general

[worn ember]

my life has been a lie

literally never seen or heard of it

[formal turret]

mojang uses them to generate most structures in the world too

[mighty storm]

It's essentially //schematic from WorldEdit

[worn ember]

weird

[unique snow]

There is also the infamous jigsaw block

[worn ember]

bruh

stop fucking with my mind

[vernal moth]

They are cool

Their format is too

[worn ember]

so you could use those to generate mazes?

[formal turret]

yes

[mighty storm]

i thought the jigsaw block was only in 20w14~

[vernal moth]

But i guess, so is the new community standard for schematics that the sponge guys came up with

[runic shale]

what is a good pet plugin?

[unique snow]

1.14+

[mighty storm]

oh i was thinking something else

[runic shale]

1.16.4

[vernal moth]

Cool thing with structure blocks is that you can basically generate dungeons

[unique snow]

Think older in bedrock

[vernal moth]

Because you can just make it fit stuff together

[unique snow]

Though who gives a fuck about bedrock

[mighty storm]

I was thinking the ant block

[worn ember]

try google

[worn ember]

jokes on you, its the biggest player base

[runic shale]

LMAO searched none I can find

[worn ember]

by a large margin

[vestal jasper]

margin: 0;

[worn ember]

no

[formal turret]

that's not a very large margin

[vestal jasper]

no it is not

the padding is massive however

[unique snow]

I'd be curious how many non-education users on PC use bedrock.

[formal turret]

on PC it's probably majority java

[worn ember]

https://youtu.be/b6eBndQ_jK0 this is cool

[merry talon]

ugh the fact that there isn't a universal rgb api in 2020

[fallen oracle]

You make it sound like RGB has been around for years.

[merry talon]

It has

lol

like at least 4

[fallen oracle]

..? For MC Clients?

[merry talon]

oh no

for PC hardware

[fallen oracle]

OH

Sorry.

[merry talon]

I forgot it was even a thing in MC

[worn ember]

They all come with their own software

You could write your own tho. But idk how compatible that would be. Since there's tones of formats on rgb

[void void]

how demanding are bedrock servers?

[worn ember]

Ur asking the wrong crowd here lol

[void void]

yeah guessed so LMAO

[warm anchor]

Go ask in official Minecraft server dude

[spiral robin]

Official Minecraft server

[worn ember]

Smh toxic

[signal aspen]

is there someone who compared performance of every minecraft version on paper ?

[waxen panther]

not really

latest is the only version we care about

[signal aspen]

or in your opinion which is the fastest ?

mmmh okay

[worn ember]

Not latest for sure

[signal aspen]

yeah the latest is really heavy that's why im asking

[waxen panther]

latest is obviously not the best for performance no, but we wont support you with others

[spiral robin]

Usually 1.12.2 is known as the newest version which doesn't require a looooot of resources, but that's now really old and everything since then is meh

[signal aspen]

yeah it's like 3 years old now

[worn ember]

Hopefully the optimization team can fix that next year

We'll see

[signal aspen]

i hope so

[void void]

man I really had fun with this lag method

its really a love/hate relationship with paper

Paper devs are sort of like rats, they are everywhere looking for new exploits, like some guy in general chat posted that for a grand total of 30 seconds till a paper dev found it and patched it

[potent fossil]

like rats

[void void]

How else can I describe it

That guy said he was on an alt too

[formal turret]

aw yea man patching exploits, the worst

[void void]

Ye i get it

I know its their job to patch exploits and thats a good thing

[potent fossil]

Here comes the "but"

[formal turret]

then why insult them lol

[void void]

Maybe paper should try to enforce mc eula a bit more but then 90% of their clientbase would vanish

[potent fossil]

It's not paper's job to enforce any EULA. That is the onus of the server operator lol

[formal turret]

that's mojangs job not papers

[void void]

Fair enough

[potent fossil]

And this isn't the paper team's "job" either, it's a volunteer community project. Mojang doesn't own this. They don't get paid for it either.

[viral hornet]

ngl @void void
You giving off some pretty ratty vibes

[potent fossil]

It's done entirely for free, so people can have fun

Exploits are not fun

So they get patched

There is a small subgroup of people who are like "exploits are fun, I love cheating" but that's not the majority

[waxen panther]

what are you even on about hey_

[potent fossil]

If you want exploits, just don't update

[void void]

Damn calm down it was a joke

[viral hornet]

oh it was a joke oh

[formal turret]

time to back pedal

[viral hornet]

[spiral robin]

[potent fossil]

Don't quit your day job, standup is not your cup of tea.

[formal turret]

can't lag out the p2win servers now that use paper

well, with that method

[void void]

Some dude leaked it

[viral hornet]

omg what is your status

https://i.imgur.com/ZvB85Xi.png

hahahaha

Are you from one of those antip2w groups

[waxen panther]

2b2t

classic

[formal turret]

he is

[viral hornet]

TheHorizon?

[spiral robin]

[void void]

Just calm down it was a joke

[spiral robin]

[limber knot]

the desire for order

vs. the desire for disorder

a battle that will only end at the end of time

[cunning raft]

ah yes

always can count on the 2b2t folk to cry about exploit patches

[limber knot]

once upon a time I was on that server, and found my way up to some island. Didn't die making it out of spawn heh. But now that there's a queue n stuff I just don't bother goin there at all

I remember it being barren of mobs n stuff cuz the global cap

but other than that I don't really follow or get the mentality of ppl that play there, I guess whoever has the best hack client and knows the exploits "holds the power" there so that's why they cling to it

cuz they feel like they have some "ownership" there with that very limited control

idk, I wanna see a psychology study on that server

[potent fossil]

psychology study on 2b2t: "recommend no contact with primitive society"

[limber knot]

no that's just a recommendation/declaration

I wanna watch a youtube movie on it

[potent fossil]

you should direct it

and then watch it

https://tenor.com/view/shia-la-beouf-laugh-laughing-lol-watch-gif-5058314

[limber knot]

if that was my degree I probably would

but alas, I have 2 much fun with software and administration

and automation

[potent fossil]

write an ai to conduct the study and make the movie for you

then watch it

[limber knot]

ok I'll hire u 2 rite an ai 4 me

[potent fossil]

no im busy watching star trek

[limber knot]

original series?

