career-advice

[vapid jay]

New Zealand

[oak spade]

I heard that if you're super good at what you do , you can find a job almost anywhere

[vapid jay]

Obv I agree but most require Experience beforehand also which you can not get without the job

[oak spade]

That's true but you can work freelance till then

[vapid jay]

for example I pursued a trade and I was not able to gain an apprenticeship for over 6months of trying even though I had done a pretrade course

[oak spade]

And small companies exists

[fringe sphinx]

This I agree with. Theres a difference between someone who merely has a degree, and someone who is passionate and knowledgeable about the field.

[oak spade]

Hey what's the timer for very annoying

[vapid jay]

Also What is CSE?

[oak spade]

Computer Science

[vapid jay]

whats the E haha

[oak spade]

Engineering!

[vapid jay]

ohh thank you

[fringe sphinx]

I don't know NZ but; degreed engineers do find jobs. It takes a little longer than in previous years, but in my opinion (anecdotally) it's rare for someone to not find a job who follows the basics; get a degree, practice projects, good programming skills

[oak spade]

I HATE THE TIMER MY BRAIN IS FAST AND IT WONT LEMME BLABBER 🙄🙄

Yeh and if you manage to get a high deal job you'll get cash and left and right

[vapid jay]

what are chances of learning and progressing without UNI?

I hate the idea of studying 4+ years with small to no income

[oak spade]

You mean university!?

[fringe sphinx]

If the job market is 'tight' for degreed candidates, you can only guess how tough it is without a degree.

[oak spade]

Yeah you honestly can't imagine a job without uni

[fringe sphinx]

But: you can learn programming on your own. A CS degree is more than 'learning programming'

[vapid jay]

Removing the factor of jobs. How much more difficult is it to purely learn

[oak spade]

Like why would a company risk hiring someone without any experience when there's better candidates

[vapid jay]

Ok ok Thank you

[fringe sphinx]

And, if you want to go an alternative route (I don't recommend), you can look for adjacent jobs in tech like support, QA and operations

[vapid jay]

Well I am sure in your CV you would put your projects to show your skill level

[oak spade]

Oh you meant learning
There's free apps now and they're quite helpful

Like Brilliant , Mimo , Python x

[vapid jay]

to what skill level can they take you?

[fringe sphinx]

Junior candidates are: cheaper, trainable, and often easier to find (vs senior)

[oak spade]

Hmm that's true

[fringe sphinx]

You can become a good programmer on your own. There are lots of good programmers in #python-discussion who have NOT gone to Uni

[oak spade]

Are you a student Bobby or are you already working in a field

[fringe sphinx]

I'm working. My kids are your age.

[oak spade]

My dad used to be a software engineer, passed away before ehe could teach me anything though 😭

[vapid jay]

Rest in peace

[oak spade]

Pay pal is illegal here and I got commissioned to draw for people

It was heartbreaking for me because I struggled to find a way to transfer money " if only dad was here "

But yeah cse seems like the next coolest thing you can possibly learn

And you get crazy rich

[fringe sphinx]

Oh, if you have good art skills, also consider studying graphic design. Good designers are important.

[oak spade]

Yesss I want to learn graphic designinh alongside cse

Cash on cash 💸💸
( I love money )

[vapid jay]

Where u from having paypal illegal?

Certain there are many bypasses I have had about 3 banned haha

Also What sort of art do you do

[oak spade]

Bangladesh...shitty country

[vapid jay]

Oh shi I heard your prime minister got overthrown or something of the sort

[oak spade]

I don't think I should discuss art here is there a " general" server for it

[twilit portal]

!ot

[inner wren]

Off-topic channel

#ot2-never-nester’s-nightmare

Please read our off-topic etiquette before participating in conversations.

[oak spade]

So we talk there ?

[oak spade]

Yes 🤣🤣 seems it's everywhere now , months ago this country was practically invisible ahhahah

[fathom wigeon]

Ye

[vapid jay]

is my baccaleurate years during highschool?

If so my goal was to be a plumber but due to the lack of work im currently looking into other things

[fringe sphinx]

That's Uni

[vapid jay]

I only stepped foot in uni to do a pre trade course for plumbing

[fathom wigeon]

Ohh

Is there any subject you're intersted in? Python is everywhere(almost)

[vapid jay]

mainly interested in making my own things such as game dev or web

I was recommended to learn python as a gateway into the world of coding

[fathom wigeon]

Ohh I see

Well I can't think of any ideas right now but Ibdo agree with your idea of finding income before enrolling uni.

[gritty rivet]

You're on a Python server. We love Python here. You can get started with some simple game development in Python. For web development you can use Python for backend (look into Django for example) but you'll want to learn basic HTML + CSS first, probably JavaScript.

But this is the career channel and if you're asking how to get a career in either of these fields, getting a CS degree would definitely be the normal focus.

[lilac sundial]

Kindov a weird one this question but do job offers from big companies for meager positions in them help with getting into a good university for masters

[vapid jay]

Guys

||Is an online degree worth it||

[near ocean]

Is it from an accredited university? Then yes, its worth more than other options, not as much as a regular in person degree

[balmy mural]

My anecdotal data from one cybersec friend is he makes about 15-20% higher salary than the average salary of my dev friends at same YoE. But that's just one data point. I believe he also earns quite a bit more than people in his field at same YoE due to some very specific knowledge he does have that allowed him to be headhunted by a company that needs his experience

[graceful owl]

Cybersec is also a pretty vast domain, whereas sweng is... Relatively one-track?

So it's hard to compare salaries

[near ocean]

Sweng as in software engineering?

[graceful owl]

Yes, maybe saying it's one-track is too naive though, correct me if I'm wrong :p

[near ocean]

SWE is way broader a career choice and i'd even put cybersec under it as a specialty

[vapid jay]

Yus w a gud university

[marble lance]

Can anyone help me

[graceful owl]

There are plenty (most) cybersec jobs that are not sweng though, like most analyst, incident response, etc. jobs are not software engineering, and have different skill sets than what is required to write good software

[near ocean]

There are way more software engineering jobs though

[graceful owl]

Do you mean more in quantity, or more difference between the type of work you do in the role?

[near ocean]

In quantity, type of work and pay

[graceful owl]

Really? How do you think the type of work you do as a software engineer differs between different roles?

Well a SOC analyst will sit there, look at incidents that come in, analyse what's happened, determine if it's a false positive, determine if there's any preventative/remediative measures they can do, and alert the customer I guess

I would argue this is a completely different skillset to software engineering

[near ocean]

You could be writing jquery and making 40k, you could be writing jquery and making 140k, there are so many companies in so many industries whose product is software, you could pulling in 500k in finance or 45k working with charities
Why would you think cybersec is more diverse?

[graceful owl]

Sure, but it's not software engineering

[whole flare]

What about Detection Engineering?

[graceful owl]

because typically the problems you end up solving tend to be pretty similar, and the skills you need are relatively transferrable

[whole flare]

Fair

[near ocean]

More similar to what cybersec problems there are to solve? I dont think so

[graceful owl]

do you work in cybersecurity?

[near ocean]

I work in software engineering

[graceful owl]

okay, i work in both so i think i have a reasonable viewpoint that cybersecurity encompasses a rather huge variety of rules: redteaming/blue teaming/dlp/vulnerability research/etc.

[whole flare]

You work in both? 👀 What is your role?

[near ocean]

Bigger than the already super generic and vague software engineering?

[graceful owl]

i am a software engineer for a cybersecurity company (like crowdstrike but not shit), but i typically end up working cross-domain a lot with our analysts/redteamers etc.

[whole flare]

crowdstrike but not shit

[graceful owl]

yes, probably haha, i do a lot of end-to-end work, writing frontend jquery, big data analysis, going into OS internals, compression, blah blah etc. etc. and i have found that my i'm using almost the exact same skills for every bit of work i do

[true harness]

I would not consider data science related applications to be software engineering, to be fair

[graceful owl]

same with previous jobs i've had and all my personal projects

the domain in which i'm working might be different, but the application of my skills is almost always identical

[whole flare]

They were just thinking outside the box. You can't get malware if the computer is bricked!

🤨

[fringe sphinx]

What?

[iron jolt]

that's someones address there's a shooting there

[fringe sphinx]

That's off topic and not something we want posted on this server.

[iron jolt]

also in las vegas there's haunted houses

never visit las vegas billy

yeah

dude this slowmode thing is enabled

[near ocean]

Guy, stop talking here about irrelevant topics

[fringe sphinx]

I don't know what you are talking about, but stay on topic in this server, don't troll, and mind our #rules.

[fringe sphinx]

!ot

[inner wren]

Off-topic channel

#ot2-never-nester’s-nightmare

Please read our off-topic etiquette before participating in conversations.

[balmy mural]

I would consider most of data science to fall somewhere under the unbrella of swe

[graceful owl]

data science is not about creating software, it's about analysing data

software is just a useful tool that makes the analysis easier

[fringe sphinx]

Stop. This is #career-advice

[near ocean]

(using software, I think it counts)

[true harness]

data scientists are focused on writing one off scripts, while software engineers have maintainability and longevity in mind. data engineering is closer to swe

[fringe sphinx]

!mute 1170123796783583375 Persistent off-topic messages in #career-advice . Stop.

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied timeout to @vapid jay until <t:1722961257:f> (1 hour).

[graceful owl]

😅 fair, i'm not a data scientist, i spoke out of line

[austere swan]

I want to make something in which i can code always in my brain also ,
So actually the problem is school and school work burnout me and give me nothing as you know its a matrix
And im finding a way to code in everything including paper coding and now i want that i can code in my brain so i can code everywhere and everytime, so is it possible?

[graceful owl]

i find that because programming is typically very intricate, in the sense that individual changes can have a big effect, it's hard to 'program' the same way you can on a computer just in your head (also, you can't run code in your head lol)

thinking about overall architecture/structure/little problems is very possible in your head though, i find myself doing it all the time

[austere swan]

Hmm same, the problem is i can't debug a code and there is nothing like python interpreter in your head that tells oh you are doing this error and you know, so i want some sort of debugger and interpreter and some sort of storage also in brain so i can transfer data also to my laptop from my brain

[graceful owl]

storage in your brain is called your memory :p unfortunately it's not really designed for this kind of thing

[austere swan]

Human brain memory can't read and write fast like ram the problem is you can forget the code that you are making in your head , the problem is its not like ssd or hdd

Imagine if you can transfer data from your brain to your pc or any device and your brain memory is real robust like pcS
So i want some sort of like that

[lilac sundial]

Wb his weekly work hours/ flexibility does he wk frm home

[balmy mural]

Hybrid, in office 3x per week. In office hours weren't very flexible at any of the companies he has worked at, but WFH hours are a bit more flexible

His workhours are the standard 45/week we have in the country for most jobs

[true harness]

9 hours a day, 5 days?

