division-universe

[ashen jungle]

We're a blank slate with no pesonality of our own.

[subtle mango]

So the possibility of going rogue in the dark zone is just not something that happens in canon?

[ashen jungle]

I don't think it's ever said anywhere directly, but I always got the strong impression that our single Agent isn't doing everything ourselves, or even in a team of 4.
We're always referred to Agents because it's just someone else.

[glad spruce]

Everytime we enter the dark zone, our network gets jammed and there's only proximity coverage within the DZs.

[subtle mango]

Well even in the main story we seemingly do ALOT on our own.

I mean it's a early part of the game people rush through but like

When we do get npc support they don't do ALOT usually

And I really wish they had a option where you can could've just joined Aaron

And then fight the agents trying to stop him

[glad spruce]

Given the latest comm in mind, ||I'm not surprised that Claire Ortiz is an important factor||

[subtle mango]

I don't pay too much attention to season lore i just run around and shoot stuff usually

Can you explain abit

[glad spruce]

Claire Ortiz and her husband Alexander are the co-founders of Ortiz Robotics. They designed our SHD Tech, ANNA, ISAC, and DIAMOND.

[subtle mango]

Oh

[subtle mango]

One thing is I wish you can just become a rogue and gain access to buffs and some cool rogue SHD abilities and maybe redone specializations

But you lose access to things like backup request

And other more divison related things

[subtle mango]

(like some of the ones we seen keener and other rogues use)

[glad spruce]

In all technical terms, we're Rogue as far as Black Tusk and the Hunters are concerned.

We just don't have our watches red cuz ISAC doesn't think we're off-mission

[subtle mango]

It's obvious rogues gain some serious amounts of benefits from no longer being under ISACS control

I think it's due to how they modify the SHD tech

And turn off limitors and what not

Like keeners stuff was abit beyond normal shd abilities

[ashen jungle]

There were SHD crates there, they seem to be able to just spam out gear.

you can see them in the Summit too.

[subtle mango]

Well even the tech themselves

He can force them to fire more than they normally can

[ashen jungle]

Say what.

[subtle mango]

I think

[subtle mango]

Like the explosive turret

I think he forces it to fire way faster and more than normwl

[ashen jungle]

Are you sure there wasn't just multiple turrets?

[subtle mango]

Normal

[subtle mango]

No, considering I only seen that one and it was the only one present

Because I was quickly evaporating anything that spawned via exotic lmg

And most of the things were like sparking and stuff even when not damaged

[ashen jungle]

I've not seen that be the case before, but it's div so anything's possible.
If that fight even happened.

[subtle mango]

It was Aaron's boss fight?

I recently had to redo it for the season or whatever

And damn, I really want those black tusk energy shields

Also I don't have imagine perms but I found a wiki quote to prove it abit

[ashen jungle]

I honestly do not need to see it, but you can copy the quote and put it in with `` on either side of it.

[subtle mango]

Well, All I'm saying is most if not ALL rogue agents are

Very powerful, even when formerly they might not have been

Like I seriously beg you to find a genuinely easy rogue agent boss fight or encounter

Where you actually kill or take down the rogue

[ashen jungle]

Having a good build helps.

[subtle mango]

Doesn't matter, difficult enemies are difficult enemies.

Also you don't gotta try and diss on people for not having a like ultra mega sweaty build..

[ashen jungle]

I said "good" build, not super OP.
Now as this has gone outside of the remit of this channel, time to move along.
"rogues are cool", okay now it's over.

@subtle mango I told you to move along.

[subtle mango]

"divison universe"

I'm literally talking about it...doesn't mean I'm gonna keep arguing but I can freely talk about divison in the channel meant for it?

Hear me out, it's a division channel in a division server..

[ashen jungle]

It's a division channel specifically for discussing lore, that is it.

[subtle mango]

Yeah, this is lore.

Sadly rogues are part of lore..actually a huge huge part of it.

[ashen jungle]

I'm not sure why it's sadly, but sure.

[subtle mango]

Meh, I just feel like every season is just a reskin of "oh this new cool rogue has revealed themselves and has tests for you agent!!"

[ashen jungle]

Rogues are just Agents who didn't want to stay on-mission, whether that means they went out and murdered a bunch of innocent people, or chickened out and ran away, they're all "rogues".

[subtle mango]

I think Aaron was cool especially with how him and the hunters kinda introduced rogues

But at this point they're milking this cow

[ashen jungle]

Keener was a failed finance bro who sold chemical weapons to the highest bidder.

[subtle mango]

Yeah but he had a ideology and a cool plotline

Also "the first rogue" is objectively a cool name

[ashen jungle]

My hatred of that.....dude, is well known by this point, so I'll refrain. And it'll rile Hawk up again for some reason.

[subtle mango]

Meh, I don't really try to put my inner thoughts and opinions into a video game and I just with rule of cool

And I have PTSD from triple A Companies just milking a money cow dry and it seems like boobisoft is doing the same with rogues

[subtle mango]

Especially a money grab run and gun game..

The forever grind...

[torn shoal]

div 2 isnt a money grab

also keener isnt a good dude even if he had motives

pb is, we are lacking manpower and intel

[glad spruce]

PTSD from AAA companies? L.O.L

[ashen jungle]

"getting the EA flashbacks".

[torn shoal]

yeah its weird ubi getting that much hate compared to the rest of the gaming industry

they are far from perfect but def dont deserve that

[ashen jungle]

Okay folks, let's re-focus.

[autumn tundra]

I thought the last paragraph was quite funny, considering how much ANNA's/Sokolova's/Viper's VA is used in the game for various characters. But I personally do find it a bit "immersion breaking" that there are multiple major characters all with the same VA.

[surreal hearth]

Kelso is playing cat and mouse and she’s the last person on the list to find

[torn shoal]

she is the most important to find rn

finding her could end black tusk entirely if we play it right

[surreal hearth]

And get this it turns out Lau was bound and conspired to kill President Ellens the moment we step foot on the lodge

Keener and viper predict it after shaeffer was no longer in the security detail

[torn shoal]

keener didnt predict it, he organized it

[surreal hearth]

And in a typical Vladimir Putin style, she is extremely paranoid and terrified of Keener

Which is nat

[torn shoal]

lau didnt kill president for no reason

[surreal hearth]

No, but it was organized, and it was a force choice

[torn shoal]

wym

[surreal hearth]

We were pretty much the third-party bait or something her intention was to conspired to blame the division in order to bold and black Tusk

[torn shoal]

wat

[surreal hearth]

She caught herself in a forced choice so we were forced to kill her to ensure Natalia doesn’t notice any more suspicious

[ashen jungle]

Embolden?

[torn shoal]

she wasnt forced to chose that, she did it to save the division

[ashen jungle]

If you're using a translate program, I'd think about switching.

[surreal hearth]

Natalia is playing 4D chess against us and keener

[torn shoal]

nat isnt some mastermind, she is very straightforward

[ashen jungle]

She's playing Uno against herself.

[surreal hearth]

Because the president was in possession of the nuclear football or even worse, a Killswitch of some kind

[torn shoal]

bruh

stop with google translate

[ashen jungle]

Nuclear Football is a legit term, that one's fine.

[torn shoal]

and killswitch ?

there are none

[ashen jungle]

Cold War thing, probably.

they did exist IRL

[torn shoal]

not for the division

thats the point of the division, no oversight

[ashen jungle]

We have tech against our eyeballs that can be electified. We are very vulnerable to tech attacks.

[surreal hearth]

I’m just worried that this will suddenly turn into a M.A.D scenario given how snapped up nat is getting on her insides since she shows no emotions

[torn shoal]

nat isnt snapped

[ashen jungle]

Both of you need a new translate program.

[surreal hearth]

Not but with keener existence she’s pretty snapped up

[ashen jungle]

I am curious if the Football would even be of any use now, is someone still running the silos and such where they're located?

[surreal hearth]

And the your comms and our comms means no comms for everyone

[torn shoal]

realistically unlikely, but its the same for a nuclear plant, and we have countdown, so who knows

this type of thing require heavy maintenance irl

[ashen jungle]

The plant was headed for a meltdown, that I can buy. It's mostly just making steam anyway.

[surreal hearth]

The nuclear plant only shutdown whether we save it or fail

[ashen jungle]

batteries of nukes are a different matter.

Parunox, it's genuinely very hard to read what you are typing.

[surreal hearth]

I lack grammar

Sorry

[ashen jungle]

It's like most of a sentence, but some words are wrong, and some are in the wrong tense.

[surreal hearth]

……..

[ashen jungle]

Regardless, what makes you think Sokolova has "snapped"?

[surreal hearth]

Her “security details” on shaeffers side failed badly and was forced to clean up his mess which is even messed up more.

Lau was put on testing phase and passed while shaeffer became her lapdog instead of a BTSU leader

[torn shoal]

thats very normal on private armies, there is a big turnover, nothing to snap over

[surreal hearth]

It means he was demoted after lau joined the BTSU.

[ashen jungle]

You're both using "snapped" so loosely, I'm picturing the entire game being a West Side Story homage.

[surreal hearth]

I just wanna cut the head of a military traitor one day

General Anderson

[torn shoal]

meh, anderson doesnt even have a brain

[sick lantern]

writers need to remember he exists first

[ashen jungle]

He could use a hair-cut, it's true.

[surreal hearth]

He’s dumber than a stoner.

And how he’s getting soldiers out of thin air is beyond me.

Black tusk and true son’s together brings back to the first division when all factions joined forces to find keener.

[ashen jungle]

They did what?

[surreal hearth]

Makes me worry if the outcast and hyenas join forces against us.

During field freemode true sons and black tusk together can bolster numbers making it a nightmare to fight.

[sick verge]

West side pier. The good old days of idk wtf is going on here but I'm loving it

Well until I got rushed by elite lmb and cleaners at once

[surreal hearth]

All factions joined forces such as the LMBs, rikers, and rioters to find keener but keener baited these joined factions to kill second wave division agents.

Eventually the pier is now a full on bloodbath body zone.

[sick verge]

I do miss the LMB

[ashen jungle]

Boy, do I have probably good news for you.

But we'll know for sure on the 23rd, probably.

[sick verge]

An agent can only hope

[surreal hearth]

Tbh I miss fighting the LMBs they were true soldiers to the last man

[ashen jungle]

Literally not soliders.

[sick verge]

I always wished that they integrated more of their units into the Black Tusk. Like the gunner, captain or even rogue agents

But sadly we only got support and rusher

[ashen jungle]

LMB were not Agents.
but canonically, they "merged" (read: absorbed by) BT, just kinda at random.

[sick verge]

LMB were indeed not agents. But there were rogue agents that joined up with them

[ashen jungle]

Rogues aren't some person with special powers, just an Agent with a red watch, without access to the SHD tech, and in fact: marked as hostile to it.
The fact that some have hacked tech is exactly that: a hack.

[sick lantern]

no but remember someone broke a window one time so they don’t even need to hack it

I’m not even joking that’s canon

[ashen jungle]

I have no idea what you're talking about.

