speedrunning

[true palm]

ye its rough on switch

so basically go down to queens

after uumuu

go down after the fungal room

[knotty vigil]

when do we get shamans?

[true palm]

during shadeskip

might want to just watch a run at this point

[knotty vigil]

like to get to resting grounds

[true palm]

maybe like 2x speed

we get shamans after claw

[knotty vigil]

oki that should be my last question lol

[true palm]

you do claw, quit to mound, kill gruz mother

then grab shamans shadeskip to resting grounds

[knotty vigil]

where exactly in spire is the seal?

[true palm]

the watcher knights one

you beat watchers

go up

and its on the left

[knotty vigil]

oki ty, i just did wk 3rd try

do i get to dirtmouth to buy luma through city storerooms/kings stations stag

[true palm]

kings station

[knotty vigil]

got it

[true palm]

you open the gate from the fountain before watchers

[knotty vigil]

i didnt get crossroads stag, hopefully that wont screw me over

[true palm]

its gonna suck

you take stag to get to peak

so you're going to need to go around

[knotty vigil]

i thought of that once i was already in resting grounds

its still a decent run so far though compared to my last one

[true palm]

i recommend pulling up a run and watching it side by side to your regular one for learning routes in future exploits, helps so you dont miss small things

[knotty vigil]

i prolly will do that after my run, watch another run

[hearty adder]

Sorry to interrupt, but these are things that you can also see in the Guides section of speedrun.com it will help you greatly

And yes, also watching other people's runs is very important

There's also smaller video resources on specific parts of runs and tricks/skips (e.g. Deepnest route, epogo)

Again, not meaning to interrupt or stop the conversation, but there's many great resources created by community members that will help you get started in the category

[knotty vigil]

1h 14m 57s igt, new pb by like 20 minutes

[desert scarab]

1h 40m 32s .44 today, new pb by like an hour, also first time i completed the game on pc

[stoic sluice]

ive been noticing sometimes my recording quality drops significantly when bosses are dying. is there something i should do to make this not so bad? normally i record at 1080p so this is a pretty massive difference.

[true palm]

whats your bitrate

[stoic sluice]

2500

[true palm]

do you have a mid end pc or better?

[stoic sluice]

id say its pretty mid end

maybe a little higher

[stuck raptor]

2500 is not enough digital information to fill out 1080p

so when things get busy like this, it can't display/record it all

[true palm]

you should raise the bitrate to like 4000

[stoic sluice]

ok ill try it thanks

[true palm]

if you have any more issues go higher bitrate and also up your process prio

[stuck raptor]

it'll still do this at 4000, but not quite this bad

[true palm]

4000 is good mostly for not affecting performance and if you stream its also good

but you could do higher if you dont plan to stream

[digital jewel]

lots of particles means lots of places in the image change colour every frame

[granite field]

Twitch is limited to 6000 afaik

[digital jewel]

yeah twitch is limited

you can record locally at lossless quality and then upload that to youtube, but they'll also reencode it anyway

[stoic sluice]

alright that makes sense

[true palm]

youtube compresses the video and lowers the quality to 1080p so theres no reason to have anything top tier perfect video

[stuck raptor]

highest you'd want to go for youtube recordings is like 10k I think

[true palm]

but i'd value game performance over anything so dont over do it

[stuck raptor]

^

[vocal dove]

that's crazy that y'all have decent internet. i go for 720p 1200 just to avoid frame drops

[true palm]

i mean bitrate doesnt make a big difference for local recordings

in terms of internet wont matter

[vocal dove]

oh i missed the part about local recording

[true palm]

for streaming i do 4000 but honestly id prefer pixelated explosions over frame drops, specially since 1221 is lacking a lot of those

[granite field]

I mean it's still decent, I have to set up to 360p 650 kbps bitrate to have a watchable stream lol

I'd love being able to stream 720p 1200

[fringe fox]

dumb question but does anyone have recs for keybindings?

[dense swallow]

guys how do people open inventory mid air as i can only inventory drop at a perfect timing

downpatching?

[low bramble]

yep

[hearty adder]

On current patch you can only do it while falling off a ledge. Runs using older patches can do inv drops whenever

[dense swallow]

right im gunno say something i might be hated on for but ive been playing on a cracked version, im gunno buy the steam version today so i can do everything properly

[dusk portal]

Yeah but there's no instant control out of the inventory

[hearty adder]

Probably a good idea to not mention that

[low bramble]

please buy the game this isn’t a AAA game you are scamming indie devs

and dont talk about it here

[dense swallow]

yes i am as i realised that im not supporting devs

alr

[true palm]

anyways once you buy the game we can help with downpatching

[dense swallow]

thank you, im getting very intrested in speedrunning is a hornet kill in 12 mins good for a begginer?

i choke on vengful skips quite a lot

[true palm]

its hard to tell whats good for someone, depends on the amount of time dropped into the game

[hearty adder]

anytime you get that you're happy with is good for a beginner

[true palm]

choking vs skips shouldnt matter too much theres some backups

[ivory glade]

Forgive my novice question, just started trying to learn speed running within the last few days.
I've followed some guides as to setting up live split and am having a hard time setting up the PB comparison? I'm not getting a time just getting a colored dash (seen gold / white so far but no +/- times)
What am I missing in the settings? Not finding an obvious fix

[dense swallow]

ive played a lot of 1 save (110 hours) time spent practising maybe an hour, and it was first try where i ac kill her

[dense swallow]

yeah i also struggle on vengfly a lot

[stuck raptor]

have you finished a full run yet

if not, you have no PB. so there's nothing to compare to

[dense swallow]

quick question can i move a hollow knight save to a different version

[ivory glade]

no, just PB on segments

[dense swallow]

and is downpatching permenant

[low bramble]

you can compare to best for that cam

[ivory glade]

do I have to fully finish the run to get segment comparison?

[true palm]

you'll want this @ivory glade

[dusk portal]

Yup

[low bramble]

best = best segments, pb = best full run

[true palm]

until you finish a run

set your comparison to average segments or something

[dense swallow]

do i lose my game save if i downpatch

[verbal stag]

no

[true palm]

nope, and you can have multiple copies

you will not lose your save from buying the full game either

[stuck raptor]

do you lose your game saves if you patch up?

would be silly to move save location around constantly for new patches

[dense swallow]

yes i think ik how to do that

i am buying the game today

[true palm]

it'll just happen

[dense swallow]

i was hesitant as i was scared ill lose 110 hours

[true palm]

the save files in a separate folder

?saves

[sick raven]

Saves

---

Windows File Paths: (Assumes Default Steam Install Path, Adjust accordingly for DRM Free or Non-Standard Steam Path)

Game Files: C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Hollow Knight\```
** **
Mac File Paths:
```Save Files: ~/Library/Application Support/unity.Team Cherry.Hollow Knight/
Game Files: ~/Library/Application Support/Steam/steamapps/common/Hollow Knight/hollow_knight.app/```
** **
Linux File Paths:
```Save Files: ~/.config/unity3d/Team Cherry/Hollow Knight/
Game Files: ~/.local/share/Steam/steamapps/common/Hollow Knight/```

[true palm]

the save files are the user1.dat, user2.dat, user3.dat, and user4.dat files

i recommend backing them up

if you open a newer version save on an older version it'll corrupt

[ivory glade]

Thanks, I think I get it, I'll just have to play around with it and actually finish a run 🙃

[dense swallow]

how do i back up

[true palm]

just copy the user1.dat, user2.dat, etc etc files

[dense swallow]

can i copy it to discord dms and send it someone and when i need em i can download it again?

