tools-and-devops

[deep estuary]

https://manpages.debian.org/experimental/openssh-server/authorized_keys.5.en.html#AUTHORIZED_KEYS_FILE_FORMAT

i also have it so that the CI runners that join the tailscale network can only talk to port 22 on the deployment VMs so can't talk to anything else going on in that network

this is my full workflow for that https://github.com/jb3/blog/blob/main/.github/workflows/deploy-site.yml

[brazen forge]

oh, huh, I didn't know that

[zenith fog]

Is this a good place to share my debugger?

Well, here goes nothing

🥧 seapie is an alternative to pdb for debugging python

https://github.com/hirsimaki-markus/seapie

'A breakpoint should just mean >>>'

[dusty forum]

Looks neat, I'll try it out!

[topaz holly]

Hi,im a intermediate level python developer and i want to know that how can i learn automation with python... are there some specific roadmaps to follow or what?.... i also want to know the freelancing scopes in automation

[dusty forum]

Really nice! I like how the ">>>" prompt impersonates the Python repl, so that it looks like I'm doing a demo of my library project (like using a Jupyter Notebook, but with the interpreter look and feel).

[zenith fog]

Nice to hear

[mint cipher]

if you want examples of automation, https://automatetheboringstuff.com has several chapters of automations

[ashen burrow]

Hey guys, I think this might be the only appropriate place to share my library given what it does?

Oh well here we go, PyPDFForm is (probably) the best Python library for PDF form processing.

https://github.com/chinapandaman/PyPDFForm

[vagrant zinc]

making my own roblox executor

i use wearedevs api

[uneven light]

Azure is growing and will surpass AWS usage because of its built in eco system, we have microsoft team,Outlook,365 like whole microsoft suite. We got everything in single suite. And integrating Azure services with others it's service will be easy.

[sage basin]

Okay thank you so much, I’ll work on learning Azure because majority of jobs that I’ve been searching for are requiring some knowledge of devops

[wind solstice]

Hello guys , Ill have a call with the release manager in the deployment domain tomorrow. I was being told to know and read about the basics of AWS, deployment , http, API's . Like they told its a fresher role for reliability engineer.

What and how should I prepare and they said mostly in this role,tools will be used.

[tender grove]

Hi! I built a CLI tool to freeze apps and save RAM without closing them. It's my first serious project on Python. Check it out! https://github.com/AnnPoshtak/Cryo

[crimson spruce]

So this is basically the same as doing killall -SIGTSTP firefox? How do you save RAM with that?

[tender grove]

Yes, it uses signals like kill. But Cryo makes it easier: it automatically finds and freezes the whole process tree (including child processes), so nothing keeps running.
When the app is paused, it stops work. This allows the OS to move it to Swap (disk) much faster, freeing up RAM for other tasks

[wind solstice]

Can someone advice me

[tired tapir]

the hell

[summer seal]

What are we replacing Github with?

[astral apex]

Depends on why you want to replace GitHub

I decided to try Renovate. It says it works with uv with "lockFileMaintenance"

{
  "$schema": "https://docs.renovatebot.com/renovate-schema.json",
  "extends": [
    "config:recommended",
    ":disableDependencyDashboard"
  ],
  "lockFileMaintenance": {
    "enabled": true
  }
}

But my pre-commit maintains a requirements.txt for GitHub, Snyk, etc, etc

repos:
  - repo: https://github.com/astral-sh/uv-pre-commit
    rev: e5ef0574ef824f2a51084062e6506068e458126e  # frozen: 0.9.24
    hooks:
      - id: uv-lock
      - id: uv-export
        args: ["--quiet", "--frozen", "--all-groups", "--output-file=requirements.txt"]
      - id: uv-export
        args: ["--quiet", "--frozen", "--all-groups", "--format=pylock.toml", "--output-file=pylock.toml"]

And the PRs that Renovate is sending are only touching the requirements.txt

From 0c54ca2b29e1c017e84e9cd4c6eb730df912a43d Mon Sep 17 00:00:00 2001
From: "renovate[bot]" <29139614+renovate[bot]@users.noreply.github.com>
Date: Tue, 13 Jan 2026 18:02:06 +0000
Subject: [PATCH] Update dependency starlette to v0.51.0

---
 requirements.txt | 6 +++---
 1 file changed, 3 insertions(+), 3 deletions(-)

diff --git a/requirements.txt b/requirements.txt
index 35b1ffe..62ac55c 100644
--- a/requirements.txt
+++ b/requirements.txt
@@ -327,9 +327,9 @@ sphinxcontrib-serializinghtml==2.0.0 ; platform_machine == 'x86_64' and sys_plat
     --hash=sha256:6e2cb0eef194e10c27ec0023bfeb25badbbb5868244cf5bc5bdc04e4464bf331 \
     --hash=sha256:e9d912827f872c029017a53f0ef2180b327c3f7fd23c87229f7a8e8b70031d4d
     # via sphinx
-starlette==0.50.0 ; platform_machine == 'x86_64' and sys_platform == 'linux' \
-    --hash=sha256:9e5391843ec9b6e472eed1365a78c8098cfceb7a74bfd4d6b1c0c0095efb3bca \
-    --hash=sha256:a2a17b22203254bcbc2e1f926d2d55f3f9497f769416b3190768befe598fa3ca
+starlette==0.51.0; platform_machine == 'x86_64' and sys_platform == 'linux' \
+    --hash=sha256:4c4fda9b1bc67f84037d3d14a5112e523509c369d9d47b111b2f984b0cc5ba6c \
+    --hash=sha256:fb460a3d6fd3c958d729fdd96aee297f89a51b0181f16401fe8fd4cb6129165d
     # via fastapi-slim
 types-pillow==10.2.0.20240822 ; platform_machine == 'x86_64' and sys_platform == 'linux' \
     --hash=sha256:559fb52a2ef991c326e4a0d20accb3bb63a7ba8d40eb493e0ecb0310ba52f0d3 \

Can Renovate bump both the uv.lock and the requirements.txt together?

[gentle solstice]

Can probably configure postUpgradeTasks

{
  "postUpgradeTasks": {
    "commands": [
      "uv export --frozen --all-groups --output-file=requirements.txt",
      "uv export --frozen --all-groups --format=pylock.toml --output-file=pylock.toml"
    ]
  }
}

[astral apex]

That would work if Renovate was bumping the uv.lock, but it’s bumping the requirements.txt directly.
I can’t go backwards from the requirements.txt back to the uv.lock.

[gentle solstice]

dang

might want to open an issue

or open a discussion page

[fallow mist]

Where do i check for #jobs

[desert skiff]

we got #career-advice where you can ask related questions, but there is no place for announcing, requasing or advertising jobs or services on this service as we have strict #rules against such things here

[agile tapir]

sigh today i legitmatly want llm tools native to linux for pattern matching in linux(bashrc) to deal with github repo pattern matching. today is a sad day

[maiden cobalt]

hi guys ! quick questions. Would you use such a tool as computational notebook ?

for research purposes we were exploring different types of notebooks that could add some additional value to overcome some of the limitations if rge existing vanilla notebooks

and we ended up with a set of features which we implemented in this one

the obvious one is the "code on canvas" but there are other set of other feature

[inland sinew]

@near mist

[cunning mountain]

I'm making a portfolio maker

Where you run the file and put all required things in config.json

Download the "small" package of dependencies and done !

It will make an index.html for you and deploy that to GitHub pages through your account. (Username and PAT)

Imma put it to GitHub soon as it finishes

[subtle mango]

This is an open-source project and feel free to contribute here: 🔗https://github.com/Legharihasham/Visionary-AI

[dense osprey]

yo Chat... anybody knows how to FRP bypass an android??

[zenith sonnet]

this is sick

[crimson spruce]

!warn 1124092593853190214 I've deleted your post. Advertising is not allowed anywhere on the server.

[rancid schooner]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied warning to @rose estuary.

[heavy knot]

Hey everyone 👋 just sharing a project I’ve been working on, in case anyone’s interested:

🖥️ EasyPyDesktop
Windows desktop app → native, pure Python code generation
Beginner-friendly, ideal for small or casual apps
Generate a Windows .exe in one click
Beta version – Pro license included (all features unlocked until May 2026)
Custom plugins • Embedded Python runtime • Built-in pip manager

https://github.com/emo44/easypy-desktop

[cosmic frost]

is it normal for large python projects to essentially have there own unique "harness" for development environment setup and such? Like, it feels like every python project I jump into I have to familiarize myself with this bespoke setup system where as, coming from my .NET background, the solution is essentially ready to build and run with 1 click a lot of the times.

[twilit forum]

duckduckgo GPT-4o mini says "Yes, it's very common [...]"

[thorny shell]

I've been using "just" to make that problem a little easier. The goal -- which I haven't quite completed -- is that someone can "git clone" my project, install "just", and then type "just runme" and just will take care of doing all the preperatory stuff in the right order.

Alas, there's still stuff they have to install manually: python itself, of course; "just", and typically a few other things.

[twilit forum]

put a Makefile to install just?

[thorny shell]

booo

[lone spruce]

Yo can some one help me? I wanna setup my tool i have the script but i need help for starting it its python tool

[heavy knot]

hello guys I am new to this community, I designed a n built a python more of a library kind of thing for performing scientific, robotics and physics calculations. It is named CalCulus. I have been working on this almost daily but now u am kind of out if ideas so I want more ideas for version improvement. If free check out the link -

0httpsgithubgithub.comLegedsDaDCalCulus

https://github.com/LegedsDaD/CalCulus

[neon shard]

much code, very wow

[astral apex]

They have releases
Each release has a wheel uploaded, and a link to a different repo
So each version is in it's own repo

[neon shard]

What the actual fuck

[astral apex]

Hey how’d you know my expression?

[neon shard]

@heavy knot this is not how you should do things 🥴

You should have one repo, add commits as you do work, add a tag e.g. v0.4.0 when ready for release and make a release at that tag

So you have all history in one repo

Rather than this bizarre one repo per version with ~1 commit each

[eager rose]

wow that's a new one

[cerulean hollow]

mini rant: I'm struggling to see the benefits of using ArgoCD to deploy my k8s resources. I had another team set it up for me, they added a few 100 lines of yaml code, an extra layer for my team to debug, and and it's hard to dry-run changes locally. All for... drift detection and prevention (and IAA)? Idk... The cons outweigh the benefits IMO. Someone prove me wrong change my mind please.

[brazen forge]

you listed the main pro (automatic drift detection)

I'm not sure what you mean by

a few 100 lines of yaml code, an extra layer for my team to debug

do you mean they made a Helm chart?

