career-advice

[hybrid sage]

You don't know that.

[fringe sphinx]

The recession fears have subsided, and hiring is trending upwards

The overhiring has been dealt with. Only thing left is high interest rates

[hybrid sage]

You don't know that tho??

[fringe sphinx]

And i don't really worry about averages: we're in a highly technical field that rewards excellence.

[fringe sphinx]

What don't I know? Which part?

[true harness]

unless you're average which is most developers

[hybrid sage]

The high interest rates.

[balmy spade]

You are correct. Nobody knows the future. Historical evidence suggests, however, we aren't looking at a complete collapse of society in the immediate future.

[fringe sphinx]

(I'm not meaning to sound combative, genuine discussion)

[smoky quest]

That won't prevent hiring

[fringe sphinx]

I said high interest rates remain high. That's a fact, no?

In other words, I agree that high interest rates will dampen a recovery.

[wheat hatch]

Multiple factors, the most impactful for me being the war in ukraine. Electricity, food, gasoline, shipping prices all went up as a result of the war, and they have not dropped much yet.

Not really no. Economy was fucked during covid. So many layoffs and hiring stops.

[blissful falcon]

Senior Python Contractor for the past 10 years mainly working with UK Public clients and finance sector and here is my take on in: Over the past few years, the rates had been extremely good for contractors, from 2017 onwards we saw increases from £350 to £500 then £700 in 2022. However as it currently stands, after layoffs from big tech giants, the demand for contractors have decreased drastically. I've known really talented contractors whom not even considered going below 700 per day to desperately looking for full time roles on £80K per year. The market isn't that great but its picking up.

I saw it in that past, high interest rates definitely had a big impact on this I would say as companies are looking ways to cut spending, from economics terms, everything is pretty much chained, so there isn't a safe bet in any industry.

It's all interconnected, that's how global economy works from what I understand, high rates mean people are spending less which overall directly effects the whole economy and thus companies are trying to save capital rather than start on PoC work for solutions they need

Absolutely

[wheat hatch]

Government contracted industries tend to be less effected by interest rates. Private sector can be very dependent on it.
For industries which rely on consumption a high interest rate means people tend to consume less, meaning less sales, meaning less income. It's like murat say.
For industries where borrowing is more of a thing the interest rates directly impacts their revenue.

[smoky quest]

money was so cheap that any random idea could get funded and companies did not really had to have healthy balance sheet. They could use that to fund growth.
Now that investors could put their money in areas with higher interest rate, it forces the companies to straighten up their businesses

[wheat hatch]

That's still the case with the AI bubble though. Drop the word AI or Algorithm in your idea and you won't have much issues getting funded.

[smoky quest]

it's not mutually exclusive 😉

if anything, imagine how worse it could be with even higher access to investment

[balmy spade]

AI is also not quite the magic word some think it is. You still need to put a ton of effort toward proving the value-risk assessment to your investors.

[wheat hatch]

I was mainly objecting to companies "straightening up their business" haha. In my experience they just moved into AI instead haha

[balmy spade]

AI, when applied to the correct problems, is a value pivot that few companies can ignore right now.

[smoky quest]

some companies let go entire departments to make room for AI/ML related teams

[wheat hatch]

You're preachign to the choir. There's a running joke at work that one of my scripts is "AI-enabled" because it uses a linear interpolation 😂

[wheat hatch]

That's interesting, which ones did that?

[fringe sphinx]

All companies are. Companies borrow money all the time. Interest rates go up, then cost of borrowing goes up, which means purchasing power goes down. Same with buying houses

[fringe sphinx]

Remember the Long Island blockchain ice tea company?

(Sometimes buzzwords have real financial value)

[balmy spade]

Everyone who has taken a bite out of the hype feast of AI wants to add it to "everything". That's unfortunate but it is how hype works. Smart companies are adding it to things that can actually benefit from it.

[balmy spade]

I remember the back-to-back-to-back hackweeks of teams wanting me to help them add blockchain to absolutely everything for no reason other than "but blockchain!"

[fringe sphinx]

Did I tell you about my project (didn't go forward) for blockchain for chicken provenance?

[balmy spade]

You didn't! Oh wait... I have a meeting. Um... I'll be... I'll be right back...

[fringe sphinx]

Apple has about 100B in total debt.

They also have something like 30B in cash

[bronze sinew]

Hi is it worth trying to prepare for python full stack developer OR wastage of time?

[gritty rivet]

Prepare how? Are you considering a CS degree?

[fringe sphinx]

It's called leverage. Having revenue streams gives you the ability to borrow against future revenue, which allows you to invest more and grow/etc.

I also agree it's a shell game, or house of cards, or whatever.

[bronze sinew]

For interviews, a 2-3 month period, not a degree

I think many football clubs also do so, the idea is if you are in debt you are exempted from certain type of taxes, hence stay in debt, they can pay if they want I think but they will not

[gritty rivet]

You have no degree but want to get hired 2-3 months from now as a full stack developer? Not much chance unless you've already put together an outstanding portfolio

Especially in this market

[bronze sinew]

I am currently doing my masters in IT

Companies will start to come in 2-3 months, that's what I am trying to say

[gritty rivet]

Ok, so 2-3 months to build a portfolio, update your resume, etc.? That's probably doable. Of course we know nothing else about your situation, goals, alternatives, etc.

[bronze sinew]

I have done my btech in EE, done 3-4 projects on electrical equipments, done a python DSA course
GOAL : get a job in either software development or as data analyst
Also open for ML AI engineer

[kindred oyster]

this all is very scatterd atm , you should decide on 1 thing and focus on that

[bronze sinew]

I c

[kindred oyster]

( i am making an assumption here that OP doesnt actually know much since they said they have just done a DSA python course )

so i would focus first on actually learning the thing , making projects in it

[bronze sinew]

Actually I have also done 3 courses on ML and 1 project, but dont know about what kind of work companies will demand

[kindred oyster]

3 courses on ML ? why so many ?

[bronze sinew]

College was giving an option, so i did in my btech

[kindred oyster]

ohh , so its in your curriculum itself , good

[gritty rivet]

Easy mystery to solve... You should look at the job listings in your local area.

[bronze sinew]

These are all coursera certified, since my college collabed with coursera during covid period

[kindred oyster]

do you understand ML ? would be able to do stuff on your own if asked to?

what i am trying to understand is , do you know what you are donig in ML ?

[bronze sinew]

Not much just have theoretical knowledge

[pastel thunder]

Is it a bad idea to be a SDE but keep changing the role, for example one job in backend, then maybe C++ EDA, then ML,
Etc etc

[bronze sinew]

I understand all mathematics but dont have hand on exp

[kindred oyster]

i would suggest first working on that , since your actual technical knowledge matters
how much you can prove in interview matters.

make some projects , learn how its actually done in practice

[kindred oyster]

how do you plan to get "hirable" knowledge in those fields ? it takes a lott of time to learn different stuff while doing a full time job

[bronze sinew]

Ok will try, thanx for guidance

[pastel thunder]

chips basically, embedded sys

[pastel thunder]

ded on the inside, ambitious on the ouside, kinda people

[kindred oyster]

well even if you do manage to learn that stuff , why the too much hopping 🤷‍♂️
i dont exactly see it as a problem (i could be totally wrong here) , but just why 🤷‍♂️

[pastel thunder]

not aiming for that, wanted to know, if experience would be counted as combined or not

[kindred oyster]

i would expect a question regarding the reason for the constant hopping from web dev to embedded to ML/AI, back to web dev , and whatnot

[kindred oyster]

and when you put out experience for a profile , its usualy "X years of web dev" , in which case ,you cant really combine all of them

maybe if you put it out like "X years of SWE experinece" ,then maybe you can combine them. But your resume would have the breakup of those anyway , so ig it doesnt matter that much 🤷‍♂️

[pastel thunder]

yeah this

i think such people have higher chance of running a new business solving a new problem

probabaly better for someone who doesnt only want to do job their whole life

[hollow merlin]

guys, if i wanna start learning gen AI, is it the right time? is this field gonna be better than ML and data analytics?

[pastel thunder]

yeah, i have seen some people who did 6-7 years of java, they just think they wont be able to do anything else

dont even try or apply elsewhere

[hollow merlin]

Also if yes, then can someone suggest me a proper guide how to start off my journey for it

[pastel thunder]

gen AI come under ML? i believe

[fringe sphinx]

If you want to, of course it's the right time.

[hollow merlin]

Thanks

[pastel thunder]

I am pretty sure its LLM or CV ultimately

[fringe sphinx]

Have you learned Python? How strong are your basic skills?

[hollow merlin]

yes i have learnt. i have moderate to good basics ig

but not much into OOP and all

[fringe sphinx]

I'd suggest developing your skills further through a few projects, otherwise some of the AI tasks might be overwhelming. But, you can always try and see how far you get.

[hollow merlin]

alright, can you let me know how much is sufficient and such?

[buoyant seal]

learn your oop
learn some more advanced topics to know python in wide

https://www.google.fr/books/edition/Clean_Code_in_Python/ZB9sDwAAQBAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&printsec=frontcover
https://www.google.fr/books/edition/Expert_Python_Programming/2tAwEAAAQBAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&printsec=frontcover

learn unit testing

https://www.amazon.com/Test-Driven-Development-Kent-Beck/dp/0321146530
This book teaches practice behind unit testing. On a specific example it walks you through how to have unit testing as part of your development cycle at every moment. It teaches you feeling how much gap between tests is allowed in your working code.

https://www.amazon.com/Unit-Testing-Principles-Practices-Patterns/dp/1617296279

This book teaches theory behind unit testing. For which goals to aim for, how to escape pitifals. It will explain you importance of unit testing and what kind of testing exists. This book is important to weaponize your skills to an average commercial level development.

And do pet projects with writing some dozens thousands of DRY code lines, while having everything unit tested.
Try working with web frameowrks like Django Ninja, and using html/css/htmx
Learn using some relational db like postgres
And u will be around of average python dev

Learn typing to be above average python dev https://careers.wolt.com/en/blog/tech/professional-grade-mypy-configuration

Drink it all with https://www.amazon.com/Code-Complete-Practical-Handbook-Construction/dp/0735619670
To know where to go further on the path of a dev

And practice it again with more projects 🙂

[hollow merlin]

Tysm 🤍

[shrewd parrot]

anyone freelancing here?

[south forum]

Yeah me

[serene merlin]

Sorry if this isnt related to the channel idk what channel to send it in. Ive been coding for about 3 days, is this good? (you cant type but Ill add that when I learn how)

[left jackal]

Me

[wheat hatch]

It's the age old question of specialization vs generalization. In my experience you need a bit of both in varying degrees depending on role.
I've worked in C, C++, Erlang, Ada, Java, Python, Matlab, ASM, R, tcl, and D in my career, and that's just the programming and scripting languages. If I had been specialized in just a single language I would not have been able to perform my work. Different roles might have different requirements, but all my jobs have always involved a mix of languages.

Personally I would not hire someone that only knew a single language unless that individual showed some ability and drive to learn and adapt.

[peak halo]

This is the career discussion channel. You can share code in #python-discussion, but you have to use the paste bin

[shrewd parrot]

How are you getting work? Any good platforms?

[left jackal]

Yes if you are American upwork is brilliant

Don't look at discord freelance servers they are full of scams

[wheat hatch]

It's not imo. Variability just means that you can approach the tasks from different angles.

[left jackal]

In my opinion specialization>>>>>>generalization

[shrewd parrot]

but i heard upwork takes too much time and its very competitive no?

[vapid jay]

I registered in upwork and didnt get my credits

[left jackal]

It is but it pays the best

[wheat hatch]

Frontend work might mean that you can work on the final stages of an ML pipeline a bit easier.

[vapid jay]

@left jackal what you do usually, websites?

When i was searching people was asking for making bots to cassinos and other things

[left jackal]

Websites, algorithms, data analytics

[gritty rivet]

The only real alternative is to have a professional network so you can rely on word of mouth etc.