[potent fossil]

yes

[limber knot]

ok ur gud den

[potent fossil]

https://tenor.com/view/spock-dazzling-display-logic-star-trek-gif-16343803

[limber knot]

which episode

[potent fossil]

s2e5

[iron zephyr]

Hello! Currently, I run a small server with minigames, creative, and survival. I am really considering using Waterfall, because right now we struggle with conflicts and glitches between survival/creative/minigame stuff. However, I am concerned about a) the additional time it will take to update three copies of everything and set everything up properly, and b) the resource usage compared to what it is now. Does anyone have insight?

[potent fossil]

Don't use waterfall or bungee, they are legacy. Use velocity. #community-guilds

[heady spear]

im starting to like kotlin

[viral hornet]

Uhh, I wouldn't say that Bungee is legacy, is it?

[zealous wedge]

don't worry, you'll get over it soon enough :p

[cunning raft]

stop right there city

[zealous wedge]

it is camm

[viral hornet]

Velocity is the go-to, sure, but BungeeCord is still developed, no?

[limber knot]

it's as legacy as spigot is

[viral hornet]

Hell, I'm still on Waterfall because plugins that are dependent on bungee only

[potent fossil]

Legacy doesn't imply not developed, it implies it shouldn't be used in favor of something else

[zealous wedge]

it is, but nobody except maybe md_5 actually wants to develop it

[cunning raft]

paper is legacy

yatopia is future

[potent fossil]

yatopia

[heady spear]

that is true

[viral hornet]

Hmm okay

[zealous wedge]

waterfall is just sorta kept alive too

[iron zephyr]

Ooh, I'm intrigued. Who runs velocity?

[viral hornet]

Maybe I should really look at moving then.

[potent fossil]

tux

[heady spear]

stop right there city
I will not stop it. Kotlin is sexy

[potent fossil]

@heady spear you're sexy

[iron zephyr]

Wait, there is a fork of Tuinity... which is a fork of Paper... 😄

[zealous wedge]

yeah the only reason waterfall still exists is because some plugins don't want to support velocity

[potent fossil]

Yes, don't use Yatopia. That's a joke

[heady spear]

zml i think i managed to brainwash them into using configurate :'')

[viral hornet]

Yeah, don't touch it though, Dawnhunter. It's terrible.

[iron zephyr]

xD I wasn't planning on it. One server-breaking change a month is enough

[zealous wedge]

though I'll continue arguing that most plugins that run on the proxy shouldn't be running on the proxy

[heady spear]

I am making it so I don't have to learn any new technologies at this point 😄

[iron zephyr]

So is running Velocity/Waterfall/whatever a pain? Like will I have to have a bunch of stuff so that people can chat across servers, etc.?

[viral hornet]

My only concern is LiteBans tbh. Everything else I'm sure there would be a Velocity alternative to, or could easily be remade.

[zealous wedge]

uwu

[heady spear]

though I'll continue arguing that most plugins that run on the proxy shouldn't be running on the proxy
I agree. The only type of plugin I'm happy running on the proxy would be the punishment suite

[waxen panther]

@viral hornet

incendo/bans

[potent fossil]

@iron zephyr usually just a chat plugin on the proxy overriding server chat

[waxen panther]

😎

[potent fossil]

not a big deal

[heady spear]

because blocking access on the proxy level makes a lot more sense than doing it on server level

[viral hornet]

That's no where near as complete or feature rich as LiteBans, is it brocc?

[waxen panther]

our dear proxi will finish it one day

[heady spear]

ur butt is not complete or feature rich

[viral hornet]

woah

[waxen panther]

dumpy

[viral hornet]

😦

[iron zephyr]

Okay, cool. And I find that by looking in the bungee section on spigot?

[heady spear]

ok Camm ban uses cloud

so we stan

[viral hornet]

@vestal jasper does carbon support velocity

[heady spear]

ok, got it?

[potent fossil]

If you run velocity, you look on the velocity website

[viral hornet]

yes sir 🥺

[potent fossil]

If you run bungee or waterfall, yes spigot site

[viral hornet]

@iron zephyr velocitypowered.com

Ignore their ugly website

Tux is a devloper, not a designer

[potent fossil]

Someone should make a sexy new website

[iron zephyr]

Ah, I see they have plugins, cool

But I still have to run Essentials 3x on the server level?

[heady spear]

https://github.com/Incendo/ban/blob/master/common/src/main/java/com/proximyst/ban/commands/HistoryCommand.java this is so sexy

[potent fossil]

yes

[waxen panther]

proxi is so sexy 🥺

[heady spear]

stop sexualizing proxy u weirdo

[waxen panther]

wtf

i am married .

[heady spear]

also catalyst is good

[waxen panther]

whats catalyst

[viral hornet]

will ban have everything litebans does

[heady spear]

https://github.com/AnvilPowered/Catalyst

if u bug proxi enough im sure she'll cave in and add whatever u need

as long as its not stupid because then she'll just roast u

[iron zephyr]

Would Catalyst replace the need for Essentials?

Or does it not do everything?

[heady spear]

depends on what u need from essentials lol

but no it wouldn't do everything essentials does

[vestal jasper]

@viral hornet carbon doesn't have much knowledge of proxies

[cunning raft]

def wouldn't have kitty cannon

[vestal jasper]

it can use bungee channels if you don't have a redis setup

[cunning raft]

game breaking

[vestal jasper]

but velocity 1.1.0 natively supports that

[heady spear]

lol i was gonna mention kittycannon

[vestal jasper]

and 1.0.0 with the quack plugin

[iron zephyr]

xD

[heady spear]

dunno how u could play without that :/

[iron zephyr]

Nvm, velocity clearly isn't for me

[vestal jasper]

it doesn't run natively on either yet though

[heady spear]

Vic plz support velocity

so I can shill ur shit

:(((

[vestal jasper]

and my mentions of having it run on the proxy are met with "why support it if it gets less features"

yeah city I might just do it tbh

[heady spear]

is there anything worthwhile you wouldn't be able to do on the proxy?

