career-advice

[fringe sphinx]

It's not a problem: but you asked why you're not getting hits, and I'm suggesting this may be a factor.

[strange pumice]

hmmm fair, could be a factor

[fringe sphinx]

(especially if you list the campus)

You could just not mention the campus.

[strange pumice]

i did list the campus,

[strange pumice]

apart from that anything else?

[fringe sphinx]

It's not bad, and I don't say that often.

[true harness]

are you looking for jobs in the US in the area you would be moving back to?

[fringe sphinx]

There's a few places I'd love to see a little more details. You don't mention languages in the projects (I know, from the other keywords, but recruiters are not that knowledgeable)

Phrases like "for enhanced functionality" are lost opportunities to say something interesting.

I'm sure GPT helped you with the phrasing, but it's not too bad... "spearheaded" twice is a flag to me 🙂

[strange pumice]

Yeah i am. More opportunities back there, i mean there are opportunities here but not as much and very very picky

[fringe sphinx]

If you're moving back to a city, I would prepare one version of your resume with that city/state on it. You're more likely to get hits from closer companies.

[strange pumice]

noted, thanks for the tip. Yes i used chatgpt with the phrasing i guess i should go more natural?

[strange pumice]

I see. But where do i post/publish out the resume?

im seeking for jobs as head-start since i just graduated college,

[mystic violet]

If you can, getting a CS degree is highly advised

[strange pumice]

i have a cs degree

[mystic violet]

Its the path of least resistance with the most opportunities

[mystic violet]

Its for anyone whose reading, not aimed at you sorry

[fringe sphinx]

I guess you'd check the usual places... LinkedIn, etc. The better thing is to work your "network": any friends, classmates, family members, friends of family members, etc.

[strange pumice]

im also looking for tips in job search, right now im trying linkedin, glassdoor, 4daywork.io, and some sites. I do think i might get a call since i started applying like last week.

ALso one huge problem i see is wanting people with at least 3+ years industrial experience, so fishing for entry-level is kinda hard.

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, entry level is brutal right now, from what I hear. You're a little late to the game for the recent graduates, so be prepared for some delay.

[mystic violet]

Public static void, it would be more suitable for you to use written communication instead of the pikachu emoji. I have no way of knowing what you mean

[whole flare]

In that case, what is the path of most resistance? 🤔

[fringe sphinx]

I do think pikachu emoji means: pika pika pika. I've been here long enough to learn that.

[strange pumice]

also i wanted to ask you for my experience, will it count. i didnt really get a coding swe internship, worked as a software instructor tho. You think i should scrap that andd add more projects.

[mystic violet]

You can ask billybolly, they sure are an expert on that front

[fringe sphinx]

No, that's great

[whole flare]

Interesting..

[fringe sphinx]

Staying in bed?

I am indeed a pro at sleeping in.

[whole flare]

Thanks, I need to show this to someone.

[mystic violet]

oh MOST?

[strange pumice]

alright cool. thought as much. one of my friends offered me a part time job as a devloper for his startup so doing that right now to pad my experience. I'm developing the website he needs for his company.
Cool thing is im working with one other dev

[mystic violet]

i thought you said least... oh you edited your post

[fringe sphinx]

That's great. Any experience is good experience.

[whole flare]

🗿

[strange pumice]

really?

[whole flare]

It was always most 👀 I was just curious

[true harness]

i think the experience needs more detail. the first and second bullets say essentially the same thing. could you write more about what specifically you taught other than just "essential basics of web app building"? what were they able to build after your teaching?

[fringe sphinx]

Also, hang out in #python-discussion and try to answer questions. You'll learn a lot. Watch Python conference videos, you'll be amazed at how many smart people there are out there doing interesting things.

[mystic violet]

Hello, what did you mean by the pikachu emoji?

Apparently it usually connotes confusion in this server? Im not sure though

[strange pumice]

noted

[strange pumice]

that's a good criticism.

[strange pumice]

sure!

Ig network really is the real deal

[true harness]

i would slim down the Relevant Coursework section. my "philosophy" is that as a CS major, it is expected that you will have taken the core courses like "programming", dsa, stat, calc, and so on, so these core courses are just taking up extra space. so i would only put in this section electives that are specific to the position you're applying for. so if you're applying to web dev, put the "Web Programming" course on, and remove some of the machine learning ones because they aren't as relevant

[whole flare]

Indeed, networking is the real deal.

[smoky quest]

show, don't tell

[fringe sphinx]

For sure. Without network, your resume is just another anonymous piece of paper. You might get an interview. With a network, your resume is more likely to get to the right person... especially for mid/smaller companies.

[true harness]

i had a tutoring volunteering thing on my resume at some point, and i listed the types of things i taught and what they were able to build (fun drawings with turtle)

[mystic violet]

As a published author, agreed.

[smoky quest]

• if you are a team lead, how big was the team? How was your leadership?
• Any cool things in your projects that demonstrate expertise?

[strange pumice]

i see. Guess i have to start askin those i know to actively refer me. it does make sense in a way.

[fringe sphinx]

You also don't have to be too transactional ("asking for a job"). Bigger picture, just stay in touch and be curious about their jobs.

Like, if you have some friends who graduated recently, get in touch, ask about their company, maybe grab lunch when you're back stateside, etc.

[true harness]

yeah. be actually interested in them. people don't want to be used, so if you approach with the intent of just getting a referral, it's not going to work out great

[strange pumice]

It was an AI hackathon, develop a project leveraging AI to solve solutions. I was the main leader, assembled the team, delegate tasks, set the goals and targets

i wanted to put those put it was beyond 1 page.

[smoky quest]

I would remove or reduce some of the fluff (git and github do not deserve a whole line, that's basic) to make space for it

[whole flare]

I had that happen to me actually, dude texted me to ask my boss for a job

[strange pumice]

i see

[true harness]

well there's a lot of whitespace you could cut. there seems to be 2 newlines between "Desktop Chat Application" and "Reddit Stock Scraper". like recursive_error said, you already listed SQL, maybe you don't need to list both postgres and mysql to shorten that line. also looks like there's 2 spaces between "Django REST framework" and "express.js". could also look into making your contact info section shorter

[strange pumice]

by "philosophy" you mean courses relevant to what i want to specialize in igh?

[true harness]

that's just the word i picked for "approach", i forgot "approach" existed for a second. but yes, i think you should only list courses that are directly relevant for a specific job role. by extension that means you should have different versions of your resume for each role

[strange pumice]

so overall drop the thing that is basic and required and fundamental for the role?

[true harness]

yeah. obviously as a CS major, you have taken intro programming, so it's just wasting space. on the other side, the fact that you have taken Web Programming or Mobile Applications may not be as relevant for an ML role

[strange pumice]

what about dsa, like big companies will require you do some coding interviews, so o need?

[true harness]

same thing; all CS majors take it, so it's not helping you stand out (imo)

[smoky quest]

think about it from the other side: your resume is your one page ad. If you focus and talk a lot about basic things, it will be interpreted as if it is something difficult and that you are proud of. Which means basic things are super advanced for you and as such does not make you look like a strong candidate

[true harness]

also there's an extra leading space for your "Managed data storage and persistence using PostgreSQL." bullet

[smoky quest]

So you should still mention them, but spend a lot more time on the advanced and cool things you did

[smoky quest]

DSA is basic stuff, unless we are talking about some complex graph algorithms

[strange pumice]

i need to work on the formatting thanks.

man, making a resume is alot of work ngl

[true harness]

it is a skill you need to learn, but it gets easier as you do it more

[strange pumice]

That actually makes sense and i think thats one of the reasons for not getting a callback in the few job app i applied to.

[smoky quest]

I think the thing that hurts you the most is that most of your descriptions can be paraphrased as "built a django backend with a postgres db". That doesn't really sell the expertise or passion

[strange pumice]

im interested in web and app developmen kind of roles, so i will include mobile development role. however i do not have any real project fullstack app project to show outside of uni project(which is just a mere gui)

[strange pumice]

i see,

[smoky quest]

so in the end, it's not bad. But it's not standing out either when I have thousands of applicants to choose from

[strange pumice]

thanks for the feedback guys, honestly this was very helpful. I'm going to rework the resume and repost it for more improvements. Learned lots today

[smoky quest]

so think about the things you did in these projects that were deep or cool. Something that was special

[strange pumice]

alright

@true harness do you think i should remove the relevant coursework altogether cause i'm contemplating it

[true harness]

if you need the space for something else, sure. in general it's more descriptive to mention the skills you learned and how you applied them in a full bullet than just saying you took a course

[strange pumice]

i think ill do it, space is very vital need to sell myself.

i also think i need to make a portfolio website as well might help

[smoky quest]

Rule of thumb is to expect the first pass to happen in less than 30-45s. As such, a portfolio can help as a bonus, but your resume should stand on its own without anyone clicking on any link and you should not expect anyone to click on anything.

[lost cypress]

Sounds great thank you

[drowsy cove]

Any advice as I am looking at a potential career pivot. I previously cofounded my own business in the office equipment industry, I built our accounting / finance structure starting without any experience, I learned everything from the internet courses, books and mentors (I say that because even though my role was CFO/COO I do not have the academic background in either finance or accounting)... I still have a passive ownership in that business but I documented everything to the point of outsourcing the role and felt I needed a change. Now I am looking into software development and trying to figure out the best way to break in. Currently doing an online bootcamp but I have the sense there is a still a huge knowledge gap I need to close. My back of academic background does concern me. Anyone have advice, direction, or experience they could share, it would be much appreciated!

[strange pumice]

@true harness @fringe sphinx is it a good idea in projects to mention the framework, or just use the language

[true harness]

imo both. e.g.

[strange pumice]

i mean in project, like previously i said, built the backend with django rest framwork. Should i say something like

Built API with Python using django framework

[true harness]

ah. then also yes, usually

[strange pumice]

alright

[true harness]

anything that can lend credence to you having a particular skill. if you want to show that you can use DRF, perhaps you want to mention what you did with it, e.g., "Used DRF to build an API that serves 1000 requests per second" or something. again, show, don't tell

[strange pumice]

for the desktop application i used kivy for the frontend

think i should include that, and not just say "Python"

[true harness]

if you think it's important and relevant, then yes

[strange pumice]

imo i don't think so. kivy is less known

ther eis also the rule of using metric but idk in what way i can use it to my projects, were all hobby/hackathon projects.

[rough kindle]

I'm pro coder

Get some help at hackerrank

[pine sleet]

it's not so simple. What's your educational background? Previous work experience? You can also leave your resume here for reviews if you're having trouble getting callbacks. doing python X hours a day for Y days does not guarantee you a job

[rough kindle]

I'm studying 8th

[pine sleet]

8th grade in the U.S?

[rough kindle]

India

[pine sleet]

not sure what that would entail. does that make you around 13-14 years old?

[rough kindle]

I gonna be 9th this year

[pine sleet]

err.. wrong person

[rough kindle]

I'm 14

[pine sleet]

sorry, that message was intended towards @finite kayak

[rough kindle]

I needed help too

[pine sleet]

what with?

[rough kindle]

After I done YouTube tutorials what should I do?

Chatgpt is trash

@finite kayak it can't even add fractions

tip from wiseman

[true harness]

the bottom line is that you should meet the requirements specified by the job description of the job you are applying to

[rough kindle]

@true harness are you girl? ❤️

[dusty panther]

[rough kindle]

Any girl wanna go date with me?

[true harness]

though, as robin alluded to, it is more nuanced than that. you will need a way to stand out among the candidates that have degrees, projects, and internships

[rough kindle]

@dusty panther Hi ayre

[rough kindle]

What is your hobby

[balmy spade]

At best, you seem to have confused #career-advice with an off-topic channel. At worse, you've confused this discord as a dating service. It isn't that.

[rough kindle]

Sorry Comrade

I go to off topic

[sand patio]

we are not a dating platform, do not ping random users about this, keep it appropriate.

[strange pumice]

Need tips to enhance my swe skills, what do i go into, specifically bacend.

Kubernetes, Docker? what else. I have the skills to develop a working app but what skills should i acuire to make me more standout?

[peak halo]

databases

[strange pumice]

i already know this(had like 2 instensie courses on it, and built a personal project to be strong in this).

[peak halo]

if you want suggestions for what skills to build, you should list all your current skills.

