it currently is, you can already only spectate your team...Until your entire team either dies or escapes.

[stuck perch]

Give Barb a skill that wrecks magic, like buffs and prot potions.

[barren orchid]

barb already has huge magic damage mitigation doesn't it?

[opal flicker]

reading back abit you will see we have been discussing how a non wizard comp feels fighting a wizard comp, and the extreme advantage the buffing potential of wizard gives in comparison to what other classes can offer to the table

mostly in the context of melee v melee

[spiral comet]

#d-and-d-suggestions message

Help make mimics not a waste of time ^ XD

[pliant sleet]

oh ty

[stuck perch]

Give Cleric and Wizard each their own Dispel magic that works slightly differently. Have Rogue caltrops remove haste and apply a major slow, also make it so that the caltrops have a decent zone. Give Fighter a skill that makes successfully blocking cause the attacker to be stunned for half a second, not affected by haste. Give the Ranger a pinning shot or bolas.

[barren orchid]

Wizard is versatile the rest of the cast apart from fighter or cleric aren't, they have specific niches which when you play those niches vs versatility such as fighter or wizard which then buffs others alleviating that niche thing such as barb being slow by giving them haste. It's a matter of design most likely mixed with Alphatest feelings

[opal flicker]

i feel that, killing a mimic is like "i killed a mimic and all i got is this crappy t-shirt" kinda moment

[stuck perch]

Fighter versatile? Not really, he's just bad at everything but stacking armor and being slow.

[spiral comet]

Fr

[barren orchid]

Fighter isn't bad

it's a jack of all trades it's not meant to excel at any one thing

[opal flicker]

incredible ideas, i applaud your creativity and makes for very good counterplay with all the classes, lovely, i could be down for this in place of my original suggestion

[barren orchid]

I would agree with a sort of caltrops for Rogue

[stuck perch]

Jack of all trades? How well does he buff? Heal? fight at a distance?

[barren orchid]

he can heal 50% he has a adrenline rush to increase his speed and can use any weapon in the game

the 50% heal is also instant

[stuck perch]

The 50 heal is not instant. It's over 12 seconds

[barren orchid]

the cast is instant

[stuck perch]

He also can't apply that heal to anyone but himself.

[barren orchid]

yea and wizard can apply stuff to others that's why fighting against a wizard feels shit.

like 2 alphatests ago it was cleric who was the issue now it's wizard, because both apply stuff to other players.

[opal flicker]

i quite enjoyed fighter last playtest, his versatility can be excellent. the ability to use a bow well and still be a menace in close quarters makes for a good pick, plus his good armor picks like the armet. very fun, never really fight against a fighter and feel wronged as any class

[barren orchid]

it's hard to adapt to a versatile character when you are playing a niche

when it can buff others

[stuck perch]

Fighter needs his stats re-adjusted, dump knowledge down to 5, put those points in strength, reduce resourcefulness to 10, and put those points into agi. Give him perks that support large weapon usage (although keep them different from what the barb gets).

[barren orchid]

it's not that it's unbalanced, it's more of it's not niche as others.

but those others excel at their niche

wizard can barely CQC and your range combat is telegraphed very hard if you are using fireball

or any spell really

[stuck perch]

I'm not saying wizard doesn't need buffs, they sure do, but they also need nerfs.

[barren orchid]

I think Nerf is the wrong word I believe a re-tweaking could suffice.

that would probably get people to not 👎 the suggestion

[opal flicker]

i dont mind a niche, niche's are fine, but niche's shouldnt be required. for instance, when i am fighting against a team with a ranger(ranged niche) and i dont have a ranger, i still feel like my team has great potential to win even without a ranger, i feel evenly matched. this is not the case with wizard, which is the cruz of the suggestion i raise. i also suggested some buffs as well to the wizard for more creative playstyles

[barren orchid]

I am kinda surprised that wizard doesn't have a button specifically for undead

[opal flicker]

i aint got nothing against wizards, i just want team comps to be flexible and fun for everyone

[stuck perch]

you mean cleric?

[opal flicker]

i think they are leaning really hard on dungeons and dragons and to my knowledge, i dont think wizard deals with undead with any subclass

definetly as cleric thing

[barren orchid]

cleric has their 100 damage undead nova thing, but I mean wizard like cast on undead and it inflicts a fear for 6-7 seconds

[opal flicker]

fear spell would be sick

[barren orchid]

it'd help noobs

[opal flicker]

would be a big fan

[stuck perch]

Wizard should have 10 agi, 30 Will, 17ish knowledge and around 10 resourcefulness.

[opal flicker]

also just those situations of like "we need to cross this room fast and there are alot of boys so fear spell"

[barren orchid]

so invis as a self cast only spell then give wizard fear spell it'd keep it's versatility while making it so that it doesn't seem AS unfair when someone can be made invisible like a barb(hypothetically) and one shot your teammate

[stuck perch]

I'm not a fan of pve only abilities. Things like the Barb warcry are fine, they're mostly pve but still affect pvp.

[opal flicker]

anyway, it has been quite an enjoyable discussion but, i gotta go. thank you for the civility and the open minds, have a great night guys

[barren orchid]

night

[spiral comet]

#d-and-d-suggestions message @stuck perch wtf take it away 😂

[stuck perch]

Invisibility doesn't make you silent, if players can't hear you coming or didn't protect themselves with traps or other counter measures, they deserve what's coming to them.

[stuck perch]

What?

[barren orchid]

you don't need to be silent just invisible for 3-4 seconds to close the gap or make it so a squad isn't stacked on the door or hall way so your teammates or yourself can flank.

[spiral comet]

u downvoted the mimic thing

[stuck perch]

Mimics have the same loot their chest would have dropped, I see no reason to change that.