[vestal jasper]

you won't be able to use placeholderapi

or gain much information from the player

[heady spear]

That's fair

hm

[waxen panther]

🎈

[vestal jasper]

I know some plugins will have the plugin running on the backend servers to pass information to the proxy plugin

[heady spear]

I mean there's not even any vault-like plugin for velocity, is there?

so then you wouldn't even have access to ranks

[vestal jasper]

but if you have it running on your proxy and all backend servers

you might as well just set it up on the backend servers

[heady spear]

that's fair

ye proxy might not be the best idea then

[vestal jasper]

I'm all for supporting proxy

[heady spear]

We should create a vault + PAPI suite for proxies

[vestal jasper]

not every server wants super detailed placeholder support

[heady spear]

just a way to hook into perm plugins and also offer basic placeholder support

would be epic 😛

[viral hornet]

pog

https://i.imgur.com/gaCnN5Y.png

I'm moving to velocity boys

[iron zephyr]

Well, I guess I'll go try Velocity and give it a shot haha

What could go wrong?

[vestal jasper]

I can see minigame servers having a use for carbon, or networks with creative etc

Setups where super detailed formats aren't a necessity or always warranted

You then get the whispering etc

[heady spear]

tbh I was only half joking about the above idea

[vestal jasper]

having a use for carbon, running on the proxy and only the proxy*

[viral hornet]

Nothing, really. Some of your BungeeCord plugins not working at most, ig?
I would strongly recommend you back everything up to be safe, prior!

[heady spear]

it would be cool to have a bridge for common perms plugins etc

[iron zephyr]

That's the scary thing: I'm not currently using bungeecord haha. I'm looking at remaking our server so it is split into three servers, instead of one big mess

But it is scary xD

[viral hornet]

Ohh.

It's really not, tbh. It's a good safeguard, too.

[heady spear]

then you have nothing to worry about lol

[viral hornet]

Join Velocities Discord, if you have any issues make sure you seek some help there 😄

[iron zephyr]

Thanks! I appreciate it. I think it will be much better - right now the creative/survival glitchiness alone is driving me crazy

[wraith trail]

If you are starting now, thats even better time to go velocity as you have no sunk cost

[void void]

Switched to velocity, never staying again

[heady spear]

what

[viral hornet]

what x2

[unkempt drift]

Idk what ^ means?

[iron zephyr]

I am confusion

[viral hornet]

Please explain

[wraith trail]

do you like or hate velocity?

[unkempt drift]

Explain.

[viral hornet]

https://giphy.com/gifs/live-documentary-aussie-PyVBGgVHrFYs

[iron zephyr]

xD

If he wanted to get everyone's attention, he got it

[heady spear]

lol if u wanna get paper against u just slightly hint that u may dislike velocity

[viral hornet]

Only because of the poor choice of english lol

[heady spear]

tbh velocity is a bit too

[void void]

Did you really think I could die by killing me?

[wraith trail]

that did not help

[heady spear]

what

the

hel

[viral hornet]

zzzz

troll

[heady spear]

l

[viral hornet]

mods ban

[unkempt drift]

^

[heady spear]

yes ban the mods

[iron zephyr]

🤣

[limber knot]

agree

[viral hornet]

Who needs mods

when we have Robo on IRC

[iron zephyr]

xD

[limber knot]

exactly

[viral hornet]

TrollDefender, coming to a Discord server near you soon™️

[waxen panther]

aussie

[limber knot]

instead of banning, memeing will be the penalty

[heady spear]

i am going to gym soon brocc

r u proud

[viral hornet]

hot

can I spot you

😳

[waxen panther]

so proud !!

[heady spear]

also go sleep u dumb nerd

[waxen panther]

i might go tomorrow if i can get someone to drive me in

im triyng to sleep

[void void]

no pls no ban

i know garbagemule

he asked me for my opinion on mario odyessy

check spigot discord messages for proof

[heady spear]

garbagemule is your biggest fan

he told me

[void void]

omg ty

wait but im actually your biggest fan

I loved reading all the fascinating projects you make on github.

[hot pumice]

AUR minecraft-launcher and minecraft are outdated ☹️

[viral hornet]

Have you given them all a Star?

[limber knot]

lie

[void void]

Truly a marvelous site, greatly appreciate the source code for forking.

[limber knot]

they aren't fascinating they just buggin

[heady spear]

I am a genius

what more can I say

you know what Robo sometimes ur just very rude

[viral hornet]

Have you given them all a Star?

[void void]

Not exactly, my darling.

[heady spear]

well then what the hell are you good for?

[viral hornet]

^

Useless, my darling.

[limber knot]

.u buggin

[void void]

I'm terribly sorry.

[heady spear]

Kotlin properties are very confusing

like idk whether to think of them as fields or just as a collection of getters and setters

this book is making it even less clear lmao

ok

why censor shit tho

[void void]

Ah, I love books, such wonderful works of art.

[limber knot]

apparently the urban dictionary query is broken in the bot but: buggin: whilen or trippin out

[void void]

Just wondering, I always wondered what ; and : are used for in writing, and what differences they make?

[wraith trail]

they are very differnent

[heady spear]

they're used to make smileys

[void void]

Also what are your opinions on the concept of parallel worlds, and alternate world lines.

[heady spear]

;) is a winking one

[void void]

I find that topic quite fascinating.

[heady spear]

:) isn't winking

[void void]

The idea of parallel worlds.

[heady spear]

so yes there's a huge difference because one is flirty whereas the other one isn't

[void void]

Existing in our universe, such a fascinating and unknown subject.

[heady spear]

don't use ;) to ur professor or he might sleep with u

unless u want that

[void void]

Ah, okay, my darling.

