career-advice

[hexed jewel]

all of them were weekend projects

[solid parcel]

Honestly, I'm not surprised you're struggling. The market is crowded for juniors at the moment, your grade is pretty underwhelming, your only experience is as an intern and you've got somewhat arbitrary bolding on your CV. Why is 'programming language' bolded?

That said, getting 400 stars on a project and maintaining it for a period of years is noteworthy. You're not doing nearly a good enough job of shouting about it! Consider the order of the bullet points, as you want your highest impact points first. The 400 stars and the first place in FOSS hack are impressive. Consider how you can frame these. First out of how many competitors? What proportion of GitHub users have 400+ stars like you do? Your work experience is the first thing people will see- can you add any stats here (even if you have to guesstimate) to highlight impact or scale? E.g. How many MAU did the website have?

[hexed jewel]

What proportion of GitHub users have 400+ stars like you do?
im sure theres a TON

[solid parcel]

In absolute terms, perhaps. Proportionally, I bet your project is in a much smaller percentage than you'd expect 🙂

[hexed jewel]

that will sound extremely performative

[solid parcel]

It's just a means of contextualising the achievement, the same way that mentioning the number of competitors in the Hackathon would.

[hexed jewel]

thanks, ive added the no of competitors in that hackathon

[long solar]

anyone here got 2 remote jobs at once

[solid parcel]

Ha, I think at the moment most engineers would be happy with one remote job 😆 Hybrid has come back with a vengeance the past couple of years

[long solar]

should fill it out more

[hexed jewel]

... with what

[long solar]

for one, you can add notable courses under the education section

each project can have at least 3 points

[long solar]

i think startups do full remote more often

[solid parcel]

Saves on them paying for office space, lol

[vapid violet]

Having 2 full time jobs at the same time sounds not ideal

[long solar]

well yeah, what about full time and part time though

[true harness]

if you are not talking about ethics or contracts, it is certainly doable to have 2 full time jobs. i know someone that did

[next plover]

Will definitely suck though

[solid parcel]

Managing scheduling with meetings for both roles would be so exhausting

[smoky quest]

good luck hiding it from linkedin/background-checks or putting it up on linkedin/resume

[solid parcel]

I wonder if anyone has managed to secretly work two jobs for the same company before? 😆

[smoky quest]

In the world of possibilities, definitely. There are plenty of chill and inefficient jobs. To make it work, you would want to avoid to stand out and avoid high pressure/performance jobs.

Whether it is advisable, not at all.

[near ocean]

The people working two full time dev jobs dont usually struggle with finding work

They probably wouldnt be overemployed if they did

[hexed jewel]

how am i supposed to apply if all jobs require experience

[smoky quest]

Not all jobs require experience

[trim rose]

Lie mildly in a way they can’t verify get job then use that job as experience for next job. Not ethical advice but it’s a method.

[magic matrix]

start of as an intern

[hexed jewel]

applying to jobs feels like throwing my resume off a cliff and hoping it lands in a tiny bucket

[magic matrix]

war did u study

[smoky quest]

It does feel empty. Though it looks like there is a lot you could say and expand on to make yourself appear as a stronger engineer

[hexed jewel]

I want to remove all those projects they absolutely suck

[smoky quest]

they aren't bad

And if you remove them, then you have strictly nothing

at least your goboscript can show some compiler skills

[hexed jewel]

none of them show skills that are useful in the industry though

full-stack development, i want to be a generalist

[smoky quest]

fullstack is not generalist though. That's competing with bootcamps and self taught

[hexed jewel]

is being self-employed counted as professional experience

[smoky quest]

Sure

as long as you don't try to make up fake employment

[next plover]

Make experience

Do projects and labs

[hexed jewel]

labs?
and projects dont count as professional experience right?

[warm sand]

Man I am lwk broke, I am willing to do work to get payed (I just want money and experience )

[pine sleet]

just go work retail or something

[crude folio]

Just declined a very big offer and feeling strange about it 😅

[hexed jewel]

my steak too juicy?

[crude folio]

sorry i realise it comes across as a humble brag, but i am actually just feeling very weird about it. declined because i don't want to move to London lol

[warm sand]

They places around me either close just after I come home or they have alchahol which won't let me work there

[next plover]

No but you can't get professional experience without a job you'll have to make your own

I started a blog and did a bunch of cybersecurity stuff and it worked out, never had even a full time job before that

[open ivy]

Setting boundaries in a job must be firm and flexible.

Being overworked is more dangerous for job security (burnout) than the immediate loss of performance from boundary setting. And for health in general.

But let's say there really is a fire drill, and it takes one all nighter. Much more critical than daily average. Then you take off the next two days. So a strict bedtime won't work

But what is an actual more-than-average event vs just mundane stuff?

[peak halo]

These messages read as though they were originally written for platforms like LinkedIn and Twitter, and they either don't contribute anything to the discourse in this channel, or (in the case of the message you posted for MLK day) incite discourse that is counter-productive. This is your official notice to stop posting them.

[wild finch]

im looking for a blockchain dev.
paid work
please dm to me with reply.

[next plover]

No

[pure locust]

Looking for full-stack jobs in DACH/EU startups. Where do you find interesting opportunities?

[vital ravine]

Do you guys recommend going into ML, Data engineering, backend, or full-stack development for a better chance to get a junior position in a company? I’ve finished my first full stack project on Django making a movie website database, now working on a CRM website, and I wanna work on a hotel booking system with Django. I love working with Django but I can rarely find any junior positions available in Slovakia where I’m living in. I’m learning new things everyday which I enjoy and I do enjoy solving problems where I get stuck on and figuring it out. It’s so rewarding when you finally fix the problem you’ve been stuck on for hours 😭. Anyways, I’m asking because I’m wondering if I should pivot to something new because it might be more in demand for the job market where I can get a junior position?

[peak halo]

If you don't already have academic credentials related to ML or can't get them, you can exclude ML positions from your search.

[vital ravine]

Nope I only got acedemic credentials in web dev

[rapid holly]

What counts as academic credentials?

[peak halo]

in this context: having taken courses about ML, probably at a masters level, and having a degree.

[rapid holly]

how about an ml researcher with good track record + no degree?

[peak halo]

what do you mean "good track record"?

[rapid holly]

did actual research or evidence that they've solved an open problem etc? stuff that goes beyond just training a model.

[peak halo]

even if you do, if you don't have a degree, there's pretty much no chance that an employer would consider you over an applicant who does. this is true for ML more than conventional development jobs.
I'm not saying this is how it should be, it's just how it is.

[winter prawn]

hello every one

[true harness]

it is also incredibly unlikely to do correct research without the support of a university system and education

[winter prawn]

i want to ask where should i head
after learing pythong
i am at intermediate level

[wind eagle]

that's true

Its one of the main reasons I got into uni

[buoyant ocean]

Data engineering is the field I am in and it’s incredibly rewarding and lucrative. I work with ADF, Bimlflex, Databricks, Spark, Python and everything in between.

[empty mortar]

hello everyone, i wanted some guidance on what type of field i should get into in CS. I am currently pursuing a degree in Computer Science and Business Systems. I am still in year one but i want to get into specialization soon and im not sure what i like

[wind eagle]

You should get into cybersecurity

[empty mortar]

I am enjoying learning about finance and its quite interesting for me and thats pretty much it what i like in college lol, my C programming professor is terrible at teaching

[wind eagle]

Mine too bro

[fringe sphinx]

Specialization is tough. The best way to start, imo, is generalization. Do different things and build up a strong foundation: you never know what skills you'll need

[empty mortar]

i kind of like things that i visualize...

[rapid holly]

there are ofcourse exceptions who has done it without uni but its hard!! and you need to be super invested in craft and nothing else much!

[wind eagle]

What do you mean?

[empty mortar]

but people tell me that you shouldn't go out learning every language and its a terrible idea. what do u think?

[wind eagle]

craft?

[fringe sphinx]

Generalization doesn't mean 'learning lots of languages'. It means: solving different types of problems

[empty mortar]

like if i were to do frontend dev, i can see what i am doing visually. but if its like backend stuff not rlly.. ykw i mean?

[rapid holly]

try a bunch of things and you'll figure it out!!

[fringe sphinx]

If you're interested in finance, do some simple regressions and plot them in charts

[buoyant ocean]

More opportunities in backend

[wind eagle]

Go become a frondend dev

[rapid holly]

y3p especially when you're just doing bachelors

[fringe sphinx]

Play around with plotly, and notebooks, and some data analysis

[empty mortar]

i think i want to try data analysis alot because it aligns with finance and i dont mind if my first placement isn't related to it

[stiff plume]

https://murmur-smoky.vercel.app/ test my chatting platform i made it review it

[fringe sphinx]

Yup, don't think of it now as 'specializing'. Think of it as 'exploring'

[empty mortar]

yea i have heard :// i will look into it though, maybe i just havent seen how it rlly works.

[rapid holly]

aren't they doing CS so why not just follow the curriculum? and delve deep into what seems interesting?

[buoyant ocean]

Get into Jupyter. Streamlit is also becoming bigger. Check out using DuckDB, Polars etc

[fringe sphinx]

I'm thought they were asking about extracurricular projects

[fringe sphinx]

Wait, are you me?

[rapid holly]

oh... fairs

[empty mortar]

its just that my teacher is like terrible at teaching and i haven't been liking C very much either and we are studying DSA rn and im kind of clueless. he just demotivates us all the time saying we aren't gonna get jobs etc and hasn't said anything positive rlly. hes a nice guy and knows his stuff but he just doesnt know how to teach students

[empty mortar]

thanks man 🙂

[fringe sphinx]

Projects are the way

[rapid holly]

thats all good, suffering is the start the fact that you're able to do it with all that demotivation is just gonna make you more strong and exceptional!

"don't choose a path make your own trial"
~ Ralph Waldo Emerson

[buoyant ocean]

A good way to get started is with public datasets. Head to UNESCO and checkout their public datasets on all the stuff they track. Practice ingesting data to a “bronze layer”, then practice cleaning it for your “silver layer” then produce a semantic dataset for your “gold layer”. And then build a visualisation dashboard in Streamlit 😊

[empty mortar]

yea exam wise i do really well in college. i am just lacking in programming though because i come form biology background and others came from a cs background in school so the struggle is real lol..

[buoyant ocean]

That’s a typical flow that you’ll encounter at many, many organisations.

[rapid holly]

also a lil advice by a math professor.. when introduced to a new idea always ask why you should care

so for eg maybe if you're being taught Trees you should think whats a good use of em!!

[rapid holly]

you were studying med before? why did you make a switch (js curious)?

[empty mortar]

noo i meant in school i was studying bio maths, while others studied cs

[rapid holly]

just code a bunch like other said you'll be fine.

[buoyant ocean]

Learning to program is free! Lots of great resources out their and best practices to follow

[empty mortar]

thanks guys 🙂 i will keep you guys updated

[next plover]

wth?

<@&831776746206265384> we got a bot

[tender thicket]

!cleanban 1460296566043574550 image spam

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @dim heron permanently.

[high nacelle]

[timber lagoon]

this might be better in #pedagogy but how do people get into tutoring python? are there any well liked platforms or strategies?

[peak halo]

(not better for #pedagogy)

[smoky quest]

scaling what?

[pine sleet]

bro made a money duping machine?

[whole flare]

so all those youtube videos were real?

[still condor]

I think they fixed it in later versions of minecraft

[smoky quest]

Scaling business could mean:

• scaling your sales force. Hiring more sales people, expanding in different markets
• Scaling your customer success. Having more business means more support load
• Scaling your finance practice. It's one thing to manage finance/accounting/receivables with a few customers, but a different thing as you get bigger

Though given we are on python discord, I will restrict it to scaling from a technical perspective.
In that case, I would say to ignore the implementation details and assume it's a black box. So from there, do some load testing. Assume you 10x the number of customers, then how would you shape the traffic and requests and see what breaks.
But yeah, being vibe coded means you might result in a super expensive and time consuming rewrite

[fringe sphinx]

If this is some trading bot: consider that certain strategies work until they don't. And when they don't, it can really wipe you out.

[smoky quest]

So what do you mean by scaling your trading bot? More money? More markets/venues/something else?

What is the end state for you?

how does it compare to today?

I would suggest to diversity your strategies so that you have multiple uncorrelated strategies

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, that's the fundamental concern of any hedge fund... even sophisticated funds may use third party traders to manage their blotter

[smoky quest]

Yes. In terms of that onoe strategy, it may not always work all the time. And as you scale volume, you will start impacting trading of that specific thing.
So you will have to be more knowledgeable about market microstructure, how it behaves and do some proper analysis.

Besides that, looking at your idea and trying to implement it in different market where applicable (ex: US market vs EU vs Asia vs crypto vs fx, etc.)

there is no free lunch

[fringe sphinx]

As they say in golf, the woods are full of the long hitters.

[smoky quest]

But diversification is key to resilience

[molten dirge]

💀

how many cons are you in with 😭

[smoky quest]

what does that mean?

[vital ravine]

Any advice on where I should start?

[mortal wedge]

Are you guys finding networking to be worth it? I've gotten positive recommendations from two C-suite level people and one technical lead and so far I'm 0 for 2 from the C suites (didn't even get a phone call) and I'm still waiting on the one from the tech lead. So right now it just doesn't seem like a good time investment

But it still takes time and effort to woo the c-suites into being willing to give a positive rec for you and then to just not even get a call is gutting

[open ivy]

I've gotten so little feedback from cold applications that networking, comparatively speaking, is much better for me even though there is no magic bullet. But this is highly individual.

But I would rather have genuine relationships in tech that don't give me a job over faking and wooing my way through life. The former is more robust.

[mortal wedge]

I think it's just gut wrenching to have a C-suite level person hand your resume to the hiring manager, give a positive recommendation, and for the role to close without even a phone screen

But at least I spoke to the C-suite person contact who at least interacted with my face ig

[open ivy]

Feedback is valuable and you still have that contact. So something worked but something else wasn't perfect.

