Marvin The Martian

[azure saddle]

It’s decent for zoning

[finite blaze]

esp in 2s you can hit someone with it at 40 and if your finn or arya is there they get to kill

has a fair amount of hit stop too so if you hit someone with it who was trying to time dodging your missile you can convert off that

[worldly steeple]

headbutt is very strong, knockbacks hard vertically and is good for getting out of juggles rather than dodging as well.

or returning to stage in a way thats harder to read

[finite blaze]

space invader to follow di and force an immediate dodge is p good too

[sacred gale]

Headbutt is also great at drifting back, good to fake out an approach

Good at baiting into bubble too as usually they try to approach

[timid tangle]

finally got me 1,000 wins on marvin today

and the match that got me the win was someone who ran off the stage twice after i took a single stock off them.

god it felt so underwhelming

[snow cradle]

Man I hate how i usually have to get someone to 130-140 to confirm a kill

[finite blaze]

2 cute ones in clips

https://discordapp.com/channels/879970800734711808/1009538859417215147/1268829081789534329 been dying to catch this one on cam

[lethal beacon]

i never want to have to do another marvin mirror ever again

holy

its honestly so miserable

it took both of us 2 minutes to get a single kill

and for the love of god please buff air side special

that move should kill way earlier

[white garden]

My lord this is so loved when the opponant try to destroy the ship and got the dam missile right into the face ❤️

[silk pecan]

He's not wrong

[proud shuttle]

how to kill besides Rocket and SA3?

im noob

[tight laurel]

be loving that shi fr 😭

[tight laurel]

me too bro me too

[scenic carbon]

SA1 + 2 -> jump + bubble -> up special

[azure saddle]

Down air and down attack or a charged side air

[scenic carbon]

down air -> up special

[worldly steeple]

jab2 into down attack on the edge of the stage, up special has really good knockback, air side special. marvin is designed to kill vertically so try to get them above you/beside you in the air, big and small bubble pop the opponent up, if theyre close to you you can also try to do ground up attack but i dont like that. if theyre hanging on the ledge, flag's hitbox is the entire circle when it's off cooldown, so you can hit them really low/out of their up attack range. this also sends them up really fast, and usually makes them bounce off the ledge, so it either kills on the top of stage or puts them in a position where you can jump and catch with up special/you might have to do up attack on taller stages like dexters.

[proud shuttle]

never thouyght to use flag at ledge to kill ty

[finite blaze]

up air into upspecial or vice versa depending on percent / position

[snow cradle]

At All

Had a agent smith at 165 and marvin STILL couldnt kill

ts is mindblowing marvin needs some buffs

[finite blaze]

thats on you dog

[snow cradle]

No it isnt

[finite blaze]

upspecial

[snow cradle]

used that multiple times

while he was flagged

[finite blaze]

trumpet can kill mfs at 70

the actual hit

[snow cradle]

Rarely hits and agent smith is faster

[finite blaze]

it still has the hitbox when ufo comes out too

[snow cradle]

Im aware

[finite blaze]

then you arent routing into it at all

[scenic carbon]

^

[finite blaze]

simply a skill issue

[snow cradle]

I guess 😂

marvin needs to be buffed

nothing will change my mind

[scenic carbon]

the projectile bug needs to get fixed

[snow cradle]

fr

[finite blaze]

ok think about like ult GNW up air.

[snow cradle]

ts is terrible

[finite blaze]

its a whole mini game trying to make the person come down

[snow cradle]

Quit the yapping dawg 😭

[finite blaze]

their trying to avoid your up attacks and up airs, but the second you know you found your hit with up air / up attack you should be there with an upspecial

[scenic carbon]

let the uneducated/lazy stay that way

[finite blaze]

ig lol

[snow cradle]

yea listen to chubs above ur message

[finite blaze]

marvin has a ridiculous good edgeguard game completely outside of side 3

[scenic carbon]

true

very fun to edgeguard

[finite blaze]

if you arent converting bad positions into kills thats on you

which yes even though the air side special doesnt kill at 70-100 like a ww or a shaggy, its putting them into a position where marvin can absolutely find a kill

multiple built in 50/50s in the kit

[worldly steeple]

what map?

[snow cradle]

rick and morty map, im pretty sure a part of me not killing was that projectile bug

[worldly steeple]

the map is short enough for you to get vertical kills, and at 165 down attack or jab probably would have killed horizontally off the edge of the stage by themselves.

try hitting neutral attack first (or some other projectile) and then hitting the up special trumpet while they are caught. almost every one of marvins attacks hits up into the air so try to get them up and stay beneath them. you would wait for smith to do something which you can catch like the slide or clone attack and then go in with jab or bubble

[fiery python]

Hey guys. What’s this projectile bug everyone is talking about with Marvin ? He’s not my main but definitely top 5 for me.

[finite blaze]

dodging through a projectile disables its hitbox even though it still is visually on screen and still has lifetime

[silk pecan]

Phantom Projectiles. If your opponent does a dodge on a projectile and then you reverse the projectile to hit them again, it will not hit them.

It's a terrible bug that's affected Marvin since June. Serious oversight by the devs, but it absolutely ruins a lot of Marvin's ability's to be more aggressive and difficult to avoid, especially considering just how much more work Marvin has to put in compared to everyone else.

[azure saddle]

I hate this, I have some screenshots of people standing inside the rocket and comboing me while they have the bouncy projectile in them

[fiery python]

OK, thanks I never really paid attention. I do like using the signature perk where reversing increases projectile, size and speed

[exotic token]

Velma too, both my characters!!!! Love this game

[jolly horizon]

I didn't even realise that was a bug, assumed it was intentional

[dim bone]

I think it is intentional

But they probably didn’t think about Marvin’s and Velma’s cases where they can affect their projectiles

[flint drum]

its annoying cus its not even consistent either sometimes

[worldly steeple]

imo if thats the intended function i dont like it but im ok with it. the worse bug is projectiles bouncing around when they are useless

eg when they hit a wall they randomly stop working, or sometimes you can bubble something and it doesnt have any hitbox from the start

[jolly horizon]

Oh I've had a bunch of objects go in the bubble and just render it useless, yeah

Iron giant scrap for one

[flint drum]

if they want phantom projectiles to be a feature, it has to be consistent on EVERY projectile, not just one one or two characters

[jolly horizon]

The tip of WWs whip counts as something you can bubble but just gives a big empty one that doesn't do damage

[dim bone]

Yeah Bugs rocket doesn’t deactivate when you dodge it which means certain characters like Jason literally cannot dodge through it because he gets hit due to being so big

[gentle ingot]

I don't play marvin

But I just wanna say

I love y'all fr

Marvin is so goated

[sterile rivet]

marvin so silly fr i would let him invade my home planet

[gentle ingot]

Fr I love a man with an Illudium Q-32 explosive space modulator

[silk pecan]

Velma has this issue too?!

[silk pecan]

hides my illusion Q-32 explosive space modulator I will not be loved for just my possessions!

[gentle ingot]

Listennnn.... A woman being pretty isn't everything but it certainly helps.

The illudium Q-32 explosive space modulator is just one of the many reasons ❤️

[wooden kite]

🤓 erm actually it’s Q-36

[gentle ingot]

Erm I have the Marvin announcer pack, it is Q-32

[wooden kite]

What? They must have changed it? I could have sworn in the original cartoons it’s 36

[gentle ingot]

nope I have that clip saved on my phone and send it to my Marvin duo every morning.

It's q 32

[silk pecan]

Won't lie, having a Q-32 explosive space modulator is no easy task. It obstructs my view of Venus.

[gentle ingot]

I thought the earth blocked Venus 🤔

[wooden kite]

https://youtu.be/_bybSYbnlvA?si=qAmMkKtlYwGNG8jB

This short says 36

[wooden kite]

Dm me the clip I’m curious

[gentle ingot]

No shot, Ive been sent to another timeline

It is 36

💀

I swear to god

[wooden kite]

Aha

[gentle ingot]

Ive watched this clip

[silk pecan]

It's a serious issue

[gentle ingot]

Over 100 times

Never once have I heard 36

But I went to go check

Nah sure enough

[wooden kite]

Sorry, you got mandellad

[gentle ingot]

Illudium Q-36 explosive space modulator

Ugh

[silk pecan]

Still got one lol

[gentle ingot]

What if some... Creature came along and stole it.

The space modulator I mean

[silk pecan]

I have trackers!

[gentle ingot]

Always prepared fr

[gentle ingot]

#clips you were right, but I'll still post it cause I ❤️ Marvin

[wooden kite]

Hehe

[silk pecan]

Still, I'm very upset with the meta rn

Er, the game really

Marvin has been glitched since June

But nah, let's nerf LeBron

Let's buff Wonder Woman

Like...who's in charge of patches?

[jolly horizon]

How come we can't bubble Tom's dynamite?

