questions-2

[plush pelican]

Auf Google Maps bekomme ich keine Treffer in Hamburg für "spanier viertel"

[nova sparrow]

Google Maps?

[plush pelican]

erst in Bremen

[nova sparrow]

Naja, warte...

[plush pelican]

Liegt es dem Hafen gegenüber?

auf der anderen Seite des Flusses?

Oder ist das das Portugiesenviertel?

[nova sparrow]

OHHH, Du hast völlig Recht, es ist eher das PortugiesenViertel 😱

[plush pelican]

Man lernt nie aus, insbesondere, wenn man sich an etwas falsch erinnert, 😄

[nova sparrow]

...

Naja, im Portugiesenviertel war ich ein paar Mal Essen, als ich in Hamburg war, es ist in der Nähe des Hafens, aber nicht unbedingt direkt am Hafen...

[plush pelican]

Und was zählt als "der Hafen"?

das Portugiesenviertel ist so ungefähr im roten Bereich

Ich nehme an, das alles südlich des Flusses mit den Kanälen ist "der Hafen"

[nova sparrow]

Da kann man wieder ein Fass aufmachen, aber, das Portugiesenviertel liegt nicht direkt am Wasser, also auch nicht am Hafen...

...

Also, ich hätte ja gesagt Hamburg Landungsbrücken und Umgebung... aber ich bin in Hamburg auch nur Besucher....

... bin ganz gesoannnt auf HalbHorst's Antwort....

Ich erinnere mich an eine Sache: es gab (vielleicht auch gibt es sie noch) eine Hafenrundfahrt von Landungsbrücken nach Finkenwerder zurück zu den Landungsbrücken, was als eine Hafenrundfahrt galt (nicht die kommerzielle)

...

[timber yacht]

[schön kurz!]
Es gibt 2 Arten von "Hafen", einmal den Fracht- oder Containerhafen, einmal den Hafen mit den pittoresken Fischerbooten im kleinen Urlaubsort.
Wenn man vom Hamburger Hafen spricht, meint man wohl meistens nicht die Landungsbrücken, sondern das abgezäunte Riesengelände.
"Am Hafen" benutzt man für den abgezäunten Containerhafen eher nicht. Mir fällt keine gute Verwendung ein.

Das Hotel liegt direkt neben dem Hafengelände.
Wir wohnen direkt am Hafen.
Unser Wohngebiet liegt direkt neben dem ~~am ~~Hafen(gelände).

Wenn man aber in einem kleinen Fischerort Urlaub macht, sind solche Sätze normal:
Wir waren gestern Abend noch auf ein Glas Wein unten am Hafen.
Unser Hotel lag direkt am Hafen.

[timber yacht]

Muss bei Finkenwerder immer an die Guppys denken von Airbus.

[nova sparrow]

Der Hamburger Hafen ist dafür zu untypisch, weil es da alles mögliche gibt: Containerhafen, Überseehafen, die Werften...

[timber yacht]

Wenn ein Hafen ein zugänglicher Hafen ist, spricht man eher von "am Hafen". Wenn es ein quasi industrielles Hafengelände ist, eher von "neben dem Hafen".

Könnte man das so fassen?

[nova sparrow]

@plush pelican : it's not too easy...

so, for Hamburg: from Landungsbrücken to Finkenwerder (there's quite a ride)...

[timber yacht]

Ist vielleicht auch keine "reine" Hafenrundfahrt, sondern eine erweiterte. 🙂

[nova sparrow]

Ja, aber die (normale) Hafenrundfahrt ist auch nur für Touristen.... 🤔

[pearl dome]

Ich sage immer falsch, über eine nicht richtige Antwort zu sagen
Kann ich etwas außerdem sagen? Falsch fühlt mich nicht sehr richtig an.
"A war die richtige Antwort, also B war die falsche Antwort"
"Ach nein, das war die falsche Idee?" (Zu sagen "That was the wrong idea" Auf Englisch)
"Oh ich verstehe, ich war falsch. Es tut mir leid" (Zu sagen "I was wrong" Auf Englisch)

[jovial nest]

can i get a roll please i wanna leaern german

[sly flare]

Can I also get a roll please? I would like to access VCs

[willow socket]

Ich lag falsch

[viral ibex]

what's he saying? there's a snowstorm and he's showing the way to safety but I can't make out the words lol

[dense obsidian]

Schnell, beeilt euch!

[viral ibex]

tyvm

[fervent kernel]

In der Pubertät entdeckt man sich selbst.

Does this mean he found out that he has puberty

?

[midnight cedar]

In Puberty you discover yourself

You learn more about who you are

[fervent kernel]

Oh its one of those sentences with deep meaning gotcha

Thanks

Er entdeckte, dass es ein magisches buch war= he discovered it was a magical book correct?

[jaunty flame]

Du = You

[fervent kernel]

Oops i mean er

[jaunty flame]

Okay. Yeah your translation is correct ^^

[fervent kernel]

Sie tauchte ein in neue abenteuer

Means she dived herself in new adventures?

[jaunty flame]

Although add -e at the end of entdeckt, since it's in past tense

[fervent kernel]

Also the « ein » i tought it was a

[fervent kernel]

?

[viral ibex]

This is "Da seid ihr ja alle. Kann ich ja lange suchen", right? Can't make sense of that last sentence. Is it some figure of speech

[delicate tiger]

Da kann ich...

[viral ibex]

yes, forgot the da

still can't make sense of it

seems off if i take it literally

[frigid perch]

what how can "Kein Thema" mean "no problem"? Thema dosnt mean problem

[balmy axle]

as in "not a topic that would cause any problems" or sum like that

[neat badge]

just like "no worries" in english, you dont have any worries

[cursive moss]

like "not an issue" in english

[kind crag]

Because not everything can be translated literally

Why do we say raining cats and dogs? It isn't raining ACTUALLY cats and dogs

Albeit not the best explanation, you can't just translate things literally from one language to another

[smoky raven]

in a sentence in which a noun is given 2 adjectives (blue small house), is only the second adjective declined?

[plush pelican]

no, both adjectives are declined, and they take the same ending

Das blaue kleine Haus

The exception to this is if the first adjective is actually modifying the second one, meaning that it's actually acting as an adverb. In that case, the first one isn't declined, because it's not an adjective at all there, but an adverb.

Das unglaublich große Haus
the unbelievably big house
NOT: the unbelievable house, the thing that is unbelievable, is how big it is. "unglaublich" is modifying "groß"
Note also the -ly, indicating an adverb.

[smoky raven]

The adv. modifies the adj. in relation to case and gender of the noun?

[plush pelican]

no, not "modify" in terms of changing case or gender

"modify" meaning just like, you start out with

das große Haus
the big house

Then you want to modify "groß", you want to change "big" a bit
So you say "das unglaublich große Haus" the unbelievably big house

So "unbelievably" is sort of giving more information on the "big" part--the house is not merely "big", it is "unbelievably big"

and the "unbelievably" is changing the "big"

"unglaublich" is changing the "groß"

[smoky raven]

Dankeschön :)

[frigid perch]

i think i found the longest informal sentence ever. ,,es ging ja schon mal ganz schön hoch hinaus". Does it mean "it went good" or is it more than that?

[fair scaffold]

What about a tall building?

[icy flax]

Analyse the context. Who said that and in what situation?

[spare depot]

Hallo

[frigid perch]

someone did some quest stuff and finished it despite it being a challange

[icy flax]

So the very thing u said. They expected it to be harder

[steel meteor]

Hallo

[rigid isle]

faq anki

[stoic mauve]

Anki

What is Anki?

Anki is a free and very versatile flashcard program that is often used for learning new vocabulary. You can import spreadsheets to quickly create your own flashcards, and you can add your own images and audio for highly custom flashcard decks. You can also access and use a wide range of community created and shared flashcard decks all for free*.

Note: Anki uses a method of learning called spaced repetition. Flashcards and spaced repetition are one of many techniques used for language learning. However, we all learn differently and while these methods work for many people, they may not necessarily work for you. Give it a try, but don’t be disheartened if these methods aren’t right for you. Even if flashcards and spaced repetition work for you, don’t forget to incorporate other forms of practice. E.g. try using your new vocabulary to write your own practice sentences.

Where To Get It

It is available here on PC, Mac, Linux, iPhone, and Android. You can also find the browser AnkiWeb version here.

Manually adding basic cards is quite simple, but making custom templates is a bit more complex. Basementality has put together this handy guide for making custom card types and decks. You can also find Anki’s documentation / instruction guide here.

*The iPhone app AnkiMobile costs $24.99 USD on the iTunes store. The Android app and all other platforms are completely free. The mobile browser version of AnkiWeb is still available for free on iPhones.

See the next page for some helpful tips on creating your flashcards.

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[rigid isle]

@raw estuary Es wird schwer für mich, um dich in deutsch zu erklären. Was ist eigentlich "Anki" . DESHALB können Sie hier rausfinden.

[latent wadi]

its from nh

for some reason nh means n ne and nen now

[teal cliff]

its kind of hard to translate lol, what exactly is confusing you?

[viral ibex]

hmm i would like to know what it conveys?
i mean if i translated it in english like "oh there you are, i can look for long there" it doesn't really say anything, they come across as two disconnected phrases ahah so I'm guessing it's a figure of speech that conveys a specific meaning and "mental image" i guess

also thanks for answering I thought that message was buried by now xD

[teal cliff]

its more like »well then i couldve looked for you guys for a long time without finding you«

but it omits a few of those words (it makes sense without them in german)

[autumn marsh]

if you translate it literally:

there you are (surprised conclusion 'ja') all of you, in this case (=under these circumstances) looking for you for a long time would've been futile

[silver rampart]

Hallo

[autumn marsh]

imagine you're looking for something, finally you ask a friend, they take it from a place where you didn't expect it or where it's not supposed to be (depends on context), so you say:

ach da ist es! da kann ich ja lange suchen / da könnte ich ja lange suchen (both variants are semantically identical)

ahh there it is, under these circumstances (= the thing being in a completely unexpected place) I could've been looking for a long time without finding it

it's just very idiomatic and translating it literally to English is very awkward

[viral ibex]

yeah, it makes sense now though. Thank you both!

[nova sparrow]

👋

[nova sparrow]

Hallo Emma, hattest du eine Frage, oder wolltest du nur mal schauen, was im Chat so alles los ist?

[main temple]

What do you guys think about those "German for Dummies" books? Is it quality? should i avoid it? if so, is there something better?

[plain umbra]

The stuff I've seen from it has mostly been bad, and I would personally say most of the popular textbooks are better options.

[pearl dome]

Ich putze jetzt meine Zähne oder Ich putze mir die Zähne und warum

[whole portal]

Geht beides

[rain talon]

Can someone explain the difference between liefern and ausliefern?

I see many verb that have a particle added but keep the same translation, I don't understand

[neat badge]

im guessing ausliefern means that it left us but we dont know when it's gonna arrive, liefern is rather for shorter deliveries, ausliefern can also be used with bigger deliveries like bulck or raw materials for example

[lusty osprey]

You can use 'liefern' for almost anything, but I’d recommend not using 'ausliefern' for shorter deliveries.

Native speaker here

[teal cliff]

You can also ausliefern someone

but you can't liefern someone

[maiden yacht]

Man kann ebenfalls jemandem ausgeliefert sein

Oder einer Sache ausgeliefert sein

[teal cliff]

The meaning changes in this case ig

[maiden yacht]

Ist aber was anderes

[teal cliff]

Oh yea

jemanden ausliefern jemandem ausgeliefert sein

Lol

[plush pelican]

to be at someone's mercy?

Do "jemanden ausliefern" and "jemandem ausgeliefert sein" different meanings?

