career-advice

[smoky quest]

@hollow jacinth slurs

[summer roost]

!mute 928036141205184573 1d You've been warned before to follow our #code-of-conduct. Name calling and slurs are inappropriate.

[inner wren]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied timeout to @hybrid sage until <t:1708981501:f> (1 day).

[tawdry sable]

Yes, i was literally refereed to him by a VP, its been 4 weeks and no messages. No it was not i was telling him i was referred by a VP his bosses boss. Maybe my profile wasnt a good match but a recommendation from a VP?

I hear clients get their kids internships and VPs cant?

[smoky quest]

there is a difference between a VP telling them "this is looking like an interesting candidate" and a VP telling a candidate "I am not the hiring manager, go talk to them"

[tawdry sable]

no the message was tell this hiring manager that i referred you

it was at a company where the stock has increased like 500% this year

[smoky quest]

sounds like it's a good time to circle back with the VP

[tawdry sable]

I should, the hiring manager did view my linkedin but ignored me after that

[smoky quest]

Are they in the same org?

[tawdry sable]

They are both at nvidia

[smoky quest]

It's as helpful as saying they are both located in the USA

[tawdry sable]

IDK if they are in same org the hiring manager is head of internships recrutiing i think, I mean im in europe and they are both in USA

[smoky quest]

There is a lot of nuance in terms of departments within a company

[tawdry sable]

How would I know

RN im begging to get into apple for finance internship

i badly want it hopefully i get it ngl after 600 rejections its hard and not looking good

[smoky quest]

It's more likely you do know than us here 😉
Being referred by a VP doesn't mean it's in the bag. The manager is accountable for the internship and thus they will be the one making the decision. So the VP can have some influence, especially if they are the manager's boss' boss, but it's unlikely to force it (not that you would want that either)

The manager is very likely to have received multiple thousands of internship applications. So it will also depend on how you compare to them

[tawdry sable]

Bro internships are so hard bro idk what to do

[zealous path]

Culture fit >>>>> Technical fit
You can teach people to code.
You can’t teach them to be a good person

[smoky quest]

don't desperate.
Continue to apply, get your resume reviewed and iterate

[tawdry sable]

like 1k applications and such i did get an interview at a quant firm tho IDK why they selected me i think it was a mistake, I wish i get feedback for every rejection but none give them out

[smoky quest]

International internships are even more rare and difficult nowadays though.
Your resume would have to demonstrate higher caliber projects to stand out internationally

[tawdry sable]

Im looking for ones in the UK im in the uk

[smoky quest]

ah, I understood it wrong since you mentioned both the vp and the manager being in the US

[tawdry sable]

most people in linkedin are in the US so it just happened to be

What do I do just fix resume and iterate? or should i focus on referrals?

Like after asking 200 people on linkedin for referrals only 5 said yes and they all were for one firm

[smoky quest]

there is no magic. Referrals may put you in front of some relevant people, but that's it.

Your resume contains standard projects you see in every applications. So no reason to put on top of the pile.
And lines like Designed classes with appropriate fields... makes it sound you are proud of your technical achievements of using basic OOP. Which means your bar to something complicated is the level of an intro class to programming.

[zealous path]

I never get why people try for internships in the U.K.
You either apply to coding jobs (if applicable)
Or
Do a coding adjecant job for 2-3 years (if not) and then switch.
Internships to me are such an American thing

[smoky quest]

internships are quite relevant in europe. It's part of the standard curriculum in a lot of countries

[zealous path]

The only internship I did was 3 months during my 3rd year of Uni only because it was a mandatory part of my course.

[smoky quest]

It's a good way to see how a company works and to see how some of the skills you learn in school are being applied in real life

[zealous path]

Fair enough

[tawdry sable]

fixed it srry was just trying to show my java project that i added today

where did u guys intern in

[hearty island]

places

[smoky quest]

there is no need to apologize.

For your fake news detector, it may be worth going deeper into scaling it and ensuring reliability.
Also putting some numbers in terms of success rate for the detection and how much data/speed/etc

[tawdry sable]

OOO good point

[smoky quest]

In general, use the rule of Show, don't tell.
People don't think superman is strong because he keeps saying it. People think he is strong because he lifts cars with one hand. Same thing here.
Don't say you are proficient in X. Instead, demonstrate you are proficient in X through projects, experience, etc.

As an interviewer, I receive thousands of applicants for each position, and every single person keep saying they are awesome. So just saying you are awesome doesn't make you stand out

[tawdry sable]

yea true

I need to include the link of my github:https://github.com/abdu558/MintKard

most proud project btw watch the video on the readme @smoky quest

[sullen magnet]

Hello, I am on my first year of Cybersecurity BS and I want to find a job in the IT field.
I am about to finish ComTia’s A+ cert probably within the month.
What type of jobs should I apply to as a new person to IT?

[boreal summit]

Hello guys, thanks for your input. I recreated the CV, does it fit more this way? (attached both for comparison)

[hearty island]

which one is the recreated one?

[sly solar]

In a work environment, is it normal for software developers to look stuff up on w3 or python documentation incase of forgetting?
Because theres no way I can remember all these operators atm haha

Actually I suppose using your tools to your advantage is a good quality as an employee xD

[buoyant seal]

I often reread official documentation to libraries (including std libraries) and yet another postgresql command.

People aren't machines to remember all available options
The flesh is weak, but the spirit is willing

[buoyant seal]

For super simple stuff u a still expected to remember eventually just from the fact of long time using it.
Do pet projects if necessary to practice new stuff more
So u could recall on reflex the most daily used stuff, being comfortable to use it

[boreal summit]

the simplistic text one with no photo is the new one

[sly solar]

of course I do expect tthat to me necessary 🙂

thank you

[hearty island]

ok good

[hearty island]

the metrics big interview scores you on

very nice tool imo

[boreal summit]

wow that looks good, thanks @hearty island

[gritty rivet]

If an A+ cert is your only qualification then you're looking for desktop support and help desk roles.

[random fulcrum]

What makes someone a qualified software engineer vs an unqualified software engineer? I for some reason do not really see anyone go in detail regarding that.

These two are just being thrown around in online articles and forums

Especially when it comes to job market related topics.

Also, the difference in salary between the US and the Netherlands is absolutely insane. Really makes me wonder whether I should move out to the US after my computer science master and find my luck there..

[smoky quest]

it's about the level of qualification for a given role, which can be described in terms of depth and breadth among the dimensions one could use to articulate said role

[fringe sphinx]

Hi, we don't allow recruiting or advertising or anything of the sort. And, recruiting requests like "please DM me" are discouraged because they can lead to predatory or scammy interactions.

[fallen vessel]

What kind of computer science jobs are in high demand in the US?

next 5-10 ish years

[fallen vessel]

I'm think about becoming a cs major in college

[true harness]

pretty much all of them

[fringe sphinx]

From one of the GOATs of software: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-QxI-RP6-HM

[fallen vessel]

Thank you!

Will give it a watch later

[oblique oasis]

Hi guys

I learnt python, now i am learning tenserflow library, is it right for my career??

[hearty island]

depends on what you want to do

[fringe sphinx]

See the video above.

[eternal mist]

Big heads up:
Try to figure out what you want to specialize in, especially if you want to go for the better paying software engineering jobs. "Jack of all trade" jobs usually have lower pay and more job insecurity.
You need to learn things (software stacks and tech) outside of your curriculum. Universities trail industry in terms of actual software libraries and frameworks by a decade or so.
Literally, the three most important things a recruiter is going to care about are:

1. Relevant work experience: tech internships/coops/part-time jobs while in school
2. Relevant extracurricular activities: a good personal project portfolio composed of not just class assignments (see my previous bullet point), undergraduate research experience, meaningful Open Source contributions, meaningful engineering club participation, hackathons, etc.
3. Networking with people in industry: professor referrals, networking with alumni, career fairs, industry networking events at your school, etc. Basically, if you can impress someone in at a company, they can put in a good word for you with a recruiter and then your resume goes to the top of the stack

[native parrot]

I'm not sure if this channel is only for coding careers but I'm still looking for input from you guys because of how meaningful the conversations here have been so far.

What do you guys think about virtual wholesaling? Which is basically you getting a contract to buy property then selling the contract to an investor/buyer for profit. But instead of face-to-face interactions and physical offices, it would be mainly online.

From what I know so far from articles and public records, virtual wholesaling is a feasible job with a 40% success rate, with most failing because they go in completely unprofessional, so what I would do is start off with online presence then probably a website and further down in the year work on networking with real estate events and meetups and after say 12k consistent monthly profit work on building a collaborative team of real estate attorneys, title companies, appraisers, contractors, and property inspectors.

How does this sound? Please feel free to complete rip apart my aspirations if that's what you believe is appropriate

[regal axle]

Wholesale - sales in general - has large opportunities for large profit. But that doesn't mean it is easy. I have no idea where you are getting your 40% success rate. That is a random number you made up. Going in professionally or unprofessionally is not a factor. Being able to be a good sales man(person) and reading your potential client - becoming more or less professional as needed - is just a part of being in sales.
As for your "tangible" plans; How do you expect to have an online presence? And even before having a website? You are an online business. You need a way for online interaction and contact. Networking is fine. But that ... is not virtual. So, you are just doing sales. As for your 12k consistent monthly profit, there are so many steps that you jumped over to get there. 12k a month in profit is a lot. Not impossible, just not a good goal for the sake of being tangible. At least not in this context since your goals are very sparatic.

One really important question. Money. Do you have the starting capital needed to pull this off? You do need to be able to purchase things. Wholesale and drop shipping are not the same thing. And I don't think you can do drop shipping with contracts for property

Anyways; You can do whatever you put your mind to! And I do belive that. That doesn't mean that just saying you will do something will make it work. I would say you should go back and do more research. Take a step back and investigate what it really takes to get this done. (Maybe you really do have all these things answered and are just not conveying that well. But if that is the case, I think there is a different issue to this plan)

[native parrot]

So you chose to rip apart my aspirations? I'm glad, my brother has been sugarcoating this entire thing since the first time I showed interest. Alright unto my response.

As expected, my plans where based more on long term goals that would take years than the actual steps to get there. For capital I have around 40k from various jobs I've done without spending anything in a brokerage account but my suspicions tell me that won't be enough. But can I ask some examples of things that would need to be bought?

For networking I should've mentioned I wasn't depending on it being virtual I actually have a long list of events for this month and the next, but you're right I should take a step back and investigate a lot more on what needs to be done.

I got some advice from an experienced wholesaler telling me about how he started with cold calling and so on with many missing details but that was years ago for him, and with the inflated market of today, that plan, I'm sure, would lead me to complete failure.

[knotty oar]

Hi, Has anyone attended interview for system development engineer in Amazon? What is online assessment for that position and what kind of questions are expected.

[final wind]

what is best cybersecurity or computer science

just want to hear different point of view

[vapid jay]

meow

[zealous path]

Mrrr

[zealous path]

The “best” course always depends on what you want to go into.
Cybersecurity is best for… cybersecurity jobs
whilst not ideal for something like ML Engineer.

[chrome narwhal]

Hi, has anyone completed the IBM Data Science Professional Certificate on Coursera then got a relevant job? My SWE mentor suggests me to get it, but I still hesitate to pay for it... Please encourage or advise me.

[gritty rivet]

I don't know the answer to your question but search on LinkedIn and the answer will be easily found

Personally I suspect the free course itself may be helpful, but the certificate is very unlikely to be worth paying for. But ask the people who did

[regal axle]

Exact, specific advice, I can't give you. 40k is likely not enough, based on the direction you seem to want to go. But it is enough if you are willing to modify your strategies. You might be able to participate in group contracts, and syndicate them. How profitable and reasonable that it is, I do not know. What you really need to do, is find people who are doing what you wish to do and ask them what is needed. "Cold call" leads. But this time, your leads are people in the industry. You can reach out on things like linkdin or other social media.

I think the biggest thing that indicates how not mature the strategy is, is that you said you want to do this virtually but all of your strategies are related to physical events. And honestly, anecdotal experience here, but in person is way easier to sell larger deals. Plus you can go out // drink with a client to really win them over.

!rule 9 6

[inner wren]

Rules

6. Do not post unapproved advertising.

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[chrome narwhal]

Oh thanks for the ideas! I’ll check through Linkedin. Actually my mentor is ex-google SWE with CS / DS master background, so I know it’s informative for the entry level considering his background but I’m still not sure if it’s worth for getting job as that’s my ultimate goal.