[surreal hearth]

With ANNA now merge we should have rogue agent tech by now

[ashen jungle]

Rogue Tech is literally just SHD tech.

[sick lantern]

the Descent comm where an agent got marked rogue for breaking a shop window, their own turret shot them, so McManus made Ortiz Robotics make it so that rogue agents still have access to their SHD tech

[surreal hearth]

Ah you mean that incident?

[ashen jungle]

I hate Descent comms.

[sick lantern]

yea that’s how it is

[ashen jungle]

I swear there's a fan-fic writer making those.

[surreal hearth]

Red watch was meant to shut down our stuff but went overboard over some pharmacy meds and she couldn’t use her tech instead it turn on her.

[ashen jungle]

An Agent wouldn't be marked as Rogue for breaking a shop window, because the entire point of a SHD Agent is to adapt and survive to the environment, in the service of continuity of government.

[surreal hearth]

Her own turret killed

[ashen jungle]

We have a licence to murder anyone if it suits us. It makes 0 sense.

[surreal hearth]

Does that make ISAC a murderer then?

[ashen jungle]

ISAC is a speak+spell, it is not a person.

it's Alexa with gun knowledge+security clearance.

[surreal hearth]

A speak then go places if you tell him.

[ashen jungle]

That's called voice-activated GPS.

[surreal hearth]

I dunno I feel like with McManus and the whole decent situation makes this a broken record.

[ashen jungle]

Sorry I have to head off, that translate is giving me a headache.

[surreal hearth]

……..

[glad spruce]

Hate them or not, they're important lore to the story

[ashen jungle]

It'll be a cold day in hell before I accept that ISAC turned on an Agent for stealing paracetamol.

[glad spruce]

ISAC is not that smart. He isn't flawless

[ashen jungle]

It's not a matter of intelligence, it makes no sense.

I can already see where this is going and I'm going to save you from the rest of this convesation.

[glad spruce]

Sure, whatever helps you.

But ISAC is a liability

I've also read fanfics that were better written than official novels, so yeah

[ashen jungle]

Having gone through my local libraries entire catalogue of novelisations back in the day, I can officially say that anything written for div: is fine.

[torn shoal]

can we say the div is a fanfic of tom clancy ?

[glad spruce]

I guess?

[torn shoal]

very expensive fanfic then

[autumn tundra]

I'm not sure the turret literally turned on the agent and kill them. McManus just says being flagged rogue and not having access to their tech "got them killed" which could just mean it left the agent defenseless without their tech, as it was disabled.

[torn shoal]

i think it was said it was disabled

[surreal hearth]

Exactly

Instead of a simple disable the turret just turn on the agent and open fire killing her in the process.

[ashen jungle]

They bought the name in 2008, so: not really, no.

and div isn't even based on Clancy's works.

[torn shoal]

no, but the spirit of the story

[ashen jungle]

Clancy didn't invent political intrigue, but if you want to stretch it out, I guess kinda?

There's a russian villain now, so it's more him every day.

[torn shoal]

yeah im streching it for the joke

[sick lantern]

fair but regardless... ISAC's comedic incompetence is absurd

there should be countless agents getting flagged rogue for nonsense reasons if that's the case

[glad spruce]

ISAC's perceived incompetence is irrelevant. Claire Ortiz is more important

[sick verge]

Well that's not completely accurate (nvm I see that already got pointed out. Long live decent the bane of my 100% completionist attitude). But even so, I wouldn't mind seeing a black tusk rogue agent run in and deploy a seeker or drone or turret. Just raises the stakes in a way. Not much but a bit. Besides you can make really cool designs for them.

[torn shoal]

how is isac incompetent when its doing the job its supposed to do

its not a human with agency

[marble dawn]

The way I reasoned this in my head was that the event happened very early on after activation and ISAC didn't have as much data to work with, seeing breaking into the pharmacy as a bigger deal since the city was still mostly intact.
Though even then ISAC should have knowledge of said agent's gunshot (iirc) wound

[glad spruce]

Because he's supposed to the most perfect, the most flawless, and the most accurate AI, apparently

[marble dawn]

Is there confirmation if rogue status is permanent in lore, or temporary like in DZ gameplay?
If latter couldve been a temporary mark, but since the status also disabled tech back then it ended up being lethal for the agent

[torn shoal]

i think its supposed to act as "you're out of a job, go home" when you go break the law, shd didnt expect agents to actually go full rogue and kill other agents

[glad spruce]

You know any time you enter the DZs, ISAC announces "Transmission jammed. Proximity coverage only"? That means Agents communications and network goes local

[torn shoal]

i guess what happen in dz stays in dz, but isac shouldnt mark you rogue on a timer

and outside dz rogues are marked rogues forever

the 5min timer we have or the manhunt consoles are a gameplay thing, in lore there is no agent that was rogue that went loyal after

unless we got a descent comm that state otherwise coming soon

[sick lantern]

Hawkster, you're not the arbitrator of what is and isn't important to discuss

regardless ISAC being unfit for purpose is in fact a relevant plot point, ISAC is the inferior version of ANNA hence why ANNA is now needed to counter the growing threat of Hunters' tech or whatever

[ashen jungle]

Thinking of ISAC as a "he" is part of the problem here, even thinking of ANNA as a "she" might not work, depending on how sentient ANNA really is (and what they prefer, but that comes after the first part).

[sick lantern]

ISAC being incompetent is what WoNY treated as a big deal for having the first wave marked rogue

[torn shoal]

time for me to show the "not a girl" meme again i guess

[ashen jungle]

I doubt ANNA would see themselves as a child, if they see themselves as anything in particular.

[torn shoal]

oh for sure, i was refering to janet from the good place (again)

[ashen jungle]

I'm aware, it's still not a good reference.

[torn shoal]

agree to disagree

[ashen jungle]

Same as it was not a good one the last 3 times you've tried to make it.

[torn shoal]

cant stop thinking about it, the parallel is just too obvious

[loud pilot]

Damn

I was just playing thru the general assembly in the div 1 for the new gb in the game and in one of the encounters spawned a lmb hunter like it looked like a hunter with lmb camo on it

[sudden mortar]

This unit has a soul Rivs, remember that

[ashen jungle]

Legion chose that, ANNA has never given a statement either way.

and Legion only picked that once the change-up went through, before that he specifically said "we".

Yes I know ME very well lol

[sleek plover]

Considering thermal clip is a radiating mechanism instead of true ammo, they are disposable heatsinks that cools down the weapon without need to wait, and me rifles are basically magazineless and its ammo basically lasting forever AND mass effect guns being micro mass accelerators that basically surpasses all modern firearms and probably could pierce a tank armor...
If somebody drops a regular ol' avenger rifle in middle of NYC and DC, whoever picks it ups.gonna be new ammo king

[ashen jungle]

What does that have to do with div lore?

[sleek plover]

oops sorry

[ashen jungle]

No harm done.
and for the record: it shaves bits off a block, so its only infinite ammo until the block runs out.

[rich lark]

Is it just me or is WONY's story really messed up now cause of the recent revalations

Like what was keeners plan and did he need to team up with the various factions because if he's as powerful as the recent seasons have made it they seem to be just there as cannon fodder

[sleek plover]

thus new ammo king with armor piercing rounds.

[late void]

@late canyon please head to the 'Channels & Roles' page and pick your platform and the Division 1 role, then you'll be able to access the div 1 channels and find other players.

[glad spruce]

That was the whole point. Dragov, Kajika, and Conley were killed so Keener and Theo can fake their deaths and keep working on their Cassandra mission

[spice stag]

Tom Clancy’s The Division universe/timeline in chronological order:

The Division 1 —> The Division Resurgence —> New York Collapse —> Broken Dawn —> Extremis Malis (Comic) —> The Division 2 —> Episode 1: Outskirts —> Episode 2: Pentagon, The Last Castle —> Episode 3: Coney Island —> Warlords of New York —> Recruited (Book 1)? —> Shadow Tide (Y2S1) —> Keener's Legacy (Y2S2) —> Concealed Agenda (Y2S3) —> End of Watch (Y2S4) —> Hidden Alliance (Y4S1) —> Price of Power (Y4S2) —> Reign of Fire (Y4S3) —> Broken Wings (Y5S1) —> Puppeteers (Y5S2) —> Vanguard (Y5S3) —> First Rogue (Y6S1) —> Shades of Red (Y6S2) —> Burden of Truth (Y6S3) —> Battle for Brooklyn —> Year 7 —> The Division Heartland (Cancelled: only through Descent comms) —> The Division 3

[torn shoal]

div 3 def aint coming so you have more seasons to come

[cold bramble]

It’s in development 😂

[spice stag]

Yup

[torn shoal]

nobody knows anything about that

"in dev" might just mean "yeah we just thinking about how it would be"

[glad spruce]

Oh, for Vanguard's sake

It's in dev! They announced it in September 2023. MSV devs formed up a dev team for it after Outlaws release. And the dev's twitter tweeted a number of times months before about recruiting people for Div 3

What would it take to convince of you out of your doomerism?

[torn shoal]

what doomerism ?

game dev take years especially triple a

its not dooming that thinking its not coming soon, its realistic

im waiting for the game, but im no rush, def not feeling bad or anything

if it comes like next year i would be very surprised, tho happy

(doomerism would be silksong fans expeting the game soon )

[true fox]

Tom Clancy’s The Division universe/timeline in chronological order:

1 - The Division Heart on Fire
2 - The Division Resurgence (First three missions)
3 - New York Collapse
4 - The Division 1
5 - The Division Underground
6 - The Division Resurgence ?/?
7 - The Division Survivor
8 - The Division Resurgence ?/?
9 - Extremis Malis 1
10 - The Division Resurgence ?/?
11 - Extremis Malis 2
12 - Extremis Malis 3
13 - The Division Resurgence ?/?
13 - Broken Dawn
14 - The Division Remission
15 - The Division 2
15.1 - Invasion Black Tusk
15.2 - Operation Dark Hours
15.3 - Episode 1: Outskirts
15.3 - Operation Iron Horse
15.4 - Episode 2: Pentagon, The Last Castle
15.5 - Episode 3: Coney Island
16 - Warlords of New York
17 - Shadow Tide (Y2S1)
18 - Keener's Legacy (Y2S2)
19 - Concealed Agenda (Y2S3)
20 - End of Watch (Y2S4)
21 - Recruited (Book 1)
22- Hidden Alliance (Y4S1)
23 - Price of Power (Y4S2)
24 - Reign of Fire (Y4S3)
25 - Broken Wings (Y5S1)
26 - The Descent
27 - Paradise Lost
28 - Puppeteers (Y5S2)
29 - Vanguard (Y5S3)
30 - First Rogue (Y6S1)
31 - Shades of Red (Y6S2)
32 - Burden of Truth (Y6S3)
33 - Battle for Brooklyn

[torn shoal]

i think a graph would be more clear

[wicked gorge]

A pie chart would be better

[torn shoal]

i love pies

[spice stag]

Wait, Resurgence is before the first game?

[ashen jungle]

That's just grammatically confusing.

