career-advice

[fringe sphinx]

Oh, then what are you stressed about? Work experience is work experience: build your relationships, go out to lunch with colleagues, and keep getting better

You're lucky to have a job while in Uni

[fallow mantle]

Like I said, it's hard to not think about what will happen after uni if I don't make a move

I'm afraid I'll be stuck there forever, handling protective gear to everyone

[fringe sphinx]

Trust the process. Gain XP, level up, take side quests, and find the prince/princess.

[fallow mantle]

What that mean? 😭

[fringe sphinx]

I'm saying it's like a video game: gain experience, even if it's unrelated to your goal.

[fallow mantle]

What if I never get to the next level?

[fringe sphinx]

How could that happen?

Honestly, I can't relate to this type of question. I'm blessed with having very little worry about tomorrow.

[fallow mantle]

Idk, not getting the right opportunity. I speak both English, Portuguese and Chinese (我爱喜欢吃面包）but still didn't get an answer from a worldwide company in 3 weeks, not even a no after an interview for internship

[fringe sphinx]

You're in 1st or 2nd year of Uni, why would someone interview you?

I wouldn't.

[fallow mantle]

I'm actually in 7th semester

[solid parcel]

Given you don't even graduate until 2028, @fringe sphinx is right. Chill, you've got plenty of time. Just focus on getting the basics down. I'm a big fan of engineers setting up a basic three tier web app as a starting project. Spin something up, and then follow the fun. Dive deeper into the parts that are actually interesting you...

[whole flare]

Resume question: Where does one put the Awards and Publications sections? My current format is: Education, Experience, Volunteering, Projects, Skills

[fringe sphinx]

Usually at bottom. If it's good, after Xp

Volunteering before projects is a little weird

[fallow mantle]

The thing I mean im running out of time you know? I don't got too much time until graduation and I fear after that I'll never be able to place myself in the field

[whole flare]

What would you define as good

[fringe sphinx]

Between chaotic and lawful, I guess

[whole flare]

I have been informed of such, the reason for that is because I don't have many projects worthy of being on my resume (in my opinion), while the volunteering is much more based in my eyes.

[fringe sphinx]

Fair, is the volunteering industry related?

[whole flare]

How do you mean?

[fallow mantle]

Well, besides literal NES homebrew development, I do really enjoy data analysis. That's what I do that is the most programming related at my job and is what my leadership has announced as what I'll be doing more and more as time goes by

[fringe sphinx]

Many people graduate without xp or a definite job. All you can do is your best: be prepared through breadth, networking and building the best experience / projects / whatever you can.

[fringe sphinx]

Awesome. One thing you can do is tackle some Kaggle projects, or get involved in an OSS project related to data analysis

[fringe sphinx]

What kind of volunteering?

[solid parcel]

Cool, if that's what you enjoy, go deeper and get cracked.

[whole flare]

Assisting in projects like Vipyr Security for example

I suppose it is industry related? 🤔

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, so that's industry related, for sure

Might be arguably experience

[whole flare]

Easy there captain

[fringe sphinx]

Why not?

[whole flare]

I mean.. I personally wouldn't place it there

[fringe sphinx]

Depends how light your experience is

Like, a recent college grad might list that as experience

[fallow mantle]

Sorry to bring one more thing to it, but That's also a key factor, Im also afraid I'm an outlier. Like, everyone I know from uni already works at IT. Tho most got there from inside help. Meanwhile my family is from a health/medic background, not surprising I work at a hospital too

[whole flare]

I understand

[solid parcel]

Flip this around. you haven't graduated yet, and you're already building connections daily with people (your peers) that are already in the field. Sounds like when you graduate, you'll already have a nice little network in place.

Them being in IT already is a boon to you.

[fringe sphinx]

You know, health care has a big tech industry.

[fallow mantle]

The thing Im most afraid is this 2 things, that it is not normal for an it student to not work in the field before uni and that I'll be stuck there forever

[fallow mantle]

Oh my higher ups are not from it, they just like to make advertisement of me for the it department. That's how I got my interview

[timid osprey]

what are you studying?

[fallow mantle]

Computer science

[timid osprey]

im a junior in hs im planning on going down that path

[fallow mantle]

Hs?

[whole flare]

high school

[timid osprey]

yeah high school

[fallow mantle]

Watch out for graphs and linear algebra, they got hands

[timid osprey]

what are you branching out to?

[timid osprey]

lol thx for the heads up

im tryna get myself get used to some of the topics by studying DSA "data structure and algorithms"

i wanna branch out to software engineering

[fallow mantle]

Hmpf, anything the company I'm at asks for. But I have an easier time for data analysis and stuff that is more theory than practice

[timid osprey]

that's cool, ive seen a lotta good things about that field if you're able to break through

[fallow mantle]

Afaik software engineering takes a long time, specially because it's a role that requires experience and a lot of it. With that said, you bouta have an easier time at uni, these are usually the most boring of classes

At my uni we have software planning and project and software engineering which includes from managing a software project, to pitch, the many roles and so on

[fallow mantle]

Idk, never talked too much with data scientist/analists

[timid osprey]

yeah i saw taht kind of stuff by researching (on chatgpt lol) that's why i wanna start right now i havent been doing much dual enrollment or other stuff to focus on school, ive been just doing the norm and focusing on programming and understanding the basics so in uni it wont take me long to get internship but who knows

[fallow mantle]

The very little I talked too they said they just trained AIs to do their job

[timid osprey]

im going into this with 1% hard work 99% faith

[fallow mantle]

Bah, take it easy, software engineering is more not a role that you either work as or you don't. You'll be applying software engineering all over your daily work, at meetings, even when you decide what/how to write code

[timid osprey]

honestly i havent had the chance to talk to tech ppl i just search online and talk to chatgpt, i liked the idea of data science and ML but it seems too much and im more into programming

[timid osprey]

interesting, ive heard stuff like you spend most time on meetings, ig that could be said for a lotta tech jobs

[fallow mantle]

A software engineer per say is usually someone with years on their back

[fallow mantle]

(for what I was taught) Software is about getting concepts of working and projects from engineering and applying to software development to make coding less painful

So even if your an intern, you'll be using many concepts of project planning along your day

[fringe sphinx]

Depends. And many meetings are actually good

[timid osprey]

by years as in years of experience?

[fallow mantle]

Was about to say that. Be it when to report what is your progress in the project/task/ticket, bring ideas, get up to date with your coworkers...

[timid osprey]

if u dont mind me asking what's ur areas of experty in tech

[fringe sphinx]

Data stuff

[timid osprey]

you're a data scientist?

[fallow mantle]

Yes

[fringe sphinx]

More or less everything but scientist

[timid osprey]

was there something you did in high school that made things easy for u or things u wish u did

[solid parcel]

I work at a bank, a solid 30% of my time is taken up with Jira/Agile shenanigans and a further 20% at least by red tape. I spend altogether too much time in meetings 😁

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, I moved to small tech a while ago and enjoy it. Meetings are generally productive

[solid parcel]

My last org was c. 30 people, and I was one of 3 cloud engineers. Current one is 70,000, so it's been quite a shift, haha.

[lilac yoke]

The difference between a developer/engineer and a scientist is what they name their variables

well_described_purpose vs rho_sigma_not

[wraith harbor]

do you like the STAR method for describing your work experience on your resume?

[smoky quest]

yes

[wraith harbor]

alright im going to try to redraft mine and then post it here maybe. i feel like ive done good stuff but i just need to phrase it better

[pastel aspen]

My last gig directly had this as an evaluation step.
(Not "they didn't frame their resume that way, ignore them", but "do a STAR evaluation" etc)

[smoky quest]

that sounds quite extreme

[pastel aspen]

FinTech is dumb, you get tons of fake applicants.

I worked with a guy once who successfully convinced us all that he'd worked on core search at old Yahoo.. much later, we learned that nobody on that team had ever heard of him, and his entire resume was fake. What's weird is that he wasn't bad, and knew what he was doing?

[cosmic mica]

Appreciate this, helped me calm myself down lol.

Interview round went off without a hitch, implemented a new feature to their prod repo with half an hour to spare, and had a great convo. Finalizing job offer this week

[fringe sphinx]

That's amazing, congratulations 🎈

[fiery plume]

hi

[peak halo]

this reads more like an ad than an organic recommendation

[trail geyser]

nope , i can delete it

if u want me to

[peak halo]

I'll take your word for it.

[solid parcel]

Oh come off it... This is AI generated slop, and you're trying to charge for it.

[solid parcel]

Did you kick them, or did they leave out of shame? xD

[peak halo]

They are still in the server.

[solid parcel]

Ah, just Discord being Discord on my side, then. Wasn't showing them as still a member

[open ivy]

People mention how even sending a few applications is "soul crushing".

But if you reframe this as a small part of the process, the main stuff being portfolios and relationship building, than submitting a few apps need not be so mentally draining. It becomes a chore rather than the focus and we know how to put up with annoying chores.

Both portfolios and networking are projects that you will feel the progress on if you put effort in, and a sense of progress on meaningful tasks is vital for mental health and thus productivity, and they make the apps stronger.

[solid parcel]

Context is key. When people are grinding out applications, it's often because they're either unemployed or imminently expect to be so. I'd bear in mind that the resulting pressure is a huge contributor to applications being draining, rather than it being the act of applying in and of itself.

[open ivy]

Yes, and making sure you maintain portfoleo projects etc is a good way to fight that draining ness, because it gives you a place to make progress on.

[solid parcel]

If you've reached a point where you're trying to land the next role to keep a roof over your head, personal projects are the last thing that would be on most people's minds.

[vapid violet]

Part of the problem is that I know I am wasting a lot of time as well. There are postings that get so many applicants that hiring managers cannot go through all of them so they just pick a subset and dont even look at the rest. As well as many postings being vague about what they actually want but they actually have something specific in mind so I get filtered out immediately.

Even simple applications take me 15+ minutes

[open ivy]

That is true and that also can cause a vicious cycle.

Because desperate people are a turn-off and it makes them less likely to land a job.

So it can lead to losing the roof and not having a network and having shattered mental health.

I do know someone who was under financial pressure. They drove for Uber to make ends meet and maintained personal projects as well. They actually liked the combination of simple labor with complex personal projects and they did eventually get a tech job that way.

Survival mode is for short term only

Long-term health neglect is EVEN WORSE THAN complete financial destruction. Both physical and mental.

I took medical courses at Johns Hopkins, a top medical school. You DO NOT mess with health, physical or mental! It is a necessity. Sacrificing sleep or other basic needs is an extreme version of credit card debt.

For me, personal projects are vital for mental health. Other personalities may differ. For all of us, taking hikes, brushing teeth, limiting doomsrolling, etc are good.

https://glasbergen.b-cdn.net/wp-content/gallery/miscmedical/diet1.gif

[open ivy]

Limit time spent applying to a level thar doesn't leave you drained and can be sustained. Follow other people's advice on this server as to how to apply and minimize ghost jobs.

Then spend time networking and on portfolio projects. Whatever you are passionate about making is a good start. Alternatively you can jump in in open source projects.

All three of these tasks together makes for a full time job, but it is an interesting and dynamic one. There is no obvious best way to do things so you will always be learning.

[fringe sphinx]

The thing to appreciate is that hiring is imprecise. Managers understand this, and use heuristics to: filter applicants, gauge fit, and whittle their candidates down to a small number. Even then, we know that not all candidates will be right. There's a lot of randomness at play. You can have an amazing interview and not get hired... and have a terrible interview and still get hired.

[granite wind]

hello people

i have a question

[open ivy]

@vapid violet I sent an anonomized resume here for review and you are welcome to as well.

If you treat applications like a daily chore that you get over with in the morning and then have the rest of the day for other tasks, you can actually do a fair amount of applications over a period of time. Slow and steady.

I wonder if AI can be used for filling out GPA and other simple tasks? Just don't use it for more complex responses.

[visual flax]

Is excel worth learning as an electrical engineer?

[analog sun]

Excel is worth learning as a professional that will have access to a computer

[pastel aspen]

This seems like a pretty reasonable take https://newsletter.pragmaticengineer.com/p/state-of-the-tech-market-in-2025-hiring-managers

[peak halo]

you should know how to use excel the same way you should know how to use word or powerpoint. you don't need to be a power-user, but you should know the basic functionality.

[visual flax]

So I don't need to be a powerhouse analysis!

[peak halo]

if you already know python, you'd probably find it easier to do data manipulations with pandas.

[visual flax]

Okey dokey, I won't do any extra prep for my excel training then. I will let them teach me.,

[still condor]

Excel is a bit janky if you're already familiar with programming

[pastel aspen]

Excel is also really powerful and compatible as a data-exchange interface, and now you can program it in Python, so it's also not a terrible idea.

Check out Excel eSports for the real crazy stuff.

[vapid violet]

They mention a few times that recruiters reach out to people directly through LinkedIn (or other platforms). What filters are being used on LinkedIn to find candidates? I feel like my profile is complete but it is rather plain and boring.

[pastel aspen]

I get a fair amount of recruiter reach-out on LinkedIn, I guess it may be based on which Skills you have endorsements for? I also get some that are directly/clearly based on where I last worked, trying to find people with FinTech experience etc.

Make sure to use keywords from the job you want, not just the ones you have had.

[fast fossil]

is the c. supposed to stand for circa? 👀

[pastel aspen]

coproximately?

[wraith harbor]

as someone who recently got their second job, recruiter outreach increased a ton for me. idk how experienced you are, but that really seemed like the bottleneck for myself

[solid parcel]

Yup

[shut shoal]

hello im new to python programming

[quartz gate]

It's honestly crazy how long programming problems take me....... But its worth it.

@shut shoal Here : https://codingchallenges.substack.com/

You'll thank me for this later, boyo.

[vapid violet]

0 dev related work experience, looking for internships so that might not be a thing there is much reach out for

[languid isle]

Heyyy , I am also want to learn python can u tell me the resources u use for it

[vapid jay]

yep

I 've doin' frm multi resources like Automating the boring stuff , n a YT's course n MOOC.fi . .

