balance-feedback-discussion

[strong solar]

you know how cool it would be to see a feathered utah with some intricate designs on its floof

[grave veldt]

i dont really think its a good idea to limit stegos tail swings in drastic ways

[hollow canyon]

he said he doesn't think Utah should be safe to jump off a Stego

Is that enough as an answer to you?

[strong solar]

huh

[hollow canyon]

Utah being able to hit mid-air is intentional

[strong solar]

utah shouldnt be safe jumping off anything

[opaque beacon]

Its not like that xd

[strong solar]

well except the obvious

[hollow canyon]

yes, obviously, Stego would get a heart attack after swinging it 10 times

[opaque beacon]

If its like that Utah should pounce as much as it wants lol

[hollow canyon]

totally comparable btw

[flint jacinth]

A stego weighs how much in game?

[opaque beacon]

6 tons i think

[opaque beacon]

yeah it is

[flint jacinth]

6 tons, it’s already big af

[opaque beacon]

Lol

[grave veldt]

apparently its now 7 tons for the highest estimate but i dont think they'll change that in game

[flint jacinth]

Imagine an elephant swinging it’s butt around 22 times, don’t you think it would get tired?

That’s just my thinking

[opaque beacon]

No tottaly not 😂😂😂😂

[hollow canyon]

You mean... swinging its tail 22 times?

Cause yea I think it could absolutely do that

without any issue

[opaque beacon]

Its tail is like 20 pounds lol

[hollow canyon]

just like Stego could swing its tail 22 times without any issue

[flint jacinth]

Not it’s tail

[hollow canyon]

Then why are you comparing an elephant's butt to Stego's tail?

[flint jacinth]

The stego in evrima swings it’s whole body, not just it’s tail like in legacy

[hollow canyon]

I mean yea the animations are better

[fresh laurel]

what are yall arguing about now

[hollow canyon]

Carno also moves its entire body while biting

[grave veldt]

the isle

[hollow canyon]

doesn't mean it should be able to bite 10 times before running out of stamina

[fresh laurel]

what about it?

[flint jacinth]

I’m not arguing I’m just trying to understand

[opaque beacon]

Who tf was talking about carno, carno is used to hunting and moving around plus it has muscles its built for high speed running

[grave veldt]

not rly sure honestly i just came in to see what was happening

[flint jacinth]

My brain hurts

[hollow canyon]

what in the world does that have to do with its alt biting?

or biting for that matter

Stego is used to whacking stuff with its tail too

What are you even on about?

[opaque beacon]

Ok so you want Utah to hunt dryo and be 2 shot by all mid tiers correct @hollow canyon

[hollow canyon]

No?

[opaque beacon]

Ok than leave Utah how it is rn

[grave veldt]

well most mid tiers will probably two shot it anyways

[hollow canyon]

I mean yea all the mid tiers should 2 shot it unless I'm missing some mid tier that I don't know about

[opaque beacon]

End of discussion

[flint jacinth]

In your mind what is the ideal Utah to you?

[strong solar]

guys 100/10 argument

[hollow canyon]

yea lol no, it's not staying the way it is right now

[strong solar]

the best argument ive ever seen in the isle discord hands down

so amazing I started tearing up omg so beautiful 😂

[opaque beacon]

Bleeder, Mid tiers to small tiers should fear it if in packs, Apex tiers should be able to kill it no matter what.

[flint jacinth]

Pab you understand what I’m trying to say with stego moving it’s heavy body around right?

Or am I drunk?

[strong solar]

what about it

[opaque beacon]

https://tenor.com/view/po-dies-dies-of-death-teletubbies-gif-23885910

[hollow canyon]

We aren't getting my ideal Utah because it's been reworked away from that. As for the current one - increase its recovery after missing pounce by 1 seconds, remove the stamina drain from pounce, make bucking dependent on weight, make it either cost no stamina or burn Utah's stamina faster... that's it I think

[flint jacinth]

That a 6 ton stego should be tired after swinging it’s tail 22 times, I compared it to an elephant swinging it’s butt around 22 times

[strong solar]

oh you want stego to lose more stam with tailswings?

[opaque beacon]

https://tenor.com/view/bullshit-see-now-thats-some-bullshit-spider-man-far-from-home-marvel-nick-fury-gif-16529336

[strong solar]

I mean ok sure

[flint jacinth]

I’m just saying 22 seems like a lot

[stark knoll]

And it is, since that's when it runs out of stam

[strong solar]

im not really sure how to balance stego since yknow, its a really slow animal and cant run nor hide

[flint jacinth]

Like a good number to me is like, 15-17

[strong solar]

so it needs to be able to murder things easily and be a tank, thats just the tradeoff

you could make stego waste more energy while tailswinging and take more damage to the head so it feels like a more realistic downside

[flint jacinth]

Maybe I’m thinking too realistic for a video game environment

[hollow canyon]

I'd personally like Stego to have 2 attacks, the current one with a higher stam drain and a weaker one that would cost less stamina, but we aren't getting that either

[flint jacinth]

Agreed

[strong solar]

stegos would need to be more careful not to waste stamina and would need to hide its weak point

[hollow canyon]

I mean maybe one day, but not any time soon

[opaque beacon]

Makres sense yes

Makes*

[strong solar]

hey im glad we can all agree on one thing

[opaque beacon]

If thay is done than when a stego is fighting a deino it tries to hide its head and the deino targets its head

[opaque beacon]

Well you said something reasonable 😅

[strong solar]

mhm it would be better than just a weird facetank

[opaque beacon]

yes

[grave veldt]

i mean this is already how it works now isnt it

[strong solar]

from my experience the deino just... tanks the hits and doesnt move 😂 maybe its just an unskilled deino who knows

[urban birch]

You can’t balance stego right now cause they shouldn’t be in the game yet.

[flint jacinth]

My thinking is, in real life it makes sense to there being risk to a dismount. A Utah could get tail swung, makes sense. But I’m a video game environment Utah cannot pounce stego safely at all rn. So if that’s what they intend to do, to where Utah should be at risk dismount from something, at least make it so stego wouldn’t just sit in deino infested water. Make it so a deino head shot on a stego does some serious damage

[opaque beacon]

https://tenor.com/view/church-baby-praise-worship-feel-the-spirit-gif-17753272

[grave veldt]

this is still my main point that stego shouldnt even be here

[strong solar]

well its here, what are they gonna do? take it out?

[grave veldt]

clearly they're trying to balance stego for whats to come

[urban birch]

No y’all are just going to have to deal with it until stuff that counters it is added

[opaque beacon]

https://tenor.com/view/the-isle-isle-devs-kaperoo-dondi-kissen-gif-24830944

[grave veldt]

that should be easier later on when larger creatures are added

[strong solar]

LOL

[opaque beacon]

Pab do you think utah is op lol

[strong solar]

not really sure

I feel like utah vs teno is fairly balanced

[opaque beacon]

@flint jacinth What u think

[urban birch]

The only thing I think needs tweaking atm is pachy everything else feels decent

[opaque beacon]

Yeah

[strong solar]

carno? ehhhhh

at least carno can die now but it feels cheap

[urban birch]

Carno is in a good place it’s just not what we are used to

It’s not a brawler anymore

[opaque beacon]

They just need to fix the recovery time for pounce and carno v utah will be good

[strong solar]

from missing a pounce? I can agree

[opaque beacon]

yeh

[flint jacinth]

My thinking is, in real life it makes sense to there being risk to a dismount. A Utah could get tail swung, makes sense. But I’m a video game environment Utah cannot pounce stego safely at all rn. So if that’s what they intend to do, to where Utah should be at risk dismount from something, at least make it so stego wouldn’t just sit in deino infested water. Make it so a deino head shot on a stego does some serious damage

[strong solar]

utah can just shoot up and not get punished

and landing a pounce is devastating for carno atm

[opaque beacon]

which it should be

[strong solar]

I suppose so since carno can use terrain/water to get them off

[opaque beacon]

I mean its the only thing to stop them from running which is critical for Utahs survival in a fight

[urban birch]

I feel like the devs tweak too many things at once. Too many nerfs at the same time

[strong solar]

^^^

the thing thats really icking me is that playing carno sucks because of multiple things so people are now calling it bad

[grave veldt]

carno hunger drain

[strong solar]

bleed nerf and a food value nerf? AND hunger drain? smh

and now utah can get up faster?