[gritty rivet]

Sounds like a good person to know 🙂

One other point about certifications... If anyone is hiring for them, you'll see them in job listings. For example a lot of job listings mention they want someone with a Professional-level AWS certification. If nobody is calling out that IBM cert in any job listings, they presumably don't care or even know about it

[marble meteor]

hi all pls help me in python in jupyter notebook pls help for my exam 9 class

bro lets meetup

[fringe sphinx]

#❓｜how-to-get-help

[marble meteor]

like i have exam

[white relic]

this channel is for career discussion

[marble meteor]

on simple python funtions using input and output

[white relic]

be aware also that it is against server rules to help with ongoing exams (if you just want help studying / revising that is fine)

[tropic sluice]

I know some fundamentals of python but i dont know what to do next

[marble meteor]

pls lets meetup in private

[chrome narwhal]

You exactly got my point… You maybe right, certificate itself is completely useless as much as actual CS / DS degree and AWS one🤦‍♂️ Even my mentor took the IBM course, he already has master degree of CS / DS. So for him it’s just a good study material, not a tool for getting jobs😂 Thank you for your kind reply. I appreciate it!

[tropic sluice]

Please help

[marble meteor]

just explane me about python

[fringe sphinx]

That is not how this server works.

[fringe sphinx]

First, read the channel descriptions. You are posting in #career-advice.

Second, stop posting discord invites. We don't allow them.

[white relic]

Do you have a career goal in mind?

[fringe sphinx]

Third, if you have a question about Python, ask the question in #python-discussion . If you need learning resource recommendations, see the link below.

!res

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[tropic sluice]

I dont think so but i like to make games

I even made ones with lua

[white relic]

1. Game development in Python is kind of niche. If you want to make a career out of that, you probably want to know some other language(s) too. But
2. Game dev is, from what I understand, a hard career. Every bright kid with a computer wants to make their own games which means there is a ton of competition for jobs and many game studios get away with paying low wages and treating employees badly. Even successful indie games often don't make enough money to pay a team and so they are wholly or partially passion projects. But
3. This is all I know about game development and it isn't based on firsthand experience, so take it with a grain of salt.

[tropic sluice]

So i should learn other languages

I already know html and css

[final sparrow]

hello

[snow patrol]

If you like game development then C++ might be more interesting for you

But game development is a hard career as trentj already pointed out

[vapid jay]

im a highschool student and i cant understand the basics T-T can anyone help me?

[deft herald]

!resources

Hey welcome! This channel is more for discussing career related topics, but feel free to check out our resources (below) or open up a help thread
#❓｜how-to-get-help

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[vapid jay]

ty

[tropic sluice]

What if i like hacking (ethical) what is the best language for me ,

If its python please tell me how to get started

[zealous path]

We can’t exactly advise on any hacking (white or black hat) but nothing’s stopping you from looking on the internet

[tropic sluice]

I meant white btw

[deft herald]

well you're already in a python discord, so that's a good start

[tropic sluice]

So its the best for hacking?/ making tools

[snow patrol]

like almost always: it depends

[snow patrol]

is that true?

[zealous path]

!rule 5

[inner wren]

Rules

5. Do not provide or request help on projects that may violate terms of service, or that may be deemed inappropriate, malicious, or illegal.

[deft herald]

The industry for "ethical hacking" is professionally known as cyber security or penetration testing (afaik)

[tropic sluice]

Yeah

[snow patrol]

im not 100% sure if that applies to that

[tropic sluice]

I meant that

[deft herald]

And it's usually a company that hires these contractors to try to break into their own systems, so it's not illegal; they have full permission

[zealous path]

We’re not qualified (or bothered enough) to check every person that says they wanna do “ethical” hacking.
So we can’t advise people and then be surprised if one of them does something malicious

[tropic sluice]

To test their encryption

[deft herald]

I mean we can adivse on how to get into the field of cyber security and pen testing right?

[zealous path]

That we can, we just can’t be like:
“If you use this code / fix this code you can hack this stuff”

[tropic sluice]

How do i get into cybersecurity then

[deft herald]

🤷‍♂️ sure. I feel like learning how to reverse-engineer encryption is like cyber security 101 though

[deft herald]

Are you in school? graduated?

[zealous path]

I’m sure there’s competitions and tasks online to learn how to get into it

[tropic sluice]

Im 15

Im not in America tho

[deft herald]

Great. So the "path of least resistance", as often discussed in this channel, is to get a degree in the field you want to work in. (Comp Sci, maybe you can find one that focuses on cyber sec)

[zealous path]

Definitely looking for a CS degree with a Cybersecurity specialisation

[deft herald]

But apart from that, you can find free courses online to take too. Like with coursera or whatever

[snow patrol]

i don't know, i think that's something the team should decide

[zealous path]

What team???

[snow patrol]

guess

[deft herald]

my team

[hot iris]

Thoughts on applying for a bootcamp?

[deft herald]

Well first, why do you want to apply for a bootcamp?

[gritty rivet]

Successful bootcamp graduate here, but I did it two years ago

If you think you're going to hand someone $10k and then quickly find a job as a result, then forget it. That was true back then but it's even much more true now

But if you're already a confirmed coding addict and just need a little extra help polishing up your skills, putting together a portfolio and connecting with people in the industry, then maybe

[fringe sphinx]

What was your background before the bootcamp?

[gritty rivet]

Irrelevant BA/MA, a few years of general IT support experience, and also years of Python as a hobby... All of those things helped.

All the successful bootcamp grads I know had some professional experience of some kind going in, and most had degrees

I don't personally know anyone who's pulled it off in the last year. Market is rough now

[hearty island]

guys i got an interview for an internal role inside the company! Business Analyst 1 🙂

i knew i should've applied for an internal role before

[dapper bane]

Why the fuk I so poor months and months of coding and no job

[near ocean]

Do you have a degree

[hot iris]

Sorry for late reply. Currently at work.

Was looking into CS and Cybersecurity. Was debating on Bootcamp as my job offers career choice. As in, they'll help pay for it

[dapper bane]

Computer science and engineering

[hearty island]

ok, what about your resume and your projects?

[deft herald]

If the job would pay, I would consider getting a degree

[dapper bane]

I ll not post with my real credential but please wait

[hearty island]

yea if it's not me helping you out someone else will volunteer

[dapper bane]

https://github.com/needJobCoder

[dapper bane]

What now

I am doing internship rn second one

[hearty island]

i see your github repo, what about the resume?

[dapper bane]

I have 4 different resume one for game , frontend , fullstack and figma

[hearty island]

post the fullstack one

[dapper bane]

But it contains all my credentials

[hearty island]

then remove them?

[dapper bane]

Ok but I ll post in some time I am not near my latop

[hearty island]

cool

[dapper bane]

This is my stack MERN , ReactNative , Django , Socket.io and Godot

My project includes a bluetooth billing app From past internship

[grim glen]

hello..im trying to change my carrier from DB developer(PLSQL and Postgre, Informatica) to AI developer....starting with Python is it a good choice?

[austere tide]

hey

so like this involves pipeline and stuff right?

[dapper bane]

Does this look cool ?

[fringe sphinx]

Should be a viable path; focus on data engineering skills, build on what you know. Check out kaggle.com/learn.

Strong db skills are a big plus, and are often hard to find.

[hearty island]

i don't see anything

[grim glen]

thank you i have 16 years experience in PLSQL and Postgre development

[austere tide]

exactly the path i had done earlier, DE > MLE

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, I’d say focus on basic Python skills first. Then data skills (Kaggle). Then ai/mlops projects

[grim glen]

nice..did you self learn or took a course ?

[austere tide]

ya self learnt, was put into a position to support a new DS/ML team and had to pick from there

[austere tide]

me and a colleague had a deal like i would teach them analytical sql queries an they'd give me the intuition around why ML?

[grim glen]

nice you got some help

[austere tide]

again most of the ml pipeline involve building unconventional data pipelines, so you should sorta fit right in

[grim glen]

wonderfull

[vapid jay]

I feel really confused by the field name of Machine Learning. Does it involve software engineering, or is it more data science related?

Cause like ML/AI seems to be the hot new thing (it's where all the crypto bros are going now lol) but I'm not really into data science that much, I prefer making things

[gritty rivet]

All this stuff overlaps. Build what you want to build and let someone else worry about what your title will be

[blazing harbor]

ML/AI has been the hot new thing and then not and back to it

AI has been filled with a history of optimism and false promises

[austere tide]

DS is more focused on the business and domain
ML is more software and product focused
if that makes sense, there is certainly overlap of skills and processes

[vapid jay]

The LLM's are pretty helpful but I don't see them replacing humans any time soon and not in our lifetime. Imo sure currently AI can make data analysis easier, writing small blocks of code go faster, do copy writing etc. But what would be more useful is AI that can stock shelves, work in warehouses etc. AI should be used to replace the minimum wage manual labor jobs and retail jobs. Not making art and stuff.

[austere tide]

the hype is real, and companies who don't know what they are doing are wasting money
there are also companies who know what they are doing, and very successful

[austere tide]

all of ml is not llm, its a new fad, it too shall pass

[dapper bane]

@hearty island

[vapid jay]

I feel any company that jumps the gun on laying off a bunch of workers cause they think the LLM's can just do all that work deserve what they get lol

[hearty island]

this is the entire resume? or just projects

[dapper bane]

Projects I am having trouble with photoshop I usually do this stuff on pc

[vapid jay]

Also the tech layoffs going on are not due to AI

[hearty island]

can you ss the entire resume?

[blazing harbor]

the readability is very off

[dapper bane]

Hey this is screenshot

[blazing harbor]

no but stick with the standard latex template

[austere tide]

absolutely, again all jobs which can be automated will eventually be automated, be it ai or something else

[blazing harbor]

also if your resume doesn't go through the ATS scanner, you might get an auto reject

[hearty island]

not might. like 100% basically. unless they actively eyeball your resume instead of ATS-ing it

https://www.overleaf.com/latex/templates/jakes-resume/syzfjbzwjncs here's a good format you can use

[dapper bane]

What I never knew this

[blazing harbor]

the more you know

[hearty island]

no time like the present then

[dapper bane]

First what is ATS and how do I make an ATS friendly resume ?

[hearty island]

applicant tracking system and by using the resume i put above ^

[white relic]

Actual ML is still research heavy. Interest is high now and there are openings because it's the hot thing but it's still far from being a field you can enter off the street without a relevant degree or even with merely a BS. The more accessible openings have intense competition and probably lean more toward data engineering than data science. Software engineering is another discipline altogether and though there is some overlap, there are still plenty of opportunities in that field for people with relevant education and there will continue to be for the foreseeable future

[white relic]

^ meant to reply

[dapper bane]

I don't think being a coder u can make good money

[peak halo]

many of the staff members and frequent contributors here are professional devs who do well enough

[stuck jetty]

how well they do

I am wondering if anyone got a chance to contribute to tenserflow

[pine sleet]

we don't have data (afaik) but 100k+ in low-medium CoL areas is common enough in tech

[peak halo]

I haven't polled anyone for their salaries, but professional devs tend to make enough to live comfortably.

[pine sleet]

it's also common to start seeing 150k+ in higher CoL areas

[stuck jetty]

do you have any idea how to get work as a contractor

[fringe sphinx]

Best plan? Work 10+ years and build up your experience first.

[stuck jetty]

like not full time employment

sure

[dapper bane]

That is in first world u don't have any idea about the third world

[pine sleet]

i don't, sorry

but i would assume a job in tech would still allow you to live comfortably, above the median

[fringe sphinx]

We do not allow recruiting or advertisements.

!rule 6 9

[inner wren]

Rules

6. Do not post unapproved advertising.

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[fringe sphinx]

Thx

[supple hollow]

Oh, SOrry

[sweet breach]

!rule 192

[inner wren]

:x: Invalid rule indices: 192

[peak halo]

please experiment with commands in #bot-commands

[inner wren]

:x: Invalid rule indices: 34

[pure vine]

!rule 6

[inner wren]

Rules

6. Do not post unapproved advertising.

[wispy flume]

Hello!, I was asking if I must have a degree to work as python programmer specially in ML&AI, it's not my main career but I like doing it and took it as a side hustle

[smoky quest]

It depends mostly on which end of the field you want to take.
Building apps on top of existing AI/ML APIs wouldn't require a degree (ex: calling chatgpt API).
If you want to make your own models then ML/AI are a very advanced field where degrees are quite important.

Saying you want to pick up AI/ML as a side hustle isn't realistic though. It's like you want to pick up building nuclear submarines as a side hustle

[wispy flume]

I like doing models that automate boring stuff using python and idk if that's a real AI&ML and same for chatbots using NLP techniques

I think it's simple ML methods, not as complex as building chatgpt or stable diffusion from scratch

[native parrot]

You've been quite useful and for that I offer my thanks. I'll follow your advice and do more research on the field and seek advice from experienced real estate agents. Also, it's quite clear at this point that my strategy for success needs to be modified, my original plan to have everything virtual was based around a situation i'm in right now and the market I want to invest in, but I'll figure that out. Thanks again! If you don't mind me asking, I have a feeling you are, but are you in real estate?

