speedrunning

[charred sigil]

we also aren't sure what your current goal is exactly

[jagged vault]

oh tipu it's the first pin in that channel

[elder gale]

but i want to get good greenpath

[verbal junco]

sub 2h

[snow dome]

There's also 3 Fireball skips

[elder gale]

yeah i found it

[snow dome]

So squit only works on one of them

[charred sigil]

@verbal junco and you've already done attempts on this?

[verbal junco]

11

[median gull]

Fireball skips are nice, I recommend doing them

or at least trying them.

[charred sigil]

what usually ends up being the issue?

[verbal junco]

watcher knights

[charred sigil]

have you narrowed it down?

getting dive does make sense then. Do you get the upgrade for the spell?

[verbal junco]

no

[jagged vault]

have you considered doing a shade soul beginner route instead? there's a good one that could help make watchers more beginner friendly

[verbal junco]

i have been

[charred sigil]

i think getting d-dark would be more worth while than shade soul or soul twister personally

[median gull]

?srpsa

use this route

[sick raven]

Reminder: This category is intended for competitive speedrunning discussion. Questions about achievements should be directed to #hk-help.
Guide for the 5hr speedrunning achievement: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1861523602

[snow dome]

https://www.speedrun.com/hollowknight/run/y8r76pnm

Here's a Descending Dark based route I did

[median gull]

this ddark route is really good imho

[verbal junco]

ill just get all of them

[snow dome]

1h20m

No Shade Soul because once you get D-Dark you don't really use Fireball anyway

[charred sigil]

^ i agree with that recomendation though sub 2 hour should still be possible with both

[elder gale]

oh noh this feels now so weird to play

[haughty fossil]

ddark does twice as much damage as shade soul, and makes you invincible for 20 years

[verbal junco]

thats true

[snow dome]

I really recommend my route if your issue is Boss Battles

[limpid ruin]

For reference on how much extra abilities can help: my first All Skills pb was like 1h37

And I was not a quick learner

[verbal junco]

i will just fight in godhome to practice

i will watch other things soon

[haughty fossil]

if you have access to the pc version, i'd recommend installing debug mod and practising in the real arena

[median gull]

not recommended but you do you

godhome wk has more hp

you are usually better equipped

there are 6 wk instead of 5

[stark stream]

I accidentally forgot the chandelier once and somehow did the fight like ten seconds faster than before

[median gull]

what loadout do you have?

[stark stream]

any% nmg. so just fireball, shaman stone, and non upgraded nail

[median gull]

wtf, fastest wk kill ever done

[elder gale]

how to heck someone is avble to 1fireball those fireballskipås

[stark stream]

practice

[charred sigil]

you mean the first second or 3rd

[elder gale]

i mean ive done it some times on prac but not today and i dont know what i am doing wrong lol

[stark stream]

i practice in slow motion to get the feel

[elder gale]

lol got it sewcond try after complaining

[normal aspen]

You kill the mosquito and then do it out of necessity

[verbal junco]

i usually just do 3 fireballs for the skip it makes it easier imo
(the second greenpath one

[normal aspen]

Yeah if it works it works

[stark stream]

@elder gale that's how it works for me too

[elder gale]

okay now i got the timing, lets go back to 2fireballs thenb

[formal bough]

https://www.twitch.tv/ins0mniasr/clip/PreciousPoorJayDogFace?filter=clips&range=7d&sort=time

^that's insomnia's backup version

[elder gale]

actually i think it was more worth than just luring thje mosquito

not sure tho

[median gull]

well, it is as lot harder

but yea

[normal aspen]

It's not about the difficulty, it's about sending a message

[old sphinx]

Isn't it faster to go back to the previous room and kill the birds?

[charred sigil]

This clip is 100% a meme

[normal aspen]

^

[charred sigil]

I'm sorry to break it to you

[hearty adder]

This is the galaxy brain version of squit skip

[elder gale]

no. Nothing is meme on speedrun community. Everything you do is just optimal stradegy or at least rng manipulation

[hearty adder]

As long as you don't say it was a mistake outloud, casuals watching will assume it's an optimal strat

[charred sigil]

honestly

that clip did rng manip his next run into being the best run of his life so

[normal aspen]

Look if you are gonna go and do mag ismas you gotta show off those turnarounds somewhere

[elder gale]

is there tutoria lfor consistent double hit moss knight

i mean i just wanna know theory behind it

but i dont think fireborn has it in his tutorial series

[dull lion]

I think Pisces talks about it in his all skills tutorial

[charred sigil]

Fireb0rn mentions it in the tutorial but he just barely glances over it

Pisces stays on it for slightly longer

the idea is slashing at it to activate it, then upslash right as it spawns, jump up, fireball twice and pray

[dull lion]

Wait what? I’ve always nail fireball jump fireball for double and it’s pretty consistent

[hallow orchid]

you basically want to act like you're gonna pogo the moss knight, so you need to be really close to it. Try it out for a bit with debug and you'll start to get a feel for it

keep in mind if you're on cp you have to be a lot further left, the hitbox is shifted, but it still works

[charred sigil]

I saw ax do this strat i think. It seems viable, just not the way pisces or fire teaches it

[dull lion]

It sounds faster now that I think about it

[charred sigil]

hmmm maybe

[digital jewel]

there are a few different ones

[dull lion]

Definitely not enough that I’m going to bother changing my setup

[charred sigil]

you can "cancel" some animation frames from a spell cast from casting again right?

it feels like you can cast again faster than the animation finishes

[elder gale]

oh thx that helped a lot

now i can get consistand backdashes, now just i need to time my fireball

[hallow orchid]

[elder gale]

got it 3 times row.. ez trick😎

lmao why nobody ever told me no hit VK is this easy if you just jump on righht spot

[hard river]

Yay it was accepted! I'm official!
https://www.speedrun.com/hollowknight/run/z188g0wy

[ionic sparrow]

congrats!

[carmine yew]

I do a different setup than what I talked about in the guide now lol

But both work, just takes some getting used to

[dreamy bough]

congratz kry!

[hard river]

Thanks!

[versed elbow]

Insomnia's clip will never get old.

"and that's how you do mosquito backup"

Literally every noob runner

[stark stream]

mosquito skip is smth i rediscovered myself

i saw someone do the fireball skip at some point and was like :o

so i tried and obviously failed but saw the mosquito and was able to bounce on it

neat history of brookie speedruns

i think my time was about 4 hours or so

[tropic heart]

anyone know how to downpatch hollow knight for steam for better speedruns?

[steady lynx]

Guide on src

https://www.speedrun.com/hollowknight/guide/jlten

[elder gale]

am io only one who thinks all skills THK is very fun fight

i enjoy it so much i dont want to stop practice

[charred sigil]

nah a lot of people really like the fight, especially in any%

THK is probably a top 5 boss when you're not strong enough to facetank it

4 phases, 9-ish attacks?

amazing ost

what more could one ask for

[elder gale]

shriek thk yes

it feels so satisfying

[short spire]

due to shriek and thk being generally janky messes hitbox wise it can be a pretty frustrating fight to try and not lose time to

[charred sigil]

oh i didn't see you say all skills specifically

[tropic heart]

have you tried the steam patcher? is it safe?
my computer says it is very untrusted and suspicious

[charred sigil]

yes you're the only one then

[short spire]

it's safe

[charred sigil]

[charred sigil]

it just says that because it's a home-made program

but i've used it myself and it works great

56 is a reliable fellow

shoutouts

[knotty vigil]

hey im interested in starting my speedrunning career with hollow knight, any suggestions for runs?

[elder gale]

learn wk

[charred sigil]

[knotty vigil]

I was thinking of starting on 112 but at the same time thats the longest

[elder gale]

starting with 112 wtf

[knotty vigil]

well, kinda

[deft flame]

well thats a huge route

[charred sigil]

I personally recommend down patching (switching to an older version of the game) and installing debug if you are on PC.

