h2-builds-and-combat

[dim kestrel]

can use rerolls on Chaos too... for me I eventually got it after rerolling

[spark robin]

Hey folks. I asked on the general discussion feed a few hours back, wanted to ask folks here for builds for 32 heat and which vows you take. Plz respond/ping me in your response 🙏

[civic ocean]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FgJoGil84EE 5 different builds 5 different weapons 5 wins at 32 fear

[wind kettle]

what can axe special block

[civic ocean]

all blockable attacks

[wind kettle]

is hecate polymorph blockable

[civic ocean]

What is your guess

[silent crow]

wait is it

[wind kettle]

idk dude what's with the passive aggression

[wide wing]

dunno about the axe but i know if you just dodge back and forth 3 or 4 times it'll go away

or frinos can tank it

[hard tinsel]

Ye you can dodge through it

[spark robin]

Not crossflames (Hecate) or the OHKO from gramps. Both can be blocked by Artemis parry. 🤷‍♂️ less intuitive than you imply

[civic ocean]

Yes, the parry does work differently than the block

[spark robin]

I know. Still, my point is its not as intuitive as you imply in your messages. Some things make less sense than it seems

[civic ocean]

Yes, generally the best answer to all of these questions is "go find out!"

[spark robin]

Agreed lol, thanks for the build recommendations. Watching your vid now. Appreciate it

It's bugged and definitely doesn't work as it says. I know because I just beat 16 heat and it almost ended me a few times

[forest hinge]

Artemis' Parry grants "impervious", which in both Hades 1/2 seems to block basically everything. But Axe-special seems to only block projectiles and various melee attacks, but not aoe attacks like Hecate's circle and (of course) gramps' kill-circle.

[hardy basalt]

is there a strategy to outdoing nemesis in the gold competitions? I’ve won a few times, but most of the time she swoops in to get the last hit on anything I attack (and one hit from her can oneshot some weaker enemies) and since I can’t attack her, I don’t know what I can do to get her off me. than could oneshot almost anything, but the delay in his attacks made it a lot easier to best him

[steel sequoia]

u need to go for quantity not focusing like the armored enemies

kill fast whats closer and have no armor, try to snipe her sometimes, usually you get the w

[forest hinge]

does Poseidon-Atk proc its splash effect on Moros' blast?

[hardy basalt]

thank you!

[civic ocean]

Easiest bit of actionablw advice for Nem is to go for the enemies she isn't going for

It's actually really cool storytelling through gameplay - Nem is much much much stronger than you, but you're way faster than she is, so use that to your advantage

[knotty fulcrum]

you can test it but I wouldn't recommend that a +x% attack boon is much better since your attacks do quite a lot of damage. hera or aprho are the best. or of course spitefull strength

[forest hinge]

ok i couldn't tell what was/wasn't taking effect on moros' blasts but i figured "Fast fire rate prob means flat dmg effects are better"

but considering moros blasts are % based it makes sense to go for % increases i guess

[knotty fulcrum]

also if you want to play moros keep in mind that all explosions are counted as normal attacks. so that arcana card that gives +50% attack damage should be used (i think huntress)

[forest hinge]

yeah I've been using that card, but the blasts from Omega-Attacks also count of regular attacks?

[knotty fulcrum]

I'm pretty sure, yeah

[spare kite]

It'll prob be fixed at some point but for now, yeah

Eos's turret ghost also works like that

[hardy basalt]

thank you, I’ll try that!

[wind kettle]

https://imgur.com/KD0EHR0

see me choke this

choked it

[obsidian valve]

What are you supposed to do about Eris's shotgun attack? I cannot for the life of me figure out how you're intended to deal with it

[limpid coral]

get behind her or behind a pillar

[obsidian valve]

Is there a way I can predict it's coming next so I know I need to go for a pillar?

[limpid coral]

eris' sprite is really small so its really hard to tell which wind up animation shes doing

so i just stay close enough to dash behind her if i see a windup, or far away if shes like hugging a wall or fire

she cant do anything if you're behind her

[obsidian valve]

ok I'll try that

[limpid coral]

the sniper shot is a little tricky to time cause she does turn pretty fast during it

[spare kite]

For the sniper you can just run away as far as possible, the dash is easy to time

[limpid coral]

true

[obsidian valve]

honestly the sniper shot was the easiest for me to dodge

I did have a sprint speed upgrade during that run though

[split thorn]

Does the Chaos Cast Boon affect Solar Ring damage or it just adds damage to the initial omega cast blast itself?

[sly plaza]

Only the initial damage

[split thorn]

Bummer. I thought it adds damage to Solar Ring which is why I always get it from Chaos

[sly plaza]

Yeah it’s a bit of a shame but Solar Ring is still really strong so it’s probably intentional

[civic ocean]

Is that the case? I was under the impression that cast damage increases applied to both Solar Ring and Storm Ring (it's sort of the basis for how most Charon builds with Apollo + Zeus + Demeter work)

[stoic kettle]

any recommendations for an aspect of momus build?

[sly plaza]

Storm Ring applies its damage during the normal omega cast duration as part of the effect. Solar Ring is an effect that applies after it ends

[sly plaza]

Apollo Omega spam is a very popular one. Basically focus Apollo attack and some form of regen, hammers that boost attack and then go nuts with omega attack covering part of the room while you smack stuff. Bonus points if you get the legendary

[knotty fulcrum]

you can try making poseidon's cast work even tho it's not the best boon. I managed to get it to do like ~1000 damage every tick

[stoic kettle]

I noticed this so I started using poseidon cast haha

[stoic kettle]

damnn that must have taken a lot of poms

[civic ocean]

I can test this when I get home but I am reasonably certain that Solar Ring's damage increases with cast damage increases, like I've killed Chronos with Torrential Downpour Solar Ring Charon like 10 times now I would be shocked to learn that the Ring damage wasn't scaling

[stoic kettle]

okay I will try focussing on attack instead of cast!

[knotty fulcrum]

yeah it was heroic and I had at least one chaos cast damage buff

[sly plaza]

Please do, I’d love to be wrong on this one just because of how good it is

Like even baseline it has a genuine case for being the best cast in the game outside like maybe Demeter on absurdly high fear due to safety

[knotty fulcrum]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1240383792884093038/1247862405090775100/image.png?ex=667163ed&is=6670126d&hm=57648ca5c410ccf39971a683fa54810cf2a278759087dcc8d7966309e68cd213&

[knotty fulcrum]

I think it does too. I remember one shoting chronos with it

[knotty fulcrum]

tho I'm not sure how that adds up to 1000 maybe I just don't remember corectly

[sly plaza]

Yeah I was always under the impression it was due to it scaling so well with rarity and poms + firing every 0.13 seconds

If it’s also due to outright scaling then it’s beyond just super good

[knotty fulcrum]

the problem with the build is that it's very good for single targets, but not so good for general room clearing

[stoic kettle]

ohhh enshrouded chasm thats dope

[knotty fulcrum]

smth you should keep in mind is that it will push enemies outside the cast so it will likely not hit 3 times. works well on bosses tho

anyway if you want to do like a kinda high fear run I think you should focus on attack and just the normal omega cast. I did 32 I think with just spaming every omega and the normal attacking

higher than 32f I think is just normal attacks all the way. hammers are really powerfull on staff

[sly plaza]

The attack boost thrasher hammer on its own is super potent. It gets so much mileage out of hammers that it’s nuts

[knotty fulcrum]

I had a 40f run where I had like 4 hammers and it was just nuts. sadly just 3 that actually helped but still very lucky run

[tired fulcrum]

Furies works on apollo cast tho

[forest hinge]

does it really?

[tired fulcrum]

Im not gunna randomly change what i said

[tired fulcrum]

Its works btw i just tested it @sly plaza

[sly plaza]

Let’s go!

[civic ocean]

I'm reasonably certain anything that boosts cast or mega cast dmg works on Solar Ring ye

[tired fulcrum]

Even golden rule works on apo cast

[sly plaza]

Yeah I will happily be wrong on this one. That changes things. Prior to this I’ve been focusing the scaling and rarity aspect mainly

[inland rock]

guys which god is best for ttack and special for a torch moros build?

[sly plaza]

Typically people go for Zeus special and your choice of an attack that inflicts a curse

[knotty fulcrum]

i usually try to get hera or spiteful strength on attack. and for special I try to get smth for orig so either dem or hera

[inland rock]

hmm okay idk tho zeus blits seems to have a pretty low dps

[tired fulcrum]

Did you like not test it before telling ppl it doesnt work

[sly plaza]

Honestly? No clue at this point. Could have sworn I tested it

[knotty fulcrum]

hear attack is not very reliable since you might block it when you get born gain

[sly plaza]

Demeter is a good alternative if you block it off imo. If nothing else for the added safety of her curse

[knotty fulcrum]

dem is the safest but you kinda always get arcting ring so idk

[sly plaza]

Alternatively you could go for Aphro I guess if you want to hunt for the secondary boon. You’re going to be very close anyway with Moros compared to the other torches

[knotty fulcrum]

the problem with aphro is that you don't really get it you want to go dem-hera-heph

so spiteful strength shouldn't be too hard to get

and since moros is op you should be able to get even to fields without attack

anyway random question. if for example I have 90 max mana and 120 should be primed the next mana up will be instantly primed? maybe I didn't say that very well

[sly plaza]

Oh you mean if you gain more mana?