For "jemanden ausliefern" I see "to turn someone in"
for "jemandem ausgeliefert sein" I see "to be at somebody's mercy"

[teal cliff]

times like these make me doubt german is my native language

🤣

ja ist im endeffekt das selbe das eine ist halt passiv, oder liege ich falsch?

[teal cliff]

warte

ja eh so

warte to be at somebodys mercy

[plush pelican]

The German definitions seem much closer than the English translations

[teal cliff]

ja genau

so hätte ich das jetzt erklären versucht

schön langsam fühl ich mich muttersprachenlos lmao

[plush pelican]

Ich verstehe nicht völlig, was hier "Gewalt" bedeutet

authority?

Das ist so etwas wie, die Person ist ein Polizist und du bist jetzt unter seiner Kontrolle, er hat dich womöglich festgenommen?

[maiden yacht]

power, control, authority

in etwa

[rain talon]

And it makes me doubt I'll ever actually speak it 😪

From all the answers I feel that liefern is a rather short physical delivery and "ausliefern* is a very long physical delivery or the abstract idea of being given to someone

Would you agree ? @teal cliff @maiden yacht

[maiden yacht]

https://www.dwds.de/wb/ausliefern#d-1-1

check the usage cases

that should clear it up for you

[teal cliff]

hm.....

you probably should not trust me on that one

[teal cliff]

also yes you'll speak it one day if you keep studying :}

[teal cliff]

They're in a more powerful position than you are.... that's what that means IG?

Ich englische nicht gerade

Bin zu müde, sorry

[plush pelican]

Das Problem ist, dass die englische Übersetzung eigentlich etwas leicht Anderes vermittelt. Ich glaube, die englische Übersetzung ist nicht unbedingt akkurat.

Wenn du sagst, "He's at your mercy", bedeutet das nicht, dass du Polizist bist und er unter deiner Kontrolle steht. Es ist eher, "Er ist machtlos gegen dich. Du kannst ihm alles antun, er kann sich selbst vor dir nicht schützen."

Zwar kann das passieren, wenn du ein Polizist bist, aber es kann auch einfach sein, dass du vorübergehend die Kontrolle hast, weil du zum Beispiel eine Waffe hast und er nicht.

Daher kam meine Verwirrung.

[dawn oxide]

Yea doesn't have to be authority. Du kannst zB auch dem Feind ausgeliefert sein

[plush pelican]

Ach so!

Dann ist es doch näher dran, als ich dachte

[rain talon]

Moin an alle. 👋
I am watching this YouTube video https://youtu.be/YfhrHmhWj3E?t=13m10s
I have a question about what is said around the time code 13:10

For context this is a super short Reportage about going to the proctologist. In this section, one of the YouTuber is being examined for the first time. He and the doctor (woman) exchange these words

👩‍⚕️ Wenn irgendwas nicht passt, weh tut...
🧑 Ist unangenehm aber tut nicht weh
👩‍⚕️Gut, hier ist eine kleine Wunde wahrscheinlich
[kurze Stille]
👩‍⚕️Ist doof, ne ?
🧑 Ja ist richtig doof !
👩‍⚕️Versuch mal dich zu entspannen

I don't understand what "ist doof" mean here.
Surely they don't mean that the medical exam is stupid. So what then ?

[full socket]

The medical procedure is uncomfortable. "doof" dosen't only only mean intellectually stupid, but in a broader sense it refers to something that is perceived as "bad". "blöd" also works like this, by the way.

[rain talon]

Oh ok
So the doctor is saying "this feels bad right?"
A bit surprising but okay

[full socket]

The doctor is showing empathy. Like "I know this is uncomfortable and I'm sorry for that, but you have to get through that." And he's like " tHE FuCk it is."

[rain talon]

I see!

Thank you so much for explaining it to me

[fervent kernel]

Du würdest wahrscheinlich eine/n Lerntpartner/in im #1065443550004781067 finden.

[summer isle]

wie kann ich sagen, dass meine Katze ein mann ist? Der Katze ist falsch, ja?

isnt it weird that you have to refer to your cat as a female oder was

[plush pelican]

There is "der Kater"

[summer isle]

oo, danke.

[plush pelican]

Alternatively, you say the name, at which point it becomes obvious that it's a "he", and then you refer to it by its name

[charred harbor]

It’s not weird at all

In the case of Katze the noun is feminine so you use feminine pronouns, but it’s irrelevant to whether the cat is actually male/female unless you go out of your way to specify and German speakers know this, so for all intents and purposes it’s no different to saying “it” in English

[summer isle]

achso

[abstract shuttle]

what's the best learning platform for german other than duolingo? i would say this in german but i don't know much and google translate isnt always reliable

[plain umbra]

Duolingo is not really recommended since it doesn't teach well.

But this website is popular.

faq nicos

[abstract shuttle]

ok thanks

[plain umbra]

Sorry the faq is not working. Here's the link instead: https://learngerman.dw.com/en/nicos-weg/c-36519789

[abstract shuttle]

i think i understand what you mean now, because the website taught me different things than duolingo did.. duolingo usually said "und du?" so i just thought it was always that but nicos weg says "und dir?"

[plain umbra]

Yeah, whether it's du or dir depends on the question you're asking. It should match the full question.

Woher kommst du? -> Und du?
Wie geht's dir? -> Und dir?

[abstract shuttle]

alright, thanks

[frigid perch]

Do you say ,,Es ist DURCH ein Tischtuch bedeckt"?

[delicate tiger]

works, but "mit einem" is more common

[untold cradle]

Hi, i write music and i'm doing a medley of volkslieds, one of them is Westerwaldlied, i have heard that westerwaldlied is sorta bad for nazi association, can a native tell me if im okay to use it or not?

this is actually the current draft

[wispy yarrow]

It should be okay

[valid marten]

hello, can someone check some basic sentences i wrote for an exercise?

[plush pelican]

Looks right

Now remember that German doesn't require the subject to be in position 1, so you could write all of those with the object in position 1 and the subject after the verb.

Depending on the verb, that may even be the more common way of doing it

[fervent kernel]

Gut

[valid marten]

danke!

[queen kelp]

Hallo Leute

[short isle]

Hallöchen

[snow tulip]

How am I supposed to know if it's 'in' or 'nach' voor Geographical names in German? like 'in die Niederlande' and 'nach Berlin' or is that just memorization?

[dawn oxide]

There are some countries that always have an article in front like die Niederlande, so for those you gotta use in

[snow tulip]

but is there any sort of like pattern in which countries do have an article and which ones don't?

[dawn oxide]

Don't think so, but there isn't that many

https://deutschtraining.org/deutsche-grammatik/artikel/laender-mit-artikel/

[snow tulip]

ah 🫠 i really dont like the nach/an/in/bei/zu situation its such a pain i need to learn that for my test in a week

also with the wechselpräpositionen this is such a nightmare to me

[dawn oxide]

What are you struggling with the most? Maybe someone here can give you some tips on how to study that in the best way

[snow tulip]

it's just remembering the usage of each one, i dont think anyone can help because i do understand it, but there are so many im mixing them up

not to mention that i need to memorize a lot this time (not just for german, but also other tests) so my brain is fried

[dawn oxide]

Ahh I see, understandable 😅

You still got some time till then tho, hope you can somehow memorize it 🙏

[snow tulip]

yeahh hopefully

[grave gust]

Think of far places using nach, like another country. „Ich fliege nach Deutschland“. Exception to this is „nach Hause“. Use In for more relative places, and countries with articles. „Ich fliege in die Ukraine.“ „Ich gehe in die Schule“. Maybe there are exceptions but it’s a good rule of thumb. I hope it helps. 😄

[plain umbra]

Here is a resource for it: https://resources.german.lsa.umich.edu/grammatik/prepositions/#wohin

[frank hemlock]

I was learning about passiv then I came across " Nicht passivfähige Verben". it was written "Das Passiv kann mit fast allen Verben mit Akkusativ-Ergänzung gebildet werden. Mit einigen Verben kann das Passiv jedoch nicht gebildet werden. Dazu gehören fast alle Verben, die im Perfekt mit dem Hilfsverb "sein" gebildet werden. Es gibt noch weitere Ausnahmen."
But then they gave a list of nicht passivfähige verben. I was able to understand most like Verben der Fortbewegung and Verben der Zustandsveränderung.But it said " Die Verbgruppe mit "sein"' are also nich passivfahige. There are many many verbs like that and are'nt akkusativ one of them .I don't know anymore. May be I am confusing myself by mixing things. But please help me understand it better

[signal cipher]

The verbs which you make past tense with sein instead of Haben.

Which are generally movement and changing state verbs.

[rain talon]

Hello. Is someone able to explain why Fremde is in Nominativ and not Akkusativ?

To me the subject of the sentence is Der and Fremd is a object, no?

He is what? : einen Fremden

[plush pelican]

what case does "sein" want for its object?

[rich prism]

sein doesn’t take accusative

[rain talon]

I never knew that 🤯🤯🤯

Thanks for your replies

It's quite crazy how long I've studied German and still I learn stuff like this only now...

[rich prism]

It’s ok, it happens lol

[frank hemlock]

can you please explain a bit more?

[rich prism]

It’s embarrassing how many basic grammar rules I’ve come across and realised I don’t know

[signal cipher]

We say: Ich bin gegangen
Not: Ich habe gegangen

Some verbs use sein in perfect tenses as auxiliary verb, some uses haben. You should memorize which verb uses which auxiliary verb.

[plush pelican]

To be clear, in the photos, when they say "verbgruppe mit sein", they list "bedeuten" and "darstellen" as examples, neither of which use "sein" as a Hilfsverb

[signal cipher]

Are they wrong or don’t I know something

[plush pelican]

so that's not what "Verbgruppe mit sein" is talking about. I'm not entirely sure what it actually is talking about; maybe something about copula verbs, where the subject = the object? except "bedeuten" and "darstellen" aren't copula verbs, I didn't think? 🤔

[signal cipher]

But verbs which use sein as auxiliary can’t be used in passive. It fits.

[rich prism]

But they listed bedeuten and darstellen

[plush pelican]

Again, the examples listed were "bedeuten" and "darstellen"

Those don't use sein as auxiliary

so that cannot be what they are talking about there

[rich prism]

Maybe it’s a mistake

[plush pelican]

I don't know what they mean by this "Verbgruppen by sein", but it's not simply "verbs that use sein for a helping verb"

[signal cipher]

Do they mean verbs which include sein?

[plush pelican]

how does "bedeuten" include sein?

[signal cipher]

Like copula verbs. Do we use bedeuten with nominative?

[plush pelican]

no, that's the thing

bedeuten takes an accusative object, and uses "haben" for its helping verb

This is why I don't know what it's supposed to mean

[signal cipher]

She should use another source then. This source is not clear.

[frank hemlock]

Thanks for your response! I get what you’re saying, and honestly, it’s making me unsure too. I’ll definitely check out another source to clear things up. Really appreciate you pointing that out!

[viral ibex]

I'm aware you wouldn't use such a construction to indicate possession in a formal text, but I thought it was really colloquial, so since I found it in a videogame I'm wondering if it's just informal but still perfectly correct grammatically or if it's the character speaking very informally

[plain umbra]

It's not always colloquial. Like the most known one is that it's common to use it for body parts or clothes. I'm sure you've seen that before. For example, "ich putze mir die Zähne" or something like that. I can't really comment on this specific sentence in the screenshot and how it sounds, but just pointing out that whether it's used formally or not depends on the exact sentence.

[viral ibex]

Interesting, I hadn't realized that phrases like "ich putze mir die Zähne" were using this construction... I thought "putze mir" worked as in "performing the action of cleaning on myself" + "the teeth specifically", because that's how it works in my native language. I didn't know the "mir" here indicated possession.

[plain umbra]

Yes, it's the dative possession grammar.