[urban birch]

Yerp

[strong solar]

like damn chill

now they gotta take a few steps back

[opaque beacon]

I mean thats how they treated Utah for the past 3 updates

Look at the patchnotes, Utahs first good buff was this update

[flint jacinth]

Off topic but whoever came up with a chicken tender sandwich is stupid, just give me the damn breast on the sandwich

[strong solar]

wtf is a chicken tender sandwich 🤨

[opaque beacon]

💀

[flint jacinth]

A chicken sandwich, but instead of a chicken breast they put 3 chicken tenders on it

[stark knoll]

#offtopic-discussion

[strong solar]

that doesnt sound fun to eat

ah yes the isle right

[flint jacinth]

Back to the everlasting discussion of balance

As long as it’s fun idc what they do

[strong solar]

I want to play the game but its pain and a chore to deal with the food value stuff

and food drain

[fresh laurel]

Always having to be to on the hunt is a bit annoying...

Wish they did something so carnivores could enjoy nesting a bit easier

If current ai spawns and hunger stay like this then... I think seeing an elder carnivore would be a pretty rare sight

[modern echo]

elder stegos: hello

[topaz panther]

@alpine plover

[half girder]

#balance-feedback message bro wot 💀

[half girder]

this

tries to brawl gets fucked up, makes sense. maybe the devs can make ambushing slightly more rewarding though

[half girder]

#balance-feedback message i’ll just take the 20 more dmg to its headbutt

it can then combo with its peck

2 headshots and one peck or 4 body shots and a peck

i’m fine with that

pachy has slight advantage as it should

downward slam leaves u too open for way too long

[dusky surge]

true but it is literally a useless part of the kit and that's ALWAYS bugged me

Also, realistically, it should hurt the most out of any ram

[half girder]

yeah i hate it too but

even with that i won’t use it

[dusky surge]

Also pachy being a combo animal makes it more interesting

[half girder]

i mean

isn’t the dmg tap ram dmg?

[dusky surge]

eh?

[half girder]

the downward slam

i don’t use it so

maybe it can do 100 and rear up ram 120

[dusky surge]

downward slam is like tap ram, yea

[half girder]

ok yeah

hmm actually

it could possibly do 150?

200 is pretty huge

[dusky surge]

i did think 200 was huge but i was high-balling

150 could work fine

[half girder]

i get that it would make the risk of being open for a pounce fine but

200 is huge

[dusky surge]

especially if its supposed to be a combo tool, yea

since alt does like 100

[half girder]

thought alt did 60

[dusky surge]

pretty sure its always done 100

unless it got nerfed, which i dont think it ever did

[half girder]

i tested and it took 8 alt bites to kill a utah

pretty sure it’s 60 or around there

[dusky surge]

pachy at one point did 300 damage with a running charged ram lmao so 200 isn't much for it

i think was back in the days where it was out-turned by carno tho

[half girder]

those days were a joke

glad we have fun pachy back but it’s more cute than scary rn

strong in packs though

as it should

hope the devs take my feedback into account

combo: rear up 120 body go around for the head that’s 240 to the head(vice versa) then hit the utah with an alt attack 60 finally finishing it off with a peck 30 dmg ez 450 dmg utah gone

though you’d have to be a pretty decent pachy but hey

sometimes though hit boxes are poop and a headshot would count as a body

[slim dragon]

I wasn't aware Utah had a 2x multiplier to its head

I thought it was 1.5x like every other dino

[mellow zenith]

really ? i thought only stego HS were 2x

[half girder]

wait what

damn nvm then that’s dumb

i mean actually

[mellow zenith]

if utah headshot multiplier is really 2x, why it isn't the case for everyone else ?

[half girder]

could still work

pachy has its reason

[obtuse ocean]

Well you tho it only was on stego, so why should it apply to everyone suddently if utah have it ? : P

[half girder]

should be 2x for all cept pachy and 3x for stego

[mellow zenith]

yeah pachy not having 2x make sense

[half girder]

wow that’s stupid

[mellow zenith]

Bran — Aujourd’hui à 12:07
should be 2x for all and 3x for stego

thats why

before it was 1.5x for everyone and 2x. for stego

it was fine imo

[half girder]

damn rip my combo ig

[mellow zenith]

utah is squishy asf, i don't get why his headshot multiplier got up

[half girder]

forgor it’s 1.5

utah is strong asf though

[mellow zenith]

irrelevant imo

[half girder]

it’s a glass cannon

[fresh laurel]

Utah takes x2 to the head?

[mellow zenith]

for the headshot talk we have, i find this irrelevant

[half girder]

idk if it does

[fresh laurel]

Pretty sure its 1.5

[mellow zenith]

even without 2x headshot, utah is stil glass

[mellow zenith]

idk some people just said its 2x

[half girder]

it can take a beating from pachy

[fresh laurel]

Dont think thats true :P

[half girder]

not too squishy lol

[fresh laurel]

Carno biting utah to the head would almost one shot it normally lol

If it were x2

[mellow zenith]

they are in the same tier and pachy gimmick is to fracture, not one or two shot things

[half girder]

it’s supposed to 3 shot utah but

[fresh laurel]

Break the utah leg and run away ez

[half girder]

no.

[mellow zenith]

why no ?

[half girder]

that’s boring

[fresh laurel]

Nothing forces you to fight when it breaks its leg

[mellow zenith]

its a survival game

[half girder]

omg not this again

[fresh laurel]

If utah knows how to juke or has backup...

[mellow zenith]

not the iron fist tournament

[fresh laurel]

Regret kicks in

[half girder]

run away so it can heal and come back

[fresh laurel]

Pretty sure the damage nerf to pachy was to make it break and run from carno and not go 1v1 to the death

[half girder]

if utah pounces pachy, u can’t run

[fresh laurel]

Tracking rn doesnt allow that

[half girder]

u can’t hide, no mud

[mellow zenith]

tracking is trash now

[half girder]

i tracked a pachy through the jungle lol

[fresh laurel]

If you ran the whole time while it sat to heal... your prints should be gone lol

[half girder]

blood is still good to track

[fresh laurel]

Harder now

And again the blood would dissapear

[half girder]

i find it pretty easy to do

[mellow zenith]

well good for you then

[fresh laurel]

The time it takes to heal fracture, every way of finding you should be gone lol

Dont think carno chasing pachys to death with a broken leg is a issue now tbh

And neither is pachy killing carno commonly a problem now

[half girder]

cuz they die to hunger lol

[obtuse ocean]

how? i would look like a rex if i could be fat in this game, tons of ai

[fresh laurel]

Yea... food for carnivores is annoying

[half girder]

5 shotting a utah is just silly

3 headshots is also silly

a thing that counters another shouldn’t fucking run 💀

[fresh laurel]

If pachy got pounced by something almost its same weight except has claws and teeth then it should die hella quick but... here we are

[half girder]

it kinda does lol

have you been playing..?

[fresh laurel]

Meh bleed still takes a bit

[half girder]

i’ll take it u haven’t hunted much

[fresh laurel]

Pachy killing utah would be faster irl but the same goes for everything

Actually irl pachy loses

[half girder]

yeah lol

[fresh laurel]

Hmmm

[half girder]

…

[fresh laurel]

If our utah was alive then irl pachy would faster idk

Ok uhh how about this

Wouldnt pouncing a pachy as a full grown utah slow it down?

Pin it realistically

[half girder]

that’s makes utah even stronger lol ITS pretty strong rn

[fresh laurel]

I say utah is strong in a pack as it should

[half girder]

solo too, good one can take down a teno and carno

[fresh laurel]

Said teno and carno have to be dog water

[half girder]

not totally but

[fresh laurel]

A solo utah could be run down after pouncing

[half girder]

not if it’s good

[fresh laurel]

No no, even if its good

[half girder]

no i don’t think so

[fresh laurel]

Sorry but you need stamina to pvp

[half girder]

i get that but like.. good players know how to use stam

something runs while bleeding, win for utah

[fresh laurel]

Pounce, get bucked and lose lots of stam then get run down

[half girder]

again, not if it’s good

[fresh laurel]

Bucking utah pounce wont put enough bleed ti kill

[half girder]

not all about pounce dude

[fresh laurel]

If utah bites

Tebo or carno can hit back

[half girder]

smh

[fresh laurel]

Fuck it im not gonna correct my typos

Im on mobile

[half girder]

lol have a good day i’m off to play

[fresh laurel]

Cya

[azure crescent]

what does irl pachy have to do with this lmao

[fresh laurel]

Meant to say realistically yea pachy could bonk our utah in a few hits

[azure crescent]

ah alr

[hollow canyon]

it doesn't, idk where this idea comes from

Utah has a x1.5 multiplier on its headshot, you can test it easily - tailslam its head with Teno and see if it goes down, if it's x2 - it will die from that, if it's x1.5 it will live with a bit of health.

