career-advice

[brittle thorn]

Lol where did to get that impression

It is

[vapid jay]

It's my dream job. I haven't worked a day since I got there. I cherish it and am mad that somehow this person was hired who is absolutely a disaster and not technically qualified for the role.

Let alone, lies about the "work" they're doing. Considering work is protected with a certain number of safeguards, this means that you cannot work if 4800 is your most recent event code.

[brittle thorn]

Why i advised him to quit lol

[vapid jay]

It's just touchy because chain of command

[void tundra]

In times past, if I have personal issues with a co-worker regardless of their position to me, I just work it out. If I feel they're not performing, I diplomatically bring it up with them.

If my issue with someone over me and they negatively impact company I work for, I take that straight over their head. Just say hey, I noticed a,b,c about X and thought you may want to know. Stated as neutral as possible.

[vapid jay]

if X wasn't in my chain, way diff approach. This one is... hard. A hard darn call to make. Mine to make, but hard.

It isn't neutral at this point though @void tundra

[brittle thorn]

Write a letter if face to face is hard

[void tundra]

And for me, doesn't make a lick of difference what their position is. I've complained about owners to owners

[vapid jay]

As much as I wish it was, that X had appeared on my radar because of Z task.................................... To say otherwise is a lie. I'm all about the ethics. Love your responses. Well done, very well done.

[vapid jay]

No, that's cowardly here =/

[void tundra]

If they're hurting the company, that's not neutral. But how you inform the powers that be can be presented in a neutral way as it is not your circus

[vast shoal]

I think it seems a little unhealthy to get so worked up about this that you're considering some kind of elaborate plot to exact revenge on them for not working hard enough.

[brittle thorn]

Then do the brave and right thing soldier

[vapid jay]

I love a good circus......
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1rAGCt3feXQ

[vapid jay]

I worked hard to get here.... I left the Corps to get where I'm at in life.

I treat this job, like I did my last lifetime. I'm almost there too... That song is special to me.

I've almost been out for longer now than I was in.

I ain't no Sgt no more.... I'm something else. I treasure what "it" is, where I am at.

[summer roost]

You can, of course. And we've already given opinions about whether you should. You won't get a different answer by just asking us the same question over and over.

[vapid jay]

I'd be a Sergeants Major, or Gunny, etc... I left to get out and pursue the greener grass on the other side that had jack to do with my MOS.

[brittle thorn]

Things wont end if you do things right and keep yourself free of wrongdoing...there is a next job

[twilit forum]

lemme get this straight, you built a tool for monitoring your coworkers?

[void tundra]

You're taking a lot of things that seem to be pretty objective and adding a lot of unnecessary depth. If there is something management would want to know, inform them.

[summer roost]

I think that your new proposed wording is better than your previous wording

[vapid jay]

I jealously guard it, and what it means to be, what I do.

@ I have informed them @void tundra

Yes @twilit forum -- I was tasked by D to view Z from a layer 8 perspective and in the process snarfed the event ids of 4800 and 4801 where 01 is logged on. I did some math, wrote some code poof. Now just make it iterate. Have fun kids 🙂

[vapid jay]

Yeah but its that burn. You cannot go over someone's head about them if you don't have the common decency to give them a chance to fix whatever your beef is.

@void tundra -- I asked them not to proceed to HR. but I did inform.

The contingency was on the further lessening of baggery. the lessening has been inverse. Z was a gift.

[summer roost]

That might well be enough for them. In fact, I expect it would. There's enough unvaccinated people in the country that this is probably not a novel situation for them. They'll probably accept that it may take you a few weeks to get vaccinated. They likely would be OK with you working remotely while getting the vaccine in order, though no one here would be able to guarantee that.

[vapid jay]

Hell, the Z algorithm.......... FUN to write.

[void tundra]

If it negatively affects the company and the problem is my supervisor, the appropriate and default business response is to go over their head.

[buoyant seal]

Well. Yet another attempt to hire a person ended in the same way.

3 months we needed to hire Frontend dev. I tried to do that. Failed. Learned quickly junior level of frontending from zero to Vue.js/jest/SASS within a matter of few weeks and succesfully did the task

Today I needed to find copyrighter. Instead of hiring him eventually I decided to write the content on my own
I have a full domain knowledge regarding the subject anyway.
I think it would be just quickler / better in topic. And I get some help from Grammarly. Perhaps I would be able to do it.

I suck at hiring. It is easier just to do the job on my own. Even if it is not that familiar one for me
I don't have patience for finding the people 😉
I'll just try to complete hopefully the task, and perhaps copyrighter will not be even needed. I hope.

[twilit forum]

I honestly think you sound like a super obnoxious person.

[vapid jay]

Not where I was taught. I have to talk with them, and first. Or with witnesses. but first. otherwise I didn't earn my stripes.

Sorry but not sorry you feel that way. Why @twilit forum ?

[void tundra]

Doesn't matter what you're taught. A business is a machine, opinions don't turn the gears.

[vapid jay]

It's not how I was raised. How I was raised matters. Can't shift for anything. It's how I was taught.

I have to tell X about X's problems before X += 1. Period. Otherwise, what a chump I am.

I just thought it novel today a prob for z yielded something for x which i've dwelt on for many months now.

[twilit forum]

You shouldn't be sorry, you do what you think it right.
But you're simultaneously making a chicken out of a feather here, while also doing some pretty weird things. Monitoring your coworkers is kinda strange.

From my p.o.v.

[brittle thorn]

Then tell maybe he will change maybe not...be prepared for explosions lol

[regal tundra]

ive found myself on a discord server that casts itself as a DAO focused on collaborating toward and eventually monetizing various AI tools. The people seem serious and based on my expertise I think the AI tools they're going for seem achievable w/ focused work. However, I don't understand and thus don't know if I trust the scheme behind DAOs, and am worried that i will never actually see any return for any contributions I make, even if the tools are successfully monetized. Can anyone explain to me how to approach the right way to approach this space without burning bridges?

sry for being so garbly im still waking up

[void tundra]

Then the decision of approach is up to you since it is off course from the default route. I think, if there were a formal procedure written for this situation, what would it be.

If the problem with X is personal, yes, it is on you to talk to them. If it affects the business, not your decision to make.

[vapid jay]

Absolutely. 100% why it isn't a PR to the comp. repo. Not sure if it will be. Also the problem with saying I can produce the report to begin with.

It was an investigation an I was asked to hunt. Logs are 101 for hunting. Just made me say hmm. Locked workstation, interesting Bob, interesting.

[summer roost]

@whole wasp if you do decide to get vaccinated for this job, honesty will be your best policy. "I held off on getting the vaccine because X and Y, but I don't want to lose this opportunity, and I'm willing to get vaccinated. I've (gotten my first shot|made an appointment to get my first shot), and I expect to get my second shot by $date.". I think that maximizes the chances that they will be happy to keep you on.

[vapid jay]

I'm glad others who weren't where I'm from aren't mad if I skip X. That does feel good.

[regal tundra]

i guess the overall question is in the neighborhood of: 1) wtf is a DAO? 2) can i trust them as a springboard for early career development or are they more like a slowburning scam

[twilit forum]

Yupp, there's definitely some bad workplace practices going on, but you're part of them.

[vast shoal]

It sounds very risky. I would just not, personally. I don't think there is a safe way to approach it.

[vapid jay]

It affects the business in ways that are very bad. Bad bad bad. @void tundra

[summer roost]

That's quite a rude thing to say. Bear our code of conduct in mind.

[vast shoal]

The idea is an organization whose rules and decision-making is governed by a blockchain.

[brittle thorn]

Bad is bad do good and stop that bad thing

[vapid jay]

Cause I'm the hacker? how so? I was asked to hunt z. z is a human. z has qualities of a thief. i make report on thief. i also multi-task and deal with X on a daily basis.

X causes my young jedis to want to quit the order. X pisses me off more than I care to explain.

I used my skills to write something useful. Not sure how it makes me an asshole.

[vast shoal]

And yeah, as interesting as it is on a technical level, blockchain technology is extremely ripe with scams.

[vapid jay]

I know... dangit i know. I hate fighting though =..... What a fight.

[void tundra]

So you know X is doing very bad things for the company. X is not a subordinate. But you're not informing management. From the businesses I've ran and my own company, I would not be happy with you.

[regal tundra]

the stuff they're doing is stuff i could do by myself, but it seems like doing it in the context of their organization increases the likelihood that my work will be eventually seen/used since their existing contributors seem particularly capable at web design and advertising (but only a little at AI stuff tbh!)

[summer roost]

I don't need it. Pay it forward: in the future, offer other people advice like I'm doing for you now, when you're in a position to do so.

[twilit forum]

Yupp, I wouldn't want to work with a person who takes it upon themselves to police their coworkers.

[vapid jay]

If you're management then you already know. You agreed with me that if X continuted to be an issue, then we kick to HR, but ONLY after I discuss with X the problems.

This talk? I don't want it. Never in my life have I ever been in a situation like this. I've been to war 4 times in 2 countries.

[void tundra]

Lol so you have spoken to management about it

[vapid jay]

Why am I dealing with a child.... It blows my mind. But it has to happen. I just dread it because it's tough speaking up.

[vapid jay]

Damn right. My guys wanna quit. 😦 No joke here.

[twilit forum]

It was a comment on their behaviour, not meant as an insult to their person.
Poorly worded on my part.

[void tundra]

Lawdy, you gave all the schpeel about not going to management first and you weren't telling us that you already have

[vapid jay]

Then you don't know what impartiality is about.

You are right, there is ethics to this. The story of X though.... Oh what a story.

See this here story is more like a story about a nail in a coffin for X.

[vapid jay]

You missed it. Scroll back and read the stryngs 🙂 I mentioned it, way back way.

[brittle thorn]

Yes this is indeed a problem in many companies with multiple layers of management...the lack of transparency and accountability and only the good news bubbles up while the bad stuff stays hidden and fester

[void tundra]

I know what you said before, you didnt say management. You just alluded to a sworn spectre. I assumed a friend of X

[vapid jay]

But once I say something.... The andrea gail just got tossed.

? is high level mgmt. I've been here a while.

[void tundra]

One of the reasons I've started my own company is to change the culture 😀

[vapid jay]

I love the culture there...

[twilit forum]

You've built a tool for automatically surveillancing your coworkers, that's real fucked up imo.

[brittle thorn]

I have tried that but chose the wrong biz partners lol

[vapid jay]

It can be abused yes. Theft is theft though no? It's just event codes 4800 and 4801.

@twilit forum We have folks work on their computers for a reason. Compliance matters. They cannot say they're working if they're not logged in.

[void tundra]

I've heard so many horror stories haha I managed to find a way to start solo

[twilit forum]

So? You didn't know that before making the tool

[vapid jay]

If they use a jiggler, bravo... Bravo... I'll catch them later... Bravo. I'll congratulate them, but I won't have them fired. Hell, I might hire them.

[vapid jay]

Oh I did.............. I study layer 8, a lot. You tend to pick up on the bullshit peg.

[brittle thorn]

I had a solo enterprise for 9 years...not too lucky when I worked with cofounders after that

[void tundra]

I'm heading to bed, all the conversations tonight running in some hard circles 😂😂

[brittle thorn]

Alrighty good night lol

[vapid jay]

@twilit forum It's a dilemma though. Using this method to burn Z allows me to burn X. burning X is well warranted and the proverbial nail in the coffin; all but assured at their trajectory. Y though. Dang. I did the math...... The curve is interesting and built to the logs which I could parse.

I saw the human over the last 7 days. Gazed into the belly of the beast and know who does what..........

[twilit forum]

You sound like a complete drama-queen who actually thrives in this but is making excuses that you're not.
I hope this works out for you man.

[vapid jay]

@twilit forum Imagine if you would a group X @ say 100 people. X is /.

Y and Z exist.

Y works 40 hours a week.

Z works 30.

You also have A.

Shitbags. ~ 20 hrs.

[summer roost]

It could be that it's an option, but they don't want to mention it because they don't want it to be the default option. It could be because people can test negative while being carriers, or because they don't want to pay for tests, or any number of other reasons. A lot of people are quite fed up with people who won't get vaccinated. They could just not want to hire people who have refused the vaccine, regardless of whether they're bringing the disease into the office.

[vapid jay]

@twilit forum Where I come from we code homie. You do it on the machine we pay for. If you don't like it do not let the door hit ya on the way out.

You're making what I'm speaking about something way oTHER than what it is. Stop it.

You sound like an A. Just sayin.

You're not allowed to code on your personal device.

[hazy oriole]

what ?

[vapid jay]

period. So no. I'm not an arse @twilit forum . It's called compartmentalization and big-boy institutions do it.

[summer roost]

@vapid jay I think you're not going to get any answers or conversation here beyond what has already been discussed.

I think this conversation has run its course.