[left jackal]

Very true

[wheat hatch]

Imo the final stage of actually visualizing the results of the analysis is one of the most important steps

[left jackal]

Never do something shady, always ensure the organisation looks legit. It's better to pass in such cases

[vapid jay]

Im having a hard time applying for jobs

[wheat hatch]

Sorry, for me they are a bit intertwined. But I'm a mostly a backend grease monkey so take everything I say frontend related with a pinch of salt

[native flint]

I want to major in comp sci what careers should I pursue after getting my degree?

[wheat hatch]

Whatever you feel interests you

[native flint]

How can I tell before going all in what interests me

[wheat hatch]

You can't. You learn as you go. That's how I did.

[balmy mural]

Learn some stuff in your own time, build a project or two. See what interests you

[wheat hatch]

Discovered halfway through university that I really liked telecommunications.

Yeah, that's a good advice. Better to start somewhat general and specialize when you find something that you want to work with.

[shrewd parrot]

ok i will try upwork

but i have have need an assitant for it

[vapid jay]

I am registered in upwork but didnt get any connects, I cant start working :v

15 cents of dollars in my currency is 75 cents, and as jobs gets 20 connects, i would have to spend 10brl to try 1 post

[white relic]

realistically, your first job will be what you can get, not what you're most personally interested in. So apply to all kinds of jobs.
As time goes on, you'll learn more about the field you're in and other related fields, and you'll either realize it's actually pretty cool and you want to stay there, or you'll at least be getting experience that you can leverage to switch fields later on.
Specialization really happens once you're in the workforce, trying to rush it rarely works.

[low epoch]

Is anyone good in HTML CSS and javascript here that's online? Need some urgent help with my project for university

[peak halo]

This is the career discussion channel. I recommend joining the "Speak JS" discord server.

[safe coral]

Hi guys I need someone to fine tune my resume please! I have job interviews

[sour tartan]

link it

[safe coral]

I met this very nice guy that works at Amazon! He will help me with my job applications. I don’t need to apply for the positions at all. I will directly go to the interviews but he said he wanted to see my resume

damn I cant upload a pdf here?!

Here you go @sour tartan

[sour tartan]

my first suggestion is that this layout isn't helping you.. The left-hand bar on the first page has email etc wrapped oddly. and the other two pages have nothing in the left-hand bar. so it just makes the whole thing longer than it needs to be. And if anyone prints it out, you will use half their ink.

[safe coral]

okay I can fix that! Anything else?

[sour tartan]

in the education, it's odd to list the same university four times.

it's good to have the quantitative results, people love that.

[safe coral]

I will fix that too! I will not include the minors. Im also planning to omit my job from Turkey. I already omitted my college education from Turkey. Would that be a good idea?

[sour tartan]

i don't think you should skip any job.

[safe coral]

What about college education? Should I skip a degree?

[pine sleet]

Probably fine to omit the ones that aren't really that relevant to the job

[rocky spear]

4

[sour tartan]

which ones aren't relevant?

[safe coral]

I mean which ones are not relevant to Data Science positions? I feel like they are all related

[sour tartan]

me too

[keen rose]

I'm a bit too early in my IT career, but I know I like writing scripts a lot. mostly powershell, recently learning Python. from my resume, do you have any suggestion for which directions I should get into?

[safe coral]

Should I also make a one page for projects?

[sour tartan]

do you have projects that would impress employers? List them.

[bronze gazelle]

Is this a cv or resume?

[sour tartan]

tell us the difference.

or don't

[safe coral]

https://github.com/KadirOrcunAltunel @sour tartan is there anything looking good here?

[keen rose]

does leetcode help you pass technical interviews?

[bronze gazelle]

I'm actually asking because Ive been recently thinking of writing down something that contains all the notable things I've done at my job (for past 5 years), as well as a general description of what I do in general but I honestly don't see the difference other than resume should only be 1 page (which means its more tailored and concise for each job application).

Caydan calls it a resume but its very dense, which is why I asked

It all seems so opinionated but I've read things were like people don't care about projects for example, and Caydan is using practically an entirely second page for that.

[keen rose]

I honestly don't know what to call it lol

But that's not what I was asking for help for lol but I get it

[sour tartan]

resumes don't have to be just one page.

[bronze gazelle]

I was selfishly diverting the question for my own gain. Apparently placing a text box with all white text in background full of keywords for the job you're applying for is the dumb easy way to get past the filters

Read that in some article where a recruiter denied an applicant bc of it but then LinkdIn comments rip em to shreds for it

[keen rose]

I think we all know that trick at this point. That also means bad news, they know it too 😂

[safe coral]

Hows this one? @sour tartan

[whole flare]

I'd suggest cutting down the amount of projects you mention, it seems like it is a lot for a person reading it.

[true harness]

the advice I got was that due to the short time that a resume has to make an impression, anything after a page or two would be only

[peak halo]

the career services director for the engineering school I attended said that the point of resumes is to convince the reader to interview you for the position to which you applied, and unless you're applying to late-career position, you can and should do that in one page.

so can resumes go over a page? sure. but unless you really do have tons of experience that's very relevant to the position you're applying to, you're probably presenting yourself inefficiently.

[whole flame]

I am looking for a opportunity to work as a web developer

React, Nextjs, Express and Django

[buoyant seal]

You have very Ops, Windows, Azure background

As an option u can continue Microsoft path, learning .Net, Azure and dealing with Windowses further. There should be demand depending on your country
But this is the path of very outdated dinosaurs

Ideally u should make a switch to Linux path.
You can go out of Microsoft stack entirely
Or u can try using your Microsoft experience to your advantage and rolling with .net core that has added support for Linux
In this case you should meet Market demand for Microsoft/windows people migrating to more modern Linux server infrastructure.

From there, regardless of when u switch to Linux u could learn common infra tools to be a proper infra dev

Stuff to learn in making Linux career switch: Linux, Docker, Terraform will be a good start.
Expanding Azure skill.
Learning some configuration management and dealing with container scheduling systems later

Learning programming further with at least one programming well supported language is also recommended. Python / C# or whatever else. May be both of them if u wish staying within Azure realm, as it can be handy having smth to script stuff anyway

[buoyant seal]

Anyway, the career path for Ops strong people that like automating infra
Is called DevOps engineer
It has variety from Site Reliability Engineer, to DevSecOps and etc.
Learning Linux and infra automating languages will be a good switching to this direction, but for truly becoming one u need uping your programming skills in a fully fledged programming language from Python to C# and etc
Like there is Dev in DevOps

[buoyant seal]

A known roadmap
https://roadmap.sh/devops
Of ecosystem to explore.
Stressing need for getting Linux ecosystem knowing and one fully fledged glue like Python.

They have it as purple as most recommended the only choice, good enough

[harsh river]

what scandal?

[buoyant seal]

Some comments on fully fledged languages:
Python is good scripting glue u will often need.

C#/.Net is good to meet demand for infra devs in Azure stack

And I will advise strongly looking to Golang direction, as it is a special language for Infra devs due to majority of infra tooling made in it. It opens room to do a lot of nice stuff (by importing their code, or just having better ability to read how infra tools work). As well as this language is cross platform compilable between windows and Linux, and should serve good for people living in both OSes

[haughty root]

Passionate about continuous learning and being at the forefront of tech makes it sound like you don't actually care about the company itself and the people theyre helping with their products/solutions.

[haughty root]

I thought Windows/Azure are still the dominant by far vs linux in enterprise use?

[buoyant seal]

as far as i am aware Windows remained popular only in the section of being used for the purpose of managing machine parks of Windows PC Users
And for hosting stuff in the most ancient way like some Wordpress to raise (by people from like Government that have skill issues in general usually)

Otherwise, 98%+ of cloud market is dominated by Linux at servers

Windows is just not horizontably scalable (As in having easier more than a single machine to distribute workload among them), Linux is

[midnight fjord]

I figured out that I could use ChatGPT 4o to do an assessment of my python knowledge and general programming concepts. It was very decent and would recommend to do that if you are a beginner.

[buoyant seal]

As well as Windows is having high overhead in resource consumption (GUI is not a necessary thing for servers too)

And ecosystem of last of 10 years did not evolve supporting to automate Windows, but Linux is fully automatable in multiple different choices. From more outdated to more modern means.
So... the necessary dozen of years to embrace Linux already passed at server side.

[haughty root]

Mmm I see, yes for cloud services it is (almost) exclusively linux

But for major non-cloud based software deployments it's still Windows written software

[buoyant seal]

we can include that baremetal self hosted way, is still applied here too as dominated by Linux

the person above demonstrated Ops skills towards servers/cloud/baremetal self hosted stuff
Therefore, i recommended accordingly

[buoyant seal]

we can clarify, for majority of a Desktop targeting development. Sure still Windows

otherwise, Mobile is dominated by linux based Android, and IOS

embedded stuff is dominated by Linux too as far as i am aware (Arduiono and etc)

i am watching with high interest how Windows introduced WSL2 to become more friendly towards Linux Development and
how game industry is shifting towards LInux too with Steam deck/Proton stuff
Hopefully one day the last remaining bastion of Windows (Desktop platform) will fall. (but this day is not today yet)

if to be relastic... Desktop is probably will not shift from Windows in the nearby 20 years at least.
I am still young. I hope to live enough to see that eventually 😄
If shift of game industry will continue to Linux, that will eliminate a huge portion of reason for Windows usage

[north rune]

also good for mock interviews, asking questions like "what's the most important things to learn for x on the job?", "What's the most underrated thing for X to learn on the job"

[midnight fjord]

Nice!

[buoyant seal]

Yeah, this is a good another blow to this ship.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enshittification
https://www.reddit.com/r/Millennials/comments/19ff6rb/millennials_are_living_in_the_age_of/

Getting proffits at any cost.

that's why it is fine for them selling all their data from Reddit, Twitter and etc gathered from user to get a new product to sell.
Windows people decided probably they wish to hop on this train too and gather even more data from users

[regal axle]

Does anyone have examples of "good" resumes? I often get asked for examples, but never really have any that I can share. They don't have to be CS related. But I mean, if they are, cool

And I don't mean a good template. I mean an actual resume that is good.

[gritty rivet]

What makes a good resume is that it tells your individual story in relation to fitting a specific role.

The Jake's template is a great resume for someone about to graduate applying for backend Python roles. It would be a terrible resume for other situations

[fleet reef]

Define "cool"
I mean, I'm proud of mine, https://bradleyreynolds.blob.core.windows.net/$web/Resume-BradleyReynolds.pdf, but I don't know if you would like it

[regal axle]

Sure. But that is what makes a great resume. There is still something to glean from a "generic" resume. Or an out of context resume. It isn't about "let me copy this 1:1" but rather let me look at examples of success and see what insights I can gain.
Generally, I don't need it. But it is a common enough request I see. (and there is always more I can learn from others, so I personally am interested too)

[true harness]

don't know about good but I got an internship <#career-advice message>. though this is older than the one I used to get the internship by about 2 months

[gritty rivet]

Makes sense, but the other thing is, it's very subjective. So I usually just try to look for multiple resumes of people working similar roles to the one I'm targeting as a model of success

[boreal kernel]

Wsg Bois im a certified software engineer at nasa

[peak halo]

What do you do at nasa?

[boreal kernel]

I literally told you ;-;

[thick raft]

make jobs about being in nasa

[peak halo]

right, what kind of software do you develop?

[boreal kernel]

Well i worked on many different projects on their team but mainly i helped them in making the official website of nasa

[whole flame]

what is your tech stack?

[boreal kernel]

I mainly work on the back end ig

[azure heart]

what's space like?

[boreal kernel]

Bro ive never been to space 💀
Im just a backend developer for their website

[regal axle]

I thought every employee of NASA went to space though

[thick raft]

same

[balmy mural]

That's just a benefit they have for employees who have been there 5+ years

[true harness]

I thought NASA was in space and you had to take the space elevator to get into work

[scenic whale]

need help

[peak halo]

Hello, you have to ask an actual question to get help. See #❓｜how-to-get-help

[near ocean]

Back end of the space rocket?

[boreal kernel]

Lol backend of website

[fringe sphinx]

Relevant nasa: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AF_lZaGWchA

[brazen island]

Going to stop freewheeling the search for my next thing on Monday and just reach out to places that will 100% hire me then 🤔

Maybe I should have more patience because responses take a while sometimes and there's cool stuff I went for but looking for roles sucks tbh

[snow patrol]

'ig'

[fringe sphinx]

Funny, I haven't written a resume in ages. Technically did one once about 5 years ago, but even that was a formality.

