dnd-discussion

[dry widget]

Yea. I’d probably throw hints every now and then that it’s forming in the background but not be up center about it

[spring light]

Talk to your table, or at least dm, first.

[dry widget]

I would. But I don’t have one yet. I need a gane to play him in

[lyric viper]

At least in D&D they're both sapient beings fully capable of companionship and consent. Relationships can be nuanced and nonconventional in a world of various sapient species.

[knotty pasture]

You'd most likely be roleplaying two characters at once between you and your dragon

So can you roleplay romancing yourself with a straight face

[dry widget]

A little

[spring light]

I'd advise holding off getting too far invested in a character before making one that's specifically designed to work in a specific game

[spring light]

Also where some of my concern lies, with the same resolution

[dry widget]

The reason I asked is cause… well bards. If they do it why not the person the dragon is deeply and intimately bonded with

[knotty pasture]

Also since you don't have a table in the first place I don't think its a good idea to have a PC made based on a homebrew class

[dry widget]

Also those kinds of feelings can cross over

[knotty pasture]

Plus the Purple Dragon Knight Fighter/Drakewarden Ranger is right there

[dry widget]

Not home brew

It’s from a published book

[knotty pasture]

The former doesn't have a dragon but

But its third party right? Its a hard sell for most tables to include those

[woven flint]

My Bugbear Ranger survived last session

He is now level 3 and a Gloomstalker, tis gonna be fun 🧐

[spring light]

3rd party is just a step up from homebrew

[severe rampart]

Oh no... he's about to be the most powerful party member

[spring light]

That's more a meme and less an actual thing at real tables

[severe rampart]

I hosted a oneshot for my DM back then, they used a bugbear gloomstalker and nearly oneshot the boss

[spring light]

Them lanky arms

[woven flint]

He's pretty strong already
But, don't worry, I'm not doing Gloomstalker-Assaasin (Even if he's a hitman for the Zhentarim)

[dry widget]

Ye but still

[woven flint]

Also, we're talking 2024 Gloomstalker, so it's not AS broken lol

He also has a new pet rat!

He named him Slank

[limber trail]

Slank

[woven flint]

Yup, Slank

[woven flint]

He's very much a Glass Cannon as he only has a +1 to con lol

[humble cairn]

That's a stereotype, Bards don't have to be like that.

[dry widget]

I’m well well aware

[woven flint]

Yeah, none of my bards have ever been .. like that lol

One was ab Actor and the other was a very Glamorous Owlin

[dry widget]

I’ve only seen 2 people actually do that

[spring light]

i do happen to play a hedonistic bard, but they're more into partying and eating.

[dry widget]

And one wasn’t a bard

[prime basin]

a dragon could certainly bond with a human but they'd have to have some body altering spell if they actually want to "seduce" the dragon

[knotty pasture]

Dragons can use change shape if you give them the ability to iirc

[dry widget]

Old dragons can shape change

[knotty pasture]

So they can just turn into a dragonborn which allows normal seduction but at this point you're just shipping two PCs together in the same campaign

[severe rampart]

Oh darnn, my next bard should be a Jester Swords Bard

[prime basin]

yes like balduran's dragon buddy

[woven flint]

None of my Charisma characters have been Hedonistic

Hell, One was a Glory Paladin born at the seat of Royalty, but he decided to handle his nation's problems with his own two hands instead of just sitting in a throne
He wanted to EARN his royalty even being born as a Noble

He was awesome, I loved him

He said "Screw Class, imma kick Ass!"

[prime basin]

i've made 2 "hedonistic" characters but I haven't played them

[knotty pasture]

I never thought deciding the color of a Dragonborn PC is this hard btw, so many options

[spring light]

since my character is in another system i was able to take an actual hedonist flaw

[barren panther]

I think the real issue there is mainly going to be whether your DM and party want to sit there and listen to you narrate your fan fic if that’s the case, lol

[prime basin]

I like cold so I go with white or silver most of the time

[woven flint]

My Glory Paladin was a Golden Dragonborn lol

[prime basin]

I also like black and blue dragons too though

[woven flint]

My current Dragonborn is a Bronze fellow

[spring light]

if it's a romance heavy game, i could totally see it working just fine.

[jolly agate]

Skyrim refference?

[spring light]

gold dragonborn glory paladin is a pretty standard affair

[woven flint]

No?
Dragonborn is a species

[woven flint]

Ssshhhhh

[spring light]

it's fine. it's tropey because it works well and is easy to read

[lyric viper]

This was my difficulty even when trying to RP a healthy loving relationship between my Paladin mum and her husband. little bit awkward to RP her holding his face and telling him she loves him. fine in text oddly, but when speaking during game it felt like I was making my party watch me make my dolls kisa.

[spring light]

this is why i try to avoid having my npc do too much in games, ESPECIALLY talk to each other.

[knotty pasture]

Well yes that too lol, this is treading into a situation where freeform rp is probably a better platform

[woven flint]

Only 4 of my characters have been in relationships
3 of which were Oneshot characters and they pursued their relationships after the job was done lol

[knotty pasture]

In freeform rp you can have your character be in a harem or what have you and roleplay all the members of said harem no problemo

[knotty pasture]

This crossed my mind before, my Dragonborn Artificer PC concept was someone who worships Tiamat so ideally they'd be a chromatic dragon

[woven flint]

Had
A Goliath Elements Monk that rizzed up a Demon he was fighting, they're husband's now

My Sahuagin Forge Adept Artificer cured a Halfling Lady of her curse

My Aasimar Sorcerer-King Warlock had a wife he left behind to go Conquest

And my Dark Elf Wildfire Druid is currently a diety with his Mortal owlin bard husband he loves very much

The last one is the longterm character lol)

[prime basin]

Ironically most chromatic dragonborn and dragonborn in general worship bahamut over tiamat

[knotty pasture]

Bahamut keeps on winning huh, though I guess Tiamat's cult's demographics are still chromatic dragonborn dominant even if more chromatic dragonborns flock to Bahamut overall

[prime basin]

a dragonborn artificer sounds cool though

[prime basin]

tiamats cults are mostly made up by kobolds actually

that and probably tiamat obsessed humans

[knotty pasture]

Dammit

[woven flint]

Tiamats Cults are ACTUALLY mostly evil Draconic creatures, not purely just Kobolds

[prime basin]

well of course but i meant like actual humanoid esque creatures

[woven flint]

The Chromatic and Metallic Dragons don't worship Tiamat and Bahamut like gods, though they view them as Queen and King of Dragons respectively

[prime basin]

well possibly but based on lore it says that most dragonborn worship bahamut

[woven flint]

What I said is also based on lore lol

[prime basin]

cool

[spring light]

tfw dragons are just highly corrupted sorcerers

[woven flint]

Dragons typically view themselves as above everything else, even deities lmao

[delicate owl]

And a dwarf here and there. (And a whole cult that is in almost every major city in faerun)

[prime basin]

I wasn’t saying they don’t worship tiamat or bahamut like king and queen simply that dragonborn worship bahamut more than tiamat

[spring light]

they do usually make their homes in mountaintops, so it's generally true

[woven flint]

Name at it again

[spring light]

Wakka wakka!

[woven flint]

It's almost like..
You're hinting at something 🤔

[stiff rock]

Does anyone know if drunken master monk is viable/actually good? I'm not sure if i should try it out

[woven flint]

It's definetly resource efficient

As to if it's good or not?
It can be, yeah

[knotty pasture]

Drunken Master is bad but most things work at casual tables so go for it

[woven flint]

I wouldn't say it's BAD, as that feels a bit disingenuous
Kensei Monk is bad
Old elements monk is Bad
Drunken Monk is middling ground

[spring light]

at my tables i try to make whatever my players want to play work

[halcyon forum]

Drunken master has a couple of issues sadly. I am not a big fan of the alchemist flavoring of the latest UA but if playtest stuff is allowed, its decent

[knotty pasture]

I put Kensei as second best, Drunken Master and Four Elements are the only two Monk subclasses in 2014 I'd tell people to tread with caution

[halcyon forum]

Kensei is great wdym (with 2014 monk at least)

[delicate owl]

No idea what you're talking abouuuutttt

[woven flint]

Ehhhh..

[knotty pasture]

Truth be told its true power comes from guns

[halcyon forum]

2014 Kensei is the only monk subclass that can compete in damage with an optimised fighter

[knotty pasture]

But it'll work with a longbow

[woven flint]

I like all Monk subclasses as I'm a diehard Monk-lover for life
But Kensei just feels.. meh

[halcyon forum]

Zen archer is so fun

[knotty pasture]

It doesn't feel very Monk like when you really think about it ig

Its less about punching and more about gunslinging

[halcyon forum]

I think the mobility and using ki to turn misses into hits feels on brand enough for a martial artist archer

[lyric viper]

I've seen/had:

• a gnome artificer married to her work (her thunder cannon) (literally she'd introduced the gun as her wife)
• seen a tragic CG cleric / CE cambion doomed affair
• centaur cleric / shadarkai witch nonconventional realtionship
• a lg guard and his cg werecat boyfriend
• so many queerplatonic relationships between pcs.

[halcyon forum]

like, a fighter cant casually walk up a wall to get a better angle at the enemy with their bow

[prime basin]

you can get cover though

[severe rampart]

Gnome artificer reminds me of Entrapta from She-Ra

[knotty pasture]

Now I'm really interested in making my self insert PC's Monk subclass as Kensei

[halcyon forum]

sharpshooter

[spring light]

will it be an aasimar?

[knotty pasture]

Sadly no it'll be a Gnome

[spring light]

gnomish aasimar?

[halcyon forum]

also, that was the whole point. a zen archer can reposition to get a better shot

[knotty pasture]

Sure let's go with that

[woven flint]

My Goliath Elements Monk was a Lawful Good individual
His husband is a Chaotic Evil Demon

They make it work though

[marble lion]

Selfinsert?

