sk-discussion

[nimble pebble]

PK is part of HK's story

[buoyant osprey]

it could also be last as in "the last one to judge u since ur gonna die"

judge jury and executioner type of deal

[hollow terrace]

Damn, TLJ has such confidence then

[buoyant osprey]

big egos :D

[chilly nexus]

TLJ's already got the explosions. just missing the shades and cigar

[haughty brook]

Is TLJ a backer boss? The only ones I know that are actual backer bosses are Sharpe and Carmelita.

[river storm]

What does TLJ stand for?

[pallid flare]

the last judge

[tawdry valley]

The last judge, yeah

[ocean mulch]

He judges people

Or she

[pallid flare]

i dont want it to judge me

my ego is too fragile for that

[buoyant osprey]

i can already tell carmelita is gonna be a fun fight

[nimble pebble]

^

I agree

[tired lake]

2021 release

[chilly nexus]

2021 release future is on life support rn

[grand ferry]

what release

[buoyant osprey]

e3 shadow drop !!!/!??!/?!/1?!/111?!?!?1/

[chilly nexus]

2022 baby

[buoyant osprey]

uhuh

[tawdry valley]

Tomorrow

[chilly nexus]

the day before

[buoyant osprey]

weird question but how does my pfp look (is anything weird or)

asking cuz the things i draw always end up looking weird to me

[chilly nexus]

if I had to bring something up, it would be the highlights over hornet's eye giving it a bit of an eyelash look. but it's a really good drawing no! nothing seems weird at all. i really like the cloak

[buoyant osprey]

ah, ty

[tawdry valley]

Solid work imo. Good job

[pallid flare]

i put several screen filters on so i cant see anything

[buoyant osprey]

lol

[honest river]

when it dropping?

[tawdry valley]

#hk-announcements has any info on that.

The answer is TBA

[warm bone]

?sspsa

[thin zephyr]

Reminder: The latest news for both Hollow Knight and Silksong is in #hk-announcements.
Check the pinned messages for more information, including a FAQ.

[chilly nexus]

puberty

[serene chasm]

The real question should be where is it dripping

[stiff burrow]

Where we droppin' boys

[analog forge]

in ur mum

[merry heron]

I love all of you ❤️

[serene chasm]

I hate you all

[nimble radish]

I hate all of you

[tawdry valley]

We've been over this
#hk-general message

[merry heron]

Kisses you on the forehead

[serene chasm]

No rp. and thats kinda creepy. ngl

[chilly nexus]

was godhome the first popularized bosh rush with modified/enhanced final bosses?

[analog forge]

doubt it

[serene chasm]

Yes. TC invented to boss rush mode

[chilly nexus]

I get that bosh rushes have been done before (there's even boss rush galaxy in SMG2),

i mean like, the bonus bosses at the end of each of them

adding the brothers, sheo, sly, pv, and absrad

[analog forge]

sheo is one of the brothers, how dare you exclude him like this

[chilly nexus]

XD

i bring it up cuz i'm doing the sekiro gaunlets, and they feel identical to the pantheons in design. TC did something very right with godhome, and i feel like, it being 2021 and all, there can't not be some sort of analgous boss-rushes with unique boss fights in SS

if the game came out in 2020 or 2019, maybe i'd believe it. but the concept is gold

why get rid of it if you have the time

[tawdry valley]

Bossrush/refights are not original, no

[chilly nexus]

but ones that add content

[tawdry valley]

What's original is the integration of godhome and the actual game.

[chilly nexus]

actually yeah

[tawdry valley]

The pantheon exclusives are cool, yeah

[chilly nexus]

adding content's been done too. all the mario and luigi boss rushes had new bosses at the end if you made it through, that weren't seen in the game

[chilly nexus]

i loved the unique bosses yeah

[tawdry valley]

I think radiant+ascended medals are sorta original?

[chilly nexus]

ascended modifying the fight was definitely cool

[tawdry valley]

Not the concept of slightly harder bosses though. Just the HoG as a whole, not it's individual parts

[nimble pebble]

So threads exist in discord now

[tawdry valley]

Not here apparently

[nimble pebble]

Rip

[serene chasm]

what is the point of them

[nimble pebble]

They seem pretty useful

[chilly nexus]

they're kinda like sub channels

so like an ss-discussion but just for a specific tool or smthn

[tawdry valley]

Temporary channels inside of channels basically

[nimble pebble]

Allows for sub-discussions, easier when people are having multiple discussions at once

[serene chasm]

So people can keep talking about a topic without disturbing the main?

[chilly nexus]

ye

[nimble pebble]

Yes

[tawdry valley]

Yeah essentially.

[chilly nexus]

someone brings up a topic you like? start a thread for it

the thread then gets to stay pure

[serene chasm]

I guess thats cool

[tawdry valley]

It's also not usable inside of the HK discord right now. I imagine it may have permissions attached to it.

[serene chasm]

It will be abused but still cool

[chilly nexus]

mods have been having fun with it in one of my other servers

they're pretty neat, but they don't take up the whole screen like a channel. they just appear on the right instead of the users list (but a bit wider)

[nimble pebble]

Seems useful

[vocal plover]

what happened?

[nimble pebble]

It's got a heart emote on the end I'm sure they don't actually mean it

[serene chasm]

I hope SS never comes out ❤️

[coarse leaf]

-_-

[nimble pebble]

Passive aggressive comment

[nimble radish]

so trueee bestiee

[chilly nexus]

Bess. (glances at the cup). tea.

[wide sand]

what the fuck is wrong with you?

[chilly nexus]

Hugs you from behind, chin on your left shoulder

[serene chasm]

stabs

[nimble pebble]

Anyone who makes a silknever jokes inadvertently is shitting on the death of Seth Goldman and his character Seth

[chilly nexus]

bleeds out peacefully. Mariah Carey feat. Boys II Men, One Sweet Day starts playing

[nimble pebble]

[chilly nexus]

the 🐌 on my part makes that comment so inappropriate

[nimble radish]

yo wtf roleplay @ moderationes

[analog forge]

in the same way that anyone who makes any joke is inadverently normalizing the death of all that you love and know

[chilly nexus]

looks up to see that it was hornet playing the song on her needolin

[chilly nexus]

#saved

[nimble pebble]

I don't recall all I know and love dying to cancer and getting to meet their hero and be a part of their next project

Also Rest in Peace Seth

[analog forge]

1. Rest in peace indeed
2. jokes about how silksong is actually never coming out doesn't spit on anyone grave because its just a joke.
   in the same way that half life 3 jokes dont delegitimize the thousands of hours spent working on that game, under what im sure is countless revisions and rebuilds and redrafts. Its just a joke.
   Everyone knows silksong is coming out, we're just having a bit of fun poking at how team cherry basically gives us no information.

[patent fulcrum]

i worry about them

[nimble pebble]

Idk about that but if you have enough faith that people aren't being super pessimistic and shitting on TC because they didn't meet their little fantasy of when it should come out then so be it

[analog forge]

Your the one being pessimistic here, automatically assuming the worst out of people

[tight linden]

What is happening here

[patent fulcrum]

i dont know mate

[tight linden]

It’s just a fact people expect TC to drop silksong (insert release window here) and when it doesn’t happen they get upset.

[olive bobcat]

Silknever bad

[nimble pebble]

Nah, I don't assume the worst out of people I just understand human behaviour

[tight linden]

Haven’t heard that one before (although it’s true tbh)

[nimble pebble]

These are the same people to make Hornet is void jokes unironcally

[tight linden]

Silknever is overdone, like Hornet is Void and the myriad of other unfunny jokes in this channel

[nimble pebble]

Or complain about no news then call any recent news not news then demand news

[olive bobcat]

I wonder how many people say silknever here thinking it's an original idea

[nimble pebble]

Like when the riddles came out and there will people like that

[patent fulcrum]

i hadn't heard of it

[tight linden]

Me who watched one mossbag video and never touched the game:
Haha, Hornet is Void, ammirite?? Hahaha, pale kings an asshole tho.