[small magnet]

I haven't messed with any 1xx% runs, but I'm guessing it would just take you longer before you can start putting the pieces together for a full run. Grinding is grinding, though. So pick the category you'd be most interested in doing

[knotty vigil]

ye, im on switch

[charred sigil]

ah

well

[short spire]

the easiest categories to start with are any% and all skills but it's totally viable to start with any category that most interests you

[knotty vigil]

ive been grinding stuff a lot, mostly just the early skips and stuff though

[charred sigil]

^ motivation is a big factor

[small magnet]

If you do a category that you don't like then you probably won't stick to it.

[knotty vigil]

so, in yalls opinion, what run should i start with to learn and stuff

[deft flame]

most commonly any% or all skills

[charred sigil]

I just learned all-skills as my third run

and wish it had been my first

any% was really fun too though

[small magnet]

If you really want an opinion on that, I think All Skills is probably a really good place to start. any% is fun and all but you only really learn nail/fireball control. All Skills gives you more experience with... y'know... the rest of the game lol

[knotty vigil]

okay, ye ill do all skills then. thanks :)

[small magnet]

I started any% cause it was the "Shortest run" and I'm kinda wishing I had started All Skills cause it just looks fun af lol

[elder gale]

doing any% before all skills makes you love queensgards+deepnest part becouse its same movement with shadesoul and desending dark tho

and dark deepnmest ez

[knotty vigil]

how do i get permissions in the run specific chats?

[elder gale]

but yeah i think all skills is good starting point. I started with any% and am currently practicing all skills

[small magnet]

Need to have a run on the boards

[knotty vigil]

ah okay

[elder gale]

with submitting run but i personally prefer this white role and not submitting my any% pb

;D

[knotty vigil]

i wont be able to submit anything for a long time 🥲

[small magnet]

You can still read most of the room convos and you're always welcome to chat in here about run-specific stuff

[stray kestrel]

What some people do to get the role is run an IL like kings pass or a pantheon or a short meme category like 4mask shards because they easy and quick to learn

[small magnet]

So, you're not hugely missing out by not having the role. A TON of great runners participate in here too, so it's not like people "stick to their club" or anything like that

[knotty vigil]

ye, im still in high school and dont have a capture card or anything...

i cant record my switch stuff

[elder gale]

me with 43min any% run recorded and highlited on twitch but still not submitting becouse its bad

[small magnet]

^ This too

[charred sigil]

ah it's your own perogative but i don't think you should be ashamed of any time

[knotty vigil]

okay well side note, whats the best way to get to monarchs wings?

[charred sigil]

i personally submitted a 55 minute run in a 20 minute category for my first run

and my first run in NMG was 45 minutes

[small magnet]

My first submitted run to any% was 1h 8m :X

[stray kestrel]

I defs didn't read the second part oops

[short spire]

idk if this is a hot take but encouraging people to do low effort submissions to get the role kinda defeats the point of the role being locked in the first place

not that there's anything wrong with getting the role by doing that but idk if it should be specifically encouraged

[charred sigil]

I mean

43 isn't low effort by any means

neither was my 55 in any% nmms

[short spire]

no i meant the thing about kings pass or similar submissions

[charred sigil]

oh

[short spire]

43 is a very respectable time, or any full any% run for that mattter

[charred sigil]

yeah kinda there with you on that ax

[vague jolt]

Maybe KP is low effort but (speaking as someone who is bad) I don't think 4ms is low effort at all

[elder gale]

Yeah if you can do full any% with only shamanstone wk i think you can achieve the role

[small magnet]

My 68 minute any% certainly didn't feel low effort haha

[charred sigil]

you should take a look at the guides on youtube and Speedrun.com

[knotty vigil]

okay i will thanks

[elder gale]

I just dont persoinally like submitting my any%time becouse my goal is sub 40 and it is easier to stay motivated when i dont evenm have submitted time

[charred sigil]

they go to monarch wings after doing a skip to isma's tear

[median gull]

i remember when I was one of them

[vague jolt]

I still get scared of itemless mawlek

[small magnet]

To each their own! I really enjoy having a time on the board and continually working to push my rank further and further. That gives me motivation :3

[median gull]

yea

[hearty adder]

trying to do an optimal mawlek for 4ms is really scary imo

[knotty vigil]

i hate that since i play digital switch i have to play newest patch

[median gull]

optimal mawlek is so hard to get

[elder gale]

why im bad again with spike tunnel skip btw

[hearty adder]

though the rest of the run is deceptively simple

[median gull]

fuck

[elder gale]

i was good at it yesterday but now it doesnt work lmao

[median gull]

there goes all my chances

but seriously, it is a really chill cat and really fun

you should definitely try it kanra

[vague jolt]

Kanra why not run worst 4 mask shards, where you have to get cg2 flower hive and 1500 essence shards

Kappa

[median gull]

4ms is only 8min tho

and you already "know" the route

[hearty adder]

i keep trying to get into other categories but my brain always jumps to "but i could just improve my time on 4ms though..."

[small magnet]

My current any% PB is 43:35 with a death in Peaks

It's the weirdest feeling

[median gull]

no

it does not

top run is missing fast cycle in the goam room

2 damage tank + inv drop yes

[knotty vigil]

i did a run where i just practiced strats over and over. I timed it anyway just to see, i ended up with like 13 hours worth of practice, and yet still couldnt get too many things down

[median gull]

yea

that other spot was on the older comsob i think

[knotty vigil]

all i got down was blue lake

[median gull]

sure

[hearty adder]

optimally it's 2 tanks, but you can also do just 1 if you're too low on hp

[median gull]

lets go to misc-runs

[small magnet]

I had Watcher Knights on repeat for 20 hours before I even completed a run. Keep at it ❤️ lol

[knotty vigil]

pretty sure 6 of those hours were watcher knights lmao

[small magnet]

You'll get there, mate! All about the grind

[hard river]

I ended up practicing the epogo for over 2 hours and in my first run where I tried it, I forgot to turn on Vsync

[knotty vigil]

the grind is real

[small magnet]

Wait... turn ON vsync?

[hard river]

yeah

to get it to 60 frames

[ionic sparrow]

for cp epogo there’s a vsync setup yeah

[small magnet]

Ohhh, gotcha. Everything I've seen says that vsync in this game is the devil

[ionic sparrow]

It is

[small magnet]

But, maybe that's just 1221 stuff

[hard river]

it's only used for the epogo I believe

[ionic sparrow]

You turn it off as soon as possible after you do epogo

[small magnet]

Ohh, interesting. Only for CP?

[ionic sparrow]

There’s something where if you close the settings menu with I think escape? It won’t s ave the settings

So when you save and quit vsync turns itself off again

Vsync is just bad on all patches for hk

Not a cp exclusive

[vocal dove]

not being able to turn off vsync on switch

[small magnet]

lol fair enough

[knotty vigil]

switch is weird cause i also have to play newest patch... now should i play stick or dpad?

[ionic sparrow]

On 1221 you can pogo the explosion + the projectile, on cp you can only pogo one of the two (I think it’s the projectile) so you need a diff setup for it

You can use whichever is more comfortable

[vocal dove]

it's down to personal preference. personally i claw the controller

[ionic sparrow]

No benefits either way

[hard river]

playing CP I've only ever pogo the projectile, but to be fair I have very little exp so it might be possible

[ionic sparrow]

You can’t pogo the explosion yeah

I rarely touch cp so it took a minute to remember

[knotty vigil]

i never got the explosion pogo down :(

[vocal dove]

emrays guide is pog

[knotty vigil]

everytime i try i swing too late and get blown up

[hard river]

It is really hard, you need to be pretty precise in timing and positioning
I have not actually used it in a timed run yet, same with qga actually

[vocal dove]

i struggle most with QGA recovery

[knotty vigil]

i also have a lot of trouble in the thk fight since i usually do the embrace the void ending

[small magnet]

QGA recovery? I just keep killing jellies to heal until I get it

Is there a better recovery for failing QGA? lol

[ionic sparrow]

You can dnail some of the bigger jellies I guess

[small magnet]

...

omg

I'm a crayon eater

[ionic sparrow]

There’s nothing perfect tho, everything is pretty slow near there

It’s by failing qga is so slow in runs

[small magnet]

I never think of using dnail for soul generation omg

[ionic sparrow]

No good way to get soul for heals in the Beginning

[limpid ruin]

Qga recovery is to do deepnest route until you can comfortably do qg route in practice

[ionic sparrow]

Yeah smtn like that kanra

[small magnet]

Yeah, for sure. Cause the game prioritizes cdash. So if it lands it will stick, otherwise it will hop you off

[hard river]

When practicing beast den before getting debug, I would dnail the little crawlers to heal up, same with uumuu practice

[vocal dove]

ah yeah you can buffer a jump if you see yourself too low right?

