balance-feedback-discussion

[viscid mica]

Oh 100%

Tbh a average troodon is awful at no fault of their own it’s hard to be good as troodon

[steep gazelle]

It didn't make sense when any of his attacks consumes a high amount of stam, at least the stomp should have 0 cost since its knockdown was removed.

[viscid mica]

And omni has like no defensive capacity

[worthy steeple]

because troodon and omni is also million times smaller.

here’s another example, who would win rank one dryo or average fresh install omni?

[elfin night]

because teno doesn't have to fight things larger than itself whereas most omnis and troodons do. Even good tenos are gonna be cooked against something like an allo or a sub rex just like how omni struggles against a teno or cera

[spiral kindle]

D-sync kills troodon most of the time and yet Dondi thought it was a good idea to revert the Hp and dmg buff😭

Good troodons get rewarded very little

[viscid mica]

Maia design isn’t to be aggressive it’s meant for running which a lot of people don’t like as it was insanely op during start of its HT

[worthy steeple]

ofc good teno is unkillable for troodons or omnis, same as omni is unkillable in a fight vs dryo

can’t compare that

[spiral kindle]

I mean for all we know they could mega buff teno and make it so it can stun stuff up to 2.8 tons

Cause y'know herbie bias

[steep gazelle]

A dino made to run won't be thrown by anyone

[worthy steeple]

i can see the stam buff, but not what you’re suggesting

[elfin night]

that's nonsense

[elfin night]

irrational perception

[worthy steeple]

doubt they will ever change teno weight

[viscid mica]

Played* ya it’s like a small tier destroyer and that’s it

[worthy steeple]

maybe the elder teno is going to be huge, but 1.6 is perfect

[spiral kindle]

Is it really tho cause Countering a charge has been made much easier you don't even have to time it at all anymore and Kicks and tail slams you can spam cause they cost such little stam to what they used too

[steep gazelle]

I'm suggesting removing the stam cost of stomp, as using stomp leaves you vulnerable.

[viscid mica]

You can kinda bully mid stuff if you got numbers but by itself it ain’t much of a fighter

[spiral kindle]

Teno is sugar coated

[worthy steeple]

as teno tail slam makes you vulnerable, should it also be stam free?

[spiral kindle]

Tbf they did nerf the agility in the maia update but still.

[worthy steeple]

😔

it’s because of the camera changes most likely

[steep gazelle]

Teno tail slam has low stam cost, unlike any of Maia's attacks.

[worthy steeple]

camera is closer and it’s harder to turn

[worthy steeple]

how much is it per maia stomp? 4 stam?

[steep gazelle]

If I'm not mistaken it's 8%, but I haven't played Maia since there's a bug in changing posture

So I could be wrong

[worthy steeple]

it’s definitely not 8

[viscid mica]

Maia stam cost for all its attacks is pretty high I can agree to that

[worthy steeple]

let me check

[spiral kindle]

HT carno has got some good QOL changes that make it alot better to play not Major but good

Dilo meta will be good for carno

Next update cause clones got fixed

[elfin night]

"fixed"

you mean they're gonna make the game unplayable for half of the roster?

if that ht dilo releases

[spiral kindle]

yep

[elfin night]

we're gonna have such a miserable time

even carnos

[spiral kindle]

Yeah i hate dilo

[spiral kindle]

2 carnos destroy 4 dilo's

[elfin night]

I loved dilo in legacy but they did it so dirty

[elfin night]

in the open at daytime, sure

if they catch you at night, you are done with no counterplay in one bite

[spiral kindle]

4 dilo's during the night can literally kill anything

Even a 9.5 ton trike prob

No skill at all

Bait , land One bite and spam clones for 3 minutes

[cosmic pelican]

Its 6% per stomp

[worthy steeple]

hm, so it’s 6% stam for 350 damage and teno uses 3% stam for 100 damage👹

💀

[spiral kindle]

is it 3%

I thought it was like 1.5%

Tail slam has longer range and more effective for cc'ing its not a dmg tool

Then following up with 400dmg kicks

that only cost like not even 2% stam cost

and it does bleed

[steep gazelle]

What were the changes to the carnotaurus?

[spiral kindle]

Faster Growth Time (Same as Cerato) Better Bleed resist, Better turn in place and More running stam

Charge stam is still the same

[worthy steeple]

it’s buffed too

[steep gazelle]

oh my god, my carnotaurus was buffed aaaaa😭 😭

[spiral kindle]

I don't think so cause that was buffed in the maia update

[steep gazelle]

ty devs

[spiral kindle]

Charge is 1 min 55 sec

Runtime is 2 mins 15 sec

Rn charging is better than running

[worthy steeple]

it’s 2:15
run is 2:40

[steep gazelle]

troodon need buff like this too

[worthy steeple]

this is HT stats

[cosmic pelican]

Real

Powercreep on troodon when

[vale brook]

what are u noobs arguing about now!!!!!

[spiral kindle]

Oh damn yeah running will now be better than charging!!!!!

[cosmic pelican]

Still same efficiency

[spiral kindle]

Finally

[steep gazelle]

poor troodon, he's been suffering since last year

[worthy steeple]

yeah

[cosmic pelican]

Both times got buffed by 25s

[worthy steeple]

let’s ask for troodon nerfs

(it’s literally impossible to nerf it more)

[viscid mica]

Not bad but for the nerfs it’s not useful

[spiral kindle]

20 sec diff now its 35 sec

are u sure?

[steep gazelle]

nerf speed when 100% to 20km

xd

[worthy steeple]

are you crazy?? it’s gonna outrun deino on land. it should be like 15 at MOST

[cosmic pelican]

Venom now HEALS opponents! PoT healer niche!!!

[worthy steeple]

AGAHAHAHAHAHAHA

literally negative damage

[steep gazelle]

made venom grow victim

[cosmic pelican]

And it should go over max natural hp too

1000hp hypsi

[worthy steeple]

team fortress medic niche

[viscid mica]

Pretty sure @solid wyvern devs have outrightly said they won’t be doing much to mutations for the time being

[solid wyvern]

Bruh. I hope they will revision some of them later

[viscid mica]

Maybe, I do know unofficials can freely change values or disable mutations thou

[solid wyvern]

Yeah I know that cause I play unofficials mostly

[viscid mica]

I do not XD I’ve learned to live with em

[viscid mica]

@spiral kindle well I do partially agree that it’s way too punishing you can always jump off before hitting the tree

[spiral kindle]

Yeah

Still is just way to punishing

Anything can kill you within the knockdown time

Diablo,Cera,Carno,Teno and Stego

Dilo aswell actually

Dilo has very fast dps

[viscid mica]

Oh 100%

[spiral kindle]

Like ofc you will jump off but like there is still times where you make a mistake and it is just bs

Especially the avg omni player

That doesn't respect that

It should just be the reg knockdown timer shouldn't be any longer

@stark fern What is it that you don't agree?

Just curios

[minor axle]

You bet I know. I’ve literally held off Omni packs as a solo dilo just because there was a tree making their hunt miserable xd

Anyways, yeah it makes sense I think to buff the recovery speed when getting up.

[elfin night]

I hate Omni apologists

Nickboay and his minions when they can’t pin an adult rex to the ground with minimal effort /j /hj /lh

[iron tree]

this is so true

[elfin night]

Hate them

So annoying, and they were like this in legacy too

[iron tree]

I know

[elfin night]

Isle’s worst plague

[iron tree]

we should replace omni with achillobator

[elfin night]

We should do a purge of omni players

And then put deinonychus instead

Or simply let austro reign once more

The one true heir of the isle

[iron tree]

yes

[spiral kindle]

Nickboay's recent video is amazing

Shows how messed up the hitboxes are in this game

[elfin night]

I don’t like omni glazers!

[viscid mica]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/855527844670865438/1342574395339706430/togif.gif

[worthy steeple]

i watched some of his videos few hours ago, the guys doesn’t understand anything about balance or how things should work.

there’s few good suggestions, but most of it just something completely unhinged, or something that just won’t work

if you want to suggest balance change you should at least understand what’s the issue and why it needs fix, also how exactly you need to fix the issue without messing up stuff even more

[iron tree]

^

[iron tree]

@hazy glen #balance-feedback message carno got some neat buffs in the HT

[hazy glen]

Qrd?

@iron tree

What buffs?

[iron tree]

stamina buffs

bleed resistance and agility buffs

and it grows faster!

[steep gazelle]

In my opinion, Carnotaurus should be able to take down Ceratos, but for that it would require 2s more use of the charge.

[iron tree]

I haven't grown one to adulthood yet but juvi carno might be a bit faster now

like, in its adolescent-sub phase

[iron tree]

Cera is just overtuned

[steep gazelle]

Indeed. Cerato should be a scavenger, but it doesn't receive any nerf like Carnotaurus did to stay in its niche.

[iron tree]

it will probably get some nerfs soon + allo will bully it into its niche

[steep gazelle]

Honestly, if the Cerato doesn't suffer any nerfs, an Allo won't be a problem for 2 Ceratos.

[iron tree]

doubt it

from what we've seen even 2-3 ceras don't stand much of a chance

but I mean we dunno until it's in the game

[steep gazelle]

Cerato has a passive buff and close to the carcass is simply grotesquely good, not to mention the damage, the bacteria that even biting the tip of the tail still makes you vomit

[iron tree]

I mean

It has a bacterial bite

the bacteria will get into you body even if it bites your tail

[steep gazelle]

2 ceratos can give trouble even to 1 dibble that was made to fight much more than an allo

[iron tree]

and the body buff is to encourage corpse stealing

[iron tree]

I can assure you that even 4 ceras struggle against a good solo dibble

[steep gazelle]

Well, so should Dillo's venom do that too?

