wiki-chat

[crystal veldt]

Well

Aliases

[pale dock]

well i dont hear any other name for em

[candid isle]

I call em respawns

[soft mason]

cocoons fits at least

[candid isle]

Or eggs

[soft mason]

and isn't stupid

[candid isle]

meanwhile some people call pablo Mega Knight

Just call him Pablo

[indigo quiver]

wiki-chat: why are there so many aliases, no one calls them these things
wiki-chat: this is what I call this thing [5 different things, 4 of which no one uses]

[crystal veldt]

Shadow striker: "Ghost"

Huh..

[candid isle]

what

who tf calls them ghosts

[crystal veldt]

Shadow giant is "shadow giant"
Shadow scout is "shadow scout"

[candid isle]

yeah lmao

[crystal veldt]

And then shadow striker outta left field with "Ghost"

Who tf calls Charger Scout "Gramps"

[candid isle]

what

why tf

if you asked me what GTFO enemy was called gramps, I’d say Pablo

literally why cscouts

[crystal veldt]

Hybrids: "Cancer"

[candid isle]

true

[crystal veldt]

Whuuut

[candid isle]

that’s a joke name but a good one

[soft mason]

real though

[crystal veldt]

Scout: Medusa/pasta

Medusa makes no sense.

[candid isle]

i call them spaghetti a lot tbh

[crystal veldt]

Scouts don't give a fuck if you sprint around them

Pardon my language

[pale dock]

i dont pardon ur language

and i sape u

[crystal veldt]

Slendmod when then?

[candid isle]

true

[crystal veldt]

I already sent my app

But who knows when the next moderator pick happens

[pale dock]

i dont pardon u

[crystal veldt]

[indigo quiver]

@sly narwhal I've edited the WeaponsInfo template to split range into falloff start and falloff end, I know that template is your baby so please feel free to have a look over if I've done it correctly

I'm not so familiar with the templates to begin with, and even less familiar with all the fancy stuff going on in that one

[soft mason]

falloff end my beloved

bonus points if they add damage loss per meter

[crystal veldt]

[timid zodiac]

wiki page even says "Licker" for scout

[crystal veldt]

I was looking at the wiki at the time I read those out but yes.

[timid zodiac]

yea but shouldn't Licker be an alias for strikers?

[crystal veldt]

Aliases are just common other names

But being it is a wiki

It can be edited often.

In which some aliases just get added even though practically no one calls them those things

Majority of the uncommon aliases are just random things people came up with. Otherwise it's a actually a common name for them

[soft mason]

it is, idk who put it for scout too

[paper helm]

Can we volunteer to do changes on the wiki

Some of it is a headache

And not fun to realize discrepancies mid mission

[undone compass]

do you mean volunteer as in doing it yourself or asking for someone else to do it?

[crimson lion]

The ladder Ofc

[undone compass]

if its the first then feel free if its the second then i guess you can bring it up but the chances of it getting changed are like 50%

[grizzled crater]

What kind of discrepancies?

[paper helm]

Like objective stack completion order, I’ve had a few missions where the wiki states to clear Overload objective before the secondary, or vice versa, or that it’ll say to put the bulkhead key for one first but that one won’t have the other bulkhead key for the other objective

[undone compass]

what pages did you read that stuff on?

[sly narwhal]

very belated 👍

(gonna take a quick look now, it's probably still intact lol)

looks alright

good shit

[indigo quiver]

The wiki is completely open to volunteer contributions. You don't need permission at all, you can literally just press the edit button and start changing things!

[indigo quiver]

Yippee!! The only other thing I wouldn't mind with it is putting both falloff start and end within the same like minibox (like reserve ammo and bullet cost are), but I couldn't figure out how to do that initially

[sly narwhal]

done

[soft mason]

surely there must be a way to have less dead space on a page

[grizzled crater]

Write a love poem about carbine :^ )?

Type about every run its been used successfully (all)

[crystal veldt]

huh. I gotta see this.

Rip your page is bugged or it got fixed

[soft mason]

i think it got fixed cause it looks normal now

[crystal veldt]

[soft mason]

how do I go about adding pics to the wiki? I got new pics of the Burst Rifle since the wiki's pics have the old reflex sight facing the wrong way

[undone compass]

it used to be easier back on gamepedia

[soft mason]

Burst Rifle pictures are updated

[jolly quarry]

Any chance someone can get better and/or more sounds on the wiki? some were clearly grabbed from recording in-game whereas others were grabbed from the files, and a lot are missing such as the scout noises, snatcher noises, hybrid noises, and the different gun noises. If someone knows how to grab them and can send them to me I can upload them.

[weak coral]

there's a guide to datamining sounds in the datamining channel of the gtfo modding discord

[proud stream]

Someone wanna add a blurb to the mother and tank that you can’t pen the tumors?

And big mother I guess granted I think that mother and big mother are copied from each other. Maybe those pages could be merged?

[indigo quiver]

The pages on the wiki are freely editable by anyone, you don't even need an account or anything. If you see something that should be added, feel free to add it!

[proud stream]

Ok I just didn’t wanna mess the formatting. You think it’s fine for me to try and combine the mother and big mother page? I don’t really see the reason of having 2 pages when they are literally copy pasted off each other

[indigo quiver]

I wouldn't combine the pages, while the content on them at the moment may be mostly copy pasted, they are distinct enemies and there's definitely reason to keep the pages separate

Sounds like someone should go and fill the pages with what makes them different! How the strategies for dealing with them differ!

[grizzled crater]

Yea, them being seperate makes it a bit more unlikely to get spoiled for pmom

[undone compass]

they actually used to be combined but we seperated them

[soft mason]

cleaned up the giant's page info about the knife, which had some wrong damage numbers

[indigo quiver]

I disagree with a lot of the takes about knife on that page. It is not better to let the knife hit first just so they can feel useful.

If there is knife + three sledgehammers/spears:

• They can already kill by themselves, the knife isn't required, and you might as well optimize their damage by letting them hit occi

If there is knife + 2 sledgehammers/spears:

• If you're going for a stagger chain kill, then the optimal play from the knife player is to stay the hell away so they don't bait a hit while missing a stagger, and let the people with weapons that can actually stagger do the damage.
• If you're going for an instant kill, then this is the only time where letting the knife hit is barely better, as with knife occi + double back hit hammer you can kill, but if you have double spear here you can't even kill with that, so you're immediately losing your instant kill potential. However, at high level you so rarely ever go for instant kills like this. If you keep your movement to a minimum then stagger chaining has the same chance of aggroing other enemies, and if you are in a situation where you can't move at all without risk, then you're probably not even risking killing a giant in the first place.

If there is knife + 1 sledgehammer/spear:

• You are completely reliant on the sledgehammer/spear being able to keep the giant staggered. Aside from maybe getting some extra burst damage with the occi, it's still on the sledgehammer/spear to keep the giant staggered, so it is just as skill intensive as the sledgehammer/spear getting a solo kill. The skill requirement barely changes for the sledgehammer/spear, the knife isn't helping here either (and once again, it's probably a good idea for them to stay away after the first hit, so they don't bait a punch).

Looks like @sly narwhal already updated the wording, I agree with it much more now. Ideally it mentions that sometimes it's good to let the knife hit occi, but it doesn't matter a lot of the time, and may even send the wrong idea other times.

Although I don't know where the 16.5 damage to back comes from. It is 11 (5.5 * 2), the backstabber bonus is broken if that's what you're thinking of

[sly narwhal]

5.5 * 2 back precision * 1.5 knife precision (charged)

[indigo quiver]

You don't get precision if you're not hitting the head

[sly narwhal]

Isn't head 1.5x and back 2x (meaning occiput is 3x)

[indigo quiver]

Hitting back of the head is:
5.5(charged) * 1.5(precision) * 1.5(giant head) * 2(back)

With potential *2(sleeping)

But you lose both precision and the head multi if you're not hitting head

[sly narwhal]

So are you saying that the back weakpoint doesn't count as a weakpoint for the precision multiplier?

[young elk]

correct, precicion multi is not triggered on back alone

[sly narwhal]

And that applies to all weapons?

[indigo quiver]

Correct

[young elk]

yes

[sly narwhal]

I see

[indigo quiver]

Precision is only for heads and tumors

[sly narwhal]

Welp, time to adjust the spear calcs

[indigo quiver]

Aside, do ya'll think that a Melee Strategies PAGE would be more appropriate. (Or perhaps a strategies section on the Melee page?).