[wraith trail]

but in seriousness you use a colon (:) when something is happening, such as a set of examples or a quote. Semicolon (;) is for when you take 2 sentences and you want them to be 1

[unkempt drift]

To; be; safe;, put; a; ; after; each; word;

[heady spear]

: is also used to list shit

and then you can use ; to separate the shit ur listing

[void void]

Sentences have to be related right?

Like I want to eat a apple; big and juicy.

[wraith trail]

not quite

[unkempt drift]

Don’t think that works

[heady spear]

big and juicy can't just be used on its own

[unkempt drift]

Big and juicy isn’t a complete sentence

[wraith trail]

you need to have two independent clauses that you join

[heady spear]

mentioning big and juicy

@viral hornet hi

actually Camm how r u

[void void]

Okay, I appreciate the help loves 🙂

[viral hornet]

I'm okay City

How are you ;)

[heady spear]

am very tired but I have this cup of coffee which I love more than everything else rn

[viral hornet]

Coffee is pretty incredible

[heady spear]

this is what I imagine it must be like to taste God's jizz

[viral hornet]

EXACTLY

I was saying that to the place where I get coffee from

[vestal jasper]

wow

[wraith trail]

that's enough paper general for today

[viral hornet]

and they asked me to leave????? wtf

[viral hornet]

umm https://i.imgur.com/M8b1nnb.png

ONE OF YOU IS IMPOSTER

[wraith trail]

i've got 2 accounts

[heady spear]

I don't realize how good coffee is until I'm halfway asleep

[wraith trail]

6018 and 2063 or something

[viral hornet]

y

[wraith trail]

used to have one I used for personal irl servers and one for rando servers, then I combined them

and now one is on my phone and one is on my computer

[viral hornet]

ah, fair.

And after all that still use default avatars 😛

[heady spear]

I have too much to do to sleep tho D: I need to finish this kotlin book and then also finish this book on agile development and then I need to read my computer security book and then I need to finish two computer security labs and also prepare for a seminar about project management and then I need to learn this code base and then I need to clean my apartment and then I need to do a case study for another assignment and then I also need to learn scheduling algorithms for embedded systems

[wraith trail]

never changed an avatar in my life

and have them disabled

compact view

[viral hornet]

City pls

Go to sleep!

[heady spear]

no !!

[zealous wedge]

city go sleep!

[viral hornet]

^

You can't learn when you're that tired/haven't slept 😦

[zealous wedge]

we're pretending i'm cute so listen to me :3

[viral hornet]

pretending?

no

zml cute

[vestal jasper]

zml u are cute

[heady spear]

I slept until 1pm yesterday

it's fine

I can sleep some other day

[zealous wedge]

lies

[viral hornet]

truth

[vestal jasper]

fuck I need to expand my music tastes

[waxen panther]

gn. .

I have two playlists

[heady spear]

talking about music

[vestal jasper]

this vibes

[viral hornet]

@waxen panther goodnight

[heady spear]

evermore is fucking good

[viral hornet]

yessss

[waxen panther]

😎

yes gn xoxo

[heady spear]

I didn't really like it at first listen but

it's goooood

[vestal jasper]

@waxen panther eyyy

[waxen panther]

i love it

[heady spear]

I lost my playlists when I switched to Apple Music so now I just listen to the same album on repeat until I start hating it

that's how I grew to dislike russian rap

[vestal jasper]

https://open.spotify.com/playlist/7FzBgJcQKKaR0a9Qi3u7Gd?si=ri-a8jy0SpW0GV7vZo4mKQ
https://open.spotify.com/playlist/0hVb9YksFSBYu2kkRh3Us4?si=BV5-U7FgTR-138JNU62kIg

oh hey my full name

nice

enjoy a weird blob of different genres that have 0 relation to each other

[heady spear]

johnny cash

[vestal jasper]

yes

[heady spear]

wtf vic

[vestal jasper]

?

[heady spear]

nothing

[vestal jasper]

@waxen panther give me attention
kinda wanna make a playlist of songs I really vibe with, just chill shit

[heady spear]

var counter: Int = 0
  private set

this would be a mutable field initialized to 0 with a public getter but a private setter, right?

[vestal jasper]

yes

[heady spear]

and you can like both access it by using .counter and also .getCounter() right??

[vestal jasper]

2 yes, 3 idk

actually 3 yes

you can use both, your IDE will just bitch at you for using the get method

[zealous wedge]

well, in kotlin .counter is automatically converted to getCounter

[heady spear]

right I just meant the syntax

they're the same thing

[vestal jasper]

yes both syntaxes are valid

[heady spear]

ok ok

[vestal jasper]

your IDE expects you to use the first whenever possible

and will give you weird looks if you use getters

[heady spear]

properties without local fields are confusing af tho

bruh i think my headphones r borked

right after my bloody chair broke

now am gonna be broke too

why does the world hate me

[zealous wedge]

aww

[heady spear]

lmao

ok ok more kotlin questions

do ppl actually follow the official style conventions

or is it like java land where people are like "o no google knows bettUr" and then there's a huge fight

[zealous wedge]

i kinda do, but sadly there aren't any good customizable kotlin formatters

[merry talon]

i mean

i certainly think google knows better than oracle

[void void]

stackoverflow

[merry talon]

but both of their style guides are super weird iirc so

[heady spear]

Ew there’s someone else at the gym

Why

It’s 5:30am

[zealous wedge]

stare at them until they leave

[heady spear]

They did leave

God I’ve gained so much weight during this pandemic lol

And lost a lot of muscle as well

I look like a seal lmao

Oh well, more to love or something like that

Ew there is someone else here and he looks sue. I’m going home

[ashen cliff]

Daily reminder: The better you know your IDE, the faster you can code.

[still cosmos]

The only way I code is trusting whatever IJ says

[coarse lily]

I made pizza waffles.

They were delish

[untold copper]

interesting concept

[coarse lily]

Yeah the batter had some seasoning in it and we used cauliflower because my partner wanted to keep the bread carbs down.