[cerulean hollow]

They added a few helm templates for an argocd application resource to the existing project. They also added pipeline templates to build the Argo app (using azure DevOps)

[brazen forge]

ah, I see

and what about "the extra layer to debug"?

what do you want to debug?
whether the generated manifest is correct?

[cerulean hollow]

I am seeing a lot of questions marks in the dashboard indicating an unknown status. I don't see those resources using kubectl get x, where x is the resource in question. I dont know how to delete them

Furthermore, the team that set it up for us did a lot of value file overriding, so now I have several values files PER environment that I must update (as opposed to two, one global file and one env specific file for each env).

[snow pasture]

is there a site for single script python code

[astral apex]

GitHub?

[visual oxide]

https://gist.github.com/

[visual oxide]

https://paste.pythondiscord.com/

[hardy plaza]

Added Kubernetes support to the web app deployment platform I have been building for last few years https://github.com/openrundev/openrun. The whole config for creating an app is just:

app(path="/streamlit/uber", source="github.com/streamlit/demo-uber-nyc-pickups", spec="python-streamlit")

That Starlark config replaces thousands of lines of YAML. It defines what path (or domain) to install the app at, where to get the source code from and how to do the request routing. Schedule a sync and it automatically monitors for any updates to app config or source code and creates/updates the Kubernetes resources.

You can get rid of Jenkins/GitHub Actions for build, ArgoCD/Flux for CD and any IDP etc. Same config can be used on single node, so your config is not tied to Kubernetes, you can run it on a single node easily.

This is limited for now to deploying web apps, no support for deploying additional services like databases etc.

[twilit forum]

Can your editor+lsp combo handle this? https://github.com/neovim/neovim/issues/30908#issuecomment-3861617601

from collections import namedtuple

Access = namedtuple("Access", ["address", "type"])

a = Access(100, "w")
a.address
#   ^------ With the cursor here, do goto_definition

Neovim + pylsp is not happy

[neon shard]

Don't use namedtuple

use NamedTuple

!d typing.NamedTuple

[rancid schooner]

typing.NamedTuple

class typing.NamedTuple```
Typed version of [`collections.namedtuple()`](https://docs.python.org/3/library/collections.html#collections.namedtuple).

Usage...

[twilit forum]

Really? I believe named tuple also support typing.

Seems strange to use something from package rather than builtin

But nevertheless, the code is like that and I'm probably not changing it. I was interested in the lsp issue.

Question though. If I want to override even just __repr__, then it's better to derive from dataclass, right?

[vague silo]

I've used a lot of typing.NamedTuples where I add methods

__repr__ should probably work. I usually use it for classmethods

[worn root]

That's what I do usually. NamedTuple and methods

[crimson spruce]

!clban 1468278465265664155 some kind of scam

[rancid schooner]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @timid wolf permanently.

[neon shard]

Seems strange to use something from package rather than builtin
both are from stdlib packages

it's essentially a drop in replacement that does typing, you can just update your namedtuple definitions and all users shouldn't really notice unless they look really closely

[neon shard]

the lsp issue is likely a consequence of namedtuple not playing well with typing, no?

actually, got to definition does work for me there with pyright, but I still stand with dropping ⁨namedtuple⁩ for ⁨NamedTuple⁩ to get typing support

[neon shard]

honestly, I woudn't use any named tuple if you don't need it for tuple reasons, dataclasses tend to be so much cleaner

(⁨NamedTuple⁩ also looks exactly like a dataclass in how you define it, so that's another good thing about it)

for context on typing

hmm, I just remembered that you might be using ⁨ty⁩, in which case yeah ⁨namedtuple⁩ doesn't behave well but ⁨NamedTuple⁩ does

I think this might be in part because with ⁨NamedTuple⁩ it's basically just a normal class definition, the code will know how to deal with that

⁨namedtuple⁩ is a weird case where a bunch of codegen is done based on the strings passed, and support for it is special handling of ⁨namedtuple⁩ in particular

[twilit forum]

I agree I don't like the style of namedtuple, but you can type it, I believe

[neon shard]

where does it allow specifying types anywhere?

[twilit forum]

Seems I was wrong, can't find it in

Yeah, noticed

It's annoying that there are many ways to do almost the same thing. Very Non-zen

[twilit forum]

I currently use pylint, pylsp ruff and mypy

[neon shard]

in this case it's more "⁨namedtuple⁩ is fundamentally broken, let's create a replacement"

[twilit forum]

Sure

Still bad current state 😐

[neon shard]

idk, the old thing is there for source compatibility, you really shouldn't use it in modern code

though arguably the old thing should be deprecated

[twilit forum]

Sure but it's still there. Should be some lint rules to deprecated it perhaps.

[neon shard]

apparently there is one for pyi files
https://docs.astral.sh/ruff/rules/collections-named-tuple/

[twilit forum]

Nice, let's see what astral thinks about checking it in regular py files as well

[cobalt lintel]

hey guys, would a gui for uv be useful?

[river crystal]

yes... i want to get into it but learning a new library takes time that i am investing in other things

[zinc beacon]

Friend of mine wrote this open source plugin for improved Claude code reviews using independent sub agents. Feel free to check it out and provide feedback or contribute: https://github.com/HartBrook/lookagain

[short peak]

my initial guess is "no" but after seeing that mock up I can easly picture some of my teamworkers using it. What about a section/tab that highlight detected vulnerabilities for specific versions?

[brazen forge]

did he check the ralph-loop plugin?

[neon shard]

I ended up looking at this and supposedly this was done ages ago
https://github.com/astral-sh/ruff/pull/6297

Yeah, it does indeed work, you just need to make sure that you have the PYI checks enabled

> ruff check a.py
PYI024 Use `typing.NamedTuple` instead of `collections.namedtuple`
 --> a.py:3:10
  |
1 | from collections import namedtuple
2 |
3 | person = namedtuple('person', ['name', 'age'])
  |          ^^^^^^^^^^
  |
help: Replace with `typing.NamedTuple`

Found 1 error.

[neon shard]

Should have been a reply to this, but oh well

[twilit forum]

Nice ✌️

[cobalt lintel]

thanks, that’s a solid suggestion. a Security tab makes sense. scan the current env and uv.lock for known vulnerabilities. show CVE, OSV IDs, severity, and a one-click upgrade to fixed version. i’ll def prototype it, i can benefit from the learning process bc i wasn't that much in security so far tbh.

[quaint shell]

very stupid question but how does one turn a .py file into an exe?

[versed glen]

That's not a stupid question. There are ways to package python modules together with the interpreter into an exe or installer, like nuitka, but I'm not an expert by far. You might want to ask in #packaging-and-distribution

[zinc beacon]

he is familiar, yes. This is more of a guard-rails oriented tool for code reviewing with auto-fix capabilities. I will suggest he add something to the readme to specify how it differs from the ralph-loop plugin tho. Thanks for the feedback!

[thorny shell]

I personally have found it so difficult that I've given up.

[quaint shell]

i just figured it out

need help?

[thorny shell]

no thanks

[alpine mortar]

Hi there! I want to automate sending emails with Gmail. Do I need any permission? Do I need api?
I read I need two factors authentication.
Any suggestions?

[astral apex]

Use this instead of a password
https://support.google.com/mail/answer/185833

[alpine mortar]

Thanks

[neon shard]

sounds great

Couldn't you just use smtp?

[astral apex]

This IS for SMTP

SMTP doesn’t support MFA so you have to make a token for your account

[dry carbon]

Guyz how can I impress my crush

By tools aur programs

[sudden igloo]

Very subjective question. You might not be able to. You need something they are interested in and something you can do for them or something you can make that they are interested in.

Speaking from experience, it is not hard to impress people if you can do something they want that they themselves can't. Maybe just do stuff you're interested in and if they get to know you they'll find it interesting. If you want someone to like you back it takes more than impressing them though. Not something you just arbitrarily do without an opportunity imo.

Most people would be impressed though if they had a software idea you could implement and if you could make it and deliver it to them efficiently (i.e. part of the devops name in this channel), if you can make software and continuously deliver it safely and rapidly after changes a lot of people would be impressed.

[gentle solstice]

Install arch linux without using the archinstall command.

[dry carbon]

Omgg

[dry carbon]

Mhm 😔

[gentle solstice]

They asked for ideas on impressing a crush, not your employer.

Don't date your boss.

[sudden igloo]

Yea but the end result is your crush gets their software to them faster. I also amidst that just suggested software development for what is related to them. What are the odds they have a crush which installing arch Linux serve to impress? 😭

[dry carbon]

Guyzz give me a some tips yar

[gentle solstice]

💸💸💸 How's this?

20% gratuity seems standard

[dry carbon]

Dayuum I'm f*ck ing 17 yarr 😔

[heavy knot]

learn to rap

[tall laurel]

Let’s say I have scripts foo and bar. If I want to share some stuff in the two scripts in a utils file, but still want foo and bar (some shebang python stuff) to be clean… basically my best bet for path management/imports is just to add file.parent to path I guess???

Wondering if there have been advances in Pythonpath management tech for smaller scripts

[rugged hare]

modifying sys.path is still not recommended

what else is in your project? You meant a utils directory I think?

[tall laurel]

So the longer version is i have this project with a scripts directory, so scripts/foo, scripts/bar, etc. You call something like scripts/do-menial-task to get a thing done

Most of these scripts are just bash/shell scripts, but for argument parsing in particular I’ve been trying to get us to use python scripts.

In bash script land we can share utils with a ‘source ./utils.sh’ call.

We don’t use relative imports in our overall Python project… but maybe relative imports for scripts is just what makes sense for doing the same thing in Python land

(The objective: being able to call Python scripts with ./scripts/foo or ./scripts/bar just as transparently as with shell scripts. Tho I just realized our shell scripts likely also have issues when called outside of the base of the project as well)

[rugged hare]

do you have install instructions for getting started with this repo?

[tall laurel]

One better, we have direnv and the like on top of that

… so maybe we set up Pythonpath from the outset to just have good imports.

[rugged hare]

i still would avoid changing the python path. You could structure your repo to install the Python code, then python -m pip install -e . as part of the installation.

[tall laurel]

Hmmm so that installs the root into the environment. If our scripts are shebanged with #!/usr/bin/env python then that should find the right python/venv when invoked and then I can import packages “properly”

[grim crag]

Looking for 1 Python repo to try a small GitHub Action that flags GitHub Actions cache regressions in PRs (cache key churn / hit-rate drops) and posts a short Job Summary + optional PR comment with “what changed / now what”.

