suggestion-discussion

[languid ibex]

Debatable as you'd take up an inventory slots for something handled by a tame or a well timed stagger.

You start fishing on the death marker and hope for the best.

[crude nacelle]

It is much, much easier to throw a harpoon at a large target and press the special attack button than it is to weave attacks between a cluster of enemies.

maybe you're trying to deal with draugr piles and it spawns 2 starred draugr. you can draw them away, pin them in place, then go kill the pile.

[languid ibex]

I fail to see how that's related, you'd still be weaving in a cluster to throw a harpoon.

Then you have the cluster remaining anyways.

[crude nacelle]

no, because it's a very easy to aim quick ranged attack as opposed to slowly drawing your bow while being chased or trying to get close, swing, and then dodge

if you're in the ashlands surrounded by lava, a bunch of skeletons spawned, and a valkyrie just appeared overhead with a morgan... would you not have an easier time if you had to option to instantly halt the valkyrie or morgan and kite the rest away?

[languid ibex]

Drawing your bow isn't slow though...

[crude nacelle]

throwing a spear is instantaneous. pulling back an arrow takes like 2 seconds and doesn't always immediately kill the target which means you have to draw it back again, possibly again, just to deal with the threat that you could be tethering.

[languid ibex]

That situation is not so difficult to deal with in my experience.

[crude nacelle]

I didn't say difficult, I said easier.

Also imagine you turn up the difficulty so that all the enemies are much more dangerous and you die in 1 or 2 hits

in that situation crowd controlling a major enemy is hugely useful

[languid ibex]

Right, that ease isn't worth carrying a harpoon, especially when halting an enemy is possible in many arguably better ways. Dead Raiser, Trollstav, staggering, terrain usage, etc.

Reminder this is just my opinion.

[crude nacelle]

dead raiser costs health and etir, a harpoon can be used by a melee character who doesn't use magic. there's not always decent terrain for line of sighting.

[languid ibex]

Dead Raiser also does passive damage alongside taking focus away from you, giving that flexibility.

[crude nacelle]

dead raiser also dies very quickly on higher difficulty combat

especially against a large group of enemies

a harpoon also takes up 1 inventory slot while a bow and arrow take up 2.

[languid ibex]

I am just speaking about normal to be clear, and making the point that it'd really only shine in higher difficulties isn't exactly great.

[crude nacelle]

so you're saving 1 slot if you're a melee-focused build

[crude nacelle]

there is absolutely nothing wrong with there being a weapon that's especially useful in harder content

[languid ibex]

Even in higher difficulties, I would just tame many asksvin to the same effect.

[crude nacelle]

you can only make 1 asksvin follow you. the one you mount.

and they can't attack valkyries

[languid ibex]

Sure but 2 stars in higher difficulties are incredibly strong

[crude nacelle]

and they die very quickly against groups of enemies

[languid ibex]

They can take focus though, which is in essence, a stun.

[crude nacelle]

okay? you can have that AND the harpoon pin. even better.

and then you don't have to carry a bow. so you save inventory space

[languid ibex]

If I am carrying another tool it wouldn't be to make combat easier personally, otherwise I would carry blob bombs.

[crude nacelle]

the harpoon is making combat easier.

[languid ibex]

I just said that.

[crude nacelle]

you're not even carrying another tool

you're replacing a different one with one that takes up less space

[languid ibex]

I think you misunderstood.

[crude nacelle]

so you can carry whatever you want with the new slot that the harpoon has created by replacing the bow and arrows

you don't need a bow and arrows if the harpoon can pin flying enemies in place

especially if you can upgrade the damage

[languid ibex]

Yeah, in no way is a harpoon stun replacing bow and arrows for me.

[crude nacelle]

how do you know? you've never used it

you'd be sacrificing range for crowd control, inventory space, and the ability to use melee weapons vs flying enemies

[languid ibex]

Because I want ranged damage.

[crude nacelle]

you can throw the harpoon

that's ranged

[languid ibex]

Absolutely not, unless it does spirit damage and increased stagger, I wouldn't have it.

[crude nacelle]

don't even have to fetch it, it comes right back to your hand

well in the world where i get what I want and there's multiple harpoons and the ashlands has one you can build in that biome

there's no reason it couldn't have spirit damage, and it would stagger as much as a spear. which is more than an arrow

it'd just have shorter range and a longer cooldown between shots

[languid ibex]

That's a whole other idea entirely. I am off to bed though, have a good night. 👋

[gaunt harness]

#suggestions message Absolutely. I'm not a fan of sticking the harpoon rope to the ground, because that's basically the rooting mechanic but worse, but I think we should be able to shorten the rope between the harpoon thrower and the target. That we can't use the harpoon to reel in feels like a very missed opportunity.
I'm also not fond of the idea that if you have an enemy harpooned, you can't hit them without letting go. It really nerfs the harpoon for single player in a way that no other weapon or tool is affected.

Being able to hook it to the boat too feels like a nice mechanic, but I can see that causing a heap of trouble.

[gaunt harness]

#suggestions message Why did you nerf your own suggestion? You can hardly accuse the Dvergr of being particularly useful to begin with, so at least let your idea shine before you yourself make it worse.

[wanton atlas]

@ember lily The dvergr don't care about you, they are in valheim to harvest materials. they sell things to you as a means to collect money or basicly overprice you for things. they aren't there to help you

[gaunt harness]

#suggestions message Wouldn't it make more sense to rebalance resistances and weaknesses among existing creatures instead of adding even more creatures?

#suggestions message I agree the UI could do with a remake. It's not like they hit a homerun 5 years ago, and there's no need to revisit it before 1.0

For instance, the adrenaline bar doesn't play nice with the Eitr bar for me.

[eternal storm]

Changing stats that players are used to is usually a mistake because they'll likely be pissed off. I think a more sensible approach would be to add new ones, like IG did with the bear, which resists to pierce and blunt, forcing players relying too much on clubs and arrows to find new strategies. Anyways, I have no idea why people seem to believe a game is fun when there's only a bunch of weapons really worth using, which is basically a self-inflicted hard mode for... reasons?

I don't care, but I imagine lot of new players will not be amused.

[gaunt harness]

And adding more new mobs creates clutter

[eternal storm]

I'm open to suggestions that would otherwise prevent the boring "choices" that everyone makes with weapons (not to mention armor). Which is made even worse by skills: once one has chosen between swords, clubs or polearms, there's even less reasons to start using a different weapon because no matter how cool that new dagger is, starting from 0 in mid to late game sounds like a bad deal, whether it's true or not.

[elder summit]

Ngl the bear does nothing for clubs since the torch, one of the most effective options for it, gives club XP

Honestly I think the torch would be a goated weapon if not for its lack of upgrades and durability (not saying it SHOULD have these mind you)

[sonic musk]

https://tenor.com/view/valheim-walk-walking-torch-gif-22602855

[eternal storm]

A torch takes forever, though, because of the bear's tankiness, I like more a shield + bronze sword so with stagger I get more damage now. Anyways, we do agree there's an issue with how resistances create huge gaps in weapon choice (and the same exact argument could be made for armor)? I believe new players are easily frustrated by such things, many could move on before hearing "there's a mod for that".

[sonic musk]

I would like to see enemies weak to special types of damage and have awesome and varied weapon options. In the early game, I memorized each enemy and their weakness. The biggest one everyone should know is trolls are weak to pierce, so bows and spears are especially effective (knives too). In the late game I don't know the enemies' particular weaknesses because they don't feel as distinct, and you aren't encouraged to fight some enemies with some things and others with other weapons.

I think a lot of late game enemies are 'resistance to pierce, neutral to blunt/slash' so spears and bows are worse and swords and maces are okay, but not many weapons are the exact weakness of most enemy types. In the swamps, maces are king because many of the undead are weak to blunt. I wish late game had some of that too

[eternal storm]

Consider how mid game offers elemental damage sources that sometimes make some choices good even when they're not. I made a chart that just accounts for how many mobs are resistant/weak to what, so it's not based on how hard they hit back, how frequent they are and so on, Just how many of them are ok to fight with your weapon. In many cases we're talking about 20/30 valid mobs against 10 or less, here.

This means you must use Frostner way beyond the Mountains. You'll never use a knife in late game, even in the biome you crafted it. And so on. This limits choice a lot.

[sonic musk]

If the DN enemies had 4 specific enemies;
1 weak to magic and resistant to pierce, blunt, and slash
1 weak to pierce, and resistant to slash, blunt, and magic
1 weak to slash, and resistant to blunt, pierce, and magic
1 weak to blunt, and resistant to pierce, slash, and magic

then you would use different weapons to kill different enemies, and knowledge of the enemies' weaknesses would matter, how you fight them matters, having a generalized weapon loadout would matter (and I feel like more people than just me try to have a generalized weapon loadout) and enemies would feel very interactive, and each fight would have a different strategy. Personally, that's very exciting

[sonic musk]

knives are still good to fight Fulings with the really fast foreswing, and the low stamina usage, and the ability to sprint with knives without a movement debuff. That's a legitimate weapon vs them. And Skoll and Hati is decent in Mistlands for similar reasons. Very fast foreswing means you can parry a Seeker and kill it with 3 quick slashes for low stamina useage.

Knives aren't useless. I even saw someone use Skoll and Hati to kill the Queen, and it worked way better than I thought it would, honestly.

[barren oasis]

Always having to carry around 4 different types of weapons would be pretty annoying imo. Of course you could use something that does multiple types of damage but still. Especially if your trying to do a build centered around magic you'd get pretty screwed over if 3/4 enemies are resistant to you.

[sonic musk]

knives do slash and pierce so you're covered on that. Would only need 3. And yes you would be. It's the final biome of the game. It can afford to be quite tough, I mean Ashlands makes every other biome look like a daycare

[eternal storm]

"useless" as in "there's way better choices". Plains is just mid game and doesn't really require you give up the weapon you already have (sword/club/polearm), and in the Mistlands you really want something that doesn't rely just on physical damage. This creates lanes at different speeds.

Yes, you can suffer through the worst choices, but why there should be any?

[sonic musk]

With how incredibly unforgiving The Ashlands is, I don't mind if the Deep North is a frozen hellscape. It wouldn't be a shock to the senses to have an incredibly challenging biome right after Ashlands

[barren oasis]

Challenging enemies is all good but struggling with inventory management constantly would make the deep north a big drag instead of a intense feeling finale. If they update the inventory maybe it could feel a lot better

[eternal storm]

The issue with maining a weapon that starts to suck in late game is that you now have to start from zero with another skill. Nobody likes that. Even worse if made more evident with an excessive diversity of mobs

[sonic musk]

well, this doesn't have to do with the weapon types. You already have this feeling in most biomes past, say Plains. I don't know if they're gonna give us flexibility in our inventory but even in our current system it's not unbearable. I wouldn't have to change my weapons that I bring by much cause I always carry at least 3 types of damage with me, it isn't too much of a strain. When I carry potions and extra food, it gets bad, but the weapons themselves aren't a problem

[sonic musk]

yeah I will admit knives don't feel as good in Ashlands. You do have a point there. If they make a frost knife in Deep North, it could fix that, but as it stands knives are lackluster in Ashlands

[barren oasis]

Yeah maining a weapon is fun and makes the game more replayable cuz you can try different weapons every run. If I end up using most of the weapons in one run I have less reason to do another run

[eternal storm]

You're supposed to be around 40-ish level in late game, but leveling takes a lot of time so splitting it in 3+ weapon types is really not a great choice. This is why people main in sword/club/polearm and forget the rest (just talking about melee here).

[barren oasis]

I was just talking with my friend earlier about how it's lame that you are forced to use an iron mace for bone mass if you don't want to be put at a huge disadvantage

Getting forced into a weapon type doesn't feel fun. Small weaknesses and resistances are good but it shouldnt be huge

It should be rewarding to use the right weapon while not being insanely punishing to use the wrong one

[eternal storm]

Yep, that's the issue. Little choices = little fun. Armor are unbalanced too but are least they don't punish you for starting with the "wrong" one (which would be heavy armor, does anybody use those?)

[sonic musk]

that is a little hard to balance, I will say

[sonic musk]

uh, always? Why would I use light armor and die faster?

[barren oasis]

Only heavy armor I ever use is wolf armor just because it looks awesome

[sonic musk]

I'd rather not debuff myself for free, the game is already punishing enough

[barren oasis]

Being super slow gets you killed way more

[eternal storm]

Actually I tuned down difficulty for that reason: I don't want to be punished because I like the wrong weapon/armor. That's not ideal game design.

[sonic musk]

trade off damage resistance for a 10% movement speed, so I need to use that speed to never get hit once? Because if I get hit with heavy armor, I survive, if I get hit with light armor, I don't. If I'm not using the 10% movement speed to never get hit, why wear the armor? Sounds like a really stressful situation. I'd rather not be a glass cannon for no reason

[spiral ice]

My play-style is to armor up with high HP and use my health as a resource. Let it drop a bit, then gain adrenaline to activate Iron Brooch for HP and armor. At that point, I just hack away at anything in my way. It's honestly really fun!

[barren oasis]

Some heavy armors are worth it but some are pretty bad. I think bronze armor is the most egregious, troll armor or bear armor is so much cheaper and you can upgrade it easily so it'll probably be better defense

Iron armor is ok but I normally take root harnesk because slash resistance is so OP, and troll armor is easily usable until mountains if you really wanted so iron armor isn't as bad but it's still not great

[spiral ice]

Also I play almost entirely solo melee, so I enjoy facetanking things. 😁

[sonic musk]

deathsquitos and seekers (when flying) are some of the enemies that force you to get hit many times. If it's 1v1 you can avoid the hit but 1v12 you cannot tell me your 10% movement speed is guaranteed the 3rd Deathsquito of 4th flying seeker misses all their hits too

[barren oasis]

I think wolf armor is the first heavy armor that can be worth it over lighter armors because that's when the defense gap gets a lot bigger

[eternal storm]

Root harnesk is basically the default choice even in Mistlands. That's insane.

[spiral ice]

*Pierce resistance on the harnesk

[sonic musk]

default for who? Is there like a poll that says most people wear light armor?

[barren oasis]

Root harnesk is objectively like the best chestplate to use from the swamps to mistlands

It's so stupidly OP

[spiral ice]

I don't find it useful in mountains (I think only one enemy does pierce: sharp Stone Golem) or the Plains. I kill Deathsquitos before they hit me or just dodge towards them and strike after. Also spear-throwing Fulings are generally not much of a threat.

[eternal storm]

It's because resistances are kind of OP. They cut in half incoming damage, which is way better than getting more armor and being sluggish. It's a no-brainer in places where the worst enemies do the same kind of damage.

[barren oasis]

True in the mountains it's not that great cuz nothing really does pierce and the cultists will shred you cuz of the fire weakness

I haven't been to the plains yet since vilebone armor was added but I assume it's a lot better than padded armor? I really like the bear armor

[eternal storm]

Hot take: either light armor gets light resistance (25%), or heavy armors get their own buffs.

[sonic musk]

'objectively'? So the swamps and mountains and mistlands enemies have tons of piercing damage? And you're weak vs fire, that sounds like really bad advice. Torch fulings and Gjalls make that hurt a lot. Do that many enemies have pierce where you'd want to make yourself die faster to getting hit in general (cause the armor is less than a higher set, ESPECIALLY mistlands tier heavy armor) and Gjalls just instant kill you almost?