[night mortar]

hi guys

any professional developer.come to private job

[fleet reef]

!rule ad paid

[inner wren]

Rules

6. Do not post unapproved advertising.

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[steady falcon]

I’ve been studying self taught Python for a week. Am I ready for a senior software development role?

[analog sun]

No

[brazen island]

Yeah, the issue is that hiring is seasonal and now is the time (at least here). Also applies for my contacts I'll reach out to next week, depending on how this week's interviews go

I'd have reached out to them already but it's a bad look to call on them and then say "Ah damn, I'm taking something else", that's why I started applying for all the moon shots first 😂

Mass onboardings happen here in September

Our amount of tax is so insane I'd say there's no point.

If you live here you can rationalise is as paying for services in the place you live but if you're remoting there's no copium left

There's nearly a 40% gap between my gross and net

[pastel thunder]

how to know if you are actually dumb or it is the manager and colleagues who are piece of * ?

[near ocean]

It could also be a secret third thing

[supple goblet]

hello! i'm new to python and going through the 'crash course in python' book currently, will that be enough to get any internship?

[fringe sphinx]

Most internships in the US are slotted for CS (or similar) Uni students, often 2nd or 3rd year.

[supple goblet]

oh hey i'm actually a physics undergrad from india

and my uni has no placements😅

[fringe sphinx]

Oh, that's much better than just studying Python and no degree/uni studies!

[crystal obsidian]

i completed a programming bootcamp/course that was in partnership with one of the top unis(Stellenbosch) in my country (South africa)

every job posting on linkedin im finding wants me to know 3 languages, C++, Java, Python
ive only learnt python from that course ( 6 months)
but all the job listings are requesting for a minimum of 2-3 years in uni
unsure what kind of job i can get
i basically just learned how to use python
during the course i made a library management system (pretty shoddy but was something)
and task assignment system that gives admin users privileges
and finally a financial tracker app per say

would i even be able to get a job e'-e'

[fringe sphinx]

Regardless of whether you get an internship from it: start with a basic tutorial, do some small projects, and hang out in #python-discussion and learn from the community. Once you're comfortable with small projects, then start thinking about more strategic learning (stuff that complements your degree)

[fringe sphinx]

Without a degree: best bet is to aim for an adjacent job in tech (like support, qa or operations) to get some relevant experience. Or, find someone who'll give you a shot at a very intro position.

[crystal obsidian]

iirc my dad with his 20+ years of experience and connections might be able to help me out there
but what should i think about looking into
like fast API or anything along those lines

[fringe sphinx]

I don't know SA, but in most markets, it's hard to get noticed with bootcamp alone... even if you're a good coder. Networking and connections is definitely the way!

[crystal obsidian]

i got a 99% average tho D:

[fringe sphinx]

Oh, I don't doubt you're good and capable. You just need someone to give you a chance, and it's hard when all they see is a resume.

In terms of what to learn; there's an infinite range of options. Web dev and data skills (ie: Kaggle.com/learn) are probably good things to learn to expand your knowledge.

[crystal obsidian]

i like backend development e'-e'

[fringe sphinx]

These are good topics too: https://missing.csail.mit.edu

[crystal obsidian]

so i just upload my projects onto my github?

resume = CV right?
From what i can tell

[fringe sphinx]

Also; GitHub is an important career skill, so it's worth doing just to learn it regardless

[supple goblet]

do they have to be original projects?

[crystal obsidian]

my projects were projects my course wanted me to make
so mine arent orginal and have been thinking about making something just not sure on what to make yet e'-e'

ah they dont like word doc files e'-e'

[gritty rivet]

There was a time when building a really great REST API built with Python with great tests and documentation could be enough of a portfolio to land you a job in some places... These days, I'm not so sure

[crystal obsidian]

:(

[gritty rivet]

Share an image, you can block out details of needed

[crystal obsidian]

when my dad isnt busy hes great help, but otherwise you guys help me D:

i got a really nice recommendation letter from my old boss e'-e'

[smoky quest]

Not sure everyone would like to be publicly blasted like that

[crystal obsidian]

e'-e'

[balmy mural]

Yo, fellow saffa here. You're gonna struggle without a degree, but it's not impossible. Especially if you target some of the smaller companies around. At a minimum you'll want to pick up some sql skills, and it won't be a bad idea to learn some C#/Java either. Most used language here is C#.

Without a degree, your projects need to be what stands out on your CV. Work on some projects that demonstrate specific skills. Write unit tests, some documentation, use git, deploy your projects. If you want to get fancy, build yourself an automated deployment pipeline.
For jobs, try some of your ideal roles, but also try some adjacent stuff that might be easier to get into. Testing, QA Automation, Support, DevOps, etc.

And lastly, you can aim for any jobs asking for 1-3 years experience. That's junior roles just listing their ideal candidate, you don't have to fit it exactly.

[crystal obsidian]

what province mate?

[balmy mural]

Also, send out your CV to some recruiting companies. You'll take a 10% hit on your salary during your first year, but they're incentivised to find your a job, and you'll have a job. They take your CV, rewrite it into the format they find works the best for the companies they work with and apply for you. They also sometimes work with companies who only work via recruiting companies

[balmy mural]

Originally from Free State, but working in Gauteng now

[pastel thunder]

both being fragment of *?

[near ocean]

It could be both
What happened at work?

[safe coral]

I think Im going to pay 400 dollars and get my resume written by a professional

[celest kite]

It was only 269 dollars yesterday

[safe coral]

well with extra stuff it costs 400

[celest kite]

@true harness will write it for $10

[safe coral]

this one @celest kite

I guess its 649. Not 400 xD

[celest kite]

Is that in Mexican pesos?

[safe coral]

usa dollars

[celest kite]

Well shit. That's really expensive

[safe coral]

Well I need help obviously

[celest kite]

@fleet reef I have a job opportunity for you

[true harness]

no one needs that much help lol. I think paying any amount is absurd

[safe coral]

well I do

[celest kite]

Can you just like... Inhale Pub and press down-b to gain some of pub's powers?

[true harness]

why?

[safe coral]

Because my resume needs fixing

[true harness]

does that require money though? there's tons of people here that do it for free. like when you asked earlier

[celest kite]

But $650 worth of fixing?

[safe coral]

if you guys wanna help me, go ahead and help. I dunno how to make it better. All you guys say fix this fix that

I sent over 15 resumes here. Im tired of writing them again and again

[celest kite]

Shen? Is that you?

[safe coral]

why not actually fix the stuff for me instead of asking me to fix it and then not liking what I fixed over and over again

Im just saying. Ive never seen anyone actually help me write a resume here. All they say is what needs to be fixed

So I cant agree with you that people here do it for free

[celest kite]

@true harness sounds like it's workshop time

[true harness]

that's not helping to you?

[safe coral]

saying what needs to be fixed is not help if I show fixed one and then you guys say thats not what I meant

[true harness]

maybe ask for clarification then? if you want more interaction, ask for it

[safe coral]

sayong what needs to be fixed is not actually writing a resume for someone

Ive been asking for over a year?

[true harness]

well, yeah. no one wants to write resumes for you. it's unethical

[safe coral]

how is it unethical? These resume writers are doing unethical jobs then?

[true harness]

yes

[safe coral]

No its not unethical? You give them your resume and they write it better

fix it to make it look better. Its not unethical

[true harness]

if you want to use them, I can't stop you. submitting it as your own creation is unethical

[safe coral]

even Linkedin has resume writing services

its called professional help

I showed my resume to my boss here and he told me to go to professional services if you dont know how to write a resume

[celest kite]

Wait, so that means you're seeking professional help?

[safe coral]

Yeah I sent them my job experience and they are gonna write a resume out of that

[true harness]

critique and advice are different from writing for you

[safe coral]

Its not like they are lying on my resume? They are writing it more professionally

I dont undertstand how it makes it unethical lmao

[true harness]

¯_(ツ)_/¯ I'm not gonna argue this. use if you want

[celest kite]

And what happens when you get on the job and they ask you to write some documentation and it's nowhere near the elegance of your resume?

[balmy mural]

I'm 99% certain that all they do is take your resume and make it fit into an existing template they use for everyone. It's the same thing the recruiters I mentioned earlier do over here. It's not actually better than a CV you could write yourself from talking to the super knowledgeble people in here and applying their suggestions

[safe coral]

I can write documentation

[celest kite]

Then document your job experience

[safe coral]

I already shared my resume here

[balmy mural]

Yea, and there are a ton of people here who shared their resumes multiple times. Making their resumes better one step at a time based on the feedback given here. Feel free to spend your money how you want to, but I highly doubt you'll get your money's worth out of it

[safe coral]

Here you go!

[gritty rivet]

Hiring paid resume writers is pretty common, and I've never seen anyone frame it as dishonest before... Lazy and expensive, sure, but it's not generally considered plagiarism

[true harness]

I didn't say it's plagiarism, I said it's unethical

[safe coral]

Whats wrong with my resume now?

[gritty rivet]

It's chopped into pieces, is the real thing one page? In the US I'd say it needs to be, but that can vary by country

[safe coral]

Thats the problem. It wont fit in one page

I have 4 related positions

try fitting all that in one page

[gritty rivet]

My point is the same.

[balmy mural]

Based on your YoE, I think it's fine to go up to 2 pages tbh

[gritty rivet]

Again it's hard to tell what the actual layout is from those screenshots but it looks like the margins might be huge

[safe coral]

Im just gonna ask chat gpt to write a resume for me

Developed predictive models in R to forecast demand and optimize pricing strategies, resulting in a 15% increase in RevPAR over a six-month period.
Built interactive dashboards in Tableau to visualize trends and patterns in guest behavior, enabling management to make data-driven decisions regarding marketing campaigns, room allocation, and staffing levels.
Conducted A/B testing of promotional offers using SQL to query the hotel's database, resulting in a 20% increase in online bookings.
Collaborated with the marketing team to create targeted email campaigns based on customer segmentation analysis, resulting in a 10% increase in repeat bookings.
Automated the generation of daily, weekly, and monthly reports using Python scripts, saving the team 10+ hours per week and ensuring timely access to critical data.
Presented findings and recommendations to senior management, effectively communicating complex data insights in a clear and concise manner.
Maintained and updated the hotel's data warehouse, ensuring data accuracy and integrity.
Contributed to the development of a new customer relationship management (CRM) system.```

[true harness]

would you say the same about having someone write a cover letter for you? or do an interview for you? my reasoning is that hiring managers are making a decision with the understanding that your resume was created by you, so they are evaluating your communication skills as well

[safe coral]

wow Gemini did a great job with my job

[languid agate]

What kind of jobs could I be looking for after getting an associate's degree in programming? I'm learning python right now but I want to keep an eye out for any prospective opportunities once I get the first degree here.

[safe coral]

I told Gemini what I did in the hotel and it came up with this @gritty rivet

[gritty rivet]

I've seen no evidence for any of your assumptions. In my experience, hiring managers know that professional resume writers have been around for decades. You're the first person I've ever seen claiming this is unexpected or unethical.

[safe coral]

also doing interview for someone is different that writing a resume for someone

that doesnt even compare... Resume writers grab information from you and then write a concise and effective resume

[gritty rivet]

I would answer that by searching your local job listings. Maybe QA roles, other dev roles. Competing in this market may be tough though

[safe coral]

Resume writers need your work history, what you want to do etc... They just dont create resume out of nothing

[languid agate]

Yeah the reason I ask despite already checking both links at the top is because all of them say "Senior" or "Manager" or require a much more advanced degree to even be considered, so I'm trying to find something that will allow me to get started

[safe coral]

If we go by your thinking, editors are doing unethical jobs too then

Editors do bunch of fixing before a book or article gets published

[true harness]

editors don't significantly rewrite stories

[gritty rivet]

Networking is a must.... I share this a lot because it's still relevant as ever: https://blog.pragmaticengineer.com/advice-for-junior-software-engineers/

[safe coral]

Noone is rewriting a story here?