[analog forge]

The internet isnt a single mass of tentacles, contrary to popular belief.
there are a range of opinions on various different things.
Some people are like that true, but its in the vast minority from what i see here

[nimble pebble]

Depends on the day

[analog forge]

Confirmation bias

[patent fulcrum]

honestly mossbag makes some jokes in poor tastes but im sure he's a cool guy

[analog forge]

you're letting the worst of your experiences taste the entirety of the experience

[nimble pebble]

Silknever has been said 570 times

[olive bobcat]

It's less like a single mass of tentacles, and more like the trailer for the Discord movie featuring Danny DeVito

[tight linden]

Hey. Never talked to him before. He definitely sucks.

[hollow terrace]

the good old glass half full and glass half empty

[tight linden]

Don’t really see the point Ijones is making

We’re just saying Silknever jokes aren’t funny

[olive bobcat]

Glass half glass

[tranquil igloo]

😐

[analog forge]

Pillow didnt say that "they arent funny"

[tight linden]

Glass full empty

[haughty brook]

Ok, so this channel needs a nice full glass of chill right now.

[patent fulcrum]

glass of..water

[nimble pebble]

Nah, it was far too common, sure there's people who aren't like that but it's either people like that or people using an overused joke ironically

[analog forge]

they said it spits on seth's grave, more or less.

Theres a difference between a joke not being funny and the mockery of the dead

[nimble pebble]

Glass Glass Glass full full full empty empty empty

[cerulean sable]

I choose the other option
Smash the glass
Free yourself to this torture
Reject Silksnog

[patent fulcrum]

embrace dead cells

[analog forge]

silknog

[nimble pebble]

Monke

[tight linden]

Glass half destroyed, glass half intact. That’s how we do it in 2021 babyyyyy.

[patent fulcrum]

glass crackd. it's leaking!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[analog forge]

Silksong is leaking into our reality guys

[patent fulcrum]

oh god oh fuc

[hollow terrace]

alright that clears it

[plain prism]

Ñ

[nimble pebble]

I would call people genuinely believing Silksong will never come out just because it took longer than they expected despite several reasons showing Silksong will come out spitting on Seth's grave yes, Because Seth's wish before he died was to meet TC and be in their upcoming game to say it would genuinely not come out is to say Seth's wish is never going to come through since there's no Silksong to show off his character Seth

You can perhaps have a different opinion but I for one find it insensitive

[serene chasm]

One day we will have a glorious battle with Seth in Greymoor and it will be beautiful

[charred pulsar]

[serene chasm]

How fun is Seth to fight? Tell us Simo

[chilly nexus]

Of all the bosses we've seen, it's the one i'm most excited for

i really like fast bosses

[serene chasm]

Hes the one weve seen the most of so far

[analog forge]

yes, get simo on several blacklists for breaking nondisclosure agreements

[chilly nexus]

where you're just always "on" and reacting

[analog forge]

muwhahaha

[chilly nexus]

Simo if i can get 1mil views on an SS video can i become an agent of TC

[silver oak]

The dark side calls

[charred pulsar]

An agent of TC huh, hmm, what does an agent of TC do?

[silver oak]

They carry out stealth missions

Stealing fellow indie developer secrets

[serene chasm]

Assassinate silknever people

[analog forge]

they silence those who break the NDA

[silver oak]

Hacking into the mainframe

That’s a thing that cool people do, right

[charred pulsar]

https://tenor.com/view/cat-computer-typing-fast-gif-5368357

Like this?

[silver oak]

And then they say “I’m in” after about 10 seconds

Because if it was longer the viewers would get bored

But you would know all this already Simo

As a Team Cherry agent yourself

“Agent Simo X. Games, TCA”

[lament mauve]

I hope to see Void again.

[silver oak]

I wouldn’t count on it

Simo killed all the void in his last special ops mission

[serene chasm]

Its possible. I dont think it will be the same level as HK, but its possible for there to be some

[chilly nexus]

I'm in

what'd I miss? I was just hacking a few mainframes with my engineering knowledge and new found TC agencyship

[chilly nexus]

serves in whatever means necessary to better TC's lived experience on this planet includes serves of the croissant variety. i'm a baked goods connoisseur

(mb i forgot to un @)

[serene chasm]

ban

[chilly nexus]

banning me means i just have another mainframe to hack

don't think i can't ssh and sudo my way out of it

(but also, don't ban me to test that)

[charred pulsar]

Don't say mb to pinging me, otherwise I might not read the message at all haha

You make 🥐 as good as this emote one?

[warm bone]

if you do not ping simo in your message, it is invisible to him

[tawdry valley]

You good with pizza better than the 🍕emote?

[chilly nexus]

Better. I've trained in bakeries in both Montreal and Provence in France

[charred pulsar]

[tawdry valley]

Restaurant in my area that does Italian style pizzas

[vivid belfry]

restaurant in my area that does barbecue chicken pizza

I don't have a picture it's just really good pizza

[tawdry valley]

I'll take your word for it

[chilly nexus]

I also make apple turnovers if Ari is a fan of things apply and cinnamon-y

can also bake 'em vegan

[vivid belfry]

why are we sending food to ari

[chilly nexus]

i'm applying to be an agent of TC

[vivid belfry]

I see

[chilly nexus]

it's a formal process

[copper knot]

why is the crust larg

[cerulean sable]

datamined info suggest a "multiplayer" mode involving 100 different vessels spawning around pharloom with scattered tools

sounds very unique, excited what its gonna be called

[chilly nexus]

can verify^

[fiery coral]

Fortknight

[nimble pebble]

Broknight

[tawdry valley]

Epic rap battles of history episode 57

[cerulean sable]

so fucking true

[gilded adder]

everyone

[chilly nexus]

You've directly inspired how I will spend the next 10 mins or so of my life

[fiery coral]

greetings, heroes, Stan Lee's here to battle

Jonny

[nimble pebble]

Jonny

[vivid belfry]

Jonnard

I have had an exhausting couple of days

[buoyant osprey]

o

[gilded adder]

What have you been up to?

[vivid belfry]

my phone got yeeted

[fiery coral]

What

[vivid belfry]

and I had to get a new one

[gilded adder]

Oh, fuck. I'm sorry to hear that.

[fiery coral]

[nimble pebble]

[vivid belfry]

well I have the new one now

after 2 days of repeated visits to the At&T store

[buoyant osprey]

i wonder if ss will be out before 2023

[chilly nexus]

Can confirm, Bonnie & Clyde vs Romio & Juliet, and the one with Catherine the Great are still the best eps

[gilded adder]

That's the year that Crowsworn is estimated to release from the Kickstarter. I hope they don't release so close together because I want to be able to play one at a time without worry or missing out on the other.

[buoyant osprey]

oop

i arrived early enough to have gotten a backer slot for a corvian ability and i didnt take it ;-;

[copper knot]

7 crowsworn updates and im pretty sure the kickstarter hasnt ended?

[gilded adder]

Yea, the Kickstarter still has 11 days to go

[chilly nexus]

I feel like Will would have a wild mario maker account

[gilded adder]

Path of Pain but in Mario Maker

[chilly nexus]

and then there's me who's just like: here's one level that's a metroidvania, another that you can only hold crouch and roll through, and another that is a very intense kaizo built entirely around smw's athletic (sky) theme

i ❤️ the athletic theme of smw

[chilly nexus]

tbh, the cat dash mimic's hornet's dive pretty well

[gilded adder]

I see

[chilly nexus]

you could probably recreate the SS PoP

[buoyant osprey]

i hope we get multiple playable chars in silksong

[gilded adder]

We will have to see if SS even has a PoP equivalent. I have a feeling it may not have one but rather have platforming more integrated into exploration and the world.

[copper knot]

im afraid of lacenet

[chilly nexus]

I can see that happening too. We got a decent bit of non-white-palace platforming in HK, but it was fairly discrete/per-room. SS will probably have it more integrated. A dedicated platforming section would still be a cool to have though

[gilded adder]

I don't see Lacenet happening, at most we might get some special dialogue between the two but that would be it.

[chilly nexus]

lacenet you needn't fear

[bleak scarab]

I just don't get Lacenet

[maiden crystal]

Its fun

[stone oxide]

lacenet cant hurt u

dont like don't read or whatever

[bleak scarab]

You tricked me once you can't trick me again

[hollow terrace]

haha

Very funny

[worldly plover]

Wow I fell for it I really hate myself

[hollow terrace]

don’t post fake material

[shy kettle]

Huh

[tawdry palm]

aluo is shaking and crying

[agile herald]

Zote Kart will be announced at gamescom 2020 there will be 12 minute gameplay trailer and release date for q2 2021 I am a team che rry insider i am not lying real

[olive bobcat]

man

[stone oxide]

Wait are fakes not allowed any more

even if its disclosed that its an edit?