[spiral comet]

they take abt5 mins to kill with practically no reward

maybe thats a subject for chest buffs tho

[stuck perch]

What? They take about 1 minute to kill with my starting weapon on most of my characters, faster on some.

[real trellis]

Do people actually like the Zweihander's right-click combo? Personally I think it's complete garbage, it swings from low to high so it's practically impossible to headshot with the first swing

[stuck perch]

You don't need to head shot with every swing, you could head shot with the first swing on the primary combo.

[real trellis]

Plus it's SUPER easy to dink the floor with it

[spice saffron]

I never play zweihänder ... they are way to "large" to be swung in most cases anyway.. and hit walls, floors, friends, stealthed rogues, gobling heads .. but not what I wanna hit.

[real trellis]

You don't need to head shot with every swing You do if you want to win a pvp encounter lol

[real trellis]

Right, which is what the alternate swing combo should fix, but it doesn't

[stuck perch]

Then use a more appropriate weapon to your situation.

Longswords are a better sword compared to the Zwei in most cases. The Zwei has better cleave but that's only when you're not in a cramped place.

[real trellis]

The problem with cleave is that it's very niche

It's nice when you're in a wide area with 3+ zombies slowly staggering after you but like

That's not a common scenario unless you're intentionally blundering into multiple spawns at once

I'd rather have a nice poke combo, y'know, like how Zweis were actually used

[autumn vale]

Plz extention

[spice saffron]

So many downvotes on my cleric perk .. seems I'm the only dude that plays with mates that are not able to block/evade any attack and need all heal spells within the first 3 minutes of a round xD hahah.

[real trellis]

I don't like the idea that some weapons are for pve and some are for pvp

which is why I want Zwei to have a better alt combo

[spiral comet]

well you do have 2 slots

[spice saffron]

tbh. I normally use the longsword.. at least for fighter.

[real trellis]

Longsword is nice

a bit fiddly to block with

[spice saffron]

Blocking is weird in this game anyway.. I prefer to use the S-key :D

and cursing any object, wall, door or whatever-else might block my way backwards :D

[languid lodge]

Remove traps. Overall unhealthy for the game and not really skill reliant. If you misstep into a shadow mid fight where somebody placed a trap 5 mins ago gg to you

[spice saffron]

thats exactly what traps are for, no? :/

For pure frustration and to increase your personal hate against rangers :D

[stuck perch]

Alright then, give the zwei a half-swording thrust at followed by a downward slash as a secondary. Funny enough if you're in a wide-ish space, the zwei isn't bad when being overwhelmed by players.

[spiral comet]

ranger will need a buff or equal ability counter barbs then

[languid lodge]

kind of i guess? But for the pace of the game theyre just an instant free kill and arent visible 90% of the time

[real trellis]

I'd say remove areas where you have to have a rogue disarm the traps to proceed, like the labyrinth

[stuck perch]

Rangers already counter barbs with their traps.

[granite plinth]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKZWZRpUtW4&ab_channel=SyracKuse

Check this out:

Cleric with longsword. Please. Deus vult

[spiral comet]

i dont think people realize how useless a ranger is rushed

[real trellis]

You know, the spot with like 3 floor traps in a hall with no way to jump around them

[spiral comet]

right he said to remove traps

[stuck perch]

You did know that you could disarm the traps right?

[languid lodge]

ah yes let me do that mid fight while its in a shadow therefore objectively invisible

[stuck perch]

Why are you charging down a trapped corridor with a ranger on the otherside?

[languid lodge]

It wasnt a trapped corridor

there was a trap in a dark corner

[stuck perch]

Ok, so why did you go in the dark corner?

[languid lodge]

in an otherwise very walkable in room

your logic is terrible sir

dont walk anywhere

[stuck perch]

Just look where you put your feet. If it's dark, throw some light in there. If you can't approach and there's a good chance he has a trap you can't avoid, consider using your throwing axes. or baiting him out.

Did you know the ranger can step in his own traps?

[languid lodge]

I cant bait him out if i get rng pushed to him by storm. And I cant just light every part of a room with torches while a ranger that can 3 tap me has LOS

[languid lodge]

yeah he also gets to know where he placed them

[stuck perch]

Just throw the torch where he's hiding.

[languid lodge]

and if he moves

[stuck perch]

Playing a ranger means being resourceful with your traps. They do shit damage with their bows anyways.

[languid lodge]

?????????????????

um what?

[stuck perch]

How many traps do you think he put down in the room?

[runic musk]

They are not as bad as they used to be, barbs is the new pain

[languid lodge]

165 hp barb with only blue and purp gear and I died from literally 2 headshots

[stuck perch]

Barbs are a class known for one shotting people, is it wrong that they can outplay you?

[languid lodge]

the point is that they are unhealthy in comparison to how the rest of the game is played

[granite plinth]

🤣 that is until you get one headshot and suddenly they start hurting

[languid lodge]

no barbs need a nerf and traps need removal

[stuck perch]

No they are very much healthy and appreciated, they're just the way to counter some of the other classes.

[granite plinth]

the way I see it, Rangers are your range supremacy option, you either force an enemy team to get out or pressure them.

[runic musk]

Also takes like a second to disarm you cant kill him in that second

[languid lodge]

it takes much longer and triple shot exists

[runic musk]

Then he thwacks you once with his staff and you are gonezo

[stuck perch]

Traps are easy to see and remove. I don't have trouble with them as a rogue and for a rogue, getting his foot stuck in a trap is much worse than a barb.

[languid lodge]

they are literally just not easy to see

[runic musk]

Also dont do it los

[languid lodge]

that is just false

[runic musk]

Need glasses huh?