[mellow zenith]

oh thank you, i prefer this way

[hollow canyon]

and... well - utah does live with a bit of health

you're welcome although I'm not the one who set it up that way lol

I'm just saying that it's multiplier is the same

I also don't particularly like the idea of increasing headshot damage even further it would have profound impact on balance

and buff some animals that don't really need any buffs

[azure crescent]

i thought utah had 1.25 multiplier on head?

or has that been changed

[hollow canyon]

it has x1.5 like almost every animal in the game

no, it hasn't been changes

[azure crescent]

alr

[hollow canyon]

it's been x1.5 since Evrima came out

[mellow zenith]

headshot always has been 1.5X except stego

[azure crescent]

and pachy

[hollow canyon]

^(and Pachy)

[azure crescent]

pachy has reduced headshot

[mellow zenith]

yes ofc, my bad

[hollow canyon]

Yea Pachy is x0.5 iirc

haven't checked it, just what I've been told

I really need to check things more before I write them here I've made some mistakes lately repeating things that I was told

[azure crescent]

it takes a carno with a head fracture 12 headshots to kill a pachy

[hollow canyon]

where is it biting it?

Because that will also affect the damage

[hollow canyon]

oh headshots

wait really? just 12? That's less than I expected tbh

[azure crescent]

a carno with head fracture that attacks a pachy's head does 43 damage

[hollow canyon]

damn does a head fracture only halve the damage?

[azure crescent]

meanwhile a utah in the same situation would need to bite the pachy's head 17 times

[hollow canyon]

I thought it reduced it more

[azure crescent]

yeah

[hollow canyon]

surprising

[azure crescent]

atleast it does for carno

[hollow canyon]

fair

I never actually tested fractures tbh

I mean in terms of how much they affect the speed and damage

[azure crescent]

carno with leg fracture is nearly as fast as pachy with 38 km iirc

[hollow canyon]

damn although that would check out I think

[azure crescent]

either 38 or 28 but i'm inclined to believe in the 38 more because carnos with leg frac. like to chase pachys and almost catch up with them

gonna test in taco island

[hollow canyon]

do let me know what you get as a result

[azure crescent]

ah nvm leg fracture halves the speed to 27.9

[hollow canyon]

that sounds alright tbh

[azure crescent]

i miss the ability to switch dinos without slaying them

[dusky surge]

0.75x

[hollow canyon]

Fair

and thx

[dusky surge]

leg fractures halve speed afaik

[hollow canyon]

again another one I haven't tested just took the word of people for it

[dusky surge]

so its 27.9, not 37.9

[hollow canyon]

Yea Duder already clarified that

they do halve it with Carno ending up at 27.9km/h

[azure crescent]

ye

deino with leg fracture is the fastest thing in the game

[dusky surge]

i also agree with bran's take that pachy SHOULD be killing utahs. If it's going to run, it should run from carno, who is too big for it to reliably kill. Utah is too quick to heal for pachy to really get much value out of a single fracture

having pachy never kill anything is ridiculous imho

[azure crescent]

50% deino can reliably chase down a carno with leg fracture wtf

[keen plover]

wait pretty sure carno runs at 30.8km? it was that in update 4.5?

[dusky surge]

55.5/2

[keen plover]

I know half, but the value was 30km

like it wasn't half speed

[hollow canyon]

I... have no idea, honestly no idea

I'm legitimately just repeating what Duder and Wave were saying

never tested how fractures affect speed and biteforce

[keen plover]

looking at old videos, it was 30.8km/h in update 4-4.5. Idk about rn

[hallow quiver]

maybe mr herrera hates all of my feedbacks on the herbs

[dusky surge]

why have you turned dryo from a plains animal to a coastal forest animal that competes with hypsi

[hallow quiver]

food competition on every animal

that was my point

i forgot to say buff hipsy

[dusky surge]

okay but you've quite literally entirely changed dryo's habitat

[hallow quiver]

and add growth system to it, make it a real animal on the game

[hallow quiver]

yeah

[dusky surge]

also tenonto on coasts doesn't seem right

[hallow quiver]

stegos changed from plains too

[hallow quiver]

tenonto will not go coast

the oranges spawns on center now

[dusky surge]

oranges are coastal plants?

[dusky surge]

dryos now have to move between plains forests and coasts for a full diet, why the huge nerf?

[naive palm]

Why would you drive stegos away from plains?

[dusky surge]

stego is also best suited for plains, yea

i dont see the need to make every herbivore fight when they're basically all a different size tier

just means one animal gets an economy on all food

and the smaller ones get fucked

especially since some animals aren't even supposed to be close to each other (dryo is plains oriented while hypsi is forest oriented, teno is swamp oriented while pachy is coast oriented)

[hallow quiver]

but on the practice, all of then mixpack on center because one of their diet is on center each

[dusky surge]

untrue

[hallow quiver]

stego pumpkings
pachy agave
teno radish

[dusky surge]

pumpkins are north east, not centre

[hallow quiver]

these are the 3 that make a difference by mixpacking

[hallow quiver]

it spawns on center too

this came on this major update

now the herbs dont have to walk all across the map to get ther diets

All of then have a place with 1 diet, and other place with 2

Swamps for teno gave mountain ash and wild potato
center gives radish

Pachy coast gives orange and coconut and center gives agave

Stego center gives marigold and pumpkins
swamps sumac

[naive palm]

In my opinion, herbivores congregating is better than herbivores constantly migrating. Carnivores know the locations to check, herbivores know where to find food and each other, people are generally less likely to get lost and starve with no one else around.

Starving and yeeting off concealed cliffs are two of the worst, most frustrating and unrewarding ways to die and often means your body - AKA your time invested - despawns rather than feeds into the server ecosystem.

I don't think any species should have all 3 food groups in one place, but I also don't think they need to be spread across the entire map. The amount of travel that'd require would be insane, and dramatically increases starvation and yeeting deaths while decreasing player encounters.

[white cove]

All that proposed diet change would do is make me spend most of my growth time sprinting cross country lol

[hallow quiver]

i made the location change just to avoid starvation, and remember we have the grazing system

[hallow quiver]

its better than just hiding in a bush seing tiktoks

[white cove]

I like how most herbivore dinos rn have one "difficult" diet then 2 that are closer together

[naive palm]

I'm talking about both carnivores and herbivores.

[white cove]

That's a matter of opinion. The tiktoks will change, the scenery between A B C will not

Also maybe I'm doing it wrong but very little of my growth time is spent tabbed out as is

[hallow quiver]

but will make more risky and make carns try to hunt juvs instead of just waiting on the center for the adults come, its a survival game, it must be hard and challenging

[white cove]

Also with this change it encourages juvi interaction from herbivores even less

Since you're going to be out of stamina from sprinting almost all the time

[hallow quiver]

playing teno i just grab radish on the center (blue), put it on 250%
come to the swamps and put potato and mountain ash on 70% each because the teno hunger decays fast

and wait like 20 minutos to walk, eat the 2
and come back to the same bush

i do this around 3 or 4 times

and take water on that intervals

[white cove]

Sounds like that's plenty of vulnerability tbh

[half girder]

love when 3 tenos run from 2 carnos

[white cove]

If they made being a juvi tenoto/stego not a death sentence then maybe I'd entertain your idea

[hallow quiver]

a juv stamina decay so slowly that you can cross the center with juv teno and dont have to sit to recover

[white cove]

Yes, as is you don't see it as a problem.

If you make the diet a sprintfest it's going to become one real quick

[hallow quiver]

see that black *?
is a human construction that if you enter there no carno can enter, just juv ones that you can fight
utahs never come to that place because they are too busy overpacking on center

[white cove]

Then...remove the building?