[dawn oxide]

It's grammatically correct and like a figurative expression (?) not sure what to call it exactly, but you can also find it in the duden here

[plain umbra]

mir die Zähne = meine Zähne

[dawn oxide]

You wouldn't use this while writing a formal text or something

[viral ibex]

If I had read that one I would've thought that was genitive, since that would still be "der" for Polizei... Instead this figure of speech always uses the dative? Like, it would always be "dem" for a m/n noun?

[viral ibex]

Thank you

[viral ibex]

I guess maybe the fact that "der Polizei" comes before "in die Falle" indicates that it's using the dative possession? Or can the genitive also switch around positions like that?

[viral ibex]

tried looking dative possession up to have more info about it but couldn't find much, there are a few reddit threads where some people bring up the body parts examples but this one guy claims that for those instances it works similarly to what I had originally perceived it as... any insight?

[plush pelican]

I've seen muehsam around the r/German subreddit a lot, and they have a lot of very strong opinions that not everybody agrees with.

I personally think the usage of "Ich putze mir meine Zähne" is actually because of influence from English. Almost all Germans under 30 have an enormous exposure to the English language because of English language social media like TikTok and YouTube. My theory is that they mix the German system of possession and the English system of possession when they do such sentences.

[plush pelican]

One thing I can tell you: there is in fact the "Dativus ethicus", where you use dative case to indicate who is (emotionally) impacted by an action, and that can be completely independent of what cases a verb demands.

[viral ibex]

Yeah that's why I'm asking back here, what he's saying makes sense to me but since I've now seen people claim both sides, the more insight i get overall the better

[plush pelican]

https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alienabilität

[viral ibex]

Ah that's useful, it's the name for what he's referring to here right?

in the mir ist schlecht specifically

[plush pelican]

Here's another interesting page

It talks about German treating possession differently depending on "internal" versus "external" possession

[plush pelican]

No, I think the dative in "mir ist schlecht" is somewhat different

Neither the dativus ethicus, nor the weird categorisation that he's coming up with.

[viral ibex]

thank you for the material🙏

[viral ibex]

oh okay, it felt similar in concept, gonna read on the dativus ethicus more in depth then

[plush pelican]

There's a whole group of "free datives", of which "dativus ethicus" is only one subcategory

https://grammis.ids-mannheim.de/terminologie/2028

Idk how far in the weeds you really need to go here

How much all this will help your German learning

At some point it's more linguistics than language learning, 😅

One interesting note:

Here, they say that one could interpret the sentence as either dativus ethicus (put on the cap for my emotional benefit) or as the Pertinenzdativ (the dative of possession) (put my cap on)

[viral ibex]

not much i'd reckon, i'm just a bit pedantic by nature lol, but I'm not interested in the most hidden minutiae because languages aren't sciences so often the deeper you go the shakier it gets where even linguists aren't totally convinced of why some things would work the way they do and that's totally over my level, that said I generally like having a clear mental picture of what a sentence conveys and the two suggested usages of the dative here suggested two different pictures

[viral ibex]

interesting

anyway both this one and the one about internal/external possessions would be suggesting that the dative here is indeed signaling possession (of the hat or body parts) rather than the receiver of the action (putting the hat on/cleaning body parts)?

[plush pelican]

?

I just said that they said that, without further context, you could interpret the sentence in both ways

[viral ibex]

Okay so I thought, sorry I still struggle reading technical texts so I need to double check

[plush pelican]

this is the trouble with German: modern German only has 4 cases, which actually cover what like 1000-2000 years ago used to be way more cases

so one "case" often actually covers several different uses

Honestly, I wouldn't worry about the details here

Just know when something demands dative, and make sure to spend a lot of time reading/listening to sentences in German to get used to the language

[viral ibex]

yeah if there's no clear cut answer I guess that's as far as it goes, thank you for your help

[viral ibex]

i think i might be wrapping my head around this one a bit better but I'm not sure if i'm actually misleading myself... i get that it might not be a 1:1 but does it feel a bit similar to saying "don't you go and... on me" in english?
Like the second example could loosely be "don't go and fall down on me, said his mother"?
I just couldn't help but notice how both examples are phrases where one commands someone else to not do something and I'm not sure if the dativus ethicus is mostly used under these same circumstances

[plush pelican]

Yeah, I think it's something like that

[viral ibex]

I like this site, and I think this https://grammis.ids-mannheim.de/terminologie/1148 answers my original question as well... So yes with the body parts and all it is indeed mainly considered to be showing a connection/belonging in these cases and not strictly indicating the receiver of an action, though from what I see in the notes there isn't an all encompassing agreement on it. Still, good to know

[plush pelican]

Like I said, muehsam has their own way of categorizing things, which they strongly defend, and which a lot of others don't agree with 😅

[viral ibex]

that's also good to know, since i do go looking for things on that subreddit from time to time xD

[signal cipher]

I asked that before. They said in German dative can be used to mean for possession only for clothes and body parts. Because you can use dative to mean possession for everything in Bulgarian. Also there is Dativus Ethicus. To mean for own enjoyment, carelessly etc. And I study on one more side usage of dative in Bulgarian but I couldn’t understand that yet. They use masculine dative short pronoun like Dativus Ethicus but I still couldn’t understand the meaning.
I imagined possession like this:

I prepare my tea.
I prepare tea to (for) myself.

I am the one who will drink tea. So it’s my tea and it’s to me (for me). I am the target of the tea.

The tea which is for me is my tea. They both end up in same target.

But this is just my guess. I don’t know technically.

[stiff wave]

Hello good people, i am learning German for almost one year. i had done from A1 to b1 level course from online, that was not much effective. I had lackings understanding the grammar concepts. So i started going through a grammar book called ' Grammatik Aktiv' from A1-b1 . that i found really helpful . There are only few chapters left. i had done all the Übungen from each of those chapters. Now the problem is i want to have a strong knowledge of all of those grammar topics mentioned in Grammatik Aktiv {as i intend to go for B2}. which is not possible by just completing the book only for once. Now what should i do to have those silly grammar topics in my fingertips ? ( Thanks for being so kind )

[rich prism]

You can do another workbook, practice writing and get it corrected to see if you really understood the topic

[valid marten]

hello, I am wondering what tense the verb “beschreibe” is in here: “Beschreibe was du an einem Wochenendtag machst! (ca. 100 Wörter)” (it’s from a homework prompt)

[rich prism]

imperativ ig

[valid marten]

but i thought imperativ would be "beschreib"?

[rich prism]

Mine says beschreib(e)

And that the one with e is colloquial

[valid marten]

i see, thanks! what resource are you using to check this by the way?

[rich prism]

Netzverb Wörterbuch

[hasty basalt]

Hello. I have the A1 exam tomorrow and I would love to get some doubts clarified about the Schreiben letter/e-mail

Should I leave a line blank between die Anrede and the base of the text and with der Gruß and the base of the text?

Should der Gruß have a comma?

[delicate tiger]

Sehr geehrte Damen und Herren,
können Sie mir ein Angebot zuschicken...

Mit freundlichen Grüßen
Directing

[hasty basalt]

Wow, no line skip after "Sehr geehrte Damen und Herren," ?

Only before Mit freundlichen Grüßen?

[delicate tiger]

you can put one there, but it's unlikely to make any difference either way in the grading

[hasty basalt]

Gotcha. And no comma after Mit freundlichen Grüßen either, I see.

Vielen Dank

[dense obsidian]

yes. https://www.din-5008-richtlinien.de/startseite/geschaeftsbriefbogen/

"Nach der Anrede folgt eine Leerzeile."

"Die Grußformel setzen Sie mit einer Leerzeile zum Brieftext ab. Soll nach der Grußformel noch der Firmenname oder die Bezeichnung der Behörde genannt werden, wird diese mit einer Zeile Abstand zur Grußformel platziert."

[hasty basalt]

Thanks!

[hexed bronze]

How does one convert this sentence to one in the passive voice? "In diesem Klub tanzt man am liebsten." (I can't do it in English!)

"The best dancing is done in this club."

That's not a "faithful" translation, is it?

"In diesem Club wird getanzt."

That doesn't quite capture the entire meaning of the original sentence, right?

So I give up (for now).

[rich prism]

In diesem Club wird am liebsten getanzt.
I think

[hexed bronze]

thanks. I considered that version, but Google and DeepL didn't like it much, offering only versions in the active voice

[rich prism]

I think it’s unnatural

Maybe that’s why

[hexed bronze]

What's unnatural, the "am liebsten" part?

The original sentence doesn't have an accusative object, so perhaps the machines behind the translators convert such sentences into ones in the active voice. perhaps it's their default setting.

My book says that in such cases, I should use the "Es wird" construction.

[rich prism]

Yeah

[rich prism]

I don't really know

[hexed bronze]

It seems unnatural to me as well.

[dawn oxide]

wait are you trying to say the best dancing or am liebsten? lol cause that's quite different

[hexed bronze]

This is the original: "In diesem Klub tanzt man am liebsten."

[dawn oxide]

oh well then it's correct

[hexed bronze]

This is correct? ----> "In diesem Club wird am liebsten getanzt."

[dawn oxide]

yea

[hexed bronze]

ok, good. But now the question whether it's normal, natural German??

[dawn oxide]

It is, but that whole sentence just sounds a little awkward, you wouldn't rlly say that people like dancing in this club the most or would you? Ive never said that before or heard it from anyone so thats probably why it feels a little awkward

so I guess it doesn't rlly sound "natural", at least to me

[hexed bronze]

wait are you trying to say the best dancing or am liebsten? lol cause that's quite different

You're right. Now I'm confused because I don't know what "In diesem Klub tanzt man am liebsten" means precisely! I see two possibilities: "Dancing is the most popular thing in this club" or "This club is the most popular place to dance". The meanings are different.

[dawn oxide]

well yea it actually can have two meanings lol that's maybe also why it feels a little akward cause Idk what exactly it means, it can either mean People like dancing the most in this club or in this club people like dancing the most 😅

[hexed bronze]

ok thanks

[jade hawk]

Ich war wirklich eine Niete in Geschichte - Heißt das "Ich war schlecht, was Geschichte angeht"? Eine Niete in etwas sein - to be bad at something? Dativ nach "in"?

[plush pelican]

How do you convert any sentence from active voice to passive voice?

The answer is:

• You search for any accusative object, and then make that into a nominative subject.
  Ich esse den Apfel.
  Der Apfel wird gegessen.

• Any previous subject from the active sentence is either dropped, or optionally you can reinsert it through a prepositional phrase, usually starting with "von".

Ich esse den Apfel.
Der Apfel wird (von mir) gegessen.

• The verb goes from just being the main verb (essen) to being a conjugated "werden" + the Partizip 2 of the main verb (gegessen).

Ich esse den Apfel.
Der Apfel wird gegessen.

• You have to remember that certain verbs cannot be used in passive (https://mein-deutschbuch.de/nicht-passivfaehige-verben.html).

---

Here, we don't have a proper subject, but instead "man". "Man" is already a quasi-passive, equivalent to "one", as in "One does not simply walk into Mordor." That means we can pretty safely discard the subject entirely, not worrying about reinserting it with "von".

There is no accusative object, meaning there is nothing that can become the new nominative subject. This is completely acceptable. Not all passive sentences have a subject, interestingly enough.

I believe papierherz's sentence is correct.

[hexed bronze]

Thanks, and the link was helpful, too!

[plush pelican]

P.S.--dative objects remain dative objects when switching from active to passive:

Ich helfe dem Mann.
Dem Mann wird geholfen.

There is no accusative object here, so there's no subject in the passive sentence, just the (still) dative object.

[visual ocean]

findet ihr das logisch? Oder sollte ich schreiben usw.

