balance-feedback-discussion

[viscid mica]

Also you can also play is slow pull the cera way from dibble fight a little than run again

Some Dino’s that don’t stand a chance against a group like that like troodon but your faster than them and can just run away

Most smalls are significantly faster than dibbles and can run carnos are strong but if your faster than cera you can make good distance than fight em as carno is strong but not that strong

Plus carno is super weak to bleed

So you just needs apply bleed and keep running

[wanton igloo]

Those are viable tactics. But they aren't fixing the issue, which is what the balance feedback channel is for. I appreciate the feedback though, maybe your in game experiance could help find a solution that supports carni players realistic hunting styles and upholds the realism for the rest of the game.

[dusky surge]

#balance-feedback message

A 60 PERCENT CHANCE TO JUST NOT TAKE DAMAGE FROM A STEGO HWAT

[wanton igloo]

Just an example lol

[dusky surge]

absolutely wild example lol

having a chance-based mechanic which more often than not punishes the stego for predicting and reacting to attacks

[wanton igloo]

I'm no dev lol but if it can one tap an omni and theyre suppsed to be experts at killiin stegos, theres gotta be some advantage

[dusky surge]

omnis should not be experts at killing stegos, frankly

[cosmic pelican]

For a second there I thought you were talking about bucking

[dusky surge]

if you need to artificially make them better at it to make them experts, they aren't experts

[wanton igloo]

yeah i agree but this isnt real life and compensation for that is common in games\

[wanton igloo]

yeah but with a 1 hit KO thats gotta be fair

[dusky surge]

it's the opposite. It's exceptionally unfair

the stegosaurus is now absolutely screwed over

[wanton igloo]

then adjust the number to balance it to be fair

[dusky surge]

landed a perfect hit and spent 15% of your stamina? damn lol get screwed random chance

an omni should die instantly upon being hit by a stego, no matter what

it has speed and agility for the sole purpose of avoiding said attacks

allowing it to facetank goes against the idea of omni and the idea of stego

[viscid mica]

I mean nuking the ability to be close to herbis aware or not isn’t a solution either

[wanton igloo]

its just a chance not a guaranteed survival mechanic

[dusky surge]

a 60% chance. Literally more likely to just tank it than not

[wanton igloo]

so what would you propose to help the issue?

[viscid mica]

like i said bigger dinos

[dusky surge]

Also chance based mechanics are godawful in games like this. I don't think EVRIMA has basically any chance based mechanics at all for that reason

[viscid mica]

pov bucking

[dusky surge]

i wonder how well that's being recieved

[viscid mica]

its super unused

[wanton igloo]

what?

[viscid mica]

everyone just runs to trees

[wanton igloo]

Bucking?

[dusky surge]

almost like chance based mechanics ain't good nor fun

[wanton igloo]

i mean, IRL im sure stegos missed all the time lol

[dusky surge]

yea, and they can miss in-game too

[wanton igloo]

fair

[dusky surge]

but when my tail is literally gliding over the omni, and the game says "oh that's a miss actually", that's just the omni inexplicably tanking a tailstrike, not a miss

its like giving stego a 60% chance to just not take damage from a rex bite. not fair to rex at all

[glossy elbow]

there are hard counters in this game if you're an omni and you try to fight a stego you're going to die simple as that

[wanton igloo]

you keep going back to 60%, even though that was just an example, so what if it was 30%? A rex wouldnt do much damage to the plates on a stegos back so a chance to miss or do less damage could be applicable

[wanton igloo]

thats my point, so then why is stego on omnis diet?

[glossy elbow]

juvie stego

probably

[wanton igloo]

true

Then a pack doesn't get enough food though, and isnt that the point of a pack? to take down bigger prey to sustain the pack?

[dusky surge]

would still be unfair to the rex

if it were 10% it'd be unfair to the rex

[wanton igloo]

because every bite isnt guaranteed 100% damage? the stego is already a tank (not to a rex obviously) the solution for that could be to apply the buff to the trike instead, an animal of similar size and caliber. The success rate could also rise with each failure and then reset back to full chance range on a successful attack (for the rex example). it would need to be uniquely calibrated for each dino but it could work

[dusky surge]

why would the buff need to be on trike?

[iron tree]

A rex wouldn't go for the plates though

[dusky surge]

if we're thinking "similar size and caliber", an omni shouldnt have a buff against stego

[wanton igloo]

Not intentionally but misses do happen

[wanton igloo]

true but were talking about the preferred diets here

i admit though the game would start to feel like party animals if every hit didn't land 😒

[iron tree]

Why are people already talking about buffing trike...we literally don't know anything about its stats

[dusky surge]

then that really just screws over herbis then, doesn't it? herbis dont get the same buffs that carnis get, because they don't have any playables on their diets

[wanton igloo]

who wants to buff trike?

[dusky surge]

i feel like you're missing the point of what i'm trying to say

[iron tree]

I just replied to your message

[wanton igloo]

Herbies are already hard to kill

[iron tree]

But I keep seeing folks saying trike is gonna be weak and needs this to survive rex, etc.

[wanton igloo]

it just doesnt seem to make sense that carnis that have a specific herbi on their diet die to them in most fights

[iron tree]

They should be hard to kill

[dusky surge]

thats the idea, yes

[iron tree]

It may sound weird but I like broken herbis... (as long as they don't invalidate 70% of the roster)

[wanton igloo]

ive never played trike but i expect it to be a total powerhouse on drop, so i agree they should be hard to kill but not so hard to kill that they come out on top in most encounters with the species thats suppsed to keep their numbers in check

[wanton igloo]

no i think they should be a challenge to kill, dont get me wrong, but i do think they should be threstened by the carni that is supposed to kill them specifically.

[wanton igloo]

itd be like a croc irl having a 90% death rate to water buffalo 😂

[urban delta]

deinos can kill stegos...

[wanton igloo]

not adults

[urban delta]

yes the ycan,,,

[wanton igloo]

not with a grab

[glossy elbow]

why does every bite not need to be guaranteed?

[urban delta]

ive seen a deino kill 4 stegos

[iron tree]

Rex vs trike should be situational and dependent on both skill and experience. It might be its natural predator but the animal evolved to counter its predator

[glossy elbow]

if the stego is swimming it can

[wanton igloo]

Really?!

[glossy elbow]

yeah

[urban delta]

dieno can kill stego its like 50/50

[wanton igloo]

at full grown a stego can get grabbed by a deino?

[dusky surge]

yup

[glossy elbow]

if it's swimming yes

[viscid mica]

Yes if swimming

[wanton igloo]

i did not know that 😱

[urban delta]

they can kill on land too.. its just stego easlily runs away if its low

[wanton igloo]

A rex vs a stego not getting every bite was an example to illustrate a rex irl biting the plates because a stego would be moving and misses could happen, if you land a hit on the head then, you know, theres no plates to bite so that chance wouldt be attached to that hit box area

[wanton igloo]

I suck at fight stegos on land then cause ive died to stegos as an adult croc many times (no food and i was desprate)😂

[urban delta]

are you saying like a random chance to miss?

[urban delta]

i mean its hard im just saying its possible

[wanton igloo]

Within the applicable hit boxes and a limited chance. not a 1-100 chance

[iron tree]

Real life rex would shred stegos

[urban delta]

this game should not have any RNG when fighting..

[dusky surge]

^

[iron tree]

If it bit its back it'd be game over for the steg anyway

[wanton igloo]

yeah which is why i agree that in that scenerio the chance to miss shouldnt be applied to a stego

[urban delta]

imagine spending hours growing and finght then lose because your unlucky

[dusky surge]

^

[iron tree]

The isle is a survival game. Every mistake could be your last

[dusky surge]

i dont think anything would make me wanna quit more

than being screwed out of 5 hours because of bad luck on a literal landed hit

[wanton igloo]

same, which is why i thin k it would need to be adjusted for each carni vs herbi.

[dusky surge]

like, people already despise random crits in TF2, and this is somehow worse to play with than those, because a random miss basically looks at you successfully doing something and tells you "no"

[wanton igloo]

you don think theres a way to make a random chance that isnt like TF2?

[urban delta]

but your saying random chance should be added when it shoudnt at all..

[wanton igloo]

0ne that works to balance thinks like this?

[dusky surge]

if its literally on if your attack does something or doesnt do something, TF2 feels like the applicable comparison

[dusky surge]

there is no way to balance things like this. the idea of random misses are inherently unbalanced and more importantly, unfun

you did everything right and the game decided you dont get that

[wanton igloo]

so what else would you propose? im not glued to the idea of random chance buit i would like to see someting shift in the game

[iron tree]

If you die
it's because you made a mistake or didn't react. But a random chance of missing attacks in a fight would be horrible. What if an attack that should have hit but just didn't could've changed an outcome?

[wanton igloo]

I agreee that would be frustrating, what alternative could we use?

[iron tree]

None

[urban delta]

what problem are you trying to solve?