[ionic sparrow]

I just did that if I saw I was too low/high cuz id normally hit it if my positioning was good

[vocal dove]

too high* lol

[small magnet]

Weird thing is I'm hitting the cdash relatively consistently now, but then I fall in the acid before the dismount cause I'm trying to jump too early or too late >.>

[mighty compass]

so i decided to speedrun hollow point

[limpid ruin]

Otherwise, kanra solved qga for me: it's all rhythm. (from transition) Dash hop dash cdash

[mighty compass]

working on it atm (my computer's half-crashing inbetween runs) but 9:04 dashmaster (or a more convenient comparison: 8:08 claws)

[limpid ruin]

Probably jumping early

[small magnet]

That's what it feels like. When I really focus on it and force myself not to panic hop it doesn't seem too hard

So I just have to slow down. Panic inputs seem to be my biggest problem in getting some of these strats down lol

[limpid ruin]

I find it easier to stop my cdash early and dash into the wall, that way you can also just mash dash

[mighty compass]

i just had to quit a run due to a bench rest though and it sucks

[limpid ruin]

Panic inputs do be real tho

[mighty compass]

anyway is this about the crossroads skip?

tear skip*

[small magnet]

Queen's Garden acid skip

[mighty compass]

that's- yeah, that's the cdash in crossroads right

not too familiar with terminology yet sorry

or is there another cdash skip

[hard river]

The crossroads is an acid skip, but we are talking about one from fog canyon to Queens Gardens

[small magnet]

It even happens to me on the VK kill. I jump > nail > miss fireball cause I tried pressing it almost simultaneously with the nail and it misses and I fall and I lose 15 seconds 🙃

[mighty compass]

ohhh right

that took me too long

[deft flame]

oh i will definitely try that, thanks

[small magnet]

When I slow down and trust the rhythm I can do all these things pretty well. But then I try to do it and it's like "OH GOD ALSJDLFKMASDLFJ"

[mighty compass]

yeah i never got to queen's gardens in a speedrun yet because i usually die prior lmao

p sure any% doesn't go into queen's gardens tho

[small magnet]

It can

[charred sigil]

the top level runs all do

[mighty compass]

wait what

[charred sigil]

that's what "queens garden acid skip" is for

[mighty compass]

ok i must've overlooked something

[deft flame]

for any% you can do queens gardens route or deepnest route

queens gardens is faster

[small magnet]

Or the low level runs of runners getting way too big for their briches and losing a minute to failures ||This guy||

[mighty compass]

oh

it's for herrah then

[charred sigil]

me too rekinn

it's a fun trick tho

[deft flame]

yeah, you go through queens gardens to get to distant village

[small magnet]

It's so fun. And I figure I have to be good at it SOME DAY right? lol

[mighty compass]

ok it just clicked

[charred sigil]

that's my philosophy

[mighty compass]

i'm gonna google the skip then, because that might give me a clearer picture

i've honestly forgotten the entirety of qg

i don't ever go there lmao

[deft flame]

look at fireb0rn's any% herrah the beast video

its all there

[limpid ruin]

its less effort to do qga after all skills than to learn deepnest

[charred sigil]

i honestly felt like it was more effort to learn deepnest even before all skills because i knew i would just go QGA eventually

but

that's just because i knew i could get qga fairly quickly i guess

[deft flame]

i realized im terrible at deepnest so im just trying to learn QGA lol

[charred sigil]

if it's going to take you 3 weeks to complete a run with qga then you'd feel differntly

[mighty compass]

ok so you need cdash for that

that's a huge lake to skip over otherwise

[small magnet]

Yes, not possible without cdash

[granite field]

I can hear this

[charred sigil]

not possible to beat the game quickly without c-dash though

[mighty compass]

i just wanted to know that since i'm technically running any% atm

but i'd have to do deepnest anyway lol

[small magnet]

I've started getting better at internalizing the rhythm of the game. Makes so many things so much easier to sort of have a click in your head for timings

[granite field]

Wk is like
cheen ka ka pow pow ka ka pow pow cheen...

[ionic sparrow]

simply turn the brain off and the boss is dead

[mighty compass]

lmao

[small magnet]

Or if you're bad at WK - BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM BOOM Wooooooooooosh

[deft flame]

so that's the secret

i see i see

[granite field]

Yep exactly lmao

[ionic sparrow]

brain has been empty for quite@some time

[mighty compass]

just don't think 5Head

[small magnet]

pest dropping knowledge bombs rn

[deft flame]

i actually do better at QGA when i dont think about the timings

pest is onto something here

[elder gale]

can i see or can someone sent their all skills segment times(like how muchb each segemnts take) becouse i wanna kinow in what split i get biggest timelosses so i know what movements to prac

gold times are also fine

just something to compare

[deft flame]

you can compare with any top run by looking at the vod

[short spire]

you can check the comsob spreadsheet

for the best times on each split anyone's gotten

it's pinned in #all-skills

[elder gale]

yeah but vods doesnt show segment times

[elder gale]

oh nice thx

[small magnet]

I'm addicted to watching these comsob clips now. wtf are you guys on

[haughty fossil]

the pure unadulterated power of this emote:

[stiff delta]

wide!

[haughty fossil]

[stiff delta]

yooooooooooooooooo

[haughty fossil]

this one isn't fuzzy and also says trans rights

[thorn jasper]

[haughty fossil]

this one doesn't say trans rights but is still cute

[faint mulch]

Anyone do challenge runs of bosses?

[haughty fossil]

you mean like pantheons?

[stiff delta]

or an all bosses run

[faint mulch]

Individual bosses. Parry challenges, floor is lava, the like.

[stiff delta]

i dont think this is the right chat for that

[faint mulch]

There doesn't seem to be one.

[stiff delta]

#hk-discussion is your best bet

[faint mulch]

I figured the highest skill players are here.

[stiff delta]

this channel is for competitive speedrunning

[faint mulch]

How about individual bosses speedruns? People do those, right?

[haughty fossil]

not really

[stiff delta]

you can find all of the speedruns on the src page

[haughty fossil]

people have been looking at All Radiant runs but

[stiff delta]

https://www.speedrun.com/hollowknight/full_game

[hallow orchid]

there are speedruns of each of the pantheons, and at least emray has does an All radiant bosses run, but yeah that's mostly it

[finite heart]

Hmmm all radiant from a new godseeker file would be interesting.

[faint mulch]

Okay, pantheons. That will still answer my question. How do you people deal with Pure Vessel's triple slash in the most optimal way? I've been trying to parry through it, which is really freaking hard, but I can't seem to shadow dash it all the time because the cooldown hasn't finished if he triple slashes after a knife throw, since I shadow dash that too. What's the best way to avoid those moves and deal as much damage as possible while doing it?

[hallow orchid]

you can't quite do it from a new godseeker file because Absrad won't be unlocked

[haughty fossil]

according to monstah's wr, by not getting the triple slash attack

[faint mulch]

I can double hit him with Shade Soul when I do manage to parry the triple slash, but that feels extremely inconsistent.

AI manipulation or luck?

[haughty fossil]

is triple slash just pogo strats?

[faint mulch]

Everyone in the general channels tells me parrying is a waste of time, but whatever kills PV fastest, I want to do that, and I'm sure speedrunners will know that best.

