h1-builds-and-combat

[mystic vale]

Debating if I want to order a controller from online.

[raw violet]

and you can go ice wine/scintillating feast/cold fusion

[eager scarab]

Awh that sucks knuckleahd

[raw violet]

but that requires a pretty high degree of luck and manipulation

[eager scarab]

Got a hammer, it has chain shot

That could work well with a Zeus attack

[dry ember]

Chain shot is good

[raw violet]

i think for a first run, ice wine is a little better

actually i don't know

i just happen to have better solo ice wine runs

[eager scarab]

Chaos gave me a cast buff, sweet

[mystic vale]

Hm. Or I could just use keyboard. It's the Interact button.

Only need speed for it for fishing or speedrunning.

Don't mind me, Tisiphone. Just catching six exploding shields next to you.

[turbid needle]

Only one shield explodes now.

[mystic vale]

Odd. There was 300 damage over her head.

Maybe that was my bull rush + catching the shield?

[turbid needle]

Yes.

[sudden dagger]

Is there a way to see past boons and upgrades you've had within the game? Or is that a spoiler

[mystic vale]

Is the amount of blue/gold laurel rooms set or within a variable range or...?

Patrick: Circumspectly, yes. Once you get the List of Minor Prophecies.

[turbid needle]

@sudden dagger Check the Administrative Chamber.

[sudden dagger]

Oh, ok, I was wondering what those descriptions meant

Thanks

[mystic vale]

Pat, didn't you just start today or yesterday? Or did I have you confused with someone else?

[sudden dagger]

Yeah lol

Sorry

[mystic vale]

I don't think he's got the Admin office yet. :p

[sudden dagger]

It's a lot of fun though!

I have the renovation guys

[unkempt pagoda]

basically, you'll unlock it, keep playing

[mystic vale]

When you get the List of Minor Prophecies, it will give you quests for collecting each boon.

[unkempt pagoda]

oh lmao

[mystic vale]

So you'll see which ones you haven't tried yet.

[sudden dagger]

Cool!

[mystic vale]

Yeah, he's just started, he doesn't have the List yet. :p

I can spoil you with the wiki, if you like.

But I think you were trying to be mostly unspoiled.

[unkempt pagoda]

you'll learn everything just by playing anyways

[sudden dagger]

I was actively avoiding rooms that gave the gems because I didn't think the renovation guys were that good

[turbid needle]

They offer cash in-run.

[mystic vale]

Not until he gets that upgrade, Schpoon.

[sudden dagger]

Yeah I was - just wanted to ask in case I was missing something that should be obvious

[mystic vale]

He's a good 20 runs short of that.

I would focus on Darkness and Keys for now. Gemstones aren't bad either. Just stick to buying stuff on the far left tab.

95% of the stuff in other tabs is strictly cosmetic.

Also; take note that on the mirror, there's arrows on the left side that switch between two ability choices.

[sudden dagger]

I got the scrying thing for the room

[agile prism]

Late game you will become a gemstone hoarder

[mystic vale]

I definitely recommend replacing Cthonic Vitality with Dark Regeneration ASAP.

[agile prism]

^^

[sudden dagger]

I'll look in the mirror again, I haven't got the 5 keys yet to unlock more stuff but I did just unlock all the weapons

There seems to be a rotating modifier that gives +.2 darkness on some weapons I've been going for

[mystic vale]

That's good - and use the one with the purple swirl around it each run for 20% bonus Darkness (which has synergy with Dark Regeneration.)

Yep.

Each run has one weapon with the purple swirl, Dark Thirst.

[unkempt pagoda]

i believe that the switching of talents is something that has to be unlocked first

[mystic vale]

I still let it dictate my choice of weapon each run.

Onyx: I was told it's available by default. I'm mid-run - could you start a clean file and check?

[sudden dagger]

I'm not sure what cthonic vitality and dark regen are though, or where to find them

[mystic vale]

They're mirror options. Cthonic Vitality is second from the top if I recall.

Yeah, second.

[unkempt pagoda]

no, i remember when they were first introduced

[sudden dagger]

I have 8 escape attempts so far - just got past Meg for the second time - first time I got all the way to the minotaur

[unkempt pagoda]

the convo with nyx implied that ||i already had the mirror for a while and now i could unlock more power||

[sudden dagger]

Sometimes I want to end my run early just to see what's new in town, heg

Heh

[unkempt pagoda]

also, there have been others in this server who were also confused at what the other talents were, and it turns out they weren't unlocked yet

[mystic vale]

One day I'll start a clean file and double check when it unlocks.

[sudden dagger]

Oh also first time I got to ashplodel I walked right into the lava and burned the revive lolol

[mystic vale]

I know I didn't notice the arrows until I unlocked the 30 key upgrade to mirror.

But I was told they unlock sooner. I don't recall by whom though.

They may or may not have been reputable.

[hazy yacht]

https://i.imgur.com/K3OcW9q.png

we streakin boyos

[mystic vale]

+119% DS damage?

SURE THING CHAOS!

[raw violet]

i was able to switch them prior to unlocking more mirror upgrades

i distinctly remember starting off with stubborn defiance until I could unlock more than one death defiance

[mystic vale]

See, I think things may have changed since the patch they were introduced.

Company just arrived so I've got to go.

But if you'd check, I'd appreciate it. Failing that, if I don't have a PM from you later, I'll probably check myself.

[dry ember]

ugh

https://imgur.com/emEvZbb

I tried desperately to get my time sub 20

but the game just won't cooperate

didn't get any good attack boon till half way through Asphodel

other boons are just not synergistic either

[eager scarab]

Oh man

World smasher is crippling this run I'm on

It's the shield hammer that gives you an short lunge to the enemy

[turbid needle]

I get why people don't like it but I don't think I've ever lost a run that had World Smasher.

[unkempt pagoda]

world smasher is good, it's just directly outclassed by charged shot

[turbid needle]

I once suggested that Charged Shot scale like Bull Rush does and people got really salty about it, which is funny because that was before Charged Shot was even buffed or used by most people (myself included).

Or it was right after it was fixed.

[unkempt pagoda]

i think charged shot should either switch its damage with world smasher, or just have its damage nerfed in some way

[turbid needle]

Scaling with charge amount would be a good fix.

[unkempt pagoda]

world smasher sacrifices both defense and mobility for an attack that does less damage than charged shot, which only sacrifices mobility (and is also ranged and piercing)

similar problem as spread fire, actually

[turbid needle]

Spread Fire is an entirely different problem, where it's an AoE attack with high base damage and incredibly high attack rate.

It's like old T-Pose Nova but better/worse because you can spike its damage much higher and it hits much faster.

[dry ember]

If people really think Spread Fire is too good, would a tweak be to reduce the attack speed rather than damage?

[turbid needle]

No, revert it to fire five pellets like it used to.

[unkempt pagoda]

^

[turbid needle]

You can't reduce the attack speed anyway, it's based on Dash-Strikes resetting attack cooldown.

Its AoE characteristics are too good.

[unkempt pagoda]

alternatively, lower the damage to something like 30

[turbid needle]

Hard disagree.

[unkempt pagoda]

old spread fire was balanced because of the nuance and variance of having five individual pellets, instead of the current aoe

also no piercing lol

[turbid needle]

"Lemme just hit these five Louts all barely clustered together real quick for full damage by clipping them all with my Nova Gun."

[unkempt pagoda]

was there some sort of technical problem that old spread fire had? that's the only reason i can think of, that made sgg change it

[turbid needle]

Not that I know.

[sudden dagger]

I'm imagining some say I might be able to invest my resources and generate an economy... I don't want to know if that's going to happen!

[unkempt pagoda]

either that or trying to make it feel more "shotgun"-like

[turbid needle]

It could very quickly apply Hangover and Chill stacks.

[minor ore]

first win ever

[unkempt pagoda]

congrats!

[minor ore]

https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/1008189224118548310/7E304F66F7C3C1246DA10AD3FD27A939E8539D2D/

finally

[turbid needle]

Holy, Epic Jolted for 120 damage!?

@amber sparrow I think there's been a mistake, attacking again after an enemy has Doom applied to them does not delay Doom from triggering.

[amber sparrow]

Seriously?!

