#balance-feedback-discussion

1 messages · Page 355 of 1

dusky surge
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teno has more potential but a higher skill floor and ceiling

carno is consistently decent due to a low skill floor and ceiling, but doesn't have the potential

hollow canyon
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Tenonto also gets screwed over by high ping and lag more

dusky surge
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very true

unborn iris
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I feel like that's a fair assessment in a 1v1. But something like a 3v3 is skewed more towards carno being able to kill one of them.

dusky surge
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laggy carnos barely suffer as much

unborn iris
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It's pretty easy to catch a charge when they have to pay attention to more than 1.

hollow canyon
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Yea I think that currently Carnos potential grows more with numbers, I'd argue for the opposite prior to 4.5 but now I think Carno is better with numbers

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old Tenonto could basically just kill a Carno with a single CC if both Tenontos cooperated well but currently with the damage nerf and kick being the main damaging tool I think Carnos might have a better time as the numbers increase

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Not necessarily to a large extent but still

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they are more mobile and their charge applies a harder CC and is more devastating

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the more Carnos there are the more you need to have eyes all around your head to keep track of all of them so as to avoid getting charged

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Carnos will also be able to pounce on a downed Tenonto faster than the other Tenontos will be able to help it, coupled with the fact that Tenontos are quite prone to friendly fire and it takes a bit of skill from Tenontos to avoid hitting their friends

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I've seen some videos and situations where watching Tenontos play in a team was just... a painful experience

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There was that video made by Kav and his friends where they were running 2v2 Tenonto vs Carno and honestly it was painful to watch with all the friendly fire from Tenos

dusky surge
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tenos are horrible in teams, this much is true

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their weapons are primarily large, clunky and rely on the enemy coming to them

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prone heavily to hitting the shit out of each other

hollow canyon
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they are only as horrible as the players controlling them are, if they cooperate well they can be quite devastating since they have CC on their attacks setting up the opponent for the assault of other herd members

dusky surge
hollow canyon
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I don't watch them that often but that one was really painful to look at

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Tenontos were just tailslamming Carnos that were right there in the kick range, slamming each other over their heads just... complete chaos and button mashing it seemed to me

somber sphinx
hollow canyon
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Idk who exactly was on which team I just know that the way Tenontos played there was... questionable to put it mildly

hasty coyote
somber sphinx
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From eye’s video he dropped something wich lead to his pc crashing and lagging

dusky surge
hasty coyote
hasty coyote
civic holly
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all this getting stuck and just having to wait for 30 minutes to die is the most riveting gameplay(please make a suicide button for this)

hasty coyote
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@swift sapphire neither of those changes will work currently.
If we add another apex, what is it supposed to eat other than stegos?
If we buff deino to bully stegs, then what stops deinos from strolling on land?

tranquil pawn
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exactly!

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and removing stego isn't a viable strategy at all either

alpine plover
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Lol
Pounce is still bugged in the stress test

hasty coyote
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Both of them were a bad choice to add, but at least they keep each other in check somewhat

hasty coyote
alpine plover
tranquil pawn
alpine plover
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  1. You cannot delatch when pouncing
  2. You cannot move after finishing a pounce
tranquil pawn
hasty coyote
alpine plover
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At least

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It seems the bleed on pounce has been nerfed as well

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Let's hope that's not true

swift sapphire
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@hasty coyote restore to what they were,, stegos still bullied deinos before the nerfs. herds of stegos went on killing sprees much as they do now, but a commited deino could take down a stego by itself if it caugh one near the water as it should be. now you better have a few deinos and chances are you'll still die. steggos were bad enough before even when deino could go 1v1 with em, it didnt happen that often.. now... not even close

golden coral
swift sapphire
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it really is

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i've played regularly since the recode lol its pretty accurate

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you obviosly never were at pocket pool when a herd of stegos rolled through killing everything

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it took 5 alt bites for a full grown croc to kill a full grown stego, but only if they comited to the kill, if they went in and tried to come out they would die.. a croc could do it, and live with a sliver of life left. that was more balanced than what we have now

hasty coyote
# swift sapphire <@482714749445079040> restore to what they were,, stegos still bullied deinos be...

Currently a coordinated pair of deinos can take down a stego. If a single deino can take down a stego, it’s not in a good spot. The balance of the game is “can’t fight? Run. Can’t run? Fight.” Deino has the agency in the fight while stego is forced to go to the water. Thus stego should win the fight. Currently, it’s not in a terrible spot, deinos can force stegs away if they are smart, but should generally just not fight them.

swift sapphire
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i dont disagree with you, however there needs to be a balance, or checks, right now there is neither

hasty coyote
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Personally, I think we just need to wait. Adding 2 apexes when the other biggest thing is the smallest mid-tier and a small game hunter is not the best choice.
Only thing I can think of is making sustaining both of them actually difficult to limit their numbers, and forcing stegos to be more solitary and increase competition.

golden coral
# swift sapphire you obviosly never were at pocket pool when a herd of stegos rolled through kill...

No, I had more sense than to make that kind of terrible decision. Any deino that did that deserved to die, no excuses.
Anyway, deinos could fight back then, and then we had that period of just biting through a stegos ass to kill it, with nothing the stego could do. And now deinos are fine, they got much better rivers to use, so there's no real excuse to get "bullied" by stegos. As Rapdex said, coordinated deinos can take a solo stego, and that's fine enough, deinos are not meant to hunt stegos all that much.

hollow canyon
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Lol at all the Deinos that are dumb enough to try to grow in the pocket pool

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Literal natural selection at work

swift sapphire
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@golden coral lol you had more sense than to make what terrible decision?.. biting through the ass to kill it with nothing a stego could do. a GOOD stego could counter the ass bite with.. wait for it.. walking forward... if a stego was stupid enough to stand there and take it, he deserved to die no excuses ;p.. this can go back and forth both ways.. as long as you want. the point is they are still broken.. and its evident in every server you login on., deinos were ment to rule the waterways with no natural predators other than other deinos, and for a time it was so.. and it was glorious.. now not so much... and i am sad

hollow canyon
swift sapphire
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i loved the pocket pool,, i killed many a stego and streamer there with a deino

hollow canyon
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That's the terrible decision, idk how hard it is to figure out that trying to grow in a spot where there's literally just one way out, a really bad one at that might be a bad idea.

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Yea then keep killing the Stegos as you did, idk what your problem is

swift sapphire
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it was fine for little deinos, big deinos had to stay near the falls, but pocket was where you went for action

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you cant anymore thats what we are discussing try to keep up

golden coral
# swift sapphire <@175015945360769025> lol you had more sense than to make what terrible decision...

No, they could not, deino could actually run after them. And they can't both move and attack, as you'd know. And yes, I had more sense than to put myself in an enclosed area where I could not get out. If you as deino looked at pocket pool and thought "ah yes, I'm gonna live in this pool where I can not get out if something sieges me" you.. are just terrible at making survival decisions. Deinos are not meant to rule the waterways, that will fall to spino most likely.

hollow canyon
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Pocket pool is an atrocious spot unless you are asking to die

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I literally only ever go there as Deino to mass murder other Deinos

swift sapphire
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no they couldnt alt bite lunged you frorward a bit with a pause between... it was easy to get out

golden coral
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Deinos are far safer, and far more powerful overall, than stegos anyway. It's not the end of the world if there's one thing the deinos can not take on, when everything else they do not fear at all.

hollow canyon
swift sapphire
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lol not even close

golden coral
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I mean, current "pocket pool" is safer I think, but why would you ever go up there as deino anyway. Nothing there, just a waste of time, unless you're growing and have fish or something.

hollow canyon
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He isn't talking about alt biting there

swift sapphire
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an old deino was slower than a steg and ran out of stam a tad slower than it does now

hollow canyon
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It was slower but just by a tiny bit

golden coral
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You were fast enough to keep up and finish off a stego, there was that one video on it I believe.

swift sapphire
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there isnt really a current pocket pool... i dont know what to call it now, no mans land i guess

hollow canyon
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it was fast enough to keep itself on Stego and land multiple bites on it before Deino ran out of stamina

golden coral
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Anyway, no longer relevant, the point is more so that deinos are fine, two deinos takes a solo stego, and that's perfectly fine. Especially since two adult deinos aren't that rare after all.

hollow canyon
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They do if the Stego is dumb enough and actually accepts a 1v2 fight

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any sane Stego will just run away

swift sapphire
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i dont disagree i enjoyed the conversation erik o7

hollow canyon
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then again - same goes for Deino, if you're 1v1 vs Stego you just get the hell out, it's not a fight that you will be winning most of the time

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Also - I actually wouldn't mind Deino being made faster again

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Not that it would let it win against Stego, pre-nerf Deino wouldn't be winning against current Stego(matter of fact it would be getting clapped even harder as it had less hp at the time)

golden coral
civic holly
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Hi! This game is incredible! So I would love to see you guys expand the beach ecology. Maybe make a seawater predator to punish bad flyers, along with seafish as part of pteradon diet instead of chicken and frogs (which i can never find btw!)

spare badger
somber sphinx
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@slender kettle Well they have a solution for that. Make the smals have more mechanics and make apexes and big boys Harder to grow

hollow canyon
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nobody will care

old hull
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its true , even if you made the smaller dinos better and more useful the players will always favor bigger ones

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if t-rex was the most useless carnivore in the game , it would 100% still be the most picked dino

hasty coyote
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There’s also a few things that video ignores for the argument for small dinos

The small dinos we have currently are not played for more reasons than “they’re small so no one cares”. Dryo has been confirmed to have a bugged model and dodge and is lacking a core mechanic, but the devs are not helping it. Hypsi hasn’t had a growth cycle for 2 updates, has 2 mechanics that doesn’t help it survive, and is missing a core mechanic that would actually help it.

Smaller predators also need smaller prey. If everything was mid tier and bigger, carno would have trouble hunting them since it’s both the fastest Dino and needs to fight things bigger than itself. Utah would be solely reliant on large packs.