[knotty pasture]

Rapier + Gun/Longbow feels very much like that pirate aesthetic I can vibe with

[spring light]

my aasimar is a gnomish aasimar

[prime basin]

can’t believe the enemy npc has the sharpshooter feat

[knotty pasture]

As in this PC is designed based off me as a person irl lol

[spring light]

i wanted gnome size, but aasimar traits

[knotty pasture]

Minus the Gnome part I think I just have a soft spot for Gnomes

[marble lion]

Youre a pirate gnome martial artist? oh ok

[woven flint]

I'm a gnome hater

[marble lion]

Just a pirate martial artist then

[prime basin]

I also do not play small species

[spring light]

huzzah for lil folk!

[knotty pasture]

Kensei Monk with a rapier + gun really does feel pirate-y

[woven flint]

No, I just hate Gnomes

[prime basin]

Gmomes

[knotty pasture]

Especially when Kensei's really focused on shooting people, why bring gun to a knifefight eh

[spring light]

is it their.... everything about them?

[prime basin]

Not a gnelf, not a gnoblin

[woven flint]

Well, it's not a hate as much as it is.. a disliking

[marble lion]

I dont mind short races, as long as its not gnomes, deep gnomes, halflings, kender or any other human-ish one that isnt dwarf

[halcyon forum]

so you are saying the fighter can get cover easier than a monk??

[spring light]

personality, appearance...?

[knotty pasture]

Fairies let's go

[marble lion]

Dwarves are cool

[lyric viper]

Unfortunately for the cleric/cambion in my game the cambion genuinely did like the cleric but only knew how to help in his own ways- such as kidnapping a local lord, trying to manipulate laws and politics to benefit the cleric, tried to set the cleric up with a well off noble woman which eventually all backfired and the cleric has to declare the cambion exiles and kill on aight or he and he town could be the target of the viscounts retribution

[prime basin]

Yes it has cover because of its plate armor

take that monks

sorry wrong person

[prime basin]

@halcyon forum yes this is my response

[woven flint]

They and Dwarves feel like Gnomes and Dwarves in every other portrayals in Media

But Dwarves are Dwarves and Dwarves are neat

[knotty pasture]

Dwarven Thrower

[halcyon forum]

thats...huh? the move speed alone makes it always easier for monks to be in cover at the end of their turn. like, its not even a competition

[prime basin]

Dwarfs* if we are talking warhammer

[spring light]

is it the manic pixie energy thing?

[humble cairn]

Kensei is great flavor for those who practice the way of the blade.

[prime basin]

imagine needing to move when you can just carry concrete walls because you are so strong

I AM THE WALL

[halcyon forum]

ok you are just trolling got it

[woven flint]

No, I mean, I think the subclass is bad

[humble cairn]

Hey, I resemble that remark!

[humble cairn]

Why? It works perfectly fine.

[woven flint]

I'll make an exception this once!

[prime basin]

Of course, why would i not when you make your npcs have sharpshooter

[knotty pasture]

The only bad ones are Drunken Master and Four Elements fr fr

[spring light]

my gnome very much hits the gnome tropes

[halcyon forum]

I misunderstood what you said because it didnt make sense

[humble cairn]

Drunken Master was also great, wdym?

[knotty pasture]

I'd even say Sun Soul is more fun than good but not yet treading into bad territory

[woven flint]

I'd play a Deep Gnome over a regular gnome, though

[halcyon forum]

sun soul is the worst I thought we all knew

[humble cairn]

I love Svirfneblin!

[woven flint]

Deep Gnomes being sullen and serious little guys, my little Svirfneblin..

[spring light]

i lean into the gnome tropes intentionally to make the character kind of groanworthy as they're intended to be perceived as one of those insufferable youtube idols

[prime basin]

also the only previous message I saw was the one i replied to so i have no context for what you were actually typing

[knotty pasture]

I put Sun Soul as bottom 3

[prime basin]

four elements was pretty bad

[halcyon forum]

yes but sun soul was worse

[prime basin]

Probably, never played 2014 monk

[woven flint]

I dunno
At least sunsoul could do its thing consistently

[valid geyser]

I based my opinion on four elements on my false belief that monks didn’t get back ki on a short rest in 2014, even now that they do I can’t think they’re very good at most levels

[prime basin]

at least they aren’t rangers

[woven flint]

You'd need way more Focus then they give ya tbh

[valid geyser]

I’d say rangers are still better than 2014 monks

[knotty pasture]

Monk has nothing against Ranger lol

[humble cairn]

If you're playing in 2024, you'd upgrade to the current Warrior of Elements Monk anyway, much better.

[prime basin]

so real

[valid geyser]

Yeah I agree warrior of elements is pretty alright

[halcyon forum]

four elements monk was not too far away from being decent. mostly adjusting ki cost and maybe learning a couple more things

[knotty pasture]

Ranger slander needs to stop especially when its 2014 😔

[severe rampart]

Ranger sucks except for Gloomstalkers

[woven flint]

Warrior of Elements is stellar
And this is coming from a guy that hates element focused subclasses

[valid geyser]

I only really have nitpicks and taste issues with it, such as not liking how late it gets resistance and its main thing being reach which is toe stepping on astral self a bit
But I still like it

[halcyon forum]

not true

[knotty pasture]

Swarmkeeper's pretty strong

[severe rampart]

Oh yeah, forgot that existed

[halcyon forum]

beastmaster, drakewarden, swarmkeeper, hunter and fey wanderer are all decent in 2014 rules

[woven flint]

Oh boy another Ranger argument is about to happen, I can feel it in my bones

[knotty pasture]

Idk how Monk discourse can somehow tie back to Ranger again

Soon we'll also talk about why Warlock is a mistake too

[prime basin]

2014 ranger had goated rp abilities compared to 2024

[valid geyser]

I think it’s at least interesting that 2014 tried to balance rangers mediocre class kit by giving them strong subclasses, but i think it just kinda made them multiclass merchants

[severe rampart]

My first ever character (technically) was a ranger, it was the strongest of the party, because the party was level 1 and the others were beginners in DnD and was constantly fighting each other

[severe rampart]

What bones? you're not a gelatinous cube like the rest of us?

[halcyon forum]

rangers were always strong in tier 1

[prime basin]

you don’t like my shadow monk gloomstalker rogue gameplay?

[halcyon forum]

even with just the 2014 PHB

[valid geyser]

The game would be better if multiclassing didn’t exist

[prime basin]

I assume tier one refers to levels 1-5?

[halcyon forum]

yes

[prime basin]

factually wrong

[severe rampart]

Mmm.... I dunno, I disagree

[humble cairn]

Beast Master 2014 was rough on action economy, unless you're talking with Tasha's patch.

[halcyon forum]

yeah I meant tashas

[woven flint]

Just don't allow it at your tables

It doesn't have to exist if you don't want it to for your groups

[valid geyser]

I don’t hold this as strongly as i did in the past, but i still think if the game wasn’t designed around multiclass tier 1 classes could get strong class defining features at level 1

[barren panther]

I require an in game reason for multiclassing at my table

[valid geyser]

I meant from a game design angle instead of a per table angle

[humble cairn]

Multiclassing is noticeably more difficult in 2024, they de-incentivized dips.

[prime basin]

laughs in fighter and warlock paladins

[valid geyser]

True, which is a good thing, i just remember thinking id still prefer if most classes got their main gimmicks at level 1 instead of 3

[woven flint]

I think Wizards and Sorcerers who multi-class for Armor are COWARDS

[humble cairn]

Well that's not any more incentivized, anyway. It used to be all Hexblade dips.

[prime basin]

sure nothing has become more incentivized i guess

[valid geyser]

Thinking about it now, I’m not super sure i fully agree with my past take, except for some stuff like cunning action and metamagic. Those would be much nicer at level 1

[humble cairn]

Expertise and Innate Sorcery do seem to be pretty thematic for those classes.

[halcyon forum]

if they remove multiclassing, they better start making a lot of general feats and a bunch of origin feats that lets one poach some stuff from other classes via feat

[humble cairn]

I feel like Innate Sorcery is more thematic for what Sorcerer is supposed to be about than metamagic.

[woven flint]

Cunning Action and Meta-Magic being level 2 is very intentional, I feel

[knotty pasture]

Just pick Tortle or Mountain Dwarf, ez

[valid geyser]

They are, i just think level 1 rogues in combat are kinda sad to play, dont have experience with innate sorcery tho

[prime basin]

man that innate sorcerer ability is absolutely busted

[woven flint]

Nah, I'd just deal with the low AC

[valid geyser]

I think 2024 should’ve done more to sorcerer subclasses to have innate sorcery related features

[humble cairn]

Certainly makes Sorcerer stand out as a class rather than just being Wizard lite.

[halcyon forum]

most classes have very sad level 1 states

[knotty pasture]

Its still interesting that by lore, the race that doesn't have anything much to do with arcane magic end up being one of the best races to run Wizard as (Mountain Dwarf)

[prime basin]

sorcerer was pretty much on par with wizard in 2014, now its objectively just better minus missing a few wizard spells

[knotty pasture]

+2 int +2 con with medium armor proficiency just sounds wicked

[valid geyser]

Disagree, but even then I don’t know if that should be a great thing

But I do understand if it might make level 1 a little bloated

[humble cairn]

It's offensively stronger in combat, sure, but that's not automatically better.

[woven flint]

It's almost like you're supposed to feel weak at the beginning so leveling up actually feels more impactful because you're feeling yourself getting stronger 🤔

[knotty pasture]

I'd say Wizard > Sorc even in 2014, the strongest Wizard subclasses beat the strongest Sorc subclasses

[humble cairn]

Can we just not with "X class is better than Y class?" It's really not helpful.

[valid geyser]

I don’t really think that’s the intent. Level 1 characters want to be seen as mostly realized characters, but the game math makes them relatively squishy

[humble cairn]

Level 1 characters want to be seen as mostly realized characters? Since when?