[exotic token]

Yep to her bubbles and her VAN

If you dodge once they don’t hit you later and they’re so easy to dodge once

[lost sand]

We can?

If you're referring to when it's split into 3 dynamites, then one of those 3 will destroy your bubbled dynamite

[jolly horizon]

I swear I saw it pass right through

Must be tripping

[terse dock]

This patch wasnt really focused on big balance changes

Those often drop mid-season or when a new season begins

But you're right, it couldve and shouldve been more
Especially bugfixing, because TnJ still have like 10 bugs which make them inconsistent to use

[exotic token]

All the charges had some kind of purpose. I would have preferred the fix the bugs too, but balance wise it wasn’t ALL bad. I see Harley buff complained about a lot but it was just them testing a possible fix for a highly complained about problem (small characters avoiding attacks just by being short)

[jolly horizon]

Anyone else ever have their rocket just leave in the wrong direction when it fires?

[fringe trout]

Random bug, don't know the cause

Built-in plot armor for the enemy (or surprise reverse if you're super lucky)

[jolly horizon]

It seems pretty rare, only seen it a handful of times

I always feel a little guilty when I get the infinite flag debuff glitch

[fringe trout]

It's strong, but for how rare it is and how weak Marvin already is, I just laugh it off and start blasting

[finite blaze]

🤠

cowboy marvin when

[wooden kite]

A cowboy event would be so fun

[worldly steeple]

i hypothesize that this is caused by trying to reverse the rocket after its already hit something and that it 'saves' the reverse for next time

[azure saddle]

I hate this glitch, also w username

[jolly horizon]

That could be it, or it just doesn't calculate the position correctly and the failsafe is for it to fire in a default direction

[silk pecan]

😦

[finite blaze]

https://discordapp.com/channels/879970800734711808/1009538859417215147/1269687494002348126

found a gross setup

basically checkmate i dunno what supe coulda done lollllll

shooting a ball just ahead of missile while marked. dodge the ball and missile is still active and kills you, dont dodge ball and get one-two'd

i think it would only deactivate the ball here. seeing as the distance between the two would be the end of supermans dodge length

[wooden kite]

That’s pretty nice

[worldly steeple]

#clips message

[finite blaze]

https://discordapp.com/channels/879970800734711808/1009538859417215147/1269760855214526587

double assassin is fun

[finite blaze]

top 50 in 2s now

yippie

[finite blaze]

https://discordapp.com/channels/879970800734711808/1009538859417215147/1269779585822888027

[worldly steeple]

im trying to stay in the top 100 in 1s at least but the lag and matchmaking is making me rethink my choices lol

[finite blaze]

i got booted outta plat one bc solo queueing decided to put me with gold shaggies lmfao

went from plat V to deranked outta 1 in one day

i need to climb with a static :3

[jolly horizon]

The amount of lives I've lost to the servers is starting to grate, yeah

[finite blaze]

i think its just some wack dudes not on ethernet that cause problems

i.e. console players

thats why i turn off crossplay lolll

i avoid a large amount of them

[jolly horizon]

What are your queue times like with crossplay off?

[finite blaze]

40s to 1 minute

not even bad tbh

[jolly horizon]

Ah that's not too bad really

I do wish the matchmaking was a little better

Sometimes it's just like "Here take this random bronze 5 guy who's never played before today"

Against 2 people my own rank who have been queueing together since alpha

[finite blaze]

yeah... that happened to me

this shaggy wanted to charge rage at the top of the screen at 80 against morty TnJ

sure buddy

[jolly horizon]

[jolly horizon]

Just hit D5

So tiring

[finite blaze]

nice

[finite blaze]

nah he didnt deserve it

[rare heron]

Anyway to check leaderboards from my phone

[azure saddle]

marvin needs a buff istg, i was just destroying a jason, took 17 damage the first stock. then he comes back, hits me twice, and kills me at 30. idk how marvin needs to beat people up for 20 mins just for other characters to hit him twice and kill him

[snow cradle]

The fact that you have to work like a coal miner to kill someone at 140+ is nuts

[azure saddle]

look in clips 😭

[lethal beacon]

I dont mind it cuz its Jason

he should be able to have really crazy kill power because he is a serial killer

for me atleast Jason is the funnest matchup

[glad fox]

i have one question

how do you guys feel after spamming the same wo moves and being toxic

i have no probnklem when you spm moves marvin takes skill

but why be toxic abt it bro

[rare heron]

Bros salty i just destroyed your as

Get off the game

Youre bad

44 damage is sad

[glad fox]

nah

[icy wren]

what’s the best signature perk for Marvin?

[finite blaze]

space invader

makes dair up air a kill option as well

makes all sorts of fifty fifties and advantage states possible

[lethal beacon]

i find dair up special more consistent

the problem with up air is that you gotta charge it to start seeing some really good knockback

the damage even scales with how much you charge it

so uncharged does like 4% whilst charged does 11%

[finite blaze]

thats the thing is you can find an up special after too

it all depends on percents and positions

[finite blaze]

https://discordapp.com/channels/879970800734711808/1009538859417215147/1270546988953505814

"wahh marvin cant kill"

learn routes

[snow cradle]

Lmfaoooo

[snow cradle]

It is well known he struggles to kill

[finite blaze]

skill issue

[snow cradle]

I guessss 😂

[finite blaze]

the clip of me is killing black adam from a bad position at 55. because i routed into a very impossible to mess up 50/50 where all i had to do was wait his dodge out and react

[sterile rivet]

that black adam was the #1 hater of dodging you cant really say that

[snow cradle]

Fr its like he wanted to die 😭

[finite blaze]

The side b into fair was true, and as i said, i waited the dodge out to get the kill with the second side b

If you look at the clip you can see him mash dodge down. There isnt a dodge direction that prevents him from dying to side b

[lethal beacon]

arya didnt die from rocket?

[finite blaze]

got nicked by the up attack

[lethal beacon]

marvin can kill but its just really inconsistent at times

[lethal beacon]

sometimes you will kill mad early and sometimes you just cant kill at all

[jolly horizon]

Up to diamond 4 now in 2v2s, #31 on Marvin

I love this little dude

[scenic carbon]

2v2 Marvin is sooo fun

[jolly horizon]

I haven't played him much in 1s, only silver there

I definitely prefer this game in 2s though, I feel the balance differences are less glaring

[finite blaze]

a lot of the characters were like strictly designed for 2s yea

i'd say marvins design tends more that way

[scenic carbon]

I agree

[jolly horizon]

Some of the stuff you can do when teamed up with another projectile character is funny as hell

Redirected a Bugs safe into someone's face the other day

[finite blaze]

oh yeah i deleted an arya at thirty because her toe dipped into the the top of the radius and the safe immediately zoomed upward at her

marked + another projectile character is a bad time

the only thing i really hate is like, finn proj armor just being constantly active in twos now that im in diamond

[jolly horizon]

Oh god yeah that drives me nuts

The armoured buns + his armoured dash

[finite blaze]

they should never not have it active between his rate of coin gain and its cost

i'd be fine if it was 2 hits and rocket penetrated it like other armor

[jolly horizon]

It blocks rocket too? Yeesh

[finite blaze]

but its just the biggest fun cancel mu issue than like clairen's no fun zone against absa/elli

[scenic carbon]

Black Adam's dodge lightning thingy targets people with the flag debuff

[finite blaze]

ive been actively comboing armored buns people into rocket and still...

i feel like if it should get ticked down taking hits

idk

[jolly horizon]

So does his side b chain lightning grab

[finite blaze]

lebron is the funnest 2s partner imo

you can redirect any balls you pass

i dont think armor perk works on armored buns either...

[jolly horizon]

LeBron and Bugs are my favourite

I noticed you can also bubble up T&J's trap

Not sure how useful that is though

I did once accidentally send his Jerry into the abyss with a bubble which I'm sure they loved

[finite blaze]

its not like jerry cd is at all noticeable..

[lethal beacon]

they kinda gave up on balancing 2s tbh

stacking perks is pretty useless now too

[dry ferry]

Does Marvin have any good kill confirms off of jab?

[fringe trout]

Vertical: jab jab jump bubble bubble up-special

Horizontal: jab jab jump side-special dodge-forwards side-air

Won't kill mad early since this is Marvin we're dealing with

[versed sinew]

cant those be DI'd out of?

[fringe trout]

Double bubble you need to predict the direction for the second. With one it should be fine

[versed sinew]

really? i couldnt do the first bubble with DI

[fringe trout]

Jab jab bubble might miss if they hold away. I could be mistaken since I haven't played for some time.