[lilac sundial]

Hey , he gettin paid tho

[balmy mural]

Ahh, I mixed it up with some research I did on our workhours recently. 45 is the maximum allowed normal working hours before overtime has to kick in. Standard is 40. Double checked with him, he works 40/week

[lilac sundial]

Im keeping cs as a backup career in case i plan to swap down the line mayb

[balmy mural]

the pay he receives is just above the average of our group of SWE. If compared to the top band from our dev group, salaries are very similar for same amount of YoE

[lilac sundial]

But perhaps my thought process is naive for coming up with that statement

[lilac sundial]

Far as ive seen swe and cs packages are comparable

[balmy mural]

And as said, it's 1 data point. If you want an accurate representation of cybersec vs software engineering salaries, you should check out something like glassdoor for salaries in your area

[lilac sundial]

[runic remnant]

whats the procedure or terms that are in place when u try to get a sponsored masters from your company or employer

[faint depot]

What are the salaries like in systems engineering and whats the job security like

[balmy mural]

This would probably be different from company to company and country to country. I know my company does sponsor people who want to go do a masters degree, and the first step I'd take if I were interested would be to reach out to my manager and ask them. They would know the specifics on how it works or if your company does it

[fringe sphinx]

In US, just ask HR if they have a tuition reimbursement program.

[dapper bane]

Did any1 got offer to go outside your country with visa sponsorship ?
How did u achieve it ?
pong me if someone knows somethin

[viral dragon]

Hello, I am looking for an online job, any suggestions?

[smoky quest]

indeed or linkedin are popular job websites

[orchid night]

can I get resume advice

[smoky quest]

It basically comes down to two parts:

• Finding a company and being interviewed
• Going through all the steps to get a visa

[smoky quest]

Feel free to post an anonymized version of your resume

[dapper bane]

I cant even get interviews

[smoky quest]

Well, that's something to work on then

[dapper bane]

this is all i got https://saintelgrandosmokio.itch.io/water-shader

[viral dragon]

Isn't linkdin more like temporary jobs?

[smoky quest]

that doesn't look like a resume

[dapper bane]

oh resume I have one

I am gonna revise my resume once more

[orchid night]

This resume is directed towards Data jobs

[smoky quest]

• Don't kill the amazon forest. Make sure the background is white. If it's through a PDF, let the PDF readers handle the dark/light modes
• Add more context in terms of numbers
• It sounds like you are underselling yourself in the way things are phrased

[orchid night]

its a white background my computer is dark theme right now so thats why its like that

what ways am I underselling myself?

[smoky quest]

I forgot to mention another path: go do a degree in your target country as a way to establish a presence and to make it easier to find a company

[dapper bane]

hell nah I aint no bill gates

[smoky quest]

Adjusted data visuals
Sounds like there is more to it? Nothing difficult?

[smoky quest]

Do you currently have a degree or experience?

[viral dragon]

^^

[smoky quest]

no

[dapper bane]

yeah I have a degree in computer science and engineering and 7 months of experience

[orchid night]

what else do you think I can elaborate on?

I was looking to apply to swe jobs as well do you think I can take anything from this resume?

[viral dragon]

Okay, thank you

What is "most recent job title" on the linkedin sine up page?

[smoky quest]

Things to elaborate on would be size of data, throughput, etc. if interesting

In terms of SWE, I would do another resume that reduces the size of your DE experience and highlight better SWE related projects

[smoky quest]

Depends if you count your DE experience as a part time job or full time job. But whatever they called you. Or put nothing if you only consider it as a student job

[dapper bane]

guys do I really need to know DSA to get FANG job or a good startup so far no startups have asked me this

[viral dragon]

Sorry, I'm not really an english speaker, What's DE?

[smoky quest]

data engineer

[orchid night]

I don't have much professional experience from previous role for swe I was more primary a DE so what I should I do for professional experience when applying to swe roles

[viral dragon]

Oh thatnk you

[smoky quest]

bro, DSA is the basic of computer.

[dapper bane]

yeah but it goes to like competitive programming level

[smoky quest]

You are graduating in 2024. You are entry level

[smoky quest]

no

[dapper bane]

wdym ?

[smoky quest]

I mean it doesn't go to CP

[orchid night]

I know that but how would cater my resume to SWE when I mainly have a DE background

[smoky quest]

Make space for non-DE stuff. Like school projects or personal projects that highlight a diverse set of skills, while benefiting from your experience gained as a DE

You already have some listed, but you are listing a whole project in a single line

[fringe sphinx]

OAs and early stage interviewing often use DSA questions. You should be able to solve "easy" (ie: leetcode easy's) DSA questions as a CS grad, they are genuinely easy. Whether mediums & hards are important is probably dependent on the type of company you're applying to/etc.

The importance of DSA is very exaggerated tho (being good at leetcode hards doesn't* help you much in real SWE jobs)

[dapper bane]

Its not like I dont know DSA at all

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, your question wasn't clear, since you said: "do I really need to know DSA to get FANG job"

[smoky quest]

The main advice would be:

• Brush up the topic of DSA. Pick up a book, a course, a video, whatever you like. I recommend https://mitpress.mit.edu/9780262046305/introduction-to-algorithms/ though as it can serve as a reference later
• Practice with leetcode. You should aim at being able to solve 1 hard or 1-2 easy/medium in 30-40min

The main benefit of the first point is it will drastically reduce the amount of time you need to practice leetcode.

[dapper bane]

Damn I am more into open source than this is there any path with that ?

[smoky quest]

Open Source is a model of development. How does it relate to preparing for interviews?

[dapper bane]

I dont know

[smoky quest]

I see

[fringe sphinx]

My suggestion: hang out in #python-discussion , try to help in #1035199133436354600 , and you'll learn a lot every day.

[smoky quest]

Can you rephrase your question then?

[orchid night]

should I list my projects individually then

[dapper bane]

I am a little worried now its like the market keeps on getting tougher and i am playing in hard difficulty my projects are whack too

[true harness]

I would focus on depth rather than breadth. list your top 3 and go into more detail

[smoky quest]

That would help.
If I receive a resume where 90% of it is DE, I get a sense the candidate really cares about DE
If I receive a resume where the percentage is lower and I see a diverse set of skills, then I get a sense that it happened to be their job but they don't necessarily want to make a career out of it

[orchid night]

so keep the same format but change content up for SWE

and lessen the amount of DE experience

[smoky quest]

It's also summer. People are on vacation.

But imagine you and all your classmates apply to the same job. Why would I call you back and not someone else? How do you show your skills?

[smoky quest]

Yeah. I generally keep a master resume with everything on it and then cut out the personas out of it.
This way the job does get something more tailored and I don't need to go all the way to tailor my resume to each job

[dapper bane]

this is all I got in the name of skills but my stuff is not complete https://saintelgrandosmokio.itch.io/water-shader

[orchid night]

I do feel like my resume gets outted by the ATS system easy do you have any advice to get in front of HR and the hiring manager

[true harness]

go to networking and career events like conferences

[dapper bane]

At the end of this month I ll get my job hopefully and my internship will be completed

I had to make a graphs library from react-native-svg that was some real pain

[smoky quest]

You should expect reviewers to make their first pass in less than 30-45s. No one is gonna click on links

[dapper bane]

wdym ? thats itch.io

every knows itch.io every in game dev atleast

[smoky quest]

TheATS filter is just mostly a myth. You can see them as a terrible spreadsheet.
So if you get outed, it's pretty much you are rejected by the recruiter or manager

[smoky quest]

And no one is still gonna click on it

[dapper bane]

nani ?

[orchid night]

you said in the past you were hiring manager right? would you reject my resume?

[true harness]

I recently talked to recruiters at my company and they say it's even less than that, 10-15 seconds

[smoky quest]

for a DE at entry level, probably not rejected
for a swe at entry level, would be rejected

[viral dragon]

Hi recursive_error, I looked at some of the jobs in linkedin and I am not really qulified to any of them, I am too young, any jobs that might not need a batchler degree?

[smoky quest]

that's ruthless

[orchid night]

DE entry levels are rare

[smoky quest]

If you are too young, then do you want a student job or a career?
If the latter, a CS degree would be the path of least resistance and with the most opportunities and compensation

[true harness]

apparently there were tens of thousands of applicants for ~100 intern positions this summer

[dapper bane]

what do I do ? there is some hope with these projects

[fringe sphinx]

That's probably what I do. The first glance is a sniff test: are they a dev?

[viral dragon]

What is the difference between a student job and a career?

[smoky quest]

You focus on your resume. It's your one page ad to sell yourself.
As such, your value should sweat out of it just by looking at it

[smoky quest]

Yeah, it's tough

[smoky quest]

A student job is a small job you do while you study for your degree

[viral dragon]

Oh, than I guess I want a student job

[smoky quest]

you can apply to all the coffee shop and fast food chains.

For tech jobs, that's more rare and would be easier to find through your network, nepotism, etc.
Though you can ask @orchid night how they did find their DE job while they were at school

The few students I have hired were through nepotism/network because someone knew their parents or something

[orchid night]

my DE job was a co-op position but I did get full-time offer before budget cuts and getting let go

[dapper bane]

I am still making changes to resume

[viral dragon]

Wdym through network?

[orchid night]

I know a lot people got referrals that they are friends with or because nepotism too

[smoky quest]

Like, your mom knows someone who works at a company and they get you in because they know your mom

[viral dragon]

Oh

[orchid night]

can I get hired?

[viral dragon]

So to sum up, There are no jobs basicly for students

[smoky quest]

sorry, I don't know your mom

[orchid night]

do I qual though?

[smoky quest]

that's a great start!

[orchid night]

do you look at github pages when you looking to hire?

Every time I interview it seems like that they don't look at github pages

[dapper bane]

it aint

[viral dragon]

Than how do I find a job? I would like to think I have some very good skills

[smoky quest]

not on the first pass.

Like imagine you want to review 200 resumes. If I spend 2min on each, that's 400min or 6.6hours

[orchid night]

I don't expect it on the first interview but the second one I do

[smoky quest]

that's 50/50

[viral dragon]

Damn it. What is a resume and how do I get one?

[smoky quest]

not even these odds

[dapper bane]

hey wassup brother

[orchid night]

does sending messages to recuriters on linkedin work tho?

[viral dragon]

So I just invent one? Like one google docs or what ever?

[orchid night]

I feel like applying to entry level or mid level roles is a different game then applying to internships?

[dapper bane]

hell yeah

[orchid night]

like damn I've been applying and had like 3-5 interviews since I got let go in December

[smoky quest]

Are you talking about unsolicited advertisements?

[orchid night]

just like finding recruiters and sending a friendly saying your interested after applying to the job

[dapper bane]

hell nah not in my experience

[viral dragon]

How can I edit the templete you sent?

Or do I just look at what's there

[smoky quest]

they will just tell you to apply into the system so you can get into the ATS

[viral dragon]

I can't quite edit the template

Oh, okay, thank you so much

[vapid jay]

Is anyone here have experience being a Comp Hardware Engineer?

[deft herald]

I've worked for 2 different hardware companies. What do you want to know?

[deft herald]

@vapid jay

[pine sleet]

this is a great example of why one should directly ask their question rather than asking for an expert

[vapid jay]

My bad im out here at work, dont judge me lol

[deft herald]

Yeah...45 min later and this has gone nowhere yet

[pine sleet]

i would suggest next time you directly ask your question so that there's no back and forth

[smoky quest]

no one is judging, but by the time you ask your question, Meltz might be gone already, resulting with you getting no answer

[pine sleet]

it is generally courteous to do so in an online chat room so that you are not wasting someone's time

[true harness]

bro should be like http3 and assume SSL

[vapid jay]

Im struggling to decide wether i pursue a comp engineering degree, or comp science. Could you give me some insight as to how the education went, what your experience was like with uni and working with companies and wether you actually enjoyed working in the field?

