🎮〕illuvium-beyond

[late cradle]

Yes it will be

[neon tapir]

I own land and I just use fuel for Overworld runs. I like that loop. Would be cool to use fuel for buying disks too. I laso like Alexa's idea to find disk fragments in the Overworld. The more interoperable gameplay loops the better imo

[surreal pecan]

Do you know if the disks will be pegged to a dollar amount, meaning a certain usd worth of eth/fuel, or will eth and fuel price of a disk be locked in at the beginning of a wave launch?

[dreamy raven]

Pliiiing

[urban stratus]

if i lose my lb position right now will i get any rewards? or do i have to hold it till rewards will be paid again?

so fuel for disk. max mintable disks will be changed am i right? - i like it btw...

good idea to raise value of fuel will be good for illuvium. gotta link things to beyond somehow. alexa's idea is pure gold. maybe consider something like burning 3x holo illuviators(same bg and expression or something) to get 1 dark holo illuvial also.

also why arent there expressions on illuvials maybe to get a different expression you need to fuse said expression from beyond with illuvial i would like that.. also would create some very rare collectibles and bring more marketactivity since you need double to hold lb. also accessories really should be added at some point to illuvials. not opening a thing for this this is the thing its like an announcement 😉 not that i know if its good anyway

[frank pier]

well time to start stacking fuel..and if we stop selling it prices will go up and be more value for the disks we buy direct with land fuel.

[urban stratus]

more spaces to use fuel will up the fuel price naturally. unless the big sellers are not interested in gaming.

how much fuel can a maxed t5 produce daily?

[frank pier]

a lot...but how many t5s are actually being run right now? A lot of land is passive so there is a lot of fuel that could come on the market, but hey might as well sit on it and start making fuel come to the upper rail

and save if for beyond 😉

[urban stratus]

i would also add anti cheat and bans for using any kind of software to run youre plot... im just guessing that this is being done..

[urban stratus]

whos pushing prices then?

[frank pier]

no one is buying fuel

[urban stratus]

really?

[frank pier]

so supply exceeds demand...yeah, I know a lot of people who have stopped playing OW

[urban stratus]

drop the price on solon for scanning the map...

by half or something...

[frank pier]

and the price of illuvials have crashed so no reason to go OW other than if you enjoy it

[urban stratus]

that makes the game much more enjoyable to play scanning the map believe me

its not a challenge to find and kill the illuvial on map

its just a chore so drop scan price

shouldnt be a big risk or maybe offer some different options for scanning.. like abilities or something would love a scan illuvial for energy without hunting it for example...

i do this in the wrong chat cause the ow chat is very bad to place some ideas in

[serene python]

There's #1020759212172775464

[urban stratus]

like i said wont open the thing

its not that i dont want to open one i hope team reads stuff and if theres something good will consider it at some point im not trying to creat a vote then they have to do it...

[serene python]

Thats what #1020759212172775464 is for... It's not about creating votes 🙂
Because in the game chats it can get lost fast

[urban stratus]

jeah but i thought once it gets 25 votes they give it to dao then it gets a second vote and i think goes to main council and if there vote is yes they have to do it...

[serene python]

No, votes in #1020759212172775464 are just for gathering sentiment.
Nothing to do with governance

[urban stratus]

ahaaa

oki

wont do it either though cause as you mentioned things get lost in chat hehe i really couldnt at this point i wont do it belongs there if they cant do the same thing.

[vague void]

will it matter which type of fuel is used to buy d1sks?

[meager garden]

https://tenor.com/view/that-is-the-motherfuckin-question-norm-lewis-don-swan-shes-gotta-have-it-thats-it-gif-16639418

it will help balance all 3 fuel's price if it doesn't matter.

hope they don't do a combination of the 3

[wide swan]

Kieran should have an announcement today

as well as a town hall for beyond possibly this friday

[frank pier]

https://tenor.com/view/big-worm-friday-bigworm-quit-playing-with-my-emotions-gif-12842611

[wide swan]

Beyond Town Hall Questions (Tentative Date This Friday): https://link.illuvium.io/BeyondTownHall

View the questions to avoid repeats: https://link.illuvium.io/BeyondTownHallQuestions

[sharp sigil]

Official IIP created by @smoky verge here to vote for the same idea: https://discord.com/channels/760344898200666112/1285722110991400991

[pastel bison]

I think this should be phrased very differently. Making claims based around fairness and expectations are value judgements that are hard to codify and open things up for further debate, etc. Sometimes they are needed but not here.

I would also avoid snapshotting at some past point as this is arguably just as unfair ("I didn't bother moving go up the leaderboard because I didn't think rewards were going to be paid").

I think this proposal would be much better if the only justification was "To encourage continued engagement with Beyond"

And the implementation was simply defined as:

1. Start rewards as soon as Secondary Wallet feature is available.
2. Payout rewards at some increased rate (such 2x,3x, or 4x ... whatever number makes sense)
3. Ensure that all 'paused rewards' are paid out before Wave 3 is launched by delaying Wave 3 launch if necessary (but aim to set reward multiplier, and Secodary Wallet release, so a delay is highly unlikely)

[alpine dew]

rewards are suppose to start again after an announcement and a grace period for people to transfer over to IMX. team is building out the wallet support for beyond rn, that is what we are waiting for.

long story short No, losing position rn has no effect as far as we know

[past tundra]

#💥〕leaks-discussion message

[alpine dew]

@smoky verge

[pastel bison]

To be clear I don't think it's a huge deal, just noting if you can say less it's less to argue over.

[sharp sigil]

Ideally, in my view,
Key Points for IIP:

A snapshot of LB should be taken before Wave 3 starts. (assuming wallet issues get resolved and enough time given to players before the snapshot)

The snapshot is crucial for fair distribution of paused rewards.

The distribution can be done at the team's convenience.

[wide swan]

we only have 6 questions for a lot of back and forth in here lol

[smoky verge]

Understood. Good feedback! Going forward i'll see whether the size of the proposal can be reduced by removing such subjective language 👍

Like spacelover shows, 2 messages up, the proposal could be a lot shorter with those 3 bullet points.

[meager garden]

I'm on it 🫡

[frank pier]

perhaps those 6 questions are the key eh?

Most of us just want some answers and firm dates set 😉

[sharp sigil]

Exactly this

[meager garden]

still no one asked about wave 3 release date though. Only the IOUs

[sharp sigil]

It's so obvious question that It's assumed that they will start with information regarding wave 3 date 😀. We have been asking about it since many weeks already...

[meager garden]

yeah 😅 I hope that's the case.

[fathom frigate]

I’m not bothered about w3 until bugs and points are sorted. Delays are fine, releasing a product when there are issues are not

[sharp sigil]

It's about communicating it with community. No one wants to use buggy product for sure.

[covert ibex]

Can't seem to get access to edit the file so I'll post them here:

Will wave 3 feature an initial alpha sale similar to previous waves?
If so, i. premium for alpha D1sks, ii. for how long will they be available, and iii. will we be able to acquire alphas with something other than ETH.

Will we be able to buy Wave 3 D1sks with sILV2?

[frank pier]

and buy with fuel at what rate

[urban stratus]

can i still put in questions?

just got back from work lol

one is enough

bye

[urban stratus]

time zones and if you need more questions scroll up my friend as you said correctly there is alot of questions in here.

[wide swan]

Pinned message

Has the form

[urban stratus]

not sure what that means

[urban stratus]

so this wasnt the grace period?

[urban stratus]

bruh never assume anything why create a form to ask questions when they already were asked?

[wide swan]

Spoiler alert: ||we have this now ||

[urban stratus]

i guess if i ask something that was obviously answered already it will get edited out?

[wide swan]

Yes

[urban stratus]

thx

[alpine dew]

I would think the grace period starts when people can move to IMX without giving up security. Right now we are waiting for the team to build out the passport hardware wallet

[urban stratus]

i just put stuff in dont have time to check the chats... gotta leave in a few lol and wont be back till monday the town hall thing is recorded right?

[fathom frigate]

For sure but we know they are on it

[urban stratus]

how is a hardware wallet more secure while connected to a device?

the passport thing not being secure i get but if you got MFA set up right its almost impossible to get in there

[alpine dew]

A hardware wallet will always be more secure whether you are connected or not

Funds are "offline" all the time and requires a pin code that needs to be punched in on the physical wallet

[urban stratus]

jeah i know i got several HW wallets.. for me its like a box in the bank

where i got my keyphrases btw lol

but jeah i cant argue with that you can be less secure with HW wallet though.. it really alway depends on you

imagine setting the pin to 1111 lol

[astral ermine]

the difference is that you need to physically be in your room if you got a hardware wallet and with imx passport a computer virus is enough to get to your account with your assets

[urban stratus]

theres ways to get around the phisically need to be in room

[urban stratus]

check out on ledger live -> zerion partner app. theres no adress on youre stick its just a very good MFA method.. not trying to say HCW is bad its the most secure thing there is. but being in IT i can tell you it always depends on the user how secure a system is... someone thinking i cant get hacked is on a dangerous road 😉 transfer some crypto to unplugged HCW adress and check on ethscan then tell me its offline..

[astral ermine]

yes stay safe man 👍

[frank pier]

and of course you can lose, lose the passkey, etc.

[vapid imp]

do you know why rewards was even stopped? i might miss something but beyond was working fine they could just let it run like they always did, until a new solution is working no?

[frank pier]

due to people on leaderboard uncomfortable transfer assets on to passport and no alternative set up...but they are working on that now

[vapid imp]

so illuvium messed up, and now we get no rewards

might be something behind the sceens that made it not possible due to the account names and the new passport account but not sure

[frank pier]

they figured it out for land owners they'll figure it out here, but communication has been disappointing..but we are promised and update from Kieran on the beyond systemy "soon" 😉

[vapid imp]

i mean when we told them we dont want to transfer our most valuable illuvitars to a wallet we dont own(which they should had known), they should just had let the old system keep running, or was there a reason they dindt do that

[urban stratus]

IMX messed up sort of... there was the beta... so i wonder how many actually beta tested? i did so for me was no surprise HCW wasnt a thing.

[vapid imp]

im pretty sure IMX support read-only and its illuvium who is not ready to support it, but with the little info we get who knows

[urban stratus]

i dont think you can link hardware wallet on imx

[vapid imp]

you can, i've done that

[urban stratus]

with passport?

[vapid imp]

but land is working with hardware

but yes with passport you can link a wallet

[urban stratus]

external wallet right?

[vapid imp]

exactly, looks like it supports ledger

[urban stratus]

jeah thing is the external it doesnt add security to wallet on illuvium

[vapid imp]

it makes you able to see all the assets in the linked wallet with read-only

[urban stratus]

why it created a new adress i dont know either since chain is still imx... i guess they will just add an option of using passport or as used to be wallet to sign stuff - not critique i just dont know lol

[urban stratus]

jep

[vapid imp]

the new address is to make it easyer to onboard non-crypto people so they dont have to store there seed IMX dos it for them

[urban stratus]

i think this is a good mistake btw will add to imx and marketplace options on how you login and sign stuff.

[urban stratus]

ah so basically crypto people will not like it mostly

lol

[forest hamlet]

Hey Guys!!! Anyone know when we start getting beyond rewards ?

[frank pier]

should find out by Friday

Supposedly 😉

support for outside wallet, time for whales to move or register collections if needed, and then the ILV printer goes brrrr

[cedar anchor]

Anyone else having trouble sleeving illuvitars in the album after transferring to passport? I can't even search for them in the album, it says I have 1 or zero available to sleeve. Most of the time finding them in profile and sleeving by ID works, but what happened to the functionality in the album?

[sharp sigil]

🤔

[wide swan]

https://tenor.com/view/burak-sevinç-sadness-cry-eyfet-sad-gif-16470588

[cedar anchor]

-SUPPORT@ILLUVIUM sent me a friend request. Is that a thing???

[fathom lintel]

nope, sc.ammers are looking for people having issues and try to dm them

[cedar anchor]

That's what I figured, but I had hope 🤣

[surreal pecan]

Same issue I’ve had… I’m waiting for a fix as well

[white vault]

Me too

[cedar anchor]

Ok, glad to hear I'm not the only one.

[cerulean quartz]

Whats the update on rewards and WAVE 3?

[wide swan]

Hasnt come yet

[exotic mica]

Hey i'm back

After a to of 1 week for no valuable reasons

Still no W3 announcement, nothing has changed it seems...

[meager garden]

@wide swan are we still having the townhall tomorrow?

[frank pier]

hey rich can you pin any messages with info that arises, here or other channels also? I'll just start reading pins as most comments are same old, same old or so negative it's not worth reading just hoping to get some needed info. Thanks

[wide swan]

Yeah

[wide swan]

I know Kierans kid has been sick so maybe not

Probably early next week

[vague void]

What's good here?

any update of resumed rewards? launch date? illuvidex sleeve update? wave one rewards?

[tepid geyser]

In short, no, no, no and no 😅 .
Soon though 🤔

[rare mica]

when Lambo ?!!

[sharp sigil]

@wide swan , Announcement as well postponed to early next week?

[worthy tide]

So bearish

[turbid moss]

I mentioned this. In arena chat. I wonder why we can not make beyond cards buff or debuff arena or overworld battles

[tepid geyser]

Only temporarily 💪 .

[smoky verge]

https://tenor.com/view/time-to-go-shopping-loretta-scott-kemushichan-shopping-time-time-to-shop-gif-20766530

XD

[echo gazelle]

Hey that sounds super interesting!
You can share your idea in details in #1020759212172775464

[turbid moss]

so everything kinda connects with each other

Then there is a reason to open packs

[turbid moss]

THere

I don't know if people actually reads these.

[echo gazelle]

I think that they do

[turbid moss]

Okay. .I hope that is a good title

I hope for illuvium success

[meager garden]

any thoughts?

[frank pier]

i'd buy alpha disks at same price or lower...same with illuvitars...don't pay a premium but see as possible future value

also symbolic of people just dumping

[meager garden]

that's it? Your conclusion is ppl are dumping? Why not dump the normal ones then as well? The supply ain't that different.

[frank pier]

some people were collecting those at issue...thinking they would go up in value..obviously did not...no other reason to sell way below non-alpha...needing money and perceiving it to have limited value..perhaps the whole ecosystem...we don't know, other than everything is down...and still no info as well

[sharp sigil]

Surprisingly wave 2 mega alphas are doing so well as compare to wave 1 alphas

[meager garden]

yes but just look at the supply. Wave 1 has over 10x the supply of wave 2.

bonkers 🤯

[sharp sigil]

People were so into wave 1 alphas because of the hype around it and causing oversupply of wave 1 alphas. Hype of being first of first alphas didn't play well at all atleast until now...

[tepid geyser]

Not yet, 5k supply long term though is still nothing. $35 is looking super cheap 🤔

[sharp sigil]

What do you think about adding some value for alphas ? I know it was marketed only as alpha and no other benefits of holding it but considering the current situation, would it be wise to rethink the value of alphas?

[sharp sigil]

Hey Alexa, was it you who just bought 21 wave 1 mega alpha ?😀

I was about to buy them but then see them all gone 😲

[smoky verge]

They get an alpha sheen right? :] maybe some day 👀

Or did we trade the sheen in for the A symbol bot right?