[valid geyser]

But even then, thinking about it I probably might not even want stuff like all subs at level 1. It would mean classes make close to no progression choices after

[woven flint]

I think it's completely the intent.
Level 1's are Novice adventurers honing their skills.

[prime basin]

well of course, but it also has access to a lot more spells that were specific to wizards which made the wizards so much better at utility in the first place

[woven flint]

Level 1 is SUPPOSED to feel rough as it reflects starting the path of becoming a true adventurer

[undone rain]

We usually start at level 3. Subclasses at start yk

[valid geyser]

This is not B/X. 5e isn’t supposed to be a baby sea turtle sim. a level 1 character is already stronger than the average person

[halcyon forum]

this is fine for veterans but not really helpful to make the game enjoyable for new players

[prime basin]

every stage of the game should feel rough optimally, level 1 just has the benefit of being boring

[knotty pasture]

That brings me back, one of the first fights in Descent Into Avernus as a level 1 iirc

[halcyon forum]

you know, the people most likely to play at level 1 at all

[spring light]

...why should level 1 be particularly rough or boring?

[woven flint]

I'm a veteran player at this point and I hate level 1 play 😭

[valid geyser]

Also the earliest level in a game you’re always gonna be considered the least survivable
A 5e level 1 is like, three times tougher than a first edition level 1

[halcyon forum]

I think level 1 should be about as deadly and exciting as level 5, 10, 20 etc

[spring light]

i consider myself something of a veteran, and i honestly prefer lower levels

[humble cairn]

1st level characters are one errant crit away from death. It's stressful in a way that can be fun in a certain mindset.

[knotty pasture]

As long as its low stakes

[swift wren]

Oh someone hit a nerve, people are writing

[knotty pasture]

Eh? I think everyone's chill in chat

[prime basin]

another reason why level 1 sucks

[valid geyser]

Yeah that statement seemed rather contradictory to the statement I’ve heard people say where level 1 and 2 are “tutorial levels”
And I don’t wanna act like the goomba meme. Not the same person saying both these things. Just noticed that

[spring light]

...isn't it really gonna come down to each particular table?

[halcyon forum]

level 1 and 2 are tutorial levels as the game was designed. I just think thats a bad thing

[woven flint]

I think level 1 should indeed be more interesting, but I also feel like it makes sense when you start your journey being weak

Because if you were never weak, then how could you get strong?

[swift wren]

DnD is high and power fantasy in general, I truly think 3 to 8 is the sweet spot for me personally. If I want to go lower, I usually play a OSR game that fullfills the things I am really looking for.

[knotty pasture]

Unfortunately just because something is at a tutorial level doesn't mean that the table has to respect it, maybe that's where the dissoance is coming from

[valid geyser]

And maybe my idea won’t even solve anything. Playing enough of early level in any game is gonna get boring

[spring light]

_> as a player i don't find current d&d to be paritcularly engaging.

[knotty pasture]

Could just set up challenging fights at level 1-2 and bam TPK

[spring light]

regardless of level

[woven flint]

I can also agree with that

[spring light]

as a dm? i am 100% fine and happy to run current d&d

[valid geyser]

I do need to play in person with a good group to really love playing 5e d&d

But otherwise it interests me just enough to be invested

[spring light]

yeah, playing in person makes it more enjoyable.

the one game i sat as a player it was fun enough. not fun enough for me to keep wanting to sit as a player.

[prime basin]

I think playing in person offers better socializing but vtt usually makes for a better “cinematic” experience

[crimson gulch]

i disagree, im far more of a cinematic presentor in person than i am online

though i must say its better now with a wireless headset so i can get up and move and act without literealy being tied down

[marble lion]

My favourite level is 1 or 2, depending on character

Halfcasters, its 2 because before then youre a featureless martial

[feral fulcrum]

I'm a hater of anything below level 3

[crimson gulch]

i love level 1 starts, i will allways start my campaigns there

[bronze wave]

I like lvl3 its a general subclass for most, its not to powerful but has enough ti make a real char imo

[marble lion]

I love the feeling of being kinda not special

[knotty vine]

I don’t like starting at level 2

[marble lion]

Its an escape from life where excelling and standing out is expected

Just a guy, doing stuff, lil quest

Its like the ratatouille scene

[knotty vine]

I will never forget the time someone convinced the dm to start us at level 0

[marble lion]

Awesome

[prime basin]

i thought this was normal?

[marble lion]

But definitely not everyones thing

[marble lion]

No definitely not the norm

[knotty vine]

How is starting at level 0 the norm?

[prime basin]

Isn’t level zero where you fight the tarrasque?

[humble cairn]

There's no such thing in the rules as level 0.

[spring light]

yes.

[feral fulcrum]

Level zero is where you die to a Cat

[prime basin]

indeed, you start out a cr zero animal instead

[crimson gulch]

i have done that once, was super fun, will do it again

[feral fulcrum]

Not a big cat, just your common house kitty.

[crimson gulch]

it was the players idea too

[prime basin]

I would imagine so if he was the one convincing the dm

[marble lion]

If a dm ever seriously has a cat deal meaningful damage to someone outside a joke quest, im having words

Having owned many cats, i dont care what the statblock says, unless dnd is implying its cats are supercats?

[prime basin]

what if its a superhero cat?

[marble lion]

Wait are dnd cats like our cats?

[prime basin]

no their intelligence stats are too high

[knotty vine]

How dumb would it be to make my inflect wounds do slashing instead of necrotic

[marble lion]

Animals unless specified are just mundane animals like ours right?

[marble lion]

Sectum sempra

[knotty vine]

Cleave

[prime basin]

i feel like sectum sempra is steel wind strike

[marble lion]

That was your cue to say "you dare use my own spells against me?"

[severe rampart]

Good Evening Urizt

[prime basin]

“I am the half-no blood prince”

[knotty vine]

Dismantle

[severe rampart]

how would that work

[knotty vine]

I don’t know I threw a chair at the dm before we started

[severe rampart]

level 0: Peasant

[prime basin]

“from the top turnbuckle”

[spring light]

why? when you can just get up and leave saying "this isn't the game for me"

[knotty vine]

Chairs are fun to throw

[prime basin]

Because it is more fun

[crimson gulch]

Morning, 9am here in the snow cover prairies

[glossy otter]

what in sam hill did I walk into lol

[prime basin]

colorado activities perhaps?

[spring light]

assault is fun?

[knotty vine]

It was a prop chair he’s fine mostly

[prime basin]

dnd smackdown airs only on thursdays

[severe rampart]

interesting, it is 12:00am here, was just wondering actually, you use Owlbear right? anything else you use to help with your gameplay?

[knotty vine]

I keep a lot of breakable items to throw at people

I own 21 breakable glass bottles

[glossy otter]

dnd raw still on mondays?

[marble lion]

Sounds fun

[crimson gulch]

I Run my online games 100% on paper just like my in person ones

[marble lion]

The chances of dying to a prop are low

[prime basin]

no it got cancelled because people were bored with everything being raw

[knotty vine]

But do be warned never aim for the face area less you wanna get stuff in your eyes

[marble lion]

But never zero

[prime basin]

sometimes you gotta change raw up yknow

[severe rampart]

interesting! with how much you were advocating for Owlbear I would've thought you frequent it!

[crimson gulch]

Yes, owlbear is used just for maps and tokens and dice

[marble lion]

I do the same

[crimson gulch]

But all the game, hit points monsters plots, none of that uses any digital tools

[severe rampart]

Yeah, along with extensions for that sweet sweet dynamic lighting!

[crimson gulch]

Nope I don't use that

[marble lion]

I cry again

[crimson gulch]

Slapping a map in owlbear takes 10 seconds, dynamic light setup is to much prep

[severe rampart]

yeah but I don't want to spoil the secret room in ||Curse of Strahd|| for my players

[feral fulcrum]

GordenRamsay.RAW.Gif goes here.

[dark pewter]

I wouldn't imagine dynamic lighting being very useful around the table, but hiding/cutting fog could be

Dynamic lighting is very good for online play, if you have the patience to set it up

[crimson gulch]

neitehr do i, the fog of war tool works fine

[severe rampart]

Yeah! mostly for dungeons

[crimson gulch]

in fact the one time i used dynamic lighting is when things got spoiled early as folks saw things they did not hit yet

when im in controll with the fog tool, its just like at the table, no one sees it untill i show it and no flub of the tech is going to let things slip

[severe rampart]

You can manually hide tokens iirc?

[crimson gulch]

i cant stand how VTTs work in general, like i was watching a streamed game and the heros confronted the big bad, and they instantly saw in foundry, "doppleganger" rolled for initative

yes, you can hide tokens but it was something on the map they had seen

[severe rampart]

Ah, well that's just awful prep

naming the thing "Doppelganger" aint wise either

[crimson gulch]

that was its stat block in foundry, it was a doppleganger

[severe rampart]

ahh, i get it

[noble tusk]

You can usually hide such things from the players with toggle options in VTT

[severe rampart]

I am getting to the point of just using paper for my character sheets

[crimson gulch]

this is the best way

[severe rampart]

No restrictions, can put whatever I want, oh it's so freeing

[crimson gulch]

im actualy setting up a rig to broadcast a livestream of my table with miniatures and terrain for my online games

[severe rampart]

so permanently/semi-permanently removing the VTTs?

[crimson gulch]

yep

[severe rampart]

that is very interesting! I've not seen anyone do that

[crimson gulch]

one of the top rated Dungeonmasters on SPG does that for all his games and i played in a game of his and was like, yep this is it

[severe rampart]

You must be part of the top in SPG

[crimson gulch]

im getting there, i am very new to the platform still. i have been running professional games in person for 3 years, and on SPG for 5 months

i have ran 56 paid session on SPG in that time

[umbral girder]

I am amused how Dragons rarely devoted to Tiamat and Bahamut.

Also sorry for replying to an old message it was the first thing on my screen.

[crimson gulch]

all my campaigns on SPG are fully booked too, so thats nice

[knotty vine]

why would they be?

