the-water-cooler

[clear ferry]

https://www.reddit.com/r/technology/comments/12gi1wp/a_dramatic_new_epa_rule_will_force_up_to_60_of/

[brazen fable]

I used that PFP pic as my PFP pic for like 2 years lol. I had to do a double take

[clear ferry]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XGoak4ISCPU

I should get tickets to Dimmu at some point

will you joiin me @last cedar ?

[brazen fable]

Wtb hue bridge 3 with MIMO

[last cedar]

Never listened to them! Will have to see 😛

[brazen fable]

Looks like David bowie slipknot and kiss had a love child band

[last cedar]

I cannot disagree 🤣

But that isn't a bad thing really

[last cedar]

https://youtube.com/shorts/nUkpQHmNx0Y?feature=share

[forest edge]

poor cat

[static schooner]

cats put up with a lot

[forest edge]

some. some don't lol

[clear ferry]

https://i.redd.it/cdusf5dqezsa1.jpg

[glacial knot]

more like, barely 30 years ago

[umbral cliff]

Barely 15 years ago

I think I actually recorded to a VHS sooner than I burnt a CD

[forest edge]

wtf does that mean

[umbral cliff]

I recorded onto a VHS sooner to today than I last burnt a CD

[forest edge]

you more recently recorded a vhs than a cd?

[clear ferry]

15øre power now @last cedar

[forest edge]

https://youtube.com/shorts/D7kJx0ZBjeM?feature=share

[clear ferry]

I recorded my first CDR in.. 1997? Then the last one in 2011 i think

I still record some DVDRs due to hpux, one every year roughly

[umbral cliff]

Yes. Didn't have a need for CDs, VHS was how I recorded TV in the early 2010s lol

[clear ferry]

I haven't used a VHS player since 1996 I think, except when digitising some old videos in 2006

[umbral cliff]

I had a dual VHS/DVD player till my parents left singapore in 2012
DVD for purchased movies/ tv shows, VHS to record live TV because it was easy and we had a stack of VHS tapes

[clear ferry]

We've had IPTV since 2006, didn't need to record stuff, and the stuff I didn't have I just downloaded

[forest edge]

you seriously still recorded tv via vhs in 2010?

[clear ferry]

I had 4 suitcases of movies i burned when I left my parents house, threw it all out

[umbral cliff]

We had pay TV in singapore, only paid for SD, was good enough and VHS worked fine

[umbral cliff]

Yes

I didn't have a need to use anything else

And I wasn't going to get my parents to buy a gadget when there was little need

[orchid rose]

[clear ferry]

I've bought my own stuff since I started working at age nine, my mother never accepted my independence

I only used my parents for housing

[forest edge]

were you watching said vhs tapes on non sd tv's?

16:9 vs 4:3

[umbral cliff]

Yeah I legally couldn't work until I was back in aus, and at that point was at boarding school so couldn't work anyway

[umbral cliff]

Yes. You can still get widescreen SD

[clear ferry]

https://tenor.com/view/jamie-private-school-girl-i-am-so-random-i-cant-believe-gif-15382386

I've worked all years of school, except college because there was no jobs in the town i attended

[umbral cliff]

Congrats?

[forest edge]

I just happen to have a dvd/vhs player right next to me. used it a few years ago to turn some old vhs tapes to digital but haven't used vhs to watch off or record on in so long I honestly cannot remember

[umbral cliff]

All I know is I didn't really care when I was younger

[forest edge]

sd content on newer tv's look like ass.. unwatchable

[umbral cliff]

I don't really care by it

Especially content that cannot be HD due to its age

[orchid rose]

Well that depends. Stuff that was captured on film can look really good

[clear ferry]

Just look at blade runner

Fucking boner material in quality

[orchid rose]

Movies tend to look really good because they were made for big screens. TV shows on the other hand will look like ass most of the time

[umbral cliff]

Even TV shows I barely notice, been watching Thunderbirds recently, very much SD but still looks fine to me

[orchid rose]

VHS was apparently 335*576 resolution

[clear ferry]

Sounds right

[last cedar]

That is really damn nice tbh, shame it has been 1000 öre not so long ago 🤣

[last cedar]

PAL is 576 lines, NTSC had 480 iirc

[orchid rose]

yes

[clear ferry]

Pal superior as always

[umbral cliff]

PAL always the better option

[orchid rose]

well NTSC was 30Hz and PAL 25Hz so it depends

[last cedar]

Yes, because it was an abreviation of || personal arse licker ||

[orchid rose]

Never Twice the Same Color

[clear ferry]

All of my answers were too dirty for this channel

[last cedar]

Takes me back to being about 6 years old and making up dirty abreviations for anything and everything

[forest edge]

lol pal

[clear ferry]

I used to hang in an irc channel that did abbreviations for years, you would submit your answer and all would vote anonymously, i was in the top ten leaderboard for years

[last cedar]

I am happy that the HD world brought around a small amount of joy when it came to standards of 720p60 and 1080i50, but then came progressive scan on 1080 too, and I think 4K is fairly standard now...

So some moron invented 3 different hdr standards, just to make things shit again

But I am NOT bitter

[clear ferry]

I've had 4k display since 2016, still download TV in 1080 and let it upscale, good enough

Movies and anime, 4k

[orchid rose]

Are European blurays 24 or 25fps these days?

[last cedar]

Same here

[forest edge]

I actually prefered 480p over 1080i

1080i always looked crappier imo

[last cedar]

I think it 23.976 just because 🤣

[clear ferry]

Probably math

Yuck

[last cedar]

Starting to get a better understanding why you don't like raccoons now 😄

[forest edge]

well the only tv i had that only had 1080i and not 1080p was a 4:3 wega lol

[orchid rose]

With proper deinterlacing 1080i can look really good. It's a clever way to save half the bandwidth

[clear ferry]

Mostly all live broadcasting is 1080 still, which is really annoying in the age of broadband, I swear Norwegian TV still uses 720, it looks horrible

[last cedar]

I believe the actual screens scan every line anyway, so 1080i never looked that bad in my eyes

1080p is just convenient

[forest edge]

with everything auto upscaling shit be all over the damn place

[last cedar]

I am spoilt with my shield and oled I guess!

[orchid rose]

Viaplay that costs 45€/mo streams sports at 720p50. The Viasat TV channels I think are 1080i

[forest edge]

dosen't matter. depending on what your viewing it's likely being upscaled at some point

[clear ferry]

Lol that's pathetic

[orchid rose]

Yeah, that's what happens when you have no competition

[umbral cliff]

We can stream sports for $10/month in 1080p lol
Or free to air for 1080i

Also no competition

[orchid rose]

feelsbadman 😦

[forest edge]

such a weird location for a tv

[orchid rose]

https://www.reddit.com/r/TVTooHigh/

[clear ferry]

Perfect height out of reach for kids, and with the distance it is only a small tilt upwards

[forest edge]

holy shit.. i'd rather just not watch tv than endure trying to watch shit like that lol

[clear ferry]

It's maybe 15cm too high at worst

My 4 year old is as tall as a 6 year old, she barely clears the corner

So it is roughly 110cm off the ground

[forest edge]

if you have to recline back just to keep your neck from hurting while you watch tv then it's too high by far

my tv in this room i use for watching cctv cameras is 106cm off the ground and i cannot stand to watch it for too long sitting upright in an office chair

[orchid rose]

imo the correct height is when the middle of the screen is roughly at eye level when looking directly at the screen. Larger screens can be a bit higher than that or it will look weird

[clear ferry]

77" club

So I'm just right

[orchid rose]

when it's high the geometry is all weird

my 92" screen is 65cm off the floor and it's too high

[clear ferry]

You weird

[orchid rose]

no, I'm right

[clear ferry]

Might be left

[forest edge]

you sit on the floor?

[clear ferry]

I'm not looking forward to my De Quarvaine surgery, but at least I live in a country where I won't be bankrupt from it

[forest edge]

just kidding, my 55" upstairs is almost 3ft off the ground

[clear ferry]

https://tenor.com/view/funnyeaster-letsparty-gif-21015928

[orchid rose]

my eye level is apparently 105cm off the floor and the middle of the screen is 122cm off and it feels too high

[forest edge]

any lower and your own reclined feet would block the bottom part of the tv

[orchid rose]

I prefer to sit pretty straight so ymmv if you like to lean back a bit. I can imagine it would be quite uncomfortable then to have the screen that low

[forest edge]

just get vr instead of a tv

[orchid rose]

VR resolution is too low but I've watched some stuff in a VR theater and it's pretty fun

[forest edge]

isn't latest vr like 4k?

