・theorycrafting

[gaunt tangle]

Kazuha or future dendro archon?

[cedar zodiac]

#・tc-lounge

[faint zenith]

they're so far apart that there's little chance you couldn't pull both

go for it

[rocky bronze]

Does anyone have Raiden Hyper Sheets

[small meteor]

does the Character Healing Effectiveness also works to other characters affected by a heal casted from other character like Shinobu or the artifact 2-pc set bonus only benefits Shinobu?

[real steppe]

that's a question for #・genshin-help but afaik that's just healing bonus worded wrong if you equip it you'll get 15% HB

[small meteor]

ohh ok thankss

[rocky bronze]

Thanks!

[west talon]

Can someone explain to me how the dendro x electro reaction works and how that is good for yae miko?

Let’s say ____ dendro character has 600 EM, how does that scale to buff yae Miko electro damage?

[plucky junco]

1. According to Genshin Intel, intensified scaled off em of the character who deals buffed dmg.
   So, Yae Miko's electro dmg scales off her own EM. EM of the dendo character 's won't influence the dmg buff from intensified reaction. Or is there any other leaker, who said dmg buff of intensified reaction scales off the character who triggered the reaction?

2. Intensified reaction buffed your character 's base damage.
   This is similar with the dmg buff of shenhe ' s elemental skills for cyro characters.

[plucky junco]

According to Genshin Intel, your character who is buffed by intensified, will have 3200 base dmg buff at 600 EM However, the dmg buff of intensified scales off the character dealing buffed dmg, it is not realistic to let the character who deals damage, stack 600 EM.

[torn ginkgo]

@plucky junco the character of the opposite element gets a buff and, yes, it looks like flat dmg.

[neon zealot]

r1 spine diluc, r1 catch xl, r3 fav kaz, proto Bennett uwu

[neon zealot]

@rugged spire no pressure ily :3

[rugged spire]

cons ?

[neon zealot]

oop

c0 diluc c6 ben c6 xl c0 kaz

[cosmic coyote]

Any idea how much a C3 Gorou with E-Skill Talent Level 13 improves the damage of a C0 Itto? CR/CD is 77/221

[faint zenith]

entirely dependent on comp

[languid badge]

has anyone done the calcs on if with a standard hu tao team (hu tao, zhongli, xingqiu) if albedo or yelan is better in the last slot?

assuming yelan is c0 and xingqiu is c6

albedo also c0

[sly flint]

Yelan would be better

[west talon]

Okay , so is this New EM artifact set BIS for yae miko?

I have a good 70-200crit 2k Atk yae miko built with r3 widsth so I need to mentally prepare myself if I need to rebuild

At least fischl is getting a nice skin so I can slap those artifacts on her instead

[mystic citrus]

Will Hu Tao bot ever be fixed?

[sly flint]

first of all #╰・server-discussion・✧ will probably be the better place to ask, secondly, for what?

[mystic citrus]

Directly in reference to these sticky messages, the previous ones are supposed to be cleared and only the latest stays.

It used to be like that, here.

Idk what broke

[sly flint]

sure I'll ask about it, thank you for your suggestion

[sly flint]

It's not broke, it cuz the lack of activity here, the bot doesn't get refreshed. So it's working the same as how it is on any other channel, just looks "not cleared" due to the lack of activity

[mystic citrus]

If I scroll up before 6/10, it's like there was no bot. There was one instance of this way, way up somewhere that didn't get cleared.

[sly flint]

is that causing issues for how you're using this channel?

[mystic citrus]

It's not really a pressing matter, that's why my original message is more of a joke than anything. But it is annoying.

[sly flint]

well sry for that but there's not much we can do, thanks again for bringing this up we can move on since its getting off-topic

[real steppe]

read bot message pls

[stone oak]

and wondering what element it will be

[real steppe]

please go to #・tc-lounge for this

[real steppe]

also don't repost the leaks or share screenshots of them, thank you

[hearty mauve]

From what we know does Dendro have the highest dmg when it come to reaction and got the boost?

[torn ginkgo]

What u mean?

[hearty mauve]

Compared to overload and the other reaction... does dendro have the highest dmg reaction

[torn ginkgo]

It is now known that dendro-reaction is a transformative. Gi_leaker reported this a few months ago.