The giant kill strategies don't just apply to regular giants but also to shadow giants, and parts of it apply to hybrids/big shooters/big chargers too. So moving it there and then just referencing it from giant/shadow giant etc. might be nice (at the moment, a lot of those pages reference the giant's page).

It could also have charger scout double kill, although tbh that would be fine on the charger scout page too.

[sly narwhal]

Welp, calcs have been fixed

[sly narwhal]

Sounds like a decent idea

(also, on a related note - might be worth merging the legacy melee weapons into a single page, seeing as they were all functionally identical)

[indigo quiver]

As in, just delete the Maul, Gavel etc. pages, and put their content into the Legacy Melee page?

I'd be in favor, it'd finally free up Sledgehammer to be a redirect to the new sledgehammer

[sly narwhal]

Yeah
tbf most of the content across those individual weapon pages are duplicates anyway

[indigo quiver]

It'd be a little bit of work, looking into it now, weapons page and weapons infobox both have all removed weapons, but we could just have Legacy Melee linked in those I guess

[sly narwhal]

(Technically they're in the 'removed weapons' navbox, not the 'weapons' navbox, but then again in a few hours they will (probably) be the only things left in the 'removed weapons' navbox)

[indigo quiver]

Excellent point, we might be able to get rid of the removed weapons navbox entirely at that point

[sly narwhal]

Yes

(tbf I only created it in the first place because I couldn't be arsed to make the weapons navbox have indentation(?) inside it the 'intended' way)

[indigo quiver]

I mean it got a lot of use, definitely worth having for a good long time

[soft mason]

The idea with mentioning that the knife can do damage to occi is so it doesn't require the entire team

obv 3 sledges can do it, but if a knife player is next to a giant alongside two sledge players its better to give that info

or if the team doesn't have 3 sledges

[sly narwhal]

The page has been updated with info about those cases

[indigo quiver]

All Weapons#Melee Weapons links now just point to Melee, since the Melee page seems like the hub for melee weapon stuff now

I'm happy to move the giant stuff there soon

[soft mason]

would prob be a good idea, last i saw the giant page was very long and repeated stuff in the melee VS stealth killing segments

[sly narwhal]

auto sentry article has been renamed, scattergun is out of the removed weapons navbox (now in the normal weapons navbox)

tools navbox has been updated

don't know any stats yet so stats of all the changed weapons will need to be updated later

[indigo quiver]

Getting the stats now

[sly narwhal]

ty

I gotta get food and then got an appointment so yeah have fun with the stats

[green falcon]

new cosmetics will be put here in a sec\

[indigo quiver]

HEL Revolver:

• Reload unchanged in datablocks, likely solely a change to animations, and thus a change to reload cancel (will require recording comparisons)

PDW:

• Damage: 2.31 -> 2.15
• Reload unchanged in datablocks.

HEL Gun:

• Charge up: 0.2 -> 0.3

Bullpup:

• Damage: 1.91 -> 2.1
• Reload: 2.4 -> 2.1

HEL Shotgun:

• Unchanged

Precision Rifle:

• Damage: 11.4 -> 13.0
• Clip size: 8 -> 12

Heavy SMG:

• Damage: 2.3 -> 2.45
• Clip size: 25 -> 33

Rifle:

• Falloff start: 25 -> 22
• Falloff end: 100 -> 80
• Clipsize: 16 -> 14

Pistol:

• Damage: 4.39 -> 4.64
• Falloff start: 6 -> 9

SMG:

• Damage: 1.86 -> 1.98
• Clip size: 40 -> 50

High Cal Pistol:

• Damage: 25.1 -> 30.1
• Bullet cost: 7.6 -> 9.0

Auto Sentry:

• Bullet cost: 0.6 -> 0.9
• Piercing: 0 -> 2

Spear:

• Light precision multi: 1.0 -> 1.3
• Charged precision multi: 1.3 -> 1.5
• Light environment multi: 1.0 -> 2.0
• Charged environment multi: 1.0 -> 3.0
• Run while charging but move at 0.75x speed - Normal sprint is ~71% faster than walking. Spear sprint is ~29% faster than walking.

Bat:

• Light stagger multi: 5.0 -> 4.0
• Charged stagger multi: 5.0 -> 6.0

[sly narwhal]

(bonus points if you upload some images of them using the overalls colours, so they'll fit in more with the rest of the apparel images on the wiki 🙏)

[green falcon]

what about no dirt mod should i turn it off?

[crystal quest]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/1024858134600233030/1091185709244760104/wgcx9a70x3ma1.gif

Did you get all the cosmetics already?

[green falcon]

no i have mods

[sly narwhal]

Seeing as the wiki is somewhat legit, would need some non-'no dirt' versions for the wiki

[green falcon]

ok ill put dirt on

[sly narwhal]

ty

[crystal quest]

smh. they better be good

[grave latch]

true

i dont wanna wait until r8 for some quality drip

not to mention r8 is the last rundown aware

[uncut musk]

Oof the hel revolver one....

Hel gun is useless now

[crystal quest]

The robot leg ones are funny

[weak coral]

foxy??

fnaf?

[green falcon]

anything else needed?

[crystal quest]

But bruh wtf. Their all goofy as hell

[sly narwhal]

the names of them :^)

(see https://gtfo.fandom.com/wiki/Apparel)

[green falcon]

so this is how the names will look with my mod

1 sec

that ok?

cause i dont think it will work

[sly narwhal]

We just need to know what each one is called

[green falcon]

ok

[sly narwhal]

(the modded red text stuff won't appear on the wiki)

[sly narwhal]

thanks again!

[green falcon]

no problem

[crystal quest]

Smoke viper?

[green falcon]

wait i think i forgot a few pics

[green falcon]

thanks for the reminder

[crystal quest]

Little disappointing that everything was a reskin, but it make sense

[undone compass]

damn you guys already got all the cosmetics?

youre quick

/s

[green falcon]

i agree but we did get a few good/funny ones

[crystal quest]

"legs

[grave latch]

actually cringe

reskins are cringe

[crystal quest]

I do like the name "Dogjaw"

[indigo quiver]

I can also confirm that scatter gun is UNCHANGED from R6

[crystal veldt]

Anyone checked if Heavy SMG reload animation fixed?

Or are we still magneto?

Unless the reason the extended mag is there so it meets the hand in the animation

[limpid pine]

it's fixed, the mag was replaced

or well

i guess it doesn't look completely stupid since you don't see the bottom of the mag during the animation

[crystal veldt]

It looks pretty dumb ngl. But it is what it is

Sadly I can't try anything myself until way later today

[white cobalt]

When you say "unchanged" do you mean the update didn't actually change it?

[crystal quest]

wtf happened to the heavy smg lol

[crystal veldt]

the reload time is the same from datablocks. But it could be a change to reload animation/reload cancel

Reload cancel might be not as good anymore

[white cobalt]

Ah

I don't really get the point of the auto sentry change

[crystal veldt]

It staggers more enemies

[white cobalt]

Yea it uses more ammo though

Idk maybe it'll be better?

[crystal veldt]

While being more ammo efficient

Even then

There's hardly that many areas auto sentry was used before.

Surges might still be one of the times people might use it

[white cobalt]

Isn't the only one used less the shotgun sentry

[crystal veldt]

The way they nerfed sentries rn just makes people take the safe pick (burst sentry)

[white cobalt]

Or is there some use for it I don't know of

[white cobalt]

Burst is too reliable in almost every situation

[crystal veldt]

Shotgun sentry is at least damages enemies. so it's debatable whether it can be usable in specific chokepoints with constant bio scans over auto sentry

Regardless. Both shotgun/Auto sentry just guzzle away your tool resources

Sniper on the other hand is hardly usable in most areas now just due to lock on speed.

(Unless you take sentry cpu speed on top of bio pings)

[olive mirage]

SPEAR BUFF?!?

