sk-discussion

[coarse leaf]

The first time this variety happens is probably the two different completely entrances to C.Peaks

[trail orchid]

In Ori you can choose order of areas as well (in 2 at least)

What?..

[vivid belfry]

you're gonna have to be more specific then, because when you say Ori people are going to assume you're talking about the first game

[lilac sapphire]

Superficial non-linearity imo

[shy kiln]

The ways to complete HK that I know of (oversimplified):

1. Kill the dreamers and defeat THK.
2. Kill the dreamers and get VH and defeat THK.
3. Kill the dreamers and get VH and kill the Radiance.
4. Defeat all bosses to complete PoH, dreamers not required.

Not counting ETV+Flower ending because it can go to hell.

[vivid belfry]

Ori 1 and Ori 2 actually aren't similar at all structurally

[trail orchid]

OK then, again: to be clear, I'm talking about the second game

[shy kiln]

Now in this, each point can elaborated to like 3-4 more.

[vivid belfry]

alright then, I don't see what you're talking about when you mention confusing side objectives

[lilac sapphire]

You have to do them all anyway

[vivid belfry]

I never thought Ori 2 was any better about collectibles than HK

[marsh ibex]

I think they’re referring to…health and soul upgrades?

[coarse leaf]

Not even "all" in the 4th one lmao

[trail orchid]

I mean that seems like a pretty limited way to measure metroidvania's nonlinearity, Super Metroid for example only has 1 option

So by your logic one of the 2 games that literally coined the genre isn't a part of it

[vivid belfry]

it's not their logic, they're making the mistake of trying to cotton to your logic

[brittle tangle]

Metroid has many endings

[shy kiln]

Bruh.

[shy kiln]

I haven’t played Metroid so I don’t really know.

[vivid belfry]

there's no reason for anyone to say that having one ending makes a game linear, but you're the one who brought that up

[marsh ibex]

Super metroid has two endings tho right

saving the animals and not saving them

[coarse leaf]

what are yall doing

[marsh ibex]

sure there’s a canon one iirc but there’s variation in the order in which you can tackle things

[trail orchid]

Well, for example, the one bug who gives you strong charms that are breakable can give you strong versions of that, and the way to figure out what to give him was impossible for me without a guide - meanwhile nothing about Ori 2 was like that at all, there's always a questlog for everything

[marsh ibex]

reverse boss order is a thing after all

you’re “meant” to do ridley last but you can do him first if you want to

[shy kiln]

And this too. As I said, that’s just an oversimplification. Those points can be elaborated much more. You can get like 4 more sub-points for each point. Heck, some might say that it those sub-points that should be considered and not the oversimplification.

[trail orchid]

https://tenor.com/view/umm-confused-blinking-okay-white-guy-blinking-gif-7513882

[vivid belfry]

idk Divine is pretty obviously the same kind of bug as leg eater

[coarse leaf]

That's true, but mentioning the different endings is a pretty quick way to say that "yeah this game has different paths"

[trail orchid]

That's more of a small variation though

[vivid belfry]

I don't even think these things are correlated tbh

undertale is an entirely linear game with multiple endings

[brittle tangle]

Also she pretty clearly talks about charms, and she tells you that it is not dcrest

[lilac sapphire]

TC has stated that they don't necessarily want all players to find every secret, it makes for a more alive world that way

[vivid belfry]

there are certainly examples of HK having shit that's unacceptably hard to find, but this is not one of them

Weaver's den, white defender,

no I think that's it

[marsh ibex]

Path of Pain

[brittle tangle]

Also doesn’t the quest log sort of make it more linear

[shy kiln]

How did Undertale come here all of a sudden? I went for like 1 minute lol.

[coarse leaf]

just an example

[vivid belfry]

not required in any capacity so I give it a pass

[marsh ibex]

I don’t

[coarse leaf]

unacceptably hard? dont you mean impossible

[shy kiln]

WD isn’t required either.

[stark estuary]

He gives a percentage

[lilac sapphire]

Weaver's den wasn't required for completion either in the first patch

[marsh ibex]

unacceptably hard to find

[vivid belfry]

no dream bosses give %

[shy kiln]

White Defender doesn’t??

[stark estuary]

Godhome

[coarse leaf]

pop's quite literally impossible to find along with some other stuff like zoternal ordeal

[vivid belfry]

WD isn't technically required but he still affects progression because of essence

[stark estuary]

P4

[shy kiln]

You can do P4 without him.

[lilac sapphire]

You xanvt

[stark estuary]

Oh, guess he's not required then

[shy kiln]

Kirb, are you the same knowledgeable Kirb I know?

[lilac sapphire]

You can only skip zote and gidtamer in pantheons

[vivid belfry]

there is no benefit to doing path of pain or eternal ordeal in terms of progression

[stark estuary]

Why would I know that WD is unnecessary for P4

[shy kiln]

Or did someone kidnap you and is now using your account?

[coarse leaf]

all the 4 dream guys are always unlocked in P4

[silver oak]

Yeah stuff like that with extremely minor non-gameplay rewards are okay to have hidden like that

[stark estuary]

I thought that was only GT and Zote

[lilac sapphire]

Wait what

[trail orchid]

I don't think so, I think it just makes it more clear, linearity to me is more about choice than clarity

[shy kiln]

Wait what? But in my first playthrough I had not fought him and he was in P4.

[lilac sapphire]

Just how inconsistent can this game be

[silver oak]

Tho I have to say Eternal Ordeal reward is pretty sick

[shy kiln]

I didn’t even know he existed until I did P4 lol.

[marsh ibex]

oh WD is very buggy in godhomd

[shy kiln]

godhomd.

[marsh ibex]

his acheevos are wack

[coarse leaf]

i forgot FC existed after i ragequitted then was like "oh this guy" at p4

[stark estuary]

Ok in my defence: what the hell?

That feels so random

[shy kiln]

You know, you used to know everything. But apparently you don’t.

[stark estuary]

As someone who bought the game before GT I had no idea WD wasn't needed to unlock P4

[coarse leaf]

gamer actually knew the kirb 2 and not kirb 3

can u please bring kirb 2 back for 2 minutes

[shy kiln]

So I thought that maybe someone has kidnapped you and is now using your account.

[vivid belfry]

It really is complete bullshit

[shy kiln]

Yeah that too.

[lilac sapphire]

Exactly

[vivid belfry]

The fact that they have locks on the P4 door at all should be evidence that they're required

[lilac sapphire]

And then there's zote who doesn't even appear if you don't get him

[stark estuary]

Yeah that's whack

[shy kiln]

[coarse leaf]

he doesn't appear on the lock even if you get him iirc

he's just a "haha you did him once? fuck you bitch get his 3rd variant now"

[trail orchid]

I don't think there is anything wrong with Silksong taking some inspiration from Ori 2, after all Ori 2 did the same to the original Hollow Knight

[keen blaze]

[marsh ibex]

I still don’t know what you’re talking about because I never played ori 2

[shy kiln]

Ummm…… that’s a swift topic change?

[marsh ibex]

or watched a playthrough

[stark estuary]

Ori 2 is mid

[marsh ibex]

That was literally the prior topic what

[coarse leaf]

honestly for the difficulty of GPZ 3, TC made the worst decision ever to just put him as a surprise

[lilac sapphire]

I don't think anyone argued against that

[vivid belfry]

I still don't understand what SS is hypothetically taking from ori 2

[stark estuary]

Also I'm not really sure what inspiration you're talking about

Goddammit snail

[shy kiln]

Oh. In my defence, I came when we were talking about linearity in HK so I didn’t know.