A third combo is triple bubble then up-special. Kills Shaggy around 90 or 100, but needs to be precise

[scenic carbon]

on DI away you can still connect the bubble if you dodge jump

[versed sinew]

Oh okay Tysm:)

[worldly steeple]

no way i lost a marvin mirror due to the games lag twice out of a bo3 and still almost won

this has to be the worst game on earth

nonarch1st the marvin you are morally bad and dishonorable for letting yourself win under those circumstances

[flint drum]

I beat up a shaggy player
he lost one stock and quit
free ranked points for me I guess

[trim perch]

loving it

[rare heron]

#clips message

So cold with it

[trim perch]

yoooo, you zapped him back into the future fr

[wooden kite]

Yoo that was sick

[fringe trout]

🥶

[rare heron]

Thanks guys

[unique agate]

I suck at kill confirms with marvin and most times it ends up costing me the match, can anyone give me tips on it?

[fringe trout]

Bubble + up special is one consistent kill option. You can also combo bubble into itself but it is tricky
dair bubble up-special kills most enemies around 100
#clips message

[wooden kite]

I feel bad for whoever the twitter social media manager is for this game
All the replies to every tweet are so mean and just complain 😭

[flint drum]

its especially bad on twitter, but its kinda just an internet thing in general for sure

[dim crystal]

Is it a duos thing. Because I swear I hit people with up special in 1v1 and they're still alive over 100+. 🫠

[fringe trout]

Up special hitbox in general makes me want to cry
Slow, smaller hitbox than visuals, low priority, no knockback

But it's all we've got ☠️

[dim crystal]

Welp 😅

Hopefully that changes later. 🙏🏿

[unique agate]

It's prob bc of the bubble cuz I've done dair up special and they haven't died at 110 but the bubble gives extra altitude so ig it works

Idk haven't tried it yet

[timid tangle]

yknow a really sad realisation i had was that marvin ditto fights are incredibly unfun

it's really just a battle of who can hit dair first

[fringe trout]

Rock paper scissors

[timid tangle]

rock paper scissors
with the secret 4th attack
down tilt

[fringe trout]

Dair, side special, down ground

[timid tangle]

hit em with a jab 1 into dtilt

[wooden kite]

looks like you're eating good lol
2 purple Marvin skins in a row

[dim crystal]

Kinda wish the skirt/kilt thing was solid black so the sneaker stripes could pop more. But it looks cool.

[wooden kite]

Yeah I kinda wish it was a little better but it’s not bad

[rare heron]

Im still a no skin marvin but i dont really care

[wooden kite]

Not even the cyber one?

[rare heron]

Nah man whenever i see the option the i could buy a character i do it

[wooden kite]

Fair enough

I have pretty much every character I have fun with

Which is only like half the roster

[rare heron]

I only play marvin and OCCASIONALLY a bit of bugs

Dirty habit

[rare heron]

#clips message

Had so much potential but they dodged☹️

[dim crystal]

Can trade cyber bucks for a chip(I did end up getting stripe with it)

[rare heron]

I just did too

Like seriously right now

[dim crystal]

You can like get three of them so you can grab the Marvin skin.

I only got Garnet and Bugs circuit skin.

[rare heron]

Nah i still have to buy supes

Plus i dont even think marvins purple skin is good

Was gonna buy golf but it just makes his head look weird

[dim crystal]

It's kinda lacking.

It's shows a weird seam on his temples, the white mark that between his eyes is gone.

Seems like little things but it bugs me.

[warped orchid]

does marvin's down tilt count as a projectile

[dim crystal]

No

[rare heron]

#clips message

Clean

[dim crystal]

✨Very Clean ✨

[wooden kite]

I’ve been thinking about a Marvin stage
It would take place in space with those red walkways and the big glass building in the background

Maybe you could get instant martians to fight for you or just be a stage hazard

[fringe trout]

Instant Martian as an item, Banana Guard item type of thing. They took all the items out of Bugs' crate and safe

[wooden kite]

Oh yeah meeseks box was the same thing in beta

[dim crystal]

I honestly wouldn't be surprised, if they tried to make Marvin an 'assassin' because he was too similar to Rick at some point in development.

[flint drum]

oh man, the duck dodgers episode with pirate Marvin is on rn
that would be another fun costume

[wooden kite]

Yess

I like that one a lot

Both the episode and outfit

[flint drum]

altho considering how golfer marvin looks, I dunno if it'll translate that well to 3d
but my problem with golfer marvin is he's shirtless, so hopefully the pirate marvin would translate better since hes fully dressed pff

[wooden kite]

True

Also my Marvin shoes are done

#cosplay message

[flint drum]

heck yeah

[rare heron]

Fire

[dim crystal]

This reminded me that a Nintendo promo had a Marvin cosplay in it..... She made the unfortunate choice of painting her face.

https://youtu.be/5ZJ9-3BYdIo?si=hAXsDy1P2-RSGCv7

[gentle ingot]

I claim this channel in the name of mars

[wooden kite]

Oh no….

I’ve seen that too many times while while looking at other cosplays online

[dim crystal]

IDK why they wouldn't use a mask, Marvin doesn't have a mouth.

[wooden kite]

Fr

I’m not sure how I’m gonna do it yet but I plan to use a mask

[minor hare]

Marvin is more cheap than instant noodles

Who started the rumour that he takes skill💀 they got easy combos and just spam

[dim bone]

Marvin takes skill depending on the matchup. It’s hard to beat someone like Wonder Woman but it’s free to beat Jason

[minor hare]

That’s just matchup, counts for every character

Even banana guard

[dim crystal]

And yet he's not everywhere.

[minor hare]

Yea because there are broken characters like Arya who can do a true zero to death

Characters who can do loops

[minor hare]

Why play would people play cheap when there are cheaper characters?

[fringe trout]

He still has some nasty setups, but so much of his melee sauce was lost on release. Feels like you just poke around to slowly build up damage until cooldowns are ready.

We now have a more spammable pistol (down ground/air), a spammable bubble, and a long-life jab 3.

Feels like most of the cast got cheesier on release, it's just whoever has the most ends up winning.

[minor hare]

He has nice jab combos ngl

Especially with his neutral special that does bounce hitstun basically gives you a free jab

[minor hare]

Here like this #combos message

Ive never went against Marvin mains who do stuff like this. Instead all I see you two types of playstyle:
Campy spam
Or
Aggressive Marvin that literally looks like they are button mashing every Ariel 💀💀

[fringe trout]

Jabs are nice when you catch the DI, though you often burn out if you try anything fancy. Just need to be cautious afterwards.

And I've seen a couple of the button masters too ☠️

[minor hare]

Yea the iad dair - di read is not that Worth it on low %

Just run through dodges like crazy

[minor hare]

But I really do wish one day a Marvin could hit similar stuff like that on me, rather than the classic uptilt and bubble gameplay.

[dim crystal]

I want Marvins bubble to be a scalable charge shot, with consistent long ranged projectiles in-between. 😅

[snow cradle]

marvin takes skill

[minor hare]

Barley

His advanced combos takes less than 5 minutes to learn

Nothing special about his bnb combos either

[fringe trout]

I miss the charging feature to an extent- you can choose when to deploy bubble. Charging was nearly useless otherwise. Sometimes I only want a small bubble but have to waste the cooldown since you can no longer charge it

[minor hare]

Redirecting a projectile can’t be hard and neither is aiming, this ain’t a fps 💀

[dim crystal]

I mean without the recharge time.

Just have small long range bubbles that don't capture at the start, short charge for capture, and longer charge to expand and add more knockback.

And maybe have up tilt be bubble too so you can send a large launching projectile upwards to ladder?

Bubble doesn't shoot fast enough to require a recharge anyway.... Even with full range.

[fringe trout]

Pretty much how bubble worked in the beta, the charge time was way too slow for most close-range encounters

Much easier to capture stuff without having to charge in advance, just takes away a few small options

[dim crystal]

Yes, kind of trading quicker capture, for a bullying tool. 🔫

When I say more knockback I don't mean a slight nudge.

I'm also thinking of always having access to capture though slightly delayed rather than waiting for it to return.

[snow cradle]

He doesnt really have combos its really a matter of making something out of nothing also he's extremely weak. I dont understand how people complain abt this guy unless ur jason or ig

[minor hare]

Nah gang y’all just don’t learn combos #combos message

[minor hare]

This one falls under advanced combo category, he definitely has combos.