[true palm]

and put them in a folder

i mean you could do it that way

or you could just save them in a folder on your desktop

[dense swallow]

yeah because i accidently deleted my save file and i had to paste my file in a website to recover it

alr

[true palm]

if ur still confused i have this video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xse63RKYqyg

[dense swallow]

tysm

ill get the game soon

[subtle glade]

Is there a benchwarp mod for 1.2.2.1? It would be really useful in practise but I can't find it

I mean like the current patch one where you can change your bench at any time

And also what's this "speedrun mod" everyone talks about in races/manhunts?

[knotty vigil]

1221 benchwarp is in #resources

[fair island]

adds many skips from 1221 into cp

[subtle glade]

Alright, so it reintroduces some glitches back into the game so that you can practise at current patch?

[haughty fossil]

its not to practice, its so that people can have all the mods available on cp but the speed tech of 1221

[elfin vortex]

Never heard of that mod. Is it the QoL one?

[haughty fossil]

no, it is different

speedrunmod was being developed by underlein last i knew, but he left the community and since then i think fire's been getting other people to work on it? not entirely sure

[elfin vortex]

Huh. Apart from menue drops what does it add?

Huh. Apart from menue drops what does it add?

[digital jewel]

oh fire was interested in it?

[elfin vortex]

I dont rlly know all the speedtech lost between 1.2.2.2 and 1.4.3.2

[fair island]

read https://github.com/underlein/HollowKnight.SpeedrunMod/

[elfin vortex]

Damn it has some good features ima download it for practise

[hallow orchid]

It's really bad for practice for cp runs

And also bad for practice for 1221 runs tbh

You're better off just using debug mod for practice. It can be fun as its own thing though

[hearty adder]

Good practice mods are debug, showHitboxes and benchwarp mod

[haughty fossil]

i know fire's been using it for the hunter vs speedrunner stuff a lot

[hearty adder]

Mods such as QoL and speedrunmod change the game too much

[digital jewel]

oh interesting

I wonder why he prefers it to qol

[haughty fossil]

i know under was doing a lot of small tweaks like moving hitboxes and stuff

because tc liked to do that 🙂

[elfin vortex]

Im planning on doing a quick any% 1.2.2.1 while learning 112 too cuz it has a simple route. Practising it for fun cuz I got pissed after a lategame death in a 112 run and seeing all the QoL features it looks good tbh. Whys it bad for 1.2.2.1 practise might I ask?

[fair island]

i mean if you wanna do 1.2.2.1 speedruns just do it on that patch

you can have multiple installs of the game

[hearty adder]

Using a mod on 1432 to emulate 1221 is just gonna result in gameplay that's a mishmash of both

[knotty vigil]

there's some stuff in srmod that isn't in 1.2.2.1 or 1.4.3.2

[elfin vortex]

Ah yh that does make sense ig

[elfin vortex]

Thing is I dont lol. Main focus is 112 but doing 1.2.2.1 any% runs for me is a brill 112 stress reliever since 112 is long

That and 1.2.2.1 doesnt run well on my comp

[strong vessel]

Run meme categories

There are a lot on CP and they're a good way to take a break

Or just do any% cp if 1221 doesn't run well

[hallow orchid]

For example uumuu behavior in qol/sr mod is different from either cp or 1221

[strong vessel]

Doesn't QoL always give good rng

[elfin vortex]

Any meme cats with interesting skips?

[grizzled maple]

acn

[hallow orchid]

Marissa audience%

[elfin vortex]

I have no idea what those cats are but ima check them out lol

[strong vessel]

There's a spreadsheet for all of the ones that aren't on src somewhere

[hearty adder]

Clawless shade cloak

Yeah, the spreadsheet is at #misc-runs-nmg

[strong vessel]

I want to create a meme category that's like softlock%

Sit at basin bench without claw

[hot latch]

Hey y'all just completed a run, however once i entered thk room my whole screen went black even when i went to main menu, i had to exit and restart hk, will this make my run invalid?

(also sub 50 pog)

[haughty fossil]

it let you menu in the black screen?

[hot latch]

Yup

You could hear the noises but nothing else

[digital jewel]

that's a really weird glitch I don't think I've seen that

[elfin vortex]

Happened to me while using debug

[haughty fossil]

i think i've seen one other person have it, usually you just get an infinite load and have to alt-f4

[hot latch]

Yeah not really sure why it happened, my laptop is very sad cpu wise but idk if that'd happen cuz of that

[hallow orchid]

I have seen that before, true invis thk

[hot latch]

I still need to stop the video once mm shows up but ig we'll see if it's verified

[hallow orchid]

If you exited the game and came back in and the timer didn't break it should be valid

[haughty fossil]

main menu has to be before the run for full game runs fwiw

[hot latch]

Alrighty i'll check it, I let the main menu show afterwords just to be safe

[true palm]

the main reason it doesnt pop up a lot is because infinite load thk prevents the bench from being automatically taken meaning ur save is stuck in beasts den still

so it automatically loses over a minute

even if the timer functions properly from that point

as for full black screen i've never had that but it might be some similar spaghetti to the white screen glitch from dream world

[hot latch]

Thank you constructive, it definitely spooked me quite a bit luckily i'm constantly worried about death so i benched at thk lol

[true palm]

for future ref, outside of infinite load the thk fight auto benches you in temple

[hot latch]

ohhh heck i didn't know that thank you

[true palm]

ur all good

its one of those auto saves that doesnt change the background for the save file so dont be spooked

but theres a few autosaves, you autobench in dirtmouth upon entering crossroads, autobench in mound upon leaving it and theres a couple others

regardless the only ways youd know about it were if someone told you or if you found out the hard way

i think fire briefly mentions it?

[strong vessel]

I'm assuming that it autobenches where it does to overwrite the vs hardsave, and then to return to the black egg after beating the game

[dreamy bough]

why the vs one?

[strong vessel]

Does it also autobench at the upper godhome bench after beating the game through p5?

[dreamy bough]

it just overwrites any hardsave

[true palm]

it wouldnt need to override the vs one since the gates down

[strong vessel]

Yeah, but that hardsave is just so you can't leave mound, right?

Idk what team cherry's logic is

[true palm]

the only one that made total sense to me was dirtmouth

i assumed they didnt want you entering kp again

[strong vessel]

Yeah

[true palm]

black egg is kind of quality of life though this games not known for that

[strong vessel]

Speaking of hardsaves, why does king's brand hardsave?

I get left-side city entrance and soul master but why that

[true palm]

idk why does dive and vs feature hardsave but not the other spells

why is dash not a hardsave but shade cloak is

this games arbitrary as hell

[strong vessel]

That's another one yeah

Shade cloak hardsave is strange

[dreamy bough]

all the dreamers hardsave

[strong vessel]

And doesn't dream nail not hardsave?

[dreamy bough]

trap bench makes sense

[true palm]

voidheart is not a hardsave either

[strong vessel]

Like, you'd expect that

Dreamers, king's brand, and shade cloak all shouldn't hardsave

There's no point and it would make things a lot easier

[true palm]

neither should dive

tbh

[strong vessel]

I kind of see why dive hardsaves?

[true palm]

they put a freaking invisible ceiling to force you to go left

but dash doesnt hardsave

in fact you can leave before the plot relevant cutscene

[strong vessel]

Maybe because that section of soul sanctum is even farther away from the bench than the rest

I'm just glad that dash doesn't hardsave

Imagine all the extra required geo

[true palm]

no its just because its as inconsistent as their coding imo

[strong vessel]

True

[true palm]

like they cant even normalize their game audio

you cant expect them to normalize their hard save

[strong vessel]

To be fair, that section is a dive tutorial, kind of like mound being a vs tutorial

Wraiths doesn't need one because it isn't actually useful

[true palm]

but isnt the section after mothwing a dash tutorial?