[swift wren]

Oh thats nice, I usually also bring just a ton of minis to paid games because people are going wild for them :) I only do one-off thingies for corporate and birthdays and similar, but having haptic and other senses in a game is great.

[knotty vine]

i mean its like yeah you made me cool

you dont see all drows kneeling at alters before loath

[dark pewter]

I mean, there are a lot of drow that devote to Lolth

[glossy otter]

Ngl I do like the concept of the Dark Seladrine, where they're all not CE but rather varying on which god one venerates

[knotty vine]

not all of them

[dark pewter]

Sure, but the comparison made was that so few dragons devote to Tiamat/Bahamut, not an "all or nothing" observation

[severe rampart]

I hope to reach a level of skill where players would willingly pay for a session lol, maybe then I could afford physical books

[knotty vine]

that can be said for most gods and there creations like Corellon Larethian

[swift wren]

The group plays, the group pays. In general, buy books for ttrpg stuff together, its not the gms job to do so.

[crimson gulch]

a lot of professional dms out there are normal folks that run the game well, but what makes them professionals is the fact they can be consistant and say the Session is at X time on X day and the show must go on, so many casual dms just cant keep that consistancy

[valid geyser]

I guess the main thing with dragons is that they’re isolated creatures, so it’s hard to imagine them in organized religion

[knotty vine]

i was gonna use humans as an example but no one knows where humans came from in dnd

[prime pewter]

Just asked my dm if my new GOOlock (character died last session)'s patron could he an elder brain!

[glossy otter]

Ngl I do find it funny that the dark seladrine has one good god in contrast to the others, just a flip to most pantheons

[woven flint]

I know right?
But, it also makes a bit of sense, I suppose?
No dragon truly wants to admit that there are powers way above them

[umbral girder]

Also they are all bordering on godhood themselves

[knotty vine]

pretty sure most metallic dragons at least admire bahamut

[glossy otter]

Looks at the greatwyrms

[umbral girder]

If the First world and Greatwyrm theory is to be believed

[woven flint]

Absolutely, most of them hold him to high honor

[umbral girder]

Even if Greatwyrm’s are close to Godhood but not there yet

[severe rampart]

Ah, that and the currency difference, iirc, SPG only deals in USD

[glossy otter]

Wasn't one of them if all of the gem greatwyrms came together they'd recreate Sardior?

[knotty vine]

it takes more then pure power to be a god unless your the lady of pain of course

[umbral girder]

An example is the former God of Death/Entropy Null being demoted into becoming a Greatwyrm

[umbral girder]

Yep! That Sardior isn’t dead but needs to be put back together

[severe rampart]

Is Lady of Pain like the Satoru Gojo of DnD

[crimson gulch]

oh man i love the currency difference, by the time that gets changed to loonies im getting paid a lot

[woven flint]

The Lady of Pain might honestly be ABOVE godhood, at least in her domain

[glossy otter]

I forget, what exactly killed Sardior?

[umbral girder]

It’s mixed.

[knotty vine]

almost but she isnt even a human/creature

[glossy otter]

Wasn't one theory Tharizdun?

[umbral girder]

Some say Tiamat did that in her rampage.

Some say the Gods did when they invaded the Material plane which made Tiamat rampage

[woven flint]

The Lady of Pain is less of an indiviual than she is a FORCE of being

[severe rampart]

Oh darn I thought they only dealt in american currency, if I do get that set up I could get like... 3.6k per session in my currency holy moly

[knotty vine]

she just is a force of nature rather then a being

[severe rampart]

That could help pay my education, hopefully!

[crimson gulch]

there are a huge amount of international players and DM's on spg

[glossy otter]

That reminds me, that giant oblivion god needs more love XD

[umbral girder]

basically Bahamut, Tiamat, and I think Sardior made the Material plane. The gods decided it was cool and invaded.
Tiamat fought to defend their home, Sardior died, Bahamut changed teams.

[dark pewter]

Yeah, running on SPG is very much a buyer's market from what I've seen. If you're consistent and put effort into your work, you tend to draw clients pretty easily.

[knotty vine]

i do think the lady of pain can be "killed" in a way but thats only if you somehow destory sigal

[dark pewter]

Many folks just want a consistently scheduled game to play in

[umbral girder]

And their material plane and their dragon children got shattered into different worlds.

[woven flint]

Good luck even trying to destory Sigil
Vecna tried to take over Sigil once upon a time and the LOP kicked his ass

Which, frankly, isn't surprising

[umbral girder]

She did the Minecraft kill command on Vecna

[knotty vine]

vecna was strong enough to where the lady thought he was a threat

[umbral girder]

Not really. More that he decided to become a god in a place where gods aren’t allowed (aka in Sigil)

[severe rampart]

I am curious though, how would you even get started if you have no history of using it?

[umbral girder]

The classic blunder in Vecna’s part.

[woven flint]

Considering LOP can just DESTROY any Gods that enter her domain, its probably less of her viewing Vecna as a threat and moreso viewing him as a nuiscance

[swift wren]

Stream games, publish games, blogs, websites and similar helped me a lot :)

[knotty vine]

he was going to force his way into sigal and the lady deemed him too dangerous to fight without destorying sigal right then and there

[valid geyser]

I mean vecna didn’t just go in head first. It was a specific plan to take over sigil while the lady of pain was out of the picture

[umbral girder]

Vecna “I will change the multiverse! In Sigil!”
The Lady : left in read
Vecna “and I will now become a god in Sigil!”
the Lady immediately arrives

[crimson gulch]

absolutly, the fact that i cancel less than 2% of my sessions is a huge point

[swift wren]

I think we are killing the vibe a bit, could fit into #dm-discussion much better regarding making money as DM

[umbral girder]

He was already in Sigil actually

[severe rampart]

you have gotten 360+ sessions last year

[glossy otter]

The Lady of Pain is typing....

[knotty vine]

and the only reason she was able to beat him was because in Die Vecna Die your party here helps

[umbral girder]

Lore accuarte.

[buoyant oar]

I signed up for start playing out of necessity I had lost my job due to [Topic not suitable for this server]

And about 20% of my players are organic pulls from there. The rest are people I have known for a long time.

[empty thicket]

considerating its his work, im not surprised

[woven flint]

But, also, this is the LOP we're talking about if you plan on becoming a deity in her domain, you should expect to die

[severe rampart]

still, hosting 7 games a week, every week for a year without burning out? that is impressive

[glossy otter]

I do like that Planescape does give a little nod to Vecna

[knotty vine]

this is vecna the unkillable

[umbral girder]

Vecna's main thing being "She can't see me."
The party "Hey look Vecna is RIGHT HERE!"

[empty thicket]

its other mindset too

[crimson gulch]

it was 9 games a week for about 3 months straight

[woven flint]

I think you overestimate the power of Vecna compared to the Lady of Pain

[crimson gulch]

trimmed it down to 7 now

[severe rampart]

How

[glossy otter]

I mean the lady of pain is essentially a dm in her own right

[umbral girder]

Well notably Vecna did have help from a being aroundd the Lady's power level (kinda)

[buoyant oar]

I would have probably a 3rd game on SPG if I wasn't running a Living Campaign on the side with 20 active PCs

[severe rampart]

No wait, I get it, Urizt is a lich and now is gathering undead minions

[umbral girder]

That was Asmodeus being the reason Vecna was not immediatly spotted.

[knotty vine]

y forcing him out of Sigil and neutralizing his threat to the multiverse. While she did not instantly destroy him due to his elevated divine power, she forced a stalemate,

[umbral girder]

Vecna was not the real threat to the Lady it was more Asmodeus doing a lot of heavy lifting behind the scenes for him

[knotty vine]

she didnt outright beat him out of Sigal without help from said party

Vecna was an greater god at the time wdym

[buoyant oar]

My games though don't have the same pull as others because I am a strictly no published Module Guy. All of my games are away from the Sword Coast and are custom meaning they require a lot more prep time.

[woven flint]

Lady of Pain is ABOVE even greater deities, don'tcha know?

[glossy otter]

Gotta love Azzy

[knotty vine]

yeah and the fact that vecna was not only able to enter Sigal but force the lady into a stalemate says something about him

[feral fulcrum]

I kind of hate that they went out of their way to hype up the Lady Of Pain as being above all despite entirely ignoring her for 10 years straight.

[buoyant oar]

If you like the Lady of Pain.

Please check out Troy Denning's Pages of Pain an official Planescape novel where the whole novel is told from Her POV. It is so good.

[woven flint]

You're acting as if Vecna was working alone, however he wasn't

[glossy otter]

I love that he's essentially the guy everyone hates but can't touch for one reason or another

[knotty vine]

well he wasnt

but the lady also wasnt only she had player party on her side

[umbral girder]

Yeah we had 1 guy try to mess with Asmodeus and now he is cursed to always turn into an Imp when he arrives in Hell.

[woven flint]

Truly...

[knotty vine]

better then being a Lemure

[umbral girder]

Most of Planescape pretty much.

Actually most D&D stuff in general I suppose. Since they are meant to be threads for DMs to play with.

[umbral girder]

Ah the 2nd worst devil in the Hierarchy.

[knotty vine]

pretty sure lemure's are just the worst?

what else is below them?

[glossy otter]

"That'll teach you to be impish with me" - Asmodeus most likely

[buoyant oar]

Pages of Pain also gives a cool power to the Lady of Pain.

She is invisible even to True Sight when her feet touch the ground

[feral fulcrum]

Her and Sigil being mentioned in Wish was entirely uneeded and feels like entirely unneeded ass-kissing.

[woven flint]

I think its hilarious and therefore a fun addition

[knotty vine]

one thing i love in plots of anything is "the enemy of my enemy is my friend"

and that can apply to heaven and hell in dnd in this case

[woven flint]

Imagine wishing to rule Sigil and LOP appears in your mind, Mogs on you and your wish doesn't work
That's COMICAL

[feral fulcrum]

I think it was a side-blurb that should have just been in the Planescape book. Instead of just adding more word bloat to an already "Woops this is a Paragraph." Word block.