[tired fulcrum]

From what ive heard yeah you go into max mana debt

[knotty fulcrum]

damn ok

[spare kite]

Mana debt is a funny concept

[sly plaza]

Debt should be how it works but I know some stuff is wonky. Or at the very least used to mess up the display

[knotty fulcrum]

had a run earlier where I got +30 but was too lazy to count how much should be primed

[sly plaza]

Not sure if you actually got out of debt or not though against your prime

[knotty fulcrum]

I assume huntress doesn't work if you have 0/0 mana right?

[tired fulcrum]

It doesnt

[timid sparrow]

uuuuh did they now patch thanatos to not support Q-attack anymore but just basic attacks instead of fixing Q-attacks? Q__Q

[knotty fulcrum]

if q means omega then it kinda supports them just not as well as before. the crit damage is only for omegas

[timid sparrow]

before it was bugged and it only gave 1 stack per omega attack

[knotty fulcrum]

that was only for some hammers

[timid sparrow]

yea

[knotty fulcrum]

it was a bit too op. but than is still a good wepon

[timid sparrow]

i hoped they would fixx that but now it says "attack" not "attacks"

[knotty fulcrum]

I would love a omega attack focused asepct tho

[timid sparrow]

also melinoe aspect says "attack might" which also only refers to "attack"

so there is not a single axe rn buffing Q attacks?

[sly plaza]

I guess Mom skull is close right?

[timid sparrow]

that cant be right

[sly plaza]

Persephone is Mom 🙏

[knotty fulcrum]

I meant on axe

[sly plaza]

In what sense? Charon and Than not what you looking for?

[knotty fulcrum]

oh really? I thought it would affect omegas too

[knotty fulcrum]

I like them but it doesn't really buff omega attacks

I mean than kinda does but I would like to only spin

[timid sparrow]

yea

[sly plaza]

Aaah. I get you. More general purpose

[timid sparrow]

i only do spin
but nothing buffs spin now

https://tenor.com/view/pepe-feels-spin-meme-cry-gif-17251762

i guess i'll just choose the 35 hp then

[sly plaza]

You always have Dashing Heave I guess. Not quite spin but it’s something that benefits off that attack power of Mel

[knotty fulcrum]

3 run streak with no dashing heave. and timing out on chronos but that's my fault

[hollow ether]

just lost a 16f on chronos, made the mistake of getting the hera boon that upgrades all commons forgetting i had the magick greed thing and it ruined the run

[knotty fulcrum]

what aspect?

[hollow ether]

axe thanatos

with omega attack hammers

[knotty fulcrum]

idk probably just do more runs and you'll get it. can always go for coarse grit if you struggle too much

[forest hinge]

The wording of the game is really specific, Attacks (plural) applies to omegas, but Attack(singular) is just the regular attack, that took me a while to realize when I was testing Huntress in the training grounds

[silent crow]

than axe does lol

[timid sparrow]

but the description only refers to "attack. click lmb to perform an attack"

[spare kite]

Attacks build up crit chance, which works on your omegas

[silent crow]

thanatos axe builds crit chance on omega moves by hitting things with normal attacjs

[timid sparrow]

as opposed to "attacks. click lmb to perform an attack or hold lmb to charge an omega attack"

[silent crow]

honestly u dont even need an aspect for spin gameplay

[timid sparrow]

yea but i want one

what is this argument lol

[silent crow]

what would it even do

base spin is already dummy op

[timid sparrow]

what do you mean. before the patch aspects did buff "attacks"

[silent crow]

which aspects

[timid sparrow]

well i do know than did because i tried to use it but the hammers bugged it

[tired fulcrum]

Old Than didnt buff "attacks", it buffed like everything

[knotty fulcrum]

you used to raise up the crit chance with "attacks"

[timid sparrow]

thats ok because that would include attacks

[tired fulcrum]

You used to raise the crit chance with omega moves

[knotty fulcrum]

only omega moves? guess I forgot that part

[tired fulcrum]

Only

[knotty fulcrum]

is there a way to predict which one of the hecates is the real one?

[tired fulcrum]

Bigger smoke cloud thingy

Also shes guaranteed too be the last one you hit /j

[faint spear]

You can also try attacking them during the moves, the real one will take damage while the others will flash green

Statuses like weak inflicted beforehand also will stay on only the real one

[knotty fulcrum]

I can not say I know what cloud thingy but I'll look for that next time

[knotty fulcrum]

that's nice

I usually just go in the same order for every attack pattern and it's usually the first one but not 100% accurate. thought maybe it's not 100% random

[tired fulcrum]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1245199026778013757/1245199027306369045/2024-05-28_18-51-35_-_frame_at_0m19s.jpg?ex=667196b6&is=66704536&hm=e0815c36c4ec2219dc10b820c630c2e22515eec98c7c49f2459ff4a9a320d8c2&

[knotty fulcrum]

ah that makes sense

[faint spear]

Interesting

[knotty fulcrum]

what isn't echo guaranteed?

[analog ether]

Well, that's super nice to know. Nemesis can also appear in NPC rooms.

[timber pawn]

No unfortunately

[limpid coral]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/885007146981396480/1252412071744897148/image.png?ex=66721f22&is=6670cda2&hm=e9a0d0efd265e12ee4cd1bb23fdf5b0c9c39549eae563c837aae811177b345f4& Maaaaan

Well maybe dodge will bail me out

[bleak night]

You're digging into those 42s, huh?

[limpid coral]

Trying to, lol

Maybe i should take something instead of suffering 4 so instead of getting crit 4 times and dying i get crit a lot more times and die

[onyx trench]

mad rn. 24 heat, chronos second phase, moros torches with free origination and total eclipse dumping damage down. Oh, and I also have coarse grit. and I still lose through a combination of the little hourglasses and skill issue

anyways Moros is busted I just need to get good

[limpid coral]

Ok do I pin or antler for tartarus

I got one revive back from charon well

[bleak night]

what weapon are you on ?

[limpid coral]

Moros torch

[bleak night]

ye probs just Pin tbh

[limpid coral]

I don't trust antler cause moros sucks at range

[spare kite]

I'd do pin

moros already has dumb dmg, just live

[bleak night]

10 seconds of going in without caring about dodging is a lot of time to do damage on that weapon

[limpid coral]

Sounds good

I'm 1 off from coarse grit lol

[bleak night]

Chronos room now ?

[limpid coral]

Ya

Aw almost had it

Think a clock hand I didn't see got me while he was walking to the middle to do a nuke

[bleak night]

ah, rip

You'll get there again, no doubt about it, though

[timber pawn]

Been there

[jovial cove]

oh boy new 50 fear runs

that leaves blades as the only one without it

[timber pawn]

I have to imagine pan can make it happen? Idk

[past salmon]

Twoeleven got decently far with it I'm pretty sure but they quit cuz it was miserable

[jovial cove]

moros playstyle seems kinda wack before you get born gain

[past salmon]

It's certainly a playstyle

Meli torches r better on 0 Mana so

[plain fossil]

same with any high mana build at high fear right u just reroll till u get b orn gain early

[alpine topaz]

eos is so much more fun in the average run though

[plain fossil]

i dont think either torch is any good on 0 mana tbh its like triple damage with mana due to 2x base + the extra attack speed

i did try a bunch i think mana is a lot better even with the advantages 0 mana gives

[past salmon]

Yeh but if you have to choose one you choose meli

[plain fossil]

yea i think so the coverage on regular special for moros is really quite bad lul

[past salmon]

Nvm

[jovial cove]

or you could just not do vow of panic
if you're not gunning for 50

[plain fossil]

i did try some zero mana mel torches with pos start i didnt love the damage

[past salmon]

I mean yeah obvs
Vow of panic is the last thing you take

I mean ig it's playable if no onion
Cuz U just born gain R1

[plain fossil]

i saw a guy get 48 charon with panic on btw his strat was just reroll 5000 times for room 1 onion room 2 born gain

[past salmon]

Draining af

[plain fossil]

and then reroll another 5000 times for perfect chaos boon

[jovial cove]

I think onion is worse tbh but it is a 3 value fear

[past salmon]

Yeh
I saw it
I can't do the 10 billion resets strats

[plain fossil]

i underestimate the pain thresholds of ppl here

[plain fossil]

btw this is why im rly skeptical of pan, its because even if u do this and get the perfect start with born gain pan still has absolutely no damage until u also get poseidon flourish

??? i think the naughtiest word there was pants idk what drugs automod is on

but yea what i said was if u dont have poseidon flourish u can dump a whole full charge slow ass omega special and still not kill a shark 😦

[past salmon]

Yeh. The argument for pan being doable is that twoeleven made fields I believe more than once and honestly if you can get out of Erebus it proves it's possible lol