[strong vessel]

Yes

[true palm]

it literally has text prompts and everything

and a cutscene

[strong vessel]

No idea

Shade cloak also has a mini-tutorial with the egg but king's brand has no reason to hardsave whatsoever

It's just so inconsistent

[true palm]

just run te so you have dreamgate so it doesnt matter

[strong vessel]

Yep

Or, better yet, 1xx

[true palm]

its hard to find time for 1xx

to like really learn it

[strong vessel]

Yeah

I haven't had time to do an unsegmented run

[prime delta]

shade cloak hardsave is so you can practice abyss climb before having to do it in void heart cutscene, clearly

[drowsy tangle]

oh god. this was painful..

[last inlet]

more gh% runners

gg on actually finishing a run tho

[hallow orchid]

Just sliiiiiightly behind wr

[last inlet]

very slightly

[hallow orchid]

But yeah ggs that run is insanely difficult

[drowsy tangle]

haha this was so annoying

gh% nmms anyone?

[last inlet]

i get the first shade skip like 50% of the time after a couple of hours practising lol

[drowsy tangle]

kingdom's edge skip was easier, b/c even if you would mistime the first nail hit you'd hit the background object. but hard to get shade in position for both.

didn't mean to respond to you specifically**

[last inlet]

i have pretty consistent setups

[drowsy tangle]

gh% consistent setups xD

[last inlet]

i can try and get clips tmrw if you want

[drowsy tangle]

please that'd be very helpful. I think im gonna continue and see what time i can get. Not WR by any means though :D

[last inlet]

yeah imo the first one is easier as well as faster if you get the good husk rng

second one you just pray to not get hit by the aspid

since depending on how it fires it can be insanely hard to dodge while not screwing up the shade skip

[drowsy tangle]

yeah i just killed the aspid

[last inlet]

fair enough

[drowsy tangle]

and the first one was very close to a bench and a room to reset shade position, which helps a lot

[last inlet]

also makes the hopper easier

[drowsy tangle]

yup

for wr u gotta pray it gets stuck

[last inlet]

seems kinda rng whether the aspid actually makes it over the wall

tbf it seems to get stuck fairly often

the movement seems a bit more consistent if you upslash it into the roof to reduce spawn rng

[lapis nexus]

Bruh how the hell do I acid skip

Literally cannot get it to work

[last inlet]

which acid skip?

[lapis nexus]

The first one in crossroads

[last inlet]

walk left off the platform above the acid and press cdash as soon as you hit the wall

[lapis nexus]

I mean i looked at quick tutorials and everything but in 25 mins i got it once

[leaden python]

make sure you don't have isma's tear

[lapis nexus]

Holy moly am bad

[leaden python]

it pulls you into the acid

[last inlet]

if you're not getting the cdash theres a good chance you're trying to buffer it

theres no buffer for cdashes in this game so you can only press after you're on the wall

[lapis nexus]

Yeah the timing window is so hilariously small i couldnt nail it at all

[last inlet]

as for jumping out, you just need to practise the timing, you can use the slam sound to time it

[lapis nexus]

Ill get back to it tomorrow but man was it demoralizing

[last inlet]

a lot of the strats in this game are hard to learn, don't feel bad if you cant get them at first

[lapis nexus]

Yeah ofc, just that i did spend a long time at it

Hopefully ill get it down

[strong vessel]

????? I've never seen this before

[short spire]

lmao

owned

[limpid ruin]

beats the baldur off screen dunking in the acid eating your yump

[naive nova]

YOU GUYS WHAT THE FUCK

I PB'd again

[true palm]

it was a banger

[naive nova]

I had an absolute meltdown in Peaks, also, 38:xx CP Steel Soul is absolutely doable

[dreamy bough]

yo congratz :O

[elfin vortex]

Dont know much about the steelsoul any% cat but what do u guys who run it do instead of the shade skip?

[dreamy bough]

getting absolutely demolished

[dreamy bough]

We get tram pass after claw and tram pass to right side city

[elfin vortex]

Ahh interesting

[true palm]

its any% and low% mashed together and scrambled

[dreamy bough]

and stag to crossroads stag, then tram pass to resting grounds for dnail, savequite warp back to hotsprings bench in deepnest, then go beat up herrah after dark deepnest, then go to king's station and from there on it's any% till after monomon where you just get queen's station and go beat up thk

it's really that, any% and low% have a baby and its name is any%ss

[true palm]

one interesting note is that sporeshroom is optimal in the cp version of the cat since its on the way

[dense swallow]

just a question if i put a game save on hollow knight from steam will i get steam achivements for it?

i dont mind just curious

oh right sorry

[chrome glade]

Hey, question on downpatching using depot downloader. I input everything by keyboard, but otherwise it looked like I matched everything from the Verulean yt video I was following, advice?

[haughty fossil]

your cmd isn't open in the same folder as depotdownloader

either run cd <path to the folder depotdownloader is in> or go there using file explorer, shift right click and "Open Powershell Here"

[vocal dove]

good times

[indigo sierra]

I've gotten myself a first proper any% run! It was pretty much opposite day: Clean first try WK, second try QGA, second try HK, but atrocious room movement throughout every simple thing. It didn't exactly help that I haven't touched the game in like three weeks.

[chrome glade]

I got an 'access is denied' what's that about? @haughty fossil

oh sorry, newish to discord

[slim geyser]

you're allowed to ping people, just as long as you keep in mind that every time you do so, it will likely make a noise on their discord and give them a big red flag to draw them here

so don't do it frivolously but when it comes to getting the attention of someone who last talked to you several hours ago, as you did, it should be fine

unless the person you're talking to specifically asks not to be pinged

[chrome glade]

im now in the xero go fast guide, and thats a help

[frank obsidian]

I mean NGL, this is like an ultra-mega- !

[strong vessel]

Is it only me that always loses my runs to the mothwing cloak split

In any (short) category

It's unironically the hardest split in any% imo

[maiden bane]

yeah my MWC splits are consistently terrible

[strong vessel]

I'm saying this after ending up at Hornet on 1 health twice in a row and dying both times

Whenever I fail the second fireball skip I always fall like three platforms too far down

[hearty adder]

It's very easy to lose time during MWC split tbh

[slim geyser]

tbf it's very easy to lose time during every split

[normal aspen]

mwc lowkey hardest split in early game

[slim geyser]

^ye un-ironically it is surprisingly technical for such an early split, I just felt like being an existential speedrunner for a second

[limpid ruin]

I lose time to everything, it just feels right

[dapper cove]

Better than me having to reset my split file lol

[alpine sapphire]

I saw people routing for 16 mask shards, does anyone happen to know the route

?

[stark birch]

the one in jeff's vod in the spreadsheet is the only one I'm aware of, I think he has a txt file of it floating around somewhere

no one's routed it for current patch afaik

[alpine sapphire]

where is jeffs vod?

[stark birch]

check spreadsheet in pins of #misc-runs-nmg

[alpine sapphire]

nice, thanks!

[umbral void]

suffering

[chrome glade]

im getting a lot of text in my steam console after my 'depotdownload complete' message, i assume i wait until it stops sending new ones

[meager juniper]

Does anyone have listing for a specific bosses speedrun times?