[true fox]

The first three missions are before game 1

[strange rock]

They're hiring for division 3 lol and have been for a while

[torn shoal]

well you need to hire people if you wanna make a game

so that make sense

[strange rock]

Yes so it's not vaporware either
This isn't a the day before situation
It just takes a lot of time to make these games

[torn shoal]

i didnt say its vaporware lol

[ashen jungle]

Just to make this clear: div3 is not "we're thinking about it", it's "we're actively working on it, alongside the dlc".

now back to the lore, folks.

[rich lark]

So like why doesn't the division have agents on the people in line to succeed

Cause for a organisation whose goal is saving What Remains, and assuring the continuity of the U.S. government during a catastrophic event. It feels dumb not gaurding whose next if you cann't secure the first pick

[sick lantern]

if you mean the presidency, it's because it doesn't matter

(in universe)

the mission is the same regardless, the SHD is designed to not need figureheads to give orders and to be able to operate autonomously under many different kinds of catastrophes

[torn shoal]

You mean line of succession ? That's because they have power and authority to kill anyone, so they could make themselves next in line by killing everyone before them
Doesnt matter if you go rogue when you are the président and order that rogues arent rogues, you're above shd and isac

[rich lark]

I mean like protecting them

[torn shoal]

That's what secret services are for

Also most of people in line died of the flu, they didnt got killed

Or unalived themselves as the kids say now, like the first président iirc

[young lily]

So does the Secretary of Commerce have clearance to the "Ark protocol" since the SOA died?

[loud pilot]

Dollar flu was an inside job

[loud pilot]

Gordon Amherst was clearly a keener plant

[glad spruce]

Cabal plant

[mint citrus]

Like, even with McManus as POTUS iirc the Division would still keep doing their thing unless he specifically ordered them to stand down

They wouldn't just go "Lol, LMAO, no."

With the death of Ellis, no one's actually in the WH as a sitting president

So we're operating autonomously

We're still on mission despite Johnson and Sokolova and everyone saying we're not or that we've gone rogue.

[torn shoal]

yeah until isac recognize someone is its boss, we're in judicial limbo

and the second its ordered to stand down, we're cooked

[loud pilot]

He was obviously a McManus plant in his grab for power

[glad spruce]

Or we don't have to listen to what ISAC orders us to do

[tepid ibex]

WHAT DID YOU MEAN BY THIS

[glad spruce]

Battle for Brooklyn reveal livestream

How did you not know about this?

[sand slate]

I hope we don't get screwed over with map size

[rich lark]

They said it'll be smaller than WONY

[sand slate]

To me, Warlords is small

So Brooklyn is going to be tiny

[rich lark]

Warlords is small cause new york is dense it's not like dc with wide streets

[sand slate]

True, there is trash and containers everywhere

[glad spruce]

Bigger isn't always better

[torn shoal]

We kinda do tho, that's our liaison to other agents. If we cant trust isac, we cant trust anyone

Isac is the one that determine if what you do is legit or rogue

[autumn tundra]

I personally wouldn't expect anything larger than 1 of the districts of WONY. They've stressed many times the DLC is not close to the same scale/size as WONY. Have to remember the team size isn't very large unfortunately, so they're very limited in what they can achieve sadly.

[torn shoal]

map size isnt very relevant if you have lot of content in it

[tepid ibex]

I knew about the trailer a month ago. I thought Rivens heard some rumor or perhaps saw leaks to the LMB returning. The possibility of them returning is a given with this DLC, i thought there was more info i hadnt seen tho.

[compact hamlet]

I was playing Iron Horse and Kelso said Morozova's files were classified because she was involved in some "high level political bullsh*t". Has there been anything else about her since?

[loud pilot]

I don’t think she was a hunter just a high level federal agent of some kind like maybe a gitmo interrogator or like a high level spec ops operator that didn’t meet agent requirements or standards

[rich lark]

So do the SHD have ranks

Cause some agents are called commanders but thats a naval role

[torn shoal]

shd does have ranks, not everyone is a field agent too

[glad spruce]

Like Maya Walsh

[true fox]

Not that I remember, but there's more about her on the Division Wiki. Now about those documents, I wanted to see for myself.

[rich lark]

Do we know the rank system?

Like navy, marines, army, airforce?

[torn shoal]

its not specified in game iirc, but its mostly standard

[sick lantern]

No

there are section/regional commanders like Louis Chang but that seems to be more of a coordination thing given Manny fills the same role in DC

otherwise, Division cells set their command structure as they see fit

[sick lantern]

Or in any other source of information, because it doesn’t exist. :)

[ashen jungle]

@azure kestrel This channel is for discussing the lore in the extended Division universe.
For non-official troubleshooting, please see #unofficial-troubleshooting

[small knot]

Ight chat what do we expect to learn in this weeks hunt?

Cause with how close it seems viper, Schafer, and keener were with each other I wouldn’t be surprised if there’s a 4th close person that we didn’t even expect to be part of keeners network

[tepid ibex]

I would say Alex, but they allegedly, "got," him.

[sleek plover]

Alex is a secret BTSU clone project

[brave merlin]

what does isac stand for

[glad spruce]

Intelligent System Analytic Computer

[brave merlin]

thanks

[ashen jungle]

Interesting Scout (9) this week.
||Schaeffer and Bridgette Douglas are discussing Sokolova's mole in DC, speculating on who it could be, potentially multiple people.
Schaeffer suggests Bridgette's father, she is unsure. Both joke about it being an actor that Sokolova hired. ||

||"that'd be pretty funny, the future of the free world depends on an actor".
I'd say more relevant though is that they mention the College, and a potential summer intern for Sokolov who now spies for her. Could be a throwaway line, but that feels plotty to me.||

[glad spruce]

Figured someone beats me to the punch while I was away in a gym session lol

[glad spruce]

Still, Nat's mole was gonna come up sooner or later

[ashen jungle]

I actually had time this week to be online close-ish to the release, so I figured what the hell.
I doubt that it'll be the one they mentioned by name, although the mention of the ||College|| does bring up some questions about a potential location for the Master Mission.

[loud pilot]

The master mission?

[ashen jungle]

@loud pilot Once a Manhunt has released all its comms, a special unique version of a Mission is unlocked, last season's was Space Admin.
It's referred to as the "climax mission", but also contains its own difficulty that is tougher than Legendary, but with no White Tusk. Master difficulty.
Complete it on that and you get a new exclusive Exotic item.

[loud pilot]

Oh that’s what you meant ok

[late canyon]

Anyone playing D1 on steam ? I’m starting over could use a partner

[patent narwhal]

#td1-lfg

[eager viper]

Hopefully this is okay to ask as it is out of curiosity but are there any gay or even transgender characters within the division games/universe? Just a thought i had, not a big lore person.

[sick lantern]

Jessica Kandel is a lesbian
Faye Lau was romantically involved with some woman I forgot, one of the rogues
and uhh I think in recent Descent comms there’s some dude who was into Keener idk

[eager viper]

Thank you! Never knew any of those 😮

[sick lantern]

there’s a few collectible phones in Div 1 about a girl Coming Out to her mother

[eager viper]

That is sweet. I did get all div 1 intel but it was years ago now 😅 thank ya again!

[ashen jungle]

@eager viper Bridgette Douglas is the one that Lau was involved with, she's in a lot of the current Season's comms.

[glad spruce]

Mel Arnold, one of the civilians we rescued in Y5S2, is non-binary.

But I don't know if they count as transgender

[ashen jungle]

I think the question was more in line with anyone who's LGBT+

[torn shoal]

I didnt notice for Mel, I should pay more attention sometimes

[eager viper]

Was nice to learn all of this, much appreciated everyone!

[loud pilot]

“Why do they always fridge the lesbians” will never not be funny to me

[ashen jungle]

I love that they actually mentioned that trope.

[drowsy prairie]

Who isnt into keener tbh

[wicked gorge]

90% of this channel

[sleek plover]

Now that was underwhelming

[glad spruce]

Hating Keener had become a running gag in this channel

[ashen jungle]

It's not so much a "gag" as it is a "yeah that's fair" thing.

[median crag]

Could be that one person who operates the radio/Castle settlement propaganda

Cause then they'd have all information they'd need, especially crucial developments within the community.

[tulip patio]

I have a question, I just found out a bit about how that Hunted book goes, well I won't post spoilers but seeing that it's in the future

this kind of puts out "alliance" with Keener in a weird spot

[torn shoal]

You can use spoiler tags to clear what you're talking about without spoiling

[sick lantern]

the chronological positioning of that trilogy is, let’s say, fluid

if the game writers want it in the past then it’s in the past

[obtuse swallow]

Am I the only one who’s confused on how the Cleaners are even still around? We’ve taken out like 2-3 of their leaders and they’re still kicking

[ashen jungle]

They had another secret leader who was actually in change the whole time and the leader we knew about was useless and uncool.

I assume.

[obtuse swallow]

I can’t tell if this is poor writing on Massive’s part or not

[ashen jungle]

That was literally the plot of Conley in WONY.

[obtuse swallow]

Quite literally makes no sense how a bunch of trash men who run on an incredibly poor structured ranking system outlived a PMC that was at one point government backed

[obtuse swallow]

I’m not even gonna lie, I had no idea what Conley did. I just thought she was there so Keener could use the cleaners every now and then

[ashen jungle]

She was Fero's 2nd in command after they found her half-dead in the DZ, but throughout comms in NYC, we learned that she was kinda running things already.

[obtuse swallow]

Ok now that makes sense, I probably missed the comms

[ashen jungle]

If in doubt: they're all on YT.
the VA's are quite good overall, they're worth a listen to for that aspect of them, I'd argue the lore parts are not half bad either but,

[obtuse swallow]

I usually just run straight to NGN, definitely has the best videos lore wise

[ashen jungle]

He's certainly the most accessible for that, for sure.

[winged reef]

So idk if anyone else has connected these dots already or not (and to be honest I’m a couple weeks behind on the lore) but I was listening to one of NGN’s older videos talking about the radio guy from the first game. || he brought up the lady investigating the guy and how she said she discovered something big, and made it sound like a big powerful shadowy organization was after her. Doesn’t that sound like this “cabal” keener was yapping about? ||

Idk if I’m just connecting dots that aren’t there or what

[sick lantern]

I don’t think WSP collectibles are quite in spoiler tag territory, they came out like seven years ago

anyway. that lady got concerned that she couldn’t find accurate documentation during the end of the world and then “ooh she got cut off mid message spooky”

She probably tripped.