[coarse leaf]

i came at the exact same moment after monitoring your entire life and even i knew it was about ori, haha ratio skill issue

[trail orchid]

The combat for example

The charm system

[shy kiln]

Ok.

[stark estuary]

The combat and Charm system that Ori 2 shamelessly yoinked from the original HK

Yeah ok

[marsh ibex]

sky I think we’re asking for the reverse

[vivid belfry]

My entire experience playing Ori 2 was "yeah this is pretty good" and then the final boss was cool

[trail orchid]

Silksong looks like it's focusing more on platforming than the original, which is a type of evolution that Ori had to the average metroidvania

[marsh ibex]

What do you want silksong to take from Ori 2

[vivid belfry]

My experience playing HK was the dawning realization that I was playing my new favorite media experience of all time

[stark estuary]

It having platforming doesn't mean it took inspiration from Ori 2 what

[trail orchid]

Wait a minute, HK doesn't have a monopoly on the concept of equipping things that change your stats

[stark estuary]

I really hated the combat system

[shy kiln]

When did he say that?

[coarse leaf]

is it focusing more on platforming than HK? i mean they could always just put the platforming parts more in the 1-2min trailers

[lilac sapphire]

Then ori doesn't have a monopoly on platforming either

[trail orchid]

Nor does having a more melee focused combat

[vivid belfry]

Silksong is focusing more on platforming and combat

[trail orchid]

He didn't, but that's what his argument is alluding to

[shy kiln]

I guess.

[trail orchid]

The way I interpreted it

[trail orchid]

Which is why I wasn't saying "shamelessly yonked" as if there's ownership of anything here

[marsh ibex]

Ok I think there’s confusion on both sices

[trail orchid]

It's like when FPSs were once called Doom clones

[stark estuary]

#sk-discussion message

[marsh ibex]

Kirb asked what inspiration Silksong is taking from Ori 2

[trail orchid]

Not necessarily, but I think it's possible

[marsh ibex]

You answered with stuff that Ori 2 took inspiration from the first HK game

that’s why Kirb answered the way they djd

[trail orchid]

Being less cryptic (from a level design standpoint, not a storytelling standpoint)

[lilac sapphire]

How would that be inspiration from ori

[stark estuary]

Yeah sure, but that's not really something that makes sense to attribute to Ori 2 in particular

[sly summit]

hi ss disc

[marsh ibex]

Wait does ori have map markers that specifically tell you where to go

[vivid belfry]

HK isn't cryptic with its level design

[lilac sapphire]

Yws

[marsh ibex]

oh

I don’t like that

[vivid belfry]

It's extremely obvious which upgrades overcome which obstacles

[lilac sapphire]

The current objective is always on the map

[trail orchid]

I just think it's likely considering most other popular metroidvanias aren't as focused on Ori's type of "bouncy" platforming, which is what Silksong is shaping up to be

[marsh ibex]

like I’m fine with it

If it’s optional?

[lilac sapphire]

And side quests are on the map as well

[stark estuary]

HK level design is fine aside from the few examples Grover and you were discussing earlier

[marsh ibex]

but taking the metroidvania out of the metroidvania

[lilac sapphire]

It's not

[marsh ibex]

is a little eh

[stark estuary]

Ori 2 has a lot of baffling design decisions

[sly summit]

I havent played ori 2, ori 1 is a cool game, at first u ask urself why there are even enemies, on late game u realise that enemies are no more than another form of movement for u

[marsh ibex]

like if all of the mask shards and upgrades were on the map

[stark estuary]

Ori 2 tried to fix this and failed miserably

[marsh ibex]

I feel like that’d lessen the experience for me

[sly summit]

is far from my favs tho

[trail orchid]

But for example I often find myself backtracking through an entire map every time I find an upgrade trying to remember where each obstacle is

Much less so in Ori

[vivid belfry]

Having a linear metroidvania that holds your hand like skyrim the whole time is preferable to a frustrating experience where it takes you an hour to find the next mandatory location after beating a boss, but HK isn't like that

HK is superior to both of those because the progression is naturally smooth, allowing multiple paths forward at any given time so it's basically impossible to get stuck

[lilac sapphire]

Oh that's optional yeah, but you are always told exactly where you need to go for the quests

[sly summit]

oh I just realised Pascal.... DO THE THING!!!

[marsh ibex]

it’s not like HK was hiding that though

[trail orchid]

I'm not talking about the objective, I'm talking about important upgrades that help you overcome the tough boss that's likely waiting for you at the objective... like the charm slots half of which are pretty easy to miss (from what I remember)

[vivid belfry]

HK is easy about this for 2 reasons

1. the map actually looks like the rooms so you can tell where things are at a glance
2. map markers

[lilac sapphire]

Also sky out I assume you've watched the gmtk video right

[lilac sapphire]

[marsh ibex]

!wiki Notches

[mental swallow]

https://hollowknight.fandom.com/wiki/Category:Charms#Notches

Content of this category:
46 pages

[sly summit]

doing the thing is the only think I liked about the messenger

[marsh ibex]

Most notches are outright given to you

from salubra

the only confusing one is the one in like, fog canyon

But there’s this whole special room dedicated to it

[lilac sapphire]

I feel offended

[marsh ibex]

it makes sense that there’d be something there

[sly summit]

The combat is meh, the movement is just good, story was good, art style was good... DOING THE THING!? God

I mean, the combat of the messenger is smashing attack

and u are almost immortal

[vivid belfry]

A game doesn't need to have complicated combat to be good, IE hollow knight

[stark estuary]

Yeah combat wasn't its strong point but that's fine, it isn't supposed to be the primary focus

[trail orchid]

OK, but:

1. While in Ori the open paths you haven't yet took are clearly defined, in HK there isn't always a part of the map that is clearly "branched off" to make it clear you haven't been there yet and so I can miss it by accident
2. forgetting to mark things, which my ADHD brain makes me tend to do, can be a real hassle

[trail orchid]

Yeah that was a huge bitch

I have no idea how you find that one without a guide

[sly summit]

the hook is so cool... with that the movement is cool, I just felt slow with all the backtracking needed and no option to dash or run

[vivid belfry]

Hollow knight also clearly defines paths you haven't taken

Because unexplored rooms show up as open doors on the map

[marsh ibex]

You see a challenge there and can clearly imply that there’s some form of upgrade there

like that pogoing spike challenge to find the grub in crossroads

[vivid belfry]

If you haven't gone through an open door, you go through it

[marsh ibex]

Except you can’t see the “grub” in that scenario

[trail orchid]

I remember that not always being the case

[vivid belfry]

I don't and I did a blind playthrough before map markers

[lilac sapphire]

The messenger is one of my favorite comedies, on top of being a very fun game. Idk, the boss combat was extremely fun for me, and I didn't mind the backtracking.
But the writing is just exquisite

[coarse leaf]

you look on the map, and go where you havent been, its pretty simple

[trail orchid]

I wish that, like Ori, it let you chart your own path without either having no map at all or having to buy something that reveals all of it

[trail orchid]

The thing is that due to being such a huge game, all those implications are easy to forget or mistake for one another, which is why I like how Ori always kept track of everything for you

[marsh ibex]

I think you have an issue with metroidvanias in general

because these are genre tropes that you’re listing as issues

[coarse leaf]

actually, about 2, i think that a lot of important places are already automatically marked

[vivid belfry]