[vapid jay]

Yeah, I'm rambling @summer roost 🙂

[hazy oriole]

ha

[vapid jay]

Noon comes quick, soon and fast. What to do, what to do.

[hazy oriole]

nothing to do, nothing to do

[vapid jay]

@void tundra -- your advice is most welcome tonight. Seriously thank you. I will be going your route of advice.

[hazy oriole]

hmm

[hazy oriole]

what are u talking about ?

[smoky quest]

finding people is tough.
But it's also a great experience to have

[vapid jay]

@twilit forum -- Before I go. Imagine if you were, an owner of a company. Covid hits and you got to let employees work from home or your company won't exist.

There exists a sector which abuse the trust instilled in them when we went wfh.

Would you be mad if this was a lot of dollars?

[vapid jay]

How to bring up a workplace dispute to the person you have the problem with.

[hazy oriole]

ohhh

[buoyant seal]

I would prefer to have people general screening being done by other people, so I would not waste time that inefficiently

[smoky quest]

are you the hiring manager? If so, it should be part of the process

[buoyant seal]

nah, i am just dev, it is not my duties
backend+infrastructure are my main responsibilities

[vapid jay]

... Maybe I should hash my output.

@twilit forum has a pt. hashing would be a very gdpr way to go.

[smoky quest]

feel free to give that feedback to your manager. Their job is to set up an efficient process that does not introduce bias, gets as many potential candidates in, but without wasting too much of your time either

[buoyant seal]

well, we already talked about it just 10 minutes ago

it was decided I would write the stuff on my own, it would be faster than fnding copyhrighter

I have some experience in writing articles, general university education

• a year played in forum roleplay games
  I think I should manage writing the needed stuff
• i have grammarly support
• full domain knowledge regarding subject to write

It should be sufficient enough advantages to do the copyrighting task

[smoky quest]

so more work for you, less expenses for the company :p

can be an interesting experience to add though

[buoyant seal]

alternative would be to find the copyrighter, which I would have to find too
I hate wasting time in finding people 😉
It is faster to do it on my own, than finding the person

[smoky quest]

the benefit kicks in after. The team can do more and it gives you and your manager more growth opportunities in leadership/mentoring

[summer roost]

I'd assume she'd want a copy for the company's records.

[smoky quest]

some documents have to be physically signed on by someone of trust. Could be a notary, or some specific folks at the company

ex: https://www.uscis.gov/i-9

[warped sparrow]

hello

[whole wasp]

I have high cholesterol vaccine cause any problems with that?

[smoky quest]

If she explicitly mentioned the vaccination proof, then yeah.
But at this stage, you are spending more time about worrying about it than anything. There aren't many solutions to it. Either they are open to accommodate you or they won't.

[smoky quest]

You should stop trying to wiggle your way around. That would only make you sound ridiculous and laughed at

If they require it, they won't give up and won't let you continue to work there without a good reason. It's not something you can manufacture

[buoyant seal]

In earlier career stage I think benefits are better to do every task on my own.
I mean, if tasks would be delegated, i would not have tried a hand in frontend and infrastructure development
and hell yeah, I like infrastructure stuff

That's a small benefit of micro startup, you can try everything
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c6rP-YP4c5I

Basically I get to try a lot of hard skills ;b

[summer roost]

Over 4 billion people have gotten at least one dose of a covid vaccine. Many of those will have had high cholesterol. We're not doctors, but you should be fine.

Scratch that, over 4 billion are fully vaccinated.

[smoky quest]

That's not a question for random forums on the Internet.
Per the CDC website, I don't see any counter indication for high cholesterol

If you have some fears or doubts, talk to a doctor.

[summer roost]

That should tell you which one is the bigger risk to your health.

[smoky quest]

Note that if anything, people with high BMI are at higher risk without being vaccinated than whatever risk any of the covid vaccine could hypothetically create

[twilit forum]

Maybe you can start, start with a lower salary than you have, police your coworkers, brown nose to no end, the model employee!

[smoky quest]

lmao Shakira's Wisdom.
But yeah, at the end of the day, it's somewhere in between. It's easier to lead if you understand what it entails

[ivory bison]

Hello

[brittle thorn]

Ask a Medical Doctor.. in general the vaccine is safe. I have medical issues myself and I had 3 doses already

[gusty topaz]

what are the commands "Floor" and "Ceil" mean?

[stiff rain]

Hii

vaccine is important

i also vaccinated

no u will feel nothing

it's okk

[whole wasp]

For now at least I could be dead in 5 years cuz of it

[stiff rain]

you will not die

[whole wasp]

No one has any long term data how can u say that?

im gonna try to sleep now hopefully everything works out 😦

[dense mesa]

Yes, what help do you need?

If you're not doing academic tutoring, you're basically looking at freelancing websites such as Fiverr

Start with your local community and education institutions, just offer free tutoring initially as a trial run

It's fairly challenging starting out, I would wait til you're comfortable doing it before charging. Lets you get clients in the meantime too

If you tutor a level CS, you'll be teaching programming along the way regardless

It's harder to just "teach programming" without the defined learning outcomes that make it clear what the student knows and needs to work on

[granite grail]

man i dont know what my future job is

[twilit forum]

And you're two for two in the lack of spine department.
But thanks for the armchair psych eval.

[dense mesa]

The rates for tutoring are about twice as much as the typical student job

Online tutoring is consistently a better source of income but I understand the benefits of customer service roles

There's a multitude of reasons people don't go for that, the main one being you get what you pay for

Yes, people will undercut online tutors a lot, but the reason there's still such high demand is because there's no language barriers, and people are being tutored directly for their exam specifications

Anyone with decent A level grades is able to earn bare minimum £15/hr if they're new to tutoring, if you're good you can get £40-50/hr

That's online as well as in person

Not sure why someone would use Upwork when there are so many tutoring service providers freely available in the UK

The barrier to entry for tutoring is fairly low, as long as you understand the subject enough to go through an exam spec and help with homework, that's basically it

I'm not sure why there's such a strong argument against this when so many students do online tutoring to earn money, and they're not extremely knowledgeable in the topic

I never advised to use Fiverr :)

[dense mesa]

If I didn't make it clear enough, this is saying to do academic tutoring because otherwise you have to use websites like Fiverr

[near ocean]

mfw my university isnt on their list

welp there goes all the motivation i had in tutoring python

imagine having manchester metropolitan and not other unis above it in rankings

[dense mesa]

I would recommend looking at these tutoring websites and their rates before forming an idea of the competition

Yes, you will actually get work, this service is in incredible demand which has only increased over the past 2 years due to covid. People are free to work service jobs as well if they want, but tutoring is still a brilliant way of learning interpersonal skills and how to develop people.

You keep denying different aspects of tutoring despite it being a healthy and growing industry for student work in the UK. If you haven't done it yourself in this specific region, I'm not sure where you're getting this information from

[brittle thorn]

And eventually become a corporate IT trainer lol

Done one corporate IT training gig...paid well time wise

[near ocean]

90k for a job that could be done by a powershell script :/

they could probably cut him loose and keep the script saving 90k + employment costs in the process

there is about 0% chance a law firm would not include an IP clause in their own employees' contracts
and they dont need to know what it does, it'll keep running until they make a change in their process

its fine to fantasize i guess, but keep in mind this is reddit

it also probably costs a fraction to hire someone to maintain a simple script, powershell/bash/whatever isnt rocket science

[crimson wadi]

hey guys new here and new to python too

....

[hazy oriole]

yo

?

[crimson wadi]

thanks though

so what this channel of discussion about

[vapid jay]

nice meeting you guys, i just joined

i wanna land a remote job in python or web design, but i dont really know where to start, anybody here willing to help me out?

[unborn sedge]

Hello

I wish to know what should I aim for with python as a core

[vapid jay]

how much experience do you have with python and web design?

[whole compass]

Hi, could anyone help point me in the right detection. I’m 18 years old from the Uk and close to finishing my second year in college doing a completely different subject. I started learning python about 2 and abit years ago and kept coding consistently ever since. Should I start making a portfolio and try applying for jobs or go on to do further education. I’ve looked at CS papers from college and could easily complete them. But it would cost money and another 2 years. What’s your suggestions ?

[unborn sedge]

I just a company and they are gonna train us....I would like to know what could u achieve with python as a core

Within 1 or 2 years

[vapid jay]

have you considered a graduate apprenticeship? it sounds perfect for ur situation

[whole compass]

Would I still be able to do this as the course I’m currently on is a btec? I’ll have a better look when I get home.

[vapid jay]

i would research graduate apprenticeships in comp-sci - you get a job related to your chosen field, and the company you work for covers your degree costs. its great because you get experience as well as a qualification so you're already a step up on people studying a degree alone. i think natwest offers them, but i could be wrong on that. it doesnt matter what youve studied before, as long as you meet their entry requirements you're all good!

[whole compass]

Thank you for the help. I’ll have a deeper look into it👍

[near ocean]

why would things cost millions just because a script that moves files around stopped working, if it was that important they wouldnt be paying a single dude to do anything

[vapid jay]

people who arent in tech roles dont know how difficult different levels of coding are. this wouldnt happen in a big company like apple / amazon etc that is aware, but the situation in the reddit story could easily happen for small law firms and similar businesses. its.. not that deep?

[near ocean]

sounds like defrauding and lying to your employer to me tbh

[vapid jay]

if you think thats bad just wait until u hear what jeff bezos does to his employees lmao

[near ocean]

no lol, youre hired to perform specific duties as per your contract and not tune out the moment standup ends, try and play dumb with your current employer and see if that works out for your as well lmao

[vapid jay]

but they are performing their specific duties

they give their employer what they need, their employer gives them what they need. everyone wins

[near ocean]

checking a script once a day and being afk the rest of your time on the job is not performing your duties and you'll never find any judge out there to side with you

[vapid jay]

if u hire me to pick up an apple every day and i build a robot that does that, am i breaking the rules? this feels more philosophical than realistic but it gets the point across

[near ocean]

sure you wouldnt be sued but you cant sue back for wrongful termination if the dude's playing fucking halo on company time lol
i sure hope if you really believe this is right you practice what you preach

[vapid jay]

but the job gets done.. its not like he's not completing the task because he's skiving off

[near ocean]

why wouldnt you sue if you were wrongfully terminated?

[vapid jay]

its a blessing that we live in a time where code can do in minutes what would take days manually. all hail the incoming four day work week

[near ocean]

it wont even go to trial if its true, employers settle instantly

[vapid jay]

also what would u do in his shoes out of curiosity? leave ur job and hand them the solution for free when u were previously getting 90k?

[near ocean]

lmao? are you?

[vapid jay]

yes?

[near ocean]

i would certainly not post on reddit lmao, what a braindead move to make

im sorry, does the law change based on my employment?

[vapid jay]

so you're not mad at his actions, but that he shared them? and what a cool way to basically say you're not working

[near ocean]

pretty sure i've stated whether im working or not before, in this channel as well, if you want to be lazy be my guest

i have to ask now, are you trolling?

[vapid jay]

this is blowing out of proportion now so im out

[near ocean]

im not mad at all, defending something like this is just insane

[fair kiln]

I need a guidance on my career path way. I’m a student currently attending high school but do not want to further my career in college instead I would love to land a job in software development without a college degree. Does anyone have any advise on how I would be able to achieve this?

[summer roost]

Don't do that to yourself. Get the degree instead, if it's at all an option for you.

It is much, much easier to get a successful career as a software developer if you have a degree than if you don't. Deciding against getting a degree when you have the option of getting the degree is giving yourself a totally unnecessary handicap.

[vapid jay]

if college is free and accessible to you then the commenter above is 100% right - please get a degree, it doesnt even need to be directly related to software engineering or computer science. i know people working in tech who studied geography, for example. that being said, if you seriously cant access college, try working on freecodecamp or codecademy and getting some certificates, and creating some projects for a portfolio.

(also as i said before, modern / graduate apprenticeships are a great way to work and make money whilst also getting a degree / qualification)

I completely agree, getting a degree is very beneficial, however do note that from personal experience, it's way easier to learn by yourself... at least at our uni some technology is quite obsolete

so ideally you should do as much work as possible by yourself, from your own interest

[snow geyser]

Started 2nd sem moved to Java why 😭

I’m a first year CS major, I suggest you look at the course structure there’s probably some data science course.

[whole wasp]

The mandates are being taken away

[smoky quest]

Whatever policies were in effect at your past employers or your neighbors or your friends' have strictly no bearing on any other employer

[whole wasp]

can’t do anything right now and see what they say as I said they didn’t say it’s “required”. From another job I got interviewed at this was their policy “Due to the issuance of Executive Order 14042 which effectively mandates COVID-19 vaccination for all U.S. based employees of federal contractors and subcontractors, all U.S. based employees will be required to be fully vaccinated by January 18th, 2022, or by their first date of employment if after
that date, subject to legally required accommodations.” Not sure what the accommodation part means but if this company was ok with accommodations mine should to. The thing about my job is it’s mostly remote they said they want me to stay remote as much as possible. If I need to go in I get tested.