[fair wharf]

Marvin is pretty good ngl

[snow cradle]

He's still weak nonetheless

[snow cradle]

compared to the rest of the cast? bro's barely surviving

[dim bone]

If Marvin is barely surviving, then where is Velma? At the bottom of the river lmao

[snow cradle]

Yea obviously her only good moves are her forward tilts, up air special and the mystery van

uptilt and up air is pretty alright

and her grounded side special

[minor hare]

Compared to the rest he’s average

He’s only bad if you just uptilt 90% of the game expecting for a early kill 😭🙏

[snow cradle]

Below average

[minor hare]

Yikes

Main downplaying is real

[snow cradle]

I dont main marvin

but be delusional in peace i guess

[minor hare]

Tryna be passive aggressive 😭

Other than kill power what makes him below average

Decent combos
crazy range
Downtilt and dair literally have hitboxes on the character

It’s not honest and can set up for cheap iad combos

[snow cradle]

Rocketship being able to be took out in 2 hits, God awful kill power, having up to 5 cooldowns is pretty crazy**, Easily DI able jabs

downtilt is really the only reliable move

[minor hare]

Rocketship should be 2 hit 😭

Maybe do it offstage next time instead of middle in the map

[snow cradle]

It shouldnt

jerry takes more hits than the rocket

thats crazy

[snow cradle]

I know how to play marvin

[minor hare]

5 cooldowns
Sidespecial has a back up move
Bubble can still be used
Button can still be used as a hit bounce combo
Upspecial can still be used

I don’t know or remember if downspecial has a hit on cd

So if there are back up moves what’s the problem?

There are characters with no back up moves with long ass cooldowns such as Velma’s book.

[minor hare]

And the cooldowns are common sense 🤦‍♂️ these things shouldn’t be used consecutively

Ok mr Marvin is weak so let’s make him an S tier

[snow cradle]

Air side special has a backup move

[dim crystal]

Side special does nothing

[snow cradle]

up special hitbox is horrible

[minor hare]

Oh i probably got confused with a different move

[snow cradle]

definitely did

[scenic carbon]

yeah so air side special and ground are completely different moves

[minor hare]

But I don’t get the problem with these moves having cooldowns other than side special which is Debateable

[snow cradle]

Completely ignored the rest of the text

[scenic carbon]

ground side special not even that good tbh

[snow cradle]

Why am I debating this obvious topic !??

[minor hare]

Like what?

[snow cradle]

fr

[scenic carbon]

air side special cracked

[minor hare]

Thats why that cooldown is Debateable

[scenic carbon]

ye

[snow cradle]

!

[scenic carbon]

just use rocket as combo ender

[minor hare]

But the rest rocket flag bubble button is a no brainer

[snow cradle]

Also marvins projectile glitch

My God

[scenic carbon]

kill power is just learn your kill combos

[minor hare]

The jab is diable argument?

[snow cradle]

this dude needs buffs

and fixes

[minor hare]

Lol maybe go for combos instead of jab 3 😭😭😭😭

Iad dair is what I like to do

Then follow it up with button

Free jab

[scenic carbon]

I wonder if you can DI up to get out of the dair

[minor hare]

Which are?

[scenic carbon]

it's the disable glitch

[snow cradle]

phantom projectile

[scenic carbon]

where you dodge through a projectile and it never hits

[snow cradle]

dumb asf

[dim crystal]

Don't care, air special should have more knockback regardless.

[minor hare]

Ive checked all Di I could in training and you can’t check Di up, but it probably can since the hitbox is your entire body

I haven’t seen someone go that high from jab 2x

[scenic carbon]

yeah maybe up and in is possible because the IAD sends you too far, but it seems pretty niche

hard to do consistently

nice find

It's also worth finding routes that can end in up special because setting up that rocket is really deadly if they're in hitstun for a decent amount of the timer

[minor hare]

In works too #combos message look at the 3rd video, in a game it’s all about reaction tbh.

Don’t worry about that combo in the video it’s probably all diable upwards

[scenic carbon]

yeah I saw those earlier, looks pretty good

[minor hare]

That would be sick ngl

I went a against a Marvin a while a ago and he comboed me into the rocket and did a dair follow up

Was pretty sick

[minor hare]

I don’t know why that’s even in the game. 🤦‍♂️

[scenic carbon]

I'm really hoping it gets fixed

[minor hare]

Velma suffers a lot from it

[minor hare]

I heard you can dodge the van once and it can capture you again

[minor hare]

Mid season they gotta do so much stuff (makes the flag look bad)

[dim crystal]

They need a perk to let Marvin Carry his flag around.

[rare heron]

Marvin could be played skillfully and he could just be played in the most braindead way possible

Depends on the player

Thats my take on the marvin doesnt take skill thing

[minor hare]

Can be said about banana guard. Marvin mains who play “skillfully” just dash jump and do button sair

Or literally just mash any other Ariel

[rare heron]

Could also be said about any character

Arya for example

You could play her woth her sick combos

Or you could play her with 0 braincells and spam down tilt and itl work 80% of the time

[minor hare]

The problem is the game rewards braindead playstyle

Why play “skillfully” when you can do the same goofy combo/move back to back

[rare heron]

Exactly

[deft bear]

this character is fun af

[minor hare]

Nahhh Marvin’s long combo game is finished

[silk pecan]

Here's hoping we actually get buffs, lads

Maybe we can spam and be as stupid as the rest of the cast

[snow cradle]

If this dysfunctional dev team takes the time to fix this phantom projectile glitch marvin will actually be somewhat better

[silk pecan]

Aaaaaaaaand nothing. We got a nerf. Yay.

[dry ferry]

Looks like we're mages now fellas

Which makes sense but yeah no buffs at all this time around

[silk pecan]

We've literally never had a Buff iirc

[glossy rivet]

😓

[worldly steeple]

Cowardly devs can't stand up to whining players - He's "Marvin the Mage" now! Sad!

[odd ore]

I was gonna say yes he has projectiles but like most of them don't go as far as the rest of the maves

Mages*

[snow cradle]

Damn no marvin buffs???

[rose hedge]

Unfortunately no

[dry ferry]

They increased head hitbox so he's easier to hit

[finite blaze]

Tf

[fringe trout]

Headbutt would break projectiles on occasion, makes sense addressing that. It's just that its weaker for melee use now 💀

[finite blaze]

you could avoid bugs rocket a lot w it while hitting him

but now ig we gotta keep the ss tiers ss

dodge attacks not costing as much is pretty huge for marvin tho

[worldly steeple]

what is a dodge attack

[wooden kite]

When you input a dodge and partway through the dodge you interrupt it with an attack

You carry your momentum with the dodge

[fringe trout]

Marvin's ground combo game now:
#memes message

[wooden kite]

LOL

[lethal beacon]

marvin lowkey sucks rn😭

[lethal beacon]

you cant even get dair into button anymore

it sucks sm

[unique agate]

what tf they did to marvin?

he deosnt do combos anymore

[exotic token]

WHY IS HE A MAGE NOW

NOW I HAGE TO FIND AN ASSASSIN TO PLAY FOR MISSIONS?

[unique agate]

WHY TF DOEST HE HAVE COMBOS ANYMORE

BOTH HIS BEST COMBOS ARE GONE

tf is "tech"???

[minor hare]

Tbf

His combo game was just button

And dair

[unique agate]

what do we do now?

[rare heron]

Can someone show me or send me a clip what it looks like when you try to down air button

Because i havent played all day and im about to sleep

Atleast stevens airels got nerfed into the ground

[lethal beacon]

@rare heron

you get the first dair into button but they tech out of it

meaning you gotta follow tech

[rare heron]

Yeah i saw

Its actually so sad

[lethal beacon]

its way less consistent man

i wouldnt mind tech if it was like every 3 ground bounces

but its way too easy to get 2 ground bounces that easily lol

[lethal beacon]

also the fact its automatic sucks too

its just a free way to go back to neutral if you dont make a read on the tech

[dim crystal]

His damage is fine without combos, his main issue is a lack of aerial knockback. Doubly so now that the ceiling is bigger.(higher ceilings are better in general though)

Dunk, or rocket

Bullying ledge will be easier at least.

[minor hare]

Not doing 50+ of a jab sucks bruh

[dim crystal]

Have to play neutral a little more but he does generate damage. Granted I always use burn or weakened.

IDK if it's true but I get two sair and up special off of the second jab string. (Likely not true I'm a scrub)

[blissful oxide]

They increased the ceiling that was his only way of killing it's so over martianheads

[dim crystal]

You have rocket (everyone can juke it unless you bubble it, and then it's useless if it's dodged) dunking with lazor, or jab ender after 150(!?!?) damage.

[dry ferry]

Even then they can dodge out of jab 3 I think, better off sending them to wall and trying to down attack them

[dim crystal]

They really REALLY want you to kill with that weak ass rocket. 🫠

[unique agate]

guys

anyone know how to counter a morty?

as marvin?

[steel moat]

since when did marvin become a mage

[wooden kite]

today

[dim crystal]

Let's be honest he never fitted the Assassin class.

He doesn't have the speed and damage the others got. Just a big projectile most people can avoid and the ability to reverse them.

[rare heron]

Hoping that this tech thing makes every single characters combos bad and the whole community hates it that theyre forced to remove it

[dim crystal]

They could update Marvin and give him a better kit instead. 🙂

He needs an overhaul anyhow.

