h1-discussion

[rustic vale]

lemme just avoid damage boosts

[inner stag]

not too much tho

i turn up my volume before fighting him

a bit more before the 2nd phase

up to max before the 3rd phase

[weak iris]

I hit 36% with the lambent plumbe...... how close was i to a perfect run with it? I'm willing to bet someone in here can tell me. I dont think I've ever had it so high.

About to fight hades... so i'm at the end

If that helps

Nvm. Killed him. 37.5%

37.2%**

[vast raven]

that is the max possible amount, no skips of any kind and max amount of chambers and all styx paths 👍

[weak iris]

Beauty 🙂

Thank you for confirming. I knew that was pretty good.

[vast raven]

can get 14.4% in tart, 7.2% in aspho, 9.6% in ely, and 4.8% in styx

oh wait forgot to account for heroes boss i think?

[weak iris]

Idk if you did. I'm 99 percent i heard it go off for them too

[vast raven]

yep forgot to account for bosses sadge

okay max should actually be 39.6% if i have actually done everything properly

[rustic vale]

Should’ve had a 7 second heroes fight

[weak iris]

So off by 1.2%?

[rustic vale]

2.4%

2 rooms

[weak iris]

Sorry yeah ^

You right

Still. I can live with that

[vast raven]

very good pluming regardless

[weak iris]

Thanks for letting me know 🙂 . Thank ya 🙂

[rustic vale]

It’s pretty easy for it to go wrong with fountains

[weak iris]

I didnt even think of that

I think i did have 1 fluntain room....Key in tart I believe.....maybe the room before the hydra too?

So that and 1 other. Idk.

[rustic vale]

You can’t have a fountain immediately before a boss

There will always be an endshop as an option, and otherwise it can be a boon, a pom, a heart or a hammer, depending on what’s still available in your pool

But the room layout will always be the endshop

[weak iris]

Oh I see

[rustic vale]

Even if you take a chaos gate in the very last room prior to endshop, the game still push it back and extends it

[polar aspen]

I'm so confused about master chaos' request

He wants me to bring his egg trinket with me when I beat Hades. He told me it serves no purpose but after all that he'll find amusement in it

I mean if I still have my death defying by the time I get to styx then I might LOL

Though I have a feeling I'll lose at least one of them to Theseus

[urban storm]

literally just beat hades with the egg equipped lmao. theyre literally just a master ragebaiter atp... if i lost to my son with an egg id simply kill myself

[runic jungle]

One of these days I should really try the Charon boss lol.
But my thing is he usually shows up when my builds are garbo so I have no faith in actually beating him

And a trend i absolutely hate is when game spams Athena boons at me when I have the absolute worst weapons for Athena.💔

[runic jungle]

Wait really? Man I keep forgetting to go to chaos because my health is usually too low so its too risky lol.
I'll definitely have to try that though

[mint coral]

Chaos thinks they are so funny

And tbf they are correct

[rustic vale]

Chaos is too powerful to pass up when you have the hp to get through the door imo

like

I could be sitting at 25 hp and the door needs 23

And I’d be like “eh it’s probably worth it” depending on the biome and aspect

[mint coral]

It just makes the dmg on action curses free

/j

But also yeah at the very worst (without ap2 in play) you keave with a mid reward/curse and skip a combat room

[runic jungle]

Chaos door always be showing up at the absolutely worst time for me lol. Its rare for it to happen when I have full health 😅
Best case scenario for me as when Zag has at least 100 hp but rng hates me

[mint coral]

And the rewards instead can be insane

[mint coral]

Once ap2/ri1 is in play chaos becomes a bit more ehhh

[rustic vale]

Mmm

Cthonic Vitality on the mirror really helps with chaos gates and your hp on the whole if you aren’t using it

it’s essentially a 6 hp discount to chaos doors alongside regening your hp every room

[mint coral]

Also remember your charon wells, they are nice sources of hp

[runic jungle]

I also have bad luck with that lmao. It rarely be having healing when I actually need it, same with Charon's shop I think I'm cursed

[runic jungle]

Ooh noted this will help a ton!

[languid gull]

hi guys if I have like 6h on the game but it was 2-3 years since I played would you guys make a new slot

[void vigil]

I would!

[indigo badge]

yeah

[void vigil]

I’m going to start overrrr

[indigo badge]

by now you'll have forgotten the basics of the story

[languid gull]

okay yea i will

do you think controller or keyboard is more enjoyable in this game

[mint coral]

Try both and see for yourself

[runic jungle]

I'm definitely gonna use a controller for pc because I play hades on my laptop and I find it a tad bit difficult lol.

I'm so mad at myself because this whole time I never thought my Nintendo switch pro controller could be connected to my laptop 😅

[rustic vale]

I would take controller every day of the week but it’s going to depend on your personal preference

[iron epoch]

I really love Theseus x Hippolyta in myths and would draw Theseus Hades and my Hippolyta design but they're buff af and I can't draw big muscular people. But I refuse to make Hippolyta anything but a 9 foot tall brick wall of a woman

[polar aspen]

I didn't realize you can get surveillance bats that let you zoom out on the house

Gods Demeter really is a stuck-up old woman

[mint coral]

I would be too if I was on her shoes

[polar aspen]

I mean I understand but like...

[mint coral]

(rip humanity's food tho)

[polar aspen]

"There's so much nonsense that the mortals say to one another of our family, Zagreus. How viciously the rumors spread! Whether from that oaf, Zeus, or likely from the mortal drunkard-poets with no better use of their limited time!"

You really hates humanity because her daughter didn't want to live on Olympus

[mint coral]

For all she knows persephone is dead

[polar aspen]

Yes but that doesn't necessarily mean that she has to despise humanity

[mint coral]

Oh yeah overall agree
Gods moment

[polar aspen]

I will say I really appreciate that they don't go with the route of Hades tricking Persephone into eating pomegranate seeds

[mint coral]

Have you done epilogue btw?

[polar aspen]

Not yet

Did I accidentally spoil myself by understanding the actual mythology lol

[mint coral]

Nah

[polar aspen]

Okay xD

Cuz in the actual story Hades tricks her into eating six pomegranate seeds, which means Persephone has to return to the underworld for 6 months of the year. which is why Demeter gets depressed and cold for 6 months, fall and winter, and then she brightens up when her daughter comes back, spring and summer

[runic jungle]

To be fair this time she's lost a lot

[polar aspen]

True, I'm moreso meant her stance on humans

[runic jungle]

Actually I still don't understand why Demeter the only one who looks old did she not have the magic to keep herself looking younger like everyone else or something?

I think she is the oldest out of all of them except for Zeus? I think maybe but still lol

[polar aspen]

I kind of chalk it up to her depression and cynicism for over losing her daughter

Just stopped caring about her appearance

Cuz even primordial chaos has this almost youthful look to them

[runic jungle]

Makes me feel bad but she must've been a real bad mom if her daughter never tried reaching out or anything even after she reunited with Zag and Hades 😅

[polar aspen]

Yeah

There was one time when she actually mentioned her daughter and that she hopes zagreus doesn't have to go through that

Or moreso states that he wouldnt

[azure sonnet]

I don't ever talk on here but I was just asking if ppl know how I can reunite Achilles with Patroclus I love them so much from Greek mythology thats why I'm asking ✨

[mint coral]

Give nectar to both, talk with them a lot, give nectar to nyx too

You also need to do either Sisyphus or orpheus quests

[azure sonnet]

Oooooooo okie also Patroclus so far won't let me give him any nectar so is it applying I have to give more to Achilles?

[mint coral]

Yeah

If you check your codex they have a locked heart at some point

[azure sonnet]

Ah okie

Thank you for the help

[mint coral]

Have fun, pray the dialogue is kind to you

[true briar]

Supergiant plz drop Hades 2 on all consoles 🙌🏾🙌🏾🙌🏾

[tepid plover]

wrong chat, and they will, later

[runic jungle]

I feel like i always do this but can never reunite them lol.
Same with Orpheus, and Eurydice

[rough carbon]

I think there planning to do it like hades one with different years

[mint coral]

that's what I meant with pray the dialogue is kind to you lol

you can have all pre reqs but dialogue still gotta show up

[grand flower]

Hi, I want to complete the codex and I'm missing loyalty card but I can't get it.

Are there any conditions that must be met to trigger the fight against Charon ?

[steep condor]

are you taking every mid shop?

[grand flower]

No

so I should buy the items in every mid shop ?

[rustic vale]

More like

The bag that lets you fight him has a 22% chance of appearing at any midshop

In general midshops have a ton of value, especially early in game to help you fill out your god pool with gods you want so you should be hitting every midshop anyways

[grand flower]

Okay tank you

[lavish sorrel]

*as long as he's not been fought before on the current run

The way modpack implements forcing the charon fight makes it possible to stack loyalty cards, but that's not a thing in the vanilla game

[bronze drift]

Somehow only today I realized that the blood stone’s inspiration came from a pomegranate seed

[autumn jewel]

are the discounts from stacked loyalty cards additive or multiplicative?

[lavish sorrel]

it "levels up" the card but idr if that does anything. fun fact, creating copies of a boon is how sgg implemented boon leveling in hades.