[strange pumice]

Frontend Development - (HTML5, CSS3, JavaScript(NExt.js, React.js, JQuery), Other frameowkrs like Kivy

Backend Development: FastAPI, Django/drf, Node.js, Express.js,

Databases(SQL, NoSQL),

Essentially full stack.

There's also Machine Learning but just the basics(what i learned from college) not too super proficient in this field yet.

but my expertise is fullstack dev

Languages: Java, JS, Python, PHP

Basically what i can do very good.

[peak halo]

I wouldn't even plan to become "super proficient in ML" unless you want to totally pivot to ML and go back to school for it.

"NoSQL" is a catch all for "any database that isn't a flavor of SQL". Which ones do you actually have experience with?

[strange pumice]

MongoDB, although ive worked on cassandra a bit.

but not to the level i can add to my resume

[peak halo]

So you don't currently have experience with docker? Then yes, I would look into that.

[strange pumice]

yeah 0 experience with devops sort of thing

[strange pumice]

any good resources or books on it i wanna become very good in swe

also im more python oriented, so im looking to learn Go or C++ i think this will boost me up. cause a good sizable number of Jobs request C++/C or Go

[strange pumice]

yeah i don't think i want to pivot to ML, i think my basic understanding is alr.

[peak halo]

I don't. Everything I know about docker, I picked up from some situation at work that required it. A good place to start might be to write a dockerfile that makes an image for a project you've created or might want to deploy.

(also you need to understand what a container and an image are for the dockerfile to make sense.)

[strange pumice]

@peak halo for desired salaries what should i give im always thrown off with this type of questions

[peak halo]

Look on glass door

[strange pumice]

alr

[charred orbit]

Should I drop out

[smoky quest]

It's super vague. In general:

• A degree is the path of least resistance and with the most opportunities and compensation
• Can you get a basic IT job? It depends on the IT job? Can you get a job? Probably

[smoky quest]

Wrong channel to ask about google support policies

[vast oak]

should i post in https://discord.com/channels/267624335836053506/291284109232308226

[smoky quest]

probably better

[sick plaza]

noncompetes a barbarous relic of feudalism finally defeated

[near ocean]

Noncompetes are not really enforceable

[gleaming wren]

its so confusing. idk if getting a masters is worth it or not. some say its not and that experience is more important. articles give the stats that it does bump income up.

[smoky quest]

It depends on your country and career goals.
Don't go for a masters to compete on frontend positions. Use it to open more advanced doors

In some countries, a masters will also greatly accelerate your career, especially into management or responsibilities

[gleaming wren]

im in silicon valley so its very competitive. economy isnt doing well. the truth is i feel like its too early for me to be interested in things like ml or ai. i took a computer vision class and that prof was kinda terrible and so i barely learnwd anything. im currently in linear analysis and this is related to ml but blah i learned the concepts but i dont feel passionate. its a stressful class

[smoky quest]

there are many more areas than ML. Be it optimization, compilers, cryptography, distributed systems, etc.

[gleaming wren]

im not smart ig. stuff like compiler construction is too much for my mind. idk i get decent grades. sometimes i get exam grades well above average. but i dont feel like i fully know what im talking about. its just a high stress environment so i end up just focusing on my grades

[gleaming wren]

those others - i dont know those but i'd be interested. i dont think i have those classes at my uni

[smoky quest]

check your uni and its classes

look up your alumni to see what jobs they are in now so you can get a sense of where it leads

[gleaming wren]

they just have computer graphics, oop, full stack, databases, computer networks which is rlly hard so i didnt take, hci which i heard everyone says the prof is terrible, ml, ai, computational cognitive neuroscience

[gleaming wren]

thanks ill take a look at that on linkedin

[smoky quest]

as a rule of thumb, things that are easy have the most people in them because it's the easiest. Thus not necessarily the most valuable.
In addition, I wouldn't let things scare you because they look difficult. That just sounds like a mental block

[gleaming wren]

i have my four year plan set out tbh. next cs classes i wanna do are ml and ai and full stack and software developement which is mandatory. and i also got gen eds to do.. so um thats all im capable of learning as upper divs aside from what ive currently gotten done

[fresh halo]

I want to convert more than one Python file to an exe file

[smoky quest]

Hi!
This is not related to careers.
You may want to check #❓｜how-to-get-help

[frigid swallow]

Hey guys I just have a question, if you got dalle -3 plus for free, would you love to use it??

[stray solar]

I have a query about recruitment assessments, if anyone can help. I was invited to a digital assessment which they said would take around an hour, this involved a coding challenge, its took me 10 hours to produce code that would satisfy the automated challenge criteria, it is not timed. Now my query is, are times collected on code challenges though there is not limit and are these code challenges results discussed on a face to face interview if it gets that far?

[fringe sphinx]

This seems very unknownable/unanswerable. You never know how any particular company works. Maybe? Maybe not?

[stray solar]

I thought i would take a punt on seeing if there was any insight on it.

It was a long shot, but though i might as well ask

[wraith ermine]

does anyone know why when i do pip install intents it gives me error and says × Getting requirements to build wheel did not run successfully.
│ exit code: 1
╰─> [54 lines of output] note: This error originates from a subprocess, and is likely not a problem with pip.
error: subprocess-exited-with-error

[vapid jay]

how do i found main ?

[fringe sphinx]

This is the #career-advice , you can ask in #python-discussion

[fringe sphinx]

See ^

[vapid jay]

bruh, someone asked something, you guys don't answer and help me, so rude

[kindred oyster]

not using correct channels is rude
no one has refused you help , you have been directed to other channel , ask there and get the help you need

[vapid jay]

no need, you guys get hard to help to people, how do you guys in the social?
idk, its bit hard to chat with you guys for me, i can see your ####

[kindred oyster]

and i wonder who is the rude one here 🤷‍♂️

[vapid jay]

yes, right, because of you guys,
i ask how do i found the main
that's all
but you guys rude for me
its just a small, tiny help

[frigid swallow]

Hi everyone! I'm working on a new website , where you can generate images for free using DALL·E 3 technology. It also features a prompt gallery where you can share, explore, and discover creative ideas. I'm curious—would this be something you'd be interested in using? What features would you like to see? Your feedback would be super helpful!

[vapid jay]

they don't

they don't help you they rude

[fringe sphinx]

You're in the wrong channel, my friend. #python-discussion is the right chnanel. This is for career discussions. Do you have a question about careers?

[frigid swallow]

Bound by rules

[vapid jay]

in your guy's theory
thats not help channel
LOL

[kindred oyster]

if someone answered the question in this channel , it may or may not work , if it did not work , you would ask some follow up question with another error , and it would continue in a conversation that is not really relevent to this channel.

BUT

if you ask the question in the correct help channel , you can do as much followup as you need without getting interrupted.

[fringe sphinx]

It's not about "rules", it's about actually getting help. This is a much smaller channel, you won't get good help here even if you tried.

[vapid jay]

i know, you guys like that
idc

[fringe sphinx]

Look, you're being incredibly rude. Please stop.

[vapid jay]

yes

<t:1713961514>
niice test timestamp

[fringe sphinx]

!mute 1134523050067513447 Please take a break and r our #rules and #code-of-conduct . Don't keep posting to this channel unless it's on topic. We have 3 off-topic channels for off topic notes, we have a #❓｜how-to-get-help help system for getting help, and a general #python-discussion for python related conversations.

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied timeout to @vapid jay until <t:1713965224:f> (1 hour).

[cinder fossil]

would be nice if this was the case in the UK

[near ocean]

🤷‍♀️ last job tried to use it to get me to stay and it didnt work, so

[cinder fossil]

was it paid tho

unpaid noncompete clauses are not binding in the UK, but paid ones are. I believe they're limiting it to only 3 months of being binding in the future though, which helps a lot (i know people with 1y+ noncompete clauses)

[fringe sphinx]

You really need about a dozen asterisks to qualify this.

They're totally enforceable in some jurisdictions, not in others, a grey area in others, and depends on how it's written, etc. then there's the question of whether someone will enforce it (whether or not they could), whether they use it as a weapon (to discourage people), whether potential employers will consider it, etc. they do have a chilling effect.

Finally, even if they aren't, it'll cost you a lot of money (in the US) and time to fight it... at which point, it's a Pyrrhic victory

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Non-compete_clause#United_States

[strange pumice]

quick question is professional summary in resume mandatory to leave a first experession? I haven't have much industry real work experience yet.
what do you say?

[fringe sphinx]

Not mandatory

[strange pumice]

alright

[fringe sphinx]

A one sentence objective -might- be helpful, if you have something interesting to say and can tailor (a little) it to job

[true harness]

i have anecdotal evidence that it might be useful to explain a relatively unusual set of experience

[queen gorge]

[near ocean]

I've been told by multiple recruiters to have one on my resume, cant see how it helps

[vapid jay]

How do I code a basic calculator in phyton

[fringe sphinx]

Wrong channel, use #python-discussion

[vapid jay]

K sorry

[fringe sphinx]

Are you on the wrong server?

[zealous cape]

No

[fringe sphinx]

Then why are you posting that here?

[peak halo]

@zealous cape randomly saying "femboy" isn't really on topic for any channel here, let alone the career discussion channel.

[zealous cape]

Is there a general chat here or off topic

[peak halo]

!ot

[inner wren]

Off-topic channel

#ot2-never-nester’s-nightmare

Please read our off-topic etiquette before participating in conversations.

[zealous cape]

Ok thx

[cinder fossil]

https://www.ftc.gov/news-events/news/press-releases/2024/04/ftc-announces-rule-banning-noncompetes

this is across the entire US right?

but yeah... the legal threat is huge. they can always just threaten to sue you for breach of contract which would be very shitty if you don't have a company willing to back you

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, waiting for the lawsuits from finance companies...

[cinder fossil]

i wouldn't be surprised if they raised notice periods

mine is 9 months with a 6mo noncompete on top of that, to prevent me from moving to another company. because finance

[near ocean]

9 months notice? How long have you worked there

[deft herald]

holy crap. Are you a contract worker or full time?

[cinder fossil]

fulltime

[cinder fossil]

heheh, only 4mo. but its the UK, a finance company, and my responsibility is quite high since I manage the company's infra

[white relic]

9 months notice is nuts
if you plan to become a stay at home parent after having kids, do you have to give notice before you start trying?

[near ocean]

9 months is crazy
Is it a startup? Its probably a startup

[cinder fossil]

loll in practice anyone who wanted to leave was put on garden leave after obtaining a replacement. so they didn't work for the entire 9 months period, only 2/3 in practice, and got paid for the rest of the time off

my contract also states the company must pay me 9mo salary as severance if I were to get fired, so it does go both ways.

[white relic]

that's still wild to me

[cinder fossil]

multi-billion dollar company

[near ocean]

I guess people are insane regardless of company size

[cinder fossil]

high notice periods are becoming increasingly common in the UK

[white relic]

in all the space of possible reasons why someone might want to leave a job, requiring them to hang around and work for multiple months after they've decided to leave seems like a huge potential liability

especially if they're the kind of worker who you also demand noncompetes from

[cinder fossil]

it's also to guard against poaching. during covid especially, people kept hopping roles and started racking up pretty insane salaries - the average price per head was almost £1m/yr at one point in this field

[near ocean]

Just leave when youre ready tbh, whats the worst that could happen

[true harness]

sued and rolled and smoked

[cinder fossil]

yeahh, would probably get smacked down by legal

[near ocean]

Doubtful, what kind of judge would side with billion dollar corpo cringe over breaking a 9 month notice

Is that even legal? Just cause its in a contract doesnt mean it is

[white relic]

sorry, you are a slave for 9 more months

[cinder fossil]

it is, for now. soon enough it wont be - UK is lowering the maximum cap to 3mo iirc

maybe that was for noncompete clauses actually. still, hopefully will be reduced in the near future aha

[white relic]

I assume there are legal allowances for if you have a major family event or health problem or something

[true harness]

hit by a car? we'll just move you to remote for a few months 🚙 🏥

[white relic]

doesn't the UK also have forced retirement? man y'all have some strong opinions about when people are allowed to work /s

[cinder fossil]

nah, i think that was abolished over a decade ago

[digital fjord]

I've seen this whole "X month notice" thing before, but usually when they just get paid to basically not take another job.