[iron tree]

realistically yeah

it'd be less effective but yeah

[steep gazelle]

4 good Ceratos against 1 good dibble, it is simply impossible for the dibble to win. At most it will leave some in yellow life

[iron tree]

nah

in the open it dies

[hazy glen]

isn't the bane of the dibble to get flanked?

[iron tree]

but if it mud camps, rocks camps or cliff camps it can definitely win

[steep gazelle]

Cerato is more agile and faster than Dibble, in open field only help cerato

[hazy glen]

I think that's what he's saying

[steep gazelle]

Oh, sy

[hazy glen]

"in optimal conditions 4 ceratos would struggle"

[iron tree]

yes

[steep gazelle]

In more closed spaces it can actually be more difficult for the 4 ceratos, but even so (if they know how to play) they won't lose

[iron tree]

and if the dibble plays unpredictable like charging at an attacking cera the pack is at a disadvantage

[steep gazelle]

But a dibble can fight so well against cerato because it was made to fight

An allo is far from being that good

[iron tree]

I doubt it

allo will most likely faster than dibble

which makes it quite dangerous for ceras

[steep gazelle]

Dibble only does so well against Ceratos because he can knock them down, an Allo will only be able to do this with the grapple.

[iron tree]

we dunno how allo will do against ceras yet

[steep gazelle]

Wow, there are a lot of updates today on hordtest

[iron tree]

yes

[steep gazelle]

We don't know yet, but you can get an idea with something of the same weight as the dibble

There's also Maia, But Maia... Ah, Maia...

[hasty coyote]

@steep gazelle I agree with all of that except the stun buff. Pachy used to have something similar, it had a like 20 second cool down between stuns. And even then, all it did was delay the slow and painful death of anything it leg fractured. since all pachy had to do was just wait out the timer, get a free hit, and then wait again. If you want to give pachy stuns again, it needs to have a HARD limit, not a recharge. Imo, the best way to do it would be to make applying a fracture stun. That way there are at most 3 stuns, which should be enough for a pachy to easily break and run. If it wants to kill the crippled target, the target needs a solid chance to fight back.

[quartz trellis]

will they ever buff omni bleed

[hazy glen]

What would be Allo's role in the ecosystem?

You're talking as if he's not a fighter but isn't he pretty big?

I'm not a dino guy I'm just hyperfixating on dino games for the last 1-2 weeks

[steep gazelle]

Pachy had the fracture stun for a while, but I think it was removed because when I'm using pachy I don't feel like it causes any stun on ceratos or carnos

[dusky surge]

it never had a fracture stun. it just had a flatout stun that allowed you to stunlock carnos

[hasty coyote]

nope, just a flat out stun with the target getting stun immunity. It was removed in 6.5 because of how oppressive pachies were to deal with because you literally could not fight back the moment you got a leg fracture

[steep gazelle]

Seriously? I remember being able to stun ceratos

[hasty coyote]

it never could

[dusky surge]

nope. never could

at least never fg ceras

[steep gazelle]

Well, I must be going crazy then

[hasty coyote]

happens to the best of us lol

[steep gazelle]

But honestly, Pachy needs stun in his attacks, he is extremely vulnerable to attacks both when he hits and when he misses.

[hasty coyote]

yeah the self stun on miss needs to be removed, if omni can get away without it, pachy should too. And either remove the stun on hit or add cc on fracture.

[steep gazelle]

A cerato doesn't need to worry about pachys, it has fracture resistance and makes you vomit with 1 bite, and this It bothers me simple fact that pachy is so slow

Pachy should be a glass cannon that predators smaller than 3t think about before trying to attack, just like the cerato is

[steep gazelle]

Removing the stun he suffers from his own ability would be a very good thing, but I think it's difficult for the devs to do that.

They simply do not accept being contradicted about something they did, they do not accept that it is bad,Just look at how long Cerato had his op vomit before he got nerfed

[hasty coyote]

without leg fracture, sure, but with leg fracture, a pachy is a major threat. Mainly due to leg fracture being one of the most op abilities in the game. Reducing speed heavily is already bad, but disabling most attacks, including alt attacks, makes leg fracture pretty much a death sentence to anything.

[steep gazelle]

Okay, I edited the suggestion and changed the stun

I agree that pachy with stun with a cooldown would be too op

I even managed to fight against Carnos in 1v1 nowadays, who would say with this

[hasty coyote]

sounds good to me 👍

[viscid mica]

@steep gazelle imma be real pachy stun is hard issue to argue as it was stun locking during its HT

[severe grail]

Pachy needs I-Frames fr.

[severe grail]

Most players can't pvp that's the main issue.

[viscid mica]

wdym

[steep gazelle]

It's literally just 3 stuns, it's nothing that leaves the pachy op like it was in spiro

[vale brook]

poor guy got muted somehow

[steep gazelle]

The game is defined in pvp, that's the end point, the reason for you to grow for 1h or more a dino. If people really want to play they will have to learn to fight

[minor axle]

No, it’s primarily defined in survival, with PvP primarily being a tool for it. So fighting matters but is the means to an end. The attacked succeeds whether he fights off, slays, or simply escapes his attacker

[steep gazelle]

Fights are what define whether you will live or die. Everything ends in a fight, whether you are being hunted or hunting

If you don't know how to play with your dino you are dead

[minor axle]

On the contrary, many playable can avoid fights, and not all deaths are fight based. It’s possible to have an entire run without fighting, and when aging becomes a feature with elders it will be even more possible since you won’t have to goof up with environmental hazards.

Ofc if you don’t know how to play the Dino you will be at a disadvantage, but their combat prowess is only one feature. Knowing if you can avoid a fight with your speed, knowing how to hide (such as a herra on a tree or raptors jumping out of reach) are examples of non combat usages of Dino knowledge.

Hell, many Dinos are balanced around avoiding fights (generally you want to avoid things slower than you, or at least they tend to have an advantage in raw power).

[steep gazelle]

One day you will have to fight, running away will not always be possible

The sooner you learn to fight, the better it is for you.

[minor axle]

My point isn’t that fighting lacks use, but that it is only secondary/a tool for surviving. Obviously some playables will have to fight more than others/have less choice (stego)

[fallow parcel]

I feel like omni needs to be second fastest dino ig after galli, maybe a lik slower than carno cause of charge but still in my opinion it's unbelievably slow

[edgy crow]

that would make dilo much worse

[fallow parcel]

True, but dilo can already kill an omni quite easily, and dilos are currently faster I think.

Maybe equal speed

[edgy crow]

exactly, dilos need to be faster

[fallow parcel]

Actually now that I think about it that makes sense

[edgy crow]

whats worse, a single omni getting run down by a dilo pack (it has numerous escape options)

or a single dilo getting run down by an omni pack (it has no escape options)

[fallow parcel]

Tru

Actually that would make dilo crap I take it back lol

[dusky surge]

rare islecord moment of someone taking an argument and realising their idea may have holes in it they didn't see before

exceptionally admirable

i love constructive conversation hell yeah

[edgy crow]

https://tenor.com/view/mgrr-mgr-mgr-raiden-handshake-hug-gif-25122328

[edgy crow]

hell yea

[fallow parcel]

https://tenor.com/view/i-was-wrong-bea-smith-wentworth-my-mistake-my-fault-gif-22838383

[dusky surge]

omni doesn't need pure speed. it has stamina and agility to its name

[edgy crow]

also it can jump

[fallow parcel]

Fr 🙏

[fallow parcel]

I didn't take stamina into accountability I'll think of that next time thanks!

[dusky surge]

once you fully master omni's movement, it's near untouchable.

it def feels weird that omni isn't y'know, exceptionally fast, but with its niche and other stats, you realise WHY it's like that

[edgy crow]

even if omni didn't have more stam and agility to its name, jumping alone is a pretty good escape option

[dusky surge]

but omni is by no means a slouch

it outspeeds all but like, 4 creatures, and in the case of maia, maia only has a .1km/hr advantage specifically in biped, with godawful agility

[fallow parcel]

True, and omni could just jump on a rock to escape most dinos

[dusky surge]

yup

omni is all about dodging, not pure sprinting

what seperates it from the creatures faster than it is that it is INSANELY agile

like most fast creatures have the downside of poor agility, but omni? nope

[fallow parcel]

Yeah

[edgy crow]

omni has so much going for it

[dusky surge]

yea. it's meant to be versatile

very jack of all trades, master of none

[fallow parcel]

lol

[edgy crow]

and yet it's a better small game hunter than carno because of pin

but that's a topic for another day

[dusky surge]

kinda? carno can kill larger things than omni can pin. different fields

[edgy crow]

carno has to aim a charge, get a knockdown, and bite its prey to kill

omni has to press rmb until it connects

which isn't even detrimental because they removed its cooldown (but kept pachy's for some reason)

[worthy steeple]

this stuff is happening so rarely..

[elfin night]

??? @fallow parcel omnis only get outrun by carnos, dilos, gallis and maias out of 17 playables

And dilos and maias is just marginal

[fallow parcel]

17???

[elfin night]

While also having one of the best agilities in the entire game

Or 16. Might be mistaken

[fallow parcel]

Yeah now that I think about it I'm mistaken sorry lolz

[elfin night]

Troodon
Ptera
Dilo
Omni
Herra
Cera
Carno
Deino
Maia
Teno
Dryo
Hypsi
Pachy
Stego
Dibble
Beipi
Galli

Yup, 17 playables

And omni only gets ran down by 4 of them, two of which are not even 1 kph faster while also having vastly inferior agility

[fallow parcel]

Mbad

[elfin night]

Respect

At least you aren’t like guy who blocked basically everyone who reads balance feedback because he claimed omni stood no chance even escaping from a dilo when it is 20cm per second faster

[eager saddle]

Literally one second later: can we buff omni speed

[elfin night]

Oh my god

[elfin night]

They are a never ending plague

@hollow marten I guess dealing 500 damage with damage with half of your stamina and having the second best agility in the entire game only behind dryo ain’t enough

Just make Omni able to one shot a cera theoretically with a stam buff

Would only need 30% more stam

[eager saddle]

I just want bucking to be buffed and to not get stunned for 5 seconds when clipped by terrain (especially annoying when it is just a random bush)

[cosmic pelican]

Random bush is fixed in the HT!