[minor hare]

They could have tackled it much differently

Im not a developer or anything but wouldn’t something like if you do the same move in a combo 3 times then your opponent gets out of hitstun and can dodge immediately be better

[minor hare]

Or like 3 ground bounces

There are characters who can loop without ground bounces so i really don’t know how this is a solution for loops

[lethal beacon]

his kit is fine

also I want flag to have a hitbox on its way down similar to lebrons first hitbox on dunk

[lethal beacon]

its not like completely dookie tbh

it just sucks for certain characters

[dim crystal]

It's literally worse than all the other Mages,

And was the worst "assassin"

He could use more range and knockback in general. Also no colordown on side special, it's literally worse lasso with cooldown.

[lethal beacon]

lasso also has a cooldown and side special is pretty good tbh

you can catch reads with it and it breaks armour cuz its a multihit

and its distance is made up by bubble

also his range isnt the main issue its just that he lacks killing options which is why he feels bad

[dim crystal]

*had cool cooldown it legit don't now, and it has longer range.

[fringe trout]

Give it a cool name too, like 'attack withering' or something...

[dim bone]

Velma: are you sure about that?

[undone cradle]

Ive been hoping they would give this character a projectile cooldown and more kill power with the rest of his kit

[minor hare]

Nah

#clips message

[dim bone]

I’ve seen the clip. It’s DI’able but will probably get removed in a hotfix

[lethal beacon]

marvin might be bottom 3 this patch im ngl

combos got gutted and kill options suck

[fringe trout]

Velma got mega fixed from what I've seen
Forgot what the other low-tiers were, but we've moved down at least one spot

[lethal beacon]

velmas a lot better now im ngl

she even got a 0 to death😭

[dim bone]

It’s definitely gonna get got fixed. They’re gonna just add like 20 frames of delay between successive down specials like they did to remove Arya double up special

Without the death combo (which you can DI to escape btw), Velma is back to being bottom 1 lmao

Just a bit closer to the rest of the cast

[silk pecan]

How we feeling as the worst character in MVS?

[minor hare]

Who’s bottom 3?

[minor hare]

Craziest downplay ever

[silk pecan]

We do need changes ngl

Starvin Marvin

[silk pecan]

Marvin, Superman, Jake, Velma, and Garnet are the running canadates

[minor hare]

Your bugging

[lethal beacon]

Marvin, BG, Lebron, Jake

well thats bottom four (not ordered btw)

lebron is like higher than the rest of them but he lowkey not that good rn

I dont think velma that bad

Garnet isnt bad either

[minor hare]

Yea and remove Marvin you got bottom 3

[lethal beacon]

marvin lost like all his routes man

[minor hare]

Yea Marvin combo game is gone

But atleast he has his projectiles

They didn’t leave him empty handed 💪

[snow cradle]

superman?

[snow cradle]

Hell no

[silk pecan]

Superman is a flared character with a lot of drawbacks such as lack of combos and bugged attacks, not to mention parryable grabs

[snow cradle]

superman is fine

No marvin buffs is despicable def a bottom 3 character

[silk pecan]

He's been glitched since June

Marvin I mean

[dim bone]

Superman potential bottom 3 is such a wild take

Superman is easily an A tier character

The changes just removed all the mindless loop spammers who didn’t know how to play neutral

Velma, Garnet, Jake, Banana Guard, and Jason are my personal picks for bottom 5

[finite blaze]

Supes still can obliterate ppl off stage its just not a mario party command grab minigame anymore

[modest gyro]

Funny grab

[finite blaze]

Beta was cursed

I think beta jake superman was a top 5 comp

[modest gyro]

I miss funny grab

[wooden kite]

https://youtu.be/ip1usqfHFOc?si=JvDmWbbEJ_VhcB-t

idk if yall have seen this old cartoon network marvin video but i cant stop watching it

[dim crystal]

Memories~🎶

[lethal beacon]

superman still got his loops lol

[silk pecan]

Superman could really use a lot

[lethal beacon]

superman has never really been a lowtier

amazing weight, mobility, loops, frost breath, and armour on a lot of his moves

[fringe trout]

Infinite frost breath brings Marvin vs Supes matches to a halt. Seems like many players just forget it's an option

[silk pecan]

That's fair

Also, I'm talking about Superman as a whole. Not just against Marvin, but I figured you guys knew that.

[flint drum]

I just realized that they fixed that one marvin bug
where with the classic toon squad ref marvin, if you crouched his skirt would still be there instead of going away like every other skin, but I guess they fixed it recently, dunno when lol

[minor hare]

Damn I would think that Marvin would have a winning match up against superman

[minor hare]

True

[lethal beacon]

its feels like a 50/50 tbh

well not this patch

but last patch

[silk pecan]

^

[finite blaze]

definitely rougher in 1s but in twos superman def doesnt win

doesnt have the luxury of sitting still and forst breathing and is usually in positions where you just have the advantage between dair / dsmash / projectiles

also charge fair at the end of vertical routes is huge

being able to dodge and fair more bc of the change is v helpful

still really good in twos w/o button routes

[finite blaze]

marvin air side special still trading with bug's fair from behind (which was nerfed to supposedly not do that) lol

cooked

marvin still redirects a lot of teammates projectiles w/o interacting w them at all still... like beetlejuice's beetle

[undone cradle]

I wish they would make me not hate this character, I know hes not relevant but god damn hes annoying 😂😂

To me less projectiles and more kill power then you guys are respectable

[lethal beacon]

when a mage has projectiles

[sterile rivet]

nerf his dair and dtilt and do whatever the hell you want with him make his sair kill at 10 dmg idc

first player games fix marvin dtilt and dair hitbox and my life is yours

[worldly steeple]

if marvins down attack is nerfed he is f tier

[snow cradle]

literally

[snow cradle]

Hell no

[sterile rivet]

buff him somewhere else,he doesnt NEED to have this extremely broken super stupid innacurate hitboxes to be a character

give him kill power like everyone is asking for 🤷

[snow cradle]

Its not "extremely broken"

Complaining about a bottom 5 character is wicked

[worldly steeple]

imo the hitbox is fine, im pretty sure it is just the laser and his body its not like the tnj air down attack or anything where you get hit by air half the time

[sterile rivet]

bro just the dair alone extends to the top of his helmet when its a down shoot lazer move 😭

[worldly steeple]

he is getting zapped with electricity so the hitbox includes his body. same as beta when he came out but you cant hold it down anymore

i dont know what move we would give marvin more kill power on other than his air side special he just doesnt have any horizontal moves except down attack im pretty sure

its more of a kit limitation than a power issue

[sterile rivet]

than have actual visual cues for it,and like even than its an absurd amount of space up and down left and right of his lazer too so its kinda rough,but yeah idk how they would actually buff marvin kill power

[worldly steeple]

i think he has good kill power but you just have to play to his strength ie ring out at the top of stage. so some stages its hard like dexter 2

[snow cradle]

his whole entire body is being zapped by the gun. The hitbox is the gun and his body

[worldly steeple]

but then again dexter 2 is so short horizontally you can kill with a jab 3 or down attack from a reasonably low percent on its own so who knows.

[sterile rivet]

would be actually cool if they gave him a sig perk that swapped the zappers to the beta ones where you could hold them while taking dmg tbh

[dim crystal]

They do

[sterile rivet]

bro its a straight shot lazer move if you dont have context of the beta you arent going to expect that

[dim crystal]

I think the effect *should linger a bit more but it's there.

[undone cradle]

I think his hitboxes are fine its just they have so much annoying stuff to make him.. well annoying

If he killed better he would be a menace

Something in his kit has got to give before they give him more kill power, same with t&j imo

[dim crystal]

Get rid of flag magnetism, and make it rapidly tick up damage on enemies near it and enrage Marvin instead.

Have missiles be magnetic by default.

[undone cradle]

That sounds terrible

[dim crystal]

You just have to avoid the flag like you already should be doing.

[worldly steeple]

i would stop playing if they did that

[finite blaze]

these are all awful ideas

i dont trust 60% of marvin mains, i think even less of some one salty posting abt the char that they lost to

[worldly steeple]

i think the obvious change to give marvin better horizontal killpower is to give him a hit move on grounded side special cooldown

you can trumpet, bubble, flag, button on cooldown but not side special

he already pulls out a rifle so it could just be a buttstroke

[dim crystal]

Applies maxed weakened?

[worldly steeple]

i really like the projectile homing and think it should even probably be buffed a bit lol. weakened is better than damage tick/rage but itd still be a major blunder to take that out of marvins kit. an interesting change to me would be if cooldowns were shorter while the flag was up

but even still the issue is just that he only has one (?) move that can knockback sideways reliably, and jab3 can do it sometimes if it hits at the right angle. you can combo down special bubble up attack bubble up special air side etc etc all day but you have to play air game and ring out high. even air side attack sends diagonally up

[worldly steeple]

or maybe you could lean into mars gravity with vertical ringouts and make characters lighter/different physics if they are flagged lol. there would be a lot of reddit posts

[dim crystal]

My thinking is making his projectiles a little more sufficient on their own. As well as more emphasis on the button having functionality outside of just reversing and having rockets track nearby opponents automatically.