[barren oasis]

Oh actually the numbers for vilebone armor make it look like your pretty squishy

Especially with damage weaknesses. That's nice cuz bear armor feels overturned defensively.

[sonic musk]

okay, you want to tell me the swamps, sure I could see that. It's raining constantly, so you're always wet and fire never hurts. But Plains and Mistlands too? With a Swamp chest? That sounds insane

[barren oasis]

Yes mistlands and plains especially. You make mosquitoes and seekers do half damage. You can always drink fire resistance wine when you have to fight a gjall

[eternal storm]

By Mistlands you have Barley Wine, so fire weakness is not really that big of a deal.

[barren oasis]

I think it'd probably be closer if it was only 25% resistance. But 50% is very very strong

[eternal storm]

Anyways, weapon choice is worse because skills actively punish you for leveling the wrong one in late game. I'd fix that before messing with armor.

[spiral ice]

Especially since Bonemass power was hard-nerfed.

[barren oasis]

Whend it get nerfed?

[spiral ice]

Call to Arms. It got its physical defense cut from 50% to 25%.

I would say Bonemass used to be the best forsaken power, but now Fader's is. Double adrenaline gain is absolutely bonkers on some trinkets.

[barren oasis]

Oh I haven't killed bone mass since then so I never knew

[barren oasis]

I've seen the build where you get infinite eitr with faders power that looks crazy

[eternal storm]

You should definitely visit your boss stones and read again the description for powers. They changed a lot.

[spiral ice]

It's nuts with Iron Brooch too: infinite HP and perpetual +20 armor.

[barren oasis]

I've started a new server with my friends so I guess I'll get to have some surprise every time we kill a boss

[barren oasis]

I'm looking forward to iron brooch

Made the bronze amulet so far. I had to kill so many damn bears for a trophy

I swear the devs made the bear trophy extra rare

[spiral ice]

Yeah. I rock bear armor with bronze helmet in Black Forest. No move speed penalty, good armor, and no resistance penalty from having just two bear pieces.

[barren oasis]

I had fully upgraded bear armor and a full stack of bear hide before I got one trophy

[barren oasis]

The damage boost and stamina and health regen is so good though

Worth the weaknesses imo

[spiral ice]

I played around with the idea of running full bear armor with dual axes and shield staff in the Ashlands. Shaman berserker build. 😄

[barren oasis]

I definitely want to get the dual axes in Ashland's. I cannot find the early axe heads though

[eternal storm]

This reminds me of that time I was ratioed for suggesting starred mobs should guarantee a tropy drop. I made that a reality with a mod, and it's great because it feels like I'm hunting, not being sit in front of a slot machine.

[spiral ice]

Run it with Fader's power and a later trinket for permanent higher damage and inifinite stamina...

[barren oasis]

Yeah I killed a couple starred bears it'd be nice if they had a higher trophy chance

[spiral ice]

They're insane. Swamp-tier weapon, and I used them into the Plains.

[barren oasis]

Bear trophies never drop but it feels like every other troll is filling up my inventory with their trophies

[spiral ice]

I think trolls have a 50% drop chance, so that actually checks.

If you find Haldor, leave his camp, then come back, the bear rug at his tent can be destroyed to drop a bear trophy. But you didn't hear that from me. 🤐

[barren oasis]

Yeah hunting for bears I accidentally found haldor before getting a trophy naturally

[spiral ice]

Oddly enough though, I've gotten three or four Stone Golem trophies (5% chance) in the last couple playthroughs, but only 2 bear trophies, even after killing far more bears than golems.

[sonic musk]

let me ask something before I post a comment evaluating it. When you're in the Plains wearing Root Harnesk, what else are you wearing? When you're in the Mistlands wearing Root Harnesk, what else?

[eternal storm]

That's because 5%/10% chance of dropping is really based on luck. With 10% people might think you get 1 every 10 tries, but on average it requires around 35 tries, likely more. Who has time for that?

[sonic musk]

well not you TungstWn we both wear heavy armor so we would be wearing the same thing. I mean the 2 that are saying Root Harnesk is OP in Mistlands and Plains

[sonic musk]

I agree with you on that. Starred mobs should have a 100% drop rate, personally

[eternal storm]

If you use Drop That! I can share a config that does exactly that.

[sonic musk]

I don't use mods and won't until I beat 1.0 at least

[sonic musk]

what else would you be wearing while you have on a Root Harnesk in Plains/Mistlands?

[eternal storm]

I made of lot of characters with different "builds". The only one able to get me Sealbreaker fragments reliably was a heavy build with shield, Mistwalker and arbalest. Other builds were punished by wrong weapons, including the one with a root harnesk. This is also why I believe weapons need fixing sooner than armor.

[sonic musk]

weapons are not worn I meant, you wear a root harnesk. Do you wear padded greaves and padded helmet with it? Or do you wear vilebone drapes? I don't know what light armor wearers use

this is just Plains, I'm sure in the Mistlands you'd wear something else

I always wear heavy armor in every biome every time. I don't bother with light armor, so I don't know what the options are. A while ago my friend used light armor for bow bonus to kill Fulings while sneaking. It's a different playstyle, and I personally would never. Too much stress having to avoid fighting constantly cause you're 1 shottable.

[eternal storm]

The best heavy head and leg armor available (they're all the same, really), otherwise the Fenrir leggings because of the speed buff. or even Eitr-waived trousers for a mixed build.

[sonic musk]

so some damage numbers for comparison
Set 1: lvl 4 Root Harnesk with lvl 4 Padded armor and lvl 4 Lox Cape
Set 2: lvl 4 Padded Armor and lvl 4 Lox Cape

1* Fuling (Spear Thrower)
damage vs set 1 = 25 damage vs set 2 = 41
1* Fuling (Normal)
damage vs set 1 = 50 damage vs set 2 = 41
1* Fuling (Torch Bearer)
damage vs set 1 = 87 damage vs set 2 = 41

So it would actually save you a lot of damage vs Spear Throwers and DeathSquitos, that is true. Loxes, Tars, Viles, most of the Fulings you encounter, especially Torch Bearers would be higher to pay that cost. You take 22% more damage from most mobs while only getting a 3% move speed increase to make up for it, so that you take 64% less damage from Deathsquitos and Spear Throwers. That does not feel worth it to me, personally.

[sonic musk]

some damage numbers for Mistlands
Set 1: lvl 4 Root Harnesk with level 3 Carapace armor and lvl 4 Feather Cape
Set 2: lvl 3 Carapace Armor and lvl 4 Feather Cape

1* Seeker Heavy Attack (Claw)
damage vs set 1 = 45 damage vs set 2 = 72
1* Seeker Flying Attack
damage vs set 1 = 63 damage vs set 2 = 50
1* Dverger Rogue (Crossbow Attack)
damage vs set 1 = 38 damage vs set 2 = 61
1* Seeker Soldier (Regular Attacks)
damage vs set 1 = 63 damage vs set 2 = 50

I actually realized fire damage will be irrelevant in Mistlands cause you should be using Feather Cape, if you do, it's a requirement to have Fire Resist Potions, so you won't need to calculate Root Harnesk's downside because Fire Mages and Gjalls force you to need Fire Resist Potions. You get 1 shot by Fire Mages if you don't have them, and I'm not exaggerating, even with heavy armor. For fun, the dmg number for heavy armor with Feather cape hit by 1* Fire Mage fireball is 170 instant damage, with 100 burning damage. You just need resist potions to fight them. Surprisingly, Root Harnesk saves more damage in Mistlands vs Seekers and Dverger Rogues than it does in Plains, comparatively, and might not be bad advice to give. But you have a hard time fighting Seeker Soldiers wearing Root Harnesk and Dverger Mages hit harder too

I chose max armor for each biome without needing higher level materials for forge upgrades and such. Turns out Root Harnesk is decent for Mistlands, not as decent for Plains. I can agree that it's good for Swamps since you never need to use a poison potion if you wear the set. That's my takeaway from this

[eternal storm]

Consider also how cheap it is. Getting a heavy armor requires lot of work i.e. time, the root harnesk almost happens by itself with all the abominations the game throws at you. You can skip a lot of iron mining and silver mining, then you realize the worst enemy in the Plains at first is actually the deathsquito and you keep your harnesk. It becomes an habit. After that it sucks getting -10% movement and no buffs, so you just upgrade helmets and get the best light leggings you can.

And I say that as someone who never goes far with light armor.

[gaunt harness]

Naw, a torch wrapped in an Iron cage would be an awesome Swamp-tier upgrade. 😎

[eternal storm]

Sorry, but maybe you meant an ancient bark torch with green flames doing blunt+fire+spirit damage.

[lofty wave]

berzerkir torches

[elder summit]

Spirit damage pre-mountain just sounds like "here's THE swamp weapon everything else is worse in comparison"

Like that's basically just a fire frostner, which means it's effective against everything in the swamp.

I do wish there were another fire melee though besides the Dyrnwyn and Torch, feels like a bit of a waste

Especially when the skull splittur is right there lacking an element when every other mistlands melee gets one

[languid ibex]

To be fair, the torch is like that with fire in black forest, but it is far from THE weapon.

[elder summit]

Yeah, and it's entirely cause of the durability of the thing lol

Thankfully it's greydwarf country and you'll have the materials for at least 5 more in your inventory at all times

[languid ibex]

Well maybe that's the key or at least part of it haha

[umbral birch]

as for the guck trees i wish you could harpoon them #suggestions message

[sonic musk]

agreed, I always wanted to farm them but it's tough without building up to it and breaking it down

[languid ibex]

Always thought the Dvergr extractor was the way we would reliably farm guck. I hope it happens haha

[shadow crow]

I just chop some wood and work on my platformer skills

[sonic musk]

hmmm I never thought of that. I mean, a repeatable source of guck would be awesome cause green torches rock

[rose swan]

Never considered that either, pretty solid idea honestly 🤔

[elder summit]

this suggestion's definitely a bit more in-depth than my build suggestions so I'm much more interested in seeing discussion about this

I just think it's a little ridiculous that archers get to have very diverse dmg typing especially once you hit the mountains, and mages have huge weapon diversity, and both use very few skill levels to do it, but if I want to use swords, maces, and spears all in one character I end up having to level 3 skills separately

my biggest problem ig is that I feel the melee skills especially disincentivize trying new melee weapons out because of the missing dmg output from skill levels

we also already have atgeirs and spears using two different skills despite both being spears, so it wouldn't be out of place

[spiral ice]

I would agree if not for the fact that with a high-level melee skill you're going to out-damage a mage, and that being an archer is much less fun than being a melee warrior.

[elder summit]

well yeah, with a high level melee skill you SHOULD out-damage a low level mage skill

that's why mage levels faster than most skills to begin with, since it's unlocked so late

which is a whole different issue

and which class is more fun isn't relevant at all, it's just true that archers have a huge advantage because of how many damage types they can cover while scaling all off of one skill

[spiral ice]

I'm talking about high-level melee and high-level mage. Melee has significantly higher damage potential, even with similar skill levels.

[elder summit]

it's also a much higher risk playstyle

I'm sure that max level skills with thundering axes will shred things, but 1. you never reach max level on ANY skill without cheesing in a regular playthrough, and 2. dual axes are incredibly high risk as your only way to avoid damage consistently is dodging

also, where'd you get this DPS info from? definitely need a source to actually compare these things

[fast void]

Single? Yes.
AoE? X for Doubt

[spiral ice]

Unless it's the Ashlands, enemies aren't going to be that clumped together. If it is the Ashlands, lightning weapons will tear them apart in seconds. Or the Ashlands itself will destroy them with friendly fire.

[fast void]

? My enemies are always that clumped because I just walk in a circle to make them clump and then "boom" 🤔

[spiral ice]

I usually kill them too fast for them to clump together. 😶
Unless I'm facing 2-star enemies...

[fast void]

Clumping them also helps your Morgen friends kill them faster for you 😄

[spiral ice]

True. I fought two Morgens together one time, and they kept rolling into each other. 😆
One was a 1-star, but by the time it killed the other, it was at half health, so it wasn't much of a danger.

Fallen Valkyries are the real MVP though. They shred everything.

[gaunt harness]

#suggestions message Hell to the no. We aren't gonna do a Bethesda here! Why not condense Bow and Crossbow as well then?

I see what you mean that switching weapons is really punishing if you move to mistwalker after having used maxes since the meadows, but completely removing all melee skills and simplifying them to whether you use one or two hands is just as bad. A knife and a hammer do are not used the same way even though they both just require one hand.

I would instead suggest a general melee stat, like we have in Kingdom Come: Deliverance (Warfare), which is just a general stat improvement to all fighting capabilities regardless of weapon, while still maintaining the proficiency of specific weapons that you've used more. That will ease the transition between weapons while still rewarding training with specific ones.

[wanton atlas]

@lapis gust the reason they don't drop fenris hair, is because they aren't fenris. They find it and worship it.
Look on the rocks in the caves and you will see the secret

[lapis gust]

Fair enough

Still think there should be more fenrirs hair in the caves, multiplayer maps can get like two sets with no upgrade unless you go after several mountains

[wanton atlas]

you rip down the hair from the walls?

you can usually pull down a few from the big rooms, and then shoot arrow or throw spear at the rest of it to get even more

[lapis gust]

Yes

Do the whole stuff when collecting it

Still like 5 frostcaves depending on how lucky we are

[languid ibex]

The good news is that it's a breeze with more people, you could even split up.

[lapis gust]

So two mountains, you can get full platinum with all tools in half a mountain

[lapis gust]

I fear the furry man

[ivory lion]

Hm… are those hair usable in something besides armor?

[languid ibex]

So you don't need more hair, you need to get better at dealing with the caves. 😅

[ivory lion]

Because I have full chests of this stuff and nothing to do with it

[lapis gust]

I don't think i ever died in one of these caves, the only danger is the brenna cave

[ivory lion]

I died several times because I was too cocky and let get fried by wolf mage xD

[lapis gust]

You're drowning while i am dying of thirst

[languid ibex]

So you and your group should each take on caves or at least locate more of them while split up.

[ivory lion]

I died there even after clearing Ashlands…. Im playing on hard but that is not an excuse xD

[lapis gust]

I don't think it is a problem that the drop quantity is small, i think it just makes it less viable to craft

[ivory lion]

Stupidity, yeah, thats more the cause ;p

[languid ibex]

It doesn't because with more hands looking for the materials, it's no less viable than solo.

[lapis gust]

In my forever world i do have fenrirs armor in the max level, but i think that for most runs it's just faster to make a plat set or just use the same set from the swamp

[languid ibex]

Each playthrough I've had, I was able to make it in one or two mountains, fully upgraded.

[lapis gust]

It's not that bad for one player, maybe just the trophy drop rate sucks

I can make one in 3-4 caves

[languid ibex]

I suppose that could be a problem, but that's not exactly a fenris hair situation at that point.

[elder summit]

Realism clearly isn't a concern though with how arbitrary the skills are currently

Again, polearms and spears level separately despite every other 2 hander levelling up with the respective 1 handed

And yk, if you want to argue instead for condensing spears and atgeirs, that's fair. At least it would be consistent

The general melee skill isn't a bad idea, all I'd worry about is skill bloat, but maybe you could move the stamina drain over to the general melee skill and leave damage in the specialized ones

It makes sense, if you use a sword a lot a mace wouldn't tire you as much but you'd still be better at using the sword

[celest flume]

Currently playing on 1x server, and it took 10 caves to make and fully upgrade one. The trophy wasn't a problem, got it in fourth or fifth cave I think. On average, I was getting around 15 hair per cave.