[regal axle]

I am not; But I do try to pick people's brains about basically anything and everything. One of my (used to be) roommates was in real estate. So I can at least talk about the most basic of things.
So yea, I guess, take everything I have said with a grain of salt, and investigate for yourself. But that is also what I originally said, so ,,, checks out.

[native parrot]

Everything you said checked out. I figured you has some affiliation with real estate. Anyways, thanks again

[blazing harbor]

@fringe sphinx I know that's a thing, but like "I'm reaching out regarding an application you submitted on Handshake back in November for the fully-remote SWE Intern role with [], for Summer 2024.

We are so excited to let you know that we would like to move you forward and invite you to complete a quick pre-interview! This gives us a chance to look beyond your resume in the early hiring process.

I will go ahead and send out a separate message within the next hour or so with a link to our pre-interview portal (check your spam folder), where you can individually submit a voice response to our prompt. We do ask that you complete this step by Wednesday at 7PM, if possible.."

this is a startup 😭 idk why I gotta preinterview for them wow

[fringe sphinx]

Be happy, you have a shot.

[blazing harbor]

have an offer lol

[hearty island]

congrats man!

[blazing harbor]

but good exposure ig I'll go

[blazing harbor]

tyty

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, think of it as batting practice (if you played baseball)

[blazing harbor]

yeah seems like a sql/Kubernetes job so I'll have to check it out

[hearty island]

i got an interview for a biz analyst 1 role at as an internal candidate 🙂

[calm glade]

Hello Everyone,

I have created one project by using LLM.

Please check it and If you have any suggestions then please tell me.

Link - https://mycareerpath.online/

[native parrot]

will do

[dapper bane]

@hearty island hey I am looking to remake my resume do I have to use that link only ?

or I can use some other as well

[smoky quest]

you can use whatever you want to make your resume

[vapid jay]

do companies that hire tech staff care about resume aesthetic presentation

or is it more about the contents of your resume, cuz in not familiar with hiring from tech

[dapper bane]

This is how my resume looks like

[dapper bane]

hey what do u think ?

[smoky quest]

aesthetic doesn't hurt as long as it doesn't get in the way

[dapper bane]

hey help me too

[smoky quest]

one at a time.

[dapper bane]

alright I am waiting

[smoky quest]

• I would suggest a single column format so it's easier to parse
• Your list of skills should put first what you are the most knowledgeable. Unless you are applying for godot related position, it shouldn't be godot
• Your billing app could be cleaned up a bit. There are some premises of skills but also some BS and claims. There is a say: show, don't tell.
• Your internship is also missing dates
• You could add some technical details for your infinite runner. Like some cool stuff that is difficult

[dapper bane]

Alright let me make some changes and stuff

[dapper bane]

Hows this ?

[smoky quest]

While it does not address all my points, it's better.
I would also encourage you to use bullets and shorter sentences. People will rarely read a giant block of text

[dapper bane]

alright then I ll keep this but my tech stack looks really less it just MERN, React Native ,Django thats all

[dapper bane]

wdy think of my tech stack

[dapper bane]

I made it in points

Does it look nice now ?

[dapper bane]

hey friend please u gotta help me

[merry cedar]

I didnt read all the discussion but this seem very lengthy, as someone who sometimes has to recruit new devs, i'd rather have a list of past experiences (whether personal or professional) with a very concise description that you'll be able to talk about further during the interview
For instance in my own CV i give a title to each job ive worked for (the title very quickly describing the mission/project i had) and then i give a concise list of tools used

you only have a single "experience" and project ?

[dapper bane]

I have only one internship second one I am doing

[merry cedar]

i see, and for personal / study projects ?
that'll be your main selling point when you don't have much pro experience

[near ocean]

Use the template people recommend

[merry cedar]

ive backread a bit and recursive_error explained it already in details

main problem for me are the subjective aspects you describe tho, those are not for you to judge and its likely that the interviewers wont take you seriously because of it

"captivating", "addictive", stuff like that

[gritty rivet]

To be honest this is probably the worst layout I've seen. On the one hand you have loads of wasted space on the left and then a dense wall of text on the right. I agree with old man: use a standard template

[fringe sphinx]

Agree with other comments, the filler/fluff phrases make it less professional, not more:: “Demonstrated proficiency in”, “spearheaded the integration”. This reads like fluff that GPT would generate. A hiring manager wants to know: What tech you used and What you did with the tech (built xyz game) And, perhaps, what was significant or impactful about it (I don’t care so much about this from an entry candidate!.

[dapper bane]

U r not mistaken it is gpt generated

[fringe sphinx]

I am 100% on my gpt detector for resumes.

My son taught me that you can prompt gpt to write ‘simply’, and avoid the overly verbose phrases.

[dapper bane]

Ok thanks

[fringe sphinx]

But: just focus on the facts. I want to know what tech you know, and what you’ve done with it.

‘Built a pygame-ce side scroller game…” “Achieved 100% test coverage with pytest, measured with coverage.py..” etc

[pulsar solar]

guys I am building ai pdf, is this good product, I mean is there demand for this ?

[near ocean]

Not really a career question, what does ai pdf even mean?

[white relic]

Embedding an AI in an actual PDF file sounds like a cool and unique, but totally impractical side project

[near ocean]

Thats cool and all but do you have a question?

[white relic]

Are you looking for feedback? This isn't a job board.

[spiral seal]

No I am just looking for an opportunity

[near ocean]

This server isnt a company you can apply to and there are rules against advertising for positions

[spiral seal]

I am looking for any opportunity or what shall i do or learn these days

[spiral seal]

I wasn't totally aware bout that

[near ocean]

Rules are the first thing you agree to when joining the server

[spiral seal]

I didn't mean to offend you mate

[near ocean]

Im not offended, its polluting the chat

[proven crest]

If you're looking for an opportunity to learn, create some independent projects. It can be anything that interests you, ones that fulfil a purpose are probably the best IMO. You can also contribute to open source projects on GH.

[spiral seal]

Great to know
Also i have a query can i get any scope of getting a us-salary while i am serving for any us company but from India

[white relic]

No

[proven crest]

This looks like it was written by AI. The sentences make no sense to a human. It's all filler, no substance. The point of a resume is to be short and concise, to effectively communicate your abilities an experience. This does the opposite, its like you're trying to reach a word count.

[pulsar solar]

yeah, I am thinking on it
If I build will people use it, if its free ?
cause who use ai for pdf

[proven crest]

Are you talking about a pdf reader with AI integration? I think if you have to ask yourself "will people use it, even if its free" its probably not a strong sign. I think it would be a fun project, and a good learning experience though. If you're captivated by it, by all means go for it, especially if you're inbetween projects

[pulsar solar]

I want to monetize it, and I agree with your point. why people use it ?
still I am thinking on it, is it good to earn some money ?

mostly I don't think but its an ai thats' why

[proven crest]

Well why wouldn't I just drop the PDF into any free LLM instead of downloading any paying for entirely new software?

[white relic]

I don't know why anyone would pay for it. It sounds like a decent resume project, like installing Linux on a toaster or whatever. But I have no idea how you make it into a marketable product

[pulsar solar]

right

[pulsar solar]

what about image generator ai ?

[proven crest]

I mean are you going to train it from scatch or use an existing model? If you're using an existing model, why wouldnt the end user use the existing model in the first place?

[white relic]

There's a lot of Buzz about AI in the news lately. That doesn't translate to any AI project being more monetizable or AI in general being a good way to start making money. If anything it can go the other way, since lots of people are trying the same thing and many of them have more resources and more expertise than you

[pulsar solar]

yeah, I am using existing model but not 100 % sure I am going to build

[proven crest]

Thats the point, if you're taking something that exists for free and charging for it, people will use what they can get for free. Unless you give them a reason to use yours, for example ease of use (but this barrier is breaking down rapidly)

[vapid jay]

umm i have a question about fronted and backend

[proven crest]

Sure

[vapid jay]

i"m wondering what is different between fronted and backend python writing? i have knowlegde fronted/backend

html/css/js php java pyhton learning progressing right now

[proven crest]

Python is mainly backend, the frontend would lean towards front end DOM manipulation, UI/UX, same way as it would in web dev AFAIK

[lilac coral]

can some help me with this really basic code?

[white relic]

This channel is for career discussion. Check out #❓｜how-to-get-help

[lilac coral]

sorry

[mossy oyster]

Hi guys ,What is the mostly used backend for web developers? Go or python?

[hearty island]

guys i got another conditional offer!

[fringe sphinx]

Most used web backend? I dunno, probably php. Wouldn't recommend it tho.

[gritty rivet]

JavaScript probably. Definitely not Go... I imagine Java and PHP are well ahead of Go

[fringe sphinx]

https://spectrum.ieee.org/the-top-programming-languages-2023 if you're interested.

[white relic]

somebody told me the other day, "nobody uses Java anymore"

[fringe sphinx]

I think all the java haters have moved onto becoming python haters.

[white relic]

hah

[frozen nexus]

Isn't rust very trendy

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, very hipster.

[white relic]

hating on rust is extremely trendy

[frozen nexus]

Its quite low on the trending list

[fringe sphinx]

Internet trendy is different than job trendy

(for the record, I do like Rust, I'm just commenting on the social media views of langs)

[true harness]

how did they remove it from the over 3 billion devices

[fringe sphinx]

rollover.

[frozen nexus]

That's true

[mossy oyster]

I am a front end developer. Which one back end language should I learn?

[proven crest]

I am a builder, which one tool should i buy?

[white relic]

Javascript (+node/whatever), Python, C#, Go are all solid choices, depending on why you want to learn and what direction you want to go with your career.

[white relic]

But as Pyrex notes, there's no reason to limit yourself to one backend language (even if your main development area is frontend).

[mossy oyster]

yes agree about that

[jagged elbow]

hey

i am new to this python world

[fringe pine]

So it is not batter to focus in one language 🤔

[vapid jay]

are You Arabic ?

[serene meteor]

Hello guys. New here

I would like to know ways where we developers can look for freelance work?

[peak halo]

@dapper bane are you asking for a resume review? because seeking employment is not allowed here.

[dapper bane]

resume review

[peak halo]

okay. you should probably change your name so that people don't think you're trying to break the rules.

[dapper bane]

Live Link -> https://needjob-coder.itch.io/mazegameconcept this is the live link in my resume

[dapper bane]

hey I just need a resume review thats all

[dapper bane]

wdy think now ?

[dapper bane]

does this look better ?

hey where did every1 go ?

[hearty island]

busy

[proven crest]

Stop spamming firstly. Its marginally better, but still much of the same. You're managing use a lot of words to say very little.
You connected to a printer?
You changed the UI?
You used some basic modules?

I also checked out your project, theres no code to review (or at least I couldn't see it).
Its also very basic and looks unfinished. I think you need to work on your projects a bit more.

[dapper bane]

thats the live project

[proven crest]

It's good to have a demonstration of the live project, but its equally important to show the code

[dapper bane]

I dont want to show the logic I wrote

[proven crest]

Why not?

[dapper bane]

because then anyone can clone it and make it theirs

[near ocean]

Did you use the template?

[proven crest]

Not to be rude, but no one will be stealing and claiming ownership of that code. Even if they do, how will that harm you?

[true harness]

the people you want advice from have jobs

[proven crest]

I think you need to work on a few solid, well made projects rather than multiple unfinished ones, have a github for the code and work on your resume without using AI. Concentrate on keeping your resume concise and effective. Don't try to fill a word count or overcomplicate something simple, that comes across as you either being a bad communicator, disingenuous or lacking competency (or all 3).

[dapper bane]

what bout this one ? https://needjob-coder.itch.io/infiniterunnerrpgstyle

[dapper bane]

ok ?

[buoyant seal]

You could learn using Typescript for backend 😉 u would get benefit of sharing code between your front and end in an interesting code quality

[buoyant seal]

trentj — Today at 3:12 PM:
Javascript (+node/whatever), Python, C#, Go are all solid choices, depending on why you want to learn and what direction you want to go with your career.
besides that
C#, Java, Typescript, Golang, Python are all solid choices yeah... they just have all different a bit directions

[proven crest]

Do you think this project shows your full capabilities?

[dapper bane]

I dont think so but I cant be making another big project while I ll be doing my internship and then doing the attached job

[lucid carbon]

hello species of earth i require help

[dapper bane]

I made this while back

[proven crest]

Well theres your answer. Maybe concentrate on your internship + job and learn and grow, that should be your main focus.