[mint coral]

Is why chaos boons show levels in the admin chamber no

Or something like that

[worn nova]

AHHH

I need more knowledge

Where can I get the shackle chthonic companion

I am doing a crystal beam run and chaos offered me shot and grasp

Idk what to choose

[mint coral]

Are you using the +2 casts or the cast regen mirror skill

Wait doesn't really matter, 1st +bloodstone is always nicer

Unless shot is like +70% and you were using infernal

[dapper carbon]

did hades come out with steam point shop items or were they made after the game was out for a bit? I want a hades 2 themed profile asap

[polar aspen]

I wish we got to hear Orpheus singing some of zagreus made up songs

[polar aspen]

I went to Charon's shop in asphodel to hopefully pick up a duo boon for Aphrodite, and she decided to have a conversation with Ares, and then offered both duos for Ares and Dionysus

Something tells me Dionysus is trying to third wheel this

Dionysus really is a party boy and a certified loverboy

[runic jungle]

Okay I'm never going back to hand held with this game lol. Pc and pro controller is the way to go.

[real loom]

do i need to get the true ending for hades to jump into hades 2

[rustic vale]

If you have Hades you should probably finish the epilogue before you go onto the next game I think

If you don’t, you don’t need to have

[stark estuary]

Not really, the ending isnt really linked to what happens in Hades 2

Get the epilogue if you’d like and if not that’s still fine

[languid gull]

do i only get a keepsake the first time i give someone a nectar thing

[indigo badge]

yes

[languid gull]

is it worth giving the same person multiple ones then or is it better spreading them out

[indigo badge]

give them to whichever character you're interested in

i guess if you're aiming for 100% trophy progress then you can spread them out

[steep condor]

gameplay wise, it makes sense to give the olympians a nectar each early

so you can use their keepsakes to help you get the boons you want

[crisp ember]

How to stop Thanatos from stealing your kills?

[indigo badge]

just dish out damage faster

[crisp ember]

300iq thought, why didn't I think of that /s

[mint coral]

Is like the only strat lol

For the big aoe you can use knockback tho

[indigo badge]

I'm sorry but it's genuinely the only way 😭

if you see the death mark appear above an enemy and you know you can't kill them before than does, just go hunt someone else

[polar aspen]

So I haven't done the epilogue very much yet, so I'm not looking for spoilers, I just got a question whether the world is perpetually cold since Demeter has never seen Persephone since she left. Whereas in the actual myth, Persephone goes back home to see demeter 6 months out of the year which is the reason we have spring and summer

[latent moon]

iirc that's answered in the epilogue

so it's a bit hard to explain the reason lmfao

but that is definitely answered

i could be wrong tho but i think i'm right

[polar aspen]

Okay duly noted

Cuz the actual myth is that Hades didn't want to lose her so he tricked her into eating six pomegranate seeds meaning she was tied to his realm for 6 months out of the year

She was instructed not to eat anything from the underworld because it would tie her to his realm

Of course I may have some of this wrong because myths do change depending on the teller

Like how the bull of Minos it's called Asterius in some myths, whereas others he's known as Asterion

[worn nova]

I want to use Chiron with something other than dio or posiden

Are there any other good ones?

With duo boons?

[rustic vale]

Artemis

[rustic vale]

Heart Rend from Artemis /Aphrodite, use aphro on strike

This is more reliant on hitting concentrated and relentless volley than dio

but the peak dps can be far higher

Chaos flourishes for special scaling also goes way more insane here

[small granite]

i went back to hades to finish ||NYX ||and ||demeter||last heart

but in the mean time i cant beat the game anymore

i shouldnt have taken a break from the game

[fringe veldt]

not sure if right spot for this question, but does anyone have any experience with using mods for this game?

Cause I can't seem to get the ones I insulted to work? Or I can't figure why they are not working

[rustic vale]

Uhhh

I have no experience but I know the modding server will

The link to join it is pinned in #self-promotion

pinned

[fringe veldt]

Thanks!

[polar aspen]

Megaera and Zagreus just had a little bonding session and.. I didn't know Zagreus with that kind of god lol

[vestal field]

What the best spear

[rustic vale]

Achilles for speed and Guan-Yu for high heat

Don’t get me wrong, Achilles should be good up to some pretty high heats but it gets crippled by RI and the hammer dependency gets pretty bad with AP

[vestal field]

i have no ideas what those word mean but yes thank you

[lavish pond]

can yall recommend a heat set up for 32 heat with extreme measures 4 for nemesis sword?

cleared 32 heat first time and only time with rama bow but cant seem to do it with the sword

||hades was bugged at the 3rd phase and was just running around for a solid 20 seconds or so and thats probably why i won||

[vast raven]

gotta love this game’s pathing

[languid gull]

uh guys is the fishing rod 1 time use

[lavish sorrel]

No

[languid gull]

why am i not finding any fishing spots tho

[mint coral]

Rng

You'll hear a ding at the start/end of a chamber if there's a spot

You can also buy a skeleton lure in charon wells to force a fishing spot

[languid gull]

okii thanks

[agile zinc]

Is there a way for me to see what weapons I've gotten out of tartarus with before I start a run

[mint coral]

Before first win you gotta write it down

[agile zinc]

okey

[cinder edge]

I like Demeter’s design

[woven turret]

You can see run history if you have the admin chamber unlocked (though you probably dont)

[worn nova]

Would dio on dash be good for aor and in case of splitting headache?

[vast raven]

should move over to #h2-discussion for that (and probably delete the message here) bc there are a bunch of h1 players that havent played h2 yet waiting for 1.0 launch

[lunar apex]

oh my bad, clicked the wrong channel

[rustic vale]

On the whole you’d rather aim for tidal dash or blade dash

[worn nova]

When the father fight gets so incredibly incompetent that's you burn FIVE WHOLE death defies AND fathers pathfinding recommends he plays Ring around the Rosie with casper

Gotta love hades

I still won

But 5 death defies hurt

[mossy dagger]

how do you even have 5? do athena's boons go above the max?

[vast raven]

chaos death defiances and tooth are a method, you could also reach that number with the additional stipulation that you run stubborn defiance and get the athena dds as if your stubborn defiance is empty/used up for that chamber the athena dd will refill it and then in the next chamber you gain back the stubborn defiance, those are the only 2 methods to gain extra dd slots outside of mirror upgrades

[cinder edge]

It’s so funny how Poseidon trash talks Theseus every chance he gets but gives him his aid anyways

[mossy dagger]

I wonder, is it hypothetically possible to get boons from all olympian gods before the end of act 3? like, get the 4 in act 1, then use keepsakes for two more, and hope for 2 random boons in shops to belong to the other 2 gods

[vast raven]

nope, the game tries to cap out your god pool at a max of four (excluding hermes, who will always be in pool), you can however still force more gods to appear in pool by using their respective keepsakes basically once you reach four different gods in pool the game will stop offering different gods

[mossy dagger]

so, 7 by the end of the run is the cap

[mint coral]

Once Demeter is unlocked nope

[mossy dagger]

I suppose theseus still can get demeter's help before then

[mint coral]

Before Demeter you can get all gods on your pool before theseus

[mint coral]

Nope, it actually defaults to artemis

As theseus can only call gods not in your pool

You can do this by getting a natural 5 god pool in tartarus

[vast raven]

only exception to this is fresh file

[mint coral]

Enter midshop with 3 gods, buy 4th and be lucky and have a 5th god be offered on exit door

Then you can keepsake the other 2

And yeah the failsafe is easier to see in run 1 lol

Cuz there's only 4 gods available

[rustic vale]

You can have 8 by runs end either by walking into styx with 7 and a god keepsake, or walking into styx with a godpool of 3 and hitting the other 5 gods

You just cap out at 7 by theseus

[wanton zealot]

Is there ever going to be a Switch 2 update for Hades?
I was well on my way to finishing a 100% play-through on my iPhone, but that version got pulled from Netflix and nobody is mentioning if that is ever coming back.
So to be able to finish playing the first game, preferably at higher fps and resolution, I now have to play my Switch or Steam version for the first game, which means starting completely over.
I’m fine with starting over, but I’m not sitting at my desk for a game so easy to run on mobile hardware, or playing at subpar resolutions and frame rates when I know my Switch 2 can do much better. Clearly it could run better. Hades 2 will run at 60 fps 1080p in handheld and 120 fps docked.
I’m not even asking for more than that.

[rustic vale]

No official word from SGG at this time

afaik

[wanton zealot]

It’s honestly baffling to me all the game companies trying to rake in before they patch their previous releases.
Doesn’t matter the team size either.
Exhibit A: THPS 3+4 with a Switch 1 and 2 version releasing before a Switch 2 patch for THPS 1+2.

[rustic vale]

I reckon it’d be something they’d put in #announcements and they haven’t

[wanton zealot]

Yea, I figured. Which is why I said something. This is kinda silly at this point. I get it, teams run on money, but I also know Animal Well has a Switch 2 patch.
That game is made by 1 person.

Which is why no developer gives an excuse as to why they haven’t done it, there isn’t a single good excuse, except for the developers that Nintendo refuses to send dev kits to.