[stiff stag]

Fully upgrading gear isn't a necessity, it's a choice that you force upon yourself. Because of that the amount is more than likely based around just getting the base set without upgrades, otherwise it would be too easy to get the full set.

[lapis gust]

Yeah 10 caves is alot of work considering that most of those " Secondary " armor sets are easier to craft than the normal metal one. Troll armor, the root set, askvin set, or any other set in general

You can get those before you can make the set of the metal armor in the biome pretty much every time

Maybe the root armor takes more time if you don't have a base in the swamps

[celest flume]

Root set kinda comes in (un)naturally if you spend enough time looking for iron...
Though I actually understand the rationale for Fenris. The move speed is an unique and very powerful bonus that makes the armor quite viable all the way to Ashlands

[lapis gust]

I think you can get the full root set very naturally, you will find a lot of abominations while looking fot the bog witch, or the seeds on the swamp, or the new wooden tool that you only find in loots across the biome

[elder summit]

I deadass went through a tiny swamp once on my way to a mountain, had zero plans of staying there and just went straight through as fast as possible

had two abominations spawn in that sliver of swamp

they are fairly common so long as you're moving, if you stay in the same spot of the swamp all the time you're not gonna find many

same rule applies to serpents and most other elites, there's cooldowns on how often they can spawn in a given area

[edgy oar]

I go for best metal helmet I can make, root harnesk, fenris leggings. all the way to ashlands

[elder summit]

I generally go bear set, fenris set, mage sets

honestly fenris is so overtuned and it's not even an issue with the set itself, it's just that no other SET comes close until the ashlands

at least we have vile armor now as a competitor in the plains

troll set bonus is pretty miniscule outside of taming, root set bonus is worthless unless you're a dedicated archer, bear & vile sets are GOOD but have a tradeoff that fenris doesn't

phys dmg vuln is a MASSIVE penalty for what the set offers, which is some passive regen (amazing) and phys dmg buff (meh)

taking +25% dmg from most sources can be a death sentence with certain enemies, and while I like the idea of it being a risk/reward set the ONLY reason I use Bear armor is because there's no good option early game and the enemies don't hit nearly as hard

and while you can use Bonemass or the one golem trophy trinket to counter it, Bonemass has a long CD and locks you out of any other forsaken power, and the trinket takes time to charge mid-combat, which if you're trying to not die you'd want up as soon as possible

[celest flume]

Bear and Vile sets are high risk, high reward sets. You can kill faster, but gotta be damn good at dodging

[elder summit]

yeah

and I like that on paper, my only issue ends up being that the buff is far less impactful than the nerf

I think the biggest thing those sets give are the passive stat regen, having lingering stamina mead at black forest tier is incredibly powerful

once you get fenris though? not so much, since move speed not only lets you cover more distance with less stamina, but it also decreases your dodge roll's stamina cost

ok had to wiki it rq

it seems that only movement PENALTIES affect your dodge cost

so going above 0% has no benefit, but having a smaller penalty does

so if you're sword & boarding a full fenris set takes you from -10% movespeed to -1%, effectively negating the dodge cost increase

I think especially for vile armor there was a missed opportunity to give it a smaller movespeed increase than fenris, maybe like +2% on each piece or something

idk I'm just brainstorming now on how the buff could be more impactful

[celest flume]

An interesting thing is that bear and vile pieces, except for vile head, have higher armor than light armor of same tier. You can effectively neutralize the set bonuses by wearing a heavy helmet instead, and get a good armor without any movement penalties

[elder summit]

yeah, they're effectively "medium armor" sets until you add the phys vuln

[celest flume]

In swamp, my set was actually root chest, bear legs and celebratory cap

[elder summit]

in my most recent playthrough the only time I used anything but Bear set pre-fenris was when I was going up the mountains to find caves

was getting my shit rocked by wolves due to the phys res decrease so I just put on a root harnesk for a bit until I made it into a cave

at which point I immediately swapped back because weak to fire when fighting cultists is not good

[celest flume]

you can do a little sequence breaking and get fire resist mead before moder. That makes it possible to keep harnesk in caves

[elder summit]

yeah but I can also just take off the scary res penalty armor lol

I mean hell if I wanna sequence break in the first place I'd be rushing the frost caves by spamming campfires up the mountain and setting my spawn outside them

[celest flume]

right...there actually isn't anything dealing pierce damage there. I thought bats and ulvs might, just checked, they're all slash

[elder summit]

yeah, kinda sucks

I thought wolves did pierce for the longest time cause, yk, BITING ATTACKS

[peak bronze]

Only mob dealing pierce in mountains is spike handed Golem when hitting with that hand.

[celest flume]

oh yeah, that. Those are rare though, only appear in that room with frozen lake and fishing rod

[elder summit]

RARE??? I WISH, I had SIX OF THEM spawn on the SAME SILVER VEIN in the span of a SINGLE IN GAME DAY

I was losing my mind yesterday because I killed two, died on the third and killed it after a respawn, went back to my outpost, came back and a FOURTH ONE was ON TOP OF THE VEIN

[peak bronze]

Inside the caves they are rare.

[celest flume]

We are talking about caves

[elder summit]

fair enough

[peak bronze]

If there is the frozen lake segment.

[elder summit]

I thought it was mountains in general, mb

yeah I've seen the golem room in the caves maybe once or twice ever

[celest flume]

Golems are the only mob that I actively avoid. No good drops, I prefer stamina trinkets so trophy is useless. And dealing with them is awful, especially on hard combat where you can't parry them until you've got carapace buckler

[peak bronze]

Had to check their spawn frequency on wiki, it is common. But the limit is 1 in the same area.

Digging a pit and dragging them in is one way to stop their spawning if you don't kill it there.

But they also have one time spawners near certain POIs.

[elder summit]

god, parrying on hard is one of my biggest issues with it

I like not being able to parry everything all the time, but also carapace buckler required for an elite TWO ZONE EARLIER is a bit too much for me

[celest flume]

or kite them toward a drake at a reasonably flat location. They'll aggro, drakes won't hurt them but golem can't hit drake either...let them play

[peak bronze]

Evasion mantle must be a godsent in hard difficulty.

[celest flume]

Going one on one with golem, it probably won't trigger in the fight

[elder summit]

gone one on one in general trinkets just never trigger

one of my biggest issues with em honestly, they only ever seem to trigger when you're in a situation that you should NEVER be in if you play well

[peak bronze]

True, but it definitely will trigger when fighting groups of enemies.

[elder summit]

they seem to be designed specifically for raids and bosses, maybe ashlands, and that's about it

which I'm fine with, but it feels like a bit of a waste tbh

[peak bronze]

Being able to parry 1 star berserker with black metal shield is very nice.

I have no problems triggering trinkets with 2 handed weapons like battleaxe. Atgeir is also very nice for gaining adrenaline.

Staggering hits grant more adrenaline.

[elder summit]

I still think it was absolutely evil work by the devs to NOT give us a Flametal Atgeir in THE crowd control region

oh what could have been, chain lightning atgeir

[lofty wave]

dual axes but no dual polearms

[peak bronze]

Himminafl deals nice damage even in Ashlands since it's partially pierce and lightning.

[tardy knot]

Fighting golems is a total chore, even on normal combat. Like har har, they are weak to pickaxes....except picks attack so slow, your overall DPS is completely cratered and useless. They are just a bad mob. Not difficult, but overly annoying and a slog to fight for how common they are. Oh and you parried one? Enjoy your one crit, because you got knocked back off the mountain and have to sprint up to get back in melee range. Oh, and now you're out of stamina because of all the extra running and jumping you have to do.

[frozen gazelle]

Hello everyone, and apologies in advance if this question has probably already been asked several times. Will version 1.0 have a built-in proximity chat feature? If not, will the Positinal Mumble mod be available upon the release of 1.0? We're so eager to start a new game on the final version.

[dark wyvern]

That's not known as far as I know, haven't seem anything on that topic. As for the mod, that's up to the mod dev.

[languid ibex]

Valheim is a single player game experience with some coop capabilities, the features developed for online play are minimal so it's incredibly unlikely such a thing will happen.

[frozen gazelle]

It's being sold on Steam as an online co-op game, and the options for joining a server are clear. Furthermore, it's extremely likely to appeal to role-playing game fans. The mysterious and highly anticipated official release will provide more information on this. I secretly hope a developer will happen to see this and leak a little bit of information 😇

[languid ibex]

Yes because it has coop capabilities, it is a single player experience first and foremost.

[frozen gazelle]

Sure, like many games. Does the fact that it's also single-player preclude community suggestions for improving the game? Is this an attempt to discourage me? Or perhaps a way to discredit the game?

[fast void]

"Improve" is subjective.

[languid ibex]

Letting you know that I personally think it's incredibly unlikely is still just my opinion. I've seen this brought up before, and have a pretty informed perspective on this topic.

[tardy knot]

According to Irongate co-op is a key feature.

[languid ibex]

Again, I never said it wasn't a thing?

[lament zinc]

What Omni means is that Valheim is a single player game.
With the ability to play it in co-op with your friends too, if you like.

Therefore the main focus will be at the single player experience, not at that of co-op.

However:

There are going to tweaks to the game once the 1.0 release is done.
So there is a posibility that the devs will increase the co-op experience as well.

[fast void]

Yeah... they also claim it is a "brutal" survival game, and then nerf everything even slightly difficult so 🤷‍♂️😁

[tardy knot]

There's a pretty big difference between a game where coop is a key feature and one that is a single player game that just so happens to support multiplayer

[fast void]

Valid.

[languid ibex]

Who said "just so happens to support multiplayer?"

[fast void]

But time and again they have been against any multiplayer-specific features.
The only one they have added is the map table.

So it is unlikely they spend dev time for 1.0 on something like that.
Post-1.0? Completely possible they sink time into multiplayer-only features.

[dark wyvern]

Maybe they even don't know themselves yet what they will do after 1.0.

[dark wyvern]

Feel free to suggest things. A lot of suggestions have been made already for coop/mp in the past.

[languid ibex]

Even then I doubt much time would be spent on a proximity voice chat, it increases server load quite a lot, and locally hosted servers will need to be tweaked and optimized massively to allow for this without increasing server lag.

Not to mention, each system having concerns with voice chat enabled in crossplay environments.

[runic plover]

As far as I'm concerned, the "survival" aspect of Valheim isn't very demanding. You can die in all manner of ways, yes, but there isn't anything you need to do to stay alive. There are no penalties of any kind for not eating, sleeping, thirst isn't a thing at all, etc. You could live in a box for 1000 days on end and never eat a thing and not die or be any weaker at the end of that time than you were at the start.

[languid ibex]

You're already dead, and what you're describing is essentially not playing the game to survive. This is possible with any survival game.

[runic plover]

There are plenty of survival games where food, water, and/or sleep are required to stay alive. Go without for too long, and you will die.

[languid ibex]

I could just hit pause for 1000 days in-game time.

That's the same thing as sitting in a box doing nothing for 1000 days in Valheim

The survival aspects come from interacting with the world.

[runic plover]

I'm just saying Valheim is light on survival mechanics, since there isn't anything you need to do to survive. As long as you don't get hit, fall very far, stand in fire, try to swim with 0 stamina, you will never die, regardless of what else you do or don't do.

[languid ibex]

Yes there are, there are plenty of things you need to do, if you're measuring that based on how long you can stand still doing nothing, you're not measuring the game itself.

[stiff stag]

Survival is a very broad genre and it can be brutal for various different reasons. Just because you won't die of thirst or starvation doesn't mean it can't be brutal in other ways.

[runic plover]

Combat can certainly be difficult, but being able to die in battle doesn't make something a survival game. This looks to mostly be coming down to a difference in personal definitions of what "survival" mechanics are, though.

[languid ibex]

There hasn't been personal definitions spoken about here for survival games, what you're describing is closer to a simulation game though.

[runic plover]

Indeed, we haven't discussed how we each define what survival mechanics are, thus we may not be engaging in this discussion from the same perspective of what a survival game/mechanic is.

[languid ibex]

I am pointing out that Stranded and I are making the point that survival games are a vast genre, not necessarily boiled down to hunger and thirst. To suggest Valheim has less demanding survival aspects because you can stand still and not die is just a bit of a needless underselling of the other prominent aspects you will need to survive.

You can do the same in Minecraft, but it remains a genre defining entry in survival games to this day.

[runic plover]

As long as you're mentioning Minecraft, it is worth mentioning that you can starve to death it in.

[languid ibex]

Not in a default playthrough

[runic plover]

The point is, there is an actual penalty for going without food for too long while engaging in strenuous activity. There is an actual need to eat. Meanwhile, hasn't Scales or someone defeated every boss without armor or food?

[languid ibex]

Having that low of health and stamina is the penalty...

You can't make a consensus with an exception to the rule.

[lofty wave]

zero health regeneration too

[barren oasis]

@summer finch toss em in the obliterator for coal

[eternal wyvern]

Does anyone else feel like there are too many text and numbers in the game?

I think a setting to disable the bottom right text hints, the effect names on the top, boss power name, health amount number, stamina amount number and probably some more I'm not thinking about rn would be nice.

[languid ibex]

Not myself, no

[fast void]

If anything, there are not enough numbers.

[eternal wyvern]

What would you add?

Also I guess I'm not asking to remove what we have but rather for an option to do so, I just want as much of the screen for the world itself without removing indicator for the hotbar, effects etc.

[fast void]

Actual timer until tamed sounds like the simplest winner.

[lofty wave]

this is inventory rather than hud but knockback variance range on tooltips (like damage) and parry armor displayed whole instead of as a multiplier would be great

right now it's very easy to play through the game without knowing knockback scales with skills and a lot of new players are confused about 'parry bonus'

[summer finch]

Have no clue what that is lol

[barren oasis]

Buy thunderstones from haldor

[summer finch]

Why does so many people thumbs down the idea of a dismantling tool for unused items lol it’s legit just a nice way to keep things clean and organized 🤷‍♂️ instead of tossing random things outside of your base perimeter and waiting 2 days for it to despawn

I bet it’s a coding side of things that they don’t want to code that in for every item 😅 ok well then make them all turn to coal like that one guy suggested but being able to put them in the coal maker thing that you put wood in to make coal would also be a nice touch

[hallow saddle]

Why is this downvoted it’s not like the data would be in the game it would just be in a menu

[marsh radish]

They're downvoting it because it already exist in the game lol. You buy a thunderstone from Haldor and can make the Obliterater which you dump anything you don't need anymore and it turns it into coal.

I do wish you could sell old stuff in exchange for materials or coins tho lol

[languid ibex]

So you want it to turn to coal.. but slower? The heck

[summer finch]

I’m just wanting to be able to get rid of old items I do not want lol

[summer finch]

That I did not know as I am only in Iron Age stage of the game and have yet to find Haldor lol

Still new to the game here folks my apologies for the silly questions 🤙 forgive me 🙏

[red musk]

don’t apologize you didn’t do anything wrong

[summer finch]

All good either way I’m just letting folks know I’m new to the game and as uncanny as it seems to some I have yet to find certain things lol 😅

[shadow crow]

A novel concept and one I’m envious of. That first Valheim experience is truly special!