[granite plinth]

traps still slow your team down if you want to push though so there's that, it sucks dealing with them tbh

[stuck perch]

I see them fine in the dark with my rogue, but on my other chars I make sure to fight rangers in well lit spots.

[languid lodge]

And if the storm pushes you to a dark room

im guessing still just dont walk there right?

[stuck perch]

I just jump over them, or disable them.

[runic musk]

Just walk around

Think and drink a pot and take a detour

[granite plinth]

Currently the meta right now for high roller is barbarian/cleric/wizard, just give barbarian steroids and he will wipe everyone out.

if he dies, cleric can take rez

[stuck perch]

You have torches for those dark rooms btw.

[languid lodge]

Again if I have to push a ranger in a dark room I cant just pull torches out mid fight to light the room

I get 2 shot if he hits me

[runic musk]

Barbarians need too be changed, playing full plate fighter and almost getting oneshot is such dogshit

[languid lodge]

agreed

[stuck perch]

As much as stepping in a trap sucks, seeing someone step in their trap they set to ambush you is quite rewarding.

[languid lodge]

felling axe and horseman axe need HUGE nerfs

[languid lodge]

half of people dont set them with any thought though

[runic musk]

Think its the spells tbf

[languid lodge]

they see a shadow and hope somebody steps 3 inches too far to their left

[stuck perch]

Then that's on them. Just like some people don't bother aiming with their spells.

[runic musk]

What is it like 75/70% pen + extra damage

No timer

[stuck perch]

If someone sets a trap and waits and you get caught in it, be assured a fair amount of thought or at least intuition went into setting the trap.

[languid lodge]

I am frankly not assured

[stuck perch]

You talk as if rangers put down dozens of traps every match in random places hoping someone will step in them.

[languid lodge]

all it takes is one random trap though

its completely rng that way and therefore unhealthy

[stuck perch]

If it's completely random it has something like 0.1% chance of catching someone.

[runic musk]

Idk i usually get creative, place two step in one people greed

Just when you see a ranger play slower

[stuck perch]

You either put one where you know someone will walk through like a doorway or hallway, or you put one where you will make someone walk through it.

[runic musk]

You hear them be placed from miles away aswell

[languid lodge]

the specific scenario im talking about i was getting pushed by storm

I didnt have an option

[runic musk]

So

[stuck perch]

You could have taken a different path through the darkness.

[languid lodge]

No i literally couldnt have

[runic musk]

Sometimes you run into two 3 mans

Remove other players

[languid lodge]

i wouldve had to walk like hundreds of feet and wouldve guaranteed died

[runic musk]

This is your logic right now

[stuck perch]

Why? Were you in a dead end?

[languid lodge]

the only path that led to circle was straight

[stuck perch]

I go through the darkness to avoid players all the time. If you're forced into a direction you should extra cautious. That generally means light.

[languid lodge]

other closest option would have been a huge backtrack

[runic musk]

I mean you legit just salty

Traps are great

I hatw stepping in them but they add tention

[languid lodge]

I think the way they work is unhealthy for the game

Tention?

[runic musk]

Yes

[stuck perch]

Then you had multiple options, you also made the strategic error of letting the darkness catch up to you. This removed some of the paths as viable options.

[runic musk]

Tension?

[languid lodge]

If you step in one you can literally just stand up and walk away from your computer

[runic musk]

Idk how to spell it

[runic musk]

Shields? Teammates with hands

[languid lodge]

getting stopped by a total of 11 people is strategic error

definitely

[stuck perch]

Or you can get your foot out while baiting shots.

[languid lodge]

YOU CANT MOVE?????

how could you bait out a shot

[stuck perch]

Duck, they'll be shooting for your head.

[languid lodge]

a triple shot to the body is guarantee kill though

[stuck perch]

Better to duck and take a chance of taking the shot to the chest instead of head.

[languid lodge]

why would they aim for head

[runic musk]

Its not

Played mainly ranger this time

[languid lodge]

If they have good enough gear it absolutely is

[stuck perch]

Well if the ranger happens to have purple gear, and you happen to be naked, and a whole lot of other excuses.

[runic musk]

If you have it isnt

[languid lodge]

I had purple gear

[runic musk]

🤷

[languid lodge]

he also had purple gear

[runic musk]

So

[stuck perch]

And you got your foot caught in his trap. Tis the way of life.

[runic musk]

Imagine you being a fish

This worm had a hook, im so mad right now

[languid lodge]

The whole argument was that its an unhealthy way of life

[runic musk]

I thrive on making those plays, you get trapped and shot without when knowing where i am

Strategic advantage

[stuck perch]

Traps are very healthy for rangers, I also enjoy having to play around them.

[languid lodge]

Most people do not

[stuck perch]

They also light up for me as a rogue so if I step in one it's really my fault.

[languid lodge]

yeah but the game isnt supossed to be rock paper scissors

rogue beats ranger just because has perfect counter

that is extremely unhealthy

[stuck perch]

It isn't rock paper scissors, if you caught the ranger he be dead.

[languid lodge]

the ranger was not possible to catch

[stuck perch]

No, rogues aren't the counter to rangers.