[latent moon]

there might be one for hades later down the line after hades 2 releases, they're prob focused on getting that out now before anything else

if i had to guess anyways

[wanton zealot]

Well I guess Hades 2 will just sit in my backlog until then.
It drives me crazy playing a direct sequel when I haven’t finished the prequel. There’s lore I crave before continuing on with Hades 2, but I also have restrictions that prevent extended desk use

Guess I’ll just play the Switch 1 version and suck it up

I’m blind anyway

Oh I know.
I will buy a Steam Deck solely for Hades.

[rustic vale]

It’s so good

I’ve 500 hours in Hades on my switch

[wanton zealot]

What a god

[rustic vale]

I generally don’t care for having the best possible frames and the best graphics thou

[wanton zealot]

I do, I play worse at Hades going from iPhone 13 Pro Max to Switch 1

[rustic vale]

I mean that’s how much I ended up playing cuz it’s such a good game

[rustic vale]

~~sounds like you might want to get it on steam and install the blind assistance mod

[wanton zealot]

The fps drops and the lower overall fps affect input lag and frame pacing. Which affect my gameplay drastically since I’m not a god

[rustic vale]

fps drops?

lower fps can mean time dilation starts happening tbf

[wanton zealot]

I mean it doesn’t drop anymore on Switch 2, but on a Switch 1 it did like crazy

[rustic vale]

I hadn’t noticed it

[wanton zealot]

Not noticing it didn’t mean it wasn’t there

[rustic vale]

I hadn’t noticed it affecting gameplay any

But

you are right

that me not noticing doesn’t mean it didn’t happen

If the switch was running Hades at 30fps then an fps drop atp would cause some time dilation for sure

[rustic vale]

Tbf the H2 1.0 isn’t even out yet like

[wanton zealot]

And at this rate it will sit in my backlog longer than the first game did

[rustic vale]

Atp I’ve been playing Hades over a longer period of time than it was inmy backlog

It keeps pulling me back

speedrunning and high heat are just too entertaining ngl

[rustic vale]

Did you finish to the credits or to the epilogue or neither

[wanton zealot]

I was in the process of visiting the end of the game multiple times to get all the lore

[rustic vale]

ok so prior to the credits

[wanton zealot]

Yes, I think

[rustic vale]

You hit credits at 10 wins so

[wanton zealot]

Right on. Thanks for that

I honestly didn’t think I’d like the games as much as I do.
Like when I first heard of them, I brushed them off initially for quite a while I am ashamed to say

[rustic vale]

I was really hyped about Hades when I heard about it in 2018(early access) and then completely forgot about it until I found it at a gamestore in mid2020 for switch

but since then it’s been the only game that’s kept me this long like

[wanton zealot]

It was when I was watching Professor Broman playing it that I finally realized my mistake.

[rustic vale]

I inevitably return to it every few months because I get an itch to play and go on a spree where I learn how to get better at speedrunning or doing high heat runs

[wanton zealot]

I hear that. I felt that urge strongly, often, when I could whip out my phone with a Razr Kishi V2 controller anywhere and play

I miss that. Hades was the best mobile game for a few months there

Now the best mobile game is Subnautica.

[rustic vale]

Terraria mobile

[wanton zealot]

Fair

[polar aspen]

I really was not expecting to see the continuation of Thanatos and hypnos conversation about his lists LOL

[polar aspen]

Apparently lady Aphrodite saw that...

[polar aspen]

I love this game so much

I was not expecting to actually hear Orpheus sing about how zagreus and Dionysus are the same deity

[mint coral]

Hymn to zagreus mentioned

[lavish sorrel]

puts on nerd glasses 🤓

After several hours of having the game open it happens at around the fps-cap AKA 600, it's unlikely they've noticed the strong versions of it (the lower the fps, the longer it takes for a certain fps-number to cause the bug due to delta-time - a 32bit float in the engine - needing more time to start rounding to 0 if there are more frames to work with. If they're complaining about low framerate, it's likely they're running the game at below 60, which doesn't trigger the strong version of the bug until a few days have passed). The weak versions happen regardless of fps from game start onward. Also, dilation doesn't affect zag; in fact almost only game mechanics other than zag, that's not what is causing the supposed input-delay. Also important to distinguish between dilation and fps affecting enemy speed, the math behind these two is different.

I should make a detailed document explaining this bug shouldn't I, there's just too much to see in the thread itself and none of the math

[cinder edge]

I love Thanatos and Zagreus

[polar aspen]

Can you buy that and replay it in the house

[vast raven]

data compliment

[mossy dagger]

standing in the same room for hours seems to make the fps drop a lot, like as if the entire history of what was happening in the room is stored in memory and processed every frame

[vast raven]

doesnt have to be standing in the same room for it to happen, i played for about nine hours straight of actually playing the game until my game became dilated

[mossy dagger]

hm, I stood for a few hours in the skelly room, my FPS was like 15, but after I walked to Zagreus' room the FPS has got back🤔

[stray shard]

HAPPY HADES DAY!!!

[strange ether]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRSpQDZMctA

[craggy pilot]

New art of the OGs, we keep winning chat

[pliant mirage]

Greetings

[viral adder]

Would it be included in the soundtrack at some point?

[void vigil]

happy 5 years to zagreus inventing bisexuality my goat

[rose kite]

I feel old. And also need to do multiple Hades 1 runs today

[deft canyon]

Peak

[autumn marsh]

Hey all, I've got a question that I can't seem to find an answer for, hoping someone here knows. If you enter the temple of Styx with only 1 Hermes boon, it's possible to be offered Hermes as a room reward. Likewise, you can be offered a Hermes boon from Charon's shop. But can both of these things happen at the same time? I've been wanting to test a theory and I've been unsuccessful so far.

[lavish sorrel]

yes.

not that it's usually relevant anyway with how expensive that boon is

but yes

[autumn marsh]

Really!? Every attempt I've done tends to grant one or the other, but not both. I think it may be possible to get 4 Hermes boons in a run, if this is the case. I've been working on this for weeks, but I'm either terribly unlucky or there's something that prevents both from appearing.

[lavish sorrel]

I think it may be possible to get 4 Hermes boons in a run
no

the game will - outside of the potential hermes from styxshop which acts as an independent 3rd hermes - only ever give the player 2 hermes-boon pickups

hermes may be skipped to delay his boon but the game very much wants the player to have 2

[autumn marsh]

Hear me out, there's an exploit with how room rewards are generated in the temple of Styx. If one gets offered in a room, and you take a DIFFERENT hallway, then use fated authority midway through the hall, you can be offered an additional Hermes boon. Then when you return to the main chamber, the original Hermes boon will still be offered.

If the shop carries one simultaneously, you could theoretically get four.

[lavish sorrel]

Hear me out, there's an exploit with how room rewards are generated in the temple of Styx. If one gets offered in a room, and you take a DIFFERENT hallway, then use fated authority midway through the hall, you can be offered an additional Hermes boon.
that's not how it works with hermes and hammers

the game keeps track of how many hermes boons you've picked up on the current run

[autumn marsh]

I've done this several times. Just never when Hermes is also offered in Charons shop.

I can try to put together a recording, if it'll help explain what I'm trying to do.

[lavish sorrel]

I know exactly what you're trying to say, and it doesn't work

look at it like this:

• whenever the player picks up a boon of hermes, increment a counter by 1
• whenever this counter is greater or equal to 2, stop offering new hermes boons in rooms regardless of rerolls or anything else (AKA the "reward-pool" no longer contains hermes)
• there's a 1 in 4 (I think it was?) of hermes showing up instead of the fated anvil in styxshop

[autumn marsh]

I understand that. What I'm saying is, if you only have one Hermes boon, you can get two more in Styx without buying one from Charon. This is really easy to do, I've done this dozens of times.

[lavish sorrel]

that won't work either because it keeps track of the hermes generated too

believe me, fated authority would be much more common to use in competitive play if your idea worked

we'd have figured it out by now

[autumn marsh]

Something about how Styx generates rewards seems to break that. I'll record a video and demonstrate, then I'll get back to you.

I promise you, I'm not just making stuff up.

[lavish sorrel]

dude I know exactly what you mean since earlier already

it doesn't work for hermes and hammers

[autumn marsh]

But if I can show you that it does work?

[lavish sorrel]

it's a lost cause, you're wasting your time

but whatever, it's your time

[autumn marsh]

Alright, well, I'll be back in a bit.

[rustic vale]

This is literally counter to how the bag of available room rewards works (which does not change when you’re in styx)

Whenever it generates a gold laurel door it pulls from a bag of rewards and the specific conditions for hermes is that there are hermes 1 boons, that require you to have 0 hermes boons to show up (no more, no less), and hermes 2 boons, that require you to have 1 hermes boon to show up (no more, no less), so even when they’re reshuffled into the bag they cannot be pulled

Thus you cannot get a third hermes from room rewards because of the how hermes boons are generated in the bag of room rewards

[rustic vale]

You should just go back through your run records (in the archive room) to find this evidence if you’ve done it plenty of times

and send a photo of an escape attempt record where you did actually acquire 4 hermes boons

[autumn marsh]

I never claimed to have done a run where I got 4 boons, that's what I'm trying to determine the possibility of. What I'm saying is I've done several runs where I was able to get 3 Hermes boons as room rewards, without buying one from Charon.