It's like winging that stegos went up on NW rock then proposing a fix by moving pumpkins SW lol

[hallow quiver]

i can hide on the other 200 bushes that exist on the swamp

[naive palm]

Spreading diets out in the way you propose is going to cause juveniles to hunker down and never move an inch.

[hallow quiver]

see a quick map of how stego diet is gone be

[white cove]

Then hide in the bushes

I play a lot of stego, I've had multiple close calls with raptors in and around bushes that I slink into

That's more fun to me than running into said raptor pack with 20% stam while weighing 1000kg because i had to haul ass from North plains to Mountain Ash

[hallow quiver]

the biggest walk you have to do is going to get the mountain ash

[white cove]

Might not be as fun for them but tough titties, if they want to eat me then they should need to find me not vice versa

[hallow quiver]

now the atual diet of stego

[white cove]

Wait

Bother this solves nothing lol

[white cove]

In fact it makes the problem you forsee way worse

[hallow quiver]

i just change the risk for distance

[white cove]

Yeah, youve lowered both risk and distance

[hallow quiver]

distance ive icreased it

[white cove]

You aint

I can show you exactly how that diet change would go down

[naive palm]

Why does it make any sense to move stegos away from the plains?

[white cove]

It doesnt

Man wants them to be vulnerable then moves them into dense woodland

[hallow quiver]

the place where marigold and pumpkins would be are mainly plains

but they are not on the center

i went on that place yesterday with my carno to find some AI

and because its a plain i found 2 deers and 2 rabbits

[white cove]

This would be where stego juvis would actually just sit for 4h

and go to the least populated drinking spots on the map

[hallow quiver]

more time

[white cove]

not more time

[hallow quiver]

its 5 hours with the 3 nutrients

[white cove]

4h 30m iirc

i was off by 2m

but im being generous as you no longer start at 0 (thanks hatchlings) and youd spend some time hauling ass from swamp

[hallow quiver]

oh thats a great website

[white cove]

https://evrimacalculator.com/

[hallow quiver]

thx for showing me it

[hallow quiver]

so with 50% multiplier it would be 6 hrs and 40 minutes

50% because of the 2 nutrients

[white cove]

Yes but that is not how you'd grow

You'd do the same thing you do at present

Spawn in hell (NW currently, this would be swamp) eat up to 300% or die trying because you're small and can hide in the blades of grass. Run to that circle and balance the 2 without mocing

At present you eat 300 pumpkin than bounce across the river between sumac and marigold, which i think is a fair bit of interaction

Puts you at threat of deino, and then straight into the populated plains

[hallow quiver]

its around 20 or 30 minutes to spawn swamps grab Mountain ash (that would spawn where the sumac stays)
and go to the NE
there they will grow like any dino

and when he is around 40 or 50% he needs to go back to the swamps

[white cove]

Right, but NE is almost all dense jungle

[hallow quiver]

the place that i marked are plains

[white cove]

No, if you eat 300 you never need to go back until full adult

I wouldn't say plains

More....clearings

[hallow quiver]

right i dont knew how to say that word in english but that it

clearings

easy to spot stegos there

[white cove]

yeah, while theyre eating

same as it is now

[hallow quiver]

i did a suggestion yesterday about that, and its kinda unfair, but everyone thought it was bad

[white cove]

except, instead of them slinking back into a small bush to hide in and possibly be found

theyd then slink into the dense jungle and you'd never see them

[hallow quiver]

but make mixpacking stop and make food competition

i wrote it wrong sorry

[white cove]

The only competition in your proposed list is Mountain Ash with Tenos if im not mistaken

[hallow quiver]

right

but

[white cove]

so theyd only compete as a juvi (if theyre doing it right)

[hallow quiver]

the hunger decays so slow with stego, when you arrive at NE you have to constantly fill with 20 or 30% the 2 nutrients

[white cove]

yes

[hallow quiver]

make you walk on the clearings

[white cove]

which is what you have to do presently

[hallow quiver]

and be vulnerable

[white cove]

except you have to walk through clearings, a river, and center plains at present

[hallow quiver]

yeah but with no competition and mixpacking on the center

[white cove]

so this solution would just be making their growth much easier

there is no competition between the top 2 nutrients on your diagram.

which is what they'd walk between

[hallow quiver]

i see

but i dont know how i can change it to have competition

[white cove]

I have a different solution to add food competition

[hallow quiver]

let me see it

[white cove]

Keep diets as is, but add unique/specialty plants that give all 3 or 2/3 diet bricks for all species but only while growing

put them in high traffic spots and also near diet overlap

and only spawn one or 2 at a time

special scent symbol, boom

all the growing herbs rush for it

Id keep it at growing herbs only or you're just going to have stegos/trikes/shants/anky camping them out and beating up anything less than 3 tons that comes for it

[naive palm]

I mean, what you would call competition I'd say would only motivate certain species to hang out together more.

[white cove]

true

its fun to say but nobody wants to kill each other over a plant

the people that already do would do so with no food involved

[hallow quiver]

oh thats a good idea

because the small herbs can grow normally but the big ones that need it will make it worth

[naive palm]

Yeah, like, if I was a stego and I knew that herd of tenos was headed to the same pasture I was because we both eat the same diet there, I'd rather group with them and lean into the safety in numbers.

If I chose to fight them, I'd be risking my life for a single diet, weakening myself if I DID win, and attracting a ton of carnivores with the noise and smell.

[white cove]

plants could give no diet and just a +30% growth boost for 30m or something too

yeah exactly

no amount of diet schmoving is going to make herbivores that dont need to eat each other fight to the death

[hallow quiver]

maybe on the high traffic spots put some of these, and a little on places that herbs use to grow, like swamps, coast

[white cove]

when there are things that actually need to fight them to the death and are looking to do so

Could be fun

[hallow quiver]

but will make then just not mixpacking

[white cove]

yeah by forcibly separating them I guess but that's kind of lame

[hallow quiver]

because if im a shant, i will not let a trike come next to this especial flower that my son will need

[white cove]

yeh

the other argument is that some food is just too plentiful rn, and im not sure if I totally agree

for herbivores, carnos are suffering

Which is funny to me because in the early development Evrima folks were like "Apexes should be way stronger but harder and take skill to maintain, like if you see a full grown rex pair it should be a wowww moment"

[hallow quiver]

agave is too plentiful on center because its where it belongs

[white cove]

now the biggest and fastest land carnivore takes skill and effort to maintain and people are furious

[hallow quiver]

but sometimes is hard to find radish on the center

[white cove]

yeah radish doesnt spawn center

so that'd be why

[hallow quiver]

and its still a carno

[white cove]

except a tiny patch near the crossing

[hallow quiver]

far away from an apex

[naive palm]

The only thing that could make herbivores fight would be a system like in another animal-but-not-dinosaur game I play, where water is very hard to find, depletes as you drink it, and proximity to certain species debuffs you both.

With that system, people get extremely territorial with competitor species. The key is that the resource is highly concentrated, eventually depletes, and both species suffer if they hang out together.

[white cove]

yeah, presently the apex I guess

Is this other animal-but-not-dinosaur game Beasts of Bermuda

[naive palm]

No

[hallow quiver]

LOL

[white cove]

because they do it too and it works rather well

you get herds beating each other pretty often, but thats a rule-thing

[naive palm]

I dunno if I'm allowed to name other games on this server lol

[hallow quiver]

it seems a lot, but BoB allow mixpacking of herbs

[dusky surge]

is it animalia

[naive palm]

Yeah it's Animalia, which is a pretty shitty game in most aspects but does a really good job of punishing mix packing

[dusky surge]

i honestly dislike MOST forms of mixpack punishment

not because i like mixpacks, mind you

[hallow quiver]

the main dev of animalia, was the admin of the biggest brazilian the isle server

[dusky surge]

i just find that being debuffed for being in the presence of another animal can be easily exploited

[naive palm]

Like OP mix packing anyway - causing rhinos and elephants to compete but zebras and wildebeest to be chill

[white cove]

I feel the same towards body guarding prevention

[dusky surge]

yep, that shit really cant be fixed

[white cove]

I dont like body guarding but everytime I see a "nausea" suggestion I slam that X reaction so fast

or "corpse sickness" or w/e

[dusky surge]

yea, same

imagine nesting and protecting your nest and you get punished because "too close to corpse >:("

killed that utah? WRONG CHOICE, NOW YOU AND YOUR BABIES SUFFER

[naive palm]