[smoky quest]

You are still trying to wiggle your way around. The exact wording of their email doesn't matter. They can still reject you any time
What matters is if they are ok with an employee behaving like you and how you would look like to your colleagues/HR

[whole wasp]

Ok. But did u see the part about the other company and their policy. What does accommodations part mean? Does that mean they will take exemption testing etc?

[smoky quest]

their house, their rule.

[near ocean]

accommodations probably means if you have certain conditions stopping you from taking the vaccine, not because you dont want to take it

[vapid jay]

why do you not want the vaccine?

[summer roost]

The best option is still to get your first shot now, and tell them when you'll have your second one. If you try to push for some sort of exemption, they may hire you, or they may not. Being in an at-will state gives them an awful lot of discretion.

[whole wasp]

I still don’t know who gives me the form, hr or I have to call my religious institution to get it. I also spoke to an employment lawyer to see if they can help me

[summer roost]

That sounds like a very good choice. I'm sure they can give better advice than we can, since they should know the relevant state, local, and federal laws.

Lawyers aren't just for suing. They're also for legal advice.

[near ocean]

Its not black and white

[summer roost]

I don't know, I'm not an employment lawyer.

[near ocean]

Thats not very helpful, why even bother replying

[summer roost]

It's good advice to say that, if you're not willing to get the vaccine you should be prepared to walk away from the job.

It's also good advice to say that you should get the vaccine.

Beyond that, I'm unconvinced that comments about American individualism or litigiousness have any bearing on what this guy should do.

He should get vaccinated, if he won't, he should research (preferably with the help of an expert) what his options are, and he should be prepared to walk away from the job if that conversation doesn't go the way he wants.

[smoky quest]

a lawyer could articulate the different legal options and trade offs.
However, when you have to talk about legal options in terms of joining a new company, that's not a very good start

[near ocean]

Its a terrible start and it sounds like he'd have a target on his back from day 1

[summer roost]

Indeed. Even if the company grants a religious exemption of some sort, I'd imagine that they won't like that you've started using the law to strong arm them out of enforcing policies that they put in place to keep their workers safe even before you started working.

!rule 6

[inner wren]

Rules

6. Do not post unapproved advertising.

[whole wasp]

Got a call from a recruiter for another company. Says they want vax and no exceptions. Then says if I can get a note from doc they will accept it

[summer roost]

I would expect job options for the unvaccinated to become increasingly limited.

[whole wasp]

Even if the doc says “ he can’t take the vax until this date or something or until further notice” should be fine I think

[graceful mason]

If you can't be vaccinated because you're part of a protected group (immunocompromised, religion with prohibition) they can't discriminate when hiring you. That means they need to offer reasonable accommodation if possible - i.e. if your job can physically be done working from home, they need to give you that option. They only need to make accomodation if the alternative is discrimination

[smoky quest]

And then what? Either you are vaccinated by that date or your are out.
Or they just hire someone else and not have to deal with the burden. And if you are too argumentative, you may also not be worth the troubles.

[whole wasp]

“until further notice”

[smoky quest]

that would be the same as being exempt from it.
What is their incentive to have a "until further notice"?

So either you are exempt or you are expected to achieve that goal by X

[summer roost]

no doctor will write you a note that says "this guy can't get the vaccine until further notice". If you have a medical condition that makes getting vaccinated a major health risk for you, they'll say that you should not get vaccinated. If you don't have any such health condition, a responsible doctor shouldn't write you any note at all, since lying about that could lose them their medical license.

[dense mesa]

Can only speak from the UK/NHS but my dad has written those types of notes for people, it's not uncommon here

There are conditions which prevent staff or just people from getting vaccinated until the ailments subside

[summer roost]

Hm. I'd expect the note to say that the shot is only contraindicated until the ailment subsides, but perhaps not.

[smoky quest]

I would also expect the concerned person to already be aware of this and not asking if religious exemptions are easier to get

[dense mesa]

Fair enough, I haven't been following the conversation so depends on their circumstances

[whole wasp]

I’m so confused one of my friends from 3 years ago blocked me over this. Like nothing has even been decided. Why do ppl get so hurt over other peoples choices holy....

[vast shoal]

Probably because it's not just a subjective preference, like how some people choose to be doctors and others choose to be lawyers, it's a choice that not only endangers yourself but also other people around you.

I would guess that's your friend's reasoning.

[whole wasp]

Ya me not getting vaxed is endangering others while u can get Covid even when vaxed.

[vast shoal]

If you're vaccinated, you are less likely to be infected in the first place, even if it doesn't reduce that risk to 0. Also, it decreases the severity of the disease if you do get infected, which means you'll recover more quickly and have less time to infect others. It also decreases infectiousness while you have the disease.

It significantly reduces the risk of infecting others, all in all.

!rule 9 @ocean ether

[inner wren]

Rules

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[vast shoal]

Also see the channel description

[vapid jay]

um wtf is a ethical hacker

and are they in high demand

[vast shoal]

I think it's just a fancy word for pen tester. You are employed by companies to test their IT security defense measures and see if you can break in despite their best efforts. I have no insight into what the demand looks like.

[vapid jay]

i see

[oak carbon]

What are the prospects for someone looking at software developement?

[vast shoal]

Prospects in what sense?

Of getting a job? If so, what's your background?

[oak carbon]

Like, what jobs am I looking at? Can I work from home? How much will I earn, etc

[vast shoal]

I mean, you're looking at being a software developer, to write code in order to create software, to power web apps, backend systems, games, machine learning systems, etc.

Remote jobs do exist to some extent. The pay tends to be good compared to a lot of other industries.

[oak carbon]

My background is I'm looking at starting a degree in a couple of years, and software development seems a bit fun, but something I could actually get money doing

[oak carbon]

Pretty much anything like that. I might also be interested in incorporating a commercial music degree (a music program software dev?) and you guys have experience in coding so I'm just curious what that job is going to be like

[vast shoal]

Music programs do exist, but I don't know how likely it is to land a job developing music software (I mean that literally, I have no idea).

I personally enjoy it tremendously, but it's probably quite subjective. Maybe you can get started learning programming (in this server for example), and see if you enjoy it.

Writing code is the core activity, so it's a good idea to see if you love it or hate it.

[oak carbon]

I've taken a couple of classes but I've basically forgotten everything. I hoped this server would help!

[oak carbon]

Ok, thanks!

[summer roost]

Like I said yesterday: people are becoming very frustrated by those who are refusing vaccines. Which is why I recommended strongly against tipping your hand and letting the company figure out that you're unvaccinated before you've figured out exactly what you want to tell them.

[whole wasp]

And how do I do that?

[summer roost]

Unless you have a very good reason why you cannot be vaccinated, you shouldn't be surprised if the company considers your vaccination status a giant red flag.

[whole wasp]

I have to tell them for them to figure it out they are asking me to send hiring paperwork by eod on Friday in there it mentions vax. I’ll just reply with the paperwork filled that I need an exemption

[summer roost]

Figure out whether you're willing to get the vaccine. If you are, get the first shot and tell them when you're getting the second. If you're not, figure out which type of exemption you're asking for, and then tell them you're not vaccinated, here's why, and ask them what they'd like to do.

[spare hedge]

What all langs are thought usually in first year of software engineering?

[whole wasp]

There’s many remote opportunities in other states such as Florida and Texas etc

[vapid jay]

I think I need some help with a code...

As a beginner, I don't understand 90% of that code

[gritty rivet]

This is the career channel, check out #❓｜how-to-get-help

[vapid jay]

oh. sorry, my bad

[summer roost]

You can always take one of those jobs.

[whole wasp]

Just got to my docs appointment

as someone was saying the mandates are going away

[summer roost]

I'd expect many companies to keep vaccine mandates for years to come. But, if you want to bet that they won't, that's your choice to make.

[near ocean]

Did you ever answer people's question about why you dont want to do the vaccine and get it over with?

[whole wasp]

They just tested me for Covid using the rapid one and it’s negative

[autumn holly]

HI

HRU ALL HOW IS UR DAY

[near ocean]

My guy #ot2-never-nester’s-nightmare

[whole wasp]

@near ocean well currently I’m already sick I’m having some breathing problems that the vaccine may or not do anything to it. Other is long term side effects. Plus the Ingredients may have allergic reaction. The biggest thing is just the unexpectedness

[near ocean]

Ok, im not a doctor but you dont need a doctor to tell you that youre not gonna get a medical exemption for those reasons
So i guess the only advice we can give you is to give up on the job in favour of something remote or to be prepared to be instantly dropped the moment they find out you fudged a medical exemption or any other exemption

Other than that, good luck i guess

[rustic schooner]

Another thing to consider is that you could unexpectedly get covid and with breathing problems already it might hit hard. The risk of that might outweigh the risk of other side effects, esp with it alr sticking around for so long. But its completely your call

[near ocean]

I have not seen breathing problems come up as possible side effects for the vaccine, its the usual vaccine sideeffects and blood clotting issues

[summer roost]

Right, @rustic schooner was saying the opposite: someone with breathing problems should get the vaccine, because COVID in unvaccinated people is known to wreck the lungs, and will likely exacerbate the existing breathing problem.

[graceful mason]

Depends on what modules you take but you could expect to see Java, Python, C++, or C

[true harness]

maybe even lisp or Haskell

[summer roost]

Or possibly Rust. And possibly JS.

[graceful mason]

Chuck in matlab as well for certain courses

[spare hedge]

Uh so u get to choose or it’s based per university wise ?

[near ocean]

Yes i was referring to their concerns about the vaccine possibly causing their lung issues in their most recent comment

[summer roost]

Right. Ok, I think we're all on the same page.

[near ocean]

Its a uni by uni thing, you dont get to choose what langs to use most of the time

[graceful mason]

It'll be based on the university and modules you select - for example in my one (UK) the standard language is Java, AI modules use python, Embedded uses C and Assembly

[spare hedge]

Oh I see, I was thinking of grasping the general knowledge of one of those Langs to have a better start of my college as this fall I’ll be applying

[graceful mason]

Solid idea, if you're lucky the university might have the languages they use on their website, or you might be able to find it on a forum online. It's unlikely that Python will be the main language because they'll use something like Java to teach OOP principles

[summer roost]

If you don't know Python, I'd start there. If you do, I'd learn C or JavaScript next, depending on your interests.

[whole wasp]

I just did a Covid test if it was any accurate it came back as negative it was rapid tho. The home test kits. I know medical exemption would be difficult but that’s why I want to just go with the religious exemption route

However as another company said they would only accept medical note so im worried my current company may do the same

[spare hedge]

Mhm I started off with python and as a matter of fact I’m learning the various class methods etc… once I’m done I might as well get a basic syntax hold of Java as which colleges I’m thinking majority of those teach Java in the first year…

[summer roost]

That's a reasonable choice, too.

[whole wasp]

The only thing I’m trying to figure out if one exemption doesn’t work how can I justify asking if I can use a different exemption and do I try medical first or religious? And which one of gets rejected first has the 2nd one more likely to get approved

Going with medical first and if that fails then doing religion seems better than the other way around but idk the reason why I would be needing another exemption

[true harness]

are you asking how to trick your future employer?

[void tundra]

I think your best bet at this poi t is asking in a discord/reddit related to employment and not Python. You've been debating this with yourself here for 24hrs nearly with no resolution

White this # is career discussion, the question has ever been specifically related to getting a python related programming position

[summer roost]

You can't. It will be immediately obvious to the employer that you don't have a genuine reason for the exemption, and they will retract the job offer.

[void tundra]

If I were a mod here, I'd be closing this conversation up, it's off topic and circular with no specific end point, getting to the level I'm getting troll vibes

[lean ravine]

.

[summer roost]

Your opinion is noted, but you are not a mod here.

[void tundra]

Agreed, just pointing it out

[summer roost]

That's less helpful than you think.

[void tundra]

Oh you are a mod! Haha

[summer roost]

🙂

[whole wasp]

Well this issue will be over by tonight as I’ll be sending the email

Apologize to anyone if I came off badly. Been here for a long time but never posted as didn’t know how to handle this. I think it’s pretty much over the doc said they couldn’t give me a note so my only option is religious exemption or get the vax if they allow. Nothing more to talk about just gotta write the email and see where it goes. At this point if I lose the job I’ve already accepted that as well. It may be too late to fix anything anyways

The only thing is if they reject the religious Exemption would they still allow me to start if I get vaccinated. I might just say since im desperate for a job I’m gonna go against my religious beliefs since I’m having a hard time financially at that point

[summer roost]

They may or may not, I don't think there's any way we can make an informed guess.