[summer finch]

I have been watching afar for a good while only to finally say fuck it and give in and buy it and haven’t regretted it once yet ❤️ my wife and I are playing this together for the first time and it’s been one heck of an experience and adventure forsure! I must say it has all our favorite things thus far so we are pleased to see what happens next!

I do wish I could tame a bear though 😅

[wanton atlas]

@flat cloud it already kinda exists 🫡

[ember lily]

Same, would probably be way too strong tho

[summer finch]

Yeah but would be loads of fun to ride around on a bear though 😂

[runic plover]

The number of people in here who play with their wife is much higher than I expected. Feels like I see a post about that every couple days. Of course, I am also one such person.

[languid ibex]

My wife only plays FP shooters with me 👀

My son plays Valheim though

[rose swan]

Omni lore drop today

[somber remnant]

Ever play valheim with your brother-in-law’s dad?

[eternal wyvern]

Do you have to be married for that?

[rose swan]

Could have a sibling that’s married, right? 🤔

[somber remnant]

Yeah

[flat cloud]

Really? How, where how do I see this. I must know

[wanton atlas]

it's a console command

press F5

then type stats

and you will see a ton of things

[spiral ice]

I plan to bring my fiancée into just such a situation when we get married. And she's cool with it. 😄

[flat cloud]

Not just deaths kills yeknow? Even stone collected stone used, etc?

[wanton atlas]

try it ingame 🙂

we plan to add achivements to 1.0.
so we might add even more data points 😄

[peak bronze]

You can type /stats in chat box too.

Then navigate it with PgUp and PgDn keys.

[flat cloud]

WWWWWWWWWW!!!!🔥

[gaunt harness]

Whomever suggested a shovel... good guess.

[glad cargo]

#suggestions message This guy saw it coming!

[wanton atlas]

only 1 out of 8 shovel ideas are even remotly close

you don't use the shovel to re-plant bushes 😄

[peak bronze]

What if it would be so late option that no one even care for it anymore at that point of the game?

Lol.

[wanton atlas]

no

then it would be wierd

and people would play the game in reverse just to get the planting option

[peak bronze]

Heh.

[arctic wharf]

Of the three things shown, the barries is the only one I specifically remember suggested. And it was a common one

Some might say it was... low hanging fruit 🥁

[rose swan]

Those berries look so freaking good!! This is probably one of my favorite things they’ve shown us thus far.

Just look at that dark red color against the snow! Beautiful.

[rose swan]

Shout out to @wind hill

[arctic wharf]

At least they should be plenty easy to see/find.

[rose swan]

I’m really excited for what they’re going to look like as placeable food items ❤️

[peak bronze]

Probably I will spend my time in Deep North foraging lingonberries during night to see them Aurora Borealis and fighting whatever nightly nightmares I face at the same time.

[languid ibex]

Someone also recently suggested shovel

I was doubtful it'd happen, but there it is!

[peak bronze]

Not for bush gathering tho. 👀

[languid ibex]

That we know of yet

[wanton atlas]

like I said. 8 shovel ideas, 1 was close to how it works

the other 7 is basicly a tool to re-plant bushes

[arctic wharf]

Not exactly the same kind of shovel yeah. More of a snow shovel than one for digging earth.

[peak bronze]

According to what Smiffe said I'm doubtful.

[wanton atlas]

According to myself. it's a big fat 🚫

[languid ibex]

Oh I am too, but after seeing a shovel happen I'm not ready to be doubtful about it so soon.

[wanton atlas]

I never was against shovels

only re-planting

in the news post, you can clearly find out the usage of the shovel

[white hollow]

Could be updated, seperately, asynchronously, small sectors at a time

(Is it worth implementing the feature is the real question in my opinion, it's time and effort the devs can spend elsewhere)

-# Edit: could be a nice mod project though

[rose swan]

I, the berry enthusiast, am also against the idea of having a dedicated tool (shovel) that’s purpose is for replanting bushes 🫐

[languid ibex]

Oh good.

Glad to know we weren't the only ones. 😄

[rose swan]

Yeah that suggestion/reddit post floating around for a bit with that shovel was interesting, but a bit too niche imo

[peak bronze]

Way to plant cosmetic bushes I'm up to. Way to plant berry bushes no no.

[rose swan]

Whatever shovel we’re getting in the deep north seems really… shiny? Techy?

[peak bronze]

Magical shovel for removing magical snow. ❄️

[rose swan]

Yee, even a dedicated tool for planting the non fruit bearing bushes seems excessive to me, when there’s an entire half empty cultivator menu 🤔

[languid ibex]

Yeah, looks like maybe flametal involved? That glowing bit is interesting for sure.

[peak bronze]

Yeah, maybe seeds sold by bog witch and plantable with cultivator would be a way to go.

[wanton atlas]

we just re-use the same GUI

we don't have a trained UI/UX designer in the team

[rose swan]

Ahh I see

Think I’m going to have to try lingonberries now 👀

[wind hill]

Then you are strong and wise and I will be very proud of you. You have to try the jam too, it’s very delicious! 🍓🫐

[sonic musk]

In a way, I hope that Deep North is harder and more dangerous than Ashlands. I have a feeling it will be perhaps tamer, but I want it to be more dangerous, somehow🤔

[prisma salmon]

Hello

[rose swan]

So far, I’m getting the vibe that it’s going to be relatively easier, but I could be wrong!

[sonic musk]

Yeah, it would be hard to top a landscape half covered in near-instant-death lava, with multiple very fast creatures that can 1 shot you, and every 15 seconds or so you run into another hostile mob of creatures that surround you from all sides.

I expect Deep North to be hardcore Mountains, but Mountains always felt mostly open, peaceful, and charming. It's my 3rd favorite biome after all

My favorite biomes in order: Swamps, Plains, Mountains, Meadows, Ashlands, Mistlands, Black Forest

If Mistlands had less ⬆️⬇️ every 2 seconds and Black Forest had more to see than most of the time, I'd rank them higher

Swamps totally changed the way the wet debuff worked for me. No longer do I fear going into water, because I'm ALWAYS wet. Bring it on, leeches! Plus every creature in that biome is very fun to fight, and it felt so much more dangerous than the Black Forest so the stakes were very high when you first discovered the biome

Plains are a beautiful, peaceful land. Filled with hatred and DEATH. Everything there wants you dead, but it's so pretty! And I love Cloudberries so much. One of the most fun resources to collect.

And the Mountains. How majestic. How truly beautiful. You can make some of the most cinematic screenshots atop a mountain. Wolves stagger is so funny to watch. Drakes are fun to fight, and you have a pet Golem you can bring around to cause destruction! What a great biome all the way through.

[eternal wyvern]

Don’t ever let Dizzy make a list

[arctic wharf]

[sonic musk]

https://tenor.com/view/shrek-what-are-you-doing-in-my-swamp-swamp-gif-22162082

Don't you insult my Swamps

[spiral ice]

I would move Plains to second last, Swamp to last, and leave everything else in that order. 😶

[sonic musk]

a fellow Mountains enjoyer?

[peak bronze]

Mountains is kinda 50/50 for me. Kinda dull on surface, but has very cool dungeons. And finding the tallest mountains on map is fun.

[arctic wharf]

Mountains are decent fun. Somewhere in the middle for me, though frost caves are easily one of the best dungeons.

[spiral ice]

I made a spreadsheet rating different biome aspects for each one in Valheim.
Here were my totals:
Meadows: 84
Black Forest: 72
Swamp: 60
Mountain: 85
Plains: 63
Mistlands: 82
Ashlands: 82

The killers for the swamp were visuals (I don't like the look of the Swamp), music (least favorite biome theme), and excitement (I dread going into the Swamp in every playthrough).

Plains suffered from visuals (looks boring to me) and the lack of interesting new equipment and mechanics.

[rose swan]

Oooh that’s a cool rating. Personally I’d put Black Forest in the 90s

Plains being in the 60s is brutal, but I can see why

[spiral ice]

Here's the spreadsheet if anyone is interested. It uses weighted values for what I consider more and less important to a biome. I totally understand someone using different weights for the aspects.

[peak bronze]

Black forest feels one of most complete of all biomes now that there are bears too, despite that I despise greydwarves.

Plains also got light armor and new cool night time creature.

[spiral ice]

Lack of new building materials (I hardly use corewood, and I counted finewood as a Meadows resource) and music (kinda depressing) held it back. The visuals and new mechanics are great, and the core aspects are all very strong.

[spiral ice]

I think the vilebone armor looks terrible.
Adding starred viles would bump the Plains' score up a little bit.

[rose swan]

I like how plains introduces the oven, baking is fun lol. But lack of a typical mining resource, standardized instanced dungeon (huge points for sealed towers though) really bring down my score.

Love the aesthetics and tar build pieces though, so that basically saves it for me haha

[peak bronze]

One of my group loves plains just for the reason there is no need for mining metals but by killing fulings (she dislikes mining). Also loves raiding the villages.
Plus now after addition of viles she loves it even more now lol.

[peak bronze]

Hmm, I like it tho, but loincloth clipping with capes is little sad. It could be little shorter or there could be short bear cape that would fit well with vilebone set. 👀

[sonic musk]

when I mark Fuling Villages on the map, even in original Valheim where it was the most dangerous biome and I wasn't fully geared, I would always mark uncleared villages as 'New Victims' I did not fear the little goblins XD

[eternal wyvern]

Mistlands
Black Forest
Ashlands
Plains
Meadows
Swamp
Mountains

[sonic musk]

What makes Mistlands your favorite?

I do really really like Mistlands dungeons, probably the most, I will admit

[barren oasis]

Mistlands is pretty. Idk why people complain about the fog, wisp light gives you pretty good visibility

Although mistlands with no map must be horrible

Exploring can be rough, but if you wanna base there you can just get wisp lights everywhere and you won't be all foggy

Then it's a nice base spot.

My ranking for biomes though would gotta be black forest > mountains > meadows > swamp > mistlands > plains.

Id never base in swamp but sunken crypts are my favorite dungeon

[eternal wyvern]

The dungeon is the best, one of the best bosses, Dvergrs are unique. The lore of dvergrs being at odds with the seekers and having locked up their queen is understood through the biome's gameplay, not runestone dump. The biome's progression is also great, I think it has the best lineup of weapons compared to any other biome. I don't like the mist but I take that as more of a challenge to be aware of my sounds and surroundings.
I think it's the most well-crafted biome in the game.

[sonic musk]

I can actually understand that logic, I agree about Dvergers

[peak bronze]

Gjalls are one of the most interesting creatures in game.

[arctic wharf]

Mistlands
Black Forest
Mountains
Ashlands
Meadows
Plains
Swamp

That's my list

Adore the mistlands asthetic and vibe, and easily the #1 dungeon currently in the game, with only the frost caves right behind it.

[small socket]

frost caves are really interesting yeah

[rose swan]

I like the frost caves just a wee bit more, but the infested mines are indeed really good

[stiff stag]

The only thing I hate about frost caves is trying to go back up, having to jump up each step in the rocky stairway areas.

[stiff stag]

#suggestions message There are plenty of options in world modifiers for casual players to tune the experience to fit their needs. The base game as a whole should not change just because it doesn't fit your personal situation.

Also to clarify my stance, I'm in no way an "elite" player but I can still recognize what kind of playerbase the base game is designed for and why that shouldn't change, and it's up to the individual to adjust their personal experience accordingly.

[spiral ice]

I would like to see a slight re-balance of the Ashlands spawn rates, but in this way:
Monuments of torment spawn a little bit faster (maybe 7.5 or 8 seconds per spawn instead of 10) with a higher chance of starred charred (that's fun to say aloud 😁).

However, the natural spawn rate of the biome would be a little bit lower to compensate for this. Essentially, a new area is more dangerous and difficult going in, but once you've "conquered" it, the danger drops noticeably.

Just my two s.

I have no interest in ice skating in real life, but that would be DOPE in valheim.

[languid ibex]

This is already the case tbh, you can easily wipe out enemies the more you conquer, with armor upgrades, gemstones, and new weaponry, ashlands already becomes a bit too easy when you're fully decked out.

[spiral ice]

I'd agree if not for the fact that 0-star charred warriors are going to deal 25-30 damage per hit with maxed out armor. But I totally see where you're coming from.

[languid ibex]

That is why you can parry every single strike though, they become so insignificant and the damage increases alongside the easiness of a stagger really just drops the difficulty.

Ashlands is one of 2 biomes where the most common weaknesses are readily available with weapons also crafted in that biome.

[fast void]

How to make Ashlands easy for casuals: equip Staff of Fireball.

[languid ibex]

Yeah I just cannot fathom needing to alter Ashlands as is. If you have a team and aren't abusing group powers, protection casting, and magic itself, that's not a problem with the game.

[fast void]

True. If you have 3 people you can permanently have Bonemass running.

[spiral ice]

Haven't the devs said Valheim is primarily designed to be a solo game?

[languid ibex]

Yes but the suggestion is made by a player who has a group in the Ashlands that is struggling.

[spiral ice]

Fair.

[languid ibex]

That's why I brought that up.

[fast void]

Which is why grouping is OP.

You can legit have one person run in an aggro circle, never taking damage, and their friends just pick off enemies.

[spiral ice]

I still think that the re-balance I brought up would be fine. You get punched a lot harder when you explore, but eventually you can treat the biome like the other ones.

At the same time, I acknowledge that the Ashlands is supposed to be a never-ending war, so making combat basically perpetual is what the place is about.

[spiral ice]

Sounds really boring. 😄

The best times I've had playing the game are with friends when we're all dying on loop while trying to get established in a new biome.

I've been playing solo for a couple years now, and I die a lot less.

[lament zinc]

And how do you exactly want to do that?
Duration is 5 minutes, cooldown is 20 minutes.

AFAIK 20 divided by 5 is still 4. And not three.

As in:
Bonemass 1: from 0 to 5 minutes
Bonemass 2: from 5 to 10 minutes
Bonemass 3: from 10 to 15 minutes
And then all of the players are on a 5 minute cooldown according to your calculations.

But with a 4th person you get:
Bonemass 4: from 15 to 20 minutes.

After which the cycle can start again.

[languid ibex]

I think they were implying 4 people, as they said if you had 3 people, which is just you and 3 others.

[lament zinc]

That's a bit odd calculating.
When I say we're with 3 people, it's me and two others. Not me and 3 others.

Also, the comment I replied to really said: "If you have 3 people you can permanently have Bonemass running."
Not if you have you and 3 others.

[languid ibex]

They didn't say that though, they said if you have 3 people, which can mean you possess 3 extra bodies. It's not the same as saying if you have 3 apples for example, because you couldn't be part of that equation.

[lament zinc]

Mate, I quoted what is been said.

It said with 3 people you have a permanent bonemass.

It didn't say that with you and three other people you have a permanent bonemass power.

And if you still don't believe me, look at this: #suggestion-discussion message

There is ABOLUTELY no mention of a person and three others in that post you find in the link.

[arctic wharf]

Chill 🧊
They may have just been off by one not realizing, it's not a big deal.
We all get what they intended to say... and 75% uptime with three people instead of four is still far better than 25% uptime in solo play regardless.

.
If we wanted to be extra spefic though, have to consider the players would definetly not be so obscenely coordinated to be activating the power right as the prior ran out. So even at 4 players, it's not going to be a perfect 100% uptime. Maybe 95% or so if we also consider everyone having to huddle for the buff.
Would need 5 players to have plenty of overlap time on the buff duration/cooldown for 100% uptime.

