suggestion-discussion

[quiet reef]

fix rolls, loot, crafting
right now we spend more time buying/trade post gambling items then playing

[hollow valley]

Honestly you can kill an unskilled ranger as a barb with just the hatchets hell you could melee kill an unskilled ranger as a wizard xD

[pallid tusk]

i think adding a random roll stat to lower arrow damage would be cool(like on helmets but other gear. If your bane is rangers you can build for it

[prisma lynx]

That's true. Often though because of ranger speed fighter for example not having speed like barb can get into a rangers face, but the ranger can just backpeddle draw or put their bow away walk redraw shoot repeat and you can basically never hit them if they are somewhat careful

And they just do wizards job better than wizards

[hollow valley]

Well that begs the question of is it that the class is balanced or are you just skilled at the game to where you can mitigate the disadvantage? when you are making the argument of balance you can't take personal experience in to play but rather the majority experience which so far to my knowledge the ranger just seems to be stronger in damage and mobility which seem to be the two key factors in PVP so far

[green swift]

I feel a lot of weapons lose viability withouta secondary action, such as halbred right click, or battle axe, horizontal sweep. The war maul, mace, and double axe feel very predictable. are there any plans or mentions of giving all weapons alternate swings? I'd love more viability on other weapons.

[hollow valley]

exactly there needs to be a sort of RPS for some of the class dynamics because as it stands atm ranger just does what other classes do but better and they have a 3use heal that is instant health and not a HoT plus the ability to track footsteps means you cant really reposition to flank them since they can see the path you took

[prisma lynx]

They also have instant death traps, can instant reload with triple shot

And can use a spear

[hollow valley]

the best way I can put it is most classes have some RPS aspect to them but ranger is just gun in most situations

Look at it this way if you took two equally skilled players and 1 played ranger and the other played pretty much any other class the ranger would win I'd say 7/10 times just purely off base kit and weaponry obviously there are a lot of variables such as weapons and armor equipped but the Ranger has too much going for it that make it so ridiculously strong against every other class

[pallid tusk]

^ i mean it should show that the easiest hell run is one with 3 archers

[idle vigil]

look boss kills its only rangers doing them

[pallid tusk]

i mean i would just make arrows do less damage to armor. Pretty simple all and all

[hollow valley]

Hell the main counter to ranged classes is typically to get in melee range but with how loud footsteps are the ranger ability to track footprints that is nearly impossible. My personal opinion is that the triple shot should stay as is BUT the shots do less damage like 50-75% less damage, the DPS is still higher than just shooting 3 times but its not just straight up tripled OR raise the maximum health of melee classes to counteract the rangers damage but that will raise the issue of health pools being too large for other classes to even stand toe to toe against melee classes as they could just become ridiculous punching bags

[idle vigil]

They did it hasnt changed anything they still outperform by far

[hollow valley]

the issue there is you have to keep in mind the size of the dev team and how much coding will have to go into making that happen as it could cause issues of the game incorrecting registering hits if its trying to register the armor type being hit

but thats the issue is because of how strong their range is you cant get into that melee range to effectively threaten them. their ranged damage needs to be lowered to allow counterplay by melee characters. You shouldn't be able to use one skill to one shot a fighter/barb before they are able to reach you

[idle vigil]

Make longbows only useable by perk requirement

[hollow valley]

either that or make longbows have a longer notching time

[sacred wadi]

roadmap? I know 128 people have already asked this question but i wanna be 129 to further its value to the community.

[dark pebble]

Gonna need this in VR please.

[hollow valley]

I agree with this whole heartedly it definitely feels like the game currently is just kill them faster than they can kill you which is a very dangerous meta since it leans heavily into only 2 characters and really limits the intention and potential of playing anything remotely tanky

[fervent glade]

Love how these devs have yet to fix the bug for spell menu not going away.. makes it unable to play the fking cleric

[elfin charm]

Hey just my opinion but the floor traps in the maze area seem almost impossible to pass without taking death dealing damage, maybe have a little bit you can slip past with map knowledge instead of it being guaranteed damage?

[drifting summit]

ADD MORE VOICE CHANNELS

[native flax]

you have to play rogue to get through there

[outer gust]

@zealous blade read the announcements lmfao

[warped quarry]

shields not counting towards armor/phys reduction

[zealous blade]

Just i check it out. Thanks

[karmic arrow]

add more freaking voice channels

[bitter stratus]

Just hit the same key you use to open the spell menu again. Tapping it closes the menu instantly.

[crude flame]

I cant make a suggestion in the actual thing for some reason so Ill ask it here: how would you guys feel if attacks with weapons were actually controllable? Every weapon would have a moveset (falchion: left, right, and overhead) and directional inputs may be the way to control these.

for example, a certain button input would allow you to do the one stabbing motion with the sword instead of having to go through the 3 hit cycle to get to it. the falchion, you could keep doing overheads without having to swing side to side. the longsword, you could keep doing the poke so it doesnt keep hitting walls every second attack. Thoughts?

[proven geyser]

I think the rigidity of the current swing system adds to the feeling of uniqueness between weapons. If I could swing overhead with everything then certain weapons might just be totally usurped in usage.

[desert crown]

1 ranger limit per team and fighter should not be allowed to use bows anymore.

[grand tangle]

Can we get a cast + weapon combo on the cleric or simply allow them to cast with their weapon out ?

Normally clerics who are divine casters don't need a casting implement other than their focus which is usually a talisman or the weapon that is a symbol of their god.

Not sure this would be an honest balance problem

[crude flame]

well it really doesn't feel all that well when I have a sword thats meant to be used close quarters but the animations refrain me from doing that because it keeps colliding with everything.

[proven geyser]

Which sword is colliding with everything? Falchion does significantly more damage than arming sword but has a wider sweep, arming swords & hunting axes make for great close quarters while falchion has huge sweeps but is usually a two headshot kill.

[grand tangle]

Some weapons have straight up doodoo movesets. The maul being perhaps the absolute worst weapon in the game . It always opens up swing in the direction of enemy shield position . It has no overhead or any alternate swing.

The great swords moveset is also very janky specially in any hallway

[outer gust]

its a zweihander

[proven geyser]

Zweihander historically was like a crowd control weapon, prob not ideal for fighting people in a hallway. If you want a melee dueling game this just isn’t it. But having played wizard fighter and ranger I’ve been both the giver and receiver of smack downs. It’s just a matter of location and how you start the fight.

[grand tangle]

Which is actually a fairly agile weapon with whole training manuals dedicated to it's use in close confines ?

I understand the one Input being the side swipe, where you swing it like a baseball bat . But the secondary swing animation starting with a wide underhand swipe that collides with everything before you get access to the narrow overhead is a... Questionable decision

[crude flame]

I was actually using a normal arming sword. but what happened is because it has an arch from the top right, it would keep hitting the doorway while a cleric just overheaded me over and over again because he had just enough clearance for it to not hit anything. Couldve been bad luck too, but it felt awful when it happened

[grand tangle]

Those are not standard sizes for zweihanders . They were mostly in the 5 foot range . The largest examples were extremely heavy parade decorations much like those gold armor suits you see.

The only zweihander I can think of that was 7 feet long and was actually used was the Grutte Pier sword who was used by Grutte Pier who was said to be at least 7 feet tall.

So yes if Shaq was swinging one then it would be that size. But considering our barbarian isn't of great height and doesn't even looks like he works out, this is not what's in game

[young crag]

Put a trade suggestion up regarding making the trade channels Grade based, Legendary/epic/rare/green channels, would make it a lot more efficient to find what your actually trying to buy/sell. Half the channels don’t even get used anyways and most people sit in the first weapon channel and post literally everything.

[outer gust]

zweihander has horrible collision problems in this game, especially in tight hallways. longsword or spear are better if you can aim

[prisma lynx]

It would be cool if you could choose strike angles with weapons sort of like mordhau or shiv. But the problem would be that would make some weapons much stronger than others, so I wouldn't know off the top of my head how to find a good inbetween

[grand tangle]

The solution would be having better animation sets . Not hiding good moves in the middle of "combos" would be a nice one at least

[outer gust]

it'd be hard to implement Chiv style weapons in a game like this but it would be interesting

[tardy smelt]

shilling a suggestion: barb should have access to Longsword, even if it's just behind a perk. It's sily to have zweihander and no longsword.
#d-and-d-suggestions message
I just got done with 4 zwei runs, and while the alt attack is fun, I think the longsword would make up for much of the issues barbs are having with zwei.

[prisma lynx]

I think barb should be able to use all 2h weapons I think it is odd for a barb to not have halberd atleast
Not bows or crossbows ofc unless they are just wacking you with it

Exactly that would be amazing ⏬

[grand tangle]

Barbarian running at you whacking you with a wizard staff. He doesn't know what it is, but stick stronk !

[random tree]

Make it so the whole party can leave at the same time instead of one by one

[prisma lynx]

@astral zodiac
Fireball is not even their strongest spell, and wizards are in a totally good spot for what they do I think

@narrow reef
If you are having trouble finding blue portals make sure your are near the center of the circle. If you are waiting on the edge the whole game that is why you are not finding them. If you make your way towards the center you will find them.

[vivid glacier]

why so much people are against a solo only mode ?

[grand tangle]

It's not about not finding portals . It's unintuitive to not have your party be able to leave together .

Feels really shitty to find 2 portals when you're loaded and have to tell your third party member

"Well that's between you and God now" specially if you get into a skirmish in the last room which takes time and you end up with portals outside the circle

[prisma lynx]

Solo v group is part of the experience. You have to hide or strategies to win as solo. And as a group it is fun to feel the power of being in a group. Once you add solo mode you take all of that fun away

It doesn't... But it does...⏬

[vivid glacier]

i get that but solo only does not mean that every solo will go in solo only

[narrow reef]

Yeah this mainly. Portal spawns are less of a problem then just not getting enough for your squad.

[vital mason]

Making teams leave at different times or split or for portals make it a little more fair for solo players. As a trio you just have to have and guard one portal until the rest pop up

[austere crow]

Make a colour blind mode, i cant see difference between elite and normal skeletons

[prisma lynx]

I never usually have this issue. I find it part of the fun to secure the circle until three portals are around. But I can see why that is frustrating and sometimes it is, but there are ways to strategies around how and when portals spawn

[random tree]

but having people not be able to get out at the same time will kill the playerbase. I personally love the idea of this game but would rather play Tarkov or Marauders where I can get out with my party at the same time. The ENTIRE match does not matter if you cant get out with your loot. Youll find a nice shiny thing and think, ill never get out with this and the game loses all its fun

[hollow spindle]

every time me and my team find my self in that situation, we leave the area and search for another portal. usually find one very fast if its a normal game.

[grand tangle]

It's an unintuitive mechanic . That encourages dunking on solos anyways . If you try to solo extract but we are camping 2 portals .

Hell we've watched people at the end of the match just not have portals at all and be forced to go red and gamble or abandon someone

[hollow spindle]

I would suggest buying bandaids and potions before going in to a match. you can survive a long time in the dark. have plenty of time to find another portal.

[high widget]

I play 3 man and I prefer to abandon one guy - makes the game more interesting. That's my €0.02 tho.

[buoyant maple]

Someone please explain to me what's so incredible about the maze being the middle of the map. I wouldn't mind it being part of the game, just not the place the circle closes in on 75% of the time.

[prisma lynx]

I think it is cool sometimes you are forced to go red. If there is no danger or risk then the game isn't as rewarding to play

You gotta think on your feet and survive against the odds

[grand tangle]

Bud we've played the game , when the final circle close it kills . Doesn't matter how much bandages or potions you got .

There are times when there are no portals left in the center even if you're the only team left .

[hollow spindle]

i wouldnt wait until the dark is completely closed to find a portal. you have i think when the second circle closes on you to find a portal. use your memory to remember where they are and head back when needed.

[high widget]

I'm okay with the maze being the middle of the map - but I hate that there's those 4 spike traps where you basically have to go "ah fuck" and hope you only get hit by one or side-damaged after throwing torches on them. It's whack man.

[foggy otter]

dislike the fact that some paths in the maze cant be accessed without entirely leaving the maze and going around the map which is a death sentence especially when the zone comes in

[buoyant maple]

I'm not saying having to SOMETIMES go into level 2 is a problem. What I'm saying is that the maze is fucking annoying and can screw you out of being able to escape through no fault of your own. It's not "thinking on your feet" when you just can't live because the game said so.

[bitter stratus]

Gotta plan ahead. If you think the zone is going to go to the maze, make sure you're ready to enter it in one of the safer sides.

Also maps change every playtest guys. Theres no telling if the maze segment will be centrally located by next playtest.

[dark pebble]

You'll get a feel for it and not take that route when you know what the impending circle time looks like

[foggy otter]

but then i cant get any loot because of the zone and clear times especially solo

[cinder fern]

thats one the downside of being solo

[winged mural]

looks like my extend the playtest suggestion worked! WHEEEEEEE (jokes)

[dark pebble]

This is a game with a lot variables to take into consideration when playing solo or in a group, sometimes you win, most times you lose, just enjoy the ride haha

[random tree]

its hard to enjoy when you feel like your time is being wasted making no progress

[granite plinth]

discussing

[dark pebble]

I feel you there, I lost 100% of my first several matches as a cleric solo, once I got to level 5 and 10 I had two more perk slots to equip and became a bit well rounded for PVE and self heal, from that point it was all strategy and luck, Ive escaped because two teams were distracted by each other and I made it out, thats the kind of risk/reward that makes it wildly fun in my eyes

[prisma lynx]

I love queueing with a mage. Pop a prot potion, haste, rage. Slam door, put away weapon and rush enemy team at the speed of light

[glad depot]

Interesting thought on wizard, same should be applied to clerics and any other spell caster added to the game in the future. #d-and-d-suggestions message

[kindred root]

why cant i make my own voice channel?

[crude saddle]

You aren't a mod

[buoyant maple]

I'm in shock with the obsession with the maze remaining the mid. Literally any other room would serve better. Getting screwed out of a victory because you simply are not allowed to go to a portal because of the map design isn't fun or fair.

[vernal basalt]

wish they'd fix the hitbox on the fireball shit has a 20m radius that gets caught on everything

[bitter stratus]

Its a dungeon designed to kill you. Its not supposed to be fair and thats where the fun comes into it. The chance of failure or death is part of the experience and you are rewarded for understanding how the zone mechanic works and planning and acting accordingly to try and stay close to where the portals spawn.

Its literally one room in one map thats already unlikely to stay as is because the maps have changed every playtest. Theres no 'obsession' here from anyone, we've just come to accept that its a hard part of the map and thats fine.

[fair plover]

I'm sure it's been brought up before but I kinda wish my stash was accessible across all my characters

[sleek terrace]

agreed, we walk through the maze and actually use it to corner people into fights. there's a minimap and can easily path the way out. it's not the best room but it's still fun and have had some good fights and funny moments in said maze too so.

[foggy otter]

unfair doesnt make something fun also you can plan around the zone and clear all the rooms you want but if the zone comes in and it randomly spawns in a section of the maze that requires you walk around the entire map its very annoying as you cant plan or work around it because you dont know where a portals going to spawn until it spawns

[buoyant maple]

Can we please stop confusing "hard" for "unfair"? I fucking love that this game is hard, and I like hard games in general. Not being able to access a portal because it spawned on the side of the maze you're just not allowed to go to isn't "hard". I don't immediately rush to where I think the zone is closing because I want to PvP and loot.

[bitter stratus]

You are allowed to go wherever you want. If you want to go to a side of the maze, take the route thatll get you there. You not WANTING to go around to get to that side is a different matter entirely.

You can pvp and loot just as much if you go to where the zone is closing exactly because everyone else is doing the same. Most of the 3v3 fights I encounter are in the final 2 circles by groups who are heading to where portals go.

There are plenty of times when portals spawn on higher or lower tunnels that I dont have instant access to and have to dip into the circle or go the long way round to get to because im on the wrong level or in the wrong room. Is that unfair? no, its a minor obstacle created from how the dungeon is made. Being cut off from escape portals ENTIRELY is such a rarity Ive only had it happen to me once in 3 playtests.

[dark pebble]

Yea prob not intentional, simply the result of applying a 2D circular zone across a 3D landscape. Since the map is relative, this could easily be worked out in future design plans or left alone and be a symptom of the game mechanic

[foggy otter]

its picking a side having the zone close in and then your portal spawns in the other side of the maze and the entire area around the maze is now in the zone in this scenario its literally almost impossible to get to the other side because you now have to clear your way through multiple rooms in the zone while the timers going down

[dark pebble]

It sounds like you're ignoring the red portal next to you

[lament valve]

SUGGESTION When you sell items, the gold goes into your stash instead of your inventory. (You don't queue with gold in your inventory on accident)

[foggy otter]

except theres no red portals either? they are also on the other side of the maze

[buoyant maple]

I'd be fine with going to the other side of the maze if I didn't have to do a marathon through the zone to get there. And yes, there's been PLENTY of times I've been entirely screwed out of being allowed to reach a portal, red or blue, because I'm on the wrong side of the maze at the end of the match. Lucky you, I guess.

[bitter stratus]

The maze isnt even that large or hard to navigate. if you go at it from the left or ride side you can be on the opposite side in under a minute if you pick the northern doors on either side. If you go for the southern door, you go thru the gauntlet of traps.

Learn the map layout and play around it.

[signal lodge]

I'm surprised people are having trouble finding portals because when I stay until the end and go to the center there will be 4-6 blue portals. Even out of the center i typically find 1-3 blue ones. They have def upped the blue portal spawns so hopefully some of y'all will run into em more. I will say, the maze part of the map f'ed me for a long time, among other things...

[distant ledge]

For people saying there's no value in a solo only mode, there are squad focused games where you can opt to VS squads as solo for a challenge, OR you can play vs other solos only. They would be different and interesting experiences. I don't really see one affecting the other.

[hidden rampart]

ooooh be careful with that topic, you're gonna trigger a lot of people

[foggy otter]

It's not the maze being hard to navigate it's the fact the maze has 2 halves that are completely disconnected with each other and you have to leave the maze room entirely and go through separate rooms. It would be such a simple fix too you'd just have to add 1 extra path in the maze to connect these 2 halves because when the zone closes on the maze and and your portal spawns on the opposite side its 1 minute to clear and maybe 2 because of travel time to get to your portal but a lot of the time means the final zones gonna close in and kill you.

[distant ledge]

Idgaf. It's just a logical truth. As long as the game doesn't have a dumpster average player base it affects nothing. Personally I like playing solo vs squads and do it in other games that allow it. That doesn't mean I don't support the potential for a competitive solo mode.

[hidden rampart]

Any moment now the terminally online video game experts will be here to set you straight

[bitter stratus]

Again, thats literally not true. Please go look at the map that was posted. You can reach either half of the maze easily in little time if you know where you're going. If youre that low on time youre either fighting when you shouldnt be or looting when you shouldnt be or you arent close enough to the zone anyway for it to matter.

[past oyster]

Solo mode would take away from playing solo in the duo/trio mode as you would find less solo players to fight, interact or ally with.

For me, playing solo and sneaking around/stabbing people in the dark is a huge source of entertainment. So is being a healer-for-hire. Dividing that playerbase just makes it even harder for solo players to enjoy the things that are already difficult.

[foggy otter]

where is this image of the maze? i wanna see the layout

[distant ledge]

It doesn't create a true division. If the game has a high average playerbase it affects no one. Matchmaking takes care of all that. There are simply players that would like to play solo but won't ever play solo vs teams, just a fact.

[bitter stratus]

#development message

[buoyant maple]

Literally if they just connected the two halves I'd be fine with it. Make the maze an actual maze instead of two separate series of narrow hallways you have to do a marathon around if you realize you're not on the right side.

[outer gust]

i love the maze. it's so good

[dark pebble]

Yeah I can totally see your side and why that's annoying, I think a lot of folks (myself included) have a different tolerance for that kind of thing. You're not wrong to feel that way though and like I said earlier it may be addressed in future design or left alone as a symptom of the mechanic

[cyan jasper]

just crouch

[foggy otter]

i just looked at the image of the maze it literally has 2 disconnected halves that require you to leave the maze entirely and clear a separate room

[past oyster]

If the game has a high enough playerbase to support both modes and matchmaking is set up in a way that doesn't hinder solo play in a mode with teams, I don't see the harm. I think I prefer the diversity there is now and am mostly just worried that adding in different modes would harm it if not done with care.

[wise trellis]

man i wanna be able turn silver coins into gold faster

[bitter stratus]

You dont have to 'clear' anything. You can dip into the two side rooms in less than 10 seconds and be back in the maze. The distance is not as far as it looks.

This discussion isnt really going anywhere at this point and neither of us are going to convince the other.

[foggy otter]

no my points been proven 100% youve just agreed you have to leave the maze to get to the other half and your dip in the side rooms only applies if you take the left side the right side is 100% death though

[distant ledge]

As long as the game is well maintained and doesn't lose players it shouldn't ever be an issue. They would have completely different metas which would be interesting.