Map markers

Use them

[burnt topaz]

some things are when you buy the markers from iselda

[coarse leaf]

if you do this for the whole game, you will find the large majority of stuff, the only exceptions i can think of are like, things like the grimm troupe or other stuff thats behind breakable walls

[burnt topaz]

stuff like the roots, springs, benches etc

[vivid belfry]

The game design problems you are describing are actually caused by you not utilizing the tools given to you

[coarse leaf]

dream warriors are definitely one of the more important ones and they're marked the moment you find them, also how places like the snail homes are literally made to stand out on the map along with their names

for examples

[trail orchid]

Wait, I think I'm partially mistaking Ori 2's system with HK's a bit

[coarse leaf]

i think the current auto marked stuff is already fair

[marsh ibex]

oof

happens in a lot of things

but yeah stuff like benches, warrior dreams etc are auto marked

[trail orchid]

Maybe

[marsh ibex]

and you have other markers that can be used to offset the issues you have

[trail orchid]

I do, but I keep forgetting what it is that I marked and backtracking often takes very long, especially in the early game

[burnt topaz]

yeah, you start marking stuff out like grubs and then it loses a bit of the discovery, and even then the collectors map exists

[coarse leaf]

ok yeah WHERE are my marker names jfdjfdfjfd;ls[pfd[

[marsh ibex]

I just use them color wise

[coarse leaf]

let me name some random shit as "poop house"

[trail orchid]

OK, so in HK you either can't see anything on the map or you buy something that lets you chart things, whereas in Ori you start out by charting parts based on areas you visited and maps reveal everything... correct?

[lilac sapphire]

.......you lost me on the second part

[tawdry valley]

Also 3 linear paths

[coarse leaf]

i havent played ori, but the way you described it sounds similar to what HK does if you rememebr that iselda exists

[tawdry valley]

That got sent late because of my internet connection

[vivid belfry]

backtracking in HK is so much easier than every other metroidvania

the movement is insanely fast, every area is riddled with shortcuts, and you can just jump over most of the enemies if you don't want to deal with them

[trail orchid]

Essentially what I like about Ori is how it streamlines a lot of this stuff

While maintaining an interconnected design and exploration

[coarse leaf]

honestly having to remember where the commonly visited locations are is only an early game issue in HK because everything that iselda sells becomes pretty cheap the moment you get out of greenpath imo

[trail orchid]

I don't know... from my experience it felt too long

[coarse leaf]

and in early game it's not like there's too many locations to remember anyway

[vivid belfry]

play an actually bad metroidvania and you will recognize how good you have it

[marsh ibex]

late game you have stag stations, dreamgate, cheart and trams

[vivid belfry]

play fuckin circle of the moon

[trail orchid]

Yeah but in the early game there are a lot of inaccessible secrets and limited markers

[vivid belfry]

actually you don't even have to do that

[trail orchid]

And I hate forgetting to mark them

[marsh ibex]

those…inaccessible secrets are a staple of metroivanias?

[vivid belfry]

play Blasphemous and you will cry tears of joy the next time you feel HK's movement

[marsh ibex]

Grover that’s an awful argument

[vivid belfry]

and Blasphemous is actually good

[marsh ibex]

“Other things are worse so this is good by default”

[trail orchid]

I never figured out how to even activate the trams lol

[marsh ibex]

What

[trail orchid]

The stag stations are great though

[vivid belfry]

I'm saying all other things are worse

[marsh ibex]

you

did you never find the tram pass

[vivid belfry]

name me a metroidvania with snappier backtracking than hollow knight

[stark estuary]

If you want to play a bad metroidvania play Kirby and the Amazing Mirror

[marsh ibex]

Kirb stop

You’re giving me flashbacks

[stark estuary]

Dead ends

[marsh ibex]

oh god that was one of the worst metroidvanias I have ever played

[stark estuary]

Also the map

[coarse leaf]

Hollow Kirby

[marsh ibex]

The areas didn’t make sense connecting wise

[vivid belfry]

I never backtracked in Ori 2 because it was too boring to be worth it

[marsh ibex]

the map was not helpful

and getting to new areas was urufhfjlaod

[trail orchid]

Yes, but my issue is how they tend to be on separate edges of the map and so I keep backtracking everywhere every time I find a new upgrade, and there are so many of them...

[vivid belfry]

and here's my critical argument about how ori handles backtracking

[marsh ibex]

shut up new mod

[vivid belfry]

backtracking in Ori doesn't feel like a continuation of exploration, it feels like a chore

[stark estuary]

wdym you didn't go back to complete enemy gauntlet #627 in order to get a random health upgrade that you don't need because combat encounters are piss and there's no penalty to dying????!?

[coarse leaf]

boomer

[vivid belfry]

backtracking in HK could cause you to stumble into an entirely new area of the map

this happens to most people in greenpath with howling cliffs

[trail orchid]

(Because I don't remember what upgrade unlocks what)

[vivid belfry]

sorry, your fault for not memorizing an entire metroidvania map instantly on your first playthrough

[stark estuary]

As they say in #hk-discussion , "skill issue".

[keen blaze]

Hey wait a minute-

[vivid belfry]

unironically, being lost is part of the metroidvania experience so don't get upset if you don't remember where things are immediately

[trail orchid]

So the combat is too easy because there's no penalty to dying? Have you ever played Celeste?

[coarse leaf]

actually fuck markers and remembering and all of it

keep photoshop or ms paint or something open in bg and edit screenshots of the map every time

[trail orchid]

Like Ori ain't as hard as Celeste but penalty for dying doesn't equate easy gameplay

[lilac sapphire]

Exactly, there's literally only one optional area in each ori game. Everything else you backtrack for is either money, health or energy...

[stark estuary]

Celeste isn't a metroidvania and the difficulty isn't piss

[marsh ibex]

Celeste is actually hard though

[grizzled dock]

jesse

[keen blaze]

you just have to git gud

[trail orchid]

Which is why your logic doesn't work, you can be a hard game without punishing for deaths

[marsh ibex]

my logic?

[coarse leaf]

Also celeste's penalty for dying is good enough, don't forget that there's actual huge rooms and that you can get stuck on the same small room for ages

[marsh ibex]

I’m not kirb

[stark estuary]

Ori 2 is an easy game even ignoring the death mechanic though

[marsh ibex]

Celeste has actual difficulty and dying puts you at the start of the room iirc

[light inlet]

Kilis

[stark estuary]

Making a metroidvania where there's no penalty for dying is whack

[keen blaze]

||GOLDEN BERRIES AAHAGHIYKGNIAGNDK ||

[marsh ibex]

it has a penalty that fits

[coarse leaf]

Yeah and there's definitely a lot of beeg rooms

[stark estuary]

You don't even spawn at the start of the room in Ori, you spawn like 5 seconds away from where you died

[coarse leaf]

You're faced with a big room at the literal very first chase sequence

[stark estuary]

And I was specifically talking about the combat, not the platforming, though for Ori that's an issue as well

Ori 2 combat is a trainwreck

[lilac sapphire]

There aren't even rooms in ori

[coarse leaf]

Deep

[stark estuary]

Yeah which is why the comparison doesn't really work

It doesn't send you back to a checkpoint or anything

Unless you die in one of the escape sequences (which there are like three of in the whole game), then it sends you to the start

[safe adder]

So ss in 2023?

[trail orchid]

But... those are concepts popularized by the souls games and roguelikes, not metroidvanias...