[languid isle]

Can u send the links of it

[vast shoal]

Automate the Boring Stuff is a really good book for complete beginners and it's free to read online: https://automatetheboringstuff.com/#toc
If you prefer to watch video tutorials Corey Schafer's playlist is also really good: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL-osiE80TeTskrapNbzXhwoFUiLCjGgY7
I also recommend Harvard’s free online course, CS50P: Introduction to Programming with Python: https://pll.harvard.edu/course/cs50s-introduction-programming-python
This is an alternative online course with lots of integrated practice problems you can do directly in the browser: https://programming-25.mooc.fi/

[languid isle]

Thank u so much

[vast shoal]

For future reference, this channel is for career discussions, not general Python help

You can ask for help with Python in #python-discussion

[balmy mural]

Once you do get a message or two, be sure to respond back. Even if it's to decline an offer. LinkedIn boosts profile visibility if you engage with other people.
But I also never got anyone to reach out until after I landed my first job. So total experience is also something to consider

[spark bluff]

I’m Val, and I’d love to get advice on my LinkedIn. Connect with me too!

https://www.linkedin.com/in/valmiknahata

[solid parcel]

I could be mistaken, but I'm pretty sure that boosted visibility doesn't take DMs into account.

[balmy mural]

It's anecdotal, but I definetly get more messages from recruiters when I'm actively responding vs not responding at all

[wild grail]

How to ?

[crude lintel]

wait python developers are supposed to have carriers 👀

[near ocean]

Careers, and yes

[barren lotus]

how important is it to know UML in the workplace?

do people really use UML? in the company i've interned in, i've never seen it being used ever

[vapid violet]

Is it clear when you get a reach out that is not a sponsored ad?

[pastel aspen]

It is on LinkedIn at least, the ads show up in a different spot than the direct messages.

[vapid violet]

👍

[solid parcel]

UML is pretty outdated, I never hear it mentioned at work. The only time I see it come up in professional circles at all is in groups like this when people mention that they're having to do it as part of a uni course, lol.

[barren lotus]

phew let me just cross that out

[solid parcel]

Being able to represent systems and architectures through different lenses can be useful, but UML itself is pretty clunky. I'm partial to a sequence diagram, for example, but wouldn't feel the need to stick rigidly to a UML specification.

[nova hare]

@barren lotus

[near ocean]

You cant advertise here

[vapid jay]

ablobhammer

[tidal oxide]

Hello everyone, what j*bs can i attain in canada from learning python?

[smoky quest]

I still see it used all the time.
There are two things to remember:

• It's a communication tool, not a design method. And it's great at what it does
• No one follows the spec to the letter

[smoky quest]

your best course of action is to look at indeed/linkedin for any job in canada that requires python

[tidal oxide]

ight

[solid parcel]

Tons, and the ones you'll see on LinkedIn won't even touch the edges. That said, you're a kid- I'd massively advise just diving into whatever you're enjoying rather than explicitly trying to optimise for a career. You might as well find what you'd have fun doing.

[pine sleet]

Bro censored job

[tidal oxide]

why did you say the j word

censor it

[jade kayak]

Hello

[nocturne locust]

hello

[jade kayak]

i am new to python ( pragramming in general to be more precise)
are there any tips on how to improve faster or things to avoid

[nocturne locust]

here for the same ques brother

[sterile tangle]

hey guys

[jade kayak]

yo

[tardy helm]

hi

[pine sleet]

not tuff

[smoky quest]

In terms of career, a degree is the path of least resistance and with the most opportunities and compensation

[shy willow]

A degree is actually the safest investment there is. Even with these inflated tuition costs in the US

[solid parcel]

Wild claim to make given only 60% of full-time college students graduate (within 6 years, which is the standard data point they take when it comes to student outcomes)

On top of that, roughly half of grads are underemployed and do not need a 4 year degree for their job.

[shy willow]

The counter point isn't that it's a completely unsafe investment. You have to place it in comparison of other investments

Which you haven't

[solid parcel]

S&P500, Gold, Bonds. If the only metric we're looking at is safety, leaving the money as cash in the bank...

Safety is not really an appropriate metric, imo. Opportunity cost makes far more sense.

[shy willow]

Past performance isn't a guarantee of future returns.

And you're also ignoring that success in finance requires extensive education

The issue here is anti intellectualism and its talking points

[solid parcel]

What? Investing in an index fund is in no way shape or form equivalent to working in finance

[solid parcel]

What are you waffling on about?! It's in very poor faith to imply I've said anything of the sort.

[smoky quest]

if the current market is already difficult for new grads, imagine how much more difficult it is for people without any education or skills

[solid parcel]

I'm not for a moment saying there isn't value in a degree, I fully agree there is. I do take issue with positioning it as 'the safest investment there is', though. I'm fully on board with you saying it's the path of least resistance.

[near ocean]

Whats safer in the context of securing a software related career

[smoky quest]

I hope this does not devolve into pedantry

[pastel aspen]

IMO you can only get "safety" from this part of your journey if you go to a top, top school and do very well.
..and that the rest always comes from the work you have done in the industry.
The safety you get is really more around human connections than anything mechanical.

I just heard back from my 1st-degree connect to the guy who ran materials science and chemistry research at Google DeepMind, so game on.

[near ocean]

I've seen plenty of people from top unis fumble interviews, its not a guarantee, but yea isnt it the safest you can get?

[smoky quest]

It will be what you make of it. You will get opportunities and it will be up to you to take them.
But yeah, the more rich and better the school, the more opportunities you will get. But it doesn't mean you get no opportunities otherwise

[solid parcel]

I think it's reasonable to say it's safer than the alternative of not having one, though it's worth considering what you're giving up to get that. Namely, 4 years and a sizeable amount of money! I think degrees are most worth it when either a) They're a near necessity for the kind of work someone wants to do, b) The person in question struggles to self-direct and would like the structure, c) They want the qualitative aspect that they couldn't get elsewhere.

[pastel aspen]

If you are just on fire to learn, and school is too slow for you, that's when you can skip it. If that's not you, then I highly suggest getting a STEM B.S. degree and/or M.S.

[solid parcel]

I'm a massive fan of apprenticeships, but alas they're woefully thin on the ground when it comes to tech, and particularly so in the US from my understanding.

[pastel aspen]

I had a job working on compilers in open source before I was scheduled to take the compiler class in my C.S. degree.
But I'm a mutant... and even I think I should have stayed in school.

[smoky quest]

I have never seen the first part actually working for many reasons (people don't know what they don't know, missed opportunities, if they think they know better than school they are wrong, difficult to demonstrate they are the same or better than a new grad...)

[pastel aspen]

Well, I built the API and implementation that SalesForce moved to, and I don't have a 4-year degree yet :V

[smoky quest]

in what year?

[pastel aspen]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloud_Foundry I was Staff Engineer at VMware for this, and they gave me the API, API server, and services architecture to handle.

[solid parcel]

That first part is massively important, imo. When I see people succeed in tech without a degree, they've always built up a network of people with more knowledge and experience than themselves, who can help guide and course correct them along the way.

[near ocean]

Theres no fund or stock you could reliably dump degree money in that would sustain you for a lifetime the way a degree would, theyre not comparable investments

[pastel aspen]

I'm not sure VMware has had other Staff Engineers without 4-year degrees.

[smoky quest]

you started your career 20+ years ago. There were not enough applicants and it was crazy during the dotcom.
I don't think your experience reflects the realities of the past 15 years

[pastel aspen]

Hence my recommendations above.
But I'm equally confident I could do it now from scratch, and would, in exchange for the years of youth.

[smoky quest]

I have seen people without degree succeed. But they do not have access to the same doors/opportunities

[pastel aspen]

THAT, I will 1000% agree with.
I am going back to school now so I can open those doors.

2009 is not "the dotcom" though

[near ocean]

What doors would a bachelors open for you that staff eng at vmware hasnt already

[pastel aspen]

For one, Space Force officer track. For others, working at some place like Galois, or having my grant proposals approved etc.

[solid parcel]

I only mentioned stock indexes as an example of an investment with a more reliable return, as an objection to the idea of a degree as 'the safest investment there is'. They're very different, as you say.

[pastel aspen]

Hashicorp told me I wasn't "accomplished enough" to interview.
(Their site runs on code I maintained and contributed to etc)

[smoky quest]

There are a few areas such as:

• More theoretical areas as it is not something self-taught usually care about and thus can demonstrate
• staff+ levels that might have a hard requirement on a degree, sometimes masters/phd

[near ocean]

You should be comparing paths in the same category, index funds vs crypto/day traders, degree vs going at it self taught

[solid parcel]

I don't think you're getting what I'm saying - I really don't think we're in disagreement here.

[near ocean]

A degree is the safest investment for securing a tech career (compared to other paths like self teaching or bootcamps)

[solid parcel]

I already agreed with you on that point more than 10 minutes ago

[pastel aspen]

Honestly I think this is increasingly going to be the case, because what I'm hearing from my university staff friends is that EVERYBODY is cheating with AI, and so if you go and actually study like a warrior, you will easily stand out.
That's how I plan to approach it when I re-start in the Spring.

Assume the exam will be in a Faraday Cage with no calculators allowed.

[wraith harbor]

Given your experience a computer science bachelor's will probably be really easy

[pastel aspen]

If it isn't, I'm gonna learn something important about myself!

[fast fossil]

you could try doing that regardless /hj

[solid parcel]

Do you already know where you're studying? If not and the only requirement is a degree, I'd strongly consider doing something like WGU and just absolutely blitzing through the course.

[pastel aspen]

Yeah, I want to get into FSU's Interdisciplinary Data Science hybrid B.S./Masters, and because of some mistakes long in the past, I don't currently qualify for admission, so I'm going to a local 2-year school that has a special track for fixing this kind of thing. (TSC ASPIRE)

https://www.tsc.fl.edu/academics/transfer-services/aspire/

[solid parcel]

I'm surprised a many years long professional career wouldn't be sufficient qualification to be admitted. Are you missing a high school diploma or something?

[pastel aspen]

Nope, but I didn't withdraw from my last C.S. classes way back when properly, it seems, and got terrible grades etc. Because I have any credit hours, I am only permitted to be a transfer student, not a new applicant. FSU doesn't have any routes to forgiveness, even special permission from the Dean of Arts and Sciences (actually my friend's boss lol).

[solid parcel]

Pfff, somewhere, Kafka is laughing 😆

Sorry to hear you're having to deal with that, how frustrating!

[pastel aspen]

It's all good, builds character, and lets me grind out some hopefully easy classes to prove I can do it and improve my old GPA etc.

The bummer is that I can't qualify for valedictorian no matter how well I do; but I'll still approach it as if that's the goal.

[solid parcel]

What if all of the other people in your class have unfortunate accidents? Valedictorian by default!

[pastel aspen]

Aha, the "Thunderdome Algorithm", I like it.

[solid parcel]

I will never understand the mentality of trying to advertise services as a developer, to a network of other developers. At least take the time to build some standing before you try and sell yourself...

I'd put money on engineers here either having the skills to do what you do already, or having trusted contacts that they could ask to point them in the right direction if they do need to hire. Neither of which would lead to them picking up an unknown from Discord, who seemingly comes without a GitHub, projects, or even a CV to speak of.

[glass trout]

sure.

[solid parcel]

No, no I do not 😂

[smoky quest]

!rule 9

[inner wren]

Rules

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[solid parcel]

Do you need developer? 😆

[pastel aspen]

I need developer what can grammar.

[peak halo]

I just got an email from the chief HR officer titled "furloughs for week of Oct 13th", but I can't read it until I get home 😔

[pastel aspen]

I will say though that open source has given me everything good in my career, other than the very first step.

[solid parcel]

Lots of tech (which is positive, you've actually shown how and where you've used each), lack of outcomes, fairly verbose bullet points, too many of them. Recruiters scan in an F shape. You need to make it easy for them to see the points that really matter for the job. If it isn't easy to scan through, they're unlikely to bother giving it a deeper read.

That said, it's already more solid than a lot of CVs I see.

If you don't have data points, guesstimate. Could be increased revenue, reliability, improved dwell time etc. Ideally, tie impact to business metrics rather than purely technical.

Stick to a more active tone of voice 'These apps generated over xxx dollars' is not the same as tying your actions directly to that outcome.

Consider giving a one liner about your role at each org. Not strictly necessarily, but I like it and it's something that is easily tweaked between applications.

[solid parcel]

Urgh, that sucks.... Are you in gov?

[peak halo]

A non profit that does research for the government. Which means we won't get backpay

[solid parcel]

That tremendously sucks, sorry to hear. Government shut downs are such a wonky way of handling the budget approval process

[peak halo]

We need an amendment to make it so this can't happen. Which means it will keep happening.

[wraith harbor]

thanks for the good advice. yeah i hear you on the verbosity, and I didn't know about the F shape concept thats pretty good.

[wraith harbor]

the entire structure of how the government works vis-a-vis shutdowns/budgets is so awful/bizarre. hoping it ends up okay for you

[peak halo]

Did you reply to the wrong message? I'm still employed

[solid parcel]

Doh, I did! Intended for Eddie.

[solid parcel]

https://youtu.be/sNbOUAkgxCo?si=7D34Izt0aw0mrEOm I'd recommend having a watch of this. Ignore the clickbaity thumbnail, it's packed with evidence backed guidance for optimising a CV.

@severe widget Scammer

[whole flare]

What if I don't reimburse you?

[wraith harbor]

thanks

[vast shoal]

<@&831776746206265384>

[pastel aspen]

Senior isn’t about how hard you can program, it’s about being able to show where on the doll the computer hurt you: https://levelup.gitconnected.com/beyond-the-code-lessons-that-make-you-senior-1ba44469aa42

[solid parcel]

Imo it's usually processes that hurt more than the code 😁 (as in organisational rather than CPU)

[pastel aspen]

Conway’s Law is more important even than Amdahl’s Law IMO.

[solid parcel]

I had a great time at work today courtesy of the ballsup that lost us access to our repos.

It meant I could stop banging my head against a wall, and get some productive work done. It's nice when things get serendipitously blocked sometimes... When you're in the weeds with something, it can be hard to tell if it's genuinely painful to make any progress with, or if you're just procrastinating.