[white relic]

good to know, I'm sure my information came from 1990s TV

[cinder fossil]

yeah, that's pretty much it. the process here is usually

give in notice
-> start finding and training replacement
-> get put on garden leave for the remaining duration of your notice.

you then get a very long sabbatical and during that period cannot undertake a job at a competitor, but are able to work elsewhere. however if you pick up another job, they stop paying you your garden leave salary immediately

just checked the contract wording, and this seems to be the case. almost all the wording is referring to "Competitive Activity" and doesn't seem to restrict working in non-related fields, given there is an explicit clause mentioning the termination of payment

oh yeah no there's an explicit clause allowing alternative non-competitive employment during that notice period too

so I could migrate sectors from finance to, say, big tech without issue

although I expect myself to stay here for quite a long time, so I don't see that happening anytime soon. and who knows what the laws will be in 3/4/5yrs time

[whole flare]

Are we talking about employees or smoked salmon sushi at this point?

[carmine plank]

does anyone know how display the data in horizontal, thanks

[vapid jay]

how i can learn programming?

[deft herald]

!resources

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[vapid jay]

what is this?

[deft herald]

a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend

[vapid jay]

nice this is helpful,thanks

[gritty rivet]

Yes

I dabbled around with it for years as a hobbyist before I got serious about trying to do it professionally, but when I did, less than a year.

Things that I believed helped me:

• Timing (made the switch over two years ago when the market was a lot better
• Having a degree
• Having professional experience, including years of desktop support/help desk
• Being in the US

A key final step for me was doing the Nucamp Backend bootcamp, but if you have the discipline to be fully self-taught that's probably just as well

Everyone is different but you could learn a lot that way.

You could very well be as good as I was when I got hired.

[smoky quest]

What is your goal? What are you trying to accomplish?

[gritty rivet]

You should focus on getting a degree

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, this is common in quant worlds too.

[gritty rivet]

Yes, if you're that serious about programming, a CS degree is the way to go

There is no way I'd have been hired fresh out of high school for this job, even if I were twice as good as programming

Degree and professional experience.

And again, market is way more competitive now. And remote or not, it also depends on the country

[cinder fossil]

without a degree, you need provable professional industry experience at a relevant role to the job you're trying to get. and a lot of companies set a degree minimum (esp. for junior roles), since its effectively a free filter.

its still doable nowadays without one, but significantly harder.

[near ocean]

Degrees are a must

Just because there could be a 0.001% chance you could find a job without it, doesnt mean you should risk it

[gritty rivet]

Find a way to get a degree. If you think it's impossible you're probably wrong

If you can get a BS in Europe and do well, you can come to the US for an MS or PhD and they will pay your tuition to teach or be a research assistant. And that will be your best bet to get sponsored for a work visa after

[smoky quest]

A CS degree will be the path of least resistance and with the most opportunities and compensation

To get a degree, you will likely spend 12h per day for 3-5 years non stop

[pastel thunder]

how to win a salary negotiation?

[gritty rivet]

The odds are extremely unlikely, especially if you hope to make an actual living and not just pocket change on Fiverr or Upwork

[cinder fossil]

I've seen a lot of people try to go without one thinking they'll be the one to win out, and they never do.
Even the ones that scored pretty highly on the technical skills. Unless they have connections to hop into industry experience immediately out of high school (e.g. via a parent) they tend to falter until they get a degree, where things pick up again.

It's a big shame, but the market is just too competitive nowadays.

[smoky quest]

Also one thing to note: your salary is based on your location, not the company HQ. So your salary would still be the same than any company local to your country

[pastel thunder]

should you never tell you expectation?

[true harness]

college is more like 45 hours a week at most, for a full time student

[whole flare]

🤔

[smoky quest]

depends on the country

[cinder fossil]

and the intensity of the course tbf

[near ocean]

Kinda arrogant, dont you think?

[smoky quest]

Why would it be a waste of time considering all the things you will learn?

[gritty rivet]

I always expect the employer to give a range before I go far with the interview process.

Don't talk further about numbers until they love you and need you

[pastel thunder]

Also, what i special pay? is it counted in fixed salary?

[cinder fossil]

most people I know at oxford/cambridge/etc did about 12hrs a day of studying/coding/extracurriculars/etc

[true harness]

there are countries with 60 hour weeks, for years?

[pastel thunder]

big companies dont, isnt it?

[cinder fossil]

but I also know folks from other universities who spend maybe 10-20hrs a week doing all that. so quite location dependent, and also how much you're willing to put in too

[smoky quest]

classes + homework + projects do add up pretty quickly.
USA is pretty easy mode comparing to the rest

[whole flare]

Yes

[smoky quest]

That depends on the job 😉

[gritty rivet]

Depends where you are, but increasingly by law they all have to, and I don't want to work for some shady places that can't be upfront about their budget

[pine sleet]

why do you believe so?

[gritty rivet]

A degree is an investment that will pay returns for the rest of your career

[true harness]

doctors need 4 years undergrad, 4 years med school, some amount of years in residency. and training every year

[smoky quest]

I would like to nuance it a bit more though.
There is an art and dance as you do not want to come across as solely salary driven. And as people grow in seniority, equity becomes a more significant part of the equation

[whole flare]

not to mention college/university professors, 3-4 years undergrad + 4 years of grad school 🗿 + (A LOT OF RESEARCH)

[smoky quest]

no you wouldn't

[pine sleet]

if it was that easy everyone in the world would be an entrepreneur making a lot of money

[near ocean]

What does that even mean?

[cinder fossil]

Under the assumption you're successful. Which everyone thinks they will be, but very very very few do.

[pine sleet]

sure. you can be like bill gates or jeff bezos

[cinder fossil]

I'm pretty pushy on this topic, because one of my friends decided university wasn't for him for the exact same reason. And he's now going to be homeless shortly.

[near ocean]

Study elsewhere then

[whole flare]

Can I be like Florian Roth?

[true harness]

in the US, that would be on the low end of salaries for software devs

[near ocean]

Arent you an entrepreneur?

[smoky quest]

beggars can't be choosers

[whole flare]

I mean.. at least you tried to help him I guess

[near ocean]

So do as you're told

[cinder fossil]

if you're EU, there's plenty of choices. lotsa choices out there, lots of schemes - quite a few countries have free or low-cost tuition, and you can subsidise living costs with part time work, bursaries and grants. usually your home country will have one you could apply to even if you study abroad!

[true harness]

and, that is a very lofty goal for a startup

[gritty rivet]

Every single person I know who managed to get into the industry without a degree eventually tried to get one because they realized they needed it to continue advancing

WGU is fast and cheap and remote but I think you have to be in the US. A traditional degree has more value, can help you find good internships, etc.

[pine sleet]

there are numerous online schools, but you miss out on one of the largest reasons people go to university

the content taught in university can mostly (if not fully) found online and can be learned yourself

[whole flare]

No.

[smoky quest]

if that was that easy, everyone would do it.
Truth is that it's just unrealistic and would not happen

[whole flare]

Wouldn't that be 60k/year?

[cinder fossil]

yeah I would highly recommend in-person studying. a lot of people tend to forget that the social skills you develop there, the networking with like-minded folks, and the additional support helps significantly in later life

[pine sleet]

networking oppurtunities

[whole flare]

Seems like a fairly average salary.

[cinder fossil]

my boss had to go through 20YoE to get to the position I achieved directly out of university. I'd gladly take 4 years in university for that.

[pine sleet]

why do you want to purposely do it the harder way? getting a degree is wayy easier

[eternal shale]

hi guys..
I am a beginner in python

[pine sleet]

people can make what you described just as an intern in college in like, 2 years

[eternal shale]

from where i can start studying python

[cinder fossil]

(dependent on your country)

[pine sleet]

you say it "takes too long" but being a successful entrepreneur will take even longer

[pine sleet]

!res

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[whole flare]

right..

[pine sleet]

what makes you so sure you'll become an entrepreneur and make 2.5k in just one year?

[near ocean]

What do you think an entrepreneur does

[cinder fossil]

although yeah, the median intern salary if you put together all my colleagues was somewhere around ~ £30,000 | €35,000/yr. and thats an internship, while studying university. median mind you, so a lotta people earned quite a bit more than that

[fringe sphinx]

I feel you, it's not an uncommon desire and a lot of influencers claim you can 'mindset' your way to success. The reality is: you're competing with other people. You can choose the road less followed, but at least admit there's higher risk. (Perhaps arguably higher reward? But I'd argue this)

One of my favorite quotes is: "Chance favors the prepared mind" (Louis Pasteur)

[pine sleet]

it's not that easy. i doubt you'll be able to make any worthwhile amount of money in just one year

[true harness]

and in the US, interns get 60+ an hour in certain areas. though it's more tame in other places

[fringe sphinx]

I hear you. You can: 1. Develop practical technical skills. 2. Practice them (projects/etc). 3. Land -any- job in tech, it doesn't have to be a coder... tech support, operations, etc. anything. Get into the industry@any way you can.

[pine sleet]

you won't make a reasonable salary in just one year

well, most likely not

but there are still ways to get into the industry without a college educaiton. see what BB mentioned above, getting your foot in via alternative paths (like tech support) is a viable way

[true harness]

the most common outcome for startups is that they run out of money within a few years. a degree is a much safer bet

[fringe sphinx]

I think our point is not: 'don't do this', our point is; 'do whatever you're going to do, but be aware of the risks'

[smoky quest]

and remember the risks could be as dire as #career-advice message

[balmy mural]

You always hear about all the success stories of people starting up their own businesses. Keep in mind that for a startup, you'd still need money. From the statistics, in 2023 - 90% of startups failed. 82% of those that did fail, failed because of cash flow problems. Going the entrepreneurial route is in no way a faster/easier easier route than just getting your 4 year degree and then being able to go work anywhere you want to in Europe since you already live in the EU. School degrees are not equivalent to university degrees
https://www.embroker.com/blog/startup-statistics/

[kindred oyster]

( also dont forget that those people who did big things by dropping out , dropped out from colleges like stanford , harvard , MIT .)

[blissful gale]

hm

[brazen valve]

Could someone explain to me what return is used for in a simple way please i dont understand i just started learning functions

[peak halo]

go to #bot-commands and run !return-gif

[brazen valve]

ok thanks

[lethal fable]

Hi, my name is Charlie, an AI Engineer based in US. Looking forward to my new team.

[deft herald]

And who's your new team?

[deft herald]

There's a couple Glassdoor reviews complaining of overwork
Honestly you'll see this at any (tech) company. My biggest piece of advice to avoid this one is to set up personal boundaries asap

speaking of delivering stuff in a timely manner
This is so generic of a bullet point it's meaningless. You can assume any job would expect you to deliver stuff in a timely manner

you can always apply, interview, ask some real questions about this, and then make a decision

for this company right now?

did yuo ask any questions about work life balance or anything?

Also just know that reviews can be very biased. People who are currently working there and happy probably aren't going out of their way to write a positive review; it's gonna be a lot of people who had a bad experience and no longer work there who want to complain

I wouldn't put too much stake in glassdoor reviews

What level are you?

[true harness]

isn't "do stuff on time" the expectation?

[deft herald]

Again, the timely manner thing is dumb and should just be ignored.

How many years exp?

Ok that's still pretty junior tbh. In my experience, you can be as busy as you let yourself be. Like I said, set up early boundaries and you'll be fine

Ask stuff like "are there ever requirements to work nights and weekends? Any meetings scheduled after hours? Are deadlines typically strict or more flexible?" Etc

"please describe the typical work life balance for this team" is a good one

[turbid bobcat]

Yeah I'm gonna ask, I don't wanna get into a place that I won't like. I'm going for a long term commitment rn

[deft herald]

I mean you already thought the team was cool. That's definitely a good sign. I've had interviews before where it was completely obvious that I would not be a good culture fit

Alright. Well I would put way more stake into this experience than a few Glassdoor reviews

[mystic violet]

well, i have found a way myself

although it takes years of previous development, so not really

[burnt zephyr]

morning, do u guys think playstore is a good spot to look for gaming companies that might need data analyst? not the obviously big ones, but some other small ones...

considering it first official job, as in No Experience

[dim pelican]

I don’t enjoy design work. Where can I go to find someone to do the design work for a flask project I’m working on?

[burnt zephyr]

post it in freelancer ... there's definitely good skill waiting around

[dim pelican]

Alright, thanks.

[pine sleet]

isn't the playstore just for finding and downloading games? if you're looking for work, you should look at somewhere like indeed or linkedin

[static kindle]

Hey guys! Me and and a friend of mine are currently brainstorming some ideas for an AI-focused helper. Both of us are in highschool, looking to create a program to boost our college application. Looking to make some sort of AI QOL tool, such as this file manager: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wTQeMkYRMcw&t=22s&pp=ygUKdGFnIHN0dWRpbw%3D%3D Only problem is, we are having a hard time finding some ideas. Would love some concepts to be bounced off us, if anything comes to mind. Thanks in advance!