[tepid geyser]

Heheh sorry, yeah had to at that price. Bit ridiculous 😅

[pastel bison]

What were they going for?

$35?!?

@tepid geyser if you want to flip a quick profit I'll buy them off of you for $45?

Wow there are still lots of cheap ones ... shopping time!

[tepid geyser]

Hey Johnny. Thanks, I appreciate the offer, but I would prefer to keep hold of those.
Still can't believe they dropped so low.

[pastel bison]

Hah no worries, just thought I would put it out there 🙂

[pastel bison]

Are d1sk opening not working at the moment? (using a passport account)

(I got my d1sk opened just no UI for it, just constant loading symbol)

Hmm working now. Just one didn't work.

[tepid geyser]

I did hear there was issues. Apparently they were resolved, but I never had the confidence to try though.
I don't want to risk losing anything.

[pastel bison]

Seems fine now

Not powerful but looking cool:

Slightly better one lol:

[tepid geyser]

Getting the background luck 😮

[pastel bison]

Yeha if only it was with holo T5s 🙂

The good thing about not opening for ages is that everything feels new 😉

Blah nothing great, but I still enjoy it. Wave 3 where are you....

[alpine dew]

Alpha Geyyeser but nothing great? lol. Like an addict who needs a big hit to feel the high 🤣

[pastel bison]

Plain expression, plain BG.

[sharp sigil]

Whales awakened 👀

[pastel bison]

Unfortunatley most of them were just 'fakes' due to dex not updating. I just bought a handful.

I got a bit excited when I saw the ones going for sILV on token trove but then I realised token trove is using market value not ILV value for sILV2 pricing.

[fathom frigate]

Has this been picked up with the team now? Is a fix for the leaderboard inbound?

[inner quest]

but when will the rewards be distributed? this is not good!!! Now everything smells like a scam... how it will work they will be multiplied x4

[zealous delta]

DMs are scams

Mods and Team members will never DM you.
Never trust advice or links received in DMs.

Beta access, giveaways, and promotions are not given out via DM. Scams are designed to trick you into installing malicious software to gain access to your wallet or to convince you to enter your seed phrase into a website. Never give your private key (12 to 24-word seed phrase) to anyone.

Support is not provided via DMs

Support is handled publicly, or in threads within the Illuvium Discord. People offering support via DM are scammers.

Please follow the instructions pinned in #report-scammers to report bad actors so we can remove them from the server.

[inner quest]

this is really annoying...

[frank pier]

well you know what word to avoid

which you should anyway...it isn't one

just very poor at communication

[sharp sigil]

Everything in dark at this stage... nothing we can do except waiting for their announcement

[inner quest]

I also don't understand why everyone is asking for a new wave? why not fix the problems with the old ones first... like albums that don't work, filters that don't find anything... lands that don't produce... etc etc... how can we think about bringing new players to beyond if the old ones want to go away? personally I spent a lot of money to make two albums... today I wouldn't make even one, even considering the rewards that are blocked every month with the most varied excuses...

[keen forum]

Same boat, but we can't do anything

Some tend to agree with this operation, and it worries me because they do not understand the importance of trust for an investor, and there will be many who will not participate in wave 3 for this reason. Maybe some will buy but much less than expected

[sharp sigil]

They must have been working to fix the issues before wave 3 and its assumed that they will comeup with fixes first before wave 3

[meager garden]

why not submit a question for the Beyond town hall?

[alpine dew]

I didn't submit this question since I'm sure it will be answered in the townhall but I did just submit one, thanks for the suggestion!

[meager garden]

I mentioned it cause no one has actually questioned it yet

[alpine dew]

I didn't even know there was a town hall for Beyond Coming up.

It's not on the calendar

[meager garden]

yeah still not scheduled...

[frank pier]

well it was scheduled for yesterday but....

[meager garden]

he did say 'possibly'
#🎮〕illuvium-beyond message

[blissful bloom]

If i buy a megadisk, what means a rare illuvitar? From what tier?
I saw garf saying
"It was about a 1/800.000 in 0.0025 eth packs or 1/66.660 in 0.0125 eth packs."
How do you see how rare one card is?

[alpine dew]

It means you get an Illuvitar over a certain power level which tells you how rare something is.

[blissful bloom]

Ok got it, so the rarity is based on power. Can i get a t5 that is lower on power than a t2 because of finish/background?

[alpine dew]

Yes you can

[inner quest]

but in conclusion, do we know when the rewards will be paid? are they continuing to take pictures of the leaderboard? incredible...

[smoky verge]

A thread was started to ensure fair leaderboard distributions. If it gets 25 upvotes, we'll know that things will proceed as detailed in the IIP:
#1285722110991400991 message

[keen forum]

but do we realize that we have to make a proposal to get information? but have we reached this point?

treated worse than rubbish just before wave 3 that at least marketing should understand that destroying sentiment before an expansion is crazy

these decisions are probably made by those who set the price of $10 per emote disk

[inner quest]

thanks Garf, what should I do to vote positively for postal?

[meager garden]

apparently the entire Illuvium universe needs to be expensive. We're like the Bored Ape Yacht Club of gaming.

[smoky verge]

You need to thumbs up the post

[keen forum]

What do you mean ?

[meager garden]

they like to overprice things basically.

[inner quest]

Filow you write: why should we be entitled to rewards if the game is stopped.
Simple: each of us invested in beyond as we saw fit, for example I bought many more accessories than I needed just to ensure I remained in the charts with my albums, this is because between one wave and another there is a period of downtime and therefore I wanted to guarantee myself the rewards, others may have had different reasoning, but we all invested in anticipation of the rewards, which by the way in a month's worth of rewards does not even equal the cost of my last card purchased...

[meager garden]

and how long was the period of downtime between wave 1 and wave 2? Do you think it's even comparable to what we had now between wave 2 and wave 3?

[inner quest]

yes, it lasted even longer I seem to remember

[keen forum]

Ok but how many disk were sold?

[meager garden]

bruh... it was a one month gap...

[meager garden]

dunno from the top of my head, would have to check. But not much.

[inner quest]

brother, I don't get back what I spent on illuvium even with 10 years of rewards... having said that, it should be added that all the rewards collected were totally put back into illuvium, also adding more money... as already written a month ago of rewards (4 ilv in the first 50 places) does not even equal the cost of a purchased card.

[keen forum]

very few were sold, and I'm sorry about the product but it was a failure, the idea is brilliant -> create a market for emote disks that didn't exist and have a profit for the DAO, fantastic, everyone is happy. the right price was 2/3$ and they would have sold many more, and I remember that emote disk and beyond disk are PURE PROFIT

[meager garden]

well that is another topic. And that is also related to the price of the token. Could you really say that if ILV was at $1000+ ?

[meager garden]

yes I agree emotes were very poorly marketed and were put on the bottom of the cosmetics page where they are very hard to find. IMO they should have their own tab.

but then again, I market something that nobody is using since almost no one is playing arena.

[keen forum]

yes I saw, I tried to play in the arena but there is never an opponent

One more reason to sell for 2/3 dollars

[meager garden]

same for me. Until they implement a ranked ladder I'm not playing.

[inner quest]

no, if ilv was at 1,000 dollars the matter was different, but with ilv at 100 dollars it always takes more than 10 years... (with two albums in the top 50 places)

[meager garden]

ILV is at 40$ so... The rewards are meaningless for the majority of the top 100 beyonders. That's why I think it's better for the DAO to only resume payments with wave 3.

[keen forum]

Can you explain to me what are the pros and cons of removing the rewards at this time?

[inner quest]

but what's the matter? why does the price of ILV increase if you block the rewards? so let's block them for two or three years so we can all become rich

[meager garden]

I never said the price of ILV would increase by blocing the rewards. There's no direct correlation there. My point is why do YOU guys feel you should receive rewards if the team said they would pause the rewards?

[keen forum]

I am a financial controller, I have to do a lot of analysis for my company working on the costs and earnings of a single product, when I have to give feedback or approve a price I have to do a cost-benefit analysis that justifies what I am saying

[inner quest]

brother, I am convinced that all the first 100 who receive rewards reinvest them in the game, even if they are low for the value of $40, for example I would have continued to buy cards in this moment of price collapse. Would the others have done the same and maybe the price of illuvials would have dropped less?

[keen forum]

So maybe I can change my mind, we all want the good of Illuvium, on this choice can I know what the advantages and disadvantages are?

[meager garden]

I'm sorry but I really don't see a point arguing about this. You can read my views on the proposal comments.

[inner quest]

I read

[keen forum]

Completely agree, I spent 3k two months ago to buy rare figurines, so I spent the ILVs more money of mine, and I'm totally fine with that, that's why I keep saying that 10 ILVs are not the problem

[meager garden]

just in broad terms I would say:
Disadvantages: Loss of confidence.
Advantages: Increase d1sk sales.

[keen forum]

Ok, I would say that on both sides there would be many more things, but let's say that making a super summary is ok

Considering the company's balance sheet, among the advantages I would also put these 400 ILVs saved every month and I am not ironic

[keen forum]

On losing trust we agree, why do you think that this specific thing increases sales and does not decrease them?

[meager garden]

man... where did I say that an erosion on confidence would increase sales?

[keen forum]

sorry maybe with the translation I expressed myself badly

[inner quest]

the issue is that there is no advantage in blocking the rewards, other than making the first 100 who have believed in and financed the game to date nervous. Without considering the land issue... buy at 5 times their current value. Now before blocking the rewards and thinking about wave 3, why not fix everything that doesn't work? if the solution is to make a new wave why not sell more lands? simple because no one would buy them unless they were at ridiculous prices.

[meager garden]

I think the pros outweight the cons with this.

[keen forum]

Why should removing the Rewards and then giving them 3x later increase sales?

[meager garden]

but that's the thing. They still need to implement the secondary wallet support for Beyond before they can reintroduce the rewards...

[meager garden]

maybe because of the increased appeal on the rewards? Which would bolster the competitive spirit.

[keen forum]

ok let's follow this reasoning, a person buys all wave 1 and 2 to get 12/15 ilv? 7/8k collection, I feel like putting a plaster on a cut arm

[inner quest]

in my opinion it doesn't increase the competitive spirit, the first 100 will continue to buy because they are forced not to lose their position at this point in the game, I lost the spirit of the game a long time ago.

[meager garden]

I'm talking about those on the 100-200th place...

obviously those are the ones that are going to get a chance to compete for top 100...

it's not that hard to understand come on guys...

[inner quest]

where I am, to get into the top 10 I would have to spend around 10/20,000 dollars... to receive what? 1 more ILV per week? (if illuvium continues to distribute rewards) so instead of 10 years of rewards, 20 are needed to recover part of what was spent..

[keen forum]

I understand your point of view. The problem therefore is to increase competition and sell as many disks as possible is also my goal, if Beyond as a project does not sell it will still be eliminated

right?

[smoky verge]

The leaderboard rewards are just a nice little benefit. You get the Illuvitars for the in-game cosmetics. Drone blasts, emotes, skins etc.

[keen forum]

The LB is the main reason why disks were sold and rare illuvitars were bought, the futures that there should be a reason why to invest 20k in Illuvium and not in BTC

[smoky verge]

leaderboards were added about halfway through wave 1 though

[keen forum]

Ok Filow we agree on the long-term reason, but there are several ways to achieve it. Doesn't the competition increase if it goes from 100 to 150? if you make a separate LB for wave 3 parallel it to the main one?

I had bought 250+ disks in wave 2 for lenses but I understand that for the sake of illuvium and sales these can be given later and I accept it, never said anything about this

[meager garden]

that is actually one of my questions for the town hall.

[keen forum]

I don't know this honestly, I entered at the end of wave 1 for the LB and because I like the project, removing the LB is equivalent to killing beyond, there would be no secondary market and whales would have no reason to buy disks, disks are pure profit, beyond alone has much more profit than ilv as a reward, simply this money was used to develop the other games

[smoky verge]

agreed. I'm not saying that we should remove it. but a lot of d1sks before the leaderboard were bought because in-game use-case was promised 🙂

[keen forum]

ok I would be curious to see the curve in the sales graph after the LB lol but in general it is a nice project, but it is really wrong to lower the sentiment of the community before selling the new expansion, then I do not agree with the modalities in any case but with a decent explanation there would not be all this discontent

[stone swallow]

Or the extra rewards for completing certain albums

I didnt bought any wave 2 because it still wasn't ready yet at that time and still not so im glad I didnt

[shadow reef]

Any idea why I wouldn't be able to post to the dex channel after posting 1 link/listing ?

[smoky verge]

there is a slowmode enabled. You can only send messages once a while 👍

[frank pier]

the leaderboard was always discussed even before the first disk was bought...it may not have been enacted right away but the concept was there from the beginning...and yes, that is what got me to bring outside money into the system.

[pastel bison]

Leaderboard or rewards? I don't ever recall there being a comittment to leaderboard rewards at the time of Wave 1. That someone once discussed somewhere, sure maybe, but I recall Kieran bringing it to the admin chat post Wave 1 launch.

In any case leaderboard rewards were stopped due to technical issues (lack of HW/secondary wallet support). Even now I wouldn't think the financial element of the rewards would be considered a sticking point by the team (although admittedly I haven't been in those discussions for some time ).

(To be clear If secondary wallets work properly then I'm all for turning them back on, I don't think we need to wait for Wave 3)

[inner quest]

How come they can't fix the problems with the sub wallets? Two months isn't enough? considering the people who work there, the problem had to be solved in 1, 2 hours... Then let's be clear, I started completing the album for the rewards, like 90% of the top 100 in the charts, otherwise I would have bought two/ three records and that's it! Why don't they say that the only thing that has worked so far has been beyond, so why let those who believed in and financed this project from the beginning run away?

there are problems with the albums, problems with the filters, problems with the wallets, problems with the rewards, problems with the lands, problems with the fuel produced, etc. etc. so don't ask to solve the problems but ask for the launch of wave 3!

[pastel bison]

Firstly there was never any promise that rewards would go forever. There's a finite rewards pool and it has to be split between all incentives. It is reasonable to expect that rewards will resume for some time there will be timely announcement of changes. If you want to influence that aspect of it that's something for the council.

As to development I have no insight into what the priorities are any more, but it is easy understand that there are thousands of people in many channels requesting fixes, features, etc. Resources are finite. Decisions have to be made on what is the priority. The reasonable assumption is that the goal is to ensure Illuvium survives and eventually thrives.

If you take away any personal investment (emotional or financial) it seems pretty clear that Beyond shouldn't be the priority. That doesn't mean it can't progress, but nothing that happens with Beyond is going to have a significant impact on the future of Illuvium.

[inner quest]

From what I remember the only significant impact was beyond and the sale of the lands. beyond held on all trading markets, collaborations with Liquid, Game stop etc. If beyond wasn't what was?

[pastel bison]

I don't disgaree, I'm just saying that the future success of Illuvium is tied far more to Overworld (for example).

If wallets were fixes, dex was fixed, rewards resumed and Wave 3 released what would happen. A little burst of positive sentiment from a few people (maybe 5% of the active community), and maybe if things go well 1-2 months more runway. Its not a game changer.