Yeah, a bodyguarding mechanic won't work well in most iterations

If you allow herbs to move bodies then they'll abuse that mechnic in other ways

[white cove]

yeah BoB has something like that and the only reason it works is because admins need to be summoned to move away the gore or you need to allow a member of the carnivore pack to survive and move it as per the server rules

which is not something the isle would do

[dusky surge]

any mechanic which forces an admin to intervene is inherently poorly made

[white cove]

agree

[naive palm]

Yup

[dusky surge]

an admin's job should be simple in a vanilla setting

if someone is saying fucked up shit, ban them

thats it really

compensating for the game's lack of solutions to larger problems is not in their duty, nor should it be

a game should run in its optimal setting while being entirely unmoderated

[white cove]

there was a time I really enjoyed rule servers with body rules and pack settings etc etc

in legacy at least

[naive palm]

The ability to nab meat chunks is actually a small help when dealing with bodyguarding

[white cove]

I feel like Evrima has put a lot of systems in place to organically prevent the need for this

[white cove]

yeah, and body down rules

[dusky surge]

i hate body rules personally, as well as pack settings

when cerato rocks up and kicks you off food, you're gonna have to learn to cope

thats its job

if mixpacking is to be resolved, it has to be done naturally

and not in a "punishes you for mildly doing anything wrong" way

i hate stepping on eggshells trying to play these games to avoid debuff #253 because i was simply FAR too close to a pteranodon and its fish

[keen plover]

Recently played on one. Apparently the admins didn't understand that killing 2 things and gaining both diets as a carni is apart of the games core. Only allowed to kill one thing. Anyways

[white cove]

Yeah, thats why I specified Legacy

Evrima has a lot of things that make those kind of rules unneccesary/tedious

[hasty coyote]

Personally, I think stuff like perks and elder system should help with a lot of the toxicity like body guarding. It gives you a reason to actually survive and leave rather than fight everything til you die.

[keen plover]

The devs at most can limit mix packing through mechanics but they'll never (imo) do away with it without any rules. I think it's fine to limit it as best as possible. I also don't think officials need rules in the future (I'd love rules rn, but doubt they even have the man power or anything to manage that, heck hacking is barely managed - not to the fault of anyone, just how it is).

but onto the topic at hand, yeah body guarding will probs be limited by herbis needing to follow migration paths. Eventually, they'll need to leave.

Bodies also stay for a long time. Hopefully in the future hunger times aren't as bad as right now

So that realistically waiting a herbi out is possible

[hasty coyote]

Like currently, diets are spreading out pachy and teno pretty well in my experience.
I normally play pachy and stay near the coasts, occasionally heading to center to fill on agave. So I rarely see tenos unless i go out of my way to fight things.

[keen plover]

While yes, a large group of tenos even with perks around will probs have the firepower to camp a body out with the current diets.

Also are perks permanent? If you get them, is there a need to redo all those tasks?

If they are permanent, people will probs complete them in like 1 day or something stupid

[hasty coyote]

Oh they can def still camp bodies, but there would be more incentive to just move away. Why risk dying before you get elder and just fight another day?

[keen plover]

Not everyone would want to be an elder tbf.

With what I see about elders, I wouldn't bother with it

[hasty coyote]

We don’t know for sure how they work.
But from what I can tell: some perks are permanent and other are not, and you are likely to get permanent perks from dying of old age as an elder.

[dusky surge]

i still hate the fact that elders are not only an option, but require a very specific playstyle to end up in

like "i haven't speced into growing old and dying" what the fuck

[keen plover]

So you get the permanent ones and don't bother ever going through the cycle again. Idk, elders while nice means eventually you'll be worse off.

[hasty coyote]

Maybe you still just die of old age, you just don’t get to reach the power of elder

[white cove]

I just hope perks are a mix and match kind of thing, or have a respec*

I'd hate to be trapped to some playstyle because I chose the wrong one

[dusky surge]

i would hope, but they seem to imply that its exclusively based on following a VERY specialised diet/set of perks

[keen plover]

I like that elders are an option. Means I don't need to worry about eventually dying without some control. I can technically be alive for as long as I want if I don't choose to be an elder

[dusky surge]

also perks allowing animals to be better combatants always rubs me the wrong way

[white cove]

Im pretty sure theyve stated they wont be going down that route

no BoB esque +15% damage to bite or w/e

One they touted was giving teno a lot more breath so it can swim, something like that IIRC

it was something to do with water

[hasty coyote]

Most I would do for “combat perks” would be more of changing playstyle. Like carno charge deals much less damage, but now turns better and drains less stam.

[keen plover]

I liked the one where it gives carnos charge fractures, but at a reduced damage or something. I butchered wavepoole's idea

[tall bronze]

Kinda late but Carno charge should honestly deal mild-moderate fractures once fracture severities come, period 😛 No need for perks.

[mystic cedar]

Lmfaooo naww

[tall bronze]

I mean it wouldn't be a death sentence like legacy bone break, you're just a lil slower or whatever kinda fracture you got. 😛

Not NOW though, that'd be bad.

Fractures right now are just "broken or not" so a Carno would always apply maximum fracture in that case We already saw how that went down before....

[mystic cedar]

Ohhh okay I see what you mean

[primal harbor]

@odd pebble you realize the reason they do that is before you could latch onto their face but since you were on.... what they use to kill and they are doing that by just biting

there is no reason to do headshot damage for pouncing

it's just latch on and do bleed, nothing else to it

[tall bronze]

Should honestly just make ye bounce off and have to actually aim for once 😛

[primal harbor]

no?

that just overcomplicates things

[tall bronze]

Not really. Don't pounce the giant mouth 🤷

[primal harbor]

that is how pounce use to work and it caused a lot of issues

[tall bronze]

How would bouncing off of something's face cause issues 😮 It'd just be like if you hit a tree or something 😛

[primal harbor]

you would pounce the side then end up on its face, because of how inconsistent it was they made it so you can only be on the side

pounce has so many issues the way it is rn is the least buggy and has the least issues atm

[tall bronze]

[primal harbor]

I'd rather not have them re-break it

[eternal iris]

If pounce would result in a pin its fine to attack head on, if it would result in a latch it should probably bounce off

[raw reef]

@hexed sorrel i tought of something like deino should be able to kill stego easier too,but the handsome gentleman in feedback discussion reminded me that if deino is able to kill stego land deinos would be op so lmao

@subtle berry that stegos either built different or hacking lmao

i find it hard to believe 20 punces didnt take it down when its supposed to go down in like 4-5 lmao

[golden coral]

@subtle berryBecause it's a very large animal, and you didn't even have a full pack. 15-25 min for hunting something like an apex is pretty reasonable, especially if you're not having 7-8 utahs at that.

[azure crescent]

@remote aurora pretty sure that the first two sentences are already a thing

[remote aurora]

Yeah kinda, i guess i just got a lil salty from my last encounter with a utah pack and really wanted to put emphasis on that tap pounce thing

[azure crescent]

i feel you haha

[golden coral]

Pounce being a "ramp up" mechanic would be interesting, would make bucking better and make it important to wear the target down before being able to properly pounce. But then pounce should probably go back to being damage over bleed.

[hexed sorrel]

never said it should kill on land. I said it should be able to have a 4 head shot, but remaining to have a 12 body shot.

if you let a deino headshot you on land... then you deserve to die haha

[raw reef]

fair

[opaque beacon]

it does

thats why bucking is a thing

[hollow canyon]

^

although I think they're arguing for it to increase exponentially rather than linearly

[winter iris]

I never realised that, but what is the logic behind a Pachy's headbutt being able to knock down something considerably bigger than itself and a carno's ram being not? Also, considering that the headbutt is not at full speed I'd see the logic of stunning something, but why knocking down something well bigger? There would be a logic in a carno's ram knocking down something bigger, but I see why the devs decided not to (even if I think something 10-15% bigger could be knocked down by a ram). But really, why should a pachy be able to knock down something bigger? It knocked me down and I was weighting around 750kg

[hollow canyon]

the cut off points for the CC on Pachy's ram are just scuffed

Pachy knocks down things up to... 1300kg iirc?