After a chance to step away, I can firmly say that in this case it's the former, haha.

[barren lotus]

<@&831776746206265384> crypto scam

same one as in pydis

[fringe sphinx]

!ban 997951881919873074 Crypto scam no thanks

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @clever basalt permanently.

[red mantle]

Is cyber security a viable path with AI and all of that on the rise?

[lunar shell]

tbh, idk what i want to be yet

[nocturne locust]

according to me it is one of the best as ai slop creates more and more code with that more and more code is vulnerable with security issues to exploit so it is a good path to follow... also more of ai code is vibe coding and people dont even know what code or language are they writing let alone security issues with that vibed code

[open ivy]

So many AI job application service ads these days.

[lunar shell]

so many disillusions and scams

[open ivy]

Are all of them scams? I am an AI skeptic in terms of AGI replace humans everywhere.

But a task that is tedious and repetitive that has been done many times before seems ideal for LLMs.

As long as there is an escape hatch that allows more complex questions to be answered manually. And if anything that is the interesting part of the application.

[fiery plume]

bro im js... code a anti raid nuke but why 1k line 😭

[fathom fox]

As someone in the threat detection space, there are definitely lots of opportunities, and it is a lot of fun (in my opinion). But it can be very chaotic, and I'd recommend choosing an area to focus in

[solid parcel]

Yes, it absolutely is

[open ivy]

I think people overestimate AI's ability to replace people for complex tasks that cover large domains.

AI is good to tell me how to use a library to do something that is a common thing to do in said library. Once you get good at programming such a task is no longer interesting. Having AI as a simple-minded assistent to do such tasks leaves more effort for tackling bigger problems.

I am looking into AI for job applications because that process is also 80% straightforward tasks with plenty of training data. Again, AI/automation does our boring tasks as a general rule.

[smoky quest]

that reminds me I promised to review your resume

let me find it

[smoky quest]

• Resumes are read top to bottom. So put the most important information at the top. That means put your stuff in reverse chronological order
• "Three internships" does not tell me how good or bad they were. Did you cure cancer or brought coffee? In the mean time, I have thousands of other resumes that describe in details how they cured cancer
• For your phd, I am missing the impact and your thesis
• For your experience, it sounds like you have a lot to say but it's too vague to get me excited. Imagine you are geeking out, what is difficult about it? What is your claim to fame?
• You have too many projects. Trim your list down to 3 projects so you can get into more details

For instance, right now, I could think about a scientific computation related job for which you might be a good fit, but given the languages involved and topics, I have a hard time to match it with your resume. And if I wasn't just reviewing your resume here to help you, I would just skip it

[tardy helm]

guys i need a advice

[smoky quest]

I have all sorts of advice. What kind do you want

[tardy helm]

It's a big topic.

[near ocean]

Do you want to narrow it down? Why did you ask for advice here

[tardy helm]

Because I can't find anyone to take advice from

[dreamy ruin]

I'm new btw

[near ocean]

Advice for what my guy, youre not making it easy

[tardy helm]

I'm a complete beginner in the world of programming, technology, and computer science, and I have no prior knowledge. I need to start from scratch and learn the basics in a systematic way so I can understand computers, programming, and networks and build strong skills in any field How do I start?

[near ocean]

You start by going to #python-discussion and doing !res, clicking the link, filtering the resource list to beginner and topic: general and picking a book from there

[tardy helm]

Ok ty

[tardy helm]

Also another question: Is language an important factor in programming, since English is not my mother tongue?

[earnest mauve]

Need some advice, I've been a software developer for 2 years now. At my company I've lead the project of building an e-commerce mobile app (In Flutter) with a Python backend (FastAPI), building the API alone interacting with MySQL database.

The app is not fully released due to internal delays - but I am wondering if I wait for the app to be deployed to customers , could be well over another year or so. or do I look around for a new role? I prefer backend and python projects, but had experience in App Dev prior hence the project.

Could I find a Python role after 2 years exp? Would that still be classed as a Junior Dev?

[pastel aspen]

What do they propose that you work on while the app is 'deployed'? Do you feel like it will help you grow in the direction you want to go?
If not, I would look for another job and use this experience as part of your explanation (in a non-complain-y way) of how you have grown in your understanding of what makes software development hard; that it's not the coding etc.

Also, a year is a wild length of time for an app to get rolled out; are they open to changing their approach? I've worked in very stodgy domains (state government welfare policy) and even there nothing took a year to roll out.
If you can propose a better way they might like that etc.
Is the app 'on-prem' for customers? Have you looked at things like Replicated?

[earnest mauve]

The app is currently in a stage where it's needed internal testing, but everyone is too busy to test it, which is a pain for me as I can't bug fix... if I don't know the bugs. It's sort of here and there rather than a full sit down, deep dive into the testing phase. But I understand the reasoning due to other issues within the business, the app has taken a backseat.

I feel like I am just delaying my own learning experience as I'm not really doing much? But would a fully deployed app be THAT benificial to my career?

The app is essentially just an ecommerce platform for customers to login, place orders, view account ext.

[pastel aspen]

Deploying it won't teach you much honestly, only scaling/defending it as it grows, and that takes time.. From your reply there, I'd say yes, be looking for something cooler.
Unless they are just pouring money on you.
(In which case just study cooler stuff on the weekend)

[earnest mauve]

Money's good but, I actually want to grow in my career as I am early twenties right now and feel like I could learn so much more elsewhere

[earnest mauve]

Cool, would this 2 year exp I've got here class as a Junior still? I'm not really sure about all the market tbh as this is my first role. in UK

[pastel aspen]

Yeah, Senior is about having endured pain, not really about shipping software https://levelup.gitconnected.com/beyond-the-code-lessons-that-make-you-senior-1ba44469aa42

I graduated out of Junior very fast, but that's because I got thrown directly into crazy critical emergency projects at scale
That you would never give to someone like I was, circa 2025, too many people know how to program now for that etc

and I didn't start calling myself Senior until I'd been in the industry for, uhh.. 15 years?

Most people claim it sooner than that now.

Technically I had a 'Senior' in my title within 5 years of starting out, but I didn't refer to myself that way

[near ocean]

No, it all depends on how you interview tbh
(And the roles you apply to obviously)

More corporate environments might not give you a chance to interview for mid level roles

[earnest mauve]

This looks like a good read. I'll read it after my shift. I wouldn't class myself as senior. Yeah I've led projects here (bar the app, many data projects and creating and managing feature requests) but I have loads to learn , aside from the programming side

[earnest mauve]

Yeah that's what I was thinking to be honest

guess it will depend on how I word my CV and outline my experience on the projects I've done here

[near ocean]

Im pretty sure im a mid level dev rn 😩 and i got into this position at 10months experience,
Surely its possible for someone with more experience

[earnest mauve]

Yeah it's all case by case, think it's time to start searching around and see what's available

[pastel aspen]

IMO read more of my crazy book suggestions that aren't about programming. Senior interview questions aren't like "solve this graph problem" 100%, they are also "How do you feel about technical debt?"
"What does rectitude mean to you?"
Trolley problem crap

[solid parcel]

Pfff, who on Earth likes technical debt?!

[pastel aspen]

Aha, but if you say you don't like something without proposing a workable alternative, you lost points in a senior interview.

[solid parcel]

Fully agreed. Certainly a question I could answer, but an exasperating one nonetheless

[pastel aspen]

Juniors know how to code through problems, Seniors know how to re-route, Principals know how to avoid them in the first place, Architects (the good ones) know how to prevent any engineer from having to know about that problem

[near ocean]

On paper seniors know how to reroute
In practise?

[solid parcel]

Ha, I've been writing up a doc today to get buy in for a change in architecture that I'm proposing. My core selling points are a smaller codebase without losing functionality, some QoL improvements and an improved operator experience (Doing some clever things behind the scenes so that more junior colleagues can use the tooling without needing deep knowledge).

[pastel aspen]

each of my definitions above is "people I would call...", to be clear

[pastel aspen]

IMO this is the real "10x", not doing it harder yourself, but enabling your colleagues to crush it.

[solid parcel]

Agreed. Even when you're thinking in those terms, working out how to do it effectively can be tricky.

Identifying when to plow on with a quick MVP and iterate from there vs when to spend more time drilling into architecture upfront is hard.

Urgh, plus trying to account for likely future requirements, without pre-emptive overengineering.

[pastel aspen]

The best/most-successful MVPs I know about actually didn't write ANY CODE at that phase.
As I've mentioned before, Engine Yard started as a Google form where people could ask for VM configs, and only once they'd manually serviced enough of those to see patterns did they write anything.
(and that was the first commercially-successful Rails PaaS, maybe just PaaS at all, in the sense of turning a profit.)
(and it got us all hired by VMware later) (RIP Ezra Zygmuntowicz)

https://medium.com/@since1968/remembering-ezra-zygmuntowicz-b03b07fc9c80

Supremely strange that this doesn't mention his role in Cloud Foundry, or in starting the 3D printing craze. Or his insanely master-class glass-blowing setup and skills. (He had a boron-silicate glass-blowing rig in his garage)

On-topic because Ezra was the MVP god. He had "the eye" for what the initial customer hook was. The one that would make them pay you to finish the product.

[earnest mauve]

So interesting, I didn't even consider this side to the whole Junior/Mid/Senior levels, I guess it comes with experience as you grow and learn more within the field. Really cool

[pastel aspen]

The way I semi-jokingly put it on social the other day is "It's not about how hard you can program, it's about showing us where on the doll the computer hurt you."

[earnest mauve]

Yeah, It's interesting to me as in my current role I have a lot of freedom. as long as I can justify why I've developed something in a certain way, and the benefit to the users then it's fine. But the article you sent with the questions regarding team and disagreements have never really imapcted me. Will be interesting to face that

[pastel aspen]

I learned so much when I failed at my first project as Architect at Engine Yard.
Zero technical reasons involved.

I gave a presentation called "A Thing We Could Do", that I found recently, and it still seems totally technically right to me even N-zillion years later.. all of the failure reasons were social/political/empathy-failures-on-my-part/etc.
The empathy thing is huge, I've learned to do those pushups ever since.

[earnest mauve]

Out of curiosity, as someone who is senior, how much guidance would you give to a junior / mid level dev under you? You of course wouldn't spoon feed them the answer, but is it more about helping them think about different ways of solving a problem rather than coding it?

[pastel aspen]

The latter, but all the time, as much as they can tolerate.
I hand out crazy book lists that have no programming books on them etc.

Some people like to read, some people prefer to listen, so figuring out how my new colleague learns is actually the first step. Then I flood them in that format.

Never just talk at someone who prefers to read etc

(and therefore never hand a book to someone who would prefer to hear a story or be given a practice problem)

[earnest mauve]

That's true, I hate being lectured about something which I can go ahead and learn myself, I'd prefer a resource. I wouldn't have thought about that when teaching someone though, really interesting

[pastel aspen]

I try to not open my mouth until I understand how to frame the sentence in a way that's adjacent to what the listener understands or believes already.

Sometimes you just have to say "Watch out!" etc but otherwise...

[earnest mauve]

Yeah, I've learnt in my years of being here that sometimes you really have to word what you say in a way the listener will understand, especially when you're trying to educate them on something. Have had many encounters with different departments who don't understand why something was written in a certain way, and refuse to listen to why

[pastel aspen]

It's funny how often two sides of an argument turn out to actually want the same thing.

[solid parcel]

The main difference as you get more senior is the scope of ambiguity you're dealing with 🙂

[pastel aspen]

The busted-ass part of the career ladder, the part that needs the most fixing, to me, is the way that, say, IC5 wants you to be crushing your IC4 work but also doing some IC5 stuff.. when the incentives management are given will have them want you to "stay in your lane", forcing everybody to change companies to level up.

I am not sure how to fix that, but it's super toxic.

It's fun when you see a new-hire get quickly promoted to your same IC level, that you've been in for 10 years or whatever.

And you told them what to build to attain that.

As a wizard in a good fantasy series puts it: "I try to perceive the opportunities implicit in even awkward situations."

Also IMO there's a huge lesson here, I know people like this too: https://vxtwitter.com/max_gagliardi/status/1976067620576043060

Max Gagliardi (@max_gagliardi)

Met a surgeon who is pulling ~$800k per year and hates his job. Constantly on call, long hours

Spends his free time scrolling BizBuySell, day dreaming about buying an HVAC company or investing in section 8 homes

Which is crazy to me and I told him those are terrible ideas

He’s way better off investing his money passively and retiring early but he’s fixated on “starting a business”

Goes to show no matter how good someone’s life seems from the outside looking in, there are high earners with incredible careers that are still miserable

Some people are constantly searching for “the grass being greener” doing something else

There is a lesson in there somewhere

vxTwitter / fixvx · Oct 8, 2025, 11:30 PM

The best cybersec guy I know is basically unemployed.

[near ocean]

800k a year is retire at 35 type income, cant say im gonna sympathise with their plight of long hours

[earnest mauve]

Definitely seems like it. Even in this very brief conversation it's really interesting to see the difference in thought process, about non-programming related questions

[pastel aspen]

Right?
(but IMO that's not the lesson to take from this)

[solid parcel]

I honestly spend more time writing documentation and working out how to make things approachable for my team rather than coding nowadays, haha.

If you want to progress fast as a junior, focus on communicating effectively and thinking in terms of business value. I recommend looking up Amazon's rules for communication. Quantify, and avoid weasel words 🙂

[earnest mauve]

I can imagine haha. I've forced that into my workflow that when I implement a new feature , I document it in-case of a handover (or if I just forget how it all works lol).

Oh okay! I'll definitely have a look at that

Thanks for all the advice everyone , much appreciated

[peak halo]

!warn @digital marten your message was removed for asking for work, which is not allowed

[inner wren]

:ok_hand: applied warning to @digital marten.

[solid parcel]

@earnest mauve Whereabouts in the UK are you? I'm working in London 🙂

[scenic glade]

Any plans for a job hiring channel ?

[pastel aspen]

UK, particularly Manchester, has a crazy graphene tech scene, fun stuff to work on.

