lore-discussion-spoilers

[cobalt palm]

In my mind, the spirits memories are either a special memory to them, or a point in time that they would travel to Eden to ascend, or that was the point that the shattering occurred, and trapped them in the realms.
All of them have their own implications, and Duets cellist's seems to imply that it wasn't when the shards first fell, as they have further memories after that point.
Equally it could well be the last memory they recorded before the shards fell, and over time became the husks we see as dark plants surround that memory, and the light becomes "calcified" into a solid husk.

One other clue may be the Steward in the Aviary new starting scenes, as the Steward seemed to know that something was going to happen at the place their husk was, and that leaving a candle there would be important to whatever happened there. And as it turns out, that's where new players land and get their candle for the first time, and the Steward is the first spirit they interact with, as a guide to the rest of the realms.

[dark mountain]

What do we think the things in the bottom right corners of these murals is?
I though they were the same shape, but side by side I see they are quite different 😅 Source; https://sky-children-of-the-light.fandom.com/wiki/Murals

For the golden ark one, I thought maybe boat?
But it's a weird shape compared to the other boats

But the wasteland elden constellation looks like bones to me now
Which implies the death of a large creature during the war?

[nimble ingot]

The bottom right?
The first image with the Forgotten ark are crashed boats. Possibly the ones in the graveyard area, if not a different space where boats have fallen.
The second image with the wasteland elder are whale bones.

We see a similar set of whale bones in the boneyard area in the forest area.
There are also a remnant of it found on the 5th flooor in Vault. Which is linked to the wasteland area becuase each floor in vault are in some way linked to their respective elders/realms.

[last oasis]

Yeah, there are quite a few broken boats around the arc, including some pretty big ones, which I assume were less of lifeboats (like the small ones) and more like some form of escort that we also see in the murals

[last oasis]

Aren't there two skeletons in the vault? One at the last floor and one at the second to last floor (where's there's also a huge ghost manta)

[nimble ingot]

That is the 5th floor, if I am not mistaken.

[last oasis]

Okay, I don't remember the numbers, but there's a skeleton with the large ghost manta and then there's another skeleton at the elder's level

[dark mountain]

Okay, so, thoughts about the war and GW
Before I did a lore dive I thought the war was between the people and the krill/other darkness creatures
Lore reading says it was a civil war, between the sun (light?) shields and diamond (Darkstone?) shields over the use of Darkstone
In the Aurora concert memory, we also see people fighting mantas
And we know that "unnatural death leaves remains"
And there's a lot of bones in gw, on a scale/size of creature we don't really see much anymore
(There's like, 3/4 really big light creatures?)

[nimble ingot]

It is though add that we dont see remains of ancestors.
Whether it is a children's game or not. The concert at least shows these stone statue versions to represent the grief and loss in the game.

For a game meant to be children friendly, it is walking a thin line with heavy topics.

kind of like how theorists here have to take care with the blasted bot sniping messages without warning or reason.
Don't forget to copy your text, folks.

[dark mountain]

All that backstory/context to say
Are all three things true?
There clearly was a civil war
But was it also a war on several fronts?
I expect people tried to deal with the krill (can you even kill a krill??)
And the light creatures clearly attacked and died in great numbers in GW
Were light creatures fighting on the side of the sun shields?
Or just attacking everyone, unable to understand who was on their side?
I've also always thought the spears look huge and harpoon like, and what better weapon to take down a krill or whale?

I'm afraid I'm just speculation central here folks, I have no big grand theory to add 😅

[ashen fractal]

This has probably been said before but the lore (at least the really basic parts) seem very similar to Journey

Which makes sense. It's just Sky they got to expound on it more so there's more figures and more distinct looks. But that's just me probably. I am much more a Journey/offline game person so this and one other game are my online games and ironically both have no talking

[spiral vault]

I wonder if the second image is an illustration of events that happened, or a prophecy of the future.

I think they just can, but they have no effect on the world. They're like ghosts

[potent gust]

This isnt really a spoiler i guess but i figured maybe someone here would know.

Isnt there a spirit with a relive sequence where they are taking care of darkness plants? Or am I going crazy and making things up in my head

[narrow marsh]

I think you're doing wonderfully, and you don't need anyone to love your growing understanding of the mysteries for it to be great to you. I've taken a very long time to learn that. We talk to talk! Everybody wins when we get to all share our own growing Understandings. ❤️

[rigid prism]

If there are dark crabs and light crabs and dark krill and (presumably) light krill, are there dark mantas to oppose the light mantas?
Also, do the dark minikrills in fire trial have a counterpart?
What about sky kids? I know that if we get krilled we become “unlit” where basically we have no inner fire left and have to re-light it, but I think of that as a sort of “neutral” state. Are sky kids inherently neutral and just carry a flame, and that’s why there’s no dark counterpart? For instance, in Eden we see a dark child and a light child merge together to become us, which I must assume are our dark and light counterparts? Maybe? And when they’re together they balance each other to become a sort of net zero, with no light or dark, sort of?
On that note, is a skykids’s flame a part of them or something that they hold inside of them that gives them ✨skykid power✨?

Sorry if that’s confusing 😭

[scenic pebble]

well uh
the dark body is just a skeleton given breath by starlight
as to the "neutrality" of skids, well
this speaks for itself
https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/content/v1/5cf9836e9d1c5200018df596/1582059225534-X1ZH0EGPE5V90674E5MU/064_Sky.jpg?format=2500w

[atomic slate]

Do all thatgamecompany games share the same interconnected universe/multiverse like Team Ico and Remedy?

[split fossil]

Is there a theory about the number of statues in the Eye of Eden (63)?

[sour sphinx]

Yes. I think there's supposedly about 63 statues. The lore behind it (that I know of, might be wrong 😁) is that the statues are people that failed to ascend from Eden like we do

[split fossil]

Indeed! I was mostly wondering why 63, and if that specific number meant something based on the lore

[sour sphinx]

We basically freed them after we went through Eden and before being reborn, the spirits of the lost Sky Kids bow in thanks to us for freeing them from the (temporary) eternal prison

[scenic pebble]

it's the max amount of flaps you will be able to get, trust me i had a dream about Sky closing down in 20XX and the last flex of some guy was him saying that it was the max possible amount
||jokes aside i think it's probably just the number they ended up with, i don't see anything deeper in here||

[split fossil]

Hahaha thanks I’ll settle with the idea they just didn’t want us to have 16ac each Eden run

[narrow marsh]

Skykids always have their Flame, we have it even before your character gets your candle in Aviary! And while you make good observations about the figures that appear after death looking like a "dark child" and "light child", I agree that it's hard to make what happens when they combine make sense: because the glowing character that is created when they combine is not a net zero but somehow even stronger Light than before you died!

About "Dark counterparts", I'm not so sure if dark creatures are born into existence for the purpose of being mirror images of light creatures. I think studying the crab and krill can actually help a lot.

• The krill's canon name is "Dark Dragon".
• The developers have told us that the krill are "corrupted", but they don't like saying more about it than that
• Most dark crabs are just crabs but with darkness particles on them
• Krill have those same particles all over their body

Everyone has always had so many theories over this information, but what do you think? 🕯️

[rigid prism]

I agree that perhaps they aren’t dark counterparts to the light creatures, as that really doesn’t make a ton of sense based on what we know.
I’ve heard about krill “corruption” and that it’s intentionally vague, but if dark crabs also have this “corruption” or what we assume to be corruption anyway for the time being(meaning this one theory rn), perhaps we can think about what this “corruption” entails (idk how much this has already been spiraled on by lore chat though)
Here’s all I think I know about dark dragons:

• they are creatures of darkness, meaning they don’t possess an inherent light like mantas (though that begs the question: where do their spotlights come from)
• it’s possible they were once creatures of light and corrupted to become darkness(unconfirmed)
• they hunt sky kids and other creatures of light, though it’s unclear to me whether they eat light, destroy it, or just split it apart (since our winged light just falls on the ground when they attack)
  Speaking of which, the manta from the very first dark dragon guarding the graveyard appears to disappear completely, so it could have eaten that
  begins tangent
  Perhaps, straying into speculative territory here, the winged light is a purer form of light which the dark dragons cannot eat? Mantas don’t really glow, but they do possess light (enough to let them fly indefinitely, though some of that may be their buoyancy).
  Though skykids cannot fly indefinitely, and need a lot of winged light to fly even half as well as a manta, so it could be that winged light is not pure enough for krill’s to eat. It could also be unrelated to the light and more related to the creature type and what they prefer to eat. I’d like to see your thoughts on this.
  ends tangent
• they appeared around the time the Eden explosion happened, though I don’t remember if it was right before, during , or right after, or if we even know that at all. This probably has some significance, though.

[rigid prism]

• I’ve only seen krill’s in polluted areas like wasteland or Eden. This could mean one of two things: a) they are attracted to it, or b) they can’t live without it, though it’s important not to confuse correlation with causation here.
• the only not polluted place I have seen them is treasure reef, though I do know they were kept in cages there. If they were indeed light creatures before, then perhaps they were corrupted while trapped (though from the state of treasure reef now as “not corrupted and not polluted,” that idea seems much less likely). I don’t remember if the krills stay in treasure reef after being freed by the quests, but that may be important to discovering whether they are attracted to/require pollution.
• honourable mention to the king krill, which only appears twice in the entire game, to my memory. From the looks of it, it is a mostly aquatic creature resembling an (outside sky) baleen whale in face and body shape. From comparing it to krills and how each behave, I must deduce that it is not really related to them and is its own species of creature.
  Knowing all this, perhaps we can begin to formulate an idea of what “corruption” is. I would like to hear you thoughts on the matter while I try to make sense of everything I just wrote

It’s also important to note that I’m not entirely certain how different corruption vs. pollution are. I like to think of pollution being outwardly pollution-like (dark water or smog clouds, for instance) or directly caused by people, while corruption is lumped into a general category of “unknown causes” with krill corruption being a more specific term within that category

I’m not sure if this is a theory or a bunch of information about krill, but I hope it helps us create some kind of baseline theory for what we think corruption is.

[solemn cedar]

question; what is the sky world called? just that? is it a planet or what form? i didnt read about that yet

[scenic pebble]

i ain't sure of the exact terminology but it's referred to as a kingdom in game
therefore the unofficial term is the Sy Kingdom

[solemn cedar]

i see! maybe there are other kingdoms then, beside Sky and Sky is the last standing?

[scenic pebble]

maybe other independent realms are/were out there
but now... there's nothing left but ruins, alas, ash is a very good fertilizer so who knows what will grow back again

[narrow marsh]

Great notes! The mention of Abyss content reminds me of all of the concept art we've gotten in relation to krill, either directlyor only in personal theories. 🕯️
#lore-discussion-spoilers message
#lore-discussion-spoilers message
You're making some great points about how WL works when krill attack you; we don't know exactly what it means for krill in terms of what they do or can do with our Light, nor about what it means for WL as a material and topic.

Additionally, and this may or may mot give some people a headache, but certain concept art and developer monologues assert that light creatures are more 'pure' than Descendants, while we've noticed that Descendants (skykids) have a much stronger Flame/Soul compared to both light creatures and Ancestors. Pure and strong being different things here on a Spectrum. Your Light could be pure, but not burn bright, just as you observed with how mantas don't glow.

And in contrast, there's a phrase where the brighter the flame the faster it burns out. Because of current breakthroughs in our speculations, we've been considering darkness substance to actually be the result of light substance becoming too chaotic.
Leading to beautiful concepts where theorists like Maelstrom has proposed that the Eden crystal may be "the strongest candle ever".
#lore-discussion-spoilers message
This current proposed model of Darkness as an "Overload" of Light has been very interesting to work on. 🕯️

[spiral vault]

I think what we see of the Sky world is all there is

[mental thorn]

so i have a question? just generally what is this

[scenic pebble]

guessing it to be the Corrupted King
https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/content/v1/5cf9836e9d1c5200018df596/1582059249504-94GTQYYN84W5OSEDHWCY/085_Sky.jpg?format=750w

[rigid prism]

The more I dive into the lore, the more I realise how everything is connected! Whew! That is great information, let me make certain that I understand it correctly so I can ✨speculate✨

Light creatures have a more pure inner light, which I interpret to mean that there is less darkness(we’ll get to that) in there muddying it up (just like with water or gemstones, less other things = more purity). Descendants (skykids) have a stronger light than light creatures, meaning that it burns brighter/more intense than that of a manta. Jellies are quite interesting, they glow but not as much as a skykid, perhaps that means they have more intense light? Perhaps that is why the current light creatures have not been corrupted by Eden, they could have been the ones who had a pure enough soul not to be corrupted by the outpouring of energy that presumably had a hand in the corruption of other creatures.

On your second point, this is very interesting to speculate on indeed! If darkness is indeed an overload of light, this has quite a lot of major ramifications. For instance, if skykids’ souls/light are less pure than mantas because they contain trace amounts of darkness, that could mean that at least part of our souls burns so bright and strong that it can generate darkness. However, this can’t be all there is to it for a number of reasons.

1. If our souls were constantly creating darkness, even at a tiny rate, we would eventually be consumed by it. As this is not the case, there must be something going on. (Perhaps we could think about what happens at the end of Eden, but that is not directly related as the Eden crystal and our winged light have something to do with that. I can address this later as well)
2. This is more the fundamental question of “what is light as we know it in sky?” If light is energy, and an excess of energy creates darkness, and darkness is a sort of negative energy? like with enough energy you can create antimatter(example), then we could easily be ripped apart from the inside. That doesn’t happen.
3. If darkness is just when light burns out and becomes inert or negative (as this is a new theory it’s hard for me to ascertain which quite yet, but we’ll just call it darkness to be simple for now), then we would simply burn out and be left with the outer shell of a skykid.

I have a few theories as to why this doesn’t happen.

I think the winged light play a critical role in our ability to contain/control/use darkness.

• Collecting winged light might add to our soul of light or create a separate store of “flight” light that our we can burn into darkness. We know that once our flame is out, rain or anything else can start consuming our winged light one by one. But, again, we aren’t constantly losing light, so there must be something else going on here.
• One important thing to note is our ability to consume a certain portion of our light to make us fly higher. I have a theory to connect these: perhaps we have the ability to store, and lock away our darkness. Then, when we need an extra boost of energy, we can combine part of our darkness and our “flight” light together to release a burst of energy to propel us up/forward.
• The winged light issue can also explain how the only time we are “consumed by darkness” and “become an empty shell” is at the end of Eden, when we’ve lost all of our light.

Although my first point does raise a question: if our “flame” is out and we are still able to move as an extinguished skykid, does this mean that we are subsisting completely off of our winged light to keep us alive? And is our flame different from our soul/inner light?

Also, one more thing I’m curious about that I’ve never got an answer to: if we lose our last winged light to rain in forest, what happens? Do we skip to Orbit but get no ac? (Unrelated but still curious)

Note my inability to decide what darkness really is. Is it the absence of light? The opposite of light?
I know that darkness and light will destroy each other if they come into contact, as we can see with dark water, rain, etc, but I don’t see annihilation. Is this perhaps because our “shell” or body protects our light enough that it gets destroyed very slowly?
Dark plants are another thing. We can burn them with a flame, and they will shrink and then pop into light pieces. This could mean that they are impure darkness, and we have to destroy the darkness to get to the light inside 🧐
Tell me if any of my theories are wildly incorrect! I love to learn more about sky and I hope at least some of these are smart :)

[scenic pebble]

have you ever looked at what happens when you stand in dark water?

[rigid prism]

Yes, your light slowly drains up your cape for each wedge

[scenic pebble]

look at what happens to the motes

[rigid prism]

Hmm, are they collecting at our feet or falling off of us?

[scenic pebble]

they're being absorbed into the darkness
i'm not sure if it was just my mind playing tricks but i think the color of the motes changes to dark red

[rigid prism]

Yes, like a dying ember hmmm

[earnest briar]

[Dark plants are another thing. We can burn them with a flame, and they will shrink and then pop into light pieces. This could mean that they are impure darkness, and we have to destroy the darkness to get to the light inside]. I actually have a theory about Dark Plants. Unlike other forms of darkness that are not creatures (the polluted/dark water and red shards), Dark Plants do not actively harm Sky Kids and can even be beneficial through the wax they release, which recharges our cape energy.

There’s a process in the real world called phytoremediation, where given enough time, plants can absorb pollutants from the soil, store it inside themselves, and can even break down those pollutants into a nontoxic form to derive nutrients from them. I believe Dark Plants to follow a similar process; plants react to preexisting darkness pollution (in the case of Wasteland) or the introduction of darkness pollution (shard eruptions) and begin to leech the pollution from the environment and store it within themselves.

Upon absorbing enough darkness, the plants will turn into Dark Plants and begin converting the darkness into a safe, nontoxic form. This can take the form of the wax-Light we gain from burning them, or even living, animate Light in the form of butterflies. Then Sky Kids come along and aid this process by burning the Dark Plants, helping them release that Light back into the ecosystem.

[rigid prism]

Oooh, that’s smart! It does make more sense that the dark plants would be containing the darkness. However, I wonder how there are dark plants that absorb darkness but no light plants that have already absorbed darkness… are they perhaps just the regular grass? But dark plants look like some kind of mushroom or vine type of plant, and grass is a leafy plant.

Maybe the seeds(spores?) stay in the ground and absorb darkness slowly, then grow into plants when they are ready to release the darkness they have collected. That could also explain how colors get into the mix, they could absorb it through the groundwater.

I’m not certain, I’m curious what you think dark plants are before they absorb darkness, according to your theory. It seems pretty cool!

[earnest briar]

Considering we can see Dark Plants pop up around where shards land in the realms despite not usually being there, I think they either come from a preexisting plant that changes/mutates into a Dark Plant as it begins to absorb the pollution, or they are a type of plant specially adapted to handle the presence of darkness pollution. They simply don’t pop up in such large quantities as we see in the presence of a shard because there’s usually not enough concentrated Darkness to trigger such a large scale response.

Interestingly, before the addition of Dye Plants by Season of Radiance, Red and Black Shards were the only places you could see mostly black dark plants (as in, no blue glow) and red dark plants. Almost like the environment is kicking into overdrive trying to respond to this massive, sudden influx of Darkness.

[narrow marsh]

Oh my apologies, but here's that Spectrum concept art by the way. I forgot to include it in what I wanted to show @rigid prism 🕯️

[rigid prism]

Ooooo interesting

[potent gust]

Was kind of wondering if anyone had an awnser to this. I might go looking for myself tomorrow but if I could save myself time that would be nice

[narrow marsh]

I think "containing the darkness" may be misconceptualizing what occurs.

The Light released from burnt plants, whether in the form of wax, butterflies, or both, seems to have been trapped inside the plant.

1. Returning back to the idea that Darkness is supposed to destroy Light: Why did the plant never completely drain all the energy from the Light substance it's captured? If the plant's purpose upon capturing Light was to "consume" it, then there wouldn't even be Light left for us to rescue.

2. And back to the Plants are Light's natural Filters theory, while phytoremediation presents a good analogy to inspire our next steps in current brainstorms, I'm unsure if this is a form Light takes as a conscious action to "contain darkness". If anything, I would think it would happen more as a Reaction. A defensive, insecure Reaction of residual Light in response to coming into contact with Darkness, where it further Calcifies into something that traps. That holds. Holds the darkness. Holds the Light.

My research on that Spectrum graph above has led me to realize that everything in Sky works within a framework of emotions. All entities, all forces, are driven by differnt expressions of emotions. 🕯️

[narrow marsh]

Oh I'm so sorry we missed this! As far as I personally understand it, there are no instances of any Spirit memories where Ancestors intereact with Darkness. The most passive interaction with any entities we commonly associate with Darkness are Ancestors interacting with crabs.
Hope this helps! 🕯️

[sour sphinx]

At the last quest in Shattering, we see all the Elders being blasted away from the Crystal. I've noticed this from someone, if you go to the very top of the Crystal, and look up, you'll see an object flying down towards the crystal. (I cant remember) Some people say that's the King or from him and he had too much corruption in him that effected (or affected because I struggle with the difference 😆) him mentally, emotionally, or physically (probably all of the above) What do you think?

[earnest briar]

I never imagined it to be a conscious action when forming that theory of mine. Just that something harmful is introduced to the realms’s ecosystem, and the environment reacts. Just like nothing tells plants in the real world to open their leaves to receive sunlight, or absorb water and nutrients from the soil. Not even phytoremediation is an intentional process in the terms of requiring active thought and decision making by the plants. They’re simply following the processes that sustain them, just with a bit more complexity.

[narrow marsh]

Absolutely!

[ashen fractal]

Sky still does carry on some of the elements of Journey though, where some of the interactions and meddling of people have been harmful. I always thought of the Sky kids as an intermediary, like with a lot of philosophies where balance is the objective you don't want more or less of a thing. It always struck me that when you are reborn there seem to be two halves of you and that accepting that makes you whole. Ludonarratively that is what I took from it anyway.

Also as someone who worked in an analytical chem lab ages ago, the use of Calcification in that seems to make sense. There is entropy in the world and everything moving to a lower more stable state is technically a natural process of the universe. That does mean we as humans on this planet aren't trying to speed run some of that process. I think that shows in Sky with how what areas contain what kind of things (like the rusty pipes and such of the wastelands) and how forgiving of an environment they are.

[foggy peak]

Hey everybody I started Sky again in 2025 and I'm surprised to see the evolution of the game but I find that there are too many cosmetics and the story of the game has no continuation

[earnest briar]

What exactly do you mean by “the story of the game has no continuation”?

Because that is incorrect. I don’t know when you stopped playing Sky, but there have been many important additions to Sky’s lore and story, and just because it doesn’t get shoved in the player’s face doesn’t mean it does not exist.