[dusky surge]

genuinely none

[iron tree]

Combat is fine

[dusky surge]

the system atm is "you get hit and you die" which is the idea

anything added on top of that just removes the simple yet effective design

[iron tree]

The game just needs something you can do besides fighting

Like playing as a juvi or patrolling an area

[wanton igloo]

it wasnt so much a problem as a suggestion for more dynamic gamplay, is a bit odd to me that you can have a prefered diet that your nourishment relies on but killing those prey animals is (in my experience) usually resulting in the carnis death

[iron tree]

If you die in a hunt you made a mistake

Happens in real life too

[wanton igloo]

yeah, it just feels like herbis have TOO much of an advantage in combat

[iron tree]

Not really

[urban delta]

they should have an advantage

[dusky surge]

they need an advantage

[iron tree]

If you ambush a pachy as a carno and get the first hit in you're gonna have the advantage

But if the pachy spots you and breaks your leg the pachy has the advantage

[wanton igloo]

"It might be its natural predator but the animal evolved to counter its predator" i think the inverse of this should apply too, carnis are adapted to hunt specific prey which means they should have some kind of advantage, instead it feels like some carnis arent really more suited to take down trhe specific herbis they need to survie even though theyre supposed to specilize in hunting that prey

[iron tree]

A large herbivore will always have an advantage over a smaller carnivore

[iron tree]

That may be true when larger predators drop but right now there isn't really a large terrestrial predator

Teno vs carno/cera is a pretty fair and equal fight

Cera/Carno vs stego isn't and will never be fair

[dusky surge]

carno isn't great at punching up, which of course is the idea behind it

[iron tree]

Yeah I know

[wanton igloo]

so maybe bigger lobbies where theres more oppertunities to get into proper combat with dinos could be a better option?

[iron tree]

I think the game needs less lethal combat

It needs more survival elements

[wanton igloo]

That sounds awesome, what kind of elements are you thinking?

[iron tree]

Maybe like territories or happiness/stress

So like

[wanton igloo]

I thought of territories too, how do you envision them working?

[iron tree]

If you keep your animal healthy and happy it's gonna be in an overall better shape than an animal that keeps murdering everything that moves

[mint star]

kissen says that patrol zones will be for more than just food

[iron tree]

Maybe some species are territorial while others are nomadic. You can access all recourses freely and if you're low on recourses you've to either expand your territory or move. And you've to defend it ofc

[iron tree]

I saw. But patrol zones aren't really territories

But I don't know what the devs want to do with the pzs

[wanton igloo]

thats be pretty cool, my idea was similer but i think player controlled territories would add some really dynamic gameplay

[wanton igloo]

thats be pretty cool, my idea was similer but i think player controlled territories would add some really dynamic gameplay
[9:51 PM]
I'm curious, how do you see territories working for carnis?

[hasty coyote]

2 things:
1: I'd rather them just change diets to not include dinos that they reasonably shouldnt hunt. Like stego genuinely hard counters omni, the dino with prob the BEST flank defense on the whole roster vs the dino specialized at attacking flanks. Omni likely has stego for juvies and if a daring pack decides to take it on, since an omni pack is the most consistent way to kill a stego atm other than diablos and other stegos (or a deino if the stego lacks a brain). Imo, the way the diet list works needs to be changed (since we are getting a roster of like 60 dinos, and you're telling me I can only eat like 10?), but for now they work and you have organs if anything.

2: Dinos already have advantages over their preferred prey based on their playstyle. Carno is incredibly fast and deals decent damage, which makes it terrifying for smaller dinos that its designed to hunt. Or cera having massive bleed resistance until it gets low on hp so that it better tanks the attacks of other carnivores. Or omni having high agility and good bleed so that a pack can run circles around a diablo and whittle it down.

[wanton igloo]

Both of those make sense to me

[viscid mica]

@wanton igloo you obviously haven’t grown a deino recently

Deino is hands down hardest Dino to keep alive rn

[wanton igloo]

i got to 80% just fine last week, a bigger croc got me though

[viscid mica]

Why do you want to nerf a Dino struggling

[wanton igloo]

the Deinos biggest threat is other deinos

[viscid mica]

Na it’s hunger

[wanton igloo]

I don't think they need a nerf, I do think a more difficult progression to get to the unstoppable adult phase like Sweaty Oni seemed to be suggesting a few posts before mine, plus if your smaller and not growing you don't need as much to eat to survive.

I play croc pretty often and I rarely die to hunger. Its always other crocs that are bigger or in a group that kill me.

[viscid mica]

But it doesn’t like

It’s already a 4-6 hour grow

[obtuse ocean]

Why is it unstoppable? Your litterly swimming in a tunnel where 90% of the stuff can kill you. Deino is hard to grow atm, cus of food and that is good.

[true ginkgo]

Not sure why people want hogs to be free food for babies. Boars are terrifying creatures, and should absolutely be murdering juvies.

[wanton igloo]

There’s isn’t a Dino in the game right now that can Kill a deino by hunting and out damaging it unless the deino player let’s it happen. (Yes a Stego can absolutely kill an adult deino but only if that deino gets caught with nowhere to go, because Stegos aren’t chasing/swimming down crocs in rivers and lakes to kill them, deinos are basically unstoppable by death from other species unless they play very poorly) The opposite is true though for other species, once a deino grabs any Dino in the game and goes to drown them, there’s virtually no escape unless the Dino’s Stam was low when they grabbed them, and even when they have full stamina if the prey gets away they’re so slow in the water that the deino can just swim up and grab them again and they’re done. I don’t feel like that power needs to be nerfed but I do think that that level of power should be earned. Plus if deino players stop growing at a point until they have the diet to grow beyond that, the issue of having enough food to eat diminishes because the food requirements to keep smaller crocs alive are much smaller so your chances of living longer increase.

[viscid mica]

Yes having to spend 4-6 hours dodging other deinos and hunting isn’t enough

Mind you that’s usually the later as having a good-perfect diet as deino is insanely hard to pull off especially when your under 3T

And once more semi aquatics that grow far faster come deino growing will get EVEN HARDER

[wanton igloo]

I guess I’m just thinking about where the game is now and its slow rate of introducing new Dino’s into the game. At the current moment, with the size dev team we have, the new Dino install rate won’t be adding more aquatic Dino’s for years.

[wanton igloo]

None of this would change or get any more difficult, it would just have a cap. And being full grown doesn’t reduce the threat of other deinos or manifest more food, so it’s the same all around.

[viscid mica]

This is fair they rate of Dino’s is agreeably slow and doesn’t help the games health much

[viscid mica]

I just don’t see why it should be any different to other apexs

Stego already has massive grow speed advantage due to simply being a herbi

[wanton igloo]

For real

[wanton igloo]

I think it should ONLY because full grown deinos are almost guaranteed a meal when they grab it, while other apex’s might get their prey or might not depending on the prey’s skill level, you can’t use skill to escape a deinos jaws so if players who are victim to a deinos grab are pretty much guaranteed to die, I think that level of power should be difficult to attain for croc players, with all due respect to the hustle 😂😂

[viscid mica]

I’d highly disagree simply existing as a carnivorous apex makes you a massive threat to everything’s existence

Any slip up can lead to instant death from a apex

Land apex’s are imo far more threating as they can get you anywhere

[wanton igloo]

True, but land apex’s can’t secure every hunt with a single grab like crocs do. If a Rex could pick up a trike, or any Dino in the game for that matter, and hold it until it bled out, I’d say the same thing about Rex’s

[viscid mica]

Deino can’t either?????

[wanton igloo]

Bro, how do you kill Dino’s as a deino? You grab it, it can’t get away and you drown it.

[viscid mica]

There are certain conditions that must be met for a deino to yoink a lot of things and as the large tier+ Dino’s widen that will only make it harder reducing even further the number he can get

[wanton igloo]

Once we have more Dino’s yeah that’ll be great, but for the moment, there’s nothing they can’t grab in the roster except a standing stego. Grabbing a Dino off the shore isn’t that hard.

[viscid mica]

Yes but nerfing it now will nuke it later and it will take a lot of time to rebalance it

To be fair it’s already in a rough spot due to fish nerf

It went from rare to pachy rare

It’s basically unplayed on NA servers beyond afew

[wanton igloo]

Yeah, that is a big problem

[warm birch]

Hi Islanders. Is there a better way to hunt as Deinosuchus ? It seems that no matter how close I am, when I chomp, most of my attacks are missing, even when launching out of the watter that should be a 100% hot as a prey is drinking. Is it a skill issue or a bug. There is no indicator or a mouse pointer.

[viscid mica]

I won’t even consider a deino nerf until they revert food and turn speed

[viscid mica]

If you use the m2 lunge and are double their weight you can bring em under and drown them even if it doesn’t look like they are grabbed keep holding m2 might be a delay

Trying to brawl anything with deino is a bad idea thou anything other than another deino

[wanton igloo]

DefeatPete on YouTube has really good tutorials, but you can get some speed with shift on approach and if you surface just before right clicking, you’ll swim fast on the surface and automatically launch into a grab as soon as you touch land.

[warm birch]

Ive seen him, Thanks !

[wanton igloo]

You know, I forgot about the turn speed, I think that’s just a bug though I had that issue before the last update.

[viscid mica]

It happened like 2 updates ago or so

[crude cairn]

Just give me a source of carbs/dots as young deino, a chicken, a deer, anything. Having three playables on the list is painful, especially in some spawning locations.