But then we are like 9 slices of bread so.

[upbeat kelp]

XD

[untold copper]

I like lagging out my own server

interesting

[ashen cliff]

Time to sleep 8 hours in 4 hours.

[untold copper]

*Aggressive Sleeping Intensifies*

[mighty storm]

isz this new?? poggers????

[unique snow]

Welcome to November 2020 ;o

But yes it's relatively new

[mighty storm]

finaly, can ignore pr notifications

[tribal flicker]

if you click P you will realize in fact they have added instagram into fucking minecraft you can now block people

[upbeat kelp]

Anyone played the bounce tales

[blissful sonnet]

Paper needs to come up with their own marketplace, I swear to god ;/

[upbeat kelp]

Paperforums is kinda clunky

[blissful sonnet]

Only paper can save spigot devs lmfao

[upbeat kelp]

XD

[blissful sonnet]

Cause spigot been acting lately

[upbeat kelp]

Paper is killing spigot

[blissful sonnet]

That's why we need an official marketplace from paper

[upbeat kelp]

Yes

[blissful sonnet]

Cause spigot is literally doesn't give a damn thing

[upbeat kelp]

Imagine using spigot

[blissful sonnet]

All of the bs spigot rules

And their "0 motivation" to continue the development of a dead site

Like they haven't added anything since idk 6 years? 😄

The gods of Paper listen to what devs say :>

[severe nexus]

The only big issue is, Spigot has become the go to place for plugins and such

When I need a plugin, I go to spigot

[zealous wedge]

I mean #hangar-dev exists :p

[severe nexus]

Its easy to make a marketplace, its getting the developers to move over to said marketplace though what is hard

[limpid comet]

lots of big names will definitely be moving to hangar

[severe nexus]

100%

[void void]

ٴ ISSOU

[limpid comet]

smaller devs will follow

ill be putting lots of stuff up there as well

[severe nexus]

Paper have that unique position of being very well liked by developers and having a huge following

So make no mistake they know you'll switch

(Which is neat imo ;P)

[coarse lily]

blue what is hangar exactly?

I think I’m unclear on some of the paper projects.

[severe nexus]

Spigots resource section, but better

[coarse lily]

Ah so it’s a web-only thing?

[severe nexus]

Yeah I believe

[coarse lily]

Waterfall is a proxy, paper is the server, paperweight is a build / mapping tool, hangar is a website?

Am I missing anything?

[severe nexus]

hangar is a plugin repository

But yeah, more or less its a website

where you go to get plugins

[coarse lily]

Gotcha

[merry talon]

hangar won't have premium resources

[severe nexus]

I think its a somewhat bad choice to not implement premium resources

[merry talon]

i dont

its been such an utter shitshow over there

[severe nexus]

Thats Spigot though and how they handle premium resources and stuff, I know paper could do a much better job on it

It gives plugin developers another avenue of revenue, which will give them even more reasons to migrate over

[merry talon]

but that's the thing, there is no good way to do it

one party will be mad no matter what

[coarse lily]

Is there a plan to have some other way for developers to monetize stuff?

[severe nexus]

Then they'll continue to use whatever they're happy with, though with Spigots whole resource section and their obfuscation fiasco it gives paper a really big opportunity here

[merry talon]

They could personally set a up a way to sponsor them or purchase enhanced support

that's as far as I would go with it

[coarse lily]

What's the "obfuscation fiasco"?

[severe nexus]

That could be another too

They restrict the amount of obfuscation you can put on premium plugins

therefore making it easier to be leaked

[merry talon]

I think the only acceptable amount is like zero

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[severe nexus]

In an ideal world, but competitors will copy your code, which is why obfuscation exists

And for various other reasons too, security, etc

[limber knot]

yes we get it

everyone wants a marketplace

[merry talon]

they have every right to straight up take your code

as per GPL

[severe nexus]

Yeah thats true

[limber knot]

competitors will copy code

only dum ppl like qball do that

[severe nexus]

xD

[merry talon]

[limber knot]

the rest don't care about copying code

I can assure you

[severe nexus]

I couldn't care if people copied my code, but major companies and such do it and its why it exists sadly

[limber knot]

plugins being bought and sold really puts an artificial value on said code

support contracts, that I can get behind

and that's where the money is for software in general anyways

[severe nexus]

Yeah thats true

mostly the selling and support afterwards where you win since 90% of the time they'll never use it

[limber knot]

what major company makes Minecraft plugins

[severe nexus]

Im talking about in general

[limber knot]

or should I start a business selling MC plugins hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[merry talon]

also as per GPL you must provide the source code if asked anyway

[severe nexus]

Like outside of Minecraft lmao

[merry talon]

afaik that applies here

soooo

[severe nexus]

But theres nothing anyone can do if they refuse to give the code lol

[merry talon]

its very unlikely

but I dont like the idea of building a business model around that weirdness

at all

[severe nexus]

Meh business is business at the end of the day, if it works it works

I don't really do much in terms of plugins anymore now-a-days

couple of plugins here and there for servers but other than that i do mostly web design work xD

so I can be somewhat out of the loop on the newest things

[zealous wedge]

well, if any of us had the money for lawyers there are things we could do :)

[severe nexus]

Yeah thats true xD

[coarse lily]

Not all of the plugins are GPL, though.

I haven’t tried to sell any Minecraft stuff I’ve written but I’ve also made very, very little of it public.

And I don’t GPL my code generally b

Depends on the use case, really b

Ugh typing is hard. Lots of rogue b.

[still cosmos]

If i make in a folder, and then reinstall my system, do I still have to make again or just sudo checkinstall and be happy?

[coarse lily]

If you reinstalled the system you’d need to run make again.

Although I’ll be honest I don’t have a lot of experience with checkinstall

So maybe don’t listen to me.

[still cosmos]

wait why it wont compile in a folder where i have the source code but rather in my system files

[coarse lily]

It does look like checkinstall will run make install by default

[still cosmos]

you dont seem to understand me rn

[coarse lily]

Ah, I misunderstood.

