career-advice

[lilac yoke]

If you were to get a CCNA right now I can guarantee you that you could land a network engineering job within a month

Net+ and Sec+ would help

Though you mentioned you had a BS in CS so I'd just go for the CCNA

[remote crater]

It doesn't offer CCNA

Or any Cisco stuff.

[solid parcel]

This unfortunately is not true. Decent cert to get, but far from sufficient to guarantee landing a job quickly in the current market.

[still condor]

!cleanban @pallid light TradingView scam

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @pallid light permanently.

[opaque furnace]

any one can me suggest for internship I'm doing a data science ?

[night sky]

Does somone have tiktok view bot code

[vapid jay]

hi i wonder why my mic was server muted

[fringe sphinx]

#voice-verification

[vapid jay]

thanks

hi guys i am currently studyin data science in china

And thinking about doing an internship, mostly online or offline in China, where should I start? I am a freshman

[fringe sphinx]

That's a great question... I'm in US... I'll let someone in China answer, because I really don't know there.

[timber warren]

Im learning python from chatgpt cuz why not 🤷‍♂️

[peak halo]

be very careful about letting it write code for you, as you'd be cheating yourself out of actually learning.

[timber warren]

Im not like copy n paste guy i rewrite it myself and do a little changes to it

[peak halo]

that might even be too much.

[timber warren]

Wdym?

[peak halo]

to learn, you have to make your own breakthroughs. if ChatGPT is just feeding you information, you're probably tricking yourself into thinking you've learned something, but have not.

[timber warren]

Oh dam

Wait wuts breakthroughs?

[peak halo]

when something that didn't make sense or which seemed insurmountable suddenly makes sense

[timber warren]

Ahh

[timber warren]

Well i'll see if it's actually worth learning python from chatgpt

[fiery prism]

Any network QA engineer out here based out from Chennai or Blr looking out for a change ?

[turbid bobcat]

this is soooo annoying

how about you actually read what I said ?

better yet, stick the whole convo in gemini

such a lazy thing to say to someone exploring different hypothesis

gosh the level of discourse I get on discord

[solid parcel]

This is very patronising given your initial posts were making huge leaps without much at all in the way of evidential support. Some intellectual humility would go a long way.

[open ivy]

The rule of thumb about AI is it does tasks that are boring for experts.

AI job application tools are booming since it is unpleasant, repetitive, and has been done many times before.

For programming AI has, for example, written fft autocorrelation code for me automatically. Because many people have written similar codes before.

The interesting parts of programming once you get to a certain level are more about algorithm design at a strategic level using these building blocks. AI helps speed it up, by acting like a gigantic database, but it does not replace humans here.

Getting a job can still be hard but I don't think AI is that high on the list of reasons why.

[fringe sphinx]

Let's not get personal here. I think you took offense to a fairly innocuous "correlation is not causation" point. They were simply saying, imo, that perhaps the graph is not telling any story at all. I believe I said the same thing.

[fringe sphinx]

Also, let's not get personal... let's agree to disagree without being disagreeable.

[old trail]

👍

Hey please can anyone enlighten me on how to create discord bot, and can you programming languages like python and the rest or does it have its own

[fringe sphinx]

Can you ask in #python-discussion ? There's lots of ways to start.

[old trail]

Ok

Will you answer my question for me there?

[regal night]

are there good scope in bioinformatics?

[fringe sphinx]

wdym?

[regal night]

i mean does bioinformatics job with good paying exists?

[fringe sphinx]

My linkedin says Yes.

[regal night]

can your linkedin guides me which skills should i be acquiring?

[fringe sphinx]

I dunno, my linkedin is tired and wants a nap.

[solid parcel]

It was refreshing to have a break from all the AI slop yesterday, thanks Cloudflare

Have you guys seen the incident write-up? It largely boiled down to a database query making an assumption that no longer held true, and a rust service using unwrap and subsequently panicking when a condition wasn't met.

Their status page coincidentally went down at the same time, which led their SREs on a wild goose chase thinking it may be a DDoS attack, given the status page is hosted on entirely separate infrastructure and has no dependencies on Cloudflare. It was just really, really unfortunate timing...

[regal night]

every single person here is fluent in english

[solid parcel]

They're a bot and likely a scam of some description

[regal night]

yeah who the hell even pays $4k/ month for english

[magic pumice]

chear up, welcome

[regal night]

ok not everyone is fluent.

[solid parcel]

Huh, dense enough to try and scam manually, it seems! I withdraw my bot allegation

[fringe sphinx]

We don't allow recruiting of any type on this server. Read the #rules. Thank you

[magic pumice]

got it

[regal night]

in this economy when there is so much unemployment for so many major field, english earning thousands lol

[floral rapids]

I love Phyton

[hearty mason]

yo can anyone tell me if i upload my django backend with basic html and css as frontend to lovable and ask it to make the frontend better using crazy types of animations and stuff like threejs and gsap nad stuff would it be able to do it?

[near ocean]

No, and also this is #career-advice , not the channel to ask in for stuff like that

[iron goblet]

i want learn about python,
However, I don't know if it's worth pursuing a professional career in cic drle.

[lilac sundial]

QA 😭

[inland talon]

What is this channel even for yall acting like Ai ain't already getting all the jobs 🥀

[solid parcel]

Ha, it's far from managing that. It can't even write a SQL query without hallucinating tables 😆 It's a great tool, nothing more

[inland talon]

I can code anything really fast thanks to Ai, and it will cost me nothing

[lilac yoke]

lego batman is right guys, shut it all down 🙁

[inland talon]

I mean I'm glad yall tried ur best to be good at coding but Ai is just better

[solid parcel]

Yup, it's fantastic for creating a quick proof of concept. Try that for prod code, and you'll find yourself unwrapping a failure variant. That's how you make a Rust service panic, and take out Cloudflare for a few hours 😆

[inland talon]

Actually, I'm pretty sure Ai would be better than you. But I greet your efforts.

[lilac sundial]

ai cant properly solve locus problems in math or even solve for trig identities with a 100% success rate, beyond taking the jobs of QA ppl and some other basic UIUX roles etc i dont see how its still going to replace engineers

[solid parcel]

Now, now, don't forget to mention tier 1/tier 2 helpdesk 😁

[lilac sundial]

i hate TCS

[inland talon]

Last time I donated a cent to a homeless he was wearing a self-made hat made from an engineering degree

[lilac sundial]

i would rather work at infosys for 120 hrs a week than be a tcs slace

[solid parcel]

Alright, that one got a chuckle from me

[inland talon]

U sound ai

😢😢😢

[solid parcel]

Though if he's made a hat from the degree, that sounds more like structural engineering than comp sci 🤔

[lilac sundial]

you sound indian

[fringe sphinx]

I appreciate the effort. But troll elsewhere. Tyvm

[lilac sundial]

hello BB

[inland talon]

No, he told me that he has a computer science engineering degree and he especially mentioned the fact that his job had been taken away by ai

[inland talon]

It's not that important

[inland talon]

Anyways I was ragebaiting u brochacho

[fringe sphinx]

The real question is when will ai take all the ragebaiting jobs?

[solid parcel]

Judging by LinkedIn, several months ago

[inland talon]

First actually potential human made sentence u uttered

[fringe sphinx]

Plz chill tho

[inland talon]

Guys I wish yall a good and successful career at the shelter but I gtg 😛

[fringe sphinx]

We do have a #code-of-conduct that says: be excellent to each other

[inland talon]

Didn't mean to offense anyone

[solid parcel]

Brb, @inland talon has shattered my self esteem. Just off to make a hat out of my degree

[fringe sphinx]

If it's one of those big cowboy hats, I'll be impressed

[solid parcel]

Alas, it's an imaginary one until I finish my Master's in a few months

[inland talon]

What kind of master

Wich country too

[solid parcel]

Cybersecurity. I'm doing it part time alongside my job as a cloud/infrastructure engineer. I'm based in the UK.

[inland talon]

I'm French btw but I wish you to find a well paying job regardless of ethical standards

[solid parcel]

Wayyyy ahead of you, I work for a bank 😆

[inland talon]

Nice to hear, gtg 😛

[silk rapids]

hey im a system engineer for system integration and i want to study it forensics. its part of it security so i need to learn automation and analyzing logs etc. has anyone recommendations how i could learn that besides yt videos?

[solid parcel]

Honestly just start by learning a little SQL and looking into what a SIEM is.

[silk rapids]

thats a good idea! i already can do statesments like select from where statements, and requests with joins etc. but i think i should start learning python

[solid parcel]

Python is extremely useful. You may also find Wireshark fun to poke around at

[silk rapids]

ohh yes, i worked with wireshark and how to analyze traffic - source and destination ip and how to analize TCP (3 way handshake)/UDP DNS, DHCP (DORA) etc.
do you have any idea how to start with python? because i would love to try idk start with analyzing logs etc. but tbh it feels like programmers know everything and i dont even know where to start

[solid parcel]

Automate the Boring Stuff with Python is a great book. I also think CS50 Python is absolutely excellent. Initially learning a language feels hard. It'll get easier once you understand the basic syntax and data structures. That's when you really get to start building fun stuff 🙂

[silk rapids]

you mean this?

[solid parcel]

Yup

[silk rapids]

tbh automate boring stuff as creating folders, rename stuff, uhhm find specific sections in .logs?

i try hackthebox and theres a python path as well, wich is tier 1, are you familiar with it?

[silk rapids]

okay okay i will look at this site! ty :)

[solid parcel]

I haven't used it personally, but have heard decent things.

[silk rapids]

oke oke ill try that one out too then. :)

also would you recommend as IDE PyCharm or VSCode?

[solid parcel]

I've never used Pycharm myself. There's nothing wrong with trying multiple and finding what you like 🙂

[silk rapids]

ill try both then, im familiar with vs code because we learned c# in school but it was so boring i almost forgot everything. also it wont help me in my forensic/cyber security career ig

[silk rapids]

wish me luck haha

[solid parcel]

Yeah I've never been a fan of C#. Boilerplate everywhere

[slender tiger]

If a job you’re applying to shows its salary expectations but when applying to it they still ask what’s your salary expectations. What do you normally put to not immediately eliminate yourself?

[solid parcel]

Somewhere in the top quarter of the range

Or if it's a free text entry, just 'Open to discussion' to avoid giving a number upfront.

[near ocean]

ask if they have a budget
ask for all of the budget

[near ocean]

Unironically, last time i tried this they had validation

[slender tiger]

Ok perfect thank you guys for that

[silk rapids]

"Before i can answer that, i need to know what the rolls budget is :)"

i think the second you say a number youre ducked, because they try to make you work for the lowest amount possible

[solid parcel]

The first numbers both sides give anchors the negotiation.

[slender tiger]

On the application it’s showing me $58,200-$96,030

And I’m stuck in what to put for the salary expectations because it’s required.

[silk rapids]

yea but as an employee youre always at the low side, wich means if you say 50k and they have a 60-70k budget, you make yourself look dumb

[smoky quest]

what's the role/seniority for and how much of a match are you?

[slender tiger]

Ahhhh makes so much sense ngl I assumed otherwise

[smoky quest]

Are you at the top end of the role/seniority?

[silk rapids]

i always say the highest number and write "open to negotiations" :D

[solid parcel]

Urgh, I hate when they give frustratingly broad ranges. That's a massive gap between the top and bottom.

[smoky quest]

For instance, if that band was for junior, it would mean that someone who is a new grad, would be closer to the beginning and someone who is almost ready to be a mid-level, would be on the higher side.
And on top, I assume this band is for tier 1, not all locations

[slender tiger]

All the jobs I’ll be applying to for this company will be entry level. So for the most part I’ll be 75-100% (prob a lil over exaggerated) of a match in most of the cases based on the job descriptions as well

[smoky quest]

are you ready to be midlevel?

[slender tiger]

Brooo tell me about it. I’ve been stuck in this last question for 20min now😭

[silk rapids]

then id take the average and if they try to lowball you, you can look somewhere else

[slender tiger]

That’s the thing I feel like I would have to see their workflow to even judge my self on that

[solid parcel]

Generally a mistake to only pitch for the midpoint, imo

[smoky quest]

Use stuff like https://progression.fyi/

[slender tiger]

Idk maybe I’m overthinking it because I’ve applied to so many these past months so I’m trying my best to take things more slowly and serious

[silk rapids]

its an entry level job though. he needs work expirience. i mean of course it depends on the job and qualification. if its and IT support role or if its SOC Analyst Junior role

[slender tiger]

Yea that’s why I’ve always given them the base number cuz I always assumed u start off with that and build your way up to the max they show

[silk rapids]

well in germany thats how it works as well, some more and some pay less. but usually you start with the lowest here

since you have 0 work expirience and they need to train you too. negative points if you dont have certificates

but every single certificate or experience and skill you have will increase your chance of a higher salary

[smoky quest]

that works better for network/IT than swe dev

[silk rapids]

also wrote my first programm, this "," between the text and the (a+b) killed me. took me 10 minutes to find the mistake xD

[solid parcel]

You've never been better at coding, and you'll never be worse than you are right now 😁 Onwards and upwards!