[burnt zephyr]

it's about the research, the developer(s) might be a person, or a small company

[pastel thunder]

some HR will still do that.
What is company is really big and work is good, how to still negotiate to get the best?

[deft herald]

Have another offer or at least be able to defend why you deserve more

[pastel thunder]

I have a lot of things to say, But you know their are these boomers who think experience matters, nothing else. What to say to them?
In terms of exp I have less then year but my publication in CVPR & my internship/research at some of the best universities and forbes top companies, makes me much more qualified then most bachelors with 1 year exp. Not to mention I have 8 technical internships in total.

[smoky quest]

same than usual, have leverage:

• being so good you are outside the norm
• have competing offers

[smoky quest]

I would suggest to avoid dissing on people because of their age or that they can't recognize your talent. That makes you sound salty and hitting some copium

[solemn merlin]

can i go to collage with no high codong experince

[pastel thunder]

I will take care, i actually wanted to refer experienced HR in general

[smoky quest]

College does not expect you to know coding

[solemn merlin]

I meant going into a coding major would it be a great idea to go in to little experince ( i am in ap csp) thats my only coding AP

[true harness]

you're ahead of about 1/3 of freshman cs students

[solemn merlin]

ahha the funny thigng is i’m a freshman in highschool

[true harness]

so you're fine

[undone glacier]

Uhhhhhhhhhh this is not about Python but about careers

Is anyone here familiar with areas or MNCs where .NET development is heavily adopted/thriving?

I was looking through FAAMG, fintech, trading companies and noticed that very few (if any) seem to use a C# or .NET stack. Mostly they are using Go, JS, CPP, OSJK (Objective-C, Swift, Java, Kotlin (Native iOS/Android)).

By comparison, .NET seems to be used mostly in/associated with consulting companies like Accenture. The only big companies I know of using .NET stack are Bing and MSN

I'm considering a 3-year contract in .NET microservices, but I can't shake the feeling that it will be investing solely into consulting tech stack (which I don't really want). Does anyone know what likely places other than consulting that a .NET dev could go with 3y exp in 2027/8?

[buoyant seal]

.net is usable for desktop development, game development (windows domain)

Also usable for backend but previously in Windows only
And last 6 years or smth like that .net stack started to support Linux deployments and became more friendly for modern developments.

U can potentially find backend dev jobs with with Linux in .net... But considering rich history with Windows it can be an issue to find real modern quality development

[digital fjord]

Here (czechia) .net webdev is about the most common stack.

[undone glacier]

game development (windows domain)

I was under the impression that most game companies are pivoting towards Unreal (cpp) now, over Unity 😕

What are some specific names for MNCs that are doing .NET/core stack?

[opal lance]

MNC stands for multinational company?

[buoyant seal]

sorry. not tracking game dev game gev that much.
But i can tell you that C# is indeed usable and supported for modern backend development
U can write infrastructure as a code in C# like in Typescript, Python, Java, Go with terraform cdks
C# is having stable support for observability solutions like opentelemetry and datadog
.net core is buildable for linux and has docker images for modern way to run backend apps
it has its own popularity as far as am aware in some first world countries with high Microsoft influence like UK. (probably in US too of course and etc)

So C# is undeed usable for proper backend dev and if filtering out ancient windows dinosaurs there is a room to navigate.
Often can be paired with Azure as cloud provider though

[vapid jay]

I am completely newbie and I got project from uni saying to build some websites useing python as backend
And I have no idea Abt backed

I have studied and did some small project on some front end useing html css and js

[kindred oyster]

this is the wrong channel for help with python , ask in #python-discussion

[vapid jay]

Ok I get it

Sorry misunderstanding

[kindred oyster]

well i dont see it anywhere , best would be to ask again or open a help thread in #1035199133436354600 so that it wont get lost again

[kindred oyster]

its alr8

[lapis wind]

<@&831776746206265384>

[pearl mango]

I'm working as a IT Helpdesk Intern and that pays me quite well as an intern, as the rate is higher than the intern market rate. That is my first job. Should I accept another system infrastructure job, with four months of probation, for the experience? The rate during the probation is lower than my intern rate, but when I'm out of probation it'll be slightly higher than my intern job.

[gritty rivet]

The purpose of an internship is more the experience and less about the money. It can also be about developing a relationship with a company you might want to work for after graduating.

If the new job will provide more valuable experience, it may be worth the temporary pay cut

The people are also critical. I wouldn't decide without meeting your new supervisor and forming an opinion about whether they will help your career growth or not

[white relic]

Internships are temporary by nature. Are you still in school? Or how do you have the choice between an internship and a (I guess) full time job?

[pearl mango]

I have been offered a job as a Security Engineer in the same company, but the entire hiring is pausing while the CEO finds a new project, so promotion is currently on hold for now.

My impression of my current internship is that the title 'intern' is representational. Which means they hire an extra labor to, sometimes, do chores for the manager. There is work but not much, and most of the time I'm free. And since it's a gaming studio, they're quite relaxing here.

[strange pumice]

in my job hunt i see lots of .NET skills needed in a lot of these jobs. Im even considering learning it, but it isn't part of the cutting edge technology

[dusky haven]

hi.

guys i hope everyone is fine. i want to start learning python..

[fringe sphinx]

!res Have you seen this list? Review this first, filter on beginner.

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[fringe sphinx]

What else would an intern be, other than: "extra labor to, sometimes, do chores for the manager."?

That said, a good manager should give work to the intern that both helps the manager and helps the intern. Having an idle intern seems pointless.

(unless said chores = getting coffee/etc)

[deft herald]

I know at least in my team, we don't hire interns unless we have a project already lined out for them

It's usually something that's modular enough to not require lots of help from others, has clear requirements, and would actually be of high value to the rest of the team

Also not critical enough to cause delays in other key deliverables from the team

[white relic]

^ criteria for the perfect intern project

[vapid jay]

hi

[white relic]

being a nominal "intern" with the promise of a promotion tied to some ambiguous future event sounds slightly sketch

[true arch]

can someone provide me with a good python notes so that i can revise for my cllg exam

[white relic]

... but being an intern with not much to do and getting paid for it (apparently indefinitely) is also odd

[white relic]

cllg?

[true arch]

collage... i mean for lifetime as well

[deft herald]

What's a collage exam? 😛

/snark

[deft herald]

You can check out the resources page the bot posted a few messages up:
#career-advice message

[true arch]

ok

[white relic]

the best people to ask about the contents of your exams would be your professor, TAs, or students who have taken the same class before you

[undone glacier]

where are you situated?

[strange pumice]

rn im in dubai, but ive been applying for jobs in the US

[undone glacier]

remote jobs? or you have multiple passports

[strange pumice]

both remote and onsite, yeah i'm a dual national

[hard needle]

hey guys

i am new on this channel

[sterile mulch]

Hello everyone I'm new here

[pine sleet]

Hi and welcome

[sterile mulch]

Thanks

[hard needle]

welcome
i am also new😀

my short intro
i am Ahmed Hassan, web developer and designer.

[true harness]

that's me 🗿 but I have a new internship starting soon which will be a lot better

[static kindle]

I promise im not a bot 😭

[deft herald]

What exactly are you looking for? And is it relevant to #career-advice ?

[near ocean]

The AI hype needs to die
My coworkers are overtly excited about copilot licenses and the like, its too much

[whole flare]

Embrace the AI bubble /j

[deft herald]

To be fair, we've been using some self-hosted internal version of copilot at our company and it's great. Nothing more than a useful tool though

[near ocean]

Maybe if it was used right
Juniors asking it how to write a list comp is not it

I dont have a real use case for it

Anyway tho, even if there was some valid use case for it, the excitement around it is unhealthy almost
Imagine a carpenter getting so excited about a new shiny saw that takes forever to give you bad answers

[vapid jay]

Are you looking for entry level jobs?

[strange pumice]

Yes

[frank mural]

Hello I am new to this server.

[wheat hatch]

Here's what I use it for:
I insert the "AI" term into my project ideas to convince management to give me resources, and it works!
Doesn't matter that the project's got nothing to do with AI, it's really just plain old boring statistics, but they love it!

[near ocean]

Marketing already beat us to it

[static kindle]

I mean yeah, I guess it is since it relates towards my career

[balmy mural]

Some of the people in our team are getting lisences and no one is really super excited. Just semi interested in what it's capable of when it gets exposed to our codebase. We only really think it can generate some boilerplate code though

[stuck urchin]

yo for job hunting
does your resume structure truly matter? Is it actually that prudent? Isn't the content the most important?

[smoky quest]

• It's your one page ad about yourself
• Rule of thumb is decisions are made within 30-45s

[true harness]

content is the most important, but if it's illegible because the words are small, it's too confusing, or whatever, then you have a problem

[tidal dove]

What are my job options for stricly python? no javascript, html, or css..... Something that doesn't require extensive math skills

[buoyant seal]

Backend developer 😄

[tidal dove]

Can you even get jobs as back end and not full stack?
i'm sure they're not very often opportunities?
As web development or?

[smoky quest]

There are quite a few backend opportunities. That said, the more interesting ones will require more math and theoretical skills.

In general, a CS degree is the path of least resistance and with the most opportunities and compensation

[tidal dove]

Thanks, any idea what types of math? I'm self taught, not getting a degree lol

[buoyant seal]

it will be hard to compete with having higher education backend too then devs.
just because they hard at least 4 years of practice before starting their first job

[smoky quest]

Without math and theory, that would pretty much limit you to CRUD style apps

[tidal dove]

What math do i need to learn? ty guys

[icy scarab]

serious question: doesn't all of these sorta meaningless layoffs push us off the cliff into a recession that we have been fighting for some time and then doesn't that make the profits decline for reals?

[smoky quest]

no

[smoky quest]

There are math linked to statistics or related to the domain you are working on (ex: optimization, distributed systems, ML/AI, etc. )

[tidal dove]

Ty guys! kinda vague for me thoguh, i'm somewhat new to coding

[gritty rivet]

I write API integrations for banks all day in Python. It's very much a pure backend role (although I do have to hack some HTML/JS together occasionally)

I have a non-relevant degree and don't know any advanced math

There are not a lot of jobs like this but they exist.

[tidal dove]

thanks @gritty rivet 🙂

[fringe sphinx]

There's a fair economic question of: can fear of recession cause a recession? That's beyond my abilities to discuss.

[balmy spade]

The question needs you to assume that the layoffs are useless, that the unemployment rate is tied to a recession, and that a recession means a decline in business profit.

[fringe sphinx]

Also that laying off employees actually has a material impact on revenue... which, for some companies, isn't necessarily true.

[south forum]

Well I've been working as a freelance developer and it hsent been going too well lately.

Like it started off great but lately just not too many offers or just way too many low ballers

[fringe sphinx]

What type of freelancing?

[outer rivet]

Hey, is anyone working in the fintech or healthtech industry?

[south forum]

mainly discord bots and backend server maintainence. ive been working with this fintech startup on a contract basis for quite a while

[south forum]

yeah and just throw in a gemini pre fed api if they ask too much😂

[south forum]

yep me

[outer rivet]

Oh, perfect! Do you work in a startup or a large company?

[south forum]

its a florida based startup

[outer rivet]

I see. I'm interested in joining a startup in either the fintech or healthtech industry. I'm a fullstack software engineer of almost 4 years and I'm interested if you've got any advice.

[south forum]

Well right now we arnt looking for any devs but my advice is start networking

like i met the owner of that business online when he was starting off and since 2021 its been working

This server itself is an excellent place to network. I believe there are a lot of business owners here.

[merry plinth]

Do most data scientists work on-site or remotely?

[summer roost]

the answer to that is probably country-dependent, and dependent on level of experience, but overall I'd assume there's significantly more working in an office than remotely

[north rune]

How can I develop these skills as someone who is self-taught?