[runic musk]

You got outplayed

[languid lodge]

I just overall think that logic is bad but sure thing

[runic musk]

There are worse balance issues in the game atm

Traps are legit a low point in frustration

[languid lodge]

Overall I think the complete guarantee of a kill if you step in a trap is unhealthy for the game end of story

traps arent even a balance issue

theyre an existence issue

[runic musk]

Throwing axes guarantee a kill aswell since they essentially root you

[languid lodge]

Again I agree that barbs need nerfs as there isnt anything any other melee can do against them

but traps are equally as unhealthy just because of how they work

Yeah throwing axe spam is probably single handedly THE scummiset way to play the game

[runic musk]

You havent seen me play

[elfin night]

I see you haven't met the triple cleric squad

[languid lodge]

triple cleric sounds downright useless

[elfin night]

LMAO

[languid lodge]

as a barb I will walk at you and you will die

[elfin night]

You'll instantly die against 3 clerics

but go off

[languid lodge]

you physically couldnt explain that to me

because it wouldnt happen

[elfin night]

have you ever gotten hit by a judgement

just one

imagine 3

[runic musk]

Clerics are way too good aswell

[balmy kernel]

Other players bad, barb has one move which is walk forward and attack while everyone else except rogue and cleric has a counter to him

[elfin night]

cleric can just shield him wdym

[languid lodge]

agreed needs heavy nerfs to felling and horseman axe

[balmy kernel]

fighter players are the biggest shitters in the game. learn how to use your shield and block

[languid lodge]

this shield gets absolutely obliterated by sheer damage stats

[stuck perch]

Rogue's counter to the barb is run away!

[balmy kernel]

fighters out here bitching that they can't use their shit two handed weapons and out damage a barbarian

[languid lodge]

I can either jump or crouch at random intervals and shields become completely useless

[elfin night]

Use an epic heater and barrier and you can block everything a barb throws at you.. 1v1 cleric wins to barb 2:1

[runic musk]

????

[languid lodge]

Cause they cant... as a barb that shit is BROKEN

[balmy kernel]

thats the point you ape, your a fighter learn how to block you literal warrior

[languid lodge]

the blocking is inconsistant

[elfin night]

skill issue

[stuck perch]

I don't want to out damage a barb with my two hand, I just want perks that help me fight in the style I want.

[languid lodge]

and barbs have an ability that can break through it

[elfin night]

you mean passive

[wicked tree]

shields have already been confirmed to be bugged

[elfin night]

and it doesn't break through it

[elfin night]

in what way and source?

[languid lodge]

This is just false

[runic musk]

Hitboxs

[wicked tree]

they said in the last interview that they will be adjusting hitbox registration on it

[elfin night]

I'll always take a buff to blocks, but they need to nerf hurtbox shifting

shit is cancer to fight

[stuck perch]

What is that?

[wicked tree]

its where you can drag a hitbox

[elfin night]

look up while blocking and your head is completely impossible to hit

as well as your whole body shifts

[wicked tree]

its more a mordhau and chiv technique if i remember right

[stuck perch]

I do that all the time and I still get hit.

[elfin night]

if you're fighting someone you can just crouch and look up and hold up block and you'll always take leg hits

[languid lodge]

taking leg hits doesnt stop a barb from killing you though>

like what?

[elfin night]

huh? are you running with no strength and cloth gear?

[languid lodge]

It stops them from completely one shotting you

and no im the barb in the scenario

and I agree that the class I play is not balanced

[elfin night]

its fine solo tbh

its only op when you have wizard + cleric buffing you

[languid lodge]

frankly that is the entire reason I started playing it

not even true

[elfin night]

its kinda subjective, no?

[languid lodge]

I dont really think so?

[elfin night]

barb loses to rogues 1v1 like what lmao

[languid lodge]

they simply out stat all other melees

[stuck perch]

Any class is OP with a wizard + Cleric buffing you.

[runic musk]

No?

[languid lodge]

This is not true if you use horseman axe

[elfin night]

horseman axe a lil busted cant deny that

[languid lodge]

VERY

[runic musk]

Still a oneshot on rogues due to low hp pool

[elfin night]

that shit wins against everything

[languid lodge]

yes

[elfin night]

dont get hit

well

[languid lodge]

that is what you are actively arguing against

[elfin night]

except for horseman

[languid lodge]

???????????????

REAL HUMAN BEING ALERT

[runic musk]

They can swing and spin mouse

[elfin night]

skill issue ig

[stuck perch]

I don't usually have trouble killing barbs on my rogue, just bait and dodge away then strike and repeat.

[languid lodge]

brain matter issue tbh

[runic musk]

You just get hit in a 360 degree

[elfin night]

i've never seen that ngl sounds aids

chiv shit

[languid lodge]

this works if they are only using a felling axe

[runic musk]

It is

[languid lodge]

if they have horseman axe they win against every melee

[elfin night]

that is not false

[runic musk]

You can 180 swing

Game kinda needs too lock mouse in some swings

Dsrksouls ish

[elfin night]

I just want them to buff troll loot and nerf the cheese so its actually challenging and fun

[languid lodge]

lock to at most like 60degree movement in either direction

[elfin night]

sitting under a torch stabbing troll with basically no difficulty is cringe

[languid lodge]

dont just let them reinhardt tornado swing

[fallen falcon]

Think Barb is mainly an issue in group play personally, the one shot potential means you have to respect them at all times

The inconsistent blocking mechanics/ability to manipulate your active attack frames to an extent certainly doesn't help, but I chalk that up to alpha playtest bs

[balmy kernel]

good fighers who actually play these types of games, like mount and blade and chiv/mordshit are able to block well enough to kill me anytime i run up against them. most of you are just shit at the game and even shittier at blocking damage with shields and actually aiming them at the weapon hitboxes. Barbarian is the melee damage class, why are you running into a barbarians melee range to fight him, Every single class has range options to deal with him except for rogue and cleric.

[fallen falcon]

I've got a lot of time in most of those slasher games, and yes in a 1v1 I shit on most brain dead barbarians

[balmy kernel]

What makes barbarian strong in team fights, isn't being a barbarian, its the haste and cleric buffs he gets. Barb is very easy to deal with without the rest of the party supporting him.