[vapid violet]

This will make more sense when you learn how functions work because print is a function.

[silk rapids]

also i saw that theres like 3 different ways to do this? people use {a+b}`??

[silk rapids]

for me a function is used when i wanna DO something, idk if that makes sense at all

[silk rapids]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/589824522283122688/1440001101016338553/Unbenannt.webp

[solid parcel]

I enjoyed, haha

[fringe sphinx]

Wrong channel. See #kat-testing plz.

[solid parcel]

10/10 gif. What did you type to find it? My gf would enjoy 😁 @silk rapids

[silk rapids]

holy chickenwing, theres a whole channel dedicated to cattos

[silk rapids]

its from a friend, you can hover over it and mark it with a star, you can find it in your GIFS > favorites

[fringe sphinx]

Yup, and we have three off topics:

!topic

[inner wren]

Off-topic channels

There are three off-topic channels:

• #ot0-psvm’s-eternal-disapproval
• #ot1-perplexing-regexing
• #ot2-never-nester’s-nightmare

The channel names change every night at midnight UTC and are often fun meta references to jokes or conversations that happened on the server.

See our off-topic etiquette page for more guidance on how the channels should be used.

[solid parcel]

Fantastic, cat gif acquired

[silk rapids]

alright, ill use them, thank you! :)

[hollow prism]

@vestal kettle

@low owl

[cold coral]

can anyone help me?
I am learning python language. I am very beginner in it. I am having the problem with terminal portion part. I can't able to run the python file from there and even can't ble to install Pip.
Please help.

[clever elm]

pip is normally installed with python, there's a pretty decent installation guide in resources if you follow the corey schafer link. Normally, it's easier to get your questions answered in the general chat channel. https://discord.com/channels/267624335836053506/267624335836053506

!resources

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[visual flax]

What is the opinion on PSM 1 certification?

[sour quail]

how’s the market rn guys? is it like extremely difficult to find remote jobs in the data/ ml field?

i’m a chemical engineer doing the shift towards data

[edgy mesa]

LETS GO

[vapid violet]

Is the general preference for remote jobs because many people do not want to go into the office or because people do not want to move to the location the office is in? For me it is the second. I am looking for internships and would prefer one in my local area or remote because I do not want to have to move too far away from home

[near ocean]

Are the two not the same

[white relic]

yeah, I would say the same thing to either person honestly

[vapid violet]

same end result but different motivations. I am just curious.

[white relic]

if you're in a position where you can demand full remote work and still pay rent, great for you. but if you need a job, it's pretty normal to move where the jobs are and do the thing where you go to the job.

[visual flax]

#python-discussion

[near ocean]

If you lived in the same city as the work offices, would you still not prefer to go in whenever you wanted, if at all, than whenever they tell you to, for no reason?

[vapid violet]

I would be ok with whenever they tell me. At this point in my life I would probably go in every workday even if I had the choice not to

[near ocean]

You're still young, you'll learn 😂😂

[vapid violet]

Really for an internship I think it is probably best to be in the office because you likely need to communicate with your mentor and other employees more frequently.

[white relic]

eh. I'm more productive in the office, I still go in every day (well, when not on leave).
And I'm probably not what you would call young

[near ocean]

Y'all are weird man

If my commute wasnt 1h i'd probably show up more often, but not if they mandate it

[white relic]

do you not have a choice of where to live?

I mean, I picked my house partially based on distance from work.

[near ocean]

I do, its kind of limited

[white relic]

If you know it's going to be a mostly remote role from the outset, living farther away is fair.

[near ocean]

But even if i lived next to the offices i'd still prefer the fully remote job than the 3x in

[solid parcel]

The market sucks, doubly for grads and juniors. Remote jobs are also unicorns even for highly qualified candidates. Huge volumes of applications, tons of noise to cut through.

[near ocean]

Just gotta get lucky, its a skill

[sour quail]

eh, i see. will continue learning though

[sour quail]

from my POV i prefer remote due to the currency value difference

average salary in egypt is 366 eur/month for ML Engineers, equivalent of some hours for an abroad company

[balmy mural]

Working remotely from a different country they'll be paying the same as local jobs 9/10 times. The lower salary is one of the reasons for hiring remote outside of the country instead of locally

[vapid jay]

I have a really different question, so it's like this... As a programmer what project you guys actually pick, let's say i am learning python but i got bored as i learned basics of python i know all loops and things now i can't find any interesting project for myself, how you guys find one? I can't make a functional calculator again and again 😵, lol i don't even know what i want

[fringe sphinx]

I know in many places, remote workers are paid in the local wage range... altho I know exceptions where they moved to another country while holding their original salary

This is also because remote workers tend to work for a local subsidiary or contract agency.

[balmy mural]

!kin
Here's a cool website with a lot of project ideas that you can have a look at to see what you want to do. These are the type of stuff I did when I was newer. How I pick projects now is more to explore new tech that I'm not familiar with, or to write something that solves a problem for myself, or is just related to something I already find interesting (these would mainly relate to games)

[inner wren]

Kindling Projects

The Kindling projects page contains a list of projects and ideas programmers can tackle to build their skills and knowledge.

[lilac sundial]

whats better if i want to transfer offices to the uk b/w joining aws or amazon both cases sde

location india and i will prolly join around 2029

[fringe sphinx]

That strikes me as something to worry about after you get offers. Those must be very competitive positions, so apply to both.

[pine sleet]

got ghosted by amazon even with a referral its gg

[solid parcel]

Are you on LinkedIn? AWS recruiters are pretty active, I've had them reach out a few times

[pine sleet]

i am

[visual flax]

IS a mohawk unprofessional?

[sacred sedge]

Hello, seniors
Can anyone help me with what I should learn, I wanna go towards ai development & robotics side & bio tech

[true harness]

yes

[pine sleet]

pick what you like more

[sacred sedge]

Ai development

[pine sleet]

theres your answer

[sacred sedge]

What should start learning in that

[vapid jay]

Engeenering is tough ?like idk I am confused I want to learn hacking and there is use of coding too

[silk rapids]

In hacking you need to learn low level language and high level ones as python.

[quasi creek]

huh

i want to learn code to get money

[near ocean]

where did you find an AWS referral robin

do you actually know someone, or is it a campus career fair thing

[pine sleet]

a close family member who works at aws

[near ocean]

and still ghosted? yikes

[pine sleet]

i applied 2 months ago, the status on the portal hasnt changed. idk if im ghosted or amazon just takes forever but i usually assume rejected until i get an email saying otherwise so

[solid parcel]

If you've not heard back, it may be a matter of them having put a hiring freeze in place. I know a couple of guys at AWS. Cuts have been happening, and it's pretty common for hiring freezes to happen around the same kinda time as cuts (though admittedly most commonly as a precursor to them).

[hidden tiger]

huj ci w dupe

HUJ CI W DUPE KURWO

huj hu jhu jhuj

[rocky needle]

kurwa mac

[hidden tiger]

kto polak pisze kutas kurwa xddddddddd

[rocky needle]

ej zainstalujesz tego pythona czy nie pls pls psl pls

[peak halo]

This is the career discussion channel. Please make sure all messages are on-topic and in English.

[hidden tiger]

hello directors

[rocky needle]

hello my name is michi and i pooped in the gyatt

[hidden tiger]

only chat made innnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn SPAIN

[peak halo]

!mute 1437884522753425531 Shitposting in career-discussion

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied timeout to @rocky needle until <t:1763677410:f> (1 hour).

[hidden tiger]

whyy bro my best friends ):::::

[soft prism]

Hi Just joined the server. was looking to chat with someone in data analytics

[true harness]

it is faster to just ask

[soft prism]

i have a btech civil background and i’m already working in the data domain with basic low code tools. i’m intermediate in python and sql learnt them on and off over the years but never got to fully commit. now i want to take this seriously and grow in the field.

i am directionless as in not sure what to do

start with

[vapid violet]

I got a rejection email from them on the 14th for the "Software Development Engineer Internship".

[near ocean]

Have your connection prod and find out

[velvet dawn]

i wanna be a hacer

[vapid jay]

nice

[magic pumice]

hi Ice Wofy! i’ve worked remotely for a while and really enjoy connecting with fellow remote workers. I’d be happy to guide you on how to boost your revenue and make the most of your remote work journey!

[pine sleet]

bro think it linkedin messages

[oblique laurel]

quick question, while im writing a text within vsc, do i need = or no.

= for like when im writing my code

[lilac yoke]

hmm

[lilac yoke]

are you asking about writing a comment? like

name = "tim"
# this is a comment i can do anything

[sacred sedge]

Hello, seniors
I want to go towards ai. Development and biotech, what should I start learning for that,
Somebody please help

[wild grail]

Just saw a junior role that requires 3 years of experience in python and 4 years of total work experience.

[deep zinc]

Question addressed to the people in Industry for 3-5 years

I've worked as a Data Scientist (Senior Associate II) in Alibaba group, got 3 years of experience overall. I left my job in March 2024 and focused solely on personal learning and upscaling my skills (LLMs, GenAI & Data Driven Decision Making) and simultaneously looking for potential good pHD opportunities. I haven't applied to any jobs since March 2024. Should I apply for job or should I focus on getting cloud certifications and keep looking out for pHD?

-# I did some certification too during this time currently studying for AWS, GCP & Azure professional certifications.

[vapid jay]

Hello guys

[lilac sundial]

u aint getting a good phD college unless you have good research and if you are from india then dont bother unless u graduated from an iit

[deep zinc]

I already have 3 publications and i am not from India.

[lilac sundial]

gotcha

well in that case i suggest you look into what you want to do research in and shortlist colleges and other reqs

[tulip pivot]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[fringe sphinx]

That's a very personal decision, often based on your personal ambitions and finances.

[azure heart]

Python is just a tool that lets you interact with a computer/data. You still need another skill to pair with learning python

[fringe sphinx]

I pursued a PhD while working, and never finished it... it felt somewhat pointless to me (I also think I chose my advisor poorly).

[tulip pivot]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[fringe sphinx]

Software Engineering (SWE) jobs? Most require a degree. Look at job postings on LinkedIn.

(mind you, most != all)

[azure heart]

It entirely depends on the exact role/position you want

[tulip pivot]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[deep zinc]

I got finances set for pHD, but getting one is a hassle. But I also think pursuing a pHDis worth it? It has already added 2 years gap in my resume.

[azure heart]

that's too vague

but you should generally have some sort of degree to support your role, it doesn't necessarily have to be a comp sci one

[deep zinc]

i've published research papers, so research wont be an issue. but i an thinking again to get back into industry and literally stop wasting more time

[fringe sphinx]

I think a PhD is generally about personal ambition: is it important to you and do you want to pursue a career of research?

[tulip pivot]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[azure heart]

it's possible but way rarer

[fringe sphinx]

What do they say?

[tulip pivot]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[fringe sphinx]

(I bet they'd say: get a degree)

[tulip pivot]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[azure heart]

yes but it's their resume that likely got them the interview in the first place

[tulip pivot]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[azure heart]

the resume gets you to the interview. They think you have the skills required based on what your resume says, but now they need to really make sure you'll fit the role

[deep zinc]

My inclination for pHD was to secure a more senior role simultaneously adding more papers under my name. I've seen people having a pHD where I was working have a L5-6 role, with less experience. I discussed it with HR they said without pHD climbing the ladder requires Experience 5-6 years, where as if you got a pHD, 2-3 years experience will get you the same role.

[tulip pivot]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[fringe sphinx]

So, 3 years in a phd program will save you 3 years of experience?

[deep zinc]

exactly that confused me.

[tulip pivot]

One message removed from a suspended account.

[deep zinc]

Atleast you need to have masters in tech fields, or have exceptional portfolio to bypass that degree requirement.

[fringe sphinx]

That story doesn't sound right to me. I suspect that is not what happened.

The people I know who've landed jobs without degrees either have some adjacent experience, or through a bit of luck & networking were able to demonstrate their knowledge outside of an interview.

[deep zinc]

Networking is gold. People usually dont get it.

[sly ibex]

I feel like going for a Masters is probably enough tbh and future proof.

[sand hawk]

do you guys know places where the impact of AI on dev is discussed ? i can already see some bad effects, low skills and high ego people are now able to produce a lot by asking gemini to do everything, to them it's a huge bliss because they feel all smart from a sudden, but for me it's not i don't enjoy working this way, so now I fear that i'm gonna become useless if all people like this start to flood the market

[solid parcel]

You're best off talking to industry professionals with some experience under their belt. Discords like this are honestly a pretty good place to find that.

A lot of the people shouting about AI taking jobs are either not in the industry at all, or junior (to the point that they can't recognise the shortcomings of the code AIs produce).

[fringe sphinx]

" I fear that i'm gonna become useless if all people like this start to flood the market": It's funny, I genuinely think the opposite - that I'll become even more useful.

[sand hawk]

@solid parcel let's say it's not AI taking my job, but more like AI changing the dynamics, if allows low skills people to produce as much, and the job feels different

[fringe sphinx]

Why can't high skill people also become higher?

[sand hawk]

can you tell me how you see things in details ?