Just treat it like a relationship where you help them when you get a chance to with whatever. Both of you will benefit. Even if it is just letting them ramble about their passion labors of love to you.

[mortal wedge]

Yeah, that's not bad idea(s). Honestly I'm not even sure it's something wrong with me. The first I think they just said they were flooded with applicants and I guess they had one in there they really liked who got back to them before they even fully looked through their second batch of applicants I was in. And the second I have no clue. The third.... we'll see I guess. Me and the lead think it would be great to work together, we're both intelligent and he has.... not sugarcoated this and said he'd love to work with someone of a similar level of intelligence as opposed to his current coworkers >.> I just really hope his rec carries weight

[open ivy]

Do you feel that you struggle with a specific social or technical skill that others are better? Have you measured yourself, to see that you actually are worse off than average?

If not, then there is no evidence that anything is wrong with you.

[mortal wedge]

There is something that I'm trying to actively work on, and I think I'm doing well at it? When technical topics come up, by impulse is to info dump and try to present all relevant factual details about the topic, but I think maybe that can give off the wrong vibes. So I'm trying to practice explaining complex topics to other people in a way that helps them feel smart as opposed to trying to be absolutely comprehensive or correct. Maybe more like a mentor explains something instead of how a professor explains something.

But otherwise I'm really not sure.

[static depot]

hello

what's the best version of python?

[peak halo]

There isn't one. Why do you ask?

[static depot]

I mean, I'm referring to the version with the most compatibility between libraries.

[peak halo]

Usually one or two versions behind latest

[mortal wedge]

I suppose it's tangentially career related, but most companies don't want to have a python version where there are no longer security updates, but don't want the latest version that may break some library versions. So @peak halo 's answer is on point, best to be familiar with versions that are a couple versions behind the latest

[open ivy]

From a "learn Python" of view the version hardly matters unless very old.

[open ivy]

Vibe is tricky. Especially if you get desperate for a job, that ruins the vibe.

I conceptualize a job as a very nice-to-have rather than an absolute necessity. To be driven toward it but not desperate for it.

[stiff plume]

Yooi

[balmy ravine]

Welcome, I'm new to the server.

I want to be part of a team

[cold bison]

Hi, I’m Jash Kevadiya, an AI Automation & Generative AI Developer with hands-on experience in building intelligent systems using Machine Learning, Deep Learning, and Large Language Models. I specialize in designing end-to-end AI solutions from data pipelines and model development to automation workflows and real-world deployment. I enjoy solving complex problems and turning AI ideas into scalable, production-ready systems.

I am struggling to find my first project as a freelancer. need an experienced freelancer to guide me.

[smoky bloom]

Probably your casual IA related question: How many of you have successfully implemented chatgpt in your workflow? Is it worth the money and does it impact the time of completion drastically (if so, any examples where it did the most)?

[timber delta]

Does anyone know if choosing an IUT instead of an engineering school in France can still lead to a great career at companies like AWS or Google?

[near stirrup]

i am for new for this community also for python so please can someone share their experience about python or relating programming stufff

[stiff shore]

Hi, i have been learning python for around 4 weeks, and i have a question. Its better to specialize in one type of coding or to know many differents

[peak halo]

you don't need to commit to a specialty quite yet, but professional devs usually have a specialization.

[timber delta]

I have a question that has probably been asked a million times, but will the developer profession—aside from AI developers—die out in the coming years?

[hexed jewel]

no

[timber delta]

thx

[smoky quest]

That would deliver a DUT, which is still technician level. Better than a BTS but still below license/masters

[smoky quest]

no

[smoky quest]

note a DUT can be a great way to get into an engineering school too. Get a DUT computer science and then apply to an engineering school. Though you still have to be at the top of your class. Engineering school will typically source from prepas, dut and fac. IUT/DUT can be a great trade off between theory and practice

[timber delta]

Yeah I think if I go into a iut I Will be well more determined bcs of the practice than into a prepa

Thx for All your advice guy

[dark thunder]

can someone give me recommendations on how to find internships or even some tools that filters out high volume applicant job posts. I find my self getting ghosted from a lot of these companies on linked in where there are over 100 applicants... or maybe its just my resume lol. but anyways if anyone has recommendations please let me know, thanks!

[peak halo]

are you a university student? does your university have a platform for applying to internships?

[dark thunder]

Yea im in Uni, and we usually just use handshake. which i do use but i notice that the job postings are always on linked in as well and have over 100 applicants usually

[peak halo]

My guess is that applications that come through handshake are preferred to applications from linkedin. because handshake requires you to have confirmed status with a university. whereas it's easier to use AI and automation to send spam applications on linkedin, and there's nothing you can do about those.

[tribal fractal]

804-874-9591 can anyone give me advice? i need advice ASAP

[peak halo]

what are those numbers?

[smoky quest]

Have good sleep and eat healthy

oh wait, I thought the numbers were part of the username. Feels like someone trying to spam someone else

[smoky quest]

Post your resume for feedback and review so we can better advise you

[crisp stream]

!mute 954332064226873404 2w Advertising your site in this server despite being warned previously for this.

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied timeout to @stiff plume until <t:1771140092:f> (14 days).

[sweet grove]

Someone can play my game please

İ send it on dm

[lime badge]

you guys do resume reviews here? need some advice. 10yoe, just finishing up an associate's, and nobody's responding to my applications

[coral hatch]

Hi can someone tell me what requirements are needed to become a IT engineer in India?

[upper junco]

hey does anyone have python practice interview questions? the company doesn’t specify what python knowledge they’re gonna test but i doubt they want more than the basics, nothing about algorithms and data structures is required.

[fresh tinsel]

What pink

[tawdry cloak]

anyone know what a quant does/how to become one? afaik it involves a ton of math, finance and programming

[unique patio]

So I just started my CS journey and my first language is Python I have done procedural programming and a little bit of Opps
And I wanted to make a Python project so I need some suggestions

[surreal violet]

guys is 3k usd/mon good?

im working on 8 projects, one of them pays 3k/mon, another pays 1.5k/mon, another pays 1k/mon, and the other 5 amount to ~4k

[surreal violet]

so its actually like 9.5k per month, but this one pays the most regularly

[regal axle]

Depends where you live and how much time this takes.
If this was all you made, no. But it seems like you are making a lot more right now.

[surreal violet]

thats one of the projects

it pays on the first of the month on the dot. the others might hop a week here and there

[surreal violet]

uh large south asian nation

[peak halo]

3k USD/mo can probably go pretty far in India.

[keen heron]

I want to go to collage for computer scinece but im scared that i wont get any job since ai is kinda taking over

[peak halo]

AI isn't the reason CS grads are having trouble getting jobs.

[keen heron]

ive heard its more difficult

[peak halo]

this: #career-advice message

[surreal violet]

ai is good, but the problem with ai is it will never be enough. there will always be CSE jobs. of course, dont just do CSE. you will need to do some other fields, like mechanical engineering.

ai still cant problem solve or make anything unique thats not already been made. even with access to documentation, it cannot understand anything it hasnt already been trained on.

it very much is just a hype train. people hyping ai to extreme extents are either trying to sell you something, or havent used ai to actually solve a problem.

all ai recently has just been benchmarkmaxxing. even when ai gets good enough to problem solve, jobs will still remain.

[surreal violet]

it is an AI though (Actually Indians)

to answer the think reaction:

people from my country absolutely flood the job market, willing to work for pennies. highly competitive, and as you said, even a dollar goes a long way here

like how are you to compete with 800 million foreigners willing to work 7 days a week for 30 dollars

[next plover]

Then you get breached cause an underpaid worker gets bribed with 5k 🥴

[surreal violet]

indeed. i really do hate the H1Beggar mindset. it makes it harder for me to garner any sort of reputation

"oh youre indian? im sorry, you create technical debt"

its very, very, tiresome to live in a country where people have a "it looks good on paper" mindset

like theyd rather have words on their resume rather than do something worthwhile.

you should see PRs on popular repos. expressjs for example. trash prs with no point, not even pretending to be useful.

all because of this mindset of "Active Contributor to Open Source", "Contributed to XYZ"

even GSoC. my country ruins that. there are youtube videos treating it like some sort of career package, "3 LPA guaranteed package"

it gets extremely annoying

i might have to start masquerading as some other nationality

[icy pagoda]

LLMs are far better than a lot of humans at algorithmic/mathematical problem solving currently

[surreal violet]

ai cannot count. other than what it is pretrained to do, and has been forced, begged to do by the engineers, it really is bad at problem solving

ask it to implement polymorphism in, let us say, lua.

it will completely botch it.

[icy pagoda]

LLMs reported a bunch of open erdos problem solutions post GPT 5.2 which humans didn't solve yet (ofc it can be a marketting trick but marketting tricks which involve posting novel solutions to unsolved problems are fairly epic)

[surreal violet]

ask for an abstract syntax tree. it will botch it beyond belief.

unless youre referring to manifold fuckery, which is a different ball park altogether

[surreal violet]

youre referring to Erdos problem #728

[icy pagoda]

there's been 5+ now

i don't think "they cannot do anything which isn't in their training set" is close to true right now. maybe they struggle with it but the whole point was always generalizing outside their training set

(this isn't claiming they're good enough with programming for any decently complex system right now but they have some good algorithmic/mathematical skills which was traditionally seen as problem solving)

[surreal violet]

on that second point, i googled a bit. thank you for that bit of reading for me 👍

but yeah, ai for programming stumbles on itself a lot. it stumbles on logic, keeping track of the system, and it has a noticeable problem with syntax. if it doesnt know, it often assumes or adamantly hallucinates that the syntax does indeed exist.

i was using ai to write a test for a project recently, and noticed it called a function in my module that does not exist.

i asked why it was using that as it does not exist. it searched the file, and proceeded to tell me that it does exist.

i argued with it for like 3 whole minutes before i gave up and did it myself.

it mightve been my fault, but for its context, i did include the relevant files

[surreal violet]

the lesson learned from this debacale was to just do things myself. theres enough shortcuts for boilerplate.

[vast shoal]

AI can be useful as coding support, but it hinges on a good understanding of what it does well and what it doesn't. For example, if I generate unit test cases, some of them may be wrong, or some of them may need fixing, and I may need to add more cases manually, but it can still save me time compared to writing everything from scratch by hand. Or if I'm troubleshooting a bug, dumping all my evidence into an LLM and asking for suggestions sometimes generates useful leads, and sometimes it doesn't. It doesn't cost much time and effort to ask, so if it doesn't produce anything useful it's not a big deal, but if it does pay off it can be a big win. I might generate code for an internal tool that is simple enough that it falls within the scope of what's possible for an LLM to succeed at, and it won't be customer-facing, so quality concerns are less pertinent. If I couldn't use an LLM to do this, I might not have bothered to create the tool in the first place and just completed that task manually, but since it's possible to do very quickly and easily, it becomes a new viable option. The throughline here is that you can't rely on it to produce accurate results down to the nitty gritty details. But sometimes it's valuable enough if it produces a result that's somewhat, or sometimes, correct, within a restricted scope or context. It's not a silver bullet to automate any and all programming, but it's also not useless, and we shouldn't assume there's nothing inbetween.

[solid parcel]

tl;dr It's fantastic for low downside activities that you may otherwise lack the time or headspace to attempt yourself.

[barren lotus]

this one message has forever changed my attitude towards cover letters

i am smiling when i am writing them, even though it's currently 1 am on a monday (i.e. sunday night)

it becomes so much easier and joyful to write when im just going down the job description and listing out exactly why i am perfect for the job

i might also be going insane

[next plover]

Yes machine learning doing what it was designed for

[near ocean]

Are you sure theyre worth the effort? Is anyone even reading them?

Supposedly recruiters have but a few seconds to look at a CV, what makes you think theyre reading cover letters

[true harness]

cover letters should also include why the company is a good fit for you, not just why you are a good fit for the company

[barren lotus]

doesnt matter anymore

[near ocean]

Doesnt matter because you stopped writing them?

[barren lotus]

even if no one is reading it, i get to praise myself a little bit

[near ocean]

You can praise yourself without cutting into your job applying time

[barren lotus]

it's alright

[barren lotus]

yea i write that too, but only 1 paragraph

[rapid holly]

why do you feel the need to praise yourself tho? are you not being praised enough/getting appreciated well where you currently work?

[barren lotus]

im not being praised by being unemployed

[rapid holly]

mb..

[barren lotus]

i have a cordial working relationship in both my internships, even if i think they are exaggerating my contributions

i dont think a real job would be like that

[rapid holly]

exaggerating in a better or worse way?

[barren lotus]

something something x10 intern (i dont actually believe it)

[rapid holly]

nice

[barren lotus]

im just pointing out that i had good memories of work

[rapid holly]

why don't the offer you a permanent role then?

[barren lotus]

im not a citizen

there are very few companies who are willing to sponsor a work visa for me

[stark flume]

guys

[rapid holly]

yeah but 10x is an exception imo.. unless there are already lot of 10x devs they can have ...which doesn't make you any special..

[barren lotus]

the boss likes to exaggerate a lot

[stark flume]

any tips if i m watching bro code course?)(

[rapid holly]

have you tried talking to the boss personally?

[barren lotus]

that company is no longer operating, for various reasons

[rapid holly]

just code a bunch

[solid parcel]

It's generally less a matter of desire and moreso some jobs insisting that you write one as part of the application process. I had to throw one together last week even to apply to an internal role... On a related note, sod Workday. No, I do not want to manually add in information about all my roles and skills when it's already on my flipping CV and you're also asking for me to upload that.

[rapid holly]

maybe bcz the boss likes to exaggerate a lot

[barren lotus]

i wrote a script specifically to deal with this application form bs

the fact remains that my mental health when writing the cover letter is a lot better than before, when i was following the format that my career advisor gave, to a tee

[solid parcel]

I'm in a happy position where I only apply for roles if they're ones I'm really interested in landing, so fortunately I don't have to go through this faff very often.