Perhaps I am quite mistaken, then

I don't believe I ever noticed it proccing while hitting the same target sequentially

But that could definitely be human error

[raw violet]

You also have merciful end which makes ares significantly stronger

Ares does seem fairly reliant of duos, though

[amber sparrow]

I did try to avoid making mention of balance in my feedback, as it's purely a thematic one

[raw violet]

But is probably a combo that is more in line with what you expected

[amber sparrow]

I've no doubt Ares is strong when you play him correctly

[raw violet]

I hear you. I have no dog in that race

[amber sparrow]

It just so happens that my playstyle, which thematically seems to fit Ares (attack fast and hard with little regard for defense), doesn't fit what he provides me

Gotcha

[raw violet]

I do see the theme of hunting, precision, and crit. So I understand Artemis

Though, I guess in that vein, why is she also so so strong for cast builds?

Arrows?

[amber sparrow]

Cast makes sense to me precisely because of arrows

I would have put Artemis in the accuracy, ranged damage, and planning realms

Doom, to me, always seemed like a mechanic that was put under Ares by mistake

Because it fits my mental workup of Artemis so well

As though Zagreus was marking a target, and Artemis, keeping watch with her bow, looses an arrow at the marked target after taking aim (the time delay on Doom expiring and dealing damage)

[sudden dagger]

I forget who asked, but I got the 5 key mirror upgrade, and now I can toggle between two choices on each line

Except I only get the currently shown benefit, not the one underneath

[amber sparrow]

Correct, @sudden dagger

Think of it this way: whichever one is currently showing is the one that is activated

It allows you to mix and match the passives on the mirror to suit your playstyle

Or even from one run to the next

[minor ore]

Is it possible to get stuck at a high heat level in hell mode?

[magic dagger]

can you get ice wine from mistral dash on demeter?

[lapis matrix]

Yes, I think so

[fallen mirage]

Does anybody know if enemy-enemy collision is intended?

If you get two thugs right next to each other you can special->dash-attack them to kill them in one combo

[latent moss]

Hey guys, i was wondering if anyone has some tips with the new fist weapons? I kinda suck bad with them and I cant figure some boon combos to make them shine a bit. Thanks!

[tepid ridge]

Most people really like any effects that stack on quick hits, so I like Demeter’s chill but people also recommend Zeus Lightning and Dio hangover. The special gets really good with some Artemis crits. And learning to dash strike etc is more important on the gloves than almost any other weapon, except maybe the bow, because the goats are supposed to be float like a butterfly, sting like a bee

[latent moss]

Thanks! I just tried Demeter's chill and its already a bit better.

I just find it hard to output enough damage to feel like its worth being that close to the enemies.

But these tips will help a lot :)

[sudden dagger]

I'm having a lot of fun leveling up the chaos egg, giving chaos all my ambrosia, and trying not to die. On an early attempt I got most of the way through Elysium, but idk what I did right besides the cursed blade. Now I die in Tartarus most of the time

[west totem]

Yknow, i had no idea you needed boons for other boons to appear that ARENT duos

[spiral gale]

I'm like 3 hours into Hades

I wanted to play something different for a change and wow im so glad i did

[umbral lagoon]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/554057222926106628/712128206639202324/20200518191004_1.jpg

farmed blood with chaos money boon kek

proceeded to die to hades

but i learned some things

flurry shot hammer + ricochet hammer + ares doom is OP for bow

[dull saffron]

Anyone know if the god-specific keepsakes only work for when you start a new run?

[supple roost]

I don't know if when you transition from zone to zone if keeping the same god-specific keepsake works, but I can confirm changing to a new one for a new zone does work. @dull saffron

[unkempt pagoda]

you only get the forced god once

[mighty ermine]

they can only force an appearance of that god once, indicated by a "1" below the keepsake icon if it hasn't been "used" yet

but it continues to affect rarity

[unkempt pagoda]

but keeping the keepsake still grants you the passive rarity boost

[mighty ermine]

you can swap to other god keepsakes inbetween regions after unlocking the keepsake rack, and they will have their 1 charge to force the god to appear

[dull saffron]

Yeah that's what I was figuring

[dry ember]

how do you use the Arthur blade?

I tried an attack build with it and kinda fail miserably at ||Hades||.

[mighty ermine]

how do you mean attack build, exactly? and if you can make it to the final boss with Arthur then it might just be a matter of getting his patterns down better

[dry ember]

oh and follow up

[mighty ermine]

was there any particular attack that gave you trouble?

or parts of the run etc.

[dry ember]

yeah part of the run I think

one room u got stun locked with the rats

trying to special

granted I have forced overtime at max

but the blade just feel clunky

[mighty ermine]

arthur with FO2 can get tricky sometimes, yeah

[dry ember]

even at normal

[copper eagle]

I've had arthur hitting crits over 2.5k with artemis attack, shadow strike (+200% from behind) +50% from behind on MoN. Run something like demeter/aphro/dio special.. athena dash, deflect everything.

Super cushy to deflect projectiles while you are in the safe zone.

Don't even need Athena's call, can go for more deeps

[dry ember]

yeah I had demeter boon for my attack

[copper eagle]

The base attack is so high you probably want crit there.

[dry ember]

in hindsight probably not the best idea

Atermis offered me a common deadly strike

and an epic flourish

[mighty ermine]

artemis and aphro are both solid for arthur

but yeah with common

i hesitate

[dry ember]

I was a bit concerned that arthur build would mainly involve special spam

[copper eagle]

I didn't realise at first but it seems you can get into the 2nd part of the attack combo out of dash-strike, too

[dry ember]

can you elaborate?

[mighty ermine]

yep, your basic combo can carry over through dashes

to a degree

[dry ember]

is that arthur specific or all sword?

[mighty ermine]

arthur specific

[lapis matrix]

Yes

All three strikes

Although the dash strike upgrade for the hammer only works with the first one

[dry ember]

Ok. I'm slow and really want to understand this.

So you attack

[lapis matrix]

Attack dash

[dry ember]

then dash

then your combo continue?

[lapis matrix]

Yes

If you press attack again

[dry ember]

what would dash strike play into this?

[copper eagle]

Repositioning for backstab. Dash attack then attack from neutral probably yields attack2, as well?

[dry ember]

would dash strike cancel the normal attack

[lapis matrix]

No

The second swing becomes the new dash attack

So it be a wide swing

Third swing is also a wide swing

[dry ember]

I see. So attack => dash strike with be a "combo" dash strike

[lapis matrix]

Why don't you try it out with Skelly?

[mighty ermine]

dash-strike damage bonuses won't apply to every single combo attack carried over through a dash though

only initial dash-strikes

[lapis matrix]

Yup

As will the dash strike hammer upgrade

[dry ember]

ok I will just fiddle with Skelly abit

thanks!

[umbral lagoon]

wait does cyclops jerky or patroclus jerky increase attack only

not special?

or both?

[lapis matrix]

No idea

[umbral lagoon]

i always for some illogical reason assumed overall damage

but i realized it probably might not

[mighty ermine]

just attack, yeah

[copper eagle]

I think attack only. It may give a tooltip to the side. I've seen runners skip taking Hourglass for Styx [for Jerky] when doing a Special focused build.

[umbral lagoon]

wew i wasted so much money then loool

improvement in this game is literally knowledge

thx everyone

[mighty ermine]

np

yeah i still check the wiki for boon prereqs sometimes if i'm feeling unsure

far after 100hrs haha

[lapis matrix]

Hades has a lot of combos

[mighty ermine]

in multiple senses too

[mystic vale]

Okay, before I do this, does anyone have a fairly fresh file or a desire to make one?

[lapis matrix]

What for if I may ask?

[mighty ermine]

you might wanna specify what it is that you're planning to do

[mystic vale]

Well I was looking to see when the secondary mirror options unlock.

I'm told it was before the point I noticed (after unlocking the 30 key level), but I've just found it's not an option on a fresh file either. Or at least, you need to make it past chamber 12 if so.

It may be a certain number of runs, a certain point of progress, or one of the earlier mirror unlocks.

I was just trying to find out when, because I want to know when to suggest Dark Regeneration to newer players.

The wiki fails to state anything beyond that: Each ability from the Mirror has two versions (one colored red and one colored green) that need to be invested in separately. For example, spending Darkness on Shadow Presence does not upgrade Fiery Presence. Only one version of each ability can be active at a time and they can be switched between freely while reflecting at the Mirror.