All fair points

[deft herald]

I'll start by just outlining my path to a career i guess

[deft herald]

• obtained BS in Electrical Engineering
  • took some electives in robotics, analog & digital comm, couple programming electives
• worked for my existing job for an additional year as a sort of front end web dev (mostly self taught stuff)
• hired at Seagate as a SelfTest engineer (6ish years)
  • responsibilites included writing low level software for HDD's to perform self tests in factory
  • took some free online courses on Computer Science - basically to fill in the gaps i thought were missing (this was all sanctioned by my team leads at the company)
  • became expert in python; transitioned to more of a test automation dev
• hired at Qualcomm (6+ years now)
  • Currently doing similar stuff. leading a small team of engineers to build end-to-end test automation packaged with lots of data analytics and such

[deft herald]

And yes, i do enjoy my current job

[vapid jay]

Thats quite the resume. So it seems like i can pursue comp engineering and do some coding on the side to fill those gaps on my knowledge. Now i guess my goals arw a bit far fetched, i want to try and pursue work involving CPU and GPU architecture, and im assuming i would have to tailor my efucation towards these fields specifically? Do you have any exeprience around these two?

[deft herald]

Fun fact: my CEO signs all his global company emails with that emoji 👊 but only if the stock price is up

[vapid jay]

Haha, thats awesome

[deft herald]

Seems like CE would be a good degree for you. and yeah, you'd usually pick electives to tailor it to more specific career goals

[vapid jay]

Did you have to take alot of math and physics courses when you were in college?

[deft herald]

Yeah as core to any engineering degree

[white relic]

I majored in CE. I work now in superconducting supercomputer research. Architecture is a huge element of designing leading edge compute systems because the demands of modern applications (especially ML/AI). Lots of fun R&D going on in that space.

[deft herald]

That sounds pretty awesome

[white relic]

I would suggest having an eye toward getting at least a master's if you want to go hard on the architecture side of things. But a CE bachelor's is a sound start

[vapid jay]

What other courses would you say are pretty integral towards this field that i should kind of focus on?

[deft herald]

I've heard stories about the R&D division at my company and how it's pretty chill and has the hopeful atmosphere of a college campus

[deft herald]

I think trentj's giving some solid advice

[vapid jay]

I was planning on it

[white relic]

Then you will be on a good path toward that career goal

But you don't need to pick it all out now. Your first few years of uni and presumably internships/other experience may show you new stuff you like even better. It's great to have a plan, also good to be able to pivot early in your education/career

[deft herald]

100% agree there. You don't need to plan out your entire career at this point

I bet in most schools you can even go in to it with "Undeclared Engineering" path because really, all engineering has pretty much the same first 2 years

[vapid jay]

Sorry for the slow repsonding, but thats actually some great insight i needed lol, thank you guys massicely for the input

Ill keep all this in mind going through school

[strange nova]

Hey, I'm about to hit applications harder than ever before with this. Anyone got any notes for my resume? Any weak bullet points? Any projects I should upgrade or just swap out entirely with new ones? I'll do anything if I must.

[whole flare]

The first bullet on project two has a weird start

Architected and maintaining

[strange nova]

Oh yeah 😂

[true harness]

i can't tell what size the margins are, but i would recommend at least half an inch, and 1 inch just to be safe. you don't know how well their (or your) printers will handle that

also, could just be me, but the text looks super weird. like there's a "haze" around all the letters

[smoky quest]

main feedback than last time: give some example of cool projects in your first bullet

[strange nova]

Maybe because I took a screenshot and uploaded it to Google photos (no discord on my computers) noticed those artifacts on another picture the other day.

[strange pumice]

wassup my people

i think i locked myself out of my github

[pine sleet]

this is not the right channel

[balmy turtle]

Finally. My first interview. After applying for months.Fingers crossed

Listing projects in resume. I should do that. I worked mostly same position so my work experience sort of looks like the same thing x4 times

[viral dragon]

Hi, I am still in high school but looking for a part time job, where could Ifind one? Preferebly remote one

[pine sleet]

what sort of job?

retail and fast food hire a lot of part time students, though not remote

[peak halo]

It's very unlikely that you will be able to find one that involves programming.

You might be able to find an internship that runs over the summer, but those are typically only offered to university students

[brave swallow]

Designer or editor

[strange nova]

You can get various types of job in IT with little to no experience, in that case certifications are quite useful for your resume to get you in the door. There's even possibility of working remote on helpdesk jobs, support, or the like.

[lilac sundial]

Do u hv a firm grasp on all those languages

[strange nova]

I wouldn't write something that is a lie, lest you be caught in it when you put in all that work to get an interview. In the same breath, you want at least a decent grasp on something, I never write C code so it's not included. Additionally, have written languages that are not relevant, so they're not included either. I don't think anyone uses Lua or MQL4 at work, for example.

[vapid jay]

The easiest and quickest way to getting a remote job in IT, would be getting your CompTIA certifications. I would recommend getting your CompTIA A + cert if you just wanna get your foot in the door, and looking into Network + and Security + certs after that. Can't garuntee as a highschooler you'll have a lot of options, as most these types of jobs are bound to be 40 hour work weeks interfering with school remote or not.

[kindred oyster]

your best bet imo would be to get VERY good at some thing and then offer that skill on freelancer platforms

[vapid jay]

^^^^

Ideal if you don't want it to interfere with school a whole lot

[stiff basalt]

What programming languages should I learn if I'm going for aerospace engineer

[lilac sundial]

I see , i asked bc i just wanted to knw if you had to know these many langs at such and such a level

[strange nova]

You could learn python only, but then you'd be doing backend work. I think the easiest jobs to get are doing frontend, which is ubiquitously done in Javascript these days, due to JS engines being present in every browser. Java is more or less the same boat as python, and you don't necessarily need to learn C++. (Mind you, this was all from a web development perspective) Ultimately you can make anything you want out of any experience, you can learn as much or as little as you feel. Anything you try that's out of the ordinary for you can be a growing experience.

[topaz shoal]

tutorial on how to become jobless.

[strange nova]

What

[strange nova]

In response to me? Or was that just a coincidence that you sent that at the same instant?

[topaz shoal]

nope.

[cedar stirrup]

Hey all
I’ll be joining Accenture in a week!
I was looking for some professional certifications which would help enhance my profile.. any suggestions?

[balmy flax]

Hey guys, say I have to send the link of a resume to a company. The usual way I know is to upload it on Google Drive and send the link. But is there a way to update the pdf without changing the link or are there any better ways of sending like the link first and then update the contents in it later. I thought of the idea of simply using a folder but people say it's not that good if an option.

[kindred oyster]

matlab, python , c/c++

[strange nova]

and rust 😏

[smoky quest]

you could use gitlab pages?

[pearl trout]

Tonight the Sun sets Forever! There will never be another Dawn

[lilac sundial]

Definetly. Atm im at about the same lvl in both python and java . Im more familiar w html than js so i def need to look into that side of the spectrum . Heard full stack jobs pay the most. Considering they arent insanely hard to nail , what route would you recommend i take

[sly olive]

your local restaurant

[true harness]

GitHub

[primal anchor]

🤡

[strange nova]

Can others give their opinions on this for me? I can't answer.

[faint depot]

This must be a joke

[primal anchor]

Naah real

😒

[faint depot]

How can someone be this detached from reality to post such an idiotic job advert? Whats sad is theres probably people who are desperate and willing to be exploited by these charlatans

If possible, it should be reported

[primal anchor]

That to be he mentioned exceptional human 🤡 , wth

[strange nova]

Don't spam the channel with shitposting or discussing the shitpost please

[near ocean]

Its a shitpost on linkedin, nothing new and not really on topic for the channel

[faint depot]

Question for those in the UK: has anyone applied to do an apprenticeship via QA apprenticeships and if so, how is QA as a training provider was the apprenticeship you carried out good for you?

[muted night]

https://programming-24.mooc.fi/

[white relic]

Aerospace is a big field. If you want to be making software that runs on planes then you'll want to know c++. Simulation models for design and such are more in the Python/Matlab space. There's some amount of legacy code in Ada or other languages you might need to know in the long run. Tcl is another one I used for automating electronic design. Various software you may use will have their own scripting languages depending on what field you go into

There's some interest in Rust for security which may start to happen slowly over the next 10 years but aerospace/defense is a conservative industry by nature

[muted night]

#networks

[lilac sundial]

Is there benefit to learning all the "big" langs cpp pyth java etc

Or should i focus only on a handful and the rest css php js and langs of other domains

[peak halo]

professional devs don't talk about how many "languages they know". they talk primarily about what kinds of things they know how to do; the language in which they do it is secondary.

[lilac sundial]

I see , thank you

[peak halo]

if you've learned one language, it's easy to learn the core features of a bunch of other languages.
So, don't focus on acquiring programming languages. Focus on categories of development and making things within that category.

[lilac sundial]

Yeah feels that way fs , def will do

[buoyant seal]

... as person holding senior rank in a company i work... i believe that...

...at student level it is nice to try everything, for the purpose of finding what u like https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c6rP-YP4c5I

at after graduation level, for professional work, it is best starting with 1 language to learn in depth and then going to fully fledged 3 languages in depth at max, which synergyze in their capabilities to help doing stuff more that other languages can't.
and language choices should be selected depending on what kind of job roles u wish to hold.
So... my job roles are backend dev and devops engineer. My interests go towards Python, Golang and Java (because they are all backend usable and linux friendly (important for backend) languages). + learning an array of infrastructure languages (Terraform, AWS related stuff with CDKs, Pulumi, Docker, Ansible, Kubernetes) and being proficient as i can in web infrastructure stuff like Postgresql, Redis, RabbitMQ, elasticsearch and etc
The pull of weight on my shoulders is already super high, because of all this stuff, and pick already mostly the most job reusable things.
It takes a lot of time investment to become comfortable with specific language, to be very efficient in debugging its issues, and being capable to bend it to your will so you would build nice libraries and code structured at growth. It takes a lot of time investment to be knowing language best practices and its ecosystem, to be ready using it for any target u wish and solve any nail of a problem.
At the same time it is very worth knowing stuff in depth, because then u can do A LOT, and solve any types of problem... if u are just overly familiar with specific thing.
As example this rollercoaster in excel https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYaLQ3LazYM

[kindred oyster]

its like learning to drive a car
its kind of irrelevent "how many cars you can drive"

[buoyant seal]

We can say there is an array of highly reusable stuff between languages, yes. A lot. (U could read about all this stuff from Code Complete book
The concepts of unit testing, code architecture, code smells and etc they are all reusable.
But in reality no, u need to input a lot of bloody time effort to become comfortable with new language, ecosystem and best practices.
Even if u are good dev, your first months-year code in new (or low used) language can be quite crap in terms of best practices at minimum
You need to input time to get to know quirks of the language and become familiar solving fast its problems, to become efficient/productive.

[lilac sundial]

Thnk u

[pastel thunder]

So, is there any well known maths/coding olympiad/contest for Masters student?
I saw some are there but I will not meet the age criterion as I will work 2 year professionally before MS and exceed the age limit by a year or so by the time I join.

[fringe sphinx]

There's always https://www.kaggle.com/competitions

[pastel thunder]

any other than this and leetcode/codeforces ?

like actual Olympiad

[smoky quest]

It's probably a better question for #algos-and-data-structs

[proper plaza]

Do I have to get good with front end design in order to get a SWE job?
That’s one of the few areas of cs I genuinely don’t like

[true harness]

not all jobs require those skills

[fast fossil]

design can be like a separate field, unless you're full stack ig, but yeah, like there are people whose entire job is designing stuff, ofc someone has to implement that ig

[stiff basalt]

How do u know what field you want to enter?