So with that thought, I was thinking the flag could be: Heath drain, damage/speed boost, remote pulse attack, armor or healing station ect ect....

[worldly steeple]

my issue with that is just that it makes the gameplay feel less clever. i like to catch enemies with offscreen reverses or plant a flag before the rocket fires to suddenly catch a kill

[dim crystal]

I don't mean remove reverse, I saying like the button press itself does more. I like the idea of Marvin having a fox style deflector that causes shock and deflects projectiles back.

[snow cradle]

Im honestly praying for this character

[finite blaze]

he's really in a fine spot

[dense aspen]

[finite blaze]

just fix dodge breaking his projectiles

[dim bone]

Universally across the board, projectiles should reactivate after like 2 seconds of the opponent dodging them

That would completely solve the issue with using button to reverse projectiles being useless if they’re dodged once

[finite blaze]

unfortunately side 3 lifetime would already be out lol

revert that too

[dim bone]

What’s the duration of it?

I thought it was 4 seconds

[finite blaze]

2.75 now

like nothing w how slow it moves

[dim bone]

Oof

Well, at least it would work with his other projectiles like the bubble and rocket

[finite blaze]

Ok marvin also just has side blast zone corner carry team combos thanks to fair just existing.

Marvin is the secret support character fr. Break your teammate outta ladders or multihit kill moves, buff their projectiles (BJ sand worm homing on marked ppl is funny af and insanely good), help them blast zone carry / team combo / ladder for free, one of the best dairs in the game, very high skill ceiling fullscreen projectiles, Giant kill win con that is destructible...

welcome back beta Velma (im referring to OG megaphone with "high skill ceiling projectile")

[minor hare]

They defending a hitbox that covers the character and the laser 💀💀

PFG decided to make the whole hitbox a rectangle 😬 it needs changing

[dim crystal]

is it really a rectangle, like the Laser isn't thinner?

[fringe trout]

What's crazy is that the beta laser could be held but had significantly more endlag. Now it has less endlag but cannot be held, so spamming it functions almost exactly the same as holding laser (without the accruing damage and endlag ☠️)

[finite blaze]

if you wanna take those hitboxes away ya gotta do it for every grouned option in the game that hits way behind and way above the actual moving part... and you have to make side 1-2 better and bigger otherwise he has nothing on the ground versus any ww, finn, jack, arya, harley, joker ... etc

its a big rectangle bc his other grounded options are especially small for the field of characters

and this is a 2s oriented game where PFG wanted to make it so that your moves are easier to hit multiple people with

[dim crystal]

They should do that anyway, like why is it literally it everywhere.

[finite blaze]

because its a doubles oriented game

[dim crystal]

yeah that means extending foward not backrwards

[finite blaze]

its so that it is easier to 1v2

which to be fair

is a good feeling to be able to do, you want your playerbase to feel skilled and capable

not that i particularly love trying to make it easier

bc at the top level all youre left with is very very big moves

that said i dont think marvin's dtilt is particularly egregious outta the field

[dim crystal]

most fighters exaggerate for consistency, but MVS is over doing it... it should be easier to hit in the intended direction, but not punishing people for trying to hit (which should be exposed) areas that the animation shows as vulnerable. keep in mind we have characters that can keep attacking endlessly and you do have to challenge their attacks.

[finite blaze]

theres a bit of hitbox communication issue too

at leasst from marvin's animation, and move description, he is supposed to be electrocuting himself during the move

if he had like a purple sparky radius around him it'd communicate that at least a little better

[wooden kite]

They could bring back the green lightning that was only for holding it

But use it for the regular move

[snow cradle]

Honestly isn't

[finite blaze]

idk what to tell you, i can kill bugs in a bad spot at 18

i can kill with all kinds of routes off the side on dexters but everyone in here will yell that dexters is his worst stage

marvin can corner carry in team combos exceptionally well

marvin has a very versatile win con that both him and his teammates can combo into it reasonably well and be an onscreen threat for a very long time

his side b is still really good in the air despite now trading with some ove the more overtuned moves the game has

he has one of the best dairs in the game

which only got better with the wall changes

trumpet comboing into itself to kill is crazy

theres minor bugs like platforms being collidable with air side b

and the major projectile deactivation thing

[dim crystal]

Marvin scares people who don't know his limitations, but folk who know simply doesn't gaf at all. He just a scrub killer, and you have to do more for substantially less.

[finite blaze]

i mean i'm diamond V only like, spending maybe 12 hrs in ranked queue, soloing

[dim crystal]

now overconfidence do work in our favor though

[finite blaze]

i have definitely given people a very hard time that would be familiar with the char

[dim crystal]

how your other characters ranked?

[dim bone]

I feel like most people downplay difficult characters in this game because the other characters are so easy to pick up and win with

[finite blaze]

i solo marvin soo

in beta i solo mained velma, then picked jake to just win post nerfs

right now none of the other characters nearly interest me as much as marvin

ive always been a character specialist

i could probably get my BG to diamond

and then a little more playtime on lebron i could do the same

my marvin def could be in master if i wanted to grind ranked w a static

[dim bone]

Do you mainly play 2v2 with Marvin?

[finite blaze]

2s only

the game has the vast majority of its design decisions oriented to twos that the ones game very obviously suffers

[dim bone]

That’s fair

Who do you think is Marvin’s best partner?

[finite blaze]

I think finn / joker / bugs are like the easiest choices rn?

But i think the highest ceiling of meta / skill is lebron marvin

Bugs and joker just get enabled to do their thing super hard and then can pick up kos the most off of marvins errant hits.

Im starting to think marvin / bj is really really good too

The stun/ and tag goes crazy for the missile win con and the team corner carries and how many of the 50/50s are just entirely covered by both kits in that situation?

Bomb being an additional setplay win con for marvin to work with is p cool too

On top of mark making the sandworm into a full fledged projectile

Might static with my favorite beetlejuicer

[dim bone]

Yeah I heard about this but haven’t seen it personally yet

[finite blaze]

The door immediately starts homing before the worm comes out

[dim crystal]

#wishlist-discussion message

[finite blaze]

i just dont think that extreme of a rework is warranted or even feasible for the dev team dawg

[dim crystal]

Extreme? They all could technically use existing assets.

[finite blaze]

its like five new moves and one of them needs new assets, many more projectile interactions to consider too

flag in the air does not need to be a spike he already has one of the best dairs in the game

[dim crystal]

First two aren't supposed to coexist, it's an either or thing

Flag is not for off stage, you can't cancel the it. The aerial version should do something other than just making you vulnerable.

The shoulder drop is to compensate for down special becoming a double sided attack where Marvin himself is does knockback and the laser is a combo tool.

[weak helm]

whats a good perk setup for marvin? rn i have the up air aim, fire projectile, movement, and meelee

[dim crystal]

Weaken makes killing much easier, but also speed would make fis jab string more reliable.

[weak helm]

any replacement for melee perk?

[dim crystal]

No, just don't. Shock requires 4 full seconds of ground movement and Marvin already has a good armor break *baked into his moveset.

[fringe trout]

Static only works in 1v1s after a kill

Mostly impractical otherwise

[iron wadi]

Marvin's a mage now

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1143378706727964692/1170922541146189915/lv_0_20231003212844.gif?ex=655acd98&is=65485898&hm=97b8fb32ce037ed41059c69c9af9eaa4ff5d26bf0daa76cc2484d6ec62267e37&

Oh.

[finite blaze]

Class him as support :^)

[weak totem]

no marvin buffs...

[idle schooner]

I'm sorry. Ive been a Marvin main for a bit now. And I can say with confidence. He is a ton of fun, but he is absolute cheeks.

He's fun and annoying at best.

I've let y'all convince me otherwise a few times. Naw. He needs some TLC

[finite blaze]

I would make his side 1 and 2 bigger, revert side 3 lifetime and then scale kbg a little harder on fair /charged fair but thats really it

Maybe make the on hit dodge cancel windows for some moves earlier

Mainly headbutt / trumpet

But trumpet is already good enough in that regard you can charge fair and kill off the top fairly early after the dodge cancel

Will ride or die "skill issue" bc ppl are not recognizing how potent fair / aerial ssp are for kills

[idle schooner]

You can champion for him as much as you want. Theres no fear. People can flat out ignore you when your ship is out to not get hit by the 1 move that kills below 125. Whats going to happen to them? Theyre going to get hit by a mediocre projectile that unless youre braindead, its probably not going to kill you below 150. He hs no "big punich" move. What his down attack? that is a good utility move but is garbage other wise

He does nothing better than anyone else.