[scenic glade]

graphene like the os ?

[pastel aspen]

The material https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_tYMNxXPHyw
(1 year old video, it's fancier even than that now. Good video intro though.)
(Graphene CPUs are going to be 1000x better performance per watt than we have now.)

[regal axle]

explicitly no.

[pastel aspen]

Yeah please never.
Money ruins every OSS community.

Do we really want to incentivize recruiter bots joining, etc?

[regal axle]

There are many other issues with it. But yea, this server has taken a hard stance on no recurting of any type

!rule 6 9

[inner wren]

Rules

6. Do not post unapproved advertising.

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[regal axle]

And honestly "uapproved advertising" is just a catch all for things like advertising python events. So even that is basically "no ads at all"

[spice ocean]

I'm sorry if i'm in the wrong section but i've got a question.
Does Amxmodx (pawn) cs 1.6 language helps me if i do want to be a self-learned game developer?
I would want to join companies in my future, i want to help creating games.

[pastel aspen]

I personally have never heard of it before just now, but maybe someone in the #game-development channel can further direct you.

[solid parcel]

You may already be aware, but a heads up if not- game dev has a reputation as being a rough role. It's a sector where crunch has been normalised, and where orgs are often very willing to exploit their devs love for gaming as a medium in order to get away with pretty poor treatment. Often without even paying them well for the pleasure 🙃

[spice ocean]

I understand, but I will think more about it. It's not necessary for me to work for others, and the role will be fine because I have plenty of time to learn since I am a mechanical engineering student

[solid parcel]

By all means go for it! I could see creating games being far more fulfilling than designing endless CRUD apps, as many devs end up doing, haha.

[earnest mauve]

Am also in London, live and work 🙂

[solid parcel]

Working for any orgs I'd recognise?

[earnest mauve]

Unless you're aware of the steel industry, I doubt it 😅

[solid parcel]

Then probably not, haha

[earnest mauve]

Yourself?

[solid parcel]

Lloyds Bank, working as a senior cloud/infrastructure engineer

So lots of pipelines, IaC, Powershell/Python, Azure

[earnest mauve]

No way, that's really cool. I actually was looking at a Job psoting today at Lloyds haha. Was in Bristol though unfortunately

Also not sure if I am qualified enough just yet to be working there

[solid parcel]

Hey, I got in with 4 years experience and 1.5 of that was a level 3 apprenticeship 🙂 No degree, just a fair bit of work 😁

I wouldn't count yourself out. It's a good place to work, too. Not too stressful, good comp (doubled what I was on at my last role), and large enough to have lots of opportunities to shift into areas you want to be in.

[earnest mauve]

Really? Maybe my CV isn't written good enough to be getting recognised by these places, or my knowledge / experience isn't there yet. I would love to work at a place like that, feel that it would teach me so much and allow me to delve in to fields which I'd realyl enjoy

[solid parcel]

I had a recruiter reach out about the role on LinkedIn. I wouldn't have known about it otherwise. Having a profile set up on there can make a big difference 🙂 Albeit the market feels a little rough recently, I've certainly seen a cooling in the number of inbound messages I get from recruiters.

Being at an org like Lloyds also opens up opportunities to shift into something like hedge funds or HFT if you're wanting to chase money. Ex colleague of mine shifted to HRT last year. Only 26, and he's on £200,000 total comp now.

[earnest mauve]

I don't really get messages from recruiters. How do I increase this? Any tips? I seem to just be endlessly applying to job which never get back. Although not the worst as I currently am working, but feels impossible !

[polar raptor]

HI everyone

[solid parcel]

Take advantage of your LinkedIn headline. Make sure you have any certs you have in there, as they're something a lot of recruiters look for. Put time into filling out your about me section. Make sure you're hitting the keywords for the kind of role you're after. Make sure you have a decent looking pfp, and set a custom banner. Engage on LinkedIn a little, even if you're not posting. Active accounts get a boost in visibility, as do those with over 500 connections

[earnest mauve]

Certs are an interesting one. I should showcase those. Luckily I did build up my linkedin, currently at around 800 connections or something , but I am not active at all in regards to interacting with people

[solid parcel]

Yeah I don't value certs much, but they can help get your foot in the door. I prioritised getting a few when I was starting out, and it helped me jump into a sysadmin and then cloud engineer role pretty quickly. Good to improve visibility...

Imo an associate cloud cert or two has a pretty high RoI given the low cost.

[earnest mauve]

You have any recommendations on which ones have value to them?

[solid parcel]

What cloud platform do you work with?

[earnest mauve]

AWS and have used a little bit of Azure

[polar raptor]

I am a young student of 13

AND I WISH TO WRITE A BOOK ON PYTHON

IF ANY EXPERIENCED PERSON WILL HELP ME DO SO OR WILL GUIDE ME WITH SOME TRICKS AND TIPS I WOULD BE THANKFUL☺

IF ANYONE IS KIND PLEASENSEND ME FRIEND REQUEST .....

[solid parcel]

Will respond when I get a sec, will be squished on a train for an hour or so 😁

Rushhour is always fun in London

[earnest mauve]

Haha no problem. Feel free to dm me on here rather than in this channel

[regal axle]

!rule 9

[inner wren]

Rules

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[dusk rock]

send me dm

[regal axle]

no

[dusk rock]

why?

[regal axle]

In this server, I only engage in the public space. Why does anything need to be moved to a DM? What are you afraid of?

[dusk rock]

can we have a video call now?

[still condor]

!warn @dusk rock We do not allow looking for developers here. Please read our rules and the description of this channel.

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied warning to @dusk rock.

[vale gale]

Giys anyone wanna do a doscord bot

[long solar]

Need some advice guys

[vale gale]

Yup

[long solar]

I've been offered a data science and backend role at a startup in Boston area after I graduate in December, but for now I'm going to just do some part time remote work as I finish my classes, to see if I'm a good fit, and I'm going to be negotiating a good rate for my contract next week. Idk what to ask for, he said I could do per hour or per project, and he said I could get some equity as well. Currently I'm just working for $25 an hour which is obviously pretty low. What should I ask for, or should I ask for per project or per hour

[analog sun]

I would say hourly is easier to track

[vale gale]

Depending onnyour exp

[pastel aspen]

If you are psyched to work there though, equity would be a smart thing to take
(and shows dedication/intent etc)

[long solar]

I'm new grad

[vale gale]

Is good then wait till you get promoted

Guys anyone to make a discord bot?

[long solar]

Any idea on a reasonable dollar range?

Or Defiler or Usamah, if you guys know, lmk

[pastel aspen]

Honestly I would take as little as you can stand, depending on the opportunity here, and take the rest as equity.. I'm not sure what that number looks like circa 2025.

[long solar]

I kinda am excited to work there, they're doing a lot of gen ai stuff

[vale gale]

Thats really depending on country minimum vital salary and the company ofc

[solid parcel]

Not necessarily smart; on average, equity comp works out at a lower rate than equivalent purely salaried roles.

That isn't to say it's necessary wrong to opt for equity, but it's certainly a stat that bears being aware of. The success stories we see are largely examples of survivorship bias.

[long solar]

Well they're a startup that started in 2021, funded by a company that the CEO sold, and it's in Boston @vale gale

[vale gale]

Im in chemistry but inreally like computer science

[pastel aspen]

I kinda mean it here as a way to show engagement vs being a financial call

[vale gale]

The best you can do is hourly

For now

[long solar]

gpt is telling me $45 - $75 / hr lol (way better than my current $25)

[vale gale]

U still New u said

[long solar]

I haven't graduated yet but I have 2 internships under my belt

[vale gale]

You should ask.for 65 $

Per hour

[solid parcel]

This is far too black and white as advice. @long solar See if you can get them to give a figure first. When you're negotiating, the first figure both sides give serve as anchors. You won't be able to push up to higher than the first number you give, they won't be able to offer less than the first offer they give. The negotiation will happen in between. Whoever gives a number first is at a disadvantage.

If they give a range, Akh is right in as much as positioning your ask in roughly the upper quartile of that range being a good idea.

[vale gale]

Boston standards of living are very high i mean its expensive

[pastel aspen]

Find out what they are paying salaried engineers and convert that to hourly

[long solar]

Yeah I've heard that you should try to get them to give a number first. If I have to go first, I'd give a range, something like

"After doing market research, $45-$75 seems to be the typical pay for this type of role. Given my experience/skills, I believe that I'm on the higher end of that range"

[solid parcel]

Fantastic, I was going to recommend framing your ask in terms of market rates. Great call.

[analog sun]

$75 / hour works out to be a salary of $156,000 which to me seems way too high for a university student

[long solar]

Lol learned that from a ig reel

[analog sun]

But that's my two cents

[vale gale]

Btw you all guys got a degree ej something related about coding and computing science

[long solar]

@analog sun yeah good piont, I'm not from MIT lol I'm from UNH. I'll say $45-$65 instead

[analog sun]

Is it a full time 40 hour a week position?

$45 is still $93,000 a year

[vale gale]

???

[pastel aspen]

According to the first calculator hit on Google, I made $168k in my first job out of school, inflation adjusted (in Florida)

[vale gale]

How many hours a day?

[long solar]

For now it's contract part time (or any amount of hours as I want, but I have to fit in classes obviously) to see if I'm a good fit, but in December yeah it'd be full time

[analog sun]

8 hours a day, 40 hours a week, 240 days a year typically

[wraith harbor]

you can view salaries for your location on levels.fyi to get an idea

[long solar]

Ig that's still too much for a new grad lol. $40-$65 new range

[analog sun]

But I could also be completely out of touch to what a local grad makes for that position / experience / location

[solid parcel]

This is absurd, and well done 😁

[long solar]

$40 x 40 hours x 52 weeks = 83k

[open ivy]

Thanks for the feedback. I am currently working on physics simulations and hope to synergize this with my biology background, given the huge unmet needs in agriculture and medicine.

The choice of language, using Python for performance numerical code, is a bit nonstandard. I am banking on using Python for metaprogramming instead of C++ templates to compile down into high speed code.

So my route is nonstandard and explaining why I choose it is important.

[wraith harbor]

just remember to know your worth. if they gave you an offer they want to work with you, don't let them undersell you. bosses would pay everyone $0 if they could

[analog sun]

If it is contract part time the higher hourly rate can be justified

[long solar]

It would only be like that for like a month as they get to know me

[analog sun]

$75/hour but you only work 120 hours in a month for example

[vale gale]

DAMN guys so boring this server

[analog sun]

Yeah

We aren't here to shitpost and troll, it is an education focused server

[vale gale]

Whats the best thing to do in python im js like bores

[long solar]

I think per hour is better to start, then once I see what each project is like, I can consider if I would want to do per project

[long solar]

my brother you are in the career channel. go here https://discord.com/channels/267624335836053506/291284109232308226

[vale gale]

@analog sun

[analog sun]

Also this channel is #career-advice , with the description:

DO NOT ASK FOR JOBS. DO NOT OFFER JOBS. | Career advice and discussion of Python in professional settings.

[analog sun]

You will also get to see how many hours go into a project

Estimating how much time something will take can be very difficult to do

[vale gale]

Damn thats nicd

[long solar]

Also I got this opportunity through a connection of my old boss, every single cold application has just been rejected even with a dialed resume, so I'm not in the best position to be a chooser

[solid parcel]

Networks are worth their weight in gold, especially when the market is rough

[solid parcel]

Got into the industry via an apprenticeship, though now doing an MSc in Cybersecurity. Honestly, I wouldn't do it again. I'm mainly doing it to make it easier to work abroad, but it's frustrating putting so much time into something that is more tangentially related to my goals than absolutely aligned.

I'd much rather be spending my time getting deep into Go and K8s operators rather than doing literature reviews and writing papers on the cyber kill chain.

[open ivy]

I definitely get more traction talking to people about my projects than cold resumes. And I am not even that good at social skills

[long solar]

Yeah, how do you get the opportunity to talk to them about your project though 😂 cold email the ceo?

[near ocean]

Meet with and talk to them at events, conferences

[wraith harbor]

So for each job in your work experience you really only want like 4-5 bullet points, 1-2 sentences each? Is that right? And then swap them out based on the job you applied for?

[solid parcel]

This is pretty much my go-to, yup.

A good litmus test is reading each bullet point, and thinking 'so what?'. If it isn't clear how what you've done was valuable, it probably isn't a very strong bulletpoint (This is a rough rule, and not one I've followed very consistently on my CV. I certainly have a couple where I'm just stuffing in keywords, and a fair few of my bulletpoints connect to technical outcomes but fail to link to business impact).

[tight tree]

Project needed

[wraith harbor]

thanks! just redrafted my resume again. hopefully for the last time lol

[solid parcel]

It is never the last time, haha. I don't think I've ever felt my CV is strong, but it does always manage to be good enough to get to the next level without issue. It's all relative 😁

In my experience at least, fixing up my CV is usually something that happens in a scramble when an unexpected opportunity comes along

[open ivy]

Meet people you get along with and are in your field. They have jobs, or will likely get jobs if unemployed.

[peak halo]

One of my friends is looking for work (in Canada, not in a CS or adjacent field), and he says that every company wants applicants to interview with a chatbot instead of a human.

[wraith harbor]

On Wellfound you can do an AI interview and submit it with your application (and they serve those apps first to companies over those who opt out)

[pastel aspen]

I've heard this too; the front door is effectively closed to humanity right now.

[wraith harbor]

Sounds like a complete waste of time and resources

[pastel aspen]

I've never used the front door anyway, so to me it's almost a feature.

[mint rampart]

👋 Hey everyone!
🐍 Is there anyone here working with Python or Django? I’m looking for some guidance and advice.
💻 I’m a beginner Python backend developer and want to learn how to get my first freelancing clients and grow as a developer.
🤝 If anyone here has experience in Python, Django, or freelancing, I’d really appreciate your insights and tips! 🙌

[peak halo]

Hello and welcome. For your awareness, people typically perceive messages that use emojis like that as fake or overly LinkedIn. You can talk like a normal person here.