[bitter stratus]

Theres literally nothing wrong with leaving the maze to access another part of it was my initial point. Theres nothing unfair about having to travel through parts of the maze to access another point nearby thats cut off from you by the dungeon. Its not as if its spawning portals in a locked room that only someone with lockpicks can open.

I dont know why youre acting like the right side is somehow an instant kill zone

[foggy otter]

the right side is because it will literally take too long clear to get the other side if the zones coming in so your forced to take the left route where you can evade the mobs and its not travelling through parts of the maze its leaving the maze entirely

[bitter stratus]

Leaving the maze, much like travelling through it, isn't that big of a deal and doesn't take that much time. I genuinely cannot express this to you in any other way and at this point Im struggling not to just tell you this sounds like an issue of skill and map knowledge. I run 3 man parties all the time and we've never had an issue navigating thru, out of or back into the maze. Its just not that big of a deal.

Take the first blue you see on the way to the maze is my only advice at this point. Maze is fine.

[simple zenith]

Quick question, why do people want the game to not be free after launch?

[lusty wren]

Because it incentivizes devs to create scummy mechanics to generate cash flow. Also it creates a barrier to entry for cheating (Obviously this does not solve that problem but hey gatekeeping of cheaters is good)

[tidal musk]

dev team is small and funding for a game thats already as good as it is brings endless possibilities.

[simple zenith]

Cosmetics are already a mecanic to generate cash that doesn't influence the game

[nimble mantle]

they deserve my money at this point.

[lusty wren]

Yeah, so is paid DLC which does not have the inherent incentive of creating scummy mechanics to generate cash flow like F2P does

[tidal musk]

its either free to play with a bunch of micro transactions or we pay for it. they need to make money somehow.

[lusty wren]

I would much prefer they choose a cash flow that is pro consumer (F2P is very predatory and anti consumer)

They can make plenty of money just by being buy to play with paid expansions. Or paid DLCs on a smaller scale

[simple zenith]

At this point they would do like Blizzard does with WOW. But the first option îs more reasonable but also would stop the income when the game stops having new players like în the start (like the first OW)

[lusty wren]

Wow you can skip the entire game directly with cash.... no thanks

Also paid expansions and or DLC at a smaller scale solves this as long as you keep it a good game.

[livid scaffold]

F2P would ruin this game. $40 would be a good price point for this game if they add more content; maps, items, etc. But a combat system like Mordhau or Chivalry would send it for me, personally.

[desert bloom]

Yea, up front cost and then, possibly, payable cosmetics

[nimble mantle]

I am honestly going to buy a digital deluxe addition of this game if they have one.

[lusty wren]

F2P can be kept in the back pocket if the game does start to hemorrhage players you have a secondary launch as F2P to draw hype and see if you can save a game.

But if you create a good enough game Buy to play is the right option.

if you are creating shit f2p is the way to go 😄

[crude saddle]

Read the devs website. This won't be f2p and devs are against microtransactions. Wrong @ sorry. https://www.ironmace.com/

[wraith gulch]

Don’t know if this has been said, but when you go down to level 2 you should merge with players from other games that also went down another level, otherwise you run around solo for the most part

[lusty wren]

I think this problem alleviates itself once the full dungeon is in the game

[jagged kelp]

Thats just an issue with people being lil scaredy cats and not going down lol

[wraith gulch]

Yeah sure, but In this case I find that it hurt the game more.

[static thistle]

Will there be a full screen map instead of just the mini map?

[lusty wren]

The goal will be to get to the bottom for the best loot when the game is finished. Floor 1 will also have more players and less loot IIRC so you will naturally get more people who are going down to the lower levels.

No need to put dev time into something that fixes itself by completing your game

[bitter stratus]

Thats more of a #q-and-a question than a suggestion. I dont think the devs have made mention of any plans to add full map access midgame

[static thistle]

I wanted to ask first before posting a suggestion. Because of they have plans for having full screen map that you can drag around /zoom in and out then that's fine. But if not I have this suggestion of having a physical map item in 3/4 slot that you need to use to open the full screen map.

[lusty wren]

If there is a full map it would be cool as an item
but if not people will just use third party maps on a second monitor as I would sooo not sure how needed it is as an in game item.

[bitter stratus]

I think that would only work if maps are entirely randomized. If we keep the current method of pre-gens with fixed locations for rooms, it wouldnt help that much since you can eventually just learn the map or reference an image someone uploads online, as is inevitable. Aesthetically neat, mechanically probably not that useful sadly

[static thistle]

Just a thought because sometimes you can't see where the next zone is and It would just help a little to plan ahead

[tidal musk]

requiring someone to have a second moniter or use a phone to simply look at the entire map is quite literally brain dead

[bitter stratus]

Well firstly no need to be rude, secondly you're not required to do anything. Plenty of people make due playing DaD or even Tarkov without a map operating off memory and map knowledge from playing.

Thirdly, if we're keeping in line with the idea that DaD is inspired heavily by old school dungeon delving classics, the lack of a full map is in line with the idea of you exploring the dungeon.

Personally I have no horse in this race as I'm happy with whatever ends up happening with the minimap system. I was just pointing out that with the way maps are CURRENTLY handled, the community is unlikely to use a full map item over third party options. Thats just how these kinds of games are.

[oak hamlet]

This game will need an anticheat, are there any plans for this?

[bitter stratus]

#q-and-a Though I suspect the answer is "we're working on it". Still only an alpha playtest.

[lusty wren]

I think the thought was to make it to where map knowledge matters. But ya it just ends up being people using it on another monitor

[oak hamlet]

Indeed I do not expect this in the test phases but hopefully the final product will wear an anticheat.

[tidal musk]

Wasnt calling you that. My point is either an in-game map or just a tab in menu where you could study layout of dunguons would drastically increase new player retention. In the end the more people that play the game the better. I was saying it would be brain dead of devs not to add somthing of the sort.

[cinder fern]

i hope if the devs do make solo mode i can disable it I rather face 1v3s then face a bunch of rogues and rangers camping center

[hard karma]

Guys i just saw Cleric using 2 ressurections after campfiring. How is that working?

[static thistle]

Clerics can rest at campfire to replenish the spells

[hardy loom]

They fix the spawns yet or everyone just pretty much spawning next to each other? also wanna say adding like 10 feet and a breakable pass is NOT separating spawns you put like 2 obstacles in their way which is nothing you have them still to close together, I get its alpha and you guys are working on things but really getting ridiculous not being able to adventure cause you're just getting rushed by a bunch of sweaty players.

[mossy solstice]

but its fun to rush and adds the hardcore aspect of it

[minor hull]

Can anyone explain why you dont like the suggestion of having solo lobbies and team lobbies be a seperate thing? Dont really see any downside myself

[hardy loom]

Yeah no that's adds the sweaty I just watched twitch players be sweaty now imma ruin it for everyone too attitude I get the "rush" and stuff aspect but don't spawn a solo next to them or don't even spawn people next to a full team

[bitter stratus]

If you scroll up, this gets argued every 4 hours or so.

[minor hull]

Lol oh didnt know that

[granite plinth]

spawns getting rushed is corny

[lusty wren]

I prefer for no portion of the raid to be "free" I like the tension it gives knowing there can be a team next to you. And killing them is nice because it negates risk of them coming up behind you in the future

[spiral gate]

@edgy ravine, can you explain the downvote please?

[edgy ravine]

Nah. Just skill issue

[fresh rivet]

That's not really a good argument... It's not that difficult to fat finger one of your skills. And it'd be nice to just test what certain stuff does while you're in the lobby.

[edgy ravine]

The game is about learning and advancing. It happens. The game isn’t exactly forgiving in general. It tells you what your skill does and you have plenty of time to learn and get better. You can just as easily fat finger in game, it happens.

[granite plinth]

lvl 17 cleric lfg

[lusty wren]

I think its such a non issue it would be wasteful to put dev time towards it. Now after release if they wanna add tiny QoL things sure lets do it

[edgy ravine]

Pretty much

[somber wind]

Why do people dislike removing spawn room rushing? It got mostly downvotes. I do it and I know it's not cool, that said I will also be killing teammates when random queue is added for their loot.

[spiral gate]

I really don't think it'd be that complicated.. for example when the match starts, the server either checks if the perk is 0 and then sets it to max or the server just sets everyone's perk to max instead of at the lobby.. not that complicated

[lusty wren]

I never said it would be complicated, basically I am saying that small tiny QoL shit should come later in the development process. Id prefer they work on base mechanics and such at this stage

@somber wind Because we like the tension it creates thru ought the entirety of the raid. No save zones, Also why is it "not cool"? Its smart to kill people when you have the option so they dont gank you in the back later

[edgy ravine]

It’s just not too much of the issue to need to do. You’re in game, you use items/skills/magic and you lose out on that amount used. You used it, even if as an accident. You can easily fuckup in game too. You’ll have to live with it

[spiral gate]

Well I have more + than - so it looks like people are on our side

[lusty wren]

Yes many people often want to push POLISH before the game is ready to do it. Its why devs dont always follow mob rule 😄

[spiral gate]

Well the dev's have asked for suggestions/feedback and that's what we've given.. not expecting they're done in the next patch lol but for the game in general

[edgy ravine]

Mob rule isn’t exactly a given of having good games. Especially when they try to push things that make the game obscenely easier or help them more than others.

[lusty wren]

Yes you were free to make your suggestion, and free to ask what we think about it. As we are free to share our opinions when you ask 😉 Polish very often comes last and polishing a tavern lobby that you are in for sub 10 seconds is very wasteful

[carmine current]

anyone else think there should be filters for trade chat? #d-and-d-suggestions message

[spiral gate]

I think you overestimate the work but sure, agree to disagree🙂

[fresh rivet]

@edgy ravine You're not "in the game" though. You're in the lobby. You can't deal damage to people, you can't loot anything other than what people drop.

@lusty wren You're acting as if it's a massive job that'll detract from their work. And, like, they literally added a cosmetic shop that, other than the skeleton race, is non-mechanic based.

[lusty wren]

Polishing things this early means work often is done that means nothing. For all we know this LOBBY system will not even exist in the full game. So why the hell would you ever polish something that may not even make it into final release?

[edgy ravine]

You are “in the game” because you’re in the lobby. Your character is active. You can use your items, everything is a go from there. You can drop everything you have and you can’t have it back otherwise that’s a dupe.

[lusty wren]

Massive or tiny, work done that is unused is a waste

[spiral gate]

What about the shop they added then, or literally ANYTHING in the game that might not make it into full release? We're testers, we're here to test their work and tweak, it's the whole point of these playtests.

[unique hazel]

It would be cool to see some damage decals
Like arrows stuck in a body should stay there after death and 2h slashes should dismember on final hit, charred corpse from fireball, etc.
So you can get an idea of what was used to kill xyz as you come across them.

[lusty wren]

You think their shop is polished? That is a laughable assertion. It barely gets the job done. Its a WIP just like the rest of the game, they have not put any time into polishing it and it shows. This is how development works polish is last

In game mechanics are what is being worked on everything else is placeholder and just passable

[spiral gate]

I never said the shop was polished... I don't think you can understand the point here so imma stop tryin'

[lusty wren]

You literally compared the shop to my comments about polish. WTF else am I supposed to think? 😄

[spiral gate]

https://tenor.com/view/lord-pleas-help-oh-no-gif-25461814

[lusty wren]

We are here to test the base mechanics of the game, not whether or not shit is polished. And your suggestion is a polish issue that can be done at a later point in development. Its a very simple point, follow standard dev practices that work 😄 Development happens in iterations and if you polish shit early it results in wasted time on shit that dont make it into the game.

[lament blaze]

do we get some loot cases or bigger bags for gold in future playtest ? it gets kinda messy after some time whit the 50 bags

[fresh rivet]

@edgy ravine I could say you're in the game as soon as you click play, but you aren't really. You're not actively playing the game at that time. You could tab out for the entirety of the time you spend in the lobby and it wouldn't effect anything. And, dude, you know they can change one thing without changing the other? Plenty of games stop you from keeping gear in similar situation yet reset your health, abilities, etc.

@lusty wren He didn't say anything about polish, just that they spent time on a system that may not make it into full release. And he didn't say it needs to be an immediate thing, plenty of developers put QOL changes on a backlog and get around to it when they get around to it.

[lusty wren]

He did say alot about polish, His entire suggestion was to POLISH the pregame lobby we are in for sub 10 seconds. THIS is a polish issue.

I never said he said it needs to be immediate he asked for opinions on his suggestion and I gave them my opinions.

I voted it down because I feel there are much more important things for the devs to focus on than adding a bit of polish by giving a pregame lobby we are in for sub 10 seconds QoL

[spiral gate]

feedback is feedback, never said it needed to be done by the next patch, it can be added to a backlog and added if the lobby is a thing

and that's me done now, bored of this xD

[lusty wren]

That is fine, but you also asked for feedback and got it 😄 Not sure what the issue is. Take the feedback and move on, i don't see why you ask for something to then get pissy about it

[fresh rivet]

He literally didn't ask you though, and that's me done!

[lusty wren]

And? Its a public forum where he asked someone why they downvoted. 😄 simple logic here

If you do not want it in a public forum where others can also give their feedback take it to DM's

[atomic whale]

Does this suggestion bot accepts pictures?

[edgy ravine]

Add a link maybe to the pic in the suggest?

[oak quartz]

I want to hear your guys' map concepts

[atomic whale]

Anything dynamic generated. It can use even big chunks. Well its tests anyway. So I assume it will have different maps at some point

[oak quartz]

I think there's fair arguments to be made both for and against dynamically generated maps for this game

[lusty wren]

I want to see a map designed off of the Palermo Capuchin Catacombs in Sicily.

[edgy ravine]

Pretty sure this one was already pitched or confirmed. But maybe a battlefield with two camps. Barricades and (im)moveable emplacements with corpses scattered around. Undead and scavengers litter the field with whatever animals like wolves or bears eating the dead. There could be a camp with more riches full of Men at Arms, Knights, Archers/Arbalests, and a General/Lord. Then an advancement to a sieged Castle or smthn around that?

Maybe a plagued village?

[frail canyon]

#d-and-d-suggestions message what's everyone's thoughts on this? I'd personally love it, I like playing both fighter and wizard but both my buds like barbarian so I wizard for them, would love to be able to keep good fighter drops on my wizard for usage

[edgy ravine]

Maybe a guild for sharing equipment and gold between friends with a small player cap?

[frail canyon]

Usually me and my buds do that while in lobby with sharescreen and drop stuff for each other ingame, but yeah that'd be nice QOL too

[lusty wren]

Hmmm, I like having to make stash decisions. I would be down for a "shared" stash if its small and mainly utilized for swapping items. (If you have a friend you can swap items for 15 gold atm though as a workaround)

[atomic whale]

give me one againts it

[edgy ravine]

Maybe the trade menu and just meet up to trade and just exchange stuffs? Idk.

[frail canyon]

havent tested the trade menu yet, how's it work?

[lusty wren]

You go into the market, pick the same "channel" then open a trade with eachother. It costs 15 gold to trade but its well worth it to do

OR ya if you just plan to use it right away have em bring it in raid, drop it in the jail cell

[oak quartz]

The developers have mentioned inthe past that they do want players map knowledge to be a factor

[white cliff]

The devs have stated they don’t like procedurally generated maps and are going with static because learning the map and memorizing where things are should be a skill.

[frail canyon]

ahh, yeah no point having another system to trade between friends then, just one-account inter-character loot transfer is needed

[atomic whale]

where exploring aspect?
maybe both modes

[white cliff]

There’s going to be three floors, currently you load in on B2, plenty to explore.

@vague shell NPCs?

@vague shell Oh holy crap no, that’s a terrible idea. I hate to say skill issue but that PvE mobs aren’t very hard. It’s an extraction based game not a battle Royale, if you want that there are many options. Similar games have PvE elements. Hunt, Tarcov.

[vague shell]

remove NPCs and the game will be golden. They are annoying, takes long to kill, they guard every singular chest. Make the game more pvp based. I hate looting myself up it takes so fcking long and to clear one room at a time. Just to later die to some random shit

[atomic whale]

Players can learn what and where to go during week. sooo imagine if game will be longer, player will be getting bored, and thats fact

[white cliff]

The gameplay loop isn’t about exploring though? I don’t play to explore I play to feed my gambling addiction by picking up different color imaginary items and then skull bashing other players for the sheer adrenaline.

[vague shell]

This game is too slow

[oak quartz]

You're solely accounting for the type of player that dedicates their entire week to games. Not as many people as you think do that. A new dungeon every six months or so is perfectly fine with me, especially when it is a tailored highly labored over experience

[outer gust]

i've barely discovered all the secrets in both versions of the B2 maps we have. there's another B2 map. there's two B3 maps that i've seen a tiny amount of and i've never seen B1

[vague shell]

I mean I come from a game called Rust . I want occasional PvE to get some loot but not in every singular room.

[atomic whale]

if you won't keep better players that will like this game style. You won't keep casuals either.
Even then, casuals also will be bored at some point :D. Its all about how often they will change maps, and how long it will please boredom 😄
I can't think of any example 🤔

[white cliff]

Extremely different games with different themes.

If you don’t like the game you shouldn’t play it, not try to warp it into what you desire by removing core elements.

[oak quartz]

This definitely is not a game for you

[outer gust]

not every game should be like every other game. come on

[vague shell]

its just why does it take so long to kill each NPC also they should make the game faster with some more movement or something. I just want to be able to go in there not loot anything and kill some poo poo head who did all the looting (without NPCs interrupting) 🙂 @white cliff yes but it has normal guns. With swords and sht there should def be movement (also I played mode called Escape from Rust which should be very similar to tarkov. Just more plug and play)

[oak quartz]

No. ❤️

[white cliff]

My guy, not every game needs to be a fast paced shooter like cod, if anything it’s based on tarcov? Plus you come from rust, that game doesn’t have movement, it’s not a fast game either. Also the NPCs take two hits with mid tier gear.

I genuinely don’t think this game is for you, no disrespect.

[lament blaze]

we are right now starting in B2 the second layer so most of the enemys are expected to be killed whit better loot then starting gear so its going to take longer until you get some gold to gear up

[oak quartz]

massive sign that says "playtest"

"That sign doesn't affect me because I can't read!"

[subtle finch]

It's listed somewhere on discord but you are actually testing the second level of the map, so assuming on release there will be an easier layer you spawn on

[vague shell]

wdym I cant read I am literally just making suggestions bro 🙂. @oak quartz sry didnt know it was funny

[oak quartz]

Just a harmless joke friend

[white cliff]

You’re suggesting something very big that would alter the core of the game. I don’t really think many people would enjoy it, and it’s not really what the devs envision.

There’s a ton of PvP, people constantly complain about getting killed.

[vague shell]

I just wish there was more pvp and less looting

[oak quartz]

I think what you will be happy with is the eventual addition of b1. It's going to be larger, have easier enemies, and drastically more players

[white cliff]

@proud fulcrum It already exists it’s called normal queue and high roller queue.

[vague shell]

Probably also will the game be free to play or will I have to buy it?

[atomic whale]

Don't loot then xD

[oak quartz]

Paid, no f2p was confirmed recently

[proud fulcrum]

yea but in normal que when im a level 1 barbarian with starter gear and a fully kitted team of 3 shows up out of no where if really sucks and makes this game not very fun

[vague shell]

this is also true they should add all scav run where everyone spawns with starter gear

[white cliff]

The game will never be catered to, or favor you being a solo sadly. Barb is also probably the hardest class to solo as as-well.

The biggest disparity in normals isn’t the white and green kits though, it’s levels. PVE/PVP becomes easier with four perks.

[proud fulcrum]

i understand that, i was making an example. Im currently playing duos and that stuff is happening. This game is enjoyable, there just needs to be some kind of balancing. also being able to leave with your group would be nice

[white cliff]

Like I said it was worse before, imagine getting rolled by someone’s with purple/orange gear who’s going to do the boss, and doesn’t even pick up your green gear. High roller queue was one of the best things for balancing that could have happened.

Also you can leave with your group pretty consistently, but you just complained about solo balance which is why they removed three man portals?

Are you advocating for groups or solos, it’s a bit contradictory.

[proud fulcrum]

It wasn't intended to just be about solo balancing but balancing in general. Also being able to play solo or groups and have the same or similarly positive experience would be nice

[half herald]

why skele so fast ??????????