[sand hawk]

because the market has a limited view in a way, if my colleague can now code a form view on his own thanks to AI, that's great from a customer pov, if I ask gemini to create something crazy complex it might not matter to customers or management

[fringe sphinx]

Software engineering involves a lot of different skills. "Writing code" is just one of them. "Writing boilerplate, generic code that you've written 1000 times before that you have to google every time you do it" is also part of the job. To the extent google stackoverflow ai assistants help me with the drudgery, I welcome it.

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, but why should coding "yet another web form" be hard? Why should centering a div be hard? etc.

[sly ibex]

Is there web development jobs?

[fringe sphinx]

Have you searched on linkedin?

[sly ibex]

@fringe sphinx I feel like a masters degree provides even greater opportunities in comparison to a bachelor. Although that's the minimum

[sly ibex]

I did but I can't remember the job description 😂

[fringe sphinx]

I'm not sure it is really measurable. I'd still recommend a masters, for personal growth, but I'm not sure it has a measurable effect on a career.

[solid parcel]

FWIW, even with scripts of a few hundred lines I find it does some very questionable things. It very much needs someone who knows what they're doing guiding it. You might find it interesting to look into the data around code complexity and regression rates when using AI to write code.

[sly ibex]

Well if one has a bachelor and another one has a master. You will pick the masters over the bachelor right?

[sand hawk]

you have some links, that's interesting

[fringe sphinx]

You're assuming "all things equal", but "all things" are rarely equal.

[solid parcel]

There's a saying that junior devs add code, and senior ones remove it. I hear what you're saying, but I wouldn't be worried. The main difficulty AI introduces is actually at the hiring stage, imo. It can write decent enough sounding CVs that there's a lot more noise to cut through.

[fringe sphinx]

A masters with zero experience vs a bachelors with 2 YoE?

[solid parcel]

Unfortunately not, it's been a few days since I was reading this stuff!

[sly ibex]

Bachelor's I guess?

[fringe sphinx]

It's just hard to answer generically. Maybe. Honestly depends on the person.

[sand hawk]

no worries, i will dig online, now that i know it exists i can find my way

[sly ibex]

True it is difficult though, because they can both be serious candidates

[fringe sphinx]

That said, to be clear: I do think a masters is a good idea.

[sand hawk]

and thanks for the tip

[sly ibex]

It's to be honest. If you want more opportunities in life. Then again, only time can tell the future.

[sand hawk]

it's odd i struggle to word my issue precisely, but seeing problematic overpaid people having a big grin because management decided to pay for their chatgpt use just kills me

[fringe sphinx]

It's really a question of timing. If you have a 4+1 bachelors+masters option, then it's a great idea. If you're about to graduate with a bachelors and can find a job, maybe take the job and do masters part time. If you're about to graduate and can't find a job, maybe a masters would be helpful. There's lots of scenarios.

[sly ibex]

True

[sand hawk]

the same people that refused to do anything are now all serious because they're creating business value thanks to a LLM they have no clue about.. such a red flag, really makes me worried for future jobs

[fringe sphinx]

Are you working in a company with these kinds of people?

[sly ibex]

Only time can tell for that specific individual

[sand hawk]

yes

[sly ibex]

Whether a masters is worth it for them or not

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, I got my masters. I don't think the degree (the paper) really matters... but the education did.

[sand hawk]

i guess it's a cultural incompatibility, maybe your team mates are much better as humans and coworkers, therefore AI use seems to just be a healthy tool for all

[sly ibex]

The paper just says that you have done your training.

[deep zinc]

Masters is not just study work. RND is considered experience. and if you are working as a TA or RA. you are getting paid. and paid professions are already considered as job experience.

[deep zinc]

during my masters i worked with industrial partners in one of my labs. best decision of my life back then

[fringe sphinx]

good point. I hired someone largely because their RA work was relevant / good xp

[near ocean]

People take masters over 2yoe every time going by job ads

[late nexus]

Take it

[oblique laurel]

ye

[pure raft]

in this market if you're just graduating are you recommending a masters degree in something like compsci ai or operations research

or are you recommending trying to just grind code and get a job that way if your job experience is not in tech?

[burnt talon]

i would like some feedback on this CV. any is appreciated :)
should i try to condense it to fit more info in? i ran out of space pretty quickly

(please ping me if you reply)

[buoyant lance]

its look nice ,

[peak halo]

• What organization issues "Certified Professional in Python Programming"?
• "Ability to learn quickly and independently" and "Strong problem-solving" are throw-away lines. Developers are expected to be able to learn new things quickly and to be able to solve problems. That you think you can doesn't tell them anything.
• You should mention that you are a staff member on this server.

[burnt talon]

1. OpenEDG Python Institute (i should probably mention that)
2. thought i'd include those since i see that being asked for in postings all the time, but maybe thats a flawed approach? would like to know
3. not sure what to put as experience for that besides helping with the codejam

@peak halo

[peak halo]

2. I don't think people would read it and think "I am now going to throw away this resume for no other reason", but I think it's pointless while also sounding too self-congratulatory.
3. Sure. And also say that you help people learn python and uphold our code of conduct, or something.

[burnt talon]

okay, thanks for the input

[ancient beacon]

hello everybody

wrong channel sorry

[oblique laurel]

win

[vapid jay]

yoyo fortnite gang

[sand patio]

have you considered using something like Jake's resume template?

[open ivy]

How do you all get people to pay attention to your personal portfolio projects? That is a keystone of my networking strat.

Presumably you also get to learn about their ideas and works. Give and take.

[smoky quest]

I don't.
I do stuff because it's fun or interesting or could be a useful skill for my career. The rest will follow

Though I already have plenty of stuff to show off. So I do understand someone who just starts out might want to think about what combination of projects would 👏 demonstrate 👏 the 👏 most 👏 relevant 👏 skills 👏

[open ivy]

Yes. Although it is hard to imagine ever finishing my portfolio because there are so many directions to take things and its important to stay relevant with up to date tech.

Fun and interesting and career-useful definitely is a big motivator.

[lilac yoke]

Flashy bullet points and an interactive hosted demo to back it up

[burnt talon]

Where can I find that?

[smoky quest]

pinned messages

[burnt talon]

Ah thanks

[gleaming kettle]

Is this the Right Video from the CS50P Curse on YouTube?

The official video?

[still condor]

This is the wrong channel, you should ask in #python-discussion
But no, the official page is https://cs50.harvard.edu/python/. This is just a reupload with no exercises or supplementary materials

[smoky quest]

How does it relate to #career-advice ?

[lunar heron]

Wrong chat

[mint oriole]

Good morning everyone

[gleaming kettle]

Yeah, I know, but I couldn’t send the picture in the other chat, sorry.

[sour juniper]

What careers can I follow (I have learned java and learning python and c++)

[queen summit]

I love that YT channel! So helpful

[ocean torrent]

Guys

[shrewd cloak]

intermediate?

[still condor]

CS50P is for absolute beginners

[pure raft]

^

Wanted to know what that guys take was on masters in this market for more opportunities or just upskilling and applying

[crimson light]

Does anyone know a good, cheap, web hosting provider, UK based?

[smoky quest]

Rule of thumb is that it's a great time to go back to school / upskill yourself when markets are down so that you are ready for when it gets better 🙂

In terms of masters itself:

• Don't go to a masters to compete with bachelors or self taught. Go there to compete with other masters
• It does open the doors to more advanced areas
• Some fields will pretty much require a masters and above (ex: data science/engineering/ml/etc.)
• This is more applicable for down the line when you are more experienced, but some companies might require a masters or above for some senior roles, especially in more advanced fields
• It's great if you plan on emigrating as countries might have different visas and quotas for more educated folks

[deep zinc]

i recommend masters degree for comsci & ai. and during masters i also recommend that look out for potential RND opportunities at the university.

[pure raft]

preciate it. Yeah i'm 34 years old in a US major city, and staying in the US in that major city. Current job has zero crossover to tech. I have a few connections to faang in the city that said I wouldn't need a masters (the connection has an ivy league phd) to get into faang, (said this 2 months ago so the market was still in this spot)

my interests are fintech/faang/optimization, if i did do a masters it would be in either cs/ai or operations research (optimization etc)

[pure raft]

yeah this is pretty attractive not gonna lie, some of the schools i would apply to though are online only, which I would imagine that aspect is nonexistent in terms of its actual value in that regard?

[deep zinc]

Online Masters might have a slight setback on the RND aspect. Labs, mostly require you to be present physically to work on lab tasks. Doing online masters is okay, but i prefer onground masters with physical presence, it teachers you more than just study material.

[deep zinc]

if your plan is to just do masters, and apply for a senior position. that works for upscaling your skills with a few research papers. but f you want community exposure, see how teams work outside of Jira. Have crucial networking opportunity. go for a physical masters, on ground.

[pure raft]

to me, to be honest, I've never had a job in tech, and the community aspect for me at this point i don't really care if i have or not. I mainly want to get my foot in the door and start getting just overall tech work experience. the physical masters i would get would be from a very good private school, and the online masters would be something of the UT austin level or georgia tech type.

also if i had no experience in that regard could i just walk into a senior role without having been a junior? if i had the masters and open source contribution as well or

[balmy river]

@gleaming kettle

[deep zinc]

Then an applied research pathway suits you, where you can showcase your applied research work/published work.

If you have a very good open source portfolio and masters with good publications you have a very high chance of getting hired then a person at bachelors level with no experience.

If during your masters you do some TA/RA work, or work in a lab that pays you, that will be considered as work experience. So its like graduating with having experience already. Then apply for senior roles, thats a good pathway.

[pure raft]

i very much greatly appreciate this. seriously changing my mind now.

[balmy mural]

I disagree. You're unlikely to be able to just walk into a senior role with a masters and TA work experience

[deep zinc]

Seen at at Alibaba.

[balmy mural]

I had colleagues who did their masters while working as software engineers (just takes an extra year to complete). After getting their masters, they then have 3 YoE and a masters. The large majority of them are still not considered seniors at that point

[deep zinc]

not just TA/RA work, collaborative work that happens in labs. Those are projects that are funded and a MOU is signed between a company and a university. these are RND projects that can potentially help the company my utilizing students ofa university on a low package base.

[balmy mural]

If you look at data science/machine learning jobs, having a masters is the minimum requirement for a lot of junior roles. It does not replace the minimum 4-5 years of experience you need to move into a senior position for the average person

[deep zinc]

I got senior associate job role right after I graduated. I was hired by university in my 3rd semester. so when I graduated I had 1 year of exp, 3 publications. it works if you make smart decisions before taking random decisions.

[deep zinc]

no amount of fresh candidates can top a resource having 4-5 years of experience. thats a different thing.

[balmy mural]

But that's generally the requirement for being a senior. 4-5 years of experience. If a fresh candidate can't top that, why would that be considered for a senior role?

I'm not directly involved in recruiting. I'd love the perspective of some of the guys involved in that on this as well

What I can say is the people around me with 3 years of industry experience and a masters don't jump into senior roles

[deep zinc]

Its differs when it comes to RND roles. Lets say an e-commerce company has an RND dpt working on upscaling their interface and trying to incorporate AI into it. Out of 10 Resumes you see a person wth 6 years of experience at managing teams, has a senior software engineer role. then you see a graduate with masters from a reputable university with a handsome amount of publications in the realm of e-commerce and AI integrations.

Who'd you hire ?

There is a miconception that masters is just pure study its not if you do it smartly and get hired in RND work the university is doing. its like studying and gaining experience simultaneously.

[balmy mural]

I feel like that's a strawman. Neither of those would fit into a senior role for my fictional company. The senior resume you put in front of me went down the management track if they're managing teams. I'd want someone that went down the IC track. Someone with 6YoE as a tech lead, staff engineer, principle engineer, etc.

[deep zinc]

I've seen people getting a Lead Data Scientist Role just after graduating from masters. Two of the reasons The University name attached to the degree and the work the did during their masters apart from Studying.

But one interesting this is that on their second job interview they had a tough time explaining their role on why he did not have data scientist experience anywhere on his resume apart from being a lead.

Big jumps are cool but risky.

My advice for people who directly jumped to masters after bachelors is to

• Do masters with good thesis project
• Get hired by the university in their RND Labs by your 3rd semester.
• Do publications

By the time you graduate you got publications and a years experience. Go for a role in startup environment job. get 2 years of exp. at that time with 3 years experience you are already very far ahead of your classmates.

[balmy mural]

A Master's degree in Econometrics, Data Science, AI or a similar field

Master's degree (or equivalent) in Computer Science, Statistics, Applied Mathematics, Artificial Intelligence or a related discipline;
Intermediate: 3+ years / Senior: 5+ years of experience delivering production-ready data science solutions in a commercial or public environment, with a strong focus on NLP and LLMs;

Master's degree (WO) in a quantitative field (Data Science, Mathematics, Computer Science, Econometrics, Business Analytics or any other relevant studies) with specific emphasis on data
Requirements for the first 3 junior data scientist roles I opened up when looking for jobs. For all of them, a masters is the minimum requirement. It does not catapult you to a senior position

[smoky quest]

Some jobs might get you started as senior if you have a masters/phd

Though there is no senior police, so it's pretty much dependent on each company

[balmy mural]

phd I can understand. But is it common to have jobs start as senior with just a masters?