[lucid carbon]

I want to make a portfolio website for myself like other people do (like the portfolio thing where you can showcase work and stuff) where can i do that for free

[dapper bane]

but the interviewer was quite impressed with these projects and gave me an internship with job offer

[proven crest]

Then why are you stressing about your resume if you have an internship plus job offer?

[lucid carbon]

yea i need a resume where do i make one

[proven crest]

Maybe look into Github Pages / Netlify

[dapper bane]

I am using canva

[lucid carbon]

isnt canva paid?

[dapper bane]

u ll find a good template for free

[proven crest]

MS Word or Latex if you want to be fancy.

[lucid carbon]

oh i see thank you for your kind suggestions i shall be back

[dapper bane]

canvas is easier though in my experience u get everything built

[proven crest]

I wouldn't recommend Canva. From what I've seen all the templates are really bad. If you want easy use MS Word. If you want beautiful use Latex(really not that hard to use) or InDesign (depending on skills)
But that being said, theres no harm in trying anything. I've never used it, so maybe I'm wrong. I'm just giving my opinion based on what I've seen from others.

[dapper bane]

bro u get everything built already

[near ocean]

Use the template people have recommended to you already for the past 3 days
Its latex but you can remake it in word

[proven crest]

prebuilt doesn't automatically mean good. As old man mar said, latex has templates too. They're just far more good options available.

[turbid bobcat]

I didn't pass the interview and I don't know why. I solved the question within the problems constraints and in time :/

It was a fairly good solution too, with enough scaffolding for optimizing if given more time.

[white relic]

Sometimes you know why you bombed an interview. Most often you don't. Sometimes you did great and they don't call back because of reasons that have nothing to do with your performance. It's best not to obsess over it. Learn what you can and move on.

[turbid bobcat]

How can you bomb an interview where you solve the leetcode and answer all questions correctly ? I'll move on, but this is a bit disappointing, and kinda odd.

This whole social ritual is very random and not very effective, I wonder if building a professional network is more effective. I hear word of mouth can be a good way to get a job if you build up reputation.

[white relic]

I hate to be the one to break it to you, but building a professional network is a lot more random social ritual and none of it feels particularly effective

[turbid bobcat]

Uhm, I have seen several experienced people advising for it, one said: "your objective as you go through your career is to make it so you don't have to have interviews again" - not an exact quote, but very close

[white relic]

That doesn't mean it isn't effective. But it doesn't feel good

[turbid bobcat]

I think that if your work is good and you are hired on that basis, that's totally okay

Though I can see the other side of the coin when it comes to networking

I'll reflect on my performance in a couple days, I also asked politely for feedback, hopefully they'll send it to me

[white relic]

You never know what leads are going to pan out. If you are networking effectively, probably the vast majority of your contacts will never come to anything and you spend most of your effort on people who have nothing to offer you. But you won't necessarily know that until years down the road. It's the same with interviews really. Most of them won't result in an offer but you have to do a lot to maximize your chances of finding the one that does

[white relic]

I've never done a leetcode interview. Was there any other aspect to the interview or just coding problems?

[turbid bobcat]

It was an image processing problem and I had to describe how I would go about solving it. I genuinely think I did good in solving it. But honestly, it's best to let a couple days pass or something and then look back at it.

[white relic]

Were you in a zoom call with someone? Did they ask you questions face to face?

[turbid bobcat]

Google meet, I walked through my solution as I went, step by step, even drawing it out for him (I have one of those e-pens, so I could draw it on the board feature of google meetings)

I was careful with my time and effectively jumped through the details that didn't matter to get to a solution that works and is extendable

[white relic]

Chances are good that your non-selection didn't have anything in particular to do with your solution to the problem. Maybe they had a lot of applicants and they just picked the top 5 off the stack to move on to the next stage.
It's good to know your weaknesses are and keep trying to improve, but getting a rejection can feel like a personal and professional failure when it's not actually your fault

It's good to ask for feedback, maybe they will give you something you aren't aware of to work on.

[turbid bobcat]

For sure. It's a shame though, I really liked the first interviewer, who was the person I'd be working with. It is what it is, there's gonna be many more opportunities.

[smoky quest]

That means your answers didn't meet their criteria.

I have had candidates very proud of their O(N^2) solution and arguing it was better than the O(N) we discussed.
I have had candidates confidently talk about toxic behaviors and would do it again.
I have had candidates who only went 60% of the way and missed some important elements.

But also, don't neglect the fact the interviewer may just not have liked you or had a bad day

[turbid bobcat]

I'd be happy to hear their alternative solution.

I think the interviewer was inexperienced.

[smoky quest]

send them an email asking for feedback. They might give you an answer

[turbid bobcat]

I did, will reflect on it in a couple days, hopefully I'll have their feedback by then

[smoky quest]

As a rule of thumb, if it's the only interview out of 10, it could be due to anything. But if you have failed 10 interviews, chances are the problem lies with you rather than the interviewer

[turbid bobcat]

Yeah makes sense, hasn't gotten to that yet tho.

[smoky quest]

yeah I don't know your stats.
Attributing problems to the interviewer is a dangerous line as it prevents self reflection and growth. So it's a fine line to tread

[turbid bobcat]

I'm pretty sure the interviewer has as many YOE as me, at least judging by LinkedIn.

But I'll reflect on it regardless. There's always room for improvement

[native narwhal]

I want to work with web develpment but It has to be without me doing any JavaScript tasks
Is this realistic? I don't mind working with config/servers/security/backend programming etc

I just don't wanna deal with any JS part of it

[turbid bobcat]

I think you can be a backend engineer. There's also htmx which minimizes frontend work

[native narwhal]

But all jobs seem to require either knowledge of JS framewroks or just straight forward full stack jobs

[white relic]

Why do you want to do web development?

[turbid bobcat]

It makes sense due to the state of the market. Specialists are paid more but generalists are the ones who do better during downturns

[native narwhal]

It seems like all jobs are in web dev to be honest, am I wrong or biased, thats the info I have atm, any info welcomed

[turbid bobcat]

Counting it up, I'm on 3 failed interviews out of 10 or 11. This last one in particular had a long process.

[smoky quest]

that's not a bad ratio overall

basically, the level of someone with a bsc in CS, proper projects and internships

[turbid bobcat]

I'll be careful about it. Hoping their feedback will be helpful. It's always gonna be that bit harder since I'm relocating.

[agile warren]

which career would you suggest when just learning python

is there like a basic intern position like in IT example ( IT support, IT help desk)

[smoky quest]

What is your situation and goal?

[white relic]

It might be that way in some places or if you are mostly looking at FAANG type companies. I can speak most comfortably for defense and aerospace, which has a lot of use for non-web programmers

[agile warren]

no situation, i would say my goal is to code in python as a side hustle but not sure if web dev, or creating bots on the side, ive seen there's a lot of ppl who create bots for users or make changes to their website

[agile warren]

@smoky quest

[smoky quest]

yeah, there will be quite a bit of competition and will also depend on your sales and communication skills

[agile warren]

why would it depend on sales and communication skills, i do have background in those fields but wonder why

[smoky quest]

you need to convince people to hire you and give you that work/contract

[agile warren]

oh i see what you mean, well the side hustle that i have my eye one already has ppl just asking you to create stuff for them so seems like an easy sale, in python or programming is there a role lower than intern ?

[smoky quest]

interns are typically for students to enable them to discover what is it about to work in a company.
If you are looking for freelancing, you don't need any internship. You only need to convince someone that you can do the contract.

[agile warren]

yea i dont think im no where near ready to do any of that yet but just wanted to see what options i have bc there is so much info and resource out there

[smoky quest]

In terms of career, a CS degree is the path of least resistance and with the most opportunities and compensation

[gritty rivet]

There's no natural path from IT support to Python dev, but having that IT experience doesn't hurt. The bar for entry in general IT support is a lot lower, but so is the pay

The idea of Python programming as a "side hustle" is a bit unlikely if you're not extremely good and well connected or looking to charge $5 an hour. You can go on Upwork and Fiverr and see what the competition is like

[agile warren]

ok yea ill take a look a those sites and see what you mean. yea i was at one point interested in pentester but started liking the coding side better so started following that more now

[forest kayak]

im learning python classes if anyone wants to vc and hep a bit it would be appreciated

[smoky quest]

You can ask your career related questions here directly. That will make it easier to answer and reach more people

[forest kayak]

ok

[agile warren]

what is the best chat on this channel to ask for basic questions

[fringe sphinx]

#python-discussion is the main channel for Python questions

[earnest bronze]

Do you all think its too nitpicky to ask other devs to stop using raise Exception and instead use built in exceptions or define our own? I know its not really against PEP, but its a real pain in the ass when I'm trying to implement their code. I know you can describe Exception however you want with a string. but a) it helps newer devs understand our ecosystem and b) what if I want to ignore a certain exception in a try/except block but catch a valuerror, you know?

[deft herald]

No it's not nitpicky

What's the context of your team though? How much seniority do you have?

[earnest bronze]

yeah so thats the thing. This is from the production utilities module. I have not been at the company very long, so I'm thinking I should keep my mouth shut for a while, or find a way to say it very very delicately

I feel listened to and heard, and I do have access to the repo, but its technically not my job

[deft herald]

Ok so the team creating this utilities module is different than yours?

[earnest bronze]

Yes, they are a different team. My team builds does the "data cleaning,munging,transformations" based on the end user specifications (eg we want a listing that will flag which patients are growing slower than the average growth rate) and that team writes little utility functions that help us fetch the data, push the listing to silver and gold, generate json files based on the params we used, things like that

for more context we use databricks and pyspark. It it is very aparant that not all devs have a strong python background, even those who work on our utility functions. Though databricks I will admit is a whole different animal

[winged arch]

where is like general chat in this server?

[near ocean]

!ot

[inner wren]

Off-topic channel

#ot2-never-nester’s-nightmare

Please read our off-topic etiquette before participating in conversations.

[smoky quest]

You can try different approaches, from soft to the more hardliners ones. In no order:

• Use code reviews to bring up the problem and an alternative solution
• Use the "Look at this cool thing I found out" talk
• Reach out to the TL/manager
• Use the retrospective to bring the subject
• Use your company cop/guild to improve the best practices. Ex: doing a tech talk or bring up the subject

[earnest bronze]

I really really appreciate this advice. I want to eventually switch to that team. Do you think It would be a good idea to reach out via email to some ppl who made the last few commits and not even bring up the "problem" but ask them questions, pick their brain, and that sort of thing? Of couse not as a way to show my knowledge, just with grace and humility

[smoky quest]

The main thing is to make sure you both are in it to make it a better place. You don't want to make it a us vs them.
To that end, anything that bridges you two is a great start. That means:

• You both build trust and the feedback will be easier to give and receive
• You can also get exposed to what they are optimizing for and what made them go that route

[earnest bronze]

Yesss exactly! since Spark/Databricks has sooo many components, I just want to learn

You seem like you would be a really great person to work with. Hope we cross paths one day

[vital wyvern]

I'm not here to add anything of value to this conversation, but I do want you to know based on my experience that you may come to regret those words one day if you value your sanity.

[earnest bronze]

either you know eachother or he/it just passed the turing test

tell me more please lol

[hearty island]

no advertising pls remove

[dire notch]

Is it okay, if I just delete the link?

[hearty island]

yea

[fringe sphinx]

Just delete the entire ad please. Still an ad.

[hearty island]

oh i thought they said ad. my bad @fringe sphinx

[dire notch]

I just wanted to see what people are more interested in, if there is not a link there is no advertisment

[fringe sphinx]

That was most certainly an ad. Link or no link. If you'd like to discuss further, please DM modmail.

[dire notch]

No problem at all

[sly solar]

Is it worth using those ai websites to check my cvs score? does anyone here work on that side of things? I tried one of the free ones and it gave me a low score but that could be becuase they want me to pay for it

[agile warren]

thank you

[true harness]

might be worth trying, but the tools that are used by companies won't have their actual algorithm online, so you might overtrain somehow

[sly solar]

Ahh i see

[true harness]

i asked the hr person that hired me to show me how the system worked and I got to play around with the ats, but this would be mildly difficult without a job

[sly solar]

There are AI sites that have an ATS according to them, but I don't know if they're being over critical for the sake of getting you to pah

I'm beginning to wander if doing a fast track a level maths course would be worth. I went to college instead of a levels and that didn't include any maths so my maths skills have sunk heavily.

[turbid bobcat]

I actually counted this wrong, I'm on 2 failed interviews, one of them I did get next steps, I was the one deciding to not move forward

[wheat pumice]

Hello everyone! I'm here cause I'm doing some research about job with python.
Someone of you guys are Junior or in intern position ?
I'm interested of demand of python on other country. (I'm from Poland) and how look like situation of job market?