[earnest widget]

See so many make the game have solo que honestly I hope they make the game harder for solos go find a group or play tactical

[jaunty tree]

@pure minnow how is ranger bad in PVE? you can sit back and shoot

[azure sapphire]

ok but why

[pure minnow]

Maybe I am trash, but I sit back and shoot too. Except it takes many many headshots and by the time I’m done there’s another fellow waiting or perhaps even a player

[fast lily]

Use multishot and rapid shot and make sure you're always headshotting against mobs

[slim oxide]

I would say the game is fairly balanced, I have seen solo barbarians taking out fully kitted groups, I myself is having trouble playing barbarian. but as rogue with just base gear I have been able to handle solo plays against 3 man group that were well equipped. but perks can be quite a big help, especially against someone who only has one. but once you're getting your second perk things are getting easier.
I am more curious what will happen to the balance once training is added into the game.
I also don't think the game should be balanced so solo is just as easy as going with others, you go solo you should have the risk of being alone without backup, but still be able to defend yourself, which you are... sorry got a bit more lengthy then I intended 🙂

[lament blaze]

i mean going solo also has a lot of good sides

[faint comet]

They should make a system to collect souls of the people you kill and have it for some kind of currency for a merchant or something

[ionic bobcat]

nerf dragonfly’s they are SO FKN ANNOYING

[slim oxide]

I don't feel like it is taking too long to take down anything with a bow, maybe the starter bow is a bit slow to take down things, but I don't feel it is slower then anyone else. now cleric is hands down the best at taking down undeads, as it should in my opinion.

[jaunty tree]

fair enough, but have you tried other classes? they're generally the same, and most of them need to use melee to attack enemies. ranger is probably the best class atm @pure minnow

[slim oxide]

agreed, find it funny to see a dragonfly still flying around with a massive arrow stuck in it

[pure minnow]

I have taken a liking to Rogue, and cleric is cool. I wanted to try them all before anything.

[ionic bobcat]

as a rogue the posion damage is unavoidable it just feels cheap asf

[jaunty tree]

kite them to a wall and poke at them after they shoot - or use stealth to get to them

[fast lily]

I almost wanna say Cleric is the best solo, at least it has been for me. Feels like it needs the least to farm the most

[slim oxide]

would argue it is probably easier to avoid the poison as rogue then a fighter, barb or cleric.

[lone panther]

@unique bone you can already split coin bags back into coins. just alt drag it iirc. whatever the split stack button is

[hollow shadow]

so are we okay with players standing in places that are out of reach of mobs in order to range them and kill them? is that the kind of gameplay we think is fun?

[ionic bobcat]

cleric for sure but with fighter I can stand really far away and poke it with a spear (or shoot it) I’ve only played rogue and fighter though so that’s all I know

[past iron]

what is item identification speed?

[jaunty tree]

rapier is your friend

[slim oxide]

would think it is exactly what it says it is, but I don't think they have any unidentified items in the game yet, not as far as I have seen

[ionic bobcat]

I’m assuming in the future they’ll have a mechanic like in tarkov where you have to identify items in containers/on bodies before you can loot them.

[past iron]

okay great thnx

[lone panther]

@flint viper you can take gold out of pouches. just split them like any other item and it takes gold out

[edgy ravine]

@split drum L

[idle vigil]

@reef cosmos The current starting floor is floor 2 there will be a an earlier floor that is meant to ease players in to the game but the game has only increased by huge magnitude of players starting on floor 2 so far so it doesnt look like the biggest issue

[earnest widget]

Everyone wants a room for low levels and pve only for learning but the best way to learn is through pain and trial and error

[idle vigil]

Its not an unreasonable thing to ask, the game in my opinion is simple enough to not need it first time i played i simply read the ingame guide then went in with not an issue the only thing that felt brutal was the healing when first playing

[crimson flax]

One day people will learn hwo to read and realize that we're on the second floor and that there will be a first floor later on. Lol

[hollow spindle]

People really dont want an option to report people for teaming? 1v3 is doable and a great /fun challenge. but when youre up against a 1v6 you basically have 0 chance to do anything other than run. and odds are, they catch you anyway.

[idle vigil]

I have only ever teamed with people i have sniped never seen teams larger than 3 lmao

[edgy ravine]

how*

[earnest widget]

No stop being anti player interaction fun things like this make a game. And I have never ran into a team idk how so many people are everyone is blood thirsty

[slim oxide]

can't say i have seen bigger teams then 3. but I don't really see a problem if people come into the dungeon and are friendly and assist each other. murder hobo isn't the only way to play the game.

[idle vigil]

Everyone i play against is a ruthless bastard since you cant really do shit to properly team with random players without voip anyway

[hollow spindle]

if there is no problem why are we limited to 3 man teams?

[crimson flax]

very funny :trollchad:

[edgy ravine]

[earnest widget]

The problem is your solution is to punish people for gooning around

[slim oxide]

I have had some fun and interesting plays where I met some strangers that turned out to be friendly, one of my favorite moments, but having voip would probably make it more fun

[idle vigil]

Also if your teaming with randoms how do you not accidently kill them

[hollow spindle]

that was exactly what I had suggested. an option to report players for teaming.

[crimson flax]

If they're so afraid of teaming why don't they just play a wizard and throw a few fireballs like the rest of us

[trail gazelle]

I met a random wizard when on my character the friendly rogue, crouched spammed each other, cleared up to middle together and escaped, it's hard to do but happens rarely, VoIP would definitely help byt its so easily trolled

[hollow spindle]

i would assume it would be pretty easy to tell your friend in voice chat. "im wearing ____ dont attack me" i dont assume that most people playing this game are solo/pugs.

[crimson flax]

God looking at hilarious warzone clips bro I wish this game had VOIP just for the sole purpose of trolling

I really do not giv ea fuck about that wholesome Reddit 100 chungus bullshit LMAO let me play copyrighted music against my TTV enemies

[idle vigil]

How many times have you ran into a team larger than 3 because i have 65 hours in the game and havent seen it once

[earnest widget]

Adding any type of reporting for people playing the game differently than you want is a horrible idea and very anti player.

[slim oxide]

when most people look identical, with no specific markers, it is very easily to kill off your none teamed up team members

[crimson flax]

then kill them

[ripe ridge]

i think people who are adamant the game is unplayable solo should try moving away from other players more but i also think it might be nice to keep player spawn rooms farther from each other based on party size

[hollow spindle]

yeah i agree, would be weird for someone to just report players for playing differently than them. I'm talking about something different though. theres a set team size at 3 (unless i dont have access to a larger que).

[distant grail]

get rid of the maze.

[idle vigil]

Solo is pretty fun if you change from charging in to playing like a rat or 3rd partying its personally entertaining

[ripe ridge]

I agree! I have a lot of fun solo, and I believe that a lot of people's complaints about wizard/ranger/rogue have a lot to do with the fact that these classes have high solo potential thats exponentially realized with teammates

[earnest widget]

It is the same thing if they team in game let them rarely happens if it all, and if it really is a problem add a mechanic or something that can punish it in game not a report

[idle vigil]

Surely they wouldnt add voip if teaming was against their rules

[hollow spindle]

so if people rarely hack the game let it slide because it rarely happens? i dont see the logic tbh. - yeah hacking is a big difference, but both equally ruin the experience of the player on the receiving end.

[slim oxide]

I usually play solo or duo, and I am having great fun with that, I am also having fun meeting people in the dungeon that are friendly, and feels like a organic way to make new friends to join with. again I don't really see a problem people having to or more groups of three meeting up and working together. people might want to team up to take the boss or, just because there is safety in numbers.

[earnest widget]

If they added bard I think it would be funny if they were the only class who could voip

[idle vigil]

I hope more support shit doesnt get added ignite is broken enough i cant wait for voip

[crimson flax]

Players in a DnD inspired game when they can't god mode and hvae to play by rules and experiment to see what works instead of treating it like a shittier version of fortnite

[earnest widget]

I think some spells from wizard and cleric could be made into its own class

[split drum]

???

[crimson flax]

wizard needs a spell that gives fall damage to enemies and increases their gravity

[idle vigil]

Probably the utility should be moved off wizard id say because that class rn is so fucking dumb the ignite 2 shotting barbarians with rondel daggers

[edgy ravine]

Your constant suggestion, fat L

[crimson flax]

i just wish they added stairs to it so it went to somewhere like the central wraith room instead of just being ANNOYING

[idle vigil]

the maze used to be worse last playtest

[crimson flax]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-wet-shower-bath-water-pouring-gif-17140437

[boreal raptor]

i wish torches werent all lit from the start its a dead giveaway that someone was or is there when theres unlit torches. wish they were randomized, any thoughts?

[idle vigil]

It was fucking bad everytime you would get that map it was just final zone in the maze and there were more traps

[hollow spindle]

tough to say, then you would have to run with a torch out yourself.

[unique hazel]

Some torches are already extinguished
maybe like 5%

[dim basin]

im disappointed with the lack of gear for every class besides fighter

[crimson flax]

Wizard and Ranger city

[edgy ravine]

They’ll probably be adding more

[slim oxide]

sure might be a dead give away, but it also servers to slow people down, since it is unlit, they need to put up their own torch or ignite the ones hanging there. which can give someone a free attack, it slows them down by making them carefully move around so not to step on something or avoid being attacked.
as for why they are lit to begin with is another question, maybe some other adventurers that came down before you (the players) ignited them and moved on to next level or escaped. I extinguish them so rangers will have a harder time at hitting me 🙂

[idle vigil]

*Hell

[crimson flax]

the opps are always out for my blood

[boreal raptor]

i think you misunderstand me, i mean too many are lit from the start not unlit i think 10-20% unlit could be the sweetspot. just so there would be a few more dark corners from the start while still having a bit of light in each room, this is dark and darker after all hehe

[jovial snow]

feel like we either need the 3 escape portal at the end back or not having the circle insta kill at the end. feels really bad to survive the whole run and fight all the players just to die because you cant open the portal fast enough

to be clear not both just one or the other

[azure sky]

instead of the insta kill, itd be nice to have the damage just ramp up over time. makes surviving in the darkness for extended time impossible while also allowing players to take a bit more time at the end.
besides, getting insta killed will always feel bad

[jovial snow]

thats a perfect compromise actually yes!

[graceful sparrow]

Nah you get a timer. I think they need to bring back triple blue portals. Forcing teams to split up to escape feels lame. Who takes the first portal and is guaranteed an out while the other two need to keep looking? It’s kinda lame to be honest.

[azure sky]

Honestly, i prefer having to split up with teammates, it gives solo players more of a chance to do stuff against 3 mans. And being alone after having experienced safety in numbers is exciting.

And often my teammates dont leave untill we all have a portal, but that might just be me being lucky with good friends

[graceful sparrow]

I think the most important change that needs to happen is bow damage. I mean a geared ranger with a long bow can hit you for not only more than half your life, but also slows you on hit. Most rangers with just a little bonus damage can kill just about anyone with triple tap. That’s wayyyyyy too easy mode. Especially since it’s the MOST played class in the game.

They have a self heal, only class that can use traps, heavy ranged damage, slows targets on hit, high movement speed, high interaction speed… cmon, they need a nerf.

My recommendation is turn bow damage into damage over time that ends instantly when a bandage is used and leave xbow as is.

[jovial snow]

the "timer" at the end is the problem to insta death. you get camped by a 3 stack as a solo and cant get to the circle and you cant run to find a blue. thats my experience and it isnt fun to insta die for surviving

[graceful sparrow]

The problem is with an inventory of campfires, a cleric could theoretically just spell heal and heal from campfires to keep lobbies open for hours and the players looking to do red portals would be waiting forever. The games NEED to end based on the level progression design.

[azure sky]

In my opinion the damage should be more avoidable instead of nerfed, for example shields should cover the head more so fighters and clerics dont get melted, same concept of avoiding damage for the other classes would be good

[boreal raptor]

the circle does need a overhaul either slow it down or make it bigger ye

[graceful sparrow]

Well we’re technically on D2 not D1. When the game is further in development, we’ll have a floor before the dungeon.

[boreal raptor]

i keep forgetting that. thats true man guess we'll have to wait and see how they handle d1

[graceful sparrow]

Nah, longbows do not do the same kind of bodily damage as a bardiche or halberd or double axe etc. the numbers need to be scaled back and the damage should be dealt through bleed, as is in real life. Nobody instantly died in the Middle Ages to an arrow unless they were shot in the head. Allowing a bow to do that kind of damage or even more than a massive axe the size of a person makes no goddamn sense.

[graceful sparrow]

D1 is bigger map, more portals, more people, easier mobs, worse loot.

[azure sky]

Yea fair, they shouldnt do more than an axe. But people also shouldnt be able to tank like 4 to 5 arrows and be fine (except maybe barbs).

[boreal raptor]

also what about some stealth gameplay buffs? its impossible to hide in the dark now with those 100gamma nerds

[azure sky]

Not a whole lot the devs can do about that i think, only real option is to overhaul the lighting system and make it something like rust where its straight up just black

[hearty otter]

"Make the pregame lobby a place where u can go while not in a game, access your stash, use the training dummies, have the merchants in there etc." THOUGHTS?

[boreal raptor]

true no clue what they could do about it but it ruins part of the rogue experience if your trying to rat

[chrome kindle]

FIX Alchemist!!! Only been getting grey staffs and orbs for the past 24+ hours. No 3rd or 4th weapon whites or greens!

[glad depot]

Interesting thought on wizard, same should be applied to clerics and any other spell caster added to the game in the future. #d-and-d-suggestions message

[burnt cove]

I have a leaderboard suggestion. (It wouldn't require changes to the infra of the system and database). Leaderboards should have "all-time" but also allow you to sort by different time periods like 30 days, 7 days, 24 hours, etc. That would give people the opportunity to climb a leaderboard for a day or week or month instead of always being too far behind

[latent geyser]

So....I hate to break it to the devs but their current suggestion format is garbage. I mean, truthfully speaking, hardcore pvpers are some of the most toxic people on the planet. Which means anyone putting up a suggestion for a PvE mode is going to get their suggestion tanked regardless of if it was a good suggestion or not or how easy it would be to implement. Current maps hold 16 players. It would be really simple to limit a map to just one group as a PvE mode without changing anything else. Of course if you did that you could also take out the swarm for that mode, make the maps bigger and put the exits at the end of the map. Still not a lot of extra work going on there.

[rose sandal]

But with that. You’re asking them to rework their entire game, they have a set unique design. And they like it. A LOT of people like it. If you don’t want pvp, hide, invs potion, don’t play the game, something. It’s a PvPvE. You’re going to run into someone eventually. If you die. Learn from your mistake and do better. If you win, evaluate how you won and what you can do to take less damage. This is just not a game for PvE.. sorry to tell you man.

[crude flame]

I wish there was a small rant part of this discord, because I just swung into someones head at least half a second before they even swung and my shield still didnt come up quick enough lmao

[latent geyser]

I'm not asking them to rework the entire game. How is limiting a map to one group, 3 players, instead of the normal 16 "reworking an entire game? @rose sandal

[solemn glacier]

Nerf Ghostking. He is way is way too OP with the instakill for the ENTIRE ROOM!

[fast lily]

The game is balanced around needing to deal with other players. That's the entire vision of the game.

[rose sandal]

You’re asking them to remove 13 people from a game. So 3 people can run the map. That changes the game completely. Where would the fun be in that.

[latent geyser]

The game is an amazing dungeon crawler. Why can't it be that without the PvP? Just because you like the way it is now doesn't mean they can't also do something for those who want a PvE mode when it's so very simple to add

The fact that YOU don't see the fun in that proves my point. While YOU and those like you can enjoy the game as is there is a LARGE group of people who would enjoy it more WITHOUT the PvP aspect that can be easily added with little to no fuss.

[rose sandal]

And they might eventually. But this is an alpha play test. Not even beta yet, and you’re asking for so much then go on to tell the devs that their suggestion format is garbage. They are giving us a piece/taste of the game. And from how it just looks (from your suggestion post that I saw, and what you’re saying in this) you’re being a major Karen about it

[latent geyser]

Let me ask you this. How does the devs adding a PvE mode affect you? In any way shape or form. Yes me telling the devs their suggestion format is garbage is harsh but true. After all this is the internet and their a a lot of toxic trolls here. Yes this is an Alpha. I'm giving feedback. It's even positive feedback as I've given ALSO given them a very easy way to implement said suggestion that would only add a little more strain to a server. That, it just so happens, would make a TON of people very happy with. Do I expect them to add this immediately? Not at all. But if they want to have it put in and tested then they should start thinking about it now. So again. I ask you how a PvE mode personally affects you at all. Is it that there won't be nearly as many noobs for you to gank?

[small socket]

this ruins the whole point of extraction sim, this is literally the 1 percent that would want to play this, if they did this it would have to be an entirely different game not connected to the overall game which pvp would be in. you wouldnt be able to mix the markets because it would tank item costs. This would also cost thousands on top of thousands of dollars for new servers

[rugged mason]

Pve would be nice as long as they tag the loot as from pve and not usable in pvp. I would play it a decent bit

[rose sandal]

Yikes kid, you’re trying to get personal here lol, chill with all that 😂 it effects me because yes, I won’t be able to trap people like you in a doorway then get that ez kill

[latent geyser]

And that is reasonable Dakka. Make loot not useable between modes. Lots of things can be done. But Frank? There's no thousands on top of thousands needed at all. Limit one group instead of 3 or 4. Done

[small socket]

you clearly have no idea how anything works, there would have to be thousands of rewritten code to make this happen, this wouldnt just appear. like hundreds of hours of devs time making this happen for the smallest percentage of players

[latent geyser]

Teddy can you stop with the name calling? First a Karen and now a kid? I'm middle aged. I'm asking them to add something that can easily be done for not only my enjoyment but a lot of others. Just look at how many people are asking for a PvE mode on steam. Frank I actually DO know how it works. Changing a limiting player number is almost like flipping a switch in how easy it is ESPECIALLY when you're lowering said number.

[small socket]

coding items to delete? coding items not to work in game? these are entirely new mechanics bruh, thats not just "one number" this would have to be done with EVERY ITEM as well

[warped orbit]

it's not that simple Kyrin, there's a lot that needs to be done for a mode like that, if you just do "a flip switch" it would ruin the game for everyone else

[rose sandal]

And for the record, In your suggestion, you literally say to add a larger map. And a larger map would mean a new map. Soooo, not that simple… in an alpha play test

[latent geyser]

Zutho why would it ruin the game for everyone else? People who want to play that mode will play that mode. Yes my suggestion was to make larger maps for a PvE mode but it's not necessary to start off with. If you didn't change anything but limiting the map to a single group instead of 4 or 5 even that would make the PvE crowd happy. And the other suggestions like from Dakka are again things that aren't needed right off the bat.

[rugged mason]

Its wouldnt be too difficult to add an item property called pve and just have all items in that mode spawn with it. Having a check before queueing for pvp that looks at inventory and equipped for that tag is also fairly straightforward. I think with everything ironmace has done so far it is entirely within their capabilities. That being said id rather they iron out balance first and at a later date potentially add a pve mode.... Particularly since there are some class balance issues IMO

[rose sandal]

Do you play call of duty a lot?

[rugged mason]

I dont enjoy those gsmes, so no. Last one I played was the old world at war for zombies.... Though im not sure how that is relevant to what i said but I am open to listening

[latent geyser]

A much simpler way would just be to have your character pool split between modes. Can't use your PvE guy on PvP mode. Simple and easy

[warped orbit]

what do you do when people can level and get gear with no risk then go into pvp fully geared? if you can do that everyone would so you would force everyone into doing that, effectively reducing pvp queues, and limiting new players, the market would be flooded, and prices would go down, pvping would feel way less rewarding, and the game would eventually die out because that's just not what the main player base signed up for, and yes that all can be fix but then it requires an entire new mode with entirely new balance, new menus, etc. that's a lot of time and resources that could otherwise be spent into actually making the game better witch is not even complete yet. asking for a mode like that as it is now it's just unrealistic

[latent geyser]

Like I said Zutho make the character pool separate.

[rose sandal]

This is the way I see it. I’ll compare it to Tarkov, it’s taken a long time for tarkov to finally add PvE (offline mode, as a group) for people to actually group up and play/learn together. And it took a long time because they focused on their true game first.
So I see DnD doing the same, balance their game first. Making their gameplay solid and servers stable THEN start expanding. But making a suggestion, then calling them garbage is a Karen move. Comments that aren’t needed and @rugged mason that wasn’t directed to you, sorry

[warped orbit]

it can be done, but I wouldn't count on it anytime soon

[small socket]

whats your game called?

[latent geyser]

This is Alpha. I don't expect very many things to be done anytime soon. Hell even just balancing classes is probably going to take a while

[rose sandal]

What they NEEEED CURRENTLY! Is to increase the gold coin purses size. I have my bottom 5 rows full of gold purses and it’s a freaking struggle.

[warped orbit]

time to spend it, you hoarder

[latent geyser]

And don't get me wrong. The reason I'm fighting so hard on this issue is that I really REALLY love what this game does and it's potential. It gives me and my mate pure Dungeons and Dragons vibes which we've been missing since getting to a table becomes a bit harder in life. Just hoping they think about us poor old nerds who don't like PvP much and throw us a bone. Also, Teddy I completely agree. 50 is WAY to small for a coin pouch.