What we know of Rick Valassi is that he’s a Vietnam vet, veterans affair advocate, conspiracy theorist and pirate radio podcaster. I think if the deep state wanted a puppet they could’ve picked someone better

than someone who spends all day saying “The deep state is out to get you” maybe it’s that conspiracy theory that conspiracy theories are perpetuated by conspirators to hide the real conspiracies but that’s just too many levels of 4D chess

the last we heard of him was for once praising the SHD which is counter intuitive to the deep state goals

[winged reef]

Yeah idk, just a theory I came up with, tho I wouldn’t put it past the people behind the black tusk. Ultimately It’s just taking shots in the dark. I do hope he gets at least mentioned in battle for Brooklyn

[tulip patio]

oh right I forgot

[tulip patio]

I didn't know it was meant to be fluid, found mentions that it's in the quite far future, like maybe even farther than game 2 was from game 1 but || it talks about Keener wanting to smuggle the virus all over the US using existing trading routres, if this is in the future it makes the alliance we have now quite questionable, I doubt we'd risk using virus even fighting Black Tusk ||

so it feels like this was done following the old story before the events of the past 3 seasons, I assume that's actually the case

[torn shoal]

You dont need a leader to have your cult do some wacky shit

But they did have one before wony

And they still have small commanders

[obtuse swallow]

Then again the outcasts are completely gone lore wise because we took out their wack job of a leader

I just think they’re way too organized for the situation they’re in right now

[torn shoal]

Im talking about cleaners, but it works for outcast too, they just work differently

[obtuse swallow]

Oh yeah I know I was just bringing up a point

[torn shoal]

They hate people and work together to make stuff

[tulip patio]

we did see Keener's friend mobilize them after what happened at Zoo

[torn shoal]

Not having a leader doesnt mean you stand still that's my point

People arent some mind less drones

Not yet at least

[obtuse swallow]

Oh 100%, I just think the cleaners are being drawn up to be way bigger than they actually are

[torn shoal]

They lose recruiting power tho

[tulip patio]

imo I would argue here, in a PMC likely many of them are there for money of benefits, not the cause, while a group like cleaners most definitely have the ideology keeping them together

[torn shoal]

So their numbers might suffer

[tepid ibex]

I was in denial for a long time too. But the LMB is a Battalion after all, and only has 300-1000 men. The Cleaners are almost every trashman in NYC, and they probably recruit people. The LMB weren't gonna start letting civvies into their ranks

[obtuse swallow]

I never saw the cleaners recruiting due to how brutal they were in the first game. It’s certainly possible though

[torn shoal]

It's not just possible, it's explained that's how they got so big

[obtuse swallow]

Really? I must’ve missed that

[torn shoal]

They sold a fake hope and people really believe it cause it's that or death

[tepid ibex]

Yeah considering they were burning everyone on sight seemingly, I don't see them getting many recruits either

[torn shoal]

They get only healthy people but they do recruit in a lot

Same for rikers

[obtuse swallow]

I always just assumed the cleaners never let anyone in due to them assuming everyone is infected, then again a lot has changed since Ferro got clipped

[torn shoal]

You got millions of people in the city, finding people isnt hard

As long as they arent infected or at risk, it's a potential recruit

[obtuse swallow]

I don’t think there’s millions, probably a couple thousand

[torn shoal]

And if they refuse you kill them to show the others what happen of they refuse too

[torn shoal]

Ny is one of the most dense city

On earth

[obtuse swallow]

Yeah but you gotta think of what’s happened to NYC since the outbreak

[torn shoal]

Well that's the point, factions appeared

And get recruits

[obtuse swallow]

We never got a full confirmation of how many people passed due to the virus, although I assume it’s pretty high

[torn shoal]

We got an estime iirc it's pretty high

[obtuse swallow]

Not to mention most people’s first reaction to an epidemic of this level in a major city is to gtfo

[torn shoal]

Like 90%

[obtuse swallow]

Yeah then we’re definitely over estimating

Most people would’ve left NYC by now

[torn shoal]

Not really

New York got like 20m people, there is a quarantaine in place, if you lose 90% that's still 2m

[tulip patio]

if they left likely some came in, I forgot where I saw it exactly but in DC at least we have mentions of people coming in and joining factions

[torn shoal]

You cant leave quarantaine thats the point

[obtuse swallow]

There’s nobody enforcing the quarantine anymore

[tulip patio]

and yeah during quarantine I doubt they could leave easily but now nobody to force it

[torn shoal]

In div 1 there was

[obtuse swallow]

JTF pulled out to rural USA

[torn shoal]

In div 2 it's not the same they expanded

[obtuse swallow]

Well that was months ago in lore now

The JTF in NYC is gone by summer

[torn shoal]

Yeah but that mean they could recruit a lot

So that mean they have numbers by now

Like a lot

[coral flume]

If I remember correctly, the bridges were closed on the fifth day since the first outbreak was discovered, which would be a total of 7 days in which people entered and left NY without any restrictions.

[obtuse swallow]

I think you’re missing the point, the JTF is gone. They left the city completely, the only friendly area we know of in manhattan right now is Haven, which probably has a few hundred people at most there

[torn shoal]

The out break didnt drive people away that much, it wasnt considérée dangerous back then

[obtuse swallow]

Oh yes it was

[torn shoal]

What's your point then ?

[obtuse swallow]

There aren’t as many people as you think in manhattan

[torn shoal]

Yeah I got that but what's your point

[obtuse swallow]

That was the point, we’re greatly overestimating how many people are in the area. The only reason there are so many cleaners and rikers everywhere is just for gameplay, in reality there aren’t 1000 rikers in a singular district

[sick lantern]

It's not "meant" to be fluid, that's just the approach the game writing team took to adapting material from the trilogy- ignoring the chronology.

[tulip patio]

ah ok

[sick lantern]

the books hard say "it's the future", the game ignored it

[tulip patio]

so I assume for now have to focus on the continuity the game picks

[torn shoal]

Who over estimated their numbers ?

[sick lantern]

also "it talks about Keener wanting to smuggle the virus all over the US using existing trading routes" this is not the plot of the book.

[obtuse swallow]

^

[sick lantern]

I think Keener is mentioned like... twice at most in the whole trilogy

[torn shoal]

I was talking about cleaners in div 1 not now

[tulip patio]

I admit I just read a shortened version, maybe it was wrong but mentioned his name and smuggling the Eclipse

[obtuse swallow]

I thought we were just talking in general

[torn shoal]

We see a lot of people in the street in div 1

[torn shoal]

Np, we just miscommunicated

[tulip patio]

so quite likely it was wrong yeah I didn't read the book

[torn shoal]

All good my dude

[obtuse swallow]

Oh yeah there people all over, I think I mis interpreted you because when I talked about the cleaners I was talking about modern day Battle for Brooklyn cleaners

[sick lantern]

maybe there was like one line I forgot. But Keener is not a relevant element to the stakes or events of any book in the trilogy

[tulip patio]

yeah he's not the focus but it makes mention of him in passing

[torn shoal]

Well we dont know what's in dlc yet

[sick lantern]

i don't think they mention trade routes at all in Hunted either... that was the plot of Recruited

[tulip patio]

I might have got the wrong book

might have been on one of the others

let me see if I can find

|| At the Texas, Maira discovers canisters of the Eclipse Virus inside the ship, realizing Keener plans to use the Freighties’ trade network to ship the virus across the country. The agents are attacked by rogues, and Colin manages to sedate David using a Mender Drone. Below decks, Maira is mortally wounded and ruptures the hull, sinking the ship and its cargo of Eclipse; ISAC declares her deceased. || this is from Compromized

it's from the wiki so it's not 100% correct likely but is this book also past where we are in the timeline?

[sick lantern]

Well Keener wasn't revealed as still being alive yet at the time and they definitely didn't have that planned out years in advance

[tulip patio]

I see yeah so they went for the old story direction

it wouldn't make much sense now I feel if he still did all this to ally

[sick lantern]

well yes and no because the timeline is nonsense. recruited said it was in the future of the timeline and then the game said it was in the past. and compromised is six months? iirc after recruited

[tulip patio]

huh so the timeline is all muddied?

[sick lantern]

The writers don't care about a coherent timeline. So don't waste the mental effort trying to make it coherent

[tulip patio]

yeah fair enough

good to know I shouldn't follow it too much then

[tepid ibex]

but

[true fox]

Do we have questions ready?
To know what is most missing in history

I didn't make a list

[glad spruce]

Okay, cross my heart and hope to live, what are you talking about?

[true fox]

I'm talking about gaps - things that haven't been very well explained so far. We already have questions prepared so that we can recognize the answers when they come, or ... do not come.

[kind hare]

Yeah I'm just the noisest one 😅
But people like @glad spruce and yourself have this shit down too.

I was a little disappointed in a standalone story for this DLC, but I think you all will be happy with what they've done

[ashen jungle]

If I tried a div2 youtube channel, it would just be the QuietteShy equivalent, and no one needs more snark lol.
You keep it up instead :p

[kind hare]

@unreal widget could tell you, I'm no extrovert. I'm awkward as hell in group situtions

I still can't listen to my own videos

[ashen jungle]

I'm, well, you know. The TTS wouldn't be because I'm awkward :p

[unreal widget]

Same! I felt like most of us are more introvert.

[kind hare]

Yeah GC was quieter than I had imagined in my head. Super nice guy though

Year 7 though... holy shit there is some cool stuff coming!

and this is where @unreal widget needs to tell me to shut TF up, because I get too excited haha

[unreal widget]

That's why I barely say anything about what's coming, because I don't wanna say the wrong stuff.

[ashen jungle]

MSV gonna show up with the Reminder Bat if you blab.

[kind hare]

I really do appreciate meeting you. It was awesome after all these years.

I was fan-girling hard haha

[unreal widget]

Me too! I totally felt like a fan-girl, getting to meet and taking selfies with everyone.

[kind hare]

It was a great group of people that went over.
When I asked them to look out for you with your anxiety of traveling alone, no one hesitated in saying that they have your back.
I like that. Good people all round.

[glad spruce]

Your compliments are appreciated 😊

[loud pilot]

Did massive invite you out to their studio ngn?

[torn shoal]

My man being the vip

[glad spruce]

Yes, they did invite NGN amongst other people

[tepid ibex]

widdz

[loud pilot]

That’s actually awesome wish I could’ve gone

[glad spruce]

I'm sure some already know from #td2-descent, but it's confirmed that ||Descent will get 19 more comms in next season.||

[torn shoal]

They really love descent huh

[glad spruce]

Maybe they saw my work in summarizing those comms, that they added more comms for me. 😛

[torn shoal]

Need to do an investigation inside ubi and massive and find who's running the "hawkster number 1 fan" as nickname

[ornate gull]

The battle of Brooklyn make me wondering

How Cleaner still stay in power after Ferro and Vivian death

[glad spruce]

Stubborness and single-minded to their goal.

Besides that, they've got logistical support from Black Tusk and the Hunters, which include new accelerant that makes their flames burn purple

[torn shoal]

Bt support them ?

I thought they only supported Washington factions

[loud pilot]

I think they have some bt because of the meret estate incursion the boss before the love birds is wearing all black tusk gear and I’m pretty sure it was confirmed he was a hunter who gave them love birds shd tech so she could attack the meret estate and Bring Mack to Natalia could be wrong

This is just what I remember off the top of my head @ashen jungle is my info correct?

[sick lantern]

you don’t need to ask a mod for confirmation on plot details i don’t think

[glad spruce]

That is more or less correct

[ashen jungle]

I appreciate that you wanted to know, but if we're not active in the chat, it's best to only ping mods if there's a scammer around or a similar emergency.