It's just not something I've seen at all when looking at job boards personally

[smoky quest]

It's enough of a thing that it isn't uncommon. But I wouldn't be able to venture a guess in terms of how common

There is also a component about the country at play as well. Different countries might have different considerations in that regard

[deep zinc]

For DS roles masters should be the minimum. But how many checks the candidate fills after the bare minimum increases his chances for senior role.

[deep zinc]

Thats the thing. Its not just a masters if you do it smartly. and work beside just stying stuff.

[deep zinc]

Just an example to address this

[balmy mural]

Fair. I'll chalk it down to country differences as recursive_error mentioned then. That's just not enough for a senior position here

[deep zinc]

Fair point. geographical locations matter alot hence the salary variations.

[pure raft]

what country are you referring to this in?

[vapid jay]

Hello

[open ivy]

That is my general plan.

My portfolio leans academic, i.e. more about interesting rather than useful, as useful is a harder sell (it is useful, but convincing them isn't easy).

Python-to-webassembly tools for the win!

[smoky quest]

ngl, as someone who is also hiring in the research/computational side, python-to-webassembly is not something I would care at all

[sharp pollen]

.

[prisma breach]

I'm currently doing my majors in cse ai (5th sem/ 3rd year), but planning to drop the degree by next sem. Cause I've 6 backlogs and 4.5/10 cgpa and my degree is getting extended by a year.
I'm trying to land a job or at least internship in ai application field.
In my internship i bulit a webapp in, techstack- postgres sql, django, azure ocr, llm api calls, firebase,.
And recently built a rag and agentic rag built pipeline from scratch. Now moving to langchain.
Any suggestions or recommendations how to build connections and get forward in carrer.

[smoky quest]

In terms of career, a degree is the path of least resistance and with the most opportunities and compensation.

So my main advice would be to do whatever it takes to get your grades up and a degree, even if it takes an additional year or two

[balmy mural]

I'm currently based in South Africa. I can say with a strong certainty that it's like that here. But I've been looking at jobs in the Netherlands as well since I'm emigrating soon and it seems to also be true for jobs there

[prisma breach]

@smoky quest thanks for showing concern but I've no interest in doing so. In my uni. We hardly have any companies visiting us, and only 5-8/120 students are getting placed with a median package of 3.5k USD per annum. The degree might be helpful in the long term. But at the moment it doesn't make sense to me to give an extra 1-2 years

[smoky quest]

wat

[smoky quest]

Each job ad receives thousands of applications, most of the applications coming from people with relevant degree, great internships and awesome projects.
Be it in short term or long term, without a degree, you are choosing a path of extreme resistance and with less opportunities and lower compensation

Recruiters can't call back everyone, so they can only call the top 20 among thousands of people. That means you would have to demonstrate you are better than people who have completed their degree and have awesome projects and great internships

And given the number of applicants, filtering by who has a degree or not can be tempting for many busy recruiters

[prisma breach]

Valid points. Very thankful for your generous concern and the way you answered, but I don't want to. Idk how long I'm going to live. But 1-2 years count.
My main concern is how to build connections tho

[smoky quest]

It's entirely up to you.
Though to note:

• 1-2 years don't count in the scale of 40 years careers
• Why would anyone want to network with you? People want to network with people who can benefit them and are worth their time

Unfortunately for you, it's not just about what you want, but also how you compare to the market. Without experience and education, you have little value to offer to others and that give little reasons to them to want to network with you.
You would have to work harder to build projects and interesting things to demonstrate you are worth the time

[prisma breach]

Sour truth to swallow. Hope I'll get things right. Still have a sem to prove myself

[lost walrus]

If you feel like your current education isn’t giving you any better job prospects, then switching fields is probably the smarter move. A lot of people are doing that nowadays, and honestly, it’s a pretty reasonable choice.

Many people change fields several times until they find a place where they can truly thrive.

[prisma breach]

Looking at that prospect too. Will probably try to get an online degree in business management, once the fog clears up

[lost walrus]

Business and understanding of the IT industry is gold. Good luck on your journey, wherever it takes you.

[prisma breach]

Thankss ❣️ ❣️

[fringe sphinx]

!warn 1229811128654233723 Inappropriate video post. Don't do this again.

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied warning to @vapid jay.

[pure raft]

yeah man that's not a situation i envy being over there. I'm united states

[tacit swallow]

Hi everyone! I’m Stella from Zagreb. I recently finished a Python Developer course and have been diving deep into AI, experimenting and practicing to really understand how it works. I’m super excited to start my first projects and learn by doing, especially in Python + AI.

I’d love any advice, tips, or pointers on where to find opportunities or projects — or just general guidance on how to get started. Any help would mean a lot!

[pine sleet]

How is this to blame for your gpa

[wild grail]

I reached out to small startups and companies near /around me . I've applied through their site , didn't hear back coz they don't actively or often check their emails or applicants. So I called them back almost 5 places . So they asked me you have work experience I said no , they said no we don't take freshers and hung up .

2-3 years experience is needed thay said know the phone call. Their job description says html, js, react , postgresql, mysql , php all familiar one . They don't care if we have skills they just want someone who has experience working former

Somedays hope goes to zero like it freezes .

[prisma breach]

the university's placement record has nothing to do with my GPA. My grades are a result of my own choices, and that choice is tied to a profound loss of motivation.
​For years, since the 10th standard board exams, I've been in a continuous cycle of grinding subjects I'm not genuinely interested in, originally pursuing engineering only as a guaranteed path to a high-paying job.
​As backlogs piled up, I hit a wall. I realized I was spending massive energy on a path that no longer offered the motivation or clear outcome I was promised. Simply put, I lost the drive because I no longer know what I'm grinding for.
​Because of this, I've redirected my energy. I've started focusing entirely on building and doing things that genuinely interest me, and I find myself willing to put in the effort there without hating the process. That's where my focus is now.

[frigid coral]

can i generally get a job without touching leetcode cause they are the worst at explaining questions

i dont wanna visit that site ever again

[near ocean]

Maybe, but theres a lot of places that use leetcode type questions for their technical interview

[pure raft]

From what I’ve seen no, if you hate it that much I would try something else

[pure raft]

From what I have seen and what people here have said, only doing engineering to get a high paying job is one of the major things that burn people out

[twin bloom]

i mean its just problem solving tbh, you should start with simple problems and slowly climb to harder, its more pattern solving anyways

[open ivy]

Are you saying that Python2WASM is so broken/slow/etc that I will be better off re-writing my demos in JavaScript for my website?

That would be annoying for sure! Especially since my optimization toolkit is built to handle Python ASTs, so I couldn't live-demo the first step in that pipeline at all.

[vapid jay]

LMAO, as if a warning’s ever gonna do anything to me.

[cerulean thicket]

A red teamer is an actual job role, with a monthly salary, where the goal is to test the orgs detection and response capabilities - they will try to get in and have an end goal of accessing a target or getting sensitive data. Usually this is over a much longer perdiod of time (up to many months).

[solid parcel]

This is absolutely untrue. There are tons of companies that don't use LeetCode for their interview process at all. Have a quick Google, and you'll find whole lists of them.

[open ivy]

@prisma breach " originally pursuing engineering ONLY as a guaranteed path to a high-paying job."

This. Is. Your. Problem.

You need a balance of motivation and money.

Most people have enough motivating to make money. Walking, in stages, past homeless tents in West Oakland and all the way to Mt Tam's western sub-summit definitely hammers in that need!

But getting motivation to do work for the sake of making cool things is much harder and more personal. For me it is just as important because it gives me milestones to keep going even when earning money feels impossibly distant. Creativity isn't something that is to be forced. It has to be something that draws you in.

[pure raft]

tons are not the average. it isn't controversial to assume if you are going for a software/dev role you will be expected to do at least 1 leetcode style question, why are focusing on edge cases

[solid parcel]

You'd been saying outright that you couldn't get a dev job without touching LeetCode. That's not even close to being the case. Given you've never even had a job in tech, I'd pipe down.

[pure raft]

I'll wait for the entire server to see you giving outright harmful advice to someone having problems with leetcode telling them that in 2025 they can get a dev job without that skill.

[solid parcel]

They can get a job without doing LeetCode. That's not the same as me saying they shouldn't do LeetCode. I think it's generally worth doing to expand the number of roles you could realistically pass an interview for. What I object to is people speaking in absolutes, particularly when they're entirely lacking in experience. Nuance matters...

[pure raft]

this is the "why do i need a degree" argument

i'm just of the mind that it's more helpful to be direct and truthful with the state of the game. as the good people here have been with me that have helped me on my journey, its more competitive and you need a degree and you need to be good at leetcode. everything else just avoids the most optimal path, and frankly i don't need to have a job so pipe down to understand that

[solid parcel]

'Optimal' varies depending on circumstance. Yes, getting a degree and doing some LeetCode is likely optimal for most. But I think it's pretty misleading to speak in black and white about them. It's more useful to articulate why they're generally beneficial, to help support people in making their own decisions.

As per recursive error regularly describing getting a degree as 'the path of least resistance' to people. He takes the time to articulate why a comp sci degree (or similar) is helpful. Informational rather than dogmatic and lacking in nuance.

[opaque patrol]

People and folk within earshot, lend me your ears: from the deepest chambers of my mortal vessel rises an ancient and unrelenting summons — a primordial decree no soul born of flesh may deny. ’Tis the whisper of Nature herself, the stern command of the body reclaiming its sacred right.

The gathered waters, held in bondage beyond their destined hour, surge and press like a river long yearning for its freedom. I may tarry no more; I can no longer feign indifference before such ordained necessity.

Thus, with steadfast step and spirit made resolute, I shall proceed to that humble sanctuary where all who came before me found relief and fulfilment. For by the will of the heavens and the needs of frail humanity… I must take my leave, and make water.

[open ivy]

If that strategy makes you motivated to do personal projects, go for it!

[smoky quest]

No. I am saying it's not relevant to when someone looks at candidates for positions that involve python

[open ivy]

Ok so I can use it but I don't need to mention it on my resume.

Which makes sense anyway as it is a small detail.

[median river]

Guys, can anyone suggest me some tips on how to get an internship in some tech related fields?

Like where to look for internship 🤔 and how can you boost your chances to acquire one.

[smoky quest]

Usually internships are targeting folks working towards a relevant degree to help them discover the field. So it would help to be in that situation.
And then having an awesome resume with great projects would help. And you can find internships on linkedin/indeed

[median river]

Does real demo of projects need to be added in this case?

[smoky quest]

if you have links to github/gitlab repositories, it might help down the line or if the recruiter is on the fence about you

[median river]

"If the recruiter is on the fence about you" means?

[smoky quest]

it means if they hesitate

[fringe sphinx]

And make water? I want to know the rest of the story.

Agree with r_e: there are many phases to interviewing. Later in the process, the GitHub links might become relevant.

[solid parcel]

Pretty sure it's just AI slop about going to the loo, lol

[fringe sphinx]

Ah, I was hoping it was some ridiculous career related question

[pearl narwhal]

hi

how can i find freelancer oppo as data scientist/analyst ?

[summer roost]

That's not my area, but AFAIK data scientists are far more likely to be employees than freelancers. Freelance contracts lend themselves much better for one-off work, and data science tends to be much more ongoing analysis and tracking of trends and patterns over time. At least that's my impression. I've never met an independent data scientist.

[vapid jay]

What does it mean to have a strong foundation in Python & C++? @fringe sphinx

[peak halo]

That you can write python and C++ code without having to read a language reference

[vapid jay]

Then I have that from a long time ago 😭 I always assumed to be able to do complicated projects with ease.

[peak halo]

If you knew how to do something in the past, it's easier to get it back than it is to start over

[sand patio]

hi yall, I've got an interview tomorrow that's supposed to be pre-screening? They mentioned that it covers "basic information and questions in anticipation of a detailed conversation between you and our hiring manager."--what exactly should I expect? From what I found online, it essentially seems like a talk with HR before a final round in front of a panel, and that it probably won't be technical.

and do yall have any experience with the "predictive index"? This same company told me to complete an IQ test and a behavioral test before the interview, via the predictive index

[solid parcel]

Yeah it's generally just a couple of very basic screening questions from someone in HR to make sure you're not blatantly unqualified for the role. Generally only 15 mins to 30 at the max.

[sand patio]

what sort of questions will they ask?

[solid parcel]

It's typically a couple of very basic technical questions. Generally ones with a clear cut correct answer; recruiters are not usually technical (if at all), so for them to be capable of doing the screening, the questions need to be pretty binary.

I'd love to give you an example, but it's been a while since I've had a screening round so I'm blanking 😁

[sand patio]

i see

thanks

[smoky quest]

might go from your visa (if any), to availability and setting expectations (ex: location, compensation, etc.). I have seen some probing some light technical question or repeating and taking notes from what a manager directed them to ask

[solid parcel]

Ah good shout on comp, they do usually prod to try and get a figure from you at this stage.