[winter iris]

seriously? Sounds strange, but if it is true That is non-sense

[golden coral]

Yes. Or at least, I do, because I think it would make pounce and buck more interesting, since you'd have to actually wear the target down properly if that was the case.

[hollow canyon]

Yea it's one of the weird shennanigans with numbers that this game is doing, there's just quite a lot of values that are in a way all over the place and affect balance.

either way that should get changed at some point, I'm pretty sure it's not exactly intentional

[grave veldt]

thats a large knock down range

[hollow canyon]

Yes, I'm pretty sure it's just an omission tbh

[fringe surge]

The problem with dryo isnt that its bad

It's just that it has no fun interaction with any animal besides running

And just having endless running from things as your gameplay is boring

It's dumb that people don't seem to realize this

[hollow canyon]

It's a meme animal, very few people care to play meme animals and even less people care to play meme animals that you actually have to grow.

[fringe surge]

^

It's at BEST 30mins just to troll people

[hollow canyon]

Idk the only reason why I ever pick Dryo is if I want to scout some stuff or something

[fringe surge]

And like, just play hypsi

[hollow canyon]

admittedly I'd straight up buff Dryo's stamina

[fringe surge]

Why?

[hollow canyon]

Idk why it's so low

Do you know what its runtime actually is?

It's 120 seconds, that's 15 seconds more than Utah and Pachy

that seems... waaay too low

[fringe surge]

I haven't played dryo in months to be fair, I just remember it being REALLY good when I played it.

[hollow canyon]

It used to be really good

[fringe surge]

And I don't remember them changing anything about it

[hollow canyon]

it used to have the highest runtime in the game

[fringe surge]

Oh they nerfed it?

[hollow canyon]

that's no longer the case

I mean... I don't recall any patch notes that would say so

but to be perfectly honest - I never pay attention to Dryo patch notes

I know its runtime is much, much shorter than it used to be

and honestly quite a bit shorter than it should imo be

idk give it at least 150 seconds imo

[fringe surge]

Honestly its hard to give a shit about dryo lol

[hollow canyon]

to be perfectly honest I don't think it's going to magically get people to play it but 120 seconds is just way too low

[hollow canyon]

Indeed

[fringe surge]

No one plays it, its play style is objectively less fun then other playables, I say just buff it to 150 and leave it be till burrowing.

[hollow canyon]

I really don't care for this animal and neither do the devs, they all but outright said so

[hollow canyon]

fair

[fringe surge]

There's no fixing dryo ig

[hollow canyon]

I think that's probably the right approach just leave it at that, it's a decent animal to play when you're just starting the game and want to find out how the different mechanics work

it's not perfect even for that but it's... decent

I typically suggested it to new players

either Dryo or Pteranodon, both are good for learning the map and don't take much time and effort to grow

[fringe surge]

Also did they break juvie ptera?

It used to have pretty bad stam for flying

Now pretty much as good as adult

So much for the "learning to fly" Thing lol

[hollow canyon]

I have absolutely no idea, I haven't touched Pteranodon since update 3

[fringe surge]

I still agree with that suggestion to make herbie max diet like 150%

[raw reef]

@deep beacon idk why people complain about hypsi being 1 shot by dryo so much,is there groups of evil dryos that go around murdering hypsis?lmao

[fringe surge]

Maybe just for stego

And maybe make the negatives for stego super harsh, like worse bleed res

That + A nerf to 5k HP will make it more fun

Because all the shitty players will be waded out

[hollow canyon]

I don't

I don't think there's any reason why herbivores should be artificially handicapped like that

[fringe surge]

Because currently its easier to AFK with herbie then with carni

[hollow canyon]

honestly anything that makes diets slightly less of a chore is a good thing in my book

[hollow canyon]

yea it's always been like that

that's just how herbivores are

[raw reef]

could be really good + spreading out herbi diets more,more herbis migrating = more of the map used

[fringe surge]

Carnis at least have to look for food, so even after you're full you're still playing the game most of the time

Herbies just eat then AFK

[hollow canyon]

gods no, the game is enough of a walking simulator as it is

[fringe surge]

And even then, 150% max cap is not that low

[hollow canyon]

I find it absolutely obnoxious right now

[hollow canyon]

it is very, very low

[raw reef]

its better than me spawning in center as teno sitting for a couple of hours and being full adult lmao

[hollow canyon]

I honestly wouldn't touch herbivores if those changes would go through

[fringe surge]

Yeah juvie gameplay is obnoxious as fuck, its just sprinting for ages.

It breaks my immersion a lot

[hollow canyon]

no, it's definitely not, i'd much rather sit in one spot afk than hold "w" and "shift" for 20 minutes at a time over and over again

[fringe surge]

Maybe just for stego

[hollow canyon]

running across the map doesn't constitute gameplay in my book

[fringe surge]

The other herbies are fine but stego is way too easy to grow

[raw reef]

eh fair

[hollow canyon]

it's a boring chore that's been put in the game to be an excuse of a gameplay loop

[fringe surge]

So the only way to make herbies fun with diets to you is to make diets matter as little as possible because its just a badly designed mechanic?

Fair

[hollow canyon]

the devs should simply introduce some stuff for people to do which would determine how far they grow rather than have that be dependent on diets

diets should only determine how well you can do those things

[fringe surge]

What do you suggest

[hollow canyon]

I've suggested "quests" before, specific random tasks that would be fitting of your animal and pop up in a semi-random fashion

they would be coupled with a tutorial-esque hints

e.g. - your animal wants to wallow

you get a hint saying that your small Tenonto wants to wallow and the hint that explains to you what wallowing does

it would both work as a little guide for new players explaining the in game mechanics to them

and encourage them to move

I'd also create a separate feedback channel here on discord where people would make their suggestions for quests

the devs would just pick the ones they'd find good/acceptable

there are thousands of people on this discord there's no way we wouldn't get at least half a dozen of decent quests per each animal

that's my take of how to solve growth, I don't think it's going to happen but I think it would make the game much better and actually far more engaging

[fringe surge]

I like it

But I don't see it being added

[hollow canyon]

Yea I don't see it being added either tbh

[fringe surge]

It's a good idea but out of the scope for the dev team I think, it's like if I suggested stego to be nerfed, it just aint happening

[hollow canyon]

I think we're going to be stuck with the growth working as a timer that has to end before you get to actually have fun

I think it's very much in the scope of what they could do

it really shouldn't be very difficult

as for nerfing Stego - I don't really think this animal needs major nerfs

Its group size should definitely go down

I'd personally have them in pairs

[raw reef]

eh group sizes dont really do much tho

[hollow canyon]

trios max, there's 0 reason why Stego should pack up to 5

[raw reef]

like you can make a dinos group size 2 and they will still stick togeather so

[hollow canyon]

Yea they don't with how they work right now, I've made a suggestion regarding that before

let me just link it, it was for Carno during update 4 days but the point stands

I wanted to potentially expand that to Stego and Deino too

#general-feedback message

There are some potential issues with that to be perfectly honest but I think it would at least make Stego less of an issue

[raw reef]

hm

i mean not a bad idea,tho feel like there may be better ways than hunger drain

[tall bronze]

Apparently they still have yet to overhaul juvies.....r e a l l y hope they do that Ontogenetic whatever blahblah idea.

[raw reef]

like maybe dinosaurs would become uncomfortable the more of the species that are ungrouped around,recieving slight debuffs at first and the debuffs geting bigger as more of the species arrive

[hollow canyon]

ontogenetic partioning

[tall bronze]

Also curious as to how the heck cypress plants help juvies

[fringe surge]

whats ontogenetic

[tall bronze]

Ontogenetic Niche Partitioning, I just didn't wanna type it all out

[fringe surge]

High stamina for juvies is just a bandaid on a shitty system to me

[fringe surge]

OH yea, that's what I thought diets would be at first lol

[tall bronze]

Should be regular capacity but FAST regen so that juvies don't run for 80 years

[raw reef]

juvies litteraly just waiting timers to play the game

[hollow canyon]

ontogenetic partitioning meaning that a juvenile of the same species occupies a different niche in an ecosystem than an adult of the same species

[deep beacon]

There are some, but it is not so horrible since the hypsi has no growth, I am more concerned that they make the decision to nerf the Dryo, just because one or two trolls, which you only find on official servers, if to make the hypsi survive They have to destroy the Dryo, I would prefer that they do nothing, I do not want to destroy a dino just so that another one can hold on better, it would not be fair

[hollow canyon]

agreed, I think they should have a bit higher stamina not... whatever in the lord Voodoo's name it is now

and then higher regen on top of that

[fringe surge]

Like when you grow you'll get different diets and those diets would be smartley picked to be fun and fair and to encourage players to use different parts of the map

But like, they didn't do that for some reason, I don't get why.