That aside, I'm concerned that you won't be able to get any freelancing gigs. The market for beginner freelancers is saturated

[mint rampart]

Oh sorry

[peak halo]

For everyone's context, why are you asking about freelancing and not getting a job normally?

[mint rampart]

Because I already have a full time job just wanna switch Field and gain more experiences

[peak halo]

What is your full time job and what training did you get for that job?

[mint rampart]

Mhm I'm working as a data labeler

To use tools and communicate with clients

[open ivy]

Given how tedious job applications are isn't it a perfect use-case for AI? No one seems to have a good answer why this would not be the case.

I am skeptical that AI will replace us all anytime soon. But for a mundane boring relative task that no one likes to do? Hand and glove fit.

[peak halo]

!warn @stiff cloak your message was removed for solicitation

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied warning to @stiff cloak.

[stiff cloak]

If you're jobless or homeless message me directly for help no charges no fee
Just said I'm jobless or homeless.!! Send me friends request and message me privately

[peak halo]

!ban @stiff cloak I just told you to stop doing that.

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @stiff cloak permanently.

[long solar]

Now it's only a matter of time before we get an ai extenion that does the ai interview for you. So it's just ai talking to ai

[wraith harbor]

job apps often have a section like 'why do you want to work here'. if you do 5 targeted apps with real human messages in those areas you will get a lot more mileage than 1000 AI postings

[open ivy]

So all the people doing 1000+ apps are doing it wrong? Makes sense. An easy trap to fall into.

I wonder if I could use AI to scrape and summarize the company culture etc from information available about said company (think companies that are not that huge). Then carefully write my own cover letter and taylor resume. AI is good at summarization.

[wraith harbor]

i can only speak from personal experience but ive noticed now companies have started to ask for stuff like "a few short human written sentences" rather than full on cover letters. The market has really changed a lot from when I was last applying

[open ivy]

The lack of feedback is really the problem here. Like what do they even want?

If not done carefully, culture match tends to exclude people who are not following the zeitgeist. But those people are those who have the most AI resistant ideas because LLMs are basically a copy machine for mainstream trends.

I will be starting low level laser applications soon, once website is set up.

[peak halo]

!warn @glass trout asking for jobs is not allowed; the messages where you have done this have been removed.

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied warning to @glass trout.

[wraith harbor]

someone else would know more but i just go off of whats in the post. also all your projects sound very interesting

[open ivy]

Yes I really need to launch that website because it will help collect my ideas and it is something to show people like if you wanted to check it once every two weeks for updates etc.

[smoky quest]

<@&831776746206265384> troll or shitpost

[ebon eagle]

Anyone know any good cv template websites or smth, tryna remake mine

[wraith harbor]

pick a generic 1 column template whatever you like. I use Jake's Template personally but there are a million that are equally good

[ebon eagle]

calm, tysm man

[ebon eagle]

what is jakes template

[wraith harbor]

https://jakesresume.github.io/

[ebon eagle]

tysm bro

[tight tree]

Hello! I’d like to find a new job as python developer!

[vapid jay]

is it okay to add in-development (ideation/prototype stage) projects to my resume?

[tardy helm]

!ris

!Ris

[near ocean]

Yes of course (as long as you can talk about it)

[vapid jay]

i can talk about it but i cannot show them any code

[regal axle]

Very very rare for anyone to actually ask to look at code.

Perfect example "sorry it is private repo. Made it for a client or something idk"

[vapid jay]

i cant show code because i dont have any

[regal axle]

I mean. I would have at least a prototype before I would put it on a resume.

Well I guess,,, depends on the role¿
If you are looking for a none coding role and more an architecture role ,,, no code might be fine too

[vapid jay]

looking for coding roles

[solid parcel]

I don't really understand why you're talking about a conceptual project without any code, when you already have a GitHub repo with 400+ stars, that you've been actively working on for a couple of years?

[vapid jay]

this project is even more ambitious than that shitty project

[solar flint]

is nixite like nix?

[pastel aspen]

Try asking in #unix

[noble rose]

good start saving time on both ends that's an attempt than staying still and not actively solving something ig

[solid parcel]

If I never have to write another cover letter in my life, it will still be too soon.

[noble rose]

for me both resume and cover letter better sound like stories or im not interested. Sure gpt minor word choice tweaks but its me end of the day

[unique oriole]

So I work as django drf dev/ manage some basic devops stuff too.
But I don't know how to transition to better job(more pay, oppertunity to grow)
I love to learn new stuff and dont wanna end up just a web dev(kind of feel like missing out on alot)
What should I focus on.

yoo sorry for tag after soo long lel,
I got the degree and got job too but now the issue is people with 2-3 yoe seem to only do/know very basic stuff!
and I feel like I could do more now or i'll just get satisfied and stay mid 🙁

[solid parcel]

Build out one of the following. That'll introduce you to some basic DevOps concepts and give you a good base to expand from. Then just follow the fun and go deeper into whatever areas you're finding most interesting.

https://learntocloud.guide

https://cloudresumechallenge.dev/docs/the-challenge/

[unique oriole]

transition to devops?
or are there devs how do backend and just can handle the devops part too?
for now I don't think I've seen any problem where I think we would require a complete senior devops engineer...

[solid parcel]

DevOps is a massively broad term. It's used to mean everything from 'cloud engineer who solely manages infrastructure and pipelines', through to 'Developer who understands what GitHub Actions is'. Whatever career path you end up choosing to follow, having an understanding of at least the basics is very useful.

[unique oriole]

Your resume needs to be written in HTML. Not a Word doc, not a PDF. Here is an example of what I mean.
fr? does this matter

[unique oriole]

these look nice will go through them. Thanks

[near ocean]

It means skip this job ad and go next, these people are insane

[solid parcel]

It's the cloud resume challenge - it's not a recommendation of how to actually approach applying 😂

[solid parcel]

It doesn't really matter what you're deploying, don't pay that bit too much attention. I prefer LearnToCloud, tbh. Put together by a Senior Microsoft Engineer, and their idea of the ideal order to learn things in to build a foundation matches fairly closely to my own.

Whatever you do by no means submit your CV as HTML when you're actually applying for a job 😂

[scenic glade]

google are skids

[smoky quest]

Do you have a question related to #career-advice ?

[dawn lagoon]

Hello, Just curious about Internship and I wanted to know whether anyone has intern at Door Dash, Raisen Canes, Tesla. I want to get information about Work, Location, Something good or bad.

[long solar]

I talked to my school's career center and they lowered my pay expectation to a range of like $40-$50 lol

[dawn lagoon]

do you work their?

[unique oriole]

per hour?

[long solar]

yesterday in this channel we were all talking like $45-$75 😂

[long solar]

#career-advice message @dawn lagoon

[dawn lagoon]

Interesting

[dawn lagoon]

anyways I would recommend working by hour then per project because you can do overtime with per hour then per project which would suck

[unique oriole]

would go for per project tbh

not sure what type of person he is,
but y would u want to get into discussion of how many hours it'll take to complete a job.

[long solar]

What if I underestimate # of hours per project

[unique oriole]

If u are new that is genuine concern

[pastel aspen]

Assume this is going to happen a lot basically.

[unique oriole]

but u can always do some research also doing 1 2 projects should give u an idea of how many hours it'll take

[dawn lagoon]

what I think he should do by hour just incase

[unique oriole]

I mean it depends on him ofc,
but if u have a choice never sell your hours!

[dawn lagoon]

Just imagine they payed a project let say for example $1200 to complete it then in a week or two week.

[smoky quest]

where are you located?

[unique oriole]

or they paid 2-3k for something u can do in a weekend

[dawn lagoon]

boston that what he wrote

[solid parcel]

Not just if new, lol. Estimation is notoriously hard in tech

[long solar]

It’s a remote job, I’m in NH, 40 min drive to Boston, he said I can work as many hours as I want under this temporary contract as I finish college

[solid parcel]

This is a rough guide at best

[unique oriole]

If u charge by an hour,
If u don't know what u are doing (beginner) u can charge for more hours!
But if u are really good and have already done something similar u can do the job faster? should u be paid less in this case?

[smoky quest]

thanks

[unique oriole]

estimation is always hard.
But if u've done something similar u will have an idea, and in project based u basically have projects in similar niche (I could be wrong here)

[dawn lagoon]

more information he get $25 hour and he is wondering wether he could ask for raise in hourly salary or get payed per project

[long solar]

But yeah my career center said the average for cs major new grads for my uni is about 85k salary (about $40/hr)

[dawn lagoon]

anyways does anyone work at Raisen Cane's?

[solid parcel]

It's depressing that this is above the median salary in the field for the UK 🙃

[smoky quest]

100k (~50$/h) in a non-tier1 city is fine for someone who hasn't even graduated yet.
Note also your salary as a part time student will not be linked to your salary as a FTE.

So at your stage, I would prioritize the learning, experience and connection over trying to extract every single $. Especially now in the current market

[unique oriole]

"everywhere else" lel

[solid parcel]

Valid

[dawn lagoon]

alright, does anyone work at doordash and if so can anyone tell me information about the pay and other

[long solar]

I must have done a bad job explaining this part. I have a completely different data science job where I’m paid $25 / hr

[solid parcel]

Your best bet is Glassdoor, levels.fyi and blind

[dawn lagoon]

Sorry about that What I am trying to say is I am looking for someone who has already done an internship at doordash! I am trying to get interview queston and other information

[dawn lagoon]

you did a great job explaining that you work as a Data Scientist in Boston getting payed $25 per hour and you wanted to know whether your getting payed hourly or per project.

[pastel aspen]

wrong channel

[old crane]

so where to send this?

[pastel aspen]

#python-discussion or one of the off-topic channels.

[old crane]

okay tysm

[rain pulsar]

Would this be the appropriate channel to inquire about finding a mentor or no?

[peak halo]

We don't have a space for that because it would be exceptionally unlikely for anyone to commit to an ongoing relationship like that. If someone wants to, that's fine, but the chances are next to none.

That being the case, there are tons of people who would be excited to help with specific questions as you have them throughout your self-guided learning journey. See #❓｜how-to-get-help

[unreal shale]

is anyone willing to do a quick review of my resume? would take like 5 min (just send me a msg if u are)

[hushed jetty]

Hi I need help

[wraith harbor]

post it here with private information removed and people can give feedback

[stone wadi]

@karmic loom could you teach me python

actualy i was know later but i forgot could you teach me

[vocal mason]

"Through out Fortnite and battlepass, I alone am the skidded one 🗣️ "

[left blade]

It's time

[vapid jay]

Hi, can anyone help me? I don't wanna sell anything don't worry. I just want to ask 1 question to see how much to price an app im making. If you're down please dm me.

[peak halo]

It's easier for everyone if you just ask your question

[vapid jay]

Yeah but like i don't really wanna tell everyone what I'm working on

And also i don't wanna shove the question into peoples faces whobdont wanna answer. People who do wanna answer are free to dm me

[peak halo]

Going forward, please always ask your actual question. It's actually more rude to make people do extra steps to find out what your question is than it is to "shove it in their face" (which isn't how anyone perceives it).

[vapid jay]

My bad it's fine nvm, sorr6

[wet field]

Hi everyone 👋 I’m 27 and currently learning Python. I don’t have a formal degree but I really want to build the skills needed to land a good paying job in tech. I’m not sure what direction I should focus on, whether web development, data, automation or something else. I also wonder how important certifications are compared to projects, and how people without a degree can make their portfolio stand out. If anyone here started later or came into tech without traditional education, I’d really appreciate hearing your advice. Thanks a lot for any guidance 🙏

[regal axle]

Why are you trying to get into tech?

[brave python]

wat % mean

[wet field]

Why not?

[regal axle]

Your motivations can help me steer my answers.
-# "because money" is the worst answer you can give btw. Although it helps me if that is your motivation. So please let me know

[wet field]

I genuinely see tech as one of the best fields right now. want to build a stable career where growth opportunities are high. Python seems like good starting point for me.

[final wing]

everyones jobless bro

[regal axle]

In that case, you will want to find the section of tech that you enjoy. For many reasons I say that. But for one, I can't predict the future and tell you what section is going to be valuable more or less, in the next X years.

Is it possible for you to go back to school and get a degree? I know it is a big ask. But a degree is the most simple path.
If not possible / logical;
You can stand out by doing. If you create something with real passion, it tends to stand out. You don't have to solve real world problems either. They can be "I made this because I thought it would be cool".

And the most important thing you can be doing, is build a network of people. You need to connect with people. That is the only way you will get a job. Not through some automated HR system. If you want to do contract work, that might mean you find clients through everyday people / business.

This path is a multi year journy btw. Don't expect results in months. At least not for "good paying job"

[regal axle]

This (partially) is true in the today. But they are talking about a career. Careers live way longer than a global recession.

[brave python]

are you an ai

[regal axle]

As a large language model, I can not assist you with that

[final wing]

that kind of question feels very eye opening

like, i might be asking that question on discord for example

[final wing]

what's exactly telling you that the global recession we're currently going through is going to end ? (idek if it's out of topic or anything, if it is i hope that you'll be okay with having this conversation in another chat)

[regal axle]

This is the right place to ask that

[final wing]

afaik the main reason behind it is ai and whatnot, and considering the fact that it's only developing as time goes on

[regal axle]

AI is not the reason for the recession. It is making things more complicated. But it is not the cause.
It is complicated why the economy is in the state it is. And I can't perfectly explain it in a short discord message.

I will say this much (for now): all recessions will end at some point. The economy will grow again. It might grow in different sectors compared to how it did before. But at a macro level, it will return and people will hire again. Work is always needed. And you have not delbt with any large companies if you really think that AI can just replace all workers. You have also not delbt with super tiny shops too. I know some clients still running PHP 5. (I think there is one running an older version but not 100% sure what version)

Point being; some people will use the new tech. But it will take a really really long time for it to be adapted by everyone. And some places will never incorporate it.
Cobolt anyone? Ok bad example because while it exists, it is really rare to actually find and on the scale that impacts you and me, it is a gone language that no one uses. But it took a long time to get there. Way longer than its actual lifetime. (Better tech / options came out way before cobolt was dropped)

Actually, cobalt is a great example!
Please go read literature on people talking about and complaining about cobalt. The discourse is honstly very similar.