[rustic vale]

This is something that should be an impossibility given how the room rewards are held in the bag like

as explained above

[autumn marsh]

I mean, I can absolutely guarantee that it's possible. If anything, I'm kind of surprised that it isn't commonly known. I can't possibly be the only person to have seen this.

[vast raven]

Hi, I have just over 900 hours in this game and can confidently say that is incorrect. I am by no means trying to push down on you, but that is a false statement.

[rustic vale]

You shouldn’t be able to get 2 of the same room reward in styx due to eligiblity

if you want a breakdown of how the bags works

#h1-high-heat-strategies message

you can read all the messages there for the simple shorter version of it or the doc for a longer

[autumn marsh]

The trick is to re-roll a room reward part way through the chamber. As in, not in the main chamber but before reaching the end. For some reason, the game forgets what is available in the main hall when you do.

[rustic vale]

mmmmm

I guess that’s feasible? Nobody runs fauthority, which would explain nobody knowing about it

[autumn marsh]

I'm not sure if it's supposed to, but it seems to do so

[rustic vale]

since it’s so bad compared to persuasion

[autumn marsh]

Lol that's all I run. I find it way more useful for how I personally play.

[stoic bronze]

Hiya, sorry for intruding on the convo but I have a QQ. In the temple, is each "mini room" its own encounter?

[rustic vale]

Encounter for everything but plume and butterfly

then it only counts the last room

[vast raven]

if you can pull off a run where it actually happens we will all gladly take that as evidence (+ repeatability by others ofc)

[stoic bronze]

So something like this bought from the last shop would be a worthwhile investment?

[rustic vale]

You need hourglass for it to make it to Hades

[stoic bronze]

(oh cant send a pic) but "rare crop", the one where it demotes all booms to common then after every 3 it goes up a rarity

[rustic vale]

since those rooms count as an encounter as previously stated

[autumn marsh]

I will do everything I can to put it together.

[autumn marsh]

Rare crop counts each room as an encounter for Styx.

[rustic vale]

Those minirooms are encounters and chambers for everything but the butterfly and plume keepsakes

[autumn marsh]

It makes it a useful boon late in the room.

[stoic bronze]

Okay thats awesome, thank you!

[rustic vale]

Hourglass (+8 room duration) means you can carry a ton of buffs to Hades

And is practically necessary for this strategy

[vast raven]

anyheat keepsake choices

[rustic vale]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/725021639506526249/1404282483536822423/80F56079-DAF6-43A5-A7E8-46D10EA7F7C2.jpg?ex=68cc0fba&is=68cabe3a&hm=bc64579087163a190f750703785562c9e9e6ddb50ee2ade2d0c385772ebca99c&

I love hourglass

[rustic vale]

It makes a lot of sense (if true) for it to be unknown by the community because no speedrunner or high heat gamer really ever uses fauthority

[autumn marsh]

Im curious, why is that? I personally love fated authority. I've done 32 heat clears with every weapon aspect, and even boonless 32 heat with every weapon, I've never gotten good luck with persuasion though.

Genuine question, not trying to be negative

[rustic vale]

it’s not good for consistency

[vast raven]

main thing is for things like approvals process, and to make the specific boon screens you want to be good more likely to be good, ie rolling for duo boons, specific tier 2 boons that sort of thing iirc vaxon has suggested that some aspects that require less build (just their attack) could use fated authority

[rustic vale]

Fated persuasion has so many more uses (wells, purging pools, poms) as well as it increases the quality of boons you hit, rather than gambling on rather low odds to hit more boons that you need

Being able to reroll your hermes boons alone makes fated persuasion more worth it

then you tack on regular gods, chaos, well buffs, purging pools to dodge bad underworld customs

[vast raven]

gives more runs the chance to have hyper sprint + rush delivery is another key thing

as it is by far the most powerful boon combo

[rustic vale]

your build consistency is so much higher with fated persuasion and at best fated authority is a shot in the dark at maybe getting another god you want

like the odds of that are really really low btw

more times than not

[autumn marsh]

I usually only use authority in mini boss rooms to guarantee getting the specific God that im looking for. No use being able to reroll a boon if you cant get the god you want in the first place.

[vast raven]

if it was able to force a specific god from the god you need it would be much better

[rustic vale]

Left-over rerolls getting you more ichors for more movespeed is also crazy damage

[autumn marsh]

Or I'll use it to force I god that I dont want in my pool away.

[rustic vale]

Keepsakes get you the gods you want

[autumn marsh]

With the shrouded chaos curse, authority also let's you see which rooms are unalterable, which helps predictability.

[mint coral]

If your build wants 3 gods is already a look

[rustic vale]

sure sometimes you have to contend with having demeter as a 3rd or 4th god but it’s not that abd

[autumn marsh]

Only once

[mint coral]

aaand we don't take shrouded for a reason

[rustic vale]

Getting them in your pool is enough

[vast raven]

just gamble!

[mint coral]

True!

[autumn marsh]

I dunno. Personally, I've had so many runs die because I need just one more Athena boon, but she never shows up again and the pendant has already been used.

[mint coral]

Epic shrouded shot into fountain into midshop into npc

Ez

[autumn marsh]

Also Styx breaks authority. Its really easy to force what you want when the item bag limits what's available. At least in the main chambers.

[rustic vale]

styx is too late

[mint coral]

Most people don't pray to finish the build by styx is the thing
Is like, get me out of here please

[rustic vale]

[vapid cave]

Hey! I just saw the offer on eshop (like 7€ on eshop 25€ on playstation store, but I read that on switch 2 it looks at 720p. I also have the ps5 pro Should I buy the ps5 version instead?

[autumn marsh]

I guess that's fair

To the build thing

[mint coral]

In my case I recommend switch just cuz hades is super nice as a portable game

[rustic vale]

The other thing is just the raw strength of rerolling your hermes and chaos boons

[mint coral]

Hermes gud

[autumn marsh]

In fairness, if a build relies on chaos I do take persuasion, but I rarely do builds that require those two. There are so many fun builds that dont need them at all.

Not that I don't take them, just that I don't rely on them

[rustic vale]

Hyper Sprint -> Rush Delivery is massive for global damage as is dodging bad curses from chaos is huge because every chaos room is taken for speed

since it skips an entire encounter

but getting slammed with jury summons 3 because you had horrible curse options

[vapid cave]

Yeah thats what i though, but i dont know if it will look blurry as people said. I dont want to play hades 2 without trying hades 1 first. Thans for the advice!

[autumn marsh]

Ah, and therein lies the rub. Im not a speedrunner. I don't actually care too much if I clear the run quickly, as long as im having fun along the way

[rustic vale]

speed also matters for high heat too

and tacked on to the dodging bad curses thing from chaos is the potential to get a relevant damage boost for your weapon

[mint coral]

Ngl h1 looked just fine on the 1st switch

Wouldn't call it blurry

I wouldn't imagine it'd look worse on s2

[rustic vale]

Hades looks perfectly fine on the swifch like

Thats where all my hours are

[vapid cave]

Yeah the thing is that switch 2 has bigger screen

[mint coral]

(at mooost you get lag on very, very busy rooms)

[rustic vale]

I guess if you have some crazy graphics inflation

[autumn marsh]

Ah, okay, then here's another question. Is the percentage based damage bonuses that chaos offers cumulative with other percentage based bonuses, such as from Olympians? Or is it multiplicitave?

[vapid cave]

Thats why people say that is blurry i will try to see any youtube video if i am lucky

[rustic vale]

Additive

[mint coral]

Additive

[autumn marsh]

Gotcha

[mint coral]

90% of the time a source of buff will be additive

[vapid cave]

For 7€ is worth trying

[rustic vale]

The specific damage calculation is (base damage)*(1+sum of relevant additive +%)*(1+sum of crit damage +%) + extra damage

[vast raven]

something else is that, i wouldnt say the take away is that it is from speedrunning is that the idea is speed, it is the idea that there is the optimal decision making being done

[rustic vale]

True

[vast raven]

only multiplicative damage sources are trap damage and one other i cant for the life of me remember

[autumn marsh]

I mean if I'm given a choice between daedalus or chaos, I'm almost always taking daedalus

[rustic vale]

you can get a hammer again

chaos is far less likely to appear again

[mint coral]

Tbh that's a depend on weapon for me

[rustic vale]

hammer is practically guaranteed based on the weapon

[autumn marsh]

True. But I usually find hammers more useful, and the earlier the better

[rustic vale]

Also yeah it depends on the weapon so much

[mint coral]

Spear def if 1st hammer so I can cimmit reset or nah

(assuming unmodded)

[rustic vale]

like sword second hammer is something you flat out avoid

if you have dedgr

no reason to gamble your run with the potential to brick with cursed + flurry + dash nova being offered

[autumn marsh]

I think one of the most fun builds I ever did was a two hammer sword

[mint coral]

Ap2 2nd sword hammer 🙂

[autumn marsh]

Zag sword with epic flurry slash, lightning strike, flurry strike and cursed slash.

I'll see if I can find the video...