Responsibilities:

Collaborate with and across Agile teams to design, develop, test, implement, and support technical solutions in full-stack development tools and technologies
Share your passion for staying on top of tech trends, experimenting with and learning new technologies, participating in internal & external technology communities, mentoring other members of the engineering community
Collaborate with digital product managers, and deliver robust cloud-based solutions that drive powerful experiences to help millions of Americans achieve financial empowerment
Utilize the programming language Python databases, Container Orchestration services including Docker and Kubernetes, and a variety of AWS tools and services


Basic Qualifications:

Must have hands-on experience developing software applications in Python.
Strong proficiency in Python syntax, data structures, algorithms, and object-oriented programming concepts.
Experience with popular Python libraries and frameworks (e.g., Django, Flask, NumPy, Pandas).
Experience with unit testing frameworks (e.g., unittest, pytest).
Familiarity with version control systems (e.g., Git)
Experience in APIs, Microservices,
Must have AWS - Serverless Lambdas, Fargate, Database, CI/CD, Jenkins, Docker, Kubernetes,
Some Production Support experience```
also pls ping me so I see that you replied :)

[true hatch]

how can i be motivated to do my homework? Even though it is sooooo boring

[pulsar talon]

is going to college worth it when you have all this knowledge

u can literally make a million dollar business with these skills

someone tell me if im wrong

[deft herald]

You're wrong. These skills alone will not get you a million dollar business.

[deft herald]

This is one of the most generic job descriptions lol.

[pulsar talon]

with a good business mind u can

[deft herald]

I don't believe that was mentioned in the job description

You also need an innovative idea

[south forum]

Innovative idea is the hardest part😂

[deft herald]

Exactly my point. Anyone can learn to code...

[vapid jay]

what projects should i make that yall wouild think educational institutions like schools and unis would take a liking to?

[robust frigate]

iv been a react js/nextjs dev for 6 years. i quit last year because im so sick of it. I just wrote a web scraper in python. i will work for free to get experience. to anyone out there.

intern or whatever

[mint oracle]

Hi Billy

Is master in operational research good? Is this good course for data domain?

[mint oracle]

Anyone?

[smoky quest]

Projects and experience are great ways to demonstrate your skills

[north rune]

How to get experience, just making projects?

[smoky quest]

projects are the main ones if you don't have professional experience

[neon marsh]

in todays market is very hard, just make a project and name yourself a company name on that project like a startup

[north rune]

So.. create a startup essentially?

That sounds like a startup with extra steps

[smoky quest]

that's also a whole different endeavor and job

[north rune]

I'm going to be working a 9-5 job and I don't have to pay bills or anything like that, is there any paid resources or maybe I could seek mentorship from fiverr perhaps to "spark" up my progress, kind of like having someone just review and analyze?

[smoky quest]

mentors are quite expensive and there are a lot of scammy videos around about "get a job in a faang from nothing".

You can get a lot of help online like here by asking specific questions.

[north rune]

Yeah I was thinking about just hiring a 20-50$ mentor from fiverr and just seeing where things go

[mint oracle]

Anyone!

[south forum]

I can mentor you

If you don't mind

[north rune]

Like paid or unpaid?

[south forum]

Unpaid bro

[north rune]

Oh awesome I'll shoot you a DM bro

[south forum]

Sure

[smoky quest]

Hi!
We don't allow ads for recruitment

[muted gate]

oh okay, I will remove my message. Sorry

[smoky quest]

np. Thanks!

[rough kindle]

Can anyone help me?

[plush summit]

With asking good questions or wha

[rough kindle]

What is parameter and passing parameter

[plush summit]

Ask in #python-discussion pretty easy concept try to look it up first and then ask there i you still find it vague

[ebon dove]

Hi guys i got a question

[gritty rivet]

If it's a career question, ask it. If not,. you're in the wrong channel

[mint oracle]

Anyone

[dense marlin]

Hi guys. Hope everyone's having a good one. This is my first time asking in this thread so pls correct me if by any chance im not following proper channel etiquette. Just wondering (especially for those who are tech leads and senior backend who have conducted a technical interview) what can I expect from a typical 1 hr technical interview? I understand that most likely it might be a leetcode challenge and I might need to brush up my Python skills (python cookbook) as suggested by a fellow member (many thanks for this bro). But is there a possibility it could be more like maybe I need to create a REST API or something since it's for a mid backend engineer role? Wanna hear your thoughts

well they requested that i have a Python interpreter in my system and text editor. so leetcode it is i guess. appreciate the feedback

[vapid jay]

Hi friends, want to apply for some IT jobs today, wanted to know if my GraphGL project from Intro to Computer Graphics would be a decent post on that resume.

[leaden jasper]

Hard to say without more details. How would you describe it on your resume?

[fringe sphinx]

Any project is good, as long as you can talk about it, and that you can explain your design choices/challenges/etc.

Many people list projects, and then can't engage in a meaningful discussion about it

[gritty rivet]

What is a master in operational research? Never heard of it.

If you're looking to evaluate any degree program in particular, I recommend searching on LinkedIn to see how recent graduates are doing.

[ripe ridge]

whats the website where you paste python codes?

[gritty rivet]

!paste

That's not a career question. You're in the wrong channel. But there's the link

[inner wren]

Pasting large amounts of code

If your code is too long to fit in a codeblock in Discord, you can paste your code here:
https://paste.pythondiscord.com/

After pasting your code, save it by clicking the Paste! button in the bottom left, or by pressing CTRL + S. After doing that, you will be navigated to the new paste's page. Copy the URL and post it here so others can see it.

[shrewd parrot]

Does anyone have any job boards related python jobs? Job boards on discord?

Im sorry if this is against the rules but i am looking for some leads for jobs

[gritty rivet]

There are two job boards in the channel description.

Not on Discord though. Mostly just scammers hire on discord 🤣. Try LinkedIn, Indeed, etc.

[shrewd parrot]

I have heard people say they found jobs on boards here but I dunno which boards they post jobs there not hire directly

[burnt zephyr]

hi guys, I'm trying to register to get an associates degree in computer science: But they title as "transfer degree" or "transfer preparation" .... if I get one of those, can i just call it associates degree in my resume? or are they significantly different?

[white relic]

If it isn't called an associate of something it probably isn't that

generally speaking, though, an AA or AS degree in CS isn't worth much, so that might be why it could be labeled as for transfer

[shrewd parrot]

so no legit discord for jobs?

[white relic]

besides being the wrong kind of environment for a job board, discord is hard to moderate,
so you're more likely to find scams than legitimate employment.

Which is why offering and soliciting jobs is against the rules here. Nobody wants to get involved in moderating that

[blazing hawk]

from a software engineering good coding practice stand, if a function returns nothing, is it better to omit a simple return or to leave it there?
tag me if u answer, thx

[void hawk]

Hey! I'm hiring developers who are experienced in frontend web development and python

[smoky quest]

Most popular job boards are sites like indeed and linkedin

[smoky quest]

This is the wrong place to ask. You should ask in #python-discussion or check #❓｜how-to-get-help

[ember oasis]

Define experience...

[smoky quest]

!rule 9

[inner wren]

Rules

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[ember oasis]

If you mean are active developers then cool. If you mean are paid for it....not so much

Oh, he's serious? I thought it was a gag

[ember oasis]

And I didn't ask for or offer work. I asked for a definition. Easy on the rule thumping. Be certain one was broken before you start limiting civil liberties

[smoky quest]

chill out lil bro

[vapid jay]

Hey, so I'm gathering a crack team for one last job, we need a hacker. Specifically one who codes in cpython.

. . . . . the hacker gets a free Donut.

The Donut is good, like REALLY good. . . .Like Bigly good.

[coarse crag]

I've always wondered about the required skills that people post on job advertisements and resume. Just, at what point can you assume that you already have X skill? (skills like kubernetes, docker, aws, python, etc)

Like, do you have to be an expert at it, or have lets say 1 year of experience with X, or simply "knowing how to use X" would do?

[lost tapir]

hi

[kindred oyster]

is it actually free though ? hes doing work for you , how is that free

[lost tapir]

anyone know mysql then please let me know

[kindred oyster]

yall are wayyyyyy tooo offtopic for this channel , read channel description and use the correct channels

[vapid jay]

You know, that's a good question Saul Goodman. This reminds me of childhood. Remember childhood, everyone? Going to Krispy Kreme with mom and dad, having your first Churro at Cinnabon. . .Remember that? 😄

Now, is it working for Donuts. . . ? POSSIBLY. . . But if we re frame it properly and it becomes more than a Donut. . . .We are really optimizing towards childhood memories. . . . .Is that such a bad thing?

[leaden jasper]

Let's keep this channel on topic please.

[vapid jay]

Oh crud, the law! 🏃‍♂️

[smoky quest]

It's about the 👏 demonstrated 👏 skills 👏 .
So in the case of K8s, how does that translate in terms of skills?

• Managing a cluster and being on call to resolve issues
• Being able to understand and leverage the different resources at your disposal
• Being able to manage applications on top of k8s
• Adjacent technologies relevant (ex: terraform, helm, etc.)
• How far in the deep end have you been, for instance familiarity with the internals
• Use cases and conditions under which it was used. Ex: a 5 nodes cluster is a different beast from a 500 nodes clusters
• How much of the cloud kool aid do you drink. Ex: do you have side cars, mesh networks
• How much do you exemplify the best practices (ex: observability, gitops, etc.)

And so, there is a lot of room for people with different experiences and level of expertise, even within the single realm of k8s

[true harness]

it also depends on the job. a swe on some team may not need to have as much k8s knowledge compared to another technology; maybe they just need to know a little bit. whereas for devops or sre, the expectations are higher

[smoky quest]

yeah, different roles will look at it in a different ways

[coarse crag]

i see, that makes sense. so if you were to apply to a junior software engineering position, and they require you to, say, have kubernetes skill. that probably does not mean you have to understand the internals completely, or knowing all the best practices, right? in a junior position, does it mean that "knowing how to deploy and manage cluster with kubernetes on a basic level" would do?

[smoky quest]

yep, exactly

[coarse crag]

yeah that makes more sense now. I just, didn't quite understand what recruiters wanted when they list all these skills that didn't seem like it was meant for juniors. but now I get it. Thank you!! @smoky quest @true harness

And i assume, that when you were to apply to a senior positions, you gotta know more than what they listed as the requirements. Because it is a senior position, that likely comes with a lot of responsibilities.

Tech is so hard. There are so many things going on all at once. I enjoy the dopamine though. But it's still hard regardless of whether you enjoy it or not.

[smoky quest]

seniority means you can handle larger and more ambiguous problems.
So the progression goes from implementing a ticket in a very specific manner to very businness-y and vague problems.

You can also see various career ladders used to assess the levels: https://progression.fyi/

[coarse crag]

ooo

oh wow never seen this one before. this is interesting. thanks recursive!

[hallow rose]

Hey guys so a recruiter reached out to me about a Full Stack Python Developer role and I've got a prelim interview Monday. Problem is I haven't really used Python as backend in a long time, not since I was teaching myself this stuff, I've mainly been using Node/C# as backend for my personal projects/freelance work and I've never worked formally as a developer for a company. So I was just kinda looking for advice on how to prep. This is probably only the 2nd or 3rd interview I've ever got for a developer role as well

[gritty rivet]

Ask the recruiter what to expect. Is it a technical screening or what? Research the company too

You can find lots of lists of common interview questions with different focuses online. The more you know the better you can guess what to practice

[brave swallow]

is an "on the job training" job only for college students with ojt subject. Or can a college graduate also apply for such job posts

[peak halo]

Every job will involve some form of on-the-job training. Teams that hire interns who are current university students expect to spend time developing those intern employees. Are you seeing job listing that say "on the job training" explicitly?

[brave swallow]

the career im aiming for is a backend developer, but ill try applying for ui/ux, i mean theres no loss whatsoever

its hard landing my first job but its expected so im fine with that

[hasty bridge]

https://tenor.com/view/karen-araragi-monogatari-nisemonogatari-chan-bouncing-gif-16355910

[summer roost]

?

[gritty rivet]

Applying for something totally unrelated to the skills on your resume isn't a solution. You'll need to demonstrate relevant skills and an actual interest in what they're hiring for

[brave swallow]

i mean its really not that unrelated since im also learning front end developement using reactjs

[strong hound]

is object oriented programming for python similar to java

[fringe sphinx]

It's different more than its similar. Better question in #python-discussion tho

[rough kindle]

Guys

[cedar moon]

https://thehackernews.com/2024/04/bogus-npm-packages-used-to-trick.html

Be careful with your interviews guys. I'm a python noob so I have no idea what goes in an interview but I do have my eye on computer security. IDK if its normal for a potential employer to ask you to install npm packages, but if it is, I suggest VMs

It's North Korea(reallly China) who is trying to gain interviews with people in specific industries. They are putting out legit job ads, etc. So if you work in industries that you think would be valuable to China. I suggest sharing this with your employer as well.