[plain fossil]

if u savestate every encounter maybe

its ok sgg will buff mana builds next patch trust

[past salmon]

If they remove or nerf panic I'll start doing 55F Moros probs

[civic ocean]

I think Moros might be able to do 55 atm but it might be TAS only

[past salmon]

It can definitely do 54F
I did 5 runs last night just to try it and got to Oceanus twice

With a crackhead Strat too

[tired fulcrum]

Do we even have hades tas

[civic ocean]

I think if someone gets like insanely sicknasty with using the normal special to pop balls and gets the god run 55f Moros seems possible

[limpid coral]

if hades runs on linux it probably can

how would moros play if your guys didn't have any collision with each other? I wonder

[past salmon]

You would just play it like Mel torches until you get a gain and then it would play the same

[tired fulcrum]

Omega special guy explosion spam kinda just better than letting guys stack up to nuke a spindle for 10k overkill damage

[past salmon]

True but the spindles deserve it

[tired fulcrum]

Also torch omega special duration hammer when

[limpid coral]

cause like, the whole deal with them having collision makes me think devs envisioned ppl making a minefield and blowing it up

even though actually doing that is really finicky

but they travel kinda far for if you wanted to like, put a bunch of guys down next to you and blow them up there

which i guess is the whole point, to have them get stuck next to you? idk its just real awkward to press m1 at an enemy and have it not hit them

[faint spear]

Hera Cast on Pan might be nice since you could theoretically get multiple omega specials out w/ it

Plus you get rid of a barrier if it lasts when enemies spawn

Doesn't matter as much on Pan but makes a slight difference

[limpid coral]

hera cast taking off 1 buffer vs arctic ring taking off all buffer plus freeze, interesting

[past bough]

pan deals ass damage

[faint spear]

Fair point

Cyclone cast can stack with it and do the same thing

[faint spear]

With good boons you can get good damage

The Wolf Howl Lethality upgrade can make your omega specials deal some massive damage

Though you need to get lucky for that

[limpid coral]

if u get perfect rewards in the first few rooms its probably doable lol

[past bough]

omega attack build still deals more dmg while being more consistent imo

[faint spear]

If you're going for omega attack idk why you'd do pan

[past bough]

idk man

im butter

[faint spear]

Fair

[limpid coral]

butter on a pan

[faint spear]

I'm not a high fear player so I know nothing

[past bough]

real

[past bough]

same my highest fear run was 15

[jovial cove]

yeah omega attack seems like artemis territory
which does have the highest fear currently

[past bough]

its good paired with flutter flourish

and born gain

[limpid coral]

oh, artemis has a 50?

[past bough]

and the hammer that quadriples your omega attack dmg

[jovial cove]

highest for knives
48

[limpid coral]

o

[jovial cove]

its ok I wasn't as clear as I could've been

[limpid coral]

idk how to get under 5 minutes with artemis it feels so slow to clear rooms with revs and +enemies

[plain fossil]

I dont think ur supposed to be spamming omega attack until/unless u have explosive ambush right ur just playing it as gimp regular attack blades?

[timber pawn]

Even with explosive ambush rebuke just really screws you up if we're talking about 50

[plain fossil]

I believe its a 48

[past bough]

guys try out zeus omega cast with his upgrade that allows you to use omega casts from distance and some other stuff its good

the apollo omega cast that makes it larger is also good for it

[limpid coral]

so true

[magic moss]

it is like the default persephone build

[past bough]

idk man im butter

[past bough]

so true

[magic moss]

i cant believe its butter

[limpid coral]

you are butter !!

[past bough]

its me!! im butter !!!

im @past bough

youre actually butter???

yes i am 🗣️

omg im your fan!!!

cool

yooo

@limpid coral im butter

die dai: omg i cant believe its butter!!!

butter: im butter

[still girder]

55 heat woes, died to hecate cuz i got sheep'd T____T i had a chaos boon that was gonna pop 50ish% extra attack damage but it made my dashes suck

i had frinos in place and everything and went to dash past him to eat the projectile early

but my dash did not go past frinos

[tame spindle]

😭

at high fear hecate goes from a fun lil challenge to ultra mega super nightmare boss

[silent crow]

why ar le uou doing this 😭

[still girder]

imagine how sick the video will be

[past salmon]

yeh ill be waiting for it in 2 years time after the vows are completely different along with everything else in the game 😭

[still girder]

(i just like challenge runs. an hour of hades, then an hour of another game, nice relaxing relax time. i've got the week off from school between quarters)

[past salmon]

I mean you can like challenge runs but 50F is a much nicer challenge run than 55F which is basically just a gambling simulator

[still girder]

yeah but 55f seems so unreachable that it's cooler to me. different strokes i guess. i'm only doing this casually until full release when i'd seriously grind.

[silent crow]

just crystal figuirine into judgement and win thatll totally work 😼

[past salmon]

doesnt even work im pretty sure lmao

[silent crow]

umm uhh umm

[analog ether]

Finally finished off 24blades. Not looking forward to 24torches.

[past salmon]

Just embrace Moros

[analog ether]

No idea what even kind of build I'd want to angle towards.

[past salmon]

Moros sort of just wants born gain + an attack boon
You can also go for spiteful strength tho which is rlly strong

[analog ether]

That's Hera/Heph, right?

[past salmon]

yeh

[analog ether]

Duo's are a pain to fish for, but I'll keep it in mind. Ideas for an attack boon?

[past salmon]

Hera/Aphro/Apollo and even Dem all work

[tired fulcrum]

i swear spirit surge is the worst boon because of bloat bags why can they suck you from off screen

[cunning pollen]

I find it very satisfying blowing them up with revenge boons (Apollo's especially, since he has two of them)

[summer heart]

i was surprised by how much i ended up liking zorephet, tbh, given how not my thing slow and strong weapons are

not that even non-than zorephet is excalibur slow, but still

[cunning pollen]

It's a technique-heavy weapon and for that reason alone I love it

[summer heart]

...hold on how did i end up in this channel and not the one with the conversation that prompted that

[cunning pollen]

You started writing about a weapon and the discord read your mind and redirected you?

[bleak night]

This feels like a hyperbolic time chamber where your 55F attempts just make you able to destroy 50f lol

[plain fossil]

I tell everyone click heavy metal it makes fields so much less unpleasant

[low bear]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1233146305308528650/1252514986253746248/image.png?ex=66727efb&is=66712d7b&hm=eabe282c003a73b75ab1849ccc3da76956dcb4ccd9fc0623eceab5f253f9bb58&=&format=webp&quality=lossless&width=2057&height=1157

Possessed + Bolstered + Mel Skull = OP

[past salmon]

nice!

u got weed killer too

[low bear]

yeah Weed Killer stronk with Possessed

I wish I could have gotten Hera's Omega buff too but it's not as good since my huntress would need to be turned off

I didn't know Artemis could show up in DPS meter lol. I was playing her chamber super safe in Erebus and let her do most of the work

[hollow crypt]

#h2-victory-boasting message
finally Dark Side Geyser Ring

[rich bolt]

Hook knives plus dancing knives feels worse than hook knives by itself to me for pan

[hollow crypt]

only reason to use Dark Side imo

[tired turret]

hey does anything change for the size for torches if i put apollo on the special?

[hollow crypt]

yeah the helixs are larger

[plain fossil]

The chain kinda breaks the return effect, we generally recommend not clicking those together

[rich bolt]

is there any compiled documentary from these discussions atm ?

[hollow briar]

Pain https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/716711284862746644/1252529059964129377/image.png?ex=66728c16&is=66713a96&hm=36aca3b8f5fd857a307c2b7a7d8bdf044fb1c722792380addcff1042dfc222d8&=&format=webp&quality=lossless&width=825&height=256

[plain fossil]

Doubt it lul theres a lot of interactions and we've been through many of them in here but by no means all

[past salmon]

simply clutch

[hollow briar]

Did

[past salmon]

nice

[hollow briar]

Zeus in his trial did more damage than Chronos LOL

[plain fossil]

Thats because he's a jerk

I click zeus in trials over literally everybody ngl

[past salmon]

nah Aphro is still a cheater I stg

[plain fossil]

Because i dont wanna deal with having no space to move or time to breathe

[hollow briar]

REAL

God, she was such a pain the last time I had a trial with her

[hollow briar]

What a wacky Arcana setup lol https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/716711284862746644/1252538118935154739/image.png?ex=66729486&is=66714306&hm=935903be87ebe5136db5e2779e8db00e09799b9e42223a514ca72a947ef0968b&=&format=webp&quality=lossless&width=825&height=516

[tall notch]

Very wacky indeed

Why would you do this

[past salmon]

wtf is this 😭

[civic ocean]

sure why not

[spice ibex]

I know you

[summer heart]

@pearl frigate scorch can melt off rebuke, sure, but you know what else can melt off rebuke? demeter's cast, which also inflicts freeze, which is useful

[pearl frigate]

That's true but Demeter might not always be beneficial in some builds

[summer heart]

i just don't feel compelled to go for hestia as an origination enabler when other gods can enable origination and help in other ways

[past salmon]

Im not gonna lie Demeter is literally the best god in the game and is always useful 💀

[pearl frigate]

Makes sense don't deny it, but I do think she has her uses is what I'm saying. But I also love her and Poseidon's duo

[summer heart]

yeah i'm not saying she's useless or anything, just, y'know, i wish she was better

rather, i hope they make her better!