[steady lynx]

Gold -> 12th spit

[hallow orchid]

I don't know what panth ILs use, where nail damage matters more. I pogo that attack in 112 runs

[faint mulch]

Dang it.

That's what I've been trying, but I can't get consistency.

[haughty fossil]

you should just be able to shade cloak through before he starts the triple slash attack, no?

during the choreograph

provided you stay close to them

[faint mulch]

I can shade cloak consistently, but if he does it after knives, my cloak isn't recharged.

[haughty fossil]

ddark iframes?

[short spire]

the freeze frames make parries basically always a bad option for anything other than mitigating mistakes

[faint mulch]

Exactly my problem, which is why I tried to get parrying down, but whatever the frame window and positioning is, it's very specific.

I use everything. I DD a lot.

[dull lion]

Ddark through definitely sounds like the move

[faint mulch]

Is it fast enough? I thought the windup was too long.

[dull lion]

I don’t really run Pantheons but if you start it in the air so that the first swing misses it should work

[hallow orchid]

you can pogo into ddark there but it's probably losing damage to more nail slashes. Ddark is pretty slow unfortunately

[faint mulch]

Anyone have a clip of a really good PV fight?

[dry sluice]

theres a tas somewhere 🥴

[short spire]

just check the p5 rekky probably

[hallow orchid]

check the p4 or p5 IL boards

[short spire]

true p4 has a higher chance to be more optimal

[hallow orchid]

tas has rng manipulation so it probably doesn't even get that attack lol

[faint mulch]

Okay. Does the TAS parry? I think a double hit off Shade Soul does more damage than anything else you could do, and I assume a TAS could do it perfect.

[hallow orchid]

tas is ridiculous lmao https://www.bilibili.com/video/av798776361

it has like 4 attacks, 2 of which are pillars

one is a parry funny enough

[uneven scarab]

Huh, I thought tas wasn’t possible in hk?

[hallow orchid]

it's a new development Ohko they figured it out

[haughty fossil]

i think they do some low level manipulation of unity engine to get it to work?

[faint mulch]

!!! What the frick!

Okay, clearly if you're a TAS, DDing pillars is not optimal, but is it for humans? Because when I get pillars, I pogo his head once then DD.

[hallow orchid]

for pillars you're better off standing right next to him and upslashing or shrieking

[dreamy bough]

shrieking is optimal imo?

but fury is amazing yeah

[hallow orchid]

I think with fury upslashes might be better but idk

in 112 shriek is optimal

[dreamy bough]

or sideslashes, because, you know, steady body in tas :)

[faint mulch]

I will try that. I'm not good enough to use fury, and I'm working on Radiant anyways. Unless there's a way to trigger fury in radiant.

[hallow orchid]

if you're just trying to do the fight radiant just ddark the pillars tbh

if you're trying to speedrun radiant then yeah you should shriek probably

[faint mulch]

Where can I find top P4 runs?

[hallow orchid]

https://www.speedrun.com/hollowknight/Pantheon_of_the_Knight

[faint mulch]

Excellent, thank you very much. Y'all were super helpful.

[deft flame]

damn canceling cdash early and spamming dash to the wall makes QGA so much easier, idk why i didnt think of this before

[stiff delta]

im not a big fan of dash into wall but cancelling it does make it easier now that ive done it both ways

[deft flame]

i had tried canceling before but without dash to wall

that one didnt help a lot for me 😅

[faint mulch]

Does FotF affect Nail arts? I thought nothing changed their damage.

[fickle igloo]

First run done \o/ 3:14:11. (Any% NMG) the only way from here is up :D

[deft flame]

according to wiki:

This effect is also applied to Great Slash and Dash Slash (but not to Cyclone Slash)

[faint mulch]

Ooh. Neat.

The description of the runs I watched said that he uses different versions for different pantheons. Why is that?

[haughty fossil]

iirc it's because nail binding was broken on earlier patches, didn't affect nail arts

[regal viper]

Hey, quick question

Can you pause the game when you spawn at the very start in console?

[sand raft]

No

[deft flame]

no

you can't do that in current patch in general

[sand raft]

Console is current patch, and most glitches don't exist, but you can technically still do inventory drop, it's just frame perfect and you can only do it off ledges

[regal viper]

I get inventory drop pretty consistently idk why

Thanks for answering so quick!

[haughty fossil]

none of us ever close discord dw

[sand raft]

Np

[deft flame]

well then abuse it as much as you can

[sand raft]

The actual reason I came into this channel was to ask if anyone wants to do some Lockout Bingo later

If anyone wants to do some in around an hour, DM me

[haughty fossil]

vanilla lockout?

(as opposed to randomizer)

[formal bough]

cause if your goal is to do bingo then do ?rank randomizer racer and go over there to ask (and maybe even do a @randomizer racer to go along with it.

[steady lynx]

Okay, took like seven attempts but I think I get QGA now

[median gull]

maybe ?rank speedrun racer for vanilla bingo, but idk if anyone plays that

[haughty fossil]

there used to be a fair few races of vanilla bingo, but honestly it's just any% start -> routing for goals, and people prefer spoiler dab anyway

[median gull]

yea, I played a few on collie streams, it was fun but weird asf

after the 3rd one I dropped out cause it was the same thing again and again

[mild moon]

Vanilla bingo could be fun with start items/random start. Or maybe even something like vanilla item area rando. I think vanilla bingo is good when it has the same kind of strong routing element you get in DAB, but it also needs something to not be monotonous (and the first 15 minutes are especially bad in that regard).

[steady lynx]

Just got QGA five times in a row, ezpz

[uneven scarab]

Ye, once u learn it, it’s ez, and the same is true for most other parts in a speedrun.

[steady lynx]

Same with epogo

[sand raft]

Yea, vanilla lockout

[median gull]

100% agree homothety

[sand raft]

What's epogo?

[median gull]

explosive pogo

[sand raft]

Oh that

[haughty fossil]

you can do this, but you're probably out of luck for people doing vanilla lockout here

[sand raft]

Yea it's really hard on CP

[median gull]

smh jame editing messages to @ me

[thorn jasper]

You know what the right call is. The two greatest words in the English language: Ping. @median gull . Need progression? Ping @median gull . Can't find claw? Ping @median gull . Trying c-dash balder? Ping @median gull . Lost a geo rock somewhere and need to find it? Ping @median gull . Died to mawlurks? Ping @median gull . Skipped some grubs? Ping @median gull .

[haughty fossil]

wtf editing a reply makes it ping?

who designed this

[median gull]

(idc about pings but discord has some 🍝 stuff)

[twin swallow]

You missed "Need 4MS comsob? Ping @median gull"

[meager current]

you also missed
"Missed a PB by 39 seconds? Ping InF™️| Yuuki#3998

[deft flame]

im disappointed you didn't divide this into several messages to ping him multiple times

[vague jolt]

Is it possible to generate a vanilla item area rando seed? I tried once and my game froze IIRC, I guess you would probably need a custom algorithm to generate it or something

Well maybe not "need"

[formal bough]

editing a message does highlight it but it doesn't ping. For example - poof I just edited in a ping in hk meme (sorry for the location but had to make sure you hadn't read the message so posted one just to ping)

I doubt jamie just got pinged in hk meme

[haughty fossil]

yes but replies do

(also i have that channel muted so bad example)

[tropic heart]

i got the depot downloader and im 25% sure my steam account got hacked

[formal bough]

pings still occur in muted channels

did you just get hornetpinged?

[haughty fossil]

no

[formal bough]

now?

[charred sigil]

56 is not hacking you

@hidden fractal can you tell him you're not hacking him

[tropic heart]

it might be a glitch

now its telling me i need a confirm code

i am confused/scared

[haughty fossil]

if you have steam mobile authenticator you will need to enter that as well

(or email authenticator or whatever)

telling you now: basically half of us here have used depotdownloader without issue. The code is open to be viewed, so if there was a security risk we would know

[hidden fractal]

why do you want me to lie wasabi

[haughty fossil]

plus 56 only wants your steam account for family share

[tropic heart]

did you go onto my account and log me out

[mild moon]

All of the vanilla item /randomized transition modes work. They're optimized toward placing progression as the map is built, but they can still eventually handle the vanilla case.