[twilit roost]

I think many people are likely sitting in the dino selection screen for extended periods of time. It makes the ridiculously long queues longer for those who are actively playing.

[urban delta]

Yeah obviously it's crazy the device haven't done anything about it..

[wheat mica]

I'm amazed it's not already part of the game, afk kicking is kind of a standard feature

[jade prairie]

Hm, people sitting in queues are generally doing so in hopes that theyll get an egg, right?
So say, when youre sitting in a queue (maybe you are in 4th place), there is some indicator as to whether eggs are currently available and as to whether there are public eggs incubating. Next to this is a button that you can click 'waiting for egg'
You see that there are currently no eggs available so you click the 'waiting for egg' button.
You get to 3rd in queue and then 2nd, nothing changes
You then get to first in queue. Nothing seems to change, except that you see the total number of people in queue dropping - they are getting in before you because you allowed them to bypass you while you wait for an egg.
At any point, you can unclick the waiting for egg (or perhaps a different button that is 'proceed') and get in the game - you retain your number 1 place in queue and will be the first in when a slot opens up. Then you can choose your egg (or not, if you prefer.)
(Along with this also kick those who are afk too long)

[stark knoll]

@rocky vapor Hypsi is planned to get climbing, like herrera

[viscid mica]

Soon.tm

@worthy steeple when did you last grow carno

[worthy steeple]

yesterday

[viscid mica]

And why do you think a small buff isn’t fair?

[worthy steeple]

alright, here’s the things i didn’t like:

• hp buff, with the current insta acceleration and insta ram last thing carno needs is hp buff

• teno applying bleed with its kicks is dumb? what?

• it shouldnt be balanced around fighting cera, it should be small game hunter devs want it to be

[viscid mica]

They nuked it pre cera drop due to it over preforming like cera is rn cuz nothing stands to cera

But I don’t think a cera nerf is nessecary a minor health buff would make it super strong

[crimson crater]

tbf kicks are more blunt force dmg, bleed dosent make much sense

[viscid mica]

Yes teno applying bleed in kick is stupid the toe claws aren’t hooked and have no reason to be drawing blood

[worthy steeple]

it got claws

tenos bleed is such an amazing defensive tool, without it it would be super weak

[dusky surge]

brother idk what to tell you but there are MANY animals which will leave you bleeding like hell if they kick you

teno isn't a hooved creature, it isn't just striking you with blunt instruments

[crimson crater]

not really super weak, the damadge makes more than up for it

[viscid mica]

Not hooked claws you are kicks with the bottom of the feet the claws ARE NOT DIGGING IN

[crimson crater]

maybe but i wouldn’t mind it getting toned down a little

[dusky surge]

it really doesn't need more nerfs, shadow or otherwise

[worthy steeple]

last thing i expected is discussing tenos bleed

[viscid mica]

I’m not saying remove it

Just that carno bleed is nutty fast

[worthy steeple]

i guess it’s carno problem

[viscid mica]

And needs faster heal

[dusky surge]

carno def needs its bleed vulnerability looked at

[viscid mica]

For bleed that is

When it sits

[crimson crater]

with its recent buffs i feel like it does

[worthy steeple]

what buffs?

[viscid mica]

Like I don’t see a minor weigh up being terrible and would add some competition for cera where it isn’t steam rolling all current predators in its weight class but doesn’t over buff it to the point of being op

[dusky surge]

its tail can stun somewhat better. it still does pathetic damage and locks you out of attacks, but it can stun bigger things

[worthy steeple]

oh yeah i know about that buff, but it’s like nothing tbh, doesn’t change anything

[crimson crater]

hitbox increase on kicks and missing tail slams dosent make you as vulnerable as before

[viscid mica]

The moment allo drops my entire life goal is to bully the teno, dibble community that stalks you to the end of the earth when your a carni

[worthy steeple]

when did they increase hitbox?

[viscid mica]

Last patch

[crimson crater]

night vision patch

[worthy steeple]

#general-feedback-discussion message i’ll remind you what they did to teno

like you can’t ask for more nerfs before they fix this

[dusky surge]

till the end of time teno will be nerfed until people realise that having a versatile, well rounded kit is not a reason to screw an animal over

[crimson crater]

the damadge nerf is nothing except for the tail one, pretty sure its front alt attack got dmg buffed btw

[worthy steeple]

100 dmg for the tail slam that locks you in place and stuns the target for what? 1 second? 0.5?
sometimes you can’t even do the combo

[worthy steeple]

5 dmg

[dusky surge]

woah

nerf teno

[crimson crater]

yea it has all that but with no proper drawbacks, increase the stamina on kicks to 3.5 or 4% and it’s good

[crimson crater]

huh

[worthy steeple]

it’s too much

especially with the maia in the roster

[dusky surge]

way too much given how most stamcosts are balanced atm

[cosmic pelican]

it went from 125, to 130dmg

[crimson crater]

i see, thought it was more

[viscid mica]

Nothing particularly needs a nerf

Only 3 Dino’s come to mind needing actual buffs

The rest are just bug fixes

[crimson crater]

how many times will you be able to kick with 4% per kick

[viscid mica]

@worthy steeple and what do you think needs a nerf

[dusky surge]

not enough, especially as an animal designed to combo its attacks + stam threshholds existing + the low rate of stam regen

[worthy steeple]

dilo, cera, maia needs some tweaks

[dusky surge]

a kick should not be nearly as much as a stego alt swing

[worthy steeple]

there’s a lot of things i would change but it’s mostly nerfs+buffs which means rework, not just nerfs

[viscid mica]

Bruh what

Maia!? Maia is weak af

Dilo is just some bugs related to venom and cera is fine for now while we wait for bigger things

[crimson crater]

yea but with the amount of dmg it does, you can kill most opponents in 3 combos. it will be more than enough no?

[viscid mica]

Cheesy is not cooking here

[worthy steeple]

i’d like you to join norden and try to 1v1 with the local maias.

good luck winning as cera or teno

[dusky surge]

the amount of damage it does is less than a cera who gets that damage for free.

i think that's fine

[crimson crater]

cera is another playable that needs a nerf. should we buff every playable to accommodate an OP one, sounds like power creep and dosent justify teno in anyway

[viscid mica]

Not everything should be based of the sweats who exclusively care about PvP in norden

Plus I still think I could win as cera

[crimson crater]

teno also can stun which allows it to get a free headshot in, so technically it does out dmg cera

[worthy steeple]

it’s not about sweats, its about potential maia has

[dusky surge]

cera can also puke which allows it to get 1-2, sometimes 3 bites in

honestly its crazy convinient for huge burst

[worthy steeple]

i said that before and i will say it again, maia was a new playable, people didn’t know how to play as maia.

and now they will learn and everyone will suffer

[viscid mica]

If your only basing it off norden PvP I can’t respect your opinion

[worthy steeple]

people see videos on youtube with one omni killing standing still afk maia and they’re thinking maia is weak

[crimson crater]

simply not tru, biting something cancels the animation.
how the hell are you gonna get 3 bites in unless your opponent just stands there and lets you lmao

[viscid mica]

Brother I grow everything myself

[worthy steeple]

the biggest problem with maia is it being too good against cera and teno and being a lot weaker against something it’s designed to fight - dilo, omni and other small things

[viscid mica]

I’ve killed Maia with a 4 man troodon group

[worthy steeple]

you’re missing the point

[viscid mica]

Maia is not strong at all it’s got slow hits a single wiff is extremely punishing and everything costs stamina

[worthy steeple]

you’re missing the whole point

[viscid mica]

I’m not arguing for a Maia buff

Maia isn’t great but it’s mostly QoL stuff related to its janky hitboxes

But carno is certainly under preforming

Pachy needs love

And deino is gone to the point of being pachy rare due to the food changes and turn nuke

Those 3 need fixes related to stats

[viscid mica]

If all you argue if based on the top 1% of PvP players you’ll ruin the game for the average player

[worthy steeple]

you’re still missing the point

[viscid mica]

Clearly

And all you doing is saying I’m missing it with no attempt to explain

[worthy steeple]

it’s not about “1%” it’s about its design.

it should be balanced around killing small things while running from something cera or teno sized.

instead it’s really good against the teno and cera but struggles against single omni.

that “1%” will soon become majority once people will realize how to play as maia, how to be effective. and when that happens you will see 8 maias running around the map killing literally anything they can. because surprise surprise they can stun other dinos up to cera and teno size. 1v1 against the good maia is tough, good luck fighting 8 that you can’t outrun and hide from

[viscid mica]

Carno is not really good against cera or teno at all

[worthy steeple]

what carno has to do with maia?

[viscid mica]

Like I said basing everything off norden PvP isn’t fair to average players

[shadow vortex]

Norden is not an Antarctica secret super server, there play average people just like us… xd Except for several Omni mains, maybe

[worthy steeple]

will you ever realize that’s you’re missing the whole point?

[shadow vortex]

With other dinos idk, they all are played pretty much the same among everyone

[worthy steeple]

pretty much, yeah, todays so called 1% will become majority at some point

[viscid mica]

Norden is infamous for PvP players. Compared to official your average norden is far better

[worthy steeple]

you won’t believe me but norden players play on officials too

[viscid mica]

Still waiting for what the point is

[worthy steeple]

.