Ich bin mir nicht sicher, ob ich gut darin bin, durch schreiben zu lernen
ich suche einen Weg, schneller Wortschatz zu lernen

Hinzu ich mache manchmal Beispiele Sätze um zu lernen

[maiden yacht]

<@visual oceanwillst du die methode bro

[visual ocean]

ja

[maiden yacht]

Nun als erstes würde ich dir empfehlen den "Close Deletion" Kartentyp zu benutzen und beide Seiten auf Deutsch zu schreiben @visual ocean

Im Endeffekt hast du einen Lückentext (oder mehrere Lückentexte oder vielmehr Lückensätze) auf der einen Seite und die Definition des Wortes/der Redewendung auf der anderen

So wie du es jetzt machst ist mMn nicht optimal

Da du dir dadurch eher das türkische Wort einfallen lässt als das Deutsche

Verstehste was ich meine

Anki soll beim Sprachenlernen idealerweise gewährleisten dass dir Deutsche Wörter einfallen wenn du sie brauchst

Bzw. im Gespräch, beim Schreiben, usw usf

[visual ocean]

Ich verstehe aber bin mir nicht sicher ob ich dafür gut genug bin aber wenn es möglich ist, werde ich jetzt so machen

[maiden yacht]

Probier es doch mal aus

Der Beispielsatz soll dir beim Erinnern an das Wort helfen

mach einfach ein paar Karten in diesem Format und schau ob du das hinbekommst

[visual ocean]

Ich werde ausprobieren! dankeschön 🙏

empfiehlst du, dass ich mit dem App ankidroid weitergehe?

oder mit den Papieren usw

[maiden yacht]

also Karten würde ich eher auf dem Laptop /PC erstellen

aber üben kannst du problemlos mit der Ankidroid App

weil es auch bequem ist

kannst überall üben

[plush pelican]

Es heißt "cloze deletion", oder?

[maiden yacht]

Joa

Auf gut Deutsch halt Lückentext

[runic citrus]

When is it recommended/okay to use Konjunktiv II sein? I have a Schreiben exam to prepare for and I see it is used a lot in some examples. (Ping me pls)

[plush pelican]

https://chatterbug.com/grammar/german/subjunctive-konjunktiv-II

[limpid edge]

Okay I still struggle sometimes with adjectives v adverbs when declining so I’d like it if someone could make sure I got this right.

In the sentence: „Im neu gewählten Bundestag sitzen weniger Frauen als Früher.“

Neu is being used as an adverb right? Equivalent to saying the newly elected parliament , rather than the new elected parliament?

And it’s being an adverb is shown by the fact it isn’t being declined right?

[willow socket]

yes and yes

[limpid edge]

Sweet! I swear not even hard drugs can beat the sheer euphoria of asking a German question and being right 😂

Thanks!!

[robust cargo]

nice website danke

[viral ibex]

why does affe become affen with the genitive?

[plain umbra]

Affe is a weak noun.

faq weak nouns

[stoic mauve]

Weak Nouns

Weak nouns are called this way because they receive the same endings as adjectives inflected with weak endings. They take an additional ending -n in every case except nominative singular. This is also known as N-Declension and affects almost exclusively masculine nouns.

Nominativ: der Junge, die Junge__n__
Genitiv: des Junge__n__, der Junge__n__
Dativ: dem Junge__n__, den Junge__n__
Akkusativ: den Junge__n__, die Junge__n__

Some nouns end with a suffix -en to make the pronunciation easier:
der Mensch, den Mensch__en__

‼ Das Herz is the only non-masculine (neuter) noun with N-Declension❣

So how do we recognize these nouns? We can divide them into 3 big groups:

1. nouns of Greek and Latin origin,
2. nouns ending with -e (most of these refer to people or animals),
3. other random German nouns (Mensch, Herr, Student, Nachbar, Prinz etc.)

Another way to divide the groups could be:

1. nouns denoting male beings in general (der Bauer, der Knabe, der Herr, der Junge, der Kunde etc.)
2. nouns indicating nationality or religious affiliation (der Chinese, der Russe, der Türke, der Jude, der Katholik, der Protestant)
3. nouns designating male beings and ending in the foreign suffixes (-ant, -arch, -ast, -ege, -ent, -ist, -oge, -om, -oph, -ot: der Kollege, der Student, der Psychologe, der Polizist, der Philosoph)

‼ der Käse and words ending with -ee aren’t weak nouns.

Genitive of Weak Nouns
You might have noticed from the examples above that weak nouns don’t have the additional -s in genitive like other masculine nouns.
Some exceptions are das Herz and nouns of group 3 that don’t refer to people nor animals (Name, Wille, Glaube, Buchstabe etc.), which take both the -n and -s endings.
Example: der Name, des Name__ns__.

[viral ibex]

oh thank you

[plush pelican]

I've been playing Warhammer 40k: Rogue Trader, with German text.

Along the way, I've come across some sentences that are clearly translation errors with missing words, but others idk if they are actually wrong or just something whose grammar I don't understand.

Like this picture: I really don't understand the grammar of this sentence. It looks like "jeder" is the subject and then there are 2 accusative objects, "ganze Planeten" and "einen Fertigungs-Superkomplex"? Or maybe "einen Fertigungs-Superkomplex" is a part of the "für" prepositional phrase?

But then the verb is "stellen" plural, which you can't do plural verb with "jeder", right?

Can anyone break down this sentence (assuming that it's grammatically correct) and explain what's happening?

Hmm, could "ganze Planeten" be (Plural, Nominative), so the subject? But then where does "jeder" come into this?

Here's another one where they use "verstehen". Is that a valid use of "verstehen"? Using it to mean something like, "the lens was steeped in the power of the arch-enemy"?

[plain umbra]

I think here the "jeder für sich" is an idiomatic phrase being used like an adverbial? As in, the way in which they are doing it is a "jeder für sich" way.

jeder für sich = each man for himself (or something like that).

[plush pelican]

How do you even translate the sentence?

@plain umbra ban time

[plain umbra]

So like, the main sentence is this:
Ganze Planeten stellen einen Fertigungs-Superkomplex mit unermesslicher Kapazität und Macht dar.

[plush pelican]

Whole planets represent (in themselves?) an assembly-supercomplex of unmeasurable capacity and power.

[plain umbra]

So I think the simplest translation is to add in "each".

Entire planets each represent ...

DeepL gives that phrasing.

Maybe it's clarifying that each planet is independently doing that? As opposed to the collective doing it as a united thing.

[plush pelican]

Another one: Is this missing a "von", or can you do "welcher Art" like that?

[plain umbra]

I can't confidently say much about the interpretation, just the structure.

[plush pelican]

In the Warhammer 40k universe, these industrial planets are each one giant factory, basically

[plain umbra]

Yeah, so I think the "jeder für sich" is just making it clear that each one independently is representing that idea.

[plush pelican]

Seems plausible

[willow socket]

That’s fine, it’s genitive “of which type”.

[plush pelican]

And then here, I would have assumed that you need a "dass" before "sie mir etwas Neues".

Can you do that?

[willow socket]

Yes you need dass

[plush pelican]

lol, forgot the "zu" in the first Nebensatz, it's actually an Infinitivsatz

[plain umbra]

I guess my question would be, rather than it being correct or not, whether it sounds like how someone would speak, since it's dialogue.

[plush pelican]

also an interesting question

[plush pelican]

This usage of "verstehen", tho

[willow socket]

Is wrong

And no, I don’t think anyone would speak like that unless they were supposed to be speaking with mistakes

[plush pelican]

I found more or less the English text for the passage about the lens:

You can do multiple different types of checks to reveal the same information, so I think this is worded slightly differently.

[plain umbra]

Well yeah, that's the point of my question. Some "mistakes" are normal things in spoken language even if they are wrong in written language.

People drop necessary words pretty freely when speaking with complicated sentences with mixed clause types and so on.

[willow socket]

I’m not even sure how to fix the lens one. Then only grammatical fix that springs to mind is to add a “zu”

Zu verstehen

But idk how or if that translates to imbued

Omg no

It’s Versehen

Duh

[plush pelican]

It's everyone's favorite game: Is this a translation error, or some new bit of German lore dropping? 🤣

[willow socket]

Simple typo, and Versehen translates perfectly

[plain umbra]

Verb versehen though, right? Not the noun?

[plush pelican]

Btw: Rogue Trader has so much text to read. 🥵

It's basically like reading a choose your own adventure book, with some tactics-based fights in-between

[willow socket]

Yes verb

[plush pelican]

@willow socket Did you agree with Base's interpretation that "jeder für sich" is an adverb and means "each", like "Whole planets each represent an assembly-supercomplex of unmeasurable capacity and power"?

[willow socket]

Yes each planet represents an assembly supercomplex with immeasurable capacity and power

[plush pelican]

Okay, last question:

"derer"

"von Valancius" is a noble house in this universe

how do you translate "derer" here?

[willow socket]

Any context?

[plush pelican]

The flagship of the dynasty of those of (house) von Valancius?

It's also used here

It's a sci-fi world, talking about a space ship owned by the head of the house of von Valancius

You take over this ship after the previous owner dies

[willow socket]

My guess is that you’re right and it’s some fancy way of referring to the members of house Valencius

[plain umbra]

I found a similar example in dict.cc

[willow socket]

But I’m not 100% sure on the grammar

[plain umbra]

the von Hohenstein family das Geschlecht {n} derer von Hohenstein [geh.]
the castle of the von Hohenstein family das Schloss {n} derer von Hohenstein [geh.]

[willow socket]

Yeah just like that

Does geh mean gehoben?

[plush pelican]

"Geschlecht" here being the word for a noble house

[plain umbra]

Ja.

[plain umbra]

Ja.

[plush pelican]

The house (of those) of Hohenstein

My God, it seems like it's an incredibly specific usage tied to talking about noble houses 😵‍💫

[plain umbra]

Nice.

Fancy speak.

[plush pelican]

https://tenor.com/view/simpsons-unpossible-gif-5110385

Thanks for the help, y'all @plain umbra @willow socket

[plain umbra]

Thanks for the cool sentences. It's fun to parse weird things.

[plush pelican]

Play Rogue Trader, you'll be parsing things like crazy, 😄

(but a good amount of the time, it will be actual errors...)

I never grew up playing games in a non-English language, so idk if this is a quality level of translation that Germans are simply used to, or what

[plain umbra]

I think it depends on the type of game and who it's targeting. After all, Germany itself has a lot of game developers.

I've definitely seen people play games on YouTube before where they are native speakers and don't like the German translations, but at the same time, I've seen a lot of games with good German translations as well.

I guess there's also the difference of correctness vs good writing. Some are translated correctly but lack the nuance and emotion of the original.

[plush pelican]

I'm talking straight up errors, xD

A word got dropped accidentally, things like that

The game is a lot of text, so I guess they didn't pay to go over everything with a fine-toothed comb.

[plain umbra]

Ja, I think that is just common in general for localisations.

And probably some developers will keep fixing as time goes, while others won't bother.

[timber yacht]

Regardless of spoken or written language, the dass is clearly missing.

[nova sparrow]

to me this looks like a typo and should be "versehen" (equipped with) 🤔
you found it already (imbued)

[snow tulip]

does anyone know a website or something where I can practice wechselpräpositionen? I understand the theory, but actually putting that into practice is difficult 😅

[plain umbra]

https://www.nthuleen.com/teach/grammar.html

[lofty gull]

Hat jemand ne Idee, wie man diese Aussage nominalisieren könnte? "Die Mühe hatte sich gelohnt"
Ich rate "Der Lohn der Mühe" aber hier ändert sich die Bedeutung, nicht? Hilfe

[wispy yarrow]

Also “ Die Mühe hat Lohn gebracht” ist das einzige, was mir einfallen würde, aber das klingt sehr seltsam

[plush pelican]

By itself, not sure, it would be just the beginning of a sentence

Die Belohnung(?) der Mühe... (war ihr von Anfang an klar, oder was auch immer)

Oft wenn man einen Satz nominalisiert, wird es zu einem Teil eines Satzes

Dadurch werden zwei Sätze im Verbalstil zu einem Satz im Nominalstil.