[proven crest]

Check LinkedIn and Google Jobs. As a junior / intern, it might be easier to find something in Poland, but that being said you're in a good position having freedom of movement across the EU.

[wheat pumice]

Yeah, I checked. But I’m curious how situation on job market looks like in other country. Cause in Poland large companies are laying of various departments

[wheat pumice]

Are you on entry level position ? 😊

[zealous path]

POLSKA MENTIONED 🇵🇱🇵🇱🇵🇱 !!!

[white relic]

Are you only interested in answers from juniors? More experienced people might have more seasoned insights for you about the job market and Python related jobs.

[proven crest]

I’m a junior dev, yes.

[dusty fulcrum]

so opinions, is a leetcode hard problem good for a 20 minute code interview?

My gut feeling is that either (a) the candidate will have seen the problem and will be able to spit out the answer or (b) they will not have seen the answer before and will not have enough time to deduce it. Either way it seems not to give you what you're looking for.

[buoyant seal]

i like to give on purpose dreadful code with high amount of worst language practices and asking to refactor it.
Thus i check that person indeed has sense of a good code, able to spot smells, and wielding coding at the level of improving it.
And even getting nice things regarding specific stack (backend stuff) things check
Before i ask this task, i make sure to ask all the theoretical questions first, so person gets extra clues what will be asked from refactoring

[white relic]

That feels accurate but idk exactly what a leetcode hard means.
Always hated those kind of "have you seen this exact problem the interviewer finds interesting" questions

[fringe sphinx]

Really? So how would you move Mount Fuji? /j

[dusty fulcrum]

it's somewhat ironic that hours before my interview I identified that as the style of question i like least.

after the interview I found the question on leetcode and submitted my solution. happy to say it passed. so there's that. but i had not seen this trick used before.

[white relic]

Which one was it? For my curiosity

[fringe sphinx]

Oh that’s good, I haven’t done that

[dusty fulcrum]

https://leetcode.com/problems/insert-delete-getrandom-o1-duplicates-allowed/description/

[dusty fulcrum]

I've had interviews like that before, They're actually quite fun.

[fringe sphinx]

I’m still ambivalent about take home and OAs

[dusty fulcrum]

My problem with it, is that it's a 5 minute coding solution if you know the answer. But might take considerably more time of testing different approaches if you have not encountered it before.

[fringe sphinx]

Reminiscent of many discrete and prob questions too.

[white relic]

Yeah, honestly, just glancing at the problem, I'm probably not going to hit on a truly O(1) solution in 20 minutes under pressure

Knowing it's a 5 minute solution is actually a good hint

[true harness]

I think the main issue when solving the problem is that you're too likely to overcomplicate it. it's clear what pieces you need just based on the constraints, though

[dusty fulcrum]

it was about 50 lines of code including a couple comments and white space

[dusty fulcrum]

that's mostly true, but for this problem if you don't know ||the O(1) random removal|| trick it can be hard to figure out in the moment.

[white relic]

OK I thought about it while I was in the shower, now looking at the solutions

[fringe sphinx]

Uh oh, now you’ve thrown down the gauntlet

[keen sinew]

Is it wrong to assume that a cert will tell middle management in a company 'I'm not a completely unskilled dufus with python'

As a way to get a foot in towards a technical interview

[kindred oyster]

its a good thing to have, sure

[fringe sphinx]

Need more context, like your background and job level etc

[kindred oyster]

but it doesnt hold the power to land you an interview

[keen sinew]

I'm a previous nuclear reactor operator, electronics hardware technician, have basic electrician-type experience, and some mechanical history. I have nothing other than using labview in a remedial fashion that would suggest I have any coding experience on a resume.

[fringe sphinx]

Navy, I assume?

[keen sinew]

Aced it

[white relic]

So I got sidetracked down a rabbit hole of thinking "but is it really O(1)" and didn't actually solve the random removal part, so I think I failed this interview

[fringe sphinx]

Work from that, that’s good context and good background. In -that- case, a Python cert and some systems skills (cloud/aws in particular) would go a long way

Python certs don’t normally mean much, but when you’re talking about a career changer (esp post military) they make sense

[keen sinew]

Thank you. I did research which cert is most named by sites other than the cert host, and it seems from what I found that Python Institute's are most named. If you've any better recommendations, I'd appreciate it

[fringe sphinx]

I’m not sure any of them are well respected. CS50P also has an online cert. the important part is writing code and projects to reinforce the learning.

[harsh river]

that experience will give you far more of a leg up than a random cert website like the one you provided before.

[fringe sphinx]

Definitely check out AWS certs for cloud stuff

[fringe sphinx]

Also, I was also in military, as were a few other folks around here. Wishing you best of luck. And visit #python-discussion when you get stuck

[keen sinew]

Thanks, man

[harsh river]

also, what branch of programming do you want to work in? depending on that answer, we can probably help you identify better ways to get a more amicable resume to tech companies.

[dusty fulcrum]

It's entirely possible you were not expected to succeed, but rather to see how you interact when faced with this challenge.

[keen sinew]

AI research seems fun. I may have a leg in with doing product development for an LLM chatbot company, but we'll see.

[gritty rivet]

I doubt you'll see any job listings looking for a cert like that

If you're looking for a role where writing code is the primary task, then a portfolio of relevant projects is what you need

[fringe sphinx]

That’s my problem with OA and take homes

But I get that when you have 1000 candidates, you gotta do something to filter

[keen sinew]

My main focus for the first bit is getting paid to develop a strong portfolio.

[fringe sphinx]

This is asked a lot; there are many jobs in tech besides SWE, and getting some tech experience is good for a resume. Support and operations are valid places to start, also, sales engineering: a lot of big tech companies train sales/systems engineers.

I knew one tech company who focused on hiring people with college sports backgrounds (their hiring criteria was: demonstrated competitive traits)

Yah, no lie. These were for sales engineering (and sales too) roles: they wanted the personality first, they could train the skills

Also, clearance / military background does help for some jobs. Have a separate resume for defense contractors.

[keen sinew]

The company I may have a leg in with wants me to help them with exactly that: KPI-related tasks, product development, products testing

I never want to use my clearance again.

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, you have a ‘demonstrated ability to learn and be trusted’

[keen sinew]

I'm done helping to kill people.

[fringe sphinx]

Careful, we might end in an ‘ethics of tech’ debate 🙂

[white relic]

Sure, but then what if I had seen the problem before? I solve it in 6 minutes and there's not much to gauge because I spent the whole time writing code and fixing syntax errors

[keen sinew]

I don't have anything to debate. It's just about trying to move into a field I think is more likely to generate human prosperity: tech

[fringe sphinx]

Oh, I was just saying other people will jump in and start saying ‘tech is bad blah blah blah’

[dusty fulcrum]

One of the reasons I want to get back into the gaming industry, having worked in the US healthcare industry, it was soul destroying, even though I was helping save people, just being a part of the system and seeing it in action was brutal.

[white relic]

them: "Talk to me about your process." me: "I saw this leetcode before and looked up a YouTube tutorial"

[keen sinew]

Fair

[dusty fulcrum]

That's what I was saying. either they have seen it before and you get little out of it, or they have not, and you also get little out of it.

[fringe sphinx]

But let me backup: have you seen these links? If not, bookmark and review them;

!res

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[fringe sphinx]

!kin

[inner wren]

Kindling Projects

The Kindling projects page on Ned Batchelder's website contains a list of projects and ideas programmers can tackle to build their skills and knowledge.

[keen sinew]

Bookmarked. Thanks!

[fringe sphinx]

You don’t need a cert to learn Python: grab one of those ebooks (such as a byte of Python, or automate the boring stuff). Study it page by page and ask questions in #python-discussion . Write simple code, then start with simple projects.

[keen sinew]

I have been learning for a couple weeks. The cert is just an attempt to get me past a bit of the 1000 applicant problem

[fringe sphinx]

Yup, great

[keen sinew]

Lots of different books, tutorials, usecases

[fringe sphinx]

Just to be clear: , you won’t (likely) land a SWE position directly, but you can get your foot in door somehow

[keen sinew]

How do I actually build a portfolio? references? github posts?

[fringe sphinx]

Projects (on GitHub)

[true harness]

(or whatever other vcs repository)

[keen sinew]

Alright. Can this be stuff that does hyper-specific memery in an interesting way, or is it better to make things with hard usecase

[fringe sphinx]

At your stage, I wouldn’t worry about ‘portfolio,, I’d just worry about projects that challenge you

But there are a few standard portfolio things: a game, a website (flask or Django or fastapi), something data science related, etc

[keen sinew]

I guess I mean, if I did something like advent of code, should I start posting as I do it, or is trashing up github looked down on

[fringe sphinx]

Lots of us had AOC repositories.

But mind you, AOC is going to be super hard for a complete beginner

[true harness]

i have tons of random stuff on github. as long as you curate the pinned repositories somewhat it doesn't matter that much ¯_(ツ)_/¯

[fringe sphinx]

They’re worth doing, just don’t get depressed.

[keen sinew]

I revel in adversity.

[fast fossil]

Also, if you create your own website as part of your portfolio, you could set up a blog and post such stuff there as well

[fringe sphinx]

excellent, because most people hit the imposter syndrome programming wall: . https://www.google.com/search?q=imposter+syndrome+site%3Areddit.com%2Fr%2Flearnprogramming

[fringe sphinx]

Or do like me: endlessly debate which blog system to use and never post anything.

[fast fossil]

yikes... I was gonna roll a custom one with django

[keen sinew]

Is this actually complicated, or mid-tier

Like, is django intuitive enough that I can set up a basic blog with a script-kiddy power-level?

And enough determination

[fast fossil]

the way I did it was pretty overengineered, but really you can get it done with some html, css (scss) and GitHub Pages
oh, the blog bit is probably not beginner-friendly, but if you want to, Corey Schafer has a tutorial series on both flask and django where he creates the same blog site, so give that a watch if you want

actually the blog bit depends, if you go with raw html, you can just set it up using gh pages and such, but there's just no backend

[buoyant seal]

@dusty fulcrum @fringe sphinx
as some extra idea
I like having asked for github accounts/git repos with his code for example
i like after tech interview giving a look there, it helps to be confident in declared score
very efficiently spent amount of extra minutes to judge a candidate i think.

Usually i navigate and try to find the best repo and score by best repo.

Pretty often helps to declare bad scores at least
if u see theory bad, refactoring bad, and code in repos is also bad (usually just very minor tiny scripts beyond 50 code lines 😅 )
it is easy to be confident that total score is bad then. Because it matches stuff in all categories.

[fast fossil]

anyway, so I'm somewhat in the middle of expanding my portfolio since I realised I don't have that many (somewhat) finished projects but I do want a job... so I'm sort of making my own site, learning nginx, docker, flask, django, react, a bunch of automation stuff using Ansible, kind of like devops although I really just can't get that concept fully. I plan on making a blog site, it'll run on django on the same server (the main site runs on flask and by runs I mean, it just serves that one page and that's it... anyway)
then I also plan on improving this one older project which is sort of functional rn, but it looks pretty bad and needs improvements
then... uhh, so basically that's 3 web related (full-stack even) projects + I get a blog where I can showcase whatever I want to showcase, lol, + also some games I have made
sooo, then also I have really only two foss projects I have extensively contributed to (both pygame-ce related)
at this point I'm not even sure what my question is, but obviously the end goal would be to eventually land a swe job, so uhh, based on this information I have pretty randomly given, do you have any suggestions? 😁

[buoyant seal]

Firstly some recommendations regarding pet projects

1. The important rule for succesful project, always thinking in advance how to unit test it preferably. how to build unit testable code architecture.. then it has a chance for me to flow properly. So, the books i linked in second link regarding testing are important)
2. typing stuff helps too (mypy/pyright) for reaching appropriate quality, although i just switched to another language in general case
3. also important for me for project to be in demand by some other people, or by me for everyday usage. I don't like to make stuff that will not be used. Project needs living capacity, then it will be evolving infinity time til more mature and nicer state. At least I am obligated to be the everyday user of the made project or other people.
4. also i choose topics i am very enthusiastic about, may be those projects resolve some original personal problem, may be just personal fun. Enthusiasm matters... it is the fuel to make the pet projects, or at least "kicker in the ass" to get started and continue
   Take a special notice of 3rd point

[buoyant seal]

recommending heavily investing into unit testing, with stuff like pytest. That makes python code... To work.