We just need to pay attention.

[ashen fractal]

Does anyone know of a youtube with voiced videos on lore? I have found some on the basic lore and the trailers from tgc but not much else. Also I wouls like to note that the trailers themselves contain tons of lore hints. Though like Elden Ring I feel like they only kind of half-commit to some lore which I wish they wouldn't do. It's just a pet peeve of mine.

Also yes I looked at the wiki but the ads and my reading disability make it hard. I also don't know the proper names of things to search. I really hate that most websites are bad with screen readers

(also while I hate monetization I would say it would really help the game Book of Travels, which is another gorgeous very well thought out game about helping life go on in a beautiful place. So I would rather have it then not. I wish there were ways to make it less disruptive but I don't have to click on the shop)

[scenic pebble]

fellow BoT fan spotted
opinion approved

[ashen fractal]

Heck yeah!
Honestly? BoT has much more in depth and specific lore than Sky. I do like that. Sky's lore does help to maintain some dreamlike quality though it seems. Unless this is because I haven't played in a while and I'm forgetting alot about the "Eden Elder" (I forget his name?) and the others and how it was essentially the whole hubris ruined the world kind of thing.

[sour sphinx]

This question might feel random or something but I feel since we're curious about the King and me (probably other people too) are wanting him back, are we dooming ourselves for wanting him back based on what he did in the past?

[obtuse tapir]

I don't have good images but i noticed that when you give light to the statues it gives them little wings, its kind of adorable
Apologies if this doesnt really fit in this channel

[long vessel]

I always thought this was more like a little flame, but Wings would make perfect sense. Did they look like the WL symbol? Did they flutter open and shut like wings?? I'm going to have to pay much closer attention next time I go

[ashen fractal]

I didn't think we "wanted him back" exactly, but I could be wrong. The Eden Elder and king were the same from what I thought? Again could be wrong

[sour sphinx]

Yeah it's possible. I always assume the Eden Elder and the King are the same person

[obtuse tapir]

For if they look like the WL symbol, that's what i thought, but im not entirely sure

I didn't pay attention for if they flutter like wings, as i only noticed these wings when i was looking back at my eden screenshots like these

[narrow marsh]

Additionally, whether they are always on the back, or not really always 🕯️

[narrow marsh]

I had thought they look a lot like how they look when they fall out of you when damaged by Darkness 🕯️

[solemn cedar]

how to get to that elder?

[obtuse tapir]

Exactly what I was thinking!!

[ashen fractal]

The Eden elder? You don't from my understanding someone who knows a little more about the lore souls probably comment on Eden and the king

[scenic pebble]

i think the guy is like gone gone so that would be hard

[solemn cedar]

ohh i see
but was he there before?

[scenic pebble]

that may be what's left of the guy

[scenic pebble]

depends what you mean by "there" and "before"

[solemn cedar]

was he in the game in its earlier stages

[scenic pebble]

nah, i'm pretty sure he wasn't present in any meaningful way like other Elders

[solemn cedar]

oh alr! thanks :D

[ashen fractal]

thank you! I was trying to find that picture

[narrow marsh]

Yes, they were looking into using him as a final boss, but decided it would be better if he was left as dead and mysterious. 🕯️

[ashen fractal]

Did they ever talk about him live?

[narrow marsh]

About him coming into the modern game? Nope! But there are a lot of concept art and in-game + official canon references to him. 🕯️

[long vessel]

Hopefully Discord doesnt deep-fry my picture, but I made an illustration theorizing about the mysterious darkstone disease progression that also includes that old version of the King, if anyone is interested. There's a whole post to accompany it as well: https://www.tumblr.com/skykidsam/780828994408939520/theorized-darkstone-disease-progression?source=share

[ashen fractal]

Sorry no I meant are there any interviews with the staff about the character or ever confirm lore about him.

[spiral vault]

That's indeed what it looks like, but the true motive is a mystery

[spiral vault]

I think the difference between lore and plot is important here. Lore refers to the past, all the things that happened before the game. In this case, new lore has been added.

But the plot of the game has remained unchanged. That's the problem with a multiplayer game such as Sky: the state of the world has mostly remained static.

[spiral vault]

What do you mean dooming?

[ocean saddle]

did you read the message?

[spiral vault]

If you mean before as in the game development: kind of

If you mean before as in the in-universe lore: definitely

[spiral vault]

Well, the Sky king is beyond dead, I'd be more worried about the lore implications of having the king suddenly reappear

If there was a season with expanded king lore, I would like it to feature close friends or allies

[sour sphinx]

Sorry if I'm confusing haha I mean that The King used power from the Crystal and from using so much power, corruption had spread out to the civilians like a virus and a war also broke out, which made everyone die off

[spiral vault]

Then yeah

although in some timeline theories of mine, the war happens beforehand

[sour sphinx]

Huh... I always thought the war came after the corruption plague (that name has a good ring to it) but good to know. I watched or read a theory that war had two sides based on shields the soldiers owned. The Elders side and the Kings side. The Elders side has sun shaped symbols on shields which the Wasteland Elder currently owns and the diamond shaped symbol on shields, which also symbolizes the Kings side

[spiral vault]

Yeah, that makes sense, but the biggest reason for the war being earlier is that it's hard to confidently fight when there's a whole 'corruption plague' going on

[ashen fractal]

eh plagues are often the reason for fight. Also we don't know what sides were what do we? All we know is the Dark Dragons (Krill) were also fighting soldiers in the Wastelands? And that there were two sides?

Also from what I had seen it seemed like the Elders were at least neutral with the King till the Shattering? Unless I am missing a cutscene or lore peice

[spiral vault]

That's likely, though we don't really know

People have made all sorts of theories on who would be pro-king or anti-king, but we only have a 2 second clip of the Vault Elder bowing

[ashen fractal]

yeah I remember that. The mood for that seemed more somber and negative than a positive interaction but that is... more speculation

[frozen glacier]

(Disclaimer: Im very unfamiliar with lore and might be clueless to some things that could be obvious)

Hey yall so I was doing eden and half way i was leaving so i took moment to appreciate the portal realm and noticed these stones/symbols on the door of eden, i understand they represeant the realms but theres 6 realms and only 5 stones, I think we're missing isle of dawn and i was wondering if this was just an honest mistake or a unique detail that could be hinting at something connecting dawn and eden?

[ashen fractal]

I thought the reason Isle of Dawn wasn't featured was because it was the bottom line that opened the door but I could be wrong....
That is interesting though. It might just be the starting area but it is important

[frozen glacier]

idk part of me wonders if theyre connected since dawn is your starting point and eden is your ending point, i couldnt find any similarities tho

[narrow marsh]

The art book tells us that the Child who would become the Ruler of the Sky kingdom was mentored by the Isle Elder! But it also tells us that, eventually, the Child "outgrew the Elder's teaching"... whatever that means. In the Vault, the 2nd floor has a giant table that is theorized to have been a meeting room for the Elders. But there is not a seat for Isle...

This, connected with your observation, might mean something about the Isle Elder... 🕯️

[frozen glacier]

ooooo this isnt even that deep but i got chills around the back of my head reading that idk why, now that you give all this information im defineitly more interested in the isle's lore

I wonder if it was too empty or too underestimated for recognisition around the sky kingdom?

[cobalt palm]

Hey lorechat, some links for deepdiving into the inspiration for the Blue Bird mentioned in the sky blog
Plot summary of the play referenced if anyone needs it
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Blue_Bird_(play)
Script on Gutenberg
https://www.gutenberg.org/files/8606/8606-h/8606-h.htm

[spiral vault]

It seems more like a sequel to Belonging with slight inspirations from the play, but we'll see

[last lion]

This some notes for my sky comic that Im making and I thought it would be interesting to share here to see what ya'all think

[spiral vault]

That looks cool, I kinda wanna see this sky comic when you've finished it

[spiral vault]

There's also this cool illustration showing the effects of darkness, I think this could interest you a lot

[last lion]

Oooo

[last lion]

Also Im still on the scripting stages so it might take me years to publish it 😅

[spark pasture]

Do the Elders have names? I'm still relatively new to sky

[narrow marsh]

They had names in development, and while those names aren't 'canon' anymore you'll hear plenty of fans use them. You can read about the names at the bottom of this lovely pamphlet made by some theorists.
Some of the ideas in there are still speculations rather than concrete facts, but it's nice. 🕯️ https://tinyurl.com/skylore

[lavish plaza]

This was very informative, ty !

[nimble ingot]

oh man, it has been a while since I have seen this brought up in the server.

First off, it is sadly considered hacked content
Second, it is because the model is not normally accessible in the game (if at all since way back then)
third, the reason why it is white and wearing a lightseeker pendant is that the hacker used a spirit as the base to make the model visible.

If you want to know more about this obscure model in the game, you are welcome to dm me.

The shortest answer to that though is that its part of cut content during the development of Sky.

My best guess is a possible prototype for the King fighting in eden as suggested in old concept art.

[ashen fractal]

Wow is there a lore book with art like this? this is amazing.

[nimble ingot]

oh these images?

I am sure there would be in the art of sky book.
Otherwise, these images can be found for free on Tom Zhao's website.
https://www.tomzhao.com/sky1

[ashen fractal]

oh, that is one expensive book but I see why. So gorgeous. I have been trying to listen to the developers talks to better get a grasp on how they meant for the gameplay to follow the lore. I am very curious about how they tie in certain Seasons.

[ashen fractal]

ok some of the art notes from Tom Zhao's page has interesting lore implications even if it can only be speculation and not canon.
Like the use of "Empty Souls" falling here:

[cosmic acorn]

Okay, thinking on Krill anatomy: They must be deaf because they can't hear you no matter how loud you honk, but obviously they can see since they can target and aim at you, though I doubt they have peripheral vision. But they must have some kind of organ to let them feel changes in the air close to them, since they can 'feel' you if you fly above them.

[earnest briar]

Fun fact: the Krill’s horns wiggle as they fly! Not only is it actually kind of cute, I imagine it to be their means of detecting changes/motion in the air around them. Sort of like whiskers.

[ashen fractal]

Ok so as someone who ALSO worked in a marine bio evolution lab in college for workstudy-
fun facts on things like Mantis shrimp: there eyesight is really good, but they are bad at usually seeing the colors that we see (SUPER OVERSIMPLIFYING HERE). And also they have antanea that help them feel changes in pressure (a lot of marine animals do, it's very important in order to survive in that enviroment).

and also some of them dive bomb their prey like the Krill. I mean others just punch them to death with the force of a bullet but hey... to each their own.

Sorry uh also the point of me bringing that up- in a lot of folklore the ocean and oceanic creatures are associated with death/The Otherworld/the Spiritworld (any number of things and translations for either the afterlife or some type of similar parallel).
So a lot of the flying creatures in the world having a sea theme is telling.

[cosmic acorn]

Oooo. That is cute! I like that theory.

[cosmic acorn]

And that is very telling yeah! It's all very interesting. Who knows, maybe krill see fewer or different colors from us.

[ashen fractal]

So a friend of mine and I when we worked in a lab did a side expirament to see who saw what colors as what (because I do art as well but I'm bad at color theory), and we were surprised to find out just what colors we viewed differently. Almost everything, even when in the same lighting, didn't get the same reaction. We also were using slightly more specific items like... we started with simple red-green color blindness things and moved on to colors that were closer to each other on what you would call a color wheel, and what counted as say orange vs yellow to each of us was very different.

People don't realize how just drastically differently your body is built and it's so interesting. Animals that can see other parts of the light spectrum I can't even imagine. The one thing that doesn't match up to me is a Krills relatively narrow feild of view (Mantis shrimp are known for having very movable eyes) so it makes me wonder if they were somehow made that way for a specific purpose or just happened naturally as a result of the darkness and are closer to say... other shrimp species. They also remind me of submarines quite a bit which always scares me.

[oblique garnet]

The poll of the week kinda has some minimal lore about ancient darkness lmao

[ashen fractal]

Oooh wait where?

[oblique garnet]

#polls

I interpreted it as a hint that the ancient darkness always just existed, kind of. Maybe it wasn't meant that way tho idk lol

[ashen fractal]

ok that is such a good line. Also knowing some cosmological history it's always a chicken or egg when it comes to what came first in our universe, so this is new. Might be overanalyzing but it is still a fun line.

[narrow marsh]

Something something intense Void research

[cosmic acorn]

That's very interesting! Thank you for sharing! :D

[spiral vault]

YOOOO

Ngl I have to wonder if the Ancient Darkness has more lore than I thought

[narrow marsh]

It may be important to note that "Krill" is a fan-made name. "Dark Dragon" is the real name of those dark creatures. Additionally, there are the theories that this wasn't how they were originally born as. Those theories might just explain any ineptitudes you're noticing. 🕯️

[ashen fractal]

Oh I know the name is fan made. But their design, the way they move, like there's a reason that that nickname happened. Even if it was unintentional people from all over had long associated the ocean with death and passage.

As for the theories are you talking about them originally being creatures of light? Or war machines like in Journey?

[narrow marsh]

Creatures of light! Some people theorize they are machines though, primarily from the sounds they make. If you'd like to know more about these theories, let us know. 🕯️

[earnest briar]

Their scoliosis ridden bones do be cracking
Like, have you SEEN the way they fold their spines to lock onto Sky Kids? That’s not exactly good or typical for bones to do.

[ashen fractal]

Tell that to my back... when I fly into the ground because idk I will probably always be a noob ^^u
But really all I meant is even if it's unconscious there is a consistent culture shift of the ocean being associated with death/spiritworld. You can also see it in the creatures of light because of the whole themes that light and dark play in the game anyway.
I wasn't trying to exclude the other creatures, I meant they too are based on sea creatures, I just meant it's a good way to evoke a sort of spiritual tie that seems to be in a lot of folklore. My guess is that was intentional? But I don't know.

[ashen fractal]

Also something I noticed, are all the Elder masks similar to at least one other character? I think Forest Elder has the same mask design as the Apologetic lumberjack and I feel like Dawn is also similar to one of the people in his area?

[narrow marsh]

Vice versa! There's one Spirit on every constellation that has what's basically the Elder's mask.

[floral ravine]

were krills before light creatures like mantas?

[ashen fractal]

I don't think that's confirmed? I haven't seen anything on how they exist but it's a theory

[ashen fractal]

I wonder if there's a connection there? Between those specific people. I think it's the Butterly watcher, Apologetic lumberjack, and... one other? I forget I think it was Isle of Dawn's one I am missing

[narrow marsh]

Rejecting Voyager is one a lot of us immediately know offhand, because murals hint that they're connected to the direct lore of The Child. (Dawn Ember / Chosen One)
🕯️

And also, Vault and even Wasteland have their own respective Spirits with Elder-like masks as well. Personally, I would think that these are masks that many people who work under each Elder would or could wear, and thus bear their uniform.

[ashen fractal]

Oh right! I didn't recognize the mask right away. I am trying to find all the cutscenes that were from the game after watching the trailer and reading the wiki. I just find it interesting because the masks normally offer some kind of protection. So I was wondering if those individuals had other ties like working directly with the Elder. Or if it was just a choice to reuse an asset (which I doubt but)... or if those individuals use to be related.

[narrow marsh]

The glowing ones that vets can get are mimics of the Elder's masks, but the ones we get from those Spirits seem to be just made from not-magical-deity-demigod material.

[ashen fractal]

did they name the material? Also yeah I completed the Isle of Dawn Constellation so hopefully in another few runs I will be able to get the Elder mask from there

[scenic pebble]

we ain't sure if they even were before they became krills
there are a few theories i am more or less familiar

1. they were one specific Light Creatures (the funny flying headlamp mule) before
2. they're a Chimera of all it has consumed before
   3.they're created from darkness in the same way as Light creatures are created from Light
   4.they are darkness that has parasited a corpse of a Light Creature
   which is true, which is false, nobody knows and no answers are given as usual

[soft timber]

appears Hewwo

[narrow marsh]

It's just a theory, but here's a list of everything we know or have conceptualized that led to the popular theories you'll hear about. ❤️ 🕯️
#lore-discussion-spoilers message

[narrow marsh]

Hast thou found yon treasures upon the outer wilds beyond thine Lorechat?

[soft timber]

I have!!! OOB buried ship parts!

[wintry cliff]

Does anyone know the Elder’s names? If they have any? If so please let me know

[wintry cliff]

Also who is the prince? I saw somewhere that his name is Alef and he is Resh’s son (Resh being king/eden elder)

[ashen fractal]

OOB?

[soft timber]

Out of Bounds!

[ashen fractal]

Also Alef and Resh as far as I remember were both name for the Eden Elder and were only used in development. I've heard them referred to as the King too but I don't think they have a name

[sour sphinx]

The Eden Elder/King are the same person. I find it confusing for his name. I know 'Resh' is probably used when he's a grown up and 'Alef' is used when he was probably a kid. Do we know why the name changed?

[wintry cliff]

Ok I see

[narrow marsh]

Shareshareshare
Did you post it to Skyblr?

[soft timber]

Oh I haven't! I should find where I put the image!

[rustic arch]

Would you guys say the King was evil? Or was it a “the road to hell was paved with good intentions” kind of thing where everything he did was out of a genuine desire for the betterment of his people… but it just all went wrong?

[sour sphinx]

Honestly, maybe, based on what he did was evil. I'm hoping the King will have some redemption if we meet, but we can't be too sure

[ashen fractal]

From what I have heard other people say who have been here longer than me doesn't sound like he'll ever be in game? That and Alef and Resh were only concept names, never used.

[cosmic acorn]

King?

Also I went to the concert for the first time a few hours ago and it seems to be full of Sky Lore? Or at least a lot of the areas are shown in different/past states.

[mellow marten]

Hey I don't see people talk about Ayin/The Prairie Elder headcanons often, in fact I'm not sure what to make of him the most out of all the others Elders- 🤔

[spiral vault]

It's because resh/alef are only used concept art. The hebrew names are generally not used in the base game.

[spiral vault]

That's a morality question. Uhh... I mean, look at the mural in Eden. It appears that the construction of the Eden Diamond was generally well-liked by the people of Eden...

[cosmic acorn]

It was constructed???
I'm a Sky Lore noob. TwT

[spiral vault]

Unfortunately, there's a lot of reading involved here, but this massive text wall explains everything: #lore-discussion-spoilers message

[minor loom]

Just noticed that in aviary, the paths to valley and wasteland are connected. But no other path is, nor do they curve like that

[spiral vault]

It's referenced in some sources that Valley and Wasteland were once united

https://twitter.com/thatskygame/status/1283925628371099648

[cosmic acorn]

Connected? How?

[spiral vault]

I think they're referring to the portal layout

[cosmic acorn]

Honestly that wasn't that much. Or maybe I was just expecting a lot more.

[spiral vault]

Discord has only a 2000 character limit...

But here's another large summary on Sky lore I made: #lore-discussion-spoilers message

[wintry cliff]

Wow there’s a lot of lore I have to look into T-T I guess I’ll have to re do the shard tasks with my alt acc.

I’m trying to form my own ideas by going directly to the sources, rather than hearing from someone else.

It’s gonna take some work though

[versed blade]

he seems like the chillest dude to me

[narrow marsh]

The lore is meant to be very unclear and unspecific, so that people can have their own interpretations and try to discover the 'Truth' for themself!

1. Here's a pamphlet made some theorists. Some of the ideas in there are still speculations rather than concrete facts, but it's nice. https://tinyurl.com/skylore

2. There are many activities and quests that hint at some major Themes or story beats of Sky. 👇

• 📌 AURORA questline and concert
• 📌 Treasure Reef and Abyss Questline
• Cave in Prairie Peaks
• 📌 Final Shattering memory
• 📌 Season of Prophecy murals
• 📌 Murals in Eden
• 📌 Remembrance Spirit memories
• A specific quest in Season of Performance
  And more!

3. 📌 Definitely see Tom Zhao's art page for some key visual concept art. 📖
   To find it, just look up "tom zhao sky"

4. For the nitty gritty of interviews and concept art, just scroll aaaalll the way up in the pins, here in Lorechat!

5. Visit the SkyFanon wikipedia to find all sorts of great information and speculative articles by theorists. The "Murals" page on the site is a good place to start. 👀

Here's an article on some popular theories, for example.
https://sky-children-of-the-light.fandom.com/wiki/User_blog:Amity206/Sky_Lore_Theories

6. 📌 And lastly, the three trailers for the upcoming animated series Sky: The Two Embers.

Overall, I hope this helps. We're still slowly building a non-biased presentation of all of our resources across the webs, and it's important to let those resources stay where they are; it shows how expansive the lore community's efforts have become! Either way, Happy hunting! 🕯️

[narrow marsh]

Aha! I found a new format to be able to post it again
This works out Void!

In any case, here is my masterlist of most of our most prominent sources of Lore research, just above this message. ☝️

I hope you have some good digging!

[last oasis]

Does this poster from the devs office location in the game exist with the text being readable?
This is from the wiki page and I can't access the location within the game, so maybe someone, who can, was able to take pictures? Is it readable on location?

[river veldt]

the performance quest Act II (help the forgetful storyteller write a story for isle of dawn) has a lot of written lore to it

[mellow marten]

That's the thing- what kind of person is he in depth? Like can you imagine how he could possibly act in the past etc, like. I have trouble putting thoughts of how to perceive his character as a whole

[river veldt]

full story here

[broken dawn]

Guys, so I've noticed recently cos I've been going to wasteland more often, I'm not scared of krills anymore ,lol. Do anyway I've noticed something, so there's a birtex sucking you in and you fall right, and when I was flying at the areas I noticed the pillars and other things, and the place where you go inside and there's one krill waiting and circling, it kinda felt like it was an elder temple and thee were also stone guards, so is it the first temple and tsadi went and took refuge to another place, like idk? 😐 ¯⁠\⁠_⁠(⁠ツ⁠)⁠_⁠/⁠¯

[earnest briar]

You don’t need to redo the shards on an alternate account. You can access the memories in Red Shards just by completing them. Course, after you complete the Shattering quests, it’s not guaranteed the memories will appear in order across different days’s shards, but they are still accessible.