[median crag]

Out of all the NY factions we've fought, the Cleaners seem to have the most solid command structure

[autumn tundra]

Cleaners are dedicated to their cause 😄

[sudden mortar]

Well, after we killed their leader twice plus a rogue that wasn't really a leader of the faction, destroyed their refinery infrastructure and repelled their incursion.
I mean, without BT and McManus secret support, I don't think they would be that strong in Brooklyn.

[median crag]

Yeah, thats a fair point

[loud pilot]

My bad I didn’t know you were a mod just that your more knowledgeable then me my bad

[torn shoal]

Oh yeah I totally forgot about tge incursion, u right

[ashen jungle]

@loud pilot No worries, we just have to keep the pings clear so we notice when a bot sneaks through

[ornate gull]

They lost dragon and 4 horsemen of apocalypse too

[torn shoal]

Lost dragon is div 1? Bt wasnt a thing then

[loud pilot]

Ok 👍

[rich lark]

So you think the moravian society will be part of the Cabel

[sick lantern]

“Cabal” and I sincerely hope not

we don’t need the Court Of Owls added to the deep state stew we already have between the Black Tusk, Hunters and Cabal

[rich lark]

Its still weird how we have had no development on that easter egg

[sick lantern]

There’s a lot of actual plot elements that have no development, let alone easter eggs.

That’s like expecting The Agony to be a major character

[sleek plover]

I actually think Moravian Society IS the Cabal and its an "official name" for it.

Original Tom Clancy Rainbow Six novel literally featured a villain group of billionaire ecofascist cabal so..

[rich lark]

Could be just Natlia hidding under a hole on roservelt island

Just they were setting it on up to be something big and seemed to drop it

[sleek plover]

also I hate LMB.

I hoped the Brooklyn dlc featured some sort of "exclusively ex lmb btsu subfaction"that are not canon-dubious white tusks which are ojly featured in non canon legendary missions

[sick lantern]

The White Tusk are 100% canon after appearing in The Division: Hunted.

[sick lantern]

personally I’d say there’s a vested difference between “an enigmatic group of creepy owl ppl from an easter egg” and “like two CEOs” from that novel

Also wow the ending to that book is absolutely vile.

[sleek plover]

Never seen any dialogues or npc barks in-game to verify that.

It just felt like fighting "elite enemies" rather than actual ex lmbs.

I wanted dialogues like "this is for bliss!" so I can crush them mercilessly with fire.

[sick lantern]

You seem to have ahhh missed the part where I said they showed up in a fully canon novel

[sleek plover]

I mean I bought and played this game becausr I read the wiki first and decided I hated LMB so I can go remnant hunting

[sleek plover]

Yes I am aware they apoeae in the novel.

i.just wanted their game appearances to be more...apparent

[sick lantern]

You’ve said that like ten times and it’s always beggared belief because the LMB are evidently more present in the first game…
Also why don’t you feel the same way about the True Sons or the Black Tusk who are basically the same thing?

[sleek plover]

I actually do feel the same way abkht them

And because they remain in the first game.

I dont get to see them actually "wiped out"

[sick lantern]

Nor do you in 2

[sleek plover]

Back when I bought the game, the return to new york was hinted so I thought I can wipe them out for good

TBH i expected sth like how the nazis were like inside the eiffel tower in the last mission "Angel of Death" from the game The Saboteur

but alas, that is a topic fit for off topic discussions

[tepid ibex]

if you could summarize, what did they do in that novel

[sick lantern]

briefly appear but are definitively solidified as "ex-LMB fighting for the BT in white armour"

it's honestly like one soldier on one page but very explicitly a White Tusk appearance

[tepid ibex]

So do ex-LMB outside of White Tusk also canonically exist but in Black Tusk? Like, the support station and scouts they have, are those ex-LMB BT?

[tepid ibex]

think, webkinz! Will the LMB remnants outlast every fragile insignificant BT soldier?

[sick lantern]

i dunno man

probably

[torn shoal]

White tusk dont have many numbers if they are remnant of lmb

But again, we dont have any numbers for any faction

[wicked gorge]

I doubt they’re all LMB but a mixture of high ranking LMB and Black Tusk

[winged reef]

Might be a stupid question, but how do the division agents watch’s and bricks stay powered? Like I know the contacts use the eyes movement to charge, but what about the other pieces? It’s not like there are many places left that you can just bring a charger and plug it into the wall.

[torn shoal]

Magic

[kind hare]

I think this is a good question.
I imagine in a similar way to the Scantek lenses, with movement and solar.

[glad spruce]

I always thought they ran on batteries.

But movement and solar is a good answer too

[winged reef]

that what i was originally thinking, but i feel like with how powerful the watch and brick are and all the stuff they can do, the amount of kinetic energy generated wouldnt be nearly enough, and solar would take too long to charge the battery to be practical, along with it being dependent on the weather. although at the end of the day its a video game, so im probably thinking to much into it. Also big fan of the vids, pls keep up the good work.

[kind hare]

No I agree, there is probably a lot more to it.
But when you think about how much combat time they actually have in between travelling between objectives, there could be enough charge time in there. I'm more basing this off the Operations Crossroad novels.

[ornate gull]

Most agent probably carry portable charger

Remind me Metro 2033/Last Light where every individual alway carry universal charger to recharge electric for their flashlight or power station

[glass notch]

It might sound stupid, but do our agent sleep???

Or do they inhale caffeine or smelling salts in the middle of an encounter?

[ashen jungle]

They sleep when you log off.
This is why it's important for you to take breaks. Let them catch up.

[winged reef]

Ah yes, maybe Dixie Dog let them use the cigarette lighter port XD

[winged reef]

But then who would recapture the control point for the 50th time today?

[ashen jungle]

That's why they (are supposed to have a chance at) getting re-taken when you log off.

[sour perch]

I always pictured them that when you're fast traveling to a mission, it's just them running all the way to it

[ashen jungle]

I always saw it as a helicopter, but that's more gameplay and less lore so

[sour perch]

True

[tepid ibex]

they call up johnny on the spot

[torn shoal]

The battery isnt early close to being a problem in lore, when you see an agent throwing endless seeker or drone

Especially when you know we were looking for used skills to attack kajika for example

Who runs around with 50 turrets ready to deploy

[late void]

No, any grenade will do

[clever garden]

I was thinking that it had to be part of the specialisation, and killing with an emp would take some skill 😄

[late void]

For people who don't own the year one pass, you can't even activate the tech spec until you've completed the field research, so none of it requires the spec to be active

For future reference though this is the lore channel, gameplay questions are better put in #ask-td2-community

[ornate gull]

Lore Question, which tech is affected by EMP and Jammer?

[sick lantern]

everything ever

[ornate gull]

Include the gun that use to launch most sticking stuff?

And balistic shield?

Balistic shield not look entirely tech to me

[sick lantern]

well just think of every time you got EMP'd in game and it stopped working

doesn't make sense but it's The Division

you shouldn't be able to disable an M32 grenade launcher by disconnecting it from the wi-fi, but you can (The Division: Compromised)

[torn shoal]

Sounds like my printer

[ornate gull]

Has there ever scenario of Division, Rogue Agent and Hunter crossfire at each other?

[torn shoal]

Ingame ? I dont think so, Hunters interactions are really rare, maybe the ending of survival mode in div 1 but that's kind of a stretch

[loud pilot]

I mean in lore, I feel like it’d be possible if a hunter was hunting down a rogue well at the same time being attacked by a non-rogue agent or a rogue agent and a hunter both hunting down the same bounty or anti cal operative

But I don’t think we’ve actually had an instance where this has happened could be wrong cause I haven’t read the books yet though

[compact hamlet]

How do the Hunters arrive at a place when fighting?
For us we see a random puff of smoke with a Hunter in the middle and the fight starts but how do the Hunters actually arrive there? Cloaking tech? Then a smoke bomb to put on a show?

[obtuse swallow]

I’m 90% sure they’re just incredibly stealthy, cloaking tech doesn’t exist in this universe to my knowledge

[ashen jungle]

You mean, not that you've seen.

[winged reef]

Well if we’re talking about the most basic cloaking tech, there was that “quantum stealth” material that a company made a while back. From my understanding it uses several layers of a material to bend light allowing for things close behind it to be “invisible”

[compact hamlet]

Could be a better version of the tech Chameleon AR uses.

[obtuse swallow]

Now that you mention it I completely forgot about that, the hunters don’t look to have anything similar to that on their kit, however we still don’t know everything they’re capable of so it’s entirely possible

Although I would think there would be some hint to that in the DARPA Labs as that was the same R&D branch that developed the Chameleon

[obtuse swallow]

I think it’s due to parts of the shield being linked with ISAC, like for example drone controls come from an agents wristwatch

[obsidian jay]

Rogues do it too
for some reason
If you lose to a rogue agent in an open world encounter they vanish in a cloud of smoke after a while
Keener also pops up in a cloud of smoke in WLONY

I think we can do it too with the new exotic

[obtuse swallow]

I think it’s due to the way those types of enemies are coded, both the Hunters and Rogues have incredibly similar tactics, I actually wouldn’t be suprised if the Rogues take code straight from the Hunters aside from they can’t jam SHD Tech

Now that I mention it I remember somebody a long time ago saying the Rogues were just coded exactly the same as the Hunters minus a few gimmicks

[compact hamlet]

vanishing AFTER a smoke is kinda understandable.
but appearing at a place out of nowhere is kinda weird.

My head-canon is the Hunters on rooftops drop and lose their health, so the Exodus gloves procs and the fight begins 🤣

[torn shoal]

Ill believe it when I see it

[ornate gull]

I was wondering abour Hunter

Should Hunter get KIA, do their watches delete any data and fries SHD brick?

Prevent Agent salvage their watches to extract info and reuse them

[torn shoal]

Everything is stored remotely anyway ?

[glad spruce]

Manhunt comm 10, Fish Tacos

||Bridgette Douglas and Bardon Schaeffer discuss about the Castle settlement, where the latter noted the jealousy coming off from the former. Douglas admits her jealousy towards Lauren Fong and Amanda Weekes, seeing their work as making a difference while all she does is clandestine murder sprees.||

||Douglas did note on Schaeffer teasing the hell out of her, which he admit. Afterwards, she felt hungry and in the mood to try out the famous Castle's fish tacos.||

[torn shoal]

I def wouldnt try that fish taco ngl

[glad spruce]

I dunno, the more I learn about it, the more I wanna give it a try

Or maybe I'm just too open-minded to try new food

[torn shoal]

Im open to new food but fish is a no go for me

Especially in this setting

Also how do they survive on only tacos

You need to vary your food guys

[glad spruce]

It's not just tacos

[ashen jungle]

It might be just tacos.

[glad spruce]

And fish fry

[glad spruce]

Oh, and salads

[torn shoal]

Well they dont talk about thoses on propaganda broadcasts

[glad spruce]

They don't have to. We can see the farm on the Castle settlement, growing with vegetables

[obtuse swallow]

I remember the fish fry being talked about at some point on the broadcasts

[late canyon]

Heyy I just started division 1 . Starting to run through missions kinda hard. Can I get help? Or maybe even run the DZ? To get good gear ?