[barren lotus]

write a script to shortlist these positions for you lol

[solid parcel]

Yeah I know a lot of engineers who start with a generic recommended format and then adapt it over time to suit their personal preferences. Anecdotally, they do seem to see better results after said adjustments

[solid parcel]

It's a very short list! 😆 My goal is to land an SRE SE L5 at Google in a couple of years. I'm looking to shift laterally at my current org from a cloud engineering/DevOps role into an SRE position to help me fill in a couple of gaps, and that's largely in pursuit of said Google role. I also had a recruiter reach out about a reliability position at IMC, so might pick up conversations with him once I'm through my dissertation in a few months.

[elder lynx]

is cybersecurity somewhat future proof, if not then what niches

[stray minnow]

is computer hardware engineer also good for the future, maybe with some AI specialties as well?

[solid parcel]

Cybersecurity certainly isn't going anywhere anytime soon

[open ivy]

The simplest use case of AI in my expirece is "example code for <this library> doing <this thing>"

Rarely wrong. Easy to test. Saves the pain of looking it up (enshittified web, bad docs, etc).

A "tier 2" use case is "Code snippit that manipulates arrays like this (i.e. sorts thigs a certain way etc)". Also quite simple.

But beyond this, it gets fuzzier because it becomes less clear when the tool is "technobabbling" or actually making good code. And I am skeptical because "synthesizing bigger things from pieces" is going beyond the training data which AI can't really do.

For all of you at the workplace, if they are shoving AI down your throat you can just yes-man and use it for simple things just with care.

No it will not replace you on the job anytime soon.

[stark flume]

Is there anyone here who has looked at bro code ?

[open ivy]

Is that a way men can form support networks and express vunerability while staying "masculine" lol?

Almost everyone is vulnerable and fearful under the right conditions regardless of who they are.

[solid parcel]

There's also much more you can do with it than just writing code. I'm leading a delivery modernisation epic for my team. As part of this, our pipelines will need migrated from Azure DevOps to Harness. I've used Opus 4.5 to map out what each of our (many) pipelines do, and to identify shared dependencies between them. Likely saved 3 days of effort and the output artifact is easily verifiable by an engineer. Even if there are some inaccuracies (and frankly it seems very on the money with this task so far), it's greatly accelerated our starting point.

[open ivy]

Good point!

DevOps is a very different world! Code is a world of "invent your own abstractions" (you want to use libraries when possible of course, but generally meaningful coding projects force you to end up having to invent stuff somewhere).

But DevOps is a menergy of very complex tools that have a right way to use them and plenty of examples of said way. AI excels at knowing the right way of doing things that have been done many times. Example: Amazon Data Firehose is a much more specific narrow-focused tool than a python dict. People can use Firehose instead of putting DIY Python scripts on instances and feeding them the streaming data.

And of course the key word is "easily verifiable" (not sure how cyber security is verified?) so if it makes slop it is rejected with minimal pain.

So I see DevOps as bieng impacted more than, say, designing higher performance algorithms, by AI, at a professional level. Python lives in both worlds and I am focusing more on the "algorithm design" side of things.

But still, DevOps will not have "AI replacing humans" either because cybersecurity is an arms race if nothing else. It just means a more dramatic shift toward strategic thinking for the human.

[stray minnow]

anyone gonna answer me?

[solid parcel]

I'm inclined to agree that DevOps is perhaps at higher risk than software engineering (note the focus on engineering rather than just writing code 😁). Largely because slowly but surely, DevOps is morphing back into being a pure ops role with more modern delivery philosophies. You're often expected to have a passable level of knowledge across a breadth of areas rather than deep expertise in a narrow range.

[open ivy]

Yes.

I remember telling people in biology etc to learn basic Python. Not to become programmers, but to have a tool in their box and an appreciation of what it means to have infinite flexiblity of Turing Completeness.

Conversely, my forey into DevOps showed me what it is like and that I am not that well suited for it. But still a useful tool when, say, they need a quick AWS instance spun up for a test and they have no dedicated DevOps Engineer.

[peak halo]

while more knowledge is better than less, the only occupation I can think of that really benefits from an in-depth knowledge of both is if you're designing AI-oriented hardware ||at NVIDIA||.

[solid parcel]

DevOps arguably worked for a time back in the early 2010, but as complexity has continued to grow, there's been a growing recognition that 'you build it, you run it' isn't particularly scalable. Hence the drive the past few years toward platform engineering. Making it easier for developers to self-service best practice platforms for their applications without needing deep expertise about the implementation details.

[open ivy]

Quantifying Risk to being replaced is tricky.

When machine code got replaced by FORTRAN, how much of a risk was that? And to what extent was it actual risk (lacking needed skills and difficulty re-training) or social risk (bieng percieved as out of date when you could in fact switch quickly).

[smoky quest]

Glad to hear that!
And yes, being human and showing up can make a big difference, especially when you have the technical skills to back it up

[sleek shoal]

How can I get started and get a job in python company?

[nocturne ore]

Pick a domain

[sleek shoal]

I want to do data science

[nocturne ore]

python3 -m venv env
source ./env/bin/activate
pip install pandas numpy matplotlib

and start creating projects with nice visuals for your portfolio 🙂

[sleek shoal]

So I should more work on personal projects rather than some online tasks like leet code?

[nocturne ore]

https://tenor.com/view/why-cry-why-pepe-why-why-pepe-cry-pepe-pepe-cry-gif-5847161834541812219

Your first job is likely to be data entry or something like that, and LeetCode will be useless for that.
Learn MS Excel instead.

[nocturne ore]

Well said

[open ivy]

More time spent on personal projects. But a little leetcode won't hurt as its a change of pace.

My reason? Because personal projects are closer to what work is like and allow you to build up something tangible over time.

Also, team projects are an option.

[sleek shoal]

where can I find a team

[nocturne ore]

https://tenor.com/view/dame-da-ne-guy-kazuma-kiryu-yakuza-john-yakuza-baka-mitai-gif-10933636834592350690

[open ivy]

It is a miniature-scale process of finding a job via networking.

1. Get to know people and their projects. Remember that it is a two way street.
2. Find out what they are working on and if it is interesting. Start small.
3. Ask to help out when you find a match.

Even without payment they are investing time into you by talking to you, so it has a non-zero onboarding cost and you cannot just "jump in".

But the whole picture is "scaled down" from an actual job with lower stakes and shorter timescales. A wind tunnel on a toy plane.

I am not sure if solo or group projects are "better". They have different sets of advantages.

[nocturne ore]

He can use AI too, you know

[open ivy]

We all should use AI to an extent for basic help. But that is a seperate problem.

[sleek shoal]

I love AI, it helps me coding

[nocturne ore]

You are even answering the wrong question. That has nothing to do with his question.

wrong "extent"

[open ivy]

I thought he was askign about human interaction?

[languid zenith]

hello

[harsh jolt]

What are some remote jobs that will hire a person learning python?

[peak halo]

There really aren't any

[harsh jolt]

Mm

[peak halo]

@harsh jolt the market isn't great right now, and even new CS graduates are struggling to get entry-level jobs.
but even during good times, a degree is often table stakes for entry-level jobs. And being a current student is usually a requirement for internships.

[leaden glade]

Hi guys is it worth going for masters to Germany or England?

[smoky quest]

It might be

It depends on your objectives and goals

[shadow locust]

I wanna know as a freshman in college what I should do to get into Quantum Computation

I'm a CS and Math major currently taking Calculus 2 and no physics with knowledge in python

[leaden glade]

oh ok

[serene kite]

quantum computation is pretty hype right now

it's not that rewarding at this stage i think

it is quite cool though

if you are serious about it then stack math + CS fundamentals first, that’s the real meta.

do quantum as a side quest unless you’re aiming for pure research/PhD, i don't think it would help you put food on the table just yet

[peak halo]

From what I can tell, people are struggling to come up with useful quantum algorithms.

[serene kite]

If all you can do is code python you will be better off applying for roles that do not require critical thinking (low stakes reception/ barista jobs)

[barren lotus]

any job in quantum computation is PhD+

[shadow locust]

I see when it comes to cs and math do you have any recommendations for learning more proof based math? I go to NYU and I'm trying to push for honors math which is supposedly way more proof based but I don't know how to self study

I self studied most of the material for calculus two but would like to push my knowledge for the subject further through learning proof and theory

on the cs side I was told leetcode would help a lot with interviews and internships

[serene kite]

discrete maths but this should be a unit in your course

[shadow locust]

wdym?

[serene kite]

what course are you doing in uni?

[icy pagoda]

if you're willing to do a PhD, not much really. you'll essentially be deviating from the traditional CS stuff by focusing on QC

[shadow locust]

2 rn

[serene kite]

bruh, what degrees

[shadow locust]

cs adding math in my second year

[serene kite]

so would that be a dual degree?

[icy pagoda]

just stay in academia and gain research experience under your professors (does anyone there focus on quantum computing? maybe you'll find some in the math/physics department too)

i don't think dual degree is good, just finish your bachelors with good research experience and then apply to PhDs (you'll be saving ~1 year)

[shadow locust]

double not dual

wait no yeah dual thought you meant getting two seperate diplomas for some reason

I see

[serene kite]

you should have a unit on discrete structures by your fourth sem

[shadow locust]

I see

is this math or cs? bc it sounds more cs

[serene kite]

discrete structures is a maths unit, i had that in my cs degree but it's included in maths degree as well

[shadow locust]

I see

[serene kite]

if i was in your shoes i would try to get into quant

that's what I am aiming for right now, but quant ops in australia are more scarce than compared to the us more specifically ny

[shadow locust]

I'm mainly curious as to how exactly to make my application/resume more competitive as a freshman

[shadow locust]

here in new york I was hearing that quant is going to be the next big pathway after AI

[barren lotus]

quant and quantum are 2 different things

[icy pagoda]

if you're actually serious about quantum computation, you'll need to contribute to academic research (quantitative analyst/researcher/quant is fintech, wildly different but pays decently)

[serene kite]

it depends on what you want to do in the future, what field you want to enter.

Right now, I am just doing basic simulation projects in C++ (to support my quant goal)

[shadow locust]

quantum computation*

[shadow locust]

in my opinion I want to do anything that allows me to do math and programming

[serene kite]

quant is pretty closely aligned to that.

[shadow locust]

what exactly is quant

[serene kite]

quantitative trader, uses advanced mathematical models, statistical techniques, and programming (Python, C++, R) to identify, develop, and execute high-frequency or algorithmic trading strategies.

[barren lotus]

supposedly

if they are so smart they wouldnt be working for a company would they

[shadow locust]

interesting

[serene kite]

look into coding jesus on youtube he used to work as a quant apparently

[shadow locust]

how intense is quant

[serene kite]

smart doesn't always equate to not working for a company, even if you are smart you will get nowhere if you don't know how to work with other people

[barren lotus]

if they can develop these money making algorithms why dont they just go and invest with their own money

[shadow locust]

very interesting

[barren lotus]

why would anyone choose to do youtube if they have a free money printer

[shadow locust]

hmmm I do like making a lot of money as well

[serene kite]

i think the problem is scale, if i have 300k in my bank, i might make about 30k on profits,

however, if a company/ hedge fund has 300m available the profits look a lot different,

i would rather work for a company which has 300m available to trade rather than solo with 300k

[shadow locust]

I've been applying for research positions in my university but I don't fully understand what they do

[barren lotus]

the salary you earn is obviously less than the profits the company/hedge fund make

[serene kite]

that's his story and i can't answer that, burn outs are quite common in the industry so maybe he worked a few years and right now is trying to build something of his own

[barren lotus]

quantum research position?

[shadow locust]

no like what is research

[serene kite]

of course, but if the company makes 30m on profits, asking for 400k+ a year isn't a big ask. wayy better than if i was doing it solo with 300k and getting 30k

i would rather get 10% of 30 million than 100% of 30k

[icy pagoda]

uh, it'll mostly be "read papers -> figure out some math -> repeat"

[serene kite]

i guess it's just looking into theories and proving something?

[icy pagoda]

occasionally practical implementations but that's rare for QC (you might still need to do it at some point of the process but it'll majorly just be theoretical)

[shadow locust]

How does that make a resume more competitive? (I'm pretty clueless when it comes to the work indeustry)

[serene kite]

i guess, it shows that you know how to operate in the scientific realm

anyways, if you have some time available i am working on a c++ program to simulate the climate conditions of the world and compare physics vs ml model for prediction and do a 10 year prediction on the different models, happy for you to have a look and contribute if you want and add it to your resume

[icy pagoda]

good research experience is always a positive, and you'll be doing it in your semesters which is great

getting work experience normally requires you to use a break from university. just researching under profs won't need that

[shadow locust]

I would gladly accept except I have no experience in c++ at the moment

[serene kite]

neither do i, i write a pseudocode then i am just using gpt to convert to c++ code then ask it to explain to me how the code works

[smoky quest]

• stroke your ego
• easier job
• free printing money based on views

[shadow locust]

I see

Than yeah I would be interested in looking at it what times are you normally available I can give you the hours I'm normally available

[serene kite]

yeah just send me your availability and your time zone, i don't have the code on github yet but i will do that in a couple days and share it with you

[surreal violet]

im not saying its useless. im saying people dooming about ai and making it seem like some sort of armageddon for programming jobs are incorrect

[amber swan]

I need some advice I wanna have a career in CS and meanwhile I'm learning some python but for cs I need to learn other stuff I know I need to learn like algorithms databases networking what else do I need to learn?