[olive bobcat]

I assume some fake was deleted or something

[charred pulsar]

Yeah was deleted

Fakes are allowed, just disclose ye

[hollow terrace]

Yeah Simo shared some image and I had it deleted

[charred pulsar]

Fakes are fun, no way we're gonna stop people from sharing/tricking people

Yeah 🦈 >

[olive bobcat]

[hollow terrace]

Has been

[chilly nexus]

ye was gonna say, that was Graig's dp for a while :p

[tawdry valley]

As you wish

[hollow terrace]

The fonts is wrong

Unless you’re using better discord

[charred pulsar]

Not fake

[chilly nexus]

omg i thought the listening to spotify bit was the fake. didn't even read "soon"

[tawdry valley]

Pog

[chilly nexus]

nvm, it does say soon, i'm just on lightmode and assumed it said Simo on the right

[tawdry valley]

Only so much I can do on mobile

[cerulean sable]

tfw admins changing names is enough to tide people with how stagnant hype has been for over 2 years

[hollow terrace]

It means something COPIUM

[stone oxide]

Classic dom

[haughty ingot]

simo?

[haughty ingot]

simo come

[charred pulsar]

[haughty ingot]

hello simo game tester for popular indie game hollow knight

i have a bug i must report

[still owl]

real shit

[bleak scarab]

Oh no

[haughty ingot]

i tried through TC bug report form but nothing yet

and it was a bug for a while so many people must’ve reported

and yet no fix

the primal aspids the collector can drop shouldn’t be able to shoot on the first frame that they appear
like that cannot be by design choice, right?

[reef scarab]

I thought it would’ve been a pic of elderbug or something

[signal crag]

Oh right, that thing

[haughty ingot]

no it’s genuine

[charred pulsar]

When did you report it? (and yeah i've heard of this for awhile now)

[haughty ingot]

i’m trying to do hitless p5 and i don’t want it to end at collector

[naive flax]

Send the most convincing fake you have seen yet

[bleak scarab]

I thought you were gonna say "No silksong" and I was gonna sob

[haughty ingot]

like before 1.5.75 i think

like soon after they opened their form

[still owl]

oh I'm just pepegaing, more or less because you asked about it being a design choice.

[haughty ingot]

so yea i think my only choice is to tell you or benji directly since it has been a known bug for a long time, so if it can’t be fixed for some reason then maybe you guys could tell why or something

that’s what speedruns are for

[still owl]

More hours means more bang for your buck.

[sacred stratus]

speedrunning is spending a lot of time trying to spend as little time as possible

[haughty ingot]

just ask speedrunners how many hours they have on HK

[charred pulsar]

Yeah it's definitely been reported. I can't guarantee what bugs TC focus or prioritise on when releasing new updates; but i'll bring it up next time, although it has been reported ye

[signal crag]

Yeah, it’s a know issue

[sacred stratus]

I'd imagine it's a few thousands

[haughty ingot]

alright, thank you simo

soon™️

[still owl]

Mad man.

[sacred stratus]

handing over the exam not filled at all is speedrunning the exam on the low% category

[still owl]

How many hits you at ara

[haughty ingot]

my best so far was 8

[charred pulsar]

What got you in that run?

[sacred stratus]

you're not too far...

[haughty ingot]

i switched from MoP to grubberfly recently and i think it’s better for me

[still owl]

I might have to play a bit of catch up then

[haughty ingot]

you mean what charms?

[sacred stratus]

he means what hit you

[charred pulsar]

I mean what bosses hit you

[haughty ingot]

ah, i don’t remember since it’s been a while, but usually when i mess up then it means i got hit more than once on the same boss

[still owl]

If you do end up beating P5NH with Grubberfly, that'd be amazing given the current line up for charms is more or less the same.

[sacred stratus]

actually it's more likely to be Markoth or GPZ

[haughty ingot]

possible contenders are uumuu, marmu, watcher knights, tyrant, or just any bosses that are in the “middle” of the pantheon

[haughty ingot]

oh those could be to

[charred pulsar]

Is that copypasta an emote? hahah wow

[still owl]

Its readable if you squint really hard

Microscopes may also help

[charred pulsar]

[signal crag]

Also, i’m not sure if this can really be “fixed”, but marmu’s collision physics are so weird and unpredictable sometimes

[edgy sleet]

any news?

[haughty ingot]

[edgy sleet]

or speculation

[still owl]

Theres the big guy lol

[haughty ingot]

little broken on mobile i’d guess

[signal crag]

Can confirm

[still owl]

Not horizontally!

[earnest merlin]

Quirrel best dude

[haughty ingot]

also i’m actually doing alright at loss kin, it’s fun

loss kin

[still owl]

Lost kin is one of the easier ones.

[tranquil igloo]

cap

[still owl]

As long as the ghosts don't spawn on top of you at least.

[tranquil igloo]

they spawn 24/7

[still owl]

You can absolutely pummle that boss with stuns

[tranquil igloo]

i focus on lost kin more then the balloons

[still owl]

That's why, prioritize balloons over LK

They go down in one hit so go for the easier target

[tranquil igloo]

nice

[haughty ingot]

i try to just kill a ghost as soon as it spawns when LK is staggered

[tranquil igloo]

nice

want a cookie?

[haughty ingot]

sure

[tranquil igloo]

there

[haughty ingot]

delicious.

[tranquil igloo]

nice

[coarse leaf]

Ah tis a good day

[edgy sleet]

explain

[coarse leaf]

^?

[edgy sleet]

explain

[cerulean sable]

let us talk about content bloat

[nimble pebble]

I'm riding some pain killers to combat my Migraine so I'm here to party

[cerulean sable]

some argues that too much content thats relatively the same could possibly lead to some burnouts and newer looking areas can only do so much

[nimble pebble]

[cerulean sable]

true

[nimble pebble]

Personally my opinion and idea of content bloating is shoving so much content in it seems disingenuine, more a quantity over quality product

[cerulean sable]

yes

[nimble pebble]

Also ruins what specific parts we might like best because there's just so much of it there that the part we like fades out into a sea of content

If every inch had an enemy on screen and there's these giant areas and we have like 50 of them then it'll get boring real fast

Part of what's entertaining about a game world is finding out for yourself what's out there not only when you know nothing but when you've discovered everything

I for one like Kingdom's edge, it's my favourite area, however if there was like 12 Kingdom's edges then it would be boring and uninteresting

Bloated content can even work sometimes as long as it's reasonably spread out and paced out in a format that's enjoyable

But if you just go and say "Here's 50 NPCS on screen, Have fun" I'm going to find it boring

The fun of talking to NPC's is often the lack there of in some cases and even if there's more usually their unique and fun to talk to and not just there to exist

[sacred stratus]

I just realized that the HK release trailer has 400 dislikes 😦

[cerulean sable]

Yeah true, tho some argues HKs gameplay is a bit repetitive to warrant that much of a long game but i think it depends whether you like exploring enough to be the primer for your search

Then ofc goes back to "well it has too much backtracking and the areas are samey" arguement

[nimble pebble]

I feel people who don't like exploring shouldn't play HK

[cerulean sable]

it depends, for some they like the idea but they just find HK's color pallete to be subdued

which i personally thought fit the atmosphere but i get where theyre coming from

[nimble pebble]

HK is a non linear game it's meant for people who want to fuck around and do what they want

Linear games are made for people who want to enjoy the ride and play through a story

Both are good and I enjoy games from both sides

While I'm more a gameplay over story guy instead of the other way around I still enjoy a good story

[cerulean sable]

yeah i mean you should enjoy exploration if you wanna like HK, but im talking about the specific subset that thought the cooler color pallete kinda subdued the "area variety" part of HK

[nimble pebble]

It's why I play a lot of Capcom games which mostly just shove the story to the side and just let you play the game

[cerulean sable]

"I love metroidvanias but i cant get into Hollow Knight" is something i see pretty often

granted it does go a little bit extreme which both had some detractors but also got some people into it

[nimble pebble]

Speaking of Linear games, I'm getting Skyward sword for my birthay and my Skyward sword joycons are already in for me to play it with and it's my first time playing the game and i'm excited