[devout cliff]

It is a transformative reaction that is added like Shenhe's quills in the formula so the comparison is flawed

[torn ginkgo]

If u check the burning on dendro slimes, u can to see that a shit.

[hearty mauve]

Ah ok I see what you mean

[west talon]

heres to hoping nilou is a hydro sword hypercarry dps

from the two small clips, it seems that shes an on-field character so thats cool

also her animations waaahhhg

[real steppe]

not the channel for this go to #・tc-lounge

[west talon]

oops sorry i misclicked lolz

[uneven chasm]

You guys think we might be able to swirl/crystallize dendro? I know we can't do it right now with the dendro samachurls but...is there a chance?

[zinc cave]

I don’t believe so- leaks say that Dendro primarily works with Pyro, Electro and Hydro. There seems to be potential for Cryo related activity, but it seems Anemo and Geo aren’t getting any crumbs sadge

[real steppe]

don't share pictures of those leaks, thanks

[zinc cave]

Ah sorry! Will do

[real steppe]

also this isn't for #・theorycrafting but feel free to pop up in any of our leaks channels for a discussion

[zinc cave]

Sounds good!

[faint zenith]

I think you misunderstand the meaning of theorycrafting lmao

[agile sorrel]

is upcoming event weapon good for kazuha? that was tested in beta right? how was the result?

[cedar zodiac]

no result on the new weapon on sheets yet

[cedar zodiac]

#・tc-lounge please

[torn ginkgo]

I think no. Kazu feels good with EM (include a sign sword) or elem dmg bonus weapons.

[glass swift]

Uh

[lost dirge]

Recommended heizou build?

[cedar zodiac]

#976003370101915668

[cyan spindle]

So I'm testing Shinobu's C4, and it says that it's supposed go desl 9.7% of her max HP as electro dmg.
With 39617 max HP, her C4 hits should be hitting 3842 before any other multipliers, like electro damage and crit.

My Shinobu has 75% crit damage, and 46% electro damage, yet on a successful crit of her C4, only deals 4488.

Even if the electro damage modifier weren't applied it should still be criting somewhere in the 6k range.

Any ideas?

[fading light]

Are you taking enemy defense and resistance into account?

Cuz while 9.7% of 39617 is 3842.
But you won't be doing the full dmg raw under any circumstances

[cyan spindle]

Hydro samachurls have a 10% electro damage res, and iirc 500 defence.

They'd need around 40% electro res to bring the damage down to 4k, if it was actually doing 9.7% of her max HP.

[outer crow]

the damage modifier for enemy defense is calculated using the formula (char lvl + 100)/(enemy lvl + char lvl +200), usually comes out to a modifier of roughly 0.5x which would explain your damage being where it is at after resistance, crit dmg and electro dmg bonus mods

[glacial star]

people still trying to make her electro dps? why not try phys

[torn ginkgo]

I think because for this need 4pieses of pale flame set. And triple em electro-charged is very pure and flex build.

[torn ginkgo]

Friends, can i see yelan sheets? I want to knoe what exactly work her a4

[frozen python]

wdym by "what exactly works for her A4"?

[torn ginkgo]

I mean does the dmg bonus remain after the character switch. Can i enter her in quick swap team without carry character (as ayaka diluc xiao)

[frozen python]

the dmg bonus would keep on stacking even when u switch chars

[torn ginkgo]

Thx u👍
I really want to play with catgirl, i believe yelan can help her.

[frozen python]

she can but the team DPS still isn't that great unfortunately

[untold walrus]

hi any purples can help out in the collab room ? thank u, much appreciated !

[robust sentinel]

Does anybody know if the damage bonus to swirl of VV affect shenhe's quills if a cryo infused swirl activates them? In other words, does the VV %Damage Bonus to swirl get multiplied by the Flat Damage that Shenhe adds? I assume that this is not the case, but wouldn't mind a confirmation

[rugged spire]

cryo swirls don't proc shenhe quills

[robust sentinel]

Ah shit you're right I forgot about the conditionality of her buff... Thanks

[cosmic coyote]

When are we having a Tighnari Theory Crafting?