[pearl frigate]

I mean, yeah but also I don't always want to be doing Demeter build every time 💀

[civic ocean]

she's pretty good atm you just have to get a bit creative

[past salmon]

I'm sorry east but the Scorch cope must stop 😭
Even air fryer is so mid compared to other options

Scorch is literally only good with a bug 😭

[pearl frigate]

Oh no doubt she has to be improved I agree with that. I also do think she's got some uses

[hollow crypt]

one button origination is so nice

[hollow briar]

Just made it to first floor of Tart on my first try lol

Either I'm better than I think or Persephone is legit just cracked at the sticks

More than likely the latter, but I don't like being honest with myself

[past salmon]

nah ur just cracked fr

[hollow briar]

Issue is that I couldn't get Trusty Shield so I took 128 almost instantly, so

The beefy dudes are just so damn annoying even when not doing this level of Fear

[hollow briar]

Also is Moon not actually worth taking it over Origination for this typa build, or

[past salmon]

nah I think Moon is better
Its just way better for glory charge'

[hollow briar]

Fair that, yeah

Then with Lovers and DDs I'm already out of, like, the majority of my Grasp LOL

[past salmon]

I'd take off strength tho
Strength isnt actual global damage its got poor wording

[hollow briar]

Oh word?

[past salmon]

yeh its only attacks/specials so its not boosting your cast

[hollow briar]

Damn. That's unfortunate.

[plain fossil]

interesting little proof of concept: https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/751691459580919834/1252550876728397874/image.png?ex=6672a068&is=66714ee8&hm=8b8d7be279542516eeb6d10c9fe6b6ca7940f0dd5deac5bf28e768a66066ea0a&=&format=webp&quality=lossless&width=750&height=421

too slow for high fear still but theres some potential there

[past salmon]

whats the concept?
Crushing?

[plain fossil]

yea

[past salmon]

ahhh cool

[plain fossil]

regular special crushing comet eos

[past salmon]

interesting
I assume just spamming Omega specials with something else might still be better tho idk for sure

[plain fossil]

this can def do 40 to 45 if u turn off timer and blue shields

i stood in everything and didnt have coarse grit lul

well i say turn off but 7min u know what i mean

[hollow briar]

Alright, second try

Maybe this'll work https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/716711284862746644/1252561377248149618/image.png?ex=6672aa2f&is=667158af&hm=bc6b39bf96934938438f682f795a9a501d12c3fd78450124668a829f4153b9c5&=&format=webp&quality=lossless&width=825&height=516

[plain fossil]

Looks bit terrifying gl

[past salmon]

probs possible timer is so scary there tho

[hollow briar]

DID IT

[past salmon]

NICE

[hollow briar]

HOLY HELL LOOOL THIS THING IS CRACKED

[plain fossil]

Gz

[hollow briar]

I believe I may be done for a bit. Might try it again with Rebuke later today though to get a little more Fear in, maybe even Revs if that ends up being fine

[low bear]

so what's the build for 45F Moros

I'm guessing Hera atk, dem/zeus/aphro special, born gain, and clean candle if possible?

[past salmon]

yeh sort of
you can also go spiteful if you want
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mvaW-CEsVB8&t=6s

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJxCsQWKC20&t=16s

[low bear]

Do you recommend rebuke or revenant if I had to choose

[past salmon]

uhh
probs rebuke ig

[hollow briar]

For Moros, I’d imagine Rebuke is the way to go

[low bear]

Or commotion

[hollow briar]

Just sounds more bearable than having to go out of your way to grab the skulls

[low bear]

There's also onion but I hate it

[past salmon]

idk what was I running in my 45F 💀

[hollow briar]

Bitterness isn’t that bad, but you’re gonna want to run Artificer to make it less of a kneecapper in Erebus

[past salmon]

I think I had panic onion and 1 lvl of revs turned off

make sure panic is off @low bear its actually miserable

actually tbf if u have onion off its fine
if ur just doing born strats

[low bear]

Oh I was thinking off having room 1 born gain, but hmm I'll consider onion too

[past salmon]

honestly no onion no revs is probs best setup

[low bear]

Arti is interesting, turn off huntress and what else for it tho

[past salmon]

I wouldnt try arti gambling before 50F tbh
its kinda miserable

my 50F setup turned off Orig and Furies for it iirc

[hollow briar]

You unironically lose more Boons overall to Destitution and Desperation than Bitterness imo, it’s just that Bitterness sucks Literally Immediately rather than the formers’ Randomly Around

Since if you’re being optimal time-wise or Fang-wise in Tartarus, you don’t stop for Boons anyway, so you’re only really losing three to the prior regions most of the time

And I 100% lose more than three Boons specifically because I can’t buy them with Destitution, and I don’t take Trials much at all with a maxed timer because of its constraints more than anything

The latter’s somewhat of a random occurrence, but the same goes for mini-boss rooms over mid-shops because of time issues more than danger levels lol

[low bear]

Also what about static shock, could help with rebuke assuming I have enough mana

[storm horizon]

hold up, second video. at the end of the second room he gains 25 max hp when picking up ashes. how does that happen?

[past salmon]

its good IF you have the mana
usually ur never clicking tho

[low bear]

2 Selene starts in a row

[past salmon]

artificer

[storm horizon]

ah

[low bear]

This should be illegal

What about Huntress vs Death, dunno what to do with my 3 grasp

[past salmon]

defs huntress

huntress effects your omega attack explosions for some(?) reason

thats why I took huntress over Orig in my 50F
Get the damage boost straight away

[low bear]

Wait really so is the explosion considered bofmal attack?

[past salmon]

yeh idk wy

[low bear]

Normal*

Hmm would something like Apollo attack be dumb

Maybe the added AoE would help, and double strike

[past salmon]

Apollo was never bad

it was worse than Hera and aphro in my experience

[plain fossil]

Does apollo aoe affect the moros explosions

[past salmon]

but like getting locked out of Hera attack was common so
I ended up just doing spiteful for my 50F lmao

[plain fossil]

I assume yes but i never actually tried

[low bear]

Man Moros damage is so stupid good, got through Hecate with 1 min left and no atk/spec/cast boon lmao

Also what would you take for fields keepsake, hammer or chaos

I guess Origin Coil can brick me so hammer is no go

[past salmon]

hammer can brick yeh Id avoid it
Idk im usually just taking pin for safety or a god if I desperately want them
you can take droplet tho channel speed goes crazy

[bleak night]

Yeah tbh Moros damage is kinda just so good

[robust prism]

Moros my beloved

[low bear]

damn I just completely choked my Chronos fight lmao, got there with 5 mins on timer and Full DDs

I forgot I didn't have Coarse Grit on 💀

[plain fossil]

I do this more often than i admit

[low bear]

I was playing too aggro considering my other 2 45F clears I was below 2:30 on the clock lol

[bleak night]

Man...

Btw, do you record your runs ? I kinda wanna see how you play

[low bear]

oh I don't I'll record on my next Moros attempt

dunno if my laptop can handle recording and playing at the same time

[plain fossil]

Alright its finally time to learn persephone

[low bear]

but if I bump down to 720 it should be good ig

[plain fossil]

What am i supposed to do here, its just a zeus cast build right

[bleak night]

OBS barely takes memory on mine, if you use that one

[low bear]

Zeus Cast and whatever special I guess

[bleak night]

P much yeah.

[low bear]

I just use the built in windows recorder 💀 I'll check out OBS

[limpid coral]

Tbh I played persephone using a lot of charge attacks and going for a good gain early

[low bear]

but Moros by far is the strongest of the 45F I've used I think

[bleak night]

If you need help setting it up lmk, it's still kinda fresh in my mind

[limpid coral]

OBS I think is quite a bit nicer than win alt r

Much more customizable

[low bear]

I'd go as far to say that Moros is the stongest aspect currently, even stronger than Pan

[bleak night]

Yeah I def swapped to just using OBS for it now

[low bear]

thanks! I'll let you know if I do run into trouble

[bleak night]

I never really considered Pan the strongest for atm

[limpid coral]

There are rly quick and easy tutorials on youtube

[plain fossil]

Do we think pan is good?