[nimble pebble]

I can get what they say, but my opinion on the matter is "I get what they're saying but personally those aren't my qualms so I don't care"

[cerulean sable]

fair enough

[nimble pebble]

Probably because HK is revamping the genre and bringing speed to the equation

Like with Movies I often like "Bad" movies because I'm not going to cave in to societal pressure idgaf if "people didn't like it" or "it has weak plot" If I had a fun time watching it, then it was fucking good

On that same Branch of thought, I like most "Good" movies but there are some that I don't like despite what people will say

[cerulean sable]

That being said while I dont necessarily agree with all of what they said, I usually understand where theyre coming from and where I wanna go is can some parts of HK that could change for SS that wouldnt really do a lot of harm

Like what I usually see is people saying they didnt find anything about HK, fine, but could it compromise some of the other peoples caveats without "lowering the experience"

[nimble pebble]

Like into the spiderverse everyone says it's an 11/10 movie, but I personally don't see the hype, Looks decent don't get me wrong but personally not my 11/10 movie on the flipside I liked Venom but I was getting shit for liking a movie that has "weak plot" like fuck you man I just like symbiotes, where's my Carnage movie

[cerulean sable]

Usually those people that complains about stuff like, the difficulty, the map system are usually the ones where if you ask them to change it, would receive major backlash from fanbase

[nimble pebble]

Who tf watches Godzilla for the human subplot we're here for GIANT MONSTERS

[cerulean sable]

Yeah some people do have kneejerk reactions when it comes to people liking something they dont, and vice versa

[nimble pebble]

Have you perhaps considered, it's just not your type of game

[cerulean sable]

I dont agree with sentiment that just because they disagree with some design decisions doesnt mean the game shouldnt be for them imo

[nimble pebble]

That's like asking Dark souls to have an Easy mode, Miyazaki wanted it to be hard, So it's hard, that's it.

[fiery coral]

Miyazaki never wanted it to be hard if I remember correctly

[nimble pebble]

He's the Game dev He'll do what he wants, Don't like it? Make your own game

[fiery coral]

as in, making it difficult was never a conscious design choice/philosophy

[cerulean sable]

Like i know at the end its up to the dev, and i wouldnt want them to change their visions, but for example

the bench distances from the bosses i do not have qualms nor did i care about it, but a lot of people didnt like it, im not jumping with "well this game isnt for you if you cant stand it" or something along those lines, but i wouldnt really mind something like that to be closer even if it wasnt an issue for me

so my questions boils down to, to some of these caveats, is it fine to do some compromises to the sake of making it slightly more accessible vs "they shouldnt change it at all ever"

same goes with the old age "early game traversal is kinda bland" arguements

[nimble pebble]

I'm quite tired of people talking hot shit but can't back up their words, thinking game development is easy or simple or "Why can't they just add this"

As if adding things like difficulty to a game that's prebuilt a certain way isn't hard and time consuming

Same when adding multiplayer to a single player built game

[fiery coral]

it can definitely be expressed better than "why can't the developers just add this it'd be simple for them", but the fact that that complaint was made shows that there is/are certainly an issue(s) that can be fixed/improved, in the eyes of some people at least

if a player sees problems with a game I don't know if it's best to just say "the game is not for you" or similar

[fiery coral]

I suppose it comes down to handling it case by case? If you consider the bench distance, for instance, I really don't think it'd have a significant impact on player experience if there was a bench closer to Mantis Lords, or the Soul Master

[signal crag]

I think an issue that some people had that could be solved without really impacting the rest of the game is the slow start

[nimble pebble]

I feel it can boil down to that in some cases while it obviously isn't as black and white, If you find certain core mechanics appalling then it simply isn't for you, it's one thing when you don't like a certain thing about a specific game but when it gets to the point where you hate a Game Genre's core concepts then it really isn't for you like how I don't like JRPG"s because of turn based combat especially slow turned based combat as well as another mechanic I really hate so most JRPG's ain't my style but I can respect that others like it

[fiery coral]

that's true, me with roguelites

[cerulean sable]

their philosophy was that the runback is part of the challenge or what not, which i can see in some angle but a lot of people disagreed even if it didnt affect me personally so whether or not they add more of those outliers is something i wont care. (even my friend who loves the game complained about it) BUT if they changed those, i wouldnt suddenly start going "oh no they made the benches closer, they casualized the game" or something like that

[nimble pebble]

Adds to the atmosphere imo, it's a dead as fuck kingdom, to show how dead it is shits gonna feel real slow, because there isn't much to liven it up

[cerulean sable]

i get something like difficulty being a very dangerous territory if they change given that its a core appeal, but lets say they did bring sprint earlier or they made benches closer, would that detract from the core experience

[fiery coral]

benches certainly not, I would say

[nimble pebble]

I feel people are getting too caught up on the perfect game experience since it simply doesn't exist, no game is perfect and if it were we'd get bored because there's nothing to complain about, if all of HK's BS glitches were gone then what would we blame our mistakes on then

[fiery coral]

perfect game experiences don't exist, of course aside from Portal 2 fight me but the flaws can still be pointed out, and attempts can be made to fix them

even if there aren't glitches developers can still take feedback on what players feel isn't designed very well or isn't fun to play

[signal crag]

As an attempt to find a compromise

[nimble pebble]

I could make the argument if HK were perfect I could just beat P5AB or R5 and anyone else could too because the games perfect it'll just teach me how to achieve it and it'll totally be possible

Something I find funny is all the game projects I plan to possibly produce are in Genre's I despise, but perhaps by doing it in my own way it becomes enjoyable

[cerulean sable]

doesnt mean the game couldnt have some changes to it, the way i see it is like the benches for example again (slow start was something i argued with grover and i agreed it boils down more to the lack interactivity with the platforming early game rather than speed itself)

Game 1 implements long runbacks
Group A = I am fine with the long benches
Group B = I do not like the long benches

Game 2 implements shorter runbacks
Group A = I find the lack of a longer runback is abhorrent to the experience
Group B = I am fine with the current runback

I dont think Game 2 - Group A is gonna be something thats gonna happen realistically, (and im kinda in that camp, but my reaction would be "doesnt really affect me but if it makes it smoother for the other players, i dont mind")
but I do see one arguement against it that understand with if its done improperly:
the lack of unexpectedness

Some argue that, eventually you start going "oh bench? obvious boss fight" whereas youre in your toes when you dont know when a boss will show up (if the game is going for this certain route)

[nimble pebble]

Tbh with the game I'm going to make I'm going to have difficulty settings but I'm going to lock them behind Passwords that you have to decipher from Youtube clips I will put up on the Company channel that you will have to figure out the hints throughout the Youtube video to change your difficulty and each difficulty setting will have a different password, If you want your "Difficulty settings" in my hard game Then earn it Maybe it can be a community thing to where they work together to figure it out

Bench just means Stag station to me in most cases

[cerulean sable]

Tho something unexpected can still be done like, for example, if an elevator went up and down from CoT benches to SM, because overall i do agree that the game doesnt have a lot of overly bad runbacks, but the first few bosses you encounter (Mantis and Soul Master) is kinda a bad introduction to it

[nimble pebble]

Yeah

My game will be the big fun but don't ask me when it'll be out, I don't even know when I'll be able to start it

[fiery coral]

Well, the unexpectedness would only be decreased if you place benches exclusively before bosses, I'd say. But if you place some benches normally, and some just before bosses, it should be enough to not make it obvious that there's a boss around the corner.

[cerulean sable]

Yeah yeah, if you just dump it in front of a large room everytime thats where the obvious "oh wow boss fight time" pops in

[fiery coral]

like, take the bonfires/lanterns/idols in From's games; usually they're placed at a reasonable distance from the boss, but there are also many other bonfires that break up areas into different sections; result being that you don't always expect a boss after a bonfire

[cerulean sable]

yeah its only placed when its during major boss fights

[edgy sleet]

release speculation?

[cerulean sable]

except for midir, i see people that hates their runbacks

[Date.now(), Positive Infinity)

[fiery coral]

...Midir?

why

you encounter zero resistance

[signal crag]

The fact that there are not even any enemies during the runback feels like a cruel joke.

[cerulean sable]

theres no enemies from what ive heard but the time it just takes to get there for an already very difficult bossfight is just annoyance for a lot

[signal crag]

They didn’t really needed to make it so long, but they still did

Unless they really wanted to make you afraid to die, as an attempt to stay focused during the fight.