Alpha install is low-risk: a vendored dist-only bundle (action.yml + dist/*) committed into the repo with SHA256 sums + commit metadata + easy rollback. No SaaS backend. It only uses the repo’s GITHUB_TOKEN to read Actions run/job metadata; PR comment is optional.

Time: ~10–15 min setup, baseline builds asynchronously from normal runs, then one quick “bad cache key” PR test.

Pilot docs + example output: https://gist.github.com/eivindsjursen-lab/ffe0fa52d55388fdda15f80719bf95af

If you can try it (single job or matrix), reply here and I’ll DM the bundle + minimal workflow snippet.

[fervent scarab]

Now day we use ai to create ai and use the ai we make to create the another ai and that ai create the best ai and the best ai create the expert ai and....

we all lost the job

[rugged hare]

i'm sorry you lost your job

[gaunt girder]

hey, im working on a project that uses pygetwindow to determine the location of a window on the screen and focus it. its important that i have it set to a specific coordinate, but i cant figure out how it uses coordinates... my screen resolution is 2400 x 1600 and setting the position of the window to half of that does not put the top left corner in the center, any idea why?

the source code for the function and my code calling it

and theres the window, tucked in a lil corner...

[fervent scarab]

Yeah that’s normal. The coordinates in pygetwindow are based on the top-left cornor of the screen, not the center. So when you do moveTo(1200, 800) on a 2400×1600 screen, you’re just placing the top-left corner of the window at that point, not the window itself centered there.

If you want the window centered, you have to subtract helf of the window’s width and height from the screen center. Something like:
center_x = 2400 // 2 - window.width // 2
center_y = 1600 // 2 - window.height // 2
window.moveTo(center_x, center_y)

Otherwise the window will always appear offset because the coordinate refers to the corner, not the middle.

[junior bobcat]

Once again thinking about Docker. I have a Dockerfile for a project that has a bunch of packages that should be in a monorepo but aren't. As a compromise, I'd like to add these packages as git submodules to the repository that manages the dockerfile and turn this repository into a uv workspace. Something like this:

Project/
├── workspace-foo/
│   └── pyproject.toml
├── workspace-bar/
│   └── pyproject.toml
├── not-workspace-baz
├── Dockerfile
└── pyproject.toml

Problem: cache invalidation galore. If Project is the build context and I mount the build context to install the workspace, then changes to not-workspace-baz or the Dockerfile invalidate that layer. I was concerned about the intermediate layer for installing dependencies but I forgot about the lockfile so I think it will be fine?

[twilit forum]

I have this monorepo structure:

pyproject.toml
tools/
└── tool-a/main.py
└── tool_b/main.py

But mypy doesn't like this, it says main is a duplicated module.

Currently each tool is added as separate mypypaths, which makes the main modules all have the same name "main". What is a better structure?

[thorny shell]

maybe you somehow need to run mypy some so that it only "sees" one tool subdirectory at a time

[astral apex]

Why can't you just mypy tools/?

[twilit forum]

Because it complains about the duplicated main module. But that might be because each tool is their own toplevel due to mypypath

One till has a dash in its name, so that also makes mypy choke.
And I'm not sure if I should sprinkle __init__.py files all the way down.

[twilit forum]

I don't use uv nor Github so not sure how applicable your picture is to my case. Do you have any identically named files in the two projects?

[twilit forum]

Here is the exact message mypy gives, all files represented in the tree are empty:

~/projects/mypy_packages_test$ tree
.
├── pyproject.toml
└── tools
    ├── foo-a
    │   └── main.py
    └── foo_b
        └── main.py

4 directories, 3 files
~/projects/mypy_packages_test$ mypy .
tools/foo_b/main.py: error: Duplicate module named "main" (also at "./tools/foo-a/main.py")
tools/foo_b/main.py: note: See https://mypy.readthedocs.io/en/stable/running_mypy.html#mapping-file-paths-to-modules for more info
tools/foo_b/main.py: note: Common resolutions include: a) using `--exclude` to avoid checking one of them, b) adding `__init__.py` somewhere, c) using `--explicit-package-bases` or adjusting MYPYPATH
Found 1 error in 1 file (errors prevented further checking)

[twilit forum]

ty solves the same without any issue 👀

[astral apex]

Are these folders not modules?

[twilit forum]

what you see is what it is

[astral apex]

i.e., do you not have __init__.py files?

[twilit forum]

no init files, no nothing

correct

[astral apex]

So that’s why

[astral apex]

Neither uv or GitHub matters here

[willow pagoda]

--explicit-package-bases technically fixes it for that minimal example, but it deconflicts them by prepending the directories to their module name (tools.foo_b.main) which i imagine would mess up resolution of other imports if you have modules in each tool's directories

though i guess that would be accurate if you run your tools with -m, e.g. sh /mypy_packages_test $ python -m tools.foo_b.main

[twilit forum]

Sprinkling init file is not doable with a folder with a dash in the name:

$ touch __init__.py
$ touch tools/__init__.py
$ touch tools/foo-a/__init__.py
$ touch tools/foo_b/__init__.py
$ mypy .
foo-a is not a valid Python package name

I'm pretty sure adding epxlicit package bases, doesn't help (at least as mypy setting in pyproject.toml, but let's try it)

[willow pagoda]

oh right, i had checked without the dash in my example

[twilit forum]

the tools are run as "standalone" scripts: tools/foo-a/main.py [OPTIONS]

Hmm! removing the init files and passing explicit seems to work for this case

$ mypy . --explicit-package-bases
Success: no issues found in 2 source files

I wonder what failed with my larger example and that setting in pyproject.toml 🤔

aha, setting these (maybe stupid) MYPYPATH reintroduces the duplicated error:

$ MYPYPATH=tools/foo-a:tools/foo_b mypy . --explicit-package-bases
tools/foo_b/main.py: error: Duplicate module named "main" (also at "./tools/foo-a/main.py")
tools/foo_b/main.py: note: See https://mypy.readthedocs.io/en/stable/running_mypy.html#mapping-file-paths-to-modules for more info
tools/foo_b/main.py: note: Common resolutions include: a) using `--exclude` to avoid checking one of them, b) adding `__init__.py` somewhere, c) using `--explicit-package-bases` or adjusting MYPYPATH
Found 1 error in 1 file (errors prevented further checking)

[willow pagoda]

yeah it falls apart under more scrutiny, tested with the following layout: py tools/ ├── tool-a/ │ ├── main.py │ │ import mod │ │ print(mod.x) │ └── mod.py │ x = 1 └── tool_b/ ├── main.py │ import mod │ print(mod.y) └── mod.py y = 2 sh (test)> py tools\tool-a\main.py 1 (test)> py tools\tool_b\main.py 2 (test)> mypy --explicit-package-bases . tools\tool_b\main.py:2: error: Module has no attribute "y" [attr-defined] Found 1 error in 1 file (checked 4 source files)

im not a frequent user of mypy though, maybe there's another option?

[twilit forum]

replacing mypy with ty might be the way forward, but i'm not sure ty is up to par with mypy yet

[astral apex]

Making proper packages

Mypy is able to see the package roots as the bases

This works just fine in my monorepo posted above

[twilit forum]

And how would one do this? I thought init files were supposed to be optional nowadays with "implicit packages", no?

[twilit forum]

Could you show what's different between your monorepo and my example?

[astral apex]

No

!pep 420

[rancid schooner]

**PEP 420 - Implicit Namespace Packages**

Status

Final

Python Version

3.3

Created

19-Apr-2012

Type

Standards Track

[astral apex]

The “implicit” part is an outer shell with, for example, your company name
Your actual code folders are still expected to have __init__.py files.

[astral apex]

As far as I understand, the only difference is the __init__.py files.

[twilit forum]

Where do you have those?

(I can't find any in the screenshot)

[astral apex]

In every folder that has other Python files

[twilit forum]

Python is so complicated, 😭

[astral apex]

vendor_products is one of the projects/tools so each of its sub folders with the actual tool code in it gets an init file

[astral apex]

How?

[twilit forum]

In this regard

[astral apex]

If code, __init_.py
If no code, no __init_.py

[twilit forum]

Packages, imports. Relative imports, python path,.. I've never been able to understand it

[twilit forum]

This is the first time I hear this simple statement 👀

[twilit forum]

1st party package, 2nd party package, 3rd party package,..

[astral apex]

What is “second party”? 👀

[gentle solstice]

Your own modules?

[astral apex]

huh

[twilit forum]

I might be misremembering, ruff had some categorization to sort imports. Maybe 2nd party wasn't there actually.

[steep coral]

I've heard "2nd party dependency" to be used for the code you control, but pull in using the same tooling as external 3rd party packages

but it's not like the actual tooling can make a distinction between these and proper 3rd party packages

[distant sigil]

not sure what is the right forum for this question - has anyone been able to add the pandas library to their IDE? I've tried these 2 different installation packages conda-forge and PyPi and I end up spending hours troubleshooting those apps and have not yet made it to download Pandas library. Is there any other option for getting it?

[versed glen]

Which IDE are you using? You might have to ask in #editors-ides

[distant sigil]

I'm using Pycharm 2025.3.3

[sudden igloo]

Are you installing pandas from the console in your ide?

[distant sigil]

no so far I have downloaded conda-forge and trying to figure out how that works

[sudden igloo]

Pycharm gives you a virtual environment of a copy of the interpreter and packages to use when you make a new project in it. Packages you install globally on your system won't be accessible to the python running in pycharm executing your code. If you go to the terminal in pycharm you'll have access to this python and it's pip and if you do pip install package_name it should work.

[distant sigil]

I knew there had to be an easier way - thanks so much

[sudden igloo]

No problem

[versed glen]

There's also a gui widget in the left bottom side where you can see the installed packages, and search for packages to install

And if you type import pandas or whatever in a script in your project, pycharm will suggest to install the package

[deft sequoia]

hi guys, has anyone worked with nerdctl here?

[gentle solstice]

Do you have a question about it?

[open laurel]

Isnt local modules the third thing in Pep 8?

[sudden igloo]

Are immutable servers literally immutable or just in principle? Take a simple example: I deploy an nginx server with some static files and I want to change the configuration, so normally I'd ssh in, update that and reload it, probably automating that.

I would assume that I can have an immutable server in principle by provisioning the server, configuring it, verifying it works and never modifying it again, only changing it through replacing it with another, not that I have to bake everything or most of everything into a golden image or something.