[green falcon]

you can run and charge

[olive mirage]

and more precision damage

a dream come too

I used the spear anyway

[indigo quiver]

@sly narwhal I believe I've updated all the stats in the stagger/precision/falloff/reload pages, all the best with the rest of the weapon pages themselves

[sly narwhal]

weapon pages are officially done

[indigo quiver]

ur so cool

[sly narwhal]

you too :)

[sly narwhal]

actually real quick just realized there's something I need to do

okay for realsies the weapon stats are now correct on the wiki

[crystal veldt]

Sadly its sprint is slower

[green falcon]

i am aware

[solar cave]

Magazine fill times during reload were nerfed (a.k.a. reload cancel was nerfed):
HEL Revolver: 0.98s -> 1.27s
PDW: 0.63s -> 0.81s

[sly narwhal]

stupid question: would you mind DMing me a list of all the magazine fill times for all the weapons (or at least where exactly those stats are)? We don't currently have that documented on the wiki, so, y'know, may as well attempt to rectify that

[indigo quiver]

It is documented on the Reload page

The magazine fill times depend on the intricacies of how the reload animations get queued, there might be a way to work them out based on the game files, but in practice they've always just been measured

[grizzled crater]

and the issue with those measures is that (iirc) it doesnt include equip time

[solar cave]

HEL Reload time is slightly off on that page btw

[grizzled crater]

which is necessary for comparision in a reload cancel (for backswap, not if its a swap to another thing)

[solar cave]

The full reload time is 2.9s

[solar cave]

You can skip equip time by ADSing

[grizzled crater]

you cant "skip" it

[solar cave]

Only have to wait the base 0.2s

Equip time is basically 0.2s + weapon equip time/2, ADSing skips the weapon dependent part

[indigo quiver]

I know :) see the bugs part of that same page

[sly narwhal]

reload page has been updated with those reload cancel timings

[solar cave]

Ah

[sly narwhal]

datablocks still say 2.3 (and the infoboxes on the main pages are based on the datablocks)

[solar cave]

I see

Oh, also @sly narwhal bullpup ammo reload time is 2.21s now (for the ammo fill time)

[sly narwhal]

damn, that's slower than its actual reload time

updated

[solar cave]

Always has been

[white cobalt]

Has high caliber been made gooder or worser from this patch

Cause +5 damage is cool but 9 ammo is less good

[sly narwhal]

If you're a fan of consistent resupply amounts, it's a great change (as it now always gets 10 bullets from a resupply - assuming you don't already have more than 15 bullets in capacity)

[soft mason]

did the high cal end up with more or less ammo than the first time it was 30dmdg?

also the wiki says it only lost 5 rounds

[sly narwhal]

If you're a fan of satisfying ammo capacities, it's a horrible change (went from 6/30 (nice, divisible) to 6/25 (not divisible))

[soft mason]

don't say that they'll take one more round

[sly narwhal]

the only weapon with a satisfying divisible ammo capacity is the scattergun - and the HCP only got that satisfying ammo capacity during ALT://R5 (where the ammo cost was silently reduced from 7.7 to 7.6)

[white cobalt]

They should just add .3 to it...

.3 is all it would take right? To make it even

Or am I thinking of a diff gun

[sly narwhal]

but that would ruin the satisfyingly consistent 10 bullets per resupply...

[soft mason]

updated the high cal's wiki because now it can one hit shooters

[white cobalt]

True and cool

Is the regular pistol good now

Or still meh

[sly narwhal]

it got buffed

[white cobalt]

Yeah but it was like .25 damage

And 3m more before falloff

[sly narwhal]

just double-checked the datablocks, it has the same ammo capacity (bullet cost & magazine) and damage as it did back then (during R7) - 6 round mag, 30.1 damage, 10 bullet cost. However, it now has an extra 10 metres of range before reaching the end of falloff (was 55, now 65)

[white cobalt]

So it's the strongest it's ever been?

[soft mason]

yes, not that the extra falloff end will really make a difference

[white cobalt]

It lets me kill scouts from outside of a room

Without alerting anyone

Cause of the doorframe muffling mechanic

[sly narwhal]

HCP falloff still starts at 8m

[white cobalt]

10 extra meters means it takes longer to drop

[soft mason]

no

it still starts dropping at 8

it just reaches minimum damage 10m later

[white cobalt]

But it drops less damage per meter

Meaning it can one shot from farther

Scout has 42 health, 3x damage on head 6x on occiput. High cal does 22 on precision, so 46 or 132 damage when in range.
I looked at the wiki and really don't want to do math, so I'll just go with this
"High cal will probably one shot a scout from no more than 30 meters of distance on occiput, and 15-20 for a head shot"

[solar cave]

Should one shot to the head up to 30m and one shot occiput up to 53m

[crystal veldt]

Did people actually reload cancel pdw?

[soft mason]

I have never once in my life reload cancelled the pdw

Reload is so short anyways (well havent tried it since patch)

[grizzled crater]

It made it have by far the fastest reload in the game

It was surreal, you basically didnt spend time in it

[solar cave]

Yeah, it had an incredibly fast reload cancel

[crystal veldt]

So when Does Heavy Sub Machine Gun get it's "extended mag" portrait?

[soft mason]

you can see the little pixel shift where the graphic designer fucked up on the in-game picture

[white cobalt]

The magazine is actually a different color than the rest of the gun

Though I can't remember if it was always this blue

[soft mason]

All mags in the game are blue

[crystal quest]

Mhm

It looks goofy as hell

[unique ivy]

I got some new cosmetics during alt rundown 6 that aren't on the Wiki page yet and since they asked to post screenshots here I'll just do that:

Kovac Smoke Viper

Qantex Canvas Gilet

Salvos Underworld

[unique ivy]

Qantex Dual Sacramento

[soft mason]

That gas mask goes hard as fuck but there isn't a palette that matches it

white gold black and red? I guess santonian vestis

[sly narwhal]

aaand uploaded!

thanks for the screenshots :)

[stable verge]

Dogjaw Mod Kit 107

Qantex Dual Jungle

HF Nematode

HF Arbustum Mark II

Spartacus MX-2

Nyxos Medlabs Oscar

Tacklebox 003 Ash

Caerulus Grind

Roughneck Robigo

Storax Aranea Mark II

[crystal veldt]

these are already posted here in the channel way up by Lurker. but Wiki itself wasn't updated

[sly narwhal]

I was not previously aware of this mask existing, thanks!

(and tbf these pics are more in line with the existing pics on the wiki)

[sly narwhal]

wiki is now updated 🙏

[unique ivy]

very cool, ty :)

[white cobalt]

Ngl I kinda wish they made gun cosmetics. Apparel is cool but you can't actually see anything but your gloves in game.

[pale dock]

and ur legs

sometimes :3

[white cobalt]

Gun customisation would be cool...even just color pallete

[crystal veldt]

At best. They bring back legacy hammer cosmetics in base game.

[soft mason]

too much work

[indigo quiver]

Burst Cannon:

• Damage: 19.0 -> 22.0

HEL Shotgun:

• Shot delay: 0.21 -> 0.2625

Machine Pistol:

• Damage: 1.81 -> 1.9
• Damage Falloff End: 45 -> 30
• Shotdelay: 0.05 -> 0.04

HEL Autopistol:

• Damage Falloff Start: 4 -> 5
• Damage Falloff End: 45 -> 55

Sawed-Off Shotgun:

• Damage Falloff Start: 4 -> 6
• Reload Time: 1.8 -> 1.6

HEL AutoSentry:

• Bullet Cost: 0.9 -> 0.7

[grizzled crater]

Hel auto sentry with 751 bullets at 100%

If it aims at body it could finally be the buff they wanted

[young elk]

i need your help
i forgot how to calc sentry max ammo
pls tell

[crystal veldt]

It was 800 before hel iirc.

800 smth I don't recall exact amount

[grizzled crater]

?

[young elk]

THE NUMBER

WHERE YOU GET IT

[indigo quiver]

Eva didn't use the number, Eva dropped in and read the sentry readout

[young elk]

THEN WHERE DID YOU GET IT

[indigo quiver]

idk the number for tool, I biotracker

[young elk]

where did this number come from then

[worldly turret]

i made it up for dramatic effect

it fluctuates depending on my mood\

[indigo quiver]

For sentry guns:

• starting ammo is: ~351/bulletcost
• max ammo is: ~526/bulletcost

The exact numbers are 100/0.285 and 150/0.285

I don't know how the per refill works, but it normally gives super close to 20%, so the number is probably 30/0.285

[young elk]

ty ty big presh huge w 🇸🇬

[young elk]

wait, if we take shotgun sentry for example, then the max ammo would be 526/2 which is 263, and thats definitely not right, so are there other factors?