[fiery coral]

personally I don't really mind the length as long as there aren't many enemies

[cerulean sable]

seriously theres like 3 sides of the discussion here

1. "You shouldnt bash your head against a wall repeatedly, so they made long runbacks to make you think about where you went wrong"
2. "Its part of the challenge, its supposed to show your mastery around the route"
3. "Its a waste of my time, the challenge is the boss fight itself, If i wanted to 'Cool Off' then i would just stay around the checkpoint and do that"

[fiery coral]

I honestly didn't even give a second thought to the runback, ha; it was a change for once to not have to worry about any other enemies

other bosses may have shorter distances separating you from them, but a lot of them have smaller enemies which are annoying distractions to me

I usually end up running past them

[cerulean sable]

for there are some parts of HK that had similar sentiments, like Hornet 2
which i wouldnt mind if they made the terrain even so i can just Cdash across but no they didnt
I was just sighing everytime i died to her

[fiery coral]

ah, understandable

[dreamy zenith]

Is this a discussion on the flaws in hollowknight's death mechanics and what they could do better in silksong?

[signal crag]

Well, more about the runback

[fiery coral]

was hoping to slowly lead it into Soulsborne territory but yeah

[dreamy zenith]

thought so

[cerulean sable]

Well yeah but my initial pitch was more "Some features are disliked by some fanbase. Whether they hated the game or still loved it, what/or should the game make compromises to some of these features without necessarily making the people the originally loved it hate it"

Which where we went with difficulty, and we kinda concluded that if you changed the difficulty or added an easy mode, people are gonna get pissed for whatever reasons

[dreamy zenith]

I find death early game much more punishing than late because early you have way less movement early, and it so takes longer to get back.
Hornet seems much more speedy and fast however so thats not too much of my concern

[cerulean sable]

So we went with runbacks

[cerulean sable]

and the looks of it hard currency will be more available in SS

[dreamy zenith]

mm

[signal crag]

Like, the inclusion of an easier mode suddenly is detrimental for the game for some?

[fiery coral]

[dreamy zenith]

Thats good if the economy problem is fixed

More things to buy and all

no point having a currency when you can't use it

[cerulean sable]

Its a tossup
Easy Mode bad cuz

• Goes against dev's vision
• Devs dont have resources to balance it
• The last aspect is the one i actually dislike whiles the others i understand, and its more of "You wont get the true experience"

[cerulean sable]

you remembered the Edge mag? they mentioned how you can connect rosary beads for a markup to make them into something similar like relics that you dont lose when you die

[dreamy zenith]

mm yes

[fiery coral]

how does it "go against devs' vision", though

[cerulean sable]

having a banker style thing on the go should alleviate the frustrations at least

[signal crag]

Dunno, ask the haters

[cerulean sable]

If they wanted to make a game to be difficult, thats their choice

and i agree, thats on them

[dreamy zenith]

dev vision is dev vision not fan vision of course

[cerulean sable]

but if the reason for not adding difficulty is because the fanbase thinks you wont understand or feel true satisfaction, thats where i think its full of shit

because at the end if a game has something more than its difficulty, its up to the player to decide how they wanna experience the game

[dreamy zenith]

Id love a harder mode that isn't hardcore

i always love hard modes

[cerulean sable]

Pathologic 2 creators added a difficulty slider where you can change tons of options like spawns and items and what not

but at the end they said "I mean, you do you, but the default options of the game is to feel like you wont save everyone, you will never have enough resources to save everyone, you will never have enough supplies for everyone, you will always have to leave someone dead, and evoking that feeling is the point of the game"

[dreamy zenith]

Maybe the sakurai system could work

yeah, the slider

then again, silksong aint level based

[cerulean sable]

But if the reason is "YOU MUJST PLYA ON HARD OR ELSE YOU WILL NEVER UNDERSTASND WHAT IT LIKES TO BE A TRUE GAMER" all i get from it is some sort of insecurity that you must feel youre part of some elite club of game who beated this or that

[dreamy zenith]

that is true

[cerulean sable]

yeah they already mentioned SS is gonna be the relative same difficulty as HK

nothing harder, nothing easier

[dreamy zenith]

same thing with a lot of the harder stuff in hollowknight

people just enjoy being elitist i guess

not talking modded bosses or p5 or radHog particularly. Just stuff "filthy casuals" couldn't do.

[cerulean sable]

yeah, if you wanna enjoy everything else in the game when it has the story, exploration, music, thats fine

i personally think HK is more than its difficulty, its a part of it sure but i get the caveats of others that just wants to explore

[dreamy zenith]

definitely

[cerulean sable]

and then go around again to the typical "its not a game for you then", its either people dont play, or they just used cheat mode and enjoy the rest of it anyway

they do them

[nimble pebble]

I feel end game SS will be harder than end game HK though even if it starts the same

[dreamy zenith]

Id guess it'd be different play styles

[cerulean sable]

i wouldnt mind a harder end game as long as the progression is smooth

[dreamy zenith]

Some people will likely have a hard time adjusting to hornets faster pace.

[cerulean sable]

P5 i just found boring more than hard

like, it has hard fights sure, but the endurance style is just tiring for me that i wasnt even having fun

[nimble pebble]

P5 is an endurance grind more than anything

[dreamy zenith]

p5 i am currently preparing for

[cerulean sable]

also relevant

https://youtu.be/E7uKUgire7Y?t=1278

timestamped

[fallen kiln]

Ya, I want combat like the mantis gods

would be amazing for silksong.

Fast paced bullet hell.

[dreamy zenith]

hm

maybe dlc could have similar to that level stuff

not so hectic however

[nimble pebble]

I understood the part you timestamped but right after that he talks about people lamenting Survival in a Survival game

[fallen kiln]

Ya, mantis gods was an adrenaline rush. goddamn that fight was cool

[nimble pebble]

Are you guys actually talking about the Mantis Gods mod or Sisters of Battle

[dreamy zenith]

Closest boss to a silksong boss in hollowknight i argue, is hive knight

[fallen kiln]

Mod

[nimble pebble]

Just makin sure

[fallen kiln]

Hive knight was slow.

[dreamy zenith]

yeah

if it were i bit faster it'd be comparable to lace

[fallen kiln]

NKG was also close to a silksong boss fight possibly

[dreamy zenith]

probably

Silksong feels more like a botw type

with the tools

[signal crag]

Is especially worse because of P4 exist:
If you managed to complete that one, then it means that you are already well above most of the fights in the last one, and things like each of the bosses still having their own introductions are really detrimental

[dreamy zenith]

lots of creativity can come from that.

yeah p5 should've just been the highest upgrade of every boss.

Only thing it does with that is sob and nosket

[cerulean sable]

yeah thats one thing i agree

P5 couldve been the test against the best the game has to offer, including the new fights

[signal crag]

Those two were unexpected and very neat

[cerulean sable]

as it stands out, for me its just a time sink

its not PV that breaks me, or NKG

its fighting 2 of the same bosses except the other one is the stronger one, or fighting boring ones like Moss Charger

[nimble pebble]

Tf's a Nosket I know you mean Flying Nosk but if you're going for Noskette trying actually saying Noskette Nosket just gives me an aneurysm every time I stare it because it makes me think of a Nosk Basket

🧺

[dreamy zenith]

pure vessel is probably the boss i have the most experience on in the game

[nimble pebble]

|| ||

[dreamy zenith]

i still need to do radiant one handed pv tho

[nimble pebble]

PV is my favourite fight

[signal crag]

That’s actually very annoying, since there’s even a way to refight every boss you prefer, having for the final challenge both version of the same boss seems pretty detrimental, unless TC really wanted a “every single boss all in one” challenge

[nimble pebble]

P5 should be the 10 hardest bosses instead of 44

[dreamy zenith]

yep

[signal crag]

Which i guess they considered it if they wanted to build an increasing tension as you “ascend” towards the final boss

[nimble pebble]

I suppose the climax was only as good as it was with having to obliterate literally every boss in the game

P5AB seems excessive and I don't really want to do it though I've done up to P3AB and will probably do P4AB at some point, but P5AB just feels like too much of a grind mentally

[signal crag]

Yeah, can confirm

Also some bosses issues and inconsistencies don’t exactly make it very inviting to to attempt, either

P5 it’s probably just too long in general,
and everytime i think about doing P5AB, i immediately lose interest

[nimble pebble]

P5 can be fun once you've beaten the grind it's about 20-30 minutes but the last 6 bosses shoot up your run by 15 minutes

I know my first run of PoP took forever because of one part I had trouble doing

But now my most recent PoP run was my fastest

Being around 17-20 minutes

I find PoP fun now

[dreamy zenith]

p5 is the roadblock that keeps me from getting like half the acheivements

Idiot Brain doesn't want to start a new save if I haven't got all acheivements i can in the first

[nimble pebble]

I've gotten all the achievements on two platforms

[dreamy zenith]

Uhuh

[nimble pebble]

[dreamy zenith]

ive done about 55 of them on switch and 40 on pc

Not gonna go back to switch, even if it was my first, most likely.