I honestly think the option that would be most likely to allow you to keep the job would be to say that you have been putting off getting vaccinated because you worked at home and rarely left the house, that now that you know the job requires vaccines you are going to get vaccinated, and to give them a date by which you'll have the second shot.

[whole wasp]

I told the other company who just asked if I got the doc note that I didn’t get it and they said to send an email to them that she will show to her manager of the medical conditions I have

[summer roost]

They will likely be understanding of this story (which is at least mostly true), and it will not start your relationship with them with the appearance that you're trying to get around their rules.

[whole wasp]

@summer roost can’t I try that even after trying religious exemption first

[summer roost]

You can try, but I think it's unwise, because it will make you look desperate, and willing to compromise on your principles

[rustic schooner]

My study is very broad, but Ive discovered I really like the programming subjects; moreso than the others. However I dont think im ready to give up on the others and pursue purely CS. How should I go about finding what I want to do?

[summer roost]

What are you studying?

[rustic schooner]

The english name for it would be; systems engineering, policy analysis and management

translating it literally would be technical governance, which imo is clearer

thank you!

[whole wasp]

Well I say that after they say they don’t accept religious exemption or the fact that I had medical issues/haven’t left the house thing but both after trying religious exemption first

Just trying to@figure out how to write my response for the vaccination part just thinking of saying “For the vaccine. I have a religious exemption.Please send the exemption form if you have one.”

If anyone can help me rephrase that better would really help

[smoky quest]

don't claim to have one unless you do have a religious exemption.

[whole wasp]

U mean the form it self? I thought that meant I am just letting them know. Ya i think my wording is messed up here. As I said many many companies in Florida/Texas etc I’ll just have to wait more

[smoky quest]

You are requesting a religious exemption. But neither the company nor some governmental entity have provided you one

[vapid jay]

Check your university's page for the course, they usually state which languages they use most

[whole wasp]

Here is what my friend said “I don't understand what is so confusing. Your employer is asking for proof so you respond with "I want an religious exemption", then employer will give you a covid vax declination form so you fill it out and return it to HR. Forget about religious institutions, you don't need them. NEVER EVER ask for medical exemption because you will need a doctor to approve it which most won't want to. Don't even mention getting tested unless HR mentions it. If they exempt you then you might have to get tested.

Quit reading other people's comments, they have no idea what they're talking about.

I'm in California and I still got hired to all the hospitals I applied to, I go in person and no hospitals have cared that I'm a pureblood. You're not going to lose your job or be forced to get the shot, chill out.”

[summer roost]

Yeah, you should definitely get new friends.

[near ocean]

ok first of all, anyone referring to their vaccination status as "pureblood" should immediately be removed from society

[vapid jay]

not getting the vaccine because you have weak lungs is so ironic i dont even know where to begin??

[smoky quest]

Asking for the religious exemption to the company is also the shortest way to learn about their standing on this issue.

[vapid jay]

can you study a combined / joint degree?

[summer roost]

If you're looking for someone to tell you that it's a good idea to fraudulently claim to a new employer that you're a member of a religion that forbids vaccinations, you won't get that validation here.

[graceful mason]

I still doubt that you're part of a religion that actually prohibits vaccinations

[near ocean]

out of curiosity, if they ask you what religion you're getting this exemption from, what would you say?

[whole wasp]

As I mentioned already my friend is same religion as me and he got approved at a different company so I’m not falsifying

[smoky quest]

The rule of thumb is to avoid possible legal threats to the company.
So you start an email thread with HR, manager and lawyers

[vapid jay]

How is everybody doing on this fine afternoon?

[graceful mason]

what's the confusion @dense mesa ?

[dense mesa]

It's just a really weird thing to say to someone lol

[rustic schooner]

Searching for this made me find a similar option which seems very interesting. Thank you!

[vapid jay]

No problem!

[graceful mason]

All major religions, other than certain minor Christian denominations, don't prohibit vaccinations. It's just unlikely that he's a part of one

[vapid jay]

Anyways, anyone else LOVE being vaccinated?

[whole wasp]

Does anyone know how do I word it correctly if I’m asking the form from them. “ I have a religious exemption” I am exempt through my religion” or something else?

[summer roost]

"my religion forbids vaccinations"

Be prepared to lose the job if that's a lie, or they don't believe you.

[whole wasp]

As I mentioned before this issue is over anyways I’m writing my email response it started yesterday and it’s over now

[summer roost]

You're asking them to exempt you from their vaccine mandate based on your sincerely held religious beliefs. If they Google and find out your religion doesn't forbid vaccines, you will lose the job. If they think your beliefs are not truly held, you will lose the job.

[dense mesa]

What a major religion is to you isn't gonna be a major religion to people elsewhere in the world. There's so many smaller sects and followings that it's quite disrespectful of beliefs to lump someone in with 'major' religions and say it's unlikely they believe what they may or may not believe

[true harness]

you don't have to compare based on what certain people think a major religion is. you can use statistics to show that some religions are more followed than others

[vapid jay]

We're still going at the job eh?

[whole wasp]

@summer roost as I said before my friend did it at his company and was able to get it approved. Otherwise I can maybe ask a lawyer to help me write it. But as I said before if I lose this job I have also accepted that as well. So right now all I want to write is the email and just word it properly

[near ocean]

ok, writing an email isnt exactly career discussion so lets move on from this topic

[vapid jay]

Does anybody want to work on a financial analysis project with me?

[whole wasp]

ok I’ll try to figure out that on my own

[summer roost]

You're making the wrong call. Good luck.

[dense mesa]

Doesn't change anything

[summer roost]

It's irrelevant, either way. We're not the ones he needs to convince

[whole wasp]

Ya I forgot to mention he was already working there so it’s diff than a new hire. He’s been there before these vaccine mandates

[summer roost]

Yeah, it's factually true that it will be very difficult to prove that the reason they rescinded the offer is your religion.

[whole wasp]

What do U mean hurting chances? @summer roost confused what u mean. I mean they are just gonna be like sorry we can’t rake u we need vax and will go with another candidate

[dense mesa]

So it's hurting your chances of getting the job

[smoky quest]

the point is it's gonna be a large majority of the jobs out there like that

[summer roost]

I gave you an option that would probably lead to you keeping the job. You're making a choice that will probably lead to you losing it.

That's fine, that's your choice. But no one here is going to help you justify that choice. It's not a good decision.

If you don't want to get vaccinated, you will find that the pool of companies that will hire you is small and shrinking.

And I hope you find a job you can keep.

[whole wasp]

Not Florida and Texas

this job is mostly remote if they need me go on i take a Covid test maybe once a month

[summer roost]

There are not enough software jobs in Florida and Texas for everyone who's unvaccinated.

And, even if there were, the fact that they'd be filled only by people who can't accept jobs elsewhere would severely suppress wages.

~$25 US. not very expensive, but not cheap.

[vapid jay]

I've pretty much decided that I need to make the most amount of money in the least amount of time

[void tundra]

The USPS has a website where you can get 4 test free to have on hand but it can take a couple weeks to get it in

Those are some cheap apartments!

I'm in a suburb of Dallas, Texas and a 2/3 bedroom apartment is typically $1400/month

[summer roost]

Per month?

[astral ermine]

Would it be advisable to accept contract work offer despite having a full time?
Would it mostly depend on the benefits if salary is just slightly higher?

[whole wasp]

Before I forget, would it be a good idea to tell them my old companany provided me a religious exemption form and I was able to keep working there. But I know that’s only cuz I was still working so new employees they might just be like on to the next...

[subtle heart]

it would be a lie.

I read back, if your old company has granted you a a religious exemption then you would have been through the process already and wouldn't be asking how to run the process here.

[summer roost]

No, that's totally irrelevant.

[whole wasp]

Ya but it’s a justification as if they accepted it They shouldn’t have a problem. Forgot to mention I got 2 good references given as well just today. Feel like this deep in the process it’s just gonna suck it took 2 months of process to get this job

[subtle heart]

just because it works for one company does not mean it works for the other

[dense mesa]

It would only serve to make you look really unprofessional

[subtle heart]

you can't run javascript with a python interpreter

[summer roost]

It's totally irrelevant. An employer won't care whether your previous employer had a vaccine mandate or didn't, or granted you an exemption or didn't.

[tight crater]

Hi everyone... I'm trying to decide on a masters program, and I've got two options: do it locally in my home country (Chile), or online in an American university (looking at Georgia Tech atm). This is for CS with a focus on Data Science/AI.

I've already been accepted to my home country's master program, and it would let me have a close relationship with professors, other students, etc. and do a capstone project. In contrast, GT's online program is mostly pre-recorded classes and pretty much no contact with professors, but the university's prestige is definitely higher.

Why an online program for the US masters? Because I'm already working full time at a great company as a senior data scientist here in Chile.

Thoughts? Especially considering that I'd like to get a job abroad in the future.

[warm sundial]

1 bedroom apartment is 3000+$/month in silicon valley

[brazen widget]

are coding summer bootcamps good for your college applications extra curriculars. im a sophomore in hs and i need extra curriculars for my college applications. i honestly didnt know which channel to ask this question in

[warm sundial]

depends on the school, also try #career-advice

[brazen widget]

uhh isnt that where im in now?

[vapid jay]

i would say so, yeah!

[brazen widget]

im trying to get in Columbia or NYU

[vapid jay]

anything that shows additional effort is always good. freecodecamp certificates are pretty well received, but im not american so sorry if its different where you are

[brazen widget]

i want a comp sci internship as one of my extra curriculars but first i need to learn certain coding languages so i might as well enroll in a summer camp to do that so i have another extra curricular to put on my application

[brazen widget]

yea im sure they help. thanks

[warm sundial]

yeah so it all evens out

[tight crater]

The funny thing is, GT's program is just 7k, while the master's here in Chile would cost me 18,500 USD lol

yea I'm going for GT's CS masters

[void tundra]

You are thinking entirely too hard about this 😰

[ivory sluice]

i think we've exhausted this conversation and it's not relevant for the topics we wish to focus on in #career-advice

i will ask that we pivot back to specifically careers as it pertains to python

so interview-related questions, how to churn leetcode questions, y'know that kind of thing

[void tundra]

I'm glad to hear that about freecodecamp!

[true harness]

2 weeks isn't even close to the amount of time it takes to get familiar with a code base. you're not really gonna be unfireable

[tight crater]

the CS masters has a ML specialization... their analytics masters is IMO for career switchers, people wanting to be closer to the business side of things or those that want to strengthen their math, but my current DS experience/background is already something like that. I want to get stronger in CS to move to tech (I'm currently in the retail industry).

[whole wasp]

Also the biggest thing is no one told me till after the offer letter was signed that I needed the vax

Couldn’t I use that to my advantage. Say it wasn’t mentioned in job description etc anywhere

[summer roost]

No.

They're not required to give you a complete list of policies prior to interviewing you.

[whole wasp]

But this could have saved everything if she would have asked if I was vaxed

[summer roost]

More than half of all human beings alive today are fully vaxxed. 🤷

[smoky quest]

If you have the opportunity to physically go to GT, it may be worth it to explore, especially towards the later years. It can simplify some visa steps

Coming to the US as a professional (ie. after the degree), is a pain.
It's much easier if you are already here as a student

but it's fully online, then yeah, not applicable

It's actually not really an issue because:

• The employer needs to prove they pay you within some normal number. It's still not fully reflecting the market, but pretty good
• The main difficult part is to get in. Once you are in, it's very easy to transfer to another company. And since you are now part of the local market, you can charge local rates
• Because of the previous point and the heavy investment to get you in, it means companies have all the incentives to pay you market rate from the get go. Otherwise if you were to move to another company, they would loose months of time and tons of dollars in getting you in

But I have no doubt there exist more cutthroat employers and some employees aren't fully aware of all their options

I have no knowledge of accounting. Would a master bring specific advantages over a cpa?

it depends a lot on which country you come from. Countries like India and China do have quotas, which creates huge backlogs

[tight crater]

yea.... right now my team works with the business to build prototypes / ad-hoc solutions to loosely defined problems with lots of ambiguity, which can be fun, but working directly with business stakeholders is quite tiring. I also have the itch to build actual products, not just prototypes.

[smoky quest]

For H1B, there is a pool of visas released per year and some extra quota for special people (ex: masters).
H1B is on first come first serve and if there are too many applicants, then there is a lottery.

The quotas are more applicable once you want to convert your h1b to a green card

[tight crater]

I work with supply chain business stakeholders, which I think is a more traditional/less analytics-minded area than marketing, but that's my pov from the outside (never worked with marketing).

supply chain in the retail industry... I do demand forecasting, inventory management, optimization, etc. and random use cases for ML

yea the issue is that the core demand forecasting (as in demand for products) was taken over by the international DS team, and now we're working on less common/harder use cases like how many trucks we'll need and stuff like that

yea I guess, I just enjoy the technical part more

I'm earning around 60k/year here, and rent is like $800 tops in a very nice area, food is like $500 even going out to restaurants multiple times a week, so I'm already at a point where quality of life > money.