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If the smaller Dinos had interesting playstyles, many people would play them. Granted, many people would also gravitate towards the big bois, but the smalls allow for much more impactful and unique mechanics. Our smalls are just lacking core mechanics that make them interesting and are being left on the back burner.

frail bobcat
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large dinos just have to be very difficult to grow, there is a reason why there are not so many biggos in real life

old hull
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if they actually difficult to grow and not just longer then yes that could work

hasty coyote
frail bobcat
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i think if apexes are adult they need to be difficult to maintain. So its an unforgiving playstyle. Like, oh you are a rex, better not fail a hunt or you risk starving if you cant find some corpses to scavenge. Apexes should take skill to keep alive

hasty coyote
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It’s mainly that the devs are making choices that favor the big bois while hurting the smalls, then just turning a blind eye to it. Then they go and say that they want to balance the smalls before adding the big ones, while actively doing nothing for the smalls.

frail bobcat
hasty coyote
frail bobcat
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competition with other herbies would be actually cool

hasty coyote
frail bobcat
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they nerfed it in update 5

hasty coyote
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Pls no more carnos sprinting through forest with in game wall hacks

frail bobcat
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so pretty good I think

hasty coyote
# frail bobcat competition with other herbies would be actually cool

That is also something I’m looking forward to, and it’s simple to do. Just limit food and make different species share food. Stegos won’t share pumpkins with everyone if they can barely feed themselves. Also I’m hoping there’s going to be more non-lethal in-fighting, like how pachies can parry each other.

hasty coyote
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The cones force you to run in a straight line because any turn you make just allows them to travel diagonally and reach you faster. But if you run in a straight line, they will still reach you because the predators are faster.

hollow canyon
frail bobcat
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then they should stop playing on no rules servers

tranquil pawn
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you don't understand the isle community, they cry and bitch about playing the game and having shit happen to them XD

old hull
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if you do have competition between herbies it better be between 2 species that can actually fight eachother otherwise you will just get 1 species shitting on the other

dusky surge
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@livid spindle it DOES have a 500 attack power, wdym

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movement doesnt change that damage

livid spindle
dusky surge
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thats entirely untrue

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it will continue to be 500

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movement changes nothing

livid spindle
dusky surge
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far more likely to be the result of locational damage

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legs take around 75% damage, which would be around 375, which perfectly explains why you're getting that damage

livid spindle
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Will this happen?

dusky surge
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wdym will this happen

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yes?

livid spindle
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And, deino often fails to kill utah and pachy at once. My pachy escaped with a small amount of health after being attacked by deino. I think it didn't hit the tail.

dusky surge
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pachy takes 75% damage to headshots

livid spindle
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OK, I see. Thank you.

ivory wolf
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They could give utahs better stam since they are at the end of the food chain

hasty coyote
ivory wolf
hasty coyote
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That’s generally how it’s supposed to be. Utah probably has one of the highest skill floors and ceilings of any of the dinos. If you play it right, you can basically never get hit, but mistakes can be punished easily. And utah has a hard time soloing teno and pachy because utah is both smaller and faster than them, you generally need 2 to kill them. Plus, utah is suffering from a broken pounce, so if it gets buffed, it might be overtuned.

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Plus, dryo and hypsi are supposed to exist for Utah. But the devs aren’t helping them atm, so they don’t exist.

ivory wolf
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I agree. But still, for example we were 9vs1 carno and we couldnt get a single pounce on him because he kept running, when his stamina drained we were too low on stam to pounce him and then he just kept walking while we were resting

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So it was impossible to kill him even though we had the numbers

hasty coyote
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Yeah, and he should have the chance to run. Carno is the fastest thing in the game, so it’s able to choose what it does and doesn’t want to fight. Just being spotted by someone should never just be instant death. The general balance of this game is “can’t fight? Run. Can’t run? Fight” dinos should have the ability to fight or run from any situation (within reason).

One tip I have for carnos is to bait them into a false sense of confidence. Just send a single raptor to bait him, most carnos are very cocky and will just chase. Then ambush them. A single pounce is all it takes to force the carno to fight, running would make it lose too much blood.

hollow canyon
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I think that there should absolutely be things that hunt Carno - they just shouldn't hunt it by running it down, they should just endurance hunt it.

hasty coyote
hollow canyon
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ngl Utah is most likely already op, it's just the pounce being as broken as it is that's holding it back

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the bleed on the pounce is just... something else

fresh laurel
hollow canyon
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It's ok imo

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I honestly kind of think that the endlag isn't even necessary for Utah's pounce anymore but I'm not entirely sure about that

fresh laurel
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would that just make it so its more about getting utah on its dismount or...?

hollow canyon
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I think Utah's pounce needed the recovery animation after missing the pounce back when it had a much larger stamina pool and was just all around much stronger

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I don't think it's necessary now

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although I might be wrong here

fresh laurel
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I can see that but wouldnt the bleed stacking still be quite op to make up for the nerfs?

hollow canyon
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it likely would, Utah's bleed is indeed op

fresh laurel
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I mean I saw a video of update 5 where a Utah pack managed to do a great bleed stack that ended said Teno pretty quick

hollow canyon
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Yea no surprise with that many Utahs pouncing him

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ngl pounce is a toxic piece of garbage when it works(let me rephrase that - it'd BE a toxic piece of garbage... if it worked as intended and Utah could actually dismount safely, there are reasons why Filipe stated that they don't really want Utah to be able to dismount from a Stego completely safely)

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if it did work as intended Utah would likely be the most overpowered animal in the game

hexed sorrel
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late, but honestly carno isnt a runner, just because its fast doesnt mean it has to be a runner, it has a ram attack, so clearly its an ambush predator, for example, would you take a cheetah as a runner? no because it can't keep up its pace for long, 1 min is actually generous if 55.5 km is its max sprint speed

glass hornet
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k

hollow canyon
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"would you take a cheetas as a runner?" - yes? I think that's the go to animal to put forth as a runner when people ask for animals that are good at running?

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not that I think Carno should have a good stamina, it should be asthmatic and vulnerable to endurance hunting

hexed sorrel
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if a carnivore cant run it would be utterly useless

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a runner for me is something that has high endurance, like humans, wolves, dogs etc

hollow canyon
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For me it's something that just runs fast

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If you were to ask me if Usain Bolt is a runner - yea, he is

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like

hexed sorrel
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???

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I mean he aint fast compared to animals

hollow canyon
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He is fast for a human

hexed sorrel
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ambush predators need to be fast

hollow canyon
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I'd definitely call him a runner

hexed sorrel
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so what is the difference between ambush predators and runners?

hollow canyon
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Not necessarily, Deino is an ambush predator - it's slow like hell

hexed sorrel
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doesnt apply

hollow canyon
hexed sorrel
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it has the advantage of stealth

hollow canyon
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runners can be ambush predators but again - don't have to be

hexed sorrel
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because it is in water

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would make it OP

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no ambush predator which can end a herbivores life within minutes can run for longer than 3 minutes

hollow canyon
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that doesn't make it not a runner though

hexed sorrel
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thats your opinion

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its like me saying carno is a bleeder

hollow canyon
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yea we clearly define the word "runner" just differently

hexed sorrel
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yes, it can bleed

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obviouslybut it doesnt kill things with bleed mos of the time

hollow canyon
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Saying that Carno or Cheetah "can run" is a bit of an understatement

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yea it kills things by running them down and mauling them

hexed sorrel
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well they need to be fast thats their whole ambush aspect

hexed sorrel
hollow canyon
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Yea, precisely

hexed sorrel
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that defeats the whole purpose of ram

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it should ram and kill herbivores within seconds

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because it is used as an ambush predator

hollow canyon
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Carnos are trash at ambushing, they are loud, crouch very slowly and need to maintain a decent distance from their target to be able to use their charge - all around, a pretty garbage ambush predator in comparison to something like Deino

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Hell even Utah is in a way a better ambush predator since it crouches faster, can sneak up on things much easier and then instagib them with pounce

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at point blank with little to no counterplay

hexed sorrel
hexed sorrel
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Also the fact that utah is severely underpowered

hollow canyon
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And Carno can indeed be played as an ambush predator but so can just about every other animal, I've sneaked up on Utahs and Carnos as a Tenonto before and ambushed them killing some in the process yet I don't think that makes Tenonto an ambush hunter(or any other kind of hunter for that matter)

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I do agree that Utah isn't necessarily a very good ambush predator right now but that's more so caused by the roster than anything else. Everything is simply larger than it(on purpose, because if Pachy was same size as Utah then the raptor could just instakill it with pounce)

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By the very design of the playable Utah is a better ambush predator than Carno for all the reasons I've outlined above. Carno's stats and abilities don't fit an ambush hunter(which it shouldn't be anyways, there are better animals to occupy that niche).

golden coral
hasty coyote
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The main thing making utah “underpowered” is a broken pounce. If it was actually consistent, utah would be very strong.

hollow canyon
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^

fresh laurel
hollow canyon
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Yea cause it's broken

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if it wasn't Utah would be absurdly good

fresh laurel
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no im saying for dismount

hollow canyon
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oh, well - argue with Filipe about that

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he specifically said that he doesn't think Utah should be able to safely dismount from a Stego

fresh laurel
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eh

golden coral
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Well, at some point the utah has to be vunerable, be it during mount, dismount, or while on the target or something. Not sure it's good to have an ability where you are never in any real danger unless said ability bugs out and kills you due to that.

alpine plover
fresh laurel
alpine plover
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At least how Utah "should" play considering it's supposed to pack hunt

fresh laurel
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Also not sure how Tenos would disengage if Utah can easily keep the chase

alpine plover
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The adults definitely could've
At the end one of them came back to fight

fresh laurel
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True

alpine plover
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To their demise, which was their play

fresh laurel
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Maybe they wanted to die with a flash Idk

alpine plover
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Holding their ground was definitely not the play against that many Utahs

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Unless they could land every single attack for most of the trades, which some players can pull off

fresh laurel
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Too many targets to try and stun lol

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When you manage to go for the kill on utah, the rest can start pouncing

alpine plover
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Right, so if there's that many targets, they should've respected them.
I am hopeful that Utah isn't fodder unless you're among the top players now

fresh laurel
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So basically make Utah more beginner friendly?

alpine plover
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Essentially yes if it's across the board not performing on average

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Either that or make it the skill gap playable and buff the bleed, pounce potential even moreso
Though I imagine people would have contention with that

fresh laurel
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I mean I normally see most Utahs hunts end with 90% of the pack dead lmao

alpine plover
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So we're going with the former it seems

alpine plover
fresh laurel
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Utah compared to other things feels like the skill needed is too much...