I'll concede that I might misunderstand what immutable servers are and if I do I feel like there is a valid underlying concept here that is being overlooked. The CEO of pulumi has this article of an example of "cattle not pets" which seems very similar.

https://www.pulumi.com/blog/deploy-wordpress-aws-pulumi-ansible/

The article by Martin Fowler on phoenix servers just says they're servers that are burnt down frequently and can rise from the ashes like a phoenix, but this thoughtworks article implied to me that only using golden images is valid? Even though I'm pretty sure I can easily get Phoenix servers while frying up base images from providers like digitalocean, even if in theory stuff could break due to mirrors being down, bad updates, and so on, but it feels comparable to any normal risk you take when managing most servers to me. 🤷‍♀️

https://martinfowler.com/bliki/PhoenixServer.html
https://www.thoughtworks.com/en-us/insights/blog/moving-to-phoenix-server-pattern-introduction

[rapid sparrow]

Only in principle.

Servers are immutable practically means u don't install anything with apt there after you created it. Also no modifications to /etc configs. But most important not having things like self updated python, installable dependencies should be frozen
You are allowed installing, modifying system level apps only during server image building stage like with Packer.

On server boot, lightweight init can make small modifications to /etc, booting docker daemon and etc, but it should be part of infrastructure code and universal to all servers, and like within one second fast without installing anything

And apps you launch as containers without needing to ssh it.
Docker images are version stored in Docker registry. Server just pulls different docker image versions

Also from point of view of work production grade immutable server means your containers do not have volumes mapped to host. Manage static files in S3, have any state of volumes in network attachable ones.
That allows easily servers scaling horizontally and recreating without regrets easily

[rapid sparrow]

Presuming container scheduling orchestrator is active like AWS ECS or EKS, it will restart apps fully on its own depending on servers availability. You do not need to relaunch even containers on your own, all code is declarative and auto synced in terms of deployment

For homelab I went more simple approach: just docker with volumes mapped to host, and controlling docker over ssh with opentofu. I broke the rules by having host mapped volumes, but as long as I backup and copy this single folder, server recreating/migrating is still manageably simple for me, despite forgetting everything a year later

Your application can be having config controlled by your container scheduling solution and defined as part of infra as a code, changeable without making new docker image

The important part in IAC code able to control all those app configurations remotely, without someone doing manual ssh to server and managing app configs outside of IAC. App management should be entirely in IAC for easy server recreation (which will become super easy if statics in S3 and volumes are remotely attachable)

If your server management is right like I described above, your server upgrade and rollback becomes simple as upgrading containerized app. Same exactly server image at all servers will run for sure with same deps for years if needed. Screwed up upgrade? Easy rollback to previous saved server image

[sudden igloo]

The infrastructure as code book mentions baking images as well as frying them where updates even when making golden images are allowed.

And s3 does not work for me on my budget, at least the services I'm using at least, it's vulnerable to unsophisticated attacks that run up the bills because no rate limiting (digitalocean spaces in my case) and they only charge for bandwidth, other providers charge per request so it's not like putting a caching service in front would stop 404s which you also are billed for.

For me, I feel strongly like it would make sense to use an s3 bucket but replicate it to servers running nginx for public access, with rate limiting, and handle upgrades or management by swapping servers out and redoing the process.

[sudden igloo]

So when you bake golden images and don't touch anything on the filesystem after besides use apps on it like docker, that's an immutable server, but frying an image with terraform/ansible to integrate your software, never touching it again, and starting from scratch when a change is needed isn't?

[rapid sparrow]

The infrastructure as code book mentions baking images as well as frying them where updates even when making golden images are allowed.
i was not able to comprehend it properly. But just to be sure, servers are meant to be changed by swapping their Server Images through terraform/pulumi and etc only.
Applications running in containers aren't part of this forbiddence.

And s3 does not work for me on my budget, at least the services I'm using at least, it's vulnerable to unsophisticated attacks that run up the bills because no rate limiting (digitalocean spaces in my case) and they only charge for bandwidth, other providers charge per request so it's not like putting a caching service in front would stop 404s which you also are billed for.
ergh, sure, then go as i do for homelab, just abuse hostpath volumes, but it will still make your servers more "vulnerable" to issues to upgrade and scale them. That is completely fine if you are the only dev on that project and forever will be so.

[rapid sparrow]

So when you bake golden images and don't touch anything on the filesystem after besides use apps on it like docker, that's an immutable server
yes, especially it is fully immutable server if it has no hostpath volumes also on it, and all applications are auto restored when servers die and created automatically by Master controlers of container scheduling system.
in situation when you still abuse hostpath for volumes of app... it is like ... 80% there towards immutable servers but not fully yet.

but frying an image with terraform/ansible to integrate your software, never touching it again, and starting from scratch when a change is needed isn't?
if you need changing server, then yes when needing change you just create another server and destroy previous one for your needs.
Since you continue abusing hostpath volumes, you would need also Migrating single folder with them between servers though.
You can achieve 95-100% server immutability if you will be abusing Digital Ocean Volumes in place for your hostpath volumes. With Digital Ocean Volumes all your state can be in a single volume, and you can be just shutting down all apps, recreating Droplet , having by iac same volume attached and then running the rest of iac code to launch back all apps

if you intend to use juts simple Docker for your container scheduling solution, remember that u can pick Droplet with image where Docker is already installed, DO offers that. So you need no system level changes at all

[rapid sparrow]

Beware of a good default production safety that people in iac use... at minimum your Droplet should be having Cloud level firewall configured to it allowing only 22, 80, 443 traffic https://registry.terraform.io/providers/digitalocean/digitalocean/latest/docs/resources/firewall
Ideally your droplet should exist only in Private network, but i am not sure it is feasiable to achieve in DO, since it is over simplistic provider

that will protect you against silly mistakes with Docker, when you binded your db to host port without any password or default password 😄 (you should not do it, but in case u did, DO firewall can prevent you from getting hacked hopefully if it was configured by iac fast enough)

[sudden igloo]

I'm aware. In addition to the fact that some providers firewalls only cover traffic that comes from outside the data center. Servers in the same region aren't necessarily filtered out, not sure about digitalocean specifically but ovh has this problem regarding firewall rules and ddos protection.

[sudden igloo]

If I were to deploy servers to replicate from a bucket and swap them out for upgrades, in my case I would go for replocating the entire bucket each time for every server, and every upgrade, not new volumes, starting from scratch. I'd have terraform or pulumi ssh in, run a command to replicate the data, wait for it to finish, and then set something up in the background to do the rest automatically. Server setup would be entirely fresh each time without having to share anything between them, a tweak to configuration like rate limiting, I'd try to do by starting from scratch with that setting. Not sure how efficient this is, because I haven't tried it yet, it might not be efficient but nothing will need to be copied between servers between setups except from the bucket.

[rapid sparrow]

👀 why would u replicate server from a bucket?

bucket is meant to be static files long term storage database, it is not supposed to participate in server creation

[sudden igloo]

It wouldn't. The replication is for public access so that people can't run up the bills by sending a lot of requests to it and so that I can control rate limiting.

[rapid sparrow]

if you are not satisfied with DO Buckets, just use Volumes instead for "remote attachable storage space", and expose this data in whatever u wish way with rate limiting and etc

skip the buckets entirely if they do not work for you

[rapid sparrow]

and/or instead u can be using Buckets only internally by your app accessable (or self hosted S3 compatible storages like Garage or smth, they will have zero limitations besides giving you extra overhead in self hosting stuff)

[sudden igloo]

I am satisfied with buckets though in the sense of accessing them to upload and manage data conveniently. I'm aiming for read only replicas to mitigate the issue.

[quiet hemlock]

Does my IDE lack features ?

I was requesting feedback. I'm not having an issue

[astral apex]

<@&831776746206265384> probably a scam?
Am confused

[quiet hemlock]

What no.

[astral apex]

Not you
The other guy

[quiet hemlock]

Oh ok

Well I gtg, bye

[compact valley]

!cleanban 997868787145637968 scam

[rancid schooner]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @weary hearth permanently.

[compact valley]

A folder tree on the left is a key feature that this appears to lack

[gentle solstice]

I'm wondering why an IDE needs rich presense integration.

[regal sierra]

.

[regal sierra]

How much are you selling your account @gentle solstice ?

[gentle solstice]

All you really need is syntax highlighting and auto complete (optionally via LSP). Additional features could include an integrated terminal, file browser, git integration, and run configurations.

[gentle solstice]

!rule money

[rancid schooner]

Rules

9. Do not offer or ask for paid work of any kind.

[quiet hemlock]

I will see how to implement it

[quiet hemlock]

I mean yeah, just added rich presence because I think its nice to have that

[stuck sun]

of course it does lack a lot of featuers... lsp, debugger, file explorer, codebase search, search, undo redo, terminal? and the repo is private. urs is not even an ide rn. its just a fancy text editor for python..

maybe take some reference from my ide which i built recently

https://github.com/adyanthm/axiom-desktop

It has all the features i mentioned above

[quiet hemlock]

Thank you for taking some time to give feedback. Really appreciate

[quiet hemlock]

Hey, added a terminal and issues checker aswell as undo, redo, and actual debugger with a redesigned UI. Thoughts ?

[empty pasture]

if this is your project and you want feedback, and it's open source, use #1468524576479641744

[quiet hemlock]

Yes its my project, but its not opensource.. yet

[distant scarab]

"yet"

[stuck sun]

well i might want to see the debugger and all that before saying

[quiet hemlock]

Sure, here's the debugger and the terminal

Made a script with errors intentionally to showcase that the issues checker works

[stuck sun]

ok nice

[rugged hare]

why wait to share the code?

[quiet hemlock]

Cuz I'm still working on making the setup executable and making sure it works on Windows and other computers

[rugged hare]

you could get feedback if you made the source public. software's never done.

[quiet hemlock]

Yea.. but just making sure everything is alright before shipping. I don't want people to complain saying it doesn't work only to find out they didn't upgrade pip

[stuck sun]

color theme looks so damn good

ima steal it

thanks

[quiet hemlock]

Don't steal theif

[stuck sun]

yes steal

[quiet hemlock]

[stuck sun]

btw am 15 too

we can collab some ideas together

i built a code editor just like you

[quiet hemlock]

https://tenor.com/view/ohio-respect-ohio-impressed-king-von-gif-5378643817404344366

[quiet hemlock]

Yea you told me about it

[stuck sun]

dms then lets make some projects together :)

[solar wigeon]

Hello

[pliant haven]

Hi folks, are there any tools, IntelliSense, especially VS code extensions that help with hinting class-based views' attributes and methods, or at least DRF generic views? One thing deterring me from using CBVs is the need to memorize a large list of attributes and methods that need to be overridden

[true bone]

general tool thing i'm working on

[nocturne karma]

what a linux version?