Though if I can get more money without sacrificing QoL then sure lol

yea, it's low compared to US salaries, but prices are much lower here

I guess I wanna go abroad for the life experience

more than money

[brittle thorn]

I only went abroad once to Taiwan for a week...yes it is great to travel

[tight crater]

Taiwan seems interesting, I'm thinking of going there in the next couple of years before the relationship with mainland China gets sour lol

[brittle thorn]

It was as a country rep for an innovation conference while I worked in a Uni

[brittle thorn]

The city is very clean...people sit down in the metro station floors and no worries lol

[tight crater]

nice... I've never had the opportunity to do something like that, I've only travelled for tourism

[brittle thorn]

Went around the entire island as part of a big group

[tight crater]

I did go to europe a couple years ago... tbh I'd love to work there, but from what I've seen, salaries are somewhat low compared to cost of living

[brittle thorn]

Taiwan is a different culture lol

[tight crater]

where are you from? I assumed you were from the US, but I didn't ask

Egypt seems like an interesting place too... besides seeing the pyramids and stuff like that, would you recommend it?

as a tourist

I actually saw a documentary on how they're building a separate area/city for the main government buildings near Cairo. Seemed cool.

[brittle thorn]

Very old lol but much history

[tight crater]

and how's food?

lol yea very centralized

[brittle thorn]

I see parallels I live in the Philippines...we are 100m ....job market isnt the best... much centralization and we have a 'Greater Manila Area' where most of the jobs are

[thick juniper]

Just to update the greater thread, for those following my travails. I had my assessment today. Three questions, sixty-minutes. The questions were super easy, but I was an idiot. I couldn't figure out why my code in the second question wasn't updating correctly (there was just one piece of code I'd planned on being there which I forgot to include and couldn't see it for fifteen minutes). I ended up not finishing the last question, but I think I put enough in it that the reviewer will see I knew what I was doing. On the other two I got 100%.

Tomorrow is the interview.

[brittle thorn]

True in terms of education and market oversaturation plus we have boracay...great beaches

[brittle thorn]

Good luck

[thick juniper]

Definitely.

[thick juniper]

Thanks!

And Boracay is great, though Coron is my favorite. The Philippines generally is wonderful, though you couldn't pay me to drive around Metro Manila. (I have family and friends there.)

Actually, this is still the code camp option. There was a misunderstanding. The call I got was from a new HR woman and she said something like, "You can take the Python assessment." What she meant was that I could take the assessment in Python; she probably didn't even know I had asked after the Python Developer one.

So following my friend's advice, I applied directly to the Python Developer position and we'll see where things end up.

It all feels unnecessarily dramatic.

Thanks

[slim night]

Good luck!

[thick juniper]

Thanks

[slim night]

You're doing a Python bootcamp?

[thick juniper]

No. I applied for a Java Developer position under a friend's advice (he works at the company), and they said that if they were to hire me, they'd hire me for a "JA" position, which includes several months of paid training that we'd been calling bootcamp-like. It's the kind of problem one is glad to have, don't get me wrong. But I'd still rather go straight into the full time position because (as you heard) I have my second kiddo on the way.

[sinful nest]

happy black history month

[vapid jay]

I recommend reading or listening or both to the speech written by Malcolm X; The ballot or the bullet.

Eye opening about his interpretation of Dixicrat v Democrat.

[thick juniper]

Shortly after I applied to the Java position (I don't know Java, so it's fair that they don't want to hire me into it straight), a Python position opened up. I asked about the Python gig, but it's been like talking to a brick wall. I don't know if the HR groups for the two positions are different, the Python people aren't interested, or the HR people just don't think I'm good enough for an entry level position without the paid training and feel bad telling me. They just haven't said anything at all, which is why I applied there separately (again, under my friend's advice).

[sinful nest]

bro i actually never asked nor care

[vapid jay]

Then why would you virtue signal some black history month stuff?

[slim night]

Nice, good luck, truly

[sinful nest]

bro what are you talking about i said literally 'happy black history month'

[vapid jay]

And then you responded to my recommended reading, rudely. A literal slap to what you just said.

[thick juniper]

Thank you

[true harness]

this isn't really the chat or the server for this guys

[vapid jay]

I agree wholeheartadly

[sinful nest]

yea because i never asked nor cared

[lapis oar]

malcolm x's autobiography is essential history reading imo, but anyways...

[slim night]

Anyway....

I am doing Python Institute's course, just as a review to take the certification exams

[vapid jay]

What certs @slim night ?

[thick juniper]

How are you finding that?

[slim night]

I have apparently hit a wall applying for jobs, and feel like job sites' asking for certs might be why

[lapis oar]

how do you know that a development/CS career is right for you? currently a junior in college and on semester leave due to burnout with coursework. I was really stressed out with coding during that time, but right now im trying to at least get some basics down if I wanna do IT, since they write scripts to automate tasks

[slim night]

PCEP, PCAP, PCPP https://pythoninstitute.org/certification/

[slim night]

It's mostly review so far

[thick juniper]

How'd you find out about them? I was led to believe employers didn't much care about certifications like that. (I could be totally wrong. The interview I have tomorrow is my first interview in the field, so it's not like I have a boatload of experience.)

[slim night]

A Google search, honestly.

I hope employers care, because I need some way to stand out

[thick juniper]

I get that.

[slim night]

I have been looking for a developer job for about 2 months now and have only had a couple of interviews

It could also be that I only interviewed for VBA positions and didn't emphasize the other languages I can code in

[thick juniper]

Other people can give you better advice than I can, but I'd just spray and pray. That's what I planned to do in a couple months, but my friend suggested I apply to his company first.

[slim night]

Haha, yes, it has been very spray 'n pray for me

[thick juniper]

Have you been prepping for the technical assessments? (I feel like my questions are a little like the blind leading the blind.) I found the technical assessment I did this morning easy, but I think I would have bombed it if I hadn't done something like twenty-five practice problems over the last ten days.

[slim night]

No, I haven't gotten to the part where I am asked to do assessments. Where did you find practice problems?

[thick juniper]

I did Codility, but only because I knew that's the website the company would use. I think the standard in the industry is leetecode

[slim night]

Neat, thank you\

[tawny spade]

[thick juniper]

Happy to help

[tawny spade]

ugh

[thick juniper]

And good luck

[thick juniper]

Oh, but I should put in a good word for Codility, @slim night. I found it very helpful.

[slim night]

There seems to be a paywall, though?

[thick juniper]

I didn't find one. You need to sign up, I believe, but I didn't pay. Check under "Lessons".

[forest nymph]

is this chat still “i heard about python and that devs make alot of money so help me”

[vapid jay]

What should it be?

[forest nymph]

a career discussion

[vapid jay]

In what way? what are we discussing? I ❤️ python and heavily use it myself for work.

[forest nymph]

how heavily

[vapid jay]

80% of my day give or take.

[forest nymph]

u write python for 6+ hours a day every day then ur not using it right

[vapid jay]

Uh. I work way more than 8 hours a day. My job is a hobby.

I do the use of Python so that I can be repetitive and never solve the same problem twice. Company has our own repo. PRs are encouraged, etc.

I like writing Python. A lot. Perhaps a bit too much 🙂 Scapy is my addiction.

[forest nymph]

scapy is already written tho

[vapid jay]

Yes. It is a lib, written to be implemented for many things.

If I go a whole work day and all I did was code Python, I'm thrilled.

It means no alarms went off, nothing broke, a good day. I didn't even need to bring my AK.

[forest nymph]

wat

[vapid jay]

I run a siem. Deal with logs, all day. Logs coming out of my eyeballs.

So yeah, Python is my zen. It means I'm not tending to elastic or logstash or any other fun tech. Just me and my keyboard and my brain.

[vapid jay]

https://giphy.com/gifs/cute-shock-site-lemon-party-3oEdv3GoULfBB2aQlG

You work in the field @forest nymph ?

[forest nymph]

python is just an api to well implemented C

yes i am a farmer

[vapid jay]

like moo and whinnie and all?

I got 5 chickens myself. Good eggs. Interesting creatures. Can see where the animation of Raptors in Jurassic Park came from for the idea.

[forest nymph]

a second wat is necessary

[vapid jay]

https://giphy.com/gifs/quentin-tarantino-pulp-fiction-samuel-l-jackson-l2YWmJXKo7imjqhxu

[vapid jay]

Ever had a big kahuna burger @forest nymph ?

I must be breaking your concentration.

[forest nymph]

I dont remember asking you a god damn thing

[vapid jay]

Allow me to retort.

What do you farm @forest nymph

[forest nymph]

money

[vapid jay]

Ah, mommy bout you a puter for christmas. Love it.

Anyone else poke logs here?

[forest nymph]

One cent a day

I mine shitcoin

[vapid jay]

Fun.

[forest nymph]

What is logpoking

[vapid jay]

ingesting logs into a siem

coming up with rules for log parsing, etc. siem stuff; logs.

[forest nymph]

i thought there were APIs for that

[vapid jay]

Yeah, apis are used sure. At the core though you still have to setup logging and such. Things like an agent or raw syslog.

++ not all software is free. Python allows us to create software without having to shell out $. Makes the $ worth it ++ fun.

[forest nymph]

C is free

[vapid jay]

So is Python.

What's the point you're trying to make?

[forest nymph]

no point

do you think that python devs know what assembly language is

[vapid jay]

Why be here to crap on Python?

[forest nymph]

I love python that is a serious question

[vapid jay]

I would assume people like Guido and others know assembly, yes.

[brittle thorn]

Im a Python Dev and done C and asm too

[vapid jay]

@forest nymph You forget what Shidoshi taught us.

[forest nymph]

who the hell is that

[summer roost]

I've used asm and Python in the same project, sorta 😄

[vapid jay]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L8yuk3lXINY

[forest nymph]

m'broski used too many movie refs tonight. Shoulda stuck with wat

[vapid jay]

🙂

[narrow torrent]

Guys where is the best place to learn python? :V

[serene kindle]

!resources

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[narrow torrent]

Wew cool

[vapid jay]

In person, doing it for something meaningful.

[narrow torrent]

oh.

[vapid jay]

You can read all you want, but doing, the act of manipulating it by hand and typing it out; that's how I've learned best.

[narrow torrent]

Damn

[vapid jay]

Interacting with an IDE such as ipython and tabbing out an object to see what cool super powers it has.

What do you want to do FragWitz? I can teach you something useful in 10 mins. I'd assume you have a python env setup?

[narrow torrent]

I only know 1 code

print('Frag Is Noob') 😂

[vapid jay]

That'd run, so congrats.

[narrow torrent]

lol xd

[forest nymph]

python has enabled something that I dont think is good for cs, thats my "point" @vapid jay. Maybe I am wrong though, that my thinking is way off -- python programming isnt computer science. its a utility, python programming isnt the expression of an algorithm, its the usage of already implemented algorithms, standing on the shoulders of giants. Like microwaving amazing food that someone else made. Its fantastic for productivity, but horrible for anyone new to cs. The essence of CS is hidden

[vapid jay]

https://giphy.com/gifs/disneypixar-pixar-disney-ratatouille-3wb47Zh5DQIXm

[vapid jay]

To each their own. You use different languages of code to accomplish different things. An example is network parsing with scapy. In some respects I have no desire to flip to C. In other respects when a very high level of throughput is needed, then and only then would I ever flip to a lower lang. Scapy is just that powerful.

Take the following snip for example:

from scapy.all import *
p = sniff(count = 1)

p00f, you just wrote a network sniffer, without needing to understand assembly. You still did something others may not know how. The knowledge is useful, and powerful.

I can keep up with your dirty C using some Python tricks. but not all the time can I win.

[forest nymph]

you didnt write a network sniffer

[vapid jay]

I don't want to argue this. It is semantics. Unless you're a fan of assembly for everything, its a circle conversation.

[forest nymph]

No, my only point is that python is an abstraction

[vapid jay]

You can call it whatever you want. The obj in memory p, it serves a purpose for whatever the chef deemed the meal to be.

It's an awesome abstraction. long live the GIL.

[summer roost]

every language is an abstraction. Even assembly is an abstraction.

[vapid jay]

^

[summer roost]

regardless, none of this is relevant to the topic of careers.

the question of whether Python is a good language for learning CS might be an interesting topic for #pedagogy - but it's certainly not relevant here.

[vapid jay]

I find that python makes one very fluid for a Blue Team role.

Also too for a Red Team role, or any other color you want to put on an IT role. Such a useful language.

My favorite interview question is to pose to someone how they would open a CSV that has 40 million rows.

csharp, c, etc... All can do it, but none as fast as something like Python. Even PowerShell bends the knee to Python.

and when I say fast, I mean implementation to get a task achieved in X time.