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You can normally pick up an adult teno, pachy, stego, deino, and possibly carno while perfoming quite well

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But Utah to feel confident in hunting you gotta become a slippy Utah

alpine plover
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Right, and everything performed much better for lesser skill gaps
That's why packs always get decimated in 1-2 hunts

fresh laurel
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How would one make utah skill gap a bit easier?

alpine plover
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It seems it already is

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By reducing the missing Utah pounce delay

fresh laurel
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update 5 videos reduced utah pounce miss endlag so thats something
(beat me to it)

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Though I would say finding a Utah pack these days can feel a bit hard or maybe im unlucky

alpine plover
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In the current build, yes
Because they all get decimated pretty quick

fresh laurel
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Ngl I find current chat pretty horrible for pack hunters

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Pack hunting needs quick group decisions and to have to stop and type every moment is just eh...

alpine plover
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I did bring up a ping system similarly to Apex

fresh laurel
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Kinda screws Utah a bit to not be in a vc at times

frail bobcat
fresh laurel
alpine plover
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Same thing
It could give the f key a function

fresh laurel
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Anyways just some buttons that quickly say I need stam or go left or right would be nice

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special ones for some dinos could be, im about to pounce!

golden coral
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Or you could just talk it through before a hunt and have some sense of how to go about things.. :p Also, you can not just "pick up teno and do good", it's probably the one critter that demands the most from the player to be good with, with pachy and utah coming next, and then carno, if we're talking about those that actually has something useful and interesting to do in combat.

alpine plover
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Yeah, intuitive ping systems are already in several other games as an example/model
It wouldn't hurt anybody and just make communication significantly easier

fresh laurel
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I would also argue teno is easier to play than Utah

alpine plover
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It'd help people that have trouble with speech problems too
Give them more tools to work with since they cant vc moment to moment

thin mantle
fresh laurel
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You can say chatting about what to do in the hunt would work but still doesnt beat just talking in a vc

golden coral
alpine plover
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Though this is more personal, I have a friend with speech problems
Ping systems do a lot for her when it comes to playing games

golden coral
fresh laurel
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Eh Teno imo was easier to try first but to each their own

thin mantle
golden coral
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And you're right, VC is clearly superior, no matter what you're up to, hunting, defending, scouting.. :p

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But that's.. an issue all of it's own really

golden coral
fresh laurel
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Utah with a working pounce can be good but its all about team work unlike the others

golden coral
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Anyway, I would argue that you can work quite well even without VC, even without chatting really, if you have a sense of how your playable works, how you go about using it, and so on

fresh laurel
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I find vc the quickest so bring chat to be a bit closer in speed with vc and it might help players more

golden coral
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But I mean, I don't think any of us disagrees that VC is ever so useful, more so that it's not.. needed per say

thin mantle
fresh laurel
alpine plover
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I think Stego is a bad example
The range and damage makes it more technical for defense, especially for juvies.
Sometimes you have to helplessly watch them get bit while you try bite them back

thin mantle
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Utah doesn't actually have to defend against threats because of it's mobility

fresh laurel
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Utah alone fighting things bigger than a pachy requires a good amount of skill so...

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comes to skill at that point

alpine plover
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Ehhh, Utah is a carnivore though
If it was a Herbi, it'd definitely be a super valid pick for it's mobility. Though ultimately it eventually has to hunt another playable

golden coral
fresh laurel
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Anyways can we go back to talking about how ingame chat pales in comparison to vc?

alpine plover
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It pales pretty bad

thin mantle
alpine plover
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I'm all for the ping system

fresh laurel
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same

golden coral
fresh laurel
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anything that lets you say things quicker for a pack hunt would be nice

alpine plover
fresh laurel
alpine plover
fresh laurel
#

imagine not being able to talk or call a friend at all because they are playing the isle 💀

thin mantle
alpine plover
#

For now that is the case

golden coral
# alpine plover You trolling

I am serious as it were Nacen. I despise the whole using outside programs for ingame usage, simple as that. Of course I understand that's not doable, but I wish it were. :p

fresh laurel
#

Just give Utahs their own ingame vc ggez TI_Troll

#

problem solved

alpine plover
#

Oh my God
The macro of such a change could effect more then you can even imagine

thin mantle
#

I can't imagine disabling discord would do much, people would just move to other forms of VC....aside from the impossibility of that feature anyway

fresh laurel
#

jokes aside bringing chat closer to vc would really help those who dont like vc or are uncomfortable with it

thin mantle
#

Regardless of the potential benefitsTI_Succ

fresh laurel
#

just saying

fresh laurel
alpine plover
#

Bro, Skype...

fresh laurel
#

No discord? Use Skype

#

No skype? Use Whatsapp or something

alpine plover
#

Call eachother using cellphones

#

Facetime

fresh laurel
#

imagine needing someones number smh

thin mantle
#

Fucking Zoom lol

alpine plover
#

Twitter spaces

fresh laurel
alpine plover
#

Lmao, it'd def happen 100%

thin mantle
#

Exchanges phone number through chat xD

golden coral
#

I mean, if you want to actually call people up on your cellphone, then you know, fine. At least that'd cost you something xD

fresh laurel
#

so my phone number is...

alpine plover
#

Discord takes the electricity bill tho

fresh laurel
#

whats yours? We need to fight those carnos man so be quick

alpine plover
#

You can call on wifi

fresh laurel
#

everything uses wifi or electricity if it relates to the isle vc-

alpine plover
#

We went way off topic

fresh laurel
#

not really

#

we were talking about vc so...

alpine plover
#

Kinda, we started from ping systems

#

No, we started from Utah's actually being formidable now

fresh laurel
#

lol

#

Still wish Utah bite was more worth the risk-

#

I mean risk is death for doing barely a chip of damage to the enemy

alpine plover
fresh laurel
#

late ping ayo?...

alpine plover
#

Yuh

golden coral
#

Remove distance pounce, keep the point blank one

fresh laurel
#

huh?

alpine plover
#

You sure? It'd look kinda janky hunting larger creatures

fresh laurel
#

You mean like having to get close to pounce?

#

Anyways I have amazing idea... TI_Troll

alpine plover
#

What is it

fresh laurel
#

Make the pounce jump not take stam TI_Troll

#

What could go wrong really

alpine plover
#

Hmm

fresh laurel
#

Its not good enough to be a proper jump

#

you spend your actual pounce on the latching

#

so the pounce jump taking stam?...

alpine plover
#

Well, the pounce we have now could be a "button combo"
While the new pounce could be Erik's idea

fresh laurel
#

Would be neat

alpine plover
#

Therefore it wouldn't be jank

fresh laurel
#

while removing the pounce button stam cost unless you are latching or pinning

#

I mean I see no big reason to keep pounce jump taking stam really

alpine plover
#

Since the jump already takes stam

fresh laurel
#

yup

#

I mean even now

alpine plover
#

Jump doesn't have much utility either other than hopping on safe areas

fresh laurel
#

Jumping is a life saver ngl

#

Also I have a question?...

alpine plover
#

Sure, shoot

fresh laurel
#

If the devs reduced Utah endlag for falling off during a buck would that really be game breaking since Utah is already dead either way with no stam?

#

Just throwing the idea out there

golden coral
alpine plover
#

Ehh, I don't think so tbh
It's pretty fucked once it has zero stam, even when dismounting, it's done for if it can't sprint

thin mantle
golden coral
#

If it's dead anyway, I think the falling off anim is fine. You're supposed to die at that point I think.

golden coral
alpine plover
#

TI should have Clamber as a universal feature ngl
The Climbers having the best Clamber in the game

golden coral
#

Or better yet, have a brace/buck mechanic, but that's fancy

fresh laurel
thin mantle
#

Just something more engaging than "hold E"

golden coral
alpine plover
#

True, I had critiques for Buck for quite some time

golden coral
#

Since I think that was Nacens point, that a point blank would look weird

fresh laurel
alpine plover
#

Movement or turning radius should affect Buck

thin mantle
golden coral
fresh laurel
alpine plover
#

Buck can work against you if you're improperly using it.

fresh laurel
#

Would you lose 90% of your stam before even pouncing? XD

alpine plover
#

Hitbox placements should affect buck too, if you land in a bad spot, easier to buck off
Near a great spot, more tough to do. Therefore Pounce isn't a guaranteed blast on blood unless they're really sniping you good.

fresh laurel
alpine plover
#

Yeah, bucking and immediately be able to punish, kind of like current running buck

thin mantle
fresh laurel
golden coral
fresh laurel
alpine plover
#

That's included in the suggestion

alpine plover
golden coral
fresh laurel
#

if it sits then your pack will pounce it more

#

so...

golden coral
alpine plover
#

Some playables get hit harder than others
Say, some playables with a big tail like Teno, is pretty okay taking a pounce on it's tail.

fresh laurel
golden coral
#

Never made sense to me that you can buck and run honestly

fresh laurel
#

May I remind yall that 2 full grown Utahs can pounce pachy but dont even reduce its movement speed

golden coral
#

Like, either you're focused on bucking, or moving

fresh laurel
#

Bucking while running should at least take much more of your own stam imo

alpine plover
#

Moving while Pounced should slow you too, you gotta buck em off. They earned it by landing on you to slow it down.