[stray kestrel]

do you mean like entering that boss to finishing the boss or a speedrun where the goal is to kill that boss from a new file?

[snow dome]

Pretty much, yeah

You'll need to keep an eye on it as it will say finished at some point, but it will keep sending messages if you Focus on and off it, so you can miss it

[dusk portal]

Has anyone got a link to the Comfy pogo strat?

[short spire]

#strats

[dusk portal]

Oh, yeah, totally forgot about that channel, sorry...

[dusk portal]

Are the Baldur Spits (Infection/Mini baldurs) RNG dependent or is there a way to reduce the number of infection spits? (CP)

[verbal stag]

completely rng

50/50 each spit

[dense swallow]

hello i just bought hollow knight on steam how do i down patch?

alr

is the steam downpatcher needed? what does it do

[dusk portal]

It Downpatches the game

[dense swallow]

yeah but cant u just go to the steam console and do it there

[haughty fossil]

no steam removed it so you need to run the steam downpatcher to reenable it

(specifically they removed downloading old depots)

[dense swallow]

im kinda confused about all this but i think ive done it

do i just have it open?

[haughty fossil]

when the download has started you just wait for it to finish

its downloading the whole game so it should take a lil bit

[dense swallow]

alr done im watching a vid on what to do next

very nice it works but i have a question

how do i add mods to it

ill go modding help

[true palm]

theres a guide on src

https://www.speedrun.com/hollowknight/guide/7br3d

the updated apis and debug mod can be found in resources

[normal aspen]

Is this too fast or too slow?

I dtanked a good bit higher than normal so im guessing its that

[onyx spade]

this is too fast right?

[normal aspen]

idk its the first time ive died to that laser

normally when im too fast i get hit by the first laser

[onyx spade]

hmm

that is weird

actually why is that laser on there

I'm so confused

[true palm]

i think you start the 2nd cycle late because you walked too far before jumping into the laser? idk for sure

[limpid ruin]

thats too fast yea

ie before the last dash

the laser was just about to switch off

[frank obsidian]

When ur on Aluba% PB pace and then u get to lake of Unn and miss twice 🥴

Still PBd tho

[onyx spade]

flashback to the time I was gonna get an 8:49 aluba% but missed and died to the moss knight

[frank obsidian]

[onyx spade]

dw fluffy I have an 8:42 now 🙂

[frank obsidian]

ebic

[limpid ruin]

hitting the aluba is literally impossible so that's okay

[frank obsidian]

I mean I hit it in all of my runs

[gritty fiber]

Hello guys, I'm thinking about speedrunning the game soon, I picked it a while ago and it's been a total blast, but I have yet to do practice for the real thing, any tip for a newcomer?

[frank obsidian]

Yeah

[normal aspen]

@limpid ruin i actually paid attention this tionme going thru the room, i think i was too slow after the dtank and youre nornmally mean tto iframe thru that laser

[frank obsidian]

First of all, know what ur getting into when you choose a cat to run, second, make sure you watch some runs first of the cat u choose to know what to expect and know how to run it. GL!

[gritty fiber]

Thank you very much, I'll ask y'all if I find any roadblock, and I'll sure do because I'm clumsy af

On the rules it said that I had to ask a mod for the role, is it alright to send a PM?

[limpid ruin]

that doesn't sound right to me at all, i need to check other runs and comsob etc I guess

[onyx spade]

for speedrunner role you need a verified run on src

[gritty fiber]

Oh, alright

Thanks :)

[limpid ruin]

a verified run yea, then you can either ask in here or DM an src mod if that's more comfortable to you

[gritty fiber]

Sadly the verified run will have to wait until I end my uni exams, jaja

[frigid rapids]

the timing after the dboost is super lenient, so cerp is probably right

[frank obsidian]

[normal aspen]

once pb finishes trimming ill send a clip of what i normally do

does the laser hitbox deactivate well before it does visually or something?

[limpid ruin]

it deactivates as soon as it stops glowing max

[frigid rapids]

also there is nothing that looked slow in your footage insomnia

[limpid ruin]

maybe a frame before, visually

[normal aspen]

normally i do the dboost lower which i thought might haave caused slowdown

[frigid rapids]

nah

[normal aspen]

tbh i am concave brain about this room esp on cp, coz for the last 2y its just worked ahah

[frigid rapids]

if you were too slow, that means you should have hit the laser sooner

as it was about to go off, that means you would have still got hit

[normal aspen]

right, so the very foirst laser gets u if ur too fast thru the conveyors, but if u just make that cycle then u need to lose a tiny bit of time after the dboodst?

[frigid rapids]

your buffered dash was just too quick

[normal aspen]

suffering from success

[frigid rapids]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EF-36wfWwAEtTNY?format=jpg&name=small

[normal aspen]

so here the laser actually dspawnbed, i didnt have iframes? I stg i know nothing about this game

nice

alright then thasnks a bunch cerp and muri, ill definitely keep it in mind

[limpid ruin]

yup

that's how it looks most of the time you see godcycle in a previous room there as well, for instance

[meager juniper]

Yeah

[grizzled maple]

Honestly it looks to me that you were at the tail end of your iframes

This guess is coming from someone who did pantheon ILs for 5 hours straight yesterday and iframes last 900 years

[desert kiln]

Hi, my first run got verified! Could I join the blue gang now? (Here’s the link: https://www.speedrun.com/hollowknight/run/z5rod9jy)

Thank you!

[orchid willow]

is there any guide in which there are terms of time within which to reach each boss to know that you are on the right path to finish the game in less than 5 hours?

[grizzled maple]

?srpsa

[sick raven]

Reminder: This category is intended for competitive speedrunning discussion. Questions about achievements should be directed to #hk-help.
Guide for the 5hr speedrunning achievement: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1861523602

[short spire]

you could take 4 hours to beat false knight and be on pace for sub 5 hours

[grizzled maple]

This is the guide we usually recommend

It's possible to do this route in an hour. You have a LOT of time

[orchid willow]

Thanks

[azure saffron]

Any tips for WK? I can get one sometimes but get completely clobbered. Might try playing a bit safer. For now I just want to complete a run using the main route (Minus QGA)

[strong vessel]

Try the nail 1 route. I know you said that you want to use the main route, but it doesn't differ that much (you basically just sell to Lemm before WK instead of after), and it should make the bosses a lot easier

[azure saffron]

Alright. Any combat tips though? The extra damage would help but I'm not sure it would help that much

[strong vessel]

Well, it does almost double your nail damage. For combat tips, I'd recommend watching fireb0rn's guide

[fiery trail]

Any tips for working on Blue Lake shade skip on 1.2.2.1 All Skills NMG? I am having a lot of issues doing that skip.

[digital jewel]

what's the main problem for you eaglemach

[fiery trail]

Timing and Movement mainly.....

BTW, I am using Pisces route.

[digital jewel]

what's happening with the shade when you fail it

are you too low?

[fiery trail]

I many cases, yes.