[worthy sluice]

Imagine playing osu then being interupted to lie about somthing you totally did

[tropic heart]

@hidden fractal

did you do something to my account

[jagged vault]

no

[haughty fossil]

no.

[short spire]

bro 56 isnt tryina steal your account lmao

[mild moon]

Even easy vanilla item connected area room randomizer only took 90 minutes to generate last time I tried.

[jagged vault]

it is asking you to log in to make sure you actually own the game on your steam

[haughty fossil]

"only"

[vague jolt]

^

[tropic heart]

well how come 2 hours after getting the depot downloader i get logged out it says my password is changed and then it changes back

i have info on that account

[jagged vault]

that is not 56's doing

[mild moon]

Vanilla area took about a minute just now, and in general it's significantly faster than room randomizer

[tropic heart]

i havent downloaded sus in the past year

[haughty fossil]

steam tends to log you out of the client if you restart your pc

[tropic heart]

it said my password was changed for a few mins

[haughty fossil]

where? if your password was actually changed you would have received an email to the connected email address

[elder gale]

Yeah. You should understand that there is propably over 100 or even 200 people who have used that same depot downloader so its not its fault if your hacked

[vague jolt]

IDK my potato-tier computer is struggling'

(Though I foolishly left it on easy...)

[tropic heart]

it might have been lag my internet was being strange for a few minutes

[hidden fractal]

you are making talking about firetrucks in osu so much more difficult

[tropic heart]

ill try not to worry about it

[hidden fractal]

you can read it yourself if you're that worried https://github.com/fifty-six/zig.SteamManifestPatcher/blob/master/src/main.zig#L25

lmfao

[haughty fossil]

56 im pretty sure they're using depotdownloader

which isn't yours

[hidden fractal]

idk they said steam patcher earlier

i have 0 trust

[tropic heart]

i downloaded off his page

[haughty fossil]

im confused now

[tropic heart]

on speedrun.com

[mild moon]

Mines took 111 attempts to generate the area rando Flib, in case you wanted to compare

[vague jolt]

How do I tell how many attempts?

[mild moon]

That also means very high variance on the number though

[vague jolt]

I started one a few minutes ago, and the modlog is currently 177KB

[mild moon]

search "beginning transition randomization" in the modlog

[tropic heart]

ive already done this

[vague jolt]

151 attempts so far 🤷

[mild moon]

1% chance vanilla randomizer lootboxes when

[tropic heart]

maybe the depot downloader made steam not recognize the computer because it was modified

[haughty fossil]

thats just what happens when you try to log into steam client and don't have mobile authenticator

[mild moon]

If you wait 10 minutes, you can roll again, or you can pay 1 dollar now to roll 100 times

[harsh mason]

only $1 smh

[small magnet]

So, the whole Hollow Knight speedrunning community is a conspiracy for 56 to play Huniepop on my account? Bruh, you just had to ask.

[harsh mason]

$7 for a roll, $50 bundle for 10, $450 bundle for 100

ill take a 50% split for better pricing

[haughty fossil]

admitting to owning huniepop

[hidden fractal]

@haughty fossil meme

[harsh mason]

me: writes code
computer: im not too sure, do you know where this came from

[haughty fossil]

im getting conflicting messages

[vague jolt]

Ooh it generated one! 318 attempts

I guess I probably have to play this now

[harsh mason]

56 you should just pay into microsofts ransoms

and pay to have your code verified

[hidden fractal]

🥴

[dreamy bough]

watch it be vanilla transitions all the way :)

[charred sigil]

admitting to not owning huniepop

[haughty fossil]

uniepop

[harsh mason]

thats just british huniepop

[twin swallow]

you mean bri'ish

[haughty fossil]

3 british people make fun of british language - as is tradition

[knotty vigil]

time to stare at my screen until this run gets verified.

[twin swallow]

just keep practicing and you'll have a better run before it does (:

[median gull]

I recommend some sleep

[knotty vigil]

I did that and had 4 pending runs at once

[median gull]

I don't think waiting 7 days staring at your screen until it gets verified is worth

[knotty vigil]

I just woke up

[haughty fossil]

top tip: the more money you bribe the mods with, the faster it gets verified

[knotty vigil]

can ijust @ go xero here take my money

[small magnet]

2nd one comes out in 3 days! So hype

[median gull]

They're streaming, you can ask them @ rusty

[deft flame]

just sub to their stream

they'll understand what it means

[knotty vigil]

LMAO

I'll cheer 2 thousand bits

and make the message "Speedrun.com Pantheon of the Master Khastiel 3:37 verify"

[mighty trellis]

I just got a 1 fireball greenpath skip

[knotty vigil]

Go big or go home amirite

[mighty trellis]

yeah

[keen cedar]

howdy all, I had a quick q for any glitched runners: I've got the load time plugin installed but I'm still getting pretty inconsistent oobs and slow superslides, should I be running a framerate limiter?

[ionic sparrow]

yeah, alot of ppl use rivatuner for that

slides are frame perfect so they're hard no matter what

[keen cedar]

oh okay, thanks for the help!

[normal aspen]

Slow suoerslides you are either brushing past a corner or you have debug on, they should always be full speed

[ionic sparrow]

oh yeah i skipped over the slow superslides part lol

inconsistent oobs are just practice

[keen cedar]

oh debug messes with superslides? thanks for the heads up, I was wondering what was casuing it

[stuck raptor]

debug makes it easier to perform, but can result in slower slides

[median gull]

oh i'm glad I read this

[keen cedar]

yeah now that you mention it I have been noticing they're a lot easier with debug

[normal aspen]

Yeah a lot of ppl cap.to 120

[median gull]

why didn't you tell me earlier D:

[normal aspen]

That way it's q nice balance between playable a good slides

I mean i don't in my pb

[median gull]

lmao

[stark stream]

I'd watch streamers wayyy more if roku tv had twitch

[vocal dove]

you ever just PB your first run of the day and play like shit for the rest of the day

[knotty vigil]

Literally today

[steady lynx]

I always have one early run that goes well, then it dies and then I play like shit for the rest of the day

[vocal dove]

same

[knotty vigil]

feels so good

[twin swallow]

it's completely normal.

[fervent dock]

Definitely normal lol

[knotty vigil]

Hi, is there a category for Nail only? Of course minus the spots where you NEED to use a spell to progress. I'm curious if that's a thing.

[digital jewel]

you're in luck

there's a category for no spell usage at all

[knotty vigil]

Oh, there is!? Are there any runs available to watch on SR . com,?

[digital jewel]

https://www.speedrun.com/hkmemes/run/y9n977kz

it's unverified right now

[knotty vigil]

Amazing, ty! I'll watch that and prob start practicing that run. Sounds like a decent challenge too.

[fervent dock]

Oh neat

[uneven scarab]

Jamie did a no spell any% run yesterday

[haughty fossil]

you could fix that

fwiw the route i take in that run is probably the easiest route possible, it gets nail2 and spore shroom (op against THK, trust me) and only does the dreamshield kill. Downside is you start with 20 minutes of geo farming

[short spire]

how much total damage is one spore shroom cast

[carmine yew]

1

yw

[stray kestrel]

from the hk wiki

releases a cloud of spores dealing 1 damage per tick. The cloud lasts 4.1 seconds allowing for 27 ticks of damage

[carmine yew]

[short spire]

yeah especially with nail2 i really can't see that being worth

unless you're having to heal constantly for hp

[harsh mason]

pretty sure it eats nail hits too

[stray kestrel]

you could also get dcrest to buff it to 2/tick for 20 ticks

[harsh mason]

unless you're using it to cheese his 1dmg phase

and it actually does significant damage

[normal aspen]

Spore shroom is broken vs thk

It does like 200+ dmg per heal

[short spire]

[normal aspen]

Only on CP tho

It's true

[stray kestrel]

wait it does more damage? i thought it just did damage even when he left the effect radius

[short spire]

doesn't really sound like enough to make cp optimal tho

[normal aspen]

Maybe but it's certainly easier

[haughty fossil]

it is absolutely broken

[stiff delta]

wr free?