[viscid mica]

Yes and they usually dominate

[worthy steeple]

here’s the point you apparently didn’t read

[viscid mica]

8 of anything is pretty rough

[viscid mica]

Ya but it’s just not true

[worthy steeple]

not when it’s maia

[viscid mica]

That or we are talking WAY down the line

[worthy steeple]

not when it’s 3.8t tank that outruns almost anything

[viscid mica]

It’s not that easy to just “get Gud” with these Dino’s and it requires a lot of hour to be confident in predicting how other Dino’s act etc having to know how they play

As more and more people get the game and newer people or people from legacy come on stuff needs to be balanced around smooth brain not 500 hours+ of envirma

[worthy steeple]

what are you even talking about

[crimson crater]

nerf teno, cera and buff carno and maia, that shrimple

[viscid mica]

High skill players will always make a Dino seem super scary even if it’s not

[worthy steeple]

what it even has to do with skilled players?

[viscid mica]

I often solo-trioroam as troodon and can take even cera does that mean troodon is op? No it’s just that I’m sweaty with it

[viscid mica]

Na

[obtuse ocean]

And im still wondring why cera needs nerf, when its super easy kill as dilo 1v1

[worthy steeple]

please, read this, like actually read, especially the last part

[worthy steeple]

because dilo is even more op rn

[viscid mica]

Balancing should be focused around if your decently played you know what it does can you survive if you haven’t grown every Dino multiple times and how well you survive

[viscid mica]

Nothing does

[obtuse ocean]

Its not, its just that alot of stuff is just crap.

[viscid mica]

Like I said high skill players will always make stuff feel strong

[worthy steeple]

survive? okay, imagine you’re cera and you see 8 maias before you, survive

[crimson crater]

cera isn’t op, it just isn’t working as intended

[viscid mica]

You need to look at average skill of relatively newer players etc under 300 hours on emvirma

[viscid mica]

It is it’s just that nothing is competitive with it rn

[worthy steeple]

meowrima

[obtuse ocean]

Agree on that, still think it needs some nerf for chasing attacking etc.

[viscid mica]

8 of anything will kill you solo what’s your point!?

[worthy steeple]

…

8 omnis cannot kill a dilo, it can run away

8 stegos cannot kill a deino, it can simply swim away

8 dibbles cannot kill a cera, it can simply run away

good luck running away from 8 maias

[viscid mica]

[worthy steeple]

so i’m gonna ask you again, you see 8 maias, how will you survive that?

[viscid mica]

That’s obviously a extreme

[west plank]

yes i did that xD

[viscid mica]

I mean like there are ways to get away from that

[obtuse ocean]

Its what the game will become neways, its just numbers you need. Not skill, unless 1v1

[worthy steeple]

for example?

[viscid mica]

Hide and avoid

[worthy steeple]

how?

[viscid mica]

If your vigilant you’ll see them and can litterally walk away

[worthy steeple]

how would you hide from something faster than you?

[crimson crater]

you can’t really balance around situations like that. you’re supposed to die.
just nerf maias swim speed, will allow you to use rivers to escape

[viscid mica]

Bushes

[viscid mica]

THATS WHAT I MEAN

[worthy steeple]

they saw you

[viscid mica]

Yes balance around 8v1 super cool

[worthy steeple]

water is situational

[viscid mica]

[worthy steeple]

you’re missing the point

you should always be able to run away or fight back

[viscid mica]

You have no point

[worthy steeple]

you have no brain

[viscid mica]

BROTHER IT IS 8V1 ANYTHING WILL KILL YOU IF THEY WANT IT BAD ENOUGH

[worthy steeple]

no?

[viscid mica]

dibbles will stalk you to the end of the world like tenos do

[obtuse ocean]

I dont think mr rex can run away from a dilo : P

[worthy steeple]

.

[worthy steeple]

because it can fight back

[viscid mica]

If your in a water source with no escape stegos will trap you in it for deino

[obtuse ocean]

Oww yea, i tho you meant i should have the option to do both : P agree

[viscid mica]

Omni can easily keep pace with a dilo even if it’s faster and will eventually out stam it as they trot faster

[crimson crater]

3 carnos can kill a cera does that make carno OP?

[viscid mica]

You HAVE NO POINT

[worthy steeple]

it can’t out stam dilo

[viscid mica]

8 V 1 you just do a clapsing push

[worthy steeple]

carno is not 3.8 tons, cera has a chance to fight back, it’s not the same

[viscid mica]

Spread out and in circle

[crimson crater]

balancing around a severe number disadvantage dosent work without making 1 op enough to fight off a 8v1 or making the 8 so weak they can’t kill a solo dino

[viscid mica]

[worthy steeple]

you don’t get it, i don’t want to fight 8 maias, i want to be able to run away

[obtuse ocean]

You need to have someone stronger then others, even just to get a good ecosystem. I hope allo will defiantly attack 3 omnis if it can

[crimson crater]

a cera has no chance to win that fight

[worthy steeple]

like ceras can run away from the army of dibbles

[crimson crater]

ceras can’t run away from an army of tenos🤷‍♂️

[worthy steeple]

the thing is, you will never ever see tenos chasing a cera around the map biting its tail with 35 damage

[viscid mica]

Um????

Aight your dumb you have no idea what your on about tenos LITTERALLY DO THAT

[worthy steeple]

and even if that will happen that’s just cera, maia can hunt almost anything

[viscid mica]

If there is enough of it anything can do that

[worthy steeple]

no, that was my point.

8 dibbles cannot outrun the cera and kill it, they don’t have the stamina and speed for that

[viscid mica]

But they can harass and stalk it into the abyss

Also that’s a extreme example

[crimson crater]

teno has more stamina you can just keep on it untill it runs out. btw that 35N bite is pretty underrated, good for chip dmg

[viscid mica]

Dibble is a hyper defensive species

[obtuse ocean]

8 dibbles would need food lol

[viscid mica]

Patrol zones be magical

[worthy steeple]

if maia has stamina and speed to outrun teno and cera, both should have a chance to fight back.

maia should not be able to stun+stomp combo them

[obtuse ocean]

Yea but chasing a cera you wont be there for long

[viscid mica]

A single miss and that’s 2 free hits for both

[viscid mica]

Ya but the point is it is technically possible

[obtuse ocean]

Yea but not practically, it can be done. But you prob gonna end up with some big food issue.

[worthy steeple]

tail reduces most of it and if teno cera will run out of stamina teno will be out of stamina as well, which means teno can only bite

while cera can charge bite and do a lot more damage, here’s perfect example of balancing

[viscid mica]

It’s not practical to have 8 Maia but bros still trying to cook

[worthy steeple]

you can chase the cera down but good luck fighting it after

[obtuse ocean]

Yea beeing 8 is something, but wasting time chasing something for a long time. Can be bad for survival aspect

[viscid mica]

[worthy steeple]

not really, never struggled with that

[viscid mica]

Exactly

[crimson crater]

sure but it still takes 1% of your hp, it has fast dps and can bite multiple times under a second. it dosent sound like it on paper but i have killed ceras like that

[worthy steeple]

herbivores can get food pretty easily from mz and pz, if pz doesn’t have food it will just respawn

[crimson crater]

you will have 30% stam left, that’s more than enough to finish it

[worthy steeple]

1% is too much

[viscid mica]

There are many teno players that will hunt you to the end of the earth if your a solo cera

[worthy steeple]

lies, you will have 20 seconds of running as teno amount of stamina

which is like what, 5%?

maybe even less

[viscid mica]

You’ll have enough

[crimson crater]

no it’s more than 20 seconds

[worthy steeple]

35 damage is nothing, it will take like 0.1% with the tail hits

[viscid mica]

Trust me I’ve died to tenos in this exact way

[worthy steeple]

it’s exactly 20 seconds

[viscid mica]

It’s brutal

[worthy steeple]

you can test it right now

[crimson crater]

never said it was, my point is that it has fast bite speed. as you bite it will quickly stacks up, 10 seconds in 15% of its hp is gone. idk what to tell you i have done it

[crimson crater]

tenos can facetank ceras btw, with their front alt. and if there is more of them its ggs

[worthy steeple]

literally lies, maybe only if it’s a body shot

tail hit reduces like 99% of the damage

[crimson crater]

it isn’t

[crimson crater]

again it’s not about the damadge its about the speed

[worthy steeple]

one alt bite vs one charge bite, 125 vs 350~?

[worthy steeple]

i mean, even with that speed it’s not like you can do much

[crimson crater]

you don’t use charged bites during facetanks lol, talking about alt bites

[worthy steeple]

even if you kill the cera in the end you lose all your stamina be low on health and stuff

[crimson crater]

teno has way more stam

[worthy steeple]

20 seconds

literally, that’s it

[crimson crater]

faster trott and can cover slightly more ground

[viscid mica]

[worthy steeple]

anyways

it’s not the same as maias chasing you, at least you can fight tenos back

and it’s more likely that maia pack will chase you down, tenos are pretty much the same speed, if they see you you have a chance to hide, if maia sees you you don’t. they’re too fast compared to you

[crimson crater]

tenos can jump, find a rock

[worthy steeple]

rock is situational, same with the water

don’t balance around that please

especially when rocks are super rare

[viscid mica]

Cheesy is all about balancing around nordens PvP community it’s like talking to a wall

[crimson crater]

you can’t balance around a 8v1 you’re supposed to die

just like if 5 allos find a lone dibble

[worthy steeple]

chill out lmao, what are you on about?