History doesn't repeat itself, but it sure does rhyme

[solid parcel]

This is a lot of words to say that economies are cyclical and people have been shouting about the sky falling in tech for decades now xD

[regal axle]

real

[final wing]

thank you, i'd like to learn more on the topic as someone who will be concerned with this in the next few years (since i'm in college right now)

[fathom lake]

hi guys what u doing

[brave python]

guys python sooo kool

[fathom lake]

i dont know

i think Ruby is taking his places soon

[near ocean]

This is the careers discussion channel, for general chitchat there are three (3) off topic channels

[swift hemlock]

hello

[weary ember]

Hello benoit

Comment Ça va!

[valid stream]

@runtime

[visual flax]

Yo guys if you wanted to be at the forefront of engineering what company would you try to join?

[near ocean]

Nowadays, probably one of these AI companies like anthropic or openai or whatever, not my cup of tea even if i could get in tho tbh

[regal axle]

... am I self sabotaging myself by not applying to AI companies, despite me needing a job? I fundamentally disagree with most of these companies // products. Do I value my values or my money more? I want to say I have strong internal values that I don't bend for. But like ,,, the jobs available are small. And most are AI companies.

[visual flax]

go for it anyway man

[near ocean]

Can you pay rent in values?

[regal axle]

For a good amount of months ... but not forever 🫠

[solid parcel]

Not in the slightest. Most of them are burning cash and are likely to fail, even if the technology itself truly is transformative.

Plus the frontrunners (OpenAI, Anthropic and their ilk) are after truly world class engineers and are pushing their employees hard in the race for market share and SOTA models. Even if you do have the skills for them to consider you, it's seriously worth considering if you'd be comfortable with the number of hours they'd be expecting.

An engineer I know had an interview at xAI recently. Sounded like they were expecting 70-80 hour work weeks.... While Musk outfits have a rep for driving their employees particularly hard, given the comp wasn't really any better than the other big AI firms are offering I suspect they may be after similar levels of dedication.

I also hear you on the morals front. Palantir is one of the best paying orgs in London, but they're not a company I'd be prepared to work for, for example!

[near ocean]

Palantir in london you say... 🤔

[solid parcel]

Yup. Their forward deployed engineers make about as much as an L4 at Google.

[pastel aspen]

My last company’s founder was one of the Palantir folks, fun times.

[solid parcel]

Thiel is absolutely nuts, his latest thing is pseudo-intellectual raving about the antichrist.

[pastel aspen]

Yeah, in my case it was Joe Lonsdale.
His newest thing is called “Thorin”

[visual flax]

best place to work for an electrical engineer low cost of living high income

[pastel aspen]

How high do you need the income to be? (Ballpark)

But I already have a proposal: Arvada, Colorado, USA
https://www.elevatequantum.org

Not crazy expensive to live there yet, but this is the frontier.
https://www.qpics.com

Lovely countryside, cutting-edge quantum and classical electrical engineering projects, lots of funding.

[peak halo]

You have to say in what country or countries. But generally speaking, the reason that certain places are expensive is often that it's desirable to live there. If you try to minimize cost of living at any other cost, you might get what you paid for.

[visual flax]

USA

[pastel aspen]

Also, "regional compensation" is the norm now, and it's very challenging to get paid more than your peers in the same area. I've broken free from it twice in my recent career, but only with luck and serious negotiation.

In one case I just walked away from the offer and let them call me a couple weeks later, which is challenging to endure.

[visual flax]

yea I was learning the same thing in my research. I was hoping you guys could tell me the opposite

[pastel aspen]

I wish I could, but my last job ended up getting prickly about it.

[smoky quest]

Unless you bring something to the table that makes you incomparable, there is no reason for a company to pay you more than what they could get with someone with your skill in your market.

The topic of compensation gets complicated quite quickly as it may also involve fairness and equality/equity

[visual flax]

I figured as much, gotta rack up that experience then don't I?

[smoky quest]

it's gonna be far more than experience

<@&831776746206265384> scam

[pastel aspen]

You don't need a lot of experience, what you need is experience, any, doing things nobody else has done.
..and that's getting harder and easier every year, for different reasons, it seems to me.

[visual flax]

heck yea it is. Trying to do a impressive coding project for me feels impossible. I want to do something cool in c++ and maybe ros but it feels impossible somedays

[pastel aspen]

If you want a wildcard idea, learn-to-use/play-with the OS called QNX.

[visual flax]

I'm an EE but I'll look into

[pastel aspen]

EE is exactly the sort of use-case for a hardcore real-time OS like that IMO
SWE never really needs QNX on their own.

[visual flax]

So what type of project would I do with it? I'm assuming most people haven't gotten projects done on it yet?

[pastel aspen]

Exposing yourself to hard-real-time challenges will make you stand out
Just make anything work hard-real-time and that's plenty

It's a hardcore regime
It's a thing, but it's more of a "did you have time" thing, not a "have you tried to break through your limits" thing IMO
(re: Unreal below)

[visual flax]

so a game in unreal engine isn't really something?

[pastel aspen]

I'd be more interested to see a real-time Hello World server than an Unreal demo personally, but that might just be me

[visual flax]

I'm super stressed because I don't feel like I have the ability to do any cool project. I feel totally inadequate. You're right about game development. Because Game dev is really about spending time not really engineering

[pastel aspen]

Also if you want to look into probabilistic computing e.g. "p-bits", IMO that's the future.
Build a tiny FPAA-based p-bit system and you win
check out the "GreenPAK" line of analog programmable stuff, it's like $1.25 per unit, and it can do cool stuff
(needs a 1-time $100-ish dev/programmer board)

[visual flax]

I was mentally handicapped for a period and honestly I could still do game development. I'm thinking about designing a robot from scratch then programming it through ros. But its so hard for me to think of something super challenging and at the same time doable withing a reasonable timespan. There's so much research and knowledge that I simply don't have ):

[smoky quest]

nothing hard work can't beat.
Start super small in scope and build over time. And start with something you are interested in as it helps with motivation.
Having small steps you can build on top of is also super helpful for motivation

[visual flax]

I guess I'll start with this nearly 210 robot I've bought. Try and program it. Get it working and maybe one day not be a loser!

[smoky quest]

nice! One step at a time!

[bleak robin]

can anyone help me to make a good resume

[shell ferry]

hey

[lethal pelican]

hi gyz

hwisit going

[wide crest]

Hey guys i am New here nice to meet you'

I am also new in coding and i opte python as my first language to learn in coding i hope i will be able to learn that language from all fo you guys

[mint rampart]

Hi can someone be my mentor just want a connection

[split oyster]

why code not work ? helloworld(print)

[pastel aspen]

Wrong channel; please try #python-discussion and 'quote' the code/error so people can understand more context. There's not enough in what you just wrote to help you, even in the right channel.

three "backticks": ` both before and after your code will 'quote' it.

[scenic glade]

I am genuinely, genuinely tired

I have over 10 years of experience in programming and cybersecurity, 10 years of REAL experience. and I cannot find a job. Yes, Ive got no degree and yes I live in a poophole.
but that dont invalidate my skills
I am tired. I can't find a job

[regal axle]

It is hard for all of us right now 🫂
I hope we can all find something soon and that life picks back up! I know it will eventually. I just hope that it doesn't take too long

[pastel aspen]

Which do you want to do more, the programming or the cybersec? Do you feel like you might thrive in FinTech? There are a lot of openings there.

[solid parcel]

Yeah, it's rough. I'm still seeing roles out there particularly at the mid/senior level. I'm in London, and even around big hubs like here things feel pretty quiet.

[pastel aspen]

Am I allowed to link to a job opening here if it's not for a company I currently work for, but have before?

[solid parcel]

I'm seeing a fair few retail banking roles out there, too. Many are still in the middle of transforming to a more modern way of doing things. Cloud adoption in banking shot up the past few years for example, but they're still needing talent to build and run all the supporting stuff that makes it actually work effectively. DevOps, SRE, finops and so on. I'm seeing demand for those kinds of roles, along with a push to reskill or make redundant staff members who are still in the ClickOps way of doing things, as well as increasingly outsourcing support work (including building out internal teams in regions like India, rather than just working with a third party).

[near ocean]

This is the careers channel, memes or whatever this is dont belong here

[lethal pelican]

hello

anyone here?

who does remote jobs..?

[pastel aspen]

Mostly how I've done it recently, switched from on-site to remote-mainly in... 2019?

[lethal pelican]

wow great!

[pastel aspen]

IMO even as someone who has done it a lot since long long ago, it's way harder than on-site for a bunch of reasons that maybe aren't the obvious ones.
The big one is that it is A LOT HARDER to convince people your ideas are good without "body language" cues in person.

Remote, you tend to need to actually go build the prototype before bringing it up.

[lethal pelican]

yeah really

[vapid jay]

For a software engineer, do you have to write psudo-code or make flowcharts for each of the features created?

[solid parcel]

I've been hybrid or remote for all of my career. Been surprised to find I prefer hybrid. Some conversations are just much easier in person, and it's far easier to get context when you can just ask someone a question directly rather than having to ping them a Teams message or have a 'quick chat' that turns into half an hour

[pastel aspen]

Yeah, hybrid is my favorite now too; occasionally in person to argue through architecture problems, then you all go home to silence and get it done.

[solid parcel]

Imo 1.5 - 2 days a week in the office is pretty ideal

Complicated slightly because most of my team are in different offices to the London one

[rough dirge]

I can be incase I'mable to teach you smth, but am pretty sure you know more.

[rough dirge]

Yeah people need to stop overflowing this field like actually stop.

[solid parcel]

Not really a matter of overflow. It's primarily just the market readjusting after massive hiring, with some additional bits (e.g. a far less certain macro-economic environment) thrown into the mix, too.

[rough dirge]

Oh ig, well from my perspective it always seemed like an overflow since even those who did medical in high school were in CS sitting with us.

[wraith harbor]

if you want it reviewed, you can post an anonymized version in this channel

[misty otter]

Guys I need help with how it make ticket in my group

[visual flax]

Is it worth doing an excel project for a resume?

[solid parcel]

What do you mean by 'an excel project?' What would you actually be trying to demonstrate, and why?

Just sticking a basic spreadsheet together isn't going to do you any good, for example.

[visual flax]

my skills in excel?

[near ocean]

What kind of skills and why excel

[visual flax]

because a lot of jobs require skills there?

[near ocean]

2 people asked you about the excel project because an excel project is weird and uncommon and unless youre showing a specific skill, its pointless, can you go in more detail on the kind of project you wanna do or are you gonna keep responding with sass

[pastel aspen]

A lot of jobs require Excel but IMO it would be rare for a programming job to do so.

[still condor]

Maybe someone in HR saw that one of their programs interacts with excel, so they decided to list it as a "requirement"

[pastel aspen]

SQLite is a more interesting developer data manipulation skill to have IMO circa 2025.

An Excel workbook is just a bad .sqlite file, and a workbook tab is just a bad SQLite table with good analysis functions etc, in my opinion.

[still condor]

I saw this some time ago https://www.getgrist.com/

it's a spreadsheet program built on top of sqlite

[solid parcel]

A) as @near ocean says, there's not really a point. You wouldn't generally expect to see an 'Excel project' any more than you would a Word project or an Outlook project.

PS: Pretty sure your bio is wrong and that you're meaning to say you fight for marginalised groups rather than unmarginalised ones, lol.

[wraith harbor]

is it really necessary to put 'git' in job requirements? surely if you dont know git theres no way you know all the other stuff

[solid parcel]

Not something I'd bother mentioning in a bullet point, likely worth having in a skills section though. Solely because a lot of recruiters rely on keyword matching for an initial sift.

[still condor]

It's possible that you've only worked with CVS or SVN or Mercirual

(like, maybe you spent the last 15-20 years working at a bank that uses SVN)

[pastel aspen]

I've replaced it with just a generic "version control systems" thing, because now I've used so many
ClearCase, cvs, p4, svn, svk, git, darcs, hg, bzr

(Perforce is actually very good IMO)

(They should have open-sourced it rather than letting the Linux kernel not use it IMO.)

[solid parcel]

Damn, just had a look out of curiosity, and I hadn't realised Git's popularity was relatively recent. Looks like it only properly took off around the same time as DevOps, Agile (yes it had been around a fair bit before, but not particularly widely used) and the more modern approach to software development through the early to mid 2010s.

[still condor]

git was created in 2005

[solid parcel]

Yeah, I'm talking about market share

[wraith harbor]

github did help git get popular i think

[solid parcel]

I'd have some reservations about this, simply because I wouldn't necessarily trust a recruiter to know that version control = Git, if they're expecting to see the latter.

[pastel aspen]

Yeah I'd be concerned re: a junior role, and be sure to have Git as a "skill" on my LinkedIn etc.
In my case I'm constantly skirting the edge of overflowing a second page.

[mint rampart]

Thank you sm

[vapid jay]

YO

[pastel aspen]

!rule jobs

[inner wren]

Rules

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[vapid jay]

oh my fault

[vapid jay]

is there any server or channel i can tho ?

[pastel aspen]

Server yes (check out the Discord "Explore" directory), but no channels here.

[vapid jay]

can you send me any would be nice (:

[pastel aspen]

Sorry, I'm not on any myself, but they exist.

[vapid jay]

oh alright thanks and mbd i didnt know about that rule btw

[split oyster]

meta tryna take me in im 13 btw

[pine sleet]

<@&831776746206265384> ?

[smoky quest]

<@&831776746206265384> needs referal to health provider

[nocturne harbor]

!warn 797702876990406666 That is not something appropriate to talk about on this server.

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied warning to @noble dawn.

[digital marten]

❤️Hi, everyone. Glad to see you here. ❤️
I'm a senior C#/.NET, python developer with over 9 years of expereince.
I'd like to discuss and help each other through this group.
If you need any help, please let me know anytime.
Thanks.

[analog sun]

@neon gulch you are expected to follow the server rules, including rules 5 and 7

[neon gulch]

Yeah sorry !!