These things will happen I'm sure, I'm just noting that they are not going to move the needle in a way that addresses an existential threat.

[inner quest]

ok but I think that the whole illuvium universe works if all its parts work. Now if one of the best parts to date is put aside, why should I invest in the others?

[pastel bison]

I'm now an outsider, which means I can share my thoughts on what I think the thougt processes would be. And if I was running the business, my thought processes would be "What is the realisable change that leads to the sustainable generation of a minimum of 5m per month in revenue"

The decision that leads to might be painful, but as an investor I would invest in companies that can make the hard decisions.

(and to be clear I'm not saying that Wave 3 won't be out tomorrow it could be for all I know 🙂 )

Breaking News: Wave 3 releasing tomorrow ... (I'm sure someone will take that from the above!)

Anywya thats my 2c. I'm off on a bit of a holiday for a week. Maybe there will be some movement by the time I'm back. Cheers all 👋

[tepid geyser]

Have a good one 👍

[wide swan]

i expect the announcement once kieran wakes up

witll have date

and town hall this coming friday as well

[sharp sigil]

I agree with @pastel bison here. It's much more important to fix the issues of OW as it's being a main game and people would come to all other games naturally. Clearly, original expectations from team was not met with OB and now, it seems team is struggling to have a proper strategic plan to fix the priority issues and also comeup with dates for all the beyond promises. I can feel the pain of the team and I would love to support them instead of criticising them at this stage. They are doing lots of things at the same time and requires proper planning to delivery things smoothly... Good luck team

[pseudo crown]

2 Months

[sharp sigil]

I am ok with it considering the ongoing issues to resolve and make wave 3 ready for successful launch.

[vague void]

Nice to have a solid date and something to look forward to

Bought a shit ton of fuel in anticipation... fuel will prob be valued at top rail I'm assuming... therefore buying fuel with a 400% bonus seems like 4x free d1sks if I'm not mistaken

[blissful bloom]

Excuse my ignorance, but what fuel has to do with beyond?

[vague void]

we will be able to buy d1sks wqith fuel

[blissful bloom]

Wow. Ok, that is great
Thanks

[blissful bloom]

Sorry to bother again, do you happen to know which type of fuel?

[sharp sigil]

I am confused on 3x rewards item. Are they planning to release 3x rewards starting soon ? I also notice that secondary wallet read only support coming with wave 3. Does it mean that 3x rewards starts without secondary wallet support? @wide swan

[vague void]

don't know yet

I would hope the type doesnt matter

@wide swan do we know if any type of fuel will be able to be used for d1sks?

[wide swan]

No, and we left it out of the announcement because although Aaron said it would be done in fuel, from my understanding the work is not started for this to be a thing.

So maybe by the time the town hall happens we will know more

[vague void]

uh oh

okayy

either way... nice to get some cheap fuel

[wide swan]

Also what I mean is the intention for it to be so is still there

[vague void]

yah I get that... 2 months should be fiiiine

[wide swan]

The intention currently is to start once wave 3 starts

As you well know there is an IIP/Idea to do things differently

Team is aware as well of this feedback idea.

[echo gazelle]

Exciting announcement! 🥳

[frank pier]

hell, I'm just happy with any confirmed announcement lol

and a confirmed town hall 😉

think paying out 3x rewards with the launch of wave 3 is unfair to some of the LB people now but it will be what it is.

Just happy to see the spigot turn on again

at some point..maybe with a higher ilv price too 🙂

[wide swan]

Also another thing that was left out of the announcement, because it is not ready, is wave specific leaderboards

so take that for what you will

but hopefully more info on that once we progress a bit towards launch

[tepid geyser]

Huge for newcomers! They would get a level playing field on wave 3 leaderboard.
Probably the best update of the lot IMO
Do you know if there would be a master leaderboard for all combined or just the individual waves?

[wide swan]

I believe the plan is for both.

[radiant silo]

So this is the only game that is out now that I do not understand, is this just collecting cards in lamens terms?

I have multiple lands in IZ, over 150 illuvials in from OW or the dex. But what is this game about, just collecting for the most part?

[tepid geyser]

It is a collector game, but the illuvitars can also be used as your PFP in game (example attached).
You will also be able to get rewards (unique to Beyond) for completing certain cololections (coming soon).
There are also leaderboards with weekly ILV rewards.
Kind of like Pokemon pack opening but with a competitive element.

[radiant silo]

Sounds cool

[radiant silo]

How good are the rewards?

[tepid geyser]

12 ILV/week number 1.
6 ILV/week number 2.
3 ILV/week number 3.

A top 10 get at least 2 ILV/week.

Top 100 places paid.

[vague void]

4-10 + 2 ilv/wk

11-50 = 1/wk

50-100 = .5/wk

[radiant silo]

So if I want to get in, what is the best way to get started?

[tepid geyser]

With the sounds of it, best way to get in is next wave, launching in November. Bit of a wait but lots of cool new features coming with it and a new leaderboard to compete on.

If you dont want to wait you can still buy wave 1 and 2 disks on the market and begin opening those and completing your collections. Every slot you fill gets you points on leaderboard.

[alpine dew]

If you wanted to try for the top 100 Leaderboard I know some guys might sell a collection. Guys like @minor merlin. Or start buying off illuvidex

[alpine dew]

Buying Illuvitars off illuvidex is probably cheaper

[tepid geyser]

True, nowhere near as fun though 😅

[radiant silo]

Is the only way to build collection is buying them?

[alpine dew]

No just the quickest and cheapest. Like Alexa said you can buy disk which is fun or buy the exact Illuvitars you need. Doing both would be funist way without hurting the pocket too much

But yeah @minor merlin was trying to sell his collection last time I talked to him

[radiant silo]

That sounds expensive

Bought this one just to get my feet wet

Now my PFP, okay I like where this is going.

[alpine dew]

Expect to pay around 5k to get top 100

[alpine dew]

Careful don't get addicted 😜

[radiant silo]

I think I am already addicted to this 3 game ecosystem, almost aped into a tier 3 land earlier, good thing I wasn't able to put buy ETH on my credit card lol.

I like the idea of collecting these, but the ILV rewards, that adds a little extra to it. I am a land owner for fun and passive income. This sounds like another good opportunity for fun and passive income.

[alpine dew]

Yup, a lot of cool stuff for Beyond is coming out soon too 👍

[radiant silo]

Alright, so I need to learn more about the power

Yeah this is super cool

So how do the accessories get generated to be sold?

[surreal pecan]

you get three random ones in each disk

accessories are a lot more expensive now, in between waves, then they are when you can buy disks

[wide swan]

Pretty nice

[radiant silo]

Thanks, my 1st one.

[wide swan]

I can’t wait to open wave 3

Really looking forward to unlockables too

[unborn mason]

planning on grabbing my first disk next month, money's tight right now but I wanna roll my pfp x)

hope we'll get Dark Holo added to beyond too

[radiant silo]

Keeps giving me an error

Then buy now on the stage two for my set....

So pretty much none of these three options are working or something is wrong on my end...

Should I report this as a bug? Dont onow enough about the current version of beyond to know if this is being seen a lot and if there is a current work around.

[frank pier]

that would make sense...and yeah, you buried the lead 😉

[frank pier]

remember it looks like you can use fuel, so you can buy some land cheap right now and you'd have two months to stack fuel

to buy wave 3

[wide swan]

Yeah def report it

[radiant silo]

I selected autofill and it worked. Not sure what the deal was

The buy now button still ends in an error though

[cerulean quartz]

Dawns was supposed to begging of September ow beginning of January lol

Only 4 more months wait hardly anything

Like a quarter od a year

I really like the new features ..how does everyone feel about another 3 month wait

[sharp sigil]

Sad to see close down of Illuvialmaster site. How are we going to know the floor prices and estimated valuation? It was so helpful website for beyond

[bold galleon]

@wide swan the goals people achieved in wave 2 will get their rewards distributed when wave 3 is live ? And the site where the achieved goals and opened d1sks will be shown again?

[sharp sigil]

Purchased 1 wave 1 alpha mega and got this. Definitely worth it

[cerulean quartz]

oh y goodness, why ?

why did they close it , cannot the team buy it or support it, this is a major major issue right befre a crucal wave launch

[sharp sigil]

I also think that it's good tool to support by illuvium. It was one of the main site that many illuvium investors were using for filtering search base price trend etc...

[arctic bloom]

damn thats not good, why dont Illuvium have a tool like this... you'd thin k they would

whats the link to view the illuvidex pls?

[dreamy cipher]

so the LB positions over the past few months will not matter for rewards? The announcement was confusing

[sharp sigil]

If this https://discord.com/channels/760344898200666112/1285722110991400991 gets 25 up votes then paused rewards distribution might change

[vapid imp]

ill support whatever that makes sure the rewards are paid to the rightful people, and if they feel its been to long since last wave and they dont want to pay anymore, just come out and say so, so we know wtf is going on
not a good sentiment for wave 3 release

[exotic mica]

Hey, is the rewards from W1 and W2 going to be distributed? There was not any news about that in the W3 Announcement 🙂

[calm cedar]

There was news. There will be a boost to future rewards because of the missed ones. Sadly this may mean that people who deserved rewards in w2 will not get them if they don't buy w3.

[exotic mica]

Im talking about the personal rewards ones

The goals man

[wide swan]

Should be ready for Wave 3, currently they have all the IOU's sorted and ensuring wallets are organised. But shouldnt be a problem to distribute soon. I'll ask what the timeline for that looks like.

@bold galleon

[cerulean quartz]

@wide swan @hazy juniper not having ilvuim master has the potential to absolutely ruin wave 3 . Something we have been waiting for a long time. Are you guys aware how this could affect beyond in a very negative way. Is there any reason ilvuim cannot support or buy or run ilvial masters?

[wide swan]

I mean not sure its in our best interest for the DAO to buy it or fund it, but I guess up to the DAO. Would be better IMO if someone like @royal anvil were to take it over. But yeah unfortunate they had to move on.

[bold galleon]

Thank you because after getting the new wallet where we had to transfer all assets I wasn’t sure how this will work!

[dreamy raven]

What does this mean?

What discussion do you need to become aware of?

I don’t get it

[smoky verge]

well there is a thread around the rewards and how they should be distributed. so claiming now that they will do things regardless of that sentiment, while the feedback on the IIP is still being gathered would be rude.

First we need to see whether the IIP gains enough traction to warrant a change in their plans. and then based on that, they may change or may not change the way they will distribute the rewards going forward.
#1285722110991400991 message

[arctic bloom]

hi, ive logged into mt IMX account and can see my inventory but when i connect to Illuvium beyond it says i have no illuviitars... can someone assist?

ah i can see it says on IMX that the assets are in my metamask but i can see them on IMX... how to fix this?

[smoky verge]

are you sure your illuvitars are on the passport and not on the IMX main chain? You need to transfer them in. from IMX to passport
But since there are some issues found around IMX today, are you certain you want to interact with IMX like this? Maybe wait a little longer for more clarification from the team.
#📣〕announcements message

[arctic bloom]

"This item is in your linked Wallet 0x25b9...233b
To play, craft, and trade this NFT within the game, head over to that wallet and transfer it to your Passport. I cant see how to do this?

[smoky verge]

isn't there "transfer in" in your profile -> top right?

[arctic bloom]

takes me to the took kit, but when i try to connect wallets i cant see the collection, can someone assist?

how do I contact support?

[smoky verge]

#❓❗〕community-help or go to the #❓❓〕support channel and get in contact with the official Illuvium support.

The mods should likely be able to help sufficiently in #❓❗〕community-help though!

[smoky verge]

don't accept DM requests or friend requests from people. they will aim to scam you.

[zealous delta]

DMs are scams

Mods and Team members will never DM you.
Never trust advice or links received in DMs.

Beta access, giveaways, and promotions are not given out via DM. Scams are designed to trick you into installing malicious software to gain access to your wallet or to convince you to enter your seed phrase into a website. Never give your private key (12 to 24-word seed phrase) to anyone.

Support is not provided via DMs

Support is handled publicly, or in threads within the Illuvium Discord. People offering support via DM are scammers.

Please follow the instructions pinned in #report-scammers to report bad actors so we can remove them from the server.

[arctic bloom]

thanks

[serene python]

check out step 2 of the guide
https://illuvium.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/10286692776591-Guide-for-users-who-skipped-the-migration-from-old-account-system

there should also be 2nd wallet support for beyond soon i heared so you might want to wait i don't know.

[sharp sigil]

This governance idea can make them change if we have 25 votes on it. Pls vote here if you feel it's unfair to distribute 3x rewards starting with wave 3.

[royal anvil]

It's part of our road map 😀

It's part of our road map to revamp our marketplace 😀

[white vault]

That's good to hear (though not sure which part of the IM functionality you are referring to), but is the roadmap plan to update this before the wave 3 beyond launch in late Nov?

[sharp sigil]

Those rewards most probably will come with wave 3 launch which is on 21st nov

[wide swan]

https://discord.com/events/760344898200666112/1287838173485072504

[hazy juniper]

Not sure what to say tbh sorry 😦

[royal anvil]

Were working on something ATM but well look into how we can get something up before beyond wave 3. We'll definitely have base functionality by then

[frank pier]

alas middle of the night for me...assume you will record and share here and youtube?

[wide swan]

yes

time is still kind of up in air

just wanted to get it scheduled

and speak to kieran if a certain time works better

[dreamy cipher]

I used illuvimaster way more then the ILV UI for tracking assets

[frank pier]

appreciate that...from my sense of things a lot more US and European Leaderboard members than say Australia...but just a sense...know there are a few big ones down under, including Kieran and Johnny 😉

[alpine dew]

Why do you think it would be better if Scrub took it over? You think he can run it better than the Illuvial Master team or you think he will fund it?

[wide swan]

1. Because it fits what his products are already trying to do
2. No I don't think he could run it better, it was ran great by Artemis and Sky, but they have decided to end it.
3. Yes I think he will fund it

[rotund halo]

Having better information about the game that can be easily found on a web page is absolutely in the best interest of the DAO. I can't recommend the game to my friends because they have no idea how to do/find anything.

[wide swan]

Yeah I mean sure, was just my personal opinion because its something else for the team to maintain, where as this is a 3rd party app I would think it would be more easily maintained by someone like Illuvidata

As I said the DAO could easily make an IIP to fund/buy Illuvial Master

[royal anvil]

We definitely dont want to take over the site. Artie and Sky along with Scoriox and (I forget the other/s) did a great job with IM. They were able to address a market need and did it well. Illuvidata had always planned to revamp its marketplace to expand its services not only to beyond and land but also to OW. We can only present our services and hope the community would appreciate and find value in them.

[cerulean quartz]

Thanks do you know who ran ivial masters ?

[cerulean quartz]

So will your site Ave the features needed to see the floor price of cards ect like ilvuial masters did.....before wave 3 ?

[royal anvil]

We had this implemented before. You could see the floor price and highest listed price of an Illuvitar whether base or with accessories. We just need to revamp it and hopefully have it in time for Wave 3.

[royal anvil]

@topaz zodiac and Sky (couldnt tag cause not sure which sky to tag lol).