It is not hyperbole ladies and gentlemen, we are experiencing wars and espionage.

[whole flare]

Average open source shenanigans.

[rough kindle]

What is that?

[vapid jay]

[fringe sphinx]

This was a social engineering attack, not a package repo issue, tbh

Sure, but it's not like everything else is not riddled with security holes. Cathedral vs bazaar has no clear winner.

[twin trout]

Hoi

[vapid jay]

Scary yet comforting thought. I love the serendipity of security.

[fringe sphinx]

Imagine how much scarier the world would be if organizations could actually protect their secrets

[wheat hatch]

It usually has to do with how much the company spends on their security. The ones that spends a lot also attracts the really qualified security folks, hence their security tends to be good. This is true for areas where laws regulate security requirements as well.

[wheat hatch]

The thing with these algorithms is that there is a lot of pitfalls you can fall into as an uninitiated developer which would compromise security. And if you only have budget to build a service in X amount of man hours you are bound to make mistakes.

[manic dagger]

guys i know this might be an absurd question but what field would you recommend someone who needs money in short time? consider this person has 4 months of free time and needs money so what do you think they should learn in terms of coding languages / fields

i've searched a lot abt it online but most people say front-end but i wanted to get opinions of people who are experienced as well

[true harness]

food service

[fringe sphinx]

Tech support or QA is what I'd recommend: gets you into tech with a much lower technical hurdle than SWE

[manic dagger]

in terms of coding languages / fields related to programming

[manic dagger]

what are the requirements for tech support?

[fringe sphinx]

Take a look at some job postings. Theres no singular answer.

Which one?

I liked cs50 for AIs structure

Good for a very basic fundamentals course

It might feel a little slow at first, but the lessons are good

[true harness]

it takes a lot of effort over a relatively long period of time to be competent enough to work as a developer. for a short period of time, lower barrier to entry jobs are more reasonable

[fringe sphinx]

We said the same thing.

[manic dagger]

yeah but im starting my studies as cs major in 4-5 months so i wanna learn coding in a field but at the same time i want this field to make me money through college

[prime path]

hello Guys

why i cant open python file but i have python but i have a problem with python anyone have a fix for this problem ping me pls ! ! ! ! !

[peak halo]

this is the career discussion channel. see #❓｜how-to-get-help

[smoky anvil]

someone knows, where to host a python flask site?

[peak halo]

this is the career discussion channel. see #web-development

[raven steeple]

Career dicussion channel hun?

[gritty rivet]

No degree and no professional experience of any kind?

The chance of being job ready in four months is near zero, especially in 2024, but you could look at the Cloud Resume Challenge if you really want to try

Desktop support doesn't pay as well but has a much lower bar for entry. If you're studying full time you could probably pull off the ConpTIA A+ and Net+ certifications in four months and be a reasonable candidate, maybe even with no degree or professional experience

[lunar vessel]

Hello people 🙂 I just started CS50P and after finishing it I don't know what to do next. I have a plan to make companion program for Elite Dangerous but I don't think this will help me find a job. I have day job and I am learning after work. What to do next? how to make a portfolio that I will be able to find a job. I have 3 years time to achieve that. Maybe there is no point because of AI ?

[gritty rivet]

You should get a degree. Part time in three years would be tough but not impossible (if you're doing an online degree like WGU)

I don't know what Elite Dangerous is but when I got hired for my first dev job, my main portfolio project was a pretty simple REST API built in Flask so that's something you could try. Have good tests, good documentation, etc.

[lunar vessel]

There is no option for getting degree. I have to be self learning guy. I have day job. I am asking options without degree. In poland i finished technician school in IT

anyway thanks for answering

[gritty rivet]

I would try looking on LinkedIn to see if anyone in your country is doing what you want to do and what their portfolio looks like

You can also look at what job openings are available, because all that really matters is that your portfolio demonstrates the skills employers are looking for, and to some extent that can vary a lot by local market

[smoky quest]

• Look for evening classes
• There less educated, the more competition you will have. And so the more skills you will have to demonstrate to stand out
• People care about what's relevant to them. So the closer to what they care, the better. And for instance, Elite Dangerous is very far from what people care about in frontend roles
• Even if you do not go to school, it will take a long time. CS550 is an introduction, so it's like the very beginning or a much longer journey

[brazen valve]

Hello could someone tell me why this doesnt work ?

[smoky quest]

This is the wrong place. Check #❓｜how-to-get-help

[brazen valve]

(there is not all the code only the part who doesnt work)

[pastel thunder]

what to say if you want a some more than what HR offers? like 15% more.

phrases that come to my mind are pretty lame
Plus i am antisocial and very awkward

[near ocean]

How much are they offering compared to what other companies are offering for similar roles?
You should do some market research

[white relic]

Depends on and also on whether you would still consider the offer if they don't raise it.

[pastel thunder]

its higher then job market but I believe my skills and qualification are much above than average.
Plus my interviews went exceptional

[pastel thunder]

will have to consider even if they dont raise it. 😢
because its a very well known company

[near ocean]

If your skills are much higher than required for the job then why dont you apply to more senior positions

[white relic]

This isn't the Cadence one, is it?

[pastel thunder]

very early in career, less than 1 year of exp.
by skill, I wanted to say, I will be better candidate than what they usually hire.
for example, I have relevant publications, and much more relevant internships than you can even imagine from a bachelors grad.

[pastel thunder]

haha, yes, it is indeed cadence

[near ocean]

Never heard of them
Anyway, the easiest way to negotiate is to show that others would pay you more
Get competing offers

[pastel thunder]

trying that but will probably get other offers after few weeks

[white relic]

I'll be totally honest with you here: your resume is good, but giving you this offer is a gamble on their part. Pretty much any junior hire is. They probably have a lot to train before you will become a useful engineer. If they're offering above market, that's already an indication that they want you, which is great. But you need to be realistic about your value to the company and your value to this company for at least the first 6 months is negative.

That said, there's nothing wrong with asking for more. Everybody wants to be paid more. But you shouldn't hope for 15% because you think you're better than other fresh grads

[smoky quest]

reach out to them to tell them you got an offer and would like to explore possibilities to accelerate the process with them

[pastel thunder]

I had same thoughts before, when I thought it was that embedded role.

But later I learned from them that they want me in ML focussed role. They wanted someone with very low level of understanding ML architecture, which is reflected in my recent CVPR paper. They need this to accelerate the chips.

Only after knowing this, I thought I deserve more.

I came across one person who reports a higher offer but has less experience then me(on ambition box, glass door etc) can I politely mention this?

[pastel thunder]

great idea, will do. thanks

video retrieval SOTA

[smoky quest]

How would that person making more than you impact your contribution to this company?

[pastel thunder]

kind of yes, they loosely mentioned compiler too

[pastel thunder]

i will hate to work with lower offer, but dont have choices at the time

[smoky quest]

As a recruiter, my answer to you would be: then you should join them. kthanxbai

[pastel thunder]

not saying that to recruiter.
I can only say that on discord

maybe all i can do is
" i am a good candidat bla bla bla...."
and then accept what ever they give
😢

[smoky quest]

I think it goes deeper than that.
It sounds like you are asking just because you think you are better, but that's not all there is to it and it's not like great candidates are rare.
Plus in terms of motivation, many people will forego 15% for a job that is more interesting and rewarding.

From a pure compensation view, you also have to consider the total package. That means equity, not just salary

There is also something to be said in terms of optimizing solely for base salary. Sometimes the better path is to optimize growth at the expense of the max salary. But it can become tricky to quantify

you can if you are one of the early employees of amazon, google, facebook, tesla, etc.
But that's a gamble 🙂

[pastel thunder]

personally, my motivation is not actually the money. It is actually doing something out of ordinary.
The reason I mentioned that 15% is because even though it sound insignificant, that would change the imaginary bracket in which I think I fall in.

I am confident, that I am capable of even more, but also know, It takes certain leverage to prove that, which at the moment I dont have. If I wasnt good enough they wouldnt have reached out to me with the opening.

[smoky quest]

Every single student or new grad that is remotely good and that I talk to will think the exact same thing than you. That's normal and it's awesome. Just walk the fine line between staying ambitious and being too cocky

[pastel thunder]

Actually, its all because of the interviews, I wasnt expecting anything, the way they praised and gave feedback about me,, laid a seed in my mind which says I should ask for more.

the remaining corruption was done by offers I found out to be higher, with less exp.

[smoky quest]

Still comes down to why they would pay more and how it compares to the bands, market and other candidates

Pointing at other people making more does not mean you would be offered the same compensation

plus engineers are terrible at understanding their comp. Often they talk about TC while including a whole multi year grant, which skew things

or mixing RSU with options

[smoky quest]

and then, if you live outside of the bay area/new york, you will have a hair cut

[pastel thunder]

outside usa, but i got your point

[burnt atlas]

I'm in high-school I'm writing O levels this year, and I've decided that I want to be a software developer, I started learning python a couple months ago. My question like I know the destination, the end goal. What steps do I take in the next few years to become a software developer

[near ocean]

A levels and then try to get into a good university
Try for red brick if you can, brits love their arbitrary elitist categories

[smoky quest]

• You changed jobs every year, frequently enough it will raise some questions
• I have no idea what to make of your cofounder thing
• It may help to give a sense of size and scope of each experience
• Projects could benefit from some details

so as an employer, why would I expect anything different?

[near ocean]

Theyre contracts, cant exactly do anything about it tho

[smoky quest]

Ah so you are looking for contracts, not jobs

your current job doesn't appear to be a contract and you are still looking out, not even 6 months in

am talking about the MLE job at the very top

joined that company in 12/2023, interviewing in 04/2024

your resume doesn't say anything about these details

no worries. If you are joining full time, I would probably make it more explicit. Like literally "joined full time".
Not sure how it's presented now

it's also a good sign since it means they liked you and you likely did a good job

yeah you can keep to cofounder thing. But explain it because it's either too little to make sense or too much to make sense

[twin trout]

Hoi

[gritty rivet]

You might also just omit the jobs prior to that as well

I don't think it's a big concern but they don't add that much either

[south forum]

What is the best place to look for a job? I've tried linked in but no luck...

[peak halo]

I used google's job listing thing to see what positions were available, but then I applied for them on the company's website.

[gritty rivet]

By talking to actual humans in your local area and wider professional network. Indeed is also helpful.

[south forum]

The humans in my area cant give me anything that matches my skill level. The reason why ive been on online freelancing instead.

[true harness]

I typically use LinkedIn for finding openings, but not getting a response usually isn't an issue with the website you're using for that

[balmy spade]

You might want to re-read the #rules there friendo.

[smoky quest]

<@&831776746206265384> They are only here to advertise.
This message also reminds me a lot of another account

[smoky quest]

what is your skill level that makes it difficult to find a job?

[summer roost]

!cban 1231866357755416580 ban evasion

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @spark pine permanently.

[twilit juniper]

guys college leaves me no time for personal coding or even reading which I used to do. Not reading a novel exactly but reading in general, things of any topic I'm interested at the moment

will it be worth it 😢

I'm studying cs

[pine sleet]

yeah

but also college isn't supposed to occupy every waking moment. if it does, perhaps you need to work on your time management

[twilit juniper]

cause there is a lot of "progpaganda" to learn by yourself and drop out of college but idk if thats true

[smoky quest]

many students still have time for personal coding and reading or other activities while maintaining good grades.
I would suggest to review your effectiveness and organization so you can make time for both

[pine sleet]

it is true but only for a very small number of people

[twilit juniper]

Yeah I think I'm not organizing myself correctly.

[smoky quest]

but yeah, don't drop out of CS. That would be one of the worst mistake you could make

[twilit juniper]

Because I literally cannot find much time for myself.

[pine sleet]

you should reevaluate how you study and spend time, then

it's very possible to do both well in school and have time for yourself. many students do this

[twilit juniper]

Yeah I'll do this then

What do you suggest? Like is there a list of different time management methods I could look at? Perhaps as an example?