[orchid rose]

probably but the the virtual screen you watch is only part of the image they cover

[forest edge]

not sure what you mean

[orchid rose]

let me see if I can find a good example screenshot

Well I couldn't so this will do. What I mean is that a lot of that resolution is used to render all the stuff that isn't on the screen

[forest edge]

yea but it dosen't have to be like that

thats just software

[orchid rose]

No it needs to be like that since it has to be a rectangular image

if you just fill the whole FOV with the actual movie it would look extremely weird

also there's an additional problem with most VR headsets that the horizontal field of view is actually pretty limited at somewhere around 80-100 degrees and the edges are extremely blurry due to how the lenses work

[forest edge]

no idea. never got to use vr yet. most the shit I see about watching tv shows some social interaction thing that has multiple people sit in like a vertual movie theater etc

but image using black bars to make the image look normal would work too

hell tv content sometimes shows black bars on the tv

[orchid rose]

The screenshot above is from a software called Bigscreen. There are different types of those "theaters" you can choose from and iirc one is just a black background with a screen. You can also throw tomatoes or popcorn at other people watching the movie

It's surprisingly fun sometimes but my Rift S has such a low resolution that I rarely use it

[forest edge]

i would image something fixed though.. so when you turn your head your not looking away from the virtual tv etc

[orchid rose]

yeah the projected image is fixed in place so you can move around and it stays in same place

oh and there's also a problem with how the framerates work since the movie is 24Hz and the headset is not so it will look choppy

[forest edge]

i think modren vr is closer to 100 now

for gaming..

[orchid rose]

Mine is only 80Hz which is the bare minimum for VR, but the problem is that it needs to be a multiple of 24Hz and be synced to work properly which I don't think is possible with how the rendering works with VR headsets

and even if it was synced properly for 24fps movies, it wouldn't be for 50fps sports for example

[forest edge]

I didn't think it was any diffrent than pc monitors

[orchid rose]

You need to change the refresh rate on PC monitors as well to have smooth playback and it needs proper vsync

Most people won't care about that though

[forest edge]

i don't

I watch our tv on my monitor from time to time, no issues

no change or adjustment or anything

maybe one day i'll pick up a vr set so I can fully understand all you mean

but then by then, they will probably have sets out just for watching tv lol

[orchid rose]

before VR became a big thing I remember Sony used to have glasses with oled screens that would be just like watching a big screen. I never tried those so I don't know how that would feel like compared to VR

[late gate]

I have tried unraid and truenas on a server now, and cant say I am impressed over truenas and its forced k8 usage. unraid seem to be better at that, and now supports zfs.

[clear ferry]

Well, unraid only does lxc still?

[late gate]

No docker and vm

[clear ferry]

Oh right

I'm thinking of proxmox

Unraid is fine if you want a pay for solution

[late gate]

Yeah I have a license though so already paid

[late gate]

Its good and back things about all of them. truenas is good at options in the GUI like scripts for start/stop, userid on docker etc, but I dont like the forced kubernetes where I have no control. They run docker in docker. Its also great that its running debian. Unraid got good hardware support, native docker and now zfs, but I dont like everything is running as root

[clear ferry]

@last cedar

[clear ferry]

And proprietary raid system

[last cedar]

https://tenor.com/view/gordon-ramsay-piss-off-chef-master-chef-hells-kitchen-gif-10154743

[finite atlas]

free energy is the best one

[clear ferry]

Solar is flipping you off

[finite atlas]

https://tenor.com/view/its-free-real-sate-gif-7215175

With the prices we otherwise would have to pay in germany... solar is turning me on

[clear ferry]

My average is down by 25kwh per day after winter

I was also on vacation from the 4th to the 6th

[finite atlas]

one can see

i'm still surprised by how much you consume

we barely use 14kWh

and in the last two days, i used my hairdryer to warm up my room

[clear ferry]

One heat pump

Four electric ovens

Washer and dryer go almost every day

Electric cooking

All lighting

Rack that pulls 1000w average currently

Ev charging

Soon i will turn on two more heat pumps

[prisma briar]

Huh, moved my Zigbee controller ~120ft and only had one door sensor go offline from it. I expected more issues.

[clear ferry]

That's the joy of mesh

Coordinator placement shouldn't matter with a decent mesh

[prisma briar]

I expected to have to repair at least a couple routers.

[clear ferry]

They should find new paths unless they are made of shite and Osram

[prisma briar]

I didn't cheap out on my Zigbee junk but the general advice I see here is whenever it's moved everything needs re-paired. This was the first time I'd moved it more than 5 feet or so.

[clear ferry]

Only stuff I ever had issues with was aqara door sensors, if the parent died

[glacial knot]

Is ledvance bad? 🤔 the only ones that are stupid in my setup are the Aqara battery powered ones

yea, they don't mesh properly =.= they want to stay on their router

[clear ferry]

First gen Osram was shite

Second gen was fine afaik

[glacial knot]

No idea what my ledstrips are.
Their PIR sucked though, that much I remember

I think my set of 4 zigbee sockets is ledvance. They work. And are most of my routers

[prisma briar]

Most of my routers are hue bulbs

[glacial knot]

I have my lights on the hue, and everything else on z2m

[prisma briar]

I've got a couple smart outlets too, idk what brand they are, they were some ebay special.

[glacial knot]

I should merge the meshes at some point and deprecate the hue, but that's effort

[prisma briar]

I don't use my hue bridge, I use zha for everything.

I used my hue bridge for like a week before I replaced it, heh

[glacial knot]

I don't even notice which mesh which stuff is on, since they are both controlled entirely from within HA

[last cedar]

Omg you have lights in Noway?

[last cedar]

YEAH

[hollow glacier]

Lol

[clear ferry]

🐻 ly

[hollow glacier]

Teddyly?

[clear ferry]

➡️ 2️⃣ 🐻 🦾 🦾

[glacial knot]

arrow two teddy biceps biceps?

[clear ferry]

JA

[shadow prawn]

No german pls

[glacial knot]

9

[clear ferry]

https://tenor.com/view/rammstein-till-lindemann-gif-10414001

[clear ferry]

Buick Roadmaster must be the most American car I've ever seen, and I would buy one

[glacial knot]

soo, ordered a robo mop+vacuum. Let's see if I regret the choice (where regret results in sending it back, so no real regrets)

[forest edge]

the wagon or sadan?

[brazen fable]

Same here

They work well enough most of the time

[forest edge]

@tidal bronze you still with us man? the world is getting crazier and crazier and want to make sure the homeless haven't drove you from your own home yet

[tidal bronze]

Lol still around. Up in Maine.

[unreal palm]

I found a creative way to monitor the downstairs computer while I'm working upstairs

[static schooner]

Did you also invent a Time Machine?

[unreal palm]

Lol!

Yes I'm just updating to the newest apple OS.

[clear ferry]

Is that the mac which had a handle? So it could double as a boat anchor

[unreal palm]

Haha yes it is. It’s a tray loading iMac G3

I’ve been enjoying Mac OS 9 on it lately, and now I’m trying to dual boot it with OSX Panther. And oh my god… installing an OS from CDs takes FOREVER

[clear ferry]

I've installed windows 95 from floppy

And halfway in one was broken

;_;

[unreal palm]

Oh nooooo

[unreal palm]

What do you even do at that point? Are you basically forced to give up?

[clear ferry]

no I just went to a friend an copied that floppy

https://tenor.com/t0iL.gif

[finite atlas]

that weird save icon? i can copy that too grandpa

[clear ferry]

https://tenor.com/0Rj6.gif

[last cedar]

https://images-ext-2.discordapp.net/external/AZfLUy9xxlDIwKnQjIKtenD2ZHy6lsuG3qMe-qy6GBI/https/i.imgur.com/oJSU27E.png

[clear ferry]

no need to bring the HAOS users into this!

[last cedar]

Just gonna have a nap, back later

[forest edge]

gross

[dusky plank]

import json
from pyflightdata import FlightData
from google_images_download import google_images_download

this is going to be interesting

[forest edge]

flight radar is scary

why would you want something that keeps reminding you of just how much shit is above your head

[dusky plank]

I'm just going to track the rich and politicians, just like that guy who tracks elon's plane

[forest edge]

ah trying to get on one of those high risk lists huh

[dusky plank]

high risk for what? 😂

[forest edge]

you know those watch lists

every country has their organization it's not just us american's who get spied on lol

[dusky plank]

yeah, if they go that far for a guy who just tracks planes then it shall be so lol
wcpgw

on the other hand it is austria and our intelligence services watch a vienna prisoner with enough criminal records buy weapons in slovenia and shoot people a month later
so who cares

[clear ferry]

Considering the US spies on its allies and doesn't even admit it when they are found, you'll be fine

[glacial knot]

What about HAk8s?

[clear ferry]

https://tenor.com/bNBIH.gif

[late wagon]

Does anyone know if the addon Emulate Hue still works??
I lost more than a day trying to make this work and not sure why it doesn't. I freed the port 80, I can connect. But basically everything that I try to do in Hue Essentials app, I get an error message. Can someone please help me?