[burnt topaz]

maybe

either 2022 or 2023

[vivid belfry]

penalty doesn't mean material cost

[stark estuary]

Metroidvanias have checkpoints, losing progress is a suitable penalty

[trail orchid]

Not really but OK

[coarse leaf]

Any time between the next second and the last second of 13th july 2023

[fiery coral]

Oh huh

[burnt topaz]

not really

[fiery coral]

I enjoyed Ori 2's movement and combat

was pretty fun

[marsh ibex]

You like portal

Your opinion is not valid

[vivid belfry]

Ori 2 is just an incredibly decent midtroidvania

[fiery coral]

[vivid belfry]

I don't think it excels at anything but it's a fine time

[lilac sapphire]

Movement was amazing, combat was ok imo

[trail orchid]

Also the platforming is a part of the combat, kinda like Doom Eternal (which I recently completed on Nightmare and I highly recommend)

[stark estuary]

Terribly unbalanced, only like five different enemy types exist which are copy-pasted everywhere throughout the game, easy as fuck

[chrome wave]

Portal is a good

[vivid belfry]

both ori games would probably be better as linear platformers

[fiery coral]

Not stellar, yeah, but not really something I ever thought of complaints for

[marsh ibex]

I’m trolling unique

[fiery coral]

was fine and enjoyable enough

[chrome wave]

Yes

[marsh ibex]

also almost every metroidvania has penalties

[vivid belfry]

Anyway, thesis statement time

[stark estuary]

It's practically impossible to die in Ori because you can Bash literally everything and then spam the healing ability which is basically instant with the Catalyst thing equipped and you never run out of Soul

[marsh ibex]

dying send you back to a save point and you have to go back to where you were previously

[stark estuary]

Also the spear was busted

[marsh ibex]

with enemies respawning and such

[coarse leaf]

even if they are, it doesn't mean HK would be wrong to take elements from other genre

[vivid belfry]

HK hypothetically telling you where everything is from the get go gets in the way of the exploratory gameplay

[fiery coral]

I mean yeah but that doesn't make their absence detrimental to the game in my mind 🥴 I'm not going to complain about not being reset to three rooms away after dying

[trail orchid]

Even if that's true, that doesn't make it a trainwreck

[stark estuary]

What do you think I meant by trainwreck

[fiery coral]

doesn't need to punish or penalise fun as it is

[stark estuary]

Ori 2's combat is easy, badly designed, lazy, and worst of all distracts from the platforming (which is actually good) with the random enemy gauntlets every two seconds

[trail orchid]

Only some weapons are badly balanced (and the same could be said for certain overpowered and underpowered charms in a certain other game) also your math seems to be a little off: https://oriandtheblindforest.fandom.com/wiki/Enemies_(Ori_and_the_Will_of_the_Wisps)

[vivid belfry]

it's only really a problem in Ori 2 because it's so difficult to die

[marsh ibex]

What games do you like again?

mid puzzle games?

[fiery coral]

too long to list

[coarse leaf]

Definitely not elden ring

[fiery coral]

[vivid belfry]

the entire game is a cakewalk and even if you do somehow die, it's basically like nothing happened

[fiery coral]

ah yes the abstract puzzler, Elden Ring

[stark estuary]

Hyperbole, and it's amazing how half of those are recolours

[chrome wave]

I think the ori games are pretty forgettable

[coarse leaf]

It makes you puzzled on if you have a life

[chrome wave]

Like i dont even remember that bear things name

[vivid belfry]

what bear thing

[lilac sapphire]

Quokok

[fiery coral]

Baur

[chrome wave]

Yeah exactly

[lilac sapphire]

Quolok

[vivid belfry]

Quolok is a frog

[lilac sapphire]

Oh wait that's tje frog 💀

[fiery coral]

of Baur's Reach

[trail orchid]

I'm not saying it should to tell you EVERYTHING, just more than it does atm

[vivid belfry]

eh

[coarse leaf]

Hi chat

[chrome wave]

Man proved the point

[trail orchid]

What's amazing is you ignoring the differences stated on the right

[vivid belfry]

HK already has a detailed map

[stark estuary]

The Ori games would've been better if the combat was completely taken out imo. Like Ori 1's combat was obviously a joke but the devs at least had the common sense to make combat encounters few and far between (late-game enemies are basically floating platforms). Ori 2 focused far more on it despite its combat system still not being "good" by any stretch of the imagination.

[coarse leaf]

When the chat becomes your example

[stark estuary]

Yeah you're right there are some that are slightly faster than the others

[trail orchid]

Are you kidding me? Ori 2's combat was infinitely better than the first

[stark estuary]

Still not good

[chrome wave]

Supermario world probably has better combat mechanics than the two oris

[trail orchid]

And also other things that you're ignoring but OK

[coarse leaf]

Hey guys its gonna be 109 f today

what's that in non-freedom

[chrome wave]

Why not 110 F today?

[coarse leaf]

Like 42.5 c or smthn

[vivid belfry]

Ori 2 combat is fine

[chrome wave]

Where

[coarse leaf]

and here the weather is cooling down from the 40s lol

[chrome wave]

It overstays its welcome tho

[stark estuary]

Incredibly mid, overstays its welcome imo

[vivid belfry]

it's an inoffensive thing to do sometimes

[coarse leaf]

its all thunderstorms eating away the electricity now

[stark estuary]

Snailed goddammit

[vivid belfry]

early 2000's 3D collectathon platformer ass combat

[trail orchid]

I agree that Ori 2's combat is too easy, and that's one thing I definitely think HK did better, but I do think HK can be too frustrating on the exploration side especially if you haven't played the game in a while and want to pick up when you left off

[chrome wave]

Those are super annoying

[stark estuary]

Bubsy 3D had great combat wdym

[chrome wave]

Like ty the tasmanian Tiger crap

[chrome wave]

Yeah cause Bubsy 3d is from the 90s

[trail orchid]

Is that supposed to be an insult lmao

[coarse leaf]

I just checked, it actually is 110 today bruhh

[stark estuary]

Bubsy 3D is timeless

[fiery coral]

Pilot's license? What for?

[coarse leaf]

what the fuck is a bobby 3d

[chrome wave]

Its a magnum opus of technology

[stark estuary]

Bubsy 3D, you heathen

[coarse leaf]

Where i live

[chrome wave]

I am gonna assume thats scotland

[stark estuary]

It won the Gold X Award

[coarse leaf]

yo why's tails in this game

and why is he acting like sonic

[burnt topaz]

Imagine Scotland ever being 40C

[vivid belfry]

it means it's mid

[chrome wave]

The most Golden of all awards

[vivid belfry]

it does not enrich the gameplay nor is it particularly annoying

it's just there

[coarse leaf]

that is all i get from this

[stark estuary]

I said that I thought the Ori games would have been better off without the combat, which I think is a fair criticism

[trail orchid]

@stark estuary how do you call Ori 2's combat a trainwreck when acknowledging that bubsy 3d exists

[chrome wave]

There are no train in Bubsy land

[marsh ibex]

worse games does not make another game better by default

[coarse leaf]

I mean there can always be worse things than a trainwreck

[stark estuary]

Because Bubsy 3D is a good game

[coarse leaf]

Oh wait u think i live in scotland? I thought you meant u thought bubsy 3d was a scotland thing

An example is when a nuke drops on a train

[chrome wave]

Yes

[stark estuary]

Obviously

[coarse leaf]

Nah i live in 'murica

[marsh ibex]

“sure this steak is undercooked but at least it’s not smeared with dirt and rust!”