[quiet hemlock]

Linux kernel v.6.x I don't remember the full version.
Distro used is Fedora Linux 43 Workstation Edition

[spice inlet]

hello guys

https://github.com/Exen-pixel/optimizer-VIE-ver-

i hope u guys are enjoying my tool

[quiet hemlock]

What does it do ?

[dreamy shuttle]

Does this noise I generated look good?

Heres a zoom in

Even closer

[dreamy shuttle]

I feel like it looks pretty good close up but far out you can vaguely see the grid

[spice inlet]

i released new vẻ

ver*

do u wanna try it ?

(srry 4 my bad eng)

it has better UI than the old one

[spice inlet]

and more feat

[rugged hare]

no one is going to run an exe you uploaded that has no information about what it does.

[patent bobcat]

my usual workflow should go like this eh?

->from dev branch i make a new worktree for feat x
->then in that, after coding shi, i do my local tests using like the turbo global test shi
->then if that works, i create a PR from that feat branch to test branch
->the qa (test branch) run their own tests (regression and integration tests)
->then if that works they merge that with the prod branch.
->in case it doesnt pass their tests, do they js reject that PR and I fix shi and send a new PR? etc etc

(granted i am working solo on this project, idek if i should be going thru all this)

but yeah would love some help or a guide i can read for this

was asking a friend and he kinda explained it a bit, thought i'd ask here as well

[rugged hare]

if you are working by yourself, you don't need a branch at all, but it's a good habit. You definitely don't need dev branch and prod branch then feature branch and test branch. That's a lot of different branches that serve no purpose.

Most projects, even large serious ones, need a main branch (production), and your branch for the work you are doing. Your branch gets tested, runs CI, is reviewed as a PR, etc. When it's ready, it's merged to main.

[patent bobcat]

gotcha, i'll stick to a simple prod and dev branch then for now. Thanks for the advice!

[rugged hare]

if "prod" is main, and "dev" is "xpert/feature-34", then yes.

[spice inlet]

i know

can u gimme some tips ?

[rugged hare]

if you know this, why are you uploading exe's to github and asking people to run them?

[rapid sparrow]

https://github.com/Exen-pixel/optimizer-VIE-ver-/blob/164b574adbdb6b1e13cdea39f45cace27ae02899/Application code#L77
Further funny issue. accordingly the code we can read, it is 89 code lines generated through Claude or some other LLM entirely.
yet another AI slop project. Value of it is around zero. Author will not learn anything, others will not need it.

[rancid schooner]

Application%20code line 77

create_btn("⚡ High Performance", lambda: [set_high_performance(), messagebox.showinfo("OK", "Đã bật High Performance!")]).pack(pady=5)```

[rapid sparrow]

tips possible to give in this situation:

1. Do not use AI for anything. you are training person and it will harm your growth and will make you looking extremely bad for others.
2. Start with learning Software development craftmanship https://www.amazon.com/Code-Complete-Practical-Handbook-Construction/dp/0735619670 , this book has pretty much Everything u need to know in average to be building smth more in quality
3. Try building projects that have more features in mind in general, that will challenge you in their complexity and things u can make.
4. get through some book of learning the most basics to write code in general at all, Automating the boring stuff or smth https://automatetheboringstuff.com/ , as far as i see your current issue is needing to practice onto developing your writing and reading code skills to write code at all in small amounts. Students after some amount of months able to operate with thousands code lines in their head, once they adapted their brain to programming.
5. find useful CLI/web/GUI frameworks to build your programs upon https://github.com/vinta/awesome-python , and other libs that could help you in implementing ideas yo uhave

[glossy echo]

Built a tiny distributed job bus that lets cloud scripts coordinate with local Termux workers over HTTP. No Redis, no Firebase, just Flask + SQLite.

Wrote a full breakdown here: https://dev.to/d_security/how-i-control-my-android-phone-from-a-cloud-server-using-100-lines-of-flask-2fl6

GitHub: https://github.com/dsecurity49/Intent-Bus

[rugged hare]

#1468524576479641744

[spice inlet]

idk

[spice inlet]

tysm

[pliant haven]

What is the best practice for handling package versions in Python? Do I pin the exact version, or just leave the lower bound in pyproject.toml? I'm using uv and building a Django web app, btw.

[slate summit]

You should use a lower bound and let the lock file pin the exact versions

[pliant haven]

I got recommended to pin the exact version for app

[thorny shell]

Sometimes I have an upper bound, too, in the case where I know the new version breaks something -- e.g. I use a binary library that hasn't been built for python3.14, so I'm forced to write requires-python = ">=3.12,<3.14"

[rapid sparrow]

if package owners are very responsible in following REAL SEMANTIC VERSIONING and you know it, and you have implemented unit testing.
you can be locking to for example >=3.1.2,<4.0.0 and it will work fine in updating itself when needed. With updating through Minor versions and Patches at the same time. Leave updating through Major version as still your own choice when ready.

if package owners are not reponsible at all in making things backward compatible (hello Django) and all Minor updates are BREAKING changes. Best locking to ~=3.1.* fuzzy version, in allowing patches only.
If you do not have unit testing in your project, such fuzzy lock to patches update only is maximum you can afford imo in general for all packages.

if package owners are complete dummies, having zero backward compatibility in any upgrade (usually they are your Coworkers). Or you are doing HACKISH overrides of their package through Monkey Patching. Best lock to specific version like ==3.1.2. Same true if u discovered breaking bug with the package and only specific version works

[rugged hare]

hot take, calling Django irresponsible.

has Django broken things from 5.1 to 5.2, or similar?

[rugged hare]

^^

[rapid sparrow]

https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/6.0/releases/5.2/#backwards-incompatible-changes-in-5-2
Each Minor version has list of backwards incompatible changes

[rugged hare]

ah, ok. I still wouldn;t call that irresponsible. They are very clear about their versioning strategy.

they have better support for these changes than 99% of projects.

[rapid sparrow]

Sure. We can say though they aren't semantic versioned. Probably pride versioned

[rugged hare]

right, they are not semantic versioned. it's important to understand the strategy a library uses.

[dry vale]

Oracle Cloud is the worst thing I have ever used oh my god man

After my account provisioning took 16 hours instead of the advertised 15 minutes, I received an email saying my account was fully provisioned and that I can login. Using the login from the email, entering my credentials keeps telling me "You entered an incorrect user name or password". I was sure of my credentials but even so went as far as resetting my password. Even with the succesfully reset password, I still get "You entered an incorrect user name or password" and can't login at all

And support is literally impossible to reach without logging in

And I can't login without support's help

[rapid sparrow]

Oracle is known to be absolutely cursed among DevOps engineers for a reason

[shadow crow]

Do you think some people elevate semantic versioning above other strategies due to the name? It seems a bit too global. Like, other versioning strategies can also assign meaning to the parts of the version.

[rugged hare]

many believe that all packages are semantic versioned by default. they also believe that semantic versioning can be crisply and clearly defined, but there are plenty of fuzzy edges that are hard to encapsulate in a number.

[shadow crow]

maybe it would've been better called "compatibility versioning" or something like that

I wonder how versioning schemes impact software. That seems like a fun research topic

[dry vale]

Yeah I just wanted their free tier because it's definitely the best

But it's clear now why

Because nobody uses it

[velvet spire]

discord 335...

they increase the build number so easily now

it used to be very limited that they build number would actually increase

and its gotten worse since then so

wow

[rapid sparrow]

practically speaking all hosting is not free or a trap. I can recommend Hetzner as cheapest nice hosting 🙂

[velvet spire]

hetzner hates trans people iirc

[rapid sparrow]

the only thing is definitely free => deploying static assets to Github Pages / and other similar "provider name Pages"

[velvet spire]

discord took from oct 2015 to june 2018 to go from version 1.6.8 to v7 on their android mobile app

compare that to now that they're on version 327

[rapid sparrow]

https://www.reddit.com/r/hetzner/comments/1d05r2j/so_any_alternatives_to_hetzner_dedi/
found thread discussing it, it does not sound as truthful information
Looks to be Hetzner is only fighting people distributing porn, according to history more specifically looks like they were fighting "child p" https://mastodon.ie/@kelpana/112172716658895776

[dry vale]

Yeah I'm hosting my FE in GH Pages

The BE is what I'm worried about

I might just turn my laptop into a server

[rapid sparrow]

to make my pet projects free, I wrote my "backend" in golang to be Static Site Generator that generates frontend static assets 😏
And just have periodic or on call triggered gh workflow rerunning it to update it when necessary
Technically the result is not backend at all, it is pure frontend, but at least i did not use Javascript Modern frameworks to make it and managed making it all in Go :]

[dry vale]

Wdym?

[rapid sparrow]

https://slimythemoon.github.io/DiscoNavmap/#q= (almost original written in jquery)
This space map COULD HAVE been written in Modern JS framework. (And another person in the past did so pure through js and gazilion of Jqueries, and 5 dependencies in 5 different languages).

https://darklab8.github.io/fl-data-discovery/map.html (my map version in Go)
I remade it a month ago to golang, using its Templ go language i TEMPLATE https://templ.guide/ all html/css/js files in files like that https://github.com/darklab8/fl-darkstat/blob/master/darkmap/front/galaxy.templ , to generate the map from Golang at a build time into Html,css,js for deployment to Github pages. During dev local usage it renders on a fly from memory and works kind of like backendish app with reusing the same Templates and the same code logic, just having a little if switch.
I used only Very small amount (10 times less JS than original had) of Vanilla JS to "sprinkle" some interactivity and a tiny bit of htmx

i evaluated all the features i need to make and realized that everything is doable with just templating from golang. I do not need modern js frameworks to make it comfy.
On cron job in Github Actions it is auto updates once in a day, or triggered manually when game new version is detected and gh workflow is called by curl https://github.com/darklab8/fl-data-discovery/blob/master/.github/workflows/publish.yaml

Thus we have web project made comfortably Not In JS for 95% (in Go), yet pretty much frontedish project deployable to Github Pages with auto updating capabilities to catch up with changing content on its own 😄
when we make SSG, Static Site Generator project, we can make it interactive if necessary by making "calls" to other already prerendered files with jsons/html content and etc. Backend DOES NOT HAVE to exist, for frontend to be able making queries to smth. Backend data can be prerendered in advance and existing as files querable by front

[astral apex]

Looks like scifi Skyrim

[rapid sparrow]

this online map was made for space dog fighter game Freelancer (2003) 🙂 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DiT2cxxEcNM
it works for different modding communities of it and was deployed 4 times at least for different its mods.
Very old game with very die hard fans. We are all trapped there to be present forever.