No if you have a dir called foo and you run make in it and then save that folder you’ll have what you need.

[still cosmos]

so i just rerun checkinstall and i'll be fine

[coarse lily]

Should be, yeah. Although it does depend on the makefile.

But generally, yes.

[still cosmos]

good, thanks

[coarse lily]

A lot of make files will put a binary in /usr/local

Or similar

So you may lose that binary and need to run make again.

But it looks like checkinstall will check that and re-run make if needed.

[still cosmos]

i hop between distros pretty frequently because i never like anything

[coarse lily]

But you can check the makefile and see if it’s going to install shit anywhere else.

Also make -n install will output what it would do without actually doing it.

[still cosmos]

CMAKE_BINARY_DIR this?

[coarse lily]

No, that’s the build tree top level.

The same as the source

If you’re hopping distros often you’re probably going to have a bad time.

And/or be rebuilding stuff a lot.

[merry talon]

just use arch

there's nothing to not like because you choose everything

[coarse lily]

Ha

[merry talon]

actual advice

[coarse lily]

I haven't used desktop linux in forever.

But for servers I'm Debian4Life

(And occasionally Ubuntu)

[limpid comet]

sorry ocelot was busy

[coarse lily]

No worries blue

[limpid comet]

seems like you got the gist of it tho yeah?

[coarse lily]

Not even remotely time sensitive and other folks answered.

Yeah

[limpid comet]

very epic win

[coarse lily]

\m/

[limpid comet]

hangar is probably gonna be one of the best things for the community in a while imo

[coarse lily]

Yeah I'm looking at it now.

It would be nice to have a decent centralized place for plugins.

[limpid comet]

exactly

[coarse lily]

Spigot forum is alright

[limpid comet]

one with proper leadership

[coarse lily]

In that it exists.

But yeah.

[limpid comet]

lol

and no premium \o/

once i get my footing with plugins again I'm gonna attempt the premium support model, see how that goes

[coarse lily]

How do you think you'll structure that?

[limpid comet]

not sure yet, in the beginning phases of the idea

[coarse lily]

I could see some folks being interested in a premium option where they get to make feature requests/adjustments/etc. Which is an interesting concept.

[limpid comet]

thinking ill have a smaller monthly subscription which gives priority support and feature requests to all my stuff

yep

[coarse lily]

"Hey I love this thing but my server does X and if this did Y it would be awesome"

[limpid comet]

not every plugin I make will be a part of it

[coarse lily]

nod

[limpid comet]

the bigger cooler plugins will have premium support, but my other simpler ones/ones that just improve on an already existing idea will be free

and there will still be community support channels

and of course, everything FOSS & GPL

[coarse lily]

I think sometimes a lot of people forget that this all got started by using/forking existing free plugins and getting all kinds of help from people.

[limpid comet]

yeah exactly

I've learned so much from just looking at how other people do things and I want to contribute to that experience with my own stuff

but ofc, everyone gotta make money :p

[coarse lily]

Yeah exactly.

Haha

Yeah.

I never saw Minecraft as a money making venture.

Although it certainly would be cool.

[limpid comet]

i used to make some good money from commissions

nothing that i want to base my life's income around obviously

[coarse lily]

I also go through phases. Because sometimes my day job is doing a lot of Java stuff I occasionally get sick of messing with Minecraft.

[unkempt drift]

Two seconds, banning bluely from hangar

[limpid comet]

WTF

rigged

[coarse lily]

Haha

[unkempt drift]

Not so different from spigot now huh? 😆😆

[limpid comet]

the m in machine maker stands for md5 actually

[unkempt drift]

Whoa

[limpid comet]

Sorry

Too far

[coarse lily]

md5achine_Maker doesn't really roll off the tongue.

[unkempt drift]

Yeah, this is my alt. 😈

[limpid comet]

gaining power from the inside, smart

hostile takeover style

[olive marlin]

Hmm, that'd explain why he'd ignore my PRs for months 🤔

Love it getting 4 notifications in 3 different languages.

[earnest swan]

.fbi

NO

.help

wait

fib command that points to this video? https://admincraft.host/fbi

[vernal moth]

Isn't that https://offlinemo.de

Ah no

Oh it is

[coarse lily]

Ha

[cosmic raft]

when will people learn

https://github.com/minecraft-dev/MinecraftDev/issues/802

[golden gust]

bahahahhahaaaaa

you think people are capable of learning

cute

[coarse lily]

Haha

I dunno why people cling to 1.7/1.8

[mossy vessel]

With that name, not much to expect.

[coarse lily]

I could see saying "I just wrote a whole bunch of shit for 1.16.3 and I can't migrate to 1.16.4 right now"

But 1.7? C'mon, man.

kashike did you see our krad5000 Skyblock build from this weekend?

Was playing to donate to charity.

[cosmic raft]

no

[coarse lily]

https://i.imgur.com/ZeOhfKg.png

[cosmic raft]

neat

[coarse lily]

I need monthly kashike validation to go on.

[minor badge]

kashike is neat

[coarse lily]

Truth.

[golden gust]

can tell it's only 10 days away, damn

[coarse lily]

No joke.

Also WTF happened to December.

[golden gust]

what december?

[void void]

Christmas is cancelled

[coarse lily]

I got a tree and everything.

[void void]

sad

[viral hornet]

Every time I see this I still laugh hahaha

[limpid comet]

oh wut you guys maintain the ij mc extension?

[quasi valley]

demon does

[limpid comet]

that's awesome

thanks demon

[minor badge]

demon is great

[untold copper]

third time.

[potent fossil]

proxi is cute

[limber knot]

smh my head

[untold copper]

and smart

[vernal moth]

You only really appreciate the mc ij plugin when you use mixins

It's soooooo goood

[sonic gull]

hey how can I make a Minecraft server on PaperMC

[viral hornet]

https://papermc.io/downloads to get the latest version

[potent fossil]

1. download paper mc
2. run it

[vernal moth]

Download that jar from our website and run it :)

[viral hornet]

Replace your spigot jar, stop/start your server, configure away!