[young sigil]

Try #add-ons-archived

Just shit-posts and raccoons here.

[clear ferry]

And important stuff

[forest edge]

https://youtu.be/en2ux_UbezI

[low harness]

Huh. I decided to finally print an upgrade part for my printer that I’ve been thinking of for a while, so I downloaded and printed it, mounted the hardware… and when I went to install it the same part was already there…

[umbral cliff]

Does the thought of a plane above you scare you

[forest edge]

have you looked at how many planes and satellites are above you?

[forest edge]

spool holder? you just didn't notice it before cause the spool you used to create the new one was hiding the old?

[umbral cliff]

Yes, its cool

[forest edge]

all fun and games till one lands on your home

[orchid rose]

I imagine the chances of that happening are near zero

https://tenor.com/view/donnie-darko-jake-gyllenhaal-gif-9692302

[static schooner]

Lol, was thinking of the same thing

Talk about a movie that I had to watch like 5 times to start to understand 🙂

[orchid rose]

Great movie with a great ending scene

[static schooner]

I've forgotten almost everything, so now I need to watch it 5 more times 🙂

[clear ferry]

Twin peaks is also great, i understand more every time I watch it

[orchid rose]

The Return?

[static schooner]

I think drugs are required to fully understand the latter parts of Twin Peaks

I read that they literally learned to say their lines backward in those scenes - they didn't just run the audio backward

[orchid rose]

Lynch is a bit mad in a very good way. Too bad he doesn't focus on filmmaking these days

The Return was incredible

That final scene still gives me creeps

[static schooner]

I think I gave up halfway through. Maybe I need to watch the whole thing straight through

I kinda lost the thread once they identified Laura's killer

the first season was great

[orchid rose]

If you rewatch the whole thing you can skip most of the season 2

[static schooner]

yeah, that's where I think it lost me

it started to meander and I couldn't figure out where they were going...

[orchid rose]

Lynch left the production and it kinda went off the rails for a while until he came back for the last two (?) episodes and fixed it

The movie is great too and much closer to the third season than the first two seasons were

[static schooner]

right, that too.

it's all so delightfully 80s/90s in production

[orchid rose]

It's supposed to be a homage to or sometimes parody of soap operas

The movie is a lot more serious and I don't even know how to describe the return

[static schooner]

I look forward to coming to a meeting where the table is covered in donuts 🙂

https://tenor.com/view/twinpeaks-gif-8534057

[orchid rose]

with a damn good cup of coffee I hope

[clear ferry]

https://tenor.com/view/twinpeaks-plotting-evil-plan-rubbing-hands-smiling-gif-7785041

[forest edge]

https://media.tenor.com/snHRkMfgd08AAAAC/swayzebegs-chonky.gif

[gray hill]

anyone make a recommendation for a KVM that supports 2 monitors and will keep them "connected" to the computers when they're switched?

[late gate]

Use the built amt Isnt that better? @gray hill

[gray hill]

amt?

[late gate]

https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/architecture-and-technology/intel-active-management-technology.html

Lots of cpu support it

[clear ferry]

People still use kvms?

[late gate]

On my msi bios they removed amt completely. That’s shit. Amt might suck, but at least the possibility to check something remotely is worth a bit

[clear ferry]

I have never used AMT in my life, but I have used proper OOBM for close to 20 years

[fallow karma]

I rediscovered that i still got a 3D printer

And it kinda works

It still runs good old marlin 1.x , Arduino mega and ramps, but i've got brand new SKR board 24V supply and other stuff to upgrade it

It hasn't run about 3 years , but runs just fine

[clear ferry]

The king of Poland returns!

[dusky plank]

I did not know that you can pack multiple videos into a single mp4

creeped me out for a bit

you click one file and 2 vlc windows open with different videos

[late gate]

On the optiplex its not much different than ilo and such. Still have full control over start, stop, bios, consol and such

[steel crag]

.mp4 is only a container, just like .mkv

[dusky plank]

yeah I knew that you can pack in multiple streams, but whole different videos is weird

[steel crag]

yeah I'd agree it's less common for sure

but promotional videos etc they often do that type of thing

you can even include still photos

[static schooner]

Here's some bonus porn with your Teletubbies...

[steel crag]

teletubby pron ? no thanks

[static schooner]

I didn't say "bonus porn of your Teletubbies.." 🙂

[steel crag]

semantics

[clear ferry]

DIPSY

https://open.spotify.com/track/5LtkHLAzggQCeIJ2o54QHF?si=0847eaa9c0594e70

[clear ferry]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_K0K3jVJnA

Yogi Lang has one of the most soothing voices I've heard in a while, glad I discovered RPWL

[forest edge]

sounds like a peter gabriel rip off

[inner lava]

Heya! Has someone by any change got a working Epever solar charger setup reading out data via a ESP? Want to do something like this for an entirely off-grid system, found a project for it but the Github page seems to be dead for quite a bit now. Not sure if it's still current and all.

[steel crag]

!topic

[silent dove]

The topic of this channel is:

There's no support for Home Assistant here - please look at the other channels for that. If you can't work out which is relevant, start in #general-archived.

If it's a question about the HA Yellow see #yellow-archived, and #330990055533576204 for the Blue. Install related problems go to your Installation Method channel.

No politics, religion, or any other obviously contentious topics! Please ensure you've read the Code of Conduct (https://www.home-assistant.io/code_of_conduct/), and #rules.

If you found this server and want to know what it's about, start with the web site: https://www.home-assistant.io/

Remember when reporting spam to include a screenshot of the spam and the user's handle (eg @spammer#123)

[late gate]

Do any of you use TrueNAS scale and know if the kubernites they use on "docker" is capable of custom IP pr container/pod? Or if the "third party" docker-compose can do it?

[clear ferry]

docker-compose is not supported, and will stop functioning

if you want to do anything non standard, don't run truenas

afaik it does not support macvlan or serviceip if that is what you are asking

also, you probably don't need what you think you need

[prisma briar]

Why not just set up a normal Linux distro and share out your drives from it? TrueNAS doesn't really add anything asides from simplicity

[clear ferry]

It adds a fancy gui that is hard to navigate

[prisma briar]

iscsi, nfs, smb, they're all pretty easy to set up CLI

[clear ferry]

targetcli is actually pretty awesome

[forest edge]

https://youtu.be/eqv1nt--H-0?t=12

[prisma briar]

At one point I had Ceph exposing volumes over iscsi and used ipxe initializing the iscsi connection then passing off to windows to boot my desktop into Windows bare metal from Ceph. That was pretty cool.

MS kinda quit supporting that feature around W10's release though so it was a pita to get it running on the latest releases.

[clear ferry]

Eh, it is pretty nische anyway, i can count on one hand the number of setups I've ever seen that pxe boot windows the last two decades

Linux, oh yes, windows, that's for weirdos

[prisma briar]

I normally just ran Windows in a VM with my GPU passed through but had the bare metal boot set up so I could play games that had overzealous anticheats that freaked out about VMs.

Funny thing, Xbox Gamepass games refuse to install to local striped dynamic disks on Windows as unsupported, but will happily install to an iscsi volume.

[clear ferry]

It probably has something to do with dynamic disks being very unpredictable in performance wheras an iscsi volume is just a regular lun indistinguishable from any other drive

I guess windows writes it is a dynamic disk in the header somewhere

[brazen fable]

I refuse to play/buy those games

Fuck giving vidya games ring 0 access

[prisma briar]

Worrying about that stuff over having fun never made sense to me.

It's not like my gaming PC has anything particularly sensitive on it

[clear ferry]

I haven't gamed on a desktop since 2015 anyway

[prisma briar]

I got a VR headset a few months ago and have been playing through a bunch of new to me games on it

My gaming PC is also my livingroom/theater PC

I just finished playing through Outer Wilds with a VR mod

[clear ferry]

I thought about a vr headset for the ps5

But fuck it's expensive

[prisma briar]

Yea, I spent a decent amount on my setup. I'm not surprised it's still rather niche.

I wish it was more mainstream so there'd be more content

The few experiences where VR shines it's really fun but most VR games are either lazy/small games or shoddy ports of flatscreen games that don't take advantage of VR nearly as much as they could.