They are grabbing your existing resume and fix it. I dont understand where you get the unethical part

They are not claiming you worked places you didnt or lying about your job experience

You have to provide them your job experience and what you did to begin with

Do you think resume builders embellish your resume? Thats not even true

[gritty rivet]

There's even a National Association of Resume Writers with an official Code of Ethics. If you think their profession is unethical take it up with them 🤣 https://thenrwa.org/codeofethics

[safe coral]

Pardon my language but thats the most absurd accusation Ive ever heard

Resume Writers do not make up stories

They work on what you give them. You dont tell them that you want them to create a resume for someone that has 10 years in data science and make up responsibilities for them

if you lie on your responsibilities and places you worked, thats you being unethical

What Can a Professional Résumé Writer Do For You?

The answer is simple—they author documents that market you to potential employers. Professional résumé writers are not just typesetters—their real skill and expertise is defining, positioning, and promoting your job skills and ultimately your career.

This was someone from their website @gritty rivet Very well put i think

I dont think that Law Enforcement positions would approve resume writing services if they were unethical 🥲

[civic acorn]

https://tenor.com/view/how-bro-felt-after-writing-that-how-bro-felt-alpha-wolf-alpha-alpha-meme-gif-307456636039877895

[safe coral]

so my current position, are 4 bullets a lot?

• Utilized Python, R, and SQL to analyze key hotel performance metrics, including occupancy rates, average daily rates (ADR), revenue per available room (RevPAR), and guest satisfaction scores.
• Developed predictive models in R and Python to forecast demand and optimize pricing strategies, resulting in a 15% increase in RevPAR over a six-month period.
• Built interactive dashboards in Tableau to visualize trends and patterns in guest behavior, enabling management to make data-driven decisions regarding room allocation, and staffing levels.
• Conducted A/B testing of guest requests and guest satisfaction on GPX platform by creating the hotel's guest database and applying SQL queries against the database resulting in 20% increase in guest retention.

How does this look for my current position? @gritty rivet

[regal axle]

I don't think this is really a question of ethics. There is a way to do that service in an ethical way. You could argue that people in here give help writing resumes. However,,,, that price is not so nice. That price is a little bit scummy.
Also, just becuase someone uses something for something, that doesn't prove that it is or is not ethical. Just look back at the rich kids who hired those guys to help with their college apps. The ones that were all suddenly star athletes!
At the end of the day, it is your money. I just think it is a lot of money to spend on this. But if they really can help and really don't just start putting lies on your paper (sorry to tell you this, but most all of them try to put at least a little bit lies that are too far,) than go for it

[safe coral]

why would they put lies on my paper?

what do you think about experience for my current position? @regal axle is it long?

[regal axle]

To make you look like a better candidate.

[regal axle]

It is not too long. If you need to cut down on space, you don't need to mention the languages you used so much. Unless the position you are applying for explicitly says that they want someone proficient in python / r / whatever

[safe coral]

Yeah all the positions I apply require proficieny in R Python or Tableau

[regal axle]

Also, it is a question of how it fits in the whole resume. I can't answer completely without seeing the whole thing. And before you send me the whole thing; I don't have time right now to go over it.
But the length is determined by the fit on the paper. I know that might sound strange.

[regal axle]

In that case, you can keep it. But I generally try not to repeat myself in my bullet points. So maybe mention it once? Or leave it as is; as is, is fine

[safe coral]

okay

[brisk falcon]

hi guys,

i wanna ask same question in here cuz i didnt get any answer in help chat

so how can i learn the biopython for like bioinformatics

[safe coral]

Revenue per available room

but it says on the first bullet what it is

[civic acorn]

Online?

[safe coral]

• Utilized Python to analyze key hotel performance metrics, including occupancy rates, average daily rates (ADR), revenue per available room (RevPAR), and customer satisfaction scores resulting in a 10% decrease in hotel operation costs.

[brisk falcon]

yep

[safe coral]

Here is the first bullet, I fixed it... How does it look? @turbid bobcat

[brisk falcon]

like are there any course that u know

[safe coral]

well if I keep writing about it

its gonna be like 6 7 lines

Utilized Python to perform predictive analysis by comparing key hotel performance metrics, including occupancy rates, average daily rates (ADR), revenue per available room (RevPAR), and customer satisfaction scores resulting in a 10% decrease in hotel operation costs.

hows this now? Better?

that sounds like an interview question tho

I cant write all that on resume... Resume needs to be one page

you want me to mention that I used time series and stuff?

Utilized Python and statistical methods (regression analysis, time series forecasting, clustering, hypothesis testing, ANOVA) to perform a predictive analysis comparing key hotel performance metrics, including occupancy rates, average daily rates (ADR), revenue per available room (RevPAR), and customer satisfaction scores. This analysis identified key drivers of operational costs and led to data-driven recommendations resulting in a 10% decrease in hotel operation costs.

Hows this? @turbid bobcat

Performed predictive analysis using Python (regression, time series forecasting, clustering, hypothesis testing, ANOVA) by comparing key hotel performance metrics. This analysis identified key drivers of operational costs and led to data-driven recommendations resulting in a 10% decrease in hotel operation costs.

I predicted possible future occupancies by dates and stuff

when we needed more house keepers in the hotel or how much stuff we need to buy for breakfast

We use occupancy rate by day to predict future occupanices

and make decisions based on that

well thats basically what my line says I thought

but thats not the only thing we project tho

we also project ADR and RevPAR

we combine all those information to get the hotel operation cost

hotel operation cost is based on ADR RevPAR and OR

• Leveraged Python and statistical analysis (regression, time series forecasting, clustering, hypothesis testing, ANOVA) to identify key drivers of hotel operational costs through data-driven recommendations resulting in a 10% cost reduction.

so I hand out my recommendations to the management

data driven decision

well I need to mention I used python because they want proficieny in python

[ripe bramble]

how much technical skill in python should i be expected to have if applying to data science internships?

[safe coral]

Performed predictive analysis using Python (regression, time series forecasting, clustering, hypothesis testing, ANOVA) by comparing key hotel performance metrics to identify key drivers of expenditures resulting in a 10% cost reduction in hotel operations. @turbid bobcat How is this?

[ripe bramble]

im taking classes on statistical regressions, managing data bases with sql, hopefully some R, and currently going through the data analyst with python course from datacamp. just wondering if i would be expected to know any leetcode type stuff

[safe coral]

Yeah I like this

[ripe bramble]

or would i be fine with focusing on the data science application of python

[safe coral]

Hotel revenue, occupancy rate, booking statistics

Im saying these are what I predicted. Key hotel metrics

I predicted by comparing

it says I predicted by comparing key hotel metrics

• Performed predictive analysis using Python (regression, time series forecasting, clustering, hypothesis testing, ANOVA) on key hotel performance metrics to identify key drivers of expenditures resulting in a 10% cost reduction in hotel operations.

better? @turbid bobcat

[errant thicket]

i am looking for freelance jobs a niche for freelance any help ?

[smoky quest]

indeed or linkedin are great for jobs. upwork/fiverrr are classic freelancing websites

[errant thicket]

i meant a niche such as what freelance jobs are they i meant specific wise

[smoky quest]

not sure to understand

[safe coral]

• Leveraged Python to analyze guest booking patterns, identifying key trends and opportunities for revenue optimization. Developed a predictive model to forecast room demand, resulting in a 15% increase in revenue through dynamic pricing adjustments.

It looks too plain tho

• Applied statistical methods (hypothesis testing, regression analysis, ANOVA) to analyze guest satisfaction surveys, uncovering correlations between specific amenities and overall ratings. Used these insights to recommend targeted improvements, leading to a 10% increase in positive online reviews.

Thanks 😄

• Designed and implemented a SQL database to centralize guest data from multiple sources (PMS, CRM, online reviews). Developed Python scripts for automated data cleaning and reporting, improving data accuracy and increasing hotel operation efficiency by 15%.

hows the other two?

[vapid jay]

you guys are making a curriculum?

[safe coral]

• Centralized guest data from multiple sources (CRM, PMS, online reviews) by designing a SQL database leading to an increase in guest satisfaction by 5% and freeing up 10+ hours of staff time weekly.

[civic acorn]

Damn i know biopython is very unpopular and ik there is no much courses in the internet, so unfortunately i think your only option would be reading, but still try investigate and search for any course out there

[errant thicket]

what freelance skills are they ?

[smoky quest]

It depends on the job you want to apply for. They will require different skills based on their need.
Do you have a concrete example in mind?

[safe coral]

• Leveraged Python to analyze guest booking patterns by identifying key trends and opportunities for revenue optimization and developed predictive model to forecast room demand, resulting in a 15% increase through dynamic pricing adjustments.
• Applied statistical methods using techniques such as hypothesis testing, regression analysis and ANOVA to analyze guest satisfaction surveys, uncovering correlations between specific amenities and overall ratings. Used these insights to recommend targeted improvements, leading to a 10% increase in positive online reviews.
• Centralized guest data from multiple sources such as CRM, PMS and online reviews by designing an SQL database leading to an increase in guest satisfaction by 5% and freeing up 10+ hours of staff time weekly.
• Developed an ML model to optimize group pricing strategies by analyzing historical group booking data and seasonality trends, resulting in 15% increase in group bookings and 10% increase in group revenue.

Yeah I need to fix my second one

• Leveraged statistical methods such as hypothesis testing, regression and ANOVA to analyze guest satisfaction surveys, uncovering actionable insights that improved online reviews by 10%.

I also fixed the first one:

• Utilized Python for in-depth analysis of guest booking trends, developing a predictive model for room demand that informed strategic pricing adjustments and a 15% revenue lift.

better right?

[wintry ocean]

How long is the slow mode interval here, let's find out.

[pine sleet]

If you hover over the bottom right it tells you

[wintry ocean]

You're immune. Wow. WOW.

[delicate elk]

He's part of the moderation team...?

[safe coral]

hi guys

what do you think about this responsiblities I had for Data Science Intern? Does it look good for resume?

• Developed a predictive model with time-series and clustering analysis to identify at-risk schools, enabling proactive interventions and a 10% reduction in course failures.
• Created interactive data visualizations using Python and R to illustrate the impact of COVID-19 on student learning, informing data-driven decisions that led to a 10% improvement in standardized test scores.
• Presented comprehensive exam results analysis to school administrators, highlighting areas for improvement and driving strategic curricular adjustments that resulted in a 7% increase in student success within six months.

[peak halo]

when you say "identify at-risk schools", is there context to establish that you're talking about covid?
it sounds like all three of these bullet points are about one project. what was your role on that project relative to other contributors?

[safe coral]

I did predictive analysis

and visualizations and then presented it to the headmasters

[safe coral]

I hope this helps

• Developed a predictive model with time-series and clustering analysis to identify at-risk schools during and after COVID-19 epidemic, enabling proactive interventions and a 10% reduction in course failures.
• Created interactive data visualizations using Python and R to illustrate the impact of COVID-19 epidemic on student learning, informing data-driven decisions that led to a 10% improvement in standardized test scores.
• Presented comprehensive exam results analysis to school administrators, highlighting areas for improvement and driving strategic curricular adjustments that resulted in a 7% increase in student success within six months.
  @peak halo did some changes

[pearl veldt]

first impression: too much to read

[safe coral]

too much?! Its only 2 lines

[pearl veldt]

i feel like you're adding too much detail in every line

[regal axle]

It is late, so I am still not going to start going into details. But I would love to see what your most updated version looks like all put together?

[safe coral]

So I only got my current job and internship @regal axle

[pearl veldt]

(im no employer this is just my honest opinion)

[regal axle]

That is fine.

[safe coral]

this is for my current position

• Utilized Python for in-depth analysis of guest booking trends, developing a predictive model for room demand that informed strategic pricing adjustments and a 15% revenue lift.
• Leveraged statistical methods such as hypothesis testing, regression and ANOVA to analyze guest satisfaction surveys, uncovering actionable insights that improved online reviews by 10%.
• Centralized guest data from multiple sources such as CRM, PMS and online reviews by designing an SQL database leading to an increase in guest satisfaction by 5% and freeing up 10+ hours of staff time weekly.
• Developed an ML model to optimize group pricing strategies by analyzing historical group booking data and seasonality trends, resulting in 15% increase in group bookings and 10% increase in group revenue.