[true harness]

best thing to do is to try and accurate account for where you're spending time. a lot of people think they have no time for things, but are not keeping track of how they spend their time, and spend a lot on non-productive things

[pine sleet]

there are probably resources out there for that but not any i'm familiar with. but time management, organization, and efficiency looks differently for each person so as cliche as it is you need to figure out what works for you

[stuck urchin]

I'm looking for a rudimentary banking job, underwriter hopefully if I can land. My question is if I should include a summary?
The summary would include the fact that I want to pursue my CFA and some of my career goals.
I just want a summer job

[smoky quest]

yeah, start logging and tracking how you spend your time

[twilit juniper]

okay gotchu guys

[smoky quest]

there are also self help books about improving your time management

[twilit juniper]

I'll start doing that

[south forum]

Not out of the world, but I'm just surrounded by duds

[smoky quest]

It depends what you want the reader to learn from it and how performative it is.
If you just put a lot of platitudes and fluff, that won't help

[smoky quest]

I am not sure how I am supposed to interpret this

[stuck urchin]

I just have my education (ma candidate, ba in econ), my work experience from 3 labour jobs, ECs of no importance, and skills and interests section (python r Stata office)
And I might add a projects section of stuff I did during my UG that I can highlight

[smoky quest]

think about your resume like your one page ad.
So what would the reader learn from it? What would make them want to talk to you after reading it?

[south forum]

I'm good at flask, discord.py tensor flow, okayish at llms good at SQL and relational database management. Java, cs decent at css . Almost a wizard at discord.py

I work freelance but I really want a stable job

But that's the problem

The people I'm surrounded with have nothing to do with any of these

[smoky quest]

I mean, as a reader, I am confused.
If you are that skilled, then what is stopping you?

[pine sleet]

do you have a resume we can review? the only thing we have to go off right now is your github and it isn't particularly impressive

[south forum]

Just unable to land a job

[smoky quest]

ok. Thanks

[south forum]

I haven't updated GitHub but yeah

Is media allowed here?

[pine sleet]

well it's not a huge heal. employers don't have time to look at your github at the initial stages. drop your resume and we'll look at it

feel free to post an anonymized image of your resume

[south forum]

Okay

[true harness]

pdfs are not allowed, but a screenshot should work

[placid swan]

Hey thinking of going for my bachelors in comp sci after I get my associates what do yall think and what do they teach for ur bachelors?

[pine sleet]

does your education go up to high school? not sure how it works in india - do you have a college degree?

[south forum]

the two lines above are university degree

hid that out for anonymity

[pine sleet]

ah, gotcha. it being cropped threw me off. anyways, about the actual content, it feels a bit basic. winning first place in a hackathon is a great thing to show off, but you have 2 others (first and last) which is basically saying "i finished this online python class" and the other one (third) says you used basic python

i don't know what all projects you did but you should consider showing more impact in them

[south forum]

okay

can i dm there is stuff i want to show but i will reveal my identity

[pine sleet]

at the end of the day, you want to convince employers to hire you instead of someone else that has professional experience (internships, for instance) and also very impressive projects

[pine sleet]

i don't do dms, sorry. if there is no way you can show us without revealing your identity we won't be able to help

seems pretty generic. do you have any hard numbers to prove impact?

[south forum]

as in?

[pine sleet]

for instance, you might list down time reduced for some optimization you did for an internal tooling/task. i've seen this done before

[true harness]

while this is well written, it is missing specific examples of how you demonstrated these skills (it is telling, not showing). also, it is quite odd that you are in possession of it. typically these will go straight to the person requesting reccommendations

[south forum]

Yeah, I'm on very good terms with my past employer

[south forum]

Oh okay

[rough kindle]

Guys I have learnt variables, data types, data structures, functions, loops. Well there intermediate topics like dictionaries, files and modules can I still move on to libraries if I don't learnt intermediate topics for now? I will learn them later

[summer roost]

that doesn't seem related to this channel's topic

[south forum]

Is there anyone who can help me write my resume? I'm very bad at this part?

[umbral frigate]

Jake's resume is usually recommended. https://www.overleaf.com/latex/templates/jakes-resume/syzfjbzwjncs

[south forum]

Okay thanks!

[smoky quest]

What's hurting you the most is that it looks like you graduated a long time but haven't had a job or professional experience. That makes it sound like you couldn't pass any interview and thus less likely to be called back.

Your profile could be useful for a very early startup. So it may be worth hanging out in these forums/hackathons/meetups and build a network

[vapid jay]

Can anyone help me with my code

[smoky quest]

probably the wrong channel. See #❓｜how-to-get-help

[smoky quest]

!rule 9

[inner wren]

Rules

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[glad tusk]

oh

very sorry

[harsh river]

#❓｜how-to-get-help

[ancient stratus]

How to design a database ?

[whole flare]

That question is probably more suited for #databases

[meager pagoda]

Hey guys, what your thoughts about relocating to Spain as digital nomad?

[sand dock]

hey

anyone can you make me understand the basics of python please

[gritty rivet]

Of course you can. You barely say anything about it anyway.

If you're filling out an application form that asks for complete work history for x number of years, that's a different story. But a resume is not that.

[meager pagoda]

But the sun man, London and Berlin are cloud af

[sand dock]

please

[deft herald]

We can't make you understand anything. Also, this is #career-advice

[pastel thunder]

If you enter in notice period before completion of 1 year, but by the time you are out, it will actually be 1 year.

will you be given yearly bonus?

if it depends what does probability look like?

[near ocean]

Probably not, just like you probably wouldnt be given a raise or considered for a promotion

[summer roost]

Almost certainly not

you should assume that unless the company is somehow contractually obligated to pay you that bonus, they won't be giving it to you after you've told them you're quitting. And if it was contractually obligated, it wouldn't be a bonus - calling it a "bonus" is a very strong indicator that it's discretionary, not compulsory

[shrewd parrot]

what is it?

[summer roost]

it doesn't sound related to #career-advice

[mortal timber]

Hey all, I currently work as a Talent Sourcer. I've also been learning Python and programming fundamentals for the past few months.

My question, is how could I add more value to a company by integrating more technical skills into my job? Or what things with Python (maybe with data related work like Pandas?) could I do and show on social media to set myself apart in Talent Sourcing?

My current process is not very technically complicated, and this is a similar process to what every other Talent Sourcer follows.

1. Pull profiles on LinkedIn with different tools that utilize boolean (search for titles, keywords, current/previous companies, years of experience, location, etc.)
2. Sort through those profiles in a Google Sheet, identify the ones I want to reach out to for my client/employer's open role.
3. Clean the data, (Michael -> Mike, Lockheed Martin Missle Defense Group -> Lockheed, etc.) and find email addresses using automated tools
4. Reach out to everyone using an automated outreach tool
5. Mark and categorize responses, introduce interested candidates to the recruiter

I've already started experimenting with Dash Plotly to make some nice looking graphs, but I have this feeling I could be doing so much more. Maybe something in the data science direction, or automating certain steps.

The step that takes the longest by far is #2 - I have to manually open and look at each profile, which is super tedious when I have 1000+ to sort through. I've thought about building a bot to automate this at least to a degree (something to elminate the obvious no's), but not sure if that's feasible for someone that isn't an experienced engineer.

Any advice?

[worn pine]

To be honest mate, go full cringe. I'm talking like, be able to scrape some crap online, feed that into ChatGPT automatically with prompt engineering and the whole nine yards, have it spit out the perfect email to a company and a recruiter or potential employee or something. From my perspective being able to manipulate data ain't worth shit to most companies I've worked with and they see it as really low value work.

I guess my general thoughts are, use Python to automate interfacing with the cutting edge bullshit thing everyone is buying into atm and you'll most likely find yourself "useful" to employers.

Or like, even better, make Python do something that can extend some excel spreadsheet in some way like say, get shit from Excel and pop that into GPT or something like that, they'd love that too

[mortal timber]

Oh interesting, thanks for your perspective! I'm surprised you've found they see it as really low value work, isn't that essentially the job of a data engineer?

[worn pine]

Nah man, data engineers are pretty much just cringe lords that buy into a certain cloud service and forget everything else they've learnt in life.

[mortal timber]

Ahhh, yes that might be awesome, I could have an excel sheet of 100 profiles and use the ChatGPT API call to generate a personalized icebreaker for the messaging of each person

[worn pine]

my advice is go cringe or work on something you love, they are incompatible.

[mortal timber]

When you say go cringe, can you tell me more about what you mean by that?

[summer roost]

yes, that is the job of a data engineer, and yes, it can be well compensated high-value work as long as it's for a company that sees it as a profit center rather than a cost center.

[worn pine]

well I like to think of like, not what is the most efficient way in reality but what will my employer think is the most efficient, that's what i mean by it

in reality, putting those excel spreadsheets in the bin and automating all of it is the most efficient, but in practice, you look better if you "extend" functionality.

about the data engineer thing, you gotta realise that people are coming out with stuff like: https://www.databricks.com/glossary/medallion-architecture. Here, "cleaning up the data" is something that is relegated to "citizen analysts", you're a big data engineering boiyo your job is to i don't know, mash a string at a delta table and call it a day, maybe try to unfuck a release pipeline someone made 2 years ago, argue with some data product team about why their dataset hasn't landed in the datalake yet, many things, not much programming. no data engineer concerns themselves with the gold layer, where all the important but not very well paid manipulations happen.

the role is really far from excellently manip data in a super optimised way

[pastel thunder]

some more facts:
It was mentioned as CTC,
Mentioned to be variable bonus
And at times, said to "performance based"

Does that change anything?

[near ocean]

No

[summer roost]

if it's discretionary, the company will choose not to give it to you

companies pay bonuses to increase morale and to motivate employees to perform better. Once they know you're leaving, your morale is no longer their problem, nor is your future performance.

[mortal timber]

Yeah there's a guy in my industry who was a Talent Sourcer and now works for Amazon as a sort of hybrid sourcer/data engineer. Does gigantic scraping operations with proxies and all that and deep data analysis and seems to be well valued there. Trying to get a chat with him

[mortal timber]

That helps me a lot, thanks man. Perception is reality, especially when it comes to management in the corporate world

[fading jewel]

is there any1 here who didMCR3U1 which is a grade 11 uni course? i have lil quesitobn

[mortal timber]

Interesting, something of that depth like what you put in the link you'll never see in talent acquisition. Maybe at FAANG, but beyond that no. It would blow your mind how primitive and basic the average sourcer or recruiter is in their process.

[fading jewel]

i would like to speak with sum1 who is in waterloo enginner or UOFT enginner. speak reply or dm me. i have a few questions

[manic dagger]

well im 17 and in 12th grade. will be graduating in a month and i got accepted from ubc as cs major. im looking to spend my time on something that is worth considering the fact that im young. bc of this i want this investment a good one which can get me a job/internship in college.

[worn pine]

not surprising, good space to be in, wish I was.

[honest ruin]

can anyone tell me what skills i should learn to create my path as a cs major
i am currently 15 and in 10th grade

[white relic]

There is nothing you can learn about coding in the next 4 months that is likely to directly lead to a lucrative job. If you need money, it's a better bet to try food service or retail as someone else mentioned.
If you want to get a head start in your studies, on the other hand, it might make sense to use this time to dig into some programming language or specialization that you won't be taught in university. If your CS classes will use Python, learn Java. Or take the opportunity to learn Linux

Owning your own business can be very profitable if it is successful. However, most new businesses fail within a few years. Moreover, entrepreneurship is both a big skillset that takes time to develop and a career path inherently fraught with uncertainty, which a lot of people don't handle well. Working for someone else is a far more reliable way of making a living.

"Better" depends upon your personal goals. I wouldn't want to own my own business, at least not at this point in my career.

[manic dagger]

oh okay thanks

[molten token]

hey, im starting a big program to learn python, but its gonna go kinda slow and i want to do extra to prepare myself for a career, i want to speed up the process and expand my knowledge in a way, although i don't know what exactly to do, especially since i am a total beginner, any ideas?

[gritty rivet]

If you're a total beginner, then do whatever works for you to start learning the basics. Plenty of free options like https://cs50.harvard.edu/python

Focus as much as possible on projects that interest you. It doesn't really matter what you do as long as you're writing code and learning something

[molten token]

oh, ty!

[marsh thistle]

Your nickname violates our Name & Profile policy. Please change it to something more respectful, thank you.

[summer roost]

!superstar 1181800890315837533

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied superstar to @twin trout until <t:1714344479:f> (1 hour).

Superstarified!

Your previous nickname, ✙ Alfred 卍, was so bad that we have decided to change it. Your new nickname will be Phil Collins.

You will be unable to change your nickname until <t:1714344479:f>. If you're confused by this, please read our official nickname policy.