[royal lily]

This game is on the easier end of games if you cant do the ashlands while putting the difficulty down idk maybe just play stardew but even then the desert cave will be too hard for you

[arctic wharf]

Can mostly skip the desert cave by prepping stairs.

[barren oasis]

Stairs are for babies

Explosive slingshot ammo is how real ones get iridium

[languid ibex]

Just pointing out that you keep misquoting to try and make a point, they didn't say, "we're with 3 people," or "with 3 people you have permanent bonemass." They said you have 3 people, which is a perfectly valid way of stating that you have 3 additional people.

[royal lily]

Spicy eel and a ton of mega bombs 😂

[fast void]

This entire message could have been condensed to:

"It's 4, not 3."

👍

[eternal wyvern]

Just saw this lol. Just to be clear, I respect your preferences, I was jus joking around.

[arctic wharf]

Was kind of the point hahaha
Can make an easier game even easier.

Stardew is for chill times tho ofc

[royal lily]

Until u hit the arcade

[barren oasis]

Those games are impossible

[lament zinc]

You mean you aren't willing to admit you're wrong. Which happens a lot when discussing things with others.
Which is fine by me, as it simply means that at some point more and more people will ignore you until you realize that you will be ignored by all because you can't admit even you are wrong.

Well, good luck with your lonely life you will end up at some point.

[languid ibex]

I'm just attempting to explain that it's perfectly fine grammar if that was the intent, I'm not here to speak on what was right or wrong, just that it's more than possible that the meaning was 4. If a team leader says that they have 3 people, people will often follow up with something like, "including myself," or "not including me." This is because it's easy to interpret it both ways for 3rd parties.

I'm unsure why this is resulting in some sort of personal attack from you, but I can assure you I'm not meaning to come across as if I'm belittling you or anything.

I made of his calculation?

[royal lily]

Oops wasnt you

[royal lily]

Are critical thinking skills are hard for you? It was a typo

[languid ibex]

Not at all, that's why I questioned it.

[royal lily]

Idk why you had to ask for help on something a 4th grader could figure out

[languid ibex]

I didn't ask for help though.

[royal lily]

Youre right, you questioned it, sorry sire

[languid ibex]

Not to worry.

[sonic musk]

A blunt weapon with good knockback makes Charred Warriors far less relevant. Any 2 handed hammer is perfect, 1 handed mace gives enough knockback, and weirdly, if you use Fire staff and hit them, sometimes the burning damage causes Soldiers to walk away for about 60 seconds, no clue why but it has happened A LOT.

1 handed mace knockback also very good for Asksvins, as I've found out

[lofty wave]

the burning effect doesnt make enemies walk away. If you stay far enough to stop them from triggering an attack they will eventually lose aggro

[sonic musk]

Also Ashlands spawn rates are not higher than other biomes. With Effigies of Hatred, yes it exceeds other biomes, but you should destroy those when you see them. After that, it has no different spawn rate than Meadows, and I'm not even exaggerating. When I built my Meadows grape vineyard, I spent a long time doing it, and I heard necks CONSTANTLY making noise so I went and eliminated a group of then, and boars, and a few greylings. This happened so often it made me realize that every biome has high spawn rates, it's just that the Ashlands ones are dangerous, so when they show up a lot, you notice more

[spiral ice]

The Ashlands biome is by no means terribly difficult, but knockback on a weapon is not super important when you're getting mobbed by several charred, two morgens, and a couple of asksvin. Certainly still manageable with maxed gear, but it would be nice not to run into that after clearing the monuments of torment.

[spiral ice]

Are you sure? Mistlands and Mountains seem to have much lower spawn rates.
I'll have to check this in console mode some time (you can kill all spawned enemies). Doing that in several random places in a given biome would probably provide a good idea of how many creatures you can expect to be loaded in at a given arbitrary time.

[eternal storm]

#suggestions message NPCs like that will never happen, sorry. The devs seem to dislike the idea (understandably so) and the Dvergr would never work with (of for!) humans, they just tolerate you until they don't. I could imagine IG making the Dvergr less amicable, but not more.

[sonic musk]

2 handed ground slam counters infinite Warriors. You can indefinitely keep them at bay by slamming when they walk forward. It's highly recommended when you first enter the biome with how easily you would die normally, and get swarmed. The knockback mace is good to keep Asksvins right out of your range, but does nothing for their lunge (you just gotta dodge that!) But yeah if you tried it, you'd be surprised how well it works to keep the melee enemies at bay.

Not Morgens though. Ice staff and magic I use for them, or a sword and shield. They're too dangerous to try to juggle with a mace

[runic plover]

For morgen, last time I was in Ashlands, I was using knives. The Mistlands knife can parry them, so they actually die pretty quickly.

[marsh radish]

I would LOVE to be able to grow different grasses no matter what biome I'm in! I love the very simple meadow grass look with no interferences

[bitter lodge]

Same. I like the idea of a lush oasis garden in the middle of a browner area like Plains.

[bitter lodge]

@gusty finch Getting materials for armor can be grindy enough. I don't think longer crafting times would be a good idea.

[gusty finch]

Yeah, thats true, for sure, specially the materials for heavy armours.
But in the end we only craft one or two of each. And I didnt mean for the crafting time to be super long, ofc, only a few seconds difference, for example.

[eternal storm]

#suggestions message So, what's wrong with giving less XPs to "farmers" and more to players who put themselves in danger and survive? The opposite seem so unintuitive and unbalanced to me, I'd like to be given a reason for that, at least from people who ratioed the suggestion.

[lofty field]

I upvoted it because I just like anything to be done to improve the skill system. But there have been many suggestions (some better than yours in my opinion) and the discussion has been had many times. If you like you can search the channel to get some insight

[fast void]

Higher level enemies automatically make you level faster by nature of taking more hits to kill.
🤷‍♂️

[eternal storm]

... but lower level enemies give away levels like candy. Ask any Greydwarf that had the unfortunate destiny of spawning from a nest.

[fast void]

Skill system is free stats that the game is not balanced around.
Smiffe has all but confirmed they are not going to change it at all.

[lofty field]

bears

[eternal storm]

I guess we'll go straight to release with one of the worst RPG-ish mechanics I ever saw, and the fault will be on the players who notice it. Because lot of players seem to notice it.

[fast void]

Ok, if we're being total depression about this:

Would you rather there just be no skills at all and everything just has flat value?

[lofty field]

Instead of the current system? yes

[fast void]

Weirdge.

[eternal storm]

It's a progression-heavy game where progression is based on getting new materials (both for gear and food), so skills are kind of overkill. It does look like an afterthought, too bad people are investing lot of time in grinding levels. So yes, better having no skills that skills done like this.

Just for the sake of discussion, players focus on skills because the game keeps reminding them they're leveling, and losing levels is like half of the death penalty. If skills are not important, why they promote them so much in-game?

[fast void]

You and I define "promote them so much" very, very differently.

[eternal storm]

I don't care much about levels, I just see a lot of people complain about them or obsessing about leveling. Obviously the game did that, I'm just guessing why.

[stiff stag]

The game isn't to blame for an individual's personal issues like obsession.

[fast void]

Which is weird, because you have to spend effort to "grind" skills.
You have to spend effort to build your base.
Raid can destroy your entire base, but when that happens everyone is just "well build defenses better."
Dying takes a small % of skills, but no one accepts "just defend your life better."

[eternal storm]

I'd argue that building requires ingenuity and rewards exploring the game (for materials and stuff). Leveling most skills is nowhere near that.

[fast void]

I'd counter that skills requiring ingenuity to level would then fit your definition of promoting something "so much."

[eternal storm]

Well, it seems like skills and levels are here to stay, we could has well have a leveling system which was a little more fun to engage with.

[languid ibex]

I have plenty of fun engaging with the leveling system personally.

Mostly because it's a passive engagement, and the game is fun.

[eternal storm]

I was just asking why giving less XPs to easy fights and more to difficult fights is such a bad idea, to no avail.

[languid ibex]

Oh, because then you'd have to assign values to every single creature.

Not every player finds the same creatures troublesome, in this way it does become more about the weapon experience, not the enemy knowledge.

[eternal storm]

That's not my suggestion. It would be based just on a modifier calculated on the fly based on health and damage of the player and the creature. It's not a cure for everything, just a way to award actual fights.

[languid ibex]

This is still assigning values, it'd just be deterministic.

[eternal storm]

What's the problem with that?

[languid ibex]

No real problem, it's just a completely new approach to something that ultimately just needs a few tweaks.

The balancing factors that extend across all skills are currently very easy to adjust, but what you're suggesting could scale in unintentional ways, where an enemy with a large health pool can become an ideal skill leveling enemy because of a weakness or exploit.

If the goal is partially to stray away from mindless grind, this also has the potential to encourage another type of it entirely.

Personally, I like being able to evenly level my weaponry on T.W.I.G. whilst I smelt metals or brew mead.

[eternal storm]

I can see that, but I imagine those kind of situations to be less troublesome than the current system that seem to encourage grinding. Which seems exactly what IG wants: otherwise why give XPs for hitting a puppet?

Actually, you know what? I give up.

[languid ibex]

There is real world applications for just such a thing, some of the world's most skilled shooters use nothing but a printed out piece of paper to hone their skills.

[runic plover]

As written, your suggestion would be extremely easy to exploit. If the calculation is just looking at your damage output and/or max health compared to your enemy, I could, as example, bring a flint knife and a handful of low-tier stamina foods to fight a lone melee fuling. Using meadow gear against an enemy from 4 biomes later should yield vast amounts of XP, despite the fight itself being very easy.

[languid ibex]

If it were up to me, every wooden weapon would have 2-3x attack speed, and training with them against T.W.I.G.(or any enemy really) would result in faster exp gain.

[stiff stag]

The general idea and goal behind the suggestion is valid but the execution and logistics of making it work are where it all falls apart.

[languid ibex]

They should be incredibly light and allow players to train their form/skill much easier.

[runic plover]

Wouldn't be in favor of faster attack speeds on the wooden weapons, personally. I imagine their primary purpose is to learn how each weapon functions and/or sparring with friends, so if their attack speeds don't match the real-weapon version, it could upset people.

[languid ibex]

I'm really unsure if anyone uses them this way, but if that's the intention, that could be an issue.

[runic plover]

Why specifically use them on TWIG? It has functionally infinite health, so actual weapons work fine.

[languid ibex]

Perhaps just an experience gain then.

I just find wooden weapons to be useless, even when playing with a group we don't utilize them for pvp.

[peak bronze]

Wooden weapons use less stamina.

[languid ibex]

I edited to say any enemy really 😛

[lofty wave]

wood atgeir secondary vs bats

[languid ibex]

Why on earth would I have a wooden atgeir on me in a frost cave

[lofty wave]

wood atgeir secondary has high knockback and bats take more knockback than any other creature

any metal polearm would kill them

[languid ibex]

This is not an answer to my question 😛

[peak bronze]

For funsies.

[runic plover]

Ah, finally found what I was looking for. I knew the devs had mentioned using the wooden weapons as sparring implements. From the Call to Arms public test post on Steam:

"If at first you don’t succeed, try again!

Fortunately there are resources at your disposal in order to improve yourself – whether that be wooden weapons for sparring with your comrades, or a built structure to hone your fighting skills against."

[languid ibex]

Interesting, I don't think I've ever seen anyone use them that way.

[runic plover]

I know I haven't.

The group I was last playing in sparred with our actual weapons.

[languid ibex]

Perhaps if used against T.W.I.G. they could offer an exp bonus, as it's more deliberate training.

Similar to how the bow functions with the target.

Only to the benefit of the player.

[runic plover]

Doesn't the target give less XP than an actual enemy? Or so I've heard, at least.

[languid ibex]

It does yes, that's why I said to benefit rather than give less.

[runic plover]

It just seemed an odd comparison. "Give more XP, like this thing that gives less XP."

[languid ibex]

It's the function I'm speaking of.

[runic plover]

Fair enough.

I can definitely agree with the overall notion that skills could use some attention, if they're going to be included at all. No game mechanic is above scrutiny, and no mechanic should get away with... lackluster design, to put it semi-politely, if the devs can reasonably do something about it.

Doesn't need to be in 1.0, of course. Deep North development should be first priority. But some skill quality of life updates later would be welcome.

[languid ibex]

There's about 5 skills that just need a tweak to how quickly they level, whether it be to exp gain or just the total experience needed for level 100 that get adjusted.

[runic plover]

Any chance most, if not all, of those skills are the ones most recently added to the list?

[languid ibex]

I don't think I've ever seen dodge breach level 30 in any of my playthroughs, and I dodge a lot.

[runic plover]

I don't think I've had it even reach 10, but I haven't done a whole playthrough since it was invented.

[languid ibex]

Fishing experience is a bit of a meme at this point.

[runic plover]

My wife does the fishing. I've never tried it.

[languid ibex]

Riding skill is basically a placeholder for a nice little 0.

[runic plover]

Not sure why it even exists, really. I think I've gotten up to 3 or 4 once?

[languid ibex]

Yeah, just things like that being tweaked could really elevate skills quite a bit.

I feel like those sort of things really make players look under the hood that much more often in a bad way.

[runic plover]

Indeed. I've seen no shortage of people talking about crafting, cooking, farming, and other such domestic skills, for lack of a better descriptor. Skills should either be made more impactful and reasonably able to be increased, or removed.

I prefer the first option, by the way.

[arctic wharf]

Sitting there hitting twig forever to level up weapons still doesn't sound like my idea of fun gameplay though

[runic plover]

It isn't a perfect option, but I occasionally do it while coal and ore cook in the background

[arctic wharf]

I have gone over this again and again, and made my own such suggestion for such adjustments as well...
Doubt I'll see any changes come to pass though for making skills a better supportive system / feature.

#suggestions message

#suggestions message

Technically my food suggestion could interplay with skills some too.
#suggestions message

Not to just self promote my suggestions ofc, but showing they are there. Long time, old topic, discussed to death 😂

Using that twig idea in tandem with the first suggestion I posted though, could have twig be a fast way to level weapon skills into the middle levels (40 or 50 or so), and then have it marked as not viable to grant XP past that.

Want to try a new weapon?
Consider using twig to catch it up very quickly.
But he also doesn't become your default grind all the way to 100.

And with the XP required to level being much smaller, I really mean very quickly. So you won't have to worry about mindlessly hitting twig for hours.

[earnest beacon]

hello, casual player here. is there any intrest in opening a casual server/servers for members?

cashualy stuck solos at ashlands

but no matter. i dont think this sub will have a big surge ib players in the near future so som servers might be appriciated

[eternal storm]

I get that, but the alternative right now is hitting an infinite assortment of early creatures with your best weapon and armor, or a harmless puppet. If we're talking about exploits, the current ones are way worse than your example.

Wait, I was supposed to give up...

[hoary pollen]

Cauldron/work bench etc Add filter to list items/food of a certain level. At Lvl 6, I don’t want to see all 1-6 stuff.

[languid ibex]

I wouldn't mind this, or perhaps a rechargeable pool of bonus exp that is reapplied every 5 hours or so, so you can get an edge when it comes to crossing higher level thresholds, without total reliance on T.W.I.G.

[tardy knot]

Are people talking SKILLS again!?

[runic plover]

I was simply explaining my opposition to the suggestion. I don't expect to change anyone's mind.

[rose swan]

I love how everyone has like one specific topic they just love discussing and being a part of every chance they get 😂

[fast void]

Hey... I have 2 😛

[shadow crow]

His love for modded content being first and foremost

[fast void]

🤬 please...