[clear ferry]

First VR system I tried was in 94 or 95

It's come a long way since

[prisma briar]

I always wanted one of those to play Descent with

Finally got to try it on my new one though

[clear ferry]

AR is where it is though, we have a datacenter with AR, where you can call a tech onsite and throw images and spreadsheets up on the walls around him, and draw on the servers etc to tell them what to do

[prisma briar]

That one AR thing that Ubiquiti has is really neat too

Where you point a camera at the switch and it shows you the device on every port

[clear ferry]

That's pretty interesting

Although would get cluttered very fast

Especially with 96+ ports

[prisma briar]

Yea, it'd also require tight record keeping

Which for a DC is norm but for a home user is probably annoying

[clear ferry]

Cmdb baby

Screw home users

[prisma briar]

We use Netbox for ours

[clear ferry]

Never seen that one

[prisma briar]

It works alright. I haven't really used any others to compare to.

We were using an in-house solution before that didn't include port mappings but that was years ago.

[clear ferry]

With modern SDN stuff it is usually self contained

I hate ACI

But it does work well for that

Nsx-t will keep track of most of it inside the hypervisors at least

[prisma briar]

Our newest stuff is using SDN but most of our existing stuff is just using vlans.

But we also have enough IPs to just give everything an external IP.

[clear ferry]

That's easy, just deploy ipv6 already

Give back those ipv4s

[prisma briar]

We only really use internal IPs for things like SAN and more sensitive servers, the rest we use external IPs with firewall rules.

But I'm at a webhost so most of the servers I manage are exposed by necessity.

[clear ferry]

https://tenor.com/view/eww-david-rose-david-dan-levy-schitts-creek-gif-20792692

[prisma briar]

I mostly deal with our vps platforms; making/maintaining images, setting up new servers, managing the storage and hypervisor, that fun stuff. I do deal with other stuff a fair bit though.

[orchid rose]

Is AR anywhere near where it would have real world use? I really think that'll be the major breakthrough in that type of tech but for now it seems like VR offers a lot more

the AR port stuff is cool though, but it's pretty niche

I'm thinking more in the scale of wearing some sort of a headset

[clear ferry]

Yes

Hololens works flawlessly

I've used it

Great resolution

And things you draw stick to items, so if you leave the room you can see it through the wall

[orchid rose]

Okayyyyy, so what's the use case here?

Also the FOV on that thing is extremely low iirc

[clear ferry]

Datacenter maintenance

Hands and eyes in remote locations

[static schooner]

robots roving around a datacenter yanking cables

[clear ferry]

You jest, but I was part of setting up an automation system 15 years ago that custom made drug prescriptions, and robots went and picked them up and delivered them when they were manufactured

[mellow parcel]

sounds like a normal amazon day

[finite atlas]

That really is for someone with chest hair :D

[finite atlas]

💩

[forest edge]

https://youtu.be/C3w3gRuJj6A

[noble bridge]

Hello guys! I'm looking to replace my synology surveillance station with an open source alternative on a dedicated thin client. Is there a current gold standard? I have a thing for modern UI and UX paired with good maintainability. I'd also really prefer to run linux over windows for any kind of server.

[clear ferry]

I really enjoy ipv6 network planning

Also, Dylan + Dead is amazeballs https://open.spotify.com/track/4SCJH07MVCOOCxDkOF2xZG?si=42eb6da186b54a09

[clever mortar]

That's an interesting approach

Makes sense though

[clear ferry]

It also makes sense to do VLAN based mapping per subnet

which is what I've done mostly for the last decade

but it is limited in ipv4 with only 0-255

[clever mortar]

Anything that makes it easier to find problem devices is good

[clear ferry]

This training is great, I've learned more in 3 days so far about ipv6 than I did in 22 years of tinkering with it

[clever mortar]

Who's the course provider?

[clear ferry]

Fast Lane

Never had them before, but great instructor

their lab environment has much to be desired and no native linux client (but they have osx client) but overall good labbing, with little issues

https://www.flane.co.uk/course/fl-ipv6fun

Reminds me, I still have a lot of vmware and microsoft vouchers

I should book some new certifications

[dusky plank]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KCzwyFHSMdY

[stark rampart]

What people can do on HA what they can’t in for example homey pro? I have never used homey pro or other commercial system, so I don’t have this experience.

This is not theoretical question about open source, but question about smart home experience.

[clever mortar]

Homey Pro isn't launched yet 😛

[stark rampart]

Right, so vs homey with imagination it is in home instead of cloud 🙂

Like more or less we know what to expect from homey pro as a hardware.

[clever mortar]

Mostly it's about flexibility - the range of things it can be integrated withh

[stark rampart]

Can you give real live example?

[clever mortar]

HA has 2,447 native integrations, and many more custom components

Plus all the Zigbee, Z-Wave, Thread, and Matter devices

Plus things like Frigate

[stark rampart]

Sounds equally

I don’t know Frigate

[clever mortar]

Basically, pick the things you want to integrate with and see what supports them

[stark rampart]

I looks like a extremely complex flow and I will fail with that anyway

[clever mortar]

And if they have a local or cloud API then with Home Assistant it's possible to add support if it doesn't have it already - that's rarely the case with commercial platforms

[stark rampart]

I see it more like choice homey pro vs HA

[clever mortar]

[stark rampart]

100% without integration between

But I can’t answer myself what I will miss in homey what I can do in HA

I guess only one way is to buy and try both

[clever mortar]

I just have to look at what Homey supports to know that I couldn't switch, too many of my devices wouldn't work

[glacial knot]

Big advantage for me that I've not seen with most competitors is the local integrations
Nothing needs to route via a cloud service if you don't want to
While others just integrate with a few cloud endpoints, even if some of the integrations run in your home

[stark rampart]

Homey pro work locally

[glacial knot]

The point is about how they integrate with other services
Do they extract local access tokens for things like Roomba? Or just hit their api in the cloud?

[stark rampart]

I don’t know. This is in pre order phase

And even in HA I am very not satisfied with roomba, because it miss all features which I need to use to vacuuming

Native app has order of rooms for vacuuming etc

At least when I was trying last time

[glacial knot]

🤷 mine doesn't support that either way
And if it did and I wanted to use it, I'd add the support

[stark rampart]

What do you mean by add the support?

I don’t even know if it is possible to code

[stark rampart]

So the only one argument is integration with devices which you want to use?

Well I see one disadvantage: if HA fail it can be fast replaced by new HA. If homey pro fail it depends how fast they will deliver new one.

And for sure you don’t want to keep 2 in home because it is expensive

[clear ferry]

you can ask @late gate about how shitty homey experience is

[late gate]

gagging

[clear ferry]

he has thrown his out at least twice I think

😄

[late gate]

three times :p

[stark rampart]

I am listening

[late gate]

its absolutely horrible. yes its an ok UI, but all the apps are just third party and nothing is guaranteed. it also got big issues with zigbee/zwave and its just an overpriced raspberry. the older ones are even more of a ripoff on the hardware. the dashboard is also extremely limited

[stark rampart]

Can you give more precise examples?

What you miss in homey what you have in HA?

[clear ferry]

had a collegue of mine who has a homey, he was using a third party integration that got disabled by homey and his products stopped working, great experience 😄

he is currently moving to HA

[stark rampart]

Do you know the reason?

[clear ferry]

think they deemed it not maintained

@late gate probably know the processes they have

[late gate]

yeah like they sold their "bridge" series. to this day the product is just a brick

they used forever to just release zigbee3 and then their hardware started to break

also how release a zigbee product with 2.4ghz wifi as the only option?

[clear ferry]

the cost of the homey is also 8x comparable hardware from off the shelf, so it is quite a premium price for a locked down environment

putting 2x 2.4ghz radios in a single box, with very little spacing is also a horrible idea

[late gate]

yeah, also people have to put in a nightly reboot just to not let all the memory leaks go to bad

[stark rampart]

I know. Just was thinking if can save my time vs HA, but buying early version sounds risky. It is true.

[late gate]

I think people look at HA as 3 years ago. HA is not hard anymore, and you almost do not need to touch any source code

[stark rampart]

HA took a lot of time, but it works.

[late gate]

its point and click

[clever mortar]

Commercial products aren't always better than open source

Some are pretty mature, but you're looking at the longer standing options, not the newcomers, and even those mature ones have issues

[stark rampart]

I don’t say they are. It always depends

[clear ferry]

Any monkey with eyes can use HA these days, most of the stuff is UI based, even though I still prefer doing yaml where possible

[late gate]

remember 99% of the "apps" for homey is NOT commercial and are NOT supported by homey

[stark rampart]

Well I think after remembering it is beta version I feel convinced to setup HA once more.

[clear ferry]

HA is also stable enough that my wife even asks me to automate and build stuff

don't think @late gate ever had that with homey

😄

😄

[dusky plank]

you need to set it up multiple times? 🤨

[clear ferry]

[late gate]

Homey was a WAF approval with the house boss, but when alexa use 5-10 minutes to reply cause of the crappy hardware to just forward a voice request it was demanded out of the house

[stark rampart]

Right now I have kind of sandbox version. But soon I hope I will buy a house and I plan to do it very serious.