@hazy juniper was their designer as well so can also contact him

[cerulean quartz]

Honestly why can't @topaz zodiac @onyx briar why can't you just reopen for wave 3 ? It's going to totally ruin wave 3 an if we don't have sort of tool may as well chuck the whole beyond game in the bin. It will be awful for players and ilvuim brand

[cerulean quartz]

Thanks we really really need that. Otherwise wave 3 will be a complete and absolute disaster a day turn player away right at the start of a crypto bull run

[hazy juniper]

@onyx briar

[hazy juniper]

Obviously I wouldn't vote on such a proposal rip, its out of my hands even as IMC 🤣.

[royal anvil]

2 of us needs to abstain lol

[hazy juniper]

Yeah hahaha, I mean I think Kieran publicly said he has partnered with Illuvidata, so that makes 3 🤣

[gusty cliff]

I would take a subscription over illuvium fixing their marketplace, which is never going to happen

[sharp sigil]

Another 9 votes needed to support this IIP : https://discord.com/channels/760344898200666112/1285722110991400991. Pls vote

[livid bramble]

Losing Illuvialmaster will likely have a negative impact on Illuvium as it provides information that Illuvium simply does not. It became a community resource that could allow users to search Illuvitars by background, place Illuvitars in order of rarity, and provides 3rd party valuations that actually supported "perceived value". Surely the site should not disappear as it would be a stupid waste. Maintenance and development of this site should be picked up by Illuvium as it would not impose much additional work or costs.

[sharp sigil]

Only thing is, Illuvium team already struggling with lots of things at the same time. They might have to setup partnership to support the IM team to keep working on it. It could be possible to have partnership between illuvidata and illuvialmaster. It will have positive impact overall for illuvium as well

More reliable tools are better and it will help in brining lots of new users as well

[livid bramble]

It would be cheaper & require less management to utilise the existing Illuvium team maintaining the Illuvium web site rather than trying to direct, motivate, & remunerate an extra external team to continue Illuvimaster. HOWEVER, the people who created Illuvimaster have demonstrated talent that the Illuvium team don't have. They clearly have a better understanding of the target audience and what collectors need.

[wide swan]

This was basically my concern

and why I suggested Illuvidata

considering we already have a partnership there

I know personally we wanted to setup a partnership with IM, it just kind of got lost in the mix and madness of things going on at the time I think, plus compounded by the delay in Wave 3 I fully understand their need to move on.

[wide swan]

A bit harsh m8 haha

I would defer to what Spacelover said and reiterate, building hyper focussed products is much easier on a third party to do when that is their sole focus

[cerulean quartz]

there is no point in launching wave 3 if we have no idea what they are worth, it will be an epic failure, so you guys still ahve a few months to resolve this, its not a maybe we should have this, its absolutely crucial we do have it

[cerulean quartz]

Its simple @onyx briar @topaz zodiac @hazy juniper simply need to just open the website before wave 3 or it will be an epic failure.

[meager garden]

the marketplace is not the crux of the matter. IM excelled by its appraisal algorithm not the marketplace.

[hazy juniper]

The website costs money to run. Opening it is not just a catch all answer

[livid bramble]

I know it seems harsh but it is true. I am not talking about technical skills to build and maintain a polished website as I think the Illuvium team absolutely can do this to a very high level. Similarly I am not talking about the Artwork which is excellent at many levels (its carrying Illuvium). It is the Functionality & Gamification which is non existent. Much like the album, it is beautiful, but functionally it lacks imagination, innovation, fun. The Album is the Game and here they are missing the whole opportunity. The only function to the album is confetti... Not much of a pay off. There is now a heavy leaning on "Cosmetics" as the cure all. I don't think the direction is given by someone who understands collectables... As for the leaderboard - which is the only hook holding Illuvitars the Illuvium approach is basic and one dimensional. Look at the gaping void filled by Illuvium-beyond-leaderboard App again it is done by an outsider. Illuvium desperately needs people who actually get what people need + know how to surprise & delight their audience.

[cerulean quartz]

So charge more for those who buy through the site. You already charged a small fee. Beyond w3 is going to be disaster without knowing what the cards cost an absolute train wreck

The team should step in if they care about beyond

[frank pier]

thanks for taking all the body blows in here 😉
And thanks for the mission update today...will buying wave 3 factor in any of the airdrop plans?

[topaz zodiac]

The site only makes income if someone sells or buys through our site, from our collected data there are a huge number of players that use our site as a reference and then go to Illuvidex to avoid those fees, so raising the fees wouldn't really solve anything. We are truly sorry that this is inconveniencing those who loved the features we built, however we mostly approached this site as a passion project, not a business and many of our team members have been sinking their own money into maintaining it. That combined with other factors it just doesn't make sense for us to continue. That being said we're in talks with others to see if anyone else wants to continue the site in our absence.

One more thing, since we’ve seen wild speculation - our closing the site has nothing to do with a lack of belief in the project. We still fully believe in its potential and the amazing IP created. Also no one on our team is abandoning crypto. Sky has moved on to work with other developers on new projects and I fully intend to return to Web3 Gaming Content Creating once I have some time to adjust to the new addition to our family. We really do love and appreciate all the support we've gained from this community as Illuvium and it's wonderful members is what started our (at least Sky and mines) journey into Crypto

[tepid geyser]

It really is a shame to see it go. Hands down the best 3rd party tool 🥺
Just wondering if you could have gone, or can go to a subscription model like some of these illuvial stat tools are currently doing.
Increase subscription price based on tier unlocks.
Tier 0 unlock for free so that people can get a feel for all of your features, to unlock and acess all data for tier 1, $5/month, tier 2 & below, $10/month, etc etc up to $50/month for all tiers.
You could take the sales commission down to 0.5% to make it arbitrary and collect all of the sales volume on top.
You wouldn't need to see a player base that large to recoup your expendatures and begin profiting.
I suppose you have the expense of building this model into the website in just 2 months without fully knowing how many people will sign up for a paid subscription. Based on your wave 1 & 2 data though, is it worth the risk?
Once wave 3 is live and this market picks up the opportunity seems too good to miss.

[topaz zodiac]

A subscription model was always the plan, and we had debated how and when would be best to implement it without getting too much backlash from the current customer base. That being said as you mentioned it would take more time and effort to implement a feature like that, and based on the number of users we never felt like it was quite worth the effort in the past. Probably different now with the launch and the expanded collections, but even adding in the new collections to our algorithm is in itself a ton of work for the feature most loved which was the estimated value tool. Something that Kfue created and managed on his own - seriously brilliant mind that one.

I am not sure Wave 3 would be the answer to our problems, even when we had these features and fees set up for all of Wave 2 and the Promotional wave of Team Liquid, the income wasn't enough to cover the expenses. Also when you take in people wanting us to include Overworld collections, the cost for the data we're compiling continues to go up.

But again there are more reasons beyond finances that are going into this decision and as those reasons go beyond just myself I am not comfortable disclosing them here. I hope people know this is a decision we've been wrestling with for over six months and it was not an easy one to come to.

[tepid geyser]

Makes sense now, thank you for that.
I wish you all the best in your future and hope to see you sticking around these parts ☺️ .

[topaz zodiac]

https://tenor.com/view/charm-ashley-not-going-anywhere-get-used-to-me-gif-11885188

[wide swan]

Always appreciated all your teams work Arty

[dreamy cipher]

Thanks for your work. Alot of us enjoyed using it. I can also read between the lines based on why you guys had to move on. Hopefully Illuvium can win the community back over and IMX can get their act together

[inner quest]

#1285722110991400991 message

the proposal is just one vote away

[inner quest]

reached 25 votes 👍

[sharp sigil]

@smoky verge , goal is reached here for the IIP. Hope to have it actioned on next steps soon.

[smoky verge]

yep will get on it!

do you want anything changed on the wording based on the feedback in the channels?

[inner quest]

I think so even Rich said that the council was waiting for the outcome of the proposal

[sharp sigil]

It's clear to me and steps mentioned on the proposal is good as well. I don't think it needs any modification as community also supported fully on it.

[keen forum]

What will be the next steps?

[serene python]

1)Upload to github
2)Icc voting
3)Imc voting

[smoky verge]

also mentioned in the particular IIP channel 🙂

[sharp sigil]

I notice that I can't put comment on the proposal as it says channel read only. Is it intended behaviour?

[smoky verge]

that is because you do not hold any ILV or have any ILV tokens staked.

if you have connected a wallet to discord with at least 1 ILV held or staked, then you can speak in that channel

[serene python]

#🎫〕verify-asset
In case you staked already but can't Find the channel to verify it for the stakers role 🙃

[smoky verge]

Man this is true teamwork 🙏

[sharp sigil]

Really appreciate your help here @smoky verge . Thank you for your help.

[smoky verge]

anytime man! hit me up if you come up with more ideas 😉

[cedar anchor]

@Artemis Thanks for the hard work on the site, I'm sorry to see it go as well. I learned most of what I know about Illuvium from your site.

[livid bramble]

I have always referred people to IlluvialMaster as the gold standard for Illuvitar collecting. I can search based on Power (bonded or not) compare rarity, select specific backgrounds and get an idea of market value all from one page. If Illuvitars is aimed as being a genuine collectible, it is absolutely essential that this functionality is available and I must say that liked that it was a 3rd party because the valuations did not feel manipulated. I also liked it because the site was obviously built by people who enjoyed collecting and I know Artemis has a very nice album, and watching her streams is always a pleasure. Same goes with Scoriox.

[cerulean quartz]

Why do t you guys support the site
..you do understand wave 3 is going to be ridiculous without knowing g the base price for cards right ?

[cerulean quartz]

Well exactly ....team seems to be ignoring the importance of this function when they could simply support the site but they choose not to. How can I put forward a vote to council to support this ? Can this be an IIP @hazy juniper ?

[wide swan]

Again, I don't think its up to us, I think it would be up to the DAO

[rotund halo]

The lack of information about the Illuvium ecosystem is brutal. If not 1p, there needs to be official 3p support (backed by team). Kinda ridiculous to say you have a launched game with so little public information on how to play it.

[cerulean quartz]

Ok thanks how can I put forward a proposal ?

[wide swan]

Its not like a typical partnership youre asking for IMO. Like we have with @royal anvil, they fund themselves.

<@&1107754780744487002>

[cerulean quartz]

And you can see the base price fir each card ?

[wide swan]

What do you mean?

I dont think Illuvidata has beyond functionality currently

[cerulean quartz]

Thank you !

<@&1107754780744487002> please advise how I can put forward a proposal to support ilvuim master. It's utterly ridiculous that we have to guess the value fir cards and either be screwed with a higher or lower price. It's unacceptable

[teal oxide]

I do also agree there should be better support for beyond trading and information.

I belive Kieran mentioned this in an ama and I will push for an official response from the council.

[cerulean quartz]

Truth is everything on ilvuim master should be on ilv main beyond dex....is there any plans for this. It's ridiculous nt to have it

[cerulean quartz]

It's soooooo simple. Ilvuim needs to support the cost of running ilv master. The tool is already there . If they refuse to do this it says alot obout the owners of the project. ALOT

[teal oxide]

Hello Stray I can see your passion for the project and the utility the illuvial master brought. I would ask that we get in a group chat with illuvial master to see what would work with them if anything. Then we Formulate and IIP based on that.

Then we can determine if there is community support, post the iip, and then the councils can vote

[cerulean quartz]

Fine you know more about it than me so I think the council should discuss this ilv master. I should all work as normal. We cannot have wave 3 without knowing the value of cards. Everyone will be screwed ....newcomers will leave. There is a simple solution

[royal anvil]

We did but we had to revamp the site and took down marketplace and prioritized other features that are not available to the public. But now that IM will be closing, were looking on bringing it back up just to give the community something while we rework the tools for beyond etc.

[cerulean quartz]

So we will have the data for the value if cards before wave 3 ?

[royal anvil]

I cant say at this point. Even if we did, the values will be different from IM since they utilize a different algorithm for it unless @coral moth is willing to let his legacy live on and allow us to use his algorithm for continuity.

[cerulean quartz]

I really dont think people understand how much of an epic failure wave 3 will be without knowing the value of a card , its completely unacceptable that the ilv team do not have this hard baked into the dex, it really is.

[cerulean quartz]

@coral moth is this possible ? If not, wy not ?

[sharp sigil]

Team, We need to have the illuvialmaster back at any cost. Let's try and do that with IIP @cerulean quartz

[hazy juniper]

I dont see why you couldnt write an IIP. But I'd try keep it simple and specific to what u want to happen

[hazy juniper]

Hahahah for free? He put a lot of hours into it 😛

[royal anvil]

Never said for free, ser. I know how the world works 😛

[cerulean quartz]

exactly , its a completely unacceptable situation, easily resolved

[cerulean quartz]

how do i do this ?

[hazy juniper]

Sent instructions

[hazy juniper]

Technically Sky/Artemis would own the algorythm, but it would definitely be a larger discussion amongst IM. Feel free to shoot Sky a message and he will organise a meeting of some kind.

[inner quest]

no one screws you with a higher or lower price, the price of the card, as in the whole world, is determined by supply and demand, so knowing the value of a card changes nothing if everyone sells it higher than its price, if you need it, buy it. I don't think I've ever bought a card at quotation, because no one sold at quotation. So we can't say that wave 3 will be crap because one doesn't know the price of a card, it seems like an exaggerated statement to me. Let's let the team work and give them the time necessary to make sure everything works properly. In my opinion the biggest problem is that many are asking for new waves, but then we should see if they buy and how much they invest.

[inner quest]

I would add that I am also in favor of having illuvialmaster, also considering the excellent work done by the people who developed it. Wouldn't it be a good idea to hire these people into the team?

[static patio]

@cerulean quartz the <@&1107754780744487002> can assist with writting an IIP - you can also get feedback here #1020759212172775464 - this allows community to share feedback

I love illuvialmaster and the founders + team behind it!

However, I feel the IIP would need to be a bit more "generic" in terms of supporting 3rd party apps/teams financially if that was the route you were considering

[cerulean quartz]

I dnt have permission to post in tha channel @hazy juniper

[smoky verge]

you also haven't staked or hold any wallet in your wallet. please make sure you go to #🎫〕verify-asset and hold at least 1 ILV$ in there.

[severe bloom]

How do I find what’s a fair value for my illuvitars?

[hazy juniper]

U can ask someone else to post on your behalf

[severe bloom]

Can anybody help with a way to determine what to list my illuvitar at?

[sharp sigil]

Do you mean to list illuvitars at what price?

[severe bloom]

Yeah exactly

[sharp sigil]

We had really good website til now for it which was showing estimated current value of illuvitars but website is closed and not available anymore :(. You can see the last sold price of similar illuvitars on illuvidex and make an assumption based on it

[severe bloom]

Ah yes I remember I used a website for this a while back. Thanks

[severe bloom]

How do I adjust based on power? Like if the last sold was one third of mines power then what sort of premium can I put on that price?

[pastel bison]

There's no rules. Even the website was pretty off for certain types of Illuvitars. All you can do is look at the effect of power and rarity on other sales and extrapolate from that.

The best things (e.g. T5 backgrounds) tend to have quite a premium, but with very little volume you probably aren't going to get those premiums unless you are willing to wait (and probably not at all).