Do u experiment first? Or do u just assume

[true harness]

experiment

[sleek kayak]

Does ranking well in Kaggle break open doors?

[peak halo]

No

[native narwhal]

Hi all,
I'be been into tech for the past several years as a hobby while my job is working with photovoltaic modules etc just hardware stuff, installations, projects, sales, documents and such but that's besides the point
but since this is the career discussion channel you know I'd rather say that I'm 36 married well situated got good job, have great connectios so its not like I'm on the street or I just finished school and don't know what to do...

I've written Python code some Swift code for iOS even finished a PHP course with a mentor just dribbling around with languages getting to know them even some MVC framewroks, did some JS too and all that is fine but doesn't really suit me
I mean overall I got so much knowledge in a lot of areas even did a Linux course I also did Networking course to learn plenty on computer networks, hardware etc.
Of course I also wrote some sql queries and that was my intro to databases so I think I have to whole picture now
But I feel like there is more to it, u know what I mean?

I keep asking myself what do I really want to do...
I mostly like hanging out in the terminal so I will now learn Bash and something about non visual database work is appealing to me

Has anyone been on a similar journey? 🙂

[inner hemlock]

Python at scale is so amazing

My new workplace is all Python and it's really cool to see it all come together

[lime cedar]

can we use python in Arduino

[twilit portal]

Sounds like a question for https://discord.com/channels/267624335836053506/545603026732318730

[plush summit]

Yeah

[lime cedar]

thank you

[vapid jay]

The future is written in COBOL

[hearty totem]

I'll be honest, this sounds more like middle-age crisis. Been there. So be careful about that first. Getting a Harley and joining a biking club may or may not be more beneficial in the long run.

Still, writing software is great fun. The question is whether a job in it will still be fun. I assume that you are pretty good with photovoltaics, hence with DC electric installations. I'd try getting more involved in embedded software first, where that knowledge helps.

The part you are missing from your message is system design. System design of software you only pick with experience. And the embedded world has probably to lowest requirement for the knowledge of system design (for better or worse, some embedded software is dreadful thanks to that).

My two cents at least

[lilac sundial]

Is there a huge difference between swe and sw development

[fringe sphinx]

The fulfilling part of tech is solving real problems, and I've been lucky to fall into roles where I am close to my customers. Given some of the data things you're describing: have you considered data analyst roles? The most important skill in those roles is usually: thinking. The technical skills are to support the 🧠

[fringe sphinx]

No, we use many terms that mean the same thing. Engineering sounds fancier than programming or development, and perhaps implies more formality (to me) but in job titles it's interchangeable

[lilac sundial]

I see , thank you

[buoyant seal]

programming can take magnitudes times more to do if doing unefficiently.
Programms deprecate rapidly, and if u don't maintain smth => it will dissapear.
maintanance of a program easiness is proportional to your skills and knowing core software engineering subjects (Code Complete and Unit testing with,theory behind it is essential) it depends on your ability to design solution with less complex things but using the right needed things to make development and long term maintanance easier

Learning static typing is very great for long term maintance too. I find solutions in golang absolutely perfect and can update them only once in a year and it is fine. I am able reread everything that happens there easily, for all logic.

Once u learned core software engineering stuff, it is only a matter of time to explore specific language and target platform in depth in order to get it (for example if backend development, then rest apis, sql, orms, auths, templating in a good way and other stuff)
Once u got hang of some UI interface builder, for CLI, for web, for desktop, for android, your imagination sparkles with possibilities what u can build 😉
When u posses enough skills and knowledge, u can be very efficient in developing and maintaining stuff

Then... being weaponized with things i mentioned, u could be beneficial to community by building and maintaining specific interesting tools people actually need, and maintain them for 10-20+ years as long commitment.

i like at the moment provide tooling for Freelancer Discovery community around space flight simulator. for me it is just a matter to go through their garbage legacy of tools, and all the accumulated knowledge and converting stuff into perfect new way with things i am ready to apply.
now maintaining Minecraft server with mods for fun, and planning long term commitment to maintain my own mods, for the purpose of also getting good with Java

[twilit portal]

good stuff, definitely bookmarking this

[buoyant seal]

You can do of course all without all those prerequisits, but human life is short (especially for the infinity world of software). best to optimize amount of time effort needed to develop and maintain stuff. then u will be able with joy to work on it in long term for sure.

If u are equiped with stuff i mentioned... u can do things at code scale then you know, u can just pretty much reprocess all the deprecating stuff of other people, and build on ashes of their stuff a good maintained new software to meet demends. Finding ideas at some point can be easy as long as u are in certain communities of some hobbies and able to understand what people wish, had or like.
A lot of software in communities dies just because of lack of maintanance and it was written in a shitty way. Just with learning the ways doing it in a good way u will have pretty much infinity stuff to do, by building stuff that works and even could do more. Just a matter of choosing what u actually like the most to spend time on

[fringe sphinx]

🔥 My favorite quote is something like, life is too short to live for tomorrow.

[native narwhal]

Thank you, this was helpful, I get what you are saying about sys design and design principles, I've come across some blogs on this previously but I absolutely understand that learning is mostly based on experience

[fringe sphinx]

In programming, it's a combination: experience, peers/mentors (talking to people and getting critiques/reviews), and purposeful education (reading a book, watching conference videos, etc)

Diversify your sources

[native narwhal]

I am literally about to buy a book and dive deeper into data engineering, I may get to do some analytics there too, I really hope this will be fun learning

[fringe sphinx]

Also, Kaggle.com/learn has some nice data primers

[buoyant seal]

other people here said they enjoyed this book a lot and recommended on this topic https://www.oreilly.com/library/view/fundamentals-of-data/9781098108298/

[mossy spire]

Hello
I am new around here and i have just started to prepare for gsoc 2025
does anyone know what companies utilise mediapipe in gsoc
i already know the basics of the library.

[high coral]

starting a new role where they use Team Foundation Server (TFS) as version control, what is that? Is TFS just Azure DevOps Server?

[true harness]

looks like that's the old name of ADO

[high coral]

thats what i thought too, not sure why they callled it TFS

[vapid jay]

Fake news

The fullfilling part of tech is opening 100 millions lines excels on a 20 years old computer

[uneven moat]

@wintry glade ask here

[wintry glade]

@uneven moat sure and Thanks

[uneven moat]

No worries

[rose sand]

Good afternoon,
Hope you are all doing well. I have a career question about python. I graduated with a bachelors in science with a focus of cs back in 2023. Since then I have been troubling putting my foot in the tech industry like most folks. I didn’t realize how behind my CS department was compared to the tech industry. Last year, I took a mental health check and tried to figure out what I wanted to do. Since then I have been doing better and have decided I wanted to be a Django developer. I am familiar with python principles and currently doing a refresher course on html and css.I guess my main question is after I finish this video and have the basics down for python, html, and css. What should I do next? Are there any videos, books or websites you can recommend?

Sorry for the long message, I wasn't sure if this was the right channel to ask this question.

[fringe sphinx]

This channel is fine, for python questions also use #python-discussion

[lucid urchin]

hey guys

[smoky quest]

Make projects to not only put into practice what you learnt but also 👏 demonstrate 👏 your 👏 skills 👏

[fast fossil]

it's the time you go on a lunchbreak and fulfill your tummy

[pastel thunder]

what to say in exit interview if i dont want to mention anything negative but last month in team review form, I criticized my last manager pretty badly.
I am pretty sure this interview will be for that only

truly speaking he is secondary reason as for why I am leaving
primary is I wanted better job

But he was indeed very a** of a manager, people still working over there deserve better

I am just afraid that while I try to give some positive, noncomplaining reason, the HR will mention the feedback form that I submitted
and would ask me to shed more light on it

[smoky quest]

yeah, keep it generic and positive.
There is no benefit to you in bitching. So I would keep it simple and positive as to leave in good terms.

If you want to share anything, then share it in positive frames

[pastel thunder]

thats the plan, but she has intentionally scheduled an face-to-face meeting
She might actually mention the statements of feedback form, and ask me to explain why I said that.
Not sure how to remain positive over there

For example I wrote:
demotivating.....held my bonus.....criticizes....focus of mistake and no appreciation

and gave 2/5 on all metric that were present (he actually deserve a 1/5 in my opinion)

[smoky quest]

they will always schedule a face2face (even if virtual) to talk about it

But yeah, if you already gave feedback form...

[silver jacinth]

https://www.cnn.com/2024/08/05/business/google-loses-antitrust-lawsuit-doj/index.html

told you

[shadow badge]

I am really frustrated these days. I am a Full Stack Web Developer having experience in PHP, JS, Python Frameworks I have also worked with langchain but the issue is I just don’t know if i am good enough I can’t get that confidence to overcome the fear’s I have.

Any suggestions on how to improve? And yea I am currently focusing on my DevOps skills too.

[lost fern]

If you are into photovoltaics and into python you should look at pvlib https://pvlib-python.readthedocs.io/en/stable/

[fringe sphinx]

https://www.google.com/search?q=imposter+syndrome+site%3Areddit.com%2Fr%2Flearnprogramming You're in good company.

[near ocean]

Why can't you refuse the exit interview? You gain nothing from doing it

[fringe sphinx]

Lots of people feel this way. You are good enough. There are many jobs and roles out there. Keep getting better, but stop telling yourself you aren't good enough. You are good enough.

[fringe sphinx]

Say nothing bad. All positive. You loved working there, you learned a lot, and hope to work with the team again.

[pastel thunder]

didnt think about it, HR didnt mention it will be this, but this is it, i know

[near ocean]

Decline the invitation or cancel
I really dont see anything positive coming out of an exit interview

[pastel thunder]

said it will be some genereic discussion before leaving, but I know

[fringe sphinx]

In US: It usually is generic. It's usually a formality. They'll usually ask you to sign a release: don't sign anything on the spot, take it home to read it.

[pastel thunder]

cannot say no to somethin she didnt tell me what it is

[shadow badge]

Trying to that for a while.

[fringe sphinx]

What would you like to accomplish?

[near ocean]

I dont understand, they tried to schedule something with you, didnt they?

[shadow badge]

I want to have a remote job that pays well and a good team

[silver jacinth]

if an interview lasts longer than a single interview I just decline. Had to do it recently, if I want to play games I'll just play cs

[fringe sphinx]

Ok. How's your resume?

[silver jacinth]

exit interviews are a waste of time

[shadow badge]

Haven't added my devops skills in that apart from that it is Good (According to me) I can send it you can take a look and give suggestion where necessary

[fringe sphinx]

Sure, but who cares. It's part of your final workday.

[pastel thunder]

first asked me which office I visit, I told it was same as hers (thinking she wanted a laptop etc)
And them boom, she told me to have a meet
I asked why to which she said "discussion"
I cannot decline a "discussion"

[silver jacinth]

still a waste of time if its not paid

[fringe sphinx]

An exit interview is done while you're still employed by the employer, at least in my experience.

[near ocean]

HR is trying to pull a fast one on you
Exit interviews have one purpose and its to put blame for something on you instead of the company

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, stop worry about it. Say nothing bad. If asked about something, just say you were frustrated at the moment, etc.

[fringe sphinx]

In US, it's also to: close out legal documents (ie: general release, final paycheck, etc), ask questions about your experience (get feedback), and for HR to try to get honest answers from exiting employees.

Why would they care about blaming you? Nobody cares about blame.