[summer roost]

If you change it back to something offensive, you will be banned.

!cban 1181800890315837533 homophobia

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @twin trout permanently.

[burnt zephyr]

hey guys have u ever put under experience something that was not a job..? how did you present it?

[whole flare]

was it volunteer work?

[burnt zephyr]

no, I'd consider that one is ok, no wonder or worries... more like small projects, maybe even a freelancer one time project... bcuz that wouldn't be like ((## years experience))

[smoky quest]

you can have a "Projects"

[burnt zephyr]

ahhh true true, i should still apply then 😅 nvm thanks

[vapid jay]

what can I do if i don't want to become a software dev

[smoky quest]

don't apply to software dev jobs, don't go to CS schools

[vapid jay]

but all i know how to do is write code

[smoky quest]

In case this is not a joke: explore different career options

[vapid jay]

im genuinely wondering

i feel like being a dev isn't for me

but all i do everyday is write code

[smoky quest]

then do something else

[vapid jay]

i tried to learn to make music

im way to bad at it and ofcourse i cant make a career of out it

[smoky quest]

There is no shortage of things to try

[vapid jay]

i want to make movies

but im poor

[acoustic zephyr]

try learning how to animate, you can start by making small animatics on youtube

[vapid jay]

when sora comes out its the end of the world

end of the world doesn't mean its inhabitable
it means its not worth living in

[hearty island]

"Upstream USA - Data, Analystics, and Technology Analyst" dawg analystics 💀

[hearty island]

it eez what it eez

[smoky quest]

!rule 9

[inner wren]

Rules

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[next scaffold]

oh alr

[smoky quest]

np, just delete your message. Thanks!

[nova snow]

is he offering paid work?

[modest kernel]

Guys, I've grasped the basics and intermediate level of python and now I'm not sure what to do. Many people say, build projects and some says it's time to learn frameworks or learn libraries like numpy and pandas. So what should I do? Can I make just make some projects and start applying in companies or do I wait?

[smoky quest]

In terms of career, a CS degree is the path of least resistance and with the most opportunities and compensation.

In terms of learning python, it's a question for #python-discussion .
That said, projects are great as it's a good way to validate what you have learned so far

[modest kernel]

Oh thanks

[tranquil totem]

anyone have this guy added or in mutual server ith him?

[robust nimbus]

Good morning everyone here I have curated list of resources for someone who want’s to get into android pen testing.

https://www.linkedin.com/posts/zeal-chhasatiya_androidpentesting-cybersecurityeducation-activity-7190662423962431488-HlPG?utm_source=share&utm_medium=member_ios

[whole flare]

!rule ad

[inner wren]

Rules

6. Do not post unapproved advertising.

[gritty rivet]

Can I ... just make some projects and start applying in companies... ?

Yes. If you have no degree and no experience then it's a long shot but there is no reason to just "wait" instead of applying and seeing how it goes.

[modest kernel]

Okieee Thanks 🫂

[kindred oyster]

<@&831776746206265384>

[void hawk]

what?

[kindred oyster]

this server is not a hiring board.

[void hawk]

mate the channel is called careers discussion and im discussing a career 😂

[kindred oyster]

!rules ad paid

[inner wren]

Rules

6. Do not post unapproved advertising.

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[kindred oyster]

it in all capital letters also says

NOT FOR RECRUITMENT

[void hawk]

so im allowed the ask people to work but only for free lol

@kindred oyster cope

[kindred oyster]

good luck with your mute or whatever the mods decide the action should be

[void hawk]

ok u mod bumlick lol

[leaden jasper]

!mute 1199688572618420284 1D Our rules are very clear about recruitment and advertising in this server. Also read our code of conduct if you want to at all stay in the server.

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied timeout to @void hawk until <t:1714482763:f> (1 day).

[icy scarab]

How important is a senior SWE title? I'm currently a senior SWE but i got an offer that is a downlevel to midlevel SWE.

[quaint dune]

i know this is very subjective, but would you guys rather be a software engineer or devops/solutions architect?

Seems like my career is reaching a point where I kind of have to make a chioce

[true harness]

titles mean different things to different companies. some companies have "title inflation", others have deflation. you can always ask about the role and responsibilities to see if it's a fit or not for your experience

[peak halo]

"solutions architect" just sounds like a pretentious way of saying "software engineer". it's definitely not a well-defined occupation with widely agreed upon distinctions from other programming-related jobs.

[quaint dune]

Well solutions architect is more consulting focused with designing infra and less code, more config

And software engineer is coding, some infra but not as much ime

I have experience in both domains, was just wondering if anybody else did too and which path they chose and why

SA obviously has more leadership potential and higher salary bands, at least where I am. And no leet code grind.

Software is interesting but the grind is relentless sometimes. Pay is also not as high

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, this is how I interpret the term SA. Primarily consultant with broad systems knowledge and some software competency... but coding is not their job.

[fringe sphinx]

I'm not sure I agree with this part... they are just very different careers. I certainly don't think SA >> SWE in terms of total comp, nor leadership opportunities... they're just different.

[quaint dune]

Yeah they're very different which is why I'm asking if anybody has been experienced in both and chose to go down one or the other.

Most people I know irl were stuck on one path from the start

[fringe sphinx]

I've worked with many of both: I know a few people who've switched; a lot of SAs start as SWEs and realize they like customer facing roles

That's somewhat the tough part. A good SA has talked to many SWEs and has a different view of the world: they know what problems other people have encountered/etc, and generally will have a lot of breadth of knowledge. But, the risk can be that their recommendations are based on stuff other people have said, not direct experience.

[white relic]

You might want a good oil painter to make a portrait, but you might want someone with broader experience to know whether an oil portrait or a watercolor landscape will achieve your overall goals.

Ask a specialist how to solve a problem and you get an answer that's in their specialty area.

architects are also capable of failing and learning from mistakes

[hearty island]

yay guys i'm under consideration for a northwell role

let's see what happens, when my friend got an under consideration by them he was called up for an interview

[white relic]

anyway, if you have a big team and you're trying to balance client needs and software design, somebody on the team is going to fall into that architect role, doesn't matter if they have coding experience or not.
and over time they're going to be doing less coding and more architecture work until it turns out, oops, you created an architect

[fringe sphinx]

Oh, not at all. I find SAs and consultants, in general, very useful because they bring different perspectives and experience. I want both inputs.

[white relic]

you're not really engaging with the argument here
there's a difference in the roles and the skills they bring to the table, it's not just about people with "real world experience" vs. ivory tower philosophers

[fringe sphinx]

Totally fair, get where you're coming from. But, the counter argument is: I find it sus when a staff engineer with little outside experience with a technology reads a few blog posts and creates a new critical component of a system with no input from people who've done it before.

[white relic]

personally, I've been on a project with good coders and inadequate architecture experience and it didn't end well.

[fringe sphinx]

Hah, yah, I remember one of the first products I worked on. Software engineers failed to account for issues like multiple IP addresses and NAT. The SA team (equivalent of) was pissed off they were consulted on these decisions.

Mind you, this organization was something like 500 people strong.

[white relic]

I can swallow the pill that a very experienced electrical engineer switched into a coding role like that, but someone who can't build a CPU from scratch can't be trusted to write code

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, to quote the great: Everyone you meet knows something you don't. I try to live by that.

[quaint dune]

@turbid bobcat Are you very junior? It seems odd to me that you don't see the value that solutions architects/infra people bring to a product

They are very much very closely related

Nevermind

[burnt zephyr]

morning guys, I'm doing a freelans project, the owner asked for my name, age, country, gender and email... so far nothing suspicious, right ?

[amber bloom]

I’ve got a networking intern position interview in a couple hours, any tips?

[gritty rivet]

Very suspicious. WTF do they care about your gender especially.

[true harness]

name sure, age ?? (unless it's something like "are you an adult"), country sure, gender ??, email sure

[burnt zephyr]

well sounds like a copy paste basic demographic format... I didn't say "specially"

[worn pine]

what if you don't value cloud offerings in general. you don't have to be junior to have that opinion

then it follows that they also don't bring value. the infra people.

[true harness]

prepare to be asked things like, "why are you a good fit?", "why us?", as well as maybe some technical questions based on skills in the job description

[quaint dune]

i think its rather myopic to discount the value of cloud even if your team doesn't use it. And besides, solution architecture is not always on the cloud.

[worn pine]

why would you assume my team doesn't use it? because I don't like it?

we absolutely do, and cloud offerings absolutely suck. just because everyone uses it doesn't mean it's good.

[placid gale]

I wonder - what are the good ways for a software developer to drift into ML professionally?

[peak halo]

the best way is if your current employer would support you in doing so. is there any way you could be assigned ML related work in your current employment?

[brazen island]

Define "drift into ML"? Do you want to call APIs and/or work with pretrained models to solve practical problems or do you want to do more researchy stuff?

[stark rose]

.

[peak halo]

Yes?

[heavy prism]

.

[amber bloom]

I’m just getting started with my IT major so the only thing I’m worried about is not having nearly as much knowledge as other applicants, you think interpersonal skills goes a long way in this field

[true harness]

yes, they are as important as technical skills

[amber bloom]

I had an interview last week that I thought went amazing, it was just for a customer relations positions that guarantees an internship in IT the last semester of college

hopefully get that but I’d rather nail this interview

[plush summit]

You should make a yt video about your aplication Journey at this point😅

Because you give update messages everytime i open this #

[amber bloom]

got offered the internship on the spot W

[velvet jewel]

Is it better to apply for internships or graduate jobs in my final year of uni, considering I do t have any internships right now?

[velvet jewel]

Especially for faang positions, I think I’d have a better chance going for the internship?

But I’ve seen people get in with only projects, too

Did you get the interview?

[deft herald]

You won't be able to get an internship if you have already graduated (unless you're enrolled for a further degree like a master's)

[velvet jewel]

Thank you

What’s msft?

How did that go?

[vapid jay]

I have a question, who can buy a python application and where, people who have money like buissneman?

[velvet jewel]

How come you’re struggling so much when lots of people get into faang with worse resumes

Oh fair enough

[fringe sphinx]

Citation please?

My point being: FAANG is super competitive, like trying to get into a top 5 university. They certainly have their pick of top candidates

[true harness]

it is actually multiple times more competitive than a top university. the trick is that universities (in the US) charge you to apply, so unqualified people are usually filtered out 😩

[velvet jewel]

Lol YouTube resumes

Reassuring to know that it really is just that competitive, but it makes me wonder how people progress so much in their pay over time in this field if that’s the case

[smoky quest]

solving problems is a big thing for most jobs 🙂

[vapid jay]

Hey guys, made a resume for IT and QA work, care to give me some pointers? Is it good? Will this fly for such jobs?

[fringe sphinx]

The obsession with FAANG is, IMO, just a social media construct / not one that people in the field care about.

[wind plinth]

Sorry I know I'm in the completely wrong place but I'm not sure where I'm meant to send it, I'm looking for help with text styling and idk where to look to find help with it🙏 🥺 sorry

[fringe sphinx]

Not sure what you mean by text styling, but start in #python-discussion and someone can guide you to the right place.

[wind plinth]

Thank you, I mean like colouring text and making it bold in the terminal

[formal topaz]

I've been off social media for a year now I'm curious about something
is it actually beneficial to get off social media? cuz tbh I feel like all opportunities disappear when I disappear from internet type shit
real talk

[blazing harbor]

good way to keep up with friends and make some good connections just don't consume short entertainment like reels

[rocky fulcrum]

nvm

[formal topaz]

for real but like I geniunely thought I was on my "spiritual self-development journey" but all it did is destroy my presence in this omniverse

not knowing about the cool shit going on around you can really fuck your chances up

[true harness]

i think you can separate "linkedin and career related social media" from "zoomer brainrot social media"

[formal topaz]

linkedin is the most depressing shit I've seen

nobody posts the cool shit their doing on linken

[blazing harbor]

yeah also you can post your party stuff or whatever just make it on your private story or something

you don't want an employer seeing a pic of you drinking in a frat party so be careful on instagram or sm

[formal topaz]

it's not just career I'm talking bout it's the connections you've made that'll eventually just fade away

not everyone in your career circle is your boss you feel me?

[blazing harbor]

fr fr

[umbral haven]

tell them brother!!

[true hatch]

people who say that school is better than work are trippin

[velvet jewel]

What about the high pay? Surely that’s a contributing factor? I also just like the idea of working in a big office in central london too

[true hatch]

on god