[indigo quiver]

shotgun fires 5 bullets per shot

divide by 5

[young elk]

i am the stupid

thank you sir

[indigo quiver]

nah it's weird, the gun shotguns don't have that extra step

[uncut musk]

Auto shotgun rip

[olive mirage]

Hold up

Burst cannon one shots strikers again?

110 damage burst on giants?

burst cannon back to S tier?

[white cobalt]

Eh I'd say it's definitely much more useable now

Idk about back to it's peak or whatever

No burst cancel is still holding it back from that

[olive mirage]

what was the damage pre-nerf?

20 or 30?

[white cobalt]

20 I think

It's above pre nerf but pre nerf had the burst cancel

[pale dock]

well that was r4 before even the alts

no, r3

idk if it was on r4 i forgot

[grizzled crater]

ALT R3 (had no burst cancel) was SS tier btw :>

og r4 had burst cancel but that one doesnt matter

[white cobalt]

Burst cancel is what will make me call it SS

[grizzled crater]

thats on you then
the gun in ALT R3 was hilariously broken

[white cobalt]

Bots get the SS burst cancel

[grizzled crater]

it and Hel gun were both a step above all other good ones then

[white cobalt]

What even are the SS and S guns

[grizzled crater]

depends on tierlist

rn there rly isnt any

[white cobalt]

A tier list would be cool

[indigo quiver]

New Back Multiplier page explaining how back damage works, feedback welcome!
https://gtfo.fandom.com/wiki/Back_Multiplier

[crimson lion]

Next come in depth stealth explanations

[indigo quiver]

Next comes client boss tumors, but I want to test one last thing before that

[autumn girder]

huh, I did not think the hit spot was included

my guess was ray from camera to enemy position

[indigo quiver]

Yeah, it's necessary to explain why you can do the funky back hit on chargers while looking up

[indigo quiver]

That would've made sense too tbh

[autumn girder]

its definitely hit related, since you can hit a giants arm from no where near parallel to its center while faced the same direction and get full back damage

so mine doesnt work

cool, I didnt think we knew the exact formula either

[indigo quiver]

Yeah I'm just really good at guessing formulas, pretty lucky

[crimson lion]

That is what said to my math teacher

I got an f

[autumn girder]

you can get a long way in math with guessing if youre good at it

its kinda funny

[crimson lion]

Tbh you can get a math degree

With guessing sorry true

[autumn girder]

pattern recognition, good guessing, and knowing how to check your answer

[white cobalt]

Explain it to me in a way that doesn't require thinking

[indigo quiver]

No

[autumn girder]

draw a line from your camera to where you hit
compare it to the direction the enemy is facing

if its within a certain angle

you get more damage

scaling up as these 2 rays approach eachother

[white cobalt]

So if I hit an enemy in the back but I'm looking at it's side technically, it does not get as much of a multiplier?

[crimson lion]

This vaule comes from a vector3so height matters as well

[autumn girder]

the height mattering is also crazy

idk how that works

[crimson lion]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1051306850903130194/1155166788401758288/stabby.mp4

Example from true

@autumn girder

[white cobalt]

So if I use a melee on the back of a giants head, I won't get full damage cause I have to look up at it. But if I jump and hit it while looking straight ahead I'll get full damage?

[autumn girder]

is enemy facing direction always level to the floor

so only camera position matters?

[indigo quiver]

Unknown, assumably so, haven't been able to test.

They might look towards the player they're attacking but idk

[crimson lion]

Yeah the difference is so little won’t matter usually

[autumn girder]

actually

this still begs the question

[crimson lion]

It is a scaler vaule

[autumn girder]

what is the y of the enemy camera period

head?

[crimson lion]

I think

It is some werid rotation thing

[autumn girder]

I think we just never notice it since 82 degrees in either direction is

generally enough to encompass regular gameplay

[soft mason]

i really wonder why they went with this system instead of just their actual model backs

[autumn girder]

it makes more sense this way

its less a back multi and more a

like

is flanking the right word?

its not right

[white cobalt]

Cause then I could shoot the back half of an arm and get back damage I guess

[autumn girder]

I think it conveys the point but its still not a great term for it

[white cobalt]

But with this I have to actually hit the back of its body head on

[crimson lion]

This is how it is

[white cobalt]

Grazing the back gives a lower multiplier

Direct hits give more

[autumn girder]

if it was like, a spine damage multi

[soft mason]

if they did make it actual backs i'd hope they restrict it to the actual back of the torso / spinal area

[white cobalt]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1051306850903130194/1155166788401758288/stabby.mp4

Except this I guess

[autumn girder]

it would make s ense for hitting it directly

but its not that

[crimson lion]

This is because vertical angle matters

it is the angle that matters

[white cobalt]

So just try and look at the enemy head on

And not up or down

[crimson lion]

Yeah

[autumn girder]

I dont know how tf we'd test where the enemy camera is

god I hate that, I liked this explanation more until this lmao

[crimson lion]

XD

[crimson lion]

It has to be from a point in the sleeper

Maybe nav mesh or something

[white cobalt]

If a sleeper looks down

Wouldn't you then have to hit from above

[crimson lion]

I don’t think the head matters crab

[autumn girder]

I think we could settle on it being level to the floor

[crimson lion]

Hate to say this

[autumn girder]

for direction

[white cobalt]

The torso on this one was facing down though
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/1051306850903130194/1155166788401758288/stabby.mp4

[autumn girder]

were talking about position now

[crimson lion]

It is definitely not moving it is some set plane value

Either their feet or the middle of their thing

[autumn girder]

wheres the navmesh at?

middle?

[crimson lion]

But that isn’t what this is showing

[crimson lion]

Approx

[autumn girder]

I feel like it cant be head just from giant enemies becoming super fucked

so navmesh makes sense

and ig we just never reach the 41 degree mark when hitting occi from behind

[crimson lion]

This was to show that angles verticals one count to back damage

[white cobalt]

So now you're trying to figure out how the game determines where an enemy is facing

[crimson lion]

Yeah

It is either a rotation value( my guess ) or some defention of vector 3

[autumn girder]

hm, I wonder if I can test this theory

[crimson lion]

Just get Unity explorer

[autumn girder]

player camera position is head correct? just to be sure

[crimson lion]

I think you are a tad in your chest but idk

I could be wrong

[autumn girder]

oh, yeah that would make sense from hand positions

[crimson lion]

We would need to do Pythagorean

To be sure

Who wants to count pixels

[autumn girder]

wait

actually

if I hit something directly above me with a hit that would normally get back damage

it should do regular right?

[indigo quiver]

If directly below, more like 1.25

When at 90degrees the multi is 1.25

[autumn girder]

let me see if I Can test it on a giants arm

ok it did roughly 29 damage

(full sledge hit)

[crimson lion]

So half back dmg just under

Oh fuck are we gonna find

Their middle

[autumn girder]

thats what im looking for

(For reference, the giant arm was fully off my screen above me)

[indigo quiver]

Careful, it doesn't depend directly on where the enemy's camera is

Just on which way they're facing

[autumn girder]

yeah, I was aligned with their direction

a place that would deal full damage if I was standing and aimed level with it

[olive mirage]

with back damage, does burst cannon one shot(s) giants?

[indigo quiver]

Yes. Very easily.

[tough lynx]

Yes. With the recent buffs it's almost enough dmg to kill them from the front with one burst

[white cobalt]

They're left with 10 hp if one bullet hits the head it prob will kill

Nvm you'd need to have multiple hit head

All 5 hitting the head one shots from front but you can't actually land that so just hit torso and finish it with main gun

[cyan coral]

you can hit all 5 into head on client

[cyan coral]

burst cannon could always do that in one burst, at least from og r4, can't remember the numbers from og r3

[grizzled crater]

it did even back then

[cyan coral]

thought so

what was the r3 damage number anyway? 16?

[white cobalt]

That'd be a huge pain to do though because of recoil and how small head is on giant

[crystal veldt]

It has been done before so it isn't impossible

But not effective really for the average player not being able to actually get it

[pale dock]

eh u can always just burst cannon it and shoot it a bit with whatev primary u have

[crimson lion]

I got news from good players that as client you can kill a giant from front with bc

[white cobalt]

A burst to the front does 110

Giants have 120

Even if you land a head shot on all 5 you only do like 125

[grizzled crater]

which is a worthless tech anyway

[cyan coral]

no, no, it can be added to the style guide

not worthless

[proud stream]

me still one-clipping hybrids with the machine pistol

[white cobalt]

Real ones can kill enemies without attacking, it's the latest tech

[autumn girder]

SO TRUE!

finally someone who gets it

[stable spire]

pretty sure old BC does 21 per shot

[indigo quiver]

20.1 was the old number.