[lean jewel]

guys where should I go if I wanna get some small commissions? I can do discord bot and various stuff

[open ivy]

For networking, I mentioned before that it is very rare I ghost people because who knows even someone you don't get along with may have a lead for a job with someone else they met?

But others mentioned that they have to filter out excessive social contacts. Which seems strange to me because even after reaching out over the years in a variety of online and in-person venues I still have not that many few people reaching out to me. My RSVP to them takes minutes a week.

It turns out that I actually am using a filter! Anti toxic negativity.

For example, I am optimistic that:

1. In the unlikley event that I actually end up homeless one day, I can still maintain my personal projects to an extent. This optimism actually reduces my odds of being homeless btw.
2. No job will eat me alive so much that months will go by w/o being able to do my personal projects.
3. I think in the US democracy will survive.
4. I think my personal projects will eventually gain traction.
5. That networking will eventually work for me.
6. That there are ways to fight against the Algorythim and other brainwashing on a local scale we all can do.
   These all keep my going.

My social filter is being insistentin this optimism, putting my foot down when they debate it. Most people end up rejecting me after that point.

But the ones who stay are better at actually being willing to improve and change. Higher quality people.

[polar portal]

career discussion

[open ivy]

Hash-tag networking...

Getting a job is a highly social task like-it-or-not.

[pine sleet]

plenty of people get it just by applying. that’s how most of the people i know got theirs

[near ocean]

I dont get the point of these posts my guy, they seem really linkedin coded

[flat drift]

Was looking into several blue team roles,
Incident Responder was quite a big one I liked the look of, I feel it's quite my style.

Does anybody have any recommendations on this direct role and how to get to it - I was thinking apprenticeship of some-sort (not into the role itself) but build off of it. However I am happy to take suggestions and ideas.

[peak halo]

when was this? from what I understand, relatively fewer people are getting hired through front-door applying than before. but I work in an industry that's been in complete meltdown for about a year, so I don't know from experience.

[pine sleet]

IDK what it was like before. im just speaking anecdotally about now

[near ocean]

I dont think in the last 10 years there was a moment when networking was more successful at getting a new grad a job than playing the mass applying game

[peak halo]

but now we have AI slop resumes

[near ocean]

That makes it harder to get a job period. I dont think it makes networking any better at that point in a career

[pine sleet]

was or wasn't?

[peak halo]

he's saying that for new grads, networking isn't very helpful.

[pine sleet]

i asked because people usually say that networking is very useful for newgrads and interns

[pastel aspen]

I disagree 1000%

[near ocean]

Yea networking is useful but im not quite convinced the network a student can generate is enough to get them a job as easily as a 3-4y+ exp dev's network

[pastel aspen]

I haven't seen a "shotgun resume broadcast" work at a company I was at for years.

"What do you think we do? How would you do it?" is an early question I would ask etc.

[near ocean]

The experienced people here arent exactly representative of the average new grad

[pastel aspen]

I have actually never clicked "Apply" on a job in my life, I now realize.

[pastel aspen]

I'm talking about hiring new-grads, not myself.
Interns get hired WAY more etc. (And internship-getting is networking)

[near ocean]

calibayzone is a recently graduated phd
Networking hasnt been working out for them
Its time to consider mass applying

[pastel aspen]

As I mentioned in my forward to off-topic that tagged them, I think they are using too many words.
Not that the fundamental idea is wrong.

[near ocean]

No the idea isnt wrong and i would dare even say that they didnt do it well or often enough
But now that theyre out if the degree and they dont have sponsorship for events/conferences/meetups maybe its time to roll it back and treat job hunting like a new bachelor grad

[pastel aspen]

Now THAT, is a point I immediately agree with. The networking opportunities just changed drastically, and not for the better. Yes. If they can't afford to self-fund some open source conference attendance etc then it's time to build a system for custom-refining cover letters/resume variants per-company.

[near ocean]

I get to go to the occasional physics conference because my gf is an events organiser for them and i see first hand how these people wont shut up about their work even when theyre supposed to be casually socializing

[pastel aspen]

Papers We Love is a cool thing that shows up at conferences, I'd go to any that had that.

[proud glacier]

<@&831776746206265384>

[analog sun]

!ban 1360858205881892934 We do not condone this behaviour here

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @dense stag permanently.

[solid parcel]

Massive disagree. @peak halo is right. AI CV spam means there's a huge amount more noise to cut through if you're cold applying. That makes networking proportionally much more impactful than previously, as it gives you a way to cut through the noise.

Comparing the effectiveness of a new grad's network to that of a dev with 3-4 years experience is also a complete strawman.

[peak halo]

Strawman, or apples/oranges?

[remote jay]

Hello guys, i just started learning python... I saw some videos, which said that i shouldnt watch many tutorials, but i should start making projects... Do somebody have some idea with which project should i start? To learn me the point of python and where i use the basic stuff as well some new ? Sorry if my english is not that great, im just 15yo and dont have that good english..

[near ocean]

Its not a strawman and i dont think its apples and oranges, the strength of a network grows with experience
A new grad's network are his peers and possibly his internship's workplace, compared to 3 or 4 years worth of being a professional and connecting with a lot more people with a lot more power to help you get a job

[solid parcel]

Both - people had been discussing the effectiveness of networking for new grads, relative to cold applying. The relative effectiveness for an established dev is irrelevant.

[solid parcel]

No-one is trying to say a new grad's network is more powerful than that of an established dev, though. They're saying that the relative value of networking has increased substantially, compared to cold applying.

[near ocean]

More than cold applying? I dont think so

Calibayzone, the person asking above, is treating networking as if theyre an established dev, thats why i mentioned the 3-4year exp network
Theyre not cold applying as much as they should be

[solid parcel]

A) Yeah the stats out suggest networking of some description are responsible for a massive number of people finding jobs (figures in the 70-90% range)

B) Even if we disregard the above point (which may be a valid choice, given there isn't that much data out there on the topic) the relative value of networking increasing compared to previously does not necessitate it being more effective than cold applying.

C) I entirely agree with you that networking should be a supplement to applying rather than a replacement to it. The two are complimentary approaches.

[balmy mural]

One of the people who graduated with me got their jobs via networking... that network was their brother who already worked at a company. The rest of us got jobs by clicking apply on a website.
For fresh grads, I'd say more than 95% of our hires each year is via the standard job application process. Maybe 5% is via networking. For devs with more experience I don't quite know our numbers, but in my team specifically, we've had 3 people come in via normal job applications and 2 via networking. These were all people with 5+ YoE

I do think networking is important while you're studying or a fresh grad, but not for finding a job at that stage. That network comes into play and is useful a few years down the line

[open ivy]

I thought it cold applying without years of industry experience was a big disadvantage? The ATS is looking for specific skills.

Although I already tried cold applying to 800 over a period of time and it failed. Networking does seem to be starting to work.

That being said, if you think cold applying at scale is a good idea, someone must have built a good tedium saving system that doesn't spit out AI slop? Although if you favor a laser approach instead maybe I just need a better way to find jobs in the scientific computing field?

[open ivy]

Interesting. I have the opposite problem. It seems like all they talk about is casual for most tech meetups I have been to.

Agree 100% that a balance is best.

[near ocean]

The couple times i tried talking to physicists i just made fun of them for using jira to manage their phd students

[open ivy]

They may be smart physicists, but would they understand anything about your personal projects in tech? They often know surprisingly little about coding complex stuff.

[fast fossil]

lmao, what?

[near ocean]

One epic per student, its the meta

[pastel aspen]

cold-applying as a new-grad through an ATS just seems like a waste of energy to me, but maybe it works sometimes :\

[wraith harbor]

what is the alternative?

[open ivy]

I think cold applying as part of the mix can still work as long as the following rules are:

1. Don't let it feel soul crushing etc. just make it a daily chore you knock out and get on with your life.

2. Minimize ATS systems by picking lesser known companies.

3. Slow it down if you stop getting useful feedback, because that means you are stuck.

[pastel aspen]

That's probably a good all-purpose meta-rule, honestly: "Always assimilate feedback before acting again"

[wraith harbor]

yeah just do 3-5 high quality apps per day, you'll get into a rhythm where you can do that pretty quickly. Then after a week or two if you don't get any results figure out what you need to improve

[near ocean]

Feedback from where? We barely get feedback from tech interview rounds

[open ivy]

There are so many online and inperson places to meet people. They have jobs and referral bonus is a thing.

Networking is not a magic bullet. But it offered so many advantages over cold applying:

1. Learn things.
2. Build skills.
3. Feel more connected.
4. Get feedback.

And yes I know someone paid to watch TV through it! I am less good so will have to settle for paid to actually work.

[pastel aspen]

Yeah this is lame, most companies are advising people not to give feedback because it puts them at risk of lawsuits.

[wraith harbor]

the rate you get an interview or how many tech rounds you pass over a certain period is the feedback

[open ivy]

Isn't there a trick to get snippets of feedback? Like I know it is not perfect but if there is some feedback better than none.

Nothing that would warrent a lawsuit risk because a court couldn't prove anything of course.

[pastel aspen]

The problem is you get lawsuits now like "Your engineer was prejudiced against me because I don't have the skills or experience necessary!"

[fast fossil]

how is that a lawsuit?

surely, that'd just get dismissed before it gets anywhere
also, if they can give feedback verbally, surely that would not be an issue at all

[open ivy]

I was more thinking implicitly. Like the transcript cannot be used in court but read between the lines.

[open ivy]

And doing so will not be "soul crushing" so it will preserve mental health etc.

Leaving energy for networking and portfolio projects.

[near ocean]

Sometimes a little bit of soul crushing is necessary

[open ivy]

Unfortunately the job applications is the "wrong kind of soul crushing" if done incorrectly.

You are more thinking about climbing a mountain of the 52 miles I hiked last weekend where it is rough but with a clear goal and then gets done.

Job applications isn't that, unless you limit the total number sent.

[solid parcel]

Any risk is more than no risk. Orgs don't want to expose themselves to discrimination claims and similar. Even if it's unlikely, it does happen. There's no gain to orgs in giving feedback, but there is certainly downside.

[open ivy]

Not having feedback is a BIG reason to limit the total time and energy spent applying.

It is a very harmful mental state to be in. 99% of the challenges we face, including on the job, have feedback.

[solid parcel]

You're in a pretty privileged position if you're able to approach job hunting from a position of prioritising mental wellbeing, rather than raw need. That suggests you've got resources that statistically speaking most people do not.

[open ivy]

Mental wellbeing is a necessity. Not a luxary!

Without it people will struggle to get anything done.

[solid parcel]

This is an incredibly privileged statement. Food and shelter are necessities. If people are fighting to keep the wolf from the door, mental health will come a distant second.

[open ivy]

Without mental health getting food and shelter is very hard. I have walked through homeless shanty towns and there are big mental health crises there.

[peak halo]

the kind of mental health issues they're having isn't from being under stress.

[open ivy]

Depends on the person. Plenty of mild mental health issues, like anxiety, do not make someone into a raving lunatic. But they can make it very hard to sustain 40 hours a week.

[peak halo]

sure, but you seem to have been suggesting that unmanaged anxiety can eventually render someone homeless

[open ivy]

Yes, it definitely can cause someone to lose a job. And a lost job in some cases is enough to cause homelessness.

[solid parcel]

Mock interviews with other engineers, recording yourself and reviewing the footage, working with colleagues who are prepared to give you candid feedback.

[open ivy]

Yes.

I struggle to get interviews in the first place, so resume help is something I accepted from various people as well.

[near ocean]

Perhaps its time to expand your pool of potential positions you apply to

[wraith harbor]

ive started doing leetcode while talking to myself

[open ivy]

If someone is desperate, and they spend 100% on applications and get nothing (because that can happen), then what?

Sabretooth tigers are short term threats. But if there is a long term threat which financial distress is often, then mental health prioritization must go first.

[solid parcel]

The main issue I see with your CV is a lack of clear impact. As a litmus test, asking "So what?" about each bulletpoint can be beneficial.

[open ivy]

Huh, I will have to somehow condense the reason and so-whats into the smaller spaces.

[solid parcel]

It's naive to think that most people have the resources to pay heed to long term threats, when there's an immediate short term threat (homeless, a debt loop, losing their kids etc.).

I'm glad for you that so many of these things seem theoretical rather than actual, but I'd bear in mind you're coming across as very detached from the world most people occupy. Have you seen the stats for the number of Americans living paycheck to paycheck, for example?

[open ivy]

Better finding more "scientific computing" roles may make it a better match? Because generic "software" positions don't seem to fit my experience that well (they tend to have more cloud/networks and specific tech stacks and emphasize tool use).

[open ivy]

I thought that a debt loop isn't a short term thing? It can go on for years.

[solid parcel]

Fine, if we're going to be pedantic, more specifically I mean entering into one.

[open ivy]

The key is to recognize when the threats are above baseline. If there is a sudden thing that rises up above the "average" level of day-to-day and week-to-week stressors than long-term goals (health fitness etc) can take a pause for the time bieng.

But many people struggle to recognize when it is actually above average.

And for debt loops, I am avoiding credit cards for that very reason.

[solid parcel]

Right, that's a more nuanced take which I can agree with. A risk of becoming homeless would certainly qualify as a high stressor, for example.

[open ivy]

Yes, unless somehow said risk persists for months and months.

Mental health is a necessity like food is: skip a meal and you won't starve.

[pastel aspen]

I wish we had a #philosophy channel sometimes because I have a lot to say that isn't quite "career advice", but more like:

Philosophy is a battle against the bewitchment of our intelligence by means of language.
-Ludwig Wittgenstein

[open ivy]

But going back to jobs, a few apps/day as a morning ritual will not destroy mental health.

[solid parcel]

Framing makes a huge difference. I was giving feedback to another engineer this morning. As an example of one of their bulletpoints, they'd written:

"Followed the new product team closely as a full cycle devops engineer,
participating in the infrastructure design, pipeline implementation,
standardization and improvements"

I was able to help them position it much more actively, as:

"Embedded within the new product team as a full-cycle DevOps Engineer, leading infrastructure design, CI/CD pipeline implementation, and environment standardisation to accelerate delivery." (Which they had done, just needed a little nudging to highlight as much)

[open ivy]

I will launch a website, summarize my products, then grab keywords for resume.