[late gate]

• 5-10 seconds

and when you start installing like 10 apps in homey it really start to go slow

so slow you have to put in pause in zwave automations to let zwave catch up

[clear ferry]

its like a rpi3 in hardware isn't it ?

[late gate]

in the original ones its even older

[clear ferry]

noice

[late gate]

we talk about pre pi1

[stark rampart]

I will probably go with HA and dell weyse 5070 or intel NUC then. Although I think it is overkill.

[clear ferry]

A mini computer is minimum imo

a pi is deemed to go to hell

at some point

[late gate]

I tried to run it on Yellow now since I got it, and I can say I rather go back to the NUC

[clear ferry]

poor storage, poor power

[glacial knot]

Why would your wife ask Aleks to automate stuff? 🤔

[clear ferry]

yellow is a vague upgrade from a pi because of the nvme, but no thanks, I'll let the weirdos keep their yellows

[clear ferry]

https://tenor.com/yGjy.gif

[stark rampart]

Dell wyse 5070 as alternative doesn’t have fan

[late gate]

The yellow is great for starters, but I notice the performance difference

in a negative way from the nux

and the nuc is just an i3 6th gen

[clear ferry]

lots of great aliexpress computers fanless for $100~

[stark rampart]

yeah but besides of that it has also other parts good. But I am totally not an expert about cheap servers.

[late gate]

no need for a server at all

just a cheap computer

you really notice it on reponsiveness and startup / reload times

[stark rampart]

I call it server, because purpose make a difference

[late gate]

I have tried them all, homey, smartthings, futurehome, fibaro, homseer, homey etc, and I always went back to HA, even at the time where HA was quite hard to use

Now its so easy, that I got the new homey delivered as a promo, and I sold it the same day without opening the pack

[stark rampart]

But if it works on rpi, then it will work in dell wyse 5070 for sure. At least this is my expectation:)

Do you use HAOS / docker compose / ?

[clear ferry]

I prefer systems that are stable and let me do what I want

so docker based install, no haos nonsense

[stark rampart]

I use docker compose right now, but I don’t know if it make sense after migrate to dedicated device only for HA

[clear ferry]

I'd say no

if you are comforable with docker, run docker

[stark rampart]

Sounds a little like overkill but I have to find a way for gitops or solve it with docker compose

I didn’t research this part yet

[clear ferry]

you can do anything you want

but... some stuff shouldn't be done

[stark rampart]

Good words 🙂

[clear ferry]

Side effect of working with 100% uptime stuff, I'm critical about what should be automated

😄

[stark rampart]

I would say on opposite way heh. But finding right solution take years or you have to wait years for someone to invent it 😉

Always both

[glacial knot]

Every push should go live the moment the server repo is updated!

[clear ferry]

https://tenor.com/bzoTh.gif

[umbral cliff]

Just test everything in prod

[clear ferry]

when you work with customers that lose their boat docking slot and have to wait 14 days for a new one, or have 3000 trucks that stop whenever you halt a system, or just have 5 consultants that cost $2500 per hour sit and wait while you fix something

#thatfeeling

[umbral cliff]

The last part, you talking about government there lol

[clear ferry]

no, oil and gas

[stark rampart]

Still I vote for cicd

[clear ferry]

cicd has its uses, that use is not something I rely on for my house to function

[stark rampart]

Yeah it can be hard to make it work with HA, because it is not how HA works, but I didn’t try yet

[clear ferry]

I keep my stuff monitored 24\7 anyway, I just do updates every 14 days or when there are explicit needs

[finite atlas]

i like rolling release linux distros

no need for me to update them constantly manually

[stark rampart]

I just like to have source of true in git repo

[glacial knot]

Why aren't you one of those consultants? 🤔

[clear ferry]

suse tumbleweed is great, but it can be cumbersome

[finite atlas]

clear linux is great too

[clear ferry]

because I have no interest in working with a limited set of stuff, nor do I have any education 😄 I'll happily enjoy my $250 per hour cost to customers and $80 to pocket per hour to sit home and look smart

[clear ferry]

https://tenor.com/view/mr-mc-mahon-ggez-moneh-mrmcmahon-gif-22008643

every week I see emails about "printing not working" "wireless not working" "coffee machine broken" from the office

meanwhile I just sit at home

with working printers

working internet

working coffee

[stark rampart]

Out of my curiosity, do you live in US?

[clear ferry]

thankfully no

[stark rampart]

But work with companies based in US?

*directly

[clear ferry]

I work with collegues in the US, and sometimes end customers in the US in collaboration with those collegues, but mostly europe based

[stark rampart]

EU pay 80$/h?

[clear ferry]

and more yes

but I never said EU

that is an american term for europe, that doesn't fit with european term EU

[stark rampart]

Do you want to extend where are you located and companies from which countries pay 80$/h?

[clear ferry]

I had a friend who worked in oil automation, he did roughly $150 per hour into pocket 😄 but with 250 travel days a year, I'm not interested inthat

Norway easily pays that

sweden too probably

and denmark

UK probably too

wouldn't put it past germany and france either

[stark rampart]

Interesting. Although last time when I was tried with europe… it was years ago.

Maybe things have changed

[clear ferry]

Not much

[stark rampart]

But for sure I do different job too

[clear ferry]

Scandinavia has always been high paying

[stark rampart]

Oh but to be clear I mean only remote work without traveling

[clear ferry]

That changed with covid

We are remaining wfh

While Us based employees are forced back into the office

I've always been 40-50% WFH, but now I'm closer to 100%

At worst i leave the house every two weeks

[stark rampart]

Hmm I have to try next time with Europe too

But at least in the past US always proposed much more, than EU

But much harder to get a job from EU

[clear ferry]

We also have the benefit of free healthcare

And free school

And child care

[stark rampart]

For me situation is different, because I live in Poland. So I am always not in the country for I work.

*country of company

Living in UK is different story

[forest edge]

seems like a bad year to visit france

[last cedar]

Just got a single aqara water leak detector

Very impressed!

Totally broke my house wifi and zigbee (guessing that I didn't set a channel on wifi... bloody idiot) during pairing, 2nd time was a charm though

[mellow parcel]

or just live in a noisy apartment complex

[clear ferry]

Did you pee on it to test it yet @last cedar ?

[last cedar]

What other way is there to test it?

[clear ferry]

Insertion

[midnight leaf]

Hi

I'm currently working on an IoT kind of project (RFID data).
I have a digital twin for every RFID reader running and was wondering if it's a better approach to just send the current state to a message broker OR send specific events to the message broker (Tag Seen, Tag Unseen, ..)?

[clever mortar]

Personally, I'd sent events to the broker

[midnight leaf]

That's the way I'm approaching it right now. Thought to ask here since Home Assistant is probably working with a lot of events.

[clever mortar]

https://www.home-assistant.io/docs/configuration/events/

[midnight leaf]

Good, else it might become to much of a data stream in my opinion.

[midnight leaf]

Oh nice, never seen this page. Will check it out right now. It's both personal interest but also for my developer job.

So for all the devices in Home Assistant (talking about state). It will only notify if the state changes, not repeating state?

[clever mortar]

That's how it works

This happened not this is still happening

[midnight leaf]

Good to know. Seems like I'm doing it the right way then. Though I need to optimise some stuff

I'm working with beam forming antenna's (28 beams per antenna) and time of flight sensors as well.

Have to do some processing to get rid of ghost beams too

Thanks for the help @clever mortar

[late gate]

Psa! Be careful updating to .4 - doesn’t seem to like my hardware at least

[mellow parcel]

hardware type?

[clear ferry]

Probably yellow

[mellow parcel]

gotta buy more ram for my mini server...

[late gate]

Yeah yellow

It deleted .storage during update

Will move back to nuc asap

[clear ferry]

Lol

Long live docker compose and proper snapshots

[late gate]

Yeah I will migrate too

Got a 12th gen I7 with dual 2.5g ethernet for 300 bucks I was thinking the use for plex

[low harness]

Windows 11 keeps delivering.
I just plugged in my wifes canon printer. Just plugged in the USB cord.
And it automatically installs some "Canon Printer Utility". Doesn't ask. Just opens up the app store and boom! It's installed.

So I sigh and open it up. And it doesn't even recognize the printer!

[forest edge]

must be a counterfeit printer then...

[forest edge]

found @last cedar https://www.tiktok.com/@ari.ant1cs/video/7220160280381230378

the REAL one..

[dusky plank]

when you geoblock don't forget to not only whitelist the country on Cloudflare but also OpnSense How do I know? yeah, take a guess

[glacial knot]

😂 did you block the entire internet?