[sand patio]

what should I say about comp

[near ocean]

Ask what the budget for the role is
Ask for the entire budget

[true harness]

internships typically have a comp in mind. i have never heard of interns being able to negotiate comp

[shadow star]

uhm- okay i guess..?

[tulip fable]

sry i had dual screen's and was messing around,

[sand patio]

do you have any suggestions for how i should prepare?

[smoky quest]

there isn't much to prepare for an internship.
Make sure you have your calendar available in case you have to deal with availability and take notes like you would do for any other call

[sand patio]

does HR usually do a resume deep dive? what about personality questions?

[smoky quest]

could be anything

I wouldn't sweat it, but it's better to be overprepared than underprepared

[smoky quest]

and what about personality questions?

[tender notch]

Heyy @all, I know Python basics and been solving problems for a while. What should I focus on to learn for a Data Engineering Role, I find on youtube and all I get is list comprehension, loops, functions which are basics. What else do I need to learn. I have also practiced working with Microsoft Azure Services but I haven't worked in any company yet so I don't know what to do

[smoky quest]

https://www.oreilly.com/library/view/fundamentals-of-data/9781098108298/ covers a lot of ground

[tender notch]

@smoky quest I have some experience, what about Python. how much of it is required? any specific library or functions I need to work on

[smoky quest]

this is covered in the book, among other things

[smoky quest]

<@&831776746206265384> scam

[tender thicket]

!cleanban 1437480713833287851 crypto spam

[inner wren]

:ok_hand: applied ban to @gloomy frost permanently.

[fervent ibex]

Hi

Is python really worth it to learn in 2025 like I almost learned basics, but whenever I opened YouTube some guy started saying ai is going to take your job so learn this or that skills,

So I'm really confused should I come in coding field or not I already have 4+ years in video editing,

But I think coding give me more money than editing

[smoky quest]

if an AI can write code, you can bet it can also edit entire videos
So if you believe that influencer, then what's your plan?

[smoky quest]

<@&831776746206265384> scam/begging

[azure heart]

!cleanban 1437071596320718878 scam

[inner wren]

:ok_hand: applied ban to @delicate fractal permanently.

[fervent ibex]

Like ai can't replace editing 100% even in future because it can't understand what user really want,

Like if I want my gameplay edited into highly funny video it can't add relevant memes or don't understand the clip where to add effects or not

It can replace basics things like subtitles,cut etc

[smoky quest]

if it is smart enough to write code that solves the user request, it will be smart enough to replace editing 100%

So if you think it can't replace editing, maybe it can't replace coding as well?
And thus studying python is not a waste of time

[vapid jay]

Hello

[hollow fern]

Hi

https://youtu.be/xUNMNVasMZk?si=Bb7h31rs21x498U_

[signal oar]

i feel like there is no use in trying to make the best resume. And i should probably start applying with what i have.
Because do companies actually care about good projects due the over saturation of the market
The quantity or number of applications i do matter more than complexity of the project in my resume ?

[visual flax]

Is it really worth buying a 44 dollar keyboard? thats wireless?

[wild grail]

They say some recruiters like projects to be short and clear, some need to see a detail bullet points. How to actually know that there is no way I guess.

Also my friend got into a company through referral , where I'm still trying ✌️
Got 4 rejections from Indeed today .

I also feel getting genuine guidance these days are rare.

[fringe sphinx]

Can't it be short, clear but contain some detail? A good resume can do all three.

Some people try to over explain their work: the resume isn't a novel.

[wild grail]

Hmm your right. But recruiters have diff expectations .

[fringe sphinx]

You can't make a perfect resume, but you can always strive for a better resume. Get critical feedback, and use your ow judgement as to which feedback to apply.

[wild grail]

Anyways situations here are like ...worse people only hire referrals .

[fringe sphinx]

Doesn't stop you from doing the best you can with the resume.

Yes: different people look for different things in resumes. There is a lot of randomness involved in job seeking

[wild grail]

Thanks . I'm trying ✌️.let's not loose hope.
But corporate hiring is probability

[fringe sphinx]

Yup, just don't take it personally. You'll hear No many times before Yes

[wild grail]

Yeah thanks a lot , but this referral shit hurts not gonna lie.

Also I got a chance to send my resume to someone who is working at ibm for almost 10 years . She gave ME a real positive feedback . She told me to focus on the track I'm on ... I'm moving the right way. I was wondering why people here said your resume isn't enough .

Idk I'll keep going . 👍

[past edge]

hii brothers

i am new here

[peak halo]

Hello and welcome to our wonderful python server. For general discussion of python, go to #python-discussion

[chilly roost]

hi

[unique pier]

I want to code in Hebrew but i don't speak hebrew

[peak halo]

doesn't really seem relevant to career discussion. you might mention it in one of the three off-topic channels.

[unique pier]

I want to pursue my career

In Hebrew python

You help me Yes?

[peak halo]

@unique pier I don't speak Hebrew.

[unique pier]

You learn Hebrew Yes?

Okay putting that aside i don't know what to do I'm stuck on what to do with python

Where do i start if i want to learn about AIs

[peak halo]

Start with fundamentals. Don't try to make an LLM because you can't. There are pinned resources in #data-science-and-ml

[lime shore]

Hi

I just started with python today do u guys like my script lmao

[peak halo]

Very meme
This is the career discussion channel. Make sure your messages are always relevant to the channel topic.

[lime shore]

Is there like a general or smpth

[peak halo]

!resources

oh, #python-discussion is for talking about python. then there are three off-topic channels.

[bright stream]

Hello all

[quiet haven]

hey can someone tell me out of these which projects can be a good choice to highlight in resume ?

flipkart product recommender
medical rag chatbot
multi ai agent
ai travel planner
mcq generator

[solid parcel]

I'd start by working out what you're actually targeting, and then extrapolate backwards from there.

It'll also be easier for people here to advise on which project would best support your goals if you can articulate what you're wanting to achieve (i.e. if your core goal is to improve your employability, what roles are you planning to target?).

[quiet haven]

so im targetting entry level ai engineer roles for that need to put some projects

these all are based on gen ai stuff (langchain,rag,llm,etc)

[hollow fern]

Hi

[solid parcel]

Great, I'd start by looking up advertised roles for entry level AI engineering positions, note the most commonly requested tools and responsibilities and then prioritise whichever project lets you hit the highest number of relevant points. Make sure whatever project you opt for goes beyond the entirety trivial. Just hooking into an OpenAI API isn't going to cut it nowadays.

I'd recommend taking the time to document the project, using feature branches and following other engineering best practices. A lot of junior projects end up being homogeneous and lacking in rigour, because juniors often rely excessively on AI without having sufficient knowledge to shape the output effectively. You want to avoid falling into that category.

Bonus points for rigour if you take the time upfront to define functional and non-functional requirements, and then design the project to achieve them (These requirements can evolve over time, it's typically an iterative process).

[quiet haven]

ohk got it, ill try researching it first then move on to development
Thanks for the help 😄

[still condor]

!cleanban @vapid jay inappropriate gif

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @foggy depot permanently.

[visual flax]

Are the engineering Jobs where coworkers feel like family?

[smoky quest]

you don't want your coworkers to feel like family

[visual flax]

Why not?

[solid parcel]

I run a mile from any job spec that uses language like this

[solid parcel]

It's usually shorthand for 'we will demand an excess amount of dedication to the role, and fully intend to overstep appropriate boundaries. Prepare to work excessively for low pay!'

[smoky quest]

they aren't your family and won't treat you as such

For instance, a company might let you go for any reason.
So trying to be a family typically result in an asymmetric relationship as pointed above

And it's not that people will have bad intentions. You can be super friendly and have an awesome relationship with your coworkers. But your manager or the CEO might change at any time and change the whole dynamic even though you are still working well with some of your coworkers.

Or the company might go through hardship and have to let you go despite liking you.

[visual flax]

I have seen this be true both professionally and personally.

[lilac yoke]

startups

[visual flax]

I've heard that too. do they make a lot of money and where can I find one.

[lilac yoke]

enroll in a decent college and start one with a classmate

[solid parcel]

Average total comp equates to lower than equivalent tech roles outside the startup ecosystem. It's been a while since I've gone digging through the data, but there have been a few analyses indicating exactly this point.

The vast majority fold (meaning that any equity you have becomes worthless). Even if the startup doesn't fold, the market for your equity is often very illiquid meaning you can end up having to sell it for far below the face value, and you'll often get diluted to all hell. Plus they're generally much higher pressure. Startups usually have negative free cash flow, meaning they're in a race to achieve profitability before they run out of runway.

[visual flax]

I figured as much

[white relic]

consider location, as well.
lots of startups can be found in the bay area, which has a very high cost of living

you're not going to find many tech startups in Kansas City (not that there won't be any) but your living expenses there are going to be way lower

[visual flax]

I know a guy working at a startup in penn

I'm honestly willingly to work for any company for nearly nothing if it means I can put it on my resume

[solid parcel]

The upside is that you have an opportunity to make a much larger impact on the success (or failure...) of the company than in most corporate roles, and there is of course the potential for outsized gains if the company does succeed. Also opportunities to wear multiple hats, be part of a company going through rapid growth, help find product market fit and so on... Working for a startup is not without merit, but I'm very wary of them and I'd go in eyes wide open.

[visual flax]

If you needed to get a software engineering role and didn't care how much you were paid how would you go about it?

[white relic]

what country?

assuming USA, my suggestion is to look for companies in areas that aren't major tech centers, and companies that aren't well known tech giants like FAANG

I started at a major defense contractor. Now I work for a European company in an area not known for tech. I get paid pretty well (software is only a part of my job, to be fair).

[solid parcel]

If this were my goal and I was starting from scratch, I'd find a narrow area (one that still has a reasonable number of positions available, so I'd avoid tooling like ebpf), and go deep in it. I'd plan to drill deep into a difficult problem that a large number of organisations are struggling to solve.

The first thing to come to mind right now is managing AI integration with corporate data. How do you label and classify the data? How do you prevent data exfiltration? How does introducing AI impact risk profiles? How can organisations sufficiently audit the use of AI models? And so on.... There are a ton of questions that are either without clearcut answers, or where orgs need help identifying where existing tooling and strategies can be applied to their new AI initiatives.

There are tons of people looking to build with AI, but the governance around that is still evolving and pretty immature. There are not many people out there with a good grasp on how to approach that space currently, either.

[visual flax]

SO I need to solve a problem before I try and solve.

I mean apply.

[balmy mural]

Small local companies where the engineers are your actual family

[solid parcel]

I'm not saying this is the route to take, but what I've laid out above is certainly the strategy I'd use. When I was getting started, it was cloud skills organisations were scrambling for (particularly an ability to automate infrastructure and application deployments at scale), so I gunned hard for those.

You don't need to have all the answers before you apply, by any means. Just a little focused knowledge is often enough to be very helpful, if you're filling in a gap in understanding and capability.

[visual flax]

What programming language would I be learning for that?

[solid parcel]

I meant I'd certainly apply the strategy of identifying an underserved, in demand niche. I don't know if it would specifically be the AI data path I went for. That was just an example based on the skill gaps I'm seeing currently.

The best language(s) will largely depend on what you're actually doing. If I were doing the AI data wrangling, Python would be my first port of call....

[visual flax]

Whats a good way to catch up on finances if you don't have a lot of money? Do you take a lot of risks or simply reduce expenses?

[solid parcel]

When I didn't have much money, taking big risks was the very last thing I'd have done. I'd massively advise you prioritise doing the latter.

The best thing you can do to grow wealth is to live below your means, build up an emergency fund and then start investing money into a broad index fund (and leave the money in there regardless of ups and downs. Do not invest money you can't afford to lose).

[vapid jay]

Ah yes, the classic “we are a family” magical words

With all due respect I really hate it when my boss says that. It’s like, no we’re not, dude. We are everything but a family

[ruby orchid]

Do you guys think a PC is sufficient for college? Or do you think I should get a laptop too? I am doing CS or software engineering major

[peak halo]

you're probably required to have a laptop.

[vapid violet]

Your school likely has a recommended technology page. At least at my school we will do in class coding activities. And I use my laptop throughout the day to complete assignments when I am not in my dorm. So I personally think a laptop is necessary, but you might be able to get away with a tablet for when you are out and about and use your PC when needed

[peak halo]

and you don't want to be in a situation where your classmates are going to do a group project on campus (though maybe people don't do that anymore since covid), and you're the only one who can't bring their computer to campus. (though again, it's likely that a laptop is required.)

but maybe there will be another pandemic, and it won't matter if your computer is portable anymore.

[vapid violet]

I definitely use my laptop when I meet up for group projects. And most of the time I might have been able to get away with a tablet, there were a few times I needed a computer of some sort. And a tablet would have been more of a pain to use in those situations anyway

[peak halo]

if money is a concern, you might get a used windows laptop and overwrite it with linux, which tends to run better on older machines. though you'd need to make sure that all the required software runs on linux.

the only true exception I ever found to this was the lockdown browser.

and I only needed the lockdown browser cuz covid (taking exams at home)

[vapid violet]

I have not had to use a lockdown browser yet but I know there are other people at my school who do for "take home" exams and even in person exams. Although you can check out a laptop from the library for temporary use. You definitely don't need anything beefy for in class use. There are actually memes about people who buy too beefy of laptops at my school

(satire)

Today when I walked into my economics class I saw something I dread every time I close my eyes. Someone had brought their new gaming laptop to class. The Forklift he used to bring it was still running idle at the back. I started sweating as I sat down and gazed over at the 700lb beast that was his laptop. He had already reinforced his desk with steel support beams...