[polar nimbus]

Really? I thought it does

[rugged spire]

Nah I doesn't but cryo infusion for stuff like kaz ult does

[cedar zodiac]

#・tc-lounge

[cosmic coyote]

That 25% Max HP hydro resonance will ne a game changer for a Hutao, Zhongli, Yelan, and XQ comp, right?

[devout cliff]

#・tc-lounge

[pine ivy]

guys what's a good elemental mastery for kazuha

[devout cliff]

#・tc-lounge

[granite idol]

I´m doing some maths on the new catalyze reaction and if thundering fury is better for it then the new EM Artefact set and so far, it seems like thundering fury might be better, but then there are those electro character that scale on EM which makes in much more complicated, so I wounder if for yae the EM set might still be better, there are my maths so far, this is just the buff flat dmg, no attack, electro dmg or crit is calculated in here and level multiplayer is 1447 since I consider everyone will max level their electro character used in dendro comps:
The first number is the EM set I used 180 more EM in the calcs for this set, since I consider most people will use 2 character of the same element, the EM number in brackats is the base EM which both characters would have without the set bonus and I calculated with a 1.4 multiplier for the thundering fury buff since it will give 40% more catalyze dmg when 3.0 releases.
4218 / 3927 (20 EM) /// 7031 / 5511 (500 EM)

[granite idol]

i made some more theorycrafting and my results for Yae E are that if thundering fury buffs the flat dmg that comes in from catalyze by 40% then Thundering fury becomes better at 500EM+ before that she would prefer the EM set because it gives her free 180EM and catalyze + yae A4 passiv scale really good until 500 where her A4 passive reaches deminishing return. This maths are not proessional, I´m not good at maths and never did a theorycraft myself, but since I´m really interested in yae and how 3.0 changes and catalyze might affect her I wanted to calculate it, in hope that others with more knowledge try it and might find better results and which set is best for yae including her burst

[digital tiger]

Hey guys will double geo team comps will still be viable with the hydro resonance buff (Yelan+Xingqiu)

[devout cliff]

#・tc-lounge and your question should be over meta not viability, because geo res doesn't change

[digital tiger]

Oh alr tnx

[keen cradle]

20% more, no?

from 4TF update

anyway, my sheet is updated for everything except quicken/spread/aggravate, enjoy

I'll add those as soon as I'm confident in the #s I'm putting in

[granite idol]

is it just 20%? If so this might change some numbers I would have to look it up again

[lapis whale]

How much crystallize damage is 1k em dendro reaction?

[gaunt tangle]

What does quicken do?? Like does it makes attacks faster ??

[robust sentinel]

Wish I could post in the dendro theorycrafting thread but I don't have the role. I've been experimenting with the reactions in spreadsheets and one thing that's quite apparent is that there is a possible inconsistency between spread/aggravate applying to transformative reactions beyond crit/no crit: electro/dendro dmg bonus. It would seem to me that it either applies for both (not how I read Genshin Intel's tweet) or to neither. If it's neither, then the damage formula for talents is quite sth...

would be sth like this (example for electro) damage:
[(Talent base damage x special multipliers) x electro damage bonus + aggravate base damage x aggravate damage bonus] x Crit x EnemyRes x EnemyDef

Thoughts?

Doesn't seem to have been addressed in that thread hence the question... Basing the thoughts on this tweet in comparison to the other one where it's said that it can crit (plus new artifact descriptions about boosting aggravate damage specifically) https://twitter.com/Genshin_Intel/status/1547768018830123015?s=20&t=oYwZToiC6gESPUqesQW3AQ

Genshin Intel (@Genshin_Intel)

Q: Does Aggravate buff Swirl?
A: Swirl electro damage is buffed by LevelMultiplier×1.15×[1+(5×EM)/(EM+1200)]×EnemyResMultiplier. In this case, the buff won't crit.

Q: What is flat damage?
A: Info on how flat damage affects outgoing damage: https://t.co/yciB1x3wEC

Likes

180

Twitter · Jul 15, 2022, 2:20 AM

@keen cradle sorry for the ping, I see you're active in the dendro thread and have a spreadsheet on the reactions... What are your thoughts on this? Thanks in advance

[keen cradle]

all crit and dmg bonus apply to it

one sec lemme copy paste my thing from kusa mains

[robust sentinel]

Oh and then elemental damage doesn't apply to transformative reactions?