[worthy steeple]

fair enough, but it’s just vs dibble, the rest can run away, maia is whole rosters issue

[viscid mica]

Your calling Maia op in its current state which for anyone who isn’t a tryhard just isn’t true

[crimson crater]

if anything maia could use some slight buffs. its attacks are too slow

[viscid mica]

I have a sneaking feeling Maia will have a hard time escaping a 5 man allo group

[worthy steeple]

it has a lot of potential you can’t see now

[viscid mica]

I’m well aware of it’s potential

[worthy steeple]

oh really?

[viscid mica]

But I’m saying your average player is not that good

And will not get that good

[worthy steeple]

average player doesn’t matter, potential matters

[viscid mica]

Think of Herrera

[worthy steeple]

no

[viscid mica]

Herrera can be insanely strong but there are EXTREMELY rare to see highly skilled Herrera

That would be what I call top 1% players for that Dino

Most people in the life of this game will not be hitting moving targets consistently. Will not be knowing every angle to hit the perfect headshot pounce

Same applies to Maia

Ya some super skilled Maia will exist

But on average they ain’t finna be that good

[worthy steeple]

it’s not the same, herreras maximum is killing juvies or something up to dilo size, everything else will most likely run away after the first pounce

don’t compare maia to herrera lmao

[viscid mica]

Every Dino’s is potential is insane but that’s just not what we should be focusing on

[viscid mica]

Oh brother

[worthy steeple]

and you can always escape herrera, just look up

dying to herrera is your fault

dying to maia pack is not

please don’t compare things that you should not compare at all

[viscid mica]

https://youtu.be/9Wom4UW6gkE?si=RR42ELJGUtEzVrRk

“Only killing dilo or smaller”

[crimson crater]

what is a teno going to do when 5 carnos see it?

[viscid mica]

Dying to Maia is your fault

Dying to deino is your fault

DYING TO ANYTHING is your fault

Ya some situations can put you at a massive disadvantage

But there is a way to survive them

Well minus hackers

[worthy steeple]

run into the trees, try to fight back, it can stun, it can kill few of them not just die.

possible injure them to the point when they might stop the hunt

[crimson crater]

nah 5 is too much, you’re gonna die

[crimson crater]

you can’t injure 5 of them at once + their bites can end you in a matter of seconds

[worthy steeple]

maybe, but i will always have chance to fight back.

that’s the difference

and also carnos pack limit is 3, maias is 8 lol. i get it people overpack, but it’s not the thing you should balance around

[crimson crater]

yea and you can lose maias easier than carnos🤷‍♂️

[viscid mica]

I mean you have the chance to fight back against 8 Maia doesn’t mean you’ll survive similar to flows example

[worthy steeple]

no, you can’t sadly, it’s the same

[viscid mica]

Na far easier to lose they turn slower and accelerate way way slower

Plus they are insanely susceptible to fall damage

[worthy steeple]

switch between stances, acceleration is not that bad

[viscid mica]

Ya I know but still having to switch constantly will waste time

[worthy steeple]

not when there’re same speed as omni

they can easily chase you

[crimson crater]

you can, maia has horrible acceleration, bad agility and can’t move through jungles as fast. not to mention that carno is 10 kmh faster

[worthy steeple]

hopefully.

[viscid mica]

You never fell

Plus your not FG

I mean if we want to talk in ridiculous situations what you doing if 10 PTs decide they want you dead

They’ll bleed you to death garanteed

Impossible to avoid

[worthy steeple]

ahah i didn’t, that maia behind me did and it died

it was just a funny clip

[worthy steeple]

pts?

[viscid mica]

Pteradons

[worthy steeple]

they don’t deal bleed

[viscid mica]

OHHHHHH

lmao I just realized I had no audio on lol

Ya Maia takes like 2 Ft fall and dies

[worthy steeple]

and you can run to the jungle, they won’t be able to chase you down? they’re not land carnivores

[viscid mica]

Plus Maia can’t slide surf like the rest of the roaster (minus stego they can’t either)

[worthy steeple]

that was fg canni maia trying to kill me, carma made them waste 3hours of growth

[viscid mica]

💀

ya ngl the cannibal killings have been crazy common sense Maia dropped for like everything I dunno why

I get cera or deino

But herbis and others I don’t get it

[worthy steeple]

was the same when they added dibble, they were killing each other more than they were killing anything else

[viscid mica]

Not even just Maia litterally everything is kosing its own recently

[worthy steeple]

@thick echo i think the solution is a lot more simple, maia should not be able to stun cera or teno with its shove

and after that we can give maia other buffs for it to be able to fight smaller predators that can actually chase it like omni or dilo

[hasty coyote]

imo, how maia's biped works atm is fine, cera and teno are strong enough to fight back and agile enough to easily dodge a maia. Only dinos that struggle to dodge are dilo and carno, who are both faster than maia.

Quad just needs faster start up on its attacks so it can actually land its hits on smalls.

[worthy steeple]

no, teno is too long to actually dodge the shove, idk about the cera tho

maias turn is slow, but its enough

[hasty coyote]

teno is like 90% tail tho, and if the shove hits the tail it wont stun it. Yeah it can get a hit and do a tiny bit of damage, but thats 5% of maia's stam for each shove.

[worthy steeple]

basically what maia does is start running in quad + switches to biped and starts running, teno is too slow to outurn it

[hasty coyote]

and I have fought ceras as maia, its super easy to just get behind the maia and it suddenly struggles to deal with it.

[worthy steeple]

tested this before, no chance teno cant escape, sadly

maybe if maia player is new yaeh

[hasty coyote]

yeah, but if its in biped, teno can just use the A or D keys and dodge, if maia swaps to quad, then it slows down.

[worthy steeple]

tested that, doesnt work

[viscid mica]

I mean teno wins that fight all be it rough but they still win

[worthy steeple]

it doesnt, like if maia knows what to do teno always loses

[hasty coyote]

tbh, prob a bad teno, unless maia can skill diff the teno, teno can easily get away. Even if it just tanks constant tail hits, maia is gonna BURN its stam before it can kill the teno. Or the teno can run around the maia after the stun and kick it back, its really easy to get around a maia, and then it struggles to deal with things.

[worthy steeple]

thats what i was saying, maia is a lot more effective against the cera and teno instead of being more effective against the smaller dinos

[viscid mica]

If the Maia is skill diffing a teno that hard the Maia is a sweat or the teno is trash

[worthy steeple]

tactical endurance, stam is infinite

[worthy steeple]

chill out lol

[viscid mica]

I played with a norden teno and like to think I know what I’m doing and got stomped mind you I did serious damage to him but I wasn’t able to win

[hasty coyote]

If your plan is to just escape, then just don't hit the maia. If your plan is to bleed it out, then you hit it

[worthy steeple]

ill record some maia vs teno later on for you guys

[hasty coyote]

Plus thats a tactile being broken issue, not a maia issue

[viscid mica]

On norden

[worthy steeple]

yes

[viscid mica]

Aight

I’ll watch it and I will be judgy if that teno is walking into hits and not baiting imma lose it

[worthy steeple]

like if we talk about perfect maia and perfect teno, teno always loses the fight

[worthy steeple]

lmao

sure, see you in like an hour or hour and a half

[viscid mica]

Maybe I could see it but same time there is a lot more skilled tenos that skilled Maia

[viscid mica]

You wouldn’t do cera vs Maia would you?

[worthy steeple]

no

[viscid mica]

Which is a default cera win

[worthy steeple]

im not really a cera player

[viscid mica]

Mmmm

[worthy steeple]

i dont like it very much

dont like run + bite gameplay

[viscid mica]

Ok cuz when I tested cera vs Maia is a really bad wash Maia gets slept so hard

[viscid mica]

Fair

[worthy steeple]

yeah its easier to fight when you attack with your front not the back

[viscid mica]

Depends on who you our the teno player I know is scary

Bro does not know what grass is

He is THE TENO

[worthy steeple]

i am THE TENO

[hasty coyote]

(still can't dodge a maia tho )

[worthy steeple]

😭

its actually impossible when you're fighting a good maia, im telling you

maia turns faster in place than you can run around it

[elfin night]

The whole point of Maia is to be the heavyweight herbivore speedtser. Nothing else can fulfill that role

😭

[fresh sand]

@regal valve I'd also like for the back kick to be possible while running in quad

[regal valve]

Like teno?

I'd be cool if he could do it while running but then stopping

instead of doing it while moving around

[worthy steeple]

its an alt attack, thats why it cant do it while running

imo it should be changed, like you should be able to alt attack while running you will just stop instantly after

[worthy steeple]

ill be there in 5 minutes

[regal valve]

yeah exactly
that would be dope

[viscid mica]

I’m ready for the clips

@winged plinth move to the side it’s easy to dodge

[winged plinth]

Sorry what?