[low bear]

I used to think Pan was 2nd strongest behind Old Momus

[bleak night]

I think it's top 5, at least

[plain fossil]

Depends on fear i guess

[low bear]

but the Axe/Skull/Torch buffs went HARD

[plain fossil]

I really hate pan's erebus

[past salmon]

Pan is a top weapon at low fear but I feel Pan scales the worst with fear

[low bear]

yeah tbf I only did 32F (and 42 with old Momus lol) before current patch

[bleak night]

Blades just seem to be the worst in high fears is all. That dash attack is disgustingly horrid ngl

[limpid coral]

Swords feel really bad early and pan doesn't help with that

[past salmon]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1246695893361496087/1252587418016550912/20240618213500_1.jpg?ex=6672c270&is=667170f0&hm=e26d3934930c794cc59191aabcbcfd9da8c2deaabd4be6389d88576e7e35879b&
But can I offer you a fire extinguisher in these trying times

[plain fossil]

Personally in terms of comfort i think theres at least one aspect id be more confident doing, say, a scratch 40 on for every weapon that isnt blades

[low bear]

Moros feels like it surpasses non double moonshot Momus too but I could just be a better player than before

[plain fossil]

Im enjoying momus atm

Oh sry u edited

[low bear]

I am enjoying new momus too much more than old

[past salmon]

It definitely doesnt but I know why you would feel that way
Moros is a lil overtuned atm

[plain fossil]

Yea im not comfortable enough on moros to really comment but it certainly seems strong

[low bear]

yeah sorry it was a typo lol

yeah fair old Momus required so little setup that it was crazy

[past salmon]

Even without double moonshot old Momus was absurd
I'm pretty sure it took twoeleven like barely any time at all to get a 50F Momus and that was without double moonshot

[plain fossil]

Im very much a hide-around-corners player in the vein of eos, momus, charon rather than a unga bunga moros or skulls player

[past salmon]

like, an hour of attempts maybe 💀

[bleak night]

old Momus was so overpowered that there are like 10 50F runs on it lol

[past salmon]

Yeah it was absurd lol

[plain fossil]

Old momus good

[low bear]

yeah I guess I could just be a better player now

[bleak night]

I think they gutted Staff special too much as a result tbh

[plain fossil]

We all are

[low bear]

I didn't even know about triple earth when I did 42F Momus first try I think lol

[plain fossil]

Staff special has sketchy hammers now ngl

[low bear]

yeah staff normal special just kinda sucks now

[past salmon]

yeah Momus runs were basically like -10 Fear lmao

[bleak night]

been spamming triple earth the moment I saw Hera was good on Axe attack and that she's 100% earth lol

[plain fossil]

I kinda wonder how bad poseidon spam staff special is now i didnt try

[low bear]

it's bad

[plain fossil]

Im always looking for zero mana angles

[bleak night]

lol I've been spamming Earth stacking since week 1 apparently #h2-victory-boasting message

[past salmon]

Thats another big reason Moros isnt close to old Momus atm
Its magick reliant
Which is just an inherent downside atm lol

[low bear]

there is something wrong with the mana system when magicless is so strong and most others want born gain which allows you to ignore mana system lol

[past salmon]

Gains are probably getting changed soon anyway
And im praying that panic gets changed/nerfed 🙏
Honestly if those 2 happen its probs fine

[bleak night]

I think Omegas should just have more tools built in via boons

[limpid coral]

The only winning move is not to play

[bleak night]

but I need to play Charon

[limpid coral]

Why think about regening mana when you could instead not

[low bear]

if Unseen got buffed to 2-3 grasp I wonder how that would feel

[past salmon]

okay Unseen is underrated ok I will die on this hill

[bleak night]

so were Torches before the patch changed them, now they're kinda just busted lol

[limpid coral]

What to replace for unseen tho

[low bear]

I've used my fair share of Unseen in my 42F clears too, but they're kinda really niche

[past salmon]

I mean I wouldnt call Mel or Eos busted lol

[low bear]

I wouldn't call Eos busted at least

[bleak night]

They definitely feel a lot better, is all

[past salmon]

Axe was also pretty good before it got buffed Mynt 👀

[low bear]

I hate Daybreaker so much

[bleak night]

as much as I miss old Than, I've been attackspeedpilled already

[low bear]

I kinda miss old Than

[bleak night]

haha funny heavy weapon is fast

[low bear]

I wish there was an easy way to rollback patch and use old weapons again

[bleak night]

heh

[low bear]

Than with atk speed hammer goes hard tbh

like I kinda miss old Eos

[limpid coral]

and yet i still manage to get bonked cause i accidentally do the big chop instead of a regular attack 😔

[low bear]

big chop feels like it should be buffed tbh

[limpid coral]

i pretty much never want to use the big chop

except for like finishing off scylla idk lol

[low bear]

same lol

[limpid coral]

it's so awful to use in rooms

[bleak night]

I use Big Chop on Than, almost never on Mel

[low bear]

if it had auto target on dashing maybe it would feel better

[plain fossil]

It does at least do damage

[bleak night]

It does 4x the damage of first swing, so it's decent for timesave

[low bear]

or make big chop a full radius around you

[past salmon]

I use big chop all th time but im an actual brainrot beserker pilled person so

[limpid coral]

big chop gets me crit for 80 in erebus so definitely biased

[bleak night]

Yeah, you gotta use it from medium range

I prefer swings because the arcs tag all the amassing enemies

[low bear]

also the fact that I can't cancel it with dash kinda feels bad too

[plain fossil]

Its actually true now i think about it, the aoe on the big chop is kind of bad

[bleak night]

@low bear sent you something btw

[limpid coral]

^^^ mel pls dash instead of being stuck in place

[bleak night]

Yeah, I kinda wish the startup on it wasn't so bad

luckily you can cancel the end lag, so it's not the worst to go for anymore

[limpid coral]

does anyone else notice how some enemy shockwaves are visual only and hit the entire circle immediately?

[bleak night]

which ones specifically

[limpid coral]

smacker and succ shade

[low bear]

smacker definitely feels like I get hit faster than the shockwave

[bleak night]

Ah, the fields enemies. Yeah they hit faster for sure

so do the Anchors in the surface, which honestly shouldn't because they do too much damage

[limpid coral]

skill issue i know but

[low bear]

I HATE the Anchors

[bleak night]

I've died quite a lot of times to Anchors lol

[low bear]

they might be just behind the Pufferfish enemies for me

[limpid coral]

anchor guys occasionally refuse to be staggered and idk why

like im in room 1 hitting it with the swords and it just continues it's attack like huh?

[plain fossil]

I dont mind anchors but i do tunnel focus them if theyre up

[bleak night]

Anchors when I stop paying attention for 1 second https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1238124170282532944/1252591947244376084/image.png?ex=6672c6a8&is=66717528&hm=8c560056207120c0f67810d4a16e474851f623fb71d5fe3bcbceb40f57ac4a91&

the fact that they slam the ground for heavy damage, then that slam echoes one more time

is what makes them so infuriating to fight against, especially when playing melee

[limpid coral]

is there a telegraph for the second wave or do u just have to remember the timing

[plain fossil]

Remember timing

[limpid coral]

dam

[plain fossil]

Its a couple seconds but u shouldnt be anywhere near it when its up anyway it hits like a bus

[bleak night]

there's a slight visual, but since it's so transparent you barely notice, especially if you set casts down

it starts to glow a lil bit brighter as it erupts

[plain fossil]

Oh u mean the telegraph itself? Thats pretty visible imo but if its down u should know

[bleak night]

true, but sometimes I forget. It's something we'll probs get used to as we go

I should probably start a catalogue for stuff that's blockable and not blockable

does anyone have a save with god mode maxed out ?

80% damage reduction goes a long way lol

[plain fossil]

Its weird that polyphemus has 2 shockwaves and only 1 is blockable

[bleak night]

yeah, see, I didn't even know that

[plain fossil]

The spiky one is blockable and the solid one isnt

[limpid coral]

ayo what
the one that's like, a circle of circles?

[plain fossil]

Idk how to call it, "spiky one" is the closest, its the one he does in last phase

It moves in discrete chunks outwards its not the smooth rings

[limpid coral]

bruh that literally looks like it rises from the ground how do u block that with a sideways shield, Mel is doing something with that axe

[plain fossil]

U can block some random stuff lul

What weirds me out further is that theres some "projectiles" that count as projectiles for cyclone speed reduction but not for soot sprint

Like hecate's rapid pewpewpew mini ground shockwaves

If u drop a cyclone cast on them they stop nearly dead but if u try and soot sprint them u take 500

[limpid coral]

Wait is that because it's an invisible projectile that spawns the little bombs

Oh no no no no

And they made it immune to soot sprint but forgor about cyclones

Spaghetti code real

[past salmon]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1246695893361496087/1252594371107360828/image.png?ex=6672c8ea&is=6671776a&hm=9459703e031f9374bbe3eec0c2caf53facc67a041230c4d0232f3dd08c03eaf6&
Ok well that probs shouldnt have taken me 180hrs but umm
lol

[plain fossil]

I havent finished mine either i dont have enough meme builds to try at low fear lul

[limpid coral]

Around 90-100 nights in was when i got enough bone/nightmare for now but i was just vibing with grave thirst and toula+fishing rod for quite a while

[past salmon]

ummm
Yeah
Lets say im at night 100 too

[limpid coral]

so true bestie

[past salmon]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1218621088049659930/1252594986227073045/image.png?ex=6672c97c&is=667177fc&hm=638b3abd4826dbce0ebd051ccecf4e033ba6fc46008700978229051cffa4f6ff&
💀

[bleak night]

gaming

[past salmon]

I have more than this too cuz 2 savefiles lol

thats so tragic
ima go cry

[plain fossil]

Im only at night 200 or somethint

[limpid coral]

I suspect my night count will go up much faster with these 40+ attempts

[plain fossil]

I should play more i just talk crap on the internet

[past salmon]

tbf 50F and 53F is like 75% of my nights by themselves

[mystic bison]

Man how does this game hold yall attention for so long

[past salmon]

its a good game

[mystic bison]

Yes

[limpid coral]

Mel go clicky click

[mystic bison]

I'm around let's say 150 but I got bored of it haven't played in a while

[past salmon]

well you see
That was my genius idea

if I just die in erebus in 70% of my runs, when I get to like Fields and tarturus its like a brand new game

I'm a genius I know

[mystic bison]

Oh you running 40+ fear?