Welcome to better performance

[vernal moth]

Basically replace it with whatever you used before

Also: backups, but that should be a no-brainer

[sonic gull]

well I have been trying to do that all day

[vernal moth]

Where have you been stuck?

And generally, #paper-help is filled with ppl eager to help you :)

[viral hornet]

I hope there's a fourth 😛

[vestal jasper]

7

[viral hornet]

vic 🥺

[vestal jasper]

Hi

[limber knot]

<M​r.​ S​no​op​a> and smart --- Agree to disagree :o

Camm 😃

[viral hornet]

Proxi 😄

In your weird IRC form

[limber knot]

among us with me and the coworkers on friday ? 😳

[undone crest]

Is there a plugin that has the same feature as protected area (like the spawn area protection) but can be placed on multiple locations?

[viral hornet]

Depends what time that is for me :P
But otherwise yesss

[golden gust]

You mean like worldguard?

[viral hornet]

Uhh, WorldGuard?

Yeah what cat said

If you're lazy (please don't read this matt) you could literally just copy the flags from one region to another

[coarse lily]

Haha

[potent fossil]

i hope matt reads this

[viral hornet]

simple pls

🥺

[potent fossil]

.taco Camm

[limber knot]

hands Camm a delicious soft-shell taco filled with various meats and topped with salsa, sour cream and cheese!

[viral hornet]

Naww

[potent fossil]

okay then

[viral hornet]

What's wrong simple

[potent fossil]

hands Camm a shrimp from the barbey

[viral hornet]

😠

[potent fossil]

fair dinkum

[viral hornet]

WE DONT
COOK SHRIMP
ON BARBEY

Simple stop this

🥺

[coarse lily]

Man now I want tacos.

[potent fossil]

Hey cunt, be a right fantastic fair dinkum aussie and trow a shrimp on the barbey for me but be wary dont let the dingos eat ya babey while yah back is turned cunt right?"

[viral hornet]

I forgot that you existed
And i thought that it would kill me but it didn't
and it was so niiiiceee
so peacful and quiiiettt
I forgot that you existed
It isn't love, it isn't hate, it's just indifference

[potent fossil]

Nice song lyrics

[viral hornet]

Thanks

I was listening to this song whilst you were typing that out and I knew what it was going to be

so I figured it was fitting

❤️

[twin lagoon]

that sounds exactly like camm

[viral hornet]

get fucked

[still cosmos]

I forgot that you existed
Sounds like a Cat quote

[mossy vessel]

hot

[twin lagoon]

get fucked cunt

[viral hornet]

on ya bike mate

[viral hornet]

no u

[mossy vessel]

[twin lagoon]

@mossy vessel uwu

[mossy vessel]

[viral hornet]

omg i have a new pleading

kinda

[twin lagoon]

[viral hornet]

[vestal jasper]

Time to sleep for 3 hours weee

[viral hornet]

night vicccc

Fix carbon tomorrow ty xoxo

[worn ember]

I open paper and the first thing I see is this

All over my screen cx

[golden gust]

Yea, it sucks when you get it all over the screen

Oh, you mean, nvm

[quasi valley]

[minor badge]

cat 😳

[coarse lily]

Alright, 2AM.

That's enough for tonight.

G'night folks.

[potent fossil]

Ocelot can't handle paper after dark

Or, mainly, Paper when Cat is awake

[worn ember]

I just got a minehut ad on instagram lmao

[void void]

Do

Do paper specific plugins

perform better over Bukkit or spigot ones

[golden gust]

no

They're plugins

[void void]

Ok so I'll use spigot ones

[golden gust]

they perform as well as they're built to perform

Nothing inherent to spigot vs paper plugins that would make them faster outside of the fact that paper plugins have access to a few things like the async chunks API, etc

But, those plugins still have to actually use those api's for performance gains, etc

[worn ember]

If you don't need paper methods build against spigot

[void void]

build?

I'm not java developer

[golden gust]

DED is DUM

[worn ember]

Ok well u suck then

[golden gust]

nou

[void void]

bro i know Julia

More epic than Java

[golden gust]

DED, remember scary movie?

[worn ember]

Julia is a slut smh smh

[golden gust]

The doofy scene?

[worn ember]

Ye

[golden gust]

You're the vacuum cleaner.

[worn ember]

Ah

Ur the black guy that goes "run bitch runnnn"

[golden gust]

Graaab my strooong hand

[worn ember]

Lmao

Are you a leftie?

[golden gust]

only when the lights go out

[worn ember]

I'm double handed

[nova dust]

Hey 🙂 Do you know if Paper spigot is better than Vanilla for a vanilla server ?

For the performances

[golden gust]

yes

[still cosmos]

for performance - yes

for your precious complex mechanics - no

[golden gust]

assuming you're not using a toaster

[nova dust]

What do you mean by mechanics ?

Redstone ?

[golden gust]

edge case redstone mechanics, etc

most people won't notice

[still cosmos]

stuff that only players with >900 vision will notice

[void void]

Villagers

[nova dust]

Oh ok I guess i will not ahah

[golden gust]

if you want vanilla perfection, use fabric + lithum + sodium or whatever it was

[still cosmos]

sodium

[void void]

Use forge

[golden gust]

forge doesn't do anything for performance

[still cosmos]

client-side mod replacing the rendering engine

[void void]

But it has cool mods

[still cosmos]

ahem it's phoshpor

[golden gust]

Don't ping

and, cool

they want performance

[nova dust]

Oh ok I ll test it thanks !!

[void void]

I use tuinity

[worn ember]

banned

[void void]

No!!!!!

I have a 1.8.8 lobby that is Paper

so i use paper

[nova dust]

So for less lag on the server (less possible rollback) I need to use Paper as server and Sodium as client mod ?

[void void]

No

I mean

[golden gust]

writes NightWolf's name down for the techbuchet

[void void]

The paper part is true

[golden gust]

use fabric + lithum + phospher if you want vanilla mechanics + performance

sodium is a client mod which you don't need, but, if you want moar FPS 🤷‍♂️

[nova dust]

Ok !