[worthy steeple]

won’t you be on the server?

[winged plinth]

Are you referring to the ramming spams? The problem isn't in the dodging the problem is that we stopped using left click or normal bites while playing as a carno and I think everybody does as well

So that makes carno so boring

[worthy steeple]

why?

carno is everything but boring

[viscid mica]

I’m working

[worthy steeple]

didn’t you say you’re gonna join?

[viscid mica]

Oh uh no? Atleast I don’t

[viscid mica]

No?

Never said that maybe someone else in the convo did

[worthy steeple]

ok maybe i misread something

[winged plinth]

I know you does, if you don't spam rams then you are playing carno wrongly as it is now

[viscid mica]

Uh huh

I have never died to a spam ramming carno

Litterally side step them and they run outa stam

[winged plinth]

This is not my problem

Or at least the main problem

[viscid mica]

I said I’d be watching for clips

[viscid mica]

The problem is that you do that and cuz you do that it’s not fun

[worthy steeple]

yeah i though you meant you will be there to watch

[winged plinth]

Are you still stuck in 2023? They don't cost too much stam rn

[worthy steeple]

pretty sure ram cost is 15% more than just normal sprint

[viscid mica]

It’s not a lot but there is a stam cost and as anything smaller that it actually effects can side step it

[winged plinth]

Not just me, everybody does, I'm tired of seeing someone spamming on me and they don't fight they just ram and run ram and run this is a dirty work and I understand that this is the only way they need to play as a carno

[viscid mica]

Something like that

[winged plinth]

And I'm doing the same thing

[viscid mica]

What server you playing on

[winged plinth]

I stopped playing survival because the game is boring

[viscid mica]

So. Your on a insta grow PvP server?

[winged plinth]

In fact, I stopped playing the isle for good until they release new content

[viscid mica]

So basically you’re playing PvP players?

[winged plinth]

Yes but I left the game after that until I see something much cooler, didn't even thought about trying the Maia

[viscid mica]

Aight that’s your problem

PvP players are only gonna spam stuff because they don’t have to worry about all the other factors of actual survival gameplay

[winged plinth]

Yes that gave me so much experience in fighting, not just that, I watched a lot of videos on current carnos and they do the same thing

[viscid mica]

Carnos ain’t spamming charge in real survival and if they are it ain’t going well for them

[viscid mica]

Yes because the content creator does it everyone does it

[winged plinth]

If you are going to face to face a cera or a teno with your bites then it's over for you

[viscid mica]

You admitted you haves played a full grow

[winged plinth]

Nope those are survival servers btw

[viscid mica]

If your try and face a teno with charge it’s over tf?

Teno can stun lock and the tail hitbox reaches further than charge

2 free kicks after tail slam

Any half competent teno will land that stun

[winged plinth]

Not if you ram behind it, but with normal bites it's now hard to bite them from behind

[winged plinth]

I can send you a video of a 90% growth carno defeating a cera by just spamming rams "I know the cera is bad but still he couldn't land a lot of hits because the carno is so fast and he run"

[viscid mica]

Brother if your ram a teno from behind that’s where its main weapons are tf

[viscid mica]

If you know the cera is bad that means a lot tbh

[winged plinth]

Uh sorry I meant from front

[viscid mica]

If a teno lets you hit that they are bad at teno

[winged plinth]

I don't blame him of not being able to land a lot of hits

[viscid mica]

A competent teno should be able to go 1-3

[winged plinth]

Maybe because I'm a good carno?

[viscid mica]

[viscid mica]

Or counter arguement they are a awful teno

They’re but should be facing you 24/7

If they let you face the front at all they’re bad

[winged plinth]

Nope they end up killing me

I haven't killed a teno in a 1v1 as the current carno before

[viscid mica]

Ya 3-1

[winged plinth]

I just could land some hits then they somehow kill me

[winged plinth]

What does that mean

[viscid mica]

It takes 3 carnos to garantee a kill on 1 teno without losses if the skill across the board is roughly the same

[winged plinth]

https://youtu.be/3471yNFz9i8?feature=shared

[winged plinth]

Yeah I know that

[viscid mica]

That’s not a FG cera

Plus he is awful bro doesn’t know about alt bite

[winged plinth]

Also isn't it so weird to see the carno too small for other dinosaurs? It's supposed to be bigger than cera and stronger not weaker also the lore tells us that scientists make stronger dinos so why are we having a so weak carno

[viscid mica]

Ya if that cera was half competent that carno would be dead 2nd charge

[winged plinth]

Bro did you run the video on a 30x video speed? I just sent you the video

[viscid mica]

Alt bites gamers alt bites

[winged plinth]

You barely saw anything

[viscid mica]

Skipped through it

Didn’t need to watch it all the first minute or two of that fight tells me everything I needed to know

[winged plinth]

?

[viscid mica]

Wouldn’t say the carno is particularly skilled but that cera was jsut awful no reason they should lost in a gorge like that

[viscid mica]

Cuz it got nerfed into the ground when it was over preforming early on and never got brought back up to speed

[winged plinth]

So if we followed the lore, scientists nerfed the carno because they wanted it to be a small game hunter?

[winged plinth]

He wasn't that bad

Both are the same level of skill

[viscid mica]

Yea

That cera looked under 75% thou

He wasn’t that big plus if he was full size it shoulda stopped the charges that hit his body from running through him

[viscid mica]

I don’t even pretend to know the lore the most common thing is a dev died to a carno and it got nerfed day after

But at the time it was over preforming and super dominant

[stark knoll]

?

[winged plinth]

That's a huge difference, both were almost the same size

[winged plinth]

So we get what the devs want? I don't remember someone asked for a weaker carno

[eager saddle]

oh there were definitely asks for it around the time

[winged plinth]

I'm sure that they want to follow the fall of Legacy in dinosaurs

[viscid mica]

Na not a chance that cera was thin

[viscid mica]

It’s what people say

[stark knoll]

The devs want a small game hunter. Carno being 1800kg made it strong against unintended targets, made its hunger hard to sustain, and generally put it in a place in the ecosystem that the devs didn't want it to be in

[viscid mica]

I neither know if it’s true or follow it all I know is carno got nuked

[stark knoll]

It's not done being balanced, nothing is

[stark knoll]

People say a lot of things

[winged plinth]

I don't remember that, or barely a lot of people did, but if you checked the #balance-feedback a lot of people asks for the same thing and it's buffing the carno and removing the spam rams

[viscid mica]

Exactly I’ll still throw it out sense someone woulda said it eventually

[eager saddle]

and mostly stuff that isn't true 😄

[stark knoll]

Ok, check out rule 11 #rules-and-info

[eager saddle]

that's such reverse logic

[viscid mica]

Ok but read what I said back

[winged plinth]

Yeah but the lore says otherwise unless the devs want to debunk their lore then there is no need to have a lore just make the game like PoT no plot no lore just what the devs ses it's right

[viscid mica]

It gets said atleast once a week if carno is talked about especially in vcs

[winged plinth]

Also why didn't the devs add another small game hunter that fits better than a carno?

[stark knoll]

The lore doesn't say that every dino they've created is bigger and stronger and meaner than the real thing

[eager saddle]

that wouldnt solve the carno problem

[viscid mica]

They will

[winged plinth]

I think that was just a joke and yoy took it seriously

[winged plinth]

But that would solve the small game hunter problem, also we are having another problem and it's a weak dinosaur with long time of growing and just for killing some sma dinosaurs and bullying babies

[viscid mica]

Na trust me there are people who genuinely believe that some of the devs are that petty which is dumb cuz they haven’t made any super biased edits that I’ve noticed

Some peps he banned from this discord for believing douche they preached etc why admin was immediately attentive when it was mentioned

[winged plinth]

As far as I know from videos and other people say, scientists were trying to create strong creatures "I guess for the government" because a huge and dangerous project like that requires an accpetion from the government so they can take on an island to start the project. Mostly the gov wanted a strong weapon for wars and that weapon is dinosaurs

[stark knoll]

That's not this game's lore

[winged plinth]

Are you sure?

[viscid mica]

Tbh this games lore is so convoluted and deep that I’ve given up and am waiting for some hour long the isle explained video

[viscid mica]

If anyone knows snowy knows

[winged plinth]

And do you think dondi isn't the one who is balancing the game?

Dondi is the one who controls the balancing system so def he is the one who came with this idea not a regular dev

[viscid mica]

I don’t know who does I’m certain he has a say but to be fair I don’t care so long as it’s balanced for survival gameplay not exclusively PvP

[winged plinth]

I don't know I watched a video explains the lore depending on what lore nerds say and game files this is the best I have found about the basic lore

[winged plinth]

Dondi is the leader of the entire thing btw + survival needs strength and sometimes you can lost your life if you are not stronger enough, sometimes you don't find AI or babies

[viscid mica]

I’m aware

[winged plinth]

Also why do you want to grow up a dinosaur that is weak and takes a long time to grow just for ruining some other weak dinosaur's day

[viscid mica]

You really outa scroll up

[winged plinth]

Or being a nightmare for babies

[viscid mica]

In balancing feedback

[winged plinth]

Why?