[past salmon]

Brother I'm running 50+ 💀

[past pewter]

i have around 5k escape attempts in h1 LOL

[mystic bison]

32 fear is enough for me any more than that and it's tedium for me ngl

[mystic bison]

Bruuuuuh.... lmao i have 200+ though granted I started playing it after full release

[spare kite]

How's the lag going (ik this with history wipes lol)

[past pewter]

It would be insane if it weren’t for cgulls wiper

It’s crazy on switch (1.8k attempts)

[bleak night]

wiper ?

[past pewter]

It resets run history but preserves PBs for each aspect

[spare kite]

It clears the runs in the admin chamber
Cuz having a high number of them causes lag when interacting with doors (small at first, it gets worse)

[bleak night]

oh, I see

wait, does run history lag your game out ?

[past pewter]

Yeah, my switch save hitches for about a second when the rewards on the doors are revealed

Also when switching weapons in the courtyard

[spare kite]

Is something about how the game stores the info iirc? But yeah

[bleak night]

I never went more than 600 runs on my Switch save is all

[spare kite]

I think if it's high enough it can even block the save from appearing (when going through chambers)

[bleak night]

what's kinda whack, wasn't ever fixed ?

[past pewter]

I guess most people didn’t reach 1k attempts lmao

[tall notch]

Guys what's the Pan meta lately? Pos start or born gain start?

[past salmon]

suffer

[tall notch]

(I'm not doing 50f)

[past salmon]

the meta is to suffer
God I hate blades

[bleak night]

Poseidon still good on it

[plain fossil]

Pos start

[bleak night]

even the gain is good because those daggers will just spawn enough bubbles

[past salmon]

Blades is the only roadblock I have to all weapons 45F streak its making me mald

[plain fossil]

Born gain start is miserable u have no damage

[tall notch]

Fair enough

[plain fossil]

Everyone says pan is strong but nobody wants to play blades

[tall notch]

I can't decide if I want to main Pan or Artemis

[bleak night]

I kinda enjoyed my Arty 45 run idk

[plain fossil]

Im starting to think pan isnt actually good other than the big fat highrolls

[plain fossil]

Arty is only fun with explosive ambush

Its really fun with explosive ambush tho

[past salmon]

Pan is good on lowfear tbf

like rlly good

[bleak night]

I'm still kinda sad about Eos being changed. When I was getting to enjoy it, it got changed

[plain fossil]

Is it better than all the other things that are good at low fear tho

[past salmon]

Simply embrace Moros

[plain fossil]

Im tellin u guys crushing comet eos meta

[past salmon]

A lot of them yh I think

[bleak night]

I did 45f with it, yeah, it's just that I can't help but be sad about how it used to be, since the gameplay loop on it was so fun

[past salmon]

thats fair

I kinda wish Mel aspect got changed to Old Eos
And then make Mel aspect the hammer

[plain fossil]

I think i can do low 40s with crushing comet eos im just too incompetent to turn on 5 minute timer

Especially on eos with daybreaker moving at 2 mph

[bleak night]

this honestly makes a lot of sense

[plain fossil]

Im in for that but mel aspect is supposed to be like

[bleak night]

but also like, they make Mel Aspects just statsticks as well, that way the mechanics aren't gone, but the numbers are, when you move to an aspect

[plain fossil]

Something a newbie can play

[past salmon]

Yeh
Eos is mostly special based now where you press attack for like 2 secs than spam specials
Moros is the opposite where you special once and then spam attacks
I like Mel aspect being attack spam or smth

[plain fossil]

Newbies are not gonna know what to do with old eos lmao

[spare kite]

Pan really got the chiron treatment lmfao

[bleak night]

channel speed, backstab damage, hp and power, special duration, bonus damage for each ammo used up

they're not mechanics, just statsticks, so idk if they'd think of putting Eos there on Mel

[past salmon]

Idk I think Eos is very basic
its literally just mel torches but the ghosties rebound when u dash
Its not that complicated

[bleak night]

yeah, but that mechanic is gone when you swap out

[past salmon]

trueeeee
But like
It would be the best solution 🥺

[plain fossil]

Torch is alrdy too hard for reddit man go to #h2-discussion ppl hate it

[bleak night]

fair yeah lol

[plain fossil]

U add eos to that and ppl brain will actually explode

[past salmon]

Cuz I dont want to delete new Eos
Cuz new Eos is really cool

[bleak night]

does Reddit still hate Torches lol, they seem to love Axe but only to play Garen from League of Legends

[plain fossil]

They like axe now

[bleak night]

I should check the sub

[plain fossil]

Ngl i only actually like charon, i tolerate mel and than

Charon is heaps fun tho

[past salmon]

Reddit is a lot of the newer/more casual players
Which tend to really like Axe and Blades and really hate torches and skull from what I've seen

[bleak night]

the main issue with melee axe is how you need to learn attack patterns and block accordingly, but sometimes there's just so much chaos that by focusing on blocking, you get struck somewhere else

[plain fossil]

I have sympathy for skull haters i always potato my skulls

Reddit does like torches more now tbf

[bleak night]

Like, people love to say that the Chronos and Cerb fights are tough on melee axe, and tbh it's quite fair to say that since you're always in danger of being smacked with no recourse

[plain fossil]

The lack of stagger on torch special REALLY bothered some ppl when torch special was the way

[bleak night]

does it stagger now ?

[brisk tusk]

damn and my favorite weapon is eos torch lmfao

[bleak night]

the current one ?

[plain fossil]

No, u just dont do any damage with special lmao

U always attacking so u get stagger

[brisk tusk]

i think i prefer old but i still like the new if i have autofire on

[bleak night]

That's fair, I just find that the hammer they replaced it with doesn't feel as good to use

[past salmon]

honestly Cerb fight is such a walk I dont think its hard on any weapon
And I think Axe is the easiest Chronos atleast for me 💀

[plain fossil]

The eos hammer is horrendous ngl

[spare kite]

Eos hammer should have kept the lingering part

[brisk tusk]

100%, the hammer reaaaaally sucks

[plain fossil]

Without any linger time its a dps loss most of the time

[brisk tusk]

i got a sub-10 speedrun with attack+dash only eos torches last night

[bleak night]

people that have a hard time on the Chronos fight just don't time the blocks well is all

[bleak night]

ooh, nice. I still haven't figured out the speedrun strats. Do you have the resource for the Fields room layouts again? I forgot the site

[plain fossil]

Blocking is for cowards u need to big chop chronos to estsblish dominance

[bleak night]

idk dude if I never blocked in that 50f fight I'd have died lol

[past salmon]

I really need to learn fields rooms layouts lol

[plain fossil]

No dominance beta smh

[brisk tusk]

i havent done any research on layouts, im just playin to play, but i think speedrun.com hades 2 has it in their resources somewhere

[past salmon]

This coming from the guy who spends every room sitting in a corner 😭

[bleak night]

iunno, I feel like dominance is effectively established by not taking damage from him LOL

[plain fossil]

Yea thats probably useful hey i waste so much time in there

[plain fossil]

I dominate that corner ok

[bleak night]

ooh lemme peep

[past salmon]

I nearly got a sub 7m today but I choked on Chronos and DIED GOD IM SO BAD LMAO

actually depressing
anyways

[bleak night]

Ah, there we go https://zacharywebsites.wixstudio.io/hades2cg/

[brisk tusk]

fields do kind of be my time sink though, maybe i should reconsider lmao

[plain fossil]

I shoulda recorded the eos i did earlier i spent the whole chronos fight offscreen

[bleak night]

...wtf this is really in-depth

[plain fossil]

Who needs to learn mechanics when the boss cant see u

[bleak night]

https://zacharywebsites.wixstudio.io/hades2cg/fields-of-mourning-1/spawn-demo

[brisk tusk]

woah wtf

[plain fossil]

Thats useful

Thanks for the link

[brisk tusk]

super cool, im impressed lmao

you found that on speedrun.com, @bleak night ?