[smoky quest]

In terms of career, a degree is the path of least resistance and with the most opportunities and compensation

[amber swan]

Ye but for now while I still am not going to college/uni for a while I'm self learning, after the army il be getting my degree

[smoky quest]

Sure, but this is #career-advice

if you want to learn python, #python-discussion is more appropriate

if you have a more specific #career-advice question, we would need more details about the role(s) you target

[amber swan]

Where is the best place in. The server to ask what stuff I need to learn for cs career

[smoky quest]

It's way too vague to get any helpful answer. You would need to narrow it down

what is a CS career for you?

[sick harness]

Hello, again, everyone. 🙂

I think I have a little roadmap for myself.

I'm going to learn Python, Bash, and Rust. Plus math needed for programming. Got several books downloaded on my Kindle, it should be a long time, but I think I'll do well if I just buckle down.

I also have a few certificates from LPI I want to get, like the Linux Essentials, Security Essentials, and the LPIC-1.

[smoky quest]

congrats!

[sick harness]

Thank you. 😄 I got, like, at least 3 years of studying to do. I can't go back to college atm, so self-study is my route, it looks like.

[smoky quest]

yeah it's tough!

[solid parcel]

At least in terms of HFT stuff the big players are doing things like creating their own custom networking protocols and ASICS in order to shave tiny nanoseconds off the time it takes for them to execute a trade. As a sole trader, you can't possibly compete on speed regardless of how good you are at designing profitable algorithms.

[smoky quest]

I mean, they might still be trading and do stuff

doesn't have to be HFT as you mentioned

[solid parcel]

No it doesn't, that's just often the world people think of when it comes to quant stuff, so I wanted to highlight an example of why you may not try and go it alone.

[smoky quest]

I recommend people to check quantocracy. It helps see how wide it can be

[solid parcel]

I'd recommend checking out if any job postings around you are actually asking for the certs you mention here. Certs are generally most useful as a means to help you get through an initial sift.

If no-one is actually looking for the certs you've got, they're unlikely to be worth the investment and you may be better of doing the learning without actually spending the money on the exam.

[novel pivot]

Hi

[mossy flame]

who wants to earn extra incomes?

if you can collaborate with me, it is possible..

[vast shoal]

!rule 9

[inner wren]

Rules

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[hexed jewel]

I want to build projects that showcase skills that employers would be interested in, but I can't either find good ideas, or the idea is already done or it's not fun to build because its a boring corporate project.

[next plover]

i pretty much recreated this (but worse): https://github.com/tecknicaltom/dsniff

the months leading up to my interview

i promise they wont give you shit for not inventing something, that is an absurd expectation unless you are like going for a crazy high level role

[hexed jewel]

its my expectation for myself

[next plover]

making a basic networking protocol isnt hard with some basic socket knowlegde if you really want to create something new

[near ocean]

Theres nothing wrong with recreating existing tools

[lime badge]

build something that YOU want to build

[next plover]

i wouldnt go remake TCP or DNS though that would not be fun

[hexed jewel]

stuff i want to build isn't something that employers generally care about

[trim crypt]

it is if the thing you build scratches your itch. usually and normally people would build to turn it into a profit. Some things are best to be built for personal use as its not feasible to charge people for it. So you could just build it for yourself and fix whatever daily problems you have

[hexed jewel]

my original concern is that i dont have good projects to show employers

[trim crypt]

Think of it this way. Do you have a daily problem that you wish that there was an app out there that you can use? If it doesnt exist, build it. If it does exist, does it have a feature that you wish it had? If it doesn't have it, build it. The idea isn't really about the project. Its about your problem solving skill. Thats what employers generally hire us for. We solve problems.

[urban kettle]

Hey guys! I’m fairly new to Python and still struggle with problem sets and problem-solving. Any tips, or is it just something I’ll get better at over time?

[trim crypt]

just practice and practice and you'll get used to it

[urban kettle]

that makes sense 😅 I’ll just keep grinding then. Thanks

[hexed jewel]

sure but none of such projects are ever going to be full-stack commercial applications

[trim crypt]

Yea thats what I said. It doesn't need to be a commercial project. A personal project is fine to brag off to potential employers that I made this thing because it scratched my itch sorta thing.

[near ocean]

If people had to build commercially viable projects to be interviewed and hired the world would have 23 software engineers total

[surreal violet]

to answer that question. you cant make the photo an executable. there is a tool to make different file types into an image, but that requires converting it back into an executable/og file to be usable in that way.

[peak halo]

!warn @surreal violet don't answer malicious questions that moderators had already identified as malicious.

[inner wren]

:ok_hand: applied warning to @surreal violet.

[surreal violet]

😭 nothing i said was helpful to that guy. i said you cant do what hes thinking of doing

[white finch]

im a math major and im torn between data career and low level eng career but my biggest want is to have a job 6 months - 1yr after graduation...so i just want to be employeed what do yall think

right now its not to late for me to switch to Mathematics, Computational and Engineering Mathematics program in our school. I believe after AI, robotics is the future and they will probably be hype for it and rn im loving programming in c++ and intrested in the electrical engineering concepts as well but that doesnt overlap with my math degree as much as data science would but rn im a junior but will probably take things slow and grad in 2.5 yrs I really want to be job ready by grad

[solid parcel]

Building something like a load balancer can be very informative

[fringe sphinx]

Standard advice applies: build projects, build things that interest and challenge you, don't try to specialize: pick things that you know the least about. That's how you get to 'job ready': by building your breadth so you can tackle whatever a job needs

Hiring managers don't go out looking for junior engineers who are robotics or ai experts.... because that's a contradiction (junior vs expert). They go out looking for junior engineers who can be useful and productive at the supporting tasks, and can then learn the specialization required

[mossy flame]

Hello

[elfin fox]

Hi

[fervent valley]

If you need any help in python , plz let me know . Python expert here

[stark flume]

day 2 when i try to learn more python

guys,tell me something that helped u in your python trip

[fringe sphinx]

Ask questions, often. Understanding 'why' is the cheat code to learning efficiently.

[solid parcel]

And I'd note that the why extends to business context rather than just the purely technical, too. Learning to connect the two is a massively high leverage skill.

[white finch]

Thanks for the advice! Yes, a good foundation is important. I am working on mastering my fundlemental skills. This was reassuring to hear.

[whole fulcrum]

Why can't I talk in the room

[vapid violet]

you need to verify in #voice-verification

[nocturne ore]

interesting

[fallow maple]

Hey folks, I'm starting out in the data engineering field - I come from frontend but want to transition. Do you guys know what are the best courses and certifications for a beginner to stand out and land a junior data engineer position?

[short viper]

who tried front-end freelancing?, is it as well paying as what everyone makes it is?

[near ocean]

No, frontend is like the lowest paying field besides game dev in most surveys i've seen

[short viper]

how so?, i seen on upwork people paying upwards of 1k and above

like does it pay bad?, or you work too long to get your comission?

[peak halo]

for how many hours of labor?
and when you compare the hourly rate of freelance work to full-time-employed work, you have to take benefits into account. full-time employees get them, but freelancers do not.

[smoky quest]

1k per what unit?

[polar portal]

holy fuck i just came here from the announcement about posting jobs

[lapis dawn]

how's my resume? I added my personal project to pad things out

[kindred yoke]

@fallow maple I did a similar jump (dev -> more data/backend). I'd focus less on "certs" and more on 1) a solid Python + SQL ase, 2) one end-to-end project (ingest -> clean -> load -> simple dashboard), and 3) learning one stack like Airbyte/Airflow + a cloud (GCP/AWS).
Coursera/Datacamp are fine, but shippping a real project usually stands out more than any cert.

[short viper]

I see, but those numbers are real right?, am not planning to make a living out of this, I wanna do this to have extra projects with client testimonials

I seen comms with 1k, 1.5k some even 2.5k

[short viper]

Per completed commision

[peak halo]

I assume websites like fiverr and upwork will penalize people if they make misleading posts.

[short viper]

I believe so, one of my friends got banned from Upwork for "no reason"

[peak halo]

to be clear, I've never used either platform, on either side.

[short viper]

Fair enough

[long solar]

most hours people have worked in one week?

[peak halo]

Probably 60. Why?

[balmy spade]

93 here but that was quite the exceptional case. 50 these days is pushing my limit while 40 is the normal hard stop.

[long solar]

93 bro is the hustler

[long solar]

Trying to see who has the high score

[harsh jolt]

So should I switch my major to something else? Like IT or sum?

[long solar]

Why would IT be better

[white finch]

dont listen to him, focus on being cracked and give it your all. even if you dont get a cs job, you will have learned so much and surely those skills are transferable to entry lvl roles in different fields

[smoky quest]

how long does it take you to complete a commmision?

[unreal arrow]

Hello all, I need advice.
I'm a 3d animator and I'm learning python. I was looking into roles like technical animators and i saw lots of people saying it is quite difficult and I have two options, I can either go in data science or go in ML but honestly seeing how many people are getting laid off in such large numbers, I have no idea which to choose as my specialization. Would appreciate some advice on what u think.

[lilac yoke]

are you seeking a degree in data science?

[unreal arrow]

i have the option to choose specialization between data science and AI ML

[long solar]

my boss is so cool his greeting is "what up hoe"

[short viper]

Right now its taking me a month to complete a project, some days I don't do work some days I do, but the good thing with react is if you made enough websites you can reuse components to finish websites in even less time

[gleaming otter]

I am looking for devs and this is paid position
Note: Excluding India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Nigeria

[plucky berry]

I am just qurious to know , why not India?

[fierce dagger]

Hi
I am looking for a long term partner to collaborate with me and this will be good extra income and you dont need to have professional skills
Preferred location: Asia (Note: Excluding India, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Nigeria) but other location is also available
Age: 25+
Nice to have: Extra pc or laptop

[balmy mural]

!rule 6 9

[inner wren]

Rules

6. Do not post unapproved advertising.

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[plucky berry]

Hope you get your preffered partner, but can you please tell me why not India??

no objections...
but, I simply wanna know what's the issue??

[near ocean]

Why cant people read the rules or the title of the channel theyre posting in?

[fringe sphinx]

!warn 1238121313793605635 Read channel topic before posting, your post has been deleted

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied warning to @frosty wagon.

[hushed crane]

So I had like 3 THA for 3 shortlisted applications (1st round I guess?).

[fringe sphinx]

Any OA?

[hushed crane]

My first assignment was train and deploy ML pipeline

[hushed crane]

Yes, 2

But for my latest rejection it was the 2nd round.

My friend at SF interviews people for FE roles and there is no DSA test, only role adjacent OAs

[fringe sphinx]

I'm in small tech, so if we ask a DSA question, it's more like a fizz buzz type question

But a lot of people are under the impression that 'FAANG/MANGA' is all about DSA.

[hushed crane]

But yeah I'm feeling discouraged, and I'm not doing this for the money only. But I gotta pay the bills somehow.

[hushed crane]

Thats fair.

[fringe sphinx]

Big tech is tough, high demand/etc, have you looked across the market tho? I assume so but worth asking

[fringe sphinx]

What kind of questions would you consider 'role adjacent'? And what kind of take homes did you get? (I'm asking because I'm curious about other hiring practices, but also because I think other people here would benefit)

[hushed crane]

Yes I just mass apply because its easier to apply than try to figure out if they are worth applying to. I was surprised got into the final round at A.

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, that's hard

[surreal violet]

scams and vibecoding i presume. unfortunate state of my country

[hushed crane]

Online assignements using coderbyte. But he checks the answers manually.

In my case its take home and live coding

Was*

[fringe sphinx]

What was the take home assignment?

(Curious about complexity / effort needed)

[hushed crane]

And explaining the THA that I wrote

I can share it here sure. i'll make sure to censor identifiable info

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, even just general, always interesting to hear

[hushed crane]

This is not from the FAANG application.

That was from a LLM wrapper startup

[peak halo]

!ban @fierce dagger upwork scam

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @fierce dagger permanently.

[peak halo]

!clban 312850997313667075 very spammy job listing for a startup

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @jade flame permanently.

[empty nacelle]

I am looking for devs with at least 5+ years experience who can share own real Github.

[peak halo]

I just banned someone for doing that kind of scam.

[empty nacelle]

what ?

[peak halo]

you're asking how to do a form of identity fraud.

[empty nacelle]

Is it impossible to find developer here ?

[peak halo]

No. Please read the rules and channel descriptions.

[fringe sphinx]

Huh, who's got time for that? It's a good question tho

[lime badge]

what's an "AD" PDF?

[fringe sphinx]

Not reading, I'm assuming sort of policy or rules (directives?)

[hushed crane]

Aircraft directive

[hushed crane]

4 hours time limit

[fringe sphinx]

What level position was this? Just seems like a lot to get in a single pass

[hushed crane]

Jr

[open ivy]

Speaking of networking, anyone had a good back-and-forth conversation about software architecture lately?

These are surprisingly hard to find.

[smoky quest]

they probably assume you are heavily leveraging LLMs

[smoky quest]

I have but that was also an interview

Also have them as part of $JOB where you have to discuss trade off and approaches for complex and large scale projects

[open ivy]

Nice! How did you find such a good workplace vibe? Many don't. Did you filter it with a clever interview question?

[smoky quest]

look for places where people are self starter and want to have an impact. Also look for people who do and not just talk. You also want people who are data driven

[solid parcel]

At virtually any large enterprise you'd be hard pressed to avoid having architectural conversations almost constantly tbh

[smoky quest]

small startups too

[open ivy]

Yea that seems like AI cannot architect very well so it's a place we will still need humans.

[smoky quest]

AI can be a great tool when dealing with architecture

[open ivy]

Do you have any specific examples where AI helped at an architectural level? I only use it for details and code snippets, but maybe I am not taking full advantage of it?

[smoky quest]

It's nice to for its comprehensiveness. It can help making sure you aren't forgetting about some concerns.
You can also use it to bounce some ideas

[solid parcel]

So in short, anywhere xD

[open ivy]

Is bouncing ideas mainly a rubber duck or bring up related knowledge from its training data? Or do you think it somehow is replacing abstract thought!?