It doesn't mention when the green options unlock, or even that they're initially locked.

@lapis matrix @mighty ermine

[mighty ermine]

i'm unsure about the unlock threshold or requirements myself because i had already been pretty far in by the time the nighty night update rolled out

this is probably the case with a lot of others and part of why it's poorly documented

[lapis matrix]

From what I can tell it takes a few runs and Nyx tells you about it first

[mystic vale]

I'll give it another run real quick, after that I want to do my Slay the Spire daily.

[lapis matrix]

I started a few days ago

But I can't recall the exact circumstances

[mystic vale]

I think I figured out why I can't "perfect catch" on fishing; I can get Power Shot on the bow right about 90% of the time, even if things are hectic, but that's because I'm releasing the button right before the actual flash happens. I feel like you need that kind of timing for a PC, but I always have to see the flash before I push the button.

(Has anyone who's actually good at the game made a fresh file and won the first run? Or does some kind of blockade exist to stop that?)

[lapis matrix]

Probably not

I mean turning off the talents is sort of like a fresh run

[mystic vale]

If you have 0 points in Aspect of Zagreus on the given weapon, yeah.

Also, can they go off? I've never tried.

[lapis matrix]

Yeah in pact of punishment

Routine Inspections

Turns the 3 talents off starting from the bottom

There are 4 ranks so you can turn off the entire mirror

[mystic vale]

Ah, true.

I admit, I'm having some trouble prioritising what to take. I want keys and darkness for Mirror options but I also know I should be taking some Gems to unlock Troves.

[lapis matrix]

Gems first I would say

You don't need too many keys in the beginning

[mystic vale]

I dunno 'bout you, but I loves me some Aegis.

Also, weapons will get the Dark Thirst swirl whether or not they're unlocked.

Got Meg on my second run.

Definitely didn't do that on my first file.

[cunning urchin]

You can use a key to reset the mirror, too.

[mystic vale]

Ah, good morning to you, Mewmew.

[rotund wagon]

how does Rush Kick interact with aspect of Demeter

[cunning urchin]

but that's because I'm releasing the button right before the actual flash happens. I feel like you need that kind of timing for a PC
No, it's just a matter of reacting to the flash (or any other cue you prefer). There's nothing else to it. It's just your natural reaction speed + practice.

[mystic vale]

Two runs in and still no arrows. I'll get back to it in a bit.

It's sort of neat playing with a lot more knowledge but limited options.

My first Nectar went to Skelly, although I wanted to do Dionysius.

(Also, my first run got Merciful End, so you can get Duos immediately if it comes up.)

[cunning urchin]

For anyone who can't get perfect catches at all, I would genuinely recommend looking into if you don't have bad input lag somewhere.

[opal glade]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/602533349898321931/712163464998551582/unknown.png?width=1204&height=677 lol i did almost 1k damage on a hit once on this build and it was insane 😂 😂 😂

[elfin ledge]

does dodge chance stack linearly with zag fists, hermes boons and plume?

[opal glade]

also after 2000years i finally got my last aphrodite boon

[cunning urchin]

Dodge and all damage reduction are multiplicative.

[mystic vale]

My R1 button is going out and L3 doesn't press fast enough. I tried the keyboard but still can't manage, even though I feel like I'm hitting it the instant the flash happens.

[raw violet]

@mystic vale the guy that was asking about the alternative mirror upgrades came back and said he could alternate them when he unlocked the first set of mirror upgrades

[cunning urchin]

Keyboards can have quite a bit of input lag. If R1 is going out, it might make you more hesitant to press that, which would be "only" milliseconds, but that can make all the difference.

[mystic vale]

Ah, that's good news. My first keys went to Aegis, as promised.

So I would have been five keys from discovering that myself.

[cunning urchin]

Try USB vs bluetooth for your pad. Also try different USB ports and disconnecting other unnecessary USB devices. Check your fps in-game, lower fps mean more input lag.

Also what monitor do you use? Some monitors have really bad input lag.

[mystic vale]

It's a laptop. Asus.

[dry ember]

Speaking of lag, does some stage just way underperform others?

I have lags and dips below 20 sometimes

And smooth 60 in others.

[mystic vale]

Altering ports, will check FPS in a bit.

Still Slaying the Spire.

[cunning urchin]

#h1-builds-and-combat is the new #h1-tech-support.

[mystic vale]

Being fair, I was originally discussing fishing. 😉

[umbral lagoon]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/554057222926106628/712169581489422386/20200518220630_1.jpg

second clear with chiron right after fists!

yeah it gets way easier when you know how to fight hades

not going to post any boring op runs anymore lol

at this point my weapons are getting strong enough that skill is no longer necessary

after this imma keep upgrading chiron to max lol

[agile prism]

Haha well that is the fun is triying new builds and finding new things that work

Dont worry one you start getting into double digit heats more skill is necessary

[umbral lagoon]

nice

[dry ember]

Dude I'm in awe with the fact that you have your first run with Hell Mode on

[agile prism]

And if the heats dont do it, go for speed

[cunning urchin]

at this point my weapons are getting strong enough that skill is no longer necessary
Until you turn up the heat.

[umbral lagoon]

if you look at my build, i feel like i would have lost if i didn't have divine protection

if you deflect, it does NOT kill the protection

[agile prism]

That is pretty powerful

[umbral lagoon]

yup

i definitely might not have won if i didn't have that

though i played pretty well

only got hit by boiling blood once (taking down my barrier)

everything else was kind of me being an idiot and thinking ares' blades non-upgraded do any damage to hades

and getting chopped by him right after my call expires

should have just been patient and kept shooting arrows

[dry ember]

Turn Forced Overtime on.

[umbral lagoon]

yeah i'm a slow player

[dry ember]

It's... fun.

I'm slow myself.

[umbral lagoon]

oh wait technically

i do every single trove

[dry ember]

But I find it fun. I do have a lot of troubles doing it.

[umbral lagoon]

for farming stuff

so i might be faster

just haven’t been playing for speed

[cunning urchin]

FO2 + EM3 + HL5.

[umbral lagoon]

and i got the legendary by doing every single room in styx

[dry ember]

FO2 Hades obliterated me

[umbral lagoon]

so my effort somehow paid off

translate 😓

[dry ember]

I lost a Scintillating Feast Ice Wine Hera Bow run

Like

[cunning urchin]

I almost find it easier to evade FO2 Hades spin than regular speed.

[dry ember]

how do I even lose with such an OP build.

Although it's Tight Deadline that kills me. I need like 10 more seconds.

[cunning urchin]

Actually might be easier because he moves forward faster, and his hitbox is active for a shorter duration.

[dry ember]

His forward lunge is harder though

At FO2 the animation is very close to the Skull throwing move.

I usually dash through the skull

So naturally I eat his attacks

[cunning urchin]

Just dodge diagonally.

[dry ember]

Yeah. Force of habit. I usually dodge by dashing into enemies rather than away.

[lament coral]

to boldly dash where no one's dashed before!

[cunning urchin]

bouldy dash*

[cedar hemlock]

Trying out Aegis Aspects. Does Aspect of Chaos hit with multiple shields at point blank? I noticed they don't seem to bounce between enemies anymore

[tepid ridge]

It does

[cedar hemlock]

Ah ok. It was hard to tell so was curious if I just missed it. Thanks!

[lapis matrix]

It never seems to that with me

[cedar hemlock]

From the looks of it, it adds the numbers together, but doesn't fully do 100% on third shield hit

So instead of three 18s you'd see 54

Or somethin glike that. Gonna look again

[unkempt pagoda]

chaos shield can get some shields at point blank, but the shields are thrown in a circular pattern (at max, 5 shields in a radius)

chaos shield used to have all the shields thrown in front, at the same spot

[cedar hemlock]

Ah ok. I see they're bouncing off the walls and only hit one when it's the multi shield throw. Anyway, thanks for pointing that out. Figuring out how I want to spend blood so this helps

[rotund wagon]

I love Theseus reaction when you use a call

"But goddess Demeter what did I do???????"

[dry ember]

Or when you use companion

A Fury? In Elysium?

[rotund wagon]

someone gotta make a meme

"when you are fighting the Blackguard in the name of god but the gods are aiding them"

[stoic thicket]

So since I just managed to complete project: get out once with each weapon, and now have more Titan blood than ever before, any suggestions what to spend them on first?