[peak halo]

All the laptops I owned while I was I college were gaming laptops. And they were pretty annoying to carry around.

But it was worth it to just have one computer with everything

[vapid violet]

Yeah, I don't have a PC (when I am at college) so I got a more powerful laptop, but still not as powerful as some peoples

[visual flax]

Whats a great engineering laptop thats not for gaming but does great for solidworks thats under 800?

https://www.bestbuy.com/product/lenovo-ideapad-slim-3-15-6-full-hd-touchscreen-laptop-amd-ryzen-7-5825u-16gb-memory-512gb-ssd-arctic-grey/JJGSH2ZQWS/sku/6610889?utm_source=chatgpt.com <---- this is what I am looking at. student/non-professional btw

[tender notch]

100% worth it!.

I think under the same range you can also look for hs or h series processor, so that your vgpu is strong enough too. Mine I do everything without a dgpu and its been fast for 6 years

[warped mirage]

Hey guys, which field is more in demand? Data science (and related fields like data mining/analytics etc) or AI/ML?

Was looking to specialise and I researched both but I can't really decide. Can anyone give me their take on either fields and your experience with them?

[vast shoal]

I feel like ML and data science are kinda intertwined, aren't they?

[warped mirage]

Kinda, i mean i do use ML models in a related data science module so i guess

But there is just so many paths to choose e.g. data mining/data analytics isn't exactly the same as someone who works as an AI engineer

[vast shoal]

I feel like I have no clue what an AI engineer does at this point.

The terms have gotten very muddled since the rise of LLMs.

[warped mirage]

i think what i'm asking is if i were to do a MSc in for example AI or something, would it be easy to switch to something like data analytics? I haven't really decided on what I want to do for masters or what i want to be working as 5 years in the future. I don't want to wait few more months and realise I will be graduating soon with no plan after my bachelors.

[solid parcel]

It may become the new DevOps, at this rate 😁

[fringe sphinx]

There is MLops as a discrete role

[solid parcel]

Oh 100% agreed, it's specifically 'AI engineer' that I've seen being used as a very broad catch-all.

[vast shoal]

There's a guy in my team who I just mentally labeled as DevOps and when he was recently asked by a newcomer what his role is, he just said "everything except developer"

[brittle epoch]

Yo

[solid parcel]

This is accurate. Observability and alerting, automated app deployments and rollbacks, automated infrastructure deployment, cost optimisation, self-healing... It's basically sysadmin with a different hat on, we just have a more powerful tooling stack to leverage nowadays, so we're not reliant on sshing in to update or fix things anymore.

[deep onyx]

anyone wanna try my discord bot?

[shut shoal]

day 1 doing python finally finished fizzbuzz shi

[vapid jay]

day 45 doing pyhton i can now create a very basic chatbot

[vast shoal]

Day 5991 doing Python, finally became an intermediate Python developer

[fleet reef]

You know the exact day?

[vast shoal]

No, I think I first used it in my early uni years, so maybe sometime 2009, so I just calculated number of days from mid 2009 to today

[fleet reef]

Ah yeah
Mine is “mid December 2008”

[vast shoal]

The joke was funnier with an exact number

[peak halo]

To the extent that people call themselves AI engineers, who primarily write systems that make API calls to LLMs, those people are not AI engineers and are just trying to jump on the hype train.

[vast shoal]

So then how would you define it?

[peak halo]

someone who trains and evaluates models

[fringe sphinx]

Oh, it's funny, when I hear AI engineer, I assume -that's- (llm api user) what they mean.

[peak halo]

right, because they've hijacked it

[fringe sphinx]

I'm still mad that data engineer got hijacked

[vast shoal]

Specifically LLMs?

Or just any machine learning model?

[peak halo]

Absolutely not limited to that, no

[vast shoal]

It's the word "AI" I'm a bit confused about, it feels kinda vague compared to for example ML

[peak halo]

that's true, but it's been true since before ChatGPT-style LLMs

[vast shoal]

If it's exactly any ML model, why not call it ML engineer?

[peak halo]

Because using a model and developing a model are different

people who make API calls to LLMs are just using them

[vast shoal]

No, I mean, why not call the people who train and evaluate machine learning models ML engineers instead of AI engineers?

It seems more concrete and specific

[peak halo]

The only AI that anyone cares about is ML (this has been true for 10+ years, probably longer), so they're largely interchangeable. ML is a methodology for achieving AI.

[vast shoal]

Hm, alright. I guess that tracks since I took my AI class in uni more than 10 years ago.

[peak halo]

• AI: something that emulates the application of knowledge in a way that isn't taken for granted
• ML: using data to approximate a function

second one should be fleshed out, but I haven't had coffee yet

[vast shoal]

Well, I'm fairly familiar with how it works, so I get what you're saying

[peak halo]

sure. I'm just writing definitions because I like to pontificate (see hat)

[vast shoal]

Haha

But I guess you can also say that not all applications of ML is what we'd intuitively call AI?

[fringe sphinx]

I like where you're going here

[peak halo]

spell checking systems are potentially based on ML, but we take that for granted, so it's not AI (anymore)

[fringe sphinx]

To be clear: i also approve of the coffee, but I was liking the definitions

(I just finished my third Cuban coffee... I'm wide awake in Florida now)

[fluid cloud]

impressive that cuban coffee transported you all the way to Florida

[sharp hound]

guys im starting to learn python today but im kinda lost, working and studying its rough but it is what it is. how long yall recon until i potentially can work w it ?

[fluid cloud]

are you learning programming too? or is python an additional programming language to one you already know? (it's much faster to learn a second programming language than to learn to program IMO)

[sharp hound]

first language ever, i hate people and i wanna work from home so i thought this is a good idea

so yes learning programming

[peak halo]

I wouldn't bank on full work-from-home being an option, especially for junior positions. a lot of companies are enforcing at least partial time in office.

if you hate people, software development will be a bad career for you, since it involves a lot of teamwork.

!starify 1011002171774488787 blank name

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied superstar to @sharp hound until <t:1764089280:f> (1 hour).

Superstarified!

Your previous nickname, ᲼, was so bad that we have decided to change it. Your new nickname will be Aerosmith.

You will be unable to change your nickname until <t:1764089280:f>. If you're confused by this, please read our official nickname policy.

[vast shoal]

In what sense do you mean that we take it for granted?

[peak halo]

people only think of something as AI if it feels futuristic.

there's a quote, "AI is what you can't do"

[fringe sphinx]

Reminds me of Clarkes law about sufficient advanced technology being indistinguishable from magic

[vast shoal]

Right

So the fact that AI companies don't quite know how LLMs work is ironically kind of a selling point

[peak halo]

well, people "don't know how LLMs" work in the same way that people don't know how neural networks work

[vast shoal]

Yeah, I mean, the behavior is kind of unpredictable in a way that classical programs aren't.

[peak halo]

right. I'm just saying that that's been a property of ML programs for a while, not just LLMs

[vast shoal]

Sure, though the degree of uncertainty must grow with the size of the models, I assume

[peak halo]

hmm, I'd have to think about that

[visual flax]

Anyone know some opensource projects that I could contribute too? THat wouldn't take millions of hours of time investment to understand the code?

[fringe sphinx]

There's many. What package did you use last

[proven raven]

hello can someone please help me to do a tic tac toe game on web tiger python

[carmine sleet]

Depends highly on your skills and what you know

[visual flax]

I guess I'd say I'm most skilled in python,c++, and c# but I understand most programming syntax like java

[carmine sleet]

Btw i meant skills in libraries/subjects 👀

[crisp stream]

see #❓｜how-to-get-help

[visual flax]

I guess pandas, pygame, dotnetmaui,

[carmine sleet]

Wait, you’re skilled in pygame?

[visual flax]

Sorta, I also have skills in unity and unreal but I'm no expert.

[carmine sleet]

Well, i got a group of devs and we work on a lot of different projects including future games
Maybe you could be interested in programming with us?
(Btw it’s for fun so there won’t be paying)

[visual flax]

Thats fine I'd love to join

[carmine sleet]

Cool! We already released our first project!
Wanna add me so i can send you the link (and invite you to the team’s server)

[steady violet]

can someone explain why named tuple fields cannot be prefixed with an underscore?

[peak halo]

this is the career discussion channel; see #❓｜how-to-get-help

[steady violet]

sorry, forgot to switch channels

[visual flax]

Historically, do employers really study your peformance? Because my dad says his colleagues often underpeform

[true harness]

of course they do, how else would anyone be promoted? a team can't be made up of only high performers.

[peak halo]

yes, but that doesn't mean the lower echelons of performers just always get fired

[visual flax]

What about high peformers that never get promoted

Also do you guys know how you match up compared to others?

[peak halo]

that company sucks, then

[true harness]

there can be many reasons why someone doesn't get promoted. it's rare to have the full story if you aren't that person

[visual flax]

So you can still get promoted if you have great skills and work ethic beyond your experience level/

[peak halo]

it depends on the company. at my company, we get performance reviews each year, and we're put into performance tiers, and only a certain percentage of people can be in each tier (like 5% for the highest one, 10% for the next, etc.) so you know what range you're in depending on your tier for the previous year.

[ruby orchid]

Okay

[blissful edge]

feeling like I’ve done the due diligence on resumes but I’m flat out getting ghosted applying for New Grad SWE

[solid parcel]

It's a really rough market at the moment. I saw the UK stats for comp sci grad unemployment earlier today... 9.7%. That's the highest of any degree, beating out Cinematics and Photography, Art, and Media Studies (which together comprise the ignoble runners up, in 2nd, 3rd and 4th respectively).

Your CV is already head and shoulders above most I see, and you've got a heavy hitting name on there with MS. Landing a role may be just a matter of needing to churn out some more applications.

Don't be disheartened if you're ghosted; that regularly happens even when the market is in good shape, it isn't a reflection on your strength as a candidate.

[vast shoal]

How many applications have you sent out so far?

[blissful edge]

About 150-200

[smoky quest]

• it's a bit high on the yapping index and the sentences are too complex/mouthful to read
• Given the uncertainties of the market, looking for a job for May 2026 is a bit ahead of time right now

For instance, your second bullet for your latest internship, I read it as "added id to components to avoid re-render", which might be wrong, but the sentence is so abstracted away that it could be many things

[open ivy]

Right now I have that irrational emotion that I never will get a job. This happens from time to time fickle like weather in Florida.

But seeing one of my personal projects start to work as I debug it and develop it keeps me going despite this emotion!

I have seen extremely powerful emotions in men (overconfidence, dogmatic trust in their favorite politician, shutdowns, petty behavior, science denial) so dealing with emotions is key for career success.

[smoky quest]

managing your emotions and health is paramount!
Stay healthy, exercise, get out, etc.
Don't ruminate the same ideas over and over

[blissful edge]

Curious what you’d think would be the best way to capture everything I did here — inherently very technical work but I’m unsure how to decompose it to be more human readable without losing like a good 80% of the impact context

[smoky quest]

I would phrase things the same way you would explain it to a classmate or a teacher

[open ivy]

Yes both cold applications and portfoleo projects have their own psychological difficulties.

Cold applications feels like having aches and pains. Portfoleo projects feels like mountaineering and the "burn" when exercising. Networking has it's own social dissapointemnts but is also very fun when it works out.

So I minimize cold applications and push through with my portfoleo+networking and feel the sense of accomplishment.

[solid parcel]

Personal opinion, but I think you're doing a decent job at this already. The sentences seemed necessarily complex rather than complex without gain.

I also didn't find them too hard to parse

[twin jewel]

hello dear python administartion

[fierce nova]

hello there sir

[twin jewel]

how is ur year going sir

[fierce nova]

i have been contemplating whether I should become a pole dancer or coder. Pay seems equal

[twin jewel]

honestly go for pole dancing coding already had enough clowns we dont need more

[fierce nova]

yeah thats true

[sharp hound]

my main idea was to full grind to invest my time on working w apis and make ai for local companies to gain some recognition and in the mean time meet some people since i will be doing this solo. whats ur opinion ?
i dont wanna work for someone i wanna work for me

[twin jewel]

so basically if you crash on a pole you might break a bone if you crash in code you just break the internet

[fierce nova]

yeah, pole dancing is more badass

[peak halo]

what do you think "make ai" entails?
I do not think you'll be able to make it as a freelance AI developer without several years of experience doing it for a company.