[runic plover]

His ironclad dedication to frostner being second.

[fast void]

There it is 😄

[runic plover]

Oh, that was right?

[fast void]

But of course!

[runic plover]

Its knock back sure is such a great feature. I bet you could even mod it to make it farther.

[fast void]

😭

[runic plover]

Just imagine playing a game of baseball with greylings. Send them flying all the way into the next biome.

[arctic wharf]

Was only for a teeny tiny bit haha

[arctic wharf]

Perhaps in addition to everything else I stated, it would make you get to the set level you can with twig even faster... but it's not really neccessary considering the XP required per level was already adjusted.
Shouldn't take long at all to blitz through the levels you can from hitting twig.

[arctic wharf]

Skills isn't even my beloved topic though, just something I think should be addressed / improved.

Mine would be dungeons.
I want more

And bonus points for content that is worth while returning to old biomes for with stuff from later biomes, for reason reason reason best I don't get into the huge reason dump again

[royal lily]

Id like some no life content like in borderlands you had a .001% chance drop of a prismatic weapon that did absolutely nothing useful but was rare and cool

[arctic wharf]

Given how some people already mindlessly grind some skills just for the personal achievement of it... that would be an instant time sink trap for some.

Not a huge fan of those teeny tiny drop chances myself.

[runic plover]

As someone perpetually farming one thing or another in Warframe, absolutely agree.

[wanton atlas]

Please don't abuse the ability to embed pictures in this channel

[fast void]

Someone wants the melee mead to work for mages? 🤔

[leaden thicket]

Sorry for the long post in advance. Made a suggestion earlier today about battle axes being rebalanced. "Could we fix the battle axes please!!? All swings should be slightly slower than greatswords (the forst swing in the current animation takes way too long) but stronger(currently krom is stronger and faster than the mistlands battle axe creating a serious balancing issue) and the special move could be a big swing with knock back kind of like the atgir but instead of a full 360 it would be a 180. Would also love for the mistlands battle axe to have an elemental infusion like spirit." after doing some research I have seen some people say that they are balanced enough and that you are meant to use the secondary strike (the thrust attack) to stagger and then use the the primary slow swing. While I can see the reasoning behind this I cannot say that I am a fan of this, but I suppose it works technically. That said I have always found it annoying that a viking themed game would make battle axes (dane axes) so...bad. Axes may be slower than swords but real fighting axes weigh about the same as a sword and are only slower and less maneuverable because all the weight of the weapon is at one end. They are however, NOT ungabunga (big heavy) weapons. But what do ya'll think? are battle axes fine as is/am I off here or do they need some love?

[quaint turret]

Buff bloodstone please 🥺

The effect is really bad and needs a rework or overhaul

[languid ibex]

Battleaxes are perfect in my opinion, they are an incredibly effective weapon and the combo is explosive. Paired with one of the best crowd control and staggering secondaries, it becomes a stand out weapon for more difficult scenarios.

[leaden thicket]

Interesting. How do you use them? I often find the primary first swing to be a bit too slow in a lot of situations. The combo, secondary attack followed by the primary combo seems feasible to me. I just struggle with that slow primary. Is it a timing thing that I just need to work on?

[languid ibex]

Most definitely just needs practice, often times I will use secondary and then jump towards my target with the swing starting mid air. This makes some of the swing happen during the approach, and eats up the starting time a bit.

Weaker enemies I will also just spam the secondary, as it becomes very strong when the stagger occurs.

[leaden thicket]

Thank you. I think I will give battle axes another go now. Also unrelated question, do you think the game could use one or tow more bucklers considering that there are only 3 and two of them are one after the other and then the third isn't until the mistlands?

[languid ibex]

Could it have more? Sure why not. Is it in desperate need of them? Not really. Attempting to fill gaps equipment leave so they're all evenly paced would lead to much more work for the developers. I think they're fine to do as they please ultimately, but would always welcome anything that widens the options available.

[spiral ice]

Also consider the fact that the primary battleaxe attack deals 50% more stagger than damage, making it great for stunning enemies. This opens them up to more damage and builds adrenaline faster. A battleaxe is more defensive than a greatsword, great for holding your ground, rather than pressing forward into the enemy.

And if that weren't enough, they can attack through walls (which a longsword cannot). They are particularly excellent in infested mines.

[sonic musk]

even better would be taking Stagbreaker with meadows armor to the ashlands, and keeping Soldiers stalled infinitely with the knockback hehe. Same concept, using stamina foods. But that does feel fairer than end game armor and weapons spamming on low level mobs at like a Greydwarf spawner, for example

[shadow crow]

#suggestions message
I like this idea! Maybe similar to the alternate positioning on item stands, where you just cycle through the different options

[fast void]

Why do we need a larger chest when the largest chest currently isn't even the "best" option? 😭

[lofty field]

"best" depends on the metric. I like the bm chest and I'd like an even larger chest

(and it would be ok for me if it's not better in storage density than the reinforced chest)

[runic plover]

What do you consider the best option?

[fast void]

For storage efficiency? Iron.
Which, storage is the only reason I can think of for wanting a larger chest.

[rose swan]

Would kinda be neat to get an upgraded version of the personal chest 🤔
Give it like the storage of a reinforced chest, but the ‘locking feature’ of a personal chest.

[spiral ice]

Best efficiency is probably the barrel. Two of them match a reinforced chest's capacity, and I'm quite certain you can fit more than twice as many barrels into a given space than reinforced chests.

And requiring coins (for hoops) rather than iron is a bonus perk.

[fast void]

Category was "chests" 😭

[spiral ice]

I thought it was storage in general... 😶

[fast void]

Does 2 barrels actually match iron chest though?

[spiral ice]

Lemme check...

[celest flume]

it depends on how you arrange them. I tend to make a wall storages of chests arranged sideways, I can fit four reinforced chests into 2x2x2m cube this way

[finite folio]

2 barrels = reinforced chest

[peak bronze]

1 barrel has 12 slots.

[celest flume]

barrels can be good as a kind of floor storage, but for vertical wall storage, chests are better

[finite folio]

i use barrels vertically cause they take up less space

[spiral ice]

Here's a screenshot of my test. I'm sure you could fit one more reinforced chest and one more barrel, for 12 chests and 36 barrels. That's 288 to 432, making barrels twice as efficient here. I don't know how their vertical colliders work, so I'm not sure if that would benefit one or the other.

Also, barrels are inconsistent with other storage pieces, so I'm going to suggest a fix to that...

And I doubt that would affect already placed barrels, since Unity would be tracking their placement on the XYZ axes (plural of axis). Moving the snap point should affect only the act of placing them, and nothing after.

[rose swan]

@warm temple Achievements are coming in 1.0

[warm temple]

So the game is still in early access?

[rose swan]

Yep, the next major update will bring out of EA however. We don’t know when that’s coming at the moment though.

[fast void]

@rose swan when do we consider this to be "late access"? 😉

[rose swan]

Valheim 2.0

[fast void]

Deeper North.

[wanton atlas]

@celest flume that's actually how the spears use to work

@warm temple don't ask questions in #suggestions please.
Achivements have been said multiple times, will be added at 1.0 release

[celest flume]

okay, then why was it changed? Having lighter javelins for ranged and a spear primarily for melee would be absolutely in line with historical combat

[fast void]

You mean making the one-handers a throwable and atgeirs the "spear" for actual combat?
I would support this.

[celest flume]

nope, making javelins a new weapons more dedicated to ranged attack

[fast void]

Wouldn't that just be a worse spear?

[celest flume]

if they were stackable, nope. You could carry, say, 20 without cluttering your inventory

[fast void]

Is this doing equal, more, or less damage than the standard spear throw?

[celest flume]

less. But you can throw more without going to pick up the ones you threw, that's kinda the point

[fast void]

Love the pun.

I feel like if spear still exist that still sounds like "worse spear" as the spear can both attack and throw.

Where changing the spear back to being stackable, thrown weapon while having atgeirs fill the melee spear roll would fit better (if anything were to be changed).

[celest flume]

they'd be a different approach to ranged. High upfront cost, no upkeep unless you lose them,short range, high rate of fire but high stamina cost too

[wanton atlas]

they where kinda wierd, and the damage to them was wierd to calculate, and they had like a chance to break when you picked them up which didn't feel good

[celest flume]

right, durability might be a bit issue. Unless you just make them ranged only, no melee attack

[finite folio]

you could have the special attack on the spear changed to a thrust instead of a throw

or like something of a one handed nature

[fast void]

Curious: why was break chance attached to pick up instead of on hit?

[celest flume]

nah, I'd keep the throw on them too, but give it higher knockback. The multipurpose spears that we have ingame were actually a thing, and were usually used to disable enemy shield with a throw, then second weapon would be used

[wanton atlas]

because other wise you would have infinite amount of weapons which never ends

[fast void]

Just offhand, I wouldn't have given them durability at all. Just chance to break on hit that mathed out to the same thing as durability.

[fast void]

No? Because they can break every time you throw one?

[wanton atlas]

have you ever seen the suggestion from users about picking up arrows?

[celest flume]

that's probably the best solution. I thought more about giving them high upfront crafting cost, but that would work too

[wanton atlas]

only a trillion times right?

same was with the javelins

hence it made more sence to have a re-throwable spear with it's own HP pool

[fast void]

Yes but I don't care about it. And I'm not equating it to this at all.

Also, I am not advocating that anything should change.

My opinion is for if it were going to.

[celest flume]

Another possibility would be that when you pick a javelin, it would always be a broken one (probably a different item) that could then be repaired at a crafting station with some wood.

[fast void]

If you make them cheap to build, just give them a 50% chance to break on it.
% chance lowers with making it more expensive.

[lofty field]

Space efficiency is not everything. I often use bm chests because I like having more slots in one chest for ease of access. The extra building space required often doesn't matter much to me.

[fast void]

Attaching break chance to "on pickup" is baffling the ol noggin.

[celest flume]

Yeah. If the price for javelins was low enough, I wouldn't even mind if they worked like arrows, no pickup possible at all

[spiral ice]

Javelins sound like they would just be a worse bow, and we already have that (crossbow*).

*At low skill levels, they're about equal, but at high skill levels, crossbows are much worse.

[celest flume]

Much higher rate of fire. It would be more like short range burst damage before melee

[spiral ice]

Short range burst sounds like a crossbow.

[fast void]

Crossbow needs to pierce enemies based on skill level.
0-20: no
20-40: shoots through 1 enemy
40-60: shoots through 2
And so on.

Would make them distinct from bows without needing to adjust attackspeed.

[spiral ice]

I don't think I've ever seen a suggestion like that. Cool idea though!

They definitely should do something to make crossbows different from bows though. I would love to have gimmicky ammo (still with phyisical damage), like explosive bolts or shattering bolts (á la Dundr).

[fast void]

I believe I put it in suggestions before.
But I know I have mentioned it a couple times 😂

P.S. All of my ideas are cool 😏

[celest flume]

oh, I'd love a Piecemaker, but that's not gonna happen in Valheim 😄

[peak bronze]

So are mine, at least in my opinion.

[runic plover]

When it comes to bow vs. crossbow, I do think crossbows have the advantage of accuracy over great range. By "great," I mean I can hit targets from the limit of my draw distance with basically 100% accuracy, even against small, airborne targets. Can't reliably do that with a bow. Once things get closer, though, it's a very different story.

[fast void]

Exactly.

[celest flume]

Another this is that you can move while reloading crossbow more effectively than when drawing a bow, giving you better damage uptime

[peak bronze]

Explosive bolts would be good AoE alternative for crossbows that would make it for the lack of speed compared to bows.

[runic plover]

Also worth noting that crossbows have great knockback, so shooting an enemy can even serve defensive purposes. And while bows likely have better DPS (assuming every shot hits), I'm pretty sure crossbows do more per individual hit and, at least for me, are more accurate. Since I prefer playing with friends, that means I can protect them better and help stagger enemies by larger chunks.

Most important, however, I simply have more fun with a crossbow.

[fast void]

Bows absolutely destroy them in DPS.
Crossbows do more per individual hit, yes.

[spiral ice]

I mean, Dundr is kinda that, right?

[fast void]

Dundr is so meh...

[spiral ice]

Crossbow sneak damage is really good, but generally you're not up against a singular enemy. Maybe they will shine in Deep North overworld though?

[fast void]

Like if Dundr did CHAIN lightning = cool.
But no...

[spiral ice]

That would be so busted if it had the same chain proc chance. 😄

[fast void]

Chance? I don't want chance.

I want Dundr to legit be a lightning shotgun.
Chain is every time.

That's like saying Staff of Fireball should have a "chance" to be a fireball and default is fire pebble.

[eternal storm]

#suggestions message
A trinket only used for a very specific kind of damage seems too limited compared to other trinkets to bother using it, and honestly it just seems like an attempt to fix a single weapon that could be fixed without messing with the trinket economy.

[languid ibex]

It would apply to 7 weapons, and I'm not implying anything needs to be fixed, just allow for players to really intensify chain lightening during combat.

[spiral ice]

Fader power would go crazy...

[sonic musk]

Dundr is the best Deathsquito killer in the game and rabbit hunter. The huge spread on projectiles means you will hit. So the few times I went to hunt rabbit meat in the late game I brought Dundr and it's super fun in the plains as a bug zapper :D

[fast void]

Squitos die to front-kicks... so 🤷‍♂️

[sonic musk]

well yes, but that involves fighting them seriously. Or you just pull out Bug Zapper 9000 and make it disappear before it lands a hit hehe

It's not a damage thing, it's an ease of access thing. You preload the eitr, so you don't pay the cost in combat, and you just go around shooting any Deathsquitos that dare offend you

[eternal wyvern]

So it is meh, but it’s convenient 2 biomes earlier.

[kind crystal]

@languid ibex that trinket would be super op, chain lightning is already VERY common even on slower weapones like the Slayer or Storm Ripper

[kind crystal]

@north rock why do you disagree with my suggestion? just curious

[peak bronze]

Let's not tag people for disagreeing with your suggestion.

[kind crystal]

im not attacking him, im genuinely just curious as to why

[lofty wave]

#suggestions message parry timing for all hits is 0.25s, the devs don't change it for individual attacks

[peak bronze]

You could just ask generally about why some people has downvoted your suggestion without tagging any people who has.
It has been stated as channel rule in pinned messages from Moderator and other Helper, found here too:
#suggestion-discussion message
#suggestion-discussion message

[kind crystal]

mb didnt know that lol

[peak bronze]

No worries, now at least you know.

I understand feeling curious why suggestions get downvotes but people will disagree with things, it's just life.
Discussing it is definitely okay and people who downvoted might give their 5 cents about the topic if they want to.

[peak bronze]

But speaking about the suggestion: personally, I'm little conflicted. On the other hand old ghost was quite unpredictable since its animations were not shown so new ghost is easier to parry but then old ghost had cool iconic looks.
So maybe some older mobs could have little more variety on attack animations. But not as necessary addition IMO.

[kind crystal]

i dont think every mob needs reworked animations, but after seeing the attack variety from the charred warriors and the new bear/ghost animations, i cant help but wonder how the game would look with a fresh batch of animations

[frank badger]

ARMOUR SLOTS

[peak bronze]

Yeah, I meant not all mobs need but some could have little variety on attack animations, but that probably would be post 1.0 update if any is going to be added. I agree bears and mobs in Ashlands having more variety in their attacks makes them fun to fight against.