[summer roost]

Again, not really on topic for this channel.

[vapid jay]

Also, the lang is fairly universal across tech these days. I can't name a distro without python built in.

[vapid jay]

... I thought I was on pt. What are we talking about here then? Sry.

[forest nymph]

id hire 5 homeless people to transcribe the data since meeting with a team of programmers to figure out how to do it on AWS would be far more confusing and costly since most people have no idea what theyre doing.

[summer roost]

this is of the few channels that we generally try pretty hard to keep on track, to at least things that are vaguely related to either a) acquiring jobs, or b) deciding on a career path

[vapid jay]

I like hackers myself @forest nymph

[vapid jay]

I find that python makes one very fluid for a Blue Team role.
Also too for a Red Team role, or any other color you want to put on an IT role.  Such a useful language.

^^ me?

Maybe my phrasing sucks. Apologies.

[forest nymph]

how can i get a job making money programming python

[vapid jay]

DM me.

[summer roost]

this whole server is about Python, and I certainly agree with you that it's a great and flexible language - it's on-topic to note some particular real world jobs that it's commonly used for.

[vapid jay]

^ siems

[summer roost]

but moving into things like comparing whether a task would be better done in Python than another language, for instance, is straying from the topic.

[forest nymph]

is there a job board

[vapid jay]

All day... Logs out of my eyeballs and Elastic ECS ain't friendly maybe. Python is a great middle plumbing.

[forest nymph]

a python pandas dataframe, not a google spreadsheet

[vapid jay]

I like wrapping pandas myself.

I find pandas to be too pedantic. I had to write a wrapper to use it, but my wrapper works great so theres that.

[summer roost]

No, we don't allow advertising for jobs here. It's too much for us to be able to moderate.

[vapid jay]

I could never rote memorize the syntax for pandas.... 😦

[forest nymph]

nor should you

[vapid jay]

Hrmm?

[forest nymph]

docs are for reference, not for memory

[vapid jay]

Oh no.... Some things should be memorized. Especially if you're using it for a 9-5.

[forest nymph]

at risk of getting banned ima go continue my rant elsewhere

[summer roost]

There is https://reddit.com/r/PythonJobs, though.

[vapid jay]

Do people give demos here @summer roost ? Free classes, etc?

[summer roost]

no, not in any formal way outside of the help channel system.

[vapid jay]

How would I propose to give a class on Python?

[forest nymph]

thats a pretty saturated market lol just see youtube

[summer roost]

Send a DM to @severe widget describing your proposal, and the admins will check it out and decide.

[vapid jay]

Thanks 🙂

[forest nymph]

point proven

[summer roost]

Again, that seems to have nothing to do with careers. Please respect the channel topic.

[forest nymph]

it has everything to do with careers. A python programmer is no longer something to consider a strong point on a resume imo

[ivory talon]

"python programmer" isn't really a job
But Data Scientist, Data Engineer, Software Engineer, ML Ops, whatever people that use Django are called? these are

[summer roost]

Python programmers, like programmers in literally every other language, come in a spectrum from beginners to experts.

and this Discord in particular has a member base that's quite young. >60% of our members are under 18 years old.

[forest nymph]

oh

[summer roost]

so, it's quite normal that people are still learning.

[forest nymph]

my bad

[summer roost]

for a baseline, the most common conversation we have in this channel is "no, you shouldn't skip college"

[forest nymph]

oh

[summer roost]

though for what it's worth, I agree with you in principle that knowing just Python isn't enough for very many jobs.

almost every real world programming job requires knowing at least 2 programming languages, if not more, and Python would be just one tool out of a developer's tool box.

[forest nymph]

i didnt realize the audience in here, so to anyone reading who is getting started, dont mind me. im kinda over the hill as far as programming is concerned. you can make an amazing career, with python by your side. and uh.... dont skip college -- or grad school 😄

[summer roost]

😄

[modest fractal]

I get why; but the python job board is a non-starter for a lot of orgs as well. I can’t get my hr people to pay for it. Apparently we prefer paying recruiters 10% of new employee salaries instead.

[whole wasp]

Writing my email now. Trying to figure out what wording is better “ I have a religious exemption, is there a form you can provide me for this or I “ I would like to request an exemption, is there a form you can provide me for this” for religious exemption

[summer roost]

You're asking them to exempt you from their policy. You are requesting an exemption because your religion forbids vaccinations.

[whole wasp]

So it would be request? Idk why everyone has been telling me to say have I felt like have made it stronger since I already have something either from someone or from my previous job or should I just do request

[summer roost]

If you ask for an exemption, you're requesting that they exclude you from their vaccine mandate. If you tell them you have an exemption, you're telling them that their vaccine mandate doesn't apply to you.

[whole wasp]

End result is the same it seems like. Still a bit confused which one I should go with and which one is better. But in the have part it seems like I’ll have to provide my own document?

[summer roost]

You will need to provide whatever information they might request to certify that your religion prevents you from being vaccinated.

[whole wasp]

In both cases of request and have?

[summer roost]

Yes

[whole wasp]

So I guess it doesn’t matter what I write cuz I thought have was stronger

[summer roost]

At the bare minimum, they'll likely have you sign a paper attesting that your religion forbids vaccinations. They may require more than that. They may refuse to hire you at all.

[whole wasp]

https://www.shrm.org/resourcesandtools/tools-and-samples/how-to-guides/pages/how-to-handle-an-employees-request-for-an-accommodation-to-a-vaccine-requirement-covid19-coronavirus.aspx

[summer roost]

I just get a log in screen from that. If you have expert advice about what to say, you should probably trust that.

[whole wasp]

From the passage below it's basically a request

Employees need not use any particular verbiage when requesting an accommodation. Managers and supervisors should understand how to recognize a request for accommodation and who to relay the information to within the company.

Requests for accommodation due to a disability or religious belief should be further reviewed following the steps below.

[summer roost]

Right

[whole wasp]

They were suppose to send a background check link to start that and that hasn’t even been sent out.
Maybe they are waiting for the vax confirmation? Seems like at this process if the background check hasn’t even started they can easily back out or am I overthinking it

[smoky quest]

the company can back out at any time. Even if someone tries to delay and push back things by 2-3 weeks, it doesn't matter at the end.

[whole wasp]

I wonder why they haven’t sent the background check link yet

[summer roost]

They can easily back out at any point, even after you start. That's how at-will employment works: both the employee and employer can end the employment agreement at any time.

[whole wasp]

I understand this position is kind of a hybrid but why are fully remote positions requiring vax

[smoky quest]

It could be some requirements from feds, it could be you may have to interact with some employees or customers or anything.
And frankly, this is not something people are actually pushing back on in science related fields. So your current position is not the norm

[summer roost]

They may occasionally need you to come in contact with other employees for team building or conferences or the like. They may just not want to have unvaccinated employees.

[whole wasp]

u do a negative Covid test then

and keep social distance in the office while wearing a mask

[smoky quest]

most people would still feel weirded out by such unreasonable positions. So it cuts down on a lot of fears across the employees

[summer roost]

You've repeatedly pointed out that you can get COVID after being vaccinated, but of course you can also have COVID while testing negative, and you can pass COVID while wearing a mask.

[smoky quest]

Simpler to make sure everyone is vaccinated than deal with stubborn exotic positions

[severe totem]

does

20 SECONDS

[smoky quest]

Also on a side note, given the amount of overthinking and arguments you have put out, just on this channel over the past two days, be aware that it wouldn't really fly in a corporate environment. People won't care that much and either you are in or you are out but they will unlikely spend as much time on that as you.
So be mindful about how you approach it with the (potential) employers

[smoky quest]

Hi!
Do you have a #career-advice related discussion?

hey that's my line

[near ocean]

We have an echo in this channel

[dark arrow]

!mute 881765513133436959 12h shitposting

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied mute to @vapid jay until <t:1643834872:f> (11 hours and 59 minutes).

[near ocean]

I dont understand why this topic is still on going
I thought he already did all he could and now its up to HR to either tell him yes or no?

Or is this all hypotheticals now, which i guess is fine to discuss

Regardless, im surprised this topic didnt degrade to name calling and whatnot

[smoky quest]

Yeah, I think it's a combination of:

• having no other discussion going on. So it's too tempting to reply
• It doesn't look like they are familiar with the professional world. So there are a lot of misconceptions
• Lots of hypotheticals to wiggle out

I shouldn't reply to this thread anymore

[near ocean]

New topic, how to trick interns into embarrassing themselves in front of boss man

[smoky quest]

I have seen a few "hey don't forget it's customary to say a joke when doing X presentation"

[whole wasp]

Question about my resume. If I worked at contract positions. Where would I put the contract would it be like Software Support engineer - contract or would it go all the way to the right next to the date or does it not matter

[smoky quest]

either at the very last minute to make them panic, or a bit early to make them panic in advance 🙂

[near ocean]

Im not sure it matters what kind of contract you signed, i would just use the title of the position (as stated in the contract) and a brief description of the roles i guess (as stated in the contract)

I would personally not make the distinction between full time employee and contractor

[summer roost]

Unless you were hired by one firm but contracted out to another. That's a distinction you need to make clear.

[whole wasp]

It’s because I have been getting asked why I left. Both roles contract ended. So I thought if I just put contract they may already know why I left. But why is a position being contract bad. Because during the interviews I just tell them contract ended and they are fine with it

[vapid jay]

good morning guys, sorry to interrupt, just wanted to say hello 🙂

[summer roost]

A position being contract isn't bad. If your tenure at a company was short, future employers will want to know why. If the reason why is just that everyone agreed up front that the job was for a limited time, that's fine.

[whole wasp]

It was contract to hire but there are many reasons other than performance that companies decide to not convert u but I’ve just been telling them that contract ended

[summer roost]

That's fine. Contract to hire means they might offer you a permanent job at the end of the contract. If they don't, it's accurate to say that the contract ended. I wouldn't admit that it could have become permanent and didn't.

[dense mesa]

You emailed asking them to guide you through submitting a religious exemption?

[whole wasp]

If this wording is better: Could you please provide me with the form required for submitting a religious exemption?

I think the 2nd one may be the best?

[dense mesa]

Before I reply any more to this ongoing conversation, which country is this?

[whole wasp]

USA

[analog sorrel]

Where are someplace to go for apprenticeships

[analog sorrel]

I mean like companies to go to

Ict related

[near ocean]

that depends on who's hiring, and you can find that out at your local job boards

[inner wren]

@vapid jay Per Rule 6, your invite link has been removed. If you believe this was a mistake, please let staff know!

Our server rules can be found here: https://pythondiscord.com/pages/rules

[analog sorrel]

Yes but do you have an opinion on who would be better off

Like which company I shouldn’t apply for and which I should

[near ocean]

so you want a list of companies? thats going to be hard to compile, even with more information

[gritty rivet]

LinkedIn as a company actually has an apprentice program, I think they're accepting applicants right now

Microsoft has one, but I think they just made all the decisions for this round and I'm not sure when you can apply again

[gritty rivet]

Just avoid places that require you to sign a two year contract and reserve the right to send you wherever they want. There are a lot of those. Otherwise, apply for anything and everything that interests you

[analog sorrel]

Oh oh okay txs

[analog sorrel]

Okay thanks 😊

[tall arch]

Hey guys, I am a beginner learning web dev! Should I be concerned that I don't know any OOP language , DSA and competitive coding. I am from India. So, if there is anyone from India with work experience Please respond !

[thick juniper]

As I have my interview today, what are some people's favorite questions to ask? Thanks!

[buoyant seal]

I've got a whole book to drop on you as answer

[cedar isle]

Hi any tips for interesting (remote) internships or open-source projects? I am doing my PhD and have some spare time which I would like to invest to gain some more Python experience (tools, data, visualisation, small libs). Feel free to DM me.

[dry flint]

I like python and I am a python developer. I wish work someone with python.

if someone have python task, please contact me.

Thank you.

[vast shoal]

!rule 6

[inner wren]

Rules

6. Do not post unapproved advertising.

[vast shoal]

Please message @severe widget to request approval

[buoyant seal]

Lets say it is a hint, that today you are either prepared or not. It is already too late to prepare then ;b
Although I could say that reading even first chapters is nice to calm down

[gritty rivet]

Sounds like you might need to work on your projects more. It never hurts to apply but if you don't have any relevant experience strong projects are usually a must. How else to prove what you can do?

[summer roost]

I'd ask what they've been doing for team building with new remote hires to help them feel like part of the team. I'd ask them to walk you through the day to day aspects of the job. How do you find out what changes they want you to make? What sort of testing do they use to make sure new changes didn't introduce regressions? Once you've made your change, who is responsible for reviewing it? Who deploys it? What happens if a bug is found after it's released?

[night gyro]

Is this book still relevant or do people prefer to use leetcode and websites of the like nowadays?