• for practical head on
• for theory of best practices
  secondly recommending unit testing for sure to learn if u work with python and aiming to land a job 😅
  very investing into it.
  the cornerstone to survive in python code that creates fully fledged apps, is having very good through testing. Everything else is secondary, because without unit testing the code will just not... go beyond a very simplistic size before getting too much entangled.
  Think of solution how to write it testable first for good coverage

[fast fossil]

Thanks for the tips, mmm, yes, I am planning to write tests, probably should embrace TDD a bit more as well

[buoyant seal]

thirdly, i made recently my own portfolio site, which i made just based on using templating language
to have my own custom static site generator. that made very nice stuff where i have it easily autodeployed with Github actions into Github Pages.
Servers aren't necessary then for your own portfolio site
The same portfolio can be utilized as a blog to write articles 😉

[dusty fulcrum]

Not sure if this link works for everyone:
||https://leetcode.com/problems/insert-delete-getrandom-o1-duplicates-allowed/submissions/1188712970/||

[buoyant seal]

i could have a lot of suggestions in addition but i will stop here from overwhelming you.
I will just stress again on the point that your Pet Projects should be everyday usable by you or other users
Only then they are iteratively improved and living and can be impressive (even if their code is pretty much complete shit, it still says a lot that it is highly usable and marketed shit (i saw plenty of very shitty projects, yet they were impressive just because they were in use))
Even just a single user for everyday (which can be you). It will make a huge difference to quality of a project
Make stuff that is useful for someone, even if it is only you.

[inner hemlock]

in which channel can links be sent?

[dusty fulcrum]

all of them afaik ?
as long as they're on topic

[analog sun]

Not for self-advertising

[inner hemlock]

ok

[fringe sphinx]

I def do that: walk me through some code/etc, then explore a bit after

[fringe sphinx]

When I skim resumes, I look first for hard skills: what your tech stack was. I weight the most recent more highly. Then, I look for some sign of depth: ie; multiple projects or jobs using similar ideas. Then, I look for some theme: what are they interested in? None of these are deciding factors, but it’s how I form an image of the candidate. I also infer some sense of maturity from the resume style: poorly written resumes, bad grammar implies bad communication skills, etc.

So, the question is how you want to convey yourself; a generalist at beginning of careeer? A SWE who takes ‘engineering’ seriously? Someone passionate about a topic?

All are fine answers.

[serene meteor]

Sorry to interrupt in. I am actually a mechanical engineer who is interested in IT and is learning on his own and wants to change his career.
I have tried making resume related to that but so far, i think, i am unable to set it right. Like for example i cannot show my experience and education at first because i do not work in a software based company and my degree is not related to IT. Only i have self learned experienced and some projects.

[analog sun]

If you have mech eng experience you can show that as well

Solving problems is the skill people are looking for, its just a matter of which tool (programming, project management, mathematical analysis, etc). For what is worth I'm still in the mech eng world (albeit more of a technical project manager type of role)

[keen sinew]

You can put your degree as a sort of tagline under your name. Shows what it is without much fluff

[gritty rivet]

Only i have self learned experienced and some projects.

We all start in that situation

Of course a CS degree in progress or complete helps a lot but is not 100 required

[keen sinew]

John Doe
BSME : Lorem Ipsum University

[gritty rivet]

If you want concrete resume feedback, share images of your resume anonymized in the channel

[serene meteor]

I'm new to discord, can you please give me a clue on how to do that if that's not too much? TIA

[deft herald]

You can take a screen shot, scribble out the personal identifying information, then paste the screen shot here

[pine sleet]

Post a picture of your resume with stuff that identifies you blocked out

[serene meteor]

Okay guys thanks i will do that here

[deft herald]

Also you don't need to send a friend request to everyone who replies to you 😉

[hearty island]

why does everything in virginia require a goddamn security clearance

[near ocean]

Government stuffs

[hearty island]

ugh

even for a basic analyst position???

[white relic]

Northern VA yeah

Rest of the state might as well be somewhere entirely different

[hearty island]

smh

[peak halo]

some advice: if a job listing says "active TS/SCI", that probably means they don't have work for you on day 1 if you don't have it, and thus won't consider you. Whereas listings that omit "active" or "/SCI" are more likely to help you get a clearance for the first time.

[hearty island]

yep, that significantly cuts down on what i’m looking for. thanks stel 🙂

[peak halo]

Of course 👍
If you feel like you have time, there's no harm in applying to those "active TS/SCI" positions, but you'll probably burn yourself out.

[hearty island]

usa jobs.gov has a filter that can take out jobs that require a security clearance and you can turn on a filter that has them open to the public from what i saw

you can also sort by ascending/descending order ofc by the posting date

[peak halo]

You can also use -"active TS" in google to omit those

[hearty island]

oh, that’s a good idea too

[hearty island]

thanks for the help!

[dusty moon]

Is the behavioral interview primarily centered on demonstrating your business acumen, charisma, and the capacity to present yourself as a valuable asset? When discussing projects, is the focus on outlining their functions or on making them compelling enough to enhance your chances of being hired?

[peak halo]

the behavioral interview is about establishing that you're not going to be an unpleasant and problematic person to work with.

[true harness]

the behavioral interview checks if you're a normal person

[dusty moon]

I know Its like a filter basically can you code.

[hearty island]

guess i'm not normal /s

[peak halo]

that's not part of the behavioral interview. sounds like you have things mixed up.

[true harness]

not at all. the situations discussed in a behavioral segment don't need to be related to the job

[true harness]

for projects, it really just depends what the review is asking. if they ask why you implemented a certain function in some way, or they ask why you made it, etc

[peak halo]

your first real-time interaction with the company will probably be a phone screening with HR. And they'll ask you questions that they themselves probably don't understand, but they'll just write down your responses and send them to hiring management to sus you out.

That is, the point of the phone screening is to ascertain if you plausibly have the skills that you said you have on your resume.

And there might be some behavioral questions mixed in as well.

[dusty moon]

Whats a surefire way to pass.

[peak halo]

There isn't. But not having lied on your resume would be the first step.

[true harness]

be what they're looking for + a little luck

there isn't really a guarantee, there's always stuff outside of your control

[dusty moon]

I do have a list of questions and responses memorized, the issues lies in the questions not on the list. The candid responses. 🤷‍♂️

[true harness]

what I do is keep a list of projects/experiences that I can talk a lot about. then you can adapt questions to stuff you did in that list

[keen sinew]

@dusty moon Tbh, behavioral interviews require bar skills: 'can you sit at a bar and talk to random people in a way that doesn't make them hate you or think you're freaky?'

I'm not in tech yet, but that was how it went for a behavioral interview I had for a defense contractor when the job was electronics hardware.

As shitty as it is to suggest: go sit at a bar and talk to people if you're worried about it.

[vapid jay]

:/

Euhm is front end and back end same code writing?

[pine sleet]

What do you mean by "same code writing"

[vapid jay]

Like any syntax are same but different source code fronted and backend with frameworks

[pine sleet]

no. frontend typically uses javascript/typescript/jsx/tsx

or any other syntax they want. often web frameworks run their own compilers (i.e svelte has it's own syntax)

[vapid jay]

Ah okay

@pine sleet but python doesn’t need compiler

[pine sleet]

well, it sort of does technically. but regardless you won't be writing frontend in python anyway

[vapid jay]

Okay lol I have done fronted html css js knowledge basic backend php java python learning now

:/

[near ocean]

Do you have a question for the channel

[vapid jay]

well, I had joined the discord server because I'm still at the basics with Python and I was looking for a hand to solve a problem :/

[near ocean]

You should use #python-discussion and #❓｜how-to-get-help

[vapid jay]

https://discord.com/channels/267624335836053506/1212468432940044338

[summer inlet]

anyone doing or has done aqa computer science a level rn

[gritty rivet]

I'm assuming that's country-specific whatever it is

[summer inlet]

yes uk colleges

[vapid jay]

guys

is it worth it to switch to a cs degree from another degree, or just do a damned masters in cs

[blazing harbor]

damned masters?

[vapid jay]

masters*

[blazing harbor]

I would def do 4 bachelors (diff degree) + 1 instead of a 5 year bachelors for CS

[vapid jay]

sorry i dont understand

[smoky quest]

can you give more context?

[vapid jay]

i could finish my current degree in 2 years

[smoky quest]

is it a cooking degree or a math degree?

[vapid jay]

or spend 3 years getting a cs degree, however way it goes i am working in tech so

[vapid jay]

has calculus class, is quantitative, but not exactly that quantitative

[smoky quest]

is your degree a secret?

Let me take it from the other way around:
A CS degree is the path of least resistance and with the most opportunities and compensation. As such, if you have the opportunity to get a bsc or ms in CS, that's ideal.

[vapid jay]

ong 🙏

[smoky quest]

fr

[proper plaza]

should I be worried about getting a cs job in the future?
I wanna study the field because I find it interesting
but the crisis revolving the poor job market has me concerned

[deft herald]

Nah

[smoky quest]

I wouldn't worry about it, especially if you work towards a degree

[deft herald]

Go study the field. You'll be employable in a wide range of industries if you have a degree in CS

[dreamy spade]

Senior Developers only work on a salary?

[smoky quest]

that's more of a function of the company, country, market, industry, etc.

[turbid bobcat]

Size of the next company I'm interviewing at: 1 employee

It's a freshly founded startup in DC

[fringe sphinx]

It’s a highly paid field. We rarely hear of degreed candidates in major markets struggling to find work. Layoffs and downturns are cyclical: it happens every decade or so.

[true harness]

that's pretty cool lol

[turbid bobcat]

I thought so too, and also, kinda funny how I might find my way into an even smaller company ahah

Previous one was like 3 people when I came in

[fringe sphinx]

Been there, it’s a wild ride.

[turbid bobcat]

It falls right on my domain of knowledge, like we can literally use my thesis to build up the product - well perhaps not my thesis, but like the decades old tested stuff (it's health tech so it might kill someone if done wrong, has to be the ancient stuff which has been tested forever )

[deft herald]

I kind of regret not getting/taking any opportunities like that in my 20's. That sounds like fun but i'm just not in a place in life where i could handle the risk of a startup

[lapis wind]

I used to work at one where we were 4 people, it can be a lot of fun, but man if you don't balance your work and life well it can be really draining

[turbid bobcat]

Uhm, I still don't know what my role would be though. I can 100% see why I got approached, I can probably even guess exactly what I'd be doing without being given any details, but I'm like 2yoe, I don't know if I'd be fit to be the second employee ever of a company

[lapis wind]

If it something you know you are interested in, and I mean really interested in and you have the drive for it, maybe it is worth trying

You learn a lot but I think you really do need to have skin in the game as the 2nd person and be committed to the idea

also you're young, worst case, it fails and it becoming an interesting thing on the CV

[turbid bobcat]

I'm gonna see what he has to say, I scheduled it for Monday so I also have time to research the company in more depth

[fringe sphinx]

I agree. And it also leads to a lot of other topics like; what funding? Self funded, angel, vc or institutional? Presumably self or angel, if only 1.

At self funded, any equity is somewhat fictional, until a real cap table gets drawn up if/when they raise money. Regardless, now’s the time to get a piece of the pie

But then, it’s hard to figure out what piece you should get, since you often have little information. My first startup I got 10000 shares, but had little concept of what that meant (it was a very small, nearly zero piece of the pie)

[turbid bobcat]

I'm wondering what implication this has in the visa process though. I saw something about co-founders/essential personnel of startups being able to access O1, which is the one that has those super strict crazy requirements

(I'm assuming that if I'm 50% of a company's output I can be considered essential)

[turbid bobcat]

Is this usually public information ?

[white relic]

Even if not public, they are reasonable questions you are entitled to ask as a prospective employee

[fringe sphinx]

Not in practical terms. But if someone offers you shares, you’re entitled to know how many shares are outstanding, etc

[turbid bobcat]

Understood

[fringe sphinx]

Or perhaps you’re not entitled to but what trentj said, it’s reasonable

[white relic]

"where does the money I'm using to pay my rent actually come from" is something most people who pay rent care about

or should

[fringe sphinx]

Yah: is this self funded? How much runway do you have? How many people are you hiring right now?

[turbid bobcat]

Okay then, thank you for the help. This is bound to be interesting.

Also,tomorrow I'm gonna apply our non profit to githubs AI accelerator. It would be awesome if we won. The project I'm doing rn is exactly the kind of stuff they want to accelerate. "Doing AI in the open"

[smoky quest]

this might be overkill for your use case but in case:

• https://www.holloway.com/g/equity-compensation/about
• https://carta.com/blog/equity-101-stock-option-basics/
• https://carta.com/equity/learn/

[true harness]

pragmatic programmer has a good one too I think

https://blog.pragmaticengineer.com/equity-for-software-engineers/

[narrow pier]

hi everyone i am new to python (1 week) but i have a 1-2 years in java. i realized how useless java is and am trying to become extremely proficient in python. i was thinking of just spamming leetcode to become better with syntax and logic, what do you guys recommend?