[snow tulip]

Thank you!

[lofty gull]

Die Belohnung der Mühe - als die Belohnung für die Mühe - schließlich hatte sich die Mühe gelohnt.
Ja, ich mag das besser, keine Ahnung ob es Sinn ergibt, aber klingt doch gut. In jedem Fall passt besser als "der Lohn"

[nova sparrow]

Ich bin nicht sicher, ob das in Richtung deiner Frage geht:
Das war die Mühe wert!

[plush pelican]

"sich lohnen" muss irgendwie zu einem Nomen werden

[nova sparrow]

Puh, darüber muss ich mal kurz nachdenken....

[lofty gull]

Mühe wert klingt auch gut

[plush pelican]

Das ist aber keine Nominalisierung

[nova sparrow]

der Lohn der Mühe klingt unnatürlich, das würde kaum jemand sagen.

[plush pelican]

Das ist schließlich ein Adjektiv, "wert"

Etwas ist es wert

[lofty gull]

ja, das habe ich mir gedacht...

[plush pelican]

Was it mit "die Belohnung"?

Zum Beispiel:

Es war ihr von Anfang an klar, dass sich die Mühe gelohnt hat.

Die Belohnung der Mühe/für die Mühe war ihr von anfang an klar.

[nova sparrow]

vielleicht sogar:
... dass ich die Mühe lohnen würde...
aber ich bin nicht sicher ob das "Nominalisierung" ist

[plush pelican]

"lohnen" ist da ja immer noch ein Verb, kein Nomen 😅

[nova sparrow]

schon, aber ich versuche andere Formulierungen zu finden die "natürlich" klingen, Nominalisierung hin oder her.... 😱

[plush pelican]

Ich glaube, hier zählt vor allem, dass es Nominalisierung gibt, das Natürlich-sein hin oder her, 😅

[nova sparrow]

Okay, dann spielt es keine Rolle wie außergewöhnlich es klingt 🤷‍♂️
Dann bleibt nur die Frage der Relevanz:
Würde man es so formulieren, bloß, weil man es kann, aber es normalerweise niemand so formulieren würde?

[plush pelican]

Nominalisierung kommt vor allem bei formelleren Texten vor, bei wissenschaftlichen Artikeln oder so

Dadurch lernt man, wie man Informationen dichter übermitteln kann

Bei einem normalen Gespräch kommt sie kaum je vor

Nominalisierung ist eher so B2/C1 Niveau, also fortgeschritten

[nova sparrow]

Gut, aber auch solche Texte sollten sich (zumindest ein klein wenig) am üblichen Sprachgebrauch orientieren. (Finde ich zumindest 🤷‍♂️ )
Natürlich kann jemand in einem "elaborierten" Text Formulierungen verwenden, die die meisten "Nutzer" der Sprache nicht verwenden würden, aber ich bin mir nicht sicher, wie weit solch eine Person vom tatsächlichen Sprachgebrauch abweichen kann, ohne einfach nur "komisch" zu klingen 🤔 .

[plush pelican]

Was ist mit zum Beispiel:

Verbalstil: Ich habe dich dafür belohnt, dass du mir geholfen hast. Daran solltest du dich erinnern.

Nominalstil: Du solltest dich an die Belohnung für deine Hilfe erinnern.

In erster Linie üben wir, wie wir zwischen diesen Stilen wechseln können. Danach können wir das raffinieren und natürlicher machen.

[nova sparrow]

Ähm, Du solltest dich an meine Belohnung für deine Hilfe erinnern... klingt hier präziser, oder?

[plush pelican]

für deine Hilfe, oder?

Aber du siehst schon, wie das geht. Die Idee ist das Wechseln zu üben

[nova sparrow]

Ja, macht auf jeden Fall Spaß

[lofty gull]

Nominalisierung ein heißes Thema 😅 Ich frage morgen(heute Morgen) meine Professorin, was hier gemeint ist. 😇 Ich verabschiede mich und noch ein großes Dankeschön für die Hilfe 💕

[plush pelican]

heikles?

[nova sparrow]

Ich denke das Problem ist, dass man nicht alles einfach nominalisieren kann...

[nova sparrow]

definitiv beides 😉

[plush pelican]

Auf jeden Fall ist es schwierig, vor allem, weil es im Deutschen keine einzige Methode gibt, ein Nomen aus einem Verb zu kriegen.

[nova sparrow]

Du meinst, nicht nur eine Methode???

[plush pelican]

ja

There is no one method to make a noun out of a verb

Es gibt keine ordentliche Methode, wo man die Regeln einfach befolgen muss, um daraus ein Nomen zu gewinnen.

[lofty gull]

gar nicht, aber wie ich sehe, gibt es so viele Möglichkeiten, dass ich einfach überfordert bin xd Verzeihung.

[plush pelican]

Deine Überforderung ist nachvollziehbar, 😅

[nova sparrow]

Dafür musst du sich definitiv nicht entschuldigen, ich finde es immer interessant, ein bisschen genauer hin zu schauen...

[pulsar sand]

Das Lohnen der Mühe / Der Lohn der Mühe / Die Belohnung der Mühe 🤔

[snow tulip]

can someone give me the right answers to these? We got a German mock test sent to us, but no answer key

it's about the wechselpräpositionen (D & E)

[willow socket]

What is it? A school test/assignment?

It’s against the rules to help you cheat. And aside from that, instead of asking for the answers, it’s in good form to give it a shot yourself and ask specific questions or for corrections

[snow tulip]

it's a mock test

it's not for a grade or stuff like that

but i could just dump in a text wall with my answers and let me be corrected not sure if thats against the rules (text wall) but yeah i could

[charred harbor]

There’s actually a mistake on the test

[snow tulip]

1. unserer haus steht neben dem einkaufscentrum
2. ich lache immer über seinen witze
3. du legst die hosen in dem schrank
4. ich sitze zwischen meinem brüdern
5. janna freut sich auf den besuch an paris
6. /
7. ich bin sehr aufgergt über den film
8. an der wänden hängt noch keine Kunst
   Corrections + explanations if I have it wrong? (please dont mind capital letters)

[snow tulip]

there is??

[pulsar sand]

@snow tulip come to voice chat. We will do it together. Np

#1352336481804353546

[snow tulip]

id prefer not to, could you just correct my answers?

[charred harbor]

Question 2 for Aufgabe E is wrong

[snow tulip]

wait how would it be wrong?

[maiden yacht]

die schönen Vögel

[charred harbor]

The “die schöne Vögel” is wrong

[pulsar sand]

plural die schöneN Vögel

[snow tulip]

oh damn

[snow tulip]

are any of these incorrect?

[charred harbor]

A few of them although some of them could be typos

[pulsar sand]

are u coming to vc or no?

[snow tulip]

which ones are? other than the capital letters because i dont feel like it

[snow tulip]

no im not coming to vc

[maiden yacht]

1. Unser Haus steht neben dem Einkaufszentrum
2. Ich lache immer über seine Witze
3. Du legst die Hosen in den Schrank
4. Ich sitze zwischen meinen Brüdern
5. Janna freut sich auf den Besuch in Paris
7. Ich bin sehr aufgeregt über den Film
   8.An den Wänden hängt noch keine Kunst(sic)

[dawn oxide]

You got a lot of the articles wrong actually

[keen night]

tenshi can you come dm real quick?

[snow tulip]

i suck at wechselpräpositionen

[pulsar sand]

nah come to vc one time offer Idc

[keen night]

cant join it says its locked

[pulsar sand]

roles? new account?

[snow tulip]

could you explain to me why 2, 3 and 8 are in akkusativ?

[maiden yacht]

Über usually takes akkusativ if its in the "about" sense

über etw. (akkusativ) lachen

[snow tulip]

oh thats true

[maiden yacht]

über etw. (akk) nachdenken

etc

[keen night]

y doesnt allow me even with roles

[pulsar sand]

prolly cuz u are a new account

[charred harbor]

8 is not Akkusativ

[snow tulip]

what about 3 & 8?

[keen night]

new to server not acc

[dawn oxide]

#getting-started

[maiden yacht]

in DEM Schrank liegen die Hosen : Ich lege die Hosen in DEN Schrank

Movement implied

because you're moving the Hosen from one place to another

[snow tulip]

aaaa i hate the movement vs standing still thing

its so vague to me

[maiden yacht]

An den Wänden because its Plural Dativ

An der Wand

vs An den Wänden

yea that should be it

[keen night]

can you come dm help me with one sentence need a native speaker

[charred harbor]

Same reason it’s “zwischen meinen Brüdern”

[snow tulip]

oh so if it was singular an der would be correct?

[charred harbor]

Yes simply because Wand is feminine

[dawn oxide]

why not ask here?

[keen night]

its kinda private sentence

[snow tulip]

if it was zwischen meinem brüder, would that be correct?

[maiden yacht]

that doesn't quite make sense though

[charred harbor]

That would be incorrect

[maiden yacht]

between my brother

[snow tulip]

oh true

[maiden yacht]

wait

Brüder is plural

but you cant say meinem

[snow tulip]

im stupid i forgot it's bruder in singular

[maiden yacht]

cuz its for singular

[dawn oxide]

what is it about

[charred harbor]

You could say “zwischen meinem Bruder und…”

[snow tulip]

wait i still dont get it

[keen night]

about children in africa

[snow tulip]

okay gotcha

[maiden yacht]

6. should either be Letzte Woche or in der letzten woche

[charred harbor]

Yeah like “zwischen meinem Bruder und meiner Schwester” for example

[maiden yacht]

not sure which one they want

since they want prepositions

een...geleden is "in the last" in Dutch i am assuming

[snow tulip]

we got the clue 'a ... ago' but there isn't a wechselpräposition like that right?

[snow tulip]

yupp

but wouldn't that be von... bis

[maiden yacht]

Letzte Woche is more common

but they prob want you

to write in der Letzten

[maiden yacht]

that would be "from...until"

[snow tulip]

but why? i have to put in a wechsel präposition

[snow tulip]

oops my bad

[maiden yacht]

yea write this

in der letzten

[snow tulip]

oh that makes sense

woche is feminine right? so in der letzen woche is akkusativ?

but that doesnt make sense

[maiden yacht]

dativ

and yes

[snow tulip]

oh mb is woche masculine?

[maiden yacht]

woche is feminine

nope

[snow tulip]

wait what

[maiden yacht]

Dativ feminine is der

in der Woche (Dativ)

[snow tulip]

oh oops i mixed it up

[maiden yacht]

aye

in der Woche, an der Wand

both feminine

[charred harbor]

Oh yeah btw it’s probably worth noting how I put Brüdern here even though the regular plural is Brüder
Plural Dativ forces an -n ending on nouns basically

[snow tulip]

oh thats good to note

[maiden yacht]

yep very important and often neglected

[charred harbor]

Obviously if the plural already ends with an -n then German doesn’t force you to add another one though

[maiden yacht]

As sadistic as the grammar is, it does have its limits

[snow tulip]

for E I have:

• ich schlaf
• siehst du
• victor anfängt
• du lässt
• wir gehen
• ihr liest
• gibst du
• er wäscht
• ihr fallt
• du spriechst

[maiden yacht]

victor fängt an

ihr lest

du sprichst

ich schlafe

in case they are pedantic about it

[snow tulip]

i keep forgetting the ich form is -e damn

[snow tulip]

why doesn't lesen get an i or ie in this tense?

[maiden yacht]

its often left out in colloquial speech but yea

[maiden yacht]

so basically

to conjugate ihr

you get the infinitive of the verb

and add a t

lesen - lest

cut the en and add a t

[snow tulip]

oh crap i forgot the ie/i/ä i only for du and er/sie/es

[maiden yacht]

schreiben - schreibt

works without fail

[snow tulip]

why isnt sprechen spriechst? isnt sprechen with a long E?