[near ocean]

recent versions are very relevant, yes

[night gyro]

6th edition is 2015

[dense mesa]

Grind leetcode until the suffering becomes enjoyable and you look forward to solving them

[night gyro]

Yes, I have been Im just curious if I may be missing out on something by not reading the book.

[dense mesa]

Use the book if you can't solve problems

[night gyro]

Ohhhhhkay fair enough 😊 thank you

No I'm rainbow team I forgot that was there.... 😅

[whole wasp]

It’s done. Sent the email just now. Thank you all for all the help u guys gave me through this situation. @summer roost and many others I can’t thank you enough. Going through this many people were mad, a friend ended up blocking me... but u guys answered all of my questions. Really really appreciate it. I’m also very glad I don’t have to think about this anymore either as it prolly caused me more anxiety/etc than needed. Now we just have to wait how things play out.

[summer roost]

I am curious to hear how it goes for you. Let us know what winds up happening, one way or the other.

[whole wasp]

Im scared lol

if it does actually get approved then I have to write my explanation which I think is even harder

[thick juniper]

I think I am prepared. But I realized y'all might have questions you like which I wouldn't think to ask but would like to.

EDIT: But thank you for the book. I'll look into it.

[thick juniper]

These are great. Thank you.

[worldly fern]

anybody here decent at matlab

[smoky quest]

I like to ask about:

• What are the teams/groups/company working on right now / next 6 months / 1 year
• What are the challenges and growth opportunity that teams/groups/company are currently facing
• What are the success criteria for the candidate. If the interviewer is someone I would work with, I would ask them from their own perspective. So what would make them say in 6 months that's a good hire from their point of view? What are the things they would want me to fix or not change

[smoky quest]

That doesn't look like it's on topic with this channel, which is about #career-advice .
You may have more success through #❓｜how-to-get-help

[vapid jay]

Hey, I want to get a job in Germany, any advice?

Currently getting my first work experience, I'm about 3 months in but would like to emigrate as soon as possible.

[thick juniper]

This is a screenshot I took two weeks ago. It's a comfort to see the consistency. Thank you.

[smoky quest]

lmao. On one hand, it's comforting for the consistency, on the other hand, damn, I am so predictable

[thick juniper]

Hey, a right answer is a right answer, right?

[smoky quest]

true

[graceful mason]

It can be good to ask how they measure the success of new hires after 3 months/6 months/1 year

[thin path]

Hello, so I've been on a python class for the last year or so, just because I thought it was interesting. It finished around 2-3 months ago, and the teacher there told us about a python certificate called PCAP, and how we should take it. At first I didnt think much of it but now I feel like taking it. It costs $150 with the discount tho, so its a bit expensive. I'm actually quite young (13 lol) and my parents are encouraging me but I am not sure how hard it is. Should I take it and how should I prepare for it?

(Also I know this isnt really a career choice, but it seems more appropriate to post it here)

[vapid jay]

#bot-commands

[summer roost]

I'd say no. Certificates are generally not that useful in the software development industry. If you liked the Python class, I'd keep learning programming, but that $150 could be better put towards another course or some books than a certification.

In terms of return on investment, I doubt it would be a worthwhile use of the money.

[thin path]

Thanks for the answer, my teacher just told me I was really good so I should take it but I'll keep that in mind. The discount ends in feb 29th so I dont have much time, but ill work it out in my head

[summer roost]

I don't think it's harmful to take it. If you did well in the course, you'd probably pass it, and it might be rewarding to be able to say that you got the cert. But employers are pretty unlikely to care about the cert, so, if it's a lot of money for your family, I think it could be better spent.

[tall fern]

31

[thin path]

Alright, its just a lot of theory that I cant see anymore cuz I cant read the course after it's ended, but I'm good at using python and I've done a few small projects, so I think I'll do well

[rustic moat]

hi guys, if I'm probably pursuing Software Engineering or Web Development, what should I learn?

and which one is brighter?

[lapis wind]

I mean why not both? They tend to go very hand in hand

[rustic moat]

Okay, for web dev I already learnt about: React, Next.js + DB ORMs (prisma), Golang Backend with net/http, Django REST framework backend
but for softwares it's almost nothing.
What are some recommended things I need to know?

is Qt high demand?

[lapis wind]

mmm I wouldn't say so, at least not for Python

[rustic moat]

.NET

[rustic moat]

what about C++ Qt

[lapis wind]

maybe a little more? But compared to web I'd say not alot

realistically it's cheaper, easier and quicker to build a good looking web app now and use something like electron or tauri to ship as an application rather than try do it with QT

[rustic moat]

hmm ok. but i heard electron fries your computer inside out no? ( it's heavier because it uses chrome )

[lapis wind]

I mean, half of the aps you use day to day are probably electron now

and it uses Chromium, which is quite a big difference between the two.
Devs love to go on about how electron is resource-heavy but realistically it litterally is irrelevant to the majority of users, considering that realistically it doesn't use enough to bother anyone outside of devs

Slack is electron and uses litterally nothing.
Discord is electron but uses slightly more resources but not enough to be cared about by users.
Same with:

• MS Teams
• Figma
• Postman
• Insomnia
• and every app listed here: https://www.electronjs.org/apps

[lapis bear]

literally nothing? That's 360mb by one little chat app, if you have all 5 of the apps you listed above, just electron's overhead will happily eat 2 gigs of your RAM

[lapis wind]

Compare that to the average user's browser usage. Most computers have on average 8 GB of memory or more, idle apps get their memory heavily swapped out to disk by windows as well so in reality I (and tbf the rest of the word) dont really see that as a big issue

Plus there are alternatives to electron like tauri if you're really not happy with electron usage

You have also got to look at this from a businesses perspective, where turning your website into a full app with electron takes a fraction of the time it would take to make a mirror in something like Qt, build and publish.

[hearty island]

i got the summer return offer from the company i did my winter internship at

[drifting yew]

hi i'm new here

[dense mesa]

Yes

[worldly fern]

messaged ya

[smoky quest]

yeah, phone spam and scam are pretty bad in the USA. There are even scams where they try to record you saying "yes".
Most recruiters will be fine taking contact over linkedin/email anyway.

[gritty rivet]

You cannot learn every useful technology. I suggest you look at the job listings in your area to figure out what's both in demand and interesting to you personally

[whole wasp]

Guys I got a response

They are letting me fill a form out but it will need to be approved

[thick juniper]

I think it went well. The interview lasted a little longer than the hour for which it was scheduled. There was never an awkward pause or a hiccup. There was thirty minutes with a programmer and thirty minutes with a personnel guy. I think I impressed both. I know I impressed the programmer when he found out I use git bash and prefer the command line to the GUI of GitHub.

I was a little stressed because I had more questions than they had time to answer. I could probably have kept them but I didn't know what the protocol was for that, but overall I'm hopeful. It doesn't start until May, though, but... I guess I'll have time to prepare.

Thanks for asking.

By the way, should I send a thank you message? I don't have their emails, but the HR woman should be able to get in contact with them (and, anyway, I forgot to ask when I should expect to hear back). I just don't know what the protocol is.

[summer roost]

I agree

[brittle thorn]

Nice congrats

[thick juniper]

Thanks all

[tranquil kraken]

I am php developer

Thinking to move in java or python#

What guys you recommend?

[high solar]

i would say python

[tacit lance]

yeah do you have any advice on distinguishing between legitimate postings and scam jobs

thanks for the advice - I'm graduating in a couple of years, and I'm def aiming for a brand name

[unique beacon]

^^ This exactly. Making meaningful connections with motivated people of similar interests will allow you to make huge strides in industry, your career, and life in general. I would not be where I am today without it

[tacit lance]

appreciate the help, we have the same mindset

I meant in terms of being a well rounded person

[hearty island]

would you guys rather stay at home for an internship or go accept an offer from a bigger company and have to travel? i have a feeling i'm going to be accepted for more than one internship this summer, so i'm a little bit conflicted

[smoky quest]

I would prioritize travel/onsite as it gives you more opportunities to connect and see how a company is run and how the different teams and folks interact

[summer roost]

I agree.

I'd also, in general, prioritize things that push you out of your comfort zone. This is your best chance to learn what types of teams and what types of work you enjoy most. Doing something pretty different from your last internship will help give you a broader perspective.

[hearty island]

hm, ok. but what if the company does not provide housing assistance?

[summer roost]

then you'd need to weigh the benefits of the experience against the cost of living.

[hearty island]

ok, in your opinion, is the benefits of working for a fortune 500 greater than the cost of living? bc i have a gnawing feeling in my stomach it is

[summer roost]

depends on the pay, and depends on the cost of apartments and food and entertainment in whatever city it's in.

[hearty island]

hm, good point. gonna do some more research. thanks for the quality advice. let's say i do say no to this internship from the smaller company, how do i do it?

my apology for all these questions, i'm out of my depth here

i'm also weighing covid into the consideration

[summer roost]

yeah, that's certainly another thing to consider.

[summer roost]

"I appreciate the offer, but I've decided to accept another offer instead."

[hearty island]

yeah, that was along the lines of what i was thinking. would it be overstepping my boundaries to recommend one of my friends who is an analytics major?

[summer roost]

Yes, I'd say so.

[hearty island]

yeah, i was thinking that would be an immature thing to do. just wanted a quick sanity check.

[summer roost]

I think it would, yes.

[hearty island]

thanks for the help

[brittle thorn]

These are typically Multi level Marketing crap...stay away lol

[cedar isle]

Shoutout number two, if anyone need some help with open-source lib or Python project I would like to start contributing (feel free to DM me).

[urban cedar]

can someone answer how python freelancers make money? Like I understand software engineers but what projects would freelancers code

[cedar isle]

You can be hired by company as external developer for short period of time

[urban cedar]

thank you

[cedar isle]

Its same as for freelance designers/web devs etc

[urban cedar]

but do you know what sort of projects they’d even work on

[cedar isle]

i do not have personal experience, but i can imagine it will be a wide range of things

[urban cedar]

thank you

[ivory talon]

I'd imagine that it is something like what you can see in https://www.upwork.com/services/data-analysis-reports
(this link in specific is for data analysis, but there are also some other Data Science related fields on the top of the page like Data Mining and Machine Learning)
other than Data Science, there's also a bunch of Web stuff

[vapid jay]

Hi everyone
I was wondering if I could get some advice on choosing my A level subjects
I want to take Cybersecurity course in uni. I'm thinking of taking Physics, Chemistry (ik its not necessary, but I like chem), Math, Further Math (I'm not sure about this one but i do enjoy solving problems) and Computer Science
Is it a good combination? I don't have any specific uni in mind so idk abt specific requirements

[near ocean]

with Math, Further Math, physics and chem you can get into pretty much any stem course in any uni

[swift veldt]

Math can never fault you in all honesty, especially if you like going into some details like compression, signal analysis, etc. which can be relevant in some part of cybersecurity.

[vapid jay]

Thanks a lot!

[night briar]

Hi everyone
I am a high school student in Turkey and i want to ask some questions.
My lessons are good i mean i can do math physics etc but i wanna be a programmer and when i ask somebody what should i do? They are telling me universities are bad in Turkey(for being a programmer)you should improve your Python skills Java C+ etc my family telling me go to a good university how can you prove yourself without your diploma it is stupid go and learn math biology physics etc. I can go to a good university but is it important to work hard like 15-16 hours a day for 1 year (in 12th class) or is it better to just work for learning Python ?

[vapid jay]

Hello,
Can you advise me where to learn to become a software engineer?
I am studying marketing but it gives me no satisfaction, it has become a toxic environment for me.

[near ocean]

You could learn in your spare time, pursuing a software dev job while studying or having graduated with something else is going to be harder but not impossible
You could learn python and pandas to do data analysis, tableau, power bi for visualization

[vapid jay]

thank u, that helps me a lot

[gritty rivet]

I'm not familiar with the situation in Turkey but in general getting a degree from the best school you can is a good investment. If you're interested in Python start learning as much as you can for sure, but don't give up on getting a degree too easily

[naive dust]

I'm making a portfolio website, i can't wrap my head around writing the "about me" part. All the portfolio examples i see are front-end developers who talk about ui-ux.

What should a backend developer mention in about me?

[gilded valley]

What kind of jobs have your worked in? What tech do you with with? Are you a student?

[dire sigil]

Hello everyone...
I am a student in class 12th..
My aim is to be an astronomer but I like programming as well wanna be a software engineer..
Which field should I go to have both of them?

[naive dust]

@gilded valley I usually work with django, rest api etc. I'm not a student, i have been coding for 3 years, haven't worked in a software company before

[gilded valley]

Well you're halfway there with that answer. Just rephrase it a little and it's good enough.

[ancient bobcat]

Would anyone here be interested in attending an online talk by a Data Scientist from N26 on setting up a Data Science environment for developing ML models?