fresh laurel
#

I mean shaking your body while running like crazy to get a almost 1000 pound utah off you is a bit weird

golden coral
#

I'm glad we're all at least agreeing that current pounce/buck interaction is.. lacking :p

fresh laurel
#

Yes I use pounds so cope.

alpine plover
fresh laurel
alpine plover
#

You guys realize by changing this one interaction can be implemented into several facets of the game as well
Such as grappling mechanics, or universal combat

fresh laurel
#

Werent we told by one of the devs or something that they would try to make utah pouncing pachy look a bit more realistic so Utah doesnt just look weightless?...

fresh laurel
#

I mean Utah is the base for all things to come later on

golden coral
#

And then we have deino xD

alpine plover
#

Utah, Teno, Carno, Pachy (maybe Deino) are

#

Stego was a cheap add on

frail bobcat
golden coral
#

Too early, and too "AI" :p

fresh laurel
alpine plover
#

Nah, it doesn't have it's proper kit either

fresh laurel
#

Man can we at least get more ways to survive a deino grab? Feels like a Beast of Bermuda Mosa grab that has no counterplay

alpine plover
#

We're talking about Deino's ambush grab
That's the first grab type we've ever seen in this game
It can be implemented even in Carno/Teno engagements

fresh laurel
#

Possibly

#

but Carno mouth im not sure would be great at grabbing like that but at the same time I know nothing about it lol

frail bobcat
alpine plover
#

I'm all for reducing the current bite system to reduced amounts altogether for better mechanics. The driveby gameplay in general doesn't do it for me unless we're talking about Pachy or Carno charges

fresh laurel
#

what if

#

actually nvm

alpine plover
fresh laurel
#

actually

alpine plover
#

I'm in favour of adding slight staggers, like in current melee focused games
And nerfing the current bites by 50% for more jousting or robust type attacks with slight staggers

fresh laurel
#

what if when Deino loses all its stamina when trying to drown something it gets some sort of endlag? This would help stop deino from just biting you to death after failing its lunge

frail bobcat
fresh laurel
#

I mean there should be more survival chances of a deino attack and thats one way to go about it

alpine plover
fresh laurel
#

Also why do some things lose stamina when being held by Deino?...

frail bobcat
#

I think small dinos shouldnt have a chance to break free tho (except for stamina running out),

fresh laurel
#

Never really got it since it just makes sure you die even after deino fails the lunge

fresh laurel
frail bobcat
fresh laurel
#

Jokes on you Gators are smaller irl

frail bobcat
alpine plover
#

I think there should be a struggle gauge, like if you move too quickly, it could raise a stress bar to break and cause "endlag" Causing you to lose an ambush
So if you grab a dino, try to sprint back to water. The stress bar gets too high and you get stunned from "exhaustion". You can buck as the captured prey, but if they got you by the head, or if the weight is so wide apart. The stress bar doesn't matter.
The same systems discussed from Pounce/bucking could be applied to this.

fresh laurel
alpine plover
#

I'm a genius

fresh laurel
#

I refuse to elaborate.

frail bobcat
fresh laurel
#

You would think having a raptor forcefully fall off you would leave some pretty bad wounds due to the claws coming off wrong

alpine plover
#

You got a bar when you ambush as a deino, move too quick it gets high, if they buck too much, it gets high.
If the bar gets high enough, you get stunned as deino.
If you land a headshot, or grab a tiny guy. The bar is moot.

#

Therefore, "Wrestle mechanics"

fresh laurel
#

ah ok

alpine plover
#

Tadaaaaaaaaa

#

I figured out a mechanic

frail bobcat
fresh laurel
#

sus

frail bobcat
alpine plover
#

Same could be done for Allo grapple, Apex battles, etc

#

Therefore

fresh laurel
#

Lets give Utah cc

alpine plover
#

I'm a genius

fresh laurel
#

Utah should get cc TI_Troll

frail bobcat
alpine plover
#

Hey man, I'm cooking up the ideas in the oven here

#

Dissect to improve it, or come up with a better idea

#

You know what

fresh laurel
#

way point system

#

Mark a tree or area and you can see it for far distances. Would be helpful for when you found a spot you like and want to return to it after going somewhere far for something

alpine plover
#

Erik's idea of bucking requiring "cycles" or some sort of movement with buck
And the "Stress Wrestle" mechanics can work hand in hand.
Bucking shouldn't even drain stam to a Utah(unless it's successfully bucking as punishment for the Utah not working against it), rather it should increase the stress bar to immediately buck off a stubborn Utah to fall off.
The stam would be reserved to the actual pounce continuous application

#

It could be a blue or highlighted bar on the stam gauge, or below
Or a visual indicator on the stam bar that increasingly gets more violent in visual cues.

#

Sprinting while pounced can increase the stress bar too for both parties
So a Teno/Pachy could be knocked down for continuously sprinting pounced, or pounced by several Utah's and unsuccessfully bucking.

#

Adding the stress bar to be inherently tied to the knockdown, stuns, staggers too

You could implement hard or soft knockdowns too
Soft knockdowns are where you can sprawl up or still, alt attack/bite in limited range until you can get back up.
Sprinting while being bitten repeatedly adds stress to being staggered.
While Hard knockdowns are current knockdowns where you're completely just down.

fresh laurel
#

sounds neat

tranquil pawn
#

very nice

#

dryo shouldn't climb because that invalidates hypsi, dryo should be burrow boi

alpine plover
#

Right, in soft knockdown, you'd be able to still defend yourself
But protect your rear flank as poor as a deino.

alpine plover
tranquil pawn
alpine plover
#

bruh

tranquil pawn
#

lol

alpine plover
#

Tbf does Hypsi even have front claws

#

They seem tiny

tranquil pawn
#

lil hands

alpine plover
#

Unless it's a slow climber

tranquil pawn
#

but herra's claws though TI_Perfect

alpine plover
#

Cause the small weight will aide it in climbing

#

Herrara in it's current iteration looks suited for the job

#

I wouldn't be against for several or more creatures climbing as long as it's Herrera's domain.

frail bobcat
#

@🐺Oni Gingitsune Kitsune🐺#9669 dryo is not easy to catch btw. I only catch dryos when they make mistakes

#

you cant @ this dude

alpine plover
#

Ngl, unless we're getting Noct Dryo

#

Dryo is a bad playable

#

Though this seems suited for general feedback rather than balance

frail bobcat
#

then its good

hexed sorrel
hexed sorrel
azure crescent
#

you're underestimating how good pounce is if it works

#

also why would you bite the animal made to hunt things like you to death

#

also utah has an amazing biteforce for its size

#

if utah's stats were scaled up to the point where its weight matches carno's, it would have a 220 biteforce

#

if you do it the other way around, carno would have a ~44 biteforce in the size of utah

#

so no, the bite isn't bad, it's just not made to hunt things much larger than a pachy with it

dusky surge
#

besides, utah shouldnt even be focused on raw damage, bleed should be its core way of killing

azure crescent
#

among smalls utah is the beast of raw damage though

#

it can like 10 shot a pachy

dusky surge
#

if anything, carno's bleed is too good with its bite tbh

azure crescent
#

this is true

dusky surge
#

no need for it to be such an effective bleeder

azure crescent
#

honestly carno's bleed just makes fights worse

#

you're a pachy successfully defending yourself but you got bit once so now you're at like half blood

hexed sorrel
frail bobcat
#

utah bite is useless against stronger opponents

dusky surge
#

i dont think that's true at all

#

there's a youtube channel of a utah that can fell adult tenos using absolutely no pounce

hexed sorrel
dusky surge
#

i think so?

hexed sorrel
#

you need tremendous skill to do that

#

heck I saw a youtube channel kill a carno with bites

somber sphinx
hexed sorrel
#

a minority of hyper skilled utahs dont apply haha

azure crescent
hexed sorrel
#

you need skill to kill the teno, and the teno needs to not use claw basically, if the teno sticks to claw utah cannot win unless the teno is lagging or out of stamina

dusky surge
#

@fierce crypt stego isnt basically an apex, it outright is an apex. Also cera stands absolutely no chance against a stego tbh

fierce crypt
#

Well Cera was stegos predator

#

So was Allo

dusky surge
#

in what world was cera stego's predator lmao, unless we're talking juvis or below

#

cera was WAAAYY too small to stand a possible meaningful threat to stego

fierce crypt
#

That's because legacy stego is stupid

#

Also you are forgetting Cera will have new mechanics

dusky surge
#

i know it will have new mechanics, but it'll also be smaller than a carno lmao

#

(likely will, anyway)

fierce crypt
#

Same as allo

dusky surge
#

cera irl was quite a small animal in comparison to many dinosaurs

#

allo is smaller than a carno???

fierce crypt
#

But cannot is not even that strong either

#

Carno

#

Not connot

#

Autocorrecter

mental roost
#

Our Cerato is probably going to be below 1600 kg(Probably either 1000 kg- to maybe 1300 kg which makes me wonder if they're going to give it higher than normal damage resistance to help it bully animals off kills a little bit better).

Note that Cerato doesn't really have a pounce either, and probably isn't the ideal choice for hunting large game--I don't know what the devs want it to hunt personally but I'd like to know what the ideal prey is for it, because I'd rather it not be a miniaturized Jack Horner Rex

dusky surge
#

cerato will def be one-tapped to the head by a stego too

#

on top of this, it's probably going to end up being a defensive bully type, which doesn't seem ideal as a niche to go against stego

fierce crypt
#

I mean Hypotheticly stego will be able to 1 tap everything In the head...