He needs TLC

Side special has a lot of prio... until it doesnt. Just abysmal projectiles. He may get nerfed again in the furure, but likely going to be complaining of spamming. Will he deserve it? Nope. But neither did Lebron

I need to find a new character. Its not very fun anymore working twice as hard as the rest of the roster and getting half the payoff. Again no fear. Alot of marvins moves in a certain redius are NEGATIVE ON HIT. you lose the exchange when you hit them. Insanity

[finite blaze]

Theres a ton of moves in the game that are negative on hit.. bc you are at 0-30%, does it make sense that on marvin thats cooldown bubble? Maybe not but its also cooldown bubble

Side special getting nerfed was an issue, i dont disagree

It should never be trading with reverse hitboxes from behind

Your problem is still only thinking of "how does he kill" where you are only considering center of the stage and not "60-120 near a blastzone"

How can i route so that my things that actually kill do in fact work.

Its like idk melee marth. If you only were considering "opponent at center stage at 100%" then yeah you'd come to the conclusion that marth cannot kill.

Like missile kills from 60 if they are center screen. Earlier if theyre above that. requires you hitting them just once to put them not center stage, maybe twice

If they are chasing UFO you can kill them so easily for it

Because you put your ufo in a position where your 2 hit 3 hit confirms will kill

Very few characters can one shot ufo

A finn using back pack on ufo should be dead every time

[tawny crane]

The problem is that Marvin can't even kill at the ledge
He has dtilt but that's all he has. When the opponent knows what you're going for, they will avoid it at all costs, and when they do, you will be hitting fair at 140% and they will live
Besides, I've hit dtilt at the ledge even with the tip while they're offstage and I've had opponents live at 120%

[finite blaze]

The wall change fixes that issue

Going off to actually edgeguard fixes that issue

[tawny crane]

If they have few resources offstage then sure, if the opponent hugs the wall then that's not an issue, you have dair and ftilt-3
But no good player is going to be wall sliding against Marvin

[finite blaze]

People so often let their opponents take wall for free

[tawny crane]

I agree with that definitely

Marvin has a ton of ways to punish people on the wall

but the issue is when people recover high

[finite blaze]

Marvin has moves to burn those resources

Thats where side special and space invader are huge

They burn a dodge and they are getting laddered

[tawny crane]

That's the problem though, if you're going for those moves then you aren't going for the move that actually kills i.e. dtilt
side special and up special are not going to kill until at least 120%

the opponent will gladly take those hits if it means getting back

[finite blaze]

If you are hitting side special at ledge sure.. but i mean actually going out and using it to contest before that point

Next to the blast zone it kills stupid early

You can fade back down and low with it a ton and basically feint with it

You can wait their dodge out

Bubble helps a lot in cutting off one resource option while air ssp covers another

[tawny crane]

I can believe that, but the problem is that you are giving up Marvin advantage state for a yolo
I'm sure that it does kill mad early near the blastzone, but what if your opponent reversals you? You die at 50
What if they recover even higher? Or go under you? What if you're fighting Rick and he just portals past you?
Marvin can't take that risk because he doesn't want to give up the advantage state he worked so hard to get, it's why so many Marvins prefer to ledge trap, because he has a ridiculous number of ledge trapping tools

sadly, very few of which actually result in a kill

If we're talking about 2v2s tho then I agree because your ally can help cover the ledge, but I also don't have too much experience with 2v2s so I can't talk too much about that

[tawny crane]

I will say though that side special feinting is something that I think people should do a lot more, even in neutral

being able to say "this is my space, beware" is so powerful especially on a character with such otherwise stubby hitboxes

surprisingly, air side special might be better at controlling space than bubble or ground side special lmao

[merry escarp]

IN THE NAME OF MARS

[worldly steeple]

@plucky mural you play ok but you shouldnt even be close to losing to samurai jack with constant lag. switch your perks to 5% fire last stand pugilist and your wr% will go up.

[finite blaze]

Again there. Is a flowchart on the edgeguard that leaves marvin in great positions/positions to kill regardless.

Like going underneath is really in marvins favor just bc dair has crazy range

Even if you cant press out all the way you can reset the edgeguard situation with plenty of solid hits that will let you have time to refresh your resources, giving you a lot more advantage the next time.

Edgeguarding is criminally underimplemented by the playerbase

It is fairly more complex bc of the amount of resources sure. But its possible and makes certain characters extremely meta relavant, i.e. Superman or Garnet

[dim crystal]

Regardless, he has to do more just to get less than the majority of the cast. On top of being feather light.

[tawny crane]

yeah, regardless of what Marvin can do to kill or get an upper hand, other characters just do it passively
sadly viability works relative to other characters, Marvin does have things that work but ultimately it's the bare minimum in this game

[fringe trout]

Balanced and high tier because he has biiiig rocket (nothing bad happens when it's dodged once)

[tawny crane]

who will win
a massive tactical missile
or
the right trigger button

[sterile rivet]

very big rocket though...

[tight laurel]

No matter what, I think Marvin is goated

[snow cradle]

I wish he was

[finite blaze]

he is trust..

[finite blaze]

that dodge exists is not the death of the character

like anyone else he's got 50/50s because of it

he was ways of making them burn dodge before missile is there, with mark+another projectile

[merry escarp]

I literally got this game just for Marvin the Martian

[wooden kite]

Yessss

[merry escarp]

I really want a ring-out kinda like the American flag one except it’s Marvin’s flag

In the name of mars

[wooden kite]

Thatd me neat

[dry ferry]

We need a K9 ringout

[wooden kite]

A k9 banner would also be nice
Or like Marvin and k9 together

[acoustic sail]

Stop normalizing the grind and normalize conquering shtuff in the name of Mars.

[merry escarp]

Fr

[fringe trout]

Figured out the double bubble bug that occurs occasionally
When a small bubble is fired the frame before the cooldown ends, it creates both bubbles
#combos message

Super hard to do consistently, took me 30+ attempts for one

[dim crystal]

Marvin can bubble BeetleJuice's window.... but why?

[acoustic sail]

It's technically a projectile.

[wooden kite]

I was gonna test that since I noticed it gets teleported on the door rifts

[finite blaze]

It also will track a marked opponent its really good

[azure saddle]

istg i thought marvin was an assassin

ya wait the website says he is, but in game hes a mage

im not insane

when did it change?

[fringe trout]

Was changed in the most recent patch
He is no longer the worst assassin, but now the worst mage 😁

[finite blaze]

realheads know he is the best support

[tawny crane]

I think his archetype fits best as an assassin, he's a glass cannon rush-down type fighter that capitalizes off pressure and overwhelming the opponent
he's always had some mage capabilities, but it's not like he does anything near as mage-like as other mages like Rick and Bugs

but eh, it's not like it matters

[sterile rivet]

wth lmao

i need to see this ingame thats crazy

marvin not being a mage always bugged me though like his jab has a projectile,he has a whole rocket move,he can make projectiles homing,change the directions of projectiles,has silly lazer disjoints and a whole bubble mechanic about combining different projectiles along with the projectile to pull enemies

it was very silly being an assasin

[finite blaze]

nah dog he kills in a way that assassins do

he has a very in your face win con in missile, a marking mechanic like other assassins, corner carries, some of the best early edgeguard ko's

very early ko's if you play to the win con correctly, play the positions correctly

changing the direction of projectiles, with how small all the other ones are, or how slow missile is comparitively, is something that just has a higher demand of precision than a bugs or a joker

especially when you are utilizing the bubble to release up attacks / side 3's / up air's at specific angles / positions

jab 3 is too slow to send out compared to other mage projectiles

same with default bubble like it just doesn't play like joker card or rick laser

[acoustic sail]

Easy Fix: Dual Classing

They can even bring back Support if they do that.

[tawny crane]

honestly dual classing would be perfect for Marvin

he's definitely assassin/mage

although I think he's more of an assassin than mage, he defo does have mage capabilities

[tawny crane]

tbf a character having projectiles doesn't mean they're a mage
Stripe is the example I like to use a lot, he has a saw that he uses very similarly to Marvin's jab-3 and bubble, he has a homing mechanic with his gun similar to Marvin's flag, and he has a gun that can extend combos and even send in different directions depending on where Stripe is facing
if anything, Marvin and Stripe are actually surprisingly similar

[sterile rivet]

i mean yeah but like just the ammount of projectile based things marvin has

[tawny crane]

the main things that Marvin has that are mage-like imo are his rocket and immense number of cool-downs which show a large element of resource management, but even then it's not a defining feature of his gameplan imo

[sterile rivet]

reversin them,combining them,making them homing, and just the amount he has

stipe has like 2 its not really comparable

[tawny crane]

sure but I also just don't think projectiles are a feature of mages in general

think of Rick, the guy has two projectiles, three if you count his down special

but he's a mage because his gameplan is wacky, involves lots of setup and requires you to be able to combine his moves in a way that compliments his combo potential

[sterile rivet]

yeah i mean true but both mean the same thing

[dim crystal]

It is Mages are projectile centric

[sterile rivet]

ricks a mage because he has very wacky magelike kit and marvins a mage because hes so projectile and projectile movement centered

[dim crystal]

Marvin is a trapper like bugs

[tawny crane]

I disagree
if that was the case then Marvin would've been a mage immediately and not 3 months in

they assigned him to be an assassin initially because he plays like one
but at some point they changed their minds

[sterile rivet]

i mean he was an assasin in beta and it just sticked

[dim crystal]

He's a mage because they didn't want two Looney tunes characters in the same class.