Or so Ive heard...

[eager saddle]

For nowTM

[worthy steeple]

i agree with random bushes, but trees and rocks should knockdown omni

[elfin night]

Agreed

[worthy steeple]

tbf omnis should be thankful they’re not insta dying, just imagine getting pressed against the tree or a rock by something 10 times your own weight

literally does nothing to you except a knockdown ahah

[eager saddle]

That’s why I said clipped…..

[eager saddle]

I mean, with those claws, it would hurt the dino who did that immensely

Bro just pressed the already deep claws even deeper

[worthy steeple]

yeah, i didn’t say i want that lol

[cosmic pelican]

Um actually they do take dmg, 10% of their hp ☝️ 🤓

[worthy steeple]

some people want pounce to ignore the terrain and those people should be thankful the penalty is not as harsh as it could be

[worthy steeple]

wait they do?

[cosmic pelican]

Yes

[eager saddle]

Yes🤣

[worthy steeple]

never happened to me..

[cosmic pelican]

You have to be knocked down

[worthy steeple]

i mean i never pounce when i see someone camping, probably that’s the reason lmaoo

[cosmic pelican]

Troodon has it too

[worthy steeple]

got knocked down yesterday when i was fighting a dibble in a bush, didn’t take any damage…

am i superior troodon?

tbf maybe i didn’t notice since my hp wasn’t full before the fight

[eager saddle]

No, that’s just the bush being weird

[worthy steeple]

hm

[cosmic pelican]

90% hp has like next to none blood screen so

[crimson crater]

which takes numerous seconds to recover from

[worthy steeple]

well, what do you expect to happen?

[cosmic pelican]

A knockdown that sentences you to die

[crimson crater]

ridiculously long animation

[worthy steeple]

it should be just regular knockdown

[elfin night]

You would take longer to stand up from a knockdown irl

[crimson crater]

don’t think so

[elfin night]

Yes

Or you would get knocked down constantly since there’s no immunity to cc irl

[spiral kindle]

@signal sentinel Carno's charge is better than running it only burns around 17.4% more stam but you are 10km faster

Carno is a charge bot

[iron tree]

It got a buff on the HT too

it can charge for 2:10 now

[spiral kindle]

It's 2:15

Runtime is 2:40

HT Carno, Charging will still be better

Wich is funny

You never want to be reg sprinting as Carno

[iron tree]

nah

you've to use both charge and your run

[spiral kindle]

90% of the time you want to be charging

No case where running is better

[iron tree]

there is

charging makes you predictable and you turn worse

you wanna use both regular bite and charge depending on the situation

[spiral kindle]

I always use reg bite aswell

It's a basic tech you do when fighting Cerato Tap charge and bite right afterwards you mostly hit there base tail tho but still, Free dmg

[hasty coyote]

https://tenor.com/view/metal-gear-rising-gif-25913914

[eager saddle]

https://tenor.com/view/arms-crossed-flex-muscles-gif-14905270

[hasty coyote]

Genuinely that’s the main issue I see with Omni. Omni players think it’s too weak because the target camps a wall and they get invalidated. But the prey sees them as op because they camp a wall or just die.

[tall bronze]

Mmhm

[spiral kindle]

So then nerf base kit omni and nerf abusing terrain

[iron tree]

Using your terrain is part of survival

[worthy steeple]

no

[iron tree]

When a carno attacks me I try my best to shake it off in the woods

[worthy steeple]

yes

[spiral kindle]

Omni and Carno are best in plains

[iron tree]

Indeed

[worthy steeple]

yes

[spiral kindle]

But omni gets countered too much

[iron tree]

Ceras and dilos are insanely good in forest biomes

[iron tree]

It literally doesn't

[spiral kindle]

Plants being able to kock down a 450kg animal

[worthy steeple]

as it should

[worthy steeple]

they fixed that "potato quote"

[spiral kindle]

You can walk through the plants cause they don't have collision but when pounced even the leaf knocks you down

[iron tree]

Realistically the 450kg would be squished by a 3.8t animal if it presses it against a wall

[worthy steeple]

plants are lame, but trees and rocks/walls should always work

[spiral kindle]

Yeah ofc#

Knockdown needs a reduced timer from it tho

[cosmic pelican]

Should or shouldnt is irrelevant when it literally is anti fun game design for both parties.

[cosmic pelican]

...

[worthy steeple]

hmm its not, you either terrain camp or you're getting pounced from all sides and dying

[spiral kindle]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1njYuhDAS0s&lc=Ugy6vBs4jHF5W9sRZKl4AaABAg.AFE-t7vuTXXAFFl54i-kIl

Literally this video is amazing

[worthy steeple]

you literally said this this morning😭

[spiral kindle]

Hitboxes and omni issues

[cosmic pelican]

Exactly, so make it balanced

[worthy steeple]

how?

[spiral kindle]

Make bucking better on avg it should be 3 - 5 seconds pounce

[cosmic pelican]

Remove the goofy ahh stun, and buff the heck out of bucking, also remove the stam cost for it

[spiral kindle]

Before getting flung off

[spiral kindle]

Yup

Getting stunned and dying from full hp from literally a dino like Dilo is just not fun

[worthy steeple]

i agree with the stun, but terrain should still knockdown, just usual knockdown, not extended

[spiral kindle]

Yeah

[cosmic pelican]

Get rid of the rng aspect too, please dear god
Make it like how bile works, but for stam

[elfin night]

Most of omni issues are just bugs and jank

and I totally think they should be addressed

[worthy steeple]

still no idea how something like pachy can survive without terrain camping and getting pounced even with those buffs

[elfin night]

but when people ask for BUFFS

I just

[cosmic pelican]

Pachy just sucks lets be real here

[spiral kindle]

Diablo,Maia,Pachy and Stego have broken Hitboxes

[worthy steeple]

its not about pachy, anything small

[spiral kindle]

It's a general issue not just Omni

[worthy steeple]

just slows you down to walk speed and then you die

[cosmic pelican]

Dilo and galli press W shift and win

[spiral kindle]

Omni gets Rolled if the player has brain cells

[cosmic pelican]

Thats why bucking should be buffed so you have options

[elfin night]

if the player is in the open

[worthy steeple]

still doesnt mean terrain should get nerfed

[spiral kindle]

Plants can stop the pounce bro

General terrain

[cosmic pelican]

Players will use terrain regardless how bucking is, so its only fair to take power away from one side, if you give power to the other

[elfin night]

so if you're in the open and know about some serious jank omni has, omni cannot pounce you for long

[worthy steeple]

omnis are strong in plains as well as they're weak when players camp terrain, they cant be strong everywhere

[spiral kindle]

Yes

[worthy steeple]

i mean, do you expect omnis to just clip through the walls?

[elfin night]

it's not even that, they are "just" losing their pounce on terrain campers. If someone runs up to a bush or tree, you can dismount and go for bites

[spiral kindle]

Pack of Carno's destroy Omni in the plains and shuts them down but in general yes you could say so

[cosmic pelican]

It should be dismounted next to the victims feet, not locked into a "haha now you die" 5 second long animation

[worthy steeple]

yeah they removed that from bushes as far as i know (i quote potato)

[worthy steeple]

so they can come back, pounce again and deal more free damage?

[spiral kindle]

Then it just becomes an m1 dinosaur Dilo has higher bleed and dmg output from bites and gets rewarded by being able to use clones

[cosmic pelican]

And the victim should have other options aside from hard camping. Fighting omnis is just straight up boring because you just stand still.

[worthy steeple]

like if there's no punishment they will come back again and again and do the same thing

there will basically be no difference between terrain or open plains

[cosmic pelican]

Remember when bucking dropped you off at your preys feet? You can get a hit on dismounted omnis that way

[elfin night]

so I think the bush thing should be addressed

[cosmic pelican]

Same thing here

[elfin night]

although I will still dunk on omni victim complex

[worthy steeple]

i think everyone hated that

[elfin night]

because it is worse than troodon's

[cosmic pelican]

Yes, but this is for terrain, miles better than the current system

[worthy steeple]

well yes, better for omnis, but not anything that fights omnis

[cosmic pelican]

Omni gets hit but doesnt die instantly, the victim gets to use bucking without it being a death sentence. Everyones happy

[worthy steeple]

i think terrain in survival game is one of the best things you can and should always use.

its not just pvp after all, you need to survive

[cosmic pelican]

And you will still be able to use it

It just wont be a free win

[elfin night]

https://youtube.com/shorts/Wz8izqCY0v8?si=UC2IuAwyQV33Q8YT so skillful!!!

[spiral kindle]

Yes ofc but even troodon does better against Terrain abusers Cera and Dilo are no question lol

[worthy steeple]

well idk about that tbh, i need to spend some time thinkging about what you said

[cosmic pelican]

Troodon gets stunned too 💔

[spiral kindle]

Troodon benefits from tap pounce

[spiral kindle]

Omni tap pounce is awful now

[cosmic pelican]

https://tenor.com/view/spongebob-patrick-star-mmm-cheesy-cheese-cheesy-gif-19257011

[worthy steeple]

i played troodon yesterday, guess what kiilled me

[spiral kindle]

D-Sync / broken hitboxes

[worthy steeple]

yes...