[obsidian mesa]

hi

[vapid jay]

you should apply for ISRO

[dire sigil]

Ok...thanks for reply

[vapid jay]

yw gauranshi

[naive dust]

@gilded valley do you think its good idea to include being self taught?

[gilded valley]

depends on exactly what your goal is

[naive dust]

goal is finding job as sofware dev

[gilded valley]

then yeah - that seems sensible enough to include

[naive dust]

ok thank you

[vital sorrel]

Hi! I'm looking if anyone has a contact at the company "Optimizely" and are willing to help with my application. I would really appreciate the assistance.

[forest nymph]

i could use some help preparing for live coding interviews

or at least a resource to read about how to approach them

never had to do it before and seems very awkward, nerve racking

[summer roost]

Have you seen the book Cracking the Coding Interview? I haven't personally read it, but it comes highly recommended.

[forest nymph]

my live code session is in 18 hours 😄 I will read the book fast

[summer roost]

It seriously might be worth a skim.

[forest nymph]

i was serious! thanks for the rec

[summer roost]

Beyond that, my biggest piece of advice would be to open to guidance from the interviewer. If you start to go in the wrong direction, they'll try to gently steer you. Don't fight them if they do.

Even if they try to move off of a question you haven't solved, that's fine: put the first question out of mind, and try to context switch to the next one.

Don't start coding until you're confident you understand the problem and the constraints. Ask questions.

[pine stag]

hello

im trying to find more info on what industries are looking for most in UK from Python programmers, would it be Data devs, engineers or web developers? im stuck in choosing which way to lean on

[tawny raven]

Straight nonsense, don't think you would really want to go to any other university if you could go to top universities in Turkey. And what's the aim of working 15-16 hours a day? You want to be the 1st and the best student in the exam? And since programming is an industry that you can learn and achieve a lot by your own, you don't really go to a great university. This applies for physics and math too.

[night briar]

My brother and my sister done it by working that hard. I must work really that hard to go a top university for being a programmer. It is okay for me if i can learn things about being a programmer and if i can find a job without a good university diploma. I can go a low-normal university too if i want but i think it is same as no diploma i mean they are really bad i can't learn anything in a bad university probably. I want to do a job in abroad so my question is:
Can i find a job if i won't go a good university but learn a lot about Python
Because if i would try to go a good university it is gonna be a waste of time for me i won't use physics in Python or in any other programming language
And can i learn everything about Python or new programing language whatever by myself? I can work hard but programming is fun.

[tawny raven]

The thing is, whether you go to a "good" university in Turkey's standards or not , you are going to have 4 years to learn anything new. I think studying to your classes and learning a programming language as a hobby, untill you go to university is the smartest choice in your case.

[tawny raven]

And if you are confident about yourself, you can find a job without a diploma too. But as you know, it's a bit harder than with a diploma.

[smoky quest]

As pointed out by dacl, your career's existence won't be conditioned on being in the number 1 university in the world.
Finding jobs without a degree is not impossible, but you will have a hard time to build a successful career. If I was to rank things, I would overwhelmingly prefer to go to a lesser known university than not going at all.
In addition, CS/SW are so much more than just a single programming language. And that includes physics/math/stats

[smoky quest]

They will all be in demand in the foreseeable future.
You should try them out and study them a bit and see which one you have the most or least affinity with

[night briar]

Thanks about answering my questions.

[past sparrow]

"but you will have a hard time to build a successful career [without a degree]" that seems a bit much

if you want to do web development, there are plenty of successful web developers that don't have any degree

[vapid jay]

I really dont know how im gonna start with my programming career.
I mean, I know I wanna do robotics or computer engineering, I like drones and stuff, I wanna build them, cus I think they're cool. I know that's a childish mentality to start with, but its just something i wanna get into. I've been told by friends that I should get into freelance coding or work for a robotics company, I've been told that i need a degree to even think about getting a job for it, I've been told a lot of things.

I'll admit, I'm not the best at math, it's the worst subject grade i have in school, so idk if I can get a degree in something that heavily relies on math, and as for freelance, I'm not the best at business either, and I don't even know what to look for in freelance, ie what to sell and advertise in myself. But I really want to get into something besides writing or art, something that i can get a stable income with, It seems I'm just struggling with figuring out what field of robotics/computer engineering suit me best

basically im just a dum that wants to do smart things

[past sparrow]

you can consider web development if you want a stable income without much formal training required, but if you wanna go for computer engineering then degrees might be needed. that being said there are still people that have impressive portfolios of their arduino's or whatever that have managed to transition into robotics, but its harder than going at it from a computer engineering background

[gritty rivet]

What's general career stage? Are you in high school?

[vapid jay]

Aye, freshman

[gritty rivet]

In university or in high school?

[vapid jay]

high school, sorry

[gritty rivet]

Cool, you have plenty of time then. Explore coding,.play with an Arduino, just try and build whatever interests you. The only thing that really matters at this stage is that you explore and get to know what you can really get in to as far as finding it motivating

And get the best grades that you can to go to a good university. You really don't need to pick a focus quite yet

If university doesn't work out for you, things can still work out fine, but it's worth it if you possibly can

[sharp canyon]

hi everyone

ive just started learning python and im already loving it any tips?

[smoky quest]

Depends on your choice of career.
It's accepted and used outside of software jobs. It's also quite popular in sw jobs. There are other useful skills and languages, but that would heavily depend on your job

[dense mesa]

If you're gonna ask about the UK specifically, what do you have in mind already

There's not really anything which is gonna depend solely on the UK, I'm seeing a lot of ads for data engineering currently

[graceful mason]

Most likely something data related

[pine sleet]

Many high schools towards the end of your high school journey will offer a lot of courses and opportunities that can be used to segue into the job world, such as dual-credit courses which can help you gain college credits in high school, so you still have plenty of opportunity left to get started 🙂 hope that helps

[regal tundra]

If I'm a PhD student in an off-cs field (computational cognitive science) and want to collect qualifications for a DS or techy research position, what should I be focusing on? What kinds of opportunities should I look for? I know part of it is to try for publications in venues known for AI research and picking up SQL but is there anything more I should make sure I invest time in?

Have seen some small evidence that leetcode is helpful, for example

[hearty island]

data visualization libraries in python (matplotlib/seaborn), pandas, numpy, scipy are all excellent tools to have in your arsenal if you want to go into DS/research

[regal tundra]

yeah i'd say id that sort of stack down. even good at parallels in other sciency languages and javascript

am worried that my ML background will be too weak given the current direction of my research. How critical is it that I get to the point where I'm, like, making novel ML research contributions in the way a CS grad student in that area might?

Right now, my "AI" background is mostly applying classifiers to analyze fmri data and applying nlp tools to process (and model) behavioral data. None of really works toward finding new ways to advance ML benchmarks as I often see ML phds working on, but I could segue into something near that ballpark if it would be important for my industry prospects. OTOH, this would be a significant sacrifice of research time from my main interests.

[simple canopy]

Hello

[hearty island]

i'm gonna be honest, this question is getting a bit out of my current depth. i hope someone with more experience can help you.

[simple canopy]

Hello

@simple canopy

[brittle thorn]

Looks like applied AI/ML and I dont think it is weak at all so industry prospects shoudnt be bad. Some do work on core AI/ML algo and make things that break benchmarks but I think applications of these algos are important too. FMRI applications in medicine are numerous

[lyric galleon]

how can i get help

[smoky quest]

See #❓｜how-to-get-help

[grim cedar]

Hi guys,Is it enough to learn python with django framework in some companies?Just get some experience.Later I want to continue as Data scientist although I am beginner.Is it possible?

If there is someone works for companies as DS or Back-end developer just only python/django,pls answer my question

[smoky quest]

it depends.
You may also refer to https://roadmap.sh

[plucky karma]

agreed here. Chances are, you might get hired and not genuinely know anything. Theyll try to train you for 3 months

[buoyant seal]

Darkwind remembered the roadmaps of all things DS supposed to know
Darkwind remembered all the things developer needs to learn in order to improve code quality
Darkwind remembered all things a person needs to know to Deploy and develop his stuff

Well ... How to say that, it could be enough to land some beginning positions.
But to remain in the company or to grow u need to know much more

[plucky karma]

Larger companies will not waste time on noobs though

Smaller ones will risk it if they have a team packed with mature experience

[smoky quest]

depends if they have a degree, the country, the experience, the job, the team, the actual requirements for the job, the opportunities, the day of the week...

[buoyant seal]

Basically the chances are always there, but they can be a bit low

[grim cedar]

Thanks guys

[plucky karma]

Just gotta work and talk til you make it

[buoyant seal]

The path of programmer is... Constant never ending learning

U agree to learn all the time, as long as u work in IT

[grim cedar]

But DS comes to me a little bit difficult

Just I resarch and I found path of DS and I am disappointed 🥲

[buoyant seal]

Heh, that is stranger territory for me.
I am not that friendly with math to work with DS

I just hardly passed all my math disciplines in university

[grim cedar]

What is your purpose with python or are you working or smth like that?

[buoyant seal]

I am backend and infrastructure guy

[grim cedar]

Good🥵

[buoyant seal]

I learn everything that is related to web development

[grim cedar]

And you are working?

[buoyant seal]

Yeah

[grim cedar]

Can you say your salary🙂

[buoyant seal]

It would be useless information.
Every country market has its own salary standards

[grim cedar]

Where r u from?

[buoyant seal]

I am usually freely saying stuff about myself, but u a heavily invasive and rude in manners, I think I am not comfortable to tell you in current case

[grim cedar]

Oke sory

[quasi sandal]

Hey guys, I'm starting my first proper role as a backend developer after university. Is there any advice you lot can offer, heads up on things to look out for. Essentially, how to survive the first 90days. Btw, this is remote...

[buoyant seal]

I recommend learning as soon as possible what is Git and how to use it
And what is testing and how to use it
this book is a nice entrance to testing

Untested code is a garbage waiting to be collected. Even if some companies / teams somehow manage to do miracles and to work with untested code... that's just a pre-death fantasy of a dying man

https://www.atlassian.com/git/tutorials/what-is-version-control
Atlassian guide is quite nice to go through the Git stuff

• with a bit of reading about best practices regarding Git
  https://deepsource.io/blog/git-best-practices/

[quasi sandal]

Good reads! Thank you

[night briar]

Are there any books that i can read about being a programmer?

[pure dome]

hey, i am a beginner here just have learned some basic of python wanted to be freelancer how should i proceed?

[buoyant seal]

Specify your background, what you know / education

[viral oxide]

what can i do with fast learning?
just quick question for my future

[honest pivot]

Imagine putting something into production and not knowing whether it works correctly. Sounds terrifying.

[buoyant seal]

Imagine doing only manual checks to check that everything works every time when you change even one line of code in the project, what would be the time to deliver the project

Imagine trying to refactorize your own code, and afraid being to do that, because everything would get broken and you have no idea where for weeks, until you finally return the code to previous state.... but wait, you can't even return, because you don't use git, and only saving the code in zip archives once in a month

[buoyant seal]

or even better, imagine developing IN production 😉

[honest pivot]

Imagine not knowing whether you need to restore the code from code-final-v2.zip or code-final-v2-old.zip

[vapid jay]

Do you also have any whatsapp group for python and programming related discussions?

[near ocean]

Is this server not enough?

[dense mesa]

What about code-final-v2-THIS-ONE-final-v7-UPLOAD-THIS-v3.zip

[graceful mason]

It sucks working with products where you can't physically test every situation and you change something where you have to hope that your functional testing is enough

[night gyro]

So far I have been using educative and the system design primer on github for system design question practice. Are there any other recommended resources for this area?

[buoyant seal]

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Systems-Analysis-Design-Alan-Dennis/dp/1118897846

If u wish it to apply at practice

[night gyro]

Thank you, I see there is a 7th edition but perhaps its not available in the uk

[buoyant seal]

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Systems-Analysis-Design-Alan-Dennis/dp/1119585856/ref=mp_s_a_1_10?qid=1643977082&refinements=p_27%3AAlan+Dennis&s=books&sr=1-10&text=Alan+Dennis
Oh yes there is

Almost tempted to read it again, to find out new changes and repeat

[night gyro]

Ah nice thanks!

[night briar]

Almost nothing. I am in high school i know Python a little bit.

[buoyant seal]

Let's get started from here then

[night briar]

Thanks i will read this book

[hot pilot]

Hi

[graceful mason]

Use Case Driven Object Modeling with UML - Theory and Practice is a good read, not sure if it's the kind of thing you're looking for

[vapid jay]

How long do you think does it take to learn full stack software? Without a job, I know there is no limit to learning, but I mean for internships, for example

[night gyro]

I'll check it out, thanks ")

[icy berry]

im not sure if there are different levels of internships, but where i work an intern is someone you are suppose to take along and teach as you go, but some requirements are expected. knowledge about the tech that is used.

the problem is that nobody will put an intern to do backend work, mostly at least