[void void]

I think you can also use mojang server

it works

[golden gust]

Seriously...

We know, and they know, that you can use the mojang server

They asked about increasing performance

[void void]

A lot of people don't even know that mojang vanilla server jar is a thing

[golden gust]

Literally any competent moron knows the vanilla server jar is a thing

[worn ember]

cuz its not even worth using lol

[golden gust]

However, people want plugins, mods, moar performance, etc than vanilla can offer

[void void]

Why doesn't the original JAR fix these performance issues

[still cosmos]

because Mojang™️

[worn ember]

is there anyone crazy enough to have a public server with only datapacks and vanilla server?

there must be right

[sand epoch]

paper switches to mojang mappings and then mojang merges all of paper 😎

[void void]

Realms are tecnically vanilla t

[worn ember]

true

[void void]

And there are a lot of them

I've played on a few

[worn ember]

might aswel just get a minehut server kekw

[potent fossil]

there are servers like that ded

they call themselves pure vanilla or something

[fallen oracle]

Hey Simple

[void void]

SMP vanilla

[golden gust]

pure vanilla, seems legit

Who needs TPS

runs

[potent fossil]

Hey Sexy

[fallen oracle]

@potent fossil 1 year ago today, we started MCBanners.

[potent fossil]

[void void]

UwU

Actually

We considered switching to Magma at some point

[still cosmos]

oh god

[potent fossil]

The forge bukkit hybrid? Don't.

That's as much of a joke as the other one

[void void]

well we do have mods in a small backend, but it's sponge

[potent fossil]

Sponge is the better choice

[void void]

And only 10 players use mod

so not worth risking switching jar

[void void]

What's wrong with it

[worn ember]

plugins just arent made to work together with mods

[potent fossil]

Forge and Bukkit are distinct APIs. It's a literal frankenstein's monster.

Just don't.

[void void]

Well sponge has plugins too

[worn ember]

all your mods will bypass the plugins

[golden gust]

it's not even a plugin issue

[worn ember]

yes then use sponge

[potent fossil]

Sponge is made for that

[golden gust]

it's a bukkit issue

[still cosmos]

Because Sponge plugins are made for Sponge

[golden gust]

Bukkit made lots of dumb choices which mean that it's just not as expandable as sponge, for example

[quasi valley]

which is why Bukkit's also become worse and worse with Minecraft itself becoming more open with its datapacks in mind and such

[void void]

Like we are searching for a more modern and better designed server for our lobbies. They currently use too many resources

[golden gust]

even sponge has it's own issues around mods, but, it does a lot much of a better job there

more modern

The thing is that people want fast

[void void]

I want fast too

[golden gust]

Not, like, use less resources fast, but, actually looks visually fast to users

That generally means using more resources on the server to distribute the work across

[void void]

Memory is the main issue of java

[golden gust]

memory is not the main issue

[void void]

We looked at Cuberite at.some point

[golden gust]

memory really hasn't been an issue for time

The biggest issue is core related and inefficent memory usage, which has nothing at all to do with java

[worn ember]

people not managing memory is the issue

[golden gust]

You can write software as shit as MC is in C, won't be much faster

you're you're throwing out literally gigs of ram every second, that's not good

[void void]

Yeah but the thing is that there should be a special solution optimized for lobby servers

[vernal moth]

There are

[still cosmos]

you're you're

[potent fossil]

well magma definitely does not fit that description

[void void]

I know

Magma was another topic

[worn ember]

the proxy uses like no resources, the lobby uses as much as you make it use 🙂

[golden gust]

Well, the best type of server for a lobby is one which does quite literally nothing

Which, goes against the entire concept of a general server

[void void]

We found this as well but it does not seem complete yet. The memory and CPU usages promised are really great
https://github.com/basinserver/basin

[golden gust]

There are limbo servers which support that type of thing

"not complete" == "uses not as much resources"

No shit

as soon as they get feature parity, especially if they follow mojangs impl decisions, they're not gonna be much better

[void void]

I mean not complete is exactly what one would look for in a lobby servee

We can't just remove stuff from paper as it would take years

[golden gust]

if you removed literally every mob, TE, and ticking block from MC, it would perform muuuuuuch better

It's literally an entire "no shit" there

Yes, you can

[quasi valley]

but then you can also screw having an interesting lobby lol

[golden gust]

a weekend of patching stuff at most

And that weekend is mostly gonna be deciding what you wanna take out

[worn ember]

cat, we're just mere mortals we dont even know how to patch

[vernal moth]

It also just takes a weekend to learn it

If I can do it drunk, you can do it sober 😂

[worn ember]

so thats 2 weekends already smh smh

[golden gust]

It's literally all written in english

I was using the patching system in like a day

[void void]

No

[golden gust]

And this was years ago, if you have basic familiarity with git, the scripts are babyish

[undone crest]

how long will it take for an average person to build a plugin that gives a specific new slash command?
because I'm on day 2 and I still haven't made it work

[potent fossil]

if you know what you're doing like 3 minutes

[void void]

Java is very boilerplate

[undone crest]

Damn you're a God

[void void]

It take sometime

[worn ember]

i'll get into patching eventually, i just dont feel like i can contribute much to paper right now

[void void]

Bro PR lobby mode

ty

[undone crest]

Thank you Camm for recommending World Guard, I just saw it right now

[lean kiln]

with my new kotlin DSL it takes 1 second

manager.buildAndRegister("newslashcommand") {
    handler { ctx ->
        ctx.sender.sendMessage(Component.text("Hello!", NamedTextColor.GREEN))
    }
}

[potent fossil]

amazing

[lean kiln]

lol cant tell if your being sarcastic

[worn ember]

but meh annotation commands

should i make my own api to fetch jars from my server or should i just use jenkins restapi?

[lean kiln]

for what

[waxen panther]

Dependabot supports kts build files now pog

[lean kiln]

it has