[cosmic pelican]

Ok so in summary:

Terrain:
-being scraped off doesnt stun you anymore (still takes away some of your hp) and drops you off at your preys feet
Bucking
-now works kinda like bile, the less stam you have the easier it will be to make you dismount, so omnis that are below X% stamina wont be able to use pounce effectively, essentially putting a soft cooldown on it
-removed stam cost of bucking for the prey

[cosmic pelican]

Skill issue

[spiral kindle]

Yet the devs feel the need to nerf troodons hp from 120hp to 60😭 and dmg from 120 3rd stage to 100😭

[worthy steeple]

https://tenor.com/view/scream-loud-scream-girl-kid-hispanic-girl-gif-3761151244536557927

[elfin night]

cheesy reaction

[cosmic pelican]

Bro has not heard about the juvi troodon speed nerf to 13kmh

[worthy steeple]

ohh hmm that sounds good ngl. i changed my mind. the bucking system sounds good

[cosmic pelican]

When I saw the clips I was considering moving to BoB and becoming a velo main

[spiral kindle]

Crazy

[worthy steeple]

i can feel the nerf btw, like i know when something should die but it DOESNT DIE

[worthy steeple]

NOOOO

i pounced that sub dibble at least 4 times during 3rd stage.. it got pounced like million times in total

[cosmic pelican]

Jokes on you Im too broke to buy that game so Im stuck here with giga nerfed troodon ;-;

[worthy steeple]

but it didnt die...

[elfin night]

troodon punching bag niche

[worthy steeple]

troodon (hatchling compy niche)

[cosmic pelican]

No dmg, no hp, no speed, arguably worse stamina efficiency than stego, venom is nearly useless, doesnt even do good bleed, gets countered by any type of terrain. 💔

[worthy steeple]

THEY SHOULD GIVE IT SOMETHING IN RETURN

like i legit think slow baby troodon with venom is amazing

BUT IIT DOESNT HAVE IT AS FAR AS I KNOW

[cosmic pelican]

At this point why play troodon when juvi omni is better 😭

[worthy steeple]

🥹

[steep gazelle]

The last test I did showed that Carno's charge causes 130 damage (to the body), but I didn't charge it to the maximum to give the stun, they say it's 175

Carnotaurus needs a health buff to at least 1500 and Cerato needs at least stam cost on charge bite

[worthy steeple]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-speech-bubble-cat-drinking-water-stupid-stupid-cat-gif-12327862702270255434

[raw arch]

Huh?

[steep gazelle]

How do you have a video of me taking a shower?

[elfin night]

radiation

it should have its teeth and claws coated in radium

[steep gazelle]

I tagged the wrong person xd

[raw arch]

xD

[steep gazelle]

@signal sentinel

[worthy steeple]

i live inside your walls

[worthy steeple]

LMAOOOO

potato will love that idea

tbf even i love that idea

[steep gazelle]

Let's take a bath together, come on 🫣

[cosmic pelican]

Troodon, dies from its own radiation niche

[worthy steeple]

😳

[elfin night]

kills an adult stego with two pounces over the course of 5 days

[elfin night]

no, it survives cuz godzilla relative. both fictional reptiles

[worthy steeple]

DONT SPOIL NEXT UPDATE

i swear tenonto and troodon are both devs punching bags

[cosmic pelican]

1 minute fly but troodon gameplay, imagine

[steep gazelle]

In the next update Troodon will have its damage reduced to 50 in stage 3, as it is very op

[cosmic pelican]

If that happens Ill switch to spiro...

Ill be lonely, but Ill have a decent troodon

[steep gazelle]

Revive Spiro my brother ✊✊

[worthy steeple]

LMAO

[cosmic pelican]

75dmg on stage 3, but magnetic pounce, incredible stam regen and grows in 30 mins

[elfin night]

troodon has health

so op. it should die as soon as it spawns

[worthy steeple]

i agree with troodon OS rex with one pounce if the fix the magnetic pounce

[steep gazelle]

Increase the stam cost for Troodon's pounce to 90% This will balance it out

[elfin night]

@raw arch only land buff I'd ever accept is to younger ones

it is insane how deino has been in the game for over 3 years and still they didn't do anything about younger ones being worse swimmers, runners and walkers than their adult counterparts

[raw arch]

I can agree with that

[elfin night]

you just get walked down to death if you are spotted by an adult one that is 5-6 tons heavier than you, ridiculous and part of why deino is ass

and since it is a croc you can't juke or outmaneuver

[raw arch]

It's really just the trot speed, the sprint speed is fine for both Julie and adult, a small trot speed buff for younger ones would be nice

juvie*

[dry forge]

sa

[crimson crater]

what “free dmg” unless you’re afk simply fight back

[worthy steeple]

https://media.discordapp.net/attachments/807809192537882647/1099161731445567568/attachment.gif

[hasty coyote]

yes, it should be a good tool. Atm, it ends up being too polarizing. You either use terrain and omnis now struggle, or you dont and you struggle.

All I want is the power budget to be like 40/60 buck/terrain compared to how it is now where its more like 20/80

Make bucking not rng and based on the dino. So a stego may take a lot longer to throw off an omni so that the omni can deal a noticable amount of damage with a pounce, but a pachy would throw an omni off quickly so that it doesnt die to a single pounce.
Make terrain no longer knock down, but instead do some combination of forcing dismount / dropping at feet / dealing a large chunk of damage / draining a large chunk of stam. So its still very bad to get scraped off, but it isnt guaranteed death.

[minor axle]

They used to make it not guaranteed death by having knocked off omnis scoot off on their butts, but I believe they patched that glitch

[iron tree]

^

[solid wyvern]

Pounce consume a lot stam. You can't spam it realistically

[iron tree]

if you miss you can just try again without any punishment

it should get a one second recovery animation imo

[solid wyvern]

They nerfed in on HT? I thought that nerf to juvie troo was the only nerf

[spiral kindle]

No those changes i said was months ago

Like last year

[worthy steeple]

you can? it does a lot of damage as well, just retreat and regen stam, let the group members attack it

if we make omni completely ignore the terrain its going to be NIGHTMARE

[solid wyvern]

I wasn't voting for that

Issue is that it getting stunned

[worthy steeple]

yes, it should get knocked down, but not for as long as it does right now

[worthy steeple]

tho i like this suggestion.

[crimson crater]

eh would still be a death sentence in most cases

[worthy steeple]

good? if you're little rat get ready to die if you decide to fight a cat

[crimson crater]

how is it good

just makes fights boring and repetitive

[worthy steeple]

so do you expect them clip through the wall?

[crimson crater]

i expect them to be dismounted

forced off you

[worthy steeple]

so basically almost the same thing? you can still attack it?

[crimson crater]

no

you don’t get knockdown

[worthy steeple]

or if you're slow enough to attack that means theres no difference between fighting omni in plains or using terrain

because they will get free damage and then dismount with no punishment and pounce you again?

[crimson crater]

which is why bucking needs to be made useful again

[worthy steeple]

how that matters? still just free damage

[crimson crater]

what free damage? you can fight back

[worthy steeple]

how? its on you

[crimson crater]

before it jumps on you

you can also just position yourself in a way that it can’t latch on

[worthy steeple]

yeah sure, good luck with that

[crimson crater]

ye pretty easy to kill them when they get close for a pounce

[worthy steeple]

depends what dino you're playing, lets be real here

i dont see something like pachy winning if terrain gets nerfed

or anything small that is not fast enough to run away

[crimson crater]

pachy dosen’t 100% rely on terrain in order to win and its a whole separate problem

it struggles in general

[worthy steeple]

alright, what about sub cera?

and other animals that will get added in future

[crimson crater]

yea like i said bucking should be buffed to make fighting omnis less tedious and “unfair”

[crimson crater]

it gets decimated by it unless the cera is 500 and below

[iron tree]

that'd be a nightmare

they could just pounce again and again and again

the knockdown should be shorter though

[elfin night]

Bro

get gud or delete omni. Pick one

[iron tree]

delete it

please. I hate omnis

[elfin night]

I hate omnis too

Because Omni and JP Raptor mostly

Delete omni, brutally rework dilo. Perfection

[worthy steeple]

https://tenor.com/view/mgrr-metal-gear-rising-revengeance-armstrong-raiden-handshake-gif-25514798

[elfin night]

Also buff troodon so it replaces omni as a more interesting and quirky pouncer

And of course.

Pounce back to austro

The long lost king, soon to be returned

[hasty coyote]

@late torrent I agree with all but the hp and stam regen ones (excluding gastro and tactile). They're only really useful outside of combat so I think thats fine. The rest I 100% agree with though.

[late torrent]

Good point

[hasty coyote]

Genuinely I don’t understand how half of these mutations made it to live, let alone are still in game.

[late torrent]

We dont know who is responsibel for balance so we porbably will never know

[steep gazelle]

@late torrent The only mutations that should be removed are the speed and damage ones, the others make almost no difference.

[late torrent]

Even Tactical endurance?

[worthy steeple]

yes lol

tactical should be changed to “50% stam reduction on successful hit”

so game actually rewards you for good plays and not getting hit by something lol, that’s ridiculous.

so basically what it will do is give you 50% stam back if you hit target successfully, in case of teno you will lose 3% stam using tail slam but you will get 1.5% back if you hit the target

[iron tree]

Personally, I think tactile is fine

Maia isn't doing too well without tactile

[worthy steeple]

i’d say between all the meta ones it’s one of the least op, but it doesn’t make it less of a meta

[iron tree]

yeah

[late torrent]

I agree with rewording player for good skill

[edgy crow]

#balance-feedback message osteo? really? same with cellular regen?

[late torrent]

Osteo is kinda against pachy , cellural just good for after fight so I see the point only about cell

[hasty coyote]

The fact that dinos require a specific mutation to function just proves that combat mutations are toxic for game balance.