[haughty fossil]

watch the end of my pb, i get 2 screams in a row and THK has like 5hp left

wr is free if you can just learn longnail baldur

(technically kanra has wr from a while ago but im not sure if she highlighted it)

[short spire]

yeah but you're missing out on lever skips, inv drops and all other 1221 tech

• losing time to picking it up

[haughty fossil]

that is fair

but consider this

i can't run 1221

let me have this moment

[short spire]

ok fine

harder and much more limited in their usefulness

[hearty adder]

doing spelless on cp to preserve jamie's honor

[haughty fossil]

plus i think optimally this route runs fury + spore shroom, and nail0 fury thk does not sound like a fast or fun experience

[vocal dove]

getting in the rhythm of doing CP inventory drops feels so good though

[short spire]

fury + spore shroom sounds counterintuitive

[haughty fossil]

i kind of meant longnail but i'll leave it there

[short spire]

oh lol

[hallow orchid]

I still think strength is potentially worth

[haughty fossil]

my brain not big here

[stray kestrel]

with nail 2 it might be if you can get geo

[haughty fossil]

imo strength is only worth if you're already going for nail upgrades, which in itself is suboptimal

[harsh mason]

get cyclone

[mild moon]

Spore shroom definitely seems like a nice convenience, but it's hard to imagine it saves much more than the ~40 seconds it takes to pick up

[hallow orchid]

Eh what's strength fury nail 0 compared to fury nail 0?

[short spire]

fury wk without vs stalling sounds kindaa hard ngl

[haughty fossil]

qg petra arena is cursed

[harsh mason]

14 vs 9 right

[haughty fossil]

kanra ran no nail upgrades, i'd ask her first about all of your boss fight needs, im just an idiot who reached a follower goal

[hallow orchid]

Yeah it's like an extra nail upgrade. Idk if it's worth but you don't need to buy shaman so you'd only be adding a bit of extra geo grind early compared to like AS routing

I suppose moss knights are slow without vs though

[knotty vigil]

Is there any other route sparing the 1800 grind on that minion?

[median gull]

yes

get long nail

do 8 frame perfect hits on baldur

save 15 min

free wr

[short spire]

wouldn't it just be 4 times you have to get it? you'd def be using fury for it and i thought you can get 2 nail hits in each time

[median gull]

2 nail hits each time?

oh yea I forgot about fury

[short spire]

yeah i'm like 90% sure you can get another hit in during the stagger period

[median gull]

wtf, if 4 is possible why is jame running dreamshield @ jame

[hearty adder]

ok

[harsh mason]

shh

you missed #hk-meme

[short spire]

uhh <@&283547423706447872>

[harsh mason]

also reported to discord for self-dox and suicidal messages

[slim oxide]

Yep I see it

[whole meadow]

ct

[median gull]

wtf did I miss (i dont really wanna know)

[short spire]

katie pretty much summed it up

[rapid jungle]

how do you even get the speedrunner role

[harsh mason]

[rapid jungle]

oh

HOW DO I DO THAT I PLAY ON XBOX

[harsh mason]

stop

why the fuck did you type that in all caps

[rapid jungle]

idk

[harsh mason]

https://bfy.tw/QKAQ

[woven saddle]

for lurien , is it possible to do the lever skip on console?

[pure vault]

no

[harsh mason]

no

lever skips only work on 1221

[woven saddle]

rip

[harsh mason]

thats a really nice picture

the answer is still no

[woven saddle]

thank you 💀

i don’t wanna fight the big red dude

he’s mean 😠

[steady lynx]

He's easier than he seems once you get the pattern down

[woven saddle]

i kno

i still don’t like him

[harsh mason]

remember when you had to fight him, but if you didnt touch the ground he didn't have ai

[steady lynx]

Only if you try to pogo him, then he swipes up

[woven saddle]

:0

yea

[steady lynx]

Idrk who I am to talk, my main cat just kills him through the floor

[woven saddle]

WAITT

that’s so big brain

[harsh mason]

with scream

[woven saddle]

i shoulda though of that

[steady lynx]

112 exclusive basically

[short spire]

it doesn't work with just the nail

[grizzled maple]

Hey rando exists

[woven saddle]

ripp

[grizzled maple]

Yeah you need a shade spell

[steady lynx]

I meant of main cats

If you really want to you can dreamshield him through the floor

[harsh mason]

i think it works with a big nail

but its terrible damage

[woven saddle]

b i g n a i l

[grizzled maple]

Dream shield takes like 14 minutes tho fair warning

[woven saddle]

gonna have to ask uncle sly

for b i g n a i l

[short spire]

nah if you try to hit him tru the floor you just hit his shield

[harsh mason]

is that a cp thing

[grizzled maple]

Yeah

[steady lynx]

Somehow, even though he can't point the shield down

[harsh mason]

tc fixing symptoms and not bugs

[grizzled maple]

You test with the nail to see where he is for the spell in rando since his position is random. On normal unmodded he's always perfectly center from the bottom spire load

[steady lynx]

Dash, jump right a bit, Shriek, Shriek

[gloomy bane]

hi, i want to do some speedruns just for fun in current patch where i can find a good route without any hard skip?

[haughty fossil]

check the pins

[grizzled maple]

You can check out both all skills and any% current patch categories. You can just skip explosion pogo, shade skip, and any acid skips if youre not comfortable with them. But those two will help you the most with route ideas depending on which upgrades you want and whats possible.

[gloomy bane]

ok thx gonna check for any%

[cloud siren]

Been thinking of getting into hollow knight runs, how beginner friendly is it?

I obviously dont expect a free run and am willing to do a lot of practice and grinding

Coming off a few months of minecraft speedrunning, looking for a change of pace from all the damn RNG lmao

[stark stream]

Very beginner friendly imo

[twin swallow]

was my first proper speedrun game, there are fairly beginner friendly categories and routes to try first and lots of great guides if you need help

[stark stream]

with any% nmg I'm not sure exactly what the fastest speed you can get without the difficult tricks, but it's probably only ten minutes behind world record and you can fail one skip and only lose a few seconds to a minute.

It's a very linear skill progression with it for all skill levels! all skills is also a category, sorry lol

[twin swallow]

any% and all skills nmg are both pretty accessible and fun, any% is shorter but has some harder bosses (you have less stuff), all skills is longer and has easier bosses but some more difficult skips

[cloud siren]

Sorry if this is a dumb question but what are the major glitches removed in nmg?

Or are there like too many to list lol

[knotty vigil]

Another Pb, 3:33 for P1. I'm getting closeeeee

[dry sluice]

Too many to list quickly but you can look at the rules on src for a pastebin of everything

The main stuff is floats and superslides and oob, stuff like that

[cloud siren]

Okay yeah I'll have a look into it, ty everyone

[knotty vigil]

https://pastebin.com/VtzvMpyW

[formal bough]

thankfully no need to route generally since mostly optimal routes already exist

remembering the route is legally considered a major glitch and is grounds for invalidating a run, don't worry about it

[stray kestrel]

remebering the route is a major glitch yea

plus its free time save for your next run

[weary root]

dying is very normal as a beginner, and as you start to do faster strats dying is also normal cause you play very risky in so many places

[stray kestrel]

check the pins

[tardy sable]

submit a run to speedrun.com and link the verified run here

[stray kestrel]

basically do a speedrun

yep

console runs are timed rta and not loadless

[tardy sable]

record yourself doing the run

[stray kestrel]

yep

yea you just need video and game audio

any time you want

best of luck with your runs

[twin swallow]

feel free to ask here if you have any specific questions or need help with anything later

[analog monolith]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9Yz9EVP43c

i require assistance with wk (again)

[cloud siren]

That's what's scaring me from getting into the run lmfao

[analog monolith]

specifically getting it more consistent, sometimes i do it almost nohit sometimes i die to the first pair

[tardy sable]

just need practice

[small magnet]

Yeah, that's just a practice thing. The more you do it the more you'll start to just kinda feel it and how to respond to weird patterns

[analog monolith]

then why can i do it almost nohit already c:

[tardy sable]

idk, that is a pretty good wk fight

[cloud siren]

Actually, how important do you think sound queues are? Is there any point in the run where they're like almost necessary, or is it not that key

[stark stream]

for some people

[cloud siren]

Cause I cant play with game sound rn

[tardy sable]

i use sound cue for qga and that's about it

[analog monolith]

i use sound cues never

[cloud siren]

What's qga?