[raw violet]

i think leveling chaos shield to 5 is probably a good strategic move

[stoic thicket]

That was my thought as well, that thing looks super strong.

[rotund wagon]

I would recommend Zeus shield over Chaos

[stoic thicket]

And I like using it.

[raw violet]

i find it incredibly easy to crank out all your bounties (heat 1-20) using the shield

and that in turn can feed further titan bloods

it does not, however, teach you particularly good habits

but it is the most painless way to crank out bounties if you are in need of blood to experiment with

at least i think so

[umbral lagoon]

honestly i'm still not exactly sure how to use shield

i had some okay runs with it but i always fail at blocking the right direction

swarms suck

[raw violet]

hold attack, release, special, dash to safety

or dash to safety then special

whatever floats your boat

[umbral lagoon]

i always had bad positioning

[raw violet]

clear room in 15 seconds

[umbral lagoon]

cause i that's exactly what i did

elysium was hard

even with doom i just didn't have the damage output

i'll try a run with shield since this was before i beat hades

it's been a while

[raw violet]

i think zeus special is strongest if you can get all the additional boons

but dio is the most reliable

i.e. requires less set up

[umbral lagoon]

aight i'll try it out

[raw violet]

but i find zeus more fun

but for any heat where i might not be able to rely on having a bunch of duos or additional boons, dio alone can get you through to the end without much of a problem

[umbral lagoon]

just making sure but dionysus right?

[raw violet]

yeah

i like dio and aphro for a super safe and super reliable build

that's not actually reliant on any tier 2s or duos

[umbral lagoon]

i think my playstyle would fit some demeter support as well

[raw violet]

demeter/zeus if you want something that can clear rooms and put out a ton of dps in a very short period of time

[umbral lagoon]

^^^ cause i remember being really slow

and not getting the direction of the bull rush right to do the most damage

super awkward

[raw violet]

demeter and zeus is fast

cold fusion does a lot of work

it just requires a little set up

dio aphro is slow, enemies do little damage to you and you put out steady and reasonable output

and does not really need low tolerance to do the heavy lifting

[umbral lagoon]

one specific thing i'm worried about is

[raw violet]

you could also do ares attack and athena special since you were trying doom

[umbral lagoon]

how do you chase after those souls in elysium

cause when you kill those soldiers their eyeball things end up flying away

and chasing them down is pretty annoying with all the traps and obstacles in the way

[raw violet]

usually just bullrush them

[gaunt tundra]

Thats the fun part

[raw violet]

or you can just do a standard special throw

[umbral lagoon]

map is too big to have chaos special do anything good

[raw violet]

not sure, i've not really had a problem with the size

[umbral lagoon]

esp. if the bull rush is closer range

cause it's your only damaging option

spearmen suck

[gaunt tundra]

You can also go cast + special

[raw violet]

i find i like space more when using chaos aspect since walls sometimes just eat the thrown shields

[umbral lagoon]

oh and the mini chariot bombs 😦

[gaunt tundra]

Eugh those are a pain

[robust gate]

it can get annoying though since you can't bull rush until your real shield comes back

[raw violet]

you can literally sit in a corner and eat the suicide chariots with your shield

[umbral lagoon]

^^^that

chaos doesn't return shield

[gaunt tundra]

But i think they cant damage you if you shield from them right?

[umbral lagoon]

immediately

[raw violet]

or bullrush through them

or dash through objects

[robust gate]

also I found out that dread flight is a wasted hammer upgrade for chaos, so don't pick that one ever

[umbral lagoon]

i'll try a chaos run one of these days

but if you guys have any finished runs pls screenshot to help me understand the boon choices

[raw violet]

i pick dread flight sometimes when there's nothing else

[umbral lagoon]

cause i think last time i had crap builds

[raw violet]

there's not really any shield options that i like all that much other than sudden rush

[robust gate]

it just sucks that is only works when throwing one shield, though it probably would be too broken

yeah sudden rush and the 400% damage to armor are my picks

[raw violet]

not to double back, but if your goal is to just farm titan blood and work your way through heat, i would not recommend Zeus aspect (over chaos aspect)

if you like zeus aspect, that's fine

but there's a reason most high heat completions (40+) are done with chaos aspect

[umbral lagoon]

oh i think i know why it might have been awkward

do you all play with aim assist?

i think it's on by default

never tried turning it off

my bull rush defense kept snapping to weird things i think, but maybe i'm just remembering wrong

[raw violet]

i do

[umbral lagoon]

bull rush probably doesn't snap

i'd have to check

[raw violet]

i don't think it does

[umbral lagoon]

but i'm probably wrong before

i just don't remember why it was so weird

but no more time to play tonight

gonna try the shield run first thing tomorrow

[raw violet]

i would probably be annoyed if it did snap

[umbral lagoon]

yeah it's probably just me playing with bow for the past several hours

[raw violet]

if you're having trouble playing shield, there's tons of vids on youtube of people playing it so you can get a sense of what people are doing

just have to make sure it's a newer vid so it's on the right patch

in fact, there is currently a heat 46 completed run that was just done this week with chaos aspect

[robust gate]

has anyone done higher than 46?

[raw violet]

no

one person got to second phase hades on heat 50

but that's as much as i know

i think just this last week 2 people have cleared 46

at least have recorded it

[robust gate]

yeah, with arthur aspect

[raw violet]

yah

doing it with arthur is pretty nuts

doing it with chaos is sort of par for the course

not to take away from it or anything

cause that's what i would do

[robust gate]

ik, i think that only worked cause of the good artemis boons, without them I don't think that would have won

[raw violet]

to be fair, that's true for any high heat run

[robust gate]

yeah

[raw violet]

pray to rng

especially if you go with routine inspection and approval process

which i think you mostly have to have to some degree, maybe, i don't remember

[robust gate]

yeah. degrand was smart to keep his mirror stuff and only did 1 rank of approval process

[raw violet]

yeah, he had a really smart set up

but when you go all in to 50 heat

oh boy

really pray to rng

[robust gate]

guess we'll have to wait and see what haelian and him are gonna try

[raw violet]

haelian is the one that got to hades on 50

basically got dio special on chaos

out the gate

and was able to ride that all the way

[robust gate]

oo haven't seen that one

[raw violet]

i think he did that on...friday?

should be able to see it

tried again today but no luck

[stoic thicket]

Okay, thanks for the tip with the Chaos shield, Krasher. I maxed it out with the blood I had available and immediately managed to clear my first heat run with it, even if it was fairly close thanks to a somewhat bad build and a couple mistakes on my part.

[turbid arch]

Haelian already doing attempts for 50 heat?

That mad lad.

[lapis matrix]

Almost completed it too

Got to 2 phase Hades or so I hear

[dense locust]

also keep in mind these guys are mapping out seeds and using rng manipulation a lot of the time to find an ideal path

[mossy breach]

how do they do that? a modded game?

[dense locust]

no there are certain actions in the game that you can do once the encounter ends that will change the offerings of the next room

its the main technique behind the speed runs

[lapis matrix]

The keepsakes, no?

[dense locust]

and since you can replay the same seed over and over, with enough time, patience, and meticulous practice, you can make a seed offer you nearly everything you want

no

its sort of taking advantage of the way the game was programmed

things like breaking 3 pots after an engagement ends, and then pausing

will give you a different result in the same seed in the next room

if you'd like to know the details head over to the speed running discord

[lapis matrix]

Ah, more classical RNG manipulation

[dense locust]

im sure someone there would be happy to explain the system

[lapis matrix]

They have an entire discord on it

[dense locust]

https://discord.gg/5Zt2Uk

i don't find the process enjoyable myself

but i can appreciate the work that goes into it

[west totem]

best server icon

[neon fiber]

10/10
Even dusa is disgusted of your speedrunning shenanigans but they still please hermes

[elfin ledge]

what gives end run title 'perfect clear'?

[neon fiber]

I assume not getting hit

[elfin ledge]

I was certainly hit

[real nebula]

if you end the run with full health

idk if it procs if you have empty defiance slots tho

[elfin ledge]

oh nice, that I did since I healed with companion and yeah I had two defiances down

[dense locust]

this is a good segue into something i've been wondering

[neon fiber]

i wonder what nyx's beauty treatment is
she does look pretty young despite being literally older than demeter and probably all the olympians put together

[dense locust]

which is if anyone knows if there is a priority system on end game titles

[neon fiber]

elaborate dongman

you mean the victory screen titles?