[iron tree]

yes

but that's just maia ngl

[elfin night]

an ideally balanced playable (or close to that) wouldn't need to crutch on mutations

definitely a maia issue when it comes to combat

[iron tree]

yes

[elfin night]

@stark mirage great and bright idea, totally flawless

Just make it so that herbivores are debuffed or handicapped around their nest or in hotspot patrol zones because some random carni died there or (in the second case) the whole place is full of bodies the local ceras refuse to eat and you can't do anything about it

or just prevent herbivores, which easily make up for less than a quarter of the playerbase at a given time in a server, now are punished for grouping up in order to stand a better chance against the million carnivore players around

while ofc carnivores can make 10 cera megapacks without any problem

keep that up, bro!

(notice the sarcasm?)

[stark mirage]

No need for the sarcasm. You bring up some good points that could potentially be exploited. Your first point i think herbivores shouldn't be affected by carnivore bodies or ai bodies, since carnivores pretty much only hunt each other anyway due to it being easier and them being way more plentiful like you said. I believe cera packs are a problem in of themselves. With almost no counterplay one of the reason being bc of people always gravitate towards playing the best thing at surviving. Cera for one has Inherit bleed resistance and I thing it has built in gastro healing for some reason?

[steep gazelle]

@haughty grotto Why didn't they delete the mutations that help carnivores more than herbivores, but delete the only one that actually helps herbivores?

[hasty coyote]

cera doesnt have built in gastro healing, it has damage resist around corpses. But it is prob the best abuser of gastro since they have a bottomless stomach so they can gorge and heal to full.

But your suggestion is still only focused on herbie+herbie, not carni+carni or even carni+herbie. Even with herbie+herbie, you havent specified how it detects " helping each other" because that could lead it its own host of issues. Would me playing diablo and not killing the dryo next to me cause me to go insane? Would the galli who keeps staying just out of reach of my stego cause me to get debuffs? etc, etc.

Similar debuff mechanics have been thrown out a lot, and I have not seen a system that doesnt introduce more/worse problems, have major exploits, is incredibly convoluted, or is easily countered. Imo, the best way to stop herbies from making a giant death ball is to make a giant death ball unsustainable, like with carnis (generally). Like change the way plants spawn so that large groups will have a hard time feeding the herd unless they split up.

[stark mirage]

Ah, I see what you mean. Although, I gave a general idea which would take time and resources to actually flesh it out and consider all posible exploits and issues, which your criticism actually helps me think about. I would say if it were to be a thing i think a similar mechanic should be implemented on the carnivore side aswell. I think your idea on the surface is a much better balancing idea because it is quite simple to implement. One issue i could think of right now would be at this time there is no competition for food on the herbivore side that would even provoke aggression towards one another for fear of starving. Actually for a herbivore it is impossible to starve to death because grass is infinite in the isle. Which means you could forever survive on 15%. I like your idea a little bit more though.

[hasty coyote]

yeah I do think grazing and plant spawns in general need to be changed for there to be competition without just deleting all plants lol.

[woven wind]

Is it just my opinion or is the Cerato vomit perk OP, especially towards smaller species like the Omni ? Just one bite and the chase is over, they make you puke your guts.

How about a nerf, like instead of 80% of your stomach, you lost 10/15% per bite ?

[minor axle]

It would be funny if you could grass indefinitely but it would both fall faster in hunger while providing “filler” nutrients in all 3 overtime (which would block nutrient filling of the amount in each, already equally, and would decay at a normal diet rate)

Ofc this could work for a limited stomach too. But the idea is more about the punishing nutrients.

So you can survive on grass but not thrive

[minor axle]

IMO it should be something that isn’t instant but instead an infection that makes you sick over time, that way it’s not really a combat (at least short term) tool but instead is deterrence

[woven wind]

Yes why not, something not immediate but something you need to take action to counter if repeated too many times or that is left untreated in time (why not eat certain types of plants that you need to find to heal, a bit like cats and dogs that eat grass to clear their stomach etc)

[hasty coyote]

only issue is that there isnt a debuff for having 0 nutrients, and as something large, even a horrible diet doesnt matter if you have a massive herd.

Personally, I hope grazing just locks out hunger similar to vomit, prob like 2x hunger filled is locked out from the top. The lockout should take some time to unfill and can't be cured by salt licks. So you can only fill up to 33% of your hunger, and if you keep trying to survive off it, you WILL starve.

[viscid mica]

@pulsar tiger poop…. is not a balance feedback it would be #general-feedback at best and even then we do not need to be that realistic

Poop mechanic is some of the ye ye ist thing he ever heard

[minor axle]

I was thinking more for younger ones, but yeah. Maybe the grazing nutrients could give some debuffs as it fills up (like a malnourished condition).

[stark mirage]

I might have got lost in a complete understanding of what you are trying to say, but the general concept being is in an ecosystem health is everything and if a animal is unhealthy for too long, not fitting into the niche it was meant to fit in, it will inevitably die from malnourshment. Animals in the wild are either healthy or dead. For example, if you took a random animal out of the wild, more so true for omnivores, and you feed them a diet out side of the niche they were evolved for they will live seemingly healthy for a period of time and then fall over and die out of the blue.

[hasty coyote]

the low growth rate is enough for juvies imo. the issue I have is just with mega apex herds who can just tank the garbage stats because most things cant even approach them to begin with, let alone like 5.

[wild briar]

Adult deinosuchus need more prey other than dinosaurs

[minor axle]

I’m not talking dying (though that’s a valid suggestion given what carnis suffer).

I was more talking about things like lowered speed/attack speed/damage/maybe even lowered max health and slower healing for as long as the malnutrition lasts.

I don’t dislike starvation punishments, but I’d prefer for it to encourage carnivores to attack malnourished (weakened). Not necessarily all of them at once, but probably several of them in combo.

Also would be nice to have at least 1 malnourished skin, so predators can tell from afar. (If wouldn’t entirely fix overpacking, but would make the herds weaker)

[minor axle]

Even if it wasn’t healable, it not being immediately would make it more of a deterrent to make big carnivores not want to lose their food. Salt could also work for a simple solution. Honestly, even if we don’t get a “cure” making it not instant would be huge

[signal sentinel]

Ok so this is a response to the previous feedback I gave about carno where I compared it to cera and said it needed help, last night truly cemented this fact for me, 1v1 against a cera(although not really as a group of raptors kept harassing him and I didn't try to kill them as honestly I wanted to fight a cera and truly see if I was crazy) and every blow we either traded or I had the advantage, fought until I was red, left, gastro healed all the way back to full in just a few minutes, cera barely had the opportunity, then went back and fought the cera again, traded nearly every hit except for a few where either I got a clean hit or he did but in general it was very even, still ended up losing, no body buff on the cera either, that I can confirm for sure, and you know, I might have won if not for a small fall that drained almost all my stam, but I can't be the only one who thinks a cera basically tanking two rounds from a full health Carno back to back where they traded almost evenly(if anything I headshot and bodyshot far more without any retaliation) and still lose is not crazy, thats not taking into account the raptors that while barely a factor and were mostly seemingly acting as distractions, did still seem to get a bite or two in. I don't think they should nerf Cera, but I don't think Carno should be this weak either, my boi really needs some help.

[steep gazelle]

Cerato needs 3-4 charged bites To kill a carnotaurus and a carno you need at least 7 charges to kill a cerato

[viscid mica]

3-4? PFT HAHAHAHA

even if they are all max charge you need 5 minimum

Mind you that means all are max charged bites

[steep gazelle]

Cerato needs urgent changes. It is the only carnivore that has an ability without cooldown or cost, the only one that can have its rmb ability affected by damage mutations and not to mention the Absurd stun that's practically like being knocked down xd

[viscid mica]

The only change it needs is the removal of the animation lock on vomit allowing them to sprint so they don’t get free hits and it’s not even urgent

Cera isn’t fast enough to bully the whole roaster if you simple don’t fight them

[steep gazelle]

Yes, considering most Ceratos have at least 1 damage mutation

[viscid mica]

Your assuming every charge bite is max charge which is simply wrong

That’d be like assuming every charge attack from carno will be a full potential charge meaning you can knock down and does 250 damage to cera

[steep gazelle]

I didn't say all of these things need to change, I just pointed out how much they are all op together.

[steep gazelle]

Carno can't take down Cerato and the maximum damage of the charge (not counting multipliers for head damage) is 175

[viscid mica]

Tbh I really don’t think cera is all that op, while it certainly needs a nerf it’s only “that strong” cuz nothing carni wise is bigger

[viscid mica]

It can you have to charge for like 20 seconds it’s kinda dumb and yes I counted hs because it’s like I said a max potential charge

[steep gazelle]

You can get an idea of how strong he is by the fact that he can take on the strongest herbivores and carni on the island in small groups.

[viscid mica]

I mean kinda but same time not? Like if the skill level is the same a stego or dibble will roll the cera.

[steep gazelle]

Sure, I understand that the game needs something to kill the larger herbivores, so I hope he at least has his vomit stun removed.

[steep gazelle]

1 dibble can face at most 2 ceratos, 3-4 the dibble simply doesn't stand a chance

[viscid mica]

If the ceras are competent maybe I’d say dibble is a 1-3 on average

Cera gotta really know their spacing to not lose anyone

[signal sentinel]

That statistic according to last night literally cannot be possible, I charged bro over 10 times in the body alone, not even including tail and headshots that I got, not to mention the insane number of bites we traded, and bro landed far more than 4 charge bites on me before I died, that might have used to be the case but I don't think it is nowadays

[steep gazelle]

What I talked about was the carno charges and the cerato bites that hit the body accurately. What happens most with Carno is that you think you hit the body but actually hit the tail.

[viscid mica]

I mean did the cera have a body ?

[twin ivy]

yo so does the dev have some crazy fetish with dibbles because they are the most OP thing ever it is insane

[viscid mica]

They really aren’t

[twin ivy]

right....