And agreed for filling in missing details. That is where the extensive training data helps. A fancy way of doing "set(best_practices) - set(my_practices).

[smoky quest]

yeah. Though to be fair, the problems can be different. For instance a small startup wouldn't have to think about how to roll out something across 15 teams

[solid parcel]

When it comes to code, I've also found it very useful for reporting on the current state of a project. It's pretty damn good at finding code smells

[open ivy]

I guess there are common pitfalls we all can fall into and the training data warns about.

[solid parcel]

It's saved me hours when it comes to finding inconsistent approaches in a couple of our repos 🙂

[smoky quest]

Both. I would recommend to try.
For instance pick a problem and start asking about what are the usual/recommend ways to solve it. You can also ask it are the concerns about it and what you should think about it.
You can even ask it to help you craft a prompt.

[smoky quest]

code doesn't lie

(or forget)

[open ivy]

If it can do more and more high level abstract thinking what skills will stay relevant on the job 5-10 years out!?

[smoky quest]

leveraging them for higher impact

that's assuming your hypothesis is true

[open ivy]

I guess that is a trend that dates back to the days of "if this FORTRAN compiler can make machine code, what skills will be needed now that no one is writing assembly?"

You don't need to know all the transistors in a computer to understand at a broad level how it behaves. Or know how a C++ compiler works to write C++.

But LLMs introduce a new "loss of behavioral understanding". Which is a new issue (mostly) and complicates staying relevant in the workplace.

It's not just "learn this new tool" it's ... a much greater loss of knowing what does what.

[smoky quest]

That is a common problem that has existed for 50 years even without LLMs.
As you grow in seniority, so will your scope. So you will start to focus on the bigger problems (architecture, making sure stuff happens in the right order, the important stuff happens the right way, etc.). But your days are still only 24h long. That means you will not have the time to look at everything in details and will usually ends up in you not having all the details and delegate that to less senior people.
So having to deal with loss of details and knowing what does what already exists

[solid parcel]

Though error codes sure can 😁

[open ivy]

We always have abstracted details away.

Python is a high level language and we aren't aware of all the under the hood details. But we know how Python lists, sets, dicts, classes, etc behave.

Like other tools LLMs are continuing to abstract to higher levels. But what is new is that they introduce an additional challenge that it's hard to even know what the tool will do. I ask "what to do to fix these glitchy jitters in my physics engine" I don't know how it will respond or what it will say (which is also the strength of LLMs).

And whoever masters this will have a big career edge.

[solid parcel]

I'm currently finding out just how difficult it can be to work out what to delegate, when to spend time giving a clear ask to a junior Vs just doing the work yourself and so on... Whole new challenge to get to grips with

[open ivy]

Seems like LLMs have some of this. Which tasks do I delegate to it? I am only doing smaller tasks atm but if I can safely give it bigger chunks then that would help.

[smoky quest]

yeah, that's why aligning on problems and not solutions is key. It helps making sure everyone solves the same problem and understand the expected outcome

[sudden slate]

guys how do I imporve in leetcodee... apparenlty I have been strugglingg in it.. I can do easy without any help like most of it... but medium I have been struggline to understand the question and some I can do half of it but end up not understanding.. hard is way out of my league... any tips on how to improve my skills

I do codewars also like am 5kyu but still struggle in leetcodee

[fringe sphinx]

Ask questions, dig deeper, spend more time thinking and worry less about 'speed'

#algos-and-data-structs is a good place to ask.

[sudden slate]

Ohhhh alrr thankss

[brazen spruce]

hey everyone
i'm going to learn python i know things but i want to start from zero
the goal is being able to do some low budget tasks like
Rename all files in a folder
Merge CSV files
Remove duplicates from CSV
Word counter from text file
Split one CSV into multiple files
and i'm watching now this playlist https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLzMcBGfZo4-mFu00qxl0a67RhjjZj3jXm&si=n1xQ7-M3AhaZ04Kh
any advices?

[peak halo]

watching lessons is fine, but it's very important that you're always writing code to practice what you're learning. you won't retain any information from passively watching videos.

I mean, maybe you'll retain information, but you wouldn't be improving your actual skill

[brazen spruce]

yes i do this while watching
but this is just the start
because you need the basics to start
and thank you for your advice

[fervent grove]

most of the things u try to achieve can be done in plane python already, for simplicity on the CSV transformations i suggest to look into pandas

[solid parcel]

who needs Python for that when awk is a thing? /s

[fervent grove]

cause this is a python DC and he asked for python ._.

[solid parcel]

I was joking, hence the /s, lol. Even aside from it being a Python server, I'd question the sanity of anyone reaching for awk for more than the most trivial of text wrangling

[fervent grove]

ye saw the /s too late ._.

[brazen spruce]

what is that?

[crisp barn]

You ever used bash?

[brazen spruce]

didn't understand the "plane python"
do you mean the base line?
like simple things everyone can do or what?

[brazen spruce]

no

[crisp barn]

Its bourne again shell, what interprets linux commands inside of a terminal

[brazen spruce]

is it like a app or how to work on it
and what is the relation of what i want to learn to get money with simple tasks and this

[crisp barn]

You can use awk for processing some text

[crisp barn]

What OS you have installed on your machine?

[lyric ether]

Sup guys. I'm a new programmer who is interested in getting a CS undergrad degree in US. My two main choices are Purdue(US ranking - 19) and UIUC(US ranking-5). I was wondering if the high tuition fees are going to be worth the job I can secure after graduation since I heard the job market is kinda cooked now. I am not from US btw.

[fringe sphinx]

Both are great schools. CS degrees are important and strongly recommended if you want to get into software engineering. Are you accepted to both uni's?

The future job market is hard to predict, but competent engineers are hard to find and I'm confident good engineers will be in demand. Engineering has always been a well paid field, i don't see that changing.

[pine sleet]

Are you currently not in the US

[lyric ether]

I've been accepted to purdue. As for uiuc im hopeful of getting an acceptance as most of my friends with similar stats managed to get in early.

[lyric ether]

nope

[fringe sphinx]

Those are great schools, impressive.

[lyric ether]

I've always heard that top recruiters don't care about which university you went to or even if you hold a degree. Then again I noticed that they actively hire from top schools. How big of an advantage do you think I might get if I went to such a school instead of a cheaper lower ranked school? Will the ROI be even worth it?

[next plover]

They'll care about a degree over which particular school

[fringe sphinx]

By 'top school', you're talking Stanford, mit, etc. A very small list

Beyond that, I don't think it matters much. My opinion only, other ppl may disagree

[next plover]

An applicant from harvard with 0 personal projects will probably look worse than someone from a normal college and lots of impressive projects

[fringe sphinx]

I suppose a Harvard or mit grad would get a look regardless

[next plover]

Unfortunately

[fringe sphinx]

Everyone's situation is different. I've generally heard people say: if money is the issue, prioritize grad school in US

(Rather than undergrad)

[next plover]

or even go to a community college for your first 2 years for free then transfer

[fringe sphinx]

I'm talking about foreign/non us students

[next plover]

ah i see

[fringe sphinx]

But yes, that too

[lyric ether]

thanks for the advice. Additionally, i was also curious about how big of a factor being an international with need of visa sponsorship will be, especially after the new H1-B regulations, if any of you have any idea.

[fringe sphinx]

Honestly, no idea. I've sponsored h1b's before but it's really uncertain what the landscape will be in 4 years

H1b has been a rollercoaster for past 15 years

But, for a student, hopefully you'll still have OPT w STEM extension

[lyric ether]

Mhmm. I can potentially do that since I also have a full tuition scholarship in a good CS program in Asia. Then again I'm a bit hesitant about grad school as I have always been under the notion that right after graduating with a bachellor's degree I should be in a job.

[neat lotus]

Recently I felt the urge to begin learning Python, I would love for someone to give me advice on the best way to learn and which direction I should head in for what reason. Just a friendly individual with some great advice is what I am looking for!

[fringe sphinx]

Dispel the idea that you 'should' do something. That's just common wisdom that is very situational. Sure, if you -can- get a job, great. But grad school can be part of an overall plan.

[brazen spruce]

windows

[fringe sphinx]

And, in this market, grad school can be a way to target more competitive specializations, like data science

[fringe sphinx]

Could you ask in #python-discussion ?

[lyric ether]

I suppose. The world is changing way too quickly.

[lyric ether]

okay I'll look more into it

[carmine raptor]

Is python worth learning

[fringe sphinx]

You have an infinite set of choices of things to learn. Python is one of many great choices.

[crisp barn]

This is why you dont know what bash is

[neat lotus]

That is asking for career advice though?

[fringe sphinx]

That channel is better for 'how to learn Python' and is more active 🙂

[neat lotus]

Ah, ok

[hushed crane]

What makes you say that

[mortal wedge]

It's for an LLM wrapper startup, lol. Safe to assume they're expecting you to use LLMs

[smoky quest]

because of scope and context

[mortal wedge]

Also, while it's not unique to LLMs, "structured outputs" just SCREAMS OpenAI API.

[smoky quest]

like they won't expect you to write your own OCR. They will expect you to throw the problem at an API which returns you the info and then process that, everything through an LLM

otherwise, no way you can make it happen under 4h

[hushed crane]

Yes they gave me API keys for LLMs/VLMs model

For the document processing / ocr / whatever

[mortal wedge]

Honestly, that was probably the hardest part right there. Definitely much more doable in 4h with those

[fringe sphinx]

The model/serialization part triggered me because; thinking through that and having a good design is something I'd want to think about and carefully model

[mortal wedge]

Did I skim too fast or did they already give you the output structure they wanted?

[fringe sphinx]

I only looked at last bullet of first page

[mortal wedge]

Ah, they give an example on the second page. Whether they're okay with the same fields or if that's just an "example" you're supposed to loosely base it off of who knows

[wide seal]

Anyone know of any worthwhile online training/certification for Python? I am a data analyst by trade, so particularly interested in data analysis and corporate automation with it (e.g. Pandas/Streamlit) and secondarily interested in ML/AI. I need to fill out my development plan and it needs to be less nebulous than "get better at Python".

[sick harness]

PCEP - Certified Entry-Level Python Programmer and PCAP by Python Institute look interesting to me, though I bet you're already past that.

I might try them out.

Has anyone here tried the PCEP or PCAP exams?

They're by Python Institute and they seem cheap to me.

[smoky quest]

None that are worth comparing to a degree

In terms of career, a degree is the path of least resistance and with the most opportunities and compensation.
So python is just one of the many tools you would learn along the way and projects will make stronger statement

Also as a rule of thumb, you should see yourself as a software/ds/ml/ai engineer, not as a python engineer. Learning the language is the easy part and can be done in a matter of hours/days. What matters is what you can do with the tools

[peak halo]

The name "python institute" gives the impression that they're widely recognized as arbiters of python skill, but I don't think they are.

[wide seal]

To be clear, I'm not looking to break into a career. I already have a well-established career, I'm just hoping to upskill to potentially change into a different trajectory. So a degree (while it may give a better fundamental view) is probably untenable along with full-time work.

[peak halo]

@smoky quest I agree, but they're responding to someone who is already working and trying to upskill

[smoky quest]

Sure. Then projects will still make a stronger statement than a python cert

[peak halo]

I'm not saying they're bad, either, to be clear.

[smoky quest]

can you inject some python in your $JOB?

[wide seal]

Yep, that's what I suspected. Thanks for confirming! Already built two tools that are widely used in the org with Python/Streamlit. Am just hoping to get more of a fundamental understanding of stuff like OOP, pythonic data structures, etc as I've had a decade+ of "scripting" (SQL/analysis) and hoping to move more into the automation/application/ML space.

[sick harness]

How does one break into tech without getting a degree? I can't go back to college for 3 years...but I want to learn Python, Bash, Rust, perhaps get LPI certs or these cheap Python Institute certs...

[smoky quest]

That's fantastic! It makes python a non-event a non-problem

[smoky quest]

It comes down to maxing out along:

• education
• experience
• projects

Since you lack in the first 2 parts, that leaves the third.
Though you could look into freelancing for experience, but that will also be its own problem without experience or education

[smoky quest]

out of curiosity, why do you have a 3 years timeout for college?

[sick harness]

I had my student loans discharged due to disability. I can't drive, or see out of my right eye...but I figured computers would be a good field to get into.

[wide seal]

Ignoring the certification component, what is the general consensus on Data Camp's teaching/learnings for the sort of area I'm looking to skill-up in? They currently have a hefty discount on their all-access plan which I am considering as a tax write-off.

[smoky quest]

oh yeah that's tough

[sick harness]

Yeah. :/

[smoky quest]

how does it compare to a masters degree, which is kinda the benchmark for data related positions?

[smoky quest]

I am sure you have already explored that, but it's worth mentioning looking around your state/county job centers for help too

[sick harness]

I have. My caseworker at the Blind and Visual Services tried getting me to take the Network+, but I only had a month to do it all in. :/ So I failed.

I just need...structure, but something decently paced, and recognized in the industry.

[smoky quest]

you can always retake it?

[sick harness]

True...

Hm. Never thought of that, actually. 😅

[smoky quest]

they only care that you pass, not how many times you had to try 😉

[sick harness]

Maybe I should try the Security+ instead. Cybersecurity seems more interesting to me.

And I use Linux, so Linux+, too...

[smoky quest]

one at a time

focus is key

[sick harness]

Yup.

I have so much I want to do. But my focus is junk. 😔

[smoky quest]

do a social media diet, remove tiktok and other notifications, put some music without lyrics and lock in

[sick harness]

I got this music on YouTube I listen to when I try and code. 🙂 It's by Coding Therapy Music.

But yeah...I have a little roadmap for myself. Python, Python Institute certs, LPI certs, learn Bash, learn Rust...

I just gotta walk it now.