[wicked tree]

honestly i find the quarter staff does wonders against barbs

it has a pretty solid hitbox

[fallen falcon]

It really isn't just those buffs, sure those help make him very potent

[balmy kernel]

get gud.

[fallen falcon]

But having 1 shot potential on everyone means that Barb gameplay is literally W key and left click

I assure you I'm probably much better than you at this game lmao

[balmy kernel]

Yes im sure you are as you cry about barbarian meleeing you

keep walking up to me in the dungeon so i can shove my axe in your face

[fallen falcon]

Not crying - pointing out a balancing issue

[languid lodge]

I am one of the 2 people who started this conversation and i completely agree that barbarian is broken

and that is from a POV

[balmy kernel]

Yeah and your shit at the game.

[languid lodge]

youre*

example sentence:You're shit at grammer

[balmy kernel]

you might want to try skyrim, thats more your speed

[fallen falcon]

He's not looking for discussion Tbf, let him spout his stuff

[languid lodge]

im literally saying that the class I play is OP lmao?

[fallen falcon]

No point engaging

[languid lodge]

this is true

he just likes being angry publicly

[fallen falcon]

But yeah, I don't necessarily want them to just flat nerf Barb - there needs to be a nuance

[languid lodge]

I think that specifically felling and horseman axe deserve a direct stat nerf

[stuck perch]

Some classes a strong in a straight forward way, others need tricks and cunning to make the most out of their abilities. I'd be fine if these classes stayed the same.

[languid lodge]

but other than that the class is just inherently going to be W key

[fallen falcon]

Bare in mind that blocking an overhead while someone is literally kissing your character requires you to look upwards and expose yourself to anyone else that might be fighting you

[languid lodge]

fully agree

[balmy kernel]

there is no nuance, its a class that has 2 moves, walk forward and throw axes. you either nerf his damage into the ground so hes not a real class and can't play the game because shitters keep crying about it. or you tell people to get good and learn how to play their classes instead of trying to engage barbarian in the fight he wants to be in.

[fallen falcon]

I'd be cool if Barb was the class that could run down ranged and force ranger/wizard/cleric to have a frontline

But they need to be stoppable by that frontline lmao

If I as a full plate fighter can't get into melee range with the Barb without fear of dying in a single hit, i.e, no room for mistakes

Personally I see that as an issue

[languid lodge]

yeah right now their frontline kinda just stops the ranged characters from being able to shoot the barb

[balmy kernel]

yeah i knew you were a shit and don't know how to block, you fighters are the worst players in the discord and the most vocal about everyone but your class

[jovial swan]

What's better? Physical Damage or Strength?

[languid lodge]

stop typing

pls

[jovial swan]

Like +3 Phys or +2 Str?

[languid lodge]

angry and negative for no reason

[delicate sentinel]

please fix main menu gpu using 80% while in main menu while ingame only using 20% what is it doing mining bitcoin? literally have i9 + 4080 + 32gb ram using more gpu in main menu then ingame

[fallen falcon]

If he knew how to read he'd see why blocking a Barb that's literally hanging off your foreskin can be an issue outside of a whiteroom 1v1

[vocal thicket]

m gonna be honest, its super easy to dodge the throwing axes since most people just autopilot and aim for the head. crouching and aiming a shield upward almost always works to avoid damage but that usually works just once before the opposing barb wises up

it does kinda boil down to how you deal with a barb

[fallen falcon]

I don't feel throwing axes are an issue but admittedly not faced against it enough

[languid lodge]

yeah part of the issue is their ability to take 15+ of them if theyre willing to trade for them

[balmy kernel]

Its literally just constant bad players complaining that the melee dps class who can only melee dps puts out too much melee dps when you get into melee with the melee dps

[languid lodge]

it is a suggestion-discussion channel

the people involved in the conversation were suggesting-discussing

[balmy kernel]

it sounds like the crybaby shitter tearjerk channel right now

[languid lodge]

you just shit talk

[summer path]

Ranger bows: is it normal that the damage cuts in half after being further than ~20 yards away? example, 40 dmg headshot point blank, 20 dmg headshot past 20 yards?

[languid lodge]

lol

[fallen falcon]

1 shots against the other tank class makes no sense, not sure how that's a defensible thing tbf

Wtf am I supposed to do against 2 barbs then? I can consistently 2v1 2 fighters

[balmy kernel]

Yeah they added damage falloff this test because ranger was dominating everyone last test

[fallen falcon]

Against 2 barbs if I don't play perfectly I lose

[summer path]

ok. I noticed it drops off like 1 dmg every yard away, then bam once you hit 20 yards its half

[vocal thicket]

lure a barb into another barb so they hit eachother 👍 then bring a backstab assassin and have him gank

works like a charm

[languid lodge]

I think barb is unhealthy in the way that against one in melee its not really your fight to win

its their fight to lose

[balmy kernel]

noooo why can't i just run a grug team of grugs against the barbarian, wtf i'm getting into melee team fights with the melee dps class and losing!!!