[keen cradle]

oh I should update that we did get some info on how swirl works

[keen cradle]

correct

[primal whale]

is there any calculations for raiden with dendro already?

[robust sentinel]

Cool! Guess I should join kusa mains haha

[robust sentinel]

Awesome thanks, no need to change my sheets then haha

[primal whale]

what about resists?

[robust sentinel]

When it affects talents both defence and resistance apply. When it affects transformative reactions only resistance applies

[primal whale]

defense is not applied yea?

[robust sentinel]

On transformative reactions, correct

[primal whale]

it looks really strong then

[robust sentinel]

Not on talents tho

Where it can crit

[primal whale]

why

[robust sentinel]

Cause it’s flat damage

Added to the formula inside the base damage part

[primal whale]

oh i got it

hope it will be buffed then

[torn ginkgo]

There are enough questions have:

1. Can swirl trigger an aggregate?
2. What is aggravate/spread reactions, 1st, transformative. Why can it crit?
3. Duration, is there icd?

[spice hound]

1. Yes even tho in that case it behaves as a transformative reaction
2. Aggravate/Spread are to be taken more like Yunjin's/Shenhe's skills, since they take in consideration DMG bonus and crit from the triggering character (when they are not triggered by a swirl)
3. 

[cloud imp]

Are there any summaries of dendro reactions?

[cloud imp]

Thanks

Is burning a good source of pyro application? That is will repeated cryo/hydro application interrupt burning?

[devout cliff]

No they changed it, it now works more like a freeze aura

[shell carbon]

Anyone got the bloom formula?

[cursive summit]

(i know ganyu xiangling bennet ZL is insanely good while not even requiring vv setup, but for people without zl...)

I've ran ganyu xiangling sucrose yanfei before and while the setup is quite finnicky the damage is decent, particularly good vs aoe content where you can ganyu burst during setup and double swirl easily.

maybe with burning, you could run ganyu dendro yanfei anemo, to use yanfei as the fire starter.

while not particularly powerful, it lets you put xiangling AND bennet on the other team

meaning you can for the first time run melt ganyu with basically any other team on the other half

unforunately yanfei has to go after sucrose, cutting into vv time, unless you are vs aoe can you can swirl both pyro/cyro until the pyro wins

[west talon]

how good is electro x dendro Yae miko hyper carry compared to just mono electro kazuha swirl or electro charge kazu swirl teams?

Is it worth switching over? Or is dendro x electro team comps more reserved for dendro units ?

[violet wing]

is the trawler bow good for yelan?

[mystic citrus]

Beta modded ERC with Uba’s latest particle counts. Does not include Collei C1 or Dori C4, as those can be rotation dependent or otherwise difficult to account for (if anyone thinks of a clever way to do it, feel free to ping me).

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Ho_FP1qq-_JgywTK0LyEuxUs6fk-yOwgN8NrntwOJHo/edit#gid=747187926

[keen cradle]

Analysis of Electro DPSes + Aggravate
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/13LhrRO2JH72HB7iWmt6glmEBoex3EGnIY863gVcBL6U/edit?usp=sharing

[uneven chasm]

can kazuha swirl 3 times instead of 2 by hitting the enemy hitbox with his plunge?

like what xiao does to do a bit of extra damage

[primal whale]

how good is akuoumaru for beidou?

is it better than battlepass claymore?

[crimson compass]

is the bot message not big enough or like? it literally sends in between people's messages and they still send it like?

[grave delta]

So, I haven't touched double auras (e.g. Electro + Hydro Electrocharge aura) in like a year.

Theoretically, if the enemy has a Electro + Dendro aura on them, and your totally-theoretical Zhongli pillar hits that aura, would it cause Crystallize?
Then, completely-theoretically, could Fischl A4 proc off of that Crystallize reaction (like it normally does right now, pre-Dendro)?
Finally, could a super-theoretical Fischl proc Aggravate as a result, turning Oz into an Aggravate turret which resonates with Zhongli's pillar?

I know we won't know for sure until we can do testing in game. I just want to know if I'm missing something based on what we already know.