[nimble pebble]

63 out of 63 on Both Switch and PC

[dreamy zenith]

Yes sir you've said that

Congrats on it still tho

[nimble pebble]

I didn't say which platforms before that though

[dreamy zenith]

not like i couldn't, more that i don't play hollowknight to calm down

[nimble pebble]

I play HK when I feel like playing HK

Video games are my relaxing jam

Unless I'm doing something insanely difficult I'm vibing and even if I am I'm still vibing, just in a different way

But I understand where you're coming from

[floral night]

Intense vibing

[nimble pebble]

Feel the Vibe

Also nice Ahit Pfp

[floral night]

Thank you, your profile is very cute

[nimble pebble]

Thanks

[floral night]

[dreamy zenith]

hollowknight can be calm, but its a gameplay game not a cutscene game

Gotta focus

[obtuse glacier]

[nimble pebble]

I see you've found my banner

[gilded wharf]

so guys any news

huh, my name hasn't changed

[dreamy zenith]

nope

[nimble pebble]

That's what's to love about it

[gilded wharf]

convenient

[dreamy zenith]

indeed

[gilded wharf]

where does half life fit tho 🤔

the gameplay is the cutscenes

[nimble pebble]

Some games are gameplay over story others are story over gameplay, I like both sides, but the best is a healthy mix of both

[gilded wharf]

i gave up p5

markoth is just too much man

[dreamy zenith]

that feeling of satisfaction where you kill a gold lynel, beat khan makyr nightmare, fight through lenora in volt white 1, beat pure vessel radiant, finally splat inner agent 3, kill moonlord on master, thats what i love about videogames

[gilded wharf]

i hope silksong doesn't have anything like that

i even beat nkg radiant but i cant do ascended markoth for some reason

[dreamy zenith]

ive done asckoth but not rad nkg

[gilded wharf]

rad nkg is easy once you know the attacks

you can get confues sometimes with the direction of the dash but overall it's quite easy

[dreamy zenith]

Yep

ive done asc nkg back on switch and ill do it again for p5 prep now on pc

[obtuse glacier]

i thought this was silksong discussion
talk about all the news we've been getting

[nimble pebble]

I've done Rad HoG several times over and can confirm Radkoth is a prick

[dreamy zenith]

your pfp describes it perfectly pear

[obtuse glacier]

i've done RHoG twice
working on the third

[gilded wharf]

dude go outside

path of pain was fun, except for the last few saws

[nimble pebble]

Kind of rude to just assume because people are good at a game they have no life

[obtuse glacier]

[gilded wharf]

of course, only i can be good at a game and have a life, id assume everyone else doesn't have one because i dont have original jokes

[dreamy zenith]

welp

yeah more than 1 radhog is overkill..
Unless its multiplat

[nimble pebble]

PoP is so much fun, the last few parts do confuse you I feel but once you're past that it's smooth sailing, doing it over and in pretty good time is satisfying and fun

[gilded wharf]

so do you guys think threads are coming to this server?

[dreamy zenith]

Nope

[gilded wharf]

they're ok for private servers imo

[dreamy zenith]

Moderation.

[gilded wharf]

yeye that's what i was saying

[dreamy zenith]

thats the difficulty in letting people make threads

[gilded wharf]

you dont need to do that on a server with a few friends

[dreamy zenith]

Yeah

[gilded wharf]

on a public server, yeah, i can totally see why that would be

[nimble pebble]

What if I'm bored, and I have a fresh new file I completed and a new HoG to rad to fill in the time

[gilded wharf]

pandemic

[dreamy zenith]

Your life choices

[nimble pebble]

Wow, way to word it like I'm wasting my own time

[gilded wharf]

i have 132 hours in gdash

[dreamy zenith]

I mean literally

I wouldn't stop you

mainly because I can't, also

[nimble pebble]

Not like you could

[dreamy zenith]

exactly.

[nimble pebble]

[gilded wharf]

wow, this chat was a lot more depressed the last time i checked

[nimble pebble]

I mostly play other things anyway

[dreamy zenith]

yeah

[gilded wharf]

yeah same

[dreamy zenith]

i only have 180 hours total in hk

[gilded wharf]

celeste was fun

[dreamy zenith]

I should get Celeste

[gilded wharf]

you absolutely should

[dreamy zenith]

i was given a choice by myself to buy 2 of the 3 out of undertale celeste and Hollowknight to play on switch

[gilded wharf]

it's pretty hard, but you'll never lose 40 minutes of progress

[dreamy zenith]

uhuh

[gilded wharf]

hey guys let's talk about tools

[dreamy zenith]

yeaaahhh fuck yeah

[gilded wharf]

where's ttaco

[dreamy zenith]

hornet mecha suit

[cerulean sable]

death tot silksong

[gilded wharf]

yay

[nimble pebble]

I would get Celeste but it looks like too intensive of a platformer to me and I don't like games that are more platformer than any other genre the game is

Even Mario let's you jump on things and throw fire balls

[gilded wharf]

you jump on stuff to knock them out

[nimble pebble]

Anyways GN guys

[gilded wharf]

though there aren't actual enemies

[dreamy zenith]

Nintendo really needs a comeback soon with a big new mainline mario game like oddysey was

[gilded wharf]

mario on steam when

[dreamy zenith]

Uh ask john romero

[violet fern]

does hornet have a body count?

[nimble pebble]

I'm vibin off the side series like PM, LM etc but they need to bring back M&L I know Alphadream went bankrupt but that sereis was good and they made Bank

[dreamy zenith]

yeah..

[nimble pebble]

But yeah another good Mainline would be good

[dreamy zenith]

Only one i played was dream team

[nimble pebble]

Never

[dreamy zenith]

Although i did play super paper and sticker star

[nimble pebble]

Just like Bloodborne for steam

[gilded wharf]

so how much do you guys bet the steam deck is a flop

[dreamy zenith]

I bet nothing

[nimble pebble]

[nimble pebble]

Don't you dare put SPM and Sticker star in the same boat

[dreamy zenith]

don't care

[gilded wharf]

have you heard of this actual hidden indie gem

[dreamy zenith]

One of them i got further in and it sure wasn't super

[gilded wharf]

chicken invaders

[dreamy zenith]

Liked super more even still

[nimble pebble]

Sticker star sucks and super paper mario was good

[dreamy zenith]

i did enjoy sticker star

[nimble pebble]

It's a switch for PC gamers, all the rich PC players will just be able to play portable now

[dreamy zenith]

id probably love thousand year

[nimble pebble]

TTYD is one of if not the best PM

[dreamy zenith]

laptop.

[gilded wharf]

imo it doesn't need to be a switch killer

[nimble pebble]

Most Laptops aren't as strong as the steam deck

[gilded wharf]

mine lags on hk

[dreamy zenith]

Just connect a steam controller to a decent-ish gaming laptop and you have steam deck

[nimble pebble]

And tbh the only ones that are aren't worth investing in when you could just buy a steam deck for cheaper

[dreamy zenith]

most is not measurable

id be happy if steam deck is good however

its just, not new

[nimble pebble]

It is, Steam deck could play the highest of quality games and is portable you're not getting a Laptop that can play same said games at good quality under 5K and that's being generous

[dreamy zenith]

eh

[gilded wharf]

could be overhyped

[dreamy zenith]

pros- lower price for equal good enough hardware
-portable
cons-
low battery life
-its a fucking value console and thus i fear for it

[nimble pebble]

Steam deck is literally a portable PC for expensive desktop PC gamers, that's it

[dreamy zenith]

Yep

[tribal merlin]

the obvious advantage over a laptop is that it's a defined hardware platform that can be a dev/optimization target whereas a laptop can never be, take 100 laptops and you have 100 different hardware configurations

[gilded wharf]

sounds too good to be true tbh

[tribal merlin]

same goes for pc

[dreamy zenith]

true, sadly, its valve

[nimble pebble]

Valve is the core company of steam

[dreamy zenith]

If nintendo made laptops that played nintendo games however...
What a wacky world

[nimble pebble]

Steam would not exist without it

[dreamy zenith]

duh

[nimble pebble]

It's only logical that it's from Valve then

[dreamy zenith]

...