[clear ferry]

also, remember to do inverse rules

!NO instead of SE,DK,DE,UK,ETC

[glacial knot]

!NO is Yes

thanks yaml

[dusky plank]

yes, except my home, switzerland is allowed to come in via vpn

but now I'm in italy and all is blocked

[glacial knot]

I thought you are in Austria not Swiss o.0

But yea, that's the main reason I don't have geoblocking ATM
I'm scared of locking myself out while at the other end of the world...

[dusky plank]

I am, Switzerland is the location for my free oracle vpn

which I will now use to get back into opnsense

[glacial knot]

^^

worst case I could mimick any geolocation as well, but that's extra steps

and I don't know if corp would ever ask why I use the work VPN to access private IP addresses from other countries D:

[dusky plank]

ffs I can reach Opnsesne but
HTTP/2 stream 0 was not closed cleanly: PROTOCOL_ERROR (err 1)

[glacial knot]

shouldn't use half an http I guess

[dusky plank]

I can get in my DMZ, I can ping and request opnsense but it won't allow me in fail

oooohhhhh guacamole saves the day

[umbral cliff]

Mmm tasty

[dusky plank]

back in all good. guacamole is the shizz

[clear ferry]

https://tenor.com/baeH3.gif

[last cedar]

https://tenor.com/view/wut-shocked-eye-pop-big-eyes-gif-15244901

But omg, tiktok... NOOOOO

[last cedar]

https://www.reddit.com/r/trashpandas/comments/12lfg8q/you_trash_panda_khaos/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=13&utm_content=share_button

@forest edge I need one of those outfits 🤣

[finite atlas]

There is a german group, where the majority of internet providers are a part of, that block DNS requests to various websites, filtering the internet. You surely want to avoid the sites listed there :)
https://cuii.info/empfehlungen/

[late gate]

@clear ferry what do you think about using this as a NAS casing and drop the synology. They have shorter too, so will fit in a regualr 60x60 rack Just pop in a mainboard https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Hot-Swappable-NAS-Server-Case-Rack_62217355672.html?spm=a2700.galleryofferlist.normal_offer.d_title.5f2813a9dL5otZ

[clear ferry]

Since we can't get cheap supermicro chassis in Norway, sure?

For that price it can't be a poor deal

[late gate]

yeah I was thinking it was not too bad priced, but need to find one that is less deep

actually they did have shorter ones: https://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/Toploong-2u-8bays-3-5-hot_1600388030358.html

[clear ferry]

I'd prefer a sas backplane

[late gate]

They said to me:
"we have sata backplane 6gb/s mini sas backplane and 12gb/s backplane for potional" - which one should I choose?

[clear ferry]

What the heck is potional

[late gate]

no idea

[clear ferry]

Optional i guess

I'd do 12g if possible, pair it with a lsi 9300/9400

And buy used enterprise sas drives

You can get 10TB ones for 1000nok

[late gate]

is it possible to run regular drives on those too, or do need ent drives?

[clear ferry]

Yes

Sas backplane means both sas and Sata support

[late gate]

so the 12g can do everything in other words

but best to use ent drives

[clear ferry]

If it has built in expander you only need the controller and backplane

If it doesn't have built in expander you need an expander too

Ask for pictures of the rear if they don't have any

[glacial knot]

that's how atx talks to girls 😉

[late gate]

they say: 8bays backplane without expander, 12bays with expander

@glacial knot I can feel the heat

[clear ferry]

Then 12bay 12g with expander

https://tenor.com/view/beautifully-moist-gif-23635729

[late gate]

I was thinking to pop in a 10g SFP and run it directly to the switch with that

390USD for chassis with 12 bay 12 g with expander. alright price?

[glacial knot]

🤔 did you dig up some money?

Does that include the fans and PSU at least?

[late gate]

yes

2x psu

and fans

and bays

[clear ferry]

That isn't horrible, but it isn't great

[late gate]

yeah I agree its a bit high priced tbh

[clear ferry]

Can get a 12-24-36 bay chassis with internals for that price

[glacial knot]

I hate banks. Bloody question answer play for security questions with only questions that are easy to find in public records....

Please do send me SMS 2FA. And then not show the digits in the input field. Because the OTP is clearly a highly protected secret

[clear ferry]

Norwegian Banks just use our national id service, tied to SSN and mobile phone plus pins

Like everything else, anything state or financial uses same government login

[glacial knot]

I wish there was actually an ecosystem to login with passports :/

[umbral cliff]

I don't because that would mean everyone would need a passport

Reminds me, gotta ring up my bank and ask them to reset my 2fa app, I forgot to transfer it before I changed phones

[glacial knot]

Everyone needs a national id by law either way. In Germany

[umbral cliff]

Where in australia that isn't a thing really

Like maybe your medicare? But thats only for citizens/ people who are eligible for free healthcare

[clever mortar]

Same here, there's a unique ID for healthcare, and another for tax purposes, but not a national ID card

[glacial knot]

Non citizens need to have a passport either way
(EU it's just any national id)

[half raft]

@clever mortar

I wasn't going to send a response at all, but I realised you're a mod around here. This discord server is also shared on blog posts on the main website so I think it's important to call this stuff out. The message of mine you responded [1] to yesterday was the first message I posted in the server. You ignored the question I responded to. I couched my response because I didn't want to join a space and say something confidently wrong. I wanted to help though, and while I knew that the yaml files for the automation aren't changed, I used language that was more helpful in a support context. Your response to me added nothing to the conversation, and came across with a 'know-it-all' tone. I responded by playing it off as a joke though, thinking you were just a regular user being a bit too much. I then read the chat later on and was honestly appalled at just unhelpful you are. I watched you respond [2] to a self-described newbie, twice [3], to just google something. I still wasn't going to say anything, until you sent this [4] message. Firstly, you're expressing a personal bias against wifi IoT devices. Secondly, you couldn't be more confidently wrong. ESPHome is a sister project [5] of Home Assistant, both falling under the Nabu Casa [6] umbrella. I think for you, as a moderator here, that it's incredibly insulting to dismiss the work of the ESPHome development team. There is a native HA integration [7], so new devices just need to be paired to your wifi from their captive portal and then they are automatically added to the integration and your HA devices. A quick google search would [8] have [9] shown [10] you that there are lots of pre-flashed ESP devices available. Then you told this person [11] to just replace their devices. Only when someone else finally brought up tuya-convert, did you then respond [12] with a similar tool. It felt like you were sharing personal biases as fact and generally pretty unhelpful in a support channel.

[silent dove]

@half raft I converted your message into a file since it's above 15 lines :+1:

[half raft]

<@&330946878646517761>

[thick crypt]

Where is the fire? 🫣

[half raft]

I linked some messages but the bot took them.

[clever mortar]

[half raft]

I don’t want to come into a space and start drama, I really don’t. But I felt like these actions were pretty unhelpful and it was the first thing I saw on joining. I don’t want to “shake things up”, I’m just going to leave.

[static schooner]

You tagged 11 people and it was automatically deleted, as it should

[clever mortar]

Yeah, but they solved that by tagging every mod... smart call

[half raft]

As far as I could tell, the mods tag wasn’t working. I’m sorry for that.

[clever mortar]

No... no you're not

[half raft]

Yeah I actually am.

[clever mortar]

If you hadn't meant to you wouldn't have done it

So... BS

[fathom sparrow]

I don't see anything wrong with what tinkerer wrote. Tuya is notoriously bad and the best way to find any device that works with home assistant is to google

[half raft]

I am sorry, because I should have checked the tag.

[fathom sparrow]

that's all we do when someone asks "what devices work" with HA

becaus ethere's no "master list"

[thick crypt]

Yes because all the mods are responding now 😅

[half raft]

But yeah, this is how I expected someone like you to react to being called out for being toxic.

[clever mortar]

Also, I'd already said:

Anything Tuya and WiFi is generally a nightmare

[fathom sparrow]

And that's a very true statement

[clever mortar]

My comments weren't aimed at ESPHome or Tasmota... but at Tuya

[half raft]

you clearly said don’t use wifi, use zig bee etc…

[fathom sparrow]

I feel like you're putting emotion behind his replies when he's simply telling you the experience MANY people have with TUYA and WIFI.

[clever mortar]

Ah... the joys of taking a single line out of context

[half raft]

a single line?

i linked 6 of your messages

but okay

[clever mortar]

Don't want to start drama... proceeds to start drama

[fathom sparrow]

So what don't you like about the replies

[last cedar]

Do we need some raccoon shit-posting to shake things up?

[fathom sparrow]

Do you not like the way he responded, or do you not like the information?

lets start there.

[half raft]

the first one I mentioned was a pedantic reply to me trying to help someone whose question was ignored?

that was off-topic and didn’t add context or clarity

[fathom sparrow]

I think you miss understood his reply

'it' doesn't get removed is replying to your comment about the entity_id being readded

[half raft]

like I said, I wrote my response from the frame of explaining something easily. The physical device was changing, using the term I did made the response clearer. It’s pretty reductive to ignore the person’s question and then correct someone else’s reply to it.