[near ocean]

They care about the company not being liable for things, theres only one other party in that interaction, you

[fringe sphinx]

That's what the general release is for.

(again, US specific, no idea if it applies to India)

[near ocean]

Why would you sign something just cause HR gives it to you?

[fringe sphinx]

No, but general releases generally have a consideration (otherwise it wouldn't be a valid contract, im not a lawyer but I've paid them a lot of money)

[pastel thunder]

I hope she leaves some stone unturned, lol.
I dont want issues

[fringe sphinx]

You're talking as if you have no agency/autonomy.

[pastel thunder]

this one is a small company

and i dont trust them

[fringe sphinx]

So? You're your own person. I know there's cultural differences, but if someone asks me a tough question, I deflect.

[pastel thunder]

this is a skill, I am trying to learn, people are pretty smooth to ignore on the face, I just become awkward

[fringe sphinx]

I understand: as you get older, you'll (probably) care less about what other people think of you 🙂

[near ocean]

Cant find anything on india at all and google seems to think exit interviews in the US are entirely optional

[smoky quest]

If you feel forced, you can also employ a sort of shit sandwich

Start with something good (ex: you are appreciative of the company and opportunity in learning about X), something not so good but framed positively in terms of opportunity, and then something else good (ex: how you are thankful and will forever appreciate what you learned about X as it will serve you throughout your career)

Not strictly a shit sandwich, but close enough

[fringe sphinx]

lol, that's a great answer

[pastel thunder]

yeah, will do something like this, I hope she does not bring feedback form in between, lol

[fringe sphinx]

Let's say she did: What would you say?

[near ocean]

"im saddened to leave the company but I must expand my horizons with this new opportunity presented to me" and keep repeating it lake laogai style

[silver jacinth]

nah just ghost them

[near ocean]

People cant just turn translucent at will

[silver jacinth]

I did at the companies I worked at

[smoky quest]

this is not super professional

[silver jacinth]

when you're done they just stop paying you and then you no longer work there

[pastel thunder]

the best I can think of is:

1. I think some improvement can be made to make environment more productive and collaborative..... (And mention the criticism in positive manner)
2. ignore

[silver jacinth]

Well those companies I worked there for a day and their standards of work were awful. Otherwise at companies I've worked at for a long time I give 2 weeks

[near ocean]

If people listened to critique they wouldnt wait until the exit interview for it

[silver jacinth]

is it professional to layoff staff without warning?

basically the same thing imo

[smoky quest]

Is it professional to steal a car?
Let's not try to justify random actions with false equivalences

[fringe sphinx]

That's the opposite of what you want: you want a network and positive reputation. Not to alienate people and have them not like you.

[smoky quest]

However a company behaves will reflect on them.
However you leave a company will reflect on you.

You want people to miss you, not be glad you are gone. This is part of building a professional network and behaving professionally

[fringe sphinx]

Work isn't merely a transaction. At least, it shouldn't be if you want a successful career.

[pastel thunder]

my company gave a 10 day notice period on asking for 30)
tells me I wont be missed at all

[smoky quest]

If people are glad you are gone, they won't be your reference, nor will they call you if there is a cool job where you are a good match

[fringe sphinx]

In US, 2 weeks is typical. We can phase anyone (usually) out in 2 weeks. 30 days? That's a long time.

[smoky quest]

That's better than them being clingy and you having to politely tell them to fuck off.
You did your part, you behaved professionally and that's great

[silver jacinth]

here you're not obligated to leave notice periods, or letting em know

[pastel thunder]

well, by all means, I am happy for what they did, hope they do more things like this

[near ocean]

Layoffs dont come from the people you work with

[silver jacinth]

the execs do it and they don't care about you

[pastel thunder]

India is different dude, its a recruiters' markets

[silver jacinth]

you're expendable, they don't have time to listen to whining or shaking your hand as you leave the door

[balmy mural]

Companies generally let people leave before their official notice is over here as well if they're able to handover everything in time. Don't think it has anything to do about missing or not missing someone

[smoky quest]

your resignation letter doesn't come from the people you work with either. It comes from you

Let's say an exec fired you. So what? Is it an excuse to behave like an asshole at another company?
The same way you would not work for that exec ever again, people wouldn't want to work with you ever again

[silver jacinth]

nah exec fires you that's good, you get EI + severance

[pastel thunder]

ohh, could be
I mostly hear about managers balckmailing to give termination letter, if notice period is not served satisfactorily

[near ocean]

If your coworkers dont understand an injustice has been committed against you and hold it against you personally theyre assholes and thats that

[silver jacinth]

HR can serve to hide that

if its not documented then it never happened. Look at blizzard

[fringe sphinx]

You have a very toxic view of work and work culture. It will harm your career if you treat your employees, peers and managers with disdain.

[silver jacinth]

it is a realistic stance

[fringe sphinx]

How you behave is your choice.

[silver jacinth]

indeed, but some prefer feeling like corporate slaves

[fringe sphinx]

You can still quit, be friendly about it, and go on to next job. Or, you can quit and be a **** about it.

[silver jacinth]

seen it when I was an assistant manager in retail

they don't think for themselves, just let you direct them around

[near ocean]

I dont think refusing an exit interview makes you an asshole

[silver jacinth]

that's your opinion

[fringe sphinx]

Oh, I never meant to suggest that. I agree, you can decline... politely. Or you can participate... politely.

My point is about how you behave. That's it.

[silver jacinth]

or just leave since you already submitted saying you're not working there

[near ocean]

Well yes, always politely, you dont wanna be rude to HR
Fly under their radar

[silver jacinth]

I'm pretty sure they'll have less paperwork from you saying nothing

[smoky quest]

This is a non sequitur

[silver jacinth]

you just gotta think like the execs if you want to not be exploited

[fringe sphinx]

It's kinda easy. Be positive, don't sign anything without review, and be polite. Nothing complicated.

[silver jacinth]

see earnings slip and you're not talking about cutting cost to some activities you do, then you're out the window

[smoky quest]

The sad part is most people don't know how they think

[silver jacinth]

exactly, too obedient

[fringe sphinx]

I think we're losing the plot now. What does this have to do with OPs question about exit interview?

[smoky quest]

nothing to do with being obedient. People don't know what they don't know and try to explain behaviors in whatever way they can given their tools

[silver jacinth]

it is a pointless event that happens when you're no longer employed

[fringe sphinx]

No, it's an event that occurs when you are still employed.

[smoky quest]

it's not pointless. Both parties can learn, especially from regrettable departures

[silver jacinth]

because they're too reliant on another for telling them what to do, or how to use the tools

no initiative, just dependence

[smoky quest]

oh you didn't get an answer.

In short, whenever an employee leaves a company, HR will schedule a quick chat to discuss the reasons for leaving, their experience, things to improve and get the temperature

yeah pretty standard

[true harness]

who are you talking about? who is "they"

[civic cloak]

[near ocean]

BigEmployer

[silver jacinth]

the employee

[orchid night]

@smoky quest here is the changes I made from your recommendations

going to be making the changes to the skill section soon but I added the projects I thought were meaning and had plenty of content

[smoky quest]

Make it one page 🙂

[sour iron]

could decrease margins

[sonic fox]

hm

[orchid night]

I thought the number of pages doesn’t matter it’s about the content

[smoky quest]

You can expect the first filter to be done in 30-45s

[chilly holly]

import time

def timer(func):
    def wrapper(*args, **kwargs):
        start = time.time()
        result = func(*args, **kwargs)
        end = time.time()
        print(f"{func.__name__} ran in {end-start}time")
        return result
    return wrapper

@timer
def example_function(n):
    time.sleep(n)
    
example_function(2)

[outer pendant]

Hello 👋
I am currently looking for opportunities to collaborate with US citizens (developer +) as a long-term relationship.
I have a compelling suggestion for you.😃

If you are interested in me, we can discuss further steps.
This partnership allows you to benefit financially without the workload, making it a win-win situation for both of us. Looking forward to your positive response.

[strange nova]

!rule paid
Also this seems suspicious

[inner wren]

Rules

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[lilac sundial]

What are somw good beginner projects

Also does every project have to be extremely niche , advanced and original?

Alr lisan

[strange nova]

Making some projects to accomplish what you want to do are fun, make a game you wanted to or automate part of your life!

Just figure out how you will solve problems in your life by writing code

Todo list example lisan gave is decent because you can use the fruits of your code

[lilac sundial]

Are game projects beneficial if i want to be employed as a swe dev

[strange nova]

Depends how you do it. I have games in a web application. Making it interesting from an engineering standpoint is the whole package of putting together backend and frontend software plus solving some problems to make the game

There's people that do graphics programming and etc but that's out of my wheelhouse

[near ocean]

Any project you build would be more beneficial than not having any projects
You could pick projects that are more relevant to what you wanna work with however

[strange nova]

Yeah, if you're a beginner then just go code a bunch of projects haha. Getting good will take a while so relax and have fun. Always be improving yourself

Empty tests folder got it /j

[winter kraken]

I need a logo for my business, which one looks best?

[kindred oyster]

what does this have anything to do with #career-advice ?

[winter kraken]

thanks

[winter kraken]

it will help start my career

Thank you, your advice is much appreciated!

[kindred oyster]

thats not what this channel is for
this channel is for python and the world of work ( for ex getting a job with python), read channel description

[winter kraken]

wheres the offtopic channel?

[kindred oyster]

!topic

[inner wren]

Off-topic channels

There are three off-topic channels:

• #ot0-psvm’s-eternal-disapproval
• #ot1-perplexing-regexing
• #ot2-never-nester’s-nightmare

The channel names change every night at midnight UTC and are often fun meta references to jokes or conversations that happened on the server.

See our off-topic etiquette page for more guidance on how the channels should be used.

[graceful owl]

i've been dev lead for like a few months now at a startup-ish company (only a few devs), i've recently taken the company through doubling our devteam, and they'll be joining soon. at the same time, i'm expecting to receive a job offer for another company that much more aligns with my personal values (for the same salary), am i potentially fucking over my career if it took this new job? i'm concerned of screwing over my company by leaving them without a guide, at a time of big expansion

[faint depot]

I know its a question thats been asked a bazillion times but I want to ask what is the realistic future of ML/AI in the next decade (taking away all the gimmicks and bullshit, which pisses me off when I see them)?

[graceful owl]

ML is a very useful tool that can (and do) solve a lot of very hard problems

LLMs are probably overhyped (imo)

[fringe sphinx]

Everyone is replaceable. I wouldn't stress it. If you're very worried, offer a 1 month. They will counter if you're very important, be prepared for that.

[graceful owl]

i've heard it's risky to accept a counter, since they know you're kind of teetering on leaving, would you agree?

thank you for your advice though :)

[near ocean]

Yes

[fringe sphinx]

I've seen counters work for a few cases, where the company could do something: fix the salary, or offer something (remote work or a different role). Sometimes the company realizes how important you are and fixes it with an appropriate options/salary package; especially a startup.

Conventional wisdom does agree tho: if someone wants to go, a counter may just be a short term bandaid. Depends on the reason.

[near ocean]

I dont think you should ever entertain a counter at a startup especially
Its smaller, people take things more personally
In big corpo youre not taking money from your coworkers, startup "families" might see it that way

(or at least thats my experience)

[graceful owl]

thanks for the insight

[buoyant seal]

Too much cheese in third words
but the logopic itself is cool the third one

First one is just no.