[chrome wave]

Thats basically like a bigger scotland

[stark estuary]

Average Sonic fan

[burnt topaz]

Don't let the Scots hear you say that

[coarse leaf]

What even is the combat in bubsy 3d

I'm lazy to actually watch the game

[stark estuary]

idk

[chrome wave]

An undered ammount of cookage can suck all the enjoyment from almost any steak mister freeemann

[trail orchid]

I really don't share the sentiment that being too easy (and not even massively so) makes a combat system bad, I love both Sekiro's combat system as well as Batman Arkham's combat for example

[coarse leaf]

When its so early in the morning that ur throat hurts but u cant open ur water

[stark estuary]

You're acting like that was my only criticism of Ori 2's combat

[chrome wave]

Go to the water closet

Drink the cement liquid from the metal apparatus

[stark estuary]

The fact that it's easy does not inherently make it mediocre, the reason why it's easy does.

[coarse leaf]

Isnt that like european bathrooms

[chrome wave]

Yes thats how we call toilets

[coarse leaf]

I've been to europe yknow

[chrome wave]

Mostly portable ones

[burnt topaz]

thats why the symbol is WC

[marsh ibex]

Anyways I think I can cap off this discussion about SS and Ori 2 by saying that the most I can personally see is compass being inherent to the maps now, as the tool system does not jive with a compass equivalent

[keen blaze]

Hello, Evan is here

[chrome wave]

Yes what do you think it meant XD?

[stark estuary]

I hate Silksong

[trail orchid]

It's the only valid one, considering the sound design and the overall feel of hits is pretty tight

[coarse leaf]

We all do

[burnt topaz]

no i knew it was that i was just explaining

[chrome wave]

Good

[marsh ibex]

I also don’t think how hits feel and sound are the only things that make combat compelling

[stark estuary]

Ok so the only things that go into a combat system are the difficulty, sound design and "feel of hits"? Lmao

[trail orchid]

Also, I hope that you won't have to grind for tools if you're stuck on a boss fight

Since I heard using them costs currency

[lilac sapphire]

Well there's also the quest boards that make for more organised quests and the escape sequences but that's about it

[marsh ibex]

Tools are basically charm equivalents

[stark estuary]

Who the hell even mentioned the sound design or how hits felt

[marsh ibex]

Do you grind for charms

[vivid belfry]

you have been banned for not saying that metal circle in the first trailer tool menu is definitely a compass

[burnt topaz]

the shards seem to be pretty plentiful, dont think youd be running out of them

[coarse leaf]

regardless of that, people will do toolless bosses for abolutely no reson

[trail orchid]

Me neither, I also like forcing you to move which is why Doom is my favorite FPS, but Ori forces you to move quite a lot

[vivid belfry]

red tools require currency to use

[marsh ibex]

all..combat requires movement?

[vivid belfry]

and bosses don't refill shell shards

[coarse leaf]

red tools?

[vivid belfry]

there is a hypothetical player who will run out of shell shards on a boss fight

[trail orchid]

Not really, charms are often passive bonuses they're not consumable buffs nor do they use limited ammo

[marsh ibex]

reddit moment

[coarse leaf]

Guys i dont wanna clean do i have to

[chrome wave]

Inherent compass? Back in my day you had to run around and explore the bug kingdom without such easy ways out. If you wanted to use a compass you had to sacrifice a single charm slot and also buy it for like 220g. You Kids have it So easy these days!

[vivid belfry]

but there are already solutions to thsi

shell shard pouches for one

[stark estuary]

All combat requires movement. Ori 2's doesn't have to, though, if you equip Catalyst, spam the attack button, and then spam heals (and spears).

[marsh ibex]

only like, one third of the tools we see are consumables that require shell shards to refill

[vivid belfry]

but also you should pick up on the fact that you shouldn't use tools unless you're gunning for the kill, not in the learning phase

[coarse leaf]

Ha whyAm

[chrome wave]

Thats like all of them

[vivid belfry]

the point remains that consumable tools are an ever-present part of the gameplay

[trail orchid]

You can rarely spam heals in the enemy's face, so that already encourages movement

[coarse leaf]

Amina whyyy*

[coarse leaf]

unless youre like me and it took over an hour to figure out you can use the elevators in cot

RAT

[trail orchid]

It's better to bash and dash away than to risk getting hit while healing

[coarse leaf]

evanporie! :) hi

[marsh ibex]

true, but you’re also a new mod.
Silence

[coarse leaf]

hi rat! How are youuu!

im doing very well! how are you?

[chrome wave]

The game has had you use levers before CoT, how long did it take you to put two and two together?

[burnt topaz]

erie is doing her best

[coarse leaf]

2 + 2 is a hard maths problem

[coarse leaf]

im.. good, i need to clean rn but like.. ahh i dont want to

[coarse leaf]

i didnt know they were levers

wdym you dont mindlessly swing your nail while exploring

[coarse leaf]

you should probably clean but it fine to put it off for a few minutes

I cleaned for about an hour yesterday

[burnt topaz]

i had a similar issue with the mushrooms in fw

[thin sphinx]

burn down the house so that you have no house to clean!

[chrome wave]

What did you think those were then? The shiny swingy Grandfather clock circle on a metal rod?

[coarse leaf]

Ive been playing too much celeste

[coarse leaf]

just decoration

I thought fw meant farewell not fungal wastes

[chrome wave]

But thats gonna kill spiders

And i like spiders

[coarse leaf]

thats pretty good. not enough though, but it can all get done eventually

[chrome wave]

Fw means foogle woogle

[burnt topaz]

you know, the mushrooms in farewell

[shell yacht]

biggest skissue i ever saw godamn
who doesnt just smack everythimg looking for stuff

[sinful flare]

fw has the worst dream warrior in existence

[thin sphinx]

deepnest no more

[sinful flare]

before you ask celeste got an update and it adds dream warriors to the game

[thin sphinx]

i like the music tho

[wispy stream]

figs waster

[sinful flare]

i think its the same as other dream warrior music

[chrome wave]

Hu is a cool guy tho he probably smoked weed

[burnt topaz]

elder wh

[coarse leaf]

yeah exactly smh

[keen blaze]

I like the music in Farewell too !

[sinful flare]

elder who?????

[coarse leaf]

the chances of ther ebeing 1 geo at a random place are low, but never zero

[chrome wave]

The police

[coarse leaf]

which is why swing your nail mindless 👍

[coarse leaf]

thats marmu

Guys we dont have any elderhu emotes

[sinful flare]

elder whomegamarmu

[chrome wave]

Use the swarm and you will know

[coarse leaf]

good

[wispy stream]

[wispy stream]

i just searched for some

imagine my dissapointment

[chrome wave]

We should Replace lace and shakra with elder hu

[burnt topaz]

no fuck elder hu

[chrome wave]

Team cherry should as well

[coarse leaf]

We actually barely have any dream warrior emojis at all (only representing 3 different warriors)

[wispy stream]

how does the best boss have an emote

[coarse leaf]

fuck hu

[wispy stream]

not have*

[chrome wave]

Also replace sherma with zote

I want a zotesmirk emoji

[coarse leaf]

:zotes irk:

[coarse leaf]

It does!

:zoteu:

[wispy stream]

meanwhile we have 50 emotes for hornet

[coarse leaf]

:zoteanxious

[wispy stream]

[chrome wave]

Damn simps

[coarse leaf]

Sherma has, well, 2 emotes, so, y'know, the world's not fair!

[burnt topaz]

the hornetcomfy tetrimono

[wispy stream]

someone loves their daughter

[coarse leaf]

It actually has 4 emotes! Too little of a the amount tho!