[wintry matrix]

Some spirits also have more or less simmilar hair to elder of their realm

[narrow marsh]

Ah yes it's the 2nd quest? Thank you for reminding me!

[wintry cliff]

Where is the link to this?

[narrow marsh]

I haven't seen this full chart many times... time to annotate 🕯️

[narrow marsh]

The link to which? The "masterlist" I mentioned is just that big message I'd sent just above what you're replying to:
This message 👇
#lore-discussion-spoilers message

[floral ravine]

what is the lore behind the BIG krill?

[river veldt]

we need to talk about this more

this tells us:

1. the birth of skykids and/or light creatures
2. what happened to alef
3. a moth's journey

[wintry matrix]

Why did my message got deleted? I spent some time writing that thing 😭😭😭😭😭

Ok im not gonna write the wall of text again (in case it gets deleted again) but in summary i was talking about how someone mentioned the last shattering quest memory and if you think that this scene/all current elders will be in two embers cuz we already saw lamed and resh in trailer

[wintry matrix]

also i would like to add to this with the mural in treasure reef, it looks like that before it got flooded they used the building that used to stand here to extract light from creatures or something simmilar (atleast to my understanding), once i get to game i cat screenshot which mural i mean

[sour sphinx]

I'm wondering if the Abyss area wasn't flooded before, in the past. Probably a huge tsunami or a flood came by and Treasure Reef came to be. Same with King Krill (big boy krill)

[wintry matrix]

well there are couple of stairs underwater that suggest it wasnt indeed underwater or that the water was much lower before (cuz they have those aquariums you free mantas from at the very bottom)

[soft timber]

Kinda similar to the sub area for the Little Prince's Star Collector, it suggests the water level was also a bit higher than what it is now

[wintry matrix]

also the first area in forest with ships (unless those were flying ships instead)

[narrow marsh]

Absolutely! That's kinda why I note that it's just Abyss in general, because that entire area is just dripping in Lore content.
And concept art for Abyss only furthers this, as we see concept murals where dark creatures are literally depicted being created! 🕯️

[hardy nymph]

Does the symbols here the bell in top of eye of Eden door have meaning?

[long vessel]

No one has been able to decipher a meaning from any of the bells yet. Maybe one day! Maybe you could be the one 🕯️

Edit
If I were to brainstorm from what I'm seeing, though, here's what I notice:

• the dots at the top look like motes of light
• the vertical lines remind me of rain and Forest
• the one that looks like two pillars reminds me of Valley
• the squiggly one looks a bit like the symbol for darkness, but also reminds me of the architecture in Wasteland
• the bottom left one looks a little like a teacher with two students (which reminds me of Vault)

I'm inclined to think the symbols would represent broader ideas rather than having some kind of direct word-for-word translation. I also think it would make sense to use elements or realms, and definitely light, to convey certain meanings. Maybe this one would encapsulate the idea of traveling through all the realms to reach this point. Who knows, though

[wintry matrix]

so i assume people already connected the dots here

[wintry matrix]

the only thing i see i the resemblance of the element symbols but thats a flex

[soft token]

awww im sure these are obvious to lore people but has anyone noticed these cute photos next to Dreams Guide in the clothes shop? Theyre so cute!!!!

[narrow marsh]

She'll always miss home 🥲🕯

[wintry matrix]

There is also photo of you and her daughter on the table she stands by (and nesting guide with forest elder in nesting shop)

I also like to hc that flight guide does the levitating animation while idle not because she is flight guide but because she is heckin small and wants to feel tall like others in the shop 🤣

[cobalt palm]

There are also photos of Prairie Peaks beside the Moments guide, and one of the bell arches from Wind Paths next to the Flight guide

Also it looks like a pair of crystal earrings that may have been a thought.

And for completeness, here's the picture on the table next to Dreams guide

Interestingly there are 2 categories which aren't accounted for in the Aviary shops currently,
First is there is no place to change necklaces, or season pendants
Secondly (though nesting and harmony hall may count as this), nowhere to change prop.

[wintry matrix]

Oh god, thank you for saying there really isnt, I thought im just dumb and blind

[wintry matrix]

Also geologist prop (i think) and some pair of darkstone keychain/earrings

[long vessel]

The other thing I noticed is a whole different category of plant! Maybe it's an oversight () but those pink plants are flat like succulents, not spherical like flowers 👀

Edit:
But it is the exact same shade as the very normal flowers right below, so

[cobalt palm]

I thought they were like the circular light flowers in the grasses of Prairie, but I'll have to take a closer look

You mean the ones in the pot, not the cut flowers on the desk?

[long vessel]

They look super similar and could very well be exactly that, but the way the item looks up close, it's rows of flat, pink, round disks (rather than the puffy ball shape of regular flowers, like the ones on the table or out in the environment)

[wintry matrix]

Im surprised passage guide and rhytm guide have nothing really? Sure rhytm has brother right across the street but passage is kinda just standing in depresso corner lol

But ofc radiance has whole atelier, second floor and basement duh

Radiance: shaman and others’ clothes pattenrs and props

Passage: the floating masks from quests

Rhytm: … the same flowers as those you can find by village theater???? theres literally nothing

Nesting shop: prairie big rock, manta & photo with forest elder + pet rock???

Harmony hall: colliseum?????

I admire people who regually play this game on phone cuz its awful imo lol (i came from switch)

[narrow marsh]

I believe that the 3rd picture shows either the throne room in Vault or the throne room in Eden (which are identical)

Also, while mobile has a much higher learning curve vets end up controlling masterfully and without much effort, with the added benefit of more complicated handling allowing for much more interesting flying tricks. I've come to love it, but as a switch player (these days) I know exactly what you mean 🕯️

[sour sphinx]

I believe I've read that a couple people or so said that us Sky Kids are reincarnations (or related) of the King. It's that, like, a theory or a possibility?

[wintry matrix]

i only saw theory simmilar to that that we are his (or alef) kids because game is called children of the light and on orbit you go... welll... to visit the light

[wintry matrix]

hmm those sus clouds under orbit kinda bother me, wa there map shrine in beta?

or is it hinting two embers season map expansion perhaps? coping

[river veldt]

My favorite way of controlling the game is…
On PC, left hand on controller, right hand on mouse…

This is so cursed, but I’ve found that it works best for me 😅
It’s my DIY switch 2 joy con mouse mode solution.

For those asking “Tristan, why?”:

I find that the mouse and the left analog stick allow me to control the camera and my character smoothly, while the WASD keys don’t have fine control over my character movement, and the right analog stick moves the camera too slowly and uniformly.

So, I frankensteined my own control scheme by mixing controller and mouse (no keyboard!).

[narrow marsh]

Knowing how strange Sky's handling is, that's not really that weird at all!

[narrow marsh]

I wish, but it seems decorative. That particular "area" on the map is so interesting, as it's used as potential evidence towards ghe argument that the Rebirth Gate area in Orbit is a real, physical place 🕯️

[river veldt]

The whole kingdom is built atop the clouds, but orbit is in literal space, far above the clouds.

I believe this design is purely stylistic. After all, the murals (drawn by the ancestors) really love depicting clouds, even if they’re not really necessary.

[wintry matrix]

I once spent like 15 minutes looking around for shrine on first orbit stop on alt account because i had false memory of one being there on right side (facing top of castle) near a pillar💀💀

[river veldt]

In sky beta, you can see the earth from orbit!

It has since been removed, but because the ascension cutscenes are still there, we know that skykids indeed go into outer space after they die.

[wintry matrix]

went on a trip to valley with kamera and noticed there are valley twins on every gate in race

couldnt sadly get closer without getting swooped by wind

[wintry matrix]

huh, i never noticed those blades... are those resh's? they seem to be too "placed on right spot" to be just random weapons laying around

[narrow marsh]

There are shields next to them too! Something something civil war correlation 🕯️

[wintry matrix]

ye ye, i noticed the shields long time ago but never the blades, they are defo atleast ayin size

ok i messed up the names tsadi not ayin but they are both big guys okay

dual wielding spirit/elder sounds dope, i imagine them doing simmilar stuff as dual wielding jedi

[wintry matrix]

i also took couple of shots of eden exploding and yeeting out shards if someone finds it useful

[polar forge]

oooooh gimmegimmegimme

[ashen fractal]

Yes please! I really would love any shots of Eden

[compact spade]

okay so like I assume this has been discussed before but there's a DOUBLE winged light on top of the shattered memory?????

I can't help but think of the Two Embers (Dusk and Dawn Embers), it might be related but idk?

also there's the strange Eden diamond symbol above the shard, whic I'm not sure what it represents (is it the remnant of the Eden Elder? Some kind of device?)

[river veldt]

The double winged lights only counts as one, but it is a reference to either:

1. our rebirth cutscene
2. Dusk Ember and Dawn Ember (who the community believes to be Hopeful Steward and King Resh)

The symbol is the king’s mask! And the thing above would be his body. He’s upside down.

If you look at the beta version of this final shard memory, you can see a fabric attached to the mask! When you think about it, it looks like a cape, and sky kids are known for wearing their capes and masks…

Source: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7RpJY6buu1Q

[river veldt]

1. It is not the pet rock. It is the base for the skykid figurine (nesting ultimate gift)

2. It is the vault’s summit! You can see the pillars in the background, the floating island of the summit, the glowing dark stone diamond similar to the one that powers the elevator, and the 5 elder statues seen in their respective temples

[celest birch]

Yep, that thing´s definitely coming from the peak itself aka the ♦️ and given how it´s still retaining itself, how powerful must these eruptions be to throw shards as far as Daylight Prairie??

Not to mention how is the castle in the sky still there in the first place even if being as fragmented as we see it during the Ascent.

[wintry matrix]

Why is there summit in harmony hall😭 i understand the aurora art there and frantic with performance going all hearts when seeing her but the summit is so random

[river veldt]

remember that the performance crew is doing plays, and so they need backgrounds for their sets!

[wintry matrix]

Valid

[river veldt]

one of the levers in village theater swaps the background of the stage
they do plays that take place in every realm!

[wintry matrix]

anyone wants elder closeups, rebirth animation and some different angle (oob) ascend screenshots?

[civic crow]

Me, please share them 😄

[wintry matrix]

interesting thing is that here, unlike any other location, the elders are tangible

next time i will propably provide prairie elder photos, im at 80% there

[ashen fractal]

Wait are the Valley Elders carrying swords like on the door

[wintry matrix]

no it was more like weird sticks, definitely not the paddles from cutscene or swords

as i said before, i think it is thew same sticks as in old valley cutscene

out of bounds they have their normal paddles (i was trying to zoom on their prosthetic arms, when you get lucky they are on the ground for a while before teleporting back to air)

it also feels little bit like orbit elders and oob elders are entire different model (big elder room seems to have same model as valley oob)

mainly cuz the folds on their arms look different

[sour sphinx]

I saw the video attachment. I guess with so much power that took over him, (my guess) it killed him (my other guess badly injured) and everyone else around him and we came to existence centuries later

[ashen fractal]

Sort of looks like a bunched up shirt or training gear. Their paddles always remind me of Lacrosse

[celest birch]

I like how the Forest Elder is the smallest of them all while everyone says that Prairie Elder is a giant, but DAMN ME if Wasteland one isn´t actual one!

[earnest briar]

I love Isle granpa
I should visit him again soon.

[ashen fractal]

None of the Elders have specific pronouns right? If I am remembering correctly lorewise no one is gendered outside of certain collab events?

[eager burrow]

Yep that sounds right, iirc

[wintry matrix]

they dont but some have gendered look

okay i cant even type that huh

forest elder has woman chest area, is that safe to type?

[sour sphinx]

Honestly I've read that the spirits, including the Elders, are gender less. I always guess the genders by either seeing them by outfits or hairstyles

[wintry matrix]

and vault elder too

[sour sphinx]

I know one twin Valley Elder is a female by hairstyle

[wintry matrix]

valley not vault and yes, valley twins hair names are skykid_hair_eldersis and skykid_hair_elderbro or something like that, i saw screenshot of it

[wintry matrix]

this tbh, like sure, hair and clothes have no gender either but like cmon

for example dreams guide is obviously mother and daughter, i would be very surprised if it was something else

but none of it is canon ofc, only aurora, rose and prince have canon gender iirc

[sour sphinx]

Makes sense. I always assume what gender the spirits have 😆

[wintry matrix]

i saw some people debating if ayin (prairie elder) is masc or fem and some people see stewie as fem too

imo stewie is enby™️ but if they are dusk ember, theres one moment in trailer where their hair is not grown out yet and it looks like pixie cut so i get what those fem headcanons come from (tho they also grunt and sigh in trailer and it sounds boyish so hard to tell)

[atomic sapphire]

What did my boy stewie do

[wintry matrix]

tbh there was time i thought forest elder is dude

[sour sphinx]

That's what I first thought too 🤣

I see it. I'm guessing when the manatee is being held, it's small. I'm guessing it's not fully grown yet

[wintry matrix]

iirc theres some concept art with grown up manatees, lemme find it

damn where it is, i can see how it looked right in front of my eyes but i cant find it anywhere aaa

[ashen fractal]

yeah that is what I meant, in canon none have a gender.

Also clothes are just clothes and any gender can have any body type

for now it is just nice to see canon gender ambiguous characters as integral strong elders. For someone like me it's nice to have that in media...

[wintry matrix]

i found ton of manta concept art but not the manatee one damnit

[polar forge]

who?- oh Steward!

[wintry matrix]

there was concept art like this but with manatees and i cant find it at all now

[wintry matrix]

ok i did found performance concept art and man the right sice guide mask is so beautiful

beta teth reminds me of hollow knight

[wintry matrix]

ok im giving upú trying to find that manatee art but basically they looked simmilar to the "mule" in two embers trailer when adult

maybe one day i will find it again by accident

[spiral vault]

Very interesting that the two different shields have different colors

[rigid prism]

Is this what you’re looking for? Sorry the quality is so… bad. I found it one the sky Facebook page, btw

[wintry matrix]

nope, it was like that manta art i posted aka with dark background and colored, those you posted are beta mantas before they become mantas i believe

[scenic pebble]

is this a moose?
or .... a skoose?

[wintry matrix]

manatoose

[rigid prism]

Moosatee perhaps?

[wintry matrix]

OMG I FOUND IT

[ashen fractal]

the creature design is so good. I hope to one day be this good at art T_T

[wintry matrix]

that cn web has so much light awaits pictures too

[sour sphinx]

When I was doing Abyss and a mural of King Krill (big boy krill what I like to call) I was like "Wait, we're going to deal with that???"
I did hear some theories that Krills used to be Light Creatures. And I wonder if King Krill used to King (or Queen) Manta

[whole stag]

“here's some food for thought: what is wax, and where does it come from? if it's inherently "good", why does it come from dark plants and shards, but also candles and spirits?”

Curiosity & Curtesy of @crisp socket

[crisp socket]

even more-- why do red candles release wax, but white candles don't? what's the significance of using white vs red candles?

[spiral vault]

Wax is just a form of light imo, as it recharges the skykid's light and is used to forge candles.

Dark plants and shards don't have wax inherently, but instead they trap wax almost in a parasite fashion

[versed blade]

agreed, the wax is trapped in the plants and shards

[whole stag]

How can darkness trap light? It’s the absence of light itself. Also OG’s question was about inherently good or evil, so whats the explanation for that?

[crisp socket]

Well, we know that the shattering is a product of the Eden crystal, which in itself is a piece of darkness which has trapped light to an extreme degree. What's kinda confusing is that the eden crystal refuses to decompose into wax, unlike how most dark plants react

[wintry matrix]

I like to think of it like carbon. You can burn coal but not diamond

Coal in this case being darkness plants and diamond being shattering

Same source, different form

[eager burrow]

I mean, at the very beginning of the game (Isle of Dawn) it tells us these red candles are ‘sacred’. Perhaps this sacredness is linked with the ability to hold/produce the wax we collect?

[crisp socket]

"Sacred", as in the same exact way in which a shard might trap wax?
Also-- remember that white candles also exist, but they don't produce wax. I believe those are what are considered "sacred", as they help:

• light up parts of the map previously obscured
• are used as currency with spirits
• used to make communication without pantomime
• always exist at elder shrines
• used to light up murals that depict sacred rituals
  etc.
  So i feel like the actual "sacred" candles are white candles, which is strange:
  we possess a red candle.

...the plot thickens...

[whole stag]

We carry a red candle at all times to light everything. So why don’t our Skid get wax from own red candle? 🤔

[eager burrow]

Thought I was being helpful nvm 🫠

[crisp socket]

No worries! Sky is full of intricacies.
Your comment really got me thinking: red candles exhibit similar behaviors to darkness. What if they were actually made of darkness itself, specifically, "red shard" darkness? You can even color-match both items, and they look relatively similar.

[whole stag]

Maybe light is not the currency but “Heat” is. The intensity of heat from Red candles is higher than that of white candles. Same goes with burning darkness. As darkness could be a byproduct of gasoline which produces high intensity heat upon burning 🤔

[wintry matrix]

Stewie is grabbing yellow candle (iirc) in trailer, what does that one mean were it former sacred turned normal it would be pink according to color theory, not yellow

In the scene with manatee

[narrow marsh]

An easy assumption to make! "Light" is just the name of the substance that are the Soul particles we study. While many theorists with backgrounds in real science have proven that there is a logical rhythm in how light-(waves) are expressed in Sky, we cannot confidently say "Light substance is just lightwaves from real science", nor can we say "Light substance isn't synonymous to real-ife lightwaves"! As there is no way to assert either as the only Truth. Think of the name as a metaphor, rather than a literal titling. The same goes for Darkness as well.

And so to ultimately answer your question in Connection with everybody else's answer, we see that Darkness inherently has a consistent story Thematic of capturing and storing Light substance indefinitely. This phenomenon seems strange at first, but then we observe Darkstone (the blue gems and crystals used to create Ancestor technology) and we find that this Darkstone tech also has a similar trait of absorbing and storing Light within itself. Could it be just a coincidence? Only further Observations will tell. 🕯️

[wintry matrix]

Fun fact when you collect the wax from plant and then go home and back on the map to respawn that flower (so it doesnt glow blue anymore aka does not contain light), it has like oily/gasoline rainbow effect on it just like polluted geyser (dye plants have it too, it is best visible on black plants even before you collect that dye)

So the darkness plants can be “gasoline cacti” jokes aside they always reminded me of flytrap and since we are “moths” it makes even more sense

[narrow marsh]

In general, it's still important to remember that candles in general are sacred, not just white ones— or else red ones wouldn't be everywhere across the entire world! So it was still a good thing to call out

[wintry matrix]

Kudos to the guy who put red candles in krill areas

Physically went to put them there i mean

And the crazy one putting torches is eden and pnr

[muted salmon]

does anyone know the original play for the blue bird quest

[wintry matrix]

original is called blue bird gasp

[plucky locust]

The Blue Bird by Maurice Maeterlinck

[ashen fractal]

So did you know when Sky first came out the red candles in the Isle of Dawn at least were white? I actually started playing in 2019 on a friends ipad. The color has changed since beta. (I also didn't start playing again till this year).
So keep in mind not everything is lore, some things could just be a mechanic too tell you what will give you wax and what won't

[narrow marsh]

Good point! That's definitely proof that white and red candles are 'just' symbolic in their literal differences, and candles are all equally candles. 🕯️

[cobalt palm]

Blue bird intro texts

[wintry matrix]

i wonder why isle elder is not on eden gate

[narrow marsh]

Belonging story

[cobalt palm]

If you watch the gate cutscene part in Isle Temple, they are the base line going up the seam of the door

[cobalt palm]

How boogie kid got their boogie

[hushed steeple]

Does anyone know what those "Easter eggs" (literally) on some dead tree in the Hidden Forest really mean to the game lore?

[wintry matrix]

old quest

it was observe eagle nest daily quest

though i saw some comics about tiny krills hatching from them

[ashen fractal]

Oh wow I did not know in the Shattering of the Crystal memory that the red shards of the crystal actually CHARGE your cape

[narrow marsh]

The art book may just provide a potential answer. 🕯️

[wintry matrix]

i need to get my hands on that book

[narrow marsh]

Evidenceee

[ashen fractal]

But now red shards drain light

[wintry matrix]

but i live in europe, the shipping would cost more than the book itself 😭

[ashen fractal]

I want that book so bad too but the cost is really high here... There seems to be a pdf?

[narrow marsh]

Not exactly, these are all pictures of our real copies, when we post them here. Mine sits high above my desk and I gently pull it down and flip through it as if I were communing with the holy scriptures
We try to be careful about respecting TGC's work with it, especially since they've granted us permission to post from the book whenever we want here. That could very easily be taken away from us.

[ashen fractal]

Oh I meant I thought I saw a pdf on their website when I was looking at the book but I must have been mistaken. Also I am an artist so I get that. I wish there was a better way for creators to protect their work but we just don't have that

[dawn wharf]

CANONEER'S OUTFITS OMGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG

[wintry matrix]

puts on glasses
lights up petroleum lamp
takes sip of tea
"Ah yes, krill hunting methods, illustrated. My favorite chapter."

[wintry matrix]

anxious angler looks prett scary if you saw that one too

[dawn wharf]

wait thats angler??!