[rustic vale]

I mean I think that’s something most people have tried at the very least

Even if it’s not the most effective build

[mint coral]

Pretty sure that's been a haelian build

[rustic vale]

It’s entertaining to try for

[autumn marsh]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=bMCydE_YR0g

Thats the one. Love this build, it's probably my favorite sword build.

[rustic vale]

I’d rather flurry slash -> piercing wave if I’m doing a meme run with flurry atp

[autumn marsh]

Lol that's fun too

[mint coral]

Sword hammers are so good you just gotta become retrash

[autumn marsh]

The flat damage of the wave actually can be pretty op

[rustic vale]

just get some global additive in there for it

Rush delivery ez

[vast raven]

if only pwaves also proc'd attack effects 🥀

or effected by the attack boon

[warped flame]

aww did they private the anniversary stream video? i was planning on watching it now

[lavish pond]

finally did it!

[vast raven]

yeah ig so damn

[mint coral]

Gg

[lavish pond]

might have took longer than to beat malenia

[autumn marsh]

Yeah, thats where you need universal damage like bad influence or rush delivery

[lavish sorrel]

*trap damage dealt to enemies specifically, trap damage to zag is additive

[lavish pond]

gonna finally put the game down

[vast raven]

shard

[mint coral]

Stygian shard my love

There's also that dumb peer pressure bug

That gives like a x8 dmg multi to normal enemies in certain situations

[lavish pond]

really loved it, excited to play the 2nd game on launch

[vast raven]

what???

[autumn marsh]

Oh? Haven't heard of that bug

[mint coral]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1228902200923918440/1417992420557193246/Screenshot_20250917-185520.Discord.png?ex=68cc7fda&is=68cb2e5a&hm=9524aef7c6becb091426f411863969157167e68bcd6ea5fc8717978587419db4&

[autumn marsh]

Oh dang

That gives me an idea

[mint coral]

Iirc is only x2 on bosses

Despite this it still stinks as a boon which is funny

[rustic vale]

peer pressure is like the stupidest boon ever

[autumn marsh]

It can be fun for gilgamesh maim focused runs

Which are hard, but very fun

[rustic vale]

It just ruins your hangover builds

that’s the thing

lemme lose all my hangover damage to peer pressures lower damage value

[autumn marsh]

That's why it works for maim. Bad influence plus peer pressure and drunken dash, maim gains ridiculous damage.

Add trippy shot and black out and youre laughing

[mint coral]

Pretty sure maim is not buffed by global?

[vast raven]

remembered the other multiplicative effect, movespeed 😌

[rustic vale]

maim is only affected by true global effdcts

[autumn marsh]

It is a actually! But it is not buffed by special increases

[rustic vale]

Damage reduction is also multiplicstive

[rustic vale]

.

[autumn marsh]

At least im pretty sure. 🧐

[rustic vale]

true global are like sweet surrender where it’s a global debuff to that enemy

or hunters mark

[lavish sorrel]

*universal

[autumn marsh]

Shattered shackle and distant memory dont work, privileged status does. Sweet surrender works, hyper sprint rush delivery does.

[rustic vale]

universal is the word I’m looking for

[autumn marsh]

Billowing strength works too.

[rustic vale]

I must be misremembering

[mint coral]

Can someone check quickly with high confidence

[lavish sorrel]

hc is global

[mint coral]

Cuz also yeah I swear it doesn't work??

[rustic vale]

Distant memory

[lavish sorrel]

rr works too

[autumn marsh]

I am not sure about hc, but ruthless reflex works.

[mint coral]

Ik is global, meant that I seriously don't remember maim working with global buffs

TIL ig

[autumn marsh]

I tried distant memory, for whatever reason the burst damage from maim didn't increase

[rustic vale]

distant memory doesn’t work because it’s an unusable amount of range

[mint coral]

Was gonna say

The range is silly

[rustic vale]

Iirc it’s like 630 which is farther than snurst

where snurst had a 600 unit radii

[mint coral]

oh yeah how did I miss this lol

I played gilga a fair amount too before

truly thought it only worked with universal

[autumn marsh]

Basically it does, just some are exempt

[mint coral]

eris route my beloved

the styx main hub is so funny

[rustic vale]

Gilgamesh try not the be unusable challenge level impossible

[mint coral]

Gilga and beo are a hidden aspect spectrum

Not enough time testing 🙂
Not enough time testing 😦

[lavish sorrel]

(actually attack-, special- and cast-speed speed as well as damage-resistance are multiplicative too, but these have no influence on damage dealt per hit and can not be effectively stacked, which is why only movespeed/crits/shard are often brought up)

[stoic bronze]

Is there a list somewhere on what effects can affect "the end boss"?

[mint coral]

Don't remember him being immune to anything?
Oh dusa's summon extra effect ig

Just remember he clears effects when using the darkness move

[stoic bronze]

So you're telling me I could charm him out of the game basically?

[mint coral]

Bosses have reduced charm duration

1/3rd

[stoic bronze]

Ahh right this is the type of stuff I'm interested in

Same goes for stuns i assume?

[mint coral]

Oh yeah festive fog stuns lol

[vast raven]

you can get hades to chain into the same attack over and over again bc of charm though (and every other boss iirc)

[mint coral]

No yeah bosses ignore that part

[stoic bronze]

Oh thats an interesting bug, I'm curious now, how?

[lavish sorrel]

idk about lernie secondary heads and other enemies, but maybe those too. tldr weird stuff happens when enemies un-charm mid-animation.

[autumn marsh]

I GOT IT

[stoic bronze]

Yep found this out in my last run, although still got through him

[mint coral]

Charm/spoiler keepsake make bosses repeat their last attack used

Have a quick enough source of charm and it can be funny

[stoic bronze]

pahahaha okay I've got to find a way to abuse that

[mint coral]

Pommed up aphro call + smoldering air duo

[stoic bronze]

Thank you

[mint coral]

The hermes thing?

[autumn marsh]

Yes

3 room rewards. Blast it, the shop didn't have a fourth, but the item bag thing worked.

Uploading the video now, I'll send a link

[lavish sorrel]

[mint coral]

Send screenshot?? Oh banger

That sounds silly

I love these silly niche

[vast raven]

if only it would be viable 😔

[mint coral]

Like the spoiler keepsake + forced pos call event for double call someone did in speedcord

[lavish sorrel]

monodash high heat fated authority meta

[mint coral]

[rustic vale]

This can often make it worse to charm him since his attacks can come out st weird times after charms

[autumn marsh]

https://youtu.be/0yUzl5v5bM4?si=CwLRMpBOV_WCrTeS

[rustic vale]

Wait I’m 400 messages behind

[autumn marsh]

Now if in theory a fourth can spawn in the shop at the same time, then maybe?

[rustic vale]

yeah

It’s always a 50:50 for your third hermes boon to be in shop

the other 50% is the anvil

[lavish sorrel]

I could have sworn I read somewhere it was a 25% chance

[rustic vale]

@night rampart did you know about this? I didn’t see anything about it in the messages about how the bag works

[rustic vale]

Nah it’s 50:50 third hermes vs anvil

[mint coral]

Is also 100% for anvil on 1st run

[lavish sorrel]

*for any run before run 4

[mint coral]

Ah yeah, teehee

[mint coral]

Finally the peak hermes set up
Hyper sprint + rush delivery + greatest reflex + greater haste

[rustic vale]

gambling time

if only it didn’t come online so late to be unusable for speedrunning and high heat

[autumn marsh]

Lol, its gotta be extremely unlikely. I've done dozens of runs and haven't gotten a fourth yet.

[mint coral]

Also I mean this fully positive but your voice is like, example of youtuber voice if that makes sense

[lavish sorrel]

@rustic vale

[autumn marsh]

Lol oh, thanks I think.

Wasn't going for that, but good to know lol

Okay, I've gotta run, got a class to teach, but I'll check back again later!

[rustic vale]

mmmm

One of these days it’s going to be time for me to debut as the prime Hades educational youtuber

I’m sure my gpa will love that

[lavish sorrel]

you better get the dilation stuff right

[vast raven]

and theres actually a decent amount of usable footage of it too!!!!

[rustic vale]

I’ll learn it

[rustic vale]

Good because I’m never hitting the frames for it on my switch or my laptop

I think I’ll start off with like damage calculations and how to actually properly build each weapon for speedrunning

damage calculations and other stuff like that can definitely be shorts

I feel like each weapon could be longform content

main purpose is just to give Hades youtube watchers some more content actually based in good gameplay and building skills

🗿 since we get so many from Hades youtube and reddit with some interesting ideas

[night rampart]

Seems legit to me

@lavish sorrel why u hatin on new tech

[waxen marsh]

I didn't have time to write something for the anniv, but I want to share my review photo from last year. Thanks for 5 years of this incredible game.

https://cdn.bsky.app/img/feed_fullsize/plain/did:plc:je236u337zd6tdgsh5ft4gpb/bafkreicjyjz2v7e2agmhzqmwomh44fcg4v4rbtovd7kzkx5oh6u4muvede@jpeg

[void vigil]

omg youve got it COVERED

[lavish sorrel]

Because my understanding of the reward-bag was flawed and apparently so was everyone else's, else I'd have been told about it already.