[glad spruce]

This is the lore channel. You should get the div 1 role from channels and roles category

[ashen jungle]

Sometimes I worry about the users here.

[late canyon]

Sorry

[torn shoal]

I dont even worry, about 0% of people here would make it in the div universe

You have to be fit, strong, and VERY lucky

[wicked gorge]

If we were in the universe, we’d look out the window, say we’ve seen this before and never look back

[torn shoal]

To add to this : you also need survival skills like foraging, farming, community care, etc

[ashen jungle]

@outer mason This channel is for discussing the lore of the world of Division, you're looking for #ask-td2-community

[outer mason]

Got it thanks

[fiery wraith]

So can anyone catch me up on when the castle settlement got restored and how/why? I missed quite some updates

[glad spruce]

It got restored around Year 5.

As for how, JTF and civilian militia got busy on decontaminating the damage caused by the DC-62 missiles from the True Sons.

As for why, it's not explicitly said. But considering Black Tusk's attack on the White House, I think it's fair to say the Division is using the Castle as a secondary base of operations

[fiery wraith]

cheers!

I like it, it was like the world actually moved on while I was away, quite cool to see it all

[marble dawn]

Wasn't Schaeffer already in coma when Castle rebuilding started (let alone fish tacos), or do I have the timeline all messed up? Didn't start playing until Stovepipe manhunt.

[glad spruce]

He was still in a coma during the Castle restoration.

Though, technically, the rebuilding started way before our civilian rescue mission.

Back in season 11, we were visiting Wally in the Castle while it was under renovation

[torn shoal]

I think in lore fish is the only food left change my mind

[rich lark]

Venison

You can activley shoot deer, rats, and dog roaming DC

[atomic lantern]

Been itching to play something like the division for sometime now, was thinking abt getting back into div2, any news on anything new coming to the division universe thats worth waiting to get back into it or are updates still coming to div2?

[glad spruce]

This is the lore channel

And second, we have Battle for Brooklyn DLC coming at the end of next month

[mint citrus]

Schaeffer's awake?

[true fox]

next week

[kind hare]

😮

[true fox]

Hey NGN, I forgot to mention this, congratulations on being part of the development team, honestly, I always had a feeling this would happen someday.
It was memorable, you deserve it for the work you do.

[kind hare]

Oh god no, I'm not a part of the dev team. They aren't that crazy to bring me on board 😅
We just got given super sweet hoodies that say "Dev Team".
More of an honorary badge than anything - but I'll take it!!!

[spice stag]

Does anyone else in this chat hate Aaron Keener?

[unreal widget]

I actually love him. I'd marry that guy.

[glad spruce]

You're not the only one lol

[torn shoal]

Ask rivens, they love the guy for sure

[fiery wraith]

wait why is theo helping me in the kelso hunt?

[glad spruce]

Cuz we rescued him last season

[fiery wraith]

must've missed that

wait is this the second manhunt for kelso?

because I quit after puppeteers, came back and saw a kelso manhunt and assumed that chronologically is the next one, but if I look at legacy manhunts there's kelso, keener, theo

[ivory knoll]

Also anyone have a full list (w pics) of free clothing items in division 2 ?

[glad spruce]

Yes, it's the second Kelso Manhunt

[fiery wraith]

damnit I should pick up where I left then rather

[obtuse swallow]

Yeah the legacy manhunts go in descending order lore wise

[glad spruce]

I think Legacy Manhunts would be less confusing if they were fully replayable instead of just the Climax mission

[rich lark]

Good old hunting Juno

Jupiter sorry

[ashen jungle]

Historially, that's a pretty solid joke.

[rich lark]

Bout to snipe elliot page

[ashen jungle]

@rich lark You're going to have to explain that one.

[rich lark]

I was thinking about the movie Juno when I was speaking where Elliot page plays a teenager whose pregnant called Juno

[ashen jungle]

What does that have to do with shooting them with a sniper rifle?

[rich lark]

Manhunt I usally snipe the target

Just straight up got multiple headshot builds

It was dumb joke but heyo

[ashen jungle]

Fair enough.

Well anyway, Jupiter and Juno were the King and Queen of roman mythology, basically Zeus+Hera.
I can't really see that tying in to div2's lore going forward, but wouldn't be entirely shocked if we get something.

[rich lark]

Huh I did not know that

[ashen jungle]

(they were also sometimes depicted as siblings, but I don't think we're getting a Luke+Leia situation).

[rich lark]

Division 2 is screwed enough without incest

[torn shoal]

Yeah let's not add that

[rich lark]

Could you be a non evil rogue?

Like would disobeying orders. For example not answering the DC call and disobey direct order would that make you rogue

[sick lantern]

no, because sanders didn’t and she wasn’t rogue

also agents can’t really take orders

[rich lark]

Directly disobeyingly the order to return to DC seems like it'd do so

[torn shoal]

That dépend on your definition of evil

Isac doesnt understand morals, it's programmed to follow the rules, that's why it couldnt order to kill Ellis back then as he was it's direct superior

But tbh in the world of the division, nobody is good, everyone is some shade of evil

Rogue or not

You gotta do some dirty things to save people

Also dépends on what school of philosophy you belong

If youre a pure utilitarian, then nobody is evil beside amerst

The story made sure to show that being flagged as rogue doesnt mean that you're evil, it's entirely a separate thing

It just means you're off mission

[rich lark]

Well what I mean is I am thinking about a rogue who isn't a manacle villian like we see a lot of rogues.

[sick lantern]

Sanders literally did what you said and wasn’t marked rogue so like

the whole point of Division agents is not to “take orders” but to choose how they tackle their mission

the only “good rogue” is Kelso

everyone else is a practitioner of evil stuff™️

[sick lantern]

which is an evil thing to do because the mission is “save what remains” and not doing that is p. bad

[ashen jungle]

The actual stated reason for the Agents is to ensure continuity of government. They're what we are supposed to save, not people.

It's an aspect of the Agents that doesn't get explored all that much, which is why the Sokolova stuff is so potentially interesting.

[sick lantern]

well “save what remains” and “when society falls we rise” are the phrases that get thrown around a lot more than the continuity of government stuff from nspd51

a government with no people to govern doesn’t really serve a purpose
regardless it’s easily demonstrable how the shd spends considerably more time helping the common people survive

like I think the SHD ensures “continuity of government” by just sort of existing, generally

[ashen jungle]

As I said, "save what remains" refers to the continuity of government, people being around too is a means to that end.

[wicked gorge]

Since we’ve gotten more information on the definition of rogue yes

[sick lantern]

nothing has changed since 2019 on that front

[loud pilot]

There was no order to return to dc it was a distress call sent out by the jtf you can ignore distress calls it’s just immoral

[neat pasture]

Its immoral and heavily judged tho since thats kinda like the main hq of your whole sleeper agent cell

[rich lark]

Might just write it as killing another agent to protect the innocent

[ashen jungle]

Why would Agents give a toss about protecting the innocent over another Agent?

Outside of pesonal morals.

[rich lark]

No win situation kill a fellow agent to save civillians the agent was gonna kill and turn or stop them

[ashen jungle]

If they're going on a killing spree for no actual purpose to the mission, they're going to get marked as a Rogue, and the killing is fully justified.

Remember that Rogue = Treason. It's the death penalty.

[rich lark]

What I mean is knowing they are about to commit the killing spree do you kill a fellow agent and go rogue yourself or do you let them commit the spree go rogue then kill them

[sick lantern]

I daresay the moral discussion of "is it right to stop a killing spree" is basically open and shut

even if you "go rogue" to stop it you don't have to immediately become the joker and start gassing people

cough cough Keener

you can just... not do evil things even when you're rogue

[ashen jungle]

I saw the question more along the lines of "can I kill an Agent if they go on a spree and not be marked as Rogue?"

obviously if you turn into Michael Myers, that's not on-mission.

[rich lark]

Haha thats one way of looking at it but it's more of a case of do you stop a crime before the crime

Would you kill a murder to stop them before they murder even if that makes you the criminal

[ashen jungle]

Stopping crime with murder, before the crime happens, is just you committing a crime, we've had at least one book and a Tom Cruise movie about this.

[glad spruce]

Regarding ANNA's debriefing for this week's scout...

I think it's an innuendo, shall we say.

[wicked gorge]

Nah, they were just eating tacos. No need to take it out of context

[torn shoal]

Well achktually

Stopping someone from murdering someone else is def on mission for isac, you dont have to wait for it to happen

Obviously it would be up to isac to be the judge of that

[neat pasture]

ISAC working like the Machine in Person of Interest

[torn shoal]

But it's not far fetch to say you killed someone to save someone else

Like let's prétend à guy plan on killing a bu ch of people, but doesnt follow through yet, might happen someday, or not.
At what point it is ok to kill him to stop him

[loud pilot]

Keener did nothing wrong

[torn shoal]

Also agents get marked as rogue for much less

Like refusing to abandon civilians in dz got a lot of first wave rogue

So yes, you can be good and rogue

Does that mean you will stay good ? Prob not if you wanna survive

[loud pilot]

Wasn’t there a descent comm about an agent being marked as rogue, loosing access to her tech and dying in the field for break the lock to a pharmacy?

[torn shoal]

Yep, it was to explain rogue tech not being disabled by isac cause even isac can make mistakes

[loud pilot]

Yeah

[torn shoal]

So yeah, isac is VERY flawed

[neat pasture]

So am I

[glad quail]

can i link to my friends twitch somewhere? Hes streaming Div2 now

[torn shoal]

Being marked rogue is a death sentence basically, but that doesnt mean youre a bad person

[torn shoal]

Promotion is not allowed

[glad quail]

then I know 🙂

[sick lantern]

not if ISAC is impossibly moronic and doesn’t understand context

[oak zodiac]

anyone know what the blinking light in the OSS bunker means?

For context I just shot one of the lights on a whim and it started recording a pattern

[fiery wraith]

almost feels like keener has become divisions billy butcher

[loud pilot]

Oss bunker?

[oak zodiac]

It's the side mission where u find an bunker hidden behind a bookshelf

After I completed thst I got the philip protocol mission which was just break a lock to a basement door and then nothing.

[sick lantern]

probably some old hunter puzzle

[torn shoal]

I wonder if someday we gonna have kelso come back as non rogue, but that would require Anna tu take over isac imo, as it cant allow rogues to not be hunted

That would open à whole new narrative, rogue network allying with shd

[misty shore]

||@wispy violet i vaguely remember an anna saying about lesbians concerning kelso/lau i'm thinking?||

[wispy violet]

Who anna? The one saying about priority mission right.

[misty shore]

yeah, i can't remember which scout it was, but it's definitely in there

[obtuse swallow]

It was scout 2 I believe, she said “Why do they always have to fridge the lesbians?”

[ashen jungle]

I'm 99% sure that was not the first mention that Lau was not 100% straight.

[misty shore]

that's the phrase, all i remember she said something about lesbians and with my current sound system the anna vocals doesn't play all the time so i just caught the last bit before it poofed

[obtuse swallow]

Yeah I believe there was a comms piece about her and another woman

[ashen jungle]

Viper, probably. They were an item.