[smoky quest]

https://roadmap.sh and https://csed.acm.org/ have some curriculum

https://github.com/ossu/computer-science worth a look too

[sick harness]

Thanks a ton. 🙂

[solid parcel]

I'd caution against getting into the mindset of chasing certs. They can be useful, but their main value generally comes from improving your visibility and chances of surviving an initial CV sift. I'd recommend checking what the sorts of roles you're planning to apply to are actually asking for. If a cert isn't fairly frequently appearing then you're likely to get very little value out of having the piece of paper.

It's perfectly valid to do the learning for a cert and opt not to spend the money on the cert itself.

[sick harness]

Maybe I'll see about just doing the studying, then.

[worthy reef]

Idk if I’m in the wrong channel or not, but I got 60 points on my programming exam the professor told me that if I want, he can give me the 60 points but if I want a better grade I have to do it again in June, i decided to do it again, but Idk if I made the right decision or not

[hushed crane]

Impossible at current market

And probably for the foreseeable future too.
I'm assuming you are on disability. So I guess it make sense to put your time towards learning.

Otherwise if you're a fulltime worker and you think you can break into tech without a degree and just by studying in your free time then...

[fringe sphinx]

Tech is a big industry; it's not just 'software engineering' jobs. Learn about the different types of jobs (including IT, help desk, testing/QA, etc). Many people have gotten their foot in the door and some work experience in a non-developer job and used that as a stepping stone.

[solid parcel]

Certainly not impossible to break in without a degree, albeit the market is in a particularly tricky spot at the moment.

[hushed crane]

I've been searching for jobs for the last 5 months and I have yet to find a job posting that doesn't require a degree

[balmy mural]

I've started seriously looking again this week in the Dutch market. Most jobs list degrees as a nice to have and not a requirement

You'll still be competing against people with degrees though. It's probably a very small minority of people getting jobs without any degrees and any relevant experience

[next plover]

You gotta know people to get in without a degree,

And you have to be very good

[hushed crane]

I agree but yeah this is just from my own experience

[solid parcel]

Very much not true. Networks help, but in most cases, people landing their first role comes down to putting the time into building up capability and an evidence base (e.g. projects).

Learning to position your CV and LinkedIn effectively and to interview well are also crucial (and often overlooked) skills.

[hushed crane]

That is true in the past, at the current market it is borderline impossible.

I knew a guy that got hired back in 2017 who only had a HS diploma. But I've never come across anyone that did it in this day and age 😔

[solid parcel]

It's still entirely true, the bar has just been raised. It's a brutal market, but the core strategy to land a role remains virtually unchanged. It still boils down to become skilled, be visible, be a bit lucky.

[next plover]

Eh automated resume reviews are not helping though

Trust me I wish degrees were optional

[solid parcel]

Agreed they're not helping. When it's an employer's market, presence or lack of a degree is an easy heuristic to filter on. A degree isn't essential, but it does help.

[nocturne ore]

haha

[novel garnet]

Hola

[fringe sphinx]

!ban 1367193058109554731 TradingView scam

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @foggy goblet permanently.

[vale pasture]

In my last year of high school, I learnt python last summer and built a few projects like snake game, pomodoro app and password manager
I don't know what i should do next

[neon marsh]

do you guys usually change resume description just for meet job qualifications? For example when the job says "experience using .net framework" and you resume change "developed java auth service" to "developed c# .net auth service"

[pine sleet]

if you developed both a java and .NET auth service, then yes you can sub in one for the other based off the job

[balmy spade]

I typically use the resume description as a 1-2 line targeted ad for myself to the company's specifically listed needs. "What I will do for you..."

[peak halo]

It's okay (and even encouraged) to tailor your resume to the specific position you're applying to, as long as everything that you say is true.

[vast shoal]

You should definitely not lie and claim you did something you did not, though, even if it's similar.

[smoky quest]

Don't lie. That's super easy to catch and doesn't bring enough benefit to be worth the risk

[timber gull]

Hey so I am working on a windows desktop app, its not done yet but I still wanna tell maybe people who are hiring, or include in my resume, the ideas I have put down for the app. Should I still include it in my resume, and tell people even if it takes a long time to build, or just not put it in the resume?

A response would be appreciated!

[mortal wedge]

I have mixed feelings on this.

It's important to tailor your resume to the position. However, people often stretch the truth or lie on a resume to look like a stronger applicant. This can be things like saying you had a job position that you had in spirit if not in name, rounding up your YOE from 1.5 to 2 to meet a cutoff, etc.

I'm not sure where the line should be drawn. Many companies say things like "used tensorflow for 3 years" as a measure of expertise, when using pytorch is mostly equivalent. I also think years spent using a tool is not a good measure of expertise. (I'd prefer it said 3 years developing neural nets/DL frameworks/whatever).

I do know the line you shouldn't ever cross, however, is misrepresenting your ability to do the job. If you can't do the job you're applying for, you'll get fired and it will blow back on people involved in hiring you which is very uncool (and if you're in a small industry, pretty damning for future careers). Also, pretty much any company doing a background check will be able to figure out the dates you worked at for whichever company you listed on your resume, providing the company is still functioning.

[solid parcel]

If you've not started actually engineering it at all there's not really much to talk about. If you're in the process of building it or have done a lot of architecture work for it, that potentially gives you a talking point at interview. Until you've at least got a decent amount of it built out, I feel it's unlikely that it deserves any space on your CV. Though this does partially come down to how junior you are and what the current state of your CV looks like. Something is better than nothing...

[mortal wedge]

How far along is it? Can you speak to it intelligently in a cohesive way that shows your experience with the process?

I've put projects that I can comfortably speak to that were pretty far along at least in prototyping and I can speak to them. If you're speaking with a technical person, they want to know how well versed you are in the technical aspects of putting that project together, not just if it's on v1.0 or 1.1 or whatever

If you can't speak to it/defend it, don't put it on your resume, is the general rule

[solid parcel]

Agreed that the core point is not misrepresenting your ability to do the job. It's frequently beneficial to peacock on a CV. The skill is understanding what you can reasonably stretch the truth on, and how far.

There are some things that immediately make me mistrust a CV because they're flags that the person is BSing without sufficient comprehension. E.g. Boasting about maintaining 100% uptime...

[timber gull]

I would say midway, its not python related, but its an AI desktop application im trying to develop that can make autonomous decisions and can go into low level computing like GPU CPU info (Computer architecture), so far I have gotten UI/UX down started 6 months ago, but busy

[mortal wedge]

In that case, I'd include it if it's relevant to the role you're applying for. Assuming you're junior.

[mortal wedge]

Agree 100%. (Honestly, I sometimes wonder if some of the positions I'm applying to my resume looks too good to be true... but I legitimately have those accomplishments 😢 )

[solid parcel]

Ha, just too capable for your own good

[mortal wedge]

Hopefully enough curious people will say "wonder if he did this" and then see if I can speak to it.

[timber gull]

Thanks! Ill keep working on it, also thanks for the advice here "If you can't speak to it/defend it, don't put it on your resume, is the general rule"

[mortal wedge]

As someone who has been on both sides of interviews, there's nothing more embarrassing for the applicant and infuriating for the hiring manager to be asked about something on your resume and not be able to speak to it at all.

[mortal wedge]

On a different note, I'm going mad trying to figure out why I'm getting so few interviews even when my resumes line up almost perfectly with a JD. It feels like the signal to noise ratio is really low and I really can't think of any other reason than my resume isn't being read. The only thing I can think of is I'm being degree gated (I'm not applying to positions that require masters or PHDs, but I still might be disqualified on those grounds), or it could truly just be things I have no control over like funding cuts and positions closing.

Maybe low number of tailored applications isn't the strategy and I need to spray and pray? Although I haven't gotten that much success with that either.

[solid parcel]

Imo high tailoring is a luxury. It's one I've been fortunate enough to have afforded to me so far in my career, but if my goal were merely to fairly indiscriminately land a better role, I don't think it's optimal for that.

I think the best balance is having a summary section at the top of your CV where you can swap in the most relevant accomplishments for the specific role you're applying for. It's a nice balance between not tailoring at all, and investing time to the point of diminishing returns.

Tl;Dr Highly tailoring each application may be locally optimal, but is unlikely to be globally optimal.

[mortal wedge]

To be honest, at this point I'd be happy to land any role. I just figured that if I'm a unicorn there's a good chance I'll get an interview, but I'm basically only applying to unicorn roles (not that many of them, 0-2 available per day) and still I'm only getting like one maybe two interviews a month

I think I'm going to pull the trigger on starting a masters program. Found one that I've already mastered like.... 66% of the curriculum? (And the remaining 33% isn't really applicable to me or my career path but I'd need to complete it anyway). Basically just an expensive tax to make me more hirable, which is frustrating,

I have accomplishments that should more than make up for the lack of a higher degree than bachelors, but I don't think they are making their way to any sort of human in the hiring process.

[solid parcel]

Blergh, I hear that. My dissertation kicked off a few days back. It's rough to fit in around a full time job...

[mortal wedge]

Yeah, I'm pretty worried about doing the job and the masters at the same time. The only people I know who did that basically phoned in one or the other (generally they had nothing to do at work somehow so studied at work)

I think I wouldn't consider it if I didn't already know 2/3rds of the curriculum

[solid parcel]

I've found it okay up till now. It's just fitting in the dissertation that I'm concerned about... Work is busy, and a dissertation is just more involved than coursework

[mortal wedge]

Very true

[solid parcel]

Also had the extra element of me not having done a bachelors

so I'm still less familiar with research and the like than the vast majority of people doing a Master's!

[mortal wedge]

Thankfully I've conducted multiple research studies professionally and actually thrive on academic course style learning/performance.

[solid parcel]

You've got a massive leg up on me, then. 😁

[mortal wedge]

Haha, for what it's worth, it doesn't seem to be helping too much currently 🙃

[obsidian harbor]

best course to learn python and job-ready? I am willing to go hardcore 14 hours a day, everyday, I am psycho so I can manage it. I just want to change my life and career. I have soem experice with python so not really zero, I studied robotics engineering but no much code with python, currently live in Europe and I want to start a fresh new life in USA and forget my damn family and friends.

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[obsidian harbor]

Something on high-demand on the market and hard to do, I can learn anything
the type of jobs nor many are made to do

[solid parcel]

I respect the drive, but you won't be able to effectively absorb information for 14 hours a day. If you want to be efficient, you'd be better off researching techniques to maximise retention rather than focusing on the raw number of hours you're studying.

[obsidian harbor]

30 mins intense sport daily, I eat good, no social media, 50 min study/work, 10 min pause x 14 times

Point me towards a direction and I will go hardcore, please.

i really need to change my life, I don't care how hard is it, I just need a good course or roadmap

[solid parcel]

If you go deep into pretty much any area in tech you can make a lot of money. The thing that trips people up is the pace of change can be exhausting to keep up with. I'd massively recommend starting by building up a decent foundation rather than trying to beeline straight away for a specific role. It's a much more sustainable way to find what you enjoy, and as I say you can still make very good money.

I like the following course. It's focused on cloud engineering rather than hardcode dev, and will give you a very good baseline to build from. Once you've got something like this in place, it's easy to dive deeper into whatever elements are interesting you. That could be app dev, observability, reliability etc.

https://learntocloud.guide/

[obsidian harbor]

thank you so much

[solid parcel]

It's also worth thinking about what 'a lot of money' means to you. There comes a point where work/life balance can be more valuable than chasing the incremental value of a higher salary 🙂

[obsidian harbor]

i don't care about my life, has been a miserable hell so far in this damn Romania living on a 800 euro salary paycheck to paycheck, haven't enjoyed anything in this msierable life in my 27 years, so i really don't care about hapiness, it is something untouchable for me, all i care is to make money and leave this shithole country and forget all the people that fucked up my life beyond recognition

[long solar]

Anyone else get a cursor subscription from their work

[placid valley]

Are you EU? Are you looking for leadership positions? In the US a masters doesn't tend to help much with independent contributor positions unless you're in a sub specialty. If you're looking for just any job it might be actively harmful. The job market is just awful. A masters makes you a more expensive hire which may whittle down potential employers who are cost cutting. Just food for thought if you don't think you're going to learn a lot.

[open ivy]

How much of a Thing is AI messing up codebases in the workplace by introducing bugs?

[smoky quest]

|------------------|

That much

There is no hard way to quantify it at a large scale like that

[open ivy]

Is it a significant problem where you work? Or are people careful.

[smoky quest]

it depends on who/when/what/how

[smoky quest]

remember that there are too many people with agendas, be it to work or be bad. So you won't find a "true" assessment.

So when you use it for the cases where it works, it's great. When you misuse it (whether willingly or unwillingly), then it's bad.
And on top of that, it doesn't have to solve all the problems in the world. It only has to make someone more efficient than they were without it.

[open ivy]

As I gradually "up my game" with AI to get it to "think" for me more rather than just basic information and snippets, I will do my best to not misuse it.

[smoky quest]

use it as an augmentation, not a replacement

[torpid sun]

Hello everyone, 👋
So I've been planning to submit my application for GSoC 2026
But there's still time to it.
I need your suggestions and guidance of the same.
Like what is my part i need to do in this 2 months before registration.
Thank you 😊

[mortal wedge]

Thanks for the insight/take! I'm in the US, not interested in leadership. Just.... fairly desperately trying to get hired, kinda blown away by not getting that much traction even within my sub specialty. But at this point really just want to put food on the table

[mint abyss]

Are these skills enough to apply for an AI internship?
Skills: Python, Pandas, NumPy, supervised and unsupervised ML algorithms, Deep Learning (TensorFlow, ANN, CNN, RNN), Generative AI (LangChain, RAG, Ollama, OpenAI, HuggingFace), FastAPI, Vector Databases (Chroma), Graph Databases (Neo4j), and I am still learning Agentic AI.