One would imagine things will pick up somewhat with Wave 3 launch.

[frank pier]

put in the illuvitar characteristics into the illuvidex and it will show current listings..that should tell you all you need to know

[cerulean quartz]

Yes I did has it been posted ?

[smoky verge]

You didnt write anything, didnt make clear what you wanted specifically so we cant write anything for you. Didnt respond to me in DMs when i asked for clarifications. Brother, there is nothing to post

If you want the icc to brainstorm this and have us work on a document without your input, then you have to make that clear to us. And even then it will take quite a bit of time to make sure it isnt exploitable.

It is not like we will just post any random idea there either. It should first have a solid backing in #1020759212172775464 that is where the idea takes shape. Then with enough sentiment around it, we move it to #1126838877429182506 . But you arent giving us anything concrete to work with, so we cant even take the first step 😄

I would suggest you go to #1020759212172775464 and post your reasoning. Something like: "Wave 3 will be a failure if we dont have Illuvialmaster. Because..."
And then think for a minute longer and add what illuvialmaster would bring to Illuvium along with some issues, and potential fixes. 👍

[tepid geyser]

It sounds like I may be a minority in this, but I don't actually think losing iM will have as significant effect as people appear to believe. There could actually be some benefit if you really think about it.
I'm also fairly confident that other 3rd party tools will be happy to try and include some of the IM features into their own platforms to take advantage of that demand.

[wide swan]

I dont disagree, where there is a need people usually deliver just like they did. Although i have nothing but respect and love for arty and sky I think others will make something if the community shows a need and wanty

[pastel bison]

100% agree. I really loved being able to get an approximation of how much I lost or gained in D1sk opening, but it's not going to change my buying habits. I'll just use my own approximation.

[dreamy raven]

It’s always hard to gauge sentiment since people are incentivised to speak up if they see potential issues, not if everything looks like it will work itself out.

Therefore you hear much more from people spotting potential issues, even though you have no idea what sentiment is.

[deep tide]

Will disc in wave 3 be purchased with fuel?

[fathom frigate]

great town hall - really great to hear about the progress being made with the product.

Will all the bugs and leaderboard issues be fixed before the W3 launch and for opening packs are we doing this through the new passport or the old version?

[alpine dew]

I am Hyped for Wave 3 now

[alpine dew]

i think they were going to try and get this feature in but if they dont land owners will still get their 5% of sales.

[fathom frigate]

deservedly so too

[keen forum]

There are some news for beyond after the town hall?

[nocturne wind]

new collection disc's will be available for fuel only?

[inner quest]

I'm really curious to see all those who keep asking about wave 3 how many records they will buy and how much they will invest in beyond...

[dreamy raven]

I hope I am able to play my land before then 😅

Otherwise I imagine the missing revenue will be that much more 😬

[frank pier]

whiner...I mean just because you paid for it doesn't mean you get to use it lol 😉

any big surprises with the beyond ama? Decided sleep was more important...assume we'll get a recording out at some point 😉

[surreal pecan]

It's up on youtube

a few interesting things stood out to me,
-they are still deciding if fuel will be used to buy disks (even if not landowners will get 5% of revenue)
-dark holos will come at some point
-they will have two leaderboards - one is for all waves like we have now/the other will be a current wave specific one
-Wave 3 pricing will be set in eth like the previous waves (not pegged to a dollar amount like the promo disks)
-The wallet delegation/link coming up will be read only, which means you won't be able to bond on it from what I understand

• Kieran is in talks with the illuvialmaster team to buy and bring back the website in some capacity

[dreamy raven]

https://tenor.com/view/538-radio538-bas-bas-menting-droevig-gif-23887360

[strong nebula]

I really hope fuel can be used to buy beyond d1sks. It gives landowners and overworld players another way to use their stored fuel. Also people could potentially have the ability to load up on fuel, when it's cheap, in anticipation of a beyond wave launch.

It would be lame to get a 5% distribution after the wave is done. What if we wanted to use some of that distribution to buy d1sks in that wave?

[frank pier]

thanks for the update and listening to it now...any word on expanding the leaderboard rewards??? Love to see them even go to 150 spots, even with last 50 at .25 ILV which would cost the dao little yet provide some incentive and fun to work to be top 150

[surreal pecan]

they didn't mention that, seemed like by making a second leaderboard it would work to help not just OG collectors but new ones as well... I think that makes more sense, because it favors both groups better than even just expanding the current leaderboard - not sure what your thoughts are on this though

[frank pier]

I'd do them both to 150..if we are trying to grow the beyond community this is one way for sure...and I bet many on those LB end up putting back the rewards into the system so win/win all around. Much better use of rewards pool than paying out rewards to people who aren't vested in the system as we did with season one on launch.

And glad that wave 3 will count for airdrops...that is big

[surreal pecan]

I think you have some solid points - I don’t know what the ilv cost of that would be - it’d be cool when getting weekly rewards if there was an option to have disks minted instead of the ilv payout- not sure how that would work but would be a cool way to reinvest back into beyond

[frank pier]

if you post this in ideas I'd give it a thumbs up 🙂
Save me from converting my ILV (and do we know which wallet that gets paid to???) to eth to buy disks 😉

And anything known on buying disk rewards like wave 2 had to great success?

We supposedly have a new hire just for beyond who should be active in here...anyone catch his name so we can ping the heck out of him lol

[surreal pecan]

@smoky verge Do you think there's any merit to this? Not sure with the direction we are going, that of automated airdrop payouts, if this is something easy to implement or a possible nightmare

Maybe a simpler solution is that after the top 100, the top 101-150 get disks.

Or

The current wave leaderboard is paid out in disks, while the OG one is ilv

[smoky verge]

I can see the merit as it would save ILV for the Treasury. We could have the game-based funds move to the treasury instead of being sold when swapping.

But I dont know the implications on backend when we add a stopping point for people to claim their rewards as D1sks instead of ILV.

They have taken a long while to automate the ILV distributions in the first place and if you want to buy D1sks it could be as simple as selling the ILV and buying D1sks right? There could even be someone selling d1sks on the secondary market where you receive your ILV. So it would barely cost you time to trade ILV for D1sks yourself.

Giving out d1sk rewards for top 101-150 i could see happen but maybe it overall is simpler to have them also remain in ILV form.

I would refer to the analysts and see whether they have noticed a spike in sales after introducing leaderboards. If so, then i could see merit.

Note how i only bring up the economic aspect. I think an overall larger group of collectors would benefit Beyond 👍

But i think we could bother the team to give their feedback and their thoughts on extending leaderboards to 150, introducing a second leaderboard for wave 3 specifically. They may even agree to announce it officially as a test trial to the public if there is no sufficient analysis done i.e.:

"This will run for exactly X time, unless sentiment + returns are in favor of keeping it active after."

Then we can do more analysis on sales/volume/revenue and finally come to a firm understanding of the pro's and cons.

Purely brainstorming here 🙏

[urban stratus]

props to the team for the announcement and all sorry late here had alot on my table. keep it up i feel informed now 🙂

[meager garden]

@late cradle I'm rather concerned about pricing the d1sks in ETH. Can you explain what do we have to gain with this? I get that the lore uses ETH and all that but why can't the ETH value vary? What if ETH goes to $10k? We'll surely need to manually adjust prices again then.

Just in one year ETH has ranged between 1500$ - 4000$. With some months having price variations of over 50%.

Assuming the wave 2 prices remain (0.018ETH for a mega d1sk). If we had Beyond going this past year it would mean a mega d1sk price would vary between 27$ - 72$ depending on the time the wave was happening...

I don't get how this benefits the product. Prices should be pegged to stable currencies for consistency.

[valid sierra]

I think they are?

[meager garden]

only the promo d1sks were pegged to a dollar amount.

[frank pier]

I think you are right and should propose it...there was always talk about extending the leaderboard rewards and wave 3 seems like a great time to do it. Don't need much but even a little feels good and gets people invested in the game and the ecosystem, and if the game takes off, rev dis could drive staking of the rewards also

[frank pier]

stop with all the negative comments 😉

And about time you are back

[tepid geyser]

For wave 3 we are having multiple leaderboards, which include leaderboards for each specific wave, essentially increasing the leaderboard spots by 200 places. No need to extend those IMO.
Apparently there are 5000 Beyong players currently, having 300 places paid by far exeeeds the % of playerbase on leaderboard than any game i've ever seen. We really should be grateful for that.

[meager garden]

a leaderboard for each specific wave? 🧐
I don't think that's what he said, there'll only be 2 leaderboards. A legacy one and the current wave.

[tepid geyser]

🤔 I though I heard each wave will have its own leaderboard.

Also if the rewards are only for the outgoing wave, what happens when it ends, 0 rewards? What if you just managed to get on leaderboard 1 week before it ends, all that work and then you only get 1 week reward. Seems unlikely.
Consistent rewards will create permanent demand and help prop up aftermarket values as people could still compete.
Would like to see confirmation either way though.

[dreamy raven]

They did mention leaderboards for wave 1, 2 and 3 and then the legacy with total points

[meager garden]

you sure?

[tepid geyser]

I thought so too. Can't be 100% though. Have to watch the recording.

[frank pier]

I heard the opposite.leagacy (all three waves) and just wave 3: two leaderboards...and yes, no discussion of ending rewards for legacy after wave ends...that should be ongoing for the foreseeable future

[white vault]

Kieren said there are 2 leaderboards, one "legacy" and one for the current wave. He also said leaderboards for future waves, which is what I think people are referring to here. So 2 to start, and future waves will have leaderboards too.

[dreamy raven]

In the town hall he says there is now going to be an individual leaderboard for each wave. So yeah

At 11:50

Things are know to change around here though, so can’t really put too much weight into it either way

[tepid geyser]

Yeah, we definitely need confirmation on it and details surrounding it.
I'm sure all will be cleared up in due course.

[inner quest]

it is a good idea to create 2 leaderboard, the main one and the one for each wave, is a good idea. I would always keep the rewards for the official and wave rankings active until a new wave comes out, so that new players who manage to stay among the top places in wave 3 will be incentivized to also purchase illuvitars from wave 1 and wave 2 (always to climb the main ranking and get more rewards), in this way we will have a more active market. sorry for my English, I hope you understand the meaning of my speech.

[tepid geyser]

Just watched again, 100% Kieran stated a leaderboard for each individual wave.

[frank pier]

for each wave going forward at the time, or for each wave ever? That be very good for you 😉 but makes little sense to payout out each wave ongoing, each as a separate leaderboard, as much as it would also benefit me

[tepid geyser]

Not sure about that. That's the nuance that we need clarity on, but at least we know each wave will have it's own leaderboard.

[meager garden]

I'm still not convinced about that.

[white vault]

I thought it was clear that it was for future waves, since he says we will only have two leaderboards for wave 3. He confirmed that later in the town hall. One legacy and one for wave 3. Then future waves have the same

About 29 minutes in, with a call out for Alexa too!

[tepid geyser]

Yeah, you're right. It does look that way.

[obsidian meteor]

@tepid geyser reply me in DM please

[smoky verge]

Alexa is so popular

[frank pier]

and I'm a big supporter of LB rewards for Beyond as it is a source of revenue for the dao and as well as the system benefits (eg I would not have bought back land before launch if I hadn't been on Beyond LB...mistake that it looks like as of now 😉
And you can't get the rewards for LB in Beyond without a substantial financial involvement, even though some get lucky with disk pulls; whereas token chat is full of negative people who don't own anything in the system, talk crap about ILV but are mining airdrops to sell asap. Beyond is a good use of ILV rewards...I think LB for Arena will be also when they get that cleaned up.

[alpine dew]

why cant you play your land yet?

[dreamy raven]

The bug where it doesn't load.

[alpine dew]

what has support told you? Is this happening to a lot of owners? We havent had any problems with Zero

[dreamy raven]

They know it and is trying to fix it asap. Unfortunately it has persisted for over a month now.

[alpine dew]

Dang Im sorry, I would be very frustrated if I couldnt play my land.

[radiant silo]

https://discord.com/events/760344898200666112/1287838173485072504

Another no notice townhall... guess they dont want us to be able to actually attend them...

[frank pier]

i finally just sold mine 💀

[pastel bison]

That sucks. @dreamy raven let me poke some people.

[meager garden]

no notice? 🤣

[pastel bison]

Does token trove let you see offers?

[livid bramble]

Totally agree. If Ethereum is heading to twice what it was during wave 2, don't expect anyone to put their Ethereum into the disks. It should be a set price in USD paid in Ethereum. Illuvium needs to get smart and work towards creating perceived value at those USD price points which it is already struggling - hence the required incentives. 🙄

[wide swan]

Yeah I said this too I think

[wide swan]

Yeah I know it’s ready to be pushed in the next update

Just hasn’t happened yet unfortunately

[urban stratus]

i dont recommend that... not like im huge on LB so just my thoughts on this: why keep any collectibles if leaderboard is wave based? how will that work with older wave collectibles in terms of worth? honestly just sounds like a stupid idea unless its seperate lb's to a main lb...

[frank pier]

maybe a reason to expand the legacy lb rewards to 150 or more...only one where they should have something in all waves

[urban stratus]

the reaction is only about the timing bro

[frank pier]

two different conversations...but I think it would be good to have an expanded LB reward system beyond 100, esp. with more people coming hopefully

[urban stratus]

ah sorry i thought it was the same thing. isnt it though? why is the wave based lb a thing again? ill check the link

[urban stratus]

lol its crypto web3 bro.. eth is the stable coin in the space. you can list and buy stuff with udst or was it usdc on open market its user driven. official sale well thats abit different but still you get the benefit using silv2 if you know about it which you do.. but jeah currency is quite volatile in crypto not a new thing... i dont think pegging to stable is the way to go in any means IMO. with volatility you get alot of speculators.. and that is investment people so jeah keep it on eth.

[pastel bison]

Are they saying no overall/master leader board?!? That seems odd.

[urban stratus]

how do i know if i am on lb?

https://tenor.com/view/star-wars-admiral-ackbar-its-a-trap-meme-gif-8125029

[tepid geyser]

There will be a master leaderboard and one for the current outgoing wave with the sounds of it.

[pastel bison]

Sounds good.

[urban stratus]

i dont see the issue with that

where do i find the town hall recording again?

[surreal pecan]

YouTube

[urban stratus]

that was referring to the announcement tab which i really do appreciate no joke or sarcasm in there. my opinion might change on it but the news being on announcement for me atleast is a big plus... unless everything changed again then i just critique changes not being in there lol. i still think there should be more specific tabs in discord but not gonna complain for that. my worry is the whole announcement town hall etc. was a thing of must do and if it has the effect it had they wont see the benefit of keeping the data updated i might be negative but usually things dont just change lol

[urban stratus]

thanks was searching on vevo

usually hard to sarcasm text but that one was easy

its the one from 16h ago?

[surreal pecan]

Yep

[urban stratus]

sorry i thought it was meant to happen a week prior

[surreal pecan]

It was but it got delayed

[urban stratus]

found it listening right now. trying to be positive so edit lol

i just wonder if im on leaderboard...