[obtuse swallow]

True, forgot about that

[ashen jungle]

Just to make sure, y'all know what "fridge the lesbians" means, right?

[misty shore]

current scout kind of explained that?

[ashen jungle]

I'm not shocked if you don't, it's a kinda niche term in 2025.

[misty shore]

can't say i do, just considering what we've done so far i was just assuming we supposedly killed lau in a manhunt

[ashen jungle]

Lau died when you got the Achilees Pulse

[obtuse swallow]

I somewhat understand it, unless I’m interpreting it wrong

[ashen jungle]

The use of the term is somewhat confusing, as the same comm also refers to Viper as "bridge", since her name is Bridgette Douglas.

[obtuse swallow]

Didn’t Bridge also have a sister? I can’t remember if she did or not

[ashen jungle]

Not sure, but her dad is in the White House, at the Firing Range.

[obtuse swallow]

Yup, I thought she mentioned a sister in that comms piece, I could be thinking of someone else though

[ashen jungle]

Lau had a sister, she was killed between div1 and div2.

you actually rescued her back in div1, she was playing the Piano

[obtuse swallow]

I remember that, wait I might be thinking of the new Agent they have in comms with Keener. Which ever one had the bug out bunker for her family

I can’t remember her name for the life of me right now

[ashen jungle]

I'm drawning a blank now, it's too recent for me.

But a condenced t;dr on "fridging" is that, it's basically when a story kills off a love interest out of nowhere, usually for some kind of shock value.

IIRC it's actually based on a comic book thing.

[obtuse swallow]

Yup that’s what I thought it was, honestly I believe Faye shouldn’t have been killed. Very clear they wanted to take the story in a different direction

[ashen jungle]

Lau dying is a tricky situation, as I kinda suspect that they were pushed into a corner with her VA, they made it work as best as they could.

[obtuse swallow]

I know her VA is in a really popular show, that’s the only reason I could see them having to do that

[ashen jungle]

It still blows my mind a little that she's Lucy in The Rookie.

it is funny that Keener's one is british though.

[neat pasture]

wait WHA

[obtuse swallow]

Funny you mention it that’s exactly what I’m watching right now as we talk about this

[ashen jungle]

https://tenor.com/view/the-rookie-melissa-oneil-melissa-o'neil-chenford-eric-winter-gif-12671363580312926417

lau IRL

[obtuse swallow]

I’m pretty sure Manny’s VA is British too

He’s in literally every video game known to man

[ashen jungle]

as an old obsesser with Midsummer Murders, Keener sounded so familiar before I realised who he was.

[obtuse swallow]

I don’t get the hate Keener gets, other than he’s affected by poor writing at times I absolutely love him

[neat pasture]

Theo was in What We Do in the Shadows lmao

[ashen jungle]

You aren't kidding, dude is in everything.

[obtuse swallow]

Yeah, I mean the dude literally voices the main character of a Lego game 😭

[ashen jungle]

You know what the funny thing is? We could still have Keener's VA play him in an adaptation.

[obtuse swallow]

Wasn’t Netflix planning an adaptation at one point?

[misty shore]

i would absolutely hate playing div 2 in japanese. probably catch a voice here or there and be like "where/when did i hear this voice before?" and draw an absolute blank

[ashen jungle]

Jake Gyllenhaal was attached at one point, but

[obtuse swallow]

I would love an adaptation, but it does come with the fear of plot holes

[ashen jungle]

An easy fix would be a british-style mini series, make it 3 parts long, or split each part in half and make it 6 episodes.

[misty shore]

was a youtube video on division kind of a fan made thing?

[obtuse swallow]

Yeah, I think they had these Agent Story things too for the first game

[misty shore]

https://imgur.com/a/cG05m1d

[obtuse swallow]

Now that I’ve mentioned Keener, I only came back the season he came back. Was he confirmed to be on Liberty Island or was that a body double or something?

[neat pasture]

Yea according to the wiki its a boody dooble

[misty shore]

no clue, but considering the current stuff going on, maybe he wasn't really dead. our agent didn't check themselves and relied on Kelso to confirm his death so

[ashen jungle]

Without clicking on it, is that the thingy Ubisoft made?

[sick lantern]

yea, can’t remember the character but he came to his wife killed and literally stuffed in a fridge

[obtuse swallow]

I was gonna say, the Keener on Liberty looks nothing like him

[ashen jungle]

and they say representation is lacking.

[misty shore]

could be, all i remember is seeing it on my youtube recommendation list and i clicked it and thought 'oh what if this became a series?" and was hoping a release one day

[obtuse swallow]

Am I the only one who thought Keener in WONY just didn’t seem like Keener? Like he was comically evil, completely goes against his character

[ashen jungle]

There was a series thingy online at one point, I saw it listed on prime.video

[ashen jungle]

The end of div1 has him trying to sell chemical weapons for profit.
he was never a good guy.

[misty shore]

that's probably it then, youtube just has a things like this one Agent Origins Full Length

[obtuse swallow]

Oh 100%, but Chem bombing manhattan just didn’t feel like him. Especially with the comms of him helping civvies cross over to Brooklyn

[neat pasture]

Spoilered just in case ||The chemical bombing of Manhattan was to drag out the Hunters embedded as Division Agents within the ranks. He has a very "machiavelli" approach where he thinks its a noble cause that he's undertaking, but doesn't matter who or what he destroys to get there in the process||

[obtuse swallow]

Ahh, that makes sense now

[ashen jungle]

I will say that trying to help a few people a while back in the city, and trying to sell chemical weapons for profit, are not things that cancel each other out.

[neat pasture]

No not at all

[obtuse swallow]

Definitely, I forgot he tried to do that. I really can’t see a way in which the rogues don’t turn on us after this plot line is done

[neat pasture]

He has moments of compassion underneath the ambitions, after all, he was chosen to be an agent

[ashen jungle]

Just in csae this turns out to be a spoiler and I managed to work out a plot-line early or something, I'll just be vague and say that you shouldn't plan on the Rogues staying as such, or even being what they seem right now.

[obtuse swallow]

Definitely, the rogues, especially Keener in particular, are master manipulators

[sick lantern]

is this in a Descent comm or etc, or are you just assuming

[ashen jungle]

||I'm not talking about Keener, ahem.||

[obtuse swallow]

Damn am I that slow?

[neat pasture]

Vanguard season comm

[sick lantern]

right

something something hunters was a valid theory i just didn’t think we’d heard it yet

i’m failing to see his plan here personally, he’s aaron effing keener did he need to draw more attention to himself?

[neat pasture]

Paranoia and desire to rule can lead to wanting the spotlight idk

[glad spruce]

We do know that ANNA is our main AI in BFB

[loud pilot]

That was Bridgette and Lau

[glad spruce]

Melanie Hoskins

She's gonna appear in Battle for Brooklyn DLC

[bold comet]

How often does The Division 1 go on sale on Steam? I recently got TD2 on sale, havent played TD1 in over a zear back on Ubisoft+

I def want to get it, and not sure how often it might be on sale, some ppl 3 months ago said it was on a sale, so sinds like its somewhat common

[torn shoal]

its often on sale, but its not the right channel, this is for lore

[bold comet]

Ahh, there wasnt a The Division 1 channel/group, wasnt sure were to ask

Oh

I joined this server years ago and only took the The Division 2 roles

[torn shoal]

you can get all the roles you need in id:customize

[shell parrot]

Dose anyone know what Kelso is doing

[misty shore]

considering some recent comms, i'd say she's looking into why lau did what she did, least one comms comes to mind where they seemed to be close like sisters or something?

[mint valley]

Hey I'm coming back from a LOOOOONG break, why did Kelso defect and how tf is Keener still alive?

[misty shore]

yeah, that was a plot twist i wasn't expecting either, but looking back at wony i was like "we did take kelso's and isaac's word that he was dead" then playing tombs is it for Theo and we go in the cafeteria isaac "theo parnell deceased" and theo saying it's not hard fooling isaac had me going ohhhh, why didn't i pick this up when i was going through div 2 for the very first time?!

[sick lantern]

holograms

[torn shoal]

You can play last manhunts to have the story and dialogues

[wicked gorge]

Keeners alive cause he isn’t allergic to bullets

[cold quiver]

Or "money-pox".

[glad spruce]

Lead allergy is a real thing /hj

[keen maple]

I with there was an option to pick which side you want to support

[torn shoal]

This one officer, he wants to go rogue, shoot him

[keen maple]

I just want to join the cleaners

Is that so wrong?

:3

[glad spruce]

Yes

[glad spruce]

Besides, we're already Rogue as far as Black Tusk and the Hunters are concerned.

What the Recruiter said in the Climax mission still rings true /hj

[ashen jungle]

I'm not zoomer enough to know what /hj means.

[glad spruce]

Half-joking

[keen maple]

I mean is it wrong that I’d join the cleaners to burn a virus?

Joe Ferro was right

[torn shoal]

you're not burning a virus, you're burning people

i thought the game made that pretty clear

[keen maple]

A sacrifice willing to save humanity

[ashen jungle]

They are very much not willing.
And also: they don't differentiate if someone is actually sick, or if they just have hayfever, or were near someone who had hayfever.

In div1, there was a camp that might've been sick, so they decided to drop a tanker full of napalm on at least a few dozen families.

[late void]

Also the fact that they were trying to 'contain' the virus when it had already spread far beyond NY

[glad spruce]

If their whole deal was basically burning contaminated areas, I'd understand.

But they're psychotic lunatics

[torn shoal]

its not a sacrifice + they target non sick people

also they target people upholding the quarantine

meaning they are killing people stopping the spread of the virus

very much not a save humanity move

the goal of quarantine is to keep the virus from spreading, not helping spreading it

[wicked gorge]

What’s wrong with being rogue buddy? We get cooler wristwatches

[torn shoal]

its the same watch actually

[wicked gorge]

But red

[torn shoal]

so the same

[wicked gorge]

Major difference buddy

[shell parrot]

The new story mission will be sweater weather you guys

[torn shoal]

not if you're colorblind

also red isnt particularly cool

its the color of passion, love, and violence

not the color of cool

[wicked gorge]

Your just mad your watch is orange

[torn shoal]

its my fav color actually

[wicked gorge]

Yes it is, red light is less likely to be noticed over farther distances and is very good for nighttime exploration

[ashen jungle]

Okay that's enough of whatever that is, back to the lore talk.

[keen maple]

They can become sick, there a liability

[ashen jungle]

You haven't played div1, have you.

A faction that burns entire families alive are not the good guys, they will never be the good guys.

[tepid ibex]

Bruh. Everyone that doesn't wear a respirator is a liability then, huh? And everyone has to eat and sleep so even the Cleaners are a liability.

[sleek plover]

Says the LMB apologist

But yeah, those cleaners burn even virus samples for study, preventing the cure.

They are no better than LMB.

[torn shoal]

Why dont they burn themselve then ? They re at fault that the virus spread out

[keen maple]

I played it when it came out

[ashen jungle]

That was 9 years ago, you should re-try it.