[analog monolith]

queens gardens acid

...skip

[stark stream]

It varies by the person. also yea i use it in qga too

[cloud siren]

Ah I see

[tardy sable]

a skip where you cdash above acid, i use the sound cue from hitting the one to time when to get up

[cloud siren]

Yeah I mean I played casually fine without sound but I was wondering if itd make the run tougher. Thanks!

[stiff delta]

Sound cues are good

[tardy sable]

sound cues also tell you when watcher knights are rolling when they are offscreen

[stiff delta]

Theres a little wall right above where the skip is done that you can use to get cdash timing down

[cloud siren]

Also yea i just realised I called them sound queues lmfao

Ohhhhh i fucking hated when they'd start rolling offscreen

So that might be good

[analog monolith]

oh yeah sound cues for offscreen knights is useful

yall think i should practice nail 0 or nail 1 then? those wk runs were nail 0 but i've never done a full nail 0 run

or practiced anything past wk nail 0

[cloud siren]

Does nail 0 mean like no upgrades?

[analog monolith]

yeah base nail

[tardy sable]

nail 0 is good practice

[cloud siren]

Ah cool, guess I gotta learn all the HK lingo

[tardy sable]

if you can do nail 0 then nail 1 is trivial

[stark stream]

not dying is really hard. even the top 5 people in any% nmg can't beat hollow knight without dying once smh 😔

[analog monolith]

lmfao

would it be viable to practice nail 0 and then run nail 1?

[stark stream]

for what purposes

[tardy sable]

yea, that's exactly what i do

[analog monolith]

practicing nail 0 to get better at shit and then running nail 1 to make the actual runs more consistent

i think that's what i'll do for a while then

tfw trying to practice, benchwarp inside egg without dreamers, then try to leave for some reason, and softlock

[tardy sable]

do play nail 1 from time to time so you don't get off guard by how fast wk die

[analog monolith]

mm that's true

could like practice nail 0 then finish off practice with a nail 1 run to keep the memory

also i did the math in the shower a while ago but

for uumuu 2 cycle strat

nvm

[deft flame]

looks like you try too much to keep the default combo going even when both beetles are side by side in the corner, where you can't really dash behind one of them, you took a lot of hits that way

other than that it looks pretty good to me

[analog monolith]

really?

[deft flame]

the other hits you took were either close calls or something that was hard to dodge really

[analog monolith]

for the last two i might've been trying to take the 4th one out as fast as possible since the last one i can heal during, other than that idrk

[deft flame]

i noticed that at 4:22 and 2:18

although in 2:18 you didnt get hit but you would have if the beetle on the left had bounced

[analog monolith]

i'll check in a bit but my laptop does not like running hk and anything at the same time

[deft flame]

oh actually sorry it was 4:29, not 4:22

usually what i do instead in that kind of situation is get 2 or 3 hits to the beetle in the front then dash away and do fireballs until one of them comes at me

[tardy sable]

wow i haven't played in 2 days and my wk is absolute garbage

[deft flame]

although thats just what i do, i dont think that would be the optimal /fastest way to deal with that

but its pretty safe at least

[verbal junco]

🍿

[analog monolith]

cons of practicing radiant pv: you assume you have shadow dash and also that thk goes farther with triple slash

[tardy sable]

lol

i am the opposite

i have done radiant pv, but now having practiced so much against thk, PV is like impossible lol

[analog monolith]

i see

it's like that for me w/ nkg, trying to grind p3ab makes nkg impossible for me lol

[tardy sable]

p3ab
all bindings are kinda bs in my opinion, i just want to use shaman stone

[analog monolith]

lmao i understand

i just wanna be able to get that shiny stone

the all bindings glow on pantheon doors

[weary root]

@cloud siren Important to note that submitted runs require game sound to be verified. It's fine if you have your speakers off or w/e but the recording needs to have sound.

[analog monolith]

ok so i got a glitch where i would go through a downward room transition, it would load for a minute and a half, i ciuld pause and unpause and move freely during the transition, so i opened inventory, then the room loaded, and all of a sudden i get uncapped downward momentum like a menu drop

1. is this banned in nmg
2. how do i prevent this since it doesn't stop the timer for a good 90 seconds while it's loading as well

[weary root]

where exactly? do you have a clip?

[analog monolith]

hold on

it was the transition from crossroads into wastes

[knotty vigil]

room attatched to the first arena?

arena as in the aspid thing lmao

[analog monolith]

yeah, from that room into wastes

[knotty vigil]

i see

[analog monolith]

that area transition

[knotty vigil]

what do you play on?

[analog monolith]

pc

the igt in the top right keeps running during the loading screen as well

[weary root]

so yes the fast falling is a major glitch

[knotty vigil]

maybe because you pasued and unpaused during the transition, it locked the state of your knights momentum from that point, and because you had entered and exited ur inventory it locked ur momentum as an increasing rate.

[analog monolith]

dang so i can't open my inventory during that 90 second load

[weary root]

no idea how this happened though never seen it before

opening your inventory during loads is what causes it yeah

[analog monolith]

40* second load

[knotty vigil]

ive managed to manually do the same thing using a Cdash glitch, and the reason it works from that

is the same reason

[weary root]

normally during long/ infinite loads the timer should stop

[analog monolith]

yep

but

it doesn't

and this is the first time i noticed this but it stops and then starts again

[weary root]

I'd say it's an anomaly, if you get it again then maybe investigate further but it's unlikely

[analog monolith]

and i also don't have sound within the room

this is like the 10th time it's happened

[weary root]

oh really?

[analog monolith]

yes

posted it this time bc i wanted clarification on the inventory storage (?) but

[weary root]

are you on 1.2.2.1 no mods?

[analog monolith]

i am on cp no mods

which, in theory, should be less broken

[knotty vigil]

i usually only get infinite and long loads when I turn on a mod like randomizer and im never able to do stuff like this-

It might just be an error with your files anyways though.

[weary root]

have you had it anywhere else, or just this specific transition?

[analog monolith]

it has happened elsewhere but only seems to happen at vertical area transitions? e.g. here, or crossroads acid skip

[knotty vigil]

have you ever played with mods before, and not validated your game files afterwards?

[analog monolith]

i do play with mods and this has happened before installing any of them

it could potentially be performance? my cpu caps out with only hk running and recording + livesplit makes it a lot worse

[weary root]

I'd hate it to be performance but it wouldn't surprise me if it was framerate related

[granite field]

what kind of hardware do you have? just by curiosity

[dreamy bough]

i'm curious, sometimes i can have horizontal movement while inventory dropping. what causes that? (noticed multiple times on the fall in deepnest, from fungal entrance)

[normal aspen]

inventory storage

major glitch. if you get it duringa run just try and go straight down and it wont invalidate it

[dreamy bough]

i... dang, okay. Thanks!

[normal aspen]

That drop 8nto deepnest is the most common place to get it, just open inv slightly later and you can avoid it entirely

[frozen nest]

Quick question: does the modinstaller have everything I need to practice/run all skills NMG? Which mods are best?

[neon island]

Debug mod is likely the only one you’ll need

[frozen nest]

I forget: is the category run on 1.2.2.1? If so, does modinstaller have a downpatcher?