[tawny crane]

did he have the same tools in beta?
I didn't play beta so I can't talk about that

[tawny crane]

source?

[sterile rivet]

nah every characters changed atleast somehwat,shoulda been mage from the start imot hough. might have been tbh my memory of betas kinda blurry

[tawny crane]

well idk, I just think that since Marvin wasn't a mage straight away, it shows that mage =/= projectile character

but idk if there's an official description for what a "mage" is

it seems like a pretty loose assignment

[sterile rivet]

yeah i mean most of the character classes litteraly dont mean anything anyways

[tawny crane]

true, I mentioned earlier that it literally doesn't matter besides missions lmao

it's not a big deal

[sterile rivet]

but to be fair every other like 3+ projectile character is a mage im p sure so its kind of a trend

[tawny crane]

I think it's more because characters that have a lot of projectiles tend to be more campy or setup-y so they just go under that umbrella

I thought it was kinda cool that Marvin was a projectile heavy character that uses his projectiles in a different way, to corner his opponents and snipe their escape options, but eh

I mean that's why I think he's more of an assassin, he's similar to Stripe etc in that vein but I won't deny that he does do stuff similar to mages

[dim crystal]

What do you think mage mean

[tawny crane]

I think a mage is a character that primarily sets up combo routes like Rick, keeps the opponent out like Reindog, or generally plays in an unorthodox manner like Bugs

basically a character that plays outside of the "normal" playstyle you would expect in a plat fighter, they are outliers

in contrast, I would define an "assassin" to be a more glass-cannon archetype that aims to rush an opponent down and prioritise putting the opponent in a bad position to capitalise off of their lack of options, which imo, Marvin does all the time

basically a character that likes to overwhelm and juggle

[dim crystal]

Granted it's just my guess, but it does seem more likely that they just didn't want to have another mage.

Apparently PFG said he was initially a mage on stream (according to his wiki, but it's wiki)

[tawny crane]

yeah yeah initially a mage

which tbf makes it even more interesting that they changed him to assassin

I wish someone could ask them but I imagine they're very busy lol

I'm okay with him being a mage anyway, better than outright lying and saying he's a bruiser

[dim crystal]

Batman is definitely an assassin and frankly so is Joker 🙃

But joker is heavier for some damn reason .....

[terse dock]

The nerfs made him an assassin

He was too agressive to be one

[brave remnant]

Batarang doesn't do this. It hits on the way back if initially dodged

[exotic token]

Ig he gets special treatment then

[brave remnant]

I was messing with bats and saw this. Confirmed it then ran to test Marvin thinking they had fixed the issue, but I guess it's just bats

[fringe trout]

Marvin is too op. Phantom projectiles help balance him out 🙏

[acoustic sail]

Explain how he's overpowered without sounding like a buffoon.

[fringe trout]

Rocket is waaay to powerful. Like it kills from the ground at 120?? wth?? Combine that with tracking debuff and it's impossible to avoid, plus the ship is too difficult to destroy and shouldn't fire so quickly

Up air spam does too much knockback and kills ridiculously early. And the disintegration pistol is impossible to dodge

[worldly steeple]

bait

[dry ferry]

Bro doesn't know what the dodge button is

[deft bear]

i have learned that no matter how good or bad a character is people WILL find a way to complain about something

[acoustic sail]

Tell me you use dodge unwisely without telling me you use dodge unwisely.

[dim crystal]

It was clearly sarcasm lol

[fringe trout]

Bruh don't even get me started on the dash attack

[acoustic sail]

Dash Attack is more inconsistent than Harley Quinn, and I haven't seen a single Marvin who uses that competitively.

I'll give you the up air spam tho. It can get annoying when you run out of aerial actions.

[fringe trout]

I always misinput that while going for jabs 😭
Free hits on you if you ever drop dash, the endlag is crazy

(Also forgot to link my latest compilation here for the Martian army: #clips message )

[snow cradle]

Huh!???? Rocket is easily avoidable. Dying at 120 isnt crazy at ALL

The ship is gone within 2 - 3 hits

sometimes 1 fully charged hit

Oh ragebait 🤦‍♂️ bro got me

[finite blaze]

Simply hit them into rocket midscreen at 60 gg ez

[sterile rivet]

bro is a marvin main its ragebait yall 😭

[finite blaze]

I was memeing

Halfway 😉

[sterile rivet]

thats so skibidi

[tight laurel]

I shall main this character in the name of Mars!

[fringe trout]

We many not have properly functioning projectiles (Batman does ), but we do have the best crouch animation
#fan-art message

[acoustic sail]

Definitely the best crouch animation.

[wooden kite]

That looks so cute

Do you post art on any social?

[fringe trout]

Unfortunately not
Don't use much outside of Discord and YouTube

[wooden kite]

That’s a shame
I really like the style of that piece

[plucky mural]

just saw this, thanks for the feedback

[tawny crane]

how can people not tell that this is sarcasm lmao the person was complaining about rocket killing at 120 idk how you make sarcasm more obvious

[snow cradle]

Theres people that genuinely want marvin nerfed so theres no telling 🤷‍♂️

[fringe trout]

I know 😭
We got button nerfed then larger hitboxes. Only buff has been the bubble mechanics
Minor changes but characters like WW get unlimited lasso

[sterile rivet]

ww lasso is such a goofy change

they realized it was a problem changed it noone complained about the nerf and they took it back for no reason so silly

[tawny crane]

wasn't the bubble thing only just a bug fix anyway

[fringe trout]

Pretty much
Allowed for some cool new interactions with jab 3 and rifle

[finite blaze]

Ppl need to use trumpet > forward air more its gross af (yet another kill confirm wowie)

[sick solar]

Ngl this character its absolutely gross

[sterile rivet]

i would disagree with you but i was told if i disagree with you im wrong so ill keep it to myself 🙏

[lethal beacon]

havent played marv since teching got introduced

cuz he lost a lot of combo routes

did anybody find anything

or is he still feeling dookie

[finite blaze]

he lost the singles only button only stuff

in doubles his combos and team combos are the same

[lethal beacon]

button was a huge part of his combos in 1s

i dont really play doubles too much so i cant say how he is in doubles

[finite blaze]

he still has fair / bubble / side b trumpet / jab 1-2 iad aerial

still has the best dair in the game

[lethal beacon]

you can still hit a few bubble stuff but losing button felt really bad

you cant hit dair into button too

[finite blaze]

its bad but not gutting

[lethal beacon]

that would be the case if marvin didnt suck prior

[finite blaze]

you just have to play to keeping them in bad positions above you after the dair bounce

you can still get 3-4 hits after

[lethal beacon]

marvin bottom 4 in 1s so he dont feel too good

[finite blaze]

it just looks like 40% instead of 60/70

[lethal beacon]

yeahh

[finite blaze]

which is what most characters are now

[lethal beacon]

kinda wish it was 3 ground bounces instead of 2

but its not even like teching solved the problem it was intended to solve

[finite blaze]

it worked at least on tnj and like some of the cast

[lethal beacon]

superman still gets away with it cuz of his dodge distance

[finite blaze]

yeah i mean theres always gonna be workarounds and different ways of routing that don't ground bounce for top tiers. its very easy to avoid a second ground bounce in 2s and keep comboing with your teammate

marvin mains learn how to take away the opponents air resources challenge impossible

[silk pecan]

Who's ready for more Marvin nerfs?!

[deft bear]

button is gonna resets projectile activity if its dodged woo

[flint drum]

marvin is finally playable again pfft

[vestal pine]

OMG YES

[sterile rivet]

we got marvin the apple tease at the end he wears an apple on his head instead of a helmet

[silk pecan]

They fixed it?!

[brave remnant]

Thank God, I've developed some weird tactics to prevent that issue, now I'll be able to just play and react how i want instead of trying to force specific scenarios to avoid less than optimal "features"

[deft bear]

they mention it at like 1:21:55 in the vid if you wanna see it https://youtu.be/rV4Onq-YAjI

[wooden kite]

Hallelujah