[viscid mica]

Your new and in-experienced so I’d give it some time

[twin ivy]

okay how do you kill them in current game

evirma

[viscid mica]

As which Dino cuz they all do it differently

[twin ivy]

okay then please explain because me and my 4 friends just tried to kill a solo dibble for 3 hours

[viscid mica]

As what

[twin ivy]

a cera and a dilo

tried both

[minor axle]

Ever? No. But stego and dibble both benefit from being added when, to be Frank, they really shouldn’t have (especially stego), with no real predators (they can be killed by groups of skilled players, but in the isle those two rarely come together)

[forest heron]

please add a suicide button. getting stuck in holes until you starve is miserable. sometimes the unstuck command doesnt get you out

[minor axle]

They won’t be nearly as strong feeling when T. rex is around (though Ofc trike will be the new super herbi, but still a much more even match)

[viscid mica]

So with cera you circle it and bait out alt attacks (where it 180s to attack behind) and then you get your hits in. Rinse and repeat it takes a good bit of time as bro has 3k hp to chunk through

[twin ivy]

yeah we did that but its like 1 hit and your insta dead

[signal sentinel]

Even assuming that is the case, let's assume ALL of those, even the ones that were directly from the front were tail shots, can a cera then according to this tank 8 direct bites to the front, then get in a trading match back and forth because while I had run out of stam and was already low I decided to make my final stand on a hill where we traded bites back and forth, where it took about 5 charged bites to kill me, keep in mind this was while I was already not doing great on health as we had been biting eachother the whole way to the top of the hill

[twin ivy]

so if there is more than 1 its just insta gg

[viscid mica]

As dilo it’s generally the same thing BUT what you wanna do is get it to t3 venom (where it’s purple) who ever applied it backs off and get everyone to get 1 bite in after it’s t3 so they can use t3 too and then you jsut keep distance and spam clones reapply the venom if it fades(recommended you do it at night) something to note is if your not on HT (horde test) dilo venom is currently none functional

[viscid mica]

Were you all full grown?

[steep gazelle]

If you don't charge Carno for a while the damage he does is 130

[twin ivy]

yes with the gens to take less dmg from larger dino and the night one and yeah we tried the clone spam with poision

[viscid mica]

Cuz that coulda just been a hacker as it should take far hits as cera and 2-4 as dilo

[viscid mica]

Ya dilo is broken on regular right now patch is awaiting the horde test to fix that

And dilo is very small so dibble can chunk their health in 3-4 hits

[twin ivy]

yeah it still wasn't enough it just feels so insanely one sided like they have nothing in the game that can compare atm and takes 7 hits to be able to poison them

just kinda seems insane and with them insta swapping stances

[viscid mica]

Against dilo venom doesn’t work rn so dilo can’t do anything

But cera it’s 100% do able

It’s all about spacing and timing

Like I said your new and it takes time to learn how to hunt up

Dibble might be strong but hunting them is all about experience and knowing game basics for hunting that take time to learn how to do effectively

[twin ivy]

i mean i guess but 300 hours in i got a pretty decent understanding it seems super insane with nothing else in the game to counter it consistently

[viscid mica]

It’s certainly a different beast than hunting stuff in your weight class as dibble are nearly 3x your size as cera and well over 3x your size as dilo

Have you ever grown a dibble?

[twin ivy]

yes i have

[viscid mica]

I’d give it a whirl and see how it moves and fights

Hope a skilled group attacks you and learn from how they do it

[twin ivy]

yeah thats what me and my friends did and it got boring killing everyone lol

[viscid mica]

Unlucky I mean it doesn’t help much when your in a group of 4 barely anything can fight that many dibble without severely over packing as there aren’t any real mid sized carni yet

try moving solo

More stuff will fight you

[twin ivy]

we did a duo and 7 ceras came and it was pretty easy

[viscid mica]

I mean most groups that over pack or mix pack are pretty bad at the game lol

There a reason they need them numbers

[viscid mica]

You could have also run into a dibble 1 trick that was just that skilled that happens too

[haughty grotto]

I'm saying they should delete both or keep both
If gastro will be removed then so should tactile

[twin ivy]

i mean yeah but its kinda crazy that the you have to play almost a perfect fight no mistakes to have a slim chance against a bad dibble player lol

[viscid mica]

Na if it’s a bad dibble you will have a pretty easy time as they’ll spam alt attacks and have no stam leaving a lot of openings

You’d only need to play a perfect game to hunt a very experienced dibble

If bro thinks dibble is op im scared of the day you dare to try your hand at a stego hunt

Stego are super strong at defending themselves from the smalls

[twin ivy]

brother im talking about the dinos they got in the game right now

makes hunting dibbles extremely hard

[viscid mica]

Ya I never mentioned anything coming

Dibble is a hard hunt yes if your not experienced and don’t understand the tactics you have to use

[twin ivy]

and yeah i fought stegos and they were easier it felt

killed 2 stegos out of a group of 3

[viscid mica]

My god you must have found a awful stego to hunt cuz they usually roll the hell outa new players

Hell even I find stego hunts rather tedious compared to dibble

Dibble is just rinse and repeat the same strategy “bait alt attacks get free hit rinse repeat”

[steep gazelle]

But there is also gastronomic for herbivores... But I understand what you mean. But by removing tactile, some herbivores would need to have their stam expenditure completely changed to be better, As is the case with Maia

[twin ivy]

idk i feel like its much easier to bait stego swings and they have a longer time before they can attack again compared to the dibble being able to insta 180 and swing right away

[viscid mica]

Ah you fought bad stegos who didn’t use power swing

[twin ivy]

i mean they were doing power swings to do the knock down

[viscid mica]

Power swing have a rather short cooldown those are the tail raised attacks they do A TON of damage and stun

[twin ivy]

yeah they were doing those ive also played stego before

like i said i got like 300 hours not insane but also not brand new to the game

[minor axle]

I mean imma be real (admittedly I’ve played since legacy) when I picked dibble up it really wasn’t that hard to play. I killed a decent number carni players (as a solo) without too much of an issue before finally dying to a noble 1v1 with another dibble.

[signal sentinel]

I know, but assuming that the various headshots and bodyshots were all counted as tailshots, how much damage do you truly think a cera, or hell even a carno can absorb, I hate to say it but I think that info is out of date at this point, unless basically evey attack me and that guy were throwing, including the ones from the front, were tail attacks the numbers just don't make sense

[viscid mica]

Ye ye, sorry I just haven’t seen you much in the discord so I tend to assume it’s new players especially now of all time. But over all like I said dibble just takes some practice as you wanna bait those 180 hits and have someone come in from behind to get a free hit. Or if they are in sparring come from behind it’s a lot of waiting and baiting

[viscid mica]

Oh ya dibble is super simple to get good at but hard to master

[steep gazelle]

This is The Isle, are you surprised to find a bug?

[viscid mica]

A “beta” at that

[steep gazelle]

Yes, beta... For 5+ years...

[viscid mica]

Most games are in alphas that aren’t even publicly accessible for 10+ we get to play as the work smh

[steep gazelle]

Sure...

[viscid mica]

[signal sentinel]

Eh I wouldn't be shocked at finding a bug but I sorta have a hard time believing that one, granted then again I ain't a programmer and considering how my baby, dilo, is aka when I was fighting him the clones half the time didn't spawn and when they did they were kinda brain dead so I killed both dilos which has made me think twice about playing dilo until the next update, I guess it ain't impossible that it was more buggy then I realized

[viscid mica]

Ya clones are broken main branch envirma rn they work on HT thou

[minor axle]

At least dilo can be played as a speedy scavenger. But it’s harder to scare people away if they know about how the clones are.

[haughty grotto]

I don't think so
Without tactile, herbivores would have to actually think and not spam attacks without any consequences

[viscid mica]

HT has working clones

[viscid mica]

This is fair

[haughty grotto]

Maia needs a bit of love from an attack animation speeds standpoint
That's got nothing to do with the tactile mutation

[steep gazelle]

Herbivores have consequences for using their attacks

[minor axle]

But then you have to play ht.

Simply not worth it smh

[haughty grotto]

No they do not if they have tactile

[steep gazelle]

The only playable currently that has no consequences for missing his skill is Cerato.

[haughty grotto]

Cera and Maia are both outliers
One has too little consequences and the other has too many consequences
Neither of them have anything to do with tactile

[steep gazelle]

Even having your stam back with tactile, missing your skill most of the time leaves you vulnerable to attacks for some time

And it depends on who is attacking you barely recover stam

[haughty grotto]

That's the case with every dinosaur, not herbivores.
If you spam you leave a window open for counterattack
Except only herbivores get their stam back whereas carnivores run out

Imagine if a raptor pounces you and you're almost dead and it runs out of stamina
Then you hit it once
Then it pounces you again cause it got stamina for free
Can you imagine the horror if Omni had tactile?

[viscid mica]

Fun fact omni pounce doesn’t give any tactile benefits

[steep gazelle]

I agree with that. A troodon, carno, omni, deino have to handle their stam with care, but larger herbivores (and cerato) don't need that.

[haughty grotto]

That is the entire point.
Large herbis should not be exempt from this rule.
Everyone should watch their stamina

[steep gazelle]

Tactile really is a mutation that should be removed, as well as the 3 Damage mutations and the 2 Speed mutations, gastronomic too

[haughty grotto]

Agreed

[steep gazelle]

But the other mutations you mentioned in your suggestion don't make sense to take out of the game.

[haughty grotto]

That is what I'm saying

I did not mention any other mutations

[steep gazelle]

No? I must have confused it with another suggestion then

Forget that last comment xd

[haughty grotto]

#balance-feedback message

[minor axle]

Day cycle Speed mutation should be made dilo exclusive (and water speed beipi exclusive)

I’m not biased or anything

[haughty grotto]

Dilo should have weight reduced to 300
I'm not biased either

[steep gazelle]

Why?