[kindred oyster]

i realized how useless java is

job market for java is nowhere near dead yet , what are you talking about ?

[fringe sphinx]

And, leetcode isn’t all it’s cracked up to be. It’s popular for interview questions but, leetcode is what you practice (for interviews) after you’ve gotten good

[narrow pier]

but wouldn't it help me get better with logic and learning python syntax?

[fringe sphinx]

Start with something like exercism or codewars.

[narrow pier]

i reached out to many people and they all unanimously told me to stop learning java (through college) and learn python and js

[fringe sphinx]

Or https://inventwithpython.com/pythongently/

[narrow pier]

whats the difference between codewars and exercism? are they just problems to practice coding

[fringe sphinx]

It’s a complex topic. Java still commands a large number of jobs. It’s popular to hate on it. https://spectrum.ieee.org/the-top-programming-languages-2023

[narrow pier]

and also why would you not recommend leet code?

[fringe sphinx]

Just try both. Leetcode and hackerrank emphasize DSA problems, a particular type of problem. Exercism and codewars are a bit more general.

[kindred oyster]

you should do some market research about your area online , see how many jobs require java

a lot of people do hate java , doesnt mean the market for java is dead

[narrow pier]

im really interested in web 3 and i found python and js to be the best choices

[fringe sphinx]

Leetcode is fine for interview prep: when you’re good. But focusing on leetcode leaves your skills incomplete

[kindred oyster]

and given that you have already spent 1-2 years in java , i would say getting a java job would be much easier for you imo

[fringe sphinx]

Also: bookmark these links:

!res

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[fringe sphinx]

!kin

[inner wren]

Kindling Projects

The Kindling projects page on Ned Batchelder's website contains a list of projects and ideas programmers can tackle to build their skills and knowledge.

[narrow pier]

ok im guessing i should start doing exercism and codewars to get better python and then do leetcode and hackerrank to further refine my skills

not in any specific order but i should basically look into exercism and codewars?

[fringe sphinx]

The real way to learn is projects.

I only recommended exercism and codewars as an alternative to leetcode (for a novice programmer)

[narrow pier]

i see so just build random cool projects found online?

[mint oracle]

I don;t think Python has more job than js

[kindred oyster]

i only found these online platforms relevant when i was studying DSA and had to practice the concepts somewhere , but other than that , pretty much projects is the way to learn stuff

[narrow pier]

where do find these projects

[kindred oyster]

project ideas should be in of the links you just bookmarked

[narrow pier]

ok thank you all for the help

[fringe sphinx]

The second link, kindling

[fringe sphinx]

Also, when you get stuck, ask questions in #python-discussion

[green wyvern]

Hello everyone. I just joined this channel and I am happy to be among you. I have a question about the PCAP exam. I am preparing for the PCAP exam using OPENEDG, youtube and some forums. I have solved the dump questions on EXAMTOPICS and some youtube channels. Do you think this is enough for me to succeed in the certification exam?

[topaz hound]

i think the question we would ask is, where are you located? and why are you taking the PCAP exam?

there aren't any industry wide recognized python certifications, PCAP is no exception.

[green wyvern]

to apply for data analyst positions

I want just add my linkedIn account some certificates

for applying jobs

[topaz hound]

well then i would say certificates do hold some weight in some countries, but most people wouldnt know about PCAP here since it's not very well known outside of some circles.

[green wyvern]

I understood, thank you for your information

And what do you think, is what I wrote above enough for me to pass the exam?

[topaz hound]

i don't know, it would take someone who has taken it to know that/

[bright finch]

Hello, I'm in a situation and I need some advice from someone mature and professional as i'm not sure if i'll be able to come up with a smart and mature decision. I'm in my last year high school and we have a obligatory 10 week internship at a company that's relevant to the education, my top interest was programming related work and my intern supervisor at school wasn't able to find anything available so I took matters to my own hands and found out one of my maths teacher was starting up a business and she was in need for a website, so I talked to her and I got to do my internship for her company (which only has 2 employees - both owners)

I regret this, I'm 7 weeks in and her demands are far beyond what an intern should be able to do, but I've been spending hard work and hours trying to figure out how to do shit the way they want it without them providing any kind of help from someone experienced aside from me having to research and read up on documentation myself. It got me thinking and I decided to stop working this hard, i'm just an intern so why should I do works of professionals? I've been a 10x developer for 7 weeks, been doing UI/UX design, frontend development with node, react and tailwind, backend development with python and flask, sysadmin stuff with setting up VPSs, been doing SEO optimization with google analytics and google ads, shit is going south and i'm not able to keep up. This is literally, my first real project.

Anyways, there was a few weeks break after week 5 of my internship and they wanted me to update some small stuff on the website on a regular basis on my own free time, I listened to them. A few days ago, I proposed that I implement a system (a CMS) that allows them to update stuff without having to go through me, but I also told them that this is too much for an intern and that if they want this they'd have to treat me as a worker and pay me, I offered this system for $700 and they said they will think about it.

Today, I found out by someone who overheard my maths teacher, that they're just gonna get things as correct and nice looking as possible and then ditch my idea in hopes of the website being good enough for them to not need to update it for a while. And that, if their business goes well enough where they earn some revenue, that they'd hire actual professionals and bring the website I've created for them down altogether. That hurt me, I've done exactly everything they wanted, from UI/UX to features and functionality.

But this website is in my hands, I can bring it down whenever I want, I can delete the codebase whenever I want, and I'm thinking of deliberatily just take it down after my intern and tell them it's their problem and if they want it fixed they can hire me. I'm not sure if this is smart, because i'm going by emotions. What should I do?

[blazing harbor]

one time I got a rapid round interview bc he was a "senior software engineer" and he didn't have time

he asked me about basic stuff like basic data structures, use cases of doubly linked list, how regression works (with Gradient Descent), weird q about an use case that combines heaps and regression, and then a few questions about indexing and like how we could store data with distributed and fault tolerance in mind

he did this all in like 20-25 minutes which was like wtf

[fringe sphinx]

You’ve got heckuva internship for your age. Don’t overthink the fact that you got exactly what you needed. Don’t be so arrogant to think you’re a 10xer (I understand your frustration and your hard work): leave a great reputation and use that for your next thing. It’s just your first internship: this is the life of working for other people. This will set you up (and your reputation) to do great things in future.

[bright finch]

thanks, yeah you're likely telling the wisest and smartest thing i can do, it just feels harsh yk?

[fringe sphinx]

Yah, I know the feeling. I’ve had similar frustrations before; it’s tough to pour your heart into something for it to be disregarded. I’ve tried to never let it get to me: I put my 110% in, and if I’m unhappy, I move on to the next thing sooner rather than later.

[blazing harbor]

Hmm is getting an internship and a research position stealing if they both pay?

Dave Ramsey told me it’s stealing if I have two jobs

[buoyant seal]

What billy bob said

I will add here that in a few years you will highly likely see your past quality of work of a very low level.
I quited my first job when I understood it is not going to get working product well and I don't regret it. I saved money for boss and my career for me.
I personally regret nothing.

Today I can tell, quality takes time. Being weaponized with many years of professional experience, I can build usually in such time only rough prototypes at best.
Maturity of a product takes time.
Building something of quality for long term maintenance takes time.
I can believe I can do it after many years of professional experience, but right after graduation? No way. I was very green and could not possibly do it for sure

[fringe sphinx]

Depends on the employment agreement. You can certainly work at McDonald’s and Starbucks on different schedules.

[buoyant seal]

Also important note. Each time I was offered overworking on weekends I preferred to reject it and puted time into my self studies and self growth.
Recommending same.

Don't be 10x effort developer
https://www.amazon.com/Clean-Coder-Conduct-Professional-Programmers/dp/0137081073
Put only your best productive work hours during work days toward job.

Leave weekends for yourself and to be a better developer tomorrow/next year
Many people remain juniors 5 years+ or whole career
Or remain middle level whole career.
Your education is important only for you and owned only by you

[bright finch]

Fair, thanks for sharing y'all thoughts regarding this matter to me, I really needed to hear something from people more wiser and experienced than me, I appreciate you both taking the time giving me advice 🙏

[fringe sphinx]

Also: when I hear someone saying they’re a 10xer, I interpret that as: they are putting in an unhealthy amount of effort.

[buoyant seal]

Yeah. Mental health is also precious and only your own responsibility.
It is best when you don't owe anyone doing anything at your own time.
Feeling stressed? Relax, go to cinema or read adventure book or smh
Feeling enthusiastic and wishing self growth? Do self studies or pet projects. (Kind of its own way for entertainment)

I have already several people in my family which went very crazy. Mental health is not as unlimited thing as many could think, better to be very considerate about it.

Wishing to get a cat 😺 to ensure better mental health ^_^

[fringe sphinx]

Might I recommend a pet that actually likes people?

[buoyant seal]

I want "Ragdoll" one to get. They have a very good personality in average according to their genetics.
Very cuddly, sleepy, lap friendly cat

[vapid jay]

hi

[kindred oyster]

!rules ad

self advertising isnt allowed here

[inner wren]

Rules

6. Do not post unapproved advertising.

[woven pecan]

I initially applied for a software developer intern position at a company, but the slots are full, so the hiring manager offered another position.

I've got an upcoming technical interview tomorrow for a data engineering internship position. This is my first technical interview and it's on-site as well.

I'm not that skilled in data engineering because I'm more focused on web development. I've used frameworks such as Flask and Django, as well as MySQL for database.

I'm nervous because although the position calls for Python, ETL, and SQL, I am more focused on web development.

Would like to hear your tips 🤟

[turbid bobcat]

Definitely gonna give those a read, I keep hearing about equity, even got offered some last year (I refused, partly because I don't understand it)

[proud plank]

is my CV cooked if i repeated a year in high school?

[pine sleet]

not necessarily

[hearty island]

i mean i basically repeated a year of college after my transfer and id say im ok

[white relic]

Not at all. Honestly it shouldn't even be on there. Graduation date yes but nobody cares when you started high school.

Past college nobody even cares about when you finished.

[deft herald]

Same story here

[pine sleet]

if your DOB is on your resume one might be able to figure out that they repeated a year (assuming they followed the standard education track) but i don't think anybody is going to look that deep

[true harness]

DOB on resume is odd though

[pine sleet]

indeed

[deft herald]

Yeah i've never even seen high school listed on a resume

[true harness]

i had it in my first semester, when i didn't have a college GPA

[blazing harbor]

no one gonna know

after you get into university, no one cares about ur hs performance; you can even remove the dates of ur high school when u want to

[deft herald]

You had a resume during your first semester of college?

[near ocean]

Part of our professional writing courses was to write/fix up your CV

[true harness]

yeah? I've had one since high school

[deft herald]

Huh. Alright then

[viscid onyx]

yo hello!

[true harness]

i was indoctrinated young

[blazing harbor]

you must go to like harvard

damn @fringe sphinx pycon is pretty expensive

[true harness]

it's cheap for conferences

an example, for reference

[fast fossil]

also, afaik usually your company would pay for that

[gritty rivet]

Isn't a resume a standard part of college applications? I'm pretty sure it is here in the US

Or at least it was when I was in HS, centuries ago

[near ocean]

No conference is worth that much, no matter who's paying

[true harness]

if it improves the efficiency of a dev by 1%, and that dev is paid more than 220k, it's worth

[near ocean]

Pycon texas is 85$ per ticket, thats not too bad

[near ocean]

People getting paid at that rate probably wont gain anything from a conference, or shouldnt anyway

Dont pithink me, at 200k+ you should be up there giving the talks, not listening to them

[blazing harbor]

you can get $200k+ entry at some companies

[digital fjord]

I find that a bit of a ridiculous notion, there is always more to learn, and conf talks tend to be about as cutting edge as it gets

[near ocean]

No one should be paying 2k plus to attend a conference is the point

[smoky quest]

to be fair, if you give a talk, you generally get a free access

[true harness]

2k is a bit absurd, but they usually have price discrimination for students, academics, and so on

[near ocean]

Its still triple digits for most cons i can find prices for

[true harness]

yeah but 3 digits ranges from pay mildly affordable to not affordable for a student

[fringe sphinx]

Not for my son, no

[near ocean]

Not all of us are students tho

[true harness]

yeah for unemployed people, they're kinda screwed. you want to get someone else to pay for it

[brazen island]

2k sounds excessive, even if my company is paying. That's 2k I'd rather have them spend differently if it's to my gain anyway 🤷

[near ocean]

2k straight into the bank account

[fringe sphinx]

Yes, the old “if I save the company X, can I get some of it?”, sadly never works

[whole bear]

Relating the machine learning industry/computer science in general, is there any over estimate of salary. Ive heard they are very well paid jobs but are there anything that says otherwise

[near ocean]

Its pretty country dependent

[pine tide]

where can i ask for help?