[rose sandal]

I TRY!! Shit, I goto the traders, and over pay to hell for the bs people are selling. But I only run high roller now. So I get around 1k every hour or so

[rugged mason]

Ive only done a few student projects in java, c++, and c#. Nothing major. Though I do understand the fundamentals of programming. I'm not sure how that is relevant though.

Also just to restate, i definitely think balance first, potentially a pve mode later.

[warped orbit]

you should try playing vermintide

[quaint sentinel]

hey holy light should be like lesser heal? ware if there's no valid target you self heal

[latent geyser]

I have. Loved it and we've been playing a lot of Darktide too. But Dark and Darker comes a LOT closer to a typical dungeon dive from table top than either of those.

[lament phoenix]

that would kinda ruin the balance, as holy light is a greater heal for teammates but damage for enemies, if you could heal yourself you would have 10 heals

[rugged mason]

I dont think it is unreasonable to hope for a pve mode though, and as I said I strongly believe ironmace is capable of accomplishing it if they so choose to... Assuming it isnt is insulting to the devs in all honesty

[quaint sentinel]

no more than broken than it is now as i can cast 10 heals on the barb id just like to be able to solo wonse and a wile

[tidal lake]

Please remove or adjust impassable floor traps that span the entire hallway

[lament phoenix]

it's support for team play but offence for solo run

[lament phoenix]

are you talking about that one that's in the trap maze?

[glad depot]

Interesting thought on wizard, same should be applied to clerics and any other spell caster added to the game in the future. #d-and-d-suggestions message

[warped orbit]

play a rogue and disarm them or ignore the room, not everything should be available for everyone imo, most of them you can just walk around anyway

[quaint sentinel]

id like tabaxi/ cat-people as a skin il pay i have money !

[tidal lake]

Most aren't the problem. It's the completely impassable ones that are. There's no skill to that. If you can't survive the forced damage you just die.

[leaden furnace]

this game really hard for solo player out there T-T

[lament phoenix]

especially if the zone forces you to go in/through that room or trap

[warped orbit]

there's just one room behind a bookshelf with impassable ones that I know of all other ones can be walked around or corner jumped with crouch jump

[tidal lake]

Yeah most you can jump corners. Crouch jumping if need be, but the FEW that you can't pass are a problem. At least make them do no damage when triggered, throw a torch down or something. I don't know if the delay is enough to get through admittedly. The three or four that span the entire width of a hall though have no point in existing, it doesn't reward skillfull play, or mechanically punish bad play, it is just random damage based on your spawn and the circle.

[crude saddle]

it rewards prior planning by not being forced to go that way and lose health

[tidal lake]

So your idea of good system for it is to just avoid a chunk of the map were are meant to play on entirely? 👌

[warped orbit]

the intent of the game is to feel dangerous everywhere so he has a point

[crude saddle]

if you have the heals to take that shortcut, sure. otherwise, it might not be worth it. glad you aren't a game designer.

[lament blaze]

its possible whit torch but u need to have the timeing down

[tidal lake]

Shortcut? It's literally just part of the standard map routes. I'm devastated that you wouldn't play my game 💔

[visual goblet]

a single circle shrink can force you into them, no matter how much you plan. especially if you didnt know they were there

[crude saddle]

so you forced yourself into a position where you only have one route

[warped orbit]

that's... that's the point

[visual goblet]

and were saying thats the problem, there shouldnt be such thing as unavoidable damage? you didnt play rogue with one specific perk? then suffer

[tidal lake]

Ah yes, so again just avoid entire chunks of the map. Gorgeous plan

[crude saddle]

you can avoid that damage by not going down one specific corridor if you arent capable of taking that damage. the solution is pretty simple.

[warped orbit]

you can take the hit and heal with items, anyone can

[lament phoenix]

solutions should be like alternative routes for people with a keen eye or ways to disable the traps naturally but it takes a really long time. not learn a movement tec or avoid chunks of the map, or the good ol fashioned "get gud"

[visual goblet]

not at like 1/3 hp rogue, on oh yes, go another route and die to the three man. shame theres no other route

[crude saddle]

so you took a lot of dmg and someone took the better route. seems like you screwed up.

[visual goblet]

glad you guys arent designing this game, imma be honest. cause thats bad design to want this as the option, die or die, with no way to maybe bypass

[crude saddle]

im glad that the sum of bad choices may end a run. that's the situation you are describing

[warped orbit]

so you're solo, with no items, took a lot of damage, didn't get the perk as a rogue and chose the wrong route to go, sounds like bad decision making and planning, you got unlucky, but that's the game

[median spire]

Who else thinks a replay system would be amazing to see cool moments from a different perspective ?

[visual goblet]

dont even gotta be solo, my team can die first, we could be fresh out a different fight, the situation can vary, either way you just lose, cause bad luck. nothing about choices

[lament phoenix]

so what you're saying is that everyone should play the rogue with the disarm trap perk to enjoy the game and not die because you're past a hp threshold?

[crude saddle]

there isn't any luck involved- its a static map

[lament phoenix]

lucky that the ring doesnt force you into the room?

[visual goblet]

luck of spawn, luck of loot, luck of ai choice, luck of what fights you got pushed into lots of luck involved

[warped orbit]

not at all what I said, I said that are many thing you can do (disarm, tank, go the other way) but he put himself in that position where he has none of those options so yes he should be screwed

[median spire]

The thing people forget is that different from most of other games this one you need to have A LOT of patience and game awareness

[visual goblet]

i just gave a kinda vague situation you could be in, you assumed the rest. all i said was 1/3 hp and stuck between a team and a trap, never said what led me there or anything else

[median spire]

What I am trying to say is this game is not a for example a rainbow six where you can 1v5 . Its obvious if you are a rogue you fucking run from a 3 stack or maybe split them with the tools given to you , like molys , doors , darkness , traps and even mobs by the cheer amount of them in most rooms

[lament phoenix]

what you're saying then is just "get gud"? because if you're response was you didnt research the map and jump tecs or out tank or out heal the damage is childish because you're saying either play a specific class with a specific perk or dont go near that room with a map known for it's multiple choke point rooms that funnel players and the constantly closing ring. the solution should be multiple options to get around the situation that arent too obvious that it defeats the purpose of the trap but rewards quick thinking, the damage can weaken you to a point of getting one shot by anything and that is unfair for how you have to go through it, going through the circle will make you take damage which defeats the poing of going around it

[warped orbit]

no, I'm saying sometimes you'll just find yourself in a situation where there's nothing you can do, and that is fine

[visual goblet]

the problem is unless its just you can do anything because you were outskilled you should always be able to do something even if its at the cost of time or resources or just lower damage. game design should never be "you cant do anything lol suffer"

[lament phoenix]

yeah and just like any dark souls player, your advice is to "be better" not actual advice or hints on what to do, saying "you should've picked a different class" isnt a workaround for a situation you cant control nor think ahead of.

[median spire]

@lament phoenix the game gives you tools its just that people didn't learn to use them

[warped orbit]

I never said "get good" bro, what are you talking about, I said he was unprepared for the situation so he had no real option, and when that is the case it makes sense for him to have nothing else to do and die/lose

[visual goblet]

aside from one specific perk on one specific class there is no tool around it. its not even a huge problem, theres like 3 spots ive ever seen it, but its an issue in those spots

[lament phoenix]

yes tools that you dont always have on hand, if there was a "trap disarm kit" it shouldnt be mandatory to bring it or you're forced to take damage, the problem is you cant think ahead of time and get punished by bad luck

[lament phoenix]

that's a phrase, it's said by dark souls players as a way to cop out advice, if someone says "this boss is hard" and the advice is "get gud" that does not help. if a person says "i cant get around this trap and im forced to take damage even if i try to move around it" your advice shouldnt be "you deserved it because you didnt know" or can be switched out with, "get gud"

[mint ridge]

was the trap floor spikes?

[jagged heron]

Rubysilver overhaul when? 😔

[visual goblet]

the one im thinking of most yes, it covers a wall to wall spot so you cant sneak along side it, you cant jump the distance, and theres no main way to disable without the perk

[warped orbit]

it isn't advice, the guy said "there's nothing I can do about it" and I'm saying sometimes it's how it is, and you're contorting my words dude chill

[mint ridge]

ah

[agile fern]

@mild idol saw your suggest post from about 4 hrs ago; it's got a lot of downvotes, although I agree with most of what you're saying. I think an issue is just that you posted like 10 things in the same suggestion

[lament phoenix]

im not "controlling your words" im rephrasing, it has the same meaning as the other phrase so im just using "git gud" as a way to replace it, "it is as it is" and "git gud" are the same thing, it's saying you have no control over it and to just get better, but you were saying earlier that you could "do something about it" and that was to go an entirely different route or to tank it, going the different route could lead you to taking more damage or just dying, tanking the damage is situational as in you could not have enough health and die, or you take the damage and be one shot by anything, these are faulty advice\

[mild idol]

@agile fern Thanks ! I figure, at least the devs could see it

[warped orbit]

no it doesn't mean the same thing dude, what are you even talking about

[mint ridge]

i feel like thats part of the game tho? like its difficult on purpose and there will always be a room that could lead to death or more damage. but thats why the game also gives you the ability to heal so you can push past or go invisible or use some kind of different perk. sometimes you run out of options like in any other game that has pvp or pve competition

[lament phoenix]

i've ran into the trap before, it was in the trap maze and i had to go through the spikes because the swarm was closing in, i didnt have heals and it lead to a room where i was one shot by mummies, it was not fair and i had no other route to go, i couldve gotten lost in the maze and die by the swarm or take the hit and still not get out, there are boards on the wall next to it but even as a barbarian i couldnt break it with the bash through perk, it was unfair and i was punished for fate

[sturdy robin]

Mummies have very easy move sets

[warped orbit]

and that is fine, that's how it's supposed to be, sometimes you'll get unlucky run out of options and that is okay, that's what I'm saying, it's not unfair, it's the game

[lament phoenix]

the game is very difficult i understand that dearly and love it for it, but forced damage is not fair nor fun, there was no other way around it and having heals is situational, there was no other option but take damage or go through the swarm and take damage, playing as a different class should not be the alternative either

[mint ridge]

i should also mention that we are also playing the second level of the dungeon i believe there will be another level before this which would be easier to navigate and survive but would have worse loot

[visual goblet]

my issue isnt that you take damage from it at all, i just feel there should be something, like a resource, or a lot of time, or just lower the damage by doing something even, and make rogues the only ones who can completely turn it off

[lament phoenix]

yes but the "difficulty" shouldnt be "do you have enough heals?" there should be ways around the situation like in dnd. you see a hall of traps but on the wall is boards, you should be able to break the boards, in that spot on the map, you cant break the boards no matter what

[visual goblet]

i can acknowledge that part, the new floor could change shit a lot

[mint ridge]

you can throw torches on floorspikes to pre enable them thus allowing you through. with wall spikes you can get close enough that they trigger without hitting you and the swinging axes you can just time your way through it. there is a way to disable each trap so you can get through it

[warped orbit]

you can also just duck every wall spike as far as I know

[mint ridge]

there is some that are lower but also they appear on the map so

[visual goblet]

they still hurt you while out, sadly, and it doesnt seem reduced though i could be wrong

[mint ridge]

it looks like you can just time jumping across as they retract so you dont take damage

[lament phoenix]

the torch trick only recuses the damage, it's basically a lingering hitbox until it closes, wall spikes you can crouch under but there also low wall spikes which you can only get around if you look straight down and crouch you can get by and if there is only one you can jump over it, the traps arent the problem it's lining up traps that when you dodge one you get hit by the other. there is a way to disable it but that's only on the rogue AND if you equipped the perk

there should be a workaround because in a lot of situations, "go another route" should not be the advice when there is a swarm that forces you into that trap, like two barrels that you can break the top one, then hop on it and hop over the trap, or a lever that opens a secret rock door that lets you get pass without damage, not "just tank it"

[dense swan]

I like the idea of voice chat but toggleable voice chat would be better imo it'd be cool either way though

[visual goblet]

ill give it a try at some point, if thats true, then i retract my entire arguement

[mint ridge]

i assume were talking about the central trap maze room in the middle of one of the maps. it has multiple ways to enter and exit the room without passing through the middle, which the only reason to go through the middle is loot. Other than that you can just avoid the room or use the other exits. if you look up the maps you can see them.

[lament phoenix]

yes the trap maze, but that is if you went there on your own, but if the swarm forces you into that room (which it usually does because it's in the middle) than you have to go through the maze, and the longer you're in the swarm the more damage you take so you cant just backtrack, i would never go into the trap room i always go around but sometimes the swarm forces me inside and it's either i get loss or i get to the floor trap spot by accident

like i keep saying the problem is not the room in particular but the fact that if the swarm forces you into that spot, you're forced to get hit, multiple options is a better choice, "just go somewhere else" is a bandaid solution, and a bad one too

[mint ridge]

the fact that you cant always escape a situation without taking damage is part of what makes the game challenging. by creating a way to escape every situation unscathed with every character makes the dungeon aspect redundant as there is no way to fail environmentally. it would remove a whole aspect of what makes the game difficult. Also, part of the circle and map's role is to make you plan ahead so you can avoid certain rooms or go through them earlier so you dont have to be forced by the circle

[tidal lake]

Not the maze, not Wall spikes, it's hallways part of the main route where it's a floor trap spanning the width of the hallway, nonroom on side to walk past

[mint ridge]

torch and timing can get you passed it

[lament phoenix]

i am not suggesting that the game shouldn't be difficult, i love it for being difficult and how you can get +spellslot on a battleaxe, it's a part of the game, forced damage is unfun and unfair, if there was a door in the game that took %25 hp every time you walked through, and you were forced to go through it because of the swarm, that's not "what makes the game difficult" it's annoying, because the game is built off paths and if the swarm blocks off one route, it's either you take damage to the swarm or the trap, learning specific jump tecs or just tanking it is not a solution for the problem, even dark souls you can go through the whole game without getting hit, and that game is difficult but it is fair and it plays by it's rules, the rule "jump over the spike trap to avoid damage" should not be broken by putting multiple back to back, that is not fair, it's not playing by it's own rules

[mint ridge]

i think we just see a different vision for what we want the game to be so agree to disagree i guess

[lament phoenix]

solution should be multiple choices, for a game where you can be multiple, completely different classes, not pick one class and the others get fucked over, how about props that reward smart thinking or a hidden lever which they've done before? the difficulty should not be tied to forcing damage and seeing if they can heal through

[mental bolt]

First and foremost, this game is super cool... and casual shockingly for the genre it is in...Now your like what?? a hard core survival game that is casual why yes..... you got that nailed down... However I play solo.. not because I want to... but because it is casual. I can log in and play like 3 rounds in under 30 minutes that is great! I do not have time to LFG as my life style does not permit.. I assume all the risk that comes with a solo life style.... SUPER COOL with it.. but why in the hall am I spawning into the Vietnam war as a solo player? Still cool with that actually... But after I clear 5 to 10 mobs just to get ran up on by a three man is tilting.

[thorny mulch]

How about a founder option, specifically offered to fans / players who have joined the discord community. This allows all the devoted players to continue to improve and play the game, and money to help keep the servers up while in development. A founders pack promises skins for later and early access but comes with knowing the game will be down for updates when ever the developers need too. I know id buy this game already.

[hidden rampart]

Something like this? #d-and-d-suggestions message

[timber herald]

Perhaps remove circle from game?

[coarse dirge]

only if increase player cap on map

[timber herald]

Player cap is already kind of high for how small the maps are

[coarse dirge]

hunt:showdown is frustrating, ure fighting in the start of the game, then 20 mins just running
or 20 mins just running, then getting ambushed lel

21 with no circle is ok i think, esp on normal mode

[timber herald]

I dont find that to be the case, because the game brings people together with the bounties. Thing about this game is the PvE is engaging enough to not need PvE. especially since the PvP is super inbalanced in favor of the higher level player. Thats true for tarkov, sure, but being high level doesnt stop you from leg meta or head eyes in tarkov. There is no leg meta or head eyes in this game. If new players continue to get stomped by geared players, this game will see the same fate as The Cycle: Frontier.

[somber wind]

Oops pressed enter not shift enter LUL Gunna have to try that suggestion again.

[coarse dirge]

?
start game, play normal mode, u will see the 90% lobby of solo ranger\rogues
i play as duo, yes high-roller is full of geared partys, but normal dungeon is full of starting gear characters, maybe 1 of 10 i meet the player in epic\blue gear

[prisma wasp]

How do we currently feel about the fact that all damage slows? I'd like it if physical damage slowed and none of the magic except ice type spells. Getting hit with one fireball is just the setup for the next one it feels like right now.

[frozen fjord]

really disappointed that fear won't work on wraith and champion, like rangers cheese every mob in the game and fighter and cleric just shield but barb fear is too much?

[granite plinth]

making wraith, skelechamp, and centuar no longer be feared is stupid, take more away from barbarian, the worst class inthe game, I love being a barb, but the other classes just out shine it, 2h is my favorite

[hexed briar]

MAN CAN THEY GET RID OF FRENDLY FIRE

[granite plinth]

Barbarian, no shield, no healing, no movement, its slow, starts with like no armor, and now you took one of its only utility tool away, fear is now only good for trash mobs, how about you nerf wizard invis instead

[frozen fjord]

yeah not really seeing how barb deals with these advanced mobs. The centaur I understand more but wraith and champion is brutal

[hexed briar]

can they nerf friendly fire????????????

[azure sky]

I wouldve been fine with the barb nerf if instead they just increased the defence debuff with that ability a lot

[terse pivot]

Highest base HP, speed gap closer, strongest 2h user. Game is meant too have a party of 3 and is balanced around 3s not solo

[silent bobcat]

ur capping, I dookied on an entire geared team as a level 7 fighter with default gear when I first started. Sure, the argument could be made that they were bad, but they were still geared and had the numbers advantage. It's really nuanced, but theres actually tons of skill expression in this game.

Edit: And even if you're not good at fighting other players, there are plenty of ways to escape from combat unless you're being chased down by a fighter who's sprinting

@frozen fjord Rogue too if you have a Rapier

[granite plinth]

thats nothing compared to the long range that wizard and archer have, the dps of a rogue, the healing of a cleric, the SPRINT of a fighter, a light weight figher with sprint out runs everyone

[frozen fjord]

ranger mage and fighter can all solo wraith and champ. true

[terse pivot]

Mobs are overtuned it's not your class

[manic coral]

barbarian was clearly the overpowered class this alpha 🤌

CCing bosses for 6 seconds is probably too strong though. Barb needs buffs in the way of having blocks added to axe weapons (which is coming), and 2h axes getting some attention in general.

[hexed briar]

man ive killed my teammates 16 times with a fireball ggs

[sly shuttle]

I used my Homie as a Conduit for Chain lightning, a worthy sacrifice.

[granite plinth]

I agree with the blocking, but those arent bosses, those are minibosses, barb has WAY less than the other classes, its got less movement, less utility, a rogue running naked, or a fighter sprinting light weight can easily out run a barb, and barb runs super slow while attacking

[terse pivot]

Give barb a shout that makes shield users unable too block maybe

[cyan pivot]

Please bring the "new/old" map "The Colosseum" also into the normal game pool! (not just highroller)

[azure sky]

Cc for 6 seconds is nothing compared to ranger sitting on a ledge where mobs cant reach and just picking them off while scrolling reddit on his phone in his left hand

[granite plinth]

barbarian is all about rage, lots of slow heavy hitting damage, and it doesnt even feel like a barbarian at all, it doesnt give that awesome raw 2 handed feeling, honestly, make it so the penalties of reckless attack and rage apply AFTER the skill ends, like it does in DnD (dungeons and dragons)

[hexed briar]

ayo any suggestions on how not to shoot your teammates on accident my teammates are dumb asf

[sly shuttle]

Communication, But Learning the Timing and Range of your spells is a huge help, Especially with fireball! Sometimes Shooting behind your enemy near their feet is a good way to do damage, and avoid hurting your allies.

[jovial crane]

uninstall the game jkjk

[manic coral]

I agree. i've mostly mained barb and it's the weakest class this alpha. it needs some attention for certain and i think a big area to start with is that barb's weapons generally suck ass and none have block options.

@terse pivot i think the fear shout should be changed to do a -15% move speed and -15% damage to all enemies for 7 seconds instead of just -25% damage.

@azure sky Ranged weapon options need to have ammo capacity added to start balancing out how powerful of an option ranged damage is. I think they intend to add it

[cerulean steppe]

Why give us the utility of fear shout and then not let us use it?

[terse pivot]

Idk if u buff barb cc wise then take away his ability too 1 shot, with haste invis he's just going to get nerfed again guys.

PvE u just let your range dps clear.

[manic coral]

Any class getting buffed with haste and invis is going to be busted (including wizards). Haste and invis are the problem there but nobody seems to want to come to terms with that.