Second.. style of words is meh
and picture looks a bit more trivial, but if to fix things may be it will balance itself to cool

[plush summit]

Takes a long time in some cases or 1 guy needs 2 replacements for example

[graceful owl]

i just feel a little guilty, like i misled my boss :(

[orchid night]

I was told seniors and hiring managers the more higher quality content on the page the better ranking you get on filter pas through

[lapis wind]

yes, but you want higher quality condensed content

Personally I would move the degree/initial education bit at the very top down, move the skills up, and try prune some of the skills list so it is a bit more compact.

Great expectations being on two lines triggers my OCD a bit.

Personally as a dev I know all the skills listed, but for less technical people/recruiters/hr some of them like Seaborn, Great Expectations, Glue (tbh I don't think anyone really cares about glue, it is just kinda something that *exists* which you end up using if you have to) Mage AI, and possibly Hive.

Power BI is a great one to have, maybe try reorganise so that some of the more 'key' skills are presented first?

[finite shoal]

https://discord.com/channels/267624335836053506/1271455543076065323 plz someone help

[faint depot]

Just got rejected from an apprenticeship. Still not heard back from the other apprenticeships I applied. I just want to cry. Constant string of rejections throughout this year since dropping out. Even though Im going back to uni (back up option) in september, i wont be able to afford it

[white scarab]

How transform my past projects into a vibrant showcase, illuminating the path for those in search of adept developers?

[fringe sphinx]

Sorry to hear that. Can't win 100%, hoping for you to get one!

[wraith blade]

Open a only fans trust ez way to fund your college tuition

[peak halo]

please don't make unhelpful jokes about becoming a sex worker.

[wraith blade]

@peak halo is falling 200k in debt to the us government a better alternative

[peak halo]

I'm not entertaining this line of reasoning. your comment was inappropriate--don't make ones like it in the future. thanks in advance.

[junior path]

Do anyone know about Turing's Python Practical Challange?

[peak halo]

Hello, please do not ask to ask. If your question about Turing's Python Practical Challange is related to careers, please ask your actual question.

[junior path]

I want to know that what type of questions they asks in practical challenge. If I failed in the practical challenge then I will not be able to take the challenge again till 90 days

[faint depot]

Hopefully I do. Ive got a back up plan in the worst case scenario where I get total rejection; cancel my uni entry and for the next year while I reapply to apprenticeships, build up my coding portfolio. Ill focus on data analysis/databases (like ive been doing now) and cybersec as i feel itll give a lot of skills which i can carry over to other disciplines

[fringe sphinx]

Any local jobs or things you can do to build some experience? QA? etc?

Not sure if that helps with apprenticeships

[faint depot]

Im nowhere near that level yet. Even though Ive been learning to code for a year, its only been in the last 3 months where Im actually focused and not in tutorial mode. I just want to have at least some decent portfolio projects just to show that I have a good understanding of the basics and Im capable of learning new skills

[fringe sphinx]

QA is an interesting role because there's many levels.

[faint depot]

QA = quality assurance?

[fringe sphinx]

Yah. Generally means "testing".

But ranges from manual testing all the way to development.

It's a good way to learn how the sausage is made, so to speak.

[faint depot]

But it depends on the ease of getting a QA job, even at the entry level. Ill look around if possible. I'm just tired of the constant rejection. Im so close yet, so far

[fringe sphinx]

Yup, I have no idea in your market, but the fact that you're eager to learn and applying to these roles might make you a good QA candidate.

[faint depot]

Itll be good to be in a job where I can actually apply my programming skills and not having to think of projects off the top of my head. Ill have a look around. I am getting a good grasp of using python and sql. Ive got ideas for one of my current projects to advance it a little more. Thanks for the suggestion

[zinc halo]

Guys I'm starting my CSE degree...and wanna learn C in my first year...any resources or tips from you guys?

[carmine haven]

How competitive is cs and is ce less competitive work

[pine sleet]

what exactly do you mean by competitive

[carmine haven]

How hard is it to land a job after graduation. In this scenario assume i have a master’s degree

[pine sleet]

depends on your skills

[carmine haven]

Whats a safer route? Im much more inclined towards cs

[smoky quest]

The safer route is to max out on all the dimensions:

• Have the best grades
• Have the best projects
• Have the best internships

[wispy lichen]

hi i need help w my resume, for my work experience, i was at a research hub for 2 years and i ended up working on diff projects/papers... (projects like interviewing ppl + collecting data, taking transcripts + coding them based on themes seen, analyzing this info, writing papers on all the data, cleaning up data + making it readable through tables, etc, an nlp eda) a lot of the projects i worked on was related to data since im in data science/ml. do i organize my work experience per project or overall? not sure how to go about this since it could be a lot of info

[fringe sphinx]

Generally overall, pick you best projects and try to shape your resume to the jobs you're applying for

[near ocean]

Best grades is easy to define, what are the best projects, the best internships?

[smoky quest]

The ones that help 👏 demonstrate 👏 the 👏 best 👏 skills 👏

[near ocean]

What are the best skills

[sleek kayak]

Getting the best internships is hard :/

[smoky quest]

Makes sense since they are valuable

[sleek kayak]

Yeah

Ideal for me would be a NASA internship.

[fringe sphinx]

Safer is hard to define, but: first - do you understand the difference between cs and ce, and the 'typical' jobs associated with each?

[wicked parcel]

Hello! I am a 21 y/o information tech student in Argentina. I want to pursue my career as a backend developer. I am quite interested in Python frameworks such as FastAPI, Flask, Django, etc. My question is. Which one should I choose? why? Do I need to know some html/css or I dont need to? Do you have any udemy course or any other material to start my learning? Thanks a lot!

[pine sleet]

it doesn't really matter too much. a lot of the concepts transfer over

[deft pelican]

If you are doing web dev, it's always useful to know at least some html basics.

[deft herald]

Useful? I'd say it's essential

[vapid jay]

I use Python

[wind cedar]

If I become a TA for the first time during the fall semester for my resume, is it still worth doing over the spring semester? Is there any value in doing it during the spring semester if I already did it during the fall semester for the first time? Should I focus on other things instead after doing it for the fall semester already? (As a university student)

[true harness]

why do you want to be a TA to begin with

[wind cedar]

why does that matter?

[true harness]

how else can we determine if it's worth it?

[wind cedar]

for my resume to have new experiences for next seasons swe recruiting?

[glad sedge]

Anyone have opinions on getting a BS for data analysis or certs and self learning?

[pine sleet]

i would assume the degree would be preferred by employers

[smoky quest]

A degree is the path of least resistance and with the most opportunities and compensation

[smoky quest]

It's all about the 👏 demonstrated 👏 skills 👏

[wind cedar]

So fall sem only is fine?

[smoky quest]

if you can't demonstrate relevant skills beyond that, sure

[wind cedar]

I can’t because it’s the same thing that’s going to happen during the spring sem

[strange nova]

Bruh

Or is it a waste of time from the perspective of transferring

[fringe sphinx]

A two year AA from a community college can be easier to transfer to a 4 year institution. Many state universities have automatic acceptance and transfer rules if you maintain a certain GPA for an AA from a CC

[strange nova]

Fuck bro cant believe I just did like the most shameful FOMO of all time. I need to practice math right now

[fringe sphinx]

Look at your state university, and look for their transfer policies for community colleges

[fringe sphinx]

Which type of math?

[strange nova]

Minimum acceptable GPA for automatic acceptance transfer 2.25 😂

But idk the ins and outs of if I'd get all the courses I need

Whatever the hell AAS in programming is

And that university is sooooo expensive

well practice math and need to apply for jobs 💀

This is cooked. 🍳

Is it even possible to do this shit and work full time

[fringe sphinx]

Many people work while going to community college.

[true harness]

many people work while going to college

[strange nova]

https://tenor.com/view/drunk-drinking-dui-omg-ricksanxhez-gif-14618491

Just need to focus on two things right now: practice my shit, apply jerbs.

[strange nova]

I guess I'll be starting doin this shit in 10 days 💀

[true harness]

doing what

[strange nova]

Programmer school unless I find a reason to cancel it

Like ay idk what I'm doing I FOMO like I said

[true harness]

what's the program you're doing?

[strange nova]

"AAS in programming" I think

Maybe I should've looked into what courses that entails

Just seemed like the most relevant option they had in the clicky box

But an applied associate degree might be bad?

Concerned that it might waste a lot of time

[true harness]

for education, you should be looking to get theory

also..I would highly recommend finding out what you're signing up for, especially if it will cost you money and time

[strange nova]

There's...engineering. none of these IT things really say anything about transfer like the engineering degree does. Not advertising it at least

[true harness]

you could ask

[strange nova]

Uhhhh... 😂 this stuff seems fun but now im hella wary of this 💀

This is like a playground

[tawdry merlin]

xd

wassup guys

[tranquil storm]

Nearly every developer job I have seen posted lists a Bachelor's degree in Computer Science or related field. That's why I'm working on mine. I was able to transfer my Associate's Degree and complete it in a little over a year. Yes, it can be done without the degree, but the degree is the path of least resistance. I'm also in a fortunate situation where my employer is paying for it.

[tawdry merlin]

careers scare me

[true harness]

seems a bit basic for 2 years

[tawdry merlin]

why if a person likes rust he becomes a simp

[strange nova]

Yea I'll be fucked when it comes to transfer right? no math credits

[true harness]

well, I have no idea what this program is, so I don't know

[strange nova]

Idk wym.

[tranquil storm]

Seems like an associates program should include all the gen ed courses. Math, history, writing, etc.

[true harness]

it means I don't know

[strange nova]

Yea i have a feeling this shit would end up costing me like an entire year of wasted time 💀

[tranquil storm]

Transfer credit is more dependent on the institution you are transferring to than anything else. Some schools have more generous transfer policies than others.

Accreditation matters too. You don't want to go to a school that isn't accredited.

Knowing your stuff and having projects to demonstrate that are key. But having the degree is the easiest way to get your stuff looked at. I looked at the current job market, job postings all wanting a Bachelor's Degree, the layoffs, etc. Then decided taking the time to get my degree is worth it and the market will likely improve when I'm done.

[strange nova]

Did you not apply because of the requirements?

[strange nova]

I'm sending in a ticket about it to the schewl

[true harness]

a ticket ?

[tranquil storm]

I haven't. Some of the postings aren't from actual companies either. Many of them are from recruiting agencies. I'm also quite new to software development. I really started diving into it in October. Although I have messed with quite a few things on and off over the years, but nothing I feel confident in showcasing.

The more I learn, the more I want to learn because there is so much I don't know.

Plus, my employer paying for my degree is a huge benefit. That would be hard to walk away from.

[strange nova]

Oh yeah thats cool!

[strange nova]

Nvm. I think this school just sucks in general and im gonna call it off. There's no guaranteed transfer of associate degree in my state. All of these "IT degrees" seem like a waste of time.
Saw some stats that it take average of 7.6 years to finish for transfer students in this state

[strange nova]

@fringe sphinx what u think about this + message above

There's some transfer program with school they are linked up with but idk what is accepted, I guess that's what I'll ask about as the last attempt.

Ight sweet i fired that email off now back to apply for jobs 🙂 don't really think this degree is for me but fingers crossed that their transfer program is magical I guess 😂

Can just imagine the uni being like "Oh yea we'll just wave our hands at all the general credits, you're good to go"

I think the only option at this place would be "associate of science", which would have nothing to do computer science

Watchu think @smoky quest

[smoky quest]

I think a degree is the path of least resistance and with the most opportunities and compensation

Now that we got it out of the way, what's the question?