[tall bronze]

Yeah it being higher than average makes since due to being young and spry, but this is w a y too much. Like they may as well have infinite running stam.

[fringe surge]

fresh teno can run for 5+ minutes i think

[hollow canyon]

Pretty sure it's another "oopsie" the devs did with numbers

[raw reef]

i mean i dont see a problem with it really since how rare it is,but i get your point

[fringe surge]

The isle has a lot of number problems

[raw reef]

tho would be really fucked if pt couldnt 1 shot hypsi

[tall bronze]

As much as current diets are disappointing, what we have was essentially just a big test to see how we use it n' such. And it's stayed that way since they have more important stuff to work on first. Apparently we have like 1/3 of what it's planned to be.

Could call current diets....

An *appetizer *

👍

[fringe surge]

Eh, I hope so, herbie diets need a major overhual first, carnivore diets are pretty fine to me since carnivores have a good gameplay loop just be being carnivores.

Herbivore diets are what's hard to make work, which should be fixed.

But diets have changed how I play

That's good I guess

[tall bronze]

It all needs major changes, ye. Carnivore diets are a tiny bit better but still w e i r d.

"Oh a fresh Stego corpse? Nah, don't like it."

[raw reef]

most apex animals should be the smallers animals diet tbh

[tall bronze]

My dinosaur dude, you are an animal trying to survive the harsh nature of a tropical island full of other dinosaurs, you would not just pass that up

Tis why I am excited for the idea of organ/body part preferences instead of a specific species

No more "No, I only want Dryo, I don't care there's a fresh Stego". But instead hopefully "I like liver. Dryo liver is okay but kinda small-OH SNAP IS THAT A STEGO LIVER!?"

It's so disheartening finding a big corpse then seeing it's not on your diet.....

[hollow canyon]

I'd say it's the opposite, herbivore diets are alright, carnivore diets make their gameplay feel like grocery shopping instead of hunting

[fringe surge]

What I do is just eat whatever I can then just vomit the food up if I find something on my diet

[zealous citrus]

Pov deino diets make me die inside

[tall bronze]

Pachy's diet changes recently are a good example of the old idea of "2 easier to access diets, 1 harder to access" that for some reason seems partially forgotten.

[zealous citrus]

Ah yes i will definitely drown a teno for my diet as croc

[fringe surge]

And for apexes like stego have it be 2 hard diets and one less hard one

[tall bronze]

Pteranodon of all things is for Deino

The chicken wing of the game

[raw reef]

than theres pt elite fish diet 💀

[tall bronze]

[zealous citrus]

Ptera should be able to eat/scavenge all corpses except other pteras

[tall bronze]

Heck a chicken wing probably has more meat than Ptera honestly

[zealous citrus]

Herbi diet personally i had no problem with

[fringe surge]

Ptera elite fish diet is braindead

[raw reef]

yeah and it would give the same diet as schooling fish

[fringe surge]

Ptera should have compy, which seemed like basic logic to me, but devs disagreed ig.

[tall bronze]

I like the idea of rotting meat (when it comes) having stages and creatures tolerating different stages. Someone actually posted an idea about it recently 😛

So like Ptera isn't like a scavenger scavenger, it's more of a fisher. But it could still have like 50% tolerance for rotten meat. So basically 50% rotten meat is 0% to Ptera. Then onwards it's like normal.

[zealous citrus]

Also give back gore stages like in legacy

[fringe surge]

nice

[tall bronze]

51% being 1% rotten to Ptera, so on and so forth

[hasty coyote]

Actually tested this recently. Iirc, it knocks down up to 800kg and stuns up to 1800kg. This is likely much better, and is because of carno and other large carnivores being faster, so pachy needs to stun them to fight back.

[raw reef]

a fisher,and murderer of turtles

[tall bronze]

aggressive pecking

[fringe surge]

Yeah they really need to add corpse limits

[zealous citrus]

Atleast after you eat the body as large carni it shrinks and you cant eat it but a smaller carnivore can

[raw reef]

titanium beak that can crack through turtle shells

[hollow canyon]

that's nice but it suggests there were some changes, I vaguely remember seeing a video where a Carno at ~1.1t got knocked down at some point

[fringe surge]

I mean isn't that just the rot system but more simple

[zealous citrus]

[tall bronze]

🐢

[deep beacon]

😊 Thanks it might be weird I mean I love hypsi I'm a weirdo jajajajaja, but I just think developers can valance dinosaurs without needing to trash someone else's favourite dinosaur

[hollow canyon]

either way it's good to have some clarity with regard to that

[zealous citrus]

Bruh i was looking for turtles for like 30 min found n o n e

[hollow canyon]

I haven't tested the upper limits of the knockdown and stun

[raw reef]

lmao tbh i love hypsi but its been bad for a long while

[fringe surge]

I don't see how tbh

[zealous citrus]

Why was the ai spawn rate nucked

[hasty coyote]

I think last update had knockdown range at 1.5 tons💀 and stun at 3 tons💀

[fringe surge]

It's SO bad

[raw reef]

i tought of auto aim when somethings really close to you

[fringe surge]

Like it's just running simulator

[raw reef]

because you really cant use spit in combat

except against crocs lmao

[hollow canyon]

yea that's what I recall more or less although I thought knockdown was up to ~1.3t or so

[fringe surge]

Just add a slight autoaim at all times

[tall bronze]

Hypernova had mentioned that before, Pachy was unintentionally hitting up way too high 😛

[fringe surge]

I use hypsi spit to troll bigger animals then me, mostly stegos

[raw reef]

yeah fair considering everything except pt and deino have small heads compared to their body rn lmao

[hasty coyote]

Guess we will never know now, and it doesn’t matter anymore, since it will hopefully not return. Otherwise rip the entire small tier and mid tiers are going to get bullied.

[tall bronze]

Hypsi spit needs an overhaul honestly

[fringe surge]

Hypsi spit is fun for trolling

[tall bronze]

Like not requiring near-perfect accuracy

[raw reef]

make hypsi spit something like primal carnage dilo/cryo spit tbh

[fringe surge]

Just make it so hypsi spit has intense autoaim

[raw reef]

just a quick right click while jumping/running and if it hits the general head area it blinds

[zealous citrus]

Everyone gangster till the hypsi says auto aim activate

[raw reef]

and they should make hypsi more agile too lmao

[tall bronze]

• Doesn't shove the camera into the grass
• Cone spray option that sacrifices range
• More forgiving long range spit (AKA you don't need to be robot levels of accurate)
• Doesn't stop you when running and spitting behind

That's how I'd do it 😛

[hasty coyote]

Gotta love that if something heads perpendicular to you, the spit is likely to just miss, even if it showed yellow.

[tall bronze]

[deep beacon]

true, but it is a dinosaur that is less similar to its real version, basically they have invented the dinosaur, that is a world of possibilities, I do not want hypsi to be a kind of fight, honestly, but with imagination everything can be improved 🤩 , by the way, sorry my english 😅 is very basic and i need help to write things haha

[fringe surge]

Holy shit I just realized that hypsi spit has shoved your camera into the grass for like 2 years now, how the hell hasn't that been fixed

[tall bronze]

It's supposed to help you focus your aim

It does um....quite the opposite

Like I can go into the jungles for that, thank you

[raw reef]

no problem lol,has the potential to be really cool i hope they make it actually good

wish they d try to balance their game and make sure the mechanics are good and working properly as intented but hey this is a dinosaur game what can you do

[deep beacon]

I agree, we can only be positive and have patience and trust the developers of course 😂

[slim dragon]

@primal harbor I think the devs confirmed that's how noghtvision will work

[primal harbor]

oh thank fuck

[dusky surge]

didnt they retract that and state it was going to be manual?