[stable spire]

okay ._.

[cyan coral]

R3 cannon couldn't one shot strikers to the body

[dusty topaz]

it could, strikers have 20hp

[grizzled crater]

Og r3 burst cannon did not have 20 dmg

Og r4/alt r3 did

[dusty topaz]

oops, thought they meant alt r3

[tight dust]

Tool pack is 105 points
Max tool points — 525
Starting tool points — 350

also your recent updates on wiki are phenomenal

[crimson lion]

More to come

!

[sly narwhal]

stupid question: any idea what the bullet cost values for the mine deployer are? (not quite sure where to find them myself)

[indigo quiver]

As far as I can tell there is no bullet cost really

It's close enough to 1.5 mines per refill that there isn't much difference

[full yew]

Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe it alternates : 1 tool use gives one mine, then the next gives two mines, and so on

[indigo quiver]

That's correct!

[indigo quiver]

@sly narwhal
Mine deployer starts with 100 "units" of tool, with a maximum capacity of 150 "units" and gets 30 "units" per refill, with a "units per mine" cost of 17.85625

So the maximum capacity is 150/17.85625 = 8.400 (rounds down to 8)

You start with 5.600 mines (rounds down to 5)

Every refill gives you 1.680 mines

So it is actually slightly better than alternating between 1 and 2 per refill

[full yew]

Understood

You will "eventually" get 2 mines twice in a row

[indigo quiver]

Correct, you can even get 2 mines three times in a row

Notably, the 150 max, 100 starting, 30 per refill numbers are the same for all tools, it's just that there's an extra individual 'cost' for each tool.

Mines use 17.85625, foam uses 2.5 (and thus gets perfect 60 max, 40 starting, 12 per refill) and sentries use 0.285 (and so have 526.3 max, 350.9 starting, 105.3 per refill) - but then sentries also have individual bullet costs applied.

[sly narwhal]

welp, WeaponInfo, mine deployer, and c-foam launcher pages have now been updated

(and the ammo amounts on the sentry pages should now be a bit less inaccurate)

[crimson lion]

Okay so what does this mean for mine players

When am I supposed to give them tool

[sly narwhal]

When they have <=6 mines

(or, if you want to be on the safe side, <=5 mines)

[crimson lion]

So what if they have 6.5 mines

okay yeah I think it is less than equal to 5

For max

[sly narwhal]

oh also if they have 7 mines in reserve, at least 1 deployed undetonated mine, and have used a tool refill pack after deploying that mine, they might want to avoid collecting that mine (as it could waste a partial mine in their reserve)

[crimson lion]

Look at this useful gtfo info

So based

[white cobalt]

what the hell does this mean?

that it can shoot faster than it should?

[sly narwhal]

It means that the choke mod shotgun is technically a burst weapon according to the internal weapon stats thingy inside GTFO itself. But functionally it's just an ordinary single-shot weapon.

[white cobalt]

a single shot burst gun (a regular gun) specifically labeled as a burst weapon

not strange at all

[olive mirage]

what do people think of the scattergun?

still holds up?

[candid isle]

A little more than that

[white cobalt]

i personally dislike it cause it has 12 shots and konig has 13

and i would use both to kill giants

but konig does it from farther

honestly i dont get why ppl like it so much

[olive mirage]

the sniper?

hate it since the ammo was nerfed

miss one shot in a game and any other special is better

[white cobalt]

this is fair, the ammo is harsh

scattergun has one less bullet though

and way lower effective range

[grizzled crater]

It has 1 more (14 max) and gets 4.7 vs 3.91 per refill lol

[white cobalt]

ur right im actually out of my mind

i for some reason went "there is nothing in the magazine, it has 12 bullets only"

[grizzled crater]

Scatter trades range and giant killing reliability for potential small clear efficiency, boss killing and a bit more ammo
Also snatcher/bbc combat

[white cobalt]

can you still get these

or no since we have alt r6 now

[soft mason]

nope

[white cobalt]

so they're just unobtainable but in game?

[soft mason]

yeah

if you missed original r6, out of luck

its shitty

[indigo quiver]

@sly narwhal As far as I can tell, the mine deployer really uses the 150 point cap thing, not the 8 mines cap. So being at 8 mines doesn't mean you're at 8.0 mines, you could be at 8.4 mines, and when you use one you'd go to 7.4 mines etc. You can tell that this is the case because after capping out on mines, the next refill can give you two mines (so you must be able to have at least 0.38 mines left over).

This would mean you could be at 7.3 mines and be able to pick one back up no problem. But you could also be at 7.5 mines and lose some mine when picking one up.

So I think the only thing you can really say for optimal use is, don't refill unless <=5 mines, don't pick one up unless <= 6 mines

I've hopefully clarified that on the mine's wiki page

Also, I am planning on eventually doing some substantial rewrites to the Bullet Cost page, and since I now know how tools actually work I'll add all that in too

Sometime(TM)

[sly narwhal]

👍

[sly narwhal]

yeah I will admit that my original bullet cost explanation definitely isn't as clear as it probably needs to be 😅

But I really do like your recent work on the various mechanics pages on the wiki

[indigo quiver]

I was more thinking of the table that has the refills from empty, which imo isn't really that useful, better to have something with like refill % or max/min refill %

[sly narwhal]

Understandable tbh

[indigo quiver]

Since I don't imagine anyone is counting how many refills they've had, they just care "If I'm at 65% Revolver, will my refill cap me out or not"

[sly narwhal]

ye

I suppose that primaries are probably easier to summarize (can be boiled down to 'do not resupply if >82%')

But secondaries are where things get Complicated™️

[olive mirage]

anyone got any thoughts on the minor buffs to the SMGs?

the smol bullet damage buff

[white cobalt]

I like smgs except I don't actually because they are worse carbines

Carbine needs a need for me to use similar gun types

But otherwise I'm appreciative of the minor buff cause I don't often see smgs

[dusty topaz]

here's a copy/pasteable pastebin of the numbers for that, to save you time (if you haven't already calculated them)
https://pastebin.com/Myp4P5FQ

the numbers/percentages are rounded conservatively, so if you use an ammopack at the "Use At" percent, you should never overcap

[tight dust]

Well, the increased magazines are more valuable.
but more damage is more damage.

25% more ammo in the magazine is delicious

[olive mirage]

might give the heavy SMG a whirl

[tight dust]

heavy smg has gotten noticeably better

[olive mirage]

yeah, slight damage increase plus big mag increase seems rad

would be a good back-up for the hel-rifle

[silk geode]

Is there an overview of all logs (Alt R1-R7) with positions somewhere?

[tough lynx]

Only on a expedition basis, no Zones/Area list yet

[simple cypress]

Does r4d2 have a disinfect station anywhere? What is the terminal command for the disinfect station?

[pale dock]

think it doesnt, u can search if there is one by usin the terminal, LIST DISINFECT or DISINFECTION
that way u check if theres disinfection packs, or a station, but for that level i dont think theres neither tho i could b wrong

[simple cypress]

i know there disinfect packs and the terminal only showed disinfect packs so i guess not

[crimson lion]

no

it has a turbine

but the secondary is supost to be a race agaisnt the clock to get the turbine

[white cobalt]

i hate races to get the turbine

just let me use the mf fog clearer why do i get it only after hitting 85% infection due to 4 door scans in 30 ft deep fog

[simple cypress]

we worked towards 102 to clear without cargo and then planned on retrieving cargo after we clear didn't play out with 95% infected at VII Security Door 99-101 somewhere

[indigo quiver]

@sly narwhal I added stamina costs to the melee weapon template and it looks good but I'm still terrified of the templates so I didn't poke the debug stuff

[lusty haven]

You have to be very fast and very conservative with what repellers you do get to skip turbine.

[sly narwhal]

tbf the 'debug' stuff is just a table stating what all of the arguments that have been passed to the template were/calculated variables from the Maths™️ at the top of the template.