[umbral girder]

Nupperibo. They are so disliked their souls weren't even worth being currency.

Lemure's are considered more valuable assets than them.

[buoyant oar]

She can see mental and emotional and invisible pain as lesions and boils upon the residents of Sigil.

She occasionally opens them to letting the pain out.

[knotty vine]

nupperibos languished at the absolute bottom of the baatezu hierarchy[12]—if one ignored lemures

Lemures are still the lowest

[feral fulcrum]

That reminds me, wasn't there a mixup with MTG D&D Art that mixed up giant Lemures and Lemurs?

[west sail]

Does anyone care if I use d&d beyond & roll20 on my phone??

[empty thicket]

Seeing demons and angels have a truce for fight the aliens would be so dope

[feral fulcrum]

Strangers on the internet don't care what you use. Ask your table.

[knotty vine]

thats already the case but its devils and angels

[umbral girder]

Ask your group

[woven flint]

"Nupperibo. No soul is turned away from the Nine Hells, but the truly worthless—those whose evil acts in life arose from carelessness and sloth more than anything else—are suitable only to become nupperibos. These pitiful creatures shuffle mindlessly across the landscape: blind, bloated from unquenchable hunger, and groping for whatever scraps of fetid matter or swarming vermin they can scoop into their groaning mouths."

[knotty vine]

the case was in 1e-2eish when the bloodwar was first mentioned it was mainly the forces of heaven fighting the demons

[glossy otter]

yep, and it became a running gag for 3 cards

[umbral girder]

Mordenkainen even states as much that Nupperibos are an active step down for devils that don't deal with the Hierarchy (which Lemures are part of)

[glossy otter]

I love that in that book it notes that it's still dissapointing if an imp managed to get an army of them

[knotty vine]

the abyss didnt just change the angels it courrpted them and when they wanted to get back into heaven they were denied acess so a god made the hell we know and love in dnd 5e and the devils are still down there fighting the blood war

[woven flint]

Nupperibos are the Reddit Moderators of Devils

[glossy otter]

Adds up

Though I do love the concept of the blood war being the only reason neither side was annihilated

[knotty vine]

and i think Asmodeus was once an angel/solar at one point

[delicate owl]

Hmm, I should do more lore research I suppose

[umbral girder]

Asmodeus was an angel but was above things like a Solar.

[glossy otter]

I think it was an angel in that iteration

[knotty vine]

He and his angels became corrupted by the evil they fought, gradually transforming into devils to better battle demons.

[woven flint]

Lore is fun

[glossy otter]

I don't think it was specific

[umbral girder]

Asmodeus is like the Lady of Pain of "Older than anyone can comprehend" entities.

[glossy otter]

Ngl I love that technically all and none of his backstories are canon

[knotty vine]

he was an archangel tasked with fighting the forces of abyss at first

[woven flint]

Asmodeus and Lady of Pain sometimes play Poker once a millennium to catch up

[knotty vine]

in 5e maybe not but allyou really need to go is go back a few editions

[glossy otter]

It's because his lore contradicts in multiple editions, but one of them I think stated he enjoyed the fact nobody could figure it out

[woven flint]

The main problem with Older Edition Lore now is that it isn't consistent to lore now lots of times, Separate editions are
Separate Editions for a reason

[knotty vine]

true

[umbral girder]

Yeah WOTC did state that each edition, novel, movie, game, etc is considered it's own continuity.

[marble lion]

Wow thats dark compared to the usual

[knotty vine]

5e never really goes in depth with its lore through

[umbral girder]

Pretty much the Star Wars Legends approach.

[knotty vine]

thats my only ick with it

[glossy otter]

Ngl one of the greatest questions i have is if the Queen of Chaos is still considered a demon lord because the 2024 dm's guide established her as an elder evil

[empty thicket]

A too big world, too much things going on so its expected there is inconsistencies

[marble lion]

Oh its old lore

[umbral girder]

Could she be both?

After all many creatures in the game got double ranks.

[woven flint]

Lots of Greater Deities are now Lesser Deities

Species lore has definitely changed (mostly for the better, being progressive and all)

And some things just aren't brought to the newer editions

[glossy otter]

fair, though it does give me another question. Was she always in that role or did she evolve to that status

[umbral girder]

Like Tiamat and Asmodeus being Gods and Archdevils, or Lolth is Goddess and Demon Lord. Could one be an Elder Evil and a Demon Lord?

[knotty vine]

i mean asmodeus is a god and an archdevil so why not

[woven flint]

Most definitely, methinks

[knotty vine]

he was an archangel that remained true i think

[woven flint]

I feel like the roles definetly aren't mutually exclusive for Extraplanar individuals

[glossy otter]

the more I think about it, how is it that aberrations haven't gotten a lot in recent times (asides from mind flayers)

[knotty vine]

Various myths claim that Asmodeus, has existed since the dawn of time. Perhaps most intriguing among the myths is the Serpent of Law. In it, Asmodeus was initially named Ahriman and, together with his rival Jazirian, created the outer realms. Their conflict led both deities to become severely wounded, and Asmodeus lost the exchange by landing in the Nine Hells. Here, he used his allies and own strength to banish the previous inhabitants and become what he remains today—Overlord of the Nine Hells.

[woven flint]

I mean
The Queen of Chaos is Obyrith in nature, which is an outsider

Though in 4e they were...Elemental for some reason?

[umbral girder]

Dragons were Elementals too in 4e

[woven flint]

4e was a strange state

[umbral girder]

Which I guess makes sense kinda.

Dragons and Giants do got their Elemental powers after all.

[knotty vine]

what about orges

[glossy otter]

4e I find suprising because it gave more to QoC but just explaining how she 'technically' made the abyss

[prime pewter]

Does a Snake or Skeleton Familiar sound better for this Lizardfolk-adjacent dragonborn GOOlock? (This is 2024 rules)

[umbral girder]

Ogres aren't part of the Giant Ordning

[glossy otter]

what about both, a skeleton snake

[prime pewter]

Mini bone naga

[glossy otter]

I mean I couldn't see why not if it's just a reflavoured snake or skeleton

[prime pewter]

Yea. I kinda wanna go with snake, lemme see its abilities

[delicate owl]

I need ti do some on stuff involving Cosmo in eve of ruin

[glossy otter]

Though looking back at older editions, it's funny seeing how different characters such as Miska looked between 2nd and 5th edition

[umbral girder]

Vlaaktih's changing designs is amusing.

From heavy metal cover to "sick githyanki cosplay"

[prime pewter]

Wow. Underwhelming. I'll ask my dm if I could have a flying snake as a familiar

[normal canyon]

Rah

[glossy otter]

Miska just went from shirtless drider man to a chitinous abomination with wolf heads

[prime pewter]

Psedodragons are kinda scary with Investment of the Chain Master. (The DC part)

[glossy otter]

Though it does make me think, what other obscure demon lords need a makeover?

[atomic kayak]

Most of them tbh

[prime pewter]

Please give my boy Dagon some love (not super obscure but)

[atomic kayak]

A lot of early stuff is. Very silly looking

[glossy otter]

Give us a demonomicon Wotc

[knotty vine]

i already made one wdym

[glossy otter]

I kinda walked into that one XD

[undone rain]

How does one get the jack of all trades role?

[knotty vine]

your both a dm and player

[undone rain]

Ah

Nevermind then

[main maple]

Hello dnd pals

[jolly agate]

Wsp mate

[proven forum]

Hi I'm new

What are the steps to join a play

[severe rampart]

first it's to learn how to play #learn-to-play

then, you can go ahead and look at listings in #looking-for-players

[proven forum]

I understand how to play

I just don't know if anyone wants me to join

[severe rampart]

#looking-for-players can help

[normal canyon]

Read and memorize every single rule, spell, damage dice, attack, class features, weapons, feats, boons, items, monsters, and everything else and ur set

Or just memorize the core rules

[proven forum]

Do you have to buy the dice

[normal canyon]

No

[proven forum]

Or is there a app or link

[normal canyon]

Use any dice u want

[polar ember]

Ever just look back at your past actions and just wondered why you agreed to DM for a bunch of procrastinators?

[severe rampart]

Yes

[normal canyon]

No

[severe rampart]

wasted a week of my life

[polar ember]

I have never ever planned a campaign AND WAITED A WHOLE YEAR FOR THEM TO FINISH THEIR CHARACTERS JUST TO TELL ME THEY AINT DONE AND THE CAMPAIGN IS THIS SATURDAY

[severe rampart]

an actual year?

[polar ember]

Yea

[severe rampart]

It's frustrating to prepare so much for people that care so little

[normal canyon]

I don’t see a problem with that tho

[polar ember]

They picked the date and time 😭 if they picked it why they not done🤣

[normal canyon]

Then kick them

[severe rampart]

Ah, I see, my bad

[lyric viper]

Unfortunately sometimes having a lot of time means people are more likely to forget to do something rather than try and meet the deadline ahead of time.

You've still got some time to finalise things.

[polar ember]

It’s funny cause it’s a friends campaign 🤣 I am stuck with them lmaooo I don’t feel bad giving them a False Hydra side quest now

[sacred pilot]

Say, is it allowed to ask for printable hex grids in here? I wanna try a few different ones for my dnd game

[normal canyon]

Then don’t kick them

[polar ember]

I like how simple ur answers are ngl it’s straight to the point

[normal canyon]

Just make a character sheet for them if they haven’t finished it by the time the campaign starts.

[polar ember]

I might have to💀

[normal canyon]

And the give them a 6 ability score to everything

[lyric viper]

TBH I've done the same thing 😅
We knew that once we finished one game, that another DM would restart an old game. But kept going 'Ah, but we have time before this game ends' so kept putting off updating our characters to the new system.
Aaand it's also this Weekend >.>

So uh.. I guess I should go finish updating that character...