#

Including rex

dusky surge
#

not in the Isle, no

fierce crypt
#

In evrima

dusky surge
#

not in evrima either

golden coral
#

Plenty of things that'll have sufficient health in the game to not be one or even twotapped by a stego. And nor should they be, that sort of fight just isn't fun anyway.

fierce crypt
#

Well realistically

golden coral
#

But just look at deino, it can certainly take more than two hits to the head and be fine.

dusky surge
#

we aren't speaking realistically

#

we're speaking about a video game

fierce crypt
#

Ah ok

#

But hypotheticly stego would've been OP

dusky surge
#

hypothetically any animal would've been OP I fail to see the point being made here

#

cerato would not be a good predator to stegosaurus, knowing what we know about the game, it's mechanics and so on

golden coral
mental roost
dusky surge
#

cerato would make quick work of a smaller stego, sure, but my certainty in its capabilities start to dwindle past the stego's sub stage

mental roost
#

I'd think after the stego reaches 1600 ish kg is when things get increasingly worse and worse for the Cerato..

#

anything below 900 kg I think is fair game(be afraid of the side jab)

dusky surge
#

1600kg stego v cerato seems pretty cera-sided to me tbh

mental roost
#

I'd still honestly be pretty worried about getting hit, depending upon how big they make an adult Cerato.

#

It surely has something up its sleeve at bare minimum.

#

But even a 1600kg stego would probably be pretty scary if you don't keep track of things.

fierce crypt
#

Cera could be population control for younger or like 50-75 percent grown steg

tranquil pawn
#

isn't that carno?

fierce crypt
#

.

eager ledge
#

Also if wondering what I ment when I talk about neck attachments I ment the muscle attachments and vertebrae weren’t thick or strong enough to ram if it were to ram it’s head it would snap its own neck because it’s not robust enough that is why as a compromise between realism and game attack ability I believe they should add the slight damage feature when it rams now I hope I was able to explain in more detail

IMG_0228.png
dreamy fiber
#

The game isn't really realistic in plenty of ways regarding its mechanics and how the animals function so giving recoil to the charge is dumb. Why should it have an ability that hurts itself when nothing else does in a maybe semi-realistic game?

celest copper
# dreamy fiber The game isn't really realistic in plenty of ways regarding its mechanics and ho...

I have to agree, adding to that we have people mixpacking; which the devs do not have much control over. Because people are behind the mixcpacking. Also the fact that there; I can't do this there are many things out of balance at the moment I made a list of what is balanced and what needs to be buffed and nerfed in the Balance-feedback channel. No body likes a challenge when it comes to their mains being nerfed necessarily

#

It's this type of stuff that annoys me, I cannot wait for the latch and tear mechanic (gore) I believe to immerse the game a little

20220607082854_1.jpg
dreamy fiber
#

Latch and tear will be cool. Pesky also did a video about balancing. I think his ideas are better though. When one thing gets buff or nerf everything else is affected, so I'd expect everything so shift at least little.
He also did a fantastic Job of explaining every match up in combat, at least in perfect conditions. Cause I mean
Let's face it, the devs aren't good t balancing. It's been a weak point before and it's a weak point now

dusky surge
#

i found pesky's video to leave out extremely important parts of the game or make some BIZARRE concepts

#

i wasnt a complete fan

#

my biggest gripes were

  • just forgetting alt-bite existed outside of pachy
  • nerfing the hell out of apex weights to a comedic degree
  • having stego be killed by carno what????
hollow canyon
#

For what it's worth - Utahraptor wouldn't be pouncing like that and Tenontosaurus would be absolute fodder so idk if we really want to be so strict with realism.

eager ledge
hollow canyon
#

Wat.... Pachy isn't ramming steel

#

The current consensus is that it likely used its head more so like a club, hitting with its sides more so than just running headfirst into things

#

it wasn't able to do that, it's not a very robust animal either

eager ledge
hollow canyon
#

I mean - sure they do, so does Carno and both Carno and Pachy would regret attempting that very quickly

#

Idk where you're getting the idea that this animal is robust

unknown.png
eager ledge
hollow canyon
#

Pachy might survive the impact simply because it wouldn't be able to create anywhere near as much momentum as an animal 4 times its size. If it was as big as Carno it and could run as fast it wouldn't be surviving that either.

#

In general I don't think there's any dinosaur that is currently believed to have been capable of charging stuff head-first. This includes Triceratops.

eager ledge
hollow canyon
#

And don't get me wrong I think that charge fits Carno about as well as chocolate fits a ham sandwich. I'm pretty sure the only reason it was given this ability was because of its horns.

#

It makes completely no sense for it considering the rest of Carno's kit, its stats and what it's supposed to be doing.

#

But theropod with horns go brrr I guess

eager ledge
hollow canyon
#

You would never want to use this ability then

#

it's already pretty garbage

#

You are playing the fastest animal in the game which also turns like hot garbage... what should its ability be? Let's give it something that will make it move even faster and turn even worse.

eager ledge
eager ledge
hollow canyon
#

If we were to make compromises between reality and game then tenonto would be doing very little damage to... well basically anything and everything really.

#

A single Utah would likely be killing this animal

#

Stego would be oneshotting the whole roster(maybe except itself and Deino) pretty much upon reaching full adult.

#

Again - Utah wouldn't be pouncing stuff

#

Tenonto wouldn't be tailslamming stuff

#

it's just idk why you would want to make a compromise between reality and game in such a weird way

#

As for it taking like 50 dmg - it probably wouldn't matter much but it would make this niche ability even more niche to be honest.

dreamy fiber
# dusky surge my biggest gripes were - just forgetting alt-bite existed outside of pachy - ner...

Two of those point were just about stego.

Alt. Bite can be consisted now, it likely wouldn't change the outcome much.

The stego weight was only nerfed as he clarified, because the devs have tied weight and health together. If those were separated the weight wouldn't have to change. The stego doesn't deserve a massive health pool. It's not a heavily armoured animal anyway.

Stego killed by Carno was also clarified that it was due to the current roster. And I think that's a fair argument to make. If stego doesn't fit in with the current roster, it shouldn't bloody be there. And it doesn't, so some alternative should be devised until a later date

dusky surge
#

in his video, he makes a big deal about how utah can no longer one-shot a ptera, yet based on how alt-bite works, it could easily still do so with an alt-bite

dreamy fiber
#

I know that, but it's not bucket loads more. It's not game-changing. And frankly, I don't personally care if utah can one shot ptera or not.

If someone knows they can alt bite to do so, then that's good game knowledge

dusky surge
#

also it wasn't due to the current roster because pesky went on to drill down on the fact that as the roster expands, carno would STILL be killing stegos

dreamy fiber
#

Still maybe kill a stego. But that's more of a skill issue than a casual player base sort of kill

dusky surge
#

its kind of a big deal when you think about it

dreamy fiber
#

It does pose some issues for some match ups that were drawn out, but not all. I do not consider the alt bite a significant issue for the balancing overall since most things that would suffer significantly from the alt bite are already in a bad matchup they probably shouldn't be taking, I. E. Utah v carno

dusky surge
#

i still find the concepts of a 4500kg stego absolutely ridiculous. Just makes it a pain when adding new animals, because at some point, you gotta give it back its old weight and then all of the matchups you made for the smaller animals to fight stego are out the window

#

unless we're downsizing every single apex to stay in line with stego and deino's new reduced weights, which would suck even more

#

utahs who are used to killing stegos suddenly have to deal with a 1.5 ton buff and a complete shift to the matchup

#

or rex gets added and ends up being puny compared to irl estimates because stego and deino got the reduction treatment so it should too

hollow canyon
#

It's like upsizing Magyarosaurus - you just turn it into a different sauropod by doing that

dusky surge
#

exactly, i just dislike the premise of downsizing the apexes so they can be inline with everyone else

hollow canyon
#

There are stegosaurus that are in that weight range but Stegosaurus itself is larger than that

#

I find it nonsensical to change the sizes of animals to such that they are corresponding to actually existing animals

#

in that case just remove the goddamn animal from the roster and introduce the one you really want to have on it

#

Want a 4t Stego? You really want a Wuerhosaurus, not a Stegosaurus. Want a very large Magy? You basically want a Saltasaurus and not a Magyarosaurus.

inner lynx
#

You're not really getting a real animal regardless.

#

Like, sure utahraptor is near its accurate estimates, but it doesn't portray the real animal in the slightest besides proportions.

hollow canyon
#

With some of them - yea, with others it's a different story. This animal is really inconsistent with the design of its playables having some of them actually reasonably accurate, others awesomebro-ish and then some that are just... taken out of POkemon or something.

hollow canyon
inner lynx
#

I like the ring of Apolloraptor.

hollow canyon
#

Sounds ok to me

inner lynx
#

The new utahraptor is a long ways from being a real thing from what I've heard.

dreamy fiber
# dusky surge utahs who are used to killing stegos suddenly have to deal with a 1.5 ton buff a...

The smaller matchup for stego once upper should go out the wi ndow if that's the direction the devs want to take it.
I don't particularly fancy 4.5k stego either but as it is now its bad for the health of the game and that should take priority over fat stego.

Besides, I said before in like this threat or another the Isle isnt realistic. Its more like a game which takes concepts found in reality and creates a blend between realism and gameplay enough to suspend disbelief. 4.5k stego as a temporary bandaid is hardly the worst realism crime in the Isle.

inner lynx
#

Having stego in right now is fine, it just needs to be hard to grow.

dusky surge
inner lynx
dreamy fiber
#

No. Being hard to grow to the devs means long growth times, largely which just isn't true. Long growth times often equate to afk players who just hide in a safe spot, which just results in more stegos than we should have because no one can find them and they just watched YouTube until they were big enough to not be threatened.

Stego is not okay as it is right now. It can swim back and fourth across rivers with very little regard for a fully adult deino. That's bad. Even as big of an animal is a stego is, it shouldn't be able to totally disregard the biggest threat currently in the water. Stegos will attempt to safelog while being attacked by their only main threat (which funnily is utahs lmao) because their health pool is so reliable.