[urban stratus]

props to @wide swan for calling out alexa's idea. is alexa on DAO though?

i personally believe alexa should be lol

[urban stratus]

my question about lb spot was skipped guess it was "off". is 100-95th spot gonna receive rewards? lol secondary wallet support has nothing to do with this question btw.

[urban stratus]

the leaderboard on illuvium.io list it shows, alexa is not on there if youre wondering what i mean, all non migrated collections are not showing....

[fathom lintel]

this is not correct, I never migrated and I do show up on the leaderboard

[urban stratus]

ok sorry but alexa is not on there and im quite sure top spot illu was 2nd based on profile pic

i asked this before so if im incorrect i am glad its still a real question

[urban stratus]

btw if the list is correct... why is reward distribution a problem? you got a list right? the blockchain never changed.... explain that to me

[fathom lintel]

I didn't say the list is correct 🙂 some people migrated only some of their illuvitars and they don't show up correctly, but I think if you either migrated and sleeved everything, or didn't migrate anything, you show up

[urban stratus]

oki then things make sense hehe does the vercel app doesnt work anymore im guessing then?

else manual sleeving should be possible..

[fathom lintel]

not sure, haven't checked it for a while

[urban stratus]

it aint uncorrect either 😉

[urban stratus]

me neither lost the link due to a reinstall on computer forgot about the saved tabs you got the link for me?

[fathom lintel]

sent you in private

[urban stratus]

thx

[radiant silo]

I asked yesterday if there was an event calendar, no answer. I would just like to be apart of these townhalls...

[radiant silo]

Is there a recording of yesterdays and todays townhall?

[tepid geyser]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rypgZc6AOBI

[radiant silo]

Thank you sir.

[dreamy raven]

Appreciate you Johnny. Rich allready brought it up though, and it looks like it's coming soon. 🙌 #🎮〕illuvium-beyond message thanks though

[dreamy raven]

Thanks for the update. 🤗

[astral ermine]

ty for the town hall, really looking forward for the new album and the account bound collection rewards

[hasty grotto]

I will repeat to myself I am NOT gonna sell my loyalty rewards and season 1 rewards for wave 3 ...I WILL NOT ....I pinky promise

Jhonny better not come back for wave 3 he always stolen my luck ....lol

[smoky verge]

https://youtu.be/mfM1QW4c5YE

[pastel bison]

I'm definitely gearing up for Wave 3.

[smoky verge]

Will you play battles in rhe beyond? Maybe I will snatch an Adorius from you with a T2 S3 holo lynx winner takes all and im very... ahum... lucky

[tepid geyser]

You are very lucky, I remember

[smoky verge]

The moment there is something on the line you'll see all of that luck vanish

But lets do some battles in wave 3. Im not much wealthy in Eth though. Dunno how wagers will work specifically. But who knows maybe ill steal your next holo T5 S3. You could then buy it back 🤣😉
Imagine pulling something better than T5S3 holo without it being T5S3 though... 👀

[tepid geyser]

I'm up for it, but don't punish me too badly though 😅

[smoky verge]

Nah i think we can make it an amicable battle. Rules TBD 😄

[fathom frigate]

I have to agree with this

if possible $$ purchases would be ideal

no one wants to buy with eth to then buy back their eth

[obsidian meteor]

@tepid geyser what happened? Why don't you respond to me in DM anymore?

[astral ermine]

https://tenor.com/view/28weeks-later-running-gif-14570791

[dreamy raven]

https://tenor.com/view/marge-simpson-the-simpsons-shy-shame-ashame-gif-16916873

[sharp sigil]

I really like how @late cradle clearly said that we need Illuvialmaster so I am confident that Illuvialmaster will be online before wave 3 🎉. Thanks @late cradle for acknowledging the urgency around it.

[frank pier]

and he is willing to buy it with his own money if I understood him correctly

[sharp sigil]

I know we were discussing about making specific alpha leaderboard. Are we still planning anything about it @wide swan ?

It may need community support and see if it's necessary to do. I can think of having alpha leaderboard can bring some sales for wave 3 alpha for sure

[frank pier]

speaking of alpha, I listed a bunch of alphas below floor if anyone wants to finish off a collection (low to mid-level stuff)...willing to take all reasonable offers. Be fun to see someone complete an alpha collection!

[sharp sigil]

Posted this on Governance ideas: https://discord.com/channels/760344898200666112/1289936547562655784. Pls comment and vote here. I would love to get community sentiment around it... 🙏

[inner quest]

I would not make an alpha ranking for each wave, but simply a general alpha ranking that lasts over time, so as to also valorise those who own wave 1 and wave 2 alpha and at the same time make the market more active with a correct price distinction between alpha and non-alpha. This wouldn't be to my advantage because I have few alphas but it would be more fair towards those who immediately believed in illuvium and beyond.

[sharp sigil]

You could put a comment in that proposal and vote there. Proposal is not strict in specific way of implementation so structure can be finalised by the team and community as mentioned in the proposal

[inner quest]

ok I'll do it right away

it won't let me write...

can you include my text in your proposal? my vote is in favor

[sharp sigil]

Done for you

[inner quest]

thanks I saw and voted

[sharp sigil]

You could verify your wallet with 1 ILV to have access to write comment on the proposal if you want. :). I also did it 2 days ago 😀

[inner quest]

ok thanks

[cerulean quartz]

Is there any info if there is going to be a wave 4 after 3 ?

[dreamy raven]

Yes. Art is mostly done for wave 4 as well

[cerulean quartz]

really ? When was that anmounced ?

sweet

[frank pier]

yep should be no more delays after this...wave and promo and wave and promo and rinse and repeat till they have all our money 😉

[cerulean quartz]

Well they pay is every week

Well not nooowww

But we still getting it

[smoky verge]

Wave 3, 4 , 5 should be close to done except for the partner ones 👀

#1282487279545356360 message

Very curious to see it all take shape 😄

[sharp sigil]

Based on community sentiment, it's not worth trying anymore so closed and locked this post for any further updates. I don't want to keep it open when community sentiment is pretty clear around it. Thanks for your feedback.

[late cradle]

The question is who will run it?

[sharp sigil]

Can we make it Open source and community drives it and fix the issues if they come? I would love to contribute towards it as dev and I am sure we have many devs here can help.

[pastel bison]

Open source helps with dev (e.g. adding a new feature or fixing a big) but not with run. Its not a stateless thing, and its not running on chain. I assume its running on some cloud service or servers somewhere and needs some level of monitoring and maintenance to support this. Kieran I'll ping you.

[sharp sigil]

It could have some kind of master control from illuvium team but development and bug fixes can be done by any dev. It's also wise that infrastructure will be managed by central authority like illuvium

[sharp sigil]

Why can't the same team run it after you buy from them? They already have expertise with them. Only thing is changing that it's now owned by illuvium but managed by the same team. I am not sure about cost wise but that's the quickest way to make illuvialmaster available online again.

@wide swan , IIP-67 is being passed already and got enough votes on it. What are the plans to implement it and finish the distribution before wave 3 starts? We need to have secondary wallet support soon if we are going to have 3x rewards as promised for limited time to distribute pending rewards before wave 3.

[tepid geyser]

It sounds like some of the team have moved on to other projects.

[alpine dew]

The IMC and ICC perhaps.

[late cradle]

It needs a developer

[sharp sigil]

What technologies used in the project if I may ask?

[sharp sigil]

It looks like @pastel bison will workout something to keep it going. I have a faith on him 😀

[worthy tide]

Why not incorporate some of illuvialmasters ideas into the official website 🤔

[astral ermine]

what about @runic glade

made the leaderboard website:
illuvium-beyond-leaderboard.vercel.app

[runic glade]

only if you give me access to a hyperbolic time chamber

[frank pier]

like to see his app incorporated into whatever we come up with..all in one place 🙂

[vague void]

Illuvial master has its issues but I still prefer it above anything else for most things in beyond .. I hope it can keep going somehow

I missed the town hall… anything notable?

We get a confirm that fuel will be able to be used? Which type? Any type?

[meager garden]

no answers regarding that sadly...

[frank pier]

is there a way we can number the illuvitars so it's clear when something is the first minted?

[cerulean quartz]

What does 3 x rewards mean for wave 3 ? Is this after our missing rewards are dropped and for how long does it go on ?

[cerulean quartz]

What does 3 x rewards mean for wave 3 ? Is this after our missing rewards are dropped and for how long does it go on ?

[cerulean quartz]

Kieran said he wanst to buy it an get someone to run it

[cerulean quartz]

so 3 x rewards for a limited time and when do we get our missing airdrops ?

[sharp sigil]

Let's wait for @wide swan to respond on it. He will comeup with more details

[fathom frigate]

Yea this needs officially addressing

[spare temple]

Agreed.. I checked out for a couple weeks, came back and no info. Idk how things can be rectified at this point, beyond holders again at the bottom of the priority/communication list

[pastel bison]

Has there been no announcement on Beyond Wave 2 rewards? I'm pretty keen to get all my free Wave 3 d1sks!!

[smoky verge]

not yet! but IOU's have been mentioned a number of times to be in the books. so even without announcement they should be ready:
#🎮〕illuvium-beyond message

[pastel bison]

Maybe misplaced faith. I'm not making any committments!

[wide swan]

I'm sure we can get you guys some more details soon as this IIP is passed, if/when IMC passes it

@cerulean quartz

As for secondary wallet support yes its being worked on and its meant to be implemented for/before Wave 3

[cerulean quartz]

Oh yeah I cannot wait ....going to try only open a few everyday.....well let's be real that's probably not going to happen lol

[pastel bison]

Hah I'm going to open everything Day 1 for sure.

[wide swan]

i feel my problem returning... must open d1sks

[urban pawn]

I will be getting ~200 mega disks. Battle in beyond is going to be lit on day 1 😁

[potent tulip]

Coming soon 🙂

[tepid geyser]

Aw maaan. If a Lynx is making me want to crack my wallet, i'm screwed 😩 .

[tepid geyser]

Yep, that confirms it 😂

[surreal pecan]

Sheesh Nov can’t come fast enough

[meager garden]

wave 3 lookin good 🔥

[tepid geyser]

When you get a minute could you post the Scoriox up again. Thanks

[smoky verge]

Oh yeahh i wanna see the reworked tailstumps 👀

[tepid geyser]

It looks incredible. He posted it in chat during Town Hall, I didn't save it .

[smoky verge]

I went ahead and extracted it from the chat there

[tepid geyser]

Holy crap it looks better than I remember 😂

[smoky verge]

Those stumps and the little orange/yellow at the base is a nice fix

[surreal pecan]

Dang....

[tepid geyser]

Stole that beast. It's my profile picture now 😅

[exotic mica]

So when will we be receiving the Mega D1SKS Rewards every 25 bought D1SKS from last Waves Rewards?
And the D1SKPLATE as well with other things?

Has this been announced yet or no?

[barren bobcat]

https://tenor.com/view/you-aint-seen-nothin-yet-rupaul-rupauls-drag-race-all-stars-you-havent-seen-anything-yet-this-is-just-a-taste-of-whats-to-come-gif-2713698221344105539

[potent tulip]

https://tenor.com/view/damn-right-breaking-bad-gif-14029087

[frank pier]

nothing firm yet...by or before nov. 21st, wave 3, expected

[calm lark]

🌕
https://illuvidex.illuvium.io/asset/0x8cceea8cfb0f8670f4de3a6cd2152925605d19a8/670470

[calm lark]

Kinda regret the bandana 😅
https://illuvidex.illuvium.io/asset/0x8cceea8cfb0f8670f4de3a6cd2152925605d19a8/670466

[frank pier]

always thought the lynx looked good with bandanas...but probably not on an illvitar at this value 😉

[calm lark]

Looks good but agreed haha

[frank pier]

good news is, there is a few points people like me who will buy it cheap if you ever sell it and just slap on some more acc. for the album points

[calm lark]

I didnt even realize the background until it was too late rip XD

Feel free to make an offer. I have one that I like for my pfp, I'm not attached to any others.

[frank pier]

feel free to list it and I'll consider making an offer 🙂

[calm lark]

🫡

[pastel bison]

So good.

[wide swan]

maybe one day we will get to clean them

i bonded an alpha by accident

haha

with unflattering accessories

Prepping my D1SK opening skills now

feel like I'll be using Rai-lu a lot

[dreamy raven]

Noob and it’s fine Will definitely have a spot in my emote spams

[young tide]

How can this be a tie? It’s not the fault of the players who were in the top 100 that issues occurred, leading to their rewards being stopped. The fair and reasonable approach, in my opinion, would be to distribute the halted rewards to those players.

[fathom frigate]

have to agree

[calm lark]

Or maybe we could have it so that the accessories can be overridden with a new one. It would destroy whatever was there first, which would also help get rid of some of the common accessories

[fathom lintel]

How is goliant a tier 0 emote when all others correspond with their illuvial tiers?

[tepid geyser]

I had the same thought 😀

[meager garden]

hopefully just a visual bug

[fathom lintel]

Lol, no detail is being overlooked in the most OG channel 😎

[dreamy raven]

The members have stated their reasons here:

Kieran: #1285722110991400991 message

Scoriox/Scrub/Jag : #📯〕council-chambers message

Ani: #1285722110991400991 message

[meager garden]

I'll say one thing. I don't like the fact that we approve IIPs for specific cases. This proposal is either a do or don't, I feel like Ani only voted for revisions cause he had the decisive vote.

I'm curious to know what are the revisions the IIP needs.

[past tundra]

https://tenor.com/view/scrubs-dr-cox-waffle-time-waffles-gif-17191262

[vapid imp]

i think its a scary signel to send that if they want they can stop rewards at anytime and we are owed nothing, i left land becouse i saw what was going on and they ended up reducing its value by 75% overnight(happy i got out), this might make me reconsider buying wave3, i mean will buy few, but might reconsider going leaderboard.

would love some reference where ani got this from - "but it was clearly communicated as a pause and not a delay"
as jag illustrate very well that is not what was communicated - #1285722110991400991 message

Its saddening to see something so simple become so complex

[wide swan]

Clearly is what’s up for debate I think that some are upset about #🎮〕illuvium-beyond message

[vapid imp]

and then Abundance asked for more details, and that is what jag is referring to right?

but if that is what ani reference, did he just ignore the following conversation after, or is he not aware?

[wide swan]

Not sure what you referring to here

[vapid imp]

#🎮〕illuvium-beyond message

[wide swan]

I mean I answered directly below at that point what I knew the plan was at that point

Which was pause and then double rewards

Even a few messages underneath people seemed to have understood what was said

@pure pulsar is this what you referring to? Or were you just saying because there was no “announcement” made

[vapid imp]

i might be complete lost

but its about paying out the "missing" rewards in totality, and not just about if they should be paid out before or after wave 3 start right?

ill go back and read some more, but got to be later, burned my food twice now lol

[wide swan]

Yeah and at that point when asked I told people the plan as far as I was aware

Which I believe is why they started the IIP

I would need to read more as well

#🎮〕illuvium-beyond message

I mean it seems like everyone in the beyond chat was pretty clear that the intent was to not pay the paused period. And the word paused was used several times which seems pretty clear vs the word delay. What did change was due the sentiment around passport and secondary wallet support the pause went longer than intended because of the obvious reasons of people wanting secondary wallet support before leaderboards started paying again

[vapid imp]

ohh okay, im starting to get it.
So his point is, pause could mean pause until wave3 aka rewards moved to wave3, nothing states it will be paid out during wave2

[wide swan]

At least from what I’m back readin now

[wide swan]

Hence why they created the IIP

[frank pier]

how may weeks of rewards have we missed already? 10?