The main reason it exists in the first place was to facilitate the creation of the Maths™️ of the templates, by spitting out the intermediate values calculated en-route so I could verify that the maths were correct, without those intermediate values being spat out anywhere important in the meantime)

[sly narwhal]

also I've just created [[Template:Nav Mechanics]], to allow for easier navigation between game mechanic pages @indigo quiver

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.fandom.com/wiki/Template:Nav_Mechanics

[sly narwhal]

(feel free to tweak it a bit to make it more presentable, currently just adding it to all the mechanics pages)

[indigo quiver]

:o BIG

[sly narwhal]

only slight problem is that, like every other navbox, it's unusable on mobile - because Fandom, for some utterly stupid reason, decided that they would prevent navboxes from loading on mobile devices (on any wiki) and not allow that behaviour to be overridden on their mediawiki instance

also [[Sledgehammer]] now redirects to the real sledgehammer

[rough widget]

https://gtfo.fandom.com/wiki/Sledgehammer

[sly narwhal]

(update: now it does)

old page has been moved

[indigo quiver]

Massive changes

[sly narwhal]

not really massive lol

mostly just wikignoming

[humble oracle]

Whoever updated the "schaeffer" article on the wiki, it is fantastic. If only other older entries like destination and such could get such quality updates.

[uncut musk]

https://gtfo.fandom.com/wiki/Schaeffer this?

[weak coral]

it was mostly duck

thanks @tough lynx

[humble oracle]

yeah

[tough lynx]

Tyvm ^^ I was kinda hoping we will get a more "official name" for Destination before making a proper page but we'll see what R8 brings

[soft mason]

I just call it Alpha

[tough lynx]

The "Giant" renaming was the result of a community poll to determine the most used names for enemies. #community-news message
(Since I don't know who reversed it to Big Striker I thought I'd try to put it here. Guess I could have written that in the talk section of the actual page but w/e ^^)

[soft mason]

Big striker is a troglodyte name

Changed the descriptions back but i don't know how to change the pages title

Whoever changed it broke the link to the video at the bottom which I fixed, but the first picture is also messed up

shadow giants are also now 'big shadows'

[sinful island]

pleagus

[sly narwhal]

looks like that article has always been called "Big Shadow"

[sly narwhal]

you do that by moving the page
https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Help:Moving_a_page
https://community.fandom.com/wiki/Help:Moving_pages

[crimson lion]

XD

[sly narwhal]

Anywho, RefFoxtrot (no idea who you are, but I know you probably can read this) - good work on archiving the stuff from the Santonian Industries website.

[soft mason]

Ah wasnt sure if it was originally shadow giant or not

[soft mason]

It is objectively same with big flyer

[charred verge]

I totally missed that this channel existed...

And yeah, found a way to semi-automate it. So can keep an eye if anything new is added.

[crystal veldt]

Probably doesn't matter much but. Lugubrious color palette Notes for obtaining it are wrong. at least for after Ext. after ext. the obj for lugubrious turned into 10 main clears

you didn't need to complete A-D and Ext to unlock it

[proper ermine]

which lvl do u start encountering the Mother?

R?D?

[young elk]

R3B1

[proper ermine]

ty

will they be sleeping or awake?

[young elk]

sleeping

[full yew]

R3B2, good sir

[proper ermine]

uhhhh so which one exactly

well just to be safe ima just assume its both

tysm for the info

[rocky wolf]

It's b2

[young elk]

my b, its been a while

[charred verge]

Added icons against each apparel palette on the wiki... took 2 nights to devise a process to get correct color data but it's done!

If anyone out there is searching and wants the data, do shout.

[candid isle]

hey I don't the wiki mention that the Auto sentry doesn't actually pen, shouldn't that be in there?

[hollow ingot]

It's fixed for the next release

[candid isle]

YAY ty!

[crystal quest]

@hollow ingot all(most relevant) character voice lines going to be implemented and working correctly??? 🤨🤨

[pale dock]

only daudas are bugged

the rest being toned down was a deliberate option

also this is wiki chat

[crystal quest]

Bishops voice lines for entering a big room have not been added at all since they’ve fully released the game. There’s also voice line relating too certain actions performed by the character. Deploying a sentry gun, killing sleeper during combat and a stealth state, etc. they had them active during pre alpha and early gameplay demos, why not for the full release

They’ve added the voice lines when a horde spawns with R7 and newer lines for ping items but that’s about it

[pale dock]

this is unsourced but think the origin from the lines not being on the full release was the devs sayin they didnt added to the inmersion, so they pulled them out

theres some mods that add em all back

if ur interested on those

[crystal quest]

I’ve tried the mods their fun. There’s one video that has bishop saying his respect line for entering a big room “plenty of scav in this gaf” something like that but sadly I can’t find it and that video also shows the mapper tool in action. Where they say it “won’t add to the immersion” I see laziness. Imo It would totally add to the immersion with the characters saying there respected lines during the situation I.e calling out when they kill a sleeper during stealth or boasting about the sleeper they killed during combat. Etc

[pale dock]

not really lazy cause, they were already there it was a choice
also the mapper its a tool that was never added cause at the end it wouldve been useless unless given another function also that trailer is like from
6 years

also this is still wiki chat

[crystal quest]

Ehh, there’s nothing more to talk about

[crystal veldt]

Bishops are as well

[crystal quest]

He just yells a lot which it some short fun

[crystal veldt]

Bishop says the opposite during alert phase for yes/no

The alert versions/calm versions of voicelines is just funky for base game in general

[crystal quest]

very calm during a horde stressed out about one sleeper waking up

Hopefully something fixed for next release

[indigo quiver]

R8 Patch Notes

Sledgehammer

• Light stagger multi: 3 -> 1
• Charged stagger multi: 5 -> 1.3

Knife

• Charged backstab multi: 1 -> 1.7
• Charged sleeper multi: 2 -> 1.5
• Max damage charge time: 0.5 -> 0.6
• Auto attack time: 7 -> 15

Spear

• Light stagger multi: 2 -> 1
• Max damage charge time: 1.7 -> 1.8

Bat

• Light stagger multi: 4 -> 5
• Charged stagger multi: 6 -> 7

Burst Rifle

• Bullet cost: 1.75 -> 1.65

HEL Gun

• Charge time: 0.3 -> 0.2

Burst Cannon

• Bullet cost: 5.1 -> 5.0
• Burst shot count: 5 -> 3
• Recoil min: 0.6 -> 0.4 (ALT://R3 was 0.2)
• Recoil max: 1.2 -> 0.9 (ALT://R3 was 0.4)

Sniper

• Clip size: 3 -> 2
• Bullet cost: 23.0 -> 17.5
• Shot delay: 0.5 -> 1.3
• Hip Fire Spread: 3 -> 13
• Numerous recoil changes

Scattergun

• Damage: 4.01 -> 4.8 (128.32 -> 153.6)
• Bullet cost: 19.15 -> 16.3

Precision Rifle

• Clip size: 12 -> 10

Machine Pistol

• Damage falloff start: 4 -> 5
• Damage falloff end: 30 -> 35

HEL Autopistol

• Damage: 1.01 -> 1.5
• Bullet cost: 0.8 -> 1.0

Sawed-off Shotgun

• Clip size: 3 -> 4

Bullpup

• Damage falloff start: 15 -> 10
• Damage falloff end: 70 -> 65
• Reload time: 2.1 -> 2.3

Sniper Sentry

• Damage falloff start: 20 -> 30
• Shot delay: 3.0 -> 2.6
• Start fire delay: 3.0 -> 2.8

Burst Sentry

• Damage falloff start: 15 -> 10
• Damage falloff end: 80 -> 40
• Bullet cost: 1.95 -> 2.05

HEL Auto Sentry

• Damage: 0.71 -> 0.8

Shotgun Sentry

• Bullet cost: 1.8 -> 1.58

[soft mason]

bullpup nerf. actually insane

well that goes for a lot of these

[lusty haven]

No AR buff

[white cobalt]

auto sentry buff

it actually is loaded with hel bullets?

[rare otter]

theve gutted the giant killers

[crimson lion]

look

at

scatter

[rare otter]

I KNOW

they gave it steroids

[crimson lion]

literally you dont need another gun

[cobalt kestrel]

am i blind or no stats on new weapons yet?