[charred harbor]

Not really without fail

Sein is right there xD

[maiden yacht]

sein - seien

cut the en and plop a t at the end of that

t and d is basically the same sound in german

at the end of words

so yea its basically foolproof

[snow tulip]

^ ?

[plush pelican]

er schreibt

er seit?

[charred harbor]

Except that’s wrong so it’s not without fail

You’d be better off just internalising them as “general rules that work most of the time as a guideline”

[maiden yacht]

dont quite see what you're trying to do there

[maiden yacht]

i'd say that t at the end is a constant feature

[plush pelican]

"sein" is irregular in 3rd person singular

You can't just use the standard conjugation pattern for it

[maiden yacht]

if you scroll up a bit you will see that i am talking about conjugating for ihr

[plush pelican]

So you're specifically only talking about when conjugating for "ihr"?

[maiden yacht]

yes as you can see if you scroll up a bit

[charred harbor]

Well ihr seid isn’t ihr seit

[maiden yacht]

its pronounced exactly like that

thats why many muttersprachler make this mistake

because seit is pronounced exactly like seit

Tod and tot

etc

[maiden yacht]

no idea tbh

[charred harbor]

But it’s not how it’s spelt. That’s why I’m saying it’s not foolproof

[maiden yacht]

for all intents and purposes it is

come on

[charred harbor]

Telling a beginner that a conjugation rule is foolproof is dangerous

[maiden yacht]

https://tenor.com/view/salieri-sulking-amadeus-gif-21469263

[plush pelican]

"Anyone who says something is 'foolproof', hasn't met enough fools." 🤣

[maiden yacht]

we're reaching levels of pedantism i never thought were possible

[charred harbor]

Just say it works “as a general guide” or “for the most part”, that’s all I’m saying 😄

[plush pelican]

I think it's worthwhile to simply say, "There is a standard conjugation pattern, but there are also a lot of verbs that differ from that slightly"

[maiden yacht]

"a lot of verbs" such as

once again argus i was talking about conjugating verbs for ihr

you know

[dawn oxide]

not rlly no

[maiden yacht]

as a trick for a newb to remember it more easily

[charred harbor]

There are guidelines for all of them (how to conjugate for ich, du, wir etc) but I wouldn’t recommend anyone to see them as anything more than that tbh

Too much irregular weird stuff

I guess as a complete beginner you’d find that out for yourself pretty quickly anyway

[plush pelican]

https://tenor.com/view/guidlines-pirates-of-the-caribbean-hector-babossa-georffrey-rush-gif-7844913

[unique dune]

not 100% the same but the difference is small

[maiden yacht]

The difference might perhaps be more apparent in dialects

[plush pelican]

Bist du dir sicher, dass du nicht von einem regionalen Unterschied sprichst?

[unique dune]

kann sein dass es da auffälliger ist ja

zumindest wenn man das t etwas schärfer ausspricht hört man schon nen unterschied

[teal cliff]

Sprechen is not pronounced with a long e

[ˈʃpʁɛçn̩]

[plush pelican]

Is it only words with a long e where the vowel becomes ie in 2nd person/3rd person singular?

[teal cliff]

I have no idea. Geben giebst ❌ gibst ✅

Die werden aber lang ausgesprochen

Ge:ben
gi:bst

aber man schreibt's trotzdem nicht ie lmao........

[teal cliff]

I'd need to think of more examples

LOL

[teal cliff]

I can't think of any words 😭

[plush pelican]

Warum hast du dann das erwähnt, wenn du dir nicht sicher bist, ob das die Voraussetzung für IE ist?

[teal cliff]

Ich habs ausprobiert einfach.

:3

[plush pelican]

Was wolltest du ursprünglich damit sagen?

[teal cliff]

Ich kenne nicht wirklich viele deutsche Grammatik Regeln, also probier ich das meistens aus

[teal cliff]

Ich wollte der Person helfen, weil sie ja gefragt hat, ob man sprechen mit einem langen e ausspricht. Ich hab die Regel die erwähnt wurde nicht hinterfragt

[signal finch]

Leute!

was ist das billigste deutschKurse in münchen 😅

können sie mir helfen

[plush pelican]

Ach so-- er/sie hat das mit dem langen E erwähnt. Ich dachte, du hättest das als Erstes erwähnt.

[signal finch]

ich kann nichts finden

[plush pelican]

Im Internet kann man viele absolut kostenlose Ressourcen finden. Das wäre ja am billigsten

#resources

[signal finch]

danke

[teal cliff]

^^

Weißt du denn, ob das eine Regel ist?

ich schätze Mal dass nicht bzw es keine Regel ist lol

[plush pelican]

keine Ahnung

[snow tulip]

anything i got wrong?
(also with explanation when wrong please!)

it's about wechselpräpositionen btw

please correct this one too

[charred harbor]

A few of them are wrong but I think it’s mostly due to grammatical genders honestly

Like neither Glas nor Welt are masculine

Boot also isn’t masculine

I’d recommend dictionary diving more to make sure your grammatical genders are right when you’re not confident, ideally when it comes to grammar you want to limit your problems to only cases

[dawn oxide]

what exactly is the exercise, do you also have to put unbestimmte Artikel? und diese etc.?

[dawn oxide]

these seem to be wrong at first glance, do you want me to tell u the solutions or do you wanna try once more?

[snow tulip]

I just have to put in the correct thing (nominativ/akkusativ/dativ) after the wechselpräpositionen

[snow tulip]

Could you explain why the ones that are wrong, are wrong?

[dawn oxide]

sentence with Glas -> wrong gender (imo it also sounds rlly unnatural, should put unbestimmter Artikel here)
ihrem -> wrong case
der Eisstand -> wrong gender
ihren -> wrong case
auf dem Reling -> wrong gender
auf den Welt -> wrong case & gender

that last sentence also sounds rlly awkward, should be without auf

[dawn oxide]

wrong case + gender

[snow tulip]

I should really look them up in a dictionary 😭 thank youu

I hate the wo vs wohin its always so weird and vague to me

Hopefully it gets better w practice

[dawn oxide]

Im sure it will

[snow tulip]

could it be explained why it's akkusativ/dativ for these?

is it all just figurative speech? (non-literal)

oh, and what was i supposed to fill in here?

[rich prism]

verb + preposition, they come with the case you're supposed to use, it's fixed

[snow tulip]

so it's just memorization?

[rich prism]

Yes

[snow tulip]

i hope it's not on my test lol, memorizing all fixed verbs and prepositions sounds like a pain

[glacial kestrel]

When are you doing your test

And what level is it

[snow tulip]

Next thursday, its at school and im supposed to be between A2 and B1

[fervent kernel]

I am searching for someone to practice b1 speaking

[sage sigil]

@fervent kernel would you like to practice together??

I'm also searching for someone to practice with me

[strange forge]

How do you get access to the voice channels?

[stoic mauve]

@strange forge, please read the Roles section in #getting-started for info on how to join VC and more.

[fervent kernel]

Sure

Sicher

[sage sigil]

You can dm me for planning our session

@fervent kernel

[fervent kernel]

Sicher

[rain talon]

What is the difference between abgleichen and vergleichen?

[plush pelican]

Fingerabdrücke abgleichen = to compare fingerprints to see if they match

Also there's another meaning of "abgleichen"

Setting something to the correct value in order to align stuff electronically

"calibrate"?

[rain talon]

But what is the difference with vergleichen? Is it interchangeable?

[plush pelican]

https://www.reddit.com/r/German/comments/1aqqfhg/vergleichen_or_abgleichen/?show=original

abgleichen is to compare two things and see how they are identical, where the goal often is THAT they are identical. Vergleichen means just to compare.

"abgleichen" is apparently often used when talking specifically about data/information

[brisk bone]

Is there anyone here doing Ausbildung , or interested in doing Ausbildung or knows about it?

[wispy yarrow]

#1033125270217048246

[brisk bone]

Thank you

[balmy spire]

Whats the difference between glauben and denken?

Both can mean “think”

So how do i know which to use?

[uneven leaf]

glauben: believe, denken: think/consider

[frigid perch]

how to you use "halten von" as in i like. "Ich halte viel von dir" "Ich halte von dir" "Ich halte nichts von dir" are they correct?

[flint grove]

yes. "Ich halte viel von dir" would be somthing like "I Like/ Respect you"
and "Ich halte nichts von dir" the opposite (i do not like / Respect you)
"Ich halte von dir" However doesn't make any sense without the specification (viel / wenig / nichts)

it is basically the opinion you have about another person

[jade hawk]

Bedeuten die Wörter "unsereins" und "unsereiner" einfach "wir/uns"? Oder gibt es mehr dazu? "Leute wie wir/the likes of us/our kind"?

[fervent kernel]

Dieses Wort ist so selten, hab's noch nie verwendet.
Anstelle von unsereins hätte ich gesagt: Jemand ist unseresgleichen (= Jemand ist wie wir)

Also es bedeutet nicht dasselbe wie "Wir/uns", denn das sind Pronomen. "Unsereins" ist eher so ein Verweis auf eine Eigenschaft oder eine Beziehung, zumindest in dem Kontext wo ich mir dieses Wort vorstellen kann.

Unsereins bezieht sich vor allem auf sich selbst, wenn man in der dritten Person Singular von sich redet, zb:
"Ich bin Psychologe, unsereins analysiert das alltägliche Verhalten von Menschen."

[jade hawk]

Okay, das ergibt Sinn! Danke

[full socket]

Ja, es wird gerne als selbstironische Bezeichnung für sich selber in der dritten Person verwendet. Aber es kann auch für eine echte Gruppe verwendet werden (all diejenigen, wie wir). Etwas sperrig, aber auch elegant. Bedeutungstechnisch hat es den Vorteil, dass es keine Form von Organisation impliziert. Spreche ich für eine organisierte Gruppe bei welcher ich Mitglied bin - Bsp. der Deutsche Hanfverband - kann ich sagen "Wir als Verband wollen...". Aber spreche ich im Namen einer angenommenen Gruppe - ohne tatsächliche Organisiertheit - kann ich "unsereins" nutzen - z. B. Hanfkonsumenten in der Bevölkerung generell. "Unsereins möchte doch einfach nur..."

[fervent kernel]

mit dem Deutschen Hanfverband als Beispiel hätte ich jetzt nicht gerechnet 😂

[full socket]

Dann ersetze es halt mit "Deutsche Gesellschaft für Psychologie" und "Psychologen als Berufsgruppe generell". Dein Beispiel klingt eher nach letzteren für mich (hier also weniger als Selbstbezeichnung).

[valid marten]

what is the general opinion on using AI like ChatGPT to practice German? currently it’s the easiest and most convenient option for me, but I’ve heard people say that it is not reliable for German. should I trust it (with a grain of salt, of course—but can I mostly trust it?)

[plain umbra]

faq chatgpt

[stoic mauve]

**AI-generated text**

This FAQ explains rules and advice for using text AI tools such as ChatGPT.

🔹 **Server rules regarding this topic:**

• Do not answer any questions by using AI-generated text.
• Do not ask for AI-generated text to be corrected.

🔹 **Problems with using AI for answers and corrections**

• No fact-checking: Tools like ChatGPT are very good at writing texts and often provide answers that sound good, but they are not capable of fact-checking their own answers.

• Fake information: It’s very common for these programs to make up fake or incomplete information, which is explained convincingly but is mostly wrong.

• Non-deterministic: The information is also partially randomly generated, meaning that if you ask the same question multiple times, you will usually end up with different answers.

• No language knowledge: It shouldn't be used for grammar or vocabulary questions, as it doesn't understand linguistics, nuance, or how a native speaker might actually use a given word or grammar point.

• Missing context: When correcting texts it needs to understand what the writer was trying to express. As such it may miss mistakes or correct things that don't need to be corrected.