But on top of all that, 4.5t stego was only ever considered because of the way Wright is tied to health. Weight should not be tied to health, its a terrible metric to use. You can be heavy because of fat or muscle, because you're armoured, because of your bone density or even that you have lots or ornaments.

dusky surge
#

it is LITERALLY the hardest animal to grow in the game

#

idk what more you want from it

inner lynx
#

It's pretty easy to grow something.

#

Unless, of course, you're bad at the game.

dusky surge
#

idk how much harder you can make growing without making it literally infuriating. What more could you possibly add

dreamy fiber
#

Depends what you consider hard. Deino takes longer and it's only other company is things that want to eat it lol

dusky surge
#

Deino takes the same duration to grow as stego

#

Also, it breezes through the first 50%

inner lynx
# dreamy fiber No. Being hard to grow to the devs means long growth times, largely which just i...

  1. Which is why the Devs need to consider AFK prevenatives, encourage gameplay throughout an animals life cycle, and somewhat force players to be active in the first place.

  2. I'd like to see if weight in water was reduced, since that's realistic. That means deino could lunge swimming stegos and drown them.

  3. When health was independent, it was a mess. I'm happier with weight being equivalent to health now.

dusky surge
#

deino, ironically, is one of the easiest animals to grow in the game, despite being on the same size range as its spiked counterpart

inner lynx
#

You can easily AFK grow stegos right now.

dusky surge
#

you can easily AFK grow any animal, stego is significantly harder tho

#

it needs to still travel all around to get its nutrients

#

also in the wide open

inner lynx
dreamy fiber
#

But it also can't lay a finger on the stego.
Cannibalism is rabid in it (which, to clarify, I believe it should be. Deino should be willing to eat each other)
Max duration for deino is 5, max for stego is 4. They about even out with the current system but that's also not. A guarantee...

calm ibex
#

Its only "harder" if you do perfect diet, but afking with 2 diets takes very little effort

inner lynx
old hull
#

i would not even say its hard it just takes forever

inner lynx
#

If juvenile stegos were constantly active throughout their growth, you'd see them die more, which is a good thing.

calm ibex
#

its hard in comparison to rest of the roster

#

deino for example u can just swim to nw waterfall and afk your entire growth never moving aside from nomming a fish

fleet vapor
old hull
#

its slightly different then teno , both are basically useless the second you get spotted when your a baby , its just stego takes over twice the time to become useful

fleet vapor
#

i take time to learn how to dodge and get punished for it

old hull
#

yeah thats our good buddy ol pal desync

fleet vapor
#

that has nothing to do with desync

inner lynx
#

My go-to to grow a stego is to spawn NW, fill up my food entirely on pumpkin diet and move southwards and cut east to run to center pretty safely all whilst carrying a pumpkin. I'll eat as much marigold as I can, and then find a bush near sumac to AFK grow. Despite little maintenance to my water and food cores, it's a mindless process.

old hull
#

server said you were in reach of his bite even tho on your end you were not , so you die

fleet vapor
#

and everything to do with HIT box

dusky surge
old hull
#

that is very much desync

dusky surge
#

not hitbox

dreamy fiber
#

Tbh most babies die once spotted, assuming the predator is actually like, bigger.

calm ibex
#

anyways, i like growth stego and would like it to be harder to grow, seeing apex level animals spammed to oblivion is boring

fleet vapor
#

either way its bs and needs to be fixed

old hull
#

he bit where you were , and server said that is where you are so you died

#

it is bs yes , and it happens constantly

dreamy fiber
old hull
#

carnos and stegos especially always hit you from miles away because of it

#

combine that with stegos dumb tail that does damage before actually connecting and it is infuriating to fight them

fleet vapor
#

i have around 50 clips like this all diff encounters

inner lynx
calm ibex
#

oh look at that, i do exact same route, very safe

fleet vapor
#

stego swinging and hitting me when im near its hind legs not where his spike tail can even impale me

inner lynx
fleet vapor
#

i could care less about nesting

#

when this is an issue

#

game could absolutely blow up if they could solve these issues

#

its already an attractive game

old hull
#

and yet here we are almost 2 years into evrima and it has never even been acknowledged

dusky surge
#

the fuck you mean its never been acknowledged lmao

#

i have seen it be acknowledged several times

old hull
#

good then , let it fixed finally

dusky surge
#

its... really not that simple

#

take it from someone who has WORKED in gamedev, that's a HUGE ask

fleet vapor
#

your right its not i just hope they can]

#

cuz their game succeeding depends on that

old hull
#

im sure it is not , but it has to be addressed eventually because they designed the combat to be extremely precise , so having even minor desync is always gonna be infuriating to deal with

#

its like getting shot around corners in shooters , it will always piss you off

fleet vapor
#

idc if they have to buckle down on stuff like if ur eu you cant join NA bcuz of ping issues could be harmful to game play experiences or really anything i just wanna be able to enjoy my fav dino Raptor and with such a small bite radius and desync and all that its pretty much impossible to ever beat a dino you should be able to with a pack

dreamy fiber
# dusky surge take it from someone who has WORKED in gamedev, that's a HUGE ask

It's not a huge ask. If they intend to rebalance the whole roster - yes. Will they? No.

Nerfing stego will upset stego mains. Does that make it difficult? No. Stego should at least have to worry about deino when crossing water (at adult). Carno doesn't have to regularly be killing it. Nor utah. But it should not be left as it is.

Fixing desync? That's hard af., but a necessity. Fixing the map collisions? Necessity. Fixing hit boxes? Necessity.
Even if those things are hard, tedious and time consuming they have to be done because they're the foundation of the game.

old hull
#

well on the bright side it looks like the next update is a bit less desyncy so thats good , sadly utahs pounce is even more broken then the current live build atm , if they fix that great if they dont then well utah gonna suffer alooooot @fleet vapor

#

then again if you play utah enough you already used to playing russian roulette everything you right click right lol , i sure am

fleet vapor
#

easy fix for utah till they fix this desync is just up their hp and bite force

#

they wont tho

old hull
#

that would delay you dying to it but it would still feel terrible

fleet vapor
#

so i am just staying away until its a better more playable game

old hull
#

a carno might kill you in 3-4 bites from 10 miles away instead of 2-3 atm

fleet vapor
#

at least u have more of a chance

#

i used to 1v1 carnos alot and i had two instances where right as they kill me they bleed out

dusky surge
#

i was talking about fixing all the desync and networking issues

dreamy fiber
#

Well I included everything, didn't I? :>

dusky surge
#

also fixing desync, again, is essentially an impossible ask. You can do your best to try and lessen it, but never fix it

dreamy fiber
#

That's very true. So they best get trying hard.
Sure, there will always be some but it's not something they can afford to let get out of hand either.
Thankfully. I've been pretty okay in the whole desync end. Not personally affected by itx but there's still plenty of things to work on thst are core to the game

hollow canyon
#

That video with Utah and Deino is almost definitely desync

#

From your perspective you were safely outside of Deino's range, from the server's perspective you just got chomped

#

I've had it on some occasions, probably the best way to realise this is to have someone you know be the Deino - once upon a time I was fighting a Deino and it oneshot me despite the fact that it shouldn't - I said that to a friend of mine who - as it turned out - was that Deino and said that from his perspective he easily hit the head.

#

From my perspective it was maybe a tail hit if it landed at all

peak pumice
#

we gon talk about how I got insta kill

#

twice

#

by carnos in 2 different lcoations?

#

i hadnt even been spawned for 2 minutes guys srsly

#

and the first time me, another utah, and a baby carno we were friends with ALL got killed by 1 charge

#

and also why does the pounce constantly miss? like i am visibly watching myself clip through his torso and i have good fps so idk why

#

ur game has gone to TI_Pog shitTI_Hurr rn

stark knoll
covert cave
#

omg Frosty's back

#

at last

mental roost
#

Seeing Frosty back makes me miss Miragaia.. damn.

covert cave
#

what happened to Miragaia?

#

is there lore

mental roost
#

I don't know.. He just disappeared

slim dragon
#

Frosty ate him

fresh laurel
#

🤨

#

wait...

#

he isnt in the server....

alpine plover
#

Carno must've been too powerful for him

fresh laurel
#

noooo...

frail bobcat
#

utah just needs its pounce fixed

tranquil pawn
#

mhm

tranquil pawn
#

oh, ok then

hasty coyote
#

@woeful trench yeah that’s a problem with desync, many dinos have issues with it. I play pachy a lot so I know your pain. Your client thinks you hit, so it does what it needs to (play animation, sound, and lowers stam). But the server thinks you missed, so the opponent doesn’t take damage. Most other people see you either phase through them or just miss barely.

Best tip I can give is aim for the head and release early. Then just pray to RNGesus that you hit.

Utahs also have issues with desync and their pounce does similar things, but carnos just get the infamous lag-bite from 10 feet away because of desync.

half girder
#

@woeful trench there’s a stun immunity window to prevent stun locking, so when you headbutt once you wait 5 seconds

#

if that’s not the prob then it’s most likely desync

#

the new patch should have this sorted

woeful trench
half girder
#

ok yeah, i got that all the time

fierce crypt
#

@turbid coyote That's because you don't know where to find it

turbid coyote
celest copper
#

This is one major reason why Stegos without a doubt should be nerfed. Realistically herbivores during these mixed eras of Cretaceous and Jurassic periods, or herbivores in general would not be so conferrable around each other and playing or fighting anything. Especially a carnivore within it's own domain or den.

TheIsle_6_15_2022_7_00_23_PM.png
slim dragon
#

Yeah but the game isn't meant to be realistic, and it doesn't take place in the jurassic nor the cretaceous era
What you're seeing here is a consequence of the lunge mechanic being lame

fleet vapor
#

ur all wrong

obtuse ocean
#

Why nerf it ? if it goes into the water , its dead. If the croc goes on land its dead, as it should be ?

celest copper
# slim dragon Yeah but the game isn't meant to be realistic, and it doesn't take place in the ...