[granite plinth]

the problem is that the meta is speed, which is why rogue, fighter, wizard, are all out shining most of everything else, and why people are making naked runs

[hexed briar]

alright so my teammates are deaf and blind so they gotta make a handicap dungeon

[frozen fjord]

any time a D&D themed anything exists, wizard is OP. It's mandatory lmao

[sly shuttle]

Well, Eventually sometimes you gotta stand back and use your friends as Chain Lightening Fodder.

[terse pivot]

Wizard will get nerfed, the devs are actually smart and a magical DPS class is the hardest too properly balance

They just need more data this test. X2 more than last playtest.

[paper musk]

It won't. Reserve your indiscriminate hatred for magic users for when they add the planned Sorcerer class

[manic coral]

It will.

[hexed briar]

see now they cant even do that because they are blind so what im thinking they should add is a handicap dungeon for the blind and deaf etc yk

[granite plinth]

barb is my all time favorite class, but man I hate playing it in this play test, I got it to 20 and it just felt like crap almost the whole time, ranger, wizard were way more fun to play

[hollow sentinel]

isn't that what they call ranger gameplay?

[tulip lava]

as a barb my only reason in this play test is to stand close to my teammates so they can fight and no one comes close....

[frozen fjord]

I actually think barb is a decent class, I have 4 classes at 20, including barb. its weapons just need work. Felling axe is like the only viable option. The issue I have with the fear nerf is it keeps him a peg below other options instantly

[paper musk]

It won't. Here's some reasons why instead of being childish and not backing up your argument.

There's only 1 magic dps class currently. You cannot balance a game around anti magic against 1 class. There will be more classes and a period of roller coaster balancing.

The items to counter magic arent in game yet. We still dont have the anti-magic pots to drink (like the physical ones) And that will help immensely against the magic classes coming.

The issues that made you feel magic was OP in playtest 2 (im assuming you arent new here) and this one are due to some bugs in the damage calcs incorrectly applying magic to various spell casts and ticks of DOT dmg

[safe nacelle]

Give the barb a dual wielding perk so he can be more viable with axes.
@granite plinth do you know what the word viable mean?

[granite plinth]

he can already dual wield, he gets an axe that fighter can use with the hatchet off hand

Edit: @safe nacelle do you not know what already can dual wield means? the one handed axe is arguably better than the 2handed weapons because of how fast it attacks and has less movementpenalties

[hexed briar]

ayo man you think they should add handicap dungeons

[paper musk]

Please be coherent with your questions and discussions. Thanks in advance from the rest of the readers here.

[terse pivot]

Magic is not op, only ignite dagger which completely overshadows rogues identity. You have to understand that at least.

Outdpses outspeed and outinvis a class that is meant to do all of that. They can't nerf them here they have too collect data to do the right changes not keep doing wrong changes over and over.

[safe nacelle]

Give barbarian a perk that buffs his dual wield ability. Make him 10% faster or stack damage per hit so I don't feel like dual wielding sucks against either players or bosses.

[hexed briar]

yo man you better chill with the negativity over here talking like a college professor im just chillin

[granite plinth]

tell that to wizards who use haste, then ignite, then invis, which they can sprint while staying invis for FOUR seconds

[manic coral]

Wizard is not OP only because it is doing insane damage. Gear scaling is absurd in this playtest and all classes are scaling well with damage. Wizard is OP because it has immensely more utility than other classes, largely in the form of haste and invis, and the ability to spam Meditate to never run out of spells. There are several ways to go about nerfing wizard so that they can't spam recover spells as much, have less uses of certain spells (like haste and invis), have short cooldowns on certain spells, shorter durations, etc.

The average wizard during a playtest is not playing wizard well enough to showcase how abusive it is. It can not die to other players unless it gets one shot. No melee should get close to a wizard unless invis. A wizard is not threatened by any element of PvE because they can simply invis with no cooldown and haste themselves away from any danger.

You're in denial if you think that they are balanced in their current form. I'm not going to make it my job or care to convince you of something that is obvious to me and I'm sure obvious to the devs. Nerfs will come, in what form i'm not sure since there are many ways to go about it. I'd DM you to gloat when it happens, but i'll forget about you by the time next playtest comes.

[peak sand]

Meditate is necesarilly limited by the fact that there's just only so much time in a run, you can't be meditating the entire time

[frozen fjord]

Meditate is not the issue but it facilitates the issue

[hexed briar]

ayo man dont be getting mad at me now i love you bro i was just saying bro they need to add aliens is all

[long raft]

Wizard OP... Mentions meditate. 100% troll.

[granite plinth]

wizard invis should not hide the light being emitted from ignite that makes your weapon act like a torch

[safe nacelle]

@granite plinth Do you understand why I want a perk that buffs duel handed? Are you mentally gone or do you not understand this is a suggestion chat. How many RPG games do you see a duel wielding berserker? I want to be more VIABLE as a 2 handed guy. Furries smh.

[barren musk]

Guys how do you feel about the basi shop, i think more rolls should be introduced, blue/purple/orange with % of course, feels bad checking it every 30min. and the best you ever see is green, i understand looting mobs and players is a big thing, just wondering if more rng drops to the shop is a good or a bad thing in peoples eyes

[urban ginkgo]

What about having items with better rarities being highlighted in the rarity color

[reef cosmos]

Beside the barbarian nerf, have you guys realised it has become even harder now to kill the centaur without a ranger? And now you cant bodyblock it anymore. There is a certain spawn on the hell lvl where you spawn on the centaur room and you cant trick it, its the stairs room.
If you spawn there now after this patch RUN, you cant deal with it in that room.

[granite plinth]

@safe nacelle being a furry has nothing to do with dark and darker? when in this entire server did I ever mention being one? way to hate on a group of people and be toxic

[hexed briar]

damn why you gotta dog on yo pfp

[manic coral]

I definitely am in favor with them nerfing all forms of cheese, but they probably should implement blocking on weapons that are meant to have blocking before they do. Some classes / weapons are unable to dodge the attack patterns of mini-boss creatures, so blocking is mandatory to fight them without cheese.

But, it's an alpha so that's a sacrifice they were willing to make

[frozen fjord]

they need to make the wow classic change where if you attack a mob and it can't target you, it immediately teleports to your location :^)

[granite plinth]

the same reason you have an elf on your profile, why your name is an elf character in skyrim, because you like having it as your profile picture, being a furry isn't important enough for me to mention it, but because certain people are uncomfortable by a fictional character, they bring it up themselves in a conversation about a game that has nothing to do with it at all, and would never have ever been brought up if they hadnt said anything at all about it

[hexed briar]

an elf? bro thats nazeem from skyrim straight human aka redguard

[granite plinth]

The trading market is so cooked, people are selling items for way too much gold and that u dont even have sufficient space in ur trade inven to trade with them

[livid python]

Nerf Ranger :)

[granite plinth]

make it so that you buy arrows in the store, hold them in a quiver like gold in a bag, and make it so skeleton archers drop arrows, gives you a reason to seek them out if you are low on arrows, doesnt make sense for the archer to magically pull arrows out of his prison pocket over and over

[hexed briar]

ey man ima let you slide on that one CLEARLY you don't make it to the cloud district very often i aint tryna be mean big dawg

[livid python]

nah it needs a whole fucking overhaul, less damage output, not the ability of a self heal and a campfire that can basically full heal 3 people. not nearly infinite range compared to a wizard and so so much more

[frozen fjord]

why is this guy roleplaying nazeem in the suggestion discussion lmao

I personally believe every class should be about as strong as ranger is now. slightly worse maybe

[terse pivot]

Think people asking for ranger nerfs is just skill issue, and is playing their first playtest

[frozen beacon]

ranger player?

[hexed briar]

roleplay bro i aint to that shit last time i did my gf strapped me down and i am him

[safe nacelle]

Okay Khord Kitty

[granite plinth]

Sorry, I dont agree with rangers having unlimited arrows while mages have limited casts, where do all those arrows come from?

[paper musk]

Full of misinformation. Damage output is not hitscan on ranger like it is on some Wizard spells and all melee. Shot leading is required for all range dps from Ranger. The self heal skill is equal to 1 white potion. The starter kit campfire does not full heal even 1 player, let alone split amongst 3. It has an extremely short duration.

[long raft]

Good rangers don't even use the self heal yall just suck MASSIVELY 😂😂😂

OMG A RANGER KILLED ME
Is below level 20 in basic grey items... While ranger is usually rocking good gear.

[manic coral]

people are clowning on this but i'm pretty sure devs said they are going to add a mechanic that makes arrows non-infinite. It may be quivers and arrows, and it may be a flat number of arrows associated with bow types that only replenish at a campfire.

Infinite ranged ammo doesn't have a healthy place in this game, especially when ranged options are so incredibly strong in both PvE and PvP. Classes should be designed with hybrid play in mind. Wizards and rangers should both need to melee occasionally to conserve resources.

[terse pivot]

Cleric main

[hollow sentinel]

the ranger's "good gear" is a green longbow btw

[hexed briar]

bro you better relax thats alot to read i failed my senior year

[dense swan]

having 5 min cool downs on make suggestion is awful lol

[granite plinth]

wizards, limits casts, clerics, limited casts, rogue, limited throwing knives, barb, limited throwing axes

ranger: magic portal in his arse where arrows are made from the pit dankest dark places of purgatory

[manic coral]

My only response to this is that meditation needs to be limited as well but I know people are going to cry at me saying so.

[hexed briar]

ay man i was wondering how a furry eats a glizzy???

[paper musk]

Most of the opinions I see stated here are from clearly new players / low skill ceiling players who aren't going to stay long enough to get better and see the real beauty of the game, but they can cause a loud disturbance and potentially upset the nature of the game with nerfs before leaving and ruining a potentially legendary experience for everyone else who stays, learns, improves at the various mechanics and skill expression the game allows.

[hollow sentinel]

thematically how you gonna limit the amount of times a man can sit and think?

[tired osprey]

A bard class sounds nice and would be nice if they could get it right with the class wielding a melee weapon alongside and instrument of choice.

[terse pivot]

Wait if people asking are for limited ammo on ranger and that they are dieng too them, nothing changes even if they get nerfed. Buy lots of ammo.

[granite plinth]

I dont think meditation is the issue, I think the issue is that they can regain spells from resting at a campfire as well

[frozen fjord]

wizards should have a base chance to fall asleep while meditating

[manic coral]

The same way you limit fighter's second wind. It's a fantasy game, and meditation is not just 'thinking', it's magically recovering resources. Second Wind and other features like it replenish at quality enough campfires and meditation should as well, but meditation should not be a limitless resource.

[long raft]

Bro do you realise how much damage ANY class does with basic green gear? 😂

Go do high roller. Youll see a massive difference and often fighter/mage will rock your shit in seconds.

[hexed briar]

so were not gonna talk about the glizzy thing??? thats fine ok ok

[hollow sentinel]

👎

[dense swan]

suggestion bot broke damnb

[safe nacelle]

Why are people limiting numbers of spells or arrows people can use? THEIR WHOLE KIT IS USING THEM. Barb and Fighter loses their weapon after they hit 10 times.

[tired osprey]

In dungeons and dragons spells slots are recovered when resting at campsites so it makes sense it works in this game.

[frozen fjord]

How about making it so you can't meditate while enemies are nearby? how do you meditate in a stressful situation?

[hexed briar]

@paper musk man you gotta be crazy mf to think im gonna do anything you tell me to do

[granite plinth]

having an infinite amount of any resource is stupid, thats why lots of people want ranger and wizard nerfed, people are upset at thee ammount of arrows rangers has, the the fact wizard can rotate meditation with campfires to get spells back

[manic coral]

In DnD wizards have Arcane Recovery that only works once and is not recovered until a long rest... which is basically exactly what i'm saying.

[long raft]

It really is a bunch of casuals suicide running in grey items screaming NERF NERF and have no fucking idea how the game actually plays at higher skill tiers. Laughable.

Anyone saying nerf meditation needs to uninstall the game you have 0 fucking clue of the intricacies of the game.

Yog and Zip are actually clueless and not worth debating seriously.

[safe nacelle]

They should have infinite just not spammable. Quiver and meditation is fine. THIS COMES FROM A BARB MAIN.
Infinite like they can use it how much they want, but their inventory isn't infinite. They get their arrows and spells back is fair.

[hollow sentinel]

ranger arrow count is not the problem with rangers tbh

[tired osprey]

You guys use meditation as wizard? man you people are suicidal because that ability sucks unless you have got lots of time.

[granite plinth]

how so? if they are out of arrows, they're not doing any ranged dps

[safe nacelle]

Oh yeah so barb and fighter can have infinite damage, but mage and ranger shouldn't?

[long raft]

People crying about meditate and ranger self heal when at high roller you don't use either LMAO

[hollow sentinel]

it doesn't do anything to address the infinite potential for one taps that come with blue and better longbows, rangers aren't oppressive because of arrow spam

[terse pivot]

Solonius is right if they only change ammo your still gonna die in pvp either way it changes nothing. PvE is the main difference for resources.
Your not gonna fight the whole lobby.

[frozen fjord]

people definitely take meditate in high roller if you've been watching people play at all. I don't know about all the time but it happens

[livid python]

1. Ranger shouldn't deal as much damage as a melee character because they are ranged. 2. Wizard SHOULD deal more then ranger cause you have to rely on a resource that isn't infinite like their arrows. 3. its a 25 hp regen after 25 seconds that is infinite as well when Cleric only has 4 15-20 hp heals in total, sure it can be distributed but thats only 4 uses you do then also have the heals that give 35 but in the end that's outweighed by infinite healing. 4. leading? yeah sure you have to lead, as if that's not a normal thing in a game, it's not hard at all and the damage output from it outways that issue and that's why the damage is too strong, cause the price of using arrows is nothing. 5. Sure you may be right the campfire may not restore that much but it's still enough to were it entirely outways the heal of the cleric in the long run, especially if you're diving down more. All in all, ranger out does the survivability and longevity of a wizard but has equal to more dmg. Ranger has the healing strength of a Cleric. And a top all of that it has the damage output of melee characters, when you look at other games melee deals more than range cause you have to get up close? Ranger should deal half the amount it's already dealing, honestly infinite arrows WOULD be fine if it wasn't for the damage output. And another point, TECHNICALLY wizard has infinite spells but the speed is outdone by ranger. Also (if im not mistaken cause i could be easily) range has a build around camping, and pvp, when no other class encourages that from what I've seen, a ranger can hunker down with it's bear traps, campfires and infinite health regen and just camp for as long as they're allowed. This isn't some skill issue or anything like that, it's a simple issue that the stats of this class heavily out do everyone else on several levels.

[tired osprey]

I understand the utility but I personally prefer the options available using Intense Focus.

[thorny mulch]

Any suggestions on adding guilds and a guild leaderboards similar to the current leaderboards except summed up by guild members

[safe nacelle]

Problem with ranger is triple shot, headshot multiplier perk and long bow damage. When your full tank fighter gets 2 shot you know there is a problem.

[frozen fjord]

if you're looted well enough you don't even need intense focus. I'm not really even trying to argue against wizard I have no issues I'm just saying.

[long raft]

High roller boss clear a wizard is saved to nuke the boss/manticores.

Campfires used to restore ignite and arcane missile.
Ranger never takes self heal, potions are better as are bandages.

Sure, some people take those 2 skills but it actually makes you weaker. A good team plays ok your class strength and high roller wizard especially is the nuclear bomb you carry to the end.

[tired osprey]

I don't need it I use it for the joy of point blanc blasting goobers with magic missile.

[safe nacelle]

If your wizard is the only dps then you go mediate. If he isn't then there is no point. I have done high roller multiple times and I can tell you if you going cleric, fighter and wizard combo you usually go mediate.

[paper musk]

1. Not a valid argument. There's balance around being ranged to justify the current damage. 2. No. Both are burst ranged classes, one specializes in physical dmg the other magical. Think 'Rock Paper Scissors' 3 Its not infinite, the charges are limited based on your knowledge (2 -3 average usages) and it cant be buffed. Cleric heals can be buffed with perks and willpower and +healing gear. 4. Leading is a valid argument. Hitscan exists in other kits, such as Wizard's Zap. 5. Not a valid argument, see previous points.

[long raft]

Lmao you have no clue what the fuck you're talking about

[safe nacelle]

Only thing I want is speedy barb with duel wielding :(

[thorny mulch]

Classes being ranged has little advantage if theirs no place to shoot people afar, the castle is very much close up, with a couple rooms you can take advantage of it. More times then not I’m getting 1 hit in the head by a fighter / barb or have a rogue so close to me stabbing I can’t hit them with arrows

[toxic forge]

pretty sure ranger spear does more damage and has better attack animations than every other melee class

[frozen fjord]

ok but no hp, and fighters can use them as well

rangers get melee bonuses for spears in the spear perk lmao. yall play this game right?

[naive gale]

Put it to invite players from certain regions, and not all because I don't find players from my region to invite, and also put it to be able to ask to join groups and not just invite them

[safe nacelle]

Ranger has no bonuses for melee weapons. They get outmatched by everyone.... Cleric beats ranger with a mace

[tired osprey]

I just realised the irony of the fact that in this game ranger is considered strong while the original ranger in current dungeons and dragons sucks real bad.

[terse pivot]

If I spend 10 seconds too buff up and slowly walk up to u hell yeah a cleric should win. Give the fucking dude who gets no action some fun.

Div strike on multishot is instant death on any1 with full legendary gear.

[long raft]

We get 10str on polearms but they're the second slowest weapon in game and leave us wide open for counter attacks.

[safe nacelle]

The point is ranger IS A RANGER. Cleric should beat people with their smite and buffs.

[toxic forge]

10 str is a lot, spears have really good reach and are easy to hit

[valid mica]

It has pretty good reach for a melee weapon, and you can utilize your traps to hold enemies in place though.

[long raft]

As cleric main. Lol what? Literally just bless up and block with your shield dude. Have you heard of bind? With bless its around 1.5second snare and that rangers dead 😂😂😂

Just going to add. Losing to ranger as cleric is 100% skill issue. Drunken cleric with mace and shield can 1-2 shot ANY Class in game

[thorny mulch]

Traps? What are we sitting in a room acting like theirs not a circle coming?

[paper musk]

The problem here is that the arguments currently fielded against or for Spears are from the perspective of area 2 where the tight corridors lend to a better playstyle for it usually. It's not the same in 1 for example, a much larger open area where the benefits are quickly diminished for it, imho.

[valid mica]

There is time. I have time to place many traps during a match.

[terse pivot]

I use bless for 3s bro, bind forces bad positioning.
Expect good teams to get peeled.

[long raft]

Bless + beer + weapon buff is around a 20strength bonus plus a raw 10-20 weapon damage on top... Add a wizards ignite and cleric is terrifying lmao

Sorry but clearly so many of you have played 1 class and have 0 clue of the synergy certain compositions.

If you're running solo it's MEANT to be fucking hard.

[hazy cobalt]

Let's be honest, if every player is playing 100% perfect whoever has a cleric should always win

[toxic forge]

this is pretty fun way to play but feels really bad since there''s only like 7-9 sec window for the buffs

[frozen fjord]

yeah buff the cleric buffs :^)

[long raft]

Use a book. Not a staff. Cast takes 0.5 seconds or so. Most buffs last 20seconds. Bless increases duration of other buffs too.

Cleric is literally ranger counter so people saying they can't kill one is a skill issue.

[safe nacelle]

I thought rogue was ranger counter?

[hazy cobalt]

Book is such a good/fast spell casting focus, it blows my mind that people actually use the staff

[long raft]

Rogue vs ranger is entirely dependant on who gets the jump on who. A prepared ranger with trap will gut a rogue. A rogue who actually ambushes a ranger will kill them in 2 - 3 hits.

Im not talking babies first dungeon. I'm talking high roller, level 20 and geared. It's an entirely different game.

[livid python]

Whats the balance around being ranged? that you need to scratch your balls to get back all your ammo and just go back to out performing everyone? im not talking about damage for wizard compared to ranger im talking about wizard in general. It being based off of your knowledge makes 0 sense cause you can't just say that timmy over here used an infinite healing ability twice in a possibly half an hourish game. It's a 25 second cooldown, thats 2 uses a minute, the fact it cant be buffed doesn't matter cause clerics buff is 5-10 extra health on a 5 25hp heal and 5 40hp overall, but guess what! that'd be clerics entire build! around healing! but ranger can just press a button twice a minute and outdo it inevitably. Now when we look at ranger for pvp it gets even worse cause now you have the ability to basically just pin someone down with traps and constantly apply pressure with infinite arrows. And with leading and hitscan, you're implying it's hard to do? no, no it's literally not at all, i feel like you don't even know what hitscan means, hitscan is when the imediate press of a button something is inflicted, who does that? cause last i checked wizard has charge time which isn't a hitscan and melee is melee... not hitscan dude. Even then! If you pick the wizard option of if I'm not wrong 0 charge time it's still not even hitscan and then you lose your ability to regen spells, so ranger just out performs there too.