🔹 **Reasons NOT to use generative AI for learning**

• It delays the development of important skills in language learning.
  Relying too much on AI generated texts or solutions may get in the way of learning the necessary skills of language acquisition, such as how to look up words or phrases in a dictionary, using critical thinking, or actually applying learned concepts.

• AI is not designed to guide learners.
  If you ask an AI a question, it will provide you with information, whereas if you ask a human, they will ideally ask you to show your understanding and offer advice on how to find the answer.

• AI output requires scrutiny
  AI output must be verified, but beginners to German or to language learning often lack the knowledge or experience to do so.

🔹 **Good uses of AI-generated text**

• Ask ChatGPT to come up with some story ideas that you can write about.

[plain umbra]

Read this but the basic answer is no, do not trust it.

This kind of AI can be used for things like completing menial tasks or getting some ideas about something. They should never be used for factual information.

For example, some people use it to do things like reformat a list of vocab so they can put it into a flashcard program. A menial task like that is fine.

[fervent kernel]

As a German, i am very unhappy with ChatGPT in general. 😅 i can not imagine learning German with it!

[rich prism]

Where else should I correct my texts then

[full socket]

I would say, if you want to practice a conversation, it's fine to do so. Talk about anything. But you shouldn't use it for factual information about the language itself and can't expect consciousness of why something is done this or that way.

[valid marten]

what about using it for conversation and telling it to correct my mistakes?

[plain umbra]

Best to get it corrected by a human. There isn't really any other option.

[plain umbra]

No, definitely don't do that.

It cannot correct mistakes.

You can have a conversation, but you should not trust that anything it says is correct.

[rich prism]

where tho

[plain umbra]

#writing-info explains how you can get corrections in our server.

[valid marten]

in this case can I get corrections on a few short paragraphs? it is about a hypothetical day in Berlin.

[full socket]

I mean, it's very good in creating natural sounding language. So it most likely doesn't create something wrong as an answer. But correction is another topic... not every mistake it changes is necessarily actually one. It might just be statistically more common in the data is was trained on. It might just be some output that's different, but just as good. The issue is that this might discourage you, if you think everything you do is wrong. And if both options are just as right, there is no coherence what it sticks to, which may confuse you.

As a genereal rule of thumb, just use it with caution. If you are suspicious, youre probably right.

[plain umbra]

It also just straight up gives wrong info, like saying something is dative when it's really accusative, weird stuff like that.

And also completely missing real mistakes.

So for correction, it just isn't at all reliable.

[rich prism]

Yess I noticed this as well

[plain umbra]

After all, all that a text gen AI is doing is just putting one word after the other to make a text that sounds good. It doesn't "know" or "understand" anything it's writing. It's just putting words down whether it's right or not.

[full socket]

It dosen't get the concept of what a Dativ is. But a sentence it normally outputs probably has the right case in context. It just can't explain it. If you ask about a case, it might want to forcefully insert it because of the question and then creates a wrong output just because of the grammatical question itself.

[plain umbra]

Sure, but even if we are talking about ChatGPT's writing style, it also has a weird style that is slightly different from real humans.

Even if we can say that ChatGPT will output a grammatically correct sentences, I wouldn't recommend anyone to follow that style.

[full socket]

It depends on the level. If you are just a beginner, style isn't even in your scope yet. Everything it does is more advanced than you. But the further down the line you are, the worse it is as a resource.

[plain umbra]

I wouldn't say it's a good resource for any level.

[teal cliff]

Naja ich find's ein bisschen komisch das zwischen präsens und präteritum / perfekt gewechselt wird (im ersten Absatz)

[teal cliff]

, welches "Meet You" heißt. *

[hidden pebble]

#writing-info

[snow tulip]

why is it auf den?

okay i understand why it's akkusativ here but why is it auf?

because you're going to the market and buying fresh vegetables right? so why is it you're going on the market? (since auf is literally on, right?)

[wispy yarrow]

That's just a german thing. "Aufs Amt gehen" also exists, but it doesnt make much sense either

[snow tulip]

ohh okay

what about this one? why is it akkusativ in this case? Because it's not like you're biking outside ofthe city right?

[jade hawk]

in die = into the city from outside
in der = in the city, already inside it

[wispy yarrow]

In wen möchtest du fahren -> in die Stadt

[snow tulip]

isn't the literal translation 'can you also bike in the city?'

so you're already in the city right?

or am i interpreting the sentence wrong

[wispy yarrow]

It's "Do you also want to go to the city?"

[snow tulip]

oh oops

i interpreted the sentence wrong

[plush pelican]

Think of a market as a bunch of stalls sitting on pavement in a town square.

You literally go onto the pavement (step onto it) when going auf den Markt.

[snow tulip]

thats so different than english and dutch (my native language, which is usually similar to german) lmaoo
are there any other 'weird' (weird to non-german speakers) präposition cases like this? (if you understand what i mean, im bad at explaining)

[plush pelican]

Tons, prepositions are particularly random between languages

[snow tulip]

ah damn :') i hope the weird ones don't appear on my german test in 2 days

[fervent kernel]

little fun fact: It is also a German thing:
when i already live in a city, but i wanna go more in the center where all the tourism and shopping happens, i can say: Ich fahre gleich noch etwas in die Stadt.

i typically say this when i am bored and wanna spend some time outside, but not outside the whole city.

Example: You wanna go shopping with me? --> Möchtest du auch in die Stadt fahren und mit mir shoppen gehen?

[jade hawk]

Ist beichten nur in einem religiösen Zusammenhang verwendet oder darf man es als "bekennen" auch benutzen?

[delicate tiger]

kann auch sonst benutzt werden, "Ich muss dir was beichten."

[flat forge]

wenn ich was wie "take your time" sagen möchte, könnte ich "beeile dich nicht" sagen?

[fervent kernel]

= Lass dir Zeit.
"Beeile dich nicht" ist auch ok, würde ich aber nicht sagen wenn ich "Take your time" sagen will

[nova sparrow]

... aber mach dir keinen Stress!...
Lass dir Zeit...

[flat forge]

okay "lass dir Zeit" klingt sehr gut
danke euchhh

[nova sparrow]

Gern geschehen ☺️

[flat forge]

:DD

[rose walrus]

Hello

[viral ibex]

"wir" or "sie"?

[jaunty flame]

Wir sind

[rich prism]

I also hear wir

[viral ibex]

lol good to know i'm not alone
it's supposed to be "sie" but my brain wants to hear it as a "wir"
wanted to know if the audio is unclear or if my ears just aren't trained enough

[kind crag]

Wtf that's a poorly said "sie"

[viral ibex]

ye

[plush pelican]

How do you know it's "sie"?

[plush pelican]

What's that?

[viral ibex]

Assimil book

[limpid edge]

Hey I encountered a word in a Nachrichtenleicht article that I don’t understand in this context. Can someone help me?

In dem Land Ungarn findet jedes Jahr eine große Pride-Parade statt.

I thought statt meant something along the lines of „instead“. I took the sentence as meaning something like A large pride parade takes place in Hungary every year. So idk what statt is doing there lol

[jaunty flame]

Stattfinden

It's a separable verb. It means to take place basically

[limpid edge]

Lol I JUST found a dictionary entry for stattfinden

[limpid edge]

Thanks!!!

[jaunty flame]

You're welcome ^^

[rapid zodiac]

Wie sagt man 'to faint' auf deutsch? Was ist der unterschied zwischen Kreislaufkollaps, Kreislaufzusammenbruch und Ohnmacht?

[storm jolt]

thats a question for @uncut walrus

Nach meinem Wissensstand bedeutet ‚to faint‘, "ohnmächtig (zu) werden". Kreislaufkollaps und kreislaufzusammenbruch sind, soweit ich weiß, dasselbe. Ein Kreislaufzusammenbruch wird jedoch durch den Kreislauf im Körper ausgelöst, zum Beispiel durch einen niedrigen Blutdruck.

[uncut walrus]

Ohnmächtig werden, bewusstlos werden

[teal cliff]

Also heard wir

Lol

[snow tulip]

could someone give me the answers to these? i found this online, but no answer key

same goes for this one

[willow socket]

you should try it yourself and then ask for corrections

[snow tulip]

i did do it myself lol but typing everything over is a pain

[willow socket]

I know you're probably just looking for an answer key to compare your answers to, but generally it's discouraged to just ask for answers here, as we cannot tell if this is a test or homework we'd just be doing for you

[snow tulip]

1. der | dem
2. dem
3. der | die
4. dem | dem
5. den | die
6. dem | dem
7. deinen | deine
8. dem | meinem
9. der | dem
10. den | dem | dem
11. der | die
12. dem | dem
13. dem | dem | dem
14. dem | den
15. den | die

1. in
2. über
3. über (this one I'm unsure about)
4. neben
5. zwischen
6. an
7. unter
8. an
9. auf
10. in

these correct?

[unreal sun]

halloo, i'm in a groupchat with some german friends and i sent some pics we took together and one of them replied "diese hayate" and i have no idea what meant by that. could someone help :)) im too shy to ask in the chat hhahaha

[dense obsidian]

5,6,9,10,11,12,13 are not correct.

[snow tulip]

yeahh i received some answers and stuff in #questions
overall i got about 73% correct which would barely be a pass for my test tmr :') i hope it's less hard on the actual test

[wise pendant]

no idea what "hayate" is supposed to mean

[faint trout]

the guy from naruto?

https://naruto.fandom.com/wiki/Hayate_Gekkō

[plush pelican]

I encountered a rare 4-verb Nebensatz in the wild, complete with Ersatzinfinitiv (double infinitive) and Verbgefährt. But I'm a bit confused about the order of the verbs?

https://www.tagesschau.de/ausland/amerika/signal-gate-nachrichten-veroeffentlicht-100.html

The story is about the leaking of classified military information in texts.

Sprich: Der Verteidigungsminister der Vereinigten Staaten textete dies 31 Minuten bevor die ersten US-Flugzeuge starteten und gut zwei Stunden, bevor der Angriff beginnen konnte - in einem Chat mit einer Telefonnummer, die er nicht kannte - die des Journalisten.

Für Kritiker ist das ein klarer Beleg dafür, dass dadurch US-Militärs in Gefahr gebracht hätten werden können. Denn, wie Goldberg und Harris schreiben: "Wenn diese Texte von jemandem empfangen worden wären, der den USA feindlich gesonnen ist, oder von jemandem, der indiskret gewesen wäre und Zugang zu Social Media gehabt hätte, dann hätten die Huthi Zeit gehabt, sich vorzubereiten auf diese als Überraschungsangriff geplante Attacke auf ihre Hochburgen." Die Konsequenzen für amerikanische Piloten hätten katastrophal sein können, warnen die Autoren.

Shouldn't it be,
"dass dadurch US-Militärs hätten in Gefahr gebracht werden können." ?

My understanding is that for the Ersatzinfinitiv, you put the conjugated helping verb in front of the rechte Satzklammer, aka in front of all the other verbs.
For example: Ich weiß, dass ich das ohne dich nicht hätte schaffen können.

"in Gefahr" I understand as a Verbgefährt bound tightly to the verb "gebracht", and so "hätten" goes in front of it as well.

This is Konjunktiv 2 Passiv mit Modalverb in der Vergangenheit in einem Nebensatz.

Also the word order of the Infinitivsatz seems weird to me.

dann hätten die Huthi Zeit gehabt, sich vorzubereiten auf diese als Überraschungsangriff geplante Attacke auf ihre Hochburgen.

Shouldn't that be
"sich auf diese als Überraschungsangriff geplante Attacke auf ihre Hochburgen vorzubereiten" ?

[slender storm]

Ohh, that’s a tough one.
I have a feeling 2x Infinitiv is only ever used by professional writers, so I can only give you a vibes-based answer (I don’t really know the grammar rules behind it).