Obviously

[nimble pebble]

Steam Deck can mod

[dreamy zenith]

i never suggested it shouldn't be from valve

[proud vale]

It can also emulate

[tribal merlin]

I doubt you'll be able to swap the SoC

and all other mods don't really matter

[alpine wagon]

so

if ss was a prequel

why would hera move from another kingdom

then birth hornet just so she can move to another kingdom

it is clear hera was not raised in hallownest

id like to see your opinions

[burnt topaz]

Is your argument against prequelists the idea that hornet couldnt have been born in pharloom, I think im misinterpreting

[alpine wagon]

ive tryed to avoid spoilers

[burnt topaz]

all spoilers are allowed here

[alpine wagon]

whats pharloom

[burnt topaz]

The new kingdom Silksong takes place in

[alpine wagon]

ok

[burnt topaz]

Could you reiterate your point from earlier?

[alpine wagon]

do weavers loose memory when moving kingdoms

[burnt topaz]

Im not entirely sure, I dont think so?

Thats a very #hk-lore question

[alpine wagon]

ok

is this server run by team cherry

[brittle garnet]

The general consensus is that Weavers and other bugs who were already intelligent before entering Hallownest don't lose anything.

[pallid flare]

not directly

Hornet got weakened by that cage

[alpine wagon]

ok

what did the cage do

[brittle garnet]

It is the opposite of clear

[alpine wagon]

i thought they forced her in the cage to forget everything

[burnt topaz]

Kinda vague but we know her power was weakened, the cage also has a seal of binding on it which wouldve done something to her

[pallid flare]

the cage specifically did weaken her

[alpine wagon]

like the seal on the black egg

[pallid flare]

yea

[alpine wagon]

ok

ss better be super long super hard

and if we dont hear anything by chistmas there wont be a single person to remember the arftermath

[pallid flare]

TC trives to make ss as hard as hollow knight

[burnt topaz]

If you are bad at the game it'll last longer

[alpine wagon]

is beating it in 12 hours without help first playthrough bad

[burnt topaz]

I have no idea

[pallid flare]

yes

[alpine wagon]

well ss is going to be fun

also https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCGkOTcm0f59M_BF-Knnktug
Go NOW!

[pallid flare]

wtf is that

[alpine wagon]

the most funny hk player

[burnt topaz]

It is just a youtube link dw

[alpine wagon]

yes

[burnt topaz]

Ive seen this guy in my recommendations but never actually checked them out

[coarse leaf]

windette is pretty good

any news on this game

[pallid flare]

nope

[fallow apex]

We wish there was

[coarse leaf]

APWOT is coming but that's not going to have much news

[fallow apex]

Apwot?

[coarse leaf]

Maybe just confirmation that they're still working on the game and are alive

[fallow apex]

The hells that

[coarse leaf]

A profound waste of time

[fallow apex]

Oh so half the games i own

[coarse leaf]

do people beleive we're getting silksong this year

nope

[fallow apex]

Some do

[coarse leaf]

I'm betting on July 2022 myself for silksong

[fallow apex]

But they Also probably belive in the tooth fairy

[coarse leaf]

true

[fallow apex]

I bet it’s gonna come out between today and the year 8792

[coarse leaf]

q4 2020 used to be pesimistic

[fallow apex]

Well if found out about SS in 2021 so No problem for me

[coarse leaf]

2023 is now the pessimistic option 😳

[fallow apex]

Nah 2065 is

[coarse leaf]

If it comes out in 2023 expect the biggest game ever

/s

[fallow apex]

It can’t be the biggest game ever

[coarse leaf]

there were

a few.... people who believed the game would come out after 2020

[coarse leaf]

sarcasm

[fallow apex]

I know

[coarse leaf]

I know you know

[fallow apex]

But it’s literally impossible since games like TBoI exist and they have unlimitrd possibilities of seeds

[coarse leaf]

Yeah

[fallow apex]

Making them theoretically infinite

[coarse leaf]

tboi is great

[fallow apex]

Yeeeee

Repentance is a good DLC

[coarse leaf]

However it could very possibly be the biggest metroidvania with a properly structured map (not infinite)

just beat tainted apollyon mega satan

[fallow apex]

That is indeed possible practically

[fallow apex]

I still haven’t unlocked the lamb or gettem to the blue baby bossfight

[coarse leaf]

did you get the alt floors

What other HUGE metroidvanias are out there anyway? Ori?

[fallow apex]

One hush fight away from unlocking them

[coarse leaf]

already have all of his completion marks

[fallow apex]

It’s not about luck you need to drop a trinket in the bossroom or item room for them to spawn

[coarse leaf]

hes a broken character

[fallow apex]

And im gonna use him to instabeat greed mode

Deep pockets pog

[coarse leaf]

or have pandoras box

[fallow apex]

Wait really?

Ile just beat it as tainted cain when i unlock it and fully fill the machine

So ile have all the unlock from it

Call me a cheater i dare you

[coarse leaf]

my greed is at 730, only two of those were tainted cain and they weren't much

[fallow apex]

Yeah thats Why tainted cain was invented

Also im waiting for the fiend folio port cuz i want to see tainted fiend so much

[coarse leaf]

tainted lilith is the best character

[fallow apex]

I prefer the pain of tainted Lost

[coarse leaf]

I have the light path on jacob and esau and that's my proudest acomplishment

[fallow apex]

Tbh he isnt that hard cuz anima sola makes you imune to esau if you use it on him

Hes still hella hard tho

Better than 12 room recharge

Or it taking up your active item slot

[coarse leaf]

I have the full radiant hall of gods, all achievements and steel soul path of pain under my belt but jacob and esau are probably my greatest gaming acomplishment

[fallow apex]

Thats fair

Now get ready for tainted łaz

Only way to get it is thru death certificate sadly

Screw you C section

Good idea

[coarse leaf]

probably

ss-discussion discussion-about-anything-besides-silksong-for-some-reason

[dusty nimbus]

Discussion-about-anything-else-other-than-silksong-because-there-are-no-ss-news

[pallid flare]

silksong

[coarse leaf]

yea

[gilded wharf]

silknever

[stark prism]

hollow knight silksong starting price will be 299,99

[coarse leaf]

people will still buy

[pallid flare]

i would still buy tbh

[stark prism]

in roubles

[silver oak]

In yen

[coarse leaf]

in penguins

[pallid flare]

that's like 3,50€

less if it's yen

[sweet lotus]

I won't buy Silksong if it's anything more than 15 dollars; HK costs 15 and with all their money from the massive sales they are already comfortable taking their time to develop and publish; if it costs 20 dollars and more it'll be a clear sign that Team Cherry has decided to indulge in wealth disrespecting their fans, are all things an idiot would say.

[dreamy zenith]

[pallid flare]

that ending tho

masterfully written

[coarse leaf]

ngl till i got to the ending i was hovering right over the block button lmao

[sweet lotus]

hm, now that you mention it, noone has blocked me yet; and I've said all kinds of stupid things (for fun)

[coarse leaf]

same

[coarse leaf]

No cost too great

[heady sandal]

I wouldn‘t go as far as telling TC they are being greedy. The whole thing of „people charging higher means greed“ needs to be dropped. They‘re an INDIE company, mainly run with 2 people, with help of various and since they aren‘t AAA companies they had to charge less to attract more customers. They deserve to charge at least 20 dollars, their game are perfectly well done and Silksong seem even far BETTER than HK may be.