[dense locust]

yeah

[untold quiver]

@neon fiber she's never in the light....that 🌞 ages you

[neon fiber]

that's a pretty good question
i assume the game gives priority to the one you had the more requirements to?

for example, if you qualify for a random title and olympus caller, but used more calls than anything else i imagine you'll get olympus caller either way

[dense locust]

i've met the requirements for more than one victory screen title before and im just curious if anyone knows how the game decides which one it gives you

[neon fiber]

@untold quiver checks out, that would also explain why hades looks somewhat younger (if also not as healthy) than his brother zeus

[dense locust]

im guessing its which ever you meet the requirements of first

also they are gods and probably have a godlike skin care regimen...

[untold quiver]

Also Demeter is clearly in her "Winter" phase as shown by her attitude and boons......most seasonal deities change appearances.....which would explain why she looks much older than everyone else

[neon fiber]

could be
maybe spring demeter looks younger

that would be a neat touch

[dense locust]

they probably could change their physical appearance on a whim but have chosen this look for a specific purpose

[tame apex]

It's been maybe 20 escapes I didn't get Titan's Blood from the 1st Boss. Diamonds and Ambrosia are super rare as well. I got to wonder if you get those by fighting the Bosses with new weapons only ?(like, if you already beat it with your actual weapons, you will only get gems). Is that so or is it just super rare ?(I still have the feeling I had more of those at the beginning of my game experience)

[spiral portal]

Blood, diamond, ambrosia have 100% chance to drop first time with new weapon(excluding weapon aspect)

To get more after the first boss win, you need to increase the heat level of the run

Other ways to get them are through shop in lounge or that charon shop in the last stage

@tame apex

[tame apex]

Hmmmm okay! I just unlocked the heat level mechanic today actually, thanks for telling me :)!

[timid sentinel]

Yeah I've just been increasing the heat level by 1 after each succesful run
unless I switch weapon of course

[lament coral]

getting the first set of items from each weapon on 0 heat is by far the easiest way to get started

you get a feel for all the weapons and some goodies

[timid sentinel]

what happens if I just jump from heat 10 to 15
can I still go back and get 11-14 rewards later? I would think so

[shrewd brook]

if you do heat 15 after 10 you will get rewards for 11. or at least that's how I interpreted the wiki

[stoic thicket]

If you set your heat gauge above the target you will always gain the Bounties for the lowest tier you haven't finished, with the exception of Heat 0.

At least that's how I understood it.

[median panther]

quick stupid question

is it ever indicated in game how to unlock your weapon aspects?

I think it went right over my head but I only found out about it yesterday after googling it

[lament coral]

are you talking about the 4th spear aspect or aspects in general?

4th aspect one is mentioned, but I don't think it's explained how to unlock em in general

[median panther]

In general

Was asking if there was any indication because if there is not I was thinking of adding that to the feedback channel

[lament coral]

I suppose it's expected that you'll want to unlock all of the weapons anyway, which is how you unlock aspects

[median panther]

I mean weapons too

At no point did I think to interact again with the weapon I already had equipped so I had no idea you could upgrade them

[sweet shell]

is there a way to give proper control to the dash mechanic?

I often am moving away from an enemy but it takes me towards the enemy instead

[neon fiber]

Use WASD

[sweet shell]

I did, but it still happens

I was fighting meg, and I was literally moving backwards-right and Zan simply moved in front instead

towards where meg was

[lament coral]

if you dash without pressing a direction, it just moves you in the direction you're facing

[sweet shell]

(I think the MC is called Zan-something, right? sorry, I only played for about two hours)

[lament coral]

Zagreus

[sweet shell]

yeah, but I pressed the two keys (S and D) while dashing

oh, my bad

[lament coral]

I dunno what to tell you, man

[sweet shell]

maybe it was just a timing issue then. maybe she moved fasrer than I can respond

[lament coral]

I sometimes dash into enemies, too, but always because I forget to keep holding the directional buttons

[sweet shell]

I just confused it for an auto lock thing

it was a p intense fight

[lament coral]

they often are

[median panther]

If you have a controler, I'd say use it

I didn;t try keyboard but controller just feels natural

[lament coral]

been playing with kbnm only, no problems

[sudden dagger]

If you're holding down a direction when you dash it seems to work as expected

[lament coral]

especially great since you can free aim quickly, which I find to be essential with ranged weapons

[sudden dagger]

Maybe you had a bug

[median panther]

so just to make sure again

Does anyone remember if the game points you towards how to unlock/upgrade aspects?

Want to make sure it didn;t just go over my head before posting in feedback

[sudden dagger]

Lu@median panther I'm playing the beginning of the game now, and so far the only hints are when you get Titans blood the first time

[median panther]

Right, you get told that you can use it to upgrade your weapon but you don't get told where or how corrct?

[sudden dagger]

And the fact that the weapons have a rotating 20 percent darkness buff

It's pretty mysterious as a hint

You're told your weapons may someday thirst for it

[median panther]

Okay yeah then I am posting in feedback to at least make a point about it

[sudden dagger]

I sold one for 250 gems because idk when I'll get to upgrade

[median panther]

you can probbly already upgrade

you upgrade by

[sudden dagger]

I don't have all the weapons yet

[median panther]

Interacting with a weapon you already picked

Ah right, you need all the weapons too right?

[mystic vale]

Let's see, choke down some breakfast, then it will be a good day to die, I am thinking.

Yes, you must have all weapons unlocked to use Bloods.

[sudden dagger]

You mean when you pick it up, you talk to the place it used to be?

[mystic vale]

I found that an important distinction on my second file because I got to Asphodel on my second run.

Yes.

[median panther]

Right what I am checking is if there was any indication that weapon upgrades were available other than the vague "your weapons might thirst for blood someday"

or where/how to get them

[sudden dagger]

I got to Elysium really early on :( now I feel bad that I keep dying in Tartarus

[median panther]

It's okay! You'll keep getting stronger

Now I always reach final boss at the minimum without really trying that hard

where before I too died in tartarus

[sudden dagger]

Lur@median panther sounds like it would be nice for the weapon shadows to look extra clicky after you've gotten them all unlocked

[mystic vale]

I do feel like Meg was a lot easier running into her the first time. She literally walked right on to traps and such, which I don't recall her usually doing. Normally she dashes past when I've been observing.

We'll see if she's smarter when I see her the second time.

[sudden dagger]

Interesting

@mystic vale are you restarting the game?

[mystic vale]

Yeah, I started a clean file for reasons.

Speaking of, apparently the alternate mirror options show up after you get the first 5 key unlock, I'm told.

[sudden dagger]

Yeah!

[mystic vale]

Haven't yet verified myself, because my first three keys unlocked Aegis. :p

[sudden dagger]

They do I checked

[mystic vale]

Good. But yes, options are nice to have. Shadow Presence works well with melee weapons because you will usually be DSing (Dash-Striking) back and forth through enemies.

Fiery works better if you're using weapons more likely to hit things in the face, like the Rail's mortar, or Bow's Flourish.

[sudden dagger]

I usually don't change the mirror because I don't want to spend the key

[mystic vale]

@median panther I am almost certain Skelly mentions talking with the darkness where the weapon was.

Patrick: No, not the 1 key option to reset your spent darkness.

https://hades.gamepedia.com/File:MirrorInterface.png

The arrows on the left side of the names.

[median panther]

Honest to god do not recall that

[sudden dagger]

Are you talking about maxing both options out

[mystic vale]

That switch between the red and green skills.

[median panther]

Skelly sometimes bugs out for me I think

Like, sometimes he jsut doesn't pop out of the ground at all

[sudden dagger]

So you can just toggle between them as needed? @mystic vale

[median panther]

or doesn't becomea vailable for conv. until I am almost ready to leaver

[timid sentinel]

damn that's a lot of darkness

[mystic vale]

Yes - you still have to pay Darkness to unlock the green versions, but in some cases I'd unlock the green ones first.

Oh, that's nothing.

The Fated skills cost over 150K on their own to fully max.