[toxic forge]

then you subtract the time you spend chasing people and it's pretty much gone

[safe nacelle]

High roller rogues are pretty good tho. I have seen them kill people then invis away.

[oak quartz]

#d-and-d-suggestions message

man, what do you guys have against the holidays?

[remote granite]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_UaA6obYJI&ab_channel=AimJunkiesGrev

Please ADD ASAP an AntiCheat or this game will remain like Rust at his worst state with aimbotter wallhacker speedhacker since it's player's loot based game.

[terse pivot]

Yeah most sweats don't push full buffed teams they hold position and fall back trade.

[hazy cobalt]

i think its more about visual clarity

[paper musk]

This is so comically wrong I am not wasting my time or energy pointing out how bad this makes you look at the game or debating.

[long raft]

Running with book has 0 penalty on speed.

Again. Gear is a huge factor.
A mixture of plate and light to provide good movement is important.

Unless its a mage you can literally just shield run someone while blessing protection or chug a potion and they're fucked.

[white kestrel]

I didnt even know what point he was trying to make xD

[livid python]

cool you're gonna leave it at that, nice to see you can't back up your claims, take care

[long raft]

I beg people. Spend at least 10 hours doing high roller with a good team.

Stop basing opinions on normal dungeons.

[toxic forge]

most others wont be wearing slower armor than you so you can be kited

[oak quartz]

they are part of the game though.

[hazy cobalt]

instructions unclear, went into highroller with lvl 1's, lost purple gear

[frozen fjord]

this is the ranger people are talking about when they say nerf ranger lmao

[long raft]

Yes which in turn its a skill issue.

If your enemy out speeds you why are you chasing? Why isn't a team mate flanking?

Sometimes the best tactic is to retreat, reform and re think. Not just bumrush.

E. G a Cleric, fighter and ranger vs barb, rogue wizard ***' team. You're out matched with range and speed. So you turtle with shields and have your ranger try pelt them.

Its literally a skill issue.

[toxic forge]

the entire point is in a vacuum, you can just be kited once you get your buffs up indefinately, no one talking about teams as that drastically changes everything

[safe nacelle]

I dont understand why they keep nerfing barb and not giving him anything back. I get it the fear was 2 good, but it was his only viable skill for 3 man. Just delete the class and bring berserker or something.

[reef cosmos]

how are we killing the centaur with the new nerfs?

[long raft]

Its a team play game. Ofcourse were talking teams.

You do NOT balance on solo untill a solo only queue is implemented.

Solo cleric is entirely different playstyle and I'd say most players can't handle that shit.

[livid python]

the statement of ranger needing a nerf has nothing to do with skill and teamwork, fair yes teamwork can make a difference but stats matter too. And if the balance of ranger is lEaDiNg then fuck me I guess You balance off of how the game can be played, that being solo or in a team.

[long raft]

No good team pvp game balances of solo play lol.

[safe nacelle]

Cycle did and see where they are now

[toxic forge]

your initial point was that you can gear to get around movement speed, that is also irrelevant when it comes to teams which you brought after that initial point. You're saying you can gear to be able to chase people but then you're saying movement speed is irrelevant because of teammates which is inconsistent

[white kestrel]

you guys really think ranger needs a nerf? xD

[oak quartz]

tbh i am so glad the devs mostly dont listen to this discord

[turbid pike]

Yes

[safe nacelle]

They did listen to me. Start of the test I said they should reduce the slow of each melee attack you did. Barb was useless bc of the 2h slow.

[long raft]

I said dependant on what type of cleric you play, you shouldn't be chasing at all.

If you want an aggresive cleric play thay can catch people run all light armor with +movement and you will literally evicersate anyone.

I play solo cleric. I often play it naked or with light armor only and I absolutely wreck everyone with beer and warhammer + book. You don't get outrun, you can bind them constantly and if you only need a campfire or 2 to make it viable.

[livid python]

it's not a team game, it's a game that can be played with up to 3. There's a difference here, unless devs said that "hey play with 3 cause it'll be only 3 at some point for the best experience." but I've not seen that.

[smoky timber]

game literally suggest you to get buddies when you try to solo queue lol

[hazy cobalt]

devs have literally said that they are balancing around 3 mans

from #❓faq

Is a Solo Queue going to be implemented in the future?

• We will need to test it first. We may make these tests public in future playtests to help us collect data. We will make our decision after these tests. Please note that the original game was balanced and designed around mostly party play so any solo-queue mode may be heavily imbalanced.

[long raft]

Not a team game? Jesus christ you literally aren't even worth a reply.

You obviously through your replies have 0 clue at all as even the Devs has stated its a team play game and they're balancing off that.

Solo play is there as a challenge. Not as a preffered method of play.

They will impliment matchmaking so that even people with 0 friends get a group and it'll stop a lot this nonsense people spout.

[livid python]

See I didn't know that the plan is a 3 team only. Currently you can play solo which would imply balance around that yah know? And to the comment from @smoky timber sure it may suggest that but that's different from being able to only queue for 3 if that makes sense?

[toxic forge]

you can't outspeed people though, other classes are straight up faster, just remove armor and easy kiting

[long raft]

Only a rogue will outrun a light geared cleric. Bless gives a movement speed buff through agility gain.

Again. Gear is an issue. You should be giving yourself + attitude + movement if you want to be able to chase.

[hazy cobalt]

or just realize that a rogue isnt gonna have any gear you care about as a cleric, and just go the other way.

also a game knowledge issue

[azure walrus]

so random thought idk what classes are planned but making a type of and i quote "death knight, necromancer, dark based magic or power house classes would be a cool way to interact with the dungeons so long as done properly

[long raft]

Exactly YOU DON'T KNOW.

Stop giving shit uninformed takes and educate yourself on the game for fuck sake.

So many people here are crying when they have played a couple of hours lmao.

@toxic forge i just have to agree to disagree. We've both obviously played a lot of cleric and experienced different outcomes and that's just how the game works.

I personally don't experience a bad chase cause I always run bind.

[hollow sentinel]

solo queue would be too easy ngl

[spring nymph]

i've been playing solo and enjoy it only a handful of games and got out twice died 20-30 times easy ##

[toxic forge]

even with bless every other class's agility is double of yours

[white kestrel]

I've been playing solo for the last 3 days shits great xD

[livid python]

"Jesus christ you literally aren't even worth a reply." -You. And you responded to me not even talking to you~ :)

[long raft]

I replied cause you're talking utter fucking nonsense.

[native copper]

now try team! Its way way better

[next lake]

Bruh chill lol

[spring nymph]

found ranger is a good solo class with traps makes it easier. Tried rouge but couldnt get away with it

[toxic forge]

it's just a discussion, it's better off having a good conversation than just insults and hostility, you're never going to get through him like that. That's the point of a discussion, right? so please more civil

[long raft]

Sorry but he comes in here crying bloody murder and then says it's not a team game lol wtf?? Then says "oh I didn't know" and wonders why people are telling him to shut up.

Suggestion : know what you're talking about before giving unformed takes.

@toxic forge yeah I know but literally so tired of people with 0 clue of how the game works or what the Devs have actually said is their vision coming in and spouting utter nonsense. Defending it to the ends of the earth then goinf"lol didn't know" despite being told

[white kestrel]

I play teams like once a night I dont know anyone whos enjoying the game as much as me xD @spring nymph and yeah ranger is insane for solo but I love rogue with the free lock picks for pve runs and just all the other options for pvp runs its great :D

[livid python]

Thanks for the compliment ❤️ . I hope you do know I'm talking exclusively of stats and not how a team needs to play around it? Yeah sure you can play around it and do certain things. But that's not the issue, it's inherently stats that are, and that's what i've been talking about my guy. I wasn't crying but you seem to be rather riled up, good to see you care bout your game :D

[long raft]

Anyway I have to go. Babysnake I did enjoy the discussion cause I do see how it can happen and why but I've personally not experienced it.

If cleric needs a buff it is just to bind. 0.75 seconds is tripe. It gets a little extra with bless but not enough. 1 second standard would fix a lot of issues

[toxic forge]

it's better to take a break from discussing until you can get more patience or calmly express your points and talk through to them. Even outlandish ignorant opinions are valid and worth considering.
Bind is too short, though I feel like in a lot of team scenarios it's best to buff barbarian or other chargers and have them go in. Though in smaller team comps or no melee/solo it can be used

[long raft]

Not when they directly go against the Devs vision and statements. That's just pure ignorance.

[timid lily]

Devs vision isn't always what's best for the game from a playability stand-point, a lot of game devs have ruined their initially successful game through bad design and not listening to their fan base.

[livid python]

I mean... look at Darktide lol

[toxic forge]

I'm mostly afraid gear creep will kill the game due to how good the better gear is

[long raft]

That's a valid concern. Genuinely going now. Ty for chat.

[spring nymph]

wey games patching so we can just go an play in ab it

[opaque crane]

suggestion 1: take the circle and down portals out completely make escaping a different experience the darker you go lvl 1 could be portals back to town or entrances to a crypt (lvl2). floor 2 can have teleport platforms around the map that will take you out or you can have the 3 pieces of the key to the gates of hell to open the gates and enter the next floor.(there should be more than 1 gate to hell on the map bc well extract camping is a thing) and in hell you have to complete a couple tasks to open the gates to slay the end boss. make maps 3 tier or 4 tier and then move on to another set of 3,4 or 5 tier maps. but i think the timer for maps will be more enjoyed than anything else. it will also spread out the players from bad to good if the better players always have a goal in mind like they brought in the 3 pieces to open hell so they dont want to risk anything they will head straight there. these are all just examples of course.

[timid lily]

They should stay true to their vision, I agree, how many players they bleed along the way is a totally different conversation.

[hazy cobalt]

I wouldn't mind "seasons" with seasonal resets

[spring nymph]

same as alot of these games tho you are either geared or not, just like tarkov

[opaque crane]

suggestion 2: why waste time on making more character models and classes when a ranger could just spec into druid and so on.

[toxic forge]

High roller and other mechanics like those aren't very ideal long term as it fragments the playerbase and having everyone play against each other has massive balance issues for new players vs players with 2-3+months progress. Even with wipes it still isn't enough. Tarkov at least you can one tap regardless of state in the game, even low tier ammo can kill depending on where you aim, so skill always wins

[spring nymph]

could just have merged classes once 2 have got to 20 ie ranger wizard unlocks druid or something

[terse pivot]

I think many can agree the idea of high roller would make the game more enjoyable but the way it was Implemented doesn't seem what most of us expected.

People still come in with trash gear.

[opaque crane]

suggestion 3: Let us spend spell points on the same spell if we want for example if cleric wants to bring in 15 small heals bc he has 15 spell capacity and so on. (obviously small heal could take up more points than just one)

[timber herald]

^ based suggestion

[timid lily]

I think a wipe system would be better than not having a wipe system, if not for a week or two the playing field would be almost even. The guy who mentioned the level playing field with Tarkov is correct, this game is different in the sense that gear helps you tank damage without an opportunity for a well placed one tap (unless you're a filthy mage get 1 tapped scrub). I think a form of Skill based matchmaking would be helpful but instead of basing it on skill perhaps put certain gear brackets together, IE worse geared characters are put in games with similarly geared characters, although I don't know how big the playerbase is right now and I'm unsure if there would be enough players to make it a reality. Maybe it would have to be char level orientated to make it more possible as I'm not a game dev and couldn't begin to fathom what would work and what wouldn't from a technical standpoint.

[hazy cobalt]

"gear scoring" system would make it easy enough to implement this suggestion

[toxic forge]

the main problem with a system like that as is, is that later into a wipe people would all play high roller and the other lobbies would rot without anyone playing them, or just people going there to stomp on badly geared players. I think there should be more of an approach to sidegrades and unique effects rather than just stat boosting, same as weapons, have some weapon types that are rare. matchmaking based on gear is also counter productive to the whole extraction shooter genre as a big value of this genre is the ability to fight off and kill people with better gear and getting the satisfaction of getting massive progression done due to your skill

[opaque crane]

this argument has been proven correct in every looter extract there is always a group of people that dont want wipes but the game always gives in to wipes bc its just plain the best way to do it. Not to mention TONS of gamers hype on wipe days tarkov hits its peeks every wipe day.

[timid lily]

Because the game becomes increasingly stale for people who play the game to progress and often hit the level cap or get bored because they have nothing ot progress towards but people who don't have the time to get to end game just never have the "need" for a wipe. Overall I think it's better for both parties, in the sense of keeping the game fresh and removing the high tier gear that freshies will come up against almost every game if they start later than most. The ONLY way of combating this is "seasons" with an inventory reset or full wipes

[toxic forge]

Wipes are essential but the question is that having gear matter so much makes getting in mid wipe impossible and falling behind painful, in a sense it's severely anti casual

[opaque crane]

honestly i think people are just going to have to accept the fact that it comes with the territory of the genre.

[terse pivot]

Oh I agree with the last statement, but I think pubstomping will happen no matter what they do in any que. But atleast this way it separates the people who don't want to pubstomp ungeared vs the people who do.

[toxic forge]

Yeah but it can be mitigated, I think tarkov works around it pretty well. It's not perfect but it works well enough. The Cycle: Frontier probably is where it is now due to not only the cheaters but also due to how the gear scales.

[opaque crane]

i honestly cant say anthing positive about the cycle i loathed that game. lol its an example for every company that wants a looter extract game of what NOT to do IMO.

[toxic forge]

It was decent but it felt that better gear gave an overwhelming advantage and once you spent a week playing something else there was no reason to go back there, why would you? to get shit on?

[timber herald]

Perhaps balance PvP damage and PvE damage differently. What I mean is resistances like magic and phys damage resist are very meaningful in PvE but very minor in PvP so that top level builds are based on stats like movement speed, spell cast speed, attack speed, spell effectiveness and potency, etc which are all RNG stats and get better the rarer the gear. This way geared players arent just tanks, but instead have unique attributes about the build that have strengths and weaknesses. Like how destiny gear kinda works

[vague thorn]

Does the green/blue framing in the #d-and-d-suggestions have any meaning?

[toxic forge]

The circle while not completely being a problem in itself makes this a bigger problem as well as people can't just stick to the bad loot zones to make some change to progress, they are forced to fight to the death with pretty much everyone else that very likely have way better gear a couple of months on

[indigo dagger]

lfg africa

[opaque crane]

I think most of the community wants that circle gone i havent heard one positive thing about it.

[timber herald]

Thats why im a circle removal advocate. Extraction games arent BRs. Not everyone has to die, and winning isnt defined by being last alive. Its defined by survival.

[toxic forge]

Yeah, it doesn't' feel right the most intense moment, the end where people are killing each other being the least rewarding one since you can't even loot anyone and will probably die cuz the final area just closed. Also extremely painful when the area closes on the maze, most my deaths are there due to no exit 💀

[opaque crane]

I had a suggestion for this at 4:44 am you should read.

[cursive swift]

PLease stop nerfing barb

[toxic forge]

I made this exact point of making the game less gear heavy and was overwhelmingly downvoted, I guess the majority prefers being it more gear centric as to skill centric

[cursive swift]

if its only skill then whats the point of the gear system? plus we have seen people kill purple geared folk while wearing green gear. but honestly if you have no skill and are just geared..youre dead. and there is so many situations where you can just die while being heavily geared

[toxic forge]

I'm saying it be more skill centric, gear can exist but probably in a more horizontal level (unique sidegrades) instead of just vertical upgrades. The difference between bad gear and good gear with good rolls is too big, like it's at least twice as much damage, the difference of skill would have to be insane in order for the better player to lose.

[modest whale]

rangers feel your pain 😔

[cursive swift]

lmao you are barbs pain

[timber herald]

That wont last. It shouldnt only matter what discord hivemind thinka because im sure the cycle discord hivemind feel the same way and that game is where it is. Its casual playerbase got fucked.

To respond to bonzetty, skill should matter MOST. Thats what we want. Right now, gear vastly outweighs skill. The way to balance that in a game like this is make gear strong based on supporting stats like % increase of base stats and increase of character stats, not raw tankyness. Armor rating and magic resist should only significantly matter in PvE while top level PvP gear will increase things like crit chance, movement speed, spell potency and effectiveness. This way people are rewarded for adhering to their characters strengths, not braindead tanky "I have more HP and armor, I win" bullshit

[modest whale]

listennnnnnnnnnnn man we are just misunderstood thats all offer a hug and a gold cup to us and we are like dogs, loyal to the end

[cursive swift]

i agree with this for the most part. im just nit picking one part here. so you want people to choose between going into a dungeon with pve gear or pvp gear? i ask this question so i can better understand

[toxic forge]

Once you play vs a legendary geared squad as a white/green you understand that even if you hit them, you do no damage compared to them. It's very jarring how some classes like wizard go from very weak (like everyone was complaining day 1 of the playtest) to absolutely broken with missiles doing 40-50 damage each and casting all missiles in 0.2secs

[opaque crane]

I would bet the nerfs on rangers has far exceeded the nerf on barbs if you count the ai changes they made to make it harder for rangers to hit normal ai.

[toxic forge]

tbh the main problem with pve are ranged classes as you can just cheese. Some mobs need additional mechanics if they are being cheesed, like the centaur being able to summon a gargoyle or have a situational ranged attack of some sorts. Cheesing eliminates all skill from pve combat that melees have to learn such as attack patterns and timings

[timber herald]

So PvP gear and PvE gear wouldnt be different. What I meant was this.

Lets say you have a set of green armor. Your armor stat and magic resist makes you tanky against PvE but shouldnt matter much in PvP. The stats thatd matter in PvP would be the RnG stats that get better with gear rarity that boost attributes, attack speed, movement speed, etc

[cursive swift]

yeah thats true. i have to agree on that.... and to respond to @opaque crane THIS IS JUST MY SUPER HOT TAKE OPINION...that is insignificant. its just pve stuff. im more so refering to the pvp side of things. theyve also received nerfs and are still as strong as they are

[modest whale]

idk, the nerfs to rangers hurt my soul but im sure its only a slight bump, im sure rangers will get some kind of buff later down the line, for now we just have to play the hand we are given

[opaque crane]

cheesing is getting progressively harder they fixed a lot of the cheeses including the doorway cheese the mob will now randomly aggro to the person crouching in the doorway.

[sturdy spear]

bardui is stupid confirmed

@wise ermine can you clarify why it's good to have a 2.6% magical interaction buff on a rare zweihander?

[wise ermine]

I misunderstood since your recent suggesting was missing some context. 🤔

[sturdy spear]

oh that's okay then

[unique roost]

Proximity chat is needed

[balmy wedge]

necromancer class? ability to sire a mob

Lvl 20+ Only (Barb Taken) LFG HIgh-Rolla https://discord.com/channels/988365908009447485/1052832849050480661

[sturdy spear]

that summon would have to be like a bat or a spider or else it would be too strong to deal with

[prisma tree]

Proximity chat would be a role players dream in dark and darker

[sturdy spear]

stream sniping would be so fun with proximity chat it should definitely be added

[high widget]

Is there some sort of idea to take all of these suggestions and distill them into a "final form?"

I see a lot of the same repeated suggestions and it would be pretty cool to see a "Here's the one's we'd like to try out in the next playtest" type of voting thing.

(I know that's a butt-ton of data to cipher through, but just wondering)

[twin wadi]

The system they use automatically sends the highly upvoted suggestions to the devs (indicated by a green bar on the left)

[modest whale]

allow magic casters like cleric and mage to seal spider vases to prevent them from spawning for a set amount of time, getting ganged up on by spiders is insanely frustrating especially once you clear a room realizing it'll never be fully clear, if you get backed into a room with spider spawns go ahead and be picking out what shoes you want in your casket lol

Thoughts on this idea?

[toxic forge]

no point since you can just destroy them? If you have range to cast that you probably also have range to cast some offensive spell and destroy it except for cleric i guess

[twin wadi]

you can just break the pot to stop them from spawning
in case you don't know, you should be breaking all pots because they have a chance to drop potions

[modest whale]

You can destroy them!? Oh my God 🤦 I was told you cant! This is absolutely a game changer lol

[rotund bramble]

should have a quick sell function for treasure and such

[signal vine]

#d-and-d-suggestions message <-- This 👍

[strange drift]

is there any chance this game will be early access and stay live until launch ? cuz i just made my friends play and its ending in 3 days 🥲

[gray sable]

I wish there was a system like friend list. And I can't use "mongko" in my nickname, why is that...?

[regal shale]

What about a system that grants rewards for killing rankers over 100? And this bounty is given differently according to rank of ranker.

[vivid ember]

Also contain treasure

[mystic charm]

Does + additional magic damage work on a bow?

[slate tartan]

Pretty certain bow is physical damage

[severe oasis]

extended playtest mr admins sir

[tardy fossil]

make the spawns points more livable

[idle bridge]

@surreal ridge Would you say the dark swarm timers are good?