I do understand the concept, but if I’d explained it fully would it have helped that person’s understanding?

[glacial knot]

btw. @clever mortar was it you or quad that experimented a bunch with mm-wave sensors? 🤔

[clever mortar]

Not me

[fathom sparrow]

I think you made it more unclear

[glacial knot]

the danger of remembering users by colour and nick length D:

[fathom sparrow]

now that person thinks that the entity_ids are readded when you change a device

I don't think it was a pedantic response at all. People should understand the system.

[half raft]

well, they are though. To the entities list at least. But okay.

Not to the automations yaml file tho

[fathom sparrow]

automations do not change at all when you change an entity_id

or when you change a device

that's a highly sought after feature request

[half raft]

Cool. That’s not what the question was asking.

[fathom sparrow]

right, but that's what your response elluded

and tinkerer was just clarifying.

[half raft]

No, he asked if the automations would still have that specific device if he removed and re-added an integration. And I answered that.

[fathom sparrow]

but as long as the entity ID stays the same afterwards, then it should automatically be re-added to things like automations.

[half raft]

There is such a thing as overwhelming a newer user with information

[fathom sparrow]

yes and you did that.

[clever mortar]

And such a thing as giving them incorrect information

[half raft]

I was referring to the physical device.

Being added to the automations

[fathom sparrow]

but you can't tell from your freaking response

[half raft]

After being pulled off a wall

and replaced

[fathom sparrow]

like you're upset that you posted something wrong and he corrected you

[half raft]

Yeah no.

This is a semantics problem

[fathom sparrow]

this statement is false:

but as long as the entity ID stays the same afterwards, then it should automatically be re-added to things like automations.

[half raft]

and you’re making it a technical one

[fathom sparrow]

100%

nothing gets re-added

[half raft]

That’s not providing support

[fathom sparrow]

ever

[half raft]

Yeah

[fathom sparrow]

they do not change.

that's it

[half raft]

The physical charger whose whole integration was re configured changed

that’s what the person was asking

[fathom sparrow]

do you understand english?

I'm generally curious

[half raft]

Okay, if this is the kind of space you want to foster for users seeking support, and other users trying to help. Then keep it. I’ll go back to the forums.

[fathom sparrow]

because you didn't clarify what it was in this sentence

but as long as the entity ID stays the same afterwards, then *** it*** should automatically be re-added to things like automations.
Which looks like you're talking about the entity_id

[fathom sparrow]

the same people are at the forums.

guess who's an admin there... you guessed it, the guy who corrected you.

[clever mortar]

Well... that was entertaining

[fathom sparrow]

I'm in awe

like, I get it that people are upset about the whole TUYA / WIFI crap

so, in a sense you can be seen as an ass when responding to that crap

but what she said was flat out wrong and she's upset you corrected her

[clever mortar]

Language barrier, or a comprehension one, or both...

[fathom sparrow]

Let me tell you, I'm terrible at reading comprehension and I even saw that a mile away.

[glacial knot]

🤷 I think it's correct form a UX perspective, even if the technical reasoning is wrong. but I also don't see any issue with how Tinkerer clarified that

[fathom sparrow]

🤷‍♂️

[clever mortar]

Some people are just angry at the world

[umbral cliff]

I love drama. Needed more popcorn though

[steel crag]

I just had to read it all. I need more coffee apparently

I cannot with the humans

[clever mortar]

https://tenor.com/view/red-dwarf-kryten-appreciation-cant-cope-up-gif-3540355

From one of my favourite comedy shows ☝️

[last cedar]

@clear ferry finally, tthe car situation is resolved.

For those who don't know... 2 years ago I ordered an Octavia IV hybrid as a works car, it has been delayed 5 times now, I think.

Finally my work has decided we can get a Kia instead, not really the result I wanted but I don't have a lot of choice 🤣

[junior forge]

Darnit, I had one call today

and during that call all drama happened?

😢

[clever mortar]

Sorry, let me know when you're next free and I'll try to schedule some drama for you 😛

[glacial knot]

EV6?

[junior forge]

Sounds like a good deal!

[glacial knot]

Romeo and Juliet? Or something good? 🤔

[clever mortar]

https://tenor.com/view/gnomes-rule-gnomeo-and-juliet-we-rule-gif-16388416

[clear ferry]

https://tenor.com/view/excuse-me-well-excuse-me-my-bad-forgive-me-gif-22026937

[ashen parrot]

what happens to all the chinese devices people own when China declares war on the US?

[clever mortar]

Mostly nothing

[ashen parrot]

like, they go on functioning?

Im imagining there would be problems with logging in to cn servers

on account of Chinese law... like every private company is required to shared data with the CCP

[clever mortar]

1. You're assuming that all those devices talk back to a central server
2. You're assuming that they're going to care about home users
3. You're assuming that they would cut off the devices, rather than maybe using them to gather intelligence

[ashen parrot]

yes yes and yes

but with what I was saying, it would be the US that would cut off access on account of that law I mentioned

not the Chinese

[glacial knot]

potentially some botnetting / proxies to avoid geoblocking
But it's questionable how much of an asset they'll actually be

[ashen parrot]

at first glance I agree

but let's take the case of a common lightbulb

as it is, xiaomi know when the light is on in my house

this means they know where I live, and when Im home

[glacial knot]

and may remote controll it 😮 no more city blackout to confuse bombers

[ashen parrot]

no, for real Im sayin

[clever mortar]

These are the tradeoffs you make when you decide to buy cheap wifi gear

[ashen parrot]

like it would be REALLY easy to send someone to my house and like replace

[clever mortar]

Replace...? You?

[ashen parrot]

completely agreed. Not trying to turn this into politics, but it's something that will be affecting a lot of people pretty soon (most likely)

sorry for the ping

pressed enter fast

[glacial knot]

Just don't ping 11 mods and you'll be fine 😂

[clever mortar]

Well... then if it happens lots of people get to learn why cloud reliance is bad

It's not like anybody here can do anything other then speculate

[glacial knot]

righty, I should extract the local token for my new vacuum soon, before the chinese firewall closes
Oh wait, roborock runs their C&C in this country

[ashen parrot]

anyway, not me, Im not important, but if a spy needed to blow up somtehing it would be easy to just set up in a loner's home and work from there afterwards

[glacial knot]

ah, they'll save roughly 2 days of observation

[clever mortar]

I think you're watching the wrong kind of spy TV shows/movies...

[glacial knot]

or taking them to serious. Those shows are fun to watch

[clever mortar]

It's not so much that most of them are full of plot holes, more that reality makes for poor entertainment

[ashen parrot]

you're not taking this seriously enough...

maybe my portrayal was off

[glacial knot]

reality can be the best kind of entertainment

[ashen parrot]

but it would be really easy and you know it

[glacial knot]

I love myself some tangential drama

[last cedar]

Rofl

No way we can get an EV6, I am a lowly technician, only the fine suit wearing people have EV6.

I can either choose a hybrid Ceed SW or an el Niro

[clever mortar]

My brother has the Ceed SW... it's actually not a bad car

[glacial knot]

Meh, I don't like the SW
I have a ProCeed^^

[last cedar]

The niro is probably too small, but the ev range would be better for me (about 80km to/ from work), but may be impractial to work from, and probably cramped used for my own usage, which is a shame tbh

Suit people can choose enjaq and polestar 2 now

I should really be a suit person instead

[static schooner]

suits are overrated

[clever mortar]

Having had to wear one at work... can confirm

I am very glad they finally accepted that wearing a suit != being competent

[static schooner]

it's incredibly rare to see anyone wearing a suit around here

it's kinda the opposite 🙂

credibility in the tech industry comes from wearing casual

man of the people

[clever mortar]

Well, I'm in favour of dress for the occasion

If you're meeting with a bunch of suits, dress suitably. If you're meeting with a bunch of techs, also dress suitably

[static schooner]

if you're meeting with a bunch of suits, get out of the closet

[clever mortar]

I'm not wearing good clothes when clambering around computer halls, but I'm also not going to brief a board in jeans and a t-shirt

(unless said board dresses that way too)

[orchid rose]

Okay sir, but how am I supposed to fake it from now on?

[glacial knot]

The Polestar looks so nice

I say... brief the board in briefs!

[last cedar]

I mean suit people as in those refined paper turners, as opposed to the controversial people who actually work 🤣

[glacial knot]

I should check if we have a dresscode. It's always a blast to make fun of it when it exists

[clear ferry]

What do you mean? They won't make the door sensors spin at a harmonic frequency so I can't produce more uranium at home?