[twin jewel]

agreed but at least with coding you dont bruise your ribs 🤣

[fierce nova]

yeah,
print("helloworld)

this is making me a millionaire

[sharp hound]

im well aware "making ai" its simply not possible because ive done my research and its giga expensive but i've watched tons of videos related to working w api and fine tuning ais for companies

specially with n8n making work 1million times easier atleast to start

[peak halo]

you can still "make AI" as an individual person, since AI is more than just interactive LLMs.
Suppose you offer your freelance AI services to a company. Why should they trust someone with no degree and no industry experience, who says they learned about APIs from YouTube, to correctly complete a task for them without their supervision in a reasonable amount of time?

[twin jewel]

lol just dont forget the semicolon or python will roast you instead of making you rich!

[sharp hound]

i dont need to say it was from youtube, it was just a self taught and who cares about degrees when they see it is working and bringing in profits
but i understand what you mean

[peak halo]

they do care about degrees, because there needs to be trust. anyone can say that they learned some stuff on their own. a degree requires that person to prove it to an expert in the field.

[twin jewel]

are you the boss

[peak halo]

the boss of what? my department at work? no

[fierce nova]

glad you noticed the mistake, put it there on purpose.

spot the mistake below:

print("_");

[peak halo]

this is the career discussion channel. please talk about syntax somewhere else.

[twin jewel]

hmm the semicolon is kinda extra in python but i see what you did there sneaky

[peak halo]

Please talk about syntax somewhere else. This is the final warning.

[fierce nova]

sorry master. ill make sure to talk elsewhere

[twin jewel]

yes we are very sorri boss, it will not happen again please dont ban us dear python admin

[sharp hound]

well im risking it anyways if it doesnt work i learned something, i just think that having a degree helps but like i said they want work done not someone with a pretty degree

[vast shoal]

The issue is that software doesn't magically appear in a single day and never ever change after that. It takes time to develop an initial working version and it generally needs to be maintained and improved upon after that. It's an investment of both time and money that can't be invested in an alternative solution. If they bet on the wrong horse, it can be very costly in terms of profit and reputation. So they want to feel decently certain they chose a good technology provider beforehand. A degree helps provide that certainty.

[peak halo]

if you value your time, I think you should take the path that is most likely to lead to success.

once you have several years of experience, ones degree doesn't matter as much, because they've already demonstrated that they can deliver for their employer.

if you don't have any experience, you need some other way to be able to convince employers that you're viable. Degrees are the main way that people do that, for the reasons I've outlined.

[deep zinc]

My take: if you have a degree AND publications people will take your input seriously. Because your work is vetted by hard-core publication committee and only then gets approved.

[fringe sphinx]

I wouldn't go so far as to say "seriously" 🙂 ... merely that they'll take your input.

[peak halo]

(except now the publication comittee and peer reviewers are using ChatGPT to decide if your paper gets published, but that's a separate issue.)

[sand patio]

a degree is the path of least resistance to a swe job, especially in today's market

[deep zinc]

People sitting in committee haven't switched to chatgpt yet. Old tend to switch slowly compared to this gen

[deep zinc]

You gotta showcase your work aswell:)

[peak halo]

also, they're specifically asking about AI jobs, which often require a masters.

[deep zinc]

My professors professor asked a HARD copy and reviewed it with a pen.

[sand patio]

yeah, if it's like, research or anything some graduate experience will almost always be required

just being in uni also opens a lot of doors and networking opportunities

[sharp hound]

if my plan doesnt work im becoming a femboy

[deep zinc]

You might not have a career outside America or Europe then. You are limiting your potential xD

[sand patio]

you also end up competing with people who have degrees and experience

it stands to reason that someone who just went to class and went straight home for four years might have trouble being competitive, but most competitive applicants are coupling that degree with things like internships, clubs, leadership opportunities, and the networks that uni facilitates you in building.

[sharp hound]

i have an advantage, i live on an island where people need to see results to invest they do not actively look for it so its a + for me

even soimething simple as websites is missing, ive made some money making websites for them

[sand patio]

I'm not sure what the market looks like for where you live, I suppose--if it's not uncommon, you can go for it. As far as the U.S. market is concerned, at least right now I don't think it's too much of a stretch to say that without a degree (or some crucial connection), you're kind of cooked.

[sharp hound]

i lack competition where i live so im tryharding to learn it fast and start monetizing soon

downside is im doing it solo but it is what it is

[smoky quest]

I have seen enough bullshit papers that I would not necessarily assume it's vetted

[small iris]

so cs degrees and so on are useful? ive heard plenty of people saying that they are not required but i would rather secure one for myself to have advantage over other people

[peak halo]

It's very difficult to out-compete degree holders for entry level positions

[small iris]

i do have 1 more question, in the uni i will go to theres cs, computer and software engineering, data analysis and cybersecurity. i am currently 17 so by the time i finish uni what would be more in demand taking all of the events happening right now? i dont want to take something thats going to be filled with people and be hard to find a career into

[modest kraken]

Is it true that some jobs are very particular about what degree/college their applicants went to

[smoky quest]

Spending 4-5 years studying full time in a specialized environment with teachers who are at the forefront of their domain and who have experience and knowledge and potentially give you access to interesting topics, is unsurpringly useful. So is spending that same 4-5 years with other students preparing for the fields and with whom you may create a network

[open ivy]

College is also really fun and definitely worth the experience.

[sand patio]

between a CS and "software engineering" degree, there likely won't be a difference in the types of jobs you're applying to, so the demand won't be any different.

you could probably apply that to most of the degrees you mentioned, tbh. a lot of people with those degrees tend to apply to a lot of the same types of jobs, so they'll have similar types of demand

except like, cyber

and maybe computer engineering

[sand patio]

there are some "target schools" for specific jobs, depending on the industry you want to break into (e.g like, quants), but just having a degree is already so much better than not having one, and there won't be that significant of a difference in your chances unless you went to like, a top ten school.

college is what you make of it

you can go to a good school but just do nothing all four years and have trouble finding a job

[fringe sphinx]

^ strong +1 for everything above

[modest kraken]

What’s like a top 10 school

[smoky quest]

CMU is an example

[sand patio]

yeah, CMU, MIT, etc. but you shouldn't put yourself in the mindset that you need to go to one of these schools to land a good job; the defining factor of success isn't solely the school you went to, but the effort you put into your career pursuits in the years that you were there.

[modest kraken]

Is uw a good school?

[sand patio]

yeah uw is a very good school

[lime badge]

anyone else think that Python's got way more of a data science / ML reputation than anything else? I've been doing web dev with Python the last 10 years, lately when I talk about knowing python people get all disappointed when I say I'm not into data science / ml

[peak halo]

yes, because Python is the language for DS/ML, whereas all the other things python is used for has other languages that are used for that.

[small iris]

I have a friend that finished the uni i want to go in and he says that most people get into internships on their 2nd, 3rd year

Is that a good thing? Do people have enough time to mix internships with uni if they got 2 years of experience

[smoky quest]

sure

most of the time, it's summer internships too, so not clashing with school

[candid latch]

what is it like looking for junior jobs without a comp sci degree these days?

[fiery jay]

It makes it harder without a comp sci degree, but depending on what you do it can vary more broadly

What do you want to do as a jr dev, and what background do you have?

[azure heart]

Put yourself in the hiring team's shoes. You're given 500 resumes. 499 of them have comp sci degrees and 1 doesn't. Where would you start in your pile?

[candid latch]

studied econ, as to what I would do I guess anything to do with analyzing and creating programs to alter data

[worthy plover]

i'd hire the one without the degree 🙂

[candid latch]

with the guy who has the best projects

[azure heart]

Yes, but once you've found the candidate you want, you stop looking

so you're assuming there isn't someone qualified in the 499 other resumes

[smoky quest]

why would the guy who has no degree and hasn't spent 4-5 years studying full time in college have better projects?

[fiery jay]

I’d start with the background based on what I’m looking for. A degree offers reassurance, and validation.

[worthy plover]

i got mine first without a bachelor's

[fiery jay]

What were you doing originally?

[candid latch]

because modern college is a meme designed to gratify the ego of midwits
although I have a degree in economics

[worthy plover]

data science

[smoky quest]

then you should try to make your project through tiktok dances and see how it goes

[fiery jay]

Were you building charts or wdym?

[worthy plover]

plotly-langchain i had the certs and prjs

but i couldnt keep up the pressure and decided to persue a degree

[candid latch]

how do you network in this field?

[smoky quest]

connecting with your classmates is a great way to seed your network.
Otherwise meetups

[fiery jay]

You had certs, which is more than nothing though..

[worthy plover]

google data analytics specialization 6 months

[smoky quest]

it's also not the same job. It's like claiming to work in a hospital. Both the receptionist and the neurosurgeon will work in the same hospital but they both have different requirements as well as opportunities and compensation

[worthy plover]

and python sql intermediate type...

[fiery jay]

Generally, through jobs, career events on campus, interviews, LinkedIn, and some general marketing techniques. Technically you’re always marketing yourself.

[worthy plover]

i'll graduate in 6 months... 🙂

[fiery jay]

So true too. Like degrees and certs are decent baselines, but you’re trying to prove to middle managers and HR that you’re not “too much of a risk”

[smoky quest]

congrats!

[fiery jay]

I did an entire BSCS in 14, so, go you

[worthy plover]

but degree isnt helping me get the next job now

[candid latch]

but if you have schooling in another field ie, econ it's not impossible?

[smoky quest]

it would

[azure heart]

depends on what specifically you're applying for

[candid latch]

looking for fintech related job

eventually aiming to branch out to developing software for hedge funds

[smoky quest]

would you hire an econ degree for surgery? Or for architecting a bridge?
Probably not.

It's like a distance function, the further away you are from the target role, the more difficult

[fiery jay]

Less than likely. If you have an engineering background it’s more likely. They usually list “or similar” which means like Electrical Engineering, Computer Engineering, Computer Science, Software Engineering, etc

[worthy plover]

so you arent planning to do bachelor;s?

[candid latch]

possibly, but I already have a bachelors so I'd rather not spend the money

[smoky quest]

you would need to target roles that have a higher blend of econ over tech so that it is more valuable

[candid latch]

what if your goal is potentially owning your own company and developing a software project to sell?

[smoky quest]

I understand you want something that is easy, cheap and fast for you, but in the end, it's about supply and demand and what value you provide to the employer

[candid latch]

how much code do I need to know to effectively manage people

[azure heart]

they're two different skills

[smoky quest]

at least 5-10 years of experience

[azure heart]

many seniors don't want to manage

[worthy plover]

just dont

[smoky quest]

as well as coaching and practice.

Managing people is a different job

[worthy plover]

first try a hackathon

[candid latch]

why not?

most owners of major tech companies are dogshit at code are they not?

[azure heart]

Where are you getting your information?

[candid latch]

mark zuckerberg as a famous example

[smoky quest]

that would be a different job

[azure heart]

You're far more likely to hear about the ones that are clowns than the successful ones

that doesn't mean most are

[smoky quest]

and remember a CEO is in charge of not just engineering but product, sales, marketing, support, etc.

So no, they cannot excel at every single function

[worthy plover]

it's not 90's and dont work like that anymore...

startup needs very skilled people to grow.

[smoky quest]

I mean, a more jaded version would say they don't need to be skilled, but they do need to bring something valuable to the table

you have plenty of leaders who are useless, but they do bring financing

[worthy plover]

if you had to thik of one problem to solve what would it be?

[candid latch]

management class provides the least value while extracting the most by definition
the ppl who provide the most value would be the programmers I'd hire, my job would just be negotiating contracts for the team to get paid
I just need to know enough about coding to navigate the mess of the project dev phase to achieve the vision or goal I have for the software

[worthy plover]

you just need to learn 2 things financial accounting, and corporate finance rest is common sense and taxes of course

[candid latch]

optimizing marketing and exploiting the dying mall industry sinking billions into commercial real estate to justify their overhead

[smoky quest]

how did you figure out all of that without experience?

how many startups have you sold?

[worthy plover]

management degree teach a lot and everything you need to know to own/manage a company

[smoky quest]

how many 9 digit products have you built?

[candid latch]

I have several friends who are entrepreneurs, this is the general trend. The management providing value thing is propaganda cope to sell to midwits.

[worthy plover]

who knows he maybe -> can built -> havent build

[smoky quest]

okay. So you hire 10 engineers. What do they work on?

[worthy plover]

after a certain point you'll need professional business people to grow either you hire them or learn all these by yourself but you need to know management

[candid latch]

you don't need 10, you need maybe 2 max if even
I can't answer your question yet because I don't know enough about coding to navigate, which is my main problem.

[azure heart]

Having been on projects that were under-managed, management is definitely important

but there's also such thing as too many managers

[worthy plover]

how do you manage product portfolio, stakeholder relationship, marketing , strategic planning, business environment change strategies and keep competing in market

[candid latch]

when I say mgmt I don't mean the mba types I mean like the difference between company owners vrs consumer class which "consumes" the corporate identity

[worthy plover]

if you dont understand this while building a product

[smoky quest]

Alright, I am telling you this outright:

• You have too many preconeived bogus notions about coding, management and startups.