[robust coral]

As a barb feel like the best thing against them is speed I try to avoid blocking and attacking from behind if possible

[balmy kernel]

use your crossbow, hit the barb for half his health before he gets to you

[robust coral]

But they are Hella strong atm

[summer path]

barbs are strong, rogues are insane

[robust coral]

Just seen a video of a raouge 1 shoting a lobby 🤣

[languid lodge]

frankly as a barb player im pretty sure I have not been killed by a rogue a single time this playtest

[fallen falcon]

Again to make it 100% clear, I dominate Barbarians in 1v1s, because most I've fought try to W key me - my main issue is, from a skill perspective, the Barb has a much easier time - they're respected based solely on the class, before you even factor in skill

[summer path]

tonight we went 8/9 all 3 of us evaced, the one time we lost it was to a single rogue that ganked us 3 and we didnt hit him once

[fallen falcon]

It means in group play I become fodder for the barbs allies if I focus on him, or the other way round if I focus on them

[languid lodge]

I dont know how to word this without it just sounding like "skill issue"

[robust coral]

It's rare for me to die to rouge my biggest fear are rangers by the time I catch one about dead

[languid lodge]

but the rogue definitely couldve been hit

[fallen falcon]

Difference with Rangers for me is that you can literally just LoS them and dip - most won't try and chase you, and if they do you have them on the back foot - they also don't have a one shot lmao

[languid lodge]

rare scenario but I fully agree. trying to get to a ranged backline while enemy barb plays slow and just safeguards feels terrible to go against

[fallen falcon]

In comparison to if they had a fighter, definitely

[robust coral]

I half agree on my ranger with a windless bow and some dmg rings I can 1 shot a fighter and almost a barb

[languid lodge]

yeah I feel like against a fighter if I get to the backline Ill still have somewhat of a chance to turn on him whereas against a barb the back of my skull just kinda stops existing

[fallen falcon]

I've yet to see it happen to me, but fair, I was unaware

At least if they miss they're very open

[robust coral]

The downside is the time to reload

[languid lodge]

This is true but I have also been full 2 shot by ranger headshots

[fallen falcon]

Barb doesn't have that issue imo

2 shot gives you time to react at least

[languid lodge]

they do have the capability to if theyre EXTREMELY good but i dont really think that aspect is broken

[fallen falcon]

If Barb could only 2 shot at best? I'd be completely fine with that - easy game honestly

Sure, 1 shot the squishies

[robust coral]

I'd have no complaints with 2 shots on barb as long as we can still 1 tap Nota k classes

[fallen falcon]

^

[robust coral]

Non*

[fallen falcon]

I def am not advocating for them to ruin Barbarian - they're supposed to be that scary class that eats people in melee

But against the other melee class, there should be some skill and effort involved in getting those kills

I have to land 3 headshots at least with my longsword to kill

[robust coral]

I can agree with that a fighter should at least stand a a chance

[balmy kernel]

the skill is getting around the blocks, your bad at blocking thats the end of it. you want to dual the barbarian in straight up fights, thats the crux of fighters argument. pull out your crossbow and hit the barbarian for half of his health before you start fighting him. i've run into fighters that 2 shot me with falchions, your just bad at the game.

[fallen falcon]

I think a good way to put it is look at the effort differential - what does barb have to do to win the engagement vs fighter

[languid lodge]

you have just typed an extremely long version of git gud like 4 times now

[balmy kernel]

Yes.

[pliant bone]

bro is still typing lol

[fallen falcon]

I'll play ball tbf

[balmy kernel]

literally use your classes advantages instead of bitching about losing in straight melee

[fallen falcon]

If I block your felling axe, I have about half a second to mount any offense

[languid lodge]

again I am the barb in this scenario

im faster than your class

I do more damage than your class

and your block will likely just not work

[balmy kernel]

your fighting bad players.

[stuck perch]

Blocking should be more rewarding against most classes. At the moment you're better off just dodging.

[languid lodge]

I agree with everyone here that it is op

[fallen falcon]

This 100%

[robust coral]

Scariest barb isn't even the felling axe imo quarterstaff can still 2 shot and has speed

[languid lodge]

Look at high roller leaderboard please

[stuck perch]

You seem to think everything is OP.

[fallen falcon]

There is no punishment for hitting a shield

[languid lodge]

that guy plays against the bes players and just walks at them and they all die

[robust coral]

There should be a second or 2 of not being able to attack when successfully blocked

[fallen falcon]

At least longsword has the riposte

[fallen falcon]

It'd need to be tuned properly

But yes, I do think there should be some reward other than not dying for successfully blocking

[stuck perch]

I say 0.5 second stun, Not going to be super noticeable with slow weapons but will make a big difference against rogues and fast weapons.

[fallen falcon]

Yeah 100%, I don't want blocking to be an instant win button either

[stuck perch]

Maybe make it into a shield bash or something.

[fallen falcon]

Honestly instead of stun that's probably the way to go

A quick follow-up attack

Similar to longsword

[balmy kernel]

you don't want to to be an instant win but you just want it to be an instant win

[stuck perch]

Shield bash is just the reasoning for applying the stun. Could be shorter too, just need to stop the flurry of blows.

I'd also like perks to make blocking easier instead of just raising your defense when blocking. That's just banking on the block failing.

[fallen falcon]

Yeah, getting blocked should put you on the back foot - keeping initiative after being successfully defended against is silly

I'm happy for blocking to stay as something to be practiced that requires some finesse, but failing a block shouldn't be instant death

[balmy kernel]

yes it should be you shit fighter

[fallen falcon]

Tells me everything I need to know about you tbh

[languid lodge]

again all you do is shit talk

all of your shit talk is also just statistically wrong

more fighter players yet much higher barb results

[balmy kernel]

"I don't think i should be punished for failing to block an attack and stop myself from getting hit" " i also think that barbarian is broken and should be nerfed because i want to take hits and not die when i fail to block"

[stuck perch]

I'm also open to the barbarian reckless blow either having a chance to destroy or otherwise debilitating the shield. Right now it's a it's pretty underwhelming compared to the fear or rage.