*in

[digital jewel]

you want to stay about halfway up the wall to lure the shade to be higher up

then when it's getting close, do a high jump and dash to it

pogo then dash back to the wall

don't forget that pogoing refreshes your dash, it means you can do the skip from quite far away from the wall safely

[deep whale]

Is QGA a skip you can only do if you downpatch or is it just harder on current patch? I feel like anytime I try on current patch I can never get it

[shut beacon]

no, it works on current patch

[deep whale]

Ok thanks, it’s just a hard skip for me lol

[shut beacon]

yea its hard

[steady lynx]

It's possibly the hardest skip in any main category and all

[shut beacon]

ppl say its the hardest trick in any%

[deep whale]

I believe that

It’s one of the only skips I can’t consistently do

[steady lynx]

It's one of the reasons I've been avoiding any%

[shut beacon]

hey gusten, were u the dude who said they had notes for true ending on console?

in the #true-ending chat

[steady lynx]

Yeah, I can fetch you them when I get home

[shut beacon]

yea thanks, ive been running it recently

[steady lynx]

It's mostly the geo route to skip well seal since that takes so long on console

[shut beacon]

oh ok

im getting stuck on traitor lord

[steady lynx]

Also dgate alterations since savequit slow

Id tell you how to fight traitor lord if I was good at it

[shut beacon]

its so hardd lol

[steady lynx]

Quacksilver about to bring up how much harder it is with vs only any moment

How

[haughty fossil]

if you're on current patch you can do deepnest route + spore shroom instead btw

makes thk infinitely easier and optimally loses only like 5s? to qg route (nobody's timed it that's a very handwavey timeloss estimate)

[steady lynx]

Basically, I think I know why there aren't any cp True ending board outside console

[gritty fiber]

Take my advice with a grain of salt. I'm pretty new to the community and I've yet to play and record a run. Traitor lord is pretty easy in my experience if you just stay close to him. He has 4 attacks:
-Jump: Just staying still make it so he wont hit you
-Little step back and charge: He will charge at you, you can dash through him or jump
-Great step back and aoe: Dash and hit
-You get too far from him and he makes the long range attack: Just try to get close again

It's a pretty opressive boss if you don't go on the offensive, as far as i've played against him

[shut beacon]

thanks

idk the double damage messes me up sometimes

also, is this for cp? cos thats what i run

[steady lynx]

In reality I have no idea how to fight most bosses, I just go autopilot

[shut beacon]

lol i wish i could go auto pilot

i just stress

[steady lynx]

Except Hornet 2, there I just panic

[gritty fiber]

I sadly still don't know most things about speedrunning the game. I picked the game a few weeks ago and I've completed it and got interested on running it. I don't know most things about most categories

[gritty fiber]

So I don't have a clue

[steady lynx]

It seems to be cp

[shut beacon]

thats cool, it probably is then

if ur not sure

[steady lynx]

I think I try to dash through TL before he attacks and attempt a double hit shade soul

[gritty fiber]

I'm just talking in general. I know the fight because I've grinding pantheons past week, but I don't know how to apply it to speedrunning

[deep whale]

That’s probably the best way to fight him

[steady lynx]

Though that backfires if he does waves

[shut beacon]

thats what i try, how do u get the double hits for him

do i just dash earlier

[steady lynx]

Honestly, after a couple attempts I got a feel for when to dash through and stuff

[hallow orchid]

TL telegraphs his attacks quite far in advance. I would focus on learning how to read those telegraphs and respond to them

The only one that can take you by surprise is the walk forward

[steady lynx]

Great thing is that shade cloak refreshes just at the same rate as he attacks

[gritty fiber]

Absolutely

Just get close to him and everything will go smoothly

[shut beacon]

oki

the fight takes me so long

but whatever, as long as i finish it

[steady lynx]

I'd post my console strats in #strats but outside any% there are too few doing runs for it to be relevant

[shut beacon]

oh ok, would you mind dm'ing it to me? if ur not gonna post it there

[steady lynx]

I'll dm you when I get home, got my stuff on my computer

[shut beacon]

ok thats cool , thank you

[steady lynx]

Jamie has a strat for cp Uumuu shade soul only one cycle so ask her for that at some time

[shut beacon]

my stupid head didnt even know a one cycle was possible

ill ask her at some point

[steady lynx]

Me neither, its pretty much mostly for cp TE but can see usage elsewhere

[shut beacon]

not many people run cp Te do they

there is like one run in the ps4 cat which is the one ill do

[steady lynx]

TE is pretty much the hardest category on console boards

It's already mostly for already great players even on 1221 pc

I did a ps4 TE run but wasn't happy with it

[shut beacon]

oh really , so my 2 and a halve hour run is still decent lol

[steady lynx]

If I finished a good deathless run it'd be about 1:43

[shut beacon]

damnn thats good

im still new to the catagory

if i get under 2 hours ill be happy

[steady lynx]

I mainly focus switch boards, gonna come back to ps4 once I've got the sweep done there

[true palm]

te is already a bit of a scary category for a lot of runners, consoles a lot less popular, you add everything together and you see a lack of runs

[drowsy tangle]

go to offtopic for that :D

[true palm]

sr-offtopic is blue role only iirc

[craggy pebble]

how do i set livesplit for phanteons

i mean i put all the bosses

but when i enter a phanteon

this happens

[steady lynx]

I looked through it in hitbox viewer and Traitor Lord should be just about fat enough to double hit with Shade Soul when he's standing still

[frank obsidian]

[frank obsidian]

Do you have ordered splits on?

[steady lynx]

Now to find those notes

[craggy pebble]

?

[spark cloak]

dude i havent speedran hollow knight in soo long

im trying to get back into it

so i need to relearn all of the strats

[steady lynx]

Me after taking a break for two days ^

[frank obsidian]

Follow this

[craggy pebble]

u did literally nothing on this video

[frank obsidian]

Crap I recorded it wrong 🥴

Okay, right click on livesplit

Go to edit splits

Then settings

And there should be a box that says "Ordered Splits" towards the top

[hearty adder]

Specifically, the Autosplitter settings

[craggy pebble]

ok lets see if works

ok works

thx

:)

[frank obsidian]

OMG MonStahLer just set a WR for Pantheon of the Artist

[steady lynx]

Just now?

[frank obsidian]

Well he uploaded the video to YT right now

[craggy pebble]

can someone explain this? ( +16.3 but in PS says +12.7)

[stray kestrel]

what are you comparing to for both of those

it seems you're comparing them to different things

[stray kestrel]

current comparison you can change between on the fly with hotkeys, best segments will always be vs your golds

by default i think its 4 and 6 to cycle through comparisons

one of those should be Best Segments

[craggy pebble]

didnt understand nothing

im dumb sorry

[hearty adder]

Current comparison will compare against whatever you select with your hotkeys (you can alternate between many types of comparisons); Best Segments will only compare to your golds. You're probably comparing to different things

You can change "Current Comparison" to "Best Segments" and it should make it work afaik

[knotty vigil]

is it just me or the control in 1.2.2.1 is a bit weird compares to CP,

[limpid ruin]

1.2.2.1 performs worse so the controls also feel a bit more unresponsive as well. Its very possible to get used to though (i feel CP is like running around on ice now after experience with 1221, for example)

[vocal dove]

yeah, i played rando for like 6 hours on CP and when i came back to 1221 i thought something was wrong. just how the game is.

[grand plume]

Hello, I'm looking for something to help with any% NMG. At each split, what should a player have (how much soul, masks, geo, and what abilities or charms).

[grizzled maple]

there are a lot of guides for this sort of thing on speedrun.com in the guides section

[grand plume]

ok

thank you!

[subtle glade]

Also, like everytime someone asks for help, let me recommend you fireb0rn's guide
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLfkLKB8O1Ff0-AApWYqqgFjMcMMVaW_JH

[quiet saddle]

Anyone have any idea why I need to re-plug my Xbox Series X controller when I open up the game? Like I'll have it plugged in and working for one game but then when opening up HK, it won't register and I'll need to re-plug it to make it work

Not really a specific SR'ing question, I know, but we swap around versions a lot so I was hoping someone would know

[grand plume]

I looked at his tutorials, but I need more specific values than what is shown, since he uses debug mod. This is for a project I'm working on, not necessarily to help me learn to speedrun. That said, his guides are excellent resources for learning to speedrun

[vocal dove]

i don't have an answer but i have the same exact controller with the same issue. pretty sure HK does that with all controllers.