(Everything else combined is only 5,965 though.)

[timid sentinel]

yeah they're the endgame sink

[mystic vale]

Oh, wait, without the boon upgrades. The boon upgrades are another 9k, but not really essential until heated runs.

[timid sentinel]

idk I just feel like I've played a lot and I'm only at like 10k darkness

[mystic vale]

That being said, if you do dedicated Darkness runs you can get 1k+ per run.

[timid sentinel]

right

[sudden dagger]

I've hit something like an early game hump. I never want to equip the chaos egg since it's so good; all the resources are so slow to gain. I guess the next thing to grind for is keys so I can start getting aspects on weapons, but idk. The ambrosia sink seems so huge too

[mystic vale]

My main file is at like 12k spent darkness or so?

[sudden dagger]

*unequip

[mystic vale]

Thing is, once you start doing heated runs, each heat for each weapon will get you two bloods, a diamond, and an ambrosia.

Let alone prophecy rewards.

So you'll start having plenty of that stuff eventually.

[timid sentinel]

keyword being eventually

[sudden dagger]

I have the list of prophesies, but it seems like I get the same few boons over and over

[mystic vale]

That will change as you consistently make it further.

Because boons have tiers.

[sudden dagger]

I guess it is accurate that the thing to progress is unlocking the aspects

[mystic vale]

Tier 2 boons require you already have one of a few (usually dash/cast/strike/special) boons from that deity.

[timid sentinel]

the aspects is probably the biggest straight powerup there is, except for like, revives from mirror

[mystic vale]

https://gamepedia.cursecdn.com/hades_gamepedia_en/5/59/Athena_boon_tree.png?version=200ae013e7de0fbf4b16f2d0a85bd843

This is a fairly uncomplicated one.

[sudden dagger]

I think I need to learn to play better. Sometimes I'm just doing so little damage to Meg that she wears me down

[timid sentinel]

divine protection is nuts, I've only gotten it once

[mystic vale]

Same, but that + careful play is almost guaranteed success.

Particularly with ranged weapons.

[timid sentinel]

yeah

[mystic vale]

(My first win was run 46 BTW, so don't feel like you're behind.)

[timid sentinel]

if I highroll I can often proc butterfly off meg

[mystic vale]

I win fairly consistently after 80ish runs.

[timid sentinel]

I've only done like 50 runs

or maybe more like 60, I might be lying

[median panther]

I get the daash + reflect every chance I get

It's a life saver

[mystic vale]

With almost all mirror options unlocked and I'm just now regularly unlocking weapon aspects (1 point Hera, max Guan Yu, max Zagreus Sword, max Chaos Shield.)

[timid sentinel]

yeah the reflect dash is very good

[sudden dagger]

@median panther Athena's reflect or another one?

[median panther]

Athena's!

[true glen]

reflect dash is great if you have anything other than the aegis

but man theseus and mino have been wrecking my behind

[timid sentinel]

I have a pretty hard time with anything but the ranged weapons

[median panther]

If you get athena's dash protection + Hermes' +3 dashes

[true glen]

i know their patterns but it's so much to micromanage at once

[median panther]

You can just dash across the place until you are safe from anything

[sudden dagger]

The only time I got very far was with cursed blade

[timid sentinel]

I've done heat 10 with hestia, but I'm honestly struggling at like heat 5 with the sword

I feel like heat 10 is still easy with hestia, but like, I just cannot stop taking damage with the melee weapons

[sudden dagger]

Maybe I should lay off of chaos for a while - try some other artifacts besides chaos egg

I kept giving chaos ambrosia to see what would happen at higher hearts, but I reached the lock :p

[timid sentinel]

I try to put levels into any I havent maxed, but the butterfly is probably the most effective one

at least for the ranged weapons

[mystic vale]

@mint pier My advice is kill Theseus first. I can't get a lot of people on that boat, but it works for me.

[sudden dagger]

Well that's some good stuff to think about, suppose it's time to get more keys

[mystic vale]

The bull only hits for like 12 damage, Theseus's spear is 20, or 40 if he hits you and immediately recalls it. Yes, he has a mode change at half health, but those attacks are single digit damage.

Just lose the bull on one end of the arena, then bash Theseus's face in.

The only time you want both on screen at once is if you have a companion to summon.

But if you're decently fast (run speed or dashes) you can keep way away from the bull.

I like Chaos myself, Patrick, but it's important to use the other deity boons, and understand how to use them to make reliable builds (and level them up.)

I usually switch to the Egg if I'm between zones and a Light of Ixion is in the well. Then I buy all the LoIs in that zone.

[elfin ledge]

for me its bull first on normal and theseus first on upgraded

[mystic vale]

I've heard that one too. I haven't done EM 3 yet. I understand you can't Deflect Asterius's attacks on EM 3 any more.

[elfin ledge]

yeah. you understand the reason when you first see him

its one thing i wouldnt want to spoil

[mossy breach]

lets just say they are on steroids

[mystic vale]

Oh man is he wearing a chicken suit?

[mossy breach]

I think asterius could kill hades by himself lol

[mystic vale]

Wait, no, a rubber chicken suit.

[mossy breach]

speaking of, will we get EM4 sometime?

[mystic vale]

What, the end boss instantly pitchforks your throat as soon as you step in the room? :p

[stoic thicket]

Good lord.

[timid sentinel]

just make him spew out 3 of the skulls in a cone

[mossy breach]

Hades but he uses the rail gun instead

[timid sentinel]

oh and, make him poison you and then put a well in the center of the arena

anytime he hits you

[gaunt tundra]

have him summon the rest of the bosses to help him during battle

[mystic vale]

He can already summon mini-bosses with heightened stats.

[gaunt tundra]

now change that to straight up bosses and we have the perfect EM4

[stoic thicket]

Thankfully that EM stuff is optional.

[timid sentinel]

yeah well, everything on the pact of punishment is optional until a point

I usually run with at least EM1 enabled
I have yet to see 2 and 3 at all actually

[mystic vale]

Awww, I couldn't beat the Hydra on my third run for some reason. :p

[gaunt tundra]

depends on damage

hydra can get quite crazy if you don't have damage to dispatch the heads fairly fast

[mystic vale]

Ah ha.

So after the third run (or perhaps reaching Asphodel after the second run) is when Nyx unlocks the arrows that change between the red and green abilities.

Dark Regeneration, here I come! :p

[sudden dagger]

Nice, even without 5 keys?

[mystic vale]

Right.

Nyx has a chat with you about the mirror, and top of screen says the Mirror is upgraded.

https://steamuserimages-a.akamaihd.net/ugc/1018322321468090687/CA678D75A793024C10D6B8605A566F39A2161307/

And then the arrows show on the left.

[west totem]

Am I doing the right thing by avoiding the Tiny Vermin even when im doing good

I fought him once

never again

[sudden dagger]

I almost escaped Asphodel, but I'd never seen Medusa... That didn't go well

[mystic vale]

She's pretty much a tutorial on "keep moving."

Which is a big thing in this game.

Her stone buddy is a chump without her freezing you in place, BTW.

I like to get him drunk so he dies in mid-air.

[tepid ridge]

Yea you walk into an elite room and see the barge, you’re about to have a good time, walk in and see a mega-Gorgon, it’s gonna be a bumpy ride

[mystic vale]

Really? I prefer the gorgon to the barge. Barge always seems to give me half a dozen bomb throwers on a rock slightly larger than a sardine can.

[tepid ridge]

As long as you get in the rhythm of killing the blue void stones and dodging the floor waves, I’m pretty sure I’m in the majority when I say the barge can be one of the more fun fights. Mega-Gorgon just is just slightly less satisfying to me

[lament coral]

you can't avoid Tiny vermin per se, since the mini-bosses are random

[delicate nimbus]

Barge has fun music and has bombs to speed up the killing. Gorgon and stone spend a lot of time slowing you down.

[cunning urchin]

That Megagorgon is actually not Medusa. Dusa is Medusa.

[mystic vale]

I was going to make that correction, but I wasn't feeling properly pedantic.

[west totem]

Maidusa

[mystic vale]

Your timing is excellent, Mewmew.

[dry ember]

What

Maid-Dusa?

[mystic vale]

Uh huh.

[west totem]

If i get the sack, i should just avoid the rat like the plague?