[clear ferry]

Polestar 2 is shit, the first one is ok imho

[glacial knot]

not sure which one usually parks outside the office. But I like the look

[clear ferry]

I've had both as rentals, the first was definitely better

Just like the Tesla Model X is the only usable one, s was shite and 3 just feels wrong, my colleague with a 3 has his in the shop once a month

[glacial knot]

🤷 I just like the exterior. No idea about how they drive

[clear ferry]

I looked at the EX90 now, but it just feels cheap for the price and is a downgrade compared my XC90

[glacial knot]

Tesla OTOH... the S looks like it was intended, the 3 and X are what happens when you take a picture of the S and transform non-ratio preserving

[clear ferry]

Annoying bit about Tesla, they designed one car and then just did randomize on the proportions

But the X is a superior car in drive feel

[glacial knot]

and that one car doesn't even look good. Just sorta acceptable

[clear ferry]

The Y?

Oh all of them

Yeah looks like a 6 yo drawing a Porsche from memory

[glacial knot]

the S. The others all look like they squished the S in weird ways

[orchid rose]

very pretty

[clear ferry]

https://tenor.com/view/trump-really-amazed-funny-face-gif-13712696

Also, yikes

https://www.theverge.com/2023/4/14/23683081/western-digital-hack-data-hostage-report

[last cedar]

I feel like... WD can't be trusted with user data

And pulled the shitty "oh yeah, btw, now that peoples zfs arrays have shit the bed, you know what, we secretly used smr on them... erm, but like now you can buy a drive that doesn't have smr, like, you know before we swapped to smr" bs

[fathom sparrow]

grand scheme of things, 10 TB isn't much if it's full harddrive backups

[orchid rose]

In terms of the amount of data, but the type of data that is saved in these types of services tends to be more personal

[clear ferry]

Considering it is database data, credentials data and access to cloud instances

Yikes

[fathom sparrow]

so update password time

[clear ferry]

Always MFA, always rotate yearly

[umbral cliff]

You're ignoring the fact that a) they don't know where you live unless you give the app location access, a lightbulb would only get the IP address which could be wildly off

b) you can have lights off when you're home, or lights on when you're not home. Doesn't really help

[prisma briar]

Wifi scans can be used to get a really accurate location. An on-premise device with wifi can most likely determine where it is.

[forest edge]

yea geofencing in the US is legit

[prisma briar]

idk how other countries laws affect it but here places like Google build maps of wifi to physical location with things like location services on Android. They used to scan wifi to map it to physical locations with their google maps trucks, too. Google also isn't the only company doing this.

I don't think it's straightforward to query Google's wifi->physical location database but I think I could probably manage to query it with a day's worth of work. I never looked into the others.

[forest edge]

it's a paid service to access that information.

[prisma briar]

It's near free to get a cheap-o android, root it, make it report spoofed wifi data, then see what it returns when it tries to ask Google for it's location.

[forest edge]

I don't think that saves you from the method used

if a device is transmitting it can't spoof the information collected because the locations etc all collected seperatly as is

[prisma briar]

Wifi data could be spoofed easily, and GPS could be turned off or just blocked with a physical barrier.

Pretty easy to block GPS with like a concrete wall

[forest edge]

you can't spoof being picked up at x location. as I said the location aspect is collected seperatly. all they log is your device id etc.. so no matter what that device, or at least it id will be tied to the location it was detected at

friend works for one of those online gambling sites and because different state laws in accordance to gambling geofencing has to be on the money, it also cann't be "tricked" cause they deal with people trying to do that all the time

[prisma briar]

"being picked up at" isn't how positioning works. Nothing picks up your location, beacons transmit their location and your device infers from that. The beacons (wifi) are insecure and spoofable in this regard since they're not designed with this in mind. The other beacons a phone uses such as cell or GPS can be turned off/blocked easily.

[forest edge]

talking about the data collected by services such as google and other geofencing companies

they don't collect that data remotely

that shit gets collected from someone driving by your house

[prisma briar]

They just use peoples cell phones now

[forest edge]

no no it's way more involved

[prisma briar]

It's really not, they quit using trucks a long time ago.

[forest edge]

good luck with thinking that

[prisma briar]

Good luck with not googling easily verifiable information

[forest edge]

as i said, friend works for one of those companies that has to collect that information

believe what you want

[prisma briar]

I don't care where your friend works, you're not your friend and you clearly don't understand your friend's job.

[forest edge]

shit is way scarier than you think

[prisma briar]

idk how what I described isn't scary as-is.

They quit using the trucks because they effectively just bugged everyone's cell phones instead

[forest edge]

lol tin foil

[prisma briar]

https://www.zdnet.com/article/how-google-and-everyone-else-gets-wi-fi-location-data/

That took a whole 4 seconds on Google

[forest edge]

so "google" dosen't do that..

[prisma briar]

Yea, the Google that I explicitly mentioned multiple times, in reference to being able to query their database.

Honestly I have no idea what you're even trying to argue. Are you just trying to argue your friend has a job with a company?

[forest edge]

they are not the only company, not even the primary company companies use

[prisma briar]

Okay? That affects my suggestion on how to spoof a device's location in order to query their database how?

[forest edge]

i am arguing that you cannot spoof your way out of a device being located

[prisma briar]

Well that's just wrong

[forest edge]

maybe for google

as i said, good luck with that

[prisma briar]

For any service? You do realize that those apps that detect manipulation and spoofing are generally reactive, right? They find a way people spoof it then address that method, generally by detecting the modification/app doing the modification instead of errors in the spoofed data.

It's not like your position has an RSA signature that can be checked for validity.

[forest edge]

any service? I guess i am not understanding what your end goal is. "any service" that requires geofencing" cannot be spoofed, the access gets denied instantly. I guess maybe you are refering to "big brother" tracking your whereabouts?

[prisma briar]

My original suggestion was just a way to query Google's Wifi db, now I'm refuting your rather asinine argument that geofencing can't be bypassed.

[forest edge]

and all i can tell you is, good luck with thinking that

as i said now for the third time

[glacial knot]

Beacons only contain location up to country granularity
But Google has a map of BSS to gps coordinates built by their cars and probably Android phone fleet

[prisma briar]

There is no property of location data that proves if it's accurate or not, it's up to the device reporting to be trusted. Apps that attempt to block spoofing are monitoring the integrity of the device reporting, not the accuracy of the data. That is a cat and mouse game that is never won by either side.

[prisma briar]

Yea, I meant peoples wifi routers that have been mapped to physical locations with GPS.

[forest edge]

as i stated, in the regards to state laws they do not rely on device reporting. that shit is tracked locally. every id of any machine is tracked. as i also said if you tried to "spoof" that data you are just simply denied access.

[prisma briar]

wtf that even mean?

Other than you have no clue what you're talking about

[forest edge]

pretty sure it was all covered

[prisma briar]

Pretty sure you just strung together a bunch of random words.

[forest edge]

sure, we'll go with that

done with this convo

[glacial knot]

Mainly pointing it out because it makes the spoofing harder
You either need to poison the database or replicate another location
You can't just tell your WiFi to say Sydney and confuse systems that way

[prisma briar]

LPT: Don't come in insisting people are wrong with such a poor understanding of what you're talking about.

[prisma briar]

My idea was take a wifi scan from the hacked/compromised IoT device and modify the wifi driver on an android to return that scan data instead of the true data.

[glacial knot]

LPT: don't engage with known trolls

[prisma briar]

I don't think he's a troll, I think he's genuinely that stupid.

[glacial knot]

Ahh. I was thinking of outside spoofing
Yea, that works better. Not easy, but reasonable

[prisma briar]

Outside spoofing would require you to have a bunch of APs that you could reconfigure, I think. You might have to take things like manufacturer oddities into account, idk of google uses those to fingerprint devices or not.

[glacial knot]

One good one would work. Beacons are ever couple hundred ms, and some APs allow to insert raw frame data

[prisma briar]

I was thinking multiple to compensate for if it uses signal strength as an indicator

I guess one AP could rapidly change it's signal strength too

[glacial knot]

depending on how accurate it is, yes. There's TX strength settings to pass to the radio^^

We had the right setup for that at the chair when I was still a student
Intended to provide actually reproducible measurements for wifi

[forest edge]

You tried to argue that any service could be location spoofed and I simply disagreed. Using an example such as online gambling that requires geofencing. In those instances you cannot spoof your location and still use the service. location has to be verified or you are denied access. not rocket science. You argued that companies no longer track via truck, try telling that to amazon or any of the other 30 some odd companies that specialize in geofencing.

[prisma briar]

I'm not going to bother reading your nonsense.

You have no clue at all what you're talking about.

[forest edge]

because you don't know what your talking about

[prisma briar]

And you've been a bit of a dick about it.

[forest edge]

you placed the tin foil hat, i'm just telling you good luck with that

and with that. this "dick" is out lol