[solid parcel]

Just listing skills won't get you very far. You'll need to show that you actually know how to build things with them

[balmy mural]

Internships are also normally for university students, in case you aren't a student. Not a worry if you are

[thick moss]

Hey guys! I'm new to python don't know where to start, I'm thinking of CS and I'm 13, how do I start?

[balmy mural]

Pay attention in school and focus on your grades. The best path into CS is via university, so you'll need high enough grades. Outside of that, you could start with something in the resources list and start making progress and building fun projects.

!res

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[thick moss]

oh yeah howto download python.org

[balmy mural]

That's not quite a career related question, you could ask in #python-discussion . But being able to google is also an important skill to have in the field. So see if you can figure it out with a quick google search, and if you get stuck, there will be people to help you out in #python-discussion or in #1035199133436354600

[left storm]

Where do I find my first backend job?

I have just finished a couple of courses for backend work over the last year and I am proficient with tools and this stack:
Python
Flask
SQLAlchemy
PostgreSQL
Docker
RESTapi
Git

Where would I start looking for an entry level job? I'd actually like to do this on the side on upwork or fiverr, but I am not sure if that's a realistic approach or if I am wasting my time trying to get hired on these platforms. They keep popping up as a recommendation when I google, yet they are incredibly hard to get any work on. At least as a beginner.

Over the last month I tried to land some jobs on upwork but I was never picked despite sending a lot of connects. Not sure if it's generally just upwork being difficult, if it's my little experience or just my approach/first message?

Please give any advice that you have on how to get a foot in now that I've laid the groundwork.

[balmy mural]

Job boards like LinkedIn, or whatever is popular where you're located.
On Upwork and similar websites you compete against people with experience who can significantly underbid you if they're from low cost of living countries. Freelancing outside of these online platforms is generally done by people with lots of experience, and who leverage the connections they've made through their years of experience for freelancing jobs.

[left storm]

But linkedin or whatever they seem to not want any entry level devs, only senior level devs with a lot of experience?

So that is one of the main reasons why I ask: Are there better job boards where entry level has better chance?

Linkedin and indeed are the first places one goes afterall. It's not like I didn't try that before.

But I haven't heard anything back and looking at the requirements, it seems a little too steep for me

[balmy mural]

There are entry level jobs on linkedin and indeed. You can specifically filter by Entry Level (On Linkedin). Sometimes whoever posted the job will mark a senior job as entry level, but the majority should be entry level.
Most entry level jobs are going to ask for 2+ YoE. That's their ideal candidate. You can still apply

If you're not hearing anything back, you might have a CV problem. Feel free to post an anonymized version of your CV on this channel. There are people who hang around the channel who do CV reviews

[left storm]

That's exactly what I mean. They ask for an x number of years experience, whch I don#t ahve. I think that's why i haven't heard back and I'd like to try a different approach.

[left storm]

Hm okay. Maybe it's my CV

[balmy mural]

As I said, that's their ideal candidate. I also applied to jobs asking for 2+ YoE when I started out. I still got interviews at those jobs

[left storm]

Thanks. Good to hear it still works? I personally didn't even seriously consider it because it feels like they're only looking for experienced people and that those big job boards are entirely overrun by applicants.

[placid valley]

I was briefly a hiring manager in IT biomed research. Even there the vast vast majority of our engs did not have a masters. The ones who did had transitioned out of comp bio usually into tech. My old department was stripped for parts with the tech downturn. Two of my friends with excellent resumes were on the market for months. The one with a storage background is still looking. The other got bored and is at trader Joe's for the benefits which she actually quite likes while she sorts out her next move.

I would expect a bear market for literally years to come. I'm now disabled, but also a massage therapist for this reason. There will always be an upper crust and they will skew older and they will always have back pain.

[vapid jay]

what r the best careers for python programmer

[peak halo]

there aren't really "careers for python programmer". there are different careers in technology that involve python to varying extents.

[vast shoal]

So far it hasn't been any kind of noticeable issue at my workplace, because our old checks and balances are still in place, so even if someone uses AI to generate code, it still needs to pass through code review, it still needs automated test coverage and it will still be manually tested both by us and by the client. The only way I'd see it mess anything up is by making code take longer to reach production, but I don't subjectively feel like that's been the case.

[vapid jay]

alr

[waxen mesa]

I’m working on networking and diagnostics

[open ivy]

Off topic. This channel is mainly about the social aspects (getting a career means at some point humans have to give you money so human interaction is crucial).
Your post belongs in
#tools-and-devops or #web-development

[peak halo]

!ban 1406331643853017272 You were told before not to use this server to solicit a business relationship, and you did it again. (No other messages in the intervening time.)

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @torn hare permanently.

[buoyant robin]

hello

[mint abyss]

I’ve built GitHub projects that show how I apply these skills in practice.

[fleet otter]

hlo everyone

[gleaming kettle]

Hi 🙋

[left scroll]

hii

[wary sorrel]

Do yall think cybersecurity is a good career option?

[next plover]

If you are passionate, sure

[fast fossil]

what if not

[next plover]

You won't get far

It requires an insane amount of dedication both in and outside of work to keep growing

Like I'm working to get into offsec and it's consumed my life

But I really enjoy it so it's not difficult to learn and study

[kindred rose]

I love that! I want that! Please lmk when done!

[nocturne kite]

Hey guys, I’m new to Python and have recently started learning it. I’m looking for guidance from experienced professionals and would appreciate recommendations on good resources to learn Python. My next goal is to transition into the field of Artificial Intelligence after building a strong foundation in Python.

[peak halo]

Since this is the career advice channel: jobs in AI are among the most degree-requiring in tech. You need at least a bachelors--and usually a masters--to get an entry level role. Knowing that, are you still interested to pursue AI?

[wraith sluice]

if you somehow manage to make an ai without being in a company that would be good

[nocturne kite]

Yes, I am still interested in pursuing AI. I understand that roles in this field often require strong academic qualifications, and I am prepared to invest the time and effort needed to build the required education and skills.

[peak halo]

If what you mean by "making an AI" is creating a model like llama or GPT, only large companies have the millions of dollars and resources required to create one

[peak halo]

Good. What county are you in, and at what level of education?

[peak halo]

Note that making API calls to existing AI is not AI development. It's just software development with API calls

[solid parcel]

Make that billions, nowadays 😁

[ancient walrus]

Heyy everyone
I've had interest in computers (graphic design, app development) since I was young, but I'm having issues figuring out what exactly to study.
I was thinking getting a S.E degree alongside some online cyber security certificates.

What would you all advice? Is this a good plan?

[nocturne kite]

I’m from India and currently studying in 11th grade. From what I’ve learned, developing strong skills in coding can lead to well-paying opportunities, potentially around ₹1million inr per year. However, specializing in AI and related fields may offer even higher earning potential (5-10 million inr per year), sometimes significantly more. This understanding is based on industry trends and information I’ve come across online.

[peak halo]

Are you in north America or Europe? If not, where?

[peak halo]

I do not know how things work in South Asia. I assume you need a degree that's focused on AI. Have you started looking at degree programs that you can apply to?

[nocturne kite]

not yet...

My main goal is to learn AI but like my teachers advised me to go for Python first as it works as a base.

[peak halo]

I would see if you can talk to an AI professional in India, but you should probably start looking at universities and figuring out what their admissions criteria are.

Virtually all AI development is done in python.

But learning python is the easiest part of this whole process.

[nocturne kite]

Fr

[ancient walrus]

At the moment Nigeria, working on getting a scholarship though to study abroad

[viscid cloak]

Just went through 3 stages of interview which required travel and they just told me no via email. Ive already crashed out 7 times. I dont need help just venting.

[peak halo]

I've summoned the greatest Nigerian in all of python discord to talk to you. Hopefully he'll be available soon.

[ancient walrus]

Ooouuu thanks a lot!

[peak halo]

I'm really sorry to hear that. Did they pay for your travel?

[modest bluff]

Hello , i make backend with fastapi + PostgreSQL, are my skill enough for paid work , are these skills on high demand (freelancing) and how can i find clients , i ve heard that on fiverr upwork or similar , there is lot of competition so it s hard for a beginner to find clients

[manic grove]

The greatest? 😀 I doubt that myself

[manic grove]

Hello Atrix 👋

[ancient walrus]

Heyy emyrs

[ancient walrus]

What's your take on this

[manic grove]

If you haven’t started your undergraduate program yet, I’d recommend considering Computer Science rather than a Software Engineering degree.

I also wouldn’t advise pursuing a Cybersecurity degree in Nigeria if you plan to work in Nigeria afterward. Compared to Cybersecurity, a Computer Science and Software Engineering degree offers broader and more practical opportunities locally. Cybersecurity in Nigeria is still not very beginner-friendly, and entry-level roles are quite limited (almost non-existent.)

That said, if your plan is to earn the degree in Nigeria and then relocate to the U.S. or Europe, a Cybersecurity degree could be a worthwhile investment.

[ancient walrus]

Luckily I haven't started, wow I always thought Software Eng. was always a better degree.

Basically If Nigeria then comp sci, if U.S. then I would benefit from Cyber security

By the way if you don't mind me asking where do you at the moment and your role?

Also is there any resources you would recommend to get started?

Or better still if you have time can we turn this into a DM cause I have lot of questions

[jade quarry]

Currently learning Python for backend development but I’m curious if it was getting any of the CompTIA certifications such as A+ Network+ & Security+ ? Any advice ?

[next plover]

What field are you going into?

Certs are good but getting them just to collect them won't mean much unless you can prove you have the knowledge to apply it

[jade quarry]

I want to go the software/developer route, not sure if adding these certs would benefit me in getting there

[manic grove]

I think you should ask here, perhaps others might gain from the conversation?

[normal burrow]

I want to get into a career in devops does anyone have any experience in it and what is it like?

[peak halo]

!warn @quartz tartan your message was removed for advertising a job, which is not allowed.

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied warning to @quartz tartan.

[manic grove]

I'm a graduate student somewhere in Germany. I also do ML Research in PPML and low resource NLP

[solid parcel]

To chime in with a European perspective, even here I think a comp sci degree is often more useful than a cyber degree. A lot of cyber only really makes sense when you have that foundational context, and the route into cyber is often via dev or operational roles initially, and then a lateral shift. Generally the only way I see people get straight into cyber is as a ticket monkey triaging for a SOC, which usually isn't the best environment to learn in.

[solid parcel]

And perhaps even more critically, if anyone else actually cares about the certs... Most of their value typically comes from helping you get your foot in the door, and even then it's largely a matter of just improving visibility with recruiters rather than it being a key differentiator. If no employers are looking for a given cert, it becomes largely useless.

[mortal wedge]

Yes, cybersec is huge. But just a heads up, if you're in the US, you'll eventually run into a career limiter based off of whether or not you can secure a security clearance. That's not to say you can't progress if you don't have one, but a lot of the most lucrative cybersec positions do require sec clearances

And unfortunately, you can't really find out ahead of time, as you can't apply for a sec clearance "for no reason" (interested in pursuing cybersec jobs doesn't count for whatever reason)

[radiant vortex]

+Most CS degrees are well established and there isn't much of a risk behind picking it, but with a cyber course they're generally a lot newer and therefore the content may not be as good (hit or miss)

[mortal wedge]

I think some certs are relevant/desired for certain specific contexts (companies usually love you having a cert if they are the offerer, like Amazon's AWS cert if you're applying to an AWS role at Amazon) but in the general case they're not worth much. But may be helpful if you don't have a college degree?

[solid parcel]

As someone at the tail end of a cybersec Masters, +1 to that.

[solid parcel]

MSPs are a fan of certs as when they have a certain number of employees with certs they can get some benefits from cloud providers. The cloud providers themselves don't really care at all about their certs. If you're working for AWS, you're generally responsible for a specific service. Albeit there are roles like customer engineering and architecture where you do need a good grasp on the breadth of the services involved. My whole career has been Azure and I've had AWS reach out to me a couple of times (thinking back, one of those times it actually was for an architecture role too, lol. They really don't care about the certs).

[dawn lagoon]

Hello?

Anyone there?

[near ocean]

Do you have a question about careers

[dawn lagoon]

sure do

I have graduated from a computer engineering degree and just want to ask whether I should pursue with electrical engineer and mechanical since I would really love to learn more about hardware?

[normal burrow]

anyone got any advice?

[solid parcel]

I work as a cloud/DevOps engineer.

This guide is a good onramp, it'll introduce you to a lot of core concepts. https://learntocloud.guide/

Do you have any education or experience in comp sci/tech?

[neat willow]

Hi! I made a stock trend analyzer in Google Colab and I’d love feedback.

https://colab.research.google.com/drive/1Fe1RamP9X_aHLiPlnVUaWs9SvGsxhWAe?usp=sharing

[peak halo]

Try #1468524576479641744

[neat willow]

Thank you, I will definitely try that. I’m very new here, so I don’t know much

[open ivy]

Lots of new people post in this sub off topic. A common novice mistake, you are forgiven and welcome to the server!

[dreamy shadow]

Any reason you wouldn't be able to use libraries like defaultdict or Counter from collections in the Algorithmic coding portion of an interview?

[peak halo]

If they tell you that you can't use the standard library.

[dreamy shadow]

Yes, but is it a common occurrence to be asked to not be able to use them? i.e. If I'm prepping LC questions, and it's easier for me to just know the defaultdict implementation opposed to using the python built-in dictionary.

[still condor]

I don't think they have any interesting algorithms in them, those are just convenience things

but you can look at the source code at https://github.com/python/cpython/blob/3.14/Lib/collections/__init__.py

[dreamy shadow]

Yes, they simplify a lot of the code needed. dict[val] += 1 vs dict[val] = dict.get(val, 0) + 1 . Looks like I'll just ask the interviewer when the time comes.

[peak halo]

I would just assume you can use stdlib unless/until they say otherwise.