[languid ibex]

A little confusing of a statement for me, if it's very common wouldn't that make the trinket not useful at all? Why would it be super op?

[kind crystal]

im saying it would be obsolete

[languid ibex]

You said it would be super op though.

[kind crystal]

iolite is already the best gem, the trinket would be op in that it would further increase the effectiveness of an already VERY strong ability, but also be unnecessary since its already super easy to trigger

if we're making trinkets to increase a gem's potency, the bloodstone needs the most help

[languid ibex]

Well there's no suggested adrenaline cost or duration of the ability, and would come at the cost of your trinket slot, so I'm not exactly sold on those downsides.

[languid ibex]

Sure it does, but one idea shouldn't necessarily be brought down by the lack of another, it's a why not both scenario.

[kind crystal]

because thats not going to bridge the gap between the gems. itll make bloodstone better but make iolite EVEN better. the power imbalance will stay the same, just at a higher base level

[languid ibex]

Bloodstone gets plenty of suggestions as well. 😅

[languid ibex]

I disagree ultimately, it still comes at a cost, and can be balanced around how long it lasts and how much adrenaline is required.

[kind crystal]

because it actually needs them

[languid ibex]

That's fine, but it isn't the #what-the-game-needs channel.

[kind crystal]

your original suggestion had nothing to do with the bloodstone buddy 😂 im not denying that bloodstone needs help, but iolite certainly doesnt

[languid ibex]

I never mentioned iolite needing help anywhere.

[kind crystal]

u said chain lightning. thats iolite

[languid ibex]

I said chain lightening needs help?

[kind crystal]

u suggested a way to make the best ability even better...

[languid ibex]

I think you're assuming it'd be an easy to activate trigger or a somewhat long duration.

[kind crystal]

u could make it a 10s duration and 100 adrenaline and it would still be one of the best trinkets because of how chain lightning works, especially when paired with faster weapons

[lofty wave]

it could lower the damage of the lightning

[kind crystal]

then you'd just be better off without it, unless youre hoping for more stagger

[languid ibex]

Yeah, not sure why I'd downvote something because it'd be the best in theory, to me that sounds like plenty of fun to be had.

[kind crystal]

i think trinkets to boost gems is a good idea but chain lightning is already objectively the best effect

[languid ibex]

I mean, Deep North could resist lightening for all we know, it's just useful in the Ashlands, and translates to older biomes of course.

[kind crystal]

the only way i see it being balanced is maybe increasing the distance it can jump between targets for a short duration

[languid ibex]

Regardless, I would suggest looking at the idea based on it's own merits, without a direct comparison to other gemstones, those gemstones can also have their own suggestions that raise them up.

[kind crystal]

everyone is going to compare the gemstones anyway. when you're given a choice between options, comparing them is literally what we as a species do

again, i think gem based trinkets is a fire idea

it just needs to be balanced properly

[languid ibex]

It's just what I'd suggest, there's plenty of cases where a rising tide only highlights problems elsewhere.

[languid ibex]

That's why I didn't include a single balancing element, just the idea itself.

[kind crystal]

i just dont like the idea of impacting the trinket meta too hard, because as it stands a lot of the trinkets are very subjective. i cant personally say there's a 'best trinket'

[languid ibex]

#IronBroochGang

[kind crystal]

nimble anklet says what

[celest flume]

nimble anklet is best until mistlands trinkets

[kind crystal]

resounding shackle is very good but i personally dont fw magic so

i dont use the earrings

currently running wolf sight and vilebone set for max pierce dmg

[languid ibex]

I virtually never run out of stamina and always have Ratatosk, Nimble Anklet is useless for me.

[kind crystal]

wait til u stack the movespeed effects

zoooooooomin'

[languid ibex]

I don't need stacked movespeed in combat.

I'm in their face.

[kind crystal]

im trying more of a hit and run thing with this world

usually im sword+shield and heavy armour

[languid ibex]

Ah, I'm a perfect dodge enthusiant until my brooch kicks in, then it's time for brazenly swinging away

[kind crystal]

evasion mantle is very fun for dodge/parry

[languid ibex]

I don't get much use out of it, my stamina is always in good shape.

[gaunt harness]

#suggestions message As a minority Swede who really don't like blackpudding, I approve of this suggestion!

Also, I just really like the idea of upgrading food. 😂

#suggestions message I agree with you. It would be nice if there could be a gradual intensity of the Ashland biomes as you progressed further into the biome space. The Ashlands and the Deep North are the only two biomes with dedicated space on the map, so it's not at all hard to create intensity zones for them since you always know what coordinates should be 'safe' or 'insanity' level threat.

That said, you will find that any attempt at suggesting improvements to the player experience, or quality of life, will get massively downvoted here. The average user who engages with the #suggestions thread do not want the game to be enjoyable for other players, only for themselves.

[sharp grove]

Could you add an option so that when a character dies, there’s no need to retrieve their corpse? As long as I don’t have to do corpse runs, I’m fine even if the game is as difficult as Elden Ring. Please!

[languid ibex]

Improvements are subjective, no sense in downplaying other's opinions simply because you don't agree.

[gaunt harness]

If a game can't be played because it requires a level of skill that a proportion of players do not have the time or patience to achieve, so called 'quit moments' where players stop playing the game altogether because it stopped being fun, any design change to smooth that barrier is an improvement both from a commercial perspective, and a player perspective.

So, yes, I will downplay the opinions of people who say that the game is supposed to be frustrating instead of fun.

[rose swan]

Can’t help but feel that’s a really broad statement though 🤔
It can be really hard to define ‘quit moments.’

Just because something is difficult or frustrating, doesn’t mean it’s bad. Some players play game a challenge, while others play to unwind or casually engage with a game. Just depends on the game I think.

[gaunt harness]

#suggestions message How will they work off ice? Is this gonna be an iron boots situation from Ocarina of Time, where the item itself was more frustrating because it required considerable menu navigation?

[gaunt harness]

No, a "quit moment" is extremely easily define: it is the moment that a player stops playing the game for any reason.

[rose swan]

Flashbacks of water temple 😭

[gaunt harness]

And, as for 'not all frustrations are bad'. If even 10% of players stop playing because of frustration, that means you cheated 10% of players out of an experience they paid for.

[rose swan]

If that’s the case, then I don’t think that term has a lot weight- it’s extremely broad and extremely variable, yeah?

[languid ibex]

You're forgetting that some players search out a challenge and are just as common place. Those players are of the same importance.

[gaunt harness]

Well, you'd be wrong for thinking so.

[gaunt harness]

Yes, but those that don't, and want to play Valheim for a smoother experience should have the option to do so. Especially since they can't refund the game after they get to the Ashlands and realise that they are no longer able to make progress.

So, allow players to modulate their experience.

[languid ibex]

They absolutely allow for this in many ways though.

[rose swan]

Hmm, ok, what if I quit the game because I don’t have time to play video games because my personal life demands more from me? 🤔

Should Irongate make the game quicker paced to cater to desire?

[peak bronze]

World modifiers exist for sole purpose to reduce/minimize those frustrations you don't personally enjoy.

[rose swan]

To be fair, no where does Irongate state that the game will be easy/smooth- in fact, quite the opposite, would you agree?

[gaunt harness]

Yes, not having time to play is a quit moment.

[rose swan]

Sure, but that’s a standard and moment defined by me, not by a developer.

[rose swan]

This is a good point I meant to touch on as well- players can already tweak their personal experience with these alone. Want faster play? Tune up the resource rate. Want easier combat? Tweak the difficulty. There are options that allow for a range of players!

The big ticket items that I feel needs the most attention (generally speaking) is performance. Because it’s performance that players pay for and expect to be adequate first and foremost.

[gaunt harness]

I'm not sure what you think you meant by that. Quit moments are on both end, yes. This is why many game these days are made to be playable in short chunk as it facilitates players with little free time on their hands.

[languid ibex]

Not to mention options within the gameplay to up the easiness. Play ranged, utilize meads, cater food types to your needs, utilize armors effectively, take precautions and be prepared. These things will all grant you an edge on top of things like modifiers, and I am sure I am missing things in that list.

[rose swan]

So Irongate should cater to the players who want to play in short chunks as opposed to those who want longer stretches of game time? That doesn’t seem fair 🤔

[languid ibex]

I am beginning to see why you're of the opinion that people with negative opinions are just wrong, because this take is just horrendous(to me).

[gaunt harness]

Valheim can already be played in short chunks.
Why are you focusing on your own example instead of the one that was raised, being the sheer difficulty escalation of the Ashlands, and the suggestion of having a smoother entry and scale up the difficulty as you progress deeper into the biome, instead of having it go 100% the moment you touch shore?

[languid ibex]

You speak like the Ashlabds difficulty is objectively a sheer increase, personally I feel it's par for the course aftrr Mistlands. I felt it was almost too easy my first time playing after the nerf. I navigated in troll armor with a firewood bow and wooden arrows effectively. It's definitely not an objective truth.

[rose swan]

Because I think Ashlands already does a good job of communicating to the player that this is going to be an extremely tough experience. The sky turns red and stormy, lighting flashes all over, intense music, giant bone serpents, etc. there’s nothing about Ashlands that indicates ‘smooth’ to me, and that’s the point I believe.

The moment the players reaches the Ashland waters- not even the shore- it’s pretty clear the level of intensity they’re about to experience.

Valheim is a challenge to be overcome, not a tour to be experienced.

[gaunt harness]

You are conflating atmosphere with playability.
To finish the game, you need to go into the Ashlands. You can't go to the Ashlands until the end of the game.
Players will not be shown the red, stormy skies until the end game, so they won't know they are playing a game they will not be able to complete until they get there.

Why do you not see the problem with that design philosophy?

[rose swan]

And why exactly can’t they complete it? Because it’s too hard? 🤔

Does Eldenring suffer from the same ‘problem’ then? What about Zelda OOT, is the water temple designed to be too difficult? Lots of players got stuck there and stopped playing the game.

[peak bronze]

And Dark Souls games are solely based on git gut philosophy.

[rose swan]

Playability is things like games crashing, soft locks, performance issues, etc.

Difficulty is something else entirely, and sometimes a player needs to hone their skills and keep practicing and beating their head on the wall until they overcome the challenge. Just how gaming is, I believe.

[gaunt harness]

Yes, have you not been paying any attention?
That was literally what the main discussion was about.

The Ashlands ramp up in difficulty way more than any other biome.

[rose swan]

Fair enough. If you believe Eldenring and OOT have flaws related to difficulty, then I think this is where the disagreement stems from. Good convo, but we’ll have to agree to disagree on this one 🤝

[gaunt harness]

I don't agree with you at all.

[rose swan]

Agree to disagree then? 👀

[gaunt harness]

No. You can disagree with me, but I don't agree with your disagreement.

#suggestions message I don't think there's any record of Vikings making Igloos. That's an inuit culture thing. 👀

[peak bronze]

Personally I felt disappointed when Seeker AI was changed to circle between attacks and not attack constantly like wolves do, which is one change I would like to be reverted back.

[gaunt harness]

#suggestions message Please, why would you suggest that they make the game even slower and more frustrating?

Crafting is already a really boring affair since it is literally just click and wait. Don't make me wait even longer just for giggles.

[rose swan]

Yeah, I don’t see any value in extending the time it takes to craft something lol

[gaunt harness]

#suggestions message I am a little confused by this suggestion... so you want a port that can act sort of like a portal, but has transportation that can be interrupted midway by attacks at sea?? And it is 'real-time' so it's not at all quicker... so are we just staring at a black screen while we wait? Or is the boat moving on its own and we just sit there?

Wouldn't it just be easier and cooler with a floating portal what we can sail through instead?

#suggestions message The Javelin suggestion is pretty fun, since Smiffe were just telling us the other day that spears started out as javelins, but playtesters wanted to be able to stab with them..
So, this suggestion is back to basics. I like the idea, but we can just make spears stackable and keep them as they are, can't we?

[celest flume]

The issue is durability. If they're stackable they can't have individual durability, but having spears that wouldn't break but could be picked up and reused would give effectively infinite ammo, which devs don't want.

[lofty wave]

stacking spears could add the durability and taking some out would split it

[wanton atlas]

@ember lily you already CAN zoom out more with Drakkar

[stiff stag]

It's definitely possible to design slots in games to allow for stacking similar items with differing values and properties, it's just not a possibility in their current state since they weren't made to support it and would require changing how slots are handled.

[celest flume]

Yeah, but that would be asking for quite a lot from developers, and thus very unlikely to be implemented....

[finite folio]

when ashlands first dropped it was insane lol the spawn rates were kicking ass

[thick bridge]

#suggestions message

why are people trying to mark it as suggested already when it’s literally not been?

[rose swan]

#suggestions message 🤔

On a side note, it’s also not a problem honestly, don’t let it get you down

[thick bridge]

Lmfao from over a year ago is WILD. I checked till like August of last year.

I’m not, I just was confused because I didn’t see it anywhere and thought it would be really useful

[rose swan]

Haha sometimes these suggestions feel like just yesterday.

Speaking of, dang it’s been a year since my landscaping suggestion #suggestions message that is crazy to think about! Time flies lol.

[gaunt harness]

You can consider the ♻️ emote as both "i've seen this before" and "boo!! never bring this up again!"
Since I very much doubt most people reacting back-checks each of these requests.

[gaunt harness]

To be fair, "Sort inventory" and "sort stacks" are not the same things..
We already have a stack shortcut for putting things into chests, but not for merging stacks in our own inventory.
Feels like an oversight

[rose swan]

I stopped using the ♻️ emote personally. I don’t think it adds a lot of feedback, and a lot of people interpreted it as an elitist reaction of sorts, so I figured I’d just stop using it 🤷🏼‍♂️

[gaunt harness]

Also, it's not really our job to sort out which requests have been made already.
It's up to Irongate to ignore the suggestion, and they don't need our help with that.

[peak bronze]

Although, requesting same things over and over again doesn't mean it will change their minds.

They are aware.

[rose swan]

Yee, also true

[gaunt harness]

We don't request the same thing 'over and over' again. We just don't do the homework of reading years of suggestions before typing one up.

It's not like Irongate will read them all chronologically. They'll spot check at best.

[peak bronze]

Smiffe has confirmed that votes don't really matter if the suggestion is something they personally find interesting and can be implemented in the game.

Sure, they show the support of other players but in the end devs decide what they like.

[gaunt harness]

Then why have the emotes at all?
At best it makes someone feel a bit better about their suggestion, and worst someone will feel bad because they got dogpiled.

[peak bronze]

This one #suggestions message is proof suggester is aware it has been suggested before.

[gaunt harness]

is proof this specific suggester is aware it has been suggested before*

[peak bronze]

Same what I said.

[peak bronze]

Votes can give some insight what players might want to be implemented tho.

[gaunt harness]

#suggestion-discussion message
You said it yourself, it doesn't matter.

So if anything, emotes is just an opportunity of community friction.

[peak bronze]

Can give insight, but doesn't matter in the end if they like the idea.

[stiff stag]

That statement was conditional. Outside of that scenario the votes can still play a role.

[rose swan]

For example, there probably isn’t much of a point to create new suggestions about armor slots. Irongate is already aware that there’s been feedback regarding it 🤔

[peak bronze]

Don't really remember back then but I'm in belief that when magic was suggested it was somewhat 50/50 for votes but devs liked the idea and added it in Mistlands.