I agree with you about the lung mechanic being undeveloped at this time. But a survival game that completely turns the tables on survival, and caters more towards this type of unenjoyable experience. Crocs are already limited to water so they have to attempt to survive as an "apex" of course crocs in real life are cannibalistic, but they have to survive from "fishing stegos and stomping tenos. It's not only the deinos, it's all the other carnivore species, and how even as an adult a herbivore will broadcast to start fights, because they are bored. I remember during region 2. The only reason I ever heared herbivores broadcast is if they were in a massive awesome heard, of the same species as themselves, no mixing of herbivores. I appreciated how it seemed realistic, during that time it even seemed to prevent carnivores resorting to fighting each other because there were no over powered herbivores that can solo 3 carnos as an adult pachy. Yes skill is involved but still there are stats that handy cap required skill

dusky surge
#

im pretty sure region 2 was an example of back when herbivores were barely at all powerful or relevant, an issue that's been in the Isle for a while, before receiving some much needed attention in U4

#

EVRIMA's herbivores have traditionally been quite weak pre-U4, and it was far more common to see piles of carnivores than a single herbivore

dreamy fiber
#

@turbid coyote bruh how are you managing that. Never coming out of the forest or something? There's ai frequently in grasslands, you might need to look hard for smaller ai like chickens or if all else fails just go to the darned coast where the turtles and crabs are very obvious.
The map has more than enough ai for everyone.

And regarding herbs like
Tenon is fine. Stego is not. Adult herbivores should be capable of defending themselves, they're not meat in wheels. You should be going for younger folk ideally

Of course corpse guarding makes that an issue so in the interest of actually encouraging player on player ordationnit would be better imo to discourage corpse guarding even if that's not muh realism

turbid coyote
calm ibex
#

it can be pretty difficult to spot small AI such as frogs/chickens/crabs as a small carnivore since your field of vision is so low

#

Where as ptera can spot it all effortlessly when AI renders sooner than grass

obtuse ocean
#

Im here wondring why its so easy to get food

calm ibex
#

once you learn all the AI spawns its basically impossible to starve even in big numbers and pvp becomes optional

turbid coyote
limber delta
#

If stego isn’t going to be made weaker because it’s meant to be balanced with apexes, then that means the apexes are going to be even worse
I would have trust that the devs aren’t ignorant enough to do this, but at this point I only have hope

dusky surge
#

i'd honestly say stego is underpowered for an apex personally, the issue is that there is literally no large-tier or mid-tier animals to even out the size difference, so stego just appears super busted

dreamy fiber
#

If any apex can swim back and fourth across the river and not care that its getting bitten by deinos that's not okay lol

There shouldn't be any apex in the game which can do that. One pass of the river? Yeah, sure. Not like two or three or more passes, which is what the stego can currently do while being bitten by two deinos.

celest copper
golden coral
#

Do you imagine any of the other apexes will be any easier to go up against? Also damage is not the only factor at the end of the day.

calm ibex
#

i genuinely do not understand how stego is able to swim across river multiple times, literally just body block it with your own body and headbite, its not sustainable at all

dusky surge
#

also legacy/EVRIMA is always a poor comparison

hasty coyote
#

@spiral kindle I assume you're talking about the pachy ram and carno charge interaction: Its supposed to be a head fracture for the carno and a body fracture for the pachy (however terrain can cause it to bug and break both your legs). I would say its in a good spot because its like a trade, you both win and lose some. Pachy loses the ability to ram you and has MUCH less stam. Meanwhile carno has reduced vision and bite damage. This means in a 1v1, the pachy needs to escape the carno before its stam runs out. If the pachy doesnt escape, it dies. Then in a group scenario, the carno has the 10 second stun immunity to get away with only a broken skull, and the pachy has to rely on its group to protect them while its vulnerable.

spiral kindle
#

i agree what u are saying but overall in a pack of pachys its defo not worth charging at a pachy because during that head fracture stun the other pachys can get a leg fracture/body fracture and the carno would of lost the fight unless he abuses the water wich i have done many times to survive bull crap like that but i still think carno should win the trade off just like how he kinda does with teno rn and next update it would give the carno a chance to get an amush charge on one of the buffed pachys,btw im talking about a group scenario and plus the charge is pretty easy to dodge by using w a s d and being aware of your surroundings

dreamy fiber
spiral kindle
hasty coyote
# spiral kindle i agree what u are saying but overall in a pack of pachys its defo not worth cha...

If I had gotten the correct info, pachies have only been buffed in turning radius and stamina, but their damage was nerfed. I would need to be in the testing to see what the matchup is like, but it seems to just make pachy more forgiving in a break-and-run but not much better beating to death. However, I'm not in the stress tests so I cant really say anything about that, I'd rather the QA testers do balance until they hit live.

Also, if you decide to charge into a GROUP of pachies, thats kinda your fault. Generally, 2 pachies would need to give you a major skill issue to win, but 3 can kill a carno somewhat consistently. However, you shouldnt try to start a 1v3 generally, if carno can just run in and not care about 3 of them, then what happens when its a 1v1? Nothing should just die because something else saw it. Also, cant you just counter the 1v3 by just, getting a second or even a third carno?

half girder
#

solo pachy gets smacked if the carno has brain cells.

spiral kindle
#

yeah solo pachy

half girder
#

i don’t see why a carno is trying to ambush a group of pachy without thinking of the consequences

#

2v3 carno v pachy would still prove pretty difficult with new pachy so a strategic ambush would easily win the fight

hasty coyote
#

heres the thing, pachy v carno 3:1 the carno has to either skill issue the pachies, or just back off. 1:3 pachy just dies

half girder
#

new pachy is perfecto and i can’t wait to play it live

dusky surge
#

what even changed about pachy lmao

half girder
#

a lot

#

it’s super fun on the ST

hasty coyote
half girder
#

way more fun than up 4.5

hasty coyote
dusky surge
#

the most i've gathered from the stress test balance is tracking less fucking stupid and utah got a cool new pounce

half girder
#

yes utah recovers faster

slim dragon
#

Just wanna say
It's not an ambush if the pachy is ramming back against the carno

half girder
#

and tracking is harder

dusky surge
#

honestly harder tracking is all i cared about lmao

half girder
#

well you’ll love it

hasty coyote
slim dragon
#

So what you guys are discussing is a situation where a carno is seen by a group of 3+ pachys and decided to charge them

half girder
#

they kinda did

#

it doesn’t hold ur hand anymore

#

he is im talking about ambushing as carno, without being seen

hasty coyote
#

I think the ram+charge interaction is perfect when it doesnt decide to just break both your legs

dusky surge
#

i still wish carno had worse tracking than the other carnivores but whatevs

#

hypsi looks genuinely interesting now

#

dryo continues to be dryo

hasty coyote
#

pachy has a disadvantage, but still is able to run

half girder
#

dryo should be ai

hasty coyote
dusky surge
half girder
#

hypsi is so op now

slim dragon
#

Every herbivore should be ai

dusky surge
#

dryo should be fun, not an ambient AI

half girder
#

naw

hasty coyote
half girder
#

boring creature, make it ai

#

proto will be more fun

dusky surge
#

it wouldn't be a boring creature if they bothered with it

hasty coyote
half girder
#

they don’t cuz it’s boring

dusky surge
#

could be a fucking sick nocturnal animal come U5.5

half girder
#

wait for galli

dusky surge
#

still think dryo should have awesome NV

#

the fact this game STILL hasn't had a nocturnal herbi is sad

half girder
#

rex is boring but it’s op so

dusky surge
#

dryo used to be OP

#

it was legit one of the best animals in the game for a while lmao

hasty coyote
dusky surge
#

still don't think the qualifiers for playables should be "big and cool"

half girder
#

dryo was one hell of an ai

dusky surge
#

i like the smaller animals. I don't play dryo because they literally haven't given it any cool mechanics, not because the idea of it is boring

half girder
#

those were its golden days

dusky surge
#

dryo AI was dogshit and I hated it

#

AI is way better as non-dinos, with the exception of compy and pterodactylus

half girder
#

that’s just wack

#

dino ai will be pog

dusky surge
#

Dino AI will suck

half girder
#

i can’t wait for it

dusky surge
#

Even if it's well programmed

#

It's just a substitute for actual players and that blows imho

#

I'd rather every animal be fun than just "oh, this should just be AI fodder haha"

half girder
#

only thing that gave a challenge for food

#

current ai 😬

dusky surge
#

Dryo AI was easy food lmao

half girder
#

naw

#

as a baby it was a fun and tough challenge

dusky surge
#

Runs in a straight line, constantly broadcast so it can tell you where it is, stops mid-chase so you can catch up (it's so considerate of its hunters haha). Fucking stupid

half girder
#

up2 it scared me

dusky surge
#

Deer are the exact same thing as dryo AI but better since they move REALLY fucking fast and will run for miles

half girder
#

oml the amount of times i thought it was some immersed ass player

dusky surge
#

I could always tell the difference, AI dryo immediately ruined the game for me

#

"Oh, it's an AI dryo, easy meal"

#

Player dryos were slippery and clever and REALLY hard to catch

#

AI dryos were walking meals for free growth

half girder
#

they do need to touch it up but with the amount of stuff they’re working on

#

“really hard”

#

i rem getting bite or pounce after a dodged

#

very fun dino

dusky surge
#

Why would you dodge

#

Dryo's dodge is just BAD (which is why so little people play it, since it's ONLY mechanic sucks balls)

slim dragon
#

I think species should be either player-only or AI-only, but there shouldn't be something turned into AI because it's not interesting enough for players

dusky surge
#

Your turn radius, speed and stamina are far better options than the dodge

dusky surge
#

Dryo isn't played because the devs gave every other dino far more love and interesting mechanics than it, then left all the potential cool mechanics for later. Burrowing? Nah. Night vision? Not even out.