[dry ember]

MAID-DUSA?

[mystic vale]

You may groan.

[lament coral]

also, Dusa is not Medusa the Gorgon

[mystic vale]

Sadly.

[lament coral]

her origins are unknown

[dry ember]

She is a floating head. But it's rude to ask why

[west totem]

Im gonna assume its because you kill gorgons by beheading them

[mystic vale]

Technically the actual named Gorgon sisters haven't put in any appearances in my game(s), but the Megagorgon that Zagreus repeatedly mentions doesn't give her name may be related.

[west totem]

And so theyre stuck like that

[tepid ridge]

Wait how could Dusa not be? She supposedly has dialogue for not trusting Athena, who sent Perseus to cut off Medusa’s head in the Greek myths and sent her to Hades.

[mystic vale]

Stheno, Eurayle, and Medusa. They DO show up in Titan Quest. :p

[lament coral]

the gorgon heads in Asphodel came about out of Medusa's blood, as is mentioned in their Codex entry

[sudden dagger]

I was just bad at dodging the stone projectiles. I already dash all over the place, I just kept going sideways into them

[lament coral]

Megagorgon is just the biggest one of em

[dry ember]

That's why you dash into the enemies in stead of away from them.

[mystic vale]

Unseen: The game does mention repeatedly that Maid-dusa isn't Medusa. She even mentions she may have had a body at one point but isn't certain.

There's probably a very excellent YT video somewhere of how to wreck the Megagorgon.

[tepid ridge]

Where? Does it reference it in the codex? The fact that her name is literally Dusa and she has a beef with Athena is a little too on the nose for me to ignore but

[mystic vale]

It was in dialogue with her. I don't think all of it transferred to the codex entry.

I don't recall if it was nectar dialogue or random.

(Or triggered by some other event.)

I know it was before she asked for help with lounge renovations.

[cunning urchin]

Probably better to continue that discussion in #h1-story-discussion. Anyway, the Megagorgon's projectiles are super easy to evade even on FO2.

[lament coral]

@tepid ridge I would imagine all gorgon heads have beef with Athena

on account of all of them being related to the Medusa

[cunning urchin]

You just have to not be greedy and overextend your offense. And back off if she floats over magma, too.

Once she shoots some projectiles, she won't do anything for a while and just float about semi-randomly.

[dry ember]

Ok the heads floating over magma is my pet peeves in this game. Ladies I have a tight deadline to uphold. I don't have time to wait for you to slowly float back.

[mystic vale]

...Meg should be caught singing "Don'tcha wish your girlfriend was hot like me?" at some point.

...even though that song is like twelve years old.

[cunning urchin]

Taking damage from magma because you're being hasty is worse than taking a couple seconds longer and potentially taking Tight Deadline damage later when you're out of time.

Unless you have Sure Footing.

[mystic vale]

(Possibly because you misclicked.)

[cunning urchin]

It's 15 years old.

If you focus on just evading damage in that encounter, you'll notice how easy they are to deal with. And the long stretches when you can safely deal some damage.

Middle Management is a different story.

[mystic vale]

Yeah, yeah, I'm old and my memory sucks. :p

Roll out the wheelchair and let's roll.

[dry ember]

Are you talking about the power couple mini boss?

[cunning urchin]

Yes.

Asphodel is very generous with the time you have, so there's no need to rush the fight even on TD2.

[dry ember]

Yeah. Without the MM heat you can skip them with companion also.

[mystic vale]

Back to my main file since I got my side answer.

Yeah, I companion the last phase of Hydra and the second half of Douchebag King.

Then whichever tunnel in Styx annoys me.

[dry ember]

Companion first phase of Hydra and burst all the damage you have in 1.6 (?) second for a potential skip.

[mystic vale]

Honestly not interested in the exploit TBH.

[cunning urchin]

Recently I value Bouldy a lot more than the other summons. With Convenience Fee at 2 but Lasting Consequences at 0, he has excellent value in a run.

[mystic vale]

Especially as it will probably be patched out since that's clearly not the intended way of dealing with the fight.

[dry ember]

Is it an exploit if the devs knew about it and patched it already?

[mystic vale]

If Bouldy would give me his summon, I'd try it. :p

Well, the video I saw that showed it directly called it an exploit, so they at least thought so.

[cunning urchin]

Ah, that one took me awhile to get, too.

[dry ember]

The devs were aware and patched it in the Nighty Night update. You can still do it to a certain extent.

[mystic vale]

I know I maxed Sis on Nectars.

And honestly, I use it on Hydra just to save time. I can usually run that encounter with 0-10 damage. But then I haven't EM2'd yet because I have an easy time with Benefits Package so far.

(Which may just mean I'm not getting very bad combos with it.)

[young gorge]

benefits package in styx is ,,,,mmmmmm

snakestones with more hp

im

[stoic thicket]

I'm currently also working on Sisyphus. That Bouldy thing looks like super good QoL.

[young gorge]

going to cry

that was the worst benefits package run i had

and i just stopped running it after that

[mystic vale]

In Diablo II there was a vast, vast difference between, say, Spectral Hit Fire Enchanted and Multishot Lightning Enchanted. :p

[cunning urchin]

You're not pressed for time because you don't use TD, and you don't use FO2, either. It's a lot easier to deal with Benefits like that.

Also other pacts on high heat that give them extra damage etc.

[young gorge]

ghh i want to get into the habbit of using TD... how do i start

i get too intermediated by timers lmao

[raw violet]

turn it on

[cunning urchin]

If it's just Benefits, I think it's alright.

[glad island]

https://imgur.com/oA7jFsH

[raw violet]

don't turn it off

[glad island]

big cast damage

[young gorge]

i mean that's like FO then

but FO is at least managable

[glad island]

It melted bossed like cheese

[neon fiber]

nice
if you only had the ares leggy boon

[young gorge]

hunting blades good...

[cunning urchin]

My first TD run was with Poseidon Aspect and True Shot.

[neon fiber]

that would have made for even bigger damage

[cunning urchin]

That was recommended to me for a first TD attempt.

[mystic vale]

I am fairly sure even if I do 32 heat, putting myself on a timer will not be involved. I do double laps around rooms for gold urns and fishing spots. I move back and forth in Asphodel in rooms with 3 options because by the time I get to one side I forget what was on the other.

[cunning urchin]

I think it gives you a good idea for how to focus your build etc. And you can do it even with Poseidon Aspect at Lv.1.

[dry ember]

The first TD is very generous

The biggest bottleneck is Elysium and Styx if you get bad sack RNG.

2nd TD is much tougher.

Turn FO on so you can save time

[cunning urchin]

Tip: getting more HP gives you more time to clear.

You don't lose straight-up when you run out of time.

Instead you take 5 damage every 1 or 2 seconds.

[sudden dagger]

Just realized the barge ride was a boss encounter. It was so fun the first time I thought it was a lucky room

[dry ember]

Barge is the best thing in Asphodel

[cunning urchin]

I think what makes the Barge of Death the most fun is that you have a clear idea of where the enemies are on the map at all times. In other Asphodel rooms, enemies constantly jump around off-screen.

It's also smaller, so they can't jump so far away.

[dry ember]

I like timing the explosives when the enemy spawn

[cunning urchin]

So many times I dash south towards an enemy, and it jumps north. I turn around and dash north, and it jumps south . . .

[dry ember]

Wavemaker and slam dancer in a nutshell

[mystic vale]

Oh gosh. There's a terrible heat option: Rooms are 20/40% larger. :p

[cunning urchin]

MM2 + FO2 + Jury Summons etc. on the Barge of Death is . . . something else. I had that and the boon from Master Chaos that enemies drop Inferno-Bombs upon death.

Bombs.

Bombs everywhere.

[mystic vale]

Are you having flashbacks?

[cunning urchin]

And you can't see the bombs because there are enemies everywhere.

And explosions everywhere.

[dry ember]

I hope you had Divine Dash

[cunning urchin]

I survived somehow. Stressful lol.

No, I think I had Divine Strike, though.

[mystic vale]

Hey, maybe I should play this game.

Heat 3 Rail run.

[cunning urchin]

Do heat 5 just for funsies.

[mystic vale]

What am I, your slave? :p

[cunning urchin]

I think you can beat heat 5.

[mystic vale]

I don't think I've finished a heat 3 run yet, except shield.