So my advice for you is to stop spitting out random thoughts from tiktok or your tech bro friends and to keep an open mind

And that's okay. Don't worry about it. Try things, discover the field and gather more experience

[candid latch]

you strike me as a tech midwit with an IQ in the range of 115-130 who takes american meritocracy seriously because you're fully bought into the system
it's not random thoughts this is clearly reality if you're not a plebeian who sold their soul to a corporation

[worthy plover]

i have a different thought if you think like starting one i'd help you out definately........ crazy people build great product.

[azure heart]

We can keep this discussion civil without resorting to insults.

[smoky quest]

okay, good luck with your endeavor! You clearly know what it takes to be successful given your history

[candid latch]

I'm a professional trader successfully, hardest white collar job, so I do.

[smoky quest]

Congrats!
Happy to help with any question about leadership and how to build a successful business or career

[smoky quest]

actually, as a trader, what's your style? drawdown?
win/loss ratio? avg win?

do you track your sharpe ratio?

[candid latch]

day/swing
avg drawdown is -0.92%
profit factor 2.1
66% wr
sharpe not relevant in swing/day trading
avg holding time ~0.5 days

my goal rn is compounding wealth

[worthy plover]

if you have some funding start a startup...... you dont need to know much coding>

you just need just enough to not get fooled by developers

[candid latch]

ye exactly, that's what I was wondering

[worthy plover]

3 people type that ships quick

[smoky quest]

nice! Sounds like a lot of work

[candid latch]

I thought apply to work in field to learn to be a dev for a bit then after 2-3 yrs branch out with my own thing

[worthy plover]

use like open source stuff for prototyping go to investors market well that's what i learned by working with like 3 startups

[smoky quest]

if you can fool investors like that, they deserve it

[worthy plover]

it's not about fooling its more about solving the problem and not getting stuck on perfection until you are funded...

[smoky quest]

"use open source for prototyping" might then be weirdly phrased.
It should take a lot more to convince someone

there should be a plan, there will be due diligence, etc.

[worthy plover]

not open source exactly i ment sth like getting things done without wasting millions on sth that dont have product market fit and looking back at a product that no one use....

[smoky quest]

definitely! Building a MVP or anything to show value

[worthy plover]

yeah and after you have investors or like initial product you can start developing professionally.....

[smoky quest]

I mean, technically, it would have been done professionally from the get go

that's where seed vs series A come in

[worthy plover]

finding an actual solvable problem is the major issue ....... if you are sure of one go for it......

[smoky quest]

it is the tough part! (among many otherS)

[candid latch]

model building is annoying but doesn't take that long, the challenge in the job is emotion mgmt as the statistical outcomes unfold
in theory trading is easy you follow rules you made, in practice it is nearly impossible to follow 1/1 esp if you have bills and it's a "do or die" situation
it's why I said hardest white collar job

[candid jungle]

hi im new who can help me learn pyton

[azure heart]

This channel is for discussing careers with python. You can ask this in #python-discussion

[solid parcel]

Is this as an employee, or day trading under your own steam? Have long have you been doing it for? I'm curious because it's vanishingly rare for day traders to profit in the long run

[worthy plover]

Hey!

[smoky quest]

I haven't had issues following the trading rules I made.
Though I would never "do or die" as you should always scale your investment based on the risk you can afford and expected outcome

It doesn't stop me from playing in terms of exploration vs exploitation. But that's a different optimization

[candid latch]

on my own, 4 yrs profitably
it's rare because edge is hard to maintain these days and liquidity engineering scams

[candid latch]

what strat do you run? crypto? options? stocks?
I use mean reversion strat based around vwap, ema bands and set targets to some deviation relative to avg drawdown, runup

the simpler the better imo contrary to what ppl might think about trading

[solid parcel]

I'll be curious to see if your performance holds up in a down market, as opposed to the hyper-bullish run of the past few years

[candid latch]

backtested on tv during bear, actually does better in bear for crypto anyways
markets tend to be in mean reversion, bull mkts have more trends which are actually imo more dangerous for leveraged trading anyways

[smoky quest]

main one is momentum on stock. Pretty simple but super consistent ~3% gain on each trades with trades I can scale in size and number

[candid latch]

swing? day? position?
what momentum indicator are you using?

[elder turtle]

Hello

I'm new at here.

Where should I start?

[analog sun]

Probably #python-discussion , and take a look through our resources which I will link below

!resources

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[elder turtle]

Thanks you sir 🙏

[sand hawk]

hey there, say i want to find a company with very high depth engineering culture, how would i proceed to find where to apply ?

[analog sun]

@flat plank your messages were removed for violating server rules 6 and 9

[fringe sphinx]

Every team within every company is different, every product, manager, engineering lead, etc carries different biases and tendencies.

[sand hawk]

that's what i was worried about... yet i need to find a place where i can thrive mentally and humanly

(thanks for your answer already)

[fringe sphinx]

I guess I'm just saying: it's almost impossible to predict culture and fit, in my experience, especially just by searching on the internet. A good manager makes all the difference, and that's really hard to gauge if you don't have a friend who'll tell you the truth

[sand hawk]

yeah i was about to say just that, networking/acquaintances should be my first tool for that. and indeed a good manager is crucial

[fringe sphinx]

Conversely: a lot of it is probably about you: you being coachable, easy to work with, prepared, etc

[sand hawk]

can't be fully unbiased regarding myself but i'm pretty open minded, friendly and highly motivated whenever there's upskill or team spirit guaranteed

i used to work a lot for free, i help neighbors of all kinds with pleasure, i just dread politically gifted low-skilled liars that play where management can't see

[vapid jay]

How do people here prepare for uncertainty with the job market? If you're already working, do you have 6-12 months of savings as collateral just in case or is this unfeasible?

[solid parcel]

Regardless of industry, having 6-12 months expenses as an emergency fund is considered good financial practice. As for if that's feasible or not, that largely comes down to if you're earning enough to put money aside.

[sand hawk]

+1 I've read that multiple times in different places. a small buffer is a must have imo

and I guess applying/networking so your name might be in recruiters mind may sh*t happen

[vapid jay]

I've heard that unfortunately there is work toxicity no matter where you work at and I wanted to know how do you avoid being involved with that?

[sand hawk]

I was just asking about the same exact issue above 😄

[vapid jay]

Universal issue, huh 😂

[sand hawk]

if you find any idea, feel free to ping me, i'm open for any suggestion

[sand hawk]

exactly

[vapid jay]

I guess what I've been told is to not be involved and if they're toxic towards you. Don't emotionally react, but if it truly goes against the companies core values or is quite literally discriminating or insulting you. You can prepare a document with date and time and the context and what was said so that if they decide to sabotage you. You can have proof to show HR if you're forced to have a meeting with them. In other words, don't give them leverage against you.

However, if they don't do anything about the toxicity. Then there is an issue with the company itself.

[sand hawk]

Oh yeah, paper trail, that's always good, for your sanity and to avoid being seen as spreader of false rumors. But then it means the strategy to filter companies is broken

that's my case, higher ups are way to loose with toxic bullshiters and just deaf toward my needs even though i end up fixing issues caused by bullshiters. that's why i'm looking for a better company.

[vapid jay]

Yeah, and don't tell anyone that you are. You can just obtain as much skills as you can and at the same time apply for different jobs. From what you're saying, it isn't a good company to work for if you end up having to deal with toxicity in a daily basis. Besides that, paper trails are good because toxic people like to gaslight people.

[sand hawk]

kinda, it's mostly one guy who is too much a politician, and he likes to play optics to appear cool to others, management cared a bit but not enough to stop him so now it's too late

are website like glassdoor useless these days ? there was a lot of employee feedback long ago

[vapid jay]

Politics and religion and private life matters is unprofessional. If a company allows these types of discussions, then they're fueling the fire.

[vapid jay]

Sometimes, glassdoor is okay but you got to give it a grain of salt. I've noticed that some actual toxic people would make comments and say "this is a great company" and claim there are no cons. There are plenty of other websites instead.

[sand hawk]

by politician i mean distorting truth and diverting conversations into non technical topics to take space and have an aura. until the zoom call is over and then he's back onto reddit

[sand hawk]

ah I should dig for alternatives to glassdoor then

[vapid jay]

Use it, but yeah.

[silver bear]

hey guys, apologies for being off-topic. i'm a 19-year old with my first day of learning python with no CS background. any advice on which platforms and resources to use for learning it the most effective way? currently drowning in the sea of resources.

[sand hawk]

@silver bear are you already good with high-school level of arithmetics and logic ? (combinatorics, exponentials, logarithms,...) ? that helps to direct you to the right books

[silver bear]

yes, i have passed A-levels with pre-engineering subjects being Physics, Maths, and Chem

[vapid jay]

I'm assuming you're applying for university, correct?

[silver bear]

currently on gap year, will apply for universities next summer 🙂

[vapid jay]

Hold on.

[silver bear]

sure thing.

[vapid jay]

I recommand the following:

1. Learn single-variable calculus, linear algebra, statistics, discrete mathematics, and group theory.
2. Learn Python using learnpython.org (and use the server’s dedicated resource channel).
3. Learn data structures and algorithms (focus on complexity, recursion, sorting, searching, trees, graphs). Make sure you fully understand the difference between stack and heap. Surprisngly, not a lot of people know this 😂 (Watch videos by CodingJesus)
4. Learn how to use Git and GitHub (commits, branches, pull requests, collaboration).
5. Develop projects to apply your knowledge (small → medium → capstone).

Useful youtubers:

1. https://www.youtube.com/@NeetCodeIO
2. https://www.youtube.com/@ThePrimeTimeagen

Do not use AI to do code for you. Learn how to use it, sure, but don't heavily rely on it. It is a useful tool to know what to learn next, or teach you what questions you should ask, how to answer someone , etc.

Use this discord server for help too.

The reason I recommanded NeetCodeIO is he forces you to think for yourself. Too many youtubers spoonfeed. One day you'll have responsibilities or duties given by someone at work or maybe in your own company. If you can't answer your own questions or do your own work without other people helping you, you're cooked. Especially if you're heavily reliant on chatgpt or coding solutions on Youtube.

[silver bear]

thanks a lot for the recommendations, i was torn between people trying to sell useless courses and other stuff. so many resources, while very few want to teach.

[vapid jay]

You learn far more by doing complex projects and also by being involved with open-source projects. However, I would recommend doing projects first before open-source. There is no guarantee of being mentored. Learn how to search, as weird as that sounds. The ability of being able to search to get what you want is a skill. And try to learn more from reading books than youtube, but do what is best for you. Doing projects is the best way to get out of tutorial hell. Learning how to use AI properly is a skill that will be valuable in the future. SInce there is no way of running away from it.

[silver bear]

understood. appreciate the help so much. any other advice before i start my journey in this world?

[vapid jay]

Challenging things is the only way to get better. So suffer.

As weird as that sounds, i have suffered a lot academically but surprisingly from that. I learnt a lot.

Other people might give better advice, and also try to learn to be coachable. If you're not easy to teach, then that will effect you negatively.

[silver bear]

alright, let's see what this path has in-store for me. thanks a lot for giving me the push i needed so badly. also, thank you for giving much valuable advice.

[vapid jay]

Good luck!

[solid parcel]

I'd start with CS50 and CS50 Python. Two free courses from Harvard that'll give you a great intro to the absolute basics of programming and Python.

The quality of teaching is fantastic, there are exercises to complete along the way and it's a great onramp to help you start building the fundamentals you'll need.

[sand hawk]

was about to suggest CS50, seems like a well rounded an deep course

[silver bear]

the duration of that course made me feel a bit overwhelmed. will definitely dive into it now that you guys are recommending it!

[solid parcel]

You don't need to do it all at once 🙂 Imo it's much more immediately applicable than the first suggestion from Firehawk (though the other ones from him are decent). For most dev work, you really don't need to be familiar with concepts like linear algebra or discrete mathematics. Imo it makes more sense to tackle those only if you find you need that knowledge, rather than while you're working to develop an initial foundation.

One of the good things with CS50 is it gives a fairly short feedback loop, too. Each lecture has related coding activities to complete, which are auto-marked. So you can immediately start applying the things you're learning 🙂

[silver bear]

cool, will be really helpful in a sense of learning as well. really familiar with the learning style of lectures. courses and instructions make me uncomfortable. can move on to those once i have built strong foundations/basics.

[torpid relic]

Guys i wanna know how long does it take to become a full stack python developer and land a job if you are self learner?

[visual flax]

what is something that uplifts you guys who feel behind in life?

[fallen gyro]

why do you feel "behind in life"? Is it because you're comparing someone else's success to your journey?

[visual flax]

Naw, I was just curious. I don't feel that too often anymore. But I wanted to see individual answers from people.

[solid parcel]

It's worth remembering that the 'successful' parts of people's lives are often the most visible. You generally don't see as much of the parts they struggle with or neglect.

[visual flax]

Obviously, we always feel behind whenever we compare ourselves to any kind of standard. I am physically fit more so than most but I am very poor. I enjoy what I do but make very little, I have a lot of fun but I have no relationship. Ect

[torpid relic]

You should focus on positive things in your life and for your weaknesses you should accept them and don’t let them distract you

[fallen gyro]

I see, if anyone does feel that way I usually tell them that they aren't behind in life. No one is. Just focus on your goals and weakness and everything will fall in place for you