[wintry matrix]

looks like it

[dawn wharf]

I thought that was boatswain

i see it now

ah nice

this is making me wanna draw them in these outfits i love the abyss spirits sm

I KNOW SHES SO CUTE!!!!!

[wintry matrix]

if it wasnt for the picture title i would guess it is cannoneer, especially the right one

[dawn wharf]

nah i knew that was abyss guide right away

I'm now headcannoning that boatswain angler and canoneer all abandoned their animal masks as they were further seperated from society

[wintry matrix]

i want the crow mask so bad

[dawn wharf]

real

[wintry matrix]

let me be true crowcore skid, mine is already somewhat creepy gremlin with crab call, this would make it even better

[dawn wharf]

aww i love them!!

maybe one of the rhythm spirits' masks dyed black would work??

[wintry matrix]

none of them is dyeable

[dawn wharf]

oh

: (

there's gotta be some kind of dyable bird mask somewhere

[narrow marsh]

If it's monologues were that simple and direct and wouldn't be... well, the way that I am

Instead, I've come to embrace ambiguity, and as a result am getting way too obsessed with philosophy. (Which I haven't been sharing recently but am still deeply entangled in. Some times it seems pointlessly tedious, but both myself and those around me can see that it's slowly making me a better person. So I can't complain about this Journey. 🕯️

[earnest briar]

We could have had a Krill horn mask…

[wintry matrix]

we do actually

just as hair, not mask

also

are you telling me this is a woman

[ashen fractal]

No reason why they can't be. Looks have no bearing on gender

[earnest briar]

That’s not horns in the way I meant and want, though. That’s more like a headband.

[long vessel]

Current Blue Bird lore notes:

• Act I is titled "The Palace" and takes us to the Citadel (all decked out and decorated, with a feast table at the bottom where all the Citadel spirits, including Warrior of Love, all come together to celebrate)
• The spirit this quest followed is Royal Hairtousle Teen
• The other new titles given to the returning spirits are: Costumed Confetti Cousin, Nostalgic Sparkler Parent, Woodcutting Pleaful Parent, and Divining Wise Grandparent
• The Blue Bird Guide (Grandma) also has a new coughing emote that gets progressively worse, so...

Some things we can glean from this info:

• Somehow Hairtousle Teen is directly tied to the palace and is considered royalty (edit: or considered to be part of the Royal Court) in some way; they also seem familiar and friendly with everyone in Citadel
• The family likely has a lot of wealth, as seen from both the fact that they must have had some close ties to the palace and also the fanciness of their attire
• The father is a woodworker, along with being a friend of the crabs
• The grandfather divines, so he likely had a lot of respect and prestige within Vault - he also could have had direct contact with the King or other members of the royal cabinet
• The illness we see in Grandma may be a natural evolution of symptoms associated with darkstone disease - and if not, we may be seeing a whole new type of sickness

[narrow marsh]

Not confirmed canonically, as Ancestors and skykids don't have distinguised or even possibly any gender. Their notes simply followed the outline of a gender.

[ashen fractal]

My thinking is the Blue Bird is a play. So all these NPCs are just acting in order to try to cheer up the boy. Not that there is a lore tie, but that's just me.

[celest birch]

It is based of a dramatic play. :) Thus now we have all collabs based on a book, an animated short (movie) and a drama play.

[earnest briar]

[The Blue Bird Guide (Grandma) also has a new coughing emote that gets progressively worse, so...]
Welp, there’s my new headcanon for why Boogie Kid is depressed. It’s because Granny is sick.

[ashen fractal]

I mean that seems accurate as far as the reason everyone is trying to cheer him up.

[copper hatch]

maybe they all just dressed up for a play

I hope grandma is all well, we love your buns 🫣

[spiral vault]

I don't think they're acting the coughing though 😆

[sour sphinx]

For creative reasons, I picture The Eden Elder/King to have psychic abilities. Which might be a possibility in lore BUT I don't think he did or not

[teal karma]

yall i have a question. i am writing a story and i think it would help me if i knew all the elders names
so do you guys know?

[narrow marsh]

They had names in development, and while those names aren't 'canon' anymore you'll hear plenty of fans use them. You can read about the names at the bottom of this lovely pamphlet made by some theorists.
Some of the ideas in there are still speculations rather than concrete facts, but it's nice. 🕯️ https://tinyurl.com/skylore

[teal karma]

thank you very much, i understand that they're not canon but it feels better to call them by their concept names

[wintry matrix]

my point was it says female in cannoneer concept art

[wintry matrix]

just like mine past few days 🥹 stupid allergies

[ashen fractal]

I think its that in canon most things are meant to be andrgynous. Some things are labeled as masc or femme for language comveiniance. Some languages do not have standardized gender neutral pronouns. Just like some professions in some languages are gendered, even if the person is not of that gender (think postman, but for instance the language doesn't have a word like "mail carrier").

More for stylistic than specific gender identity description of the character.

[earnest briar]

I’m not even sure if it’s possible for Spirits to suffer things like injuries, diseases, illnesses, etc. since well, they’re dead. Even Spirits who do exhibit signs of being unwell only do so in their memory sequences from when they lived.
So maybe illness is what took Granny when she was still a living Ancestor…

[ashen fractal]

There are stories of nature spirits being ill in folklore but that is usually tied too the land. Also idk the world is magic sooo... anything is possible?

[marble horizon]

There was some Abyss concept art I saw a lil ways up that seemed like it was depicting baby krill hatching from eggs in treasure reef. Since Wasteland and Forest were both light "mining" factories, I wonder if they're connected

waow i did not realize how far back I was in the chat, sorry for pinging on such an old message lol

[wintry matrix]

its fine im still here haha

there seems to be some oob island/ship on treasure reef, wanted to explore but wind barrier wont let me and it is also hard to take photos of it cuz the camera keeps turning away by itself

also some aerial view of the windy area in starlit desert

[marble horizon]

I think thats supposed to be the leviathan, but idk why it would be at the surface. whatever it is, it "shifts" the longer you look at it if you use the camera

[sour sphinx]

I'm curious, what lore or theories are you hoping for in the Two Embers series?

[wintry matrix]

i definitelly wanna see more elder lore cuz we know like nothing

[sour sphinx]

So far we saw the Vault Elder in the Two Embers trailer. I'm kinda wanting the rest of the Elder gang

[long vessel]

Personally, I'm looking forward to...

• finding out more about the structure and politics of the realms pre and post-King
• learning more about the overall timeline and what order events took place in
• getting more info about the biology of the realms and all of the light creatures (and seeing all the shapes and sizes creatures can come in, other than what we're used to in-game)
• seeing the range of culture, clothing, and architecture across the realms (and how they develop over time)
• getting to know and connect with the ancestors on a deeper level by getting a look into their lives
• seeing the progression of technology over time (and hopefully getting a better understanding of the intricacies of darkstone)

...and so much more lol

[wintry matrix]

yes yes and resh too

[sour sphinx]

It looked like Resh wasn't too happy with something. I wonder what

[wintry matrix]

possibly alef as well if it is that kid (dawn ember)

[sour sphinx]

We've seen Alef a few times so far

[wintry matrix]

could be that he got annoyed stewie broke in (as we see in scene before it) or maybe alef refused to cooperate

i will think about it in my dreams, its already 2 am here

[sour sphinx]

Oh, maybe Stewie had done something Resh didn't like and was maybe like, "He (or she) is in the way" or something. Or maybe something bad is coming to the kingdom

Tgc said the Two Embers characters won't have dialogue but will have a narrator. I did notice that the characters have vocals like sighs, grunts, etc

[ashen fractal]

Alef and Resh were both names for the King, so same person

[sour sphinx]

I wonder if it'll explain why he changed his name?

[ashen fractal]

Those names were not meant to be theirs. Though people use them, they were only working names that were given to the character during storyboarding and not technically canon

[sour sphinx]

Yeah 👍🏼 I wonder what name they'll use for canon use

[ashen fractal]

most of the NPCs don't have names so I wouldn't be surprised if none of them had names, more descriptions

[spiral vault]

Probably Dawn Ember? That was used in the promotional material I think

[molten dust]

heavy breathing. I made. A thing. So you know how the Big Map shows shortcuts visually with birds and interconnecting structures. Does. Does that mean that- oh. I just realised.

Okay so originally I was thinking ‘hey maybe shortcut!!’ And then I realised, that the social forest was to the wind paths. I’m very stupid. Ignore me.

had a revelation the moment I typed that.

anyway so the birds are interconnecting to wind paths—

[sour sphinx]

My own headcanon Lore, my Sky Kid was raised by the Vault Elder and didn't tell her she is biologically the Eden Elder/King's daughter < <

[narrow marsh]

You called it! Here's something to help out your listing there:

• Aviary connects to Wind Paths; there's a tunnel to the left of the portal area.
• Forest Social Area connects to wind paths; right before you jump off the ledge at the beginning of Forest, just look towards the clouds on the right and you'll see the official main entrance to the Wind Paths.
• Your marking of the Valley races with #7 might be mistaking the floating platforms shown there for birds.

Otherwise, yep! Wind Paths
I hope we get more tunnrl connections eventually. 🕯️

[narrow marsh]

That father reunion is gonna be rather hectic....

[molten dust]

the valley races was an example of interconnecting structures; as would the jellyfish in forest and the crabs be in wasteland!!

my next question is. and it’s more of a musing. how does big map work in universe. who made Big Map. is it connected to our light. meta???????

[ashen fractal]

Lore-wise there is possible support that all sky kids are from (fragments? parts?) the Eden Elder

[sour sphinx]

Oh gosh yeah 🤣 I'm trying to imagine or think about how he would react to see my Sky Kid

[earnest briar]

we’re always required to light some candles before we can sit at a map shrine we haven’t unlocked. The symbol on the stone also matches the marker that pops up when you call. You know, the one that leads you through the realms and eventually to Eden. It can also display things such as areas where you have uncollected Winged Light and where to look to find a quest with a specific objective (find Colored Light, admiring a sapling, reliving a specific Spirit Memory, etc). So I do believe the map and the Big Important Collective Light of the Sky world are linked in some way.

[molten dust]

The Light (™️)

[narrow marsh]

Because it's in our minds when we meditate at the shrine, I'd say we 'make' it, but that somehow something about the way the Ancestors designed those shrines make them have the map appear in your mind. Unless perhaps they really are Descendant creations?

[spiral vault]

I imagine the Ancestor Spirits created it and used it to navigate around the Sky world.

Just wondering, is 'map shrine' ever used in-game? Or is it just a common fan term like krill?

[wintry matrix]

Alef is a prince tho?

[wintry matrix]

My skid is eldtrich creature who speaks in enchantment table aka just a weirdo

But i like to hc that they and stewie become some “pseudo elders” of aviary village and aviary being somewhat sanctuary for lost spirits and creatures but not everyone knows where it exactly is for safety reasons kinda like Berg/Hidden world in HTTYD

[wintry matrix]

The star wars i am your father scene but opposite, but keep the skid saying I AM YOUR DAUGHTER in super deep and dramatic tone there tho, even better if they are petite chibi

And resh just screaming NOOOUUUUUUU while grabbing on eden crystal or something

[sand dove]

Alef was the name before becoming king from what I know

[ashen fractal]

Those names were only used for the King/Eden Elder before the game was fully created. Though some people here use them to refer to that character. It was in the concept art from the artbook I beleive? He doesn't have a name. Neither do the Elders, all of it was in the concept work.

If you look back in this channel you can see others post about this who have been here longer than me

[nimble ingot]

Daleph, Ayin, Teth, Samekh, Tsadi, Lamed, Alef and Resh are all placeholder names that are not canon.
Fans and theorists can still use them as long as they know what they mean to the lore.

[nimble ingot]

correct.
Concept art that showed their names (keyword: concept)
Which were scrapped.

The elders in the game are simply called "Elder of [realm]" or even "[realm] elder"

[ashen fractal]

The reason those names are interesting is their tie to the Hebrew and origin in proto-semetic and Arabic alphabet and are a part of that language structure called the Semitic abjads. They have significance when you are reading the biblical texts in Hebrew or Quran in Arabic. Because you could kind of read words within words (this is not the best example. While I am a friend of a rabbi who does a lot of work with these kinds of multifaceted language translations I can not read Hebrew or Arabic let alone the older forms of those languages).

But as was said before the names are not canon

[earnest briar]

I don’t know about other people’s reasons for using the names, but I like to use the concept names because it makes the Elders feel a little more like people, instead of some vague, distant figurehead of a realm.

[ashen fractal]

honestly I prefer the titles but I feel like it contributes to the dream like quality for the game for that reason. I don't see any issue using the names.

I only bring this up because it seems like people are ascribing these names to the characters (as if it is still canon) when they do not have names or ascribing them to the wrong people.

I guess I should add that I meant as far as lore and canon go they don't have names (currently)

[wintry matrix]

yes im fully well avare that the names are just concept art stuff, just to this day i thought prince and king are two separate entities, thats what i was trying to tell

and if alef is not the liitle kid then whos that dawn ember then unless there will be some big timeskip in between

[wintry matrix]

this and also it is much faster to type the name than elder of xxx

[ashen fractal]

that's fair, also I think a lot of people's guesses were the King was the dawn ember and Steward was the dusk ember? those are guesses as far as I know

[wintry matrix]

dusk ember looks A LOT like stewie yes

i would be surprised if they were someone else

[olive mirage]

😋

[nimble ingot]

There are a few theories debating that.

The just of them boil down to the following:

• The king and sky prince are the same person (but at different ages)
• The sky prince is the king's successor (two different people)
• The king and the prince are the same person (but the king is the prince's larger form. Or a mech suit/construct)

Since we dont have much to go off for them in the game (the sky prince is all but none existent in the game's evidence), there are plenty of room for speculation on them.

[wintry matrix]

i like the last one, eden king the iron man

built a huge mansion too lol

[nimble ingot]

fallen stars could also refer to the children of the light (the winged lights we collect in the realms)

[wintry matrix]

forwarding this here cuz its something to think about

[nimble ingot]

(also rip the message that got nuked.)

Dont forget to copy and paste your messages folks.
The bot may not be as nice to warn you or give a reason to deleting messages.
Even if the offending word happens to be something as innocent as a bug like the "cucaracha'

[wintry matrix]

nono it was the same message as the last one in bracket, i just accidentally double forwarded it

[sour sphinx]

If the Eden Elder/King was theoretically a fallen star in the past, and we also are fallen stars, are we connected to the King? If I'm wrong or correct, we are pieces of him (probably like a puzzle but different)

[wintry matrix]

both are my messages from other chat room

i just thought it is something to brainstorm about so i posted it here too

[wintry matrix]

there was one stream where they said skids and elders come from same source but we are not related, king could be same example of that (even more if you look at him as elder and not as entity who happens to be king)

[sour sphinx]

I'll have to look into that because I find stuff like that interesting

[sand dove]

Correct me if anything's wrong, but one theory was that the King was basically the first skykid who landed in Isle of Dawn, was found by those spirits and gave them light?? something along those lines and became king then the fall thing happened
All the spirits were dead and then more skykids kept coming but none were able to save the world and kept dying in eden. Their wings/souls?? spread around the world and became wing lights which is why you give the statues in eden wl
The elders lost hope because then those children stopped coming so they fell asleep until we came along

The statues in eden could be the fallen stars

[floral ravine]

how are there light creatures in the part after dying in eden?

[wintry matrix]

they dead too

[floral ravine]

oh

[wintry matrix]

theres even that little manta that follows you around maps, waiting for you at the orbit

[floral ravine]

the one that dies in the wasteland?

[wintry matrix]

circles around between you and the reborn gate

[cobalt palm]

New mask glyphs from grandpa in the Blue Bird season
1st picture from grandpa spirit
2nd grandpa mask on myself
3rd vault spirit mask
4th vault mask on myself
5th vault elder mask in The Light

There are certainly similar glyphs and symbols, and they're not direct copies of any one line, though most lines end in a diamond shape, and share a lot of characters between them

[wintry matrix]

M U M

vault elder skids mother confirmed /j

jokes aside i think those can be alternations of the symbols from bells

[cobalt palm]

MUH

[mild valve]

Season of belonging and season of bluebird. A story about a sky family. Chapter 2 started now. Nice lore.

[wintry matrix]

wdym chapter 2 started now, act 2 starts in 13 days

[cobalt palm]

Grandma : there can be only one

[mild valve]

I mean the season as a story itself.

[wintry matrix]

i dont understand sorry

[cobalt palm]

Season of belonging, part 2

[mild valve]

Season of belonging is chapter 1.. Season of bluebird is chapter 2

[wintry matrix]

oh

[wintry matrix]

hmm how about comparing (except elder) those symbols to some of hebrew alphabeth? some symbols have simmilar shape

and elders also have hebrew names in concept art

[narrow marsh]

Did the sister and brother get older? Or is the size scaling in this comparison just inaccurate?

[nimble ingot]

why is this giving meta parody vibes.
(sarcasm mode enabled)

Introducing! confetti cousin as the masked musketeer, tousle teen as the musical prince, pleaful parent as the fisherman dad/woodsman, sparkler parent as the prima dona, wise grandpa as ... old sky conspiracy theorist?
And grandma as themselves!!

boogie kid sadly did not seem to make the cut but can be seen in the promotional trailer. Guess they have to stay behind on the isle of Dawn. The realm where birds is a major feature...

(yes, this is satire. Also, yes, there is a notable sprinkle of salt in it. The season looks great. this is just satire. nothing more)

[mild valve]

I scale it bit smaller because they were young. 😅

[earnest briar]

Don’t mind me, just finally took a look at the Days of Nature post in #news and

THE BOBBIT HATH RETURNETH

[wintry matrix]

ok as much im anti ai i tried to ask chat gpt about the elder one and (it is funny it mentioned journey)

the second point can be the decipher key

[mild valve]

Boggie kid ist the sad kid in blue bird season.

[nimble ingot]

I take that is from the Blue Bird story.
At least there is that in the game for players/theorists to look into.

[cobalt palm]

The first character could be similar to Tet (T)
Then the M like character I'm not sure,
Square P like maybe Qof (Q)
K I don't really see a similar character
Reverse P (q) maybe Daleth or Resh
A/triangle I don't see a similar character
Square could be Samech (S)
Diamond could be punctuation?

[earnest briar]

It’s interesting that we seem to see it floating in relatively deep water, though. The Prairie Peaks Bobbit had burrowing behavior. It would hide in the riverbed and patrol that path, occasionally poking its antennae out to sense any nearby Skids. This one seems like it might actually swim around like Krills.

[cobalt palm]

I mean parody, they could be playing characters in a production, the area does look a bit like a theatrical "stage" in the void

[sour sphinx]

I'm curious if you can get to the Blue Bird Season area through the Vault?

[nimble ingot]

Every past collab season was set up like that.
The moomins season does not have any other alternate means to access it.
One could also make the same point with the little prince season since the tunnel to the area was replaced by the collab room.

[wintry matrix]

blue bird is not collab, it is adaptation

[nimble ingot]

Then I take it that Aurora was only a guest singer?

Blue bird is a book written by a third party that Sky included in their season like any other collaboration season.
Little Prince, Aurora, 9 coloured Deer, Moomins....

May I ask what about the Blue Bird season implies is not a collab?

[wintry matrix]

it is adaptation.

[wintry matrix]

okay, the gpt might be ontot something but it is above my current mental capacity

keeps insisting those symbols could be mayan glyphs, hieroglyphs or runic alphabet flipped to various directions

and for vault elder mask the same + abstract version of katakana/hiragana

[winged raft]

What if

What if Sky is a chunk of the Earth broken into pieces which explains the abnormal activity of gravity in the trials

[narrow marsh]

Oh wow, where would the actual earth be then?
...Journey?

[winged raft]

Most probably Journey, yeah. After an apocalypse due to a war between magic and machine. Then all of the magic went to Sky realm

[nimble ingot]

an adaption implies taking the original source and transferring its content from one form to another.

The sky season is " inspired by Maurice Maeterlinck’s timeless play."
~ https://www.thatskygame.com/news/chasing-the-blue-bird-a-new-season-in-sky/

The original story did not take place in the realms of Sky, nor include skykids. It is not an adaption.
It can be more like an inspiration or influence.

The reason why I said collab. Because of the trend TGC devs had running with a season that includes a third party source.
The little prince, Aurora, nine coloured deer and Moomins were all collaborations.
This season may not be a collaboration as with these other seasons. It is though not an adaption because it does not stay true the original form of the Blue Bird play. Naturally because it includes ancestor spirit playing the role of some of the characters. Or more like game taking inspiration from the play and intergrating its story to the world of sky.

[earnest briar]

The reason it’s not a collaboration is because The Blue Bird, both the original story and the play, are old enough to have entered the public domain. There’s no need for TGC to negotiate contracts and IP usage and whatnot with whoever currently holds the rights to said IP, because at this point it falls under fair use, and as such, it’s an adaptation instead of a collaboration.

[nimble ingot]

Fine.
So it is not a collaboration.

Calling it an adaption is like saying the Lion King is an adaption of Hamlet.

[wintry matrix]

thank you for explaining it to them further, my brain is currently fried from allergy flareup and i dont have mental capacity for that 🙃

[wintry matrix]

because it is adaptation of hamlet

[earnest briar]

It is, though. Just because Disney doesn’t go around loudly proclaiming it to be so doesn’t mean that it is not, in some way, an adaptation of that story.

[nimble ingot]

Bruh.
How so?

Because the little prince season is not an adaption just becuase it has the Little Prince himself in the season along with spirits based on the characters of the book.

The Blue Bird season has the supposed blue bird while the spirits from season of Belonging are (as far as I understand it) dress up as the characters of the play.