[neon island]

All skills NMG is 1.2.2.1, yup

And the ModInstaller does not have a downpatcher but you can get debug mod for 1221 is #resources as well as the modding api for it

[frozen nest]

Okay, I'll check that out then. Thanks!

[snow dome]

Please be aware that you can't use a Modded version of the game to run

Obviously practice is fine, but when when you actually want to do the run you need a non modded version of the game. You can use Fireborn's tutorial for down patching on speed run dot com to create multiple separate installs for practicing and actually recording.

[foggy crescent]

It's a bit sad how you can't normally die in the room from crossroads to fungal, where you need dash. Even thematically, having a spike fall down there would make a lot of sense, and it would allow lower% afaik.

[dreamy bough]

you don't need dash for low%

[granite field]

I agree that letting the possibility to die here would be interesting

with a spike fall for example yeah

[dreamy bough]

the more annoying one is all the dreamers being clawlocked tbh

[granite field]

In some randos run where you found a dreamer in crossroads, you can pogo the infected bulbs and go to the wastes but otherwise I don't think there is others possibilties without any skills picked up

[granite field]

yeah totally

I was thinking that herrah might be possible with wings but I'm not sure at all

[dreamy bough]

wings is hard claw locked :(

[granite field]

yeah true lol

I wonder how a modded run where you start with claws at KP would look like

[hearty adder]

rando moment

[wispy vessel]

Any tips on watcher knights for a new runner?

[hearty adder]

I'm assuming you're running any%?

[wispy vessel]

yes

[hearty adder]

I recommend you watch this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XlmjHynpIjc

[wispy vessel]

ty

[hearty adder]

If you're running on current patch, the main difference is that the fireball doesn't go as far as in 1221

[wispy vessel]

I'm running 1221

[hearty adder]

Then that video is pretty self explanatory

[dreamy bough]

i mean there's also the way, way worse fake bounces in 1221, and the fact that they do less moves from off screen in current patch :P

[cloud siren]

Yea it will dw

Ty tho

[digital jewel]

kill him before he screams

[neon island]

^

[digital jewel]

or if you know you won't make it in time then wait for after the scream

[neon island]

When that happens, it means you killed him on the exact same frame that he screams

[formal bough]

I don't think it is the exact same frame just during the scream?

[neon island]

Well, yeah, but I think there is a one frame window where that can happen

[formal bough]

your fireball could kill it after the scream occured

[neon island]

Oh yeah

[formal bough]

but before it ended

[quick meteor]

is practicing on QoL current patch the same as practicing on 1.2.2.1 in terms of any%?

[granite field]

I think yes

[digital jewel]

kind of but not really. there are some things like uumuu that are just too different

[quick meteor]

doesnt qol change uumuu HP though?

[knotty vigil]

Whats qol?

[quick meteor]

Quality of Life

[digital jewel]

yes

[knotty vigil]

A mod?

[quick meteor]

changes a bunch of things on current patch to be more like 1221

yeah

[digital jewel]

that's part of why it's not a good way of practicing for 1221

[quick meteor]

gotcha

[digital jewel]

on qol uumuu has 50 less hp than on 1221

[quick meteor]

o

thought it just made it the same

[granite field]

A mod that allow some things and speed texts for example

allow on CP*

[digital jewel]

speedmod is closer to 1221

[granite field]

Speedmod looks great tho

[glass furnace]

Does anyone know what strats aren’t possible on current patch for any% NMG? I’m just starting out and I haven’t found a way to downpatch on xbox.

[quick meteor]

where do i get speedmod from, dont see it on modinstaller

[short spire]

if you're practicing for 1221 you should just practice on 1221

[quick meteor]

but... debug mod 😦

[granite field]

Inventory drops are possible on current patch but different. You can do them but only off-ledges with a good timing
Lever skips are not possible (hitting levers through walls)

[short spire]

1221 has debug mod tho

[glass furnace]

Ok, thanks!

[short spire]

with less broken savestates than the cp one

[quick meteor]

my modinstaller is donked up and cant point to the folder where i have my 1221 hk setup

[digital jewel]

modinstaller doesn't work for 1221 anyway

you just do it manually

[granite field]

there is other things but I don't have all the knowledge of differences between 1221 and cp sorry

[quick meteor]

so much work

[short spire]

theres a video in the pins here for installing 1221 debug

trust me youll have it working in like 5 minutes

[quick meteor]

you overestimate my power

[digital jewel]

Hewwo... yeah so this is just blushes gonnya be a quick v-v-video on how t-to get youw... debug mod w-wowking on de 1.2.2.1 vewsion of Howwow sweats Knyight, since... sighs peopwe sometimes get confused by that since it's a bit diffewent fwom instawwing uhh instawwing mods on the x3 nyewest vewsion of the x3 game. Uhh so without fuwthew ado I've winked runs away this w-wittwe site in the x3 descwiption so you wannya downwoad the x3 modding API smacks w-wips fow the x3 game on 1.2.2.1. As I said I winked runs away i-it in the x3 descwiption and... as weww huggles tightly as the x3 debug mod dww which is awso in thewe. Once you have both of those you go t-to youw downwoads and they shouwd be wight hewe... obviouswy. UwU smacks w-wips

[quick meteor]

Hewwo... yeah so this is just blushes gonnya be a quick v-v-video on how t-to get youw... debug mod w-wowking on de 1.2.2.1 vewsion of Howwow sweats Knyight, since... sighs peopwe sometimes get confused by that since it's a bit diffewent fwom instawwing uhh instawwing mods on the x3 nyewest vewsion of the x3 game. Uhh so without fuwthew ado I've winked runs away this w-wittwe site in the x3 descwiption so you wannya downwoad the x3 modding API smacks w-wips fow the x3 game on 1.2.2.1. As I said I winked runs away i-it in the x3 descwiption and... as weww huggles tightly as the x3 debug mod dww which is awso in thewe. Once you have both of those you go t-to youw downwoads and they shouwd be wight hewe... obviouswy. UwU smacks w-wips

[granite field]

Yeah you're right I forget to mention that

not every ledges are worth inv dropping on cp tho

[dreamy bough]

biggest differences on the top of my head : inv drops are harder (ledge perfect), you can't skip dreamers in cutscenes, explosion pogo is harder (you can't pogo the explosion, only the spore), boss logic is different (hornet takes one more hit to stagger, wk are arguably easier, uumuu is bouncy and can't reasonably get two-cycled, thk is MUCH faster), geo is less tight, petras (the flying mantis in Queen's garden) have more hp and so are more annoying to deal with in the arena if you're going for qga, beast den eggs don't spawn spiderlings anymore

i think for any% NMG that's most of what matters?

[granite field]

CP also, generally, runs smoother for some configs (but I guess it only concerns PCs)

[dreamy bough]

oh also double spike kill is free on current patch

[quick meteor]

um ax i timed myself and it actually took six minutes so in your face

[dreamy bough]

and you can't fastkill greenpath baldur

[twin swallow]

you can't lever skip spire, no qg hazard respawn, cycles are slightly different

[quick meteor]

never overestimate me again

[dreamy bough]

and the moss knight double hit is different in a weird way

[twin swallow]

yes his hitbox has migrated to a different postal code

[digital jewel]

that moss knight just has a displaced hitbox on current patch

[granite field]

I suggest to pin somewhere a list of differences between cp and 1221
that can be helpful for some people

[jagged vault]

there's the vys video

[granite field]

oh yeah true

[jagged vault]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D68LWbb2GO4

this compares the paches

focuses more of the negatives of CP though

[haughty fossil]

list of positives of CP:

• more consistent enemy spawns
• the devout left of herrah doesn't respawn after you kill herrah
• higher framerate
• You can kill Crystal Guardian while he's still just chilling on his bench
• Aspid arena doublespike is made significantly easier
• Enemies jumping into ceilings doesn't make your jump input die
• Fireballs are eaten by walls a little less
• Isma's spike tunnel is easier due to hitbox shenanigans
• Trinomi planks is "free"