[regal axle]

I meant, that I wanted to see it actually on a paper. All the little details do matter. But they are not the only thing that matters. The overall resume is important. And especially since the first screening will likely only have someone looking at your resume for about 7 seconds; I want to see the shape.
I can make no comment on the length of bullet points without seeing the shape

[safe coral]

So far @regal axle

[regal axle]

Got it. And are these two experience sections your only ones; or do you still need to add more? (Obviously I see education and skills is missing)

[safe coral]

Im gonna add one more

another three bullets and that should be it

Is this a better template?

[regal axle]

Your margins are off. I think. I don't remember what the proper margins are. But at first glance, they are smaller margins. If possible, the flow of your sentence should be broken sections and not just where they line wrap. You will have more control over that, if you have smaller margins. For that last one, as an example, I don't love that it is 3 lines. And that other template does fix that issue it would seem. As for what template is better .... idc. I wouldn't make a dark mode resume to being with. But I won't bother getting into that type of detail becuase it is super opinionated and I don't have any real reason for some believes.
Except for the dark mode one. Don't. Studies show that people are more trusting with lighter colors. This is UI/UX study. But I can assume it is simlar for resumes

Actually, your margins don't look that off

[safe coral]

Oh its the website

I have dark mode on my browser lol. I will download the resume once im done finish writing

[regal axle]

Example of splitting long sentence by grouping and not by line wrap

[regal axle]

But your lines are a little too long to worry about that. I would much rather 2 lines of bad grouping than 3 lines with good grouping

[safe coral]

my lines look bad?

[regal axle]

No, i am just saying that there is a way to split lines into more grouped manners. But it is something you do if the space permits. And the space does not. It is a little detail thing

[safe coral]

What do you think about bullet points?

Im sending this resume directly to a person in Amazon. Its not gonna go through HR at all. They are gonna put me right in the interview

so I wont go through HR to check my resume and go through all that stuff. The person told me not to apply to positions and just give him the job id. He will recommend me directly to the hiring person who conducts the interview

[regal axle]

Overall this looks pretty good. A far cry from "my resume needs sooooo much work and help." Looks pretty good. I do want to see what the whole thing looks like first before you start worrying about tweaking what you already have. Work on blocking out the whole thing and then chipping away at any details you want to change

[regal axle]

Thats amazing. These things are OP

[safe coral]

OP?

I know that HR doesnt look at every resume soo... I wanted my resume to show some of my achievements since the resume goes directly to recruiter for interview stage

[regal axle]

Having connections / network / referrals. Being able to get right to the people who actually matter.
Overpowered

[safe coral]

so my last position was in an EMR company. I did a lot of SQL in that one

[regal axle]

Don't forget that the resume is a window into you. But you can and will go into more detail in the interview. So it is ok to not include a detail if you think it is better to leave for an interview. Focus on the more "marketable" points. How one defines what is marketable ....

[safe coral]

Electronic Medical Records 😄

I would use a scanner to scan paper medical records and upload them on the database and query them with SQL

[regal axle]

Sounds like you can use a OCR document processing pipeline that converts irregular documents into structured XML :p
Well ,,, medical stuff requires a different level of accuracy. ....

[safe coral]

• Spearheaded the implementation of OCR software to automate the upload of patient visit histories, reducing manual entry time by 50% and improving data accessibility for billing staff.

• Implemented a suite of SQL queries to automate the extraction of relevant patient data for billing, resulting in a 98% accuracy rate for reimbursements and 15% decrease annually in manual review costs.

[safe coral]

Less than one page @regal axle

[safe coral]

Do you think it looks good?

[civic acorn]

Bro its been like 4 hours 💀

[boreal kernel]

G'day mates

[blissful needle]

Yo guys

[thick raft]

Good day mates

[pine sleet]

good day all. do we have a career question?

[jolly sluice]

Oh hey I can talk here

[true hatch]

If I don't like math class will I struggle in CS?

[chrome nacelle]

Hey guys any suggestions what should I do after 12 standard?

[blissful needle]

You will surely struggle with data structures lool

[buoyant seal]

!rule 6 9 , this is not the place for recruitment. See channel description. <@&831776746206265384>

[inner wren]

Rules

6. Do not post unapproved advertising.

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[clear widget]

Sorry

[buoyant seal]

I liked it enough in school. Had good scores in Algebra. Not that great flared in Geometry though.

In university I discovered I don't like higher math in majority. It is like full of Chinese eroglyphs hard to understand.

It is not preventing me to excel in strictly Software engineering subjects, from data structures and more.
And even liked applying linear algebra for computer graphics.

University with CS degree was mostly to survive math for me period. Life after university became simple though, since need for math is very rarely needed at my job at least. So lack of math proficiency did not prevent me having rapid nice career

Although that I don't like it, does not mean I can not get it if I try. Surviving 6 years in math oriented highest education strongly asks to get it in order to pass it, hehe

Ergh... I rarely see how it is applyable in the real world. So. There was no motivation for me.
Some teachers managed to teach math with more practical math, which we applied to real world examples, that was way more awesome

[buoyant seal]

Tldr: we can say I even in general strongly dislike higher math

It made my university period hard, but work after that was not a problem at all

[night cove]

Is it rare to get a job without a degree?

[plain vector]

In the IT field? Yeah

[buoyant seal]

@night cove depends on quality of a job.
It is rare to get a good job without degree.
having some low quality job like being manual QA, system administrator, wordpress/CRM dev, help desk support, or computer repairing master is not uncommon.

[night cove]

Is it possible to land a high paying job without degree?

[buoyant seal]

Everything is possible in the world, including inventing hyperspace engine, and earth turning to spaghetti monster.
It just has different chances for probability.
Due to natural human limitations in lifespan, and every person having different... levels of soft and hard skills, and level of luck and free time, it all depends.
So, if u have sufficient tech background, aptitude for solving tech problem, luck and connections (nepotism and etc), there is a chance to get a high paying job without degree. Especially after 5-10 years of career.
especially if u live in a very poor country, and u managed to get to external market which has salaries more than your native country. (which requires usually also aptitude to learning at least English)
Or may be u are career shark capable to go by human heads to reach the top in management positions or smth.

Otherwise, chances are kind of slim. As i mentioned human lifespan is limited, and without higher education it is a good chance to have low level paying job for the rest of career

TLDR: IF depends on input of variables into this equation. But in average we could say no.

[balmy mural]

Possible yes. Probable no.

[long rose]

Are there any examples where I can apply for Python dev jobs as a 17 yr old with no degree

And have only python skills

[near ocean]

Not really

[fringe sphinx]

You can get a job in tech without a degree: but you'll generally start at a lower pay position with either an adjacent job like QA or support, or network your way to find someone who'll give you chance. High paying isn't just about a degree: it's also experience and excellence.

[latent bear]

Hey I just finished the cs50 Python course. My goal is to land an internship in the next 6 months. What would be the best way to go about this?

[fringe sphinx]

See my comment directly above yours plz.

My main advice is: network: talk to people, that's your most likely path to a tech job. learn: there's a lot to learn besides Python, keep learning about related topics. practice: do small and not-so-small projects to develop your skills.

[plain vector]

I want to ask that is freelancing still worth in 2024 for intermediates like me ? since the coemption is too high and not just tht , ppl from big companies do free lancing too so me as an intermediate programmer thinking tht i can generate a good profit olio to get a little bit income freedom how can i compete with them ?

[fringe sphinx]

I dunno, was freelancing ever worth it? (fiverr/etc)

[whole flame]

worked on upwork

[plain vector]

How was the experience ?

[plain vector]

so as an intermediate programmer there is no way to generate some income ?

did he generated money ?

[whole flame]

are you a dev?

[gritty rivet]

How about a normal job?

[plain vector]

no ... i am high school student still learning

[plain vector]

i am talking abt like if i am in college or smthg ?

[gritty rivet]

Then a normal internship

Or a normal student job

[plain vector]

so no hope in free lancing huh ...

[gritty rivet]

You're free to try. Go look at the competition on Upwork and Fiverr and see for yourself. If you're really good at shady webscraping work and don't mind making $3/hour maybe it will work out for you 😉

[fringe sphinx]

My advice would be to try to find someone (through networking) who has a problem that you can solve.

[plain vector]

🥹👍

[plain vector]

Alright

[near ocean]

why did you post this twice? you wont find a job here

[vapid jay]

I feel miserable because I dont know where to put my skills to have an income source

I tried some freelancing websites for weeks but no answer

so i deleted and eventually came back to see if i could get something

[fringe sphinx]

Not snark, but have you tried applying to jobs? How has that gone?

[vapid jay]

I apply everyday
some of the things i know: git, docker, python (flask, django, fastapi, pandas), golang, c#, linux (sysadmin and bash scripting)

[fringe sphinx]

What kind of jobs?

[vapid jay]

I am still a junior, but everyday I am learning more and more

[vapid jay]

junior, mid and senior, no distinction cuz the company could call me anyway, mostly for development jobs and backend thing

[fringe sphinx]

Have you tried tech but non-programming jobs?

[vapid jay]

no, what kind of jobs would that be

[fringe sphinx]

QA, support, etc. If you're struggling, lower your sights a little and get some work xp.

I know a lot of devs who started in adjacent roles.

[vapid jay]

Unfortunatelly I am from brazil, so I am far away from tech centers like USA or... Estonia. So I could do remote jobs or find a company to relocate me

[fringe sphinx]

Most remote jobs are through a local subsidiary (ie: via a local company who is contract or part of a larger company), not directly for a MNC.

[vapid jay]

you mean consulting?

I will lower my sight and apply for QA jobs also, taking into account what you said

[worldly storm]

I wanna learn python oops

can anyone suggest me a good source?

[harsh river]

please check out #python-discussion , this channel is for career discussion

[livid raven]

does someone here use a website called beecrowd?

[errant thicket]

what tech jobs are they you can get with no degree?

[balmy mural]

QA, support, testing

[near ocean]

usually QA, helpdesk, design/artistic type jobs

[balmy mural]

For all of those you'll still likely compete against people with degrees though. Except maybe design/artistic jobs

[near ocean]

you should assume all jobs in tech have degree holders applying to them

[fringe sphinx]

Just to repeat what I said earlier: there are three things you need to "make it": experience, education, and excellence. Good networking can overcome a gap in one of those.

So, if you don't have education, invest your time in networking (plus experience and excellence)

[true hatch]

What is the difference between computer science and computer engineering?

[peak halo]

it's probably going to depend on the degree program. "computer engineering" could mean either "software engineering" or "electrical engineering as it pertains to computer hardware"

[amber cargo]

computer science is more programming and the IT side of things, whereas engineering is more the building of the computer and the science behind the components etc

[true hatch]

i love your profile picture so much

[safe coral]

Did anyone check my resume? Im about to send it to the recruiter

do you guys think I need more tweaking?

Its less than a page! 😄

[regal axle]

It looks pretty good. But 1 question I have, is why is your top level experience item a part time job?

[safe coral]

Because Im at school. I got hired during undergrad and now Im doing masters.

Actually before I started my undergrad! I was front desk supervisor and then I started working on other stuff to use my skills from college

[pastel thunder]

section will become more distinguisable if you increase font size of "Experience" , "Education", "Skills" etc

[regal axle]

Idk if I would bother mentioning that it is part time. That is something you can say in an interview.

[safe coral]

Okay!

well it will be more than 1 page then. Im trying to make it one page @pastel thunder

[pastel thunder]

you seem to have white space above name, and at the end too

[regal axle]

It looks to me like you have the space to make the font bigger. But idk what program you are using and if it eagerly tries to make multiple pages

[pastel thunder]

if thats not possible, use gray line?

[regal axle]

But this looks pretty good. Definitly doesn't require you to spend $600 on someone to help you :p

[safe coral]

Yay made it into one page guys

Here you go!

[gritty rivet]

Seems good overall, but unfortunate that you only list URLs for the projects which don't add much value.

If there's nothing worth saying about them, a single link to your GitHub will do.

If you're really proud of your projects but don't have space to say why, it's worth building a quick portfolio website and linking to that

[gritty rivet]

I agree with Lisan's points. If you double-majored in Cybersecurirty and Data Science, list that as one degree with two majors

[shrewd parrot]

guys any good job boards except linkedin?