[wide swan]

July 23

Whatever that is

[vapid imp]

thank you so much rich for helping me trying to figure it all out, really appreciated

[smoky verge]

The pause should have started week 30. So 10 weeks now.

[vapid imp]

can be hard to stay up-to date with so much happning

[wide swan]

Yup just showing what was written it’s been a lot across a lot of different channels for me personally so even I needed to back read

[frank pier]

what is the timetable for a definitive answer on all this?

I mean I'm out thousands in ILV as of now so it's getting significant.

[wide swan]

Well now that council has tied the vote it’s on them I guess.

Honestly first time I think I remember need to look at the process but I think like someone mentioned earlier 2 downvotes and a revision is basically revisions

If it’s completely downvoted we continue with the plan Kieran mentioned in the town hall which would be start rewards with wave 3 and if not we figure out what do based on the iip revisions

[frank pier]

It sorta sucks with the uncertainty, and as someone who's put thousands in, unlike a free to play airdrop, and may miss the chance to stake for next rev. dis. it's really disheartening.

alas I think it's also affected the mood and the amount of players for beyond

[wide swan]

I mean I’m right there with you meaning I spent thousands on illuvitars. And my opinion of it the whole time has been that saving them for wave 3 is more beneficial to get new participants in. Boosts the competition and gets people buying up wave1/2 Illuvitars to compete this reinvigorating Beyond volumes. I get that people don’t think it’s fair to compete with new people coming in but I we are also much further ahead than them. We have promos, and wave 1/2. also as a side note I know separate leaderboards could/we want to be a thing but as I said previous just not sure yet if those would be ready

[pure pulsar]

yes. is the plan still doubling the rewards?

[wide swan]

The difference I think for some is me personally I bought illuvitars to collect them, and not for leaderboards. I think leaderboards are a bonus on top of what you’re already paying for which is a piece of the Illuvium IP in Beyond.

[frank pier]

I mean I'm so far up the LB I'm not too worried, more that is seems a switch and bait to the ones already on the board. Appreciate you being here for us Rich. I have known over 10 LB top 100 players who have left or are in the process to leave personally and a few more, including top three that would sell if they could...love to see us honor this system.

[wide swan]

We’ve since said 3x like in the town hall.

[frank pier]

yeah, LB was key for me...and for many others. Not to be minimized or neglected

[wide swan]

Yeah I mean I hate to see people leave. It’s not like anyone here at Illuvium goes out saying “let’s screw them over”. We really do make a concerted effort to make you guys happy everywhere we can.

I’m sure some one will comment “what about Illuvium zero”

😂

I’m trying to help there too guys I promise

[vapid imp]

i hope they do the right by the community.
we tryed getting new players on the cost of the community before, was not worth it back then and dont think its worth it now.
if we was in an alt cycle and a lot of new people was entering crypto atm i could see the case being made, but i think right now its a lose-lose

have a good evening everyone

[frank pier]

The LB rewards was the only way I could justify bring in thousands

[pure pulsar]

#JusticeForLandholders

[frank pier]

I've given up hope on zero lol...Beyond still has a chance if they don't mess it up 😉

[pure pulsar]

ok ill buy 5 Alpha D1sks

[frank pier]

well you can use your worthless land fuel for it at least 😉

[pure pulsar]

i dnt have a plot

i played the F2P plot

[past tundra]

https://tenor.com/view/anakin-liar-star-wars-lying-gif-8634649

https://tenor.com/view/issa-joke-its-a-joke-im-joking-gif-7246089

[frank pier]

anyone who has been involved in a real world business knows that your best customer is your current customer. That is your easiest sale going forward and if you create loyality it may be for a very long time. Yet if you cheat them or lie to them in anyway they become your worst enemy as we can see in token discord. Beyond is the only product that got it right from the start, and created excitement and loyalty with the Leaderboard rewards, as well as the fun of opening disks and album slots. Then the first mistake, which Kieran owns, is delaying wave three "for a few months"..and we can see where that is now. Now messing with rewards could be the second huge mistake. Tempting people to buy disks who don't stay part of the community will be of no benefit to Beyond or ILV in the long run. Be loyal to your long term LB members and they will be loyal to you...if not, there will be consequences for the whole ecosytem. Maybe it won't matter, maybe ILV will get another raise and in a few years have a new ecosystem that works. But if not, better to take care and honor the agreements with those of us that are still here.....

[dreamy raven]

Yeah. I don’t think it has the intended effect. People be like, oh, lots of rewards? Nice! Let me just read discord to learn more.
Oh. They just stop the rewards when they feel like it. Hmmm 🤔

[dreamy raven]

Yup. Staying true to your words and commitments is of upmost importance.

[wide swan]

Not cause we felt like it really

Because it would’ve been unfair with the migration

And then coupled that with secondary wallet

We felt it was necessary

[dreamy raven]

Not true. That’s an excuse to pause, not cheat out players who would otherwise have earned it, if it hadn’t been for the moves made by the team

And Kieran’s statement:
“I declined this proposal because rewards are not guaranteed to Beyond players. “

And he continues: “At any point, we reserve the right to pause rewards if they are not providing sufficient value to the ecosystem.”

[frank pier]

The funny thing is he has said in numerous recording beyond rewards are safe and will continue...starting to make me wonder if there are real management issues.....

[keen forum]

At least now we understand who we're dealing with, they even tell us the lies about the wallet, while Kieran clearly said that they were paused because they don't generate revenue

They can do anything but now if someone invests in illuvium or beyond it's not the team's fault

[astral ermine]

For instance, in Season 3, we determined that the rewards weren't driving enough revenue, so we made the decision to pause them while we devised a better system.
but that was communicated differently, i thought this was about the leaderboard on passport and secondary wallet fixes

[keen forum]

We say that communication is their problem, but considering how much money they took from us, I think that in reality we were the fish

just right to share

I wasn't good at the game of finding the differences

For over two months we have been told a lie and investors are not as stupid as you think, wave 3 will go wrong but the fault lies with those who make the choices, not with the team that certainly works a lot, not at Beyond

[surreal pecan]

Hard for Beyond to generate revenue when waves aren’t released…. I feel like we are being “disciplined” for something that we aren’t responsible for. I don’t know; i guess we can get down to semantics and opinions, I just know this feels bad

[keen forum]

Wave 3 doesn't generate revenue? How strange it has been postponed I don't know how long, and it's still far away. Surely the fault of the community this delay

[wide swan]

Well at least initially i know it was stopped because of this reason. Not for the reasons he mentioned

[wide swan]

I was wrong here as well

@royal anvil informed me that the tie breaker being revisions means it was rejected

[dreamy raven]

https://tenor.com/view/homer-simpsons-simpson-fail-failure-gif-8569786

[wide swan]

its a good lesson

[dreamy raven]

Better to learn it before your in a Olympic competition between the parents in your kids class, it’s who can jump the longest, you are maxing your effort and when you jump something loud snaps, and your not able to walk for a year

[wide swan]

This sounds like a very personal story lol

[dreamy raven]

Yeah.

Not sure why it popped in my head

[vapid imp]

also i assume the triple rewards will be for the "all waves" leaderboard, so even if new people join very few or non will even have a chance to build a album and get the x3 rewards
but at this point the other things that was said i think is even more worrying

[inner quest]

incredible!! they make fun of us, they clearly say that they will block the rewards as and when they want... they also make us vote on decisions already made... and then maybe they expect wave 3 to be a success? It seems like a comedy film... congratulations this is the perfect manual on how to scare away your supporters and investors. Congratulations!!!

[urban stratus]

admiting mistakes should get some positive feedback in the community IMO. Don't ignore honesty

[inner quest]

when you make a commitment it must be respected!! if you don't respect it once it means that your word is no longer worth anything. We earned the rewards in waves 1 and 2 by investing time and money, what we are given as rewards is a drop in the sea.

[wide swan]

I would just say that we have made things right in the past where we’ve made mistakes, this went through governance like anything else would’ve. If the IIP had passed we would’ve followed the IIP. Also I’ve asked Kieran already to come try and clear up any misunderstanding about his comments when he’s online

[inner quest]

Kieran's comment was very clear, no further words are needed, it's clear that you can remove and modify as you like, so I don't like this game anymore. As soon as I can I will sell all my collections (2 albums in the top 50 places) and at this point you can keep my rewards.

Good luck for wave 3!!

sorry for my english

[wide swan]

Im sorry weve made you so upset, not the intention by all means

[inner quest]

I'm sorry, I have nothing against you, but I feel really cheated.

[alpine dew]

This is probably the first time I think @late cradle has made a bad decision and I think his reasoning is even worse. Pausing Season 3 is was different than Beyond rewards as people know that if they spend money playing the game now that they wont earn points of airdrop because season 3 is paused.

---Also I think this reasoning from him will set an even worse precedent that will harm the ecosystem way more than handing out rewards that players think they "deserve". From the start of Beyond it was said that rewards would happen every week and players/investors like myself believe in Illuvium so much that we invested our money into nfts (that are not liquid instead of ILV which can be quickly sold) to get top 100 for rewards.

--Saying that, I have faith Kieran will write a great proposal around Beyond rewards which should clear up how exactly Beyond rewards work.

[fathom lintel]

This is not about the money, it's about trust. Most players on the leaderboard take their ILV rewards and recycle them right back into the project. AND they spend a whole lot more on top if it. We don't mind to spend serious money in the game, but we do mind being played.

Turning a clearly technical reason for a pause around and trying to twist it in a way that somehow justifies not paying out the rewards that would have been payed out if it were not for the technical issue is wrong.

Selling out the trust of those customers who spend the most in your project over a payout amount that is chump change in the grand scheme of things is a terrible business decision!

“At any point, we reserve the right to pause rewards if they are not providing sufficient value to the ecosystem.” @late cradle , if you think this somehow applies here, please do a calculation for a lifetime value of a customer, who has already spent 4-5-6 figures in the game, AND to whom you can keep selling almost indefinitely, provided you can keep them around. The Beyond reward money may well be the best spent money by the project when it comes to bringing value to the ecosystem.

This is literally the worst group to try to shortchange over such a trivial issue, especially at a time when the project badly needs paying customers.

@royal anvil, @verbal hedge with all due respect guys, you are being trusted to make good business decisions for the DAO. Scroll up a bit and read what several people from the leaderboard had to say, then see if you still think your judgement has benefited the DAO, or caused financial harm instead... And those are just the ones who voiced their opinion, there are likely to be many more who will only vote with their spending (or lack of)

[worthy tide]

10 weeks of missed Rewards should be paid put immediately, not that it's even worth much now the token price has dived. Pretty disappointed in the leadership of this whole project tbh I've already written this off as a complete loss, only a fool would buy these assets as they stand. Trust is gone. How are you going to fix trust for your current investors? How is wave 3 going to have a remote chance of success after so many broken promises?

[hazy juniper]

As a top level organising direction I'd be happy to run it. But I dont have the code skills to do all that.

[royal anvil]

Thats the thing. We are looking at it from a business perspective.

First of all, there has been no IIP regarding leaderboards across the illuvium system which means that it is a marketing initiative. Leaderboards across the whole ecosystem has a purpose. When Arena had ILV payout for leaderboard it was to incentivize DAU/MAU. Beyond was to incentivize continuous purchases of d1sks.

In Arena, leaderboard rewards were paused (at least to me) cause the game wasnt fun and was not drawing the number of players we wanted. Same thing with the airdrop. Were currently on a pause so that we can fix the airdrop mechanics and attract the right playerbase. Now for Beyond, I had advocated that we pause the rewards long before simply because there was no product. We were not getting the intended results of getting players to keep purchasing d1sks since there was no product! This meant that the DAO was bleeding ILV to 100 people in the ecosystem and not extracting any value from them. That to me is not sustainable!

Now granted the pause that happened was through a technical issue and not the reason I stated above. I get that. It is what it is at this point. However, that doesnt distract from the fact that it was never communicated that beyond players will be receiving their ILV indefinitely with or without an active wave/product.

I say this with utmost respect but its human nature for those affected to advocate for their own bags. If people is able to get free ILV without having to purchase anything or invest time in it, who wouldnt want that? But has anyone calculated the total ILV that was supposed to be distributed for the 10 week pause and compare it to the revenue from beyond? (bigger math heads chime in lol) Im sure the disparity will be crystal clear that were bleeding money for little to NO revenue flowing in to the DAO. Does that make any business sense?

Again, I am not insensitive to the top 100 and Kieran/Labs arent either. A x3 rewards for Wave 3 makes sense to me. Were providing a bonus cause Wave 3 got super delayed but at the same time incentivizing purchase of d1sks.

Finally, I also acknowledge the fact that there were lapses in communication and clarity. Im looking into this and will work with labs on establishing guidelines for pauses and such. Most likely a proposal would be in order to be applied prospectively.

Note: Oh snap. this was supposed to be in reply to @fathom lintel
P.S. These are all my personal take not to be confused as the council or IMC's opinion

[alpine dew]

I would be willing to take a pay cut to add someone to council with code skills

[hazy juniper]

That's admirable but I am not sure how that helps. U think the council should take ownership of a third party Illuvium website?

[alpine dew]

Kieran said he wants to buy it

but he dosent know who would run it

lets hire someone via council pay

[wide swan]

I’m sorry man but I’ve been in crypto a long time. And I still stand by the fact that we are one of the most trustworthy projects out there. Yes something’s didn’t work as we would’ve liked. Some promises weren’t kept as intended. But the intention wasn’t and still isn’t to harm anyone or hurt anyone’s investment or love for the project. There are very few projects that have actually stuck around for the amount of time that beyond has and the dedicated art and team behind it. These illuvitars are not just pfps from some rug devs with AI art nor are they useless nfts from some other influencer hype project. They will unlock things in game for you let alone being actually good looking art that people literally hand drew.
The comparison to other projects in the space isn’t even close. I can’t disagree not everything has gone perfect. But show me a project that has. This team has poured the heart, soul, time, and energy into making this something people would love.

[alpine dew]

lets just all wait to hear Kieran's proposal, hopefully it makes everyone happy. If not we can all get out our pitch forks. lol

his reasoning is what bothers me rn

not so much the ilv

[wide swan]

People are acting like this is some kind of rug of a beyond. I had a 2 hour conversation with Rogier today about beyond. I don’t think people grasp what beyond is meant to be. Beyond was Rogier’s baby. And we talked and he’s gonna write a blog when time permits (soon). But without speaking for him it’s genuinely not about just the leaderboard rewards. He and the art team didn’t just do this all for nothing.