New people regularly come in here and type about things that definitely don't work, I had no reason to believe this to be any different.

[rustic vale]

I had the exact same attitude

heavy doubt because of how often this sort of thing happens and it turns out the person was misremembering

[pine hinge]

Is there a way to make slicing flare work?

It's too shortlived that it lost the advantage of damage ramping

[lavish sorrel]

just making sure, you do mean the beowulf-specific version?

[pine hinge]

Yea

[lavish sorrel]

you're right, it lingers around before the cast-stone can drop, and deals too little damage in return

[pine hinge]

Well... I uh, I use stygian soul

Maybe that was the problem, perhaps it's meant to use the other one

[lavish sorrel]

no, slicing flare is - at least conventionally - considered to be overall bad regardless of mirror or godpool

[pine hinge]

Ah

So I'm stuck with Crush flare and Trippy flare?

That's... limiting

[lavish sorrel]

flood -> mirage shot, crush, or trippy -> bonus casts (stygian)

there are 3 viable options

4 if you include phalanx flare but that one's just a budget crush flare, therefore never used

[pine hinge]

I'd rather use tidal dash if we are talking about Poseidon though....

[lavish sorrel]

why so? Sure, Poseidon dash is great, but most flares are bugged to give the Mirage Shot duoboon far more damage than it's supposed to have

Flood Flare not only opens Mirage Shot but also has large range and alright damage. it also doesn't knock enemies back (which helps the flares all connect, as opposed to what you might think.

[pine hinge]

Wait that means no seastorm isn't it

[lavish sorrel]

you can still get it to activate though standing strikes or knocking an enemy back with a bullrush, but that's too minimal to justify looking for (in fact, having sea storm open is often viewed as detrimental since it means making Mirage Shot less likely from Poseidon)

flood beo is part of what makes beowulf the powerhouse that it is considered to be: it's not just strong, but also (as opposed to trippy flare beo) incredibly consistent (needs only 3 boons to work)

[pine hinge]

Gonna give it a shot later, wasn't considering flood casts back then, since it was kinda awkward to run Hera on it

[lavish sorrel]

hera uses "Shot" boons for every cast except dionysus'

flood hera is weird and has a potential niche in high heat (tartarus and styx enemy cleanup), but outside of this is very bad (casts like to fly off)

[pine hinge]

Wait does that mean crystal beam is going to be even worse

[lavish sorrel]

👍

[pine hinge]

Finally did my very first 32 heat, but again it was in God Mode, but at least I can finally accomplish something

[deft canyon]

Hades just 6 bucks

I have it 2 Times i will buy it for my Steam Deck 😭

No brainer thats how much i Love SG and the Games

[deft canyon]

Yeah the Music still slaps hard

[rough carbon]

how much is physical edition of hades 1

for switch

is it 24.99$ usd

[pine hinge]

I think I have discovered something rather funny, I was running Sisyphus support, and I managed to use it to be the last hit, and she's like "Where did that come from"

And if it's Meg, I remember it was "Don't you Sisyphus me" or something

[rustic vale]

The bosses aside from Lernie will all make comments on your use of summons like that

[mighty terrace]

just started a sword run, first boon i get is a daedalus hammer 🤯

and i picked flurry slash

this might be a goated run

[rustic vale]

flurry slash and goated run in same thought

[mighty terrace]

is it actually bad

[stiff pendant]

I am sure someone else has commented on this (sorry, I'm not active enough on discord) but I noticed the sneaky update with new dialogue talking about all of the Nix kids we meet in #2! <3<3

[mighty terrace]

so far ive been doing well 😭

[autumn marsh]

Flurry slash is excellent with zag sword. Try to get swift strike from Hermes, and focus on flat damage boons like Zeus lightning strike or maybe ares curse of agony + dire misfortune.

Its less ideal with other sword aspects, though.

Support fire works well too, just for that little bit extra.

If you get a second hammer, piercing wave works nicely with it. Added range, shield penetration, and a solid 30 flat damage with each swing.

[mighty terrace]

oh i see

well i just died in a random room in elysium 🥀

[autumn marsh]

Aww dang. Better luck next time. ☹️

[rustic vale]

It’s only bad when you’re trying to go farther in speed and heat

You can reasonably use it without issue for 0-20 heat and ofc you can use it for higher heats, but it’s downsides are only going to become more apparent

It can really mess with your dash-striking and cause you to be stationary for a lot longer than intedned

and in general it really only buffs a worse dps option (standing striking) to be a wee bit better instead of taking hammers that will boost your better dps dash-strike

[rustic vale]

Curse of agony dire misfortune when you could just aim for merciful end for like 8x the dps of waiting for doom to fall

Actually realistically it’s more like 3x the dps

[autumn marsh]

Very true. Usually if I do zag flurry sword I'll go with lightning strike, but merciful end works with nearly anything, honestly

[rustic vale]

Flurry jab is like

sorry flurry slash

is like the one flurry hammer that is actively bad

and will cause you to take more damage than any dps boost it gives

But like flurry jab

holy 2x dps if not more

Flurry shot on bow

is some added qol for like Hera and just pops off

[autumn marsh]

Flurry shot + twin shot on zag bow with heartbreak strike and heart rend. Favorite bow run.

Or, weirdly, triple shot + explosive shot. Works too.

[rustic vale]

Optimal pseudotech hammers

Iirc

[rustic vale]

That was my record up until recently

Found it

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1217110989242241094/1400307169898790912/4DAA3C6B-8777-48A9-A70F-6B15A8823167.jpg?ex=68cd6b6d&is=68cc19ed&hm=0bd83449a74f817c9cd66c55840ec3786407742429c4cb2c8477045537598ebb&

Not heartbreak strike

[autumn marsh]

Oh dang, that's impressive

[rustic vale]

It was very silly because I was only trying to sub9 and then I realised “wait uh I’m actually on pace to sub8”

Since bow was the only weapon I hadn’t sub9ed with atp

[autumn marsh]

Lol that was me yesterday with the fists. Wasn't even going for times, then I got the early satyr sack and thought "oh shoot i can sub 10 this run"

[rustic vale]

It makes sense that it was l my first sub8 cuz I’ve been a zag bow main for the longedt time but

I recently beat it by 3 seconds with a spreadfire zag rail build

[autumn marsh]

Spread fire? Really? I never found that hammer terribly useful, personally. Although I guess the base damage increase could be really powerful with the right build...

[rustic vale]

4x base damage it pretty crazy when you’re only taking like a 2/3’s attack frequency reduction

that dash-striking supercedes

Although the ammo down is the bigger penalty tbh

[autumn marsh]

I guess it makes to use zag rail for it then, offset the penalty.

[rustic vale]

It’s literally like a stock standard zag/eris build but with spreadfire added

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1217110989242241094/1413284970213937184/071354D1-D9C6-40BC-BBEB-41DD8DB05DB4.jpg?ex=68cd2bf2&is=68cbda72&hm=696949e20c1d3f255cee9c74a9bfa98d23aa286f1af51e17eb5e9800c5d08ef7&

[autumn marsh]

I never really considered the actual damage of the rail, since it's base is so low at 10. I almost always use lightning strike, or doom dire misfortune, or sea storm

[rustic vale]

Lightning strike is the way to go for the most part

[autumn marsh]

So if the focus is on lightning strike, wouldn't flurry fire be more effective?

[rustic vale]

Spreadfire makes +% strikes viable thou

[rustic vale]

It’s not the focus

It’s just part of the equation

[autumn marsh]

Ah, gotcha that makes sense

[rustic vale]

also flurry fire doesn’t really help your dps thanks to the 0.15s internal cooldown of the standing strikes

rail strike is already like 0.1533s (or 6.5 shots per second iirc)

[autumn marsh]

Oh shoot, I didn't realize that. I knew thunder flourish had a cooldown, didn't know that about strike

So wouldn't dire misfortune be just as effective if paired with impending doom? In theory

Epic dm is 14 additional damage per hit, plus the base 50 from common coa, then impending compounds it all, and I dont believe there's a cooldown on it iirc

Or is it the rail itself that has the cooldown? Maybe I misunderstood

[rustic vale]

Not really

since it takes so long to drop

most doom strats circumvent it by just building merciful end

lightning strike is also a level of aoe since the strikes bounce around and apply jolted

[autumn marsh]

Thats true. I guess i just like keeping my distance with the rail, so merciful end isn't usually the route I go

[rustic vale]

It’s useable but not really speedviable is what I think

[autumn marsh]

Totally fair!