[fringe sphinx]

What kind of help?

[pine tide]

there is a small problem with my code

[fringe sphinx]

#python-discussion

[blazing harbor]

very dependent on many factors

[spark cobalt]

What conference is this? At least for me, most conferences I am interested in ends up posting the vod online

The fact that a conference is charging that much sounds unreal

[true harness]

❄️

[spark cobalt]

Oh it's a whole thing

That's still hella expensive holy

Oh even they post vods, that's so based

[versed condor]

I tried doing that "data annotation" job application This! and did all the tests and feel that I did very well, but never got email back. I felt this was the best place to ask this.

Is there any jobs I could do as a beginner with python? And by beginner, I mean one who has made various games using a discord bot. If not is there anything I can do to help with getting a job or do I need to get certificate? Please, anything helpful.

[gritty rivet]

You applied for one job and got ghosted? Repeat that dozens if not hundreds of times and you'll be getting the hang of it... Persistence is more than half the game.

Certificate no, degree yes

More generally the way to understand what employers are hiring for is to read a lot of job listings.

[versed condor]

Yeah, I got ghosted even though it told me to look for email. That is literally the only job I qualified for. It had a test to make code to decode their secret message which I was able to.

I really don't want to waste precious time going to community college for 10 years to get a degree when a certificate would be much faster. I'm also too old for college since I'm in 30s now.

Looking jobs on indeed it's all super 20 years experience with 20 degrees for all jobs basically.

[mint oracle]

2095$ for a few hour conference

[true harness]

it's multiple days

[late flame]

It would take closer to 4 years, 2 for an associate's degree.

More importantly, the years will pass anyways. You can either spend them getting a degree, or not getting a degree. It's not always the right answer, but not doing it because of how long it will take is the wrong reason to avoid it.

[late flame]

Those conferences are major networking events. People you meet there could lead to jobs or sales opportunities. 2k is an absolute steal.

[coral vine]

i just found out today that i got this scholarship ! https://www.wgu.edu/financial-aid-tuition/scholarships/general/distinguished-alumni.html just want to say thanks to the folks in this community because in my essay i did write a portion about what i learned from you all (programming community).

also, my internship starts in 3 months ! so the extra cash definitely helps. i am really shocked because it is my first time applying to a scholarship. itll be my first time living with a bunch of other programming interns for a few months in a new state 😱

[native parrot]

Would it be a good decision to explore alternative majors and career paths because the computer science/software engineering path seems unpromising?

Seeing people with scholarships, internships, and excellent grades throughout college claw their way through mounds of applications to secure a spot in the first of three to eight rounds of interviews and leading professionals in their fields get tossed out of their companies is really uninspiring, to say the least.

[fringe sphinx]

Why does it seem unpromising? What other field are you comparing it to?

[native parrot]

im not comparing it to anything right now, from what I'm seeing so far that's why I'm considering changing majors

[fringe sphinx]

People are landing high salary jobs. Yes, it takes more apps than before, but I’ve yet (or rarely! Hear from degreed SWEs who can’t land a job.

Secondly, tech jobs are cyclical. Job downturns have happened every 10 years or so for past 30 years

[late flame]

I have experience so my anecdata is probably worthless, but I've seen no issues with getting a job.

It's really only hard for complete fresh grads. Once you're in, you're in

[fringe sphinx]

Finally, the major reasons for the current events are economics, not systemic. Recession fears and then inflation rate hikes have been major factors

[fringe sphinx]

This has been my observation, too. Longer delays, and the struggle certainly exists, but tech firms are still hiring. It just might not be FAANG

[native parrot]

Well what do you suggest for graduates? Do your best in college?

[late flame]

Basically! Internships are super important, get those and do well.

[fringe sphinx]

What else could you do? My comments are also US centric.

[native parrot]

yeah I figured, thats the market im targeting right now

Well I'll look more into my dilemma. Hopefully I'm wrong about the software job crisis

thanks guys

[fringe sphinx]

Also: network. Firing job applications into the void is the worst strategy (but takes the least effort and planning)

[native parrot]

I'll remember that, thank you

[late flame]

Also remember, by the time you graduate the situation could be completely different

[native parrot]

I hope, it would be a shame to have a student loan payment and no job

[tidal gazelle]

Anyone knows what mechanical engineering jobs really are about, in general? Like what work do you do

[white relic]

From what I understand, it often involves lots of 3d modeling and FEA simulations, but it's not my field

I'm sure there are a lot of different kinds of MEs. It's a broad field just like EE (which I am more familiar with) ranges from digital logic and computer architecture to RF and materials

[upbeat carbon]

How to make something like this?

I want to code phone app with vs code and see changes on the side of my screen

[white relic]

This channel is for career discussion. That screenshot appears to be of some mobile developer tool, somebody who knows mobile app development might be able to identify it. Try #❓｜how-to-get-help

[gritty rivet]

I googled it for you. https://engineeringexpectations.com/day-in-life-mechanical-engineer/

Not sure we have any ME's in here but you can find plenty of them on LinkedIn.

[white relic]

There are meetings... So many meetings
Clearly written by an engineer

[kindred oyster]

!rules ad

this is not allowed here

[inner wren]

Rules

6. Do not post unapproved advertising.

[analog sun]

It can really vary depending on the type of company and size of company

Anything from technical project management (which is more or less what I do) down to component design following specifications / construction guidelines / design for specific manufacturing processes. Sometimes the work is open ended e.g. I need a machine to accomplish this, I need it in xx weeks and you have xx thousands to do it to very specific "build to print" type of requests

[analog sun]

Also yes

[vapid jay]

guys , I have a career question that is also something of a social question...?

It's going to take a minute to explain , but bare with me.

You know how you get instigators on discord who the MOMENT you push back against their harassment or bullying, people get on your case for "starting drama" and then those same people end up joining the instigator later at some point?

How does one deal with that in the workplace? I ask this becasue a LOT of the people from Rutgers basically behaved in that fashion, and they graduated too. I keep having this problem across multiple discords and blocking doesn't always work. Like, is this problem going to be consistent in real life as it is online?

[analog sun]

Usually if you are facing some harassment in the workplace you take it to the HR department, and make the appropriate reports.

That would be if you cannot solve the issue on a personal level, such as explaining what you feel when someone behaves in a way that you are uncomfortable with.

Discord is not like real life with working professionals in a company

[vapid jay]

I've just been in a position too many times online where I explain to the person : "Look, what you are doing is genuinely bothering me and I want you to stop." only to be met with refusal online. It would just be too much if I had to deal with that in professional circles is all, but if what you're saying is true then that's a relief.

[rotund aurora]

If I’m new to python where should I start? Like what should a first project be

[vital wyvern]

That's just the... internet. Anonymity tends to lead people to be shittier than real life.

[analog sun]

!resources - I would start with checking out automate the boring stuff and byte of python, and from there check out the !kindling project ideas

[inner wren]

Resources

The Resources page on our website contains a list of hand-selected learning resources that we regularly recommend to both beginners and experts.

[rotund aurora]

Aight Ty

[white relic]

There are toxic workplaces (research teams, sports teams, fan clubs, neighborhoods, families) where this kind of thing does happen and there are (in my opinion) many, many more non-toxic workplaces (etc.) where this kind of thing just doesn't happen and anyone who tried to start it would be shut down with a quickness. If you're unlucky enough to find yourself in a toxic environment, the best thing you can usually do is keep your head down and stay out of the drama as best you can while looking for other options. There are other options. And yeah it is always way worse on the internet than in RL

[hearty island]

i don’t think the pfizer interview was the worst interview of all time. i think by far the worst one was my machine learning interview for cuna mutual group

where it basically ended and they told me i didn’t have a future in machine learning, but my path should be more business intelligence than anything

[warm flint]

Hi - Where do I start learning DSA?

[hearty island]

check out the #algos-and-data-structs channel, there are resources pinned there. also neetcode is a good resource.

[blazing harbor]

wow

[hearty island]

yea

[hearty island]

epically crashed and burned

[hazy gull]

I have a career path question. I like programming and stuff, but I don't know what I want to specialise in. I know for sure I don't want to do anything with machine learning (or at least not for now), and I don't want to do game development because I'm not so creative that I can create games. I would consider myself a novice in the art since the only experience I have I doing the cs50x course, cisco's entry level python course and I'm currently doing their intermediate course also. I also did a bit of coding exercises on hacker rank. So ultimately my question is does anyone have any suggestions for what I should specialise in, or what should I put my main efforts into learning

[little sluice]

guys how i learn python basics

[deft herald]

Well, there are way more than just "game dev" and "machine learning" out there.

[deft herald]

What kind of formal education do you have? High school, college, planning to go to college, went to college 20 years ago? Where are you at

[hazy gull]

I went to highschool and planning to go college

[deft herald]

Ok great. Well the "path of least resistance" as often discussed here to getting a job as a software dev is to get a college degree in computer science or related field

Good news is that you really don't need to specialize right now. The first 2 years (generally) of college will be basically one path. Then in the last 2 years, you get to start picking your electives to align with more of what you want to specialize in

I think right now you don't know what you don't know, so that's why you're having a hard time deciding what you want to do.

[hazy gull]

Ok thanks for the help

[dapper bane]

Hey I got terminated how should I make money now ?

[stone nymph]

Is your pfp the default github pfp?

[dapper bane]

Someone holp

[white relic]

Yes

[hearty island]

by getting another one

[stone nymph]

Cool!🔥

[dapper bane]

U gotta help me man

[hearty island]

how's the resume going?

[dapper bane]

I got selected for two more interviews

[hearty island]

ok, that's good.

did you follow the tips people recommended you to use?

[dapper bane]

How do I make some big boy money ? and yes

[hearty island]

by doing a job that people need

[dapper bane]

The market is real real tough rn man

[hearty island]

yea, i agree. as someone who's looking for a job atm

[dapper bane]

How much experience u have bro ?

[hearty island]

i'm in college, graduating in may

[near ocean]

Multiple interviews lined up doesnt seem like youre struggling in this market

[errant thicket]

the market is tough for coding how?

[errant thicket]

old man the market is tough? that has to be an illusion?

[dapper bane]

It's like my interviews go perfect 90% of the time the multiple interviewers themselves said that I know a lot everything I told them was correct but they reject me

[near ocean]

Are you looking for a job right now?
Its hard

[gritty rivet]

For all you know, 5 other people also had the same questions correct. Nothing to do but keep trying

[dapper bane]

Hmm u r right

[errant thicket]

i am in college now for computer science

[errant thicket]

but im looking to make money without a job old man any help?

[dapper bane]

Why don't they teach us actual skills in college

[near ocean]

You what

[hearty island]

is this a troll?

[dapper bane]

What no I am not

[errant thicket]

yes i want to make money now with python or coding in general

[near ocean]

Yea you wont

[hearty island]

not you lol

[errant thicket]

im in college learning cs but my teacher is weird

[gritty rivet]

Most teachers are weird, that's ok

[errant thicket]

why wont I ? who said that you cant make money coding without a job?

[near ocean]

I do lol
Pay attention in class instead

[gritty rivet]

You're a college student with zero professional experience? And you plan to make money without a job by... Selling your brilliant and unique software, or what?

[errant thicket]

i do but he doesnt even teach anything we just write code and upload it as work

[cosmic igloo]

im making data scientist as my career .. Is it good?

[dapper bane]

Isn't there anything at all that one can do ?

[errant thicket]

no i just wanted someone ideas to make money coding so i can start my journey thats all mate

[near ocean]

How do you plan on getting money with coding if youre complaining about uni classes

[gritty rivet]

Do you like doing data science? If yes, then yes. If no, then no.

[cosmic igloo]

yes indeed and its a lot to learn man

[errant thicket]

cause i like money and coding old man

[gritty rivet]

Get a normal internship and/or student job

[dapper bane]

F data science man that's tough business

[near ocean]

Do internships and graduate first

[cosmic igloo]

Fr ik ik this what if its good...

[errant thicket]

so there isnt anyway at all to make money coding... without getting a job or internship?

[near ocean]

No

[cosmic igloo]

any one who is studying DS/DA ?

[dapper bane]

I wanna make cyber tools one day or make my own cyber company but this dream feels like a delusion

[cosmic igloo]

you can bro how good u are in cyber tools?

[dapper bane]

I just did some basic ctf pico ctf

[errant thicket]

ok thanks and that was your side i hope someone else has a different viewpoint on this and if you do please reach me.

[cosmic igloo]

Its just that how good u are in this field.

[gritty rivet]

It's extremely unlikely... Go ahead and look at what people are doing on Upwork and Fiverr. If you think you can compete with them, then go ahead and try