[odd mountain]

As far as I'm aware:

1. Yes, when you apply Geo to an Electrocharged enemy you still get a crystallize, specifically a Hydro Crystallize if i remember correctly.

2. Yes, Fischl does proc A4 off this Crystallize reaction.

3. Afaik, even without the Geo application Fischl automatically procs Aggravate through her A4. After the Dendro Element is applied to an enemy with Electro Aura, Fischl's A4 immediately procs, triggering Aggravate.

[grave delta]

Well, the thing about the Geo application is that Fischl's A4 requires the on-field character to trigger the reaction, Zhongli being an on-field driver in this case.

Good to know about Crystallize with Electro-Charged

[torn ginkgo]

Does the buff of aggravate depend on the character that triggered it? How many em needed to char on avg.

[spice hound]

Aggravate buffs the electro attack that triggers it, and we don't have a specific range of EM since it will mostly depend on each character's own scalings

[violet wing]

is the trawler bow good for yelan?

[devout cliff]

Pls read the big message from Hu Tao bot 🙂

[abstract maple]

When calcing a team rotation, how much time should i leave for like human error? cause i assume when trying to do a rota i wont be able to fully do perfect frame switches

[pale berry]

at least add average ping (like 80 ms or something) after every character swap

[topaz viper]

Some people assume frame perfect

Otherwise you can record the rotation yourself and adjust

[robust wind]

do we know if Aggravate is limited to attacks that apply electro, rather than any attack that deals electro damage (limited by ICD)?

[signal breach]

#・tc-lounge is a better place for this question. But Aggravate only triggers on attacks that apply Electro, same with Spread for Dendro.

[robust wind]

Gotcha, ty

[lusty raft]

#・theorycrafting is a channel reserved for discussions of any in-depth topics that could lead to fruitful findings and discoveries in the game. This also means that simple questions such as (is x good/which artifact is the best/is x worth it) are not allowed as there are better avenues for those kinds of questions ( #・tc-lounge ). Users in #・theorycrafting are encouraged to have discussion on game mechanics and make requests for testing new, unexplored information. The end goal is to further our understanding of the game and to have a collaborative environment for TC.

[sturdy helm]

wait sara doesn;t need artifacts right? just her weapon for base atk?

[real steppe]

read bot msg

[austere thicket]

How can I get access in #979373957255954522 ?

[austere thicket]

Aye, gotcha.

[torn ginkgo]

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[pine ivy]

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[cedar zodiac]

#・bot-use-1 please

[elder cliff]

There's no standard in determining badplay duration in TC afaik. At least not as standarized as KQMC. So it's up to you to how you're gonna assume the duration. Be mindful that when assuming perfect rotation, you'll tend to be overselling the numbers. You're basically only catering your calc to fewer hardcore gamers and a chance of overhyping a comp/rotation. But the upside is most TCers (I see around) assume perfect rotation because that's the most comparative without too many random variables going on. So it's good for figuring out the max potential of a comp/rotation.

I myself calc my rotation with badplay duration assumed. When I calc my rotation duration, there are actions that can be buffered, and those which cannot (most of the actions in this game cannot be buffered). For those that can be buffered, I personally assume 0ms badplay duration. However for the actions that cannot be buffered, then I'll be looking at type of badplays we're talking about. It's pretty long to explain but there are 3 (you can check my sheet later, mind you it's all my personal take on this matter). Usually it can range between 100ms to 300ms per action. As a result, my calc usually tend to be longer in rotation duration and less DPR/DPS as well.

Sometimes it's not about how many variables you take into a calc. But it's also being fair and consistent to other calcs you make/comparing. Make a rule, be it KQMC or your own standard, then apply it strictly to every of your calc.

but ofc, the best way would be have someone (or yourself) record the rotation and you'll have easier time figuring out everything.
But sometimes you don't have that luxury, or probably you're making a POG rotation that only bowtae can do (and he's on hiatus iirc)

oh, almost forgot. Here if you want to see how I make a rule for badplay duration in my calc. See "Timing method" tab below on my sheet if you wanna make reference of it (if you're interested, that is)
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1WfqzHy2lbs50yHR4jbl_6Sdw34b-Ctjt8LPytcMsm6A/edit?usp=sharing