[true harness]

generally if the problem is not specifically related to implementing a data structure, you can use it

[viscid cloak]

if you go for let's say palantir as a job and say get that job, will there be grave consequences for your future employment

[peak halo]

If you go to work for another federal contractor or for the US federal government, they won't care.

Source: I'm from Washington DC and work for a non-profit lab that is government-related.

[smoky quest]

On average no. But applying to companies with a culture of people who hate palantir might get you passed over

[lime badge]

does anyone here work in hong kong? i'm finishing up a degree on the VPAS program here and looking to get a job this year. so far have had no responses to applications despite 10 yoe on my resume

[stoic eagle]

Guys how do i get posted in New York or California in some companies I’m in india

[smoky quest]

you find a company willing to hire you and sponsor your visa

[glossy summit]

Guys as an indian, looking for masters in europe or america. Can someone help?

[serene kite]

is hackerrank good for preparing for data engineering roles? i am doing their sql stuff

[solid parcel]

Palantir has a great rep for talent. That's what orgs will generally care about, much more than any moral qualms. Working there would be a boon for your career, albeit they're not a company I'd want to work for myself.

[normal burrow]

Yeah quite a bit, thx for this tho

[solid parcel]

If you share a little more about your background and where you're trying to get to, I may be able to give some more targeted advice. 'DevOps' is a term that is used to encompass a pretty wide range of different roles and responsibilities 🙂

[normal burrow]

Ig id be more into the programming and internal stuff

I havent really started getting jnto it yet i previously wanted to do API dev but im struggling between that and devops

[near ocean]

Ideally they shouldnt be that different

Unfortunately, yaml wrangling docker nerds have coopted the term

[solid parcel]

Cool, then the link I shared should be a good starting point. The best thing you can do is create an app, including automated infrastructure and deployment mechanisms, and then once you've got that baseline in place you can dive deeper into the parts you actually find interesting. Follow the fun.

[solid parcel]

Said YAML wrangling docker nerds are now known as platform engineers 🙂 Now the devs get a pretty little catalogue where all they need to do is click a button to provision a golden path. It's the closest we could get to giving you guys a picture book 😆

[near ocean]

Not my experience tbqh, theres an Ops team at work that calls themselves devops but all they do is k8s work
I wish i had proper platform devs or was allowed to do the platform work myself

[solid parcel]

Ah boo, yeah platform engineering is still relatively recent. It makes more sense for larger orgs, and typically only gets adopted once the cognitive overhead of a 'you build it, you run it' approach starts to significantly impact velocity (simplifying slightly, but that's a reasonable gist).

[normal burrow]

What are the salaries like in dev ops?

[near ocean]

We never had that approach, there has always been an Ops team back from the days of needing Ops and sysadmins and dbadmins and such
Honestly, boo this whole thing

[solid parcel]

It varies, but generally solid and there's high demand. I'm in the UK with just over 5 YoE. Base of £89,000, TC of £107,000.

[normal burrow]

Damn

[solid parcel]

What country are you in?

[normal burrow]

Uk aswell

[solid parcel]

Ay. Whereabouts? Mine is a bit higher than you'd expect nationally as I'm down in London.

[near ocean]

How close to london are you 💀

[normal burrow]

Around 3 hours in a car

[solid parcel]

Sadly a very pertinent question 😅 Though I've gotta say, most of the DevOps, cloud and SRE roles my org is recruiting for are actually up around Leeds

[normal burrow]

2 hours on train

[solid parcel]

Boo indeed...

[near ocean]

London is the tech hub, with manchester second
You will probably have to move here

[normal burrow]

Im in sheffield its starting to become a lil more techy

[near ocean]

As for roles, i've not seen ads titled devops in a while, but the role still exists and is in demand

[normal burrow]

London rent is going to be the end of me tho if i do decide

[solid parcel]

Commuting is straightforward on the Elizabeth Line. Chelmsford has a fast train that can get you to Liverpool St in 30 mins.

So you could be in a commuter town rather than in London itself. A lot of roles are hybrid, too. I'm in twice a week

[near ocean]

Moving to london is the easy part, find the job first

[solid parcel]

I get recruiters reaching out about reliability, platform, infrastructure, cloud and DevOps engineering roles. In practice, I find the terms are all used in a very malleable fashion.

[near ocean]

I swear 3-4 years ago linkedin and indeed was crawling with "DevOps Engineer" ads tho

[solid parcel]

Yeah, platform engineering is the new thing. In many ways, it's an evolution in response to some of the difficulties with the DevOps approach.

[near ocean]

They changed the language so searching for just devops might not work anymore

[solid parcel]

Ah right, I see what you're saying. Yeah, going off the roles and responsibilities is a better shout than titles alone

[nocturne kite]

I’m currently learning Python from Corey Schafer on YouTube, Is it worth??

[fringe sphinx]

Yes, it's a good resource. You also need to practice, learning isn't just watching.

[nocturne kite]

Yes , like while I watch his video ,my python is opened in the background and like I practice it

[jagged gust]

What is generally expected from a 23-year-old software engineer in terms of skills, problem-solving ability, and professional maturity?

I’m a Python developer and would appreciate perspectives from people with industry experience on what “good progress” looks like at this stage.

[quaint viper]

is there any way i can get a python internship as a minor/

[solid parcel]

Varies massively, tbh. In terms of maturity, you can get hugely different levels of maturity between individuals at 23 so it's hard to define a set expectation beyond basic professional courtesy. Similarly, some engineers have been coding for a decade plus by the time they're entering the workforce, while others are just getting started, so comparing yourself to others is often a matter of apples to pears. Focusing on trajectory rather than current positioning is a more fruitful approach, imo.

[quaint viper]

??

[solid parcel]

Hugely unlikely. What's your goal? If you share that, it'll likely be a more fruitful starting point to the conversation

[near spear]

hey

i know this question have been asked a million times. the thing is i'm very passionate about cs and i'm planing to go to a foreign country to study there and take student loans. i heard a lot of negatives things about this field and i'm afraid when i graduate i woudn't be able to find a j*b and be stuck with my student loans . would you advise me to take risk or not ? thank you very much !

[quaint viper]

Just more on knowledge

[near ocean]

Internships are usually reserved for university students, are you one?

[quaint viper]

nah

[charred temple]

does anyone have advice on how to get a co-op?

[smoky quest]

What did you manager say when you asked that?

The expectations will depend based on many factors, including but not limited to:

• Your skills
• Your role
• What you were hired for
• Your learning rate
• Your country
• Your education

[smoky quest]

It's more like cannibalism rather than new.
Platform used to be the core services of the product (ex: user management, etc.). Now it's more like the SRE++ which was devops++ which was sysadmin++

[icy rune]

haihai

i was learning python last month and got pretty far i made my own ai model that uses decision trees to predict some stuff but i forgot a lot now any course that I can start right back in?

[south agate]

Hello guys I wrote my first code

name = input("Hello and what is your name? ")
print("nice to meet you! " + name)
print("my name is kevin and im 14")
age = input("How old are you? ")
print("welcome to my profile!")
print("=" * 14)

[peak halo]

Hello @south agate, glad to see you're making progress. But this is the career advice channel. Try #python-discussion

[marble knoll]

how would python/other languages help someone like me? i have ~17 years working front of house in restaurants, every position imaginable. i want to pivot into something with more stability. which direction should i be looking in?

[peak halo]

if you haven't worked in a technical field before, a degree in something like computer science is pretty much a must-have.

[marble knoll]

damn, i see, learning python really is something i want to learn for myself, but was hoping it'd be useful in my job searching

[peak halo]

I think it's always a good thing to learn about things that interest you. in either case, Python can be very useful for computer-facing jobs that aren't programming-related, though I'm not sure how much hiring managers for those jobs care.

[marble knoll]

ah, gotcha. yea i've definitely always been interested in tech side of things and i figure having so much customer facing experience could be beneficial. don't particularly like people but i sure can strike up conversations with anyone

[peak halo]

it could, but a degree is still table stakes, really. speaking about jobs in tech.

[marble knoll]

heard that, appreciate your advice, i've been considering schooling again regardless. really did not give it a fair shot when younger

[soft walrus]

hi all
im a cs sophomore and really didnt have a path to pick but something i like to do is automation and i was wondering how do i learn automation and will it help me professionally
other paths dont really interest me much, anyone on a similar path please advise

[vapid jay]

In my third year of computer science engineering degree(6th semester) I have no internship experience or practical skills. All I did in this whole duration of my course so far was try to be disciplined, attend my classes and maintain decent grades (I have 8.5 cgpa rn). I really have no clue what to do further and am clueless as I see people around me getting internships and jobs.

[wooden granite]

If you really want to do automation, you need to know machine learning and deep learning afaik

[solid parcel]

Not at all, automation is a much broader and more fundamental concept than it seems you're imagining. It definitely does not require an understanding of AI.

[modest bluff]

Hello , i am new in freelancing, didn’t get my first client yet , does anyone have some advice please ?

[wooden granite]

Yes I agree. But that will only reach to certain level. If you want to truly automate like agentic ai's you need to learn machine learning and deep learning. Since this is the new meta

[solid parcel]

I'd caution against talking definitively about topics when you seemingly lack much experience in them, particularly if you're advising others. Agents are a tool like any other. In many cases, they are not the most appropriate tool to reach for. Additionally, agents themselves frequently leverage existing deterministic automations to complete their work. It's not nearly as simple as agents and AI being better than the current state of affairs.

[stark tundra]

Hey there,I'm new here and tbh I'm here to take advice from you guys so my university had taught us C programming in 1st semester but I dont know what does even C programming mean so can I directly start from python?

[modest bluff]

Yeah you can start learning python , you don’t need to know C to learn python

[wooden granite]

People wants to earn more money after all. That is the end goal. So I don't really know how it is wrong to advice someone when at the end, it is the same field

[solid parcel]

It's a hugely fundamental skill, absolutely 🙂 What have you enjoyed doing in terms of automation so far?

[solid parcel]

You were saying you need to know machine learning in order to automate effectively, which is blatantly untrue... I wouldn't call that helpful advice

[wooden granite]

I said "afaik" at the end

[solid parcel]

Right, well you know better now...

[wooden granite]

I never disagreed 🤷

[solid parcel]

🤔

[wooden granite]

I was just saying based on the current trend which way he can earn more money

And it is related to automation in some way so....

[modest bluff]

Is there anyone experienced as a freelancer?

[solid parcel]

It's a rough way to make money. I take it you're talking about finding work on Fiverr and similar sites rather than working as a consultant?

The former tends to involve a race to the bottom as you're competing against global talent, including some that are likely in much lower cost of living locations than yourself. It also takes a lot of time bidding for work. People will not be coming directly to you until you've managed to build up a good reputation.

It's generally a time-intensive thing to do, often for little monetary reward. The market is also flooded as there's a lower barrier to entry relative to landing a professional role. Add in the latest generation of LLMs being damn good at the kinds of tasks you could likely offer as a junior (correct me if I'm wrong, given what you've said so far I'm assuming you're a junior), and it's just not a compelling option imo. I think in the vast majority of cases, the better long-term strategy is to prioritise upskilling and building projects to learn, in order to land a decent job.

[modest bluff]

You re right , but i don t really care if clients come from platforms like fiverr or working as a consultant, and btw , i ve heard that platforms like fiverr are full of competitors so i wanna start small then upscale

[solid parcel]

The same largely applies if you're striking out on your own. Most people I know that have managed that have been able to land 1 or 2 pieces of work via their network, and then leverage word of mouth to keep going. It's still a tricky thing to do, and much of what I said above still applies to some extent, but it can be done.

I was drawing a distinction between freelancing and consulting as the latter tends to involve you having strong prior professional experience and being pulled in to provide expertise in a given domain. That can be a much more lucrative place to be, as you're getting paid a premium for your expertise.

[untold herald]

<@&831776746206265384> whatever this it

[still condor]

!cleanban @spring surge selling telegram accounts

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @spring surge permanently.

[ancient walrus]

Hmmmn

[fleet iris]

Do everyone get a job or internship while at university

Because am approaching my final year at university and
I don't think i would be able to land some internship or job

I am not sure what should i do

I can either go for like higher studies
Or look for a job

I wanted to do both by having a remote job

But the problem is, even after applying for some remote internships and jobs
I find it difficult getting responses and finding the perfect one
Like the only one i got reply was some data analysis stuff which i was told to do assignment on
It was like way complex stuff i did what i can and submitted it

I mean thats the only response i got for a remote job

So my problem is i am concerned i will be unemployed after college and the lack of responses for remote jobs

[fringe sphinx]

You should be applying to internships, and failing that, look for research opportunities within the Uni

[solid parcel]

Remote jobs are massively competitive at the moment, too. There are also fewer of them around for junior roles

[fringe sphinx]

Failing that, come up with a meaningful project including getting involved in some open source project of interest. Something that you can stick with for a long period of time: a 1 year project or contribution looks good on a resume

[fleet iris]

Hm i think i could apply to all sorts of internship right. I mean now am applying for everything
Because roles I like (backend) are limited and very competitive

[fringe sphinx]

Secondly, spend your time 'networking'. Join clubs, whatever opportunities, talk to recent alumni and get advice... it doesn't have to be about asking for jobs,

[fleet iris]

Remote*

[fringe sphinx]

Dont be selective about where you apply. Be picky when you have offers to decide between

[fleet iris]

Hm so i think it's common to remain unemployed and build your skills and hope I will make it..

After uni

[fringe sphinx]

You have 1 more year of school, right?

[fleet iris]

Yes i have and a lot of university exams

I won't get much time to build stuff during that period

[fringe sphinx]

Great. Set aside time to look for opportunities. Ask your profs if they have research work.

[solid parcel]

Imo when people are starting out they often make the mistake of approaching networking as something purely transactional, when in reality the value usually comes from building up real rapport and relationships. Regularly engaging with communities can open up so many opportunities you'd never have come across otherwise.

[fleet iris]

We have some examination called Gate for masters i plan to prepare for it