[stable void]

That was a great game! Microsoft should have made a sequel for it.

[fallow hamlet]

¡Hola! Soy David, developer independiente de Zaragoza.

Acabo de lanzar Worvi - un template de chatbot WhatsApp con IA que detecta patrones de conversación automáticamente.

Stack: Python + FastAPI + Claude API
Setup: 5 minutos sin código

Si les interesa, pueden verlo aquí: https://kitbot.gumroad.com/l/worvi-whatsapp

¿Alguien más ha trabajado con webhooks de WhatsApp Business API? 👇

[astral apex]

<@&831776746206265384> ads in Spanish

[crystal crater]

!cleanban 1319363827648958525 1d first message ad

[rancid schooner]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied ban to @fallow hamlet until <t:1777596586:f> (1 day).

[tacit orbit]

Hey guys I came across this server I wondering where we actually can post our github to find feedback I wanna share a tool I created using Python but I don't want raise issue like ads content or something like, it is a Open Source project that I am looking for share

[rugged hare]

#1468524576479641744

[tacit orbit]

Good, Thanks

[marsh bison]

HEllo

[timber basin]

I have a question about whether it is more practical to store a Discord bot token in a .env file or in Docker Secrets with Swarm.

[modern geyser]

Use Docker Secrets. .env is fine for local dev, but it’s not secure for production—easy to leak or commit by mistake. Docker Secrets are designed for this use case.

[opal reef]

what is ty doing? theres no point in zed using 26MB RAM when ty is going to do this
and it took nearly a minute to finish
here pyrefly lsp is almost instantly providing completions on same code (through pulsar editor)

[shadow crow]

you should probably ask/report in the astral server

https://discord.com/invite/c9MhzV8aU5

[opal reef]

oh, its not memory leak, i think its normally working, its just my 30K LOC project thats 100% untyped

[shadow crow]

now that it's owned by OpenAI, maybe they just want people to buy more RAM

[opal reef]

what!?

[shadow crow]

Astral was recently acquired by OpenAI https://openai.com/index/openai-to-acquire-astral/

[opal reef]

im deleting ruff and uv

i can code without linter

and venv will be fine

[shadow crow]

for LSP, zuban exists I guess

haven't tried it though

4.4GB for a 30k line project is definitely unacceptable, it's a perfromance bug even if no leak occurs

[opal reef]

could be because i dont write typehints

so its trying to guess them

[shadow crow]

Could be something related to that. But that's not uncommon

type checkers ideally should support gradually adding types to an untyped codebase

[opal reef]

i tried to make zuban work with pulsar (assuming it uses same protocol as pylsp), and zuban panicked and crashed
so ig pyrefly is the only usable lsp

[velvet cradle]

You re welcome

[analog kettle]

!warn 970292961000701992 You cannot use Python Discord to seek jobs of any kind. Your other messages suggest that you intend to be paid. Telling people to DM you also suggests that you intend to be paid.

[rancid schooner]

:incoming_envelope: :ok_hand: applied warning to @velvet cradle.

[velvet cradle]

Sorry guys

[white ivy]

.bm

sorry for ping

[neon shard]

https://github.com/astral-sh/ty/issues/3445 maybe?

[white ivy]

crosspost from ot0 but can someone explain why/when i would want to use proxmox? i dont see why i want to virtualize/what benefits it has over just spinning up a docker container bare metal

[astral apex]

TL;DR: not everything can be containerized

[white ivy]

well that isnt the right mindset /j

[white ivy]

im kindofaware that its better for security but im not really concerned about that

[astral apex]

Its not really a security thing

[white ivy]

its not like all of my services are exposed to the public interwebs anyways (they are)

[astral apex]

VMs are a maintenance thing

[white ivy]

hm

[astral apex]

You can back up a copy of your VM's virtual hard drive before you update something, and if it blows up you click the restore button and 10 seconds later boom its working again

If you want a new server, you just click the ➕ button and a new server pops up, you don't have to screw with hardware or installing an OS

[white ivy]

ic ic

[astral apex]

You can also do multiple nodes like Kubernetes and load balance your VMs

[white ivy]

thats neat

[white ivy]

anyway ty (astral type checker)

do i send the check to doggo co. LLC /j

[astral apex]

Yes

$250/hr consulting

[white ivy]

sending a check for 10 bucks

or so

[astral apex]

tyty

[white ivy]

(astral type checker)

[astral apex]

^2

[white ivy]

i cant see ty without thinking of the type checker by astral now

i mean

the OpenAI Codex Team

my bad

lmao

[south vector]

hello guys, anyone can recommend a Minio substitute?

is RustFS the best sub?

[sick root]

Greetings, more a VSCode-related question: Is there any working solution to load secrets (like API keys) from an .env file in VSCode's mcp.json file? Known mechanics like ${env:MYSECRET} does not work. Not even when I export the variable in the terminal first. Seems like variables do not get resolved in mcp.json at all.

[crimson spruce]

!rule 10 @jaunty wraith

[rancid schooner]

Rules

10. Do not copy and paste answers from ChatGPT or similar AI tools.

[jaunty wraith]

thanks

[toxic surge]

Nahh

[remote anchor]

hello guys

wassup

[gritty lily]

guys im making a game with python and im using ursina as an engine but every time i run it doesnt run a game it just says point 0 wat engine should i use to make a fairly simple game

[astral apex]

Also see #game-development

[valid ibex]

PLs can anyone help me with installing discord in python

[uncut oxide]

hammer

[mint briar]

wrench

[copper compass]

no.

[hushed orbit]

I prefer the scalpel

[copper compass]

This is an on-topic channel on a python server

you might assume that, as the topic suggests, it's about Python tooling

[delicate gorge]

wait python tooling? the description says For discussing editors, IDEs, and tools like pip or pipenv.

[dawn stump]

pipenv > pip
nano > vim
sublime > atom
ubuntu > centos
python 3.6 > python 2.7

[copper compass]

success, I actually got Nix to read a channel topic

[delicate gorge]

oh i always read them gdude

always

[vague silo]

that‘s the first time I hear someone recommend nano

the Keybinds are very cryptic to meS

systemctl edit uses that for god knows why

[delicate gorge]

i only know ctrl o, ctrl x for nano

[copper compass]

nano has the keybinds at the bottom of the screen

[vague silo]

yeah, and that‘s a bad sign

[dawn stump]

ctrl x is all you ever need :D

[vague silo]

should be self-documenting

lol that‘s the one i remember

[delicate gorge]

and ctrl o

[burnt maple]

M-x help

[clever raven]

yeah cause vim is so self-documenting

[delicate gorge]

ofc it is

[dawn stump]

mentioning nano and vim in the same sentence usually sparks more of a debate. Shortest debate ever!

[vague silo]

i mean

i for insert

c for cut

and so on, that‘s what I meant

if you go by what the commands do you can remember them pretty well

[copper compass]

I'm fine with this not being about editor wars

[vague silo]

Are there plugins for nano?

i didnt plan to make it one :(

Was just curious about nano

[wicked flicker]

I think you can enable nano syntax highlighting

[blazing prawn]

were those all serious statements, Inver?

[dawn stump]

yes

[blazing prawn]

huh

[dawn stump]

I am infact a heathen

[copper compass]

it amuses me how confused people get when they're using nano and I tell them to cut/uncut

they're like "WHY IS IT CALLED UNCUT?"

[wicked flicker]

[heavy knot]

how to quit vim

[uncut oxide]

:q

[blazing prawn]

when I was doing my short stint of system adminstration work I feel like using nano would have been a nightmare

[wicked flicker]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLbfqZBL8t8

I hope this wasn't too off-topic

I mean it's on-topic technically

[blazing prawn]

let's keep the memery to a minimum for the time being

[heavy knot]

exiting vim is hard we need guides and speedruns for this 😮

[vague silo]

No but really, @dawn stump, can you customize nano? I never really looked into it.

[dawn stump]

@blazing prawn the truth is I don't actually use console text editors anymore, given that everything goes through git nowadays, I don't remember the last time I used either nano or vim

[heavy knot]

dont think so

[vague silo]

I also don‘t recall nano having syntax highlighting, but maybe I just didn‘t enable it

[heavy knot]

nano is rly simple

[blazing prawn]

I see

[heavy knot]

its okay for mobile

like on termux

[blazing prawn]

nano definitely has at least limited highlighting

[heavy knot]

maybe it did i cant remember 🤔

[clever raven]

I've never seen it highlight anything

but maybe there's a feature there. deep down.

deep inside its heart of hearts.

[heavy knot]

you have to buy it dinner first

[blazing prawn]

back when I used it in school it always highlighted my py and html files

[clever raven]

yeah, a nice dinner. that'll loosen the features.

[copper compass]

Nano does have syntax highlighting

[blazing prawn]

maybe it's a distro dependent configuration?

[copper compass]

It has to be enabled

[dawn stump]

ubuntu definitely ships a version with some basic highlighting, but it .. what gdude just said

[vague silo]

ah

[clever raven]

man

I never knew

[vague silo]

same

[clever raven]

this channel is paying for itself in dividents already

I'm learning so much

[heavy knot]

not sure learning about Nano is valuable 😂
best to never use it

[delicate gorge]

did you know that with :set spell spelllang=en_us you can get a spellchecker for vim

[vague silo]

yes, but i dont recall wanting a spellchecker in vim

[sacred cedar]

I use nano for small edits on remote servers but I wouldn't use it for real development :P

[vague silo]

idea‘s spellchecker is nice, but i find it to be annoying most of the times

[heavy knot]

remote servers can have vim though instead of nano

[copper compass]

Yeah it's for small edits, the idea checker is nice once you add the false positives to the dictionary

[sacred cedar]

They can, and if you know vim that's great. But I'm lazy haha

[vague silo]

of course, when you‘re writing line 1300 of your AbstractMisterBeanFactory class, i can see it being helpful in finding typos

thats probably true

[heavy knot]

if you're writing something like that,
best to take it to IDE rly

[delicate gorge]

what if i like my headless openbsd systems

[heavy knot]

then you can be a meme 😄

[delicate gorge]

i know people from some security companies who do that

[wicked flicker]

I never needed vim

[delicate gorge]

then youve never used git from a terminal

[heavy knot]

some people like the old ways

[wicked flicker]

@delicate gorge ? what

[delicate gorge]

oh its not about the old ways

[wicked flicker]

of course I have. I just use nano to edit my commit messages, or a graphical editor

[delicate gorge]

ewww

they actually like all aspects of openbsd

[heavy knot]

a r c h

openbsd is fine TBH I used it in VM for a while

can have hardware driver issues

if u have weird hardware

[kind bough]

zsh is cool

i like ranger too

[heavy knot]

Whats ranger

[sullen moth]

a keeper of a park, forest, or area of countryside.