[viscid mica]

It’ll make that last comment look stupid

[winged plinth]

If you mean a lot of people ask about the same thing then I already know

[viscid mica]

No no just recently

3 posts up from yours

[winged plinth]

I don't think your feedback has to do anything with my words

Why are you saying that tho maybe I don't understand

[viscid mica]

You attempted to make a slight about my opinion of carnos current state

That should answer your question

[winged plinth]

Still don't understand

Do you mean I copied your feedback?

[viscid mica]

Bruh

No I don’t care for carno grow time to it’s weak nature

[winged plinth]

Just to know my main language isn't English

[viscid mica]

Yes I think it needs a change

[winged plinth]

I just added another problem to yours

[viscid mica]

No I don’t think it’s charge is the problem

It’s lower health and awful bleed is what makes it rough to play

[winged plinth]

The charge isn't the problem yes because without charge carno is going to get bullied by every dinosaur, the problem is the rework that made the carno needs spam rams, so if we reworked the carno again we may fix the spam rams

[viscid mica]

It’s bite force could use maybe a minor increase but over all not much else needs to change

[winged plinth]

Don't forget about his bad agility

[viscid mica]

It’s really not bad though

[winged plinth]

I'm sure a sauropod is more agile that evrima carno

[viscid mica]

Like I personally drink alt bite and can immediately take off in another direction getting away with free alt hits

Spam ramming sounds like more of a PvP issue as I rarely see it on survival and when I do it’s ineffective

[winged plinth]

Depends on the specy you are fighting

If omnis then it won't work well for you
Tenos, ceras, dilos would work better on them

If you could read the opponent's mind and his next move you can land a good ram charge on him easily

[viscid mica]

Tenos is a wild accusation

Cera dilo maybe

But a teno should absolutely crush you if you dare to try

[winged plinth]

Idk this is the only way I found to fight a teno without getting killed faster

[viscid mica]

I dunno maybe the teno duo I play with are just insanely good

[winged plinth]

If you could land it on his heas - body then it's ok but he will kill you later because carnos damage is bad even with rams

Do you know what is worse than current carno?

[viscid mica]

Like anytime I tried to ram I’d get tail slammed and then either double kicked or they line up a head kick and usually can get a body kick in before you get away

[viscid mica]

Pachy

[winged plinth]

Then you are doing it wrong if you die instantly

[winged plinth]

No... My keyboard

I'm tired of editing every single message

[viscid mica]

Not instantly but certainly not doing real damage again that’s if I do what he did in that video and you said spam ram cuz it doesn’t work

[viscid mica]

L

[winged plinth]

Wait what is wrong with pachys? I know it's an abandoned dinosaur and boring in a specific point but I don't think it's broken or underrated like carnos

[winged plinth]

Yeah that's the problem you don't do enough damage to a teno to carry you during the fight

[viscid mica]

It’s super weak, slow, and extremely inconsistent when it comes to breaks

[winged plinth]

You need 1 billion hit on his head with rams while he needs 3 - 4 kicks to kill you besides the insane stun that gives him free kicks

[viscid mica]

Only if I’m doing your ram tactic cuz it’s easy to counter

Otherwise I don’t do terribly

Not amazing but not horrible

[winged plinth]

It's a bachy ofc it's weak, but I wish it could compete with dilos I think dilos are another problem in this game they need for a rework

[winged plinth]

It's not my tactic it's the devs what they made

[viscid mica]

Dilo is fine minus some bugs related to shadow clones

[winged plinth]

Tell me how much he weight again?

[viscid mica]

Only issue is that the breaks are insanely inconsistent you might get the perfect leg hit and not get a break and then hit the tail with a m2 tap and break the body

It’s super buggy and inconsistent

[viscid mica]

I dunno like 6/700??? @stark knoll I require your knowledge!

Oh great snow man bestow upon me the knowledge of solos weight!

[stark knoll]

700kg

[viscid mica]

Bet

[winged plinth]

That's the problem

[viscid mica]

Bruh

[winged plinth]

Aren't they too big for you?

[viscid mica]

Not at all

I prefer it lets it actually be threatening

[winged plinth]

Compared to other dinosaurs he is oversized

[viscid mica]

I’d be upset if a solo omni could pin it

[viscid mica]

Not at all

[winged plinth]

And also it's somehow one of the fastest dinosaurs

[viscid mica]

The problem is all we have is small or tiny tier carnis excluding deino

[winged plinth]

Faster than omnis

[viscid mica]

We don’t have any big boys

[viscid mica]

Now that is a problem but more so that omni is kinda slow

Omni should be a 49-50km ngl

[winged plinth]

What is it now?

46?

[stark knoll]

46.8

[winged plinth]

Are you watching our conversation silently?

[cosmic pelican]

Omni casually running the same speed or faster than carno:

[stark knoll]

Not closely

[winged plinth]

I don't know what does that mean but carnos are way faster

[cosmic pelican]

Carno is 49.5kmh

[stark knoll]

Carnos are 49.5 without mutations or using charge

Closer to 60 with charge though

[cosmic pelican]

If you make omni run at 50kmh it will run faster than carno

[winged plinth]

I'm aware

[cosmic pelican]

While charging its 59.4kmh

[stark knoll]

Given that it has one of the strongest CCs in game, I don't think it needs that

[cosmic pelican]

Also uh, poor dilo

[winged plinth]

How do you know that

[viscid mica]

Oh?

[stark knoll]

Admin spec cam

[cosmic pelican]

Admin testing

[viscid mica]

I thought carno was 55 for some reason

Nvm them but omni still should be 3rd fastest imo

[winged plinth]

CC?

[viscid mica]

Omni, carno, galli

Minus tiny tiers

[winged plinth]

I guess that's our beloved old carno

[cosmic pelican]

Dilo would get absolutely decimated by 50kmh omni
Cant run, cant dodge

[viscid mica]

Ya sorry I thought everything was faster than they are for some reason

[stark knoll]

Pinning and grappling

[crimson crater]

i don’t think this “small game” hunter niche suits carno

[viscid mica]

Na omni just needs to be atleast a km or 2 faster than dilo

[cosmic pelican]

Dilo would get rekt then

[viscid mica]

I don’t mind it but I don’t think it should get completely run over by cera

[crimson crater]

its weight should definitely go back to 1.8T

[cosmic pelican]

Dont get me wrong, I hate dilo with a passion, but that would be too much

[viscid mica]

No?

[winged plinth]

TELL THEM!

[viscid mica]

Heavier, stronger and venom

[stark knoll]

Extremely poor agility

[cosmic pelican]

If its slower than omni it cant run, and it cant dodge the pounce because of its horrible agility

[viscid mica]

Alt bites are magical

[stark knoll]

And dilo's are fairly slow last I played it

[viscid mica]

But with it faster and how buggy omni pounce is they get destroyed rn

[cosmic pelican]

Friendly reminder a full dmg pounce does 1000dmg, one good opening pounce and the omni can just facetank the dilo to death

[viscid mica]

Yeah fair

[winged plinth]

I don't think it's a good idea to 1v1 a dilo as an omni alone

[viscid mica]

Hwat did you just say

[cosmic pelican]

Havent had problems myself tbh and I play omni a lot

[viscid mica]

Aight I need proof

Or if snowy knows

[cosmic pelican]

Nah u can 1 shot it with pounce

[crimson crater]

you’re finally letting go of your bias for it. i’m proud

[cosmic pelican]

Trust me, its 1k dmg

[viscid mica]

Lots of bugs rn with pouncing plus getting run to a tree is over punishing

[crimson crater]

its true

[viscid mica]

REALLY

[winged plinth]

They are faster than an omni

[viscid mica]

1k is crazy

[stark knoll]

I'm referring to the alt attack

[viscid mica]

Is that just a full ride to no stam

[winged plinth]

Bro thinks the dilo is going to be afk and stand still without pressing E

[crimson crater]

alt bite is fairly quick

[cosmic pelican]

By the time the dilo runs to the tree chances are you already dealt hundreds of dmg to it and can just facetank it

[viscid mica]

Bucking is god awful

[winged plinth]

Sorry

[viscid mica]

Imma have to test it

[cosmic pelican]

Lmao bucking benefits the omni more than the dilo

[viscid mica]

Your best bet is to sprint to the nearest rock or tree

And pray they don’t have freinds

[cosmic pelican]

Also lets not forget having an omni pouncing you slowls you down drastically as a dilo

[viscid mica]

Mmmmmm

[cosmic pelican]

So youd need even more time to run to that tree

[crimson crater]

how did this conversation go from carno to dilo

[viscid mica]

I guess I’ve just had to many bugged pounces around dilo

[viscid mica]

DONT ASK QUESTIONS

[cosmic pelican]

Cuz I hate dilo🗣️

[winged plinth]

I can drain the omni's stam before I get a lot of damage besides the new bucking system that auto drops the omni and including the fight ability to fight back and can kill that omni easily if I could land bites

[crimson crater]

dang

what if i do

[winged plinth]

Why?