[surreal bone]

Any clerics think maybe more spell variety would be fun for the class? Maybe a 1 charge group heal (longer cast) maybe a projectile spell would be cool? (3 charges)

[warped quarry]

Successful block really needs to add a slight penalty to attackers next attack.....

[quiet marten]

#d-and-d-suggestions message
how about singular inventory?

[coral acorn]

Why'd they put archers/bows in the game if they were gonna make them useless?

[sterile quartz]

Am I dumb is mining just super not even close to worth?
Costs 25G per pickaxe. In turn spending 25G per death.
Takes a Nutty amount of ores to make anything, in turn likely spending a LOT of gold buying pickaxes to reach enough ores.

Not to mention you sorta need to sprint around the map checking all ore spots... Which makes death extra likely as you WILL run into teams doing that.

It seems it will always be more worth to just buy purples from players than making the ore armor. As you can get good purples for 300G or less (Cheaper than all the pickaxes you'll need. Far far far cheaper in time. That's 1 or 2 runs of low profit to just buy a purple (If you don't find one))

Borko-Sama - Rangers are the strongest class imo.

Thought I'd try it for the last few days to see how much mining armor I could make. Just hard focusing on only that -
But maaan it's just not worth.

[granite plinth]

Rangers are useless now. Rogues reign supreme gg. Look at the leaderboard and tell me why rangers were nerfed

[coral acorn]

They nerfed the draw time, then they nerfed the accuracy, then the servers stopped registering your arrows timing/hitbox/flightpath, then nerfed the damage for a bow you need to buy or find and now you are unable to 1v1 any of the other classes. Only thing they got goin for them is the traps, which were nerfed 😦

[latent flower]

Is it allowed to make multiple suggestions in 1 post? I have several suggestions I wanna make so should I just post them all individually?

[sterile quartz]

Ye probably. As people react to the ones they like. Should make them separate

[latent flower]

@coral acorn I dunno how old these nerfs are and I haven't played ranger in 2 days, but when I did I achieved more as ranger in 2 hours than I did as rogue in 2 days (while learning the game). I played solo. With a little bit of gear, ranger is able to oneshot headshot most classes or all classes if they're already injured, you just have to wait for them to stand still while interacting with something. He also has traps which are great for survivability, best starting gear and access to spear.

[umbral elm]

I would probably still successfully escape on my ranger 9/10 times if im running longbow/spear

[warped gulch]

whats with the voip hate

[torpid quiver]

what is a voip? would like to join that discussion

[latent flower]

@elder vessel If you're feeling slow on Barb, play with a Wizard, they can haste you with no penalty. If you only play solo know that Barb is probably the weakest solo character

[torpid quiver]

why doe sno one like mele wizards :*( tehyr clearly somewhat intended to work and of cause should be balanced but there are melee magic weapons and even ignite also AR increase and passively proccing shield in perks so its somewhat intended but it is unplayable and way too weak

[elder vessel]

nah ment as skill

[latent flower]

@elder vessel But he already has the +move speed +str skill

[torpid quiver]

That#

[coral acorn]

@warped gulch voip w/out regionlock can be used to abuse ping

[torpid quiver]

#d-and-d-suggestions message That would just make it ALOT harder for soloplayers because tehy cant steal teh portals the agme is still not about a deathmatch and rather about getting out with loot

[lost raven]

they can steal if fast enough, but would you rather fight a trio at every portal they open or u rather run to a portal when there's only 1 person? and still have a chance on surviving. i mean i've had plenty of moments where a player opened a portal and i was able to steal it from them while they were guarding it

[spark mountain]

How have they still not dialed back the time for each game?

[torpid quiver]

if they move to the next portal to open it they either need to defend the palyer whos opening or go into the portal to secure tehyr escape and leave 2 or 1 behind

[dull glen]

because they oneshot with the right gear

[rose sandal]

They have stated many times, they are making their game Non Solo friendly. They want teams together, there intentions are not for solo play

[torpid quiver]

how do melee wizards oneshot? and if tehy do teh scaling JUST got scaled down and the base power should be increased while lowering teh scaling, it would make wizard somewhat solo viable after all even with defensive perks im also a oneshot

[lost raven]

yea.. that's probs why they are still trying to adjust things so it's abit less harsh on solos

[rose sandal]

It’s an alpha play test, they are trying to balance out the game so everyone can enjoy it at the moment. Wether it be for a solo player or a group. But also in that same sentence. I have not seen a single thing that would benefit me as an archer in every single hot fix that has came out. Nothing but nerfs for the archer, and I’m solo most of the time. If anything nerfing my arrows against bosses, nerfing my longbow damage, nerfing my true physical damage.
You can see it how you’d like. But I don’t see much going towards “a bit less harsh on solos”

[lost raven]

i see that, but archer is atm 1 of the best solo classes IMO. i do get what you're saying, but like i said, what every they change to make it easier for solos, they make it even easier for Trios. They Nerf bown because they are OP in Trios, but yet you are Nerfing the solo archer even more... XD

[dull glen]

stack + magic damage, equip crystal sword, ignite haste invis and go oneshot anyone

[latent flower]

At the end of the day, right now the game is designed to be played in a group. Solo is harder but doable. I saw someone say that in the future there might be a way to join games in a random 3 man group, separate from 3 man premade parties on Discord and stuff. It might be a good middle ground, there might even be solo que.

[rose sandal]

I understand exactly where you’re coming from. And all in all, with how the game is right now. (As a team) it’s pretty freaking fun regardless of a few problems here and there

[lost raven]

Agreed 🙂 i still love the game as a solo though, wiping trios and duos once in a while. just not playing as much cuz i dont wanna get burned out before release lmao

[carmine current]

what does the suggestions being highlighted green mean in #d-and-d-suggestions

[rose sandal]

I think they said there will never be a solo que, but please don’t quote me on that

[warped quarry]

I believe I heard same, and I am okay with that

[torpid quiver]

playing in a group should be the strongest thing and THE route to chose, doesnt mean that ppl shouldnt be able to survive solo or that changes towards that end of solo working are wrong

[north snow]

Tavern used as a Hub

[surreal ridge]

Of course; I dont see any issues with the timers of which they close on the first stage. However when you go down to hell that dark swarm timer is VERY VERY quick which isnt necessary a bad thing. Its just that not many people go down i feel like therefor when only 1 team goes down and your in a room of 20 mobs its Very Hard to kill all those mobs and move on in the given time.

[zealous cedar]

Remove moving while being invisible, you cant do ANYTHING when a rogue appears next to you and starts stabbing you

[rich grove]

Id suggest making a discord server for each region so it does not lag and there is space for people to join a channel.

[zealous phoenix]

DO NOT ADD DURABILITY TO THE GAME. It's good the way it is..... please.

[hazy nimbus]

dont get near rogues lol

[wraith gulch]

You can die peacefully

[zealous cedar]

they get near me lol you cant do shit about them

[white cliff]

Durability and weight are things that are coming soon.

[willow condor]

Rogues have to perk to be able to slightly move while hiding, they really can't move far at all. while wizards can clear a lot of distance with their invis.

If anything needs to be done, the invis spell needs to be brought in line with what the rogues can do perked.

[surreal ridge]

Thats a good idea actually.

[hazy nimbus]

oh. welp. time to find another game

I dont mind durability if you can pay to maintain and repair a weapon/gear (more expensive the higher rarity)
but for fuck sakes if we have BOTW type of durability I will fucking quit

[zealous cedar]

10/9 times i die to rogues appearing from nothing and you cant do anything about it only if they have MUCH worse gear

[winter nova]

im so tired of starting a match and having 3 players with full gear armor and potions run at me to steal my campfire. i just started tossing it. when i play mage, they steal my protect potion. 3 vs 1 in random isnt fun

[rain wraith]

need voip system

[zealous cedar]

or if anyone can tell me a way how to counter rogue im curious

[echo bobcat]

be in a three man, never push anything, always focus rogue first, shoot him at range, have your headphones cranked to 300 decibles so you can hear footsteps or if he's moving while invis. Hope they die against AI because that's their only weakness. hope that helps kekw.

[zealous cedar]

lmao

[open quarry]

Have a barb with fear and max health shout hold your pocket

[dull glen]

yeah sick lets turn it into another Tarkov - why not add inertia while they are at it

[unborn pond]

weight is alright durability is ridiculous

[golden path]

Bro, I see some good suggestions and people are immediately "No quick PvP, no interest 🤓"

[white cliff]

Oh I think it’s a horrible idea I’m just saying the mechanics are already there.

[carmine current]

@mossy kiln #d-and-d-suggestions message
You are wrong if you step on a trap you have to look down and open the trap off your leg. its not permanent. generally if you walk onto their trap they can hit you with 1-2 arrows before you undo it.

[harsh wedge]

TRADER SWITCHER HOTKEYS FEATURE PLEASE

[grand wagon]

Multishot.

Longbow.

Goodbye.

[carmine current]

@open quarry there is never a reason to take the max hp shout. its not ever worth it over rage or fear. the fear saves you hp against ranged mobs and other stuff in pve and for pvp it makes enemies do 20% less damage overall. where as the 25% hp isnt even coded properly to be 25% its only 20%. Since barb has 130 hp and it only brings his hp to 163. on top of that the damage you take during it doesnt mean you get free hp. when you take 20% damage from a hit at 163 and go to 131, when it wears off you will be at 80% hp of the 130 being 104. though if you use the fear you would get the exact same damage reduced. since if the hit were to bring you from 163 to 131 then it does 32 damage but using fear will reduce that by 20% and bring it down to 26 damage. meaning 130-26=104. Also strength is 1% hp per 1 strength rage gives you 15 strength so it gives you 15% physical damage, 15% max hp, 15% move speed and 20% increased physical damage taken (from the -armor you get).

[carmine current]

@grand wagon you can still crouch dodge headshits and turn your characters head backwords by looking the opposite direction and looking down. fighter and barb cant be killed with 3 body shots from a non amazing long bow (2 flat damage rolls added).

[open quarry]

I totally agree bad skill; just was a response to keep a squishy teammate alive when a rogue is on them less damage and the fight prob won’t last more than 7sec

[cinder fern]

@indigo girder they already have. Most barbarian weapons can hit multiple targets at once

[small tendon]

wait it doesnt even give you extra hp to cheese something like a rez shrine? what a godawful skill, absolutely useless lmao

[open quarry]

Ya even used at max hp you stay at w/e the percentage of you hp is

[carmine current]

@small tendon yep i did tons of testing the other day with the barb and fighter. the only skills on barb worth anything are fear and rage. for passives you should only take smash, 10 damage to axes, damage with 2 handed, and damage not wearing chest if you dont have a good one and damage based on your hp% if you have a good chest.

[open quarry]

Smash should be baked into barbs base kit

[crimson flax]

people who say skeletons shouldnt bleed when they learn their bones have blood inside

[carmine current]

and if it were to be cheesable like that then barb would make his entire party never take damage to pve mobs. which would be to op.

[small tendon]

no extra damage to your next hit for 1hko donk cheese?

meanwhile anyone with a shield and/or ranged skills can already take no dmg from pve mobs lolololol, compared to maybe tanking an extra hit per encounter?

[royal ice]

Do you think we could get class specific rooms added to discord for deeper and easier to find discussion pertaining to each class?

[carmine current]

@small tendon that makes you do damage through 70% of the enemies damage reduction stat. so if you have 10% damage reduction it makes you ignore 7% of that damage resistance. so if you were to do 100 damage in a hit that would give you 107 damage Also that skill makes you take 20% more damage. so pairing it with rage means you take 40% more damage.

Also shield and ranged classes dont take much from pve but still sometimes do. the barb with the aoe max hp being cheesable would make him and any class in the game redardless of it be able to tank pve hits for free.

@crimson flax true but if we are talking about thematics, then rogues shouldnt be able to do any damage against someone in full plate armor, let alone bleed them.

[open quarry]

But a lot of mobs hit for more than 20% of you hp so your reg hp pool would still suffer. And a lot of classes don’t run the risk of getting hit by mobs at all. Adjust the cooldown as needed. Edit: as it stands if you aren’t gonna die in the 7 secs the buff is up then is useless

[crimson flax]

you got me

[carmine current]

@open quarry true but it would be about the same as giving your whole team a heal for no reason. Also if it were cheesable like that if you and everyone else is missing hp then you would just pop it and boom you just have your full team 20% hp back. if you and your team are all barbs, you could off cd for each warcry provide 20% hp heals for your team with no limiting factors, meaning you would effictively be immune to damage from pve.

[open quarry]

I’m not saying the 20% should stay if you don’t take damage. Because yes that’d be insane. Just a 20%hp aoe heal. But instead of it “snapshotting”a percentage of hp and carrying that through the buff, add that 20% on top and if you don’t take more than that amount of health your starting hp isn’t changed. Edit youd never gain hp after the buff expires

[carmine current]

@open quarry im assuming you mean that in the example i gave if you are 163 and then take 32 damage then since you have 131 hp then when the effect ends you would be at 130/130, since the 131/163 is still over the 130. the only issue i see with that is there would need to be a ton of coding with it and it would be very hard for it to determine that it wouldnt heal you, on top of that healing hp during the effect would make it even harder to code. edit by healing i mean with bandages or hp pot

[open quarry]

I couldn’t really speak to the difficulty of implementation. Make like prot pots where it’s a temporary pool that can be consumed by damage but can’t be healed only refreshed; to keep multi barbs from stacking but mechanically a hp shield.

[carmine current]

@open quarry that would be an interesting way to do it. give an aoe 20% of your hp as a shield. it would def make it easier to code it. however the issue would be balancing, putting a entire party of barb together would then let those players take damage, then another player pops his, and so on. meaning in a fight you could potentaily have 60% hp on each player as a shield. even if not stackable, some people would be able to micro out when they get hit to pop another shield and so on.

[dusky temple]

Suggested proximity voice chat, what do you guys think?

[carmine current]

@dusky temple i wouldnt have an issue with it as long as there is a way to mute people before going into the game

[atomic topaz]

3 barbs would probably be the worst party composition

[open quarry]

Apply a debuff that prevents reapplying within a certain time frame… or if it is reapplied in said debuff window it has diminishing returns like 2nd application is 12% 3rd is 7%.

[carmine current]

im not saying for a regular team. im saying if the warcry was changed to be a 20% hp shield instead, then it would be broken having 3 people with 60% hp shields, considering on top of that they could then have a shield pot going for more like 80% hp shield. then the barbs could then take fear for 20% damage reduction for enemies. meaning a party of barbs would have about 3x the hp pool of something like a fighter. and 4-5x the hp of something like a rogue.

[honest wharf]

something I would like is if they increase the buy in for highroller lobbies. At the moment I would say <3% of people have a full set of blues >50% are in the base starter gear and the rest somewhere in-between. Right now it's viable and worth while to not bring any gear and hope for a survive. I'm not sure how to balance it right now but im currently running down nearly 80% of the players are naked or nearly naked.

[open quarry]

Gotta be the most fun

[carmine current]

personally i would like to see a limiting factor of making players have to have atleast a majority of greens eqiuped to que. its annoying killing someone in high roller and seeing they didnt have any gear at all other then basic setup

[honest wharf]

well the gold is supposed to be the limiting factor, why spend 70g if you don't have the kit or gear to be able to secure it and that's a viable price when you're running mainly greens but as you get more and more the price matters less and less. I'm sure how to fix it but I don't want to run into grey geared teams vast majority of the time, it's just not enjoyable as geared teams fighting.

[reef cosmos]

i think rogues has become harder and harder to counter, too much dps. What do you guys think?

[lusty wren]

Depending on the class rogue is easy to counter. Depending on the team its even easier 😄 Rogue with a good dagger is pretty tough tho

Id way rather come across a rogue than a Ranger. I am a fighter once the rogue appears as long as I never give it my back I handle them pretty easily

[carmine current]

true but the sad thing is that a team of 3 in grey gear will genearlly be able to take on a solo player even if that solo player is geared and they aren't. also most of the time people going around with grey gear aren't looking to fight other players and try to get away at all costs. since a single run in highroller with an escape gives way more then teh buy in cost.

[lusty wren]

You need to meet my duo partner 😄 He regularly beats 1v3 as his ranger. (which is geared of course) Positioning is king, especially as a ranged you can destroy a full team with a trap and a long corridor they have to push

I play with him as a rogue as a duo, and our playstyle is I sit there and stealth and get whoever pushes. SOOOO many times I sit there and do nothing while he kills the entire team LOL

As far as high roller, Id think the 70 gold is enough of a barrier of entry. Setting anymore limits on it is pretty lame IMO.

Zero to hero runs in high roller can be fun

[carmine current]

@lusty wren @reef cosmos its not just about the weapon a full geared rogue in great gear can 1 shot any class in the game. the problem is the flat damage rolls that gear can get. the daggers base damage isnt very high but with great gear you could have every single piece giving you 6-8 flat damage. while you have 10 pieces at one time. meaning you with a grey dagger could be doing about 80-90 damage flat. IMO i think some weapons should have modifiers to flat damage that decrease the value of them. for example a 2 handed weapon should get teh full value of the flat added damage, where as a dagger should get 1/2 or 1/3 of the total from gear's flat added damage rolls. The same btw can be said with every single piece of gear in the game. a bow can do that much damage extra as well. If you apply a buff to your character that adds flat magic damage to the attacks via ignite or smite, then you can also get stuff like flat magic damage and magic true damage which also apply. which means you could get a god rolled dagger or something that has true physical flat, physical flat, weapon damage flat, magic damage flat, or true magic damage flat and getting those rolls on gg gear, would mean you could be doing over 130 per hit even with your fist.

[normal lava]

@twin wadi It's easy to just buy candy canes my guy. It's 25 to 20 my guy

[lusty wren]

This is assuming the class has no gear. NO rogue no mater the gear will one shot my fighter. I have fought rogues with lego daggers and purple gear and they dont even one shot me or even close

[twin wadi]

yeah I don't feel like paying 50 per one, and seems like nobody else is either (as hell is dead and not in a good way)

[lusty wren]

This is true on normal dungeons but I find lots of groups go to hell in HR.

But ya I don't see why people are so afraid of HELL TBH in normal dungeons.

[carmine current]

@lusty wren well lets do some math you can get 4 rolls on legendaries lets say you get a middling roll of +3 flat for all 4 rolls on it making those rolls something like flat physical, flat weapon damage, flat true physical, and flat magic damage. then lets say the rogue or a wizard has ignite put on. which is a flat 5. the dagger base should be about 30 then you 10 pieces of gears (2 rings, 1 amulet, body armor, gloves, boots, helmet, pants, 2 dagger slots). so 4 rolls of 3 flat on each roll (flat damage rolls between 1-5, so 3 is an average) would be +12 flat damage per piece of gear, 10 pieces of gear, being 120 flat base damage (some of it would be true damage) then add the 30 base from a legendary dagger, bringing the total to 150. Then add the 50% more for weakpoint attack and 50% more for ambush, also not counting backstab but that is 30%. so 100% more damage on top of the 150 base flat, meaning you now hit for 300 damage on your next attack. lets say the fighter is in gg gear he can get about 40-50% damage reduction so lets say half of that damage is gone, meaning 150 is still there and a rogue now still does over 50 flat over your total hp in a single hit.

[normal lava]

Go to hell all the time in normals 🤷‍♂️

[lusty wren]

In use cases this just does not happen, I have been playing every day of the test and have literally never been one shot by a rogue neither has ANY of the people I play with. Do you know the damage algorithms and how everything actually adds up? I dont so just curious. Its very possible that those numbers do not add up to anywhere near that depending on the dmg calculation

Its very likely that the "add 50%" shit is calculated before ANY other buffs. Without knowing the calculation its impossible to do the math

[carmine current]

@lusty wren ive done tons of testing on the dummies in between rounds and yes the way the game calculates things are as such.

((((weapon damage base + flat added moddifiers)x(1-(damage reduction from armor or mr + damage reduction% from gear-penetration from gear))+Flat added true damage moddifiers)x damage % increase moddifiers)x damage based on the body part hit

im not saying all or hell even any rogues could one shot you. I'm saying what you said of a rogue no matter the gear couldnt one shot you is blatently wrong. Gear in the game is king and flat added damage gear makes faster attacking weapons broken. you can say that it doesnt but if a rogue damage with a dagger can hit for something like 60 per hit to body and a fighter hits for 70 per hit to body, then the rogue would always win that fight, since the dagger attacks 2x faster then any of the base fighter weapons.

[lusty wren]

I disagree, i wont contest that you think you know the calculation. You also are giving the rogue the benefit of the doubt with a team effort of ignite and such, yet give nothing to the fighter as far as protection pots or spells go.