[coarse leaf]

we dont have any good collector emotes

[tawny basalt]

Sherma has many emotes

[sinful flare]

do a t-spin

[coarse leaf]

[coarse leaf]

Yes

[coarse leaf]

bad emote

[wispy stream]

holy shit

[coarse leaf]

fire_extinguisher:

[thin sphinx]

[chrome wave]

Why is there 4 Times the same emote

[burnt topaz]

i wish i knew how to

[wispy stream]

ho

w

the fuck

[tawny basalt]

I get it, stop flexing

[sinful flare]

i know a website that explains t-spin, it's actually very easy to do a t-spin
https://four.lol/srs/t-spin

[burnt topaz]

huh ok, i dont really play tetris anymore but if i do

[sinful flare]

if it intrigues your interest

[chrome wave]

Delete

[coarse leaf]

You can't spell interest without tetris

[chrome wave]

Thats the damn spinny

[sinful flare]

who wants to do tetris pvp with me

[chrome wave]

You are baiting

Oh wait t spin?

I thought that was some other spin nevermind

[sinful flare]

o-spin best spin

[chrome wave]

#cement

#concrete

#rusty-pipes

[sinful flare]

#clay

[chrome wave]

#bricks&rubble

[coarse leaf]

#kaan

#evanporie-is-super-cool

[sinful flare]

#evanpoviproeiavoreafhlkghc

#transberry

[tawny basalt]

#jesters

[coarse leaf]

#right-guys?

[chrome wave]

Silksong for calculator

[tawny basalt]

#TRUE

[chrome wave]

Yeu dont seem all that cool ngl

[coarse leaf]

[grave snow]

#hi

[keen blaze]

#yeah-thats-true

[chrome wave]

Kinda like below Average or mediocre

[keen blaze]

#oblovle

#dead-meme

[chrome wave]

The power

[tawny basalt]

Illegal image of me without nitro

[chrome wave]

CARDGAMES!!!!

[sinful flare]

🦑🎮

[keen blaze]

Yeah those mario enemies are so annoying I understand-

[coarse leaf]

#crying

[sinful flare]

NO..

[tawny basalt]

I would post a copy pasta, but I would get banned

[chrome wave]

Then send a picture of at least 7 bricks to be cool

[tawny basalt]

I will just say, I can’t do anything

[coarse leaf]

N

[sinful flare]

🧱🧱🧱
🧱🧱🧱🧱

[chrome wave]

He became cool

[sinful flare]

am i cool yet..

[coarse leaf]

Thats 14 birkcw

[sinful flare]

YOOOOOOO

[chrome wave]

Double cool Goes to kaan then

[coarse leaf]

🧱 🧱 🧱 🧱

Tere 8 bricks anm i cool now

[sinful flare]

IM DOUBLE COOL NO FUCKING WAY THIS SHIT REAL

[coarse leaf]

my cat just jumped on the chair, jumped on me in the most painful way, and then jumped off

[chrome wave]

Not enough

[sinful flare]

\🧱

[coarse leaf]

Wtf bro thast 7 ur a scammer

[chrome wave]

I only see 4 and now i have spinal pains

[coarse leaf]

Want me to to cake the tat for a bit

[chrome wave]

What have you done evan

[coarse leaf]

Each stack is 2 bri...

[coarse leaf]

no he ran off

[chrome wave]

Doesnt look like that for me

[coarse leaf]

How the &u i did you even undertanad what tinsad

[haughty brook]

Random though, let's compare the architectural style in Pharloom with the one in Hallownest

[coarse leaf]

no

[chrome wave]

Yeah tell me which one has more bricks

[sinful flare]

the one has a ball with spool traces on it the other has uhh pale king symbol

[tawny basalt]

One is garbage the other one is garbage

[sinful flare]

hallownest has bricks made out of soul so they dont count

wait a second
can you weave bricks

[chrome wave]

You can with mushrooms

[tawny basalt]

can we not brick spam

[coarse leaf]

does hallownest have more wheels or doors

[chrome wave]

Cool mode unlocked

[tawny basalt]

Trick question there are no doors

[chrome wave]

I seen like at least 16 wheels

[keen blaze]

Hallownest is sharp and spiky, Pharloom is idk I don't pay attention to the Silksong stuff I come here to talk about Celeste

[chrome wave]

Pharloom has Ball worship

[wispy stream]

isint geo wheels if you think about it

[sinful flare]

i come here to talk about bricks

[tawny basalt]

I came here cause the cool people are here

[sinful flare]

and make egg jokeggs

[wispy stream]

like me

[tawny basalt]

Cheggers

[sinful flare]

like you

[keen blaze]

Like me !

[chrome wave]

I can make an egg joke

[sinful flare]

yooo we're doing the jokeggs again?

[tawny basalt]

Yooo let me find cheggers

[sinful flare]

concreggte

[wispy stream]

somebody snailed the snailed

[chrome wave]

How can you recognise russian egg?

[shell yacht]

the fuck?

[coarse leaf]

Uhhh who? Definitely not me.. w ho..

[shell yacht]

who lied to you

[sinful flare]

government of hallownest

[keen blaze]

idk bro just go with it-

[wispy stream]

#evanporie-is-mid

[chrome wave]

Egg is russian if instead of chicken, frog salamander hatches XdDddd

[sly summit]

KAAN! MY BEST FRIEND IS HERE

[coarse leaf]

I onow 😭

[sinful flare]

POTHEAD

NO WAIT ITS ZERK

[keen blaze]

#dumbtoes-is-dumb-wait-thats-in-their-name-

[sinful flare]

I ALWAYS REMEMBER MY BEST FRIEND AND NEVER FORGET WHO THEY WERE

[wispy stream]

time to be evanphobic😈

[tawny basalt]

He is resistant to being called dumb

[coarse leaf]

nooooo

[sly summit]

NO WAIT IS PLAGUE KNIGHT

am going to buy some cat food, I just came here to say hi to kaan, good bye gamers

[sinful flare]

good bye fellow gamer

[coarse leaf]

Goiod bye

[sinful flare]

amen

[chrome wave]

Remember to Eat what you buy

[tawny basalt]

Goodbye

[coarse leaf]

Im a gaymer

[sinful flare]

play the gamer anthem

[sly summit]

wtf

[wispy stream]

yeah no shit im dumb

[sly summit]

ig I'll have to eat my pc

[haughty brook]

In Hallownest they put spikes in elevators, in Pharloom they put upside down spikes at the bottom platforms.

[sinful flare]

YOU ARE WHAT YOU EAT

[chrome wave]

That is the number one spiritual rule of the earth

[tawny basalt]

I’m a gamer, I play games while being angry and calling it dumb

[wispy stream]

im a gamer im gay

[sly summit]

I'm a gamer, I have all cookie clicker achievements

[sinful flare]

every game that i ever played is dumb and stupid and im right and youre wrong

[tawny basalt]

This is true

paradox made

[wispy stream]

thats not true im not gay

[chrome wave]

Homer sexual???

[haughty brook]

Ah, so you are from 4chan, do you visit /v/ frequently?