Although that wouldn't be so bad, it would be better to just remove both the photo and the noc from the game.

[pulsar tiger]

i just pinned a herrer as raptor twice in a row and it broke out of it instantly both times when i had 90% stamina. is that normal or is that guy cheating?

[viscid mica]

Hacker prolly

[dusky surge]

god no

[minor axle]

Fine, we can just make dilo run 90mph base then 😢

[hasty coyote]

were you by terrain that could have bugged the pin and kicked you off?

[slim dragon]

Day cycle speed mutations should simply not affect speed
Hydrodynamic should not be available to semiaquatics since they're already hydrodynamic

[elfin night]

@glad wasp learn how to use it. Ptera can fly across over half of the map wasting like 30% stam in case you find some elevation or hill

Also air currents are coming soon

[woven wind]

• Make the Cera use chuck of stam to use vomit / OR
• Make the vomit less powerful (needing more bites to work. Why not add vomits stages ? Or a system much like the bleed ?)

[cyan ferry]

Are you actually holding rmb lol

[indigo rain]

I might reccomend that instead of only asking for mutations to be removed that new ones be proposed to replace them. That way theres at least less loss of options.

[indigo rain]

As long as you are not pressing space, you should not be losing your grip.

[indigo rain]

You dont need to hold rmb for pounce anymore. Its space to dismount. Lmb does damage. Rnb does bleed. Tapping both does negligable damage but you burn far less stam so your pack has more time to pounce on and pin the target with you

[cyan ferry]

That's interesting, I don't play Omni or troo so I wasn't aware. In that case, probably was a hacker😔

[indigo rain]

Yeahhh prob

[crimson crater]

#balance-feedback message @cyan ferry how long would the cool-down be hypothetically speaking

[cyan ferry]

2-3 seconds imo, but that would be for the devs to figure out. It just shouldn't have the ability to be held down indefinitely and then immediately used again

A cool down wouldn't be necessary if it slowed them down considerably

[iron tree]

a cooldown is unnecessary

just give cera its slide back

it'd prevent spamming and would force ceras to use their charged bite more wisely

[worthy steeple]

i’d say slow it down while it’s charging and it’s good

[woven wind]

Hit their stam pool harder, it's way more agile than the Carno with the same weight. Or nerf its turn radius

[iron tree]

Hell nah

The slide and a slight speed reduction are fine and would make it less overtuned

The slide would punish ceras for missing its attack

Carno doesn't even have to fight ceras

It can simply run

[woven wind]

I'd agree with a slide or some sort of punishment that allows for an opening, which it don't currently have (no drawback for missing an attack)

[iron tree]

When cera dropped it had a slide on its charged bite

[woven wind]

Even the normal bite does significant damage and you can spam it while turning

[iron tree]

Charged bite is meant to be a defensive attack and not a superior bite

[iron tree]

So can literally everything

[steep echo]

Check out my cool graph

either I screwed up the measurements or omni is in the same awkward position as troodon

[crimson crater]

its agility? hell no

[hasty coyote]

Interesting. I’d like to see %dmg by %max weight, that feels like it would also be telling to any inconsistencies.

[crimson crater]

do you got one but on weight

[steep echo]

I have all the values on a bunch of them for weight, but I haven't plotted them

dryosaurus and stegosaurus have very closely matching growth charts which shocked me

[steep echo]

wait no I did #general-feedback-discussion message

[crimson crater]

on carnis tho?

[steep echo]

not yet

working on it

[crimson crater]

mind sharing it when you’re done? curious

[late torrent]

You know guys , we are talking about balncing , writing all that feedback stuf , but let me ask one question , can we at least know , who are responsibel for balancing the game? Who are making the decision that mutation like Gastro and Speed boosts are ok? Who decided that troodon is op and needs a nerf ha?
Who is reading that feedback exept , us felow players? QA team? Who are they? Im not troling , I really wanna know peopel who are(or is?) responsibel for game balance

[steep echo]

As far as I know, Dondi himself has taken over control of balancing, but I have no clue how detailed that control is.
I imagine a 39km/h juvenile was ridiculous, and any speed changes made to it were just overtuned

[stark knoll]

Hypno also helps with game balancing

And they still take community feedback as well

It's not a 1-person effort

[late torrent]

Problem is that with such low speed as carnivore , you cant hunt , run away , change your location fast you realying on luck , thats not good

[steep echo]

I didn't think it would be, but I've heard it thrown around that dondi gets the final say

[late torrent]

If its like these thats really not good

[sick lion]

why is it when you pin someone with the omni that it takes me forever to let go? Or is this a bug because thats how it feels.

[steep echo]

it is a hordetest change, I really doubt it's a concrete change

[late torrent]

Imedeatly press space bar

than it should be faster

[late torrent]

I hope so

[sick lion]

thats exactly what i did, i was stuck for at least 5 seconds until 2 tenos came and killed me. well its the isle, what can you expect lulz

[late torrent]

Unfortunatlly you are right , bugs are bugs , we cant controll them

[steep echo]

@crimson crater which ones do you want to compare?
Carno is the most extreme, dryo is the least

[crimson crater]

herrera and omni

[steep echo]

herra is on top, omni on bottom

Full graph.
It's missing galli, beipi, deino, hypsi, pachy

[crimson crater]

nice

[slim dragon]

Now make the Y axis total biteforce instead of percentage, it would be funny to see

[steep echo]

I only have the biteforces of most of the carnivores but okay

omni has the wackiest one, but I might've measured wrong

[slim dragon]

Omni has a
What's the opposite of a growth spurt ?

[steep echo]

stunted growth

[warm cloak]

Arrested development

[steep gazelle]

#balance-feedback message @cyan magnet dilo in pack of 4 can hunt diablos and stego (during the night)

If a dibble stays in stage 3 venom overnight, it is dead. There is nothing he can do but accept death

But there is a way to counter Dilo's clones, which is to keep walking or running, when you do this the clones will not attack you, but if you stop for a moment, all the released clones that have not yet disbanded will attack you.

[haughty grotto]

@cyan magnet maybe you need a bit of practice but dilo is the strongest carnivore in groups currently in the game

[cyan magnet]

i understand that part. I think the health is the main concern

[haughty grotto]

It needs nerfs not buffs

It's already way bigger than it's supposed to be

A pack of 4 dilos can hunt anything in the game, except stego

And I swear I'm not saying this out of any bias
Ive played all carnivores heavily, including dilo, and I think dilo is by far the easiest with it's insane run speed, bite speed and risk free clone mechanic

[steep gazelle]

This "low" life he has is something that is completely overshadowed by how deadly he is.

[elfin night]

even stego in the open at night is doable

especially in HT where all clones work or if the stars align in the live branch

dilo is disgustingly overpowered and in a very cheap way

[haughty grotto]

The problem with stego is that it can just blindly oneshot and any lucky hit will be a kill

[elfin night]

true

[haughty grotto]

It's tail strike time is instantaneous and reaches too far out on its flanks

[elfin night]

dilo maybe lacks speed as a full adult to properly deal with it

[viscid mica]

@steep gazelle so basically make Maia op? Like reduced cool down higher damage and less stam while being one of the fastest things in the game? Your legit asking for it to be as op as it was in its HT it don’t need all that

[steep gazelle]

3-4 ceratos will still kill the maia without any problems, what are you complaining about?

5-8 omni

3-4 dilo

It's just a bit lame that something weighing 3.8t has the same damage as something weighing 1.3t in the base value of its bite xd

[steep gazelle]

Maia consumes stam on literally every minimum movement and attack he makes

Obviously you will still need to know how to play with him. An inexperienced player who catches Maia must die to 1 solo cerato

[worthy steeple]

it’s not tho

cera is also not 46.9km/h

[steep gazelle]

If you can't dodge a Maia, even though he has a horrible spin but good speed, I can't do anything

[worthy steeple]

i like how you insta switched to aggro mode xD

no, i know how to dodge, that doesn’t mean maia should outdamage cera.

[viscid mica]

Maybe I dunno use maias greatest weapon SPEED

Like I’m not saying some tweaks to Maia aren’t fair

But that many buffs to out out right power would not be healthy for it

And would cause it to be HT op

You can Literally run down carnos I don’t think it needs to be that strong and fast

[steep gazelle]

"3-4 ceratos will still kill the maia without any problems, what are you complaining about?
5-8 omni
3-4 dilo"

[steep gazelle]

3 good carno can kill 1 maia

[worthy steeple]

maia doesn’t need anything outside of some qol

[viscid mica]

Bro 3-4 cera can kill almost anything without to much concern your legit talking about group sizes that can wipe basically anything solo bruh

[viscid mica]

3 good carnos can kill everything except dibbles and stegos

Your not even helping your point

Bro I hunt stegos with 6 omni easily like

What’s your point

4 cera and dilo can easily kill a stego too

[steep gazelle]

That's exactly the point, it's currently like that with Maia. The biggest problem is the excessive consumption of stam for any attack, increasing your damage by 50 would just be an extra

[viscid mica]

At most a minor tweak to the reactiveness of attacks so it’s less clunky but it’s not meant to be a high mobile brawler like teno it’s mean for fight or flight specializing in flight

@maiden ginkgo brother it ain’t the Dino it’s the gamer that’s got good motion tracking lol

[cyan ferry]

You can just ... Run away and disappear

Troodon of all playables is like a ghost

[maiden temple]

Make a sudden turn and sit down, nothing is finding you

or crouch if you're noisy when sitting

[steep gazelle]

That's what I would like for Maia, faster attacks and lower stam consumption would already help him.

[viscid mica]

Ya but why all the extra shtuff that would genuinely make him op!?