[rustic vale]

hestia can use doom though due it’s attack frequency

the strike itself breaks armour and then doom falls

on their regular hp

[autumn marsh]

Oh, I hadn't thought about that. I usually just went full percent bonuses

[rustic vale]

Usually you do go full +% strike bonuses

but you can supplement that with fiery presence / high confidence / family favourites off the mirror and then a bunch of chaos strike damage as well

the ares strike is a less common strat but

[autumn marsh]

Hunter dash too, maybe

[rustic vale]

Iirc it is used for speed

[autumn marsh]

With then hyper rush delivery

[rustic vale]

hunter dash is an option but more often tidal dash or blade dash for quick aoe damage on small targets

and extra bossing dps

Those dashes wreck styx so much

and numbskulls & etc

really any small guy where your special (given you didn’t find rocket bomb) would take ages to hit

[mighty terrace]

OMG i finally beat theseus and the minotaur for the first time

[rustic vale]

If you want to avoid story spoilers you might wanna stick to #h1-for-new-players btw

[mighty terrace]

oh alr

[rustic vale]

since that’s like specifically intended for people who haven’t reached the credits or finished the epilogue yet

a lot of experienced players still drop in to give advice to questions, they just know to be mindful of spoiler content

[worn nova]

I'm trying to get good at Beowulf and desperately need tips

Pls

I beg

Chamber 5 mirage shot wth

[rustic vale]

screw all that normal meta beo stuff and just make a cjarged flight special build

[worn nova]

Also

Mr wise one

Does chaos shot give bull rush DMG?

Or do I go for grasp?

[rustic vale]

You need strike for bull rush damage

shot and grasp only affect your casts

bull rush is still a strike

[worn nova]

Kk

[rustic vale]

But the cast damage and amount of casts is far better scaling

[worn nova]

Alr ty

[vast raven]

cshot + artemis attack

[old bluff]

shackle pls

[rustic vale]

I’m actually not really helpful for beo aside from “build mirage shot” “get charged shot” “hit shot and grasp and boons from chaos”

[old bluff]

I mean

there isn't really much more you can tell a new player

i could start talking about breakpoints and other things but that is not very helpful to a new player

[snow cloak]

So heres a pretty stupid question

So Theseus uses a god that you dont have a boon from during s run, what if you have a boon from every god/goddess

[vast raven]

defaults to artemis

artemis is the failsafe god for theseus (most easily see-able in fresh file runs)

[snow cloak]

I see that's interesting wouldn't have suspected that but it makes sense

Imagine if he just suddenly called upon chaos or something, now that would've been cool

[rustic vale]

It’s primarily something you’ll see in fresh-files runs because you can easily hit every god available (ares, athena, artemis and dionysus) and it doesn’t even spoil you for other gods

Otherwise you have to be in the sweet spot between freshfile and your first journey to the surface, because once you unlock demeter you can’t get all the gods by Heroes anymore

[snow cloak]

Yeah it seems impossible with every god unlocked although who knows if there's some seed or combination out there that rolls every god

Then and again I have no idea how seeds work in this game

[rustic vale]

It’s just not possible

the game stops naturally showing you new gods after you hit 4

so at best you can hit your 4th god from a shop and walk into a 5th at the exit to that shop in tartarus

and then force in 2 more gods in asphodel and elysium with keepsakes

And hit 7

For a very ineffectual build

[rustic vale]

The seed is a very fickle thing that changes with pots being broken, cast stones hitting the ground, reloads, and summoning companions

like

it’s so easy to alter a seed while in the run

[snow cloak]

Yeah I've seen seeded runs and heard it being explained and it still doesn't make any sense to me even after it's been explained but I've got the rough idea on how it works

[rustic vale]

but whenever you hit “give up” in a run it puts you back before you entered the run with the exact same seed but you can do things slightly differently to alter it sfter a certain p-

Ok

🫡

[snow cloak]

I see I didn't know the game had a limit like that, makes sense though

[rustic vale]

It’s nice because as soon as you hit that 4th god you double your boon consistency

[snow cloak]

Sorry no please keep talking, I always love learning more

[rustic vale]

because you go from the game picking from 8 olympians when generating a boon to 4

Hermes and Chaos are exempt from the god pool (community term for this mechanic) for the record

[snow cloak]

Yeah they seem to have their own unique traits

From my gathering it's 2 Hermes boons and they can only start in asphodel

And you can hit a 3rd at Styx shop

[rustic vale]

Hermes is like if a regular god, chaos and a hammer had a love child

Like chaos, he has no core boons / no call / no pommables and he has worsened rarity odds

Like regular olympians you can sell his boons and he has legendaries, and counts for family favourites

and like hammers, you can only pick up 2 (3 from a 50:50 in styx shop) boons from him in a run

[snow cloak]

That's low key the perfect way to describe him

[rustic vale]

He’s also more like hammers and chaos in that he can come earlier than your keepsake god boon I forgot about that

[snow cloak]

Yeah I've noticed that as well, he's low key one of my favourite gods to get

[rustic vale]

since hermes boons are generated wholy differently for the bag (which is this slightly complicated mechanic for how the game determines which rewards you can get next which favours giving you options you haven’t come across a lot of so far to sort of balance it out)

[snow cloak]

That is if he would ever offer me more dashes during my merciful end builds smdh

[rustic vale]

I mean aside from extra dashes, hyper sprint -> rush delivery is just more pure raw damage

huge damage at that

[snow cloak]

I've never actually thought about putting those both together, is bonus damage bonus to everything like does that include extra doom damage for instant or is it only your actual weapon damage

[rustic vale]

If a source doesn’t specify what it boosts

It’s global damage

and applies to pretty much everything

[snow cloak]

Makes sense, I might try that out next time

[rustic vale]

there’s a difference between global additive and something like sweet surrender which is universal additive which applies to a few more things you probably wouldn’t thinkof

[snow cloak]

ATM though working towards epilogue

[rustic vale]

If it says “strike/special” or anything like that, that is only weapon damage

not doom/lightning/hangover or any other add-ons

and the damage calculation is like

(base damage + any base damage multipliers) * (100% + the sum of all relevant +% bonuses) * (300% + the sum of all relevant crit +% bonuses) + extra damage

where extra damage is only damage from Hoarding Slash (sword hammer) and the +40 damage from Merciful End

[snow cloak]

I think I understand that, honestly this is helping to see the game in a different way

[rustic vale]

movement speed is multiplicative though so a few ichors and your global damage from rush delivery is going expontential

[vast raven]

balatro ref!

[snow cloak]

I love balala

[snow cloak]

I'm definitely going to need to run this at some point

[rustic vale]

it gets a little crazy when you have like +186% global additive on a flat damage build

[snow cloak]

My best merciful end run was getting the full build going + Revenge doom and then I got the Demeter boon that increases the rarity of boons you own and it hit regular doom attack and that one that makes doom do more damage

[vast raven]

routed eris

impending doom 😌

[snow cloak]

Imagine playing flush 5

[snow cloak]

My beloved

[rustic vale]

High rarity doom

this is actually what rng manipulating eurydice was invented for

oh because of how the seed works you can consistently rng manipulate bouldy boons and anvils and semi-consistently rng manipulate eurydice rarity boosts

there are some circumstances underwhich eury rarity boosts just will not be changed no matter what rng manip trick you pull and idk why

[snow cloak]

Have you tried asking it nicely

That usually works for me

[vast raven]

if only i could send clips in this channel 😔

[mint coral]

Use your embeds

[rustic vale]

You could always just dm stickybot

oh wait

[vast raven]

oh yeah gimme one sec

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1418410776053682336/1418410832483586219/calling_out_eurydice.mp4?ex=68ce0587&is=68ccb407&hm=68c615f352f625274765f4ad7bff19ad834fae4bb1a47cbaa0036a2130a14f34&

i hate when im right

[rustic vale]

Rng manipping eury is so annoying because sometimes she just doesn’t change

And I asked in speedcord and I got told “try spamming summon after you click the option” and that actually does help!

only…

some of the time

[vast raven]

i ❤️ seed incrementing

[rustic vale]

Seed incrementing my beloved

gimme movespeed from bouldy

actually obols % often has higher value ngl every time I get bouldy movespeed I don’t hit rd

[mint coral]

Have you considered just getting the boon? - hypnos voice

[rustic vale]

Have you considered just getting the rooms

Actually what do you think would be faster

A stellar build with horrid rooms or a horrid build with stellar rooms

[mint coral]

Do we count horrid rooms as a 5 sack or nah

[vast raven]

depends on where it is in a run, bad rooms with good build early id say is workable, while good rooms with no build gives a bunch of lead up time but you're going to fall so far behind later on

[median tendon]

||Why is patroclus not appering in my run ive exausted all the achellis dialouge and to get them back together im pretty sure I need to talk with patroclus like 1 more time but ive done around 10 runs now and he hasnt appeared in any of them||

[rustic vale]

Whether patty shows up or not is like pure rng

[median tendon]

i just need to complete that quest and i fully 100 percent the game

[rustic vale]

like a steam 100% or a non-resource director 100%

[median tendon]

minus the stuff from the workbench that needs like 25k darkness and the other stuff

[median tendon]

non resource

[rustic vale]

ah

[median tendon]

actullay i also need to get the spear dedleus hammers but thats easy

[rustic vale]

25k darkness chaos theme is the least of your worries for resources tbh

Compared to the 325k darkness for Unseen One

[median tendon]

uhh anyways hades 2?

lol

[rustic vale]

Hades 1 too fun for that

I’ll get Hades 2 when it comes out fully

[median tendon]

i ended up getting hades 2 like 2 weeks ago because I wanted abit of a break from hades

i put around 10 hours in then they announced the full release so im just going to restart a save file when it fully releases

[rustic vale]

I went back and dug out my 3ds when I started my break from Hades

[median tendon]

yea i recently had an operation on my foot so ive been replaying pokemon y and pokemon sun