I am in US so would prefer US boards.

also anyone has a good cover letter I can look at?

Its a job board? can u share the link?

[sacred wind]

Is it still smart to study computer science because of AI?

hahahaha

[steady falcon]

I started coding Python this week, am I now ready for senior software dev position?

[analog sun]

No, and if you continue to ask the same question without follow up it will look identical to trolling

[sacred wind]

I'm just 16 and by the time I'm done, who knows

[steady falcon]

My bad

[dreamy shadow]

First time I've seen Jira/Confluence listed this way (as CRM). Does this make sense?

[whole flare]

the AI itself /j

[shrewd parrot]

its allright we can go back to fishing if AI takes over programming

[peak halo]

too late, overfishing has made that impossible, too.

[white relic]

I was about to say

[peak halo]

one of my coworkers (who has a phd in computer science) has been learning to dig, just in case.

[fringe sphinx]

You have to learn how to dig?

[peak halo]

to be able to dig fast, idk?

[whole flare]

yeah, just incase you dig out the foundations of a big building.

[white torrent]

!rule 6

[inner wren]

Rules

6. Do not post unapproved advertising.

[kindred oyster]

<@&831776746206265384> want to earn 50k i assume

[analog sun]

!cban 1226860527196835852 crypto scam

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @full sage permanently.

[pastel thunder]

between this does not look like an A4 size

you will have more space if you choose A4, and it is standard also

[harsh river]

If you don't wanna ruin your back

[fringe sphinx]

Too late 😢

[plush ivy]

Hi guys what can i do for goes deep in python to basic

Sorry from basic

[shrewd parrot]

Guys anyone has a toptal profile? It didnt let me make one

[safe coral]

I’m the only one so I’m the lead

@turbid bobcat

If I start explaining my projects it will be another page @gritty rivet. I don’t have a website unfortunately

I have two degrees tho. One for Data Science and one for Cybersecurity. They are separate bachelors. If I put them in one, it would be one bachelors degree

I have two bachelors from the college

Oh it says I should also mention my minors if it is related to my jobns

Should I say dual degree or double major?

Should I change it to data scientists?

yeah I got double major and double minor at the same time

what about the minors?

[regal axle]

No one cares about those. They disappear 😄

Nah. They vanish. Unless you have a strong reason to want to include them, they generally end up having 0 added value. There are exceptions of course. But generally, they end up not

[safe coral]

Mine are in Statistics and Information Technology Analytics

[regal axle]

Right; there are reasons to add them. Like if you are applying for a math related position, you will likely want to signal that you do know math. But there are more situations where this isn't the case, than it is.
And many people don't count minors as actual value. This is person to person. So in short, add them if they are important. Just don't be surprised if others don't find them important

[safe coral]

should I change my most recent position to Data Scientist?

[vapid jay]

Turk var mi

[safe coral]

I changed it to Data Science Analyst

[regal axle]

I won't disagree

[safe coral]

Okay! In terms of projects should I just remove them?

I also have a certificate from Google in Google Data Analytics

should I add that?

well they can see them in my github

I have a readme section in some of them

Im just gonna link the whole Github to them

I just put one of my projects there @regal axle @turbid bobcat

well I didnt graduate from college yet (Masters)

Hows all gonna fit in two lines? I need to add college name location expected graduation date and the major

You are forgetting Cybersecurity

[dreamy shadow]

You don't need the location of the university. It's not relevant.

[safe coral]

I dunno how to make it one line on this software

it doesnt let me :/

I downloaded it as a word and it messed everything up. https://resumegenius.com

[dreamy shadow]

Use word and create your own or use something else that's not a website.

[safe coral]

It looks almost like mine

if I used that template it would be more than one page

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1UPPP7SgQ7HMgk9HXMPmgSI4LLvQI0tIn/edit?usp=sharing&ouid=114763240659532693987&rtpof=true&sd=true

check this @turbid bobcat 😄

does it look good?

no?

Im gonna put one more project there

really? :'_

better now? @turbid bobcat

It wont go shorter than that

I have to add two majors and my college name is really long

I tried to manuplate that but it didnt work

its a table... Thats why I wanted you to open it to see if you can manuplate that

[final ravine]

I've always done education, experience, skills, projects because of latex moderncv template does it that way

Til

[true harness]

what are some other orderings and why?

[safe coral]

seriously can someone fix that table 🥲

[true harness]

just use a comma separated list

[vapid jay]

any1 know any1 good python projects for beginners?

[safe coral]

I fixed it!

I also removed my minor so its only one line @turbid bobcat

[safe coral]

Should I put my certificate?

whoops

doneeee

[gritty rivet]

You think so? You'll be tweaking it all the time 😉 You usually need different versions from different roles, especially for the skills section to hit the right keywords for a given job.

Looking good though for sure!

[safe coral]

😄

Thank you

[cinder jackal]

how hard is is to get an entry level backend dev position with no degree?

[balmy spade]

How does one measure that difficulty? You'll have an easier time with a degree than without, that's all I know for sure.

[vapid jay]

i heard it's pretty hard to get one without a degree unless you can really stand out

[strange pumice]

@fringe sphinx

guess what?

I GOT A JOB OFFER! WOOHOO

[cinder jackal]

I mean, like are there a ton of people that have applied to a ton of jobs and not gotten a single reply back? like assuming they meet all the normal requirments for jobs besides the degree

[white relic]

yes, many many people are in that situation

[balmy spade]

There are a ton of people that have applied to a ton of jobs with a ton of them getting replies back. You only hear about the ones who are frustrated for what ever reason.

And just think, without a degree you have to stand out above all of them too!

[strange pumice]

I feel, good. It's been a heck of a ride, huge pro is i get to work with python as the main language

[fringe sphinx]

That is awesome! Congratulations!

[cinder jackal]

yeah thats interesting. I wonder if it gets easier after breaking in? like it is for IT. Do you think have 5 years of exp doing network administration would stand out? I'm trying to figure out how feasible it is for me to change careers over.

[strange pumice]

Thanks man, you've been of huge help ngl

[balmy spade]

Experience is the gold standard. Without experience you need something else to prove and demonstrate your value (skill) to the employer. If you have 5 years in IT already you aren't starting with nothing. Just don't drop one job until the employment contract is signed on the next and consider all your options.

[safe coral]

Do you guys think I should add my Linguistics Degree in my resume?

[cinder jackal]

yep i understand! thanks for answering my questions!

[white relic]

Yes. Why would you not?

[safe coral]

Because its an old degree. Back in 2006...

I got my recent degree in the field in 2023

So I didnt wanna mention that degree

[vapid jay]

good my friend
I wish yuo the best

[strange pumice]

thank you bro

[viscid tusk]

not related to python or anything but how would I find a $20 an hour job nearby with zero experience

[pine sleet]

Maybe look at customer service or fast food or something similar. I don't think it's common but it might be possible

[viscid tusk]

Where I’m at fast food places are all roughly 13-16 an hour :(

[peak halo]

that's more than I ever made in food service (2014-2021)

[harsh river]

all degrees matter imo

[peak halo]

idk about that. I once joined a gym where the "check-in person" had a degree in fashion marketing.
as much as I want to live in a society where all academic endeavors are rewarded, the unfortunate reality is that a degree needs to be an investment in a specific career path.

[summer roost]

my advice for a mid-career shift would be different than my advice for someone in high school. I'd be trying to find ways to parlay your existing experience into a job offer doing something that interests you more. If you've got 5 years of network administration experience, play up the aspects of that job that intersect with what a backend dev would do - maybe an understanding of caching, maybe profiling distributed applications, or debugging the causes of latency, or something like that. Maybe you can point to scripts that you built or maintained in service of your network admin duties. Maybe you can parlay that experience more easily into an SRE type of role than directly into a backend dev type of role, since there's more overlap.

it might still be worth getting the degree, but it's a lot less valuable at age 50 than it is at age 20

[viscid tusk]

Real! Would there be any jobs that would pay 20~ an hour with no experience that I could look into? I’m more than willing to learn and work 5-7 days a week

[harsh river]

yes, the trades. construction, painting, plumbing, roofing, etc

[brisk cargo]

why $20/hr?

[viscid tusk]

seems like a good amount , just something roughly around that

[brisk cargo]

what's your highest level of education

[whole flame]

university

[cinder jackal]

this is great advice! Thanks1

[summer roost]

I'd start drafting a resume, and trying to highlight ways that your existing skills related to the job that you want. And maybe you want to consider doing some course work, or a boot camp, even if you aren't able to get a degree.

[lime loom]

There's a bunch of butt-knockers here offering 20 bucks per hour with Python.....considering it....for 20 bucks I get no wake up at morning !!!!

[muted osprey]

Does anyone have any advice for an entry ai developer?

I'm in HS rn and have a summer internship at a semi-large it consulting company

[smoky quest]

• Make sure you soak up as much learning as you can from your internship
• Make sure you keep good grades so you can go to the college of your choice
• Build things and have fun

[muted osprey]

This is great advice! Thank you 🙂

What about publishing papers?

I'm planning on going the PhD route

How many published papers do I need before I get to the doctorate program?

[smoky quest]

You have plenty of time for that

[muted osprey]

I'm really worried about that part 😅

I see everyone online who have like 25 papers + 2 FAANG internships + Harvard, Mit + more in their first year of college

And I'm worried about the competitiveness

Do you have any suggestions to overcome this fear?

[narrow magnet]

I am a junior dev in xyz organization with minimum skills and the people inside the organization are really incompetent but are in high position, are most of the industry like this ? I feel kinda conceited and frustrated at the same time as they give me orders.

How did people with so less knowledge get in higher positions

[strange nova]

Hell yeah that got me hyped up, I wanna crush them

[snow patrol]

it depends on the company

but i really understand your frustration because it's hard for you to expand your knowledge when the people you are working with are not as professional as they should be

[snow patrol]

that can happen when the manager has no real overview of their employees and has no idea what they are doing

i experience similar situations

[balmy mural]

I've worked at two companies. One with a very small team and currently in a pretty big team. The small team was very informal and everyone had very different responsibilities, but I got the impression that everyone technical were competent in what they were doing. In my current big team I feel like one of the dumbest people in the room most of the time and I love it. I can constantly learn from everyone around me and I can basically approach anyone when I need some help and just soak up all the knowledge I can from everyone around me

[fringe sphinx]

Accept that: everyone feels a bit of imposter syndrome. It's not healthy to worry about competition and what other people are doing; focus on; your education, excellence (getting good), and networking (talking to people)

[fringe sphinx]

I think you're misreading reality, this isn't true and social media is good at portraying fake. Step 1 is excelling in Uni. Do that.

[gritty rivet]

Forget about FAANG, the obsession with them is silly. If you get any internship at all you'll be on a good track to have a decent career

[fringe sphinx]

You may be a victim of dunning kruger: your world view may be rather small and not see the bigger picture.

[rigid sinew]

Would computer science be a good major

[near ocean]

Yes

[true harness]

it depends on what you want to do. it's good for software engineer careers

[vapid jay]

I found Barista 20 an hour part-time and Housekeeper 23 per hour wth benefits. Maybe my place is just different cuz its California and everything its expensive, So i guess they just raise hourly paychecks.

[modest pendant]

hi

newbie😀

[vapid jay]

hello guys

[buoyant seal]

we see only you point of view.
You should explain better why they are incompetent?

Be aware that distinction to job roles happens for a reason. It is impossible to be professional in every role.
I am personally judgmental only of people in same job roles as I am (as i can relate more properly qualifications between such epople) 😄 and even in this case i learned to give a lot of benefit of doubt.

[buoyant seal]

Usually when i rant that others are incompetent, i at least give reasoning why i see it 😉 Like.. if developer is coding without unit testing, he is not a professional developer as it is considerably below my most minimal threshold of quality.
So do tell why.

[balmy mural]

I can also confirm that I've known people who claim everyone above them are incompetent while the truth was that they were completely inflexible in their ways and unwilling to accept anything can be done in any other way except their way. It was never a case of their seniors actually being incompetent

[manic lintel]

-paste

[deft herald]

In my experience, if i consider someone to be incompetent, its usually just means they have a much different skill set than myself. Yeah I often see more higher-level engineers unwilling to learn a new tool or technology or test procedure or whatever but that's not incompetence, that's just stubbornness. (and yes it's a problem)

[mortal kite]

Had a bit of an eye-opening experience during my interview on Wednesday. It didn't go well, but it is important that I failed the technical questions that I did because it shows me where I need to focus on improvements.