[sweet lotus]

got him

[coarse leaf]

[coarse leaf]

thats probably just because blocking doesnt really do anything, discord always asks you like " do you want to see what the person that you blocked wrote" and lets be real, everyones totally gonna look at it and get annoyed again

[heady sandal]

Ah

[sweet lotus]

yes, Discords block function is ass

[coarse leaf]

to be fair it's also annoying when you cant see what they said in apps

[heady sandal]

Whenever that was a joke or not, I‘m actually for higher prices, they DESERVE it for all the hard work and crunch month they went thru. 20 dollars is a fair price to me tbh. Whatever the price, I‘ll buy it in the end so

[pallid flare]

you got baited lol

[heady sandal]

I already saw

[coarse leaf]

No life too great

[sweet lotus]

at $30, if Silksong's scope is what it seems to be, it will yet again be an exceptional price

[pallid flare]

I would still buy if it's 30€, no question

[coarse leaf]

Hollow Knight is totally worth more than 15, so 30 for Silksong is still not that bad

[sweet lotus]

$40 will be a no hot no cold price for Silksong

if it turns out to be good, $40 will be just a fair price

[pallid flare]

40 is going a bit too far but it's still manageable

[coarse leaf]

I'd still buy it for 40

[dreamy zenith]

Value for money wise?
Hollow knight i have enjoyed about as much as the doom eternal main campaign, in total.

[pallid flare]

too far as in, i have never paid 40€ for a game

[cerulean sable]

but their potential playerbase at 40 would be way less

[coarse leaf]

I'd stop at 70 when it comes to Silksong, but theres no way it'll cost 70

[pallid flare]

yeah at this point it's more about the accessibility

[sweet lotus]

I don't believe in correlation between play hours and money price

[dreamy zenith]

indeed

[pallid flare]

there's a correlation between money and the perceived worth of a game though

if a game is free then it's never really all that good

[sweet lotus]

that's true, but it has not much to do with play hours

[coarse leaf]

Not necessarily true

[sweet lotus]

no, there have been numerous great free titles, but I get your point, most of them are trash

[heady sandal]

Same but as said they‘re an Indie Company and indies generally struggle with keeping revenue when they charge even at a deserving price, because it‘s not going to attract a lot of people

[coarse leaf]

yeah

[pallid flare]

If you get a game for free then you go in with somewhat lower expectations

[sweet lotus]

true, you don't care if it's trash or not cause you didn't pay

[pallid flare]

but if go in with the knowledge that you paid 60€ then you'll be mad if it's bad

[heady sandal]

Which is a pity, because SS deserves so much and introducing it so that you don‘t have to play HK before is a great way to get more customers

[dreamy zenith]

Is the google offline dinosaur game a good game

[coarse leaf]

yes

[sweet lotus]

the same is valid for the reverse; if you buy a game at $60, you expect a damn good game

[dreamy zenith]

i argue, yes.

[pallid flare]

it's decent to keep you busy for like 5 minutes

[coarse leaf]

yes

[pallid flare]

that's exactly my point

if the game was incredibly good AND cheap then you'll like it a lot at the end

[sweet lotus]

like HK

[stark prism]

just 500 more days and silksong will probably be released

[heady sandal]

Expect some most of those games, especially AAA games, don‘t actually fit those money worth of gameplay. Pokemon SwSh always came out as one of those demanding questions whenever AAA games should lower their price and make it fairer. Ofc there are games like BOTW that deserve to keep the 60$ worth

[sweet lotus]

hot take: people have become unnecessarily pessimistic about SS's release date cause of no E3 news

[nimble radish]

nintendo is nintendo y'know

[pallid flare]

it's probably more because we haven't heard anything for like 8 months

[heady sandal]

We‘re getting desperate

[sweet lotus]

Metroid Dread at $60 raises questions as well, given that we've seen amazing titles of that genre for a lot less

[serene jewel]

Nintendo is a small company they can't fix drift bro

[sweet lotus]

but they did, at least that's what I hear

[coarse leaf]

Personally I think Silksong will release in 361 days

[stark prism]

what is the approximate date when silksong development started?

[serene jewel]

I literally saw a video where a guy fixed drift by putting a paper inside the joy con

[coarse leaf]

sometime in 2018 it properly started, they might've worked on some Hornet code and enemies before then though

[signal crag]

Shorty after HK was out

We don’t know much more than that

[pallid flare]

yeah a bit after HK released, they didn't take a break as far as I know

[obtuse glacier]

any news?

[pallid flare]

?sspas

[obtuse glacier]

?sus

[pallid flare]

shit i messed it up ?sspsa

[coarse leaf]

It was considered a DLC until about 2018 when they realized they might need to make Hornet a game

[pallid flare]

?sspsa

[thin zephyr]

Reminder: The latest news for both Hollow Knight and Silksong is in #hk-announcements.
Check the pinned messages for more information, including a FAQ.

[obtuse glacier]

why should i listen to a robot

[pallid flare]

there is the bot

[signal crag]

You got a problem with robots, bud?

[stark prism]

does, April 4, 2022 sound like a probable release date?

because i don't think it can come out any earlier

[signal crag]

If we knew at what point in dev they are, it could be likely
But we just don’t know

[obtuse glacier]

Yes.

[signal crag]

Uh...alright, just wanted to clarify

[stark prism]

it could also be December 11 2022

[coarse leaf]

very specific dates

[cerulean sable]

what are these random arbitrary dates

[coarse leaf]

I think it can release anytime mid2022-early2023

any later and the game will be HUGE

[stark prism]

i am just looking for patterns

[cerulean sable]

or its going through some dev issues

either can work

[coarse leaf]

true

[stark prism]

i mean they got jack vine he apparently codes things better than the last guy they had

[serene jewel]

I'm willing to intern to fix their game

[stark prism]

and i don't think there is an engine switch like with the first game

[signal crag]

It’s still unity

[stark prism]

i mean some development time was dedicated to making hk on stencyl

[serene jewel]

Apparently the old code is quite a mess

[signal crag]

Yeah, i know

[coarse leaf]

Im fine with whenever Silksong releases as long as they dont delay it simply to try and make it a big metroidvania (which I seriously doubt they would)

[serene jewel]

So I stepped in

[signal crag]

At least, it was for HK on release

[coarse leaf]

I'm fine with any size for Silksong as long as its jam packed with secrets and fun

[serene jewel]

For me to google up cause I can't find anything

[signal crag]

Oh, hi Grover

[stark prism]

when was the hollow knight beta build first released to streamers?

[vivid belfry]

Reasons that silksong will take longer than HK: no Kickstarter deadline, releasing the game with all intended content, introducing a bunch of new mechanics and physics interactions that require new coding techniques, more content and more polish
Reasons that silksong will take less time than HK: built on top of existing code that they can use to speed up AI development, no engine switch, both code developers are more experienced, some content was already developed before the official start date, they have more money for full time development and better design tools

[pallid flare]

hehe, tools

[coarse leaf]

yep

[vivid belfry]

In conclusion: there is no conclusion

[signal crag]

So....result is: it will be out when it’s complete

[coarse leaf]

if*

[signal crag]

Lol, thanks grover

[coarse leaf]

[stark prism]

and it most likely won't be complete before April 4th 2022

[coarse leaf]

but why so specific about the dates?

[silver oak]

In terms of conclusions, we have no conclusions

[vivid belfry]

In memoriam: conclusions

[silver oak]

Conclusions saved my life in ‘94

[coarse leaf]

Conclusions be like: hola

[silver oak]

Hey didn’t you get muted a few days ago

[coarse leaf]

yea why?

[serene jewel]

Anything warrants a mute

[coarse leaf]

[silver oak]

Idk I just remember seeing your name gray

Welcome to the club

If you weren’t in it already

[serene jewel]

At least not perma banned..

[coarse leaf]

[pallid flare]

what does this mean

[coarse leaf]

what

[signal crag]

real reason Silksong is taking longer than Hollow Knight: TC is adding physical support for every single "floating" platform so that they actually make sense.

[serene jewel]

Do the math

[stark prism]

the upper one is the time between the release of void heart edition and the first showcased gameplay of the unity build where the lifeblood cocoons don't work

[coarse leaf]

nearly 900 days from release

but what does it prove

[stark prism]

probability of a release date or something

[coarse leaf]

ok

[stark prism]

well you could also count time from the first teaser to voidheart

[serene jewel]

The date is specific but the window isn't unrealistic

[stark prism]

then the date you would wind up with is december 11th 2022