[polar ember]

I was gonna say that glad we on the same page🤣

[lyric viper]

In all honesty though, you genuinely still have time.

[polar ember]

Yea I am excited though using one of my OC in this campaign as a NPC

[lyric viper]

They have today and tomorrow to finalise their characters. So they need to do them now or not have a character to play. That's doable.

[normal canyon]

It’s only 10 minutes to make a character sheet.

If you memorized every class, race, background, and do ability score

[lyric viper]

Which is not necessary.

[polar ember]

I require a backstory from my players I like writing lores and character improvements

[normal canyon]

Use some clanker material for that then

[lyric viper]

Get on them. See if you can get them to answer some direct questions in chat. See if you can get them into a VC together.

[polar ember]

It’s okay I told them if I don’t get a character sheet and background soon I am driving to them and egging their house, and I meant it, they know from last campaign

I’ll crack a whip if I have to

I also bribed them, told them the first one to hand in a character sheet, I’ll recreate any food from an anime/game for them

[echo meteor]

okay

im a bit confused on getting picked up... if you are downed, and then you got picked up by healing word... do you still get your actions?

or do you have to wait until next round?

[polar ember]

You have ur bonus action and movement

[normal canyon]

Yooo a flying pickle

[echo meteor]

but no action? i thoguth it was purely a BG3 thing lol

[polar ember]

You also get your action yes

No action is a BG3 thing

[echo meteor]

so you can get downed, then picked up by a cleric before your turn starts.. and you have all your actioons?

[polar ember]

Yesh

[normal canyon]

[polar ember]

Again BG3 ROBBED US OF AN ACTIOOOOON

[echo meteor]

thats soo weird

[polar ember]

But when you get healed you are technically still proned, you’ll have to use half of ur movement to get back up

[echo meteor]

and once u get back up, you start swinging XD

[polar ember]

Exactly like this

[normal canyon]

Why do people always think I’m trolling.

[echo meteor]

you can have a zombie party where the monsters down your players, you revive them with 1hp, they take their turn... rinse and repeat lol

[normal canyon]

That’s how I got kicked from like 10 campaigns

[echo meteor]

?

[normal canyon]

Wut

[tidal bough]

Thats alot

[normal canyon]

Idk

[polar ember]

I would guess that some people don’t like simple answers and simple solutions

[tidal bough]

I think we're both confused on what you meant by people thinking youre trolling and getting kicked from 10 campaigns

Wait i read that wrong

[normal canyon]

It’s also how I have beef with 90% of the people I know, got banned from 19 discord servers, and smth else.

[tidal bough]

Oh wait no I didnt

[tidal bough]

Wym

[normal canyon]

Idk

[polar ember]

Like I said it’s cause ur blunt🤣 no offense

[normal canyon]

How fix

[opal wharf]

10 games and 19 discords id have a long look at how you are talking to people and how you converse with people

[normal canyon]

I can’t look at sound.

[polar ember]

This🤣

[lyric viper]

Going to be hard to give specific advice seeing as we're not part of those games, but might want to check things like that response.

Because that was a clearly dismissive response that seemed to intentionally misunderstand what someone was saying.

[tidal bough]

10 games and 19 discord servers is alot, even if 50% of them were decisions you made to leave its still a very large number

[normal canyon]

*0%

[tidal bough]

Granted that depends what course of time this took place over

[normal canyon]

Within 3 months (discord ever would be 4 tho)

[latent flare]

Hey - I hope I’m not interrupting a convo. I just wanted to talk about a struggle I’ve been having. D&D seems like such a cool game. But there’s a really high barrier-to-entry. Having friends. Does anyone know how to make friends who play d&d? I’ve tried going to cafes meant for random people to play together and everyone is very exclusive. How do I find playmates?

[normal canyon]

Talk to people.

[polar ember]

I am down to have more dnd sessions if you want to friend me

[tidal bough]

Would you be fine with online play?

[proven mountain]

Check out #dnd-newcomers it's the space for new players learning the game 🙂

[latent flare]

I cant send, please friend request me 🙂

[latent flare]

Absolutely!

[polar ember]

But just reach out to people like you are now, there’s also a #looking-for-players or #find-a-game to help you with that search

[tidal bough]

Check #find-a-game in that case and read through the different channels there/how it works

[lyric viper]

Getting a group together can be one of the first big hurdles for sure.

For online. I recommend looking out for newbie friendly games, oneshots (short games that last one session or so), and Adventure League (Organised play ⁠⁠al-general ), or westmarches (large servers where people run spontaneous games for players).

For in person, check out local gamestores, libraries and so on. Advertise a D&D game.

Or... kidnap some existing friends and run a quick oneshot for them, see how they like it >.>

These are all ways of meeting people quickly and playing with them, to see if you get along- think of it a little bit like speed dating. You want to know you all click before committing to a full game together for ages.

[normal canyon]

Kidnapping is illegal

[lyric viper]

Again, this response would be seen as rude/unhelpful because 1) it implies that was not already considered and 2) does not give any further advice.

[mossy spire]

its so annoying that my parents hate me and i cant vc becus i cant let them hear me talking becus they will get mad at me and maybe even take my stuff

[lyric viper]

If looking for reasons why folk might not be vibing with how you respond and see it as rude/trolling.

[proven mountain]

Sorry to hear that, hope you're doing well

[tidal bough]

Theres pbp/text based games aswell

Definitely sucks tho but just offering an alternative possibility

[proven mountain]

Yes! Text based play by post games would be a good option

[normal canyon]

What they said

[mossy spire]

i dont see any text based games and i would hate to ask on one that doesnt specify

[tidal bough]

Also yeah, theres a difference between being blunt and being rude, its normally determined by how useful the information being provided is

[tidal bough]

Check out #looking-for-community there's quite afew on there, theres also some that appear on the #looking-for-players sometimes

[marble lion]

If youre seen as too blunt by people, the solution is to be so nice it sickens you. Soften everything and compliment to the point you think it sounds patronising and sarcastic. If youre as blunt as it seems, and your experience is like mine, people will then think youre normal

This especially goes in extremely public servers where moderation is on the safe side

You dont mean harm. You may even mean well. But because you use direct words and people are used to being treated with sweetness, they think youre attacking or dismissing

I also recommend not using "." On short statements as it makes people read it in a cold finality

[mossy spire]

alright i guess i see some thank you

[marble lion]

Im still upset i got told off for that but it is what it is. Its a corpo server after all

[tidal bough]

Johnny Silverhand Intensifies

[marble lion]

That is very silverhand indeed

[polar ember]

Well maybe not overdue the compliments to the point it sound almost sarcastic, you don’t have to be extremely nice just have common sense on what is and is not rude to say. Say it twice in your head and if you have to question if something is okay to say or not then it’s probably better not to say them

[knotty vine]

This server is something sometimes

[iron herald]

Wait, you got told off for using periods at the end of sentences, or am I misreading?

[marble lion]

I may have exaggerated just a little bit because as i said i am still upset

[polar ember]

You’re good Haise

[marble lion]

No haha but it actually was a factor due to tone im sure

[iron herald]

Ah, gotcha. I took a typing class at a young age so I'm wired to type in classical typewriter fashion, including double-spacing at the end of sentences. 😂

[lyric viper]

Periods at the end of sentences is a strange one because I always do it, but I think it's a bit of a generation thing too.
On short informal sentences it can be read as a bit 'short' I guess.
The things you end up dicussing and learning as part of D&D, eh?

[knotty vine]

Somedays the abyss is louder then others

[polar ember]

I sometimes do punctuation, but only if it fits my tone XD

[marble lion]

Yeah its only a problem with short sentences that are denying something or telling someone something

[severe rampart]

For real, you gotta add some extra letters to not sound rude

[marble lion]

If I put a period behind this sentence, it doesn't lead to an abrasive tone, only a factual one.

[torpid hound]

What's the point of skill monkeys if you can leave the skills you don't have up to the other PC's?

[lyric viper]

Communication is a big part of playing a social TTRPG so makes sense Communication itself comes up as a topic.
I think it's where things like the classic Reddit D&D/TTRPG 'THE CHAAART' ends up being unhelpful in the end.

[polar ember]

Echo would you DM for me🤣

[marble lion]

No.

[knotty vine]

Being better then everyone at everything is really funny

[iron herald]

Let's eat grandma
versus
Let's eat, grandma!

[severe rampart]

See I just imagined you glaring as you typed that

[torpid hound]

That's until you realize you don't have high enough ability scores

[knotty vine]

Let’s devour grandma

[severe rampart]

Jack of All Trades baby let's go

[marble lion]

Echo.

Now you know how we feel whenever you show up.

[knotty vine]

That’s where proficiency and rouges ability at higher levels to never roll below a 10 was it Carries the build

[severe rampart]

Stop yelling at me

[knotty vine]

type echo

[polar ember]

Yea and it’s also the fact that’s sometimes I care about being grammatically correct and sometimes I don’t care. It’s not always because of connotations or anything like that

[severe rampart]

Oh and yeah, emojis, sometimes you gotta add emojis so you don't sound rude too

[marble lion]

Have a nice day.

[lyric viper]

See I read that as disappointed dad voice.

Ouch.

[knotty vine]

Echo!!

[polar ember]

This Grandma is of limits

[glossy otter]

I leave for a few moments, what happened?!?!

[knotty vine]

Most people say I’m intimidating i still don’t see it

[severe rampart]

This gives off the opposite effect, it's like excited to see me, one exclamation is anger like "Echo!"

[lyric viper]

Punctuation.

[polar ember]

I hope ur pillow is hot on both side tonight but I also wish you a good day

[marble lion]

I will say tho ive been enjoying moderation a lot more these past few days

[knotty vine]

Hey echo!!

[lyric viper]

But yes, might need to pull back round to D&D.

[severe rampart]

Yeah my session is right around the corner (Was that a nice save, Elgate?)

[glossy otter]

Anyone got any theories when we'll hear about the 2026 roadmap?