[proven robin]

I posted this before, but it might have gotten lost in the shuffle.

Most recent completed run with T H E G U N was....extremely entertaining because my Attack was...well... https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2101321489

[mystic vale]

Yeah, I've done that before. It is teh b0rk3d.

[proven robin]

There were SO MANY PROJECTILES and I was just going ham fighting the urge to just Rambo-yell while shooting.

Also, check my Cast and Call. Dual-Shot Artemis arrows, and I had her Call as well.

Plus two Chaos Grasp-type boons, so I had 3 Casts on Stygian Soul.

[dry ember]

Pressure Points better be in there somewhere

[proven robin]

I...think so? I forget if I ever was able to find it, but you know I woulda got it.

Also, Explosive Fire synergizes so nicely.

Plus I had Hangover on my Attack, and that boon that further slows enemies who are Hungover.

[cunning urchin]

You could do EM1 and Convenience Fee 2 to get 5 heat. Once you make it past the Furies, the rest will be like usual. And you're efficient with how you spend obols, I think, so Convenience Fee shouldn't affect your run all that much.

[proven robin]

Also! I completed my first run with Aspect of Hera.

[cunning urchin]

Nice! Congrats!

[neon fiber]

nice

[proven robin]

Which...definitely interesting! I didn't get any broken Duos, but the style is very cool.

Definitely more of a boss-killer, but putting Athena on Attack and Special helped with projectile defense.

And I used Chain Arrows and Twin Shot for my Hammer mods, which was...fun.

[cunning urchin]

Hera Aspect was my favorite for awhile. But recently I don't actually use it anymore.

[proven robin]

And Hermes was nice and gave me his Legendary!

Yeah, Hera isn't my favorite Aspect, but was a fun thing to try.

I think next I will want to juice some Sword Aspects that aren't Zag or Arthur.

But either way, I guess I'll see what comes.

[mystic vale]

...life hates me today.

[cunning urchin]

Try Poseidon Aspect!

[mystic vale]

Athena/Artemis trial OR Hammer. 😦

[proven robin]

Awwww.

[cunning urchin]

@mystic vale trial!

[mystic vale]

Yes, yes, Trial, I know.

[cunning urchin]

The Hammer will show up later.

[proven robin]

I think it's more that life likes you too much and got overeager.

[mystic vale]

Hammer will show up later.

See? I do listen to you, Mewmew. :p

[proven robin]

Also...I think I might go Nemesis just because I like critical hits.

Just stack that with Artemis and see Big Number.

[mystic vale]

Divine Strike/Deadly Flourish so far. This could get good.

[cunning urchin]

Just think of it as the other room was gemstones.

No one picks gemstones.

[mystic vale]

And Divine Dash.

[viscid vale]

im doing my first arthur run

[cunning urchin]

Exalibur Lv.5 or lower?

[viscid vale]

much lower

[cunning urchin]

Ah, I see. It's fun either way.

I'd recommend getting used to dashing between strikes first on Skelly.

[viscid vale]

i'm on a 8 clears streak, peepo is happy

but i'm tired i guess ill catch up later wit the game

i think ive reached a good point, i have a good bunch of resources now

i'm like, is there something more to unlock that's big ?

i guess the special aspects

ive just done the spear at this point

arthur / exc is so different to the sword playstyle i liked, but it's powerful for sure

[mystic vale]

Big and locked? Fort Knox?

[viscid vale]

i'm calling the police

[cunning urchin]

You can also (with any sword aspect) start up your special, cancel into dash, and your special will slam the ground right after the dash. That's really good, and I never see anyone talk about it.

[viscid vale]

dash and special is good

[cunning urchin]

The slow startup is the worst aspect of the sword special. By using the dash like that, you can start up at a safe distance, then dash into a group of enemies and BAM!

[mystic vale]

Zeus thinks I'mma swap Deadly Flourish for Lightning Flourish.

[dry ember]

Which weapon?

[viscid vale]

what does deadly flourish do again, i'm so bad with the names

[dry ember]

Crit chance

[viscid vale]

oh, that makes me think, Zeus is nice for visual effect, but can we talk about how Dionysus is crazy good

[mystic vale]

Rail.

[viscid vale]

I love it

[cunning urchin]

i'm like, is there something more to unlock that's big ?
There are weapon aspects and story etc., of course. But also, there are higher heat pacts to conquer!

[dry ember]

Yeah so attack boons end with Strike. Special boons end with Flourish

[viscid vale]

i know ! thats great 🙂

[cunning urchin]

Something like 15 heat runs can be very different depending on what pacts you choose.

But even on 5 heat it can be very different.

[dry ember]

What's the highest heat you climbed?

[viscid vale]

don't ask me, i'm gonna be ashamed among all those progamers

[dry ember]

Lol it's not for comparison purpose.

Just curiousity

[cunning urchin]

20. With Malphon, I've only done (and failed) 32 heat runs since.

[dry ember]

I'm not a le epic gamer

[viscid vale]

ive yet to do 5, i'm changing weaps and going slow

[dry ember]

Yeah heat is intimidating. Before my first clear I was like why would you make the game harder?

This is almost impossible as it is

[cunning urchin]

all those progamers
lol I've fought an actual pro gamer and EVO champion (comparable to world champion in other sports) in Street Fighter V before. It was . . . it was something else lol. I've never been so clinically taken apart in my life lol.

[viscid vale]

its intimidating, yea, but ive not done enough runs to do big heat levels anyway, i'm at like 14 clears and no more than 4 on one weapon

[dry ember]

Dang girl you are hard core

[proven robin]

I've gotten mega-salty fighting Skullgirls online matches with an acquaintance who I didn't realize was the third-best Skullgirls player in the entire world.

[cunning urchin]

lololol

[viscid vale]

haha

[proven robin]

The reassuring part was that I was still able to beat him.

[dry ember]

Oof

[cunning urchin]

I did alright the first few rounds, but very quickly every round was practically a perfect lol.

[proven robin]

And I saw him using one of my combos in a tournament once.

So...awesome.

[viscid vale]

ive got friends who thought they were top tier Fifa players until they got wrecked at a tournament, it was a lil funny

i'm a bad friend

[dry ember]

Not to brag but I faced a top 200 SC2 player once. Got obliterated in 7 mins.

We all le epic gamers I suppose

[viscid vale]

not to brag but i can lose against easy FPS AI

and same with RTS AI come to think of it

my reflexes are not that great

[dry ember]

Yeah I'm done with PvP

[viscid vale]

but still i wish fish to my death in Hades

[dry ember]

Now I find PvE games more relaxing.

It's one thing playing PvP, another Co oping with a friend.

[mystic vale]

I used to be top in a certain version of PC Monopoly, and was half a world champ MSN Zone Spades player. :p

I had a decent position on a Diablo II ladder at some point too.

All that and $5 will get me a burger.

[dry ember]

This is def off topic haha

[mystic vale]

gets flogged.

[dry ember]

But everyone can have their claim to fame.

[viscid vale]

i'm a progamer at off topicing

[proven robin]

Yep, apologies.

[dry ember]

Lol I started it

[cunning urchin]

I'm practically half a world champion in Street Fighter V. If you only consider the weaker half of the world.

[viscid vale]

i'm good at sleeping

[mystic vale]

Don't sell yourself short, Mewmew.

You've gotta be top 100 at pedantry too or close to it.

:p

[sudden dagger]

Why does my screen keep saying ruthless?

[viscid vale]

snorts

short one

[mystic vale]

Ruthless Reflex.

[cunning urchin]

Because you have the Ruthless Reflex. It shows "ruthless" when the effect is triggered.

[mystic vale]

When you get near-missed by a source of damage, you get +50% dodge and damage for 2 seconds.

[cunning urchin]

I.e., whenever you dash away just as an attack would hit you.

[mystic vale]

Note: That source of damage can be a trap, or even your own weapon if you have Hazard Bomb with the Rail.

All that matters is that it almost hits you, but you dash away.

[proven robin]

Part of why I never take Convenience Fee is because I always wanna get the Titan Blood store purchase in Styx if possible.

[dry ember]

Dashing will get you away from damage, but not from Chaos pact.

[mystic vale]

(Even if you're, say, standing parallel to it and it wasn't going to hit, if it got close enough, it triggers.)