[rustic vale]

pokemon sun and moon / usum was the peak of the series

[median tendon]

im playing pokemon sun for the first time*

[median tendon]

yea im on the 4th island it gets so much hate the cut scenes are annoying but for my first play through i dont mind to much

[old bluff]

Trueeeeee

[rustic vale]

I’m thinking of playing it again when I’m done with fire emblem awakening

[median tendon]

yea you should im buying the switch 2 with legends za bundle and once I finish that im going to buy sword and shield

[rustic vale]

Or I could keep modding my 3ds with more games I wanted to play back in the day before I had the spending money to purchase them

and are now purely being retailed on facrbook marketplace by resellers who’ve jacked the price up since

[median tendon]

yea i modded my 3ds game as well but I didnt own one when I was growing up im not really sure what games to get

[median tendon]

if you want CEX has alot of the games for "cheap"

[rustic vale]

I’ve mainly been playing the mario+luigi rpgs tbh

[median tendon]

the pokemon games at least by cheap i mean like plus 20-30 aus dollars extra then the original price which is fine by me

[rustic vale]

Some of the games I’ve been meaning to pirate are regular ds games and are thus a little harder to pirste

I already have a ton of games for the 3ds so it’s only a handful that I’m actually wanting to pirate but you can get mileage out of it

[median tendon]

my lucks so bad no patroclus again

[median tendon]

what games do you reccomend?

ive barley played 3ds games so im not sure what to get

[rustic vale]

I like the fire emblem games even if the difference between like fire emblem awakening and fire emblem shadows of valentia is pretty crazy

I have x/y but and sun/ and ultra moon but you already mentioned those

I have a ton of games but most of mine are at home while I’m at uni because I only brought up so many here hmmm

[median tendon]

i dont really find fire emblem to intresting tbh

[rustic vale]

Kirby Planet Robobot if that’s your style

shovel knight is a baller game but you might ha e that on other platforms

[median tendon]

wow i completly forgot about kirby ill look into some of the games and yea im down for shovel knight

[rustic vale]

The toon-link zelda games have a special place in my heart

Like spirit tracks / phantom hourglass

[median tendon]

ive never played a zelda game tbh

idk why

[rustic vale]

they get pretty varied but they’re all mixes of combat and puzzle games

[median tendon]

and i know id enjoy it as well

[rustic vale]

it’s just some are 2-d and some are 3-d so you get that mix of puzzles between them

[median tendon]

yea theres a 3d one on the 3ds that i might get

i cant remember the name of it but i have the name saved somewhere

[rustic vale]

A link between worlds maybe?

majoras mask?

triforce heroes is a multiplayer 3person one that idk if it works anymore

[median tendon]

yea that one

[median tendon]

probably not cant play online anymore

[rustic vale]

I think there might be some third party work arounds and also the 3ds does have built-in local play

like I would play mario party 7 with my little brothers in the car and despite only one of us having the game

[median tendon]

yea 100 percent there is and idk anyone in my family that owns a 3ds

[rustic vale]

because you could get them to connect to each other and send a little copy to play with each other

[median tendon]

yea isent it called game share im pretty sure

[rustic vale]

Yeah

or even without game share

my brothers and I would play the multiplayer kirby game w/ each other

[median tendon]

ima give up on this patroclus guy very soon

[rustic vale]

It’s not that uncommon lmao

[median tendon]

i used to get him once every 2 runs

[rustic vale]

do you have dark foresight on? iirc that should increase your odds because they count as a gold laurel reward

[median tendon]

even every run

[rustic vale]

Lemme double check the bag thou

[median tendon]

nah i dont think so

i only have 3 of the green ones

[rustic vale]

ok so it doesn’t actually change your odds because story rooms aren’t a part of the bag

but dark foresight is just the better option than olympian favour or whatever it’s called

[median tendon]

the dice roll the status effect and i switch between the cast one

[median tendon]

ill check it out ima hop off for now

[rustic vale]

good options

[median tendon]

cya

[rustic vale]

👍 it basically just massively boosts the number of gold laurel rewards (obols/boons/hearts/poms/hermes) you get in a run

you get 7 more

[median tendon]

damnn

thats actullay very good

hades 2 releases at 2 am for me

lol

[final anvil]

Hades is back on gamepass

[autumn marsh]

Woah woah woah

Remember that Hermes thing I was talking about yesterday? I managed to get it with Daedalus hammers too. Turns out you can actually CHOOSE 3 hammers in a single run, without needing the anvil of fates.

I'm not sure if it has any useful applications, considering how late it happens in the run, but damn that's cool.

The only other thing that I can think of for usefulness around this is being able to get both 3 hammers and 3 Hermes boons in a run. But again, just sort of cool, not terribly useful I don't think.

https://youtu.be/iLVBqmNV5CA?si=t5fXNe2WhLFuxAip

[lavish sorrel]

Aspect- dependent (some care more about hammers past the first one than others, I could maybe see this be handy on the rails and bows, both of those benefit greatly from a wide selection of hammers.

[rustic vale]

I’m not surprised since it’d be via the same exact problem with the bag

Main application would be like Alexca said with bow and rail

[autumn marsh]

I honestly thought daedalus MIGHT have generated differently, since it's not technically a boon. I also wasn't sure what would happen if I grabbed a third, since mutual exclusivity between certain hammers can limit your options, and I wasn't sure how the game would handle offering a third.

[lavish sorrel]

If the game ever runs out of options in any menu it gives you "spare wealth" AKA money dependent on chamber number

[autumn marsh]

But after testing dozens of runs, I no longer think it's possible to get 4 in a run. There's something about how the shops and room rewards generate that makes it seemingly impossible, or I'm just insanely unlucky.

[autumn marsh]

Huh. I knew that for poms if you have no boons, but that works for boons and hammers too?

Neat. Didn't know that.

[lavish sorrel]

One can prove this using the codex menu mod, and giving oneself all options a menu can otherwise give

[rustic vale]

It’s a matter of how many times you can force the bag to refill

That’s the true limit

[lavish sorrel]

Doesn't happen in practice in a vanilla context though of course since there's no way to get enough hammers / hermes

[autumn marsh]

Oh that would be cool to see. I've never played modded, not even sure how tbh, but if it can test or prove the theory, I'd be willing to figure it out

[rustic vale]

What you’re probably encountering now is that you only had a single extra hermes 2 boon or hammer 2 in the bag

so you can only hit it one other time

[lavish sorrel]

No, I'm saying, anyone could verify that statement for themselves, but it's entirely true and doesn't need testing. It's already been tested.

[autumn marsh]

Oh I misread which statement you were referring to, my bad

[rustic vale]

They’re added again on subsequent refills though so if you were able to get a third refill in with hermes 2 or hammer 2 you could feasibly roll a 4th

[autumn marsh]

I don't think rolling a fourth would be possible, I'm just not sure how the game calculates Hermes boons in the shops against a chamber reward

I don't know though.

[rustic vale]

It doesn’t take it out of the bag for the third hermes

in shop

For the same reason that you’ll never hit an anvil on a regular door

That’s generated completely seperately from room rewards

[autumn marsh]

🤔 weird. I wonder why I can't seem to get both then. Maybe I really am just that unlucky.

[rustic vale]

I think it may be I’d just need to theory craft the scenario bc I think you’d need to do some specific things to force the bag to refill a couple times

which iirc there are some ways that you can?

because the real cap is just that you probably only had two hermes 2 boons in the bag when you go to styx so it was only able to grab a single other one out from the bag when you reroll into it

and the other was placed on a door

[autumn marsh]

Huh. Well, I'll keep looking into it, see what I can find out. Lol it might be useless for any sort of serious play, but who knows. I did try turning off the mirror setting that generates more gold laurels, but I've only just started doing runs with that disabled, so maybe that'll help.

If nothing else, it doesn't hurt to have more options, and I like learning new stuff about this game, even 5 years later.

[rustic vale]

The thing is it’d need to be a specific scenario where you did x y or z to actually force another bag refill

[rustic vale]

If anything this would worsen your odds I believe since you’d have less opportunities to pull from the bag and refill it with those extra hermes boons you need for this strat to even happen

Also it is pretty much useless for anything outside of like a meme/challenge youtube video since fauthority doesn’t really stand a chance for speed nor for heat

[autumn marsh]

Ah, okay. I was thinking, less gold laurels means less Hermes offered throughout the run, which means maybe better odds in Styx? Not sure, I don't really know how the bag works yet.

[rustic vale]

Addressing that one point

[rustic vale]

it’s more that for the extra boon to even happen in styx you need to have dug through the bag enough to have refilled it with another heap of all the boons and obols and everything

Thus putting another hermes 2 boon in the mix

That you can grab

[autumn marsh]

Ahhh, okay I think I understand what you're saying.

[rustic vale]

and you can have the bag refill early if you say hit a miniboss encounter and the bag is completely out of boons

and then everything already in the bag stays

but everything gets added again

but hermes 2 boons are only added once you’ve taken hermes 1 iirc

iirc

I’d need to take a other look at it

I should just put the message in my side discord for all my hades gifs and texts and clips

for quick reference