[subtle glade]

I believe he talks about soul when it's relevant, but I agree a more detailed guide on how much geo you need would be helpful

[hearty adder]

https://www.speedrun.com/hollowknight/guide/j234z

Text guide for any% nmg

[knotty vigil]

The important geo numbers are 206 after mantis claw and 2322 leaving city of tears

[grand plume]

I'll look at the speedrun race video, they talk about it sometimes

Thx for all the help! I didn't see the messages in my mobile notifications

[frank obsidian]

So this is comparing to my previous run right?

[wheat furnace]

Sorry if this isn't the right channel to ask this question in, but is it possible to do Hornet 2 before Hornet 1?

[last inlet]

i believe so

[wheat furnace]

Do you know if it requires any shade skips?

[last inlet]

it shouldnt

[wheat furnace]

Ok, thanks

[last inlet]

just low% up to cheart, broken vessel, then you can wings up to h2

or you can use aspids

to skip wings

[grizzled maple]

you can beat the entire game without ever getting dash, you can even go straight to hornet 2, but you will need to do a jank aspid skip up to her

[frank obsidian]

or is it smth else?

[haughty fossil]

we can't answer that question

[hearty adder]

i don't think it's possible to say from this screenshot you'll have to check yourself what your comparison is

[grizzled maple]

yes we can

i just didnt because its literally on the splits

[haughty fossil]

right click > compare against

[grizzled maple]

the x:
best:
part

x is always the current comparison

[haughty fossil]

oh yeah detailed timer exists

[hearty adder]

oh wait true

[grizzled maple]

i dont like answering obvious questions tho

[hearty adder]

then it's just comparing to PB; if your last run was your pb, then it is in fact comparing against your previous run

[frank obsidian]

So wait what do I set to compare against if I want to compare against my prev run like normal ppl do

[frank obsidian]

Well the reason I asked it was because I was confused, regardless of it was obvious.

[last inlet]

most people compare to pb rather than prev run

[grizzled maple]

people dont compare to previous runs unless they are pb

there are a lot of other comparisons you can choose from though such as balanced pb or averages

[frank obsidian]

But then wouldn't u always be red unless u were Pbing?

[grizzled maple]

you turn on other types of comparisons in livesplit settings
active comparisons > choose active comparisons

then you access them by right click > compare against

[haughty fossil]

yes? that's the point I want to go faster than my pb

[hearty adder]

visual aid for what emray is saying

[last inlet]

yeah the idea is to improve on what you've been able to do before

[frank obsidian]

yeah but im bad so that's a rare occourance

[haughty fossil]

so am I

[grizzled maple]

you should practice then, or if you just want to be green for the endorphins or whatever, just compare to worst

and if you lose time gg you got a new personal worst

[hearty adder]

Average Segments also has a lot of green and gold

[frank obsidian]

So this is prev run, right?

[grizzled maple]

there is no previous run comparison unless you manually make one every single time you do a run

[frank obsidian]

oh

[grizzled maple]

livesplit only tracks details on segments

you can even see the date when you got specific segment times

[frank obsidian]

then what do ppl mean when they save "timesave for next ig!"

[grizzled maple]

that means they made mistakes in one pb but they can improve next time

[frank obsidian]

oh that makes sense

[short spire]

livesplit can compare to your latest completed run

[haughty fossil]

"Latest Run"?

[grizzled maple]

like was already said, the whole point is to go faster

[short spire]

it's in the settings

[grizzled maple]

oh wtf is that new

[short spire]

i dont think so

[true palm]

no but it needs to be added under active comparisons

[short spire]

not like new new at least

[grizzled maple]

yeah i hadnt seen that before

[true palm]

its not a default one

[short spire]

maybe it's boomer new

[grizzled maple]

i havent opened that in actual years though

[frank obsidian]

yesss i found it! ty guys!

[grizzled maple]

either way idk how helpful that would even be

[true palm]

might be good for like tournament practice or something

[grizzled maple]

it probably wont give you good feedback on how youre progressing which is the point of splits

[haughty fossil]

i find it helpful when im in a big performance slump and just want to know whether i'm getting better again, not whether i'm back up to pb pace. speaking from tourney praccy experience

[upper lion]

Hey could someone help me with a prob im having getting a two cycle uumuu?

[true palm]

do you have the damage rotation down?

[short spire]

previous run is a chill comparison for derusts

[true palm]

and are you on 1221?

[upper lion]

VS>Nail>Nail>VS

yes

He keeps shooting out of the platform before i can get the last hit

[true palm]

your starting the rotation too late

try dboosting before they go vulnerable

dboosting isnt necessary but its cozier

[strong vessel]

Something that I found helped a lot is doing a 2-3-1 cycle

It's a little more complicated but it seems more reliable to me

[true palm]

a 2 3 1 would work

[upper lion]

The thing is with that i have been trying that like i shoot my VS like the second he goes vulnerable and still shoots out

[strong vessel]

Idk, Uumuu always left the platform on my second to last nail hit when I did 2-2-2

[true palm]

the reason uumuus leaving the platform is because they're accelerating during the end of the phase

you're most likely too far from uumuu when you start or missing a nail cancel

[quiet saddle]

Bruhhhh

Someone please explain this lmao

https://clips.twitch.tv/PhilanthropicSmilingMetalVoHiYo-frHcBjqJCcONCpOf

[true palm]

either way if you send a video i could help more

[quiet saddle]

Did I do anything to prompt this camera weirdness or is it random?

[grizzled maple]

hk cameras are a meme

[true palm]

its elevator storage isnt it?

[grizzled maple]

no it can happen at wk too

if something does cause it i've never figure it out. it just kinda happens

[upper lion]

Ill try a 2 3 1 and ill let you know if it works

[true palm]

if you're still struggling send a video and it'll be easier to point out where things go wrong

[knotty vigil]

is there a way to use save state in 1221 ?

[grizzled maple]

yes, if you're missing the option you likely have an old version

[hearty adder]

Check the latest version of debug mod for 1221 in #resources

[upper lion]

Yeah im still having problems i got a vid of my last attempt and ill try to send it to you

[knotty vigil]

i know this is a really dumb question but, is there anyway to fix the problem with the control in 1221 ? or i will just have to deal with it

will it help if i have a stronger pc or something ?

[digital jewel]

problem with the control?

[knotty vigil]

sometimes i got input delay. I didnt have any problem with the control in CP

for example, sometimes when i run and jump at the same time, it will only stand still and jump, i've never had that problem with cp

[digital jewel]

sounds like your framerate is bad

if it's a big problem you should consider just running on current patch

[knotty vigil]

alright, thank you very much

[true palm]

1221 is significantly less optimized

lower framerate = input delay

anything under 60fps is going to experience MAJOR issues, under 200fps is going to be frustrating (as such, make sure vsync is turned off)

[knotty vigil]

will lowering the resolution help ?

[true palm]

potentially

you can use steam overlay to check your ingame fps on cp

[knotty vigil]

i have like 500-800 for cp

[true palm]

Oh then you should be fine for 1221

will you double check that vsyncs off for me?