[near ocean]

I pitched #the-watercooler many a time

[solid parcel]

Also remember that recruiters take roughly 7 seconds to scan a CV initially, to decide if it's worth giving a more thorough review. In that time, it's your job to show them why they should be interested in you, else your CV is going in the bin.

I'm a fan of opening with impact for that reason so it's clearly visible as they scan down the left of the page, as well as (judiciously) bolding metrics.

[fringe sphinx]

I generally ignore the impact stuff. I assume it's all made up.

[fringe sphinx]

First bullet of most recent job is the most important, imo.

[solid parcel]

Agreed, I make a point of putting the most relevant at the top of each role

[solid parcel]

This is valid. I certainly see some juniors go wayyy overboard with it. Some are clearly just chat-GPT or similar. Metrics that don't even make sense... Talking about improving velocity by adding container scanning, that kinda thing.

[fringe sphinx]

Implemented tests that increased customer satisfaction 9274 percent and single handedly saved all starving children in the world.

[solid parcel]

My bugbear is seeing a CV talk about 100% uptime. Either you're lying to me, have never worked at any meaningful scale, or are entirely unaware of error budgets and modern SRE philosophies.

[still condor]

Unfortunately, we decided to go with a different candidate. Your age discrimination when deciding which starving people to save does not fit our company's culture.

[fringe sphinx]

For once, a realistic: 'Documented our build process and created a test plan that my entire team ignored and reinvented 4 times in the subsequent year'

[solid parcel]

What do you mean realistic? Documentation isn't real!

[still condor]

Integrated AI into the development process to reduce productivity by 13%, creating 75 new jobs in my town.

[pastel aspen]

"Unsuccessfully lobbied for Product Management to make better decisions, then dutifully implemented their mistakes in production."

"Why am I not getting offers? The market sucks."

[solid parcel]

Somewhere out there, an Amazon manager just caught themselves murmuring 'disagree and commit' under their breath

[woven shale]

Good people of the server what's a good coding profile/portfolio that one could make before applying to good uni with those unreasonable standards

I don't know much about coding so I'm trying to understand what sort of and how many projects matter

My biggest project rn is to code a chess engine that uses ML to get better

So I would not mind learning and understanding what would make others think of me as a good coder

[vapid violet]

When I applied for collage in the US I dont think they were looking for a coding profile/portfolio. Might be different if you are somewhere else

[woven shale]

I am trying to get into a good uni in the states

So could you tell me where I should redirect my focus if I wanna pursue cs

[lucid matrix]

You could probably write about your projects as part of your application essays but unless it’s a school where you apply directly into the CS program you may not be able to directly share projects

[wise raft]

guys, I ws looking at courses at edx and coursera, which one do you think is better

like which one adds more value to kind of my portfolio (im in hs, and i alr have a certificate on python)

what is this

oh

[nocturne harbor]

!clban 1320238143345004596 scam

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @buoyant yacht permanently.

[wooden patrol]

guys could anyone suggest me on how to get people attracted to my portfolio so I can make money and build it for them?

[scenic glade]

applied to company

They just ignored me lol not even rejection email I feel embarassed... maybe i should just give up and kill myself

[hazy pond]

mm

ever you make web/ app

and whatever

[vast shoal]

There's no reason to feel embarrassed. It's not personal, and a lot of companies these days receive ungodly amounts of applications. That they don't respond likely has nothing to do with a disdain for your application in particular. Most likely they are just swamped and can't process all applications properly.

[solid parcel]

Both are pretty useless. Great for learning, but the certificates themselves mean absolutely nothing.

[swift hemlock]

hello

[swift hemlock]

where r u from ?

[vapid violet]

Colleges love people who have shown leadership. At my college at least many people come in with little to no experience in their major. By no means stop your personal projects as that will help you with internships, but it is unlikely that a college will review your projects

[woven shale]

I see ty

[near void]

Hi guys. I learnt a little bit of python (the basics, excpetions, and ik a sumn about classes). I wanna expand my knowledge. I wanna have enough knowledge to think of an idea or an application and start coding it immediately. I dont really know what projects I should do, or where I should start. Ive seen some people my age do amazing projects and im just confused how they figured out all the technical stuff behind it, and where they learnt it. Can yall give me some tips??

Would be nice if i got to know what projects to start with, what modules to study and stuff like that

[fringe sphinx]

"amazing projects" start as "curiosities".

generally speaking, mess around / experiment / try stuff that seems too hard.

Hard to give specific advice... you have to follow your interests.

[near void]

its fine, this was actually useful advice

[nocturne locust]

heyyyyyyyy

[sand patio]

I think it's less so about having a programming portfolio, and more so about (like what wolfy said) having tangible extracurriculars that showcase your leadership experience; college admissions are holistic, and while they probably won't look at your GitHub or whatever, they will conduct a combined evaluation of your grades, test scores, and the stuff you participated in outside of school (e.g were you president/other leadership position of a club? did you participate in some sort of competition? did you do a lot of volunteering or a part time job? did you play a sport? etc).

there is the idea of having a "spike" related to your major, where your extracurricular activities are kind of centered around what you intend to major in, but imo as long as you've got any sort of consistent and substantial extracurricular activity that you've been involved in, it goes a pretty long way.

and then, yeah, most of the top schools are going to have minimum GPAs and test scores they'll want to see

[woven shale]

Obv but I just find it hard to sometimes understand how being a club president is better than having the actual skills of your field

This is all so confusing and just because I took an initiative or two and founded my own club in middle school and volunteered in a hospital should not mean that now I am the perfect model student for Harvard or something

Why are humans like this, it just all feels so irrelevant and illogical

[pastel aspen]

"It shows leadership skills" etc, it's weird, yeah.
As LLMs rise to destroy right-thinking everywhere, IMO "soft" skills like that are going to become more of a signal to recruitment efforts, not less. Showing that you can have a conversation with a real human without melting down is going to matter etc.

You already had to do that to filter out the pre-LLM "edgelords" who are wizards with programming but unable to believe anyone else is right about anything ever.
..and now we have automated edgelords.

[woven shale]

You are funny my good sir

[solid parcel]

Not necessarily better, but certainly a good compliment to technical skills. Soft skills (an ability to communicate, persuade, resolve conflict, energise etc.) have a much larger impact on career trajectory than raw technical talent. It's all about the people at the end of the day.

[woven shale]

I see

[pastel aspen]

This is legit IMO:
(I guess if I'm honest, I've lost jobs over this.)

[vast shoal]

That's why stand-ups are good. They make you do this routinely.

[pastel aspen]

Yeah but if you're all working on distinct things that don't overlap much, it can be really hard to understand what the other team members are on about.. framing it the way that Tweeter did is nice IMO because it has you "writing mini blog posts" to convey the ideas, rather than dumping yesterday's commit log on the group.

My last team was a complex synthesis of SQL financial madness, Dask python distributed computing, and low-level NumPy, and later also Databricks integration

and the Databricks standup report is utterly meaningless to the people in the weeds with SQL.

and the NumPy folks had no idea what I was on about re: Dask on AWS Fargate
We eventually all tried to cross-train really hard but it took forever.

[prisma beacon]

do we havee an machine learning channel?

[pastel aspen]

#data-science-and-ml

[prisma beacon]

tysm

[vast shoal]

Hm, well, maybe, but at least it solves the problem of people thinking that you're not doing anything.

I don't think it's absolutely necessary that everyone in the standup understands the minute details of what everyone else is doing. If I'm working on something that's somewhat related to what someone else is doing, we're at least probably going to understand each other.

So that at least contributes to general awareness.

[quasi kestrel]

yo i have a python code to get rid of these nametags on this video can sm1 help me run it idk what im doing

[bleak atlas]

hi . i have a question , im haven't advanced at python yet its early to learn pygame ?

[pastel aspen]

(Wrong channel both of you, try #python-discussion )

[flat drift]

CV wise, I have a Level 3 degree in python, a level 2 certificate in python, and a level 1 award in python.

All from the same place, would I be better off just putting Level 3, or do I need to list all my levels?

[near ocean]

What are these levels, where did you get them

[visual jacinth]

I AM SIGMA

[wild grail]

I never did any python internships, but is it possible to get a job with just projects .

[pastel aspen]

Yes, though internships work really well if you put in the effort. They can be hard to get now though, there's so much competition 🙁

[wild grail]

😮‍💨😕

People are like oh try remote jobs . But no .... doesn't seems as they say

[balmy mural]

You're much less likely to find a full remote job compared to a hybrid or on-site job. Especially if you're looking for entry level jobs

[visual flax]

Is 2 minutes late really a big deal in corporate america? My job took 15 points off of my contract for being 2 minutes late.

I actually wasn't even two minutes late I signed in two minutes late.

[pastel aspen]

Yep.

[visual flax]

Seriously? I guess they were right to take those points off....

[regal axle]

This is not uncommon. Now should it be ,,,, thats a different question. But yea, this rounding system is pretty common.

[visual flax]

wow, oh well. I got knocked down in the standings now. Guess I jus gotta lock in

[pastel aspen]

Good luck! But yeah, corporate America gets spicy at the moment if you are late to meetings.

[unborn quarry]

Hi guys this is bit off question but it could be great if someone could help. i want to create a similar type of discord community for folks of my field of study which is related to business, there is no such great place where people can ask quality questions and get answers and have such cool community like this in my field of study, like there is for sciences and certain social sciences. can anyone guide me how i can go about this this is sort of idk idea i am thinking. very different q but u guys are techy and better understand this so may be can help me out before i bang my head at chatgpt.

[visual flax]

<----thats bait

Or just blant disrespect.

[unborn quarry]

?

[visual flax]

It's pretty clear this is about job discussion. Not figuring out how to host a discord community.

[unborn quarry]

This is about hosting a discord community

Which part sound like job discussion?

to be clear i want to host for accounting/tax/finance/etc.. in my field of study i am also student.

[smoky quest]

You are asking about hosting a discord community in this channel, which is named #career-advice and about discussing topics directly related to career.
So you are asking in the wrong place since hosting a discord community is ill fit for a place where we discuss careers. #ot0-psvm’s-eternal-disapproval would be more appropriate for your question

[solid parcel]

Hell yeah, boss said he wants me to own driving innovation for the team. Some of the outputs will be visible to the divisional CIO, too. 🎉

Now I just need to wrangle a few sysadmins/infrastructure engineers into learning some python 😁

[pastel aspen]

This is how to move up an "IC" level, yeah.

[solid parcel]

We don't really have an equivalent to staff engineer (outside of architects), so the next step would be lead 🙂 If I can build up a good evidence base across the next year while I'm finishing off my Master's and then move into a lead role, I'd be happy 🙂

[unborn quarry]

Thnx

[vapid violet]

I find that somewhat weird. I understand them not wanting you to be late all of the time. But my grocery store job pays to the closest minute. If I check in 3 minutes early and 5 minutes late I get paid for those 8 minutes.

[pastel aspen]

I made IC4 in 2012 so lemme know if you want to bounce ideas off etc.

[solid parcel]

Hell yeah, appreciated!

[balmy mural]

So, I'm leaving my current company in about 5 months (let's say 7 months if things don't go as planned)
Are there any things I could/should focus on at work to maximize my personal growth in this last time with them before I leave? There's not a lot of space to take any type ownership of new incoming projects since we're mainly building and adding onto existing projects currently. And within my team there's not really anything I could take initiative on. We're severely limited by testing capacity at the moment, so only feature work that's coming straight from the client is really getting touched at all. I've had some framework fixes that have been sitting in a PR for many months since we're unable to budget testing capacity for it since it's not something directly affecting the client :/

[pastel aspen]

The first two things that come to mind:

• Cultivate direct relationships with the co-workers that most impressed you, so you can stay in touch
• Try to understand what your Product Management team did right or wrong, and be ready to explain that in a non-hostile/sassy way in your next interview

Bonus: If you can save them some quantifiable amount of money, that's a lovely resume line-item

[balmy mural]

I have good relationships with most of my co-workers, but transferring that to more direct relationship is hard since we're fully remote. Since I'm emigrating though, it's probably not that important to get those connections, as it's extremely unlikely to really meet up again professionally.
Quantifiable money is a hard one. Got one line for that on my CV for one of the bigger projects I worked on, but we're a consultant company for a big bank. They rarely give metrics on the time/money saved

[pastel aspen]

OK, given that I guess my suggestion is to try to 'multi-discipline' into the financial side while you're there. Are you familiar with, like, time-weighted return? If not, maybe learn some of that from the most book-keeper-y of your current colleagues.

internal rate of return also (IRR)

computing IRR is often basically all a fintech company does when you strip away the top layer

My advice above is basically "Shift Left" in the currently-hot CEO terminology.

https://blog.kodezi.com/what-does-shift-left-mean-in-business-a-comprehensive-overview/
(This is ludicrously over-popular right now, but not totally a bad idea etc.)

[blissful solar]

Tryna get in cs in college

Let's say one of the top 50s. I got some of my siblings there and im tryna make a resume. Are these extracurriculars good or nah?

• started my schools first ever cs club prob the first club in my country
• employed by my school to make a website
• made agricultural monitoring systems relating to needs in my country
• volunteered in cs tutors

[balmy mural]

We actually work on the servicing platform for the bank, so unfortunately not quite fintech. Don't think anyone would be familiar with those concepts from my team, but just looking at their formulas, they don't look foreign to me. I played around with trading and building algorithms for it at some point, thinking I could beat the markets. You can see me still working, so unfortunately I never beat the market :p

[blissful solar]

Pretty much all my resume except sports is based on cs. I've tried to keep a high standard throughout these different causes. Just wondering if this would actually get me anywhere

For jobs I was tryna get an internship but at my age that was a no go. I went tto my school and made an accessible quizlet app. Not sure if these contribute to work resumes as well though. For now just getting into uni

[pastel aspen]

3 and 4 are the ones for me on that list
A lot of folks have done the first 2