How would it qualify as an adaption?

[nimble ingot]

That sadly does not answer the question, nor help explain the point.

Feel free to ignore if you dont want to take part in a debate.

[wintry matrix]

it does answer your question actually

[nimble ingot]

(asks about how blue bird is an adaption)
(gets a screenshot of a copyright on little prince instead)

And no ellaboration beyond that?

[wintry matrix]

read what enzhale wrote again

[nimble ingot]

I have and responded, the question directed to you though....

Look if the convo is going in circles. Then there is not point in having the conversation at all.

[wintry matrix]

you cant make adaptation of something that has copyright applied on it... for example alice, tgc used the original story which is public domain, if they used disney one, they would be in big trouble

blue bird is public domain hence it was made as adaptation and not collab, if moomins were public domain or prince was, tgc would make their own version of the story based on those stories instead of collabing with the copyright owner to create something

you are the one going in circles here, enzhale explained it to you quite nicely

also i think this convo you are having here is going bit offtopic for this channel

[nimble ingot]

Technically, you can as long as you are allowed to do so.
Copyrights are there to protect IPs, that does not make it impossible for people to make an adaption of something.
Especially when the people making the adaption owns or have permission to use the IP.

That however is regardless of the point of the first question of an adaption.

Here is something to compare.
The Tomb Raider IP has been adapted from video games to film.
That is an adaption.
If one were to take a game called "Pitfall Harry" and a call it an adaption of the Indiana Jones film. Then one would dead wrong because the characters are different, the setting is different. Even though the core idea of an adventurer/archaeologist going on an adventure in the wild is what they have in common.

Back to the Sky season of the Little Bird.
The original play does not have flying mantas, or even ancestors spirits.
Just because the characters from Sky (season of Belonging) are dressed up as the characters from the play. That does not make it an adaption.
If anything, it is TGC taking inspiration.

Enzhale kindly explained that it is not a collab. And that is what I understood.
Your statement of it being an adaption, and stubbornly sticking to it while ignoring the explanation saying otherwise is what I dont get.

[earnest briar]

In the absolute simplest terms I can think of specifically regarding TGC using outside works:
copyrighted = collab with IP holder
Public domain = fair use adaptation, no IP holder to negotiate with

[earnest briar]

Listen, Avian, if you want a be all end all answer on whether The Blue Bird season is an adaptation or not, personally I would just go and check what TGC has officially said about it. They made the Season, if they say it’s an adaptation, it’s an adaptation. If they call it something else, then it’s that something else.

[nimble ingot]

Feel free to provide the qoute.

I'd rather run Eden than go in circles with a stranger.

[wintry matrix]

just ignore them at this point, they smell like ragebait honestly

[narrow marsh]

Raider doesn't 'ragebait'. But yes, it's okay to agree to disagree.

@spiral vault Oh by the way, I found out that it is indeed concretely called "map shrine" by the devs! Feel free to dm me about how I found out. 🕯️

[wintry matrix]

still this whole conversation was bit offtopic for lore channel

should be in #seasons-events-chat imo

tommorow i will look more into those vault spirits tablets, head foggy today

im no expert at paleography but i have good pattern recognition

[nimble ingot]

The lore channel is about the lore.

That can include meta.
Talking about the seasons themselves have been in this channel for years.
Besides, I would not be shocked that when someone were to ask if this season is an adaption. They would get directed to this channel in any case.

[earnest briar]

The bitly page for the Blue Bird’s announcement says “inspired”. Admittedly that is very vague, and was the only part of the page mentioning something like that, so really, unless there’s any other official stuff from TGC mentioning it, I think it could probably end up going multiple ways.

[wintry matrix]

oh enzhale i hope the time is in pm and you are not arguing with someone at 5 am

[earnest briar]

Honestly, if TGC themselves considered something a collaboration, I feel like they would specifically call attention to it. Like the Cinnamoroll cafe opening, or AURORA.

[pastel brook]

When the last tree in Hidden Forest has fallen and the rivers in Golden Wasteland are poisoned, you cannot eat darkstone oh no

[nimble ingot]

inspired, yes.
which I did say (quoted even).

Not adapted.

And not collaborated either, so that is something I recognise now.

[wintry matrix]

like few days ago when i relived lumberjacks memory

[spiral vault]

I honestly think blue bird could be realistically considered a collab, but let's shift the focus

I like how the first quest is kind of a satire of the Sky community: money, wealth, candles, wax, they're re all fickle and won't cause happiness

[narrow marsh]

That's what I love about the thought put into which collabs: they're always meant to reinforce Sky's crucial Themes. ❤️ 🕯️

[nimble ingot]

Interesting.
I'll check it out later.

The satire is a double edged statement if it is indeed a comment on the sky community. Since the game's main grind is candles. And with the candles are a ton of cosmetics.
With the events showcasing more IAPs.
The community is not the only vane party in that regard.

[lone vector]

i know this is a very old question but i was talking w some friends who just started sky and they made me wonder this even though ive been playing for 5 years or so;
doesnt vault seem really out of place? i dont believe we see the cosmic manta anywhere else and the architecture just seems.. different. i initially thought it was meant to be archival but a lot of history can be found outside of it so im unsure of that now

i know some of the seasons are very lore heavy and also very recent but im interested in the lore of the base game a LOT
still not over how abyss had weapons in it though i gotta replay it

[spiral vault]

Vault seems to be embedded within the Eden mountain itself

If you want a lore summary, dm me and I can send some lore videos made by a friend

[narrow marsh]

You'd be very surprised just how much lore there is in Sky.
The lore is meant to be very unclear and unspecific, so that people can have their own interpretations and try to discover the 'Truth' for themself! However, we know quite a lot from what context clues we've dug up and studied.

Here's a full essay on the king by the fanatic Nekovo.
#lore-discussion-spoilers message
And if that's too long here's a good simple summary of Sky by Void of Shattering.
#lore-discussion-spoilers message

And to answer specifically about the Vault of Knowledge, you can read about what the developers wanted that realm to mean in this twitter blog by TGC:
https://x.com/thatskygame/status/1284645576881999872

Hope this helps! 🕯️

[wintry matrix]

Theres cosmic manta flying around starlit desert but that also technically vault

[wintry matrix]

From the two embers trailer it seems to be part of the “eden building” yeah. Kinda like how you have the main castle (eden) and then the surrounding buildings (vault) protected by tall walls irl

[wide orbit]

Can anyone please explain what these pillars were for? They look like structures for defending the wall or supporting tower-like buildings(watchtowers or anything else), and the top seems too plain to be a bridge

[sand dove]

Probably just part of a wall

[sand dove]

I saw a theory about how mantas were turned into krill and used as weapons (evidence in abyss season) and the cosmic mantas could be part of the transition phase!! Or based on the cosmic manta call spirit's name memory whisperer the mantas could be a sort of replica of the real ones

[sour sphinx]

I read part of that theory that the Mantas were used to become dark creatures, Krills included. And now come to think of it, the King Krill used to be the Elder Manta

[sand dove]

imagine if all the sanctuary mantas turned into krills

[sour sphinx]

Then Sanctuary would be a little chaotic like Eye of Eden. And a little like Wasteland

Now I'm trying to picture King Krill roaming Sanctuary Islands

[bright panther]

guys what the freak is a king krill..

[quasi phoenix]

its like a big whale with many red eyes

search it maybe<3

[bright panther]

oh like the big fat wriggly worm thing?

[quasi phoenix]

kinda wait ima search it up for yall

[SPOILER] Taking a closer look at king krill : r/SkyGame
https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=&view=detailv2&id=DFC30203FE0D01A766914E49EAF5F6E35B1F5BD4&ccid=BbbhxzMJ&iss=fav&FORM=SVIM01&idpview=singleimage&mediaurl=https%253a%252f%252fpreview.redd.it%252fetufaw098ph81.jpg%253fwidth%253d1500%2526format%253dpjpg%2526auto%253dwebp%2526s%253d04d221a32ee4cf2d7f671bd81cd0fe18dafe6435&expw=1500&exph=900&thid=OIP.BbbhxzMJZgaoBmpPFRnM_QHaEc
www.reddit.com
this ling will take u to king krill photos!

[wintry matrix]

theres one manta skeleton in vault (possible our little friend who sacrificed for us to the krill) where when you use REGUAL manta call, little cosmic manta spawns so I assume they are like ghosts and krills are empty husks of them, so soul and body separated

[wintry matrix]

you can re enter the abyss to take look at him yourself

[bright panther]

oohh that one

[sand dove]

ohh good point

[sour sphinx]

Since Maybe Krills were made as weapons, were they used on the King's side (diamond shaped symbols on shields) and the Elders side (sun shaped symbols on shields) was forced to fight back?

[wintry matrix]

i wonder what i so special about wind paths that it makes skid supercharged with light and even on some other maps i noticed we get charge not only from wax and light creatures but also wind, namely in birds nest and citadel

[spiral vault]

Maybe just proximity to other light creatures?

[narrow marsh]

I think there's some correlation there as well; each of the three areas in mind (Wind Paths, Sanctuary, that one place in Valley) both have a highly sizable amount of light creatures.

"But this other place has high creature population yet no Light in the wi-"

This is why correlation is the word used here. There may be unknown factors we are aware of, but light creatures are at least an observable feature. 🕯️

[sour sphinx]

I've pretty much memorized where each wind path leads. I'm curious how the Wind Paths originally came to be?

[wintry matrix]

but we glow bright only on wind path "highway" (oops i forgot to press enter lol)

[wintry matrix]

theres lot of manta on ice rink and no charge but you get charge in fly race

[nimble ingot]

Skykids typically glow a bit when they are charged.
The more energy they absorb, the more they glow.

This may imply during the eden ascend that skykids are supercharged with light.

[wintry matrix]

sanctuary doesnt give charge (or i didnt notice) birds nest does

[nimble ingot]

-_-
what's your problem, dude?

[wintry matrix]

that wasnt the point of this topic

[wintry matrix]

theres also pretty windy in birds nest, one stream goes froim bottom up and the other towards sanctuary islands

but it cant be wind alone cuz eden is even more windy than wind paths and memorial area in starlit desert as well and neither of them give charge

[narrow marsh]

Yes, I addressed this kind of comment It's less about direct causation, and more about that some things have some sort of relation. It's about Themes, and context clues. In order to reach into the deeper subtexts of Sky being able to think about these subtleties are really helpful even if it's difficult to conceptualize sometimes. 🕯️

[wintry matrix]

the only thing i can think of is that there might be lot of cloud particles flying around (we get charged from them after all) and thats what is giving us the passive charge

and wind paths is basically all clouds and the "highway" goes through clouds as well

but then again, how do clouds give us charge? clouds by default are not made of light

[narrow marsh]

Oh, you're correct, I may be misremembering. So that leaves the Orreries in Valley and the Wind Paths. Is there anywhere else we could be missing, gang? 🕯️

[wintry matrix]

and i dont think its the warmth either (as ice cold water in water trial washes our light in instant and try to find warm wind in valley

[narrow marsh]

To be fair, that's stormwind rather than airflows. Additionally, when these charging effects are present, you'll notice you can fly upwards by just tilting upwards, hinting at the presence and significance of an updraft. Perhaps that might be part of what we're looking for?

[nimble ingot]

I can't find the actual source, though vaguely recall mention of the clouds reflecting light in some way. And it was the reason why skykids get energy from them.
Sort of like how in real life clouds have ice crystals or water droplets that can scatter light.

[narrow marsh]

To be fair the Orrery area does seem to give warmer vibes. (Emotionally, not literally.) Due to the mysterious nature of the Orreries themselves (the golden rings) people often theorize that they affect the local area around them somehow, the ideas being in different ways. It's also at one of the highest points in Valley, with the sun more openly upon it. Who knows? 🕯️

[narrow marsh]

I do remember Tanabe's livestream where he described early concepts of the soul cycle as being "soul particles moving through the clouds, creating refractions where memories of different lives would be [projected]" (highly paraphrased)

Is this what you're thinking of? 🕯️

[wintry matrix]

thats kinda creepy ngl

just the thought of milions of tiny ghosts giving you a lift

[nimble ingot]

Maybe.
It was from a long time ago for sure.

Honestly, the logic of sky is a bit odd seeing how some energy sources apply while others do not. And what makes this inconsistency worse to apply to the lore is when comparing these sources.
It is a case where not all ingame interactions have to apply to the lore. And not all lore factors apply in the game sadly.

[nimble ingot]

more like the scattering remnants of energy as it transforms.

Like water, oh wait. I think that was the link.
Water.

Water from the ocean evaporating in to the sky, forming clouds, and the rain coming back down.
The water cycle was a source of inspiration for the cycle of light in the Sky realms.

Where the spirits of sky rise up to the sky (aka the pilgrimage to the mountain peak), and then ascending through the clouds and then coming back down to start the cycle again.

The caveat here is that the water is being transformed along the journey. The energy of the Light from the spirits are transformed.

Therefore, the light of the spirits are what may be in the clouds. And may be what gives the skykids energy.
Granted, this logic does not work with the ocean. But the focus is on the light energy forming in the water (aka the fish), then evolving with the light creatures in the air, and eventually reaching Orbit. Where it falls back down to the waters in the realms to start a new cycle.

[narrow marsh]

My research has proven to be of a very different opinion. I have studied a lot of the older sagas of Lorechat culture, and while I understand that >Contradiction has been a very popular and understandable accusation to be sentimental of, I find that us as we are now are closer and closer to seeing things as they are, rather than the personal perceptions they earlier have allowed theorists to self-fulfill as valid. I know that's unfair to older veteran theorists though. As I haven't had to struggle through all the inconsistent information and constant holes and gaps, I unfortunately can only imagine the struggle, and empathize. You all have worked so hard. I think it would help the mindset a lot to understand that none of it has ever gone to waste. We needed every opinion in order for this to be Lorechat, for the community to have Experienced this as a collective.

No Love is ever wasted, my friend. ❤️ 🕯️

[wintry matrix]

chill water kill your light

[narrow marsh]

Yes!!! (Btw)
The water cycle is exactly the point. We need to understand everything as

• Transformative
• Compository (a collective made of units)

But this does not work with the ocean.
Ah, but I personally believe we have long since been able to visit the 'ocean' of Light. 🕯️

[nimble ingot]

Learning about the lore back then compared to learning about the lore today are entirely different journeys.
Much like the parallel of how skykids of older season arrived on a quiet little island compared to skykids of today arriving in aviary.

A notable downside of having older theories are the personal biases. Or even a case of holding on to what an old theory outlined despite it becoming outdated in the lore of sky.

The lore is open to interpretation, though it is still open to debate on what one can determine is closer to being canon(ish) and what is fanon.

Many modern theories have lend some of its research from older theories, and there were cases where a new theory develops on its own and it overwrites older theories. As new seasons are released in the game, there is new lore to be learned from it (although not all seasons are made equal and may not bring much of value to the lore).

One comforting thought is how a community can come together and talk about the lore.
The channel has seen its fair share of arguments and fights. But that at least proves that there are folks here who are interested in the lore.

[nimble ingot]

Surprisingly enough, there has been a time where us skykids were never able to dive underwater.

Season of Abyss was the season where skykids first gained the ability to dive underwater.

Personally, I thought that the devs would have moths learn how to dive by completing that season. But instead retconned the mechanic into the game where all skykids automatically know how to dive underwater.
It would have been a nice character development opportunity. Where skykids can learn new abilities through progressing in the game.
But instead of that, it was given to the player from the start without any need to earn that skill.

[wintry matrix]

not many moths even notice the boat to treasure reef to be honest...

[nimble ingot]

It could have been in the crabfield (shipwreck) area at some point during that season's development.

Also, weirdly enough, it is one of the season areas that does not have a windpath leading to it.
Perhaps it has to do with gameplay balancing where only one season area per realm gets a windpath.

[wintry matrix]

abyss guide would need to be made into shop and be part of season of revival quetline for moths to even find her if the diving mechanic was limited to unlock after abyss and there isnt really any pssible shop she could run (as we dont have fishing or anything like that in sky)

because there is wind path leading to ark instead

which imo comes more handy than abyss cuz it is quite long fly to that boat

[nimble ingot]

In season of revival's final cutscene/epilogue. The abyss guide is seen alongside the other season guides for some reason.

I assume that the devs still intend for players to explore the realms and find these areas without the game spoon-feeding the info to them.
Season of Revival has been a conflicted season because veterans had less to do with completing quests while moths were essentially made to complete 5 other season's worth of quests to complete Revival.

[wintry matrix]

she just came for food, lets be honest lol

"no one sent me party invitation but i will arrive anyway"

[narrow marsh]

Yes, I've actually heard quite a lot about it. There are undoubtedly painful retcons of little things that matter to us that just don't matter to everyone; and this example is just the one that we know about! To think of how many potential features could have greatly developed and characterized Sky's world and yet were archived due to "difficulties" and engine restrictions is enough to give us a headache the world over.

But thinking on it further, I can at least acknowledge that the developers are at the mercy and whim of tech constraints and investor margins that pull and tug them in every which way behind the scenes.
From a pointlessly philosphical outlook (as usual), I see this as the Nature of things. The inevitability of obstacles taking their place in TGC's (and as a result our's as well) course.

From a scientific point of view (and arguably from a religious and spiritual view as well);
Staring into the face of anomalous adversity, and screaming out into the void that surrounds you and this antagonistic-feeling Unknown is not materially productive.
"WHY???
IT JUST DOESN'T MAKE SENSE!!!!!!!!!"
You may be able to voice your concerns, if only to yourself, but the creature before you will not hear you out. Mother Nature will not change its ways simply because it inconveniences us.

We can question it. We can be upset. But from where we stand, if we want to Love and enjoy this process, this Experience, and make Progress, we have to be able to let go of Control and just keep moving. It'll all work itself out in the end. I don't think it's unfair for me to have faith in that. 🕯️

[wintry matrix]

finally catch the moment as a proof - the little manta friend indeed finds you first in prairie, curiously circles around you whole time you burn the towers

you have to burn the upper plants first to see it cuz after activating the tower he moves to another

[pastel wraith]

In terms of lore and the game, what actually are the Winged Lights?

[narrow marsh]

There's an entire mystery behind that question! Here's a list of multiple names that we have heard them be called by; it may just give some vital hints towards what they truly are 🕯️
#lore-discussion-spoilers message

[pastel wraith]

Oh thanks! Where's the list?

[narrow marsh]

Right there, my apologies

[hushed steeple]

Lorechat. Whats bluebird based off of?

[plucky locust]

A play, in the public domain, also called The Blue Bird

[mystic tinsel]

i like this because when we have to collect purple light we go to vault , grenn light in parie , red in wasteland .... i'm not sure where am getting at but i like your theory

[spiral vault]

Yeah, it seems the lights form in the most 'natural' places for their element

[minor loom]

If it’s a real life thing, then shouldn’t it be in the vault room? Does this imply that it’s at least adjacent to lore?

[narrow marsh]

I hope that Caster is doing well in whatever hyperfixation they've moved on to. It's so fascinating watching Change both in real time and through Lorechat's entire archived history. 🕯️

[sour sphinx]

Do we have any theories about Sky's timeline in the Two Embers? I can't remember who but they said the Dawn Child (the boy probably) journey is the beginning of the journey, the Dusk Child (the girl probably or the Hopeful Stewart) is the main story, and ours is the sequel

[long vessel]

That more or less sums up what I would also think. I imagine it would be something like...

• brief intro to the world before the Prince is born
• Prince is born, we see their progression up until they become King (aligns with first season associated with the animation)
• switch to Dusk Ember POV (King already in power & darkstone everywhere; this kicks off the second season)
• watch Dusk Ember's progression, watch tension build, deal with the main catastrophe (Shattering)
• see post-apocalyptic world, hopefully see Stewie & co building Aviary
• either end there or with another timeskip to peak at modern day with skykids all flying around and doing normal skykid things

With this progression, this also leaves room for tension within the first season/half of the animation. We'll probably see some of the Prince's little hiccups growing up as The Chosen One (and how they discover that to begin with), as well as the Trials (which could be the big tension point for this season), and maybe some more hiccups leading up to their coronation and as they are crowned King and start dealing with the growing pains of adjusting to their new role

I've also been thinking about how they'll achieve all this with no dialogue outside of some narration. I'm really, really fascinated with what they'll do there. Like, just think about basic conversation like this real quick... how would you animate this with no words to convey the meaning of exchanging theories? Could you even explain, in that format, that you're having a conversation about the lore of a fictional world?

Details like that are maybe a little too intricate for the format - they will have to also rely heavily on the music, the camera angles, lighting, zoom, dramatic cuts, murals and different pictures (like how we see some stone tablets with painted illustrations on them in the TTE sneak peak from last year), and all kinds of different visual elements to help clue us in on different details. It may very well be the kind of thing you could watch a dozen times and notice new things every time

[narrow marsh]

I've been thinking a lot about how Lorechat could be illustrated as a 'thing' going on within the 'canon' world of Sky. After all, we are the skykids, and these Descendants are Us. Everything we do and talk about is effectively as much extension of our skykids as much as they are extensions of Us.
The science, the philosophy, the research investigations, the field observations. The discussions, the debates, the heated arguments, and even the drama. Teaching loremoths, creating art and posts across the web, private servers and groups and direct message conversations between theorists.