[thick bridge]

Which is primarily why I did it. I’m kinda tired of picking up stuff only to see I have a stack of 1/50 and a separate stack of 15/50.

[rose swan]

Haha I remember those days, now that felt like ages ago!

(talking about Joel’s magic comment)

[arctic wharf]

I use it probably more than the 👍 and 👎 combined

But I have my little "must vote on every suggestion" streak still going strong.

[gaunt harness]

I can't believe a community for a game with magic portals and wards and magical enemies had problems with the idea of players being allowed to use magic too.

[thick bridge]

Honestly it’s really stupid to use it instead of either thumb. Unless it’s specifically meant as a “suggested already” because how is someone supposed to know what is meant unless by ♻️ if it’s not what was pinned

[arctic wharf]

Most suggestions just are ♻️ though hahaha

And maybe I wanna be stupid, IDGAF

[gaunt harness]

Because I live in Sweden, and we recycle here.

[thick bridge]

That’s wild tbh. Just let people have magic if they want. Like if you don’t wanna use it just don’t use it

[thick bridge]

Tbf I think it should be limited to like 6mo-1yr. If it’s recycled after that then that’s fine because I doubt the devs look that far back

[arctic wharf]

Honestly I think people need to just not care about the votes 😂

[gaunt harness]

That's asking people to do a lot of homework though. Not every request is worded the same, so you could make a suggestion that has been made recently, but with different words. In that case, you'd have to cycle many different words to see if your request already exists.

Not that it matters, because how many people actually scroll up even one page, let alone months to read requests?

[rose swan]

As someone who’s really active in the suggestions channel and seems to remember a vast amount of suggestions… I agree, people shouldn’t take voting too seriously

[gaunt harness]

I think we should probably just remove them. We already have a discussion space here, and most people don't care enough to talk about suggestions anywya.

[rose swan]

Well, I don’t think the voting should be removed- sometimes people want to give quick and concise feedback in the form of a vote instead of a discussion- and I think that’s fair

[arctic wharf]

I think they matter as a simple metric for the devs, but us the ones making the suggestions should just ignore them

[gaunt harness]

Smiffe said the devs do not take votes into account

[arctic wharf]

Smiffe is one dev and is not always right.
But I would believe by now they don't look at suggestions all too much.

[gaunt harness]

Obviously. 99% of requests here are not implemented.

[rose swan]

There’s definitely a handful of things that were either A) inspired by suggestions or B) awfully close to a suggestion

Aurora Borealis is a good example- obviously I can’t say for certain the degree of which it was inspired by the community, but it used to be a super common suggestion. And now, looks like we’ll be getting it

[peak bronze]

Shovel has been quite common suggestion too, although some for replanting berry bushes or other purposes.

[arctic wharf]

They have paid attention

just not sure how much they may still be, considering it's heads down work on DN for now.

Smiffe ofc will always be looking ❤️

[gaunt harness]

I think we can safely say that the most commonly suggested things have not been implemented.
There are 5 total mentions of Aurora in the entire Suggestion thread. There are 354 mentions of some form of inventory proposal, yet the inventory is the same today as it was in 2021.

There is definitely a mismatch between the frequency of suggestions, and what actually makes the cut.

[gaunt harness]

Shovel has been mentioned 8 times in the suggestion thread. And it's not even being implemented in the way that it was suggested. Instead it seems to solely be used to deal with a wholly now environment obstacle.

Oh, wow! Here's someone who got what they asked for. Sadly they didn't live long enough to see it.

[rose swan]

This is going to come off as nitpicky, and I apologize in advance lol but also count the term ‘northern lights’ for aurora borealis. Also keep in mind there was a lot of suggestions that were lost 🤔

[gaunt harness]

Fair. I looked throught that, and of the 23 mentions of 'northern', only 5 of those were specifically about adding northern lights/Aurora borealis.
So.. 13 total.

[peak bronze]

Still, repetition doesn't make implemention faster nor guaranteed.

[gaunt harness]

#suggestion-discussion message clearly.

But, again, not the job of users on this forum to do their homework before they make a suggestion. It's entirely up to Irongate what they include. They can handle something they aren't gonna implement being mentioned more than one or twice a month.

[arctic wharf]

It just depends on what the devs end up agreeing they would like to add, not how much the community wants it haha

That being said, I would be surprised if inventory didn't get a little somethin somethin, since it's for sure the talk of the town and on their radar.

[languid ibex]

A fairly negative interpretation, I see recycle very differently. The more recycle emotes means it's a more common suggestion, because more people have seen something similar. It only takes on a negative or positive spin based on the votes alongside it for me.

I will still upvote or downvote alongside recycle, and if I just hit recycle, it just means I have seen it before and I don't feel strongly either way.

[gaunt harness]

This is too perfect moment to not to:

no sense in downplaying other's opinions simply because you don't agree.

[languid ibex]

This isn't relevant.

[gaunt harness]

Again, not really our job to tell Irongate if a request has already been made.

[languid ibex]

Telling people they are wrong and stating something is negatively interpreted is very different.

[arctic wharf]

Alrighty you two, settle down

Ofc it isn't our job, nothing forcing us to leave reactions. But it is a metric they must appreciate having. Or it wouldn't exist.

[languid ibex]

Sorry Zion, I just thought I would clear up that recycle emotes aren't a negative reaction for everyone.

[gaunt harness]

I'm not sure. Sometimes you put things there because you are 'supposed to'. It's a very Swedish traditional mentality.

[arctic wharf]

No worries, and I agree on that. Some people (not GurraDesu, not implying you) get really bent out of shape needlessly over the reactions.

[ember lily]

Oh I didn't know that, for me it still felt kinda hard to look around/above it

[wanton atlas]

yeah. it needs to have a maximum sadly

[gaunt harness]

maximume biggerly

[gaunt harness]

#suggestions message Absolutely for this request. Better menu sorting would be great! And also, if items could be sorted by tier too. Trying to make an Ash set and scrolling to every quartile of the scroll box is tedious when finding out what ingredients you need.

[finite folio]

I’m surprised there aren’t very many sorting options in the game tbh

Or rather that the sorting in the sub menus is questionable

Like hammer menu Iol

I see a lot of potential for optimization

[gaunt harness]

The menus in Valheim are pretty much the same as in 2021, so there' definitely room for improvement now that there are multiple times more items to go through.

[finite folio]

Yeah and they might be working on all that jazz already for 1.0

Assuming it’s like deep north + optimization of previous areas I hope would include those menus and the other small details

[sonic musk]

I have a totally different perspective here. The red stormy skies, the murder birds, the massive bone serpents with a piercing wail, the endless horde of demons that swarm you on shore, all of that combined made me feel like the adult version of going to Disney Land when I first landed.

Every biome before this you approach the shore, usually quite easily, land, and encounter a few creatures. This time, long before you even land, scary cliffsides block your way, you're intimidated by the large predatory creatures scouring the path to the land, and once you land, you're no less in danger. It's an epic experience!

Once you finally hit landfall and clear the area and can safely build a portal, you take a breath and realize you've made it. I loved my first trip to the Ashlands

[gaunt harness]

Once you finally hit landfall and clear the area and can safely build a portal
This is the part that a significant portion of players will fail to do, and will probably quit before achieving.

We don't have steam achievements to go on, but when we do it will be interesting to see how many people ever get the achievement for finishing the Ashlands.

[sonic musk]

That being said, it is objectively much harder than the other biomes, and the other biomes look like daycare comparatively. You really do have significant more danger surrounding the island than in any other biome. And your workbenches burn to ash, so setting up permanent encampments are made more difficult, same for any wooden structure you build. Warriors can and will 1 shot you, with intentionally odd timing on their attacks, and the Voltures and Askvins make you use a lot of stamina fleeing when 10 other enemies are chasing you. And don't forget the near instant-death lava that everyone gets to experience at least once!

It really is, objectively, significantly harder than other biomes. You are not wrong at all, but personally, I loved that challenge, and still do. I'm not even 'good' at these games, and I don't enjoy insane challenges.

I legitimately stopped playing for 6 months when I could not find the Queen Vegvisir. And once I gained the resolve to play again, I almost quit out of frustration of 50 or so deaths to the Queen solo, while she fully healed and reset every time, and felt like an impassable obstacle (Like every single other boss fight before, I tried to do Melee with Arrows, and it just doesn't work that well. Used Magic, beat it first try).

I think the Queen is the most unfun fight of the entire game. If they rebalanced her to be like a Mario/Zelda fight where the Queen burrows, has a big flashing indicator underground, and you hit her critical point when she's underground, then takes a big chunk of damage to unburrow, she would be actually enjoyable.

I did Queen solo and Fader in a group. I died 4 times at Fader and 50 times on the Queen. I don't know why the Queen is made to be nigh unstoppable, unless you use magic. (I know other people didn't have my experience, but her health pool is a joke, and she 1 shots you at melee while you barely barely tickle her, it's not a boss fight it's a brick wall, in that sense)

[rose swan]

I got melted the first time I reached the shore- had to build a whole new Drakkar! It was tough, but it was a lot of fun! I still enjoy the biome mostly, even after the nerf.

[elder copper]

Ehh, max level Carapace Shield will stagger her immediately if you parry the block.

Parry Block, 3 piece combo Mistwalker, rinse repeat. She’s dead in 15 minutes.

[rose swan]

Hm? I don’t think you can stagger bosses 🤔

[elder copper]

Well not staggered staggered, but Everytime I would parry with the carapace shield she’d stop moving long enough to get a combo in. So just parry is what I meant I guess 😂

[royal lily]

Attack attack roll repeat win?

[gaunt harness]

I just used the fireball while standing at the entrance... the AoE will hit her through the wall just fine, and the DoT is nice too. Then you just put an Orb of Protecc when she excapes, run out to draw her back in, and then run back to the entrance.

Summon some skeletons too if you feel lonely..

Fast? No. Fun? A little bit.

[sonic musk]

yeah that confused me cause she can't stagger and doesn't care if you block her, you still take damage blocking

[sonic musk]

attack attack lose 40% of HP get 2 full health seekers and 8 brood on you, she burrows underground and is 2 floors above you, when you approach she poisons and summons 8 more brood with 2 full health seekers, she melees you a few times then burrows and resummons, you forgot that part!

[royal lily]

U can stand in one spot and auto auto dodge. 2 seekers. U should be ok. Broods do 1 dmg

[gaunt harness]

I remember my first time at the Ashlands. I played multiplayer, with two other people, and we landed in probably the most hostile area imaginable. We lost 2 Drakkar and completely wiped. 😭

Third time we managed to figure out that there were ruins in the water, and then we put a portal and shield up in there instead.

A really brutal learning curve.

[sonic musk]

well, if I got mad enough I would cheese her like that, but I wanted to fight her and kill her as a normal encounter, like I did for every fight. I never did the Moder cheese or the Elder cheese like some people, I wanted a straightforward fight between me and the boss

[sonic musk]

broods take up time, doesn't matter if they do 0 damage. They can also stagger you if you just ignore them like it seems you are implying. You can stand in 1 spot but dodging the Queen +2 seekers means a ton of work on your stamina. If you ignore them all, you do a lot more running around. It sounds like you're trying to make it sound like it was an easy fight melee like I had some simple obvious solution that I was forgetting. If it was that obvious I wouldn't have died 50 times. I didn't die to Yagluth once, and he was by far the hardest boss released in original Valheim. The very next biome boss scaled up insanely in the same style combat, and I didn't get significantly worse at the game since then. Once I used magic, beat it with nearly zero difficulty. That's not right

Yagluth was the most fun boss fight of all time. He hit insanely hard and had tons of awesome environmental attacks with a cool lazer beam, and during my Yag fight I encountered 15 Fulings with a Shaman and 20 or more Greydwarves from a nearby forest. I brought 300 arrows and 2 bows and by the end, I was down to about 3 arrows. And 2 of my melee weapons were broken. My friend died early in the fight and we had no portal so I had to beat a multiplayer-buffed Yag solo. That was fun. No frustration, beat it first try, with a lot of effort. I love Yagluth, hate the Queen.

Fader encounter was similar and very fun. We had portals so could return quickly, and Fader summons are frail versions of the normal enemies. Yag Fulings were coincidental. Queen intentionally summons full health full power seekers and brood and burrows away dragging the fight on for so long that the fun fades away and at a certain point you aren't fighting her for the fun of it, you're just doing a chore, and quickly, before she burrows and summons again. No charm, no silliness, just 'okay, here we go again'

[gaunt harness]

By the time I got to Fader I was really in love with the Trollstav
I kept two trolls on him at all times while my two teammates used ranged attacks and kept enemies that wandered in away.

Pretty epic fight. But slow... It wasn't until I killed Fader the first time I discovered the Staff of the Wilds
The wilds staff is my new favourite.

[arctic wharf]

no surprise, the magic staffs are stupidly strong... almost brokenly so, feels cheesy
Am not judging btw, is a game you should 100% play however is the most fun for you.

[sonic musk]

Yes, me and my friends could not keep our trolls alive for more than 15 seconds. Fader SHREDS those summons, but we still used them to keep him at bay

Staff of the Wilds is by far the most broken weapon in the game, and puts so many weapons to shame. You can 1 shot many enemies without fighting them. Summon a tentacle close to an enemy, but not close enough to damage, they walk closer BAM sneak damage multiplier to deal 430 damage in 1 hit. That's 1 of the 4 or 5 you could constantly summon that revolutionize the way you fight

[gaunt harness]

Of for sure. Which is why I was on dedicated trollstav duty. I really only could spend Eitr on Trolls and Protecc orbs.

[gaunt harness]

I love it! ❤️

It feels like a really nice payoff after struggling for hours!

[royal lily]

The queen didn't hit me the first time I fought her. Very easy fight, especially compared to yagluth. If you cant manage walking around 2 seekers after summoning the queen.... im not attacking you personally and I understand magic is op but im just saying the queen, even though shes one of my favorite bosses, was easy for me

[sonic musk]

I tested it, and you can cheese it and summon infinite vines btw. If you stand on top of a mountain and throw the vines very far, you can visually see them, but they're out of your 'detection range' so the normal programming that tells the vine 'okay, you've been alive for 30 seconds, die now' doesn't trigger and you can stack infinite vines that serve little to no purpose, but you can

[sonic musk]

I'm glad you are a dark souls player and that's good for you. I did not have that experience on the boss before or after, so I don't think it's a Valheim in general thing

[sonic musk]

it is. And I take it everywhere in every biome. It's just too strong

[royal lily]

Never played it, again u can cope but the fight is swing swing roll.

[sonic musk]

thank you mr expert. I appreciate your feedback. I won't be responding anymore, we obviously played 2 different versions of the fight and that's fine. But I won't respond with you being demeaning to me

[royal lily]

Ud think after dying 50 times ud stop being the one explaining things

[gaunt harness]

Why are you being rude？

[quartz basalt]

also would you mind share fighting difficulty?

[royal lily]

Hardcore

[quartz basalt]

Ashlands biggest issue is internal server lag. I encountered package lost - like issue with teleporting enemies and resync with 'server' which sometimes ends up by creating situations where enemy atacks just get skipped and you get outcome of them(instant death out of nowhere) while being the host

[royal lily]

No ur right its too hard to fight the queen melee

[quartz basalt]

sarcasm doesn't make you cool, you know that ?

[royal lily]

Oh no im trying very hard to be