[rare otter]

scroll up

OH

new wepons

yeah idk

[indigo quiver]

Stats for new weapons now live on the wiki

@cobalt kestrel ^

[cobalt kestrel]

🙏

[indigo quiver]

@sly narwhal If you're happy to add the backstab multi to the MeleeInfo template I'd muchly appreciate it. If not I'm more than happy to figure it out!

I've added the backstab bulti to the knife page itself, but obviously it doesn't show yet

[autumn girder]

wait wtf

short rifle has negative (under 1) stagger multi?

interesting

[rare otter]

it speeds them up

[grave latch]

any idea on what the new cosmetics are?

[rare otter]

new bat skin new spear skin 4 returning hammer skins a knife skin

[grave latch]

i meant for the player model not the melees

can confirm u can still 1 shot giants in the back

i just tested it

[rare otter]

what bout the front

[grave latch]

2 bursts if its front

2-3

[rare otter]

ah

so its same

[grave latch]

yep

[olive mirage]

is it me or are the slug shotgun and the short rifle not where you might expect them to be, regarding weapon slots

i thought the slugger was going to be special and the short to be main

[soft mason]

short rifle is basically a souped up Rifle (from my limited experience) so special makes sense

[olive mirage]

oh i'm sure they are balanced for their respective slots

its just based on the weapon descriptions

BACK TO 5 ROUNDS REFILL ON THE SNIPER

[mental wren]

compared to the scatter now

💀

[sly narwhal]

is the backstab multiplier a separate thing to the precision multiplier?

[indigo quiver]

Yup!

[sly narwhal]

and is backstab damage mulplicative with precision

[indigo quiver]

I believe so

[sly narwhal]

is it

• A: Stab anywhere in back = base * precision * backstab
  or
• B: Stab non-head back = base * backstab; Stab occiput = base * precision * backstab

[indigo quiver]

stab back of head -> back multi * backstab multi * precision multi ( * sleeper multi)

stab back non-head -> back multi * backstab multi ( * sleeper multi)

[sly narwhal]

welp, it's implemented.
it shows backstab multipliers (if either are defined as not 1), and the appropriate base/charge*backstab damage.

[indigo quiver]

ur da bestest

I'm planning on making a page for backstab multi tomorrow sometime

[sly narwhal]

added a link to that potential page to MeleeInfo

[indigo quiver]

Ended up making the page tonight, just made it a redirect to Melee#Mechanics since there's a paragraph explaining it there and there's not really too much more to go into beyond that.

Did the same for Sleeping Multiplier

[sly narwhal]

aight

Anywho, I wonder where the fourth sawed-off shell is stored

[stray plume]

In yo mind, gonna have to update the model of sawn-off shotgun if that was the case

would probably look like m202 FLASH barrel

[raw oriole]

probably same lore explanation as hel revo chambers 7 and 8

[sly narwhal]

true

[sly narwhal]

Anywho, seeing as there are now reskins of melee weapons - I'm thinking of swapping the existing melee pages (Santonian HDH, Mastaba Fixed Blade, MACO Drillhead, Kovac Peacekeeper) with their generic currently-redirect pages (Sledgehammer, Knife, Spear, Bat), making the newly reintroduced old melees redirect to Sledgehammer (as they're now reskins of it), and set up some redirects for the other melee reskins

[white cobalt]

So just all skins redirect to the main thing

And IDK include an image of the skin on the page

[sly narwhal]

already did that 😅

[sly narwhal]

don't have any images of the knife/bat/spear reskins though

[tough lynx]

One sec, gonna upload them

[white cobalt]

Am I wrong or does knife now kill scouts to the front of the head too?

And do like 60? Damage on giant occiput

5.5×1.7×1.5 is 14.025

3x on scout head is 42

[white cobalt]

IDK where I got 60 from

[sly narwhal]

5.5 * 1.5 * 1.7 * 3 = 42.075 (awake)
5.5 * 1.5 * 1.7 * 1.5 * 3 = 63.1125 (asleep)

[white cobalt]

Right

Forgot about scouts not being asleep

And sleeping calc in general

Also precision

Or did I?

[sly narwhal]

5.5 * 1.5 * 3 = 24.75 to head in front

[sly narwhal]

that's the 1.5

[white cobalt]

Can you give me a breakdown on multipliers? I just woke up and I'm too unawake to do math

[sly narwhal]

5.5 (base charge) * 1.5 (charge precision) * 1.7 (charge backstab) * 1.5 (charge asleep) * 3 (giant occiput) = 63.1125 (charged knife on sleeping giant occiput)

[white cobalt]

I realize now I was adding backstab bonus for scout front of head

So knife still needs scout occi

But thanks

Knife does quite a lot on giants now

[sly narwhal]

actually I realized I looked at the wrong row earlier on (misread asleep multiplier)

[white cobalt]

So it does less?

[sly narwhal]

63.1125

[white cobalt]

Mmm

It's totally workable

[mental wren]

How much does spear do

[white cobalt]

Also doesn't it break limbs when hitting the back in one charged attack now

[sly narwhal]

17.5 * 1.5 * 3 = 78.75
(charged) * (charged precision) * (giant occiput)

[mental wren]

Real

[sly narwhal]

and it works regardless of whether or not the giant is asleep

[mental wren]

Well Yes

But

[white cobalt]

Knife is very fast so I think it's a viable alternative

[mental wren]

It's gonna be a bit hard to get spear occu alone while it's awake

[white cobalt]

And if it breaks limbs consistently then it's good for stunning

[sly narwhal]

Sledgehammer still deals 60 damage to giant occiput
Bat still deals 36 damage to giant occiput

[white cobalt]

I'm just glad knife can function when the enemy is awake better cause of the backstab multi

[crystal veldt]

Did someone just copy/paste pistol dmg onto the double tap pistol?

[chrome violet]

I hope so. If it legit has as much damage as shelling its NUTSO. Ima test it on the bots rq.

Yeah tested on bots just now. It's doing ~6.125 FF damage per bullet. So around 3.06 per bullet based on shooting a bot.

[white cobalt]

hmm

i'd say its still better in a lot of cases

[chrome violet]

i wonder what the damage dropoff lookin like

[white cobalt]

prob p ass

my guess at least

[sly narwhal]

welp, I've updated the page to say 3.0625 damage per shot for the time being, I guess it'll be double-checked once someone with the updated weapon stats logs in.

However, looking at the raw stats as of ALT://R6 - it appears that the burst pistol (which was in the stats back then) was supposed to be 3*4.64 - so, y'know, chances are it might actually be 2*4.64 as of R8

[crystal veldt]

I wouldn't be surprised if those stats were a placeholder from using normal pistol as a base

[umbral merlin]

Do we have numbers on reload cancel times for the new weapons?

Ehh fair enough

[dusty topaz]

Burst Pistol: 0.867 sec
Slug Shotgun: 1.117 sec
Bullpup: 2.433 sec (was 2.217s)
Arbalist MG: 2.383 sec (was 1.867s)
Revolver: 0.75 sec (was 0.767s)

[umbral merlin]

Thanks! Dang that slug shotgun reload cancel is nuts

[sly narwhal]

All we need now is the short rifle 🙏

[dusty topaz]

oops, shortbarrel is 1.167 sec

edit: also Rifle (main weapon) was quietly nerfed, reload cancel is 1.467 sec (was 0.817s)

[royal phoenix]

let's gooo indirect revolver buff

[umbral merlin]

Aww yeah .017s faster reload

milliseconds become seconds which become minutes

[cyan coral]

the real revolver buff is snapping your wrists 4 times when reloading it

[umbral merlin]

I love wrist pain

[sly narwhal]

wrists are overrated

[umbral merlin]

Give me MORE tendonitis

What flashlights do the new weapons use?

[humble oracle]

you guys getting the logs i'm posting in #gtfo-lore ?

[sly narwhal]

update: okay, burst pistol is 3.05 damage per shot

[chrome violet]

yo i was close with the teamkilling bots

[sly narwhal]

Commendable effort

[chrome violet]

did u get those numbers urself? If not where from? also i think this should be updated at some point with the newer numbers. it's the only place i know of where those are listed https://gtfo.fandom.com/wiki/Reload

[sly narwhal]

It's on the to-do list.

[chrome violet]

i can do it but idk where you guys are getting the numbers from

[sly narwhal]

the weaponinfo stats are all up-to-date (via datamined stuff)

[chrome violet]

where are the reload cancel numbers

[sly narwhal]

I think they're calculated manually

[umbral merlin]

wouldn't surprise me

like record it, then go frame by frame

[hallow pagoda]

petition to call new enemy squigglies?