[bleak night]

Yeah, it's there

[plain fossil]

I find in these games when u know layouts and other ppl dont its like some kinda magic

Ppl like OMG I WASTE FOUR MINUTES IN FIELDS and ur like yea whatever check out my 90 second run boys

[bleak night]

true, though it still feels fairly randomized because I noticed that these maps have 4 slots for the unsealable rewards finds

won't find everything by memorizing the map

also some of these areas have 4-5 areas where you can spawn from

[brisk tusk]

ill probably go study that if i end up reaaaaly going for a record but, ill leave it for now lmao

[plain fossil]

Thats ok tho its just extra memorization

[bleak night]

I'll probably use it for a high fear run when I get back into it. Doing two 50F Axes has gotten me so drained

[plain fossil]

I speedrun path of exile when im not in here and a lot of those layouts are combo layouts where the map is built out of several independent tiles so u have like 40 combos to remember

[brisk tusk]

i finished 32f on torches and just,.. stopped lmao, i dont have it in me for that torture

[plain fossil]

If u wanna optimize u gotta put in the hard yards

This guy's done all the hard work anyway the website is even kinda pretty

[brisk tusk]

think i lulled myself into speedrunning thanks to running a different roguelite

[bleak night]

unironically, 40f isn't that terrible of a jump from 32 imo. I was able to help Jodie jump to 42, and he almost won 45 but Chronos timed him out

[plain fossil]

Yea im not going past 40 on torches i dont think, i hate playing moros

[brisk tusk]

play eos 🙂

[bleak night]

Torches was a bit tough for me on 45 because I have a hard time getting my brain to work with the weapon

[past salmon]

Mel torches have done 50 so they are an option if you want to try 45 or smth ig

[brisk tusk]

gotta get that dash timing for his one hit KO lmao

[plain fossil]

Yea i did a meme 32 on eos a couple hours ago

That can easily do 40 im sure

[bleak night]

nah bro died to phase 1 because Chronos teleported 5x in a row lmao

[brisk tusk]

honestly autofire is gamechanging for eos torches, dont have to lift your dang finger off the attack button

[past salmon]

I will hit the iframe every single time in speedruns but there aint no way in hell im going for it in like a 50F lmfao

[bleak night]

his run was good, he finished Erebus at 3:55 or something, sadly his Oceanus took until 9 to finish

[brisk tusk]

lmfao bet

[plain fossil]

Its funny i click more with eos despite its 10x worse weapon

[past salmon]

Eos is more interesting aswell
Mel torches r pretty boring unless ur doing goofy ahh omega special stacking

[bleak night]

I haven't played Pink Aura in a long time...

[past salmon]

The only builds I enjoy on Mel torches are romantic spark and Fire extinguisher and neither of those are viable at high fear

oh and pink aura

[bleak night]

like, I've just played so much Axe, Skull and Staff

[plain fossil]

Pink aura is rough now

All special torch builds are, special is smaller and u get 1 less omega special per zone in erebus

[brisk tusk]

maybe now that ive got the sub-10 ill try climbing fear with eos, it sounds awful lmao

[plain fossil]

Im sure eos can get up to about 42 i just dont know how to do 5min timer on it

[brisk tusk]

problem is i like to play it attack only

[plain fossil]

That weapon is so slow

What do u do when the daybreaker is out, dance the macarena

[brisk tusk]

i make another

you can keep attacking, idk what you mean lmao

[plain fossil]

It overwrites the old daybreaker and resets the explosion cd so its not the most efficient thing in the world if u wanna climb fear

If u could stack daybreakers itd be awesome

[brisk tusk]

am i so dumb that i never noticed you cant stack daybreakers? lmfao

[limpid coral]

The new big guy explodes very soon after it appears no?

[brisk tusk]

and somehow still got a sub-10, ffs

[bleak night]

huh?

[plain fossil]

Its like 0.5s/2s/2s/2s

Something like this?

I suppose thats not too bad

[past salmon]

bro 😭

[brisk tusk]

i had to test it myself and my conclusion is, i hate that youre right

[plain fossil]

Eos is my most recent run u would hope that i paid at least 5 brain cells of attention lul

I actually didnt mind demeter strike on eos the coverage is quite good

[brisk tusk]

80% of my nights are eos, youd hope id notice too lmao

[plain fossil]

Well in that case now u know... i recommend the macarena as per above

Very useful skill, builds fitness, gets chicks but only over-40 chicks

Much more productive than second daybreaker

[tall notch]

New Eos seems to want to send out a daybreaker and then spam omega specials for its best damage

[brisk tusk]

maybe ill just go mel and still only use attack rofl

[tall notch]

If you want attack torches similar to old Eos, play Mel

[plain fossil]

I got the TECHNOLOGY

[brisk tusk]

exactly haha

or, now hear me out

dont get any boons that increase channel speed

[plain fossil]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/751691459580919834/1252550876728397874/image.png?ex=6672a068&is=66714ee8&hm=8b8d7be279542516eeb6d10c9fe6b6ca7940f0dd5deac5bf28e768a66066ea0a& see, advanced technology

Omega special is for potatoes and people with a gain boon

[tall notch]

Almost missed 7 mins deadline 😭

[bleak night]

are you playing 5 min timers again lol

[plain fossil]

Hey man its eos

[tall notch]

New Eos eats so much mana you probably want to click born gain asap

[plain fossil]

I use no mana its for cowards

[tall notch]

I've not done any serious runs since coming back from my break tbh

[brisk tusk]

i wholly disagree with that lol

[bleak night]

ight we're doing 40 Charon

[brisk tusk]

like 4 mana regen and your daybreaker upkeep is fine unless you stack channel or get an additive

[plain fossil]

I mean if ur just doing daybreaker then ur usually ridiculously zdps

[brisk tusk]

#h2-victory-boasting message

[plain fossil]

Hence the default is spam omega special while daybreaker is up

[brisk tusk]

i refuse XD

sorry for the phone pic btw, was to send to a buddy and i forgot to get a proper SS

[plain fossil]

Sub 10 minute good but im not very familiar with low fear speedruns

I assume this is quick for torches idk speedrun meta at all

[brisk tusk]

no one uses eos for speedruns

its moros or nothing

theres not even an eos run on the leaderboard

[spare kite]

Wr by default

[plain fossil]

That makes sense, moros does damage and eos does not so seems logical

[past salmon]

yeh I have absolutely no clue how quick Eos could be
Moros is top 2 speedrun weapons atm

[brisk tusk]

im sayin XD

eos isnt even a candidate for WR

just outright

[plain fossil]

Aspect WR dont argue with it

[spare kite]

You have the eos wr
We separate by weapons anyways

[brisk tusk]

well

[tall notch]

You did sub-10 with new Eos?

[brisk tusk]

sure did, just.... didnt record it

[plain fossil]

Yea this man doesnt special

Just make a daybreaker then make another daybreaker

[tall notch]

I'll need to experiment more with the daybreaker into omega special spam playstyle. It could actually deal damage

[plain fossil]

Some glowy brain strat

[spare kite]

200 base dmg good ig?

[plain fossil]

Im telling u man crushing comet is the future

[brisk tusk]

i think the only thing MAYBE viable is aphro eos

[spare kite]

Or did you get like mad skips

[plain fossil]

U dont need mana and it hits for 5 million

[brisk tusk]

i got incredible RNG outside of 1 mistake and needed like 1 more dmg boon

[plain fossil]

Also doesnt have tiny range like omega special

[spare kite]

Dumb idea
Local climate aphro cast eos, just bring everyone into the ghost

[brisk tusk]

crushing comet eos? maybe

[plain fossil]

Thats the screenshot i shared above

[brisk tusk]

but im lazy and literally just hold attack lmao

never thought id get sub-10 playing daybreaker only ngl

and it didnt take 900 resets like my other wr -.-

[tall notch]

Does anyone know if new Eos can get extra damage from omega special if it's the one sent out by the daybreaker but you are not close to the enemy?

[plain fossil]

Uh u mean from aph special? I dont think so

[spare kite]

For aphro is based on your position

[tall notch]

Then I guess you'd want some other special. What are we thinking about Zeus?

[spare kite]

I'm just acknowledging eos ngl

#NotMyAspect

[brisk tusk]

i got the most consistency out of aphro, zeus never did too well for me

but maybe if youre not just holding one button lmao

[past salmon]

Hera probs good

[plain fossil]

Zeus is like the default

Because daybreaker triggers it

[brisk tusk]

hera wasnt bad

[plain fossil]

Its failed to wow me so far

[brisk tusk]

the advantage with daybreaker is sending it towards one spawn while you go kill the other

at least, thats how ive been playing it

[spare kite]

Welcome back zeus shield

[plain fossil]

Well yea thats what ur supposed to do p sure

[brisk tusk]

well, good thing im doing it right then i guess lmao

[bleak night]

I want Jolted back

[past salmon]

we have cool Blitz tho

idk Jolted was kinda lame
Like it was just +damage basically
It didnt rlly have utility or anything

[bleak night]

Blitz is just damage-based Doom popping rather than time, no ?

[brisk tusk]

zeus is hard for me, cant friggin see anything past all the flashy lights

time to campaign for daybreaker to allow multiple orbs lmao

[bleak night]

Oh, does it not allow more than 2 (3 with triple helix) ?