[hazy juniper]

Kieran is buying it, wouldn't Kieran hire someone? Or Labs? Again I don't understand why the council would be involved

[alpine dew]

idk just spit balling. maybe if Kieran deciedes he dosent want to buy it the DAO can. I just dont want to see such a great grass roots project go down in flames, we should be supporting that

[hazy juniper]

Fair enough. I actually think the right course of action is taking the core tech and integrating it into the Illuvidex

[alpine dew]

if possible that would be awesome

[hazy juniper]

But it would mean the Illuvidex team would have to maintain it. I know it got messed up here and there whenever IMX deprecated specific APIs

[dreamy raven]

When I am reading this, I get the feeling you have never run a business that is dependent on it's costumers. What you are saying is true when looking at spreadsheets. When you run a business, your costumers loyalty and the business brand are number 1 priority.

I also think you are missing the point most is trying to make. It is NOT about our own bags getting those ILV's. It's trust.

[pastel bison]

Its not breaking trust if people just assume something with absolutely no official statements that say otherwise. This used to happen all the time on Zero, some community member would say something like it is a fact, and then people would dicsuss it and come to think of it as fact, then get all uppity that some feature that was never validated by the team, or via any official announcement, wasn't available.

Beyond rewards should continue for some time once all blockers are removed and there should be some 'make-up process' such as x3 rewards. This was discussed by lots of team members and official statements and unless there is a very good reason not to do it it should be adhered to.

But they don't have to go on forever.

[dreamy raven]

Not according to Kieran: #🎮〕illuvium-beyond message

[pastel bison]

In which case I'm sure there is a very good reason.

[late cradle]

I think where things have gotten confused is the message of why the rewards were paused. Instead of us saying rewards are paused due to the wave being delayed, we said it was an infra thing, which I can now see confused people into thinking once that was fixed we would continue them

[pastel bison]

Are we saying they will never come back, or that they are still delayed?

Delaying until Wave 3 is very different to "no more rewards ever".

[late cradle]

Please don't mince my words. I am not saying we won't continue rewards. But the purpose of the rewards is to incentivise people to buy more illuvitars.

[dreamy raven]

I am not mincing your words. Johnny said it's not breaking trust if there is an official statement otherwise. There was. It's pinned. Now you have rejected the IIP and giving the reason "For instance, in Season 3, we determined that the rewards weren't driving enough revenue, so we made the decision to pause them while we devised a better system."

That has nothing to do with the official statement

[late cradle]

And as you can see from my message above, I wasn't aware we said they were stopped due to migration. Which changes my stance considerably

[fathom lintel]

I appreciate the time you put into your response.

I'm also happy that you mentioned this being a marketing initiative. Because as a marketer, I know that a successful business looks at the LTV (life time value) of a customer when they decide how much they spend on aquiring/keeping said customer. If that a customer is likely to spend an average of $10 over their average lifespan of 2 years, they happily spend $5, even if they bleed money initially.

Your reasoning looks at the customer more like a cash cow. But when a player commits to competing for the Beyond leaderboard, they know they have to fork over a significant amount of money and also know that they have to keep spending. There is the "extracting value from them" part.

We love the art as much as anyone else. But let's not pretend that the rewards have not been a major factor in people's decision making here. Without them, I would have spent hundreds on some of my favorite illuvitars. With the rewards, I could justify spending 10x that amount.

It requires trust to sink that much cash into a project. The team has earned this trust over the last 3 years. And you are now eroding this trust because you are focusing on a short stretch of time instead of looking at it with their LTV in mind. I'm sorry, but that is a shortsighted approach. No business succeeded yet by driving away their best customers.

What effect do you think it has on a person considering spending thousands on a game when you state that you can just take away the leaderboard rewards they could potentially earn at any time? They likely to think about it twice, no?

Contrast that with giving an iron-clad guarantee that you will keep paying out leaderboard rewards for at least the next 5 years (this would be a commitment for about 1/40th of the prize pool!). Now you would be giving piece of mind and licence to spend for a bunch of degens, who would be happy to splurge and compete. Which of these would be the better business decision?

[dreamy raven]

Glad to hear it changes your stance.

Sad to hear the official statement hadn't reached council before voting on the IIP set forward by the community

[pastel bison]

I think its fair to say that there there were several contributing factors to the reward halt. And that different people, team, council, and community, may have had different opinions on why they wanted them to stop. But which reason was the main reason or the "real" reason really doesn't matter, they were stopped. To start them again you consider the current state, and when it makes the most sense for the business to start them again (and obviously customer impact is the driving force behind that).

[dreamy raven]

I will stop commenting on this, as the message isn't getting though. I do think you are painfully unaware how much trust is needed to build a successful brand and growing costumer base. As most of the talk is the community telling this to the council / team, and team / council then defending the actions taking, it seems fruitless.

Again, I am such a big fan of Illuvium, so will be enjoying the games, and hope they turn out great.

[pastel bison]

As an example:```
Lets assume for the sake of argument rewards were stopped due to migration issues.
Lets assume that migration issues were fixed.
But lets say we now see that 50% of the leaderboard players had not migrated due to concerns over the lack of hardware wallet rather than due to lack of migration features.

In that case even though the "issue that caused us to stop" is rectified I still wouldn't think it best to turn them back on again.

[pastel bison]

This is very reasonable point, but only a very small amount of the customer base actually post here with any regulairty. The community can get very vocal and enthusiastic about certain issues, and it can seem like there is overwhelming support ... but if you actually look at the number of people of posting it might be 20 or so.

This noisy few don't neccessarily represent the view of the majority, nor what is best for the other customers or DAO.

That's not always the case, but it does happen here a lot.

[dreamy raven]

Agree it happens a lot.

[pastel bison]

(Just for reference last time I looked ... before I lost access ... there were over 5k DAU on Zero, so a vote of 20 on a Zero issue is so small as to be statistically meaningless)

[late cradle]

8K beyond players 😉

But anyway, let me work on this before we discuss any further. I think everyone will be happy.

[dreamy raven]

It is time for Leviathan gauntlet though.

We aren't getting enough players without you jumping in voice

[royal anvil]

I understand your POV on trust and keeping customers and I know full well that the rewards is one of the main driving factors why people poured money into it. But where we differ is how trust is being maintained here.

Theres uncertainty with leaderboard rewards. It was never clearly defined only assumed that it would continue the whole time with or without a live product (wave). Theres also ambiguity in when and how leaderboard rewards can be paused/restarted. To me, these are prime topics for a proposal. Provide clarity by passing a proposal (as an example) that rewards are only doled out during the set period of a wave. Or leaderboard rewards can only be paused if any of the conditions are present. At the same time, if a pause occurs over a set period or longer, a mechanism will be put in place such as minimum x2 rewards etc.

---

What Im reading from most people is that the only way trust can be maintained is if to give the ILV rewards from the pause. Theres no room for other options. My ask is for people to be open to other options. Yes. Lets address the gaps. Lets maintain/build that trust. But at the same time, be open and even suggest alternatives.

[pastel bison]

Rewards are a sensitive topic, so maybe good to have some really clear way to communicate whats going on there.

Like a roadmap/status page of current rewards, planned rewards, rewards that are going away, etc.

[fathom lintel]

Yes, please! It would be great to have clarity on the rewards conditions. This issue has come up already from time to time but we never really had a clear answer.

Please give some thought to committing to guaranteed rewards for a longer time period (3-5 years). I know that at first this sounds like the DAO would be tying their own hands but is it really the case? Is their any real risk here? Because I could not come up with any.

We are likely to keep rewards in the foreseeable future anyway (we are even hearing about multiple leaderboards), so why not commit to it? If people would have certainty, it's reasonable to assume that they would spend more.

There are really only 2 possible outcomes. Either the project succeeds (in which case Beyond will bring in much more money that the payout amount) or it fails (in which case, who cares about worthless tokens being given out).

So maybe I'm missing something, but the way I see it the benefits would heavily outweigh the risks here.

[rotund halo]

"Theres uncertainty with leaderboard rewards. It was never clearly defined only assumed that it would continue the whole time with or without a live product (wave)."

That's the exact problem that we expect to be fixed going forward. But simply saying the expectations of the community were wrong, when there was not clear communication that supports that, is quite bad.

Startups think growth is the most important thing until they experience loss of retention.

[nocturne wind]

What will be currency that will be used to buy beyond discs? fuel? or still ILV/ETH? because there were plans to convert it all to fuel right?

[alpine dew]

the team is trying to get the fuel feature into wave 3 but if they cant get it implemented in time, Zero owners will still get 5% of sales.

[livid bramble]

This is such a mess. I'm tired of it.

[inner quest]

excellent words, it's nice to see how something so simple to understand remains so complicated for those who have to vote. It's disconcerting to read that Scrubadubdad, Dr. Spoon and others say that if there is no game there should be no rewards, comparing Beyond to OW or Arena, the difference is that on OW and Arena you received rewards by playing for free or with minimal investment , while in beyond the top 100 on the leaderboard did not spend less than 10,000 dollars to be there. In my opinion you are destroying a jewel like beyond, and I think that the vote should not be valid if the motivation does not make logical sense for the majority of the community.

[inner quest]

excellent explanation

[inner quest]

just to be clear: beyond players continue to "play" even without a game. I bought many more accessories and cards than I needed to continue to stay in the top 50 places. If I knew the rewards were being blocked I would have made do with what I had. To move up one position, beyond players spend 400/500 dollars if not more with just one card, the rewards are just a little help and an incentive to continue fortifying the album and investing in beyond, but three months of rewards they are not even equivalent to the cost of a purchased card. The rewards that the top 100 receive are multiplied by x10 or x20 to continue to remain in the rankings. By the way, if you look carefully, the first 100 beyond players are also the first to spend in OW on lands, etc., etc. Now can you understand better why paying the rewards? and that the rewards paid do not go up in smoke elsewhere but return multiplied into the game?

Can you understand why we feel so ridiculed?

so please no longer compare beyond rewards with other types of rewards.

[dreamy cipher]

It’s pretty simple. If there were no leaderboard rewards they would not sell as many packs. For the team to randomly not reward players is ridiculous

[meager garden]

https://tenor.com/view/shade-watching-baby-yoda-messy-tea-gif-12692722566736320360

[late cradle]

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1t9qufi44Mhsrc_KtlTRaKqG9Gn74teDotJyRBaukMgw/edit#heading=h.jeflx9p1l

[spare temple]

Thank you Kieran, this sounds great for Beyond folks and gives a clear outline for future, while making sure Beyonders are contributing the the ILV economy.

Thanks for understanding the urgency of the matter

I'll wait for clarification on how previous week leaderboards will be determined for retroactive rewards. Cheers

[tepid geyser]

https://tenor.com/view/dave-chappelle-nailed-it-chappelle-d3adlyz3bra-gif-25768261

[surreal pecan]

This is great- really appreciate you taking the time to clarify - feeling much better about wave three and beyond

[mossy turtle]

That the rewards stops one month after the wave is something that i think people will feel like it kills their idea of sitting on the leaderboard and getting massive rewards each week during a bullmarket.

And while we are at it, should we discuss the reward itself, if ILV would be at 250$,500$,750$,1000$ does the amount of ILV given out still stand? Because i know @late cradle has mentioned this before of lowering the amount, if ILV were to hit crazy numbers

[tepid geyser]

I'm pretty sure that they don't want to have a huge amount of downtime between waves, I think this is just a precautionary measure, just in case there are any unforseen delays, they reserve the ability to stop them and everyone is fully aware of this.

[late cradle]

The waves are meant to only be 1 month apart in an ideal world. The beyond players wanted the pause due to the bear market, so theoritically there should be no break in rewards if things go as planned

[mossy turtle]

Thoughts? beacuse IF it were to happen that we got a massive bullrun and we stunted the rewards during that time when people would be the most euphoric, it would look very bad

[spare temple]

one thing at a time lol, tho i see the want to get it all worked out while we're on the topic

basically sayin team deserves a rest for a sec

[frank pier]

this is what we were looking for! Thank you
Not perfect but clear and understandable....and really aren't the waves pretty much running concurrently going forward? ie limited down time between waves?

[late cradle]

It would require an IIP, I mean theoretically, the rewards aren't meant to be forever, although they could be using a few methods.

[spare temple]

yep just mentioned that too ^^

[late cradle]

What is it missing?

[mossy turtle]

Definitely, im not demanding an awsner, just raising the question

[frank pier]

more clarity on retroactive payments. Obviously it will have to be a snap shot at the time of wave 3, and LB has changed a lot as we had quite a few people drop in rank or sell out. That's fine if that's what we need to do with read only wallets not available till then (and where are we on that?).

And to be fair, you say 8k beyond players but really active players have dropped substantially (look at illuvidex sales). Like most businesses the top 10% of your customers supply the vast majority of your profits...certainly true in Beyond 😉

Now if we have expanded albums and rewards (check) and onging ILV rewards and continuous releases (and I'm already looking forward to promos) then we can keep people in the system. I hope you do some big email blasts etc where we can get people back into ILV who have left the system and Beyond is a fun way to do that...and some of them probably have free disks coming also.

[late cradle]

I'll speak to Jeremy and provide more clarity on the retroactive payment tomorrow

[frank pier]

Man, now I love you again lol

https://tenor.com/view/celebration-impatient-joy-happy-baby-gif-18429967

[mossy turtle]

This is fake, but i wish it was true:

[inner quest]

in my opinion, blocking the rewards one month before the end of the wave seems small... this means that if each wave is delayed by more than a month, no one will get anything. Considering the investment people make to stay in the rankings for a month is too little. Then the fact remains that from October 3rd to November 21st no one receives anything, right?

if the wording "one month" is inserted as a precaution it's one thing, otherwise it doesn't seem like a great victory to me... I would have preferred to know that the main ranking rewards were always paid for x... years and in the event of significant delays between the waves they could have a period of suspension. Excuse me but I have to regain confidence...

[frank pier]

Few other ideas for you: Keep the total leaderboard rewards (legacy) for the whole set...this is a nice conclusion, will give some certainty and can be revisited before set 2. This being certain also helps the secondary market as people will buy bonded illuvs and also gives us sellers cash to buy other illuvs and more disks. I would also expand the LB rewards to 150 to draw a few more people in to going long term. Doesn't have to be much, even .25 for the last 50, but people love incentives and completing things. I could see the wave specific rewards ending at the end of the wave, including promo (which I assume will be included in airdrops if still going) and they are double the rewards vs legacy amount so still quite an incentive even if they end by the start of wave 4. And then spell out expectations, but may change depending on dao needs and also ILV price which could lead to change in amount of ilv rewards. Thanks for being on this...and yes we will have the degens show up just to open disk also, so this could go quite well. Any incentive to burn those clown noses proposed yet? 😉

[keen forum]

@late cradle Thank you for making a proposal that seems correct. I think other people like me when they started collecting for the Top 100 were like "As long as Beyond exists, there are rewards." There was no defined limit, and if there was a time limit it was right to specify it. Apart from this, however, it is right to make the proposal and put a time limit, clarity is the key. I only ask 2 things for this very important proposal, change the time from 1 month to 3, for many reasons, but if the next wave is emitted after 1 month as indicated this problem does not exist right? and expand the LB to 150 seats, the last 50 with 0.1 ilv. It would be an addition of 5 ilv per week, 20 per month. This incentive, which is a cost to the company, will generate much more revenue than costs through the disks sold and a more active secondary market.