Would Lorechat be a place? A building in Aviary (if we were to imagine Aviary to be more expansive than we know it)? A club that meets in places like the cafe? Or perhaps some will interpret Lorechat as having never been canonically organized. To a lot of people, Descendants aren't actually Us, and they don't actually think about things in parallel and in tandem alongside the player who projects onto them. The fact that we can all interpret in so many ways beautifully presents the sandbox afforded to us. ❤️ 🕯️

[spiral vault]

We know it's gonna be 10 episodes long, so I made a short summary of what I think it's gonna be:#lore-discussion-spoilers message

[sour sphinx]

Since the Two Embers seasons are likely to happen, I'm guessing I'm my own theory that the King probably barely survived from what happened in the past (either I don't know or don't remember what the final disaster was before civilization died off) and went into hiding somewhere so the Elders wouldn't find him. If I had to guess, either the King would be upset or maybe relieved that a new civilization (us) is thriving

[sour sphinx]

Those were good! We haven't seen the rest of the Elders yet from the series since we only saw the Vault Elder but we all know they'll be involved with whatever is coming

[spiral vault]

In the lore, the king is like super-super dead, maybe the season guide would be Hopeful Steward again?

[sour sphinx]

Those are great guesses! Who knows if they'll happen in the series

[sour sphinx]

Could be! I'm not sure if Stewart would want us to see or know what happened but would probably have no choice but to show and tell us

[spiral vault]

At first I was worried about season guides reappearing for another season, but they're doing that with Blue Bird so my theory could be more likely

And honestly, it could be something like "I waited until the right time to tell you"

[plucky locust]

I think not, if only because, being in the public domain, you can really do what you want with it.

Alice in Wonderland is also in the public domain, even if that was only for a Winter Wonderland.

[spiral vault]

I hope to ignore the collab room in Sky lore anyways

[spiral vault]

But speculation is not my strong suit, and TGC could do literally anything for those seasons

Would it be a shameless tie-in, a vague adaptation, or somewhere in between? Nobody knows

[earnest briar]

I’m imagining a bunch of Sky Kids sat at tables in the Aviary cafe, scribbling out diagrams and highlighting important parts of photos they’ve taken with wax-Light crayons while Teabrewer brings them snacks, and occasionally suggests new things to investigate that they’ve heard rumors of from other Spirits visiting the cafe.

||Meanwhile a couple conspiracy theorist Skids have commandeered the corner of the Nesting Workshop where the tack board is to hang up all their photos and red connecting string and whatnot, and are forcing the Nesting Guide to listen to their unhinged ramblings about jars and Husks and the Elders and how the King is DEFINITELY still alive trust me bro, he’s just hiding out somewhere in Eden where Sky Kids can’t reach.||

[crisp socket]

there's probably a nonzero amount of skykids who are specifically studying the lore of how the spirits descended from the sky itself after converting the lamplighter's lighthouse in the starlight desert into an observatory

[scenic pebble]

"skybro, i'm telling you, the sky is a facade"
"how are you so sure?"
"IT'S A DIFFERENT COLOR THAN ANYWHERE ELSE"
"but you can still see Eden"
"the lights up there are different than anywhere else, i checked"
shows two different star maps, one of the Aviary the other of the Desert
"nuh uh"
"wdym nuh uh?"
"nuh uh"

[narrow marsh]

I agree, it's (headcanonically!!!) the same with Passage.
The constellations don't line up. The moon isn't real. We have been to space countless times, we have looked. People say that the Night is real but there are so many factors against them here.................

[cobalt palm]

I've noticed the darkening in the place the characters on the isle door sits being darkened (or the rest of the stone in the doors bleached) for a while now.
And going there today I wonder if it's not just age, but that the rest of the door was bleached by a great light, like a giant diamond exploding and shattering, and what we see behind the characters as they move, that was the original color of the stones.

We also knew from the Aurora concert, and animations that isle used to be grassy, so could be a great light and heat caused the grass below the cloud to die, and the stones to bleach.

[earnest briar]

Or...the reason we don't see the Moon when ascending from Eden is because it's actually Orbit.
At least, it could be part of it.

[scenic pebble]

hear me out
THE ELDERS DON'T WANT YOU TO NOW IT BUT THE NIGHT IS ACTUALLY THE WARM EMBRACE OF THE MEGABIRD, THE STARS ARE ACTUALLY THE FUNNY LITTLE CONDENSED MOTES IN IT'S FORM AND THE MOON IS THE EYE WHICH WATCHES OVER US, THUS ALL THAT IS UNDER IT IS AT LEAST PARTIALLY A LIGHT PROJECTION
||insert a Joe Rogan picture here||

[earnest briar]

Why is this reminding me of the Big Sky Cat Tumblr post
Y'know, the one where it starts out being all ominous like "oooh it's a full moon, but suddenly you notice there's another moon, and then they blink" and then the response post goes "I blink back at the moons, because it's only polite to say hello to the Big Sky Cat".

[wintry matrix]

I think I need Razor language of that first sentence

Also do you think all the sand in vault/gw/isle is just… well… sand (how it ended inside vault though?) or like… people. Cuz from what I saw, when sky kingdom person loses light (or us in PNR), they turn into stone. And stone over time turns into dust/sand. It is bit morbid but I have been thinking about this for a while

I dont count starlit desert or oasis to this btw cuz those are clearly made to be desert to begin with, im talking about all the sand/dust in places where lot of people used to exist

[wintry matrix]

There are not enough stone statues (besides PNR and the hill leading to PNR) for all the people who died

[narrow marsh]

This is actually quite beautiful to picture

[cobalt palm]

Yeah it is a bit of a word salad, I'll try to simplify it.
I have noticed the stone behind where the characters on the isle temple doors sit being darker than the rest of the stone. Is this darkening, or actually bleaching of the rest of the stone, and the darker area is actually the original color.

A bit more verbose, but that was what I was trying to condense

[plucky locust]

So... I have actually seen one of the statues in eden, the ones before the PNR, like... crumble as I passed by.

[ashen fractal]

Oh wait where is that statue? In curious. Left or right?

[plucky locust]

I think the husk that crumbled was in the last area before the tunnel?

I only just noticed it happen.

[ionic maple]

So, sky kids are the ones who give back light right? And it is known in the Sky kingdom they age and have families, so it makes me wonder if the elders were at one point also going through Eden to bring back light. Is there a certain age at some point in the Sky Kingdom universe where they can't anymore? Idk it's just something I thought of rn

[hushed steeple]

Ancestors guided light (souls) back to the rebirth point (eden) skykids do it by filling with light (experience/glowboys) and sacrificing it at the rebirth point. I think elders could toss up light without sacrificing ancestors. But they kinda died in the eden explosion, as seen in shattering flashback.

[signal heath]

say something about this please:
why is the blue light of krill the same color as the light of the spirit if you release a spirits memory

[nimble ingot]

One can also wonder why the crystals glow blue at times as well.

One may believe it has to do with what the colours represent (i.e. blue being the colour for ancestor spirits, their technology and their spirit energy).

It is not entirely clear why the krill's lights are blue exactly. Though their colours do link them to the ancestors in some way.\

[spiral vault]

I think skykids are unique in this role. Because of the circumstances of the apocalypse and stuff, they're the only people who can return the light

[slim mango]

Ohhh, concept art of Blue Bird!

[wintry matrix]

first one looks like that skid has projector on their head

[earnest briar]

Sky Kids perching like birds… and they’re wearing the Sparrow and Lively Navigator capes!
Too cute…

[narrow marsh]

It seems to me like it could easily just not be painted, I see what you mean!

[wintry matrix]

landlord special

another oot - one thing i also noticed that not every spirit has a cape like us and when they do, they have only 1 star with only exception being granma with 5 (all of them are unlit, makes sense when they are dead), i wonder if theirs is just piece of clothing or if it worked like ours and they could fly (the stars are making it confusing) but then they wouldnt have cape at all cuz they lost their light by dying??? or maybe us reliving their memory made them appear from moment of time when they still had their "wings" but the stars are unlit because they are dead?? also why granma out of all spirits has 5? not even flight spirits have this many (i think)

sorry if i wrote it confusing, its a bit late where i am

[sour sphinx]

Come to think of it, I'm curious about that In the Two Embers trailer, we haven't seen any of the characters wearing capes like we do, well other than the King (of course I doubt he flies but we saw him levitating in front of the Eden Crystal)

[wintry matrix]

okay she has it lit this time

so does this guy hmm maybe spirits living in aviary get some "special power"?

granma has jusst one star out of five lit

[spiral vault]

I've heard it's a glitch

[wintry matrix]

what is a glitch? spirits having capes?

[scenic pebble]

yo fun fact
look at the "tall" model Spirits

[wintry matrix]

what about them

[spiral vault]

No, the stars on the capes

Apparently, it's because spirits can't display a cape with zero WL

[sour sphinx]

Sometimes I wonder what some of the spirits clothing's original color is? Like Granny's dress, we see them as grey or blue.

[hushed steeple]

They used to though. What new unintentional thing being mistaken for lore, its always fun to watch! Let us remember the prophecy murals temporarily appearing in sanctuary, turned on their side. 😭

[wintry matrix]

We can see vault elder having dark blue robe in two embers trailer

We can see other vault members wearing blue-ish colors too, maybe the spirits wear mostly colors from dye plants you can find in their area? Im yet to make comparison though

[patent pagoda]

Are the King of Sky and the Eden Elder the same person? Or are they two seperate people
While I'm here also, what are their names?? I've heard the names Alef and Resh be thrown around, but idk who's who???

[serene pollen]

Same ancestor/elder
Alef was his name before turning king
So just Alef or prince Alef pre-king era and King Resh when crowned

[patent pagoda]

Ohhh, ty

[scenic pebble]

they have one active flap on their back, even if they don't have a cape

[wintry matrix]

Well granma still visibly HAS stars besides the one active

[scenic pebble]

i meant this

[wintry matrix]

Yes, I know what you mean. But Im talking about this

[spiral vault]

Yes, all four names you've thrown around refer to the same person. They have other names as well

[supple sluice]

I saw a post on the sky subreddit that claimed the current season is a spoof of the current Sky community, with each spirit representing something wrong with the sky community

I like the idea but i do not know how to feel about the idea that the sky devs would actively poke fun of their own community

So like-
Hairtousle-Candle hoarding (Their quest literally gives a ridiculous amount of candles)
Confetti Cousin-Obession with cosmetics
Nostalgic Sparling Parent-Veterans complaining about how the older seasons were cooler
Pleaful Parent- Candle farming obession (Something about overworking yourself???)
Wise Grandparent-Predictions and beta spoilers

I don't know what to think, cuz these bad 'habits' of the sky community are kind of just. encouraged by the game itself?? anyway-

[wintry matrix]

and boogie kid is moth i assume

[narrow marsh]

In the end, it's effectively just an interpretation, and as valid as any other interpretation is or ever will be. With that in mind it's a really powerful idea!

In general we have to not become obsessed with and reliant on material possession and wealth, and that goes for life in and out of Sky. 🕯️

[supple sluice]

Yeah I agreed that it was compelling, especially since in the original story (the blue bird play) there was only a message about wealth

Predictions, hard work, fashion, nostaliga...Those are all sky-exclusive additions to the story, so those had to be on purpose

[sour sphinx]

If your Sky Kid were an Elder, what would they do?

[wintry matrix]

i already shared this earlier - after witnessing their little manta friend sacrifice to krill and later meeting each otehr again on orbit, they would get inspired/motivated (i cant find the right word) to make aviary village into sanctuary/rescue center for all lost spirits and injured creatures and even go "into the wilderness" to seek more animals and spirits who need help from dark plants or any other danger

from the... virtues? other elders have i guess it would be selfishness? kindness? i cant really tell but it still imo fits to the whole "valley elders provided entertaitment, forest elder technology, gw elder protection etc etc)

i need Stewie lore to complete this whole thing, waiting for two embers

tho i think stewie is more suitable to be aviary elder than my skid heh

[lone vector]

Mess everything up because she's a literal monster

[wintry matrix]

maybe hope is their virtue... or freedom

[sour sphinx]

Either she's chaotic or chaos itself

[wintry matrix]

yeah second thought i think freedom works even from lore pov cuz skids have wings just like peace dove and they spread light to other realms and FREE the trapped spirits

[eager burrow]

If my skykid were an Elder, whoof… I think they’d prolly hang out either around IoD (specifically during Passage/Eclipses), the top of the VoK, or the Windpaths and be like,, an extra guide for moths or help skykids harness their creativity/imagination (excellent for problem-solving and communication). Idk, it might fall more under the Valley Elders’ influence of entertainment, but I feel like Elder Skykid Cro would def have some sort of creative aspect, like mural painting or smthn.
They’d be the one you talk to if ur having issues with creative blocks or having trouble getting along with someone/struggling to communicate your ideas.

[soft timber]

I think the idea of the Elders also having a small group of spirits that help the people and skykids is a wonderful idea, maybe they are the seasonal guides maybe not

[wintry matrix]

VoK?

[molten dust]

vault of knowledge :skylol:

[wintry matrix]

Oh

Its morning so im little slow lol

[narrow marsh]

Themes!!!

I'm so sorry but this question led me to make an entire analysis
(Would anyone be surprised?)

When we look at what the color blue Thematically means in Sky, we have more concentrated Theme connected to colored/elemental Light, and then many, many other (likely) Themes that surround the broader worldbuilding of Sky. Let's take a look

1. Blue: Colored/Elemental/Dyed Light 🌊🔵 🖌️
   Colored Light is still a highly speculative field of Skyology.

• First we were introduced to elemental Light in Season of Enchantment and Season of Prophecy, where Blue Light was used to create a Spell (and a Blessing in Prophecy) that made waters rise.
• In the Cave of Prophecy, we also would be shown that Blue Light would rest in a strange unknown cold arctic. It is unknown whether the arctic depicted is found in the world or Sky, or just depicts the Trial of Water.
• Blue Light was given to the Forest Elder by the Chosen One, and though there are many theories, we're unsure what exactly the Elders did with them.
  Blue Dye
  There are a lot of theories and concept art that point to the location of Dye being relevant to the color and symbol of each Dye. Blue Dye still uses the symbol of Water. So it should be in places like Sanctuary and Forest, right?
• Strangely enough, Blue Dye is only collected in Wasteland and Vault! (And the Wind Paths, which has every color.)

This will be important later, after we see the other Themes that Blue Light represents besides being an element.

[Part 1/2]
I'll post the next part tomorrow. Today we talked about part of the Where, but next we'll look the rest of the Where—as well as at the What and Why in terms of the symbolisms behind Blue. ❤️ 🕯️

Part 2:
#lore-discussion-spoilers message

[ocean tiger]

is there any lore around this bird in valley?

[humble sonnet]

[wintry matrix]

(pre shard fall) if this is how GW looked right before eden exploded im not even surprised no one survived cuz how are you gonna look for a shelter in these conditions

[wintry matrix]

wrong channel buddy

[past hornet]

Imagine amongst all sky kids, there is a ||[Null]|| sky kid whose appearance will never be shown despite every lit, forever be an unlit child
The one way to encounter them is finding a weird bug that teleport you to the aviary village, but the twist is that the village is off. No one around except that dark figure wandering.
You can offer lit, they will lit back but their appearance will just flicker without showing

[wintry matrix]

I saw some people talking about how they intentionally dress like that to confuse people - bald head, no mask, black cape, black pants… i lowkey wanna try it too but i dont own any full black pants unfortunately

[past hornet]

nah ik XD its a story i made up
but who knows, there is one

[wintry matrix]

And im saying i geniunely saw people on reddit talking about dressing like unlit child to confuse players after lighting up

I also like the au where child of abyss exist, basically opposite of skids, they are fully black simmilar to unlit players and they go light up innocent moths and lead them away from others where they consume their light, leaving only statue like those in eden

Lemme see if i can find the artist, there was whole refference sheet with how it works

[past hornet]

we can lead this story to 2 ways
one is that those abyss kids are hungry for lights

two is that those are once us, but life wasnt so lucky and caused them to fallen without will to resist

[wintry matrix]

Artist is Harpyco on pinterest /harpyco1 on Instagram, easy to find on their profile

They call them void entities, not abyss children, mb

[past hornet]

np, wonder if devs see this and decide to welp +1 season that has never been done

[wintry matrix]

I mean two embers is also open book for domething like this if you think about it

If not to the series, then into season but i dont think they will do it at all cuz “it is too dark for children players and yadayadayada”

[past hornet]

ye, in the middle of friendly and for kids long series seasons, suddenly a dark story appear
ye it wont work

[wintry matrix]

If any already existing entity would fit to this it would be dark shadow from days of mischief/trial of fire

It is aleeady blob of something, they could form into void kid or any other void version of light creature just like this artist headcanon

[past hornet]

even though it wont happen that soon, im already hyped to see it

[wintry matrix]

Or if they ever exapnd eden map (bruh) they could just add them there to simply exist like corrupted crabs on other maps or something. They would just wander around and consume your light like red rocks do when you get close and the lore would be something like “it is all the skids who failed to reach orbit” i dunno

Or ghosts of skids who got consumed by krills/souls of people caught in eden explosion (who took the wave of power that consumes light as first and on its strongest and it was that strong it didnt even left a trace outside those empty husks, kinda like shadows in hiroshima)

[past hornet]

hmm, under the madness of eden palace of rock rain, its hard to put in ghost kids as you would be overwhelmed with rocks (for moths mostly)

plus ghost kids would make eden looks like a haunted place rather than an unstable madness

[wintry matrix]

The reward for going there would be like 10 to 20 winged lights but for price you can lose more than you get by going there

[past hornet]

the stage worse than <10 WL?

where you wander endlessly till u see the lost light at the end of ded cutscene maybe?

[wintry matrix]

Just make the void kids consume the light faster than the red rocks and combine it with rock rain

And strong wind with no shortcuts allowed unlike second eden map where you can skip the entire thing to collect the lights in tunnel

[past hornet]

how about this, lets say you have 200+ and you reached the 63rd statue with more than 50 wl in your body

instead of waiting to be hit till 0, everything fades slowly, only you in unlit is visible

[wintry matrix]

I dont understand

[past hornet]

normally you would wait until your wl is 0 that you move to the ded cutscene yes?

[wintry matrix]

Yeah but i dont get the trhing after like how would the extra wings benefit you in the void when you will lose all of them by going to orbit anyway

[past hornet]

well, in my made scenario, your strong will (WL amount) made some entities notice and you slowly go to the unknown place, after that i havent thought of

its like a mid phase between Eden and Orbit

[wintry matrix]

The reward would be more ascended candles then?

[past hornet]

possibly, i wont wish for more type of currency X X

The season that you will want to do Eden in the end for that extension of a process of giving your lights to the fallen ones

[cobalt tangle]

Help ;w; please?

[wintry matrix]

None??? To my knowledge atleast

I dont think she would even be elder if she was evil cough cough uhh shoves resh into wardrobe

do we even know for sure resh was elder and not just some guy who happened to have power??

As far i know it was resh and people of abyss who used the light from creatures to turn them into darkstones, forest was just export hub (forgot his name but one forest spirit memory is about a group trapped inside a cave digging for something, likely dark stones so i think teth just received all those unrefined stones from forest and peaks, cut them into shape and sent them “next door” where they filled them with light)

Also if she was evil why would she be helping (and failing) other elders to stop the eden crystal explosion in final shattering memory and also bow to us in vault cutscene..? Maybe im just way positive and biased cuz I like her but imo she is not evil (nor had evil intentions in her own cutscene, being crafty person she was propably VERY bored being stuck in purgatory without her own light and suddenly we showed up with light and she was like GIMME)

(if I was stuck somewhere for a long time without anything to do and suddenly someone handed me stuff I can do something with, I would propably react the same tbh)

Ok i will have my leave now lol

[scenic pebble]

Teth herself was probably not a part of the hunting/gathering process
but part of the charging process?
hell yeah
say what you want but more than anything she seems to have been a craftswoman backk in the day.
there were also a few discussions on the Forest Temple possibly being used to trap and take the Light from mantas but alas, these are just theories

[wintry matrix]

i think she possibly couldnt even have idea about the whole process, maybe she was just given instructions and followed those

cuz like why, when your realm is literally the average common picture of "life" aka forest and its plants and animals, would you participate in anihilating it?

[spiral vault]

Indirectly, you can assume they did. The Forest Elder mural shows them crafting darkstones, which are powered by the light from light creatuers.

[spiral vault]

Perhaps similar to real life...

[narrow marsh]

There is not really 'evidence' and definitely not quotations pointing to any of the Elders being "evil", though plenty of room is left for anyone to interpret their actions that way.
However, there is quite a lot of concept art, in-game context clues, and direct quotes stating that the Forest Elder captured light creatures and this somehow was used to create Darkstone tech.

Concept Art
(Image attached)

Context Clues

• Mantas are freed from cages in the walls when Forest Temple activates.
• Forest Elder is shown to be working on creating a prism in your interaction with them, visually similar to Darkstone.

Direct Quote
(Also attached)

Hope this helps! 🕯️

[earnest briar]

This is going to be a tangent that will eventually get to what I’m trying to say, so be warned.
A painting from Season of Nesting depicts Forest Elder with the Nesting Guide in the clearing behind their temple. The one with the pond, where you fly into a tunnel in the clouds and enter Valley of Triumph. During the final Nesting quest, the Guide meets us at that same clearing to collect wood from the trees for their projects. However, instead of breaking branches off of the trees, or cutting into the trunks, they specifically ask us to collect branches that have already fallen.

There is also the Wind Paths, both a travel hub and a safe haven for Light Creatures, led by the Flight Guide. The Flight Guide is confirmed by teasers leading up to Flight’s release that they are the apprentice of the Prairie Elder, so based off the painting and the fact Nesting Guide specifically meets us in an area only accessible by first going through the Temple, I think it’s safe to assume they are Forest Elder/Teth/whatever you want to call them’s apprentice.
Elder of a realm known for it’s abundance of Light and Light Creatures, with 2 different Seasons that have maps full of Light Creatures-> apprentice runs and cares for a place full of Light Creatures.
Elder of a realm known for craftsmanship and building things, with at least 1 Season focusing around this (Assembly and rebuilding the treehouse) -> apprentice who opens their own workshop, and even has a Season about constructing your own Nest to call home.