half girder
#

and that’s why it should be ai

slim dragon
#

Ultimately there could be different gamemodes, each proposing different species as either playable or AI
Like one gamemode when every carnivore is playable and every herbivore is AI, one gamemode where only small species are playable, and larger ones are AI
possibly a "classic" gamemode where only creatures from legacy are playable, the rest is AI...

dusky surge
half girder
#

it won’t for a very long time so

slim dragon
#

Dryo could be AI if there is another small animal with a similar playstyle for players to enjoy

half girder
#

for now make it ai aswell

dusky surge
#

I still remember when teno, carno and utah AI were added, it was probably the worst experience I ever had with this game

#

Tenos were free food, carnos were inescapable missiles and utahs could SPAM pounce

half girder
#

that shit was funny asf

dusky surge
#

Dino AI has always been dogshit imho, both for the game design-wise and implementation wise. I fucking HATE it. Ambient AI was the best decision they ever made

#

Immediately identifiable as AI, small enough to not act as a giant sack of free meat, unique behaviours and mechanics DESIGNED first and foremost for an AI, not a player, so on.

slim dragon
#

Having select species be AI only could also cull the roster in a smart way
Acro and giga are too similar ? Acro is AI
Trike makes styraco's existence useless ? Styraco becomes AI (just an example, I like styraco and I don't know if it's gonna overlap with trike at all)

half girder
#

frick i can’t wait for up5 to go live

dusky surge
half girder
#

next week 🙏🏻

hasty coyote
slim dragon
dusky surge
#

Honestly, keep dinos playable. If not enough people are playing the dino, that's a design problem, not an invitation to make it AI

slim dragon
#

I remember seeing Utahs in AI testing who acted in a believable way and could be escaped

half girder
#

ai is free food atm so dryo would fit perfectly

dusky surge
#

I would rather the designers challenge themselves to make animals all distinct and unique enough to warrant playability, rather than throw in the towel and concede to just making it AI

slim dragon
half girder
#

very high standards

slim dragon
#

That's not a lot of dinos for a dino-island if you want my opinion

dusky surge
slim dragon
#

Even if the numbers are pumped up to 200 (huge considering current technical limitations) that's still only 4 of each species

dusky surge
#

New technologies and more finances, so on

slim dragon
#

300 ? Enjoy playing as a pack of 6 troodons

half girder
#

won’t be 300 that’s just unplayable

#

the ping desync etc.

#

that’ll take them years to optimize

celest copper
dusky surge
#

it's going to be a GOOD while till we see 50

slim dragon
#

And if we want the game to feel like it's a real ecosystem, we need at least 5x as many small things compared to the big ones
And same ratio for herbis compared to carnis

half girder
#

we prob won’t see all 50 but

#

game will never feel real

#

mixpacking being one of the top toxic behaviors

#

game ruiner

slim dragon
#

Mixpacking has no correlation with realism imo
We're humans controlling dinos, let us act like humans controlling dinos

#

If we were supposed to behave exactly like dinos would, why even make it a game
If you wanna see dinos acting like dinos, Prehistoric Planet just came out

dusky surge
#

i personally got into the Isle because it's a player driven game. Players are both hunter and hunted for the mostpart. Adding a bunch of AI substitutes for players defeats that for me

half girder
#

not saying i don’t want it but it’s pretty toxic

slim dragon
#

Example, if players are bound to smalls and AI is big dinos only, you clearly know when you're gonna oppose AI and when you're gonna oppose players

#

Like in Monster Hunter, if the thing in front of you is 10x your size, then it's an AI
But it doesn't make things less interesting, because with that much size difference interactions wouldn't be much different than if it was a player

half girder
#

don’t care how lively the game feels, just here for the pvp, balance over anything

#

they can work on ai after balance, it’s fine how it is

hasty coyote
#

i just want to break things. Whether that be bones or the game itself

half girder
#

i love doing those things

#

thank god they didn’t listen to the people that thought the turning was fine

dusky surge
#

honestly, I think the PvP has become too central to the game's identity. EVRIMA basically started as a showcase of improved movement and combat compared to legacy. I'm excited for less combat and more survival focused gameplay, since I find the game essentially being an arena dino fighter with long respawns to be rather dull. Don't get me wrong, combat is cool, but constantly seeking it out is less cool. I'd rather fight out of necessity for my own survival than just because that's what you do

half girder
#

zZzzZ

molten turret
half girder
#

i will always LOOK for combat

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idgaf if i’m full lmao

golden coral
half girder
#

i think i am

dusky surge
#

the game SHOULD have you fight people, but like, IDK, I'm excited to be rewarded for SURVIVING rather than just kind of having my adult life being war sim

molten turret
golden coral
#

Looking for things that can actively be detrimental to your continued survival is.. well, opposite of playing for survival, which would be the goal in a survival game.

golden coral
hasty coyote
#

pvp is a core part of the game, but we just don't have the full survival aspect yet.

half girder
#

^

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i kill, i survive longer

dusky surge
#

as the game stands, just fight when adult, that's what you do, fighting is the most fun you can have. But I'm hyped as hell for elders and actually getting rewards for genuinely SURVIVING

molten turret
half girder
#

i’m doing it right 😎

dreamy fiber
golden coral
#

Survival games should promote survival gameplay, otherwise there's something done wrong in the design.

dreamy fiber
#

I enjoy both but I do enjoy it more when I need to survive

half girder
dusky surge
hasty coyote
#

carnivores have to constantly pvp, or they literally will not survive. The herbivores also have to ward off the carnivores, so they are also constantly pvp.

half girder
#

i will no matter what kill when i want 😎

dusky surge
#

Combat is still fun, just, I want survival to feel fun too

dusky surge
molten turret
dusky surge
golden coral
# half girder that’s too bad

Too bad how so? I'm merely stating how an actual survival game should and would work. Hopefully the Isle can get towards that at some point.

half girder
#

it won’t

molten turret
dreamy fiber
#

And to get rid of mix packing between herbs smh

golden coral
half girder
#

game will always be a br

molten turret
dusky surge
#

PvP and combat should be a CORE part of the game, just, sometimes people should know if the cards are stacked against them and bugger off for the sake of their own survival (i.e. low chances of beating this stego, most of my pack is dead, if I wanna survive to elder, I'll just leave). You know, that kind of deal. In no way do I want combat to stop

half girder
golden coral
dreamy fiber
#

Nobody said combat should stop

half girder
#

fighting stego is 9/10 the most boring thing

#

99% of the time you’ll get hit with it’s fair and balanced hitbox

golden coral
# half girder how?

I'm not.. sure how you do not understand. The point of a survival game is to survive. As such, putting yourself in danger should always be a "I have no choice", and as such, always be dangerous and something you'd prefer to avoid if possible.

molten turret
dusky surge
#

the ONLY change I want to see in the Isle is people caring SLIGHTLY more about their dino's survival. Picking less risky fights, retreating when shit gets hairy, putting their own survival first rather than blindly searching for the kill because they've already reached the "end" of their life cycle

half girder
#

but killing stuff = survive..

dusky surge
half girder
#

i’m surviving..

golden coral
half girder
#

and fighting = fun.. i have fun

golden coral
#

I'm just not sure how the concept of "getting into a fight should be bad" in a game where your goal is to remain alive, since fighting generally means taking damage and becoming exhausted and so on.

molten turret
golden coral
#

Like, should you kill others to survive, sure. Should you aim to kill things that can't fight back, absolutely.

half girder
#

i just can’t wait to break all ur bones with the boys soon

molten turret
dreamy fiber
golden coral
# molten turret its a risk with a greater reward because the threat is gone

Sure, but if you can kill it before it even becomes a threat, that should be by far preferable. Again, it should be an easy concept to understand. Fighting implies the risk of taking damage and so on, that should be bad for you. So if you don't need the other thing dead, it might be preferable to leave it.

dusky surge
#

i feel like people are getting the wrong idea. I'm not anti-combat, I just want to see more people care about survival rather than just fighting till they drop. Running and disengaging when shit gets hairy rather than blindly throwing yourself into an already lost fight, you know?

dreamy fiber
#

It is literally more fun in the Isle to fight than to survive and therefore you end up with a whole lot of fighting.

dusky surge
golden coral
#

But yes, as Frost said, there's not enough incentives to remain alive, that's the main issue.

molten turret
dusky surge
#

why???

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it's still GOING to be combat

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they aren't removing combat elements

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they're just giving a reason to keep living

golden coral
#

I think you might confuse the idea of killing others with the idea of going around fighting being a good choice

dreamy fiber
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That's an assumption, and an opinion not a fact @molten turret

dusky surge
#

all this does is give people MORE options in terms of survival, it doesn't strip away your ability to fight

dreamy fiber
#

Frankly it is also supposed to be a horror game somehow lol

molten turret
half girder
#

horror

dusky surge
#

you... can... still fight

golden coral
#

None of us are saying you shouldn't kill others. We're more so arguing that getting into fights is a bad idea, and should be avoided if doable. Of course, it won't always be avoidable, and that's when you need to do or die. But you should measure when it's worth fighting and when it's not.

half girder
#

only horror are the fps drops

molten turret
half girder
#

stop-motion combat

dreamy fiber
#

No? If only combat was fun people wouldn't play puzzle games. If only puzzles were fun people wouldn't play combat.

golden coral
dusky surge
#

GUYS YOU CAN STILL FIGHT NO ONE IS SAYING TO REMOVE YOUR ABILITY TO FIGHT LMAO

dreamy fiber
#

There's fun in every genre and how you achieve your genre is what matters

half girder
#

it’s the only part.

golden coral
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@dusky surgeIt's like if you can't play it like a deathmatch, then there's no fighting at all.. xD

dusky surge
#

If you wanna fucking fight that's not going to change

molten turret
dusky surge
#

People aren't going to STOP fighting because elders give a reason to survive

golden coral
dreamy fiber
#

Combat is inherently a part of most survival games (but not all).

#

The Isle will obviously have combat no matter what. Its integral.

half girder
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i mean kinda

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will still be the only part