[steep gazelle]

@maiden ginkgo Troodon is not that easily tracked, but you are probably stalked by cera and carno just as easily by the sound of their footprints.

[steep gazelle]

How would 50 more damage make Maia op?

[viscid mica]

It’s the combination of all of them

[steep gazelle]

50 more damage on the stomp wouldn't make as much of a difference as you might think, but I understand. If Maia had his cooldown between attacks reduced it would help a lot, but I doubt the devs will do that.

[viscid mica]

50 damage, faster attacks, less stam consumption….

Plus being as fast as they are

It’s legit HT Maia

Which was SUPER OP

Like dibbles on speed

[dusky surge]

nah, not like HT maia at all

HT maia had far greater acceleration and turning in biped, which is what made it so dominant

current day maia is far more escapable

[viscid mica]

The problem would be the amount of damage out put his suggestion would lead too if it’s faster costs lest stam and does more damage getting knocked over then HS like Maia do would be devastating and Maia are so fast that a skilled Maia who knows how to shift between bipedal and quad the accel wouldn’t matter

[pure jay]

@lean vapor That is nothing, I get hit oh 2x further distance on 8 ping :v

Just how the game is

Desync/clientsided combat, if they change it then you won't hit anything anymore

[lean vapor]

yeah thats gigacope. Has nothing to do with desync, it is literally how the hitboxes are

[pure jay]

The game is super desync, go play with a friend and screenshare

On that carnos screen you were 10 meters off

[dusky surge]

It’s absolutely desync. If you play it on a low pop server with two people on low ping, hit boxes are super tight

[solid wyvern]

You can kill clones without damage, no?

[shrewd jungle]

you cannot get rid of them without them hitting you first

[solid wyvern]

If you well time attack it should be possible

At least I remember that it worked like that

[solid wyvern]

Well there actually was video by Nickboay that some hit boxes consistently busted (they repeatedly hits in the same areas where they physically shouldn't)

https://youtu.be/1njYuhDAS0s?si=KbB6dP0E4o52JiUp

Skip to ~5 minute

[crimson crater]

no its latency issues, you can test the hitbox for yourself

[lean vapor]

yeah I did, its scuffed

[bronze carbon]

just found out, that you need 21 elite fish as full grown deino to get ur stomach full from 6%

[dusky surge]

Fair enough

I’m more surprised you were able to find and eat 21 fish lol

[minor axle]

Give the ai spawn patterns people have been posting, it seems you either find all or nothing xd

[elfin night]

Now it doesn’t work

Because of their bs timing

[crimson crater]

#balance-feedback message how dare carno be strong against omni and pachy

[solid wyvern]

Well I remember that I managed to catch them in right timing without damage

[elfin night]

Now it doesn’t

[dusky surge]

“It’s very OP against smaller dino” made me audibly laugh

[elfin night]

Your anecdote is meaningless with the current dilo, sadly

Now the only thing that can save you is dilo clones not biting you if they bug

Which doesn’t happen in ht so unless you can jump, climb or are a good swimmer, you are done

[keen plover]

saw a clip earlier of a ht dilo killing 2/3 carnos. third one ran away

2 fgs and one sub i think

dilo is back to what it was it seems

[elfin night]

My problem with carno charge rn is how it is fing impossible to dodge in the open

Unless you can jump over the carno

Why even give it bad turn then

But I am fine with carno being able to spam it and in all fairness it doesn’t do all that much damage

It just doesn’t really feel like it is just a lag thing when carno anywhere just manages to magically hit you while you dodged the charge and you are like 2 meters away from the carno but they can still chip away at your health while missing their charges

Not really an earned kill

[thorn mountain]

guys it needs nerfs its good at killing small game 😦

[edgy crow]

almost like its.. a...

https://tenor.com/view/the-isle-carnotaurus-the-isle-evrima-evrima-dinosaur-gif-16978147132789972619

[edgy crow]

#balance-feedback message why are you going after a stego as herreras?

[mint star]

thats extremely wierd though

[edgy crow]

it is

but it doesn't change the fact you shouldn't be going for a stego as herreras

[woven wind]

The same problem with the Pachy head kick, they can headkick you when you're behind them

[solid wyvern]

Kinda nice that at least teno have very polished hitboxes unlike others

[woven wind]

Yes, Teno boxes quality should be the standard for all Dinos

[solid wyvern]

I suspect that cera and dilo also have OK hitboxes.

Dilo hitboxes are frustrating due to their small sizes but it probably intentional

[woven wind]

Problems with Cera are its strenghts and almost no weaknesses compared to other Dinos, apart from its slow run speed

[elfin night]

Nah

Cera is mostly fine

Just that everyone plays it because it’s the “land carnivore apex” atm and coincidentally the scavenger is extraordinarily easy to grow

No competition+people refusing to cannibalize when there’s food because that’s how human beings work+big carnivore bias from the community+above average playable right now in the meta= ceras everywhere

Just nerf charged bite as well as a few mutation synergies like not letting them heal beyond 100% stomach with gastro and we’re golden

Still a very good playable that hasn’t been nerfed into oblivion and does its job fine

[woven wind]

Problem I have with the Cerato is its turn speed relative to its weight.

It turns better than a Dilo with 400kg more, I would have no problems with its other perks if it wasnt so agile.

[dusky surge]

just dont have gastro lol

or rework the thing

[elfin night]

I agree with the rework too

Not like I would really care if someone lost progress if it got removed tbh

Because it’s just one dinosaur that you can grow again

[elfin night]

Because it needs to turn well

It’s a defensive carnivore. It should be a risk to approach one

Dilo doesn’t really need the agility as it stands because it’s so damn fast and its ability doesn’t need constant engagement, just a quick bite and running afterwards

[solid wyvern]

Idk why but despite the fact devs for some reason hate teno and consitently nerf it - teno still remains a solid playable which dangerous to fight with

Not to speak that teno players are second bloodthursty hebivore mains after pachy players lol. And it is while tenos attacks are more defensive than offensive (most of power comes from back direction attacks)

[woven wind]

That's because herbies lives are too easy with plenty of food available everywhere, so they get bored

[elfin night]

Teno is just an inherently strong playable

By design. Simple but good

[crimson crater]

they hate it? don’t think so lol

[maiden ginkgo]

I'd like to believe that, the heavy rain should have masked them quite well.

[solid wyvern]

Well people say that it was nerfed countless times

I don't remember who stated that

[crimson crater]

people exaggerate, last it was nerfed was nearly half a year ago and they also did compensate it

[dusky surge]

it does get micronerfs pretty consistently

[crimson crater]

like

[worthy steeple]

they didn’t compensate

[worthy steeple]

kick nerf, tail slam nerf, acceleration nerf, agility nerf, knockdown nerf.

love, when tail slam is practically useless against omnis because they recover almost instantly

[crimson crater]

they increased the kick hitbox + increased the damage on the front alt attack

[worthy steeple]

the kick feels the same, it was adjusted, not buffed

[crimson crater]

its agility didn’t get touched and what knockdown nerf are u talking about lol

[crimson crater]

increased = buffed

[worthy steeple]

they nerfed tail slam by 50 and kick by 25 to give 5 damage to alt bite? you call that compensation?? lmao

[worthy steeple]

it can’t knockdown for as long as it could before, and agility got touched, i even have a feedback on that.

[crimson crater]

they also reduced the lock out thing when you miss a tail-slam, you’re not as vulnerable

[crimson crater]

huh? every knockdown duration is universally the same no matter what dino performs the attack

[worthy steeple]

no? it’s not.

[crimson crater]

yes

common knowledge

[worthy steeple]

you mean how fast animal gets up no matter what knockout attack was used?

[crimson crater]

yes

[worthy steeple]

ahh that yes

[crimson crater]

alr what did you mean then

[worthy steeple]

some animals get up way faster now which makes tail slam almost completely useless

[crimson crater]

like?

[worthy steeple]

omni

[crimson crater]

it has always been like that

[worthy steeple]

anything that is not carno tbf, but carno gets up way too slowly

[worthy steeple]

no, it wasn’t

they used to lay on the ground for at least a second or two, now it’s just almost instant

[crimson crater]

does this only apply to them being knock-down by tenos

[worthy steeple]

teno suffers the most, because it’s the one that should turn around run back and kick. dibble can easily do the combo

[crimson crater]

omni has had a fast recovery from knock-downs since like spiro days, still don’t get what you mean

[worthy steeple]

it wasn’t as fast as now lol

[crimson crater]

can you show patch notes to back up this theory of yours

[worthy steeple]

this is what i mean, BARELY any time to run back and kick, and you can’t even headshot because of how fast they recover.

what’s the point of tail slam if it doesn’t knockdown for as long for you to do the actual combo?

[worthy steeple]

i’m not gonna look at all the patch notes to find that lol.

[slim dragon]

https://tenor.com/view/godzilla-kong-vs-battle-fight-gif-21122673

[worthy steeple]

so what we got:

acceleration nerf.
agility nerf.

kick nerfed by 25
tail slam nerfed by 50

knockdown is so short tail slam becomes almost useless.

here’s the list you wanted.

[crimson crater]

dude omni has always had a fast recovery, since gateway or even before

[worthy steeple]

you can argue with that but that’s doesn’t change things

[worthy steeple]

wasn’t like this before, that’s for sure, just look at the old spiro videos. and it doesn’t matter when it got changed, it got changed which makes tail slam a lot less useful

[crimson crater]

knock-downs aren’t short on the tail-slam? omni takes just as fast to recover from any attack

[worthy steeple]

they are, look at the video i sent

i mean, doesn’t matter if it’s short knockdown or fast omni recover, teno suffers from that, that makes tail slam less useful, that’s the point

[crimson crater]

🤦‍♂️

can you prove that omni takes longer to get up from other attacks

[keen plover]

omni used to take 3 seconds to get up back in the day

was altered in update 5