[wintry matrix]

i always thought that thing on ceiling is some device to control weather huh

[earnest briar]

I personally believe, or at least like to think, that the Forest Elder attempted to be environmentally conscious in their darkstone mining and refining efforts, but as the Ancestor civilization flourished with the usage of darkstone and demand for it increased, it became less and less feasible to try to do that. This led to degradation in Forest’s environments, and ground collapses such as the one in Tearful Light Miner’s memory, or Mindful Miner’s song-memory.

[wintry matrix]

i have troubles reading this one though

[narrow marsh]

No prob, here you go! You can also find this concept art amongst so much else on this site 🕯️
https://www.tomzhao.com/sky1

[scenic pebble]

this statement makes the industrialist blood in my veins boil
isn't it obvious?
to make something by yourself
to craft an uparalelled creation grander than what mother nature could've ever conceived
to finally prove yourself, to reach the heights none have even dreamt of before, to reach that transcendental state of pure bliss, to synch the hammmering to your heartbeat, to become one with the hammer and anvil, to be the song sung for Millenia, the piece that will be presented for eternity, the blade that will stay shar forever, to leave your own mark on this world with that rusty knife you call your heart
but the furnace's fire must burn on for one to achieve that
and flames need fuel

[wintry matrix]

geez looks like i offended everyone by saying this lol

[narrow marsh]

Not you, but the hubris of humanity 🕯️

[scenic pebble]

i'm not offended, just probably let too much out on it
i can be remarkably unhinged sometimes

[narrow marsh]

Noone my philosophy work is going so well but also is driving me insane
These notes are still somehow about Sky by the way

[narrow marsh]

And we love you for it my friend

[wintry matrix]

hmm i should finally do the dye vs clothing color of spirits comparison but im lazy

but i was thinking about it and from the spirits i can remember from head it fits so far

[wintry matrix]

ISLE
no dye and too few spirits to really work with

PRAIRIE

DYES: red, yellow, white
SPIRITS CLOTHING COLORS: yellow, red, orange, blue, pink, white
CONCLUSION: except blue, all of those colors can be found in this realm, pink is mix of red and white, orange is yellow and red
FITS THE THEORY? yes

FOREST:

DYES: green, cyan, white
SPIRITS CLOTHING COLORS: white, yellow, pale blue/cyan, green, purple + red from hairtousle teen (blue bird)
CONCLUSION: one instance of purple that doesnt fit but that can simply be just to put second spirit with colored cape there (could be easily swapped with white cape from vault as you can find purple in vault but I guess they did not want the white and black capes to be accessible so easily), yellow is used by assembly spirits and could be argumented they sourced the fabric for their signature scarf elsewhere, lively navigator has yellow-ish orange on cape but thats wind paths and you can find all colors in wind paths
FITS THE THEORY? yes

VALLEY:

DYES: red, yellow, green, cyan, white
SPIRITS CLOTHING COLORS: red, black, yellow, white, blue, pink, purple-ish blue + whatever aurora spirits have going on
CONCLUSION: black and colors mixed with black (dark blue) can be found on performance and dream spirits, so can be dark blue, both of those groups are perfomers so one can assume they outsorced their clothes in different realms on purpose, juggler has blue-purple cape but you can get this shade by mixing bit of red into blue and again this spirit is also performer (though different season) so same apply here, interesting enough, there is no spirit with cyan outside tassels on storyteller outfit
FITS THE THEORY? kinda???

[earnest briar]

For Forest, remember that all (or almost all, I can’t remember if black dye appears there) colors of dye plants grow in the Wind Paths, likely due to the location’s role as a travel hub between realms. So of all the realms, Hidden Forest is actually the most feasible one to have access to all colors of dye.

[narrow marsh]

All colors of Dye appear in the Wind Paths, even black and white. My guess is that it's because all realms intersect there. It's a really cool feature, honestly. 🕯️

[wintry matrix]

WASTELAND

DYES: blue, purple, black
SPIRITS CLOTHING COLORS: blue, black, ashy red, purple, yellow, green, white (gray)
CONCLUSION: yellow is mostly used only on details with exception of snoozing carpenter and playfighting herbalist, another color is ashy red that can appear as purple or brown under certain lighting, could be just purple clothes dirty from all the dust or again, fabric they scavenged elsewhere, green is here propably for same purpose as purple in forest (why didnt they swap those two though????)
FITS THE THEORY: yes

VAULT

DYES: same as wasteland
SPIRIT COLORS: white (suprisingly a lot), yellow, teal, blue, green (not counting deer and moomin spirits cuz collab, prince is somewhat canon? spirits from there wear realm colors anyway)
CONCLUSION: green and yellow is used by remembrance spirits so argument here can be that they came from different realm to seek shelter, suprisingly a lot of white both on collab spirits and regual/travelling spirits (propably cuz it is... how to say it... nun/monk color kinda????), no black at all (they are just lazy to go collect it in eden next door)
FITS THE THEORY: why is there so much white???

EDEN

[wintry matrix]

yes but valley is the one with most variety of colors and no direct access to wind paths (hermit valley is pretty much abadoned area and too high up for regual travel imo) though it can be because it has lot of tourism (I assume???) and also as i said, half of the spirits are perfomers more or less and when you play in theatre and stuff you want your costume to be as flashy as possible

[wintry matrix]

also that yes, i was just focusing on colors found in the realms itself as not everyone could travel to source their clothes/fabrics outside the realm they live in unless some merchant happen to visit and they bought it from them

[narrow marsh]

Would this idea help perhaps add some crucial context clues you might be able to add to the picture?
#lore-discussion-spoilers message

[wintry matrix]

it just supports my point of spirits locally sourcing the dye yes

now i wonder what colors would isle have

[narrow marsh]

We see flowers and grass in Isle in the TTE trailers!

[rapid latch]

Guys I have a theory about where the Enchantment spirits came from.
They came from Daylight Prairie. The murals on the walls of the crab cave in the Ark support this theory.

[narrow marsh]

Dabbling in @scenic pebble's stylings right now as I finish up the analysis on Blue. 🕯️

Very appropriate for being just in time for Days of Nature, too! 🌿

Part 1: #lore-discussion-spoilers message
Part 2: #lore-discussion-spoilers message

[wintry matrix]

guys imagine they put Flight and The Light Beyond in Stewie and Alef dying (assuming from that one scene from trailer where they meet on orbit), I will be bawling my eyes out i love those two songs so much, it is the main reason i do eden runs

[earnest briar]

“We cannot Control Blue. And so we cry. Our tears adding to the pool.”
Me when I can’t find the right temperature for the shower

[spiral vault]

I really have to wonder how that scene is gonna be. Will it actually be in orbit, or will it be more like the child hugging scene?

[wintry matrix]

the trailer part looked a lot like the child hugging scene!

it looks the roles are reversed though

[spiral vault]

Also, this seems to confirm both figures are definitely Skykids

It makes me think of the differences between skykids and spirits

[fiery condor]

i'm totally very normal about this specific line for the DoN quest intro no im not

almost as if its like a parallel to skykids being made to take the burden for the elders and/or spirits. cleanse the darkness polluting the world (a byproduct of their misdoings) to made the realm a better place for the future

its prolly just for the event quest but yknow... something to think about

[long vessel]

There's SO much interesting information about the nature of darkness in this event

• You can only absorb so much darkness before it no longer clings to you
• Darkness makes you lose Light, but you can still fly up until that Light is gone. Once all Light is gone, it does not cause damage or WL loss
• Maximum darkness absorption results in nearly full colorblindness, with the exception of Light/fire and geysers
• Fire and geysers both cleanse darkness
• Leviathan leaves a trail of darkness (may be the current source of the pollution)
• The Dark Worm also seems to pollute the area it’s in, but only when not underground (needs confirmation, my game was being a little buggy)
• A difference between darkened skykids and dark creatures - dark creatures can shed darkness, meanwhile darkened skykids don’t seem to (and rather than draining each other’s light while darkened, they do still charge each other)

[earnest briar]

"Clean up after yourselves and don't leave trash in the ocean ya honkin' dinguses, otherwise The Horror™️ is going to show up"

[long vessel]

Here are some pictures from today - first two of the darkness being cleansed in the fire, then the leviathan and its trail of darkness, and finally two darkened skykids (while the darkness is actively draining your Light, it also has these dark "bubbles" that come up and pop quickly all over your body)

[fiery condor]

honestly i feel like the new darkness feature would have potential for a post- or pre- shattering season

maybe like there'd be new dark creatures or fauna that induces colorblindness to disable their prey

[long vessel]

Maybe!

It also clues us in on the lives of Dark Creatures. They are likely color-blind, if not fully blind

[fiery condor]

oooo maybe ur onto something! maybe thats why krills and crabs attack us— we stand out amongst their black/white vision

[long vessel]

It's also interesting to think that we can be cleansed, but dark dragons, seemingly not? I wonder why, and I wonder if it has something to do with the fact that we, as skykids, are biologically incapable of being drained of our innermost light by this darkness - but light creatures, maybe not. They don't have an outer shell to protect that light very well to begin with (the exception being crabs, who we do see at the campfire at Wasteland - so maybe they were being cleansed rather than cooked after all)

Same with how we don't pollute the surroundings, even when we've taken in the maximum amount of darkness. But the krill do, potentially regardless of size (if I was right in observing the worm also exuding darkness when out)

[earnest briar]

"Maximum darkness absorption results in nearly full colorblindness, with the exception of Light/fire and geysers" If I remember it right, colorblindness in the real world in species who otherwise can usually perceive most colors is caused when the cones and rods and other bits in our eyeballs that process light don't work properly, preventing that creature from registering the full light spectrum of colors.

Perhaps something kind of similar is occurring here? Absorbing so much of that specific form of Darkness and being drained by it prevents Sky Kids from seeing the full Light Spectrum, with only sources of Light that can clear that Darkness still having color. Almost like we're instinctually laser-focusing in on it, recognizing it as our means of healing/restoring ourselves and removing the Darkness.

The Leviathan's trail of darkness and these "dark bubbles" you're mentioning is also really interesting, because when I saw that 4th picture of the Skids covered in the stuff, my mind immediately went to oil spills and what happens to any animals caught in it.

[long vessel]

Reducing the amount of the Light Spectrum available for us to perceive is a really good way to put that. I do think that's a big part of it. And the fact that, once fully covered, a dark creature almost always has little flakes of darkness on or around its eyes

It also may just be an artistic animation choice, but I find it really interesting that when you do cleanse the darkness from yourself, those flakes that were originally stuck all over don't just fall off. Instead, they actually seem to be repelled and cleansed. All the black spots fly off of you and hover momentarily as they all turn white and disappear

OH, another tidbit I totally forgot about that might make some creature-lovers happy: After being helped, when you get covered in darkness and need to cleanse it, the birds you helped will lead you to the nearest source to rid yourself of the darkness. So not only are they just being very empathetic and helpful in those moments, it also suggests that creatures know how to cleanse themselves (and that the birds were just too laden with darkness to fly to get to either location)

[earnest briar]

How's that one Dawn dish soap ad go again?
"Isle of Dawn Skid Soap: Tough on Darkness, gentle on capes".

[earnest briar]

That reminds me of how the Manatee on the beach, and then the ones trapped in junk inside the Sanctuary Vortex during previous Days of Nature, would always seek out other trapped Manatees and circle around them while calling out. I always interpreted it as the Manatees understanding you're here to help, and that as creatures blessed with the gift of hands, we're able to free their friends when they're incapable of doing it.

[long vessel]

Waitttt a minute! If Krill are color-blind except to light sources, it might make their lights make a little more sense too (aside from dormant vs volatile, which ofc still applies). But thinking back to how red is the longest wavelength/the darkest perceptible color on the spectrum... wouldn't that make focusing in on a light source that much easier?

Like, red would make your surroundings even harder to see, which is why the blue/cyan works for just getting around. But then you spot a target and want to focus in, so it's like trading the vision of the rest of your surroundings for better vision of just that one little speck of light

[earnest briar]

"Target locked, lunch acquired "

[fiery condor]

"Target ran away, we'll get 'em next time"

[earnest briar]

Now then, here's something else I'd like to call attention to in regards to what happens when Sky Kids and other Light Creatures get covered in what I will refer to as "Darkness oil". If absorbing a bunch of darkness and getting drenched in the stuff to the point we lose the ability to see color can drain our Light, why don't Krill repellent spells have this same effect when they're active?

[long vessel]

I actually haven't used one of those yet - I know it protects you from one(?) hit from a krill, but don't know anything else. Does it have any visual component at all while active? Is there anything we could look at to see why it works other than it just being a spell? What happens when a krill hits you?

[earnest briar]

You get covered in darkness as well as the little particles, and your whole body is blackened. When a Krill attacks, it just lunges at you and then rebounds, continuing at an upwards angle in the direction it went to attack you, like what they usually do upon attacking. When the spell ends, the darkness and the little particles disappear, and there’s a little blue glow coming from you for a few seconds that resembles the one from a Winged Light as you’re collecting it and absorbing it into your flame core.

Actually, now I’m curious if it can work on Mr. Bobbit, so I’ll have a chance to test that hypothesis and get you a video of what I’m talking about at the same time!

[molten dust]

hi lore chat what do we think of us cleansing the waters and absoribing dakrnes

[earnest briar]

We’re already being Incredibly Neurodivergent about it, if that’s what you’re wondering.

[molten dust]

OMG :D SAME

[earnest briar]

☝️ here’s where it started today, if you’re interested in our collective ramblings and hypotheses.

[molten dust]

:D thank

[earnest briar]

Interesting. We’re actively slowed when we’ve reached the max amount of darkness we can absorb. Or at least, it seems like that to me.

[long vessel]

Except when in flight, if you have the wings to do so

Which made me think... maybe krill lie dormant in the sand until a light source arrives and awakes it in order to save the little energy they have for their hunts

And instead of the vibrations of footsteps awakening them, which was my first thought, maybe it is literally the presence of light essentially aggravating their darkness (for lack of better term)

[earnest briar]

The new, sudden presence of something that they once had and were connected to, but no longer are. And they desperately seek to regain it, in order to fill and maybe cleanse that emptiness always gnawing at their beings. But it’s consumed them so much, that now instead of sharing our Light with them in beneficial symbiosis, all they can do is Take and Hurt and Empty.

[sour sphinx]

I noticed that on the Two Embers trailer (one of them) Isle of Dawn used to be full of green and filled with life. Maybe Wasteland and Eden used to be like that too?

[spiral vault]

This would be cool for a Shattering 2.0, though gameplay wise, the darkness particles are a bit slow and not that impactful. Call me cruel, but I kinda hoped to see more damaging impacts on skykids

[spiral vault]

Wasteland is probably a yes, we see grassy parts of it in Two Embers already.

Eden is much weirder, it's the peak of a mountain, it might be more barren at the start

[wintry matrix]

The part with colorblindness makes me wonder if thats how light creatures see. They dont have eyes (I like to assume the white spot on their forehead is their “eye”, it just makes sense and it is also roughly the same position that “mule” has in two embers and krills do). Maybe they see how we see when polluted by microdarkness - everything in grayscale except light sources, maybe thats why are they so curious when we are nearby (flock of mantas following you in sanctuary, the bird in wind paths, the little manta curiously looking at your burning shenanigans in prairie villages etc) and how krills are able to locate us even when we pretty much blend with the surroundings

[narrow marsh]

...colorblindness??
(Great notes! 🕯️ )

[wintry matrix]

There was krill concept art where you could “purify” the krill but that meant it completely dissolving

[narrow marsh]

Lol we both zoned in on the same feature.

[wintry matrix]

This also assumes krills can still die even when they are basically (un)dead

[wintry matrix]

The little manta friend (sorry for talking about him this much i love him, i love sky mantas overall) also seem to do that, always waits you by nearest source of light, mostly in forest where it also leads you through path with most shelter available (yes Im a freak and tracked the path he moves) and even returns for you if you decide to backtrack

And then that dumbo still gets caught in dark plants

[wintry matrix]

I noticed yesterday that they for some reason completely ignore the other sources of light that are not skids or light creatures. In graveyard, there is one krill that directly circles through one of the skeletons close to ground, there is torch placed literally in his place yet he completely ignores it so there has to be something more special about actual “living light” over normal fire (or it is just game mechanic preventing krills from freaking out but it would be cool if you could place your own torch or any other glowing prop as decoy to confuse them)

Also I wonder if you could technically blind the krills with too much light like spamming firework staff near their face

Oh i never noticed the charcoal note… does that mean spirits/elders (bones? bodies?) are made out wood/charcoal instead of wax or whatever skids are made of?? That note is super wague

Its not the mask, one of interviews states the masks are made out if stone

But then this also mentions charcoal over the stone… so either this is older concept than stone or the interview has slight mistranslation

Then is the darkness accumulating on us also charcoal and thats why it goes off so easily with fire? (see? it was related all along lol)

[long folio]

I'm not sure if I'm allowed to ask this? I am assuming I am going off on the pins in this channel
I was looking for a document on the art book so I can be up to date with development concepts and such! If anyone has it of course I am very curious

[wintry matrix]

Theres few photos of art book but not a whole thing. Respect the authors and buy the physical copy.

[long folio]

fair enough!

[silent hill]

I found this picture on telegram. I'm unsure what show/game it is from but I like how this concept resembles eden leading up to prn.

[wintry matrix]

more eden pre-shard pics (i forgot to bring camera)

flying race structures + aerial view on colliseum (i got lost in clouds and yeeted to next stage so i couldnt unfortunately do more photos, i will try again next time)

[scenic pebble]

may all your bools be false Sky Bot

[scenic pebble]

that's because it's quite literally the concept art of Eden
i'm still kind of disappointed seeing how many hostile obstacles skids were meant to come across and only crebs and krills ended up making it to the game

[minor sluice]

wats the main storyline of the game?

[long vessel]

Colorblindness! As you take on more darkness, the color fades from your vision and everything (except the campfire and geysers) turns to greyscale. Upon being cleansed, the color returns to normal.

And a note on geysers! Being blasted by one does cleanse you instantly, but standing in the mist (like right next to it) after it has erupted will also cleanse you, just a bit slower so you can watch it happen

I'm imagining little crabs scurrying to the geyser just in time to go WEEEEE

[earnest briar]

I tried using a geyser yesterday to do that, it didn’t work even though I was in the spout radius. Maybe it’s cause I was floating in the water inside it.

[minor sluice]

wats the min storyline? 🥲

[long vessel]

• There was a civilization who worshiped light
• A prince was born and completes the trials, fulfilling the prophecy
• At some point, this civilization discovers a stone that can absorb light and use it like a battery
• The Prince is crowned King and he sets off to industrialize the realms. Every flying boat, bridge, and gate are powered by this, among many more items
• The production of these stones begins to pollute the environment and ancestors and light creatures start getting sick with a mysterious darkstone disease
• The King has a giant diamond built to power his floating castle above Eden's peak
• This stone becomes their downfall as it explodes and kills everyone in its immediate vicinity (all the elders and the King)
• Post-apocalypse, people struggle to survive, but eventually Aviary is built as a refuge (...and still gets struck with at least one shard)

And that's about it.

[minor sluice]

ty. so the spirits we save in eden are dead ppl?

[earnest briar]

Everyone is dead except for the Sky Kids. And Light Creatures.

[long vessel]

Yes, but it's debated whether they're skykids or old, dead ancestors. I think the common consensus is that they are fellow skykids going on the same mission as us - if you'll notice, once you die in Eden, you also turn to a statue just like them

[minor sluice]

wat about those blue spirits? and that boy in aviary village? and the nesting, dreams, trial, and sanctuary guide?

[long vessel]

Maybe? I didn't play around with it much, I was just waiting next to the geyser for it to go off and happened go get close enough to it right after a blast to get accidentally cleansed lol

[earnest briar]

All dead. They’re called Spirits for a reason.

[minor sluice]

wow.

[earnest briar]

Death is not a permanent “you never come back” for the Ancestors, though. That’s why we’re encouraged to find Spirits, relive their memories, and help them ascend to Orbit. Even though they’re no longer alive in the biological sense, their souls still persist and can even interact with the world once we save them. That’s why all those Spirits appear in Aviary Village after completing the Hopeful Steward’s quest that asks you to go to Eden.

[earnest briar]

We’re helping to bring them over to Aviary after dying in Eden and ascending to Orbit, where all freed Spirits go. We basically let them know “hey, there’s this cool place back down in the Kingdom, you wanna come visit?”, so they follow us down from Orbit as we’re reborn and show up in Aviary.

[narrow marsh]

The artbook among other sources directly confirm that they are "children".

[wintry matrix]

huh?

[wintry matrix]

everyone is dead, dave

[scenic pebble]

bool
a binary function that can only assume the value true or false and is stored in a single bit

[wintry matrix]

tbh you will find answers to some of your questions by simply playing the game and paying attention to your surroundings

[wintry matrix]

i cant stop giggling on imagination of skids powerwashing each other from the microdarkness just like you pressure clean the walls and concrete

[scenic pebble]

robot insult

[wintry matrix]

i think im not neurodivergent enough to understand this despite being autistic

[earnest briar]

Computer see bool and think yes or no based on what it’s set to say

[scenic pebble]

alternate version is: "may all your ones be zeros, clankaaa"

[wintry matrix]

i give up lol

[earnest briar]

“Is this thing on? If yes, continue, if no, no continue”

[wintry matrix]

oh

[earnest briar]

that’s a very, very simplified version of it.