[mint briar]

@heavy knot https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Ranger

[heavy knot]

ty

[lapis hazel]

ah yeah i had that page open but i forgot to send it here for you haha

[heavy knot]

Lol

[vague silo]

https://dev.to/gabeguz/git-bundle-2l5o very interesting

[heavy knot]

I don't do advanced git LOL

[vague silo]

i probably don‘t even know half of git‘s commands and I use it daily

There‘s some website that generates manpages that look like git manpages but are just random nonsense

[heavy knot]

its bad I should learn

im lazy

[static cedar]

I'm not even sure of syntax for common commands

You dont really need it

[heavy knot]

I'm not sure of the syntax of anything ever
I look things up a LOT

[static cedar]

As long as you know what the main commands do, i.e. pull, push, fetch, commit, add, rm, rebase, branch, checkout

you can do things fine

[heavy knot]

ye i know those

[static cedar]

then for the most part, you are gucci

bot.xkcd("git")

oh we dont have that command yet

tsk tsk, someone get on it

[heavy knot]

I'm trying to get better at CI

[static cedar]

Oh yeah I know nothing about CI

It's not my job

I let someon else worry about it

[heavy knot]

now that Gitlab has some CI built in
that's a nice way to start I guess

[static cedar]

I think its important for me to draw a boundary between my job and someone else's job because I have a bunch of things to learn and my skills would be better improved learning something else. Not to say I'll be completely ignorant of CI or something, but its not really going to help me and someone else will be responsible for it anyway

Though now that I think about it, engineering companies might have non-existent devops policies

Whoops

[heavy knot]

you want to work in engineering ?

I guess electrical ?

[static cedar]

Mechatronic engineering. Hopefully in robotics R&D

Either the electrical bits or the software bits

Or control

[heavy knot]

ah okay nice

engineering can be tough

[static cedar]

no more than programming :P

[heavy knot]

lol

[dense ingot]

Hi guys! Is there a coprehensive rewue of all tools that may make life easier for newbies like me? I tried to look for a pinned messages but haven't find anything 😦

[forest bay]

bot.tags.get("resources")

[rancid schooner]

resources

It can be difficult to know where to begin when you are first starting out with Python. On our website, we have compiled a list of both free and paid resources that we recommend for learning and mastering Python.

It is hard to say exactly where you should start, as everyone will have a different prefered method of learning, but whether you like video tutorials, books or courses, you should find a suitable resource on our resources page

[wicked flicker]

@dense ingot ^

[dense ingot]

Thanks! @wicked flicker

[wicked flicker]

Thank @forest bay but sure 😃

[smoky slate]

I can't seem to find a pycharm theme I like. Looking for something along the lines of city lights from atom if anyone has a suggestion. https://github.com/Yummygum/city-lights-syntax-vsc

[copper compass]

editor colour schemes can be entirely customized

I personally use the material theme

[smoky slate]

I'm not really sure what i'm doing, or I might just customize it all myself lol

[copper compass]

Themes cover the entire application

Colour schemes are just in the editor

[wicked flicker]

@smoky slate check out material theme

It has many different colorscheme presets which look good

There are also options to make it look more compact

[smoky slate]

@copper compass @wicked flicker Thanks!
Material Darker is pretty decent 😃

@wicked flicker What do you mean by compact?

[wicked flicker]

There's a settings section for the theme, it allows you to reduce the padding between items

For example in the tree view

I hate it when it looks so bloated

[smoky slate]

Cool, thanks! Will have to play with the settings some 😃

[wicked flicker]

[modest pollen]

can some1 just send me the IDLE link? to type python codes? or IDE.. i dun remember the name exactly

download link?

[hidden quail]

IDLE is bundled with Python, but it's not great

[modest pollen]

umm

[stable cloak]

Mu-Editor would be a better way to go

[modest pollen]

so what should i use?

im just a beginner

[stable cloak]

I'll get the link, one sec

[hidden quail]

https://codewith.mu

[heavy knot]

VS Code or Pycharm

[stable cloak]

Not if they're a beginner, cake

[heavy knot]

why ?

[stable cloak]

Because there's so many other things you have to figure out with it, when they should be strictly focusing on learning to code first

One thing at a time

[heavy knot]

VS Code is just a text editor though
its not an IDE like Pycharm

[hidden quail]

VSCode is fine if you have some experience with programming already, but an editor like Mu will be better for someone who's new to programming

[stable cloak]

^^

[sacred cedar]

IDLE is probably perfectly fine for the beginner. Easy to write, run, and test in

[stable cloak]

Mu is that much easier and cleaner looking

[hidden quail]

Not great for testing

No line numbers

[sacred cedar]

IDLE?

Shows line number when you click on a line

[stable cloak]

And only then

[heavy knot]

line numbers are important I think

[barren iron]

What about

[sacred cedar]

Sure, but it's not terrible to use

[barren iron]

Sublime

[stable cloak]

But there are better beginner alternatives

[sacred cedar]

*banned

[barren iron]

It's pretty basic

And then

You can change it later

[stable cloak]

Mu and Thonny are the two I suggest to people

[heavy knot]

Sublime is fairly similar to VS Code I think

[hidden quail]

Sublime and VS Code are great for people who are familiar with programming concepts

[sacred cedar]

Mu looks nice

[hidden quail]

Or even basic command line skills

[stable cloak]

The less that people have to deal with their editor when they're just learning, the better

[hidden quail]

I like VS Code myself personally

[sacred cedar]

I prefer just VS

[stable cloak]

Remember what it's like to be a beginner guys. Too much at once can be intimidating and can cause people to give up entirely

[sacred cedar]

Derp we just scared him probably lol

[stable cloak]

Or he clicked the link and went on his merry way, either way

[sacred cedar]

True

[heavy knot]

I didn't know about Mu or Thonny, they do look very friendly

[stable cloak]

Yep

[modest pollen]

so should i go with the Mu thing?

[stable cloak]

I used Thonny for a long time, and Grey introduced me to Mu. I try to keep an eye out for beginner stuff, since that's where I like to help people the most

I would say yes, Fox

Mu is a good place to start

[modest pollen]

but why can't i download?

it says beta servers?

[hidden quail]

You can still download it

[stable cloak]

You can also install it via pip

[hidden quail]

Just scroll down to the Windows Installer

[modest pollen]

oh

[astral vector]

self.unsubscribe()

[stable cloak]

@astral vector Please try to keep bot commands in #bot-commands to reduce clutter

[astral vector]

i just figured that out thank you

[copper compass]

decided to go through the default nanorc

not bad!

[hidden quail]

Pretty

[heavy knot]

https://www.zapcc.com/

somewhat unrelated but i thought you guys would find this useful

it's pretty amazing

(to give a comparsion, gcc took 17 seconds to build a project of mine; zapcc took 3-4)

[dawn stump]

wow, that's interesting

[copper compass]

doesn't that only speed up recompilation?

rather than initial compilation

the site uses cookies but has absolutely no dynamic content

there's almost no info on it either

[heavy knot]

it's on github

[copper compass]

okay, yeah, they have another page which is a little less misleading

[heavy knot]

also that

it's pretty fascinating though

[copper compass]

they have 3 read more links that link to an FAQ

and that page redirects back to the homepage

[heavy knot]

that's weird

FAQ used to work

https://www.infoq.com/news/2018/06/zapcc-caching-cpp-compiler-open

'Similarly, on incremental recompilations, Zapcc can be up to 50x faster than Clang. '

[copper compass]

also I will say this has only passing relevance to this server

since C modules

:P

[serene sandal]

can we get variable explorer in vs code

[blazing prawn]

from the thread you pulled your image from,

just in case it wasn't clear that the VSCode team will not be extending this functionality themselves any time soon

[stable cloak]

Couldn't find any plugins when I looked around.

Not with good reviews, anyway

[copper compass]

Really odd request

VS Code is an editor

If you want features like that, you need an IDE

[heavy knot]

if you want heavier features
a text editor is a bad choice ye

[atomic nexus]

is there a tool that converts poorly formatted code to pep8?

[heavy knot]

well the problem would be parsing the poorly formatted code

its hard to parse code when you don't know what format it could be in

its like trying to parse HTML, very reee

[copper compass]

yapf

[lost rock]

Yet Another Parser Failure? 🤔

[copper compass]

Haha

I don't use it

But mart apparently likes it

[heavy knot]

parsing is big headache

[heavy knot]

this is becoming a go-to for many: https://github.com/ambv/black

i strongly disagree with the "only double quotes" decision but it's otherwise solid

[lost rock]

I use " only.

[copper compass]

black is awful

you can't configure it

and it doesn't match a lot of what we like about our styles here at pydis

[uncut oxide]

You can though

[heavy knot]

the non-configurability is its selling point though
philosophy is "write your code however you like, but let us normalize it"

and there are a few config things here and there yeah

i like to configure everything

[copper compass]

I mean I also don't like things that format my code for me

[uncut oxide]

Did they remove the config-- oh

[heavy knot]

isn't a linter a better idea

read black's README

or yapf's

oh it's in yapf's

Most of the current formatters for Python --- e.g., autopep8, and pep8ify --- are made to remove lint errors from code. This has some obvious limitations. For instance, code that conforms to the PEP 8 guidelines may not be reformatted. But it doesn't mean that the code looks good.

[kind bough]

control alt r 👌 pycharm we good

[copper compass]

I agree with flake8 for the most part

[hollow swan]

I think there is a balance between linters, and what they do

some like linters to be super configurable in their control

some like it to just work and set whatever standard

[uncut oxide]

We can't forget the elephant in the room

[copper compass]

the linter that uses every other linter available?

[uncut oxide]

No matter if you follow a style guide or not your code won't actually change

[copper compass]

well yeah, it's about style

[heavy knot]

🤔

[uncut oxide]

Yes

[heavy knot]

poor style can like
cause future bugs

[delicate gorge]

The linter that uses every other linter

[uncut oxide]

@kind bough it's ctrl alt I

[delicate gorge]

You mean snekcheck? @copper compass

[kind bough]

oh sh

true

[copper compass]

yeah

I do

lol

[hollow swan]

there are a whole lot of them

coala is one more that brings unified linting to multiple languages

[copper compass]

That actually sounds kind of interesting

[hollow swan]

well its a hard problem to solve to bring that unified configuration that works for every linter across all languages

[woeful cobalt]

hey so i was interested in getting a new set of screwdrivers?