[knotty vine]

Trying to guess dnd’s road map feels impossible

[crimson gulch]

Fingers crossed by Canada day

[tall forge]

My session tomorrow had to be canceled

[polar ember]

I feel like I was just turned down at a blind date😭

[glossy otter]

I know it's becoming a bigger question since we're closer to the end of Q1

[tall forge]

Sobbing

[knotty vine]

Why

[tall forge]

Player couldnt make it and its a big boss fight

[knotty vine]

Funny

[marble lion]

Rugpull

[tall forge]

I dont wanna remake it to be balanced for -1 player

[lyric viper]

Can you still get folk together for games or a movie?

[tall forge]

Yeah already doing it

[glossy otter]

if only movies online were so easy lol

[severe rampart]

I didn't know whether you were serious 😭

I am bad at social cues, sue me

[polar ember]

I was😭 😭 😭 😭 I really wanted to play

[lyric viper]

Also remember folk to keep LFG chat to the LFG channels or PMs 😉
(Psst, this means posting to those channels: #find-a-game )

[pine herald]

do people usually specifically play with the 2014 or 2024 ruleset or just go we ball with both rulesets as long as it's fun and balanced

[severe rampart]

Oh I'm a sucker for the occasional 2014 game, but the 2024 rules are the best imo

[knotty vine]

I wish this place had an area where you could post like looking for specific game instead an entire group

[polar ember]

I sent a request and it robot checked me

[lyric viper]

We go ball.

[pine herald]

there is a channel but it kinda sucks imo

[lyric viper]

I still ran 2014 while letting players opt into 2024 rules or not. Worked out fine enough, except for an occaisonal 'Wait, which counterspell we using?'

[polar ember]

How is echo gonna react and not accept friend request

[knotty vine]

I’ve been wanting to join a decent into Avernus game for a while

[lyric viper]

You can always specify in your LFG post what type of game you're looking for. But Discord's not the best medium for this.
We're hoping to change the form a little bit to help encourage some uniformity and easier to search.

But 100% that's a thing you could put in your post.

[severe rampart]

Yeah a Forum style would definitely be much easier to navigate with, given tags and all (could specify what rules, edition, and even campaign)

[knotty vine]

Yeah but that leans more into looking for dm no?

[lyric viper]

I'm stuck in the DM version of a player having too many character ideas.
I want to try a sandbox game. I want to try a birthright game. I want to try a darksun game. I want to try an all dragon game.

[lyric viper]

Ah, I might be a little confused. So you want to be a DM, but DM an avernus game?

[glossy otter]

I feel that way with multiple setting ideas but I've got 4 games already going

[lyric viper]

There's not enough time. Where did the days go.

[knotty vine]

Id prefer to play apart in the game rather

[glossy otter]

For me I think it's two ravenloft settings. One based on Legend and one set in Lamordia

[knotty vine]

At least the way I saw Looking for players is usually posted by dms

[glossy otter]

That or a very grim Spelljammer campaign

[knotty vine]

Through finding a dm to well dm a certain game is decently hard

[lyric viper]

It doesn't feel that long ago that my group was happy to commit to whatever game was working, and we ended playing a campaign that took seven years (including haitus and playing other games for a bit). Now the idea of having to commit to a game seems.. daunting.

[glossy otter]

Tbh I'm just grateful for my tables as most if not all are now consistent tables after numerous times where it got shifted around

[lyric viper]

I think my groups beginning to splinter a tad once we've started craving different things. Some players want an entirely different genre to others.

[torpid hound]

What the heck is a Tactician, and why are all of its subclasses in Free Basic Rules?

[knotty vine]

What are you looking at,

[valid geyser]

Not officially

[lyric viper]

On roll20? It's actually from free to use rules (Drizzt's Travelogue of Everything Volume 1 | Roll20 VTT)

[tall forge]

Not the specific class

But just play any gish ever

Ive heard it doesnt feel 1:1, but its sorta the effect of a system that cant really do magus

[severe rampart]

That'd be the dream!

[valid geyser]

It absolutely can do a magus, but it’s kinda too late to make one

[meager fractal]

PF2 magus? Eldritch Knight or Hexblade Warlock are probably the easiest way to scratch that itch in 5e

[feral fulcrum]

Bladesinger as well.

then play pathfinder?

[tall forge]

Then… why play dnd

[dark basin]

What am I reading right now?

[tall forge]

Ok but why play a ttrpg when you dislike it in comparison to another?

[meager fractal]

2024 Eldritch Knight is at a much better place compared what it was in 2014 at least

[torpid hound]

Can you use the Duel fighting style while holding a Shield?

[lyric viper]

Might be better then to focus on what D&D already has and supports than try and make a class from another TTRPG fit it when you already feel it won't work.

[tall forge]

You can, but if you’re asking for chocolate flavored vanilla, dont be surprised when all they got is white chocolate

[valid geyser]

I do think it’s a shame there isn’t just an arcane half caster with the generic flavor. It’s like wanting tomato soup but the cafeteria only has gazpacho

[dark basin]

like dual wield or dueling for the +2 damage? Yes to dueling, no to dual wield.

[torpid hound]

I said Duel not Dual

[dark basin]

My bad friend, I'm dyslexic and misread it.

[lyric viper]

Because when asking for advice in a public space, expect the public to respond 😉

[torpid hound]

Oh didn't know that

[lyric viper]

Whoo now.

[severe rampart]

I say we move from this topic and onto something more lighthearted!

I am excited to run Curse of Strahd

[meager fractal]

I'm excited to run Shattered Obelisk

[lyric viper]

Go punch Strahd.

[delicate owl]

Anywho, on to something else. I have a waterdeep heist session tonight! Its gonna lead into dungeon of the mad mage. Very neat.

[lyric viper]

Go punch the mad mage.

[lyric viper]

Go punch that.. uh... obelisk.

[meager fractal]

i'm sure it deserves it

[lyric viper]

Wait, no, it's already shattered....

[tall forge]

I am curious, whats so different about magus and say, bladesinger or hexblade?

[hot marlin]

I just finished Dim Sun, Rich Burlew's parody of Dark Sun. It's brilliant, read it.

[delicate owl]

I will, in about 15 levels.

[tall forge]

Cause i do hear a lot of Pathfinder players say it just isnt the same

[feral fulcrum]

It's a Different system, for one ,so, generally pretty big mechanical differences. And capable of basically casting spells shile making Melee attacks I beleive.

[meager fractal]

No idea. Maybe power level but Hexblade and Bladesinger are quite strong so...

[tall forge]

Ive only played a little pathfinder (i played the brawler, it was so cool) so i dont think i get the mechanical differences yet lol

[valid geyser]

Pf2 magus is one of like, two equivalents to a half caster in the system. Pf2 is very anti-gish

I think when people say they want a magus ( me included) they mostly mean they just want an arcane half caster without the artificer flavorings

[meager fractal]

I think they just want to stick things with the pointy end and cast spells (at the same time) which is pretty hard to balance

[echo meteor]

idk, barbarians are pretty good at taking 50 damage to the face, and still be standing thanks to reducing much of the damage by 50%

[tall forge]

Oh so like, the same attack?

[delicate owl]

You are focusing the spell into the blade, basically making any attack spell (and I think save spells?) act as a blade spell instead.

[tall forge]

Ahh

[echo meteor]

barbarians are a godsend to any party because they can take the hits and dish out damage

[dark basin]

There are better tanking and damage choices than barbarian, but they're not bad.

[echo meteor]

whats better than a barbarian at tanking damage?

[rough basalt]

Fighters probably, and Paladins.

[echo meteor]

the 50% damage reduction and massive hit dice is soo good

[tall forge]

Technically, a lot of things

[meager fractal]

Moon Druids are really good at it too

[dark basin]

There are plenty of ways to minimize damage. The best is AC because no damage is best damage.

[echo meteor]

fighter/paladins cant exactly take as much punishment though.. the 50% damage reduction is HUGE

[tall forge]

50% damage reduction to only physical damage gets beaten out by just having high ac

[rough basalt]

They can heal themselves to varying degrees, wear magic heavy armor, and do more damage.

[echo meteor]

cant barbarians get high ac?

[tall forge]

They can but it’s harder

[rough basalt]

Not really compared to magic plate armor

[meager fractal]

not as good as a fighter or paladin

[valid geyser]

Yeah I think due to healing and ac fighters and paladins are usually more survivable, at least in the long term

[tall forge]

The MAD factor makes it not great

[severe rampart]

I can't believe people actually see 12 hours of DnD as light work and have played 24 hours for a session before-

[valid geyser]

Doesn’t help that barbarians are almost always gonna have enemies hitting them with advantage

[tall forge]

Yeah, they also kinda have low damage outputs compared to other martials

Not enough to matter but, still kinda low

[echo meteor]

are they? i would see they get downed quite often... considering each attack has a 5% chance to crit and just instantly down a hit that a barbarian could have just shrugged off

[rough basalt]

Crits don't happen as much as regular hits

[echo meteor]

its 5% and then theres multi-attacks. it will happne eventually

[rough basalt]

Which regular hits hit barbs a lot more than other martials.

[meager fractal]

the best tanking is taking your enemies to 0 hp before they reach you. dusts off fireball scroll

[tall forge]

May be a joke, but thats legit the correct answer

Rpg math moment

[rough basalt]

And as you get higher level, a barbarian is guaranteed to be hit without crits.

[severe rampart]

"Crit, but no crit"

[solar nebula]

ok so I had my first DND session ever today (everyone else was new too) and uh.
the druid didn't know how spells work. and they didn't know what the spell "cast fire" does or something.
the rogue didn't know it had sneak attack

but well we had fun so it was worth it.

[severe rampart]

Adamantine Halfplate + Rage goes insane

[valid geyser]

Barb is the one class I’ve played from 1-20. Most deadly encounters I’d survive but be heavily wounded. I’d probably have been targeted less if I was another martial

[tall forge]

Debatably a rogue can tank better than a barb

[severe rampart]

You had fun, that's all that matters, the only question is

Does it keep you engaged, and you are genuinely excited for the next session?