[chrome wave]

He has homersexual

[sinful flare]

what the fuck

what is a /v/

i just have based opinions all the time

[tawny basalt]

Goodbye guys

[chrome wave]

Its the 4chan board where people complain about videogames

[sinful flare]

gn tonio

[wispy stream]

homer😻

[sinful flare]

homersexual

frying pan sexual

[wispy stream]

me when i get homer with a b when i see homer

[chrome wave]

Bikersexual is real

[coarse leaf]

gender liquid

[chrome wave]

Clean that up

[coarse leaf]

omnipotencesexual

[chrome wave]

No gender liquids allowed on the floor

[wispy stream]

i like sipping on gender liquid sometimes

[coarse leaf]

Mannnnn

[chrome wave]

Unsanitary

Gr*ss

[wispy stream]

well not the one off the floor

[coarse leaf]

Ewwwwww

[wispy stream]

i make sure it properly disinfected like all other liquids

[coarse leaf]

I hope it's not me dumbtoes

[wispy stream]

well gay strawberry is kinda my thing

[lilac sapphire]

[coarse leaf]

oh god

[chrome wave]

That guy Probably also drinks caviar gender liquid

[coarse leaf]

Id.l assume strawberry..

[keen blaze]

Golden Berries taste better.

[wispy stream]

how do you not know gay strawberry flavored gender liquid its my favorite

[chrome wave]

Thats poisonous

[coarse leaf]

How am i not dead yet thats literally just me

[chrome wave]

It comes from swamp toad

[coarse leaf]

[keen blaze]

Well not like t was a bad thing.

[wispy stream]

can you find your also gay strawberry sister

[chrome wave]

Isnt there a celeste server?

[coarse leaf]

My sister isn't gay or strawberry

[coarse leaf]

Why would that matter

[wispy stream]

but i drank her either way

[chrome wave]

Like are the admins of that server at some sort of cold war with this one?

[keen blaze]

#sk-discussion IS THE CELESTE SERVER AYAYYAYYYYYY !!A pgstr kfgnpvnb

[chrome wave]

Are they trying to make this into celeste server 2??

[coarse leaf]

She isn't genderfluid either stop

[wispy stream]

too late slurp slurp

[coarse leaf]

stop

[chrome wave]

By covertly recruiting randos to derail everything into celeste?

[wispy stream]

burp

[coarse leaf]

Theres no derailing in ss disc

[wispy stream]

oopsie

[keen blaze]

#sk-discussion is the derailing.

[chrome wave]

Fridge discussion

[wispy stream]

it was made to be derailed

[chrome wave]

Wrong activation passwoed

[wispy stream]

you spelled celeste wrogn thrice

[chrome wave]

Add in some numbers and Say it backwards to deactivate evan

[wispy stream]

wait shit

[copper knot]

celes

[coarse leaf]

Evan on their way to do that annoying thing like "who" when wrong pronouns are used

Who??? His? Bro who are you talking about

[chrome wave]

Wait evan is multiple operatives using one account to screw with us?

[coarse leaf]

Shhhh

[chrome wave]

The cure for Heamohroids does not exist

Damn wrong Word sequence

We must do the actions jeeded to reprogram Evans brains

[coarse leaf]

electric vehicles are not polished or religious in excess.
E.V.A.N.P.O.R.I.E.

YAR DiE DIE DiE DiE ShITLATO BITch

[chrome wave]

Reverse it

[coarse leaf]

💤

evanporie we should do celeste multiplayer sometime

yesss

I have a question what do you even do in celeste myltieplrayehrhlp

just play maps, except someone else is there. its surprisingly fun

you can interact with other people, although its a bit buggy

[coarse leaf]

ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

you can do mods with other people assuming you both have them

So like streaming but less laggy and also way cooler

yeah

Ooooooohh

its called celestenet on the mod installer, we should also maybe move this to your server

Imuh ok

What nobody ssaid that

[distant crown]

ZOTEBOTE

guys what the best song in metal gear rising?

Revengence

[coarse leaf]

Whyd u ask if wyou already knew

[distant crown]

id idnt

[coarse leaf]

yous ad revenrgance sislly

sicily

[keen blaze]

Evan catyp woerwvr the wan

:skissue:

[fiery coral]

very tough question

Red Sun, Stains of Time, The Only Thing I Know For Real would be my top 3 but pretty much every boss theme is absolutely stellar

Gaelot

[marsh ibex]

They’re all the same so just choose one and you’ll have heard the whole soundtrack

[fiery coral]

🔫

[distant crown]

my favorite is sam theme

unqnueuqnr

also mods can we get a hornoot emote

[marsh ibex]

no

[keen blaze]

[marsh ibex]

if you make it and modmail it sire

[distant crown]

[marsh ibex]

Sure

not sire

[distant crown]

[fiery coral]

Oh I thought you were being sarcastically respectful

[distant crown]

i am now with the higher ones

can i get orange name

nvm i want red name or yellow name

[marsh ibex]

no u and i are right next to each other on keyboard

[fiery coral]

we're pretty far apart what do you mean

[distant crown]

i am sire mango

[distant crown]

yeah

[marsh ibex]

I genuinely have nothing but disdain for your likes. The depths of my loathing are nothing compared to the howling winds in the wasteland of my soul that you will experience to the fullest extent once your body degrades into nothing but dust

wait who the fuck put a fedora on my head

[shell yacht]

[distant crown]

who is he saluting to?

unique

give me your powers

[subtle flint]

I may have had a bit too much fun

[keen blaze]

nahhhh it's fiiiiinnnnee, at least you're rich now.

[distant crown]

shermasmirk this message

and you will get 100 silksong copies

[wispy stream]

oof

[distant crown]

@coarse leaf your prize is

silksong

in 2023

gEt IT dAy ONe WItH GAmE PasS

[charred heron]

silksong tomorrow!!!

[keen blaze]

Just a week away !

Can you believe it ?

[hexed crow]

whats up with those guys saying silksoon?

[charred heron]

its releasing tomorrow!!!

[hexed crow]

didn't they say ss was gonna release july 24?

actually confirmed

[keen blaze]

[charred heron]

source?

[distant crown]

one month and 12 days after window

[hexed crow]

https://tenor.com/view/armstrong-made-it-up-gif-25653819

[distant crown]

xbox release window

also window knows the silksong release daye

[wheat sail]

Gm chat

[distant crown]

mornin kirb

[wheat sail]

[tawny basalt]

Not me

[marble totem]

Something*

(Silksong)

[keen blaze]

[tawny basalt]

Correct

[vivid belfry]

do we believe that the harp being active in the harp crest has any mechanical effect or is it just a bigger visual indicator to compensate for the smaller bobbin

I lean toward the latter because cheaper binding is already a significant enough change

additionally, do we think the harp crest might have faster healing to compensate for the fact that it doesn't heal as much

[wheat sail]

Do we see the harp in action

[distant crown]

maybe

[surreal crown]

It does have a function that is pretty cool I think

When it activates there's an AoE that pushes stuff back

[vivid belfry]

I mean we see the harp crest being used and we know all it's effects except how it affects healing

[vivid belfry]

the enemy is being pushed back because hornet just hit it

[distant crown]

i thought that was silksoul but they wouldn’t spoil that for alot of people

[vivid belfry]

hornet flashing white and shooting out a cluster of soul particles happens when she gets enough silk to bind

this also happens later in the trailer with a different crest

[wheat sail]

Something interesting may be that the harp stilll heals overall the same or more, but you heal half a mask per second. And if t cancels healing if you get hit

[distant crown]

i cant wait to see how people actually use the crests and tools in certain situations

[vivid belfry]

she doesn't

we infer that it will have a reduced healing effect because the cost is reduced to 6 notches from 9 while it's equipped

that plus the fact that the indicator bobbin is much smaller than other crests

meaning there's less "fuel in the tank"

[serene chasm]

6 months later: Everyone is just using the same crest and tools

[distant crown]

.heals with reaper

[distant crown]

y e s

[vivid belfry]

I actually really appreciate how nuts TC has gone with the indicators for binding being ready

hornet flashes white, the top left of the screen flashes white, and the front of the spool glows brighter than the excess

this was speculation / suggestion

[wheat sail]

Maybe it doesn't even effect healing

Besides changing an animation

[vivid belfry]

maybe visually but the way it conveys information is much simpler than HK

that's partially just because the spool is a simpler system than the soul vessel

[distant crown]

do yall think that six eyed crest is the harp crest

[vivid belfry]

I think that's possible, the weaver gates in the demo are surrounded by harps

[distant crown]

yeah

[south rock]

Did we get another trailer

[vivid belfry]

not since last month

[distant crown]

no

[south rock]

[vivid belfry]

oh I just noticed something new about Ass Jim

[wheat sail]

Ayo

[vivid belfry]

at the very beginning of the shot, you can see little maggot particles falling away from him

[serene chasm]

why would we get a new trailer so soon after?