[wintry matrix]

sorry im slow sometimes

[narrow marsh]

Is this conversation why my Oscillation studies haven't been batting well in here 🕯️

[eager burrow]

Prolly haha 🥲 (I’m very intrigued by the theory, you have some interesting concepts!)

[wintry matrix]

english is not my first language so i cant really grasp the concept of those texts i like creative writing otherwise, even studied writing-related college (journalism)

[wintry matrix]

valley elder cutscene version closeups sah is kinda serving ngl
they are definitely smaller than in vault elder room and on orbit (see last pic)

my theory is that the cutscene still uses old models because they are

1. much smaller
2. way less detailed not only in comparison to their orbit version but also to other elders in OOB

for example Sah does not have cut on mask like on orbit

[zinc sandal]

got a theory abt the baby lurker in sanctuary islands

[real mortar]

I visit here every now and again, quietly snuffling amongst the lore archives; learning of old theories and past content. Then I shuffle off with my mittens full of the wonders to share amongst friends in other communities, so I just wanted to say to all the lore friends old and new - thank you for sharing your wonderful theories and all the screenshots, videos, drawings, diagrams and more!

[earnest briar]

And thank you for being here! I always feel very happy knowing that people appreciate my (sometimes barely coherent) ramblings, and I’d imagine many other lorechat regulars probably feel the same way.

[untold belfry]

is the valley elder with the short tousled hair a boy or a girl?

[narrow marsh]

Sky characters don't have set genders, and are meant to be left vague for the individual's personal interpretation! I've seen each of the twins portrayed as masculine and feminine, so it goes to show that everyone could see anything differently, which is beautiful! Is there a particular reason you were asking? 🕯️

[raw breach]

Is the war we see in the aurora concert(during the seed) the same war taking place during the repository refuge?

Im trying to understand the full range the war took place because it seems the only places that mention/are impacted are wasteland and vault

[winged raft]

I have a feeling that the Dark Dragons (aka krills) originate from Elder Mantas. Because of the current event in Sky, I could see the similarities of Elder Manta and Dark Dragon

[earnest briar]

@long vessel back with updates on this, the Krill repellent spell does protect you against getting damaged by the baby Bobbit in Sanctuary! Unfortunately I forgot to get a video, but I will do that tomorrow. Tomorrow I will also test if it works on Mr. Bobbit in Prairie Peaks.

[narrow marsh]

"Time divides each contender."
–the Trial of Water

2. The Symbolisms 📖📊🔎

Blue is everywhere, and Blue is extremely important. Let's take a look where Blue is found as a predominant color symbol and why.

Where

• Spirits (Trapped/Frozen)
• Spirit Mote/Souls (Immaterial/Freed)
• Descendant Mote/Souls (Wandering/Traveling)
• Memory fragments (Recollection)
• Darkstone tech (Advancement)

[powered and unpowered]

• Shared Spaces (Collective Recollection)

[technically Darkstone tech]

• Darkness plants (Depth/Containment)
  "Something within the waters."
• Dark Dragon eyes (Searching/Processing)

[scouting]

• Water Trial (Patience)
• Blue Light (Purity/ clean waters)
• Blue Dye (Reflection/Depths)

[Wasteland and Vault]

[Part 2/3]

I was going to hold off on posting this part, but here it is just in case it sparks any thoughts for anyone else.
Laying this out was simple enough, but a lot of these Themes seem to contradict each other. How could they be part of the same thing? I'm sure any normal, less- clinically-obsessed person would rule this out as just happenstance tossing-outs of Themes that Blue can represent. But as usual, I refuse to see it so simply. We can still tie this all together. I believe it's all Connected. And that whatever I learn will help us learn more about this world. ❤️ 🕯️

Part 1:
#lore-discussion-spoilers message

The Brainstorm:
#lore-discussion-spoilers message

[earnest briar]

I would like to offer my (admittedly much less detailed) response to this. Blue, like water, is versatile and can take many shapes and forms. It’s not restricted to just one set of concepts.

[narrow marsh]

That's exactly the point! However, total fluidity only results largely in incoherence. For a Theme to 'encompass everything' (many things) is for it to, in reality, not stand for anything particular at all.
My objective is to Define it as a mode of Being, of Experience, rather than to boil it down to a single trait, anyways.

Currently, it's something like:
"Body of inward motion and depth"
But that's still currently a work in progress, of course. 🕯️

[wintry matrix]

Their hair filenames are skykid_hair_elderbro (the spiky hair) and skykid_hair_eldersis (the bob hair) so we can just assume (also their body proportions differ from each other but I got diss for saying that before, heh)

[wintry matrix]

People also do ship arts of them and oh boy sweet home alabama

[wintry matrix]

Now the question is what unholy brew is in that potion so even krills find it disgusting

[long vessel]

This got me thinking and I have returned with a couple diagrams! (And a very fried brain lol )

I hope the connections I'm making are making some sense, but I can try to elaborate more tomorrow to clear up any confusion

I also may have to switch around the order just a tad because there's another underlying theme I'm trying to get at with the specific locations at which these colors/elements are located. For now, I'll say this: if I could quickly redo it, I'd make the horizontal line Blue vs Orange/Yellow. I think it's possible to think about this symbol in the terms of cardinal directions (including up and down, so what may look like a 2D axis may actually be representative of 3 dimensions)

[long vessel]

Here is the alternative I think I'd be happy with. But now I sleep

[narrow marsh]

Oh my wow
Yes I will sleep now too but I am going to gnaw on all of this like a bone thank you!

[turbid quiver]

what are saplings and why are some bigger and have more leaves than others

[wintry matrix]

its just ghost trees imo

they have same shade as spirits mostly

[untold belfry]

Ohh i see thanks for clarifying. Ive seen alot of people say that the twin with the short hair is a boy and it confused me

[tender creek]

OH COLOUR THEORY IS AT WORK HERE

THESE ARE THE NEGATIVES OF EACH OTHER I LOVE THIS

[distant pebble]

A lot of these are death and captured and contained stuff exept for wind and water

as well may be just cold/cool stuff

[earnest briar]

Theoretically I believe it could protect you from more than one Krill attack, as unlike the Elder masks, the darkness particles don’t go away until the spell ends, but it only lasts for 1 minute before going on a…maybe 30 second cooldown? So it can’t be used again immediately after. You would need to position yourself in just the right spot (or do a lot of wrangling) to get two Krills to aggro onto you close enough together that the spell timer doesn’t run out before they attack, and/or account for the animation of using the spell that occurs before it takes effect.

[long vessel]

You're seeing the vision!

As well as being color opposites of each other, I think they also represent spectrums along each axis.

White vs black = the spectrum of life and death, light and dark

Orange vs Blue = the spectrum of warmth and destruction vs coolness and creation

Green vs Purple = the spectrum of nature and nurture

Cyan vs Red = the spectrum of disinterest and passion

Everything above the X axis is closer to light, everything below the X axis is closer to darkness (not to say they are actually light or darkness or that it's inherently related, just that it's thematically closer).

Everything on the left side of the graph is more on the cool spectrum, and everything on right is on the warm spectrum.

And looking at it in the 3D: Light is above, Darkness is below, fire and water represent the earthly plane. Below the X axis, in this instance, everything is earthly; above, everything is "heavenly" for lack of a better term (but I don't mean it in the "holy" sense - I mean that these are mental, emotional, "upper-level" concepts as opposed to the earthliness of of the bottom. Maybe it would be easier to say the top half represents the mind/ideas/emotions while the bottom half represents the body/the material

[eager burrow]

Mmm charts make brain go brrrrrrrr

[long vessel]

It may also correspond with the four humours/four temperaments framework... and yet another spectrum to look at. One of wet vs dry.

The four humours are: sanguine, yellow bile, black bile, and phlegm. These are based on the earlier four temperaments, which are based on the four seasons (and two spectrums of hot vs cold and wet vs dry). These were used to determine what maladies and health issues you might be dealing with, but also used to describe different emotional states.

Top right = sanguine/blood; cold, dry, spring. If you are too far on this scale, you may be too happy (and have too much blood, apparently lol)

Bottom right = yellow bile; hot, dry, summer. If this is where you are, it may mean you are habitually angry

Bottom left = black bile; cold, dry, autumn. On this point in the spectrum, you are likely dealing with depression

Top left = phlegm; cold, wet, winter. Here, you may be too calm and reserved.

I see this as all fitting into the spectrums previously listed as well. A bunch of overlapping ideas. Although the humours/temperaments do use a slightly different spectrum of hot vs cold than I do.

[long vessel]

Here we go, I hopped on canva to make another nice visual. I feel like these ideas can be expanded on, but I've cooked by brain on it so hopefully it helps someone else lol

[wintry matrix]

i was replaying the aurora quest in isle and for some reason i had the kid remembered as random spirit girl but its a skid - is it Alef? or just some random bald kid lol (i know those scenes should be canon)

[long vessel]

A lot of people think so (including me!) but we don't really know for sure. It does seem that way though. The spirits who find the child (voyager and stargazer) seem like they might line up with the guardians of the Dawn Ember in the trailers as well

[narrow marsh]

Adding some of my own active annotations during breaks at work, and I spent a lot of time carefully selecting the wording for Blue and Orange in order to make it perfectly fit all of the Themes I've studied for Blue. Here's what I've got so far:

White and Black = Life and Death
Orange and Blue = Warmth/Melting and Cool/Pooling
Green vs Purple = Material/Body vs Cultivating/Mind
Cyan vs Red =

Red already has a lot of active research over it by various Lorefolk here, as our brainstorms are getting closer and closer to sealing it in as Overload/Combustion/Flare.

But Cyan is a lot trickier, and is further disguised by the visuals of the warfare used in the AURORA concert's The Seed. While many of my cohorts see the bombardments that were portrayed as "Cyan Light magic" I am leaning more and more towards @spiral vault 's interpretation that it's just Light magic in general being portrayed. We tend to forget that literally everything in the concert's visions were light blue, using the over-encompassing visual thematic of Spirit Memories.

With that said, here's my current notes on Cyan:

Behavioral Traits:

• Passive, drifting, distant
• Perceptive without intervention
• Mentally/spiritually detached
• Peaceful (Avoidant?)

Natural Phenomena:

• Mist, haze, fog
• Thin ice layers
• Horizons
• High atmosphere sunrises
• Scattering of light (Rayleigh scattering; why the sky is blue)

Keywords (neutral to negative):

• Dissociation
• Diffusion
• Drifting
• Evaporation
• Glaze
• Cool detachment
• Observation without action

This is all really cool so far 🕯️

[spiral vault]

I think you got my interpretation wrong, I think it's definitely cyan light being bombarded. They're launched from the Valley of Triumph, who were shown to use cyan light

[sly token]

Hi, What do you think the next season is gonna be?
Ikik season of blue bird just started but I'm curious to know if next season related to that sky animation about two embers. I just feel curious about what's coming next since the beta is closed

[wintry matrix]

is there any closeups (even OOB, I will try my best) yall would be interested to have photo of for lore reasons? i like to just go around maps and snapping photos of interesting stuff

[spiral vault]

It's all but confirmed that the next 2 seasons will be Two Embers related. From an announcement about the future of Sky

That's all we know though.

[narrow marsh]

Oh, I might have it backwards then!
I do now remember that being the evidence to the theory, thank you. 🕯️

[sour sphinx]

I've been thinking about the Mega Bird a bit recently. I'm curious if the civilians ever honored her or him as some kind of God or something?

[eager burrow]

My knowledge is more limited than an egg with legs, but I think one of the only in-game depictions of Megabird (please tell me I’m not the only one who wishes the name was more majestic to match the being/concept) is from that swirling ‘mural’ that leads to the secret Office place.
Idk if it’s considered canon, with its relation to the Office/Devroom, but it does exist.

It would be neat if maybe future seasons dropped a couple new murals with MB depictions. It would answer a few questions, to say the least.
My personal Headcanon is that there were prolly lots of ‘religions’ or similar belief systems within the extended Ancestor community. MB could be one, AURORA would def be one (I mean, her whole thing in the Arena is set up like an icon you would pray/worship to, and it FLOATS for crying out loud);
Eden King would probably be one, too (whether Eden King liked it or not), the Elders in general might’ve even had a small sect of Ancestors who worshipped them as mouthpieces of the universe. Idk tho; there could be any number of religions the Ancestors could’ve had. It’s just a fun thought experiment, really. :))

[earnest briar]

I like to call Megabird “The Cosmic Bird of a Million Stars” sometimes, or alternatively (since that one feels a little too grandiose, and it’s also shorter to write) “The Great Starry Bird.”

[signal heath]

Hi Skyfolk. Let’s go into kabbalah: As very much of the story has a lot in common with various mysticism around the world, the main evidence for the spirituality of the creator of sky are the names of the elders. Each of them has a hebrew letter as his name. And each hebrew letter contains a lot of information in the teachings of the kabbalah. So here is a summary of meanings.

Elder of Isle - Daleth - ד - The word Dalet is the word for door, gate and indicates resistance and the state of selflessness and humility needed to pass through it. The letter Daleth also represents structure, strong will, diligence, perseverance and patience

Elder of Praire - Ayin - ע - The Hebrew letter Ayin means eye and correspondingly, the Ayin has to do with vision and bringing forth lights that are hidden. Ayin teaches us to see beyond and relates to time. The Ayin is meant to take us from dark to light. It urges us to break through the walls of limitations in order to see what is not yet visible to us.

Elder of Forest - Teth - ט - The literal meaning is basket or nest. It has to do with purity and impurity, teaching us to choose the good, and also the realization that even within the bad things that happen, there is hidden good.

Elders of Valley - SahMekh - ס - Samekh is the symbol of support, protection, and memory. It means to lean upon, support, uphold. The Samekh teaches us that once we have learned to clean ourselves of all the negativities and distortions, controlled the ego, found true humility and learned to listen to the inner voice of our souls, that we are automatically guarded, supported and helped.

Elder of Wasteland - Tsadi - צ - Righteousness and humility are the two defining traits of the Tsaddi. The idea is that the world is broken so every person must face their own evil and learn to restore it. The literal meaning of Tsadde is a fishing hook.

Elder of Vault - Lamed - ל - The 12th letter of the hebrew alphabeth is the symbol of learning. It also represents the heart and the soul as it is in the center of the alphabeth. And also the wor for heart לב is written with lamed. Lamed teaches us to learn from everything in life

The Prince - Alef - א - The letter Alef represents the creation of something from nothing. It is the essential symbol of beginnings and ultimate reality that cannot be talked about, timeless, spaceless, and present everywhere.

The King - Resh - ר - Resh means head, leader and beginning. It is the symbol of choosing between greatness and degradation. In it is the word for poor רש Rash, but when it is filled the power of the Aleph it becomes Rosh ראש, head or first, expressing the Firstness, Oneness, and Eternity of the Creator, and the qualities of being a leader, not a follower.

[long vessel]

I am in awe. Well done There's so much good information to chew on in there

[long vessel]

I have returned with another graph. I won't lie, this one IS helpful for analyzing themes and archetypes, but I mainly wanted to share because it's satisfying lol

[narrow marsh]

My personal interpretation over AURORA is that the four AURORA Spirits created a Space where their idealized, humanized version of their god, can take a form. ☕
They (the four Spirits) created a visual conception of her. In my idea, it's their religion, but not what's 'actually' representative of the 'real' Megabird.

Creating a super-powerful Shared Space allowed them to make their dreams of meeting and sharing about their goddess a 'reality'.
I just feel like this is a good compromise on making the entire concert 'canon' while not dismissing the 'Truth' of the Megabird, but also giving due homage to various theorist's immense passion for believing that The Light has a human form in the goddess AURORA. I've also tried to make a list before of every belief the Ancestors seem to have 'canonically' had just based on what we've seen. 🕯️

[narrow marsh]

So what does green represent again? Presence?

[long vessel]

I also have another metaphor for this color theory/spectrum situation and all the themes they represent because I feel like the spectrum comparison makes it look a bit like we're comparing opposites, when I don't think that's fully the case

Imagine a set of three marbles. In the sun, they look orange, green, and cyan. But when you look at the marbles on a surface and get to see the shadowy underside, you see the color is not as clear or as vibrant as you thought. Yes, where the sun touches, they do still look orange, green, and cyan. But on the underside, where shadow begins to take over, you notice the shadow of orange is a deep blue. The underside of cyan is a dark red, and the darkest point of the green is purple.

You can pick up these marbles and look at them closely - they are but one shade. But where there is light, the marble will always have a Shadow. And where there is darkness, they may look unrecognizable at first, but the marble will sparkle with its true color when touched with the smallest ray of light.

But even beyond this - it's not as though the marble has changed for simply existing in darkness. An orange marble is also blue, a cyan one is also red, and a green one is also purple - it's only a matter of perspective

[long vessel]

A lot of things. The main thing it was meant for was the color spectrum conversation, getting to compare these different areas of color and what they mean thematically (because just listing each color out separately is helpful, but may ignore interconnected aspects of things). Think of it kind of like a political compass test but for... anything Sky.

You can place anything on the graph from different themes and elements, to literally the ancestors and elders themselves. Even skykids. All it is, really, is looking at how something may be associated with a color, an element, or the critical themes of light vs dark, connected vs disconnected

[ashen fractal]

I beleive there was a peice of concept art on Tom's website that listed orange as "sacred" but also anything concept or pre-game isn't technically canon so idk...

[long vessel]

True! That played a part in my thinking here, but instead of "sacred" I chose to go with the idea that some things are "closer to The Light." I do think sacred could probably still apply though

[narrow marsh]

Seems synonymous for the most part anyhow. 🕯️

[long tiger]

What if the passage guide used to collect masks but whatever happened to aviary led to most of his collection getting destroyed leading to only having these left

[autumn rivet]

Hello guys, I've been a solo lore enthusiast for a long time. I stalk this channel from my alt but have never texted before. This has been bugging me for quite a while and I just couldn't stay quiet. The way the temple of the isle is originally very high above in the second cave mural and then the constellation is shown to cut through the middle of the clouds in the third cave mural, is eerily similar looking to the way the temple here has actually cut through the clouds. Does anyone have a briefing on what interpretations are popular surrounding this connection?

[autumn rivet]

I like to think of the passage guide as not just a collector but also a maker of masks. The knowledge of the rites of passage had probably been handed over to him over generations along with the knowledge of different masks and their symbolic meanings and the methods to make them. He has always felt solemn in stature and form while performing any rite and it signifies that passage must have had quite the amount of significance for the civilisation. Although the playful nature of the kids during the passage rites, suggests that it did not have an apparent effect which young ones could feel any importance from. So the spiritual importance of the masks remains that only the passage guide/adults could know. Might be the case that although the passage guide could make masks, there were some specific masks he had no knowledge to make, and which must have required special methods. As you said, many of these might have been destroyed with whatever happened at aviary.

Ofc most of this is just speculation on my part from what I inferred during the interactions with the guide.

[long tiger]

Makes sense ngl

[distant pebble]

might just be people who wanted for the temple to look cooler

[autumn rivet]

Asking this specifically because I am just starting off on making a series of lore Infographics, so after making one on the sky kid, I was thinking of going serially from isle of dawn. Didn't wanna miss any references if there exist so thought this is the best place to ask. Would also love to hear everyone's thoughts here on what I should include and things you think should definitely be mentioned.

I'm planning on categorising them into different Infographic parts starting from

• The story told by the first isle cave murals
• The boats and pots and the trapping of butterflies starting from isle
• The burial of the cities of the realm under the sand
• The explanation of carvings and murals within the temple

The cave of prophecies will entirely have its own bunch of infographics and parts since the cave of prophecies has way too many references to be just a sub infographic under isle

[wintry matrix]

Concert version of Runaway actually shows simmilar scene to this - many kingdom citizens “yearning” for the temple but unable to fly. Then the chosen one (Alef) shows up, they all pray while he climbs up where your first winged light you get in whole game is. The light shows up and scene changes to them using flying boats to reach the temple.

Who built up the temple is a mystery. Maybe it was always there, maybe it was Isle elder who created it. Maybe it is just regual building built by kingdom citizens but it was hard to reach from the village/market on Isle, kinda like people invented bridges to reach their neighbours over river or the one guy who dig a tunnel through mountains for his village to reach the city hospital faster.

I also remember concept art briefly mentioning that the sky people who came before us (aka pre-eden fall generation) were unable to fly, same for elders. Our generation (possibly including Chosen One/Alef) can fly and thats also maybe why he was Chosen One.

[autumn rivet]

Original caption regarding the winged light btw. Thanks to baudshaw and mono/purutwo, for making me aware of it

[wintry matrix]

people arriving to isle, we can see some of them wounded and using crutches > fallen star/chosen one appears > desert changes to green fields (unsure if it was always like this or if people created the oasis) > people climb the rock with Alef in lead > alef is reaching for the light > people pray > alef sends the light towards the temple (notice we cant see Eden at all even when we should) > light explodes and we see people on boats heading towards the temple

[wintry matrix]

first winged light you obtain in the game is not this one, this one spawns later, the first one you obtain is on the tall rock in front of temple, game makes you use butterflies until then

[autumn rivet]

Yep yep I remember. Rn, the one we get the first time is the one where Alef is shown boarding the boats with people from first aurora quest. (Or from the reference images you sent, the place the people are praying while he reaches for the light)

However this was the first winged light from the earlier versions of the game when this boat winged light had not relocated outside the isle temple gates(pre daylight prairie area). I think that happened in the season of revival if I'm not wrong.

Also thanks a lot for the aurora quest pics and explanations!!