[dark basin]

For example, a current Paladin I have ( am playing the lad tomorrow 🙂 ) has a cloak of displacement, +1 plate, +1 shield, defense, and so on and so forth for standard high AC. He is able to take a lot more hits than a barbarian because of the fact he doesn't get hit. Even if a barbarian were to have a cloak of displacement, the disparity and discrepancy is massive.

Barbarians are made to be hit.

[solar nebula]

kinda, we killed a young green dragon in the city at lvl 1 and we got to level 3 so we decided to just say that this was just a session for rules and stuff and the next session is actually the real one. the dm forgot his notebook..

[tall forge]

Now you could go all in with totem of bear barbarian

[valid geyser]

In some conditions (dex saves). Otherwise they have to use their reaction a lot

[severe rampart]

I'm not even gonna ask how or what

[tall forge]

But you sorta get hit with the “you do no damage” realllll bad

[valid geyser]

Rogues like making opportunity attacks

[severe rampart]

that is not a crazy thing to say

[tall forge]

Hard to get those

[solar nebula]

yeah the dm said it was a fight were supposed to lose but then we enchanted some arrows with some magical sharpness and poison, dealt like 30/136hp to it and he decided randomly that it also takes like 30 more damage a few rounds later.
also the druid filled his character sheet with Chatgpt and he had 68 HP. not even on purpose he just thought it was correct

[rough basalt]

Ultimately at most tables all that matters is what you wanna play as long as it's competent.

What I mean by that is no Charisma wizards, or "sickly dull monks" that have an 8 in con, dex and wisdom

[severe rampart]

Oh. I'm not going to say anything, just gonna add my opinion, I think that is a boat that's about to sink.

[tall forge]

This is true

[tall forge]

I have a character idea….

[solar nebula]

pretty sure it sank. just hope the actual campaign is gonna be better.

[feral fulcrum]

Well, if you've got access to Headbands of Intellect, Charisma Wizards work. But that's obviously not something the majority of people can rely on.

[severe rampart]

it was a oneshot?

[solar nebula]

wasn't supposed to be but after we got to the 3rd level we decided to just forget about it

[severe rampart]

If that's your decision then sure, it wouldn't be mine, but good luck

[rough basalt]

I used to be more tolerant of "incompetent pcs" but now i just put a hard stop to it

cause they can make games pretty rough on everyone

[echo meteor]

can barbarians actually multiattack with javelins now?

because they added "unsheathing" as part of attacking

so you can pick up the javelin as part of the attack

[tidal bough]

Multiattack is different to extra attack but yes for taking the attack action and using the extra attack feature

[echo meteor]

yeah, that used to not be a thing in 2014, because if you threw a javelin, you coudlnt get a 2nd javelin for the extra attack

[dusky ridge]

I am trying to find a oneshot posting but it seems all DMs are looking for long terms game members

[echo meteor]

DAM they nerfed orcs wtf

didnt "orcs" used to have "aggressive" in 2014? where they can just dash as a bonus action whenever?

now you have

Adrenaline Rush
You can take the Dash action as a Bonus Action. When you do so, you gain a number of Temporary Hit Points equal to your Proficiency Bonus.

You can use this trait a number of times equal to your Proficiency Bonus, and you regain all expended uses when you finish a Short or Long Rest.

[tall forge]

Technically you can, you just have to have a javelin out already

[cedar nova]

Hii

[echo meteor]

well kind of, if you wanted the extra attack, both of your hands needed to be holding the javelin b4 you attacked

because attack action didnt include wielding the javelins

[tall forge]

You get a free object interaction, which is pulling out a weapon

[severe rampart]

I was about to post a listing for my CoS oneshot, hah!

[tall forge]

Have a weapon, throw, object interaction pull another, throw

[echo meteor]

its clunky because you have a great axe in your hand. you want to attack something at range...
you drop your axe, pick up a javelin with item interaction, throw it as an attack..
then you cant do ur 2nd attack..

[feral fulcrum]

Throwing is really an afterthought in 5E.

[echo meteor]

you had to somehow have the javelin already in your hand when the turn starts

[echo meteor]

its better now in 5e 2024

[rough basalt]

ye paladins can smite on thrown weapons which is fun

[barren panther]

it's kinda funny how this is the case but in BG3 it's extremely broken

[feral fulcrum]

BG3 makes substantial changes that are not RAW in 5E, I'll note. Which contributes heavily to why it's busted.

Such as height added a not insubstantial amount of damage, and being able to stack 20 boxes on top of each other before fights.

[echo meteor]

i mean.. a bear barbarian is resistant to most damage

how the heck do you get alot of AC with a fighter?

[feral fulcrum]

The same as anyone else does. Armor + Dex + Shield (The object, not the spell.)

[echo meteor]

like over 20?

you can easily hit 16 AC on a barbarian i think

[tidal bough]

Check #looking-for-community

[echo meteor]

you can get 18 with shield.. but shield feels a bit clunky

[tidal bough]

If youre looking for oneshots theres quite afew communities there

[feral fulcrum]

Fighter's start with Either Chainmail or Leather armor, and optionaly a shield. So that's potentially 18 instantly. Defense fighting style bumps that to 19

[echo meteor]

a barbarian can do the same too

shield is a bit clunky when it comes to dealing ranged damage

they can also be bear raging and be resistant to pretty much all the damage

which is actually pretty sick

[feral fulcrum]

I'm not sure if you've actually looks at Barbarian? They don't start with armor, or shields. And rely on Unarmored Defense rather then armor typically. They also don't get Fighting Styles naturally

[dusky ridge]

Ty

[echo meteor]

they get medium armor proficency, what do you mean?

[feral fulcrum]

Their starting gear my guy.

If I was talking about Proffiency's, I'd say it.

[echo meteor]

yeah, you start with unarmored for 15 ac, then work upto the breastplate/halfplate for 16-17 ac :/

id prolly go 17 str, 14 dex, 16 con, then dump 2 stats

then rage as a bear

grab great weapon mastery feat at level 4

[timber holly]

Hi
Me and the party defeated a young black dragon at level 3!

[echo meteor]

when you say "high ac" what number are you referring to?

[brazen maple]

hii ❤️

[timber holly]

Hey!

[tall forge]

Anything up to 23 really

A normal ac tank even lvl 1 hits 17-19

[echo meteor]

how would u get 23 ac on a fighter?

[feral fulcrum]

Magic Items, typically.

[tall forge]

Around level 5, magic items will get you there

[echo meteor]

well thats not exactly exclusive to fighters

[feral fulcrum]

Plate =18, Shield = 20, Defense style = 21, from there just grab magic items.

[feral fulcrum]

I mean you asked how they got to a specifc AC?

[echo meteor]

well he was arguing that fighters make better tanks than barbarians...

[tall forge]

16 from heavy armor, +2 from shield and +1 from the fighting style gets you 19

[echo meteor]

so i was trying to see how specifically.

[feral fulcrum]

I will put this pretty simply. Alot of things are better Tanks then Barbarian, but they lack things like Reckless Attack.

And thus, trend to not frequently giving enemies free advantage on attacks against them.

[echo meteor]

you say that, but numbers dont make sense

[tall forge]

Fighters can focus on getting Dex to 20 immediately also

[autumn sinew]

What do you think of paladins

[tall forge]

Meaning whether its heavy or light armor, they hit 17-18 ac without extra stuff

[feral fulcrum]

Fighters also get Second Wind, which is In combat healing. Barbarians don't get such a thing.

[echo meteor]

they lose out on the "free" ac from the medium armors that are capped at +2 or heavy armor that dont care about dex

or.. rather, dex doesnt mattter past +2 if you are using medium

[feral fulcrum]

So Barbs, while being big HP blocks, don't get access to heavy armor, typically don't use a Shield, and have features that make them even easier to hit.

[tall forge]

Mediums max is 17, heavy armor is 18

[autumn sinew]

My character is a paladin with 21 armor

[echo meteor]

yeah... so having +5 dex with light, max you can get is +17 minus magic stuff

[feral fulcrum]

And lack the in combat healing of Fighters. So, there's plenty of room to argue that Fighters are better Tanks.

[echo meteor]

barbarians can get combat healing they also get 50% damage reduction

[tall forge]

From physical attacks only*

[glass granite]

That resistance is only for BPS, which does get less common as the game goes on in my experience

[feral fulcrum]

Yeah, but it's not Innate. "If I do X Multi-class or Take X Subclass then-" Doesn't actually make the Class Inherently tankier then another Class

[tall forge]

Totem barbarian is 1 specific subclass

That suffers from success tbh

[autumn sinew]

My favorite move that the paladin has is divine smite

[echo meteor]

suffers?

[glass granite]

Mine is aura of protection

[severe rampart]

saw a guy here with like 100 spell slots for Divine Smite

[autumn sinew]

Cool

My character is an oath breaker

[tall forge]

The subclass does nothing besides totem of bear

It becomes a mega tank and…. Thats it. Nothing to help damage

[feral fulcrum]

Totem Barbarian is a thing that has the Illusion of Choice.

[tall forge]

Yeahh

[feral fulcrum]

"Why pick Mediocre when can pick Best?"

[tall forge]

And barbarians already dont get a lot of bonus to damage other than… +2 rage bonus and crit fishing

[severe rampart]

I am a bit afraid to post in the LFG channels, what if the players can't commit to the sessions and I waste another week of my life? can't stop thinking about that first party I was gonna DM for that just ghosted me

[glass granite]

That +2 eventually grows to a +4, which is something

[tall forge]

And then if the barbarian doesnt do damage, why even attack them compared to say, any other less hp class

[autumn sinew]

What is your favorite race

[glass granite]

Plus brutal strike

[tall forge]

And this is coming from a barb enjoyer, i love being buff and never wearing armor