[stray kestrel]

might want to cap that tho for 1221 yea

[knotty vigil]

alright then, thank you for the help

[hearty adder]

200-250fps is a good cap for 1221

[true palm]

300 is standard

wouldnt recommend going higher

but anything between 200-300 should work

recommend rivatuner for capping fps

[hearty adder]

multiples of 50 are recommended due to the physics going at 50fps

[stray kestrel]

yea unless youre doing glitched stuff, as high as possible while still being able to go under a baldur when upslashing would be best

multiples of 50 also matters slightly more for glitched things too

[true palm]

(in theory the physics engine and graphics should mesh but i havent heard any instances of issues with it in nmg)

[stray kestrel]

but not like anything super huge

[digital jewel]

if you have 500fps on current patch I have no idea how your 1221 fps would be low

[true palm]

regardless i'd check it out with rivatuner

the other option would be to rename your 1221 install to "Hollow Knight" and move it to your steam directory, and launch the default game through steam for the steam support

[knotty vigil]

Like even for the Radiance fight ( which is the fight that dropped the most fps that i've noticed ), i still have at least 370

[true palm]

ye i'd be curious to see the number you're getting in 1221
(specially since the frame drops for most people are in thk)

[knotty vigil]

lemme check for THK

i have like 390 for THK

[digital jewel]

hmm

you should try capping your framerate to 300

[stuck raptor]

are you playing keyboard?

[knotty vigil]

im playing on my xbox controller

so for CP i can do fireball skip pretty easily, but most of the time my character doesnt turn back in 1221 even though i've been doing the same input

that's why i've been wondering about the control for 1221

[true palm]

was that thk framerate for 1221?

[knotty vigil]

no for CP

[chrome glade]

trying the steam downpatch, but im getting this message a million times with no end in sight (left it on overnight)- Loaded Config for Local Override Path for App ID 413080, Controller 0: C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam/controller_base/empty.vdf
OnFocusWindowChanged to window type: k_nGameIDControllerConfigs_Desktop, AppID 413080

[true palm]

it'll be easier to diagnose the issue if we get some numbers on framerate in 1221

[true palm]

OnFocusWindowChanged to window type: k_nGameIDControllerConfigs_Desktop, AppID 413080 just means that steams no longer in focus

your downpatch might have finished tbh

check the folder and tell me what the last file in hollow knight data is

[chrome glade]

ok, well now i look for the steam, steam apps and i cant find it. For the hollow knight folder, I don't have any files labeled hollow knight except the videos folder under my nvidia thing

[true palm]

its in content

[snow dome]

You definitely have a steamapps folder somewhere

[true palm]

C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\content\app_367520\depot_367521

[snow dome]

Yeah, it's not called Hollow Knight as you see in that SS above

[true palm]

if you just go to that directory

[chrome glade]

oh found it!

[true palm]

you'll see it

yup

[snow dome]

If the last file in that folder is the same as the one in the screenshot it's done. If not, it's not done.

[knotty vigil]

for 1221 it's around 350 for THK

[true palm]

might be a controller issue then

so we have 2 options

[chrome glade]

it is the last one

so i guess its doen

[true palm]

yup so you can just finish setup then!

[true palm]

option 1 is to use steam controller support and see if that helps, option 2 is to try joy2key out, option 3 is to send a video of the stuttering so we could better understand it

i actually personally use option 1 as my controller is jank as shit and often doesnt register

[chrome glade]

making my steam appid now one sec

[knotty vigil]

so one question, what's steam controller support ?

[true palm]

so steam basically by default takes all your controller inputs and converts them to xinput for whatever app you have (so things like switch pro work on old games)

[knotty vigil]

ok... so how do I use it ?

[prime wren]

Is there some way to actually practice p5 collector scream skip. I have been trying with savestates but saving in the bench room just before just breaks the game when I go back to it. Same with savestates in elder hu.

[digital jewel]

don't load a savestate from a bench

[prime wren]

so I assume I have to savestate before benching then. Since I just did it in the room. I could load it but then wasn't able to exit the room at all.

[chrome glade]

thanks for the help all

[digital jewel]

no problem femboysocialism

[unkempt goblet]

Whats the charm build for pop speedrunning

[dull lion]

Obligatory “Charm build pls hunt”

[ionic cargo]

Hello, I have just gotten a verified run, may I please have the speedrunner role? https://www.speedrun.com/hollowknight/run/y6d70w6m

[serene raptor]

has every 1 seen the "speedrun" from G. Milky low% godhome is insane

[normal aspen]

Yeah

by the time a fire / skurry video gets made about something most speedrunners prob found out about it a week or 2 ago

[kind flume]

?rank Randomizer Racer

[sick raven]

You left Randomizer Racer.

[lethal kite]

hey does anyone have problems with downpatching

[halcyon quail]

All Lore Tablets% ?

[lethal kite]

i tried the method fire gave and it kept launching in latest patch

[haughty fossil]

follow the guide in the pins first

[lethal kite]

yea thats what i followed

i tried to open it and it kept opening latest patch

[haughty fossil]

ah i see, screenshot the downpatch folder w/ the exe & steam_appid?

[lethal kite]

alr

right i dont think i can screenshot since its a windows installation in bootcamp so ill just send a picture

[haughty fossil]

steam_appid.txt.txt

rename it to just steam_appid

[lethal kite]

ohhhhhhhhhh

ty

ty it works now

[haughty fossil]

no worries

[dense swallow]

please i beg how do you do the watcher knights

whats harder thk or watcher knights

[true palm]

i see you've arrive to the roadblock of any%

for new runners watcher knights is the hardest boss

[dense swallow]

ive only killed 3 one time

[true palm]

ye so what you're gonna do

is just grind the first one

make sure you kill it before the next 2 spawn

[dense swallow]

i can do him most times being hit once

[true palm]

you dont want to be hit by the first one at all

[dense swallow]

ok ill try

[true palm]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XlmjHynpIjc&t=146s

[dense swallow]

i was gunno watch it but i didnt watch all of it

i just skipped around it

[true palm]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oc-_Vg-Y8ME

there you go

[dense swallow]

ty

[true palm]

the 2nd ones a pretty simple introductory, 1st covering a lot of fights

[dense swallow]

i normally kill the first wk right when the other spawns

[true palm]

you want to do it before so you can get the double dreamnail off

[dense swallow]

right

[true palm]

if you kill the first you can get to full soul with dnails

also keeps them spawning close together

[dense swallow]

and how does he do fireballs that fast idk i just cant time it well

im kinda sloppy

[true palm]

nail cancels

[dense swallow]

wtf is that

[true palm]

practice fireballing in the backhalf of your nail animation

[dense swallow]

alr

[true palm]

obviously quick cast is needed

you're going to need to know nail cancels anyway for uumuu

[dense swallow]

whats the difference between quick cast and normal cast?

[true palm]

normal cast is like 1/3 of a second slower

[dense swallow]

oh wow

i didnt know

[true palm]

it waits until after you release the button and then some more to cast

[dense swallow]

i have been using quick cast tho

[true palm]

makes fireball skips like nearly impossible

[dense swallow]

right i am using quick cast

still mess up a lot on fireball skips

[true palm]

the disparity is because it needs to check that you're not trying to focus

[dense swallow]

right

i got dream nail in 26 mins but i did die in fungal wastes

im too used to shade cloak i keep trying to dash thru them

[true palm]

watcher knights will take a while to get used to and do your first time

[dense swallow]

how long did it take you?