[viscid mica]

It’s chance based

[winged plinth]

I forgot to ask why does it benifit the omni more than a dilo

[cosmic pelican]

Being bucked off dismounts the omni normally now, and theres also a 2 second grace period where it cant be bucked off

[viscid mica]

^

[winged plinth]

What about the stamina the omni is going to lose while bucking? And do you think a dilo is going to stay still and watch the omni to when he is going to pounce on him?

[viscid mica]

They don’t lose anymore than normal and can just circle and re pounce

[cosmic pelican]

Being bucked off dismounts you like normal, bucking doesnt drain the omnis stam but drains the preys stam heavily, theres a 2 second grace period where the bucker cant attack unless it wants to cancel the bucking, its also completely rng based so you have a chance to stay on indefinetly and drain all their stam

[cosmic pelican]

I already said what happens, read above

[viscid mica]

^^^^

[winged plinth]

Since when does bucking drains the prey's stam

[cosmic pelican]

Dilo gets slowed by the omni pouncing it, tries to run to the tree but by the time it even gets close the omni already dealt hundreds of dmg to it

[cosmic pelican]

Ever since u6

So uh, almost 3 years now

[winged plinth]

Maybe that's going to be changed if the fight happened isnide a jungle

[cosmic pelican]

Yeah fair enough I guess

[winged plinth]

What? I don't remember bucking cost stams I remember even without stams I still can buck

[cosmic pelican]

But it still wouldnt be fun, stay in jungles or die

[cosmic pelican]

The last time that was a thing was back in 2022

[winged plinth]

And if a dilo was so good he can land good hits on the omni before the omni pounce on it

[cosmic pelican]

Cant really do that if the omni is both faster and more agile than the dilo

Unless the omni is just straight up bad

[winged plinth]

I suggest reworking on dilos again making them 600 kg and more agile how does it sound?

[cosmic pelican]

Nah omni still peak

[winged plinth]

And make it slightly slower because it doesn't make any sense to make dilos faster than omnis when omnis have better legs for running and less weight

[crimson crater]

game design>realism

[winged plinth]

If we don't have some realism a lot of things are going to be nonsense

Also it's not realism it's a basic thing

[crimson crater]

dilo being faster than omni isn’t too unrealistic

[cosmic pelican]

Omni and troodon just existing already breaks realism

[crimson crater]

herra aswell

[winged plinth]

Why?

[cosmic pelican]

Because they dont exist irl

[crimson crater]

entirely fictional

[winged plinth]

No there is actually some realism, herra was created by scientists to be able to climb on trees or rocks

Maybe his jumps are overrated

[crimson crater]

overrated?

[cosmic pelican]

Ok so the same scientiscts can make dilo faster than omni too no?

[winged plinth]

Omni is just a normal raptor without feathers and when I talk about realism I mean physics

[crimson crater]

well yes but actually no

because err

[winged plinth]

You can jump miles away like a diving squirrel

[winged plinth]

In physics no they can't

If that works then they can make even a rex faster than an omni

[crimson crater]

then lets nerf omnis pin, it’s not realistic

[cosmic pelican]

Ptera can fly with abnormally small wings that wouldnt make it be able to irl.
Also herrera, a 175kg animal isnt surviving a fall higher than 15 meters, meanwhile herrera casually leaps from hundreds of meters from the sky to the ground and lives without a scratch.

[winged plinth]

The thing is not realistic in it it's so buggy

[crimson crater]

i’m not talking about pounce

[winged plinth]

Again when I speak about realism I mean physics

Physically a dilo can't be faster than a raptor

[cosmic pelican]

Unless it has a built in parachute to slow its fall it throws physics out the window

[crimson crater]

physically a 175KG dino would implode and explode simultaneously if it jumps from 50 feet up. this game isn’t all about realism and accuracy

[winged plinth]

I don't find any problems with pteras
And for the herra maybe because the scientists developed better bones and body for falling in their project?

[cosmic pelican]

Ok so then they can develop more efficient muscle fiber for the dilo so it can run faster than an omni

Sounds way easier to do than making herrera not explode from its own ability

[winged plinth]

Maybe I just gave a good explanation? Why don't you give me a good one for why dilos being faster than raptors

[crimson crater]

perhaps dilos got pumped with steroids to make them faster than raptors

[winged plinth]

Why don't you take your hedgehog for a picnic bro

[crimson crater]

don’t you disrespect the hedgehog now

[winged plinth]

Don't get me wrong I love shadow

[crimson crater]

peak

[winged plinth]

Look at my pfp closely

[crimson crater]

W

[karmic nebula]

ptera is awful.

[cosmic pelican]

If we had complete realism carno would absolutely outcompete every other carnivore on the island aside from deino

[winged plinth]

I'm out of words

[winged plinth]

It already was

[cosmic pelican]

Besides, game balance > realism

[winged plinth]

Before the nerf

[crimson crater]

yea carno needs some help

[winged plinth]

Also you said troodon doesn't exist, they did exist wdym they didn't?

[cosmic pelican]

I wanna do this without needing to charge for 2 business days beforehand😔

[cosmic pelican]

"Troodon" as we know it is just 1 tooth, also the genus it once belonged in is no longer considered valid

[crimson crater]

simple change that would fix carno…

[cosmic pelican]

Its just way too fragmentary to even tell if its a unique species or not

[winged plinth]

Those issues started to happen after the rework and the devs forgot to fix them

[karmic nebula]

they really have done nothing but dilute the fun of this game over two years lol

[winged plinth]

I can search it up wait

[winged plinth]

For me the game was fine until the carno rework, now the carno doesn't have anything unique ovee other dinosaurs

Unless if you consider bad hitbox and spamming rams a unique thing

[cosmic pelican]

Go ask a dino nerd in #paleotalk , wouldnt trust google with this one

[karmic nebula]

around the time i stopped playing, every time i come back it's just more obnoxious changes

[winged plinth]

I don't trust google I trust the sources in google since tou can't find anything related about what you ask but in the internet

[cosmic pelican]

🥔👍

[winged plinth]

Do you consider national geographic as a good source?

Every site says it existed, the one who disagree with this are reddit nerds

[cosmic pelican]

Good enough I suppose

[winged plinth]

Check this then

[cosmic pelican]

"Troodon formosus, is no longer a valid classification, naming two others in its stead."

Ill post link too one sec

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2017/08/170808145519.htm

[crimson crater]

questioning “mr. troodon” if troodon is real or not is crazy

[cosmic pelican]

Troodon in this game belongs to the species "troodon formosus"

Which as a species has been disbanded and instead made into separate new species

But all of this is pointless, the isles troodon just couldnt exist irl, simple as that

Same for omni

[worthy steeple]

gaming

[winged plinth]

I don't think Troodon formosus and Troodon are the same thing I'm sure a classification and an entire animal name are differents

[winged plinth]

I thought about it lol

Bro thinks he is not real

[cosmic pelican]

Yes, but Im talking about the species this games troodon belongs to

[worthy steeple]

holy moly mr troodon is even more tryhard than me

[cosmic pelican]

Which is troodon formosus, which no longer exists

[worthy steeple]

literally struggling to kill him as a teno

[winged plinth]

Also this article was created in 2017, I've read something happened for troodon in 2023 in wikipedia

[worthy steeple]

damn you potato!!!

[winged plinth]

So what? Troodon animal isn't real? Or the classification isn't valid? There is difference

[cosmic pelican]

Troodon as a separate species isnt real

The genus "troodontid" is still valid as far as I know

[worthy steeple]

https://tenor.com/view/pregnant-man-pregnant-pregnant-man-react-him-pregnant-man-react-pregnant-man-reaction-gif-4790048922908092687

[cosmic pelican]

...

[worthy steeple]

that’s what you get for killing me yesterday!

[cosmic pelican]

This is bullying😔

[worthy steeple]

the consciences

[winged plinth]

I'm not sure what does this say tho

Not good enough in English to understand 100% of everything and I'm sooo tired I need some sleep

[worthy steeple]

i wonder why we can react in this channel, but not in the other channels, like what makes this one so special

[cosmic pelican]

Its the theorised nesting behaviour

[cosmic pelican]

Yeah I get you, english isnt my first language either😄

[cosmic pelican]

*consequences☝️🤓

[worthy steeple]

OH NO MAJOR SPELLING MISTAKE

[winged plinth]

Why bothering making a theory in 2023 that was stated by a study it doesn't exist in 2017

[cosmic pelican]

https://tenor.com/view/minor-spelling-mistake-gif-21179057

[worthy steeple]

😔😔😔

[winged plinth]

I mean troodon doesn't exist why do we still make theories about him

[cosmic pelican]

Wikipedia is open source, anyone can edit it, maybe the person who did got misinformed, or just didnt type the genus troodontid correct

[winged plinth]

You can get the reference after every article

Look at the two numbers down

17 and 18 those are supposed to be the sources

[crimson crater]

#phase-three-requests message no

[winged plinth]

I wonder what does phase three mean

[cosmic pelican]

Why must you do this to me

[viscid mica]

@worthy steeple clips >_>

[crimson crater]

#isle-phase-three its a channel for sneak peaks etc

[winged plinth]

thanks