[muted palm]

@alpine plover

[dusky surge]

@muted palm thats a planned ability for austroraptor

or something like it

[muted palm]

in 3 years

[dusky surge]

ok

point still stands

[muted palm]

@primal harbor if they wont implement an in game map which forces me to use a 3rd party website then why would gamma cranking be abusive hmm? If I slapped some really dark shaded sunglasses with super glue to your eyeballs would you be still be complaining? Game is literally unplayable without gamma its darker than DC movie. I cant even see during the afternoons in this game.

[dusky surge]

he's talking about after NV lmao

[primal harbor]

💀

what he said

[dusky surge]

also dude he just wants people to not have an unfair advantage why you going to such extremes lmao

[muted palm]

yes but the amount of people I've meet in game complaining on how they literally cant see anything is unbelievable. The temporary solution to it would be cranking gamma which most computers have embedded into its OS. Its easy as 2+2 no need to download from a potentially virus infected website. Obviously I can tell you how because apparently it's against the rules or so I've heard which frustrates me but at least they are finally working on a night vision update

But I sometimes forget some people have no clue because I always forget this game is for all ages

I've meet a bunch of people going afk beacuse their mom told them to take a shower lmfao

[dusky surge]

???

My brother in Christ read the feedback post, he is LITERALLY asking for the NV to prevent gamma exploits AFTER the update which makes night easier to see in, not asking for us to be plunged into darkness with the current nights

[obtuse ocean]

I can see clear as day at night time in the game, i have not used any gamma. Not sure why people complain about it, but i see very clearly at night. I have a good monitor, not sure if thats the case

[muted palm]

its mostly because of different monitors

[dusky surge]

i feel like you've MASSIVELY misinterpreted the point of the post

i do agree that gamma has been near a necessity in recent patches (although currently nights are VERY bright)

[livid hatch]

I have a laptop and another monitor,in one I essentially have to use gamma and can still barely see anything,on the other I'm chilling without ever touching gamma

[mellow zenith]

I think you're right on this

Shame, i really liked the idea of an auto/natural night vision

[dusky surge]

same

but it might be weird when trying to adapt to other light sources

for example, human buildings, flashlights, forest fires, the like

the sun isn't the only light source in this game

we'll see how it goes

[mellow zenith]

Indeed

[frail bobcat]

Forest fires will be lit

[dusky surge]

Literally

[frail bobcat]

(please murder me for this pun (sarcasm))

[mellow zenith]

Nv is technically "close" to be release

[frail bobcat]

Does somebody have the screenshot of poutine italienne in the ST?

[dusky surge]

what one

[frail bobcat]

It kinda looks like night vision

He is a raptor in that screenshot

[dusky surge]

i literally dont know what screenshot you are talking about

[frail bobcat]

Its a screenshot from the stresstest that is/was going recently

It shows a utah with a blueish vision during the night

[dusky surge]

could you find it lmao

blueish vision during the night sounds like nothing new

[frail bobcat]

It looked different

[mellow zenith]

i think its the filter to counter gamma

[frail bobcat]

@primal heart and how long should apexes take to grow in your opinion?

Btw.

The carno is a pseudo mid. The thirdsmallest tier

[dusky surge]

idk if he realises but carno is barely even a mid-tier, absolutely not some kind of large animal

[frail bobcat]

So no large predator

[dusky surge]

it's the biggest pseudo-mid/smallest mid (depending on how you wanna look at it)

[frail bobcat]

Pseudo-mid sounds cooler and makes it more complicated than just smallest mid

[frail bobcat]

What are the other pseudo mids except teno?

[primal heart]

In my opinion carno is big enough and bigger than allo can call huge

[dusky surge]

cerato, magy, kentro, diablo, megalania, bary

[dusky surge]

its not bigger than allo what the fuck?

[frail bobcat]

Its a pseudo-mid tier the third smallest tier

[dusky surge]

neither in reality not in the Isle is it larger than an allo

[primal heart]

Predictor bigger than allo ,can call Huge

[dusky surge]

what?

[frail bobcat]

And it has 1600 or 1800 kg so not very big in dinosaur terms

[primal heart]

My mystic

[dusky surge]

?????

[frail bobcat]

Allo weighs like 2000- 4000 kg (dont know the excact number, please correct me)

[dusky surge]

around 2-3 tons

nowhere near 4 tons

[frail bobcat]

What are you talking about?

[primal heart]

I mean, a predator bigger than Allosaurus would be a giant predator

[frail bobcat]

But carno is not bigger

[primal heart]

Didn't mean carno bigger than allo

[frail bobcat]

but you said it like that

[dusky surge]

there's tons of predators larger than allo, allo isn't really THAT big

[primal heart]

Yes my English sucks

[frail bobcat]

And back to my question. How long should a apex take to grow?

@primal heart

[primal heart]

In the case of this carno have to be the top predator on land, I think it should be at least three or four hours

[frail bobcat]

But why?

A singular carno can be fucked up bad by two utahs

[dusky surge]

that seems entirely unnecessary

[frail bobcat]

Do you do something else except for chilling in the discoussion channels in your life?

[primal heart]

Top predators must always be harder to come by, even it is carno now

[dusky surge]

isnt the top predator deino

[primal heart]

land one

[dusky surge]

also, that just punishes people for playing carno

[frail bobcat]

But they get fucked up by two utahs if they are good

[dusky surge]

which is entirely unnecessary

just makes it that no one wants to play carno

which isnt very fair

[frail bobcat]

Every playable should be enjoyable (exept for stego, stego is cringe)

(sarcasm)

[primal heart]

I use to think so，But the top predator stayed the same for more than a year

I also thought that this problem would be solved soon

[frail bobcat]

Because its the biggest? Have you thought about that?

[dusky surge]

the way to solve it isn't to make carno gameplay garbage

also carno has counterplay

so it really doesn't make sense to put in so much time for so little value

[frail bobcat]

The horse

[primal heart]

I think the they are trying to balance the number of herbivores by strengthening herbivores and weakening carnivores, but doing that all the time may not work well

[frail bobcat]

And yet you are saying to weaken the carno

Kinda does not make sense

[primal heart]

I said buff it

[dusky surge]

i dont think expanding its growth time to 4 hours is a buff

[frail bobcat]

Its a nerf

3-4 hours growtime is a nerf

A huge one

[primal heart]

I also said get it back to the place to top predictor should be

[frail bobcat]

Huh?

[dusky surge]

what does that even imply

[frail bobcat]

Carno is fine right now

[primal heart]

Return carno to the previous version

[frail bobcat]

And now you are talking shit

[dusky surge]

and make it 3-4 hours? lmao no

[primal heart]

Carno is good now but as a top predictor ,no

[dusky surge]

absolutely not worth growing 3-4 hours for that

[frail bobcat]

The carno from 4.75 was so op

[frail bobcat]

It wont be in like half a year

[primal heart]

I'm not going to talk about when there's going to be a big new land predator, I've been disappointed too many times, and as far as I know, the next one is

[frail bobcat]

And if the carno should take 3-4 hours, how long are big ones are going to take?

[primal heart]

2t 225 bite

[dusky surge]

imagine how long rex will take being 5x bigger than a carno

full day to grow one

[frail bobcat]

I know, but carno is fine right now

[frail bobcat]

Huh?

[primal heart]

With a bigger predator we can call back the carno data

[dusky surge]

why would we need to do that in the first place

[frail bobcat]

Carno is fine

[dusky surge]

we dont need carno to fill some kind of rex niche by making it awful to grow for very little reward

[frail bobcat]

We do need a buff to it for the sake of having a big predator

[dusky surge]

2 tons and 225 bite is 100% not worth the time spent

[primal heart]

But as long as the carno is a top predator, I think it should have the intensity and cost to match

[dusky surge]

when i can spend 5 hours for a deino who has 8 tons and 500 bite force, why would I EVER pick carno and grow for 3-4 hours

[frail bobcat]

I cant believe this persons ignorance to balance

[dusky surge]

carno would be a waste of time

[frail bobcat]

You are talking about destroying a playable for the sake of having a big predator which is not needed right now

[primal heart]

But crocodiles are not a mainstream predator, you're more of a natural mechanic to land players

[dusky surge]

okay? its still far more worth the growthtime

you're entire plan involves giving carno a few minor buffs and then making it a huge chore and difficulty to grow

[frail bobcat]

^

[dusky surge]

which, frankly, is not fun

[primal heart]

I just put my point, you can disagree it for sure. I just think this game lacks the right top predator, especially a species that runs the fastest and must be confronted by other species