[true palm]

i started with low%

which is a very different fight

it took me like 20+ hours

but i did the fight dashless without shamans

but people can take upwards of 10 hours to do the fight their first try

[dense swallow]

dear lord

[true palm]

watcher knights is the big reason we recommend all skills as a beginner category but that has hornet 2 so 🥴

[dense swallow]

yeahhh

[true palm]

but for most people its a few hours

[dense swallow]

im not giving up tho ill keep trying

ive spent maybe an hour

[true palm]

it really depends on randos and other things done

[dense swallow]

i just killed 2

btw where do u put shamans on

[true palm]

at salubras

[dense swallow]

i might of missed fire say it in the video

[true palm]

right after you die

[dense swallow]

right

thats how he was killing everything quicker

as a beginner should you heal during your run?

because there is no way im beating wk if im not on 5 masks

[true palm]

i wouldnt just default heal to full outside boss fights

for boss fights

whatever beats them

[dense swallow]

alr

[true palm]

i heal in watchers while waiting for them to spawn if i need to

if they both roll/bounce at the same time you can opt to heal

outside of that wouldnt recommend trying to heal too much as you can get stuck in that trap of trying to heal and then taking damage and having no soul

soul is your main way to do damage so everytime you heal the fights going to go on longer

[dense swallow]

yes i dont heal during fights

i heal before

idk why but i start getting really good when im on one mask

i just killed 3 im improving now

[true palm]

start with healing in between watchers

and if ur at 1 hp and they give you a chance to heal you can

[dense swallow]

i can only heal when theres one bouncing

[true palm]

obviously you're not aiming for a 32XX your first run so timeloss is fine to get runs done

consistency with watchers takes a while

[dense swallow]

im aiming for sub an hour rn lmao

and ill start cutting it down

[true palm]

sub hour is a good goal

[dense swallow]

when i got dn in 26 mins i could of saved 4/5 mins

[true palm]

you can take a couple deaths and still make it because deathless runs take a long time to get consistent with

[dense swallow]

so do i take benches incase i die

but then i cant exit and leave

[true palm]

for watchers the kings bench is the normal safety to take

because you're run will instantly be over if you die without benching at all

because your shade is in watchers with geo

and you'd need to shade skip again

[dense swallow]

ah

yes

[true palm]

if you want to do a run and would rather continue if you die to watchers spire bench is chill

[dense swallow]

wheres that?

[true palm]

after spire lever skip

go left

and not right

theres a bench right there

[dense swallow]

lemme check that out

[true palm]

loses like 10s to grab but if you die to watchers it'll save minutes to walking from kings station

[snow dome]

You could check out runs that are closer to the time you're aiming for

[dense swallow]

yeah i will

[snow dome]

That should help you see some safety strats and things

Like what benches are available etc

[dense swallow]

alr i will

[dense swallow]

isnt the bench at map guy tho thats like 30 seconds

[true palm]

no not that bench

[dense swallow]

and it costs geo

oh

lemme look at a map w benches highlighted

[snow dome]

If you watch a run that's arrive an hour it will likely take that bench

That is being talked about

[true palm]

this one

[dense swallow]

yes i found it ty

is sub hour hard?

[true palm]

i wouldnt say its super difficult but it'll require practice

i think my first any% run was like 48 minutes but i had practiced low% before

sub hour could have a few deaths, take deepnest or nail1 routes, and still be fine, but will require you to actually learn the route you're doing

[dense swallow]

whats your best any% nmg constructive?

[dense swallow]

nail1 routes?

[true palm]

right now its a 40:42 (i lied)

[dense swallow]

damn

[true palm]

nail1 route is for those who could never do watchers or didnt want to learn

highly recommend not doing it

[snow dome]

Basically everything you're asking is covered in guides

[dense swallow]

LMAO

ok lemme search up why nail 1 is bad

[true palm]

nail 1 gives 4 damage

4 extra damage

and loses a couple minutes

[dense swallow]

OH

[true palm]

it doesnt really help the fight that much

[dense swallow]

i was thinking about getting a better nail

before the fight but it loses lots of time

[haughty fossil]

nail1 route is valid dw

[true palm]

nail1 is valid

[snow dome]

I would as I walkways do suggest that you grab Dash Slash and go get Shade Soul

Nail 1 just does so little

[true palm]

but I'd keep on just grinding watchers without upgrades, will help longterm anyway

[snow dome]

It adds less than 25% to your total damage output.

[dense swallow]

im going to keep trying wk for a while and see if i need it

as for now im making progress

[true palm]

shade soul is a route that exists that makes everything kind of free, will lose more time than nail 1

if your goal is for long term gains in the category, the only beginner strat that you wont have to unlearn that hard is deepnest

[dense swallow]

can you link a guide on it?

[haughty fossil]

weren't the 2 video guides already linked?

or do you mean for deepnest route

[dense swallow]

the deepnest one

yeah

[true palm]

fireborns covers it

[dense swallow]

alright

[true palm]

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLfkLKB8O1Ff0-AApWYqqgFjMcMMVaW_JH if you need the playlist

[dense swallow]

ty for the help guys

[deep kernel]

any tips on sanctum for 106?

[grizzled maple]

pray

(this is not funny haha meme i am serious)

[deep kernel]

thank you so much :D

[grizzled maple]

the worst room is hell room, i recommend learning the high strat that most runners go for. outside of that yeah... they can teleport straight into you on this patch so there's really nothing you can do sometimes.

maybe debug and practice the movement and see how they can move, but reacting is often not possible

[deep kernel]

I get down to like 2 health after hell room and then the mistakes + follies in twister just end me

[true palm]

lower your fps so the follies and mistakes are slower

[grizzled maple]

If you can get to the end of that room fast enough you should beat the folly spawns more often than not. You need to pogo the mistakes to do so. then you can fireball twice, stalling the second one for the later folly spawn

that's the really safe strat for that room

[deep kernel]

Is there anything worse than sanctum in 106 or not?

[grizzled maple]

106 sanctum is actually one of the worst things in hk yeah

[true palm]

its the worst in the category specially with fury from what i've heard

[grizzled maple]

its bad in 112 too but less so because they can only teleport in a range of you rather than literally on you

the category is really fun, just the early game is a nightmare hellscape

[true palm]

if your fps isnt capped to like 300 would recommend you do so, because iirc uncapped sanctums kind of not fun

[grizzled maple]

nah it's fine. I run at 300-350 on 1221

not 3000, i am not on a nasa pc

[digital jewel]

it's current patch where that's an issue

[true palm]

oh ye mb

[digital jewel]

someone posted a video of literal light speed follies at some point

[grizzled maple]

i should've tested them on the gdq pc while i was there

[deep kernel]

also when I entered soul warrior from above he just wasn't there and I had to noclip out and back in (the gates were closed)

[grizzled maple]

yeah that's a softlock that happens. that's why we avoid that room now

it's related to fps, and what's happening is that he gets stuck in the dive attack in the load

[deep kernel]

oh im following monstah's guide

[grizzled maple]

yeah i would watch valignatev's run on src, it's the most up to date unless someone else pb'd. there's been a lot of rerouting done in the last few months

there's even been some changes since his, mostly overcharming QG and deepnest which you are by no means required to do.

[deep kernel]

Wait Pest got a 32:39? I had no idea

I see daotmb with a pb from 3 months ago instead of 4 months

[grizzled maple]

i think vali's run is faster though. vali has really good movement (except for some peepo) so he's good to learn from

[deep kernel]

alright I'll do that!

[dense swallow]

omg i did it

i beat wk

i took a break

but i beat it with 4 masks

[ionic cargo]

^

[dapper cove]

You gotta be patient zenith

If it takes too long you can ping the mods though (src mods)

[ionic cargo]

i mean it has been 8 hours, I'll probably wait longer before pinging