For your first example including the US-Militärs I think both yours and theirs are correct, but the one in the article reads better.

In the second example with the Huthis, again, the sentence in the article sounds totally correct but so does yours. I wouldn’t necessarily choose one over the other.

But again, I am not sure. Double Infinitiv is kinda rare so I can totally see even authors getting the grammar wrong lol. Someone with more knowledge on grammar should definitely give you a more precise answer.

[plush pelican]

How often do you see an Infinitivsatz where the verb isn't at the end?

For example, if the Infinitivsatz had been shorter:

Ich versuche, mich vorzubereiten darauf.

Ich versuche, mich vorzubereiten auf den kommenden Kampf.

Those are undeniably wrong, oder?

[slender storm]

Yeah they definitely sound wrong, however the second sentence is definitely one you would hear from some natives lol

[plush pelican]

It's funny how "wrong German" in terms of verb placement often sounds like English, 😄

[plush pelican]

So if those are wrong, then why is the exact same structure okay when the prepositional phrase is simply longer?

I am thinking it might be related to a similar phenomenon

When you are trying to avoid Schachtelsätze

For example:

Ich habe den Hund, den ich liebe, gesehen.
vs.
Ich habe den Hund gesehen, den ich liebe.

When the Relativsatz gets particularly long, you end up putting the verb in front of it in order to avoid the verb being "isolated" at the end:

Ich habe den Hund, dem ich gestern bei meinem Spaziergang in das dunkle Parkhaus gefolgt bin, gesehen.
vs.
Ich habe den Hund gesehen, dem ich gestern bei meinem Spaziergang in das dunkle Parkhaus gefolgt bin.

You pull the verb closer to the front when there's a lengthy description

Maybe? Just a thought.

[plain umbra]

When you say 2x Infinitiv, you mean actual double infinitive, right? Not just 2 infinitive form verbs next to each other? Since the latter is definitely common.

[slender storm]

I mean something like the following sentences:
„Sie behaupten, dass sie es nicht haben machen können.“

„Er hat gesagt, dass er das Kind nicht hat weinen hören.“

[plush pelican]

that's Ersatzinfinitiv/double infinitive

[plain umbra]

Yeah, it's a special usage of infinitive, used in the same role that a past participle would normally be used. But for example, something like "einkaufen gehen" is nothing special, it's just a normal 2 verbs used together.

[viral ibex]

wondering if a construction like "es lohnt nicht, sich [...]" is perfectly correct or more of a colloquial choice

[surreal rapids]

It is way more correct than the colloquial phrase "Es macht keinen Sinn, sich [...]"

[viral ibex]

would "es lohnt sich nicht, [...]" be preferable or are they equivalently correct?

[fervent kernel]

"Es lohnt sich nicht, ..." is perfect. i dont know if the other form is correct

[surreal rapids]

It depents on what you want to say: "Es lohnt sich nicht, dort anzufangen" or "Es lohnt nicht, sich dort abzuarbeiten" (at a job for example)

[viral ibex]

hmm alright, thank you

[heady hull]

They carry a different meaning. "Es lohnt sich nicht" = "not worth it", " es macht keinen Sinn " = "it makes no sense". Both are correct German.

[viral ibex]

oh i meant compared to the construction "es lohnt nicht, sich"

[heady hull]

What do you mean? You can use both followed up by ", sich".

[viral ibex]

i was wondering if "es lohnt sich nicht, ..." was preferable to "es lohnt nicht, sich ..." or if they were both equally correct

[heady hull]

Both are correct

A wait

It depends on what follows

"Es lohnt sich nicht, sich morgens zu waschen."
"Es lohnt nicht, sich morgens zu waschen.'

Are both correct.

" Es lohnt sich nicht, morgens zu waschen." Has a way different meaning.

[surreal rapids]

" Es lohnt sich nicht, morgens zu waschen." - U usally use this, when you talk about things which get washed

[rain talon]

Hi
Sorry if disturbing the current conversation, I fell like I'll forget if I don't ask now
What is the difference between Zeichen and Anzeichen?

[viral ibex]

Okay I think I understand, thank you for the answers

[wispy yarrow]

A Zeichen kann be a letter or any other symbol. An Anzeichen is an indication for something e.g. an Anzeichen for illness is fever

[heady hull]

Zeichen = sign, letter, symbol
Anzeichen = indication, evidence

But Zeichen can also have the meaning of Anzeichen. So you can write Zeichen instead of Anzeichen in most cases but not the other way around.

[surreal rapids]

For example if a girl gives you Zeichen that she likes you and you are not sure its called Anzeichen (like a guess)

[rain talon]

Thank you guys! @wispy yarrow @heady hull @surreal rapids

[rapid zodiac]

Sagt man Zimmermädchen auch ob die Frau alt ist?

[full socket]

An sich schon. Man sagt etwa auch Geburtstagskind, selbst wenn jemand 100 Jahre alt geworden ist. Aber Zimmermädchen ist vielleicht etwas altbacken. Lieber "Reinigungskraft".

[rapid zodiac]

Ist 'Reinigungskraft' hotelspezifisch?

[full socket]

Nein

Das trifft auf jeden Job zu, bei dem es ums sauber machen geht,

[rapid zodiac]

Ok, weil ich in einem Hotel arbeite. Dann soll ich nicht 'Zimmermädchen' verwenden?

[full socket]

Zb. im Büro, für WCs, für Züge,... oder in der Industrie (etwa im Schlachthaus)

[full socket]

Kannst du schon. "Reinigungskraft" ist etwas formeller und zeitgemäßer. Zimmermädchen ist schon korrekt und Hotelspezifisch, aber ich würde es als umgangssprachlicher einschätzen.

[rapid zodiac]

Ok dankeschön

[full socket]

Es ist auch geschlechterneutral. Falls du auch männliche Kollegen hast, also erheblich zu bevorzugen

[feral pendant]

quick question is there a difference between 'Himmelsrichtung' and 'Windrichtungen' ?

[wispy yarrow]

Yes. Himmelsrichtungen means the 4 general geographical directions N,E,S,W, the other means the direction where the wind comes from

[feral pendant]

ohhhhh danke 🙏

[grave vapor]

hallo ich bin learning german

[surreal rapids]

*Hallo, ich lerne Deutsch.

Viel Erfolg! 🙂

[foggy frost]

Ok I got a question. If “du wirst” is you will and “werden Sie” what are the rules because I can’t tell and also can’t find anything. 😡

[fair scaffold]

"du" is informal. "Sie" is formal.

[limpid edge]

The wiktionary entry for viel as a pronoun gives the example sentence "Es ist viel passiert".

Am I crazy or is this not an example of viel as a pronoun? It looks to me more like an adverb than anything else.

[plush pelican]

What's the subject?

Hint: It's not "es"

[limpid edge]

I’d say it’s the unpersönliches es

But I guess not lmao

[plush pelican]

Es ist viel passiert. = Viel ist passiert.

This is the use of the "dummy es"

The end of a German sentence is where the new/important information is at.

So what happens if you want to delay the subject until later, because the subject itself is new/important?

You still need something in position 1, before the conjugated verb.

But sometimes there isn't anything else in the sentence.

So then you create a "dummy es" and put it in position 1, just so that the conjugated verb gets to still be in position 2, and the real subject can come later in the sentence.

[trim hemlock]

What is the "dummie" es? Honestly curious

[limpid edge]

Oooooh I’ve never heard of the dummy es. Only the es that stands in for something not yet introduced! I never thought it could be used for something that would be introduced a word later though! That’s interesting!!

[plush pelican]

There are other times when there is a "dummy es" as well, like when an entire Nebensatz is the subject

[limpid edge]

Wait on second thought I’ve definitely seen and written sentences using this principle

[plush pelican]

Es überrascht mich nicht, dass du Hilfe brauchst.
It doesn't surprise me that you need help.

What doesn't surprise me? (the fact that you need help).

If you move the Nebensatz to be in front, this "es" disappears:

Dass du Hilfe brauchst, überrascht mich nicht.

[limpid edge]

Es überrascht mich auch nicht, dass ich Hilfe brauche. Lol

Right Right. That explains it perfectly thanks!

[plush pelican]

Anyway, so if we go back to:

Es ist viel passiert. = Viel ist pasiert.

"viel" is the only thing that can be the subject

so it must be a noun or pronoun

[limpid edge]

Also what book or website are you using? You always give me these perfect explanations and I feel like I should get that grammar reference you’re using

[plush pelican]

That's Hammer's German Grammar, a reference book

It's not an easy read, 😅

[limpid edge]

Hahaha I’ll check it out! Thanks!🙏

[maiden yacht]

Kann man "Mich überrascht nicht, dass..." sagen?

Ist es unüblich oder einfach falsch?

[plush pelican]

Eine Frage für einen Muttersprachler

um auf Nummer sicher zu gehen

[maiden yacht]

Die "Es" Setzung bringt mich manchmal völlig aus dem Konzept

Einer der wenigen Teile der deutschen Grammatik die ich nicht vollständig verinnerlichen kann

[plush pelican]

Einer der wenigen Teile?

[maiden yacht]

nun mit C1 muss man sich schon mit der überwiegenden Mehrheit aller Konzepte auseinandergesetzt haben

Der Rest besteht aus eher ungewöhnlicheren Sachen

Die selbst die Muttersprachler möglicherweise nicht ganz verstehen

[regal wave]

Ich würde sagen, nein, nicht in der Reihenfolge (kann jemand anderes aber anders sehen 🤔). Fühlt sich komisch an. Aber umgangssprachlich kann man das "es" tatsächlich weglassen: "[Es] überrascht mich nicht, dass..."

Nur ist das eine Ellipse.

[plush pelican]

Je fortgeschrittener ich werde, desto mehr "ungewöhnliche Ausnahmen" entdecke ich

[maiden yacht]

wie etwa Ersatzinfinitiv

[maiden yacht]

joa finde ich auch

Aber das ist ein gutes Anzeichen

Heißt dass man die einfachen Sachen hinter sich hat

[maiden yacht]

👍

[regal wave]

Hm. Ah, doch. Ja. Geht. Aber die Nuance ändert sich etwas. (...im Zug laut zu sich selbst sprechen ist komisch 😂)

[maiden yacht]

Ach echt

[regal wave]

Mich überrascht nicht = Betonung auf mich legen; Überrascht mich nicht = Betonung auf überraschen

[maiden yacht]

ach so

Mich überrascht (es) nicht also vs (Es) überrascht mich nicht

[regal wave]

Genau

[maiden yacht]

Ich geh da trotzdem auf Nummer sicher

Die Form mit "es" dürfte wohl üblicher sein

Ich habe das Gefühl, ich hätte "Mich überrascht nicht" iel gehört, aber im Netz finde ich keine Treffer

zu "Es überrascht mich nicht" allerdings schon

[surreal rapids]

oder "überrascht mich nicht"

[maiden yacht]

ach ja stimmt

das weggelassen

[regal wave]

Ja, bei "Mich..." finde ich das "es" drin noch eher...hm, wichtiger?

[maiden yacht]

Wahrscheinlich weil das "es" eher am Anfang des Satzes weggelassen wird

oder

[regal wave]

Ich glaube, eher meine eigene Sprechgewohnheit. Das ist sehr subjektiv, aber je öfter ich es sage, desto normaler finde ich es 😂

[maiden yacht]

Ich gehe davon aus dass du Muttersprachler bist oder

[regal wave]

Ja.

[maiden yacht]

Die Sprechgewohnheiten eines Muttersprachlers stimmen sehr oft mit den Regeln überein

ich glaube du hast recht

[plush pelican]

Warum hast du noch keine Muttersprachler-Rolle?

[regal wave]

Also, die Wortstellung wäre ein kleiner Unterschied darin, was ich eher betonen wollte

[maiden yacht]

Ich muss mich tiefer mit den verschiedensten "es" Formen auseinandersetzen