[languid lodge]

including the 2 highest killing players currentyl

[storm creek]

this is why they set the trap there it wasnt random it was planned and you fell for it

[robust coral]

Just a heads up he probably wants you to keep responding I'd just ignore him

[fallen falcon]

Yeah for sure, it really doesn't bother me though haha

[languid lodge]

There was no falling for it. The scenario was completely and utterly uncounteraplayable. Hence claiming they are unhealthy for the game

[robust coral]

That would be amazing atm I would t use it doesn't feel worth

[fallen falcon]

I agree, give them some counterplay to shields too

If that has a visual indicator, then that's perfect

[storm creek]

"oh no I cornered myself but no its clearly the games fault" lol the answer was not getting into a situation where u had one place to go that was ur mistake accept it and move on

[fallen falcon]

Here's a hit I should be dodging instead of blocking

[languid lodge]

I think the shield counterplay mechanics are good but first they need their stats shutdown a bit

[languid lodge]

I will just choose where the circle moves next time. I apologize that my pathing was not god master psychic tier

[stuck perch]

While losing an item to a player like that might feel bad, it's not your weapon so it's not a total one-shot kill. It negates a class' advantage against the barbarian but at the expense of not taking fear or rage which the barbs seem to consider mandatory.

[fallen falcon]

Don't even have to lose it persay, just make it disable blocking for like 6 seconds

[robust coral]

Could also do it where barb needed the perk that let's them break doors to do so to shield if hit to much

[languid lodge]

I think this would definitely be interesting

it stops somebody from just blocking and doing nothing else

[twin delta]

shields don't need a stat nerf

[stuck perch]

How about we stop nerfing everything into the ground? It's important that every class and playstyle feels fun to play before balance even comes to mind. If you take away the toys because they're all OP then everyone is just going to suck and quit the game.

[twin delta]

they're only as strong as the skill of the wielder

[robust coral]

I. The shop there a repair tab they could use it for that repair shields and what not

[twin delta]

and you can still hit someone through their block if they don't drop their shield btw

[fallen falcon]

That's the point though, it is t to nerf things into the ground

[balmy kernel]

Don't tell these two that shields require skill, they are on their victim complex soap box crying about everything but their classes

[fallen falcon]

Also true, forgot about that!

[languid lodge]

im literally complaining about my class

what?

[twin delta]

if someone blocks their head then just hit their leg

dealing less damage is better than dealing no damage smh

[fallen falcon]

I mean feel free to tell me how fighter is overpowered and we can talk about it lmao

[twin delta]

damn, i had a suggestion and forgot it

wanted to workshop it before sending it in

[storm creek]

i really like where the rouge is at in the meta/vibe

[regal parrot]

We dont havegood options im otherthan fear or buff rage

[stuck perch]

The perk that breaks doors is a passive and massively popular, while it might make sense in-lore I think having that as a passive might be too much. The skill on the other hand is triggered by the player and can be dodged while it's active.

[twin delta]

oh right, trap master on ranger: make it to where you can recover bear traps that you disable

[regal parrot]

Single buff which lowers our armor by 55 btw, would be nice to add hitstun

On shield ofc

[stuck perch]

I like the HP buff myself, but fear kinda wins over it for pve.

[regal parrot]

Hp buff is passable but i cant say anything but the two big ones are choice

[storm creek]

i think that would be neat but they are pretty cheap so its not nessecery

[twin delta]

hp buff is subtly pretty alright. since your max HP is raised it means when the buff wears off any damage you took was effectively reduced

[regal parrot]

You have to rememberthe fear also lowers damage output in pvp

[twin delta]

traps aren't cheap?

[stuck perch]

HP buff might be better if you're teaming with another barb that has fear.

[twin delta]

they're like 24 gold each

[languid lodge]

I think he was saying you would need to have both the passive and the ability

since the passive is already so heavily used

[robust coral]

Fear also shows mimics

[regal parrot]

Yeah but thats just poor character management kindof to me

Id take 2 fears also

[stuck perch]

Not only that but it also buffs your entire party.

[twin delta]

fear for extended effect tbh

lets you clear out the mummy rooms without risk

[regal parrot]

It does buff your party. But fear lowers damage output in pvp by 25% also

Its kind of like

[twin delta]

only physical damage output

[regal parrot]

Eh

Mages i sleep

[twin delta]

ye, they put you to bed

[languid lodge]

LOL

[stuck perch]

I'm not saying buff is better than fear, just that I like it more.

[storm creek]

does poision and bleed count as physical or magical

[regal parrot]

Im not high enough elo or whatever to see good mages yet

[twin delta]

they count as status effects, so they bypass both

[robust coral]

Mages hurt in high roller

[regal parrot]

Yeah i bet

[languid lodge]

From what ive seen every mage is borderline naked or every 1/100 you see will be the physical embodiment of all magic.

[twin delta]

oh so i bought the blue torch cosmetic

[regal parrot]

You are completely right

[twin delta]

it actually drops your light level and range by a good amount

makes it legit good for sneaking around

[regal parrot]

But 99 outta 100 i smash them once lol

I may die to the 1 due to major skill issue thats true

[languid lodge]

the blue light shining through the walls which can oly be a player definitely does not help sneak

[twin delta]

but also it might be from sheer luck, but people are less likely to be hostile when i have the torch out. is there an association with it?

oh so that's the thing

the blue light doesn't actually come through walls?

[regal parrot]

Maybe people assume ur a big fish with cosmetics

[twin delta]

i put it around a corner and checked, and it doesn't go far enough to actually make it past the wall unless it's like, immediately against it

[regal parrot]

M

[twin delta]

and maybe

[languid lodge]

Its mainly from the game being buggy but a lot of the time the light just kind of goes way farther

[twin delta]

but running around in goblin cave and supporting peeps so they are less likely to die in it has been fun

[languid lodge]

Ive seen somebodys blue torch light from like 3 rooms away

[regal parrot]

Everyone so peaceful in goblin cave..