[strange nova]

To "associate of regular ass science" from college with some hope of transfer, or not to do any at all. I ask about this "AAS" but I highly doubt it's not gonna waste years of time.

[smoky quest]

it's better than not having any degree. I would encourage to push for a bs if you can though. Or if that AAS can be transferred later on for a bs

[strange nova]

Yeah knock on wood about the latter 😂. I'm feeling content though, this was a good exercise in free will.

[smoky quest]

nice!

[smoky quest]

It also gives something to look forward to

[strange nova]

I'm seeing an estimated 53 credits from the AAS degree when adding them all to a tool from an online school

[pine sleet]

sounds about right

[smoky quest]

bro, I take people once they graduate from school, not before. So I have no idea what 53 credits mean

[pine sleet]

associates is about half of a BS

[smoky quest]

Is it good? Is it bad? Can you eat it?

[pine sleet]

i dunno,can you eat half a bachelors?

[smoky quest]

depends if you want to cook with them

[strange nova]

Lol I mean that I guess u need 120

can enter the courses from the other degree they offer in now.

This science degree seems like a bunch of boring stuff tho 💀

[smoky quest]

what kind of science are we talking about? the computer kind?

[strange nova]

No like all general "extended high school" stuff

Oh in the second year you can choose some computer science electives

[smoky quest]

nice!

[strange nova]

I can get like 10-15% more credits with that but a lot of the courses are bloody stupid

Like having to write a report on US history and go cite sources for that 💀

So 10-15% more saving me 5-7.5% of my time I guess if I did the whole Bs

This sucks 😂

[smoky quest]

you can also look for more CS focused classes
bro could be stacked

[dark shell]

is it legal if i sell the chatgpt macos desktop app client i made with pyqt5

[strange nova]

Gotta be really careful to abide by the licenses of everything you used

[dark shell]

ok

is it legal to put it on github with an MIT liscense

[true harness]

just because it's called "associates of science" doesn't really matter if the classes are good

[strange nova]

👍 won't get to do any fun computer stuff at all in the first year 😩

[true harness]

most BS CS programs have geneds as well, in the US

[strange nova]

But get more credits transferable to online partner which saves time and money, also there was some sort of stupid certificates in the programming associates I don't need. Save $4000 on those unless I was reading that wrong

I think I'm just thrown off by their numbers being slightly off like "45 + 16 hrs = 60" ,"1150 + 3105 = $4140" great table design 👍

I wish I could just get started right now

https://tenor.com/view/dmx-bark-gif-11280912

[true harness]

i would advise to look into options like loans and scholarships to offset the cost

[torn magnet]

You typically don’t do CS first year. Fundamentals first. Maths, physics, chem, and some liberal arts. They are necessary subjects.

[strange nova]

I hate 3/4 of those subjects

Idk what a liberal art is vs a regular one 😂

But now that I think of it chemistry could be pretty sweet

[fringe sphinx]

Look at the curriculum (courses) for a bs in cs. You should know that for your target Uni

[torn magnet]

The math courses are necessary. A code monkey will be fine without it, but if one wants to develop beyond that, then I expect them to understand those subject. Of course, it is not necessary to learn them only thorough a degree course, but they should know it.

[white scarab]

Hello Everyone,

Throughout my career, I have gained extensive expertise working with an array of technology stacks:

Core technologies: Python, Node.js, Blockchain, React.js, Vue.js, Django
Mobile development skills: React Native, Flutter, SwiftUI
Blockchain and Web3: web3.js, Solidity
Frontend and styling: Next.js, Nuxt.js, Angular, Tailwind CSS
Graphics and Web Rendering: Three.js, WebGL
Backend and More: MERN stack, Rust, Nest.js, GLSL, PHP

These capabilities have been utilized across eclectic sectors - e-commerce, finance, IoT, AI, health tech - to tailor efficient, industry-specific solutions.

How to transform my past projects into a vibrant showcase, illuminating the path for those in search of adept developers?

Regrettably, server rules prevent sharing URLs but I'm open to DMs if anyone wants a deeper insight into my projects. I eagerly anticipate opportunities where my skills and experiences can foster growth and deliver impactful results. Reach out!

[warm merlin]

hi hi hi im having problem with this basic python code, can anyone tell me whats the solution to fix it pls

[near ocean]

First you put down the thesaurus
Next up, you could build a portfolio site to showcase your projects, github or other code hosts arent for showing what your product does
You could then include links to this portfolio in your social media and CV

[acoustic plaza]

Whats a data scientist?

[peak halo]

There is no consensus as to what a data scientist is or does.

[acoustic plaza]

I worded it wrong i mean what they do but u said no consensus as to what they do

[peak halo]

Same answer. Two people can have "data scientist" their job title and have zero overlap in their job responsibilities.

The term was created relatively recently and is mostly hype.

[acoustic plaza]

Oh ok

[torn magnet]

Usually to give you some breadth of understanding useful to you as a citizen. You take courses like economics, literature, sociology, poli sci, history, etc.

[acoustic plaza]

I still don't know what i wanna do with computer science
Im looking maybe software engineer or front end developer but still not sure bc not enough experienced with coding languages and projects

[torn magnet]

You learn some in school. But you also take them in college/university in America.

If you only want to program, then take a boot camp. If you want to expand your knowledge, go to university. Otherwise, waste of money, if you go to the wrong place.

[peak halo]

Do you have or are you currently pursuing a CS degree?

[acoustic plaza]

Nah still in school

[torn magnet]

In the USA, it is a bit broader.

[acoustic plaza]

But when i enter sixth form(uk version of junior and senior years i think)
Ill be doing
Computer science
Maths
Further maths

Cause unis like oxford and cambridge and other top unis here would like them for Computer science courses

[torn magnet]

You can get minors here too…but in under graduate, you usually take courses that are broad in year 1 and year 2 before getting more and more focused.

[peak halo]

@acoustic plaza so you have time to decide. Try different things and see what interests you most.

[true harness]

even in the US, you're still going to be taking intro programming and intro math courses your first years

[acoustic plaza]

Ye
Ill just continue learning python before moving onto a different language and continue like that till uni starts

[torn magnet]

Then just go take boot camp. A university is not worth it for you.

[acoustic plaza]

Maths is a big part for computer science right?

[torn magnet]

Math is important for any stem field.

[acoustic plaza]

I thought boot camps wasnt worth it

[torn magnet]

It is not about being related to cs. It is about expanding your understanding of human society.

[torn magnet]

Depends on the boot camp. I am just saying that in America, if you want to learn hardcore cs and software programming knowledge, you go take boot camp like courses. If you want an education not training, then go to a university. If you go to the wrong place, expecting something different, you will be disappointed.

[acoustic plaza]

I wanna go uni
But i also want training

[peak halo]

Bootcamps aren't an alternative to a university education if you don't already have a degree or experience.

[torn magnet]

Then you need to do both (which is what I did).

[true harness]

no... in the US bootcamps don't teach you anything other than practical skills

[acoustic plaza]

Are some good bootcamps online

[torn magnet]

Right. This is what I mean.

[torn magnet]

Try Udemy or zero to mastery.

[acoustic plaza]

K

I do want to go to university 100%

[torn magnet]

Both ztm and Udemy are good…if you want to learn practical skills. If you want an education, go to university.

[acoustic plaza]

Ill just do both simultaneously when i do go to university

[true harness]

you don't need a bootcamp when you're in uni. just learn stuff on your own on the side

[acoustic plaza]

Whats that

[true harness]

things like math, physics

[torn magnet]

In the USA, most universities have them. You can’t avoid it.

[acoustic plaza]

Thought they would be related to cs or maths

Idk how many u can do for uni but ill maybe try do maths alongside cs

[torn magnet]

Are you in the USA?

[acoustic plaza]

Uk

[true harness]

sociology is great. i was considering it for a double major after i took a gened in it

[torn magnet]

Then my advice on university is not relavent to you.

[acoustic plaza]

Oh ok

[torn magnet]

CS undergraduate degree is incredible easy in a typical university. If you have gone through the rigors of another stem degree, cs degree becomes a bit of a joke,

[fringe sphinx]

I want to disagree, but man, my EE friends had much harder classes.

Higher education has always believed that their job is more than vocational: that well rounded graduates is their responsibility

Universities will set certain requirements for all majors, such as writing and literature, etc

[fringe sphinx]

Taking one college level literature course seems pretty reasonable. Years ago, the core curriculum was larger in most uni's.... modern programs are leaner

Also, liberal arts degrees were also far more common

[torn magnet]

MIT is a private university, so I cannot know for sure. I suggest looking at any public university.

Yes

[burnt atlas]

Really?

[torn magnet]

MIT, Harvard, brown, Stanford, etc…are all private.

[fringe sphinx]

https://mitadmissions.org/discover/the-mit-education/general-institute-requirements/

General requirements exist at most Uni's

[torn magnet]

The number of cs degree holder who can’t write worth a damn is too numerous. Imagine if they didn’t even have that literature course.

The Santa Cruz one looks more like a typical university.

[fringe sphinx]

What?

[torn magnet]

The courses there are the required course. You still have to take more physics electives than that. And the liberal arts subjects.

[fringe sphinx]

No, that's are the gened course requirements for all students

"However, as a rule of thumb, you can generalize that about half of your time at MIT will be spent taking the GIRs, and about half of your time will be spent specializing in your course(s) of study. "

[torn magnet]

Which is more or less what public univ do as well.

[fringe sphinx]

Cambridge or oxford doesn't have similar requirements?

[torn magnet]

Yes. USA is different.

[pine sleet]

some universities do this (mine did) but i don't think its common

[torn magnet]

I mean you can always take a cs courses in the first year or even take sophomore year courses in the first year. But you start to me more dedicated about halfway through sophomore.

[fringe sphinx]

But are there overall course requirements beyond those specific to the degree?

[torn magnet]

If you have literally never done any programming before UG …such as in school..you would take an intro to programming course.

Dude, the UK degree is only 3 years. Basically they do the same stuff we do minus the lib ed

[unkempt egret]

guys help i know literally nothing about coding in any form im 15 and im interested in learning from scratch but i have no clue how to start what would i need to do if im starting today and how do i get started. any tips?

[torn magnet]

It is. But a liberal arts background can expand your horizon beyond just how to program. You don’t typically learn how people think, color theory, people’s psychological preferences, effect of technology on a population ,etc in a pure cs or technical course.

[fringe sphinx]

#python-discussion is the channel for you! Just ask, and they'll give you some places to learn from

[fringe sphinx]

Philosophy is one of those courses I'm forever happy I took, but would never have chosen it if I didn't have to

[shy oasis]

hiiiiiiiiiiii

[torn magnet]

Sure. But you are not their target audience. Majority of ameicans don’t go past an undergraduate degree. And they don’t tell you what specific course to take for the lib Ed’s. They just have some categories you need to satisfy. You pick the course that you want based on the category requirement, if you know you don’t want sociology, you might take something else.

[torn magnet]

Yes. And I think that is part of the point.

Depends on your university probably. And note, this is only for undergraduate. Masters, and phds don’t have this requirement. It is more focused by then. But I would say each category had at least 20 classes to pick from…and maybe you needed one or two courses from those categories. So there is some choice.

No. We have minors. Minors are more focused on a specific field. For example you could take a degree in Cs and a minor is math, but your additional requirements are all math for the minor. Liberal arts requirements aren’t a specialization.