I'd like them to have some sort of neodymium magnet in the base so all the attachments are magnetic

I'm also interested in something that has pretty much all the bits required for tech repair etc

but a must have is a torsion bar of some kind

[heavy knot]

[woeful cobalt]

Chrome Vanadium is a requirement.

[copper compass]

go to the off-topic channels

you're not original

[heavy knot]

rekt

[dawn stump]

'hammer' was literally the first word i this channel :D

[woeful cobalt]

"For discussing editors, IDEs,...."

[kind bough]

Vanadium 🤔

[woeful cobalt]

Just saying if you're splitting channels...

¯_(ツ)_/¯

[heavy knot]

what]

its not for physical tools

[copper compass]

no.

:P

[dawn stump]

xD

[kind bough]

🤔 Chromium-vanadium steel (symbol Cr-V or CrV; 6000-series SAE steel grades) is a group of steel alloys incorporating carbon, manganese, phosphorus, sulfur, silicon, chromium, and vanadium.

[dawn stump]

goodnight guys o/

[kind bough]

bloated

[copper compass]

\o

[woeful cobalt]

Nn Inver

o/

[heavy knot]

Nn Inver

[copper compass]

Go to off-topic, you gon' get muted

[kind bough]

Nn

what

[woeful cobalt]

Genuine question now.

What's the actual advantage of pycharm pro over basic?

[heavy knot]

templates for Django and Flask etc

[woeful cobalt]

I've been using it at work for 2 days now and it feels the same while doing some flask shit

or am I too basic?

[heavy knot]

https://www.jetbrains.com/pycharm/features/editions_comparison_matrix.html

[kind bough]

pycharm pro remote interpreter

[heavy knot]

supports some extra stuff

[woeful cobalt]

Not sure what it supporting it means.

That's my point

Autocomplete stuff?

[heavy knot]

I think so ye

[kind bough]

thats in community too... no?

ohhh

[heavy knot]

for JS ?

[kind bough]

hm not sure

but probably a plugin to do it anyways

[heavy knot]

probably not

I doubt they would put their paid functionality into a plugin

[copper compass]

pro supports tons of web stuff, yeah

like non-python stuff

html, js, css, all that jazz

[heavy knot]

SQL also

[kind bough]

i meant someone elses plugin

[copper compass]

right yeah, you have the whole database integration stuff

[woeful cobalt]

hmmmm

[copper compass]

docker/vagrant support

[heavy knot]

but jetbrains make a seperate IDE for databases, which is better

[woeful cobalt]

i guess i need to open some other projects and check it out

oooooh

docker support

[kind bough]

yea

[heavy knot]

they have an IDE called Datagrip
that you can run alongside Pycharm

[kind bough]

the fancy stuff

[heavy knot]

for DB work

[copper compass]

remote debugging

[kind bough]

remote anything

deploy etc

[woeful cobalt]

docker api i assume

rather than file

[copper compass]

it supports deployments and stuff too

[woeful cobalt]

okay, guess i just need to explore it more

[heavy knot]

for front end Webstorm is gud

[copper compass]

pycharm pro supports everything webstorm does

[heavy knot]

react and Vue project templates ?

are you sure ?

[copper compass]

try it

[heavy knot]

ook

[heavy knot]

no Vue reeeeee

at least it has react I guess

[heavy knot]

ah okay nice

thats good then

may as well just use that and not webstorm then rly

[clever raven]

@lost rock I'm saying the full VS, at least Visual Studio C#, used to be 2000% worse.

they've really cleaned it up

[heavy knot]

Visual Studio used to be a massive bloat-bomb

you can get a leaner install these days

[clever raven]

not just can, the one you get if you just go to the website and get community edition or whatever is really impressive compared to, yeah, the "bloat-bomb" it used to be.

[lost rock]

I used VS for C# in early 2016 for a month or two

was not bad

[copper compass]

I remember using Qt and C++ back in.. uh..

jeez, like.. 10 years ago

[lost rock]

but I never got back to C# development after that internship, so...

[heavy knot]

Qt existed 10 years ago?
I had no idea lol

[copper compass]

and Qt Creator didn't work so I found some thing that added Qt Designer to VS

but VS's intellisense was shite back then

had to keep deleting the intellisense file

[clever raven]

I think the JetBrains C# IDE is almost definitely better, though. Rider, is it?

[heavy knot]

some C# people really praise intellisense

[clever raven]

Ryder?

[lost rock]

didn't try it

[copper compass]

Ryder? yeah

there's also resharper

[lost rock]

They.... that ^

[clever raven]

I used the resharper plugin with visual studio

[copper compass]

which is a jetbrains extension for VS

[clever raven]

and it's fantastic

but ryder comes with it

and it's not free for VS

[heavy knot]

while we are here...
what for Java?

I guess intellij ?

[clever raven]

IDEA? yeah

I mean.. can't really go wrong with jetbrains

[heavy knot]

I bought a big fat java textbook for this summer

[clever raven]

they make quality shit. but also all their IDEs are pretty similar

if you like pycharm, you'll like the others.

[copper compass]

IDEA is great for java

I've used it

[clever raven]

they're all basically just modules for IDEA

[copper compass]

the Android SDK is based on it

[mint briar]

yeah, pycharm pro is good for basically everything I do, not just Python

[heavy knot]

ye i love pycharm so IDEA should be gud for me

[clever raven]

should be.

[mint briar]

a brilliant IDE

[copper compass]

yeah I could never dump pycharm

it's just so integrated into my workflow now

as an IDE should be

[mint briar]

[clever raven]

wow lennythonk

[heavy knot]

👍

[clever raven]

wow, Aperture

[mint briar]

finding invite

wait you're already in that server

[lost rock]

[mint briar]

This isn't #ot0-psvm’s-eternal-disapproval or #ot1-perplexing-regexing or #ot2-never-nester’s-nightmare

[kind bough]

zsh 👌

[lost rock]

u started

[mint briar]

no u

[lost rock]

[mint briar]

ByteCommander, stop getting so personal. That is not a nice thing to say.

[copper compass]

geddouddahere

[lost rock]

GDPRdude, stop getting so personal. That is not a nice thing to say.

[haughty stratus]

hello guys anyone knows how to insert tables into jupyter notebook?

[forest bay]

VScode now supports portable mode: https://code.visualstudio.com/docs/editor/portable

Standalone executable you can dump on a flash drive or whatever

[blazing prawn]

ooooooooh

[forest bay]

Also drag and drop from explorer into vscode

[heavy knot]

Is Pycharm the best IDE for python?

[blazing prawn]

it's a subjective matter, but PyCharm has as pretty exceptional featureset that it's difficult to find anywhere else

[heavy knot]

I know its real-time code error checking.

And that's nice.

[copper compass]

PyCharm is the best IDE if what you want is a fully-featured toolset

[sharp marsh]

What do you guys use for visualisations? Right now I'm only in need of static graphs, but it would be nice having something more powerful, maybe interactive for the future.

I'm kind of tiredof matplotlib and its API. I've heard good things about bokeh, Altair, and seaborn.

What's your favourite package and why?

[static cedar]

Matplotlib is the most powerful option there is

It's API is alright

Not the best but it could be worse

I use MATLAB when I really get tired of it

[heavy knot]

I haven't used Altair
but I use bokeh, seaborn and matplotlib loads

Seaborn has a fairly good looking style out of the box

and bokeh can do some really pretty things

you might want to check out R and JS visualisation libraries

D3.JS is cool

[heavy knot]

so in the python ide that comes pre installed with python, you can check variables after the code has run.. how can i do this in visual code

[delicate gorge]

First, the thing you call IDE ( i assume you are referring to IDLE) is not an IDE its an editor (a bad one)
Second, what IDLE can easily be imitated by running the code with python -i mysript.py from a command line

[heavy knot]

thank you

[smoky slate]

Just trying out VS Code, been trying to find an editor/IDE I like. So far it seems awesome. I feel conflicted saying that about a Microsoft product..

[spiral pendant]

VS code is really nice

I use the debugger in PyCharm too much to swap but it’s nice to make quick edits on files

[smoky slate]

What about the VS Code debugger is not sufficient for you?

[spiral pendant]

Doesn’t support remote interpreters afaik

[smoky slate]

Ah, okay. Well, development of VS Code seems very active - hopefully they will keep it up 😃

[forest bay]

I haven't tried using the PyCharm debugger yet

Really should one of these days

[clever raven]

it's great

[deep estuary]

I like pdb

[kind bough]

tmux > screen

[static cedar]

Not even a competition, you're right

[glossy talon]

yeah tmux is better than screen

plus the name actually makes sense

[heavy knot]

ye tmux is good

[glossy talon]

c:

[forest bay]

Tuxedo Mux

[glossy talon]

:P

[forest bay]

pudb is cool if you're on Linux

https://pypi.org/project/pudb/

[glossy talon]

ooh

[weary fulcrum]

@crystal depot pycharm is great

it does have it's on env support, so you can install packages into the app itself, and run them without the need of a separate env folder or set up

[crystal depot]

that seems to be on by default on macOS unless i turned it on somehow on accident

is each project it’s own env?

[weary fulcrum]

but it does not have support for all the packages that you may want to install. So, sometime you may want to run a seperate env

[crystal depot]

i’ve never messed with virtual env (i think that’s what it is called)

[weary fulcrum]

yes, and no

you can have different packages run for different projects

[crystal depot]

i’m worries it’ll complicate what i’m doing but it does seem nice to not have random modules installed at a system elvel

oh, i see

[weary fulcrum]

it helps alot

I have used atom, and many different ides

[crystal depot]

i noticed that it makes a separate folder in the root of the project and the project is pretty large size wise because of it, is that normal?

[weary fulcrum]

I settled with pycharm, personally, but you will have to choose what works for you

it creates a physical folder?

[crystal depot]

i think so, let me check

[blazing prawn]

I've never used PyCharm, but the workflow it supports is extremely common for Python development. an entirely separate environment for every single project

[weary fulcrum]

are you referring to the .idea

?

[crystal depot]

venv folder

[weary fulcrum]

oh

[crystal depot]

which has a bin, include and lib folder

[weary fulcrum]

ok, that makes sense

see ^ lucy's response

you can opt to have your own env folder, or you can use that one.

[crystal depot]

I see

I thin I might need to change my repo behaviors then

[blazing prawn]

virtualenvironments are about as important to Python work as pip itself

[crystal depot]

because a sample project with barely any code is 20mbs now

and normally i just sync my whole python folder to my repo

as like a backup, which I guess is not the intended way to use it