[near ocean]

The incompetence i see usually is the inability to say no to stupid demands from customers and other teams

[white relic]

There's definitely examples of incompetent leadership but yeah people tend to easily get that confused with "doesn't have my technical skillset"

[wheat hatch]

There's a cultural aspect to this that I think also needs to be brought up. Some work cultures promotes people based on other things than performance. Can be political or social connections that factor in. I have worked with multiple such individuals and they are always a pain to deal with. Then there is also the concept of "failing upwards" as I think we usually translate it to. It basically means you hire someone with a technical degree but that person turns out to have no technical aptitude, so he or she is put on management work instead.

It's a quirk in our labour system. For some people this works out really well. They might get an engineering degree but what they really like and are good at is project management. They can do a lot of good work as a project lead. Others turn into incompetent managers with a lot of decision power.

[analog sun]

You can be a really good engineer, get promoted to manager, and turn out to be a bad manager

Or the Peter Principle can apply:

employees are promoted based on their success in previous jobs until they reach a level at which they are no longer competent, as skills in one job do not necessarily translate to another

[reef night]

.

[analog sun]

I happen to be reviewing some material and think this fits:

[fringe sphinx]

Also called the Peter principle. But, i think juniors often have an exaggerated degree of confidence

[reef night]

I wrote a server client code in Python. I tried this code with a device connected to the same network. If the server IP address is 0.0.0.0, the client IP address is I gave the IP address of the target machine, that is, the device that will join the server, but it does not work. I start the server. The client cannot connect to the server. What is the error?

[white relic]

leading a team of software engineers has more skills in common with leading a team of any other technical experts, than it does with software engineering specifically.

[fringe sphinx]

In military, had a saying: two up two down. That's the number of levels below and above your role that you need to be familiar/competent with

A lot of managers only manage up, and forget to manage down

[wheat hatch]

Didn't know that! 😄
Yep, it's a natural phase for many I think (I wasn't any different).

[gritty rivet]

That's not a career question, try a help channel #❓｜how-to-get-help

[twin juniper]

When it goes to skills, it can used to leading various teams. Like, let's say for instance, how a leader in software engineering might use communication and project management skills, similarly to leader.

[analog sun]

Oh boy, there is a lot of material that covers leadership

The basics are that you have to manage yourself, your team, and your team within the organization. Key qualities to be perceived as "good" would be communication, empathy and generating measurable successes.

You can learn the concepts, but you have to put them into practice for sure

And depending on the organization there may already be a "training" system in place for potential managers

[errant thicket]

can we network bobby?

[sudden mulch]

where can i ask a question abt data structures

[brazen island]

How bad is it in your opinion to reach out to someone in your network for an opportunity and then walk back on it? It something I should keep in my back pocket as a plan B if all else fails or should I lead with it and turn it down later if the rest succeeds? I'm a fan of the former to be honest.

[fringe sphinx]

I keep my stuff private, but I and everyone are happy to talk here!

[fringe sphinx]

I don't think bad at all, people understand that this is a risky and uncertain process. I happily give introductions all the time and don't think anything of it doesn't work out

[wheat hatch]

The way I've approached this is to always play with open cards with your network contact

[brazen island]

It's not a referral. It would be me going straight to the partner at $ConsultingCompany I interned at in the past. I got two offers I rejected and then he basically said he's open to hire whenever I'd be ready. Somehow I thinks it's rude to then say no a third time if the other things pan out

[pastel thunder]

is background check/verification done before sending offer letter?

I think thats what they are doing in the name of "VP on leave, for final approval"

[fringe sphinx]

Usually after, ime. Offer contingent on background check is what we usually do/see.

[fringe sphinx]

Still? Pretty normal to take another job. But worth maybe having a conversation or lunch, to build the relationship beyond being purely transactional

[pastel thunder]

how to verify unpaid internships? full time can be verified easily from salary slip though

[brazen island]

Alright, that's interesting to know. Thanks

[pastel thunder]

ok, and is it necessary for reference to have atleast one person from last job?

like how am I gonna ask manager? wont he know I am leaving, with me having no confirmation of offer from company asking for reference

ok, and what if my manager is likely not to give a good reference?
what to do?

I mean, in case they ask for it?

likely wont ask, you mean?

[lilac fable]

Hey, so I am still fairly new to Python I did cs50p and got the certification from that. I know that alone isn't really enough to get a job but I'm working with a mentor who is currently a senior developer at a tech company who is giving me projects to work on for my portfolio. To just explain the scenario, I just wanted some reviews on the types of projects he's giving me and if they would actually get noticed. This is the requirements he gave.

This is all in a Flask application I'm building for a web api endpoint

Redis
before your API hits the database, check the Redis cache for info. If it's not in the cache, hit the 3rd-party weather API. After your API returns a response, populate the cache with the data.
This is definitely overkill for your app, but those are important data flows in large-scale applications.

New Relic/Datadog:
Implement APM monitoring for your app
Use APM data to understand your API's performance
Use k6 to load test your API

Kubernetes
Using a local minikube instance, deploy Redis, Postgres, and your weather API
Write a kubernetes manifest that can deploy/remove all three resources at the same time
Use a Kubernetes HPA to auto-scale your weather API based on load. When done while load-testing your API with k6, this will help you understand how applications behave under high load

[pastel thunder]

apart from current job, I just have internship/research experience,
So, can they ask for that?
or will they skip this?
As no one, from full time exp is their to give reference

like can they ask for more than 2?

should be manageable, i guess

[lilac fable]

He said said some stuff about it being a good project to take to his hiring manager for a possibility to get hired on as a Jr Developer at his job, so I plan on doing it anyway just for the opportunity but didn't know how relevant outside of that it would be.

My bad, didn't mark as reply. I was replying to this ^

I have seen a lot of fastapi in some job postings, I'm applying to some just because but I don't really expect to get any calls until I build out my portfolio more.

I've already built most my current app with Flask but nothing wrong with learning both. I'll probably build another project with fastapi next.

I haven't really looked into it at all yet

[fringe sphinx]

Background check is diff from reference check. References checked before offer. Background check, as is used commonly, refers to criminal check and is post offer.

[pastel thunder]

process going on for last 2 months and 19 days lmao

yeah, for me too,. apart from delays, everything else is good.

[smoky quest]

still haven't closed an offer?

(I thought you were in negotiation)

[pastel thunder]

😢 roughly discussed range of "base" i want
then they say VP on leave , 4-5 level of approval needed

[smoky quest]

tbh, smells bad. Closing should happen fast as "time kills all deals".
I would continue talking to them to use that for leverage with another company, but I would be scared from their process

[pastel thunder]

I am interviewing at other places, but this is my first preference.

they said VP on leave till 1st(today), they havent post poned something which was already post poned, lets see what happens next week

I think it was beneficial for me, as I got a hint that I am low balling a little, I will ask on higher side,

yes, monday again I have one on-site round at some place

[smoky quest]

so you are saying the VP needs to micromanage 4 layers down

[pastel thunder]

so, recruiter said VP will approve, and he is on leave
HR said 4-5 levels of approval needed, so expect to get response by next week.

[smoky quest]

so you are saying the VP needs to micromanage 4 layers down :pithink:

[pastel thunder]

may be yes, or could be an excuse

[smoky quest]

yeah, either way it's BS

[pastel thunder]

but things move verrrryyyyyyyyyy slowly their, I have experienced it first had
during interview and lunch

[smoky quest]

Yeah, so if they are THAT slow to hire, think about how SLOW they will be on day to day

[pastel thunder]

I personally, think work life balance will be better,
and I can do some personal stuff, so its fine, as long as they give an offer

[smoky quest]

yeah lifestyle companies can be great for your personal life.
Just make sure you don't get stuck in it though. I have seen it happen where people freak out after 2 years when they need a new job and have nothing to show for

[pastel thunder]

funny, thing I remember from interview:
Whole office seemed empty, then suddenly during lunch, the food area got flooded.
and
then after lunch a good percentage of emplyees (including me and my interviewer) had a walk for around 30 min

[smoky quest]

Been there done that. I would suggest to look at their fundamentals and how strong they are. These signs typically lead to either toxic things that render employees checked out, or company going downhill and having to lay off and shape up

[pastel thunder]

so, its a pretty big company, they mentioned, they didnt lay off during the covid also(only did performance based 2% lay off)

[smoky quest]

I am just making sure you are informed and not getting into these situations blind.

Note also there is more than one way to skin a cat 😉

[pastel thunder]

had to ask openai to decode this for me

so, now that you say it
One flag I noticed, was that when I asked "what do you expect me to achieve within 1 month of joining"
his smiling face changed to serious one and he critically mentioned, he expect I do not need hand holding after a month or so. and should look like 1 more person is contributing to the team
now I am afraid

not scared about that, but the experession change, seemed like he was acting all the time before that

[vapid jay]

can someone review my resume please

what?

oh okay one sec

thanks😊

okie and these projects are they worth adding?

ill do that

thanks a lot

should i remove that certificate section completely?

they look very pale idk ill remove it

udemy isnt a big deal ig
thanks dude ill implement these things😊

any tips about github or linkedin? @turbid bobcat

i was searching for an internship wantes to gain experience with some real life projects

haha with my current skills do you think ill get one?

ill give it a try needed this push🥹 thank bro

[eternal summit]

Hey guys I'm currently trying to find a niche I want to explore within SWE. I'm trying to figure out what area I can explore without that much math or much math in general, currently know python sql java any recommendations or advice would be great, I'm also a 3rd year uni student

[tardy sierra]

hey guys! i am looking for feedback on my personal website / portfolio. I'm trying to figure out a good way to maybe display more things on the projects page, but I am wondering how the UI looks to everyone and if there are any things that could use a rework. https://debugr.net

[gritty rivet]

When I think Python+SQL I think Data engineering or backend web.

Have you looked for internships in either of those areas?

[balmy spade]

I second the option of internships. "without that much math" covers a huge area of technology. Though, I suppose that depends on what you call "much" in math.

[buoyant seal]

Server side options: Backend development, Data engineering, DevOps engineering.
Desktop development: Windows/MacOS development.
Mobile development: Android, IOS.
Embedded development exists, but it asks a different tech stack from yours.

As person with Java, you can go at least Backend/Data engineering, Desktop development and Android development 🙂
Backend and Android dev with Java i know at least very popular. How much desktop Java is a thing not sure exactly, but i saw IDEs and banking apps made as desktop in Java, and even games (Yay to minecraft), probably a thing too.

[errant thicket]

who could i network with people here anyone? would like to network?

[pine sleet]

It may be more valuable to you if you networked with people you already know IRL

[errant thicket]

i don’t have any friends that code or anybody i know that’s why i asked in here

[pine sleet]

Local tech meetups are good places to meet other tech people

[fringe sphinx]

Besides what Robin said, contributing to OSS is another strategy. It's not as personal as meeting people IRL, but you can build a reputation through your contributions that's more tangible than just some discord comments.

[pine sleet]

yeah very true ^ seen it first hand

[errant thicket]

ok thanks

[errant thicket]

what’s oss ?