[rotund kernel]

yes yes yes

[dusty topaz]

Yup, I record 60fps with an input overlay, measure the number of frames from the first frame where I press my reload key to the first frame where the reload counter changes, divide by 60 for the reload cancel time in seconds. i usually post them here https://www.reddit.com/r/GTFO/comments/1350qkc/resource_weapon_data_reloadcancel_times_time_to/ (edit: its updated now)

[chrome violet]

sick

[agile tundra]

are the new melees just reskins or do they have stat differences?

with all of the old sledges back, i'm assuming just reskins

[pale dock]

reskins :]

[umbral merlin]

Yep just reskins, I like the spear one

[crystal veldt]

You telling me the Machine gun I love. Basically got nerfed

[agile tundra]

i too, love the spear reskin

[pale dock]

spears one its literally the best dont at me

u know its true

[white cobalt]

wish it was a real stinger

the image in the loadout tab makes it look like it has a needle

the blade is cool too but a needle would be sick

[indigo quiver]

@dusty topaz If you're available to, could you also retime the sniper reload. It's definitely worse

[dusty topaz]

sure, i measured sniper's reload cancel as 2.9 seconds (was 2.45s)

[languid pond]

None of the new enemies inside the wiki yet?

[sly narwhal]

correct.

[languid pond]

damn

wanted to check the well

big thingy

[sly narwhal]

honestly I know even less about it than you lol

[languid pond]

😭

[sly narwhal]

in the meantime, your best bet is probably asking in #gtfo-spoiler-chat I guess

[mental wren]

The nightmare shooter is technically

[crystal veldt]

question

did the bullpup reload get slower or faster

or is that patchnote just worded incorrectly

[chrome violet]

slower

[crystal veldt]

so patch notes are just worded incorrectly

[chrome violet]

https://www.reddit.com/r/GTFO/comments/1350qkc/resource_weapon_data_reloadcancel_times_time_to/

I think slower because this is up to date

[crystal veldt]

IT's not that idk the numbers

More so the patch notes being fucked

[chrome violet]

arbalist reload got nuked

[crystal veldt]

I keep getting people telling me the reload is faster because of how it's worded

[sly narwhal]

it's still faster than it was pre-buff :^)

[split thorn]

It’s slower now. They removed the buff and we don’t know why

[crystal veldt]

I know. ' ^ ' (just a side note. I do run a mod allowing me to see weapon stats and etc. but I more wanted confirmation here)

just let's me know patch notes can't be trusted to be accurate/not mention shadow nerfs

[split thorn]

If you use the Archive mod, the weapon stats update automatically

[crystal veldt]

Yuki I know

I use archive

:/

WeaponStatShower is ripped from Archive anyhow

[split thorn]

😔

[raw oriole]

yeah I thought they buffed it too

apparently whoever wrote the patch notes doesn't know what speed is

[crystal veldt]

turns out I read it wrong the time and read it as Reload time

instead of reload speed and turned out to be right anyhow

but yeah :/

[white cobalt]

Short rifle wiki page should mention it's absurdly low delay between shots

Since it mentions it on the choke shotgun

[indigo quiver]

The wiki is open to contributions from anyone, you don't even need an account, feel free to add something on it!

[white cobalt]

Oh never knew that, thanks

@indigo quiver what am I doing wrong here

NVM

I think I fixed it

[tidal walrus]

Can anyone put images of the new cosmetics?

[indigo quiver]

The wiki is open to contributions from anyone, you don't even need an account, feel free to add any that you've gotten!

[timid zodiac]

New Masks (names in same order as pictures)
SNAPJAW RX-A1 HERUS, STORAX ROCKER N, STORAX TEGU LEGACY, QUANTEX FORGE RED, GUNNAR DUAL VISION ROGUE, GUNNAR TWIN SCEPTER II, ARGON FENRIR LG, GARUGA ALLOY T17

New Torso
QANTEX WINDBEATER (displayed using both overall pallete and blush safeguard pallete)

New Backpack
KITHAULER GALAXY

New Palettes
POISON LIVIDUS, LAST LAZARUS, DECEM, AZUL TINTO

there are no new leg cosmetics

[crystal quest]

No legs 😔

I’m actually happy we got new helmet models

[white cobalt]

i have been informed

that evade has been changed in some ways?

[sly narwhal]

Choke shotgun's delay (or lack thereof) is absurdly lower tbh

[white cobalt]

.095 seconds is p low

its a fire rate of 25

thats literally the highest firerate tied with machine pistol

but its a semi auto

this is only 20 cause thats as high as my macro goes

[soft mason]

im so curious why they made a gun that seems designed around a macro

[mental wren]

i mean its not like its good with one

:P

[soft mason]

real.

[chrome violet]

Yes it is

[white cobalt]

30 bullets, 4.8 dmg each

thats enough to melt a giant

[mental wren]

so is a single scatter bullet

and it doesnt cost 15%

wiat sorry

nvmd i cant math rn

[raw oriole]

I'm confused. A shot delay of 0.095 should be a bit over 10 shots per second

25 shots should be more like a delay of 0.04

I'll grant that the video footage looks like 20 per second though

[white cobalt]

idk

the fire rate is DEFINITELY 25

(source is game code detecting mod that shows stats for guns)

so idk what the .095 delay is from or if its accurate

[raw oriole]

fair

[rare otter]

they skiped leg day

[white cobalt]

@celest nymph found this on the sawed off page

[crystal veldt]

LOL

I get it but to go and edit the wiki page because of it

[dusty topaz]

Here's one with 25 (clicking every millisecond) #gtfo-media message

[white cobalt]

So real

[raw oriole]

I always liked the 8 rounds in 6 chambers on hel revo, gave the gun character

[sly narwhal]

just double-checked the raw stats, looks like that is correct.

page has been updated.

[crystal veldt]

Me trying modded rundowns that nerf it to 6 rounds throws me off so hard. But when I use normal revo I'm used to 6 rounds

[glossy mantle]

Have you tried infinite?

Or both y’all can’t do infinite and are capped at a certain number

When Voxy and I tested this we ran infinite and then had to do workarounds with burst firing

Not that it makes much a difference I think, but curious

[glossy mantle]

I should note that short rifle macros benefit most with a 2 round burst

4 to kill sleeper w/ head

So 2 bursts

[dusty topaz]

infinite? what do you mean?

[glossy mantle]

You said you set your macro to 25

I just have my macro set to right click on a consistent sub milisecond repeat

[dusty topaz]

ohh, i had a autoclicker set to left click every 1ms

[glossy mantle]

Infinite

Toggle

[umbral merlin]

The wiki is saying that the burst cannon and the double tap rifle has the same flashlight (medium range flashlight #1) , yet they are very different, burst cannon has a lot more range

Burst cannon flashlight looks like the wide range flashlight like the machine guns have

[muted hull]

if its inaccurate, then you can change it. the wiki is open to contributions from anyone

[umbral merlin]

Problem is, I'm not 100% on which flashlight is which lol

But yeah that's true

[pale dock]

burst cannon its the machinegun one, burst rifle i think its the sniper one

u can go ingame with both guns to check

[umbral merlin]

Yeah burst rifle is the sniper one

That I know

[crystal veldt]

Extended

[crystal veldt]

Machine guns use Wide iirc

[mental wren]

:P

hey

uh

the new enemies arent spoilered or hidden in the small enemies link box thingy at the bottom of enemies pages

[charred verge]

Should they be?

[mental wren]

probably

i mean

theyre spoilered on the enemies page

[charred verge]

Fair point...

I guess its a tricky thing beacuse, for new players, the bosses are also somewhat a spoiler...

Maybe we just need spoiler warnings on all enemy pages

[mental wren]

2 week rule at least

:P

some vets havent even seen them

[mental wren]

wait also you done ||a2 sec|| yet/

[charred verge]

Only just started playing 8.0...

[mental wren]

oop

:<

mb

[charred verge]

Eh. I find the environments far more engaging then the enemy types.

[mental wren]

the page on one of the new enemies is just fkn missing data

[charred verge]

But yeah -- that's a good point. We list all the epxeditions on 8.0 on the wiki but they're not available from the start...

Hmm

[mental wren]

m

[charred verge]

I wonder if we can do hidden spoiler text in the nav...