[distant crown]

clover area

silksongs

[vivid belfry]

gelato about to go sicko mode

[sly summit]

silksong is on an incomplete state rn, I bet it will come out feb. 2023

like...

wait I cant find it

wow

[vivid belfry]

I feel like this is at least 4 arguments that need to be broken apart separately

[sly summit]

the upper pick is from the old trailer and the bottom one from the newest microsoft one iirc

like, silksong is so unpolished

hornet cant be flying!

[vivid belfry]

the primary one I will focus on now is that a lot of the complications to the HUD are the results of passive tools and therefore don't really have anything to do with the core mechanics presented

[sly summit]

(to be fair, the knight sometimes doesnt touch the ground when idling on some surfaces, specially in godhome)

[vivid belfry]

when I say "the silk spool is much simpler and easier to read than the soul vessel," I mean without the use of tools/charms

[kindred pewter]

could cornifer and iselda come from pharloom? I mean, it is stated that cornifer and iselda are from other kingdoms

[vivid belfry]

the silk spool is a simple one hit equals one notch, and that's it

[haughty brook]

Maybe those long arguments should have separeted paragrahp fro easier reading

[sly summit]

I wouldnt say they are from pharloom

[nimble pebble]

correct

[haughty brook]

Most likely...no

[vivid belfry]

the soul vessel has a default value of 11 soul per hit, but it's increased by charms and decreased past the initial soul vessel

[nimble pebble]

Yoooo fellow Death's door fan

[vivid belfry]

no new player would be able to infer that the additional soul vessels have nearly a 50% reduction of incoming soul from dealing damage

because it's not visually clear how much soul you have, numerically

[kindred pewter]

I know this is speculation, but, the reason why I said is that, in a post made by team cherry, it says iselda will one day take her weapon up again, and since silksong COULD be a prequel, maybe we can see warriour iselda

[sly summit]

hey!

[vivid belfry]

the silk spool on the other hand is easy to parse not just because of the notches of silk, but because of the rings on the spool indicating when you can bind

[nimble pebble]

https://tenor.com/view/deaths-door-gif-23013791

[vivid belfry]

now on to my second major point

[sly summit]

tbh I didnt like thaaaaaaaaaaat much deaths door, but it was a game that i wanted to play, and thats fun

[vivid belfry]

the only reason the modifications to the spool seem complicated/mysterious is because we have no clue what they do

[kindred pewter]

mood, even I use my mouth when I don't know how to use chop sticks

[haughty brook]

My take is that TC did some cheeky reference about Iselda's previous ocupation but most likely is not going to play out in the future.

[sly summit]

like, lately I just play anything... deaths door was a good fresh air

[south rock]

Confession: I haven't watch a single silksong trailer

[vivid belfry]

can we stay on topic for now

[kindred pewter]

cool

[distant crown]

yes sir

[sly summit]

good, if u start u will never stop, since the first trailer I've been watching at least once a day a silksong thing (music, gameplay or trailer)

[vivid belfry]

take it to #off-topic while actual SS discussion is happening

[kindred pewter]

damn, honestly, I wish we can see iselda like fight alongside with hornet

[vivid belfry]

it's a rarity

[south rock]

What are u talking about?

[kindred pewter]

silksong being discussed IN SILKSONG-DISCUSSION!?!?!?!?

[vivid belfry]

death's door discussion

[nimble pebble]

It's a fantastic game can't wait for the third instalment in the Acid nerve storyline

[distant crown]

DDD

[vivid belfry]

#off-topic

[south rock]

There was a death door discussion
Damn I gotta pay attention more

[nimble pebble]

https://tenor.com/view/dedede-king-dedede-smash-bros-ultimate-sr-pelo-the-hand-gif-25439525

[distant crown]

de de

[nimble pebble]

Jokes on you Grover you know this is #off-topic

[vivid belfry]

there's an actual discussion happening now

[distant crown]

where do you all think the warlords tower is?

[kindred pewter]

but anyways, while sadly, cornifer and iselda are not from pharloom, is there any other character from pharloom that is present in hallownest

[south rock]

I see u want cool grey name as well

[sly summit]

he isnt Grover tho... its on his name

[nimble pebble]

In zoteboat

[haughty brook]

The Weavers?

[kindred pewter]

oh yeah I forgot about the weavers

[vivid belfry]

I subscribe to the theory that Nymm/Brumm is from pharloom

[distant crown]

alot of people say it’s in greymoor others say its in the coral forest area

[distant crown]

likely

[nimble pebble]

Nah I'm gonna turn green

🟢

[haughty brook]

Otherwise, don't expect much of any important named NPC from the first game to appear in SS, maybe as a flashback or passing mention?

[nimble pebble]

I think Nymm is from Gilded city

[distant crown]

which gilded city?

[south rock]

I want orange

[nimble pebble]

My source is that I made it the fuck up

[south rock]

Cabbage phrog: becoming mod

[distant crown]

what kingdom is that?

[nimble pebble]

Zotelandia

[kindred pewter]

while thats a good theory, I think they just, came, like, they happened like, they are created by the flames of grimm to serve him or something

[distant crown]

[vivid belfry]

the grimmkin are created by the nightmare heart, but Brumm and Divine were both originally normal bugs

[nimble pebble]

Brumm mentions he's enslaved to the cycle I don't think he was originally part of it

[sly summit]

normal bugs that arent found on any other part of hallownest... I mean, Divine species maybe exists because of the bug that sells u the fragile charms... but Brumm?

[vivid belfry]

we literally see Brumm without the influence of the troupe, this isn't something that needs to be speculated about

[sly summit]

I mean, also there are very few npcs that come from an specific species

[distant crown]

cutadeel

[nimble pebble]

https://tenor.com/view/yugioh-anime-omg-wtf-cant-unsee-gif-5159766

[nimble pebble]

indeed

[vivid belfry]

please respond with shorter points

[distant crown]

he wants to stop them

[vivid belfry]

anyway, it actually is very easy to tell exactly how many notches you have in this screenshot- it's 10

with the hunter crest it takes 9 notches to heal. There is one unlit notch after the glowing spool so it's one more than is necessary

[kindred pewter]

oh, thanks

[languid linden]

The Hand of Thrawn was located on Nirauan

[vivid belfry]

in contrast to HK, it's much easier to tell how many hits you need to fill up, especially when things like soul boosting charms get involved

[distant crown]

wha’s the hunters crest?