[brisk tusk]

its just one

[past salmon]

sure but there is a lot of other things Blitz has to build upon where Jolted had like nothing
Also there are neat thing you can do with Blitz Like having it on an attack while cast continuously procs it etc

[brisk tusk]

or are you talking about special?

[spare kite]

I miss jolted and shoals

[bleak night]

ah, fair enough. I should try Zeus on Axe tbh

[spare kite]

(blitz is still cool tho)

[bleak night]

The specials

[brisk tusk]

daybreaker is the omega attack specifically

[past salmon]

Shoals is definitely cooler than Slip

[bleak night]

Oh, I should probs play that aspect more so I'd know lol

[brisk tusk]

im probably one of 3 people that like it a lot, so i dont blame you for not playing it lmao

[plain fossil]

Slip actually sucks so hard

Its origination + put random mob out of range of ur aoe

• garbo damage

I pommed this stupid thing because it was epic to abuse arrogance bug and it gave me like +3% damage

[brisk tusk]

maybe ill try using crushing comet daybreaker today, that sounds like it slaps so hard

and itll still render aphro suuuuuper useful

[plain fossil]

Join the religion

[brisk tusk]

just gotta remember to hit the X button

[bleak night]

what does the X button do ?

[brisk tusk]

special attack lmao

[bleak night]

my control setup when I do play controller is kinda weird tbf, and when I don't play controller it's even weirder

[brisk tusk]

or, just special, whatever it is in this game

dash and attack, all you need with torches 🙂

[plain fossil]

U should seriously play mel torches it will change ur life

Its like all the things u enjoy plus u get more than one omega attack at once

Mind blown amirite

[brisk tusk]

thats what i was doing until i discovered autofire works with eos

only made that switch a few days ago lol

[steel sequoia]

i think the new mel torches are weird, the old ones were too strong tho

im a eos fan

[brisk tusk]

theres the third, I TOLD YALL THERE WERE 3

i want to like moros torches, but it annoys the absolute crap out of me that the attack orbs can collide with each other and like, literally just get stuck

[steel sequoia]

i dont like moros but is the strongest flames

[sly turret]

Can I go with rebuke on axe if I'm starting with arctic ring?

[bleak night]

on what fear is this

[sly turret]

Attempting 45
I'm not great with the axe so my best is only 40 right now

melinoe

[brisk tusk]

cries in 24 axe

[bleak night]

Melinoe is really bad to run vs Rebuke ngl to you. You can def give it a shot to see what sticks, but I'd like to think Static Shock or Spirit Surge is what saves you rather than Arctic

[brisk tusk]

@bleak night can you tell me how you run your binds using L-stick + mouse?

[sly turret]

Ah okay
I didn't have zeus on my 40 run with mel so I wasn't sure
I'll try that thanks

[steel sequoia]

if you adress mana quick rebuke is nothing to charon

[bleak night]

L1 Dash, L2 Hex
LeftClick Attack, RightClick Special, Mouse button on side for my thumb for Cast.

Right side of controller or R Joycon has the same button combinations for my usual controller only runs, but I have interact on R2. Could also just maybe use the dpad for it, but I just move to my R-Joycon and tap ZR

[bleak night]

Hope it works out for ya

Zeus isn't necessary without Rebuke, but if you're adamant about running it then you def need him to save time

[brisk tusk]

thanks! L1 dash sounds banana sandwich lmao

[bleak night]

Your finger is just resting on it, so honestly it feels really comfortable to run it that way

[sly turret]

I'm just worried about the timer if I go with max health so I wanted to try with rebuke first
my time was 18.20 on that run

[brisk tusk]

was gonna pull out my keypad to try that, since it has a stick, but i... dont have it anymore lmao

[bleak night]

Ah, sounds like you can manage though

[bleak night]

You can do controller + mouse if you have one, it keeps the L-stick gate and controller inputs while keeping the mouse on screen for aiming

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1238124170282532944/1248300628552450108/anim_cancel_ContMouse.mp4?ex=6672534e&is=667101ce&hm=81c4417ed4136710ff5856dd695195162043dea07db5deb3afb0104bed217386&

[brisk tusk]

yeah definitely, im gonna have to try it out and see if i can get used to it

torch auto aim is SO AWFUL that i think that method would be wayyyyy better

[past salmon]

Rebuke will almost certainly cost more timer than max health
Alot of enemies you are doing more than 30% damage per swing
Rebuke will just eat TWO swings

like yeah you can do goofy ahh like static shock start but why not just take off rebuke and start with like Hera attack?

[bleak night]

true lol

I even go Aphro on Mel Axe tbh, might as well go in hard

let the big chop do massive damage

you could do Spiteful Strength as well

[brisk tusk]

i mean, if you aint going for big chop damage, why you even playing axe lmao

[past salmon]

Spiteful do go crazy but wtf do you take from hera to enable it if you arent going magick?

[bleak night]

Bork your early game with Born Gain 💀

[past salmon]

💀

[bleak night]

I like to swing it really fast hehe

[sly turret]

yeah that's fair

[ionic lily]

Born gain doesn't actually give you mana until you do an omega move tho right?

[past salmon]

yeh

its more like r we really taking a useless boon in high fear just to gamble on getting spiteful soon like 💀

[bleak night]

I'm really lucky, so I'll get it before I fight Hecate fr dw

[past salmon]

I did spiteful on Moros but thats because it can manage through Erebus and Oceanus without an attack boon

and also my goofy ahh arcana setup I was testing at the time had queen on anyway so 😭

[steel sequoia]

spitefull work with static shock right?

[ionic lily]

oh right, the opportunity cost

[bleak night]

static shock is just its own thing, doesn't get boosted

[past salmon]

Spiteful only doesnt work if its the core slot thats filled

[steel sequoia]

its not easy to get origination with spiteful tho

[past salmon]

Thats why I had origination off in my 50F Moros LMAO\

I mean its not that hard tbf

ur clicking dem cast regardless so just get galeforce/any sprint

[steel sequoia]

well idk how its a 50 run but im pretty sure it aint the easiest thing to do

[brisk tusk]

did anyone toss out a livesplit file yet?

autosplit?

[bleak night]

autosplit ?

[brisk tusk]

for speedruns, the timer thing

im too tired to form complete sentences im sorry lmao

[spare kite]

Prob check speedrun.com or speedcord

(link to speedcord pinned in #self-promotion )

[brisk tusk]

checked one already but sweet ty illl check the other

[brisk tusk]

can confirm its there, WIP but looks functional (speedcord)

[timber pawn]

Not done yet apparently

[hollow stag]

If you get Spiteful Strength early in Erebus (after born gain and mint condition), do you need any attack/special boons?

[bleak night]

I'd still probably just put a status effect on the one I use less for damage

like, if I'm on Axe, I'd put Heph, Blitz or Freeze on Special (attack if Charon)

on Torches, you'd probs want Blitz on Special still

[hollow stag]

Hmm Blitz or Hitch for special

[bleak night]

what weap we doin ?

if Torches, then I'd think Blitz works better because Hitch isn't entirely necessary anymore with how that weapon works

[low bear]

I haven't tried high fear surface runs beyond 32, sounds painful right now

[bleak night]

it's actually not that bad, try it out first with 7 min timer

also use the resource for Ephyra, it should help you in deciding rooms

[steady yoke]

any advice on getting legendaries? i’m quite a ways in and i dont think ive found even one 😭😭

[bleak night]

https://zacharywebsites.wixstudio.io/hades2cg/blank-6

[knotty fulcrum]

what specials are good for persephone?

[bleak night]

Let me grab you a link

[bleak night]

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3243844568

[bleak night]

probs Hera or Aphro for damage

You can do Hera Special, Zeus Cast and Demeter for Cyclone as well

you probs just put something on attack for origination

[past salmon]

idk what the difficulty at like 32-40 is compared to UW but at 45-48 its way easier than underworld
Probably 50 too but I dunno if people have done 50F surface runs

[bleak night]

I can see Zeus Special also being good so you can Blitz targets suffering under the Storm Ring

[bleak night]

50F surface is kinda terrible rn, ngl to you

[past salmon]

Hera is best imo followed by aphro

[bleak night]

I did 48, but Rebuke shields go a disgustingly long way up there

[past salmon]

yeh ig its way easier on a weapon that doesnt care about rebuke

Like Moros probably completely sweeps surface 50F
Since it has an easy ephyra and gets its mana regen and everything else it could ever want early

[steel sequoia]

i like zeus or hera specials on persephone

[past salmon]

Zeus is okay but its really not that much damage compared to other stuff

[steel sequoia]

tho i always get like Twisting Crash hammer

[knotty fulcrum]

ok thanks guess Ill get hera for regen also

[bleak night]

p much yeah

[low bear]

oh really that's interesting

I thought timer would be an issue

[past salmon]

Yeh I did like 1 48F attempt and would of won if I wasnt the master of choking and then Mynt did a singular 48F attempt and won so liek
lmao

[low bear]

ah lol

surface enemies seem harder in general too