But again I will go from my experiences before I go from unsubstantiated claims of knowing the calculation 😄

I also am much to lazy to do it myself so like I said I wont contest that

That seems like lots and lots of testing to do in 3 seconds intervals in the lobby 😄

[earnest widget]

I just want to hit people with books as wizard

Instead of throwing knifes for wizard throwing books

[carmine current]

@lusty wren okay fine lets say cleric he has smite or wizard since he can put ignite on himself. both still do the same damage since it doesnt matter about the base of the gear it only matters about getting a buff for magic damage to weapon. also not give anything for fighter? i said with perfect gg rolled defensive gear meaning + armor, + physical damage reduction%, and magic damage reduction % that the fighter would have about 50% damage reduction that is also considering the taunt skill for 10% armor, 10% armor passive and 5% armor while in defensive stance. fine you want a protection pot fine put on a purple protection pot that 100 flat hp + 35 still wouldnt give you enough to survive the hit of 150. if you want to add on a cleric shield to then yes with a purple protection pot, cleric shield, perfect defensive gear, and everything to give extra armor then you would live that hit with 5 hp. until you consider that rogue could also just drink alchol, include the 30% damage for the back stab and it still would one shot you.

[earnest widget]

Just don’t get back stabbed

[astral crypt]

@atomic whale remember we are only using the 2nd and 3rd levels of the dungeon as of now. maybe make a guarantee escape on the first floor. and keep 2nd and 3rd how it is

[lusty wren]

When I see a rogue one shot someone in equal gear Ill possibly reevaluate but without seeing actual calculations I will go with my anecdotal viewpoint. But we can agree to disagree 😄

[astral crypt]

I dono.. I've seen mage 1 spell kill, I've seen hunter 1 shot kill, I've seen barb 1 shot kill, I've seen Claric 2 shot kill... haven't seen fighter 1 shot., I feel they need to lower attack speed of dagger ever so slightly.

[earnest widget]

Maybe they can add a detect life spell or potion to counter rouge a bit but never actually had problems with them

[lusty wren]

The topic was on rogue, I didnt say there was not a single class that cant one shot equal gear. Barb has a pension for it, so does wiz. Ive never had a ranger one shot me but get very close. So they probably could in the right situation also

But equal gear, ive never seen a rogue come close to one shotting me even with better gear than I am wearing at the time

[astral crypt]

yeah with Q and E skills set properly and a bunch of + physical damage or weapon damage I can do 1 hit of 120 or so dmg

[lusty wren]

And in many cases depending on gear and buffs this is not a one shot, hell in some its not even close

[carmine current]

@lusty wren let me put it to you this way if you go into the lobby and see your base weapon does 14, then you put on boots or something that add +5 weapon damage, that would bring the weapon total to 19 correct? well when you activate weakpoint attack and you see the damage done to a chest hit is 29 what does that mean? well (14x1.5)+5=26 so it cant be that. but (14+5)x1.5=28.5 rounding up to 29. that is how you test it. then for damage reduction you would have to assume its applied before the true damage is calculated in. It also doesnt matter if the reduction is calculated before or after the 50% increased damage since (14x1.5)x0.5 and (14x0.5)x1.5 both equal 10.5

[atomic whale]

Thats suggestion, it can be used on other levels. What if it was some skip to level 3? 😄

[thorny mulch]

#d-and-d-suggestions message

Let’s get some more votes on this hopefully gets considered

[signal sierra]

sanest rouge player

[earnest widget]

Idk what this is all about but it looks funny when rouge crouches and stabs my leg

[lusty wren]

You are testing on a dummy that has nothing to enter into the calculation. You have no clue how the calculation is done when hitting an armored/buffed person. It matters on what is calculated first. Hitting a non armored dummy is not the same calculation as hitting a person. YOU HAVE NO CLUE what is calculated first. And I dont think you have all this data you think you do by hitting this dummy in 3 - 10 second intervals that the pre lobby lasts 😄

We can agree to disagree though 😉 Ill take my anecdotal evidence you will take your "data" driven view. and we can move on 😉

[carmine current]

@signal sierra i dont even like playing rogue i main fighter. i have all classes other then ranger and cleric at level 20 and between 2-4k gold on all my classes level 20.

[atomic whale]

To everyone disliking 4 team suggestion.
It was on loading screen, 4 guys walking through dungeon 😉

[astral crypt]

lol have numbers pop up on damage done like Fortnite. If they add a 4 man team then they would need to seperate solo into a seperate queue

[earnest widget]

You might be on to something they should add building as well

[lusty wren]

I personally think 3 man teams is the sweetspot. I think things would just get too cluttered in 4 mans

[astral crypt]

you can.. sorta with the pivage(spelling) shield for those that don't know you can place the shield down as a movable cover

[cyan orbit]

I think if your suggestion 4man why not just add a party mode where you can add x amount of players and only those player will be on the map with you but it still be 3 man and a minimum of 4-6.players and you pick your team

[carmine current]

@lusty wren well first you say 3 -10 secs but like you mentioned before of saying 3 secs. its a 5 sec count down and about a 5-6 sec timeframe on when you get into the area. and about 1/3 of the time you are going to spawn in the room with the dummies and the rest of the time you wont. in the times you dont sometimes you can run in and get 1 hit off and see the damage number.

Also I can tell you failed basic math if you dont realize when in multiplication it doesnt matter when its multiplied. ive already proven that flat damage is added to base damage, then damage increases are applied as a whole to it. you can test it as well if you have any throw away gear with +flat damage on it with a skill or perk that gives % increase to your damage. so what you are arguing is that should the damage reduction be applied before or after the % increase to damage. Which when you calculate it in either way like i said you arrive at teh same exact damage number. since ((14+5)x0.5)x1.5=14.25 and ((14+5)x1.5)x0.5=14.25.

Its not about if i know my calculations are correct i know 100% that they are correct, in determining the damage you actually do.

[lusty wren]

Sure bucko, as I said we will agree to disagree. You "proved" nothing if you can show your tests and calculations then sure you have proven it. But just saying "this is the calculation and i know cus I tested" means nothing to me sorry, lets just move on

[dull glen]

why is it do hard to admit you are wrong rofl

[carmine current]

@lusty wren disagree with what? the math that i have already proven to be acurate. your logic is basically I don't like your math therefore its invalid. I also gave you the exact numbers for it and you can test them yourself as well. I said a 14 base damage dagger (your basic starter dagger) with a +5 weapon damage/physical damage/true physical damage roll on any other piece of gear will result in you doing with a weakspot attack (the ability) hit to the body 26 damage. its not rocket science.

[lusty wren]

I disagree with his assertion he knows the calculation. Until I see a calculation with proof, I will not rethink my anecdotal viewpoint as I said.

Has nothing to do with my "likes" Show me proof you know the calculation and we can talk

I am done repeating myself though. So moving on as I suggested

[dull glen]

go test it yourself if you want proof, I have also tested damage calculation and what he said is correct for physical damage

[carmine current]

@lusty wren why dont you test it yourself then. like shit ive litterally given you the exact numbers and where they come from. the only thing you are saying is until i do it myself that you wont believe it. well guess what, then do the test yourself. if your to lazy to do it yourself then your point is invalid, since you will never agree since your to incompitent.

[lusty wren]

I have no wishes to do it, I never asked you to do it for me either. You have chosen to do so, and you have no proof of what youve done. So you cant say its proven 😄 But again Im done with this convo

I did tests on smoking, turns out! Shit dont cause cancer... Source? Trust me bro

[astral crypt]

I'd like to see an Auction house WoW style. will allow players to play vs sitting spamming the same message for 5 minutes looking for a buyer

[carmine current]

@lusty wren obviously your not since you keep commenting on it. look do you think any other person when testing how the calcuations worked takes screenshots of the damage numbers that show up for about half a second. no! also to do that in the very limited time window while still going into a run would be insane. most of the time people put together a spreadsheet showing the numbers and what caused them. I litterally gave you those from multiple differnt ones. i understand you cant definatively say that its correct or not without testing it yourself. However, to say that you will not test it yourself and won't take other people's word for what they, even when they show all of the calculations for the numbers. on top fo that you have another person litterally saying that those numbers are accurate @dull glen. like at this point im convinced you wouldnt believe it unless i took a video of the whole damn thing and broke it down frame by frame. Even then you would just say well its photo shopped or something stupid, just to not admit that you are wrong.

[lusty wren]

If they were trying to say "I proved it" then yes

Again I tested smoking, and its no longer cancerous trust me bro 😉

Sorry I tend to struggle just believing random strangers did a good job "testing" something with no proof. If you believe everything someone says I feel sorry for you

[dull glen]

Actual midwit tier arguing
If you are unwilling or incapable of basic math and interacting with a target dummy why are you posting your dribble in this chat
Bringing up cancer and smoking is a false equivalency as well

[lusty wren]

😄 ok bucko, Sorry I am unwilling to take your unsubstantiated claims

@carmine current Eh i dont care to test it. Show me your data and evidence and maybe It will sway my point of view

[carmine current]

then test it your damn self. Like shit, all im saying is if you don't believe it, then do your due diligence before commenting on it. like its running around in a circle with you where all im doing is saying if you dont believe it then test it yourself. why would i be saying that because I know my numbers are correct. I've done the tests on them. Even @dull glen agrees with them

Edit @lusty wren ive already shown you the data. i litterally gave you the exact numbers that I got for the calcualtions and how i arrived at them. what do you not understand about that?

[small tendon]

imagining the world where bumping rogue doesnt cancel hide and I get to play "is the server rubberbanding or am I already dead" everytime my internet flickers

[lusty wren]

I can toss out numbers and act like they are data too 😄 You said you "proved it" so lets see the evidence that you did in fact "PROVE" it

I do not see a video, I do not see a excel sheet, I see you saying numbers that I didnt even bother to read because they are unsubstantiated. 😉

[devout lynx]

Here's an easy fix for the trade channel spam. Make it so you can add a text filter, then it will only display messages containing the keywords. Then you'll be able to see relevant trades to your keyword.

I think this would be easier than revamping the whole system.

[carmine current]

the evidence is are the numbers i gave you. @dull glen already confirmed they are accurate. I didnt take screen shots of them, nor did I take a video of them. I litterally just brought in a single piece of gear with flat damage roll on it with a basic rogue kit and tested hitting the dummy with the E ability (weakspot attack) on. the only thing left for you to do is to test it yourself.

[lusty wren]

Numbers paint the picture you want to paint. With no evidence that these numbers mean anything you are just spewing out random data

[dull glen]

you should go do an iq test and post your results tbh

[earnest widget]

Proxy I think this can all be fixed it you just don’t let the rogue back stab you

[carmine current]

the numbers that i'm "spewing out" that I littearly told you that you could confirm yourself by just going into the lobby and testing it. like its not rocket science this isnt going anywhere, since you refuse to look at the numbers and refuse to test it out yourself.

[lusty wren]

I have no problems with rogues 😄

@carmine current Yes I do not care to test it myself. This has nothing to do with the fact that your "data" is unsubstantiated so I ignore it. Until you can show me some excel forms or videos actually proving your numbers as you suggested you have done. I have no care to even read your "data"

[valid delta]

I think if game doesn’t come f2p it will lose a lot of players

[lusty wren]

Why do you think that? I feel there is a very large market for people who prefer B2P games

[carmine current]

@earnest widget thats not what he is talking about he is saying the calculation for how damage in the game works isnt correct, until I send him a video of me testing out the exact values. even though ive already given him teh exact values. and @dull glen litterally confirmed that its correct. meanwhile @lusty wren refuses to due his due diligence of testing and confirming it himself.

Edit
The calculation btw is this
((((weapon damage base + flat added moddifiers)x(1-(damage reduction from armor or mr + damage reduction% from gear-penetration from gear))+Flat added true damage moddifiers)x damage % increase moddifiers)x damage based on the body part hit

[earnest widget]

he failed the skill check

[lusty wren]

When one has no argument they resort to personal attacks. Well shown! 😄

@carmine current You are the one who made the claim that you "proved it" It is your Burdon of proof not mine. You can state the "calculation" all you want but without PROOF that its a valid calculation you are just spewing numbers

[stray canyon]

i wouldent pay a dollar for this game untill they seperate groups from solos lol

[valid delta]

There’s a reason most popular games were usually f2p, (ex. valorant, league, fortnite, and lot more too many to name) usually having in game purchases like skins and then game being free also made those games make a lot a money as well

[forest kelp]

skill issue

[lusty wren]

The F2P model is inherently predatory so many people prefer B2P games. There are just as many games that do well that are B2P as there are F2P.

IF the game is good it will do just fine as b2p

[stray canyon]

so when my two buddies and i jump your ass on the street no crying about it being fair right? sKiLl IsSuE.... LMAO

[valid delta]

How many b2p games really got as big as those games tho, just bigger audience that would play f2p imo

[lusty wren]

I counter play with the gun I shoot you with. Just like this game there is counter play 😄 Divide and conquer.

@valid delta LOADS of B2P games make a perfectly fine return on investment. These guys can easily turn a profit with their vision of it being B2P. Sure they could be greedy fucks and push their game to predatory limits and generate more cash...But that is not their want as they have stated

AS a consumer you should want B2P seeing how F2P is very anticonsumer

[forest kelp]

lmao someone got butthurt, if you have two buddies why are you playing solo???? also playing solo def has its own benefits aka stealth and stuff, a barb went on a 30 solo win streak legit pushing 3 mans and not hiding, not saying its easier solo, just its possible and its own way of playing

[slate slate]

f2p games are just popular because they're free, you can just download it

[carmine current]

@lusty wren ive already given you the exact information i have on my calcuations. you said provide you some "excel forms or videos". Where do you think that calcuation came from it was me litterally removing off the numbers that were in it with what the numbers were from. so yes all of that came from an excel form showing the exact damage you can do. there are other calculations that I mentioned earlier as well like war cry saying it gives 25% max hp but instead onyl gives 20% and brings the default 130 to 163. at the end of the day you should realize that without testing things like this out yourself, you would never be satisfied. almost any game I play for a while I do the calcuations myself to test how it works. So if my calcuations with great detail aren't enough for you, then... again... test the numbers out yourself. Any normal person that looks at any of these numbers and disagrees with them would be able to at least point out a reason why. Your reason why its incorrect is I couldnt tell from the armor or anything on a dummy that has none. Well there is no way to tell that since hitting a player doesnt show damage. also put armor and you see that you get an physical damage reduction % piece of gear. Well that is % damage reduction to the damage you do. so if you hit a dummy for 100 and someone was 25% damage reduction then its perfectly reasonable to assume it would be doing 75 since you know its 25% damage reduction.

[lusty wren]

No one is reading this wall of text bro. You stated you "proved it" with 0 evidence to back it up. Move along

[valid delta]

Exactly u don’t gotta have to buy to test and see if u really like the game either, also some casual people who jus wanna play the game every once in a while could play as well without spending money either as it’s probably not worth if they aren’t playing much

@bitter stratus just was saying the game will not be as popular when it’s b2p compared to rn when any1 can play for free

[bitter stratus]

Devs already said theyre likely not going to do F2P so I dont know why this aspect is being talked about.

I feel like at this point you two have argued this to death and neither of you are going to budge or convince the other. Might as well move on

[carmine current]

@lusty wren lol refuses to read text that explicitely states how you are wrong. so you can still try and be on your high horse. just to then say move along after you yourself refuse to "move along".

[lusty wren]

You can state I am wrong all day long, where is your proof? Where is the evidence that these numbers mean anything? I am not just going to take a random strangers word for it. Its not a personal attack on your character why wont you let this go? 😄

[carmine current]

because you keep bringing it up! like shit. just do as you said yourself "move along". you litterally state provide you an excel form. Then when i explain that info came from an excel form you say you wont read that wall of text.

[earnest widget]

@lusty wren the proof came to me in a dream

[lusty wren]

Stop pinging me then and move on bucko.

All this talk of an excel sheet and its still not been shown 😄

@earnest widget yes this I would not doubt 😄

[stray canyon]

theres discussing and then theres fanboying XD

[carmine current]

"All this talk of an excel sheet and its still not been shown"

((((weapon damage base + flat added moddifiers)x(1-(damage reduction from armor or mr + damage reduction% from gear-penetration from gear))+Flat added true damage moddifiers)x damage % increase moddifiers)x damage based on the body part hit
((((14+5)x(1-(0.00+0.00-0.00)+0)x(100%+50%))x(1.00)=28.5
Damage dealt 29

[half cobalt]

naked ranger kite meta is disgusting

[lusty wren]

Rangers are very strong I agree. Pushing one is a death sentence if they are good

[thick swallow]

I think fighter should get little defence buff, +10hp would be fine, feel so weak in frontline compared to barbarian

[bitter stratus]

Also to the people downvoting accessibility option suggestions: you ok? you need a hug? who hurt you? Aracnophobia mode isnt going to hurt you.

[wicked tree]

try wearing more armor if you can get a decent pair of chest pants and helm you get alot of damage reduction

[slate slate]

yeah im not sure why people would even be against it? maybe its those ''just face your fears!!!!!'' people but then they will complain about a bow doing 2 damage too much

[lusty wren]

I think its not something they should put dev time to NOW, but in the future when the base game is finished I would be ok with QoL like this

[astral crypt]

I do 142dmg on the dummy with dagger with weakpoint and hide(with ambush perk)

[crude saddle]

It's a video game. If you can't play a videogame bc it has a spider in it, you are truly being a snowflake

[slate slate]

do you have any understanding of what a phobia is?

[astral crypt]

in a game you get to kill what you fear 🙂 I fear pixels.. luckily games are not made from pixels.................

[crude saddle]

It's a fear of real things not an inability to discern between reality and fantasy.

[bitter stratus]

Thats literally not how a phobia works and denying those with phobias the very MINOR accessibility options they might need to be able to play the game is a real short sighted and childish way of thinking. Please love yourself and others a bit more.

[lusty wren]

Would you not agree though that this is something that would be done later in development? Not before base mechanics are even finished?

[jade monolith]

I don't think anyone here is saying that it needs to be the next thing added to the game

[lusty wren]

I didn't say NEXT i said after the base mechanics are done. If that is the case I am fine with it and will upvote. If its wanted done before base mechanics are even fleshed out Id have to downvote because Id rather development be spent on getting base mechanics in first

[bitter stratus]

Aracnophobia modes are piss easy to do. You can just change them to a floating ball like Grounded has done.

More than half the suggestions I see submitted are things that would have to wait till the base game is totally finished anyway to be added. In the end its not really about the timeframe as much as it is just putting the suggestion out there for the devs to be able to reference whenever they get around to it. You shouldnt be downvoting things based on an ambiguous timeframe for development that we dont have because we dont know what will or wont be worked on.

[lusty wren]

Time frame matters to some people, and will sway their vote. So I was just asking for clarification on if this was something the suggestion would want NOW or is ok to come later with a QoL pass

[slate slate]

its still early testing, i dont HAVE to play these next 3 days solo, i can play with a group that can deal with that for me. but even now im not sure if i want to buy it since my friends cant always be there. and like sightless has said, i honestly wouldnt care if its a floating jpeg

[astral crypt]

but i have a fear of floating Jpegs.. they should change it to spiders

[mint wharf]

add solo

[thick swallow]

I have claustrophobia, should I ask devs to remove all small rooms or make the game open world? Your opinion is stupid, just stop talking random stuff, also these spiders are not even scary ffs

[bitter stratus]

"This thing that I do not have does not effect me therefore the people it does effect shouldn't be considered."

Awfully shitty way of thinking for someone with claustrophobia. Not all content is going to trigger specific phobias. The point is to have the option for those who need it. If you don't need it, it doesn't effect you and you shouldn't care that its added for those who do.

[earnest widget]

na i want them to make the spiders even worse

[jade socket]

NOOOOOOO the devs must cater to ever individual gamer!!!!

[jade socket]

people who say they have aracnophobia only force it on them selves because everyone is scared of them for no reason

[slate slate]

you couldnt have made a more ignorant comment even if you tried. do people not know what a phobia is anymore? google it

[jade socket]

do people not know what a piece of paper is pick a spider up with it and take it out side edit: just looked up phobia lets read it together "an extreme or irrational fear of or aversion to something." aracnomophibia is pretty irrantional

[bitter stratus]

Thats not how phobias work.

[lean bone]

what do you guys think about an item we could loot to enhance our gears quality up a tier or multiple tiers. Like imagine looting a scroll that follows the gear quality system of junk - unique, and when used on an item base, it raises the tier of the item to the quality of the scroll that was used and gain random attributes equal to the tier of gear, a little POE influence crossover

[slate slate]

you cant even seem to understand the meaning of it, what you said makes no sense. ''arachnophobia is pretty irational'' what do you even mean by that? i dont see how you completely miss the point?

[jade socket]

have you tried overcoming your fear instead of avoiding it?

[bitter stratus]

Yeah not taking this bait. Enjoy your night, fam.

[slate slate]

yeah after that one i have the exact same message

[lusty wren]

I mean it is irrational ... a phobia is the irrational fear of something

With that said I am not sure why people really care about a setting that would be "off" by default