[twin delta]

huh, weird

[languid lodge]

I have a friend who just trains goblins and runs them into players

[twin delta]

goblin cave is pretty rough for most peeps, and classes

[languid lodge]

he does not play in any other way

[twin delta]

it's like, strangely better to be a cleric in goblin cave than most?

[regal parrot]

I kind of do this

[robust coral]

The goblin caves are nice for late night looting gjust teabag and no one attacks you

[regal parrot]

Its more effective than fighting them

[twin delta]

well 'cept tryhards who get pvp'd out of the main dungeon

[languid lodge]

yeah its pretty funny to watch too

even from the victims perspective

[regal parrot]

Yeah

[twin delta]

it is

[regal parrot]

Trains of 20 guys

[twin delta]

also it's real good training

did manage to actually kill a train a player sent at me

[regal parrot]

John wick..

[languid lodge]

its pretty much full counterable by like a single molotov/oil lantern

[twin delta]

'cause they caught me putting on divine smite and that makes each goblin die in two bonks, one if they friendly fire on cleave

[languid lodge]

you can pretty much kill avery goblin on the floor at once as a mage with fireball

[twin delta]

legit, mollies are on hand just so i have a ranged option as cleric

[languid lodge]

respectable

[twin delta]

also the fire just kills mages if you let them cook a spell

it's real funny

[languid lodge]

I think the main issue is how their abilities can scale with the stats they give

I think additional magic damage in items need to be lowered and the base stats of spells need to be raised

I think the class is jjust terrible if youre poor rn or amazing if youre rich

[twin delta]

eh, it's real good if you're naked and at lv 10

it's okay at lv5

'cause the synergy from traits is just pretty much universally strong

[languid lodge]

I feel like a green armor or higher barb just obliterates you

[twin delta]

surprisingly not that common to find tbh

[languid lodge]

you cant really kill him

base fireball deals 10 damage on explosion

with item stats you can more than triple that number

[twin delta]

that's 10 splash damage

direct damage is 30

if you hit the head it'll be 45+10

[languid lodge]

did they buff direct and nerf the splash?

I thought they just nerfed splash

[twin delta]

they nerfed splash, but the direct seems to be dealing more damage

[languid lodge]

unless im just remembering numbers wrong

[twin delta]

like full on, center projectile

[languid lodge]

i just checked and youre right

i thought it was 20 prejectile and they nerfed splash to 10

[quiet gorge]

Slowmode +4h haha i cannot suggest more

But if you can, and agree please / or smth similar for faster start ❤️ :

.suggest [Ready button for everyone in party. Game starts when everyone is ready]

[twin delta]

that's already a thing

oh you mean making it to where the host doesn't have to wait for others to ready

[languid lodge]

also what i was saying about this is just that the math ends up working out weird

since all buffs are flat damage the splash can easily be tripled and more

where as any other attack in the game (except maybe daggers) cant even double

so inherently they scale much harder with items than other classes

[ember oracle]

how would you guys feel about cleric if his resurrections spell healed all the player hearts he had on him since it is such a high cost spell and if not that what about a prayer mechanic similar to meditation were the cleric gets on his knees and prays to get charges of healing spells

[languid lodge]

I dont really think the devs want infinite healing spells

right now seems like it would just completely ruin the already only small difficulty of most PvE

[languid lodge]

rogue ends up having same problem but not as severe

[peak garden]

@balmy kernel @open monolith why should cosmetics not be kept by people of playtest ?? I'd like to understand your dislikes

#d-and-d-suggestions message

[balmy kernel]

Its an alpha, it makes sense when it releases in early access. it took you 4 days to grind those. thats literally no time at all

[peak garden]

4 days is like 30hours + of playing and winning, that's not that little of a deal

[balmy kernel]

lmao

[peak garden]

It's hard for anyone with a job

[balmy kernel]

yeah i don't care about wageslaves crying and ruining things for gamers anymore.

[peak garden]

You're that kind of guy

itsok

i understand now

no need to go further

[ember oracle]

the wageslaves are the ones who pay the people who make your games

[balmy kernel]

Yeah i am, back to your 9-5 to cry about how you have no time while you make your boss wealthy wagie

[wicked plume]

Just tried Goblin Caves since they upped the cap from 9 to 11 and was dead before loading in. Not sure if there's a bug in a spawn location but upon loading in I was already being looted.

[peak garden]

weird

[languid lodge]

When working in a small family business this consequence does not exist

[balmy kernel]

i don't care "but my wageslavery bro" is not an argument for why you should have things

[languid lodge]

oh wait youre that far down that rabbit hole?

damn gg to you

[peak garden]

It's not only for people who work, playing this much a day is not gaming it's just unhealthy

touch grass

[balmy kernel]

cope zoomer, back to your dead end life

[peak garden]

your toxicity is way beyond average and your ego seems off the roof

[languid lodge]

this implies that playing video games all day is peak life possibility

[ember oracle]

you cant reason with these kind of people @balmy kernel

[balmy kernel]

I'm aware, anyone who says the word toxic seriously is not to be considered human

[peak garden]

exactly

[ember oracle]

you are being toxic

[balmy kernel]

Yes, thank you npc man

[peak garden]

take a deep breath, clean your room, shower, go for a run, you'll be fine

[languid lodge]

im very confused by the wording of this message and the messages following it. Who do you agree with?

[balmy kernel]

take a deep breath and get in your car, its almost time for another day of menial labor

[twin delta]

i got it: cleric recovers some spells when using a shrine

or altar

[languid lodge]

OH THIS

hyper good suggestion

[ember oracle]

people can think differently then you and some people need to work jobs to survive and pay bliss or support people calling then wageslaves or dumb because they are doing what they can or what they know how to do is not a "cool" thing to do

[languid lodge]

cause it also works for lore

[twin delta]

like it's so damn fitting

you could make it a perk