Basically think of it as a year worth of study on subjects that are non stem.

[fringe sphinx]

Technically, I think you'd say they're 'general education requirements' not 'liberal arts', since some of them are science

[torn magnet]

That maybe. And maybe it depends on the school. In my school, they had a biology program within the liberal arts. They also has a stem biology school which was different.

[fringe sphinx]

Also, the Uni will have some general req's, and then the college too. So, college of engineering will have additional geneds (science, certain maths, etc) on top of the Uni

[torn magnet]

I pretty much consider those part of the core degree. Why would you want an educated cs person without an understanding of linear algebra and calculus.

[fringe sphinx]

Fair, altho some engineering colleges end up requiring 3 or 4 calcs whereas others only 2

[unkempt egret]

thanks man

[torn magnet]

Probably. Math 3 and 4 is linear algebra and multivariable calc. Perhaps some fields don’t need that quite as much.

[unkempt egret]

thats quite helpful im going to follow some of the videos you recommended on youtube

[torn magnet]

Multivariable calc is not something I have used in cs that much. But math 3 linear algebra, I have used.

[fringe sphinx]

Oh I meant calc,,, I had to take 1,2,multi and diffeq.

[fringe sphinx]

When you get stuck, ask for help in PyDis, lots of beginners here

[torn magnet]

Yes. Differentiation, integration, linear algebra and multivariable calculus.

[unkempt egret]

thanks

[dusk niche]

Should I know about cloud architect?

[peak halo]

you mean cloud architecture, the concept, or cloud architect, the occupation?

[dusk niche]

Occupation

[peak halo]

why do you think you need to know about it?

[dusk niche]

I'm curious to know about it

[peak halo]

why would someone here tell you not to know about something that interests you?

[pastel thunder]

maybe he wants to know from us, maybe some one who is working as cloud architecture.

[orchid night]

@smoky quest thoughts?

[smoky quest]

about?

looks like it's written by corporate cosplayers

[whole flare]

[viral dragon]

Is there a place to try bot commands?

[twilit portal]

https://discord.com/channels/267624335836053506/267659945086812160

[viral dragon]

Yeah thank you

[peak halo]

"can anyone who is a cloud engineer tell me if cloud engineering is worth pursuing as a career in the current climate?" Is a different question from "should I even bother to learn about what cloud engineers do?"

[unkempt egret]

What jobs are there out there that can develop from learning to code using python

[raw mantle]

https://learn.deeplearning.ai/courses/ai-python-for-beginners/lesson/1/introduction

[tulip vector]

what does a typical job as python look like?

[peak halo]

There is no "python job". There are jobs doing different things, that might involve Python to varying extents.

[tulip vector]

@peak halo Thanks , i framed the question wrong but you got what i meant..I m diving head first into programming and i kinda need a role model

[peak halo]

role model, or mentor?
do you have a family member who's a developer?

[tulip vector]

I dont mind Sir Role model ...mentor ...i need all the help i can get... yes i do ... i saw him work and i told myself i will do this.I dont know how to get him to help because i feel he is doing his own thing and might not have time to help

[strange nova]

Just figure it out and do it then. Your friends might help a bit along the way.

[tulip vector]

@strange nova i dont have any friend in I.T ...Thats why i am here.

I completed an IT admin course and I just enrolled in the google system administration and IT infrastructure service afterward i want to get the crash course on python yet i feel i need a community that i can relate with

[vital wyvern]

You might want to find... some IT related communities. Python has applications in IT, but the people in those communities can probably help you more than we can.

[lilac sundial]

Is even like 3 months of work exp good to have on ur resume

[balmy spade]

Any work experience is good to have on your resume.

[smoky quest]

It's all relative.
Showing you only had a job for 3months prior to getting fired? not good
Showing you have had a 3 months internship? pretty good

[lilac sundial]

Yeah i meant the second one sorry

[lilac sundial]

Is it important that i intern in a big and known company

Or are startups and the likes good as well

[pine sleet]

what you do is more important

its very possible that you could intern at a large company, and not do much of value, or work at a startup, and work on a lot of things that improve your skills

[smoky quest]

It's far more important what you do rather than which cafeteria you will have you lunch at

[lilac sundial]

Mhmm

Plus this one is work from home with a high salary

[smoky quest]

I wouldn't do an internship from home. Wasted opportunity to learn more about how a company works and to learn from coworkers

[summer roost]

I say this as someone who works from home: the earlier you are in your career, the more beneficial it is to work in the same physical space as your teammates. You will learn a lot more from them if there's less friction in talking to them

you might think "but if I ever have a question, I can just ask them" and sure, that's true, but you're much more likely to ask them if they're sitting next to you and asking why you just groaned than if you need to start a Zoom call

[smoky quest]

you also don't get to overhear or observe

[summer roost]

yep, that too

[smoky quest]

you also don't get to sit at the lunch table across from the CTO or architect or a marketing person and hear what they are up to

[summer roost]

I like a lot of things about working from home, but the biggest downside for me is that I know it has put me in a position where it's much harder to mentor more junior teammates. Remote mentorship takes far more effort and still achieves worse results

[lilac sundial]

Im in a crappy part of india where people dont even speak english. Plus i would have to relocate and that is NOT an option atm

I absolutely agree with what you say , i do. Its just that i dont have the faculty to do so atm

[summer roost]

If it's your only option, it's better than no internship. But it does sound like you should be planning to relocate eventually

[smoky quest]

It's entirely up to you. It won't affect me either way.
You are aware of some of the trade off and then you have to do what's best given your situation

[lilac sundial]

Mhmm

[vapid jay]

How much does new freelancers earn per hour

[teal viper]

@sage jungle

[white relic]

freelance work doesn't pay by the hour

[vapid jay]

Then by what

@white relic ?

[white relic]

You can look on sites like upwork to see what jobs are going for

you will almost certainly spend most of your time pursuing more work, not doing work

[vapid jay]

No bother like how much will I earn In a week I have learned python

[white relic]

especially starting out, for established people with contacts it can be different

[vapid jay]

@white relic ?

[white relic]

no need to ping, am still right here

[umbral frigate]

It's quite hard for newbies to get the attention needed to get some work.

[vapid jay]

So how much I am 17

[umbral frigate]

I thought you were 14?

[vapid jay]

I have learned python for software development

[umbral frigate]

Again, it's not really a fixed amount. It changes depending on what people want, and your popularity as a freelancer.

[white relic]

It depends on how much time you spend pursuing jobs, how much you are willing to charge and how good a job you do advertising / selling your skills to potential clients

[vapid jay]

No like what for newbies

[white relic]

There isn't really a meaningful way to quote an average

[vapid jay]

Give me an estimate

[umbral frigate]

For newbies, you probably are looking at maybe 1 to 2 clients a month? It really depends.

[white relic]

The programming gig economy is very competitive.

[umbral frigate]

You can't really be certain for a paycheck each week/month. Freelancing is usually a side hustle and can't really be a sustainable form of income.

[vapid jay]

I just want some motivation should I start or not or I should work at my local shop

[white relic]

do you need money?

[umbral frigate]

If you do need money for school, consider an actual job, and have freelancing as a secondary option to get some extra bucks when somebody pops up.

[vapid jay]

Yes I want for education just give me an estimate for example from this to this

[umbral frigate]

Relying on freelancing, especially for a scholarship, is quite risky. And trying to do it with limited knowledge in Python and with limited experience in contract work, it wouldn't be feasible.

[vapid jay]

No I have knowledge in python and I am not on scholarship I

Can U please give an estimate from this to this

[umbral frigate]

I really can't. My advice is to just get a stable income at a job that you can easily work for.

[vapid jay]

Minimum please

[white relic]

$0.00

[vapid jay]

Just shut up men

[umbral frigate]

You don't have a 100% guarantee that you'll get money.

[white relic]

I'm serious

[umbral frigate]

You're competing against people that have been in freelancing for years with a large audience and reasonable skill. It won't be easy.

[white relic]

freelance is an unreliable source of income, especially starting out

[vapid jay]

I am just saying I will do freelance for one year at newbie level then I will do freelance in intermediate level after experience

[umbral frigate]

It's always an easy option to set up and try, but if you need money for your schooling, then you probably should try to look for a job that might not pay well but has a guaranteed paycheck.

And we are being serious, not trying to deter you from doing freelancing. It isn't easy to build up enough clients to be able to be a significant figure in the market.

[vapid jay]

He pays 20usd per month how will I give tution fess from it

[white relic]

Around here, foodservice is a good popular option

[plush summit]

Personally i would Just work then and study in free time

[umbral frigate]

And you could always try tutoring your peers at school.

[plush summit]

Usa?

[white relic]

Yes.

[umbral frigate]

If you're 17, then you could try teaching people younger than you at your school.

[white relic]

I know some high schoolers lucky enough to get paid technical internships but they are the rare exception

[plush summit]

How much do they make i make 15 in europe a hour

[white relic]

Uh I'm not sure actually but probably not much more than that

Minimum wage here is $13

(varies by state)

[plush summit]

👍 im 19 btw

[fast fossil]

well, that's assuming you don't pay for advertising and such 😬

[stiff crag]

Hey

Can someone introduce me to data science?

[fringe sphinx]

Kaggle.com/learn is one place to start

[stiff crag]

k

[topaz rain]

I just finished learning a full stack course and I'm good in it but, to get jobs online is quite convincing, guys how do I go about it

[buoyant seal]

portfolio web site is a good start, especially for the full stack frontend job roles.

when u hire art drawer u check their portfolio. So... same for frontend dev roles is legit

[topaz rain]

Okay just front-end and I should post on GitHub is that all???

[glacial prism]

I like coding, but I can't fully commit to it. I'm getting bored, what should I do?

[near ocean]

You dont need to make a career out of it then

[dapper bane]

I am working on my resume

[glacial prism]

What should I do to get a Job in IT?

[dapper bane]

learn some programming start with python basics

[glacial prism]

I have trouble staying focused and get easily bored when I'm trying to learn it I don't know why

[dapper bane]

do something in programming u r passionate about that u have interest in

[near ocean]

First you should make sure that you like whatever youre trying to make into a career
Next you should go to #bot-commands , do !resources and pick a beginner resource from the list and go through it
You should also go get a degree in CS

[dapper bane]

@turbid bobcat u there ?

[topaz rain]

Bro I just finished my full stack course and I'm kinda confused in getting a job

[dapper bane]

u in india by any chance ?

[topaz rain]

No

[dapper bane]

make a project with skills u learned and then start applying on internships

and entry level jobs

[topaz rain]

Where exactly, cus I've tried LinkedIn and I didn't have any progress at All

[dapper bane]

there must be a site specific to ur county or region apply in ur region to get some advantage

maybe once u get a job then u can start applying on remote roles

i did the opposite though i got a remote role first

now applying to better remote jobs

[fringe sphinx]

What country? What other education/experience do you have? And how's your resume look?

[dapper bane]

wassup billy nice seeing u

[topaz rain]

I don't even know where to start

[dapper bane]

make a project first a really nice one

[topaz rain]

Nigeria, just full stack

[fringe sphinx]

What's full stack? What 'course'?

[topaz rain]

Can I upload it here

[dapper bane]

I hope u dont reveal any personal information by mistake

[topaz rain]

HTML, CSS, JavaScript, python, Django and some other frameworks like tailwind and I did flask too

[dapper bane]

ok that is very good for an internship

[fringe sphinx]

No I mean, what course did you take?