[whole flare]

Open source software

[eternal summit]

I just find it kind of hard to really pinpoint positions because they ask for so many different things and a lot of them go under a broad title

[eternal summit]

def will check these out, fill me in more about embedded, I heard I can get into that with python as well. I also did want to check out ai/lml I spoke to a fe devs they said if your not building the LLMs and algos from scratch then math isn't as necessary, not sure how true it might just be very situational

[buoyant seal]

Embedded people deal with Arduino, microcontrollers. Capable to design their own computer mouse, xbox controller, or "smart house"
Majority of market asks for profficiency in C/C++. Some extra languages can be asked in addition, from python to C#, and sometimes even others
Highly likely "assembly lang" knowing is part of their common skills

[fringe sphinx]

Open source software. There are many projects out there, from single dev projects that need a partner to large projects that have a backlog of bugs to fix.

https://docs.github.com/en/get-started/exploring-projects-on-github/finding-ways-to-contribute-to-open-source-on-github

[smoky quest]

This has nothing to do with careers. Feedback for the server should be given to #community-meta

<@&831776746206265384> shitposting

[sweet lintel]

My badddd

[wheat hatch]

Re Embedded: It's like darkwind says, C/C++ is very common. Assembly I'd say not so much in an interview context but it is very valuable to know for the actual work you do. The issue with assembly and embedded is that sometimes you work on these strange ass cpu's that are not x86 or ARM based, basically forcing you to throw any prior assembly language knowledge you have before the job out the window and keep just the general concepts of operation.
Languages like python, sql, java, etc can be used for testing and data analysis. I use python quite a lot in my job to make sense of log data that the chips spit out. We also have a test framework built in java.
There's also a quite large spread when it comes to embedded. The chips I work on are all in house developed. In-house cpu, in-house assembly language, in-house compiler. Other embedded devs sometimes work on commercially available chips, meaning their work can be vastly different than mine.

[umbral frigate]

!topic not really appropriate for this channel, which is about career discussion btw

[inner wren]

Off-topic channels

There are three off-topic channels:

• #ot0-psvm’s-eternal-disapproval
• #ot1-perplexing-regexing
• #ot2-never-nester’s-nightmare

The channel names change every night at midnight UTC and are often fun meta references to jokes or conversations that happened on the server.

See our off-topic etiquette page for more guidance on how the channels should be used.

[brave swallow]

thats sensitive topic and not really related to python or programming in general

[umbral frigate]

If you don't feel comfortable feel free to touch grass until July.

It's not about liking it. It's about respect.

[twin sonnet]

guys is it possible to clone an existing telegram bot when you don't have an access to its code?

[umbral frigate]

https://www.python.org/community/diversity/

Then just ignore the LGBTQ and talk about Python instead.

[fringe sphinx]

We take our channel topics seriously. You're off topic in the career channel. If you'd like to discuss the server branding, see #community-meta

[fringe sphinx]

You should ask in #python-discussion

[errant thicket]

backlog of bugs to fix is that why it is alot of dev sometimes to fix large projects ?

[fringe sphinx]

Yes, big projects have -many- bugs. What Python packages have you used recently?

[errant thicket]

just webscraping modules and pygame i like to webscrape and make bots

[fringe sphinx]

Have you looked at their git issues? Look for any tagged 'good first issue'

[errant thicket]

i see and if like webscraping and bots should i continue to code those ?

[fringe sphinx]

Yes, build what you enjoy and get better at it. The skills you learn will easily transfer to other types of projects.

[paper mica]

I choose software development.
What language do i need to learn?

[fringe sphinx]

"need" is a strong word, but: Most people nowadays start with Python. Learn python, get good at it. Once you're good at that, then ask the question: What should I learn next?

[grim spire]

hetero pride month when

Uganda kids pride month when

there's nothing with respect, it's just business

[fringe sphinx]

How about: stay on topic when?

You can discuss the server branding in #community-meta

[copper marsh]

i’m new to python and have no sense of direction as to how to learn, should I use learning courses or should I start by reading the automate the boring stuff

[queen lark]

mess around with syntax

[near ocean]

The book is very good and includes projects you could do that are closer to real, practical projects

[copper marsh]

ok thanks

[silver jacinth]

Do a quick search

[true hatch]

Corey Scahfer is good, he is on YouTube

!res

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[silver jacinth]

Microsoft has a GitHub for getting started with Python. Depends on what you're planning on doing

[fringe sphinx]

A simple tutorial plus hang out in #python-discussion : there's many people learning like you there

[fierce hill]

Bye python cowders

[warm geode]

Does anyone have any projects for a beginner as python to do

[sour iron]

https://github.com/practical-tutorials/project-based-learning

[kindred oyster]

<@&831776746206265384>

[fringe sphinx]

!kin

[inner wren]

Kindling Projects

The Kindling projects page on Ned Batchelder's website contains a list of projects and ideas programmers can tackle to build their skills and knowledge.

[wispy lichen]

Hi, as an ML engineer or a computer vision engineer, how much are you expected to know about algorithms such as BFS, DFS, A*, etc? For these careers/interviews, will they ask about stuff like this or more about linear regression, SVM, PCA, etc?
I will still review this info but wanna know if I should do LeetCodes for BFS, DFS, etc.

[white relic]

I would expect anyone applying for an engineering position that involves a substantial coding element to be able to explain the difference between BFS and DFS as well as other stuff covered in a basic algorithms class

[jolly sluice]

Dang

Well I sure can't atm.

[wispy lichen]

true

[white relic]

Well, have you ever taken a college course in algorithms and/or data structures?

[white relic]

That's where I would expect most people to be exposed to those concepts

[pastel thunder]

how lunch happens? when there is an onsite round and there is no food facility in office

[true harness]

should just ask the company that question

[pastel thunder]

i mean concern is not taking in the calorie, but the awkwardness while buying etc

i am taking a flight, cant bring lunch box, wouldnt it be wierd if i start eating cookies, lmao

they will probably have lunchbox, i will be the odd one, lol

[smoky quest]

Buy some food on the way or at the airport

[smoky quest]

this is not middle school anymore. No one cares if your mom cooked your lunch or buy to go somewhere

[pine glen]

Very truly spoken

[white relic]

If you're onsite for an interview I would expect lunch to be provided. It is reasonable to ask

[covert cairn]

i have a month for my comp sci as exam and i can barely code anything in python

how can i learn it in a week

[smoky quest]

practice hard

[covert cairn]

it doesnt make sense to me

[smoky quest]

why not?

If you have an exam in a week about driving a car -> practice hard
If you have as math exam next week -> practice hard
If you have a cooking exam next week -> practice hard

[covert cairn]

i am practicing hard for maths engeneering but when it comes to comp sci I have no idea how to even start

[smoky quest]

You could review your classes

[covert cairn]

My teacher would just give us a powerpoint and not really teach

[smoky quest]

what is inside the powerpoint?

And how does it prevent you from practicing? If that source of knowledge is not great, then pick another one

[covert cairn]

number systems oop etc

[pastel thunder]

for every specific topic that you dont understand, see some youtube videos

[smoky quest]

!resources

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[smoky quest]

sounds like python to me

[covert cairn]

thx

[smoky quest]

The sooner you start, the more time you have to practice and ask questions here and to your teacher

[jolly sluice]

No I haven't been to college yet B)

[wispy lichen]

Do you guys think having a cs related degree is key to getting a job in the field or is just having the skills and knowledge the key?
I hear ppl get cs jobs after boot camps and such so not necessarily having a college degree.

[smoky quest]

It's like saying "I work in a hospital". The janitor sure got a job in the hospital, but not the same pay nor responsibilities than the neurosurgeon.

A CS degree is the path of least resistance and with the most opportunities and compensation

[fringe sphinx]

Education (a degree) is very important. As is experience and ability

[wispy lichen]

Ok ty both appreciate it

[acoustic robin]

The hardest thing about getting into a career in software is getting that first job. A degree makes it much easier to get over that hurdle.

Once you've got 5 years experience, the difference between devs with degrees and those without is pretty small.

though there will always be some employers who require a degree, so you will have slightly fewer employment options without one.

so having a degree isn't a requirement, but it will remove a lot of hurdles that someone without a degree will face.

[smoky quest]

It's a matter closer to plausibility than possibility. In abstract anything is possible.
Furthermore one has to consider gains compound. As such, after a few years of experience, while what was done recently will matter more than what was done 5-10 years ago (ie. a degree), these things done over the last 5-10 years were made possible by the skills and opportunities provided by a degree

[acoustic robin]

Oh, I agree that getting a degree is a good idea if you want to pursue a career in programming.

just saying it's not a hard requirement.

[regal axle]

I am looking to get out of what I have been doing (freelancing / contract / consulting work.) Tired of being a big fish in a small pond etc etc.

I want to do what I call D2D work. Dev to dev. As in tooling. But honestly, this type of thing doesn't have a good name. What do companies call this type of thing? What job "title/description" should I be looking for, for this type of work? I am fine with doing backend related work. But most ideally that isn't the focus.
Finishing up a big client and then going to start applying to stuff

[smoky quest]

it depends on the role

[smoky quest]

"tooling" "devops" "devex" "platform engineering" might be interesting keywords

[acoustic robin]

well yeah, having a degree will open up more opportunities. But there are plenty of working software devs in a variety of roles without one.

[smoky quest]

so basically you are saying it depends on the role

[acoustic robin]

I don't know of any specific role that requires a degree across the board. But there are definitely companies who won't consider anyone with out a CS related degree for any programming role.

but there are definitely roles that will be easier to get into with a degree.

[smoky quest]

companies that require more advanced skills like things related to optimization problems, compilers, AI/ML, etc. are very likely to demand something like a degree

[acoustic robin]

true. But at least some of the companies doing those things will look at experience in lieu of a degree.

if you really want to get into one of those fields, a degree is definitely the way to go.

[smoky quest]

which is like asking fora unicorn and goes back to the plausibility

like in my roles, we are open to people without a degree. But realistically, no one without a degree meets the bar. So they don't get in interviews

[acoustic robin]

I think how important a degree is really depends on what your long term career goals are. But I'll stand by my statement that there are a large number of jobs in software development available to people without one, and so a degree will make things easier, but is not a hard requirement for a career in software development.

[smoky quest]

I still think it's misguided but everyone is entitled to their opinion

[regal axle]

I am very confused. It sounds like you guys agree with each other

[acoustic robin]

I think we agree that a degree is a good idea, but disagree on whether you really need one or not.

[smoky quest]

The distinction is more about the fact that not having a degree is not an alternative path. It's a failure mode

[regal axle]

Yea. But the last time I went looking, I found a lot of lump positions. As in, they just kinda lumped everything under the sun into one position. Now, that is the fault of the company; but I could tell that they leaned more in one direction and seemed more to say "it would be nice if you knew these other things too".
What I am getting at, is, are there any specific things I should look out for, for jobs that focus on tooling even if they are being put together with other responsibilities?

[balmy spade]

Wouldn't the number of developers and tech employees in the field without a degree somewhat counter the declaration that having no degree is a failure mode?

[acoustic robin]

If degrees were cheaply available for everyone, I'd agree. But given the reality that a college degree is either not a viable option, or comes with a massive financial burden for some people, I do view it as a viable alternative path.

[smoky quest]

there isn't really a job for "write tools for engineers". There is always an angle to it, the outcome.
Writing a tool is a mean to an end, not an end itself

[smoky quest]

It's an investment, not a cost

[regal axle]

100%; I understand that. That is why I want to see if anyone has insight for things to look for when looking at those positions

[acoustic robin]

sure, but it's an investment that many people cannot reasonably make.

[regal axle]

Some investments have far too high of an upfront cost to enter. I would love to invest in real estate. But I can't just do that.

[smoky quest]

there are a few different paths including but not limited to student loans, or community colleges and in-state colleges.

It becomes the choice between saving 100k and then making 50k$/year versus spending 100k and then making 150k/$ as starting salary

[acoustic robin]

I know plenty of no-degree devs who 5 years into their career are making over 100k, and a fair number with degrees who are making well under 150k.

[smoky quest]

great for them, but they are the exception rather than the norm

skipping college is one of the worst mistake one can make for their career

[regal axle]

You say that like this is a binary choice.
What if you are not in a stable enough point in your life to do that? What if you are unsure about that path? What if you need to make money now becuase you have responsibilities over other people?

[acoustic robin]

I think we all agree that it's a good idea to get a college degree if you're able.

[smoky quest]

Then that means you will be at the bottom of the totem pole.
One could say similar things for many minorities or people who are handicapped and who have not gotten the same opportunities

[fringe sphinx]

Tbh, the job market right now isn't the job market of 5 years ago. 5 years ago, I had to dig deep when interviewing

[acoustic robin]

but seem to disagree on whether everyone is really able or not.

[fringe sphinx]

Even then, non degree candidates often had other tech experience or something to support their transition: more than just high school and boot camp.

[balmy spade]

I don't think it's been suggested that the no degree route is easy or can be done without something to support the move.