[sick lantern]

you can see in Napalm Production Site they actually have decontamination areas iirc

UV lights so they have sterile indoor spaces

[tepid ibex]

yeah but surely not every cleaner is gonna be making it back to their decontamination areas after every mission/patrol realistically. It'd be impossible for them to keep a mask on all the time, in the mean time. And yeah the pants they have in D2 with the blacklight goes hard too

[sleek plover]

The only thing cleaners are good for is basically exploding cuz their back tanks are punctured

golly they were so easy to kill en masse cuz their smoke grenade pouches are too large, thus purple smoke everywhere

I really enjoyed hearing.conley scream as she dies

[sick lantern]

it’s not like every molecule on the streets is contaminated either though

[tepid ibex]

A statement like that is heresy to Cleaners

[torn shoal]

cleaners would blow up the planet to win vs the virus

they delulu af

[sick lantern]

in Div 2 they’re literally walking around sleeveless and sometimes maskless

[keen maple]

Doesn’t she blow up after she gets killed?

[tepid ibex]

So they too can become sick and are a liability (like everyone else according to tha Burned Man)

[patent narwhal]

isn't there an encounter in one of the games where a cleaner starts coughing and the guy next to him kills him for it

[wicked gorge]

Probably not encounter but a comn

[patent narwhal]

nah it's in div2 cleaner A starts coughing cleaner B asks why are you coughing A responds with smoker trying to quit then sneezes causing B to turn and kill him

[glad spruce]

Yeah, I've seen it happen a few times whenever I was in Lower Manhattan

[torn shoal]

Rikers do that too, they start fighting each others for fun and one of them get killed if you dont stop them

[shell parrot]

I don’t stop them I kill

[patent narwhal]

🙁

I don't like this last scout comm it makes me feel bad

[fresh nymph]

||Roosevelt Island, huh.||

[strange rock]

So

|| Doctor Summers is killed by Kelso, Schaeffer wakes up||

|| not sure what happened with the Ellis echo at the end||

[patent narwhal]

I

what the fuck is going to happen in brooklyn

[strange rock]

Also got all the season collectibles in one run

[fresh nymph]

||Wondering why she killed summers lmao||

[glad spruce]

||Cuz he's supposedly Nat's mole||

[cold quiver]

||Maybe she prefers winters.||

[fresh nymph]

||Yknow, that would explain why he was out so long||

||And why one adrenaline shot or whatever woke him||

[sudden mortar]

|| so we or at the end of October in game timeline, because the legacy manhunt timeline screen says that we went after Schaffer on 27th August and Manny confirmed that he was in a coma for 2 months.||

[wicked gorge]

||Since when did the lieutenant care about danger close?||

[glad spruce]

Manhunt comm 11, Recruiter

||Aaron Keener and Bridgette Douglas discuss about the Hunters, and if she knew Brian Johnson. She's not, but she was familiar, as with other recruited Hunters who's first names are David, Joe or D**y.||

||Keener muses that he and Douglas had very different lives before the Green Poison. Keener also comments that she and Faye would've never met before all this, with him asking if it's wrong he's grateful that Amherst blew up the world, as the crisis brought both women together.||

||Douglas thinks it's wrong from Keener, though she's aware that he's just trying to be sweet. Of course, there's also the bitter pill over the fact that Schaeffer is in Division's custody and in a coma, as well as the fact as the agents are coming for Douglas and Faye next.||

||Douglas heavily laments the situation, almost beginning to cry and wishing they had more time. Keener reminds her that quality is more important. And the comm ends with Douglas having to leave and seeing Faye one last time.||

[strange rock]

Was expecting || hunter masks|| in the master version

[ashen jungle]

||Wait, so who was that doctor that Kelso murdered? Manny didn't seem bothered.||

[strange rock]

|| Summers, the guy you recruit as barber during the campaign||

[lone salmon]

||Kelso suddenly being a jerk for no reason||

||also no more barber i guess||

still feels very random

||can only hope it's tranq rounds but i somehow know to not hold my breath||

[ashen jungle]

||The gurgling sound as she threw the thingy is usually a code in media for blood in the breathing tubes.||

||I don't know if someone sent the wrong audio file for it, or there was a cut line about him being a (the?) spy for Nat, but it deffo felt odd.||

[lone salmon]

apparently [PTS/next season spoilers] ||the doc might be sus and working for the BTSU what||

[ashen jungle]

There is no way I'm reading that.

[lone salmon]

ah i was just referring to what you just said (probably)

||either way, still felt very random||

[strange rock]

Dead

[lone salmon]

||yeah, definitely deadzo||

||this is a trope we call "Superdickery"||

[sick lantern]

“Don’t you realise, hero? It was me all along… Johnson Smith!”

[glad spruce]

||Considering Doctor Summers was Nat's mole, Kelso did the right thing||

[glad spruce]

Manhunt Comm 12, Nat.

||Bridgette Douglas asks Keener if he ever spent so much time making excuses for someone's behavior that he forgets why they're friends to begin with. Keener answers no, as he tends to not let people get that close to him. And when people piss him off, he pushes them away., which prompted Viper to tell him to work on that.||

||When Keener asks on whether to work his attitude on Nat or Mack, Viper says Nat. Then, she goes to a rant about Mackenzie Meret, how she's never going to change, will never be satisfied so she'll never be happy, and she's too old to change.||

||Keener retorts that Mack is only 40 years old, though Viper remarks that Mack has always been like that since she was 16 and it's who she is, and she has no incentive to change.||

||This led to Keener questioning that Viper might as well be talking about Nat. Viper admits that Nat is the saddest person she's ever met, and looking so perfect to others is her superpower.||

||Viper continues on with her rant, wheer she talks about how everyone thinks being perfect is being the person who can fulfill their deepest desires, but that's just access to ISAC's database as far as Nat is concerned. It's really easy to figure out someone's dream when they tell us, to make you appear as this super empathetic and intuitive person, but it's just data and tech.||

||Scan a person's face, have the algorithm search every piece of intel on them for hopes and dreams, and it pops up on Nat's smart lens or watch and therefore she can make anyone's dream come true.||

||Keener couldn't decide if that's amazing and terrifying. Viper says it's both. When people have amazing dreams, it can be amazing. But people who dream of horrible and vile things, that's the world. Our world. Sick and twisted and glorious and beautiful. Full of possibility and pain.||

[ashen jungle]

Was that in a comm? I missed that

[glad spruce]

Yes. A comm from scout 9 goes over Viper and Schaeffer discussing Nat's mole.

||And it makes sense as to why Schaeffer has been unconscious for two months in the in-game timeline.||

[ashen jungle]

||I remember the conversation, but no one was ever mentioned by name.
In fact, at the time IIRC, they mention the idea that it could be a bunch of people, and them not so much being evil as "in debt" to her.||

||I don't think we can safely say that the reason he was in a coma for 2 months was that guy, there's very little chance that no one else would've noticed. ||

[lone salmon]

||What are y'all thoughts on the Ellis retcon?||

[indigo trench]

no side mission after ||Schaeffer awake?||

[glad spruce]

||I don't know if it's a retcon, especially when Ellis's lost memos involve trying to convince himself to not give Nat the key to the Ark.||

[tulip patio]

but it does feel like it wasn't mean to be the original story to me

so they're kind of trying to branch off the fact we don't know exactly what happened

[fresh nymph]

Lack of voice lines could suggest that too

[ashen jungle]

I commend them for having to work around one of the VA's jumping ship.

[glad spruce]

Well, Ellis's lost memos were added in Season 9, so there.

Manhunt Comm 13, Watch.

||Bridgette Douglas shows off the cuff that Mackenzie Meret made for her to hide her SHD Watch to Bardon Schaeffer. Schaeffer reads the inscription that Mack wrote, which he found it bizzare, and Douglas tells him that Mack's the worst.||

||This led to Schaeffer questioning about Mack being a rich philanthropist, which Viper admits it's true and that Mack is very community oriented. But if you're a friend to her, she's a jerk, all about ego and competition. Viper pins the blame on Nat, as Mack and Nat always have to one up each other, to the point that she wishes these two women would just have s** and calm down. But Viper is too aware that'll never happen, as Nat is too repressed and Mack is too much of herself, which Schaeffer found the latter confusing.||

||Viper asks him if he ever meet someone who doesn't think they deserve to be happy so they do everything in their power to make sure they will never be happy, in which Mack is the billionaire version of that person.||

||Viper then elaborates Mack's life, where she lost her parents when she was a kid and was shipped off to a boarding school with the rest of royal and captain's of industry kids. Mack hated her time there, she would never be as beautiful as Nat, and she didn't want her family's inheritance.||

||Especially when Mack didn't want to feed the war machine and pass it on to her kids, so she was hellbent on never having kids and tried to give away all the blood money. As a joke, Mack made a fashion line and it took off, so her blood money multiplied.||

||So as far as Viper is concerned, Mack is nowthis sad rich spinster in a marble tomb trying to make up for generations of exploitation, which is not possible, so she spends her time getting drunk and growing tomatoes. And on occasion, making titanium bracelets for her friends with really inappropriate inscriptions.||

Manhunt Comm 14, The Key.

||In this comm, Aaron Keener and Bardon Schaeffer talk. Schaeffer is committed to helping the Rogues, as he was convinced by Lau and Douglas.||

||Schaeffer soon learns that he's the key to unlock Nat's secret bunkers, though he was apprehensive as Nat will never let Keener near her bunkers.||

||Keener is aware, but also knows that Schaeffer is Nat's favorite among her BTSU inner circle and already has the security clearance needed. They just need a good reson to get Schaeffer to the bunker so he can upload Theo's program.||

[tepid ibex]

Shits going over my head, how does what explain why Schaeffer was unconscious for two months?

[tepid ibex]

blud should've said he was also a sneezer trying to quit, rip

[glad spruce]

Cuz ||Doctor Summers is a medic. He was the mole acting on Black Tusk's behalf. He was acting under orders from Nat to keep Schaeffer from waking up.||

||The first corrupted Echo we see in the climax mission also shows a sillihouete of Summers as if Kelso was trying to warn us about Summers||

||How else would Schaeffer be this unconscious for two months?||

[ashen jungle]

It's a coma, it happens.

They can last decades.

the real question is: ||presumably that was Adrenaline that Kelso injected him with, why did that work?||

||And why did it take so long to inject?||

The f-word is being censored by the auto-mod.

[tepid ibex]

||what a fricker, I'm surprised Summers didn't try to low key kiII Schaeffer if they could keep him asleep so long||

[tepid ibex]

yeah I assumed after 3 times lol

[ashen jungle]

The auto-mod can trigger a ban on its own, so it's best to err on the side of caution.

[glad spruce]

It's adrenaline, so it bumps his body enough stuff to force him out of his coma

[ashen jungle]

||It's weird it was done slowly, I'm assuming to heighten the tension of someone stumbling in on what we were supposed to think was one of Nat's people trying to kill him.||

||The outfit being front-and-centre visible before that did ruin that somewhat.||